WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.520 We do not normally do this, but we are kicking off the New Year 2 00:00:02.560 --> 00:00:06.799 twenty twenty four with a VIP sale. Go vip for a full month for 3 00:00:06.839 --> 00:00:10.759 three dollars in ninety nine cents. That is six dollars off our normal, 4 00:00:11.039 --> 00:00:15.400 very reasonable rate. We're told of nine dollars and ninety nine cents per month. 5 00:00:15.640 --> 00:00:22.239 Pw torch dot com slash go vip. That's pwtorch dot com, slash 6 00:00:22.399 --> 00:00:28.519 go vip and enter coupon code New Year twenty twenty four. That six dollars 7 00:00:28.559 --> 00:00:31.280 discount can be applied to a one month sub, a three month sub, 8 00:00:31.399 --> 00:00:35.399 or a one year sub. You'll get six dollars off whichever option you choose. 9 00:00:35.560 --> 00:00:38.719 We'd love to have you tries for the first time or come on back 10 00:00:38.719 --> 00:00:42.600 if for some reason you've had to take a break from VIP membership. Our 11 00:00:42.679 --> 00:00:47.439 podcasts with a VIP membership are compatible with the Apple podcast app. That means 12 00:00:47.439 --> 00:00:51.240 CarPlay. That means on your iPhone and you don't have to go to advanced 13 00:00:51.240 --> 00:00:55.119 settings or enter any special password or anything like that. It's a simple click 14 00:00:55.200 --> 00:00:58.640 of a link from your iPhone when you sign up that'll be email to you. 15 00:00:58.719 --> 00:01:02.920 It is frictionless. You can also use many other popular podcast apps or 16 00:01:02.960 --> 00:01:07.799 just streamed from our vip ad free website. So many perks with VIP membership, 17 00:01:07.799 --> 00:01:11.920 including last Saturday Nights nearly two hour review of AW World's End. Todd 18 00:01:11.920 --> 00:01:15.879 Martin, Rich Fan and I dissected that event. We got under the Jericho 19 00:01:15.959 --> 00:01:19.840 controversy and how AW had handled it so far and how they should going forward, 20 00:01:19.239 --> 00:01:23.319 Thoughts on MJF and the Devil reveal and Somojo is Champion, and so 21 00:01:23.760 --> 00:01:29.519 much more in that VP exclusive roundtable. Also for VIP members, we have 22 00:01:29.719 --> 00:01:34.840 a written roundtable after pay per views and pls with staff scores and reviews. 23 00:01:34.920 --> 00:01:40.680 Alan Coonahan, Rich Fan, Sean Radikin and I wrote reviews of Saturday's pay 24 00:01:40.680 --> 00:01:44.239 per view and we'll do so again for the Royal Rumble coming up later this 25 00:01:44.400 --> 00:01:49.560 month. Also, we just ran our nearly two hour World Class Championship Wrestling 26 00:01:49.599 --> 00:01:53.319 Von Eric special podcasts that we did back in two thousand and six. This 27 00:01:53.519 --> 00:02:00.040 was a show that I did with Bruce Mitchell reviewing the Von Eric DVD that 28 00:02:00.079 --> 00:02:04.760 had just come out, and they ended up putting this podcast on that DVD 29 00:02:04.840 --> 00:02:07.560 in the deluxe edition because the producers of the DVD were so happy with the 30 00:02:07.560 --> 00:02:12.479 thorough coverage we gave of the history of the Von Erickson World Class Championship Wrestling, 31 00:02:12.639 --> 00:02:15.599 cutting through the crap and talking about the Von Erics, but also other 32 00:02:15.639 --> 00:02:21.439 aspects of that promotion in the rise and Fall. It is a thorough supplement 33 00:02:21.479 --> 00:02:24.439 to the Iron Claw movie and it is available as soon as you sign up 34 00:02:24.439 --> 00:02:28.240 as a VIP member. We just put it up on the VIP podcast feed 35 00:02:28.280 --> 00:02:30.360 on December twenty ninth, just a few days ago. Also, when you 36 00:02:30.400 --> 00:02:35.240 go VIP you can listen immediately to my review of the Iron Claw movie that 37 00:02:35.280 --> 00:02:38.759 was a VIP exclusive Wade Keller Hotline. I attended the movie, I reviewed 38 00:02:38.800 --> 00:02:43.919 the movie, and I also included in my Keller hotline reviewing it excerpts from 39 00:02:43.960 --> 00:02:46.319 the very hard to get Gary Hart book. Gary Hart was a booker of 40 00:02:46.560 --> 00:02:50.759 World Class Championship wrestling during the rise of the Von Erks and the Freebirds feud. 41 00:02:51.000 --> 00:02:54.039 He was very blunt in that book about what he thought of the Von 42 00:02:54.199 --> 00:02:59.159 Erics and that era, with some amazing insight. That book sales on eBay 43 00:02:59.159 --> 00:03:01.960 for one thousand dollars. I've got a copy of it and I took key 44 00:03:02.000 --> 00:03:07.199 excerpts that put more perspective on what was in the movie. January first, 45 00:03:07.199 --> 00:03:09.199 Wadekeller Hotline, which was a return of the s the Editor format. I 46 00:03:09.240 --> 00:03:14.319 answered questions about the vo eric movie. What era of the von Erics careers 47 00:03:14.319 --> 00:03:16.319 would I've added to the movie if they had fifteen or thirty extra minutes to 48 00:03:16.360 --> 00:03:21.000 work with? Also, why did Kevin Dunn leave WWE? I have insight 49 00:03:21.080 --> 00:03:23.960 into the situation and I conveyed it in an answer to a VIP member question. 50 00:03:24.199 --> 00:03:28.240 And also will Tony Kahn really go into more sports like direction in twenty 51 00:03:28.280 --> 00:03:30.800 twenty four? Those are just some of the topics covered in a way. 52 00:03:30.879 --> 00:03:35.280 Keller Hotline asked the Editor edition thirty minutes in length, posted on January first. 53 00:03:35.719 --> 00:03:37.879 I could go on and on. So much comes to the VIP membership 54 00:03:37.879 --> 00:03:40.319 and add free VIP website, mobile friendly, desktop friendly, so much more. 55 00:03:40.439 --> 00:03:46.000 Checkout full details at Pwtorch dot com slash go VIP. Click on the 56 00:03:46.000 --> 00:03:51.639 sign up link coupon code New Year twenty twenty four to get six dollars off 57 00:03:51.639 --> 00:03:53.919 three dollars ninety nine cents to try us for a month. It's a great 58 00:03:53.919 --> 00:03:58.360 deal and hopefully you'll stick around. Beyond that for nine dollars and ninety nine 59 00:03:58.439 --> 00:04:12.560 cents. All right, now, let's get back to today's podcast. Now, 60 00:04:12.840 --> 00:04:16.639 PW Torch and Spreaker bring you the Wig Keller Pro Wrestling Podcast. It's 61 00:04:16.680 --> 00:04:21.160 time for this week's Interview Classic, where Wade Keller interviews one of pro Wrestling's 62 00:04:21.199 --> 00:04:30.759 newsmakers ten years ago. This week, Hardcore Bob Holly joined me for over 63 00:04:30.839 --> 00:04:33.759 an hour and a half. Bob Holly continues to be near the top of 64 00:04:33.759 --> 00:04:40.120 my list of surprise excellent interview subjects from my series of interviews over the years 65 00:04:40.120 --> 00:04:45.480 on podcasts and Torch Talks for the Newsletter. In this episode, which live 66 00:04:45.480 --> 00:04:49.160 streamed on January twenty fourth, twenty fourteen, he has a passionate reaction to 67 00:04:49.240 --> 00:04:55.199 Daniel Bryant's port push, also insight into his Royal Rumble match against brock Lessner 68 00:04:55.399 --> 00:05:00.279 ten years prior, thoughts on Batista as a rookie, reaction to the date 69 00:05:00.319 --> 00:05:04.360 of hardcore style wrestling, and much more, including live callers and email questions. 70 00:05:04.560 --> 00:05:09.399 Bob Holly worth listening to start to finish anytime you see him show up 71 00:05:09.399 --> 00:05:13.839 here on our Interview Classic feed, and it is today's Wade Keller Pro Wrestling 72 00:05:13.879 --> 00:05:28.160 Podcast Interview Classic for Saturday, January twenty seventh, twenty twenty four. Welcome 73 00:05:28.240 --> 00:05:31.120 to the p W Torch Live Cast. I am wad Keller, editor and 74 00:05:31.120 --> 00:05:38.199 publisher of the Pro Wrestling Torch newsletter since nineteen eighty seven and also pwtorch dot 75 00:05:38.240 --> 00:05:42.720 Com since nineteen ninety nine, also PW Torch app bailable on iPhone, Android 76 00:05:42.759 --> 00:05:46.839 and other devices since two thousand and eight, and host of this PW Torch 77 00:05:46.879 --> 00:05:49.000 Live Cast, which is on five days a week, and I host on 78 00:05:49.120 --> 00:05:53.480 Tuesdays and Fridays, and we've been on the air at blog Talk Radio since 79 00:05:53.560 --> 00:05:57.439 late two thousand and nine. In fact, we'll have as six show instead 80 00:05:57.480 --> 00:06:00.759 of five. We'll have six shows next week because we begin on Sunday with 81 00:06:00.040 --> 00:06:06.120 a post Royal Rumble edition of the PW Torch Live Cast starting at eleven thirty 82 00:06:06.120 --> 00:06:10.480 Eastern, about a half hour after the Royal Rumble, and so we welcome 83 00:06:10.519 --> 00:06:14.040 you to join James Caldwell hosting that show with your phone calls and thoughts. 84 00:06:14.399 --> 00:06:17.199 The PW Torch Live Cast every day is brought to you by audible dot com, 85 00:06:17.240 --> 00:06:23.399 a leading provider of spoken audio, information and entertainment. Listen to audiobooks 86 00:06:23.439 --> 00:06:27.240 whenever and wherever you want. Get a free book when you sign up for 87 00:06:27.319 --> 00:06:33.879 a free trial at audibletrial dot com Slash Pro Wrestling Torch again a free audiobook 88 00:06:34.079 --> 00:06:41.279 just for signing up at audio excuse me at audibletrial dot com Slash Pro Wrestling 89 00:06:41.319 --> 00:06:46.160 Torch. It is Friday, January twenty fourth, twenty fourteen, and we 90 00:06:46.160 --> 00:06:49.839 welcome a returning guest for Interview Friday today, one of our favorite guests from 91 00:06:49.920 --> 00:06:54.399 last year, Hardcore Bob Holly. Bob, welcome back to the show. 92 00:06:55.000 --> 00:06:57.560 Thank you way, thank you for having me again. I appreciate it. 93 00:06:57.560 --> 00:06:59.959 It is great having you on. There is so much to talk about. 94 00:07:00.040 --> 00:07:02.680 We are forty eight hours away from uh just over forty eight hours away from 95 00:07:02.720 --> 00:07:08.600 the Royal Rumble pregame festivities beginning, and uh I got so much to talk 96 00:07:08.639 --> 00:07:10.839 to you about. We're going to open up the phone lines to callers. 97 00:07:10.879 --> 00:07:15.160 Also. The numbers here are six four, six, seven to one nine 98 00:07:15.199 --> 00:07:17.199 A two eight. Again that is six four, six, seven, one 99 00:07:17.680 --> 00:07:19.959 nine A two eight. I want to remind people too, you can call 100 00:07:20.000 --> 00:07:24.199 that phone number and not participate in the show and just eavesdrop. If you've 101 00:07:24.199 --> 00:07:27.399 got Bluetooth on your cell phone during rush hour traffic. Just call up the 102 00:07:27.439 --> 00:07:29.480 line and as long as you don't push one on your phone to say you 103 00:07:29.519 --> 00:07:31.720 want to participate in the show, you can actually listen on your phone. 104 00:07:31.759 --> 00:07:34.160 It's kind of a cool gimmick. Not everybody knows about that. Otherwise, 105 00:07:34.160 --> 00:07:40.199 you can always find us live at pw torchlivecast dot com, or you can 106 00:07:40.240 --> 00:07:43.759 find our archives at pw torchlivecast dot com in case you miss a show, 107 00:07:44.199 --> 00:07:48.519 and that also has links on that page to subscribe in iTunes and other podcast 108 00:07:48.639 --> 00:07:55.360 apps and websites. Bob, you uh, you've got uh, you've got 109 00:07:55.360 --> 00:07:58.399 some thoughts on what's going on with Daniel Brian. We taught we corresponded before 110 00:07:58.399 --> 00:08:01.560 the show about that. I want to kick off the show by talking about 111 00:08:01.560 --> 00:08:05.680 something that we've been talking about since SummerSlam, which is this really special moment 112 00:08:05.399 --> 00:08:09.319 where Daniel Bryan gave John Cena a running high knee and pinned at the top 113 00:08:09.319 --> 00:08:15.240 star in WWE one two three. The crowd goes bananas and for about two 114 00:08:15.319 --> 00:08:20.360 to three minutes, all was right in the world, and then Triple As 115 00:08:20.399 --> 00:08:22.360 gives the Pettigree turns heel, Randy Orton comes out catches the money in the 116 00:08:22.360 --> 00:08:26.600 bank, and then month after month after month, Daniel Bridan screwed out of 117 00:08:26.600 --> 00:08:30.920 a title, and then Big Show uses a lawyer to basically steal away WHI 118 00:08:30.920 --> 00:08:35.159 should have been Daniel Bryan's title rematch that he deserves. He screwed out of 119 00:08:35.159 --> 00:08:37.840 the previous three or four, but Big Show supposedly has a babyface, hires 120 00:08:37.840 --> 00:08:41.559 a lawyer and gets the title shot. People don't really like it by rates 121 00:08:41.600 --> 00:08:43.879 not good. And then Danny Brian joins a white family and then he breaks 122 00:08:43.960 --> 00:08:48.320 up a couple of weeks later, and now he's facing Bray White upside at 123 00:08:48.320 --> 00:08:50.559 the Royal Rumble. That is the summary of Daniel Bryan's career in the last 124 00:08:50.879 --> 00:08:54.120 well, however long it's been since SummerSlam. What are your thoughts on what's 125 00:08:54.120 --> 00:08:58.000 been going on with Daniel Bryan's Oh man, you know what, I really 126 00:08:58.039 --> 00:09:05.320 don't know where to begin because I just, honestly and this is just my 127 00:09:05.399 --> 00:09:09.200 opinion, and I hope people just understand it's just my opinion. You know, 128 00:09:11.159 --> 00:09:16.519 Hunter made the comment about he doesn't believe that, you know, Daniel 129 00:09:16.559 --> 00:09:20.080 Bryant should be world champion because he's number one, he's too small, and 130 00:09:20.159 --> 00:09:22.159 he looks like a troll. First of all, he doesn't look like a 131 00:09:22.200 --> 00:09:28.039 troll. Number one. I mean, he's over more than anybody I've seen 132 00:09:28.240 --> 00:09:31.840 come along, you know, almost send Steve Austin or you know, even 133 00:09:31.919 --> 00:09:39.320 John Cena, and this is their guy, and you know, and I 134 00:09:39.440 --> 00:09:43.480 just think Hunter can't stand it because the guy's over more than him and he's 135 00:09:43.519 --> 00:09:48.720 nowhere near the stature that Hunter is. You know, he's organic, and 136 00:09:48.799 --> 00:09:54.399 he's pretty much self made, you know, with I mean with ww's help 137 00:09:54.639 --> 00:09:58.200 in a sense, you know, because you've got to have their help. 138 00:09:58.559 --> 00:10:01.320 But he pretty much, to me, pretty much did it on his own, 139 00:10:01.399 --> 00:10:05.000 got over on his own, like nobody has ever gotten over on their 140 00:10:05.039 --> 00:10:11.200 own. And I just truly believe that Hunter, you know, because Hunter 141 00:10:11.639 --> 00:10:16.360 makes a lot of decisions now and I just don't think Hunter thinks this is 142 00:10:16.360 --> 00:10:20.879 the face of the company when obviously it is. And I just I just 143 00:10:22.120 --> 00:10:26.360 I don't think because Hunter bases a lot of his decisions on personal feelings and 144 00:10:26.360 --> 00:10:30.320 that's not the way it should because we've talked about that before, and you 145 00:10:30.360 --> 00:10:33.240 know, and it's obvious when you see the crowd chan yes, the whole 146 00:10:33.320 --> 00:10:37.159 you know, you have twenty thousand people chan yes every damn night. That 147 00:10:37.200 --> 00:10:41.679 should tell you something. So I just I believe that, you know, 148 00:10:41.720 --> 00:10:48.279 it's his time. And I think they're starting to realize now that even though 149 00:10:48.320 --> 00:10:52.120 they've tried to suppress him getting over as much as he's getting over now, 150 00:10:52.120 --> 00:10:54.080 and they tried to make him to where it does he doesn't mean as much 151 00:10:54.440 --> 00:10:58.679 as he did before and it backfired on him. So now I think they're 152 00:10:58.679 --> 00:11:03.159 trying to they're rethinking this whole thing with him, and I'm hoping, you 153 00:11:03.200 --> 00:11:05.799 know, I'm hoping that he gets well, he's not gonna be in the 154 00:11:05.879 --> 00:11:11.159 Royal rumbo am I correct, he's having a max with Bray Wyatt. Is 155 00:11:11.200 --> 00:11:15.600 that is that what's going on? They've announced twenty wrestlers for the Rumble, 156 00:11:16.120 --> 00:11:20.200 and there's thirty in the match, and they haven't said if somebody's not in 157 00:11:20.200 --> 00:11:22.879 the Rumble. They've simply only announced twenty, or maybe they've added a couple, 158 00:11:22.879 --> 00:11:26.120 but there's open spots, so there is some speculation that he might be 159 00:11:26.159 --> 00:11:30.919 added. But if they add him without advertising him, I think that's almost 160 00:11:30.960 --> 00:11:33.399 worse than not including him, because he's so popular, you would want to 161 00:11:33.399 --> 00:11:37.440 give Dan O'Brien fans a reason to order the Rumble, not just to see 162 00:11:37.480 --> 00:11:39.799 him beat up Bray Wyatt, but the fact that he might have a chance 163 00:11:39.799 --> 00:11:43.399 to meet event WrestleMania by winning the Rumble. So my hunches he's not in 164 00:11:43.440 --> 00:11:46.399 the Rumble, but I don't feel like I note that Jason Powell wrote a 165 00:11:46.399 --> 00:11:50.240 blog at Progressing dot net and we talked about it on the live cast on 166 00:11:50.279 --> 00:11:52.320 Tuesday where he thinks Danny brien will be in the Rubble and will win and 167 00:11:52.360 --> 00:11:56.399 people should not give a pope on that. But I'm not giving up hope, 168 00:11:56.399 --> 00:12:01.120 but I'm skeptical. Yeah, well, you know what, even if 169 00:12:01.120 --> 00:12:03.000 he isn't in the Rumble and just has a match with very White, it 170 00:12:03.000 --> 00:12:09.039 doesn't mean that he may not main event WrestleMania, because they've done in the 171 00:12:09.080 --> 00:12:15.440 past. The winner of the Royal Rumble, you know, has has not 172 00:12:15.840 --> 00:12:20.559 in the past gone on to headline WrestleMania, you know, because somewhere in 173 00:12:20.639 --> 00:12:24.000 between Royal Rumble and WrestleMania, you know, storylines have change to where they 174 00:12:24.000 --> 00:12:28.720 put somebody else in that spot. And I'm hoping, you know, if 175 00:12:28.799 --> 00:12:31.399 Daniel, if Daniel Bryant in the Royal Rumble. I want him to win 176 00:12:31.559 --> 00:12:35.039 because he deserves it. He's worked his ass off, he he deserves to 177 00:12:35.039 --> 00:12:41.159 be world champion, and the crowd dictate, you know, tells you that. 178 00:12:41.639 --> 00:12:46.879 And number two, you know, I think it would be great for 179 00:12:46.159 --> 00:12:50.960 him to become world Champion in WrestleMania because he I think he would be a 180 00:12:50.000 --> 00:12:54.759 good ambassador for that company. I really really do. And and I'm hoping 181 00:12:56.919 --> 00:13:00.279 that if by some reason he's not in the Rumble and he doesn't win it, 182 00:13:01.240 --> 00:13:07.879 that they do something with him in between to where he does end up 183 00:13:07.919 --> 00:13:11.480 with a shot at the title at WrestleMania, because I mean, they could 184 00:13:11.559 --> 00:13:16.720 change storylines, you know, between Rumble and WrestleMania to where Daniel Bryant will 185 00:13:16.720 --> 00:13:18.720 get a shot. And I hope that's what they do, because they've done 186 00:13:18.759 --> 00:13:24.120 that stuff like that before. Yes, I want to. By the way, 187 00:13:24.120 --> 00:13:26.279 if you're just joining us hardcore, Bob Holly is our guest, a 188 00:13:26.360 --> 00:13:30.919 fifteen year WWF and WWE veteran wrestler from the mid nineties to the end of 189 00:13:30.960 --> 00:13:33.559 the two thousands. You left in two thousand and nine, right, Bob? 190 00:13:33.639 --> 00:13:35.879 Is that right? Yes? Yes, I sure it is. But 191 00:13:35.039 --> 00:13:41.159 about fifteen years in WWF and also an author of an excellent autobiography talking about 192 00:13:41.159 --> 00:13:46.840 his journey beat, his life before wrestling and then getting into wrestling, and 193 00:13:46.840 --> 00:13:52.519 then getting to WWUF. It comes with the highest recommendation of me. And 194 00:13:52.600 --> 00:13:56.519 I've read a lot of wrestling books over the years, and Bob Holly's is 195 00:13:56.519 --> 00:13:58.519 one of the best overall. And I think it's an elite company when it 196 00:13:58.519 --> 00:14:03.679 comes to talking about life behind the scenes in the WWF during that nineties through 197 00:14:05.159 --> 00:14:09.559 early two thousands era from a perspective, and this is what I mean. 198 00:14:09.600 --> 00:14:11.399 Not only is it a good book on its own merits, but what really 199 00:14:11.440 --> 00:14:15.600 jumps out is Bob's not writing a book that's going to be edited or read 200 00:14:15.600 --> 00:14:20.279 by Vincick Mann. Bob's not writing a book where he's worried about Vinci Mann 201 00:14:20.279 --> 00:14:24.720 firing him or withholding something in the future from him. And yeah, any 202 00:14:24.759 --> 00:14:28.799 book published by WWWE, no matter how honest Vincent Mann tells everyone to be, 203 00:14:28.120 --> 00:14:31.120 there's that apprehension. And I think Bob was really fair, but I 204 00:14:31.159 --> 00:14:35.840 think he said things he might not have felt comfortable writing if he were still 205 00:14:35.840 --> 00:14:39.480 working for WWF. It's human nature might have gotten in the way. So 206 00:14:39.480 --> 00:14:43.039 it's just there's some great stories, great insight. Bruce Mitchell does not recommend 207 00:14:43.039 --> 00:14:46.759 books slightly, and he was on the first time, Bob, you were 208 00:14:46.799 --> 00:14:48.360 on the show. He was co hosting with me and gave it the highest 209 00:14:48.360 --> 00:14:52.320 recommendation, and he actually hounded me about reading the book because I hadn't. 210 00:14:52.360 --> 00:14:54.679 I didn't read it when it first came out, and Bruce did, and 211 00:14:54.720 --> 00:14:58.039 when I read it, I totally agreed. So I want to give a 212 00:14:58.039 --> 00:15:03.000 big endorsement to your book, Bob. We talked at the length about it 213 00:15:03.799 --> 00:15:05.440 when you were first on the show, but it's called The Hardcore Truth, 214 00:15:05.840 --> 00:15:13.240 and it is available in bookstores and certainly through online retailers. I can't thank 215 00:15:13.279 --> 00:15:16.559 you enough for doing that way, because that that truly means a lot, 216 00:15:16.000 --> 00:15:20.480 because I look up to you in the wrestling world, you know, as 217 00:15:20.840 --> 00:15:24.519 a journalists and things like that, and that that means a lot. Your 218 00:15:24.600 --> 00:15:28.000 endorsement coming from you like that, that that means a lot. I can't 219 00:15:28.000 --> 00:15:30.200 thank you enough, and I really appreciate it. Well, well, you're 220 00:15:30.240 --> 00:15:31.919 welcome, and I won't I won't push it that hard if it weren't true, 221 00:15:31.960 --> 00:15:37.240 even though you're nice enough to be on the show. I do want 222 00:15:37.279 --> 00:15:39.360 to shift for just one minute to talk about our sponsor of the show one 223 00:15:39.360 --> 00:15:43.399 more time, and that is Audible dot com. Uh. The p WW 224 00:15:43.399 --> 00:15:48.320 You Torch Lovecast is sponsored by Audible, which is a leading provider of spoken 225 00:15:48.360 --> 00:15:52.960 audio information and entertainment. And you can listen to audiobooks whenever and wherever you 226 00:15:52.000 --> 00:15:54.600 want, and you can get a free book when you sign up for a 227 00:15:54.639 --> 00:16:00.200 free trial at audibletrial dot com. Slash Pro Wrestling Torch Bob Holly's book is 228 00:16:00.240 --> 00:16:03.840 not available at audible dot com. Maybe we need to try to change that, 229 00:16:03.720 --> 00:16:08.320 but many other wrestling books are and so if you are looking to listen 230 00:16:08.360 --> 00:16:12.080 to Steve Stonecold Steve Boston's autobiography from ten years ago, I also recommend that 231 00:16:12.120 --> 00:16:17.240 book. I think it's a great book from Steve Boston. Our Hardcore History 232 00:16:17.240 --> 00:16:19.559 by Scott Williams. Speaking of hardcore, Holly, you can read about the 233 00:16:19.600 --> 00:16:25.200 history of hardcore wrestling and especially ecw by an author I also respect Scott Williams. 234 00:16:25.879 --> 00:16:27.480 The Squared Circle, Life, Death and Pro Wrestling by David Schumaker. 235 00:16:27.840 --> 00:16:30.600 You might know him from grant Land dot com. That book is a new 236 00:16:30.600 --> 00:16:34.159 book and that is vailable on Audible. Also Wrestling with the Devil by Lex 237 00:16:34.240 --> 00:16:37.960 Luger, a recent autobiography, Hollywood Hokog and Dusty Rhodes, Mick Foley, 238 00:16:38.480 --> 00:16:41.279 many other wrestling books available at Audible. But if you're in the mood to 239 00:16:41.279 --> 00:16:44.600 get away from wrestling for a few minutes, you can escape into a Stephen 240 00:16:44.639 --> 00:16:48.440 King novel, John Grisham, Tom Clancy, Dean Kuns, George Carlin, 241 00:16:48.840 --> 00:16:52.080 heck, even Bossypants by Tina Fey or Malcolm Gladwell tipping, point outliers and 242 00:16:52.159 --> 00:16:56.480 blink. If you want to quit smoking, I recommend not because I'm an 243 00:16:56.519 --> 00:16:57.799 ex smoker, so don't be mad at me. But I know a lot 244 00:16:57.840 --> 00:17:02.279 of people who smoke, a lot of friends and family who smoked and quit 245 00:17:02.639 --> 00:17:04.519 after reading or listening to this book. And it's called The Easy Way to 246 00:17:04.559 --> 00:17:10.440 Quit Smoking by Alan Carr And on this show, because people bring it up, 247 00:17:10.559 --> 00:17:11.319 they'll say, Wade, what was that book again? What was that 248 00:17:11.359 --> 00:17:17.680 book again? I can list eight people I know who quit smoking immediately after 249 00:17:17.720 --> 00:17:21.359 reading this book and did not go back and did not have trouble doing it. 250 00:17:21.359 --> 00:17:23.880 It is sort of magical, and I have been fascinated by it because 251 00:17:25.240 --> 00:17:26.839 these friends of mine just they all shared the stories about it, and so 252 00:17:26.880 --> 00:17:30.960 I've always remembered it. That's called The Easy Way to Quit Smoking by Alan 253 00:17:30.039 --> 00:17:33.279 Carr. If you are smoker and want to quit, you might consider that. 254 00:17:33.400 --> 00:17:37.039 As you're a free audio book, but you can read about others, 255 00:17:37.079 --> 00:17:40.000 or you can listen to books on other sports NFL, NHL, et cetera. 256 00:17:40.279 --> 00:17:44.079 Check it out, go to audibletrial dot com. Slash Pro Wrestling torch. 257 00:17:44.839 --> 00:17:48.039 All right, we were done with our sponsors, Bob, and I 258 00:17:48.039 --> 00:17:52.279 want to get back to the dang of Bryan situation and something you talked about 259 00:17:52.119 --> 00:17:56.119 or I want to draw in your experience. Was there any time in your 260 00:17:56.160 --> 00:18:03.359 fifteen years working for WWF that you saw somebody eyes up from out of nowhere, 261 00:18:03.480 --> 00:18:07.519 organically from fans, deciding we love this guy and we want to cheer 262 00:18:07.559 --> 00:18:11.119 wildly for him. And it wasn't preordained, It wasn't part of a plan. 263 00:18:11.559 --> 00:18:15.640 It wasn't because he had great music videos and beat all these top guys. 264 00:18:15.920 --> 00:18:18.039 Is there somebody who comes closest to comparing to Daniel Bryant in that regard? 265 00:18:18.960 --> 00:18:22.680 I have not seen anybody, and I'll be honest, and you know 266 00:18:22.720 --> 00:18:26.880 what another thing toe I'll be honest because when I first saw him on TV, 267 00:18:26.839 --> 00:18:30.160 I really didn't think much about him, you know. I just I 268 00:18:30.359 --> 00:18:34.000 just thought, you know, there's a you know, just a plain looking 269 00:18:34.039 --> 00:18:37.200 guy. I mean he's got a beard and everything, and he's a great 270 00:18:37.359 --> 00:18:41.440 athlete. I mean, he's unbelievable wrestler too, you know, and I 271 00:18:41.519 --> 00:18:47.200 just I really didn't think anything about it, and just you know, watching 272 00:18:47.319 --> 00:18:52.680 him from time to time here and there and just listening to the people and 273 00:18:52.000 --> 00:18:59.039 just watching him. I mean, he's believable as far as facials and his 274 00:18:59.240 --> 00:19:04.039 timing and you know, and it's just it's crazy, which is a good 275 00:19:04.039 --> 00:19:11.160 thing for him. How he got over without without that big shove like they 276 00:19:11.160 --> 00:19:14.200 give a lot of guys where they try to force them to get over, 277 00:19:14.839 --> 00:19:18.039 and this guy just did it naturally. And I have never, honestly, 278 00:19:18.119 --> 00:19:23.880 I just I cannot say I've ever seen anybody get over like that without you 279 00:19:23.880 --> 00:19:27.160 know, the big shove. And that's what doesn't that what makes it so 280 00:19:27.240 --> 00:19:33.079 frustrating seeing what happened the last uh you know, five six months in WWE, 281 00:19:33.240 --> 00:19:37.119 and it just feels like a blown opportunity because of uh In an idea 282 00:19:37.160 --> 00:19:41.640 that finsic mantriple h have that you have to look a certain way to be 283 00:19:41.720 --> 00:19:45.279 the face of the company, and I'm I'm curious about the dynamic with Batista 284 00:19:45.279 --> 00:19:49.039 coming back on Monday, and I'm I'm presuming the most likely scenario is Batista 285 00:19:49.039 --> 00:19:52.839 winning the World Rumble because he's the only guy that they hyped on Raw that 286 00:19:52.920 --> 00:19:56.480 had a chance, right and and it seems like he'll win and face Randy 287 00:19:56.559 --> 00:20:00.000 Orton WrestleMania if Randy Orton wins. But they're, you know, the obvious. 288 00:20:00.000 --> 00:20:00.960 This thing isn't always what happens, and that's part of the fun of 289 00:20:02.000 --> 00:20:06.240 watching WWE is until it happens. It hasn't happened. But I'm curious how 290 00:20:06.279 --> 00:20:11.559 fans react if they feel bob that Bautista has been brought in as a legacy 291 00:20:11.640 --> 00:20:15.119 star who's big and tall and fits the face of the company, dimensions that 292 00:20:15.200 --> 00:20:21.920 Vincent manager Blake to look for if they would have cheered Batista, but they 293 00:20:22.000 --> 00:20:26.119 resent not Bautista the person, although maybe they resent his tight jeans or his 294 00:20:26.200 --> 00:20:29.880 shirt or something because he's been made fun for that his kidney jeans, but 295 00:20:30.559 --> 00:20:36.599 or telling people on Twitter, I think he parental advisory coming up here, 296 00:20:36.680 --> 00:20:38.039 but on Twitter the other day he told someone to suck his balls, which 297 00:20:38.039 --> 00:20:45.240 I'm not quite sure that's PG, but yeah, but no. But nevertheless, 298 00:20:45.319 --> 00:20:48.559 I wonder if Batista's going to have a harder time than even he deserves 299 00:20:48.640 --> 00:20:51.519 or he would have had otherwise, because fans are gonna look at Batista's taking 300 00:20:51.519 --> 00:20:56.039 a spot that they hoped and felt belong to Daniel Bryan. Hi, I'm 301 00:20:56.559 --> 00:21:00.880 you know what, I I don't know. I would guess that would be 302 00:21:00.279 --> 00:21:03.720 how the fans would feel. But I just I think the reason they bring 303 00:21:03.759 --> 00:21:07.440 a lot of these guys in because they don't have enough star power for WrestleMania 304 00:21:07.839 --> 00:21:15.759 and they're trying to, you know, create something for WrestleMania that you know 305 00:21:15.880 --> 00:21:18.720 that the current roster, you know, they're trying. Of course, WrestleMania 306 00:21:18.720 --> 00:21:22.279 is a big show over the year, you know, so they do bring 307 00:21:22.319 --> 00:21:25.720 in a lot of people from the past, from the Attitude era, you 308 00:21:25.759 --> 00:21:27.960 know. And I just I think that might have something to do with it, 309 00:21:29.000 --> 00:21:33.079 because maybe they're thinking that's gonna you know, sell more tickets or more 310 00:21:33.079 --> 00:21:37.599 pay per views Patisa versus Randy Orton, And I really don't think that will 311 00:21:37.720 --> 00:21:41.799 I think Daniel Brian versus Randy Orton again, will you know, and if 312 00:21:41.920 --> 00:21:45.960 if it's like John Cena and Randy Orton for the umpteenth millions time, I 313 00:21:47.039 --> 00:21:51.039 really don't think people are in tune to that as much as they would be 314 00:21:51.279 --> 00:21:55.359 to Daniel Brian and Randy Orton. I would even take a rematch from SummerSlam 315 00:21:55.440 --> 00:21:57.880 Daniel Bryan and John Cena. Yeah, exactly, That's what I was saying. 316 00:21:57.960 --> 00:22:02.680 I just I think people would tune in and buy the pay per view 317 00:22:02.759 --> 00:22:07.880 to see that and hopefully Daniel will get to go over because and he should, 318 00:22:07.000 --> 00:22:11.559 he really should. And it's like I said, and I just I 319 00:22:11.680 --> 00:22:15.039 think it's Hunter, Hunter's way of you know, this guy shouldn't be the 320 00:22:15.039 --> 00:22:21.400 face of the company. He's not your typical big guy that stands out, 321 00:22:21.559 --> 00:22:23.640 you know. And I just and I think it goes against everything Hunter believes. 322 00:22:23.680 --> 00:22:27.359 But it's almost the people are dictating this is what needs to happen, 323 00:22:27.960 --> 00:22:33.559 you know. But as far as Batista, I just don't think that's gonna 324 00:22:33.920 --> 00:22:37.480 you know, they're gonna bring back probably your your fan from back in the 325 00:22:37.519 --> 00:22:41.920 day when Batista was around and stuff like that, because he's got a lot 326 00:22:41.920 --> 00:22:45.400 of following you know, but I just don't think it would be as big 327 00:22:45.039 --> 00:22:53.119 if it was Daniel Bryan. I really don't. In twenty twelve, NXT 328 00:22:53.319 --> 00:22:59.359 transitioned into the developmental system and ultimately the brand you see today. On the 329 00:22:59.400 --> 00:23:03.720 Torch va Pea podcast NXT Eight Years Back, we'll be taking a weekly look 330 00:23:03.759 --> 00:23:08.839 at this page in NXT's early history. Joined Kelly Wells and me Tom Stout 331 00:23:08.920 --> 00:23:14.279 from PWT talks NXT every Saturday as we go eight years back to the day 332 00:23:14.480 --> 00:23:18.960 to track NXT's rising talents and why they did or didn't work out exclusively for 333 00:23:18.000 --> 00:23:30.039 PW Torch VIP members. The return of Matista. It popped a big rating 334 00:23:30.039 --> 00:23:34.319 on Monday Night, or it seemed to, but Daniel Brian was turned baby 335 00:23:34.319 --> 00:23:38.079 face. Essentially, we broke away from the Wive family the week before SmackDown's 336 00:23:38.119 --> 00:23:42.640 rating was up, Batista wasn't on SmackDown and SmackDown's rating was up. Batista 337 00:23:42.839 --> 00:23:47.920 was on Raw in the first hour and the first hour of Raw rating was 338 00:23:48.000 --> 00:23:51.319 up, but Daniel Bryan was also in the first quarter hour of Raw and 339 00:23:51.319 --> 00:23:55.759 bled over into the second quarter hour. I'm really curious if, and I 340 00:23:55.759 --> 00:23:59.079 don't know if we'll ever know for sure if the big pop and the rating 341 00:23:59.119 --> 00:24:03.279 for raw averaging a three point five, which was phenomenal earlier this week, 342 00:24:03.640 --> 00:24:08.559 if we could ever figure out if that had more to do with fans being 343 00:24:08.640 --> 00:24:15.079 so excited that their Daniel Brian was back and they congregated on Monday, and 344 00:24:15.759 --> 00:24:18.119 if they were happy with Daniel Brian's push and what he said. If they 345 00:24:18.119 --> 00:24:21.640 stick around, it's going to be hard to differentiate between the two of them 346 00:24:22.000 --> 00:24:23.279 in terms of you know, who drew that rating. I don't know how 347 00:24:23.359 --> 00:24:26.519 Vince will do it. You keep saying Triple H. I'm wondering, Bob, 348 00:24:26.559 --> 00:24:29.519 how do you think if Triple H was not in the equation? Do 349 00:24:29.559 --> 00:24:33.079 you think Vince McMahon, from your experience working with him and around him, 350 00:24:33.079 --> 00:24:38.319 would have been more open to Daniel Bryan being pushed more consistently and sincerely with 351 00:24:38.359 --> 00:24:42.119 what the fans wanted. Or do you think Hunter is really almost overriding what 352 00:24:42.200 --> 00:24:47.480 Vince's instincs would be in this case. Hunter's got a lot of input, 353 00:24:47.720 --> 00:24:49.359 you know, when it comes to vance. I mean, he Vince listens 354 00:24:49.400 --> 00:24:53.480 to him. And again, Hunter's very smart, Trug, I mean, 355 00:24:53.519 --> 00:24:57.279 he is very intelligent. He's got a great mind for the business, but 356 00:24:57.839 --> 00:25:00.960 you know, if he I think what gets in the way is the personal 357 00:25:02.000 --> 00:25:06.880 feeling thing. But you know, like Vince, I mean, Vince made 358 00:25:06.920 --> 00:25:11.079 Ray mysterial world champion, and look how and Ray was half the size of 359 00:25:11.200 --> 00:25:15.519 Daniel. You know, you've had small people as a world champion before, 360 00:25:15.119 --> 00:25:18.319 you know, And I just I just think, you know, with Hunter 361 00:25:18.400 --> 00:25:22.599 in the position that he's in, he has a major, major influence on 362 00:25:22.680 --> 00:25:27.720 the decisions that are carried out. And I just you know, and because 363 00:25:27.720 --> 00:25:32.079 I keep going back to what he said about Daniel Bryant, you know, 364 00:25:32.680 --> 00:25:36.640 and he said, this guy is not the face of the company, he's 365 00:25:36.759 --> 00:25:41.240 not world champion material, and I and I think he's wrong. I really 366 00:25:41.319 --> 00:25:44.559 do. And I you know, no disrespect to Hunter by no means, 367 00:25:44.839 --> 00:25:49.519 but the people can tell you that, you know. And let's go back 368 00:25:49.559 --> 00:25:53.279 to the rating thing, because I think a lot of I think a lot 369 00:25:53.319 --> 00:25:57.440 of that was curiosity. You know, what what's Dave going to do when 370 00:25:57.480 --> 00:26:00.720 he comes back? Because that that's what it was for me. I was 371 00:26:00.839 --> 00:26:04.519 curious to see. It's not that you know, hey, I want to 372 00:26:04.519 --> 00:26:08.000 tune in to see Dave beseised to come back. I tuned in because I 373 00:26:08.079 --> 00:26:11.839 wanted to see what he was going to do. Yeah, and I think 374 00:26:11.960 --> 00:26:15.079 I think that's where a lot of that rating might have came in. But 375 00:26:15.160 --> 00:26:18.799 I also think, you know, a lot of it's because of Daniel Bryant, 376 00:26:19.359 --> 00:26:22.480 you know. So it's it's like you said, it's hard to differentiate 377 00:26:22.519 --> 00:26:26.960 and we'll never know, but you know, and I tuned in because I 378 00:26:27.000 --> 00:26:30.279 was just curious and that's the only reason I tuned in to see what was 379 00:26:30.279 --> 00:26:34.799 going to happen. Let's go to the film banks, and I want to 380 00:26:34.880 --> 00:26:37.920 let people know they can call if they want to get in line on the 381 00:26:37.920 --> 00:26:41.400 phone banks to talk to hardcore bob Olli. The number is six four six 382 00:26:41.640 --> 00:26:45.119 seven one nine A two eight. I'm Wade Keller, editor and publisher of 383 00:26:45.160 --> 00:26:48.880 the Pro Wrestling Torch newsletter and pw torch dot com and also MMA toorch dot 384 00:26:48.920 --> 00:26:52.599 com. If you're a UFC fan, be sure to check out our sister 385 00:26:52.680 --> 00:26:55.960 publication, our sister website, mmatorch dot com, and we also have an 386 00:26:56.000 --> 00:26:59.400 app. Just search MMA Torch in the Google play Store, the Apple App 387 00:26:59.440 --> 00:27:06.079 Store, Amazon Kindle Fire Store and enter MMA Torch and downloader app. It's 388 00:27:06.119 --> 00:27:08.559 free and we'll keep you up to date with great daily updates. We cover 389 00:27:08.680 --> 00:27:12.319 all the top news stories, have a great staff of analysts and contributors that 390 00:27:12.960 --> 00:27:17.079 will help you keep up on what's going on in USC and all other MMA 391 00:27:17.119 --> 00:27:18.440 groups like Bellatour. All right, let's go to our first phone call. 392 00:27:18.440 --> 00:27:22.599 This is a VIP member the VIP Express Line Airy code nine to five to 393 00:27:22.640 --> 00:27:26.599 two. This is Brian from Minnesota. Minneapolis. Brian, welcome back to 394 00:27:26.640 --> 00:27:30.799 the show. Thank you, Wade, and hello Bob. A spark plug 395 00:27:30.960 --> 00:27:33.480 and I mean that pun intendantly of the WWF during the nineties, you and 396 00:27:33.519 --> 00:27:37.000 Owen Hart were among my favorites to watch who always gave me great matches. 397 00:27:37.039 --> 00:27:40.559 So thank you Bob. Thanks, oh well, thank you very much. 398 00:27:40.640 --> 00:27:44.640 Ryan, Thank you very very much. I appreciate that I was going to 399 00:27:44.640 --> 00:27:47.119 ask you just one question, and that's in regards to what you guys have 400 00:27:47.200 --> 00:27:51.480 Meit disgusting and like for example, Randy Orton has the two strikes and several 401 00:27:51.559 --> 00:27:55.839 things he has not done right. And Dave Batista was protected when he came 402 00:27:55.880 --> 00:27:57.680 out, nothing was said ill about him. He was only pushed even though 403 00:27:57.680 --> 00:28:00.799 he's not a super megastar, but someone like the Rock comes in and he 404 00:28:00.839 --> 00:28:04.839 gets a couple of gigs. I was curious about some ways and how the 405 00:28:04.920 --> 00:28:11.240 physic man and the family of the mcmnons, as always the executive protect certain 406 00:28:11.279 --> 00:28:14.720 wrestlers, and why they do it, for example, like a Randy Orton, 407 00:28:15.799 --> 00:28:19.160 right I you know, I just think it all boils down to money, 408 00:28:19.319 --> 00:28:22.359 you know. It just that's what it boils down to. And and 409 00:28:22.640 --> 00:28:26.759 you know, Randy is a huge, huge money maker for the company. 410 00:28:26.920 --> 00:28:30.920 So a lot of you know, a lot of things are thrown to the 411 00:28:30.920 --> 00:28:34.359 wayside, and you know they just turn and look the other way when you 412 00:28:34.400 --> 00:28:40.200 know, things go on. So you know, it's it's it's it's really 413 00:28:40.240 --> 00:28:44.359 political when it comes to that stuff. And it's just it boils down to 414 00:28:45.119 --> 00:28:48.960 you know, because Randy makes a ton a ton of money for that company, 415 00:28:48.559 --> 00:28:53.599 you know, and Vince isn't gonna you know, reprimand somebody for you 416 00:28:53.640 --> 00:29:00.799 know, and and try to discipline somebody and send him home or whatever for 417 00:29:02.160 --> 00:29:04.240 you know, their actions, especially when they make a lot of money, 418 00:29:04.240 --> 00:29:07.799 and right now, when that person's the face of the company, you know, 419 00:29:07.960 --> 00:29:14.960 So it just boils down to a lot of political you know stuff here 420 00:29:14.960 --> 00:29:19.119 and there. Brian anything else, I just I just want to hear about 421 00:29:19.119 --> 00:29:22.880 the mud in WWE. Thank you so much, Bob and your books amazing. 422 00:29:23.000 --> 00:29:26.400 Thanks again, Thank you, Brian, thank you. Have a good 423 00:29:26.480 --> 00:29:33.839 night. Excellent Bob. You were around during Randy Orton's rookie span in WWF 424 00:29:33.960 --> 00:29:40.759 WWE. Did you think he had everything it took athletically, appearance, wise, 425 00:29:41.079 --> 00:29:44.759 promos, work, ethic, attitude, professionalism. Did he look like 426 00:29:44.759 --> 00:29:48.200 somebody who was going to be the total package and be the face of the 427 00:29:48.200 --> 00:29:51.319 company or did you see that there might be a couple of things that keep 428 00:29:51.359 --> 00:29:55.440 him from being that premier money player that had John Cena, Steve Austin Rockho 429 00:29:55.519 --> 00:30:00.160 Cogan types have become. No, I've always seen it in Randy, you 430 00:30:00.160 --> 00:30:04.079 know, because he's he's you know, spot on with his matches. Is 431 00:30:04.160 --> 00:30:10.599 all his matches are pretty pretty darn good, and his facial expressions and how 432 00:30:10.640 --> 00:30:14.599 he takes time to you know, deliver his lines and stuff like that. 433 00:30:14.759 --> 00:30:17.000 You know, at first when they come in, Yeah, they're nervous, 434 00:30:17.039 --> 00:30:19.880 so you may not see something right away because a lot of their stuff is 435 00:30:19.960 --> 00:30:26.359 rushed because they're so nervous, and that's to be expected. But it's you 436 00:30:26.400 --> 00:30:27.839 know, the weeks went on. Is because I worked with him a lot 437 00:30:27.880 --> 00:30:33.000 when he first came in, and you know, within a few weeks I 438 00:30:33.160 --> 00:30:37.079 really started seeing, Hey, this guy could possibly be, you know, 439 00:30:37.640 --> 00:30:41.480 one of the top guys. And because I worked with him, so I 440 00:30:41.559 --> 00:30:42.839 know in the ring, I know how he feels, I know how he 441 00:30:42.880 --> 00:30:47.440 works. He's there for everything, and you know, and he can get 442 00:30:47.519 --> 00:30:48.880 rough. You get rough with him, he can get rough right back, 443 00:30:48.920 --> 00:30:52.359 and he you know, and he can bring it and he can deliver. 444 00:30:52.839 --> 00:30:56.160 You know, he delivers when he has to deliver. And just watching him 445 00:30:56.200 --> 00:30:59.720 the other night, I told my wife, I said, you know, 446 00:31:00.039 --> 00:31:03.799 and he is really good at facial expressions and timing. I said, he 447 00:31:03.799 --> 00:31:08.559 he knows, he knows, you know, what to do. He knows 448 00:31:08.599 --> 00:31:12.400 what it takes to be where he's at. And you know, I've always 449 00:31:12.480 --> 00:31:17.920 believed that one day he would be on top. And that's just you know, 450 00:31:18.400 --> 00:31:21.720 from observing and being around him and working with him, and you know, 451 00:31:21.880 --> 00:31:25.400 and the only thing that could have held him back was you know, 452 00:31:25.480 --> 00:31:29.440 he his attitude here and there, and you know, he got in trouble 453 00:31:29.680 --> 00:31:33.680 a few times along the road and stuff like that. But hopefully he's over 454 00:31:33.720 --> 00:31:37.079 all that and but I mean I always knew that he could become something, 455 00:31:37.559 --> 00:31:41.319 you know, because he he did have. He had what it took, 456 00:31:41.680 --> 00:31:45.240 and you know it's obvious. The same question about Batista. You're around for 457 00:31:45.480 --> 00:31:51.839 the entirety of Dave Batista's early career in WWF, wwe I cauld think WWF 458 00:31:51.839 --> 00:31:55.680 because you were around with WWF. The same thing about him, like, 459 00:31:56.000 --> 00:32:00.000 did did you think that he he was a total package to still a term 460 00:32:00.000 --> 00:32:02.839 from Lex Winter. I didn't see it. I did not see it in 461 00:32:02.920 --> 00:32:06.279 him, yea, And I'll tell you why. And this is just my 462 00:32:06.400 --> 00:32:09.440 opinion, okay. I mean everybody's got different opinion, different opinions on everyone, 463 00:32:09.920 --> 00:32:15.240 you know, and I just I because he's not He's not that crisp 464 00:32:15.400 --> 00:32:21.599 worker like you see in Randy Orton or you know, or Punter or Shawn 465 00:32:21.759 --> 00:32:28.200 Michaels or Undertaker. He's just he's you know, he's your typical bodybuilder. 466 00:32:28.240 --> 00:32:30.640 He's blocking, he's not good at promos, and who am I wanted to 467 00:32:30.680 --> 00:32:34.640 talk? But I mean I can give my opinion because I know I suck 468 00:32:34.680 --> 00:32:37.960 at promos, so I can I can say, you know, he's not 469 00:32:37.400 --> 00:32:42.200 that good at promos, and he still isn't to this day. And I 470 00:32:42.359 --> 00:32:46.240 just never saw it in him. But when he was with Evolution, him 471 00:32:46.240 --> 00:32:51.519 and Hunter became really close friends, really tight, you know. So that 472 00:32:51.640 --> 00:32:54.720 goes a long way, you know, And and that to tell you why 473 00:32:54.759 --> 00:32:59.440 he's where he is, you know, I really because when he let me 474 00:32:59.440 --> 00:33:01.759 tell you some when he first came to wrestling, when he was in Louisville, 475 00:33:01.799 --> 00:33:06.359 because I was when I first met him, you know, after I 476 00:33:06.400 --> 00:33:09.079 had had next surgery. I was out for thirteen months and they sent me 477 00:33:09.119 --> 00:33:13.440 to Louisville to get the ring Russ knocked off and I was there for three 478 00:33:13.559 --> 00:33:17.720 or four weeks. Well, Dave was there, and he to me, 479 00:33:17.839 --> 00:33:22.279 he was just green is the grass outside? Well not now because it's snow, 480 00:33:22.319 --> 00:33:28.119 but anyway, he just he didn't have what it took. And you 481 00:33:28.119 --> 00:33:31.839 know, he's he's a bodybuilder and see and Hunter's a bodybuilder. So I 482 00:33:31.880 --> 00:33:37.039 think that's how Hunter took to him. And you know Vince also, you 483 00:33:37.039 --> 00:33:39.599 know, he Vince is a freak for bodybuilders. Guys are big guys, 484 00:33:39.640 --> 00:33:44.200 you know, so and I think that's what they saw in him, and 485 00:33:44.319 --> 00:33:47.039 him and Hunter became really tight and then off to the races as he went, 486 00:33:47.200 --> 00:33:52.400 and I truly believe that's why he's at where he is today because he 487 00:33:52.680 --> 00:33:55.839 was good such good friends with Hunter, you know. And I just I've 488 00:33:55.920 --> 00:34:00.839 never been impressed with his matches, you know, and if if you know, 489 00:34:00.160 --> 00:34:05.920 and I that's just my opinion, and you know, and I think 490 00:34:05.960 --> 00:34:09.679 it's a fair assessment because I you know, I think I'm I'll tell you, 491 00:34:12.039 --> 00:34:15.000 I'll call it like I see it, and you know, and I've 492 00:34:15.039 --> 00:34:19.079 and I'm you know, you know me, I've told you guys that can 493 00:34:19.119 --> 00:34:22.360 work and guys that can't work. And I've always thought Dave really wasn't one 494 00:34:22.360 --> 00:34:24.480 of those kind of guys, you know. And he's always had had to 495 00:34:24.519 --> 00:34:29.519 have somebody lead him. And the good matches that he has had, if 496 00:34:29.559 --> 00:34:34.599 you think about the good matches, he's always had somebody leading him, you 497 00:34:34.639 --> 00:34:37.800 know. So but if you just he's just he just doesn't move smoothly in 498 00:34:37.840 --> 00:34:43.440 the ring. And I've never seen anything in him, I really haven't. 499 00:34:43.440 --> 00:34:45.519 I mean, he looks great, You've got a great build, but that's 500 00:34:45.559 --> 00:34:51.480 not what wrestling's all about anymore anymore. Got our people to you towards VIP 501 00:34:51.599 --> 00:34:53.199 sale going on right now a new year, so we don't normally do this. 502 00:34:53.280 --> 00:34:58.800 Get six dollars off of VIP membership right now with coupon code New Year 503 00:34:58.920 --> 00:35:01.639 twenty twenty four. That's New Year twenty twenty four. Take six dollars off 504 00:35:01.639 --> 00:35:06.039 our normal nine dollars ninety nine cent monthly rate that gives you one month the 505 00:35:06.119 --> 00:35:08.440 VIP membership for three dollars and ninety nine cents. Act now. It's a 506 00:35:08.440 --> 00:35:14.119 limited time offer here to kick off the New Year twenty twenty four. So 507 00:35:14.199 --> 00:35:17.920 many perks come with VIP membership. Our retro World Class Champion Wrestling review, 508 00:35:19.280 --> 00:35:22.239 our post pay per view reviews both in podcast and written format, add free 509 00:35:22.320 --> 00:35:25.400 versions of our free shows like this one, and so much more. Pw 510 00:35:25.480 --> 00:35:30.480 torch dot com slash go VIP coupon code New Year twenty twenty four and take 511 00:35:30.559 --> 00:35:35.239 six dollars off a one month, three month or one year VIP subscription. 512 00:35:38.639 --> 00:35:42.679 He seemed to get a push. I don't know, I want to say 513 00:35:42.679 --> 00:35:45.960 prematurely, but the window for his push to really increase came when brock Lesnard 514 00:35:45.960 --> 00:35:51.360 decided to leave WWE and first strut out for the Vikings and then obviously went 515 00:35:51.400 --> 00:35:54.599 to USC and there was kind of the spot open, and they looked for 516 00:35:54.639 --> 00:35:59.440 somebody who looked like they were a main eventor as opposed to you know, 517 00:35:59.480 --> 00:36:01.599 And it's not that they didn't give jabl obviously a good chance and Eddie Guerrero 518 00:36:01.679 --> 00:36:05.920 good push, and it wasn't like other people didn't have chances. But Batista 519 00:36:06.039 --> 00:36:09.559 really got accelerated when brock Lesnar left and you were around for that, was 520 00:36:09.559 --> 00:36:15.800 there some jealousy or some eyebrow raising that, Wow, is Dave really ready 521 00:36:15.880 --> 00:36:22.239 to carry that level of matches and promos that because he's you know, with 522 00:36:22.239 --> 00:36:24.239 all the respect of Batista, and I think he has improved over time, 523 00:36:24.280 --> 00:36:29.440 and I think he's a natural on facial expressions, like I think he has 524 00:36:29.480 --> 00:36:32.440 some intangibles that that are something that not everybody has, and so he's not 525 00:36:32.519 --> 00:36:38.880 just an empty vessel. But I do think that he wouldn't have necessarily been 526 00:36:39.000 --> 00:36:43.000 everybody's choice of being the right guy to push at that time. So take 527 00:36:43.079 --> 00:36:44.920 us back to that time in the locker room, because I'm sure some guys 528 00:36:44.920 --> 00:36:46.880 who have been around longer had their own opinions thought, is Dave really the 529 00:36:46.920 --> 00:36:52.280 right choice? You know? The thing is when somebody comes in and they 530 00:36:52.320 --> 00:36:57.079 don't have it experienced, you know, and they've never they've never been up 531 00:36:57.079 --> 00:37:00.199 and down the road and made five ten here and there, like a lot 532 00:37:00.239 --> 00:37:04.639 of the other guys that have put their time in. You know, sure 533 00:37:04.679 --> 00:37:07.400 that's going to come up. You know it's going to be like, Okay, 534 00:37:07.960 --> 00:37:12.000 you know I can outwork this guy. I looked almost as good as 535 00:37:12.079 --> 00:37:15.719 him. You know, I'm better at promos than him. You know, 536 00:37:15.760 --> 00:37:19.880 a lot of guys think that way, but it's just not the way it 537 00:37:20.039 --> 00:37:23.079 is. It's the right place at the right time. And another thing I 538 00:37:23.119 --> 00:37:28.519 was going to say is when Dave was in Louisville when I first met him, 539 00:37:28.800 --> 00:37:31.760 he really wasn't a wrestling fan. You know, he just he saw 540 00:37:31.800 --> 00:37:36.000 it and he wanted to try it. And you know, he's never really 541 00:37:36.159 --> 00:37:38.679 been a wrestling fan. I mean he is now now that he's been in 542 00:37:38.719 --> 00:37:43.639 it. But you know a lot of these guys they see it on TV 543 00:37:43.760 --> 00:37:45.639 and it's like, oh, I think I want to try that, and 544 00:37:45.679 --> 00:37:47.280 that's what they end up doing. And you know, Dave, it was 545 00:37:47.400 --> 00:37:51.800 the right place at the right time for him, because I promise you you 546 00:37:51.800 --> 00:37:53.840 know, when we're in Louisville and we all you know, because me and 547 00:37:53.920 --> 00:37:58.840 him and Kevin Fertige and a couple other guys. We would go out to 548 00:37:59.119 --> 00:38:01.760 lunch and stuff like debt or to dinner afterwards or whatever. And I just 549 00:38:01.880 --> 00:38:07.360 I liked a great guy, super super nice, nice guy. I have 550 00:38:07.360 --> 00:38:09.280 all the respect in the world for him, you know, very polite, 551 00:38:09.679 --> 00:38:14.559 and I just never I was like, I just don't see anything great build, 552 00:38:14.639 --> 00:38:16.280 big guy, you know, but those guys are a dime a dozen, 553 00:38:16.920 --> 00:38:21.800 you know, and I just never saw anything in him. But getting 554 00:38:21.840 --> 00:38:23.719 back to your question, you know, yeah, there's a lot of that 555 00:38:23.719 --> 00:38:27.000 that goes on in the locker room. You know. It's like, okay, 556 00:38:27.000 --> 00:38:29.639 why not me? Well, you know, what is it about me 557 00:38:29.760 --> 00:38:34.239 that you know? And they choose him over me, And it's just a 558 00:38:34.559 --> 00:38:37.360 lot of its right time, right place. And and also it is a 559 00:38:37.400 --> 00:38:42.039 political decision. You know, politics play a big part in it. And 560 00:38:42.079 --> 00:38:45.800 that's something that I just couldn't do, play the political game, because I'll 561 00:38:45.880 --> 00:38:50.039 be damned if I was going to be up Hunter's ass every day or hang 562 00:38:50.159 --> 00:38:52.960 out with those guys and just to get further in the company, you know, 563 00:38:53.039 --> 00:38:57.159 And that's just something I chose not to do. I just, you 564 00:38:57.199 --> 00:38:59.920 know, I wanted my talent to dictate how I how far I went. 565 00:39:00.480 --> 00:39:05.239 But you know, I just think a lot of it is political and right 566 00:39:05.280 --> 00:39:08.559 place, right time. Also, well, well if people want to read 567 00:39:08.679 --> 00:39:15.760 more of that type of insight and forthright opinions and observations from his time in 568 00:39:15.800 --> 00:39:17.559 the trenches for fifteen years. Again, the book is a hardcore truth. 569 00:39:19.000 --> 00:39:21.519 Check it out, buy it online, have it delivered to our mailbox soon. 570 00:39:21.559 --> 00:39:25.960 Buy it as an ebook on your Kindle or Nook or Sony's what is 571 00:39:27.000 --> 00:39:29.199 Sony's Reader calls whatever, there's all kinds of readers out there. You can 572 00:39:29.239 --> 00:39:31.920 have it in two minutes if you do it that way. Let's go back 573 00:39:31.920 --> 00:39:34.519 to the phone lines. I got lots of follow up questions, but I 574 00:39:34.559 --> 00:39:37.480 want to get to callers too, So let's go to our next VIP Express 575 00:39:37.519 --> 00:39:40.000 caller. This is Will from the New Jersey area. Will, thanks for 576 00:39:40.039 --> 00:39:45.920 holding. Please confirm your name and where you're from. Will it is this 577 00:39:46.039 --> 00:39:51.960 you? All right? Well, let's go eight five six? Is it's 578 00:39:51.960 --> 00:39:54.679 a different caller from the New Jersey area. Hello? Hello, yep, 579 00:39:57.159 --> 00:39:59.280 yeah, this is Will from Jersey. Oh good, well, sorry, 580 00:39:59.280 --> 00:40:06.719 we didn't mean to wake up my question on it. I guess I just 581 00:40:06.719 --> 00:40:09.559 don't get it. I understand if the fans are gonna crazy with Daniel Bryan 582 00:40:10.159 --> 00:40:13.719 and they're showing you that, you know what I mean, if they'll consistently 583 00:40:13.760 --> 00:40:16.360 watch if he's on, how can he not push him? Like? What 584 00:40:16.440 --> 00:40:20.280 can you do not watch when you know what I mean, when you put 585 00:40:20.280 --> 00:40:22.960 if you don't want to see or on for them to realize it, Like, 586 00:40:23.000 --> 00:40:24.840 I don't you know what I mean. I can't understand how they can 587 00:40:24.840 --> 00:40:30.559 say he's right and wrong when we're the ones watching the product. So we 588 00:40:30.599 --> 00:40:34.320 should be dictating who is, you know, anything who's getting a pushed. 589 00:40:34.440 --> 00:40:37.559 They don't have to put him out there for sponsorship like Sina, but for 590 00:40:37.679 --> 00:40:40.400 who we want to see on TV rap When you would think that he would 591 00:40:40.440 --> 00:40:45.320 you know, listen to what's going on in the live ARFE and the people 592 00:40:45.320 --> 00:40:47.559 who are paying. Oh yeah, I agree with you, and that's the 593 00:40:47.559 --> 00:40:52.480 way it should be, but unfortunately it's not in some cases. I mean, 594 00:40:52.760 --> 00:40:54.400 yeah, they put Daniel Broy. They know they've got to put Daniel 595 00:40:54.440 --> 00:40:59.280 Bryan on every week in some capacity, in some role, you know, 596 00:40:59.320 --> 00:41:01.639 whether it be top guy, mid card, because they bump him down I 597 00:41:01.639 --> 00:41:07.119 guess to mid card now and so you know, and ratings say a lot 598 00:41:07.159 --> 00:41:14.039 about somebody when when they're on TV, and it's I think it's gotten to 599 00:41:14.039 --> 00:41:19.800 the point now and I think the fans have expressed their opinion, you know, 600 00:41:20.559 --> 00:41:22.880 for Daniel Bryan to be back on top, and you know, and 601 00:41:23.039 --> 00:41:27.480 and plus you can see in the arenas the people going crazy for him, 602 00:41:27.800 --> 00:41:30.840 and I think it's gotten to the point now it's like, okay, they 603 00:41:30.920 --> 00:41:34.119 they're almost like backed into a corner. We've got to do something more with 604 00:41:34.159 --> 00:41:36.840 this guy. We got to put him back in the role that he played 605 00:41:36.880 --> 00:41:39.880 before. So I think that's the direction. I'm hoping they do the right 606 00:41:39.960 --> 00:41:43.719 thing, you know, and make the fans happy, because that's what it's 607 00:41:43.719 --> 00:41:45.760 all about, making the fans happy. And I hope they do the right 608 00:41:45.800 --> 00:41:49.360 thing and put him back in that spot, you know. And and but 609 00:41:49.440 --> 00:41:52.239 I agree with you, you know, it should be up to the fans, 610 00:41:52.280 --> 00:41:54.559 Like you said, well, appreciate the call. Let's stop, let's 611 00:41:54.559 --> 00:41:57.960 go to one. Let's go to another phone call here and we'll go to 612 00:41:58.239 --> 00:42:00.480 Eric code U six nine six. I think we're holding. Please state your 613 00:42:00.519 --> 00:42:05.559 name and where you're from. Oh, this is Lewis again from New Jersey. 614 00:42:05.639 --> 00:42:07.000 Hey, Lewis, thanks for Colin. What do you got for Bob 615 00:42:07.000 --> 00:42:10.079 Holly today? Well, first of all, you're lucky. You just got 616 00:42:10.079 --> 00:42:13.519 three new Jersey people in a row. That's great. Hey, there's nothing 617 00:42:13.519 --> 00:42:22.199 more lucky. Hey Lewis, what's going on? Where you're at? Is 618 00:42:22.360 --> 00:42:28.119 showing where you're at? Yes, actually I'm driving or out on the snow, 619 00:42:28.239 --> 00:42:30.320 so I'm risking my life to talk to you. You know. Oh 620 00:42:30.519 --> 00:42:35.599 I appreciate that. Well, thank you. And the ticket, yeah, 621 00:42:35.679 --> 00:42:37.800 absolutely absolutely, yep, I got the phone right to my ear. But 622 00:42:37.880 --> 00:42:40.400 hey, I'm in the military, so you know I usually just flashed the 623 00:42:40.480 --> 00:42:44.239 car. So well, hell, thank you for your service. Then, 624 00:42:44.320 --> 00:42:49.079 thank you very very very much. Thank you for your support. Definitely. 625 00:42:49.519 --> 00:42:52.519 So right now, that's always just like most people from Jersey because he's got 626 00:42:52.599 --> 00:42:55.480 got another guy named Kyland that does the same thing. I got three things 627 00:42:57.320 --> 00:43:00.639 les than four months. The quickest thing is probably like, I know you've 628 00:43:00.639 --> 00:43:02.960 done this about a million signs, but can you clear up what the finish 629 00:43:04.199 --> 00:43:08.599 was supposed to be? I think it was WrestleMania two sixteenth, where you 630 00:43:08.639 --> 00:43:13.760 know, like you guys all look like chickens with your heads got off like 631 00:43:13.760 --> 00:43:16.760 when Yeah, some of the one with Crash, it looked like where a 632 00:43:16.800 --> 00:43:23.239 timer was supposedly messed up. Talk about that pop and and give a little 633 00:43:23.280 --> 00:43:27.599 background for people who don't know what what Lewis is talking about. Yeah, 634 00:43:27.639 --> 00:43:30.440 it was a hardcore match where there was several of us in it, and 635 00:43:30.800 --> 00:43:36.880 there was a clock on the Titan Tron and it was counting down because we 636 00:43:36.920 --> 00:43:42.280 had like fifteen minutes a fifteen minute time limit, and Crash was supposed to 637 00:43:42.320 --> 00:43:45.920 win. Well, it didn't work out because when Tim White when I made 638 00:43:45.960 --> 00:43:50.519 the cover on Crash, I blurred TAZ. I believe it was one of 639 00:43:50.559 --> 00:43:54.159 those two. Anyway, they counted as the timer went that to what you 640 00:43:54.159 --> 00:43:59.800 know, three to two one. Timmy White was counting we got this and 641 00:44:00.199 --> 00:44:04.880 he had the buzzer didn't go off and he had to count to three and 642 00:44:05.599 --> 00:44:12.199 they the timer was messed up. It wasn't synchronized with in the TV truck 643 00:44:12.440 --> 00:44:16.039 with the timer on the Titan Tron, and so that's where everything got messed 644 00:44:16.079 --> 00:44:20.719 up because it was supposed to be one two, the buzzer goes off and 645 00:44:20.800 --> 00:44:24.599 Crash retains the hardcore title. So that's what was actually how it was supposed 646 00:44:24.639 --> 00:44:30.119 to go down, but the timer was off, and you know because Timmy 647 00:44:30.119 --> 00:44:32.679 White had the earpiece in his ear and they were counting down to him as 648 00:44:32.719 --> 00:44:37.480 he was counting one, two, and then the buzzer goes off and he 649 00:44:37.599 --> 00:44:39.960 had to hit three because he would have looked stupid if you'd have just stopped, 650 00:44:40.239 --> 00:44:44.239 you know, right away. So he had to count to three and 651 00:44:44.320 --> 00:44:47.360 the buzzer didn't go off, you know, so until after the fact. 652 00:44:47.440 --> 00:44:52.400 But that was that was the original plan. You know. The timer was 653 00:44:52.400 --> 00:44:57.800 supposed to go off as tim White was counting before his hand hit three, 654 00:44:58.159 --> 00:45:02.920 and Crash was supposed to retain the the Hardcore title. Instead, I ended 655 00:45:02.960 --> 00:45:13.000 up with it all right. You don't have to wait for the way Keller 656 00:45:13.079 --> 00:45:15.000 Pro Wrestling post show to find out what I thought of Monday Night Raw and 657 00:45:15.079 --> 00:45:19.599 SmackDown. Each week, you can check out my reports that are updated live 658 00:45:19.639 --> 00:45:23.800 throughout Raw and SmackDown at pwtorch dot com. My written report will tell you 659 00:45:23.840 --> 00:45:28.039 what's happening in detail in case you missed the show, and it will also 660 00:45:28.159 --> 00:45:32.559 analyze key segments and give my random thoughts quips on what I'm watching as it 661 00:45:32.639 --> 00:45:37.079 airs, So check it out every Monday night and Tuesday night at pewtorch dot 662 00:45:37.119 --> 00:45:43.119 com. That also applies to wwepayperviews. I cover those live at pw torch 663 00:45:43.119 --> 00:45:45.400 dot com with a detailed written report with star ratings, and of course you 664 00:45:45.400 --> 00:45:51.320 can find other TV reports from other contributors to pw torch such as nxt roh, 665 00:45:51.360 --> 00:45:54.679 Impact Wrestling and more. Check it out pwtorch dot com your first stop 666 00:45:54.840 --> 00:46:09.800 for TV and pay per views written reports. Thanks for clearing that out, 667 00:46:10.239 --> 00:46:15.599 and the fancy thing is quick quickly? Do you have any click stories since 668 00:46:15.599 --> 00:46:20.239 you talked about triple ation? You talked about politics where you know back when 669 00:46:20.239 --> 00:46:22.519 you were doing it because I was like a little kid, but I still 670 00:46:22.559 --> 00:46:27.039 remember as clear as day with the Thurman spark plug gimmicking the race car driver. 671 00:46:27.119 --> 00:46:30.480 Give me, did you have any click stories where it directly affected you? 672 00:46:31.480 --> 00:46:34.679 Oh? Yeah, yeah. If I'll tell you what, if you 673 00:46:34.719 --> 00:46:37.880 read my book, I talk all about it in there. There's a good 674 00:46:37.960 --> 00:46:43.159 story in there. Scott Hole, what's that? Uh? What was that? 675 00:46:43.679 --> 00:46:45.719 Was that? And? I thought you were just gonna leave it at 676 00:46:45.719 --> 00:46:49.800 a plug? But like, is there is there one that stands out above 677 00:46:49.840 --> 00:46:53.000 the rest? Uh? That's not in your book. No, it was 678 00:46:53.039 --> 00:46:55.719 pretty much that only one because I nipped it in the butt and they never 679 00:46:55.719 --> 00:46:59.480 messed with me again. Pretty much. Will you gotta buy the book for 680 00:46:59.519 --> 00:47:02.480 that one? Right? But if you listen to and I encourage you too, 681 00:47:02.559 --> 00:47:07.280 if to listen to the previous times Bob's been on the show in our 682 00:47:07.400 --> 00:47:08.920 archives, and if you're a VIP memver, it's real easy. Just click 683 00:47:08.960 --> 00:47:12.800 got the people, do you torch? Live cast interviews on the drop menu 684 00:47:13.079 --> 00:47:15.719 on the VIP website and uh, and then just do a search for Bob 685 00:47:15.760 --> 00:47:19.840 Holly's name and that'll pop up. It's real easy to listen to our archives. 686 00:47:19.840 --> 00:47:22.360 And I'm not sure how much you went into it earlier, Bob on 687 00:47:22.400 --> 00:47:24.840 our previous previous shows, but I know, either on the live cast or 688 00:47:24.880 --> 00:47:30.119 the VIP exclusive after shows, we certainly certainly got into that kind of politics 689 00:47:30.159 --> 00:47:32.480 more so. Well, we're not trying to do punt punt too far. 690 00:47:32.519 --> 00:47:35.760 But you got three answers, so let's let's go to the third one and 691 00:47:36.079 --> 00:47:38.519 we'll let people who read the book with that answer, I got you. 692 00:47:38.920 --> 00:47:44.599 But also last thing, the ball for all. I'm pretty sure you talked 693 00:47:44.639 --> 00:47:46.880 about this too, but like you know, doctor deaf Steve Williams. Everybody 694 00:47:46.960 --> 00:47:51.719 knew that that was supposed like, I mean, Jim Moss wanted him to 695 00:47:51.840 --> 00:47:53.880 be the guy that won the thing. So I want to know how much 696 00:47:53.960 --> 00:47:57.639 of it was a shoot and how much of it worth? I mean, 697 00:47:57.760 --> 00:48:00.679 how were you guys guided in any way? Like were you guys kind of 698 00:48:00.719 --> 00:48:05.199 like scared the death, Like oh damn, if I actually knocked this guy 699 00:48:05.239 --> 00:48:10.559 out or if I kicked this guy's out, now it was there. Well, 700 00:48:10.559 --> 00:48:14.239 hold Lewis, hold on, Bob, before you answer, I just 701 00:48:14.239 --> 00:48:16.679 want to say, this is my this and there are many candidates, but 702 00:48:16.719 --> 00:48:21.039 this might have been my favorite part of the book. Was your chapter about 703 00:48:21.039 --> 00:48:23.280 the brawl for all. It was so in depth and I learned a lot 704 00:48:23.280 --> 00:48:25.800 from it. I talked to people about it for years and got a lot 705 00:48:25.800 --> 00:48:30.960 of details. But I'm just telling people and and Lewis asked some good questions 706 00:48:30.000 --> 00:48:34.079 it. Even if you don't read books, read Bob's book, because this 707 00:48:34.199 --> 00:48:36.440 is the kind of thing that is just so fascinating when you got to sit 708 00:48:36.480 --> 00:48:37.840 down and go into such detail on it. But feel free, obviously, 709 00:48:37.840 --> 00:48:39.719 Bob, I just want to insert that in there because that was my favorite 710 00:48:39.760 --> 00:48:44.079 part of the book. Yeah, yeah, will the whole brawl for all 711 00:48:44.199 --> 00:48:46.960 it was a shoot. Every bit of it was one hundred percent shoot because 712 00:48:47.199 --> 00:48:53.159 Jim Ross just knew, without a shadow of a doubt Steve Williams, bless 713 00:48:53.199 --> 00:48:58.960 his heart, was going to come in and just run through everybody. And 714 00:48:59.039 --> 00:49:02.000 as you know the ending of that story, how that went. And uh 715 00:49:02.280 --> 00:49:06.760 yeah, no, nobody told us, hey, you know better not knock 716 00:49:06.800 --> 00:49:09.519 anybody out, you better, you know, you better lay down for this 717 00:49:09.559 --> 00:49:13.480 guy or no, none of that. It was a straight one hundred percent 718 00:49:13.559 --> 00:49:16.639 shoot. So I would I would have been Bobby. I would have been 719 00:49:16.639 --> 00:49:21.079 curious to see Doc against butter Bean, because I don't think Doc would have 720 00:49:21.079 --> 00:49:23.079 stood up with Butterbean like Bart tried to do. And so I wonder if 721 00:49:23.119 --> 00:49:27.119 if Doc got in wrestling kind of shape, you know, worked on the 722 00:49:27.159 --> 00:49:30.239 takedown, if he would have been able to do what a lot of USC 723 00:49:30.079 --> 00:49:35.000 guys with with wrestling bases are able to do against stand up guys, especially 724 00:49:35.000 --> 00:49:37.840 a stand up guy who probably doesn't have a great takedown defense, and Butterbean 725 00:49:37.239 --> 00:49:39.079 that I think probably would have been a little more of a fight than the 726 00:49:39.119 --> 00:49:45.000 bark butter well, well see, we'll see way they they had already agreed 727 00:49:45.719 --> 00:49:50.360 going into WrestleMania that it was just going to be stand up only there was 728 00:49:50.400 --> 00:49:54.320 going to be no taken down. Butterbean would not agree to takedowns or anything. 729 00:49:54.400 --> 00:49:58.719 Oh man, okay, yeah, So so that right there, and 730 00:49:58.920 --> 00:50:02.079 that's I think I failed mentioned that in my book, But that right there, 731 00:50:04.360 --> 00:50:07.840 Butterbean would have had a chance if if Mike Bart would have been able 732 00:50:07.840 --> 00:50:09.880 to shoot in on him, I think that would have lasted a little bit 733 00:50:09.920 --> 00:50:15.480 longer. But the thing is, though, Butterbean's not no idiot. You 734 00:50:15.519 --> 00:50:17.400 know, he didn't get where he was. But by being dumb, I 735 00:50:17.440 --> 00:50:22.920 mean he Bart was playing his game and he knew it, and Butterbean knew 736 00:50:22.920 --> 00:50:28.199 not to play you know, somebody else's game, and and and that's that's 737 00:50:28.239 --> 00:50:34.360 the whole thing in a nutshell right there, because Bart agreed with Butterbean that 738 00:50:34.559 --> 00:50:37.280 there would be no takedowns and just be straight up boxing. And sure enough, 739 00:50:37.400 --> 00:50:40.039 you know, look what happened to Bart by playing somebody else's game. 740 00:50:40.079 --> 00:50:44.599 You just don't do that. But I agree it, butter they would have 741 00:50:44.679 --> 00:50:49.559 never happened anyway if Butterbean was Butterbean would have never agreed to take agreed to 742 00:50:49.639 --> 00:50:53.079 doing takedowns because that's just not his thing. You know, I think if 743 00:50:53.119 --> 00:50:57.039 he took somebody down, he'd have a hard time getting back up. You 744 00:50:57.079 --> 00:50:59.239 know, he reminds me of a turtle. If he was on his back, 745 00:50:59.280 --> 00:51:01.760 you wouldn't able to get that. Uh, you know, yeah, 746 00:51:02.800 --> 00:51:07.559 you know, that's that's just you know, they brought Butterbean in for that 747 00:51:07.679 --> 00:51:12.280 one deal there, and it wasn't gonna be wrestling a straight boxing and you 748 00:51:12.320 --> 00:51:15.039 know, and and that was Bart's big mistake right there, was agreeing to 749 00:51:15.119 --> 00:51:19.800 try to try to be a boxer. Because they sent Bart off for I 750 00:51:19.840 --> 00:51:25.639 think six or eight weeks to train up in New York and to learn boxing 751 00:51:25.679 --> 00:51:30.199 techniques, and it's just not gonna happen in that short time. Let's, 752 00:51:30.239 --> 00:51:31.760 uh, let's go back to the phone lines and see what some other callers 753 00:51:31.760 --> 00:51:36.239 have to say. Thanks Louis for your call. Good questions, two one 754 00:51:36.320 --> 00:51:39.400 nine, you're up. Now Please state your name and where you're from. 755 00:51:39.599 --> 00:51:42.719 Hi, this is Mike from Indiana. Hey Mike, what do you do 756 00:51:42.960 --> 00:51:49.440 about today? Hey guys, I'm I'm I'm. I read your book. 757 00:51:49.719 --> 00:51:53.119 I enjoyed it very much. Gave him the level of respect for you after 758 00:51:53.159 --> 00:51:59.679 reading how you dealt on the asshole backstage? Well, not everyone's like that, 759 00:51:59.800 --> 00:52:05.320 but anyway, what's your question? Some of them were yeah, okay, 760 00:52:05.360 --> 00:52:08.480 anyway, two questions for you. Sure. For one, you're talking 761 00:52:08.519 --> 00:52:13.360 about the Daniel Briant situation earlier and back in nineteen ninety four. There seemed 762 00:52:13.360 --> 00:52:17.360 like they're a similar situation with Brett Hart and Mike Slugger. Sugar was being 763 00:52:17.400 --> 00:52:22.719 shot down everybody's throat, he was being hyped, and that Brett Hart he 764 00:52:22.840 --> 00:52:25.840 was kind of more of the underdog, and he seemed to get the similar 765 00:52:25.880 --> 00:52:31.800 crowd reaction that Daniel Brian's getting now, right, What was the feeling backstage 766 00:52:31.800 --> 00:52:37.519 back then? Oh gosh, it's no Brett Hart. Yeah, back see, 767 00:52:37.639 --> 00:52:40.880 back back then, you know, because I was just I was new 768 00:52:40.920 --> 00:52:45.760 to the company, and I just you know, I really wasn't aware of 769 00:52:45.159 --> 00:52:50.440 anything like that back then, and you know, because I was trying to 770 00:52:50.480 --> 00:52:52.320 get my feet wet as it is, you know, so I was just 771 00:52:52.440 --> 00:52:55.920 you know, I was just kind of like, you know, not really 772 00:52:55.960 --> 00:53:00.400 paying attention to all that kind of stuff going on on, you know, 773 00:53:00.519 --> 00:53:04.360 the little games backstage and everything, you know, because I was trying to 774 00:53:04.360 --> 00:53:08.519 get to know everybody. And but you know, I think when they try 775 00:53:08.559 --> 00:53:13.760 to shove somebody, you know, shoved talent down the people's throat, I 776 00:53:13.800 --> 00:53:16.920 think a lot of people resent start resenting that person, you know, and 777 00:53:16.920 --> 00:53:21.800 and I think that's what helps like got help get Bread over too, you 778 00:53:21.840 --> 00:53:23.519 know, in a sense. But I mean Brett got over, you know, 779 00:53:23.559 --> 00:53:29.159 because Brett's good and uh, but I think it backfires on him when 780 00:53:29.159 --> 00:53:30.880 they do try to shove somebody down, you know, the people's throat. 781 00:53:30.920 --> 00:53:35.480 And it's like Daniel Bryant, they never shoved him down the people's throat. 782 00:53:35.760 --> 00:53:39.039 He just all of a sudden, here's this guy. Thats what it takes, 783 00:53:39.239 --> 00:53:44.039 and just out of nowhere. And you know, they really weren't, 784 00:53:44.719 --> 00:53:46.840 you know, giving him that big shove. And I think that's what helped 785 00:53:46.880 --> 00:53:52.079 get him over so much, you know. And but it's it's you know, 786 00:53:52.199 --> 00:53:53.519 like I said, back then, I really wasn't paying a lot of 787 00:53:53.519 --> 00:53:57.800 attention to what was going on because you know, I was new and everything, 788 00:53:57.800 --> 00:54:00.000 and I'm just trying to get to know everybody and see how the games 789 00:54:00.000 --> 00:54:04.840 are played, you know. So but thank you watching questions and so much 790 00:54:04.840 --> 00:54:07.440 of the product. Back then, I I bred was popular and he was 791 00:54:07.480 --> 00:54:08.960 the right choice in Setlex Sluga for a lot of reasons. And I wrote 792 00:54:08.960 --> 00:54:13.159 about that. Yeah, you member's kind of those back issues. Uh that 793 00:54:13.440 --> 00:54:17.360 said it was, Brett's popularity was nothing like the groundswell for for Danil Bryan 794 00:54:17.440 --> 00:54:23.079 today. Oh no, huh. I mean it's insane how those people go 795 00:54:23.199 --> 00:54:28.639 crazy over him. Yeah at heart, Yeah, that's just Dan. Yeah, 796 00:54:28.679 --> 00:54:30.559 no, no whatsoever. But you know, and the thing is, 797 00:54:30.599 --> 00:54:35.480 it's like, I'm for whoever can get over like they do, because you 798 00:54:35.519 --> 00:54:38.159 know what, if that guy's going to get over, guess what that means, 799 00:54:38.199 --> 00:54:40.679 I'm going to make more money, you know. And that's the way 800 00:54:40.679 --> 00:54:45.079 how everybody tries it should look at it, you know, And and that's 801 00:54:45.119 --> 00:54:46.360 pretty much how I looked at it. You know. Yeah, I got, 802 00:54:46.519 --> 00:54:50.320 you know, my panties in a wad here and there because it's like, 803 00:54:50.360 --> 00:54:52.840 okay, when are they going to do something with me? Kind of 804 00:54:52.920 --> 00:54:54.960 like thing. But you know, I didn't focus so much on that. 805 00:54:55.039 --> 00:54:59.280 I've just focused at the you know, the the task at hand, and 806 00:54:59.320 --> 00:55:02.599 I did what I had to do. But I was always four, if 807 00:55:02.599 --> 00:55:07.719 somebody can get over, whether they're brand new and they've got what it takes 808 00:55:07.800 --> 00:55:10.960 and they can get over and make me money. I'm all for it. 809 00:55:12.119 --> 00:55:15.199 And that's the way everybody should look at the whole Daniel Bryant situation. This 810 00:55:15.280 --> 00:55:16.840 guy is gonna make a lot of money for the talent, you know. 811 00:55:16.880 --> 00:55:22.079 And and I and I really think the boys in the back are really happy 812 00:55:22.079 --> 00:55:25.440 for Daniel Bryan too in a sense because he's a great guy. I've never 813 00:55:25.480 --> 00:55:29.559 met him, I'd love to meet him, but just from his demeanor, 814 00:55:29.639 --> 00:55:31.440 watching him on TV and stuff like that, and seeing how he is on 815 00:55:31.960 --> 00:55:36.599 you know, other shows and stuff, I really believe he is a truly 816 00:55:36.679 --> 00:55:44.039 good person and this guy deserves to be where he's at. So but yeah, 817 00:55:44.519 --> 00:55:47.639 need an extra dose of positivity in your wrestling podcasts? Will come join 818 00:55:47.719 --> 00:55:53.159 me Alan fourrel Over in the Progress Paradise at peterw georch VIP as we ask 819 00:55:53.280 --> 00:55:58.199 on the bright side of wrestling and focus on some of the great matches and 820 00:55:58.239 --> 00:56:01.519 shows from around the world, be it the US, Japan, Europe, 821 00:56:01.639 --> 00:56:06.679 or Mexico. There's always a place for restlings past in the Paradise too, 822 00:56:06.920 --> 00:56:10.559 and we've done fun historical shows such as the We Love Liger series celebrating the 823 00:56:10.559 --> 00:56:15.559 glorious career of Jusian Thunderliger and our eye was there when shows where our guests 824 00:56:15.559 --> 00:56:20.280 will join me to talk about a classic bout that they were in attendance for. 825 00:56:20.840 --> 00:56:23.840 We love variety and you can expect lots of it at the Progress Paradise. 826 00:56:24.239 --> 00:56:30.679 Detailed PW Torch VIP subscription information and a list of all the VIP benefits 827 00:56:30.719 --> 00:56:35.760 is available at pw Torch vip info dot com. And yes, all VIP 828 00:56:35.920 --> 00:56:40.599 podcasts are compatible with popular podcast apps on iPhone and Android devices, or you 829 00:56:40.599 --> 00:56:45.000 can stream them directly from our ad free VIP mobile site. See you in 830 00:56:45.039 --> 00:56:55.000 the Paradise. Am I getting the upra? Bob? Oh? Yeah? 831 00:56:55.039 --> 00:57:00.000 One more question? They announced a couple of weeks ago at the Ultimate Warrior 832 00:57:00.039 --> 00:57:02.639 it will be inducted into the Hall of Fame this year. Bob, you're 833 00:57:02.760 --> 00:57:07.000 on in nineteen ninety six during his last run. But was he as difficult 834 00:57:07.039 --> 00:57:12.000 to deal with it in as crazy as everybody says he is? You know, 835 00:57:12.159 --> 00:57:15.400 I just I you're dealing with him. Yeah. The first time I 836 00:57:15.440 --> 00:57:20.880 met him was in la It was in Anaheim at the Arrow Hitpond there in 837 00:57:20.920 --> 00:57:23.800 Anaheim, and that was the first time I ever met him, and I 838 00:57:23.840 --> 00:57:28.360 mean he was in the same dressing room as everybody, and he just, 839 00:57:28.400 --> 00:57:31.880 you know, he's very cordial. But I just didn't get the feeling that 840 00:57:32.199 --> 00:57:36.360 you know, he didn't he really didn't know anybody there, you know. 841 00:57:36.639 --> 00:57:39.599 But I've just I don't know about him being hard to deal with because I've 842 00:57:39.599 --> 00:57:43.639 never had to deal with him behind closed doors. I never was you know, 843 00:57:43.880 --> 00:57:45.440 I never had to work with him or anything. So I just I 844 00:57:45.480 --> 00:57:50.480 can't answer that question, you know. I just and you know, so 845 00:57:51.320 --> 00:57:53.039 as far as him, I'm feeling hard to deal with, that's you know, 846 00:57:53.079 --> 00:57:55.480 so I just can't answer that. I mean, he was nice to 847 00:57:55.519 --> 00:57:58.719 me, don't you know. Don't get me wrong, he was very nice 848 00:57:58.760 --> 00:58:00.719 to me when I met him. And you know, like I said, 849 00:58:00.760 --> 00:58:02.119 whenever I'd come in the arena and come into the locker room, he always 850 00:58:02.159 --> 00:58:06.239 spoke, you know, so he was always nice to me, you know. 851 00:58:06.280 --> 00:58:08.800 So I never had a problem with him. So and but other people 852 00:58:08.840 --> 00:58:13.039 have said that, you know, he's a you know, prick and all 853 00:58:13.079 --> 00:58:15.000 this stuff that I don't know because I never saw it. So, you 854 00:58:15.000 --> 00:58:20.440 know, I you know, I can't answer that one fair enough. Mike 855 00:58:20.480 --> 00:58:22.480 appreciate your call very much. We'll take one more call here on the live 856 00:58:22.519 --> 00:58:25.000 cast, and then we'll move to the VIP after show with our time left 857 00:58:25.000 --> 00:58:29.519 with Bob Holly. I don't forget pw torch dot com is your source for 858 00:58:29.599 --> 00:58:32.920 daily wrestling news and commentary right now. We have Fridays ask pw Torch staff 859 00:58:34.000 --> 00:58:38.079 article up including what happens if WWE network is a failure? Is wwwe's Performance 860 00:58:38.119 --> 00:58:43.159 Center good for the future of wrestling? Would will TNA benefit from ww be 861 00:58:43.239 --> 00:58:46.000 kind of shunning indie wrestlers and wanting to only have graduates of the performance center 862 00:58:46.039 --> 00:58:50.800 put on TV? And some comments from staff on Hogan, Bishop and Flair 863 00:58:51.119 --> 00:58:53.079 and whether they're running TNA was a failure. Also, big update on the 864 00:58:53.079 --> 00:58:57.519 physical Hall of Fame building, Where might it be and what is the update? 865 00:58:57.840 --> 00:59:01.920 Also, Ted Dibiassi's oldest son are following a police standoff. Debiasi addresses 866 00:59:01.920 --> 00:59:06.119 that incident. Highlights of an in depth interview with cm punk. Will he 867 00:59:06.159 --> 00:59:08.400 resign with WWE? Maybe go to MMA? Does he have concerns about the 868 00:59:08.440 --> 00:59:13.480 network? Thought his thoughts on Batista, Lesnard, Daniel Bryan and more. 869 00:59:14.360 --> 00:59:19.760 There plus the full report on last night's TNA Impact, which by the way, 870 00:59:19.760 --> 00:59:21.880 did a nice rating, one of the best they've done on a long 871 00:59:21.880 --> 00:59:24.039 time, a one point two to one rating. It always happens, Bob, 872 00:59:24.119 --> 00:59:28.840 or almost always happens when Ro's ratings are up, Impact ratings go up. 873 00:59:28.840 --> 00:59:30.639 It's a weird thing. But it just seems like there's sort of a 874 00:59:30.679 --> 00:59:37.039 wrestling season. And part of it could because it was older demographics that were 875 00:59:37.119 --> 00:59:39.039 up for Impact last night, and maybe it was staying in the main event 876 00:59:39.079 --> 00:59:43.880 that drew that, but still there. It does seem when wrestling does well, 877 00:59:43.920 --> 00:59:45.400 everybody does kind of well. Has that kind of been your experience when 878 00:59:45.440 --> 00:59:50.440 you've been around, you know, fifteen years full time and time before that 879 00:59:50.480 --> 00:59:52.280 and after that on the indie scene, that when wrestling's hot, everybody kind 880 00:59:52.320 --> 00:59:55.800 of does well. Yeah, I really do. I truly believe that, 881 00:59:57.159 --> 00:59:59.920 you know, and you know, good for TNA as their rating came up. 882 01:00:00.280 --> 01:00:02.159 But and I because I want to see everybody make it, you know, 883 01:00:02.199 --> 01:00:06.639 because competition is good, and you know, and T and A has 884 01:00:06.639 --> 01:00:10.119 got a lot of learning to do, and but I just I really I 885 01:00:10.159 --> 01:00:15.719 would love to see them really make it. I really would, because you 886 01:00:15.760 --> 01:00:19.880 know, competition is good. You always been a big believer in competition is 887 01:00:19.920 --> 01:00:23.360 good and so and uh the thing and you mentioned the performance center too, 888 01:00:23.800 --> 01:00:27.320 and you know, I want to elaborate on that just for a second, 889 01:00:27.360 --> 01:00:30.480 if you don't mind, of course, Yeah, I really there's the pros 890 01:00:30.519 --> 01:00:34.760 and cons about the performance center. And I think it's a good tool, 891 01:00:34.840 --> 01:00:38.199 I really do, you know, I think, but I just they I 892 01:00:38.280 --> 01:00:44.199 honestly think the only bad side to it is you almost put out cookie cutter, 893 01:00:44.800 --> 01:00:47.320 you know, characters almost in a sense, you know, I don't 894 01:00:47.360 --> 01:00:52.320 know, you know, it's kind of a cool thing. They really want 895 01:00:52.320 --> 01:00:57.159 to They want to mold from start to finish and own their performers. And 896 01:00:57.199 --> 01:00:59.760 I think part, I mean part of it is is is Jerry Jared talk 897 01:00:59.800 --> 01:01:04.559 to me about this in the Torch Talk in the early nineties in prosing towards 898 01:01:04.559 --> 01:01:07.079 saying WWSS eventually is going to run into a problem if they become a monopoly, 899 01:01:07.280 --> 01:01:09.519 where are they going to get talent? Because right now they're living off 900 01:01:09.559 --> 01:01:14.000 of talent developed in the territories. And I think this is a smart way 901 01:01:14.000 --> 01:01:15.719 to address that, but is it the best way to address it? And 902 01:01:16.559 --> 01:01:21.719 shunning the indie scene and not having that diversity of experience is something that really 903 01:01:21.760 --> 01:01:24.119 is going to kick in Bob and maybe five years when the only people around 904 01:01:24.159 --> 01:01:28.840 are people who only work for WWE, right, And I think that's a 905 01:01:28.840 --> 01:01:30.639 bad thing because if they're shunning see, I didn't know they were shunning the 906 01:01:30.639 --> 01:01:36.159 indie you know, circuits, because the indie circuits is where, you know, 907 01:01:36.639 --> 01:01:39.760 you can get your name out there because there's a lot of popular people 908 01:01:39.920 --> 01:01:45.320 through the indie circuits, you know, and they have a following. And 909 01:01:45.440 --> 01:01:50.039 I think it's a good thing that if you can get performers from the indie 910 01:01:50.079 --> 01:01:52.320 circuits simply because number one, they have experienced working in front of crowd. 911 01:01:53.320 --> 01:01:57.800 You know, they've already perfected their craft, you know, and they've perfected 912 01:01:57.840 --> 01:02:00.599 it the hard way. And you know, because you can go out and 913 01:02:00.679 --> 01:02:04.880 you can find those the diamond in the rough in the indie circuit. You 914 01:02:04.920 --> 01:02:07.719 just have to look for it because there's so much good talent out there. 915 01:02:07.079 --> 01:02:10.159 There is a ton of good talent in those indie circuits, you know, 916 01:02:10.440 --> 01:02:15.159 and they just they I think they're just they got their blinders on to just 917 01:02:15.280 --> 01:02:20.000 the guys from the performance center that they are working on and those are the 918 01:02:20.079 --> 01:02:22.119 like you said, they want to be able to own their performers, and 919 01:02:22.159 --> 01:02:25.159 that's how they're going to do it. And I think it's going to be 920 01:02:25.400 --> 01:02:28.960 a bad thing. It's like you said, it's going to come back and 921 01:02:29.039 --> 01:02:32.239 haunt them, you know, when that's all there is is people from the 922 01:02:32.239 --> 01:02:37.760 Performance Center, you know, because I just really truly believe, you know, 923 01:02:37.960 --> 01:02:40.920 because it helped me before I got WWE, you know, running up 924 01:02:40.920 --> 01:02:45.079 and down the roads doing the indie scene, all these small towns, all 925 01:02:45.119 --> 01:02:47.639 these you know, driving for miles and miles. It's good, it's it's 926 01:02:47.760 --> 01:02:52.199 it's good experience, and I think everybody should have to go through that. 927 01:02:52.559 --> 01:02:55.599 And with the Performance Center, you're just you know, you are, You've 928 01:02:55.639 --> 01:03:00.239 got everything, every tool you need. You know, you don't. Yeah, 929 01:03:00.239 --> 01:03:01.679 you have to work, but I don't think you have to work as 930 01:03:01.800 --> 01:03:06.519 hard as if you were out on your own, you know, running up 931 01:03:06.559 --> 01:03:08.159 and down the roads, trying to make a name for yourself, trying to 932 01:03:08.199 --> 01:03:14.360 get over you know that. I think, uh, you have manufactured talent 933 01:03:14.599 --> 01:03:17.519 down at the Performance Center. And yeah, not everybody's like that. They're 934 01:03:17.559 --> 01:03:21.239 going to find, you know, good talent, you know, through the 935 01:03:21.280 --> 01:03:24.719 Performance Center. But I think it's it's just it's not a good idea to 936 01:03:24.920 --> 01:03:30.239 just focus on guys from there. I just don't think that's a good idea. 937 01:03:30.719 --> 01:03:32.000 Yeah, it's it's tough too, you know, if you're if you're 938 01:03:32.039 --> 01:03:34.719 triple ahs, you think, well, there's the right way to do it, 939 01:03:34.719 --> 01:03:36.960 and we want those we don't want to break bad habits and all that. 940 01:03:37.480 --> 01:03:39.320 But they're just there's, there's so and it's it's a lot of it 941 01:03:39.360 --> 01:03:42.559 is I think symbolica what we talked about a lot on the show, which 942 01:03:42.559 --> 01:03:46.360 is Daniel Bryant. There are things that are unconventional that make pro wrestling more 943 01:03:46.360 --> 01:03:50.079 interesting when they are, like you said, Bob all cookie cutter, and 944 01:03:50.159 --> 01:03:54.440 I think WWE should embrace that more as a corporation, the quirkiness and the 945 01:03:54.679 --> 01:04:00.840 diversity that makes pro wrestling so fun. If if everybody is kind of in 946 01:04:00.880 --> 01:04:04.639 the same mold with the same teachings, pro wrestling loses something. I mean, 947 01:04:04.639 --> 01:04:08.119 the first wrestling I watched, it was Mad Dog Mashan and Crusher, 948 01:04:08.159 --> 01:04:12.440 Jerry Blackwell and Jesse venturing Adrian Adonis, and you had verne Gania in stark 949 01:04:12.519 --> 01:04:16.119 contrast to the Crusher, and it was just it was Billy Robinson and Bruiser 950 01:04:16.199 --> 01:04:19.960 Brody. It was like there was such a diversity of characters when I became 951 01:04:20.000 --> 01:04:24.239 a fan, and that's part of what attracted me to it. Not everybody 952 01:04:24.519 --> 01:04:28.519 looked like Jesse Ventura, the muscular six foot three guy. And I do 953 01:04:28.599 --> 01:04:31.719 worry. I do worry a little bit that that is one of the negative 954 01:04:31.760 --> 01:04:35.960 side effects of WWF being kind of control freaks about wanting to just groom these 955 01:04:35.960 --> 01:04:39.679 people from start to finish and fit a mold. The good news is people 956 01:04:39.679 --> 01:04:43.559 like Bray Wyatt are getting through who don't fit that conventional body type. But 957 01:04:43.679 --> 01:04:46.159 you know, he's not exactly a first generation wrestler, and there's some exceptions 958 01:04:46.199 --> 01:04:49.800 made for those types of guys, right right. You know, like you're 959 01:04:49.800 --> 01:04:55.760 gonna find guys through the performance center that's gonna stand out every once in a 960 01:04:55.800 --> 01:05:00.760 while. It's inevitable, it's gonna happen, you know. But when they 961 01:05:00.920 --> 01:05:04.280 train there, you know, you have, like in the independent circuit, 962 01:05:04.519 --> 01:05:09.920 you know, you perfect your craft, you have a certain way you you 963 01:05:09.960 --> 01:05:13.800 go into your maneuvers and you know, and if it looks good, great. 964 01:05:14.000 --> 01:05:16.039 But I think what they do is when they take somebody to the performance 965 01:05:16.079 --> 01:05:20.039 that I don't know. I'm just I'm just speculating because i've never been there. 966 01:05:20.480 --> 01:05:24.000 You know, I'm sure I'm gonna end up there one of these days. 967 01:05:24.400 --> 01:05:30.239 But I'm sure maybe they take them and say that you're starting over from 968 01:05:30.280 --> 01:05:32.079 right here, and this is how you're gonna do things. This is the 969 01:05:32.119 --> 01:05:35.079 way we want you to do it. And then and then and then that's 970 01:05:35.159 --> 01:05:41.199 how everybody ends up doing looking the same when they move up to raw or 971 01:05:41.239 --> 01:05:45.639 smack down, and you can tell that they've been at the performance center because 972 01:05:45.679 --> 01:05:48.679 it's it's you know, everybody's taught the same way. A good example, 973 01:05:49.079 --> 01:05:54.880 One good example is if I've noticed whenever somebody goes for a false finish, 974 01:05:55.039 --> 01:05:59.559 they hook the leg and it's it's the guy that they're covering is on his 975 01:05:59.599 --> 01:06:01.440 back. And then when they hook the leg, the guy covering him, 976 01:06:01.800 --> 01:06:05.920 he's on his it's it's his back is on his chest. Yeah, and 977 01:06:05.920 --> 01:06:11.239 he's looking up the ceiling. I've noticed every single time somebody does a false 978 01:06:11.280 --> 01:06:14.519 finish, they cover somebody like that. And I noticed that the pattern, 979 01:06:14.559 --> 01:06:17.519 and I'm like that, right there is a fine example of they're making people. 980 01:06:17.519 --> 01:06:20.800 They must be making guys cover people like that. You know, and 981 01:06:20.840 --> 01:06:25.000 so I'm just just a little example, and I'm thinking maybe that's the way 982 01:06:25.000 --> 01:06:28.239 they were taught down at the performance center, you know, And and everybody 983 01:06:28.280 --> 01:06:31.960 has to have their own unique way of doing things to stand out from somebody 984 01:06:32.000 --> 01:06:35.320 else. You know. It's like when you go for a cover, you 985 01:06:35.360 --> 01:06:38.760 know, yeah, you can hook the leg and cover them, but you 986 01:06:38.800 --> 01:06:41.679 don't have to roll on your back to cover them. And it's like that 987 01:06:41.800 --> 01:06:45.039 and that it drives me crazy when I see that, because it's like everybody 988 01:06:45.079 --> 01:06:47.679 does it, and it's like, can somebody just cover somebody just to hook 989 01:06:47.719 --> 01:06:50.480 the leg and cover them normal? You know. And it's like, but 990 01:06:50.679 --> 01:06:54.760 I guess that's how they want guys to do it. And I'm I'm and 991 01:06:54.800 --> 01:07:00.639 that's the point point being is you know everything you can tell when guys come 992 01:07:00.639 --> 01:07:03.159 from that performance Ernet' And I'm thinking, you know, if guys do get 993 01:07:03.199 --> 01:07:06.480 picked up from the independent circuit, you know, maybe they take them and 994 01:07:06.519 --> 01:07:10.360 just say, hey, you're you're psych you haven't even been wrestling. We're 995 01:07:10.360 --> 01:07:13.920 starting all over, you know. I guess that's what they do. I'm 996 01:07:13.960 --> 01:07:16.920 not sure, but it just seems like that to me. Yeah, we 997 01:07:16.960 --> 01:07:19.760 do not normally do this, but we are kicking off the New Year twenty 998 01:07:19.800 --> 01:07:24.920 twenty four with a VIP sale. Go vip for a full month for three 999 01:07:24.920 --> 01:07:29.840 dollars in ninety nine cents. That is six dollars off our normal very reasonable 1000 01:07:29.920 --> 01:07:33.079 rate. We're told of nine dollars in ninety nine cents per month. Pw 1001 01:07:33.119 --> 01:07:41.719 torch dot com slash go VP. That's pwtorch dot com slash go VP and 1002 01:07:41.920 --> 01:07:46.119 enter coupon code New Year twenty twenty four. That six dollars discount can be 1003 01:07:46.159 --> 01:07:48.800 applied to a one month sub, a three month sub, or a one 1004 01:07:48.880 --> 01:07:53.880 year sub. You'll get six dollars off whichever option you choose. We'd love 1005 01:07:53.920 --> 01:07:57.039 to have you tries for the first time or come on back if for some 1006 01:07:57.119 --> 01:08:00.760 reason you've had to take a break from VIP membership. Our podcasts with a 1007 01:08:00.840 --> 01:08:05.800 VIP membership are compatible with the Apple podcast app. That means CarPlay. That 1008 01:08:05.840 --> 01:08:10.039 means on your iPhone and you don't have to go to advanced settings or enter 1009 01:08:10.079 --> 01:08:13.760 any special password or anything like that. It's a simple click of a link 1010 01:08:14.000 --> 01:08:15.880 from your iPhone when you sign up that'll be emailed to you. It is 1011 01:08:15.960 --> 01:08:20.600 frictionless. You can also use many other popular podcast apps or just streamed from 1012 01:08:20.680 --> 01:08:26.279 our vip ad free website. So many perks with VIP membership, including last 1013 01:08:26.279 --> 01:08:30.359 Saturday Nights nearly two hour review of AW World's End. Todd Martin, Rich 1014 01:08:30.399 --> 01:08:33.680 Fan and I dissected that event. We got under the Jericho controversy and how 1015 01:08:33.720 --> 01:08:38.680 AW had handled it so far and how they should going forward, Thoughts on 1016 01:08:38.880 --> 01:08:43.680 MJF and the Devil reveal and somojo is Champion, and so much more in 1017 01:08:43.720 --> 01:08:48.119 that VP exclusive roundtable. Also for VIP members, we have a written roundtable 1018 01:08:48.199 --> 01:08:53.640 after pay per views and pls with staff scores and reviews. Alan Coonahan, 1019 01:08:54.000 --> 01:08:59.119 Rich Fan, Sean Radikin and I wrote reviews of Saturday's pay per view and 1020 01:08:59.159 --> 01:09:02.520 we'll do so again for the Royal Rumble coming up later this month. Also, 1021 01:09:02.600 --> 01:09:09.399 we just ran our nearly two hour World Class Championship Wrestling Von Eric special 1022 01:09:09.439 --> 01:09:13.000 podcast that we did back in two thousand and six. This was a show 1023 01:09:13.039 --> 01:09:17.520 that I did with Bruce Mitchell reviewing the Von Eric DVD that had just come 1024 01:09:17.560 --> 01:09:23.279 out, and they ended up putting this podcast on that DVD in the deluxe 1025 01:09:23.399 --> 01:09:27.239 edition because the producers of the DVD were so happy with the thorough coverage We 1026 01:09:27.279 --> 01:09:30.039 gave of the history of the Von ericson World Class Championship Wrestling, cutting through 1027 01:09:30.039 --> 01:09:34.239 the crap and talking about the von Erics, but also other aspects of that 1028 01:09:34.319 --> 01:09:39.880 promotion in the rise and Fall. It is a thorough supplement to the Iron 1029 01:09:39.920 --> 01:09:43.840 Claw movie and it is available as soon as you sign up as a VIP 1030 01:09:43.960 --> 01:09:46.239 member. We just put it up on the VIP podcast feed on December twenty 1031 01:09:46.359 --> 01:09:48.760 ninth, just a few days ago. Also, when you go VIP, 1032 01:09:48.880 --> 01:09:53.319 you can listen immediately to my review of the Iron Claw movie that was a 1033 01:09:53.399 --> 01:09:58.079 VIP exclusive Wade Keller Hotline. I attended the movie, I reviewed the movie, 1034 01:09:58.079 --> 01:10:00.960 and I also included in my Keller hotline re viewing it excerpts from the 1035 01:10:01.279 --> 01:10:04.720 very hard to get Gary Hart book. Gary Hart was a booker of World 1036 01:10:04.720 --> 01:10:09.000 Class Championhip Wrestling during the rise of the Von ericson the Freebirds feud. He 1037 01:10:09.399 --> 01:10:13.720 was very blunt in that book about what he thought of the Von Erics and 1038 01:10:13.960 --> 01:10:16.279 that era, with some amazing insight. That book sales on eBay for one 1039 01:10:16.279 --> 01:10:20.640 thousand dollars. I've got a copy of it and I took key excerpts that 1040 01:10:20.760 --> 01:10:26.000 put more perspective on what was in the movie. January first, Wadekeller Hotline, 1041 01:10:26.000 --> 01:10:28.760 which was a return of the Asked the Editor format. I answered questions 1042 01:10:28.760 --> 01:10:31.600 about the Von eric movie. What era of the Von Erics careers would I've 1043 01:10:31.600 --> 01:10:34.600 added to the movie if they had fifteen or thirty extra minutes to work with? 1044 01:10:35.000 --> 01:10:39.239 Also, why did Kevin Dunn leave WWE. I have insight into the 1045 01:10:39.279 --> 01:10:43.199 situation and I conveyed it in an answer to a VIP member question. And 1046 01:10:43.239 --> 01:10:45.600 also with Tony Kahn really go into more sports like direction in twenty twenty four. 1047 01:10:45.640 --> 01:10:48.439 Those are just some of the topics covered in a way. Keller Hotline 1048 01:10:48.479 --> 01:10:53.680 Asked the Editor edition thirty minutes in length, posted on January first. I 1049 01:10:53.720 --> 01:10:56.039 could go on and on. So much comes to the VIP membership and add 1050 01:10:56.039 --> 01:10:59.640 free VIP website, mobile friendly, desktop friendly, so much more. Checkout 1051 01:10:59.640 --> 01:11:02.920 full d at PW Torch dot com, slash go VIP, click on the 1052 01:11:02.920 --> 01:11:09.359 sign up link coupon code New Year twenty twenty four. You get six dollars 1053 01:11:09.399 --> 01:11:11.840 off three dollars ninety nine cents to tries for a month. It's a great 1054 01:11:11.840 --> 01:11:15.319 deal and hopefully you'll stick around beyond that. For nine dollars and ninety nine 1055 01:11:15.359 --> 01:11:23.439 cents. All right, now let's get back to today's podcast. And then 1056 01:11:23.600 --> 01:11:28.000 I think there's value and experience in other parts. But at WWS FSC Mantrible 1057 01:11:28.279 --> 01:11:30.640 in Stephan Wickmahn, they don't want to think of themselves as part of the 1058 01:11:30.680 --> 01:11:34.319 wrestling industry. They want to see themselves as WWE. And there's just there's 1059 01:11:34.319 --> 01:11:38.000 a way that we do things. We're not part of this larger fabric anymore. 1060 01:11:38.000 --> 01:11:42.319 We just are this industry and it's I think it's it's a it's a 1061 01:11:42.319 --> 01:11:45.199 shame and certain in a lot of ways. And I think someone unnecessary or 1062 01:11:45.239 --> 01:11:47.079 quite a bit unnecessary because when I when I was in England, I was 1063 01:11:47.119 --> 01:11:54.279 in England in November, and then I went to Australia and there's a couple 1064 01:11:54.279 --> 01:11:58.439 of people that stood out to me. This one fella, you know, 1065 01:11:58.720 --> 01:12:02.680 he looks like Bobby Lashley, He's Bill like Bobby Lashley. And this guy 1066 01:12:02.800 --> 01:12:05.359 is good, I mean he is really good. They call him ooh oh 1067 01:12:05.399 --> 01:12:10.720 the Great and I was really impressed with him. And you know, and 1068 01:12:10.800 --> 01:12:15.520 so you know, I called Billy Gunn because Billy works down the performance center. 1069 01:12:15.560 --> 01:12:16.560 I said, you guys got to get this guy. I mean, 1070 01:12:16.600 --> 01:12:20.000 he's really good. He's got charisma, he can cut a promo, he 1071 01:12:20.079 --> 01:12:24.760 can work, and he looks great, you know. And he's not your 1072 01:12:24.760 --> 01:12:29.640 typical you know, bodybuilder where he can't move. This guy can move. 1073 01:12:30.119 --> 01:12:33.479 And then as far as the girls, I was in Australia. There's a 1074 01:12:33.520 --> 01:12:38.039 girl. Her name is Cassie, and you know, and I told Billy 1075 01:12:38.039 --> 01:12:42.359 Gunn about her too. She is unbelievable. I mean she because I did 1076 01:12:42.399 --> 01:12:47.359 a training camp down there in Australia and she was there. She doesn't work 1077 01:12:47.439 --> 01:12:51.279 like your typical girl does. I mean, I you know, I could 1078 01:12:51.319 --> 01:12:56.439 have swore she was a guy dressed as a female, because not that she 1079 01:12:56.520 --> 01:12:59.479 looks like a guy, but I mean, I'm just saying because her work 1080 01:12:59.600 --> 01:13:03.279 was so good, so polished, so everything was so chris everything looked believable, 1081 01:13:03.319 --> 01:13:08.880 everything she did, you know. And and I'm hoping that, you 1082 01:13:08.880 --> 01:13:13.119 know, people like this get a break because I'm telling you these way these 1083 01:13:13.119 --> 01:13:15.199 guys were good, you know. So there's a lot of great talent out 1084 01:13:15.199 --> 01:13:20.960 there that's just been undiscovered. And I and I really believe if they had 1085 01:13:21.119 --> 01:13:26.640 a scout just go around to all these independent shows, if they can you 1086 01:13:26.680 --> 01:13:30.439 know they can find good talent like that, you know, instead of I 1087 01:13:30.479 --> 01:13:33.359 don't know how they get the guys into the performance center. Now, I 1088 01:13:33.399 --> 01:13:36.439 don't know what they have to do to get there, but I don't you 1089 01:13:36.479 --> 01:13:40.039 know, they send in video of them or what, or pictures or what. 1090 01:13:40.119 --> 01:13:43.159 I don't. I have no idea, but I think it would be 1091 01:13:43.199 --> 01:13:46.880 a great idea if they just send somebody out to do go to all these 1092 01:13:46.880 --> 01:13:51.600 independent shows around the country and find talent, because there is some talent out 1093 01:13:51.600 --> 01:13:56.680 there that's unbelievable. Well, hopefully they do that, and if they don't, 1094 01:13:56.720 --> 01:14:00.720 hopefully that is TNA's game. You know, hopefully TNA those scouts out 1095 01:14:00.720 --> 01:14:02.760 there and takes advantage of that. If W dow he doesn't, I want 1096 01:14:02.800 --> 01:14:06.600 to clarify that wwe will bring somebody in from the indie scene, but there 1097 01:14:08.000 --> 01:14:10.640 that's not the first place they look, and it's not where they want to 1098 01:14:10.680 --> 01:14:12.880 look. And if somebody is hot on the indie scene, they're still going 1099 01:14:12.880 --> 01:14:15.560 to put him through the performance center. And like you said, Bob kind 1100 01:14:15.560 --> 01:14:17.039 of treat it like, oh God, you learn some bad habits. You're 1101 01:14:17.119 --> 01:14:19.840 even further behind than we want than you would be if you came to us 1102 01:14:19.880 --> 01:14:24.399 first, like that's the feeling that they're giving off. But Triple H said 1103 01:14:24.439 --> 01:14:28.279 in his grant Land interview last August, we want everybody who makes it to 1104 01:14:28.279 --> 01:14:30.880 the main roster within a couple of years to have gone through a full performance 1105 01:14:30.880 --> 01:14:35.239 center run and and be in developmental and and and he sees, you know, 1106 01:14:35.279 --> 01:14:39.720 he sees the roster being a prop you know, a product of developmental. 1107 01:14:39.840 --> 01:14:41.920 Anyway, we are at a time of the live cast, Bob, 1108 01:14:41.920 --> 01:14:43.479 I know you just have a few more minutes, and I want to talk 1109 01:14:43.520 --> 01:14:45.319 to you when they'll get the after show about brock Lesner. It's the ten 1110 01:14:45.359 --> 01:14:49.760 year anniversary of your World title main event pay per view match with brock Lesner. 1111 01:14:49.840 --> 01:14:54.119 I want to talk about working with him and doctors thoughts on his return, 1112 01:14:54.279 --> 01:14:56.399 and a couple other things. We've got a couple of email questions too. 1113 01:14:56.600 --> 01:14:58.479 If you're on holding, we didn't get to you, you can drop 1114 01:14:58.520 --> 01:15:00.880 us an email real quick and we might get to in the after show. 1115 01:15:00.319 --> 01:15:05.920 PW Torch livecast at gmail dot com. Please do check out pwtorch dot com. 1116 01:15:05.960 --> 01:15:09.840 I told you some of the news items that are on there today news 1117 01:15:09.880 --> 01:15:12.960 every day. Also, if you've got a smartphone and you probably do download 1118 01:15:12.960 --> 01:15:15.199 our app. Search PW Torch in the app store and while you're at it, 1119 01:15:15.239 --> 01:15:20.359 if you like UFC, download mmatorch also or visit mmatorch dot com. 1120 01:15:20.399 --> 01:15:24.680 And my final plug for Torch stuff is our email list. I haven't mentioned 1121 01:15:24.720 --> 01:15:28.399 this in a while on the show, but every day James Caldwell puts together 1122 01:15:28.439 --> 01:15:32.399 the top five stories in wrestling that day and you can get a free email. 1123 01:15:32.800 --> 01:15:35.479 You can unsubscribe anytime, and there's no spam. We work through a 1124 01:15:35.520 --> 01:15:39.439 reputable third party service for this. All you have to do to sign up 1125 01:15:39.520 --> 01:15:45.680 is go to pwtorch dot com slash email PW torch dot com slash email. 1126 01:15:45.760 --> 01:15:47.680 There's a sign up page and to your email and you are set. And 1127 01:15:47.840 --> 01:15:51.199 if there's major breaking news, we'll also send out an alert to that, 1128 01:15:51.239 --> 01:15:54.840 although we don't do that very often. Mostly you're just gonna get one email 1129 01:15:54.880 --> 01:15:58.439 a day from us, and it's kind of cool. If you are out 1130 01:15:58.439 --> 01:16:00.760 to a loop for a couple of days you want to catch did I miss 1131 01:16:00.760 --> 01:16:03.000 anything huge? You can look at those top five stories and we provide links 1132 01:16:03.039 --> 01:16:05.960 to give you more details on those top five stories. So if you're listening 1133 01:16:05.960 --> 01:16:10.640 to this right now. PW Torch dot com, slash email sign up and 1134 01:16:11.039 --> 01:16:14.840 Bob, thank you so much. Your book is the Hardcore Truth. I 1135 01:16:14.880 --> 01:16:16.880 looked it up on Amazon. You can get it on tindall for eight dollars 1136 01:16:16.960 --> 01:16:21.640 fifty four cents. They have paperback copies for seventeen dollars and people just check 1137 01:16:21.680 --> 01:16:24.600 it out. I say something real quick way, Yeah, but I do, 1138 01:16:24.640 --> 01:16:29.960 But I meant. Everybody can follow me on Twitter at the Bob Holly. 1139 01:16:30.079 --> 01:16:33.279 And you know I've said this before on your show. If you send 1140 01:16:33.279 --> 01:16:36.399 me a tweet, I will talk to you. And if you go back 1141 01:16:36.439 --> 01:16:40.319 and look at my history of tweets, I speak to everybody, and if 1142 01:16:40.359 --> 01:16:42.199 you talk to me, I will take time to talk to you. And 1143 01:16:42.199 --> 01:16:44.319 if I don't get to you right away, I promise you I will talk 1144 01:16:44.359 --> 01:16:46.840 to you. So tweet me at the Bob Holly if you got any questions 1145 01:16:46.880 --> 01:16:49.760 or whatever, I'd be happy to answer for you. And if you throw 1146 01:16:49.880 --> 01:16:55.479 some garbage at me, you won't get any answers. You're just blocked. 1147 01:16:55.600 --> 01:16:59.439 So I don't I don't play that game going back and forth with somebody. 1148 01:16:59.520 --> 01:17:01.960 So yeah, everybody's following me at the Bob Holly Thank you, Wade, 1149 01:17:01.960 --> 01:17:04.439 Thank you very very much. Bob, thank you for your time. We 1150 01:17:04.479 --> 01:17:08.039 got to have you on again soon because you're always a great guest and you're 1151 01:17:08.079 --> 01:17:11.520 one of our listeners favorites. And also, if we have a chance in 1152 01:17:11.560 --> 01:17:15.039 the after show, I want to talk about your experience at speaking to college 1153 01:17:15.119 --> 01:17:18.119 kids recently who were signed watching raw reading your book and you did a Q 1154 01:17:18.199 --> 01:17:20.439 and A with them, and I'm I'm curious to talk to you about it 1155 01:17:20.439 --> 01:17:23.439 if we have time today, it'd be fun to hear about what that experience 1156 01:17:23.520 --> 01:17:26.640 was. Absolutely surprised. Yeah, so excellent. All right, thank you 1157 01:17:26.680 --> 01:17:30.880 already for joining us. Don't forget Sunday night after the World Rumble live right 1158 01:17:30.920 --> 01:17:35.359 here at PW torchlivecast dot com is where you want to be to get the 1159 01:17:35.399 --> 01:17:39.840 postgame show live eleven thirty Eastern, about a half hour after the Rumble ends. 1160 01:17:39.960 --> 01:17:43.039 Joined James Caldorf for the live Postgame Show VTP members. Be on the 1161 01:17:43.039 --> 01:17:45.760 lookout Sunday night for Bruce Mitchell, Pat McNeil, and I will do an 1162 01:17:45.800 --> 01:17:47.880 end depth our own table right after the Royal Rumble. Thank you everybody for 1163 01:17:48.000 --> 01:17:51.239 joining us until Sunday night on behalf of my guests, Bob Holly, this 1164 01:17:51.279 --> 01:18:25.439 is PW Torch dot Com editor Wade Keller signing off. Not all right, 1165 01:18:25.479 --> 01:18:28.960 We're now in the VIP after show portion of the program. Bob, I 1166 01:18:29.279 --> 01:18:32.960 assume you were aware that it was the tenth anniversary of the Black Lester match 1167 01:18:32.960 --> 01:18:36.800 at the Royal Rumble. Actually I was not aware of it, but now 1168 01:18:36.840 --> 01:18:42.039 I am, uh talk about talk about You talked about it in the book, 1169 01:18:42.079 --> 01:18:45.680 and I know it was a special opportunity for you. What what was 1170 01:18:45.720 --> 01:18:48.880 your thought when when that What do you remember about your thoughts of that match 1171 01:18:48.920 --> 01:18:54.199 being uh given to you, I guess her, or being given a chance 1172 01:18:54.279 --> 01:18:56.920 to be in a match of that high profile in the two thousand and four 1173 01:18:57.000 --> 01:19:00.279 Royal Rumble. Oh, I thought it was a great, great opportunity. 1174 01:19:00.319 --> 01:19:01.640 You know, I was on cloud nine. I was like, you know, 1175 01:19:01.720 --> 01:19:04.600 because all my hard hard work paid off, and I thought, well, 1176 01:19:04.600 --> 01:19:08.640 maybe this is my ticket, you know, if if if I can 1177 01:19:08.680 --> 01:19:11.760 pull this off, you know and have a good match with Brock, you 1178 01:19:11.800 --> 01:19:15.760 know, maybe this has an opportunity to go somewhere. But you know, 1179 01:19:15.880 --> 01:19:17.840 little did I know. I didn't know what was going on, you know, 1180 01:19:17.920 --> 01:19:21.079 behind closed doors. You know, they had no plans for me, 1181 01:19:21.479 --> 01:19:25.920 you know, because and and you know, to be perfectly honest, Brock 1182 01:19:25.960 --> 01:19:28.960 didn't want to work with me. And it's not because I didn't like It's 1183 01:19:29.000 --> 01:19:32.159 not because he didn't like me or he didn't like working with me because he 1184 01:19:32.239 --> 01:19:35.800 knew he wasn't going to make any money with me because I wasn't a top 1185 01:19:35.840 --> 01:19:40.840 guy. I wasn't. I wasn't you know, one of the major players 1186 01:19:41.199 --> 01:19:45.880 you know, on on the on the roster, and I was never pushed 1187 01:19:45.079 --> 01:19:49.079 as a top guy. I was really never, you know, because I 1188 01:19:49.119 --> 01:19:53.319 was never really held any major titles. You know, I had the tag 1189 01:19:53.880 --> 01:19:57.760 team belts and you know, and I was a hardcore champion, but I 1190 01:19:57.800 --> 01:20:01.640 was never Intercontinental or US champ the end. And honestly and honesty, I 1191 01:20:01.680 --> 01:20:05.880 don't blame him in that aspect aspect, because he wasn't going to make a 1192 01:20:05.880 --> 01:20:10.880 whole lot of money working with me unless they started pushing me, you know 1193 01:20:10.960 --> 01:20:15.640 and giving me, you know, giving me title shots down the road here 1194 01:20:15.640 --> 01:20:19.039 and there and making me a major player. And because the where I was 1195 01:20:19.079 --> 01:20:21.960 on the card, I mean, this was just one of those things where 1196 01:20:23.359 --> 01:20:27.800 okay, they brought me back from my injury, so let's play off of 1197 01:20:27.840 --> 01:20:31.359 this and let's go with it, and and it just it didn't go very 1198 01:20:31.359 --> 01:20:38.159 far. And so but you know, I'm going into this whole thing thinking, 1199 01:20:38.199 --> 01:20:42.239 you know, this is my chance to really do well. And then 1200 01:20:42.640 --> 01:20:45.720 after the royal rumble's over, I get to TV and then all of a 1201 01:20:45.720 --> 01:20:46.600 sudden, I'm not doing anything, and it's like, well, wait a 1202 01:20:46.600 --> 01:20:50.520 minute, what's going on here? You know, And so I just it 1203 01:20:50.680 --> 01:20:54.880 just it is what it is, and you know, there's nothing I can 1204 01:20:54.920 --> 01:20:57.239 do about it. I wasn't going to complain and bitch and piss and moan 1205 01:20:57.279 --> 01:21:00.319 about it, you know, because that wasn't gonna get me anywhere. And 1206 01:21:00.359 --> 01:21:02.239 I thought, well, you know, maybe an opportunity, maybe they'll do 1207 01:21:02.319 --> 01:21:05.279 something with me again, hopefully that maybe they'll come up with something, you 1208 01:21:05.319 --> 01:21:09.199 know, But you know, it just it wasn't meant to be, I 1209 01:21:09.239 --> 01:21:12.000 guess. And that's the way I always try to look at it. Yeah, 1210 01:21:12.359 --> 01:21:15.600 Yeah, am I disappointed? Yes, you know, because you know, 1211 01:21:15.680 --> 01:21:16.840 when you're put in that role, you make a ton of money, 1212 01:21:17.439 --> 01:21:20.680 and you know, and that's what every that's what it's all about. It 1213 01:21:20.720 --> 01:21:24.680 boils down to money, you know. And and I was having a good 1214 01:21:24.720 --> 01:21:28.279 time. I enjoyed working with Brock, you know, I it was it 1215 01:21:28.319 --> 01:21:30.319 was fun because it was physical with him, and I didn't mind that. 1216 01:21:30.640 --> 01:21:33.119 And you know, and I can, I can crack him as hard as 1217 01:21:33.159 --> 01:21:36.359 I want, and he wasn't gonna, you know, take it in a 1218 01:21:36.439 --> 01:21:39.880 way where I was trying to hurt him or anything, because then he can 1219 01:21:39.920 --> 01:21:42.560 hit me as hard as he wanted to. And I didn't care because that's 1220 01:21:42.600 --> 01:21:45.560 the way I was. And but I was just kind of, you know, 1221 01:21:45.640 --> 01:21:48.720 disappointed after the fact that I just that was the end of the line 1222 01:21:48.760 --> 01:22:00.119 for me, so to speak. So you know, though, every Sunday, 1223 01:21:59.880 --> 01:22:02.840 I catch Wrestling Night in America on PW Torchdailycast dot Com, hosted by 1224 01:22:02.880 --> 01:22:06.800 me PW Torch calumnist Greg Parks. Each week, I'll welcome a co host 1225 01:22:06.840 --> 01:22:10.960 from the Torch family to discuss the big shows in pro wrestling, taking your 1226 01:22:11.000 --> 01:22:14.800 calls and emails. You can listen live most week's beginning at eight pm Eastern. 1227 01:22:15.159 --> 01:22:17.279 On Sunday nights with a WWE or Impact pay per view, we go 1228 01:22:17.399 --> 01:22:19.880 on the air. At the conclusion of that pay per view, you can 1229 01:22:19.920 --> 01:22:23.720 listen live, but of course, the full show is available for download on 1230 01:22:23.800 --> 01:22:28.359 demand anytime shortly after it airs. Visit PW torchdailycast dot com and click the 1231 01:22:28.399 --> 01:22:31.119 live stream link to find the next scheduled live show link. Search PW torch 1232 01:22:31.119 --> 01:22:35.600 and Apple Podcasts or your podcast app to subscribe Wrestling Night in America every Sunday, 1233 01:22:35.720 --> 01:22:51.720 PW Torchdailycast dot com. Well, how is it working with broad Just 1234 01:22:51.840 --> 01:22:56.479 on a personal level? I think people are fascinated with him because well, 1235 01:22:56.560 --> 01:22:59.159 I mean, for so many reasons. He just he's one of the more 1236 01:23:00.399 --> 01:23:03.199 Uh, I don't know, I don't even know how to put he He's 1237 01:23:03.199 --> 01:23:08.600 somebody who's really good at professional wrestling. But he's incredible athlete, incredible athlete, 1238 01:23:08.640 --> 01:23:12.159 but he wasn't He didn't feel like one of the boys in a traditional 1239 01:23:12.199 --> 01:23:15.640 sense. And then talk about that, is that an accurate perception? And 1240 01:23:15.640 --> 01:23:17.039 how was he different than the average guy that you ran across, who was 1241 01:23:17.079 --> 01:23:24.319 the top guy? He just Brock was just Brock. I mean, he 1242 01:23:24.399 --> 01:23:27.840 just had this you know, I don't give a shit attitude, and you 1243 01:23:27.840 --> 01:23:31.239 know, I'm you know, he says what he feels and what he thinks 1244 01:23:31.279 --> 01:23:33.760 and that's just the way it is. And he didn't, you know, 1245 01:23:33.800 --> 01:23:38.640 he didn't he didn't get into the political part of it either. I don't 1246 01:23:38.640 --> 01:23:41.039 believe, you know, he never seemed to me like he was one of 1247 01:23:41.039 --> 01:23:44.399 those guys that you know, played the political game. You know, if 1248 01:23:44.600 --> 01:23:46.439 if he likes you, likes you. If he doesn't, you'll know he 1249 01:23:46.479 --> 01:23:50.039 doesn't like you, you know, And so I just you know, the 1250 01:23:50.119 --> 01:23:55.760 thing is, Brock is a businessman, and and Brock's gonna do what's best 1251 01:23:55.760 --> 01:23:58.760 for Brock, and that's the way it should be. And he was just, 1252 01:23:58.920 --> 01:24:00.239 you know, he was nice to everybody in the back. You know, 1253 01:24:00.319 --> 01:24:03.000 he was fun to hang out with. He was you know, he'd 1254 01:24:03.199 --> 01:24:06.439 liked to kid around a lot, and you know, play games and stuff 1255 01:24:06.439 --> 01:24:13.000 like that. And but he was just, you know, he just he 1256 01:24:13.199 --> 01:24:15.000 wasn't It's like you said, he wasn't one of your typical you know, 1257 01:24:16.279 --> 01:24:21.600 the typical that the typical role of you know, being you know, part 1258 01:24:21.600 --> 01:24:25.800 of the locker room. Rock was just you know, Brock was Brock's own 1259 01:24:25.840 --> 01:24:29.239 person basically. You know, he just did he didn't cave into all the 1260 01:24:29.680 --> 01:24:33.640 political bs. Yeah. Yeah. Was there anything between you and Brock in 1261 01:24:33.680 --> 01:24:39.359 that match that was not typical that got a little intense or were there hard 1262 01:24:39.359 --> 01:24:42.479 feelings based on things that went on in that match. People talk about that 1263 01:24:42.520 --> 01:24:45.760 a lot and are curious what was going on in that match, if there 1264 01:24:45.760 --> 01:24:48.239 was any undercurrent or things that maybe you have to watch the match on a 1265 01:24:48.239 --> 01:24:51.920 different level to experience or understand. Right. No, no, there was 1266 01:24:51.960 --> 01:24:56.199 no you know, none, none of no heat between us or you know, 1267 01:24:57.319 --> 01:25:00.439 you know, nothing you know made me up what he did or I 1268 01:25:00.560 --> 01:25:03.640 upset him what I did or anything. There was nothing like that. It's 1269 01:25:03.840 --> 01:25:06.840 you know, and it's funny because it's funny how people talk and they act 1270 01:25:06.920 --> 01:25:10.439 like they were right there in the middle of it, you know, and 1271 01:25:10.479 --> 01:25:13.680 they think they know, and that just what I laugh at that because it's 1272 01:25:13.680 --> 01:25:16.119 like, you know, I read stuff and it's like Brock says he didn't 1273 01:25:16.159 --> 01:25:19.000 like Bob Holly and he wanted to beat this crap out of him and this 1274 01:25:19.079 --> 01:25:23.880 and blah blah, and you know Bob did did this on purpose to him 1275 01:25:23.880 --> 01:25:27.079 and stuff, and it's like, where do they get this stuff because they 1276 01:25:27.119 --> 01:25:30.239 weren't there, you know, And it's it's it's the furthest from the truth. 1277 01:25:30.279 --> 01:25:31.640 And you know that's what I tell people. We got along great. 1278 01:25:31.800 --> 01:25:34.359 I enjoyed working with him. You know, it was fun, you know, 1279 01:25:34.720 --> 01:25:38.760 to me, it was fun because I didn't have to worry about, 1280 01:25:39.399 --> 01:25:43.000 Okay, am I going to be too rough with this guy or whatever? 1281 01:25:43.119 --> 01:25:45.960 You know, And if if anything, I wasn't rough enough with him, 1282 01:25:46.359 --> 01:25:50.159 you know, because he's he is probably one of the you know, the 1283 01:25:50.239 --> 01:25:54.199 roughest of the roughest that would you know, you know, you can be 1284 01:25:54.239 --> 01:25:57.479 as rough as you want with him, but guess what, you better be 1285 01:25:57.520 --> 01:26:00.520 ready for it back because you're going to get it back, you know. 1286 01:26:00.560 --> 01:26:05.560 And then people it's funny because you know, people just have this per se 1287 01:26:05.600 --> 01:26:10.239 they they watch two guys out there and they think they know what's going on 1288 01:26:10.319 --> 01:26:13.600 when they don't. They truly don't, you know. And And like I 1289 01:26:13.600 --> 01:26:16.760 said, and when I got hurt that night, Brock was just like over 1290 01:26:16.840 --> 01:26:20.600 the top, you know, sympathetic. I mean, he really was. 1291 01:26:20.640 --> 01:26:24.600 And I just I told him to fucking knock it. Oh excuse my language. 1292 01:26:24.720 --> 01:26:26.920 I told him to knock it off, you know, pretty much, 1293 01:26:26.960 --> 01:26:30.439 because you know it was it was like because he felt bad, you know, 1294 01:26:30.520 --> 01:26:32.399 and I told him not to worry about it because it was an accident. 1295 01:26:32.960 --> 01:26:36.000 You know. I I didn't get up like I should have got up, 1296 01:26:36.399 --> 01:26:40.239 and it just it was one of our timing was off. And it 1297 01:26:40.319 --> 01:26:43.800 wasn't his fault at all, not at all. You know. It's just 1298 01:26:43.880 --> 01:26:45.920 one of those freak accidents that have happened, you know. And he and 1299 01:26:46.239 --> 01:26:49.880 even after my surgery, he called me and checked on me, and you 1300 01:26:49.920 --> 01:26:55.039 know, everything was good, you know. And and uh, but none 1301 01:26:55.079 --> 01:26:58.600 of that stuff between me and him, none of that stuff was done out 1302 01:26:58.600 --> 01:27:01.439 of spider on purpose or anything. You know, it was just it was 1303 01:27:01.760 --> 01:27:03.720 you know, we went out there and work. We did what we had 1304 01:27:03.720 --> 01:27:06.560 to do, and we got along fine, you know, because if you 1305 01:27:06.560 --> 01:27:09.520 don't get along with them, but you're not gonna make money with them, 1306 01:27:09.960 --> 01:27:14.119 you know. And and and so and you know. And but I've always 1307 01:27:14.159 --> 01:27:16.239 enjoyed working with him, you know, I always have, always have. 1308 01:27:18.560 --> 01:27:23.520 Let's let's talk about the experience. Uh, was it Dubuke University, Bob 1309 01:27:23.560 --> 01:27:26.880 that you spoken? Yeah? Yeah, talk about how that came about. 1310 01:27:26.920 --> 01:27:30.399 I'm I'm curious in particular when you give a little background on it, Uh, 1311 01:27:30.439 --> 01:27:32.079 if you were surprised by any of the questions and and kind of what 1312 01:27:32.119 --> 01:27:35.960 the tone of the reaction was after reading your book, how enlightening it was 1313 01:27:35.960 --> 01:27:40.239 because I'm sure there were some students in that class, uh who had not 1314 01:27:40.239 --> 01:27:43.000 watched wrestling and didn't really know a lot about it and had some preconceptions that 1315 01:27:43.039 --> 01:27:46.279 reading your book broke. Yeah. They Actually what it was was it was 1316 01:27:46.319 --> 01:27:55.680 a sports marketing and management class. And I did a book signing uh at 1317 01:27:56.079 --> 01:28:00.720 Aaron debuke, at a at a bar, at a casino, and had 1318 01:28:00.760 --> 01:28:03.920 it was a great turnout. You know, I'd stood there for two hours 1319 01:28:03.920 --> 01:28:08.319 straight, you know, signing autographs with books and everything, and sold a 1320 01:28:08.319 --> 01:28:12.560 lot of books. And you know, one of the teachers happened to be 1321 01:28:12.600 --> 01:28:14.600 there and got my book, and well, he read my book and thought 1322 01:28:14.600 --> 01:28:18.800 it was quite interesting, and so he wanted to set up another book signing 1323 01:28:18.880 --> 01:28:23.720 at Laura's College here in Debuque, and so that's what we did. And 1324 01:28:23.760 --> 01:28:29.760 then he told me he was gonna make it one of his requirements for the 1325 01:28:29.800 --> 01:28:33.680 class to read or required reading, because they were gonna uh do sports marketing, 1326 01:28:34.000 --> 01:28:39.359 uh sports marketing uh subject or whatever. And so I thought I thought 1327 01:28:39.479 --> 01:28:42.039 I was flattering. I was like, wow, that's that's pretty good. 1328 01:28:42.079 --> 01:28:45.159 And he you know, and and so Laura's College got in touch with us, 1329 01:28:45.279 --> 01:28:49.159 and you know, we delivered you know, thirty books to them or 1330 01:28:49.159 --> 01:28:54.720 whatever, and the class, you know about the books, and and so 1331 01:28:54.920 --> 01:28:59.720 he the teacher sent my wife an email and asked if I would come and 1332 01:28:59.760 --> 01:29:02.359 watch Monday Night Raw with them and this which was this past what not this 1333 01:29:02.520 --> 01:29:06.960 past Monday, but the Monday night before, And I said sure, you 1334 01:29:08.000 --> 01:29:11.680 know so and a lot of them have never watched wrestling. Some of them 1335 01:29:11.680 --> 01:29:15.880 were your casual wrestling fan, and and some of them knew who I was. 1336 01:29:15.720 --> 01:29:19.039 And I thought it was pretty It was a unique kind of situation for 1337 01:29:19.159 --> 01:29:21.960 me, and I was just I was flattered. I mean, it was 1338 01:29:23.239 --> 01:29:26.640 it was kind of neat, you know, you know, because they they 1339 01:29:26.680 --> 01:29:30.800 talked about, you know, the whole point of you know, why guys 1340 01:29:30.840 --> 01:29:35.239 go over and why did they tell stories? And how do they determine who's 1341 01:29:35.279 --> 01:29:40.399 going to get pushed and you know, and it basically all boils down to 1342 01:29:40.880 --> 01:29:45.119 you know, marketing and selling, you know, selling pay per views and 1343 01:29:45.560 --> 01:29:49.239 television shows and stuff. So and then that's, you know, basically, 1344 01:29:49.239 --> 01:29:53.399 in a nutshell, what it was about. And I thought it was I 1345 01:29:53.399 --> 01:29:56.159 thought it was pretty neat. I was like, you know, they want 1346 01:29:56.199 --> 01:29:58.640 to do a book with me, And I just you know, I just 1347 01:29:58.800 --> 01:30:01.960 I was just blown away by it, really because Laura's college is a major 1348 01:30:02.000 --> 01:30:05.560 college here in Iowa. Yeah, and you know, and I thought, 1349 01:30:05.720 --> 01:30:10.000 shoot, that's a big deal, you know. And I was just I 1350 01:30:10.039 --> 01:30:13.960 was really flattered by it. And you know, very humbling experience, very 1351 01:30:14.000 --> 01:30:18.800 humbling. What was there one question that stood out the most that surprised you 1352 01:30:19.039 --> 01:30:25.600 that you were impressed with or thrown off by that? The students asked, 1353 01:30:29.239 --> 01:30:32.640 Yeah, my wife just told she said, the internship. The guy there's 1354 01:30:32.680 --> 01:30:38.880 a gentleman that asked me what does he need to do to get an internship 1355 01:30:38.880 --> 01:30:42.600 with WWE. Yeah, And I asked him, I'm like, well, 1356 01:30:42.640 --> 01:30:45.840 what do you want to intern? And he really couldn't answer me, and 1357 01:30:46.119 --> 01:30:49.840 because I said, there's you know, they they they do internships, but 1358 01:30:49.880 --> 01:30:56.439 there's a whole list of jobs that you can do, and he couldn't specifically 1359 01:30:56.479 --> 01:30:58.840 tell me one thing. And I just thought it was kind of funny that, 1360 01:30:59.159 --> 01:31:01.039 you know, you know, and he's he wasn't a wrestling fan. 1361 01:31:01.560 --> 01:31:06.760 And then but one guy he wanted to become a sports therapist, you know, 1362 01:31:08.119 --> 01:31:12.039 a trainer, one of the trainers in the back the sports therapy and 1363 01:31:12.039 --> 01:31:14.640 stuff like that, and you know, I thought that was pretty cool too, 1364 01:31:14.640 --> 01:31:17.680 because he he was interested in the travel and stuff. And I don't 1365 01:31:17.680 --> 01:31:21.760 think he quite understood how much travel was involved because he, you know, 1366 01:31:21.800 --> 01:31:27.119 because he asked me, goes, okay, do you guys if somebody gets 1367 01:31:27.199 --> 01:31:30.319 hurt, just somebody there to see to it that you guys are taken care 1368 01:31:30.359 --> 01:31:32.319 of. And you know, and I went into the whole thing. We 1369 01:31:32.359 --> 01:31:35.439 have trainers in the back that you know, they say, tape us up, 1370 01:31:35.479 --> 01:31:40.520 do whatever, ice ice and all the electronics stuff that they hook up 1371 01:31:40.560 --> 01:31:43.680 to you if you have you know, injuries here and there and whatever. 1372 01:31:43.800 --> 01:31:47.399 And you know, he was very interested in becoming you know, a sports 1373 01:31:47.399 --> 01:31:53.880 therapist or what and whatnot. And uh but I he because he thought they 1374 01:31:53.960 --> 01:31:57.560 only traveled on you know, once a week. And I told him, 1375 01:31:57.560 --> 01:32:00.680 I was like, no, these guys travel every single night with them. 1376 01:32:00.840 --> 01:32:04.640 I didn't get that. And and and and I think also it blew the 1377 01:32:04.680 --> 01:32:10.199 class away too, that how much travel is involved, how much work is 1378 01:32:10.239 --> 01:32:15.159 involved, you know, because they only see what's on TV. And they 1379 01:32:15.199 --> 01:32:17.920 did, they did not realize when I told him, I said that right 1380 01:32:17.920 --> 01:32:23.399 there, what you see is the fun part. That's not work that's enjoyable. 1381 01:32:23.640 --> 01:32:27.279 I said, the work starts once you leave that ring and go to 1382 01:32:27.359 --> 01:32:30.840 the back when your work really that's when your job really starts. And they 1383 01:32:30.840 --> 01:32:32.279 didn't quite understand that when I said it to them, And then of course 1384 01:32:32.279 --> 01:32:36.000 I went into explaining to why as to why, and it just kind of 1385 01:32:36.039 --> 01:32:41.359 blew them away, you know, as to how much is involved, how 1386 01:32:41.399 --> 01:32:45.800 much traveling, how much preparation you have to do, you know, and 1387 01:32:45.800 --> 01:32:50.560 and how much work outside of television you have to do, and and how 1388 01:32:50.640 --> 01:32:55.840 much you have to keep up with and you know, in hotels and rental 1389 01:32:55.960 --> 01:32:59.560 cars and so forth, and you know, and it just cocked them off 1390 01:32:59.600 --> 01:33:02.239 guard as far as that, because they didn't think it was that, you 1391 01:33:02.279 --> 01:33:04.399 know. And like I said, they written my book and realized it, 1392 01:33:04.439 --> 01:33:08.840 but before that they just did not realize the travel that was involved or the 1393 01:33:08.880 --> 01:33:12.600 work that was involved. We're doing. And I think a lot of fans, 1394 01:33:13.159 --> 01:33:16.640 you know, new fans that I think they don't understand either, you 1395 01:33:16.640 --> 01:33:21.039 know. So give yourself a reason to look forward to going to the mailbox 1396 01:33:21.039 --> 01:33:27.840 each week with a PW Torch newsletter paper copy. Subscription details at PW torch 1397 01:33:27.880 --> 01:33:30.600 dot com. Slash paper copy It's twelve pages every week, packed with my 1398 01:33:30.720 --> 01:33:34.399 TV reports, along with exclusive features such as my cover story on the top 1399 01:33:34.399 --> 01:33:39.239 story of the week, our pay per view roundtable reviews from the Torch staff, 1400 01:33:39.560 --> 01:33:43.720 exclusive feature length columns from Greg Parks, Rich Fan, Sean Radikin, 1401 01:33:44.239 --> 01:33:47.359 Alan Coonahan, and Zach Cadorn, Torch Talk, transcripts, the latest news, 1402 01:33:47.600 --> 01:33:53.359 and more. PW Torch dot Com slash paper Copy take a break from 1403 01:33:53.439 --> 01:33:58.239 screen time and settle in every week with a megaandosa wrestling news and analysis with 1404 01:33:58.319 --> 01:34:01.800 a Pro Wrestling Torch newsletter paper copy edition. In the year twenty twenty two, 1405 01:34:02.279 --> 01:34:06.319 you can get a full year of home delivery for just ninety nine dollars, 1406 01:34:06.680 --> 01:34:12.359 or try US four an eight week trial subscription PW Torch dot Com slash 1407 01:34:12.560 --> 01:34:23.159 paper Copy. Did you think that they're still the college students did not grow 1408 01:34:23.239 --> 01:34:28.960 up with any kind of exposure even peripherally to the presumption that wrestling is real 1409 01:34:29.000 --> 01:34:31.760 competition Like that age group just never had that was that interesting to you? 1410 01:34:31.800 --> 01:34:35.159 Did did they under did they seem surprised at how the wrestling industry worked, 1411 01:34:35.279 --> 01:34:40.199 or or or or did they just kind of go with the flow and it 1412 01:34:40.239 --> 01:34:41.920 was like, yeah, we always kind of knew what it was like. 1413 01:34:42.920 --> 01:34:45.239 No, they didn't. They they weren't sure. They had an idea, 1414 01:34:45.479 --> 01:34:50.439 as everybody has an idea, you know, and but they weren't quite sure 1415 01:34:50.560 --> 01:34:57.079 how how winners and losers are determined. You know that that kind of blew 1416 01:34:57.079 --> 01:35:00.720 them away too, when I explained to them, you know, the storylines 1417 01:35:00.720 --> 01:35:03.640 and stuff like that, because they they like, how do you guys decide 1418 01:35:03.680 --> 01:35:06.479 who wins? Do you guys just decide amongst yourselves? And I said, 1419 01:35:06.520 --> 01:35:11.000 no, no, no, no, we have writers, we have storylines 1420 01:35:11.039 --> 01:35:13.920 we have to go by because they're selling a pay per view at the end 1421 01:35:13.960 --> 01:35:19.640 of every month, and they write TVs and storylines towards those pay per views 1422 01:35:19.720 --> 01:35:23.760 because because they're selling these pay per views, trying to get people interested in 1423 01:35:23.760 --> 01:35:26.640 buying the pay per view, and you know, and they and I explained 1424 01:35:26.680 --> 01:35:30.399 how that all worked, and they they started understanding that, and they had 1425 01:35:30.479 --> 01:35:34.680 no clue whatsoever that you know, that's how somebody you know, you know, 1426 01:35:34.720 --> 01:35:39.640 it's like the popularity, Well, how is their popularity determined? Yeah, 1427 01:35:40.359 --> 01:35:45.560 you know, and you know, so it's like they had an idea 1428 01:35:45.680 --> 01:35:47.319 because you know, they would come to me and say, well, I 1429 01:35:47.399 --> 01:35:51.239 know it's fake, but you know, and it's like, you know, 1430 01:35:51.720 --> 01:35:55.399 yeah, they always you know, people throw that word fake out there. 1431 01:35:55.640 --> 01:36:01.079 It's fake is not how you describe wrestling, describe it as entertainment. You 1432 01:36:01.119 --> 01:36:08.000 describe it as athletic soap opera. Because if fake, yeah, everything is 1433 01:36:08.000 --> 01:36:14.199 scripted, don't get me wrong, but it's fantasy. It's the bumps are 1434 01:36:14.199 --> 01:36:16.600 reel that hits you take a reel. They're not the kind of hits you 1435 01:36:16.720 --> 01:36:19.159 take. You know, if you punch somebody in the face, obviously you're 1436 01:36:19.159 --> 01:36:23.840 not getting full hit completely, but yeah, you're getting connected something. You 1437 01:36:23.880 --> 01:36:27.319 know, you're connecting to an extent that I wouldn't quite go as far as 1438 01:36:27.319 --> 01:36:29.920 saying it's fake. And that's what I explained to them, and they understood 1439 01:36:29.920 --> 01:36:31.960 that too, you know. So I don't think people mean anything by it, 1440 01:36:32.000 --> 01:36:35.960 but I don't think they realize it's not an applicable term, right Yeah, 1441 01:36:36.000 --> 01:36:39.439 I agree, they don't mean anything by it, by no means. 1442 01:36:39.600 --> 01:36:45.199 I just don't think they know what term to use, right yeap to describe 1443 01:36:45.199 --> 01:36:47.159 it. You know. I think it's where you know, they're they're missin 1444 01:36:47.239 --> 01:36:51.000 formed, you know, And I don't blame them for saying that because I'm 1445 01:36:51.000 --> 01:36:55.000 telling you when I was young too, I would say the same thing because 1446 01:36:55.000 --> 01:36:57.119 you know, you know, yeah, Bob, the first thing you should 1447 01:36:57.119 --> 01:36:59.159 have done is when someone said that, especially if it was a guy, 1448 01:36:59.159 --> 01:37:00.079 you should have said, come on to the stage, let me show how 1449 01:37:00.119 --> 01:37:03.039 fake it is and just beat them up. Because that's what they had have 1450 01:37:03.039 --> 01:37:06.239 done in the seventies. Yeah, yeah, oh exactly, Yeah, they 1451 01:37:06.520 --> 01:37:10.600 would do. And it's funny, you know, and you know, and 1452 01:37:10.600 --> 01:37:13.479 and people, it's funny because like, you know, people try to you 1453 01:37:13.520 --> 01:37:15.039 know, get to me, you know, like on Twitter and stuff. 1454 01:37:15.359 --> 01:37:18.399 You know, people, you know, I get some people trying to light 1455 01:37:18.479 --> 01:37:21.399 my fire and things like that, and they call me name this and that, 1456 01:37:21.520 --> 01:37:25.000 and you know, I just I go l O L or I just 1457 01:37:25.000 --> 01:37:28.119 don't even ignore. I ignore it and I just block them. And it's 1458 01:37:28.159 --> 01:37:32.439 funny because it's like they're trying to engage me into their into their conversation by 1459 01:37:32.479 --> 01:37:35.479 cussing me out, and you know it's not and I just laugh. And 1460 01:37:35.520 --> 01:37:39.840 then, you know, but you know, fake as far as you know. 1461 01:37:39.880 --> 01:37:42.000 And I tell people too, and you know, I was like, 1462 01:37:42.600 --> 01:37:45.199 you know, if somebody does you know, fake or whatever, and I 1463 01:37:45.279 --> 01:37:48.560 just I play along with it too, because it's like, you know, 1464 01:37:48.680 --> 01:37:51.680 I get it. I get it, you know, and I think they're 1465 01:37:51.800 --> 01:37:58.760 not saying it to be hurtful or to to you know, to put down 1466 01:37:58.840 --> 01:38:00.680 or downgrade what I do or anything like that. I just think they just 1467 01:38:01.439 --> 01:38:06.119 they're uneducated about it and they don't know what term to use. Bobby, 1468 01:38:06.439 --> 01:38:10.479 we're fifteen minutes over the time allotted, and I can edit this out because 1469 01:38:10.479 --> 01:38:11.960 I don't want to put you on the spot. Do you want to take 1470 01:38:11.960 --> 01:38:14.159 two email questions? Or do you have to run because I can save these 1471 01:38:14.159 --> 01:38:15.319 firsts? No? No, no, I'll take him. I'll take dol 1472 01:38:15.399 --> 01:38:17.680 email. Yeah, I'll do it. Okay, great, yep, and 1473 01:38:17.840 --> 01:38:20.039 no pressure because I know if you got somewhere to be, don't worry about 1474 01:38:20.039 --> 01:38:25.159 it. Cool. Well, let's take the first of the two questions. 1475 01:38:25.199 --> 01:38:28.159 This is from Jason, who says, first, I just wanted to give 1476 01:38:28.159 --> 01:38:30.439 my endorsement for Bob's book. I've read many wrestling autobiographies and never have I 1477 01:38:30.520 --> 01:38:34.159 read one that I felt so that felt so brutally honest without sounding spiteful. 1478 01:38:34.319 --> 01:38:38.239 That's a really nice compliment. Yeah, that is, it's very nice. 1479 01:38:38.520 --> 01:38:41.800 Yeah, thank you. He wasn't afraid to step on toes and didn't try 1480 01:38:41.840 --> 01:38:44.399 to skate around issues that could get him into trouble with people in the industry. 1481 01:38:44.399 --> 01:38:46.920 It's truly a must read for any nineties to two thousands pro wrestling fans. 1482 01:38:47.000 --> 01:38:49.680 They just need to get it for audible dot Com so I can listen 1483 01:38:49.680 --> 01:38:53.199 to it. Yeah, I don't know how that works. I don't know 1484 01:38:53.199 --> 01:38:57.479 how they decide that stuff. Well, yeah, my wife sent ECW press 1485 01:38:57.479 --> 01:39:00.960 and email to find out if they were going to do to an audio version. 1486 01:39:00.199 --> 01:39:04.359 Yeah, and they said they weren't. Okay, Yeah, I know. 1487 01:39:04.399 --> 01:39:09.159 And I think that what it is is not so much that they don't 1488 01:39:09.199 --> 01:39:13.359 do it, is finding somebody to do the audio version for them. I 1489 01:39:13.359 --> 01:39:17.279 think that's the issue. Yeah, you don't want to read it, Hey, 1490 01:39:17.359 --> 01:39:21.239 maybe I'll do it. I'll be glad to sell more books. Yeah. 1491 01:39:21.479 --> 01:39:24.680 Well, here's his questions. He goes as someone who is at the 1492 01:39:24.680 --> 01:39:28.560 forefront of WWE's movement toward more violent matches during the Attitude era. What are 1493 01:39:28.560 --> 01:39:30.199 your thoughts when you watch a gimmick match today? It feels like in most 1494 01:39:30.199 --> 01:39:33.520 gimmick matches today with hardcore steps, the gimmick ends up being more of a 1495 01:39:33.560 --> 01:39:36.680 marketing gimmick used only to sell the match than actually a hardcore gimmick during the 1496 01:39:36.720 --> 01:39:41.279 match itself. Like Helena Seller elimination Chamber. They just come across looking like 1497 01:39:41.279 --> 01:39:45.039 a regular match that just happens to be inside a cage with no real added 1498 01:39:45.079 --> 01:39:48.359 element or k fabed danger of k faded danger. Even in an era with 1499 01:39:48.479 --> 01:39:51.359 no cheershots to the head and no blood, the matches just come off so 1500 01:39:51.560 --> 01:39:55.439 incredibly lame. I'd love to hear what Bob thinks when you see something like 1501 01:39:55.479 --> 01:39:58.680 the Brian Orton hell in a sell match these days. Yeah, I you 1502 01:39:58.720 --> 01:40:02.520 know what I I do. I think the matches are just your matches that 1503 01:40:02.600 --> 01:40:08.640 you would see every week on TV. They're just they just have the cage 1504 01:40:08.680 --> 01:40:12.439 as a prop, you know. And and I'm a firm believer if you 1505 01:40:12.760 --> 01:40:15.399 have a cage like that, because I'm old school, And if you have 1506 01:40:15.439 --> 01:40:17.000 a cage, I mean, somebody's got to draw blood. There's got to 1507 01:40:17.039 --> 01:40:24.119 be some you know, some kind of you know, some type of over 1508 01:40:24.159 --> 01:40:29.079 the top violence. To me, that's just you know, my opinion. 1509 01:40:29.560 --> 01:40:33.279 And because when you when you're selling this hell in the cell, it's supposed 1510 01:40:33.279 --> 01:40:38.359 to be something unique, something different, you know, from your typical match 1511 01:40:38.359 --> 01:40:42.399 that you see, so it's supposed to be brutally violent, but in today's 1512 01:40:42.399 --> 01:40:45.920 era, they have the PG thirteen thing going on, and so they have 1513 01:40:45.960 --> 01:40:50.239 to tone it down. And I understand why they do that, but I 1514 01:40:50.279 --> 01:40:55.279 really think it hurts the credibility of the match because now when they say, 1515 01:40:55.279 --> 01:40:57.840 hell in the cell, Okay, well, it's just another match with the 1516 01:40:57.840 --> 01:41:00.840 cage around it, that's all it is, you know, And I think 1517 01:41:00.960 --> 01:41:04.359 that's it, and it's because of the PG rating and and that's just the 1518 01:41:04.399 --> 01:41:06.479 way it is now, and it's the way it's going to be for a 1519 01:41:06.520 --> 01:41:12.479 while from you know what I see. And it would be nice if they 1520 01:41:12.520 --> 01:41:15.199 would go back to the way it was before, but I don't see that 1521 01:41:15.319 --> 01:41:18.399 happening. But I'm in total agreement with it's just another match with a cage 1522 01:41:18.399 --> 01:41:25.000 around it. Do you think there's anything positive about dialing back on it? 1523 01:41:25.079 --> 01:41:28.319 In case someday they want to ramp it up again, there'll be a whole 1524 01:41:28.359 --> 01:41:31.760 generation of people whose jaws will be dropped because it seemed like for a while 1525 01:41:31.840 --> 01:41:35.840 they just would throw stipulations out there, and you know, undercard matches that 1526 01:41:35.920 --> 01:41:40.239 had no context would have a lot of weapons, and then the main event 1527 01:41:40.239 --> 01:41:44.279 would be a straight wrestling match. And that's so flipped from what I grew 1528 01:41:44.359 --> 01:41:45.399 up with and what makes the most sense to me, which is bring the 1529 01:41:45.399 --> 01:41:49.880 weapons out, not as some sort of lower card novelty that really is just 1530 01:41:49.880 --> 01:41:53.239 for people to laugh at the announcers to go look at them, use the 1531 01:41:53.279 --> 01:41:56.600 toys, which is their term now for weapons, right, you know. 1532 01:41:56.800 --> 01:41:59.199 But but it's I think there's a happy medium, which is, like you 1533 01:41:59.239 --> 01:42:01.000 say, if there's good a cage match, the cage should be there for 1534 01:42:01.039 --> 01:42:05.079 a reason that he'll kept running away or kept people kept interfering, and so 1535 01:42:05.199 --> 01:42:08.800 you need a cage to contain them. That's what the AWA did when there 1536 01:42:08.800 --> 01:42:11.279 was a cage match. There was a reason for it, and then somebody 1537 01:42:11.279 --> 01:42:15.479 bled because it was a hardcore feud. It wasn't some opening match that didn't 1538 01:42:15.560 --> 01:42:17.479 matter, and they just said, well, let's satisfy those bloodthirst defense, 1539 01:42:17.680 --> 01:42:19.640 you know, with a quick match. Like to me, there is a 1540 01:42:19.680 --> 01:42:23.520 happy medium where do it, but make it count when you do it, 1541 01:42:23.600 --> 01:42:26.720 and don't put it in the opening match and happy and eults laugh at it. 1542 01:42:27.439 --> 01:42:30.560 Right, Because back in the day, whenever they would they would build 1543 01:42:30.560 --> 01:42:34.279 a storyline, you know, it would you know, they would have you 1544 01:42:34.319 --> 01:42:39.039 know, they would have said match and they would have you know, several 1545 01:42:39.079 --> 01:42:41.640 matches and then we'll get to the point where, like you said, people 1546 01:42:41.680 --> 01:42:45.840 would interfere and interfere. Well, that was the payoff, was the cage 1547 01:42:45.840 --> 01:42:47.920 match. You know, That's where everybody's like, Okay, I've got to 1548 01:42:47.960 --> 01:42:51.880 see this because now he can't get away, there's no way out, there's 1549 01:42:51.960 --> 01:42:55.960 no way in. Somebody's gonna get hurt in this thing. There's gonna be 1550 01:42:56.000 --> 01:42:59.279 a winner, and that's what you always look forward to back in the day, 1551 01:42:59.680 --> 01:43:02.039 you know, and now it just seems like it's it's almost like to 1552 01:43:02.159 --> 01:43:08.000 me, you know, they have too many hell in the cell matches and 1553 01:43:08.039 --> 01:43:12.319 that's just you know, and I just I think you know, the way 1554 01:43:13.920 --> 01:43:16.439 the way they do them now where they're just you know, a cage and 1555 01:43:16.479 --> 01:43:21.760 a match toned way down as you know, as far as the violent part 1556 01:43:21.800 --> 01:43:27.720 about it, you know, I don't really see. I just I think, 1557 01:43:30.000 --> 01:43:33.560 you know, that's a tough question to answer because I think that it 1558 01:43:33.600 --> 01:43:38.760 doesn't matter if you know, if it's toned down now, you know, 1559 01:43:39.520 --> 01:43:41.960 I don't think they're saving it for the future as far as we're going to 1560 01:43:42.039 --> 01:43:45.760 have to wrap it up because what I think what happened is too Also what 1561 01:43:46.159 --> 01:43:50.359 got carried away is you know, you had your first version of the version 1562 01:43:50.399 --> 01:43:53.840 of the hell in the Cell. Well, we got to top that. 1563 01:43:54.039 --> 01:43:56.479 So they would do more. They would, they would, you know, 1564 01:43:57.319 --> 01:43:59.720 they would step it up, step it up, you know, and and 1565 01:44:00.119 --> 01:44:02.520 they you know, they raised the bar every time there was a Hell in 1566 01:44:02.520 --> 01:44:05.880 the Cell. They kept raising the bar, and it got to the point 1567 01:44:06.000 --> 01:44:09.840 to where, you know, it's like, okay, where do you go 1568 01:44:09.960 --> 01:44:14.159 from here? And thankfully they went into the PG that uh, the PG 1569 01:44:14.319 --> 01:44:16.319 era, because it's to me it was like almost where do you go now? 1570 01:44:16.359 --> 01:44:19.319 Because you know, so many things have happened, and it's like, 1571 01:44:19.359 --> 01:44:23.159 how do you top that? Yeah, you know, because keep topping it, 1572 01:44:23.199 --> 01:44:25.279 and you have to keep topping it. They raised the bar, raised 1573 01:44:25.279 --> 01:44:28.640 the bar because so much crazy stuff goes on, you know, moon salt 1574 01:44:28.760 --> 01:44:31.319 off the top and you know, and the or like or like mc foley 1575 01:44:31.359 --> 01:44:35.399 going off the top of the cage and and you know, and breaking through 1576 01:44:35.439 --> 01:44:40.720 because in that time McK foley went through the top of the cage that wasn't 1577 01:44:40.720 --> 01:44:45.199 supposed to happen like that, right, and so, but I just I 1578 01:44:45.319 --> 01:44:50.039 just think that you know it the way it is now, that you know 1579 01:44:50.079 --> 01:44:53.680 it's going to keep going that way for a long time. I truly believe. 1580 01:44:53.680 --> 01:44:56.359 I don't think that later on they're gonna be able to ramp it up 1581 01:44:56.399 --> 01:44:59.439 and and start, you know, having blood and stuff like that. I 1582 01:44:59.520 --> 01:45:02.800 just I, you know, got our PW Torch VIP sale going on right 1583 01:45:02.840 --> 01:45:05.199 now, a New Year sale. We don't normally do this. Get six 1584 01:45:05.239 --> 01:45:11.279 dollars off of VIP membership right now with coupon code New Year twenty twenty four. 1585 01:45:11.520 --> 01:45:14.760 That's New Year twenty twenty four. Take six dollars off our normal nine 1586 01:45:14.800 --> 01:45:17.439 dollars ninety nine cent monthly rate that gives you a month the VIP membership for 1587 01:45:17.560 --> 01:45:20.880 three dollars and ninety nine cents. Act now. It's a limited time offer 1588 01:45:20.920 --> 01:45:26.680 here to kick off the New Year twenty twenty four. So many perks come 1589 01:45:26.720 --> 01:45:30.479 with VIP membership. Our retro World Class Champion Wrestling review, our post pay 1590 01:45:30.520 --> 01:45:34.279 per view reviews both in podcast and written format, add free versions of our 1591 01:45:34.319 --> 01:45:38.640 free shows like this one, and so much more. PW Torch dot com, 1592 01:45:38.680 --> 01:45:43.640 slash Go VIP coupon code New Year twenty twenty four and take six dollars 1593 01:45:43.680 --> 01:45:50.520 off a one month, three month or one year VIP subscription. Are you? 1594 01:45:50.560 --> 01:45:54.119 Are you, by the way, one hundred percent convinced that that second 1595 01:45:54.159 --> 01:45:57.039 bump through the cage wasn't planned because I know make fully said it, but 1596 01:45:57.039 --> 01:45:59.239 I think you said it because he promised his wife he wouldn't do it. 1597 01:45:59.520 --> 01:46:01.399 But when you watch the match, he kind of avoided that spot until that 1598 01:46:01.479 --> 01:46:05.199 spot, until that well part of the match. Well, I'll tell you 1599 01:46:05.279 --> 01:46:10.760 this is how it was. What was supposed to happen. Yeah, Taker 1600 01:46:10.960 --> 01:46:15.640 was supposed to choke slam him, and it wasn't supposed to break because it 1601 01:46:15.720 --> 01:46:19.680 was supposed to break sometime during the match, but not with a choke slam, 1602 01:46:19.720 --> 01:46:23.960 you know, Okay, And yeah, because they were he was they 1603 01:46:24.000 --> 01:46:29.600 were both supposed to go through it Undertaker sand Yes, if I'm not mistaken, 1604 01:46:29.640 --> 01:46:32.359 they but I know for a fact that it was supposed to collapse. 1605 01:46:32.399 --> 01:46:36.560 It was supposed to break. I do know that, But that wasn't the 1606 01:46:36.560 --> 01:46:41.479 spot that they intended it to break at. And and Taker wasn't going to 1607 01:46:41.560 --> 01:46:44.279 take that kind of a bump. Was he going to be holding on and 1608 01:46:44.359 --> 01:46:45.800 drop down on his feet. I mean, can't imagine him doing a flatback 1609 01:46:45.840 --> 01:46:48.479 from through the roof. Yeah, I know, I think he was supposed 1610 01:46:48.479 --> 01:46:51.560 to land on his feet or he was supposed to hang on. I know 1611 01:46:51.760 --> 01:46:55.680 Mike was supposed to go through. I do know that for a fact. 1612 01:46:55.960 --> 01:47:00.439 Yeah. But that bump, the choke, the choke slam, Yeah, 1613 01:47:00.520 --> 01:47:03.239 I do know that wasn't the intended spot. And I just you know, 1614 01:47:03.319 --> 01:47:06.520 and it makes me wonder too, because it's like, how how is that 1615 01:47:06.600 --> 01:47:12.760 thing not supposed to to give with all that weight coming down? If you 1616 01:47:12.800 --> 01:47:15.039 know, you know what I'm saying. Oh, it makes no I do. 1617 01:47:15.119 --> 01:47:17.960 It makes me a little suspicious of an audible being called during the match 1618 01:47:18.239 --> 01:47:23.319 perhaps where yeah, yeah, and yeah, and I think maybe an audible 1619 01:47:23.439 --> 01:47:26.760 was called it, and uh, you know they wanted to make it spectacular 1620 01:47:26.800 --> 01:47:29.960 because I know Mick he wants to go. He's over the top anyway with 1621 01:47:30.079 --> 01:47:32.119 every bump he does, you know, so he wants to be remembered. 1622 01:47:32.479 --> 01:47:35.479 He doesn't want to be remembered as Mick Foley. He wants to be remembered 1623 01:47:35.520 --> 01:47:39.800 as the guy that went through that cage, you know, or you know, 1624 01:47:39.920 --> 01:47:42.600 when flying off the top of the cage or fell through the cage like 1625 01:47:42.640 --> 01:47:45.319 he choke slammed through it. You know, that's how he wants to be 1626 01:47:45.399 --> 01:47:47.840 remembered. He wants to be remembered for the guy that did these crazy stunts, 1627 01:47:48.159 --> 01:47:51.720 you know. And so I just I really think that, you know 1628 01:47:53.319 --> 01:47:57.680 that, you know, because I do know for a fact that that thing 1629 01:47:57.800 --> 01:48:02.279 was supposed to to fall open. But I just I think that, you 1630 01:48:02.279 --> 01:48:05.960 know, when he choke slammed him, they wanted to go through then, 1631 01:48:06.439 --> 01:48:10.640 you know, maybe because that wasn't the intended spot for that thing to break. 1632 01:48:11.159 --> 01:48:14.960 And I just think Mick is she wants to be remembered for, you 1633 01:48:14.960 --> 01:48:17.000 know, crazy bombs and stuff like that. So you know, I just 1634 01:48:17.039 --> 01:48:19.560 really think an audible was called right there and said, hell, let's just 1635 01:48:19.560 --> 01:48:23.439 go through it right now. Just choke slam me right here. You know 1636 01:48:23.680 --> 01:48:28.319 though, Let's let's let's go to another Jason, this from Long Island to 1637 01:48:28.359 --> 01:48:30.479 be IFP member for five plus years, and he said, my question deals 1638 01:48:30.520 --> 01:48:34.720 with the Dudley's Holly s feud that featured the Starcross lovers Spike and Molly's storyline. 1639 01:48:34.840 --> 01:48:39.039 I remember that being a really good hat fields in McCoy's asque storyline that 1640 01:48:39.079 --> 01:48:42.560 myself and my friends were enjoying up until it was abruptly dropped and then Molly 1641 01:48:42.600 --> 01:48:45.199 somehow owned up as a sidekick of Hurricane Helms. Can you provide some insight 1642 01:48:45.199 --> 01:48:48.600 into that feud, into why it was dropped so suddenly? Yeah, See, 1643 01:48:48.640 --> 01:48:53.479 that's that's one of those things where you just never know why they dropped 1644 01:48:53.479 --> 01:48:57.359 something that's working. You know, we we were having a ball, all 1645 01:48:57.359 --> 01:49:00.239 of us were having a ball with that that angle, that storyline. You 1646 01:49:00.239 --> 01:49:03.920 know, they had some really good stuff planned for Crash and I and Mollie 1647 01:49:04.520 --> 01:49:10.680 and you know there, I don't know why, you know, they stopped 1648 01:49:10.680 --> 01:49:13.439 it. I have no idea why, because it was working, it was 1649 01:49:13.439 --> 01:49:16.520 getting over and I get people asking me those questions all the time. How 1650 01:49:16.560 --> 01:49:20.039 come they stopped with the whole holly, you know, the storyline and stuff 1651 01:49:20.079 --> 01:49:23.960 like that, because people enjoyed it, you know, because it was it 1652 01:49:24.000 --> 01:49:26.800 was different, it was fun, you know. And you know, there 1653 01:49:26.880 --> 01:49:29.479 was another thing we were supposed to do at Christmas. It was a vignette 1654 01:49:29.520 --> 01:49:31.239 we were supposed to do, and it was supposed to be it was a 1655 01:49:31.359 --> 01:49:33.880 Christmas or a Thanksgiving. We're going to do. I think it was a 1656 01:49:33.920 --> 01:49:36.680 Christmas we were supposed to do because I was supposed to get you know, 1657 01:49:36.720 --> 01:49:40.479 sweaters for Christmas, and I was supposed to be really pissed off about it. 1658 01:49:40.760 --> 01:49:46.960 And because he told us ahead of time, Ed oh what was his 1659 01:49:47.079 --> 01:49:50.840 name. He was one of our writers, Ed Cosky, Yes, sir, 1660 01:49:51.479 --> 01:49:54.720 And he was telling me, he said, this is when we have 1661 01:49:54.840 --> 01:49:59.079 planned for you. Because Ed was a really he was a big proponent for 1662 01:49:59.359 --> 01:50:01.680 us. He really, you know, he was pushing for this angle big 1663 01:50:01.720 --> 01:50:03.920 time. I mean, he always came to me and said, this is 1664 01:50:03.920 --> 01:50:06.319 what we're doing. You know, you got any ideas, We're going to 1665 01:50:06.479 --> 01:50:10.600 run with this thing. And you know, life was good when we were 1666 01:50:10.600 --> 01:50:14.439 doing that. Everything was fun. And he came to me with this storyline, 1667 01:50:14.520 --> 01:50:16.319 Hey, we got this idea. We're going to go find this rundown 1668 01:50:16.399 --> 01:50:20.399 trailer somewhere where we got tall grass growing up. There's you know, we're 1669 01:50:20.399 --> 01:50:24.880 gonna put cars in the in the in the yard up on blocks and stuff, 1670 01:50:24.920 --> 01:50:28.079 just old piece of junk cars and everything, and that's gonna be where 1671 01:50:28.319 --> 01:50:30.279 your family lives. And I'm like, hell, yeah, let's do it, 1672 01:50:30.720 --> 01:50:35.680 you know, And we were supposed to have like probably something like fifteen 1673 01:50:35.880 --> 01:50:40.840 twenty family members. It's this Christmas and it was going to be it was 1674 01:50:40.880 --> 01:50:43.960 a great idea, and you know, it was supposed to wind up into 1675 01:50:43.960 --> 01:50:46.239 a big fight, you know, at dinner and stuff like this. And 1676 01:50:46.560 --> 01:50:49.199 you know, because we all me you know, obviously me and Crash never 1677 01:50:49.239 --> 01:50:53.039 got along on TV because that was the whole thing with me and him, 1678 01:50:53.159 --> 01:50:55.920 we just never saw eye to eye. And that was going to be the 1679 01:50:55.960 --> 01:51:00.439 whole thing with the with the family get together is none of the families to 1680 01:51:00.479 --> 01:51:02.520 eye, you know. And it was gonna it was gonna it was gonna 1681 01:51:02.520 --> 01:51:04.239 be fun, and it was gonna be good. And they dropped it. 1682 01:51:04.279 --> 01:51:08.399 And I don't know why. And see, that's one of the things when 1683 01:51:08.479 --> 01:51:11.479 they they you're in a storyline, then all of a sudden they decided to 1684 01:51:11.479 --> 01:51:15.000 go a different direction, you know, with other people that may be involved 1685 01:51:15.000 --> 01:51:18.279 in the storyline. There's no rhyme or reason why, they just do, 1686 01:51:19.039 --> 01:51:23.680 you know. And that's something that I you know, maybe I should have. 1687 01:51:24.640 --> 01:51:26.920 You know a lot of times I've second guessed myself, you know, 1688 01:51:27.279 --> 01:51:30.000 shouldn't I ask why are we not going forward with what we're doing? You 1689 01:51:30.039 --> 01:51:33.000 know? And and you know, I kicked myself sometimes for not asking, 1690 01:51:33.039 --> 01:51:38.119 but you know, I've just I never wanted to really create any waves backstage, 1691 01:51:38.319 --> 01:51:40.439 and I just wanted to do my work, do my job, and 1692 01:51:40.479 --> 01:51:42.520 have a good time at it, because I just I didn't you know, 1693 01:51:43.039 --> 01:51:45.159 I enjoyed what I did, and I didn't want to, you know, 1694 01:51:45.960 --> 01:51:48.560 piss off anybody basically, And I didn't want to come off sounding like it, 1695 01:51:48.680 --> 01:51:53.319 you know, because the thing is to wade if if if you're you're 1696 01:51:53.319 --> 01:51:55.760 in a storyline, then all of a sudden they drop it, and you 1697 01:51:55.880 --> 01:52:00.800 just question why they dropped it, and you ask somebody. They might take 1698 01:52:00.840 --> 01:52:03.800 what you said and turn it around to where it look like you're really pissed 1699 01:52:03.840 --> 01:52:08.079 off about the whole thing, and then it looks bad. It reflects bad 1700 01:52:08.119 --> 01:52:13.039 on you as that individual, you know, because it's like challenging them and 1701 01:52:13.039 --> 01:52:15.479 and you know, and I didn't want to do that. I just wanted 1702 01:52:15.479 --> 01:52:17.039 to do my job. And it's like, Okay, well maybe they'll have 1703 01:52:17.079 --> 01:52:20.000 something for me better later on. You know. I always I always had 1704 01:52:20.000 --> 01:52:24.800 that hope, you know. I was always looking at the glass half full, 1705 01:52:25.079 --> 01:52:29.159 you know, And but it maybe it's a little more faith in the 1706 01:52:29.239 --> 01:52:33.279 system than if you kind of sat back passively, then you maybe should have 1707 01:52:33.319 --> 01:52:38.199 in retrospect, right, Yeah, And I and a couple of times I 1708 01:52:38.239 --> 01:52:40.439 should have. I should have came forward and said, hey, why are 1709 01:52:40.439 --> 01:52:44.920 we not going forward with this? Yeah, but it is what it is. 1710 01:52:45.119 --> 01:52:46.560 That's why I always try to look at it. Look, it is 1711 01:52:46.600 --> 01:52:49.279 what it is. There's nothing I could do to change it now, you 1712 01:52:49.319 --> 01:52:55.319 know, because because throughout life, you know, especially, you always question 1713 01:52:55.720 --> 01:52:59.119 things along the way, what should I have done this different? Or you 1714 01:52:59.159 --> 01:53:00.359 know, there's a lot of things I think I could have done different that 1715 01:53:00.840 --> 01:53:03.920 I might have benefited from. But I just I didn't do it, and 1716 01:53:03.960 --> 01:53:08.359 I just I regret it sometimes, but I look at it like, Okay, 1717 01:53:08.399 --> 01:53:11.199 well I still had a great run. I still had fun doing what 1718 01:53:11.279 --> 01:53:14.319 I was doing, you know, until the end, because I really ran. 1719 01:53:14.520 --> 01:53:16.720 It wasn't having fun. But and that that's the thing for me. 1720 01:53:16.760 --> 01:53:20.560 As long as I'm having fun, you know, that's that's all that matters 1721 01:53:20.600 --> 01:53:25.319 to me. But in retrospect, yeah, I should have stepped up and 1722 01:53:25.359 --> 01:53:28.479 said, hey, you know, how come we stopped the storyline with the 1723 01:53:28.560 --> 01:53:31.319 Dudleys because it was going good, you know, And I didn't and to 1724 01:53:31.479 --> 01:53:36.800 answer the email question. You know there is no reason why they stopped. 1725 01:53:36.800 --> 01:53:41.039 They you know, there really wasn't a reason. They had no reason, 1726 01:53:41.239 --> 01:53:45.239 you know from you know so because it was going good, it was getting 1727 01:53:45.239 --> 01:53:49.760 over So it is what it is. Yeah, yeah, well, Bob, 1728 01:53:50.119 --> 01:53:54.800 thank you so much once again. You're very generous with your time and 1729 01:53:54.960 --> 01:54:00.439 great stories and great insights and entertaining and informative, all those great early and 1730 01:54:00.600 --> 01:54:03.000 as I said, u VFP members who are listening now, can uh I 1731 01:54:03.079 --> 01:54:08.119 encourage you to uh buy his book on your on your Kindler, nooker online 1732 01:54:08.199 --> 01:54:12.239 or at an actual brick and mortar store they still exist, and UH support 1733 01:54:12.279 --> 01:54:15.960 what Bob did and read some more great stories. It comes with our highest 1734 01:54:15.960 --> 01:54:18.239 recommendation, Bob. We well look forward to having you on again a few 1735 01:54:18.239 --> 01:54:21.079 months on the line. Beck, Yes, I would love to come back 1736 01:54:21.119 --> 01:54:25.279 on. Please don't forget about me. I won't. I won't. You're 1737 01:54:25.319 --> 01:54:27.920 too good of a guest. And you know, it was great today because 1738 01:54:28.079 --> 01:54:30.680 you had some things say about Daniel Bryan, and you had some insights about 1739 01:54:30.680 --> 01:54:34.439 two people in the news right now, Batista and brock Lesnar with some experiences 1740 01:54:34.439 --> 01:54:38.159 with both of them. You talked about the performance Center, and and I 1741 01:54:38.199 --> 01:54:42.960 mean just you're you're able to uh provide that that credible first person insight and 1742 01:54:43.039 --> 01:54:45.960 perspective on some things that are still current and wrestling and so in addition to 1743 01:54:45.039 --> 01:54:48.840 just fun stories. It's it's really nice because I think people will watch Batista 1744 01:54:48.840 --> 01:54:53.359 differently having heard what you said about him, and watch Daniel Brian differently having 1745 01:54:53.760 --> 01:54:57.079 heard you with the credibility that you carry saying what you said about him. 1746 01:54:57.119 --> 01:55:00.800 So it's all great, well, good, good deal. I'm glad I 1747 01:55:00.800 --> 01:55:02.960 can I hope. I hope I can help you know, that's that you 1748 01:55:02.960 --> 01:55:06.680 know. I just you know, I hope I can help. So anyway, 1749 01:55:06.720 --> 01:55:09.560 but I thank you a lot, man, I really do, and 1750 01:55:09.560 --> 01:55:12.640 I appreciate a way I do. I'll hold you in high regard. I 1751 01:55:12.680 --> 01:55:15.000 respect the hell out of you, and I really appreciate everything you do. 1752 01:55:15.119 --> 01:55:18.159 You've done for me, pushing my book and everything having me on the show. 1753 01:55:18.359 --> 01:55:20.920 I do. I am very grateful to you, man, I really 1754 01:55:20.960 --> 01:55:25.800 appreciate it. Thank you. And people can follow you at Triple h Rules 1755 01:55:25.880 --> 01:55:31.840 right on Twitter, yeah yeah, no, they can follow me at the 1756 01:55:31.880 --> 01:55:34.800 Bob Holly yeah excellent, excellent, and follow me by the Way at the 1757 01:55:34.960 --> 01:55:38.960 Wade Keller. If you're a VIP member not doing that and you're on Twitter, 1758 01:55:38.960 --> 01:55:41.399 shame on you Follow me at alt Way Keller and follow Bub Holly at 1759 01:55:41.439 --> 01:55:45.319 Don Bob Holly Well from two doues on Twitter, This is Way Keller and 1760 01:55:45.359 --> 01:56:05.000 me Apple Bob Holly Thanking everybody and signing off. Invite you to email the 1761 01:56:05.000 --> 01:56:11.000 show with feedback or questions or comments. That email address is Wadekeller Podcast at 1762 01:56:11.000 --> 01:56:15.279 petwtorch dot com. That's Wadekeller Podcast at PW toorch dot com. Also welcome 1763 01:56:15.319 --> 01:56:19.199 your feedback on Twitter. You can follow us on Twitter at PW Torch and 1764 01:56:19.399 --> 01:56:25.720 follow me at The Wadekeller. That's at PW Torch and at the Wadekeller. 1765 01:56:27.680 --> 01:56:30.920 Searching for more great pro wrestling talk, then join me Jason Powell host them 1766 01:56:30.920 --> 01:56:35.239 the three weekly Pro Wrestling Boom Podcast. Each week you'll hear the latest news 1767 01:56:35.239 --> 01:56:39.520 and analysis from me and my team at Pro Wrestling dot need along with other 1768 01:56:39.560 --> 01:56:44.520 pro wrestling media members. Plus The Pro Wrestling Boom Podcast features long form interviews 1769 01:56:44.560 --> 01:56:47.319 with notable names in the pro wrestling industry. Subscribe and iTunes, Stitcher, 1770 01:56:47.520 --> 01:56:53.000 Downcast, and all your favorite secondary apps, or visit us directly at PW 1771 01:56:53.039 --> 01:56:58.920 boom dot com. 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There's no larger longer spanning pro wrestling podcast 1813 02:00:03.520 --> 02:00:08.840 library than that that comes with a pw torch VIP membership. Now we're approaching 1814 02:00:09.039 --> 02:00:12.880 twenty years of podcasting. Go vip and dive into our post pay per view 1815 02:00:12.920 --> 02:00:16.239 roundtables are covered to some of your favorite eras of wrestling, top name long 1816 02:00:16.279 --> 02:00:21.680 form interviews and special format podcasts that we've done throughout the years. Pw torch 1817 02:00:21.720 --> 02:00:26.920 dot com slash go vip. We have a streamline signup form and you can 1818 02:00:26.960 --> 02:00:30.560 pay with PayPal or directly with your credit card or debit card. In one 1819 02:00:30.640 --> 02:00:32.359 or two minutes from right now, you can be a VIP member and diving 1820 02:00:32.359 --> 02:00:36.640 into our library. Pw torch dot com slash go vip. We do not 1821 02:00:36.680 --> 02:00:40.720 normally do this, but we are kicking off the New Year twenty twenty four 1822 02:00:40.800 --> 02:00:44.680 with a VIP sale. Go vip for a full month for three dollars in 1823 02:00:44.720 --> 02:00:48.520 ninety nine cents. That is six dollars off our normal very reasonable rate. 1824 02:00:48.560 --> 02:00:53.960 We're told of nine dollars in ninety nine cents per month. PW torch dot 1825 02:00:54.000 --> 02:01:00.520 com slash go vip. That's pw torch dot com slash gov vip and enter 1826 02:01:00.560 --> 02:01:05.920 coupon code New Year twenty twenty four. That six dollars discount can be applied 1827 02:01:05.920 --> 02:01:09.479 to a one month sub, a three month sub, or a one year 1828 02:01:09.520 --> 02:01:13.399 sub. You'll get six dollars off whichever option you choose. We'd love to 1829 02:01:13.399 --> 02:01:15.279 have you have tries for the first time, or come on back if for 1830 02:01:15.319 --> 02:01:20.039 some reason you've had to take a break from VIP membership. Our podcasts with 1831 02:01:20.159 --> 02:01:26.199 a VIP membership are compatible with the Apple podcast app that means CarPlay. That 1832 02:01:26.239 --> 02:01:29.439 means on your iPhone and you don't have to go to advanced settings or enter 1833 02:01:29.479 --> 02:01:32.079 any special password or anything like that. It's a simple click of a link 1834 02:01:32.399 --> 02:01:35.279 from your iPhone when you sign up that'll be email to you. It is 1835 02:01:35.359 --> 02:01:40.960 frictionless. You can also use many other popular podcast apps or just streamed from 1836 02:01:41.079 --> 02:01:45.680 our vip ad free website. So many perks with VIP membership, including last 1837 02:01:45.720 --> 02:01:49.520 Saturday night's nearly two hour review of AW World's End. Todd, Martin, 1838 02:01:49.600 --> 02:01:53.960 Rich Fan and I dissected that event. We got under the Jericho controversy and 1839 02:01:53.960 --> 02:01:57.880 how AW had handled it so far and how they should going forward, Thoughts 1840 02:01:57.920 --> 02:02:01.800 on MJF and the Devil reveal, Mojo is Champion, and so much more 1841 02:02:01.920 --> 02:02:06.720 in that VP exclusive roundtable. Also for VIP members, we have a written 1842 02:02:06.960 --> 02:02:12.479 round table after pay per views and pls with staff scores and reviews. Alan 1843 02:02:12.560 --> 02:02:17.159 Coonahan, Rich Fan, Sean Radikin and I wrote reviews of Saturday's pay per 1844 02:02:17.199 --> 02:02:21.000 view and we'll do so again for the Royal Rumble coming up later this month. 1845 02:02:21.560 --> 02:02:28.119 Also, we just ran our nearly two hour World Class Championship Wrestling Von 1846 02:02:28.239 --> 02:02:30.960 Eric special podcast that we did back in two thousand and six. This was 1847 02:02:31.119 --> 02:02:36.560 a show that I did with Bruce Mitchell reviewing the Von Eric DVD that had 1848 02:02:36.600 --> 02:02:42.199 just come out, and they ended up putting this podcast on that DVD in 1849 02:02:42.239 --> 02:02:45.199 the deluxe edition because the producers of the DVD we're so happy with the thorough 1850 02:02:45.199 --> 02:02:49.279 coverage we gave of the history of Von ericson World Class Championship Wrestling, cutting 1851 02:02:49.279 --> 02:02:54.560 through the crap and talking about the Von Erics, but also other aspects of 1852 02:02:54.560 --> 02:02:59.000 that promotion in the rise and Fall. It is a thorough supplement to the 1853 02:02:59.000 --> 02:03:02.239 Ironclaw movie and it is available as soon as you sign up as a VIP 1854 02:03:02.359 --> 02:03:05.680 member. We just put it up on the VIP podcast feed on December twenty 1855 02:03:05.760 --> 02:03:09.359 ninth, just a few days ago. Also, when you go VIP you 1856 02:03:09.399 --> 02:03:13.760 can listen immediately to my review of the Ironclow movie that was a VIP exclusive 1857 02:03:13.840 --> 02:03:16.560 Wade Keller Hotline. I attended the movie, I reviewed the movie, and 1858 02:03:16.600 --> 02:03:21.199 I also included in my Keller hotline reviewing it excerpts from the very hard to 1859 02:03:21.239 --> 02:03:26.119 get Gary Hart book. Gary Hart was a booker of world class championhip wrestling 1860 02:03:26.199 --> 02:03:29.199 during the rise of the von Erics and the Freebirds feud. He was very 1861 02:03:29.199 --> 02:03:32.880 blunt in that book about what he thought of the von Erics and that era, 1862 02:03:33.159 --> 02:03:36.479 with some amazing insight. That book sales on eBay for one thousand dollars. 1863 02:03:36.760 --> 02:03:41.359 I've got a copy of it, and I took key excerpts that put 1864 02:03:41.399 --> 02:03:45.399 more perspective on what was in the movie. Dannyway first Wade Keller Hotline, 1865 02:03:45.439 --> 02:03:47.439 which was a return of the sc editor format. I answered questions about the 1866 02:03:47.479 --> 02:03:51.399 Von eric movie. What era of the von Erics careers would I've added to 1867 02:03:51.439 --> 02:03:55.720 the movie if they had fifteen or thirty extra minutes to work with? Also, 1868 02:03:56.039 --> 02:03:59.159 why did Kevin Dunn leave WWE? I have insight into the situation, 1869 02:03:59.279 --> 02:04:02.079 and I convaded in an answer to a VIP member question. And also will 1870 02:04:02.079 --> 02:04:05.199 Tony Con really go into more sports like direction in twenty twenty four? Those 1871 02:04:05.199 --> 02:04:09.520 are just some of the topics covered in a way Teller Hotline Ask the Editor 1872 02:04:09.640 --> 02:04:13.600 edition thirty minutes in length, posted on January first. I could go on 1873 02:04:13.640 --> 02:04:15.319 and on. So much comes to the VIP membership and add free VIP website, 1874 02:04:15.319 --> 02:04:18.680 mobile friendly, desktop friendly, so much more. Check out full details 1875 02:04:18.720 --> 02:04:25.199 at pwtorch dot com slash go VIP. Click on the sign up link coupon 1876 02:04:25.319 --> 02:04:29.920 code New Year twenty twenty four to get six dollars off three dollars ninety nine 1877 02:04:29.920 --> 02:04:31.239 cents to try this for a month. It's a great deal and hopefully you'll 1878 02:04:31.239 --> 02:04:35.560 stick around beyond that for nine dollars and ninety nine cents. All right, 1879 02:04:35.600 --> 02:04:38.720 now, let's get back to today's podcast.