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Hello, and welcome to Open Mind
UFO Radio. I am your host,

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Alejandro Rojas, and I am with
Martin in UFO. Willis Okay, Yes,

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I you called me that before,
and I have used that before,

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and uh, this time, I
use it because I couldn't come up with

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something else. And but this is
the other thing. It's right in front

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of my face as your Skype icon, your logo, and it's got your

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face kind of hovering above the planet
Earth. So you're like this gigantic I'm

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the mother ship. Yeah, you're
this huge mother ship that is your head

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kind of coming to I don't know
what you're doing here too, and you

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almost look like some sort of deity, yes, smiling upon the planet.

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Uh huh, So that's it.
Did you put together that? I kind

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of process. I have no idea, And when I did, I don't

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even remember. That was when I
think I joined skyped I think that was

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like four years ago, five years
ago maybe, so I don't even really

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remember. Okay, so you're not
like an extraterrestrial who has come to Earth

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too enlightened all of us or something, and that this is what you're trying

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to portray in this this picture.
Well, probably I mean, oh,

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yes, I am, but I
probably you know, just threw that picture

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together. Well it's interesting. We'll
have to talk about what planet you're from

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and kind of where your message is. Oh yeah, yeah, good,

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well welcome. Yes, it's good
to be here. So I haven't even

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told you this, Like I stayed
home. I came home early today because

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I just for some reason, I'm
feeling really not very good today. So

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oh yeah, So that's why I
need to apologize to the listeners, because

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that's why this show is not getting
up Monday, and it's actually going to

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get up Tuesday, which is tomorrow, because actually today is Monday, but

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it's late, but nobody knows that. Yes later in the day. Now

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they know it, and I'm gonna
I just don't have the energy or that,

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like my brain is not functioning well, so I will not be putting

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up the show. And actually I
was feeling I wasn't feeling that great the

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other day when I did the interview
with our interviewee our guests today, and

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I was a little worried about that
because it's some pretty heavy stuff for me,

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but I got so interested in what
he had to say that I felt

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just fine and I felt that the
interview went really well. In fact,

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it goes a little long, but
I interviewed Pauldine. I know you've had

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him on the show before, but
he's an Australian guy and I've gotten familiar

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with him. I know you and
I have talked about him, but he's

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always sending me stuff on Facebook about
I've got these files and I got those

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files and you know, government files
from doing FOYA And at first I thought

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maybe he was just kind of full
of hot air, because I get a

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lot of these people saying, oh, I've found files that no one's ever

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found before, and it's rare that
that is the case, because you know,

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I follow you know, this sort
of thing quite closely, especially like

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John Greenwall doing foyas all the time
and others. So and I belonged to

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some groups where they talk about this
stuff and he was in some of these

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groups. But you know, he
would send me so many files. It

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was so overwhelming, and I've been
wanting to tackle this to get to see

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what he's gotten. Over time,
I started looking at the files and he

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does have some really good stuff and
so it's been great. I think this

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is part one and fifty as far
as the interview today getting delving into what

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he's gotten, and I'll be posting
more about what he's finding, but he's

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kind of following that thread. I
mean, we hear Bluebook investigated UFOs,

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they didn't find anything. Then through
Foya people like you know when we talk

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about this, there's a Foyer researcher, Barry Greenwood, there is John Greenwald,

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others who have found other files that
show that there were other investigations.

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But the question is, you know, you and I have talked about this,

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and I talked about it with Richard
Hoffman quite a bit in our interview.

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Where do those files go? Who's
got those files? And that's what's

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so fascinating as Paul Dean has really
been asking that same question and he's been

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figuring that out. So I think
it's fascinating and really interesting stuff. So

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yeah, I hope everybody enjoys the
interview as much as I did coming up

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here after you and I talked about
the news. Yeah, sounds good.

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You know, it's I also wonder
like where you know, if something's going

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on in our airspace, it can't
be just ignored. You know that someone

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somewhere has to be looking into it, especially when it comes to like protected

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airspace or you know, or near
anything military. You know, it's just

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someone has to be investigating. Yeah, I agree. So yeah, so

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we'll talk about that, But before
we do, why don't you and I

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talk about some UFO news. And
we always let you start this portion off

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because we are gracious hosts to our
wonderful guest here. So what do you

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got there for us? Bill?
This is it's titled Witness says photo show

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UFO changing shape. Oh yeah,
yeah, I'm always intrigued by these.

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And this is a grass valley which
is out kind of in the middle of

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nowhere. I've been there towards Lake
Tahoe from San Francisco. It's kind of

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like in a very it's very hot
in the summer. Grass valley. And

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anyway, this happened back and on
May twenty second, not too long ago,

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and the witness stepped out in his
back porch and just by chance he

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looked up and noticed a dot in
the sky. I'm sorry he saw this

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dotting this guy. This sounds very
intriguing. What happened next, Well,

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he thought it was a planet,
but after observing it, he realized it

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was moving from left to right,
eas to south, and a slight upward

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angle, and he realized it was
not a planet and too slow to be

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a satellite. So he basically sent
his friend in to get a camera or

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a phone or whatever and started taking
pictures of these. This thing went up

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into a higher altitude sort of like
into a transparent cloud, and then it

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just faded from sight. But while
it was moving, it was well you

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can see it in the pictures on
the website. That first a first of

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all, is very find or in
one of the pictures, is very defined

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and oblong, and then it's kind
of like squashed looking. I mean,

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it really looks like something kind of
unexplainable, you know. I mean it

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doesn't about a balloon wouldn't do that. A number of things, just plane

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wouldn't do that. So and I
don't know if it had anything to do

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with photography, someone like Mark de'
antonio would know that. But it is

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really some intriguing there's five intriguing photos
right in this article. Yeah, the

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photos are weird, I would agree, and I think some of them,

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in fact, most of them are
camera problems. Like actually three out of

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the five pictures, I would say
looks like it's just out of focus.

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However, you have very clear images
on the first and the fifth photo,

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and they are distinct objects in this
sky. Colors are similar in each it

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could be a white or silver thing
that's reflective, and but the shape is

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distinctly different in both of the pictures, like very different. I mean,

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one is kind of like an oblong
shape and up and down, and then

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the other is kind of like it's
hard a canister with round little things on

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the bottom. Right, Really weird. That is pretty weird, unless it's

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some kind of balloon tumbling or something. I don't know. This is a

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weird one. I agree. I
like this one. Yeah, I don't

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think it doesn't look like something that
would be tumbling, because if you look

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at the it just wouldn't the shape
wise, it wouldn't really make sense because

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it's sort of round looking when it's
oblong. And then the second picture is

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squatty with like you said, little
like a canister with little like almost looks

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like legs sticking out. It is
really an odd duck, a little squatty,

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a squatty duck, yes, yeah, but interesting squatty duck. UFO.

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I like that. Yeah, that's
a good one. That is a

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good one. There's another video.
That one was posted by Roger Marsh.

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And there's a video that was posted
by Roger Marsh also, and this was

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from May twenty sixth at nine thirty
pm. Now, this video is a

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white dot. It's pretty bright,
but it's moving pretty steadily through the sky.

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It's a little cloudy, so it
looks like it's this side of the

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clouds. Did you see this one? Yes? I did, And however,

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I kind of feel like this one
is a Chinese lantern. He said

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it was a translucent square with a
sphere in the middle, which is a

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good description of a Chinese lantern.
Now, the field investigator for MUFAN said

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he didn't think that's what it was
because the wind was going in the different

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direction was one of the reasons,
and he thought the speed of the object

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was not like a balloon. However, I don't know. I don't agree

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with that assessment. Necessarily, winds
at different levels go different directions, and

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given the description and the movement at
least in the video, it really I

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think it's probably a Chinese lantern.
So I don't know. People can take

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a look at what do you think
am I wrong on this one. It's

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awful hard to say in my opinion, because the thing looks so tiny in

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the video. You can't really I
mean, if it was blown up and

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you know, didn't lose the you
know it's quality, you could actually see

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a lot more about it. But
it's so far off it's really hard to

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tell. And it's sounded like you're
kind of it was kind of like based

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on the witness testimony what he was
seeing, but you certainly can't really tell

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in the video. Yeah, unless
you're looking at it in some type of

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computer. I'm not, I mean, now, yeah, well, it's

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just that it flickers, I think, like and the description fits a Chinese

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lantern like perfectly. So those darn
things, those damn things, well,

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you know, as we just get
more and more, as we've talked about

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before, things with lights on them
up in the sky. In fact,

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I'm surrounded with these little led lights
right now here and there throughout our house

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because there was a party here for
we had for my girlfriend's teenage daughter because

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she was leaving for a trip,
and so she had our friends over and

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we lit up these balloons with led
lights in them, and you know,

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the helium's side. And now these
things have popped and these little tiny I

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mean, these LEDs are so small, and here we are a week and

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a half later, and most of
them still have power. So yeah,

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I'm looking at there's one over here. It's still lit up. So I

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mean, the technology with these LEDs
is amazing. I mean, this little

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one right here, I could tape
this to absolutely anything, or I could

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take a dozen to something and and
floated in the sky and it would look

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pretty pretty cool. So yeah,
so many different things lights in the sky

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these days, right, so many
things to call be called a UFO.

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So Roswell, Roswell the story that
knows never goes away, and some people

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get really upset about that. And
actually, uh, there's a new Roswell's

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story here, and it's really interesting. I think, Well, if you

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look at it on the surface,
it's just another story. And that's one

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of the hard parts when it comes
to the Roswell alleged UFO crashes. It's

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mostly anecdotal stories from these people.
How do you know if you can trust

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them or not because some of them
are so elaborate, and and that's all

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you that's mostly all you got.
So who do you believe in? Who

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do you not believe? And people
may be thinking these stories are diamond dozen,

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so why the heck would I post
yet another one of them, especially

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from an anonymous source. But here's
the deal is that this was posted by

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Mary Joyce of sky Ships over Cashiers. She's a very hard working person in

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this field who is always looking for
stories and posting some stuff. And this

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one's interesting in that she just she
never posts YouTube videos. This is her

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first YouTube video, but she felt
that this interview with a friend of hers

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over this alleged medal that this lady
played with as a child that she believed

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came from the Roswell crash, that
if you listen to it, that's what's

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interesting. So you can read my
story, and some people have and some

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people have even said, you know
what, this is just another story.

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But I implore people even you know, you don't even have to read the

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article. Just hit play right at
the top on the video on the top

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and you can hear this lady tell
her story and she just you can tell

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she's articulate and intelligent, and it's
just really interesting. She says, as

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a ten year old kid, she
had a boyfriend who who, and she

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was a military brad essentially. They
both lived at Wright Patterson Air Force which

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is also, you know, where
Blue Book was housed and where everybody believes

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that's where they would have sent the
material because that's where the Division for Foreign

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Technology is. So this her boyfriend's
dad was a colonel, and he worked

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in a very secretive area. According
to the kid, you know, he

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lived in or his office was underground. Even he had to take an elevator

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underground. But this kid got a
hold of this strange medal and it sounds

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like the metal hear about Roswell.
They could crunch it, They tried to

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cut it with scissors, and they
couldn't destroy it. They burned it.

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And these kids sounded you know.
She talks about how they were just very

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curious and an intelligence sounding kids,
and they kept trying to do all of

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this different stuff testing this metal.
Finally, it's kind of funny because actually

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she says, her dad, you
know, used to go around and he

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couldn't tell him where he was going
on his missions. She doesn't think he

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did anything UFO related, but one
time she read about Silly Putty and asked

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her dad when it first came out
to get her some so he did and

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she was playing with it, and
her boyfriend, who she calls John and

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the story, saw it and he
just went crazy. He thought it was

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the coolest thing ever. And he
said, I'll trade you the metal,

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the weird metal, for the silly
putty, and she's like, well,

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I don't know. But finally he
talked her into it. And but then

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this guy, the colonel, came
and was really up, I guess,

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upset, mad at his son and
the kids, and said give me this

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back and never tell anybody. And
she said she was afraid of the guy

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because she was the only a kid, but she also respected him. She

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respected you know, the military and
everything, and that she never spoke about

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what happened until now because she believes
he's passed away and she really did not

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want to say anything. In fact, Mary Joyce has been friends with her,

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00:17:26.079 --> 00:17:30.079
she says, for something like twenty
five years, and she told her

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about this something like over twenty years
ago, but she said, I don't

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want to be interviewed about it,
And finally now she's decided to be interviewed,

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but stay anonymous. So you have
to hear her tell the story now,

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in the story, she never says, I know that the colonel told

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me this is from Roswell, this
is from UFO. He never said that.

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So this medal could have just been
some high tech medal that they were

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00:17:56.920 --> 00:18:00.519
using in crafts that they were developing, or maybe a metal that they retrieved

215
00:18:00.599 --> 00:18:07.559
from a Russian crash or something like
that. So we don't necessarily know that

216
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it is UFO or that it is
from Roswell. But that's I think the

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00:18:11.079 --> 00:18:15.079
assumption that Mary Joyce and her friend
are making here. But Mary Joyce says

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00:18:15.240 --> 00:18:18.759
her friend's very well respected in the
community. I talked to her about this.

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She says, you know, she's
she's she just really believes her about

220
00:18:23.000 --> 00:18:29.079
this. So and if you hear
you can see why this woman she's she's

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definitely with it. I mean,
it's not like those deathbed confessions where the

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it's an older person who sounds delusional, and honestly, a lot of these

223
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interviews sound like that, but not
this one. She's definitely got her wits

224
00:18:42.519 --> 00:18:49.359
about her and it's it's it's a
fun listen, so definitely listen to it.

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Just don't read the story, because
if I were you and I were

226
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to just read the story, I
would be like whatever, but listening to

227
00:18:57.079 --> 00:19:02.960
it is what's really compelling. Yeah. I listened to some of it and

228
00:19:02.960 --> 00:19:07.480
and it was interesting. She talks
about putting it in an oven and letting

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00:19:07.519 --> 00:19:11.880
him sit there for a while and
then reaching it and was exactly the same

230
00:19:11.920 --> 00:19:14.799
temperature as it was when she put
it in. They also brought it to

231
00:19:15.039 --> 00:19:22.160
a ye a blacksmith, a horseshoe
faerrier and had him mess with it,

232
00:19:22.440 --> 00:19:26.039
and yeah, pretty cool. Whatever
the metal was. If it wasn't it

233
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was, I guess it was ten
years after. So who knows. It's

234
00:19:32.400 --> 00:19:36.400
very It's possible. It is an
interesting story. Yeah, I guess it

235
00:19:36.440 --> 00:19:41.240
is possible. I mean, Jesse
Marcel Junior story is not too dissimilar where

236
00:19:41.599 --> 00:19:45.599
you know his dad brought it home, you know, so maybe this guy

237
00:19:45.720 --> 00:19:49.759
did bring it home and the kid
snuck them away or something, who knows,

238
00:19:49.799 --> 00:19:52.000
I don't know, or maybe the
kid went to the office, and

239
00:19:52.480 --> 00:19:56.640
because I guess. She talks about
how on Saturdays they were able to go

240
00:19:56.720 --> 00:20:00.920
to the base and run around.
They couldn't go every whe they could go

241
00:20:00.960 --> 00:20:03.160
to the store and the pool and
stuff like that. They weren't supposed to

242
00:20:03.720 --> 00:20:10.119
just have go anywhere. But so
I don't know, but it's it's very

243
00:20:10.160 --> 00:20:15.160
I think it's interesting and it's it's
worth a listen. So I wonder if

244
00:20:15.160 --> 00:20:18.359
she ever got her silly putty back
after her You know what. It's funny

245
00:20:18.359 --> 00:20:22.599
you should say that, because as
we were talking just now, I was

246
00:20:22.680 --> 00:20:26.759
thinking the same thing. She better
have got her silly putty back. Yeah,

247
00:20:26.119 --> 00:20:32.000
but uh or maybe yeah, or
maybe her dad got her some more.

248
00:20:32.279 --> 00:20:34.720
But yeah, if that kid wanted
to keep his girlfriend, he probably

249
00:20:34.839 --> 00:20:41.440
gave it back. Yeah, yep. Yeah. All right, Well that's

250
00:20:41.519 --> 00:20:45.160
all the news I have. Do
you have anything more? No, I

251
00:20:45.200 --> 00:20:48.640
am all done on this side.
Great. Well, I'm really excited to

252
00:20:49.680 --> 00:20:53.200
I and I hope every the listeners
are excited to hear what Paul Deine has

253
00:20:53.279 --> 00:20:57.720
to say. I think this gives
me hope because sometimes you when you're working

254
00:20:57.880 --> 00:21:04.519
with the military and getting information,
you hit brick walls, and it almost

255
00:21:04.519 --> 00:21:08.759
to me feels like Paul's broken down
some of these brick walls. So yeah,

256
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I think people will find this really
interesting. Great, have a great

257
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show. Thanks, let's talk to
Paul. I am very happy to welcome

258
00:21:18.359 --> 00:21:21.920
to the show. Paul Dean.
Hello, Paul, Hi, how's it

259
00:21:22.000 --> 00:21:26.160
going good? How are you?
Yeah, I'm good, I'm yeah,

260
00:21:26.240 --> 00:21:30.039
yeah, going very well. It's
Saturday morning here, so we're a bit

261
00:21:30.039 --> 00:21:33.240
ahead of you. Yeah. Where
is here for you? Okay? Melbourne,

262
00:21:33.240 --> 00:21:37.200
Australia, So down in the south
east of the country, below Sydney,

263
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so literally on the other side of
the world to you. Yeah.

264
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Literally, So that's cool. So
seven a m. On Saturday, and

265
00:21:45.319 --> 00:21:49.559
just for the listeners to know,
it's like four pm on Friday here,

266
00:21:49.640 --> 00:21:56.519
so we're pre recording this interview.
So that's fun. Yeah, No,

267
00:21:56.599 --> 00:21:59.839
it's going to be very very good. Yeah, Larry, Sorry to get

268
00:21:59.880 --> 00:22:02.960
you up so early on a Saturday, that doesn't matter. No, that's

269
00:22:03.000 --> 00:22:07.160
fine, Okay, great. So
you are a busy fella. You are

270
00:22:07.640 --> 00:22:15.160
essentially doing Foroyer requests like crazy here
in the US for UFO files, and

271
00:22:15.279 --> 00:22:18.880
it looks like you've gotten a lot
of stuff no one else has gotten before.

272
00:22:19.160 --> 00:22:23.119
What started you on this path?
What to say? Made you decide,

273
00:22:23.359 --> 00:22:27.039
Hey, I'm gonna figure this out
and do this, Okay, So

274
00:22:27.119 --> 00:22:32.920
that's actually a pretty good question.
I've been studying the UFO phenomena since I

275
00:22:33.079 --> 00:22:41.559
was thirteen. I'm now thirty seven
and and I guess, I guess I

276
00:22:41.640 --> 00:22:45.680
got I got hot. In virtually
all books, virtually everything you read is

277
00:22:47.160 --> 00:22:55.319
is semi unsubstantiated or unsubstantiated, or
it's it's it's very very difficult to clarify.

278
00:22:55.759 --> 00:22:59.599
You can't see, you often can't
see you know, very specific in

279
00:22:59.640 --> 00:23:07.200
detail hailed scholarly background evidence to cases, or you know US Air Force policy

280
00:23:07.279 --> 00:23:12.680
decisions or you know United Kingdom processes
for processing I don't know, radar data

281
00:23:12.920 --> 00:23:17.799
whatever. And as the years went
on, I just read more and more

282
00:23:17.960 --> 00:23:22.960
more books, and I found that
the only thing that really satisfied me that

283
00:23:22.000 --> 00:23:27.440
there was something, something probably really
was flying around was actually government documents,

284
00:23:27.480 --> 00:23:33.319
particularly from the United States, not
solely by any means, but especially from

285
00:23:33.359 --> 00:23:37.599
the United States. To me personally, if I if I could see a

286
00:23:37.640 --> 00:23:41.039
document that was signed off by say
a colonel or a rear admiral or whatever,

287
00:23:41.480 --> 00:23:47.599
that discussed something that that shouldn't be
happening at say the buzzing of a

288
00:23:47.640 --> 00:23:52.160
warship by an unknown craft, or
you know, a series of very unusual

289
00:23:52.240 --> 00:23:56.359
lights in the sky that's seen to
focus in on a base, you know,

290
00:23:56.359 --> 00:24:00.599
a military based whatever that that seems
to me held a lot more weight

291
00:24:02.039 --> 00:24:08.079
than just an endless stream of hyperactive
stories. So anyway, I found out

292
00:24:10.119 --> 00:24:14.599
the actual first serious book I read
about the topic was nine to eighty seven

293
00:24:14.599 --> 00:24:18.039
book called Above Top Secret by Timothy
good. Now. It does have problems,

294
00:24:18.079 --> 00:24:22.759
all books do, but at the
time the it's a it's a six

295
00:24:22.880 --> 00:24:29.440
hundred page book, and at the
time it's just the level of detail that

296
00:24:29.519 --> 00:24:32.400
he and it's not even it's not
even considered that powerful now, but the

297
00:24:32.480 --> 00:24:38.880
level of detail he would go into
as far as misinformation disinformation, you know,

298
00:24:40.000 --> 00:24:44.359
one to eighty degree turns within classified
documents from what was being told to

299
00:24:44.400 --> 00:24:48.559
the public, you know, whistleblowers, et cetera. That got me hooked.

300
00:24:49.079 --> 00:24:53.240
And and then I found out over
the years, I found out that,

301
00:24:55.279 --> 00:24:59.480
in fact, as extraordinary as it
may seem, that you in the

302
00:24:59.559 --> 00:25:03.160
United S States, Australia, England, to a lesser extent, Germany,

303
00:25:03.519 --> 00:25:07.559
that if you do things the right
way, you can actually ask government agencies

304
00:25:07.640 --> 00:25:12.119
for records about anything. And that's
what got me hooked. So about three

305
00:25:12.240 --> 00:25:18.920
years ago in Australia, I started
studying. You don't to me it was

306
00:25:18.000 --> 00:25:23.240
useless simply FOI you know, freedom
of information requesting the Australian Defense Department for

307
00:25:23.240 --> 00:25:26.799
anything on UFOs. I mean,
it's so broad. It can mean unidentified

308
00:25:26.880 --> 00:25:33.640
radar contacts on primary radar systems,
it can mean correspondence with ministers, it

309
00:25:33.680 --> 00:25:37.240
can mean anything. So I started
to learn how things were done here.

310
00:25:37.759 --> 00:25:42.480
So how you know civil aviation bodies
what you would call in America the FAA

311
00:25:42.559 --> 00:25:48.400
Federal Aviation Administration, but here in
Australia Bureau of Air Safety. I started

312
00:25:48.440 --> 00:25:52.559
learning how they did things. I
started learning how they took reports from pilots

313
00:25:52.599 --> 00:25:59.359
about safety issues. I started to
investigate how they physically stored data, and

314
00:25:59.440 --> 00:26:04.680
I started sending very very specific FOI
requests to Australian agencies, and all of

315
00:26:04.720 --> 00:26:08.839
a sudden, all this stuff started
coming out. So I've started the exact

316
00:26:08.920 --> 00:26:14.720
same thing with the United States,
and I've had great success in both countries.

317
00:26:15.000 --> 00:26:19.119
You know, the last time things
were foid on this scale was in

318
00:26:19.160 --> 00:26:25.119
the late seventies when Robert Todd,
Berry Greenwood, Lawrence Fawcett, and Todd

319
00:26:25.160 --> 00:26:30.079
Zekil started pummeling the what you call
the Three Letter agencies N SAD, I,

320
00:26:30.240 --> 00:26:33.160
A, c IA, FBI with
FOI requests and what came out then

321
00:26:33.279 --> 00:26:37.640
was extraordinary. So I'm attempting with
the help. I've got a guy in

322
00:26:37.839 --> 00:26:42.640
England who we work together, but
I'm attempting to do exactly the same thing

323
00:26:42.640 --> 00:26:48.720
in the United States, and so
far we've managed to do it. So

324
00:26:48.519 --> 00:26:52.160
with Timothy Goods book, because it's
a great book. I mean, it's

325
00:26:52.160 --> 00:26:59.319
a classic book. There's a lot
of really important information that he has shared

326
00:26:59.440 --> 00:27:00.960
in that book, but like you
said, you know, a lot of

327
00:27:02.000 --> 00:27:07.880
it is anecdotal or alleged documents.
They don't link back to actual official documents,

328
00:27:07.960 --> 00:27:11.640
although some do. He try.
He's at least better than many at

329
00:27:11.680 --> 00:27:19.279
giving his sources. Was there a
particular document that in that book that you

330
00:27:19.400 --> 00:27:25.160
said, whoa, you know this
is real that you start and retrieved and

331
00:27:25.240 --> 00:27:27.839
that really kind of opened your eyes. Yeah, there was that. Look,

332
00:27:27.880 --> 00:27:32.079
there's a few. There's one that's
probably a bit of a surprising thing

333
00:27:32.119 --> 00:27:40.279
that wasn't about a case. That
was a policy in the United States during

334
00:27:40.319 --> 00:27:45.720
the forties and fifties and sixties UFOs
when reported, particularly from within the military,

335
00:27:45.759 --> 00:27:48.519
within the Army, Air Force,
Navy, Marine Corps, they were

336
00:27:48.559 --> 00:27:55.200
supposed to be reported using a channel
called Air Force Regulation two hundred DASH two

337
00:27:55.440 --> 00:28:03.039
unidentified flying objects. But there was
actually another slightly more classified reporting channel called

338
00:28:03.319 --> 00:28:11.839
service reporting, its communication instructions for
vital intelligence sightings. And what happened was

339
00:28:11.880 --> 00:28:15.920
in Timothy Gooods's book he highlights,
I remember the exact words he says.

340
00:28:17.240 --> 00:28:22.319
He says, from nineteen fifty four
onwards, a series of quote communications for

341
00:28:22.440 --> 00:28:29.640
Vital Intelligence SI sightings were laid out
and proligated in Joint Air Force, Army

342
00:28:29.720 --> 00:28:33.680
Navy Protocol one four six, and
the results since nineteen sixty nine, the

343
00:28:33.720 --> 00:28:40.440
results, like any records of actual
pilot sightings laid down submitted via the service

344
00:28:40.480 --> 00:28:45.240
system, had been classified. So
what he's basically saying is is that after

345
00:28:45.359 --> 00:28:48.519
nine like continuing after nineteen sixty nine, with the closure of Project Blue Book,

346
00:28:49.079 --> 00:28:55.039
the America right actually, up until
twenty eleven, Americans, the American

347
00:28:55.079 --> 00:29:00.119
military, through the Joint Chiefs of
Staff, promligated an entire classified system called

348
00:29:00.160 --> 00:29:07.000
service reporting, as I said,
for specifically reporting missiles, planes, and

349
00:29:07.160 --> 00:29:11.920
unidentified flying objects for pilots. And
it got me because because not in the

350
00:29:12.000 --> 00:29:18.039
United States, not one single service
report by a pilot, or or any

351
00:29:18.079 --> 00:29:25.759
investigations or analysis of that report of
a UFO has ever been released like like

352
00:29:26.000 --> 00:29:29.759
you know, service report, the
service reporting channel has been around for so

353
00:29:29.960 --> 00:29:36.079
long, but not like like nobody
in the United States, norrid or First

354
00:29:36.119 --> 00:29:38.880
Air Force or eleventh Air Force.
They're the places where service reports finally go.

355
00:29:40.640 --> 00:29:44.519
No one has ever released any service
reports from the United States military.

356
00:29:44.799 --> 00:29:48.559
And I'm thinking to myself, there
must be hundreds of them, and I

357
00:29:48.559 --> 00:29:52.960
mean just alone in Canada. Canada's
released their service reports up till nineteen ninety

358
00:29:52.960 --> 00:29:57.279
six, and just for the nineties
alone, there's like thirty. And Canada's

359
00:29:57.319 --> 00:30:00.799
got a very small air force compared
to the United States, and you know,

360
00:30:00.920 --> 00:30:03.720
much less planes, a lot less
flying, time, less pilots.

361
00:30:04.000 --> 00:30:07.519
So I did the math, even
back in the eighties, I did the

362
00:30:07.519 --> 00:30:11.039
math, and I thought there must
be hundreds and hundreds of service reports by

363
00:30:11.119 --> 00:30:14.880
pilots that have never seen the light
of day. And this is at a

364
00:30:14.920 --> 00:30:18.839
time as well, when the US
Air Force had said, well, Edward

365
00:30:18.119 --> 00:30:23.279
Condon, the head of the Colorado
Project and the Secretary of the Air Force,

366
00:30:23.680 --> 00:30:27.480
had said that UFOs are of no
interest anymore. There is no place

367
00:30:27.519 --> 00:30:32.799
in the United States except airports in
the police to report UFOs. And yet

368
00:30:32.839 --> 00:30:37.480
here in dead Black and White in
the Jane app documents. Was the service

369
00:30:37.720 --> 00:30:41.960
instructions for pilots the actual system works. If for pilots flying along and if

370
00:30:41.960 --> 00:30:45.079
he gets dragged off by something I
don't know the shape of a gridiron ball

371
00:30:45.119 --> 00:30:48.920
at two thousand miles an hour,
he is supposed to say down the radio

372
00:30:49.039 --> 00:30:56.640
system service service service. Then that
goes to an encrypted, sc scrambled channel.

373
00:30:56.599 --> 00:31:00.839
He is able to directly talk to
the near command and control or air

374
00:31:00.880 --> 00:31:06.519
defense base. He says what he
sees, like, what latitude longitude is

375
00:31:06.519 --> 00:31:08.000
at, what altitude is at,
what the object looked like, how many

376
00:31:08.000 --> 00:31:11.119
of there were, what color it
was, you know, did it nearly

377
00:31:11.200 --> 00:31:17.200
hit his aircraft? And so on. That report is vocally transmitted to Norrad

378
00:31:17.960 --> 00:31:21.839
or used to be ent Air Force
Base now it's Peterson Air Force Base,

379
00:31:22.519 --> 00:31:26.880
and there it would stay and they
would do some analysis on it, you

380
00:31:26.880 --> 00:31:30.680
know, particularly if it was a
flight safety issue or it happened right neither

381
00:31:30.759 --> 00:31:33.240
Russian border or something. Now.
Now, like I said, I mean,

382
00:31:34.160 --> 00:31:37.799
that's how a service procedure works.
And the public are not told about

383
00:31:37.799 --> 00:31:41.839
this. I mean, I know. In nineteen ninety six, a congressman

384
00:31:41.960 --> 00:31:47.039
called Patty Murray actually r C United
States Air Force. Look, what's the

385
00:31:47.119 --> 00:31:49.759
latest on UFOs. What's all this
closure of Project Blue Book stuff? And

386
00:31:49.799 --> 00:31:53.720
they came back to her and they
said, no, there is no new

387
00:31:53.839 --> 00:31:59.400
reporting channels in the last forty years
for UFOs. It's all closed up.

388
00:31:59.440 --> 00:32:01.640
And yet here we have, in
black, black and white, we have

389
00:32:01.799 --> 00:32:07.519
service procedures laid out for the American
military, particularly pilots. That's the sort

390
00:32:07.559 --> 00:32:09.519
of thing that got me. That's
where I started thinking that, you know,

391
00:32:09.599 --> 00:32:14.279
there must be so much more information
out there. We've already been released

392
00:32:14.279 --> 00:32:16.200
a heck of a lot, but
there must be so much more out there.

393
00:32:16.200 --> 00:32:19.599
And the more I looked into it
to realize, I study. I

394
00:32:19.640 --> 00:32:23.960
studied policy documents and procedural documents.
I found out that service procedures are not

395
00:32:24.079 --> 00:32:29.920
the only way that the US military
can report UFOs to themselves. There are

396
00:32:30.160 --> 00:32:34.440
you know, three or four other
systems, and I've got actual examples of

397
00:32:34.480 --> 00:32:38.240
where UFOs have been reported on those
other systems. And so it looks like

398
00:32:38.279 --> 00:32:42.240
we've got a gold mine in front
of us, held at the National Military

399
00:32:42.240 --> 00:32:49.960
Command Center Noorad Tinder Air Force Base
Almendorf. So yeah, so yeah,

400
00:32:50.000 --> 00:32:54.200
you asked me what a powerful document
was the service procedures were one of them.

401
00:32:54.200 --> 00:32:58.920
Well, that's really interesting and to
clarify, so, of course we

402
00:32:59.000 --> 00:33:07.400
have tons of blue Book report but
what you're saying is the service reporting method

403
00:33:07.799 --> 00:33:15.039
is separate from blue Book We not
only is it, yeah, not only

404
00:33:15.119 --> 00:33:20.519
is it separate, but Brigadier General
Carol H. Blender in nineteen sixty nine

405
00:33:20.720 --> 00:33:25.000
actually wrote, he wrote in a
memo called the Blender Air Staff Study or

406
00:33:25.079 --> 00:33:30.680
Blender MIMO. He actually had the
nerve to write, you know, UFOs

407
00:33:30.799 --> 00:33:36.880
that affect national security have never been
part of the blue Book system, and

408
00:33:37.359 --> 00:33:43.000
current systems replace the blue Book system
into the future. And then on another

409
00:33:43.079 --> 00:33:46.799
line he says those systems are service
reporting. And then there's another one,

410
00:33:46.839 --> 00:33:52.119
he writes called Air Force Manual fifty
five eleven. An Air Force Manual fifty

411
00:33:52.119 --> 00:33:59.519
five eleven is another one, and
that's even more serious. That is it's

412
00:33:59.640 --> 00:34:06.480
called it's called Serious Incident or Air
Force Serious Incident Reporting, and that two

413
00:34:06.480 --> 00:34:08.199
can be used for UFO reporting.
That's right back from the sixties. So

414
00:34:08.559 --> 00:34:13.920
yeah, So what I'm saying is
is that is that the US government has

415
00:34:14.000 --> 00:34:16.519
had systems in place. There's actually
a third one, and there's probably a

416
00:34:16.519 --> 00:34:22.239
fourth as well. The US government
has had systems in place to accept UFO

417
00:34:22.320 --> 00:34:27.960
reports off its military officers. Yeah, so you probably heard this story.

418
00:34:28.000 --> 00:34:31.280
I know that John Greenwald went to
look for those service documents and he,

419
00:34:31.599 --> 00:34:35.519
like you said, I was not
able to get them from the US,

420
00:34:35.639 --> 00:34:40.480
but he did get them from Canada. And did you had the same experience,

421
00:34:42.320 --> 00:34:46.199
Yeah, kind of, so it's
really interesting he actually yeah, okay,

422
00:34:46.440 --> 00:34:52.679
so John Greenwell did look for so
anyone, anyone that's one of the

423
00:34:52.880 --> 00:34:55.519
if you want a foy the US
government now for anything about UFOs, that

424
00:34:55.559 --> 00:34:59.039
would be one of the first places
to go. And that's exactly what John

425
00:34:59.079 --> 00:35:02.360
Greenwell did a few years ago.
He I think he foid specifically for any

426
00:35:02.800 --> 00:35:07.719
service reports submitted to you know,
the United States Air Force magic coms or

427
00:35:07.760 --> 00:35:14.559
headquarters or NOURRAD that involved unidentified flying
objects unusual, you know, drones,

428
00:35:14.639 --> 00:35:19.039
whatever. So he he got told. I think he got told. I

429
00:35:19.039 --> 00:35:22.559
mean we've all been told, others
have been told that this that service reports

430
00:35:22.639 --> 00:35:30.599
are of a quote transient unquote nature
and are not kept for longer than sometimes

431
00:35:30.639 --> 00:35:35.559
they say six weeks, sometimes they
say two years, sometimes they say five

432
00:35:35.639 --> 00:35:39.079
years. So John Greenwell got completely
knocked back. He was told that there

433
00:35:39.159 --> 00:35:44.199
was no service report. I think
he was told that there was no service

434
00:35:44.239 --> 00:35:50.239
reports currently in the in the you
know reporting you know database that had been

435
00:35:50.320 --> 00:35:54.159
kept. Now I find that very
hard to believe, because one Canada had

436
00:35:54.360 --> 00:35:59.719
kept all of these for you know, two decades too. I just I

437
00:36:00.440 --> 00:36:04.920
know a lot about how the US
military works, and it is absolutely inconceivable

438
00:36:05.199 --> 00:36:10.159
that one hundred million dollar fifteen that
nearly gets slammed by a UFO mid air

439
00:36:10.199 --> 00:36:15.519
and the pilot reports it via the
service system. I find it inconceivable that

440
00:36:15.679 --> 00:36:19.760
only after six weeks or you know, three months or whatever, that that

441
00:36:19.960 --> 00:36:25.599
service report would be drawn up or
deleted from the deleted from the service database.

442
00:36:25.800 --> 00:36:30.559
Just I know how this works,
and it is just inconceivable. Maybe

443
00:36:30.599 --> 00:36:34.320
after five years if nothing came of
it, like no safety instant, no

444
00:36:35.400 --> 00:36:37.920
you know, no war fighting mission
related issue, whatever, maybe then,

445
00:36:37.960 --> 00:36:43.320
but not after six weeks. So
I've had the same experience. Me and

446
00:36:43.440 --> 00:36:47.599
my friend in England have also.
We have we have FO wid pleters and

447
00:36:49.599 --> 00:36:53.400
Northcombe noorad we Foor the headquarters the
United States Air Force and Secretary of the

448
00:36:53.400 --> 00:36:58.360
Air Force and Assistant Secretary of the
Air Force for all service reports you know,

449
00:36:58.400 --> 00:37:01.559
in the last ten years, and
we got knocked back saying that we

450
00:37:01.599 --> 00:37:08.800
cannot find any responsive records. So
what we did something else is that service

451
00:37:08.840 --> 00:37:15.480
reporting actually was canceled in twenty eleven. It was actually removed from Air Force

452
00:37:15.519 --> 00:37:21.400
Instruction ten DASH two O six.
So what we did we decided, well,

453
00:37:21.480 --> 00:37:24.039
if we can't get any actual service
reports, what we'll do is we

454
00:37:24.079 --> 00:37:30.880
will get documents out of them asking
for the rationale or the reasons behind why

455
00:37:30.920 --> 00:37:37.679
they moved this. Removed the service
reporting system from the instructions, and we

456
00:37:37.760 --> 00:37:43.119
actually got a few documents out.
We couldn't find any reasons why they're like

457
00:37:43.679 --> 00:37:47.280
killed off service reporting. We did
find some internal emails that they released to

458
00:37:47.400 --> 00:37:51.159
us, and some of them just
simply said, look, it was an

459
00:37:51.199 --> 00:37:55.320
Air Force policy in Plans Directorate in
the Pentagon and it simply said, look,

460
00:37:55.559 --> 00:38:02.480
NORAAD does not require service reporting procedures
any longer. Another one was a

461
00:38:02.679 --> 00:38:08.840
matrix, which is a list of
changes to any existing document and it also

462
00:38:09.000 --> 00:38:15.280
said no service reporting is paragraph six
to two whatever is canceled because NORD no

463
00:38:15.320 --> 00:38:22.960
longer requires service reports to be submitted
to their command. And we look,

464
00:38:22.000 --> 00:38:25.239
we don't know why it was removed. We don't know why service, we

465
00:38:25.280 --> 00:38:29.559
don't know what they've been replaced by. I think, I think I know,

466
00:38:30.000 --> 00:38:32.880
but we don't know for sure.
And we're still we're still appealing that,

467
00:38:32.960 --> 00:38:37.079
Like we're still saying to them,
Look, you can't make major policy

468
00:38:37.119 --> 00:38:39.599
decisions like this and then not be
a paper trail that's minutes of meetings,

469
00:38:39.639 --> 00:38:46.440
commanders, briefs, discussion papers,
opinion statements, internal emails, concurring statements

470
00:38:46.480 --> 00:38:51.639
and so so yeah, so John
Greenwell's given it a crack. We've given

471
00:38:51.679 --> 00:38:54.400
it a crack. I Like I
said, I find it unbelievable that one

472
00:38:55.559 --> 00:39:01.280
the service that no US pilots have
ever reported UFOs vias. So that's what

473
00:39:01.320 --> 00:39:07.119
they tell They've effectively told us by
knocking back our requests, they've effectively told

474
00:39:07.159 --> 00:39:09.559
us, no, we have nothing. And then I find it inconceivable that

475
00:39:10.159 --> 00:39:13.679
even if they did have anything,
that they only be kept for a few

476
00:39:13.679 --> 00:39:16.639
weeks or months. So yeah,
that's the story. So you have not

477
00:39:16.679 --> 00:39:22.400
been able to get any service documents
either, No, not actual service reports.

478
00:39:22.440 --> 00:39:24.880
I've got I've got internal policy material, like I said, but I've

479
00:39:24.880 --> 00:39:29.360
got no actual service reports. Now, I might there might be another way

480
00:39:29.400 --> 00:39:32.960
of doing it. Like I said, when a service report gets summitted by

481
00:39:32.960 --> 00:39:37.800
a pilot down the radio system,
first it goes through the nearest air traffic

482
00:39:37.920 --> 00:39:39.000
like an air defense space. We
might be able to go straight to the

483
00:39:39.000 --> 00:39:44.840
air defense spaces like Tindle, Elmendorf, you know, Peterson, McCord and

484
00:39:44.880 --> 00:39:46.159
so on. But that's very slow. It means you've got a foy,

485
00:39:46.360 --> 00:39:50.559
you know, two dozen bases across
the whole United States, and they're probably

486
00:39:50.599 --> 00:39:52.880
all going to come back with different
answers. So that's one way of doing

487
00:39:52.880 --> 00:39:57.800
it. You know, it's it's
very slow, and yeah, so there

488
00:39:57.840 --> 00:40:01.880
you go. So but there were
other channels. So tell me about the

489
00:40:02.679 --> 00:40:07.800
manual. What was that manual fifty
four? Yeah, a manual fifty five

490
00:40:07.880 --> 00:40:15.760
eleven. Manual fifty five eleven is
was first promulgated or first you know,

491
00:40:15.880 --> 00:40:23.159
created in about nineteen sixty nine,
sixty six, I think. And what

492
00:40:23.199 --> 00:40:30.320
it actually states is that is the
major events, like any what they call

493
00:40:30.480 --> 00:40:37.320
what they call Air force reportable events
can be submitted by let me just say,

494
00:40:37.320 --> 00:40:40.800
I'm just getting it up in front
of me. Yeah, so the

495
00:40:43.599 --> 00:40:46.519
system is actually the actual system itself, like the actual screens on the computer

496
00:40:46.599 --> 00:40:54.480
screens is called an Air Force operational
reporting system and it's the information about that

497
00:40:54.599 --> 00:40:59.960
how to use it is laid out
or it was laid out an old manual

498
00:41:00.159 --> 00:41:06.519
called Manual fifty five eleven Operations Air
Force Reporting System. And that we also

499
00:41:06.679 --> 00:41:12.280
think because the General a Brigady General
Blenda sett in nineteen sixty nine, that's

500
00:41:12.360 --> 00:41:16.039
service reporting and this manual fifty five
eleven was just going to be just fine

501
00:41:16.079 --> 00:41:21.800
for reporting the UFOs in the future. Now Air Force Manual fifty five eleven

502
00:41:22.920 --> 00:41:30.119
was promulgated this two decades after nineteen
sixty so we think that, you know,

503
00:41:30.239 --> 00:41:31.360
if we go to their back to
the Air Force and say, well,

504
00:41:31.360 --> 00:41:34.800
you're not going to give us service
reports, maybe you'll give us any

505
00:41:34.880 --> 00:41:42.639
UFO reports submitted under fifty five eleven
Operational Air Force Reporting. So that's that's

506
00:41:42.800 --> 00:41:45.000
quite powerful as well. I don't
know what the differences are. I don't

507
00:41:45.039 --> 00:41:49.039
know if they have to give more
detail in the report or if it's more

508
00:41:49.119 --> 00:41:52.320
highly classified, like you know,
a secret instead of confidential or whatever.

509
00:41:52.400 --> 00:41:58.960
But yeah, so that's one,
but there are more a really really big

510
00:41:59.000 --> 00:42:01.840
one that I've just actually done a
blog about last night and this is something

511
00:42:01.920 --> 00:42:08.119
that really really will cause waves.
There is a third system specifically for bases.

512
00:42:08.599 --> 00:42:14.880
Pilots can't use this. It is
called the OPREP three system, which

513
00:42:14.920 --> 00:42:22.519
is Operational Report Category three, which
means serious incident slash serious event reporting.

514
00:42:22.159 --> 00:42:28.960
And what I can't believe is so
an operational report three is any event or

515
00:42:29.039 --> 00:42:32.519
incident near a base, above a
base, or on a base, whether

516
00:42:32.719 --> 00:42:40.400
commanding officer or someone ranked very highly, can report really serious unusual events directly,

517
00:42:40.599 --> 00:42:45.639
in real time immediately to the National
Military Command Center, the Alternate National

518
00:42:45.639 --> 00:42:52.119
Military Command Center nor AD, the
Joint Chiefs of Staff, and the Office

519
00:42:52.119 --> 00:42:55.360
of Secretary of Defense, all at
the same time. He can report anything

520
00:42:55.360 --> 00:43:00.559
he wants, riots, shootings,
anything miscellaneous. And what's so stunning is

521
00:43:00.559 --> 00:43:07.760
is in the seventies there was a
bunch of UFO reports from bases US military

522
00:43:07.800 --> 00:43:15.840
bases where the commanding command post officers
had actually reported the UFO events via the

523
00:43:15.880 --> 00:43:21.679
OPREP three system directly to the Pentagon, not through another Air Force base,

524
00:43:22.199 --> 00:43:28.239
not confidential or unclassified. I'm talking
secret, directly to the Joint Staff and

525
00:43:28.280 --> 00:43:32.400
the National Military Command Center. We've
actually got examples from Luring Air Force Base

526
00:43:32.599 --> 00:43:38.360
and October nineteen seventy five, Worthsmith
Air Force Base November nineteen seventy five,

527
00:43:38.960 --> 00:43:46.599
and pine Castle Pinecastle Electronic Test Range
in Florida from nineteen seventy eight. And

528
00:43:46.760 --> 00:43:52.119
every single one of these documents they
say things like, you know, this

529
00:43:52.159 --> 00:43:54.679
is Pine Castle or this is lawing
urgent, urgent, we have an unknown

530
00:43:54.760 --> 00:44:00.840
helicopter slash object above the nuclear weapons
facil We don't know what to do.

531
00:44:01.639 --> 00:44:06.719
We need your answer within five minutes. And these OPREP threes have actually been

532
00:44:06.760 --> 00:44:09.119
sent and they've been released to us. They were released in the eighties and

533
00:44:09.199 --> 00:44:15.840
not enough people took notice. Now
these OPREP threes are kept for a very

534
00:44:15.880 --> 00:44:19.079
long time and they are submitted to
the National Military Command Center, and they

535
00:44:19.079 --> 00:44:24.960
are considered very serious. So yeah, I've highlighted five different documents, and

536
00:44:24.960 --> 00:44:31.760
there's more. I've highlighted five different
documents where where major sensitive US military installations

537
00:44:31.800 --> 00:44:37.119
have reported what only can be described
at minimum as really weird helicopters and at

538
00:44:37.159 --> 00:44:43.159
most they actually use the term UFO, They actually say oblong UFO or circular

539
00:44:43.280 --> 00:44:49.719
UFO and sent It's sent with op
PREP three precedents straight to the highest levels

540
00:44:49.719 --> 00:44:53.599
of command and The great thing is
the Oprep three system is still in existence

541
00:44:53.639 --> 00:44:59.639
today. So we think that we
think that any bases and we've all heard

542
00:44:59.679 --> 00:45:05.039
the story stories about nuclear missiles or
nuclear guidance systems or bombers being knocked out

543
00:45:05.119 --> 00:45:08.679
or tampered with by UFOs, we
now know in black and white that base

544
00:45:08.760 --> 00:45:15.480
officers have been submitting of Prep threes
about such incidents straight to the Pentagon in

545
00:45:15.480 --> 00:45:20.719
the White House. And you know, like that to me is extremely powerful.

546
00:45:21.679 --> 00:45:24.039
Just as an anecdote, there was
a researcher. I'm not the first

547
00:45:24.079 --> 00:45:29.440
person to find this. There was
a researcher in the nineties, a UK

548
00:45:29.639 --> 00:45:34.039
researcher called Amen Victorian, and he
was hot on the trail of these oprep

549
00:45:34.079 --> 00:45:37.800
threes and he harassed the Office of
the Secretary of Defense no end for op

550
00:45:37.840 --> 00:45:43.239
Prep three reports involving UFOs, and
he was actually told in a letter.

551
00:45:43.719 --> 00:45:46.199
I haven't got the letter, it's
in England, but he was actually told

552
00:45:46.199 --> 00:45:55.960
and I quote op Prep threes containing
information regarding unidentified objects over US military installations

553
00:45:57.559 --> 00:46:04.280
are considered extremely sensitive and are thus
not releasable. Wow, yeah, no

554
00:46:04.400 --> 00:46:07.400
joke. That is an extraordinary statement. So first we have this going on.

555
00:46:07.440 --> 00:46:10.880
In the seventies, Oprep three is
being sent about UFOs to the Pentagon

556
00:46:10.920 --> 00:46:15.199
and the National Military Command Center.
Then in nineteen ninety we have in Victorian

557
00:46:15.239 --> 00:46:22.440
being told that objects over bases are
considered extremely sensitive. Oprep three systems still

558
00:46:22.480 --> 00:46:27.760
are in existence today. I actually
know someone that works at King's Kings Bay

559
00:46:28.559 --> 00:46:32.199
Naval Facility in I think it's George
Rook, South Carolina, And I actually

560
00:46:32.239 --> 00:46:36.199
asked him not or six months ago, I said, do you guys still

561
00:46:36.320 --> 00:46:38.360
use oprep threes? And he actually
said to me, he said, not

562
00:46:38.400 --> 00:46:42.079
only do we use them, he
says, they're one of our main form

563
00:46:42.119 --> 00:46:44.880
of drill practice. He says,
if you want to get guys out of

564
00:46:44.880 --> 00:46:47.760
bed, say there's an OPREP three
going down. Yeah, that's what he

565
00:46:47.800 --> 00:46:52.920
actually said. So what we are
doing now is foying both the Joint Chiefs

566
00:46:52.920 --> 00:46:58.000
of Staff and the Office of the
Secretary of Defense for any op Prep threes

567
00:46:58.039 --> 00:47:00.679
in the last you know, say, fifteen years that have involved unknown objects.

568
00:47:00.679 --> 00:47:04.320
And it's an extremely slow process.
We know they're going to knock us

569
00:47:04.320 --> 00:47:07.400
back, so we're going to appeal
it. And yeah, so there you

570
00:47:07.440 --> 00:47:14.199
go. So with these op Rep
three reports that or files that have come

571
00:47:14.239 --> 00:47:20.679
out with the unknown helicopters? Are
these just then what you're able to receive

572
00:47:21.119 --> 00:47:30.440
the message to command? But or
are you able to actually get any further

573
00:47:30.559 --> 00:47:37.079
report or investigation? Very good question. I like that. What happens with

574
00:47:37.119 --> 00:47:39.000
an OPREP three? First, the
op Rep three gets shot off from the

575
00:47:39.000 --> 00:47:44.239
base and then five minutes later it
look it's changed over the year. It

576
00:47:44.320 --> 00:47:46.599
used to be fifteen minutes later,
I think. But sometime later the commander

577
00:47:46.599 --> 00:47:51.119
who sent the original Rep three,
he's got to send what they call an

578
00:47:51.159 --> 00:47:54.079
op REP update, which it tells, you know, National Military Command Center,

579
00:47:54.679 --> 00:47:58.559
what's going on now, what's going
on next? What's going on now?

580
00:47:58.599 --> 00:48:01.760
Like it's got to be constant because
really serious and so we were in

581
00:48:01.800 --> 00:48:07.320
the seventies. It was actually Robert
Todd and Barry Greenwood who got basically cut

582
00:48:07.360 --> 00:48:12.000
along story short for listeners. A
bunch of Air Force huge Strategic Air Command

583
00:48:12.039 --> 00:48:16.159
bases across the Northern Tier border with
Canada, all in the same week got

584
00:48:16.199 --> 00:48:22.039
overflown by miniature helicopters, massive helicopters, helicopters that weren't helicopters, UFOs,

585
00:48:22.559 --> 00:48:27.679
things that looked like light aircraft that
made no noise, bizarre I mean,

586
00:48:27.840 --> 00:48:32.119
bizarre occurrences kind of looked human like
but probably couldn't have been. I mean,

587
00:48:32.159 --> 00:48:37.519
one object seemed to go from Alluring
Air Force Base to Falconbridge in Canada.

588
00:48:37.639 --> 00:48:39.920
It's something like, you know,
in ten minutes, and that means

589
00:48:39.920 --> 00:48:43.719
it was probably going at a thousand, well in your language, six hundred

590
00:48:43.719 --> 00:48:45.920
miles an hour. Now, the
Apache helicopter can't even do that, and

591
00:48:45.960 --> 00:48:50.760
it wasn't even invented then, so
you know. So, so these ore

592
00:48:50.760 --> 00:48:53.599
Prep throws get sent, and then
the National Military Command Center will create its

593
00:48:53.639 --> 00:48:58.760
own records like memorandums of understanding,
things like receipts saying yes, Lauring,

594
00:48:58.840 --> 00:49:01.840
we received your message on the telephone
right now to you, or things like

595
00:49:01.840 --> 00:49:08.880
they're called DdO talkers deputy of a
Deputy director of Operation Internal UFO or sorry,

596
00:49:08.920 --> 00:49:14.199
internal talker. And so we were
able to get both the original Op

597
00:49:14.199 --> 00:49:19.480
Prep three s from the bases,
plus the updates, plus internal National Military

598
00:49:19.519 --> 00:49:24.599
Command Center memorandums and talkies about those
of Prep three. So you'll see these

599
00:49:24.679 --> 00:49:29.320
things. You'll see the National Military
Command Center writing out, you know,

600
00:49:29.519 --> 00:49:37.760
Memorandum for Urgent Appraisal Subject UFO Overlawing
contents urgently checking with West with Eastern Hemisphere

601
00:49:37.800 --> 00:49:45.679
desk for temperature inversions over Lawing two. Phone conversation with Lawing indicates unusual helicopters

602
00:49:45.679 --> 00:49:50.599
still on base. Three. Another
O PREP three update is expected in three

603
00:49:50.599 --> 00:49:53.320
minutes. Four. You know,
object has now moved to bottom of the

604
00:49:53.360 --> 00:49:58.440
base as told by Brigadier General Smith. Five like that, So you get

605
00:49:58.440 --> 00:50:05.559
these constant this unbel believable, this, this barrage of internal tallexing and carbon

606
00:50:05.599 --> 00:50:09.280
copies of printouts. The crazy thing
is we didn't eat Barry Greenwood and Robert

607
00:50:09.320 --> 00:50:13.360
Todd. They didn't get everything.
They were knocked back. I mean they

608
00:50:13.360 --> 00:50:16.280
were consistently. I mean even Norrad
was involved in one of these cases.

609
00:50:16.320 --> 00:50:22.960
The operate one Opera three says we've
requested air support, like actual tactical air

610
00:50:22.000 --> 00:50:28.719
support from nor Ad. So Noorad
actually flew in fighter jets to identify these

611
00:50:28.800 --> 00:50:34.599
visual these potential aircraft and the aircraft
actually these weird objects actually nicked off just

612
00:50:34.599 --> 00:50:37.000
as the planes arrived. And so
we can see all this in writing.

613
00:50:37.039 --> 00:50:42.559
And what gets me is is that
is that our UFO researchers who were doing

614
00:50:42.599 --> 00:50:44.599
this, you know, in the
middle of the night trying to get some

615
00:50:44.639 --> 00:50:49.239
answers. They they they were actually
knocked back. There was a lot of

616
00:50:49.280 --> 00:50:52.719
documents that they couldn't get out because
they were just too highly classified. Now

617
00:50:52.440 --> 00:50:59.880
you know, again another mystery.
What this is pretty incredible, I think

618
00:51:00.920 --> 00:51:07.800
because these cases aren't as well known
and they sound pretty intense. So you

619
00:51:07.880 --> 00:51:12.360
talked about, you know, this
wave that happened kind of in the border

620
00:51:12.480 --> 00:51:15.679
of Canada and this one object.
What are some of the other incidents you've

621
00:51:15.719 --> 00:51:22.519
you've kind of found there? Okay, so well from the time I'm actually

622
00:51:22.519 --> 00:51:29.280
pulling out my folder, now,
let me just have a look. And

623
00:51:29.360 --> 00:51:32.519
you know a lot of them be
found on your website. Oh yeah,

624
00:51:32.679 --> 00:51:36.440
absolutely, If anyone's interested, all
I have to do is email me.

625
00:51:36.480 --> 00:51:39.760
I can send you three hundred anyone. I can send hundreds and hundreds of

626
00:51:39.800 --> 00:51:45.360
documents about this, about these matters. Hold on, just give me a

627
00:51:45.400 --> 00:51:53.360
second. I'm just absolutely anyone can
find these. They are all over the

628
00:51:53.360 --> 00:51:58.239
internet. All you would have to
do is type in go to Google and

629
00:51:58.320 --> 00:52:07.440
type in nineteen seventy five overflights,
opera three or situation or you know Canada

630
00:52:07.559 --> 00:52:12.920
US border, and you will find
anyone can find hundreds of documents. The

631
00:52:12.960 --> 00:52:15.440
weird part is is that, like
I said, for a week, these

632
00:52:15.719 --> 00:52:21.719
these unknown objects and funny looking helicopters
and stuff were flying over these bases,

633
00:52:22.159 --> 00:52:23.880
but there was no bar to their
operation. I mean, no one got

634
00:52:23.880 --> 00:52:29.119
prosecuted. The FBI will call in
there, we've got We've got FBI documents,

635
00:52:29.519 --> 00:52:34.679
Office of Air Force Special Investigation documents, Strategic Air Command documents, nor

636
00:52:34.719 --> 00:52:37.320
RAD documents. No one investigating this
could figure out what was going on.

637
00:52:37.400 --> 00:52:42.599
No one was prosecuted, nothing landed, no one tried to refuel and do

638
00:52:42.639 --> 00:52:46.159
it again. No Russians were caught. There was nothing seen, you know

639
00:52:46.920 --> 00:52:51.000
beforehand. It wasn't like it's slowly
built up. It just started banging on

640
00:52:51.000 --> 00:52:54.480
the twenty seventh of October nineteen seventy
five. But what's really odd is that

641
00:52:54.920 --> 00:53:00.119
the more the researchers dug into this, they started knew that had happened along

642
00:53:00.159 --> 00:53:05.800
the Canadian border. But but for
it, just just for a crack.

643
00:53:07.760 --> 00:53:12.000
The researchers in the seventies decided to
FOI quite a few other bases around the

644
00:53:12.079 --> 00:53:15.639
United States and right into nineteen seventy
six, and the same things were going

645
00:53:15.639 --> 00:53:21.199
on there. What's weird is is
is that you know, a Cannon Air

646
00:53:21.239 --> 00:53:24.960
Force base, there was a UFO
reported just outside the base, like in

647
00:53:25.000 --> 00:53:31.400
the air that was shaped like a
doughnut of silver gold color and flashing lights

648
00:53:31.440 --> 00:53:36.519
on it. And it was actually
signed off like the actual message it was

649
00:53:36.880 --> 00:53:39.360
sorry it was it was an internal
National Military Command Center memo. It was

650
00:53:39.400 --> 00:53:45.159
actually signed off by a by I
think a rear admiral who's very, very

651
00:53:45.199 --> 00:53:47.320
high ranking. I mean, if
this stuff wasn't serious, there is no

652
00:53:47.440 --> 00:53:52.119
way that the deputy director of Operations
for the NMCC would be even touching this

653
00:53:52.159 --> 00:53:58.519
stuff. There's so you know,
I've so these documents are absolutely available.

654
00:53:58.559 --> 00:54:02.079
Yes, yeah, that's pretty incredible. I mean it'd be great too.

655
00:54:02.719 --> 00:54:07.679
So what since you've been doing this
work, what have you found that you

656
00:54:07.719 --> 00:54:12.639
feel is new that no one else
has discovered? Right, Okay, I

657
00:54:12.679 --> 00:54:17.920
will tell you one thing that is
very important. I think I'll try and

658
00:54:17.960 --> 00:54:23.719
cut it short. It's quite complex, but the NORRAD, who is North

659
00:54:23.760 --> 00:54:30.719
American Aerospace Defense Command. They are
in charge with the United States and Canada's

660
00:54:30.000 --> 00:54:35.440
air sovereignty. Well, the FAA
is too, but the nor AD really

661
00:54:35.960 --> 00:54:40.400
is the key in America and Canada's
air sovereignty, airspace management, and aerial

662
00:54:40.519 --> 00:54:49.760
war fighting capability. That's hijackings terrorism
from the air, that's interrogating unusual aircraft

663
00:54:49.800 --> 00:54:54.840
that shouldn't be there, watching drug
smuggling aircraft, you know, coordinating military

664
00:54:54.880 --> 00:55:00.000
flights within civilian airspace and so on. Now, nor AD when they pick

665
00:55:00.079 --> 00:55:06.639
up something on radar that is not
talking on radio, like something just pops

666
00:55:06.719 --> 00:55:09.880
up on primary radar and it's got
no associated code with it, like,

667
00:55:09.960 --> 00:55:15.559
it's got no m it's it's got
no flight plan established, it's it's immediately

668
00:55:15.639 --> 00:55:22.039
called an unknown track. And nor
AD battlespace controllers and air traffic controllers,

669
00:55:22.039 --> 00:55:24.519
they just watch it and they'll say
to it. Look, they'll say down

670
00:55:24.559 --> 00:55:29.880
the radio system, they'll say,
look, we see you. You're coming

671
00:55:29.920 --> 00:55:35.880
in over I don't know, Plattsburgh, New York, whatever, and they'll

672
00:55:35.920 --> 00:55:37.920
say, can you identify yourself?
Can you get on the radio, because

673
00:55:38.000 --> 00:55:43.159
right now you're breaking the law.
And if that, if that object just

674
00:55:43.239 --> 00:55:46.159
keeps flying around doing a few circles, whatever, they call, they continue

675
00:55:46.159 --> 00:55:50.119
to call it an unknown track.
But then they raise the precedents. They

676
00:55:50.159 --> 00:55:52.320
say, they say, right,
we better get a couple of jets turn

677
00:55:52.360 --> 00:55:57.480
their engines on with pilots in case
we need to intercept this thing. If

678
00:55:57.559 --> 00:56:02.960
this unknown track, this unknown track
that's that's appearing on these unbelievably cutting edge,

679
00:56:04.039 --> 00:56:08.840
high tech screens, if that continues
to not you know, land or

680
00:56:09.079 --> 00:56:13.440
you know, talk back or doesn't, if it's if it doesn't call a

681
00:56:13.559 --> 00:56:17.840
may day or whatever, then it
gets really it gets. The term gets

682
00:56:17.920 --> 00:56:22.079
upgraded to a nor AD remaining unknown
and that's when the jets actually take off

683
00:56:22.079 --> 00:56:28.039
to intercept it. Wow. Now, nor Ad has always said, nor

684
00:56:28.119 --> 00:56:32.679
Ad has always said in writing that
we do not study after the event,

685
00:56:32.800 --> 00:56:36.559
like whether the thing lands or it's
shot down, or it's you know,

686
00:56:36.960 --> 00:56:39.079
or it's or it vanishes because of
it, it's a it's a bad radar

687
00:56:39.159 --> 00:56:43.639
glitch or whatever. That Nourra has
always said to us. We do not

688
00:56:43.800 --> 00:56:49.159
study unknown tracks or NORD remaining unknowns. We just don't do it. They

689
00:56:49.159 --> 00:56:51.480
don't say who does do it,
but they say we don't do it.

690
00:56:51.800 --> 00:56:54.840
Well. I found a nineteen ninety
six nor AD document and in there,

691
00:56:55.119 --> 00:57:01.320
on page ten, it discusses unknown
track nor AD Remaining Unknowns, and right

692
00:57:01.360 --> 00:57:07.679
at the bottom it says something really
interesting. It says copies of these types

693
00:57:07.719 --> 00:57:14.480
of reports will be sent to the
Center for Aerospace Analysis for further study.

694
00:57:15.559 --> 00:57:20.880
Now then it sees in brackets Center
for Aerospace Analysis is a nor AD US

695
00:57:20.880 --> 00:57:24.440
Space Command joint center. So first, like I said, NORD says we

696
00:57:24.480 --> 00:57:29.119
do not study unknown tracks other than
while they're going on or nor AD remaining

697
00:57:29.199 --> 00:57:34.800
unknowns. But then in this formally
classified document it says that you know that

698
00:57:36.159 --> 00:57:39.199
copies of unknown tracks or NORD remaining
unknowns will be sent to the nor AD

699
00:57:39.400 --> 00:57:45.920
Center for Aerospace Analysis. So I'm
thinking the nor ADS Center for Aerospace Analysis

700
00:57:45.039 --> 00:57:49.679
is where. So like, if
we believe in UFOs, and if UFOs

701
00:57:49.679 --> 00:57:52.440
do appear on radar, which we
think they do, sometimes we've got this

702
00:57:52.519 --> 00:57:55.440
too many cases in Project blue Book, there is too many whistleblowers, there

703
00:57:55.480 --> 00:58:00.440
is too many cases from the airports. So we've got to assume that UFOs

704
00:58:00.480 --> 00:58:02.880
do appear on radar. Then we've
got to assume that Norrad, who has

705
00:58:02.920 --> 00:58:07.800
some of the best radar networks in
the whole world, we've got to assume

706
00:58:07.800 --> 00:58:12.559
that UFOs also appear on their radars. And that means that when they appear

707
00:58:12.599 --> 00:58:16.000
on NORRAD radars, they are classified
as unknown tracks or nor Ad remaining unknowns,

708
00:58:16.519 --> 00:58:20.800
and it says in that document that
they go to the Center for Aerospace

709
00:58:20.840 --> 00:58:25.239
Analysis. So that is where you
if we have cases where UFOs have appeared

710
00:58:25.280 --> 00:58:30.360
on radar over North America and have
appeared for quite a while, like not

711
00:58:30.440 --> 00:58:36.480
just glitches but solid targets, then
we are I'm sure that they are studied

712
00:58:36.519 --> 00:58:39.960
at this Center for Aerospace Analysis.
I've got another document from the Government Reform

713
00:58:40.000 --> 00:58:45.480
Committee. It's a question and answered
document after September eleven, where the Government

714
00:58:45.519 --> 00:58:51.599
Reform Committee in the House of Representatives
actually sent Norrad a bunch of questions about

715
00:58:51.639 --> 00:58:54.719
September eleven, and in there they
say, they say, look, with

716
00:58:54.800 --> 00:59:00.360
all these unknown tracks and unknown targets
around Washington, d C. They ask

717
00:59:00.360 --> 00:59:04.199
a few questions and then they ask
one question. They say, they say,

718
00:59:04.960 --> 00:59:07.679
with you know, with any unknown
tracks that you guys pick up,

719
00:59:09.000 --> 00:59:14.559
what happens later on? How do
you study them to improve performance? And

720
00:59:14.679 --> 00:59:20.480
Norrad's answer was, again, these
unknown objects, the reports, like the

721
00:59:20.519 --> 00:59:24.119
actual radar data is sent to the
Center for Aerospace Analysis. And so now

722
00:59:24.199 --> 00:59:30.199
I've got it twice in writing.
I've also seen emails between the eighty fourth

723
00:59:30.280 --> 00:59:36.639
Radar Evaluation squadron at the Hill Air
Force BACE UTAH and Norrad's a command and

724
00:59:36.639 --> 00:59:42.599
control center at Peterson Air Force BACE, also saying that they study unknown tracks,

725
00:59:42.920 --> 00:59:45.800
so there is no doubt about that. Now the Center for Aerospace Analysis

726
00:59:45.800 --> 00:59:50.400
doesn't exist anymore. I don't know
what it's been replaced by. It started,

727
00:59:50.480 --> 00:59:53.960
it was raised in about nineteen eighty
eight, and it was actually dissolved

728
00:59:54.000 --> 00:59:58.519
in about in two thousand and six, So I don't know what it's been

729
00:59:58.599 --> 01:00:04.039
replaced by. But I can assure
you that that that any weird unknown writer

730
01:00:04.840 --> 01:00:08.800
UFOs are held, like the documents, the data the writer are imaging,

731
01:00:08.840 --> 01:00:15.440
any analysis, whether analysis, etcetera, is held somewhere in Nerrad and that

732
01:00:15.800 --> 01:00:19.400
and that we've got that in black
and white. Now that's very very powerful.

733
01:00:20.599 --> 01:00:23.800
Yeah, that's pretty incredible. And
I think what's really interesting about this

734
01:00:25.039 --> 01:00:30.239
is that, and you would know
better, is that when I do like

735
01:00:30.320 --> 01:00:37.840
a search for the Center for Aerospace
Analysis, you find practically nothing. Nothing.

736
01:00:37.519 --> 01:00:45.639
Yeah. I found on a NERRAD
site a person who got reference exactly,

737
01:00:45.679 --> 01:00:51.719
who got an award, who works
for the Center for Aerospace Analysis.

738
01:00:52.159 --> 01:00:54.639
But that's it. I found.
Uh, And this is an interesting group

739
01:00:54.719 --> 01:01:00.760
you've probably heard of it. The
Federation of American Scientists exactly, who is

740
01:01:00.840 --> 01:01:06.480
kind of an advocate for open information. You can. They're a great organization

741
01:01:06.480 --> 01:01:10.880
because they're scientists looking for information on
defense and everything, and they have something

742
01:01:12.039 --> 01:01:21.119
on it. But that's that's pretty
I mean typically even uh even Space Command

743
01:01:21.239 --> 01:01:27.440
has their own website, so that
is sort of streams. It means that

744
01:01:28.679 --> 01:01:31.960
this is not a public feacing organization, no way. I actually have had

745
01:01:31.960 --> 01:01:37.320
the nerve because I'm quite cheeky with
this. I've actually had the goal to

746
01:01:37.400 --> 01:01:44.679
go to LinkedIn and like what I've
done. Yeah, so there's it's not

747
01:01:44.719 --> 01:01:50.480
just Center for Aerospace Analysis anymore.
There's another organization within NORRAD called it's called

748
01:01:50.559 --> 01:01:55.159
NORAD JS three free air Space Management
or you could write j S three free

749
01:01:55.199 --> 01:02:00.480
C and they also apparently study unknown
tracks as well. Now I've had the

750
01:02:00.559 --> 01:02:06.760
cheek to type in every conceivable keyword, and what I do is what I've

751
01:02:06.800 --> 01:02:08.800
found is some of the only yep, some of the only stuff I could

752
01:02:08.800 --> 01:02:13.719
find is actually people's LinkedIn pages.
And it might be you know, a

753
01:02:13.800 --> 01:02:20.000
major I'll say major Breece Smith who
and you'll see a LinkedIn page and it'll

754
01:02:20.039 --> 01:02:23.280
say currently working at Air Force twenty
one, you know, Air Force Space

755
01:02:23.320 --> 01:02:30.000
Command twenty first Operations Wing. Previous
history nor AD Command Center, nor AD

756
01:02:30.079 --> 01:02:35.519
J three three operations or Center for
Aerospace Analysis. Now I've had the cheek

757
01:02:35.880 --> 01:02:40.880
to go and actually get these people
on Facebook, so they that, you

758
01:02:40.880 --> 01:02:44.360
know, so no one's talking yet. I mean they find it a bit

759
01:02:44.400 --> 01:02:46.920
odd, but I mean I'll do
anything, like I'll do anything to to

760
01:02:47.400 --> 01:02:52.880
sort this out, you know.
So yeah, so are they located?

761
01:02:53.039 --> 01:03:00.119
Then it looks like they were part
of Space Command, So Space Command and

762
01:03:00.400 --> 01:03:05.440
doesn't exist anymore. It got absorbed
into the US Strategic Command in nineteen in

763
01:03:05.440 --> 01:03:07.920
two thousand and two, So in
the eighties and nineties, the Center for

764
01:03:08.000 --> 01:03:14.840
Aerospace Analysis was a joint nor AD, a US Space Command center. Body.

765
01:03:15.360 --> 01:03:21.079
Then when when US Space Command was
absorbed into Stratcom, the Center for

766
01:03:21.159 --> 01:03:27.199
Aerospace Analysis became under nor AD and
north Comb which is Northern Command which controls

767
01:03:27.239 --> 01:03:31.039
the military for North America. So
basically, first it was a joint NOD

768
01:03:31.119 --> 01:03:37.159
Space comm Center, then it was
a joint nor AD a north Comb center.

769
01:03:38.360 --> 01:03:42.599
And so look, it is very
hard to find stuff. It is.

770
01:03:42.800 --> 01:03:45.519
It isn't a new organization like I
said, I've been told reliably I

771
01:03:45.519 --> 01:03:50.679
think that that's Center for Aerospace Analysis
vanished in two thousand and six, and

772
01:03:50.800 --> 01:03:53.119
I don't know what it got replaced
by. I will find out somehow,

773
01:03:53.320 --> 01:04:00.639
but you know, so look,
it is really important because if it looked

774
01:04:00.679 --> 01:04:02.719
nor at our exempt from the Freedom
of Information Act, they do have to

775
01:04:02.760 --> 01:04:06.199
follow it by spirit, i e. They do have to respond to you.

776
01:04:06.280 --> 01:04:09.960
They do have to search for records. They don't have to release anything.

777
01:04:10.199 --> 01:04:13.559
They barely even have to tell you
if they found anything. They don't

778
01:04:13.559 --> 01:04:16.599
even have to tell you why they
won't release it. But they will do

779
01:04:16.840 --> 01:04:23.039
some work, and you know,
in time, I will, you know,

780
01:04:23.079 --> 01:04:26.320
maybe in the next month or so, I will definitely foy North comb

781
01:04:26.320 --> 01:04:32.760
slash nor AD and ask for any
mission records, you know, even any

782
01:04:32.800 --> 01:04:38.880
analysis done on unknown tracks done at
the old Center for Aerospace Analysis. Whether

783
01:04:38.920 --> 01:04:42.400
they've kept the files, I would
say they probably have. But you know,

784
01:04:42.480 --> 01:04:45.800
it's just a constant process. I
mean it's very very, very slow.

785
01:04:46.679 --> 01:04:53.280
Now there still is at least a
group calling themselves Air Force Base Command.

786
01:04:53.639 --> 01:04:59.559
Is that separate then? Yeah?
So US Space Command was an organization

787
01:05:00.440 --> 01:05:06.280
from nineteen eighty to two thousand and
two that was actually comprised of elements or

788
01:05:06.320 --> 01:05:12.800
sections of the United States Air Force
Space Command, the United States Navy Space

789
01:05:12.840 --> 01:05:18.559
Command, and the United States Army
Space Command. So US Space Command from

790
01:05:18.559 --> 01:05:27.239
eighty two two thousand and two was
basically a huge body, but really what

791
01:05:27.280 --> 01:05:30.440
they were was a collection of three
entities Army, Air Force, and Navy

792
01:05:30.440 --> 01:05:33.760
Space Command. So Air Force Space
Command specifically for the Air Force. They

793
01:05:33.760 --> 01:05:40.400
still exist and it's one of the
biggest major commands within the United States Air

794
01:05:40.440 --> 01:05:43.519
Force. Air Force Space Command,
I think that will. They're headquartered at

795
01:05:43.519 --> 01:05:49.880
Pederson Air Force Space They control satellite
launching, you know, satellites, a

796
01:05:50.000 --> 01:05:57.079
design, satellite upgrades, you know, the interface between space and aerospace,

797
01:05:57.159 --> 01:06:01.719
computer systems for space management, space
warfare policy, et cetera. So,

798
01:06:01.840 --> 01:06:08.000
yeah, but US Space Command has
vanished and it's it's it was absorbed into

799
01:06:08.000 --> 01:06:14.199
Strategic Command, which is based off
at Air Force Bace Nebraska out of Nebraska.

800
01:06:14.719 --> 01:06:17.559
Yeap, so if you so.
Yeah, So US Space Command,

801
01:06:17.599 --> 01:06:21.360
which like I said, was a
combination of the three component commands air Force,

802
01:06:21.440 --> 01:06:26.320
Army, Navy and and but they
got absorbed into Stratcom which is based

803
01:06:26.320 --> 01:06:30.199
in Nebraska, and and you know, so a lot of what the old

804
01:06:30.320 --> 01:06:34.000
U S Space Command used to do
is currently done by US Strategic Command.

805
01:06:34.480 --> 01:06:41.400
So yeah, it's an interesting piece
of history. So somewhere in Strategic Command,

806
01:06:41.840 --> 01:06:47.480
it seems likely would be where these
reports are going, these unknown tracks.

807
01:06:48.199 --> 01:06:53.920
Yeah, possibly, Yeah, well
I still will like I I think

808
01:06:53.920 --> 01:06:57.719
that in the atmosphere, certainly in
what we call air breathing and the in

809
01:06:57.880 --> 01:07:02.400
aerospace, I think it's still within
I think unknown track reports and nor AD

810
01:07:02.440 --> 01:07:08.199
remaining unknowns are still held at Norrad. Now for space, I'm not saying

811
01:07:08.239 --> 01:07:12.079
strat Com would know about it,
but for space out of space, that's

812
01:07:12.079 --> 01:07:15.559
all done at Strategic Command. It's
actually done at a place called the Joint

813
01:07:15.559 --> 01:07:19.039
Functional Components Center for Space, which
is based at Vanderberg Air Force Space and

814
01:07:19.079 --> 01:07:25.000
the actual building is called the Joint
of Space Operations Center. So that's another

815
01:07:25.079 --> 01:07:30.039
story altogether. When they pick up
something unusual in space, it's called something

816
01:07:30.079 --> 01:07:34.880
completely different, it's called an uncorrelated
target, and it's picked up by one

817
01:07:34.880 --> 01:07:39.920
of thirty senses around the world,
and then it's tracked to make sure it's

818
01:07:39.960 --> 01:07:43.480
not the first thing you want to
do, is anything in space that shouldn't

819
01:07:43.480 --> 01:07:47.119
be there or that you've never seen
before. The Strategic Command want to be

820
01:07:47.159 --> 01:07:51.159
absolutely sure that it's not an incoming
missile that threatens the sovereignty or safety of

821
01:07:51.159 --> 01:07:54.840
the United States or Canada. That's
the first thing they do. And then

822
01:07:54.880 --> 01:07:57.400
they see if it's in orbit,
or if it's going to crash into Earth,

823
01:07:57.519 --> 01:08:00.960
or it's space debris or whatever.
But yes, so there's no doubt

824
01:08:00.000 --> 01:08:04.280
about it. There is a vast
amount of highly technical stuff related to the

825
01:08:04.400 --> 01:08:08.719
UFO matter, or sort of semi
related to the UFO matter, that is

826
01:08:08.719 --> 01:08:13.760
held at NOORAD and Stratcom and in
archives. That's the other thing I say.

827
01:08:14.039 --> 01:08:15.680
I often have to pinch myself and
say, you know, like I'm

828
01:08:15.720 --> 01:08:19.880
asking NOORAD or strat Com or even
just generally the United States Air Force for

829
01:08:19.960 --> 01:08:24.039
records. And the thing is a
lot of them have long gone, you

830
01:08:24.079 --> 01:08:28.359
know, you know, they're packed
up and they're putting they're put in in

831
01:08:28.840 --> 01:08:34.279
these basketball basketball stadium like warehouses.
They're not It's funny. They're too old.

832
01:08:34.880 --> 01:08:39.039
So many records from the eighties and
nineties. They're too old to be

833
01:08:39.119 --> 01:08:42.960
kept on Air Force or nor AD
bases, but they're too new to go

834
01:08:43.000 --> 01:08:46.319
to the National Archives. So they're
kept in this limbo period. I know

835
01:08:46.399 --> 01:08:53.960
that there's a huge facility in Saint
Louis that keeps very sensitive records and we

836
01:08:54.079 --> 01:08:57.119
can't you know, even under the
FOI Act, they just won't search because

837
01:08:57.159 --> 01:09:00.720
it's too big a job, you
know. So it is frustrating. But

838
01:09:00.960 --> 01:09:08.880
yeah, and then these records often
get quote unquote whilst yeah, yeah,

839
01:09:08.960 --> 01:09:14.159
yeah, the old lost, destroyed
lost or like segregated or misfiled or yet

840
01:09:14.199 --> 01:09:16.520
now some of them. Look,
I do know that a lot of records

841
01:09:16.560 --> 01:09:20.560
are destroyed. There is absolutely no
way that they can keep everything. I've

842
01:09:20.600 --> 01:09:26.760
seen the National Reconnaissance Office documents,
scheduling and a lot of records are legitimately

843
01:09:26.760 --> 01:09:30.479
destroyed after one year or five years. A contractual records, you know,

844
01:09:30.560 --> 01:09:38.319
building maintenance records, you know,
occupational health and safety records, personnel records,

845
01:09:38.319 --> 01:09:42.640
even things like applications for annually or
vacation you call it, or you

846
01:09:42.640 --> 01:09:45.439
know, base security measures, and
they're all just I mean, I don't

847
01:09:45.680 --> 01:09:50.199
it's very hard to see what is
kept long term, I mean for fifty

848
01:09:50.279 --> 01:09:54.399
years, and what's kept medium term, like for say nine years, and

849
01:09:54.439 --> 01:09:58.319
what's kept short term, you know, a year. It's it's you know,

850
01:09:58.439 --> 01:10:01.960
and but yeah, I know situation
for instance, like with the NSA

851
01:10:02.039 --> 01:10:05.680
and the DIA recently saying that they've
lost the origin all those you know,

852
01:10:05.840 --> 01:10:10.680
redacted documents that we got out in
the seventies and eighties, they've now suddenly

853
01:10:10.680 --> 01:10:15.720
lost the originals. It is possible
that they really actually have and or they're

854
01:10:15.760 --> 01:10:18.880
just not looking hard enough, because
you know, the amount of paperwork that

855
01:10:18.920 --> 01:10:25.439
these organizations kept in the seventies and
eighties is so vast that, you know,

856
01:10:25.520 --> 01:10:30.800
I read once that at the National
Security Agency that some of the printers,

857
01:10:30.840 --> 01:10:34.399
like some of the stationary equipment were
actually printing out six ply papers.

858
01:10:34.399 --> 01:10:39.000
So a message would come through from
another building, and you know, a

859
01:10:39.039 --> 01:10:42.159
message could be something so simple like
we've run out of coke and the vending

860
01:10:42.159 --> 01:10:45.159
machine, and it would be literally
printed out on six bits of paper.

861
01:10:45.199 --> 01:10:47.720
One would go to the guy that's
supposed to receive it, one would go

862
01:10:47.760 --> 01:10:50.880
in the bin, one would go
to archives, one would go to the

863
01:10:50.960 --> 01:10:55.880
first guy's boss, the other one
would go to a temporary archives for safety

864
01:10:55.920 --> 01:10:59.319
and statistical purposes and so on.
I mean, they just can't keep it,

865
01:10:59.680 --> 01:11:01.560
you know, so that at the
same time, you know, I

866
01:11:01.640 --> 01:11:06.119
find it very strange that some records
are supposedly missing or lost. I'll have

867
01:11:06.159 --> 01:11:12.319
say, incidences where you have to
be very suspicious. Yeah, M So

868
01:11:13.279 --> 01:11:15.920
I knew this conversation would be like
this, and that's why I was one

869
01:11:15.960 --> 01:11:21.000
excited for the conversation, but two
I knew that. I mean, because

870
01:11:21.079 --> 01:11:29.600
you often will barrage me with information
and it looks interesting and I'm always like,

871
01:11:29.760 --> 01:11:32.319
I need to tackle this, but
I don't know even where to start.

872
01:11:32.760 --> 01:11:36.560
But that's what's great about this conversation
is I'm starting to get now an

873
01:11:36.640 --> 01:11:41.680
idea of where to start. And
what I like, I'm so happy that

874
01:11:41.720 --> 01:11:45.600
we're talking is that now the listeners
can also, you know, get an

875
01:11:45.680 --> 01:11:49.920
idea of this structure out there.
And what's great about what you're doing is

876
01:11:49.960 --> 01:11:55.319
this is kind of that you're following
the thread, which is what's really important

877
01:11:55.359 --> 01:12:00.239
to find out what's really going on
out there, because when we are asking

878
01:12:01.399 --> 01:12:09.079
people officials about what's going on,
we need to be knowledgeable and we need

879
01:12:09.119 --> 01:12:15.000
to do that, follow the thread
as to where what is happening and when

880
01:12:15.760 --> 01:12:17.960
Yeah, yeah, it's yeah,
it is really important. Someone told me

881
01:12:18.000 --> 01:12:23.479
something once that is it was key. They said to me with any given

882
01:12:23.520 --> 01:12:29.399
agency. Find out when the security
was at its weakest. It could be

883
01:12:29.399 --> 01:12:31.399
the nineteen it could be nineteen fifty
nine, could be nineteen seventy three,

884
01:12:31.520 --> 01:12:35.800
whatever. Find Out when security was
at its weakest, when they were releasing

885
01:12:35.840 --> 01:12:41.800
documents or making a lot of public
statements or like press releases. Find out

886
01:12:41.840 --> 01:12:45.319
when the organization was at its weakest, and then follow the thread for you

887
01:12:45.319 --> 01:12:51.000
know, to twenty sixteen. So
classic example, Project Bluebook was run under

888
01:12:51.560 --> 01:12:56.359
BO. It was run for a
while under the United States Air Force Research

889
01:12:56.359 --> 01:13:00.640
and Development and then United States Air
Defense Command. It was physically ran at

890
01:13:00.680 --> 01:13:05.239
the Air Technical Intelligence Center, which
later became the Foreign Technology Division at Right

891
01:13:05.239 --> 01:13:12.279
Patterson Air Force BACE, and in
the early sixties was probably when the security

892
01:13:12.319 --> 01:13:15.840
was at its weakest they were releasing
documents. They eventually all the blue Book

893
01:13:15.840 --> 01:13:20.520
files eventually went to Maxwell and someone
told me, you know, Air Technical

894
01:13:20.520 --> 01:13:25.720
Intelligence Center turned into the Foreign Technology
Division. Well, what happened after that?

895
01:13:26.079 --> 01:13:31.720
Foreign Technology Division turned into the National
Air Intelligence Center in the seventies,

896
01:13:31.800 --> 01:13:38.399
and then the National Air Intelligence Center
changed its name to the National Aeronaudic and

897
01:13:38.720 --> 01:13:45.640
Space Intelligence Center NASSIK in about nineteen
ninety five, and this person, this

898
01:13:45.760 --> 01:13:49.840
researcher, he's awesome, he's very
private. But he told me, he

899
01:13:50.000 --> 01:13:55.199
said, he said, old habits
die hard if you find that, you

900
01:13:55.239 --> 01:13:58.720
know, if we know that the
Air Technical Intelligence Center and then the Foreign

901
01:13:58.760 --> 01:14:02.880
Technology Division would definitely doing UFOs in
the fifties and sixties, old habits die

902
01:14:02.960 --> 01:14:06.199
hard. Were they still doing them
in the seventies, then the eighties,

903
01:14:06.239 --> 01:14:12.279
then the nineties, then two thousands
and now, And sure enough, if

904
01:14:12.319 --> 01:14:17.039
you look at the linearage, nothing
much has changed the old Foreign Technology Division

905
01:14:17.039 --> 01:14:20.800
and Air Technical Intelligence and it's now
called NASIK, but it does exactly the

906
01:14:20.840 --> 01:14:25.359
same as what it did sixty years
ago. It studies foreign objects, It

907
01:14:25.439 --> 01:14:30.159
studies plane engines, It studies unusual
weather patterns that affect you know, combat

908
01:14:30.199 --> 01:14:38.760
jets. It studies missile propulsion,
and it studies you know, unusual you

909
01:14:38.760 --> 01:14:43.239
know, unusual flight pars taken by
I don't know, Chinese jets. It

910
01:14:43.399 --> 01:14:47.800
studies all sorts of stuff. So
yet another place to look for UFO records

911
01:14:47.880 --> 01:14:54.319
or UFO apprais, all discussions,
meetings, whistleblowers, whatever would be nassick.

912
01:14:55.039 --> 01:14:58.720
Right back, It's where it all
started, right Patterson Air Force Base,

913
01:14:58.760 --> 01:15:01.000
where it all started in nineteen forty
seven, So it sounds so easy.

914
01:15:01.039 --> 01:15:03.199
Sometimes people say, Paul, you
make it sound so easy. It

915
01:15:03.199 --> 01:15:06.079
can't be this easy, and it's
not, of course it's not. It's

916
01:15:06.119 --> 01:15:12.159
just it's all hypothesis at the start. But these hypothesis hypotheses have led me

917
01:15:12.439 --> 01:15:16.479
to interesting developments that now I will
tell you one thing. This will this

918
01:15:16.520 --> 01:15:20.319
will make you laugh. I have
to ask, though, did you recently

919
01:15:21.279 --> 01:15:28.760
put on Open Minds TV a blog
about the FAA and that one page they

920
01:15:28.800 --> 01:15:35.600
have about calling National UFO Reporting Center? Was that you? Yes, Yeah,

921
01:15:35.800 --> 01:15:40.479
so they release Yeah, they release
what they release everyone else. They

922
01:15:40.520 --> 01:15:45.560
release that that that it's a they
release that Air Operations manual that says,

923
01:15:45.800 --> 01:15:50.159
you know, pilots who ce UFOs
unless it's like unless they nearly crash,

924
01:15:50.279 --> 01:15:54.079
you know, but if it's pilot
sees the UFO, just call this number.

925
01:15:54.119 --> 01:15:58.359
Blah blah blah. Well, I've
got some good news for you.

926
01:15:58.520 --> 01:16:00.960
We've got a whole lot more out
of the f and I'm going to publish

927
01:16:01.000 --> 01:16:05.119
it as absolutely as soon as I
can. I'll leave you on a hook

928
01:16:05.159 --> 01:16:10.800
with that. But we pushed really
hard, hard, and they released a

929
01:16:10.840 --> 01:16:14.159
whole lot of stuff and it's really
interesting. I'll give you a clue.

930
01:16:14.640 --> 01:16:18.159
There is a form that FAA air
traffic controllers at certain sites, not all

931
01:16:18.199 --> 01:16:21.920
sites, but at certain types of
FAA sites, there is a form that

932
01:16:23.039 --> 01:16:29.640
an air traffic urgently and it is
a UFO pro former. It is a

933
01:16:29.680 --> 01:16:31.760
form that says, you know,
what station they were at, what time

934
01:16:31.800 --> 01:16:35.520
the UFO unknown unknown aircraft, what
time it appeared on radar, what time

935
01:16:35.520 --> 01:16:40.239
it disappeared on radar, what direction
it was going. Was it inbound to

936
01:16:40.239 --> 01:16:44.840
the United States, was it outbound? You know what e radar frequency was

937
01:16:44.840 --> 01:16:48.439
involved, that sort of stuff.
So that and a whole lot more they've

938
01:16:48.520 --> 01:16:51.239
released. Yeah, they've released a
whole lot of stuff. And it took

939
01:16:51.319 --> 01:16:56.039
us three years, but we forced
them. Yeah, we forced them.

940
01:16:56.680 --> 01:17:00.199
Well that's awesome. So I'm really
excited to hear more about that, and

941
01:17:00.239 --> 01:17:02.920
we'll definitely write something up and we'll
talk to you more about that. But

942
01:17:03.840 --> 01:17:08.680
this is cool because now we have
because to me, I guess maybe because

943
01:17:08.760 --> 01:17:15.319
I've done this and I understand,
uh, just what you've described sounds not

944
01:17:15.560 --> 01:17:20.680
like making it easy, but making
I mean, I understand the large amount

945
01:17:20.840 --> 01:17:27.680
of work because you have to make
so many requests in so many different ways

946
01:17:27.720 --> 01:17:31.319
to get documents, to find these
little scraps and crumbs, and and it

947
01:17:31.640 --> 01:17:38.159
literally bread clumbs that leads you to
the next steps. So I can appreciate

948
01:17:38.239 --> 01:17:42.159
the huge amount of work, uh
that what you're talking about has taken.

949
01:17:42.479 --> 01:17:45.680
Uh, and it's awesome that you're
doing it. This is so extremely exciting.

950
01:17:46.279 --> 01:17:48.880
Yeah, yeah, look at it. It is quite exciting. I

951
01:17:48.920 --> 01:17:51.399
mean is there's a lot of obviously
misses. I mean, at any one

952
01:17:51.520 --> 01:17:56.319
time, like I said, I've
got a friend in England called David Carmoichael

953
01:17:56.359 --> 01:17:59.399
who does it as well, and
at any one's time between the surls,

954
01:17:59.439 --> 01:18:02.680
we've got fifty FOI requests out or
thirty or whatever. I saw one funny

955
01:18:02.720 --> 01:18:06.840
thing once north Comb Noorad released a
log like a data b like a table

956
01:18:08.199 --> 01:18:13.399
of FOI requests for two thousand and
six, two thousand and fifteen, they

957
01:18:13.439 --> 01:18:16.840
released this this log and it's got
columns like date when an FOI request was

958
01:18:16.880 --> 01:18:21.000
sent to north Comb Noorad, and
then like the person who's like the surname

959
01:18:21.000 --> 01:18:25.319
of the person who's sent it in, and then you know if it was

960
01:18:25.359 --> 01:18:28.680
knocked back or if it's still pending
whatever, and when you go down the

961
01:18:28.800 --> 01:18:31.840
second column. The only thing that's
in there is our names that goes Carmichael,

962
01:18:31.840 --> 01:18:35.680
Carmichael, Carmichael, Dean, Dean, Carmichael, Dean like this.

963
01:18:35.760 --> 01:18:39.680
And it's really quite embarrassing because I'm
thinking, I'm just you know, in

964
01:18:39.680 --> 01:18:43.680
one sense, they must be so
frustrated. But you know, in another

965
01:18:43.720 --> 01:18:45.640
sense, you know, I think
that that, I mean, this is

966
01:18:45.680 --> 01:18:49.119
your I mean, the other thing
that gets me is I'm able I'm doing

967
01:18:49.119 --> 01:18:53.479
all this from Australia and he's my
friend's doing it all from England, and

968
01:18:53.479 --> 01:18:58.520
and I am a bit you know, they they must be a bit baffled

969
01:18:58.600 --> 01:19:01.079
about the effort we put into but
it does not done because I mean,

970
01:19:01.119 --> 01:19:05.760
in the end, if nothing else, like forgetting potential extraterrestrials or whatever,

971
01:19:05.800 --> 01:19:10.000
the fact is the matter. This
relates to your air safety, like you

972
01:19:10.039 --> 01:19:13.159
know it does. Actually, it
relates to the national defense systems. You

973
01:19:13.159 --> 01:19:16.079
know, it relates heavily to flight
safety, fair paying passengers. You know,

974
01:19:16.640 --> 01:19:20.159
you know probably you know Dick Haynes, Richard Haynes runs an arcup.

975
01:19:20.199 --> 01:19:24.000
I mean, he would tell you
black and blue that there has been so

976
01:19:24.079 --> 01:19:28.319
many near misses between objects that have
never been found that have shot off into

977
01:19:28.439 --> 01:19:30.479
space or what or you know,
like that have behaved weirdly, and you

978
01:19:30.479 --> 01:19:33.880
know, it is a serious issue. The other thing is is that you

979
01:19:33.920 --> 01:19:36.319
guys are paying for this, Like
if there is a cover up, well

980
01:19:36.399 --> 01:19:41.800
multiple little cover ups around the place, right Like, it's not coming out

981
01:19:41.800 --> 01:19:45.239
of their pockets. It's it's it's
something that you know, push comes to

982
01:19:45.319 --> 01:19:48.840
shove where it's twenty sixteen. This
this, these vast records have been around,

983
01:19:48.840 --> 01:19:53.720
particularly these really classified records have been
around since the seventies. Well,

984
01:19:53.960 --> 01:19:57.000
you guys are paying for it,
and you know, and it shouldn't be

985
01:19:57.119 --> 01:19:59.600
like this forever, you know.
I mean if I had someone had a

986
01:19:59.640 --> 01:20:03.199
seat in nineteen ninety that this this
this cape of this cat and mouse game

987
01:20:03.239 --> 01:20:08.079
will still be going on in twenty
sixteen. I think the likes of Timothy

988
01:20:08.119 --> 01:20:10.960
Good and you know, a young
Richard Dolan or whatever would have said,

989
01:20:10.960 --> 01:20:13.000
oh, baloney, it'll be all
out by then. Well it's not.

990
01:20:13.520 --> 01:20:15.439
And you guys are forking. You
guys are coughing up the bill for it.

991
01:20:15.960 --> 01:20:19.399
And so that's another thing is that, And I think it would let

992
01:20:19.399 --> 01:20:21.000
a lot of people off the hook. I mean, there must be a

993
01:20:21.039 --> 01:20:25.720
lot of colonels and admirals and majors
out there who are actually a little bit

994
01:20:25.720 --> 01:20:29.560
embarrassed about all this and at a
little bit awkward going home every night knowing

995
01:20:30.000 --> 01:20:32.920
that sometimes they're, you know,
one hundred and fifty million dollar combat jets

996
01:20:32.960 --> 01:20:36.760
are completely outrun by something that looks
like the shape of I don't know,

997
01:20:38.119 --> 01:20:41.840
a computer mouse. You know,
it's it's. It must be quite difficult

998
01:20:41.840 --> 01:20:45.319
for some of these people to keep
this from their families and so on.

999
01:20:46.359 --> 01:20:50.800
You know. So yeah, I
mean I know that a lot of them

1000
01:20:50.800 --> 01:20:56.960
are public servants. But you know, when the APA responds to Joan Greenwalden

1001
01:20:57.000 --> 01:21:00.000
says, the only UFO document they
have is that one piece of a manual.

1002
01:21:00.399 --> 01:21:04.560
That's that's disingenuous, it's dishonest.
It's it's and you know, I

1003
01:21:04.560 --> 01:21:10.079
think it can't be interpreted as as
a lie. And just like you have

1004
01:21:10.199 --> 01:21:14.520
demonstrated here, you know when the
Air Force or they say they're not looking

1005
01:21:14.680 --> 01:21:18.520
at UFOs, and it's not true. They are looking at unknown targets,

1006
01:21:18.680 --> 01:21:25.079
unknown tracks. Uh, but they're
not sharing that information or sharing what you've

1007
01:21:25.119 --> 01:21:30.279
discovered these these channels. Uh,
that these reports are getting funneled to and

1008
01:21:30.279 --> 01:21:33.079
and I would and I guess my
last question I was gonna, uh save

1009
01:21:33.159 --> 01:21:39.640
this but because we're running over but
would be I mean, all of the

1010
01:21:39.720 --> 01:21:44.319
name changes of these departments, Uh, why is that happening? It almost

1011
01:21:44.359 --> 01:21:50.760
seems like that also can help serve
to keep uh this information out of the

1012
01:21:50.800 --> 01:21:54.840
public eye. End that. Yeah, it is a really I think a

1013
01:21:54.880 --> 01:21:58.119
lot of it's not Look, a
lot of it's budgetary, a lot of

1014
01:21:58.119 --> 01:22:00.199
it's physical, a lot of it's
a malgamiting. You might get two squadrons

1015
01:22:00.239 --> 01:22:04.199
like I don't know, the eleventh
nineteenth Night Fighting Squadron and the eleventh nineteenth

1016
01:22:04.319 --> 01:22:08.720
ninth Fighting Support Squadron, which are
really the same thing. They you know,

1017
01:22:08.880 --> 01:22:13.479
they emerge them to make something like
the eleventh nineteenth Composite Squadron or something

1018
01:22:13.520 --> 01:22:15.680
like that. A lot of it, a lot of it is to save

1019
01:22:15.760 --> 01:22:19.039
money into streamline. But yeah,
look, there is definitely this frustration where

1020
01:22:19.279 --> 01:22:23.800
you do wonder, I mean you
do wonder if the constant name changes,

1021
01:22:23.840 --> 01:22:27.840
the base changes. Like you know, there's one really suspicious squadron that used

1022
01:22:27.880 --> 01:22:31.000
to be at Hill Air Force Base
called eighty fourth Radar Evaluation Squadron. We've

1023
01:22:31.039 --> 01:22:35.119
just found out it's up and left
now to lack to Langley Air Force Base

1024
01:22:36.199 --> 01:22:42.920
in I think Virginia wherever it is
near CIA headquarters. Now, you know,

1025
01:22:43.039 --> 01:22:45.560
you just think you're onto something.
You've got a full address that you

1026
01:22:45.640 --> 01:22:47.399
can write to on a phone number, and all of a sudden you find

1027
01:22:47.399 --> 01:22:53.399
out that they've done a runner on
you. So that, yeah, it

1028
01:22:53.479 --> 01:22:56.319
is very very difficult. They can
light to you. I mean when you

1029
01:22:56.399 --> 01:22:58.840
say, they can light you in
the brick blink of an eye and say

1030
01:22:58.920 --> 01:23:01.199
no, that organization does not exist, when really what they mean is,

1031
01:23:01.199 --> 01:23:04.800
well, the organization technically doesn't exist, but it just changed its name,

1032
01:23:05.159 --> 01:23:10.479
you know, like yeah, or
it became you know, or it changed

1033
01:23:10.520 --> 01:23:13.239
its code, or it moved address
or something like that. That's that's frustrating.

1034
01:23:13.359 --> 01:23:15.600
That's where it's got to be on
your toes. It is very boring.

1035
01:23:15.680 --> 01:23:17.680
People people say that, like I
talk like this, and people say

1036
01:23:17.680 --> 01:23:20.920
to me, how can you be
bothered? This is just remembering all these

1037
01:23:20.960 --> 01:23:27.199
acronyms and these addresses and all these
database names and these you know, names

1038
01:23:27.199 --> 01:23:30.359
of frigdier generals and major generals and
stuff, and it is actually very bored.

1039
01:23:30.399 --> 01:23:34.920
It is very very very you know, it's a real head. It's

1040
01:23:35.039 --> 01:23:40.239
very, very very dense, and
and sometimes I don't even enjoy it.

1041
01:23:41.159 --> 01:23:43.239
I will tell I know where over
time. But I will tell you one

1042
01:23:43.279 --> 01:23:47.000
other thing. We've also found.
So if as you've heard of cases where

1043
01:23:47.039 --> 01:23:54.239
possibly combat jets or aerial refuels or
whatever have have crashed, like where you've

1044
01:23:54.279 --> 01:24:00.199
got an aircraft crash where potentially UFOs
have been involved, so mantel the mantelent

1045
01:24:00.319 --> 01:24:03.520
is one. I think it was
probably a skyhook balloon, but it might

1046
01:24:03.560 --> 01:24:08.119
not have been. The Walesville crash
in New York definitely related to a UFO

1047
01:24:08.199 --> 01:24:13.039
of some sort. We've actually found
where those files are kept. How's that

1048
01:24:14.319 --> 01:24:17.079
So, if there's any UFOs that
have slammed into planes, they are currently

1049
01:24:17.119 --> 01:24:24.079
they were kept at the Norton Air
Force Base Air Safety Inspection Center. That's

1050
01:24:24.199 --> 01:24:27.720
as I was saying before, that's
actually moved to Kirkland Air Force Base and

1051
01:24:27.880 --> 01:24:31.079
is now called the Air Safety Agency. I think so their files date back

1052
01:24:31.119 --> 01:24:35.760
to nineteen fifty two. And in
those files there is a certain section of

1053
01:24:35.800 --> 01:24:41.079
the file called the border of proceedings, and in the border proceedings is described

1054
01:24:41.119 --> 01:24:46.399
circumstances around the actual aircraft mishapp or
crash or loss or whatever, and that's

1055
01:24:46.399 --> 01:24:49.880
apparently we've got it on. Good
word is there are some cases that definitely

1056
01:24:49.880 --> 01:24:56.840
involve UFOs. So you've got American
military aircraft that are potentially being lost or

1057
01:24:56.840 --> 01:25:00.680
have been lost in the past,
and these were are certainly not released.

1058
01:25:00.840 --> 01:25:03.319
I can assure you of that,
even to Congress, even to the Armed

1059
01:25:03.319 --> 01:25:11.640
Services Committee. So yeah, another
interesting lead. Wow, Well, thank

1060
01:25:11.680 --> 01:25:14.560
you so much for coming on and
sharing all of this. Of course,

1061
01:25:14.600 --> 01:25:18.239
we'll definitely be in contact, and
I'm sure the listeners just like me,

1062
01:25:18.399 --> 01:25:23.840
are feeling like they want to hear
and talk about more. But I mean,

1063
01:25:23.880 --> 01:25:28.319
an hour flew by, and we're
able to scratch your surface. But

1064
01:25:28.760 --> 01:25:33.840
you know what you've done here because
I've always been fascinated and always I felt

1065
01:25:33.880 --> 01:25:38.920
that, you know, curious about
Space Command's role, nor Rad's role,

1066
01:25:39.079 --> 01:25:44.800
and where that information goes from Norrad
uh and and a lot of people who

1067
01:25:45.039 --> 01:25:48.159
who follow those leads kind of feel
like we've followed it as far as we

1068
01:25:48.239 --> 01:25:53.920
can. But that's what's great about
what you're doing. You're following it further.

1069
01:25:54.039 --> 01:25:59.000
Yeah, so that's really exciting because
that kind of opens up layers of

1070
01:25:59.039 --> 01:26:02.760
the onion, the more avenues to
pursue. Yeah. Yeah, look,

1071
01:26:02.800 --> 01:26:05.720
we are very very determined. I
am, I am very aggressive about this.

1072
01:26:05.760 --> 01:26:10.680
I actually got an email from Strategic
Command the other day and at the

1073
01:26:10.760 --> 01:26:14.880
final words were it was over a
particular matter. It was over where certain

1074
01:26:14.920 --> 01:26:18.439
records were kept, certain records from
the one Command and Control squadron were kept,

1075
01:26:18.479 --> 01:26:24.079
and he actually I've just been harassing
and saying, you know, but

1076
01:26:24.159 --> 01:26:28.840
anyway, the final email said,
mister Dean, I will not discuss these

1077
01:26:28.880 --> 01:26:31.600
records any further. Like so then
you start another I mean, the other

1078
01:26:31.680 --> 01:26:34.720
day, I've got an email from
NORAD saying will you call us? That's

1079
01:26:34.800 --> 01:26:38.920
really weird. Like I sent an
email to NORAD. It was a public

1080
01:26:38.960 --> 01:26:42.479
relations inquiry. I asked a bunch
of very specific questions. The email me

1081
01:26:42.560 --> 01:26:46.720
back immediately saying saying, I think
it's best if you call us. Asked

1082
01:26:46.760 --> 01:26:50.399
to speak to mister whoever on this
number, and that's the person you need

1083
01:26:50.439 --> 01:26:54.920
to speak to. They won't even
sometimes they frightened to put stuff in writing.

1084
01:26:55.680 --> 01:27:00.000
They are they are sick of it. But but yeah, yeah,

1085
01:27:00.039 --> 01:27:02.159
yeah, so it does happen.
It's it is unusual. It does happen.

1086
01:27:02.479 --> 01:27:05.800
But what's interesting, Like I say, I mean, I wouldn't be

1087
01:27:05.800 --> 01:27:09.640
I wouldn't spend another moment on this
if I thought there was nothing to it.

1088
01:27:09.800 --> 01:27:12.800
And like I say, it's it's
it's your you guys are paying for

1089
01:27:12.840 --> 01:27:15.560
it, and it is your airspace. And one of these days when a

1090
01:27:15.640 --> 01:27:19.039
UFO does slam into a Pactsivia airliner
over you know, a huge urban area,

1091
01:27:20.279 --> 01:27:25.039
then then there's going to have to
be some really serious questions to be

1092
01:27:25.079 --> 01:27:29.279
answered. M m. Yeah.
Well, and the US is tasked with

1093
01:27:30.600 --> 01:27:33.720
the defense of some all of our
allies, yeah, yeah, yeah,

1094
01:27:33.800 --> 01:27:38.840
yeah, taking a lead to it
is the interest also of everyone in the

1095
01:27:38.880 --> 01:27:43.640
world, particularly Canada and particularly in
the Middle East around all the Air Operations

1096
01:27:43.640 --> 01:27:48.479
Center in Iraq, Afghanistan, NATO
allies, the Mediterranean Fleet of the Navy,

1097
01:27:48.520 --> 01:27:51.560
the Atlantic Fleet of US Navy.
Yeah, I mean it is.

1098
01:27:51.640 --> 01:27:56.479
It is a serious issue. I
mean yeah, So there you go.

1099
01:27:57.119 --> 01:27:59.960
All right, Well, thank you
so much for getting up in the morning

1100
01:28:00.079 --> 01:28:02.640
and talking to us. And of
course people can go see a lot of

1101
01:28:03.279 --> 01:28:09.319
material and your top story, like
you said, you just released us yesterday

1102
01:28:09.760 --> 01:28:13.960
about op Rep three is on the
front page of your site. And that's

1103
01:28:14.399 --> 01:28:19.079
UFO's Documenting the Evidence. You can
google that and find it. Otherwise it's

1104
01:28:19.199 --> 01:28:25.960
UFOs dash Documenting Dash the Evidence or
the dash Evidence you know, dot bugspot,

1105
01:28:26.000 --> 01:28:30.119
dot com dot au. But we'll
also of course put a link in

1106
01:28:30.359 --> 01:28:35.279
the the show notes. So thank
you so much. That's all right,

1107
01:28:35.560 --> 01:28:38.960
okay, thanks to you. Celendro. Is that how I saw your name?

1108
01:28:39.680 --> 01:28:43.039
I can't say it. You said
it pretty well just now, Eleandro,

1109
01:28:43.560 --> 01:28:46.800
my axcent is quot strong. Yeah, that's no problem. It's fun

1110
01:28:46.840 --> 01:28:50.600
to hear the different ways that people
say it. Be gets to be completely

1111
01:28:50.600 --> 01:28:55.359
honest, and people who speak Spanish
will tell you this. I don't even

1112
01:28:55.359 --> 01:29:00.560
say my name correctly as at least
as far as from the Spanish, so

1113
01:29:00.560 --> 01:29:05.239
so no problem. Okay, thanks
hey, sele Andre, thank you so

1114
01:29:05.479 --> 01:29:12.119
much for Paul being on the show. That was a really I found his

1115
01:29:12.279 --> 01:29:16.239
interview fascinating And if you want to
find out more about this, you can

1116
01:29:16.279 --> 01:29:23.720
go to that UFOs Documenting the Evidence
blog Paul Dean and he's got some information

1117
01:29:23.880 --> 01:29:28.159
up there too. Also watch our
website because we are planning on working together

1118
01:29:28.199 --> 01:29:30.439
and getting more of his stuff up
there, and as soon as I can,

1119
01:29:30.479 --> 01:29:34.000
I'll write some more about this op
Rep. Three. What's great about

1120
01:29:34.000 --> 01:29:38.279
Paul two is when I talked to
him, even these documents I haven't seen,

1121
01:29:38.319 --> 01:29:41.640
He'll be quick to tell me I'm
not the first to find this document

1122
01:29:41.720 --> 01:29:45.960
these people did or those people did, which is really cool because, like

1123
01:29:45.000 --> 01:29:47.319
we talked about, even when I
felt, you know, it's the first

1124
01:29:47.319 --> 01:29:53.520
one to receive some documents, I
did some more research and found out that

1125
01:29:54.319 --> 01:29:59.079
others had found them also in the
past, just not promoted them, or

1126
01:30:00.159 --> 01:30:02.600
just you know, had different things
they were looking for, because sometimes we

1127
01:30:02.640 --> 01:30:06.720
all run across this stuff when we're
looking for something else. So I think

1128
01:30:06.760 --> 01:30:10.640
this is great. Like I said
at the beginning of the show, sometimes

1129
01:30:10.720 --> 01:30:15.880
you feel like you are up against
a brick wall as to who's doing what.

1130
01:30:15.199 --> 01:30:17.560
And that's what I want to know. You know, we can claim

1131
01:30:17.680 --> 01:30:21.119
that, oh, you know,
the government's doing this or that, but

1132
01:30:21.680 --> 01:30:26.880
we really need to dig to figure
out more. And I just am confident

1133
01:30:27.039 --> 01:30:33.279
that that we can. I think
it's John Alexander puts it a good way.

1134
01:30:33.399 --> 01:30:38.479
He says, you know, for
a lot of UFO researchers, you

1135
01:30:38.520 --> 01:30:42.439
can't have it both ways. You
can't assume the military is a bunch of

1136
01:30:42.439 --> 01:30:45.960
idiots and they can't figure out this
or that, or they can't figure out

1137
01:30:45.000 --> 01:30:49.720
what to do with this phenomena.
But at the same time, say that

1138
01:30:49.760 --> 01:30:56.479
these same people you think are are
idiots are so vastly more intelligent than anyone

1139
01:30:56.520 --> 01:31:00.439
else that they're able to hide this
all up so no one else can see

1140
01:31:00.439 --> 01:31:01.960
it. There's there's got to be
an in between, and as time goes

1141
01:31:02.000 --> 01:31:08.600
on, we ought to get like
what Paul's getting as these breadcrumbs to follow

1142
01:31:08.880 --> 01:31:14.920
what's going on where? And that's
what's interesting. Where are the files going?

1143
01:31:15.000 --> 01:31:17.960
I mean Martin and I and and
you know when we have people on

1144
01:31:18.000 --> 01:31:23.319
these shows, we're talking about this
so often, is where are these reports

1145
01:31:23.359 --> 01:31:27.920
going? And I think Paul Deane's
onto something to figure out where they're going,

1146
01:31:28.239 --> 01:31:31.159
And he says he's also onto where
pictures and videos might be going.

1147
01:31:31.359 --> 01:31:35.119
And you figure that out and then
you're able to foil these and get some

1148
01:31:35.159 --> 01:31:42.479
more information. So really fascinating stuff. You know, this is the real

1149
01:31:42.960 --> 01:31:48.039
research. I've been told by someone
who is out there purporting that you know,

1150
01:31:48.680 --> 01:31:55.560
aliens are here and everybody knows it. And I ask him, how

1151
01:31:55.600 --> 01:31:59.359
do you know this? And in
how are you going to prove to you

1152
01:31:59.399 --> 01:32:01.159
know, Paul that this is a
case, and he says, he tells

1153
01:32:01.199 --> 01:32:06.359
them, just google, Google it
and you'll find it. Well, google

1154
01:32:06.399 --> 01:32:09.520
it and you're gonna find a lot
of crap out there. You're going to

1155
01:32:09.600 --> 01:32:14.840
find a lot of junk, and
so it's hard to decipher what's not junk

1156
01:32:15.319 --> 01:32:18.479
from what is legit stuff. And
that's what we're trying to do here on

1157
01:32:18.520 --> 01:32:24.520
the show every week and with the
rest of our stuff. So so thank

1158
01:32:24.600 --> 01:32:28.279
you so much for joining us again. Again, I apologize for the day

1159
01:32:28.600 --> 01:32:33.199
or for the show coming out a
day later, and thank you so much

1160
01:32:33.239 --> 01:32:38.319
to the people who donate and help
with the show. So, for instance,

1161
01:32:38.479 --> 01:32:43.159
thank you to Martin Willis and his
show podcast UFO. Thank you to

1162
01:32:44.439 --> 01:32:47.039
Caleb Hanks for doing the music at
the beginning and the end of the show.

1163
01:32:47.079 --> 01:32:51.279
Caleb's music is really cool. If
you go to Openminds dot tv and

1164
01:32:51.319 --> 01:32:55.079
to the radio page, you'll find
a link to more of his stuff.

1165
01:32:55.319 --> 01:33:00.239
You're also going to find a bunch
of new ads all over our website site

1166
01:33:00.359 --> 01:33:03.720
for the UFO Video portal. The
portal, we've really beefed up. We're

1167
01:33:03.720 --> 01:33:09.800
adding videos every day and now there
are tons and tons of videos up there

1168
01:33:09.840 --> 01:33:13.119
for people to watch, so,
you know, for it's like the Netflix

1169
01:33:13.159 --> 01:33:15.439
of UFOs. For one low fee, you're gonna get to watch all of

1170
01:33:15.479 --> 01:33:20.760
this incredible stuff, including all of
the lectures from the twenty sixteen conference.

1171
01:33:21.159 --> 01:33:26.399
The other speaking of the UFO Congress. The other ads you're going to see

1172
01:33:26.399 --> 01:33:30.359
out there are ads for the UFO
Congress. We are beginning to take registration.

1173
01:33:31.399 --> 01:33:35.279
You know, I haven't been really
pushing that big time because I'm still

1174
01:33:35.279 --> 01:33:40.319
working on getting the speakers. But
I will have names out soon, and

1175
01:33:40.399 --> 01:33:45.760
I gave you a name last week
actually, haha, just for you radio

1176
01:33:45.800 --> 01:33:49.239
listeners, you got a little sneak
peek into our speakers for the UFO Congress

1177
01:33:49.279 --> 01:33:53.840
this year, or at least one. But I'm very excited about that speaker,

1178
01:33:54.039 --> 01:33:56.920
and I'm very excited about the other
speakers that we're going to have,

1179
01:33:57.000 --> 01:34:00.920
and I think you will be too, So stay tuned for that. Go

1180
01:34:00.079 --> 01:34:04.840
check out openminds dot tv for the
latest. There you'll find a links to

1181
01:34:04.920 --> 01:34:11.680
the UFO Congress. And as you
know, as many people know, more

1182
01:34:11.720 --> 01:34:15.960
and more people are registering early because
they just have faith that we are going

1183
01:34:15.000 --> 01:34:19.159
to have good speakers. And thank
you for that, and and that's why

1184
01:34:19.199 --> 01:34:24.239
we work so hard to make sure
that you all are not disappointed, and

1185
01:34:24.439 --> 01:34:27.159
I don't believe you will be.
So this is going to be a great

1186
01:34:27.239 --> 01:34:32.239
year, another great year. Really
really excited about that. I'm always excited

1187
01:34:32.279 --> 01:34:36.399
about stuff, aren't I. But
there's a lot of exciting things going on.

1188
01:34:36.880 --> 01:34:40.760
You know, some people talk about
how this field is dead or there

1189
01:34:40.840 --> 01:34:44.760
isn't anything going on, but you
know, Martin and I never have a

1190
01:34:44.840 --> 01:34:46.920
lack of things to talk about at
the beginning of the show when we're just

1191
01:34:47.039 --> 01:34:53.560
reviewing the week, and of course
myself and my guests never have a lack

1192
01:34:53.600 --> 01:34:58.880
of things to talk about, so
there's always stuff going on and interesting things,

1193
01:34:58.920 --> 01:35:04.399
so it it's not dead by any
means. So thank you all for

1194
01:35:04.520 --> 01:35:09.920
keeping things alive and returning each week
to listen to the show. Be sure

1195
01:35:09.960 --> 01:35:13.279
to check out our YouTube channel for
our u a full report so you can

1196
01:35:13.319 --> 01:35:16.279
see some of these pictures and videos
that Martin and I refer to, and

1197
01:35:16.359 --> 01:35:20.520
of course you can see all of
it on Openminds dot TV. Thank you

1198
01:35:20.560 --> 01:35:26.159
all so much for listening. We'll
talk to you again next week. Audios,

1199
01:35:26.359 --> 01:36:19.119
move chuchos, your motionless sound the
glasses of hurry