Paul ask alright, alright, alright, alright, alright, that's enough of
that. Hey, everybody, welcome to the podcast. My name is Paul
Abernathy, your host, and welcome to the Let's Ask Paul podcast, where
you submit questions to me about the National Electrical Code. And of course you
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right, folks, We have a great show fee tonight. We are going
to be looking at a question two questions that were submitted through the portal,
and I think they're beneficial for everybody because again, sometimes some of the easiest
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night's episode. So we have a question that was submitted through the portal,
and I'm going to tell you up front, I looked at this question and
there's some stuff missing. So whoever wrote this question, let me give you
some advice, and I want to answer your question. I'm gonna do my
best, but there are so many variables that come into play here, and
you're not giving all of the information. So what happens is people come out
of a test and they aren't They can't really remember everything that was on the
question. They only remember pieces of it, and then they try to regurgitate
it and it's really hard, and sometimes it does you a disservice by trying
to get into your head because if you leave some of the information off,
it can totally change the answer. So let me go and read the question
and you'll kind of see that there's some information that is lacking here. But
do our best to try to dissect something for you, at least give you
direction. How about that, because I want to give you some direction in
here. So okay, it says here's my question. It says, hello,
I had a question on my code test and I failed. It said
the sixty five amps seventy five degree fahrenheit ten six THW the maximum demand factor
is question mark and says if that makes sense, I can't figure it out.
What video do I watch? Thinks, okay, well, the first
thing here is you've got some information missing. Now we get it. You
said sixty five amps seventy five degree fahrenheit, but typically sixty five amps for
the six gage is what you're asking about is going to be under the seventy
five degree C column, right, So that's typically the first thing. Now,
you didn't give a condition of use, whether it's a wet or dry
because THHW is listed under both seventy five and ninety, so you didn't really
give us the condition. So we're gonna have to figure that that seventy five
degrees fahrenheit is really supposed to be seventy five degrees celsius. And so we're
going to solve this question the first way by saying, because it's only asking
for what's the maximum demand factor? So we're going to try to solve it
the way we think you want it to be solved. So it's sixty five
amps. If you go to table three ten sixteen, which is the ampacity
table in the twenty twenty edition of the National Electrical Code. You'll notice that
under the six gage is good for sixty five amps under the seventy five degree
column. Now, so taking out the fact that you said seventy five degrees
F when I think you met C, we're gonna look at it from from
that perspective as if you're just talking at seventy five sixty five amps at seventy
five degrees C. Okay, So now, if that's the case, that
sixty five amp rated conductor under the seventy five degree column is going to be
reduced in a capacity because of what's called mutual heating from all these bundled conductors.
And so that's going to take you to Table three ten fifteen C one.
That C is in Charlie one, and that is the adjustment factors for
more than three current carring conductors. Now, it didn't really say in here
that they were current carrying conductors or not, but typically these kind of questions
are asking for that, So we're going to have to assume that it's current
current conductors. Right, So that detail was left out, but sometimes that
can be left out in exams. They just assume you know that they're all
going to be carrying current, which may or may not be the case.
But anyway, if you're doing this, it's pretty simple. If you have
ten sixes in this raceway, and we assume it's a raceway because they didn't
say that in the question anywhere, If I have ten six thhws in the
raceway, then I'm going to go to and we know the impacity sixty five
amps because of the seventy five three column in three ten sixteen the table.
Then if you go to three ten fifteen C one, you'll notice that the
number of conductors ten to twenty, that the percentage or basically your demand value
is fifty percent. So that means a conductor that is sixty five amps has
approximately half that amount of current carrying ability due to mutual heating, so it's
thirty two point five amps. So those conductors are effectively been reduced from sixty
five amps of current carrying ability down to thirty two point five amps of current
carrying ability. Okay, that's what the conductor now has because of that mutual
heating, because of the bundling, but because of the results of table three
ten fifteen C one. Okay, So on your exam they've could have if
they were asking you for percentages or values, then your answer would have been
fifty percent. Okay, because that's within three ten fifteen c one for ten
sixes and it started out at sixty five amps, but now it's good for
thirty two point five amps each conductor. By the way, Okay, now
let's take this in a different direction and get kind of funky with it.
Right. If we're if this question actually said that it's sixty five amps,
and maybe it was seventy five degree fahrenheit environment and it was ten sixes,
well, then we have to look at it in a different, different way,
right, because I want to have the ability to potentially use the ninety
ampacity for my adjustment and correction. Right now, I know the amps are
under one hundred, but the conductor is a THHW, so to verify that,
I like to tell people, let's go on and go and look just
so we can kind of deconstruct this, because again, not enough information was
really given to us. But I like to like to deconstruct things. Y'all
know that, let's go look and see what it says undertable three ten dot
four A for THHHW. Let's just go look and see what that says.
Okay, for those that have your codebook and you go to three ten dot
four and you'll look at it, and you'll start to notice that when you
just look at THHW. As I said before, there is a wet location
rating for seventy five and there's a dry location rating for ninety. Okay,
so this is important. Your question didn't stipulate that. So if it doesn't
stipulate that, then then we're gonna go with the seventy five because it is
the lesser the weaker. And of course, since you didn't give terminal limitations
on any of the terminations, then we'll follow the rules and one ten fourteen
C one A, and then we'll go down and say, well, since
it is marked THHHW, then we're able to use the seventy five. So
we follow that logic train. So that's how it got us into the seventy
five. But nothing in your question can get me personally, can get me
to the ninety degrees C to be able to use that value for the adjustment.
I just can't get there. So that's why I'm locked at the seventy
five. Okay, makes sense, right, So when looking at that I'm
going to have to say, well, it's it's seventy five, and I
did mind from the seventy five. Now, if it's sixty five amps and
the ambient temperature is seventy five degrees fahrenheit, then we're going to incorporate a
different table. Hey, we're going to be looking at and let me get
it up on here. We're gonna be looking at three ten all right,
hold on, let me pull it back up. We're gonna be looking at
three ten dot fifteen B one because that is the ambient temperature correction, and
so this says seventy five degrees fahreheit. So if we look down the fahrenheit
scale that we see that it's sixty nine two seventy seven, and we would
be using one point zero five as our ambient correction. Now you notice that
means that it's below the eighty six degrees fahrenheit, which is what table three
ten sixteen is all about. So you're actually going to get some extra amps
because of the cooling effect. Okay, So if we did it that way,
we'd be plugging it a little bit different. And how we would do
this, Okay, we would do sixty five times and that would be times
one point zero five times fifty point five zero, Okay, And that's how
we would do it in order to see what that conductor actually is. So
let's kind of do that and see what it is. And that's just the
conductor. That's not what your question asks, because your question asked what is
the maximum demand factor? And I believe we've already done that, because I
beli that seventy five was supposed to be seventy five C for sixty five amps
because that makes more sense. But I'm playing the devil's advocate here. Is
just so you learned the question is how important it is to give me the
details. We're going to assume that seventy five degrees F is the ambient and
see what it comes out at. And if we do the math, it
actually comes out to thirty four point one two, so not a big difference
from thirty two point five to thirty four. You got a little bit more
because it was a cooler ambient. It was lower than the thirty degrees clcs
eighty six degrees Fahrenhek. Right, Again, that's really not what your question
was. I believe that the question was basically sixty five amps at seventy five
degrees C ten six gages THHW in a race way. What's the demand factor
and it should be fifty percent. That's what I think your question was.
Now at the end of the day, if you want to learn how I
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Look for de Rating Demystified, and that's going to tell you everything you
need to know about adjustment and corrections. But I've tried to dissect your question,
and since it's only asking about the maximum demand factor and it talks about
ten sixes, that's why I sent you to three ten fifteen C one and
that's why the answer would be fifty percent. But I also worked it out
as if it was seventy five degrees fahrenheit ambient and how you would do that
as well, because that means you would go to table three ten fifteen B
one. Okay, that sounds confusing, then you need to watch the derating
demystified video. Folks. All right, so hopefully I answered that question for
you. Great question. The only thing I ask from people for exam questions.
Please try your best to be specific. I get it when you leave
an exam, it's hard to remember things, but I need the details,
the details in matter. Is it a wet location, is it a dry
location? Is it in a race way? Is what cycle? What edition
of the code you're on? All of the details matter because I want to
get you the best answer possible. That's it. I can't read your mind,
and I can't read what these other people put on tests, so I
do my best. So hopefully you got something out of that. Polked.
Until next time, Stay safe, God Bless, and remember go listen to
us on all of your favorite podcasting listening stations. Until next time, Stay
safe, God Bless has open