Hello, and welcome to this episode of Superhero Ethics. Friends. We're rushing
this episode out to you because the last episode of the Disney Plus live action
Percy Jackson has just been released. Recording this on January thirty first, and
I'm recording it just a few hours later with the hope that it's going to
be in your earbuds tomorrow Thursday. So we want to get a quick turnaround
on this. And for the next couple of weeks, the Superhero Ethics schedule
is gonna be a little bit off kilter. We're gonna put out episodes when
we can. We're gonna mostly stick to a normal schedule, but this one's
gonna come out soon, and then we're also gonna be having a bunch of
episodes right when the new version of Avatar the Last Airbender comes out. Today.
We're all about doing reviewing the live actions of children's classic shows that people
are excited about nervous about. And for this I've got two great guests.
I've got Alex Corman, who is one of my regular guests on the Storre
Wars Universe podcast, and Amelia Love, who is a first time guest on
here but has been someone I've been talking about Percy Jackson with for quite some
time, including during the show, and I knew I really wanted their opinions
and feedback during this episode. So Amelia, let me start with you before
you talk about the show, talk about the books and what they meant to
you. So I got into Percy Jackson actually, like during the pandemic,
Like I'd read the first one, you know, back in middle high school
when they started coming out for me, and then never really picked him up
again. And then during the pandemic, I kept seeing tiktoks about them and
it made me download them all on my kindle and it was just a progressively
read all that had been released back to back, like I read it through
them. And it was at the same time that the last Trial of Apollo
book was coming out, so I read up to that book and then had
like a week before that one came out. Yes, so I got to
read basically fifteen in a row, which was insane, and I did that
in about two weeks. And what do you think it was about the books,
the characters, the writing that we drew you in so much. I
really loved like just the overall found family throughout all of the different Percy Jackson
series, but specifically, you know, the foundation it builds with Annabeth and
Grover and Percy in the first book, and then later on with more characters
as it grows. But I really just liked that how it was done,
like it was like everyone had their flaws and you know, there were issues
between everyone, but it all worked out and along the way, you know,
you get this, you know, retelling of Greek mythology in a very
child way, which you have to it's Greek mythology, but you know,
I think that gets kids interested too. You know, you start with the
Percy Jackson books and then you end up you know, studying on your own
can lead to things. Yeah, I'm totally with you there. I think
I might have started reading them a little before the pandemic, or it might
even during the pandemic. But I know one of the things that really drew
me in was that I think this is part of why I was being talked
about so much on TikTok. Actually I think I discovered it earlier, but
it's talked about for similar reasons. Is that was around the time when more
and more people were starting to realize to what a terrible person JK. Rowling
was, and we're starting to realize, like I think I had gone through,
Like the last wave of that was when I discovered Percy Jackson. But
a lot of people were talking about Percy Jackson and the books in part because
the author, Rick Rordon is like super queer positive, really does a lot
to bringing people of color into his books and draw it like when he wrote
a trans character in a book, he like worked a lot with other trans
authors to cover things like that, and so I kept seeing these things where
he was presented as this sort of like you know, all the boay of
the Harry Potter world, because United is kind of a similar thing of like
a bunch of kids coming together and sharing the fact that they have these magical
abilities, and they're all in different kind of communities based on their parents or
things like or their beliefs or things like that, in this case their parents.
So it kind of hits a similar niche but with a much different perspective
in that is both true of the author but also true of the books.
And so for reheat for me, I think all the things you talked about
the found family, I guess they're all cousins but they have still found family
dynamics. Getting to see the kid's age. I think that was told really
well. But also it just hit at a time when I was really hungry
for more of this and feeling really betrayed that the Hair of Potty books I
loved so much, I was now seeing through very different eyes. So it
really meant a lot to me to find this new thing. Alex, what
up for you? Yeah? I I read them as they came out.
My mom got me the first book when he came out in two thousand and
five, and I was about eight years old. I was really like the
perfect age for these books, and like, this is pretty this is my
favorite book series of all time. I grew up with the characters, you
know. Every few years. Every year or two, when a new book
came out, my mom would take me to Borders, which was the Barnes
and Noble equivalent back of the day, and we'd get the book right when
it came out and I would stay up all night reading it. Like I
never had that experience with the Harry Potter books a lot of other people had
growing up. I was just a little too young for it. And Priscy
Jackson was which is my It was my thing and and and my my friends
all really got into it. And it's just I connected so deeply with Percy
on so many different levels. I mean, I to the stay am very
adhd. But you know as a kid, I was adhd, you know,
working through and I wouldever I would never like a problem in schools,
but like you know, teachers having to work with me and my parents about
me being too impulsive and too like you know, just it's kind of crazy
and it's just a lot of like the things that Percy described. I basically
convinced myself that I was a demigod. Like I was like, I'm I
checked every box on the which you have just laid in front of me.
I have to be. And I also like I've also always my whole life
felt very connected to water and felt very like safe and and and special like
like I don't know, I feel special inside when I'm in water, and
so I And that was even before I read this book. So I was
like, oh my god, on Percy's brother, I got even the stud
of like eight year old me. It was a convinced that like I was
the demigod. And I just I grew up with them, and then when
the uh I can't remember what the sequel series was called, but the Heroes
of Olympus, when those came out, I read them always they came out.
I did not read the Trials of Apollo. I read it. I
like I read it. I've skimmed the first book a bit. I just
I care mostly about stories that really set are around Percy. And I thought
that I'm against the Apollo books at all. I think I'll read them eventually.
I just haven't gotten to it yet. But I've reread the Originals and
the Heroes of Olympus countless times. Well, I think when you you mentioned
the uh Apollo books, I think you're actually thinking about the Heroes of Rome
books, right, because we don't really have a whole series of apollollows is
five books. Yeah, there's the Trials of Apollo. It's a five book
series on Apollo. It's the third one. Oh okay, No, I
haven't cleared I here, here's the Olympics. Is the Roman one. So
that's why the Roman oh okay crossed over? Which I really the first book
I did it love in that series, but the other four I loved.
But actually I still have my original five Percy Jackson books I had from growing
up with all the same terrors and little marks and stuff I made in them,
which I think is special. But yeah, in Percy Jockson is like
extremely important to my identity. Yeah, well, I love that, and
I love that we have a couple of different perspectives here in terms of when
we discovered Percy Jackson and what these characters have meant to us. And so
let me then for the next question. I think a lot of us had
some trepidation about, uh a live action version of these books because there had
been a little bit of live action already. H that not everyone loves.
UH. So for both of you, what'd you guys think of the lot
action movie if you've seen it. There's two of them actually, and they're
both ass So I actually did not curse in this one, Matthews is fine.
I want to I want kids you'll listen to it, especially to Percy
Jackson, so we'll keep the language fairly family friendly. But as is fine.
Okay, okay, okay. I actually watched the movies before I read
the books, because I remember when they came out so and even then I
knew they were bad. I was like, this is like, oh wow.
I was like, these are not going to do good and then they
didn't. And I feel like they were really just trying to contend with the
competition at the time. Yeah, like they were silly and they were Yeah,
they pushed him out though, I think, yeah, I just I
just did that. The entire fact that the three main characters were all in
their twenties, they're running around just immediately, just listen. I love Logan
Laherman, but that you too, that was not the best move. Yeah,
I was a big stand for to be the Poseidon in this series.
Yet I get it. But I think it's a common thing that that happens
when there's books that are about kids who are like just on the cusp of
being teenagers, they often will make them like much older teenagers, although or
it appears like full on like adults, in part because they want the like,
you know, heart throbbedness and like to be more okay with like the
flirtatiousness or the sexuality of the characters. And I'm really glad the show didn't
do that here because I hated that in the movie. Yeah, the movies
are not great, but so let's Okay, let's talk about the show itself.
What did we I think we had a lot of specific things to go
into, But Amelia, you first, would you think of the show overall?
So I think it started off strong, Like I was really happy with
the first two episodes, like the changes were minor. It seemed like we
were going to get a really good adaptation. And then it just slowly started
going its own way yep, and I it just out more and more that
I was like, okay, okay, And I feel like, you know,
I'm always happy when I was an adaptatient because it always gets people more
interested in something. But when you you promise to the fans that this was
gonna be so good and then you kind of let it spin off in its
own way. Like even the ending of it is different, Like they don't
make it in time for the solstice they need directly with Zoos and then everything
with Looke's betrayal, what's that sword? What's going on with this? Like
you know, that's not what happened at all, Like yeah, and that
was I was I the only one who was really rooting for Luke at the
end, Like I kind of felt like the show had the Magneto killmonger problem
of they make a villain have a point, but they actually wind up making
the villain so sympathetic that the only thing that like turns you against them is
that they're being betrayed by the wrong people or the you know, their methods
are bad. Because every word of Luke's speech about how the gods treat us
like like, you know, terrible parents. I was like, yeah,
kids, right. If I may offer my thought on this, I agree
with everything I just said, is that I felt pretty good about the first
two episodes. There was a few little things that was like upset about in
that, like I, and this is a theme throughout, I think that
Disney sanitized the story personally. I think the domestic abuse that occurred towards Sally,
which exists in the book, was really watered down. I think that,
like a lot a lot of more some of the more heavy things were
just made more kid and I get it, like they wanted to make it
work kid friendly show. But if I was able to read that in a
book at eight years old, I feel like we could put it on a
screen in a way that still is true to that heart, to the point
of Luke I really liked the casting of Luke. I thought Luke's acting was
great, but I agree with you, Matthew. It actually made me mad
because Luke doesn't seem like wrong. He didn't like they didn't. They didn't.
I don't think like make the gods seem unwakeable enough, like they portrayed
Poseidon is too good of a dad. He wasn't. He's not a good
dad in the book, He's a really bad He literally says, and I
quote to Percy in the book, I'm sorry you were born child. And
in the in the show, he's like defending him from seue surrender, doing
all these you know. And so I think that the gods are portrayed as
you know, bad parents enough to like really hit home Luke's point of the
guys being bad parents, and like we only know that they're really bad because
I think that we've read the books. But Luke was so likable that I
didn't feel I didn't feel the betrayal. Like in the book, I was
so shocked and hurt and upset, And in the show, I'm like this
entire betrayal scene was like three minutes and he's just gone, what the hell?
And they didn't even like bring in like the fact that Backbiter is also
able to harm humans. But that's a big part of how Luke is kind
of turned to this darker side of himself, Like they don't explain a lot
of the darker things, and I think hit home his betrayal and his character.
So I was I lost as it went on. I kept trying to
defend the show and believe in it and believe it, and at the end,
I was like, man, you just changed way too much, Rick,
way too much. Yeah, that's exactly how I felt. Definitely,
like the points you touched on with like Gabe's abuse being like negated and stuff
like that, That's exactly what I was seeking in the whole end of the
episode watching that, I was like, are they gonna, like, you
know, portray this is this gonna how are we gonna do this? And
then they just skimmed it. Oh whatever? She divorced him, right,
you know, I really especially because in the book she kills him. Yes,
she Genie's gonna meduce it. Yes, and he said she sells him.
Did you guys, did you all watch the end credit scene? Yeah?
Oh no, I didn't see he there's an end credit scene math did
you mind if I tell you? Yeah? So basically it's it's it's it's
it's him turing the stone, so he it pans back to right before Percy.
It's how I get back, or how I had just gotten back.
She changed the locks to the apartment and he finds a package outside that says
return to send her from the gods, and gave has opened it himself just
to be a jerk and finally produces his head and turns himself to stone.
So they incorporated it. But again it's sanitized because Sally doesn't kill him.
It's just him being a jerk and doing it to himself, which I think
again, like Sally was was it really diminishes Sally's character because she suffered through
domestic abuse willingly to protect Percy, and that's just not what's being portrayed.
And then she finally gets a chance to take that back and to get back
at him and to like take back her life and get rid of this vile,
vile man. Like I didn't actually hate Gabe. He was just a
goofy loser as being from New Jersey, like I have met many many Jets
fans that look an act like Gabe in the show, and that's just not
how he is in the books. J E. T sh Jets Jets motherfucker.
I'm a hardcore Jets fan. We're not like that. But yeah,
I definitely hear your point. And yeah, and it's funny because also,
like in the books, Gabe is like calling the police on them and it's
like doing all these things to like put Percy in trouble, and that's never
it kind of hinted at in the show, but we don't get anywhere near
as much of that. And I really like what you said there about how
how how you know impactful what Sally does at the end there is and the
way Percy helps her do it, And to me, it's even worse because
like to me, the Olympic, it's funny that you thought that in this
the Olympian parents aren't as bad because I think they absolutely are. I think
they're flat out abusive. And you're right, Poseidon is nicer at that end
scene, but the rest of the time him like not acknowledging him, you
know, all the other stuff like the like Athena basically being like okay,
well you were kind of rude. So I'm gonna set this monster into possibly
killing you. I think it's part of why I was reading for Luke.
I thought Luke was right because it's especially when Percy says like, well,
but our parents are trying their best. It's like that to me feels like
a really bad message to send to people, especially kids, if your parents
are really being horrible, I think you go ahead. I think one of
the main overall points of the first five Percy Jackson books and is that Luke
isn't necessarily wrong. Like that's something that they all struggle with later on in
the book, especially Annabeth because of her relation to Luke. They do struggle
with that, and that that theme is brought up several times later on,
which hopefully we do get to see the screen. I hope we get all
this. I hope we get heroes of Olympus. I need everyone that,
I need to see them all come to life on the screen. But yeah,
I think a big part of that is just I can't explain it super
quick. I just want to respond. I think I get where you're coming
from and the gods part. But I think what got me was that,
like Sally drops a candle anywhere she goes Poseidon shows up immediately to be by
her side. Hephestus immediately helps Annabeth Hermes lets him take the keys. They
just they all seem to be being a little bit nicer and a little more
likable. In the books, they were just hirks, and like I was
like, these guys, like like by the end, I'm all right,
Poseidon's kind of cool, but like they were all just real bad people.
And I felt like in the in the show, they just they were more
likable. And besides, especially was being a much better helper to Sally than
it ever seemed like she was being. That's fair. That's fair, I
guess to me. Then, my problem is that the only parent Greek parent
who looks truly awful is Athena. Yeah, which feels really weird for her
to be the worst because she tries to kill her She doesn't try to kill
her daughter, but she puts her daughter in a life and death situation because
her daughter was rude, Yeah, or her daughter's friend was rude. I
like wanted to physically put myself between Poseidon and Sally when they were talking to
each other to a restaurant. I was like, no, don't talk to
him, girl, like I wanted to like get them apart. I was
like, no, you do, do not talk to him. I don't
want any relationship between the two of them. I need Paul to come in
right now and steal Sally away. Because the book presided as a show up
until person has a birthday party at the end and just rolls it, and
that's such a better way, And I don't know, I just yeah,
yeah, because you're right, because they didn't instead of making because I think
the thing that they does in the book is to say, like, you
know, Luke is the kill monger. Luke is the magneto where he like
has a good solid point, but he's willing to kill humans. He's got
a human killing sword, he's willing to work with Chronos. And yeah,
well, clearly though, there's a lot about the show that we liked,
because, like as Amelia was just saying, like we do, you know,
Mili was saying at least that she wants more of it. I certainly
want more of it. I think there is a lot of good in this.
So we can go back to some of our critiques in a second,
but let's just talk about what are some of the things that really worked especially
in those first couple episodes. And I'll actually start by throwing one out.
That's funny because they just talked with Alex about this on the Strong Wars podcast.
In the books, I think what actually, let me back back this
up a bit and actually ask you, Alex, when you were reading them
as a kid, did you find the scenes of the monsters scary? Depending
I did not find I did not find the like the actual monsters, the
minotaur scary. Really, it was kind of like humorous. What I did
find scary in the books that I don't think was actually scary. One that
they reversed it in my opinion in the show is that I found Haiti's scary.
I found some of the gods scary in the books, and they kind
of made them more like in the show, while the monsters, I felt
like, became way scarier in the show. Right. Well, yeah,
because that's where we'll get to the guards in a little bit. But I
was getting the monsters specifically for me reading them as an adult. They were
all slapstick. You know, the minuitar is chasing him, but the minutar
is in Tidy Whitey's and we focus on that, and like every Monster,
there's always some silliness as it's trying to adopt to the modern world, and
this though, they were just straight up terrifying. Like the first scene that
minu tar was one of the things that made me really be like, I
like where the show is going because it felt like it was a lot scarier
than the books were. I agree. So that's kind of my first thing
about what I like. What else do you guys like? I like a
little bit of the modernization which has progressively happened in the books as they've come
out, Like they've kind of like the references of stage modern even though I'm
the same age as Percy Jackson is like chronologically, but even though he's still
only like eighteen nineteen in the books, but they've kept the references modern and
like a Percy Flossing. I thought that was really funny and like updating the
music that Grover sings, you know, things like that that kept it modern
without like completely changing it. I really appreciated. Yeah, I thought Grover's
performance was the best thing in the show. I think that I have opinions
that all the different acting, but I think Grover By and far like like
Grover embodied exactly what I imagine Grover being like growing up like this little shy,
kind of goofy but also sharp, little sader. The only the only
thing that I felt it was a little bit missing from his character. Was
he anything he ate enough. I felt like in the book he was constantly
eating in cands and stuff. He never ate a tin camp he did.
I was very sad. I was sad about that too. But general acting
wise and the way he like portrayed the character I thought was like spot on
spectacular. I thought he stole the show. In my opinion. I didn't
think he was necessarily the best. I actually really liked the kid playing Percy.
But I thought all of them, oh wow. I actually I think,
honestly, I think the best acting is Luke. But I think all
of them were very, very good, especially for child actors. I do
think Percy was spectacular. I personally thought Anabeth was a little wooden. I
just don't I don't know, compared to the book, she didn't seem as
like that's what what I'm looking for, like upfront, in your face.
I think I think they interpreted the characters being more like sit back and think
wise. While in the book it's a lot more take action on the flywise,
and I wanted her to be a little more aggressive, and maybe she
will be in the future episodes or future books, but that was my only
That was my main critique of Annabeth was I just was like, I need
you to be more in it. I don't know, Amelia, what was
your take on the actors. I kind of agree with the Annabeth stuff.
I think it might have been more of like a direct her kind of issues
in an actor issue, because she started off like really sassy like at the
beginning there, and I was like, yeah, that's Annabeth, and then
she kind of just like took a step back and was more like, you
know, a background character instead of being like upfront and like, you know,
making being a stronger lead. You know, That's what the word I
was looking for. Yeah, yeah, she's she's more sitting back. Well,
like you said, like she's thinking, which is fine. She is
a child of Athena, but that's not how Annabeth is, right. Yeah,
I definitely think that it's a director thing, non acting thing, because
what I interpreted it as was it felt like that in this movie, in
this show, they talk in the books about how she has lived most of
her life at Camp half Blood and doesn't really know much about the world outside,
but it felt like they were playing that up a lot more in the
show. So I interpreted as like she was just a kind of uncomfortable with
this leadership situation, you know, in terms of she the leader, is
Percy the leader, but also just that she felt very like fish out of
water, which I thought the actress did a good job of portraying that character.
But I agree with both of you, that's not the character is written
in the books. Yeah. I think I just have a very especially having
grown up with the books, a very strong idea of who Percy, Anameth,
and Grover are. And I felt like the direction they gave Percy and
Grover was spot on with what I always imagine, and the director to think
of Annabeth just didn't wind up with how I've always imagined Anabeth, and so
I think it just bothered me. I co couldn't see it, that's fair.
Yeah, I thought the actress was great, but I definitely think they
made some directorial choices seemed weird. Luke's acting spectacular, yeah, yeah,
and Clarice. I thought Clarice was also. I remember thinking in both the
book and the movies that I wanted more of her, and I thought the
actress they got to play Clarice was so spawn on good and I in the
book she specifically described as ugly, and I Rick Rick Rick Rardan, the
author has really like grown up with the books himself as well, and he
has said that like part of why he started including more queer characters was he
he got, you know, negative feedback that they weren't there, and he
want he listened and he learned, And I think that his writing of women
characters has grown a lot. And I think that a little bit of the
writing of Clarice in the first book, as you know, she's kind of
ugly and looks kind of like, you know, like Tom not even Tom
boyish, but just kind of like she's heavy set and she's not pretty at
all. And the fact that the actress who plays Carise is gorgeous and mean
as hell and like not Caddy but just going to totally kick your ass.
I thought it was just it. It really felt like an evolution of the
character in that way. But what I really really loved I have a slight
different opinion on that. I get what you're saying, but I actually it
actually kind of it bothered me a little bit because I was expecting a plus
size actress, like, you know, why why can't we have, like,
you know, a plus size actress who in the books, you know,
Chris described as having like a camel jacket and being very punk and like,
you know, and I felt like, you know, now I want
to cry, was saying, I really did enjoy her performance at her acting
a lot in the show, but I don't know, it felt to me
like I was like, why why did you have to take that aspect of
christ away? Like why can't she be a little like what's wrong with being
a little a little beefy as you as a child? Why do you why
do all of the characters have to be like fit in shape? Like,
I don't know, I think that part just kind of got me because I
was like, I felt like in the in the book, that was one
of his better ways of like being a little more inclusive at how the folks
with the camp and I felt like they could have. I don't know,
That's just how I interpret it. And and I and I agree with Chrissy's
gorgeous in the show, and I was like, did they did they make
that choice? You know, like why did they make that choice? I
just kind of I don't know. Yeah, I agree with Alex too.
I mean, like you niver see especially like plus sized child actors. You
know, how many of those do you see? You know, it would
have been good to get some representation out there. You know, that's fair.
I mean I would just push back and say that I think that you
could have had plus size and still have her gorgeous. I'm more to she
described it's ugly. Yeah, no, no, yeah, but I in
that REGARDLE totally agree, although I do think there's something weird if you only
have two real female campers we get to know and the good one is standing,
the bad one is is heavier. But but I also hear what you're
saying, like it's interesting that that's the part of the representation that you picked
up on, because I was just more focusing on the ugly part. But
yeah, I think both of us have good points. Yeah, I also
will say that I did. I think you're right that a lot of the
kids looked like they were, you know, really in great shape and kind
of stuff like that. And I did like that there was one of the
kids who was in great shape, was also in a wheelchair, and that
was definitely a nice touch. I thought, I'm asking you a question in
regards to that. Do you feel like when they include a character like you're
somebody in a wheelchair, for example, and they're only on screen for a
brief moment, does it feel inclusive or does it feel like they're just doing
it to check a box? Like that's a genuine question, like when Disney
like throws in a character or whether they whether it's like just a person of
color or you know, you know, if you want to include you know,
an indigenous actor, so someone where there's just a briefly on screen just
to say, oh, look, we have inclusion. Like did you feel
like the fact that the character was only on screen briefly was beneficial or do
you feel like it felt like Disney was just kind of doing that just to
be Disney. I think I'm kind of happy to finally be a box that
someone wants to check. Yeah, Like I do think in that regard was
just box checking and that's not enough. Yeah, but I think that like
a the fact that he festus, I mean, this isn't like something Rorden
came up with this is like from the Greek myths themselves, but like he
is disabled and they play that as disabled when he's up. And the fact
that I know in later things there's gonna be more of that, and the
fact that most of them, Like I think, if we'd gotten to know
like five other campers, but then the one in the wheelchair had only been
on screen for two seconds, I would have felt differently. But the fact
that like, really we get to know, you know, are our three
heroes, Clarice and Luke, and that's about it. And so having like
one of the many others be you know, there's a nation who's only on
screen for a few seconds, there's you know, et cetera, et cetera.
So but yeah, I think it's a fine line to walk, and
I kind of think that disability has been so long forgotten in that regard that
it's we're just at the like. But also probably like if I hadn't seen
Echo a week ago and felt like I see myself on screen in the most
represented a way anyone's ever been represented, which is weird because she's a native
woman, deaf person who I'm not any of those three things. But I
saw in her more of my story as an amputee than I've ever seen on
screen. But yeah, it's a good question, Like if this was the
like, look, we have superhero representation, you got to be a guy,
I'd be like, no, walk that right. And I fact I
asked that because you know, if I might ask one other kind of a
larger question in that I know that you know, there's a lot of fans
and Rick pushed heavily back against this because a lot of it came across this
very racist commentary that were upset that they cast a black girl for Annabeth because
in the book she's described as a white, blonde California girl. And I
don't think that her race matters in the slightest in her and how she and
how anything happens in the books. But people, you know, I've heard
the argument from people that Disney and Rick chose to do a lot of this
casting just to seem inclusive, and that it was not. But they did
it just to be inclusive and and have people call around screen and not like,
let me say, have a bit of worthy instead of just doing that
to have him write more you know, inclusive characters in the first but it's
like, you know, Indi Codeangela, who you haven't met in the show,
is Hispanic. And you know, writing those you know, different keys,
writing the characters a certain way. Do you feel like the castings were
done? You know? What is your what is you'all take on all of
that dialogue? Well, first of all, as a million points out,
Nico is Italian, He's not Latino. You're a radio yes, thank you,
thank you. And then then we have Hazel too, and like he
got better at writing those characters as the books went on. Yeah, he
adds a lot more and Raina and everyone, just everyone, and like here's
so much, so much more story. Yeah. Yeah, And that's kind
of what I'm saying. And I think, honestly, I like from a
lot of it, Like I kind of feel like, given that growth from
Rick Reardon himself, for him to go back and say, yeah, I
wrote those books is probably a little too white. I want to fix that
when I bring it to screen is totally fine. I also think that if
you have the chance to have Lance Riddick anywhere in your show, you change
everything so it fits around Lance Riddick. And I do think that the way
that gods are written. The fact that Zeus is played by a black actor
by no means we actually never mind know that because Annabeth is a Feenus daughter.
So ignore everything I just said. But certainly I feel like the idea
of like Lance Riddick, Just like the moment he came on screen, My
spouse Mary was like that Zeus. Of course, that Zeus. He's so
perfect. It makes you wonder who they're going to cast Esthalia too, if
they have. If they have Lance Reddick playing as Zeus, I mean,
who are we what kind of character we're gonna get for Thalia, which is
my favorite character personally in the whole series. Is I want them to cast
me as Salia. I don't care that I'm thirty well, especially because and
I think this is a real tragedy that obviously goes far beyond the show but
does affect the show. Lance Riddick has passed on. Yeah, and I
don't know if they're going to recast him, or if they're going to like
use something else or have Zeus be mostly off screen. But yeah, it
is an interesting question. I don't guess they recast him, because gods can
change their form. I thought they could very easily. Yeah, but it's
hard. It's very hard to recast. It's rick of anyone else. Yeah,
he was so good in this, even though the part of Zeus is
so different than the books, but I still loved him. For me,
I think kind of the high water mark of the show because it's both my
favorite point and also I think after it starts to go downhill was in the
Medusa episode, and this also felt to me like an episode where they had
intentionally updated it because in the books, she is one of the monsters who
they have to fight, and you know, she at first appears kind of
nice to them, and then you know, they quickly realize that she's trying
to like get them onto her side, you know, for her fight against
the gods, and then they have to fight her and kill her. And
one of the things I think that has happened in more recent like just cultural
development, in large part because of an incredible statue that was made, but
also because of other things, is there's really been a change in how Medusa
is perceived in popular culture, and this understanding of that when you really look
at the Zeus, look at the myths, Medusa is a woman who is
sexually assaulted in the temple and then gets punished by the gods for nothing that
she did. It's one hundred percent of victim blaming and that doesn't come up
in the books because that conversation wasn't really happening yet. And I really loved
Medusa's portrayal in this of she does get to be sympathetic, and she does
get to say, hey, think about how poorly I was treated. This
wasn't fair. And she does then like turn on the kids and try to
kill them, and so I understand why they have to kill her. That
makes me sad because they need the head for so many other plot points.
Yeah, I gen really loved the way she was portrayed, in the way
that they they allowed her story updated as our sort of cultural understanding of the
myth was updated. But what did you both think of it? I liked
the episode. I think that the only thing I would have liked different And
this is a critique I had throughout is they just immediately knew it was Medusa.
Like that happened multiple times, so they just immediately knew. And I
think it took away a little bit from like the surprise of like look at
all these stones look at this nice lady, Oh my god, and like,
I feel like maybe if they had met her, they hear her story,
they get to know her like this, similar things can happen, and
then then they realized it's Medusa, after they've connected with her and realized she's
a kind person. That would have actually sunk it even more for me,
because I feel like a big part of the books was that, like they
are learning, Annabeth has not seen outside, has not been outside for the
world Jesus stepped it over. Annabeth has not been out of camp very often.
Grover hasn't been on a quest since he helped save Luke and h and
Annabeth and and goletho Alia get turned in to a tree, and Percy's brand
new to all of this, And I felt like them just immediately having the
answer took some air out of the sales. It didn't take away from how
much I like to portrayal of Medusa and how that episode went. I actually
let a lot of the changes they did make in the episode and felt like
it was a really fun, refreshing take on it. I just wished it
like there was a little more suspense build of, like you know, they
come upon this place, they meet this kind woman, they listen to her
story, they connect with her, and then we find out it's Medusa.
It's just right away. I'm like, man, come on, Mallia.
Would you think of her? And the way they kind of updated her story
made her more sympathetic. Well, I think what that story was bold for
Rick to include anyway, you know, given it is what it is,
and you know, I have a Medusa tattoo, and you know, everything
that stands for and everything that is a hard subject to broach when you're broaching
middle schoolers, Like I get that, like I have. I have a
sixth grader, you know, perfect age for Percy Jackson right now. And
I think they did the best they could. But I agree to Alex like
they rushed it, like where they were like, oh, we know she's
Medusa. That was a little lame. I liked the mystery where they're kind
of like piecing it together, you know, But I do like I did
like the Medusa kind of went more after Annabeth like look at what your mother
did to me and I didn't do anything, you know. I really liked
that Medusa had that like spunk where she's where she was got to express herself
and her story in the most Disneyfied way possible. Yeah, but you know
I liked that, Like that felt good to me. Yeah. Yeah,
I think that makes sense. And I think also in some ways that's Annabeth's
best episode because I think that's where, you know, Percy is the one.
One thing I always liked about Annabeth and Percy's story is that they're such
opposites. Percy is the one who is just learning about the gods and it's
very cynical and detached. Annabeth is the the gods can do no wrong.
And this was I think a really great way of Medusa being the first one
to sort of poke at Annabeth and be like, really, is your mom
that perfect? So where do you think things started to come up? Where
the whales start to come off the bus? What are some of things that
didn't work for you? The Lotus casino? Yeah, I've already talked to
you about this. I will never we did not learn from our mistakes of
the past. Why are their children at a casino? It is not a
casino, It is an arcade. And you have like these adults like they
they walk into a Vegas casino and are handed unlimited gambling money, and they
just go, oh, this seems right, Like Annabeths is just like yeah,
this is normal, like smart Wise Girl, Annabets, It's just like,
yeah, the math checks out. We definitely look twenty one and can
gamble. And then I think something that was hard to portray. I think
they did try to portray it is the people in the different error outfits.
Unfortunately, people in Vegas just kind of dressed like that I've noticed, so
it was kind of hard to tell until they were directly talking to people that
they were supposed to be undated clothing. I don't know how they could have
made that better or worse. I think if they had sex stuck with the
theme of it just being children in there, it would have been easier to
tell that everybody was from different periods of time. Yeah, I really I
don't like that they just go in there and talk to Hermes like that.
You know, we kind of changed the whole thing there. I And you
know, I don't I don't like Linn wil Miranda as Hermes, but that's
I just feel like Disney's played him too much. Honestly, it's something personal
against him. I just feel like he's in Money grab Casting. Mm hmmm,
I agree fully. I mean, I also I love women Win Men
wil Miranda. I'm I think Hamilton fan. I love him and like all
his Broadway stuff, and like I like the scores he's done for Jay.
But it just it didn't it didn't fit here to me. I think I
just all I could see was women Will Miranda. I couldn't see, like
I couldn't separate the character from the actor. And I also agree that this
is kind of where a lot of it fell off for me. Again,
there have been moments throughout that were like kind of poking me the wrong way,
but this just, I mean again, it's again, it's like the
immediate before they even got into the place, they're like, do remember we
can't stay here long? Like this is you know, we know the myth,
this is what happens. Don't do like whatever. And like again in
the book, they get trapped. They really are caught up, and like
they again they kind of water that down. And yeah, and this is
actually the single moment that I'm gonna give the movie a piece of credit.
In the movie, Percy realizes that they're stuck because he goes to way Pinball
next to some guy, like some hippie guy dressing like close in the seventies
and he makes some reference to like a yeah, I love this this movie
whatever the Pinball Game was, you know, best movie of the year nineteen
seventy, and it like makes you realize that like time moves differently. And
I was like, wow, that was a clever way of doing it.
And I feel like a simple interaction like a two second line or something could
have really done that, because I feel like that wasn't really portrayed as strongly
and they missed the deadline like this made them lose all of that time where
they just fully missed the deadline. That just takes all the wind out of
the quest. What what what are we doing? We'll get to the stuff
about the gods in a second one there, just on the Casino Verus arcade
thing. I don't know if this is why they did it, but I'm
curious, Alex, as a kid, did you go to arcades and they
took quarters in the machine? Okay? So that because I wondered if they
think that like modern kids don't and maybe like Jen Alfa, Amelia, does
your daughter ever want to go to or your child ever want to go to
I don't want to go to the casino. But like I mean, like
we got a Demon Busters, you know, like we go to arcades.
I mean, yeah, yes, So there's no reason why I couldn't have
been like, there's definitely that's definitely still a part of it. Just did
it to fit the Las Vegas five? Yeah, yeah, I don't know.
Children in casinos, I don't know. That's such a weird stretch for
me. And they did in the movie, they did it in the show.
I don't get it. Why can't you just make it an arcade?
Like why did it have to be a casino? Like we know it's in
Vegas, but it's implying that these children are in there playing like they're showing
like people playing poker and stuff, like it's put in the movie when Grover
was just going down with like eight ladies at a craps table, is these
like row and dice? I'm like Jesus, oh well, And especially because
in the book, one of the things I think that really comes across really
well and this actually is is like legitimate to the lotus eaters from the Odyssey,
Uh, is that the original work by Homer is that in the book.
You know, they've been sleeping in buses, they've been sleeping by the
side of the road, they've they've they've had all these horrible offul experiences,
and here's a it's not just an arcade. It's a hotel where they have
rooms waiting for them and these comfortable beds and linen sheets and showers that are
just bats that are so luxurious. And it's the the incredible contrast between all
of this like awfulness, where and also that everyone has been turning their backs
on them. All the gods are trying to screw them or ignoring them,
none of their parents are helping, and here the whole staff is like,
oh, Percy Jackson, We're so glad to see you. And to me,
that's a big part of what makes it so appealing. And that and
the awesome games because again like, yeah, I don't know many twelve year
olds or fourteen year olds we're gonna be like, ooh, blackjack. It's
kind of a boring game unless you have a chance to win money at it.
So yeah, I just thought that whole scene was done weird. And
as for the Linn Manuel Miranda part of it, when we start to get
into the gods. For me, I grew I was someone who really love
Greek myths growing up, and I think in the Greek mythology, at least,
Hermes is really portrayed as like the teenager of the group. Like he
is he's the youngest or the gods, and he's still like kind of a
manchild in a lot of ways, Like he's you know, supposed like he's
the guy who you imagine if he went over to his house, like he'd
have like some empty pizza boxes and probably be like uple not playing video games.
One of the things that I always loved about the book is that I
think this is more developed in the later books of the series, but you
get the idea of is that like Hermes wasn't old enough to have it to
be a father yet, and that's part of why he was not a great
father to Luke, and like none of the gods were good fathers. But
then he was kind of like, you know, he's kind of like that
manchild who has a kid, has no idea what to do with him.
And yeah, so making it minimal Miranda, who is just much older and
distinguished and like it just felt all wrong and it just I don't know.
It took the way they introduced the character who is not as good as the
way they introduced him in the books, and like the fact that like the
kind of brushed past a little bit, like which just briefly explained how Luke's
mom was a seer and like everything that happened. I was like, Where's
There's so much more exposition. This is important to understanding Luke in his backstory
and why he thinks the way he thinks. Why are we rushing through this
story? It just it felt like they were just trying to squeeze it in
for no reason. Yeah, Dide wants you to feel too short to you,
Like I I think a seat like a movie was you could never do
this book and it felt way too short they rush. Yeah. I felt
like a ten episode or twelve episode series would have worked much better. I
was entirely surprised about how short the episode were. I was like, that's
it, yeah that Like there was one that was like under forty minutes.
I was like, wow, okay, Like I feel like it takes me
longer to read that, and that's saying something. Yeah, And I felt
like they really wanted to focus on the action adventure, you know, like
where it's like I actually really care about this mother of monsters and her holy
dynamic. Then I do like watching CGI of this huge scorpion Camara monster.
Yeah, the pacing just felt weird to me. Throughout it felt like they
like were just I don't know, like sometimes they spent time, like with
getting from point A to point B, I spent a lot of time expisaying
like a short period of time, and other times start going through multiple days
in like ten minutes. I agree with you, I think ten twelve episodes
would have really helped. I mean just skipped over a bunch the Empire state,
Pudy go up to the Olympus, which should have been this big,
grandiose climactic moment, so her five minutes. Yeah, what do you all
think about the way the other gods were trained? Let's actually start with Poseidon
too soft fully? Why is he like care? I don't like that I
don't trust. Yeah, it makes me nervous. I don't like that he's
being nice. I don't like that he talked to Sally. Ever, I
don't want him to ever talk to her ever again. I would put a
restraining order on him. For her. I don't like that he cared as
much about Percy. You know, I didn't like it. I it was
weird they were trying to make us feel compassionate for the gods when Luke makes
really good points that you should be compassionate for the gods, and in the
book they back that up. Yes, yeah, they back it up.
Yeah, because like there is there's the one moment where Poseidon says that he's
like really proud of Percy, and Percy's like, oh my God, thank
you, and your heart just breaks because it's like that abused kid or partner
who just gets that little love colonel, and it's like, oh, this
is so wonderful, and you're like you should be getting that every day.
Yeah, that's what I articulated this poorly earlier. That's what I was trying
to get at, is that I felt like the same exact what immediately just
said is that Beasada was too soft and was just too They tried to make
it seem like he carried a lot more guilt than he really does. Like
I think in the books is portrayed that he is a little guilty, he
feels a little bad, and he does have a little favorite tanism towards Percy,
but like it's still he's still a very distant father, very distant,
very hands off, very like you know, And I think again that's what
like makes you question throughout the series, will Percy join with like will he
maybe actually agree with Luke? Like will Annabeth agree with like? Like it
makes you question, like if Anabeth or Percy might actually join up with Luke
at some point, But in this point, like, they've made it very
clear that, like you know, Percy will defend the gods to the end.
Percion's at the battle of a dad towards him, but Athena is a
jerk towards Anabeth, And so I don't know it just the look of a
Satin was great, but it's just I don't feel like the energy of the
care all the gods fote too nice, except for Zeus well, especially because
like you guys said, as in thinking about it, like that part worked
great in the first couple episodes, like Poseidon doesn't show up. He doesn't
say great job and capture the flag. He just lets his try and it
be above the kid, and then we immediately learn it's not because he's like,
oh, poor Percy. Percy should know whose dad is. It's like,
Oh, I'm in a fight with my brother. I need my kid
all of a sudden to do this very dangerous mission, so all of a
sudden, I'll claim him. I'm like they established that in the in the
show in the early episodes. I shn't know what happened later. And what
about Hades and Zeus and Arias, because they're like in the books, and
all three of them, they're portrayed fairly supernaturally when he first meets them,
and then they kind of shrink down into Hades and Zeus both are like ten
foot tall, and Hades has like fire in his eyes and all this kind
of stuff, and they wind up being aries. I'm sorry, he has
like fire in his eyes and it being more human. What do you think
about the changes they made there? I don't like what they did to Hades
me neither. That was they made him a little little lucy Lucy goosey,
Yeah, and I didn't like that. It was weird. I was like,
this is not Hades at all. Like I literally had just read that
part in the book when that episode came out in my reread, and I
was like, this is so wrong. Yeah, it's funny because I'm I
commented to Amelia about Aries because I had just read the part about Aries in
the book, and so I was like, Oh, this is so wrong,
and Amelia is like, what are you talking about? Because I actually
think that the actor who plays Arias was spot on perfect, and I'm willing
to believe that maybe that the like they tried having them look it just looked
cheesy, you know, because some effects work better on page than they do
on screen. But I don't know what they were going for with Haites.
He just seemed kind of like like shady and slimy instead of like haunted or
you know, it felt like the way that Hayes always always described in the
books was a little more put together, a little like you could you know,
he had a humanside that you saw come out a little bit around Nico
and stuff, because it was always like scarier to me in the books and
more aggressive. And I just I agree with you. I thought Aries casting
was really, really, really good, and I liked how he was portrayed.
I felt like the battle between him and person was very anticlimactic. Unfortunately
it kinda is in the book too. It is it is but I don't
know. I was picturing something a little more grandiose. But I agree that
the casting I thought was was excellent. I also like that, like I'm
starting a Twitter fight, like I love just making people feel like bringing that
into the modern age was cool. Yeah, I don't know, man,
Haydes just didn't. And it's funny because I have multiple friends like who grew
up with me, same like went to school with me and had been percy
fans of me since day one. All of us have all agreed on that
Hades was just weird. It just wasn't how we ever it pictured him.
I don't know. It's just very odd and off putting. For me.
He's always been this kind of like scary version of like a goth, like
a goth who grew up kind of like this weird cross of like Jerref the
Goblin King from Labyrinth and Jack Skellington from Nightmare before Christmas and like you know,
Lucius Malfoy, you know, and like that kind of like menace in
a soft voice, you know, and like gorgeous, put together three piece
suit and black eyeliner. And yeah, it was not and his whole attitude
felt very and it's because like a god of the dead, and yeah,
again, if you're disneying it down doesn't work as well. But when you
think about how these books are written for kids but still come across much carrier
and so why do you think they changed the ending so dramatically in terms of
they don't finish the Quest on time? Zeus does start the war. Even
after Zeus knows that there's no reason to start a war with Poseidon, he
still wants to fight a war and Poseidon surrenders in order to end the war.
I don't know. Rick went out of his way in an interview to
say that it doesn't really change the ending, and it all would make sense,
and I was like believing him, and then I saw it and I
was like, are you kidding me? I think that it the fact,
like the fact that the Percy, Animeath and Grover overcame everything and finished a
Quest on time, was a testament to their strength and their courage and their
endurance, and I thought that taking that away was insulting. I think that
they only in reality, I think they had only Zeus up there to save
money on having to pay a cast of sixteen actors to all sit in on
Mount Olympus, and I feel like Percy first walking into Mount Olympus and seeing
all of the gods and seeing how small he was compared to them, was
again would have lent some canter to what Luke was saying and beside him being
kind of aloof towards him versus in here, he's like defending Percy and like,
I surrender. Okay, they made Zeus. They did make Zeus feel
as jerky and angry and proud as he was in the book. And I
really think lou Reddick did it perfectly. Be said it again, soft so
soft, like I don't think we said in the book would surrender it just
for Percy. It just didn't. It just didn't feel true to the way
the characters were in the book for me, and I was, I don't
know, I felt like they didn't need to do any of that. We
could have very easily made the change they wanted to make and still had to
end the normal way. Yeah, Amelia, would you think I agree?
You know? I mean, if I'm trying to believe in Rick, I'm
trying like he hasn't hurt me, he hasn't really really hurt me. Yet
I want to have faith that it's all going to make sense. There is
a war coming though, that's the whole purpose of the first five books.
There's a war, you know, but it's not It's not like that.
And then with Poseidon defending him and just that whole inter connection right there,
like I hated that, Like that dynamic never happened in the book between Sidon
and Zeus, and no point was beside it every like submissive to Zeus or
really were they, you know, ever directly in contact other than discussing things
about Percy, right, you know. And I feel like just if you
had a moment where Aries was up there and a seed was up there,
you got to see the glare and like just kind of like, you know,
the fact that I always picture with the air getting sucked out of the
room as this little rebellious demigod who was only nob who's been at deemic good
for two weeks, walks in and it's already sticking it to them, Like
it just it felt like as a kid reading that, I was like,
like, this is like when I feel really passionate about something like and I
stick up for myself or talk back to an adult, That's how I would
feel and they will kind of look at me and then they're like what is
this, Like, you know, if his kid might might be right,
but we're the adults in the room, so we're going to exert ourselves over
him. And like I felt that as a kid. I felt that I
experienced that, and I felt they didn't portray that in the show, like
he was just Zeus being angry. Yeah, yeah, I think it's very
true. I think because because when Poseidon surrenders, like what happens, there's
no stakes in that war whatsoever? Right, Like, what's is it just
rollover? You know? Could we know that the war's starting for no good
purpose? If the war is to get the ball back, but you have
the bolt back already, like who cares? Just to prove that Zeus is
that petty? Yeah, And I was like that's just it's just it was
just silly to me, and like he didn't seem I know about Kronos.
I know, I'm not surprised by this, Like it's just I don't know,
like in the in the books, the gods kept ignoring it and saying
you're wrong, like Chronos is, Cronos can't come back, we can handle
it. He just it feels like Zeus takes it more seriously in the show,
and I feel like in the books it's portrayed as them being very like
nonchalant, like we are much like the Jedi Council, Matthew, very like
Aloof and like we can't be beaten. They're done, They're dead, the
Titans are gone. Like I don't know, it's just I would say that
Kronos' portrayal is being this like creepy creature in his dreams. I thought it
was pretty cool. I thought that was a good portrayal. The dreams of
Percy had of Chronos was was cool. Yeah. And I love they called
him Grandpa. Yeah I did. I did so. I was like,
don't call him that. That was great. Well, it's been a great
conversation. Thank you guys so much. Any last comments, and Melia,
I'm gonna start with you. Well, I just hope that this gets big
enough that we get the rest of the books. Like, personally, my
favorite is Heroes of Olympus over the other three or the other two series,
and I would just I want to see those characters come to life. I
want to see Jason, Piper, Leo, Hazel, Frank, I want
to see them and more than I want to see Percy. So I just
really hope this show goes well. I hope we get five seasons, and
I hope we get many more. I don't know how the possible. They're
child actors. They're rapidly aging. I noticed in several points that I could
tell where reshoots had been done on Walker's struggle, because he looked visibly older
in scenes. Yeah. Yeah, especially in the last episode, there were
reshoots because he looked older. And like, if you want to know why
this is a problem, watch the last season of Stranger Things. Yeah,
where it's obvious that a couple of those kids have hit their puberty growth spirit
and a couple of them have not, and they look dramatically different. And
why they're doing there From what I read at the Avatar show on Netflix,
they're recording season two. Are they almost finished recording the second season because they're
trying to record all three seasons in under like a year, so they have
them all be the same age. Still, Yeah, that's what you have
to do with child actors. Yeah, yeah, because that whole show happens
within a year. Yeah, you're right. The actual animated show in Percy
Jackson. The kids age, I mean they should be, you know,
about to graduate by the time it ends. But still, I would like
to ask one one more question before we go about to write Matthew to both
of you. I have always been of the mindset and I want to I
enjoyed the show, but I always been of the mindset that Percy Jackson lends
itself better to an animated show. Yes, I'm curious the two of you
think about that. Uh be Like, I feel like that it's that's true
for every book, and that's something I was thinking about earlier today that I
wanted to bring up on this. So that's really good. Like a lot
of books, especially fantasy books and things like that that have like an element
to that where would be a little better animated, are getting turned into too
TV shows and movies, and I'm like, we need to not make these
live actions. We need to animate these. Then you don't have to you
know, it's cheaper I think overall compared to the CGI budget. You'll be
able to get the seasons out more rapidly. You don't have to worry about
people aging, you know. I feel like a lot of books, especially
with the fantasy element would be better done animated. I would say, you
know, all this stuff about areas with the fire in his eyes and like
the twelve foot tall version of Hades before ten foot tall version before he shrinks
down to human size. Yeah, like it may have been the right decision
not to do that because it appeared cheesy in live action with the hecks they
have. But yeah, I think then, I think for far too long,
too many people, myself included, saw animation as kind of like,
well, what live action is the real stuff? And I think we just
got to stop that entirely. There's some story. Pneumona is one of my
favorite, I think, one of the best movies that came out last I
wish it was in the Best Picture discussion. And I think Nimoto would not
work at all as live action. Yeah, and I mean, I mean,
I look at I'm a big anime fan. You look at you know,
stories being told an anime, you know, made in Japan, and
like an example, I mean an extreme example, but like One Piece is
about like young people and that show is going on for over twenty years and
the characters haven't really aided very much in the show where you're able to keep
telling the story indefinitely, because all you need is a voice actor. And
I think that like the ability to do so much of what they do in
Princy Jackson, all the fantasy elements, Like they didn't even include Ergus in
the live action show because they didn't want to pay the CGI budget of putting
all the eyes on somebody like. I just think that the animated an animated
series would allow them like, like you know, like you said to Melia,
like to paste it out to to really like. And also you could
make a twenty episode animated show and no one would bat an eye for an
animated season to be like that. Yeah, Like twenty episodes in live action
cost a ton of money. People would be like that's too much. Animated
it happens all the time, and you would have been able to give more
time to way things out. And I just think, I don't know,
that's just not that this show is bad. I really enjoy it. I
hope we get all this show episodes as well. But I think one day
I would love to see an animated adaptation of this book series. Yeah,
I think it's true. I will say though, in terms of casting,
I forgot the person who I think was perhaps the best casting of anyone in
the entire show. But can I guess go for it? Do you think
it's Denis Denisus? Yeah, I mean it's the one character we haven't really
talked about it all, but yeah, Jason manzakas I think the last name,
yes, fully, her degree good, perfectly, he give body.
Yeah, especially Grouchy hasn't been able to have a drink or have any fun
with satyrs. Yeah. I saw that casting for the first Yeah, yeah,
that that change. I was so okay with him just being like bringing
Percy and circles like son. Yes, it's me. Yeah, you can
do whatever he wants with the care and it's right because it's correct. Yeah.
Yeah, it's so good. It's so good. All right, Well,
thank you both. In our bonus section, we're gonna talk a little
about like thoughts for the coming seasons. Uh. I think a simple fact
that we all want more of this, We just want it to be a
little bit better. It already puts this miles and miles ahead of the books,
So I'm so glad for that. Ahead of the movies. I mean,
I think the books are clearly the best TV shows next, and the
movies are you know, the movies. The less spoken about them, the
better. I'll just say again, thank you to both of you so much
for being here. If you're not a member, thank you so much for
listening. You can become a member for just five dollars a month, fifty
five dollars a year. You get ad free content, you get the bonus
content. And we're now doing bonus episodes over on the Star Wars Galaxies podcast.
We're doing a book club. We are probably gonna be starting a book
club here in Superhero Ethic Land as well. So there's lots of great reasons
to be on there for the bonus content. And uh yeah, so thank
you much. Thank you both so much for mega part of this episode.
Uh to all our listeners. We have spoken. Matthew, I love you
bout mc funny. For one thing. You have mentioned the podcast twice this
episode and got the name wrong both times. What did I say? You
said? First? You said Star Wars Universe, he said Star Wars Galaxies
like, oh the other podcast, okay, haven't got yeah, Star Wars
Generations podcast. Thank you, thank you. We have spoken,