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Hello, and welcome to this episode
of Superhero Ethics. Friends. We're rushing

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this episode out to you because the
last episode of the Disney Plus live action

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Percy Jackson has just been released.
Recording this on January thirty first, and

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I'm recording it just a few hours
later with the hope that it's going to

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be in your earbuds tomorrow Thursday.
So we want to get a quick turnaround

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on this. And for the next
couple of weeks, the Superhero Ethics schedule

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is gonna be a little bit off
kilter. We're gonna put out episodes when

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we can. We're gonna mostly stick
to a normal schedule, but this one's

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gonna come out soon, and then
we're also gonna be having a bunch of

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episodes right when the new version of
Avatar the Last Airbender comes out. Today.

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We're all about doing reviewing the live
actions of children's classic shows that people

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are excited about nervous about. And
for this I've got two great guests.

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I've got Alex Corman, who is
one of my regular guests on the Storre

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Wars Universe podcast, and Amelia Love, who is a first time guest on

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here but has been someone I've been
talking about Percy Jackson with for quite some

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time, including during the show,
and I knew I really wanted their opinions

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and feedback during this episode. So
Amelia, let me start with you before

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you talk about the show, talk
about the books and what they meant to

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you. So I got into Percy
Jackson actually, like during the pandemic,

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Like I'd read the first one,
you know, back in middle high school

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when they started coming out for me, and then never really picked him up

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again. And then during the pandemic, I kept seeing tiktoks about them and

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it made me download them all on
my kindle and it was just a progressively

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read all that had been released back
to back, like I read it through

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them. And it was at the
same time that the last Trial of Apollo

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book was coming out, so I
read up to that book and then had

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like a week before that one came
out. Yes, so I got to

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read basically fifteen in a row,
which was insane, and I did that

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in about two weeks. And what
do you think it was about the books,

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the characters, the writing that we
drew you in so much. I

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really loved like just the overall found
family throughout all of the different Percy Jackson

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series, but specifically, you know, the foundation it builds with Annabeth and

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Grover and Percy in the first book, and then later on with more characters

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as it grows. But I really
just liked that how it was done,

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like it was like everyone had their
flaws and you know, there were issues

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between everyone, but it all worked
out and along the way, you know,

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you get this, you know,
retelling of Greek mythology in a very

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child way, which you have to
it's Greek mythology, but you know,

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I think that gets kids interested too. You know, you start with the

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Percy Jackson books and then you end
up you know, studying on your own

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can lead to things. Yeah,
I'm totally with you there. I think

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I might have started reading them a
little before the pandemic, or it might

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even during the pandemic. But I
know one of the things that really drew

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me in was that I think this
is part of why I was being talked

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about so much on TikTok. Actually
I think I discovered it earlier, but

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it's talked about for similar reasons.
Is that was around the time when more

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and more people were starting to realize
to what a terrible person JK. Rowling

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was, and we're starting to realize, like I think I had gone through,

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Like the last wave of that was
when I discovered Percy Jackson. But

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a lot of people were talking about
Percy Jackson and the books in part because

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the author, Rick Rordon is like
super queer positive, really does a lot

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to bringing people of color into his
books and draw it like when he wrote

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a trans character in a book,
he like worked a lot with other trans

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authors to cover things like that,
and so I kept seeing these things where

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he was presented as this sort of
like you know, all the boay of

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the Harry Potter world, because United
is kind of a similar thing of like

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a bunch of kids coming together and
sharing the fact that they have these magical

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abilities, and they're all in different
kind of communities based on their parents or

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things like or their beliefs or things
like that, in this case their parents.

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So it kind of hits a similar
niche but with a much different perspective

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in that is both true of the
author but also true of the books.

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And so for reheat for me,
I think all the things you talked about

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the found family, I guess they're
all cousins but they have still found family

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dynamics. Getting to see the kid's
age. I think that was told really

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well. But also it just hit
at a time when I was really hungry

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for more of this and feeling really
betrayed that the Hair of Potty books I

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loved so much, I was now
seeing through very different eyes. So it

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really meant a lot to me to
find this new thing. Alex, what

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up for you? Yeah? I
I read them as they came out.

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My mom got me the first book
when he came out in two thousand and

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five, and I was about eight
years old. I was really like the

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perfect age for these books, and
like, this is pretty this is my

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favorite book series of all time.
I grew up with the characters, you

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know. Every few years. Every
year or two, when a new book

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came out, my mom would take
me to Borders, which was the Barnes

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and Noble equivalent back of the day, and we'd get the book right when

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it came out and I would stay
up all night reading it. Like I

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never had that experience with the Harry
Potter books a lot of other people had

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growing up. I was just a
little too young for it. And Priscy

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Jackson was which is my It was
my thing and and and my my friends

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all really got into it. And
it's just I connected so deeply with Percy

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on so many different levels. I
mean, I to the stay am very

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adhd. But you know as a
kid, I was adhd, you know,

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working through and I wouldever I would
never like a problem in schools,

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but like you know, teachers having
to work with me and my parents about

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me being too impulsive and too like
you know, just it's kind of crazy

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and it's just a lot of like
the things that Percy described. I basically

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convinced myself that I was a demigod. Like I was like, I'm I

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checked every box on the which you
have just laid in front of me.

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I have to be. And I
also like I've also always my whole life

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felt very connected to water and felt
very like safe and and and special like

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like I don't know, I feel
special inside when I'm in water, and

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so I And that was even before
I read this book. So I was

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like, oh my god, on
Percy's brother, I got even the stud

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of like eight year old me.
It was a convinced that like I was

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the demigod. And I just I
grew up with them, and then when

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the uh I can't remember what the
sequel series was called, but the Heroes

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of Olympus, when those came out, I read them always they came out.

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I did not read the Trials of
Apollo. I read it. I

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like I read it. I've skimmed
the first book a bit. I just

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I care mostly about stories that really
set are around Percy. And I thought

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that I'm against the Apollo books at
all. I think I'll read them eventually.

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I just haven't gotten to it yet. But I've reread the Originals and

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the Heroes of Olympus countless times.
Well, I think when you you mentioned

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the uh Apollo books, I think
you're actually thinking about the Heroes of Rome

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books, right, because we don't
really have a whole series of apollollows is

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five books. Yeah, there's the
Trials of Apollo. It's a five book

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series on Apollo. It's the third
one. Oh okay, No, I

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haven't cleared I here, here's the
Olympics. Is the Roman one. So

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that's why the Roman oh okay crossed
over? Which I really the first book

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I did it love in that series, but the other four I loved.

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But actually I still have my original
five Percy Jackson books I had from growing

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up with all the same terrors and
little marks and stuff I made in them,

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which I think is special. But
yeah, in Percy Jockson is like

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extremely important to my identity. Yeah, well, I love that, and

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I love that we have a couple
of different perspectives here in terms of when

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we discovered Percy Jackson and what these
characters have meant to us. And so

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let me then for the next question. I think a lot of us had

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some trepidation about, uh a live
action version of these books because there had

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been a little bit of live action
already. H that not everyone loves.

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UH. So for both of you, what'd you guys think of the lot

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action movie if you've seen it.
There's two of them actually, and they're

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both ass So I actually did not
curse in this one, Matthews is fine.

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I want to I want kids you'll
listen to it, especially to Percy

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Jackson, so we'll keep the language
fairly family friendly. But as is fine.

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Okay, okay, okay. I
actually watched the movies before I read

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the books, because I remember when
they came out so and even then I

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knew they were bad. I was
like, this is like, oh wow.

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I was like, these are not
going to do good and then they

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didn't. And I feel like they
were really just trying to contend with the

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competition at the time. Yeah,
like they were silly and they were Yeah,

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they pushed him out though, I
think, yeah, I just I

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just did that. The entire fact
that the three main characters were all in

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their twenties, they're running around just
immediately, just listen. I love Logan

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Laherman, but that you too,
that was not the best move. Yeah,

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I was a big stand for to
be the Poseidon in this series.

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Yet I get it. But I
think it's a common thing that that happens

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when there's books that are about kids
who are like just on the cusp of

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being teenagers, they often will make
them like much older teenagers, although or

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it appears like full on like adults, in part because they want the like,

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you know, heart throbbedness and like
to be more okay with like the

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flirtatiousness or the sexuality of the characters. And I'm really glad the show didn't

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do that here because I hated that
in the movie. Yeah, the movies

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are not great, but so let's
Okay, let's talk about the show itself.

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What did we I think we had
a lot of specific things to go

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into, But Amelia, you first, would you think of the show overall?

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So I think it started off strong, Like I was really happy with

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the first two episodes, like the
changes were minor. It seemed like we

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were going to get a really good
adaptation. And then it just slowly started

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going its own way yep, and
I it just out more and more that

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I was like, okay, okay, And I feel like, you know,

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I'm always happy when I was an
adaptatient because it always gets people more

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interested in something. But when you
you promise to the fans that this was

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gonna be so good and then you
kind of let it spin off in its

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own way. Like even the ending
of it is different, Like they don't

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make it in time for the solstice
they need directly with Zoos and then everything

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with Looke's betrayal, what's that sword? What's going on with this? Like

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you know, that's not what happened
at all, Like yeah, and that

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was I was I the only one
who was really rooting for Luke at the

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end, Like I kind of felt
like the show had the Magneto killmonger problem

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of they make a villain have a
point, but they actually wind up making

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the villain so sympathetic that the only
thing that like turns you against them is

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that they're being betrayed by the wrong
people or the you know, their methods

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are bad. Because every word of
Luke's speech about how the gods treat us

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like like, you know, terrible
parents. I was like, yeah,

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kids, right. If I may
offer my thought on this, I agree

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with everything I just said, is
that I felt pretty good about the first

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two episodes. There was a few
little things that was like upset about in

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that, like I, and this
is a theme throughout, I think that

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Disney sanitized the story personally. I
think the domestic abuse that occurred towards Sally,

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which exists in the book, was
really watered down. I think that,

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like a lot a lot of more
some of the more heavy things were

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just made more kid and I get
it, like they wanted to make it

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work kid friendly show. But if
I was able to read that in a

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book at eight years old, I
feel like we could put it on a

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screen in a way that still is
true to that heart, to the point

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of Luke I really liked the casting
of Luke. I thought Luke's acting was

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great, but I agree with you, Matthew. It actually made me mad

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because Luke doesn't seem like wrong.
He didn't like they didn't. They didn't.

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I don't think like make the gods
seem unwakeable enough, like they portrayed

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Poseidon is too good of a dad. He wasn't. He's not a good

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dad in the book, He's a
really bad He literally says, and I

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quote to Percy in the book,
I'm sorry you were born child. And

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in the in the show, he's
like defending him from seue surrender, doing

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all these you know. And so
I think that the gods are portrayed as

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you know, bad parents enough to
like really hit home Luke's point of the

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guys being bad parents, and like
we only know that they're really bad because

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I think that we've read the books. But Luke was so likable that I

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didn't feel I didn't feel the betrayal. Like in the book, I was

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so shocked and hurt and upset,
And in the show, I'm like this

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entire betrayal scene was like three minutes
and he's just gone, what the hell?

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And they didn't even like bring in
like the fact that Backbiter is also

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able to harm humans. But that's
a big part of how Luke is kind

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of turned to this darker side of
himself, Like they don't explain a lot

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of the darker things, and I
think hit home his betrayal and his character.

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So I was I lost as it
went on. I kept trying to

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defend the show and believe in it
and believe it, and at the end,

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I was like, man, you
just changed way too much, Rick,

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way too much. Yeah, that's
exactly how I felt. Definitely,

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like the points you touched on with
like Gabe's abuse being like negated and stuff

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like that, That's exactly what I
was seeking in the whole end of the

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episode watching that, I was like, are they gonna, like, you

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know, portray this is this gonna
how are we gonna do this? And

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then they just skimmed it. Oh
whatever? She divorced him, right,

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you know, I really especially because
in the book she kills him. Yes,

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she Genie's gonna meduce it. Yes, and he said she sells him.

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Did you guys, did you all
watch the end credit scene? Yeah?

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Oh no, I didn't see he
there's an end credit scene math did

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you mind if I tell you?
Yeah? So basically it's it's it's it's

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it's him turing the stone, so
he it pans back to right before Percy.

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It's how I get back, or
how I had just gotten back.

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She changed the locks to the apartment
and he finds a package outside that says

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return to send her from the gods, and gave has opened it himself just

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to be a jerk and finally produces
his head and turns himself to stone.

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So they incorporated it. But again
it's sanitized because Sally doesn't kill him.

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It's just him being a jerk and
doing it to himself, which I think

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again, like Sally was was it
really diminishes Sally's character because she suffered through

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domestic abuse willingly to protect Percy,
and that's just not what's being portrayed.

219
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And then she finally gets a chance
to take that back and to get back

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at him and to like take back
her life and get rid of this vile,

221
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vile man. Like I didn't actually
hate Gabe. He was just a

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goofy loser as being from New Jersey, like I have met many many Jets

223
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fans that look an act like Gabe
in the show, and that's just not

224
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how he is in the books.
J E. T sh Jets Jets motherfucker.

225
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I'm a hardcore Jets fan. We're
not like that. But yeah,

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I definitely hear your point. And
yeah, and it's funny because also,

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like in the books, Gabe is
like calling the police on them and it's

228
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like doing all these things to like
put Percy in trouble, and that's never

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it kind of hinted at in the
show, but we don't get anywhere near

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as much of that. And I
really like what you said there about how

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how how you know impactful what Sally
does at the end there is and the

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way Percy helps her do it,
And to me, it's even worse because

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like to me, the Olympic,
it's funny that you thought that in this

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the Olympian parents aren't as bad because
I think they absolutely are. I think

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they're flat out abusive. And you're
right, Poseidon is nicer at that end

236
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scene, but the rest of the
time him like not acknowledging him, you

237
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know, all the other stuff like
the like Athena basically being like okay,

238
00:15:56.159 --> 00:15:58.679
well you were kind of rude.
So I'm gonna set this monster into possibly

239
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killing you. I think it's part
of why I was reading for Luke.

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I thought Luke was right because it's
especially when Percy says like, well,

241
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but our parents are trying their best. It's like that to me feels like

242
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a really bad message to send to
people, especially kids, if your parents

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are really being horrible, I think
you go ahead. I think one of

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the main overall points of the first
five Percy Jackson books and is that Luke

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isn't necessarily wrong. Like that's something
that they all struggle with later on in

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00:16:29.279 --> 00:16:34.360
the book, especially Annabeth because of
her relation to Luke. They do struggle

247
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with that, and that that theme
is brought up several times later on,

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which hopefully we do get to see
the screen. I hope we get all

249
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this. I hope we get heroes
of Olympus. I need everyone that,

250
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I need to see them all come
to life on the screen. But yeah,

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I think a big part of that
is just I can't explain it super

252
00:17:06.400 --> 00:17:08.039
quick. I just want to respond. I think I get where you're coming

253
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from and the gods part. But
I think what got me was that,

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like Sally drops a candle anywhere she
goes Poseidon shows up immediately to be by

255
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her side. Hephestus immediately helps Annabeth
Hermes lets him take the keys. They

256
00:17:22.480 --> 00:17:26.799
just they all seem to be being
a little bit nicer and a little more

257
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likable. In the books, they
were just hirks, and like I was

258
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like, these guys, like like
by the end, I'm all right,

259
00:17:33.000 --> 00:17:37.119
Poseidon's kind of cool, but like
they were all just real bad people.

260
00:17:37.119 --> 00:17:40.000
And I felt like in the in
the show, they just they were more

261
00:17:40.119 --> 00:17:45.160
likable. And besides, especially was
being a much better helper to Sally than

262
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it ever seemed like she was being. That's fair. That's fair, I

263
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guess to me. Then, my
problem is that the only parent Greek parent

264
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who looks truly awful is Athena.
Yeah, which feels really weird for her

265
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to be the worst because she tries
to kill her She doesn't try to kill

266
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her daughter, but she puts her
daughter in a life and death situation because

267
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her daughter was rude, Yeah,
or her daughter's friend was rude. I

268
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like wanted to physically put myself between
Poseidon and Sally when they were talking to

269
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each other to a restaurant. I
was like, no, don't talk to

270
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him, girl, like I wanted
to like get them apart. I was

271
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like, no, you do,
do not talk to him. I don't

272
00:18:22.720 --> 00:18:26.119
want any relationship between the two of
them. I need Paul to come in

273
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right now and steal Sally away.
Because the book presided as a show up

274
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until person has a birthday party at
the end and just rolls it, and

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that's such a better way, And
I don't know, I just yeah,

276
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yeah, because you're right, because
they didn't instead of making because I think

277
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the thing that they does in the
book is to say, like, you

278
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know, Luke is the kill monger. Luke is the magneto where he like

279
00:18:48.720 --> 00:18:52.000
has a good solid point, but
he's willing to kill humans. He's got

280
00:18:52.000 --> 00:18:56.519
a human killing sword, he's willing
to work with Chronos. And yeah,

281
00:18:56.559 --> 00:18:59.680
well, clearly though, there's a
lot about the show that we liked,

282
00:18:59.720 --> 00:19:02.960
because, like as Amelia was just
saying, like we do, you know,

283
00:19:03.079 --> 00:19:04.240
Mili was saying at least that she
wants more of it. I certainly

284
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want more of it. I think
there is a lot of good in this.

285
00:19:07.079 --> 00:19:10.200
So we can go back to some
of our critiques in a second,

286
00:19:10.200 --> 00:19:11.279
but let's just talk about what are
some of the things that really worked especially

287
00:19:11.279 --> 00:19:15.079
in those first couple episodes. And
I'll actually start by throwing one out.

288
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That's funny because they just talked with
Alex about this on the Strong Wars podcast.

289
00:19:19.279 --> 00:19:23.559
In the books, I think what
actually, let me back back this

290
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up a bit and actually ask you, Alex, when you were reading them

291
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as a kid, did you find
the scenes of the monsters scary? Depending

292
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I did not find I did not
find the like the actual monsters, the

293
00:19:44.480 --> 00:19:48.960
minotaur scary. Really, it was
kind of like humorous. What I did

294
00:19:48.000 --> 00:19:52.039
find scary in the books that I
don't think was actually scary. One that

295
00:19:52.039 --> 00:19:55.960
they reversed it in my opinion in
the show is that I found Haiti's scary.

296
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I found some of the gods scary
in the books, and they kind

297
00:19:57.960 --> 00:20:02.119
of made them more like in the
show, while the monsters, I felt

298
00:20:02.160 --> 00:20:04.359
like, became way scarier in the
show. Right. Well, yeah,

299
00:20:04.359 --> 00:20:07.640
because that's where we'll get to the
guards in a little bit. But I

300
00:20:07.640 --> 00:20:11.799
was getting the monsters specifically for me
reading them as an adult. They were

301
00:20:11.799 --> 00:20:14.680
all slapstick. You know, the
minuitar is chasing him, but the minutar

302
00:20:14.680 --> 00:20:17.319
is in Tidy Whitey's and we focus
on that, and like every Monster,

303
00:20:17.359 --> 00:20:21.960
there's always some silliness as it's trying
to adopt to the modern world, and

304
00:20:22.039 --> 00:20:23.720
this though, they were just straight
up terrifying. Like the first scene that

305
00:20:23.839 --> 00:20:26.240
minu tar was one of the things
that made me really be like, I

306
00:20:26.359 --> 00:20:30.039
like where the show is going because
it felt like it was a lot scarier

307
00:20:30.039 --> 00:20:37.440
than the books were. I agree. So that's kind of my first thing

308
00:20:37.440 --> 00:20:44.279
about what I like. What else
do you guys like? I like a

309
00:20:44.319 --> 00:20:49.039
little bit of the modernization which has
progressively happened in the books as they've come

310
00:20:49.079 --> 00:20:53.559
out, Like they've kind of like
the references of stage modern even though I'm

311
00:20:53.599 --> 00:21:00.279
the same age as Percy Jackson is
like chronologically, but even though he's still

312
00:21:00.279 --> 00:21:04.279
only like eighteen nineteen in the books, but they've kept the references modern and

313
00:21:04.359 --> 00:21:08.720
like a Percy Flossing. I thought
that was really funny and like updating the

314
00:21:08.799 --> 00:21:12.799
music that Grover sings, you know, things like that that kept it modern

315
00:21:14.119 --> 00:21:21.200
without like completely changing it. I
really appreciated. Yeah, I thought Grover's

316
00:21:21.240 --> 00:21:26.119
performance was the best thing in the
show. I think that I have opinions

317
00:21:26.119 --> 00:21:29.519
that all the different acting, but
I think Grover By and far like like

318
00:21:29.640 --> 00:21:36.319
Grover embodied exactly what I imagine Grover
being like growing up like this little shy,

319
00:21:37.000 --> 00:21:41.359
kind of goofy but also sharp,
little sader. The only the only

320
00:21:41.480 --> 00:21:44.039
thing that I felt it was a
little bit missing from his character. Was

321
00:21:44.039 --> 00:21:45.599
he anything he ate enough. I
felt like in the book he was constantly

322
00:21:45.680 --> 00:21:49.440
eating in cands and stuff. He
never ate a tin camp he did.

323
00:21:49.599 --> 00:21:52.359
I was very sad. I was
sad about that too. But general acting

324
00:21:52.400 --> 00:21:59.039
wise and the way he like portrayed
the character I thought was like spot on

325
00:21:59.160 --> 00:22:03.720
spectacular. I thought he stole the
show. In my opinion. I didn't

326
00:22:03.720 --> 00:22:07.799
think he was necessarily the best.
I actually really liked the kid playing Percy.

327
00:22:07.839 --> 00:22:10.000
But I thought all of them,
oh wow. I actually I think,

328
00:22:10.039 --> 00:22:11.160
honestly, I think the best acting
is Luke. But I think all

329
00:22:11.200 --> 00:22:15.279
of them were very, very good, especially for child actors. I do

330
00:22:15.319 --> 00:22:18.799
think Percy was spectacular. I personally
thought Anabeth was a little wooden. I

331
00:22:18.880 --> 00:22:22.119
just don't I don't know, compared
to the book, she didn't seem as

332
00:22:22.160 --> 00:22:26.640
like that's what what I'm looking for, like upfront, in your face.

333
00:22:26.759 --> 00:22:30.519
I think I think they interpreted the
characters being more like sit back and think

334
00:22:30.559 --> 00:22:33.799
wise. While in the book it's
a lot more take action on the flywise,

335
00:22:34.160 --> 00:22:37.319
and I wanted her to be a
little more aggressive, and maybe she

336
00:22:37.400 --> 00:22:42.039
will be in the future episodes or
future books, but that was my only

337
00:22:42.119 --> 00:22:45.559
That was my main critique of Annabeth
was I just was like, I need

338
00:22:45.599 --> 00:22:52.759
you to be more in it.
I don't know, Amelia, what was

339
00:22:52.799 --> 00:22:56.799
your take on the actors. I
kind of agree with the Annabeth stuff.

340
00:22:56.799 --> 00:23:00.920
I think it might have been more
of like a direct her kind of issues

341
00:23:00.960 --> 00:23:04.480
in an actor issue, because she
started off like really sassy like at the

342
00:23:04.519 --> 00:23:07.319
beginning there, and I was like, yeah, that's Annabeth, and then

343
00:23:07.359 --> 00:23:11.519
she kind of just like took a
step back and was more like, you

344
00:23:11.519 --> 00:23:17.480
know, a background character instead of
being like upfront and like, you know,

345
00:23:18.480 --> 00:23:22.359
making being a stronger lead. You
know, That's what the word I

346
00:23:22.359 --> 00:23:26.200
was looking for. Yeah, yeah, she's she's more sitting back. Well,

347
00:23:26.200 --> 00:23:29.000
like you said, like she's thinking, which is fine. She is

348
00:23:29.000 --> 00:23:33.240
a child of Athena, but that's
not how Annabeth is, right. Yeah,

349
00:23:33.240 --> 00:23:37.519
I definitely think that it's a director
thing, non acting thing, because

350
00:23:37.880 --> 00:23:41.759
what I interpreted it as was it
felt like that in this movie, in

351
00:23:41.839 --> 00:23:45.119
this show, they talk in the
books about how she has lived most of

352
00:23:45.119 --> 00:23:49.279
her life at Camp half Blood and
doesn't really know much about the world outside,

353
00:23:49.759 --> 00:23:52.759
but it felt like they were playing
that up a lot more in the

354
00:23:52.799 --> 00:23:57.640
show. So I interpreted as like
she was just a kind of uncomfortable with

355
00:23:57.640 --> 00:24:00.599
this leadership situation, you know,
in terms of she the leader, is

356
00:24:00.640 --> 00:24:06.319
Percy the leader, but also just
that she felt very like fish out of

357
00:24:06.319 --> 00:24:11.559
water, which I thought the actress
did a good job of portraying that character.

358
00:24:11.079 --> 00:24:14.440
But I agree with both of you, that's not the character is written

359
00:24:14.480 --> 00:24:18.920
in the books. Yeah. I
think I just have a very especially having

360
00:24:18.920 --> 00:24:23.519
grown up with the books, a
very strong idea of who Percy, Anameth,

361
00:24:23.559 --> 00:24:27.319
and Grover are. And I felt
like the direction they gave Percy and

362
00:24:27.359 --> 00:24:30.680
Grover was spot on with what I
always imagine, and the director to think

363
00:24:30.720 --> 00:24:33.680
of Annabeth just didn't wind up with
how I've always imagined Anabeth, and so

364
00:24:33.720 --> 00:24:37.839
I think it just bothered me.
I co couldn't see it, that's fair.

365
00:24:38.480 --> 00:24:41.319
Yeah, I thought the actress was
great, but I definitely think they

366
00:24:41.319 --> 00:24:48.039
made some directorial choices seemed weird.
Luke's acting spectacular, yeah, yeah,

367
00:24:48.079 --> 00:24:52.799
and Clarice. I thought Clarice was
also. I remember thinking in both the

368
00:24:52.799 --> 00:24:55.519
book and the movies that I wanted
more of her, and I thought the

369
00:24:55.559 --> 00:25:00.440
actress they got to play Clarice was
so spawn on good and I in the

370
00:25:00.480 --> 00:25:06.400
book she specifically described as ugly,
and I Rick Rick Rick Rardan, the

371
00:25:06.440 --> 00:25:08.799
author has really like grown up with
the books himself as well, and he

372
00:25:08.839 --> 00:25:12.160
has said that like part of why
he started including more queer characters was he

373
00:25:12.160 --> 00:25:15.880
he got, you know, negative
feedback that they weren't there, and he

374
00:25:15.960 --> 00:25:21.440
want he listened and he learned,
And I think that his writing of women

375
00:25:21.599 --> 00:25:23.920
characters has grown a lot. And
I think that a little bit of the

376
00:25:23.920 --> 00:25:27.440
writing of Clarice in the first book, as you know, she's kind of

377
00:25:27.559 --> 00:25:30.519
ugly and looks kind of like,
you know, like Tom not even Tom

378
00:25:30.559 --> 00:25:33.799
boyish, but just kind of like
she's heavy set and she's not pretty at

379
00:25:33.799 --> 00:25:38.680
all. And the fact that the
actress who plays Carise is gorgeous and mean

380
00:25:38.720 --> 00:25:44.200
as hell and like not Caddy but
just going to totally kick your ass.

381
00:25:44.440 --> 00:25:47.279
I thought it was just it.
It really felt like an evolution of the

382
00:25:47.359 --> 00:25:51.440
character in that way. But what
I really really loved I have a slight

383
00:25:51.599 --> 00:25:55.720
different opinion on that. I get
what you're saying, but I actually it

384
00:25:55.759 --> 00:26:02.279
actually kind of it bothered me a
little bit because I was expecting a plus

385
00:26:02.319 --> 00:26:04.680
size actress, like, you know, why why can't we have, like,

386
00:26:04.799 --> 00:26:08.720
you know, a plus size actress
who in the books, you know,

387
00:26:10.039 --> 00:26:12.559
Chris described as having like a camel
jacket and being very punk and like,

388
00:26:12.680 --> 00:26:18.599
you know, and I felt like, you know, now I want

389
00:26:18.599 --> 00:26:21.799
to cry, was saying, I
really did enjoy her performance at her acting

390
00:26:21.839 --> 00:26:23.359
a lot in the show, but
I don't know, it felt to me

391
00:26:23.480 --> 00:26:26.720
like I was like, why why
did you have to take that aspect of

392
00:26:26.759 --> 00:26:30.160
christ away? Like why can't she
be a little like what's wrong with being

393
00:26:30.160 --> 00:26:33.640
a little a little beefy as you
as a child? Why do you why

394
00:26:33.680 --> 00:26:37.599
do all of the characters have to
be like fit in shape? Like,

395
00:26:37.680 --> 00:26:38.519
I don't know, I think that
part just kind of got me because I

396
00:26:38.559 --> 00:26:41.599
was like, I felt like in
the in the book, that was one

397
00:26:41.640 --> 00:26:45.880
of his better ways of like being
a little more inclusive at how the folks

398
00:26:45.920 --> 00:26:48.440
with the camp and I felt like
they could have. I don't know,

399
00:26:48.480 --> 00:26:52.119
That's just how I interpret it.
And and I and I agree with Chrissy's

400
00:26:52.119 --> 00:26:56.119
gorgeous in the show, and I
was like, did they did they make

401
00:26:56.160 --> 00:27:00.319
that choice? You know, like
why did they make that choice? I

402
00:27:00.720 --> 00:27:03.160
just kind of I don't know.
Yeah, I agree with Alex too.

403
00:27:03.160 --> 00:27:07.119
I mean, like you niver see
especially like plus sized child actors. You

404
00:27:07.119 --> 00:27:10.960
know, how many of those do
you see? You know, it would

405
00:27:10.960 --> 00:27:15.599
have been good to get some representation
out there. You know, that's fair.

406
00:27:15.799 --> 00:27:18.519
I mean I would just push back
and say that I think that you

407
00:27:18.519 --> 00:27:22.079
could have had plus size and still
have her gorgeous. I'm more to she

408
00:27:22.200 --> 00:27:25.240
described it's ugly. Yeah, no, no, yeah, but I in

409
00:27:25.279 --> 00:27:26.960
that REGARDLE totally agree, although I
do think there's something weird if you only

410
00:27:26.960 --> 00:27:30.640
have two real female campers we get
to know and the good one is standing,

411
00:27:30.799 --> 00:27:34.279
the bad one is is heavier.
But but I also hear what you're

412
00:27:34.319 --> 00:27:38.559
saying, like it's interesting that that's
the part of the representation that you picked

413
00:27:38.599 --> 00:27:41.279
up on, because I was just
more focusing on the ugly part. But

414
00:27:41.319 --> 00:27:45.640
yeah, I think both of us
have good points. Yeah, I also

415
00:27:45.720 --> 00:27:48.119
will say that I did. I
think you're right that a lot of the

416
00:27:48.160 --> 00:27:51.599
kids looked like they were, you
know, really in great shape and kind

417
00:27:51.599 --> 00:27:53.720
of stuff like that. And I
did like that there was one of the

418
00:27:53.799 --> 00:27:56.480
kids who was in great shape,
was also in a wheelchair, and that

419
00:27:56.559 --> 00:28:00.200
was definitely a nice touch. I
thought, I'm asking you a question in

420
00:28:00.240 --> 00:28:06.480
regards to that. Do you feel
like when they include a character like you're

421
00:28:06.480 --> 00:28:07.799
somebody in a wheelchair, for example, and they're only on screen for a

422
00:28:07.839 --> 00:28:11.799
brief moment, does it feel inclusive
or does it feel like they're just doing

423
00:28:11.839 --> 00:28:15.799
it to check a box? Like
that's a genuine question, like when Disney

424
00:28:15.319 --> 00:28:18.559
like throws in a character or whether
they whether it's like just a person of

425
00:28:18.599 --> 00:28:23.640
color or you know, you know, if you want to include you know,

426
00:28:23.680 --> 00:28:26.839
an indigenous actor, so someone where
there's just a briefly on screen just

427
00:28:26.880 --> 00:28:30.480
to say, oh, look,
we have inclusion. Like did you feel

428
00:28:30.480 --> 00:28:33.640
like the fact that the character was
only on screen briefly was beneficial or do

429
00:28:33.680 --> 00:28:37.720
you feel like it felt like Disney
was just kind of doing that just to

430
00:28:37.759 --> 00:28:42.640
be Disney. I think I'm kind
of happy to finally be a box that

431
00:28:42.720 --> 00:28:47.200
someone wants to check. Yeah,
Like I do think in that regard was

432
00:28:47.240 --> 00:28:49.480
just box checking and that's not enough. Yeah, but I think that like

433
00:28:51.160 --> 00:28:53.400
a the fact that he festus,
I mean, this isn't like something Rorden

434
00:28:53.440 --> 00:28:56.440
came up with this is like from
the Greek myths themselves, but like he

435
00:28:56.519 --> 00:29:00.920
is disabled and they play that as
disabled when he's up. And the fact

436
00:29:00.960 --> 00:29:04.279
that I know in later things there's
gonna be more of that, and the

437
00:29:04.319 --> 00:29:07.640
fact that most of them, Like
I think, if we'd gotten to know

438
00:29:07.759 --> 00:29:11.480
like five other campers, but then
the one in the wheelchair had only been

439
00:29:11.519 --> 00:29:14.400
on screen for two seconds, I
would have felt differently. But the fact

440
00:29:14.400 --> 00:29:18.440
that like, really we get to
know, you know, are our three

441
00:29:18.519 --> 00:29:23.039
heroes, Clarice and Luke, and
that's about it. And so having like

442
00:29:23.160 --> 00:29:26.559
one of the many others be you
know, there's a nation who's only on

443
00:29:26.599 --> 00:29:30.440
screen for a few seconds, there's
you know, et cetera, et cetera.

444
00:29:30.640 --> 00:29:33.160
So but yeah, I think it's
a fine line to walk, and

445
00:29:33.200 --> 00:29:37.559
I kind of think that disability has
been so long forgotten in that regard that

446
00:29:37.599 --> 00:29:41.079
it's we're just at the like.
But also probably like if I hadn't seen

447
00:29:41.119 --> 00:29:45.839
Echo a week ago and felt like
I see myself on screen in the most

448
00:29:45.839 --> 00:29:48.200
represented a way anyone's ever been represented, which is weird because she's a native

449
00:29:48.240 --> 00:29:52.880
woman, deaf person who I'm not
any of those three things. But I

450
00:29:52.920 --> 00:29:56.279
saw in her more of my story
as an amputee than I've ever seen on

451
00:29:56.279 --> 00:30:00.680
screen. But yeah, it's a
good question, Like if this was the

452
00:30:00.880 --> 00:30:03.640
like, look, we have superhero
representation, you got to be a guy,

453
00:30:03.640 --> 00:30:07.519
I'd be like, no, walk
that right. And I fact I

454
00:30:07.640 --> 00:30:10.160
asked that because you know, if
I might ask one other kind of a

455
00:30:10.200 --> 00:30:15.079
larger question in that I know that
you know, there's a lot of fans

456
00:30:15.160 --> 00:30:18.480
and Rick pushed heavily back against this
because a lot of it came across this

457
00:30:18.640 --> 00:30:22.559
very racist commentary that were upset that
they cast a black girl for Annabeth because

458
00:30:22.559 --> 00:30:27.200
in the book she's described as a
white, blonde California girl. And I

459
00:30:27.200 --> 00:30:33.240
don't think that her race matters in
the slightest in her and how she and

460
00:30:33.240 --> 00:30:37.519
how anything happens in the books.
But people, you know, I've heard

461
00:30:37.519 --> 00:30:41.079
the argument from people that Disney and
Rick chose to do a lot of this

462
00:30:41.200 --> 00:30:45.880
casting just to seem inclusive, and
that it was not. But they did

463
00:30:45.920 --> 00:30:48.400
it just to be inclusive and and
have people call around screen and not like,

464
00:30:49.960 --> 00:30:52.559
let me say, have a bit
of worthy instead of just doing that

465
00:30:52.640 --> 00:30:56.960
to have him write more you know, inclusive characters in the first but it's

466
00:30:57.000 --> 00:30:59.960
like, you know, Indi Codeangela, who you haven't met in the show,

467
00:31:00.440 --> 00:31:03.920
is Hispanic. And you know,
writing those you know, different keys,

468
00:31:03.519 --> 00:31:08.319
writing the characters a certain way.
Do you feel like the castings were

469
00:31:08.400 --> 00:31:11.920
done? You know? What is
your what is you'all take on all of

470
00:31:11.920 --> 00:31:15.079
that dialogue? Well, first of
all, as a million points out,

471
00:31:15.160 --> 00:31:19.799
Nico is Italian, He's not Latino. You're a radio yes, thank you,

472
00:31:19.799 --> 00:31:25.799
thank you. And then then we
have Hazel too, and like he

473
00:31:25.839 --> 00:31:27.920
got better at writing those characters as
the books went on. Yeah, he

474
00:31:27.960 --> 00:31:30.960
adds a lot more and Raina and
everyone, just everyone, and like here's

475
00:31:33.400 --> 00:31:37.400
so much, so much more story. Yeah. Yeah, And that's kind

476
00:31:37.400 --> 00:31:41.279
of what I'm saying. And I
think, honestly, I like from a

477
00:31:41.279 --> 00:31:45.440
lot of it, Like I kind
of feel like, given that growth from

478
00:31:45.480 --> 00:31:48.079
Rick Reardon himself, for him to
go back and say, yeah, I

479
00:31:48.079 --> 00:31:51.480
wrote those books is probably a little
too white. I want to fix that

480
00:31:51.519 --> 00:31:56.559
when I bring it to screen is
totally fine. I also think that if

481
00:31:56.599 --> 00:32:00.519
you have the chance to have Lance
Riddick anywhere in your show, you change

482
00:32:00.880 --> 00:32:05.839
everything so it fits around Lance Riddick. And I do think that the way

483
00:32:05.880 --> 00:32:08.960
that gods are written. The fact
that Zeus is played by a black actor

484
00:32:09.319 --> 00:32:13.559
by no means we actually never mind
know that because Annabeth is a Feenus daughter.

485
00:32:13.599 --> 00:32:17.079
So ignore everything I just said.
But certainly I feel like the idea

486
00:32:17.079 --> 00:32:21.319
of like Lance Riddick, Just like
the moment he came on screen, My

487
00:32:21.359 --> 00:32:22.599
spouse Mary was like that Zeus.
Of course, that Zeus. He's so

488
00:32:22.680 --> 00:32:25.799
perfect. It makes you wonder who
they're going to cast Esthalia too, if

489
00:32:25.799 --> 00:32:29.519
they have. If they have Lance
Reddick playing as Zeus, I mean,

490
00:32:29.640 --> 00:32:31.160
who are we what kind of character
we're gonna get for Thalia, which is

491
00:32:31.440 --> 00:32:36.519
my favorite character personally in the whole
series. Is I want them to cast

492
00:32:36.559 --> 00:32:40.720
me as Salia. I don't care
that I'm thirty well, especially because and

493
00:32:40.759 --> 00:32:44.359
I think this is a real tragedy
that obviously goes far beyond the show but

494
00:32:44.359 --> 00:32:46.880
does affect the show. Lance Riddick
has passed on. Yeah, and I

495
00:32:46.880 --> 00:32:50.279
don't know if they're going to recast
him, or if they're going to like

496
00:32:50.480 --> 00:32:53.359
use something else or have Zeus be
mostly off screen. But yeah, it

497
00:32:53.400 --> 00:32:58.519
is an interesting question. I don't
guess they recast him, because gods can

498
00:32:58.599 --> 00:33:01.200
change their form. I thought they
could very easily. Yeah, but it's

499
00:33:01.240 --> 00:33:08.000
hard. It's very hard to recast. It's rick of anyone else. Yeah,

500
00:33:08.039 --> 00:33:10.640
he was so good in this,
even though the part of Zeus is

501
00:33:10.680 --> 00:33:15.279
so different than the books, but
I still loved him. For me,

502
00:33:15.559 --> 00:33:17.519
I think kind of the high water
mark of the show because it's both my

503
00:33:17.599 --> 00:33:22.119
favorite point and also I think after
it starts to go downhill was in the

504
00:33:22.200 --> 00:33:27.400
Medusa episode, and this also felt
to me like an episode where they had

505
00:33:27.440 --> 00:33:31.920
intentionally updated it because in the books, she is one of the monsters who

506
00:33:31.960 --> 00:33:37.279
they have to fight, and you
know, she at first appears kind of

507
00:33:37.359 --> 00:33:39.200
nice to them, and then you
know, they quickly realize that she's trying

508
00:33:39.240 --> 00:33:44.160
to like get them onto her side, you know, for her fight against

509
00:33:44.200 --> 00:33:46.079
the gods, and then they have
to fight her and kill her. And

510
00:33:47.559 --> 00:33:51.759
one of the things I think that
has happened in more recent like just cultural

511
00:33:51.759 --> 00:33:55.000
development, in large part because of
an incredible statue that was made, but

512
00:33:55.039 --> 00:33:59.839
also because of other things, is
there's really been a change in how Medusa

513
00:33:59.880 --> 00:34:04.720
is perceived in popular culture, and
this understanding of that when you really look

514
00:34:04.720 --> 00:34:09.239
at the Zeus, look at the
myths, Medusa is a woman who is

515
00:34:09.320 --> 00:34:14.920
sexually assaulted in the temple and then
gets punished by the gods for nothing that

516
00:34:14.960 --> 00:34:19.840
she did. It's one hundred percent
of victim blaming and that doesn't come up

517
00:34:19.840 --> 00:34:24.760
in the books because that conversation wasn't
really happening yet. And I really loved

518
00:34:25.039 --> 00:34:30.440
Medusa's portrayal in this of she does
get to be sympathetic, and she does

519
00:34:30.480 --> 00:34:34.079
get to say, hey, think
about how poorly I was treated. This

520
00:34:34.239 --> 00:34:37.880
wasn't fair. And she does then
like turn on the kids and try to

521
00:34:37.960 --> 00:34:40.519
kill them, and so I understand
why they have to kill her. That

522
00:34:40.559 --> 00:34:44.559
makes me sad because they need the
head for so many other plot points.

523
00:34:45.840 --> 00:34:46.880
Yeah, I gen really loved the
way she was portrayed, in the way

524
00:34:46.880 --> 00:34:51.840
that they they allowed her story updated
as our sort of cultural understanding of the

525
00:34:51.880 --> 00:34:58.800
myth was updated. But what did
you both think of it? I liked

526
00:34:58.840 --> 00:35:01.920
the episode. I think that the
only thing I would have liked different And

527
00:35:01.960 --> 00:35:07.039
this is a critique I had throughout
is they just immediately knew it was Medusa.

528
00:35:07.719 --> 00:35:10.639
Like that happened multiple times, so
they just immediately knew. And I

529
00:35:10.639 --> 00:35:14.760
think it took away a little bit
from like the surprise of like look at

530
00:35:14.760 --> 00:35:16.280
all these stones look at this nice
lady, Oh my god, and like,

531
00:35:16.639 --> 00:35:21.239
I feel like maybe if they had
met her, they hear her story,

532
00:35:21.280 --> 00:35:23.000
they get to know her like this, similar things can happen, and

533
00:35:23.039 --> 00:35:27.159
then then they realized it's Medusa,
after they've connected with her and realized she's

534
00:35:27.159 --> 00:35:29.840
a kind person. That would have
actually sunk it even more for me,

535
00:35:29.840 --> 00:35:31.519
because I feel like a big part
of the books was that, like they

536
00:35:31.519 --> 00:35:36.000
are learning, Annabeth has not seen
outside, has not been outside for the

537
00:35:36.000 --> 00:35:39.440
world Jesus stepped it over. Annabeth
has not been out of camp very often.

538
00:35:40.320 --> 00:35:45.079
Grover hasn't been on a quest since
he helped save Luke and h and

539
00:35:45.159 --> 00:35:49.280
Annabeth and and goletho Alia get turned
in to a tree, and Percy's brand

540
00:35:49.280 --> 00:35:52.320
new to all of this, And
I felt like them just immediately having the

541
00:35:52.400 --> 00:35:58.079
answer took some air out of the
sales. It didn't take away from how

542
00:35:58.159 --> 00:36:00.519
much I like to portrayal of Medusa
and how that episode went. I actually

543
00:36:00.559 --> 00:36:02.880
let a lot of the changes they
did make in the episode and felt like

544
00:36:02.920 --> 00:36:07.679
it was a really fun, refreshing
take on it. I just wished it

545
00:36:07.760 --> 00:36:10.119
like there was a little more suspense
build of, like you know, they

546
00:36:10.280 --> 00:36:14.440
come upon this place, they meet
this kind woman, they listen to her

547
00:36:14.440 --> 00:36:16.519
story, they connect with her,
and then we find out it's Medusa.

548
00:36:16.559 --> 00:36:22.400
It's just right away. I'm like, man, come on, Mallia.

549
00:36:22.440 --> 00:36:24.639
Would you think of her? And
the way they kind of updated her story

550
00:36:24.679 --> 00:36:31.760
made her more sympathetic. Well,
I think what that story was bold for

551
00:36:31.880 --> 00:36:37.320
Rick to include anyway, you know, given it is what it is,

552
00:36:37.559 --> 00:36:42.280
and you know, I have a
Medusa tattoo, and you know, everything

553
00:36:42.320 --> 00:36:45.559
that stands for and everything that is
a hard subject to broach when you're broaching

554
00:36:45.559 --> 00:36:49.159
middle schoolers, Like I get that, like I have. I have a

555
00:36:49.199 --> 00:36:52.519
sixth grader, you know, perfect
age for Percy Jackson right now. And

556
00:36:53.960 --> 00:36:58.360
I think they did the best they
could. But I agree to Alex like

557
00:36:58.400 --> 00:37:00.360
they rushed it, like where they
were like, oh, we know she's

558
00:37:00.400 --> 00:37:02.599
Medusa. That was a little lame. I liked the mystery where they're kind

559
00:37:02.639 --> 00:37:07.480
of like piecing it together, you
know, But I do like I did

560
00:37:07.519 --> 00:37:10.719
like the Medusa kind of went more
after Annabeth like look at what your mother

561
00:37:10.800 --> 00:37:15.480
did to me and I didn't do
anything, you know. I really liked

562
00:37:15.519 --> 00:37:22.239
that Medusa had that like spunk where
she's where she was got to express herself

563
00:37:22.280 --> 00:37:29.079
and her story in the most Disneyfied
way possible. Yeah, but you know

564
00:37:29.239 --> 00:37:32.960
I liked that, Like that felt
good to me. Yeah. Yeah,

565
00:37:32.960 --> 00:37:36.480
I think that makes sense. And
I think also in some ways that's Annabeth's

566
00:37:36.519 --> 00:37:39.519
best episode because I think that's where, you know, Percy is the one.

567
00:37:39.559 --> 00:37:43.320
One thing I always liked about Annabeth
and Percy's story is that they're such

568
00:37:43.320 --> 00:37:46.840
opposites. Percy is the one who
is just learning about the gods and it's

569
00:37:47.000 --> 00:37:52.440
very cynical and detached. Annabeth is
the the gods can do no wrong.

570
00:37:52.000 --> 00:37:54.880
And this was I think a really
great way of Medusa being the first one

571
00:37:54.920 --> 00:37:58.679
to sort of poke at Annabeth and
be like, really, is your mom

572
00:37:58.719 --> 00:38:00.679
that perfect? So where do you
think things started to come up? Where

573
00:38:00.679 --> 00:38:05.519
the whales start to come off the
bus? What are some of things that

574
00:38:05.519 --> 00:38:10.039
didn't work for you? The Lotus
casino? Yeah, I've already talked to

575
00:38:10.119 --> 00:38:15.880
you about this. I will never
we did not learn from our mistakes of

576
00:38:15.920 --> 00:38:20.320
the past. Why are their children
at a casino? It is not a

577
00:38:20.360 --> 00:38:24.519
casino, It is an arcade.
And you have like these adults like they

578
00:38:25.079 --> 00:38:30.000
they walk into a Vegas casino and
are handed unlimited gambling money, and they

579
00:38:30.079 --> 00:38:32.719
just go, oh, this seems
right, Like Annabeths is just like yeah,

580
00:38:32.760 --> 00:38:36.679
this is normal, like smart Wise
Girl, Annabets, It's just like,

581
00:38:36.760 --> 00:38:39.119
yeah, the math checks out.
We definitely look twenty one and can

582
00:38:39.159 --> 00:38:45.039
gamble. And then I think something
that was hard to portray. I think

583
00:38:45.079 --> 00:38:47.320
they did try to portray it is
the people in the different error outfits.

584
00:38:47.480 --> 00:38:52.199
Unfortunately, people in Vegas just kind
of dressed like that I've noticed, so

585
00:38:52.400 --> 00:38:55.840
it was kind of hard to tell
until they were directly talking to people that

586
00:38:55.920 --> 00:39:00.320
they were supposed to be undated clothing. I don't know how they could have

587
00:39:00.360 --> 00:39:04.400
made that better or worse. I
think if they had sex stuck with the

588
00:39:04.280 --> 00:39:07.480
theme of it just being children in
there, it would have been easier to

589
00:39:07.519 --> 00:39:12.400
tell that everybody was from different periods
of time. Yeah, I really I

590
00:39:12.599 --> 00:39:15.239
don't like that they just go in
there and talk to Hermes like that.

591
00:39:16.719 --> 00:39:21.639
You know, we kind of changed
the whole thing there. I And you

592
00:39:21.679 --> 00:39:28.880
know, I don't I don't like
Linn wil Miranda as Hermes, but that's

593
00:39:29.360 --> 00:39:31.320
I just feel like Disney's played him
too much. Honestly, it's something personal

594
00:39:31.360 --> 00:39:37.679
against him. I just feel like
he's in Money grab Casting. Mm hmmm,

595
00:39:37.320 --> 00:39:40.920
I agree fully. I mean,
I also I love women Win Men

596
00:39:40.920 --> 00:39:44.519
wil Miranda. I'm I think Hamilton
fan. I love him and like all

597
00:39:44.559 --> 00:39:47.920
his Broadway stuff, and like I
like the scores he's done for Jay.

598
00:39:49.000 --> 00:39:52.239
But it just it didn't it didn't
fit here to me. I think I

599
00:39:52.320 --> 00:39:54.320
just all I could see was women
Will Miranda. I couldn't see, like

600
00:39:54.360 --> 00:40:00.199
I couldn't separate the character from the
actor. And I also agree that this

601
00:40:00.239 --> 00:40:02.920
is kind of where a lot of
it fell off for me. Again,

602
00:40:02.920 --> 00:40:07.320
there have been moments throughout that were
like kind of poking me the wrong way,

603
00:40:07.320 --> 00:40:09.199
but this just, I mean again, it's again, it's like the

604
00:40:09.320 --> 00:40:14.159
immediate before they even got into the
place, they're like, do remember we

605
00:40:14.159 --> 00:40:15.480
can't stay here long? Like this
is you know, we know the myth,

606
00:40:15.519 --> 00:40:17.639
this is what happens. Don't do
like whatever. And like again in

607
00:40:17.679 --> 00:40:22.000
the book, they get trapped.
They really are caught up, and like

608
00:40:22.039 --> 00:40:25.400
they again they kind of water that
down. And yeah, and this is

609
00:40:25.440 --> 00:40:30.480
actually the single moment that I'm gonna
give the movie a piece of credit.

610
00:40:31.239 --> 00:40:36.239
In the movie, Percy realizes that
they're stuck because he goes to way Pinball

611
00:40:36.280 --> 00:40:38.599
next to some guy, like some
hippie guy dressing like close in the seventies

612
00:40:38.599 --> 00:40:43.559
and he makes some reference to like
a yeah, I love this this movie

613
00:40:43.679 --> 00:40:45.760
whatever the Pinball Game was, you
know, best movie of the year nineteen

614
00:40:45.840 --> 00:40:50.159
seventy, and it like makes you
realize that like time moves differently. And

615
00:40:50.199 --> 00:40:52.079
I was like, wow, that
was a clever way of doing it.

616
00:40:52.280 --> 00:40:55.199
And I feel like a simple interaction
like a two second line or something could

617
00:40:55.239 --> 00:40:59.800
have really done that, because I
feel like that wasn't really portrayed as strongly

618
00:41:00.760 --> 00:41:05.239
and they missed the deadline like this
made them lose all of that time where

619
00:41:05.239 --> 00:41:07.800
they just fully missed the deadline.
That just takes all the wind out of

620
00:41:07.800 --> 00:41:12.679
the quest. What what what are
we doing? We'll get to the stuff

621
00:41:12.719 --> 00:41:16.079
about the gods in a second one
there, just on the Casino Verus arcade

622
00:41:16.119 --> 00:41:19.400
thing. I don't know if this
is why they did it, but I'm

623
00:41:19.440 --> 00:41:22.239
curious, Alex, as a kid, did you go to arcades and they

624
00:41:22.360 --> 00:41:27.039
took quarters in the machine? Okay? So that because I wondered if they

625
00:41:27.039 --> 00:41:30.559
think that like modern kids don't and
maybe like Jen Alfa, Amelia, does

626
00:41:30.599 --> 00:41:32.519
your daughter ever want to go to
or your child ever want to go to

627
00:41:32.639 --> 00:41:39.039
I don't want to go to the
casino. But like I mean, like

628
00:41:39.079 --> 00:41:42.719
we got a Demon Busters, you
know, like we go to arcades.

629
00:41:42.960 --> 00:41:45.199
I mean, yeah, yes,
So there's no reason why I couldn't have

630
00:41:45.239 --> 00:41:49.000
been like, there's definitely that's definitely
still a part of it. Just did

631
00:41:49.000 --> 00:41:52.920
it to fit the Las Vegas five? Yeah, yeah, I don't know.

632
00:41:52.000 --> 00:41:54.880
Children in casinos, I don't know. That's such a weird stretch for

633
00:41:54.960 --> 00:41:58.360
me. And they did in the
movie, they did it in the show.

634
00:41:58.559 --> 00:42:00.719
I don't get it. Why can't
you just make it an arcade?

635
00:42:00.800 --> 00:42:04.280
Like why did it have to be
a casino? Like we know it's in

636
00:42:04.360 --> 00:42:07.559
Vegas, but it's implying that these
children are in there playing like they're showing

637
00:42:07.559 --> 00:42:14.840
like people playing poker and stuff,
like it's put in the movie when Grover

638
00:42:15.000 --> 00:42:17.880
was just going down with like eight
ladies at a craps table, is these

639
00:42:19.000 --> 00:42:22.400
like row and dice? I'm like
Jesus, oh well, And especially because

640
00:42:22.440 --> 00:42:25.440
in the book, one of the
things I think that really comes across really

641
00:42:25.480 --> 00:42:30.599
well and this actually is is like
legitimate to the lotus eaters from the Odyssey,

642
00:42:31.119 --> 00:42:36.880
Uh, is that the original work
by Homer is that in the book.

643
00:42:37.360 --> 00:42:39.360
You know, they've been sleeping in
buses, they've been sleeping by the

644
00:42:39.400 --> 00:42:43.880
side of the road, they've they've
they've had all these horrible offul experiences,

645
00:42:44.519 --> 00:42:47.239
and here's a it's not just an
arcade. It's a hotel where they have

646
00:42:47.400 --> 00:42:54.280
rooms waiting for them and these comfortable
beds and linen sheets and showers that are

647
00:42:54.280 --> 00:43:00.719
just bats that are so luxurious.
And it's the the incredible contrast between all

648
00:43:00.760 --> 00:43:04.760
of this like awfulness, where and
also that everyone has been turning their backs

649
00:43:04.800 --> 00:43:07.880
on them. All the gods are
trying to screw them or ignoring them,

650
00:43:07.079 --> 00:43:10.440
none of their parents are helping,
and here the whole staff is like,

651
00:43:10.480 --> 00:43:14.920
oh, Percy Jackson, We're so
glad to see you. And to me,

652
00:43:15.039 --> 00:43:17.199
that's a big part of what makes
it so appealing. And that and

653
00:43:17.239 --> 00:43:20.559
the awesome games because again like,
yeah, I don't know many twelve year

654
00:43:20.559 --> 00:43:22.679
olds or fourteen year olds we're gonna
be like, ooh, blackjack. It's

655
00:43:22.760 --> 00:43:25.079
kind of a boring game unless you
have a chance to win money at it.

656
00:43:27.920 --> 00:43:30.840
So yeah, I just thought that
whole scene was done weird. And

657
00:43:30.119 --> 00:43:32.480
as for the Linn Manuel Miranda part
of it, when we start to get

658
00:43:32.519 --> 00:43:37.400
into the gods. For me,
I grew I was someone who really love

659
00:43:37.480 --> 00:43:40.320
Greek myths growing up, and I
think in the Greek mythology, at least,

660
00:43:40.800 --> 00:43:45.920
Hermes is really portrayed as like the
teenager of the group. Like he

661
00:43:45.000 --> 00:43:50.360
is he's the youngest or the gods, and he's still like kind of a

662
00:43:50.360 --> 00:43:52.199
manchild in a lot of ways,
Like he's you know, supposed like he's

663
00:43:52.239 --> 00:43:54.480
the guy who you imagine if he
went over to his house, like he'd

664
00:43:54.519 --> 00:43:59.119
have like some empty pizza boxes and
probably be like uple not playing video games.

665
00:44:00.119 --> 00:44:02.559
One of the things that I always
loved about the book is that I

666
00:44:02.559 --> 00:44:07.039
think this is more developed in the
later books of the series, but you

667
00:44:07.079 --> 00:44:09.119
get the idea of is that like
Hermes wasn't old enough to have it to

668
00:44:09.199 --> 00:44:12.880
be a father yet, and that's
part of why he was not a great

669
00:44:12.880 --> 00:44:15.039
father to Luke, and like none
of the gods were good fathers. But

670
00:44:15.079 --> 00:44:17.119
then he was kind of like,
you know, he's kind of like that

671
00:44:17.159 --> 00:44:20.400
manchild who has a kid, has
no idea what to do with him.

672
00:44:20.960 --> 00:44:24.000
And yeah, so making it minimal
Miranda, who is just much older and

673
00:44:24.119 --> 00:44:29.840
distinguished and like it just felt all
wrong and it just I don't know.

674
00:44:29.960 --> 00:44:31.239
It took the way they introduced the
character who is not as good as the

675
00:44:31.239 --> 00:44:35.239
way they introduced him in the books, and like the fact that like the

676
00:44:35.400 --> 00:44:39.199
kind of brushed past a little bit, like which just briefly explained how Luke's

677
00:44:39.239 --> 00:44:43.320
mom was a seer and like everything
that happened. I was like, Where's

678
00:44:43.639 --> 00:44:46.639
There's so much more exposition. This
is important to understanding Luke in his backstory

679
00:44:46.679 --> 00:44:50.800
and why he thinks the way he
thinks. Why are we rushing through this

680
00:44:50.880 --> 00:44:53.320
story? It just it felt like
they were just trying to squeeze it in

681
00:44:53.400 --> 00:44:58.920
for no reason. Yeah, Dide
wants you to feel too short to you,

682
00:44:59.440 --> 00:45:01.599
Like I I think a seat like
a movie was you could never do

683
00:45:01.639 --> 00:45:05.519
this book and it felt way too
short they rush. Yeah. I felt

684
00:45:05.519 --> 00:45:07.239
like a ten episode or twelve episode
series would have worked much better. I

685
00:45:07.280 --> 00:45:10.960
was entirely surprised about how short the
episode were. I was like, that's

686
00:45:12.000 --> 00:45:15.280
it, yeah that Like there was
one that was like under forty minutes.

687
00:45:15.360 --> 00:45:19.440
I was like, wow, okay, Like I feel like it takes me

688
00:45:19.599 --> 00:45:23.000
longer to read that, and that's
saying something. Yeah, And I felt

689
00:45:23.000 --> 00:45:25.920
like they really wanted to focus on
the action adventure, you know, like

690
00:45:25.960 --> 00:45:30.920
where it's like I actually really care
about this mother of monsters and her holy

691
00:45:30.960 --> 00:45:36.920
dynamic. Then I do like watching
CGI of this huge scorpion Camara monster.

692
00:45:37.159 --> 00:45:39.800
Yeah, the pacing just felt weird
to me. Throughout it felt like they

693
00:45:39.920 --> 00:45:44.559
like were just I don't know,
like sometimes they spent time, like with

694
00:45:44.679 --> 00:45:46.880
getting from point A to point B, I spent a lot of time expisaying

695
00:45:47.079 --> 00:45:51.760
like a short period of time,
and other times start going through multiple days

696
00:45:51.800 --> 00:45:55.280
in like ten minutes. I agree
with you, I think ten twelve episodes

697
00:45:55.280 --> 00:46:00.519
would have really helped. I mean
just skipped over a bunch the Empire state,

698
00:46:00.559 --> 00:46:01.800
Pudy go up to the Olympus,
which should have been this big,

699
00:46:01.920 --> 00:46:08.239
grandiose climactic moment, so her five
minutes. Yeah, what do you all

700
00:46:08.280 --> 00:46:10.800
think about the way the other gods
were trained? Let's actually start with Poseidon

701
00:46:15.559 --> 00:46:19.159
too soft fully? Why is he
like care? I don't like that I

702
00:46:19.199 --> 00:46:22.440
don't trust. Yeah, it makes
me nervous. I don't like that he's

703
00:46:22.480 --> 00:46:25.760
being nice. I don't like that
he talked to Sally. Ever, I

704
00:46:25.760 --> 00:46:29.920
don't want him to ever talk to
her ever again. I would put a

705
00:46:29.960 --> 00:46:35.440
restraining order on him. For her. I don't like that he cared as

706
00:46:35.519 --> 00:46:40.800
much about Percy. You know,
I didn't like it. I it was

707
00:46:40.840 --> 00:46:45.519
weird they were trying to make us
feel compassionate for the gods when Luke makes

708
00:46:45.559 --> 00:46:47.039
really good points that you should be
compassionate for the gods, and in the

709
00:46:47.079 --> 00:46:52.119
book they back that up. Yes, yeah, they back it up.

710
00:46:52.840 --> 00:46:59.320
Yeah, because like there is there's
the one moment where Poseidon says that he's

711
00:46:59.360 --> 00:47:02.119
like really proud of Percy, and
Percy's like, oh my God, thank

712
00:47:02.159 --> 00:47:07.400
you, and your heart just breaks
because it's like that abused kid or partner

713
00:47:07.639 --> 00:47:08.920
who just gets that little love colonel, and it's like, oh, this

714
00:47:08.960 --> 00:47:12.519
is so wonderful, and you're like
you should be getting that every day.

715
00:47:14.079 --> 00:47:17.320
Yeah, that's what I articulated this
poorly earlier. That's what I was trying

716
00:47:17.360 --> 00:47:21.320
to get at, is that I
felt like the same exact what immediately just

717
00:47:21.360 --> 00:47:24.559
said is that Beasada was too soft
and was just too They tried to make

718
00:47:24.599 --> 00:47:29.719
it seem like he carried a lot
more guilt than he really does. Like

719
00:47:29.760 --> 00:47:31.360
I think in the books is portrayed
that he is a little guilty, he

720
00:47:31.400 --> 00:47:35.320
feels a little bad, and he
does have a little favorite tanism towards Percy,

721
00:47:36.159 --> 00:47:39.840
but like it's still he's still a
very distant father, very distant,

722
00:47:39.960 --> 00:47:44.000
very hands off, very like you
know, And I think again that's what

723
00:47:44.119 --> 00:47:51.079
like makes you question throughout the series, will Percy join with like will he

724
00:47:51.199 --> 00:47:54.440
maybe actually agree with Luke? Like
will Annabeth agree with like? Like it

725
00:47:54.480 --> 00:47:58.400
makes you question, like if Anabeth
or Percy might actually join up with Luke

726
00:47:58.440 --> 00:48:01.000
at some point, But in this
point, like, they've made it very

727
00:48:01.039 --> 00:48:05.559
clear that, like you know,
Percy will defend the gods to the end.

728
00:48:05.719 --> 00:48:07.599
Percion's at the battle of a dad
towards him, but Athena is a

729
00:48:07.880 --> 00:48:14.960
jerk towards Anabeth, And so I
don't know it just the look of a

730
00:48:15.039 --> 00:48:17.119
Satin was great, but it's just
I don't feel like the energy of the

731
00:48:17.159 --> 00:48:22.840
care all the gods fote too nice, except for Zeus well, especially because

732
00:48:22.880 --> 00:48:24.599
like you guys said, as in
thinking about it, like that part worked

733
00:48:24.599 --> 00:48:29.400
great in the first couple episodes,
like Poseidon doesn't show up. He doesn't

734
00:48:29.400 --> 00:48:31.480
say great job and capture the flag. He just lets his try and it

735
00:48:31.519 --> 00:48:36.280
be above the kid, and then
we immediately learn it's not because he's like,

736
00:48:36.280 --> 00:48:37.880
oh, poor Percy. Percy should
know whose dad is. It's like,

737
00:48:38.239 --> 00:48:42.760
Oh, I'm in a fight with
my brother. I need my kid

738
00:48:43.000 --> 00:48:45.079
all of a sudden to do this
very dangerous mission, so all of a

739
00:48:45.079 --> 00:48:47.599
sudden, I'll claim him. I'm
like they established that in the in the

740
00:48:47.599 --> 00:48:52.719
show in the early episodes. I
shn't know what happened later. And what

741
00:48:52.800 --> 00:48:59.199
about Hades and Zeus and Arias,
because they're like in the books, and

742
00:48:59.280 --> 00:49:02.280
all three of them, they're portrayed
fairly supernaturally when he first meets them,

743
00:49:02.639 --> 00:49:07.599
and then they kind of shrink down
into Hades and Zeus both are like ten

744
00:49:07.639 --> 00:49:12.519
foot tall, and Hades has like
fire in his eyes and all this kind

745
00:49:12.559 --> 00:49:15.920
of stuff, and they wind up
being aries. I'm sorry, he has

746
00:49:15.960 --> 00:49:17.840
like fire in his eyes and it
being more human. What do you think

747
00:49:17.840 --> 00:49:23.239
about the changes they made there?
I don't like what they did to Hades

748
00:49:23.800 --> 00:49:30.039
me neither. That was they made
him a little little lucy Lucy goosey,

749
00:49:30.119 --> 00:49:32.519
Yeah, and I didn't like that. It was weird. I was like,

750
00:49:32.559 --> 00:49:37.280
this is not Hades at all.
Like I literally had just read that

751
00:49:37.280 --> 00:49:40.079
part in the book when that episode
came out in my reread, and I

752
00:49:40.199 --> 00:49:46.559
was like, this is so wrong. Yeah, it's funny because I'm I

753
00:49:46.679 --> 00:49:51.639
commented to Amelia about Aries because I
had just read the part about Aries in

754
00:49:51.679 --> 00:49:52.599
the book, and so I was
like, Oh, this is so wrong,

755
00:49:53.000 --> 00:49:55.280
and Amelia is like, what are
you talking about? Because I actually

756
00:49:55.320 --> 00:50:00.559
think that the actor who plays Arias
was spot on perfect, and I'm willing

757
00:50:00.599 --> 00:50:05.840
to believe that maybe that the like
they tried having them look it just looked

758
00:50:05.880 --> 00:50:07.400
cheesy, you know, because some
effects work better on page than they do

759
00:50:07.480 --> 00:50:10.920
on screen. But I don't know
what they were going for with Haites.

760
00:50:10.960 --> 00:50:16.320
He just seemed kind of like like
shady and slimy instead of like haunted or

761
00:50:16.639 --> 00:50:22.440
you know, it felt like the
way that Hayes always always described in the

762
00:50:22.480 --> 00:50:24.599
books was a little more put together, a little like you could you know,

763
00:50:24.760 --> 00:50:29.400
he had a humanside that you saw
come out a little bit around Nico

764
00:50:29.480 --> 00:50:32.760
and stuff, because it was always
like scarier to me in the books and

765
00:50:32.960 --> 00:50:37.840
more aggressive. And I just I
agree with you. I thought Aries casting

766
00:50:38.000 --> 00:50:40.719
was really, really, really good, and I liked how he was portrayed.

767
00:50:40.800 --> 00:50:46.119
I felt like the battle between him
and person was very anticlimactic. Unfortunately

768
00:50:47.440 --> 00:50:51.519
it kinda is in the book too. It is it is but I don't

769
00:50:51.519 --> 00:50:54.480
know. I was picturing something a
little more grandiose. But I agree that

770
00:50:54.519 --> 00:50:59.039
the casting I thought was was excellent. I also like that, like I'm

771
00:50:59.079 --> 00:51:01.079
starting a Twitter fight, like I
love just making people feel like bringing that

772
00:51:01.119 --> 00:51:05.559
into the modern age was cool.
Yeah, I don't know, man,

773
00:51:05.599 --> 00:51:08.280
Haydes just didn't. And it's funny
because I have multiple friends like who grew

774
00:51:08.360 --> 00:51:12.559
up with me, same like went
to school with me and had been percy

775
00:51:12.599 --> 00:51:15.800
fans of me since day one.
All of us have all agreed on that

776
00:51:15.360 --> 00:51:20.920
Hades was just weird. It just
wasn't how we ever it pictured him.

777
00:51:20.960 --> 00:51:23.639
I don't know. It's just very
odd and off putting. For me.

778
00:51:23.800 --> 00:51:30.880
He's always been this kind of like
scary version of like a goth, like

779
00:51:30.920 --> 00:51:36.119
a goth who grew up kind of
like this weird cross of like Jerref the

780
00:51:36.199 --> 00:51:42.079
Goblin King from Labyrinth and Jack Skellington
from Nightmare before Christmas and like you know,

781
00:51:42.320 --> 00:51:45.559
Lucius Malfoy, you know, and
like that kind of like menace in

782
00:51:45.639 --> 00:51:52.119
a soft voice, you know,
and like gorgeous, put together three piece

783
00:51:52.159 --> 00:51:55.960
suit and black eyeliner. And yeah, it was not and his whole attitude

784
00:51:57.000 --> 00:52:00.880
felt very and it's because like a
god of the dead, and yeah,

785
00:52:00.880 --> 00:52:05.800
again, if you're disneying it down
doesn't work as well. But when you

786
00:52:05.840 --> 00:52:07.880
think about how these books are written
for kids but still come across much carrier

787
00:52:14.039 --> 00:52:19.480
and so why do you think they
changed the ending so dramatically in terms of

788
00:52:19.559 --> 00:52:23.440
they don't finish the Quest on time? Zeus does start the war. Even

789
00:52:23.480 --> 00:52:27.360
after Zeus knows that there's no reason
to start a war with Poseidon, he

790
00:52:27.400 --> 00:52:30.519
still wants to fight a war and
Poseidon surrenders in order to end the war.

791
00:52:36.000 --> 00:52:38.840
I don't know. Rick went out
of his way in an interview to

792
00:52:38.880 --> 00:52:42.400
say that it doesn't really change the
ending, and it all would make sense,

793
00:52:42.440 --> 00:52:44.719
and I was like believing him,
and then I saw it and I

794
00:52:44.760 --> 00:52:47.679
was like, are you kidding me? I think that it the fact,

795
00:52:47.719 --> 00:52:52.920
like the fact that the Percy,
Animeath and Grover overcame everything and finished a

796
00:52:52.960 --> 00:52:55.800
Quest on time, was a testament
to their strength and their courage and their

797
00:52:55.880 --> 00:53:00.360
endurance, and I thought that taking
that away was insulting. I think that

798
00:53:00.400 --> 00:53:04.880
they only in reality, I think
they had only Zeus up there to save

799
00:53:05.000 --> 00:53:09.840
money on having to pay a cast
of sixteen actors to all sit in on

800
00:53:09.920 --> 00:53:15.320
Mount Olympus, and I feel like
Percy first walking into Mount Olympus and seeing

801
00:53:15.480 --> 00:53:19.480
all of the gods and seeing how
small he was compared to them, was

802
00:53:19.599 --> 00:53:23.760
again would have lent some canter to
what Luke was saying and beside him being

803
00:53:23.840 --> 00:53:28.400
kind of aloof towards him versus in
here, he's like defending Percy and like,

804
00:53:28.760 --> 00:53:31.280
I surrender. Okay, they made
Zeus. They did make Zeus feel

805
00:53:31.320 --> 00:53:35.639
as jerky and angry and proud as
he was in the book. And I

806
00:53:35.679 --> 00:53:40.039
really think lou Reddick did it perfectly. Be said it again, soft so

807
00:53:40.039 --> 00:53:44.119
soft, like I don't think we
said in the book would surrender it just

808
00:53:44.119 --> 00:53:47.960
for Percy. It just didn't.
It just didn't feel true to the way

809
00:53:49.000 --> 00:53:52.920
the characters were in the book for
me, and I was, I don't

810
00:53:52.000 --> 00:53:53.679
know, I felt like they didn't
need to do any of that. We

811
00:53:53.760 --> 00:53:57.760
could have very easily made the change
they wanted to make and still had to

812
00:53:57.840 --> 00:54:07.039
end the normal way. Yeah,
Amelia, would you think I agree?

813
00:54:07.239 --> 00:54:13.760
You know? I mean, if
I'm trying to believe in Rick, I'm

814
00:54:13.760 --> 00:54:17.239
trying like he hasn't hurt me,
he hasn't really really hurt me. Yet

815
00:54:17.800 --> 00:54:21.679
I want to have faith that it's
all going to make sense. There is

816
00:54:21.719 --> 00:54:25.519
a war coming though, that's the
whole purpose of the first five books.

817
00:54:25.519 --> 00:54:30.519
There's a war, you know,
but it's not It's not like that.

818
00:54:30.599 --> 00:54:36.920
And then with Poseidon defending him and
just that whole inter connection right there,

819
00:54:37.119 --> 00:54:40.920
like I hated that, Like that
dynamic never happened in the book between Sidon

820
00:54:40.960 --> 00:54:45.039
and Zeus, and no point was
beside it every like submissive to Zeus or

821
00:54:45.079 --> 00:54:50.159
really were they, you know,
ever directly in contact other than discussing things

822
00:54:50.159 --> 00:54:55.199
about Percy, right, you know. And I feel like just if you

823
00:54:55.199 --> 00:54:58.800
had a moment where Aries was up
there and a seed was up there,

824
00:54:58.880 --> 00:55:00.440
you got to see the glare and
like just kind of like, you know,

825
00:55:00.639 --> 00:55:04.119
the fact that I always picture with
the air getting sucked out of the

826
00:55:04.159 --> 00:55:07.840
room as this little rebellious demigod who
was only nob who's been at deemic good

827
00:55:07.880 --> 00:55:10.280
for two weeks, walks in and
it's already sticking it to them, Like

828
00:55:10.400 --> 00:55:15.599
it just it felt like as a
kid reading that, I was like,

829
00:55:15.599 --> 00:55:19.239
like, this is like when I
feel really passionate about something like and I

830
00:55:19.280 --> 00:55:21.920
stick up for myself or talk back
to an adult, That's how I would

831
00:55:21.920 --> 00:55:23.960
feel and they will kind of look
at me and then they're like what is

832
00:55:24.000 --> 00:55:27.519
this, Like, you know,
if his kid might might be right,

833
00:55:27.880 --> 00:55:30.719
but we're the adults in the room, so we're going to exert ourselves over

834
00:55:30.800 --> 00:55:32.840
him. And like I felt that
as a kid. I felt that I

835
00:55:32.960 --> 00:55:37.000
experienced that, and I felt they
didn't portray that in the show, like

836
00:55:37.079 --> 00:55:43.199
he was just Zeus being angry.
Yeah, yeah, I think it's very

837
00:55:43.199 --> 00:55:47.320
true. I think because because when
Poseidon surrenders, like what happens, there's

838
00:55:47.360 --> 00:55:52.320
no stakes in that war whatsoever?
Right, Like, what's is it just

839
00:55:52.760 --> 00:55:54.159
rollover? You know? Could we
know that the war's starting for no good

840
00:55:54.199 --> 00:55:57.239
purpose? If the war is to
get the ball back, but you have

841
00:55:57.320 --> 00:56:00.320
the bolt back already, like who
cares? Just to prove that Zeus is

842
00:56:00.320 --> 00:56:05.239
that petty? Yeah, And I
was like that's just it's just it was

843
00:56:05.280 --> 00:56:09.039
just silly to me, and like
he didn't seem I know about Kronos.

844
00:56:09.480 --> 00:56:13.000
I know, I'm not surprised by
this, Like it's just I don't know,

845
00:56:13.280 --> 00:56:15.119
like in the in the books,
the gods kept ignoring it and saying

846
00:56:15.159 --> 00:56:19.239
you're wrong, like Chronos is,
Cronos can't come back, we can handle

847
00:56:19.239 --> 00:56:22.719
it. He just it feels like
Zeus takes it more seriously in the show,

848
00:56:22.679 --> 00:56:25.519
and I feel like in the books
it's portrayed as them being very like

849
00:56:25.599 --> 00:56:30.440
nonchalant, like we are much like
the Jedi Council, Matthew, very like

850
00:56:30.599 --> 00:56:35.519
Aloof and like we can't be beaten. They're done, They're dead, the

851
00:56:35.519 --> 00:56:39.480
Titans are gone. Like I don't
know, it's just I would say that

852
00:56:39.559 --> 00:56:45.079
Kronos' portrayal is being this like creepy
creature in his dreams. I thought it

853
00:56:45.119 --> 00:56:47.760
was pretty cool. I thought that
was a good portrayal. The dreams of

854
00:56:49.000 --> 00:56:52.320
Percy had of Chronos was was cool. Yeah. And I love they called

855
00:56:52.400 --> 00:56:53.599
him Grandpa. Yeah I did.
I did so. I was like,

856
00:56:53.760 --> 00:57:00.679
don't call him that. That was
great. Well, it's been a great

857
00:57:00.679 --> 00:57:04.320
conversation. Thank you guys so much. Any last comments, and Melia,

858
00:57:04.320 --> 00:57:08.480
I'm gonna start with you. Well, I just hope that this gets big

859
00:57:08.599 --> 00:57:13.280
enough that we get the rest of
the books. Like, personally, my

860
00:57:13.360 --> 00:57:17.480
favorite is Heroes of Olympus over the
other three or the other two series,

861
00:57:17.639 --> 00:57:21.440
and I would just I want to
see those characters come to life. I

862
00:57:21.480 --> 00:57:24.760
want to see Jason, Piper,
Leo, Hazel, Frank, I want

863
00:57:24.800 --> 00:57:29.559
to see them and more than I
want to see Percy. So I just

864
00:57:29.639 --> 00:57:31.639
really hope this show goes well.
I hope we get five seasons, and

865
00:57:31.679 --> 00:57:35.480
I hope we get many more.
I don't know how the possible. They're

866
00:57:35.559 --> 00:57:38.840
child actors. They're rapidly aging.
I noticed in several points that I could

867
00:57:38.840 --> 00:57:43.960
tell where reshoots had been done on
Walker's struggle, because he looked visibly older

868
00:57:44.000 --> 00:57:47.000
in scenes. Yeah. Yeah,
especially in the last episode, there were

869
00:57:47.000 --> 00:57:52.119
reshoots because he looked older. And
like, if you want to know why

870
00:57:52.159 --> 00:57:54.440
this is a problem, watch the
last season of Stranger Things. Yeah,

871
00:57:54.440 --> 00:57:58.679
where it's obvious that a couple of
those kids have hit their puberty growth spirit

872
00:57:58.719 --> 00:58:02.079
and a couple of them have not, and they look dramatically different. And

873
00:58:02.440 --> 00:58:07.440
why they're doing there From what I
read at the Avatar show on Netflix,

874
00:58:07.519 --> 00:58:10.559
they're recording season two. Are they
almost finished recording the second season because they're

875
00:58:10.599 --> 00:58:15.960
trying to record all three seasons in
under like a year, so they have

876
00:58:15.039 --> 00:58:17.320
them all be the same age.
Still, Yeah, that's what you have

877
00:58:17.400 --> 00:58:22.000
to do with child actors. Yeah, yeah, because that whole show happens

878
00:58:22.000 --> 00:58:24.559
within a year. Yeah, you're
right. The actual animated show in Percy

879
00:58:24.639 --> 00:58:27.719
Jackson. The kids age, I
mean they should be, you know,

880
00:58:27.719 --> 00:58:30.559
about to graduate by the time it
ends. But still, I would like

881
00:58:30.599 --> 00:58:32.280
to ask one one more question before
we go about to write Matthew to both

882
00:58:32.320 --> 00:58:36.400
of you. I have always been
of the mindset and I want to I

883
00:58:36.559 --> 00:58:39.519
enjoyed the show, but I always
been of the mindset that Percy Jackson lends

884
00:58:39.559 --> 00:58:44.280
itself better to an animated show.
Yes, I'm curious the two of you

885
00:58:44.320 --> 00:58:47.280
think about that. Uh be Like, I feel like that it's that's true

886
00:58:47.280 --> 00:58:51.199
for every book, and that's something
I was thinking about earlier today that I

887
00:58:51.239 --> 00:58:53.760
wanted to bring up on this.
So that's really good. Like a lot

888
00:58:53.800 --> 00:58:59.119
of books, especially fantasy books and
things like that that have like an element

889
00:58:59.400 --> 00:59:02.800
to that where would be a little
better animated, are getting turned into too

890
00:59:02.920 --> 00:59:07.280
TV shows and movies, and I'm
like, we need to not make these

891
00:59:07.320 --> 00:59:10.320
live actions. We need to animate
these. Then you don't have to you

892
00:59:10.320 --> 00:59:15.840
know, it's cheaper I think overall
compared to the CGI budget. You'll be

893
00:59:15.880 --> 00:59:20.239
able to get the seasons out more
rapidly. You don't have to worry about

894
00:59:20.239 --> 00:59:24.400
people aging, you know. I
feel like a lot of books, especially

895
00:59:24.599 --> 00:59:29.519
with the fantasy element would be better
done animated. I would say, you

896
00:59:29.559 --> 00:59:30.960
know, all this stuff about areas
with the fire in his eyes and like

897
00:59:31.559 --> 00:59:37.440
the twelve foot tall version of Hades
before ten foot tall version before he shrinks

898
00:59:37.440 --> 00:59:40.360
down to human size. Yeah,
like it may have been the right decision

899
00:59:40.400 --> 00:59:44.400
not to do that because it appeared
cheesy in live action with the hecks they

900
00:59:44.440 --> 00:59:47.960
have. But yeah, I think
then, I think for far too long,

901
00:59:49.079 --> 00:59:52.440
too many people, myself included,
saw animation as kind of like,

902
00:59:52.440 --> 00:59:53.360
well, what live action is the
real stuff? And I think we just

903
00:59:53.400 --> 00:59:57.760
got to stop that entirely. There's
some story. Pneumona is one of my

904
00:59:57.880 --> 01:00:00.239
favorite, I think, one of
the best movies that came out last I

905
01:00:00.280 --> 01:00:02.119
wish it was in the Best Picture
discussion. And I think Nimoto would not

906
01:00:02.199 --> 01:00:06.119
work at all as live action.
Yeah, and I mean, I mean,

907
01:00:06.360 --> 01:00:07.639
I look at I'm a big anime
fan. You look at you know,

908
01:00:07.800 --> 01:00:10.400
stories being told an anime, you
know, made in Japan, and

909
01:00:10.880 --> 01:00:15.280
like an example, I mean an
extreme example, but like One Piece is

910
01:00:15.320 --> 01:00:20.119
about like young people and that show
is going on for over twenty years and

911
01:00:20.159 --> 01:00:22.079
the characters haven't really aided very much
in the show where you're able to keep

912
01:00:22.079 --> 01:00:27.079
telling the story indefinitely, because all
you need is a voice actor. And

913
01:00:27.119 --> 01:00:30.280
I think that like the ability to
do so much of what they do in

914
01:00:30.320 --> 01:00:35.000
Princy Jackson, all the fantasy elements, Like they didn't even include Ergus in

915
01:00:35.039 --> 01:00:37.000
the live action show because they didn't
want to pay the CGI budget of putting

916
01:00:37.000 --> 01:00:40.719
all the eyes on somebody like.
I just think that the animated an animated

917
01:00:40.800 --> 01:00:45.280
series would allow them like, like
you know, like you said to Melia,

918
01:00:45.360 --> 01:00:50.039
like to paste it out to to
really like. And also you could

919
01:00:50.039 --> 01:00:52.480
make a twenty episode animated show and
no one would bat an eye for an

920
01:00:52.480 --> 01:00:55.360
animated season to be like that.
Yeah, Like twenty episodes in live action

921
01:00:55.880 --> 01:00:59.280
cost a ton of money. People
would be like that's too much. Animated

922
01:00:59.320 --> 01:01:01.320
it happens all the time, and
you would have been able to give more

923
01:01:01.360 --> 01:01:05.199
time to way things out. And
I just think, I don't know,

924
01:01:05.239 --> 01:01:07.920
that's just not that this show is
bad. I really enjoy it. I

925
01:01:07.000 --> 01:01:09.840
hope we get all this show episodes
as well. But I think one day

926
01:01:09.840 --> 01:01:15.079
I would love to see an animated
adaptation of this book series. Yeah,

927
01:01:15.280 --> 01:01:16.760
I think it's true. I will
say though, in terms of casting,

928
01:01:16.800 --> 01:01:22.159
I forgot the person who I think
was perhaps the best casting of anyone in

929
01:01:22.199 --> 01:01:24.280
the entire show. But can I
guess go for it? Do you think

930
01:01:24.320 --> 01:01:29.559
it's Denis Denisus? Yeah, I
mean it's the one character we haven't really

931
01:01:29.559 --> 01:01:32.760
talked about it all, but yeah, Jason manzakas I think the last name,

932
01:01:32.960 --> 01:01:38.320
yes, fully, her degree good, perfectly, he give body.

933
01:01:39.599 --> 01:01:43.760
Yeah, especially Grouchy hasn't been able
to have a drink or have any fun

934
01:01:43.760 --> 01:01:47.719
with satyrs. Yeah. I saw
that casting for the first Yeah, yeah,

935
01:01:47.800 --> 01:01:52.239
that that change. I was so
okay with him just being like bringing

936
01:01:52.239 --> 01:01:58.719
Percy and circles like son. Yes, it's me. Yeah, you can

937
01:01:58.800 --> 01:02:05.480
do whatever he wants with the care
and it's right because it's correct. Yeah.

938
01:02:05.679 --> 01:02:07.400
Yeah, it's so good. It's
so good. All right, Well,

939
01:02:07.400 --> 01:02:09.719
thank you both. In our bonus
section, we're gonna talk a little

940
01:02:09.719 --> 01:02:14.400
about like thoughts for the coming seasons. Uh. I think a simple fact

941
01:02:14.400 --> 01:02:15.360
that we all want more of this, We just want it to be a

942
01:02:15.400 --> 01:02:19.960
little bit better. It already puts
this miles and miles ahead of the books,

943
01:02:20.360 --> 01:02:22.159
So I'm so glad for that.
Ahead of the movies. I mean,

944
01:02:22.400 --> 01:02:25.360
I think the books are clearly the
best TV shows next, and the

945
01:02:25.400 --> 01:02:29.400
movies are you know, the movies. The less spoken about them, the

946
01:02:29.440 --> 01:02:31.800
better. I'll just say again,
thank you to both of you so much

947
01:02:31.800 --> 01:02:35.920
for being here. If you're not
a member, thank you so much for

948
01:02:35.960 --> 01:02:38.400
listening. You can become a member
for just five dollars a month, fifty

949
01:02:38.400 --> 01:02:42.199
five dollars a year. You get
ad free content, you get the bonus

950
01:02:42.199 --> 01:02:45.400
content. And we're now doing bonus
episodes over on the Star Wars Galaxies podcast.

951
01:02:45.440 --> 01:02:47.760
We're doing a book club. We
are probably gonna be starting a book

952
01:02:47.800 --> 01:02:52.679
club here in Superhero Ethic Land as
well. So there's lots of great reasons

953
01:02:52.679 --> 01:03:00.519
to be on there for the bonus
content. And uh yeah, so thank

954
01:03:00.559 --> 01:03:02.079
you much. Thank you both so
much for mega part of this episode.

955
01:03:02.360 --> 01:03:07.719
Uh to all our listeners. We
have spoken. Matthew, I love you

956
01:03:07.800 --> 01:03:10.840
bout mc funny. For one thing. You have mentioned the podcast twice this

957
01:03:10.920 --> 01:03:15.039
episode and got the name wrong both
times. What did I say? You

958
01:03:15.079 --> 01:03:17.119
said? First? You said Star
Wars Universe, he said Star Wars Galaxies

959
01:03:19.400 --> 01:03:22.119
like, oh the other podcast,
okay, haven't got yeah, Star Wars

960
01:03:22.159 --> 01:03:24.639
Generations podcast. Thank you, thank
you. We have spoken,