WEBVTT

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Timothy, Chapter two, Verse eleven. Let a woman learn quietly with all

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submissiveness. I do not permit a
woman to teach or to exercise authority over

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a man. Rather, she is
to remain quiet. For Adam was for

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him first, then Eve, and
Adam was not deceived. But the woman

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was deceived and became a transgressor.
Yet she shall be saved through child bearing

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if they continue in faith and love
and holiness with self control. Gross,

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real, real, gross. Hey, if you think that this is the

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good book, you should give us
a call, because the show is starting

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right now. Welcome to Talk Ethan. Today is May twenty eighth, in

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the year of our Lord, two
thousand and twenty three. I'm your host

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foris Valkai, and I'm joined today
for the very first time by Sophia.

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How are you doing today, Hi, I'm doing all right. I'm nervous

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and excited to be here. It's
an exciting show. It's it's a great

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time for everybody. Hey, really
quick, I gotta let you guys know

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that Talk Then is a product of
the Atheist Community of Austin, which is

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a five O one C three nonprofit
organization dedicated to the promotion of atheism,

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critical thinking, secular humanism, and
the separation of church and government. Talk

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Ethan is a live call in show, and we have open lines. You

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can get your calls in using the
number at the bottom of the screen right

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now, or from your computer at
tiny dot cc slash call call THH.

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And with that, we already have
callers on the line. But like I

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would love to give Sophia a chance. Yes, you'll introduce yourself briefly,

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tell us a little bit about who
you are. Is that okay? Yeah,

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I am Sophia Spina and I am
somewhat of a baby atheist in some

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ways. I'm newer to this whole
thing, but I'm really excited to be

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here. I love learning, I
love logic, and I am sort of

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a fangirl for as Valakai. Don't
tell him, but yeah, so it's

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it's nerve wracking and exciting and I'm
so excited to hear what people have to

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say. Yeah, it's gonna be
a great show. And I also want

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to thank very quickly. We are
live in studio today and I'm super stoked

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about that. I rarely get to
be all the way down here in Austin,

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but because I'm here. I want
to take a time to shout out,

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like the real cool people here and
that's the audience, which are right

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out there. Look at them,
aren't They're wonderful. I like that one

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the most. That one over there
is my favorite, you know the one.

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If you're ever in the Austin area
and you want to come see us.

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We are live in studio I believe, the last Sunday of every month,

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So come see us here. It's
it's a pretty cool place to be.

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It's it's a small little area,
so parking is just kind of wherever

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you can find a legal spot hopefully. But the Free Thought Library is an

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awesome resource for anybody in the Austin
area who wants to learn a little bit

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more about atheism, freethinking, whatever, or wants to watch one of our

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ridiculous shows. So come on down
and have some fun with us. And

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with that, if it's a cool
with you, I'm gonna jump right into

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cales. Yeah, yeah, we
do the Question of the Week real quick

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first. Oh yeah, we do
have a job to do as well.

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I was just moving right on in. This is where they don't have me

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down. I don't forget Question of
the Week Okay, yeah, do you

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want to go through it really quick? Because I oh, man, yeah,

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you do that. Okay, Okay, I'm bad at all. Right,

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So before we get started, we
want to give you the results of

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last week's talk Heathen to Me,
which is just the sexiest name I can

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think of. Last week we asked
you, if God favors humans, why

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are they so blank? And so
here are the top three responses. Number

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three is from Mark Allen, and
it says, if God favors humans,

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why are they so illogical most of
the time? Of course, maybe God

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does exist and just realizes that if
we had better logic and critical thinking skills,

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none of us would believe. So
that's pretty great. Number two is

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from Mike B Talk Heathen to Me. If God is on humanity's side,

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why did he make humans so hard
to convince of being wrong? That?

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I mean, I'm never wrong,
so I don't really relate to this question,

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but you know fair enough. Number
one is from x million. If

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God favors humans, why are they
so mostly damned to hell? That's such

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a good one. Well, I
always like to ask, is like people

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like they say that you know,
God knows everything already, God that it's

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predetermined. So then certain humans were
made to go to hell. That's their

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job, because he already knows what's
going to happen. He knows everything right,

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so he knows they're not going to
be convinced. He knows they're going

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to go to hell. But he
made them anyway. It was once explained

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to me by a Calvinist classmate of
mine that, well, you could just

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spend your time being really grateful that
God didn't condemn you to hell. Oh

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yeah, no, that's yeah.
He answers all the questions. Screw those

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people. He's always the way to
live, always all right, How do

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you want to read the prompt?
Sure? Yeah. The prop for next

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week is what did the caller say
to make secularity look like this? And

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to your God, I didn't realize
there'd be a thing. I thought we

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were just going to make fun of
him for how he is all the time.

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I made a special face, a
special face for us And to your

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answer below the video and the comments
next week, or view our favorite top

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three answers. But let me ask
you this, what do you think that

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the caller said to make secularity look
like that? You don't get it.

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Secularity, They were baby dinosaurs on
the arc, so it works. Yeah,

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no, that would make me the
same face. That's great. Uh

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So now now we do the ship. I'm a professional, and I forgot

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about the whole Introshey. Hey,
it's making me feel better that it's my

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first time. I'm like, all
right, I'm bad every time. So

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like, if you're good on the
first time, you're already blown me out

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of the water. Um okay,
So now we will do the things that

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I've I've I'm here to do,
and that is starting with Charles and from

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Pennsylvania and you know pronouns. I
asked God to change my life and he

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did. Charles, you're on Talk
Heathen. How are you today? Oh?

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I'm doing real good. I hope
you are too. I've never had

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a bad day in my life.
Yeah. Let me let me first saying

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that. Um, I've made a
few atheists, and I think are really

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smart people, really cordial, nice
people. You know, some aren't big

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for the most part atheists. They
seem pretty smart and just easy to get

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along with. And I don't think
any of you are going to be thrown

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into him or anything like it.
I think, you know, God wants

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different people in this world. So
he was not bored because if everybody was

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the same, he would I mean, everybody was pretty much the same,

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it would be kind of boring.
I guess, well, I appreciate that

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I can say the same thing,
for I've met a lot of Christians that

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are are very cool people. I
used to work for a Catholic who had

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a PhD into tim molecular physics,
and he was a charming dude. So

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it's very very kind of you to
start to call that Witch's what did you

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want to talk about today? Well, to be blunt, um, I

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random and found a photograph of my
grandfather on eBay about six years ago when

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I was sitting around board looking at
So I'm gonna look at old cars on

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eBay to pass the time. I'm
sixty four years old and my grandfather was

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a police officer in Manessa in Pennsylvania
back in the nineteen twenties and thirties.

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Anyway, Grandpap died when I was
a four month old baby, and I

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could get to later how I knew
the picture to recognize it. But I

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was sitting in a water trucket of
gas well in West Virginia about six years

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ago and we're sitting in line board. I saw me here a while.

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I'm gonna look at old cars on
eBay to pass the time. And I

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like old sixty four fair Lane sports
coups, so I looked at that on

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eBay sometimes, and I put that
on eBay fair Lane and the very first

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one on the list was in nineteen
fifty eight. I really don't like him.

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Out my spider's board, I clicked
it on, reading about nice old

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car. I still wonder what else
said guy's got for sell. I hit

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the seller's other item list and m
he had twenty six items there, and

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one said four old police pictures for
ten dollars. And I like him old

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police pictures because of my grandfather.
I think about him a lot, and

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I just I'm like into them inor
I guess that, um. So I

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clicked that on four old police pictures
for ten dollars on eBay, and one

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of the pictures was my grandfather in
nineteen thirty four. And I called the

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guy up in Kentucky, Green Up, Kentucky. His name is Steve,

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and I asked, how did you
get a picture of my grandfather down there

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like that? He said, he's
a retired police officer down there. He

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bought that about ten years ago on
eBay and he's seventy four years old and

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he's just reselling some things that he
had laying around or what he said.

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He actually had two original copies of
my grandfather. It's a cool picture.

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He's on a nineteen thirty four Hernie
Davidson at the dealership in his uniform.

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It's in a super cool picture.
And he had, you know, he

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sold me the other one. I
made him some money. And the reason

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I knew of that picture was about
twelve years ago. I would go visit

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my mother and dad's grave and belvern
On, Pa. And I was still

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am bad about my life. I
was fifty two years old and my life

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was really not good and I was
having like some missues. And I've gone

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there to feel better about my life, just contemplate things. And um,

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so I see Grandpap's headstone there,
and I thought, you know, I

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never had no grandparents. My mom
and dad were old or when they had

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eight, so, um, I
really needed my Grandpap. I just looked

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at his headstone. I said,
man, I wish I had Grandpap.

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I started thinking about being a four
month old baby in his arms when he

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had done a pancreas cancer and he
died and I never knew much about him.

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You know, I caught my mind
gets. I just want to ask,

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like, I'm sorry, I don't
want to cut you short, but

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we've got a feel of the calls
in a lot. I just want to

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know, like, how does this
relate back to God and changing your life?

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Like where where's this go? Well, my my heart drew really heavy

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and I believed in God. I
never wanted to charge it and I cried

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out to God to change my life
and he sure did. I'm a really

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good person. I don't know his
shues and no problems and um I um

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so let's dig into that. Then. How how did God change your life

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to make you a good person?
Well, yeah, issues with drugs and

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um just immorality, I guess a
little bit. And it just kind of

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affected my life where I was alone
and I really just my family was dead,

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and I just think it affected my
heart like a little bit. And

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it's like almost like God drew me
in. So would it be fair to

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say you you were struggling with some
things that you knew weren't the way you

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wanted to live. You weren't.
They weren't living the direction you wanted to

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live, and you weren't living a
lot of life you wanted to live.

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And so you found something that gave
you social structure and a sense of community,

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and that helped you the support to
get your life on the track that

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you wanted in the first place.
Is that a fair summary of what you're

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saying. Yes, yeah, i'd
say so cool. I think I might

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throw in there too. It sounds
like you had a mindset shift. You

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know, you had a time when
you knew you wanted things to change,

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and you found a way that enabled
you to make that shift within yourself.

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And I definitely I don't think most
atheists want to take anything away from anybody.

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If that's something that you experience and
find valuable, I'm curious, do

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you are you calling in because you
think that's sort of a more generalizable thing

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that if people find God, this
happens, or is it just to share

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that that's what happened for you.
Well, personally, I started reading about

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religious stuff and I kind of believe
that I was chosen him, I dare

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to say, because I had a
lot of really miraculous things happen you don't

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have time to hear it. But
I mean these are really bonafied. I

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can what's the best one? People
like, what's the most convincing miracle?

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Because you're right, we don't have
time for all of them, but like,

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as an example, what's like the
coolest miracle that you experienced? Well,

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I made a lady in Bible study, and I tell her my story

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and she said, told me happened
to her. Her dad's name was David

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Attarney and he died when in twenty
sixteen. She said, two sisters.

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They cried for six months over that, and they said one day, let's

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go to the mountains in Maryland,
in Deep Prick, Maryland and spend the

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day together. Put this behind us. So she did, and they met

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a couple up there would like to
go bowling. They did too, and

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they went to the bowling Alley in
Oakland, Maryland, and coming home,

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she told her sister they had a
good time here. The sister googled the

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bowling alley and the bowling alley was
located on David Attorney Street in Oakland,

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Maryland. And the lady's name is
Dailey. She lives in bell Vernam,

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PA. That's her dad named David
Attarney. He went up there and they

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just led to the bowling alley located
on David Attarney Street in Oakland, Maryland.

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And she said, there can't be
that many David Attorney. So I

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said, lady, I've never heard
that name before. And I said,

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I know through my miracles that you
were led up there. And she's a

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super nice lady. She works at
the college in the admissions department as a

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really nice thirty seven year old Bible
state teacher. And she had no idea

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that that bowling. She liked the
bowl, you know, right. So

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that's the thing. Like, my
dad's name was Heinz and I miss him

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terribly. Died about a decade ago. I don't get like the feeling that

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I'm experiencing a sign every time I
pick up a bottle of hinds ketch Up.

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00:12:07.200 --> 00:12:09.919
You know, it's just that's that's
a name. And I just googled,

205
00:12:09.919 --> 00:12:15.039
just for fun, I just looked
up David Turney on Google, and

206
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I've got here one of these find
a Person websites that has one hundred and

207
00:12:18.320 --> 00:12:20.159
eighty nine matches, and so like, yeah, that that you're right,

208
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that is a coincidence, like,
Wow, there's there's a street with this

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00:12:24.200 --> 00:12:28.320
guy's name. That's pretty cool.
Um, But humans have this really bad

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habit of seeking patterns and finding meaning
in things that are relatively kind of meaningless,

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00:12:33.519 --> 00:12:37.919
maybe interesting and coincidential, but still
not really meaningful. There's a apophemia

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00:12:37.120 --> 00:12:43.440
and paradelia patternicity, these these phenomena
that we experience where we see shapes and

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00:12:43.519 --> 00:12:46.960
clouds and the stars and and and
you know, meaning from meaningless data or

214
00:12:48.039 --> 00:12:50.759
like when sorry, oh you're fine, okay. But when I first learned

215
00:12:50.919 --> 00:12:54.360
that Sam Louis Obispo was a place
and not just a funny sequence of sounds,

216
00:12:54.399 --> 00:12:58.120
I started hearing about it everywhere,
to the point when I actually started

217
00:12:58.120 --> 00:13:03.440
thinking, is there's something in San
Louis Obispo I'm supposed to be doing here?

218
00:13:03.720 --> 00:13:05.120
Right? I think that these things, you know, we notice them,

219
00:13:05.159 --> 00:13:09.080
and I think it's totally okay to
be like, I'm grieving. Hey,

220
00:13:09.080 --> 00:13:11.039
this reminds me of my this is
the same name. What an interesting

221
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coincidence, And again, give that
meaning if you want to. But I

222
00:13:16.960 --> 00:13:20.840
look at it and I just think
that doesn't really mean anything to me,

223
00:13:20.159 --> 00:13:26.399
or to perhaps other unbelievers, like
I'm glad that they were healing experiences.

224
00:13:26.879 --> 00:13:31.519
I don't see them as evidence of
miracles though, when they can pretty easily

225
00:13:31.600 --> 00:13:35.639
happen in completely mundane ways too.
Does that make sense Charles, what we're

226
00:13:35.639 --> 00:13:39.200
saying. Yeah, I can respect
your thoughts on it, but I mean,

227
00:13:39.440 --> 00:13:45.080
this happened to me several times.
I mean it's really far fetched coincidences

228
00:13:45.120 --> 00:13:46.840
that were really and I know that
I prayed. I don't have to be

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00:13:46.919 --> 00:13:50.120
called pray. I kneeled down to
my bed and I talked to God about

230
00:13:50.120 --> 00:13:54.879
things. And I've had so many
things, just unique things happened. That

231
00:13:54.600 --> 00:13:58.840
I met a lady that my sister
saved your life from drowning forty years ago.

232
00:14:00.440 --> 00:14:03.759
Not long after I prayed about my
little sister. She died about twelve

233
00:14:03.840 --> 00:14:05.440
years ago, and I prayed about
her. I needn't She's okay. And

234
00:14:05.480 --> 00:14:09.080
I've seen my buddy the next day
at the Dollar General store and he told

235
00:14:09.080 --> 00:14:13.360
me that he woke up at five
am and he thought about my sister Tracy.

236
00:14:13.200 --> 00:14:16.360
He said that he heard the voice
that she remember once he saved that

237
00:14:16.399 --> 00:14:20.559
girl in Ohio Pile State Park.
He said that was forty years ago.

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00:14:20.080 --> 00:14:22.320
Man, I prayed about her last
night, and you woke up and I

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00:14:22.320 --> 00:14:24.639
said, you think that was gone? He said, he really did so.

240
00:14:24.720 --> 00:14:28.639
And I went up in State Park
and prayed a little bit, and

241
00:14:28.799 --> 00:14:31.759
a month later I met that same
lady that she randomly met her. Yeah,

242
00:14:33.039 --> 00:14:35.960
she saved her life in the terrace. Um, so, Charles,

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00:14:35.320 --> 00:14:39.720
let me ask you just two brief
questions. And because we got to move

244
00:14:39.759 --> 00:14:41.960
onto the US call, but like, I just want to ask you two

245
00:14:41.000 --> 00:14:46.600
things. Number one, how many
times have you prayed and then not gotten

246
00:14:46.639 --> 00:14:50.679
a miraculous result like this? Uh? Usually I just pray about money.

247
00:14:50.679 --> 00:14:54.399
I don't get that m r to
be able to have much stories now and

248
00:14:54.919 --> 00:14:58.600
like publicly, you know that doesn't
happen. I don't think God has it

249
00:14:58.679 --> 00:15:01.600
in his time. So so you
pray for some things and they don't happen,

250
00:15:01.639 --> 00:15:05.080
and you pray for other things that
are more related to like, you

251
00:15:05.159 --> 00:15:07.960
know, community, because you live
around people, right, You have families,

252
00:15:07.960 --> 00:15:11.080
you have friends, you have extended
friends. You you know, there's

253
00:15:11.120 --> 00:15:13.240
millions of people that are connected to
you. When we're another that kind of

254
00:15:13.279 --> 00:15:16.320
thing, we get answers to prayer. But when it comes to like winning

255
00:15:16.360 --> 00:15:20.480
the lottery or like you know,
getting your name out there or whatever like

256
00:15:20.519 --> 00:15:24.559
that, these very rare things.
Prayers don't work very well on that.

257
00:15:24.840 --> 00:15:28.120
Do you think maybe there's a bit
of confirmation bias here where you're seeing things

258
00:15:28.159 --> 00:15:31.120
that are maybe a little bit coincidential, but coincidence has happened all the time,

259
00:15:31.399 --> 00:15:35.799
and you're looking for meaning and that
meanwhile, all the things that you're

260
00:15:35.840 --> 00:15:39.360
not getting from prayer, you're not
attributing that to saying okay, so prayer

261
00:15:39.480 --> 00:15:41.120
doesn't work in this way. It's
just saying, okay, well God didn't

262
00:15:41.159 --> 00:15:43.120
want to do it, but he
did do these other things that having an

263
00:15:43.159 --> 00:15:48.039
explanation, Like is thatnot kind of
sit weird with you? Yeah, like

264
00:15:48.200 --> 00:15:50.720
say things that he needs to really
don't need anyway, money or whatever,

265
00:15:50.799 --> 00:15:54.960
but from my heart, And that
really grabs my heart. When I talked

266
00:15:54.000 --> 00:15:56.120
to God, I said, this
is like urging a little bit. I

267
00:15:56.320 --> 00:15:58.639
trying to talk to him like,
yeah, a little bit. And the

268
00:15:58.720 --> 00:16:03.480
next day or two something really crazy
happened. You know. I told that

269
00:16:03.559 --> 00:16:06.960
picture of my grandfather to Staples about
two years ago. I asked that,

270
00:16:07.039 --> 00:16:08.120
lady, can you blow this something? Make me a couple of coffees.

271
00:16:08.159 --> 00:16:11.559
Her name Samantha. The front of
the manager. She said, yes,

272
00:16:11.679 --> 00:16:12.559
she looked at it. She said, that's weird. I said, what

273
00:16:12.679 --> 00:16:15.200
is that? She said, she
wants to visit her sister out in Ohio

274
00:16:15.360 --> 00:16:18.919
last Christmas, and her sister's boyfriend
had that same picture hanging on their wall

275
00:16:18.919 --> 00:16:22.440
in their bathroom, and they don't
know who that is. I lets my

276
00:16:22.440 --> 00:16:26.159
grandpa. I wasn't even surprise that, because I see, I have so

277
00:16:26.200 --> 00:16:30.279
many crazy things happened that, you
know, the photo manager or Samantha the

278
00:16:30.399 --> 00:16:33.360
staple. She looked at that picture
of my grandpa. She said, wants

279
00:16:33.399 --> 00:16:37.039
to visit her sister on the Hio
last Christmas, and her sister's boyfriend had

280
00:16:37.080 --> 00:16:40.759
that same exact picture hanging on the
wall in her bathroom. I mean,

281
00:16:40.799 --> 00:16:45.399
that's the twinsidence. I guess I
don't know. Sorry, sorry to interrupt

282
00:16:45.399 --> 00:16:48.679
you again. And it is really
interesting as a story. It reminds me

283
00:16:48.000 --> 00:16:55.000
my grandfather lived in eastern Oregon for
fifty years, and he's everywhere, and

284
00:16:55.159 --> 00:16:57.960
my great grandparents are everywhere, and
it's really cool to be able to go

285
00:16:59.039 --> 00:17:03.080
and find pictures of them or something
named after them. I don't think it's

286
00:17:03.120 --> 00:17:06.720
necessarily evidence of God, which might
offend my grandfather. He was a preacher.

287
00:17:07.160 --> 00:17:11.880
But it makes me feel good and
I love those stories. I don't

288
00:17:11.960 --> 00:17:15.640
think it's really that shocking though,
in an area with not that many people

289
00:17:15.720 --> 00:17:19.920
necessarily or with the same families who've
lived around for quite a while, that

290
00:17:21.200 --> 00:17:25.720
we would see pictures of them.
I also love old pictures. It's wonderful

291
00:17:25.720 --> 00:17:30.319
stories to share. I still out. Maybe you're probably about done with me

292
00:17:30.400 --> 00:17:36.799
here. But if you look on
my tik TikTok channel, it's called Truis

293
00:17:36.839 --> 00:17:40.880
Dog four Truith Dog four, and
I made a video and it had a

294
00:17:40.920 --> 00:17:44.680
picture my grandfather in it and a
model that I found in the good Will

295
00:17:44.799 --> 00:17:48.480
store the very next day after I
framed that picture. There was a model

296
00:17:48.519 --> 00:17:51.160
of the nineteen thirty four her Are
you Day Listened? With a side car,

297
00:17:51.480 --> 00:17:55.160
same thing, grandpapad But it was
in the goodwill store the very next

298
00:17:55.240 --> 00:17:57.400
day. And I actually went into
good Will the day I got the frame.

299
00:17:57.519 --> 00:18:00.720
Nothing was in her and I had
the next day awful, I'm back

300
00:18:00.759 --> 00:18:03.440
in the good world. There is
a model of the nineteen thirty four Harley.

301
00:18:03.680 --> 00:18:07.599
Yeah, with a side card,
but look at my Trace Dog four.

302
00:18:07.799 --> 00:18:10.079
I'm not gonna do that, but
hey, Charles, I really really

303
00:18:10.160 --> 00:18:11.559
quickly. The last thing that I
want to ask you, and this is

304
00:18:11.559 --> 00:18:14.559
where it really getting to the meat
of it, because like we could sit

305
00:18:14.599 --> 00:18:17.319
here all day and talk about like, well, this weird thing happened to

306
00:18:17.359 --> 00:18:18.440
me and that was God, and
then I'll tell you some weird shit that

307
00:18:18.440 --> 00:18:21.680
happened to me and I don't believe
it was God. You know what I

308
00:18:21.720 --> 00:18:23.240
mean, We can be do that
for a while. I guess the biggest

309
00:18:23.240 --> 00:18:26.640
thing that that stuck out to me
you said, and then we'll be done

310
00:18:26.680 --> 00:18:30.599
after this is that you said that
you know the reason why prayer doesn't work

311
00:18:30.640 --> 00:18:33.000
for money, and the reason why
prayer doesn't work for fame, but it

312
00:18:33.039 --> 00:18:34.240
does work when this thing with your
families, because these are things that are

313
00:18:34.240 --> 00:18:37.759
really weighing on your heart and that
it really matters to you, and you

314
00:18:37.799 --> 00:18:40.400
ask God about those types of things. And like, I guess my question

315
00:18:40.480 --> 00:18:44.680
is, why then isn't prayers very
like one hundred percent reliable when like say,

316
00:18:44.680 --> 00:18:48.240
for example, someone has a child
with cancer that's dying in the hospital

317
00:18:48.279 --> 00:18:51.880
and they pray about it. Why
isn't God answering all of those prayers,

318
00:18:51.880 --> 00:18:55.480
because surely those way on people's hearts
and they're selfless prayers. They don't involve

319
00:18:55.480 --> 00:18:59.160
money or fame, Like, why
aren't those prayers working? But your prayer

320
00:18:59.200 --> 00:19:03.160
to like see somebody who had a
memory of your sister from a while ago.

321
00:19:03.279 --> 00:19:04.960
That that's what God's interested in.
Why why is that the case?

322
00:19:06.240 --> 00:19:07.839
Yeah, I've been told to have
a prophetic gift, and I did pray

323
00:19:07.839 --> 00:19:11.200
about little children would having camps are
laying there in the hawkspital bed dying,

324
00:19:11.519 --> 00:19:15.759
and I've prayed about that, and
God give me the thought that he took

325
00:19:15.759 --> 00:19:19.160
their soul to heaven already that lay
that little baby laying their dying child actually

326
00:19:19.200 --> 00:19:23.160
has an angel in their body and
they know how to mimic that little kid.

327
00:19:23.720 --> 00:19:26.680
Mommy, mommy, I love you
and all that. So it's just

328
00:19:26.799 --> 00:19:32.039
giving that that parents a tremendous amount
of grief and trauma. That's yeah,

329
00:19:32.079 --> 00:19:34.279
the baby isn't hurting. It's just
the parents that need to experience a tremendous

330
00:19:34.319 --> 00:19:37.920
amount of grief and pain and suffering. That's that's the goal. They experience

331
00:19:38.240 --> 00:19:42.039
a great amount of joy whenever they
reach heaven and they see their little baby

332
00:19:42.119 --> 00:19:45.160
there. I don't know that God, So if I, if I you

333
00:19:45.160 --> 00:19:48.440
know, beat the crap out of
somebody. Now, it's okay because they're

334
00:19:48.440 --> 00:19:51.640
gonna feel happy later when they're not
being beaten anymore. That's yeah. I

335
00:19:51.640 --> 00:19:56.319
would also point out that there are
quite a few people who lose their faith

336
00:19:56.440 --> 00:20:00.720
in God because they go through something
like that with a child. So the

337
00:20:00.799 --> 00:20:04.680
idea that you have an imitation angel, it actually sounds like an Irish fairy

338
00:20:04.759 --> 00:20:11.519
like this asserting him sounds very mythical. Torturing these parents by making them watch

339
00:20:11.599 --> 00:20:18.240
their child go through something horrifying that
they can't understand, and then that parent

340
00:20:18.319 --> 00:20:21.839
loses their faith and they never see
that baby in heaven. So all that

341
00:20:21.920 --> 00:20:26.640
was accomplished is torment. That's horrifying. Maybe they were casted. I really

342
00:20:26.640 --> 00:20:30.960
don't know why he does things.
I know he's real, absolutely not,

343
00:20:30.279 --> 00:20:33.559
because there's things have happened, many
things in my life that are just That's

344
00:20:33.599 --> 00:20:36.519
the thing, Charles, is that, like I, you know, I

345
00:20:36.880 --> 00:20:40.039
don't know why Ted Bundy did the
things that he did either. But I'm

346
00:20:40.079 --> 00:20:41.839
not going to say that there might
have been some positive outcome to it and

347
00:20:41.839 --> 00:20:45.599
that maybe he was a good guy. You know. It's just I think

348
00:20:45.599 --> 00:20:48.200
we're doing a lot of a lot
of the legwork for this god by trying

349
00:20:48.200 --> 00:20:52.000
to say, Okay, well,
when he does good things, that's because

350
00:20:52.000 --> 00:20:55.000
he's good, and when he does
horrible things, that's because he's mysterious.

351
00:20:55.240 --> 00:20:57.440
Like I. I'm sorry, it
just it doesn't work that way for anybody

352
00:20:57.440 --> 00:21:00.680
else. Anyway, We're going to
move on to the next call. But

353
00:21:00.720 --> 00:21:03.119
I really appreciate you calling it and
b and so politeness a cordial with us.

354
00:21:03.160 --> 00:21:04.039
I encourage you to call back in
another time if you want to have

355
00:21:04.039 --> 00:21:07.480
another conversation with us. Okay,
I may do that. Thank you very

356
00:21:07.519 --> 00:21:08.279
much. Thank you, Charles,
take care, have a good day.

357
00:21:08.599 --> 00:21:14.359
A genuinely nice guy. I know
it seems like such as sweetie. So

358
00:21:14.480 --> 00:21:17.400
before we move on to the next
call, we have merch, y'all,

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lot. If you enable notifications,
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All those things help the channel and
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of train your algorithm to see more
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And also you can become a channel
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373
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can do if you want to support
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375
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now, please throw some of those
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they're missing out on if they're not
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377
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to perpetuate the mission of Talk Heathen
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378
00:22:17.799 --> 00:22:19.200
whole. So if you like what
we do and you want to support us,

379
00:22:19.319 --> 00:22:22.640
those are all ways to do it. And then finally, you can

380
00:22:22.880 --> 00:22:25.759
send in a super chat with a
question or a comment. This is the

381
00:22:25.759 --> 00:22:29.799
most noncommittal way to do this.
So we've already got some super chats right

382
00:22:29.839 --> 00:22:33.000
now here. Let me see if
we can open them up. And they

383
00:22:33.079 --> 00:22:36.400
said they'd be in this message,
and I don't see them, but we'll

384
00:22:36.480 --> 00:22:38.039
keep an eye open. You have
to take it on faith maybe a little

385
00:22:38.039 --> 00:22:44.559
bit. There are in fact super
chats. They here we go. We've

386
00:22:44.599 --> 00:22:48.480
got ten dollars already from Greg Murkowski
for ten dollars here. Thanks for the

387
00:22:48.480 --> 00:22:52.759
show for us is fantastic, Thank
you very much, and welcome Sophia.

388
00:22:52.880 --> 00:22:56.039
Yeay for us. I heard that
crabs have all done Earth more than once.

389
00:22:56.039 --> 00:22:57.400
If that's true, does that mean
that they're the best life form?

390
00:22:57.599 --> 00:23:02.960
Is god crab? Yes? Yeah, just so this is actually this a

391
00:23:03.039 --> 00:23:07.279
process. It's a thing called carconization
where we see crabs evolving over and over,

392
00:23:07.480 --> 00:23:11.839
and oftentimes this gets blown up in
like pop culture, people like say

393
00:23:11.960 --> 00:23:15.759
the crab is like the ultimate final
form of all evolution. What they're missing

394
00:23:15.759 --> 00:23:21.200
out on that is that crabs evolve
repeatedly. In marine crustaceans specifically, there's

395
00:23:21.200 --> 00:23:23.880
no swidz becoming crabs, right,
there's no humans becoming crabs, but like

396
00:23:23.960 --> 00:23:27.640
crabs or like the crab body type
does evolve over and over and over and

397
00:23:27.680 --> 00:23:32.079
over, and also there are some
things that have evolved away from that body

398
00:23:32.079 --> 00:23:34.279
type. It's all just you know, fitting in the best niche and crabs

399
00:23:34.319 --> 00:23:37.960
are real, real, real good
and fitting into obscure niches. And then

400
00:23:37.960 --> 00:23:41.559
we've got George or sending in five
dollars with no message from George, but

401
00:23:41.640 --> 00:23:45.519
thank you anyway for the five dollars. I'm we're going to use all of

402
00:23:45.559 --> 00:23:48.759
those five dollars to support this show, and I appreciate you sending that in.

403
00:23:48.400 --> 00:23:52.400
With that, the lines are filling
up like crazy. I really want

404
00:23:52.440 --> 00:23:56.640
to take this guy here. We've
got Dre from right here in Texas says

405
00:23:56.640 --> 00:24:00.200
that atheists told him that God is
just a guess than a scientific theory.

406
00:24:00.559 --> 00:24:03.359
I believe we can help clear up
that confusion. Dre. You're on talk

407
00:24:03.400 --> 00:24:06.799
he than. How are you doing
today? I'm doing great. How you

408
00:24:06.799 --> 00:24:10.359
guys doing, I'm awesome? Man. Thank you, so expand a little

409
00:24:10.359 --> 00:24:12.440
bit on what you're saying, Like
what exactly is like the point of contention

410
00:24:12.480 --> 00:24:17.480
here? Um so, so when
I was having a discussion with the atheists,

411
00:24:17.480 --> 00:24:21.200
I believe it was in the comment
section of one of the shorts on

412
00:24:21.240 --> 00:24:25.839
this channel, Okay yeah, um, so so basically I was I really

413
00:24:25.880 --> 00:24:30.039
wonder and we understand that there's there's
concepts that theory is. Basically, theory

414
00:24:30.200 --> 00:24:33.319
is the agreement that there's not going
to be a concrete not going to be

415
00:24:33.359 --> 00:24:37.359
a concrete resolution to some things.
Right, No, not really no,

416
00:24:37.519 --> 00:24:40.640
no, what is what is theory? So? So, in in common

417
00:24:40.720 --> 00:24:42.880
language, like when you and I
are just speaking like people, um,

418
00:24:44.039 --> 00:24:47.680
theory does mean like a gas or
something that we're not able to test,

419
00:24:47.759 --> 00:24:49.200
like I have a theory about where
my sock wind in the dryer. I

420
00:24:49.240 --> 00:24:52.519
have a theory about why my car
won't start, you know whatever like that.

421
00:24:52.599 --> 00:24:56.119
But in science, a theory is
actually the highest level to which an

422
00:24:56.119 --> 00:25:00.119
idea can be elevated. So a
theory is a functional explanation for observed of

423
00:25:00.200 --> 00:25:03.920
natural phenomena that's backed by all the
best evidence that we have. It's something

424
00:25:03.920 --> 00:25:08.559
that's been tested and checked and critiqued
and rigorously like like gone over a million

425
00:25:08.559 --> 00:25:11.640
different times. It's got to be
predictive. We can use this theory to

426
00:25:11.680 --> 00:25:15.559
make predictions on what's going to happen
in the in the world and in nature.

427
00:25:15.119 --> 00:25:21.000
It's also got to have you know, repeated experimentation from several different fields,

428
00:25:21.000 --> 00:25:22.599
of different lines of evidence, all
pointing to it. So a great

429
00:25:22.599 --> 00:25:26.200
example of a theory is gravity.
Gravity is a theory. Um, your

430
00:25:26.200 --> 00:25:30.440
body being made of cells, that's
a theory. Germs making you sick,

431
00:25:30.519 --> 00:25:33.680
that's a theory. The shape of
the planet is a theory. Um,

432
00:25:33.960 --> 00:25:36.880
you know we relativity is a theory. We can go on and on and

433
00:25:36.920 --> 00:25:38.680
on with these things. Um,
my favorite theory is evolutions. What I

434
00:25:38.680 --> 00:25:42.640
study for a limit And so this
doesn't mean a guess. It means actually

435
00:25:42.720 --> 00:25:48.720
something that is like the best explanation
we have, backed by all the best

436
00:25:48.759 --> 00:25:51.400
evidence we have. If you think
that, you know, the crust of

437
00:25:51.400 --> 00:25:55.319
the Earth is broken up into tectonic
plates that move around and change the shape

438
00:25:55.319 --> 00:25:57.079
of the surface of the Earth,
that's called plate tectonic theory. That's my

439
00:25:57.119 --> 00:26:00.160
favorite, and that's backed by a
lot of it. And it's not just

440
00:26:00.240 --> 00:26:03.039
a guess. And so like when
you say, you know, we're using

441
00:26:03.079 --> 00:26:06.920
the word theory to means something that's
kind of unresolved or something we're not really

442
00:26:06.920 --> 00:26:10.319
sure about. No. In common
language, sure, but in science,

443
00:26:10.319 --> 00:26:12.640
when we're talking about things that are
real, no, that you can pretty

444
00:26:12.720 --> 00:26:17.240
much usually replace the word theory with
something that's true, and also just because

445
00:26:17.240 --> 00:26:19.839
inevitably we will get comments about this. Theories and laws are completely different things.

446
00:26:21.079 --> 00:26:25.000
Laws the theories don't become laws.
Laws explain what's happening. Theories tell

447
00:26:25.039 --> 00:26:26.680
you why it's happened. So like, for example, the law of gravity

448
00:26:27.079 --> 00:26:30.079
is fs of G equals negative G
times m one m two divided by our

449
00:26:30.119 --> 00:26:34.000
square. That's the force of gravity
is equal to a set gravitational constant,

450
00:26:34.000 --> 00:26:37.319
which is derived by Newton a long
time ago, multiplied by the mass of

451
00:26:37.319 --> 00:26:42.160
the two objects being experienced gravitational attraction
multiplied together divided by the distant between those

452
00:26:42.160 --> 00:26:45.759
two objects squared. I can plug
any numbers into that and come up with

453
00:26:45.799 --> 00:26:48.599
an answer. I can figure out
the gravity between the Earth and the Moon,

454
00:26:48.759 --> 00:26:52.599
the gravity between the Milky Way and
Andromeda, the gravity between Sofia and

455
00:26:52.640 --> 00:26:56.759
I. At this moment, I
can calculate the gravitational force between any two

456
00:26:56.759 --> 00:27:00.319
objects by just plugging in numbers.
The theory of gravity into general relativity,

457
00:27:00.440 --> 00:27:03.839
the bending of space time to pull
massive objects, or so like. These

458
00:27:03.839 --> 00:27:08.880
are different things and and and they
all matter and so anyway, I say

459
00:27:08.920 --> 00:27:11.920
that not to be pedantic, but
just because I know for sure we're gonna

460
00:27:11.920 --> 00:27:15.799
have people in the comments like,
no, if a theory was true,

461
00:27:15.839 --> 00:27:18.519
it becomes a law. That's not
how that works. So yeah, that's

462
00:27:18.559 --> 00:27:21.039
that's the long and short of it. Man. That's why I'm sure this

463
00:27:21.079 --> 00:27:22.799
person told you that God is not
a scientific theory because for God to be

464
00:27:22.799 --> 00:27:26.039
a theory, Um, we'd have
to have evidence, and we don't have

465
00:27:26.079 --> 00:27:32.880
that. Okay. So um,
So basically that was un extraordinary exclamation.

466
00:27:32.960 --> 00:27:36.240
I think that's a gooddition for me. Really, I appreciate that. Sorry

467
00:27:36.240 --> 00:27:38.599
to just dump on you like this, it's something we encounter question. No,

468
00:27:38.599 --> 00:27:42.680
no, Wow, that was a
very extraordinary exclamation. So um,

469
00:27:42.400 --> 00:27:48.279
I'm from the from the side of
somebody that is a the is like,

470
00:27:48.480 --> 00:27:52.480
what would you consider theology the study
of God? What would you consider that

471
00:27:52.559 --> 00:27:56.880
from um an intellectual standpoint of this, because I wouldn't. I want,

472
00:27:57.000 --> 00:28:03.079
I wouldn't consider anything that's any thing
to study intellectually a guest. So there's

473
00:28:03.119 --> 00:28:07.559
so many ules that there are schools
that study theology, Yes, very deeply,

474
00:28:07.759 --> 00:28:11.960
wouldn't. Yeah, I wouldn't consider
it a guest though. That's a

475
00:28:11.000 --> 00:28:15.599
little bit that sounds a little bit
condescending. Yeah you go first, Yeah,

476
00:28:15.640 --> 00:28:21.160
totally can I um. When I
was studying theology, I went to

477
00:28:21.240 --> 00:28:23.960
a Christian university. I loved theology. I love doing biblical exe Jesus,

478
00:28:25.000 --> 00:28:30.279
any of that. Like historical contextual
criticism, theology is not necessarily I would

479
00:28:30.319 --> 00:28:33.279
say, the study of God.
It's a study of how we speak about

480
00:28:33.359 --> 00:28:38.440
God about religious texts. I remember
writing like this eight page paper offhand about

481
00:28:38.480 --> 00:28:42.680
three verses in Isaiah ones. That's
your studying theology or getting into the nitty

482
00:28:42.680 --> 00:28:45.480
gritty of who actually wrote this,
what did it mean at the time,

483
00:28:45.599 --> 00:28:48.839
what did people take it to mean, and how has that evolved over time.

484
00:28:49.480 --> 00:28:53.680
It's not a guess because we're not
actually talking about God. Most of

485
00:28:53.720 --> 00:28:59.680
the time, you are talking about
what you do have evidence for, which

486
00:28:59.759 --> 00:29:02.960
is how the cultures around you know, the culture of the authorship, things

487
00:29:03.000 --> 00:29:07.000
like that. So it would be
kind of ending to say theologians are just

488
00:29:07.680 --> 00:29:11.279
guessing out in the wild. Some
probably do, let's be real, but

489
00:29:11.559 --> 00:29:15.240
there are some that are, you
know, incredibly rigorous in their research and

490
00:29:15.279 --> 00:29:19.960
are really thoughtful and don't make claims
that are wild and don't have any backing.

491
00:29:21.160 --> 00:29:25.559
But most of the time, uh, it's not really about God,

492
00:29:26.079 --> 00:29:27.799
you know, it's about history.
Yeah. I was going to say some

493
00:29:27.960 --> 00:29:30.880
very simil I'm glad you brought that
U, because I have some friends who

494
00:29:30.880 --> 00:29:33.400
are a theologists, who are earth
I suppo as you say, theologic,

495
00:29:33.519 --> 00:29:37.359
because yeah, yeah, but I
have some friends who study theology, um,

496
00:29:37.440 --> 00:29:41.720
And like, that's that's exactly right. They're they're studying the history of

497
00:29:41.880 --> 00:29:45.839
belief, the history of the language
surrounding belief, the the history of the

498
00:29:45.880 --> 00:29:51.079
interpretations and translations of religious texts.
It's they're they're basically anthropologists in this way.

499
00:29:51.119 --> 00:29:53.640
They're studying the history of this culture
and this phenomenon that we call religion.

500
00:29:53.920 --> 00:29:56.559
Um. So, like I can
totally understand how you would say that,

501
00:29:56.559 --> 00:29:59.599
you know, calling God a guest
or whatever like that would be you

502
00:29:59.640 --> 00:30:00.799
know a little what condescending, and
it kind of is. You're right,

503
00:30:00.960 --> 00:30:04.920
um, But like I would argue
that, like, theology can be theory

504
00:30:04.960 --> 00:30:08.200
based, and theology can have facts
behind it, and theology can be a

505
00:30:08.480 --> 00:30:14.000
scientific endeavor. But when we're talking
about the actual belief in God, we're

506
00:30:14.000 --> 00:30:17.000
not talking about theology. We're talking
about something very different. We're talking about

507
00:30:17.000 --> 00:30:19.400
personal belief. We're talking about religion, and so religion and theology are are

508
00:30:19.480 --> 00:30:22.680
are very much not the same thing, you know what I mean, Yes,

509
00:30:22.799 --> 00:30:26.119
absolutely absolutely, And that's that was
a very that was very sufficient answer

510
00:30:26.160 --> 00:30:30.720
for me as well. So and
then I just rode down by what I'm

511
00:30:30.720 --> 00:30:33.920
saying, was saying that, Um, I understand, like I watched this

512
00:30:33.960 --> 00:30:40.640
program a lot because I know when
I'm listening to I'm listening to actual objective,

513
00:30:40.799 --> 00:30:47.039
intellectual people speak to me as a
theist, I understand that my theism

514
00:30:47.160 --> 00:30:51.000
is faith based. It's not necessary
scientific based, it's not necessary, and

515
00:30:51.519 --> 00:30:55.839
it's faith based. It's a faith
is the belief in things unseen. I

516
00:30:55.920 --> 00:31:00.279
really can't have evidence for my faith
besides me just believing this thing very deep

517
00:31:00.359 --> 00:31:02.880
me. Yeah, it would go
against what the Bible tells you to do

518
00:31:03.000 --> 00:31:04.720
if you had evidence for it,
because the Bible says you're supposed to believe

519
00:31:04.759 --> 00:31:07.279
like a child and not not seek
out evidence. So like, yeah,

520
00:31:07.359 --> 00:31:11.680
I get that, yeah yeah,
so so so basically, you know,

521
00:31:11.880 --> 00:31:15.359
I feel like sometimes when not not
not speaking on you guys, not to

522
00:31:15.400 --> 00:31:18.119
speak on anyone necessarily on the channel, but I feel like someone sometimes when

523
00:31:18.160 --> 00:31:23.319
I speak to atheists, it's like
they come from automatic like, since I

524
00:31:23.519 --> 00:31:26.599
have, since I do not believe
in God, I am therefore better than

525
00:31:26.720 --> 00:31:32.400
you. I totally get that end
believes you're just so I'm sorry. I'm

526
00:31:32.440 --> 00:31:34.720
sorry. I just for a long
time I didn't say I was an atheist

527
00:31:34.799 --> 00:31:38.720
because I just didn't want to be
like those dicks I was. I was

528
00:31:38.839 --> 00:31:42.920
very religious in my past, and
I remember sitting at a dinner table after

529
00:31:42.960 --> 00:31:48.400
a sleepover with my friends atheist parents, and they were just grilling me over

530
00:31:48.839 --> 00:31:52.319
what they you know, all of
the things that they had issues with religion

531
00:31:52.400 --> 00:31:53.799
about, some of which were valid, some of which I even look at

532
00:31:53.799 --> 00:31:56.880
now and I'm like, that was
actually just kind of a bizarre argumentum,

533
00:31:57.079 --> 00:32:01.160
but it sucks so bad, and
I honestly I fully get it. I

534
00:32:01.200 --> 00:32:07.440
think there's also an era of atheism
the Bill Maher, where people like that

535
00:32:07.480 --> 00:32:13.039
we're really at the four where being
snarky and horrible was kind of how you

536
00:32:13.039 --> 00:32:15.799
you got some I don't know,
atheist straight crad. I guess. So

537
00:32:16.000 --> 00:32:19.799
I would say I think that's changing
a little bit. I think that it's

538
00:32:19.799 --> 00:32:23.720
becoming more normal to be nice as
an atheist. But I would say,

539
00:32:23.759 --> 00:32:30.160
like I both affirm and and validate
that, and I want more atheists to

540
00:32:30.200 --> 00:32:32.000
hear like, yeah, I mean
it doesn't make you better. It means

541
00:32:32.000 --> 00:32:36.640
that you, you know, thought
about something and decided what you believe based

542
00:32:36.720 --> 00:32:40.160
upon it. But you're not like
a superior human because of that, just

543
00:32:40.240 --> 00:32:45.359
like someone who's a believer is not
a superior human because of what they believe

544
00:32:45.440 --> 00:32:46.920
either, Right, Yeah, that's
the one thing is like, you know,

545
00:32:46.960 --> 00:32:52.799
atheism is one single position on one
single question, do you believe there's

546
00:32:52.799 --> 00:32:55.200
a God? And we say no? And in that you have a tremendous

547
00:32:55.240 --> 00:32:59.880
diversity of people. You have,
you know, a Republicans and democrat,

548
00:33:00.119 --> 00:33:04.000
you have capitalists and communists, you
have all sorts of different people from all

549
00:33:04.000 --> 00:33:07.440
sorts of backgrounds also believe. The
one thing you can say about us is

550
00:33:07.440 --> 00:33:08.400
that as atheists, we don't believe
there's a God. And so like,

551
00:33:08.480 --> 00:33:10.680
yeah, you're absolutely right. There's
there's gonna be a lot of dicks out

552
00:33:10.680 --> 00:33:14.559
there that are gonna be jerks about
it. I've interact with some of them

553
00:33:14.599 --> 00:33:17.880
before. They're a lot of times
when someone is like a freshly minted atheist,

554
00:33:17.920 --> 00:33:22.079
when they're just starting to deconstruct their
religion, they're pissed because they feel

555
00:33:22.079 --> 00:33:24.079
like they've been lied to their whole
lives and they want to go out there

556
00:33:24.079 --> 00:33:27.880
and rattle the walls and shake everybody
by their shoulders and be like this is

557
00:33:27.880 --> 00:33:30.119
all bullshit and like it. You
get people who are pretty insufferable. Sometimes.

558
00:33:30.440 --> 00:33:34.039
There's there's a joke that I heard
from some religious friends a long time

559
00:33:34.079 --> 00:33:36.240
ago that you know, how do
you how can you tell that somebody's an

560
00:33:36.240 --> 00:33:38.720
atheist? Just wait, they'll tell
you and like this kind of thing that

561
00:33:38.799 --> 00:33:43.799
like it's sonabout of a troope.
So yeah, you're you're gonna experience that.

562
00:33:43.839 --> 00:33:46.119
Man, I'm sorry, it sucks. It's the same thing I can

563
00:33:46.160 --> 00:33:50.359
tell you about horrible experiences I've had
with religious people who think they're better than

564
00:33:50.400 --> 00:33:52.000
me. Because we had a guy
I think it was the last time I

565
00:33:52.039 --> 00:33:55.319
was on a XP who started the
conversation by saying, I just want to

566
00:33:55.400 --> 00:33:58.200
let you guys know, if you
don't believe in God, your life is

567
00:33:58.200 --> 00:34:00.880
meaningless. And that's how we started
the conversation. So like, that's just

568
00:34:01.559 --> 00:34:05.960
man, that's just how people are. Um. But I appreciate you taking

569
00:34:05.960 --> 00:34:07.320
the time to talk to us and
to listen to us, and like like

570
00:34:07.440 --> 00:34:10.360
call in and ask these are great
questions you're asking right now, UM,

571
00:34:10.599 --> 00:34:15.719
like that really matters. And as
condescending as I know this will sound to

572
00:34:15.840 --> 00:34:19.760
you, UM, I really hope
that this helps along the line, maybe

573
00:34:19.800 --> 00:34:22.320
to the maybe you'll question some of
the things you believe in and ask,

574
00:34:22.400 --> 00:34:24.679
like I know you just said,
I know that my positions are faith based.

575
00:34:24.920 --> 00:34:30.599
Maybe ask yourself, would you use
that same kind of thinking for anything

576
00:34:30.719 --> 00:34:34.440
else ever? And if not,
why? And and maybe that'll be a

577
00:34:34.639 --> 00:34:37.159
maybe you'll call in some day with
some some questions about like, Okay,

578
00:34:37.159 --> 00:34:39.400
maybe maybe I wasn't believing the right
things. Maybe we would pick apart a

579
00:34:39.400 --> 00:34:43.079
little bit, have some fun and
just like chipping away at your faith a

580
00:34:43.119 --> 00:34:45.840
little time, a little bit.
I'm willing. I'm willing to do that,

581
00:34:45.519 --> 00:34:47.880
glad to do that. Well,
Thank you, Dre. I really

582
00:34:47.920 --> 00:34:51.360
appreciate you calling in. You've been
awesome. We're gonna move on the next

583
00:34:51.360 --> 00:34:53.119
call, but please call back in
anytime you want to ask about anything.

584
00:34:53.159 --> 00:34:55.159
Absolutely, thank you for your time. Hey, take care, Dre,

585
00:34:55.239 --> 00:35:00.679
have an awesome day after it's been
so nice. I'm crazy. Just come

586
00:35:00.719 --> 00:35:04.880
at me, guys, come on
anything right now, because we got a

587
00:35:04.880 --> 00:35:07.960
bunch of the car. But yeah, no, this is a phenomenal day

588
00:35:08.000 --> 00:35:10.760
now, I'm a great cars there, wonderful. I like talk Ethan talking

589
00:35:10.800 --> 00:35:14.920
in this a usual lot more chill. Um. Hey, you can support

590
00:35:14.960 --> 00:35:16.599
us on Patreon. Did you know
that? If you wanted to give us

591
00:35:16.639 --> 00:35:21.199
money and achieve like special benefits and
perks, you can go to tiny dot

592
00:35:21.199 --> 00:35:25.239
cc slash patreon THH. And we
also have a new channel that houses all

593
00:35:25.320 --> 00:35:29.760
of the shows of the ACA in
audio podcast form. You can go to

594
00:35:29.760 --> 00:35:35.039
tiny dots, tiny dot cc slash
a n podcasts. You can also become

595
00:35:35.079 --> 00:35:37.519
part of the Talk Heathen community in
our fan run facebook page. You can

596
00:35:37.519 --> 00:35:43.320
go there at tiny dot cc slash
fb t h G. There's it's oh

597
00:35:43.320 --> 00:35:45.239
my god, so many letters h. And also, in case you didn't

598
00:35:45.280 --> 00:35:49.719
know, talk Ethan has a TikTok
channel. I didn't even know that,

599
00:35:50.119 --> 00:35:52.559
and we'll be going live there before
the show is on Sunday, so go

600
00:35:52.599 --> 00:35:58.119
subscribe. Um, you should say
follow on TikTok um and join the pre

601
00:35:58.239 --> 00:36:01.199
show on the Talk Ethan TikTok if
you'll follow us over there as well and

602
00:36:01.239 --> 00:36:06.280
get even more talky than content because
I know that you're all at home,

603
00:36:06.400 --> 00:36:09.440
just kitchen. Every time this show
isn't on, you just need more content,

604
00:36:09.840 --> 00:36:14.599
follow us on TikTok as well.
We've got a ton of callers here.

605
00:36:14.639 --> 00:36:15.639
Do you have any in particular that
you were looking at? Because I

606
00:36:15.639 --> 00:36:21.119
found a couple that I liked,
I think just just give me whatever.

607
00:36:22.320 --> 00:36:25.480
I'm pretty easy. I'm gonna go
for Tommy. Tommy's an Oregon No pronouns

608
00:36:25.519 --> 00:36:30.599
given. He wants to talk about
the historical context of the infalliability of the

609
00:36:30.639 --> 00:36:32.400
Bible. Tommy, You're on talk
Ethan. How are you doing today?

610
00:36:32.599 --> 00:36:36.320
Good? How are you guys doing
pretty well? I'm excited to talk to

611
00:36:36.400 --> 00:36:42.639
an Oregonian. Um. Yeah,
So I just, um, quick quick

612
00:36:42.679 --> 00:36:47.360
background. I'm I'm currently in school. I'm studying a psychology and religious studies.

613
00:36:47.599 --> 00:36:53.159
Um. And in my free time, I'm I like to just study

614
00:36:53.239 --> 00:36:59.880
theology and specifically Christianity. UM.
So I saw the prompt in the common

615
00:37:00.159 --> 00:37:05.039
for the insallibility of the Bible.
Um okay, So, UM, I

616
00:37:05.039 --> 00:37:09.239
guess where I want to start is
I think that um, that kind of

617
00:37:09.239 --> 00:37:15.599
that conversation. UM. I think
a lot of people forget the you know,

618
00:37:15.840 --> 00:37:19.880
I mean really the two thousand years, but especially the last thousand years

619
00:37:19.880 --> 00:37:25.360
of history that has molded um American
Christianity into what it is right. Um,

620
00:37:25.480 --> 00:37:31.760
So, up until the Protestant Reformation, the authority in the faith was

621
00:37:31.840 --> 00:37:37.079
not the Bible. It was the
papal authority because no one could read m

622
00:37:38.639 --> 00:37:42.360
Yeah. They also burned people at
the stake for owning a Bible in the

623
00:37:42.440 --> 00:37:45.519
language that they could read for a
while. Yeah, right, and not

624
00:37:45.599 --> 00:37:51.239
many people could read in general.
So after Luther did his you know,

625
00:37:51.440 --> 00:37:57.800
big public um scene and we got
the split um, there was kind of

626
00:37:57.800 --> 00:38:01.800
now a whole um for Protestant in
their faith because they were like, well,

627
00:38:02.000 --> 00:38:06.320
we can't we don't have the authority
of the pope anymore or of the

628
00:38:06.400 --> 00:38:10.920
church. So the Luther kind of
bunkered down on this idea of well,

629
00:38:12.000 --> 00:38:15.599
that's because the Scripture is the authority. We're not going to listen to man,

630
00:38:15.719 --> 00:38:19.639
We're going to listen to God,
and the best way we can do

631
00:38:19.679 --> 00:38:22.960
that is through the Bible. And
um throughout the next you know, up

632
00:38:23.039 --> 00:38:29.400
till the twenty first century, and
as we got all these new um branches

633
00:38:29.400 --> 00:38:35.360
of Protestantism from Calvin with the Reformed
theology and all the way to you know,

634
00:38:35.519 --> 00:38:39.239
latter day's saints. Um. We
got to this point where the Bible

635
00:38:39.320 --> 00:38:45.400
became god. It basically like the
Quran, UM, like it might as

636
00:38:45.400 --> 00:38:49.280
well have fallen out of the sky. UM. And I think especially nowadays

637
00:38:49.519 --> 00:38:52.920
with the twentieth century, UM,
you know, good examples like the Scopes

638
00:38:53.000 --> 00:39:00.400
Monkey trial, UM, where fundamentalists
had to really start to um kind of

639
00:39:00.440 --> 00:39:04.679
make a choice. And I think
people started going to the extremes. And

640
00:39:04.719 --> 00:39:08.159
I think that's why we now have
this this issue of kind of this infallibility

641
00:39:08.400 --> 00:39:14.360
part of American Christianity, which unfortunately
I think. So to be clear,

642
00:39:14.480 --> 00:39:17.119
you do not think that the Bible
is infallible? No, okay, so

643
00:39:17.599 --> 00:39:22.719
what is your Are you just sort
of just giving a summary or do you

644
00:39:22.760 --> 00:39:25.519
have a point of view on this? So UM. For me, with

645
00:39:25.559 --> 00:39:30.800
my beliefs, I believe that,
well maybe not believe, but I'm I

646
00:39:30.800 --> 00:39:37.280
would consider myself a follower of Christ
and I don't see the Bible as infallible.

647
00:39:37.400 --> 00:39:43.880
But I think that it is a
book packed full of information that is

648
00:39:44.159 --> 00:39:50.159
one percent useful and if you can, if you can learn to kind of

649
00:39:50.280 --> 00:39:53.440
diy sector and understand it properly,
I think that it has a lot of

650
00:39:53.480 --> 00:39:58.639
messages that are are very, very
beneficial for humans, So what about the

651
00:39:58.679 --> 00:40:01.519
messages that are definitely not very beneficial
for humans? Because it has a lot

652
00:40:01.559 --> 00:40:06.320
of those two. So like,
how how should we then pick through this

653
00:40:06.679 --> 00:40:10.400
and how should the layman, the
average everyday person decide which parts they should

654
00:40:10.400 --> 00:40:15.800
believe and follow and which parts have
been corrupted through history and which parts shouldn't

655
00:40:15.800 --> 00:40:17.920
have ever been there in the first
place, And like, how how should

656
00:40:17.920 --> 00:40:22.599
an average person deal with this book? Um? Yeah, so I think

657
00:40:22.639 --> 00:40:28.639
that, UM, if if someone's
looking to be a Christian and their ultimate

658
00:40:28.639 --> 00:40:34.800
goal is to follow Jesus UM,
starting with the Gospels, I'd probably say,

659
00:40:34.880 --> 00:40:37.880
Mark is your you know, Mark
or Luke, those are your going

660
00:40:37.920 --> 00:40:40.880
to be your best bits and doing
a bit of doing a bit of work

661
00:40:42.440 --> 00:40:50.400
on trying to understand them, you
know, anthropological historical context to those just

662
00:40:50.519 --> 00:40:54.199
those accounts in the communities that they
were being written to, UM, and

663
00:40:54.239 --> 00:40:58.119
then kind of you can work through
the New Testament. But in terms of

664
00:40:58.159 --> 00:41:02.960
the Old TESTAMENTUM, I would say, find a find a good scholar um

665
00:41:04.320 --> 00:41:07.320
that if you have those questions and
if you want to explore that stuff,

666
00:41:07.360 --> 00:41:09.320
you can kind of look at their
work. I don't think it would be

667
00:41:09.400 --> 00:41:14.079
fair to ask, um, every
single person who wants to be a Christian

668
00:41:14.079 --> 00:41:17.320
to you know, go through six
years of academic study, right, But

669
00:41:17.360 --> 00:41:20.679
like that, that's kind of what
I'm getting at is, do you really

670
00:41:20.719 --> 00:41:23.119
think it's reasonable for you know,
average everyday people to put in this much

671
00:41:23.159 --> 00:41:27.679
work to dissect the historical context and
the translations and the this and the that

672
00:41:27.840 --> 00:41:30.880
of this ancient you know, at
this iron age age, you know,

673
00:41:30.960 --> 00:41:34.199
sex manual or do you think that
it's better that maybe we just kind of

674
00:41:34.239 --> 00:41:37.360
do away with that and focus on
things that, like the morality of our

675
00:41:37.400 --> 00:41:43.039
culture today is not derived from the
Bible. It's derived from logic and reason

676
00:41:43.119 --> 00:41:47.159
and argumentation and the blending of cultures. So like, why not just encourage

677
00:41:47.199 --> 00:41:52.480
people to be good people and participate
in the society that they're in and adopt

678
00:41:52.639 --> 00:41:57.400
universal principles of morality rather than saying, here's this book, and you should

679
00:41:57.440 --> 00:42:00.599
explore this book because it'll make you
a better person. Just don't read these

680
00:42:00.599 --> 00:42:02.280
parts. And when you do read
these parts, remember these certain things.

681
00:42:02.360 --> 00:42:05.519
And when you get to this section, you needed to go find a Bible

682
00:42:05.519 --> 00:42:07.559
scholar and he's going to tell you
what to do with it, Like,

683
00:42:07.679 --> 00:42:09.360
don't you think it's at easier just
to you know, do away with this

684
00:42:09.400 --> 00:42:15.639
outdated technology. Um. So I'm
I think if if someone's not interested in

685
00:42:15.920 --> 00:42:24.840
a spiritual component to their life and
they're simply looking for a simple like moral

686
00:42:24.920 --> 00:42:30.079
code to live by, there's yeah, there are some great philosophical viewpoints even

687
00:42:30.119 --> 00:42:32.840
if they even wanted to go a
step further than just like you know,

688
00:42:32.920 --> 00:42:37.239
figuring out for themselves. There's some
great philosophers, um, from history that

689
00:42:37.320 --> 00:42:42.039
have come up with some great ways
to live. Um. But I think

690
00:42:42.039 --> 00:42:47.199
if you're talking about spirituality, which
um, you know, having a spiritual

691
00:42:47.280 --> 00:42:52.559
point into your life in any former
fashion is very beneficial, um, then

692
00:42:53.880 --> 00:42:57.639
I would I would debate that with
you, but I'm not gonna go down

693
00:42:57.679 --> 00:43:02.400
that rabbit trail. Please finish what
you're saying. If Jesus is somebody that

694
00:43:02.679 --> 00:43:07.760
you want to follow spiritually, then
then I would say the Bible is still

695
00:43:07.840 --> 00:43:12.480
very important. I mean, I
guess I'm a little curious because you're mentioning,

696
00:43:13.440 --> 00:43:15.199
Yeah, I guess if you want
to follow Jesus, the Bible probably

697
00:43:15.239 --> 00:43:17.960
matters. But it's sort of like
saying, if you want to follow Jesus

698
00:43:19.199 --> 00:43:22.840
then read about Jesus like, Okay, great, why is this better than

699
00:43:22.840 --> 00:43:24.880
any other kind of spirituality? If
you want one? You kind of threw

700
00:43:24.920 --> 00:43:29.840
a passing reference into the Kuran.
But I don't really see why studying the

701
00:43:29.880 --> 00:43:32.840
Bible and being a Christian as somehow
superior, at least from anything you've said.

702
00:43:35.000 --> 00:43:37.239
You've basically said, the Bible's useful. A lot of things can be

703
00:43:37.360 --> 00:43:43.800
useful. They're not necessarily good things. If I break my ankle, it

704
00:43:43.840 --> 00:43:46.280
can be useful because then I start
working out and all of my joint muscles

705
00:43:46.280 --> 00:43:51.480
become better after that to rehab my
ankle sack that I broke my ankle,

706
00:43:51.480 --> 00:43:53.360
though, So I don't know that. I guess I have two questions,

707
00:43:53.360 --> 00:43:58.159
one being why is the superior to
any other kind of spirituality? And the

708
00:43:58.199 --> 00:44:02.920
other being you're you've said this is
useful? Why how is it uniquely useful?

709
00:44:04.159 --> 00:44:07.039
Okay? So? Um, and
you know I'll preface this with,

710
00:44:07.280 --> 00:44:12.920
uh, you know, I'm I'm
still learning, um, you know,

711
00:44:13.239 --> 00:44:19.119
and and I so I through my
studies. Um. There Uh, there's

712
00:44:19.199 --> 00:44:22.079
a um. There's a French polymath. His name is Nay Gerard. Have

713
00:44:22.159 --> 00:44:24.480
you heard of Have you guys heard
of him. It sounds familiar, but

714
00:44:24.519 --> 00:44:28.639
I couldn't tell you anything about it
from here on this show. I don't

715
00:44:28.679 --> 00:44:30.599
have anything in front of me.
I do love you drop in the word

716
00:44:30.639 --> 00:44:32.880
polymath though. That's a good way. That's very good. Yeah. Um

717
00:44:32.960 --> 00:44:38.599
so he he uh. In the
late twentieth century, UM he was working

718
00:44:38.639 --> 00:44:44.760
on this this UM idea that he
coined memetic theory, and out of it

719
00:44:44.840 --> 00:44:50.159
he kind of built this theory of
religion UM, which focused on UM violence

720
00:44:51.079 --> 00:44:57.199
of humans in communities and specifically sacrificial
violence UM and kind of how that built

721
00:44:57.559 --> 00:45:04.000
religion and UM he he kind of
he outlines this idea that when communities are

722
00:45:04.079 --> 00:45:08.280
in conflict, UM, they the
way that they resolve that conflict and unify

723
00:45:08.519 --> 00:45:16.079
is UM is creating escape in the
community, and killing them is a way

724
00:45:16.079 --> 00:45:22.440
to appease that kind of appease the
conflict. And so he went back and

725
00:45:22.480 --> 00:45:30.119
he's seeing that this theory or this
kind of outline is all across myth and

726
00:45:30.400 --> 00:45:37.199
stories of across human history, and
that he got to the Bible and specifically

727
00:45:37.239 --> 00:45:43.679
the Passion narrative, and in all
of the myths leading up to this,

728
00:45:44.119 --> 00:45:50.199
it's always either there was two victims
that he saw there was the kind of

729
00:45:50.239 --> 00:45:54.079
just the sacrificial victim, one who's
convinced that they deserve this, and so

730
00:45:54.360 --> 00:45:59.840
they are they willingly go, um, you know, think of like kind

731
00:45:59.840 --> 00:46:02.599
of I'm normal, one hundred percent
sure this is fact? What all this

732
00:46:02.760 --> 00:46:06.880
us? Example? Because I've heard
it, um, like how people would

733
00:46:07.039 --> 00:46:15.480
line up um to be sacrificed in
uh um an ancient uh South American communities.

734
00:46:15.800 --> 00:46:19.199
Um. And then the other type
of victim was the retributed victim,

735
00:46:19.320 --> 00:46:22.840
which we see in Judaism right where
it's no, I don't deserve this,

736
00:46:22.880 --> 00:46:25.800
and in fact, you guys are
the ones that deserve um to be to

737
00:46:25.920 --> 00:46:30.159
be sacrificed or to be killed um, and they demand justice and retribution.

738
00:46:30.400 --> 00:46:35.280
And when we get to Jesus,
he breaks that all down when he's on

739
00:46:35.320 --> 00:46:39.519
the cross. And okay, so
forgives his enemies. Is the premise here

740
00:46:39.519 --> 00:46:50.039
then that Christianity is uniquely useful because
the scapegoat was a perfect person. Is

741
00:46:50.079 --> 00:46:53.440
that kind of the idea here that
he was the first he was the forgiving

742
00:46:53.519 --> 00:46:59.199
victim. Okay, but so that
he breaks the cycle of violence, and

743
00:46:59.519 --> 00:47:04.079
but he kind of sorry to interrupts, I just he can't really say that

744
00:47:04.199 --> 00:47:09.519
Christianity broke a cycle of violence or
broke a need for scapegoats and sacrificial victims.

745
00:47:09.679 --> 00:47:14.320
It was only in believe it was
the nineteen seventies with Vatkin too,

746
00:47:14.360 --> 00:47:17.840
that the Catholic Church finally said we
don't blame all Jewish people for the crucifixion

747
00:47:17.960 --> 00:47:22.639
of Jesus. It kind of feels
like, if we look at this historically,

748
00:47:22.679 --> 00:47:27.440
which I think we should, that
he doesn't break down the cycle of

749
00:47:27.519 --> 00:47:30.159
violence, he just provides a different
kind of justification. Yeah. I also

750
00:47:30.159 --> 00:47:34.039
want to throw out there, like
you mentioned that, like this is unique

751
00:47:34.119 --> 00:47:37.599
because Jesus sacrificed himself, He's not
unique in doing that. I just googled

752
00:47:37.760 --> 00:47:43.039
list of gods that sacrificed themselves and
the first one here is in Aztec mythology,

753
00:47:43.159 --> 00:47:47.119
Nanahwatson sacrificed himself. He is the
most humble of all gods who sacrificed

754
00:47:47.199 --> 00:47:51.880
himself and fire so the earth would
continue to have the sun, and then

755
00:47:51.920 --> 00:47:54.480
he became the sun god in doing
so. And then here's a Reddit thread

756
00:47:54.480 --> 00:47:58.840
that mentions Prometheus, which is one
of my favorite literary characters, and right

757
00:47:58.880 --> 00:48:04.840
away he was Rometheus was crucified and
tortured for all eternity because he gave people

758
00:48:04.960 --> 00:48:07.199
hope and fire and things like this, and so like like it's not a

759
00:48:07.360 --> 00:48:12.840
unique doctrine to say, you know, okay, this guy sacrifices himself versus

760
00:48:12.840 --> 00:48:15.440
this person was sacrifice it. And
now here's this person giving himself and he

761
00:48:15.480 --> 00:48:20.360
becomes a god and doing so like
all these are yes, themes of sacrifice

762
00:48:20.440 --> 00:48:24.599
do surround religious tradition, sure,
but like the Jesus story at face value

763
00:48:25.039 --> 00:48:30.519
is not unique at all. And
also it's not necessary anymore because we no

764
00:48:30.599 --> 00:48:36.159
longer have that mindset that we used
to have when we were hunter gatherers or

765
00:48:36.159 --> 00:48:38.880
early civilization. We're like, well, I have to give all this stuff,

766
00:48:38.960 --> 00:48:43.679
sacrifice this stuff in order to get
the Sunda rise tomorrow. Now we

767
00:48:43.719 --> 00:48:47.440
can like function in more civilized ways. So like, I just I don't

768
00:48:47.559 --> 00:48:52.519
think that your narrative here about like
the uniqueness or the specialness or whatever of

769
00:48:52.559 --> 00:48:59.519
this passion model are either useful for
society or give any credibility to the religion

770
00:48:59.559 --> 00:49:01.639
at all. I guess also on
that um, sorry, oh you can

771
00:49:01.679 --> 00:49:07.440
go in just on the theme of
self sacrifice. Moms throughout history have sacrificed

772
00:49:07.559 --> 00:49:09.639
quite a bit, even to just
reproduce the first time. All of these

773
00:49:09.679 --> 00:49:13.480
examples are male, which is,
you know, history is what it is.

774
00:49:13.800 --> 00:49:16.639
But putting it out there, the
idea of being self sacrificial. Um,

775
00:49:17.039 --> 00:49:21.480
so just female existence in there of
course, yeah, of course,

776
00:49:21.559 --> 00:49:24.719
and and yeah, I'm not I'm
not claiming that self sacrifice is what the

777
00:49:24.760 --> 00:49:30.800
idea of self sacrifice was created with
Jesus's death. Um. Obviously self sacrifice

778
00:49:30.920 --> 00:49:35.559
has probably been going on since humans, uh, you know, since we

779
00:49:35.639 --> 00:49:38.000
transitioned in the Homo sapience. But
I don't even there's other species to do

780
00:49:38.039 --> 00:49:42.000
it too, or yeah, other
species even I'm sure, yes, Um.

781
00:49:42.039 --> 00:49:46.480
And so I think what it's it's
more specific than just self sacrifice.

782
00:49:46.719 --> 00:49:53.639
UM. I think the context of
um kind of leading up to Jesus's death,

783
00:49:53.800 --> 00:50:00.000
who people or who the Depending on
what costfully you read, I guess

784
00:50:00.000 --> 00:50:02.639
it varies a bit. But um, kind of who people saw him as,

785
00:50:04.000 --> 00:50:10.000
who he eluded or claimed to be, who and and and what he

786
00:50:10.119 --> 00:50:17.760
was teaching m all of that taking
place in Jewish community and the conflicts of

787
00:50:17.800 --> 00:50:25.119
their beliefs. Um. It's it's
much more about the fact that Jesus is

788
00:50:25.320 --> 00:50:34.360
breaking down these walls of religious violence
that permanent communities all throughout history and still

789
00:50:34.440 --> 00:50:37.440
do. Like you said, yes, Christianity is no different. And that's

790
00:50:37.519 --> 00:50:45.079
the ironic part, right, is
that when the Way Right became institutionalized into

791
00:50:45.159 --> 00:50:49.920
a religion, it the same thing
that religion has done across the world forever.

792
00:50:50.159 --> 00:50:53.119
And so Tommy, really quickly,
we've been going for about sixteen minutes

793
00:50:53.159 --> 00:50:54.960
now and we've got a few other
callers. I want to move on,

794
00:50:55.000 --> 00:50:59.199
but I do want to ask you
very quickly before, which is without I

795
00:50:59.239 --> 00:51:02.039
don't think this requires a history context, is just just asking you personally.

796
00:51:02.679 --> 00:51:06.519
Over the course of this call,
we've mentioned the fact that the Bible is

797
00:51:06.559 --> 00:51:08.280
corrupted and fallible and has a whole
bunch of bad stuff in it. We've

798
00:51:08.320 --> 00:51:12.519
mentioned the fact that Christianity as a
whole is corrupted and fallible and has a

799
00:51:12.519 --> 00:51:15.599
whole bunch of bad stuff in it. We've mentioned that humans are humans,

800
00:51:15.719 --> 00:51:17.920
and that we do good and bad
things, and that no part of this

801
00:51:19.000 --> 00:51:22.840
doctrine is unique. I've been trying
to press over and over about like what

802
00:51:23.039 --> 00:51:27.599
is the actual usefulness of this whole
thing? And so that's kind of where

803
00:51:27.599 --> 00:51:29.599
I'd like to land now at the
very end of the call is just to

804
00:51:29.960 --> 00:51:32.760
ask, like, the whole point
of society moving forward is that we do

805
00:51:34.000 --> 00:51:37.320
way with things that aren't useful anymore, things that are outdated, things that

806
00:51:37.360 --> 00:51:39.559
are getting in the way of progress. Even if they have a little bit

807
00:51:39.599 --> 00:51:42.880
of good to them, maybe we
can save it a little bit of that

808
00:51:42.920 --> 00:51:47.000
good. There's not a single thing
that a religious person Christian, Muslim,

809
00:51:47.039 --> 00:51:52.079
whatever, can do or can say
that is good that an atheist also couldn't

810
00:51:52.119 --> 00:51:55.199
do or say that's good. But
I can give you a laundry list of

811
00:51:55.239 --> 00:52:00.719
things that religious people have done and
would do that are evil that an atheist

812
00:52:00.800 --> 00:52:04.320
would never do for these reasons.
So like at the end of the call,

813
00:52:04.360 --> 00:52:07.599
I just want to know, like, again, why do we need

814
00:52:07.719 --> 00:52:10.800
this? Why is this useful?
If it isn't true, then shouldn't it

815
00:52:10.840 --> 00:52:13.880
be done away with? And if
you think it is true, if you

816
00:52:13.880 --> 00:52:16.079
think that the story of Jesus is
a real thing, still, why do

817
00:52:16.159 --> 00:52:22.159
we need this particular doctrine, this
particular structure, this particular way of life,

818
00:52:22.159 --> 00:52:27.199
this particular religion. Why is this
thing right here the actual only way

819
00:52:27.239 --> 00:52:34.079
to do it? So I would
say that the example that Jesus sets in

820
00:52:34.199 --> 00:52:40.960
the Gospels and the teachings that he
gives us of forgiving our enemies or loving

821
00:52:40.960 --> 00:52:51.760
our enemies, and forgiveness and compassion
and not having these imaginary borders between people,

822
00:52:52.639 --> 00:52:58.280
that we're all brothers and sisters,
and we're all children of the Father.

823
00:52:58.800 --> 00:53:02.679
That idea is something I think is
very profound, and I think it's

824
00:53:02.679 --> 00:53:07.440
something that's missing from the world,
especially right now. But isn't there a

825
00:53:07.440 --> 00:53:12.559
way to teach those kinds of information, those kind of ideals without the baggage

826
00:53:12.800 --> 00:53:15.239
of Christianity. Like Sophia and I
are good people. I like to think

827
00:53:16.079 --> 00:53:20.440
we work pretty hard to make the
world a better place. I can speak

828
00:53:20.480 --> 00:53:23.519
from myself. I dedicate my entire
career to try and to make the world

829
00:53:23.559 --> 00:53:27.320
a little bit less shitty than it
was when I got here. Donate a

830
00:53:27.320 --> 00:53:30.360
lot to charity, raise a lot
of money, try to help people where

831
00:53:30.360 --> 00:53:32.280
I can give a sandwich to a
homeless guy. Like can't and I don't

832
00:53:32.280 --> 00:53:38.000
believe in any of this, So
can't we all adopt those ideals without the

833
00:53:38.039 --> 00:53:44.360
additional baggage of Christianity. Isn't that
possible or useful? I mean, flip,

834
00:53:44.440 --> 00:53:46.239
dude, Santa Claus teaches all the
same things that you just taught.

835
00:53:46.400 --> 00:53:51.400
Be good, be kind, we're
all brothers and sisters, of course it

836
00:53:51.559 --> 00:53:54.920
is and and and you know,
I think there are a lot of people

837
00:53:54.960 --> 00:53:58.960
in this world that are a lot
more Christian than a lot of Christians are.

838
00:54:00.119 --> 00:54:01.880
Think that, yeah, if if
if someone like I said, and

839
00:54:02.079 --> 00:54:06.400
towards the beginning of the coal,
um, if someone's not interested in a

840
00:54:06.480 --> 00:54:12.199
spiritual component to their life, and
and really they're not looking to kind of

841
00:54:12.400 --> 00:54:16.559
tie this into maybe some bigger picture
that um, well, yeah, only

842
00:54:16.559 --> 00:54:21.480
be really subjective and in their own
head, that I would still say,

843
00:54:21.480 --> 00:54:25.920
sure, an atheist living by the
principles of forgiveness and compassion and not making

844
00:54:27.039 --> 00:54:31.440
enemies and self sacrifice is uh will
be awesome. I feel like we're kind

845
00:54:31.440 --> 00:54:35.599
of going around in circles here because
we're like, why is it unique to

846
00:54:35.599 --> 00:54:39.360
this? Why not drop all of
the other things that come with what has

847
00:54:39.400 --> 00:54:44.639
become this what we all agree as
a corrupt religion and just just live this

848
00:54:44.679 --> 00:54:46.199
way. And you're like, yeah, but then also spirituality, and really

849
00:54:46.239 --> 00:54:49.880
you can get spirituality from somewhere else. And then we kind of keep going

850
00:54:49.920 --> 00:54:52.480
into this. We're having the same
conversations that are over and over. UM,

851
00:54:53.039 --> 00:54:58.519
I would really encourage you. I
used to be whoop hit and stuff.

852
00:54:58.840 --> 00:55:01.559
I used to be very really Um. I ran a Bible study at

853
00:55:01.559 --> 00:55:04.719
my school. I was like,
I thought I was going to be a

854
00:55:04.719 --> 00:55:07.519
missionary. All this stuff right,
and for me it was really helpful in

855
00:55:07.559 --> 00:55:13.079
these sorts of discussions to write my
premise out first and test that. I

856
00:55:13.119 --> 00:55:15.519
feel like you have a lot of
sort of premises here. Things you can

857
00:55:15.559 --> 00:55:20.880
say, Okay, the Bible is
a uniquely good way to accomplish these goals.

858
00:55:21.039 --> 00:55:22.480
Test that theory. That's something you
can do, you know, like

859
00:55:22.559 --> 00:55:25.760
Google or like I just called you
Google, like for us, just did

860
00:55:27.320 --> 00:55:30.000
you know with a Google? All
right, yes, mister Google here.

861
00:55:30.239 --> 00:55:32.960
Um, you know it's something that
you can kind of do on your own.

862
00:55:34.119 --> 00:55:37.400
And not to say that we wouldn't
want to talk to you again,

863
00:55:37.440 --> 00:55:39.800
because absolutely we would. I feel
like you're on this really interesting intellectual journey.

864
00:55:39.840 --> 00:55:43.679
I feel like you're really smart,
um, and I do want to

865
00:55:43.679 --> 00:55:46.400
know where this goes for you.
But I also feel like some of this,

866
00:55:47.039 --> 00:55:51.159
I think you can push your own
thinking here, and I'm excited to

867
00:55:51.159 --> 00:55:53.760
see where that would lead you.
If you just start testing your own ideas

868
00:55:53.760 --> 00:55:58.320
a little bit. Definitely. Okay, yeah, and I appreciate you guys

869
00:55:58.400 --> 00:56:00.159
talking. Hey, thanks so much
to thanks for calling. I've an awesome

870
00:56:00.159 --> 00:56:04.320
rested day. Man. Take care. So before we go on, we

871
00:56:04.360 --> 00:56:10.800
have the top five Patrons announcement,
which yay patrons. Um, I might

872
00:56:10.920 --> 00:56:15.320
say all of these things. All
of your name's terribly wrong. You should

873
00:56:15.320 --> 00:56:20.000
do it on purpose. Um,
all right, why not? So?

874
00:56:20.519 --> 00:56:25.519
Um we have let's see our number
one, uh, top patron is See

875
00:56:25.519 --> 00:56:28.559
this one's so easy to say,
but I'm going to try to do it

876
00:56:28.599 --> 00:56:35.719
wrong. U Dinglebree Jackson um,
which I believe is Dingleberry Jackson. Um.

877
00:56:35.840 --> 00:56:38.039
This one I might just say wrong
on accident. I am a I

878
00:56:38.159 --> 00:56:43.239
am a anime. You are what
I am. I get it. I'm

879
00:56:43.320 --> 00:56:46.119
so slow on puns. It's like
my super weakness. Um. Yeah,

880
00:56:46.199 --> 00:56:50.320
if I were a superhero, my
weakness would be not getting puns. It

881
00:56:50.320 --> 00:56:53.840
would be terrible. Number three we
have oops all Singularity, which I didn't

882
00:56:53.880 --> 00:57:00.679
say wrong because it's too funny on
its own. Number four is divorce Davar

883
00:57:00.079 --> 00:57:04.880
Valjean. I was going to say, my brain went to Jean Valjean from

884
00:57:05.719 --> 00:57:07.519
Leima's Rob, so yeah, you
know what kind of a nerd I am.

885
00:57:07.679 --> 00:57:15.039
And then our fifth top patron of
this week is Calvetti HELVETI well name

886
00:57:15.079 --> 00:57:16.920
and here we go. It's very
cool. It also makes me think of

887
00:57:16.960 --> 00:57:22.360
Helvetica the font, so I'm just
word associating now. And an honorable mention

888
00:57:22.480 --> 00:57:28.800
too towards in OsO Fluffy Phil.
But Phil spelled strangely and I'm not sure

889
00:57:28.800 --> 00:57:31.519
if it's a typo or if your
name is actually Peel. So I'm hoping

890
00:57:31.559 --> 00:57:36.079
it's Phil because otherwise that's really unfortunate. Thanks Fluffy pe Hole. Yeah,

891
00:57:36.159 --> 00:57:43.039
we appreciate being here. Thanks for
your support. Thanks Paton. Make sure

892
00:57:43.119 --> 00:57:46.360
to check out the newest episode of
the flagship show of the ACA the Nonprofits,

893
00:57:46.360 --> 00:57:52.000
which will air at three pm Central
Time today at tiny dot cc slash

894
00:57:52.159 --> 00:57:55.599
y t n P. The AC
also wants you to know what's going on

895
00:57:55.639 --> 00:58:00.280
in our community, and we've got
you updated on a cool website. Head

896
00:58:00.320 --> 00:58:04.000
over to Atheist hyphen Community dot org, where you can learn all about the

897
00:58:04.079 --> 00:58:07.440
organization itself, our policies, and
how you can get involved because I know

898
00:58:07.519 --> 00:58:10.079
you want to. We also want
to hear from you. We're dying to

899
00:58:10.159 --> 00:58:13.800
know what you think. So if
you want to tell us what you liked,

900
00:58:13.920 --> 00:58:15.679
what you thought was effective, what
you think we could do better,

901
00:58:15.840 --> 00:58:21.119
any comments, questions, concerns,
feedback, you can email us at TV

902
00:58:21.440 --> 00:58:24.079
at Atheist hyphen Community dot org and
let us know. We're always interested in

903
00:58:24.119 --> 00:58:28.800
what you guys think we were.
We are a community organization and you are

904
00:58:28.840 --> 00:58:31.559
part of the community. So right
in to TV at Atheist hyphen Community dot

905
00:58:31.679 --> 00:58:36.360
org and get involved. We've got
like twenty five minutes left. I think

906
00:58:36.400 --> 00:58:37.599
we can squeeze in like maybe two
more callers that we try to do.

907
00:58:37.639 --> 00:58:44.760
It's squeeze Forest. I'm all into
it. We've got Alex pronouns he him

908
00:58:44.800 --> 00:58:47.239
from Michigan, wants to talk about
the start of the universe. Alex,

909
00:58:47.280 --> 00:58:50.840
you're on talk Heathan, how are
you doing today? Hey, I'm doing

910
00:58:50.920 --> 00:58:53.119
great, awesome. So what so
what I've got here on the call screen

911
00:58:53.440 --> 00:58:55.679
is a little bit confusing to me, and I want to make sure I'm

912
00:58:55.760 --> 00:58:59.320
understanding it right, So we please
tell me a little bit about what you're

913
00:58:59.320 --> 00:59:02.599
calling about. This is a thing
I've been thinking about the past few weeks,

914
00:59:02.679 --> 00:59:07.480
and it's always difficult to explain.
But if everything is cause and effect.

915
00:59:07.679 --> 00:59:13.679
If everything is affected by some other
cause, there really is only one

916
00:59:13.880 --> 00:59:16.480
cause, being whatever start of the
universe. This is right. So the

917
00:59:16.599 --> 00:59:22.440
question really is do we have free
will? Where's everything just a reaction to

918
00:59:22.519 --> 00:59:27.280
the thing that happened before it.
This is an ongoing debate with all sorts

919
00:59:27.280 --> 00:59:31.239
of people, and I'm definitely in
the camp that we have a lot less

920
00:59:31.239 --> 00:59:36.519
free will than we think we do. And that's simply because you can trace

921
00:59:36.599 --> 00:59:38.559
any action. You know, whatever
I do in any moment, you can

922
00:59:38.599 --> 00:59:42.559
trace it back to what neurons we're
firing at that moment to cause that.

923
00:59:42.760 --> 00:59:45.840
Okay, well, what were my
blood sugar levels like for the past hour

924
00:59:45.920 --> 00:59:47.880
that would have kind of brought that? What kind of mood have I been

925
00:59:47.920 --> 00:59:52.039
in for the past six hours that
brought me up to that kind of decision?

926
00:59:52.280 --> 00:59:54.239
What has my week been like I've
been really stressed at work or something

927
00:59:54.280 --> 00:59:58.119
like that. How has the last
five years of my life gone? What

928
00:59:58.199 --> 01:00:00.639
kind of mindset am I in right
now? Was my emotional intellectual journey going

929
01:00:00.679 --> 01:00:04.519
to be? Like? How was
I raised as a child, what principles

930
01:00:04.559 --> 01:00:07.400
were I taught? How were my
parents raised? What culture did we come

931
01:00:07.440 --> 01:00:10.440
from? Five thousand years ago that
led to the kind of ideals that we

932
01:00:10.480 --> 01:00:14.800
have today, all the way back
to the evolution of Homo erectus, And

933
01:00:14.880 --> 01:00:17.599
I like, what what stone tool
was made that made me make this decision

934
01:00:17.639 --> 01:00:22.440
to day? You know? So
like in terms of that, I'm definitely

935
01:00:22.480 --> 01:00:27.719
on the significantly reduced free will camp. I've yet to really sit down and

936
01:00:27.760 --> 01:00:30.960
really hash out whether I'm a full
on proponent of like zero free will whatsoever.

937
01:00:31.239 --> 01:00:36.360
However, i will say that people
that I respect intellectually and are way

938
01:00:36.360 --> 01:00:38.159
smarter than I'll ever be, are
on both sides of the aisle on this

939
01:00:38.239 --> 01:00:42.000
issue, and I've heard them both
speak about it so like it's it's a

940
01:00:42.000 --> 01:00:44.800
good question. I don't have a
great answer for you, but it's a

941
01:00:44.840 --> 01:00:46.960
good question and people should think about
it. I also have a bad answer.

942
01:00:49.239 --> 01:00:52.400
I've been thinking about this actually a
good amount recently. Have you read

943
01:00:52.480 --> 01:00:55.559
Victor Frankel and Menser tre Meaning or
familiar with him at all? No?

944
01:00:55.679 --> 01:01:01.159
Not at all. So he was
a Holocaust survivor who started he was a

945
01:01:01.199 --> 01:01:06.400
psychologist, neurologist, philosopher, And
I'm not just complaining those two things.

946
01:01:06.440 --> 01:01:10.480
He's actually both. So he was
talking about the idea of free will being

947
01:01:10.519 --> 01:01:15.519
fundamentally not a very useful one because
we feel like we have it, we

948
01:01:15.599 --> 01:01:17.840
are affected by all of those things
that fres just mentioned. But what he

949
01:01:17.960 --> 01:01:24.679
points out was that in his experience
surviving Nazi death camps, you can argue

950
01:01:25.159 --> 01:01:30.559
against free will as Freud did,
saying that if you were to starve people

951
01:01:30.559 --> 01:01:34.679
and mass then they would all behave
the same way. What Victor Frankel points

952
01:01:34.679 --> 01:01:37.239
out is that that is not true. That everything that you are becomes more

953
01:01:37.239 --> 01:01:43.920
exaggerated in those situations. And so
maybe you're going to see honorable people behave

954
01:01:43.960 --> 01:01:47.239
honorably in extreme situations than they were
predestined to do that, or there was

955
01:01:47.280 --> 01:01:52.480
a they didn't have the free will
to choose. Maybe you'll see people be

956
01:01:52.519 --> 01:01:55.760
horrible and evil. But ultimately,
you don't know how any given person will

957
01:01:55.800 --> 01:02:00.000
respond to stimulus, no matter how
much information you have. So the way

958
01:02:00.039 --> 01:02:02.239
that I look at the question of
free will, and this is probably a

959
01:02:02.360 --> 01:02:07.840
terribly unsatisfying answer, is that I
feel like I have it, So that's

960
01:02:07.880 --> 01:02:10.920
all I can that's all I can
really work with, because ultimately I don't

961
01:02:10.920 --> 01:02:15.480
think we can answer that question,
and I find more value and philosophy here

962
01:02:15.719 --> 01:02:20.679
for myself. Oh my gosh,
I need to stop hitting on microphone than

963
01:02:20.800 --> 01:02:25.519
I do in maybe you strict science
and what's provable, because here nothing really

964
01:02:25.639 --> 01:02:29.159
is. Yeah, I like that
I'm kind of on the same vein where

965
01:02:29.239 --> 01:02:32.320
like I know that the decisions that
I make and the way that I navigate

966
01:02:32.360 --> 01:02:37.320
my way through my life is completely
determined by like the experiences that I have,

967
01:02:37.519 --> 01:02:39.320
like the tools of my tool belt. What experiences have I had,

968
01:02:39.360 --> 01:02:44.679
What philosophies and ideologies have I been
exposed to? What things have I studied

969
01:02:44.800 --> 01:02:49.119
in order to give me the arsenal
that I need to attack the world around

970
01:02:49.159 --> 01:02:52.639
me literally to deal with the problems
that I'm exposed to every day. And

971
01:02:52.719 --> 01:02:55.320
the more experiences that I have and
the more that I learn, and the

972
01:02:55.320 --> 01:02:59.239
more that I'm exposed to new ideas, and the more that I debate and

973
01:02:59.280 --> 01:03:00.880
talk and think, the more tools
I have in my tool belt. In

974
01:03:00.920 --> 01:03:05.280
that way, and so like I
can kind of reason my way into a

975
01:03:05.320 --> 01:03:07.400
free will argument there where it's like, yeah, I'm making the choice to

976
01:03:07.480 --> 01:03:10.400
learn the thing to allow me to
make better choices. And that's still you

977
01:03:10.400 --> 01:03:14.360
still have the deterministic side of that
that I'm only able to make the choices

978
01:03:14.360 --> 01:03:15.519
that I've been exposed to, but
also I'm taking control of that. But

979
01:03:15.559 --> 01:03:19.440
then a determinus would also come along
and say, yeah, but like what

980
01:03:19.719 --> 01:03:22.800
happened to you to learn that to
then know to make that kind of decision

981
01:03:22.840 --> 01:03:25.280
to now give you the so called
choices that you're making. So like,

982
01:03:25.480 --> 01:03:29.119
it's it's one of those things where
like, um, you kind of get

983
01:03:29.119 --> 01:03:31.480
stuck in a logic loop. Who
bullied you in third grain? What do

984
01:03:31.559 --> 01:03:35.800
they smell like? And are you
responding to the smell in this situation that

985
01:03:36.280 --> 01:03:39.880
you chose tapioca putting today exactly?
You know, it's so specific. So

986
01:03:39.960 --> 01:03:43.480
yeah, this is this is something, as I said at the beginning,

987
01:03:43.559 --> 01:03:45.679
like there are way smarter people than
I will ever be on both sides of

988
01:03:45.679 --> 01:03:49.719
this issue. I disagree I'm the
smartest person, but I still don't know

989
01:03:50.119 --> 01:03:52.559
what it's. Yeah, so like, yeah, I appreciate you bringing it

990
01:03:52.639 --> 01:03:54.559
up, but I don't think either
one of us are going to be able

991
01:03:54.559 --> 01:03:58.400
to give you a satisfactory answer at
this moment. That's your answer right now?

992
01:03:58.679 --> 01:04:00.960
Yeah, what are you feeling?
I don't think any of us have

993
01:04:01.039 --> 01:04:05.679
free will, But I also think
that on a universal, on such a

994
01:04:05.880 --> 01:04:12.480
vast scale, that things actually happen, giant rock smashing into each other,

995
01:04:12.559 --> 01:04:18.000
and Son's exploding that our concept of
even doing anything, it like, what

996
01:04:18.079 --> 01:04:24.559
are the like we make choices that
in millions of years will be irrelevant upon

997
01:04:24.639 --> 01:04:28.840
her like like the most irrelevant you
can get. So really it doesn't matter.

998
01:04:29.360 --> 01:04:31.280
It doesn't matter if we don't have
free will, because you know,

999
01:04:31.280 --> 01:04:35.239
none cares. Yeah, I mean, you're you're getting into my territory now

1000
01:04:35.280 --> 01:04:39.559
because I'm a big fan of cosmic
nihilism and like, yeah, at the

1001
01:04:39.679 --> 01:04:42.800
end of the day, you know, if the entire Earth was destroyed this

1002
01:04:42.840 --> 01:04:45.599
moment, nothing changes on Andromeda,
nobody cares, you know what I mean.

1003
01:04:45.679 --> 01:04:47.280
So like it's it's, yeah,
I'm the same way in that van,

1004
01:04:47.320 --> 01:04:50.840
I just take a different like moral
arm. On the end of that,

1005
01:04:51.400 --> 01:04:55.159
I encourage you to check out.
There's a really cool neurobiologists to I

1006
01:04:55.159 --> 01:04:57.280
shout out all the times. He's
one of my favorite authors. He's got

1007
01:04:57.320 --> 01:05:00.639
named Robert Sapolski. He's a neurobiologist
at Stanford and he doesn't have any social

1008
01:05:00.639 --> 01:05:04.559
media presence, but he writes some
great books and he's done a ton of

1009
01:05:04.599 --> 01:05:09.800
cool interviews. And I saw him
on a podcast a little while ago with

1010
01:05:09.840 --> 01:05:13.480
another Standford neuroscientists, and he was
talking about this exact thing, and he

1011
01:05:13.519 --> 01:05:16.039
said, when you really really really
take this to its extreme, because he

1012
01:05:16.039 --> 01:05:18.559
believes we have no free Willy,
he's on that camp, and he was

1013
01:05:18.599 --> 01:05:21.320
saying, you know, when you
really really take this to his logical extreme

1014
01:05:21.360 --> 01:05:25.239
and you really think about it from
a neuroscience perspective, you come to the

1015
01:05:25.239 --> 01:05:30.679
conclusion that really you can never fault
anybody or praise anybody for anything. Humans

1016
01:05:30.719 --> 01:05:34.800
are completely blameless in everything forever.
And like he's like, when I really

1017
01:05:34.880 --> 01:05:39.320
meditate and try to focus on it, I can have a few seconds where

1018
01:05:39.360 --> 01:05:44.199
I really just am completely at peace
with everybody forever. And that's wild.

1019
01:05:44.360 --> 01:05:45.880
But like even he says, he
can't know, you can't keep that up,

1020
01:05:45.920 --> 01:05:48.280
even though he's a proponent of this. So it's an interesting thing to

1021
01:05:48.280 --> 01:05:50.440
think about. Man, it's really
really cool. Anyway, if you had

1022
01:05:50.440 --> 01:05:53.320
anything else you wanted to add,
I'd love to hear it. Otherwise we're

1023
01:05:53.320 --> 01:05:55.400
gonna jump on the nice calls me
en try to sweez somebody else in.

1024
01:05:56.400 --> 01:06:00.039
I think I think he's already he's
done with us. Well, thank you

1025
01:06:00.159 --> 01:06:01.480
for calling in, Alex. It
was a really thought provoking conversation. We

1026
01:06:01.519 --> 01:06:04.480
hope people out there play with this
and and and have some fun with it.

1027
01:06:04.719 --> 01:06:08.199
Um, we've got to oh,
hey, look at that the super

1028
01:06:08.280 --> 01:06:13.440
chats. Yeah, you know what
I just poked for as the thing reminded

1029
01:06:13.480 --> 01:06:15.920
me to do super chats. And
you know what's funny, Greg, Literally

1030
01:06:15.960 --> 01:06:18.239
the last two calls, I've had
the super chats open and I'm like,

1031
01:06:18.280 --> 01:06:21.800
I gotta remember to do this,
and then I get so distracted by hanging

1032
01:06:21.840 --> 01:06:26.760
up the call that I don't I
am. He could have blamed me job.

1033
01:06:26.880 --> 01:06:30.000
I do this for a living and
I have no idea what I'm doing.

1034
01:06:30.760 --> 01:06:31.960
M Yeah. We got all sorts
of super chats, all sorts of

1035
01:06:31.960 --> 01:06:35.039
people writing in things that they want
us to say, and I'm ignoring them.

1036
01:06:35.039 --> 01:06:38.760
We got James Call, who's been
a Channel member for a year,

1037
01:06:38.840 --> 01:06:42.119
sending in ten dollars. Nice to
meet is Sophia, thank you kind of

1038
01:06:42.360 --> 01:06:45.320
writing that's so sweet. If crabs
are prevalent, um, if crabs are

1039
01:06:45.360 --> 01:06:49.199
so prevalent and eating shellfish as a
sin, does the devil evolve crabs?

1040
01:06:49.440 --> 01:06:54.039
That's the only explanation that's the only
explanation. One more reason to love him.

1041
01:06:54.239 --> 01:06:58.360
Um we got Joema nineteen seventy seven. A. A. I'm sure

1042
01:06:58.400 --> 01:07:02.440
there's some context there, but Joma
numbers are sent in four dollars and ninety

1043
01:07:02.519 --> 01:07:05.400
nine cents to say, Happy Sunday. Keep on doing the good work of

1044
01:07:05.400 --> 01:07:09.519
influencing the world to be more educated
and be better critical thinkers. Thank you

1045
01:07:09.599 --> 01:07:14.159
very much. We appreciate you sending
that in. Mark Fern sent in five

1046
01:07:14.199 --> 01:07:17.039
and I've said that wrong. Sent
in five dollars to say Forest Henry,

1047
01:07:17.119 --> 01:07:21.440
four years old wants to know why
eyeballs are squishy. So the long and

1048
01:07:21.480 --> 01:07:25.719
short of it is that your eyeball
is full of goo. It's full of

1049
01:07:25.719 --> 01:07:30.519
fluid. And that's because the very
back of the inside of your eyeball has

1050
01:07:30.880 --> 01:07:34.000
what we call photosensitive cells. It's
this tissue called your retina, and that's

1051
01:07:34.000 --> 01:07:38.400
how you're able to see things.
These This tissue back here absorbs the light

1052
01:07:38.519 --> 01:07:41.559
and so if your eyeballs were hard, then the light wouldn't be able to

1053
01:07:41.599 --> 01:07:44.679
pass through there. Effectively, they
need to be able to squish and move

1054
01:07:44.719 --> 01:07:46.159
around a little bit to make sure
light gets through there. And you have

1055
01:07:46.239 --> 01:07:49.880
all sorts of really cool parts in
the front of your eye, the colorful

1056
01:07:49.880 --> 01:07:53.960
part that you can see. Um, this is called your iris. And

1057
01:07:54.639 --> 01:07:58.679
you've got this like lensy thing in
the front called a coronea, and you

1058
01:07:58.719 --> 01:08:01.079
have like a little magnifying last right
behind that that's actually just called lens.

1059
01:08:01.119 --> 01:08:05.039
And you have these little muscles that
squeeze and stretch that to move the light

1060
01:08:05.079 --> 01:08:09.280
around. But the light has to
pass through the goo to get to the

1061
01:08:09.320 --> 01:08:12.400
part of your eye that can actually
see stuff. So that's why your eyeballs

1062
01:08:12.400 --> 01:08:15.159
are squishy. It's just to make
sure that you can see things effectively through

1063
01:08:15.279 --> 01:08:17.840
the gou. You always have to
go through the gou. Hope, I'm

1064
01:08:17.840 --> 01:08:20.720
not the only person who just wants
to poke my eyeballs. Now I want

1065
01:08:20.720 --> 01:08:24.840
to do it. There's a spy. It's exciting, yo. I got

1066
01:08:24.920 --> 01:08:29.079
lasic a little while. Look,
I've heard that's like quite a freaking cool

1067
01:08:29.199 --> 01:08:31.359
dude, because they slice your cornea
off a little bit, and then they

1068
01:08:31.560 --> 01:08:35.199
do some laser they reshape the structure
of the front of your eye. They

1069
01:08:35.279 --> 01:08:39.199
basically carve your eyeball into a contact. Well, now we know Flores's idea

1070
01:08:39.239 --> 01:08:42.319
of a good time, Yo,
I'm not even joking. If I could

1071
01:08:42.359 --> 01:08:45.239
do it again, I would.
It was a ton of fun because they

1072
01:08:45.279 --> 01:08:47.960
flop your cornea off and the whole
world's all grainy and it looks all crazy

1073
01:08:48.000 --> 01:08:51.720
as you did different. It's ah, it was so much fun bro learning

1074
01:08:51.760 --> 01:08:56.439
about the eyeball as it's being dissected. There's a lot of diversity in the

1075
01:08:56.439 --> 01:09:00.439
atheist community. Some people like having
their eyebrows but gauged out for funds.

1076
01:09:00.479 --> 01:09:02.760
Some people are normal like me,
so you know that's you know what.

1077
01:09:02.840 --> 01:09:05.880
I would make a comment, but
honestly, biologists, we are not normal.

1078
01:09:06.479 --> 01:09:12.439
Not a million stories about that.
Um. We've got eleven dollars from

1079
01:09:12.560 --> 01:09:16.600
Zachary Martin. Oh, I'm gonna
say this, so weird by forest ya,

1080
01:09:16.920 --> 01:09:21.680
Hummy, I heard you being awesome
and smart, and I gotta say

1081
01:09:21.760 --> 01:09:28.279
that's something worth noticing. You maybe
a uney hume, but you got to

1082
01:09:28.439 --> 01:09:36.520
brains. It's atheist crumping time,
well crumping, Zachary Martin. I'm married,

1083
01:09:36.800 --> 01:09:41.239
but I appreciate the offer. That's
very kind of you. Um,

1084
01:09:41.960 --> 01:09:46.000
that's uh. They we got two
dollars from Emory King. Dre was a

1085
01:09:46.079 --> 01:09:49.119
receptive caller. I hope he calls
back I hope so as well. Um.

1086
01:09:49.840 --> 01:09:56.840
Joshua Joshua Billinghurst aka Flynn sends in
three dollars to say thanks guys,

1087
01:09:56.920 --> 01:10:01.520
Thank you Flynn. Um, I
miss so many super chats y'all, dm

1088
01:10:01.680 --> 01:10:06.880
MX and two twenty five dollars from
greetings from Mexico. I love Forest,

1089
01:10:06.920 --> 01:10:13.279
smile. I never stopped doing it. Um uh dre W sends in two

1090
01:10:13.319 --> 01:10:16.960
dollars. Um, Zachary Martin's what
what is this? What? What?

1091
01:10:17.039 --> 01:10:21.239
Oh? Zachary Martin's is a Warhammer
reference? Someone just sent me and let

1092
01:10:21.239 --> 01:10:24.279
me know what was going. Okay, So I'm not cool enough to play

1093
01:10:24.279 --> 01:10:27.159
Warhammer. Yeah, I don't know
what it is. I've played Age of

1094
01:10:27.880 --> 01:10:31.399
Siegmar on the Oculus and it was
a nightmare of a game, awful,

1095
01:10:31.439 --> 01:10:34.279
and I've never been into it since. I did feel my brother's Warhammer figures

1096
01:10:34.279 --> 01:10:35.840
when I was like hey, and
I got mad at him. So that's

1097
01:10:35.880 --> 01:10:40.359
as much as I know about Hammer. You know that people are emotionally attached

1098
01:10:40.439 --> 01:10:44.000
enough to it to warm them by
taking their figurines away. I know when

1099
01:10:44.000 --> 01:10:47.840
you're saying we're good people, I'm
like, it's us evil atheists, eaten

1100
01:10:47.920 --> 01:10:53.920
babies and stealing warhammer figurines. Okay, so we got a bunch of other

1101
01:10:53.920 --> 01:11:00.560
people here. Um, and I
think I'm gonna go with Steve and pronounce

1102
01:11:00.800 --> 01:11:03.039
him in Arizona lives in a very
conservative area and wants some advice. Stephen,

1103
01:11:03.079 --> 01:11:05.159
You're on Talk Evan. How are
you doing today? Um? Well,

1104
01:11:05.199 --> 01:11:08.800
how are you? Awesome? Man? Really really great. So it

1105
01:11:08.840 --> 01:11:11.399
says you're you live in a conservative
area and you're looking for advice. What

1106
01:11:11.520 --> 01:11:14.920
exactly are you looking for? Well, I live in a suit wall say,

1107
01:11:14.960 --> 01:11:17.960
a pseudo pseudo conservative area. I've
you know, as an atheist,

1108
01:11:18.000 --> 01:11:23.279
you're always surrounded. And I actually
live in a very Mormon neighborhood, and

1109
01:11:23.319 --> 01:11:26.439
my Mormon neighbors are lovely. But
you know, when I go to work,

1110
01:11:26.760 --> 01:11:31.399
it's a very ethnically and religiously diverse
community, including atheists. I've actually

1111
01:11:31.399 --> 01:11:36.159
performed atheist weddings, and everywhere that
I've ever lived, there's been a lot

1112
01:11:36.199 --> 01:11:42.359
of diversity. And I'm about to
move to a crazy place that is where

1113
01:11:42.399 --> 01:11:46.479
my partner wants to live. I'm
moving from Arizona to Pennsylvania, And in

1114
01:11:47.000 --> 01:11:51.920
advance of going there, I looked
up some demographics and some politics, and

1115
01:11:53.000 --> 01:11:57.960
it's like ninety eight percent Republican,
ninety nine percent white, which means any

1116
01:11:57.960 --> 01:12:01.039
person of color is probably the only
one in town who they are. I

1117
01:12:01.520 --> 01:12:08.720
am LGBT. My partner is straight
and emerging out of the Catholic experience.

1118
01:12:09.079 --> 01:12:12.680
But we're getting married, so I'm
explaining to him that it's going to make

1119
01:12:12.760 --> 01:12:18.079
him LGBT by association by marrying me. So I'm wondering what it's going to

1120
01:12:18.159 --> 01:12:25.840
be like to go into Forest.
I know that you're from Oklahoma, or

1121
01:12:25.880 --> 01:12:28.520
at least you live there, Sophia. You're lovely. I don't know where

1122
01:12:28.520 --> 01:12:34.399
you're from, but it's but it's
this. I've never lived somewhere this monolithic,

1123
01:12:34.720 --> 01:12:41.600
this conservative, this much of a
place where I know I'm going to

1124
01:12:41.680 --> 01:12:45.319
be very alone. And that isn't
to say that I won't find other atheists

1125
01:12:45.359 --> 01:12:48.239
eventually and so forth. I'm sure
that's going to happen, but going into

1126
01:12:48.319 --> 01:12:53.880
it, I feel like I have
to be very quiet and somewhat defensive.

1127
01:12:54.079 --> 01:12:57.720
And I just wondered if you could
give me some advice if I'm approaching this

1128
01:12:57.840 --> 01:13:01.720
the right way or what I can
expect, because this is this is going

1129
01:13:01.760 --> 01:13:06.239
to be bananas. I've never lived
somewhere this rural. I've never lived somewhere

1130
01:13:06.319 --> 01:13:11.800
this conservative um or this white for
that matter, which is going to be

1131
01:13:12.399 --> 01:13:15.000
hard to get used to, which
means sounds strange, does but I'm used

1132
01:13:15.000 --> 01:13:18.279
to people of color being around me, and there won't be. We're all

1133
01:13:18.279 --> 01:13:21.159
going to be the same color.
I mean, I actually in my new

1134
01:13:21.159 --> 01:13:25.159
property, we're going to have something. They call it a crick, which

1135
01:13:25.199 --> 01:13:29.800
I an what they were actually saying, So you know, it's it's that

1136
01:13:29.920 --> 01:13:32.680
kind of a thing. And it's
not that I'm not still excited to go

1137
01:13:32.920 --> 01:13:36.039
and this new chapter of my life
and it's all going to be wonderful,

1138
01:13:36.399 --> 01:13:40.560
but there's this other part of it
where I'm like, what the hell am

1139
01:13:40.600 --> 01:13:44.359
I doing? So I wonder what
your thoughts were and if you had any

1140
01:13:44.359 --> 01:13:50.520
advice for me? By gun,
I mean honestly, all right, well

1141
01:13:50.520 --> 01:13:55.920
we're gonna side step for I live
in Oklahoma. I live in Tulsa,

1142
01:13:55.960 --> 01:14:00.119
Oklahoma. There are and always have
been double digit churches within walking distance of

1143
01:14:00.199 --> 01:14:04.479
my house. Um, you know
there there we have very tiny racial diversity

1144
01:14:04.520 --> 01:14:08.760
in our town. Um. I
grew up in a town just outside of

1145
01:14:08.800 --> 01:14:11.760
Tulsa called Broken Arrow. My po
box is still out there. Um,

1146
01:14:11.880 --> 01:14:14.960
and uh, you're like, yeah
no, that was actually started as a

1147
01:14:15.000 --> 01:14:17.079
white flight town. Um, and
so like, I totally get your coming

1148
01:14:17.119 --> 01:14:20.479
from dude, I understand it,
and it does absolutely suck. There's different

1149
01:14:20.520 --> 01:14:24.199
camps, there's different lines of thinking. Um, you know, my wife

1150
01:14:24.479 --> 01:14:27.800
is very cautious to make sure we
don't have anything in our yard that we

1151
01:14:27.840 --> 01:14:30.720
don't put bumper stickers in the car
or anything like that, because people will

1152
01:14:30.760 --> 01:14:32.680
follow us home where we're from if
they don't like what you have to say,

1153
01:14:33.199 --> 01:14:36.640
because they have the majority and they
feel comfortable and empowered in doing so.

1154
01:14:38.000 --> 01:14:40.840
Um, I'm an idiot and I
love to go out in the street

1155
01:14:40.840 --> 01:14:44.760
corner with signs and scream at people
and yell from a megaphone about my ideas

1156
01:14:44.800 --> 01:14:47.840
and so like literally and so yeah, no, I I I'm all about

1157
01:14:47.880 --> 01:14:50.880
the getting the death threats. I
don't mind one bit. So it's it

1158
01:14:51.039 --> 01:14:57.039
really is just how much does the
community matter to you? Do you want

1159
01:14:57.079 --> 01:15:00.760
to fit in? Do you want
to have a community exp arians or do

1160
01:15:00.800 --> 01:15:04.399
you not mind being a homebody by
way of ostracization, because that it can

1161
01:15:04.439 --> 01:15:10.680
happen in any case. I would
always just recommend if I had my way

1162
01:15:10.720 --> 01:15:13.439
in the world, and I understand
this is difficult and dangerous and scary,

1163
01:15:13.479 --> 01:15:15.199
and so nope, shame if you
don't do this. I would always say,

1164
01:15:15.399 --> 01:15:19.680
be aggressively and unapologetically yourself all the
time, and if people don't like

1165
01:15:19.760 --> 01:15:25.359
it, they can fuck right off. And if that will get you in

1166
01:15:25.439 --> 01:15:29.520
trouble, it absolutely will. But
I would rather be that way myself than

1167
01:15:29.560 --> 01:15:32.079
any whales. And I say that
with all the confidence of a cis gender,

1168
01:15:32.199 --> 01:15:40.439
mostly heterosexual white man. I think
that, yeah, I mean as

1169
01:15:40.479 --> 01:15:43.760
a fellow white person, there's there
is some level of like, yeah,

1170
01:15:43.920 --> 01:15:46.039
I mean speaking from that perspective as
well. I was way more okay with

1171
01:15:46.119 --> 01:15:48.960
idea of death threats until I had
a kid, and I'm like, I'm

1172
01:15:49.800 --> 01:15:53.520
it's a little more risky. But
I think the first thing that I would

1173
01:15:53.520 --> 01:15:56.760
really want to say is you don't
owe anybody anything. You do not owe

1174
01:15:56.840 --> 01:16:01.479
them being the token like LGBTQ per
person. You don't owe them listening to

1175
01:16:01.520 --> 01:16:05.239
a bullshit idea if they're going to
be offensive and disgusting, like just to

1176
01:16:05.439 --> 01:16:09.399
reaffirm that, because there's going to
be people who try to make you feel

1177
01:16:09.399 --> 01:16:13.800
like you do the school of just
asking questions or you can't even talk anymore.

1178
01:16:14.279 --> 01:16:15.680
Throw that shit out. You don't
know that, you don't need to

1179
01:16:15.680 --> 01:16:18.359
spend the time on that. And
it's totally okay to be like, hey,

1180
01:16:18.640 --> 01:16:23.600
I'm just not interested in having this
conversation with you. It's going to

1181
01:16:23.640 --> 01:16:28.039
offend people, but just know your
boundaries and also know that they can change

1182
01:16:28.119 --> 01:16:30.600
day to day. That it's okay
if you're like, yeah, today we

1183
01:16:30.600 --> 01:16:33.119
can have this conversation, and then
other days just be like, I can't

1184
01:16:33.119 --> 01:16:38.359
take that load on, you know. And so I currently this is not

1185
01:16:38.479 --> 01:16:41.880
exactly the same, but I mean
from Seattle to Texas and then became an

1186
01:16:41.880 --> 01:16:46.560
atheist in Texas. So good planning
there, right, And I now go

1187
01:16:46.680 --> 01:16:51.000
to a Christian university, And so
I didn't tell people for a while that

1188
01:16:51.119 --> 01:16:56.800
I was an atheist. I already
have enough that sort of makes me stick

1189
01:16:56.840 --> 01:17:00.039
out a little there until eventually I
couched it. In the sense that I

1190
01:17:00.119 --> 01:17:04.800
am nervous about how people will respond
to this. There are things that if

1191
01:17:04.800 --> 01:17:08.319
I have an obligation, I'll say, Hey, I have an obligation.

1192
01:17:08.399 --> 01:17:12.560
I won't tell them it's for the
atheist community, but I will say stuff

1193
01:17:12.600 --> 01:17:15.760
like, you know, here are
things I've heard from Christians before. Here

1194
01:17:15.800 --> 01:17:18.720
are things I've heard said or had
said to me or that I find really

1195
01:17:18.720 --> 01:17:23.680
offensive. I'll open it that way
instead of just doing it, We're gonna

1196
01:17:23.680 --> 01:17:26.119
have a free wheeling conversation. I'll
actually be like, yeah, here's my

1197
01:17:26.159 --> 01:17:30.520
emotional state here, and it's not
from nothing, Like there are reasons that

1198
01:17:30.680 --> 01:17:32.560
I think it's valid for me to
be nervous and for me to be to

1199
01:17:32.720 --> 01:17:36.479
feel defensive. Yeah, I mean
that doesn't really help with a lot of

1200
01:17:36.520 --> 01:17:41.319
what's you're going to encounter so many
microaggressions. The other thing I think you're

1201
01:17:41.359 --> 01:17:44.039
probably going to encounter that I just
put to you to like, maybe think

1202
01:17:44.079 --> 01:17:47.119
about how you're going to handle this. If you are part of the majority,

1203
01:17:47.359 --> 01:17:49.479
then they're going to be people who
say shit to you that you don't

1204
01:17:49.479 --> 01:17:54.880
want to co sign right, that
are going to say racist shit or whatever

1205
01:17:54.920 --> 01:17:58.640
it might be. And I think
just putting some thought into how you're going

1206
01:17:58.680 --> 01:18:00.960
to you know, shut that down
or move on or for your safety,

1207
01:18:01.000 --> 01:18:03.279
I would never say, like,
you know, do something that would make

1208
01:18:03.279 --> 01:18:06.560
you feel unsafe, but um,
you know, I get a lot of

1209
01:18:06.600 --> 01:18:11.439
mileage about saying I don't agree with
that and just you know, it's sort

1210
01:18:11.479 --> 01:18:13.880
of a moderate tone and you're not
making an argument, but you're just like,

1211
01:18:13.920 --> 01:18:17.359
I'm not gonna gonna cosign that one. Um. Varying levels of intensity

1212
01:18:17.399 --> 01:18:20.680
for sure, But yeah, I
don't think that there's one size fits all

1213
01:18:20.720 --> 01:18:25.840
advice. But I think protect yourself
and know that you deserve that. I

1214
01:18:25.880 --> 01:18:28.399
think that's where I would start.
Yeah, I would. I would just

1215
01:18:28.479 --> 01:18:31.520
parrot um what Sofia just said,
because I am also an antagonistic little shit

1216
01:18:31.680 --> 01:18:35.640
and when when I am, you
know, in Oklahoma, lots and lots

1217
01:18:35.640 --> 01:18:39.960
of people around me like to fly
the loser flag, like the Confederate flag,

1218
01:18:40.439 --> 01:18:43.039
and they, you know, there's
this whole heritage, not hate,

1219
01:18:43.079 --> 01:18:45.560
a heritage of being a fucking loser, right, cool, whatever, But

1220
01:18:45.600 --> 01:18:48.520
like they they this is a very
popular symbol, and because they live in

1221
01:18:48.560 --> 01:18:54.319
this majority, they rarely, if
ever experienced any pushback on that. And

1222
01:18:54.359 --> 01:18:58.439
so for you to just kind of
be even just a gentle little bit as

1223
01:18:58.479 --> 01:19:01.159
like, oh that sucks. Wow. I like the winning side personally.

1224
01:19:01.199 --> 01:19:03.119
I like the side that didn't want
the slaves, you know what I mean,

1225
01:19:03.119 --> 01:19:06.840
That's just that's just me. I
actually like America, So I don't

1226
01:19:06.880 --> 01:19:11.439
root for the traders that that you
know, committed terrorist attacks on American soldiers.

1227
01:19:11.439 --> 01:19:13.560
You know, I don't like that. I'm kind of patriotic that way.

1228
01:19:13.600 --> 01:19:17.159
You know that that little bit of
pushback it's often quite jarring, um

1229
01:19:17.199 --> 01:19:20.000
for these people because they've never,
ever, ever had to deal with that

1230
01:19:20.079 --> 01:19:25.239
before. And so if you are
like us, and you are are instigative

1231
01:19:25.359 --> 01:19:29.800
and provocative and enjoy causing some trouble, these are great ways to do it

1232
01:19:29.800 --> 01:19:31.159
with a smile on your face.
UM. Might not be for everybody,

1233
01:19:31.159 --> 01:19:35.079
though, Yeah. I've always been
I mean, my partner being Catholic and

1234
01:19:35.119 --> 01:19:40.640
everything. I've actually been very impressed
with his because I haven't been pushing him

1235
01:19:41.119 --> 01:19:46.199
and he's sort of he's deconverting and
he's sort of generalized Christian right now after

1236
01:19:46.279 --> 01:19:50.399
being very devout. But his parents
are like SOX news watchers. So we

1237
01:19:50.479 --> 01:19:56.600
have conversations about what all of this
is going to mean. Um. But

1238
01:19:56.720 --> 01:19:59.479
and you know, and he did
say to me very recently, you know,

1239
01:19:59.479 --> 01:20:01.439
he's like, it's very white here, Like, well, okay,

1240
01:20:01.560 --> 01:20:04.319
I don't know what that means.
And he's like, well, there's like

1241
01:20:04.600 --> 01:20:08.640
one person of color and they live
three doors down. And I know they're

1242
01:20:08.640 --> 01:20:12.359
the only one or the only family, and it's like, holy crap.

1243
01:20:12.439 --> 01:20:15.520
You know, I've never I've lived
I've lived in cities and I've lived in

1244
01:20:15.840 --> 01:20:19.600
other places, you know. But
I also I console myself because of the

1245
01:20:19.640 --> 01:20:24.399
region. It's Pennsylvania Dutch Country,
so there's going to be a lot of

1246
01:20:24.399 --> 01:20:29.640
handmade furniture and stuff like that.
And yes, but but you know,

1247
01:20:29.680 --> 01:20:34.239
you can kind of the easy thing
about that because Pennsylvania Dutch or or some

1248
01:20:34.279 --> 01:20:38.479
of the other I don't know how
to refer to them as a group,

1249
01:20:38.479 --> 01:20:40.239
but you all know what I mean. They don't know how to dress,

1250
01:20:40.319 --> 01:20:45.119
and they were you know, bland
colors and are very into woodworking and farming.

1251
01:20:45.399 --> 01:20:48.239
But they you can kind of look
at them as being other and separate

1252
01:20:48.680 --> 01:20:53.520
that. It doesn't feel like they're
is influential and they're not. But it's

1253
01:20:53.720 --> 01:20:56.399
you know, when you walk away
from that and you see people who are

1254
01:20:56.560 --> 01:21:00.319
are dressed more normally, you start
to feel a little safer and to realize

1255
01:21:00.319 --> 01:21:03.920
I'm not necessarily going to be I
think is what I'm I'm wrestling with,

1256
01:21:04.600 --> 01:21:08.600
you know, and I hear everything
you're saying. It is it is tricky.

1257
01:21:08.720 --> 01:21:14.600
I will have the more militant,
aggressive conversation. And I like to

1258
01:21:15.119 --> 01:21:17.279
just be myself. So if I'm
going to wear something that says hi,

1259
01:21:17.479 --> 01:21:20.720
I'm I'm celebrating pride. You know, you can like it or not.

1260
01:21:21.079 --> 01:21:24.600
And you know, and I'm I'm
old. I don't have to put up

1261
01:21:24.600 --> 01:21:27.279
with too much at this point in
my life, or at least that's how

1262
01:21:27.319 --> 01:21:30.680
I feel about it. So it's
it's just navigating it. I've just never

1263
01:21:30.760 --> 01:21:33.520
lived anywhere like this, so I'm
just wondering what it will be like.

1264
01:21:33.600 --> 01:21:38.680
And you guys are from parts of
the country that reflect that better. So

1265
01:21:38.760 --> 01:21:41.479
thank you for your input. I
appreciate it. Any worries and and you

1266
01:21:41.520 --> 01:21:44.880
know, don't don't be I don't
think you are, but like, don't

1267
01:21:44.960 --> 01:21:46.840
let us make you too cynical either. There's there's good people everwhere, And

1268
01:21:46.880 --> 01:21:49.600
like I think people surprise you.
I think the thing I would also put

1269
01:21:49.640 --> 01:21:54.640
out home. I'm sorry, I
don't want to interrupt anybody. You surprised

1270
01:21:54.680 --> 01:21:58.119
me, Yeah, the Mormons here
really surprised me. They protect me as

1271
01:21:58.159 --> 01:22:01.600
an LGBT person, they protect me
as a democrat. They watch my house

1272
01:22:01.600 --> 01:22:04.920
when I go on vacation. You
know, they're they're just they're really nice

1273
01:22:04.920 --> 01:22:09.479
and I'm actually going to miss this
sort of nineteen fifties kind of neighborhood that

1274
01:22:09.520 --> 01:22:13.560
I'm in because of that. So
it's you know, I'm trying to tell

1275
01:22:13.600 --> 01:22:16.039
myself there'll be people like this there, and I'm sorry, Sophia, please

1276
01:22:16.039 --> 01:22:18.640
go ahead. No, absolutely,
I think the thing that I would throw

1277
01:22:18.640 --> 01:22:23.560
out there is that you might end
up becoming this this guardian angel protector type

1278
01:22:23.800 --> 01:22:26.600
for folks who live in that community. If you're wearing a Pride shirt,

1279
01:22:26.680 --> 01:22:29.319
you know, they're always looking.
The number of people who will secretly,

1280
01:22:29.960 --> 01:22:31.159
you know, come up and tell
me things at the school that I go

1281
01:22:31.239 --> 01:22:34.039
to be like, oh, I'm
not religious either. You know, they

1282
01:22:34.079 --> 01:22:39.000
don't want to say it, but
yeah, they will will take the cover

1283
01:22:39.079 --> 01:22:43.399
that you provide, and that's really
amazing too. But remember to take vacations,

1284
01:22:43.439 --> 01:22:45.640
give yourself a break, because that
is insane to stay in that position

1285
01:22:45.680 --> 01:22:49.079
for too long. Oh yeah,
we're already planning, you know, Mediterranean

1286
01:22:49.119 --> 01:22:54.920
cruises and things every so often.
So yeah, there's there's stuff. But

1287
01:22:55.239 --> 01:22:57.359
well, again, thank you very
much. I know we're coming up to

1288
01:22:57.399 --> 01:23:00.199
the end here, so thank you
very much. I appreciate you take my

1289
01:23:00.319 --> 01:23:03.960
call and very lovely. Take care. Well, I don't think we had

1290
01:23:04.000 --> 01:23:13.239
a single seriously negative I know everyone's
so friendly. Worst views of any show

1291
01:23:13.359 --> 01:23:16.479
on this one isn't nothing controversial confrontation. I mean, I'm adorable, so

1292
01:23:16.560 --> 01:23:21.720
I bet it'll be fine. Stephen
working in there somehow. Um, so

1293
01:23:23.359 --> 01:23:27.039
really quick, Just a reminder,
the prompt for this week is what did

1294
01:23:27.039 --> 01:23:30.479
the caller say to make Secular Rarity
look like this? I'm gonna hold it

1295
01:23:30.520 --> 01:23:33.640
there. Reply in the comments and
tune in the beginning of next week's show

1296
01:23:33.800 --> 01:23:39.079
to hear the top three answers.
Um really quickly before we wrap everything up.

1297
01:23:39.119 --> 01:23:42.600
Sofia, where can people find more
stuff about you? Um? They

1298
01:23:42.600 --> 01:23:46.479
can't right now. I'm sorry here. You just have to keep what you

1299
01:23:46.520 --> 01:23:48.800
have to You have to watch this, okay, Well, really quickly.

1300
01:23:48.800 --> 01:23:51.000
Then I ask you a different question. I've been trying to catch a glimpse

1301
01:23:51.079 --> 01:23:54.359
of your forearm tattooed for a minute. I thought it was a cross.

1302
01:23:54.560 --> 01:23:58.199
Is different ones, This is oh
my gosh, oh yes, this is

1303
01:23:58.199 --> 01:24:02.359
the shart of Narsil is the sword
that is reformed for our going and lord

1304
01:24:02.399 --> 01:24:05.279
of the rings um. And then
the other one is a pencil and they're

1305
01:24:05.279 --> 01:24:08.840
done in matching ways. They will
be filled in so they'll be bright and

1306
01:24:08.880 --> 01:24:12.359
colorful. They're brand new. I
was a whimp about it. I was

1307
01:24:12.399 --> 01:24:15.000
told by one of the tattoo artists
that I was being annoying. Um,

1308
01:24:15.479 --> 01:24:18.079
that's confidence building, that's good,
I know. But I'm like, all

1309
01:24:18.159 --> 01:24:21.560
right, well, that's so cool, that's that's great. I just want

1310
01:24:21.560 --> 01:24:25.039
I thought it was a cross.
I'm like, oh my god, God

1311
01:24:26.079 --> 01:24:28.840
sometimes in her past that she's trying
to get over. Now, let's got

1312
01:24:28.960 --> 01:24:30.560
to be hard to live with that. But like, no, that's just

1313
01:24:30.600 --> 01:24:32.279
dope shit. That's awesome. Well, thank you. It is my goal

1314
01:24:32.319 --> 01:24:38.039
to be dope shit. Really quick
recap for anybody who missed it, Please

1315
01:24:38.199 --> 01:24:40.800
like the video and subscribe to the
channel if you want to do those things.

1316
01:24:41.199 --> 01:24:43.119
If you'd like to become a channel
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1317
01:24:43.119 --> 01:24:45.640
the joint button down below. Support
us on Patreon at tiny dot cc slash

1318
01:24:45.680 --> 01:24:49.279
Patreon t H. We have a
channel that houses all the shows, the

1319
01:24:49.279 --> 01:24:54.600
ACA and audio podcast forum that's at
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1320
01:24:54.760 --> 01:24:58.239
You can become a part of the
talk Ethan community and a fan run Facebook

1321
01:24:58.239 --> 01:25:02.680
page at tiny dot cc slash h
b f b t H g um.

1322
01:25:02.720 --> 01:25:05.159
If you would like to continue discussion
having the show, you can join us

1323
01:25:05.159 --> 01:25:10.159
on a c D vious community discord
fan run discord server at tiny dot cc

1324
01:25:10.359 --> 01:25:14.279
slash a c D discord. Also
make sure to check out the newest version

1325
01:25:14.279 --> 01:25:17.359
of the ACA show. The Nonprofits
will air live at three pm Central today

1326
01:25:17.399 --> 01:25:23.039
at tanny dot cc slash y t
n P. Shout out to the crew.

1327
01:25:23.159 --> 01:25:26.800
Put them up there as well,
Thrust. You can't look at that.

1328
01:25:26.800 --> 01:25:31.239
That cat works so hard he's exhausted. And also can we give another

1329
01:25:31.239 --> 01:25:33.960
shout out to the audience. Can
we show them as well? Because they're

1330
01:25:34.039 --> 01:25:38.079
fantastic and I love having them here. Bring the audience up on the screen,

1331
01:25:38.159 --> 01:25:45.840
don't No, they don't want to. Also, because this is talking

1332
01:25:45.960 --> 01:25:48.119
than they do something that we don't
do on l any of the shows,

1333
01:25:48.119 --> 01:25:51.000
and that's love rings. Have you
seen the Love Rings recently? I'm shocked

1334
01:25:51.000 --> 01:25:54.800
by it. Every time it happens, it's it's less weird than it sounds.

1335
01:25:54.840 --> 01:25:59.680
Okay, do this do this?
What is this? Ready? Oh?

1336
01:26:00.439 --> 01:26:02.760
Yeah, it's literally magic. I
feel done that. I didn't know

1337
01:26:02.800 --> 01:26:05.159
that was going to happen. But
also either the last time I was down

1338
01:26:05.199 --> 01:26:09.119
here and I watched this show.
It's very Powerpuff Girls. It's what I

1339
01:26:09.159 --> 01:26:12.800
get like. Thanks so much for
our viewers. Thanks so much for our

1340
01:26:12.840 --> 01:26:15.800
production crew, Thanks much of our
cale screeners and our moderators. Thanks much

1341
01:26:15.800 --> 01:26:17.600
to the audience. Thanks as much
to you for tuning into this show.

1342
01:26:18.399 --> 01:26:23.119
I'm Forrest Valkai. This is Sophia. Thank you so much for tuning in.

1343
01:26:23.239 --> 01:26:27.279
Have an awesome day and never stopped
learning. And don't forget We as

1344
01:26:27.319 --> 01:27:05.039
atheists don't hate you, which is
not convinced in your ears. We want

1345
01:27:05.079 --> 01:27:10.920
the truth, So watch Truth Wanted
live Friday at seven pm Central. Visit

1346
01:27:11.000 --> 01:27:15.000
tiny dot CC slash y t tw
and call into the show at five one

1347
01:27:15.079 --> 01:27:20.039
two nine nine one nine two four
two or connect to the show. I'mline

1348
01:27:20.239 --> 01:27:24.159
at tiny dot CC slash call tw