Welcome to the Paranormal Pendal Podcast, coming to you from the heart of pendul
Witch Country in the northwest of England. My name is Craig Bryant, author,
the investigator and collector of stories. Join me as we take a journey
into the paranorial UFO sightings, cryptozoology and big casts. This is the Paranorial
Pendal Podcast. Welcome to episode forty of Paranormal Pendal, broadcasting to the Paranorial
UK network at PAUK radio dot com. So my guest on this episode is
Gary Jones. Gary has made it his personal aim in life to research,
read, and investigate a wide range of fascinating subjects areas such as UFO et
phenomena, ancient history, false flag events, and forbidden knowledge and sciences.
And in particular I'm going to talk with Gary today about his book which is
called The Denbig Lights, and we'll get onto that in a few minutes.
Over the last seven years, is UFO investigation work has produced some fascinating and
hard hitting evidence that has resulted in solid UFO cases such as the Penrich Incident,
The Denbig Lights, Caldecock Triangle, Clan Tristan read away by up at
that justice and the Mystical Lights of Mirth Tidville. So Gary, it's an
absolute pleasure to have you on. Thank you for joining me. Yeah,
thank you, hav me on. Chris, good to be here. So
you've been very busy talking to quite a few different people about your book,
The Denbi Lights, which I'd love to talk to you about as we go
through the podcast. But can I just ask, first of all, how
did you actually become involved in research and investigations in the first place. I
asked myself that same question quite a few times. I've always had a fascination
with the subject, but looking back through my life, I think the subject
kind of chose me. I just I've had sightings as a young child and
strange paranormal experiences which led me to you know, at the time, it
was just television and what you read the newspapers. And as I got a
bit older, started reading a bit, started learning a bit more, and
I think sometime yeah, around the early two thousands, I just decided I
was going to read a lot of material, study a lot of material,
and then I just decided around it must have been about ten years ago now,
I just decided I wanted to do some investigation work. I'd had enough
of the research side. I've got a good knowledge base, stood what was
necessary and to learn about this, to learn about cases. And I started
small in my own area, looking at local cases, and then I somehow
ended up branching out to the whole country of Wales. And that's what I've
sort of kept myself busy, because I figured, you know, this is
my backyard in the way in the scale of the world, like small country.
Although it's a kind of fair sized little country, it's still a small
country. And I just decided I wanted to start looking at the case and
I was amazed that just what there was there. Well, it's it's it's
very there's lots of very large rural areas in Wales. It's it's very sparsely
populated, isn't it in certain areas. So I suppose that in itself would
would sort of lend itself to strange things. I mean, you've had quite
a few sightings yourself, haven't you, over years? So Johnna, to
tell me about some of the more interesting sightings you've had, Well, name
three. I'll try to quick because they can go on for quite a bit.
But when I was seven. I lived in a place called Lunsbury Park
in Kafilly. Me and my friends were playing in the summer night and it
was a school holidays because my parents would let me stay out after dark in
the summer months because obviously they'd have to get up for school the next day.
But as long as stay in the street was fine, and a certain
time he had to come in anyway. But one of my friends looked over
and the farmhouse, the farm lands behind the estates was there was this strange
light and we all turned to what he was pointing at, and there it
was this oval disc shaped craft with these very unusual lights coming off of it.
The way they sort of moved from brightness to brightness is like the night
Rider car if I remember that series. I yeah, the car had the
red light on the front which would go left to right and you know,
you'd have the bright spot and then the sort of faded bits would fallow behind
it. And it looked like that, but it was small, yellow,
red and orange of color, and it had a sort of in as to
it. The way it sort of moved, it was like lava, like
a lava lamp, you know, like a volcanic flow of lava. It
was strange. It was so hypnonic, and it was silent. I mean
it floated. It moved like a stick floating on a calm lake, you
know what I mean, just very very you know, it was moving,
but it wasn't like it wasn't like like it was trying to whole position.
It just it looked like it was floating there. And if I could show
you in video, you know, I could probably demonstrate. But if anyone's
ever seen a craft like that, the what I'm talking about, how we
stared at it for about three minutes, two minutes easy, three minutes I
think was the maximum. I think we all talked about it. One of
my friends jokingly said it was a UFO, and we didn't know the significance
of what a UFO was. We just knew what the word meant and identified
flying object. I think we turned our gaze from it for like fifteen seconds
tops, and then I look back, and where the hell did it go?
It couldn't have disappeared from sight. It wouldn't have had enough time.
It was a plane or a helicopter sort of vehicle that could fly. And
yeah, I never forgot that one. And when I was twenty one.
I think it was January of two thousand and four, and actually know I've
been twenty two. I think it was January two thousand and four. This
one I get confused with the two thousand, two thousand and four, but
I think it was. It was definitely January time. Excuse me, goo
a bit of cold. I was coming off from I was coming on from
work on the last evening bus before the late night shuttle buses took over.
There was a different company, but this is the state last stage coach bus
coming from Mura, Tidville, and I was going up to the place where
I live and lo and behold. As as soon as I got off the
bus, it was about seven pm at night, so very dark. Kind
of the weather we're getting now, with all the damp clouds and the low
misty, misty clouded areas and all that. It wasn't raining. But as
I got off the bus about twenty seconds, no more than that, it
was a young girl behind me who was going to her own place. But
we both looked up because something caught a ry. Someone came below the cloud
layer and it was this massive six hundred foot wide boomerang shaped liked the vehicle
with a strange sort of light configuration on it, which just came below the
clouds for a brief moment of time, didn't make any sound, and then
just went back above the clouds. And if I had to guess how fastest
thing was going, probably about three maybe close to four hundred miles. And
now I couldn't tell you, but it was going quick. But yeah,
I saw that one in one time when I was really getting into the whole
UFO thing and collecting some information. I was getting interested in this whld white
old business that was happening around my area, and I was just clicking photos
and something said look over here, and I looked over there. It took
a picture. I coudn't see anything with me, but as soon as I
looked at the photo, there it was this white, orbish looking thing.
I described it like a Pokemon ball. It's got that shape to it,
you know, the sort of an outline and the circles, the center and
the circle, but way more mechanical looking. I got the phone somewhere.
Maybe I'll send it to you at some point. Yeah, it's buried somewhere
in my little father. Yeah, and I just know, I just know
these things are real and they always seem to to rack me at some level
at some stage. And with the paranormal events and everything else, I mean,
well, it was pretty I think becoming an investigator was the next logical
step. So what what paranormal events have you been been witnessed to you?
Then? What what sort of things? Oh? One time I woke up
and there was a woman figure standing right the front of my bed. The
strange thing is I was waking up in the middle of the night. You
know, it happens, but I got the strange feeling there was some you
know, at the end of my bed, and my body was telling there's
someone in the room with him, and shouldn't be anyone. There's my cat
maybe you know, tries to sneak in and have a cutch and on her
anyway, you know, I can see it with my eyes closed, and
as my eyes there it is largest life standing like I'm standing in front like
i'd be standing in front of you. And she very quickly sort of like
looked at me. It's very beautiful looking woman in this blue suit. I
kind of described like one of those Nordic blondes or Palladian look at people that
people often describe. Yeah, I don't know if that's what she was,
but she faded right before my eyes, literally faded before me, you know.
And there's a lamp, and there's a lamp post outside my house which
shines l like in and you know, it comes through the window sometimes and
you can see to the edge of the door. And she faded right before
that. And I've had, you know, like strange flickerings of lighting.
But I remember one time, Oh what was that strange one? I think
that's when I happened when I was so ten. Maybe the kids are all
messing around, right, you know, going the going the toilet on your
own and say the alphabet backwards. Yeah, yeah, you know, sort
of like you know, if you say something in the mirror when you're on
your own, the summer is going to happen. The trouble is it lights
flickering and then a sinkhole fill that with dirty water. Oh no, I've
never seen that happen before. I thought, is there a is the pumps?
Is the dream system flowing backwards up? What? But normally I would
expect it to flow up through it and just spit, you know, like
a fountain. Yeah, yeast. Have you ever seen the way water goes
down at a sinkhole? Yeah? Yeah, yeah, yeah, it goes
the same way, yeah, same way. Yeah, just came up the
same virtually, like that same way. So I thought, this is strange.
That's almost sort of horror film Hollywood esque, isn't it really that sort
of Yeah? I was expecting something to jump out of the time, Yeah,
the cubicle or something. But oh, I just left. I thought
it was nothing. But what can I say? And I like streams dreams,
you know, it's not they don't even dreams, you know, But
I just get the feeling that, you know, sometimes I sense something in
the room and all. So you're quite quite sort of sensitive then to I'm
goin to sense there's something close. Yeah, different things. Yeah, and
that's obviously that manifests itself in the startings that you've had of the UFOs and
as well. So it's all yeah, I personally think it's all linked,
and I know quite quite a lot of other people think that it's linked as
well. I mean, what's what's your thoughts on that? Do you think
it's all linked or I think it is? Yeah, because I'm I'm an
investigator, but I'm also an experience of sorts. Yeah, I've kind of
I've kind of not just read about it, I've actually experienced it. It's
like people talk about Egypt, you know, I mean, I love Egypt.
I've never been, but I know if I went there, my perception
would be a lot more different. And then just reading it in a book,
you know what I mean. Unless you've been there and dan it yourself,
you can't really you can't really appreciate it. So, yeah, I
think Egypt, I mean Egypt, Egyptology is fascinating, and I think the
whole history and the law and everything else around, you know, the religion
and the gods and the goddesses and everything else, and think's fascinating. Yeah,
it's It's definitely on my backet list anyway. So that's probably a discussion
or a subject for a different time, isn't it, Because there's a whole
of things that you can talk about about that. Let's let's move back then
to the UFO stuff. And I mean you've mentioned quite a few in your
by orders, the is it penchurch pen p Turk pen Turk incident. Sorry
my apologies for the pronunciation pen. It's like a writing pen. And then
you know, like turkey, but pen turk, you know. Okay,
so that's quite an interesting one. I mean, what sort of drew you
to investigate in that? Well, it happened pretty much on my doorstep.
There was a build up of military activity in my area. Lots of planes,
helicopters flying around at night and daytime, low, irritating everyone. People
have been down the valley's area of Mirtha. We're wondering what the hell is
going on. No one seemed to have any idea, And there was all
these trucks and convoys at times going up and down the A four seventeen,
and I'm like, something going on here. I don't know what there is.
Anyway, the night of the incident, the twenty sixth of February twenty
sixteen, there were a lot of low flying aircraft and they were really low,
literally coming over people's houses. And I mean the one time I had
a chimney coming over my roof, I could have been on the ceiling.
I could have been on my chimney and touched it, you know, that's
how low it was. At one point I even saw it in the streetlight.
It it was reflecting off of that. You know. So the street
lights out here are not that's all. They are incredibly big, aren't They
are incredibly like as well? Oh, they make a racket. They rally,
you win some a good couple of hundred you know, couple like a
good thousand meters away before they Yeah, yeah, I mean I can.
I can understand where you're coming from with that, because we strangely enough,
we seemed to be on a flight path here where we get a lot of
military aircraft and particularly helicopters in particular oaks. So and they do come across
here very low as well, and so I can I can totally get what
you're saying about the noise and the vibration and everything else, you know.
So yeah, sorry I interrupted again, but I'll get to the point.
This went off like forty five minutes and then two days go by, nothing
like it just stopped. But I was at the Mirth of Tydville Rugby Club.
There was a conference taking place, the rich Planet Tour Richard D.
Hall was taking place. He was going up and down around the country and
it stopped that they stop was in Mertha. It's kind of lucky actually,
because the person who witnessed it, Car's Clark went there that night. I
didn't know who she was and never even met her. And she told the
room doing the Q and AS what had happened, and everybody's jaw dropped,
of course, you know, she told it was a UFO event, and
sudden got shot down. And then people started grabbing the microphone and started telling
some pretty pretty corroborating stuff about explosions and how one work person looked in the
hospital. There was smoke filling the car doors. The whole hospital was shut.
I mean, I just shake the hospital for crying out and yeah,
roads being blocked, and I was just saying, this is not an exercise.
So right away the inclination for me was to get in there investigate.
But it was a little difficult at the time because the Q and A session
was kind of over and everyone was sort of going over to cars. I
couldn't get through to it. I couldn't get through the crowd. It's pretty
difficult. We had a left weighting outside, so I thought, damn,
you know, I gotta get going. And there's a person over there who's
got a Probably the most interesting thing ever since I started all this anyway,
I thought, Okay, I have to leave it. I'll probably get her
the details tomorrow within the week, you know, because everyone's not going to
be talking about it. And it took me twenty months to find her because
somebody was suppressing her name for the last year. Only way I can suppress.
Figure it out. She was commenting on Wales Online. I can comments
on other places, but for some reason, just couldn't find her own Facebook,
even though I knew she was on Facebook. And when I put the
word out, people who knew her were talking to her friends, who all
my friends could I thought, what was going on here? Man? How
can you not put two and two together when you do a search on Facebook
sex? Somebody deliberately removed her name. But then a group I was with
which I'm not going to go into because I would have made a fallen out
with them over this. For reasons, if people want to find out,
go to the pent Turkey incident website page on YouTube. June twenty two UFO
report on Newport That will help that one. But getting back to this,
we said she made a comment on one of the pages and we realized it
was her, and then the investigation began and then all these years later we've
collected so much evidence. Now we're at the point where we've uncovered the cover
up. Cars's experience along with David, her neighbor who witnessed it with her,
and some other witnesses who witnessed some other things too, all confirming that
there was a large pyramid triangular shaped craft that the military were waiting for ambush
for. Multiple objects came out of it, fifteen to twenty barrel shaped orbs,
two of which came over to the witnesses who were watching by the gate,
cousin David, incredible interaction happening there. And then later on we've now
proved also that there was something shot down over by the Royal of Morgan Hospital
in Lantrast. And yeah, I mean when we saince shown that the military
were lying, they didn't have any exercises in the area. There's no operations
of any kind. So whatever they were doing here, it was more for
offensive operations. Purpose is actual operations. You know, they they launched an
operation, you know, over a public air space, which they are allowed
to do if if there's a you know, an enemy, a foreign enemy.
What they did, what they deem you know, friend or foe.
I guess in this case they deemed it a foe, and yeah, took
steps, took whatever steps they took, and yeah, we've got a book
about it, probably another one now because there's a lot more information that used
to go into an updated version, I guess. But whenever that could be
done, I don't know. And then, of course, yeah, that
case is really come along. I've kind of other cases I can mentioned quick
Yeah, yeah, that'd be great, I mean, kind of quickly.
Just asked you about about the Obviously there was there was a huge military involvement
in that, and from what you've what you've said, there was clearly some
sort of suppression of information going on. I mean, did you at any
point when you got really sort of deep into that that rabbit hole, did
you ever worry about your own safety? Yeah? I tend to do this
quite a bit, and I guess I just realized, Hey, look,
you know, I could die tomorrow and leave nothing, you know. So
if they're gonna take me out, they're going to take me out, And
if they're going to take anyone else out, they're going to take them out.
But I'd rather die doing what I'm doing now than sit around waiting for
them to do it and not get anything done, you know what I mean.
Yeah, I mean I've had my computers hacked. I'm sure I've lost
card drives, I've lost information stuff in the beginning, which I know was
probably not as interesting as it would be now given that, you know,
there were some interesting comments, statements, posts. Some people sent me stuff
about NASA, about the International Space Station. May picked something up. I
don't know if they ever sent me the images, but I know they were
in the process of trying to get them to me because I said straight away
I was going to investigate. But I started even in the twenty months between
I couldn't find Hans and when she went public, I was still looking in
for it, looking for information. Yeah. So, yeah, I mean
I do feel I mean, yeah, it is worrying, you know,
it's it's kind of scary, But I mean I've been doing it for close
to eight years now, camp fair worrying. Still you still hear you?
Yeah? I think, well, some people in the UFO field, and
if you know, we're looking for the we're treading in areas they don't want
us to go. I guess there are some people who want us to go
there, you know what I mean. Well, yeah, there are theories,
aren't there that that you know. I mean, we're sort of teaching
on the edge of disclosure. And again that's another massive subject probably for for
for another podcast and it will be talk. Yeah, I mean, it
will be interesting to get your your views on that at some point in the
future. But I mean, I know, I from from doing limited research
in the area around where I am, in the northwest of England, there
are government departments. There are government bodies who take a great deal of interest
in these types of incidents, and you know, there have almost been your
archetypal and again this sounds very Hollywood, but you know, your men in
black turn up to these sites and I know that, you know, there's
been incidents in the northwest of England where these people have just arrived on these
sites where things have been seen and they act particularly you know, peculiar to
normal investigators. So there is there is definitely a government department which is which
is involved in these sort of things. And did you get any sort of
any site of anything like that when you were when you were doing that particularly
investigation. I think if I started early on and may have, but after
twenty months, I guess it kind of cooled off. Yeah. Yeah,
yeah, stories about some strange you know, the way the military people,
she knows, people who addressed like civilians but clearly the military. But they're
incredible physique, yeah, yeah, and the way they talked anyway. You
know, there's been that It's not like you're going together would take up the
whole hour. But I mean, I've come across some strange individuals myself.
I just don't know if they were anything to do with it. It's just
you know, where I live, it's pretty I won't say it's dull,
but you know, you get to know that the characters of the place and
the sort of feel of the personalities are kind of mean. And there's just
been a capital times where people have introduced themselves to me. Yeah, you
know, I've never seen them before, but yeah, and they say things
I'm just like, and they sort of stand out. They're not they look
normal, but they stand out because of the way they mannerism themselves. Yeah,
it's interesting. Yeah, I just don't anybody's experience that. But I'm
just saying I'm not saying that they were you know, those men in black
people, the strange government people. I'm just saying, sometimes I do come
into contact with them in the places I would never expect to see them.
Yeah. Well, I mean I've spoken to all the other you know,
very well respected investigators. I won't mention any names, but I have spoken
to other people who've said similar things. You know, they've had they've met
people in the street who they just didn't feel right speaking to. You know,
they've just been the whole demeanor has just been completely different to what they
would expect a stranger to interact with them. So he it clearly does happen.
You know, Let's let's talk about your book. Then let's talk about
the DENBI lights, and let's talk about how you got involved in that investigation
and what it was that sort of drew you into that in the first place.
Well, like I said, well, that particular case came along in
my lap around April of twenty eighteen. But what happened was is when I
was researching around December seventh, not sorry, October seven. Let me start
again. October twenty seventeen, I met Carl's Cock. I was twenty months
after the original event at Penturk. Now, once I've got some statements and
some information and I was able to really start bring my efforts into finding what
I needed to find. I was looking for any videos, photos, UFO
reports that might coincide with this event. Yeah, the date, and there
were some videos popping up and some photographs popping up of UFO sightings. And
then when I realized the location was well beyond you know, it's up in
the northern areas, came across that case and I went up to a visit
in North Wales one time with a group I was once with and met this
family at the last stop and they showed me this video and I gotta say,
wow, you know, what a what an impressive video. And the
thing that really stood out for me is, you know, I've seen something
like this myself at that first sighting I had when I was seven. All
the light configuration was a little different. I mean, the shape is underniable,
you know, all the like the way it moves, you know,
it's definitely got a sort of sorcer cyllinder shape, oval shape to it.
And I asked him was anybody investigated this? I mean I asked the witnesses
and everybody actually done any investigation into this, because this is a fantastic footage.
I did say that a man named Peter Glynn had done some preliminary work,
did the local investigation stuff, and he put together some good evidence.
You know, he did it. The family went to the location, did
a day night comparison from the actual sight of the wind the window because it
was at night, and then you want to get in the daytime. And
I did a bunch of other things too, and he did a good analysis,
a good viewing of the the video itself, and all in all he
did about eight videos which combined to about an hour. And I thought,
you know, this is a really good report. I could do quite a
bit with this, so I asked for a permission to use it, of
course, and then I just started doing all the other stuff I knew that
could do. I thought, well, I could do a let's really sit
down with all of you now and get this on film if you want,
which they agreed to. I said, let's let's really go to the areas
and take a look around, and I want to take a look at radar
returns and see if we can just eliminate that, you know, the usual
suspects. I said, this video needs to be analyzed properly, and I
know just the man for it, Jason Gleese of uf only former RAF man
now to and investigated in the UFOs. He does analysis work on photos and
videos. Very good at it actually, and you know, I recommend people
really stuff. He's got a YouTube channel, which I find good because I
just love watching videos that have an analytical work done to it. And yeah,
so I did all the usual things that I would do, and then
when I was ready, I put together a documentary around I think it was
just towards the end of twenty nineteen, beginning twenty twenty maybe no, no,
no, that would have been beginning twenty nineteen. Sorry, And I
kind of left it at that, and then I just promoted the case then
about last this is about summertime last year, I thought I'm gonna write a
book on this because there's enough material here. And that's what I did.
I put together a book and what the case is called. It's called the
Denbi Lights because the craft is just omitting these unusual incredible amount of lights randomized
pands. You can't you can't synchronize them in any way or you know,
figure out what when they're going to come on and off. And I call
that subheading a truthful argument for the existence of the UFOs. The reason I
call it that is because if anybody, I mean, I'm not trying to
prove the existence of the UFOs. I think we've already done that. What
I'm trying to say is that if you're looking for if you're looking for a
case for someone to look at and say, you know, yeah, this
is definitely real, or you know, this is definitely happening, but there's
no need for speculation here. There's your case. There's the denib lights for
you, and if you want me to go into the details, I shall.
Yeah. No, yeah, I'd love you to. I just wanted
to sort of ask you at this point what Jesson thought of the footage,
because I have I have an interviewed Jess and myself a few months back,
so I am, you know, fairly familiar with his work. I'm wondering
really what he made of the footage. He got a twelve minute video report
on his own channel. I am. I am asked to look at it,
and he said, well, yeah, this is incredible footage, very
ratty. I guess so so long because it was close a ten minutes worth
of video, and the he described as unexplained. It's unexplained. You know,
this is not a uf Sorry, it's not a playing in a helicopter
or a drone of the usual explanations. This is unexplained. Whatever that object
is is not where you would normally expect to find. Therefore it's a UFO
event. So that's where he concluded, right, So yeah, so what
what was the sort of series of events with with the sight in them?
Okay, well, it was January third, twenty twelve. It was three
am in the early hours of the morning, big real well into the night.
Nathan Thomas was the first person to witness it. He was twelve at
the time. He heard a noise outside because it was a stormy night,
you know, fifty sixty seventy mile hour winds that you know, strong gusting
winds. It's freezing temperature zero degrees and the rain was coming down, so
visibility was poor as hell. Any went outside anyway, the noise was his
bin. As he looked out. You know, the bin was quite a
big you know, I don't know if you ever seen those big council bins,
you know, the really big ones, you know, obviously it was
packed full, like because of the as the Christmas rubbish and everything was either
anyway, as he looked out, you could see something. Something was dazzling
with lights in the distance. And as he looked, he thought, was
that a reflection from my window or you know, coming off of the TV
or something. And as he opened the window, he realized it's coming from
outside. It's not from inside his room reflection and he looked at it and
he realized, you know, oh my god, you know that's that's some
kind of That's one of those UFO, isn't it. You know. He
goes to get his brother who's in the next room, Alex Thomas, who's
fourteen at the time, and he was trying to get asleep, and Nathan
was kind of annoying him, you know, clear you know, go away
and say UFOs side alexfo, so come see come see So obviously listening to
his brother, he thinks winding me up, but he seems seems to be
genuinely trying to get his attention. And it goes to the window and if
you could, I mean I would have left the scene. His expression,
he obviously went, you know, went from being tired they suddenly, you
know, instantly awaken. Oh my god. And Nathan had been given a
video camera that The camera was a Cameleo S thirty mate by Toshiba, and
at the time it was, you know, one of those nice little handheld
cameras you could use for parties and red ins, you know, just just
just a video logue events. Nothing like today, of course, but the
video was a very good quote, you know, the video worked very well,
worked well enough, and they started recording and they got about three minutes
worth of video before you can hear it in the dialogue, they're using their
voices. I transcribed the video, by the way, in the video documentary
that if people want to see it, I'll send you the links to that.
Anyway, they went down to go get their mother, Linda Pritchard.
She was a third witness to see it, and Alex came down, now
you know, the one who's trying to get asleep in that wide awake,
literally literally telling you know, shot, you know shot. I wouldn't say
he was shouting at his mother, but you know, eager to get his
mother up. Thinking she got up and what what you know, thinking it's
the house on fire, that's her words, it's the house on fire.
There's nothing wrong, you know, it's just alex is getting all excited,
and she goes upstairs, takes a look and sees it for herself. The
lights now at this point they're filming again, and the lights are really starting
to go now and yeah, they what do you see with the camera.
It's not what they see with their eyes. Their eyes are getting a much
better definition of this. It's oval shape. It's source of shape. They're
talking about their lights on top. They can see the underneath it as it
tilts up and down. This thing goes from a horizontal to vertical position,
you know, like a from flat to forty odd degrees maybe. And at
one point they decided to go and wake Kear up. And this is Linda
as granddaughter, and she could hear the she could hear the sort of commotion
like it was waking her up, and then she realized, you know,
something was going on, and I think Nathan went to wake her up.
And then by that point all four of them are watching it. And yeah,
you can hear it in the on the transcript of the video that they
just what is that? And you know, and it's interesting when you listen
to how they speak. I mean, Linda is like, that is the
most amazing thing I've ever seen. Nate and Alex is similar, but a
little more eager as well. He's like, I've never seen anything like that
before in my life. And it's getting worried, you know that people are
going to come visit him, you know. And and Nathan, the youngest
one, he's still enthusiastic. So she put us on YouTube. Ales,
she put us on YouTube. She contact the post, you know, I
contact the local press, and Keira is in this somewhere and she's just like,
wow, you know, amazing. Anyway, it's just it's just man.
And then at one point, the lights all stop. They just stop.
They're gone. That's it, They're finished. And alex Is reaction is
priceless. He just goes, I guess this is exactly more. That's exactly
how it went. The lights stopped, and he goes, oh, don't
stop. Literally died durn blue. You couldn't say that, but that's that's
where it is. It's like, oh, don't stop. You know,
he's so freaking eager to see them again. Attitude today, I said,
Attitude today, they really really want to see it again, and I'm just
amazed, you know, because Peter investigated. Not long after it happened,
the police were called in. They said they were lampers. Right. There
was no police or helicopters or army or anything going on. The farmer doesn't
work at night in the golf club which is there with the quarry in the
distance, they're all shut. They're nowhere in line with the the lights anyway,
But obviously looking for normal explanations, this is what people would go on.
And yeah, I mean all those things were done in the beginning which
clearly show this was a UFO. But anyway, have you interviewed the family
about six years, seven years after the event, Their memories were as fresh
as the day had happened. And even to this day, I mean,
we're talking, well, it's been it's been over ten years though, eleven
years nearly, No, we've been it's been well over eleven years, become
twelve years now in January. I should go back up there just to speak
well and see how they are. So was it sort of was it seen
by any other people that you know of? I'm hoping that there were other
witnesses, But to this day, I still have not received any other witnesses
now, but four people from one window was pretty good. But I had
hoped that other people might have seen it. But given the time, I
mean, the Demba shit area is pretty quiet. Know there's a small community
there. I mean given the vantage point, really there only a certain number
of houses I think would have seen it. Anyway, you mentioned in your
in your bioor that the story was picked up by the Mirror. Yeah,
it's and they're on an article. Well, I mean, how how was
that received? I think it was the Daily Star, wasn't it. Well,
I don't know if you said it was picked up by the mirror.
I know some of the some of my UFO cases have been picked up by
the mirror, and some of them, I think the usual responses all the
same. UFO expert describes lights as real, and you know, they they
just they just mentioned it in a sort of a passing sort of thing.
Really, they don't really go into detail or describe the the events in full.
They just like to. So I did have a clip of it somewhere,
Yeah, there was a I did have it in the Daily Star,
and I think he may have gone in the Mirror also, So for give
me from getting used on that one. But no, they just said,
yeah, you know, Jason Gleaze put out his video. They picked up
on the story and I think, you know, if I remember correctly,
they just said, you know, UFO UFO video described as real by expert,
and then they just wrote a story told about the witnesses and misslf.
You know. It was just one of those online one of those online things.
I don't think it made it to the papers. It just went on
one of their websites, right, okay, hmm. Interesting speck up by
early on when Peter was looking into it, and Peter's a local UFO investigator
at the time, he was interested in this stuff, you know, he
did other investigations as well, so he was very into this. Someone named
Scrilex. Skrilex was a DJ American DJ and a record producer, and he
was very I don't know what he's doing now, but at the time he
was very very popular. Excuse me, it was very very popular. And
he put the link to the video on his Facebook page, which automatically meant
all his followers went to that page themselves, and the views on Peter's page
went from someone like a couple of thousand up to like ten fifty thousand.
I think at last count it was somewhere around like maybe four hundred thousand.
OK. And that's sort of just I really obviously opened the case open for
a lot of people then. So it was quite surprised that. I mean,
the local media picked it up, but I don't think anybody in the
mainstream was bothered with it. But the family became targets for some of the
you know, de bunkers out there and the people who feel it's their duty
to out you know, liars, and even when they got video evidence,
they're still liars. Oh, I tell you the treatment there were something.
Especially Nathan, you know, the one, the youngest one who saw it,
was so enthusiastic. He won't talk about it now. No. I
mean he may give an interview an audio, but you won't get him on
a camera. And I think you gave him an audio he'll be because I
think he just got fed up with the attitude of people have towards it.
Yeah, And I think I think that's an issue, isn't it in general
with with witnesses, that a lot of people don't want to come forward do
the no because of the absolute idiots. I can think of stronger bloody guys.
I mean, there's a guy named Mick West who does the what do
you call it? Metabunk? And I'm not against Mick West being someone to
be skeptical, but it seems like everyone a meta bunk lately. Their default
mode is just skeptic. I would even call it skeptic. I mean their
thing is confirmation biased. They all just get together and let's say, every
every UFO things is a lie. And you know, although Mick has done
some good work on other things, you know, cases that have been fraudulent,
and he's out with those frauds very easily, when it comes to the
more genuine stuff or the more you know, realistic, you know, part
hitting stuff, those are given the same sort of scorn. You know,
they just can't be real. They're not allowed to be real. And I'm
like, well, why the hell are you fipin deep? But what's the
point I met about that? You know, what what do you what do
you stand for? Because he's got it down on his page as Aliens Versus
golf carts, right, that's what he's calling it. And he only took
that small video from the Daily Stars of the lead there and this is what
you called it foot they just spooky spinning. UFO in Wales declared genuine by
expert and that that was basically the whole story. After that, they just
named Jason as the expert, they named me as the investigator, they named
the place where it happened, and it wasn't all that much of a story,
to be honest with you, you know, they but I mean,
it was nice to declare it for them to talk about it. But obviously
Mick found this and decided to call it alien versus golf carts. I said,
have you actually looked at the whole video? Have you actually been to
the place. This is why I consider field research a genuine you know,
a genuine thing the UFO investigators to do. By the time I figured out
this is the one big thing I did do for this case. I lined
up the two furthest light points I could find in the video right, because
it seems to me this object's not moving, it's staying where it is.
So when the lights are going on left, furthest left right and furthest right
light. And I got this in the book how I've done it. I
then take the location of where the site was from. And then I just
keep lining up that and following the line as far as it will go in
it. And it does lead up to the day and night time photographs when
you overlay them, does show that it's pretty just below the landscape point in
the photographs. And Mickers decided that this thing is lights or vehicles coming from
the top of that mountain hill place by the golf course mass all it is,
okay, good theory, Like you know, never heard that one before
Et came. Et came to them be the play around at golf like I
guess he thought the Masters wasn't on or something. But I mean three,
you know, I mean if anybody's on vehicles, because this is where Peter
comes in again. He did. He went around those fields, couldn't find
any tracks or any evidence of vehicles, quads, bikes or anything like that,
bikes or scramblers wherever you call them. And I said, and in
the way I lined it up right from the furthest lights to the left and
right going up to the golf course. Is the woods up there called christ
Mar Woods, so Christ or christ Christ Woods or something like that. Well
she named a strange It's just the way you pronounce it. I thought it
said it sounds like Crestwoods, but it's it's it's called christ Woods or some
christ Woods. Yeah like that. There was there was something torove with the
lady called Margaret Pritchard. Wasn't to do with that. Yes, this will
lead into that. Yeah, okay, the if the if somebody was riding
vehicles around there for fifteen minutes, right, they would have to then drive
it through the woods, through thick, dense woods, crashing into trees,
bumping into things and being able to avoid all that and come back around and
do it all again for fifteen minutes because that's along the siting lasted floor like
you know, sighting wise, and somehow then tilt off the ground and go
and then have their bags flying in the air like et. I guess you
know they must have been up there. But yeah, so I'm a hit
the golf course. If they were on the pitch I think was sorry of
the pitch on the on the on the fairway, it's obscured by a small
banking. You no, there's a there's it goes up, then it goes
over and down. Does that make sense? Yeah, yeah, it would
be obscured from their site. They wouldn't be able to see anything even if
there was someone up there. And yeah, one day I went up to
the woods to have work around. Then I found out when I was there,
this is the value of going to these places. Sometimes people say things
when you're on location that you wouldn't really pick up in an interview or a
phone call. She said, six weeks, no more than six weeks,
probably less less than four, this huge section of woods, this lovely area
that they loved walking through because there is a path through there, but it's
a very narrow path. You know, you're not going to ride a big
vehicle through there, but enough to get through the single fannel, let alone
anything else. But they chopped on this large section of trees. They weren't
exactly shall we say, fell removed and taken away because of anything contamination wise.
They were just chopped down, removed and sent over to the side.
Now I don't understand why it happened. I think maybe the storm did something
to them, But I have a sneaky little feeling that maybe something with the
UFO was involved, maybe coming over that way. And I've tried to find
out about why this was done, got no answer. Tried riding to the
councils and the local authorities up there, not really getting any answers. And
I've since learned that that particular wooded land area is an ancient woodland and it's
protected under certain laws. They have protection rights for that area. So you
know, I mean, if someone's going to touch it, go in there
and have a mess around with it, I mean, yeah, what's it
had to be a reason? Then I don't there If it's a protective woodland,
it's not that easy for a local authority just to move in there and
call out of the trees down, isn't it. Yeah, I got it.
And I did a slight presentation on this last year, and I did
make a note of this. This is what it's called. There's an acronym
for There are twenty teen nine s S S Eyes wholly or partly within Demish
protected sites in Demas and this is from one of their lists, and there
it is Christma that's protected. So it doesn't mean they can't chop down trees.
But I'm pretty sure if you're going to you're going to need special permissions.
That's a very good reason for it. Yeah, the sites of special
scientific interest. I think it stands far, doesn't that. Yeah, special
scientific interest isn't interesting one of them? Yeah that's the one. Yeah,
so special interest it will be. They will all have to jump through hoops.
Wanted to sort of go in there and start cutting trees down. Oh
yes, yes, some of them have been blown over too. You can
see one of the trees. I've been blown over a pull over, but
it's heavily uprooted, and it means a big, bloody tree, you know,
I mean it's not something small. And you can see the others where
they've chopped them through. There still there were signs there there, and they
may be still signs there now. But since then the area has overgrown,
and I mean today it doesn't look anything. You're suck a big thing pile
of just bramble bushes, and then you know these thin twig trees. It's
it's it's nothing like what it said in their former glory. But that was
strange, and uh yeah, I mean, is there any other questions you
got? Well, I was I was just going to ask you, really,
where where you can buy the books? It sounds like a fascinating raid.
That's a very underrated case. You can get it from Amazon, typing
the THEMBI lights UFO. It's available in Kindle, It's available in paperback and
hardback. And if you're one of those people who likes audio, it's available
on that too. Okay, is there anything in the pipeline? Any any
other books in the pipeline? Not for them, Not for the time being.
I mean I want to write some more, but time consuming and it's
very difficult to get the book sold. I mean, the Pento one is
doing very well. That case has gone worldwide. But yeah, the ones,
you know, I mean, if I were to write them, I
don't know. I mean I have to think about it. If I got
like a like a lot of spare time, to be honest, I want
to break from the UFOs and all this other stuff I've been doing because I've
been doing it for over twenty years and it's getting a little it's a it's
a lot, a lot of time consuming stuff. So I mean I will
write books, obviously, I will at some point, because these cases need
to be known because they all come with evidence and great witnesses and videos and
analysis and field work and all that, you know, Like I try to
make my cases as comprehensive as possible, Like I mean, there is something
I could go into here. Yeah, it's not a witness, but he's
someone who may have seen the craft himself. There's a man named I got
this from a local paper from the pictures were online and managed to find it.
Lucky I saved them. Uh yeah, this is from one of the
local papers in Denby. I don't know which one it's called. That's what
I was what I was sold in that place. This was from the eighth
of February twenty twelve. The sightning occurred on the first of February of the
same year, just a month after Denby actually and Graham Evans from Denby was
startled when a strange flying object suddenly appeared in the daylight sky as he was
taking a photograph with his digital camera that it says. I was walking around
Denbiy taking pictures of several locations for a video I was making. And it
was about two thirty pm when I reached Leicester's Church by Denby Castle, said
mister Evans, just about to take the picture where an object suddenly appeared in
the sky, moving very quickly from left to right. And if you can
see the picture, it's a dish shaped object. A close up enhancement of
it would reveal that it's got some sort of like underbelly roundish underbelly with a
saucer outline. And Denby Castle is not too far away from where this sightning
took place. You can see Denbigh from the house of the family itself.
You know, it's a very visible place. It's a very old castle's like
eight nine centuries old, I believe, but maybe it'll less. But I
mean it's very old, you know, and the castles seen better to his
mind. You But it's just interesting that a month after, you know,
something like that he's got. He had quite a few photographs of it.
And it's been my experience to learn that that whenever major UFO signs take place,
there seems to be that these sightings may occur afterwards, not as prominent
as the denbi Lights one, but people may see objects similar nature in the
air because they seem to stay for a while and then they go away.
Yeah, you seem to get him been clusters. I've noticed that. Yeah,
So that's so interesting. So is it has there been anything recently up
there? Is it? Is it a hot spot? Do you think or
was it just these isolated North Wales is very active. I mean there there
are sightings happening in and around there out to see below the below the mountain
ranges. I mean it's always going Yeah, there's always something going on there
and people are reporting stuff then taking videos and things, which reminds me what's
his name? Now there is another thing. Yeah, David Williams is an
interesting character in this case because he had something to offer as well. See
the original video was played on his iPad, David's ipie. He's the next
door neighbor, the same age as Alex I believe. Okay, yeah,
so he would have been thirteen to fourteen at the time, maybe a bit
older. But anyway, they were messing around with the video. He was
taking a screenshot zoom in, and then taking another screenshot zoom in, taking
another screamshot, and every time he did it seemed to enhance it a little
bit, you know, bring out a little more detail. And he got
really close into it. I couldn't believe what he had. He had this
you could see shape of the dome on top. You could see four large
bluish white lights with several smaller ones around them, clear red light on top
which seemed to be distinctively like two separate red lights. It looks like a
cherry if you you know, if you're just looking at it in a blurry
version. And I was like, Howard Earth did you manage to get that?
I said, I've been messing around with this video trying if I could
bring out the background of this thing, because the family said they could see
the sourcer with their eyes, but the camera I guess didn't have a sharp
enough sense at the time. And I guess today most cameras will pick it
up very easily because they've got night vision and things, or you know,
they got much better ICEO rangers, you know, for for for light in
the dark. Yeah, yeah, anyway, And I was just asking and
he said, well, that's amazing, because I mean I've done something similar
but just not as clear as that. But it clearly shows. I mean,
I'm surprised that image doesn't get the credit it deserves. It clearly bloody
shows this thing isn't alval shape. It's got a source of shape on the
top and it does have you know, that's that classic source of shape sort
of look to it. Whatever this thing is it's a solid object of some
sort, but it's clearly not designed by man, you know, because we
don't make them like that unless we've recovered some and do you know what I
mean reverse engineer. Yeah, that's interesting. Yeah, So it's a sort
of classic source of shape that you imagine in a sort of nineteen fifties B
movie? Is it? Is it that sort of shape? I could say
that, Yeah, I mean I wish I had the MS to show you.
Yeah, I can imagine it, and I hope that that, you
know, the listeners will build to imagine it as well. Because of the
way you've described it. It's sort of it's sort of like you know,
you know, the Day the Earth stood Still filmed from the fifties or sixties
whenever it was that sort of classic silver sort of UFO shape, circular UFO
shape. Well, what's interesting Also, when I've interviewed the family, all
four witnesses, I asked them about these lights. I asked them, I
said, probably look to you then, I mean, because obviously you've all
seen it, But if I asked you to describe them, how would you
describe them? I think I think Alex described it like explosions going, brightening,
dimming down, brightened, dimming down. I think Nathan described it like
a real bright firework display, but you don't contain within that area. I
think Linda has described it a similar way. But you know what it is
very interesting is Kira's description of the lights. Kira said something you need to
do that I'll relate to, you know. I mean she described the lights
like I don't know, if you've ever been on holiday or eve, ever
been in a swimming pool and you see the lights under the water, I
mean the water. No one's in the water, the lights are underneath and
the water's moving around. Yeah, so the shimmering, shimmering. Yeah,
it was like that, but it was more hypnotic and it was just so
unbelievably mesmerizing. And and I said, oh, it's something you really want
to see again. Oh yeah yeah. And I think we're going into a
conversation about this. I said, Oh, okay, then, so if
you know you told me you're an Ed Shearing fan, I mean, if
you could get a backstage pass through a tour of Ed Shearing, you know,
for the whole thing, or win the lotry and go live your dream,
or you know, go see the world, or see this thing again.
What would it be, Oh, I see this thing again, you
know, because it's priceless. I mean, that's that's that's not much of
an impact this thing has made. That's interesting. So you have you have
to wonder them whether there was in dates, some sort of hypnotic element to
these lights, or whether it was some sort of perhaps subconscious communication or something
like that. It may well be. I have not perceived any indication that
they receiving a communication. I think they just they just gott and incredibly,
I think they just whether they were meant to see it, I don't know,
or whether it was just there and they were lucky. I mean,
either way, they've seen it, and it's made that war impression on them,
and certainly it's you know, they've lived there their whole lives, even
you know, all this time, and I mean I did comparisons for the
whole thing. It's not fireworks, it's not vehicles, it's not helicopters.
It's not arcing of light from any electrical cable. It's not anything from the
quarry or the golf course. It's not lightning on the ground. It's none
of that natural weather phenomenon that you describe. There's very few things that would
match these configurations anyway. And you know, hovering and tilting vertically and the
like partner that we saw. You know, Please to me, what vehicle
does that or any kind of craft that you can think of besides us?
I guess, yeah, I mean was there. Well, it just remains
a mystery then really as to what it was, well, I can describe.
I mean in their minds, it's a it's an extraterrestrial craft. And
then I mean, if we don't have them, I would I mean I'm
not saying that it wasn't, you know, but I mean with me,
I mean I was remin open minded. It's skeptical, but I mean,
I mean I keep hearing about all this reverse engineering stuff. But if these
things are not if we can't reverse if we can't build them, a reverse
engineer them, and what's left? You know what I mean? I mean,
to me, I think it is an extraterrestrial vehicle of some sort.
You know. The question is where they come from? Yeah? Absolutely,
North Wales is notorious for having things coming in and out of the sea.
I mean, there's been so many freaking sightings up there. It's unbelievable.
You know, you've got the Berwin Mountains in nineteen seventy four. There's a
book coming out now with Philip Mantle with Mark Oley, is it with the
Gary Rose case from nineteen eighty three. Then you've got this one of course,
and you've got night the triangles up there, because if that came from
South Wales to the north, then you've got the one case I mentioned in
the book, it's called in nineteen seventy nine that involved the craft coming out
of the sky and landing with three occupants inside. I mean I were during
the Welsh Triangle. The broad Haven thing is very incredible too if it's in
around that area. But Wales is a small country. It wouldn't take long
for any of these craft to cover the distance given the seeds they can go.
Yeah, it sounds like it's an absolute hotbed, especially especially up there
in the north, on the on the north coast. Well, I've got
a lady now, who's I'm just trying to I was hoping I might be
able to go and see her in the place. I think it was called
Parsons Beach or some Penson beaches there, Pinzan or something in there coming in
Flandadeno area. Okay, I'm trying to remember the details here, but a
very rainy weeks holiday in Clandon. Now yeah, child, well what I
imagine you're probably well grown adult now h yeah, I'm certainly getting along in
the tooth. Let's put it that way. It's interesting, is it,
because you've got you've got angles see up there, and of course there's a
there's a nuclear power station. Isn't there an angle? See? I was
do you know what? But I have look, I know there was a
nuclear power station there. I didn't think it was around that area. There
is there is one angle? Say, yeah, definitely, because we actually
drove past it. When we did, we did a too well, we
sort of drove around angles see in a in a day because it's for people
who don't know it's it's a fairly small island off the off the north coast
of of Wales. We were staying in Beaumaris at the time, so we
we just went through a drive around and we actually stopped at the petrol station
and you could see the power station just literally maybe half a mile just just
just down the just down the coast, and it was playing Havoc with the
central locking in the car, and I actually went into the into the garage
and said, I've got a problem with central locking and he said, oh,
it's all right, it's just the radiation from the nuclear power station.
It'll it'll settle down. And I was like, oh. And the thing
was my wife, Sarah was about six months pregnant at the time, so
we met a hasty retreat. But the reason I mentioned that is because I
have mentioned this before to other people about nuclear power stations and military installations.
We have a lot of sightings up in the more Convey area of Lancashire,
and we have two nuclear house stations at Hetiam, which is just just south
of Morecambe, and there are a lot of UFO sightings in that area and
there have been historically going back well over one hundred years. And I'm just
wondering whether it's the same sort of thing on in North Wales because of the
proximity of that nuclear power station on angles, I would have to say it's
definitely yes. It's interesting, isn't it. There are sort of there are
sort of correlations I think in a lot of these areas. Whether there are
similarities, it's been it's a fascinating story, and I do I do actually
feel a little bit for the family because obviously they've they've been you know,
not particularly well treated by certain sections of yeah, the press or whatever people
people trying to debunk them. So yeah, I mean, I would urge
anybody who's listening to this to go to go and buy the book. How
many books if you're written altogether, Gary, if you don't bund me asking
to But maybe I'll do a few more the Penturk Incidents. That's a co
author book with me and cars Clark, the then be Legs. Yeah,
and maybe in the future I'll have another one then with more that would be
the more series of cases they've done. Yeah. Yeah. Do you have
a website or anything where people can get hold of you. I'm only your
Facebook at the minute. I was going to get a website going, but
I got so much going on I cannot. I can't really devote so much
time to all these other little things. But I'm on Facebook and the Gary
John so you can find me there, okay. And if people will send
you any stories or startings or anything from from your area, the Cando obviously
through through Facebook. Yeah, they can do it. Through Facebook. Yeah,
that's usually where I like to meet people or contact people, because maybe
I will set up a website at some point just to say, you know,
people want to yeah, yeah, just get in contact with you and
that. Yeah, well I know people might want an email. Remember,
but I don't really have those facilities right now, because I mean it's a
lot of work. You know, I'm busy with so many things I can't
really yeah, the vote, So I'm trying to cut back on the number
of things that I'm doing because you know, it's it's sort of like eats
away my time. Yeah, absolutely, I know exactly what you mean.
It's it's a very it's a very fine fine balancing acts, especially you know
when you've got to when you're working full time and you've got a family and
everything else. It's you know, it can become all consuming and all it
can take over your life. So I can I can fully understand where you're
coming from with that one. Yeah, but maybe at some point I will.
But I mean, at some point I do do intend to take a
break from it because I want to do a bit of traveling around the country
and I'll just see a few places you spend a few nights here, a
few nights there. Yeah, yeah, yeah, So Facebook's probably the best
best place to get hold of you and obviously go out and buy your books.
That's that's the name thing. Yeah. I'll give you a link to
all of that anyway, and then you can put it on on the thing
if you want. I will. I will put it on the on the
description for the podcast. Yeah, that'll be that brilliant. Well, it's
been great talking to you, Gary, Thanks for giving us your time this
evening. It's been a really really interesting I mean it's it's been a story
that I've not really should have done much research about. So it's always great
to hear about these sort of stories that you know, I don't know much
about it anywhere. So it's been it's been fantastic talking to you. Thank
you. You're welcome, Craig, thank you, Thank you. You can
visit my website at www dot Craig Bryant dot co dot uk. Parrymalpendle will
return and remember to keep watching the shadows. Don't don'