WEBVTT 1 00:00:03.040 --> 00:00:13.039 Third lap, the podcast with Alejandro Gaviria and Ricardo Silva Romero, a podcast 2 00:00:13.160 --> 00:00:22.519 from the locutorio arroba la locutorio de that gratitude Ricardo for waking up and knowing 3 00:00:22.600 --> 00:00:26.600 that we are alive. It seems to me perhaps the most essential form of 4 00:00:26.679 --> 00:00:31.239 prayer. He told another poet and I think I' ve already said it 5 00:00:31.280 --> 00:00:36.799 in some previous third- round episodes, that poetry is that last religion that 6 00:00:36.920 --> 00:00:43.000 is left to men. An idea about praying that interested me a lot, 7 00:00:43.799 --> 00:00:49.280 if not bad, is in St Augustine, and it is the idea that 8 00:00:49.560 --> 00:00:54.280 it is one who is listening to his prayers, his prayers. One. 9 00:00:55.240 --> 00:01:02.719 In other words, he could never complain that his prayers were not heard, 10 00:01:02.759 --> 00:01:08.319 because it is one who is listening to them first and the one who is 11 00:01:08.439 --> 00:01:23.000 repeating them again and again hello Ricardo we meet again for our weekly conversation in 12 00:01:23.000 --> 00:01:27.000 third round. This time again we have to resort to the audio exchange of 13 00:01:27.040 --> 00:01:34.359 Whatsapp as a result of the emergencies and contingencies of the beginning of the week 14 00:01:34.359 --> 00:01:36.879 Santa Te. I propose that we talk about a subject that we have not 15 00:01:37.040 --> 00:01:41.000 touched upon, the act of praying, how we prayed in our past life, 16 00:01:41.319 --> 00:01:44.359 how we do it now, and a connection. I want to know 17 00:01:44.840 --> 00:01:49.239 what you think about prayer, the act of prayer, and the poetry of 18 00:01:49.239 --> 00:01:55.519 prayer. In my opinion, it' s a conversation with a presence, 19 00:01:56.120 --> 00:02:00.120 connections, a universe, something or someone who doesn' t respond, we 20 00:02:00.159 --> 00:02:05.000 imagine, who listens to us, who imagines that he pays some attention to 21 00:02:05.000 --> 00:02:10.000 us. In that conversation we often make requests and sometimes simply express gratitude. 22 00:02:13.199 --> 00:02:16.680 I am particularly interested, as I said Ricardo, in that kind of prayer 23 00:02:16.759 --> 00:02:24.639 I am going to call it idiosyncratic, built by those skeptical priests who are 24 00:02:24.639 --> 00:02:31.280 poets. And I want to start with a Spanish poet, Juan Vicente Piqueras, 25 00:02:31.439 --> 00:02:37.280 and a book published a few years ago by the publishing house Angosta in 26 00:02:37.319 --> 00:02:39.439 Pandemia, called La SED de las Palmeras. And with this poem, until 27 00:02:39.479 --> 00:02:45.840 tomorrow he tells us Good night, prefers until tomorrow. Until tomorrow it is 28 00:02:45.840 --> 00:02:49.960 clear, bright, full of ace that shines with the light of one more 29 00:02:50.039 --> 00:02:53.520 day. A man in the dark night prefers tomorrow morning, not him, 30 00:02:53.080 --> 00:02:58.919 not the night, if he does of the day goodbye father. Good night 31 00:02:59.400 --> 00:03:04.439 until tomorrow he answers and that is an act of faith his prayers. There 32 00:03:04.560 --> 00:03:08.360 is another poem by Piquera that sums up well this part, This first part 33 00:03:08.400 --> 00:03:15.960 of the conversation roots of heaven is called, says the office of God is 34 00:03:16.080 --> 00:03:22.360 to silence ours, to speak temptfully. We' re praying ants. We 35 00:03:22.439 --> 00:03:27.520 are roots of the sky, that maybe we are Ricardo ants who pray. 36 00:03:32.560 --> 00:03:38.639 I do not know if it is for religious education, which in my case 37 00:03:38.800 --> 00:03:43.120 was very particular, because I studied in a very liberal school and yet had 38 00:03:43.120 --> 00:03:51.960 a church. It was not said whether it was by those images of the 39 00:03:52.039 --> 00:04:00.400 people crossing the sea divided into two and the commandments and movies from Venur until 40 00:04:00.479 --> 00:04:05.800 the day Christ died. But it seems to me that praying is somehow a 41 00:04:05.879 --> 00:04:15.959 possibility for me. I have no fixed ideas about transcendence or about what or 42 00:04:16.079 --> 00:04:24.959 who or how God is, but I do have the suspicion that the world 43 00:04:25.040 --> 00:04:31.759 was well done. Societies may already be counter- made, but the world 44 00:04:32.000 --> 00:04:39.319 of nature is at least a spectacle and then it seems to me that there 45 00:04:39.480 --> 00:04:46.720 is one after the scenes, a way of having done everything that may be 46 00:04:46.839 --> 00:04:51.279 aware of their creation. Let' s say then the temptation to pray is 47 00:04:51.560 --> 00:04:59.439 within me for that education, so I see there is a tic even in 48 00:04:59.480 --> 00:05:03.800 my way of expressing, which includes good- bye my God is an expression 49 00:05:03.879 --> 00:05:08.319 that can come out to me constantly. I don' t know if it 50 00:05:08.319 --> 00:05:14.839 ' s Ricardo' s day, I don' t know if it' 51 00:05:14.920 --> 00:05:23.360 s true I' ve been messing with politics, but now that I' 52 00:05:23.480 --> 00:05:24.439 m recording these audios and we' re exchanging impressions, I' m in 53 00:05:24.439 --> 00:05:27.079 that mood more prone to poetry. Poetry seems to me to be how music 54 00:05:27.160 --> 00:05:33.480 works at times, not at all. The connection with poetry our panente and 55 00:05:33.720 --> 00:05:39.720 that is why I want to continue with these forms of prayer and god- 56 00:05:40.199 --> 00:05:46.120 incráticos I called them And now I am going to read a poem by an 57 00:05:46.160 --> 00:05:50.360 Anti- Oqueño poet, The King Restrepo has been a Medellín director for many 58 00:05:50.360 --> 00:05:56.639 years of the magazine of the University of Antioquia, and this poem, which 59 00:05:57.720 --> 00:06:04.319 is a conversation of those who express gratitude, who thank the Universe, some 60 00:06:04.399 --> 00:06:10.839 God, something perhaps with that idea that there is hidden some moral order in 61 00:06:10.839 --> 00:06:15.439 the Universe. This poem of whom Restrepo is called in witch. No desire 62 00:06:15.480 --> 00:06:19.920 better than life itself, no dream more appropriate than reality itself, no event 63 00:06:20.439 --> 00:06:26.639 greater than a day in which nothing happens. A party, the most trivial 64 00:06:26.680 --> 00:06:33.240 of acts, the most distracted of kisses. Fable to wake up and know 65 00:06:33.360 --> 00:06:41.839 we' re alive. That thanks Richard for waking up and knowing we' 66 00:06:41.839 --> 00:06:46.279 re alive. It seems to me perhaps the most essential form of prayers. 67 00:06:46.480 --> 00:06:50.480 Te Rezar said another poet and I think I' ve already said it in 68 00:06:50.519 --> 00:06:57.199 some previous third- round episodes, that poetry is that last religion that men 69 00:06:57.279 --> 00:07:02.319 are left with. I also have a custom that I do not know if 70 00:07:02.399 --> 00:07:08.120 custom is the word, because so far it is inevitable. It seems like 71 00:07:08.160 --> 00:07:13.279 a better fate said and it is the mania of being the last to sleep 72 00:07:13.279 --> 00:07:18.000 in the house, that is, until they are not all asleep, breathing 73 00:07:18.079 --> 00:07:24.680 in peace and dreaming at best, good things. I can' t sleep 74 00:07:26.000 --> 00:07:30.720 It' s hard to sleep when the others are awake. It' s 75 00:07:30.920 --> 00:07:38.680 been quite a difference in my life to have a child that' s bigger 76 00:07:38.680 --> 00:07:41.240 than a late night. And all this I' m saying because the moment 77 00:07:41.279 --> 00:07:46.759 everyone' s asleep and there' s a silence that' s between moving 78 00:07:46.879 --> 00:07:51.319 and bordering anxiety, everyone' s asleep and all the lights are off and 79 00:07:51.720 --> 00:07:56.680 you feel like there' s only a few windows on in the neighborhood. 80 00:07:57.199 --> 00:08:01.759 To me comes that temptation to pray me, comes the temptation to ask God 81 00:08:01.959 --> 00:08:07.160 or God to exist or whatever he is watching for us or interested in us 82 00:08:07.560 --> 00:08:15.680 being well. It gives me the temptation to ask just for these people who 83 00:08:15.759 --> 00:08:18.160 fell asleep, for my wife, for my children, for my mother, 84 00:08:18.399 --> 00:08:26.399 who does not live with us, but is a presence for a long time. 85 00:08:26.439 --> 00:08:31.799 In another apartment where I lived, there was a huge tree that reached 86 00:08:31.840 --> 00:08:35.200 the floor where I lived, which was the tenth floor, and somehow, 87 00:08:35.519 --> 00:08:41.759 whenever I walked through that apartment at night, I saw that tree, it 88 00:08:41.840 --> 00:08:45.759 seemed to me that it could be a good place to pray, even an 89 00:08:45.759 --> 00:08:50.679 image to which to pray to and I would have ever fallen into that trap, 90 00:08:52.879 --> 00:08:56.200 without perhaps not cheating, but in that as I said at the beginning, 91 00:08:56.600 --> 00:08:58.519 in that temptation, I have prayed very rarely in the traditional form, 92 00:08:58.960 --> 00:09:03.480 in the way of repeating the most common prayers of the Catholic Church, which 93 00:09:05.039 --> 00:09:07.879 has been the predominant religion, the one that has predominated in our culture, 94 00:09:09.799 --> 00:09:13.200 and I always did it as a child. After the confession, by indication 95 00:09:13.320 --> 00:09:18.080 of the father or priest at the time. I' ve confessed three or 96 00:09:18.120 --> 00:09:26.440 four times, no more. The last one was more than fifty years ago 97 00:09:26.480 --> 00:09:33.080 that the father always told me the same thing happened Well, pray two of 98 00:09:33.159 --> 00:09:39.120 our parents so that that invisible presence with which we talked forgives him. It 99 00:09:39.159 --> 00:09:43.080 seemed to me since then I return and, I repeat, being still a 100 00:09:43.120 --> 00:09:48.919 child, a treatment too easy, a sort of almost utilitarian exchange, that, 101 00:09:48.559 --> 00:09:52.120 to pray without involving the soul, two our parents and to be at 102 00:09:52.120 --> 00:09:56.559 peace with the world. It seemed to me a sort of shortcut with which 103 00:09:56.600 --> 00:10:01.879 I was not calm, so much so that rc as indicated by the priest 104 00:10:01.960 --> 00:10:07.519 or father, that remorse for any venial sin I had committed at that time 105 00:10:07.519 --> 00:10:13.039 never disappeared. That' s not my favorite way to pray just repeat one 106 00:10:13.080 --> 00:10:18.360 of those common prayers. I' d rather do it this other way, 107 00:10:18.840 --> 00:10:22.200 with poetry, as I' ve been saying, Ricardo. On the other 108 00:10:22.200 --> 00:10:30.480 hand, my favorite word, among all words is prayer and I like the 109 00:10:30.799 --> 00:10:37.559 way it sounds, but I also like the idea of folding. I like 110 00:10:37.679 --> 00:10:45.679 the idea of recognizing that one cannot alone, the idea of asking for help, 111 00:10:48.159 --> 00:10:50.440 and the idea that one is, in some way, going to fiction 112 00:10:50.559 --> 00:10:56.759 to be okay. I mean, I see a direct link between prayer and 113 00:10:56.799 --> 00:11:05.240 poetry, between prayer and longing, and prayer and beauty. And then it 114 00:11:05.320 --> 00:11:16.600 is a word in which I also believe as well as we pray to make 115 00:11:16.679 --> 00:11:22.759 petitions or express gratitude with that presence that we believe listens to us, but 116 00:11:22.759 --> 00:11:30.240 it never answers us. Thus there are also ways to pray quieter contemplation or 117 00:11:30.320 --> 00:11:35.639 some meditation. I think of a person with his eyes closed in a church 118 00:11:35.639 --> 00:11:41.720 temple. He' s always caused me some admiration. That connection to divinity 119 00:11:41.759 --> 00:11:46.919 that I find hard work tending to have richard, an anxious mind, always 120 00:11:46.919 --> 00:11:56.799 anticipating future events difficult to quiet down. About four years ago, three years 121 00:11:56.799 --> 00:12:01.120 ago, the beginning of the pandemic. I' m the rector of the 122 00:12:01.120 --> 00:12:03.600 University of the Andes. I had to say so, a communion with a 123 00:12:03.679 --> 00:12:11.159 psychedelic substance guided by a wise priest. I' m going to say it 124 00:12:11.840 --> 00:12:22.360 this way too and then I could have an episode of contemplation, observe the 125 00:12:22.559 --> 00:12:33.120 world with amazement similar to that of those people I admire silent meditations in a 126 00:12:33.120 --> 00:12:35.200 temple connected with divinity. What I had left of that episode I summed up 127 00:12:35.240 --> 00:12:41.399 once with a phrase by Octavio Paz, not Christian piety, but that feeling 128 00:12:41.480 --> 00:12:48.120 of universal sympathy with everything that exists, that fraternity in impermanence with men, 129 00:12:48.159 --> 00:12:52.080 animals and plants, which is the best, which is the best that Buddhism 130 00:12:52.080 --> 00:12:56.240 has given us, a sort of instant viatitude that does not exclude irony or 131 00:12:56.279 --> 00:13:01.399 mean closing our eyes to the world and its horrors, the contemplation that does 132 00:13:03.200 --> 00:13:11.200 not deny the worst of reality, but that has some cosmic gratitude. There 133 00:13:11.240 --> 00:13:18.360 I see rich also a way, I do not know how to say it, 134 00:13:18.120 --> 00:13:26.120 an attractive way to pray the act of prayer. I recently found an 135 00:13:26.120 --> 00:13:31.080 idea about praying that interested me a lot. If I am not bad, 136 00:13:31.919 --> 00:13:39.480 it is in St Augustine and it is the idea that it is one who 137 00:13:39.480 --> 00:13:43.480 is listening to his prayers, his prayers. One, in other words, 138 00:13:45.440 --> 00:13:52.240 could never complain that his prayers were not heard, for it is one who 139 00:13:52.279 --> 00:14:01.480 is first listening to them and one who is repeating them over and over again 140 00:14:01.519 --> 00:14:09.919 to somehow mentalize, counsel one' s hope and counsel one' s life. 141 00:14:09.879 --> 00:14:16.799 That idea seemed very satisfying to me, especially for people like me who 142 00:14:16.919 --> 00:14:20.960 believe in everything I can easily believe in God, I repeat, not as 143 00:14:22.039 --> 00:14:26.440 a figure, not as a person, but I can believe. I am 144 00:14:26.480 --> 00:14:33.360 made educated to expect things to make sense and to go through something and for 145 00:14:33.360 --> 00:14:41.600 something, but also when one doubts, for it is not bad the idea 146 00:14:41.360 --> 00:14:46.519 that one is addressing oneself to his prayers, to the part of one who 147 00:14:46.639 --> 00:14:56.039 can accompany, who can find the strength, which can dust off, can 148 00:14:56.080 --> 00:15:03.360 be the desire to live and the desire to correct and the desire to overcome. 149 00:15:03.840 --> 00:15:11.519 That idea of those who are addressed to the prayers and who start by 150 00:15:11.759 --> 00:15:18.000 being yourself, I think, seems to me a relief. I' m 151 00:15:18.080 --> 00:15:20.679 going to finish Ricardo, this podcast, a, this episode is probably going 152 00:15:20.720 --> 00:15:24.679 to be a little shorter than the others in the midst of the affluences of 153 00:15:24.679 --> 00:15:30.559 these days, but it' s been for me a moment of concentration, 154 00:15:31.039 --> 00:15:33.159 also of connecting with poetry. And I' m going to end up in 155 00:15:33.240 --> 00:15:37.879 that tone with a prayer of prayer, a prayer of gratitude. I appeal 156 00:15:39.320 --> 00:15:46.039 to the Spanish poet Juan Vicente Piqueras. This poem is called Thank you and 157 00:15:46.159 --> 00:15:52.639 with the term Oh, Gods, deep, Gods, High Gods? Whether 158 00:15:52.759 --> 00:15:56.559 or not you are, it doesn' t matter. You saw us for 159 00:15:56.720 --> 00:16:00.039 a moment in this life, a brief day, on fire, blind, 160 00:16:00.519 --> 00:16:06.759 luminous to embrace, the air burns with love, enjoy, suffer, sing, 161 00:16:07.360 --> 00:16:11.039 know, say, learn to tell you. Simply, thank you. 162 00:16:11.240 --> 00:16:18.919 This poem Ricardo seems to me a prayer of gratitude and with that I would 163 00:16:18.960 --> 00:16:22.720 like to finish my part of this conversation. I send you a hug and 164 00:16:22.840 --> 00:16:32.360 more holy teelice. I remember praying on different occasions. I have never been 165 00:16:32.679 --> 00:16:41.840 very religious in the sense of going to Masses and believing in those solutions, 166 00:16:41.759 --> 00:16:47.279 or assuming Catholicism, even though it has been, because my education at school, 167 00:16:47.919 --> 00:16:52.879 my parents were very Catholic at one time met in Catholic groups and yet, 168 00:16:52.120 --> 00:17:00.240 when I came to the film of that family, they were no longer 169 00:17:00.279 --> 00:17:08.519 in those groups and had a very personal relationship with the spiritual. They were 170 00:17:08.519 --> 00:17:11.440 no longer to go to Mass, they were no longer to go to groups, 171 00:17:11.599 --> 00:17:21.319 they were no longer to walk with religious people, even though they had 172 00:17:21.319 --> 00:17:25.480 both studied, he in the Saint Bartholomew and she in the Sanfason, that 173 00:17:25.519 --> 00:17:29.319 is, in religious schools. But when I came to the film, that 174 00:17:29.359 --> 00:17:33.759 had already been overcome and they had their relationship with God, which they did 175 00:17:33.880 --> 00:17:37.079 not broadcast or comment on or ever. None of my parents told me to 176 00:17:37.079 --> 00:17:41.839 believe or not to believe. Many times, even my dad was physical, 177 00:17:42.640 --> 00:17:48.720 he had his own theories about what God could do, and my mom even 178 00:17:48.839 --> 00:17:55.279 came many times to question existence in front of us, that is, I 179 00:17:55.960 --> 00:17:59.680 have never had the pressure to believe. And yet, there is something beyond 180 00:17:59.759 --> 00:18:06.599 that I remember from a very young age that makes me feel, for example, 181 00:18:06.920 --> 00:18:10.720 when everyone is asleep or, for example, when I' m alone 182 00:18:10.759 --> 00:18:17.720 there' s a kind of veil, there' s a kind of climate 183 00:18:17.720 --> 00:18:22.480 that' s in favor or that' s there watching what happens. And 184 00:18:22.599 --> 00:18:30.680 so, since I was a child, I have gone to pray not the 185 00:18:30.799 --> 00:18:36.640 prayers taught us by our Father, which, in any case, seems to 186 00:18:36.680 --> 00:18:41.359 me a very touching prayer. The sound of it, the mere fact that 187 00:18:41.440 --> 00:18:48.559 it is called our Father, moves me into a word that usually appears to 188 00:18:48.599 --> 00:18:56.559 me because it is also a word followed by a father of ours, a 189 00:18:56.559 --> 00:18:59.680 single word, but I asked whatever or whatever God was, that everyone be 190 00:18:59.680 --> 00:19:03.279 well. I remember, praying my parents were okay. Then, pray, 191 00:19:03.960 --> 00:19:10.039 at a very curious moment, full of love with my dad, pray that 192 00:19:10.079 --> 00:19:12.960 I would never be taller than him, because I was ashamed to be taller 193 00:19:14.000 --> 00:19:21.880 than the person I adored. Then pray for my dad to live many years 194 00:19:22.680 --> 00:19:32.599 when he got sick and he' s always praying for distressing moments, asking 195 00:19:32.680 --> 00:19:38.920 that especially the people I have around me stay well. Always choose a good 196 00:19:40.039 --> 00:19:45.480 time, always choose a good conversation. Third, turn the podcast subscribe now 197 00:19:45.640 --> 00:19:52.119 and listen to it every week on your favorite platform, a podcast produced by 198 00:19:52.119 --> 00:20:00.000 the speaker. The newsroom follows us as it throws the newsroom of that in social networks