What is krack alac in fellow thermonuclear a efforts. I am Dan Favalley,
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to Celtics Sixers. Okay, this series we I think we both picked the
Celtics in five that was operating under the assumption that EMBID might miss more than
one game, and even when we factored in and be playing more. I
think we said, oh Celtics in six. What are your overarching thoughts about
this series? Is we get ready for game six. I'm gonna try not
to dump on the team that's losing now for a change of pace. And
I think from the Sixers perspective, my overarching thoughts are surprised that they got
They've got two phenomenal James Harden games, Like he basically won them, two
games, one of which did not feature Joel Embid in the lineup. So
that's not that's it's like a little bit of a stretch to say, well,
that's found money because Harden, you know, for all his playoff whatever
throughout his career, he's just like he's Pele of that he can get you
forty and just win you a game. That's that. We spent like seven
straight seasons with the Rockets when he was really at his peak. So like,
yeah, once in a while, those games are gonna happen. So
impressed by Harden, I think again, I keep looking for these things to
say, well, we're having a different conversation if and on now on game
five, right where are we? It's three the most recent game Boston shot
three for thirteen on wide open threes. That's six plus feet a distance between
them and the shooter and the defender, and four or fifteen on open which
is like four to six feet. So yet again just like if the Celtics
make a couple more threes because I was a single digit game, then like
what are we talking about? So I do think there's reasons to be critical
of the Celtics. Their offense comes up sometimes. They have not had a
good answer for Harden. They're letting him bead shoot the mid rate jumpers that
he wants too. But like you know, make some shots and things are
a lot different if like Horford in particular, like the first half, like
Horford was getting good looks and just can't hit anything, and you know that's
a big deal because then MBID doesn't have to you know, then the Sixers
can pack the pain and it just makes things harder and it makes an offense
that is prone to kind of gear grinding like fall into that more quickly and
struggle to get out of it. But the Sixers has been good, like
Tyres Maxie finally got loose, getting him the ball on the move. Is
is just like that's hard to handle if you have decent space. Yeah,
so I don't know. I'm mostly crediting the Sixers, and maybe that's just
because I didn't think that they had much of a chance in this series.
So it's like more surprising to me. But yeah, I don't know.
Do you feel differently, do you think this is a Sixers success or or
Celtics failure. It's a It's a Sixers success for sure. I mean they
even Daniel House, who's apparently just a tank game comes in midway through the
playoffs and she's just like dominant. He was good for them, And then
you mention start respecting Tobias Harris had a great game just rebounding. I thought
he provided some tough one on one defense and then he's gotten better at making
quick decisions with the ball, but he gave you more of a scoring punch.
And Hi chat Stefan story. It's being beaten by Harden without a first
step, and like, look, Harden still found ways to just dice up
the Celtics in the middle of the floor. And I think that's the biggest
criticism. And people were lighting into Joe Mazoula for this, and I saw
a half court hoops. On Twitter during Game five, it said the Celtics
are just letting the Sixers go to that left side pick and roll like to
their left with and beat and hardened. Harden wants to go to his left
and if you're gonna be and drop against them, beat and give him the
middle of the floor. He's been banging in those jumpers, and so what
is the you know, what is the adjustment? And I wonder maybe Horford
can't play this one anymore. And look, Robert Williams a third certainly can't
play this way anymore. He's been just speaking of diced uff. It feels
like he's just been relegated to obscurity in this series. I like, can
you just go and play higher now and put because when you're looking at who's
behind Al Horford, even if he gets beat, like you're gonna be helping.
There's sometimes it's PJ. Tucker and then like a Daniel House on the
same side of the floor, And even if it's Maxie on that side of
the floor, like you can live with someone helping off PJ. Tucker in
the corner because there might be times where he doesn't shoot and I know he's
been on so many good teams for a reason. He's an NBA champion for
a reason. But I think the Celtics they seem very hesitant to throw to
it the ball unless it's ever ebid and like right at the point where it's
like we'll maybe try something different there, like I like, so that might
feel more like a failure. And I'll also say their offensive process. For
a team that was so elite offensively statistically during the regular season, there's just
so much variance in their offensive process. And I feel like I've said it
probably too many times on this podcast, but like they'll go through stretches where
Okay, yeah, they're not really committing any turnovers there, the ball might
be moving, they're taking higher percentage shots, and then it's just they'll be
stretches where oh, they're committing a ship ton of turnovers and they're taking early
contested looks in the shot clock that make no sense, and Joan Brown is
deviating, Jason Tatum looks super passive or is settling, And I think he
adjusted well. He was the one member of the Southlicks, so I think
for the most part, adjusted well. As Game five went on, where
he started attacking more and then he had the jumper going for a little bit,
and like you said, they did miss a lot of high quality looks,
and I like, like I said, I do think there's probably some
more. I think they could stand to be more aggressive defensively against Joel Embiid
and beats Joel Embiad and James Harden specifically. Maybe we're then killing them if
they do that, and then they're getting carved up by Tyrese Maxie or PJ.
Tucker from the corners. But I think it's easier to live with that
then if we know hard and especially if Harden's gonna take mid range jays,
which was that was kind of a thing at the start of the season and
then it vanished into nothing and now it's just the thing again and it's working.
Doc Rivers. Someone asked me on the radio, and these radio hits
are so hard because one, I'm not even calling out any producers. I
know your job is hard, but like sometimes they're like, hey, can
you come on in twenty minutes and it's like, well no, and that
stresses me out what I have to say no. But two, you never
really know what you're gonna talk about, so they'll ask these questions, And
one of my questions was, this was before Game five, is is Joe
Missoula being thoroughly outcoached in this series? And I was like, well,
fuck, like that's not something I'm really giving a ton of thought too.
And I was like, well, maybe so like as this the analysis that
you come for is I'm just stuttering on there like I don't fucking know,
like he probably has. When you look at Doc Rivers, is the Daniel
House pushing that button giving beball Paul? Like some of the Beball Paul minutes
have just been an actual shot of adrenaline. Who was in Who got in
foul trouble? Was it PJ? Tucker early on in Game five got in
foul trouble? But that you're throwing the Anthony Melton and the way that they've
used him defensively through this series, I think that he's done a good job
of that. I think this is more of a Sixers success story in part
though, because it's exposed a lot of just I don't even know if it's
flaws, but question marks about the Celtics, where I don't know if it's
simply just a matter of play more aggressive against the Joel embiid pick and roll,
hit more shots, because I do think, you know, to get
like big picture and they might win this series. It's just like, is
there something weird now going on with the like how do we view this center
rotation moving forward? Which is Al Horford's getting older, Robert Williams a third.
I don't know if he's still injured or if this is just a bad
matchup for him, but that's gonna have to be something they look reflect on
over the off season or if not beating into Game six. Yeah, I
really thought that the Celtics would have be able to at least, you know,
have a little success playing Williams and Horford together and just having Williams guard
PJ. Tucker. That has not happened the other So as I was trying
to imagine myself in your shoes getting asked that question about Missouli getting out coached,
and I think what I would have said is the Nets kind of showed
you with way worse personnel, Like how you could do a decent job of
making sure and bad didn't get you know, didn't get loose, which is
you just double them relentlessly all the time and make the other sixers, you
know, try to score. And the Nets lost that series for several reasons,
but it wasn't necessarily because they had a bad defensive plan. Now,
like I'm not saying the Celtics, the obvious answer was, let's just do
what the Nets did, let's double all the time, because the Celtics just
don't play that way. And it's you know, if you imagine the counterfactual
of Boston coming up with this totally new defensive scheme where they double all the
time and they trap and stuff, which they never do, and then they
lose the series, then it's like, what is Joe Missoula doing. But
at least, like the Nets showed you a way to try to handle and
bead and you know, maybe that would have just meant Harden had more than
two forty plus point games. But I think I think there was something to
take away from that first round series that the Celtics have not really gone to
very much. It may be a little late in the game to try that.
I think more than likely Boston is just gonna, you know, rely
on making more shots and kind of sticking to the sticking to the plan.
But if you know, they're out of time, now because you can't lose
again, so maybe it's a halftime adjustment. It's it's hard to say,
what have you thought of you mentioned Tatum? What do you? What have
you so? Like every year we do this thing where you know, as
Tatum finally you know at that tier one level of just like if you have
him, it's he can be the best player on a title team because he's
shot thirty point six percent from three forty five and a half percent overall,
he's averaging like twenty six, eleven and five, has had really good stretches.
Do you feel like Tatum has had a good series? Like a decent
series, an encouraging series, a discouraging series like what because he's one of
the most confounding, really good players in the league, because we're just never
quite sure if he's all the way at the level we think he can get
to, and we just kind of keep waiting. What has this series,
if anything, kind of made you think or reevaluate about Tatum. I don't
think it's made me reevaluate Tatum at all? Is that a fair thing to
say? It's just if I think if you have problems with the way that
he settles or carries himself on offense sometimes I don't think that's necessarily changed,
but you've also seen I think, at least in denser pockets, that this
is someone who can be ultra aggressive if he doesn't have the jumper falling or
the three pointer falling, where maybe you couldn't say that in years past.
I think the bigger and I don't know if it's an indictment but doesn't speak
to this team structure, is that you're still not going to Yeah, okay,
I think in this series he's tied for the lead in his his per
game with Marcus Smart, but both of them are averaging. They have three
different guys averaging four or more, Like you don't have that Marcus Smart is
the best passer on your team. And that's maybe fine. If Jason Tatum
as he reached like the levels of like Kevin Durant or Kawhi Leonard as a
passer, I think he's probably closer to there than not. But like I
think, really the main issue might be sometimes it's too easy for him to
fade away because he's not the one that you're primarily going to use as the
table setter. And I don't know if that's an indictment of his game or
the roster structure. Does he need to be the one that's going to demand
to operate on the ball more and run those sets like I just and then
it seems like there are other players on the team wore Jalen Brown will feel
like he gets frustrated, like all of a sudden, deviating from the game
plan, he's hoisting up a contested jumper, or he has one of those
nights where he just goes like three of eight from the foul line. I
think he wasn't in Game five, which is not it's a typical, but
it's not completely unusual for him. He's got that in him every once in
a while. I think if anything this series has for me is reinforced the
variable, the weird variability of the Celtics where you look at their talent one
through seven, let's say, and you're kind of left thinking, why the
fuck are they trying to play Peyton Pritchard right now? Like Joe Bizila was
clearly searching. And it's just to be in that situation when you have those
top seven guys, it's weird. Yeah, right, It's just my camera's
shaking because I'm so like, it's hard to put a finger on. That's
why I was asking about Tatum is it's kind of like in a series that's
gone away, you know, that's getting away from you. If you're the
Celtics, it's kind of like, well, maybe our best player just didn't
play well enough. And I guess like thirty thirty percent from three is not
great if you're if you're very much a maker miss team. But I don't
come away from this thinking ill of Tatum either, Like I think he's been
good enough, and I think Brown mostly has been good enough too. I
guess I'm just surprised that I don't know, I just felt like the Sixers
had, you know, there were more holes to poke in the Sixers coming
in, and I felt like, you know, Embiad's injury was going to
be a big issue. And I guess maybe it's really just like I didn't
think Harden had even you know, one game in him, like the two
that he's played so far. So I guess maybe that's where it comes down
to. Yeah, I don't know, it's been amazing to see hard and
have these games. So Rome eighty one eighty, whose podcast I was on
this past week the Devil's Den podcast. I think it is. I don't
want to get that wrong. I apologize said this in our discords. I'm
gonna read it like he said it while we were recording. I've always thought
coaching matter a lot. I know Dan feels the opposite, but the fact
that the Sixers have just been able to run the same harden and bead pick
and roll over and over shows the lack of adjustments. I also do think
over history, you see coaches take over a team and that team take a
massive leap with the same personnel. The Warriors would be an example. Well,
clearly Missoula didn't hurt the Celtics during the regular season. He seems to
be in over his head here. The playoffs probably maximize the importance of a
coach, since constant, on the fly adjustments are required. And I read
this by saying one and it's totally fair to think that way. And two
is the person, the figure, the stakeholder in this series that you're most
disappointed or most responsible for where the Celtics are? Is it Joe Missoula event?
Because we just said, are you gonna We're not gonna ascribe the line
share of the blame to Jason take it's as a team. I want to
make that you said, like you point out of the top of this,
they missed a lot of shots that they normally make, some of them super
high quality. But if you had to just point is it okay? Well,
Al Horfords looked really weird or bad on offense at points. But then
I feel like for me, it might just be more the defensive principles that
the Celtics are spousing here or the refusal to or stubbornness to deviate from them
or change them, and that I think would fall on Missoula. I might
be all over. You can taught me that it's our W three's fault for
not being more eminently playable. No, I don't know. I mean that's
interesting. I would say that, like the Harden and Beid pick and roll
is one of the hardest actions to defend in the league, like full stop.
That's just right there with Deven Booker existing. Yeah, right up there
with Devin Booker being alive and shooting basketballs. Yeah, I know it is
fair to say that, and we look we just I just praised Darvin ham
for making a key adjustment that short circuited something that the Warriors if probably thought
like we got it now, like this is gonna work. We got them,
and then no, you don't in the second half, like in game
adjustment. That that's a real thing. I think, you know, Eric
Spolster is going to have several hagiographies written about him after this this postseason two.
Uh, and you just sort of can't praise those guys without I guess,
you know, doing the opposite for the coaches that don't seem to be
making the adjustments. By the way, with the roster in Boston, that
like, you could do a lot of different stuff with that personnel. You've
got a lot of good like backcourt defenders, you have switchable forwards, you
got Williams. You could roll out Grant Williams plus Caucasians like they did at
the end of why not get creative. I wouldn't go with that strategy,
but I would not. That was just they actually they cut into the lead
when the game sixers wouldn't see it coming, they wouldn't expect it. That's
not on the white board and the that's not in the locker room, the
all transparent lineup. Fair point. Fair point by Rome I can't. I
can't get I can't get a too critical of that one of the teams that
are well. Actually, we need to get to the next series. I'll
do that to wrap up. Do you want to move on to uh Nuggets
war Nuggets Warriors? Wow? No, yes, I would love to move
on to Nuggets Warriors in in a week or so. Do you want to
move on to Nuggets Sons? Yeah? Is this so many? Good?
Because I have a very basic question for you. Is this series as simple
as Devin Booker has to be superhuman? Otherwise the Nuggets are just too good?
That feels like my takeaway so far? Yes, because good pun.
You know what the other issue is too is they need both Devin Booker and
Kevin Durant to be superhuman. And like Kevin Durant's only been Kevin Durant in
like two of these five games, maybe three of these five. He he
looked, he did not look good, the same thing, did not look
right. No, to start, he looked awful, and then he had
that stretch. Was all right, He's fine, and then it was afterwards
it was, oh no, this was not him. Is he tired?
He's been playing a crap ton of minutes. But Devin Booker has a rough
game relatively, and I think this game, more so than the first two
games, reinforced why the Denver Nuggets should just be titled favorites and probably should
have been entering the playoffs. We I even said that I understand why people
would want to default to the Bucks in general, Like at points, no,
it should have been the Nuggets. They They're starting lineup has won this
series by forty points, so if they lose, it's and like even when
you have go ahead, No, I was gonna say, which like that
that starting lineup was awesome all year, Like that's just more than any other
team, you get back to what you're saying, but more than any other
teams have sort of given us what we expected minus like they don't have any
defensive problems like I expected defensive problems, but otherwise, like all the guys
you needed to play well have played well. Generally speaking, Yokah is an
unsolvable problem, like as there's just like the Nuggets have performed up to expectations
the most consistently of any playoff team so far, I think is that you
know what I mean? Does that seem fair to say? Yeah, and
look it's even. Look they pulled the thread where it's a Bruce Brown and
for KCP, that lineup is a plus eighteen in the minutes they played this
series. Now it comes with the caveat of Phoenix just does not have a
real supporting cast right now. And I want to let me continue to focus
on the Nuggets though. Yeah, Nicole Yokich, all time great, just
breaking the brain. And when he's you know, he looked kind of he
didn't start game five good. I'm with you. I trip up over like
these game numbers, like he kind of sensed as it went on, especially
when Jamal Murray felt like he was actively detrimental offensively for much of the first
half, Like he kind of sense he just knows how to read the game
of well what do I need to do where it's like if I need to
be ultra aggressive as a score, it doesn't matter if I'm missing all these
tip bunnies at the rim. And then he's just gonna go when he's gonna
drop a trillion points, knockdown jumpers, hit these shots off the dribble.
He's just an incredible basketball player. What I think he is not. He
has impressed me He is by far the least shocking thing insofar as he should
even be shocked about what the Nuggets have done. And I think probably the
biggest surprise to me it has been Michael Porter's Michael Porter Junior's defense, Right,
he finally has. He had a really good offensive game in Game five,
but you look at what he did defensively, and I tweeted this out.
I think that was probably the most complete defensive performance of his career,
playoffs, regular season, whatever you had rebounding, giving contest with length,
his length, bather Devin Booker a little bit. He was matched up against
Kevin Durant a little bit without getting absolutely roasted. He was really contesting passes.
He came in for his steel, I think on an entry pass to
DeAndre Ayton. Yeah, it was a gamble. It was a smart gamble,
and he just was. He wasn't everywhere. He was just reliable,
and that's what you need when you're gonna look at some of the defensive coverages
where if you're gonna bring Nikola Yokas up really high, unique guys behind him
were reliable. He's been that guy for most of this series, and that
changes the entire calculus of what the Nuggets can be if he is this player,
Because yes, there's I saw someone. I wish I could remember who
it was in the tweet, but I laughed hysterically at it. Where it's
like Michael Porter Jr. Is basically the living embodiment of what you become when
your dad owns a Mercedes dealership. And there's some truth to that on offense,
but like he's gotten a little bit better finding his own stuff on offense.
He's also missed some really high quality looks in this series. But if
he's going to be like impactful consistently on defense, I'm not talking about a
net positive. I'm not even saying a net even which he's been probably both
in this series, just not this demonstrative negative someone you can rely on that
like we have to. It's not just yes, the Nuggets could win the
title this season, when need to start talking about like who's going to dethrone
them next season? That changes everything about Denver. I think watching them,
and there are people who are more educated in this, and I would be.
I thought they did a good job of varying up their defensive coverages.
I like that they put more Aaron Gordon. On Devin Booker, we saw
more of I think that makes life more difficult on Devin Booker. We saw
in Game four there was weird specifically maybe towards the latter half of the game,
there was a lot of helping off of kd Onto Devin Booker or maybe
vice versus Wild and the Sun's by the way there there's a lot of like
reels out there of Durant being very open and not getting the basketball. So
some of that's on Phoenix, but continue and I don't know if, like,
do you need to stack the floor with Kevin Durant and Devin Booker on
the same side more to put the Nuggets in that predicament. But again,
I want to like to have all this happening. And then got Boy in
the chat saying also jam Moore, Murray's under performing. He could easily get
ten plus more points than Yoke Yoke if he wakes up. The league is
in trouble. I think they might have found something where it's let's set more
high ball screens for him. We saw that in the second half against Phoenix.
This is unique because the Phoenix is personnel, but the Nuggets to beat
here, even against the Sun's team as shallow, missing CP three despite Jamal
Murray aside from having though he had the Electric Game one and really just hasn't
been like that since that's huge for them and Bruce Brown, My god,
you talk. I tweeted this as well. I want to live entirely in
the moment, but I can't help. They'll worry about him pricing himself out
of Denver. He's priced himself out of Denver because Denver has non bird rights
on him. And I think the most like an offer him is like seven
point seven million starting salary. Like that, ain't it's correctly If I'm wrong,
I'm pretty sure that that's not going to cut it. I'm wondering if
it changes because of the scale the taxpayers mid level. But if it's not,
they can offer him the taxpayers mid level then, which will be more
than that's seven point seven million. I think, yeah, well, like
that's their max number. It's the taxpayer mid level, one hundred twenty percent
of his current salary. The rim pressure he provides, he's been very sturdy
defensively at points. I think KCP. Look, Devin Booker has kind of
roasted him, but like KCP gives you someone who's just at least semi competent
on the idea of Cacypond Devin Booker, I want you on every playoff roster
I ever have. Like what he's kind of like the modern Danny Green a
little bit, where like he's just gonna make forty some odd percent of his
threes. He's gonna defend capably. He can. You know, he's not
just a three point shooter. He you know, he can cut to the
bat like KCP is, Like it's outside of like stars is. Just put
him on every if he's a starter for you, you you are not precluded
from winning a title like he can absolutely. I mean he's done it.
So it's not like that's a great revelation, but like he's super underrated because
he just doesn't take anything off the table and keep showing up now lately in
this portion of his career on really really good teams with title aspirations. Anyway,
if he continues to be this valuable, the Nuggets maybe just maybe might
trade him for a ball dominant point guard who yeah, only if you also
trade Kyle Kuzma with That's that's that's really that's how you have to do it
there. I'm just everyone was wrong about the Denver Nuggets, even this podcast
that was high on them. I picked them to win the title. And
even I was wrong about the Never Nuggets because I thought there were more defensive
questions because of how they closed the regular season specifically, it turns out maybe
they really worked. Even in the chat Walmart Danny Green for is he Walmart?
I don't know. I mean he's Danny might be like the best transition
guard defender of all time. So Danny Green is the ideal that you aspire
to to be called anything. Any version of Danny Green is a high compliment
for a role playing guard. Let's just let's call it that. So,
yeah, everyone was wrong about the Denver Nuggets. I think they are probably
the odds on title favorites, but they should have been ever since the like
after it was clear during the regular season. It's like they should have been
the title favorites to me, and maybe the Lakers or Warriors would bring them
back down the earth and the next round or whoever they faced in the finals.
I had this team winning in six. I don't know how great I
feel about that. Role players tend to shoot better at home and I definitely
want to get into the Suns a little bit. I'm even in the impression
the Nuggets everyone was wrong these It's not just that their title favorites now they
should have been the long standing title favorites. You know, what's reassuring to
me is that Christian Brown is going to be really good if he ever figures
that out on offense, and he's a great defender that you can put on
Kevin Durant. Sometimes that's very reassuring. We've all we do is talk about
how the playoffs are different. The playoffs are different, at least in this
one regard where the Nuggets look so good after being the top seed in the
West. It's like, okay, good, now we can actually start looking
at the regular season as somewhat predictive. This is an outlier, I think,
but it's like it's it's a little it's nice and the other We'll have
to talk about this later because there are so many like uncertainties surrounding it.
But wouldn't it be awesome if we got Yokich and Embiid in the finals and
then we could say, like, well, you know, because you whether
it's Janis or Steph or Kawhi or Durant. You say, like, yeah,
those two guys have the best seasons, but they're not the best play
years because in the playoffs it's different. If you got yokichen Embid in the
finals, you're gonna have somebody with a very recent MVP that you could also
then say, oh, he's also the best player. It's not just that
he had the most valuable season. I'm really looking forward to that possibility because
the way it would simplify a lot of the debates we have to have,
because if you win a title and your MVP like no notes, there's nothing
else to be to argue about with that, and that rarely happens. But
I'm looking forward to that hypothetical that the discourse of that series will be terrible,
and I'm gonna tell you right now, I don't. I don't think
that in favor of EMBIID. I think that that would be a series that
kind of exposes not how wrong the voters were about EMBIID, but how wrong
people were about Yoki. Yeah, and some people you can kind of tell.
And this isn't an insult. I think there are casual basketball fans were
super important. I hope a lot of them listen to this podcast when they
care about the NBA during the three months of the year that it's postseasons active.
You can kind of tell like when people are just sort of seeing Nakolea
Yokiches like for the first time in a regular or basis and there, and
it could be like radio hosts and podcasters, they's like, look at what
he's doing. Every's like he can shoot like this and finish like this.
He's like he always looks discombobulated when he's going up with those shots on the
run, and they just always go in. Uh. I don't know who
if we had this conversation or where we landed on it, but it's been
out there of like who's under the most pressure in the playoffs or what are
what are the stakes for certain guys, and like yokich came up, I
think, but like in a positive way. Now, if the Nuggets,
you know, close this out, make the finals after you know, whoever
they see in the conference finals, probably the Lakers, and in that case,
Yokicher just has to go through Anthony Davis, which would be you know,
add to the legend, like we're gonna look at this, you know,
half decade or so run of his with you know, two MVPs,
maybe should have had a third, very debatable, and then wins a title
and it's like, huh, Yokis was the best player in the league,
like all along, and when we just now like we have to acknowledge that
of the massive chunk of you know, NBA history, that dude was the
best there was. Like, that's that's on the table right now. There's
I try not to have rooting interests outside of the Woebegone Nicks, but there's
a part of me that really wants the Nuggets to win the titles. Well,
I can just have the most insufferable victory lub possible podcast should be rooting
against. I want that for you too, because that's what I mean.
You're on it. You you you had the Nuggets, and I just I
want I like the idea of Yokis being regarded as like just undisputed he this
is the best player, because I think it would be a good thing if
a guy who just like makes every you know, does the right thing offensively
all the time in like the past, shoot dribble decision, Tree like plays
kind of perfect offensive basketball and is creative and doesn't do it with like jumping
out of the gym or running past guys. I'm excited for a world where
we have like Yokich emulators, you know, where it's like everybody wanted to
shoot thirty five footers because the steph And now we might just have like everybody
trying to make really some passes and shoot, yeah, shooting off their wrong
foot. Like I'm here for the next for the generation of kids that try
to play like Yokich. That sounds like, and I hope they all have
the same body types. Yeah, he's really a trailblazer. Anyone can play
basketball. Look at this guy, dude. We want to move on to
the son's here, and we actually have a good comment which I think is
a leaping off point and I'll hijack this part of the conversation too, but
Stephan says, I think sons need to spend more pick and roll. Now
here's Devin Booker spectacular, and I have some uncomfortable questions that we're gonna need
to ask for other people who are not Devin Booker. They're uncomfortable probably for
us, but they could spend more pick and roll. I think we're kind
of seeing the limitations on a Suns team that doesn't have CP three. And
everyone talked a lot about or the idea of CP three. Everyone talked a
lot about how much faster they're playing, and they are playing faster, And
this is just like through the first two games, their average offensive possession time
was fifteen point one seconds. Now it's down to thirteen point eight. They're
scoring one point one nine points per offensive possession while their offense is faster compared
to one point one six. It's not this huge different difference. And so
anyone who thought they were better off without CP three when seeing how fucking shallow
they are, was out of their mind. But I think we've also,
at least through the first two games, I think we saw more of the
impact on how much pick and roll can you actually run without CP three.
There Devin Booker is, he's the second best passer on the team, but
he's a fantastic passer. I don't know if you can spam pick and rolls,
especially when the Nuggets aren't going to play drop as readily against him like
they would CP three, And that's why I think you need CP three.
And then we also saw the impact as I stammered through before and then finished
that thought on DeAndre Aytan through not so much Game five, but like games
three and four where we sat, his minutes were down too. I think
at least one of those he was in foul trouble if I'm mistaken, like
he's not getting as many shots like that's kind of when you don't have CP
three running those actions. See me there. He's important to this team.
So whether he played, he's in game six, whether he starts, if
he does, he's coming off the bench. And the fact that you know
the Nuggets are going to inherently drop against him because they want him. They're
gonna be okay with his mid range jumpers. That's an elm of your offense
you need in part, in large part, not just because Kevin Rantsman all
over the place, your bench is talk about all over the place. Landry
Shammitt comes up huge in game four, Game five, Josh Coo, he's
so bad that Landry Shammitt is starting in the third quarter. He I thought
he did a better job than people credit. I thought the Nuggets just made
better offensive adjustments. Where if you're gonna set higher on ball screens, those
are a lot harder for Landry Shammit to navigate and if he's trying to defend
Jamal Murray away from the ball or just straight up but you can't count.
It's you're trying to Oh, do we need to play more Terrence Ross?
Do we need to play more TJ. Warren. I think the one one
of the adjustments the Suns can make is I think Tory Craig needs to actually
play, and he tweeted out something cryptic. I think after getting basically another
dm P outside of garbage time, I like, I just don't know if
they have the firepower like or depth beyond. And you could say we over
romanticize depth in the playoffs when it's when you're so reliant on these two guys
need to be superhuman every single night, every single possession, for forty plus
minutes a game, your margin for error does not exist. And I think
that's just what this series boils down to. For the Sun's so far.
And look, let's not forget when CP three got injured. I'm not saying
this entire series will be different. Phoenix was up eight in Game two at
the time. This could the tenor of this series could look completely different if
he never gets injured. Injuries are part of it, especially when it comes
to CP three. The Nuggets might have come back anyway, they've been great,
but this is they're a team where they haven't even lost yet. They're
headed home and they have Devin Booker and Kevin Durant and Devin Booker has been
the single most valuable player in these playoffs, I think, just because of
what he's brought defensively, maybe not so much in Game five. Like,
I'm already thinking about their off season because I feel like they desperately need to
flesh out like the like at this point, like, let's just be real,
they need to flesh out the third, fourth, fifth, sixth,
and seven spots on this because it's what are you like? C P three
has that partial guarantee and it's half like basically half his salary. You're gonna
keep it. But I'm like, is there just a world where they waive
him, stretch it, have that five whatever million dollars in the books for
three years, and then try to give themselves flexibility on the trade market.
But hey, that rests on DeAndre Ayton having actual trade value and does he
Lets let's tie that together. So one of one of the most I think
on our part, certainly my part overlooked or sort of I don't know,
misjudged angles of this postseason was Phoenix's lack of depth because I've just kind of
viewed it as they have Devin Booker and Kevin duran like, I don't really
care that that's enough. You know. Any theory of the Sun's making a
conference finals or finals was based on you can't do anything with those two guys
that you'd you know, have some traffic cones out there. Those two guys
are just gonna be too hard to guard. That was wrong. So the
CP three injury, I think it's not just about him specifically, it's about
you just took a guy that you really could play out of the picture,
and that exacerbates the lack of depth everywhere else. To get to the pick
and roll spamming. I think that in a way is going to play into
Denver's hands, because I think they should be more than happy to just have
Yokichen whoever is guarding Booker just double him, you know, and somebody stay
hugged up on Durant wherever he is. And then you say deandret and you
need to beat us in space and maybe he'll hit like a million nine foot
push shots, right, but he shot five free throws, fading hooks,
five free throws in one hundred and forty eight minutes, two for five from
the foul line free, and he's averaging ten points a game. Like if
DeAndre Ayten beats you, like, that's that's a shake, shake his hand
type of thing, Like that's just that plays exact. The Nuggets could not
be happier because then you don't have to you don't have to drop, you
don't have to do anything. You just get the ball out of Booker's hands,
don't let Durant touch it, and let Aten be the decision maker or
score. Like that's the Suns cannot survive that way. There's no chance,
especially with some of the poor shooting they've gotten from the other guys they've tried
to throw out there on the wings. So that's a depth issue too.
I just think like as far as the off season goes, you got to
try to trade Eighten, and the CP three decision really is a decision because
you've got to find you have to turn certainly Eighten's money into two guys.
You just you just need that to be two guys you can you can go
find a center that's gonna average ten and eight in a playoff series, which
is what Aiten is giving them, I know, like points and rebounds per
game or you know, we try to do better than that in our analysis.
But like in terms of his actual role and impact, you can go
find someone. You can go Kvon Looney, like just throw him out there,
like he's not making a fraction. He's making a fraction of what of
what Aiden's gonna make next year, and you can just plug and play.
Someone like that gets get a wing. So again, I don't know whose
value is, but the depth issue affects now, It affects the balance of
the series for however much longer at lasts, and it affects the off season.
Like getting more playable guys around Booker and Durant is just priority one,
and to do that it might mean no more Chris Paul and no more DeAndre
Aden because you just need the flexibility, the money, the you know,
trade capital to flesh out this roster. Because like if you look down the
rest of it beyond you know, Booker Durant, like who who's who's gonna
who do you want back, like do you? I guess campaign as a
backup, like maybe jack Landale as a backup? Like how much worse are
they with jack Landale in there versus Eyton especially like dollar for dollar? So
yeah, it's all. It's all connected, the depth, the pick and
roll stuff and the off season. It's just the the issue that we didn't
pay enough attention to. It was depth. That's just it, and usually
that's the wrong approach for a playoff series, but it's so profound for Phoenix
that it just has become the defining, you know, feature of the series.
In addition to yok it's just being god like. That's the other one.
I have two follow ups that should be mostly quick. Does Indiana this
summer after the full years passed? Do they do? And they can do
it? Miles Turner for DeAndre Atan straight up, I don't think I would
do that if I were the Pacers. I think Miles Turner might just be
better like or at least, you know, the theory of him makes more
sense than Eytan. I think I wouldn't do that if I'm indeed, who
has more trade value? DeAndre Eten at three years and one hundred and two
million dollars guaranteed or Jordan Poole at four years and one hundred and twenty three
million dollars guaranteed. That's a good one. I'm gonna say you have to
say Aten as much as as much as I just dumped on him, Like,
don't you have to say Aden, because like I think Pool, if
you go get Jordan Pool, you're kind of saying he's gonna run our offense
for a significant portion of the minutes we play. And that's a terrifying thought
based on how he played this whole season because he can't be a role guy.
Clearly he's not interested in being a role player. If you were interested
in that, he'd be playing a lot differently right now. That's I think
that I've probably mean Eton as well, But it's just he plays a position
that has less scarcity, and when you're at that number, I think there's
a team that might be more willing to bet on. Jordan Pool is just
the idea of a shot creator. I just feel bad. It's just like,
are they even you could if you're gonna wave CP three, you could
try and do the DeAndre and for Kyrie Irving stuff with Dallas. I'm just
what team wants DeAndre eten, what team is going to be chomping at the
bit for DeAndre and a lot of people like to name Toronto. I don't
love that with Siakam and you don't have they now of Yaka Purdle. You
also don't have anything to add to an eight and trade anymore. You have
swaps, like a couple of swaps if you really want. No, that's
tough. I mean, it's funny, Like it seemed like the right decision
for Phoenix. We're getting way too. It's a transactional stuff for a Sun's
team that's actually still alive, but like it seemed like the right decision to
match, just to preserve the asset, except like it's not an asset anymore.
He's just he's like he's someone that you might like. I don't know.
I yeah, we should really spend some time trying to figure out what
Aiden's trade value is once, if, and when the Suns are eliminated,
because that's like I don't know, I don't know what I would pay it
at right now. I this is and I don't this is still skewing transactional,
but in discord real SERI of twenty two and nineteen pose an interesting question.
Not that I didn't respect him before this series, but it makes me
respect Devin Booker so much more. He's been amazing. I can't even decide
on a single superlative, and one of the superlatives was Booker has been so
good it makes you think the Suns would have been better off keeping their picks
and defensive piece is instead of trading everything for Kevin Durant. This is like
my Donovan Mitchell Lowrie market and thing, except way better, right right?
I mean, well, would Bridges have ever gotten to be this version of
Bridges in Phoenix? That's an indictment of Phoenix. But I don't know.
Also, wait, hold on, I I just had a better thought.
The Suns made the finals and then they won sixty four games, and then
Chris Paul probably got COVID and that's why they got smoked last season's playoffs.
Like, the Suns were awesome. They were really good, and they had
all these assets too that they don't have anymore. So maybe that maybe that's
like the correct take is that the correct take are we we flipped all the
way already on the Durant trade was bad? I will say I very clearly
thought the Suns as constructed before didn't have it, and this rent rests on
two things would have needed to happen if you still and I guess it wouldn't
have been an issue because CP three got injured. But like you're always,
when you have CP three, you're going to gravitate more towards CP three and
Devin Booker to where even when they expanded mcal Bridges role, it was never
anywhere near what it was now in Brooklyn. So I would be super interested
to see what does Bridges look like in this series if it had played out
the same way and CP three gets injured because you have no choice, I
would think other than kind of to go and it come close to explaining what
he's done in Brooklyn. So it's Kevin Durant, right, And I think
I've been banging the druma of you do. When you make these trades,
even if you make them in the off season when they tend to happen,
you kind of needs if it's happening after free agency and the draft and whatever,
you need some time to reboot, like the consolidate, the consolidation of
it all, whereas you need time to flesh out that supporting cast. That's
gonna be their job for the off season. But given how well Bridges played
in Brooklyn and how well Devin Booker is playing now to the point where Kevin
Durant has large he's been putting up even by doesn't really ring the bell in
Game five, but like he's been putting up I'm melting numbers and he's just
like being the Sun's second best player by a comically cosmically distant margin. I
don't know, man, they'd have Cam Johnson too, and all those picks
and they be able to Yeah, look, it's a fair discussion to have
because you're out of like big chips to play. If you have to,
like, if you think DeAndre Ayton's this massive trade chip, you have to
assume he is a lot of value to a team and I don't. And
look, I feel like we're getting beering too far in to post mortem.
But that's this is all stuff. Whether the Suns win this series or not,
they're just going to be huge questions about how they figure out the rest
of the rest of this roster inside the limitations that they're operating in. Yeah,
oh, I can't believe we're already there talking about that. Well,
we can talk about I told you I was going to have some an uncomfortable
exercise. Let's do an uncomfortable exercise and then I'll take us out. Is
is Devin Booker, over the course of a full season, regular season in
playoffs, one of the five best players in the NBA. Now, well,
let's figure it out that. I'm not gonna rup again. I'm gonna
throw NBA players who are the ringer does this thing where they rank players throughout
the course of the year, and I'm just gonna throw some names out here.
They're not all in front of Devin Booker. But what are these Let's
let's fringu this right. Are these players or would you rather have these players?
Which of these players would you rather have over the course of an entire
season, regular season and playoffs than Devin Booker, Lebron James, No,
I'd rather have a Booker. I'm with you, John Moran, Oh,
Booker, Anthony Davis. That's the closest one so far. But I guess
Booker just because you don't Davis is gonna miss time. It's David. It's
excuse me, it's Booker. Damien Booker, Booker, Shay Gil just Alexander.
Mmm, I mean Booker because we haven't seen it yet in the playoffs
from SGA. We've we've were watching it with Booker. Yeah, I think
the pull the threat of his pull up jumper at this point just it's and
he's played better either Jimmy Butler. M Well, Butler is probably no worse
than third in postseason MVP right now, right, I would say, hmm,
I might go Butler because I think he's doing all this. Yeah,
I don't know, but plus Butler's brained his ankle, so I don't know
how we evaluate this last series just for purposes of the exercise, So we
don't keep saying Booker. I'm gonna say Butler by a nose. But like
the age thing is a huge factor. So if we're starting next season like
that might be that might be Booker. I don't mean to simplify this.
I'm taking Devin Booker pretty comfortably. Here, can we say who? You're
not going to take Devin Booker over We're getting there. I take Booker,
kau I may never play basketball again. I don't know that was mean,
but I'm with you starting interesting Jason Tatum. Hm hmm. I'm hesitating because
they're like varies. Uh. I think Booker because he has shown us a
capacity to just get more shots than Tatum can get, and I think that's
that matters in the playoffs. Luca don Chich, Oh, I'm gonna take
Luca. Sorry, this might be my spicies take. I'm taking Devin Booker,
Okay, Kevin Durant Booker, he's out playing him right now. I'm
with Booker, last Un Joel and Bead Hmm, I'm gonna take him,
Bead. I'm gonna take Booker. He's easier just to build a team around.
I think Steph Curry. I'm gonna take Curry. You knew that was
coming. I'll take stephf Yannis. Oh, I'm gonna take Yannie. I'm
gonna take honest to Yokichi. So Steph, Yokich, Jannis. We're basically
the only consentsis players that we were willing to take over. Devin Booker,
Yeah, that's wild. That's wild. So he's the top five basically,
but he certainly he's inside the top ten. It's pretty definitive to me at
this point. I mean, you took a d you took Butler the seven
territory. It's not It sounded like an outrageous question, but I did the
exercise in my head, and it's It's an uncomfortable discussion, I think for
some of us, but it's it's an actual discussion. I think there is
some element of recency bias at work here because regular season wise, like he
you know, he might have made an All NBA team, made like he
was in the mix. I think if he'd played more games, it would
have been harder. But the playoff run, like, you can't say a
single bad thing about it. He's been He's been the best player in the
playoffs. And that's with like, I mean, Yokich probably is gonna have
something to say about it by the end of this series. But Butler has
been awesome. There's been like there's been no shortage of incredible performances, Like
Steph has been really good buying large, but Booker has just been Yeah,
I mean, if the playoffs matter the most, Booker has been the best
in the playoffs. Like it kind of make it kind of makes it pretty
simple in some ways. Are you ready to take us out on that.
I'm sure you're a little bit rattled. I'm just I am very rattled by
what we just decided Devin Booker where he belongs in the NBA hierarchy. Everybody,
thanks for listening, Thanks for your comments. What's up? What's up
Brent? We didn't say hi, he's been commenting. Please. As Dan
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a shout out to Frank Nilikina, But as you mentioned, I don't know
who else to apologize to because Mitchell Robinson has not been as great. So
I'm gonna go back, at least for today to issuing an apology to Jared out