WEBVTT

1
00:00:32.359 --> 00:00:36.560
Welcome back to the Path with Chili. I'm Robin, I'm Jules, and

2
00:00:36.719 --> 00:00:43.079
I'm Ashley. Let's dive right into
this week's case. September thirteenth, nineteen

3
00:00:43.119 --> 00:00:49.799
ninety two, Boston, Massachusetts.
While working as the ramp supervisor for Northwest

4
00:00:49.880 --> 00:00:55.600
Airlines at Logan International Airport, twenty
seven year old Sue rasca Witz leaves in

5
00:00:55.640 --> 00:00:59.799
the middle of her shift to purchase
food for her crew. She never returns

6
00:01:00.000 --> 00:01:03.520
and is found murdered inside the trunk
of her car if the following morning.

7
00:01:03.799 --> 00:01:08.359
One year later, Sue's mother finds
her diary and reads that Sue is the

8
00:01:08.439 --> 00:01:15.400
victim of non stop sexual harassment at
her workplace. Some of Sue's harassers are

9
00:01:15.480 --> 00:01:19.480
later indicted for their role in a
credit card theft ring, but the identity

10
00:01:19.480 --> 00:01:25.640
of her killer remains unknown. After
that, the Path Went Chili, So

11
00:01:25.680 --> 00:01:29.280
the case were going to be covering
today also happened to be featured on Unsolved

12
00:01:29.280 --> 00:01:34.799
Mysteries the nineteen ninety two murder of
Sue Tarrascowitz and fair Warning, this is

13
00:01:34.840 --> 00:01:38.480
definitely one of the most rage inducing
cases we've ever explored. I originally covered

14
00:01:38.519 --> 00:01:44.000
this on The Trail Went Cold in
September of twenty seventeen and released the episode

15
00:01:44.000 --> 00:01:48.640
of the exact twenty five year anniversary
if Sue's Murder, and sadly, here

16
00:01:48.640 --> 00:01:52.799
we are six years later, and
we've recently passed the thirty one year anniversary

17
00:01:52.879 --> 00:01:55.959
and the crime is still unsolved,
So I thought it would be a good

18
00:01:56.000 --> 00:01:59.599
idea to revisit it on the Path
went Chili. It's going to seem pretty

19
00:01:59.680 --> 00:02:02.519
unbelievable that this case has gone on
sold for thirty one years, because there

20
00:02:02.519 --> 00:02:06.799
are likely quite a few people out
there who knew the truth about what happened.

21
00:02:07.599 --> 00:02:09.719
This is a pretty maddening story of
a woman who found success in a

22
00:02:09.759 --> 00:02:14.960
male dominated industry, but some of
our co workers just couldnot handle that,

23
00:02:15.319 --> 00:02:20.360
so she was tormented for years by
a NonStop stream of sexual harassment. It's

24
00:02:20.360 --> 00:02:23.639
been out for debate whether the harassment
itself was the primary motive for Sue's murder,

25
00:02:23.759 --> 00:02:27.719
or if she might have been killed
because of a legal activity going on

26
00:02:27.800 --> 00:02:30.680
in her workplace. Whatever the case, this is a pretty disturbing story,

27
00:02:30.759 --> 00:02:36.319
but it needs to be told.
Okay, so I'm already on board because

28
00:02:36.319 --> 00:02:39.919
you said it's the most rage inducing
case we've ever explored. So bring it

29
00:02:39.960 --> 00:02:45.240
on, Robin. But also,
I mean, we're talking about a young

30
00:02:45.599 --> 00:02:51.800
girl twenty seven years old who is
working at an airport, and she's a

31
00:02:51.879 --> 00:02:55.680
ramp supervisor already at age twenty seven. This is in nineteen ninety two.

32
00:02:57.080 --> 00:03:00.719
We are still today and very vocally
talking about out sexual harassment in the workplace,

33
00:03:00.879 --> 00:03:06.800
women's rights in employment, and back
in ninety two that was not so

34
00:03:06.879 --> 00:03:09.759
much the case. You were expected
to deal with it, particularly in a

35
00:03:09.759 --> 00:03:15.360
male dominated field, and to almost
feel privileged if you were appointed to a

36
00:03:15.360 --> 00:03:21.599
certain position. And so I'm very
concerned about Sue being harassed to a point

37
00:03:21.639 --> 00:03:25.520
where she's writing this in her diary
saying that the harassment won't stop at work,

38
00:03:27.080 --> 00:03:30.479
that if she were to mention at
work, it definitely makes you a

39
00:03:30.520 --> 00:03:34.960
target. And the fact that she's
found in her trunk of the car the

40
00:03:35.080 --> 00:03:40.719
next morning, surely someone is seeing
something happened to Sue between the times I'm

41
00:03:40.759 --> 00:03:45.560
assuming leaves work and makes it out
to her car. So I need to

42
00:03:45.599 --> 00:03:50.080
know more. I'm already on the
edge of my seat. Our story begins

43
00:03:50.120 --> 00:03:54.159
in Boston in nineteen ninety two.
Our central figure is twenty seven year old

44
00:03:54.199 --> 00:04:00.360
Susan tarasco Is who goes by the
name Zue. Sue lives in Saga with

45
00:04:00.439 --> 00:04:04.960
parents Ronald and Marleine Tarrascowitz, and
is currently an employee of Northwest Airlines and

46
00:04:05.039 --> 00:04:11.879
works at Boston's Logan International Airport.
She went to art school and originally dreamed

47
00:04:11.879 --> 00:04:15.720
of being a cartoonist, but instead
she decided to break new ground by achieving

48
00:04:15.759 --> 00:04:21.560
success in a very male dominated industry. Sue started out her career at Northwest

49
00:04:21.639 --> 00:04:27.920
in nineteen eighty seven by cleaning the
interiors of jets and became a ground service

50
00:04:27.959 --> 00:04:31.600
employee within the next two years,
only the second woman in the history of

51
00:04:31.600 --> 00:04:36.199
the company to ever hold that position. She continued working her way up the

52
00:04:36.279 --> 00:04:42.240
ladder and eventually earned a promotion to
the position of Equipment Service Crew Chief.

53
00:04:43.000 --> 00:04:46.839
Her job involves supervising round porkers who
unloaded mail and baggage from the airplanes,

54
00:04:46.920 --> 00:04:51.240
and this time Sue became the very
first woman to ever hold such a position

55
00:04:51.279 --> 00:04:56.920
at Northwest. Wow. Okay,
so here she is twenty seven years old,

56
00:04:57.040 --> 00:04:59.639
and not only is she moving up
and being a superior, but she's

57
00:04:59.680 --> 00:05:03.360
break these massive barriers where she's the
second woman to hold this position. The

58
00:05:03.399 --> 00:05:10.160
first woman to hold another supervisory position. I'm very interested in knowing how the

59
00:05:10.279 --> 00:05:13.759
men who were working underneath of her, and even the females who were working

60
00:05:13.800 --> 00:05:17.199
below her and were not promoted to
those positions, how are they reacting to

61
00:05:17.279 --> 00:05:23.199
Sue at work. It sounds like
perhaps that alone could be a big reason

62
00:05:23.240 --> 00:05:27.160
why people were really targeting her and
trying to make her uncomfortable, perhaps in

63
00:05:27.199 --> 00:05:30.519
a way to get her to not
be the person supervising them. There's a

64
00:05:30.519 --> 00:05:34.120
lot of people, including young men, who are sitting there going I don't

65
00:05:34.120 --> 00:05:38.920
want some woman and a young woman
at twenty seven telling me how to do

66
00:05:38.959 --> 00:05:43.399
my job. And what do you
both think about the fact that these guys

67
00:05:43.639 --> 00:05:47.800
likely saw Sue from the beginning of
her career at Northwest when she was cleaning

68
00:05:47.839 --> 00:05:54.560
the planes, and the fact that
this upward mobility for her seemed to be

69
00:05:55.399 --> 00:05:59.839
just incredibly fast. She was obviously
doing a really good job. If within

70
00:06:00.079 --> 00:06:04.319
two years she got another promotion and
then she's promoted to round supervisor like that

71
00:06:04.480 --> 00:06:09.600
career trajectory says this woman is going
to be a star. I can imagine

72
00:06:09.639 --> 00:06:14.279
that there would be some resentment from
the men around her who weren't being promoted

73
00:06:14.319 --> 00:06:16.480
at that rate. Oh, definitely, I think that was one of the

74
00:06:16.480 --> 00:06:20.600
big issues there. And Ashley just
asked about the other female employees. As

75
00:06:20.639 --> 00:06:25.839
far as I can tell, there
really were not that many female workers at

76
00:06:25.839 --> 00:06:30.720
that particular airport, especially working in
the baggage industry at that time, so

77
00:06:30.000 --> 00:06:32.360
there were only a handful of them. But as far as I can tell,

78
00:06:32.439 --> 00:06:35.519
Sue was still very close with them, and they were very supportive of

79
00:06:35.560 --> 00:06:40.240
her because I think they had the
mentality that in this industry, a woman

80
00:06:40.319 --> 00:06:45.480
breaking ground and climbing up the ladder
that quickly and becoming going into like a

81
00:06:45.519 --> 00:06:48.600
supervisory position is a pretty big deal. So I think they respected her for

82
00:06:48.680 --> 00:06:51.879
being able to pave the way for
And I think, as we're going to

83
00:06:51.959 --> 00:06:56.920
find out, one of the reasons
Sue would stay at this position and not

84
00:06:57.040 --> 00:07:00.040
quit even after facing a steady stream
of harassment, is that she knew what

85
00:07:00.079 --> 00:07:03.759
would make it tougher for all the
other female employees if she just decided to

86
00:07:03.839 --> 00:07:08.839
leave and not fight all the harassment
she was facing. Oh man, been

87
00:07:08.920 --> 00:07:12.399
there, done that, Where it's
like it's almost on you as a young

88
00:07:12.480 --> 00:07:15.000
woman to say, if my voice
isn't heard, if I don't stick this

89
00:07:15.040 --> 00:07:17.879
out, then it's going to be
just the next girl behind me. And

90
00:07:17.920 --> 00:07:21.839
so you feel this incredible responsibility,
even at your own health risk, to

91
00:07:23.480 --> 00:07:27.120
stay and to put up with it. I know you've dealt with that in

92
00:07:27.160 --> 00:07:30.160
the workplace, Ashley, and you
know how difficult it is. But can

93
00:07:30.199 --> 00:07:34.319
you imagine what it would feel like
if in your workplace it was you and

94
00:07:34.519 --> 00:07:40.439
only men. Oh, it would
be pretty intense. I think there'd be

95
00:07:40.800 --> 00:07:43.519
the both sides of the coin,
which we talked about a lot. There

96
00:07:43.560 --> 00:07:46.920
would be the people who treated you
like a sister and daughter and respected you

97
00:07:47.000 --> 00:07:51.319
and we're in awe of your progress
and really proud of you. And then

98
00:07:51.360 --> 00:07:55.000
I do think there would be a
whole other party that's sitting there, going

99
00:07:55.199 --> 00:07:59.279
this young girl like I don't think
so there's not a place for her here.

100
00:07:59.720 --> 00:08:03.000
I'm to make her as miserable as
possible so that she leaves. And

101
00:08:03.279 --> 00:08:07.079
I think she would be dealing with
both of those camps in her position and

102
00:08:07.160 --> 00:08:13.240
the ones that want to basically reduce
you to a sexual object because it makes

103
00:08:13.240 --> 00:08:18.000
it a lot easier for them,
and they know that it can break down

104
00:08:18.000 --> 00:08:22.480
a woman over time, and clearly
that's what Sue is dealing with and she's

105
00:08:22.560 --> 00:08:26.639
such a hero like I just can't
get over the fact that she continues to

106
00:08:28.040 --> 00:08:35.000
with this incredible fortitude because she wants
to not allow them to make her quit

107
00:08:35.039 --> 00:08:37.519
her job. She wants to be
strong and put herself in a position that

108
00:08:37.720 --> 00:08:43.279
would support other women who want to
potentially take that position. I just think

109
00:08:43.320 --> 00:08:48.399
she's an incredible twenty seven year old
woman. So on the evening of Saturday,

110
00:08:48.399 --> 00:08:50.960
September the twelfth, Sue showed up
to work the eleven PM to seven

111
00:08:52.000 --> 00:08:56.600
am graveyard shift with her crew.
Sometime around one am on the thirteenth,

112
00:08:56.679 --> 00:09:00.600
she volunteered to go on a food
run to a nearby Samwich shop. After

113
00:09:00.639 --> 00:09:03.519
taking orders from her co workers and
leaving the airport, Sue did not return

114
00:09:03.600 --> 00:09:07.759
for the rest of her shift.
On the morning of September fourteenth, Sue's

115
00:09:07.799 --> 00:09:11.679
car was found parked at an auto
body shop in nearby Revere, and after

116
00:09:11.720 --> 00:09:16.279
a passer by noticed blood dripping from
the trunk, the police were notified.

117
00:09:16.720 --> 00:09:20.759
When the vehicle's trunk was opened,
Sue's body was inside. She had been

118
00:09:20.759 --> 00:09:24.440
beaten and stabbed multiple times. Sue
was not sexually assaulted, and the only

119
00:09:24.440 --> 00:09:28.600
item of hers which appeared to be
missing was a necklace she usually wore.

120
00:09:28.240 --> 00:09:31.919
So what could have been the motive
for her murder? Oh, my goodness,

121
00:09:33.240 --> 00:09:35.679
beyond the sexual harassment. I got
to go back to this idea of

122
00:09:35.759 --> 00:09:41.000
Sue really was only at work for
about two hours when she is the one

123
00:09:41.039 --> 00:09:43.600
who says, Hey, I'm gonna
go grab some food at this nearby sandwich

124
00:09:43.639 --> 00:09:48.440
shop. Two questions, do we
know if she ever made it to the

125
00:09:48.480 --> 00:09:52.519
sandwich shop or was she somehow kind
of apprehended between the her walk from work

126
00:09:52.600 --> 00:09:58.360
to the car. And is there
any way that this food run could have

127
00:09:58.440 --> 00:10:01.399
been staged, like someone on her
shifts saying, Hey, I'm hungry,

128
00:10:01.559 --> 00:10:05.720
do you think you could go get
us food? So that she was then

129
00:10:05.759 --> 00:10:11.679
outside of the building at that point. I see no indication that she ever

130
00:10:11.720 --> 00:10:15.120
made it to the sandwich shop.
There's no record of her having ever purchased

131
00:10:15.120 --> 00:10:18.759
anything. And while we have no
idea when exactly she was murdered, I

132
00:10:18.799 --> 00:10:22.519
have to assume it's a very short
time after leaving the airport. And I

133
00:10:22.519 --> 00:10:26.320
don't get the impression that the food
run was staged, because I think it

134
00:10:26.440 --> 00:10:30.840
was Sue's idea to go and buy
food for her entire crew. But of

135
00:10:30.879 --> 00:10:33.440
course, as we're going to talk
about later, one of the most disturbing

136
00:10:33.480 --> 00:10:37.840
elements is that she never returned with
anyone's food even after taking their orders,

137
00:10:37.159 --> 00:10:41.679
and no one seemed overly concerned enough
to notify the police. Wait, so

138
00:10:41.840 --> 00:10:48.200
no one said where's our food?
Where's Sue until some time after the end

139
00:10:48.240 --> 00:10:50.799
of her shift, exactly like,
no one really reacted at all. She

140
00:10:50.919 --> 00:10:54.320
just did show up for the rest
of her shift, and they just seemed

141
00:10:54.320 --> 00:10:58.240
to go on business as usual,
and then she's discovered in her car like

142
00:10:58.279 --> 00:11:00.679
the following day, as we're going
to talk about, that's one of the

143
00:11:00.759 --> 00:11:03.559
major red flags in this case,
that no one was overly concerned when she

144
00:11:03.679 --> 00:11:09.759
just went missing for around thirty six
hours. Then you almost have a question,

145
00:11:09.080 --> 00:11:13.080
is this a conspiracy of many because
nobody's asking a question, where is

146
00:11:13.120 --> 00:11:18.120
Sue? This dependable person. Then
it seems almost as likely that you could

147
00:11:18.120 --> 00:11:22.279
ask what asked she was asking,
and that was this whole food run stage,

148
00:11:22.440 --> 00:11:28.279
because either they're all conspiring to not
report the two's missing or hasn't returned,

149
00:11:28.799 --> 00:11:31.480
or they're conspiring to say that there
was a sandwich run or a food

150
00:11:31.559 --> 00:11:35.039
run when maybe one of the guys
went and talked to Sue, something happened

151
00:11:35.480 --> 00:11:39.120
and he ended up putting her in
the trunk or ended up causing her some

152
00:11:39.200 --> 00:11:45.960
kind of harm. But it just
feels like they're covering for somebody well right

153
00:11:46.039 --> 00:11:50.360
from the outset. Alarm bells were
raised for Sue's family when they learned that

154
00:11:50.480 --> 00:11:54.480
after she failed to return from her
sandwich run on her shift, no one

155
00:11:54.600 --> 00:12:01.120
attempted to report her missing for the
next thirty six hours. Since Sue usually

156
00:12:01.120 --> 00:12:05.279
worked overnight and did a lot of
overtime, her parents did not find it

157
00:12:05.360 --> 00:12:09.240
unusual when they did not see her
at their home on September thirteenth, But

158
00:12:09.360 --> 00:12:13.639
on the morning of the fourteenth,
Marlene to Raskowitz received a call at work

159
00:12:13.840 --> 00:12:18.240
from her other daughter, Debbie,
who told her she had received a phone

160
00:12:18.240 --> 00:12:22.240
call from one of Sue's co workers. In addition to disappearing during her shift

161
00:12:22.320 --> 00:12:26.000
on the morning of the thirteenth,
Sue did not show up at all for

162
00:12:26.039 --> 00:12:30.879
her next shift. On the evening
of the thirteenth, When Marlen went to

163
00:12:30.879 --> 00:12:35.279
the Saugust police station to report her
daughter was missing, she was informed that

164
00:12:35.320 --> 00:12:39.039
Sue's body had already been found.
It would turn out that, in spite

165
00:12:39.039 --> 00:12:45.159
of her disappearance, Sue's time card
was punched to indicate that she completed her

166
00:12:45.159 --> 00:12:48.519
shift on the morning of the thirteenth
like normal, and even though she failed

167
00:12:48.559 --> 00:12:52.559
to show up for her shift later
that evening, her time card was punched

168
00:12:52.679 --> 00:12:58.360
again. Some of Sue's coworkers claimed
they only did this to cover for her

169
00:12:58.720 --> 00:13:03.000
so she wouldn't get into try,
even though Sue had never missed a shift

170
00:13:03.039 --> 00:13:09.759
without explanation during her entire tenure with
the company. WHOA, all right,

171
00:13:09.799 --> 00:13:13.120
there's a lot to unpack there.
So when mom is going and trying to

172
00:13:13.159 --> 00:13:15.360
report her daughter missing, she said, oh, by the way, we

173
00:13:15.440 --> 00:13:18.440
found her body. So this must
have been a very odd coincidence of time

174
00:13:18.480 --> 00:13:24.519
where they're finding her body shortly before
she comes, I hope, And there

175
00:13:24.559 --> 00:13:28.639
aren't hours that passed before Mom's informed
that her daughter's body has been discovered.

176
00:13:28.039 --> 00:13:33.799
But also when we're sitting here and
we're talking about Sue's time card, someone

177
00:13:33.000 --> 00:13:37.120
punched her out at seven am,
which wouldn't be that weird if like she

178
00:13:37.159 --> 00:13:39.879
had left it five or something or
six, and they're like, oh,

179
00:13:39.919 --> 00:13:45.320
crud, she didn't come back.
We're all going home but it was six

180
00:13:45.960 --> 00:13:50.159
hours and she was supposed to be
bringing me food back, So there's a

181
00:13:50.159 --> 00:13:52.919
lot of like Sue had a plan. We all knew she was going to

182
00:13:52.960 --> 00:13:56.919
the sandwich shop. She had a
duty to bring us food back so that

183
00:13:56.919 --> 00:14:01.000
we could eat during our shift.
And I suppose, if I'm trying to

184
00:14:01.039 --> 00:14:03.639
be a good friend, I don't
want her in trouble, so I might

185
00:14:03.679 --> 00:14:09.080
punch her out. But as my
supervisor and someone that does have a history

186
00:14:09.159 --> 00:14:13.879
of being at work following through being
very responsible and punctual, I almost feel

187
00:14:13.879 --> 00:14:18.200
like my gut would be something's wrong, and there would have at least have

188
00:14:18.240 --> 00:14:20.480
been a discussion with some of us
to say, hey, I'm concerned,

189
00:14:20.879 --> 00:14:26.279
let me follow up with Sue later
this morning or something. If I covered

190
00:14:26.320 --> 00:14:28.200
for there was still more for me
to do at that point to make sure

191
00:14:28.240 --> 00:14:33.039
Sue was okay. If that makes
sense. Oh yeah, exactly. Like

192
00:14:33.080 --> 00:14:35.519
when you look at her history with
the company, like if Sue had a

193
00:14:35.559 --> 00:14:39.519
habit of leaving shifts or not showing
up without calling, there's no way that

194
00:14:39.600 --> 00:14:43.720
a woman in her position would have
ever been promoted to ramp supervisor. So

195
00:14:43.799 --> 00:14:46.240
this was very out of character,
which is why it just seems like a

196
00:14:46.279 --> 00:14:50.879
red flag that they didn't become more
concerned that she did show up. She

197
00:14:50.960 --> 00:14:52.720
disappeared in the middle of one shift, didn't show up for her next shift,

198
00:14:52.960 --> 00:14:56.159
and they just decided to go on
business as usual and punch her time

199
00:14:56.159 --> 00:14:58.360
card in it. I mean,
if this was someone who had a history

200
00:14:58.399 --> 00:15:03.200
of slacking off and having people cover
for that'd be one thing, but this

201
00:15:03.279 --> 00:15:07.320
was just so uncharacteristic. So in
spite of this odd piece of business,

202
00:15:07.360 --> 00:15:11.960
the investigation into Sue's murder went nowhere
and failed to turn up any solid leads.

203
00:15:11.960 --> 00:15:16.240
For over a year. However,
Sue's mother, Marlene, would make

204
00:15:16.279 --> 00:15:20.440
a shocking discovery which took the investigation
in an entirely new direction. For a

205
00:15:20.480 --> 00:15:24.279
long time after Sue's murder, Marlene
could not handle the grief of going into

206
00:15:24.320 --> 00:15:28.639
her daughter's room, but finally decided
to do so around Christmas time in nineteen

207
00:15:28.720 --> 00:15:33.799
ninety three. Marlene found a briefcase
inside the closet containing Sue's diary, but

208
00:15:33.879 --> 00:15:39.159
when she opened it, Marlene was
horrified to read Her daughter described many disturbing

209
00:15:39.200 --> 00:15:43.519
accounts of sexual harassment which took place
at her workplace in nineteen eighty nine.

210
00:15:43.000 --> 00:15:48.320
According to the diary, Sue faced
this harassment because her male co workers did

211
00:15:48.360 --> 00:15:52.480
not like the idea of a woman
entering their world. Sue never told her

212
00:15:52.480 --> 00:15:56.039
family about this, so Marlene was
forced to read about the harassment for the

213
00:15:56.080 --> 00:15:58.919
first time in the diary. And
I think it's important to put into context.

214
00:16:00.159 --> 00:16:03.440
This is again nineteen ninety two.
So while now we have things like

215
00:16:03.519 --> 00:16:07.440
hashtag you know me too, and
we have these movements where women are truly

216
00:16:07.519 --> 00:16:11.679
using their voice to make a difference
not only for themselves but for other women,

217
00:16:11.320 --> 00:16:15.960
Sue is this kind of revolutionary groundbreaker
at that point where she's saying,

218
00:16:15.000 --> 00:16:21.120
I'm going to endure this and take
it, but it's really devastating to me

219
00:16:21.159 --> 00:16:25.240
as a career woman. And it's
exactly what I thought when you were at

220
00:16:25.240 --> 00:16:27.159
the first paragraph. To me,
you have this young woman. She's young.

221
00:16:27.279 --> 00:16:30.000
That matters as well. This is
not some fifty five year old careered

222
00:16:30.000 --> 00:16:33.600
woman who men could look next to
him and be like, yeah, she's

223
00:16:33.600 --> 00:16:37.159
been here forever. You know,
I get it, she's young, and

224
00:16:37.200 --> 00:16:38.919
you know that there's people who have
been there longer than her, that are

225
00:16:38.919 --> 00:16:42.559
older than her, who have more
experience than her. That we're not picked

226
00:16:42.639 --> 00:16:48.240
for these promotions, and so especially
when she's the soul woman and you have

227
00:16:48.279 --> 00:16:52.039
a bunch of men looking around,
it is easy to move you aside and

228
00:16:52.080 --> 00:16:56.080
push you aside. Because I harass
you long enough, you'll get uncomfortable enough

229
00:16:56.080 --> 00:17:00.799
and you'll step aside without saying anything. That's just a typical EMO in that

230
00:17:00.919 --> 00:17:06.799
kind of wolfpack aggressive behavior. And
I think that's exactly what people were likely

231
00:17:06.839 --> 00:17:08.920
doing to Sue. Is they're saying, we will make it so miserable for

232
00:17:08.960 --> 00:17:12.640
her that she'll just step aside,
and then one of us will get it

233
00:17:12.640 --> 00:17:18.000
because we deserve it more than her. And oh, I'm already upset.

234
00:17:18.400 --> 00:17:22.720
And poor Mom is sitting here reading
this after her daughter has passed away.

235
00:17:22.160 --> 00:17:26.559
You know, there's a lot to
the grief process where she's saying, what

236
00:17:26.599 --> 00:17:29.279
if I had known, could I
have helped Sue. I wish Sue would

237
00:17:29.279 --> 00:17:32.400
trust me enough to share. And
you know, that set off a whole

238
00:17:32.400 --> 00:17:37.039
another grief journey for Mom. Even
though Sue was very well in control of

239
00:17:37.039 --> 00:17:40.599
what she was doing. There's a
reason she protected her mom for that info.

240
00:17:40.680 --> 00:17:42.720
But I can only imagine Mom sitting
on the floor of that bedroom and

241
00:17:44.200 --> 00:17:47.079
reading that and just wondering what if, like Sue, I would just wish

242
00:17:47.079 --> 00:17:48.920
you had told me I might have
been able to save you. And that

243
00:17:49.000 --> 00:17:53.440
just breaks my heart. You think
that we'd come leaps and bounds, being

244
00:17:53.440 --> 00:17:59.039
that it is twenty twenty three.
Literally yesterday I was reading all of these

245
00:17:59.079 --> 00:18:06.119
tweets from surgeons in the NHS,
female surgeons in the UK talking about sexual

246
00:18:06.160 --> 00:18:11.079
harassment in the workplace and sexual assault, and this prominent surgeon who just recently

247
00:18:11.119 --> 00:18:18.359
retired called them all snowflakes and told
them to toughen up and that these types

248
00:18:18.400 --> 00:18:21.720
of situations will happen and you're just
going to have to deal with it.

249
00:18:22.400 --> 00:18:26.359
This was a prominent male doctor who's
saying you're just going to have to deal

250
00:18:26.400 --> 00:18:29.400
with it. And all of these
women are brave enough to share their stories,

251
00:18:29.559 --> 00:18:33.200
but it's become so normalized that women
are going to experience sexual harassment and

252
00:18:33.240 --> 00:18:37.880
sexual assault that people feel that it
is okay to just say, just deal

253
00:18:37.920 --> 00:18:41.559
with it, sweetie, just deal
with it, because it's going to happen.

254
00:18:41.680 --> 00:18:45.759
Boys will be boys, and it's
uncomfortable for people to look at the

255
00:18:45.799 --> 00:18:48.119
facts of the impact of that,
and that people need to be accountable and

256
00:18:48.240 --> 00:18:52.519
change their behavior, even though historically
it's been accepted and allowed. I remember

257
00:18:53.039 --> 00:19:00.000
asking for help and talking to my
very close family friend who's an older lady,

258
00:19:00.039 --> 00:19:02.640
and I remember her saying, oh, come on, ash, like

259
00:19:02.880 --> 00:19:04.599
we used to have men put their
hands up our skirt at work, and

260
00:19:04.680 --> 00:19:07.039
like you just this is minor,
this is not a big deal. I'm

261
00:19:07.039 --> 00:19:11.519
going wait, excuse me, Like
okay, because that was normal for you,

262
00:19:11.759 --> 00:19:17.200
then it's acceptable, and therefore other
generations should be treated the same way.

263
00:19:17.279 --> 00:19:22.960
Like normalcy doesn't mean right, and
normalcy and history doesn't mean that it's

264
00:19:22.039 --> 00:19:25.920
should be allowed to happen. But
you're right, Jewels, it's twenty twenty

265
00:19:25.920 --> 00:19:29.599
three, and while we've come a
long way, while we've gotten stronger voices,

266
00:19:30.480 --> 00:19:34.759
behaviors haven't necessarily change. It takes
unlearning behaviors and making changes from generation

267
00:19:34.759 --> 00:19:41.640
and generation to make an actual difference
here. Yeah, it takes raising little

268
00:19:41.720 --> 00:19:48.000
boys that you're raising them with empathy
and compassion and not with this kind of

269
00:19:48.319 --> 00:19:53.039
gendered idea that like of masculinity being
this kind of overarching theme in a man's

270
00:19:53.079 --> 00:19:57.039
life where he cannot express his emotions
and he can't be in touch with his

271
00:19:57.119 --> 00:20:00.640
feminine side because that would make him
like, quote unquote weak. And it

272
00:20:00.720 --> 00:20:07.480
also takes women reinforcing that behavior and
making it okay. Like you see it

273
00:20:07.759 --> 00:20:10.279
all the time right where it's like, oh, a guy just made a

274
00:20:10.319 --> 00:20:14.960
mistake, let's not ruin his life. You see women saying that in regards

275
00:20:14.960 --> 00:20:18.000
to somebody who's sexually assaulted a woman, and it's like, you'd think you

276
00:20:18.039 --> 00:20:22.839
would stick up for other women,
But it's been so conditioned into us that

277
00:20:22.920 --> 00:20:26.680
it's going to take generations of unlearning. But I've got a lot of faith

278
00:20:26.720 --> 00:20:30.519
in gen Z. Yes, gen
Z is going to save us. Yes,

279
00:20:32.599 --> 00:20:34.920
But to mention that point is like, I've always wondered if that's one

280
00:20:34.960 --> 00:20:38.400
of the reasons that Sue decided never
to tell her mother about the harassment that

281
00:20:38.440 --> 00:20:41.640
she may have felt. If I
tell my mother about this, she's probably

282
00:20:41.640 --> 00:20:45.079
going to tell me the same thing, that it's to be expected, and

283
00:20:45.079 --> 00:20:47.720
then I just have to put up
with it, and it would have disappointed

284
00:20:47.720 --> 00:20:49.599
her. Though of course, now
that we know that Marlene found out about

285
00:20:49.599 --> 00:20:53.000
it and was outraged, I'm sure
she would have told her daughter that you

286
00:20:53.000 --> 00:20:56.680
don't have to put up with this, you can complain to someone. But

287
00:20:56.200 --> 00:21:00.200
I think Sue is just being selfless
saying that I just don't want to and

288
00:21:00.279 --> 00:21:02.839
my mother with what I'm going through, and that's why I'm going to keep

289
00:21:02.839 --> 00:21:04.960
this from her. I think there
can be a lot of shame associated with

290
00:21:04.960 --> 00:21:08.200
it as well, right, there
can be like a multitude of reasons not

291
00:21:08.200 --> 00:21:11.599
wanting to burden your mother, but
being in a situation like that, you

292
00:21:11.599 --> 00:21:15.960
can feel like, what did I
do, even though you haven't done anything

293
00:21:15.000 --> 00:21:21.519
to deserve it. I know when
I've been victimized in the past, I've

294
00:21:21.720 --> 00:21:26.039
certainly asked those questions myself, and
I'm sure ash you probably have in situations

295
00:21:26.079 --> 00:21:30.279
too, even though you know logically
that you did nothing wrong, nothing to

296
00:21:30.319 --> 00:21:34.599
bring that behavior upon you. Well, knowing and feeling are two very different

297
00:21:34.599 --> 00:21:38.559
things. Like I'm very logical and
sensible, but then i also have a

298
00:21:38.640 --> 00:21:42.480
huge heart and you know, my
own mental health to battle. So it's

299
00:21:42.519 --> 00:21:47.480
interesting when you're logic and you're you
know, mental health kind of conflict with

300
00:21:47.519 --> 00:21:49.559
each other. But you're right,
you also don't want to burden people around

301
00:21:49.559 --> 00:21:52.359
you, and you also don't want
to feel like you're quote weak or that

302
00:21:52.400 --> 00:21:56.240
you can't handle things like it's part
of it, Like we're raised to think

303
00:21:56.279 --> 00:21:59.720
it's part of it, and you
fight through it. And I really don't

304
00:21:59.759 --> 00:22:03.079
want to bother anyone or have anyone
ask questions or tell me to leave,

305
00:22:03.519 --> 00:22:07.359
you know, like I want to
be able to be here and be strong

306
00:22:07.400 --> 00:22:10.359
and tough and stay put in this
position and not have someone run me off.

307
00:22:10.440 --> 00:22:14.680
And so I think there's a lot
of that kind of internalization and a

308
00:22:14.720 --> 00:22:18.720
lot of fear and shame you bring
on yourself anticipating people's reactions, even though,

309
00:22:18.799 --> 00:22:22.480
like you said, her mama probably
would have embraced her with open arms

310
00:22:22.480 --> 00:22:25.400
and said hell, yeah, let's
fight this, or I'm here to listen.

311
00:22:25.759 --> 00:22:29.799
But we anticipate a lot of negative
reactions from people, and so we

312
00:22:29.839 --> 00:22:33.680
don't turn to them. Yeah,
And I think we worry in those situations

313
00:22:33.759 --> 00:22:37.599
that the narrative around us will shift
to people having to walk on eggshells and

314
00:22:37.680 --> 00:22:42.279
that it will be like the quote
unquote victim, right, And a lot

315
00:22:42.359 --> 00:22:45.079
of people don't want that. I've
in the past been like I don't want

316
00:22:45.079 --> 00:22:48.599
to share this because I feel as
though it makes me look weak or I

317
00:22:48.640 --> 00:22:52.759
feel as though it makes me appear
to be a victim. But I mean

318
00:22:52.799 --> 00:22:55.720
I've kind of reframed that in my
brain now where you know, it makes

319
00:22:55.720 --> 00:22:57.559
me a survivor, and it means
that you're strong when you share that.

320
00:22:57.839 --> 00:23:02.559
I think that it can be that
knee jerk reaction and did You're a problem,

321
00:23:02.559 --> 00:23:07.519
and it's going to make it worse
exactly. Here are just a few

322
00:23:07.559 --> 00:23:11.400
examples of the harassment Sue was forced
to face. On numerous occasions, she

323
00:23:11.519 --> 00:23:17.599
discovered explicit and demeaning graffiti written about
her at the airport, usually in the

324
00:23:17.599 --> 00:23:21.279
men's room. At one point,
she found a new drawing of her in

325
00:23:21.319 --> 00:23:25.720
a sexual position in the cargo hold
of one of the jets. Sue frequently

326
00:23:25.759 --> 00:23:30.759
filed complaints with management at Northwest Airlines
as well as her union, the International

327
00:23:30.839 --> 00:23:36.079
Association of Machinists, but very little
was ever done to stop the harassment,

328
00:23:36.400 --> 00:23:40.799
and the union often advised her not
to rock the boat. In fact,

329
00:23:40.839 --> 00:23:45.720
one of management's most common responses to
Sue's complaints would be to assign her unappealing

330
00:23:45.839 --> 00:23:52.880
jobs such as cleaning and emptying the
airline toilets. Yep, we'll help you.

331
00:23:52.880 --> 00:23:55.640
You're a problem, so we're going
to help you on your way out,

332
00:23:55.799 --> 00:23:59.839
is what they typically do in these
kinds of institutions. When you speak

333
00:24:00.039 --> 00:24:03.440
up, you now become a liability. And so instead of firing you or

334
00:24:03.519 --> 00:24:06.559
letting you go because that's illegal,
they're going to make it as hard on

335
00:24:06.599 --> 00:24:08.119
you as possible. And that's exactly
what they're doing here. Oh you had

336
00:24:08.119 --> 00:24:11.799
a problem, I'm so sorry.
Also, could you go clean the toilets

337
00:24:11.839 --> 00:24:17.559
for us? It also didn't help
that Sue was technically the highest ranking woman

338
00:24:17.599 --> 00:24:19.920
in the company, so anyone she
complained to is going to be male,

339
00:24:21.079 --> 00:24:22.880
and they probably have the same mindset
as a lot of the people who are

340
00:24:22.920 --> 00:24:26.519
doing harassments, so you can understand
why nothing was done to stop it.

341
00:24:29.160 --> 00:24:33.519
Other female employees at Northwest would corroborate
Sue's stories, claiming that some of the

342
00:24:33.559 --> 00:24:37.359
men there went out of their way
to create a hostile work environment. Some

343
00:24:37.480 --> 00:24:41.720
of their tactics included using derogatory language
to describe Sue and other women, scattering

344
00:24:41.759 --> 00:24:48.519
pornographic magazines throughout the lunchroom, and
hanging women's undergarments and feminine hygiene products from

345
00:24:48.519 --> 00:24:52.920
the ceiling. Even those who's diary
to only chronicled harassment, which took place

346
00:24:52.000 --> 00:24:56.359
until near the end of nineteen eighty
nine, her family would learn that it

347
00:24:56.400 --> 00:25:00.240
continued to escalate in the ensuing years. It even spread outside of her workplace,

348
00:25:00.480 --> 00:25:04.480
as Sue's car was vandalized and she
started getting anonymous, threatening phone calls

349
00:25:04.519 --> 00:25:08.240
in the middle of the night.
On one occasion when Sue launched a complaint

350
00:25:08.279 --> 00:25:14.640
against her co worker's behavior, her
sister Debbie's car was vandalized in her driveway.

351
00:25:14.680 --> 00:25:18.480
If any of Sue's co workers,
both male and female, attempted to

352
00:25:18.519 --> 00:25:22.599
support her, they would find their
own vehicles vandalized and receive death threats.

353
00:25:22.480 --> 00:25:26.960
This is so sad because here's Sue
is and she's trying to really do the

354
00:25:27.079 --> 00:25:33.039
right thing right and every time she
turns around she has worsening harassment. So

355
00:25:33.079 --> 00:25:37.079
you know she's sitting there going like, what do I do. I've done

356
00:25:37.119 --> 00:25:38.880
the like actual tactics I've been told
to do, which is go to my

357
00:25:38.920 --> 00:25:44.160
superiors, ask people to stop,
ask them to leave me alone. I

358
00:25:44.279 --> 00:25:47.400
try to ignore it. It seems
like nothing's working, and it just keeps

359
00:25:47.400 --> 00:25:52.000
getting worse. And then when you
watch people who are defending you also have

360
00:25:52.119 --> 00:25:56.279
retaliation against them. That's a lot
to handle because you're watching with this sense

361
00:25:56.319 --> 00:26:00.880
of responsibility, like, wait,
they're getting hurt they're getting vandalized, they're

362
00:26:00.920 --> 00:26:06.160
at risk with their position because they're
protecting me. Like, that's a lot

363
00:26:06.240 --> 00:26:10.680
for a twenty seven year old to
deal with. In spite of this hellish

364
00:26:10.720 --> 00:26:15.440
situation, Sue continued to perform stellar
work for Northwest and applied for the position

365
00:26:15.440 --> 00:26:21.839
of equipment service crew chief. Another
male employee in Sue's union initially got the

366
00:26:21.920 --> 00:26:25.839
job instead of her, but then
she discovered that he had illegally bid for

367
00:26:25.839 --> 00:26:30.480
the position, So Sue filed a
grievance about this, and after she won,

368
00:26:30.599 --> 00:26:33.920
the job was hers and she was
officially promoted in February of nineteen ninety

369
00:26:33.960 --> 00:26:40.400
two. While not surprisingly, there
was some male employees who had serious issues

370
00:26:40.680 --> 00:26:45.480
with the idea of a woman being
in a supervisory position, so things became

371
00:26:45.680 --> 00:26:49.599
even more tense it were. Graffiti
continued to be written about Sue, but

372
00:26:49.680 --> 00:26:55.759
it became more threatening. At one
point, Sue opened her locker and discovered

373
00:26:56.240 --> 00:26:59.400
and discovered that a drawing of a
coffin with her name on it had been

374
00:26:59.400 --> 00:27:07.359
scrawled in side. Wow, so
it's become even more invasive and intense.

375
00:27:07.480 --> 00:27:12.119
It goes from kind of sexual harassment
to more of death threats. Is what

376
00:27:12.200 --> 00:27:18.039
a coffin drawn inside of my locker
looks like and this is because now someone

377
00:27:18.200 --> 00:27:22.640
in their brain, their perception is
you've messed with me, and now you're

378
00:27:22.680 --> 00:27:26.839
going to pay for that. And
instead of the jokes and instead of thinking

379
00:27:26.880 --> 00:27:30.200
that they're kind of doing this foul, gross humor to make her uncomfortable,

380
00:27:30.599 --> 00:27:36.039
it's turned to pictures of a coffin. So in here you have Sue saying,

381
00:27:36.119 --> 00:27:40.440
listen, maybe it's already bad.
So when I am the one qualified

382
00:27:40.440 --> 00:27:45.119
for a job and I watch somebody
next to me illegally obtain that position and

383
00:27:45.160 --> 00:27:49.799
I was overlooked for it, she
gets a union behind her to support and

384
00:27:51.119 --> 00:27:56.039
eventually she gets this promotion. You
know that now people are looking at her

385
00:27:56.039 --> 00:28:00.559
and saying, wow, this crazy
kid and woman and actually messes with people's

386
00:28:00.559 --> 00:28:04.119
family and money. She's got to
go, like, it's up to the

387
00:28:04.160 --> 00:28:07.960
auntie from just being this pain in
people's butts to people feeling threatened by her

388
00:28:08.000 --> 00:28:14.000
even though she did the right thing. And yeah, the escalation is very

389
00:28:14.000 --> 00:28:17.039
scary. When you read that there
was a drawing of a coughin the hair

390
00:28:17.079 --> 00:28:19.039
on my arms stood up. I
went, wow, we've crossed the line.

391
00:28:19.079 --> 00:28:23.319
At this point, beyond sexual to
a physical risk. To me,

392
00:28:25.359 --> 00:28:27.720
these guys are super creepy. The
fact that they want out of their way

393
00:28:27.720 --> 00:28:32.799
to get feminine hygiene products in the
beginning, and they were putting it like

394
00:28:32.839 --> 00:28:36.799
in the break room and hanging up
women's panties. It's like, where did

395
00:28:36.880 --> 00:28:40.400
you procure this? You certainly put
a lot of time and effort into this,

396
00:28:40.720 --> 00:28:42.720
but you could almost see that they
were trying to be almost like a

397
00:28:42.720 --> 00:28:47.799
little bit cute or funny about it, leaving the pornographic magazines around. You

398
00:28:47.799 --> 00:28:51.559
could see them laughing amongst themselves.
But then when it starts to get to

399
00:28:51.599 --> 00:28:56.799
that point where Sue's complained, she's
given all of these duties like cleaning toilets,

400
00:28:56.160 --> 00:29:00.240
so there's no consequences for their actions. No one's there to check their

401
00:29:00.279 --> 00:29:06.279
behavior. And when you're left free
to behave like that, you're left to

402
00:29:06.279 --> 00:29:08.640
be able to escalate that behavior to
a point where, like you said,

403
00:29:08.640 --> 00:29:14.200
Ash, they're feeling like they're threatened, you know, their livelihood, and

404
00:29:14.200 --> 00:29:18.799
they're seeing themselves all in this guy
who illegally bid I'm sure, because they're

405
00:29:18.839 --> 00:29:22.599
trying to find any excuse to hate
Sue. And so this is a perfect

406
00:29:22.640 --> 00:29:29.559
one but just the threatening nature of
that, Like, I can't imagine what

407
00:29:29.680 --> 00:29:32.759
poor Sue must have felt like.
Like it's one thing to have to look

408
00:29:32.799 --> 00:29:36.880
at pornomegs spread everywhere. It's a
whole other thing to see a coffin with

409
00:29:36.920 --> 00:29:40.559
your name drawn on it. Oh
yeah, And you would think that would

410
00:29:40.559 --> 00:29:44.119
be the line that you could not
cross, and that Sue would finally get

411
00:29:44.160 --> 00:29:47.839
action from complaining. But nope,
once again she tried to do so,

412
00:29:47.960 --> 00:29:51.160
and it didn't help. When she
attempted to report this issue to the higher

413
00:29:51.240 --> 00:29:53.480
ups at Northwest, things did not
go well during a meeting, so she

414
00:29:53.559 --> 00:29:57.359
broke down crying. She later told
a female co worker that she felt a

415
00:29:57.400 --> 00:30:00.079
shame for crying in front of them, but I was not going to quit

416
00:30:00.359 --> 00:30:04.079
because that would send a message that
the harassers had won and only make things

417
00:30:04.119 --> 00:30:10.000
more difficult for other women who entered
the industry. Also, though, Two,

418
00:30:10.079 --> 00:30:12.640
what's interesting is when you're sitting here
looking at the dynamics of where she's

419
00:30:12.680 --> 00:30:15.200
working and jewels, you just said
this. I just popped into my head.

420
00:30:15.559 --> 00:30:19.160
You know it too. The guys
there in some ways it wasn't even

421
00:30:19.200 --> 00:30:23.440
probably really directed towards Sue. The
silly stuff. You know. It's like

422
00:30:23.839 --> 00:30:29.440
I remember working at a police department
and so obviously it was me and a

423
00:30:29.480 --> 00:30:33.079
bunch of men, and I remember
like just their jokes and language and things

424
00:30:33.119 --> 00:30:36.359
like that, and then like you
know, three hours into they be like,

425
00:30:36.440 --> 00:30:37.319
oh my god, Ashley, I'm
so sorry. I forgot you were

426
00:30:37.359 --> 00:30:41.680
here, and like genuinely we're like, ah, sorry about that, sorry

427
00:30:41.680 --> 00:30:44.559
about that, and I'm like,
yeah, been here the whole time.

428
00:30:45.440 --> 00:30:48.920
It's just so ingrained, especially back
in the nineties, to have those I'm

429
00:30:49.119 --> 00:30:53.240
very sexualized humor jokes, pictures things
like that. Now, for Sue,

430
00:30:53.440 --> 00:30:56.440
she can tell that she's the brunt
of it, which makes it different.

431
00:30:57.000 --> 00:31:03.319
But when it crossed that line to
risk a physical threat now and I'm threatening

432
00:31:03.400 --> 00:31:07.279
your life, not just your kind
of safety and security of your womanhood,

433
00:31:07.279 --> 00:31:11.720
but I'm also like telling you I'm
going to kill you. There's no way

434
00:31:11.759 --> 00:31:15.480
you could explain that in a way
as like this just crude humor that wasn't

435
00:31:15.519 --> 00:31:18.839
really shunned at the time, right, So I don't know, I'm just

436
00:31:19.680 --> 00:31:25.759
I feel sick because I you know
what's coming, and everyone around her was

437
00:31:25.839 --> 00:31:27.960
watching this treatment of her, and
it's like you stood up, you got

438
00:31:29.240 --> 00:31:33.000
silenced and you were at risk.
And so in time, a lot of

439
00:31:33.000 --> 00:31:36.920
people just keep their mouth shut and
watch in horror with Sue and say,

440
00:31:37.079 --> 00:31:40.000
hey, my job is important.
I gotta protect my family and that kid

441
00:31:40.200 --> 00:31:42.359
is going to have to survive on
her own. Was there not one man

442
00:31:42.480 --> 00:31:47.759
there that was looking at this behavior
and went, WHOA, Like this is

443
00:31:47.799 --> 00:31:49.559
too much. I have to stand
up and say something. Or is it

444
00:31:49.599 --> 00:31:53.680
likely that one of the guys was
like the alpha and they were afraid to

445
00:31:53.720 --> 00:31:59.680
step to him, and he had
his eye on Sue getting fired or doing

446
00:31:59.720 --> 00:32:02.599
some thing horrible to her. I
think it takes a lot for someone,

447
00:32:02.680 --> 00:32:05.880
Robin, you can speak to this
more. It takes a lot for someone

448
00:32:05.920 --> 00:32:08.559
to stand up while everyone thinks is
that this is hilarious and say this is

449
00:32:08.599 --> 00:32:10.880
wrong? Like same, you know, like now it's like you know,

450
00:32:12.000 --> 00:32:15.359
say see something, say something,
or when a racist joke's told, when

451
00:32:15.359 --> 00:32:19.119
a joke about a you know,
someone getting assaulted is told, I turn

452
00:32:19.200 --> 00:32:22.160
around and I shut it down.
But it takes I mean, my gut

453
00:32:22.160 --> 00:32:23.160
flips when I do it. Do
you know what I mean? It takes

454
00:32:23.200 --> 00:32:27.440
a big like ah, there's a
survivor in this room somewhere, you need

455
00:32:27.440 --> 00:32:29.960
to keep your mouth shut, or
like, you know, your jokes aren't

456
00:32:29.960 --> 00:32:34.119
funny, but everyone else looks at
you like you're a monster and you're crazy

457
00:32:34.720 --> 00:32:37.640
when you stand up for people,
And especially back then, I don't I

458
00:32:37.640 --> 00:32:40.599
don't know why it is, but
it seems to be very difficult for people

459
00:32:40.599 --> 00:32:44.960
to stand up and say something.
Yes, we're going to talk about that

460
00:32:45.039 --> 00:32:49.359
later. That there was one male
coworker who did confront someone who was harassing

461
00:32:49.400 --> 00:32:52.839
Sue, and they got threatened themselves. And I think there was just such

462
00:32:52.839 --> 00:32:55.960
a bad culture of fear there that
everyone knew that something bad could happen to

463
00:32:55.960 --> 00:32:59.759
me if I try to defend Sue. And of course the fact that she

464
00:33:00.119 --> 00:33:02.920
just disappear from her shift and miss
another shift and none of her male co

465
00:33:04.039 --> 00:33:07.640
workers would do anything to alert the
police or or launch an alarm because Sue

466
00:33:07.680 --> 00:33:12.480
was missing, shows that everyone there
must have been so terrified about what would

467
00:33:12.480 --> 00:33:15.400
happened if they tried to do the
right thing. It's that whole idea of

468
00:33:15.440 --> 00:33:20.599
like, how dare you call me
out on my bad behavior? I'm now

469
00:33:20.640 --> 00:33:23.680
the victim because you've called me out
and you are the villain, And it's

470
00:33:23.720 --> 00:33:28.240
just it's so insane. How you
can see things like that turned on their

471
00:33:28.240 --> 00:33:32.279
head and ask you just described it
perfectly with the situation where you're calling out

472
00:33:32.279 --> 00:33:37.400
a really poor joke and somebody is
very offended that you decided to say,

473
00:33:37.440 --> 00:33:40.759
hey, this could be really hurtful, and you know, I really don't

474
00:33:40.839 --> 00:33:44.519
like it, and it's like,
how dare you say that? I'm rude.

475
00:33:45.319 --> 00:33:49.079
Yeah, people aren't comfortable being like
taught that maybe their way of thinking

476
00:33:49.119 --> 00:33:51.440
it's not right, And I mean
I get it. I don't either,

477
00:33:51.599 --> 00:33:53.519
Like I have people that are like, oh you don't. We don't use

478
00:33:53.559 --> 00:33:57.079
that word anymore, right, And
I'm like, wait, what what?

479
00:33:57.160 --> 00:34:00.880
And then you're humiliated, you're embarrassed. But like, my response as I've

480
00:34:00.920 --> 00:34:04.440
gotten older is not to defend myself
and explain it away. It's to go,

481
00:34:04.799 --> 00:34:07.920
oh, I'm so sorry, will
you teach me why? Like and

482
00:34:07.000 --> 00:34:10.599
that's a change generational thing, right, But instead of saying no, this

483
00:34:10.639 --> 00:34:14.719
is how I've always said it or
this is what I've always heard, I'm

484
00:34:14.760 --> 00:34:17.559
like, oh my god, I'm
so sorry. Will you please teach me

485
00:34:17.639 --> 00:34:22.199
why that is not an appropriate word? And thank you for educating me.

486
00:34:22.239 --> 00:34:27.400
I'm going to change my verbiage now. But that takes some emotional intelligence and

487
00:34:27.440 --> 00:34:30.760
maturity to say, like, whoa, maybe everything I've been doing for thirty

488
00:34:30.800 --> 00:34:34.840
nine years is wrong and it doesn't
have to be a personal attack on me.

489
00:34:34.880 --> 00:34:37.920
You're trying to help me be a
better person or make those around me

490
00:34:37.000 --> 00:34:40.719
safer. I'm okay with that.
But it takes saying I'm willing to learn

491
00:34:40.760 --> 00:34:46.639
that what I know is not acceptable
behavior. Takes humility, right, yes,

492
00:34:47.079 --> 00:34:51.599
deep humility to go whoa, eke, I'm so sorry, I'm so

493
00:34:51.639 --> 00:34:54.239
sorry, not my intention teach me
instead of oh well, not a big

494
00:34:54.280 --> 00:34:58.920
deal. No, if someone has
the courage to say don't say that,

495
00:34:59.079 --> 00:35:00.719
or hey, and I and you
can say it in a way that's really

496
00:35:00.719 --> 00:35:04.800
helpful, like hey, I know
you didn't mean anything, but can I

497
00:35:04.880 --> 00:35:07.440
can I say like, hey,
that was my daughter? That would make

498
00:35:07.440 --> 00:35:09.159
me really uncomfortable that you had said
that. Maybe we should clean it up

499
00:35:09.199 --> 00:35:12.480
and like watch how we speak around
sue. You know, like there's a

500
00:35:12.480 --> 00:35:15.280
sweeter way than like hey man,
you're a dick. You know, there's

501
00:35:15.320 --> 00:35:17.360
a nicer way to say it and
be like hey man, if that was

502
00:35:17.400 --> 00:35:20.920
my wife, I'd be like appalled. Did someone talk to her like that?

503
00:35:21.000 --> 00:35:22.320
We should. We should watch it
and protect her a little bit,

504
00:35:22.400 --> 00:35:25.800
and then it's not as threatening to
somebody. I don't think these guys would

505
00:35:25.840 --> 00:35:32.039
respond well to sweet. They probably
they'd respond more to you're a dick.

506
00:35:32.559 --> 00:35:36.440
Fine, fine, I'll go that
route with them when they when they look

507
00:35:36.480 --> 00:35:40.880
at me like I'm crazy. In
the weeks preceding her death, Sue apparently

508
00:35:40.960 --> 00:35:45.960
told friends that she was in fear
for her life. Needless to say,

509
00:35:45.119 --> 00:35:51.960
all of those revelations about Sue's years
of constant workplace harassment opened up a potential

510
00:35:52.000 --> 00:35:55.519
motive for her murder, so her
family started making waves. Sue's parents,

511
00:35:55.599 --> 00:36:01.039
Marlene and Ronald, eventually took legal
action by finally complaint with the Massachusetts Commission

512
00:36:01.360 --> 00:36:08.239
against Discrimination about the failure of Northwest
Airlines and the International Association of Machinists to

513
00:36:08.239 --> 00:36:14.719
stop their harassment against their daughter.
They also sued Northwest Airlines for sexual harassment,

514
00:36:15.079 --> 00:36:17.639
and the two sides would reach a
settlement where the airline agreed to pay

515
00:36:17.719 --> 00:36:22.480
seventy five thousand dollars just use a
state and put up a two hundred and

516
00:36:22.480 --> 00:36:27.199
fifty thousand dollar reward for information,
which led to the arresting conviction of Sue's

517
00:36:27.239 --> 00:36:30.639
killer. However, it turned out
there might have been a different reason for

518
00:36:30.719 --> 00:36:36.320
Sue's death, which had nothing to
do with sexual harassment. Well good for

519
00:36:36.360 --> 00:36:39.440
them. You know, here's Marlene. Remember she opens up a diary she

520
00:36:39.519 --> 00:36:45.960
finds in Sue's bedroom and in a
hidden briefcase. Years later, and all

521
00:36:45.960 --> 00:36:47.280
of a sudden, she goes,
oh, my god, my daughter was

522
00:36:47.320 --> 00:36:52.280
not only murdered at work, but
she also had been subject to this horrific

523
00:36:52.400 --> 00:36:58.880
harassment. And had someone stepped forward
and listened and not just listened, but

524
00:36:59.000 --> 00:37:04.039
acted and held people accountable for their
actions, would my daughter still be alive

525
00:37:04.079 --> 00:37:09.280
today? Because it seems very clear
that something around the airport likely led to

526
00:37:09.320 --> 00:37:14.239
Sue's death. I think there's a
very very very small percent chance that Sue

527
00:37:14.440 --> 00:37:16.880
met a stranger that killed her.
But we know that's not likely. We

528
00:37:16.960 --> 00:37:22.119
know Sue had people angry with her, Sue had people who were threatening her,

529
00:37:22.320 --> 00:37:24.199
and then Sue ends up dead.
It's much more logicble at someone that

530
00:37:24.239 --> 00:37:30.280
she knows. But here her parents
say, you know what, you didn't

531
00:37:30.280 --> 00:37:32.559
answer while she was here, and
now someone's going to answer. We're going

532
00:37:32.599 --> 00:37:40.679
to make sure that Northwest Airlines and
the International Association of Machinists is held accountable

533
00:37:40.760 --> 00:37:44.559
for what they failed to do while
she was alive. I'm incredibly proud of

534
00:37:44.599 --> 00:37:46.599
them. They took up a fight
the same way they would have taken up

535
00:37:46.599 --> 00:37:50.440
a fight if Sue had called on
them to act while she was alive.

536
00:37:50.760 --> 00:37:55.800
But here this is almost like a
symbolic way to bring her justice without really

537
00:37:55.840 --> 00:38:00.960
having an offender to hold accountable.
I don't think at a moment this was

538
00:38:00.000 --> 00:38:05.519
about a financial payout for them,
because this doesn't come close to pain for

539
00:38:05.559 --> 00:38:12.320
my child's life. But it is
a symbolic screw you for failing my child

540
00:38:12.639 --> 00:38:16.719
because I wasn't in tight are privy
to this information. I wasn't given this

541
00:38:16.760 --> 00:38:20.840
information while she was alive, and
you were, and you failed her.

542
00:38:21.199 --> 00:38:24.039
And so bravo Marlene and Ronald.
I'm incredibly impressed that they said, you

543
00:38:24.079 --> 00:38:28.800
know, maybe the next young lady
or young man who comes in your office

544
00:38:28.800 --> 00:38:32.119
and says they're scared that they're mistreated, maybe you will step forward and say,

545
00:38:32.159 --> 00:38:37.000
guess what the culture is about to
change in this department. Exactly what

546
00:38:37.039 --> 00:38:39.440
you just said is what I was
thinking when you were talking, like this

547
00:38:39.480 --> 00:38:45.280
is the legacy that Sue Tarrascoitz would
want to leave, and her parents picked

548
00:38:45.360 --> 00:38:47.840
up where she left off and was
like, we're gonna hold your feet to

549
00:38:47.840 --> 00:38:52.480
the fire and we're gonna make you
pay for your inaction with our daughter.

550
00:38:52.880 --> 00:38:58.840
And the next human that walks through
here that is dealing with something similar to

551
00:38:58.880 --> 00:39:01.960
what our daughter was dealing will be
treated in a different way because you will

552
00:39:02.000 --> 00:39:07.000
think of the lawsuit that preceded whatever
is happening to them, and you'll go,

553
00:39:07.119 --> 00:39:08.880
Okay, WHOA, we don't want
to have to deal with that again.

554
00:39:09.079 --> 00:39:14.440
Let's take the appropriate actions. I
also think it's poetic that the majority

555
00:39:14.440 --> 00:39:16.559
of the payout went to a reward
to find the killer, because it's kind

556
00:39:16.559 --> 00:39:20.480
of symbolic to say, well,
because you didn't do any effort to stop

557
00:39:20.519 --> 00:39:22.639
this and prevent a murder from taking
place, we're going to take your money

558
00:39:22.679 --> 00:39:27.599
and use it to find the person
who did this. So during the summer

559
00:39:27.639 --> 00:39:31.760
of nineteen ninety two, a federal
investigation was launched against Northwest Airlines because it

560
00:39:31.800 --> 00:39:36.840
turned out that some of their baggage
handlers were participating in a stolen credit card

561
00:39:36.920 --> 00:39:40.440
ring, which netted over seven million
dollars. It was a massive investigation involving

562
00:39:40.480 --> 00:39:45.760
the FBI, the Secret Service,
and the US Postal Service. Whenever at

563
00:39:45.800 --> 00:39:50.760
Northwest Jet transported shipments of new credit
cards from Minneapolis to Boston, which were

564
00:39:50.760 --> 00:39:53.760
supposed to be delivered to customers,
these handlers would steal some of the cards

565
00:39:53.800 --> 00:39:59.079
from the mail bags. The people
involved in this scheme would generate phony driver's

566
00:39:59.159 --> 00:40:02.320
licenses which at the names on these
cards, which were then used for nefarious

567
00:40:02.320 --> 00:40:07.280
purposes. One of their biggest scams
was to use the card to take out

568
00:40:07.360 --> 00:40:10.800
large cash advances at casinos, and
they would sometimes use this money to gamble

569
00:40:10.880 --> 00:40:15.159
there and make even more money.
Other times, the stolen cards would be

570
00:40:15.159 --> 00:40:20.199
sold off through a fence. The
advantage here is that the cards were stolen

571
00:40:20.199 --> 00:40:23.360
in transit, so the thieves would
have several days to profit off them before

572
00:40:23.400 --> 00:40:29.440
the customers even noticed their cards hadn't
arrived yet. So okay, let me

573
00:40:29.440 --> 00:40:32.800
get this right. You have the
baggage handlers are the ones who are actually

574
00:40:32.880 --> 00:40:38.800
running this scheme, So it's actually
the people working right underneath of Sue pretty

575
00:40:38.880 --> 00:40:42.280
much. Yeah, like they didn't
know this at the time, but some

576
00:40:42.320 --> 00:40:45.320
people are going to get into a
lot of legal troll who turned out we're

577
00:40:45.320 --> 00:40:49.199
working under Sue, which is why
this theory has come up that perhaps she

578
00:40:49.320 --> 00:40:52.159
found out about illegal activity that was
going on there at the airport and that's

579
00:40:52.199 --> 00:40:57.280
what led to her being murdered.
Yep, that would be a massive red

580
00:40:57.320 --> 00:41:00.000
flag beyond even the sexual harassment.
That's what I was saying, Like,

581
00:41:00.039 --> 00:41:02.960
I think part of them thought it
was cute that they were sexually harassing her.

582
00:41:02.960 --> 00:41:06.159
They thought they were like in the
good old boys club and they're being

583
00:41:06.239 --> 00:41:10.119
silly. But in nineteen ninety two, seven million dollars would be fifteen and

584
00:41:10.159 --> 00:41:16.159
a half million dollars today one hundred
and eighteen percent more like fifteen million dollars

585
00:41:16.599 --> 00:41:21.800
by little baggage handlers that are working
underneath of Sue. And if she did

586
00:41:21.920 --> 00:41:28.840
have any knowledge that even something was
wrong, that is a massive, massive

587
00:41:29.360 --> 00:41:35.000
federal crime. And so the risk
of her opening her mouth I think calls

588
00:41:35.039 --> 00:41:38.519
for silencing her way more than a
sexual harassment or kind of oh I got

589
00:41:38.519 --> 00:41:43.039
this position or you lost this position, it didn't get your promotion. I

590
00:41:43.079 --> 00:41:51.360
think this speaks amplified volumes over the
sexual harassment. One month before Sue's murder,

591
00:41:51.599 --> 00:41:55.800
several baggage haddlers were subpoena to testify
in front of a federal grand jury.

592
00:41:57.039 --> 00:42:00.960
In the end, a total of
thirty seven people were indicted and convicted

593
00:42:00.000 --> 00:42:05.199
on federal charges for their involvement in
this scheme, and ten of them were

594
00:42:05.239 --> 00:42:09.119
baggage handlers at Northwest. In fact, some of these handlers just happened to

595
00:42:09.159 --> 00:42:15.239
be named in Sue's diary as employees
who'd been sexually harassing her, and two

596
00:42:15.280 --> 00:42:20.960
of these people really stood out.
One of them was Joseph Nuzo, the

597
00:42:21.079 --> 00:42:24.239
ring leader among the baggage handlers,
who wound up getting a three year prison

598
00:42:24.280 --> 00:42:30.000
sentence In nineteen eighty nine. Sue
filed a harassment complaint about Nuzo after she

599
00:42:30.039 --> 00:42:35.280
attempted to break up a fistfight between
him and two other employees, and he

600
00:42:35.360 --> 00:42:39.800
responded by calling her a very derogatory
term. Nuzo soon wound up getting fired

601
00:42:39.840 --> 00:42:45.440
from Northwest, though he was hired
back six months later under a last chance

602
00:42:45.519 --> 00:42:50.679
policy. Yikes. So he's on
thin ice anyway, and Sue is actually

603
00:42:50.800 --> 00:42:54.480
one of the people who is part
of his problems at the airport. So

604
00:42:54.840 --> 00:43:00.719
not only is he involved in this
handler scheme, but then he gets in

605
00:43:00.760 --> 00:43:05.519
a fight and there is Sue coming
forward and saying, listen, I'm going

606
00:43:05.559 --> 00:43:08.800
to file a harassment charge against you. You called me a derogatory term.

607
00:43:08.880 --> 00:43:14.400
You're a dangerous person here and again
she's standing up not only for herself but

608
00:43:14.480 --> 00:43:19.079
the environment and the integrity of the
department that she's leading, and Nuzo has

609
00:43:19.159 --> 00:43:21.880
to look at her as a massive
problem, kind of a thorn in his

610
00:43:22.000 --> 00:43:23.599
side. But when you then turn
to say, oh my god, he

611
00:43:23.639 --> 00:43:28.280
was also involved in this federal crime
that's going on at the same time,

612
00:43:28.639 --> 00:43:32.239
Sue becomes a very dangerous person in
his script in the way that he's kind

613
00:43:32.239 --> 00:43:37.719
of living out this employment on incredibly
thin ice. I've had. It's so

614
00:43:37.840 --> 00:43:42.159
laughable, this whole last chance policy
thing for her a guy who had like

615
00:43:42.199 --> 00:43:45.360
a history of harassment, and in
the end, karma got back to them

616
00:43:45.360 --> 00:43:50.079
because he wound up his last chance
of fence was literally stealing credit cards worth

617
00:43:50.199 --> 00:43:52.960
millions of dollars. So I think
it's safe to say that that policy doesn't

618
00:43:52.960 --> 00:43:58.719
actually work. I don't think Northwest
policies were all that great at the time,

619
00:43:58.920 --> 00:44:04.519
given that would complain about sexual harassment
end up cleaning toilets and Joseph Buzo

620
00:44:04.639 --> 00:44:07.880
gets to screw up here, there, and everywhere and have fi fights with

621
00:44:07.960 --> 00:44:12.039
people, and he gets to come
back six months later on a last chance

622
00:44:12.079 --> 00:44:16.840
policy, only to basically embarrass the
airline greatly. It just really hoped that

623
00:44:16.840 --> 00:44:22.280
they revised their policies after all this. By the sound of things, Nuzo

624
00:44:22.360 --> 00:44:27.800
had committed a number of disciplinarian fractions, and the incident involving Sue and the

625
00:44:27.840 --> 00:44:30.679
fist fight was not the only reason
he got fired, but he seemed to

626
00:44:30.719 --> 00:44:35.440
hold a massive grudge against Sue and
was believed to be the instigator of some

627
00:44:35.519 --> 00:44:38.320
of the worst harassment against her,
including the vandalism of her car and the

628
00:44:38.400 --> 00:44:43.639
threatening phone calls. When the subpoenas
were handed down in the credit card ring

629
00:44:43.679 --> 00:44:47.719
investigation in August of nineteen ninety two, Nuzo was finally fired from Northwest for

630
00:44:47.880 --> 00:44:52.679
good, and reportedly told people that
he believed Sue was a snitch who had

631
00:44:52.760 --> 00:44:57.280
ratted them out to the authorities.
However, the investigation concluded that Sue had

632
00:44:57.280 --> 00:45:00.519
no involvement or knowledge of the credit
card ring and never been asked to assist

633
00:45:00.599 --> 00:45:06.000
in the investigation or testify in front
of a grand jury. So what month

634
00:45:06.119 --> 00:45:12.000
was she killed? Timber Okay,
so literally a month before new Zo is

635
00:45:12.280 --> 00:45:17.840
given a subpoena, right or is
in charge or in dited for this.

636
00:45:19.639 --> 00:45:24.199
Let me start over. So literally
a month beforehand, you have newso subpoena

637
00:45:24.360 --> 00:45:30.079
about this credit card ring and then
he's telling people listen that you know,

638
00:45:30.199 --> 00:45:32.360
you know, he's calling her nasty
names, that little brat is the one

639
00:45:32.400 --> 00:45:36.880
who snitched on me. I know
she did. She's always had a problem

640
00:45:36.880 --> 00:45:38.039
with me. Oh my god,
it's going to ruin me. And then

641
00:45:38.079 --> 00:45:43.400
she's dead a month later. Keep
in mind, if he truly believed that

642
00:45:43.440 --> 00:45:46.840
she is a snitch, wouldn't she
be one of the individuals called to testify

643
00:45:47.039 --> 00:45:52.360
or to at least be, you
know, asked what happened in that workplace.

644
00:45:52.320 --> 00:45:54.400
And that's what's said about this whole
thing, is that she may have

645
00:45:54.440 --> 00:45:59.559
been murdered because people believe that she
was involved in this credit card ringing,

646
00:45:59.639 --> 00:46:02.360
was working as an informant when an
actuality. She knew nothing about it.

647
00:46:02.440 --> 00:46:06.840
So she may have been killed for
nothing. And maybe not even by news.

648
00:46:06.880 --> 00:46:08.559
Oh maybe by someone he told,
oh, Sue's the snitch, and

649
00:46:08.559 --> 00:46:12.320
they go, oh, shoot,
right, like that girl's got to go.

650
00:46:13.320 --> 00:46:15.599
Well, you're about to find out
another guy from Sue's diary here.

651
00:46:15.639 --> 00:46:21.000
Oh Lord, bring it on.
So another participant in this scheme who really

652
00:46:21.039 --> 00:46:24.519
stood out and had been named in
Sue's diary was a baggage handler named Bobby

653
00:46:24.599 --> 00:46:30.119
Brooks. Sue and Bobby supposedly had
a brief affair, but he became increasingly

654
00:46:30.159 --> 00:46:36.480
hostile towards her after it ended,
particularly when she became involved with another coworker.

655
00:46:37.280 --> 00:46:40.719
Things reached a boiling point after an
incident in the employee break room where

656
00:46:40.719 --> 00:46:45.280
Bobby grabbed Sue's radio and smashed it
on the floor. Sue's boyfriend at the

657
00:46:45.320 --> 00:46:51.679
time confronted Bobby and demanded he replace
the radio. When Sue confronted Bobby about

658
00:46:51.679 --> 00:46:53.960
this herself, he blew her off
and threatened to beat up and kill her

659
00:46:53.960 --> 00:47:00.800
boyfriend. Yikes. So you have
someone who not only was violent with her,

660
00:47:00.840 --> 00:47:04.920
but also involved with her and then
rejected by her, and then he

661
00:47:05.159 --> 00:47:10.280
is working alongside her and her new
boyfriend. I assume, so incredibly dangerous

662
00:47:10.280 --> 00:47:15.960
situation for someone who seems unstable like
Bobby and someone who seems pretty darned strong

663
00:47:16.039 --> 00:47:19.519
like Sue. That's going listen,
I'm gonna live by life. We didn't

664
00:47:19.559 --> 00:47:22.559
work out. It is what it
is. But you're sure not going to

665
00:47:22.559 --> 00:47:25.159
disrespect me. You're not going to
be violent in my workplace, and you're

666
00:47:25.239 --> 00:47:30.079
not going to threaten my boyfriend and
I. And it's almost as if you

667
00:47:30.760 --> 00:47:34.760
can just feel the tension and the
anger and the rage that's boiling inside of

668
00:47:34.800 --> 00:47:37.840
Bobby that he can't have Sue or
that it didn't work out and he is

669
00:47:37.920 --> 00:47:43.840
forced to work with her and watch
her move on with her life anyway.

670
00:47:43.880 --> 00:47:47.400
When the subpoenas were handed down in
nineteen ninety two, Bobby Brooks immediately requested

671
00:47:47.400 --> 00:47:51.920
a transfer. He moved out of
state and got a job as a bagga

672
00:47:52.000 --> 00:47:55.800
chandler at Minneapolis Saint Paul International Airport, but he was eventually indicted in the

673
00:47:55.800 --> 00:48:00.920
credit card scheme. In exchange for
testifying against Joseph Neuzo, Bobby received a

674
00:48:01.000 --> 00:48:06.800
sense of three years probation. One
question about Sue's murder, Bobby claimed he

675
00:48:06.840 --> 00:48:09.119
was working the late shift at the
airport in Minneapolis on the night she was

676
00:48:09.199 --> 00:48:14.519
killed and that he never had any
communication with Newzo at all that entire weekend.

677
00:48:15.239 --> 00:48:19.239
Well, they're clearly involved in this
scheme together. Can we confirm that

678
00:48:19.320 --> 00:48:22.239
he was working, and did we
know if they could confirm with records that

679
00:48:22.280 --> 00:48:27.039
he didn't communicate with Neuzo. No, we're about to talk about that.

680
00:48:27.039 --> 00:48:30.559
That Bobby's alibi is not exactly rock
solid. No shock, Okay? Cool.

681
00:48:32.800 --> 00:48:37.960
However, in nineteen ninety seven,
Bobby found himself in hot water again

682
00:48:37.159 --> 00:48:42.199
when he was indicted on three counts
of perjury and two counts of obstruction of

683
00:48:42.280 --> 00:48:45.800
justice. It turns out that is
alleged to alibi for Sue's murder was not

684
00:48:45.960 --> 00:48:51.840
exactly rock solid, as time cards
showed that he was not actually working at

685
00:48:51.840 --> 00:48:57.679
Minneapolis Saint Paul International Airport that night, and even though Bobby had testified under

686
00:48:57.719 --> 00:49:01.880
oath that he had no communication with
Joseph Newso that weekend, there were records

687
00:49:01.880 --> 00:49:06.880
of a phone conversation between the two
men on the same day Sue was killed.

688
00:49:07.760 --> 00:49:10.000
In the end, Bobby agreed to
plead guilty to obstruction of justice,

689
00:49:10.400 --> 00:49:15.360
and when sentenced to fifteen months in
prison, but as part of his plea

690
00:49:15.440 --> 00:49:21.760
bargain, he would not have to
face further questioning about Sue's murder. What

691
00:49:21.840 --> 00:49:24.800
kind of plea bargain is that,
Hey, you're in you're in for this

692
00:49:24.920 --> 00:49:30.599
credit card ring. We're going to
have you testify against new Zo And if

693
00:49:30.639 --> 00:49:35.079
you do that for us for this
credit card ring, that little murder that

694
00:49:35.159 --> 00:49:39.880
happened, we won't ask you anymore
about that. Like that seems incredibly backwards

695
00:49:40.159 --> 00:49:45.239
that I'd be more concerned about the
murder that I was the credit card ring.

696
00:49:45.679 --> 00:49:49.920
And how do you just say,
oh, you're helping us here,

697
00:49:50.039 --> 00:49:52.920
so we won't talk to you about
any other crimes that took somebody's life.

698
00:49:53.679 --> 00:49:58.519
Does this remind you both of the
case that we literally just covered the Blount

699
00:49:58.519 --> 00:50:04.039
family bombing and there was the one
guy had like charges of interfering with miners

700
00:50:04.239 --> 00:50:08.920
or like you know, molesting children
or whatever it was, and he basically

701
00:50:08.920 --> 00:50:13.800
had his charges. You know,
they didn't charge him with that because he

702
00:50:13.920 --> 00:50:17.559
gave evidence against who is it Tony? Yeah, Michael roy Towny. Yeah,

703
00:50:19.000 --> 00:50:21.760
unbelievable, Right, the worst crime
you could possibly commit, a crime

704
00:50:21.760 --> 00:50:23.000
against a child. They're like,
ah, we're just gonna look away from

705
00:50:23.039 --> 00:50:28.280
that if you'll help us with this. Yeah, like what in order to

706
00:50:28.320 --> 00:50:30.519
put an innocent man in prison?
So it didn't do anybody any good.

707
00:50:30.639 --> 00:50:34.519
And Yeah, this thing with Bobby
Brooks, I've never heard of this before

708
00:50:34.559 --> 00:50:38.440
a plea bargain where you're exempt from
being questioned about another crime which is considerably

709
00:50:38.559 --> 00:50:43.239
worse than the crime that you're being
indicted for. It's it's so weird and

710
00:50:43.639 --> 00:50:45.480
I'd like to see the terms of
this pleak Reeman. But it sounds like

711
00:50:45.639 --> 00:50:50.800
if they did find evidence that showed
that Bobby was responsible for Sue's murder,

712
00:50:50.800 --> 00:50:52.800
they could charge him for it at
a later time. But I guess these

713
00:50:52.880 --> 00:50:57.119
terms was we can't ask him about
or to question him about it. So

714
00:50:57.199 --> 00:51:00.280
he's essentially getting a free pass for
a crime only got him fifteen months in

715
00:51:00.320 --> 00:51:04.639
prison, So it doesn't seem like
a fair trade off. Okay, one

716
00:51:04.679 --> 00:51:09.360
thing I'm confused about. So Bobby
originally did a plea bargain, he got

717
00:51:09.360 --> 00:51:15.679
the three years probation when he spoke
out against new Zo and Neuzo's role in

718
00:51:15.719 --> 00:51:20.880
the crime, and then this later
plea bargain. What is this later plea

719
00:51:21.039 --> 00:51:23.360
bargain about? Why do they have
to do a plea bargain with him?

720
00:51:23.679 --> 00:51:29.800
Are they just trying to ensure that
they get a conviction because he's already done

721
00:51:29.920 --> 00:51:34.320
testifying against new Zo? What do
they really need to plea down this thing

722
00:51:34.400 --> 00:51:37.480
and go, we're never going to
ask you about anything about Sue. To

723
00:51:37.559 --> 00:51:40.800
Askowitz again, like that seems like
a really weird ad that they didn't need

724
00:51:40.840 --> 00:51:46.199
to do. It is because he
technically got probation for testifying against new Zo,

725
00:51:46.320 --> 00:51:50.760
but he technically violated the terms of
the probation because they caught him in

726
00:51:50.800 --> 00:51:54.719
a lie because they uncovered the phone
records which showed that they had communication that

727
00:51:54.760 --> 00:51:59.559
weekend, even though he had testified
under oath that they didn't. So they're

728
00:51:59.599 --> 00:52:01.440
holding all the cars. They really
don't have to offer him anything. They

729
00:52:01.480 --> 00:52:06.440
could just give him like a fifteen
month prison sends and he's got nothing in

730
00:52:06.480 --> 00:52:09.000
exchange to offer, So I don't
know why they threw those terms into the

731
00:52:09.000 --> 00:52:15.360
plea bargain. Sadly, Sue's death
took a huge toll on her parents' marriage,

732
00:52:15.440 --> 00:52:20.119
as Marlene and Ronald tarasco Its eventually
divorced. Sadly, they would be

733
00:52:20.119 --> 00:52:23.639
forced to endure the pain of losing
another child when Sue's brother, Ronald Tarascus

734
00:52:23.760 --> 00:52:28.599
Junior, i'd expectedly passed away in
July of two thousand and seven at the

735
00:52:28.639 --> 00:52:30.760
age of thirty five, though I'm
not sure what the cause of death was

736
00:52:31.599 --> 00:52:36.360
Ronald Senior himself passed away four years
later at the age of sixty nine,

737
00:52:36.719 --> 00:52:39.760
so the only surviving members of the
Tarrasqwitz family are Marlene and her daughter,

738
00:52:39.840 --> 00:52:44.840
Debbie. Marlene is now eighty two
years old, but she continues to work

739
00:52:44.880 --> 00:52:47.599
diligently to keep her daughter's case in
the spotlight. Every year, on the

740
00:52:47.599 --> 00:52:53.119
anniversary of Sue's murder, Marlene holds
a solitary vigil outside Logan Airport while carrying

741
00:52:53.119 --> 00:52:58.400
a sign containing all the information about
the case. She is also paid to

742
00:52:58.440 --> 00:53:02.000
put up billboards for at the Boston
An area featuring Sue's photograph and contact info

743
00:53:02.119 --> 00:53:07.239
for the authorities. During one interview
for Inside Edition, Marlene stated, quote,

744
00:53:07.280 --> 00:53:10.960
these people that did this are looking
over their shoulder every year because I'm

745
00:53:12.000 --> 00:53:15.679
not going anywhere. I'm a fighter. My daughter was a fighter. End

746
00:53:15.760 --> 00:53:22.920
quote. This is incredible. It's
really sad that you have a marriage that

747
00:53:23.159 --> 00:53:27.199
dissolved in this moment. And one
of the things I found when I worked

748
00:53:27.239 --> 00:53:31.000
with families of these unsolved murders is
that whatever the marriage was like before the

749
00:53:31.039 --> 00:53:36.039
murder usually gets amplified. That's not
always the case, but let's say you

750
00:53:36.039 --> 00:53:39.199
were kind of struggling anyway, then
it quickly dissolves it. If you were

751
00:53:39.239 --> 00:53:44.119
incredibly strong and your marriage is at
the forefront of your family, then it

752
00:53:44.239 --> 00:53:49.199
usually brought people closer together. But
as time goes on, you would start

753
00:53:49.239 --> 00:53:52.920
to see a husband and wife or
a mom and son grieve very differently and

754
00:53:53.079 --> 00:53:58.360
fight very differently, one wanting to
constantly be working on the case, one

755
00:53:58.440 --> 00:54:02.639
wanting to constantly be talking about the
victim and their loved one someone who wanted

756
00:54:02.679 --> 00:54:07.679
to constantly be working with the media, and the other one wanting to try

757
00:54:07.719 --> 00:54:13.159
to move forward, not on,
but forward, while keeping those antennas up

758
00:54:13.239 --> 00:54:16.800
but still needing to move forward to
heal. And it's very possible that happened

759
00:54:16.840 --> 00:54:22.639
here. I'm obsessed with Marlene because
she's just like her daughter was. Sue

760
00:54:22.079 --> 00:54:28.280
refused to lie down when the fight
got tough. She said, I'm gonna

761
00:54:28.440 --> 00:54:31.400
be strong. I'm going to show
people why I got promoted to these positions.

762
00:54:31.400 --> 00:54:36.239
I'm a fighter, like her mom
said. And then you have in

763
00:54:36.320 --> 00:54:39.079
her death her mom saying, bring
it on. I don't care if I'm

764
00:54:39.119 --> 00:54:43.360
one hundred and eight right, I'm
going to be tap dancing to my grave,

765
00:54:43.559 --> 00:54:47.480
fighting for my daughter because I'm a
fighter, and then get this people,

766
00:54:47.800 --> 00:54:53.159
My daughter was a fighter, and
it's unbelievable to me the strength of

767
00:54:53.239 --> 00:55:00.320
these people have. I feel so
much kind of just sadness and pain for

768
00:55:00.440 --> 00:55:06.440
every single family member. They not
only lost their marriage, they lost another

769
00:55:06.519 --> 00:55:10.039
baby. And then Mom's sitting here
going well, I might be losing a

770
00:55:10.079 --> 00:55:13.519
heck of lat in life, but
I will not lose my fight to protect

771
00:55:13.559 --> 00:55:17.840
my kids. So even though Northwest
Airlines merged with Delta Airlines in two thousand

772
00:55:17.880 --> 00:55:22.599
and eight, Delta told the Tarrascoit's
family that they would still honor at the

773
00:55:22.599 --> 00:55:25.280
two hundred and fifty thousand dollars reward
if it led to an arrest in Sue's

774
00:55:25.320 --> 00:55:30.079
case. In addition to being featured
on Unsolved Mysteries and Dateline, this story

775
00:55:30.159 --> 00:55:35.559
also inspired a two thousand and three
episode of Law and Order Criminal Intent titled

776
00:55:35.599 --> 00:55:40.199
Baggage, about a female airline baggage
supervisor who is murdered after enduring constant harassment

777
00:55:40.239 --> 00:55:45.480
from her male co workers. But
unlike that fictional episode, the real life

778
00:55:45.480 --> 00:55:49.800
story would not have a conclusive ending. After thirty years, there's still no

779
00:55:49.880 --> 00:55:53.920
answers about who actually killed Sue Tarrascowitz. So I guess you could say the

780
00:55:53.960 --> 00:55:58.760
path went chilly. So I think
this would be a good time to bring

781
00:55:58.760 --> 00:56:01.559
an into Part one. Join us
next week for Part two as we continue

782
00:56:01.599 --> 00:56:04.880
to discuss the murder of Sutrascoitz