What is krack alagin hardwe Not's listeners, I am Damn Valley coming out you
once more without my fantabulous co host Adam Cromwell. I am, however,
pleased to be joined by Paul Garcia. He covers the Spurs for Projects Spurs.
He's also the host of the Spurs Cast. Follow him on Twitter at
Paul Garcia MBA. As you might have guess, we're gonna be talking about
the San Antonio Spurs. Truly a fascinating team heading into this year, given
everything that happened over the off season and also how they're tangentially. I guess
you would put it linked to the Ben Simmons sweepstakes in Philadelphia, or soap
opera in Philadelphia, whatever you're calling that these days. Our conversation was great
and also highly efficient. Paul dropped like fifty points here on a perfect fourteen
of fourteen shooting, or something fifty points on twelve shots, whatever you want
to call it, So you're gonna enjoy that, I am sure. Before
we get started, just our usual housekeeping notes. Please please, pretty please
continue rating, reviewing, and subscribing to us wherever you get your podcasts.
That helps us out ton in the charts and moving forward. It also helps
us whether or not you use iTunes. If you go over to iTunes search
Hardwood Knox, throw us that five star rating writer review, include criticism if
you must, that is totally fine. We'll take it to heart. Just
throw us that five star rating. That also helps us out a crap ton
into the charts as well. Finally, if you stumbled onto us for the
first time, maybe by accident or because you're a diehard Spurs fan, or
because you're a religious follower of Paul Garcia's content, hello, welcome. Consider
throwing us that permanent subscription. We cover the entire league at large, and
we are pleasantly sub mediocre. Follow us on Twitter as well at hardware Knox.
You can also find us on YouTube. Go to YouTube dot com search
hardwa Knox. We will pop up. We are also on Instagram at Hardwood
Underscore Knox. Now that the housekeeping notes are out of the way, let's
get into some deep san Antonio Spurs talk with Paul Garcia. Paul, thank
you so much for coming back on the Hardwoo Knox podcast to talk some San
Antonio Spurs with us. I keep a spreadsheet of the guests that I've had
on and how many times they've been. This is your fourth appearance, and
this is the third time we've done the Spurs look Ahead, So thank you
for returning so often to talk about San Antonio basketball with us. First and
foremost, though, how are you doing? I'm doing well? You know.
Actually I didn't realize this is a time the fourth time. Now.
I thought it was like like second or third. But yeah, I'm really
glad. It's always a fun conversation to have. The season approaches. The
Spurs this year, I think are still confusing, kind of like they were
last year. But it does seem like what they did this off season was
cannonball more into a youth leaning movement, which I think is something you know,
you always have the national analysts or just people who are moved from San
Antonio who called for that. But it feels like the fans might actually be
relieved that this is finally direct the direction that they're going in. Yeah,
no, for sure, you know, with the team, you know,
letting go of letting Demartaros and Patty Mills, Rudy Gay I'll walk away in
free agency. They have shifted to that tour that youth movement. This is
something that, like you said, the fans have wanted for a long time.
You hear, you know, their their complaints during the season of you
know, let let Dejunty take all the pick and rolls, like Kelton take
doom more on offense, and all these different complaints and now all of a
sudden, here we go, this is it. This this team, this
is that the unit that Pops giving throwing out there. And there's not many
veterans left on this team, and so those young guys are going to be
responsible. So now when the fans get upset, it's gonna have to be
with with these young players that are developing, you know, in their early
twenties. And see, you know, they're gonna have to to live with
those mistakes. And see as this team goes along, is it are they
still sort of trying to straddle two timelines when you look at the McDermott contract,
just having Pop there and just I mean even the age of you know,
I don't call it. We can't call Jante Murray and Derek White prospects
anymore, like they're they're on their second contracts, Like these are just really
good players. So are they still sort of trying to straddle two timelines a
little bit. Yeah, they're kind of in in both both of those modes
where you know, at best, you know, they're trying to get into
that you know, staying that that playoffs, that playing game realm uh,
you know, maybe finishing towards the later part of the Western Conference. But
at worst, you know, if things go south with an all of a
sudden, you've got you've got a top five lottery type team. Here are
top ten lottery team if things don't go well. And yeah, so it's
kind of like they're really just trying to see, you know, what can
these young guys Derek White, John t Murray, Kelton Johnson, these guys
all you know, pop and turn into and then they have some veteran presence
there, you know, guys like like Doug McDermot, who they brought in
some shooting Britt Forbes. So just kind of bringing in pieces around those guys
to really let them try to flourish and see what can they turn into?
Are these going to be real players down down the road here that maybe turn
into an Allstar down the road or not. You know, they'll get that
chance this coming season. Fun Britton Forbes facts for our listeners in case they
didn't know, he led the NBA in points per shot last year. So
just talk about some microwave offense there. You sort of mentioned this already.
Is when you look at if the Spurs are rebuilding, retooling, playing for
the future, whatever it is, I don't know that they have that obvious
mystery box star level you want to call them prospect or young player who is
most likely on this team to make that seize MC leap where maybe we don't
say that's a future All Star, but at least sort of gives their rebuild
a direction, a starting point, a fulcrum, if you will. I
would say, we just say opportunities they're gonna get the season, it's gonna
be j Murray or Derrik White because they're both gonna get those opportunities. They're
going to play together. But then they're also going to get to, you
know, really be in charge of the offense a lot of the times.
And if it's not one of those two players, then they have Calton Johnson
Lonnie Walker the fourth then also Devon Vassell. I really feel like that Devin
Vassell had a really strong summer league but then now that he's back with the
San Antonio team, just based on one preseason game against one, it's one
game. He's got all those other guards and like premier players aroun him,
who get more opportunities before him. So maybe that's why I wouldn't say Devin
as my safe answer. But again I think de Jontay, Derek White and
then maybe even Calton. Are those three players like maybe one of them turns
into to something that, you know, an impactful player down the road from
ten thousand miles out. I agree with you. I would give up some
of my fingers though, if we could see Devin Vassell just get a crack
at more of that type of volume. But look, Demarta Rozen's gone,
even having Patty Mill's gone, are they just officially turning the keys over to
de Jonta Murray on offense? And what do you think? You know,
what do you think he needs to improve upon most in that higher profile role?
And he did quietly have for you know this, our listeners. He
had a really good year last season. Defense was still excellent, and I
thought he showed progress on offense where no, he's not this knockdown jump shooter,
but he seems willing to take them, and I trust him. He
seems less predictable with the ball in his hands in the half court. I
am curious to see though, just what that looks like in a higher profile
role. Yeah, I think it's going to really be on him to see.
You know, what does he turned into on offense, especially the scoring
wise. We know he still has amitterings jumper that he likes to go to.
He was more aggressive, and again it's just one preseason game. In
that first preseason game, he was really good about attacking and really settling in
at the third quarter. He kind of took over in that third quarter and
he ended up with seventeen points in the night. I'm being being one of
the leading scores for the team. And again it all came quickly there in
the third quarter. We also know that he has that potential to basically like
put up stats. He had a multiple triple doubles last year. He's really
gone on the defensive board and getting in ending possessions for the defense, and
like you mentioned, you know, setting up teammates and also on just his
individual defenses is really good too. So I really feel like, yes,
let's see, let's see exactly now with the with basically like the offensive his
hands to see, you know, how does he handle that with with you
know, with driving, with getting the scoring, you know, with the
rose and gone, and especially if Derek White's Nott doesn't have it going for
a night, I automatically think this is the season We're gonna get to see
more of Murray and Derek White play together. But then I'm like, okay,
well De Rosen and Patty Mills are gone, so if they're going to
be even more of an effort to stagger with them, or do we finally
get to see what these two might be able to do it together? So
I think that Coach Pop's first priests the game, showing how he used both
players was really interesting. So he started both them for for a few minutes
till the first six minutes, like the Spurs normally do with their starters,
and then all of a sudden, he took out de john T pretty early
and then he let Derek White stay with the second unit. Then when Derek
White need a break, he brought john T back in. So so we
did see the initial staggering that could be because Tray Jones is out right now
he's out with them a left ankle spring to start the preseason. But again,
like if he doesn't trust coach Pop, doesn't trust Tray Jones, and
you know, and they they don't really have a backup point gard Maybe they
don't want to give the ball to Josh Prema just yet. Well then I
could see him continue that staggering route. But they'll still get you know,
those first six minutes of the first quarter and third quarter together on Tan Derek
White. Yeah, it's you know, it's interesting because I look at this
roster and I'm wondering, is the lack of I think you could say playmaking
in general or just table setters like their biggest weakness right now and you already
kind of you know, stepped on it. This doubles as my is.
You know, Trey Jones when he's healthy, is he going to get minutes
because he had a hell of a summer league himself. Yeah, that's that's
an interesting question. Again, we'll see. Right now, he has heard
it. I know that even for this their second preseason, giving it's Detroit,
he's on the injured list. His listen is doubtful, but we will
see because I mean that was he was kind of like through it through a
wrench in the rotations because of how well he played it at Summer League.
You know, if he's able to put up those kind of numbers and just
that kind of composure at summer League, they're hoping that he can take this
into the season and become that that backup point guard now that Patty Mills is
officially gone. I know he plays a different role than Patty, but yeah,
like, if if Trey's not ready, then coach Pop doesn't see see
him ready to have an increased load workload, then I think that, yeah,
you could see more of the staggery between John Ty and Derek White,
the hopping around on the at line. I saying you hear because you've Josh
Primo already based off what we saw at the Draft combine and then one preseason
game I watched. Did not watch the game. I watched just the Josh
Premo highlights. There is so much that it seems like he can do with
the ball in his hand, And so I'm wondering if one, what intrigues
you most about his game? And two I guess is he sort of the
barometer for how committed they are to this youth movement, because I think in
a normal year he really wouldn't get that much minutes with the regular club.
Yeah, no, no, you're you're right. I mean just I would
say, honestly, like in terms of shot creativity and potential with off the
dribble kind of shots, he's already like like not not in terms of like
accuracy, he's not. He's not there yet, but he's going to be
down the road one of the one of the top players on this team already,
who can who can make difficult shots, who has that potential to really
just throw in you know, you know, you know, I'm crossovers into
into step back jumpers and things like that, and just shooting naturally off off
pick and rolls. He showed that already this first preseason game. He showed
some of that as well in the summer league. So yeah, I think
that he's kind of he's kind of throwing the coaching stuff off a little bit
here where they didn't expect him to play so well so early on. Especially
again it's just one preseason game, but just the way he plays, he's
gonna have to make them start questioning, you know, do we send him
down to Austin, which it should be the normal route for a Spurs rookie.
But then also if this team just isn't very good, you know,
where they really struggle, maybe they could because because just looking at their schedule,
I mean on paper, you would you might expect them to go maybe
like two and twelve at one point or four and fourteen really early on.
If things don't go well, If that does happen, you know, why
not just go into full rebuild mode and let Primo start getting real NBA minutes
against you know, quality opponents rather than sending him to the G league route
if the team again that's only in the case that the team isn't struggling,
but but again, if he plays like this throughout the preseason, where he's
showing some of these these impactful performances, but then I really think that it's
going to really make the coaching staff really question, you know, do we
send him to the traditional rookie route or do they start giving him some minutes
now? And I was also wondering if maybe a coaching staff would be open
to being let's say, more experimental, not because of the direction that Spurs
are headed in, but just you know, when you look at the half
court offense without Damarduroz in last year, like the numbers on that are disgusting,
like they were bad, And so I don't know that there's a clear
cut answer, And I my initial thought was like, you know, maybe
just trying, you know, maybe see what goes on, what's happening with
Trey Jones or Jush for just to see if it helps at all, because
you still need that. Yeah, you have Murray, you have White,
But I guess unless you're expecting like a Lottie Walker or Kelton Johnson or Devin
Misselda to pop or do a lot more with the ball in their hands,
depending on which player are talking about, it feels like this team should be
built to get weird or at least really indulge self discovery no matter what they're
trying to do. Yeah, and I think I think they know that's gonna
be probably one of their weaknesses as half court offense, you know, creating
when when a defensively locks them down. So I think that's why they've shifted
their focus this coming coming get to training campus. They've been talking about coach
Pops as as the players that they just really want to play fast, use
their speeding athleticism to their advantage. So so you saw that in their pace,
you know that they were really pushing the ball up the floor after every
possession. And then also they're going to really rely on something that they talked
about last night is they're gonna rely on their defense to really create offense for
them, and they need that. They basically need to get stops and create
you know, havoc on the defensive end so that they can get out in
the open court and use a lot of these these young athletes. I'm out
there in the open court because yes, once a team gets into their half
court offense, I mean, and their half court defense and really buckles down
on San Antonio, you do see where where they did struggle even even though
the Jazz were missing multiple, you know, core players in this preseason game.
You saw that when it really got to a you know, a more
half court oriented game, with like fourteen seconds left of the shot clock,
San Antonio did struggle. You know, they were trying to run their sets
and they really weren't going anywhere. And so I think, again, that's
are you gonna They're gonna really miss the rosen And that's why they got to
continue to push the pace and try to, you know, avoid letting a
defense get set up like how they want to. It's also real to hear
Pop talking about that. I know the Spurs in more recent years, like
they've had certain lineups that really just get after it up and down the floor,
but they've always just been built on such like this methodical, deliberate approach.
And it's there's just something surreal about going into the preseason hearing Pop talk
about like their identity needs to be like this frenetic pace. It's just I
don't know, it feels, it feels it's kind of awesome, but it's
just it's like an outer body experience for me looking so far outside the picture.
Yeah, I mean you mentioned experimental and that's kind of what it feels
like already. I mean, I don't again, I can't, Like I've
talked about this on a few podcasts where I just don't feel like Hops have
ever been in this situation where you know, the expectations aren't champion, championship
or bus so you know, and then it's also where you know there's just
really no a lot, not a lot of brometers for this team to have
to set. So you see him being more experimental, like like you said,
on offense, you know, wanting to go fast, and then even
saw this in the one preseason game, he's already experimenting like crazy, where
he's already like throwing in a half court trap and stuff like I think he
just likes the fact that like there's not like a go to player on this
team on offense, but then on defense he can basically because they are all
these players are so switchy and you know they're all along in athletic he can
basically, you know, have different schemes, whether it's his zone for a
possession or throwing in a half court trap or just different things with their energy
and just taking a little bit more risk and gambles and just seeing what you
know, this team turns into. I think that even for Pop, he's
very excited. Just looking at his mood and his tone coming into this season.
That's awesome because I think there's that when you just look at his age,
there's not a two ways that could go. This team could frustrate the
hell out of him, or he could just go full mad scientist and lean
into it. And so I'm just really hoping it's the ladder. Yeah,
so okay, we'll see they end up like two and twelve that it could
change. I went back and watched a lot of Kelvin Johnson towards the end
of last season because I think like he was just one of the players that
I feel like, not that I passed judgment on too soon, but you
think that you know what he was and he was. People have just described
like he seemed to thrive on this chaotic energy. Towards the end of the
season, it felt like there was just a little bit more finesse or change
in direction to his game offensively, and I'm just wondering, like, what
do you view as the best version of Kelvin Johnson offensively or maybe even what
type of opportunity do you think he's going to get on this specific roster construction
offensively? Is there a more dynamic player long term than we saw last season
on that side of the floor. Yeah, I think we're gonna see exactly,
you know, what can you turn into, especially in the A half,
because that's where he kind of struggles. You know, we saw that
if you if you watch tape from last year, you'll see that he was
he was very good about being aggressive, getting to the free to line,
get into the pain and scoring early on from like December to about February.
But then by like February, teams kind of figured him out. They know
that all he wants to do is score inside, so they purposely started backing
away off the three point line. And then of course he struggled a little
bit because people, you know, defenders are just leaving wide open and they
congested the lane for him. So he definitely said that he's wanted to work
on his shot. His strug looks a little bit different right now in preseason.
It's a little bit quicker, and he wasn't shy about taking them.
He didn't make any last night in this first preseason game. But one thing
that was interesting to watch that you see from the coaching staff is that he
was getting a chance to run multiple pick and rolls where if Calton brings the
ball down, he right away calls for a screen for Yakapotle set a screen
or Doug McDermott to set a screen for him. And so you've got to
see more opportunity to create now, not again, not just Derek and de
Jaunty, but now Kelton is also getting that opportunity. So again I don't
know exactly how far he's gonna go in that and that, you know,
being an offensive player in the half court, But again I think that that's
it's good to see that the coaching staff wants to see how much can he
development into that type of role. I think it's it'll definitely help him be
if his jumpers not working. That's he's just seemed again as the year went
on, more comfortable, like spinning or changing directions a little bit as he
got closer to the basket, even if the end result wasn't always great.
But I feel like if you wanted him to be in that sort of pick
and roll capacity in the half court, like, there's gonna need to be
some progress, whether it's a pull up jumper or at least like where defenses
are worried about him stepping into even if it takes forever for him to own
work at three or even just as a spot up shooter, improving his percentages
on those looks. Yeah, for sure. I think that's that's the big
one right now that I'm watching is the spot up shooting. You know,
how is he going to be when when he's left wide open, and so
again we'll kind of well see what happens there. I have no idea what
to make of Lonnie Walker. I just don't like, We're three years into
his career and I'm not sure I've seen We've seen like the highs, we've
seen the lows, we've seen the middles. His career has been so on
even what is the biggest aspect of his game that he needs to work on
to ensure that he's a part of this team long term? He is extension
eligible, Yeah, I personally would be a little bit surprised if he ended
up getting one, which is why I'm framing the question that way. Yeah,
No, You're You're right, And I think that the biggest thing that
he needs to work on it. I think that that's been the same case
for Lonnie is consistency. I mean, he has these these these these crazy
nets would put up twenty two, twenty five points and just look like you
know, he can he can he can drive on a defense in the pick
and roll, he can go, you know, just go coast to coast
on a team. He can shoot. He can make threes, whether it's
off the drib or spot up action. But then and you know, and
some some nights you say okay with maybe because Rosen was out or somebody was
out of the rotation, so he got more opportunity. But then there's games
where like the Rosen was out or you know, somebody was hurt and all
of a sudden he got to start, and he still only put up maybe
like six points in the games. And so again it's just that consistency where
he's never been consistent. Again, last night, in this first preseason game,
he looked really good. You know, he took like a crossover and
then just made made a three. He was driving in and kicking to teammates.
Defensively, he was really active. I'm really getting doing a great job
of moving his feet and getting in front of the opponents. But again,
you know, is this going to care him to the second game and then
the third game? And that's kind of been the question of Lonnie, is
that he's had these he's had these these signs before of being this you know,
this player at another level, but he never consistently brings forth those performances.
And so, yeah, you're right, you know, with that extension
coming up on the eighteenth of October, which is thirteen days away from from
you and I recording this. I don't see san Antonio. I'm giving him
that extension. But again, if he has two or three more, you
know, impactful preseason games and it looks like this is going to be a
consistent Lonnie Walker, then maybe, who knows what happens. I'm assuming the
opportunity will be there at least early in the regular season for him because he's
you know, you mentioned some of the shots he's hitting, Like there's no
other guy on the team that's comfortable hitting the types of shots, and like
that's what you would you would love to see that out of a Murray or
Johnson. Maybe White comes closest, or is Josh Primus. But like the
fact that we're going that deep now into it, like he is, like,
there's no one else on this team to me that's comfortable hitting in theory
that the shots that he can take and make. Yeah, no, you're
right, I mean, just just saying it, just seeing those names,
I think after Lonnie is probably Primo who's most natural to be able to kind
of crusty old Yeah, exactly. So, so it's so, yeah,
Salani has that potential. But again we'll kind of see you know, you
know, how how much he's able to keep that consistent. I think that
one thing you saw with him as well is you know when he came on
off the bench, he's you know, poplex season in that six man type
of role he started doing that last year. Is that he he's actually getting
a lot of opportunity as well. It was really cool to see at the
end of the first quarter, you know, with twenty with like twenty seconds
I timing down, they let they let Lonnie run the final pick and roll
of a possession and so he rans something with Yakov and so again he's gonna
get those opportunities, just like Kelton, just like Murray, and just like
White. We're we're going to see, you know what, what kind of
player can you turn into, especially with you know, no de Rosen there
and more to be in the way. Evan Vassll. Every team has a
player that I would follow to helen back and I think Devin Vasella is mine
for the Spurs. It could be Jean Day Murray, I'm not it's a
toss up between those two. He's going to be really good. I know.
It's three ball dropped off like towards the talent of last year. He's
got just as a three D guy, he's going to be spectacular. Is
that what he is? Or do you see more elements to his game that
he could be this more you know, expansive player. I think we're going
to see more elements to his game. And we saw that. You know,
it's gonna be slowly, but but there's going to be more and more
that comes with Devin Vasilla in the years to come. And we saw that
initially at Summer league on this passed off this past summer where they wanted him
to purposely run more pick and roll, run more more you know, one
on one sets and just see what you know. The assistant coach at the
time, Mitch Johnson, basically said, you know, how he performs at
some league is going to dictate, you know, what kind of role he
gets here with the San Antonio team down the line. And so he was
really impressive in some league you know, you know wh where he was running
a lot of pick and roll when defensive would go under it on him on
screens. He was getting to his spot there in the mid range and that
was a pretty good shot for him. He saw that they learned how to
they learned how to switch it on him, They learn how to switch over
the screens, they learned how to just to trap him at times, and
he and he did struggle with that, but then he said he wanted to
be in those opportunities to learn, you know, exactly how to adjust the
defense. Uh. And then, like I said earlier, you know,
going into him this this preseason game, he didn't get that opportunity with all
those different ball handlers on the floor. But then all of a sudden,
the third quarter comes and he just has a really impactful quarter where he finally
got to rout a pick and roll and he got you know, he got
a screen and he actually took it down for a dunk. He had a
midriage jumper, he had a three go down. So he had a pretty
good game as well. And of course, defensively, it's always gonna be
their forum. He's really good at anticipation. He's got long arms. And
I remember Zach Loo recently wrote a piece last week on Devin and he just
talked about how Devin basically like like was able to hold him a Trey Young
forever possession pretty well. That not a lot of defenders were able to do
at the NBA level, So I think defensively, it's always gonna be there
for him. It's going to see now we're going to see, now how
much can he expand on offense if he winds up running multiple pick and rolls
per game. I'm gonna do like I'm I'm gonna riot in celebration because that
would be that I would just love to see it. I think he's gonna
get the chance. Yeah, what is so how are they going to use
Daddy as young on this team? Like? Is he gonna primarily play backup
five? Will he play a bunch with Jaku Peartle. I think he was
first of all that deal for Demarta rozen They absolutely they killed it, and
so he's definitely someone who could help this team. I'm just curious as to
how they're actually going to deploy him. Yeah, So here in San Antonio,
we're still watching that date October eighteenth, because that's the day that the
Spurs thirteen days now, the Spurs need to need to trim the roster down
from they have seventeen guaranteed players and two players need to get waved or traded
by the end. So so Daddy is young, is one of the players
we're keeping an eye on whether he gets traded. You know, we don't
think he'll get waved, just because of the valley he brings to the team.
And then also Alfred Caminos another player. So so in terms of Daddy,
it's like it was interesting already first preseason game, he had zero minutes
to him and he and Amino didn't play at all. Popped in and use
them. Now, if he stays on the team past the eighteenth of October,
I do think that he will have a role here because San Antonio needs
to keep his trade value high, so they have to keep playing him.
And so you know, he could either fit in off the bench, I
think at the four or the backup five. But you know, you have
Drew Eubanks playing well there. You have Jack Landale, that news center that
they brought in play playing well there as well. Uh, and then even
at the four. Actually Devin got those minutes at the four last night.
I think kellyop wants to continue. Yeah, Devin got the four, the
backup four minutes, So so really, Pop us to give you a lot
of a lot of wings out there. So I don't know you know where
he's gonna fitting on the roster. But I think that for sure he's gonna
have to play if he stays past the eighteenth of October, because they need
to keep this trade value high, and I know that they want to try
to, you know, try to get some assets for him, you know,
considering he's a he and a Meano or the two you know, veterans
who don't really fit on this team right now? Do you think there's a
chance that they wave a mening before the start of the season. Yeah,
with the Meana, I think there's a chance. Maybe they look like for
like a buyout, so you know, he's got ten million coming back,
or he's got ten million that he's old, so I maybe let me like
an eight eight million dollars buyout something like that that he can maybe make it
up with the vet with the team on a veteran minimum. So I think
a mino there's a very high chance he gets a buy out. There's a
few teams already looked at that have trade exceptions that could absorb Amino or Young.
But again it's really tough to see, you know, who's gonna get
moved. But there has to be a move here within the next thirteen days.
And I look at their front court rotation, specifically the four five,
and maybe some of this is organically solved because Zach Allens, we don't even
know when he's gonna play. It sounds like if they decided to wave a
meto, they could find a trade for Sad. But you look at you're
talking about those three guys. There's Kelvin Johnson, you mentioned Devin Vasselo spend
some time at the four. I would imagine you at least want to like
maybe they're interchangeable, but like Doug McDermot and probably factor into there a little
bit. And so I'm just curious as to how you see sort of the
four five rotations shaking out for San Antonio once this season starts. Okay,
so yeah, so I had, you know, coming into the season,
I had you know, I had McDermott probably starting, and then Lucas Somonitor,
who doesn't get a lot of minutes playing the backup for or at that
he's young, if young still on the team. But basically looking at what
coach Bob in the first preseason game he had he had McDermott starting at the
four, and then now that he wants to keep keeping more wing oriented on
the on the on the front court. He actually had Devin at the four,
so that that throws off the minutes for everybody. Luca's kind of got
buried even further now down and wout. Yeah, Kata based Jop was playing
before Lucas Somonitch and so at one point I was like, I was watching
the game and when Pop wasn't bringing in Luca, I was like, is
you know it's Luca part of this? Maybe there's a trade with Daddy's young
and Amino going somewhere. Maybe Luca's like that young trade chip to throw in
for a team. But then you know, he eventually got some time.
But I just feel like Luca has never had a chance and he's just kind
of been in Austin to the last two years. And again looking at the
rotation from the first preseason game, it doesn't look like he's in the rotation
again to start. But that's kind of my thoughts on where I see the
fore going. So how do you so, what's the starting lineup do you
think actually gonna wind up looking like? Then? I think the one that
we saw yesterday where it's gonna be Derek, Jontay Kelton, Doug McDermott,
and Jaka Purdle. Okay, so it sounds like you don't expect that he's
shown to be on this team by the end of the season. No,
no, I do not, And just listening to his comments and also Amanos,
they're basically giving those you know, veteran quotes of like, you know,
as long as we're for the time that we're here kind of stuff.
You know, we're gonna be professional, We're gonna be you know, mentors
that they're giving those kind of quotes and interviews. So it almost sounds like
like their answers like they know they're not going to probably be here a long
term for the end up until the end of the season. This is I
don't even need to ask you then, who's the player most likely to get
traded because it's him. This was low hanging fruit. That does feel like
something I know you mentioned maybe before the start of the season. We're almost
being some prizing if they found a deal before then. It feels like he
might be one of the guys that just moves. December fifteenth, I think
it is when like every team can is just get to more players on their
roster can be dealt right now. It just gets a little bit tough for
for some of the teams to do anything given how many players are ineligible to
be moved. Yeah, I no, no, Like you're right, so
you know it could I could very well see him going past October eighteenth,
up until maybe that December fifteenth deadline where they have, you know, more
more teams to trade with, because right now, like I said, there's
only a few teams that have a trade exception large enough to absorb Daddy's song.
I don't even know if those teams would would want Daddy's song and against
get it. It's only a certain amount of teams because they have to be
more select those contenders or those those playoff level teams. So there's not a
lot of teams to work with right now. But yeah, I don't I
don't. You know, it wouldn't surprise me if he's still on the team
past the eighteenth of October, but but it would it would very much surprise
me if he's still here by February tenth, which is the trade deadline.
I did not, for some reason send you anything about this when I was
sending you an outline so you can feel free to punt on it. But
so you actually viewed san Antonio as a dark horse Ben Simmons suitor, And
do you even like the idea of Ben Simmons in San Antonio? Yeah,
no, no, I I do. You know, every time, every
time that there's a rumor about the Spurs, you know, you know,
inquiring about him, I always we always report on it over on our website
and also on our podcast, the Spurs Casts, And so yeah, I
really think that, yes, you know, san Antonio's gonna continue to stay
engaged. I think with Philly because you know, for them, you know,
Simmons I think would be a good option for san Antonio because again Murray
Wide, you know, Devassell, these players, they could have that potential
down the road, we don't know for sure. Whereas Ben Simmons, you're
getting an All NBA level player, You're getting an all Star right now,
and then you get him in San Antonio and then you start building a team
around him, especially you know, coming into the next season as being one
of the one of the few teams that actually has a good amount of cap
space, so you can kind of restructure roster to fit around Ben Simmons and
kind of work with them, you know his strengths and weaknesses. So I
really feel like, yes, as long as the price, you know,
whatever the trade package comes down from what Philly would accept. Right now,
I think that yes, Sanatona is gonna continue to call and kind of a
stay, stay engaged in those conversations until you know, he eventually gets moved,
because I really feel like, yes, if, if, if he's
there for the right trade package that san Antonio is comfortable with, I think
that yes, they would make that move. Uh and to to to bring
in Brent Ben Simmons, and I think he has regardless of what people think
of Ben Simmons now, he has the better chance of being a north Star
for your rebuild than either a Murray or Derek whiter and Johnson or Vassell at
this point. Yeah, I know I agree again just because we know what
he is. You know, you know what he is already as a player,
you know, at the level he can get to. And then and
then I think that from there you can you can really kind of do it.
Well. He's been saying, you know, through through through through his
you know in these reports that you know he wants to team boats around him,
and I think that the Spurs would be able to do that where they
can start, you know, moving maybe some of these young players to get
to get in whether it's shooting around him or you know whatever, different players
that they feel what best work with Simmons. And again, now now all
of a sudden, you have your your your all star, you're all unbable
level player for the next four years if you're san Antonio there and they could
offer a bunch of different packages. Which interesting about there is they could be
one of the teams where you need that third or fourth team if Phil he's
really just dead set on getting a star back for Ben Simmons, Like they
can offer to me the best of both worlds when you look at having a
Murray and a White to include that someone like a Devin Vassell who can already
play now but it's a prospect, and then picks. They can offer the
best of both worlds. No, they can't offer you an incumbent star.
But if you're going to accept like the tea or less, or if you're
gonna settle at any point, if you're Philly, yeah, I think sant
Antonio's package probably intrigues me most unless maybe Sacramento puts like Tyrese Halibert and on
the table, which it doesn't sound like they're gonna do. Yeah, No,
I think I think that's a perfect word. You said, they're settle.
I think that if Philly ever gets to the point where they're willing to
settle on what they're asking for Simmons, I think that sant Antone is one
of those perfect trade partners for them. Were yet the young players they have,
they have some picks just to send as well, and it would just
be again on Philly bringing their trade package what they're asking for it down.
This question is always somewhat matchup dependent. But what do you think should be
there go to crunch time lineup this season? Oh okay, that's an interesting
question. I think let me just think here, So I would say Murray,
Derek White, Lonnie, let's see here, maybe maybe McDermott, someone
at the four, maybe McDermot of a cell and then for a big I
don't know if I want to necessarily go Yaka, but but you know,
if Thaddy songs on the team, maybe him or or maybe Yaca just again,
I would want over you know, I know, I didn't include Kelton
in there, just because when it comes to crunch time, you want shooting
in their shooting that you trust more so, and I know Murray's not a
knockdown shooter, but at least you trust is play making a little bit more.
Whereas when Kelton got stuck in those crunch time situations last year, he
really struggled, and that's that was he wasn't in a lot of those rotations.
And so I think that those those players can all kind of shoot,
and they can kind of play make for themselves and for others. You going
through all those names just made me realize how many options that they just have
to sort of fuss and fiddle with and their lineup. And it's also makes
me curious as to you know, you mentioned Jocque Landale and then you have
Drew you Banks plus Peartle. I kind of thought this team might be built
to go a little bit smaller at points where Thaddy is young would play a
lot of five. He's still there even if you get rid of them,
maybe you just go nuclear and try those smaller lineups there. But do you
think that they're that interested in Obviously we know what Yako Peartle can do as
a rim protection. They also still look Zach Collins is on this roster too.
So do you think that they are a team that could play smaller for
stretches or is that their center rotation they're gonna play more true bigs for most
of the time. No, No, they're gonna stick to I think just
just two traditional centers. I think it's always gonna be yak Up starting and
then there's gonna be that battle between you Banks and Landals. Last year there
was that battle between you Banks and and Gorgy Jank when now it's it's Landale
and Eubanks and and and Zach Collins will throw it throw a wrench in here
in this situation because coach pop just said recently that they're expecting him back after
Christmas time, that he could be returning to the floor by like January.
So so yeah, so so they'll get a few months with Zach Collins is
able to compete there for some minutes. But yeah, I think that based
on the rotations, they're gonna try to keep it more so to just keeping
one five and a lot of more wing and guard players at from the other
four positions. You're a great Popovich in this scenario and your task with throwing
out a quirky, unconventional, weird on line up that you have no idea
how it's gonna fare, but we just need to see it to find out
what will happen. Which five guys you're rolling with. I'm gonna go all
wings, like it's just like a lot of wings. Saw. I would
go at like de Jonte, Derek White, Lonnie Walker, Devin Vassell and
then you know, I don't know who that who that other one. Maybe
maybe it's starting maybe even starting Josh Premo in that line up, just to
just to have a little bit more fun. Oh Calton, I forgot Coltan.
So yeah, So basically basically putting like like Vassell at the five and
then it four is like Kelton, then yeah you got Lonnie and then you
got you still got Murray and just a bunch of wings, a lot of
speed. You know, they have some shooting in that lineup, and just
kind of saying go out paste the teams. And that's something I've tried.
I've tried to do before on an NBAHUK with those kind of line up.
Mine was for them was along the similar lines. I need to see Murray
White, Premo Vassell, and Kelvin Johnson. Just give me those five and
see what would happen. I'm with you though, like they're built to have,
like just play all wings just for a few just for a few possessions
each game. I need to see it. Yeah, so that would be
it would be intense. Their current wind total over under as we record this
to set at twenty nine point five, there are curveballs that can go into
that. Obviously, it seems like what's baked in is they could pivot really
into a rebuild and trade not only thaty is young, but they look at
trading someone else. Would you what's you're feeling on the over under there?
And where do you sort of see them stacking up in the large picture of
the Western Conference? Okay, so I have, unfortunately have two answers here
because like I have pre watching the preseason, then I have now post watching
the preseason game at least one there, So you know, on paper,
I kind of went through their schedule and I got them to like twenty six
wins. But I would just go safely say yes, I'm over at the
thirty. I would just say over just because it's the Spurs. You know,
teams are gonna get into dealt with like injuries and all these different situations,
So I really feel like they could get to at least over thirty now
as far as where they stack in the West, I do also see them,
you know, outside of the playing game originally coming in but based on
again it's one priest in the game, so I don't want to put too
muchmphsis on it. But but if they can really show that they're a top
ten level defense, and I think that there's there's a little bit of potential
there with the team that they're bringing back with losing a lot of their weaknesses
like having Deronda Rosen and Patty Milson of those other players that weren't as strong
defensively, if they can get to becoming a top ten defense, I really
feel like, you know, now we're talking you know, maybe maybe playing
games back or maybe even yeah, yeah, playing game I would say it
is right now, it's the safest answer. Uh and and just wins,
you know, that's gonna be you know, at worst, maybe like a
thirty thirty five win team. If you can become like a top and defense,
again, it kind of matters on how how good can they be defensively
because right now, again it was one game, but they have the pieces
there to be a really good defense. Yeah, they look like they could
be super disruptive on the defensive end. Is there a chance, like,
let's say they're just better than expective to start the year. I would never
view them as buyers, but like, is there just that, then you
just don't move daddy. It's like, what if you're just so good and
you are in the playing conversation, Let's say they're let's say they're eighth,
like heading into the trade deadline, do you just keep that he's young at
that point and be like, hey, like we're here already. We're not
gonna how quickly we're gonna be able to bottom out without him because coach Pop
is still in charge of the team, you know, coaching the team.
He's Yes, they would keep that that circumstance. Yeah, And that's the
one thing about that he said, you know, taken away from from from
young some of the younger players, is that as soon as they start winning
games and if he and he's and he's on the court, you know,
impactful, Pop is not gonna let him go. He's not gonna let him
just get traded just for you know, pick down the road or something like
that. He's gonna want to keep him in and staying as competitive as they
can. So again, if they're in that ballpark of being within that playing
game range, then yeah, I think that if Daddy was part of what
they're not going to let him go, is there a chance that they could
go in the opposite direction beyond Daddy is Young, Because if you take Daddy
is Young off this team, I still don't view it as anything close to
one of the three worst teams in the NBA three or even five. And
if you are going to commit to the rebuild, you want to give yourself
the best chance at like the highest lottery odds. At the same time,
I don't think you look at this roster and say, aside from Daddy is
Young, well, you could look at moving this guy. But is there
a chance that they would visit that end of the spectrum where they'd be willing
to entertain offers on a Murray or a White in the middle of maybe a
Lonnie Walker or a or even a Doug McDermott. If they're really trying to
go hohle hog into this rebuild, No, I don't think they would.
They would start, you know, moving those players unless you were getting somebody
like you know, like Ben Simmons, Like we discuss it just because it's
it's an A star, unless you're getting an All Star player than no,
I don't think they would even if they even things went went south for this
team. All that's all I see. What they would they would do is
like players like McDermott or or just like you know, some of the Murray
they would maybe start start giving those minutes like Josh Primo to two younger players
like Trey Jones, maybe get some lucasmontage, maybe gets some so a good
if things went south, they could just see them, you know, basically
like like kind of limiting the core players minutes and kind of giving the young
players some minutes. But you know again, I don't unless it's like a
it's like an All Star player that they're getting back. It's a very impactful
player. I can't see them moving, you know, some of some of
these young core pieces like Maria derk White or a line Walker, those kind
of players. I don't mean to put you on the spot here, but
how do you which two players do you think end up. I think it's
two players they need to get rid of before Open Night, which two yeah,
they have to get rid of, but two players I would just say
right now, save us answers to say Amenu and Daddy Song just because they're
the two veterans, they don't really fit with this team. But you know,
if they can't find takers, well then then then from there, let's
just say they both stay on the team past the eighteenth of October. Then
I would say the next the next round would be the guys on on on
shorter contracts and maybe like a Kadabates job. And I don't even know who
with the second player would because you know, Drew Gabanks played really well and
I don't think they want to move him from this team. Yeah, I
mean together if they just have so many players that I think you would want
to keep on the roster. So I would be shocked. Wow, I
can't there. You would definitely be floored if they negotiate a buy out with
Daddy h. Right, if someonea ends up getting Thady is Young for for
free, that doesn't you know, it doesn't mean they lost to the margin
ros and the like that that he is Young was like the second best player
on the Bulls last year. Yeah, no, no, I can't.
I can't see a bio with him. You know they're gonna they would try
to keep him up until that February tent trade adline and try to get something
for him. You know, I remember when he first got traded San Antonia.
You know, Zachlo on his podcast was kind of just entertaining the idea
of getting a back of first round pick. And so I think that if
you can get either young player and you know, a veteran just to make
the salaries work or I'm getting back you know, maybe a first or at
least some two seconds just like that down the road, then you think you
have to hold on him until February tenth. Is there? We covered a
lot in an efficient amount of time for this For this podcast specifically, I
tend to be very verbose and long. Is there anything or anyone about this
roster that I did not ask about that you think needs to be covered?
No, I'm just honestly, like, I know, it's one preseason game,
but man, it's like you just gotta really wait and see, you
know, what this team turns into. Because I am very I'm very interested
to see what they become because again it was one preseason game. They looked
really good. They want by twenty six points, but that defense, just
the commune unication, the moving around, the pop throwing weird traps already in
a preseason game, and just the high level of energy and the pace.
It's interesting because this is something we haven't seen from a San Antonio team.
Me that I've been covering them for ten years now, I've never seen this
kind of this kind of a team. And so just to see a bunch
of young athletic wing players who want to use speed and just you know,
just a lot of energy and high potential. You know, I do want
to see what they turn into. You know, maybe maybe it is a
bad year and they end up being at the top ten lottery team like they're
supposed to be according to Vegas or who knows, maybe maybe they surprise people
and you know, they end up becoming a top ten defense and that carries
them, even though they will have their offensive struggles, into becoming, you
know, one of those teams who's fighting for a play and seed. Do
you think they'll be a top to They were thirteenth outside of garbage time in
points aloud of per possession last year. Do you think they'll be hot better
than the thirteenth this year? The talent's there, but then they're also so
young. It's like I don't I don't know what to do with that.
Yeah, that's why, that's why it's hard to say. You know,
I want to say yes, because again they lost some of their weaker defenders
and Rozen and Patty Mills, and now they've they've they've added some some better
defenders, like you know, when you're just giving them not really adding defenders,
but just having more more more players who are to be better about communicating
and moving moving around the floor and just having more high level communication. I
want to say yes, that that potential is there, but again we'll kind
of have to wait and see. Right now, I think we I'm gonna
go out on a limit and say that they're better than nineteenth in turnovers forced
because if they're going to run traps like that all year, and that's never
been like, I don't know, the Spurs great defensive teams, So when's
the last time they ranked like super high and forcing opponent turnover? They're all
about like not fouling or being like super fundamental. This feels like a team
that's just gonna maybe they'll foul a ton, but it feels like they're going
to force a crap ton of turnovers as well. Yeah, no, no,
I think so. And again, like you kind of saw it in
that in that first priests A game where you know, Pops Letting Johnson Murray
trying to go into those deals. Even last year, Devi of a cell
was given that freedom to kind of anticipate and try to try to go for
some some some you know, incoming passes, even if he missed assignments at
times, and you know, he was still able to get his minutes and
and log plain time. So I feel like, yes, they're gonna take
a lot more risk than a normal Spurst team would do. And so so
we'll see how that pays off. And then of course they still got Yaka
Purtle back there at the five near the paint to help, you know,
command the paint area, who was statistically like one of the most effective M
protectors, if not the most effective M protectors in the league last year.
Yeah, it hit a really good season last year. And just so last
year the Spurs were nineteenth and opponent turnover percentage and they were in the bottom
five and the two previous years before that, so I think it's pretty safe
to say they're gonna blow that out of the water. Paul, this was
great as always. Are you able to tell our listeners where they can follow
you on social media and also where they can find your work? Sure,
you know on Twitter? I usually on Twitter lot, so you can follow
me at Paul Garcia, NBA. I write for Project Spurs dot com analyzing
the league dot com and then you can listen to me on the Spurs cast
to weekly. You do a lot, you do it extremely well. I
appreciate these chats as always. You're always it's always fun to pick your brain
about the Spurs, and thank you so much for your time. And I
think, as you know by now, in the future, I will be
coming to call again. Awesome, cool, looking forward to it.