What's up, y'all is Drewski and I've teamed up with Mountain Dew to produce
a hilarious new basketball podcast called The d Zone with Drewski. Learn the backstories
of your favorite balls and celebrities like Jamal Murray. Did you have like a
favorite team? Was it the Raptors at the time or no, was the
Raptors even started on the top? Come on, bro Hi, tell you
like I'm vivit, the Taylor Roges, Asian Wilson, and any more.
You won't want to miss this. Listen to The Dzone with Drewski on Apple
Podcast, Spotify, and wherever you listen to podcasts. Hello everyone, and
welcome to the latest episode of Hardwood Knocks. This is Adam Prommel here with
my fantastic co host Dan Favalley, and we have a special All Hardwood Knocks
edition of the podcast today. Rather than going over the traditional all NBA teams,
which we will be doing in a later episode, we're gonna be going
over the players who we enjoyed watching most. This is different than the Awards
Conversation, which we will actually be doing on Locker Room this Sunday at four
pm Eastern, So please join us there for that, we're definitely excited to
go over all the biggest awards. But again, this is not that we're
looking at the players who entertained us the most, who made us want to
watch them the most, to put up big numbers in an entertaining way,
however you define it. That's how we approached this, Dan, was it
a fun exercise an enjoyable one? How did you personally approach this? I
think it was really enjoyable. It was definitely interesting, though to the extent
of how it made me think of measuring enjoyment, because there is that natural
pull to stars and the big names. But you also, when you really
think about this, you start to realize there are just players. Maybe some
of them are off beat, maybe they're more middle of the road who you
just still really enjoy watching. And so I'm still personally when you look at
my first team, let's say I gravitated towards stars there because like, those
are the players I'm watching most frequently. But as I got deeper, I
think you even noted about my third team. It's there is like a finer
appreciation for it. And I did try to wait that where it's like just
because as a spoiler, like Lebron James didn't make any one of my teams.
It's not that I don't enjoy watching Lebron James, it's there are people
that he gets enough shine, and so especially after my first team, I
tried to focus on those who I just wanted to highlight that maybe weren't necessarily
obvious inclusions. You know what's really interesting about Lebron James here is we incorporated
fan voting for this as well. So the All Hardwood Knox team is determined
by my ballot, which counts for a third, Dan's ballot, which counts
for a third, and fans submissions because we ask you on Twitter or wherever
else you are engaging with the Hardwood Knocks account the NBA math account to submit
your own All Hardwood Knox teams, and we compiled those and then created the
overall composite rankings that are the All Hardwood Knox team. So, again,
full parts between myself, Dan and the fans. Lebron did not get love
from anyone. He was not on my list. He actually didn't even make
my honorable mention this season. Had I ended up writing down thirty six names
as I was trying to pull this down to fifteen. The fans also did
not vote him on there Is. He finished twenty first in the fan vote,
which was really surprising to me. I figured that the name value alone,
especially considering the fan vote, tended to gravitate a little bit more towards
stars than either you or I did. Dan, I thought that he would
be hiring that one. I'm surprised he fell aside the top twenty the fan
vote. I'm also surprised that you only had thirty seven players written down as
the initial thing. Well, I had like thirty eight down, and then
you told me to remove Dylan Brooks. Yeah, I don't. I can't
believe you enjoy watching Dylan brook I enjoy watching his defense, and then I
closed my eyes and don't watch well he has the ball exact. I mean
there are probably some nights though, where you really could enjoy when he does
have the ball. I guess that's the appeal of Dylan Brooks. Yeah,
kind of like the car crash theory. Can't take your eyes off it,
and then there's also a chance that maybe something good will happen too. Also,
I didn't actually remove him from my honorable mentions. To spite your disapproval,
I didn't even come up with honorable mentions. I deleted everyone off my
Google spreadsheet once I pinned it down to my final fifteen. And I will
say no, I'll wait till I get to him. But one player ended
up on two different teams. There's the same I didn't keep it that way,
but when I went through it to proof it before I sent it to
you, I had the same player list. That's how much that I enjoy
watching said player. I'm going to be very curious to hear who that is.
But do you want to start from the first team or the third team
here? Oh, I don't know, what do you think? I think
we should start from the first team? That works for me? Okay,
so yeah, we're gonna these follow the traditional All NBA format, which the
validity of that is a topic for another time. Shout out to Joel Embiid
there. But it does have two guards, two forwards in a center,
and the forwards in the centers are are kind of interchangeable now more than ever.
So I think both of us kind of cheated a little bit at times
there, and validly so, I believe because we wanted to get our favorite
guys in there. But let's start with our first team guards. We had
one in common across the board, so our first entry on the All Hardwood
Knox team is Steph Curry, who made the first team for me, made
the first team for you, and made the first team for the fans,
and among fans, he was actually the second highest vote getter of any player.
I don't know that there's another player in the NBA that, realistically,
I'll probably say some hyperbolic shit throughout this podcast that I enjoy watching more than
Stephen Curry. One of my favorite basketball players to watch of all time,
and I think clearly my favorite player to watch in the NBA right now.
I mean, there have been moments stretches where it's I don't even want to
name their names because they're coming up. They are players who are close to
equally as enjoyable. But Stephen Curry is just like this perpetually erupting volcano who
fucked everything up for opposing defenses even if he doesn't have the ball. And
that's just to watch someone to have the impact on the rest of the court,
not even what he's doing off the ball, which he can be pinballing
and coming off screens and relocating doing all these things, but watching just the
shift of the geometry of the court or how other players are reacting on the
court what he doesn't have the ball. It's really fun. Absolutely, I
mean spoiler alert. But Nicola Yokich makes this team as well, and he's
going to be the runaway MVP, and deservedly so. But Steph Curry was
the first name I wrote down. It had to be, like, there
is no more enjoyable player in the league right now. He has almost single
handedly carried the Warriors back to relevance this season, despite the injuries they've suffered,
despite the poor roster construction around him, to put it kindly, and
he's just had a blast doing it. And it's so readily apparent every time
he takes the floor, And even as he's greeted with these nightly double and
triple teams, and we even saw a qua druple team, like a legitimate
quadruple team the other night, he still finds a way to just shoot flames
out of that right wrist. It's unbelievable the shots that he's able to make
on a consistent basis. That would be foolish for like basically any other player
in the NBA to even dream about attempting a few exceptions. Sure, you
know, like, you're not going to be shocked if Dame Lillard pulls up
from three feet inside the half court line. You're not going to be surprised
if Luca don Chich attempts a ridiculous step back over an outstretched hand. But
Steph does those so routinely that he still manages to play effortlessly despite this incredibly
high energy output that he has to exert on a nightly basis just to extricate
him from a defense. I don't know that I can add anything to that.
We've Stephen Curry is enjoyable to watch that. There was a comment we're
breaking news here. Yeah, there was a comment or in interviews that said
we need to be spicier with our takes. There is all right, Steph
Curry. The first inclusion the second was not unanimous. You and I both
had LaMelo Ball on our first team. The fans had Luca don Chich in
this second spot. So we did get to overrule the fans here. Luca
will be showing up later, But yeah, I mean I don't LaMelo Ball
was also the first guard included on the second team for the fans. So
it's not like we're like totally superseding the opinion of the voters here. I
mean, it's not quite as much as stuff, but it's pretty darn clear
how enjoyable he is when he's making those underhand flip passes the length of the
court and just showing that he has eyes in the back of his head on
every single possession, and just the joy that he plays with as a rookie,
and the impact he's already been able to make on the Charlotte Hornets was
so palpable from the very start until he broke his wrist, and even since
he's returned, there's a nonchalantinists the way, a nonchalance to the way he
plays that you see it with nicolea Yoki too. You know, I'm not
saying that they don't try or that this is easy for them, but they
make the exceedingly difficult look possibly easy, effortless, and so I can't get
enough of that. And like you said that, the full court passes that
look like they're just flicks of the wrist basically, or like those underhanded tosses,
the decisions he can make after he leaves his feet, he can even
he can go to posing offenses into turnovers too. I think that's been what
sort of pleasantly surprising is that. I think we mentioned this on a previous
podcast. There have been a few rookies that have made better, much better
than expected impacts on defense. I think that he is one of them.
I'm so interested to see how his career progresses from here because if he becomes
more of just like a flashier off the dribble finisher or shooter like that,
how are you ever supposed to take your eyes off of that player? You're
not? And the other thing about him, he makes everyone else on the
team so much more fun too. Miles Bridges, for example, has always
been entertaining because of the turbojet hops that he has and is able to exhibit
on a nightly basis, but he's done so much more, so much more
frequently because he spent so much time with LaMelo Ball that Bridges was one of
my honorable mentions here. He got some votes from the fans. That impact
alone helps justify Lamello's presence here. And I should also say that he ended
up ninth in the fan vote Yeah, I don't know what else to add
that I am surprised he didn't end up on the first team for the fans.
There's there is when looking at the fans team, I think there's probably
only one inclusion that actually surprises me, and they're all justifiable, but I
am still a little bit surprised. I thought I pretty much thought there was
going to be like a consensus top five here. Yeah, I kind of
did as well, But we did have another near consensus with the first forward
spot. You and I both had Zion Williamson, who was on the second
team for fans, and among the fan votes he ended up ranking eighth,
So I'm not surprised by that one either. Again, we're kind of gravitating
towards stars on this first team, but how can you not enjoy watching Zion
play basketball? Just the effortless power that he exhibits on a nightly basis,
and the glides to the rim and the offhand finishes and the inability of any
defender to stay in front of him, especially once New Orleans started featuring him
more as that primary playmaker, which I think really allowed his game to just
jump to that next level almost immediately after the roll shift happened, Yeah,
putting the ball in his hands. More aside from giving the Pelicans a blueprint
for the future, just the results were absurd. And this is someone who
doesn't have a perimeter game that yeah, he could work from the outside in
and one of the things that I don't think it's surprising, but it's definitely
underappreciated when looking at his game because everyone just considers him this force of nature.
There's more variance in how he's attacking it, Like he can use angles,
he can change directions. He's just not barreling straight through these guys,
even when he doesn't have a ball, and he's like going up for an
alley oop, Like they're not even always like these straight line paths that he's
taking. So the way he moves on or off the ball isn't is incredible,
So he doesn't receive enough credit for that. The passing acumen, it
it's clearly there. I would love to see what happens if he's working with
more space in the half court because New Orleans has not been a good shooting
team. There just might be more highlight plays in storm, maybe more highlight
passes. Even but as my original point that I was making and then just
took a huge ass detour off of This is something who doesn't have an outside
game, doesn't shoot just like it's a it's not a thing, it's not
a part of his game. And yet he has like a true shooting percentage
of a zillion. How do you it's not even I know he's getting to
the rim at all time frequency, but he's also like he shouldn't. I
don't know if he should be finishing at as high as a clip because of
the contact he's absorbing. I do think there's probably something too. I know
you probably saw David Griffin complaining a week or so ago. I was going
to ask you about it right after this. Yeah, referees don't know how
to officiate him, and I do think that's clear. It's the shock conundrum,
but it's like something entirely different because you're upping the volume as well,
and this is just a this is just a body type that we've never shack.
Was never this mobile and was never operating like that from the from the
outside into which probably makes it more difficult. It's almost like this might be
a terrible comparison because I never thought it's like Shaq and Lebron rolled into one.
Almost when you're looking at Lebron's agility, sure, I can go with
that. Shack's build so so enjoyable to watch, and he's so much more
than just those dunks. It's just the entire play, from when you put
the ball in his hands start to finish. It's an absolute joy to watch.
I'm totally on board with him not being officiated properly and still managing to
thrive to such an extent on the interior that it's just even more impressive that
he's able to do that. I was a little bit surprised that he was
not even higher in the fan vote. He if you had to, let's
say, if we had to narrow three players that had to be consent his
first team, I would have had Steph Zion, and then I might have
had Yokich over Lamello. But like one of those, I would those four
I just thought were non negotiable. Basically, yeah, I figured Zion would
be a lock as well, but I guess like still eighth overall, not
too shabby. Sugar Ray, Leonard, Roberto Duran, Marvelous, Marvin Hagler,
and Thomas Hearns Legends whose four way rivalry define one of the greatest errors
in boxing history. Relive their decade of dominance in the new Showtime Sports documentary
The Kings, a four parts series premiering Sunday, June sixth, only on
Showtime. The other forward on the consensus first team. You're laughing a lot
about that, but I feel like, I don't know if people are gonna
be surprised who made my own first team. I'm just thinking about the conversation
that's to come. I apologize, no, I'm glad that you're just hyping
this reveal up a little bit more. Unsurprisingly, the consensus first team forward
joining Zion is Jannisana da Cumbo, who was third in the fan vote,
so obviously on the first team. He was on my first team as well.
I'm scanning Dan's first team, he's not there. I'm scanning his second
team. He's not there. And he's not on the third team either.
So your first team forward is fan favorite and especially dan favorite, Chris Bouche,
and he is the guy that made two teams. I had him on
first and second. It wasn't so I don't know. I figured he might
be the first name you wrote down. He well, he was one of
the first names I wrote down before it's ordered them into teams. I think
I was grappling with whether I was brave enough to put him in first team.
And look, Chris Brusche one. There's some todd foolery going on here.
He spent most of his minutes at center, but he's also played alongside
other bigs. So I'm letting you know, if Joe Ellenbi can qualify as
a forward on All NBA, Chris Brusche can qualify as a forward on the
All Hardwood Knocks team. That's all. It's my logic here. I don't
before you, before you continue. I feel I feel compelled to say that
Chris Bouche does actually make the Composite rankings solely because of you. Like he
was in my honorable mentions, he was twenty six in the fan voting,
so it just barely missed the cut for their third team. But he does
make our third team center spot thanks to your best efforts. How many so,
how many ballots was he on overall? He was on? He was
on thirteen percent of ballots. That's not insubstantial, It's not now. I
don't know how many of those were your submissions fair enough? Did you get
the ballot that was just fifteen Chris Bouchees. Yeah, I deleted that one
along with the one that was all Mavericks for the third time. Also,
wonder before I actually get into why I picked him, Well, I guess
this factors into it too. Swatter Boy is a fantastic nickname. I'm sorry,
that's just actolutely a fantastic nickname. Look, he has if you care,
if you care about numbers at all, on this shooting over sixty percent
on his two's, over thirty eight point three percent on threes, almost two
blocks per game in under twenty five minutes. You want a shot blocking,
floor spacing center who can also sort of. He's got the hardest roll over
the basket, but he got really good at navigating the seams off the ball,
whether he was coming from the corner or actually coming off a screen.
He's really good. He deserved more love than the six man of the year
discussion before his injury. He still leads the league. I believe in blocked
jumpers despite going down with that injury, and he's gonna wind up playing and
I mean, I say, just sixty games, but the season is only
gonna be seventy two games, so given what the Raptors have gone through,
that's actually really impressive. That's the thing that I enjoy watching most is there
is like an unhinged element to his game where it's like, oh, okay,
he can still get into foul trouble and take too many risks and his
closeouts could be just absolute anarchy. But I appreciate those clothes outs, that
effort of that. Even if he is at the elbow, or if he's
in the restricted area and you think you're about to take a jump shot,
like Chris Bruche is gonna come out and try and block that shot. I
absolutely love that energy. And I also think what I've latched on in the
fact is I don't think he's been appreciated enough. I'm not gonna throw Raptors
fans into here, but nationally it was just, oh, the Raptors need
a big they need a big I get it, Like he's just not going
to be this guy who helps you rebound a ton. They're more inclined to
put Ogna Nobi on a five than him. It feels like defensively, sometimes
I really don't care Chris Bruche is one of the most enjoyable players to watch
in the NBA. I would call him my foremost guilty pleasure, but I
don't feel bad about this at all. So he's just my outright, unconditional,
no strings attached pleasure. I make no apologies for putting him on my
all hardwood en off first team. I wonder how much love the video of
that monologue is going to get from from raptors Twitter. You think that I'll
cut that one up, that's the we're gonna I think you have to.
Yeah, I think you have to. Yeah, there was some passion there.
But you know, Chris Buche is included at the expense of Jannisanza Dakumba,
who again did not make your first, second, or third team.
I'm just going to assume that this is like MVP fatigue translated to a different
exercise, because that dude is still a joy to watch. The hustle,
the energy, the physicality, the athleticism, the ridiculous length that allows for
plays that no one else can make. The dunks that feature an outstretched arm
after he starts at the top of the key and picks up his dribble there,
Like everything about his game is made to be ridiculously entertaining, and you
don't have him on any of the teams. Look, I'm gonna be honest
with you too. Is as I said, like I really committed to the
star bit at the top and then tried to be dispersed it out more towards
the bottom. I probably would have had Kyrie here over. Be honest,
It's not that I don't enjoy watching Jannis. They're just his game feels.
I'm not on defense so much. There's that fun unpredictability here of there fromhim,
and it's almost always good. I'm not saying he's bad on defense.
Sometimes the offense is just like, yeah, it's cool. We've seen him
get up the court in two steps now and is finishing at the rim is
also ridiculous. The dunking is absurd. He's he's been better as a passer
this year too. I don't know, I need to see him like,
let's I don't I don't know what he needs to add. I'm not saying
it's because of his jumper and he takes them like he's gonna take those turns
and fades or he'll pull up for three. I'm just maybe it is MVP
fatigue, but he wasn't. I didn't view him as a snub. It's
if you wanted him on your first team. I get it. But once
the focus was pulled off of stars, he needed to be You know,
this wasn't Chris Bouchet instead of Jannest attends to Cuba. It was probably Chris
Bouche instead of Kyrie Irving. So Kyrie Irving is a forward though, Oh
good points. So maybe it was Chris. Kevin Durant was on my initial
list. He might have been in there too. I did have Lebron penciled
in. You know, there's there's a part of me that likes watching Kauai
operate just as much as Yannis because he's Kawai's just so damned methodical on both
ends of the floor. I again, maybe it's taken as an insult,
but I'm going to appreciate. You know, I'm a fan of chaos,
and Chris Brouchet is like controlled chaos. Almost. All I'm saying is that
we have to take this podcast seriously, so like, I just need you
to stop drinking so heavily when you're putting together this kind of stuff. I
have not had a sip of alcaol since October twenty eighteen. If you're talking
about the caffeine I'm currently consuming at the moment, even though it's eleven PM
Eastern time as we're recording this, then fair. That's basically what I meant.
Anyway, moving on, you're yanna certification. I understand why you included
him, if if that helps at all, I don't think it's egregious.
I'm like slightly mollified, not fully. People are going to be mad at
me again, aren't they. They're definitely gonna be goose dumb dan again.
Fortunately, you, much like myself and much like the fans who voted him
first overall by a lot, had Nicola Yokich as our first team center,
and do we, like, do we even need to justify it at this
point? I think we could. We know why, But there's for you.
I don't know if this for me, this is how it was,
and I don't know if it was the same for you. It's not even
just his passing anymore, like he's scooting by people off the dribble. It's
the samboar shuffle, obviously, but like he's become one of the most clutch
players in basketball in and so much more aggressive too. Yeah, he's scoring.
You know, when we had the question on the last podcast about why
isn't he most improved player, or maybe that was the conversation, I don't
think. You know, he's doing a lot of the same things he's always
done, just in higher volume. But there's the real argument is just the
scoring. Because of how much more aggressive he is. DeMar Deroson is the
only player who has made more baskets in the final two minutes of one possession
games. There's nicoleo Kit. He's doing everything and so they're going to mister
mum Murray. I want to make that clear. In the postseason, I
think his absence will matter more. But like this, we're seeing Joel Embiid
do it too, because he gets to the foul line a bunch. This
idea that you necessarily need that conventional crunch time option in the form of a
guard or a wing might be true in some cases. Maybe it's even true
for Denver. We'll have to see this this, you know, once the
playoffs rolling around. But the things he's doing and to be so, he's
so freaking quick and he's in you know, I don't think we're giving enough
credit to He's in the best shape of his life after going through the shortest
offseason in sports history. There were two teams that had a shorter offseason than
the Nuggets, maybe three. I can't remember when the Eastern Conference Finals ended.
I think it's only two though, So just that it didn't push him
over the top. But it's just like a wrinkle in his game where it's,
oh, he's getting past people on face ups and off the dribble.
That's just why that baseline that's spin to the baseline is just unstoppable at this
point, Like if he feels your hand on the wrong hip, you're just
toast. Even if and if you provide help, like you know that he's
going to find the guy that was helped off of He's just unstoppable on that
low block now. And there's even his postgame commentary where he talks about like
the bond he has with Mike Malone, Like part of watchability for me is
are they going to hit me in the fields? And Nicoleoki, maybe some
of it will get lost in translation, but like he'll hit me in the
fields. There's another player onund here that will that has definitely hit me in
the fields multiple times, but like that's so cool. And then yeah,
there is his passing, like those are just how many passes a game does
he throw? Where you're just like he did that? Did he really just
do that? Well, I think my follow up question is how many passes
per game does he throw? Because that's the answer. Fair enough. I
thought you were going to give me a real over under question there, Oh,
definitely not. This is this is definitely one of our least numbers based
episodes, I would say, which is definitely why I cited final two minutes
of Crunch Time play. Yeah, but I mean I get that, you
know, if you find close games exciting like some people do. Also,
because I was writing something and I happened to just know that that's not even
pulled up on my computer, right, So that's an unfair advantage you have
over me these days. But still, but still I'm not the one referred
to as the dumb guys. The fact that I write, yeah, I
was gonna say it just means I have one more job in which people need
to call for me to lose it. Yeah, fair enough, fair enough.
We just we want those calls to get more creative, Like if they're
gonna come like, let's at least like show a little more creativity these days.
That's my that's my lead to our listeners and actually be more hostile in
the past that I'm giving where I'm not trying to play a character right now
where I'm spitting out these takes. And by the way, one of the
things that people took issue with was Isaiah stew It over Manuel Quickly for first
Team All Rookie. I actually I absolutely agree with that after watching Manuel Quickly
a little bit more since then I was working on something where I was watching
past highlights and then he came back against the because of the Knicks beating the
Spurs, I would absolutely have a Manual Quickly over Asaia stew It on first
Team All Rookie. Now, I don't want apologize for having Fakuno Compazo over
you know, Sadi bay or giving Jaden McDaniel credit for second Team All NBA
when he's been as good. That's besides the point, though I clearly need
to be I'm not trying to be a troll, but maybe that's the problem.
Pete Kennedy, if you're listening to this episode, first of all,
we appreciate it as always. And second of all, we in the last
week we have generated a much more definitive answer to which of us gets more
hate on Twitter. That feels like a good segue to the second team,
right, and I think from here on, I'm changing all my teams to
just agree with yours. To Mini, I'm gonna get That's how fragile I
am right now. It's a cowardly, cowardly play, but I'll respect it
if you do it, except I won't. Anyway, the second team,
Uh, there's gonna be a lot more deviation here. I'm I'm trying to
figure out how the hell I'm going to present all of this information, So
just barrow with me as that changes. Let's give the fans to special treatment.
Why don't you read there is first? Well, I'm just I'm going
down our composite list because that's in order of who got the most overall points.
So we are going to start with the one that the fans carried into
this spot, which is Russell Westbrook. He was tenth in the fan vote,
actually tied with LaMelo Ball for ninth, but because as Dan and I
also had LaMelo Ball, he won the overall tiebreaker and got that first team
spot I had. Russell Westbrook is my third team guard. He did not
appear on yours. I guess we should go to you to justify that first.
It's the same thing with Jannas Atenta Kompo. It's I did veer away
from from stars and I don't know that I've I enjoyed watching Russell Westbrook during
his MVP campaign because it was just he actually was russ against the world.
That play style has graded on me a little bit. I've enjoyed him immensely
this season, particularly during the closing kick run with the Wizards, and I've
never, I guess I've been lower on him than the consensus, and I
think you've been there too. I've never not enjoyed watching him, though just
the way that he has played it has sort of chipped away at my enjoyment
a bit. But I also do appreciate the energy with which he does play
on every single night. It's just that's definitely unmatched. It's, you know,
there's a thing with him. There's a thing with Jannie. Although Russes
doesn't always apply to defense, they take like every possession personal, it feels
like, and that's how they play it. That was basically like a theme
for my overall selections. If you go through the non stars who gained admission
to my ballot, it's very much those guys who don't take possessions off,
who are just going to blow you away with their hustle and their more hidden
contributions on a nightly basis. I totally get not having Russ here, just
because the way that he plays can be grading. There are nights when it
just flat out doesn't work and he wants to keep shooting and makes these mental
mistakes. But you can be one hundred percent sure that he is never taking
a possession off, much less a game, and that counts for so much,
and it's why this Wizard's season has been turned around. It's why you
suddenly have people arguing in the comment sections that maybe Bradley Beal isn't the best
player on the Wizards anymore, which I still think he is. I don't
think he's been the most valuable player on the Wizards this year, and that's
part of what has made Westbrook so entertaining. Is just that relentless, indefatigable
motor that he plays with every time he hits the court because he can't help
but take everything personally in like kind of that Michael Jordan motivational way. And
maybe also the thing that I didn't mention before, and you saying this about
me and Jannie, where is it MVP fatigue. I'm not gonna say it's
not. I do have him. He's going to be in the top three
of my MVP ballots. I didn't think I had MVP fatigue. But with
Russ, it's almost just like I'm exhausted from the discussion about Russ over the
past half decade essentially, and that's not his fault. I just maybe that's
contributing to this too. I ye, so, but yeah, I don't
begrudge anyone who has him here, I totally I totally get. But it
also me leaving off Yannis and Russ kind of makes sense because when you're looking
at they playing the open floor, Russ is basically if Yannis were a guard
type, you're definitely consistent. Yeah, no doubt about that, And I
totally understand that argument. But I need a name who I did or no,
let's what did you have? Yeah, how do we want to handle
that? Let's let's not reveal those until the end, and we'll go over
our final ballots and kind of talk about anyone we skipped over. Ok.
Does that work? Sweet? So we're gonna move to Yeah, exactly.
We're so prepared for this, which I say sarcastically, but at the same
time, like we have a very elaborate spreadsheet in front of us tracking all
of this, which is not a surprise to anyone who knows me anyway.
Second, the other second team guard in the composite is another guy who does
not appear on your list. He also does not appear on mind, but
he is in the honorable mentions. This is solely carried by the fan ballot,
which had Luca don Chich fourth overall and as a first team guard alongside
Steph Curry, which is enough to get him the second team spot. I'm
gonna guess that your argument against having him is very similar to the russ and
they, honest one, just a little different in terms of playing style,
but it's that same like star level inclusion kind of thing. For me,
it was just as entertaining as he is on a nightly basis, Like in
a weird way, that almost worked against him a little bit, just because
you know, that you can miss some of the highlights because he's going to
generate fairly similar one sometimes. And that was enough to as convoluted as that
logic may seem, that was enough for me to want to favor other guys
who don't necessarily get as much shine, especially because this whole season, as
ridiculously good as don Chich has been, it's also had this slight undercurrent of
disappointment because the Mavericks were supposed to ascend to a higher tier of the Western
Conference, and don Chich was the MVP favorite going into the season, and
I think because we were expecting even more from him, it made the ridiculously
high level at which he's playing feel a little bit disappointing. There's and I
think for my ballots specifically, I've clearly shown that I either favor this suddenness
when you're looking at Zion Williamson specifically, or LaMelo ball or just the the
brain bending factor, which I think Luca definitely has as a passer. But
his you know, his shot selection is not trickery like it is with Stephen
Curry. When you look at Curry's handles compared to Lucas, and this exercise
sucks because now I feel like I'm just demeaning the way that Don plays.
He's fantastic, one of the best passers in the game, top five or
seven passers in the game already, but I probably appreciate a little bit more
speed and less, you know, having less methodology to what you're doing,
and like, yeah, there is that unpredictability with Luca when you're looking specifically
at his passes, or like, yeah, you kind of know his three
pointers coming, but there's the nonchalances with he fires it up. And I
did pick Yoki, who was just one of the most players in the games,
but that he still feels more unpredictable or sudden than a dontage or you
know, I didn't have James Harden on this list for among those reasons too.
Yeah, I mean I didn't have him either. I get it.
It's I don't think we need to frame it as negative though, Like Luca's
going to get mentioned quite frequently when we're talking about our all NBA teams,
Like it's very easy to appreciate the efficacy of his game the aesthetics as well,
But maybe it's just the narrative around him right now where I just wanted
to highlight other guys. I don't hate that he's included, though I don't
I don't hate that he's included. I also don't hate that we didn't include
him ourselves. Fair we are going to jump to a guy who we carried
though, because only one other person, and if it was you, let
us know had Nicholas Claxton on their ballot at all. Both you and I
had him as a second teamer. I had him at forward, You had
him at center. Again, those positional definitions are so amorphous these days.
That didn't really matter that much, but that was enough to earn him our
first of the two second team forward spots. Yeah, he's how do you
not enjoy his switchability on defense? And I think the flashball moment for a
lot of people, maybe myself, is the game where he forced the ball
out of Damian Lillard's hands, not once, but twice in crunch time.
That's Damian Lillard's hands and crunch time. That's huge, and he can defend.
He's weren't like Dame dribbling off his foot either, No, it was
actually the ball before. He wasn't forcing a turnover, he was just forcing
the ball out of Damian Lillard's hands, and that's a twenty one year old
big man doing that. By the way, wtf would be my reaction the
nets They switched liberally overall, but they have not shot to tapping into it
with Claxton, so that definitely helps. There is his you know, I
talk about controlled chaos with Chris Bruche. I don't think Clackson has that much
of an element. But he can be foul happy as well. But that's
also sort of part of the fun because he's taking so many chances or doing
things that are so diff cult. I think on offense too, what's taken
me by surprise and which I've enjoyed is the comfort with which he'll put the
ball on the floor and it doesn't It does not always end well. I
want to make that clear. And that's not necessarily something they need him to
do. He probably suffers from cases of doing too much on both ends of
the floor. At the same time, it's like his off the dribble johnts
are encouraging because he's trying them out, and so I'm very interesting to see
he's not just going to be to me. Maybe he won't just be this
pick and roll guy. Maybe there will be other things that he does.
No, I don't think they're going to post him up, even though he
loves to really get off those occasional hook shots. But when he is driving,
he's not turning the ball over a ton. Can he just get better
at passing and finishing overall? There, then all of a sudden, there's
really this super versatile player at both ends of the floor, not just on
defense. Yeah, it's all about the energy for me, just the switchability,
the willingness to dive on the floor for loose balls, to challenge shots
at the rim. If you look at like shots contested for thirty six minutes,
he's at fifteen and a half, which is pretty darn high on the
leaderboard among players who are actually in rotations. He is always active on that
end. I do think there's more to plumb on the offensive end. As
you mentioned, that doesn't even matter to me. It's it's all about the
defense here, and I just have to end with the obligatory go dogs.
We're gonna get We're gonna get to more go dogs too soon, I think
we are. We are. But first we're gonna go with the second of
the second team forwards. It's another guy that you and I carried. I
had him on my third team. You had him on your second team.
He did get one other vote from the fans, So again, if that
was you, please identify yourselves so we can thank you. Actually we know
who it is. It's friend of the Pod Jacob Borne, because it's one
Tuscano Anderson. Yeah. Look, by the way, this is going to
earn him. It earned him points after they've already pretty much team. But
just like, he's had just some awesome quotes this season, and we were
set one where he called his mom after signing his contract with the Warriors being
converted to then be a contract. That's just a cool moment. I wish
you know. He definitely is worth more than the contract that they gave him.
What I really like about his play style though, is he is just
like hustle in bodily form. And we've seen some scary moments too. I
think did he suffer a concussion on that play where he like literally cleared the
scorers table and flipped over. I don't think he did, but I don't
encourage people. I would make the business decision and most definitely not go after
that ball. But the fact that he will when you're not on the guarantee
contract at the time is incredible to me. And then I do like how
he kind of just plugs every single hole just he does. I don't know
that he does anything exceptionally. I do think he's really good at holding his
own defensively across multiple positions. But I'm not even sure are you gonna call
him like you know that defense is a specialty. I don't know. But
he gives you range on offense. He will put the ball on the floor
there too. He'll also keep it moving. I'm very interesting to see moving
forward, and I think this seasons has proven it. Even though the Warriors
they're very clearly reluctant to use Draymond Green at the five, they've basically been
forced into it as the season is worn on. But when Draymond Green is
at the five with Juan Tiscano Anderson on the floor and he's predominantly the four
in this situation, they have a The Warriors have a one seventy possession sample
size. They have a net rating of plus thirteen point three. This is
I like that Mottel, like that's the if you're gonna play Green small or
play sorry if you're gonna play smaller with Green at the five. I think
JTA can sort of help abbreviate the burden that's placed on Draymond Green defensively because
he can guard some five. It's not a ton, But if you look
at his defensive matchup data according to be Ball Index, he's defended every single
position at least fifteen percent of the time this season. That versatility, that
hustle, and then the fact that I do think he's just an effective gap
filler maybe on offense for them, not somebody gonna turn to to create.
You take Stephan Curry off the floor, or Draymond and Draymond Green or Draymond
Green even though they don't really split the two up. Yeah, he's going
to be put in a disadvantage. He does need other creators around him.
But I also don't think he's someone's going to hurt you too much. And
I'm so interested to track his career moving forward. He's also a sneaky good
passer. Four point eight assists for thirty six minutes with minimal turnovers is pretty
solid, and they're coming from those swings around the perimeter. The Warriors love
to find relocating shooters. They're coming off the short roll, and they're coming
in a wider variety of ways. As the season has progressed, I think
there's more there than we've seen to this point, which just gives the Warriors
another fun element with this six six versatile wing. Yeah, that's a great
point. I mentioned it with keeping the Blab movie. But there's some flare
to the passes too, where it's you know, he's not always going to
throw them off the dribble, but like he's gonna let you know that he's
throwing this quickly right off the catch. To me, if I had to
pick one player in the NBA where it's like, given what we've seen this
season, you just and I'm only talking about watching how they play and how
they approach the game, if you had to just find that one guy who
you just can't help but root for, I think Jta is my choice this
year. Yeah, he would be up there for me for sure. If
not the outright pick, another guy who would be high up there is the
second team center. He appeared on the third team for the fans. He
was on the second team for me. He did not make your ballot,
though, I'm sure you at least considered him because it's bam out of Baio.
Yeah. I love his feet. He has happy feet that he does,
and they let him stay with everyone. Like you talk about switchability and
you see it from guys like Nicholas Claxton. You see it from other other
wings like Draymond Green or Kawhi Leonard, kind of those pseudo wing bigs.
But if you want to talk about that one through five switchability from a high
minutes guy, it's bam out of Baio. Yeah, I would totally agree
with you. I was interested in what your thoughts were. We haven't done
all defense teams yet, but he had commented at the end of did he
beat the Celtics whatever? It was the TNT game last Thursday where he said
he thinks he's Defensive Player of the Year. I think that's very clearly going
to go to Rudy Gobert. But is he Is he going to finish third
on the ballot? Ye for d po y Maybe just because of the sheer
minutes he's played for all defensive I think that he's behind Miles Turner as well,
but there's all defense. Doesn't care about positions, so he probably has
a better chance of making one of those ten spots for sure. Agreed,
Agreed, But yeah, I don't know. I think that Rudy Gobert is
the obvious winner. I don't think that's a spoiler at all for the upcoming
Awards episode. Again, tune in Sunday four PM on Locker Room. I
wouldn't make Bam infinitely more watchable if he cared about scoring more, not like
he doesn't care, but if he was more selfish, maybe it might be
the way to put it. Yeah, but we've talked about that on a
Mailbag episode and I still push back on that a little bit. I don't
think that being more It's like it's kind of like Lebron and Crunch Time,
where you know, I'm not comparing you to Skip Bayless. First of all,
let me let me make that I'm nervous to hear what you say now
that that was the qualifier. But no, like for years, Skip Bayless
has erroneously criticized Lebron James for wanting to pass in the biggest moments. And
it's not that Lebron is scared of drawing contact and having a shoot free throws
or having to make the game winner himself. It's that he is a robot
designed to make the most efficient basketball play in every situation, regardless of what
that situation is. And I think there's some of that in Bam, where
like he's just so conditioned to playing the right way that if you ask him
to be more aggressive, it might work, but it might come at the
detriment to the team. And I don't know, like I think he's going
to be a twenty five point per game scorer. Does he gets naturally better
at finding mid range jumpers and maybe the occasional three, or generating contact within
the flow of the offense. But I don't know if I want him to
be that takeover looks to get his own points first kind of guy. And
that's that's like why I have him here too, just because I really appreciate
that kind of style. You're also you're the one that said he is best
player in the league potential or top five players. I think he does.
Yeah, yeah, I mean, like given that plus that one through five
switchability, Like I don't think he's going to be the best player in the
NBA, to be clear, Like I don't think that he's ever going to
hit that that ceiling. I think that ceiling exists. I think that there's
a reasonable out future outcome where he has a season where he's the best player
in the league. I don't know if he'll get there, but that is
shame Adam for that take. Again, I'm saying, I don't think it's
going to happen, but I don't want to rule out that possibility. He's
good. I do enjoy watching bam Adebio. I considered Jimmy Butler too as
well. By the way, he didn't make my ballot at all, but
you talk about someone who plays with sort of a Janis Russell Westbrook type edge
to him at both ends of the floor, He's definitely up there, and
he got a lot of love from fans as well. I think Jimmy Butler
finished seventeenth in the overall voting, but forward was just so packed on those
ballots that that was not good enough to make any of the three teams.
So to recap, though, the first team on the composite is Steph Curry,
LaMelo Ball, Zion Williamson, Jannisan Dia Dacoumpo, and Nicole Yokich.
The second team is Russell Westbrook, Luca don Chich Nicholas Claxton, want to
Scotto Anderson and Bam Auto Baio, which brings us to the third team,
and our first guard on the third team also happened to be the first overall
pick of the most recent NBA draft, and that is Anthony Edwards, who,
in a huge one eighty was single handedly carried to this position by me
because I had him on my second team. He did finish nineteenth, one
spot ahead or he was tied with Bam Auto Baio for nineteenth among fans,
which was one spot ahead of Lebron James. I feel like I've justified this
because I notoriously hated on the selection and actually went as far as saying that
I wouldn't want to take him in the lottery, and I I have eaten
those words on a number of occasions. I have very publicly renounced that take
on my Twitter account, and I regret saying it, but I don't regret
like coming to that conclusion because I didn't really enjoy watching him play in college,
despite him playing for the school that I went to, the growth that
he's shown, the joy on the basketball court, the displays of athleticism like
it's beyond clear watching him, especially since the All Star Break, he just
gets it now, like he is finding himself in the right positions on both
ends of the floor more. The energy level is more consistent, still not
one hundred percent, but more consistent. He's taking better shots, he's making
more shots, he's getting the line more, he's involving his teammates more.
Just the improvement is staggering, and it has completely changed how I felt about
him to the point that I can just wholeheartedly enjoy those displays of athleticism now.
And beyond that, the quotes that he's given, the interviews that he's
given, the viral moments that he's given, talk about a player who knows
who he is and is true to himself and is not afraid to be himself.
And that is so refreshing in a world where there's so much cliche athlete
speak to have somebody just willing to speak his mind and say that he doesn't
know who Alex Rodriguez is, or that you know, he thinks he could
still throw one hundred mile per hour pitch if you gave him a month to
ramp up to that despite not knowing who Alex Rodriguez is the honesty, the
openness is so refreshing, especially coupled with this style of play. Yeah,
is you mentioned the quotes thing would be the only thing I could add on
top of that. I think my favorite one definitely a one from day one.
That entire video, if no one's seen the interview was fantastic, But
his most recent one where he said he's going to travel to Spain to learn
Spanish just so he could understand what Ricky, Rubio and wan Her and Gomez
are are talking about. I found that it's just fantastic. Yeah, he's
he's he's great. I'm sure you at least considered him, right, he
did not make my initial list, my big list of players. No,
oh really, maybe I was tainted by the fact that I already knew you
had him on yours. It's possible, but you did have I had to
figure out two to three spots to fit Chris Bouche in. So that's fair.
That's fair because he hustles so much he can fit all of them exactly.
M I see, I see what you're doing there. But you did
have a member of the rookie class beyond Lamella Ball on your second team because
you single handedly carried Tyrese Halibert into the second guard spot on our third team,
which means that we have three rookie guards on the all her with anox
team. Maybe we're paying too much attention to rookies just because that's part of
the job is Honestly, though, I'm not surprised that we went that way
because by definition, rookies are new to the league, they're fresh, they're
exciting. We're discovering more about them than we're discovering about veterans. Yeah,
that's a that's a good point with Tyrris Haliburton, though I don't think his
game is gonna disarm you, not even in the way that you know wants
Uscano Anderson is not Jannie or Russ, But Tyris Haliburton is even less so
like that, I'm not He does hustle, but it's not the same,
it's not in the same vein as wants Scono Anderson. He's just so fundamentally
sound. But there's that's not even just why I picked him. It's the
disarming nous with which he can play, goading opponents into a steel just like
being a lull in his stance. But then being able to pulp the ball
away or jump the passing lane when he's working off the dribble on offense,
being able to change his speeds, being able to hit shots off the dribble.
Maybe there is a fascination bump at play here where I'm saying there should
not be a rookie who's this good at both ends of the floor already.
I'm also married to the idea that he can be an All Star in this
league, where people have said when talking about the Rookie of the Year conversation,
specifically, they didn't want to bump him over LaMelo Ball when it looked
like Lamello might not play again this season. They didn't even want to put
him above Anti Edwards. I feel like now a lot of people as the
runner up because those two have higher ceilings. Great grand I'm not ready to
write off that he is going to be an All Star All NBA type player,
because when you're this fundamentally sound as a rookie, why does the implication
have to be because you're not you're throwing these highlight reel passes all the time,
or you're not hitting these as many off the dribble jumpers as Anthony Edwards,
who has probably missed more off the dribble jumpers than Tyres Albert has even
taken this year. Why does the application have to be that you're somehow going
to top out? And do I think he has as high as this ceiling
as Anti Edwards are in La lah Blah. I would skew towards though at
the moment, but this looks like it might be a star in the making.
And I don't know that I have a comp for him. I think
I call him in the last podcast would have manho genobly played within finds of
himself. I don't know that that's perfect, but I love Tyres Haliburton.
He's one of the foremost reasons I've watched the Kings at all this year,
because they haven't given you, I guess individually some reasons. I love the
Aaron Fox, Rah Holmes on his hell but Tyrese Haliburton before his injury absolutely
amazing. Yeah, I'm right there with you. I originally had him on
my third team. He was the last player cut because I had to give
credit to my favorite player of all time who we haven't gotten too yet.
The fans also did give him some credit he finished thirty third, and I
should say that one hundred and fifty three different players showed up on the fans
ballots, so finishing thirty third is pretty solid. And I don't really have
much to add to your description of why he's here. I just want to
share that he is part of the most naturally grouped together players imaginable to finish
in the with the same amount of points from these fan ballots. And that
group is comprised of Tyrese Haliburton, Nikola Vukovich, Devin Booker and bull Ball.
Oh so you know, of course you're going to put that foursome together.
It just makes sense, right balls. I like that deep cut.
I don't know. I tried to focus on players who are getting at least
a moticom of consistent playing time with bull balls. I respect whoever put bull
Ball on the ballot absolutely, so that brings us to our first or the
third team forwards. And in keeping with the theme, since I single handedly
put Anthony Edwards there, you single handedly put Tyrese Halliburton there, the fans
single handedly put Julius Randall there. I will say it was really tough for
me to keep him off because He's made the Knicks infinitely more watchable and more
competitive. The spin move to baseline fadeaway does not get old, the aggression
the last second. I think Zach Low called at the eleventh hour passing the
everything, the defensive improvement, Like I really struggled not including him here.
He's one hundred percent among my honorable mentions. But again this is solely the
Fans fifth place overall, a member of their first team. Yeah, Julius
Randol has been eminently enjoyable. I think his passing that you mentioned that Zach
Low was written about where he leaves his feet and is throwing these passes has
been most fun. And the difficult jumpers he's hitting it's I will be interesting
to see if this holds next year when it's not a pen or as affected
by the pandemic type of season. But Julius Randol has been an absolute monster
this year. I think he's a shoe in for all NBA at this point,
the way that they classify players, I don't know that he has a
shot at second team anymore, just because what happens if people use Luca don
Chi as a forward or in Beater yokas a forward to get both him on
the first team. I'll be shocked if he doesn't make the third team,
though I think it's definitely a worthy choice. I don't know that I consider
him like one of the most enjoyable players in the league to watch. For
me, I will say the level of difficulty on his role is just magnetic,
and that's what I enjoy watching most about how he's thriving is this is
just what he's doing is not easy. The results aren't always great. We've
seen it in crunch time a lot this year. We saw it in one
of the nixt's more recent losses too. Could he stand? You know his
in between games can go off the rail sometimes, but you talked about the
baseline jumper already to step back threes, just the everything, and I think
you have to appreciate when players are in this very complete, it's complicated role.
It's why it was such an advocate for Shay Giler Alexander being a Most
Improved Player candidate before he had a torn plant or fashion on his right foot.
Was just the level of difficulty ascribed to his role right now is through
the roof. And it's the same thing with Julius Randold he's putting up lebron
esque numbers when you're looking at scoring an assists and rebounding more. Obviously,
it's been amazing and it's it has been, to steal a phrase from before,
fund is hell to watch. So my question for you, and I
want to preface this by saying that I'm in no way trying to diminish the
impact that Tom Thibodeau has had as a coach, that RJ. Barrett's incredible
improvement has had, that Derrick Rose's play lately has had. But is Julius
Randalls single handedly responsible for reinvigorating the entire Knicks franchise or is that too hyperbolic?
I think it's a tad over the top. Just I think what Tom
Thibodeau has done for them has really helped defensively, because that's been the driving
force of their success this year. Right, They're still not a great offense,
and they've been better. They've been like top ten efficiency since April first
or whatever it is. But I also just the improvement of RJ. Barrett
at both ends what they've got. They made some really smart one year signings
over the offseason. When you look at No. One's No. Alec Burke's
So I don't. He's one of the two biggest reasons why the Knicks are
where they are right now, and that's the big If there's a reason bigger
than him, I don't know that it's an individual player. So much is
the culture that's been laid down there, or their overall defensive play and hustle.
Yeah, I don't. I still don't know that. I think it's
that hyperbolic, just because, while giving due credit to all of the other
factors, he's the talking point, right Like, the Knicks are a prominent
figure within typical NBA conversations these days, and it centers around him. He's
the reason that they're becoming must watch television. He's the one whose highlights you're
going to see. He's the one who's getting fringe MVP talk and all NBA
consideration and most Improved Player love. Of course, I just think because so
much of the narrative has featured him, that it's allowed the conversations about the
Knicks to shift tone entirely. Yeah, that's that is a great way to
put it. And there's also the element of has he given them the foundational
star that they need for this to be sustainable and also real enough for them
to build upon it moving forward. No, even with RJ. Barrett,
I think you can reasonably assume that, yeah, maybe he does still have
that all star ceiling. I mean we had a RJ. Barrett versus John
rand debate at one point on this podcast. Julius Randalls still probably your best
shot, just looking at what he does as a passer and shot creator,
at having that player into so I totally understand where you're coming from. So
let's move on to our second of the third team forwards, again single handedly
carried by the fans who had Joe LMB in sixth. Overall, he was
an honorable mention for me. He was not on yours either, but still
obviously a deserving candidate, just for the sheer defensive terror that he exerts on
a nightly basis. I've used a nightly basis a lot on this pot.
It's okay. I'll use fun as hell at least three more times to make
it better. Thank you. Were you surprised he made the list? Yes?
They too. Yeah, I think that he's It's universally accepted just how
good he is. But he gets a lot of hate. There are fan
bases that can't stand him. There were no like Sixers heavy submissions like Ben
Simmons, for example, did not get a lot of love on the fan
votes. So yeah, I think I was a little surprised that the reception
was so universally positive from an entertainment standpoint, that he was very close to
earning a first team spot on the fan ballot because of that forward eligibility.
I will say, if we were factoring in postgame instagram locations, joelbe reply
be first team. That's fair. But yeah, I mean I had him
on my honorable mention list. I don't know that I really gave much thought
to including him. Yeah, I gave more thought to guys like and this
is a spoiler, like Damian Lillard is someone who didn't make the cut for
me. Even Chris Paul a little bit was on there, and Joel Wilbead's
fantastic. I do appreciate defense. I probably enjoy watching him on defense a
little bit more than I do his offensive, though his shooting has been out
of this world and when he's hitting off the dribble jumpers, perhaps that's not
true. Sorry yack that statement. Yeah again, I don't mind that he's
included here, obviously like he's an unquestionable MVP candidate, shouldn't win over Yokich,
but absolutely deserves to be one of the most prominent candidates out there.
He should get second place votes for Defensive Player of the Year from a lot
of people. He is an incredible basketball player who's really entertaining. But I
still didn't really consider him over a lot of the hustle guys at center.
So how do we want to do this? Now? Do you want to
recap overall than go through the fans, then go through Let's wait to recap.
Let's go through the people we didn't mention on ballot, starting with the
fans, so we can both kind of talk about those, and then we'll
go through the players on yours who aren't mentioned, and then mine. Sounds
good to me, So the fans had the following players who did not appear
on the composite rankings. As you probably just heard, since we're making up
the plant as we go. Second team forward Kevin Durant surprised. No.
I might have put him on there if he'd played more this season. He's
said, that's what it was for me. I probably also would have liked
the team have a little bit more control over the game, but at the
same time there's the effortlessness which with which he can score thirty plus points is
mesmerizing. If you if aliens landed on the planet and asked us just to
like teach them about the aesthetics of scoring basketball, you're probably telling them to
watch tape of Stephen Katie. Yeah, the Mothership. I'm always worried he
is going to call one of those two hold for sure and look the other
thing. And I wouldn't begrudge anyone who did this having been able to watch
Katie play basketball this season? Would Clay Thompson has made my list, just
been able to if were totally valid. Yeah, totally turns like the night
before we did this, he would have been first team for me. So
I totally get that as Yeah. Absolutely on the third team at guard they
had Damian Lillard. I think that's from this project. Yeah, it's it's
such a tough one, one of my all time favorites, like one of
our absolute go to war for this player selections. That's the next, that's
the next hard one. Not they all follow them into hell and let's do
it. We should definitely do that. At some point, I already know
who would be on your team. Their other guard was Facundo Composo. I
don't hate that one at all. You know, the peskiness he plays defense
with which he plays defense, the highlight reel passes. It is almost unfair
to have him and Yokich on the court together, just in terms of esthetic
passing. I totally get that selection. He was on my honorable honorable mentions.
I actually liked that the fans did that type of a It's not super
deep too, it's a deep cut. It's a pretty deep cut. Well,
I didn't want to say by no means a household name. Yeah,
I didn't want to make it seem like people don't know who he is though.
I was trying to give a fans credit here. But that's a deep
that's a that's a deep cut relative to I mean, relative to all the
other names on this list. For them, for the we call them fans.
But how many people hate follow listen to this, so the followers might
be a better way to put them. I'm gonna keep calling them fans enough.
I love that. That's my favorite fans selection, probably aside from Damian
Lillard. Just because I had so much invested in him. Oh yeah,
it's it's a great one for sure, not the only nugget on the third
team, because Michael Porter Junior also made it. Again, I'm not surprised,
Like a guy who can put up thirty points and it's just ultra flammable,
one of the prettiest jump shots you'll find out there. Just getting better
at those relocation threes, at creating off the dribble. He's an offensive machine.
He hasn't look if he can, They've already increased his on ball responsibility.
If he ever becomes more of a creator, it'd be easy to you
know, if you like watching KD, then yeah, you're gonna like watching
Michael Porter Junior. It's not a perfect correlation, but like just the size
and there the potential that you could see with him on the ball creating his
own shot, Like there are similarities there, right. And then rounding out
the fans team for players that we have not yet talked about is Kawhi Leonard,
And I'll admit this is one that did not appear on my honorable mentions.
He's amazing, like just absolutely a two way terror. There are moments
during the playoffs when he is like the best reincarnation imaginable of Michael Jordan,
just the way that he elevates for those off the dribble jumpers, the intensity
on defense. But at the same time, like personally, and I don't
know how you feel, I find that my expression watching Kawhi Leonard is often
similar to the one that he has on his face because he's so smoothly,
efficient and calm and collected that my eyes kind of glaze over a little bit
because I just know that he's going to do good things. I would almost
say it's the opposite for me, because I already mentioned that I like the
deliberateness that he operates with. At the same time, this is like a
player where it's what if Tim Duncan gave you highlight dunks every once in a
while, you know, coming down, coming down the lane type deal,
because he's just so to see the way he plays and how much he wants
to get to that jumper and take the difficult jumpers. But then also he's
gonna have like those somewhat wild finishes or finish above the rim, and the
reaction is just percent of the time never gonna be there. It can take
you off guard when he actually finishes a play like that, but then to
appreciate just the non reaction from him when he does it, or if it's
just a clutch jumper or something that's definitely injects some watchability into him. In
my opinion, he does, and he's super watchable and I like watching him,
but I just have to remind myself to like, it's okay to be
excited. Fair enough I do he And also he can steal people's souls on
defense in a way that no one else on the perimeter can, and I
think that has to be that's part of it too for me, for sure,
for sure, definitely a worthy inclusion. Do you want to do yours
or mind next? So I my entire third team, I realized I have
to go through, So would you rather do that first or a last is
based? Let's do that last? Lets you're up, So I'm up.
On my second team, I had Fred van Vleet at guard. I love
the defensive acumen that he brings. I love those ripaways from bigger players.
I love the peskiness on the perimeter. He's also a really smooth offensive player
with a well rounded three level scoring game. At this point, he I
think he's veering towards that most underrated player in the league category, just like
his predecessor. Just like his predecessor. I guess, running mate, Oh
wow, I hope I didn't just send Kyle Lowry out of Toronto. I
really want him to stay. We know, yeah, but I view that
less as Kyle Lowry moving away from the Raptors and more as him vacating that
number one spot. Fr Van Fleet was one of my final cuts too,
so I totally understand where you're coming from. Relentlessly entertaining my second team forward
who was not mentioned as Jay Shawn Tate. I just absolutely love the hustle
he plays with. The length is so readily apparent because he's already such a
smart defensive presence. Very few first year players, even if he's a delayed
first year player, because he went undrafted in twenty eighteen and played Overseas first
before getting his chance in the NBA, very few first year NBA players are
this intelligent in passing lanes and are able to be so disruptive as off ball
defenders, and that, paired with his hustle. I actually had to debate
between him and Jannis for my first team forward spot. Wow. I love
watching him. He has grown on me so fast. That is, I
get it in the spirit of the exercise. I think that's really just final.
I just don't know that that. I'm surprised that that's the player that
you ended up zeroing in on there to that extent. Yeah. He and
Kevin Porter Junior, who was a tough exclusion for me, both have just
made the Rockets watchable even as they're bad. I would I would have definitely
went with Kevin Porter Jr. Just his the nuclearness of the fifty point game.
Yeah, I mean there's something to be said for that for sure.
Moving to my third team though, my all time favorite player Chris Paul.
I know that's not a popular all time favorite player choice, but as greating
as the complaining can be, and like some of the dirtier plays, that
dude is just a basketball savant and it is so fun watching him refuse to
decline as almost every point guard has before him, moving deeper into his thirties
because he can get to whatever scot he chooses. You know he's going to
connect on those snake around pull up jumpers from the elbows. He makes everyone
around him better. He is. You know, you've you've talked about him
versus Devin Booker in MVP conversations and stuff, and she should not win MVP,
but he should be in the conversation because of the impact that he's had.
So the fact that he's still playing at such a high level and elevating
a franchise that has been down in the dumps for so long. He's continues
to be a joy and I continue to just absolutely love watching him. He
was on my honorable if I had honorable mentions, he was one of my
semi final cuts. There's the troll factor for me too, just he It
doesn't he could be friends with him. He's with Donovan Mitchell earlier in the
season. Him and Donovan Mitchell are close off the court, but he's trolling
Donovan Mitchell at the free throw line. It's just I love that, and
I know it's probably he can definitely We've seen him wear on teammates and he
definitely is gonna wear on opponents. I don't care. I just I love
that kind of fu that he brings, and he is I don't want to
say he's ironic, but he just he knows that he's a nudge and he's
just gonna keep doing it, and he's gonna try and get under your skin.
Absolutely, and I think there's something to the idea that he's not the
easiest locker room presence. He is not the easiest teammate. But the way
I've always looked at that, because it's ms from just this relentless competitive drive
and is validated by the way he plays, is to me, that says
more about the guy who can't get along with him than it does about Paul.
That's fair. My next third team selection, who has not yet been
mentioned is San Antonio Spurs forward Keldon Johnson, maybe more of a swingman than
a forward. I loved a comparison that Nicias Duncan made on Twitter maybe a
few weeks ago at this point, where he said that Keldon Johnson might be
the closest thing we've seen to peak Gerald Wallace. I love that comparison.
Just like the crash towards the basket, play with this reckless abandon that more
often than not works out. You know that he's always going to be willing
to sacrifice his body to barrel towards the basket, regardless of the contact that
he's going to endure. I I really have enjoyed watching this not quite star
turn but turned towards a productive starter for one of the model organizations began in
the bubble and has continued throughout this season. I'm with it, we need
a better nickname for him, though he's called big Body and mustang. Yeah,
those are terrible. I don't I don't have one. I'm just saying
we need better ones. We should just go with like crash two point er
or something. Let's be a little bit more creative than that. He probably
should be. Is he bandicoot? And then I almost said that too,
we can go with that. My final inclusion on my third team, who
has not been mentioned is Robert Williams, the third the time Lord. I
wish that he were able to stay on the court more than he is,
because his game really isn't made for that kind of big minute role. But
when he's on the floor, you know that he's going to be involved in
plays. Another one of those like kind of sneakily underrated passers who is adapted
at least at passing out after collecting an offensive rebound and finding that open man
in a situation that so often generates points, but it's it's more about just
the number and sheer volume of plays that he's able to impact. I mean,
three point three blocks and one point six steals per thirty six minutes.
Like I feel like that in and of itself is almost a sufficient justification,
because he's just so relentlessly active on the office on the defensive end, not
to mention the lab threat nature that he has on offense. He was the
guy that I was one of the guys that I knew you were just non
stars that I knew you were going to have on your list. You've been
caping for Robert Williams since before he was called, but since before he overslept
from one of his Celtics workouts or whatever it was exactly, And I was
pretty close to giving this spot to Neurlans Noel for very similar reasons. I
view those two players as incredibly similar ones. But Noel is probably a little
bit better and plays for a better team this season, while Williams is a
little bit more frenetic, which is kind of what I was going for here.
Do you want to read? All right? So I'll go into mine.
Now we want to do that? Yeah, let's do that I'm gonna
try and do mine quicker because I have basically half my ballot or a third
of my Yeah, basically half my ballot, which has just been untalked about.
So my second team, one of my second team guards, I had
Tyrese Halibert and then I had Kyle Lowry, which is just funny that you
had fred Van Fleet. There is just he has the Chris Paul type personality
where he's going to try and get under opponent's skins, but like he'll he'll
do this weird and sometimes it's shady stuff on defense. I just love it.
The sacrificing his body is definitely part of it, but just you know,
like he'll climb through someone's legs basically if he has to, and he
verges on reckless there and it can come at the expense of the player he's
guarding or helping onto, but it comes at the expense of himself too,
and so I view it as that's fair game to me. We all know
that he is the captain of your follow to Hell and Back team and he
should be. Damian Lillard is probably the captain to be. Oh really,
yeah, that's changed. Then that is a new opinion. Kyle Lowry's up
there for sure. But and the other thing that I like is just like
his stardom almost isn't powered by his actual numbers, and like his numbers can
be good, and he is an all star by those most metrics, but
he is like the essence of the Toronto Raptors. It feels like even fred
Van Fleet has subsumed some of Kyle Lowry's approach to the game and just overall
personality. He is the unifier for Toronto. I also love and you can't
say this. Not every big name is malleable and they're definitely not as infectious
as I mentioned with his personality, but he gives Toronto their identity without confining
it. He's his hustle and versatility sets the tone for the rest of the
team that they visibly follow. But then also it's yeah, he can he
can run the offense, but he can also play off it. And if
you watch him, it's not just him relocating at times for shots, it's
him belocating to set screens. He'll set multiple screens on the same possession.
That's just not something you see for a six foot guard. And I love
I just love me some Kyle Lowry one of my favorite players of all time.
I still want to push back against the idea that he wouldn't be the
captain of that team, though you know why he would be a great captain.
Why because he's really good at taking charge. Wow. Moving on to
my second team forward who wasn't mentioned, I apologize, I'm so sorry I
had Kyle Anderson. He is just like the idiosyncrasies of his game. I
can't take my eyes off of them, and people have noted this ad nauseum.
He plays it as speed entirely his own, but it's almost to the
point where defenses are so confounded by how is he playing this slow? I
think the implementation of his jumper and go is improved three point shooting. That's
been a cool wrinkle to his game. I just love watching him move on
the ball because his body mechanics don't make sense to me. And the comparison
I've made is he looks like one of those inflatable two men billowing in the
wind of those sketchy car dealerships. I can't get enough Kylerson. And I
also he has the I don't even know who would be the apt comparison it's
probably a current player where it's like, oh, Joe Ingles in his prime
being able to keep up with guys on defense even though he doesn't have the
raw physical tools. Kyla Erson's kind of the same way, where he gives
you all this positional flexibility because he knows how to use space and angles and
just timing, just being in the right spot. I appreciate that fundamental value,
but it's it's the weirdness of his offensive game that I just love so
much. So that's why he's on there. I'm not gonna say too much
just because we're going really long as it is, and you have a lot
more players to get through. But he is like the living basketball embodiment of
an Ephis pitch like you know when it's coming, you know how once the
pitcher throws it, you know when it's coming, you know how slow it's
going to be. You still can't fucking hit it. It's like it's like
a changeup and a curveball combined. What does that call? Is there a
pitch for that? I probably they're like, there's so many different pitch types,
but I'm gonna stick with my ethis comparison. I hope that that will
I don't. I don't actually don't care. But that's my that's my baseball
ignorance shining through. That's totally fine. Let me try so. Let me
run through these players the last five on my third team without interruption. I'll
trying to do it really quick and then can comment on the sum of them.
That work. Absolutely. I had Jeante Murray on here because, oh
my god, I'm talking about Kauai being able to steal souls on defense.
I love the defensive pressure he brings. I'm actually kind of surprised he's not
receiving more consensus consideration for all defense this year. I don't know if he's
gonna be on one of my two teams, but he definitely belongs in there.
He's fun to watch in transition, even though it's not the most efficient
basketball all the time. And he has the different I don't think he uses
them simultaneously as much. Where you see a DeMar De Rosen or Devin Booker
can change speeds on the same possession, but he has like different speeds to
his game that you don't expect. Definitely more comfortable and less predictable off the
dribble this season on offense, which I've also sort of appreciated my other guard
on the third team, Devin Booker. Funny you like Chris Paul on yours.
I feel like I've tilted so far in the direction of just the Devin
Booker bandwagon, like Chief Devin Booker bandwagon, or among national analysts, because
Suns fans no how good he is. He has defenses just on a string,
and he has a change of pace to his game that I think I
just said it when I was talking about Murray, that he can bake in
on the same possession where it's when you see guys play up on him,
like he can get by them in a way that CPS three really can.
Where he's looking to get off that midrange jumper. Yeah, Devin Booker wants
to do that. He'll snake into them too, which is something I feel
like he's borrowed from CP three. But he also he will really just blitz
past those guys on occasion. I really love his passing and you can just
see the manipulation out of the pick and roll, the decision making out of
double teams. I love when it feels like someone has total control over the
defense and he's miss shots this year, especially in crunch time, I feel
like he would normally hit. But I wasn't factoring in purely efficiency when I
was picking these teams. I just want I find myself endlessly appreciating how much
control and influence he has over the offensive end. And I do think he
throws just some really smart passes where no they're not the flashiest, but you
look it and you're like, well, that shot wouldn't exist if Devin Booker
wasn't on the court. Third team forward, this might be the one that
catches you off guard the most, even though you already know about it.
I'd Devin Fassel and this was one of the weird numbers I looked up because
I wanted to make sure that I wasn't like overweighting it. I feel like
he just never stops moving, and that it especially happens on defense. So
I looked it up among all the players, and there are three hundred and
fifty three of them who have appeared in at least five games and are averaging
at least fifteen minutes per game. He ranks fifth in average defensive speed.
I know that doesn't always translate to good defense. One I think he's gonna
be a fantastic defender, but like, who moves like that that fast on
defense, Like that's not something that just genuinely happens. And so I think
he's gonna be great for the Spurs on that I'm moving forward. I'd like
to see more from his offensive game. But there is also the element for
him where it's you know, he's not going to move as I guess,
what do you want to say quickly on offense, because that's just not his
game. And you're gonna need him to hit spot up three and you're going
to need him to cuts, and so like, I don't know, he's
never gonna be that necessarily that quickly, move that as quickly on offense.
But but he does when you watch him. He just the Spurs if they
want they like to have guys in different iterations of their teams, different iterations
of their line ups, they're going to have those guys in constant motion.
He is someone who's just going to be all over the place on both ends
of the court. And that was a terrible way to phrase it, to
say that he's not gonna be as quick on offense. That wasn't really what
I was saying his role on defense is going to be more complicated was my
point. But offensively, like there's just zip there. I wonder if he'll
have more ball skills to plumb, but he's gonna he's going to be a
really good two way player. My final two spots of this exercise, to
round out the third team, I had f forward Alex Alexei Pokashevski Poku.
It's not rooted in effectiveness, but it's like, what if al you took
Alan Iverson Iverson's confidence and added twelve inches to it. And that's just the
shots that he takes. The stuff he tries to do off the dribble.
I don't know if it will ever always come together, but he's had moments
where it's like, that's a seven footer dribbling the ball like a guard,
moving like a wing. It's bizarre, it's weird, it can be a
train wreck. I can't take my eyes away from it, and I love
it, infatuated with it. This will look poorly if he doesn't turn into
effective player. I think universally we could say everyone on this list is an
effective player. Poku is the one from my list you look at and say
I don't know if he'll ever get there, but he's going to be what
is the model of this podcast, fun as hell along the journey. And
finally I have Norland's Noel. Is you already mentioned him as an arnable mentioned
among yours? The dude watching him on offense can be rough, like where
he won't give the ball up if he's under the basket, or the stone
hands that we've talked about. He is so fun on defense and the fact
that there are no business decisions on that end. He is going to try
and contest your poster and I think this isn't there's not going to be an
official staff for this, but of the contesting posters, to successfully contesting posters
ratio, he has to have the highest in the league, like he has
stopped so many would be just explosive poster dunks this season, and I love
watching it. And they're not even just oh he's around the basket. He's
making these plays. He is coming into those plays on occasion. And then
obviously I didn't include him in here. This would be my one honorable mention
because he has not played enough and I was trying to talk about guys got
mints Frankie Lakina. I feels indicated after watching his no Look pass the other
night and the defense that he plays. Frankie Lakina is on his own list
and he takes up all fifteen spots of it. So my thoughts in response
that are very scattered. After your solo podcast there, my honorable mentions included
de Jante, Murray and and Nerolan's Noell among those five players, so I
did think about giving them some love. I thought about the other guys,
probably less about Fassel, but did at least consider them. You mentioned that
Poku is is like if you took Allen Iverson and added twelve inches. That's
actually exactly accurate in terms of height because Iverson was listed at six foot.
I don't think he was actually six foot, and Poku is seven foot,
but you would also only be adding twenty five pounds, which is kind of
hilarious. Ai was listed at one sixty five. Poko is listed at one
ninety. I just thought that was worth pointing out calling bullshit on that Allen
Iverson might be the one that's that needs to have twenty five pounds attracted from
him, So I'm calling bullshit on Poku. Being almost two hundred pounds.
If we yeah, yeah Thunder fans listening to this, we need we need
his actual weight. Please find that out for us. Poku, if you're
listening to this, just send me a text. I will also say that
you were the only person who had Dejante Murray or Devin Wasssell on even a
single ballot, not a single fan vote for either of them. And then
finally, I still just can't get past the missed opportunity that we had because
it seemed like there was a chance that Anthony Davis and Nerland's Noel were going
to play on the same team and can you imagine can you imagine that defense?
And look, it's still possible. They're gonna have their mid level and
they're obsessed with getting bigs for Anthony Davis and he's gonna be a free agent.
I would kill to see that. That would be so much fun.
But now let's real fast. Let's recap all the teams because it's been hard
to track who made which one, so let's just run through a real fast
I'll share mine first, where my first team was LaMelo Ball, Steph Curry,
Zion Williamson, Janisanta to Cumbo, Nicolai Yokich. Second team was Anthony
Edwards, Fred Van Vleet, Jay Shawn Tate, Nicholas Claxton, damn Adebayo.
Third team was Chris Paul, Russell, Westbrook, Keldon Johnson, want
To, Skano Anderson, and Robert Williams. The third My first team guards
were Stephen Curry, LaMelo Ball, forwards, Chris Bouchet, Zion Williamson,
center, Nicola Yokich. My second team in full Kyle Lowrys, Haliburton,
Kyle Anderson, Wantaskano Anderson, Nikolas Claxton. My third team in full Dejanta
Murray, Devin Booker, Devin Vassell, Alexey Polkashevski and Nerland's Noel. I
liked that I had double Kyles in the second team and double Devon's in the
third team, which is actually an accomplishment because it feels intentional. Yeah,
it wasn't aentional. That's how I did this fair enough. The Fans team
first team Steph Curry, Lukachi Jannisan To, the Kumbo, Julius Randall and
Nikola Yokich. The second team LaMelo Ball, Russell, Westbrook, Kevin Durant,
Zion Williamson, Joel Embiid. The third team at guard, we had
Damian Lillard and Fecunda Composo. At forward, Michael Porter Junior and Kawhi Leonard
and at center bam Autubaio. And all of that means that the first annual
All Hardwood Knox team. At first team we have Stephen Curry, LaMelo Ball
a guard, Zion Williamson and Janishan to the kum Poe at forward, Nikolai
Yokich at center. The second team Russell Westbrook and Luka don Chich had guard
Nicholas Clacks and then one to Skano Anderson it forward and bam on a Bio
at center. And at the third team we have Anthony Edwards and Tyrese Halliburton
and a rookie pairing at guard, Julius Randall and Joel Embiid at forward,
and Chris Bouchet as our center. It's great that he made it as a
center, even though I put him as a forward. Yeah, I was
just pigeonholing guys in as I could to get the ones who had the highest
course. He deserved to be there. That's why I put him on first
team, to ensure that I could skew the scores enough that he would make
it. You did it. You succeeded at that task. That does it
for us. I hope everyone enjoyed this near ninety minute podcast. It was
fun for us. This was an enjoyable exercise and will now be an annual
thing as per usual. Please, please, pretty please remember to rate,
review and subscribe to this podcast wherever you get your podcasts, if you use
iTunes, if you don't use iTunes either, or head over there search Hardwin
Knox. Throw us a five star rating, write a review. Those numbers
have been a little bit stagnant lately, but the ratings and reviews help us
a ton, so head over there, five star rating right, whatever the
hell you want in the reviews. Follow us on Twitter at Hardwood Knox.
Follow our YouTube channel, go to YouTube dot com or Chard Knox will come
up. Follow the Sports Math networked at the Underscore Sports Underscore Math until next
time, leave with the shout out? What are you whispering at me?
Ada, I'm trying to get out of here. I'm trying to subconsciously influence
your shout out. Oh, until next time, we leave you with the
shout out two No One The Old Sugar, Ray, Leonard, Roberto Duran,
Marvelous, Marvin Hagler, and Thomas Hearns. Legends whose four way rivalry
define one of the greatest errors in boxing history, relive their decade of dominance
in the new Showtime Sports documentary The Kings, a four parts series premiering Sunday,
June sixth, only on Showtime