WEBVTT

1
00:00:00.480 --> 00:00:04.240
As I say these words, my
microwave is heating up my latest Factor meal.

2
00:00:04.559 --> 00:00:07.719
It's the chili, and it is
a cool, rainy day here in

3
00:00:07.759 --> 00:00:12.560
Minnesota, and I am looking forward
to an easy lunch because I take the

4
00:00:12.560 --> 00:00:16.399
Factor meal out of the refrigerator,
fresh, never frozen, with wholesome ingredients,

5
00:00:16.519 --> 00:00:19.839
packed with nutrients that will give me
the energy to make it through the

6
00:00:19.839 --> 00:00:24.440
workday, all the way through watching
wrestling tonight and hosting the post show podcast.

7
00:00:24.719 --> 00:00:27.519
With a busy fall season already in
full swing, you might be looking

8
00:00:27.519 --> 00:00:32.679
for wholesome, convenient meals for jam
packed days. Also, Factor America's number

9
00:00:32.719 --> 00:00:36.439
one ready to eat meal kit can
help you fuel up fast for breakfast,

10
00:00:36.479 --> 00:00:40.280
lunch, and dinner. With chef
prepared, Dietitian approved ready to eat meals

11
00:00:40.679 --> 00:00:43.880
delivered straight to your door, you'll
save time, eat well, and stay

12
00:00:43.880 --> 00:00:47.280
on track with your healthy lifestyle.
And like me, you don't want to

13
00:00:47.280 --> 00:00:50.159
wait forty five minutes for food to
be delivered and agonize over what kind of

14
00:00:50.159 --> 00:00:53.200
tip to give and then regret how
much you spent and eat fried food that

15
00:00:53.399 --> 00:00:55.799
ends up not being all that hot
by the time you eat it and you

16
00:00:55.840 --> 00:00:59.479
have to microwave it anyway, so
why not have Factor deliver a week's worth

17
00:00:59.479 --> 00:01:03.079
of meals to your door, as
many as you want, and in whatever

18
00:01:03.159 --> 00:01:07.599
variety you want. They have different
themes, including vegan meals and high protein

19
00:01:07.599 --> 00:01:11.519
meals and much more. In fact, there's over thirty five weekly flavor packed,

20
00:01:11.599 --> 00:01:15.560
fresh, never frozen meals that promote
a healthy lifestyle in meet your meal

21
00:01:15.599 --> 00:01:19.439
preferences, all again ready to eat
in just two minutes. They also offer

22
00:01:19.480 --> 00:01:23.560
not just dinner, but lunch to
go meals, effortless wholesome meals like grain

23
00:01:23.599 --> 00:01:26.519
bowls and salad toppers that are ready
to eat when you're on the go,

24
00:01:26.840 --> 00:01:30.480
no microwave required, and my microwave
just beat to the background, My food

25
00:01:30.519 --> 00:01:34.519
is ready. There's also calorie smart
meals with around or less than five hundred

26
00:01:34.519 --> 00:01:38.599
and fifty calories per serving, but
with the nutrients you need for the energy

27
00:01:38.640 --> 00:01:42.120
to get through the day. You
can also try protein plus meals with thirty

28
00:01:42.159 --> 00:01:45.319
grands of protein or more per serving
if you're trying to pack on some muscle

29
00:01:45.599 --> 00:01:48.359
from workouts at the gym, and
with Factor, you can rest assured you're

30
00:01:48.359 --> 00:01:51.640
making a sustainable choice. They outset
one hundred percent of their delivery emissions and

31
00:01:51.719 --> 00:01:57.280
source one hundred percent renewable electricity for
their production sites and offices. So this

32
00:01:57.359 --> 00:02:00.719
October, get Factor and enjoy eating
well without the hassle. Choose your meals

33
00:02:00.719 --> 00:02:05.040
and enjoy fresh, flavor packed meals
delivered to your door, ready in just

34
00:02:05.079 --> 00:02:07.919
two minutes, no prep, no
mess. So head to Factor Meals dot

35
00:02:07.960 --> 00:02:14.520
Com slash Wade fifty. That's Factor
Meals dot com slash Wad fifty and use

36
00:02:14.560 --> 00:02:19.759
code Wade fifty to get fifty percent
off. That's codewad fifty at Factor Meals

37
00:02:19.759 --> 00:02:23.319
dot Com slash weight fifty to get
fifty percent off. Now I'm gonna go

38
00:02:23.439 --> 00:02:38.840
have my delicious lunch. Now,
PW Torch and Spreaker bring you the Wade

39
00:02:38.919 --> 00:02:43.879
Killer Pro Wrestling Podcast. It's time
for this week's Interview Classic, where Wadekiller

40
00:02:44.039 --> 00:02:52.280
interviews one of pro wrestling's newsmakers ten
years ago. This week, XWWE creative

41
00:02:52.280 --> 00:02:54.800
Team ever John Piermarini joined me and
we talked about the hype for helen A

42
00:02:54.879 --> 00:02:59.919
Seal, Randy Orton against Daniel Brian, looking ahead to wrestle Mania thirty,

43
00:03:00.319 --> 00:03:05.599
and the Royal Rumpe preceding it,
Undertaker's potential opponents behind the scenes stories on

44
00:03:05.840 --> 00:03:09.080
working with Vince McMahon, Triple H
and Michael Hayes, and more insights from

45
00:03:09.199 --> 00:03:15.080
John Piermarini again he worked behind the
scenes in WWE in circa two thousand and

46
00:03:15.120 --> 00:03:19.080
nine twenty ten. We had live
callers and email questions throughout this originally live

47
00:03:19.080 --> 00:03:23.319
streamed on October twenty fifth, twenty
thirteen, and it is today's Wade Keller

48
00:03:23.360 --> 00:03:35.639
Progressling Podcast Interview Classic for Thursday,
November two, twenty twenty three. Welcome

49
00:03:35.680 --> 00:03:39.360
to vp W Torch Live cast.
I am Wade Keller, editor and publisher

50
00:03:39.400 --> 00:03:46.639
of the Pro Wrestling Torch newsletter since
nineteen eighty seven, and also pwtorch dot

51
00:03:46.680 --> 00:03:51.599
com, the website since nineteen ninety
nine, and the PW Torch apps available

52
00:03:51.599 --> 00:03:57.080
free on iPhone Android in the Google
Play Store, Amazon Kindle Fire, and

53
00:03:57.599 --> 00:04:02.319
the Windows Phones App Store, and
also the latest Samsung Smart TVs and Smart

54
00:04:02.360 --> 00:04:05.280
Blu Ray players. Just do a
search for PW Torch you'll find our free

55
00:04:05.280 --> 00:04:11.199
app and we hope you can enjoy
our articles through those mediums in addition to

56
00:04:11.599 --> 00:04:14.719
the world wide Web. Thank you
for joining me today. It is Friday,

57
00:04:14.719 --> 00:04:18.639
October twenty fifth, two thousand thirteen. It is five thirty two Eastern

58
00:04:19.600 --> 00:04:24.319
and that means it's two thirty two
Pacific time. And we are live every

59
00:04:24.360 --> 00:04:30.839
single day on the blogtalk radio network
here at PW torchlivecast dot com and Mondays

60
00:04:30.839 --> 00:04:33.160
we are on in the hour leading
into Raw Live, so you can listen

61
00:04:33.199 --> 00:04:38.800
to Bruce Mitchell and Travis Bryant live
discuss weekend happenings and also preview Raw,

62
00:04:39.079 --> 00:04:42.759
and then Tuesday through Friday, we
have different hosts different lineups. I host

63
00:04:42.800 --> 00:04:46.120
on Tuesdays with the Jason Powell of
the website Pro Wrestling dot Net, and

64
00:04:46.160 --> 00:04:51.360
then Wednesdays is Pat McNeil with a
special guest or guests, and Thursday James

65
00:04:51.360 --> 00:04:57.519
Caldwell hosts with either Torch columnist Greg
Parks or Sean Radikin and Friday's Our Interview

66
00:04:57.560 --> 00:05:00.959
Friday, where I have a special
guest from the rest world joining me.

67
00:05:01.560 --> 00:05:04.759
Today, I was scheduled to have
Chris to Joseph, he was unable to

68
00:05:04.800 --> 00:05:08.720
join us. He had a last
second conflict come up that has not happened

69
00:05:08.720 --> 00:05:12.480
to us very often over the last
couple of years, but he will be

70
00:05:12.560 --> 00:05:16.959
on perhaps as soon as next week, so in his place is All Star

71
00:05:17.160 --> 00:05:23.199
panelist John Pierre Marini, another ex
WWE Creative Team member, and he would

72
00:05:23.199 --> 00:05:27.480
be calling in in just a moment, probably in about a minute or two,

73
00:05:27.519 --> 00:05:30.360
so when we hear the chime,
it will be it'll be John joining

74
00:05:30.439 --> 00:05:35.240
us. Also, just want to
make notes that Sunday night after Helen us

75
00:05:35.279 --> 00:05:39.600
Cell the Helen USL pay per view
at eleven thirty Eastern, so just a

76
00:05:39.720 --> 00:05:43.120
half hour or so after the pay
per view wins, James Caldwell will be

77
00:05:43.120 --> 00:05:48.000
hosting with Greg Parks and taking your
live phone calls and emails and discussing the

78
00:05:48.240 --> 00:05:55.199
just completed event. VIP members of
PW Torch and we sincerely hope you choose

79
00:05:55.240 --> 00:05:58.560
to spend spend a few bucks a
month and become a VIP member with us

80
00:05:58.800 --> 00:06:02.160
and enjoy many many of the benefits
and perks, new features every week,

81
00:06:02.199 --> 00:06:08.000
plus twenty five years worth of Insider
Wrestling archives and text and PDF and audio

82
00:06:08.040 --> 00:06:13.759
format and VP members will have a
chance on Sunday night to hear Bruce Mitchell,

83
00:06:13.839 --> 00:06:16.879
Pat McNeil and me discuss the event
for at least an hour. That

84
00:06:17.519 --> 00:06:24.720
roundtable will be available late on Sunday
night again on exclusively on the PW Torch

85
00:06:24.920 --> 00:06:28.920
VIP audio feed. Today's live cast, by the way, will also include

86
00:06:28.920 --> 00:06:32.240
a VP after show exclusively for VIP
members. As the after the live show

87
00:06:32.279 --> 00:06:35.560
goes off the air, our VIP
members will have a chance to hear bonus

88
00:06:35.600 --> 00:06:41.360
content. John Piermurney will be sticking
around after our live hour to do some

89
00:06:41.399 --> 00:06:46.279
more discussion on various topics current events, including Sunday's pay per view. I

90
00:06:46.319 --> 00:06:48.839
do want to note that we just
got t and A Impact ratings in and

91
00:06:49.079 --> 00:06:56.079
a sy relief in both Spike TV
Headquarters and T and A Headquarters, with

92
00:06:56.160 --> 00:07:00.480
the rating surpassing a one point zero. Finally, it has been since September

93
00:07:00.480 --> 00:07:06.879
twenty since. They haven't surpassed one
point zho since September nineteenth, but they

94
00:07:08.480 --> 00:07:13.000
are back up after a four weeks
stretch under one point zero. In fact,

95
00:07:13.000 --> 00:07:15.560
of the last two weeks way under
one point oh. They did a

96
00:07:15.639 --> 00:07:17.680
point eight two rating two weeks ago
at a point eight to four rating.

97
00:07:17.759 --> 00:07:25.040
Last week they surged we'll call it
no pun intended with Fixy's husband, but

98
00:07:25.279 --> 00:07:29.040
they surged to a one point one
rating. We'll have a lot more details

99
00:07:29.040 --> 00:07:31.879
on that on PW Torch dot com, so check that out. We always

100
00:07:31.879 --> 00:07:36.399
have great in depth coverage of ratings
with demographic breakdowns and we put it all

101
00:07:36.399 --> 00:07:40.959
in perspective with the trends. I
heard the chime and that means our guest

102
00:07:41.040 --> 00:07:43.759
today, John Piermarini is joining me. John, welcome back to the live

103
00:07:43.800 --> 00:07:46.800
cast. Hey Wade, how you
doing. I'm doing great. I'm glad

104
00:07:46.839 --> 00:07:48.639
you could join me. At the
last second. I had explained that Chris

105
00:07:48.759 --> 00:07:53.560
Joseph was scheduled to be with us
for they had a last second cancelation.

106
00:07:53.959 --> 00:07:56.680
So John, I really appreciate on
short notice of you being able to join

107
00:07:56.759 --> 00:08:01.279
us. Sure anytime, Always good
to have on. John Permrini is part

108
00:08:01.279 --> 00:08:05.319
of the PW Torch All Star Panel. The SPW Torch All Star Panel every

109
00:08:05.360 --> 00:08:09.720
single day this month, it's a
website exclusive. Next month it'll go back

110
00:08:09.759 --> 00:08:13.319
to being an app exclusive and if
you're a VIP member, you can read

111
00:08:13.360 --> 00:08:16.000
it on both platforms, both the
app and the website. John Permrini answers

112
00:08:16.040 --> 00:08:20.240
your questions along with other All Star
panelists every day on that feature. So

113
00:08:20.800 --> 00:08:26.319
this month you can read the views
of X creative Team ever John Piermerini,

114
00:08:26.879 --> 00:08:31.039
X Announcer mccarsh current Indie wrestler and
former ACW World Champion, Just Incredible,

115
00:08:31.279 --> 00:08:35.720
and many other all star panelists who
have wide wide array of experience behind the

116
00:08:35.759 --> 00:08:41.679
scenes in professional wrestling. Plus Torch
Assistant editor James Caldwell and PW Torch website

117
00:08:41.679 --> 00:08:46.799
contributors join in the discussion sometimes also, that is a great feature, definitely

118
00:08:46.799 --> 00:08:50.320
we're checking out this month at PW
Torch dot com our website. Our website,

119
00:08:50.360 --> 00:08:54.399
of course is updated every single day
throughout the day with TV results,

120
00:08:54.440 --> 00:08:58.720
paper results live as they happen,
and breaking news and a ton of special

121
00:08:58.720 --> 00:09:03.679
feature Hope you have a chance to
check that out every day. We're opening

122
00:09:03.759 --> 00:09:07.840
up the phone lines U six four, six, seven, two one nine,

123
00:09:07.039 --> 00:09:11.159
eight to eight is our phone number. If you have a question about

124
00:09:11.200 --> 00:09:15.679
Sundays Helen us Sell, you want
to talk about where WW may go with

125
00:09:15.759 --> 00:09:20.159
things this Sunday, or you have
some thoughts on what happens headed into survivorceries

126
00:09:20.200 --> 00:09:24.679
after Helena Sell, or you just
want to talk about current events in professional

127
00:09:24.720 --> 00:09:28.399
wrestling. Otherwise, we invite your
phone calls and we also will be checking

128
00:09:28.440 --> 00:09:33.840
out email if you have email questions
for John and me. PW Torch Live

129
00:09:33.919 --> 00:09:39.200
Cast at gmail dot com is our
uh is our email address, and we

130
00:09:39.200 --> 00:09:43.440
welcome you to join in. I'm
checking right now, John to see if

131
00:09:43.440 --> 00:09:46.759
we have any VAP members on hold
who told us that they would be calling

132
00:09:46.879 --> 00:09:52.720
in, and uh, I'm not
seeing any of the numbers on hold jump

133
00:09:52.799 --> 00:09:56.559
out as VIP members. So we
may go. We may go right to

134
00:09:56.600 --> 00:09:58.919
a couple of calls, John,
and then I've got some questions for you

135
00:09:58.960 --> 00:10:01.799
too. But let's see, we're
caollers. Take us okay, great,

136
00:10:01.039 --> 00:10:03.559
great, And by the way,
I should note for those who are new

137
00:10:03.559 --> 00:10:07.360
to the show, John, for
me, you were with WWE for two

138
00:10:07.399 --> 00:10:13.679
years. I'm trying to remember,
was it roughly it was like, yeah,

139
00:10:13.759 --> 00:10:16.600
two thousand and nine to the beginning
of not the beginning. I think

140
00:10:16.639 --> 00:10:20.960
it was right after Wrestlemane at two
thousand and nine to the end of twenty

141
00:10:22.080 --> 00:10:24.080
ten. Perfect, yep, so
nearly two years with the company. So

142
00:10:24.320 --> 00:10:26.279
I want to throw out there too, if you have a question about that

143
00:10:26.360 --> 00:10:31.519
specific time period. John Piermarini was
working behind the scenes with Vinsic Man,

144
00:10:31.600 --> 00:10:35.519
John Cena and everybody, and we
certainly welcome for your questions on that era

145
00:10:35.639 --> 00:10:39.159
specifically. It's always cool to get
questions about that. All right, Let's

146
00:10:39.240 --> 00:10:43.519
let's set a record here and get
to a phone call before we are more

147
00:10:43.559 --> 00:10:46.320
than fifteen minutes into the show,
and start with aera code eight four five,

148
00:10:46.879 --> 00:10:50.039
and on deck will be five seven
to one, eight four five.

149
00:10:50.080 --> 00:10:56.000
Please stay trename and where you're from? Eight four five. We've stunned him

150
00:10:56.240 --> 00:11:01.320
by going to him. I think
you wanted to talk to christ Joseph if

151
00:11:01.320 --> 00:11:03.720
you want to ask Bake Dick Dudley
about his fans, all right, eight

152
00:11:03.720 --> 00:11:07.039
four five. I'll just avoid confusion. I gotta hang up on you.

153
00:11:07.080 --> 00:11:09.399
If you want to call back,
you certainly can't. All right, Let's

154
00:11:09.399 --> 00:11:13.120
try five to seven to one as
promised. Five seven one. Please state

155
00:11:13.120 --> 00:11:18.320
your name and where you're from.
Five seven one, five seven one.

156
00:11:20.320 --> 00:11:24.279
All right, I am over too. All right, well, let's take

157
00:11:24.279 --> 00:11:26.879
an email question. We got some
wonder No, no, I wonder.

158
00:11:26.919 --> 00:11:31.200
I'm wondering if there's not a problem
with switchboard the way things are showing up

159
00:11:31.200 --> 00:11:33.919
as people wanting to be on hold. I got to refresh the switchboard and

160
00:11:35.159 --> 00:11:39.080
fix that. But anyway, all
right, let's uh, you know what

161
00:11:39.279 --> 00:11:43.559
screw. I'm gonna ask you questions
John, because I want to know what

162
00:11:43.600 --> 00:11:48.399
you think of the hype for Helen
usself, for Randy Orton and Daniel Bryan.

163
00:11:48.399 --> 00:11:52.600
I think there's been some good,
there's been some bad, something's missing,

164
00:11:52.720 --> 00:11:56.480
something's good. But overall, how
do you grade it and what jumps

165
00:11:56.480 --> 00:12:00.159
out to you as the strength and
weaknesses of the rematch of a rematch and

166
00:12:00.320 --> 00:12:05.919
the ongoing storyline Wage and Stephanie McMahon
kind of their power trip. Yeah,

167
00:12:05.960 --> 00:12:07.480
I don't. I don't know if
I could give it a grade, just

168
00:12:07.480 --> 00:12:13.960
because I haven't seen everything I've been. You know, I don't watch SmackDown

169
00:12:13.000 --> 00:12:18.759
at all, but I'll tune into
to Raw periodically and check it out,

170
00:12:18.799 --> 00:12:24.360
so, uh, you know,
I don't know. I I kind of

171
00:12:24.399 --> 00:12:26.480
don't get it. I mean,
it's it's a I guess I'm in the

172
00:12:26.480 --> 00:12:31.639
middle on it because there's aspects of
it that are appealing and then there's there's

173
00:12:31.679 --> 00:12:35.000
just mind boggling aspects of it.
I just don't understand. I think that,

174
00:12:37.360 --> 00:12:39.879
you know, especially like with helping
you with that All Star panel,

175
00:12:39.960 --> 00:12:43.240
you know, we see a lot
of questions that you know, they purposely

176
00:12:43.720 --> 00:12:50.159
burying Daniel Bryan because they don't want
him to succeed, And I think the

177
00:12:50.200 --> 00:12:54.720
misconception that a lot of fans have
with this storyline is that although they are

178
00:12:54.919 --> 00:13:00.000
burying him, I don't think that
that's their intention. I think they truly

179
00:13:00.080 --> 00:13:05.399
we feel that this is the best
way to get Daniel Bryan over. I

180
00:13:05.559 --> 00:13:11.240
don't think that it's working, but
they truly believe this is the best way

181
00:13:11.279 --> 00:13:15.120
to do it and how it could
be because normally, and you see this

182
00:13:15.240 --> 00:13:18.759
with past champions, you see the
guys like the Batistas and the John Cenas

183
00:13:18.759 --> 00:13:24.200
and the bigger guys, they get
booked strong and then you get the smaller

184
00:13:24.240 --> 00:13:28.480
guys. When Mysterio had the title, Brian, I can't think of anyone

185
00:13:28.480 --> 00:13:33.120
else off top of my head.
I guess even when Heeler had the title,

186
00:13:33.639 --> 00:13:37.200
they're booked and he was a heel
so it's a little different. But

187
00:13:37.519 --> 00:13:43.679
they're booked almost weak, and you
know, I don't know if that's just

188
00:13:43.759 --> 00:13:46.320
the perception of Vince going, well, that's the way that they're going to

189
00:13:46.360 --> 00:13:50.200
be perceived, So we'll give it
to them that way and then show that

190
00:13:50.240 --> 00:13:54.720
they'll fight from the bottom and succeed
or not succeed with this story though.

191
00:13:56.639 --> 00:14:00.399
The weirdest part for me though,
with this whole thing. Even when you

192
00:14:00.519 --> 00:14:05.679
had different champions, you never had
the company come out and basically tell you

193
00:14:07.360 --> 00:14:11.399
this guy is not worthy of being
a champion. He's not worthy of the

194
00:14:11.440 --> 00:14:16.320
position that he has. It's it's
almost as if you'd have this movie that

195
00:14:16.360 --> 00:14:20.840
you're gonna promote and the studio comes
out and says, you know, hey,

196
00:14:22.080 --> 00:14:28.080
Ben Aflack doesn't deserve to be Batman. He thinks he's not even as

197
00:14:28.080 --> 00:14:33.919
good as anyone who's been Batman before. And so but anyways, it's twelve

198
00:14:35.000 --> 00:14:37.559
dollars, make sure you go get
it or go watch it this Friday,

199
00:14:39.679 --> 00:14:41.720
and great, we hope that we're
number one at the box office. I

200
00:14:41.720 --> 00:14:46.120
mean that part. I just don't
understand the way that they're presenting Daniel Bryan,

201
00:14:46.679 --> 00:14:50.559
burying him and then telling you to
spend money to watch him wrestle.

202
00:14:50.960 --> 00:14:56.440
So with that said, I don't
know. I think majority of the people

203
00:14:56.480 --> 00:15:03.360
lost interest in this match itself two
months ago. I think that they went

204
00:15:03.399 --> 00:15:09.799
two pay per views in a row, disappointing the viewers. And I don't

205
00:15:09.799 --> 00:15:13.200
know, I don't necessarily know if
anyone's all that interested in coming back.

206
00:15:13.919 --> 00:15:16.440
Let me ask about that finished to
battle round the big show runs in knocks,

207
00:15:16.440 --> 00:15:20.559
both guys out, show goes off
the year, no decision. I

208
00:15:20.559 --> 00:15:24.840
don't know how my job was just
dropped when I realized that's the end,

209
00:15:24.960 --> 00:15:28.799
you know, like to me to
kind of point the question in a certain

210
00:15:28.799 --> 00:15:33.559
direction with my point of view,
it seemed like that was somewhat revealing of

211
00:15:33.080 --> 00:15:41.559
the brain trust, the creative team
ultimately basic managerrible ah not understanding that there's

212
00:15:41.600 --> 00:15:43.759
a core aspect to what makes people
buy a pay per view in an era

213
00:15:45.200 --> 00:15:48.279
where you can see five hours of
it's like your answer for the all star

214
00:15:48.279 --> 00:15:52.480
panel that'll go up later today on
Survivor series and why you know you used

215
00:15:52.519 --> 00:15:54.000
to be able to do the one
big team against another big team and that

216
00:15:54.120 --> 00:15:58.519
novelty was enough to sell a pay
per view, but now it's starvarsus Star

217
00:15:58.559 --> 00:16:00.480
matches all the time. So the
gain people buy pay per views in this

218
00:16:00.519 --> 00:16:06.039
era where there's five six hours of
primetime first run star versus Star wrestling is

219
00:16:06.080 --> 00:16:08.679
there's a trust. There's an implicit
trust that it may not even be overtly

220
00:16:08.679 --> 00:16:12.039
thought about by the buyer, by
the fan, but there's an overt trust

221
00:16:12.120 --> 00:16:17.279
based on just history that the pay
per view is where big things happen and

222
00:16:17.360 --> 00:16:21.559
things are resolved and you're not giving
cliffhangers and you're not screwed over, especially

223
00:16:21.639 --> 00:16:25.000
in the main event. And I
thought that they lost sight of that on

224
00:16:25.080 --> 00:16:26.440
that with that finish of that pay
per view, and I think it was

225
00:16:26.440 --> 00:16:32.080
a real blow to the trust that
that the pay perview customer base is shrinking

226
00:16:32.080 --> 00:16:33.919
as it is, especially in the
United States. It was a blow to

227
00:16:33.960 --> 00:16:37.240
that pack, to that unstated pack
that viewers in ww we had with each

228
00:16:37.240 --> 00:16:42.759
other. I feel, and this
is completely just a guess, but you

229
00:16:42.759 --> 00:16:45.480
know, just kind of based on
my experience there, what I think happened

230
00:16:45.519 --> 00:16:49.039
is, you know, they plan
to go and who knows how far they're

231
00:16:49.080 --> 00:16:52.480
going with it, But let's say
they planned to go three months with Brian

232
00:16:52.559 --> 00:16:56.399
versus Orton in this program, and
you know it's planned out. I can't

233
00:16:56.399 --> 00:16:59.679
remember the names of the pay per
views, but let's just say they go,

234
00:17:00.159 --> 00:17:03.440
Okay, we're going to have Brian
versus Orton and Battleground at Helena Cell

235
00:17:03.640 --> 00:17:07.559
and at this pay per view.
So we know that we're going there,

236
00:17:07.880 --> 00:17:14.880
but we don't necessarily have everything locked
in as far as you know, we

237
00:17:14.960 --> 00:17:17.960
may have an idea of going well, we know, you know, Orton's

238
00:17:17.960 --> 00:17:21.039
going to walk in as champion,
and you know, two three months later,

239
00:17:21.079 --> 00:17:22.680
however long ago, he's still going
to be champion. We may know

240
00:17:22.720 --> 00:17:26.440
that, but you know, in
this case, I think that what probably

241
00:17:26.480 --> 00:17:30.000
happened is that they said, Okay, we've got to get to Helen a

242
00:17:30.079 --> 00:17:36.799
Cell with this, and maybe they
didn't even have a finish for Battleground until

243
00:17:37.359 --> 00:17:38.680
the day of the pay per view. And I mean, I think it's

244
00:17:38.680 --> 00:17:42.519
pretty clear. I think you've had
Meris writers come on here, and I

245
00:17:42.559 --> 00:17:48.960
think you know, whoever else is
probably mentioned that there's there's rewrites and decisions

246
00:17:49.000 --> 00:17:55.319
made hours before a show, And
what it sounds to me was that they

247
00:17:55.400 --> 00:18:00.079
felt, how do we get out
of this match without declaring a champion and

248
00:18:00.599 --> 00:18:06.240
going one more and that was the
best scenario. And I mean, when

249
00:18:06.279 --> 00:18:11.000
you're locked up against you know,
a time, it might just have been

250
00:18:11.000 --> 00:18:12.880
the best thing that they could have
done, because maybe they didn't want to

251
00:18:12.920 --> 00:18:19.839
put the title on one of them, because then how can you realistically get

252
00:18:19.880 --> 00:18:23.000
to a third matchup. I mean, it's possible, but maybe at the

253
00:18:23.039 --> 00:18:26.440
time they went, you know,
there's only so many stories we could tell

254
00:18:26.440 --> 00:18:30.279
with this. If it's not on. If Orton doesn't win it, we've

255
00:18:30.279 --> 00:18:33.200
already expressed our frustration with him,
So how could we get him in the

256
00:18:33.240 --> 00:18:37.400
match again? If Daniel doesn't win, well, that's easy, he's out.

257
00:18:37.480 --> 00:18:40.680
We can we don't have to give
him another opportunity. So maybe they

258
00:18:40.680 --> 00:18:42.599
felt like that was just the best
way to give both these guys into a

259
00:18:42.640 --> 00:18:45.920
match again. And maybe it was
the last minute decision because I truly feel

260
00:18:47.200 --> 00:18:52.440
that, you know, creative.
I know that they're not. They don't

261
00:18:52.480 --> 00:18:59.680
have a huge fan base out there, but you know they're smarter than they

262
00:18:59.720 --> 00:19:03.480
get credit for. And there is
a lot of great ideas that come out

263
00:19:03.480 --> 00:19:07.720
of that room that never actually happened
because it hits a roadblock somewhere. And

264
00:19:08.119 --> 00:19:12.880
sometimes there's a lot of bad ideas
that do happen, but also bad ideas

265
00:19:12.880 --> 00:19:17.359
that don't because you know, when
it hits Vince or or Triple H,

266
00:19:17.519 --> 00:19:19.200
they make it better or they just
say it's not going to happen, but

267
00:19:19.839 --> 00:19:23.880
you know it was. Ultimately it's
going to come down to Vince, and

268
00:19:25.000 --> 00:19:26.759
you know I could I could sit
in a room and I could pitch that

269
00:19:26.839 --> 00:19:30.039
idea. He doesn't like it.
He's not going to go, well,

270
00:19:30.240 --> 00:19:33.279
you know, I pay you to
to write the show, so I guess

271
00:19:33.359 --> 00:19:40.079
that's what we're doing. So you've
never said that. Ultimately, that's what

272
00:19:40.200 --> 00:19:42.440
Vince wanted to do, and and
you know he had his reasons for it,

273
00:19:42.680 --> 00:19:48.680
and you know, again that would
have worked on a raw I you

274
00:19:48.720 --> 00:19:52.079
know, but the Big Show thing
is just tiring, and I'm glad they

275
00:19:52.119 --> 00:19:56.279
kind of moved past the whole him
being stuck with having to do what Triple

276
00:19:56.400 --> 00:19:57.720
H tells him, but the whole, you know, the whole thing with

277
00:19:57.839 --> 00:20:02.200
getting fired. I mean, guys
are getting fired on a weekly basis.

278
00:20:02.240 --> 00:20:07.759
Now, that thing is so tired
and warm vow. I can't believe they

279
00:20:07.799 --> 00:20:11.000
still go that route and expect,
you know, people to care or get

280
00:20:11.000 --> 00:20:17.000
a reaction out of someone getting fired. And I mean, realistically, it

281
00:20:17.160 --> 00:20:22.920
just doesn't make sense how Big Show
has so much access to I guess the

282
00:20:22.000 --> 00:20:26.279
arena and when you it just tells
me as a fan, all right,

283
00:20:26.359 --> 00:20:30.359
well if I want to I don't
want, I'm gonna held Daniel Bryan,

284
00:20:30.400 --> 00:20:33.680
I'm gonna I'm gonna hop the guard, I'm gonna knock out Brandy or and

285
00:20:33.720 --> 00:20:37.640
there you go. You know,
it's just treated so differently that I feel

286
00:20:37.680 --> 00:20:41.240
like if you want to present something
one way, it's got you've got to

287
00:20:41.279 --> 00:20:45.599
be consistent in that for people to
continue to believe in what you're trying to

288
00:20:45.640 --> 00:20:51.119
get across. We invite you to
email the show with feedback or questions or

289
00:20:51.119 --> 00:20:56.160
comments. That email address is Wade
Keller Podcast at petew torch dot com.

290
00:20:56.279 --> 00:21:00.359
That's Wadekeller Podcast at PW torch dot
com. Also welcome your feed back on

291
00:21:00.400 --> 00:21:03.799
Twitter. Even follow us on Twitter
at PW torch and follow me at the

292
00:21:03.960 --> 00:21:12.880
Wade Keller. That's at PW Torch
and at the Wade Keller. Was there

293
00:21:12.880 --> 00:21:18.039
ever a time or let me ask
this specific if you were sitting there and

294
00:21:18.039 --> 00:21:22.160
you heard this finish for the pay
per view Daniel Bryan and Randy Orton being

295
00:21:22.240 --> 00:21:25.599
knocked out by Big Show when it
goes off the air, and you're thinking,

296
00:21:25.680 --> 00:21:26.640
or you know, a couple of
people on the creative team are thinking,

297
00:21:26.680 --> 00:21:29.759
oh man, you know, and
let's say it's not a last second

298
00:21:29.839 --> 00:21:30.880
thing. You know, like this
is brought up by vincck Mann on a

299
00:21:30.880 --> 00:21:36.000
conference call. Would you feel comfortable
saying, you know, hey, here's

300
00:21:36.000 --> 00:21:37.680
the downside of this. I think
we should look for another way. I

301
00:21:37.720 --> 00:21:41.680
think the negative autlways a positive is
the environment with the creative team working with

302
00:21:41.759 --> 00:21:45.319
Vincic Man such where that can be
said or does everyone when it gets to

303
00:21:45.319 --> 00:21:48.359
that level a main event, pay
per view finish, you kind of know

304
00:21:48.680 --> 00:21:52.160
that you better not. You know, Keel Vinson Hunter, this sounds awful

305
00:21:52.200 --> 00:21:56.839
and here's why. Okay, So
I guess you can't just give one straight

306
00:21:56.880 --> 00:22:00.319
answer to that, but I can
kind of get you a few different ones.

307
00:22:02.920 --> 00:22:07.480
Speaking for myself, Yes, there
has been times where there's been something

308
00:22:07.519 --> 00:22:10.920
that was set that you know,
I'd raise my hand and I and I'd

309
00:22:11.000 --> 00:22:15.880
say, hey, just something different, you know, not to say I

310
00:22:15.880 --> 00:22:18.519
don't think we should do this,
just something different, what about this?

311
00:22:18.880 --> 00:22:22.680
And he has changed his mind,
whether it was me or whether it was

312
00:22:22.680 --> 00:22:29.000
somebody else that Sometimes it's an agent
that that gives an idea and if Vince

313
00:22:29.119 --> 00:22:32.119
likes it, he will change his
mind and he will go with that.

314
00:22:32.480 --> 00:22:37.279
But you know, it just kind
of depends on for me, the mood.

315
00:22:37.400 --> 00:22:44.079
So if if I know that we
went through this finish and when we

316
00:22:44.279 --> 00:22:48.759
had the initial meeting with Vince on
on Thursday or Friday, or the conference

317
00:22:48.799 --> 00:22:52.000
call or whatever, it may be, and he was set. He goes,

318
00:22:52.039 --> 00:22:56.039
Guys, I came up with this
idea, it's the greatest thing ever.

319
00:22:56.480 --> 00:22:59.640
This is what we're gonna do.
Then you kind of just sit back

320
00:22:59.680 --> 00:23:04.200
and go, I mean, unless
I have something so great that's going to

321
00:23:04.240 --> 00:23:08.519
blow him away, he's pretty set
on doing this, so you kind of

322
00:23:08.599 --> 00:23:15.359
and you kind of need to know
when you can throw something out, because

323
00:23:15.359 --> 00:23:18.319
you don't always want to be the
one that goes, I got something different,

324
00:23:18.319 --> 00:23:19.759
I got something different. I got
something different. And a lot of

325
00:23:19.799 --> 00:23:23.720
times it was actually there were times
where I would say something and I'd get,

326
00:23:23.839 --> 00:23:27.839
you know this this look from Ran
like I can't believe you just said

327
00:23:27.839 --> 00:23:30.160
something. So there's times like that
where you should go I just don't want

328
00:23:30.160 --> 00:23:33.960
to deal with that, So let
it go. That's what they want to

329
00:23:34.000 --> 00:23:37.480
do. Fine, if there's something
that I truly want to fight for,

330
00:23:37.960 --> 00:23:41.920
you know, like, uh,
I guess it doesn't relate to this.

331
00:23:42.039 --> 00:23:45.160
But you know, when it came
to like money in the bank and they

332
00:23:45.319 --> 00:23:48.720
they wanted to put it on give
it to Orton originally, and I said,

333
00:23:48.759 --> 00:23:52.400
I think we should put it on
miss and you know, Vince gave

334
00:23:52.440 --> 00:23:53.480
me the opportunity to say, why
should we put it on miss And then

335
00:23:53.640 --> 00:23:56.559
you had Brian over there looking at
you like I've got this whole thing planned

336
00:23:56.599 --> 00:24:00.599
out with Orton going over and you
kind of just I'll deal with the consequence

337
00:24:00.640 --> 00:24:08.039
of that, which there wasn't really
a consequence except for you just knew you're

338
00:24:08.119 --> 00:24:12.200
on his bad side. But and
you just go, you know what,

339
00:24:12.279 --> 00:24:15.640
I don't care. This is this
is something that's important to me. So

340
00:24:15.119 --> 00:24:18.200
this is what I'm gonna fight for. And there's other time that you sit

341
00:24:18.200 --> 00:24:21.200
there and you go, no,
like, fine, if that's the finish

342
00:24:21.279 --> 00:24:25.160
that he wants to the pay per
view, I'm not all that invested in

343
00:24:26.359 --> 00:24:30.680
going into battle on this one because
then I can't go into battle on the

344
00:24:30.720 --> 00:24:33.920
next one. So you just kind
of let it go. And again it

345
00:24:33.960 --> 00:24:37.319
really comes to the level of now, let's say there's a right like we

346
00:24:37.680 --> 00:24:40.799
have a finish, and let's say
arn Anderson raises his hand, he goes,

347
00:24:40.799 --> 00:24:42.680
what if we have show come out
knock out both guys. We go

348
00:24:42.720 --> 00:24:45.359
off the air, and Vince likes
it. Okay, well, maybe if

349
00:24:45.400 --> 00:24:48.279
I don't like that, I'm not
gonna raise my hand and go I don't

350
00:24:48.359 --> 00:24:56.839
like it because you absolutely cannot do
that unless you have something to put in

351
00:24:56.880 --> 00:25:00.319
its place, because if you don't, you're you're dead in the water right

352
00:25:00.359 --> 00:25:04.039
there. And on top of that, I remember, I can't remember the

353
00:25:04.039 --> 00:25:07.519
details of it. I'm sure we
talked about it on your show one time.

354
00:25:07.720 --> 00:25:12.759
I remember we were doing the Nexus
story and we had Sena versus Shamus

355
00:25:12.880 --> 00:25:21.440
coming up for the WWE title,
and Sena and Seamus stood together in the

356
00:25:21.519 --> 00:25:26.240
ring with chairs five days before they're
gonna you know, and this is like

357
00:25:26.279 --> 00:25:30.000
their third matchup, five days before
they're gonna go to battle, and they're

358
00:25:30.000 --> 00:25:37.559
standing there with their backs to one
that. I think John's phone cut off,

359
00:25:37.960 --> 00:25:42.880
but I hope he can call it
right back again. That you,

360
00:25:42.960 --> 00:25:48.039
John, I probably was probably drove
out a range. Sorry about that,

361
00:25:48.079 --> 00:25:51.480
everybody, after just joining us,
Chris Joseph you may have heard on Twitter

362
00:25:51.599 --> 00:25:55.440
it was our scheduled guest ex WWE
Creative Team Ember in the mid two thousands.

363
00:25:56.000 --> 00:26:00.799
He had a last second conflict in
his schedule, something much more important

364
00:26:00.839 --> 00:26:03.920
than doing the show. If you
can imagine something, if you can imagine

365
00:26:03.920 --> 00:26:07.920
such a thing, and uh so
he had about out. But John Permerini

366
00:26:07.960 --> 00:26:10.960
did join us, and he is
now back with us, John, we

367
00:26:11.119 --> 00:26:17.160
you were probably uh maybe talk talk
no no, no, I no,

368
00:26:17.519 --> 00:26:21.799
definitely am not complaining about that at
all, but we probably missed the last

369
00:26:21.839 --> 00:26:25.119
ten seconds before your phone disconnected,
before you might have known you disconnected.

370
00:26:25.160 --> 00:26:27.000
So if you want to pick up, did you hear that it was Sina

371
00:26:27.000 --> 00:26:30.759
and seamuson's ring? I'll pick up
at that point. Yeah, okay.

372
00:26:30.799 --> 00:26:33.400
So you know, so they're in
the ring and they're holding off Nexus with

373
00:26:33.519 --> 00:26:37.960
chairs and that's the way they wanted
to go off the show. And I

374
00:26:37.960 --> 00:26:40.559
said, who who's gonna want to
pay to see these two guys fight?

375
00:26:41.039 --> 00:26:44.480
You know, they have this bitter
rivalry and they're standing there as a team,

376
00:26:44.480 --> 00:26:45.519
and then they're going to turn around
and fight each other at a pay

377
00:26:45.559 --> 00:26:51.400
review. And I remember going okay, so and he couldn't say I told

378
00:26:51.440 --> 00:26:52.160
him, And he goes, well, what I mean, how do you

379
00:26:52.240 --> 00:26:56.599
not? How do you get out
of that? Did I remember going,

380
00:26:56.640 --> 00:26:59.240
okay, Well, what if you've
got these two guys with the chairs?

381
00:26:59.279 --> 00:27:04.039
So NeXT's powders and they go out
and Seena turns around and boom, Shamus

382
00:27:04.079 --> 00:27:07.640
hits them with the chair. You
know, it's like, well, Seamus

383
00:27:07.680 --> 00:27:11.400
obviously being the heel is going,
Hey, I'm not trying to get my

384
00:27:11.599 --> 00:27:15.160
ass kicked by Nexus, so I'm
going to stand next to Sina. But

385
00:27:15.279 --> 00:27:18.119
now that Nexus is gone, I
mean, the only reason why I was

386
00:27:18.119 --> 00:27:22.279
standing next to you, Sina,
was to save my ass. So I'm

387
00:27:22.279 --> 00:27:23.680
going to I'm gonna knock you out
now, and I'm going to get out

388
00:27:23.680 --> 00:27:26.200
of here. And if, if
you know, the wolves want to come

389
00:27:26.319 --> 00:27:30.599
and feed on Sena while he's laying
in the rain, great, And I

390
00:27:30.640 --> 00:27:36.480
remember he just he was so set
on it being those two standfall back to

391
00:27:36.519 --> 00:27:37.559
each other to end the show,
and that was it, and it's like,

392
00:27:37.599 --> 00:27:41.640
all right, well that's it.
It yea more generic question, but

393
00:27:41.680 --> 00:27:45.759
related to this interaction that the creative
team like you had with hitsick Man,

394
00:27:45.400 --> 00:27:49.799
did you feel by the time you
left after nearly two years that you learned

395
00:27:49.839 --> 00:27:55.599
a lot and had some misconceptions and
preconceptions about how wrestling should work broken.

396
00:27:55.640 --> 00:27:59.200
Were there's some ideas that you would
have suggested in the first six months that

397
00:27:59.200 --> 00:28:02.400
you worked for WUM that you would
have been embarrassed to even offer in your

398
00:28:02.440 --> 00:28:06.680
last six months because there's kind of
a back and forth education process, not

399
00:28:06.720 --> 00:28:11.720
so much just about what's right and
wrong, but also what fits WWE and

400
00:28:11.799 --> 00:28:15.359
vitzick Man's vision for how they want
to promote, the pace at which they

401
00:28:15.359 --> 00:28:18.559
want to do things, and how
they hold back on like everybody always has

402
00:28:18.559 --> 00:28:19.440
a great idea. Hey, if
you turn John Cena this month, you

403
00:28:19.440 --> 00:28:22.359
could pop business. And my answer
to that is you can turn John Cena

404
00:28:22.440 --> 00:28:26.480
any day between now and his retirement
and pop business. That's not a genius

405
00:28:26.480 --> 00:28:30.960
suggestion, that's a duh. You
know, of course you can. The

406
00:28:30.039 --> 00:28:33.759
question is is now a better time
than in the future, and do you

407
00:28:33.799 --> 00:28:37.640
want to spend that card now versus
later? So more of a broad question

408
00:28:37.680 --> 00:28:41.759
to you, But how do you
feel about your experience there? Yeah?

409
00:28:41.799 --> 00:28:47.319
I mean you definitely learn along the
way and know the way that he wants

410
00:28:47.359 --> 00:28:48.960
to present his product, the way
he wants to tell a story, the

411
00:28:49.000 --> 00:28:53.119
way he wants to build, how
he builds someone, how you don't build

412
00:28:53.119 --> 00:28:56.160
someone. You learn all those things. So yeah, I mean there's definitely

413
00:28:56.279 --> 00:29:00.960
things that I had pitched when I
first got there, and every writer that

414
00:29:00.000 --> 00:29:03.920
walks in there thinks that they have
the best ideas to turn business around,

415
00:29:04.000 --> 00:29:11.960
and there's been I could say probably
every writer when I was there, at

416
00:29:11.119 --> 00:29:17.039
least twice pitched turning Sena. But
that was also because you know, when

417
00:29:17.039 --> 00:29:22.200
I was there, we were struggling
to come up with something to kind of

418
00:29:22.200 --> 00:29:25.960
give us that that pop, and
you know, we kind of went to,

419
00:29:26.200 --> 00:29:27.799
well, I mean, if that's
what we're looking for, this is

420
00:29:27.839 --> 00:29:30.559
it. And you know, you
look back and you go, was it

421
00:29:30.640 --> 00:29:34.480
the best timing? I mean,
I don't know that since I've left that

422
00:29:34.799 --> 00:29:41.920
Sena has accomplished anything as a babyface, all that significant that he couldn't have

423
00:29:42.000 --> 00:29:45.920
done being a heel right now.
So I think if they would have done

424
00:29:45.960 --> 00:29:48.440
it, I think it would have
helped. But you know, I don't

425
00:29:48.480 --> 00:29:53.640
think that it would have been such
a horrible idea at the time. I

426
00:29:53.720 --> 00:30:00.359
think that anytime. My philosophy is
anytime you you do something, as long

427
00:30:00.400 --> 00:30:03.160
as you're not doing it, just
do it. It's fine if you can

428
00:30:03.200 --> 00:30:07.240
think long term. Okay, we're
gonna turn Sina today. Okay, well

429
00:30:07.279 --> 00:30:11.279
what does that do for us?
Because once you turn Sena, you can't

430
00:30:11.279 --> 00:30:15.119
turn him back. Maybe ever,
you know, maybe towards the end of

431
00:30:15.119 --> 00:30:17.480
his career you can. But then
you got to you gotta decide, you

432
00:30:17.519 --> 00:30:19.599
got to go, if this is
going to be impactful, he's got to

433
00:30:19.599 --> 00:30:22.599
be a heel and he's got to
stay a heel for as long as possible.

434
00:30:23.119 --> 00:30:26.680
So as long as you can plan
that out and think about maybe even

435
00:30:26.720 --> 00:30:30.519
one two years ahead, then you're
good. But you know, just to

436
00:30:30.599 --> 00:30:34.119
kind of throw something out there,
like, you know, if I interact

437
00:30:34.160 --> 00:30:37.839
with people on Twitter when I had
the blog and all that stuff, you

438
00:30:37.839 --> 00:30:44.799
know a lot of people think I've
got this great idea or you know,

439
00:30:44.880 --> 00:30:48.400
I remember one person said something I
said something on Twitter or stuff and he

440
00:30:48.400 --> 00:30:52.599
he replied back and he said,
yeah, coming from the guy who worked,

441
00:30:52.599 --> 00:30:56.440
who wrote, who wrote for the
show when it was like the worst

442
00:30:56.480 --> 00:30:59.359
restaurant I've ever been, Like,
yeah, you you're a real authority in

443
00:30:59.440 --> 00:31:03.119
that. And you look at it
and you go, look, I bet

444
00:31:03.200 --> 00:31:07.839
you think you're ten times better than
I am when it comes to writing or

445
00:31:07.880 --> 00:31:12.039
storylines or creating a character. And
maybe you are, but it doesn't mean

446
00:31:12.119 --> 00:31:17.480
that when you show up there,
any of that is happening. So you

447
00:31:17.480 --> 00:31:19.000
know, you learn a lot.
But you know, what happened with me,

448
00:31:19.039 --> 00:31:23.000
and this is kind of when I
knew what's the point of staying here

449
00:31:23.319 --> 00:31:26.440
was that it got to the point
for me where I got there, and

450
00:31:26.480 --> 00:31:33.319
you have this new kid who's enthused
to try to literally change the business.

451
00:31:33.359 --> 00:31:37.680
Everyone pups in there going I'm going
to have that idea and you come in

452
00:31:37.720 --> 00:31:41.720
with that. And for me,
going on almost two years later, I

453
00:31:41.880 --> 00:31:47.440
found myself going, anytime I wrote
something for myself and wanted to get something

454
00:31:47.519 --> 00:31:51.680
going, it was either turned down
or it was going, we can't do

455
00:31:51.759 --> 00:31:56.000
that because we do things this way. Before it could even get to Vince,

456
00:31:56.440 --> 00:32:01.119
so I found myself going, I'm
just it's gonna write to please Bryant

457
00:32:01.920 --> 00:32:08.839
and everyone eventually, I feel,
turns into that. And that's what I

458
00:32:08.839 --> 00:32:13.759
always thought was the problem at the
end, and I felt like we're never

459
00:32:13.799 --> 00:32:20.160
gonna see a turnaround because everyone eventually
just goes. In order for me to

460
00:32:20.279 --> 00:32:25.000
feel like I'm spending you know,
one hundred hours or more a week dedicating

461
00:32:25.039 --> 00:32:29.839
my life to wrestling, you know, I didn't see my wife, I

462
00:32:30.240 --> 00:32:35.200
missed per days, I missed anniversaries, I missed everything, and and for

463
00:32:35.279 --> 00:32:37.799
what so that I can just show
up to a show and take notes or

464
00:32:37.839 --> 00:32:40.799
to write, you know, write
a promo, so you kind of go

465
00:32:40.880 --> 00:32:45.359
all right For me to feel accomplished
and get something on TV. I'm gonna

466
00:32:45.359 --> 00:32:49.799
write it the way that these guys
want me to write it so that it

467
00:32:49.839 --> 00:32:52.920
can get on and I felt limited
in doing that. But eventually you just

468
00:32:52.960 --> 00:32:55.720
got to go. If that's what
they want, fine, But then that

469
00:32:55.799 --> 00:33:00.519
got boring to me, and eventually
I was just like, what's the point.

470
00:33:00.839 --> 00:33:02.480
I don't want to live in Stanford, Connecticut, you know, I

471
00:33:02.759 --> 00:33:08.400
don't want to I don't want to
not see anybody I know. So I'm

472
00:33:08.400 --> 00:33:12.160
done. And so that's that's what
I kind of feel like. And I

473
00:33:12.160 --> 00:33:15.119
think people, I think you were
talking to someone a couple of weeks ago,

474
00:33:15.400 --> 00:33:20.440
a writer that just left or was
just working there. Yeah, yeah,

475
00:33:20.480 --> 00:33:22.319
And I don't remember how long he
said he was there, but it

476
00:33:22.359 --> 00:33:24.839
wasn't it wasn't that long. And
he just kind of had his sort of

477
00:33:24.880 --> 00:33:28.920
his own reasons as to like why
he wanted to leave. But I can

478
00:33:29.000 --> 00:33:31.000
tell you that, you know,
you go in there going this is my

479
00:33:31.119 --> 00:33:37.000
dream job and it was for me, and eventually, though, you go,

480
00:33:37.200 --> 00:33:39.599
it's not what I thought would be. So there's factors that would get

481
00:33:39.640 --> 00:33:43.119
you to walk away. And in
his case, he's like, you know

482
00:33:43.160 --> 00:33:45.680
what, I have an opportunity to
go do something that's for me and that

483
00:33:45.799 --> 00:33:50.680
I can actually do the way I
want it to be done. So this

484
00:33:50.960 --> 00:33:54.079
no longer is my dream job.
So I'm out of here, and I

485
00:33:54.119 --> 00:34:01.640
feel like I don't think Vince knew
that was how and that's why eventually it

486
00:34:01.640 --> 00:34:04.839
gets to the point where some of
these guys, at least for me,

487
00:34:05.079 --> 00:34:07.480
started going, you know what,
I'm gonna pitch what I want to Vince

488
00:34:07.960 --> 00:34:10.039
and if he goes for it,
great, if he doesn't, fever and

489
00:34:10.079 --> 00:34:14.599
I know I'm gonna get on Brian's
bad side, but so be it.

490
00:34:14.679 --> 00:34:17.440
I mean, I'm already I'm already
counting down the hours until I'm gonna leave.

491
00:34:17.480 --> 00:34:22.480
Anyways, So, and what I
noticed was that Vince is receptive to

492
00:34:22.719 --> 00:34:28.280
a lot of ideas. But the
problem is that a lot of people don't

493
00:34:28.320 --> 00:34:31.119
pitch to him. I think they're
worried about you know, let's say they

494
00:34:31.119 --> 00:34:34.559
pitched it to Michael, or they
pitched it to Brian. I know it's

495
00:34:34.559 --> 00:34:37.760
different now with you know, whoever
is in charge over there, But and

496
00:34:37.800 --> 00:34:39.360
it gets shot down and they just
go, well, I'm not I'm not

497
00:34:39.400 --> 00:34:45.920
repeating that. And it sucks because
people have great ideas that sometimes never actually

498
00:34:45.960 --> 00:34:51.280
happened, and I could probably guarantee
you creative had some great ideas for Brian

499
00:34:51.360 --> 00:34:54.280
versus Orton that maybe even never got
to the point of Vince hearing it.

500
00:34:54.920 --> 00:35:05.719
M In twenty twelve, NXT transitioned
into the developmental system and ultimately the brand

501
00:35:05.760 --> 00:35:10.159
you see today. On the Torch
VIP podcast NXT Eight Years Back, we'll

502
00:35:10.159 --> 00:35:15.280
be taking a weekly look at this
page in NXT's early history. Join Kelly

503
00:35:15.280 --> 00:35:21.000
Wells and me Tom Stout from PWT
Talks NXT every Saturday as we go eight

504
00:35:21.079 --> 00:35:23.880
years back to the day to track
NXT's rising talents and why they did or

505
00:35:24.000 --> 00:35:34.880
didn't work out Exclusively for PW Torch
VIP members. Michael hays been in the

506
00:35:34.920 --> 00:35:39.599
news lately in the doghouse for a
variety of reasons. But what was Michael

507
00:35:39.679 --> 00:35:45.320
Hayes's What was he like as a
coworker, a colleague, and what was

508
00:35:45.360 --> 00:35:50.599
the perceived perception of him? Do
you think from Vincent Man, Triple H,

509
00:35:50.679 --> 00:35:54.199
Kevin donn as somebody who is one
of the few actual veteran wrestlers on

510
00:35:54.199 --> 00:35:57.960
the creative side of things, and
certainly a guy who's been around a long

511
00:35:58.000 --> 00:36:01.320
time, but comes with some baggage
real quick, not to bore people that

512
00:36:01.400 --> 00:36:06.000
may already know, but what's the
reasoning for him being in the doghouse.

513
00:36:07.039 --> 00:36:12.239
He drank with a talent who was
trying not to drink anymore and encouraged her

514
00:36:12.280 --> 00:36:17.519
to drink, so he's allowed to
drink again. That may not have been

515
00:36:17.599 --> 00:36:21.760
allowed either, So I think it
was kind of a double whammy. They

516
00:36:21.760 --> 00:36:25.039
didn't want him drinking at bars,
you know, under WWE's clocker on the

517
00:36:25.079 --> 00:36:30.440
road, and then he was with
a female talent and was trying to encourage

518
00:36:30.440 --> 00:36:32.519
her to drink, and I think
that got him in real hot water.

519
00:36:32.559 --> 00:36:36.039
And I think there was one other
thing that has been hinted about that I

520
00:36:36.079 --> 00:36:39.159
even confirmed that kind of irked him
too. So wow, Okay, So

521
00:36:39.159 --> 00:36:45.360
your question is the what was your
perception of the Creative teens thoughts on Michael

522
00:36:45.360 --> 00:36:47.840
Hayes. Was he intimidating as an
ex wrestler with so much experience and so

523
00:36:47.880 --> 00:36:52.440
many things to draw from and a
respected wrestling mind, or was he seen

524
00:36:52.480 --> 00:36:54.719
as kind of a joke because or
not a joke? But like, did

525
00:36:54.760 --> 00:36:59.320
he undo the respect through his own
personal actions and behavior and demeanor? And

526
00:36:59.360 --> 00:37:01.480
then how to visit and look at
him. Yeah, I don't know,

527
00:37:01.559 --> 00:37:06.719
I don't. He was very,
very respected amongst the writers. You know,

528
00:37:06.760 --> 00:37:09.920
a lot of the writers were wrestling
fans and knew who Michael was.

529
00:37:09.960 --> 00:37:14.800
So you walk in with the respect
for him automatically. And I had that,

530
00:37:15.400 --> 00:37:17.920
and and you're also you know,
the thing is too, when you

531
00:37:17.960 --> 00:37:22.360
pitch to someone like Michael, who's
been there for so long, but also

532
00:37:22.360 --> 00:37:24.360
who understands everything, it's you get
a little, uh, you get a

533
00:37:24.400 --> 00:37:30.280
little nervous when you pitched him because
you wonder, all right, do I

534
00:37:30.440 --> 00:37:36.159
have you know, everything lined up? Is this something that he's heard before,

535
00:37:36.440 --> 00:37:37.719
or you know, how is he
going to react to this? And

536
00:37:37.760 --> 00:37:42.320
so it's a little intimidating to pitch
to him. I never really had to

537
00:37:42.440 --> 00:37:45.440
pitch straight to Michael because he was
on SmackDown and I was on Raw.

538
00:37:46.559 --> 00:37:50.480
But you know there were times too
where you know, I would talk to

539
00:37:50.559 --> 00:37:53.320
him like I respected Michael a lot, and I respected his vision of what

540
00:37:53.480 --> 00:37:58.079
he was trying to do because I
thought at the time SmackDown was was better

541
00:37:58.119 --> 00:38:01.800
than Raw when I was there,
and so you know, I I had

542
00:38:01.880 --> 00:38:05.960
many talks with him where I said, I trade me, you know,

543
00:38:06.440 --> 00:38:08.880
literally take a smack down rider or
put him on raw and I want to

544
00:38:08.880 --> 00:38:12.679
come SmackDown. And and I know
he wanted to do it, and I

545
00:38:12.719 --> 00:38:20.000
know Brian zidoed it. But you
know, as far as the way he's

546
00:38:20.079 --> 00:38:25.679
perceived, he's perceived as a very
smart man and he's well respected as far

547
00:38:25.719 --> 00:38:30.880
as his ideas and his thoughts go, I do think there's still a little

548
00:38:30.960 --> 00:38:36.760
bit of the uh the jokes so
that he could put on himself, you

549
00:38:36.760 --> 00:38:40.360
know, with his wardrobes, uh
huh. But uh, but you know

550
00:38:40.400 --> 00:38:44.440
what, he owns it. And
the thing is is I don't see anything

551
00:38:44.480 --> 00:38:46.159
wrong with it. I mean sometimes
when he walks in with you know,

552
00:38:46.440 --> 00:38:52.199
an orange uh tuxedo suit on,
you know, everyone laughs, But he

553
00:38:52.320 --> 00:38:55.760
owns it and that's what he likes
and and you know, and he pulls

554
00:38:55.800 --> 00:39:00.079
it off because he walks around with
confidence and uh. And I think that

555
00:39:00.760 --> 00:39:05.719
might be where some of the you
know, the the jokes might come from.

556
00:39:05.719 --> 00:39:07.480
But I don't think that, uh, he would have been there that

557
00:39:07.599 --> 00:39:14.679
long and been so close uh to
Vince and the creative process and even with

558
00:39:14.960 --> 00:39:21.440
producing the matches had he just kind
of been perceived as anything less than an

559
00:39:21.480 --> 00:39:27.639
asset. Yeah, a very big
asset, mind you. Yeah, interesting

560
00:39:27.679 --> 00:39:30.199
else. So sorry, let's go
to no. I was just gonna say,

561
00:39:30.199 --> 00:39:32.400
but you know, you know what
I don't know because I don't know,

562
00:39:32.760 --> 00:39:36.599
you know, if there was jokes
told you know, whisper in Kevin

563
00:39:36.639 --> 00:39:38.960
Dunzeer, I don't know, maybe, but I can just tell you that

564
00:39:39.079 --> 00:39:43.840
overall, you know, you could
kind of see if someone would say something

565
00:39:43.920 --> 00:39:46.639
or suggest something. Uh, it's
listened to you, Like when Pat Patterson

566
00:39:46.719 --> 00:39:52.960
opens his mouth and suggests something,
he has Vince's full attention. Yeah,

567
00:39:52.039 --> 00:39:57.320
and and he's going to listen to
every word Pat says, and he's gonna,

568
00:39:57.519 --> 00:40:00.440
he's gonna and if it's something if
Vince said, let's say, for

569
00:40:00.480 --> 00:40:01.800
example, Vince says we're gonna have
big, she'll come out and knock out

570
00:40:01.800 --> 00:40:05.480
both guys. And Pat Patterson raised
his hand and goes, Vince, no,

571
00:40:06.719 --> 00:40:12.039
we shouldn't. Instantly, Vince wants
to know Pat's idea and why Pat

572
00:40:12.079 --> 00:40:15.639
doesn't like that idea, because he
respects whatever it is that Pat's thinking,

573
00:40:15.079 --> 00:40:20.079
and I think it just kind of
trickles down from there. I think Kevin

574
00:40:20.159 --> 00:40:22.199
Dunn has that too, But then
it kind of trickles down. But I

575
00:40:22.199 --> 00:40:25.840
would definitely say that Michael is on
that next level below it where he's not

576
00:40:25.960 --> 00:40:30.800
always going to get the Okay,
we're going with what Michael said, even

577
00:40:30.840 --> 00:40:34.280
if the room hates it. But
he would do that for Pat. And

578
00:40:34.480 --> 00:40:37.840
if he doesn't like something that Michael
says, he'll tell him. But I

579
00:40:37.920 --> 00:40:45.559
think Pat nine times out of ten
would convince Vince to do what he thought,

580
00:40:45.599 --> 00:40:47.559
and if he didn't, Vince would
would kind of keep that in the

581
00:40:47.559 --> 00:40:50.440
back of his head and kind of
go, Okay, we're going with this

582
00:40:50.480 --> 00:40:53.559
one this time. Pat, next
time, well we may do it your

583
00:40:53.599 --> 00:40:58.079
way. Yeah. Interesting, Yeah, it's interesting here that dynamic between,

584
00:40:58.400 --> 00:41:02.559
you know, the different hierarchies of
how took Man reacts and plays to the

585
00:41:02.599 --> 00:41:07.320
resume of sorts in the relationship that
he's built with each of the different writers.

586
00:41:07.719 --> 00:41:08.960
Yeah. Yeah, all right.
So if you're just joining us,

587
00:41:09.039 --> 00:41:13.719
John Piermarini is our guest execreative team
member in WWE in two thousand and nine

588
00:41:13.719 --> 00:41:16.880
twenty ten, also part of the
PW Torch All Star Panel. The ASPW

589
00:41:17.079 --> 00:41:21.760
Torch All Star Panel is a feature
that runs every afternoon on the PW Torch

590
00:41:21.800 --> 00:41:24.440
dot com website. Starting next month
and we'll go back to being a PW

591
00:41:24.519 --> 00:41:29.119
Torch app exclusive. And as a
VIP member, you get access to both

592
00:41:29.199 --> 00:41:32.840
versions of SPW Torch, the All
Star Panel and the staff version. Every

593
00:41:32.840 --> 00:41:37.599
single day, every morning and afternoon, a new version of SPW Torch is

594
00:41:37.639 --> 00:41:40.280
posted. Both are available to VIP
members on both the app and the website.

595
00:41:40.360 --> 00:41:43.760
If you're not a VIP member,
you get one version on one and

596
00:41:43.800 --> 00:41:47.360
one version on the other. And
we're rotating this month and flipping the All

597
00:41:47.360 --> 00:41:51.000
Star Panel from the app to the
website. So if we've confused you,

598
00:41:51.159 --> 00:41:52.880
sorry about that, but just to
know, as a VIP member you get

599
00:41:52.880 --> 00:41:58.199
a lot of perks, including both
versions of SPW Torch on whatever device you're

600
00:41:58.280 --> 00:42:00.880
using to read PW torch content.
If you're in VIP, you can go

601
00:42:00.960 --> 00:42:07.199
vip pwtorch dot com slash go VIP. It's that simple. Pwtorch dot com

602
00:42:07.239 --> 00:42:10.760
slash go VIP. You can become
a subscriber, get access to the new

603
00:42:12.000 --> 00:42:15.679
Progressing Torch newsletter which is published every
week, which is published issue thirteen and

604
00:42:15.719 --> 00:42:21.119
twenty seven. I believe this week
sixteen pages packed with exclusive content, in

605
00:42:21.159 --> 00:42:25.119
depth columns, transcriptions of our interviews
and exclusive news and a lot of cool

606
00:42:25.159 --> 00:42:30.159
features in a PDF format and all
text format available on tablets and on the

607
00:42:30.199 --> 00:42:32.960
website and on our phone app.
Much much more comes with VIP membership,

608
00:42:32.960 --> 00:42:37.760
and if you enjoy the show,
you will enjoy everything else that comes with

609
00:42:37.800 --> 00:42:42.639
being a VIP member. You can
support us on Patreon and get these shows

610
00:42:43.000 --> 00:42:45.559
with ads and plugs removed, the
Weight Killer Prossing podcast, Weightkller Processing post

611
00:42:45.559 --> 00:42:51.079
shows and the PW Torch daily cast
throughout the week with ads and plugs removed,

612
00:42:51.119 --> 00:42:54.480
plus a few bonus VIP shows throughout
the month for just four dollars and

613
00:42:54.559 --> 00:42:59.880
ninety nine cents a month. Check
it out patreon dot com slash pw Torch

614
00:43:00.159 --> 00:43:05.320
VIP. That's patreon dot com slash
pw Torch VIP and you can also upgrade

615
00:43:05.360 --> 00:43:13.159
to other tiers and receive even more
benefits through Patreon. All right, we

616
00:43:13.199 --> 00:43:15.920
will now go back to go back
to the full lines, and actually I

617
00:43:15.960 --> 00:43:21.039
think succeed this time in bringing a
VIP member on board Aera code seven to

618
00:43:21.280 --> 00:43:23.480
four VIP member, Dave, Thanks
for calling, David Pittsburgh. Are you

619
00:43:23.559 --> 00:43:28.239
there, I'm here? How are
you doing late? Doing great? Thanks

620
00:43:28.239 --> 00:43:31.039
for joining us. What have you
got for John today? First off,

621
00:43:31.079 --> 00:43:35.760
one of the sec congratulations on one
thousand shows. I've actually listened to pretty

622
00:43:35.840 --> 00:43:38.280
much all of them. I stumbled
upon h stumbled upon when I got my

623
00:43:38.320 --> 00:43:42.039
first I phone at the end of
two thousand and nine, and I've listened

624
00:43:42.039 --> 00:43:45.880
ever since. But I have a
couple of questions three if five the time.

625
00:43:46.599 --> 00:43:51.360
First off, well, how much
the first one involves Paul Hayman.

626
00:43:52.199 --> 00:43:55.880
How much creative direction do you think
he actually has right now regarding the storylines

627
00:43:55.960 --> 00:44:00.639
that he's involved in. John,
What do you think what kind of cretive

628
00:44:00.639 --> 00:44:04.360
freedo would vinceic Man give to Hayman
and especially his own content? Obviously,

629
00:44:05.119 --> 00:44:07.159
Yeah, I don't. I honestly
don't know, because I never really worked

630
00:44:07.199 --> 00:44:10.920
with with Paul Hall. When I
was there, Uh he was, he

631
00:44:12.079 --> 00:44:15.840
was gone, I think, well
before I got there, and obviously I

632
00:44:15.880 --> 00:44:22.360
was gone before he came back.
I don't know. I I honestly don't

633
00:44:22.400 --> 00:44:29.440
know. I'm assuming that because of
who he is, you know. I

634
00:44:29.480 --> 00:44:32.960
think I think the best way to
answer that is to go I'm sure he

635
00:44:34.039 --> 00:44:39.480
had an open door policy with Vince
where he could walk in and pitch an

636
00:44:39.519 --> 00:44:44.280
idea and I think it just kind
of goes from whatever he brought to the

637
00:44:44.320 --> 00:44:46.360
table at that point. You know, if he brew something that Vince really

638
00:44:46.480 --> 00:44:50.440
likes, Hey, Paul, making
sure you come in here anytime you want

639
00:44:50.440 --> 00:44:52.760
to, you know, tell me
something. And uh and if and if

640
00:44:52.800 --> 00:44:57.840
it if he didn't like what what
Paul was was pitching, and you know,

641
00:44:57.960 --> 00:45:00.079
he probably would just kind of uh
huh uh uh huh. But I

642
00:45:00.119 --> 00:45:04.960
don't know, I don't know what
if Paul's even trying to do that.

643
00:45:05.480 --> 00:45:08.159
You know, he may just be
happy with being there and playing a character

644
00:45:08.360 --> 00:45:15.760
and you know, kind of tweaking
ideas that come to him. But I

645
00:45:15.760 --> 00:45:17.360
don't know. I wish I had
a more solid answer for you, but

646
00:45:17.400 --> 00:45:21.920
I don't. Yeah, my interpretation
for what i've or my interpretation my my

647
00:45:22.159 --> 00:45:25.119
uh information, I guess is that
Paul does have definitely say someone is content

648
00:45:25.280 --> 00:45:30.719
that he's at that level where he
does have says so over what he says.

649
00:45:31.320 --> 00:45:35.079
But I'm not so sure John that
that he's somebody who can go up

650
00:45:35.119 --> 00:45:37.000
to Vincent go all right, here's
the finish of the next pay per view

651
00:45:37.039 --> 00:45:39.400
match, and then here's who I
want a feud with next. I don't

652
00:45:39.559 --> 00:45:43.639
absolutely not. No, Yeah,
I think Paul could walk in there and

653
00:45:43.679 --> 00:45:46.320
go, hey, Vince, you
know, I see this. Uh yeah,

654
00:45:46.840 --> 00:45:50.880
let's just use Curtis Axel. You
know, I see Joe Henning,

655
00:45:51.239 --> 00:45:52.320
you know, a week after week, and I'm traveling with him. I'm

656
00:45:52.480 --> 00:45:57.199
seeing them at live events, and
I'm watching them when he's wrestling on Superstars.

657
00:45:57.480 --> 00:45:59.559
Man, this has got something,
you know. I think if you

658
00:45:59.559 --> 00:46:01.480
put him with me, I got
we should really do them with this guy,

659
00:46:01.840 --> 00:46:05.559
and and you know, and have
him go all right, hey,

660
00:46:05.840 --> 00:46:07.039
if you think so, let's put
him with you and see what we thought.

661
00:46:08.119 --> 00:46:10.719
Yep, yep, very good,
Dave. What else have you got

662
00:46:10.760 --> 00:46:16.840
for us? The second thing the
Rural almost coming to Pittsburgh, for which

663
00:46:16.960 --> 00:46:22.320
I already have tickets workin. I'm
excited about that, you know. The

664
00:46:22.400 --> 00:46:24.159
next couple, you know, months, I guess over the next month.

665
00:46:24.519 --> 00:46:30.960
Uh, it'll start taking shape towards
WrestleMania. Who are early projections for Rumble

666
00:46:30.960 --> 00:46:35.039
winners? I know it's a pretty
generic question, but just you know,

667
00:46:35.119 --> 00:46:37.239
what do you think it looks like
at this point based on the storylines that

668
00:46:37.239 --> 00:46:43.079
we're seeing right now? John,
Yeah, looking ahead to Royal Rumble,

669
00:46:43.119 --> 00:46:45.480
I mean, are there is there
a long list or short list of candidates

670
00:46:45.519 --> 00:46:49.679
typically at this point in the season, you know, I would think that

671
00:46:49.760 --> 00:46:58.800
there's probably a projected winner by now. I think that with the I would

672
00:46:58.840 --> 00:47:04.679
say, like the lack of big
star power, typically you'd probably see a

673
00:47:04.679 --> 00:47:09.119
bigger star go over just to kind
of uh. I don't want to say

674
00:47:09.119 --> 00:47:12.639
that they don't want to give it
to somebody else, but I don't know

675
00:47:12.679 --> 00:47:15.000
if there's someone there, and that
there is and they're they're they haven't set

676
00:47:15.039 --> 00:47:20.000
them up yet, but you know, I could see someone like, you

677
00:47:20.039 --> 00:47:22.760
know, it's it's hard. It's
hard to project because whatever their wrestlming the

678
00:47:22.880 --> 00:47:27.559
main event is, it's it's probably
already set up. And I think that

679
00:47:27.639 --> 00:47:31.360
they probably want to use the Royal
Rumble uh to get over I feel like

680
00:47:31.360 --> 00:47:37.639
they're kind of pushing the world titled
down and just kind of going, Hey,

681
00:47:37.719 --> 00:47:40.159
it's the WWE title, this is
the prestigious one, and I feel

682
00:47:40.199 --> 00:47:44.239
like they're going to use the rumble
to set up that match. So maybe

683
00:47:44.440 --> 00:47:47.960
I can't really necessarily see it,
but maybe they want to go with you

684
00:47:49.000 --> 00:47:52.239
know, Brian chasing it all the
way until Mania. I doubt it,

685
00:47:52.280 --> 00:47:58.000
but he's someone that could go over. I don't. I don't know because

686
00:47:58.000 --> 00:48:02.440
I haven't watched the product close enough
go they're really looking like they're setting this

687
00:48:02.519 --> 00:48:06.639
guy up, and I haven't noticed
that from the bits and pieces that I

688
00:48:06.679 --> 00:48:09.639
see, so i'd probably say,
you know, you could even see something

689
00:48:12.039 --> 00:48:16.920
like Sena comes back at Hell in
a cell, Alberto del Rio re injures

690
00:48:17.000 --> 00:48:20.880
his arm, and I think I
even gave an answer similar to this in

691
00:48:20.920 --> 00:48:24.880
one of the All Star panel questions. But and then you kind of put

692
00:48:24.920 --> 00:48:29.840
Sena's career back in jeopardy. Did
he come back too early? You have

693
00:48:30.039 --> 00:48:31.840
him, you know, maybe even
make a surprise appearance in the Rumble he

694
00:48:31.920 --> 00:48:36.599
wins it, and then you kind
of have that story for Sena going into

695
00:48:36.639 --> 00:48:37.800
Mania. But I don't know.
I don't know if they want to go

696
00:48:37.920 --> 00:48:42.920
Sena Orton or if Brian holds the
title till then now you got to think

697
00:48:42.960 --> 00:48:46.239
of a Heel or maybe it's a
Sena And I don't know. I guess

698
00:48:46.239 --> 00:48:49.840
he wanted us the names, and
I just talked for five minutes without really

699
00:48:49.840 --> 00:48:53.400
giving one, so I apologize for
that, But I don't know. If

700
00:48:53.440 --> 00:48:57.079
I had to guess, i'd say
it's gonna be one of the bigger names

701
00:48:57.119 --> 00:49:00.519
Asena, maybe even like a Shamus. I don't know if they want to

702
00:49:00.519 --> 00:49:05.559
put him in that slot at Mania, maybe even Big Show. Who knows.

703
00:49:05.599 --> 00:49:08.599
Maybe you have Undertaker come back and
win the Rumble and then you set

704
00:49:08.639 --> 00:49:13.320
that up, you know, depending
on who the champion might be. I

705
00:49:13.320 --> 00:49:15.639
don't know, way do you like, what are some of the bigger names

706
00:49:15.639 --> 00:49:17.199
there, and then maybe I can
kind of give an opinion. Yeah,

707
00:49:17.239 --> 00:49:22.280
I mean, we're definitely entering a
point where we're going to start being able

708
00:49:22.320 --> 00:49:23.599
to be able to make those predictions. I kind of like to wait till

709
00:49:23.639 --> 00:49:30.159
Survivor series before honing in on making
those kinds of predictions because I think there

710
00:49:30.159 --> 00:49:31.800
it is pretty wide open. And
heck, I mean, Vince could have

711
00:49:31.800 --> 00:49:35.239
a curve ball thrown at us.
When Seamus is ready to come back,

712
00:49:35.280 --> 00:49:37.119
he may decide he wants to move
him, you know, surprise people and

713
00:49:37.119 --> 00:49:40.119
not do a typical finish because whatever
the main event is going to be for

714
00:49:40.159 --> 00:49:44.920
the WWB title, he doesn't need
that person to win the Rumble. In

715
00:49:44.920 --> 00:49:46.679
fact, he has a completely different
way he wants to go about setting that

716
00:49:46.719 --> 00:49:51.039
match up. So therefore it's going
to be Shamus winning because he wants to

717
00:49:51.039 --> 00:49:53.679
get Seamus strong again so we can
co headline house shows next year. So

718
00:49:54.000 --> 00:49:58.920
Seamus taking on del Riot WrestleMania perhaps
an opening match, but that could be

719
00:49:59.000 --> 00:50:04.199
the surprise winner. But the angle
at the Rumble would be Lesner and Sina

720
00:50:04.280 --> 00:50:07.440
are in the Rumble and something happens
between them where they both get eliminated,

721
00:50:07.840 --> 00:50:10.400
and then that leads to some story. Like I think there's such an array

722
00:50:10.400 --> 00:50:15.519
of possibilities, but given that Punk
at some point has to break away from

723
00:50:15.559 --> 00:50:17.840
Paul Hayman, I don't think we'll
see that still going on at WrestleMania.

724
00:50:17.920 --> 00:50:25.000
Hopefully you have John Cena Brock Lesner
potentially in the Rumble CM Punk, Shamus

725
00:50:25.000 --> 00:50:29.360
making has comeback. Wade Barrett's a
very dark horse. You know, Vince

726
00:50:29.400 --> 00:50:30.599
decided, Hey, this is gonna
be way Barrett's season. He got his

727
00:50:30.719 --> 00:50:37.360
vices, she's taken care of.
And then whoever doesn't have the belt between

728
00:50:37.400 --> 00:50:40.159
Daniel Bryn and Randy Orton is another
big name who would be in that mix.

729
00:50:40.880 --> 00:50:44.679
And then if Mark Henry's healthy again, Like I'm trying to think of

730
00:50:44.719 --> 00:50:46.559
all you know, that list of
maybe six to eight names who are even

731
00:50:46.599 --> 00:50:51.199
at all a possibility, and that
covers probably most of them. So is

732
00:50:51.239 --> 00:50:55.000
the rumor Sena versus Lessener amania Now
No, No, I think there's there's

733
00:50:55.079 --> 00:50:58.840
enough rumors out there. I don't
have one that I consider most reliable,

734
00:51:00.079 --> 00:51:02.039
know, and I wouldn't say no. I kind of threw that out there

735
00:51:02.039 --> 00:51:06.159
more illustratively. Although I don't think
Sena Lesner is being ruled out. I

736
00:51:06.159 --> 00:51:09.920
think uh Sena Undertaker, Sena triple
ation, Sena Orton probably I would have

737
00:51:10.000 --> 00:51:14.679
higher on my list of likely matches. Yeah, yeah, I could.

738
00:51:14.920 --> 00:51:19.280
But I think Lessner is a good
one that they could that they could go

739
00:51:19.360 --> 00:51:22.559
with, and especially because you know, who knows what they're gonna do with

740
00:51:22.639 --> 00:51:28.679
Sena. They may they may want
to build that that world heavyweight title again,

741
00:51:28.800 --> 00:51:31.559
so by putting it on and maybe
you'd have the lessoner Sena for the

742
00:51:32.000 --> 00:51:36.719
world heavyweight title is well. And
that's the thing because John Lesner has a

743
00:51:36.800 --> 00:51:38.320
history with the world title and so
you could draw on that, you know,

744
00:51:38.360 --> 00:51:42.920
because that was his belt during on
SmackDown when he was a champion before

745
00:51:43.039 --> 00:51:45.360
he quit pro wrestling to go to
play for the Vikings briefly and then UFC.

746
00:51:46.880 --> 00:51:50.719
I was at the I was at
a preseason game at the Metrodome and

747
00:51:50.760 --> 00:51:52.880
got to see Brock Lesner playing NFL
game preseason on the less but in a

748
00:51:52.960 --> 00:51:58.079
Viking uniform in person, and that
was a pretty surreal experience to see that

749
00:51:58.559 --> 00:52:00.079
I got this in fact, not
that this is all that big of a

750
00:52:00.119 --> 00:52:02.920
deal, but Lesner's you know,
went to went to University of Soda,

751
00:52:02.960 --> 00:52:07.440
and he's got the roots here.
I was. I was there for his

752
00:52:07.480 --> 00:52:10.360
first w w E show. I
sat about three chairs from him at the

753
00:52:10.360 --> 00:52:14.840
first show where he was introduced to
the crowd as a new developmental signee.

754
00:52:15.719 --> 00:52:19.719
And then I was there for uh, probably his first wrestling match in Minneapolis.

755
00:52:19.719 --> 00:52:22.440
Then I was there for his first
Viking game and only Viking game.

756
00:52:22.599 --> 00:52:28.119
And then I was there for his
first USC fight against uh crazy horse or

757
00:52:28.800 --> 00:52:35.679
no Frank mir No no, his
first uh uh his first Minneapolis mm A

758
00:52:35.800 --> 00:52:40.559
fight where he not not uh crazors
over and backflipped him with the uh he

759
00:52:42.199 --> 00:52:47.119
he'th carrying up and then uh so
I was there for that actually in media

760
00:52:47.199 --> 00:52:51.960
role covering that at Target Center.
And so it's like it's I've kind of

761
00:52:52.039 --> 00:52:54.519
like just been able to be there
for various big moments in his career,

762
00:52:54.519 --> 00:52:59.960
but nevertheless, that's totally off the
subject. Need an extra dose of pub

763
00:53:00.000 --> 00:53:04.639
scitivity in your wrestling podcasts, will
come join me Alan frel Over in the

764
00:53:04.719 --> 00:53:09.119
Progress Paradise at Pterboo Torch VIP as
we mask on the bright side of wrestling

765
00:53:09.320 --> 00:53:13.920
and focus on some of the great
matches and shows from around the world,

766
00:53:14.239 --> 00:53:19.000
be it the US, Japan,
Europe or Mexico. There's always a place

767
00:53:19.000 --> 00:53:22.239
for wrestlings past in the Paradise too, and we've done fun historical shows such

768
00:53:22.239 --> 00:53:28.880
as the We Love Liger series celebrating
the glorious career of Jusian Thunderliger and our

769
00:53:28.920 --> 00:53:31.239
eye was there when shows where our
guests will join me to talk about a

770
00:53:31.280 --> 00:53:36.599
classic bout that they were in attendance
for. We love variety and you can

771
00:53:36.679 --> 00:53:42.440
expect lots of it at the Progress
Paradise. Detailed PWO Torch VIP subscription information

772
00:53:42.760 --> 00:53:47.000
and a list of all the VIP
benefits is available at pterwrew torch vipinfo dot

773
00:53:47.039 --> 00:53:52.239
com. And yes, all VIP
podcasts are compatible with popular podcast apps on

774
00:53:52.320 --> 00:53:57.840
iPhone and Android devices, or you
can stream them directly from our ad free

775
00:53:58.119 --> 00:54:07.599
VIP mobile site. See you in
the Paradise Lesler or the world title makes

776
00:54:07.599 --> 00:54:10.960
some sense, And that's the question
that I had cute here was what was

777
00:54:10.960 --> 00:54:15.880
your reaction when you first heard that
they had John Cena against del Rio at

778
00:54:15.920 --> 00:54:19.760
this paper you're putting aside how quickly
Seena's coming back? What did that tell

779
00:54:19.800 --> 00:54:22.440
you? What do you imagine the
scenario was or the rationale was for bringing

780
00:54:22.480 --> 00:54:25.800
Sena back and having him go after
the world title. Really without explanation,

781
00:54:25.840 --> 00:54:29.400
it's just something that Vicky did and
no one really brings it up since.

782
00:54:30.599 --> 00:54:35.920
To be honest, I hadn't really
paid enough attention to know what his timetable

783
00:54:36.079 --> 00:54:39.639
was, so you know, I
left PRIs for another I was fast blaying

784
00:54:39.679 --> 00:54:43.599
through the show, and I just
saw that he actually even probably read it

785
00:54:43.639 --> 00:54:46.480
on your website when it was like
a in one of the spoilers or something,

786
00:54:46.480 --> 00:54:49.400
but I don't remember, but I
just remember going, oh, okay.

787
00:54:49.480 --> 00:54:52.440
I figured they're bringing him back,
and they need to put him in

788
00:54:52.440 --> 00:54:55.239
the most high profile match possible.
They obviously can't do it with the ww

789
00:54:55.480 --> 00:55:00.639
title, so that was second best. And then you know, and kind

790
00:55:00.639 --> 00:55:07.159
of seeing how they're building it with
them showing how he's kind of beating the

791
00:55:07.159 --> 00:55:10.840
odds and coming back sooner than later. To me, that just seems like

792
00:55:12.119 --> 00:55:16.599
they're either and I wouldn't be surprised. They're either building him again as Superman

793
00:55:16.760 --> 00:55:21.960
and okay, this guy defies the
odds, this guy is not human.

794
00:55:22.440 --> 00:55:25.159
Look at him. We've you know, he's the greatest thing ever. Or

795
00:55:25.519 --> 00:55:31.039
they're they're setting up a story to
which his career may be put in jeopardy

796
00:55:31.119 --> 00:55:37.480
because he came back too soon.
And and if you think about you know,

797
00:55:37.719 --> 00:55:39.360
again, like it's kind of like
with a conspiracy theory, you can

798
00:55:39.559 --> 00:55:45.039
find ways to continue to believe if
you if you want to find what you're

799
00:55:45.039 --> 00:55:46.960
looking for, and if you think
about it, if you're going to go

800
00:55:47.119 --> 00:55:51.840
that route, because they they did
the freeline wise it is his elbow,

801
00:55:51.920 --> 00:55:54.480
correct, that's the problem, right? Yeah? Well that and uh uh

802
00:55:54.920 --> 00:55:59.320
and the the trip or the why
am I drawing a blank on it?

803
00:55:59.360 --> 00:56:05.039
The hice his arm? Correct,
it was a but not just the elbow.

804
00:56:05.519 --> 00:56:07.400
Okay, so you have him come
back, Well, what does what

805
00:56:07.440 --> 00:56:10.960
does del Rio do? He's got
the arm bart, you know, and

806
00:56:12.280 --> 00:56:15.440
and that could I don't know how
I remember when del Reel first did it.

807
00:56:15.960 --> 00:56:19.960
They got over the fact that it
like could hurt his shoulder or something,

808
00:56:19.960 --> 00:56:24.519
which I mean, it's it's gonna
dislocate his elbow. But you know,

809
00:56:24.599 --> 00:56:28.960
and maybe that's all. Maybe this
is all part of it to to

810
00:56:29.079 --> 00:56:32.360
maybe even build del Rio, you
know, and and you know, because

811
00:56:32.400 --> 00:56:37.320
maybe they want del Rio versus Brian
as the next you know, WWE title

812
00:56:37.639 --> 00:56:44.360
story. All things that we speculate
on, But I don't know. I

813
00:56:44.400 --> 00:56:49.079
don't really have an opinion except thinking
there's there's two possibilities. One they put

814
00:56:49.119 --> 00:56:51.599
the title on him, and now
they've got this title, and like you

815
00:56:51.679 --> 00:56:53.480
said, if it is less Ner
versus Seen, okay, now we have

816
00:56:53.519 --> 00:56:58.880
a title on the line for it, or maybe something that I thought was

817
00:56:58.920 --> 00:57:00.639
really good, because I like,
they need to get rid of that title

818
00:57:00.679 --> 00:57:04.760
there. It makes no sense.
How do you have two world champions?

819
00:57:05.079 --> 00:57:08.719
Can't have two best So I feel
like if they put it on him and

820
00:57:08.760 --> 00:57:14.840
they wanted to go to Mania,
it's a great way to have Undertaker versus

821
00:57:14.840 --> 00:57:19.400
sena streak versus title like your reader
sent in as a as an option,

822
00:57:19.880 --> 00:57:23.280
and have Undertaker win, retire with
the title, and retire the title.

823
00:57:23.639 --> 00:57:27.360
And now you got that out of
the way and now you have one world

824
00:57:27.440 --> 00:57:30.760
champion, and you've got the secondary
titles, which there should only be one,

825
00:57:30.679 --> 00:57:34.119
but you can kind of clean that
up. So maybe they're going that

826
00:57:34.159 --> 00:57:37.760
way. Maybe they're going with the
Sena story that leads to another, you

827
00:57:37.760 --> 00:57:42.840
know, return Royal Rubbles surprise,
he wonted, but his prayers on the

828
00:57:42.880 --> 00:57:50.559
line health wise, not necessarily as
a as a stipulation at at WrestleMania and

829
00:57:50.559 --> 00:57:53.159
he's coming back and oh, my
gosh, he's gonna wrestle brock Lessner with

830
00:57:53.639 --> 00:57:58.119
the fact that he's not one hundred
percent my god, like, we could

831
00:57:58.119 --> 00:58:00.360
see the end of John Sena at
WrestleMania. So who knows where they're going

832
00:58:00.400 --> 00:58:04.079
with it, and it might not
be either of them. They might just

833
00:58:04.119 --> 00:58:07.079
go, huh, let's have them
come back and carry the world every week

834
00:58:07.159 --> 00:58:09.280
title. Will figure it out earlier. I think they are nervous enough about

835
00:58:09.360 --> 00:58:13.639
drawing a million buys that they're going
to leave their options open. I mean,

836
00:58:13.679 --> 00:58:16.320
I think they have a course set
by this point. That's the A

837
00:58:16.559 --> 00:58:20.679
plan, you know, that's the
A plan. Yeah, but it's but

838
00:58:20.719 --> 00:58:23.519
I would say there's some nimbleness flexibility
to it at this point, depending on

839
00:58:23.599 --> 00:58:30.679
some factors that come into play besides
injuries, just better ideas or a celebrity

840
00:58:30.679 --> 00:58:32.480
type thing they're going after that might
cause you know, a plant, a

841
00:58:32.519 --> 00:58:37.039
changing plan. Sure, they could
be workin trying to get a celebrity now,

842
00:58:37.079 --> 00:58:40.400
and you know, let's say the
plan again. I'm gonna throw this

843
00:58:40.440 --> 00:58:44.159
name out there because it seems to
be the name that's always involved at WW

844
00:58:44.400 --> 00:58:46.000
and I can only hope that they
don't go with this, but let's just

845
00:58:46.039 --> 00:58:52.559
say it's Shack, and they they
might be going, Okay, let's just

846
00:58:52.639 --> 00:58:57.599
tentatively if we get them, it
will be Shack versus Ziggler or another heel,

847
00:58:57.920 --> 00:59:00.559
and they kind of have that on
the board and they're going, all

848
00:59:00.639 --> 00:59:04.039
right, we're hoping towards to get
towards that, and if it doesn't happen,

849
00:59:04.320 --> 00:59:07.079
we'll figure it out with Ziggler later
and then obviously it'd have to be

850
00:59:07.079 --> 00:59:09.239
a bigger name. But yeah,
there's things like that that that may not

851
00:59:09.360 --> 00:59:14.519
be set in stone because they need
to actually get the guy involved. But

852
00:59:14.719 --> 00:59:17.880
I can probably tell you that if
it comes to seen a Listener, Undertaker,

853
00:59:19.000 --> 00:59:25.079
the WWE title, and you know, any other very important aid list

854
00:59:25.239 --> 00:59:31.079
names, those matches are already being
set up to be billed, like you

855
00:59:31.119 --> 00:59:36.440
said, the A plan, and
barring a huge injury, those matches are

856
00:59:36.480 --> 00:59:39.639
probably going to stay in place.
Yeah, let me go back to Dave

857
00:59:39.639 --> 00:59:42.679
because I think he's still on hold
and we got through two of his three

858
00:59:42.760 --> 00:59:45.039
questions. Dave, if you're still
there and you still have a third question,

859
00:59:45.360 --> 00:59:47.880
go for it. Yeah, I'm
still here. Actually, you guys

860
00:59:47.960 --> 00:59:51.559
kind of we're talking that for a
little bit of kind of segue into my

861
00:59:51.559 --> 00:59:59.719
next question. The Wrestling Observer reported
earlier this week that Undertaker will be facing

862
00:59:59.760 --> 01:00:05.119
Brock Plesner Wresselmania. I'm not gonna
ask you guys to speculate on whether that

863
01:00:05.159 --> 01:00:08.360
match will actually happened, but do
you think that if it, do you

864
01:00:08.440 --> 01:00:14.840
think that would be the biggest money
match for the Undertaker at Wressellmania. I

865
01:00:14.920 --> 01:00:16.079
think so one. I think it's
always been regarded that way, John,

866
01:00:16.199 --> 01:00:22.559
I mean, I think I think
Undertaker Lesner feels like and it's a reliable

867
01:00:22.639 --> 01:00:23.679
report, I mean, so,
I mean, we're far enough out,

868
01:00:24.039 --> 01:00:28.199
but not so far out that I
wouldn't say that that isn't the A plan.

869
01:00:28.960 --> 01:00:34.880
And Lesner, it seems John like
the biggest threat to the streak that

870
01:00:34.920 --> 01:00:38.239
you could create storyline wise. Plus
of course you have you know, they're

871
01:00:38.280 --> 01:00:43.280
crossing paths at the UC event,
and you have Undertaker in corporat submission holds

872
01:00:43.280 --> 01:00:46.000
into a style, and you have
Lesner obviously having that skill set. I

873
01:00:46.280 --> 01:00:51.039
just think it's a really good go
to match other than the other option,

874
01:00:51.480 --> 01:00:53.840
which I think was considered as of
recently, which is Undertaker. John Cena

875
01:00:53.960 --> 01:00:57.679
is always a card they can play
because it's been It's It's just it's a

876
01:00:57.719 --> 01:01:01.760
match that I think would feel very
fresh and feel very monumental. Again,

877
01:01:01.960 --> 01:01:07.119
I can agree with you and at
the same time disagree with you in that

878
01:01:07.639 --> 01:01:13.800
Lessner versus Undertaker as their their best
bet. I do believe that that's a

879
01:01:13.920 --> 01:01:17.599
valid point, But I think that
Sena versus Undertaker is their best bet because

880
01:01:17.639 --> 01:01:22.159
I feel this might be hard to
explain because I can't think of the words

881
01:01:22.199 --> 01:01:24.360
yet on how I want to do
it, so it may come out and

882
01:01:24.480 --> 01:01:31.159
make zero sense. But I feel
like in the WWE world, Sena versus

883
01:01:31.239 --> 01:01:35.880
Undertaker is the biggest match. Now. I think that you have that aspect

884
01:01:35.920 --> 01:01:37.920
of going, oh my gosh,
you've got brock Lessner, this monster,

885
01:01:38.039 --> 01:01:42.360
this UFC fighter, and he's going
to take on the Undertaker. I feel

886
01:01:42.400 --> 01:01:47.239
like that's not the way that brock
Lessner has really looked at inside the WWE

887
01:01:47.280 --> 01:01:52.199
world, because I don't think that
he's necessarily been and I haven't seen every

888
01:01:52.239 --> 01:01:53.559
single one of his pay per view
matches, but I just remember when he

889
01:01:53.599 --> 01:01:58.519
first came back and he lost to
Sena, and I don't think that he's

890
01:01:58.559 --> 01:02:07.840
been presented on on television as this
guy who you know, is as a

891
01:02:07.920 --> 01:02:13.199
threat really to anybody or anyone's career. I mean, I feel like if

892
01:02:13.239 --> 01:02:16.039
they brought him in and said we're
gonna eventually, maybe one year from now,

893
01:02:16.760 --> 01:02:21.440
we're going you versus Undertaker, I
feel like it should have been built,

894
01:02:21.519 --> 01:02:23.199
as you know, just if he's
only going to be here every few

895
01:02:23.199 --> 01:02:30.960
months, build this guy to destroy
everybody without hurting the talent that you have

896
01:02:30.079 --> 01:02:36.159
to sell every single week. But
in a way they can go Okay,

897
01:02:36.280 --> 01:02:38.719
no one's been able to stop him. Now he's going after the Streak,

898
01:02:38.960 --> 01:02:44.039
but I think that in the world
of the WWE, people will go okay,

899
01:02:44.119 --> 01:02:45.559
yeah, and he's a threat to
the Streak, but it's just gonna

900
01:02:45.559 --> 01:02:49.719
make Undertaker look better when he beats
him. Now, when you put Sina

901
01:02:49.719 --> 01:02:53.639
in there, I think that the
WWE world and the people inside of it

902
01:02:53.719 --> 01:02:58.199
will go, there's no way Sena's
losing this match, you know, and

903
01:02:58.599 --> 01:03:00.840
how would they get out of it. You're gonna lose to the Undertaker.

904
01:03:01.039 --> 01:03:04.519
So I think that you get those
people to go. I gotta see.

905
01:03:04.559 --> 01:03:07.119
I just got to see what's gonna
happen. Plus, I also feel like,

906
01:03:07.400 --> 01:03:12.440
you know, every year, it
gets closer and closer and closer with

907
01:03:12.519 --> 01:03:16.679
the Undertaker maybe not being able to
go right, And I think that eventually,

908
01:03:17.039 --> 01:03:21.679
I don't think w wants to make
the mistake of missing out on that

909
01:03:21.840 --> 01:03:24.159
match. Now. I know we've
seen Sena versus the Undertaker before, but

910
01:03:24.199 --> 01:03:30.559
it never never at the height that
they are both at now, and I

911
01:03:30.599 --> 01:03:32.679
feel like they don't want him doubt
on that. And hey, they might

912
01:03:32.719 --> 01:03:36.960
go to Undertaker and say, realistically, how many of these do you have

913
01:03:37.039 --> 01:03:38.280
left? And he might go,
listen, I can give you three more.

914
01:03:38.360 --> 01:03:40.840
All right, Well let's not go
to that SNA one just yet.

915
01:03:42.239 --> 01:03:46.079
But uh right, I think I
think that depending on you know, and

916
01:03:46.119 --> 01:03:49.920
I wouldn't even want to take that
chance with the Undertaker. I'm going Look,

917
01:03:49.960 --> 01:03:52.480
this is WrestleMania thirty with the two
guys on the roster, and think

918
01:03:52.480 --> 01:03:54.719
of it this way. Wait,
if they go and help me with an

919
01:03:54.760 --> 01:04:01.800
answer to this, if they go
Brock versus Undertaker, you can't go Sena

920
01:04:01.960 --> 01:04:09.280
Rock. Realistically, who does Sina
have to work with that feels like WrestleMania.

921
01:04:09.679 --> 01:04:13.599
It has to then be him an
Orton WWE title. I would think

922
01:04:14.400 --> 01:04:16.119
the only other option to be seen
at Triple H. If Triple Ah,

923
01:04:17.079 --> 01:04:19.480
yeah, I mean you know Triple
H has made that, you know,

924
01:04:19.639 --> 01:04:23.000
on Monday made the speech. You
know, if I if I can wrestle,

925
01:04:23.039 --> 01:04:24.719
I can still go, but I'm
not going to do it against a

926
01:04:24.719 --> 01:04:27.360
B plus wrestlore. I'm going to
do it against a star, which,

927
01:04:27.400 --> 01:04:29.599
by the way, I love,
you know Triple H. Kind of that.

928
01:04:29.679 --> 01:04:31.639
I talk about his tunnel vision,
like when he's involved in something,

929
01:04:32.280 --> 01:04:36.239
all he sees is how things affect
him and he doesn't really look at peripheral

930
01:04:36.320 --> 01:04:41.719
damage. And Randy Orton, he's
going to be headlining Wrestlemedia. He's probably

931
01:04:41.719 --> 01:04:45.000
going to be w W champion between
now and WrestleMania at some point unless Daniel

932
01:04:45.000 --> 01:04:47.599
Brian wins on Sunday and holds the
belt until Mania, which I would put

933
01:04:47.599 --> 01:04:54.400
money against. The notion that Triple
H is standing next to Randy Orton,

934
01:04:54.719 --> 01:04:59.440
Well he tells Daniel Brian, You're
not worth my time. I just when

935
01:04:59.480 --> 01:05:01.079
the paper have you made? Event
is Randy against Brian. I thought was

936
01:05:01.159 --> 01:05:03.719
kind of a slap of the face
to Randy, Like, yeah, Randy,

937
01:05:04.199 --> 01:05:06.800
you know you're you're x w to
be champion your might. You're probably

938
01:05:06.800 --> 01:05:10.960
gonna be championed on Sunday if you
beat Daniel Bryan. Uh. But you

939
01:05:10.960 --> 01:05:14.360
know the guy who I wouldn't bother
wrestling is giving you tough fights and has

940
01:05:14.400 --> 01:05:18.840
beating you basically friends, Right,
I'm both that you guys. Yeah yeah,

941
01:05:18.880 --> 01:05:20.880
but but by the pay per of
you on Sunday fans. But just

942
01:05:20.920 --> 01:05:25.960
remember I'm a bigger deal than anybody, right, Yeah, you're not gonna

943
01:05:26.000 --> 01:05:28.960
get me. You're not going to
get the big star, but you'll get

944
01:05:29.000 --> 01:05:31.119
these guys, two guys that you
know. I mean, I I couldn't

945
01:05:31.119 --> 01:05:34.199
be bothered to wrestle Daniel Bryan,
But Danie Brien's gonna give Randy you aren't

946
01:05:34.199 --> 01:05:36.639
a tough tough fight on Sunday,
So buy it. Everybody spends sixty five

947
01:05:36.639 --> 01:05:40.639
bucks Yeah, it's just you know, it's almost kind of comical with Triple

948
01:05:40.760 --> 01:05:43.920
H. How and he's and I've
I've said this on my vip Keller hotline.

949
01:05:43.960 --> 01:05:46.039
He's really smart, Like he's a
really smart guy. He understands a

950
01:05:46.079 --> 01:05:51.639
lot about wrestling, but there are
these almost comically absurd, uh kind of

951
01:05:51.679 --> 01:05:59.280
insecurity ego driven uh lapses in his
judgment when it comes to anything that he's

952
01:05:59.280 --> 01:06:01.239
involved in on the air. And
that's just another example, you know,

953
01:06:01.239 --> 01:06:05.079
one of the smaller ones, but
still it's kind of funny. Thanks for

954
01:06:05.119 --> 01:06:09.400
downloading today's show. Take it to
the next level with a VIP membership.

955
01:06:09.400 --> 01:06:13.079
Get shows like this, the Way
Keller Prosing Podcast, Weaykeller Prosing Post Show,

956
01:06:13.400 --> 01:06:17.280
and the PW Torch daily casts on
our PW Torch VIP podcast feed with

957
01:06:17.440 --> 01:06:21.880
ads and plugs removed from the shows
for a streamlined listening experience. And also

958
01:06:21.920 --> 01:06:26.360
hear the VIP exclusive shows that I
host with Rich Fan and Todd Martin,

959
01:06:26.360 --> 01:06:30.039
Everything with Rich Fan and The Fix
with Todd Martin signature VIP series that you're

960
01:06:30.039 --> 01:06:33.079
missing out without a VIP membership,
So go vip here in twenty twenty two

961
01:06:33.159 --> 01:06:39.000
and enjoy all the benefits all the
bonus content and the ad free listening experience.

962
01:06:39.079 --> 01:06:46.960
PW Torch dot com, slash go, VIP. Can I add one

963
01:06:47.000 --> 01:06:51.440
thing? Oh yeah, BBD a
Triple H apologist here. Yeah. No,

964
01:06:51.519 --> 01:06:56.320
I don't want to say I worked
closely with them, because I didn't.

965
01:06:56.599 --> 01:06:59.639
But you know, I worked with
and talked with Triple H. You

966
01:06:59.679 --> 01:07:02.480
know what was during my time there, And you know, I truly feel

967
01:07:02.559 --> 01:07:08.320
that he does get a bad rep
for, you know, holding guys down.

968
01:07:08.360 --> 01:07:11.360
And again, maybe he does it, but I can honestly tell you

969
01:07:11.440 --> 01:07:16.719
for the almost two years that I
was there, I never saw him frey

970
01:07:16.840 --> 01:07:24.159
anybody or or stop a guy from
getting a push now, you know,

971
01:07:24.199 --> 01:07:27.199
and everybody was guilty, but there
may have been a guy. So let's

972
01:07:27.199 --> 01:07:30.360
say Wade, we're thinking about pushing
you, and he might sit there and

973
01:07:30.400 --> 01:07:34.840
go, guys, I just I
don't know why we're pushing Wade when you

974
01:07:34.880 --> 01:07:39.280
know, I think John brings this
to the table, and I think that

975
01:07:39.360 --> 01:07:43.119
he would be you know, more
credible or more reliable or he's got this

976
01:07:43.320 --> 01:07:45.159
going form and I don't think,
you know, and if and if we

977
01:07:45.239 --> 01:07:48.559
push Wade, eventually he's gonna go
against Sena and man I just don't see

978
01:07:48.599 --> 01:07:53.880
it, but I can see John
versus Sena and and but everybody did that.

979
01:07:54.000 --> 01:07:56.599
And that's the worst is what I
saw with Triple H. And you

980
01:07:56.639 --> 01:08:01.000
know, in King of going okay, well, did that line maybe means

981
01:08:01.000 --> 01:08:05.079
something like I One thing that I
did learn there is like sometimes you watch

982
01:08:05.079 --> 01:08:09.199
something you go, God, why
do we do that? And then you

983
01:08:09.239 --> 01:08:13.239
find out from Vince you know,
listen, guys, yeah, that that

984
01:08:13.360 --> 01:08:15.600
may have been said, but here's
where we're going with it. And maybe

985
01:08:16.159 --> 01:08:20.600
Triple H said that to Brian to
establish you're not on my level. I

986
01:08:20.600 --> 01:08:25.239
wouldn't waste my time with you because
it is going to go to a Triple

987
01:08:25.399 --> 01:08:30.760
H Daniel Brian where now you go, Wow, Daniel Brian is now on

988
01:08:30.840 --> 01:08:34.920
Triple H's level. And you did
it fairly easily, like you built Brian

989
01:08:35.079 --> 01:08:39.800
to be an a plus player because
that's the way Triple H is presented.

990
01:08:40.119 --> 01:08:42.279
You know, one of the greatest
of all time, if not one of

991
01:08:42.279 --> 01:08:45.920
the biggest names ever in the way
that he presents himself on TV. And

992
01:08:45.960 --> 01:08:47.239
all of a sudden, he's going, I want to fight you, Daniel

993
01:08:47.239 --> 01:08:51.479
Brian. Now your fan base is
going, oh wow. Now you know

994
01:08:51.840 --> 01:08:55.800
I think you lose that if you're
gonna wait till WrestleMania, you can't go

995
01:08:55.840 --> 01:08:58.359
back and go, hey, remember
six months ago I told you I wouldn't

996
01:08:58.359 --> 01:09:01.039
wrestle you, so you they might
have to go to that quick. You

997
01:09:01.079 --> 01:09:04.039
know, maybe if Warton goes over
this pay per view, maybe Brian can

998
01:09:04.119 --> 01:09:08.159
get his hands on Triple H and
they go to that match, and then

999
01:09:08.199 --> 01:09:11.560
it makes sense. So but then
again, hey, you know, there's

1000
01:09:11.600 --> 01:09:15.439
been more people than me said bad
things about Triple H. So maybe I'm

1001
01:09:15.479 --> 01:09:18.439
wrong, but I personally never thought
and if anything, I saw him try

1002
01:09:18.479 --> 01:09:23.840
to build guys more than he tore
anybody down. And the ironic part about

1003
01:09:23.840 --> 01:09:30.520
people who think that I have been
unduly critical of Triple H since since Daniel

1004
01:09:30.520 --> 01:09:33.720
Brian's celebration after he won the title
at SummerSlam, if you listen, if

1005
01:09:33.760 --> 01:09:38.319
you go back and listen to the
Keller Hotline and read my writings in the

1006
01:09:38.319 --> 01:09:42.039
Pros and Torch newsletter and editoral,
you'll actually see me being the guy who

1007
01:09:42.079 --> 01:09:45.920
defended Triple H against the conventional wisdom
that he held everybody down. Because I

1008
01:09:45.960 --> 01:09:48.760
think time has proven him right about
Rob ban Dam. I mean, Rob

1009
01:09:48.840 --> 01:09:51.319
van Dam just he wasn't going to
be the face of the company. He

1010
01:09:51.359 --> 01:09:55.720
had attitude issues, he was nonchalant, he was you know, he wasn't.

1011
01:09:55.920 --> 01:09:59.479
He just wasn't a guy who brought
a level of dedication to the business

1012
01:09:59.600 --> 01:10:05.600
that WWE has learned through experience a
top guy needs to have. And RVD

1013
01:10:05.720 --> 01:10:10.319
established that from his first moment as
an ECW guy backstage, just acting like

1014
01:10:10.319 --> 01:10:12.840
he was too cool for school,
and they're just all kinds of it.

1015
01:10:13.000 --> 01:10:15.399
I think he was right about him. I think that there's other guys that

1016
01:10:15.479 --> 01:10:19.159
he said aren't really even and I'm
in the minority here, but I don't

1017
01:10:19.159 --> 01:10:21.439
think Chris Jericho was ever a guy
that you could just build the whole,

1018
01:10:21.479 --> 01:10:24.760
the whole company round in the brand
around. I just don't think he was

1019
01:10:24.840 --> 01:10:27.600
quite at that level. And I
think Hunter was right about that. I

1020
01:10:27.600 --> 01:10:30.560
think he takes on fair heat about
it. Edge. I think he's right

1021
01:10:30.560 --> 01:10:33.600
about Edge. I mean he said
it on Monday and his promo he mentioned

1022
01:10:33.640 --> 01:10:36.760
those three specifically. Robind Am,
Jericho and Edge are three guys who,

1023
01:10:36.840 --> 01:10:40.159
if they had been the face of
the company, we'd be owned by,

1024
01:10:40.199 --> 01:10:43.479
we'd be working for Ted Turner right
now. A bit of an exaggeration in

1025
01:10:43.520 --> 01:10:46.840
a caricature for drama, But I
don't think I think John Cena is definitely

1026
01:10:46.840 --> 01:10:49.159
better than Edge when it comes to
being a face of the company guy.

1027
01:10:49.279 --> 01:10:53.000
And I'm not I'm a fan of
Edge, but you know he's not.

1028
01:10:53.399 --> 01:10:57.239
There's certain things about him that aren't
there so I think. But my issue

1029
01:10:57.239 --> 01:11:00.520
with Triple H is once he makes
that assertion, once he makes that conclusion,

1030
01:11:00.960 --> 01:11:04.920
I think he works a little harder
than he should to prove himself right

1031
01:11:05.279 --> 01:11:11.640
instead of trying to make trying to
get the best out of those people that

1032
01:11:11.239 --> 01:11:15.319
he sees flaws in so that maybe
he can be proven wrong or at least

1033
01:11:15.319 --> 01:11:17.359
get the most out of Rob Bandam. And I think most people look at

1034
01:11:17.439 --> 01:11:23.000
vdswwe career and go Maybe people are
willing to admit yeah. And you know,

1035
01:11:23.039 --> 01:11:25.279
the more I learned about RVD and
the more I see him, I

1036
01:11:25.359 --> 01:11:27.840
kind of get where Triple AH is
coming from. But I think they could

1037
01:11:27.880 --> 01:11:30.079
have worked a little harder to get
more out of him without seeming like they

1038
01:11:30.079 --> 01:11:33.760
were just like it was painful to
push him. Ever, and that's where

1039
01:11:33.800 --> 01:11:38.720
I think there's a middle ground with
Triple H and sometimes his right opinions.

1040
01:11:38.960 --> 01:11:42.479
He tries too hard to prove that
he's absolutely right. Well, you know,

1041
01:11:42.560 --> 01:11:45.039
but here's the thing too, is
you're never gonna have whether it's a

1042
01:11:45.079 --> 01:11:48.640
district man, whether it was Eric
Bischoff, whether it was Vern Gania,

1043
01:11:48.800 --> 01:11:56.520
whether you know, Paul Hayman,
whoever was in charge of creating the top

1044
01:11:56.600 --> 01:12:01.520
guys, everybody has been wrong,
and everybody has had an opinion. It

1045
01:12:01.600 --> 01:12:06.439
was Vince who said Hogan's the guy, and maybe at one point someone came

1046
01:12:06.479 --> 01:12:11.960
to him and said, no,
the guy should be fill in the blank.

1047
01:12:12.279 --> 01:12:15.039
And he then had to make a
decision and he went with I believe

1048
01:12:15.199 --> 01:12:18.920
this guy is the guy and this
guy isn't. And I feel like if

1049
01:12:18.920 --> 01:12:24.159
the Internet was around back then maybe
we would have seen that more with people.

1050
01:12:24.199 --> 01:12:28.079
But it's like that with everything.
I mean, you can have two

1051
01:12:28.119 --> 01:12:30.000
guys off the street, me and
you can sit down on the couch and

1052
01:12:30.039 --> 01:12:35.159
we can watch a baseball game and
I can say Barry Bonds is the greatest

1053
01:12:35.159 --> 01:12:39.000
player of all time, or we
could I'm sorry, we could even just

1054
01:12:39.720 --> 01:12:43.119
watch it today and I can say, hey, I think the best player

1055
01:12:43.119 --> 01:12:45.439
in baseball is Mike Trout and you
can go no, no, no,

1056
01:12:45.439 --> 01:12:48.079
no, no, here's why Mike
Trout is not the best player in baseball,

1057
01:12:48.199 --> 01:12:51.119
and this is why Miguel Cabrera is
the best player in baseball. And

1058
01:12:51.159 --> 01:12:56.239
we have our arguments, and if
we were in charge, I would sit

1059
01:12:56.279 --> 01:13:00.560
there and I'd go, I want
to push Trout or whoever the the I

1060
01:13:00.600 --> 01:13:03.479
want to push Daniel Brian. And
we've got, you know, Wade Keller

1061
01:13:03.520 --> 01:13:05.880
from the other side of the table
that goes, no, no, no,

1062
01:13:05.920 --> 01:13:10.960
here's why we shouldn't push Daniel Brian. Here's why we should push Randy

1063
01:13:11.000 --> 01:13:15.359
Horton is the guy. So you
know, it's you're not always going to

1064
01:13:15.399 --> 01:13:17.840
be right, but people tend to
no matter who you are, Triple H

1065
01:13:17.960 --> 01:13:23.760
or anybody. You have an opinion
of something, you're going to showcase all

1066
01:13:23.800 --> 01:13:29.159
the reasons why you were right.
And I don't think that Triple H fits

1067
01:13:29.159 --> 01:13:30.640
there and goes, look, I
don't think Daniel Brian's the guy, or

1068
01:13:30.720 --> 01:13:33.960
Rob van Dam's the guy. I
think that he and Vince have been smart

1069
01:13:34.039 --> 01:13:39.479
enough to go listen, we may
not believe that Daniel Brian is the guy,

1070
01:13:40.000 --> 01:13:44.560
but he's the best we got right
now. So we need to make

1071
01:13:44.600 --> 01:13:48.479
sure that we do what we need
to do to get him over and they

1072
01:13:48.520 --> 01:13:53.359
truly are trying that, and whether
it's failing or not, they're not going

1073
01:13:53.399 --> 01:13:57.800
out there to bury him. But
they're also probably going to be sure that

1074
01:13:57.880 --> 01:14:02.119
they don't go out there and make
him put too much into him because maybe

1075
01:14:02.159 --> 01:14:09.079
they feel he's not the guy.
He could be a great role player,

1076
01:14:09.359 --> 01:14:13.600
but we need to be sure that
we don't tell everyone we're going all in

1077
01:14:13.640 --> 01:14:16.840
on him, because that could also
be a mistake if they're wrong. Right,

1078
01:14:17.039 --> 01:14:23.880
yep, yep, no, well
put, well put. Do you

1079
01:14:23.960 --> 01:14:28.119
remember when Hulk Hogan shocked the world
and formed the New World Order? Or

1080
01:14:28.159 --> 01:14:31.439
when Stone called Steve Austin passed down
on the Sharpshooter to break the hit Man

1081
01:14:31.479 --> 01:14:36.279
heart. I'm Torch contributor Frank Pettianni, and I've reviewed these shows and many

1082
01:14:36.319 --> 01:14:42.239
more for my exclusive VIP podcast,
Pro Wrestling Than and Now. Together with

1083
01:14:42.319 --> 01:14:45.840
a rotating chair of co hosts,
we go back ten, twenty, even

1084
01:14:45.920 --> 01:14:49.159
thirty years, review pay per views
from top to bottom, talk about where

1085
01:14:49.159 --> 01:14:53.600
the wrestlers were at the time,
and compare what took place then to what

1086
01:14:53.720 --> 01:14:58.600
is taking place now. You get
exclusive access to these and other podcasts as

1087
01:14:58.640 --> 01:15:02.439
part of your PW Torch VIP membership, which is compatible with the Apple podcast

1088
01:15:02.560 --> 01:15:08.600
app. Visit pwtorch dot com slash
go vip for details and sign up for

1089
01:15:15.800 --> 01:15:19.239
all Right, let's let's try Fight
seven. It's been out whole a long

1090
01:15:19.279 --> 01:15:20.920
time, and get on a call
date. By the way, thanks for

1091
01:15:20.920 --> 01:15:24.479
your calling, your questions, good
topics, Fight seven. Oh please state

1092
01:15:24.479 --> 01:15:28.439
your name and where you're from.
Hey wait, it's Larry from Pennsylvania.

1093
01:15:28.479 --> 01:15:31.840
Hey Larry, what have you got
for John today? Hey? John,

1094
01:15:32.039 --> 01:15:34.600
thanks for coming on the show.
By the way, I got a real

1095
01:15:34.680 --> 01:15:39.600
quick question and I'll just hang up
there and listen later. For example,

1096
01:15:39.680 --> 01:15:44.159
when when cm poncour John Cenar Rock
come out for the beginning of Raw,

1097
01:15:45.039 --> 01:15:47.439
how much is that opening segment when
they come on to mic, how much

1098
01:15:47.439 --> 01:15:51.239
has that ad lived or scripted?
Like do you have that all written up

1099
01:15:51.279 --> 01:15:55.880
for them? And if you do, when did they get that? Thanks?

1100
01:15:55.880 --> 01:16:01.000
Guys? You bet? Thanks?
Yeah, good question. It depends,

1101
01:16:01.159 --> 01:16:05.119
It depends on who it is,
and it depends on you know,

1102
01:16:05.359 --> 01:16:11.640
the night. And you know there's
times that we've had a raw written on

1103
01:16:11.720 --> 01:16:18.479
Friday, pitched written off on by
Vince show up Monday. Slight changes,

1104
01:16:18.560 --> 01:16:21.760
I mean, very slight changes,
change this to this, this to this,

1105
01:16:23.039 --> 01:16:29.439
let's go and then essentially that let's
say seton one is like you said,

1106
01:16:29.479 --> 01:16:33.680
a CM punk promo, some Punk. We'll get that promo probably minutes

1107
01:16:33.720 --> 01:16:40.159
after the production meeting, which could
be let's say, let's say typically maybe

1108
01:16:40.199 --> 01:16:44.399
three o'clock, so he's got three
hours to work on that. Then there's

1109
01:16:44.439 --> 01:16:47.319
times that we show up to Rob
and we go on the production meeting and

1110
01:16:47.359 --> 01:16:51.880
we walk out of it an hour
before the show, even sometimes forty five

1111
01:16:51.880 --> 01:16:57.279
minutes before the show, with a
whole new show, and I gotta run

1112
01:16:57.319 --> 01:17:00.000
and find see them Punk and go
here it is. But Punk was also

1113
01:17:00.039 --> 01:17:04.279
somebody who would take take what you
wrote for him and go, I see

1114
01:17:04.319 --> 01:17:08.079
what you want me to do.
Now, I'm gonna do it how I

1115
01:17:08.239 --> 01:17:12.199
do it. And so he'll come
back to you and he'll go, here's

1116
01:17:12.239 --> 01:17:15.760
what I have. And then obviously
you got to get that approved through Vincent.

1117
01:17:15.840 --> 01:17:17.880
I don't know how it all goes
down, now, I know that

1118
01:17:17.920 --> 01:17:21.000
since I've been there, I know
that they they went from like fully scripted

1119
01:17:21.000 --> 01:17:25.439
to bullet points. Who knows what
they're doing now? Maybe nothing, but

1120
01:17:26.479 --> 01:17:29.239
you know, so see them Punk. We'll rewrite and saying, listen,

1121
01:17:29.359 --> 01:17:32.000
see them Punk is saying this,
You're not see them Punk. I'm gonna

1122
01:17:32.000 --> 01:17:34.520
say it like CM Punk. But
I'm gonna follow what it is you want

1123
01:17:34.600 --> 01:17:38.439
me to get over. Here you
go. I can take it to Vince

1124
01:17:38.520 --> 01:17:41.079
Vince just like this. Yeah,
go back to punk. Here you go

1125
01:17:41.159 --> 01:17:43.680
Punk. And then Punk goes cool
going and I already know to me,

1126
01:17:44.199 --> 01:17:46.239
I'm gonna go out there and do
it. And then there's you know,

1127
01:17:46.279 --> 01:17:49.720
there's people where let's say, if
I was working with Miz, I'm literally

1128
01:17:49.760 --> 01:17:54.119
gonna I'm gonna leave the production meeting. I'm gonna go MS. Let's sit

1129
01:17:54.159 --> 01:17:58.000
down. They want us to get
over the fact that you know this,

1130
01:17:58.000 --> 01:18:00.359
this, this, and this.
So me and you let's come up with

1131
01:18:00.560 --> 01:18:05.720
a very miss promo. I really
wanted like to miss to be different when

1132
01:18:05.720 --> 01:18:09.319
I was working with him, and
so we would sit down and he'd throw

1133
01:18:09.359 --> 01:18:10.880
an idea at me, and I
go, man, that's good, Okay,

1134
01:18:10.920 --> 01:18:12.520
let's write Okay, now how about
this? Oh man, Okay,

1135
01:18:12.600 --> 01:18:15.239
let's go and then we would write
it together and then now you know,

1136
01:18:15.319 --> 01:18:19.279
maybe that took a half hour,
and so now he's got two hours to

1137
01:18:20.279 --> 01:18:25.640
get that go out there and he's
reading pretty much. I have that piece

1138
01:18:25.640 --> 01:18:27.520
of paper write in front of me
and Vince can have it, and we're

1139
01:18:27.560 --> 01:18:30.359
sitting next to each other and he's
literally not missing a single letter of a

1140
01:18:30.359 --> 01:18:34.560
word of what he's saying. And
then you've got John Cena, where with

1141
01:18:34.680 --> 01:18:39.920
Sina sometimes it would be hey,
John, let's go write this, and

1142
01:18:40.079 --> 01:18:42.680
he basically, you know, I
could throw him an idea, eh,

1143
01:18:42.840 --> 01:18:45.479
and it doesn't matter what I say. If Sina wants something down, you

1144
01:18:45.520 --> 01:18:47.840
write it down, and then you
go to Vince and you can go,

1145
01:18:47.920 --> 01:18:53.159
hey, hey, Sena, this
is Sena's promo. Oh okay, yeah,

1146
01:18:53.239 --> 01:18:55.760
go ahead, or if sometimes if
if he didn't like it, you'd

1147
01:18:55.920 --> 01:18:57.840
Seena in there and Tina would go, hey, I want to say this,

1148
01:18:57.880 --> 01:19:00.600
Okay, you're gonna say it,
and then Sena goes out kind of

1149
01:19:00.640 --> 01:19:04.039
says his own thing. But you
know, he would have the bullet points

1150
01:19:04.039 --> 01:19:08.720
of what you wrote with him.
So it all depends on who it is,

1151
01:19:09.000 --> 01:19:11.560
and it depends on what they're doing. Now. I don't know if

1152
01:19:11.560 --> 01:19:13.720
it's bullet points, and I don't
know if it's ad lib, but I

1153
01:19:13.720 --> 01:19:16.720
can tell you at the time when
I was there, we had to stay

1154
01:19:16.920 --> 01:19:21.279
pretty close to what we wrote down, only because it had to get approved

1155
01:19:21.279 --> 01:19:25.720
through Vince. And if a guy
went out there and did something completely different,

1156
01:19:25.760 --> 01:19:28.279
it's on me. So I got
to make sure I know what they're

1157
01:19:28.319 --> 01:19:33.880
saying when they're going out in different
scenario for different guys. I think I

1158
01:19:33.920 --> 01:19:38.039
gave a couple examples of, you
know, each case, it's fair to

1159
01:19:38.039 --> 01:19:40.880
say, John, if you're a
newer guy given a longer promo, and

1160
01:19:41.119 --> 01:19:44.840
generally the long promo segments are for
guys who have earned trust. They're in

1161
01:19:44.880 --> 01:19:48.039
money matches, they're not just filler
and all that. But the newer and

1162
01:19:48.119 --> 01:19:53.399
younger and less experienced the guy,
the higher the expectations are that they spend

1163
01:19:53.399 --> 01:19:58.399
the time necessary to hit the points
exactly as word for word as possible.

1164
01:19:58.680 --> 01:20:01.880
And then if you move up the
card you're saying, John Cena has certainly

1165
01:20:01.960 --> 01:20:06.600
more liberty to stray from the prescribe
even bullet point order, and certainly word

1166
01:20:06.640 --> 01:20:12.640
for word, Yeah you know,
it's it's more so, Yes, yes,

1167
01:20:12.720 --> 01:20:15.800
you're right, But I can also
add that it's also more so earning

1168
01:20:15.880 --> 01:20:19.119
Vince's trust. I know that we
got miss uh to the point. I

1169
01:20:19.159 --> 01:20:21.920
remember I walked in with with Mis
one day and I said, I haven't

1170
01:20:23.000 --> 01:20:25.880
missus promo. And a lot of
times I'd like to take the guy in

1171
01:20:25.920 --> 01:20:29.199
with me if if they wanted to, if they didn't define, I'll go,

1172
01:20:29.279 --> 01:20:31.439
I'll go cut the promo. But
sometimes I almost want Vince see the

1173
01:20:31.520 --> 01:20:35.439
promo. Then he gets a better
idea. So I remember I would take

1174
01:20:35.479 --> 01:20:39.199
Mis with me. And then we
walked into his office one day and I

1175
01:20:39.199 --> 01:20:41.279
said, hey, I got I
got the miss promo. I got Miss

1176
01:20:41.359 --> 01:20:43.880
here he'd like to to give it
to you, and he just said,

1177
01:20:44.720 --> 01:20:47.039
don't don't need to hear it.
I trust him. Okay, he's he's

1178
01:20:47.039 --> 01:20:50.880
earned my trust. Just just go. I trust you guys. Whatever you

1179
01:20:50.960 --> 01:20:55.319
have. You guys are good.
Do guys sometimes? And this gets back

1180
01:20:55.319 --> 01:20:58.960
to our original callers question and expanding
on a little bit. Do some guys

1181
01:20:59.039 --> 01:21:02.760
spend a hours memorizing word for word
and other guys can read it once or

1182
01:21:02.800 --> 01:21:05.560
twice and pretty much have it down, Like, did you notice a different

1183
01:21:05.640 --> 01:21:10.840
level of studying that it's necessary depending
on how experienced or how good people's memories

1184
01:21:10.880 --> 01:21:13.439
are. Yeah, you know,
my memory is not that great, so

1185
01:21:13.479 --> 01:21:15.039
I can't really get these specific names, but I could tell you that there'd

1186
01:21:15.079 --> 01:21:17.800
be times where I'd walk up to
someone and you know, I had like

1187
01:21:17.840 --> 01:21:21.640
my core guys that I would probably
work with on on a weekly basis,

1188
01:21:23.680 --> 01:21:26.680
and then there'd be sometimes I'd get
a guy that I'd never had written with

1189
01:21:26.880 --> 01:21:30.279
before, and so they'd go,
hey, you know you've got and again,

1190
01:21:30.319 --> 01:21:32.119
I'm not using this guy because I
don't know if this was a specific

1191
01:21:32.119 --> 01:21:34.439
guy, but let's just say they
got, hey, you got a Mark

1192
01:21:34.479 --> 01:21:38.359
Henry today. So I may go
up to Mark Henry with you know,

1193
01:21:38.840 --> 01:21:42.199
two paragraphs of a promo and walk
up to him and he might take it,

1194
01:21:42.399 --> 01:21:44.479
read it right in front of me
and go cool, god it see

1195
01:21:44.520 --> 01:21:47.439
you, and then he's whatever he
was doing with it. Maybe he went

1196
01:21:47.479 --> 01:21:50.319
and you know, you'd see him
go over his match the entire time,

1197
01:21:50.319 --> 01:21:53.399
and you're sitting there nervous, going, oh my gosh, I hope he

1198
01:21:53.439 --> 01:21:56.159
knows this thing. And he'd go
out there and you never saw him read

1199
01:21:56.199 --> 01:21:59.479
it a second time. But or
he'd come up to you, like right

1200
01:21:59.520 --> 01:22:01.920
before, I'd be waiting in gorilla
position the segment before, and then you

1201
01:22:02.000 --> 01:22:05.039
see Mark Henry walk up and he's
like, hey, let me see that

1202
01:22:05.079 --> 01:22:08.319
promo again, he'd look at it
the second time and go, Okay,

1203
01:22:08.359 --> 01:22:10.000
cool, I got it, and
he'd go out there and do it.

1204
01:22:10.039 --> 01:22:13.079
And again, Mark Henry is not
the guy I'm referring to, but guys

1205
01:22:13.079 --> 01:22:15.880
like that. Then you'd have guys
where I'd give it to someone again say

1206
01:22:15.880 --> 01:22:17.279
it's dull good or something, and
I walk up to him, I go,

1207
01:22:17.319 --> 01:22:19.880
here it is. And most of
these guys, like I wanted to

1208
01:22:20.039 --> 01:22:26.000
really sit down with them and write
it with them, because if they don't

1209
01:22:26.600 --> 01:22:30.000
like or believe what they're saying,
and if they feel like their character wouldn't

1210
01:22:30.000 --> 01:22:33.840
say or do something, they're not
going to go out there and cut a

1211
01:22:33.840 --> 01:22:36.720
good promo. They have to believe
what it is. It's rottn down.

1212
01:22:36.720 --> 01:22:41.840
So I always wanted it to be
from that person's perspective. So I always

1213
01:22:41.880 --> 01:22:43.880
wanted to sit down with a guy. But like, I'd walk up with

1214
01:22:44.000 --> 01:22:46.199
a guy and let's just say we
write the drum and then the whole night.

1215
01:22:46.319 --> 01:22:49.720
If they're in like seg eight,
which is you know, towards the

1216
01:22:49.800 --> 01:22:54.680
end of the show or was when
it was two hours, you'd see that

1217
01:22:54.760 --> 01:22:59.720
guy literally with that paper, pacing
back and forth all night long, and

1218
01:22:59.760 --> 01:23:01.359
you okay, I mean, you
feel good about it because you know that's

1219
01:23:01.359 --> 01:23:04.840
really working with it. So it's
it's it's different for each guy. And

1220
01:23:04.880 --> 01:23:08.239
I think a lot of times,
you know, like even with someone like

1221
01:23:08.279 --> 01:23:11.000
Sena'd be like, Hey, Sina, you want to you want to sit

1222
01:23:11.039 --> 01:23:13.399
down and write something. What is
it that I need to get over?

1223
01:23:13.640 --> 01:23:16.119
Well, you need to get over
that last week Shane has put you down

1224
01:23:16.239 --> 01:23:18.399
and then this and that blah blah
blah. And he'd be like, cool,

1225
01:23:18.880 --> 01:23:20.640
I got it. I'll go out
there and do it. And then

1226
01:23:20.680 --> 01:23:25.880
he just go out there and just
say whatever he wanted to say. Let's

1227
01:23:26.199 --> 01:23:29.079
take one more call here before we
moved to the VP after show with our

1228
01:23:29.079 --> 01:23:31.720
remaining minutes with John Erico two one
nine, Please state your name and where

1229
01:23:31.720 --> 01:23:35.880
you're from. All right, this
is bikes from Indiana. Hey, Mike,

1230
01:23:35.880 --> 01:23:41.079
good hear for you. What have
you got for John today? Quick

1231
01:23:41.159 --> 01:23:45.720
question? And I hopefully didn't cover
this earlier. I just jumped just started

1232
01:23:45.720 --> 01:23:49.640
listening a little while ago Wrestle Many
Authority. There's there's been some rumors at

1233
01:23:49.680 --> 01:23:54.439
Hawk Hogan my return to the w
w E. Do you guys think there's

1234
01:23:54.439 --> 01:23:59.039
a place for Hogan to wrestle on
the card. Yeah, we haven't talked

1235
01:23:59.039 --> 01:24:00.239
for sure. Yeah, we haven't
covered that yet, Mike, So good

1236
01:24:00.319 --> 01:24:05.560
topic, John. I mean,
it seems like Hulk Hogan is leaning towards

1237
01:24:05.600 --> 01:24:10.800
or it's more likely I guess I
should put it staying in TNA. But

1238
01:24:10.840 --> 01:24:15.279
your your thoughts on the whole Hulk
Cogan possibility of showing up Atresselmania thirty if

1239
01:24:15.279 --> 01:24:17.920
you were healthy enough, is there
even a match out there that that makes

1240
01:24:17.960 --> 01:24:21.439
sense as they're up if Hogan were
healthy enough to make it through you know,

1241
01:24:21.520 --> 01:24:25.880
the bare bones match? Do you
do you do a dream match with

1242
01:24:25.920 --> 01:24:28.760
Hogan in some one of the bigger
names on who are available and on the

1243
01:24:28.800 --> 01:24:33.199
roster right now. I mean maybe
on paper it would look good to see

1244
01:24:34.199 --> 01:24:39.760
Hull Hogan versus John Cena or Hull
Cogan versus you know, another big name,

1245
01:24:41.000 --> 01:24:43.479
but I don't like, you know, if something like this were to

1246
01:24:43.479 --> 01:24:46.079
come up and we had the possibility
of hey, guys, there's a possibility

1247
01:24:46.399 --> 01:24:49.640
that we may have Hull Cogan at
WrestleMania thirty. Get in your ideas,

1248
01:24:50.760 --> 01:24:54.399
you know. If I had to
come up with five or six ideas for

1249
01:24:54.479 --> 01:24:56.680
him, Yeah, one of them
would be a match, But I feel

1250
01:24:56.760 --> 01:25:01.520
like if I'm big as Hull Cogan
fan, maybe ever I love the guy.

1251
01:25:01.560 --> 01:25:05.000
He's the reason why I became a
wrestling fan. I made my parents

1252
01:25:05.079 --> 01:25:09.319
take me to Venice Beach, California
because I thought i'd run into him.

1253
01:25:09.399 --> 01:25:14.760
Like I I was the biggest polkamaniac. So it's not coming from someone who's

1254
01:25:14.760 --> 01:25:16.000
not a fan of his. But
I don't know if i'd want to,

1255
01:25:16.960 --> 01:25:18.960
And even as a fan, I
wouldn't order the pay per view to see

1256
01:25:19.000 --> 01:25:23.359
him in a match again. On
paper, that'd be cool to go Wow

1257
01:25:23.520 --> 01:25:27.600
Sina versus Hull Cogan, but in
execution, I don't think that I would

1258
01:25:27.640 --> 01:25:30.680
like it. I would probably come
up with some segments where it would be

1259
01:25:31.319 --> 01:25:35.079
somewhere he's got and it's something you
got to promote too. You can't just

1260
01:25:35.079 --> 01:25:39.840
say and apparents by whole Cogan.
It'd be a segment where you can promote

1261
01:25:40.039 --> 01:25:45.720
that he'd be involved in something and
I'd have some sort of physicality where you

1262
01:25:45.760 --> 01:25:49.359
know, maybe it's del Rio and
not him specifically, but just throwing out

1263
01:25:49.359 --> 01:25:53.720
a heel you know gets involved with
him in there's physicality and you can get

1264
01:25:53.720 --> 01:25:56.560
the big Hogan moves. You know, you can have del Rio come out

1265
01:25:56.560 --> 01:26:00.800
and drop them and then he hulks
up and then hits them and then drop

1266
01:26:00.960 --> 01:26:02.800
them and big boot and leg drop
and then you get that, you get

1267
01:26:02.800 --> 01:26:08.760
that that cool uh hul Cogan moment. But I don't necessarily know that I'd

1268
01:26:08.840 --> 01:26:12.640
want to see him in a match. But again, it really does come

1269
01:26:12.640 --> 01:26:15.560
to what sells the pay per view, and it's gonna be probably what's put

1270
01:26:15.640 --> 01:26:18.399
down on paper. So maybe it
would benefit them to say it's gonna be

1271
01:26:18.439 --> 01:26:25.800
Hull Cogan versus this person, But
even then, who really is there for

1272
01:26:25.920 --> 01:26:30.880
him? What about? What about
since their their pals going way back.

1273
01:26:30.279 --> 01:26:35.359
If Big Show eventually turns, eventually
succumbs to the pressure to get his job

1274
01:26:35.399 --> 01:26:38.600
back and does what he feels he
has to do, they somehow write that

1275
01:26:38.680 --> 01:26:42.439
story and you do rest. You
know, WrestleMania three Hogan andre WrestleMania three

1276
01:26:42.600 --> 01:26:46.079
zero Hogan Big Show in some sort
of a spectacle match like that just comes

1277
01:26:46.119 --> 01:26:49.079
to mind to something where fans expectations
for the quality of the wrestling would be

1278
01:26:49.119 --> 01:26:53.239
great. It would more be can
Hogan survive a clubter ring of the hands

1279
01:26:53.239 --> 01:26:56.800
of Big Show, as Dusty would
put it, you'd have to really build

1280
01:26:56.840 --> 01:27:00.640
up Big Show, and I think
at this point there's enough of your audience

1281
01:27:00.680 --> 01:27:02.199
that knows who he is, so
it might be hard. But I remember

1282
01:27:02.239 --> 01:27:09.920
again someone on that the All Star
panel question asked about a Hogan match at

1283
01:27:09.920 --> 01:27:13.840
thirty and that literally the first thing
popped in my head was that if you

1284
01:27:13.920 --> 01:27:16.560
kind of recreated WrestleMania three. But
then I thought, I just don't think

1285
01:27:16.600 --> 01:27:20.880
Big Show's there or can even get
there, And really, what is that

1286
01:27:20.920 --> 01:27:25.239
you're going to see If Hogan can
slam Big Show or just survive it.

1287
01:27:25.479 --> 01:27:29.479
I feel if that's the case,
I mean somehow have it be brock lesser.

1288
01:27:30.439 --> 01:27:33.239
But that just doesn't seem like,
oh man, I've been waiting forever

1289
01:27:33.319 --> 01:27:38.479
for this dream match. I think
that I think realistically it have to.

1290
01:27:39.039 --> 01:27:40.960
It just kind of needs to be
seen, and I know that, and

1291
01:27:41.039 --> 01:27:43.399
I'm a big proponent of it.
Where it's almost like, oh man,

1292
01:27:43.399 --> 01:27:47.880
you got Hogan, use a guy
you're trying to build, But I don't

1293
01:27:47.920 --> 01:27:51.479
think you could with Hogan. Yeah, Like I think with Hogan you would

1294
01:27:51.520 --> 01:27:56.079
almost to avoid it seeming like it's
not a big deal that he's back.

1295
01:27:56.119 --> 01:27:59.039
You'd almost need it to be against
one of the top four guys. I

1296
01:27:59.079 --> 01:28:00.600
just wonder if Hogan came back and
said, I used to run this place,

1297
01:28:00.640 --> 01:28:03.000
Triple Ah, I used to be
the face of this company. I

1298
01:28:03.039 --> 01:28:05.880
recognize the face of the company,
and I'm sick of what you've said about

1299
01:28:05.920 --> 01:28:08.960
Daniel Brian and blah blah blah blah
blah. I'm here, you know,

1300
01:28:09.119 --> 01:28:12.079
and that ends up being Triple H
Hogan. I think Triple h could say

1301
01:28:12.159 --> 01:28:14.680
I think, you know, Triple
Sho think highly enough of himself that he

1302
01:28:14.720 --> 01:28:17.079
could, you know, work magic
around Hogan and take some bumps and you

1303
01:28:17.079 --> 01:28:20.159
know, be in a legendary match
at Wresselmanedia thirty That comes to mind.

1304
01:28:20.199 --> 01:28:30.600
Also, longing for some nostalgia,
or maybe you want to learn some wrestling

1305
01:28:30.680 --> 01:28:34.560
history, don't miss the Nineties Pass
cast Every Friday on the PW Torch Daily

1306
01:28:34.640 --> 01:28:40.560
Cast feed. Alex and Patrick will
transport you thirty years into the past by

1307
01:28:40.680 --> 01:28:44.840
taking you through the Torch issue from
that very week. Follow news from the

1308
01:28:44.920 --> 01:28:48.920
WWF and WCW and all the happenings
from across the wrestling industry in real time

1309
01:28:49.119 --> 01:28:54.720
as The Torch reported it thirty years
ago. That's the Nineties Pass cast every

1310
01:28:54.720 --> 01:29:09.720
Friday on the PW Torch Daily Cast
feed. I mean, but okay,

1311
01:29:09.760 --> 01:29:13.920
to add the band midway. Would
would you rather see him in the match?

1312
01:29:14.560 --> 01:29:16.039
No? No, I don't think
Hogan should wrestle. I'm trying to

1313
01:29:16.079 --> 01:29:19.600
take I'm trying to take Mike's question
and go if he were available to wrestle,

1314
01:29:19.960 --> 01:29:23.279
if he were healthy enough, truly
healthy enough, what would you do?

1315
01:29:23.640 --> 01:29:27.640
I think, at his age and
everything, I think he's more in

1316
01:29:27.640 --> 01:29:30.920
the unlikelyhood that a deal is struck
and he is at Wressemania thirty. And

1317
01:29:30.039 --> 01:29:32.840
when I say, I'm likely,
just a little bit blow fifty percent until

1318
01:29:32.920 --> 01:29:38.239
an announcement is made about a t
and a renewal. I think Hogan being

1319
01:29:38.239 --> 01:29:41.279
at Wressemania thirty makes some sense.
But I think you could actually use the

1320
01:29:41.279 --> 01:29:44.680
Restumenia thirty as just a platform for
him to, like Rock a few years

1321
01:29:44.680 --> 01:29:46.000
ago, kind of be the host
of the event and just be there to

1322
01:29:46.039 --> 01:29:49.279
be there and add a little nostalgia
to it. But I don't want to.

1323
01:29:49.439 --> 01:29:51.319
Honestly, I don't want to see
Hogan and wrestle again. I just

1324
01:29:51.359 --> 01:29:56.239
don't. But if you're going to, I kind of think a big show

1325
01:29:56.319 --> 01:29:59.399
or triple h a match where there's
low expectations. I just think expectations would

1326
01:29:59.399 --> 01:30:02.279
be too high for for using John
Cen in a match where Hogan just almost

1327
01:30:02.319 --> 01:30:06.560
can do nothing. Yeah, that's
a great point. Yeah, all right,

1328
01:30:06.640 --> 01:30:10.319
very good. We've got just a
few minutes left with John, but

1329
01:30:10.319 --> 01:30:13.000
we're gonna put it on the VIP
after show because we've got some email questions

1330
01:30:13.039 --> 01:30:15.880
I want to get to. We'll
do rapid fire answers for that. John,

1331
01:30:15.920 --> 01:30:18.880
thank you so much, especially on
short notice, for joining me today,

1332
01:30:19.079 --> 01:30:23.600
and thanks as always for your contributions
to the s PW Torch All Star

1333
01:30:23.640 --> 01:30:28.600
panel. If you've enjoyed the show
and you haven't heard John before, a

1334
01:30:28.600 --> 01:30:31.319
great way to listen to all of
his previous appearances, including right when he

1335
01:30:31.399 --> 01:30:35.960
left WWE within a couple months,
we did what about five was it three

1336
01:30:36.079 --> 01:30:39.319
or five hours? John? It
was, oh gosh, I don't know.

1337
01:30:39.359 --> 01:30:43.279
It was a long time enough long
form interview a couple of years back,

1338
01:30:43.600 --> 01:30:46.720
going on three years maybe, And
it was a long form interview going

1339
01:30:46.920 --> 01:30:53.960
just almost week by week through his
stay in WWE. Really comprehensive walk through

1340
01:30:54.000 --> 01:30:58.800
his through his run on the Creative
Team and as a VIP member, you

1341
01:30:58.880 --> 01:31:01.960
can join immediate and have access to
the transcript of it word for word,

1342
01:31:02.039 --> 01:31:05.359
start to finish and listen to it. Plus, as a VIP member,

1343
01:31:05.359 --> 01:31:09.880
you can instantly just click on a
drop menu of VIP features and go to

1344
01:31:09.920 --> 01:31:14.399
the pw Torch live cast and VIP
after show listening and see all the interviews

1345
01:31:14.439 --> 01:31:16.920
we've done for the past three years
on this show, including roughly a half

1346
01:31:16.960 --> 01:31:19.479
a dozen times John's been on the
show. So if you've liked the inside

1347
01:31:19.479 --> 01:31:23.800
from John and the stories and his
opinions, there's a lot more that you

1348
01:31:23.840 --> 01:31:28.279
can listen to immediately going VIP,
along with half a dozen other at least

1349
01:31:28.359 --> 01:31:31.319
x WWE writers Vintrusso at Ferrara all
the way through Matt McCarthy who was just

1350
01:31:31.600 --> 01:31:35.920
with WWE through a year ago.
We've had a lot of different people on

1351
01:31:35.920 --> 01:31:40.199
the show, and so if you've
enjoyed this show, you absolutely will get

1352
01:31:40.199 --> 01:31:43.680
your money's worth as a VIP member
at least for one month to listen to

1353
01:31:43.720 --> 01:31:48.000
and download all the previous appearances of
various x WWE writers. On the other

1354
01:31:48.079 --> 01:31:50.960
side of the music, a couple
of rapid fire topics with John again.

1355
01:31:50.960 --> 01:31:55.960
Thanks everybody for joining us and until
Sunday Night after how I want to sell

1356
01:31:56.199 --> 01:32:09.920
Wade Keller signing up? All right, John, right now in the VIP

1357
01:32:10.000 --> 01:32:12.640
after show portion of the show,
I know your time is limited, so

1358
01:32:12.720 --> 01:32:15.960
let's get right to some rapid fire
email questions and begin with a question from

1359
01:32:16.199 --> 01:32:19.600
Jerry. Is he using blog talk
radios? Goodbye? And begin with a

1360
01:32:19.640 --> 01:32:21.760
question from Jerry, who says,
I was wondering if you could give insight

1361
01:32:21.800 --> 01:32:27.520
into why we are reliving El Matadores
and Mantar when these gimmicks didn't work the

1362
01:32:27.560 --> 01:32:32.039
first time around. Uh, yeah, Well I never even thought of it

1363
01:32:32.039 --> 01:32:39.079
that way. I don't I don't
know. Maybe they forgot that they ever

1364
01:32:39.119 --> 01:32:43.520
did it. I mean that that
sounds like a joke, but it could

1365
01:32:43.720 --> 01:32:49.199
very well just be this m That's
a good question. I don't know.

1366
01:32:49.880 --> 01:32:53.880
Well, maybe Vince has pet ideas
and when they don't work the first time,

1367
01:32:53.960 --> 01:32:56.319
he thinks, ah, it was
just the wrong time, or if

1368
01:32:56.359 --> 01:32:59.399
I would have done this differently,
and he just has to keep trying and

1369
01:32:59.439 --> 01:33:02.600
trying until it well, you know, And sometimes I think of things just

1370
01:33:02.680 --> 01:33:05.039
kind of based on things that you
say. So I appreciate you kind of

1371
01:33:05.079 --> 01:33:11.520
like in the end, but I
feel like with with with someone like Vince

1372
01:33:11.800 --> 01:33:16.239
who you know, maybe in the
eighties and nineties he was he was someone

1373
01:33:16.239 --> 01:33:23.960
who was more involved and kind of
got it as far as like what was

1374
01:33:24.000 --> 01:33:27.399
going on in the world, you
know, and keeping up with things in

1375
01:33:27.399 --> 01:33:30.800
the times. And I feel like
with someone like Vince, who's been and

1376
01:33:30.840 --> 01:33:32.760
it'd be most people. So I'm
not saying it about Vince because it'll probably

1377
01:33:32.800 --> 01:33:35.199
happen to Triple Ah one day.
And you know, as much as I

1378
01:33:35.239 --> 01:33:39.239
talk about it happening with someone else, it would probably have happened with me

1379
01:33:39.800 --> 01:33:43.960
if I was there a certain amount
of time. But eventually, you you

1380
01:33:44.119 --> 01:33:50.720
have so much information or you have
so many ideas that eventually it just kind

1381
01:33:50.720 --> 01:33:55.359
of you just kind of revert back
and start over. And I feel like,

1382
01:33:55.760 --> 01:34:00.880
you know, maybe Vince doesn't know
kind of you know, what's I

1383
01:34:00.920 --> 01:34:04.079
hate using the work like hip or
cool, but maybe it's just like,

1384
01:34:04.159 --> 01:34:06.560
oh, okay, we got these
guys and you need to repackage them.

1385
01:34:08.079 --> 01:34:11.359
What can we do? Well they're
hispanic? Uh okay, well what if?

1386
01:34:11.880 --> 01:34:15.880
Uh? And and you you have
what you have inside your brain and

1387
01:34:15.920 --> 01:34:19.319
you had your knowledge and you have
these this file cabinet of ideas and he's

1388
01:34:19.319 --> 01:34:24.720
pulled from it, and eventually you
go, I don't have anything new in

1389
01:34:24.800 --> 01:34:27.840
here, and you just pull the
same things. Maybe he just doesn't know

1390
01:34:28.039 --> 01:34:31.640
another idea, and maybe when it
came down to, you know, creative

1391
01:34:31.760 --> 01:34:34.840
having to come up with ideas for
them, maybe it was the same thing.

1392
01:34:34.920 --> 01:34:38.399
Maybe it was you know, seen
this, seen this, seen this,

1393
01:34:38.800 --> 01:34:44.119
I'm going with mind and and you
know, it's almost like I kind

1394
01:34:44.119 --> 01:34:47.680
of look at it as if you
buy like a box of Crans, there's

1395
01:34:47.720 --> 01:34:51.960
only so many colors in it,
so you you continue to color or draw

1396
01:34:53.159 --> 01:34:57.439
or whatever it may be, no
matter what your you only have that limited

1397
01:34:57.560 --> 01:35:01.880
selection of colors. And unless you
decide to go, hey, I need

1398
01:35:01.920 --> 01:35:06.199
to go out there and I need
to find different pillors to add to my

1399
01:35:06.279 --> 01:35:11.319
collection of Krans, then you're just
gonna have that. And if you don't

1400
01:35:11.319 --> 01:35:14.840
go out there and look for it, then you're never gonna get You know,

1401
01:35:15.159 --> 01:35:16.800
you're gonna have red, green,
yellow, You're not gonna have peel.

1402
01:35:17.359 --> 01:35:20.479
And so if you never go out
and get it to try to find

1403
01:35:20.520 --> 01:35:26.319
it or whatever it may be,
then you'll just never gonna have it.

1404
01:35:26.359 --> 01:35:29.079
And all you have is you're gonna
go man all John does is color was

1405
01:35:29.800 --> 01:35:33.159
red, blue, and green.
Well that's all I got. Yeah,

1406
01:35:33.279 --> 01:35:36.039
all right, I'm gonna try to
squeeze another question here, and you cut

1407
01:35:36.079 --> 01:35:38.680
me off when you actually have to
go, because I know you've got a

1408
01:35:38.720 --> 01:35:42.319
conference call waiting for you. Yeah, I cannsk this question, okay,

1409
01:35:42.960 --> 01:35:44.760
Cody says. I remember seeing,
Well, I have to get through it

1410
01:35:44.840 --> 01:35:47.319
first. Cody says, I remember
seeing it's a long one. I remember

1411
01:35:47.319 --> 01:35:50.319
seeing right back out of House Show
where Dark Show pre match with hisff gimmick

1412
01:35:50.319 --> 01:35:53.800
and the crowd almost got into it. I also saw Johnny Curtis before find

1413
01:35:53.840 --> 01:35:55.880
Down go to House show, and
even though we didn't have any mic time,

1414
01:35:56.039 --> 01:35:59.199
you could see the flamboyant dancer thing
coming up NXTS tape. So house

1415
01:35:59.199 --> 01:36:00.880
shows can't get away with a few
things, So house shows can get away

1416
01:36:00.920 --> 01:36:04.119
for with a few things. Does
Creative use WWE house shows as a trial

1417
01:36:04.119 --> 01:36:08.720
and error as far as newer,
repackaged characters or is that an expiece thing

1418
01:36:08.800 --> 01:36:11.600
right now? Any angle to wrestling
characters that were tried at house shows that

1419
01:36:11.680 --> 01:36:14.760
ended up getting over more than expected
or vice versa, any that went way

1420
01:36:14.760 --> 01:36:23.439
worse than expected. Cody from Iola
that it is used to try things and

1421
01:36:23.439 --> 01:36:25.960
and kind of see how it goes
over. And it's another thing too,

1422
01:36:25.960 --> 01:36:28.600
to kind of it's it's a good
way to experiment a little bit too,

1423
01:36:28.640 --> 01:36:32.600
Like there could be talking more where
you know, I write a I wouldn't

1424
01:36:32.600 --> 01:36:38.920
say like an experimental but a that
I go, hey, you know see

1425
01:36:38.920 --> 01:36:41.399
how well this you know? Or
hey, get used to kind of talking

1426
01:36:41.520 --> 01:36:44.720
like this or trying to get over
this sort of character. Why don't you

1427
01:36:44.720 --> 01:36:49.079
take this promo and why don't you
use at the next loop of house shows?

1428
01:36:49.199 --> 01:36:51.279
And and then he can go out
there and he can go, oh,

1429
01:36:51.319 --> 01:36:54.439
you know, I kind of get
it, and I'm hearing it out

1430
01:36:54.479 --> 01:36:57.800
and oh when I talked about this
and this, this really got over.

1431
01:36:57.880 --> 01:37:00.920
Oh okay, good, let's use
that now now know how the reaction is,

1432
01:37:01.039 --> 01:37:03.920
or we know that you're comfortable with
it, and now let's put it

1433
01:37:03.960 --> 01:37:10.560
on TV where you could have a
guy like let's just say it's right back

1434
01:37:10.800 --> 01:37:13.319
and you go, hey, man, we're going to go with this crocodile

1435
01:37:13.399 --> 01:37:15.920
dundee gimmick. But we want to
know kind of how how well you might

1436
01:37:15.960 --> 01:37:18.439
be able to do it, or
maybe he's not comfortable with him and go

1437
01:37:18.520 --> 01:37:21.159
listen, go out to the house
shows, let's try it out. Get

1438
01:37:21.159 --> 01:37:25.520
back to me, let me know
what you feel. And if if it

1439
01:37:25.600 --> 01:37:29.079
works, great, let's let's do
it. And if it doesn't, we

1440
01:37:29.159 --> 01:37:30.600
can even maybe he thinks it's great
and we watch it, we go,

1441
01:37:31.199 --> 01:37:34.199
oh, we're not going to go
there and then and if we don't.

1442
01:37:34.239 --> 01:37:39.319
So it's it's great to be able
to do that. It's not really used

1443
01:37:39.399 --> 01:37:44.560
that often, but it's definitely it's
definitely a way to do that. And

1444
01:37:44.600 --> 01:37:47.159
I don't watch enough NXT to know
or any of it really to even know

1445
01:37:47.239 --> 01:37:51.159
what it is doing over there.
Yeah, yeah, uh, defm for

1446
01:37:51.199 --> 01:37:54.239
one more quick corner, you got
to go. If it's a quick one,

1447
01:37:54.319 --> 01:37:57.119
Sure it is a quick one,
if you remember. Just wants to

1448
01:37:57.119 --> 01:38:00.479
know if the I'll paraphrase, if
the uh gimmick pay per view schedule like

1449
01:38:00.520 --> 01:38:04.119
we have this Sunday helps create guidelines
for you to write stories or gets in

1450
01:38:04.159 --> 01:38:08.439
the way of telling the stories at
the pace that you'd prefer, gets in

1451
01:38:08.439 --> 01:38:11.319
the way. I think, so, yeah, thank you for explanation that

1452
01:38:12.119 --> 01:38:17.000
you just start writing around the gimmick
pay per views as as opposed to writing

1453
01:38:17.319 --> 01:38:23.159
stories. And I think that you
know the gimmick mess is and you can

1454
01:38:23.239 --> 01:38:27.239
even extend the story. I think
we just lost John as he was moving

1455
01:38:27.279 --> 01:38:30.600
his way to his next appointment,
but we got the general sense of the

1456
01:38:30.600 --> 01:38:31.159
answer there. I don't know John, if you can still hear me,

1457
01:38:31.159 --> 01:38:33.600
but we can't hear you. But
he had a conference call at the top

1458
01:38:33.640 --> 01:38:35.680
of the hour, and we are
at the top of the hour. So

1459
01:38:35.720 --> 01:38:40.760
thanks to John Pimerini for joining me
today. Thanks to all the VPP members

1460
01:38:40.800 --> 01:38:44.239
for your continued support of what we
do here. Don't forget these audio shows

1461
01:38:44.279 --> 01:38:47.680
our copyright TDH Communications and progressing torchs
which means there to be stored now and

1462
01:38:48.079 --> 01:38:55.039
for eternity at PW torch dot com, slash members and other than of course,

1463
01:38:55.079 --> 01:38:57.359
if you're a paid BAP member and
you have it on your iPod or

1464
01:38:57.359 --> 01:39:00.439
computer for your personal listening enjoyment,
and we appreciate everybody a biting by that

1465
01:39:00.439 --> 01:39:04.880
and not distributing them elsewhere. On
that note, stay tuned VIP members for

1466
01:39:04.920 --> 01:39:09.920
Bruce Mitchell and I will be going
in depth on the Hell out of Cell

1467
01:39:09.920 --> 01:39:13.399
pay per view with our predictions for
the show and talk about Monday's raw that

1468
01:39:13.640 --> 01:39:16.600
is going to be recorded tonight and
so you can be able to lookout for

1469
01:39:16.640 --> 01:39:21.680
that this weekend. And that's it. So thanks again and we'll talk to

1470
01:39:21.680 --> 01:39:42.760
you next time. Invite you to
email the show with feedback or questions or

1471
01:39:42.760 --> 01:39:47.079
comments. That email address is Wade
Keller Podcast at pwtorch dot com. That's

1472
01:39:47.159 --> 01:39:51.399
Wadekeller Podcast at PW torch dot com. Also welcome your feedback on Twitter.

1473
01:39:51.520 --> 01:39:56.920
You can follow us on Twitter at
pw torch and follow me at the Wade

1474
01:39:57.000 --> 01:40:02.520
Keller that's at PW Torch and at
the e Wade Keller. Searching for more

1475
01:40:02.560 --> 01:40:06.279
great pro wrestling talk, then join
me. Jason Powell host them to three

1476
01:40:06.319 --> 01:40:11.359
weekly Pro Wrestling Boom Podcast. Each
week, he'll hear the latest news and

1477
01:40:11.399 --> 01:40:14.760
analysis from me and my team at
pro wrestling dot net along with other pro

1478
01:40:14.800 --> 01:40:18.560
wrestling media members. Plus, the
Pro Wrestling Boom Podcast features long form interviews

1479
01:40:18.640 --> 01:40:23.399
with notable names in the pro wrestling
industry. Subscribe and iTunes, Stitcher,

1480
01:40:23.560 --> 01:40:28.079
Downcast, and all your favorite secondary
apps, or visit us directly at PW

1481
01:40:28.079 --> 01:40:33.000
boom dot com. Once again,
that's PW boom dot com. Thanks for

1482
01:40:33.039 --> 01:40:36.880
listening to our podcast. Did you
know we also have a website pwtorch dot

1483
01:40:36.880 --> 01:40:42.319
com daily news updates, editorials,
and my live TV coverage covering Raw,

1484
01:40:42.399 --> 01:40:46.800
Dynamite and SmackDown, and my live
pay per view coverage for WWE and AEW.

1485
01:40:47.039 --> 01:40:50.039
Create a tab or bookmark make it
a daily stop. Visit us throughout

1486
01:40:50.079 --> 01:40:55.800
the day every day to keep up
on breaking news and more. That's pwtorch

1487
01:40:56.000 --> 01:41:00.000
dot com. Need an extra dose
of positivity in your wrestling podcasts, will

1488
01:41:00.039 --> 01:41:05.640
come join me Alan forel Over in
the Progress Paradise at Pterbo Torch VIP as

1489
01:41:05.680 --> 01:41:10.600
we mask on the bright side of
wrestling and focus on some of the great

1490
01:41:10.680 --> 01:41:14.760
matches and shows from around the world, be it the US, Japan,

1491
01:41:15.079 --> 01:41:18.640
Europe or Mexico. There's always a
place for restlings past in the Paradise too,

1492
01:41:18.880 --> 01:41:24.439
and we've done fun historical shows such
as the We Love Liger series celebrating

1493
01:41:24.439 --> 01:41:29.199
the glorious career of Jusian thunder Lighter
and Our Eye was There When shows where

1494
01:41:29.199 --> 01:41:31.479
our guests will join me to talk
about a classic bout that they were in

1495
01:41:31.520 --> 01:41:35.760
attendance for. We love variety and
you can expect lots of it at the

1496
01:41:35.760 --> 01:41:42.600
Progress Paradise. Detailed PW torch VIP
subscription information and a list of all the

1497
01:41:42.680 --> 01:41:47.279
VIP benefits is available at pterwrew torch
vipinfo dot com. And yes, all

1498
01:41:47.399 --> 01:41:54.399
VIP podcasts are compatible with popular podcast
apps on iPhone and Android devices, or

1499
01:41:54.479 --> 01:41:58.880
you can stream them directly from our
ad free VIP mobile site, See you

1500
01:41:58.880 --> 01:42:02.479
in the Paradise. One way that
you can help us sustain our schedule of

1501
01:42:02.520 --> 01:42:06.000
putting out podcasts throughout the week is
by giving us a five star rating on

1502
01:42:06.039 --> 01:42:10.640
Apple Podcasts. Just go to Apple
Podcasts and look for our Weight Keller Prosing

1503
01:42:10.680 --> 01:42:14.319
podcast and Weight Keller Prosing Post show
and give us a five star rating.

1504
01:42:14.399 --> 01:42:17.079
We hope you think we've earned that
score with our fast turnaround times and our

1505
01:42:17.159 --> 01:42:21.920
quantity and quality of wrestling analysis throughout
the week. So take a moment out

1506
01:42:21.960 --> 01:42:26.119
for us and do us favor and
give us a five star rating and Apple

1507
01:42:26.159 --> 01:42:30.159
Podcasts. That helps us on search
returns and helps us grow. And if

1508
01:42:30.159 --> 01:42:31.319
you want, you can add a
few comments about what you like about the

1509
01:42:31.319 --> 01:42:39.239
programs in the comments section. Thank
you so much. In twenty twelve,

1510
01:42:39.439 --> 01:42:45.000
NXT transitioned into the developmental system and
ultimately the brand you see today on the

1511
01:42:45.000 --> 01:42:49.560
Torch Vip podcast NXT eight years back. We'll be taking a weekly look at

1512
01:42:49.560 --> 01:42:55.680
this page in NXT's early history.
Join Kelly Wells and me Tom Stout from

1513
01:42:55.760 --> 01:43:00.199
PWT Talks NXT every Saturday as we
go eight years back to the day to

1514
01:43:00.279 --> 01:43:04.039
track NXT's rising talents and why they
did or didn't work out exclusively for PW

1515
01:43:04.079 --> 01:43:10.079
Torch VIP members. PW Torch VIP
membership doesn't just give you add free access

1516
01:43:10.119 --> 01:43:13.319
to these shows and a ton of
other VIP exclusive podcasts throughout the week,

1517
01:43:13.399 --> 01:43:16.720
but you also gain access to our
unmatched vast library of wrestling history, our

1518
01:43:16.720 --> 01:43:20.800
contemporaneous week to week coverage through our
progressing Torch weekly newsletters dating back to the

1519
01:43:20.880 --> 01:43:26.720
late nineteen eighties, along with streaming
and download access to hundreds of retro radio

1520
01:43:26.760 --> 01:43:30.239
shows from the nineteen nineties, including
some of my interviews with wrestling's top newsmakers

1521
01:43:30.239 --> 01:43:34.279
in the nineties, and also our
podcast library dating back to the year two

1522
01:43:34.319 --> 01:43:40.439
thousand and three. There's no larger, longer spanning pro wrestling podcast library than

1523
01:43:40.479 --> 01:43:44.760
that that comes with a PW Torch
VIP membership. Now approaching twenty years of

1524
01:43:44.800 --> 01:43:48.239
podcasting, Go VIP and dive into
our post pay per view Roundtables are coverage

1525
01:43:48.239 --> 01:43:53.640
of some of your favorite eras of
wrestling, top name long form interviews and

1526
01:43:53.760 --> 01:43:58.840
special format podcasts that we've done throughout
the years. PW torch dot com slash

1527
01:43:59.039 --> 01:44:01.159
go VIP. We have a streamline
sign up for me and you can pay

1528
01:44:01.199 --> 01:44:04.640
it with PayPal or directly with your
credit card or debit card. In one

1529
01:44:04.680 --> 01:44:08.439
or two minutes from right now,
you can be a VIP member and diving

1530
01:44:08.439 --> 01:44:13.600
into our library. PW torch dot
com slash go VIP. As I say

1531
01:44:13.600 --> 01:44:16.560
these words, my microwave is heating
up my latest Factor meal. It's the

1532
01:44:16.920 --> 01:44:20.359
chili, and it is a cool, rainy day here in Minnesota, and

1533
01:44:20.399 --> 01:44:25.920
I am looking forward to an easy
lunch because I take the Factor meal out

1534
01:44:25.920 --> 01:44:30.079
of the refrigerator fresh, never frozen, with wholesome ingredients, packed with nutrients

1535
01:44:30.119 --> 01:44:32.439
that will give me the energy to
make it through the workday, all the

1536
01:44:32.439 --> 01:44:36.840
way through watching wrestling tonight and hosting
the post show podcast. With a busy

1537
01:44:36.880 --> 01:44:41.199
fall season already in full swing,
you might be looking for wholesome, convenient

1538
01:44:41.239 --> 01:44:45.199
meals for jam pack days. Also, Factor America's number one ready to eat

1539
01:44:45.239 --> 01:44:49.000
meal kit can help you fuel up
fast for breakfast, lunch, and dinner.

1540
01:44:49.199 --> 01:44:54.279
With chef prepared, dietitian approved ready
to eat meals delivered straight to your

1541
01:44:54.279 --> 01:44:57.279
door. You'll save time, eat
well, and stay on track with your

1542
01:44:57.439 --> 01:45:00.680
healthy lifestyle. And like me,
you don't want to wait forty five minutes

1543
01:45:00.680 --> 01:45:02.239
for food to be delivered and agonized
over what kind of tip to give,

1544
01:45:02.279 --> 01:45:05.560
and then regret how much you spend
and eat fried food that ends up not

1545
01:45:05.640 --> 01:45:08.680
being all that hot by the time
you eat it, and you have to

1546
01:45:08.720 --> 01:45:12.479
microwave it anyway. So why not
have Factor deliver a week's worth of meals

1547
01:45:12.720 --> 01:45:15.600
to your door, as many as
you want and in whatever variety you want.

1548
01:45:15.600 --> 01:45:19.840
They have different themes, including vegan
meals and high protein meals and much

1549
01:45:19.880 --> 01:45:24.560
more. In fact, there's over
thirty five weekly flavor packed, fresh,

1550
01:45:24.640 --> 01:45:29.399
never frozen meals that promote a healthy
lifestyle in meet your meal preferences, all

1551
01:45:29.560 --> 01:45:32.680
again ready to eat in just two
minutes. They also offer not just dinner,

1552
01:45:32.680 --> 01:45:35.840
but lunch to go meals, effortless
wholesome meals like grain bowls and salad

1553
01:45:35.840 --> 01:45:40.760
toppers that are ready to eat when
you're on the go. No microwave required

1554
01:45:41.000 --> 01:45:43.840
in my microwave just beef to the
background. My food is ready. There's

1555
01:45:43.880 --> 01:45:47.239
also calorie smart meals with around or
less than five hundred and fifty calories per

1556
01:45:47.399 --> 01:45:51.199
serving, but with the nutrients you
need for the energy to get through the

1557
01:45:51.319 --> 01:45:55.520
day. You can also try protein
plus meals with thirty grands of protein or

1558
01:45:55.520 --> 01:45:59.079
more per serving if you're trying to
pack on some muscle from workouts at the

1559
01:45:59.079 --> 01:46:01.079
gym, and with Fact you can
rest ashirt. You're making a sustainable choice.

1560
01:46:01.079 --> 01:46:04.279
They offset one hundred percent of their
delivery emissions and source one hundred percent

1561
01:46:04.479 --> 01:46:11.319
renewable electricity for their production sites and
offices. So this October, get Factor

1562
01:46:11.359 --> 01:46:15.039
and enjoy eating well without the hassle. Choose your meals and enjoy fresh,

1563
01:46:15.079 --> 01:46:17.279
flavor packed meals delivered to your door, ready in just two minutes, no

1564
01:46:17.359 --> 01:46:23.520
prep, no mess. So head
to Factor Meals dot com slash wide fifty.

1565
01:46:23.840 --> 01:46:28.479
That's Factor Meals dot com slash weight
fifty and use code weigh fifty to

1566
01:46:28.560 --> 01:46:32.279
get fifty percent off. That's codeweight
fifty at Factor meals dot com slash weight

1567
01:46:32.319 --> 01:46:35.800
fifty to get fifty percent off.
Now I'm going to go have my delicious lunch