WEBVTT 1 00:00:30.719 --> 00:00:38.719 Welcome to destiny. Now here's your host, Cliff Dunning. Hey, how 2 00:00:38.719 --> 00:00:43.000 how are you? Come on in and have a seat. Today we're talking 3 00:00:43.119 --> 00:00:49.640 about a divination technique known as toro. And when I say divination, this 4 00:00:49.759 --> 00:00:56.200 is where you're working with the spirit, your guidance, your soul, and 5 00:00:57.119 --> 00:01:03.039 getting the answers to create a solution to know what's going on outside of your 6 00:01:03.079 --> 00:01:07.079 physical body. And Toro has been known about for a number of hundreds of 7 00:01:07.760 --> 00:01:11.680 hundreds of years, but we don't know how much further it goes back. 8 00:01:11.840 --> 00:01:19.040 When we say divination, we're asking higher wisdom, We're asking the elements, 9 00:01:19.079 --> 00:01:25.799 We're asking the other realities, the other dimensions to work with us. Tourou 10 00:01:25.959 --> 00:01:30.719 is like the ruins, the stone rooms that you throw and you get information 11 00:01:30.879 --> 00:01:38.359 from. It also relates to astrology, where you have planetary systems affecting you 12 00:01:38.359 --> 00:01:45.959 your biology. Current science doesn't really consider astrology as science, but we know 13 00:01:46.040 --> 00:01:52.400 that the Egyptians were very much involved with astrology. I always mentioned that the 14 00:01:52.439 --> 00:01:59.439 Hathor Temple at Dendera, Egypt, the entire observation deck, the ceiling of 15 00:01:59.480 --> 00:02:08.439 that building is one huge astrological chart. Actually is a gigantic carving that has 16 00:02:08.520 --> 00:02:14.599 all the figures, has the planets, has all the details, so that 17 00:02:14.639 --> 00:02:19.680 when they were looking into the heavens, they would could relate to it on 18 00:02:19.719 --> 00:02:25.039 a number of different scales. So our ancestors were very much involved with subtle 19 00:02:25.159 --> 00:02:35.520 energy, and today we're talking about the energy the information gained from using Tourou 20 00:02:35.719 --> 00:02:40.240 cards. One of the things that's challenging about Toro is that there are so 21 00:02:40.360 --> 00:02:46.919 many different decks and each deck has over seventy cards that you mix and you 22 00:02:47.039 --> 00:02:53.439 match and you hold on to you provided your intention for the cards. This 23 00:02:53.520 --> 00:02:58.319 is what I want to see. I want more information on. This is 24 00:02:58.319 --> 00:03:01.360 this relationship going to work out? Tell me about a new job, Tell 25 00:03:01.360 --> 00:03:06.840 me about the job I have now, Tell me about my finances. I 26 00:03:06.879 --> 00:03:10.840 don't feel well, what's going on? This is a way to step outside 27 00:03:10.879 --> 00:03:20.000 your body, step outside your physicality and get answers. And I don't use 28 00:03:20.039 --> 00:03:22.879 it enough. I used to use to roll a lot. I would pick 29 00:03:22.919 --> 00:03:28.439 a card every I think it was every week and ask for what you know, 30 00:03:28.479 --> 00:03:32.520 what can I look forward to? Sometimes it was right on, sometimes 31 00:03:32.520 --> 00:03:37.520 it was right on. And as we're going to hear today, the questions 32 00:03:37.599 --> 00:03:43.879 you pose when you're working with divination, divine spirit, divine information. Is 33 00:03:43.919 --> 00:03:47.840 that your question has to be phrased and composed in such a way that you 34 00:03:47.919 --> 00:03:53.800 get the maximum out of it. Questions like tell me yes, tell me 35 00:03:53.840 --> 00:03:58.639 now if this is going to happen, that it cannot be that type of 36 00:03:58.680 --> 00:04:01.000 a question. It has to be more are thought out. Some people go 37 00:04:01.080 --> 00:04:08.240 into quiet time meditation and come up with a question. The more detail you 38 00:04:08.280 --> 00:04:13.520 have in the question, the more information you're going to get back. And 39 00:04:13.599 --> 00:04:16.399 for those of you who don't believe in divination, all I can say is 40 00:04:17.199 --> 00:04:26.519 your ancestors used it of effectiveness, with great deal of clarity. We didn't 41 00:04:26.560 --> 00:04:32.639 have computers, we didn't have database storage systems with information, and in those 42 00:04:32.720 --> 00:04:43.240 times you were using the collective scene and unseen sources your higher wisdom, and 43 00:04:44.600 --> 00:04:49.040 it's more earth based energetics. Now, I talk a lot about energetics all 44 00:04:49.079 --> 00:04:53.439 the time. That can be reiki, which is healing. It can be 45 00:04:53.680 --> 00:04:57.120 yoga, it can be taichi, it can be body movements. Those are 46 00:04:57.160 --> 00:05:04.000 all energetic movements because you're moving energy when you're doing you're moving into those different 47 00:05:04.000 --> 00:05:12.199 positions to stretch the body. One of the big ones that's really important is 48 00:05:12.319 --> 00:05:17.759 meditation. And when you meditate, you're quieting the mind and opening it to 49 00:05:17.879 --> 00:05:25.759 receive healing. You're opening it to receive data, and you are connecting with 50 00:05:25.839 --> 00:05:31.759 your higher self. So those are all very very important techniques to gain quiet, 51 00:05:32.240 --> 00:05:40.040 to gain information, and to write questions down for to row reading. 52 00:05:41.000 --> 00:05:46.959 I have had to rough readings in the past, but I tend to go 53 00:05:47.079 --> 00:05:53.759 for more in depth analysis. And that's where you go to a noted astrologer 54 00:05:54.879 --> 00:05:59.800 and you give them the date, the time, the place you were born, 55 00:06:00.079 --> 00:06:10.800 and other details about yourself that allows them to create computations on what planets 56 00:06:10.920 --> 00:06:19.839 are influencing you, what those planets typically do positive negative, and what is 57 00:06:19.879 --> 00:06:30.199 a tendency of those energies on your physical body. And again, wellness relationship 58 00:06:30.240 --> 00:06:36.839 relationships are huge work pleasure trends. You know, there's some people that go 59 00:06:36.920 --> 00:06:44.680 to an astrologer don't want to know what the financial trends are. It's useful 60 00:06:44.680 --> 00:06:47.319 for a lot of stuff. And you know, there's been some United States 61 00:06:47.399 --> 00:06:53.920 presidents, I think most notably Ron and Nancy Reagan had an astrologer that would 62 00:06:54.040 --> 00:06:58.279 visit the White House on a regular basis. I shouldn't be laughing. This 63 00:06:58.439 --> 00:07:03.199 is fun. It's great fun. We need more of that in our struggling 64 00:07:04.360 --> 00:07:10.120 culture here in the United States where we have one side against the other right 65 00:07:10.160 --> 00:07:17.639 now politically divided as ideally philosophically divided as well. We need more humor. 66 00:07:18.199 --> 00:07:26.879 We really need more humor that opens things up, enlightens up the environment, 67 00:07:27.079 --> 00:07:33.560 and gives us pause to consider what the hell we're doing. So today's program 68 00:07:33.600 --> 00:07:40.480 deals with sol energy and the book we are talking about is called Soul Journey 69 00:07:40.600 --> 00:07:47.240 through the Ureau Key to a Complete Spiritual Practice, integrating Numerology, astrology, 70 00:07:47.879 --> 00:07:56.839 cabal and the Contemplative Life. And my guest is John Sandbach. Now listen 71 00:07:56.879 --> 00:08:01.959 to what he has to say regarding energy to work with divination and how it 72 00:08:01.000 --> 00:08:41.879 can open things up and make life a lot more pleasurable. Up until recently 73 00:08:41.960 --> 00:08:46.960 we've had a number of authors on the program who are talking about divination. 74 00:08:48.159 --> 00:08:52.159 This is working with energetics, getting a sense of where your karma is, 75 00:08:52.399 --> 00:09:00.639 are you processing, are you working with your own surrounding helpers, scene and 76 00:09:00.919 --> 00:09:07.200 unseen, And that is numerology and astrology, and even some people have been 77 00:09:07.720 --> 00:09:13.200 looking at channeled material. These are people that go into a state of full 78 00:09:13.440 --> 00:09:18.879 trance or partial trance and are getting information today. We're talking about a very 79 00:09:18.360 --> 00:09:26.960 interesting and actually provocative divinations known as terreu. And my guest today has written 80 00:09:26.000 --> 00:09:33.919 a book called Soul Journey through the Terurou key to a complete spiritual practice integrating 81 00:09:35.279 --> 00:09:37.679 listen to this. This is what makes this book kind of cool, integrating 82 00:09:37.759 --> 00:09:45.360 numerology, astrology, cabal and the contemplative life. And this is a lot 83 00:09:45.759 --> 00:09:50.679 to tackle, but my guest today has made it very easy to read and 84 00:09:50.799 --> 00:09:56.559 understand. My guest is John Sandbach. He has written quite a few books 85 00:09:56.600 --> 00:10:01.159 before this one. He wrote The Circular Temple and Astrology, Alchemy and the 86 00:10:01.240 --> 00:10:09.000 Tourou And he is a highly respected astrologer and touro researcher and has been working 87 00:10:09.039 --> 00:10:15.240 professionally in these fields for over fifty five years. And he's coming to us 88 00:10:15.279 --> 00:10:20.559 today from Kansas City, Missouri. John, Welcome to Destiny. Great they 89 00:10:20.600 --> 00:10:22.919 have you on the program. I'm so very happy to be here. What's 90 00:10:24.000 --> 00:10:31.039 the weather like in Kansas City today? It's been amazingly warm, has it. 91 00:10:31.039 --> 00:10:35.120 It's been doing really well. It's kind of eerie for December. It 92 00:10:35.159 --> 00:10:37.879 should be cold with the wind blowing and snowfalling. I was just gonna say, 93 00:10:37.879 --> 00:10:41.960 don't you guys usually have snow by about this time? Oh yeah, 94 00:10:41.080 --> 00:10:46.759 we haven't had any and there's still leaves on trees. Yeah, so that's 95 00:10:46.840 --> 00:10:54.480 kind of strange. Huh wow. Talk about tourou why is it an important 96 00:10:54.960 --> 00:10:58.200 tool for integrating the scene and in the end the scene, talk a little 97 00:10:58.240 --> 00:11:07.919 bit about your interest in it. Well. So, I believe that underlying 98 00:11:09.080 --> 00:11:16.440 all of life are patterns and energies at work that are basically hidden. It's 99 00:11:16.559 --> 00:11:22.399 kind of like in your body. You know, all these subtle chemical processes 100 00:11:22.399 --> 00:11:26.120 are going on in your brain and your liver, your other internal organs, 101 00:11:26.759 --> 00:11:33.960 and it's all unseen. But if we can tap into it and get in 102 00:11:33.080 --> 00:11:39.639 tune with it, we can support and enhance what's trying to happen. And 103 00:11:41.360 --> 00:11:48.120 Marishi Mahashoki says that the most important says, the strongest force in the universe 104 00:11:48.480 --> 00:11:54.000 is the force of evolution. That is, we're all headed toward enlightenment, 105 00:11:54.639 --> 00:11:58.799 and the Buddhists tell us we're all going to make it. We know where 106 00:11:58.799 --> 00:12:03.480 we're going, and so the question is a how we're going to get there 107 00:12:03.600 --> 00:12:07.440 and be how long it's going to take, but we're going to get there. 108 00:12:07.960 --> 00:12:13.799 And so the tarot helps to see patterns in life, and it helps 109 00:12:15.399 --> 00:12:22.000 with getting in contact with angelic forces and spiritual forces so that we can align 110 00:12:22.080 --> 00:12:26.879 with those which then will enhance our own evolution. That's how I see the 111 00:12:26.919 --> 00:12:33.519 tarot. It's got so much packing, the each card and each description, 112 00:12:33.720 --> 00:12:39.320 and there's different books out there, But in its essence, John, why 113 00:12:39.919 --> 00:12:46.320 who developed it? If you can even answer that? And because you you 114 00:12:46.320 --> 00:12:52.240 you talk about some very ancient individuals that are part of part of it, 115 00:12:52.440 --> 00:12:56.919 and I'm just curious, give us your best guess as to how they came 116 00:12:56.960 --> 00:13:05.240 about as a divination tool. Okay, So there's one side of that is 117 00:13:05.320 --> 00:13:11.399 the researcher's side. Who would a researcher looking at objective information like historical facts, 118 00:13:13.600 --> 00:13:20.200 And then the other side would be an intuitive, visionary approach to the 119 00:13:20.240 --> 00:13:24.360 whole thing. When it comes to the actual facts, there's so little there, 120 00:13:26.240 --> 00:13:31.600 you know. These cards appeared in Italy in the fourteenth century, and 121 00:13:33.840 --> 00:13:39.000 the first decks we have of them are just partial, you know, and 122 00:13:39.039 --> 00:13:46.720 then later the regular playing cards were added to what's called the major arcana. 123 00:13:48.519 --> 00:13:54.720 We don't really know exactly where they came from. I have beliefs about that. 124 00:13:54.879 --> 00:14:01.320 I believe that they're associated with Kabbala, that they came from the Kabbalistic 125 00:14:01.440 --> 00:14:09.200 tradition. You know, there's twenty two major Arcana cards, and the Zohar, 126 00:14:09.480 --> 00:14:18.159 which is the most important text on Kabbalah, is twenty two volumes, 127 00:14:18.080 --> 00:14:24.440 and each one of those volumes corresponds to one of the major Arcanic cards. 128 00:14:26.960 --> 00:14:37.960 So in a sense, the Tarot is and abridged Zohar. It contains the 129 00:14:37.000 --> 00:14:43.720 whole of the knowledge of the Zohar in that cards, and it's very It's 130 00:14:43.879 --> 00:14:50.200 primary base, I believe is numerology. Numerology is a very very important part 131 00:14:50.200 --> 00:14:54.919 of the Tarot. I personally have had visions of how it came from Fez 132 00:14:56.679 --> 00:15:01.799 in North Africa, the city of Fez. There were a group of Kabbalists 133 00:15:01.799 --> 00:15:09.240 who lived there who developed the whole thing and then disseminated it out from there. 134 00:15:09.039 --> 00:15:15.120 So you made a very good point. There's been cards. The actual 135 00:15:15.200 --> 00:15:22.559 cards have been found in different parts of Europe, and then the defining of 136 00:15:22.600 --> 00:15:30.600 the cards are what they mean, have been found in old books in different 137 00:15:30.600 --> 00:15:35.639 parts of the world. That was your suggestion, Okay, Yeah, and 138 00:15:37.039 --> 00:15:41.120 the probably the oldest book I go back to when I look at the cards 139 00:15:41.200 --> 00:15:46.200 is the separate Yetserah, which is a kabalistic book, and I go back 140 00:15:46.240 --> 00:15:52.039 to that for the numerology. It has the Hebrew letters associated with the first 141 00:15:52.120 --> 00:15:56.960 twenty two numbers, numbers one through twenty two, and the astrological signs and 142 00:15:58.080 --> 00:16:07.200 planets. So that becomes a groundwork for then building all these other ideas connected 143 00:16:07.240 --> 00:16:10.960 with the tarot. Okay so and and by the way, for you those 144 00:16:11.000 --> 00:16:18.080 of you listening John's book Souls or Sole Journey through the Tarurou is an enhanced 145 00:16:18.720 --> 00:16:22.799 description of each card. It's not the actual cards itself. And that leads 146 00:16:22.840 --> 00:16:25.960 to my next question. John, and you talk a little bit about this 147 00:16:26.000 --> 00:16:30.120 in the introduction. There's so many versions of the card. There's people that 148 00:16:30.159 --> 00:16:37.519 are in fact, you reproduce some cards from a client or a person who's 149 00:16:37.159 --> 00:16:41.480 an artist that you worked with that had, you know, painted these wonderful 150 00:16:41.679 --> 00:16:49.159 figures and then they are a card. But how does the uninitiated select a 151 00:16:49.320 --> 00:16:56.000 deck to work with, because that's the key is choosing a deck. Well, 152 00:16:56.039 --> 00:16:57.399 if you're going to work with the tarot, one of the first things 153 00:16:57.440 --> 00:17:03.080 I'd say is that some of the decks out there don't have seventy eight cards. 154 00:17:03.359 --> 00:17:07.359 A tarot deck has seventy eight cards. So if you want to work 155 00:17:07.359 --> 00:17:11.640 with the tarot, you want a seventy eight card deck. And then beyond 156 00:17:11.720 --> 00:17:21.880 that, it's about choosing whatever you feel drawn to, whatever whatever calls to 157 00:17:22.000 --> 00:17:29.599 you. A very very good tarot deck to use that goes very well with 158 00:17:29.799 --> 00:17:34.240 my system of working is the Church of Light deck developed by C. C. 159 00:17:34.480 --> 00:17:38.920 Zin and it's a black and white deck. The most color deck, 160 00:17:40.720 --> 00:17:45.359 no color, no. The most popular tarot deck is the Arthur Edward Waite 161 00:17:45.599 --> 00:17:53.240 deck, and I think that's a very good deck. They have one reversal 162 00:17:53.359 --> 00:18:00.400 in there where they've reversed our canon eight and eleven, but other than that, 163 00:18:00.079 --> 00:18:04.880 it's a good deck. So that's one of my criticisms of it. 164 00:18:04.960 --> 00:18:11.000 I don't like that reversal. I put them back where they were in the 165 00:18:11.000 --> 00:18:15.680 older decks, just the eight and the eleven switched. And then the other 166 00:18:15.720 --> 00:18:18.640 thing I don't like about the Weight deck is it kind of in the minor 167 00:18:18.799 --> 00:18:26.039 arcanum. It has some negativity going on, some negative stuff. And I 168 00:18:26.079 --> 00:18:30.960 went back we recently and read about this, and you know, Pamela Coleman 169 00:18:30.079 --> 00:18:34.400 Smith was the designer of that deck, working under Arthur Edward Waite, and 170 00:18:34.480 --> 00:18:40.559 she asked him, she said, with the minor arcana, what are you 171 00:18:40.559 --> 00:18:41.319 going to do with these? And he said, oh, I don't care, 172 00:18:41.680 --> 00:18:45.880 just do whatever pictures you want. In other words, he wasn't so 173 00:18:47.000 --> 00:18:49.920 interested in the minor arcana. So she did. She did what she wanted, 174 00:18:51.400 --> 00:18:57.519 and for instance, the Tent of Swords is a picture of this black 175 00:18:57.680 --> 00:19:08.799 sky with this man lying face down with ten swords stuck in him, and 176 00:19:08.839 --> 00:19:12.839 it's pretty more bid. There is no one tarot card that is good or 177 00:19:12.920 --> 00:19:19.359 bad. These are energies, and so you can use any of the energies 178 00:19:19.359 --> 00:19:25.119 in a good way or you can use them in a negative way. And 179 00:19:25.160 --> 00:19:29.480 so putting off that negativity on that card is disturbing to me. I don't 180 00:19:29.559 --> 00:19:32.759 like it. I can see why, because they're all stuck in the guy 181 00:19:32.960 --> 00:19:34.960 and it's like, well, he's not bleeding, but yeah, what do 182 00:19:36.000 --> 00:19:38.079 you do when you're doing a reading for somebody, you turn that card over? 183 00:19:40.880 --> 00:19:44.720 I mean, I've had that happen before. And even when I say 184 00:19:44.720 --> 00:19:48.240 to the person, oh, you know, this card does have a positive 185 00:19:48.359 --> 00:19:51.920 side, and the positive side is thus and so, and I explained it 186 00:19:51.960 --> 00:19:56.160 to them, they'll look at the card and be like worried, you know, 187 00:19:56.759 --> 00:20:02.839 magnify apprehension and fear and like that. So that's why I don't like 188 00:20:02.880 --> 00:20:07.319 to wait deck. So really I have to say that the one deck I 189 00:20:07.359 --> 00:20:11.240 really approve of is the Church of Light deck. Now, the deck that 190 00:20:11.359 --> 00:20:18.000 I'm currently using and I just started using, is this one. And it's 191 00:20:18.039 --> 00:20:26.559 called the Abstract Futures Tearot, and all the cards are abstract paintings and they're 192 00:20:26.559 --> 00:20:33.279 based on the paintings of the female artist Hilma af Klint, who is a 193 00:20:33.440 --> 00:20:41.200 Swedish painter and a mystic and her paintings are extremely metaphysical, very mystical. 194 00:20:42.000 --> 00:20:48.880 And on the front of the box it says by Hilma's ghost at the bottom. 195 00:20:51.160 --> 00:20:56.319 And so these two women what they did was they painted these paintings, 196 00:20:56.359 --> 00:21:02.680 these seventy eight paintings, and they channeled the energy of the cards from Hilma 197 00:21:02.720 --> 00:21:07.039 off Clint, who is deceased. And I just they're pretty, they're very 198 00:21:07.519 --> 00:21:11.079 show one. Let's take a look at one. Okay, this is the 199 00:21:11.119 --> 00:21:15.079 Tower. Oh interesting, Okay, they're very simple, look, very abstract. 200 00:21:15.400 --> 00:21:22.880 Very simple and they have a very calm vibration. This is the world. 201 00:21:26.119 --> 00:21:30.640 Yeah, I'll show you one more. This is a the four Cups 202 00:21:32.119 --> 00:21:38.200 and this is called Abstract Future, the Abstract Futures deck. The only problem 203 00:21:38.279 --> 00:21:42.920 with this deck does it costs one hundred dollars? Oh my god. It 204 00:21:44.000 --> 00:21:48.119 must be limited reproductions, the limited edition and it's it's an art piece. 205 00:21:48.559 --> 00:21:52.559 Yeah, but I love the deck, So I got it. Talk a 206 00:21:52.599 --> 00:21:59.640 little bit John about the the major and the minor arcanas, because that's the 207 00:21:59.720 --> 00:22:07.160 key. What does that mean when someone's pulling these cards, What does that 208 00:22:07.279 --> 00:22:12.640 mean when they have a major or minor arcana. Well, the major arcana 209 00:22:12.839 --> 00:22:22.880 shows universal principles, like in a pure form, whereas I would say that 210 00:22:22.000 --> 00:22:30.000 the minor arcana shows universal principles principles in an applied form, how they apply 211 00:22:30.279 --> 00:22:40.359 to outer reality and how they apply in specific contexts and situations. So the 212 00:22:40.400 --> 00:22:47.440 major arcana is more the pure form of the energy. Now, so in 213 00:22:47.519 --> 00:22:52.559 the tarot, in the minor arcana, there are four suits and they go 214 00:22:52.599 --> 00:22:57.799 with the elements fire, air, earth, and water, which is fire, 215 00:22:57.880 --> 00:23:06.279 creativity, earth, physicality, air, mind, thought, connection, 216 00:23:07.559 --> 00:23:14.119 and water emotion. But now in traditional metaphysics, we have a fifth element 217 00:23:15.079 --> 00:23:19.920 called the quintessence, and the fifth element is the one that harmonizes all the 218 00:23:19.960 --> 00:23:26.640 other four, brings them all four into coherence and connection. And the fifth 219 00:23:26.680 --> 00:23:33.279 element is the major ar canon. So the major ar can of those twenty 220 00:23:33.319 --> 00:23:40.640 two cards are the great harmonizing elements for our world. You can think of 221 00:23:40.680 --> 00:23:48.119 it that way. Okay, So when someone's working on their own and they're 222 00:23:48.039 --> 00:23:55.599 wanting to do a reading, do they pull I mean we just started mentioning 223 00:23:55.599 --> 00:23:59.319 you mis mentioned that you pull one card a day for yourself. Yes, 224 00:23:59.440 --> 00:24:07.119 But somebody who's new, can they pull more than one card? Or can 225 00:24:07.119 --> 00:24:11.359 they do a past president future? Yes? Well, talk a little bit 226 00:24:11.400 --> 00:24:15.720 about how they can work with it and how what you describe for the newbie, 227 00:24:15.759 --> 00:24:22.319 for the for the uninitiated user. Well, probably the most common sort 228 00:24:22.319 --> 00:24:25.319 of reading that I do, or that I do the most frequently, is 229 00:24:25.359 --> 00:24:27.799 a three card reading. And it's just like what you said. The first 230 00:24:27.880 --> 00:24:33.640 card is the past, and it's also the groundwork of the situation, the 231 00:24:33.680 --> 00:24:41.000 background of the situation. The middle card or second card would be the present. 232 00:24:41.599 --> 00:24:45.119 In other words, it's what's going on, what's at work here, 233 00:24:47.240 --> 00:24:52.160 And then the third card is where is it going? What is the pull 234 00:24:52.319 --> 00:25:00.799 forward into the future. And then since each card has a number, you 235 00:25:00.839 --> 00:25:06.920 can add the numbers on the cards and that will give you an overall feeling 236 00:25:07.039 --> 00:25:15.079 for what's going on. Like let's say your cards add up to twenty six. 237 00:25:15.559 --> 00:25:19.279 Well, then you add the digits of twenty six two plus six is 238 00:25:19.319 --> 00:25:26.279 eight, and that tells you that the overall feeling, the overall energy of 239 00:25:26.319 --> 00:25:33.920 that three card reading isn't eight and eight goes with Capricorn. Eight goes with 240 00:25:34.160 --> 00:25:45.400 practicality, it goes with being careful. So fascinating. Any questions about that, 241 00:25:45.720 --> 00:25:49.839 Yeah, I want to I'm looking at this from I mean, I've 242 00:25:49.920 --> 00:25:55.319 used to Rocos. I want those who are listening to get a sense of 243 00:25:55.359 --> 00:26:00.240 why these cards are important, what they've been embellished with, and when you 244 00:26:00.359 --> 00:26:07.559 actually begin working with them, it's not only your energetic feel that is imbuing 245 00:26:08.400 --> 00:26:14.160 the information. You're also pulling from source, right, Yeah, exactly, 246 00:26:14.519 --> 00:26:18.599 and talk about that, because this is what makes Toroso powerful, is the 247 00:26:18.720 --> 00:26:29.880 fact that there are others in your energy field or sphere that may be influencing 248 00:26:29.920 --> 00:26:33.720 the outcome. Talk about that. I'd say that again, place last part 249 00:26:33.000 --> 00:26:42.640 there could be energies or influences that could be influencing your outcome or the outcome 250 00:26:42.640 --> 00:26:51.279 of the question, yes, that is true, you know. So it's 251 00:26:51.640 --> 00:26:53.640 in a way it's a little harder for me to do readings for myself and 252 00:26:53.759 --> 00:26:59.400 for other people because one of the things that influences the outcome is your desire, 253 00:27:00.200 --> 00:27:04.680 yeah, you know. Or for instance, I want to tell someone. 254 00:27:04.839 --> 00:27:10.119 I want to give someone good good news or make them feel good. 255 00:27:10.680 --> 00:27:17.200 So let's say that they say, oh, I'm going to this new job 256 00:27:17.480 --> 00:27:21.640 and I want to know how it'll be, and maybe I turned the cards 257 00:27:21.640 --> 00:27:26.799 and what I see is this is a dead end. It's not probably the 258 00:27:26.880 --> 00:27:30.640 job you're meant to be in or something like that. You know, that 259 00:27:30.680 --> 00:27:36.720 can be that could be hard to deliver that information to the end of yeah, 260 00:27:36.759 --> 00:27:40.519 how do you how do you soften the blow on that? As well? 261 00:27:40.880 --> 00:27:45.799 I tell them, I say, I'll say things like be open to 262 00:27:45.920 --> 00:27:53.519 the changes afoot, be open to alternative possibilities, or maybe I'll say something 263 00:27:53.559 --> 00:27:59.680 like maybe you won't be at this job that long, you know, or 264 00:28:00.400 --> 00:28:04.480 you know. One of the most powerful ways of approaching the tarot is to 265 00:28:04.519 --> 00:28:11.079 ask the question, what am I to learn from this. Oh that's good. 266 00:28:11.200 --> 00:28:18.839 Yeah, Because let's say you have a negative situation in your life. 267 00:28:19.480 --> 00:28:26.319 If you learn what you need to learn from that situation, it tends strongly 268 00:28:26.359 --> 00:28:32.160 to make the situation go away, because then if you learn what you need 269 00:28:32.200 --> 00:28:37.960 to learn, you don't need that situation anymore. So focusing on what you 270 00:28:38.039 --> 00:28:45.440 need to learn can be a really great way to approach the tarot. What 271 00:28:45.640 --> 00:28:49.519 came through you as you were writing this? Because I see you've written each 272 00:28:51.240 --> 00:28:55.519 card and you have a description. What will you I mean, you talk 273 00:28:55.559 --> 00:29:00.960 about channeling, but that's a lot of channeling to write a whole book. 274 00:29:00.240 --> 00:29:03.279 But I mean, yes, you're a creative person, and so it does 275 00:29:03.440 --> 00:29:08.119 you know, you flow with the energy probably on a regular basis. But 276 00:29:08.240 --> 00:29:11.200 what were you channeling when you were writing the book? Do you have a 277 00:29:11.279 --> 00:29:19.559 sense because you do mention Hermes here his energy or that God's energy may have 278 00:29:21.160 --> 00:29:26.519 permeated you talk a bit about it, would you? Well, my experience 279 00:29:26.559 --> 00:29:34.599 of channeling is as I'm writing, I will get this feeling of like, 280 00:29:34.880 --> 00:29:40.039 yes, oh, yes, this is it, this is that's what you 281 00:29:40.119 --> 00:29:42.920 need to say, And then I'll start saying something else and I'll get a 282 00:29:45.119 --> 00:29:49.000 kind of like it's hitting a dull note or something, or there's a weakness 283 00:29:49.039 --> 00:29:52.519 there, there's a lack of energy, and that's I feel like what that 284 00:29:52.680 --> 00:29:56.079 is is the spirit saying to me, No, you know that's not so 285 00:29:56.160 --> 00:30:00.640 important, or don't you don't need to go there, or you can leave 286 00:30:00.680 --> 00:30:04.039 that out or whatever like that. And of course, as I'm telling you 287 00:30:04.160 --> 00:30:07.640 this, I'm taking a certain amount of time to tell you. When it 288 00:30:07.720 --> 00:30:14.599 happens to me, it's very fast. I mean it's quick download, yes, 289 00:30:14.920 --> 00:30:17.839 yes, like go here, this is what you need to say, 290 00:30:17.880 --> 00:30:19.519 This is what you need to put across. This is the way you need 291 00:30:19.559 --> 00:30:26.039 to say it. Yeah, like that. And that happens in readings too 292 00:30:26.119 --> 00:30:32.240 all the time, where I'll start saying things to people. And you know, 293 00:30:32.359 --> 00:30:36.160 one of the things that CC Zane said, bless his heart because it's 294 00:30:36.240 --> 00:30:41.359 so important. He said, if you're doing a reading and your intuition is 295 00:30:41.480 --> 00:30:48.279 telling you something that seems to go against the cards, go with your intuition. 296 00:30:49.680 --> 00:30:57.079 Your intuition trumps the cards. Wow, that your intuition is so important. 297 00:30:57.400 --> 00:31:03.000 And I think that one of the most important things for human evolution as 298 00:31:03.039 --> 00:31:08.400 a whole right now is that we all need to develop our intuition more. 299 00:31:11.799 --> 00:31:15.359 And the way we do that is we get in touch more with our inner 300 00:31:15.440 --> 00:31:22.319 life. I think so much unhappiness in the world, so much of the 301 00:31:22.359 --> 00:31:30.400 sorrow and the depression and those negative things, is due to people not being 302 00:31:30.400 --> 00:31:37.079 able to connect with their own inner world, because that the Indian mystics tell 303 00:31:37.160 --> 00:31:44.160 us that the Indian the inner world, when we really fully connect with it, 304 00:31:44.240 --> 00:31:51.400 is the source of endless bliss. It's beautiful, you know, and 305 00:31:51.480 --> 00:31:55.200 we need to bring that beauty out into the world and let it form our 306 00:31:55.240 --> 00:31:59.240 world in a beautiful way. If you're not a meditator, and you just 307 00:31:59.359 --> 00:32:04.079 mentioned when we started, Maharishi mesh Yogi, who is my guru, I 308 00:32:04.519 --> 00:32:06.960 learned trans I'm so happy to hear that. How well. Well, when 309 00:32:07.000 --> 00:32:10.680 I learned transitental meditation when I was eighteen, so I was. I know, 310 00:32:12.119 --> 00:32:15.680 I've been meditating for a long time. But for those who don't meditate, 311 00:32:15.799 --> 00:32:20.519 John, how do they tap in? Do they close their eyes and 312 00:32:20.599 --> 00:32:24.079 ask for support? What is your suggestion for those who are not aligned with 313 00:32:24.160 --> 00:32:30.279 Eastern philosophy? You know, I think a person that answered that question very 314 00:32:30.279 --> 00:32:37.119 well is Eckhart told and what he said was. One good way is follow 315 00:32:37.119 --> 00:32:43.039 your breath, just observe your breath, just just track it with your attention. 316 00:32:43.240 --> 00:32:46.839 Just put your attention on your breath. Another way is to just put 317 00:32:46.839 --> 00:32:52.799 your attention on your body, like what am I feeling? You know, 318 00:32:52.839 --> 00:32:55.839 what what am I feeling? What's my body doing? What's what am I 319 00:32:55.960 --> 00:33:00.680 sensing going on in it? You know, don't try to think about what 320 00:33:00.720 --> 00:33:05.720 it is or anything like that. Just experience it. And then the ultimate 321 00:33:05.759 --> 00:33:15.039 way is to just experience the void. If you can tap into the void, 322 00:33:15.039 --> 00:33:21.640 you've got it made. So somebody who's not into any of this spiritual 323 00:33:21.720 --> 00:33:25.319 or metaphysics tapping into the void, how would they go about doing it? 324 00:33:25.319 --> 00:33:37.519 They're sitting quietly, uninterrupted, and then what that's a good question. Transcendental 325 00:33:37.559 --> 00:33:42.799 meditation takes you into the void. That's a set up to that, and 326 00:33:45.000 --> 00:33:52.279 everything comes from the void. Okay, here's the deal. Become two people. 327 00:33:53.920 --> 00:33:58.640 You know, one of you is thinking, whereas you know the thoughts 328 00:33:58.640 --> 00:34:02.519 are coming, coming, coming, coming. Also become the observer. Just 329 00:34:02.720 --> 00:34:10.280 watch your thoughts. When you're watching your thoughts, that that'll take you into 330 00:34:10.280 --> 00:34:17.440 the void. Mm hmm. Just just observe your your mind thinking don't try 331 00:34:17.480 --> 00:34:22.920 to stop it, don't try to fight with it or control it or something 332 00:34:23.000 --> 00:34:29.400 like that. Just watch what and when I say thoughts, I mean emotions 333 00:34:29.440 --> 00:34:35.199 too. Watch the feelings coming up. Just observe. It's so simple, 334 00:34:36.920 --> 00:34:43.239 it's very simple. I want you to think about that. I mean, 335 00:34:44.159 --> 00:34:47.400 you sound like you're a meditator because you brought up maharishi. Uh. If 336 00:34:47.480 --> 00:34:52.800 you're a meditator, you I've been telling people since I started this podcast that 337 00:34:52.880 --> 00:35:00.000 they need to seek and learn a real simple form of meditative practice because it's 338 00:35:00.000 --> 00:35:07.000 extremely important to quiet the brain, quiet the mind. And I have been 339 00:35:07.039 --> 00:35:13.519 practicing for over thirty years, and I have benefits I can't describe. Yeah, 340 00:35:14.000 --> 00:35:16.239 I believe that it was about ten years ago that they did. It 341 00:35:16.320 --> 00:35:22.079 might have been longer that they did scientific studies that show it actually does it 342 00:35:22.159 --> 00:35:27.280 heals you. It heals you, Yes, and it helps you process data? 343 00:35:27.960 --> 00:35:31.519 Oh yes, yes. And you know I was reading in one book 344 00:35:31.559 --> 00:35:37.440 I even forget what book it was, but it said that when you go 345 00:35:37.599 --> 00:35:42.119 into the void, when you finally align you know, with the emptiness, 346 00:35:43.119 --> 00:35:47.400 what it does is it releases karma. In other words, any negative karma 347 00:35:47.480 --> 00:35:53.000 you're carrying holding on to it, releases it. And that's why it's such 348 00:35:53.039 --> 00:36:00.480 a wonderful thing to do, to do a simple meditation releases karma without identifying 349 00:36:00.519 --> 00:36:06.440 what the karma is, just because karma's layered, you know, exactly. 350 00:36:07.440 --> 00:36:10.519 So maybe that's an interesting statement. I've never heard that before, you know, 351 00:36:10.559 --> 00:36:15.559 one of my favorite things that Maharishi said about you know, well, 352 00:36:15.920 --> 00:36:19.800 you have to release this and you kind of like someone was talking about having 353 00:36:19.840 --> 00:36:22.920 to know what it is or whatever, and Maurice said, oh no, 354 00:36:22.119 --> 00:36:25.000 to release karma, he says, you don't have to know what it is. 355 00:36:25.320 --> 00:36:29.559 He says, it's like taking the trash out. You don't have to 356 00:36:29.679 --> 00:36:37.119 know what's in the trash bag to carry it to the curb. That's a 357 00:36:37.159 --> 00:36:39.480 good point. Yeah, I mean, that's why we're here physically, is 358 00:36:39.519 --> 00:36:45.920 that we're working on our karma. We're going to take a short commercial break 359 00:36:45.960 --> 00:36:52.519 and we will return with my guest today, John Sandbach, discussing his new 360 00:36:52.519 --> 00:37:37.159 book, Sole Journey through the Toureau. Will be right back. My guest 361 00:37:37.199 --> 00:37:40.440 today is author John Sandbach, who has written a book on to row. 362 00:37:42.239 --> 00:37:47.400 John is a lifelong astrologer but also has been practicing to row for many, 363 00:37:47.440 --> 00:37:53.760 many many years, and this book is a condensed version of his understanding and 364 00:37:53.960 --> 00:38:01.360 his teachings of the practice. John, let's talk talk about a few cards. 365 00:38:01.360 --> 00:38:07.639 Somebody has decided to do a past president future review on their own and 366 00:38:07.679 --> 00:38:12.679 they pull a couple of cards. Can you address one or two? Let's 367 00:38:12.760 --> 00:38:16.119 let's talk about the messenger, the mangus. What happens when we pull the 368 00:38:16.960 --> 00:38:22.440 messenger? What does that mean? Well, you know, the Kabala has 369 00:38:22.480 --> 00:38:27.360 the idea of seeds that in the beginning is the seed. Yeah, so 370 00:38:27.760 --> 00:38:31.519 the messenger card is the first card, and so it's the seed of the 371 00:38:31.559 --> 00:38:38.480 whole taro. And the messenger card is ruled by mercury. And it's about 372 00:38:38.519 --> 00:38:50.559 communication. And one of the things it takes to really perfectly communicate is flexibility. 373 00:38:52.800 --> 00:38:54.880 You need to be flexible. So what that card is telling you to 374 00:38:54.960 --> 00:39:05.880 do is be flexible, be open information, Uh, communicate, say what's 375 00:39:05.960 --> 00:39:08.880 on your mind to the people who need to hear it. Would you say 376 00:39:08.920 --> 00:39:14.000 as a reader that when you pull the card on somebody, it's saying be 377 00:39:14.239 --> 00:39:19.559 less reticent. Speak out your mind, is what you're suggesting. Speak your 378 00:39:19.559 --> 00:39:25.360 mind exactly. And also another thing about that card is stay in the moment, 379 00:39:28.000 --> 00:39:31.079 in the moment, and because it's in the moment that communication happens, 380 00:39:31.719 --> 00:39:37.679 that's where it happens. So track with what the other person is saying. 381 00:39:38.519 --> 00:39:43.960 And you know, we people think of communication as like what what I'm saying, 382 00:39:44.119 --> 00:39:50.679 What I'm saying is communication, But that's the yng of communication. The 383 00:39:50.920 --> 00:39:59.079 yin or the passive part of communication is listening, really taking in what the 384 00:39:59.199 --> 00:40:02.719 universe is trying to tell you. The universe is trying to tell me something 385 00:40:02.840 --> 00:40:07.679 right now, and it's using you. It's using you to tell me things. 386 00:40:09.320 --> 00:40:13.840 You know, everybody we meet, everything that happens to us, is 387 00:40:13.840 --> 00:40:17.199 trying to tell us something. Listen. So that's what that card is saying. 388 00:40:19.400 --> 00:40:28.440 Okay, how about number six the Crossroads or the two paths when you 389 00:40:28.480 --> 00:40:32.559 pull that car? Such a beautiful card. That card has a very complex 390 00:40:35.320 --> 00:40:45.480 iconography. Maybe I'll mention to a painting by Titian where it's I forget the 391 00:40:45.559 --> 00:40:49.440 name of the painting, but it's something like natural beauty versus refined beauty, 392 00:40:49.480 --> 00:40:52.639 you know, and it's these two women and they're out in a landscape and 393 00:40:52.679 --> 00:40:59.199 one of them is completely naked standing there and the other one is dressed in 394 00:40:59.239 --> 00:41:06.239 this finery. You know, she's all jewelry and whatever like that, And 395 00:41:06.320 --> 00:41:20.039 it's a metaphor for you know, sophistication versus simplicity. And it's not saying 396 00:41:20.079 --> 00:41:22.960 that one is necessarily even better than the other, but that you have to 397 00:41:23.079 --> 00:41:28.599 choose. That card is about choosing. That's why it's called the two Paths. 398 00:41:30.679 --> 00:41:37.000 And of course we always will choose what we're attracted to. And so 399 00:41:37.039 --> 00:41:42.000 that card is about attraction and it's ruled by Venus, which is the astrological 400 00:41:42.000 --> 00:41:46.880 planet of attraction, and ultimately it's love. And you know, six is 401 00:41:46.920 --> 00:41:53.800 a perfect number because the only things that will divide into six are one, 402 00:41:53.880 --> 00:41:58.679 two, and three, And when you add one, two and three you 403 00:41:58.719 --> 00:42:02.760 get six. Mm hmm. There's only one number like that between one and 404 00:42:02.800 --> 00:42:08.599 ten, and that's six. Between one and one hundred, there's only one 405 00:42:08.639 --> 00:42:13.159 number like that, and it's twenty eight. We won't go into why you 406 00:42:13.239 --> 00:42:16.480 improve it or anything like that. That six is perfect number, and that 407 00:42:16.559 --> 00:42:30.079 makes sense because Venus is love. That car is about love. You keep 408 00:42:30.119 --> 00:42:37.000 talking about numbers, so obviously your interpretations you've got numerology, you add a 409 00:42:37.000 --> 00:42:44.239 little astrology cabal, and then contemplative life into the car descriptions that you've created. 410 00:42:45.039 --> 00:42:49.519 Yes, So give us a little bit about the crossroads in terms of 411 00:42:49.559 --> 00:42:59.800 astrology in the cabal. Okay, well, there's two principles in alchemy called 412 00:43:00.039 --> 00:43:12.239 and coagula. And coagula means kind of coming together, connecting with and salve 413 00:43:12.280 --> 00:43:19.760 a is like dissolving, dispersing, moving away from. So everything in our 414 00:43:19.880 --> 00:43:28.039 environment we either want to connect with it or we want to move away from 415 00:43:28.039 --> 00:43:34.280 it, go against it kind of thing, you know. And really in 416 00:43:34.320 --> 00:43:42.360 relationships we need both things. If you have a relationship with someone where you're 417 00:43:42.360 --> 00:43:50.920 both very very much alike, like extremely alike, probably get bored. So 418 00:43:51.239 --> 00:43:58.039 you want somebody who's different enough from you that there's this kind of dissonance that 419 00:43:58.159 --> 00:44:02.039 makes it interesting. Same thing in music. If there's too much harmony, 420 00:44:04.760 --> 00:44:12.760 the music's not interesting. The great composers are masters of using dissonance and then 421 00:44:12.960 --> 00:44:17.679 resolving the dissonance, dissonance, bringing it up and then you know, dispersing 422 00:44:17.719 --> 00:44:22.960 it kind of thing. And that's what this card is about. It's about 423 00:44:22.000 --> 00:44:27.920 the idea of beauty. What is beauty, what you find beautiful, It's 424 00:44:27.920 --> 00:44:37.360 about what you're attracted to. So hmm, interesting talk for a minute, 425 00:44:37.400 --> 00:44:46.599 John, about unseen forces in our life. If we are physical biological beings 426 00:44:49.480 --> 00:44:53.519 and we pull a to row deck, we we we pull three cars past 427 00:44:53.559 --> 00:44:57.480 president of future. I'm using that as a reference because I can't think of 428 00:44:57.800 --> 00:45:02.920 I mean, you pull one card. We can say too, what are 429 00:45:02.960 --> 00:45:08.679 we asking for? And should we have an intention when we use our cards? 430 00:45:09.760 --> 00:45:16.280 The turo Dick talk about, Yes, whatever intention you bring to the 431 00:45:16.400 --> 00:45:22.719 tarot, it will mirror back to you. So to use the tarot in 432 00:45:22.760 --> 00:45:29.639 a spiritual way, you want to have the intention to receive spiritual help. 433 00:45:30.239 --> 00:45:36.000 If you carry that intention when you use the tarot, that's what it'll mirror 434 00:45:36.000 --> 00:45:39.800 back to you. But but for those who are not familiar with spiritual help, 435 00:45:40.840 --> 00:45:45.440 give us a definition a little more. I mean, your book helps 436 00:45:46.039 --> 00:45:53.639 with the definition because you're giving the person who is receiving the reading data on 437 00:45:53.920 --> 00:45:59.480 their reality. Right, yes, okay, yes, but that data is 438 00:45:59.519 --> 00:46:05.800 coming from so unseen forces that are influencing the biological self, right, yes, 439 00:46:06.280 --> 00:46:08.519 okay, carry that on. What else are they getting when they're getting 440 00:46:08.599 --> 00:46:19.280 and reading? Such an interesting question because you know, in my book there's 441 00:46:19.360 --> 00:46:28.239 a lot of intellectual type things like objective rational knowledge, But one thing that 442 00:46:28.280 --> 00:46:32.000 makes me so very pleased about my own book is that when I read it, 443 00:46:32.480 --> 00:46:37.920 I feel like stuff is going on below the surface. I feel like 444 00:46:37.960 --> 00:46:46.320 there's lurking energies down there kind of thing, and something's happening on a subliminal 445 00:46:46.440 --> 00:46:50.559 level. And that's what I want when you read that book. I want 446 00:46:50.559 --> 00:46:55.840 the actual reading of the words to be uplifting and healing and to give you 447 00:46:57.920 --> 00:47:04.000 to help you align with these spiritual forces. That's really ultimately, that would 448 00:47:04.000 --> 00:47:07.400 be the highest thing like that. I like that. I think the other 449 00:47:07.480 --> 00:47:09.400 thing is, and I don't want to put words in your mouth, but 450 00:47:10.400 --> 00:47:16.519 you're asking for support. You're asking from the unseen forces where you came from 451 00:47:16.559 --> 00:47:23.360 before you incarnated, to give you a sense of what is happening in this 452 00:47:23.679 --> 00:47:30.320 period of my life exactly exactly. And here's another thing too. If you 453 00:47:30.760 --> 00:47:42.199 get advice from the tarot and then you follow it, that will magnify the 454 00:47:42.239 --> 00:47:45.760 flow of advice. Oh. In other words, you know, if you 455 00:47:45.800 --> 00:47:51.000 have a friend and you keep going to them and say well I need this 456 00:47:51.079 --> 00:47:52.360 or that or can you help me with this, and then they help you. 457 00:47:52.679 --> 00:47:57.400 If you go take that advice and it works, it helps you that's 458 00:47:57.440 --> 00:47:59.719 going to make them happy. You're going to go back, You're going to 459 00:47:59.760 --> 00:48:02.320 ask for maybe more advice like that, you know, and it says it's 460 00:48:02.360 --> 00:48:07.440 this wonderful flow. But see, some people use the tarot it kind of 461 00:48:07.480 --> 00:48:12.000 like it's it's just like TikTok, you know, like, oh, I 462 00:48:12.039 --> 00:48:14.519 want to know what's going on with this, and I want to know what's 463 00:48:14.519 --> 00:48:16.480 going on with that, and can I ask a question about this or that? 464 00:48:16.880 --> 00:48:22.000 But it's more just like it's they're treating it like it's a movie or 465 00:48:22.039 --> 00:48:30.119 a pastime or an entertainment. You know, that's weakening the power of the 466 00:48:30.159 --> 00:48:37.400 taro ro to do that. I want to talk about a very very important 467 00:48:37.440 --> 00:48:42.559 part of your book that I didn't realize was important, but then when you 468 00:48:43.440 --> 00:48:46.679 emphasize it over and over again, is an important portion. And this is 469 00:48:47.639 --> 00:49:00.400 correctly developing a question. The question cannot be It has to be an important 470 00:49:00.480 --> 00:49:04.760 question that you thought about, that you formulated, and then you thought about 471 00:49:04.760 --> 00:49:08.519 it and intended to get an answer for it, and then you pull your 472 00:49:08.559 --> 00:49:13.880 you shuffle your deck, and then you pull your cards. Talk about the 473 00:49:13.920 --> 00:49:22.199 importance of questions. Of course, the question will come out of intent and 474 00:49:22.239 --> 00:49:27.519 as I just mentioned. You know, intent is very very important. People 475 00:49:27.599 --> 00:49:30.480 are always sitting down with the I have a reading to do later today, 476 00:49:31.000 --> 00:49:36.360 and I bet you anything. As so often happens, people will ask me 477 00:49:36.400 --> 00:49:40.679 a question that the answer is yes or no. Oh my God. Doesn't 478 00:49:40.719 --> 00:49:46.239 tend to like yes or no questions. Yeah, it's yes or no questions 479 00:49:46.440 --> 00:49:55.519 lack creativity. And also they imply fatalism hmm, Like if you say, 480 00:49:58.760 --> 00:50:00.519 oh, am, I am I going to at this job I applied for. 481 00:50:02.840 --> 00:50:07.840 That kind of a question comes out of anxiety. You know, they 482 00:50:07.880 --> 00:50:10.119 already told you that they're going to send you an email in two days and 483 00:50:10.159 --> 00:50:15.239 tell you whether or not you got the job. So why are you coming 484 00:50:15.280 --> 00:50:17.760 to me to want to know the day before whether you're going to get it? 485 00:50:20.119 --> 00:50:22.320 You know, it's just anxiety. It's a question that's born out of 486 00:50:22.360 --> 00:50:28.280 anxiety. So it's important to think about what your questions are born out of. 487 00:50:29.480 --> 00:50:35.880 And I sympathize with people having anxiety and asking questions based on that, 488 00:50:36.760 --> 00:50:43.519 but I want to help them to see that they have power. We all 489 00:50:43.559 --> 00:50:52.480 have so much untapped power, and we create our reality through our beliefs, 490 00:50:52.280 --> 00:51:00.199 and so as we change our beliefs, we can change our reality, and 491 00:51:00.239 --> 00:51:07.039 the tarot can help you find ways of doing that. So somebody buys a 492 00:51:07.119 --> 00:51:15.000 deck and they buy your book, Sole Journey through the Toureau, and perhaps 493 00:51:15.079 --> 00:51:20.679 the deck comes with a very simplified version of interpreting the cards, and they 494 00:51:20.679 --> 00:51:27.079 shuffle the cards and they've listened to to this podcast and they know now not 495 00:51:27.159 --> 00:51:30.559 to just say yes or no, yes or no. How do they go 496 00:51:30.639 --> 00:51:40.280 about formulating the best questions for the energetics of tourou ask questions like what do 497 00:51:40.360 --> 00:51:49.280 I have to learn from this situation? Okay? Another question? Okay, 498 00:51:49.880 --> 00:51:54.679 So five minutes before this podcast started, I said, what's going to be 499 00:51:54.719 --> 00:52:01.559 the vibration around this podcast? And I got our canum twenty one? I'm 500 00:52:01.599 --> 00:52:07.880 sorry, no, I got our can of nineteen. Great, that's just 501 00:52:07.039 --> 00:52:12.360 great. Tell me, I don't know that card. What does that define 502 00:52:12.360 --> 00:52:15.760 that? That card is called the Sun, and what it's about is expression 503 00:52:15.880 --> 00:52:23.760 expressing something. And so see when I asked the question what are the vibrations 504 00:52:24.039 --> 00:52:29.360 around this, I'm not only asking that, but I'm saying, Okay, 505 00:52:29.360 --> 00:52:31.440 if that's the vibration, then what I want to do is I want to 506 00:52:31.480 --> 00:52:37.320 flow with it. If I flow with that vibration, it'll enhance what's going 507 00:52:37.440 --> 00:52:45.400 on. And our Can of nineteen is about self expression, and so that 508 00:52:45.519 --> 00:52:52.079 told me that you most likely were going to assist me in expressing what I 509 00:52:52.199 --> 00:52:55.360 need to express. Oh, and I think you've done a great job of 510 00:52:55.400 --> 00:53:01.320 that. I think everything we've touched on are the most important things. Oh 511 00:53:01.400 --> 00:53:07.280 fascinating, and I think you've been really good at getting there. And that 512 00:53:07.320 --> 00:53:12.360 goes with that Arcan of nineteen, which is ruled by Leo, and Leo's 513 00:53:12.360 --> 00:53:20.320 about dramatization. Dramatization of something I'm working to get across the concepts to my 514 00:53:20.400 --> 00:53:29.960 listening audience who are likely interested in using the cards, but I'm about energy, 515 00:53:30.199 --> 00:53:36.360 seeing and unseen energy, and as a physical being and a long time 516 00:53:36.400 --> 00:53:42.360 meditator, talking about energy isn't the always easiest thing because we experience it, 517 00:53:43.840 --> 00:53:51.679 but explaining it or trying to define it to others is a challenge because there 518 00:53:51.679 --> 00:53:54.599 could be and I've seen this all through my life, is that different people 519 00:53:54.679 --> 00:54:00.760 are waking up at different times. Somebody could be fundamental religious, then they 520 00:54:00.800 --> 00:54:05.400 got over that they didn't want to deal with it anymore. Another part of 521 00:54:05.440 --> 00:54:08.719 their body and brain and soul turned on and all of a sudden, now 522 00:54:08.719 --> 00:54:13.480 they're interested in to row, they're interested in channel material, they're interested in 523 00:54:14.159 --> 00:54:21.119 working with difinition, which is what yes row is. And so for them, 524 00:54:22.000 --> 00:54:25.079 I'm like, okay, I'd like you to try to row. It's 525 00:54:25.119 --> 00:54:32.320 a very inexpensive way to discover elements about yourself, right, yes, but 526 00:54:32.519 --> 00:54:36.960 even more so, and you said this in the very beginning, John, 527 00:54:37.800 --> 00:54:43.159 it's a form of evolution because you can see and get a sense. And 528 00:54:43.199 --> 00:54:49.800 I want you to talk about this of where you're heading. Yes, One 529 00:54:49.880 --> 00:54:54.159 thing I want to say right now about that is keep a Tarot journal. 530 00:54:54.239 --> 00:54:57.639 It's such a wonderful thing. Oh and you don't have to put a lot 531 00:54:57.679 --> 00:55:00.800 of energy into a bit, like if you ask if do a three card 532 00:55:00.840 --> 00:55:04.000 reading, right down the three cards and just jot down on what the question 533 00:55:04.280 --> 00:55:08.559 was. The reason being is so often people go back and look at that 534 00:55:08.639 --> 00:55:13.880 and they and then they get further perspective on it. They go, oh, 535 00:55:13.960 --> 00:55:16.000 yeah, now that all this other stuff has happened, I can look 536 00:55:16.039 --> 00:55:20.440 back and see where that was right there. It's a great idea. I 537 00:55:20.519 --> 00:55:23.920 was right there in the cards, you know. Yeah, yeah, I 538 00:55:23.920 --> 00:55:29.199 can imagine Also if you're looking at a passage in your journal that's like five 539 00:55:29.280 --> 00:55:35.880 years ago, and you can kind of see how you moved along. Yes, 540 00:55:36.000 --> 00:55:43.960 exactly what choices you made as you were pulling cards. Yes, Now 541 00:55:44.519 --> 00:55:50.079 back to your question though, what kind of what was your question? I 542 00:55:50.119 --> 00:55:57.519 forgot? I think I was asking about the energetics behind well, energetics. 543 00:55:57.599 --> 00:56:01.519 Yeah, energetics is a fun thing because you know, it's everywhere and everything, 544 00:56:02.760 --> 00:56:07.039 our whole body, that's what. That's all the material world, it's 545 00:56:07.079 --> 00:56:20.840 all energetics. And I am an animist and animism is really a part of 546 00:56:20.920 --> 00:56:25.679 Kabbala. My heart and soul is with Kabbala. And what animism believes is 547 00:56:25.760 --> 00:56:32.360 everything is alive. Oh right, and everything is alive. Yeah, And 548 00:56:34.960 --> 00:56:37.679 you know, Kabbala says that you should. It's very good to be nice 549 00:56:37.719 --> 00:56:45.079 to physical objects. Treat them well. A gratefulness is a good thing. 550 00:56:45.239 --> 00:56:52.000 Thank them for being there, thank them for helping you. That's energy that 551 00:56:52.039 --> 00:56:57.840 puts that energy toward them, and life is a big mirror. So we 552 00:56:58.159 --> 00:57:01.159 emanate this energy and then we get back to us. That's what car that's 553 00:57:01.199 --> 00:57:07.559 what karmen is. Yeah, we're getting back what we're putting out. You 554 00:57:07.639 --> 00:57:12.440 do talk a lot about karma. In the closing time we have together, 555 00:57:12.719 --> 00:57:16.039 can you pull a couple of cards and read share your book? Let's pull 556 00:57:16.679 --> 00:57:20.559 let's pull a card on Uh, what do we want to talk about? 557 00:57:20.559 --> 00:57:25.119 What? How does the year end for those of us living in the United 558 00:57:25.119 --> 00:57:31.599 States? Something that's broad? Okay? And why don't you just set an 559 00:57:31.599 --> 00:57:37.760 intention and shuffle the deck? Pull a card in this, open your wonderful 560 00:57:37.800 --> 00:57:42.000 book and see what we find. Okay, And now, and what question 561 00:57:42.000 --> 00:57:45.679 are we going to ask? What as the years ending? What? What 562 00:57:45.719 --> 00:57:49.719 can we look forward to? How something like that? Okay? Like what 563 00:57:49.840 --> 00:57:52.880 are the vibrations around the rest for the rest of the year. Yeah, 564 00:57:52.920 --> 00:57:57.360 well, in the few weeks we have left, okay, and so and 565 00:57:57.440 --> 00:58:01.039 shall we do three cards on this? Let's pull one and then we'll have 566 00:58:01.239 --> 00:58:07.400 we'll have time for one more card pulling. Okay, Uh, we're gonna 567 00:58:07.400 --> 00:58:14.239 pull a card. Vibrations for the rest of the year. We got the 568 00:58:14.360 --> 00:58:20.079 Five of Swords, the Five of Swords? Okay, you want to pull 569 00:58:20.119 --> 00:58:22.840 your book? Well, I hate to say it, but you know this 570 00:58:22.000 --> 00:58:29.159 is very like it's about obstruction. It can be about obstruction, Okay, 571 00:58:30.840 --> 00:58:40.480 It's about a need to address definite physical problems, and it's also about the 572 00:58:40.519 --> 00:58:47.920 substantiation of something. Hmmm. You know, there's a lot in the world 573 00:58:49.039 --> 00:58:55.760 now that's up in the air. This seems to say that some of this 574 00:58:55.840 --> 00:59:02.280 stuff is going to be decided for us. Would you say it's going to 575 00:59:02.320 --> 00:59:07.000 be decided for us? Well, it's going to be decided one way or 576 00:59:07.000 --> 00:59:14.159 the other. Oh, okay, one way or the other. Yeah. 577 00:59:14.199 --> 00:59:19.960 And you know, I in a way, I'm reticent about saying this, 578 00:59:20.079 --> 00:59:24.440 but I'm going to say it because sad Guru, who I think very highly 579 00:59:24.519 --> 00:59:30.199 of, said it that the time frame we're living in now, you just 580 00:59:30.320 --> 00:59:36.320 can't stay where you are anymore. You can't. You're either going to progress 581 00:59:37.360 --> 00:59:42.800 or you're going to fall behind. So it's very very important right now to 582 00:59:42.840 --> 00:59:51.079 get on a spiritual wavelength and at a very high level. This card is 583 00:59:51.119 --> 01:00:00.639 about manifesting spirituality, m manifesting the spiritual meaning and in in a highly tangible 584 01:00:00.639 --> 01:00:07.760 physical way, like doing what you can to help people to be a positive 585 01:00:07.800 --> 01:00:19.119 force in the world. I like that. Yeah. Okay, So once 586 01:00:19.159 --> 01:00:22.800 you mix up the deck and you think it's something that's kind of a broad 587 01:00:22.000 --> 01:00:42.400 question that covers covers a humanity. If you want to say that I'm going 588 01:00:42.400 --> 01:00:45.599 to go back to the question that you ask we got the five of Swords 589 01:00:45.639 --> 01:00:52.000 for and I often do this. I'm going to ask for another card that 590 01:00:52.119 --> 01:00:57.239 will point the direction to specifically, how do we do what I just said? 591 01:00:57.400 --> 01:01:00.960 Oh I like that so kind of a you know, how do we 592 01:01:00.559 --> 01:01:10.559 h instrument travel through this next phase or sort of exactly the chariot. Hmm, 593 01:01:10.679 --> 01:01:15.199 well, us, that sounds very very active. Oh yeah, and 594 01:01:15.280 --> 01:01:22.280 the Chariot is about rising above things, getting an overview. You know. 595 01:01:23.079 --> 01:01:29.800 Ah, there's so much in the world today that can make people feel powerless, 596 01:01:31.559 --> 01:01:36.800 you know, make us feel like we're at the mercy of things. 597 01:01:37.320 --> 01:01:44.159 Just being kind to each other is so such a big thing, such a 598 01:01:44.199 --> 01:01:51.000 powerful thing. That can be a way of spreading light through the world. 599 01:01:51.119 --> 01:01:53.280 And you know, when you go out in the world and someone is unkind 600 01:01:53.360 --> 01:02:00.199 to you so much of many people have the first reaction of like get away 601 01:02:00.199 --> 01:02:06.079 from that, or react to it in a negative way, or shut it 602 01:02:06.119 --> 01:02:12.880 out or something like that. But if you put kindness out toward that source 603 01:02:12.920 --> 01:02:19.280 of the unkindness, it can have a very positive influence. The Chariot is 604 01:02:19.320 --> 01:02:27.000 a very friendly card. It's a very fellowship card. It's a card about 605 01:02:27.039 --> 01:02:37.840 making making connections. So I'd say we need to generate joy and that will 606 01:02:37.920 --> 01:02:45.320 be a way of helping to deal with these obstructions. If you are suggesting 607 01:02:45.360 --> 01:02:50.880 that we're friendly, being more kindly and loving towards our neighbor, our friends 608 01:02:51.199 --> 01:03:00.440 and associates, is that also reaching out and being more demonstrative of of UH 609 01:03:00.119 --> 01:03:13.000 friendship and hearing? Yes? Absolutely, mm hmm absolutely, Okay, I 610 01:03:13.079 --> 01:03:16.440 like that Sagetarius. That card is ruled by Sagittarius, which is about rising 611 01:03:16.519 --> 01:03:28.760 about things rising, you know, rising about fascinating. The books called Soul 612 01:03:28.920 --> 01:03:35.119 Journey through the Terreau Key to a complete spiritual practice. And my guest today 613 01:03:35.119 --> 01:03:40.559 has been John Sandback. John, give us your website for those of want 614 01:03:40.599 --> 01:03:44.599 to get more information and by the way, those of you listening, John 615 01:03:44.719 --> 01:03:50.000 does private readings if you go to his site. But go ahead and give 616 01:03:50.079 --> 01:03:52.159 us the details of your website, John, Oh, yes, I will. 617 01:03:52.199 --> 01:03:55.960 And the private readings. I do terror terrort readings. I do astrology 618 01:03:57.079 --> 01:04:05.079 readings both and psychic readings. And the website is johnsandboch dot net. Okay, 619 01:04:06.400 --> 01:04:10.960 let me ask you, when you say you do astrology, do you 620 01:04:11.000 --> 01:04:15.719 do Sdeial or do you do Hindu? I do tropical astrology, Western astrology, 621 01:04:15.800 --> 01:04:21.159 Western astrology. Wow, fantastic, Hey, this has been a lot 622 01:04:21.199 --> 01:04:25.480 of fun for those of you listening in. The book just came out. 623 01:04:25.599 --> 01:04:29.760 It's only been out for I guess it came out the first part of November 624 01:04:29.800 --> 01:04:33.880 fourteenth. Oh, came out almost a month ago. Yes, so it's 625 01:04:33.920 --> 01:04:41.639 been on Amazon. It is packed, filled full of amazing material. It 626 01:04:41.800 --> 01:04:46.239 is not a light read at all, but it's important that we read it 627 01:04:46.440 --> 01:04:50.440 in sections. And what I like about it is he gives the arcade, 628 01:04:50.519 --> 01:04:57.719 the minor and major focal points, and then breaks him down and gives a 629 01:04:57.719 --> 01:05:01.519 great deal of material. So I'm going to read this real quickly. This 630 01:05:01.559 --> 01:05:05.760 is what John writes. The purpose of this book is to promote a crystalline, 631 01:05:06.360 --> 01:05:13.119 therapeutic and spiritual understanding of the Toureau in this new age we've been in 632 01:05:13.599 --> 01:05:20.159 the process of entering now for a good while. Fantastic John, And I 633 01:05:20.239 --> 01:05:25.159 love that to hear that, because that means that you thought about this book 634 01:05:26.320 --> 01:05:32.199 and it's come through after fifty plus years of work that you've done and the 635 01:05:32.280 --> 01:05:40.480 various levels that you've obtained and dealt with as a personal biological being. Yes, 636 01:05:42.239 --> 01:05:45.079 well, thank you so much. This has been wonderful for me, 637 01:05:45.360 --> 01:05:51.039 and you've been so very supportive. I'm so great. I'm so grateful that 638 01:05:51.079 --> 01:05:55.960 we've made contact with each other. My pleasure, John, and hey, 639 01:05:56.239 --> 01:06:00.360 continue success and I hope you sell a ton of these books. Oh well, 640 01:06:00.360 --> 01:06:13.840 thank you so much. Thank you. So that's all about tools and 641 01:06:13.880 --> 01:06:18.400 what does that mean. What it means is that if you only live in 642 01:06:18.400 --> 01:06:24.559 the dense physical world, you're missing out on a lot of subtleties. You're 643 01:06:24.599 --> 01:06:30.480 missing out on messaging, You're missing out on internal information that comes from the 644 01:06:30.559 --> 01:06:35.199 different aspects of who you are. Some people would call that your past lives, 645 01:06:36.239 --> 01:06:42.840 your higher self, your soul whatever. They're constantly trying to communicate with 646 01:06:42.880 --> 01:06:48.320 you. And when you use a divining to a divining tool like to row, 647 01:06:49.079 --> 01:06:57.440 those messages come through, and that way you have better understanding of how 648 01:06:57.480 --> 01:07:01.159 your life is preceding what you should be doing, how to enjoy your life. 649 01:07:01.199 --> 01:07:05.880 And one of the big ones that John mentioned was burning karma, because 650 01:07:05.880 --> 01:07:12.000 you could be dealing with relationships, with jobs, with lifestyles that are too 651 01:07:12.119 --> 01:07:15.360 challenging and you need to burn through those and do some other things. So 652 01:07:15.880 --> 01:07:17.599 it's good to have him on the program. It's a cool book. It's 653 01:07:17.639 --> 01:07:24.280 actually pretty good size. It's over three hundred pages, almost three hundred and 654 01:07:24.320 --> 01:07:28.800 seventy pages, and he has a lot of technique in here that he didn't 655 01:07:28.800 --> 01:07:31.840 talk about. Well. One of the things he brought up that he didn't 656 01:07:31.880 --> 01:07:35.480 mention. He mentioned it after we had finished, was to keep a touro 657 01:07:35.760 --> 01:07:40.320 journal. So, in other words, you sit down, you intend to 658 01:07:40.360 --> 01:07:45.079 get information about a relationship or whatever, and you pull a one card, 659 01:07:45.159 --> 01:07:50.000 or you pull three cards, or you pull whatever, and you're beginning to 660 01:07:50.039 --> 01:07:55.079 read the interpretation, and you write that down, what happened, what is 661 01:07:55.119 --> 01:08:00.760 going on this day at this time, and my question is my relationship with 662 01:08:00.880 --> 01:08:06.000 Billy, Bob or whoever. And then you then you write it down, 663 01:08:06.079 --> 01:08:10.800 and then you can go back and go, Okay, I was processing that 664 01:08:11.320 --> 01:08:15.599 and now I cleared it, or I'm still dealing with it and I need 665 01:08:15.639 --> 01:08:18.600 to pull another card. It's a way to kind of govern where you're at. 666 01:08:18.880 --> 01:08:24.640 So Toro journaling it was a great idea when he suggested it. We 667 01:08:24.720 --> 01:08:28.399 hear about journaling your dreams. You have a dream, wake up, write 668 01:08:28.399 --> 01:08:30.600 it down, then you can look at it later. It has more impacts, 669 01:08:30.640 --> 01:08:39.439 so very very cool material. Again, more technique for you to delve 670 01:08:39.479 --> 01:08:45.880 in on the unseen higher levels of consciousness that are interacting with you on a 671 01:08:45.960 --> 01:08:50.880 regular basis, and this is how you connect with them. Hey, the 672 01:08:50.920 --> 01:08:55.960 holidays are here and that means gift giving. Got to get a gift for 673 01:08:56.000 --> 01:08:59.000 the kids, for the parents, for the friends, for the loved ones. 674 01:08:59.720 --> 01:09:02.359 Every everybody gets a gift. What do you get, Well, there's 675 01:09:02.399 --> 01:09:06.279 a lot of joy in giving gifts, and you know, you love to 676 01:09:06.319 --> 01:09:11.279 see people open a gift that they really love that you gave them. Wonderful. 677 01:09:11.960 --> 01:09:15.960 But you need something to and I'd like to suggest an Earth Ancient's Destiny 678 01:09:16.680 --> 01:09:20.760 tour that we are doing in twenty twenty four. We will be in Egypt 679 01:09:20.880 --> 01:09:27.239 from April twenty sixth to May ninth for our Grand Egyptian Tour. It is 680 01:09:27.520 --> 01:09:32.079 world class for not for a very reasonable price. By the way, it's 681 01:09:32.119 --> 01:09:35.840 all covered. You get in the plane, you fly to Cairo. As 682 01:09:35.920 --> 01:09:40.880 soon as you get off the plane, you're met with by a representative of 683 01:09:40.920 --> 01:09:45.479 Saba Tours, our tour director and his team. They take care of you. 684 01:09:45.479 --> 01:09:48.920 You're driven to the hotel. From the minute you step into the hotel 685 01:09:49.520 --> 01:09:53.720 to the minute you get back on the plane to go home, you are 686 01:09:54.039 --> 01:09:59.319 taking care of. It's a VIP tour. We see world class temples, 687 01:09:59.359 --> 01:10:03.920 pyramids, artifacts, and the food, the beverages, the bus ride, 688 01:10:04.319 --> 01:10:11.159 the entire tour is vip VP, or, as we like to joke, 689 01:10:11.840 --> 01:10:15.319 you are a diplomat of your city, your state, your country, your 690 01:10:15.399 --> 01:10:20.319 universe, your planet, wherever you're from. So come out and join us. 691 01:10:20.319 --> 01:10:26.920 We're also going to be in Turkey. That's going to be August fourteenth 692 01:10:26.920 --> 01:10:30.680 through the twenty third of twenty twenty four. That tour is just about full 693 01:10:31.279 --> 01:10:38.079 for both tours and including our Mexico tour. Go to Earthancients dot com Forward 694 01:10:38.119 --> 01:10:42.920 slash Tours. Let us know what you think. Sign up, register and 695 01:10:43.319 --> 01:10:45.359 come out and join us. We're also giving until the end of the year 696 01:10:45.439 --> 01:10:51.920 a discount. If you use code get Grant Egyptian Tour twenty twenty four, 697 01:10:53.079 --> 01:10:58.319 you'll get a couple hundred bucks off the price of admission. So our tours 698 01:10:58.399 --> 01:11:04.279 are fabulous. They are all inclusive, and they are mind blowing and fun. 699 01:11:04.760 --> 01:11:12.520 Earthacients dot Com Forward slash Tours. Okay, that's it. For today's 700 01:11:12.560 --> 01:11:15.319 program, I want to thank my guest John Sandbach, coming to us from 701 01:11:15.319 --> 01:11:23.039 Missouri his book on tourou As always a team of Gail tor Mark Foster and 702 01:11:23.119 --> 01:11:27.800 everyone who makes this thing happen. You guys rock all right, take care, 703 01:11:27.960 --> 01:11:30.239 be well, and we will talk to you next time.