WEBVTT

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In this episode, we are part
two with Austin Arrowwood. This one is

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called Austin Gets a Dick. If
you haven't listened to part one, you're

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like what or we just trust me? Okay, if you're listening to this

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you didn't listen to part one,
go ahead and get to part one.

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I have Austin Arrowwood here. We
are doing an interview and Austin gets dick

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surgery slash bottom surgery next week,
and so we are going to discuss so

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be right back. Well, hello
there, this is Hellllo. This is

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Shelley from Latderday Lesbian podcast, the
ex Mormon gay girl, just trying to

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figure out life. I'm here with
Austin and we are continuing our discussion.

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Austin, how you doing. I'm
good. How are you? I am

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great? Are you ready to talk
about body parts? Absolutely sweet? Okay,

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So quick review. The last episode
kind of went over some of your

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history. Again, go listen to
it if you haven't yet. We already

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talked about your boob surgery. Those
came off. Basically that was just about

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the best thing ever for you as
far as your mental health, your physical

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health. So at what point were
you then thinking hmmm, so boobs are

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gone, now what? So I
would say it was after after I started

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to lose weight and I can actually
see my another regents because you know,

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I had a postpartum belly, you
know, I get it. Yeah,

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so, and I just started to
feel like I still wasn't complete, like

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I thought I would be okay without
it, and then I was like,

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no, I'm really not. But
when you're on testosterone, you get bottom

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growth, so okay, you know, the clatorius grows and it can get

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up to two or three inches long. Honestly, see, these are things

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that I don't know, so feel
free to like spill all all the goods.

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Yeah, so you have like a
little mini penis, like a micro

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penis, but I still have my
female parts as well, and I had

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had my uterus, cervix, ovaries, tubes, everything removed, so there's

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nothing in there, but it still
reacts to sexual pleasure the same way.

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So you get you know, moisture
whatever, gotcha. I hate that word,

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but yeah, okay, yeah,
but it grosses me out like and

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it always has, and so I
was like, I want that gone.

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And I have been trying to pee
standing up since I was little, Like

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that's not easy, by the way, as with woman parts, not easy.

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Not with the anatomy I was born
with. I have dribbled down my

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legs so many times trying to stand
over a toilet because I thought boys were

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cooler than girls. Yeah, oh
well yeah. And I remember being with

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my friend. My best friend was
a boy when I was ten. We

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were dirt biking in the woods and
he, of course could pee on a

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tree, and I was like,
well, I should be able to do

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that too, because I realized I
wasn't a boy, and it did not

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work, and I peed all down
my pants and I was like, what

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the hell, Like that is not
cool. So one of the huge bad

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parts about having the female anatomy is
the inability to properly pee on a tree

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exactly. Yeah. You know,
like if you have to pee when you're

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driving down the highway, you can't
just pull over and pee on the side

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of the highway. No, it's
like you got you pee all over your

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leg? How do you wipe?
Like now your socks are wet? I

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get it. Yeah's been there yea. So so I just decided that I

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needed bottom surgery. And I knew
that, but then I had to decide

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what bottom surgery I wanted because for
you know, for male to female,

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there's really only one. There's the
vaginal plast and that did well for female

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to You can either do a metoidoplasty, which is basically where they just release

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the clatorus from the ligaments that surround
it so it can extend to its full

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length, and then they seal up
the vaginal canal. If you want it

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sealed up, they can extend the
urethra to the tip of the clatorus and

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then you you know, turn the
laby into a scrot them in there you

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go with falloplasty, there's a little
more involved to it. So at first

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I wasn't going to do that because
I thought, I really don't want the

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scar. You know, they take
my forearm and they will take a graft

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from my forearm that's like five inches
long, goes all the way around your

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forearm, and then they take another
graph from your leg to cover that spot

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and they make the phallus out of
your forearm. Why do they use the

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forearm skin? Is it more similar
to penis skin? Is that correct?

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Yeah? So it's the texture,
the elasticity, everything is very similar to

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a natal penis. And then There's
also the sensation is better in your forearm.

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So if you take your finger and
you rub it along the inside of

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your forearm compared to like the inside
of your thigh, there's definitely more sensation.

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So they try the area with the
most sensation and the best blood flow,

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which generally is people's arms. Most
people have better blood flow in their

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arms than they do in their legs, so they're going for the best blood

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flow, the best nerve supply,
and the best skin that resembles a natal

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penis. So I was really hesitant
to do that at first. I was

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like, I think I could just
do the metoio plasty and I'd be okay

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with that. Had you spoken to
any doctors yet or are you just kind

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of looking online at this point and
looking at options. I had been looking

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at falloplasties online for like ten years. Oh wow. Yeah. So before

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I even came out as trans,
I was looking up the surgery, like,

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okay, let's talk about that,
Austin. You suld do that whole

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thing. Jesus Austin, this is
some big shit. Okay. So before

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you even came out as trans,
you were looking at at surgeries that a

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trans person would get So then,
were you thinking you were trans you just

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didn't want to admit to it,
or you were curious what was going on?

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No, I knew, like I
said, I knew when when I

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was twenty five, I knew.
I just couldn't vocalize it because I did

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not want to hurt anyone. I
didn't want to hurt my family. I

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didn't want to hurt my kids.
I was so afraid of the backlash people

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pleaser, I get it. Yeah, I was like, I can't do

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this. I can't hurt them.
So you're getting information, but in your

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mind, are you just it's curiosity
because you're not going to actually do it

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right, or were you maybe hopefully
you know. I was like one of

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those people that was like, if
I could go to sleep and wake up

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with a penis, it wouldn't be
the worst thing, you know. So

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it's kind of like cool, Like
I wasn't really looking at I'm going to

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do this to myself. It was
more Wow, science is so cool,

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Like they can do that, they
can wow, you know, like this

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is amazing. And so when I
would tell people about it and they would

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give me a weird look, I
would be like, I'm just amazed at

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what science can do, like,
isn't this cool? Like, well,

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so was there other science things you
looked into or was it just the people?

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Come on now, yeah, I
researched all the science stuff. Okay,

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I bet yeah no so uh yeah, my Google searches were kind of

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weird, but I bet yeah.
So I had been looking like into surgery,

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it's like that for like ten years. So I it was more amount

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of when I decided I'm going to
do bottom surgery, it was what do

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I want to have done? And
there were things that I knew were non

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negotiables for me. I wanted to
vagnect me because I cannot stand having any

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kind of pole there. And I
wanted you rethrow linkedening because I want to

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stand to pee like. Those were
my two non negotiables. After that,

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it was do I want well with
the matoidoplast. The issue is some men

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can't clear their fly because there's not
enough lengths when you're only using an extended

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clatorus to clear the fly in like
peet a urnal, so I would still

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have to go into a stall.
Gota got you, gotcha? And most

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female born people have not been in
men's restrooms in a man's men's restroom in

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like a store or whatever, there's
generally one stall and three urnals. So

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if someone's in there watching a game
on their phone, which generally seems to

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be the case, or playing a
game or whatever trying to kill time,

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then if people have to use the
stall, they have to wait. So

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you know where women seem to go
in, they pee, they wash their

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hands, and they leave. You
know, men go in the bathroom and

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kill time in the stall if it's
available. So, and the stalls are

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always disgusting in men's bathrooms, they're
gross. So I was like, okay,

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Jenny, the p is not negotiable. I say, Plus, urinals

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are very cool. They are.
I mean I have gone drunk, thank

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you, drunk into a men's restroom
because women's was packed and thought this would

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be fun to use the urinal.
Now I don't have a penis. I

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made a mess. I was drunk, But like, they're just one of

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those cool things I think that you
just have to experience once in your life.

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Yeah, all right, so you
want to be able to pece standing

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up, which I get. I'm
not making light of that, like like

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yeah, that's yeah, I get
it. Yeah, And no, vaginal

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canal. So those were my two, Like have two? What do you?

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I know, I'm really prying.
Now let's talk about the vaginal canal.

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Is it gross to you? Is
it too female for you? What

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is it that makes you like I
don't want that? All of the above?

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Yeah, Like it was always gross
to me. So from the time

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I was old enough that I started
having any kind of discharge. So I

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was like, this is disgusting,
Like this is so gross. I don't

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what is the point of this whole
thing. Ew So you know, I

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had an eating disorder when I was
a teenager to stop my periods. So

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I had like three percent body fat
in high school. Okay, let's talk

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about that. You just skimmed over
this part of your life, Jesus awten.

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And this is why this is now
a two parts interview. So you

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what was it about your period?
Was it because it was such a female

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thing that you didn't want to have, or was you just like gross in

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general? It was a reminder that
I had the wrong body every month and

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wow, you know, so I
would get suicidal every month when my period

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would start, and I was like, this is so gross. It's just

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gross, Like why what is the
point of this, And of course I

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knew it's so you could have babies. Bah whatever. No, it's like

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it's still disgusting, Like can't we
just do away with it? And You're

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not the first trans man that I've
heard say that about having their period is

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like practically a death sentence every month, like this is so horrible. I

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don't want to be here anymore because
this is so bad, because it's just

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not who you are right right.
Well, And there was also the my

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mom had the you couldn't use tampon's
rule, shut the fuck up. Yeah,

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so I only got pads, and
you know, they didn't have the

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nice little thin pads that they have
now that they were pillows back then.

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Yeah, And so I was like
everyone could see it in the outline of

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your pants, you know, like
they were just disgusting. And I was

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like you you like, ah,
so yeah, no, it was horrible.

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Yeah. So you knew that if
you lost enough weight, your period

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would likely stop, right, Yeah, that was some science I found out

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by accident. Actually really tell me. Yeah, So I started self harming

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probably around the time my period started. It started restricting food. I joined

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the track team so I would get
up and I would do a paper out

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in the morning at four. Then
I went to seminary, then I went

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to school. After school, I
had track practice. I would come home

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from track practice and I would run
another ten miles Jesus. I usually ate

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once a day. So and it
was not a lot of food, like

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an apple, maybe a sandwich,
and that was it. Why Because I

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hated my body, telling you,
okay, I wanted to be just all

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muscle, like got it, Okay, you didn't like the curves and the

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baby fat and the female okay,
okay, I did not want boobs.

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So while I was doing all that, I had no boobs. I was

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three percent body fat and I had
no period. So I was like,

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yes, like teenage boyhood without having
the boy you know, super healthy choices.

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Austin huh yeah, God, oh
that makes me sad, but I'm

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sure so many people do that.
Wow. Yeah, you know. I

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always thought I was fat too growing
up, and I don't it. Maybe

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I wasn't, but it was like, you know, just the girl padding.

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I had boobs and I had you
know, like when you hit puberity,

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you start women's their hips spread a
little bit. Not that I did

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that much I still have my boy
hips. But any kind of like that

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padding that's natural and healthy for a
woman when you don't feel like you're a

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woman and that hits you that,
I can only imagine how that would feel.

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Yeah, yeah, it wasn't It
wasn't good. Did your parents know

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that you were that you had an
eating disorder? Was that anything that you

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talked about? No? No,
I mean they kind of figured out I

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was self injuring, but I would
tell them I got beat up by a

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bully at school, or that I
tripped and fell, or how were you

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self injuring? I would cut myself
with anything I could get hold of.

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I would hit myself in the face, like smash my face against stuff.

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Yeah, that kind of stuff.
And when you were doing that, why

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what was your brain telling you?
So most people who self injure do it

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because the pain inside is so great
that if they can refocus it to external

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pain, it makes it go away. Not for our long time, but

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for a little bit. You can
ignore the pain internally because you're focusing on

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a pain externally. Gotcha, that's
how it was for you. Wow,

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at what age were you doing that? Did you start when you start your

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period? Said roughly yeah, okay, So so in your mind, then

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did you recognize that it was because
you didn't feel like your gender and your

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parts lined up, like did you
have the maturity? I guess the thought

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pattern of this is why I'm doing
this, or you're just were like,

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I hurt, I need to stop
hurting. It was I hurt and my

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body is wrong. Not that it
didn't align, because I didn't really put

207
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that together because I didn't think that
was an option. So it was just

208
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it felt wrong. So it's one
of those things where if you always feel

209
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wrong in your body but you don't
know why, you're just kind of like

210
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I just feel wrong, like,
you know, And I couldn't really put

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words to it because I didn't know, like, I just knew it felt

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wrong. So that's what I would
tell people, like I just feel wrong.

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And they're like, but you're you're
fine, you know, I got

214
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you're cute. You should be a
cheerleader, you know, blah blah blah,

215
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and that's what you want to do. Yeah. Well, and they

216
00:15:50.799 --> 00:15:52.840
wanted me to be the flyer,
you know, so because I was tiny,

217
00:15:52.879 --> 00:15:54.559
so they were like, we want
you to be the flyer, you

218
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know, And I was like,
no, Like, if I'm in a

219
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cheerlead, I want to be like
on the bottom of the pyramid. Yeah,

220
00:16:00.039 --> 00:16:03.159
and I want to are peeling those
girls up yeah, you know right,

221
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you know, like if I can
look up their skirts. Cool.

222
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Yeah, I don't want to hear
you know, sit on my hand.

223
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I'll hold you above my head.
Absolutely. I don't want to be up

224
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in the air like no, oh
wow. So so how long? And

225
00:16:21.120 --> 00:16:23.799
I know we're hopping around because that's
how my brain works. How long did

226
00:16:23.799 --> 00:16:27.519
you continue with this pattern of self
harm? Like? Did this go well

227
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into adulthood and marriage and everything?
Oh? Yeah, yeah, up until

228
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pop surgery? Really yeah your therapist? Did you tell your therapist about it?

229
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M h? And their response was
they knew. I mean, of

230
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course they wanted me to stop.
I signed so many safety agreements through the

231
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years, you know whatever. You
just get better at hiding, yeah,

232
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what you're doing. Yeah. So
I just thought of a question, what

233
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was it like for you? You
being pregnant and having a child. That's

234
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probably people will look a look at
that as being like the most womanly thing

235
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a woman can do, right,
What was that like for you? I

236
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didn't mind being pregnant I had easy
pregnancies. Uh, and my periods stopped.

237
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Ah, good point, you know, so for the pregnancy plus breastfeeding,

238
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I didn't have to worry about it. That was definitely a bonus.

239
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It was weird, I guess like
I would. I remember watching my stomach

240
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when you could see like the baby's
feet move across, your hands move across,

241
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and being like an alien. You
know, it's just kind of weird.

242
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But but I mean, it is
weird, let's be honest. Yeah

243
00:17:42.240 --> 00:17:47.119
it is, but it wasn't bad. It wasn't bad. It wasn't You

244
00:17:47.119 --> 00:17:49.920
don't know if it was extraordinarily weird
for you because you felt like a man.

245
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Yeah no, I felt just disconnected. Okay, I get you.

246
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That makes sense. Like I could
look at it as I'm growing a baby.

247
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Mm hmm, so it was like
a science clinical Okay. Yeah,

248
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I'm thinking about this in my head
because I'm thinking about how I felt being

249
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pregnant, and it was again I'm
not trans. It was fine. I

250
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didn't feel extraordinarily womanly. I did
hate how huge my boobs got, but

251
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that's just because I am not a
fan of having huge boothe but it's not

252
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because I'm trans. I just don't
like huge boobs. What was that like

253
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for you? I mean, did
your boobs get huge? So I was

254
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a double D prior to pregnancy to
a G they make those, yeah,

255
00:18:33.599 --> 00:18:37.079
yeah they do. It looked like
watermelons on both sides. I was,

256
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Yeah, I did not like that
part at all, right, right,

257
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And I remember I googled a lot
of breast reduction, you know, like

258
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what what would you need to get
a medical brass or rest reduction? Yeah,

259
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and I never liked those. I
did have an issue with that.

260
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What about nursing? Was that weird? Not really, but again and I

261
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kind of detached myself from it.
I guess we just like I'm feeding my

262
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kid, and you know it was
like I'm just feeding my mother child bonding.

263
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No, I mean it wasn't that
way for me either, because I

264
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hate breastfeeding. But again, not
trans I'm just as I'm thinking of things

265
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that I didn't like about pregnancy.
Yeah, just wondering like was that like

266
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the breastfeeding that's such a again in
quotation woman thing to do, but you

267
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just sort of disconnect it. You're
just feeding a kid. Yeah. I

268
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looked at it as well. It's
easier than making bottles and it's healthy,

269
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and you know, like it was
all just a it was a process.

270
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So I guess I was good at
disconnecting myself from my body. But I

271
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had to do that in order to
have sex. Good point, Oh you

272
00:19:42.039 --> 00:19:45.799
want to talk Do you want to
talk about that? Sure? I mean,

273
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yeah, I I married my ex
husband because he courced me into having

274
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sex prior to us being married.
Gotcha, I knew I was chewed gum

275
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and no one would want me because
I had been tainted. You have no

276
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choice at that point in my mind, I had no choice. I was

277
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seventeen, Like right, you know, seventeen year old aren't smart? So

278
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whatever. Yeah, So anyone listening
that doesn't have a Mormon or religious background,

279
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there's this teaching in the Mormon Church
and other churches that the girls are

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taught from go right, to keep
yourself clean and pure for your future husband,

281
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like this is your value as being
a virgin and being chased, and

282
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I fucking hate that shit. So
there there would be teachings like in class

283
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as you're a teenager, a teenage
girl, about would you chew somebody's already

284
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chewed gum? No, you wouldn't. Well guess what if you're not a

285
00:20:52.359 --> 00:20:56.720
virgin, you're chewed gum. There
was one of the teaching. I remember

286
00:20:56.720 --> 00:21:00.400
that teaching, and I remember about
the who wants apple with a bite already

287
00:21:00.400 --> 00:21:04.160
taken out of it? Right?
More recently, in in the last ten

288
00:21:04.240 --> 00:21:07.359
years, it was do you really
want a cracked iPad? You know,

289
00:21:08.400 --> 00:21:14.400
like, what the fuck? What
a horrible teaching. And I know that

290
00:21:14.839 --> 00:21:18.519
I've talked about this a shit tone
on multiple episodes of the podcast because it's

291
00:21:18.559 --> 00:21:22.799
so so damaging. But you know, look at what it did to you.

292
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Again, you chose to marry him, did you? Did you really?

293
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Right? Right? Like, no, you didn't because because you're only

294
00:21:30.920 --> 00:21:37.799
worth is being a virgin for yourself, right, and so since your virginity

295
00:21:37.880 --> 00:21:41.279
was gone, it's it's him or
no one in your mind. I'm sure

296
00:21:42.160 --> 00:21:48.400
I was not a virgin when I
got married, and so I this is

297
00:21:48.440 --> 00:21:53.359
going to sound horrible. I would
have married whatever boy, man, whatever

298
00:21:53.440 --> 00:21:59.200
came along and was willing to marry
me. Right. I remember you saying,

299
00:21:59.200 --> 00:22:02.799
you know, it's like whoever,
what have you? Because you're taught

300
00:22:03.079 --> 00:22:06.200
your value just went like you know, strike driving a used car off the

301
00:22:06.240 --> 00:22:10.400
lot, you know, like,
yeah, your value just decreased by seventy

302
00:22:10.400 --> 00:22:15.759
five percent, Like what, so
it's so fucked up, it's so fucked

303
00:22:15.839 --> 00:22:19.200
up, And so then you end
up having these marriages that should have never

304
00:22:19.240 --> 00:22:25.480
happened in the first place. M
h. Which is why the divorce rate

305
00:22:25.799 --> 00:22:30.279
is astronomical. Astronomical. It's funny
too, and I'm going off track here,

306
00:22:30.319 --> 00:22:34.839
but you know, people in the
church will talk about how wicked the

307
00:22:34.880 --> 00:22:40.279
world is getting that, you know, the divorce rates are so high,

308
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and if you leave the church,
your family will fall apart, your marriage

309
00:22:44.480 --> 00:22:48.759
will fall apart. In that psych
because you're doing wicked things. But no,

310
00:22:48.640 --> 00:22:52.839
no, no, no. I
think people who leave the church,

311
00:22:52.920 --> 00:22:57.319
a lot of them recognize I never
should have gotten married to this person.

312
00:22:57.400 --> 00:23:00.720
And it's not a dis on the
other person. I'm just saying, they're

313
00:23:00.759 --> 00:23:03.160
like, there' see, I should
never I would never do this in the

314
00:23:03.200 --> 00:23:07.799
real world with my actual brain functioning
and be making choices on my own.

315
00:23:07.359 --> 00:23:11.880
And that's why the marriage is end. It's not because now you're a sinner.

316
00:23:11.359 --> 00:23:15.960
It's because you're finally able to use
your brain and recognize this shit should

317
00:23:15.000 --> 00:23:18.359
never have happened. Like, wow, we have nothing in common. We

318
00:23:18.759 --> 00:23:23.960
you know, let right, we
hate each other. I don't even want

319
00:23:25.000 --> 00:23:27.160
to have coffee with you, Like, what what the fuck? I you

320
00:23:27.200 --> 00:23:30.920
know? Uh yeah, So no, you don't just leave the church and

321
00:23:32.000 --> 00:23:33.720
become wicked and that's why your family
falls apart. You leave the church and

322
00:23:33.720 --> 00:23:37.519
you start thinking about your life and
you're going, oh hmm, yeah,

323
00:23:37.599 --> 00:23:41.079
that that was a bad choice that
was made. Choice in quotations that was

324
00:23:41.119 --> 00:23:45.160
made. Yeah, I don't know
what got me off on that tangent?

325
00:23:45.599 --> 00:23:48.519
Oh the so the sex with the
with the husband. So the reason that

326
00:23:48.559 --> 00:23:53.000
you got married was because you were
now tainted, right, So well,

327
00:23:53.039 --> 00:23:56.039
if you're gonna get married, it's
gonna have to be him. And that's

328
00:23:56.079 --> 00:24:00.440
such a healthy way to start a
marriage. Absolutely, it's the best way

329
00:24:00.480 --> 00:24:04.359
to start a marriage. So,
so, did you guys get married civilly

330
00:24:04.400 --> 00:24:07.599
and then went to the temple or
did we wait a year? Yeah?

331
00:24:07.880 --> 00:24:10.799
Uh, we got married civilly and
then a year later went through the temple,

332
00:24:11.119 --> 00:24:14.680
and of course that was the disappointment
of the family. You know,

333
00:24:15.480 --> 00:24:18.839
got to have a civil wedding because
you're you know, the center. Did

334
00:24:18.839 --> 00:24:23.000
your bishop do the wedding? He
did, and he gave the lovely speech,

335
00:24:23.240 --> 00:24:29.039
you know, that that's like,
now, remember that this is only

336
00:24:29.079 --> 00:24:33.000
for time because blah blah blah,
and when you die, you're not going

337
00:24:33.079 --> 00:24:37.160
to be together anymore, and the
only way to do that is to go

338
00:24:37.240 --> 00:24:41.480
through the temple. And it's like, you know, like your wedding is

339
00:24:41.519 --> 00:24:44.599
just one huge, like lecture,
and it's like it was like a death

340
00:24:44.720 --> 00:24:48.039
or something, and you're like,
wow, this is such a great occasion.

341
00:24:48.079 --> 00:24:52.359
I'm so happy I'm doing this,
Like, wow, let's let's celebrate.

342
00:24:52.559 --> 00:24:56.519
I'm like, what is wrong with
you people? So well, you

343
00:24:56.519 --> 00:25:00.440
probably knew, I mean, had
you had you been to civil weddings before,

344
00:25:00.519 --> 00:25:02.960
like been to wine seeing that shit? Okay, so did were you

345
00:25:03.039 --> 00:25:07.559
prepared for the lecture you were getting
there? Okay? Yeah, I went

346
00:25:07.599 --> 00:25:11.279
to a friend's wedding. I mean
I was probably twenty at the time,

347
00:25:11.319 --> 00:25:17.000
I guess, and she had gotten
pregnant and so they had a civil wedding

348
00:25:17.079 --> 00:25:18.920
first, so she had to hurry
and get married before she was starting to

349
00:25:18.960 --> 00:25:23.400
show, right, But everyone knows, like if you're Mormon and you're getting

350
00:25:23.400 --> 00:25:26.319
married not in the temple, people
know it's either because you got knocked up

351
00:25:26.440 --> 00:25:30.599
or you're for sure having sex,
Like that's that's oh yeah, and you're

352
00:25:30.640 --> 00:25:33.480
not gonna stop having sex, So
you're gonna get married and then go to

353
00:25:33.480 --> 00:25:34.880
the temple in a year. You're
gonna have sex for that year. It's

354
00:25:36.079 --> 00:25:38.400
ridiculous, But I remember the bishop, uh there, and these, by

355
00:25:38.440 --> 00:25:41.599
the way, are not temple weddings
when the bishop is doing them like in

356
00:25:41.680 --> 00:25:47.079
the cultural hall for listeners who don't
know that, by the way, the

357
00:25:47.119 --> 00:25:49.640
cultural hall is basically a gym.
Yeah. I think we did a whole

358
00:25:49.680 --> 00:25:55.480
episode about like the ridiculous decorations in
a cultural or wedding streamers from the basketball

359
00:25:55.480 --> 00:26:00.559
hoops. Yep, hell yeah,
uh. Anyway, it's I don't know

360
00:26:00.599 --> 00:26:03.759
if the bishop is instructed to say
this. He probably is, or they

361
00:26:03.799 --> 00:26:08.440
just can't resist the urge to point
out that your wedding valves that you're saying

362
00:26:08.440 --> 00:26:14.759
they're in the gym slash cultural hall
are not for time and all eternity.

363
00:26:15.039 --> 00:26:19.240
It's till death do us part.
And it is driven home to you that

364
00:26:19.720 --> 00:26:27.039
you fucked up by having to get
married for time only, and that the

365
00:26:27.079 --> 00:26:32.759
only way to have this person for
eternity is to basically get your shit together

366
00:26:33.839 --> 00:26:36.440
and go to the temple in a
year. Yep. Yep. And if

367
00:26:36.480 --> 00:26:40.039
you die on the way home from
your from your honeymoon, you're fought.

368
00:26:40.079 --> 00:26:45.359
Well, you're done, like not
getting into heaven. Now that's such a

369
00:26:45.440 --> 00:26:48.240
Jesus thing to do, by the
way, to just fucking separate people who

370
00:26:48.319 --> 00:26:52.079
love each other. Right, No, Well, well, you know,

371
00:26:52.119 --> 00:26:55.559
when my daughter got married in the
temple, I had a bunch of people,

372
00:26:56.160 --> 00:27:00.240
you know, who would make comments
to me like you're choosing a lesbian

373
00:27:00.279 --> 00:27:07.200
lifestyle over being in your daughter's wedding, And I'm like, not really,

374
00:27:07.759 --> 00:27:11.480
Like I'm not the one who chose
to get married in the temple. I'm

375
00:27:11.519 --> 00:27:15.400
not the one who chose to exclude
me from the ceremony. Like that's the

376
00:27:15.480 --> 00:27:18.759
church that chose that. You're also
not the one who chose to be a

377
00:27:18.799 --> 00:27:22.200
lesbian, like right, Like that
you didn't choose to be attracted to women,

378
00:27:22.880 --> 00:27:25.599
right. And I had another child
who had already left the church.

379
00:27:25.720 --> 00:27:27.440
So I was like, so you're
telling me that I'm basically having to choose

380
00:27:27.480 --> 00:27:32.519
between my children because when I die, you know, if I go to

381
00:27:32.519 --> 00:27:33.200
heaven, I'm not going to see
him, But if I go to Hell,

382
00:27:33.240 --> 00:27:37.680
I'm not going to see her.
So so I have to choose God,

383
00:27:37.039 --> 00:27:41.559
Like, does God really do that? Does he make you choose between

384
00:27:41.559 --> 00:27:45.960
your children? No kind of supreme
being that I would ever believe in would

385
00:27:45.960 --> 00:27:48.920
do that, Like, that's some
bullshit, but I hadn't thought about that.

386
00:27:48.000 --> 00:27:52.319
So with you having one kid that's
Mormon and a believer and one that's

387
00:27:52.359 --> 00:27:56.279
not, Like, if you become
super Mormon again, not that that will

388
00:27:56.279 --> 00:28:00.440
ever happen, so that you can
go to the highest Kingdom of Heaven and

389
00:28:00.480 --> 00:28:07.920
be with your super obedient family.
That's like telling you your non Mormon kid,

390
00:28:07.039 --> 00:28:11.599
like, sorry, I'm gonna go
be with the righteous people, right,

391
00:28:11.759 --> 00:28:17.279
right, But if you choose to
live your authentic life, which I

392
00:28:17.279 --> 00:28:21.640
would say would be good for the
kid who's not a member, right,

393
00:28:21.759 --> 00:28:26.160
you're setting the example of being true
to yourself. Well, now you're excluding

394
00:28:26.160 --> 00:28:33.319
yourself fraternity from being with your super
Mormon kid. Yeah that's so fucked up.

395
00:28:33.160 --> 00:28:40.000
Yeah, but people don't see that. Oh Mormon's you know all about

396
00:28:40.039 --> 00:28:48.519
family really yeah really yeah Jesus.
Anyway, that was quite the offshoot tantrum

397
00:28:48.759 --> 00:28:52.160
that got no one here to really
back in. So I'm just going for

398
00:28:52.319 --> 00:28:56.559
it works for me. Okay,
So you had to get married sex with

399
00:28:56.599 --> 00:29:00.960
the husband was this just like this
connect, this isn't happening. Whatever,

400
00:29:02.559 --> 00:29:06.680
be done with it? Yeah,
like out of body kind of yeah,

401
00:29:07.400 --> 00:29:14.480
disconnect. So I know for me, it was hard for me because again

402
00:29:14.680 --> 00:29:17.599
I'm a lesbian. That's kind of
a name of the podcast. So having

403
00:29:17.680 --> 00:29:21.480
straight sex was not a thing that
I really wanted to do. And so

404
00:29:21.680 --> 00:29:26.279
because I did something sexual but I
didn't want to do, I always felt

405
00:29:27.200 --> 00:29:32.559
cheap, kind of like a whore. And this wasn't put on me by

406
00:29:32.720 --> 00:29:34.079
my husband at all. He didn't
even know I was having these thoughts at

407
00:29:34.119 --> 00:29:38.400
all. This was just my internal
conversation anything like that. For you,

408
00:29:38.480 --> 00:29:45.000
what was it? It was more
like being raped, Yeah, because you're

409
00:29:45.039 --> 00:29:49.960
doing what you don't want to do. I'm sorry. I think a lot

410
00:29:51.000 --> 00:29:56.599
of women in marriages go through that. Whether you're straight or gay, it

411
00:29:56.640 --> 00:30:00.519
doesn't matter, but I think that
a lot of women just kind of like,

412
00:30:02.480 --> 00:30:03.680
well, this is my job,
this is what I'm supposed to do.

413
00:30:04.359 --> 00:30:07.359
Well, yeah, because if he
masturbates or watches port, it's your

414
00:30:07.359 --> 00:30:11.759
fault, right doing your job.
Yeah, he's not getting enough. Yeah,

415
00:30:11.759 --> 00:30:15.519
So you know, it's like you're
responsible for your own salvation and your

416
00:30:15.599 --> 00:30:19.319
husband's salvation and your kid's salvation.
And that's a lot of people that you're

417
00:30:19.319 --> 00:30:23.079
trying to get into heaven, you
know, So aren't you glad we'd have

418
00:30:23.119 --> 00:30:27.359
to worry about getting people to heaven
anymore. Hallelujah, let'm worry it's about

419
00:30:27.359 --> 00:30:32.160
themselves. Let's just all go to
hell Jesus, It's gonna be way better.

420
00:30:33.799 --> 00:30:37.480
Yeah. So, how many years
were you married? I was married

421
00:30:37.519 --> 00:30:40.920
for ten years. Okay, so
ten years of just trying to toe the

422
00:30:40.960 --> 00:30:45.759
line. M h and I during
your marriage? Was that a lot of

423
00:30:45.759 --> 00:30:52.240
the time that you spent in and
out of facilities for mental health? I

424
00:30:52.240 --> 00:30:56.880
think it's been about once a year
for the last four years we were married.

425
00:30:56.160 --> 00:30:59.640
Yeah. And then I was like, I can't do this. Yeah.

426
00:31:00.759 --> 00:31:07.880
Terrible, terrible, terrible, terrible. That's some deep shit. I

427
00:31:07.920 --> 00:31:11.680
hate that for you and for everyone. And by the way, thank you

428
00:31:11.839 --> 00:31:15.920
for being vulnerable enough to share this. I mean, this is some deep,

429
00:31:15.000 --> 00:31:18.039
dark shit that I'm sure there are
people right now listening that are like,

430
00:31:18.279 --> 00:31:22.559
oh wow, I thought I was
the only one who went through that,

431
00:31:22.640 --> 00:31:26.319
But there's a lot of people that
have silently suffered, and I think

432
00:31:26.599 --> 00:31:30.799
people like you being willing to talk
about it just saves lives. I really

433
00:31:30.880 --> 00:31:34.480
believe that I do. Yeah.
So back to penis talk. Yes,

434
00:31:37.920 --> 00:31:44.920
let's jump. So last episode when
we spoke, we talked about you know,

435
00:31:44.960 --> 00:31:48.920
you got divorced and the girlfriend,
the wife, etc. Et cetera.

436
00:31:49.880 --> 00:31:56.599
Then you are to the point of
deciding, yes, I would like

437
00:31:56.119 --> 00:32:00.920
bottom surgery. So you've been researched, seeing different types, You've talked about

438
00:32:00.960 --> 00:32:05.640
that before. At what point did
you decide, all right, let's talk

439
00:32:05.680 --> 00:32:08.400
to a doctor. I wanted to
say. That was twenty twenty one.

440
00:32:09.039 --> 00:32:13.680
Yeah, and then once you schedule
the consult they're like six months out.

441
00:32:13.799 --> 00:32:16.799
So at that time they were six
months out and now they're years. So,

442
00:32:16.839 --> 00:32:20.839
by the way, what's the process
do you have to anymore have like

443
00:32:21.160 --> 00:32:24.640
a psychiatrist say yes, this person
needs this surgery. What's the process.

444
00:32:24.960 --> 00:32:30.839
So when I had my consult so
again this was twenty twenty one, I

445
00:32:30.880 --> 00:32:32.839
had to have three letters. I
had to have one from a medical professional,

446
00:32:34.319 --> 00:32:38.279
my doctor who prescribed my hormones,
stating how long I'd been on testosterone.

447
00:32:38.839 --> 00:32:43.799
I had to have a letter from
my therapist saying how long I had

448
00:32:43.839 --> 00:32:46.519
been presenting as mail. And I
had to have a letter from an additional

449
00:32:46.720 --> 00:32:52.079
therapist stating that they agreed with the
first therapist that I actually did have gender

450
00:32:52.119 --> 00:32:57.119
dysphoria, as this is, you
know, a persistent pattern of belief that

451
00:32:57.160 --> 00:33:00.160
I am in the wrong body.
So how do you feel? How do

452
00:33:00.200 --> 00:33:01.400
you feel about that? I have
no opinion on that at this point,

453
00:33:01.400 --> 00:33:05.599
I haven't thought about it. What's
your opinion? Having three people need to

454
00:33:05.640 --> 00:33:09.799
kind of agree with you. You
know a lot of people are upset about

455
00:33:09.799 --> 00:33:17.839
that. I personally feel for bottom
surgery for gender confirmation surgery because it's considered

456
00:33:17.880 --> 00:33:25.680
an irreversible surgery. You know that
it wasn't a bad thing to have multiple

457
00:33:25.680 --> 00:33:30.599
people have to agree that this is
actually something I'm dealing with. You know,

458
00:33:30.440 --> 00:33:35.079
it's the same thing with people are
saying that miners are getting gender confirmation

459
00:33:35.119 --> 00:33:37.200
surgery. No they're not, they're
not. You know, a sixteen year

460
00:33:37.200 --> 00:33:39.559
old cannot go into the doctor's office
and be like I want a penis and

461
00:33:39.759 --> 00:33:43.720
have surgery scheduled a week later.
Like, that's not going to happen.

462
00:33:44.119 --> 00:33:45.440
You know. For me, it
was I had to be in therapy for

463
00:33:45.480 --> 00:33:49.440
at least a year. I had
to be on testosterone for at least a

464
00:33:49.519 --> 00:33:53.319
year. I had to be presenting
as my desired gender for at least a

465
00:33:53.400 --> 00:33:58.519
year, like those are the minimum
requirements. So and that means you're out

466
00:33:58.559 --> 00:34:00.680
socially, you're out at work,
you're out at home, you're out to

467
00:34:00.720 --> 00:34:07.680
your friends. You are that gender
in all your dealings every day. So

468
00:34:07.239 --> 00:34:09.880
not I just put on address every
once in a while, and or you

469
00:34:09.920 --> 00:34:12.440
know, I just put on pants
every once in a while. Like,

470
00:34:12.519 --> 00:34:17.199
no, it was not an easy
process. And then once I had my

471
00:34:17.280 --> 00:34:23.360
console, so I actually had consoles
with two different surgeons for folloplasty and two

472
00:34:23.360 --> 00:34:29.159
different surgeons for metoidoplasty, so I've
had four consoles all together. To talk

473
00:34:29.159 --> 00:34:31.920
about there, to look at a
bunch of surgical photos which are not at

474
00:34:31.920 --> 00:34:37.239
all pleasant to look at. They're
very gory, to hear about complications,

475
00:34:37.840 --> 00:34:43.280
to hear about the preparation, you
know, and then it was like,

476
00:34:43.360 --> 00:34:46.239
okay, your BMI has to be
under this amount. You have to not

477
00:34:46.360 --> 00:34:50.800
carry your weight in this way.
I had to get a stomach surgery done

478
00:34:50.960 --> 00:34:54.480
first to remove the excess skin from
pregnancies. Really, so that was back

479
00:34:54.480 --> 00:34:58.360
in August that they had to go
into that as like a mini tummy tuck

480
00:35:00.000 --> 00:35:05.599
because the overhanging skin can cut off
blood supply to the fallac and create cause

481
00:35:05.639 --> 00:35:08.000
it to fall off, so which
you obviously don't want to happen. We

482
00:35:08.039 --> 00:35:12.039
don't want that, right, These
are good things. These are good things

483
00:35:12.079 --> 00:35:15.039
to know. I would never would
have known anything about this, the things

484
00:35:15.079 --> 00:35:19.840
that you have to go through to
be spiteful. And then X husband,

485
00:35:20.239 --> 00:35:23.519
right exactly, you know, because
I can't my ex husband and then yeah,

486
00:35:23.559 --> 00:35:27.039
you know, and then I had
to do hair removal on my arm

487
00:35:27.559 --> 00:35:31.199
that took almost a full two years. I did laser and electrolysis. So

488
00:35:31.280 --> 00:35:37.360
I have spent over three thousand dollars
of my own money to remove hair from

489
00:35:37.519 --> 00:35:42.760
my arm so that it won't grow
back ever. That right, because they

490
00:35:42.920 --> 00:35:45.880
use the interior of your arm.
So I'll kind of show you here,

491
00:35:47.000 --> 00:35:51.960
So my arm, where my tattoo
is, that will actually be inside my

492
00:35:52.119 --> 00:35:55.440
urethra. So they create the urethra
out of your inner form and then the

493
00:35:55.480 --> 00:35:59.960
external form will be the exterior of
the penis. So it has to be

494
00:36:00.159 --> 00:36:04.880
completely hairless at least on the inside
for sure, because any hair that you

495
00:36:05.000 --> 00:36:09.599
can grow in the urethra can cause
issues for sure. Yeah, okay,

496
00:36:09.719 --> 00:36:12.440
so you have to go through that. You know, I had to lose

497
00:36:12.480 --> 00:36:15.480
weight. I had to get the
surgery to remove the excess skin. Yeah,

498
00:36:15.639 --> 00:36:19.320
Like if you smoke, which I
don't. I never been on.

499
00:36:20.440 --> 00:36:22.840
You don't just wake up when morning
decide hey, I'm a man, I'm

500
00:36:22.880 --> 00:36:27.639
going to go get a penis.
Like, that's not how it works.

501
00:36:28.519 --> 00:36:34.480
That's how some people would watch people
to think that it works. And you

502
00:36:34.519 --> 00:36:37.679
know, the kind of like a
scare tactic of well, now people just

503
00:36:37.679 --> 00:36:39.880
decide one day they're a boy and
they go and they butcher them their bodies

504
00:36:39.960 --> 00:36:43.639
up. That's not how it goes
down. Yeah. No, no,

505
00:36:44.360 --> 00:36:47.119
if it were that easy, some
people would be very happy. But to

506
00:36:47.159 --> 00:36:52.400
even get on testosterone is not that
easy. Like top surgery was two letters.

507
00:36:52.639 --> 00:36:54.360
I had to have two letters to
get top surgery. So you know,

508
00:36:54.800 --> 00:37:00.800
it's a lot of meeting with mental
health professionals and having to prove who

509
00:37:00.840 --> 00:37:07.400
you are repeatedly. And you know, it's like if someone if your kid

510
00:37:07.440 --> 00:37:10.400
comes to you and they say I
feel like a boy, and they're five

511
00:37:10.480 --> 00:37:14.400
or six years old, and you
just repeatedly tell them, well you're not,

512
00:37:14.519 --> 00:37:16.400
you're a girl, shut up,
go away, you know whatever.

513
00:37:17.039 --> 00:37:20.599
Like I don't know, I feel
like that's crushing a part of who they

514
00:37:20.599 --> 00:37:25.679
are. Yeah, and it's not
that hard to say, Okay, that's

515
00:37:25.719 --> 00:37:30.119
how you feel, why don't you. You know, if they want to

516
00:37:30.119 --> 00:37:31.440
cut their hair, let them cut
their hair. It's hair, it'll grow

517
00:37:31.480 --> 00:37:35.159
back. If they want to wear
boys clothes or girls clothes, let them

518
00:37:35.159 --> 00:37:37.079
wear the clothes they want to wear. Their clothes, they're covering their naked

519
00:37:37.119 --> 00:37:42.119
body. Who cares? You know. It's kind of like boy toys and

520
00:37:42.199 --> 00:37:45.360
girl toys. Toys are toys,
you know, Like if my kids wanted

521
00:37:45.360 --> 00:37:47.519
to play with toys, they played
with whatever they wanted to play with.

522
00:37:47.599 --> 00:37:50.880
I did not care. I just
wanted to be quiet. I don't care

523
00:37:50.920 --> 00:37:53.079
what you're playing with. Just be
quiet and do it. Yeah. And

524
00:37:53.119 --> 00:37:57.920
I was like, the world is
so gendered, and they try to stick

525
00:37:58.119 --> 00:38:02.280
kids in boxes. Kids don't fit
in boxes. People don't fit in boxes.

526
00:38:04.239 --> 00:38:06.840
And I think if they just laid
off and let kids be who they

527
00:38:06.840 --> 00:38:09.960
are, there are kids who will
say their trans until they hit a certain

528
00:38:09.960 --> 00:38:13.320
point and then they're like, actually
I don't feel that way anymore, No

529
00:38:13.440 --> 00:38:15.800
harm, no foul, right,
you know, they go on with their

530
00:38:15.840 --> 00:38:23.800
life exactly. And on top of
that if if the kid truly is trans

531
00:38:23.960 --> 00:38:29.280
and you're telling them their whole childhood
that they're not, they're gonna have some

532
00:38:29.280 --> 00:38:36.440
some fucking issues. And if they're
not truly trans, they're they're gonna change

533
00:38:36.519 --> 00:38:38.320
back, change their opinion or what
have you. Anyway, So just be

534
00:38:38.480 --> 00:38:44.519
supportive and let them figure their shit
out, right right, yeah right,

535
00:38:44.760 --> 00:38:46.760
And that's why I've had actually several
friends come to me who know that I

536
00:38:46.800 --> 00:38:52.079
transitioned. They've come to me later
down the road and said, my child

537
00:38:52.159 --> 00:38:53.599
just came out to me as trans, and I need to know what to

538
00:38:53.639 --> 00:38:58.239
do. These are people who I
knew from the church, so people I

539
00:38:58.280 --> 00:39:00.119
grew up with in the church and
they're kids have come out to them as

540
00:39:00.119 --> 00:39:05.440
trans, and they've come to me
because they know they saw me as a

541
00:39:05.440 --> 00:39:08.880
teenager, and they're like, what
do I do? And I'm like,

542
00:39:09.519 --> 00:39:16.760
you listen to them, respect that
they know themselves, and let them do

543
00:39:16.840 --> 00:39:22.280
puberty blockers because the only thing that
will do is stop puberty. That's it.

544
00:39:22.280 --> 00:39:25.559
It doesn't hurt them, and if
they change their mind, they stop

545
00:39:25.599 --> 00:39:29.880
them, and their puberty starts like
it's supposed to and they go into their

546
00:39:29.920 --> 00:39:34.639
natural puberty. But if they truly
are. Trans It stops their period and

547
00:39:34.679 --> 00:39:39.159
it stops boob growth, and that
could save mental health. It's like if

548
00:39:39.199 --> 00:39:44.320
I had been able to do that, Yeah, wow, we know so

549
00:39:44.400 --> 00:39:47.519
much more now than was out you
know, years and years and years ago.

550
00:39:49.239 --> 00:39:51.679
And again it's because people talk about
it, right. I mean,

551
00:39:51.719 --> 00:39:54.840
if someone could have understood you as
a child and you, if you would

552
00:39:54.840 --> 00:40:00.360
have had access to puberty blockers as
you're just kind of figuring your shit out,

553
00:40:00.440 --> 00:40:05.119
you likely wouldn't have been punching yourself
in the face and cutting yourself.

554
00:40:05.320 --> 00:40:10.559
And you know it would have been
so people who are listening now, I

555
00:40:10.599 --> 00:40:13.840
guess you would tell them what you
just said, like, love your kids,

556
00:40:13.840 --> 00:40:16.599
support your kid. You know,
it's it's only hair, and believe

557
00:40:16.639 --> 00:40:21.639
your kids. Believe your kids,
yes, and that's with any kind of

558
00:40:21.840 --> 00:40:25.039
thing they tell you. You know, they're they're queer, they're whatever.

559
00:40:25.679 --> 00:40:30.480
Just believe them. They know themselves
better than you do. Even though you're

560
00:40:30.519 --> 00:40:32.519
their parent and you think you know
them better than anyone in the world.

561
00:40:34.599 --> 00:40:39.400
No one knows you better than you. And you can raise your kids however

562
00:40:39.440 --> 00:40:44.000
you want to raise them. They're
going to do what they're gonna do.

563
00:40:44.760 --> 00:40:47.039
If you love them, you'll at
least have the good relationship with them,

564
00:40:47.039 --> 00:40:52.400
so you'll know your child not You
know, my parents didn't know me.

565
00:40:52.639 --> 00:40:58.719
They didn't know me until then.
Now they know me now years old nine.

566
00:40:58.920 --> 00:41:01.840
Yeah, you know, I think
of the relationship I could have had

567
00:41:01.880 --> 00:41:08.119
with them if they'd known me all
along. Yes, think of the relationship

568
00:41:08.199 --> 00:41:13.599
they could have had with you if
they had known you all along. That's

569
00:41:14.320 --> 00:41:16.960
beautiful. And one thing I often
tell people, and this is something that

570
00:41:17.719 --> 00:41:23.000
I heard a long time ago,
you know, it was would you rather

571
00:41:23.039 --> 00:41:27.639
have a dead child or a gay
child? You know? With my parents,

572
00:41:27.639 --> 00:41:30.039
it was what would you rather have
a dead daughter or a live son?

573
00:41:31.000 --> 00:41:37.280
Yeah? Either way? That person
you knew doesn't exist anymore, right

574
00:41:37.400 --> 00:41:40.159
that person? Yeah? Absolutely,
So you can know the person who is

575
00:41:40.199 --> 00:41:44.880
here, or you can have no
relationship with your child at all. Would

576
00:41:44.920 --> 00:41:49.559
you rather? Right? I know? Wow? Huh some deep shit.

577
00:41:51.079 --> 00:41:57.639
Okay, back to this upcoming surgery. So you had to go you had

578
00:41:57.639 --> 00:42:02.719
to be years of a stomach surgery
to get rid of any kind of overhanging

579
00:42:02.800 --> 00:42:09.599
flesh from from your baby making days. Uh, letters from doctors stopping your

580
00:42:09.599 --> 00:42:13.599
hair from growing on your arm?
What else? What else? Are you

581
00:42:13.599 --> 00:42:16.800
your preparations. Uh, let's see. I mean that's pretty much it for

582
00:42:17.639 --> 00:42:21.960
physical preparations. I guess, you
know, getting in shape, you have

583
00:42:22.039 --> 00:42:27.559
to make sure you have good cardiovascular
and blah blah blah. But the surgery

584
00:42:27.559 --> 00:42:30.639
itself, you know, is not
a picnic. So this is a nine

585
00:42:30.679 --> 00:42:34.159
to twelve hour surgery in the operating
room that you're under und stea show.

586
00:42:35.400 --> 00:42:39.960
So starting today, I had to
start showering with hippocleans, the antiseptic cleanser.

587
00:42:40.679 --> 00:42:44.000
I have to do that every morning. I have to do it the

588
00:42:44.079 --> 00:42:46.599
night before surgery and the morning of
surgery. I'm four days away now,

589
00:42:46.840 --> 00:42:52.159
four days okay, the day before
surgery, so Sunday I have to do

590
00:42:52.679 --> 00:42:57.199
a colon cleanse, like is if
you're having a colonoscopy, So you get

591
00:42:57.199 --> 00:43:00.079
to do the lovely prep where you're
you know, in the bathroom all day

592
00:43:01.079 --> 00:43:05.800
because you have to be completely empty. So yeah, so you're on like

593
00:43:05.800 --> 00:43:07.760
a clear liquid diet. The day
before surgery, you're doing the colon cleanse.

594
00:43:08.639 --> 00:43:13.599
The morning of surgery, you know, it's the hospital six hours after

595
00:43:13.719 --> 00:43:17.840
surgery. You're in the ICU the
first night because you can end up having

596
00:43:17.840 --> 00:43:22.159
to go back for emergency surgery anytime
in the first twelve hours after you're done.

597
00:43:22.159 --> 00:43:25.599
You still don't get to eat for
the first twenty four hours after surgery.

598
00:43:25.880 --> 00:43:30.119
Oh, that would be the worst
part. Yeah. Yeah, So

599
00:43:30.159 --> 00:43:32.840
at this point it'll be like three
days with no solid food by the time

600
00:43:32.840 --> 00:43:37.000
I can finally eat again. And
all of all of this to spite your

601
00:43:37.400 --> 00:43:43.360
ex husband. Wow, yes,
you see how much I hate him.

602
00:43:45.480 --> 00:43:47.199
So you're in the hospital for five
days. You're flat on your back for

603
00:43:47.239 --> 00:43:52.039
the first four so you can't even
sit in a chair like you know.

604
00:43:52.199 --> 00:44:00.320
I will have four drains and two
catheters coming out of my body. I

605
00:44:00.320 --> 00:44:07.000
will have a wound back on my
arm and dressing on my leg. They

606
00:44:07.039 --> 00:44:09.519
have like a cloud, they call
it the cloud. It goes around the

607
00:44:09.559 --> 00:44:13.760
pallas to keep it at a forty
five degree angle away from your body because

608
00:44:13.760 --> 00:44:16.960
it has to stay in that position
to make sure that the blood flow stays

609
00:44:16.960 --> 00:44:23.719
good, that nothing detaches where it
shouldn't. And then on day five you

610
00:44:23.800 --> 00:44:28.719
can be discharged from the hospital.
We have to stay in California for five

611
00:44:28.800 --> 00:44:31.559
weeks. I have postop visits every
week. So this is you know,

612
00:44:31.599 --> 00:44:37.360
you're paying for a rental in California, which is not cheap. Plus your

613
00:44:37.400 --> 00:44:44.679
normal house bills back at home,
you know, so it's yeah, it's

614
00:44:44.719 --> 00:44:47.960
a very expensive. The surgery out
of pocket is over one hundred thousand dollars.

615
00:44:50.039 --> 00:44:52.559
I'm lucky that my insurance covers a
lot of it. But there's still

616
00:44:52.880 --> 00:44:59.000
the travel, you know, all
the hair removal, none of that was

617
00:44:59.000 --> 00:45:02.039
covered, all of that stuff,
So it's still a lot of money.

618
00:45:02.239 --> 00:45:05.760
It's a lot of money, a
lot of time, a lot of mental

619
00:45:07.119 --> 00:45:09.360
you know, when you think about
being in a hospital bed for five days,

620
00:45:10.079 --> 00:45:15.559
like that's a lot of mental crap. So especially for someone who's active,

621
00:45:15.960 --> 00:45:22.199
like right by you, Yeah,
what are your what are your worries?

622
00:45:23.400 --> 00:45:30.719
My worries are mostly recovery, the
mental aspect of recovery. Like I've

623
00:45:30.760 --> 00:45:36.039
had twelve surgeries. I think I
don't even know a lot of surgeries.

624
00:45:36.519 --> 00:45:40.280
And the main thing I'm concerned about
is the length of time I have to

625
00:45:40.360 --> 00:45:45.000
be inactive after this one, Like
I can't ride a bike for four to

626
00:45:45.039 --> 00:45:51.599
six months. That's going to be
hard. Because they're the vaginectomy, they

627
00:45:51.639 --> 00:45:55.400
cauterize the vaginal canal, so they
completely seal it shut. It's cauterized it's

628
00:45:55.480 --> 00:46:02.880
gone, and that's painful that,
you know, you can't sit, especially

629
00:46:02.960 --> 00:46:07.159
on a saddle which I have like
a racing bike, can't run for at

630
00:46:07.239 --> 00:46:10.480
least, you know, eight weeks. I think it is so basically my

631
00:46:10.599 --> 00:46:14.239
physical activity. And I was one
who was going to the gym like five

632
00:46:14.280 --> 00:46:17.920
times a week. So yeah,
it's you can't work out, you know,

633
00:46:19.400 --> 00:46:22.480
I can't work like, I can't
do my job. So I'm like,

634
00:46:22.880 --> 00:46:24.480
mentally, it's going to be really
hard for me. I'm not a

635
00:46:24.519 --> 00:46:29.840
person who can sit and do nothing
ever, so I never have been.

636
00:46:29.880 --> 00:46:34.840
I have add really bad, so
I'm I always have to be doing something.

637
00:46:35.000 --> 00:46:37.639
So my girlfriend and I are sitting
here trying to figure out all these

638
00:46:37.639 --> 00:46:39.719
things to keep me busy while I'm
sitting in a bed for four weeks.

639
00:46:43.559 --> 00:46:46.159
Yeah, good luck with that.
Yeah that, Yeah, that's gonna be

640
00:46:46.199 --> 00:46:53.599
tough. I can imagine though that
you can spend lots of time on Facebook

641
00:46:54.039 --> 00:47:00.360
chatting in our Latter Day Lesbian Podcast
discussion group about how you're doing. People

642
00:47:00.400 --> 00:47:04.320
are going to be wanting to check
in on you and everything like that.

643
00:47:04.960 --> 00:47:07.199
What do you think, like,
when are you going to get to see

644
00:47:07.199 --> 00:47:10.840
it? When do you get to
look at your penis. That's a weird

645
00:47:10.920 --> 00:47:15.639
question, but I'm just so curious
as soon as you wake up from surgery,

646
00:47:15.639 --> 00:47:19.719
so it's not wrapped up, Yeah, they'll show you. Yeah,

647
00:47:19.800 --> 00:47:22.159
Okay, it's not right, so
it'll be I'll be able to see it

648
00:47:22.199 --> 00:47:29.320
right away. And I'm super stoked
about that moment, like I wonder.

649
00:47:29.440 --> 00:47:32.280
Yeah, I was. Actually I
was talking to our friend Kirsten, and

650
00:47:32.400 --> 00:47:37.440
I told her that I've had several
people ask me like, are you sure

651
00:47:37.440 --> 00:47:40.400
this is what you want? And
I'm like, I have wanted a penis

652
00:47:40.440 --> 00:47:44.880
since I was five years old,
and I'm going to go to sleep and

653
00:47:44.880 --> 00:47:46.679
I'm going to wake up with one, Like this is this is a dream

654
00:47:46.719 --> 00:47:52.079
come true? Like you know?
Yeah, so no, I'm I'm one

655
00:47:52.119 --> 00:47:55.719
hundred percent positive that this is what
I want, right You're not like,

656
00:47:55.880 --> 00:48:02.559
eh, we'll see they I'll return
it. Yeah. So how long how

657
00:48:02.559 --> 00:48:07.440
long post surgery before you can you
know, use your penis if you know

658
00:48:07.480 --> 00:48:14.199
what I mean? Yeah, anywhere
from six weeks to twelve weeks, depending

659
00:48:14.239 --> 00:48:17.840
on how it heals, if there's
any complications that you know, any open

660
00:48:19.320 --> 00:48:22.000
like any seams open that shouldn't open, that kind of stuff. So basically,

661
00:48:22.039 --> 00:48:25.480
once it's all healed and everything,
the stitches are gone, then you

662
00:48:25.480 --> 00:48:30.639
can use it. I'm just sorry, I'm so full of questions. Is

663
00:48:30.679 --> 00:48:32.920
there a time, because you know, anytime after a surgery, things kind

664
00:48:32.920 --> 00:48:37.519
of swell and they look kind of
like they got beat down. How long

665
00:48:37.559 --> 00:48:40.559
before I think, I guess that
your penis will look normal. I guess

666
00:48:40.559 --> 00:48:44.320
that's a bad word to use,
but you know what I mean, like

667
00:48:44.440 --> 00:48:47.639
it it's gonna look all So is
it gonna yeah? Yeah? They said

668
00:48:47.639 --> 00:48:52.840
the swelling generally can last up to
six months, so okay. And unfortunately

669
00:48:52.880 --> 00:48:57.320
this is not just one surgery,
so there's actually three surgeries. This is

670
00:48:57.400 --> 00:49:00.320
just the first one. What yeay, carry on, tell them tell me

671
00:49:00.360 --> 00:49:06.079
more so. The next surgery,
which is generally six months to a year

672
00:49:06.199 --> 00:49:09.280
later, is when they put the
implants in the scrotum so you'll get the

673
00:49:09.320 --> 00:49:14.920
testicles, and they do the glands
pasty to create the head of the penis

674
00:49:14.960 --> 00:49:21.159
to make it look more realistic,
I guess. And then the third surgery,

675
00:49:21.199 --> 00:49:23.280
which is another six months to a
year down the road, they put

676
00:49:23.320 --> 00:49:28.559
in an erectile device. So there's
two different kinds you can choose from.

677
00:49:28.800 --> 00:49:30.599
I'm going to go with the one
that's inflatable. So what will happen is

678
00:49:30.599 --> 00:49:36.400
they'll remove one of the testicular implants. They put up a bulb in one

679
00:49:36.400 --> 00:49:39.480
of your testicles, and then it
has like two inflatable rods that go through

680
00:49:39.519 --> 00:49:44.719
the penis itself, and you can
pump the testicle and it'll actually blow up

681
00:49:45.679 --> 00:49:51.360
the rods so you can get an
erection and use it. Gotcha, gotcha,

682
00:49:51.400 --> 00:49:53.079
I've heard about I've heard about that
before. Yeah. And then we

683
00:49:53.119 --> 00:49:57.920
also you can get medical tattooing so
it looks completely relate. They'll talk to

684
00:49:58.000 --> 00:50:02.280
the veins on, they'll change the
skin color so it would pass one if

685
00:50:02.280 --> 00:50:06.440
someone were to see it, like
in a locker room. Ah wow,

686
00:50:06.519 --> 00:50:08.719
that's okay, that's cool, because
I mean, you know, that's that's

687
00:50:08.719 --> 00:50:12.559
probably a concern for people as well. I would think it's like, am

688
00:50:12.599 --> 00:50:16.000
I am I gonna look weird?
Right? If so, if I'm in

689
00:50:16.000 --> 00:50:20.159
a locker room or if I'm peeing
in the urinalal and someone glances, like

690
00:50:20.840 --> 00:50:24.840
because you don't want you don't want
to continue your life feeling like do I

691
00:50:24.960 --> 00:50:30.760
pass right? Right? Yeah?
Like I'm finally to the point now where

692
00:50:30.800 --> 00:50:37.920
I'd never get missgendered like ever,
right, But I do worry, you

693
00:50:37.960 --> 00:50:39.840
know, like if I were naked
in a locker room, that would be

694
00:50:39.880 --> 00:50:44.679
a different story obviously. So yeah, you know, like when I go

695
00:50:44.719 --> 00:50:46.760
to the gym or even in public, I still hardly of we'll go into

696
00:50:46.800 --> 00:50:52.159
the bathroom unless it's like an emergency, because I just am extremely uncomfortable going

697
00:50:52.159 --> 00:51:00.440
into a men's restroom. So yeah, I'm hoping that will dissipate as right.

698
00:51:00.519 --> 00:51:02.679
You know, so you plan on
doing all the tattoos and everything.

699
00:51:02.840 --> 00:51:07.400
Yeah, yeah, I plan on
doing That's cool. So I'm looking at

700
00:51:07.440 --> 00:51:10.119
like a three year process from That's
what I was. I was trying to

701
00:51:10.119 --> 00:51:13.199
do the math in my head,
and I suck at that. So it's

702
00:51:13.239 --> 00:51:15.719
it's not again, It's not you
decide one day, I'm a dude,

703
00:51:16.039 --> 00:51:20.719
you go get surgery next week,
and then you know, three weeks later,

704
00:51:20.760 --> 00:51:22.360
you're healed up and you're living as
a land like this is this is

705
00:51:22.400 --> 00:51:28.639
a big ass process. This is
a huge undertaking. Wow, I didn't

706
00:51:29.239 --> 00:51:32.960
I didn't know it was three years. I didn't know the extra surgeries obviously.

707
00:51:34.119 --> 00:51:39.000
Like I'm sure so many people have
learned so much from listening to this

708
00:51:40.079 --> 00:51:43.880
podcast, not just about you,
but about the process of you know,

709
00:51:43.960 --> 00:51:47.239
getting the surgery. Sorry, I'm
kind of just like in a daze right

710
00:51:47.239 --> 00:51:51.239
now, thinking of like taking it
all in, like wow. So then

711
00:51:51.280 --> 00:51:54.800
they do this and then there's the
pumped part and then three years and that's

712
00:51:54.840 --> 00:52:00.000
amazing. Yeah, it's definitely a
process and to see where you came from.

713
00:52:01.119 --> 00:52:07.039
Yeah, yeah, wow. Sorry, I'm almost speechless and that's hard

714
00:52:07.079 --> 00:52:12.360
for me, and I'm just like
taking this all in. It's incredible.

715
00:52:12.519 --> 00:52:16.760
Someone note that on the calendar right, Shelley was speechless. It won't last.

716
00:52:17.000 --> 00:52:22.000
It won't last. Don't worry.
So if people who are listening,

717
00:52:22.079 --> 00:52:29.119
who are in the situation that you
were back when we met, back when

718
00:52:29.119 --> 00:52:32.440
you started listening to podcasts, what
kind of advice would you give. Never

719
00:52:32.599 --> 00:52:40.440
put off being yourself to make a
partner, family, kids, whatever,

720
00:52:40.719 --> 00:52:46.840
happy, because it doesn't. That's
what I've learned. It doesn't make them

721
00:52:46.840 --> 00:52:52.920
happy when you're not happy with yourself. When you can't love yourself, you

722
00:52:52.960 --> 00:52:54.480
can't be a good partner, you
can't be a good parent, you can't

723
00:52:54.480 --> 00:52:59.519
be a good child to your parents. Like you know, if you hate

724
00:52:59.519 --> 00:53:04.199
who you are are, you can't
love anyone. Else, So it actually

725
00:53:04.440 --> 00:53:07.920
was more damaging for me to keep
When I thought I was doing it to

726
00:53:07.960 --> 00:53:15.920
make them happy, it actually made
everyone more miserable. So it's better to

727
00:53:15.079 --> 00:53:20.440
just accept who you are and live
your truth, and if people are meant

728
00:53:20.440 --> 00:53:22.960
to be in your life, they
will deal with it and they will come

729
00:53:22.000 --> 00:53:27.960
around. So speaking of coming around, how's your family dealing with the fact

730
00:53:28.000 --> 00:53:30.159
that you're having surgery? Do they
all know? Is it? They are

731
00:53:30.199 --> 00:53:34.559
actually good? Now? Wow?
They all know. We actually talked about

732
00:53:34.559 --> 00:53:39.599
it at Christmas and for my birthday
this last year, my mom gave me

733
00:53:39.639 --> 00:53:44.079
a card that said, son,
today's your day. I hung it on

734
00:53:44.119 --> 00:53:45.320
the wall in my bedroom because that
was the first time she called me her

735
00:53:45.360 --> 00:53:52.280
son. Wow. So yeah,
so my family is they're all awesome now

736
00:53:52.400 --> 00:53:57.920
they've come Yeah, that is amazing. People people change, they do not

737
00:53:58.039 --> 00:54:01.320
everyone, they don't, but give
give them a chance. By you being

738
00:54:01.440 --> 00:54:07.519
yourself, that gives them a chance
to actually kind of like rise to the

739
00:54:07.559 --> 00:54:12.320
occasion and love more purely and more
deeply, you know, instead of I

740
00:54:12.320 --> 00:54:15.760
feel like when you're pretending to be
someone you're not to try to make them

741
00:54:15.840 --> 00:54:21.840
happy, they're not actually loving you. They're loving who they want you to

742
00:54:21.880 --> 00:54:25.679
be, which to be is kind
of fake ish, it's very it has

743
00:54:25.719 --> 00:54:30.360
its limits well, And one thing
I see a lot, especially in the

744
00:54:30.440 --> 00:54:32.480
church, is that people think they
can't cut off their family. Like,

745
00:54:32.519 --> 00:54:37.039
it's not okay to cut off your
family. It is absolutely okay to take

746
00:54:37.039 --> 00:54:40.480
a step back from people who hurt
you and say things that you know,

747
00:54:40.480 --> 00:54:45.079
if they refuse to respect who you
are as a person and respect your truth,

748
00:54:45.239 --> 00:54:47.519
it is perfectly fine for you to
take a step back and say,

749
00:54:47.519 --> 00:54:52.119
like, you know what, I
don't need to have you in my life

750
00:54:52.559 --> 00:54:55.360
if you can't respect who I am. Absolutely like, you do not have

751
00:54:55.440 --> 00:55:00.360
to stand there and be abused by
people, No, because they're your family,

752
00:55:00.280 --> 00:55:04.159
it's not required. Well, and
when you stand there and accept the

753
00:55:04.199 --> 00:55:08.480
abuse, there's really no need for
them to change because it's exactly But when

754
00:55:08.519 --> 00:55:12.360
you set a boundary, then it
puts the ball. Well, first of

755
00:55:12.400 --> 00:55:15.360
all, you've protected yourself, and
then it puts the ball in their court

756
00:55:15.360 --> 00:55:20.079
where they have to decide am I
really going to love my child or am

757
00:55:20.119 --> 00:55:23.800
I going to say well whatever then
and a lot of parents are really going

758
00:55:23.880 --> 00:55:28.920
to love their child. They really
are, Like your parents have come around,

759
00:55:29.199 --> 00:55:31.519
my parents came around. My family
came around. Not everyone's parents and

760
00:55:31.559 --> 00:55:36.000
family will I'm not saying that everyone. This is all you know, kumba

761
00:55:36.079 --> 00:55:40.840
yaf for everyone now, but do
what's best for you and let people make

762
00:55:40.880 --> 00:55:46.320
the decisions if they're going to truly
love you, and they just might you

763
00:55:46.320 --> 00:55:51.840
know. Yep. Yeah. How
are your kids with everything? They're good,

764
00:55:52.079 --> 00:55:55.239
They're good. My daughter actually calls
me her dad now wow, but

765
00:55:55.280 --> 00:55:59.559
she doesn't have a relationship with her
biofather, so that's kind of you know.

766
00:56:00.440 --> 00:56:02.880
And she did it because it actually
started because she was babysitting this little

767
00:56:02.880 --> 00:56:07.079
girl who was eight, and I
video chat with my grandbabies every day because

768
00:56:07.079 --> 00:56:10.920
they're four and two and they're just
so I video chat with them every day.

769
00:56:12.280 --> 00:56:15.679
And the little girl asked, my
daughter, who are you talking to?

770
00:56:17.119 --> 00:56:21.039
And my daughter was trying to stop
for a second because she realized,

771
00:56:21.039 --> 00:56:23.280
you know, this guy with a
beard deep boys talking to, you know,

772
00:56:23.880 --> 00:56:27.719
and she's like, oh, it's
my dad. So that just kind

773
00:56:27.719 --> 00:56:30.760
of and then it just stuck.
So cool. And Katie, the four

774
00:56:30.840 --> 00:56:34.000
year old, is very obsessed with
what genitals people have right now because she's

775
00:56:34.000 --> 00:56:37.360
ata ache, you know, So
she asked her dad if I she's like,

776
00:56:37.400 --> 00:56:42.880
does Lola have a penis like daddy
or vagina like mommy? And her

777
00:56:42.960 --> 00:56:45.679
dad was like, Lola has a
penis like daddy, which I was very

778
00:56:45.679 --> 00:56:51.199
grateful for because he is very LDS
as well. So but you know,

779
00:56:51.239 --> 00:56:52.920
they were like, we don't want
to confuse her, and you're a boy.

780
00:56:53.079 --> 00:56:59.000
That's all she sees. So you
know, good good. So they've

781
00:56:59.039 --> 00:57:01.159
all been amazing mysef. It's been
amazing from the get go. You know,

782
00:57:01.679 --> 00:57:06.559
both my kids are just awesome.
So that was never a problem.

783
00:57:06.719 --> 00:57:09.320
That's great. I love that.
I love that. Well. Is there

784
00:57:09.360 --> 00:57:13.960
anything you want to add? By
the way, I will be having you

785
00:57:14.039 --> 00:57:17.800
on again post surgery so we can
talk about it because everyone's going to know

786
00:57:17.880 --> 00:57:23.679
how did it go? Send pictures? I'm just kidding. I'd probably get

787
00:57:23.679 --> 00:57:30.159
blocked from Facebook inappropriate content, Yeah
for sure. Yeah. Is there any

788
00:57:30.239 --> 00:57:34.840
questions that that's right? Yes?
Let me let me pull up this question

789
00:57:34.960 --> 00:57:38.320
really quickly. Have a question for
us and about what kind of thoughts he

790
00:57:38.440 --> 00:57:42.639
had and what research he did before
he chose a surgeon and a method for

791
00:57:42.719 --> 00:57:45.840
surgery relevant for both top and bottom. I wish all the best for next

792
00:57:45.880 --> 00:57:49.599
week and It's great to see on
social media how happy he is with his

793
00:57:49.679 --> 00:57:53.360
transition and new body. Lots of
love from Denmark. So you got some

794
00:57:53.880 --> 00:57:58.920
Denmark fans. Yeah, how did
you try to choose your surgeon? Let's

795
00:57:59.000 --> 00:58:01.440
let's answer that one. Yeah.
Yeah, So I had two different surgeons

796
00:58:01.440 --> 00:58:07.559
that I was debating between, which
is OHSU that's the medical training hospital here

797
00:58:07.599 --> 00:58:10.000
in Oregon, and the Bunk Clinic, which is the group I ended up

798
00:58:10.039 --> 00:58:14.519
going with. They're down in California. The reason I chose the Bunk Clinic

799
00:58:14.880 --> 00:58:19.280
is because they have a one percent
complication rate for foloplast They've been doing only

800
00:58:19.320 --> 00:58:22.440
folloplasty surgeries for ten years, so
this is what they specialize in. Their

801
00:58:22.480 --> 00:58:28.159
team of surgeons specializes in it,
and one percent complication rate for this type

802
00:58:28.159 --> 00:58:34.000
of surgery is phenomenal. You know, generally you hear of much higher complication

803
00:58:34.119 --> 00:58:38.039
rates. Plus, I met both
doctor Watt and doctor Chen, who are

804
00:58:38.039 --> 00:58:44.480
my two surgeons. They both have
awesome bedside manner. They're just incredibly the

805
00:58:44.480 --> 00:58:46.639
way they talk to you. They
do not talk to you like you're stupid.

806
00:58:46.840 --> 00:58:51.199
They don't talk to you like they
have to explain everything. It's what

807
00:58:51.239 --> 00:58:52.920
do you want to know, okay, do you want to see photos of

808
00:58:52.960 --> 00:58:57.280
that? You know, like they
make sure you know all the risks of

809
00:58:57.320 --> 00:59:01.679
course going in. But I never
felt stupid to them, like they respected

810
00:59:01.679 --> 00:59:05.960
what I wanted. They said,
we can definitely do that, you know,

811
00:59:06.000 --> 00:59:07.920
and they'll be upfront with you if
they can't do it for whatever reason.

812
00:59:08.280 --> 00:59:12.440
So I just like I liked their
bedside manner. I talked to a

813
00:59:12.480 --> 00:59:15.000
couple other surgeons where I just didn't
really like how they talked to me,

814
00:59:15.440 --> 00:59:19.159
Like, you know, I've done
a lot of research, so I was

815
00:59:19.159 --> 00:59:22.719
like, I don't need you to
tell me what I need for my body,

816
00:59:22.960 --> 00:59:24.400
Like I know what I need for
my body, I need you to

817
00:59:24.440 --> 00:59:27.719
tell me if you can work with
that or not. That's kind of how

818
00:59:27.719 --> 00:59:30.679
I went into it. Got it, So got it? That's great.

819
00:59:30.719 --> 00:59:35.480
So just meeting the doctors and knowing
their their stats as far as there being

820
00:59:35.519 --> 00:59:38.719
any issues after the surgery, that's
cool. So that just you just felt

821
00:59:38.719 --> 00:59:43.159
comfortable, like go with your gut
right, Yes, that's yeah. And

822
00:59:43.480 --> 00:59:46.639
I'm on a bottom surgery board on
Facebook, so you can see how people's

823
00:59:49.119 --> 00:59:52.800
experiences were with different surgeons, and
that really helped as well, you know,

824
00:59:52.880 --> 00:59:57.800
because everyone who had surgery with this
particular group was always happy with how

825
00:59:57.840 --> 01:00:01.400
it went. The bedside manner,
they office staff, the billing like everything.

826
01:00:01.920 --> 01:00:07.079
It was smooth, whereas other surgeons
you need to read horror stories and

827
01:00:07.079 --> 01:00:10.320
it's like, you know, I
had this complication and they wouldn't return my

828
01:00:10.400 --> 01:00:13.880
calls, you know, like that
kind of stuff. I don't want that.

829
01:00:13.880 --> 01:00:15.599
That's not something you want to hear
when you have a surgery that involves

830
01:00:15.599 --> 01:00:21.320
genitals. No, no, yeah, you know, especially if you're in

831
01:00:21.360 --> 01:00:24.960
another state right where it's like you
can't just go to your family doctor,

832
01:00:25.119 --> 01:00:29.599
you know, like and you can't
go to any old r when you've had

833
01:00:29.639 --> 01:00:34.440
gender confirmation surgery and be like,
I'm having this complication because they have they

834
01:00:34.519 --> 01:00:37.719
might not have any clue. Well, right, they have doctors there.

835
01:00:37.719 --> 01:00:39.920
Well, they will try and put
catheters where they shouldn't. They have doctors

836
01:00:39.960 --> 01:00:44.920
you know that will think that because
your trans you botched your own body.

837
01:00:44.960 --> 01:00:49.119
So you can just deal with it, like you know. So, yeah,

838
01:00:49.320 --> 01:00:53.719
it's definitely important to do your research
into how they respond to different things.

839
01:00:54.440 --> 01:00:58.119
Oh, this has been a great
interview. I still have ten million

840
01:00:58.199 --> 01:01:01.440
questions, but I'm going to save
those until I get you back on again

841
01:01:02.320 --> 01:01:09.639
after the surgery. Anyone who has
questions or comments or whatever, feel free

842
01:01:09.719 --> 01:01:15.119
to send in an email. I
will put the email with the show notes,

843
01:01:15.360 --> 01:01:20.199
and gosh, we just wish you
the best. I know you're gonna

844
01:01:20.239 --> 01:01:24.000
sail through this. You've been through
so much. And to see you just

845
01:01:24.679 --> 01:01:30.000
happy and excited in just plowing ahead, I fucking love it. I love

846
01:01:30.039 --> 01:01:35.559
you. I just am just in
awe. You're amazing. Gosh, thanks

847
01:01:35.559 --> 01:01:37.199
for coming on. Oh thanks for
having me. Course, you know,

848
01:01:37.440 --> 01:01:42.400
I enjoy I've enjoyed the podcast from
the beginning. I think that you have

849
01:01:42.480 --> 01:01:45.360
done amazing things for, you know, all the Mormons out there that we're

850
01:01:45.960 --> 01:01:51.679
trying to figure out how to deconstruct
the religious upbringing and how to deal with

851
01:01:51.760 --> 01:01:54.039
dating for the first time and all
that fun stuff that you know, we

852
01:01:54.119 --> 01:02:00.199
kind of missed out. I sure
did growing up. So yeah, so

853
01:02:00.239 --> 01:02:02.280
it's definitely this podcast has helped a
lot of people. And I've seen the

854
01:02:02.400 --> 01:02:06.400
letters that pour in, you know, when they had the letter episodes,

855
01:02:06.440 --> 01:02:08.400
and listening to all the people that
you changed lives for, and I thought,

856
01:02:08.559 --> 01:02:12.199
yeah, I'm definitely down to be
a part of that. So I

857
01:02:12.239 --> 01:02:15.760
can help someone then yay, thank
you. I appreciate that. All right,

858
01:02:15.800 --> 01:02:19.039
I guess this is time for me
to wrap it up and try to

859
01:02:19.079 --> 01:02:23.320
remember again how to wrap it up. Say thank you Dan for leaving it

860
01:02:23.360 --> 01:02:29.440
in Dan and Extension Audio. He
is my badass editor in chief, actually

861
01:02:29.440 --> 01:02:32.599
the only editor. I don't do
editing because I got I got seven kids

862
01:02:32.639 --> 01:02:37.559
in like twelve jobs, so I
don't have the time. Again, thank

863
01:02:37.599 --> 01:02:44.800
you Austin for coming on and I
will be recording more episodes soon. Also,

864
01:02:45.119 --> 01:02:50.599
always remember steer clear of cults because
they are no joke. Talk you

865
01:02:50.679 --> 01:02:58.519
later. Hi. Everyone,