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Hello, and welcome to the show. I'm Martin Willis your host, and

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I'm excited about tonight's guests. Grant
Levek. I had to pre record with

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him because right now in Australia it
is eleven o'clock on Wednesday, and there

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was no way he could get out
of work unfortunately. So it's a pre

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recorded show with him, and I'm
live right now, of course just for

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a couple of minutes here for a
couple of announcements, and so he'll be

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on. He's a great guest.
You're really going to enjoy him. A

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couple of things. The blog this
week from Charles Lear as a general and

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a UFO hotspot in Brazil. A
great blog. Another great one by Charles

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Lear. I'm pretty excited to say
that on the thirtieth you're going to see

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myself with this gentleman right here.
So Tim Burchett is going to be on.

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It may be a short interview.
I'm not really sure how long it's

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going to be unfortunately. Also,
I have to pre record with him because

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it's during the day. But that
I'm going to pre record with him on

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Thursday, it's going to be on
the following week, so on the thirtieth.

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Tuesday the thirtieth, I'll have Dave
from Space Out Radio as my guest

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and Tim Burchett. The recording that
I have with him will be played at

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that time. So I have a
lot of questions for him about the hearing

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that just happened. Seems like a
lot of positive things were said according to

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what I've seen from the interviews afterwards. So if you have any really good

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questions, you'd like to email me
at Martinette PODCASTUFO dot com. I'll see

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if I can ask them if if
it makes sense. So what I'm going

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to do is I'm going to play
the recording that I did with Grant and

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I'm going to be in chat.
So if you're joining us live, you

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can interact in the chat room.
And I'm going to get going right now.

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Thank you all for those of you
who support the show, and thank

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all of you who listen to the
show. I really appreciate it. And

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here we go. Grant, Welcome
to the show. Martin it's good to

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be with you. Thanks so much
for having me on and give me an

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opportunity to share some perspectives and insights
with your viewers. It's good to be

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with you excellent. You know,
I have to say that whenever I look

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at the demographics to listeners to this
show, it's the United States number one,

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and then between the UK and Australia
it's number They go back and forth,

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who's the second names listen to?
I only had twenty six million people

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in Australia and that's right, and
so many listeners And what would you attribute

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that to? Well, look,
I think the Australian public has certainly a

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fascination and interest in this topic.
Like you know, to the Australian mainstream

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media is credit Whenever something significant happens
in the US, whether it's Congress or

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David Grush coming out with Ross called
on News Nation, the Australian news media

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will cover it. But that's all
they do. It's very copy and paste

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journalism. They don't ask questions of
you know, those in positions of leadership

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and authority in Australia, those in
the Australian government. So whilst my gripe

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with the media is that they don't
exercise their due diligence on the topic as

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frequently as they should, to their
credit, they do cover it and they

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do have folks that are well known
to us in the community, like Jeremy

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Corbell, John Greenwell Jr. They
have folks come on and provide some commentary

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on the US landscape. So I
would put it down to the fact that

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with everything that's happened in the last
several years with the US that information has

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flowed through to the Australian public.
I see now, I know you're ufologists,

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are UFO researcher, and we're going
to talk a little bit about Westall

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and maybe a few other cases.
But let's hear about who you are and

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what got you interest in the topic
of UFOs to begin with. Yeah,

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So, I mean, I've had
a fascination for this topic really ever since

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I was a young fellow. I
forty five years of age now, and

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in the mid eighties, when I
was around about six or seven or eight,

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I can't remember the exact year,
but my father took me to a

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photo exhibition, a UFO photo exhibition
that was being held at Australia's tallest skyscraper

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called Center Point Tower, which is
kind of comparable with I guess the Space

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Needle in Seattle kind of looks really
similar. And so there was this photo

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exhibition which I found out only a
few years ago that renowned Australian ufologist or

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researcher, Bill Chalker was provided some
consultancy in the organization of that photo exhibition.

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But coming back to the point that
you're in this photo exhibition, there

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are a lot of black and white
photos blown up on canvas and displayed around

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the photo exhibition of these famous sightings
and cases over the of the decades past.

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And one of them was the black
and white McMinnville photo from the fifties.

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And I've said this a number of
times before, but I really just

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lost myself, Yeah, that's the
one. Lost myself in that photo,

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and just imagining what it would have
been like to be in the in the

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shoes of the ranch or of the
farmer, to take that photo and see

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what happened before, during, and
after that event. And then obviously growing

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up as a teenager in the nineties, you know, I was a fan

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child of the X Files. You
know, Wednesday night, nine pm every

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week, you'd watch it. Then
you have a big debrief with your schoolmates

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the next day. And then my
interest kind of ebbed and flowed in the

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years thereafter, and for like so
many folks. It wasn't really until you

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know, the bombshell New York Times
articles of December twenty seventeen that that really

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piqued my interest. And obviously then
throughout COVID, you know, so many

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of us were spending so much more
time at home and you know, not

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able, certainly for me in Melbourne, not able to get outside and enjoy

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the fresh air. I kind of
just became a sponge on the topic to

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the to the disinterest or distaste of
my wife. And I've always said,

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you know, marriage and the UFO
topic does not always go hand in hand,

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but she's come to appreciate my interest. But you know, I just

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really became a sponge on the topic
during COVID and trying to learn really as

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much as I could from as many
as I could during that period. And

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you know, following obviously, there
was a three day live stream event in

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September of twenty twenty two called the
Big Phone Home. I was a Big

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Phone Home too. I was prying, yeah, yeah, right, and

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I remember seeing, you know,
it was the time zone difference wasn't all

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that friendly for me. So I
had a lot of watch a lot of

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the stuff in the middle of the
night. But that event really inspired me

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to get off my ass, you
know, rather than sit on the bench,

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to get in the game and not
be a passive observer but be an

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active participant and activate myself and engage
my elected representatives on the topic, to

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really see what Australia is doing about
the UAP UFO topic, and sadly,

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Australia is doing very very little.
So that's kind of been my driving force

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for a number of years now,
is to engage my elected representatives and members

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of the media to advocate that they
tape the topic more seriously and ask questions

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of those that are in positions of
leadership and authority in Australia, because Australia

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is, you know, the US's
closest ally. I mean, we're the

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closest of allies, but we couldn't
be further apart on the UAP issue.

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You know, Australia pretty much is
in lockstep with the US on every defense

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initiative, but it will not touch
the UAP topic. And that's been a

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question that I've been puzzling to find
an answer on for a number of years

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and that's kind of where I am
today, trying to you know, dig

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francewers as to why Australia has been
so lackluster on its interest for the topic.

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I think that's a strange just in
the way that there is so much

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obviously so much public interest per capita. As I mentioned earlier, you know,

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so many people listened to my show
from there, so it really I'm

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really surprised at that. And is
there anything you can attribute to that to

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Yeah, it's a good point because
not a lot of people know this,

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but Australia has almost as long as
a history investigating the uap UFO topics as

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the US does, you know,
dating back to the early nineteen fifties,

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in the years following Roswell, you
know, the Australian Air Force and the

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now defunct Department of Supply, they
were there was a policy implemented. It

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was called a UAS policy in Australia. It was referred to as unusual aerial

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sightings as opposed to US as opposed
to UFOs, because there were a lot

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of UAS UFO sighting over sensitive military
installations in Australia in the nineteen fifties,

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in the nineteen sixties, and Ross
Coultart talks about these on number of occasions

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in his book In plain Sight,
You've got Woomera, you have mari Linga

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where the Brits were permitted to detonate
i think five nuclear blasts without telling the

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indigenous population. And there was a
lot of anomaloist activity observed and are reported

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over these sensitive, top secret military
installations in the fifties and sixties. So

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you know, there was a gentleman
by the name of also by the name

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of Harry Turner, who veteran researcher, Bill Chalker, has done a ton

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of ton of work on and I've
had the good fortune of learning from Bill

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directly, and you know, he's
certainly been a great mentor for me.

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But Harry Turner took a very he
was an Australian nuclear scientist. He took

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a very keen interest in the UFO
topic, and he was permitted to see

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the Australian Air Force's you know,
secret documents reports of UFOs, and he

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took it upon himself to really start
to investigate the topic from an Australian context,

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to the point where he even made
a recommendation to the Joint Intelligence Organization

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the JO and the Directorate of Air
Force Intelligence that they consider implementing a rapid

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intervention team like a crash retrieval team. So Harry Turner was taking this topic

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very very seriously, and unfortunately all
of the recommendations that he made unfortunately fell

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on deaf is because the you know, the Air Force and Directorate of Air

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Force Intelligence and JO they caught wind
of him supporting the work of Donald Kehoe,

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who had made some hypotheses that will
perhaps UFOs are of an extra tre

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origin. And the fact that Harry
Turner just referenced Donald Keeho's work or supported

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it in that fashion, his findings
and all of his work was kind of

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brushed to the wayside, and his
work for on deaf ears, which was

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really unfortunate. Then essentially fast forward
to nineteen ninety three where a policy recommendation

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change was submitted to the Chief of
Air Staff which is now known as the

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Chief of Air Force, and there
was a recommendation made that the Royal Australian

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Air Force cease its ongoing investigation into
UFOs because it could not find any compelling

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or scientific or other compelling reason to
continue to devote resources to the ongoing investigation

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of the topic. And sadly,
that policy was implemented. That policy recommendation

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was implemented in nineteen ninety six,
and that's when the Royal Australian Air Force

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washed its hand and basically said,
move along, folks, there's no thing

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to see here. So has What
is puzzling to me is that the Royal

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Australian Air Force in the Australian Department
of Defense continues to bury its head in

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the sand on this topic and basically
toe the line of move along, folks,

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there's nothing to see here, and
continue to reiterate the line that they've

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said in nine and ninety six that
there's no compelling or scientific reason for us

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to continue to vote resources well that
the problem there is that the Australian Department

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of Defense and Royal Australian Air Force
has not investigated reports of UFOs since nine

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ninety six, up until May of
this year, where doctor Sean Kirkpatrick of

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Arrow conducted the first ever five Eyes
forum on UAP. Prior to May of

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this year, Australia had not had
any engagement publicly that we're aware of with

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the United States on UFOs UAP,
and it had not been privy to any

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of the classified information housed within the
classified reports provided to Congress by the ODNI,

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and there was this document that I
was able to secure for release through

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the Freedom of Information Act in Australia, one of the most significant documents that's

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come out of the Australian Department Defense
in more than thirty years. That basically

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confirmed that the Royal Australian Air Force
had a strategic narrative, specifically that UAP

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UFOs must be one of three things. It made this determination without having done

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investigated the topic, being exposed to
classified info or engaged in the US.

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They came to the conclusion that UAP
are likely to be natural or other benign

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phenomena. That was the first number
two censor errors with surveillance equipment, and

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three human made technologies which could include
foreign adversarial systems. There was no reference

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whatsoever in that Chief of Air Force
brief on UAP that UAP could be anything

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other than those three things. There
was no catch or other bin that the

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ODN I indicated in its preliminary assessment
on UAP back on the twenty fifth of

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June twenty twenty one. So that's
been a real sense of frustration for me

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trying to understand why Australia, the
US's closest ally, is so reluctant to

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acknowledge that a conversation needs to be
had on UAP, that it should be

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investigated, and that a conclusion should
be reached as to what UAP are.

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Because the US Department of Defense and
Congress has reiterated time and time again that

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UAP pose a national security threat and
safety of flight risk, and that UAP

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is not isolated to the United States
or North America. It's an international issue.

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So why Australia continues to bury its
head in the sand on the topic

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is completely perplexing. There's a couple
of reasons why I think that is the

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case that they're so reluctant, which
I can speak to a fewish, but

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that kind of gives a bit of
a brief history on Australia's past in terms

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of the uapuf A topic. Well, you know, it's similar. You

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think about some of the things that
happened in the United States as far as

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our Air Force nineteen sixty nine.
You flipped the last two digits ninety six

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sixty nine, that, yeah,
is when they concluded basically the same.

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However, you know, going all
the way back into nineteen forty seven,

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was the first document that came out
that said that, you know, these

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are not imaginary. You know,
so our government has been aware of this

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and kind of acknowledges it, you
know, back and forth over the years,

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not so much until the last you
know year, when we have this

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you know, this hearing in DC. But you know, in ninety seven,

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you're right, the bombshell article that
hit the New York Times really did

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change so much, you know,
when you really think about it. For

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my own personal level and that whole
situation, it's like I felt finally comfortable

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enough to talk about it to people
that normally I wouldn't, you know,

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where the topic has come up.
I'm a fine art appraiser and I work

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in homes, you know, a
lot, and usually it's very affluent people

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that are having these appraisals, and
you know, I am not so afraid

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to bring up the topic if it
works, you know, and it has,

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it has a number of times,
and you know, there's definitely the

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stigma has worn down quite a bit. Well, you're right, I think,

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and that goes to you know,
it's kind of safety in numbers now

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isn't it. And strength in numbers
where so many more people have been exposed

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to this topic, and see how
seriously it's been taken. It's not about

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you know, the green little men
anymore, that conversation, even though that's

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a huge part of it, David
Grush's claims, and it's great that members

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of Congress are taking those allegations and
claim seriously. But you're right, you

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can, I think. I mean, I was always very hesitant and reluctant

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to talk to friends, colleagues,
family, or people I just met on

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the street about the topic out of
fear of ridicule and stigma. And you

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know, slowly, very very slowly, those walls of stigma are starting to

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fall around this topic. And I've
said this story a number of times.

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You know. I'm originally from Sydney, live in Melbourne now in Australia,

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and I was traveling to Sydney a
year or two ago and I was doing

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some research on the time on the
Phoenix Lights. I was reading a book

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by doctor lyn Key Tye, and
I was going through the security checkpoint screening

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with my carry on baggage and I
had the book in my carry on and

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they screened my bag and they wanted
to go through it, and the screener

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saw the book in my carry on, and before you know it, we'd

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dived into a whole conversation about the
Phoenix lights and uap UFOs, and you

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know, we ended up having probably
a conversation with good five or ten minutes

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in between him screening other bags,
and it was just, you know,

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there was no ridicule, there was
no stigma attached to it. So I

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think people would be surprised as to
how open others are in having a conversation

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on this topic because of everything that's
happened over the course of the last you

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know, six seven years. And
also another thing, when that topic comes

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up, I'm never surprised at how
many people will say, oh, yeah,

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well, my uncle, you know
how this, you know, that

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type of thing happened back in you
know, in eighteen seventies or whatever.

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There are so many people that this
has that have have had encounters. I

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forget. I read something recently where
it's in the hundreds of thousands of encounters

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that have been reported. Now granted
probably you know, five percent of those

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are totally unexplained, but still,
you know, the old saying goes,

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you only need one you know exactly, that's right, and they're the ones

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that we're interested about it. It's
not you know, Project blue Book closed

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its doors with still what was it, two or three percent of cases unresolved,

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and you know that also echoes true
with the Australian Royal Australian Air Forces

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your UAS policy. It closed its
doors on investigating UFOs as I mentioned in

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nine to ninety six, despite the
fact that it could not reach a ready

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there was no ready explanation as to
what about three percent of their cases were.

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So you're there the three percent that
we care about. It's those anomalous

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reports that we want. And and
this is kind of to echo what doctor

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Sean Kirkpatrick, now the former head
of URRO said when he testified before Kirsten

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Gillibrand's committee in April of last year. His goal, his goal with ARRA

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at the time was to get cases
to a point where they could resolve it

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and turn it into an s SEP
someone else's problem, and pass it on

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to someone else. But they're not
the ones that we care about. We

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care about the two three percent that
are truly an ANOYMN anomalist is the word

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I'm trying to get out, and
we want to learn more about those cases.

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So you know, it's just amazing
that it's taken. It took as

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long as it did for ARRA to
get a public facing website up and running,

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and to this day, I mean
there's and there's not a whole lot

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of content on that website pertaining to
cases that they have been able to resolve.

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And you know that the lack of
communication strategy is telling. I mean,

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they've had one post on social media
on x since July twenty twenty two,

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so I think they've really fallen short
of meeting the general public's expectation of

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being as transparent as it could on
the topic. Well when I don't know

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if they have the I don't believe
they have the permanent chair of our row,

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Sean Kinpatrick's permanent replacement there yet,
but they've only got an acting acting

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director, so I think that's Tim
Phillips. I don't think they have appointed

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yet a full time replacement, but
hopefully, who knows what that new installed

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director will be. Hopefully they'll be
a little bit more ambitious and aggressive than

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doctor Sean Kirkpatrick was because I think
he was very I mean every time.

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I mean I've never met the guy, don'd know him, but just from

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an observational perspective, at face value, whenever he spoke, he sounded like

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he really didn't want to be there
or talking about the topic. So you

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know, hopefully the next person that
comes along is going to be a little

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bit more proactive than reactive on on
on the topic. You know, I

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understand when he said. I've heard
him say two or three times that he'll

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go wherever the evidence points him.
And I think that's you know, that's

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only fair, and that's that's the
you know, a proper response. But

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I didn't see the ambition, and
I saw a lot of more or less

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closed mindedness, you know, kind
of rear it's uglyhad a few times,

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and you know, and the statements
he made about David Rush and things like

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that, you know, we're pretty
negative and uh, you know, not

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scientific to the point where you know, the there wasn't an open mind,

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you know, like it just can't
you know, it can't be that type

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of are I agree, and and
you know, the the he said she

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said kind of scenario where you know, Grusha's saying that no, he had

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never received any any coals of meetings
from from Arrow and end up the showing

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Ko Patrick and yeah, the doctor
Kirkpatrick is refuting that. So the whole

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back and forth and the fact that
you know, Kirsten Jillibrand was trying to

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get David Grush and Sean Kirkpatrick to
get together and have a conversation that didn't

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happen, and the challenges that Kirsten
Gillibrand herself had trying to get a sit

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down face to face with David Grush. The whole debarkle over trying to you

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know, not paying for travel and
lodging fees to get into Washington, d

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C. Was ridiculous. So yeah, yeah, you know, I think

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I am hoping that the next person
that comes along with RRO, you know,

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is someone that we can look to
to really you know, be a

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bit more aggressive and proactive and take
a more open, you know, skeptical

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yet open tone and follow the facts
wherever they lead, follow the data,

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not just select data, but follow
all of the data wherever it leaves.

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And for him, for one of
the announcements that I heard him make was

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someone questioned him about the TIC TAC
UFO incident and back in two thousand and

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four off of I'm trying to think
of the name of the island out there

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in California. Yeah, right,
So when they asked him about that,

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and I was really shocked at his
reply was, no, we have all

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the data. Matter of fact,
do you have all the data? You

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see everything on YouTube. That's all
the data we have for that. And

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that's is bs. Yeah, because
someone went on board the Princeton and took

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the I mean not of the Princeton, on the niements I guess it was,

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and took the Hawkeyes radar data bricks. So those data bricks and you

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know, went somewhere and that's you
know, that's some major data that they

307
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actually do have on that. And
so that that is living somewhere and someone

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00:26:02,039 --> 00:26:07,920
has that and he can he can't
be unaware of that, I don't think

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if he's exactly. I mean,
all you need to do is listen to

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listen to the testimony and what Kevin
Day has said PJ. Hughes, Gary

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Vorhes all of the additional sensor data
that was collected on the Nimitz incident,

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and it wasn't just on that day, it was ten days leading up to

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that event where David Trevor and Alex
Dietrich had the encounter, and then obviously

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the famous tic TAC footage was taken
shortly thereafter. So for Sean Kokpatrick to

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00:26:34,359 --> 00:26:40,200
come out and say that there's no
additional data available to completely disingenuous. And

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I mean, you know, is
it possible that that data no longer exists,

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00:26:44,240 --> 00:26:48,599
has been destroyed. Possibly, but
to say that the no data was

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00:26:48,599 --> 00:26:52,799
ever no other data was ever available
on the tic TAC, the nimits in

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00:26:52,839 --> 00:26:56,039
its incident, is completely disingenuous.
Yeah. I mean you think of all

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the cases that did have information footage
or radar data or whatever like that,

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the big sur incident years ago where
that missile was firing at you know,

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a dummy warhead, you know that
that type of thing going all the way

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00:27:17,559 --> 00:27:23,400
back to Gordon Cooper's you know the
footage on the airbase there that they had

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the Vandenburg and never saw that footage
ever. Again, those types have never

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been returned or where have they gone? You know? Yeah, it makes

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00:27:33,079 --> 00:27:36,839
you really makes you wonder where do
they go? And maybe maybe that is

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a possibility that things are destroyed,
I mean for what reason? I would

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00:27:40,880 --> 00:27:44,759
have no idea, but you know, I mean for deniability, I guess

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they could be disposable deniability. I
think that's probably a big part of it.

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I think that's a big part of
why you know, those in positions

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of leadership and authorn in Australia,
like the Australian Minister for Defense, like

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the Chief of Air Force. You
know, those guys to my knowledge have

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00:28:02,799 --> 00:28:08,599
not yet even been briefed on UAP
and is plausible, but deniability an element

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00:28:08,640 --> 00:28:15,680
of that possibly, you know.
I mean the thing that has that I

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00:28:15,759 --> 00:28:19,200
was able to break, you know
before the end of last year, was

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00:28:19,240 --> 00:28:25,559
that. And this just kind of
gives you some background information on you know,

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00:28:25,720 --> 00:28:30,640
the back and forth and the hypocrisy
in Australia. So on the fifteenth

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00:28:30,680 --> 00:28:37,440
of February of two thy and twenty
three, so last year, the obviously

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00:28:37,480 --> 00:28:40,880
you know, in February of last
year for your viewers, you remember that's

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00:28:40,880 --> 00:28:45,920
when the Chinese by balloon the thing
happened and the three unidentified aerial objects were

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00:28:45,920 --> 00:28:52,839
shot down. So the fifteenth of
February twenty twenty twenty three, the Chief

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00:28:52,839 --> 00:28:57,920
of Air Force was pressed by Senator
Peter Wish Wilson who's the Senator Greens Senator

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00:28:57,920 --> 00:29:03,519
for Tasmania, And sadly he's the
only Australian Senator to date that has taken

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00:29:03,559 --> 00:29:08,440
this topic seriously in Australian context and
had the courage and gumption to ask questions

345
00:29:08,839 --> 00:29:15,000
about UAP in Parliament. And so
he has dating back to October of twenty

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00:29:15,000 --> 00:29:21,680
twenty one, he's been on a
mission to really better understand why, like

347
00:29:21,759 --> 00:29:26,680
me, the Australian Department Offense is
so hesitant and reluctant to acknowledge the UAP

348
00:29:26,839 --> 00:29:33,079
topic and take it more seriously,
secure briefings from the United States and so

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00:29:33,119 --> 00:29:38,119
on. So fifteenth of February last
year, Senator wish Wilson pressed the Chief

350
00:29:38,160 --> 00:29:41,680
of Air Force, current Chief of
Air Force, Air Marshal Robert Chipman,

351
00:29:42,160 --> 00:29:48,920
on the Chinese by balloon incident and
those three unidentified aerial objects, and the

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00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:56,680
Chief of Air Force testified that he, as the head of the Air Force,

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00:29:56,799 --> 00:30:04,160
had sought information from the Air Attache
to the United States in Washington,

354
00:30:04,240 --> 00:30:11,839
DC on those shootdown events, and
Senator wish Wilson asked the Chief of Air

355
00:30:11,839 --> 00:30:15,759
Force, well, why did you
seek a briefing on those four events?

356
00:30:15,799 --> 00:30:18,559
Specifically and the Chief of Air Force's
response was, well, we wanted to

357
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better understand the intent, the source
of those objects and more importantly, see

358
00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:33,160
what learnings we could gain from the
US Department of Defense's responses to those incidents,

359
00:30:33,920 --> 00:30:40,000
which the US Department Defense has reiterated
time and time again they were shot

360
00:30:40,079 --> 00:30:44,039
down or even President Biden said this
that the Chinese by balloon was brought down

361
00:30:44,200 --> 00:30:48,960
because of the national security risk,
and those three unified aerial objects were brought

362
00:30:48,960 --> 00:30:52,720
down because of a safety of flight
risk. Now rewind the clock back to

363
00:30:52,759 --> 00:30:59,160
the twenty fifth of June twenty twenty
one odeonized preliminary assessment on UAP, and

364
00:30:59,200 --> 00:31:03,599
it states that UAP clearly pose the
safety of flight risk and pose a potential

365
00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:12,240
national security rest risk. And that
was reiterated and echoed by Representative Ogle's questioning

366
00:31:14,559 --> 00:31:18,279
of David Grush, Ryan Graves and
David Frever and in July of last year

367
00:31:18,279 --> 00:31:22,880
at the Congressional Hearing that UAP clearly
pose a national security threat. Well,

368
00:31:23,119 --> 00:31:27,240
why is the Australian Department Offense or
the Royal Australian Air Force courtesy of the

369
00:31:27,279 --> 00:31:33,000
Chief of Air Force, why is
it seeking a briefing and information on the

370
00:31:33,039 --> 00:31:37,920
shootdown of the Chinese Bible and those
three unidentified aerial objects which clearly represent a

371
00:31:37,000 --> 00:31:41,200
national security threat and safety flight risk, yet it won't seek a briefing from

372
00:31:41,279 --> 00:31:48,240
the United States on UAP which represent
exactly the same threat safety of flight and

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00:31:48,319 --> 00:31:52,720
national security threat. And it was
only in you know, it was in

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00:31:52,000 --> 00:31:57,920
July of last year, the nineteenth
of July that the Australian Department of Defense

375
00:31:59,559 --> 00:32:04,559
respond to a question on notice,
a written question that Senator wish Wilson had

376
00:32:04,599 --> 00:32:10,279
submitted in June of last year,
asking well did Australia attend the inaugural Five

377
00:32:10,319 --> 00:32:16,279
Eyes Forum on UAP led by Row
in May twenty twenty three, And the

378
00:32:16,359 --> 00:32:22,960
response that came back from the Department
of Defense was Australia did not attend a

379
00:32:23,119 --> 00:32:29,440
United States briefing on UAPs and that's
a verbatim quote. Fast forward to the

380
00:32:29,440 --> 00:32:35,039
fifteenth of December of only last year, and the Australian Department Defense responded to

381
00:32:35,359 --> 00:32:38,839
a follow up a number of follow
up questions on notice that Senator wish Wilson

382
00:32:38,839 --> 00:32:45,079
had submitted I believe on the second
of November, and the response was that

383
00:32:45,119 --> 00:32:52,720
the question was did the Australian Department
of Defense receive an invitation from ROW to

384
00:32:52,839 --> 00:32:57,079
attend the Five Eyes Forum on UAP
in May twenty twenty three. And that's

385
00:32:57,079 --> 00:33:01,240
a paraphrasing of the question. The
the response that came back to that question

386
00:33:01,839 --> 00:33:07,519
was yes in that it did receive
an invitation and the response was a Defense

387
00:33:07,640 --> 00:33:14,880
representative based at the Australian Embassy in
Washington, d C attended. So why

388
00:33:15,119 --> 00:33:21,359
those contradicting statements. There's a complete
one to eighty why basically the lie back

389
00:33:21,359 --> 00:33:27,359
in July of twenty twenty three and
an about face in December of last year.

390
00:33:27,440 --> 00:33:31,480
So one of two things is happening. There is some pure deception being

391
00:33:31,559 --> 00:33:37,559
played by the Australian Department of Defense. They've lied to a sitting Senator and

392
00:33:37,640 --> 00:33:45,839
Australian taxpayers. And or there is
some catastrophic incompetence taking place where the Australian

393
00:33:45,839 --> 00:33:51,119
Department Defense is not exercising its due
diligence to find out, well, did

394
00:33:51,160 --> 00:33:53,200
we even attend the Five Eyes Forum
on VP? Did they do the homework

395
00:33:53,720 --> 00:33:57,880
and search and go for answers to
that question? And I think it's a

396
00:33:57,920 --> 00:34:00,920
combination of the two, which doesn't
really instill a lot of confidence in a

397
00:34:01,000 --> 00:34:07,920
sitting senator like Senator wish Wilson going
forward that they're questions and basically he's a

398
00:34:07,960 --> 00:34:12,679
member. Senator wish Wilson's a member
of the Senate Estimates Committee for Defense,

399
00:34:13,039 --> 00:34:15,280
Foreign Affairs, and Trade, comparable
with kind of like the House Oversight Committe

400
00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:21,400
in the US. It scrutinizes taxpayers
dollars where they're being spent on government projects.

401
00:34:21,639 --> 00:34:23,920
So it doesn't really instill a whole
lot of confidence in Senatate wish Wilson

402
00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:29,320
and other senators going forward that their
questions are going to be taken seriously and

403
00:34:29,320 --> 00:34:32,320
that there'll be a degree of due
diligence exercised by the Department of Defense to

404
00:34:32,400 --> 00:34:37,320
find answers to the questions that they're
asking on behalf of their constituents. So

405
00:34:37,599 --> 00:34:42,519
I suspect Senator wish Wilson is going
to have some rather pointed and pertinent questions

406
00:34:42,800 --> 00:34:45,840
for the Australian Department Defense at the
next Senate Estimates which is next month in

407
00:34:45,880 --> 00:34:51,679
February, to get to the bottom
of why that significant discrepancy, why that

408
00:34:51,800 --> 00:34:55,679
deception, why that lack of due
diligence to answer the Senator's questions back in

409
00:34:55,760 --> 00:35:01,360
July as opposed to doing a backflip
into lost you so there are two things

410
00:35:01,360 --> 00:35:08,360
that are a big concern in in
an Australian context. Wow, you know

411
00:35:08,400 --> 00:35:12,880
there's there's a lot of similarities here. It seems like, you know,

412
00:35:13,079 --> 00:35:17,079
there's a lot of it has been
a lot of double talk, and I've

413
00:35:17,119 --> 00:35:22,519
often pondered, and it's only an
opinion. I have no evidence to back

414
00:35:22,559 --> 00:35:28,000
it up of any kind at all. But I've always thought that our government

415
00:35:29,320 --> 00:35:34,079
probably knows a lot more than their
sharing, but they don't know everything.

416
00:35:34,400 --> 00:35:39,880
And I wondered, I think there's
still one of the reasons that the Air

417
00:35:39,960 --> 00:35:45,599
Force has not really gotten too involved
at all our Air Force is because they

418
00:35:45,639 --> 00:35:52,480
can't really tell us exactly what they
are. I believe, you know,

419
00:35:52,519 --> 00:35:57,880
it's all speculation. I wondered if
you felt a similar feeling about your government

420
00:35:57,920 --> 00:36:02,159
as far as they may know more
than yeah, hundred percent. I suspect

421
00:36:02,320 --> 00:36:08,480
that the Australian intelligence community knows a
hell of a lot more than the Australian

422
00:36:08,480 --> 00:36:14,880
Department of Defense does. So the
Australian Defense Force Services, the Army,

423
00:36:15,079 --> 00:36:20,280
the Navy, the Air Force,
and Defense Space Command which now no longer

424
00:36:20,320 --> 00:36:22,480
falls up under the remit of the
Royal Australian Air Force, it's now Joint

425
00:36:22,480 --> 00:36:28,840
Operations Command. But the defense services, those four that I just mentioned,

426
00:36:28,880 --> 00:36:32,119
I suspect they know not nearly as
much as the intelligence community in Australia.

427
00:36:32,159 --> 00:36:39,320
We're talking about the Australian Signals Directorate, we're talking about the National Geospatial Organization

428
00:36:39,480 --> 00:36:44,480
or the equivalent of the n GA
in the States. You've got ASIS,

429
00:36:44,559 --> 00:36:51,960
You've got the Australian Security Intelligence Organization
Organization ASIA, You've got the Office of

430
00:36:52,039 --> 00:36:54,599
National Intelligence O and I, and
you've got the Defense Intelligence Organization. I

431
00:36:54,639 --> 00:37:00,440
suspect those intelligence community bodies know a
hell of a lot more or on the

432
00:37:00,519 --> 00:37:07,159
uap UFO topic than we the Australian
general public know about. And that's you

433
00:37:07,199 --> 00:37:13,000
know what I'm trying to seek clarification
and confirmation of is well, what does

434
00:37:13,519 --> 00:37:17,239
the not just the Australian Department Defense
know, but what does Australian intelligence community

435
00:37:17,239 --> 00:37:22,159
know about UAP Sadly, that's going
to be a very hard question to get

436
00:37:22,159 --> 00:37:28,360
an answer to because all of the
intelligence communities in Australia are exempt from foryer

437
00:37:28,800 --> 00:37:32,920
exempt from freedom of Information Act.
So you know, as a private citizen,

438
00:37:34,199 --> 00:37:38,159
I'm never going to get any information
out of those intelligence community services.

439
00:37:38,199 --> 00:37:45,360
However, a sitting senator that has
the appropriate clearances to hear classified information,

440
00:37:45,639 --> 00:37:50,719
like the likes of perhaps the Senator
Wish Wilson and others that are on the

441
00:37:50,920 --> 00:37:54,639
Senate Estimates for Defense, Foreign Affairs, and Trade, well they can ask

442
00:37:54,719 --> 00:38:00,320
questions and they maybe are able to
have those questions answered in a class fired

443
00:38:00,400 --> 00:38:07,000
setting. So it's important that folks
that need to know that earned positions of

444
00:38:08,000 --> 00:38:14,960
leadership and authority afforded that information.
And if the intelligence community knows more than

445
00:38:14,960 --> 00:38:20,800
it is it is shared with the
Australian public, then it's imperative that our

446
00:38:20,840 --> 00:38:27,159
elected representatives that have those clearances provided
that information as well. Right right,

447
00:38:28,039 --> 00:38:30,079
we have. That's very and that's
and and this is very similar to what's

448
00:38:30,119 --> 00:38:34,320
going on in the in the US
at the moment. I mean not to

449
00:38:34,360 --> 00:38:37,719
cut you off, but obviously you
know, we've just had the House Oversight

450
00:38:37,760 --> 00:38:45,679
Committee sixteen members of that committee attend
a skiff meeting with the Inspector General for

451
00:38:45,719 --> 00:38:49,000
the Intelligence community, and all of
them, a lot of them have come

452
00:38:49,039 --> 00:38:55,199
out of that that hearing sounding somewhat
more taking a more serious tone in in

453
00:38:55,199 --> 00:39:02,000
in how they felt that hearing went
compared to the last skiff meeting they had

454
00:39:02,000 --> 00:39:07,360
with the Inspector General for the DoD. So it sounds like, you know,

455
00:39:07,440 --> 00:39:14,920
if you just look at what you
representative or Jared Moskovich came out of

456
00:39:14,960 --> 00:39:19,960
that skiff hearing and posted on x
OR put a tweet out saying that he

457
00:39:20,039 --> 00:39:24,280
basically now believes or feels that you
know, what was his quote he said,

458
00:39:25,320 --> 00:39:30,440
Jared Moskovitz's quote was based on what
we have, Based on what we

459
00:39:30,800 --> 00:39:35,440
heard, many of Grush's claims have
merit. So it's good to see that.

460
00:39:36,880 --> 00:39:40,440
It sounds like those members that attended
of that house services like community that

461
00:39:40,440 --> 00:39:52,199
attended the skiff have reached a greater
level of assurance knowing that the claims that

462
00:39:52,239 --> 00:40:00,079
Grush has made deemed is the reasons
why the Inspector General deemed those you know,

463
00:40:00,159 --> 00:40:05,719
the complaint as urgent and credible.
And it sounds like, you know

464
00:40:06,519 --> 00:40:08,480
that they've got a course of action
that they want to pursue going forward.

465
00:40:08,480 --> 00:40:13,679
I mean, you just look at
what Anna Paulina Luna has put out basically

466
00:40:13,719 --> 00:40:15,960
saying, you know, I feel
confident that we have enough evidence to move

467
00:40:16,000 --> 00:40:22,239
forward with our field hearing. We
will be announcing more soon. So it

468
00:40:22,360 --> 00:40:27,440
sounds like, you know, members
of the House of Psite Committee have whilst

469
00:40:27,519 --> 00:40:30,639
all their not all their questions were
answered, because obviously they don't have all

470
00:40:30,679 --> 00:40:37,280
the appropriate clearances to hear everything that's
classified that the Inspector General is aware of

471
00:40:37,320 --> 00:40:42,440
pertaining to David Grush's claims. It
sounds like they're now, you know,

472
00:40:43,320 --> 00:40:46,679
they have a plan of attack to
continue to move the needle forward and get

473
00:40:46,679 --> 00:40:52,320
to the bottom of really what's going
on. And it's just so frustrating that,

474
00:40:52,679 --> 00:40:55,719
you know, July of last year, David Grush testified before the househover

475
00:40:55,719 --> 00:41:00,679
Psyche Committee in Congress, and to
this date, you know, they still

476
00:41:00,679 --> 00:41:04,119
not have been afforded the appropriate clearances, even if it's just a one time

477
00:41:04,159 --> 00:41:09,920
reading to hear David Grush's testimony classified
testimony in a skiff as it pertains to

478
00:41:10,480 --> 00:41:16,239
waste fraud and abuse. And that's
exactly what the House Overside Committee is charged

479
00:41:16,239 --> 00:41:22,000
with. Its mission is to expose
waste fraud and abuse and mitigate the potential

480
00:41:22,039 --> 00:41:28,360
for waste fraud and bruce going forward
and it's how can it exercise oversight when

481
00:41:28,559 --> 00:41:32,000
it is not allowed to see the
classified information? Uh? That that that

482
00:41:32,079 --> 00:41:37,639
David Grush, you know, has
has uh has indicated that he is.

483
00:41:38,639 --> 00:41:44,039
That's that he's he's aware of.
You know, it's just crazy that there's

484
00:41:44,079 --> 00:41:49,400
this, there's this, this this
stone walling going on in the US by

485
00:41:49,440 --> 00:41:53,800
the intelligence community and those in US
D O D that are just hampering efforts

486
00:41:53,840 --> 00:42:00,559
for House Overside Committee to do it, to to fulfill its congressional Right.

487
00:42:00,840 --> 00:42:07,079
Well, we just there was just
a closed UAP meeting for the House you

488
00:42:07,119 --> 00:42:15,360
know, let's see House members.
So I think sixteen out what's that?

489
00:42:15,360 --> 00:42:21,039
Yeah, and and from all accounts, sixteen uh so about thirty four percent

490
00:42:21,079 --> 00:42:27,280
of the entire houseover Side Committee sixteen
members attended that skiff meeting by you know,

491
00:42:27,800 --> 00:42:31,960
conducted by I think it's the Inspector
General Monheim for the Intelligence community.

492
00:42:32,079 --> 00:42:36,719
So yeah, you've got a pretty
you've got a turnout, more of a

493
00:42:36,760 --> 00:42:40,239
turnout at this skiff meeting than those
that attended the House of Side Committee hearing

494
00:42:40,280 --> 00:42:44,119
in July of last year. So
yeah, that should tell you something in

495
00:42:44,159 --> 00:42:49,000
itself, right, Right, So
I think we should shift gears this has

496
00:42:49,039 --> 00:42:52,719
been really fascinating. But I'd like
to talk about some Australian cases. And

497
00:42:52,800 --> 00:42:55,559
I know you've done a lot of
work. I've had Shane Ryan on a

498
00:42:55,679 --> 00:42:59,119
number of times on the show.
A great guy. I know that you

499
00:42:59,199 --> 00:43:02,719
know him. The west All nineteen
sixty six. I want to say,

500
00:43:02,800 --> 00:43:07,480
is when that that's six of April, six of April nineteen sixty six,

501
00:43:07,719 --> 00:43:15,559
would you say that's basically Australia's Roswell
or yeah, I would say it's Australia's

502
00:43:15,639 --> 00:43:22,280
roswell and it's Australia's aerial school.
Yeah, I understand that. Yeah,

503
00:43:22,320 --> 00:43:25,559
that's a good connection. It's a
fascinating case. And you know, coming

504
00:43:25,599 --> 00:43:31,400
into you trying to be a sponge
and learners as much as I could on

505
00:43:31,400 --> 00:43:35,159
this topic from as many as I
could, I didn't really know a whole

506
00:43:35,199 --> 00:43:38,840
lot about the west All incident coming
into it. I've not heard of it.

507
00:43:38,880 --> 00:43:44,800
I knew the background information, but
it wasn't until I saw you A

508
00:43:44,800 --> 00:43:51,440
few people had suggested I maybe look
into it. I watched a wonderful documentary

509
00:43:51,440 --> 00:43:58,559
that Shane Ryan, who's really been
the lead investigator researcher on west All for

510
00:43:58,719 --> 00:44:01,119
more than a decade now for men
many years. There are other great researchers

511
00:44:01,159 --> 00:44:06,199
that have done some wonderful work on
Westall, Keith Basterfield, Bill Chalker,

512
00:44:06,599 --> 00:44:12,519
Ross Coultant as well, but Shane
Ryan has really carried the torch to continue

513
00:44:12,519 --> 00:44:15,800
to try and uncover information on the
west All Incident. And so I reached

514
00:44:15,800 --> 00:44:21,679
out to Shane Ryan just to kind
of pick his brain and get some good

515
00:44:21,679 --> 00:44:24,599
background information from him, and he
suggested to me. He told me about

516
00:44:25,199 --> 00:44:30,960
an annual reunion event that a small
number of the west All Incident witnesses,

517
00:44:31,000 --> 00:44:37,639
the Western Witnesses kind of you put
together and attend each year. And you

518
00:44:37,679 --> 00:44:39,760
know, obviously over COVID there was
a bit of a hiatus on that reunion

519
00:44:39,800 --> 00:44:45,239
event. But Shane Ryan told me
about a reunion event that they had planned

520
00:44:45,320 --> 00:44:49,039
for and this is going back in
April of last year, and I thought,

521
00:44:49,039 --> 00:44:51,679
oh, well, well, I'll
just go along as a member of

522
00:44:51,719 --> 00:44:53,840
the general public, and you know, I would love to hear what they

523
00:44:53,880 --> 00:44:58,360
have to say. And so I
took you know, I went along.

524
00:44:58,400 --> 00:45:00,639
I took my little iPhone with me, thinking maybe I'll get a couple of

525
00:45:01,320 --> 00:45:06,480
comments on camera, and before I
knew it, there was quite a decent

526
00:45:06,519 --> 00:45:09,920
turnout of other members of the general
public that were curious like I was,

527
00:45:10,480 --> 00:45:16,320
and I was just fascinated to hear
what these primary witnesses had to recount,

528
00:45:16,360 --> 00:45:22,199
you know, the stories that they
had to share, their recollections, and

529
00:45:22,400 --> 00:45:25,159
many of them were very very giving
in All of them actually were very generous

530
00:45:25,199 --> 00:45:29,599
in giving of their time, and
they accepted they were willing to go on

531
00:45:29,679 --> 00:45:34,159
camera. So I just had MyPhone
with me, put that on record and

532
00:45:34,639 --> 00:45:39,400
just asked. I felt bad because
I was kind of you gunning them with

533
00:45:39,599 --> 00:45:45,039
tons of questions, but I was
able to get all of this wonderful commentary

534
00:45:45,039 --> 00:45:51,320
and testimony from these primary witnesses which
they'd kind of shared before in Shane Ryan's

535
00:45:51,320 --> 00:45:57,559
great documentary west All sixty six,
A Suburban UFO Mystery, A really good

536
00:45:57,599 --> 00:46:00,039
introduction for anyone that doesn't know much
about the west Or case. It's a

537
00:46:00,039 --> 00:46:07,000
great documentary. It was also obviously
covered by James Fox's great documentary The Phenomenon

538
00:46:07,360 --> 00:46:10,480
number of years ago twenty twenty,
So you know, I captured a lot

539
00:46:10,519 --> 00:46:19,159
of footage of these primary witnesses just
talking about their recollections of the day,

540
00:46:19,239 --> 00:46:22,760
their memories, and they were all
willing to go on camera, So I

541
00:46:22,760 --> 00:46:25,599
had quite a number of hours of
footage that I was able to then edit

542
00:46:25,639 --> 00:46:31,639
and compile down into about almost a
ninety minute mini documentary, kind of like

543
00:46:31,800 --> 00:46:37,800
just a long form format of them
answering questions and talking about their experience,

544
00:46:37,840 --> 00:46:43,199
and I found them all to be
incredibly compelling. The one thing that is

545
00:46:43,360 --> 00:46:45,760
very frustrating that I gathered from all
of them is that, you know,

546
00:46:46,440 --> 00:46:51,599
now fifty eight years after the incident, which happened on the sixth of April

547
00:46:51,639 --> 00:46:55,480
nineteen sixty six, they're also still
very frustrated that they were told on the

548
00:46:55,599 --> 00:47:00,760
day and in the days following to
shut up about it. They weren't allowed

549
00:47:00,800 --> 00:47:04,519
to talk about the incident. Why
Why weren't they allowed to talk about it?

550
00:47:04,559 --> 00:47:08,719
If it was something as prosaic as
a weather balloon or a high bower

551
00:47:08,760 --> 00:47:14,239
balloon, a high altitude balloon,
which there were, there were launchings from

552
00:47:14,280 --> 00:47:24,920
Mildura in north of kind of north
west of Victoria, where they conducted in

553
00:47:25,840 --> 00:47:30,679
coordination with the Department of Energy in
the United States and even NASA. They

554
00:47:30,760 --> 00:47:36,280
used these high altitude balloons to conduct
scientific testing, atmospheric testing, even try

555
00:47:36,320 --> 00:47:43,800
and smell remnants of detect radioactivity in
the air following detonation of nuclear blasts in

556
00:47:44,760 --> 00:47:49,360
the Pacific region in the Pacific,
And so there was a hypothesis put forward

557
00:47:49,360 --> 00:47:55,079
by great research of Keith Basterfield that
High Bow should be considered as ap plausible

558
00:47:55,239 --> 00:48:01,039
explanation. And I'm respectful respect the
great work that Keith did to put that

559
00:48:01,159 --> 00:48:06,920
forward as a hypothesis. And that's
all. He positioned it as a hypothesis.

560
00:48:06,960 --> 00:48:09,199
He doesn't know what it is if
it was or wasn't, but that

561
00:48:09,320 --> 00:48:14,960
was a hypothesis. But the thing
that's so frustrating is that fifty eight years

562
00:48:15,039 --> 00:48:20,400
after the west Or incident, to
date, no official record or explanation has

563
00:48:20,440 --> 00:48:24,039
ever been provided by the Australian federal
government, state government or local governments.

564
00:48:24,079 --> 00:48:30,440
There's been no official documentation on the
incident at all that has seen the light

565
00:48:30,480 --> 00:48:34,239
of day, despite the fact and
Ross Coulthard has said this a number of

566
00:48:34,320 --> 00:48:37,559
times along with Shane Ryan, despite
the fact that the now defunct Department of

567
00:48:37,639 --> 00:48:46,679
Supply was more than rumored was it
was confirmed that they investigated the we incident

568
00:48:46,760 --> 00:48:53,000
fairly comprehensively and compiled a fairly significant
report. Now that report on the Western

569
00:48:53,079 --> 00:48:59,199
incident by the Department of Supply has
never seen the light of day. If

570
00:48:59,199 --> 00:49:02,760
it was so prosaic, and if
it was, you know, some say

571
00:49:02,800 --> 00:49:07,239
it was high bou or some top
secret technology back in the sixties. Well

572
00:49:07,239 --> 00:49:15,119
that technology is obviously rudimentary now and
it's no longer of top secret nature,

573
00:49:15,159 --> 00:49:19,320
So why not release information pertaining to
what it was. If it was prosaic.

574
00:49:20,679 --> 00:49:27,000
There's been no documentation or ever any
record provided by any government agency,

575
00:49:27,000 --> 00:49:30,480
and that's been part of the frustration. But if you talk to and you

576
00:49:30,519 --> 00:49:35,840
know, those primary witnesses, and
even if you watched them on the phenomenon,

577
00:49:36,679 --> 00:49:39,000
you know West or sixty six,
or even the documentary that I did,

578
00:49:40,079 --> 00:49:45,960
you know, many of them are
a pretty much adamant in the fact

579
00:49:45,000 --> 00:49:51,400
that they saw something that resembled a
flying saucer. It resembled the shape of

580
00:49:51,400 --> 00:49:57,239
a flying saucer. One of the
witnesses said, it almost looked translucent,

581
00:49:57,400 --> 00:50:07,159
translucent in nature. It moved in
ways that some of them could not explain

582
00:50:07,920 --> 00:50:15,039
or reconcile with technology that they would
have seen. Light aircraft which flew over

583
00:50:15,079 --> 00:50:20,519
the school repeatedly. You know,
Meraban Airport was only a couple of kilometers

584
00:50:20,519 --> 00:50:25,079
away, so you were clearly able
to hear and identify light aircraft flying over

585
00:50:25,119 --> 00:50:31,639
the school and the alleged landing site
area of the grange, which was about

586
00:50:31,840 --> 00:50:37,119
a mile south of the school,
and you would be able to identify,

587
00:50:37,400 --> 00:50:43,000
you know, other prosaic objects like
weather balloons, like hot air balloons,

588
00:50:43,079 --> 00:50:47,119
which the children knew what those objects
looked like, but they weren't able to

589
00:50:47,159 --> 00:50:52,719
reconcile what this was that they saw
that they saw above the skies above in

590
00:50:52,760 --> 00:50:59,199
the skies above their school, and
that was reported to have descended or even

591
00:50:59,280 --> 00:51:04,679
landed in this densely wooded area known
as the Grange, about a mile south

592
00:51:04,719 --> 00:51:08,880
of the school. So what the
west All incident? What can be attributed

593
00:51:08,920 --> 00:51:14,679
to what they saw on the sixth
of April nineteen sixty six above their school

594
00:51:14,679 --> 00:51:16,360
in Westall at the Grange. I
don't know. I wasn't there, but

595
00:51:16,519 --> 00:51:23,199
I certainly find their testimony incredibly compelling, and the fact that there's a complete

596
00:51:23,280 --> 00:51:30,199
lack of any documentary evidence fifty eight
years after that that makes it an enduring

597
00:51:30,280 --> 00:51:36,079
mystery and one of those long standing
cold cases. Yes, yeah, that's

598
00:51:36,159 --> 00:51:42,800
really there's so many puzzles and I
know that I believe this was the incident

599
00:51:42,880 --> 00:51:50,000
where the girl was kind of whists
away and night scene, but they had

600
00:51:50,039 --> 00:51:53,039
been able to locate her. Is
that true? Yeah, So her name

601
00:51:53,199 --> 00:51:58,880
was Tanya Vassi and she was actually
brought forward by Ross Coulta only a few

602
00:51:58,920 --> 00:52:05,320
years ago. So she came forward. There were reports that she was you

603
00:52:05,360 --> 00:52:10,159
know, uh whisked away. She
was taken away in an ambulance and then

604
00:52:10,239 --> 00:52:15,119
she she left the school abruptly and
no one ever heard from her again.

605
00:52:15,519 --> 00:52:23,800
I think that that account has been
disputed since obviously the documentary, So I

606
00:52:23,880 --> 00:52:32,719
don't know the truth behind those those
claims, but she certainly came forward only

607
00:52:32,800 --> 00:52:39,880
a few years ago and spoke briefly
about you know, her recollections of the

608
00:52:39,960 --> 00:52:45,599
day. But you know what is
what is also incredibly interesting is that you

609
00:52:45,719 --> 00:52:52,400
had reports from several of the primary
witnesses of a military presence on site at

610
00:52:52,440 --> 00:53:00,000
the school in a very short time
after the anomalous object or objects, because

611
00:53:00,199 --> 00:53:02,960
some indicated that up to three objects
were seen, not just the one,

612
00:53:04,840 --> 00:53:08,000
That there was a military presence on
site after it happened and for a number

613
00:53:08,039 --> 00:53:14,280
of days, and that were there
were even some folks that appeared to be

614
00:53:15,639 --> 00:53:21,199
military officials or even government officials that
were, you know, telling people to

615
00:53:21,199 --> 00:53:23,320
shut up about it. I mean, you had one of the one of

616
00:53:23,360 --> 00:53:27,559
the children, I believe it was
Tanya, Tanya Vassie, I can't quite

617
00:53:27,559 --> 00:53:34,519
recall, but she was taken into
a room in the in the school and

618
00:53:34,719 --> 00:53:40,000
she was asked questions by two folks
in suits, which she stated one of

619
00:53:40,000 --> 00:53:45,719
them she was able to identify had
a distinct American accent. So why is

620
00:53:45,800 --> 00:53:51,000
a Yank? Why is an American
on site investigating a prosaic you know,

621
00:53:52,239 --> 00:53:57,360
sighting and you had there not surprising
at all. No, well, there

622
00:53:57,360 --> 00:54:01,199
you go, and you know you've
got the the But then also, you

623
00:54:01,239 --> 00:54:08,320
know, it wasn't just children that
observed the flying saucer or flying sources.

624
00:54:08,360 --> 00:54:14,159
You had a young teacher by the
name of Andrew Greenwood who is twenty years

625
00:54:14,199 --> 00:54:20,400
of age on the day of the
incident, and he was also He also

626
00:54:20,639 --> 00:54:24,239
came forward only a couple of years
ago on a documentary that Ross Coulta did

627
00:54:24,280 --> 00:54:30,079
on the Western Incident, and he
has stated that only a day or a

628
00:54:30,159 --> 00:54:34,800
few days after the incident, he
had some folks in military uniforms come knocking

629
00:54:34,840 --> 00:54:40,079
on his door at his house,
unsolicited, uninvited, asking him to not

630
00:54:40,400 --> 00:54:44,679
yeah, telling him to shut up, not talk about the incident, because

631
00:54:44,679 --> 00:54:49,119
if he did, it would be
very easy for people to then come to

632
00:54:49,119 --> 00:54:53,159
the conclusion that he was drunk on
the day of the incident and that he

633
00:54:53,159 --> 00:54:59,559
was an alcoholic. So they've basically
given him this veiled threat that if you

634
00:54:59,559 --> 00:55:01,239
talk about at it, you're going
to lose your job and no one's going

635
00:55:01,280 --> 00:55:05,679
to take you seriously going forward.
Yeah, hang on, just one minute,

636
00:55:06,320 --> 00:55:08,599
just one second here. First of
all, is that documentary available.

637
00:55:10,119 --> 00:55:15,559
It is, Yes, So when
you missed it was done by sir Ross

638
00:55:15,559 --> 00:55:19,559
Coulton has done at I'm sorry,
I apologize. I mean the one that

639
00:55:19,639 --> 00:55:22,679
you did. Oh yes, no, certainly so. It's called The west

640
00:55:22,719 --> 00:55:29,000
All Witnesses and it's it on YouTube
my YouTube channel if you just type into

641
00:55:29,039 --> 00:55:32,400
YouTube my name or the Unexplained Rundown, which is the name of my podcast.

642
00:55:32,800 --> 00:55:36,480
One of the videos you'll find there
is called The west All Witnesses.

643
00:55:36,840 --> 00:55:38,639
All right, I will put that
link that in the show notes as well

644
00:55:38,679 --> 00:55:45,280
as below this YouTube and this video. What I'd like to do right now

645
00:55:45,320 --> 00:55:50,119
is say goodbye to everyone at kg
ra A Radio. We'll see you next

646
00:55:50,119 --> 00:55:53,360
week and I will continue on a
little longer. I have a doctor job

647
00:55:53,480 --> 00:55:59,000
SAFA on next week for a guest. So let's continue on a little longer

648
00:55:59,079 --> 00:56:05,760
if you don't mind, because again, thank you all at KGr A Radio

649
00:56:06,039 --> 00:56:13,119
and so so to continue on,
I'd like to ask you about as far

650
00:56:13,159 --> 00:56:19,159
as this case, there's really been
nothing relevant except for that teacher finally talking

651
00:56:19,199 --> 00:56:23,679
about it and coming forward. And
was this also the case where they took

652
00:56:23,719 --> 00:56:28,920
the camera from someone or they took
film or something out of a camera.

653
00:56:29,440 --> 00:56:35,440
Yeah, so it was also alleged
that another teacher by the name of I

654
00:56:35,480 --> 00:56:39,920
can't remember her name, but there
was another teacher that was alleged to have

655
00:56:40,079 --> 00:56:47,840
taken photographs on a camera during the
incident. But like any you know,

656
00:56:49,079 --> 00:56:54,920
good UFO case, that camera was
confiscated. If the allegation is to be

657
00:56:55,320 --> 00:57:02,559
to believe to be true, that
camera was confiscated and that photographic evidence has

658
00:57:02,639 --> 00:57:08,360
also never seen the light of days, so you know there is if And

659
00:57:09,039 --> 00:57:13,760
to go one step further, the
Channel nine, which is one of our

660
00:57:13,840 --> 00:57:19,760
legacy news medias in Australia, they
were on site on the school in the

661
00:57:19,800 --> 00:57:22,719
afternoon that day, a journalist was
on site with a cameraman and they were

662
00:57:22,719 --> 00:57:29,440
interviewing a number of the children,
and they would and that night on the

663
00:57:29,480 --> 00:57:35,440
news they aired their story of what
the children had seen that day at west

664
00:57:35,480 --> 00:57:43,360
Ole High School. And that broadcast
has also disappeared since the broadcast on the

665
00:57:43,440 --> 00:57:45,800
night of the sixth of April ninem
sixty six. Now, Shane Ryan is

666
00:57:45,840 --> 00:57:52,880
of the belief that it's quite possible
that that broadcast was simply destroyed in accordance

667
00:57:52,920 --> 00:57:58,440
with retention policies. Years passed,
But you would think something that is potentially

668
00:57:59,000 --> 00:58:04,599
so significant, because there were some
articles in the you know, local newspapers

669
00:58:04,599 --> 00:58:08,280
in the days following the Western incident
on the on the on the siding,

670
00:58:08,320 --> 00:58:14,159
on the incident itself. But to
your question, you know, the alleged

671
00:58:14,760 --> 00:58:19,320
photographic evidence that was taken on a
camera by one of the other teachers that

672
00:58:20,119 --> 00:58:25,320
was confiscated again never seen the light
of day. So another piece of the

673
00:58:25,320 --> 00:58:30,280
puzzle that makes it just an enduring
mystery. Do you recall if any of

674
00:58:30,320 --> 00:58:37,400
the witnesses had any like other sightings
along the way, Did they any of

675
00:58:37,440 --> 00:58:42,880
them talk about them having other things
in their lives, you know happened since

676
00:58:42,960 --> 00:58:45,320
that time. It's a good question. No, I didn't ask that question.

677
00:58:45,400 --> 00:58:51,800
I only I only asked them specifically
about their recollections on that day,

678
00:58:51,840 --> 00:58:54,719
the sixth of Aprah nineteen sixty six. I wouldn't be able to tell you

679
00:58:54,760 --> 00:59:00,559
either way if they've had any other
experiences pre or post that that day.

680
00:59:00,079 --> 00:59:05,960
But you know, they were all
those that were there on the day of

681
00:59:06,000 --> 00:59:09,360
the reunion event that I was able
to get on camera. On the day

682
00:59:09,400 --> 00:59:16,400
of the incident. Most of the
children were, you know, twelve thirteen

683
00:59:16,480 --> 00:59:22,119
years of age. There was,
but it wasn't all school children that saw

684
00:59:22,679 --> 00:59:27,840
the object above the Westall High School. It was also Andrew Greenwood, as

685
00:59:27,840 --> 00:59:30,760
I mentioned, the teacher. And
there was also Paul Smith, who was

686
00:59:30,800 --> 00:59:36,360
a sixteen year old working in the
market gardens that were adjacent to the grange

687
00:59:36,400 --> 00:59:38,880
area, this wooded area where it
was alleged to a descended or landed or

688
00:59:38,920 --> 00:59:43,480
hovered on the ground. He was
sixteen years of age on the day of

689
00:59:43,519 --> 00:59:47,920
the sighting and he was not associated
with the school children. And then you

690
00:59:47,960 --> 00:59:52,559
have there are other witnesses that were
offsite, not on the school, not

691
00:59:52,679 --> 00:59:59,079
in the market gardens, that also
saw something in the sky above Westerll High

692
00:59:59,119 --> 01:00:01,599
School. The one of the primary
witnesses I spoke to on the day,

693
01:00:01,639 --> 01:00:07,719
her name was de Satok. She
was a student. She was about twelve

694
01:00:07,840 --> 01:00:10,840
thirteen years of age. On the
day of the incident. She was at

695
01:00:12,119 --> 01:00:16,280
a school that was several miles away
from Westall High School, and during her

696
01:00:16,360 --> 01:00:21,960
recess break, she looked up in
the skies and she saw something anomalous that

697
01:00:22,000 --> 01:00:25,320
resembled a flying saucer. She saw
it was clearly a flying saucer when it

698
01:00:25,360 --> 01:00:30,480
banked and kind of turned on its
side to move. So she wasn't even

699
01:00:30,559 --> 01:00:34,519
at Westle High School and she saw
something. So it's not just isolated to

700
01:00:34,559 --> 01:00:37,760
the children and these small number of
teachers at Westle High School. You've got

701
01:00:38,119 --> 01:00:45,639
cooperative evidence from a number of different
folks from different backgrounds, different ages that

702
01:00:45,800 --> 01:00:51,800
saw something on the day. And
today, to Shane Ryan's credit, he

703
01:00:51,920 --> 01:00:57,599
has now interviewed and uncovered I believe
he spoke with up to one hundred and

704
01:00:57,599 --> 01:01:01,920
eighty witnesses of the of the west
All incident. And so you know,

705
01:01:02,000 --> 01:01:08,960
he's done a remarkable, remarkable job
to bring forward so many people. You

706
01:01:09,000 --> 01:01:15,159
know, more than just the handful
of school children that were willing to come

707
01:01:15,199 --> 01:01:19,679
out early on and talk about what
they saw. So there is you know,

708
01:01:20,559 --> 01:01:22,840
over time, more and more people, I think maybe feel more comfortable

709
01:01:22,880 --> 01:01:28,480
to talk about what it is they
saw on the day, and hopefully that

710
01:01:28,519 --> 01:01:36,079
continues to happen as well. So, now, did anyone go where this

711
01:01:36,199 --> 01:01:42,639
thing either hovered or landed in the
grange and try to you know, gets

712
01:01:42,760 --> 01:01:45,960
to see if there's any type of
trace evidence. Yeah, So it was

713
01:01:46,639 --> 01:01:52,760
reported that where there were three students
I can't remember their names, but it

714
01:01:52,840 --> 01:02:00,519
is covered in the phenomenon Rosscooltat's documentary
on seventh Spotlight and west All sixth that

715
01:02:00,559 --> 01:02:07,079
Shane Ryan did that there were three
school children that ran to the grange area

716
01:02:07,400 --> 01:02:14,639
where this object was reported to have
seen descending or hoverde of the One of

717
01:02:14,679 --> 01:02:21,800
the girls reported seeing it had landed
in the grange and then it kind of

718
01:02:22,400 --> 01:02:27,000
banked on an angle and just shot
up at an incredible rate of speed.

719
01:02:27,920 --> 01:02:32,239
What is interesting is that on the
day of the reunion event April of last

720
01:02:32,320 --> 01:02:38,480
year, the primary witnesses it took
place at the grange. They took those

721
01:02:38,559 --> 01:02:42,440
members of the general public, including
myself that were there on the day.

722
01:02:43,000 --> 01:02:46,320
We all walked to the alleged landing
site. So it's a clearing at the

723
01:02:46,360 --> 01:02:52,480
southeast corner of the grange, and
it's just it was reported that there was

724
01:02:53,320 --> 01:02:59,960
and they say this in the documentary
I did, that they saw a symmetrical

725
01:03:00,199 --> 01:03:07,320
circle an imprint of flattened grass where
this craft was alleged to have hovered or

726
01:03:07,440 --> 01:03:12,920
landed. So and then you have
reports from some folks that military were on

727
01:03:13,000 --> 01:03:16,840
site in the day, later the
day and the days following in that area

728
01:03:16,400 --> 01:03:23,000
with Geiger counters, with metal detectors, that soil samples were dug up and

729
01:03:23,039 --> 01:03:28,639
taken off site. Why would you
need to do that if it was something

730
01:03:28,719 --> 01:03:31,519
that was prosaic in nature, you
know, other than if it was some

731
01:03:32,119 --> 01:03:38,960
you know, top secret technology that
was being used to detect atmospheric conditions on

732
01:03:39,000 --> 01:03:43,239
a high bower that crashed and they
didn't want anyone to retrieve it. Maybe

733
01:03:43,280 --> 01:03:46,119
I don't know, but that seems
less plausible to me based on the fact

734
01:03:46,159 --> 01:03:52,519
that you would think school children and
a sixteen year old market gardener would be

735
01:03:52,519 --> 01:04:00,400
able to discern a deflating high bar
balloon. And it's really hard for people

736
01:04:00,480 --> 01:04:05,840
to appreciate the environment unless they're actually
there on site, you know, having

737
01:04:05,920 --> 01:04:11,199
been now on site at the school
and at the grange and see how low

738
01:04:11,320 --> 01:04:16,440
light aircraft fly above you. It's
it's it's implausible for me to think that

739
01:04:16,920 --> 01:04:21,599
children would not have been able to
identify it as a deflating balloon if it

740
01:04:21,679 --> 01:04:26,800
did, you know, descend towards
the grange, well, it's coming towards

741
01:04:26,800 --> 01:04:31,000
the ground. Paul Smith would have
seen, you know, I believe he

742
01:04:31,039 --> 01:04:34,320
would have seen and been able to
identify it as a balloon. And he

743
01:04:34,400 --> 01:04:40,079
has said categorically when I asked him
the question. You know, some have

744
01:04:40,159 --> 01:04:42,280
said that it's a high valley says, no, it wasn't a balloon.

745
01:04:42,320 --> 01:04:45,519
It certainly wasn't a balloon. So
but but yes, to your question,

746
01:04:45,760 --> 01:04:50,199
there was there, There was a
room. It alleged to be trace evidence

747
01:04:50,639 --> 01:04:57,199
this imprint and imprint in the flattened
grass. Soil samples were taken. That

748
01:04:57,440 --> 01:05:02,159
area was closed off to for a
number of days, and you even had

749
01:05:02,199 --> 01:05:05,519
reports of and this is what I
tried to cover off in my little documentary,

750
01:05:06,079 --> 01:05:11,639
is that parallel to the southeast corner
of the grange where this alleged landing

751
01:05:11,639 --> 01:05:15,199
site is there's a golf course called
the Spring Valley Golf Club, and that

752
01:05:15,280 --> 01:05:21,840
golf course has not changed all that
much significantly since since nineteen sixty six.

753
01:05:23,320 --> 01:05:28,280
So I wanted to know well and
it was reported and Shane Ryan has reported

754
01:05:28,280 --> 01:05:32,119
this. He got in touch with
the son of a groundskeeper who was working

755
01:05:32,480 --> 01:05:38,880
at the golf course on the day
of the incident, and the groundskeeper's son

756
01:05:38,960 --> 01:05:44,320
reported to Shane Ryan that when his
dad came home that day, he was

757
01:05:44,360 --> 01:05:47,599
told that there were a number of
golfers on the eighth hole that observed something

758
01:05:47,880 --> 01:05:54,559
in the skies descending towards the grange
and it was anomalous to them. They

759
01:05:54,599 --> 01:05:58,159
weren't able to identify what it was. So I was very curious to see,

760
01:05:58,159 --> 01:06:01,320
well, what was the perspective that
these golfers potentially what would they have

761
01:06:01,400 --> 01:06:05,880
potentially seen through their eyes, what
would their point of view or perspective been

762
01:06:05,920 --> 01:06:09,760
On the day, the sixth of
April nineteen sixty six, so I booked

763
01:06:09,760 --> 01:06:13,320
myself in for a round of golf, paid through the ass for a round,

764
01:06:13,360 --> 01:06:17,679
but I was able to film from
the eighth the eighth the eighth hole,

765
01:06:18,320 --> 01:06:23,280
from the fairway and the green,
what the perspective would have looked like

766
01:06:23,480 --> 01:06:29,280
by golfers that were putting or playing
the short game towards the end of the

767
01:06:29,280 --> 01:06:32,519
eighth hole, to see what it
may have looked like through their eyes on

768
01:06:32,559 --> 01:06:39,920
the day seeing something anomalous descend into
the densely wooded area known as the grange.

769
01:06:39,960 --> 01:06:44,960
So I cover that element in my
documentary which had never really been touched

770
01:06:44,960 --> 01:06:48,440
on before. So just another added
piece of the puzzle. I guess that's

771
01:06:48,480 --> 01:06:56,920
interesting. So for the person out
there that's listening or watching and it's not

772
01:06:56,920 --> 01:07:02,280
familiar with the Westall UFO incident,
I will put a link to that so

773
01:07:02,440 --> 01:07:06,920
an overall Wikipedia or something in the
show notes, so you'll be able to

774
01:07:08,119 --> 01:07:12,239
read up on that and get more
information. It's a very very interesting.

775
01:07:12,440 --> 01:07:16,519
I think there were one hundreds or
well over one hundred witnesses back in nineteen

776
01:07:16,599 --> 01:07:24,679
sixty six in the Melbourne area at
the West Dall School. So yeah,

777
01:07:24,719 --> 01:07:29,480
it's a great case. What would
you consider another one of your favorites that

778
01:07:29,519 --> 01:07:34,199
you've looked into that happened in your
country. So there's another case that I

779
01:07:34,239 --> 01:07:38,800
haven't done a lot of homework on
myself, but I know someone who has

780
01:07:38,840 --> 01:07:43,639
George Simpson, who's another research in
Australia. He authored a wonderful book called

781
01:07:43,760 --> 01:07:49,000
Nothing on Radar. So it's the
Frederick Valentiche case of the late nineteen seventies

782
01:07:49,559 --> 01:07:58,840
where sadly he lost his life his
light plane. He encountered something that was

783
01:07:59,280 --> 01:08:02,960
anomalist him. He couldn't reconcile what
it was, uh, and a lot

784
01:08:02,960 --> 01:08:10,480
of the commentary was caught between him
and air traffic control was recorded. Unfortunately,

785
01:08:10,519 --> 01:08:14,239
the actual recordings have never been located. They may have been destroyed.

786
01:08:14,239 --> 01:08:17,279
There's a transcript that I was made
aware of. There was put into a

787
01:08:18,560 --> 01:08:25,720
recreation using the transcript. But that's
a fascinating case where you've got someone that's

788
01:08:26,439 --> 01:08:31,760
you know, a general aviation pilot
that has seen something anomalous that has engaged

789
01:08:31,800 --> 01:08:40,000
his aircraft and unfortunately he Frederick Valentich
Valentchs lost his lost his life. And

790
01:08:40,039 --> 01:08:44,800
that's been another case that has never
been resolved. So that still remains an

791
01:08:44,880 --> 01:08:49,079
enduring cold case mystery as well.
You know, I am yet to read

792
01:08:49,880 --> 01:08:53,479
George Simpson's book, Nothing on Radar, but from what I've heard, it's

793
01:08:53,520 --> 01:08:59,000
a it's a great account of that
that incident. Yeah, yeah, that

794
01:08:59,159 --> 01:09:02,000
is such a mystery. And you
know, I mean there's the noise.

795
01:09:02,199 --> 01:09:08,359
I believe, I I believe James
Fox told me that he actually at one

796
01:09:08,399 --> 01:09:14,479
time heard the original recording I believe, if that's possible, many years ago,

797
01:09:14,800 --> 01:09:19,119
and that's h and that's gone.
But yeah, that there's a lot

798
01:09:19,119 --> 01:09:23,840
of reenactments. You can find that
out if you're looking on YouTube. They

799
01:09:23,880 --> 01:09:29,520
have reenactments of the transcript of what
what happened that day. But yeah,

800
01:09:29,560 --> 01:09:32,560
that's I mean one of the one
of the cases that I covered on my

801
01:09:32,720 --> 01:09:36,359
on my channel that I'm a big
I'm a big Kurt Russell fan. For

802
01:09:36,439 --> 01:09:43,319
those yeah Russell, uh, and
I've taken a big interest in the Phoenix

803
01:09:43,399 --> 01:09:47,359
Lights of March of nine and ninety
seven. And for those that follow and

804
01:09:47,439 --> 01:09:53,600
know the Phoenix Lights incident, you
know, it was in twenty seventeen when

805
01:09:53,640 --> 01:09:59,000
Kurt Russell was promoting Guardians of the
Galaxy Volume two on the BBC's The One

806
01:09:59,039 --> 01:10:01,640
Show that he came out and he
revealed to the world that he was the

807
01:10:01,680 --> 01:10:08,600
general aviation pilot that reported to air
traffic control at sky Harbor International that he

808
01:10:08,760 --> 01:10:15,159
was the pilot that reported observing the
Phoenix Lights on approach to the airport,

809
01:10:15,319 --> 01:10:17,039
and I found that to be incredibly
fascinating. And then it was a year

810
01:10:17,119 --> 01:10:21,600
later in twenty eighteen. He then
went on the Jimmy Kimmel Show and talked

811
01:10:21,600 --> 01:10:29,119
again about his encounter with his son
Oliver Hudson seeing the Phoenix Lights. And

812
01:10:29,720 --> 01:10:34,439
Kurt Russell and his family seemed to
have quite an interesting connection with the UFO

813
01:10:34,520 --> 01:10:42,119
topic because Goldie Horns, Kurt Russell's
longtime partner, has had her own experiences

814
01:10:42,159 --> 01:10:47,119
with the phenomenon, and even Kurt
Russell's son, Whittet Russell, has seen

815
01:10:47,159 --> 01:10:50,119
the UFOs, So I don't know
if it runs in the family, but

816
01:10:50,840 --> 01:10:56,399
I did a bit of a deep
dive of Kurt Russell's account or sighting of

817
01:10:56,439 --> 01:11:00,319
the Phoenix Lights and was able to
actually uncover some new information that had never

818
01:11:00,359 --> 01:11:05,840
been reported before publicly. Is that
I was able to track down the pilot,

819
01:11:05,880 --> 01:11:12,479
the owner of the aircraft, the
Light aircraft, a single prop propeller

820
01:11:12,880 --> 01:11:17,520
engine plane that Kurt flew to Phoenix
on the night of the thirteenth of March

821
01:11:17,600 --> 01:11:21,119
nineteen ninety seven. And for anyone
that's a Kurt Russell fan out there,

822
01:11:21,119 --> 01:11:25,840
this is a bit of a spoiler. But Kurt Russell did a film in

823
01:11:25,920 --> 01:11:33,239
nineteen ninety six called Executive Decision where
he is at the front end of the

824
01:11:33,279 --> 01:11:41,079
film's he's learning how to become a
general aviation pilot. So he's doing one

825
01:11:41,119 --> 01:11:45,520
of his last flights with an instructor
before he does his solid flight. And

826
01:11:45,680 --> 01:11:49,920
if you listen to what Kurt Russell
says is in that interview on the BBC's

827
01:11:49,960 --> 01:11:55,560
The One program in twenty seventeen,
he says three words. He says.

828
01:11:55,800 --> 01:12:01,640
He basically says, I was the
tails of the plane, was to Tango

829
01:12:01,760 --> 01:12:05,720
Sierra, and I was the pilot, and I knew I had heard the

830
01:12:05,760 --> 01:12:11,880
words to Tango Sierra before, so
I consulted the oracle my Kurt Russell David

831
01:12:12,000 --> 01:12:15,600
collection. And at the front end
of Executive Decision Decision nine to ninety six,

832
01:12:16,000 --> 01:12:20,880
there is a scene where Kurt Russell's
character, David Grant is doing one

833
01:12:20,880 --> 01:12:27,399
of his last flightspoort for his solo
flight, and he's coming into land.

834
01:12:27,399 --> 01:12:32,880
He's on approach and he during in
the film, he says his call sign

835
01:12:33,279 --> 01:12:39,479
of Tou Tango Sierra to air traffic
control, the exact same call sign that

836
01:12:39,560 --> 01:12:44,199
he revealed in that interview on the
BBC's One Show, and I was able

837
01:12:44,239 --> 01:12:50,359
to confirm that the plane that he
flew in the film Executive Decision was the

838
01:12:50,439 --> 01:12:56,000
exact plane that he flew to Phoenix
on the thirteenth of March ninety oh seven.

839
01:12:56,079 --> 01:12:58,560
And I know that to be the
case because I was able to track

840
01:12:58,640 --> 01:13:02,920
down the owner of that plane,
Tutangi Sarah Tutango Sierra. His name was

841
01:13:03,000 --> 01:13:08,359
John Rixey Moore. And as a
fun fact, he was actually the flight

842
01:13:08,439 --> 01:13:13,560
instructor in that scene with Kurt Russell
in Executive Decision. He's good friends with

843
01:13:13,680 --> 01:13:17,279
Kurt Russell and it was his plane
that was used in the film that Kurt

844
01:13:17,359 --> 01:13:21,520
Russell also flew to Phoenix when he
saw the Phoenix lights. So talk about

845
01:13:21,560 --> 01:13:27,520
some synchronicities there. But I just
found that to be an interesting side side

846
01:13:27,600 --> 01:13:30,800
story. Yeah, and if it
wasn't for Goldie Hain, he would have

847
01:13:30,880 --> 01:13:36,359
never recalled that whole incident. She
was watching something on the Phoenix sites,

848
01:13:36,439 --> 01:13:41,840
I believe, and that's what jogged
his memory, like, oh yeah,

849
01:13:42,039 --> 01:13:44,199
you know, I was there about
the same time, and when he looked

850
01:13:44,199 --> 01:13:48,319
into his logbook he figured out it
was March. I mean isn't it interesting

851
01:13:48,359 --> 01:13:56,520
that Kurt Court and Oliver Hudson never
spoke about what they saw the Phoenix lights

852
01:13:56,600 --> 01:13:59,960
after it happened. And I mean
you hear that time a lot of other

853
01:14:00,159 --> 01:14:01,279
they kind of just forget about it
and get out with life. Yes,

854
01:14:01,399 --> 01:14:05,640
and yeah, you're right. Yeah, he ever heard this documentary that that

855
01:14:05,760 --> 01:14:10,520
goalie was watching on TV about the
Phoenix Lights and that sparked his memory.

856
01:14:10,520 --> 01:14:14,479
And then he ran and had a
look at his log books because he you

857
01:14:14,479 --> 01:14:17,560
know, like any good pilot,
they document every single flight. And yeah,

858
01:14:17,600 --> 01:14:21,119
he confirmed it. He was flying
to Phoenix on the thirtieth March nine

859
01:14:21,239 --> 01:14:27,600
ninety seven and he saw the Phoenix
lights. Yeah. I'm just gonna pop

860
01:14:27,720 --> 01:14:30,039
this up just I don't know if
I can show this, but just a

861
01:14:30,079 --> 01:14:33,239
couple of things. We're at the
end of our show and I was actually

862
01:14:33,359 --> 01:14:40,279
underneath the Chinese spy balloon when it
was shot. Well, yeah, I

863
01:14:40,359 --> 01:14:43,880
just happened to get out of my
car, lady in Myrtle Beach. I

864
01:14:43,920 --> 01:14:45,079
don't know if this shows it.
I'm going to take a chance here of

865
01:14:45,159 --> 01:14:50,199
this looking at the Chinese all out
and when it gets over with you and

866
01:14:50,239 --> 01:14:58,000
then this is when it was showing. Yeah, I actually am doing this

867
01:14:58,119 --> 01:15:01,439
while they shot the balloon. It's
coming. They shot the bullow. How

868
01:15:01,560 --> 01:15:08,399
fascinating. There go our first hand
witness. Yeah, the BBC. Actually

869
01:15:08,439 --> 01:15:11,960
I put it on Twitter and the
BBC got a hold of me and they

870
01:15:12,000 --> 01:15:14,880
interviewed me and they did put it. It did they did publish it.

871
01:15:15,640 --> 01:15:18,800
So Also, what I would say
that is how frustrating is it that the

872
01:15:18,920 --> 01:15:25,479
US Department of Defense will be quick
to quick to release footage from a YouTube

873
01:15:25,760 --> 01:15:29,439
spyplane Dragon Lady of the Chin's by
balloon, and it will be quick to

874
01:15:29,479 --> 01:15:35,640
release your footage of Russian jets dowsing
m Q nine Reaper drones with fuel.

875
01:15:35,760 --> 01:15:40,560
They'll be quick to release that footage, but they have not yet released any

876
01:15:41,159 --> 01:15:48,680
of the visual, photographical, or
injury footage of those three identified unidentified aerial

877
01:15:48,720 --> 01:15:51,840
objects that were shot down. That's
right. What does that tell you?

878
01:15:51,640 --> 01:15:56,239
You know? Yeah, yeah,
I know those the ones up in Alaska,

879
01:15:56,279 --> 01:16:00,000
in the Yukon and all that very
very strange. Also, we mentioned

880
01:16:00,159 --> 01:16:05,039
Ross Coldheart a lot, and I
want to say to the public that listened

881
01:16:05,039 --> 01:16:12,359
to this show, my favorite podcast
is Need to Know with Bryce Zabel and

882
01:16:12,640 --> 01:16:15,359
Ross Coldheart. I love that show, and I listened to each one of

883
01:16:15,399 --> 01:16:20,359
them, and I think for all
those of you that I really like this

884
01:16:20,479 --> 01:16:26,319
topic, I highly endorse that and
I would like for you to check it

885
01:16:26,359 --> 01:16:30,079
out. They need to know it's
called and they do such a wonderful job.

886
01:16:30,119 --> 01:16:32,920
Those two really great stuff. So
you should be proud you got your

887
01:16:32,960 --> 01:16:38,760
guy from Australia taking this so seriously
and he's such a sharp I mean,

888
01:16:39,159 --> 01:16:43,840
I need to know is one of
my primary sources of information because, like

889
01:16:43,880 --> 01:16:46,000
we were saying off air at the
start, you know, with so much

890
01:16:46,079 --> 01:16:49,800
that's been happening on this topic of
the coolest of the last few years,

891
01:16:49,479 --> 01:16:55,119
it's almost become a full time job
to stay up to date with what's new

892
01:16:55,119 --> 01:16:58,880
and what's breaking. And Bryce and
Ross they do such a great job of

893
01:16:58,960 --> 01:17:03,319
covering and recaping your what's come out, what's breaking, and the implications as

894
01:17:03,359 --> 01:17:10,159
well and what to potentially think is
around around the corner on the rise,

895
01:17:10,199 --> 01:17:14,199
and so you know, for so
many of us, Ross and Bryce serve

896
01:17:14,239 --> 01:17:17,640
as a bit of a barometer as
to where we are, you know,

897
01:17:17,680 --> 01:17:21,159
where we're going on the topic.
But I certainly echo your sentiment. Need

898
01:17:21,199 --> 01:17:28,399
to know is a great, great
educational platform and it certainly very informing as

899
01:17:28,399 --> 01:17:30,640
well. Excellently. Well, thanks
so much. It's been a real pleasure,

900
01:17:31,079 --> 01:17:34,960
and thank you for all your information
and good luck for your journey along

901
01:17:35,000 --> 01:17:41,039
the way here. And I'm sure
I appreciate it. We'll back here absolutely.

902
01:17:41,479 --> 01:17:44,560
Yeah, thanks so much man for
having me on and having a good

903
01:17:44,560 --> 01:17:46,640
fun chat with you and sharing some
insights with your viewers. I appreciate.

904
01:17:47,600 --> 01:17:53,800
I appreciate the chat. Excellent.
Okay, take care. So I have

905
01:17:53,880 --> 01:17:57,079
been talking a lot with Markty and
Tony and a few other people about the

906
01:17:57,199 --> 01:18:00,800
jellyfish balloon because so many people have
an interest in that, and it's possible

907
01:18:01,359 --> 01:18:09,560
that it is this right here,
which is actually an Islamic e Id celebration

908
01:18:10,119 --> 01:18:14,560
balloon. The kind of fits that
I don't think there's anything conclusive yet though

909
01:18:14,600 --> 01:18:17,840
exactly what that is. It's very
interesting. You know. What would really

910
01:18:17,880 --> 01:18:24,760
help is if we had footage of
this thing actually going into the water,

911
01:18:24,960 --> 01:18:30,239
like some of the witness is that
Jerey mccorbell says he has spoken to has

912
01:18:30,600 --> 01:18:33,760
talked about and they actually have that
footage supposedly. Now, that would really

913
01:18:33,800 --> 01:18:38,319
help if we all could see that. And you know, of course it's

914
01:18:38,399 --> 01:18:43,479
definitely a mystery as to what it
is. Next week we have Job Safah

915
01:18:43,520 --> 01:18:46,000
on Don't Forget. It's a good
show. He's a scientist, will be

916
01:18:46,079 --> 01:18:50,640
interesting and just in a couple of
days. On Thursday night, we have

917
01:18:50,720 --> 01:18:55,920
Michael Schratt joining us on UAP Crossfire. A lot of people really love it,

918
01:18:56,000 --> 01:19:00,600
some people don't like it. It's
myself, Christoperno, Don Ecker and

919
01:19:00,880 --> 01:19:04,319
Commanded Cobra with four of us.
We kind of have different points on UFO

920
01:19:04,439 --> 01:19:12,000
topics. And again Michael Schrat on
UAP Crash Retrievals. He was on the

921
01:19:12,039 --> 01:19:14,840
show not too long to go,
very well received. He will be on

922
01:19:14,880 --> 01:19:18,239
that. Also, we have a
treat. I've noticed tonight that my friend,

923
01:19:19,279 --> 01:19:25,039
very talented musician Mark Stanley has been
in the chat and joining us,

924
01:19:25,079 --> 01:19:27,800
and I've known him for many years, a great guy. I'm going to

925
01:19:27,840 --> 01:19:30,880
play one of his songs for the
outro here, which is a little something

926
01:19:30,920 --> 01:19:34,079
different for us, and I hope
you enjoy it and we'll see you next

927
01:19:34,079 --> 01:19:59,399
week. Remember to keep your eyes
to the sky. She's so cool and

928
01:19:59,560 --> 01:20:08,239
calm, it's steady, but she's
as closed as nearest star. But I

929
01:20:08,319 --> 01:20:15,880
got time until she's ready, I
got time. It's there you are.

930
01:20:18,960 --> 01:20:29,800
When I see my heart beats faster
stops beating like a big beast drum every

931
01:20:30,039 --> 01:20:36,359
time then I walk past it.
Everything about he says, she's the one.

932
01:20:38,279 --> 01:20:54,560
Everything about he says, she's the
wall. She's like the sun dancing

933
01:20:54,640 --> 01:20:59,960
off the water. She's like the
first time that I fell in love.

934
01:21:02,000 --> 01:21:08,560
I can't wait to say that I've
got her. What I've waited for is

935
01:21:09,359 --> 01:21:24,279
only come when I see my heartbeats
faster starts beating like a big beast drum

936
01:21:24,640 --> 01:21:31,079
every time that I walked past her. Everything about he says, she's the

937
01:21:31,239 --> 01:21:47,359
one. Everything about since she's the
wolver She's a one makes me forget where

938
01:21:47,520 --> 01:21:57,680
I've been before. She's a warm
and having no regrets that I've never been.

939
01:21:58,000 --> 01:22:11,920
Loving life it is be let us
see my heartbeats faster starts speaking like

940
01:22:11,960 --> 01:22:20,239
a big bass drove every time that
I walk faster. Everything about us says

941
01:22:21,079 --> 01:22:31,680
she's the one. Everything about her
says she's the one. Everything about us

942
01:22:31,720 --> 01:22:51,000
she's she's love. She's a