1 00:00:00,800 --> 00:00:06,599 You're listening to the Paranormal UK Radio Network, the best in paranormal talk radio 2 00:00:06,799 --> 00:00:11,519 in the UK and around the world. If I had to boil down the 3 00:00:11,560 --> 00:00:17,559 two most important books that catapulted near death experiences into public awareness, they would 4 00:00:17,640 --> 00:00:25,760 be first off, Life After Life, written by Raymond Moody in nineteen seventy 5 00:00:25,800 --> 00:00:36,000 five, and then this one in twenty twelve, exploding onto the public stage 6 00:00:36,200 --> 00:00:43,560 was Eben Alexander's Proof of Heaven. Both captured the imaginations of millions of people, 7 00:00:44,240 --> 00:00:49,560 and today I have the privilege of introducing you to doctor Eben Alexander. 8 00:00:50,520 --> 00:00:56,039 Welcome to the Afterlife Files, where we investigate near death experiences, shared death 9 00:00:56,079 --> 00:01:00,359 experiences, and how they affect you. Unlike by casts that are just stories. 10 00:01:00,399 --> 00:01:03,200 We'll give you a heads up on what to look for in our conversation, 11 00:01:03,359 --> 00:01:08,400 and then after the interview, stick Around will help you make sense of 12 00:01:08,400 --> 00:01:12,840 those accounts so you can incorporate the insights into your life. I think you'll 13 00:01:12,879 --> 00:01:19,359 find that once having your most profound questions answered, living life in the physical 14 00:01:19,480 --> 00:01:38,040 is filled with more peace and joy. Evan Alexander, MD was an academic 15 00:01:38,120 --> 00:01:45,480 neurosurgeon for over twenty five years, including fifteen years at the Brigand and Women's 16 00:01:45,519 --> 00:01:51,680 Hospital, Children's Hospital, and Harvard Medical School in Boston. In two thousand 17 00:01:51,760 --> 00:01:57,159 and eight, he experienced a transcendental near death experience during a week long coma 18 00:01:57,840 --> 00:02:07,319 from an index explicable brain infection that completely transformed his worldview. A pioneering scientist 19 00:02:07,519 --> 00:02:13,560 and modern thought leader in the emerging science that acknowledges the primacy of consciousness in 20 00:02:13,599 --> 00:02:19,199 the universe, he is the author of the New York Times number one bestseller 21 00:02:19,560 --> 00:02:24,439 Proof of Heaven, Map of Heaven, and Living in a Mindful Universe. 22 00:02:27,360 --> 00:02:34,080 This fascinating interview is unlike any I have conducted in the Afterlife Files. It's 23 00:02:34,120 --> 00:02:38,639 a curious mixture of head and heart. We find out later in the interview 24 00:02:38,639 --> 00:02:45,439 when he talks about being attacked. Watch how evans first response to questions is 25 00:02:45,479 --> 00:02:49,840 to go to his head and answer from a scientific viewpoint. He's very good 26 00:02:49,919 --> 00:02:53,879 at that, and he should be. He's a trained scientist and has that 27 00:02:53,000 --> 00:03:00,639 worldview. So keep your penhandy. He will give you tons of leads to 28 00:03:00,800 --> 00:03:05,680 interesting and relevant books, articles, and papers. I'm not going to list 29 00:03:05,759 --> 00:03:09,120 them down below. He'll give you a reference at the end of the interview. 30 00:03:09,520 --> 00:03:13,479 Where there are a bunch of hot links and you can just pick them 31 00:03:13,599 --> 00:03:17,879 up from there. Now, here's the interesting part. About seventeen minutes into 32 00:03:17,919 --> 00:03:22,520 the interview, I ask him about the role of heart and love and near 33 00:03:22,560 --> 00:03:30,159 death experiences. The scientist drops, Evan emerges and he talks eloquently about the 34 00:03:30,159 --> 00:03:36,639 primacy of love and its directing force in the universe. It's a moving and 35 00:03:36,879 --> 00:03:43,240 breath taking in its importance. In that description, he uses the word consilience. 36 00:03:43,719 --> 00:03:49,319 Frankly, he stumped me on that one. It means the agreement between 37 00:03:49,360 --> 00:03:54,159 approaches to a topic of different academic subjects, especially science and the humanities. 38 00:03:54,520 --> 00:04:00,960 Simply put, it's a synthesis of ideas from different disciplines. Lastly, we 39 00:04:01,039 --> 00:04:06,080 assume that you know his story. If not, there are hundreds of interviews 40 00:04:06,120 --> 00:04:13,840 captured and uploaded onto YouTube. Choose your favorite. Here's our interview with doctor 41 00:04:13,919 --> 00:04:28,279 Evan Alexander fifteen years later. I've been really glad to have you here on 42 00:04:28,519 --> 00:04:32,040 the Afterlife Files. Welcome well, Scott. It's great to be with you 43 00:04:32,120 --> 00:04:35,839 again. It's been a while and I've always looked forward to catching up with 44 00:04:35,879 --> 00:04:41,000 you and finding out what's new, and looking forward to our time together today. 45 00:04:42,519 --> 00:04:47,600 Well, I have been so thinking about you lately because it's been this 46 00:04:47,680 --> 00:04:51,160 is kind of an anniversary year. It's been fifteen years since you had your 47 00:04:51,399 --> 00:05:00,959 ND and over the course of time, I know that near deathics experiencers kind 48 00:05:00,000 --> 00:05:05,240 of evolve their understanding of their experience. What's happened to you? Well, 49 00:05:05,639 --> 00:05:11,279 what I can tell you is, you know, being a scientist, I've 50 00:05:11,800 --> 00:05:16,360 tried to always put my journey into a kind of a scientific perspective, and 51 00:05:16,399 --> 00:05:20,439 that's what I've really spent the last fifteen years doing. And the good news 52 00:05:20,560 --> 00:05:27,079 is, as you're quite well aware, there are multiple scientific groups around the 53 00:05:27,120 --> 00:05:34,160 world who are studying the afterlife question and similar issues concerning consciousness. So for 54 00:05:34,279 --> 00:05:38,959 me, I feel like a kid in a candy store. You know, 55 00:05:39,079 --> 00:05:43,680 people often think, oh, well, I guess the scientific community is not 56 00:05:43,839 --> 00:05:46,360 on board with that kind of craziness. But in fact, some of my 57 00:05:46,439 --> 00:05:51,720 biggest support for sharing my stories come from the scientific community, from groups like 58 00:05:53,199 --> 00:05:59,920 Division or Perceptual Studies at University of Virginia or Institute of Noetic Sciences at California, 59 00:06:00,120 --> 00:06:03,759 and of course the European Investigators. There's a lot of support for our 60 00:06:04,279 --> 00:06:10,279 story in Europe and the scientific and Medical network as well as the Galileo Commission. 61 00:06:10,639 --> 00:06:13,800 So I've just I really have been like a kid in a candy store 62 00:06:13,839 --> 00:06:18,079 working with scientists around the world. There's a fantastic revolution in kind of the 63 00:06:18,120 --> 00:06:27,639 fundamental tenets and metaphysics supporting our modern science that are in shift. And that's 64 00:06:27,720 --> 00:06:32,399 what I think is so exciting is how this whole near death experience community in 65 00:06:32,480 --> 00:06:38,920 many ways is kind of a tip of the spear for a revolution in scientific 66 00:06:39,079 --> 00:06:43,319 understanding of the mind brain relationship, the nature of consciousness, and indeed the 67 00:06:43,439 --> 00:06:47,120 very fundamental nature of reality. So it's an exciting time to be alive and 68 00:06:47,160 --> 00:06:55,360 I'm certainly thrilled to be part of this revolution. Amen. Brother. So 69 00:06:56,120 --> 00:07:00,600 it's also been five years since your last book, Living a Mindful Universe. 70 00:07:02,000 --> 00:07:06,079 What have you been thinking about lately? Because I know your brain is always 71 00:07:06,160 --> 00:07:13,399 percolating. Well, you know, I must say I often tell people that 72 00:07:15,240 --> 00:07:18,839 the book Proof of Heaven from my perspective, is a big question mark. 73 00:07:18,839 --> 00:07:23,439 You know, it simply says, yes, these amazing events happened to humans, 74 00:07:23,439 --> 00:07:26,680 but what do they mean? How can we interpret them? And I 75 00:07:26,720 --> 00:07:30,560 would say that the book Living in a mindful Universe, which, as you 76 00:07:30,680 --> 00:07:32,879 point out, came out five al those five years ago. It came out 77 00:07:32,879 --> 00:07:40,600 in twenty seventeen. In fact, that book is more of a proof of 78 00:07:40,720 --> 00:07:46,959 heaven because it goes into the details of really kind of uniting science and spirituality 79 00:07:46,720 --> 00:07:53,279 in a way that Karen Knewll my partner, and I saw saw fit at 80 00:07:53,279 --> 00:07:58,720 that time, but since that time, I would say, my understanding of 81 00:07:58,759 --> 00:08:03,600 some of the relevant issues, and in particular that concerns quantum physics and its 82 00:08:03,639 --> 00:08:13,199 relevance and really putting together the whole package of consciousness from the hard problem consciousness 83 00:08:13,199 --> 00:08:18,199 and neuroscience, through the binding problem in philosophy of mind, all the evidence 84 00:08:18,240 --> 00:08:22,199 for non local consciousness and parapsychology, like to Lepitham of viewing, and then 85 00:08:22,240 --> 00:08:28,079 of course that lion's share of information coming from the world of quantum physics, 86 00:08:28,120 --> 00:08:33,559 which implies to us that the very physical world around us doesn't exist except as 87 00:08:33,600 --> 00:08:39,600 an expression of the mental layer of the universe. It really brings into kind 88 00:08:39,639 --> 00:08:46,559 of importance in a scientific perspective, the power of mind over matter, And 89 00:08:46,600 --> 00:08:50,720 of course it's a healer. I'm fascinated by that as it presents in something 90 00:08:50,759 --> 00:08:56,519 like placebo effect or spontaneous remission, and especially of course miraculous healing and near 91 00:08:56,600 --> 00:09:01,600 death experiences, which I think is the most profound kind of expression of mind 92 00:09:01,639 --> 00:09:05,919 over matter and the power of our free will and kind of our spiritual nature 93 00:09:05,120 --> 00:09:11,320 to guide our unfolding universe. And so all of this is now gained for 94 00:09:11,440 --> 00:09:18,440 kind of the scientific interpretation, given a lot of our modern efforts to understand 95 00:09:18,480 --> 00:09:24,279 these phenomena. And of course these phenomena include not only you know, all 96 00:09:24,320 --> 00:09:28,039 the evidence for the afterlife, but after death communications and near death experiences, 97 00:09:28,120 --> 00:09:33,720 but also the tremendous evidence for kind of eternity of soul, and that privacy 98 00:09:33,799 --> 00:09:41,679 of consciousness has exemplified through all the work showing of you know, reincarnation memories 99 00:09:41,679 --> 00:09:48,399 and children past life memories and children suggestive of reincarnation actually are telling us something 100 00:09:48,480 --> 00:09:54,159 deep and profound about the nature reality, and all of this blends into an 101 00:09:54,200 --> 00:10:00,840 incredible kind of revolution and understanding and living in a mind for unise is probably 102 00:10:01,120 --> 00:10:05,840 still one of the best premers to help people get up to speed on where 103 00:10:05,840 --> 00:10:11,480 all that's headed. But we're already kind of working on what the next levels 104 00:10:11,480 --> 00:10:16,840 of explanation might be and you know what's required in various theoretical models to try 105 00:10:16,879 --> 00:10:22,360 and make sense of all this and explain his privacy of consciousness and viewing the 106 00:10:22,399 --> 00:10:28,879 brain is a filter for that primordial mind. But you know, waiting for 107 00:10:28,960 --> 00:10:31,840 the scientific world to catch up on all this is not something any of us 108 00:10:31,840 --> 00:10:35,120 really have to do. We can all kind of run with it now, 109 00:10:35,360 --> 00:10:39,519 you know, through meditation, centering, prayer, all the various ways of 110 00:10:39,639 --> 00:10:45,600 going within are ways of experimenting with how we can glean information from the universe 111 00:10:45,759 --> 00:10:52,120 and contribute to a much more ideal world. Unfolding is our reality, and 112 00:10:52,159 --> 00:10:54,279 that's where I think that the lessons of the book Living in My Mind for 113 00:10:54,440 --> 00:10:58,799 Universe, as well as a lot of the teaching that we've done in the 114 00:11:00,080 --> 00:11:03,720 last five years since it came out, is really important to help people get 115 00:11:03,799 --> 00:11:11,159 up to speed with understanding where this is all headed. So I remember that 116 00:11:11,600 --> 00:11:16,879 about five years ago the International Association for Near Death Studies did kind of a 117 00:11:18,000 --> 00:11:22,840 switch. I'm not sure it was conscious, but it was. They kind 118 00:11:22,840 --> 00:11:31,960 of moved away from our nd is real to the question of how do they 119 00:11:31,000 --> 00:11:37,759 live with what they know? And you're touching on that here, you know, 120 00:11:37,799 --> 00:11:41,679 it's like, what is this? What does this mean for us as 121 00:11:41,759 --> 00:11:46,919 individuals and for us as a community. Talk more about that, well, 122 00:11:46,960 --> 00:11:50,039 I think it's important to point out, you know, this is not just 123 00:11:50,679 --> 00:11:56,360 my thoughts on it, as you know, an isolated scientist, I'm reflecting 124 00:11:56,399 --> 00:12:01,559 a lot of what the major kind of scientific community, the interested in understanding 125 00:12:01,720 --> 00:12:09,639 of consciousness and mind brain relationship is expanding tremendously, and we have moved well 126 00:12:09,679 --> 00:12:15,600 beyond you know, all these things real or not. That might have been 127 00:12:15,600 --> 00:12:20,320 a discussion ten and fifteen years ago, but I think especially with the advent 128 00:12:20,639 --> 00:12:24,440 of kind of a modern notion of consilience. That's what I was hinting out 129 00:12:24,480 --> 00:12:28,559 a few minutes ago when I talked about how this information and this kind of 130 00:12:28,559 --> 00:12:37,600 science of consciousness is now a consilience synthesis of information coming from neuroscience and the 131 00:12:37,639 --> 00:12:43,120 hard problem consciousness where you realize that the brain cannot in and of itself create 132 00:12:43,200 --> 00:12:48,080 conscious awareness. This is something Wilder pin Field recognized, you know, renowned 133 00:12:48,120 --> 00:12:52,799 Canadian nursers and back in nineteen seventy five, and it's even more true now 134 00:12:52,159 --> 00:12:58,720 because the evidence continues to pile up showing us that consciousness is primary in the 135 00:12:58,840 --> 00:13:03,399 universe. That's where I think the iads kind of took their lead from the 136 00:13:03,480 --> 00:13:11,799 scientific community, because, of course that IAANDS group is fundamentally about the scientific 137 00:13:11,879 --> 00:13:18,200 investigation of near death experiences. And when you realize that near death experiences and 138 00:13:18,240 --> 00:13:24,919 what they're telling us about what happens when we die aligns perfectly with other avenues 139 00:13:24,960 --> 00:13:30,480 of inquiry. For example, Christopher Kerr, who is a Buffalo, New 140 00:13:30,559 --> 00:13:35,840 York hospice worker, wrote a beautiful book, Death Is But a Dream, 141 00:13:35,919 --> 00:13:39,879 and came out I think about three years ago, and in that book he 142 00:13:39,960 --> 00:13:43,720 deals only with hospice and the end of life issues. But what he finds 143 00:13:45,039 --> 00:13:50,679 is that eighty six percent of the patients in his study had very profound events 144 00:13:50,799 --> 00:13:56,480 that lined up perfectly with kind of the life reviews and the things that indie 145 00:13:56,639 --> 00:14:01,279 ors described as occurring in a near death experience. So when you find that 146 00:14:01,360 --> 00:14:07,200 the dying experience lines up perfectly with what you discover in near death experiences, 147 00:14:07,399 --> 00:14:11,879 you start to realize that indiees are truly an indicator of what happens when we 148 00:14:13,039 --> 00:14:16,879 actually die. Even though indie ears by and large come back to this world, 149 00:14:18,519 --> 00:14:22,320 so they didn't actually die, but The fact is when you start building 150 00:14:22,360 --> 00:14:28,879 these lines of inquiry together and realizing how much they align and support each other, 151 00:14:30,360 --> 00:14:33,279 that's where the real power comes into it. And a lot of that 152 00:14:33,440 --> 00:14:37,440 lines of that discussion, I would simply like to mention something I'm sure you're 153 00:14:37,600 --> 00:14:41,039 very aware of and want to make sure that your listeners are, and that 154 00:14:41,200 --> 00:14:48,320 is that contest run by Robert Bigelow back in twenty twenty one where he challenged 155 00:14:48,360 --> 00:14:52,799 the scientific community and said, well, what's the best scientific evidence for survival 156 00:14:52,840 --> 00:14:58,159 of conscious awareness beyond permanent bodily death? And when they put out that challenge, 157 00:14:58,200 --> 00:15:01,799 they receive more of the a thousand inquiries and people who wanted to participate. 158 00:15:03,480 --> 00:15:05,679 Then they made it clear that you had to show at least five years 159 00:15:05,720 --> 00:15:13,799 of rigorous scientific work experience investigating the afterlive question to submit an essay, and 160 00:15:13,840 --> 00:15:16,919 in that context they got two hundred and four essays. They were originally going 161 00:15:16,960 --> 00:15:22,120 to give out three monetary awards. The essays were of such high quality they 162 00:15:22,200 --> 00:15:26,000 ended up giving out twenty nine monetary awards. And I would urge any and 163 00:15:26,080 --> 00:15:31,480 all of your listeners who are not familiar with it to go to Bigelowinstitute Dot 164 00:15:31,600 --> 00:15:35,480 org and right now for free, all twenty nine winning essays are available, 165 00:15:37,240 --> 00:15:41,840 and you can just start with Jeffrey Mischlaw's First Place essay is a beautiful starting 166 00:15:41,840 --> 00:15:46,480 point. He does an excellent job, and again he takes many different lines 167 00:15:46,519 --> 00:15:50,039 of inquiry, and I think that's the important thing is we spent a lot 168 00:15:50,039 --> 00:15:54,240 of time where, you know, scientists were kind of debating, you know, 169 00:15:54,320 --> 00:15:58,639 one or two cases or issues. But it's only when you really look 170 00:15:58,679 --> 00:16:06,960 at the whole big package of all phenomena of non local consciousness, including reincarnation 171 00:16:07,200 --> 00:16:11,639 stories and including all the afterlife information, that you can start to really make 172 00:16:11,679 --> 00:16:17,080 sense of it. It's taken the whole big database of information from many different 173 00:16:17,120 --> 00:16:22,759 lines of inquiry, and I think that's where the scientific community has finally started 174 00:16:22,759 --> 00:16:26,600 to get ahead of this and realize, of course, the afterlife is real. 175 00:16:26,960 --> 00:16:30,639 Of course our souls come back again and again. To get this right. 176 00:16:30,759 --> 00:16:34,480 That much as crystal Clear from erland Er, Haroldson, as well as 177 00:16:34,519 --> 00:16:40,879 the word New Va, dops Ian Stevenson, Jim Tucker. They have more 178 00:16:40,919 --> 00:16:45,679 than twenty seven hundred cases they've investigated past life memories and children, of which 179 00:16:45,759 --> 00:16:51,840 seventeen hundred are solved. So all of this adds up to a tremendous amount 180 00:16:51,840 --> 00:16:57,799 of evidence, scientific evidence that these cases are real. Pay attention to them. 181 00:16:57,840 --> 00:17:03,360 There's something very real going on here. Does not defy modern science at 182 00:17:03,360 --> 00:17:10,680 all. In fact, in many ways, of quantum physics demands the reality 183 00:17:10,759 --> 00:17:14,720 of kind of a mental layer of the universe and its primacy over the physical. 184 00:17:15,119 --> 00:17:25,000 And that's why it's taken our kind of materialistically biased of scientific community more 185 00:17:25,000 --> 00:17:27,640 than a century to understand what quantum physics is trying to say to us. 186 00:17:27,799 --> 00:17:33,039 But given that the twenty twenty two Nobel Prize in Physics was given for entanglement, 187 00:17:33,319 --> 00:17:37,319 that is, spooky action at a distance, as proven by three scientific 188 00:17:37,359 --> 00:17:42,000 investigators who have been involved for the last five decades in proving that work, 189 00:17:42,519 --> 00:17:48,079 that's a huge step for the Nobel Committee to admit that, because it's really 190 00:17:48,119 --> 00:17:53,759 a major step towards admitting the primacy of mind and the unification of consciousness throughout 191 00:17:53,799 --> 00:18:00,000 the universe. And that's where I think this russion is becoming very very excited. 192 00:18:00,240 --> 00:18:03,920 Indeed, well, you know, I'm sure glad that you mentioned that 193 00:18:03,960 --> 00:18:11,000 Bigelow award. Our viewers had a chance to listen to doctor Jeffrey Long, 194 00:18:11,119 --> 00:18:15,880 who got the third place award, and he was describing his work on the 195 00:18:15,960 --> 00:18:25,119 show and same thing read Mischlaf read Jeffrey Long's They're fascinating in how many different 196 00:18:25,200 --> 00:18:30,880 lenses they bring to this problem of consciousness. So you get a thumbs up 197 00:18:30,920 --> 00:18:34,720 on that one. Evan for bringing that into the discussion, well good. 198 00:18:34,759 --> 00:18:38,359 And while it's I would simply like to also point out for those who insist 199 00:18:38,480 --> 00:18:45,279 on a very hardcore scientific interpretation, you can find those essays to Pim van 200 00:18:45,400 --> 00:18:52,319 Lobels, a second place winner, is a strong, very strong scientific paper 201 00:18:52,359 --> 00:18:59,160 supporting the reality of the afterlife. So was Bernardo Castrip's excellent Bigelow submission. 202 00:18:59,799 --> 00:19:04,200 He goes at it completely from the viewpoint of modern quantum physics and its interpretation 203 00:19:04,319 --> 00:19:10,240 without invoking any kind of parapsychological issues. And I also would highly recommend Julie 204 00:19:10,240 --> 00:19:19,519 Weischel's paper in the Bigelow submissions because hers is a very scientific assessment of psychic 205 00:19:19,640 --> 00:19:26,000 mediumship in a way that I think when you read it, you realize she's 206 00:19:26,039 --> 00:19:30,960 done a very good job scientifically improving the reality of some psychic meetings. Not 207 00:19:32,079 --> 00:19:36,039 all, of course, but certainly some are very good at what they do. 208 00:19:36,920 --> 00:19:41,519 And that's where I think the Bigelow essays are so important to this world. 209 00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:45,480 Yeah. Amen, on that, I'll go to that church. All 210 00:19:45,559 --> 00:19:52,480 right. Back to your book for a second, Living in a Mindful Universe. 211 00:19:52,640 --> 00:20:00,000 You talk about this concept of the heart of consciousness. Go a little 212 00:20:00,000 --> 00:20:04,000 little bit more into that and how that fits into what we've been talking about. 213 00:20:06,039 --> 00:20:10,839 Well, it fits in beautifully. I can tell you from you know, 214 00:20:10,920 --> 00:20:15,240 having lived through the experience in its aftermath and kind of seen how I 215 00:20:15,279 --> 00:20:21,279 as a former Harvard neurosurgeon as a neuroscientist and tried to explain my experience and 216 00:20:21,559 --> 00:20:26,319 come to a deeper understanding of it. Well, always I was very blessed 217 00:20:26,960 --> 00:20:32,359 because, as you know, back in November twenty eleven, I met my 218 00:20:32,480 --> 00:20:38,680 best half Karen Newell, who turned out to be a beautiful spiritual mentor certainly 219 00:20:38,960 --> 00:20:45,039 understanding deeply about the use of sound for deep trends and inal states of conscious 220 00:20:45,079 --> 00:20:52,240 awareness. And Karen was reminding me back in those early days when I would 221 00:20:52,240 --> 00:20:56,400 be so in my head, is this neurosurgeon talking about the experience that it 222 00:20:56,440 --> 00:21:00,759 was ultimately, ultimately about that binding force of love. And I'd say, 223 00:21:00,839 --> 00:21:03,000 of course, of course, but I tried to tell her, you can't 224 00:21:03,119 --> 00:21:08,079 really bring that love back here, the same love that you know Indie ears 225 00:21:08,119 --> 00:21:12,119 bathe in. But she was right, you can bring it back here, 226 00:21:12,119 --> 00:21:15,920 and I've seen it, you know, through meditation workshops, We've done people 227 00:21:15,960 --> 00:21:22,799 who've never had an inde but coming to a beautiful knowing of that binding force 228 00:21:22,880 --> 00:21:27,160 of love and it's infinite power to heal through personal experience of meditation, of 229 00:21:27,200 --> 00:21:33,160 centering, prayer, going within. So when we use that phrase, you 230 00:21:33,160 --> 00:21:37,480 know, as a subtitle a neus Urgeon's Journey into the Heart of Consciousness, 231 00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:42,319 what really pointing out is that it's truly ultimately all about love. And as 232 00:21:42,400 --> 00:21:48,920 much as the scientific community can harp on kind of the cognitive and intellectual framework 233 00:21:48,240 --> 00:21:53,240 of that mental layer that we've seen to share, ultimately, as any Indie 234 00:21:53,480 --> 00:21:59,720 or will tell you, it's about that binding force of love that ultimately determines 235 00:21:59,799 --> 00:22:03,599 kind of our understanding and our very brocking of the nature of our relationship with 236 00:22:03,640 --> 00:22:11,680 the universe. So it's just pointing out that you cannot ignore love as a 237 00:22:11,880 --> 00:22:17,559 primary factor that guides the evolution of these kind of concepts and of human understanding 238 00:22:17,599 --> 00:22:21,640 of it and where humans go with it is all about that love. And 239 00:22:21,680 --> 00:22:23,880 I often like to say it's the love of the creator for the creation, 240 00:22:25,400 --> 00:22:30,480 because we all become those co creators as we realize this deeper aspect of connection. 241 00:22:32,640 --> 00:22:37,480 And so to me it's a beautiful kind of reminder that as much as 242 00:22:37,480 --> 00:22:41,720 we try and bring this scientific answer of this nature of reality and the mind 243 00:22:41,720 --> 00:22:48,400 brain connection to some kind of mechanistic and demonstrable, hardcore truth of causality, 244 00:22:48,720 --> 00:22:56,279 it ultimately is all about love and never to forget that in this entire journey 245 00:22:56,319 --> 00:23:02,160 of discovery, because ultimately that's the part that we'll most impact and influence and 246 00:23:02,279 --> 00:23:07,839 benefit humankind, is that binding force of love and how all of us are 247 00:23:07,880 --> 00:23:11,279 in this together and we're here to take care of each other and take care 248 00:23:11,279 --> 00:23:15,839 of the least, the last, and the loss. This includes taking care 249 00:23:15,839 --> 00:23:21,599 of refugees and many of the other people that our modern polarized world doesn't necessarily 250 00:23:21,640 --> 00:23:26,440 see the value in helping. But I would say that from the perspective of 251 00:23:26,480 --> 00:23:33,880 this revolution and understanding about the nature consciousness from a scientific perspective, that power 252 00:23:33,000 --> 00:23:38,759 of love cannot be denied and is ultimately what we drive what we see is 253 00:23:38,799 --> 00:23:45,799 the benefits of this revolution. That strikes me that that orientation would be an 254 00:23:45,839 --> 00:23:52,359 important part of spiritual health. Talk a little bit more about how that has 255 00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:56,759 impacted your life and your view of the world. Well, I would say 256 00:23:56,799 --> 00:24:04,319 it's mainly through this rerect cognition that in my experience, you know, love 257 00:24:04,519 --> 00:24:08,160 was obviously very important. It was the thing that brought me back to this 258 00:24:08,240 --> 00:24:15,319 world. At the end of my inde, I saw the six faces that 259 00:24:15,519 --> 00:24:21,160 kind of served as important markers because for one thing, five of them were 260 00:24:21,160 --> 00:24:23,640 physically present in the ICU room in the last twenty four hours I was in 261 00:24:23,680 --> 00:24:27,559 coma, and there are many other family and friends who'd been there earlier in 262 00:24:27,559 --> 00:24:32,839 the week who I didn't remember. And this helped me to know that the 263 00:24:32,960 --> 00:24:37,119 vast majority of my coma journey and the spiritual experience had to happen between days 264 00:24:37,119 --> 00:24:41,839 one in four or days one in five of my seven day coma. And 265 00:24:41,839 --> 00:24:45,279 we explained the timing of all that in the book Proof of Heaven and going 266 00:24:45,319 --> 00:24:51,519 to a little further detail in Living in a Mind for Universe. But that 267 00:24:51,599 --> 00:24:57,680 really that recognition of that binding force of love and how important it was in 268 00:24:57,720 --> 00:25:03,039 my many passages, you know, from the Gateway Valley up into the core 269 00:25:03,079 --> 00:25:08,440 realm, as I described in Proof of Heaven, and it was always about 270 00:25:08,480 --> 00:25:12,519 love. And I came back to this world realizing that, in fact, 271 00:25:12,680 --> 00:25:18,359 just as the Armenian soldier Err was reported to say by Plato twenty four hundred 272 00:25:18,440 --> 00:25:22,079 years ago, you know, when you die, your life flashes before your 273 00:25:22,119 --> 00:25:26,480 eyes, and the only important thing is how much love you were able to 274 00:25:26,759 --> 00:25:30,319 hand out to your fellow beings. And I knew that much very clearly from 275 00:25:30,319 --> 00:25:34,480 my own NDE about the power of love and how it was so healing in 276 00:25:34,559 --> 00:25:38,559 this world, but I didn't realize just how important it was for healing all 277 00:25:38,720 --> 00:25:44,400 the kind of issues that we face that individually in terms of any kind of 278 00:25:44,440 --> 00:25:48,920 personal illness and challenges all the way up to humanity at large, and some 279 00:25:48,000 --> 00:25:55,480 of the challenges we face with stewarding this sub planet through some major challenges, 280 00:25:55,599 --> 00:25:59,640 many of which of our own making, like our addiction to fossil fuels and 281 00:26:00,200 --> 00:26:04,680 warming climate change, those kind of things. But it really is about expanding 282 00:26:04,680 --> 00:26:08,400 our view to this unification, of seeing how we're all in this together. 283 00:26:10,240 --> 00:26:12,599 I mean, from my perspective, that's one of the deepest messages of the 284 00:26:14,079 --> 00:26:19,240 near death experienced community is that we see how our mental space overlaps both those 285 00:26:19,279 --> 00:26:23,799 still living and those who passed over when we're in that kind of never never 286 00:26:23,880 --> 00:26:30,440 land of ndees. So it shows us that that mental space in many ways 287 00:26:30,559 --> 00:26:37,160 is eternal and reflects relationships that go beyond the death of the brain and body, 288 00:26:38,279 --> 00:26:42,480 proving in many ways the eternity of our souls and the ongoing nature of 289 00:26:42,480 --> 00:26:48,640 our soul and how important that is. But it's because of my NDE in 290 00:26:48,680 --> 00:26:51,960 the fifteen years since then of trying to make sense of it, that I've 291 00:26:52,000 --> 00:26:56,400 come to have a much clearer vision of this notion of love and oneness and 292 00:26:56,519 --> 00:27:03,359 taking care of each other as the ultimate driver of what leads to kind of 293 00:27:03,960 --> 00:27:10,759 the world of our dreams unfolding in our reality. But it must involve an 294 00:27:10,799 --> 00:27:15,240 expression of that love for others and the way we live our lives. So 295 00:27:15,279 --> 00:27:19,799 it's not just paying lip service to it, but living the choices and every 296 00:27:21,079 --> 00:27:23,960 breath we take, and every decision and choice we make of how we view 297 00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:30,279 ourselves and view others in our world, and our actions and our thoughts. 298 00:27:30,839 --> 00:27:37,440 That is where invoking this power of love and its healing forces is so important 299 00:27:37,480 --> 00:27:41,559 in any and all of our lives, and I think that's really where the 300 00:27:41,599 --> 00:27:45,680 world stands to benefit the most is realize that that deep lesson of love, 301 00:27:45,880 --> 00:27:52,000 kindness, compassion, mercy and acceptance and when necessary forgiveness bundled, especially with 302 00:27:52,079 --> 00:27:59,559 tremendous gratitude with which I think most inner death experiences certainly feel when they come 303 00:27:59,599 --> 00:28:03,799 back to this world having glimpsed that bigger view of it all, and then 304 00:28:03,880 --> 00:28:10,119 having the opportunity to continue living in this material body, knowing that ultimately that's 305 00:28:10,160 --> 00:28:14,559 not defining of who they are, but this is how we express it is 306 00:28:14,599 --> 00:28:18,480 what we do in living in these bodies, and that means so changing our 307 00:28:18,519 --> 00:28:23,640 lives to care more for others and the higher good. So have in your 308 00:28:23,759 --> 00:28:29,160 meditations, have you been able to go back and touch that loving space again? 309 00:28:30,720 --> 00:28:33,119 Well, yes, that's one of the most beautiful gifts. And of 310 00:28:33,119 --> 00:28:38,400 course I've also been able to witness other people who've never had an MDE similarly 311 00:28:38,519 --> 00:28:42,920 using meditation to get in touch with it. For those in your audience who 312 00:28:44,000 --> 00:28:47,759 might not be aware when I talk about meditation and centering prayer, for me 313 00:28:47,880 --> 00:28:53,279 personally, I use a form of differential frequency brain wave in trainment called Sacred 314 00:28:53,319 --> 00:29:00,920 Acoustics and full disclosure. Sacred Acoustics was co founded by my life partner, 315 00:29:00,200 --> 00:29:03,480 the co author of that book Living in a Mind for Universe, Karen Newell. 316 00:29:04,400 --> 00:29:08,680 But what I've found is that she was a beautiful spiritual resource going all 317 00:29:08,680 --> 00:29:14,880 the way back to our meeting in November twenty eleven, and then she and 318 00:29:14,920 --> 00:29:19,960 what her sound engineer and business partner Kevin Cossey have put together in the form 319 00:29:21,000 --> 00:29:25,559 of Sacred Acoustics, I have simply found to be a very powerful way of 320 00:29:25,599 --> 00:29:29,880 exploring across the veil and getting deep into a meditative state. And I was 321 00:29:29,920 --> 00:29:36,279 attracted to buying Oramal beats back in twenty eleven when I was first researching meditation 322 00:29:37,000 --> 00:29:41,920 because to me it sounded like a very powerful way to launch conscious awareness away 323 00:29:41,920 --> 00:29:48,839 from the here and now and the false sense of self that we normally experienced 324 00:29:48,079 --> 00:29:52,759 in our living in our world. But it's important to point out that that 325 00:29:52,920 --> 00:29:56,240 voice in your head is not your consciousness. That's not the magic I wish 326 00:29:56,319 --> 00:30:00,759 for n de Kartes. Instead of saying I think therefore I am, I 327 00:30:00,759 --> 00:30:04,359 wish he'd said I am aware of thoughts and therefore I am. And it's 328 00:30:04,400 --> 00:30:10,759 that awareness that's the mystery. The thoughts themselves, in many ways, are 329 00:30:10,799 --> 00:30:14,880 little more than a parlor trick. You know. I love how Michael Singer 330 00:30:14,880 --> 00:30:18,440 in his book The Untethered Soul, he says, that voice in your head, 331 00:30:18,519 --> 00:30:22,200 you know, all your running stream of thoughts and consciousness, is nothing 332 00:30:22,240 --> 00:30:27,920 more than an annoying roommate. To say that, again, that's great, 333 00:30:29,640 --> 00:30:33,319 it's nothing for Michael's Singer. I have to credit him fully. But in 334 00:30:33,359 --> 00:30:37,839 his book The Untethered Soul, he says, to look at that voice in 335 00:30:37,880 --> 00:30:44,200 your head as your annoying roommate. And I can't realize early on that the 336 00:30:44,240 --> 00:30:48,720 little ego mind, that little linguistic voice in my head was little more than 337 00:30:48,720 --> 00:30:53,160 a parlor trick. There's a much deeper aspect of wisdom within us. And 338 00:30:53,200 --> 00:30:59,519 it's almost tricky the way our language forces us to say within and go within, 339 00:31:00,160 --> 00:31:03,680 because actually going within the mental space is going out into the universe, 340 00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:10,440 once you realize is modern quantum physics is telling us that the physical universe does 341 00:31:10,440 --> 00:31:15,920 not exist except as an expression of the mental layer of the universe. And 342 00:31:15,839 --> 00:31:22,519 from my perspective, there's a beautiful essay that covers the shift of that thinking. 343 00:31:22,960 --> 00:31:26,640 It was by Richard conn Henry. He was head of physics at Johns 344 00:31:26,680 --> 00:31:32,559 Hopkins, very reputable institution, and he published a one page essay in the 345 00:31:32,599 --> 00:31:37,480 scientific journal Nature in two thousand and five entitled Mental Universe. And he makes 346 00:31:37,519 --> 00:31:41,000 it very clear in that essay from a modern scientific perspective, and this was 347 00:31:42,319 --> 00:31:48,039 seventeen years ago when it was published. He said, the universe is not 348 00:31:48,160 --> 00:31:52,480 physical, but what quantum physics and the modern experiments were showing us is it's 349 00:31:52,519 --> 00:31:56,759 fundamentally mental and spiritual. Enjoy is the last word of his essay. But 350 00:31:56,880 --> 00:32:02,480 he's simply saying we are spiritual beings in a spiritual universe. And it's similar 351 00:32:02,519 --> 00:32:07,000 to what Wen Heisenberg's, you know, one of the founding fathers of quantum 352 00:32:07,079 --> 00:32:12,519 physics. He said that the first gulp from the glass of natural sciences will 353 00:32:12,599 --> 00:32:15,240 lead you towards atheism, but at the bottom of the glass God is waiting 354 00:32:15,359 --> 00:32:21,559 for you. And that was simply his way of saying that modern science and 355 00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:27,839 consciousness has come to acknowledge the primacy of consciousness and that the brain serves only 356 00:32:27,839 --> 00:32:32,319 as a filter that allows projection of these events from that mental layer of the 357 00:32:32,400 --> 00:32:37,119 universe. But ultimately, we as human beings have access to that mental layer, 358 00:32:37,480 --> 00:32:42,799 and that's where a lot of this newfound power of healing and coming into 359 00:32:42,799 --> 00:32:49,960 wholeness comes from. So yes, it leads right there that if our consciousness 360 00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:57,759 is primus, then healing that naturally could result because we just reframe what the 361 00:32:57,799 --> 00:33:02,319 physical world is. Talk more about that, because you've read and witnessed some 362 00:33:02,680 --> 00:33:09,519 really remarkable healings as a result of NDEs or just shifts and consciousness. Well, 363 00:33:09,559 --> 00:33:15,519 I'll say it's important to understand kind of an expansion of my own story. 364 00:33:15,599 --> 00:33:20,720 You know. I put out my story as it occurred to me as 365 00:33:20,759 --> 00:33:25,160 a neurosurgeon in the book Proof of Having. But luckily there were other physicians 366 00:33:25,160 --> 00:33:29,119 interested in my case, and three of them who were not involved in my 367 00:33:29,200 --> 00:33:34,880 care but fascinated by my recovery, ended up spending the better part of two 368 00:33:34,960 --> 00:33:38,160 years going through more than six hundred pages of my medical records, and they 369 00:33:38,160 --> 00:33:43,640 wrote a medical case report that was published in a peer review journal. It 370 00:33:43,680 --> 00:33:47,000 came out in Journal of Nervous and Mental Diseases September twenty eighteen by doctor Laurie 371 00:33:49,000 --> 00:33:52,480 Sirbi Kana, Lauren Moore, and Bruce Grayson. But the important thing, 372 00:33:52,880 --> 00:33:59,640 they came to two major conclusions that kind of went far above and beyond what 373 00:33:59,720 --> 00:34:02,079 I dated in the book Proof of Heaven. But one thing, they made 374 00:34:02,119 --> 00:34:07,119 it crystal clear that given the Glasgow coma scale, the CT and MRI scans, 375 00:34:07,239 --> 00:34:12,599 the lab values, et cetera, my brain was in absolutely no condition 376 00:34:12,719 --> 00:34:16,480 to harbor any kind of dream or hallucination, much less the most profound, 377 00:34:16,920 --> 00:34:22,400 detailed, memorable, and transformational set of events I've ever experienced in my life. 378 00:34:23,360 --> 00:34:30,599 So they came through and confirmed and validated and strengthened that argument from Proof 379 00:34:30,599 --> 00:34:34,920 of Heaven that I should have had no experience at all. And then secondly 380 00:34:36,360 --> 00:34:40,400 they made it crystal clear, and this had to do with a challenge from 381 00:34:40,440 --> 00:34:44,840 the peer review editors. They said, wait a minute, somebody spending a 382 00:34:44,880 --> 00:34:49,760 week in coma from GRAM negative bacteria as deep as this guy was and then 383 00:34:49,800 --> 00:34:53,440 having a full recovery is unprecedented in the medical literature. They called the case 384 00:34:53,639 --> 00:34:58,079 absurd, and they said, how do you explain it? They challenged the 385 00:34:58,119 --> 00:35:00,400 three authors of the paper, and the three authors said, well, it's 386 00:35:00,400 --> 00:35:06,360 because he had a near death experience, that this miraculous healing was enabled, 387 00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:08,920 and so the peer of you editors said, okay, they knew of other 388 00:35:09,119 --> 00:35:15,760 similar cases of near death experiences with extraordinary healing that goes beyond any medical explanation, 389 00:35:16,400 --> 00:35:22,079 like Anita more Johnny healing from her stage four lymphoma and deep coma doctor 390 00:35:22,119 --> 00:35:30,320 Mary Neil who had an over thirty minute warm water drowning kayaking in Chile back 391 00:35:30,320 --> 00:35:34,559 in the late nineteen nineties. Anyone in medicine, you hear of those stories 392 00:35:34,559 --> 00:35:37,840 in mind and you realize those people don't survive, and yet they come through 393 00:35:37,880 --> 00:35:44,119 with a complete recovery. That is in the setting of a spiritual journey and 394 00:35:44,119 --> 00:35:47,559 a deep near death experience. And that is what is informing us in the 395 00:35:47,599 --> 00:35:53,119 modern scientific community of the power of mind over matter and that in many ways 396 00:35:53,119 --> 00:35:58,880 we are spiritual beings in a spiritual universe and we do have free will. 397 00:35:58,960 --> 00:36:02,079 In fact, in our book Living to Mind for Universe, we make a 398 00:36:02,199 --> 00:36:08,519 very strong case, a multidisciplinary case for the primacy of consciousness through neuroscience, 399 00:36:08,519 --> 00:36:15,239 philosophy of mind, a pair of psychology, non local consciousness, and quantum 400 00:36:15,280 --> 00:36:21,599 physics, and make that very strong argument of consilience. And this is where 401 00:36:22,639 --> 00:36:27,880 I think that this whole world is waking up to that much bigger truth is 402 00:36:27,880 --> 00:36:32,000 because of the capacity of these kind of arguments to really support this. But 403 00:36:32,840 --> 00:36:38,239 the fact that the peer of viewers of that medical journal agreed, oh well, 404 00:36:38,280 --> 00:36:43,800 now we have an explanation for this miraculous healing. It's because of the 405 00:36:43,920 --> 00:36:49,159 NDE and that shows they're on the right pathway for understanding the power of mind 406 00:36:49,159 --> 00:36:52,480 over matter. I mean, medical science has admitted this for more than six 407 00:36:52,599 --> 00:37:01,920 or seven decades now by using using uh blocking blocking on it, hold on, 408 00:37:02,840 --> 00:37:09,000 pluce Ebo effect plus e bo, et cetera. But placebo effect has 409 00:37:09,039 --> 00:37:14,159 been the gold standard for assessing any new medical treatment in many ways, new 410 00:37:14,639 --> 00:37:19,199 surgical procedures. By doing a sham procede, you can do a placebo controlled 411 00:37:19,320 --> 00:37:24,400 arm And that really it reflects something very deep that many people don't realize. 412 00:37:24,800 --> 00:37:30,119 Uh. That is just the medical professions acknowledgement that our beliefs, thoughts, 413 00:37:30,119 --> 00:37:35,960 and attitudes can actually play a tremendous role in our healing. And that is 414 00:37:36,199 --> 00:37:40,599 kind of the starting point for where we really jump off into spontaneous remission. 415 00:37:40,920 --> 00:37:45,719 For example, if you go to noetic dot org. That institutent Nedic Science's 416 00:37:45,800 --> 00:37:50,039 website. Put in the search term spontaneous remission, you'll find a book they 417 00:37:50,119 --> 00:37:52,280 publish. It's out of print now you can download the whole thing for free 418 00:37:52,320 --> 00:37:59,000 and legally from them. But their Helene wabe at Ions is now updating that 419 00:37:59,199 --> 00:38:02,880 entire database. But the database currently there from the mid nineties had more than 420 00:38:02,960 --> 00:38:10,239 thirty five hundred cases of people who healed advanced cancer, advanced infections, even 421 00:38:10,280 --> 00:38:16,719 congenital deformities healed them through kind of mind over matter and things beyond any medical 422 00:38:16,760 --> 00:38:22,400 intervention. That's the important thing. That we have tremendous power to bring a 423 00:38:22,400 --> 00:38:27,440 lot of healing to ourselves. And as I've said, that has so much 424 00:38:27,519 --> 00:38:30,920 to do with just that primacy of love and acknowledgement of a loving connection that 425 00:38:30,960 --> 00:38:36,360 the universe has with us. And that's what allows us to start to manifest 426 00:38:37,159 --> 00:38:43,960 this kind of well being, wholeness and healing in our own lives. Lovely 427 00:38:44,119 --> 00:38:47,679 yes. And just this week I had a chance to speak with a near 428 00:38:47,719 --> 00:38:55,880 death experiencer who had her eyesight restored to twenty fifteen after her experience, and 429 00:38:57,039 --> 00:39:00,679 I was like, no reason for it other than she went through it and 430 00:39:00,719 --> 00:39:06,679 then woke up and was able to toss their glasses. It was you know, 431 00:39:07,000 --> 00:39:12,800 it just goes on and on about how that can change our lives. 432 00:39:13,559 --> 00:39:17,079 Well, I think it's an important point that any kind of physical, mental, 433 00:39:17,239 --> 00:39:23,480 or emotional wholeness and healing ultimately depends on spiritual wholeness and healing. And 434 00:39:23,519 --> 00:39:28,360 when I use the word spiritual, it doesn't have to be religious at all, 435 00:39:28,400 --> 00:39:31,960 even though people can use religion and centering prayer to get in very deep 436 00:39:32,159 --> 00:39:38,840 spiritual connection. But for me, spirituality just implies one a sense of deep 437 00:39:38,880 --> 00:39:43,679 connection through this kind of mental air of the universe, that we're all in 438 00:39:43,719 --> 00:39:46,880 this together, and the other is a sense of shared meaning and a sense 439 00:39:46,960 --> 00:39:53,079 of shared purpose that I think becomes evident, especially from kind of the bigger 440 00:39:53,159 --> 00:40:00,320 view of this revolution and understanding consciousness and the nature of reality, moving away 441 00:40:00,719 --> 00:40:05,920 from the false sense of separation that is so inherent in materialist scientific thought, 442 00:40:06,239 --> 00:40:13,239 but more towards a quantum informed, uniform and universe where we're truly all connected 443 00:40:13,320 --> 00:40:19,400 in deep and powerful ways, and that our thoughts and choices reflect the importance 444 00:40:19,559 --> 00:40:23,719 that we might place in that sense of connectedness. So it's for all of 445 00:40:23,800 --> 00:40:30,159 us to shift away from that false sense of separation that comes from materialism. 446 00:40:30,559 --> 00:40:37,679 So shifting gears only sort of kind of is. I actually almost called you 447 00:40:37,719 --> 00:40:45,320 about a week ago, just personally to say that now that I've been on 448 00:40:45,440 --> 00:40:53,719 this podcast venue, I have also been I think I think about fifty interviews 449 00:40:53,800 --> 00:41:00,599 plus or minus on different podcasts and radio and television shows around the country, 450 00:41:01,679 --> 00:41:07,079 and I know you've been on hundreds of them, so you're way ahead of 451 00:41:07,119 --> 00:41:15,280 me on this one. But what happened was it about a week ago I 452 00:41:15,519 --> 00:41:24,559 had I told my story and it was just one time too many, And 453 00:41:24,880 --> 00:41:32,840 it's, as you know, it's a very emotional, heartfelt experience to have 454 00:41:34,360 --> 00:41:39,039 a near death or a shared death experience, and you know, I'm kind 455 00:41:39,039 --> 00:41:44,800 of in this spot now where I'm feeling like I need to protect my heart. 456 00:41:45,880 --> 00:41:50,159 Did you ever get to that spot where you like, told it too 457 00:41:50,199 --> 00:41:52,920 many times and you're like, I, I just can't go there one more 458 00:41:52,960 --> 00:42:00,119 time. Well, I don't think I've ever tired of sharing the story, 459 00:42:00,679 --> 00:42:05,960 especially as I've come to realize that it helps people in many ways, and 460 00:42:06,000 --> 00:42:10,679 I often cannot predict how it's going to help a specific person. But I 461 00:42:10,719 --> 00:42:15,840 think I sense a bit of what you're talking about, mainly because you know, 462 00:42:15,880 --> 00:42:21,639 occasionally of people kind of attack you for sharing this kind of thing, 463 00:42:21,800 --> 00:42:27,760 and to me, those attacks seem to be you know, they can take 464 00:42:27,800 --> 00:42:32,320 their toll, and so sometimes you feel like kind of holding your cards a 465 00:42:32,360 --> 00:42:37,480 little closer to your chest. I must agree with that, but I don't 466 00:42:37,480 --> 00:42:40,960 think I've ever tired of sharing my story. And what I find is kind 467 00:42:40,960 --> 00:42:45,079 of my sense of gratitude. You know, I have tremendous gratitude for every 468 00:42:45,280 --> 00:42:51,800 breath because I came back to this world, and you know, I should 469 00:42:52,079 --> 00:42:55,159 have gratitude for every breath before, but I guess I needed this something, 470 00:42:55,199 --> 00:43:00,400 this waking up. But the good news is that gratitude is kind of a 471 00:43:00,440 --> 00:43:07,679 basic fundamental mode of being, has been my natural ambient state ever since coming 472 00:43:07,719 --> 00:43:14,599 back from the NDE, and that gratitude can easily be expanded to a point 473 00:43:14,639 --> 00:43:19,679 where it acknowledges that if my story helps you know one person out there in 474 00:43:19,679 --> 00:43:23,360 a given telling, it doesn't matter if there are others that hear that telling 475 00:43:23,400 --> 00:43:28,880 that might try and attack me or bring me down. It's the benefit of 476 00:43:29,119 --> 00:43:34,440 one the one that benefits that I take away, you know, with gratitude 477 00:43:34,480 --> 00:43:37,880 in my heart as the reason I keep doing this. And so it's really 478 00:43:37,880 --> 00:43:43,639 that gratitude and that notion of the higher good that in many ways I think 479 00:43:44,440 --> 00:43:47,559 helps helps me to kind of live through the day to day challenges that I 480 00:43:47,599 --> 00:43:52,559 think are part of what you're talking about that sometimes you know, these are 481 00:43:52,719 --> 00:43:59,480 deep, emotional, very personal sharings, and you know, our culture at 482 00:43:59,639 --> 00:44:04,920 large arge is not necessarily ready for this awakening. But the good news is 483 00:44:05,000 --> 00:44:08,639 what I've seen in fifteen years is a tremendous kind of increase. Now you 484 00:44:08,679 --> 00:44:12,840 can argue, you know, I have kind of a prejudice view because I 485 00:44:12,880 --> 00:44:15,599 live this stuff all the time. It's what I talk about with people, 486 00:44:15,960 --> 00:44:17,840 believe it or not. This is what Karen and I talk about all times, 487 00:44:17,920 --> 00:44:22,800 you know. But you know it's a deep and passionate interest of mine. 488 00:44:23,719 --> 00:44:27,840 But I also realize how it can help people. How the story, 489 00:44:28,159 --> 00:44:32,239 you know, my story, sharing the wisdom from hundreds of other indie accounts, 490 00:44:32,280 --> 00:44:37,039 which you know, I applaud you're doing that, getting you know, 491 00:44:37,079 --> 00:44:39,719 many of these stories out to the world. As ken Ring pointed out, 492 00:44:39,760 --> 00:44:45,039 you know, thirty plus years ago, the indie ear is not the only 493 00:44:45,119 --> 00:44:52,280 one to benefit from indie accounts. The world at large benefits from these accounts, 494 00:44:52,320 --> 00:44:57,679 and he showed how the world at large can improve as people of discuss 495 00:44:57,840 --> 00:45:02,199 and share and and more and more news stories come out. Because, as 496 00:45:02,199 --> 00:45:07,639 you're aware, the natural tendency in our culture is when this happens to you, 497 00:45:07,639 --> 00:45:12,559 you're very concerned about sharing it, you know, because our culture has 498 00:45:12,639 --> 00:45:17,079 kind of a present of prejudice and an assumption that you're crazy, that this 499 00:45:17,599 --> 00:45:20,679 is not the way the world works. You know, when your die, 500 00:45:20,679 --> 00:45:23,800 you're supposed to come to a complete end, no more awareness at all. 501 00:45:23,960 --> 00:45:28,880 So what the world are all these stories of people staying aware and in fact 502 00:45:28,920 --> 00:45:32,400 having enhanced awareness when they leave the brain and body at the time of bodily 503 00:45:32,519 --> 00:45:37,760 death. Well, guess what, that's just the nature reality. Let's get 504 00:45:37,840 --> 00:45:42,679 used to it. It's actually good news for all of us to realize that 505 00:45:42,760 --> 00:45:45,480 we have a much bigger purpose here than one that can be solved and just 506 00:45:45,599 --> 00:45:51,840 a birth to death incarnation in one physical body. And that's where I think. 507 00:45:51,920 --> 00:45:55,039 You know, religions have had five thousand years plus to try and get 508 00:45:55,039 --> 00:45:59,119 the golden rule, you know, treat others as you would like to be 509 00:45:59,199 --> 00:46:04,199 treated out into our society and to our culture, and in many ways, 510 00:46:04,239 --> 00:46:08,679 the near death experience is the golden rule written into the fabric of the universe. 511 00:46:08,719 --> 00:46:13,800 When you look at life reviews, which are described anywhere from twenty five 512 00:46:13,880 --> 00:46:19,039 to fifty percent of NDE series depending on who's doing the work. But life 513 00:46:19,039 --> 00:46:22,920 reviews are quite common, and one of the most interesting thing about life reviews 514 00:46:22,920 --> 00:46:29,519 is that forty five percent of people who have them feel that like they're in 515 00:46:29,559 --> 00:46:34,280 actual reliving of events, not just remembering, but that you're going back through 516 00:46:34,320 --> 00:46:37,119 it again, which shows you the power of those kind of spiritual realms to 517 00:46:37,239 --> 00:46:43,519 kind of guide our evolution and spirits. And the other important thing is about 518 00:46:43,559 --> 00:46:52,960 seventy five percent of people who have life review describe it as experiencing the events 519 00:46:53,079 --> 00:46:58,800 through the emotional perspective of those around them, So in other words, the 520 00:46:58,840 --> 00:47:02,920 boundaries of self are false. You experience these things kind of as the dream 521 00:47:04,039 --> 00:47:08,000 of the one mind. And those figures I get from a recent article by 522 00:47:08,000 --> 00:47:13,800 Bruce Grayson that was published just in the last few months, so they're very 523 00:47:13,840 --> 00:47:17,480 current figures from someone who knows what he's talking about. Bruce Grayson has studied 524 00:47:17,519 --> 00:47:22,039 indies for more than forty five years. Now I can highly recommend his book 525 00:47:22,119 --> 00:47:30,920 After which is basically his monoir about in the Ease as a skeptical scientific investigator, 526 00:47:30,639 --> 00:47:34,840 and it comes through that, you know, a true open minded skeptic, 527 00:47:35,239 --> 00:47:39,480 it can be amazed by this information. Don't be misled by the people 528 00:47:39,480 --> 00:47:45,280 out there in the media who call themselves skeptics, who actually are nothing of 529 00:47:45,320 --> 00:47:47,880 that. They've already made up their mind. They don't care about the scientific 530 00:47:47,960 --> 00:47:52,679 evidence. They're not about to study it. They just know that based on 531 00:47:52,880 --> 00:47:59,800 modern scientific materialism, that these stories are impossible. Well, modern scientific material 532 00:47:59,880 --> 00:48:02,719 is in many ways was just debunked with the ordering of the twenty twenty two 533 00:48:04,000 --> 00:48:09,039 Nobel Prize in Physics for entanglement. And there are many quantum physics out there 534 00:48:09,079 --> 00:48:13,880 who will deny that, but they just don't know enough about consciousness in the 535 00:48:13,920 --> 00:48:20,679 brain. So you touched on the concept of oneness and this this binding force 536 00:48:21,079 --> 00:48:27,320 of universal love. Expand on that just a little bit, because I think 537 00:48:27,360 --> 00:48:31,239 that's at the center of everything that we do here. Well, I would 538 00:48:31,280 --> 00:48:36,599 say in my work as a neuroscientist understanding the mind brain connection. In the 539 00:48:36,639 --> 00:48:43,800 last fifteen years since my own kind of mind opening experience. That's what has 540 00:48:43,920 --> 00:48:49,360 come to be very clear in the scientific study. Now you can look at 541 00:48:49,480 --> 00:48:53,320 quantum physics, go back one hundred years, and you had people like Max 542 00:48:53,360 --> 00:49:02,280 Planck, We're in Heisenberg, Rowin, Schroedinger, Pustual, Jordan and others 543 00:49:02,639 --> 00:49:08,559 quantum physicists saying we cannot get behind consciousness. It seems to be something fundamental 544 00:49:08,599 --> 00:49:15,239 in the universe. And they were simply saying what came to mind in looking 545 00:49:15,280 --> 00:49:19,679 at the very early experiments in quantum physics. Well, all of that story 546 00:49:19,760 --> 00:49:23,760 evolved tremendously. In fact, we discussed the whole history of that story and 547 00:49:23,800 --> 00:49:28,719 how it's unfolded in Living in a Mind for Universe. So for anybody who 548 00:49:28,760 --> 00:49:32,679 wants to catch up on the real nuts and bolts and details of how quantum 549 00:49:32,760 --> 00:49:37,760 physics over the last century has come to increasingly kind of define the mind brain 550 00:49:37,840 --> 00:49:44,280 connection and inform us about the nature of consciousness and how it's really unified in 551 00:49:44,320 --> 00:49:49,280 the form of one mind, can see how all of this has unfolded. 552 00:49:51,119 --> 00:49:59,360 The story goes through Einstein's objections in nineteen thirty five to entanglement, to spooky 553 00:49:59,360 --> 00:50:01,320 action and a day distance as he called it. It goes to John Bell, 554 00:50:01,440 --> 00:50:07,960 the brilliant Irish physicist elaboration in nineteen sixty four that there was a way 555 00:50:07,000 --> 00:50:13,079 to experimentally assess whether Einstein was right, and there were some form of hidden 556 00:50:13,159 --> 00:50:16,159 variables in these particles that allowed them to know how they were supposed to behave 557 00:50:16,599 --> 00:50:21,199 or whether it was true spooky action at a distance, where in fact, 558 00:50:21,440 --> 00:50:28,239 local realism the concept that all of physics involves particles interacting locally, and realism 559 00:50:28,320 --> 00:50:32,880 is the notion that the world observed out there exists before it's observed. Well, 560 00:50:34,039 --> 00:50:37,199 one of those things has got to be false if ententegrament is true, 561 00:50:37,239 --> 00:50:44,039 and that is where the modern scientific world has gotten is to acknowledge basically the 562 00:50:44,079 --> 00:50:49,920 reality of objective idealists. Idealism which is the oneness of mind and consciousness, 563 00:50:50,000 --> 00:50:55,199 and it views our brains as being filters that reduce that primordia one mind into 564 00:50:55,239 --> 00:51:00,119 the apparent individual cells. But of course when we die, those in the 565 00:51:00,159 --> 00:51:05,880 boundaries of individual selves begin to dissolve. Again is we become one with that 566 00:51:06,079 --> 00:51:08,920 mind, and that gives where we get mental experience with those still alive in 567 00:51:08,960 --> 00:51:13,719 the world, mental experience with those who have already departed the mental world because 568 00:51:14,159 --> 00:51:17,159 one of the most common features of NDEs and this goes back thousands of years 569 00:51:17,199 --> 00:51:22,280 across all cultures. Like if you read Gregory Shushan, who's written about ancient 570 00:51:22,280 --> 00:51:28,199 cultures and near death experiences, you find that of seeing a loved one, 571 00:51:28,199 --> 00:51:34,039 a departed loved one is the most common of finding across all cultures. And 572 00:51:34,119 --> 00:51:38,639 it's because our loved ones still exists, and there's often information gain that goes 573 00:51:38,719 --> 00:51:43,760 far beyond any kind of wishful thinking, et cetera. So those stories have 574 00:51:43,800 --> 00:51:47,239 a tremendous basis in reality. But it's this oneness of mind that's such an 575 00:51:47,239 --> 00:51:53,599 important concept. And in fact, if you read Pim van Lamo's beautiful Bigelow 576 00:51:53,719 --> 00:51:57,800 essay, he won second place, and at the very end of it, 577 00:51:57,840 --> 00:52:00,679 he's making the scientific case for how you explain all this, and he is 578 00:52:00,800 --> 00:52:07,840 exactly going into the one mind hypothesis, what we call the primordial mind hypothesis 579 00:52:07,840 --> 00:52:12,599 in our books Living in a Mind for Universe. And he recommends four sources 580 00:52:12,599 --> 00:52:16,000 for that one mind thinking that he says are the best scientific sources. One 581 00:52:16,159 --> 00:52:21,039 is Larry Dasti's excellent book called One Mind, which I think came out in 582 00:52:21,079 --> 00:52:27,360 twenty eleven. The other is Steve Taylor's more recent book Spiritual Science. His 583 00:52:27,519 --> 00:52:32,559 third source is Bernardo Castrip's paper I think it's Journal of Consciousness Studies in twenty 584 00:52:32,599 --> 00:52:37,320 eighteen. It's called the Universe in Consciousness. And the fourth resource that Pim 585 00:52:37,400 --> 00:52:42,039 vent Level mentions is our book Living in a Mind for Universe. But I 586 00:52:42,079 --> 00:52:47,920 would also certainly recommend his book, A Consciousness Beyond Life, Pim van Lovel's 587 00:52:47,920 --> 00:52:52,320 book, because I think that is one of the best jobs of taking consciousness 588 00:52:52,360 --> 00:52:58,559 as it's currently understood in a modern scientific setting and really elaborating the importance of 589 00:52:58,639 --> 00:53:02,840 quantum physics and the importance of understanding how this is where all the evidence leads. 590 00:53:04,559 --> 00:53:07,920 Let's go there. But it's all for those five of those resources that 591 00:53:08,000 --> 00:53:13,760 I just mentioned are all about the one mind hypothesis and that the brain is 592 00:53:13,800 --> 00:53:16,840 simply a filter. That filter theory has been around for more than a century, 593 00:53:17,079 --> 00:53:21,440 but it kind of went to sleep for a while as the materialists have 594 00:53:21,519 --> 00:53:24,440 their heyday in the twentieth century trying to prove the brain creates consciousness. But 595 00:53:24,519 --> 00:53:29,880 we've now gotten to a point where all the evidence is pointing to the primacy 596 00:53:29,880 --> 00:53:34,159 of mind, that the brain only is a filter which completely opens the door 597 00:53:34,199 --> 00:53:40,639 to the reality not only the afterlife, but of reincarnation. Wonderful. We 598 00:53:40,679 --> 00:53:45,719 are bumping up against a time limit here, so I have two questions left 599 00:53:45,760 --> 00:53:52,559 for you. This next one is pretty easy. If people are interested in 600 00:53:52,599 --> 00:53:54,320 you and what you're having to say, how do they get a hold of 601 00:53:54,360 --> 00:53:59,880 you? How do they find out about Sacred Acoustics give us a commercial? 602 00:54:00,360 --> 00:54:05,760 Absolutely well, definitely. The best way to keep up with me is follow 603 00:54:05,880 --> 00:54:14,000 ebeneb in Alexander dot com. I would especially recommend there's an extensive recommended reading 604 00:54:14,039 --> 00:54:19,280 list there with more than one hundred recommended books, chapters, papers. Many 605 00:54:19,320 --> 00:54:24,440 of the papers links are hot to the actual paper themselves, and it's all 606 00:54:24,480 --> 00:54:29,079 categorized to make it easy to kind of go through that list, So recommended 607 00:54:29,119 --> 00:54:32,880 reading. Also, the faq page very important for people who want to know 608 00:54:32,960 --> 00:54:37,400 more about kind of my history, my belief on certain deep topics. So 609 00:54:37,480 --> 00:54:43,760 don't miss the FAQs and don't miss the blog postings which go into a lot 610 00:54:43,800 --> 00:54:46,599 of detail of a lot of this. Now. In addition, Sacred Acoustics 611 00:54:46,639 --> 00:54:52,039 dot com is a beautiful resource to inform you about differential frequency brain WAVEN trainment. 612 00:54:52,119 --> 00:54:55,840 That's what I use daily, sacred acoustics. I've been meditating an hour 613 00:54:55,880 --> 00:55:00,360 to a day for the last eleven plus years and I wouldn't trade it for 614 00:55:00,440 --> 00:55:06,880 anything. Very powerful and helpful in coming to a deeper understanding of the nature 615 00:55:06,880 --> 00:55:12,880 of reality. And also I would highly recommend a site that this is largely 616 00:55:13,079 --> 00:55:16,960 Karen's brilliance. During the pandemic, we had to cancel a lot of our 617 00:55:16,960 --> 00:55:22,159 meetings with people and a lot of those world experts and consciousness other experiencers, 618 00:55:22,159 --> 00:55:30,440 et cetera, and so we would interview those people and those interemis are all 619 00:55:30,480 --> 00:55:37,199 available at United in Hope and Healing dot com. That's one way to access 620 00:55:37,199 --> 00:55:43,199 it. There are other resources available there too, but I can highly recommend 621 00:55:43,199 --> 00:55:47,480 those free interviews. That whole series will bring anyone and everyone up to speed 622 00:55:47,559 --> 00:55:55,519 on this kind of discussion. Wonderful And for the people listening, what's the 623 00:55:55,559 --> 00:56:00,880 one thing they can do right now to improve their lives? And what would 624 00:56:00,920 --> 00:56:07,320 you recommend going within spending you know, twenty minutes, forty minutes, whatever 625 00:56:07,360 --> 00:56:10,760 time you have a day, even if it's late at night or early in 626 00:56:10,760 --> 00:56:14,719 the morning, when you might be able to brack at the time, but 627 00:56:14,960 --> 00:56:19,480 go within, centering, prayer, meditation. If you need a tool to 628 00:56:19,519 --> 00:56:22,159 help you separate from that little voice in your head, the little ego mind 629 00:56:22,199 --> 00:56:27,360 or monkey mind, I can recommend sacred acoustics. It's worked very well for 630 00:56:27,559 --> 00:56:30,679 me, and I know it's worked for many other people. You can see 631 00:56:30,719 --> 00:56:37,039 the testimonials page on sacred acoustics dot com. There's also a pilot study from 632 00:56:37,079 --> 00:56:42,079 a busy Manhattan psychiatric practice doctor Anna Usam. It came out the peer review 633 00:56:42,400 --> 00:56:45,800 Journal of Nervous Mental Disease February of twenty twenty, supporting the use of sacred 634 00:56:45,840 --> 00:56:52,760 acoustics against anxiety, a very powerful result of twenty six percent reduction in symptoms 635 00:56:52,800 --> 00:56:59,360 over two weeks versus only seven percent reduction in two weeks with a psycho talk 636 00:56:59,440 --> 00:57:05,840 therapy alone and not with the sacred acoustic sounds. So anyway, it's meditation. 637 00:57:06,039 --> 00:57:08,280 Going within is one of the greatest gifts we have for living our lives 638 00:57:08,280 --> 00:57:14,199 in this world, and it's what I highly recommend to people to stay sane 639 00:57:14,280 --> 00:57:19,320 in our modern world and then to bring the world of your dreams into reality. 640 00:57:20,559 --> 00:57:22,800 I love that, and I love you Evan, this has been a 641 00:57:22,920 --> 00:57:28,840 terrific conversation. Thank you for taking the time to be on the Afterlife Files. 642 00:57:29,639 --> 00:57:31,679 Well I love you too, Scott, and thanks for doing what you're 643 00:57:31,760 --> 00:57:37,239 doing. Getting this out to the world is very important to help wake people 644 00:57:37,320 --> 00:57:40,280 up to their own power of healing and wholeness. So thanks for everything you 645 00:57:40,320 --> 00:57:45,119 do, and for those of you that are listening, stick around because there's 646 00:57:45,199 --> 00:57:50,280 a couple of things that Evan said today that I think could use a little 647 00:57:50,320 --> 00:57:57,239 expansion and at least a different lens for me. So stick around and thank 648 00:57:57,280 --> 00:58:01,119 you once again Evan for being on the Afterlife File. Have a good day 649 00:58:01,480 --> 00:58:15,559 you too, Thanks a lot, Bye bye. I warned you that this 650 00:58:15,639 --> 00:58:21,480 interview would vacillate between head and heart, given that there are several insights that 651 00:58:21,519 --> 00:58:24,440 I gained. Just to be clear, these are my viewpoints, but that's 652 00:58:24,480 --> 00:58:30,360 where you watch the Afterlife Files to gain perspective by using more than one lens 653 00:58:30,400 --> 00:58:37,840 with which to view this rich information. First, I'm touched by his definition 654 00:58:37,960 --> 00:58:43,639 of love as the love of the creator for the creation. It explains why 655 00:58:43,719 --> 00:58:50,599 love is the organizing principle of the universe, and what's important is how much 656 00:58:50,719 --> 00:58:54,719 love you are able to hand out to your fellow human beings. Second, 657 00:58:55,199 --> 00:59:00,159 I appreciate his definition of the voice in your head as an annoying roommate. 658 00:59:00,519 --> 00:59:07,239 Isn't that great? We are so much more than that. Third, I 659 00:59:07,280 --> 00:59:10,840 felt Eban was at his best when he stated, and I quote, it's 660 00:59:10,880 --> 00:59:15,880 all about love. We're all in this together. We're here to take care 661 00:59:15,920 --> 00:59:22,119 of each other. Love will drive the benefits of this revolution end quote. 662 00:59:22,880 --> 00:59:28,960 The revolution is how we think of ourselves and the primacy of consciousness. Here's 663 00:59:29,000 --> 00:59:35,000 another great quote. We cannot get behind consciousness. He sounds just like our 664 00:59:35,039 --> 00:59:38,440 interview with Stephen Schwartz. So after you're done watching this, go watch that 665 00:59:38,480 --> 00:59:45,719 one. I think you'll get a great perspective. Number four, he said 666 00:59:45,800 --> 00:59:52,960 that the near death experience is the golden rule written in the universe. He's 667 00:59:52,039 --> 00:59:58,079 referring to the concept that the universe is reactive. What you put out is 668 00:59:58,119 --> 01:00:02,280 what you'll receive. So pay attention to what you're thinking and the energy that 669 01:00:02,360 --> 01:00:06,960 you're emitting, for the universe is going to send that back to you. 670 01:00:07,039 --> 01:00:12,440 It's going to reflect it back to you. Lastly, his comment on the 671 01:00:12,519 --> 01:00:17,360 Life Review, I love this. The boundaries of self are false. He 672 01:00:17,480 --> 01:00:22,719 was quite dramatic about it, didn't you think You may remember from our other 673 01:00:22,840 --> 01:00:28,320 interviews that during a life review, you get to experience your life as first 674 01:00:28,800 --> 01:00:35,000 as yourself as how you experienced it, and then the other meaning also the 675 01:00:35,079 --> 01:00:38,159 other people in the exchange or in the room, So get your perspective and 676 01:00:38,239 --> 01:00:45,199 their perspective, and simultaneously you'll get it from a third perspective, that of 677 01:00:45,320 --> 01:00:52,320 God's perspective or the omniscient perspective. And that's when you learn how your interaction, 678 01:00:52,480 --> 01:00:55,960 how you were living your life affects not only you the other, but 679 01:00:57,039 --> 01:01:05,320 your family, friends, community, and a sally humanity at large. This 680 01:01:05,840 --> 01:01:10,320 is a huge concept. Sit with that a while. I do hope that 681 01:01:10,440 --> 01:01:15,039 videos such as this can give you some insight on what near death and shared 682 01:01:15,039 --> 01:01:21,800 death experiencers discover about the afterlife, the nature of consciousness, and how to 683 01:01:21,920 --> 01:01:27,599 live your life more fully. If you're watching on YouTube, please subscribe and 684 01:01:27,679 --> 01:01:31,239 comment, And if you've not already hit that subscribe button, I'm going to 685 01:01:31,239 --> 01:01:36,440 ask you to do it again. Please do so. You can find the 686 01:01:36,519 --> 01:01:40,079 Afterlife files on all podcasts, streaming apps, Apple, Google, Spotify, 687 01:01:40,280 --> 01:01:47,800 Audible, lot and please play us a visit at neardeathmeditations dot com. I'll 688 01:01:47,840 --> 01:01:54,119 repeat that Neardeathmeditations dot com by now. We'll see you next time, and 689 01:01:54,280 --> 01:02:16,159 thank you for joining us at the Afterlife Files