M It's a big world out there. Welcome to Bigfoot's Wilderness Podcast. We'll
welcome back to Bigfoot's Wilderness tonight. I have a special guest on the podcast.
His name is Greg and he's going to share his encounter and his book
Ridgewalker in Two Worlds. But before we start the interview, I thought i'd
share a story or two. And if you're a pro Bigfoot believer, as
some would say, you may find these stories pretty incredible. I'll just say
that Bigfoot behavior isn't always going to be the same. They can be different,
just like we are. This first story was published on a Facebook page
called the Sasquatch Highway. If you're using Facebook to follow groups and pages,
I highly suggest this one. A lot of effort is put into it and
it's not your run of the mill Bigfoot fan page. And by the way,
check out Bigfoots Wilderness too when you're checking through your social media. Thanks
everyone, I think this has got to be my favorite story and the image,
well, it actually speaks of kindness and innocence. Once again, this
is from a group of friends that are telling me all these stories, which
I don't know whether or not they're true, but I find them very amusing
and inspirations for my art. The subject in this is Robert, who lives
out in the woods and has his best friend, a bully pitbull by the
name of Roscoe, who weighs a whopping one hundred and twenty pounds. Roscoe
is quite intimidating and has been known to chase the local black bears away,
yet overall has a very kind, playful, yet protective demeanor. Robert began
to notice a daily pattern of Roscoe running off towards the evening and would come
back within an hour and a half with either a bone or a large stick,
and would place them in a pile in front of the front door that
was beginning to build up. Finally, curiosity got the best of rot so
on a particular day, he discreetly followed behind Roscoe to see what was this
routine that occupied his thoughts and actions every day, and what was behind these
sticks and bones that he was collecting. Robert began to notice that Roscoe,
without hesitation, was heading straight towards a bridge that overlooked a creek and that
had an embankment on the side that the locals say was inhabited by something that
looks like a giant bear, but was much larger than any of the local
bears ever seen because people only got a glimpse of it. Robert began to
hear the sound of Roscoe barking, but surprisingly it was in a playful way.
Once he got to the area, he found Roscoe at the edge of
the bridge, barking by the side of the embankment, but not going into
it. Suddenly, Robert began to hear a movement and to actually feel the
pounding of whatever it was. Given the disc it must have been huge,
as he could actually feel each step made by whatever this was. Suddenly like
a bolt of lightning, his heart began to shudder, and he thought the
metallic taste in his mouth that accompanies that paralyzing fear. He just stood there,
motionless as it came up from the embankment. It had to be well
over nine feet tall, with shoulders three times as wide as his own.
It initially glared at Robert, almost as if to acknowledge that it knew he
was there, but proceeded to ignore Robert and took a stick that was in
its hand and threw it in the direction of Roscoe. Robert sat in amazement
on a stump. As this went on for about forty five minutes, as
these two seemed to have some kind of bond and it was obvious that this
interaction was something that they both came to look forward to. During the entire
interaction, neither this thing nor Rosco go looked in Robert's direction, with the
exception of the one time it momentarily gazed to acknowledge that it knew he was
there. Suddenly, this huge, almost human looking creature let out a grunt,
which evidently Roscoe understood to mean that their interaction was done. Upon turning
and heading back towards the embankment, it stopped and looked at Robert and let
out the oddest sound. It was a very deep chested, heavy but soft
whoop, and glared into his eyes for a good five seconds. Robert could
almost read what it was trying to tell him by its glare, and to
this day he has not taken anyone to the area, though he has on
many occasions gone and watched the interaction from a distance, and out of respect
for the sheer experience of witnessing this such a strong bond yet strangely pure and
innocent interaction, Robert stays out of it. Robert stated that he gets the
impression they don't want to interact with us too much because they don't trust us.
Artist and sculptor Andrea Lupchenko claims that he came face to face with an
abominable snowman back in twenty fifteen. What's more, the Yeti almost seemed to
pose for him, not withdrawing or skulking away into the wilderness. Lupchenko attempted
to draw the creature on some birch bark. The pair even managed to speak.
He claimed, it happened so unexpectedly and fast that I didn't have time
to get scared. He said, there was a clear feeling that this was
a thinking creature, and I felt he was trying to talk to me.
The yetty was two and a half meters tall or about eight feet tall,
with thick, dark brown hair like a bear's, but looked softer, not
as coarse as a bear's, and it was holding a wooden stick with bits
of hair wrapped around it. But the main thing was his eyes. They
were just like light colored human eyes. At the time, he was in
the remote tiger Kmarovo region, well known as the Russian region with the most
yetty sightings. It was on the morning of the twenty seventh of July.
I went into Tiger to gather materials for wooden sculptures. I usually get a
lot of curved and unusually shaped branches. I live right next to the edge
of Tiger, so I left early in the morning. It was five am.
I was getting close to the Trunuka Mountain. I went out onto a
small open patch, and there I began to feel a presence. It was
that feeling that you get when you know you're not alone. I started to
turn back and saw something standing up. It was him deeper in the woods,
not going away, but trying to communicate. It happened so unexpectedly and
fast that I had no time to get scared. Lupchenko explained further, I
am saying he because of the shape of his body, his gestures, his
behavior were clearly mail. His body was very tone, with lots of visible
muscles. His hands and feet were proportionate to his body the same way as
with humans. His face was expressive. Also, I remember he had huge
legs, and a rough estimation was that he had about eighteen inches of a
footprint. His feet were huge I can't describe or understand how we spoke,
because well, it sounds unbelievable. It felt like we heard each other's thoughts,
as if it was telepathy. There was only one word that the Yetty
actually said when I asked his name. His voice was low and chesty,
and the name resounded as if somebody hit a tambourine twice ta'ban. After the
encounter, he sought a person who spoke the local Siberian Shore language and asked
about a meaning of the word, without explaining where and how he heard it.
He was told that there can be several translations, one meaning a soul
and another one meaning the one that wasn't discovered. The artist said he was
talking to the Yetty for about forty minutes. He admitted he could not prove
his encounter and that he was previously predisposed to believe in the existence of the
Yeti, factors which are in common with many supposed sightings. I didn't have
my phone or camera phone or a camera, but I always carry a pencil
and something I can draw on. This time it was a piece of birch
tree bark. He said, I made a drawing of the Yeti and showed
him the YETI studied it really careful for a while, and then he drew
a symbol next to my drawing. I still can't find what the symbol means.
I've been going through books and the Internet but found nothing really similar.
Well, there is one similar looking symbol for friendship, but I am not
sure this is it. If Yeti's live so close to people. He was
asked by Natalia Guzeva, a journalist, why they did not show themselves more
to humans. I wonder if they are scared to intervene. Do you think
it was easy to put up with this meeting. I am still in a
state of shock. I can't believe it happened to me, he said,
Why was he chosen by the Yetti? I guess it was just a pure
coincidence. Or perhaps it happened because I sincerely believed in Yetti's existence and imagined
how one day I would meet him. I've been dreaming about meeting them.
To be honest, I also don't think I am the only person that has
ever met a Yetti. Others simply don't speak about it rightly, fearing they
might be called insane. All I can say about myself is that I am
as normal as one can find. I am physically and mentally healthy. I
don't drink or take drugs. I think one day I'll get back to the
place where we've met. I think we might see each other again, the
newspaper said it asked about him, and he is a reputable person in the
city, quite well known, and certainly isn't seen as a nutter. Russia's
best known Yeti hunter, igor Bertsev, head of the Russian International Center of
Homonology, has previously stated that as many as thirty yeti's rome Kameovo region,
we are on the brink of finding the Yetti at long last, he said
back in two thousand eleven. However, many sightings or finds of yetty hair
or footprints have been disputed by other experts who point out no remains of the
animal have ever been discovered. All right, and onto our interview with Greg
and his bigfoot encounter and also his book Ridgewalkers in Two Worlds. Enjoy so
Greg, thank you so much for coming on to Bigfoots Wilderness podcast. And
I want to tell you that what your encounter story that you shared with me
that I've read, I really enjoyed, and I know you've got a lot
more than that to share. We're all looking forward to hearing about your book,
and then, of course we'll always want to know after that if you're
writing another book. But Greg is a writer, author, and his bigfoot
book, I called it a big footbook, is called Ridgewalker in Two Worlds.
Very cool cover, too, sore share with us now, I know
I kind of put a couple of a little regiment together. I said,
Okay, I want to know about your book. I want to know about
your counter story. I want to know. I also want to know about
your your favorite video or photo out there that you think prus that Bigfoot is
real. Now, of course, I'm totally in the camp of Bigfoot is
reel. I saw something a few years ago, and I'm almost positive that
bigfoot is absolutely real. My kids saw it, everybody in my family saw
it. But I'm the only one that believes what I saw isn't that creating?
It happens as such. Yes, So thank you for having me on
your show. I deeply appreciate that. My name is Greg Walter, author
of Bridgewalkers in Two Worlds. I based the book on my encounter that I
had with one of these cryptids back in it was like the mid nineteen nineties
and right on the borderlands between southern Oregon and northern California, and it was
a very inten ends experience. I didn't realize what I had walked into,
but over the course of several years I was able to piece together what I
experienced, and that's what led me down this path of where these things are
more spiritual than they are in the horror genre. But that was my experience
and so and that was within the area of knowledge and in place that I
know the best. The book is a sci fi magical realism. I did
that on purpose, I guess, in part just to test my ability to
write a sci fi book, but also that I sin since we all are
still struggling with provenance within the crypted arena of you know, what are these
things? Are they here twenty four seven? Why why aren't they in the
fossil record? Why haven't we found a full skeleton? Some would argue,
well, we kind of have, you know, or we found skulls.
We found remnants, but in different places, not so much in the Pacific
Northwest, and you know, and I think that there's a reason for that.
I think. Also, you know, this is once again my thoughts
on the topic, and you know, this is this is why we tend
to um, we tend to tell a story or a narrative that this is
what we've been able to piece together. And this is the thing is that
as much as I can can debate on this show, as as far as
being a skeptic in this and I'm playing the devil's advocate there, I can
also then you know, it still comes back around to all of the various
sightings in all of these different places, and but yet we still have very
little physical evidence. We have the footprints and the casts. And you know,
the one part I hang my hat on there was that from Texas who
was ah, he was a forensic. He was a forensic guy basically,
you know, making a statement looking at all these different footprint casts. He
studies footprints as far as solving crimes. That's his that's his suit DuJour.
And what he said on that show, or what he determined, was that
ninety eight percent of all those footprints out there are just are just malarkey.
It's somebody having fun with you. Um. But then there was two of
them two of them that he said, this cannot have been have been falsified,
and you know, and he just basically left it with you know,
whatever it is, you folks up there in the Northwest have got something that
you know, you don't know about yet. And so that jumped to me
because that was a guy that he didn't care one way or the other the
thing exists, it doesn't exist. You know, he's looking at shoeprints so
he can solve a crime down in Texas. And so you know that I
like those kind of bias thoughts on this, you know, when we get
into you know, real versus fake and you know, but but says,
a lot of my friends are in the scientific community, and you know,
and a lot of them also are wildlife surveyors and similar to I think I
sent you a video of this of the most elusive man in North America where
it took him six weeks to finally find this guy. And you know,
and someone like that, you know, it's kind of weird because that can
play on both sides. Like I have a friend that lives out probably within
six air miles or where I had my encounter, and he's lived out on
the land there for forty five years off and on. I mean, he
kind of disappears in different seasons, steps out of there and goes goes down
into California or wherever he's going. But you know, he's never had an
encounter. No tree knocks, no no feeding them apples, nothing results.
Um, you know, everything that's happened to him or everything that's that basically
he knows about he got from me. And a lot of that too is
where that's because he's not in the right place to have the encounter with these
things, which then kind of wait a minute, you know, because I
felt like the thing that I saw would have no problem traversing the landscape going
across i mean, major river canyons into other mountain ranges. And so when
people say, oh, it's a little big food, well there's the possibility
that they did. You know. Now, the question that that really we
need to bring to bear here is that are these things here twenty four to
seven like we have, you know, monkeys living in a cave somewhere,
or are they coming from the other place or another place? And that would
be you know, so now we go go down the rabbit hole of dimensional
theory and all of these different scientific things that I think we fully know about
three percent of the universe right now, and so there's a lot of room
for for knowledge to fourth. And you know, the other thing too,
is that when you think about theory, you know, before you get to
theory, you have to have hypothesis, and before you get to hypothesis,
you have to have an idea, you know, and then and then work
your way through the evidence gathering, you know, and all these different things
that leads to theory that then leads to fact and so so that's so that's
kind of you know, just a scientific process that that we need to get
broken down, um, you know. And that's but I mean back around
to that fellow and his name slips my mind, sig or Big or something.
Um. You know that that for the amount of time he spends out
there, you know, how often has he run across something that like,
wait a minute, that wasn't a bear, that wasn't a cougar? You
know? What was that? And you know, and and I think we've
you know, because a lot of people who are unfamiliar with the woods see
things where it's just a bear, you know, you know, might be
something weird like a like a fisher or even like a wolverine, which is
which is very rare. But nonetheless, they are around out there and you
know, um and so and so, did we run across a known animal
or but it was just something that we're just not familiar with, m you
know, or was it something else? And this is where and this is
where the mystery is, and this is what makes it really so much fun.
Oh, I totally agree. Excuse me. The whole thing with Bigfoot
is there are so many TV shows, and I don't want to go off
on a tangent about TV shows, but I hope everybody can understand it.
I'm not a TV producer an executive. I know about as much about TV
as anybody else listening to this. They are never going to prove Bigfoot is
real on TV. If you found that Bigfoot was real and they had all
the evidence displayed on TV, their show would be over. They don't want
their show to be over. They to run that thing for ten more years,
just like they did with the last one. So it's never gonna happen
on TV. So everything that anybody watches on TV, it's just going to
be suspenseful. And that's going to be the end of it. You're never
gonna find out anything about Bigfoot on TV. Just remember that it's entertainment.
TV is entertainment now. And that's kind of what you know, when you
think about like Patterson Gimblin just sort of like a you know, you know,
the Rosetta stone of this whole of this whole foundation of Bigfoot and motion,
you know. And and it's difficult there because there's a lot of ways
we could say, wow, for sure that was it. The muscle structure,
the way the thing moved, et cetera, so forth, it wasn't
like anything that I saw. Um, you know, my guy was probably
like a solitary male, thin, very muscular. Could I mean this thing
could run down a deer and kill it, you know, with its bare
hands, no problem, grab a rock and just go clunk and um,
you know, down a deer at a dead run. Um, that thing
on the Patterson Gimlin. And I don't think so the deer could easily escape
that guy. Um, I think, you know, um, show me
something different. But but you know, the other thing there too was that
was that this is where the skeptics come out and say, wait a minute,
it was it was late October, and they raised a good point here.
You know, the rainy season was about to set in. Um.
If you've ever spent any time in Bluff Creek, it's actually a very beautiful
canyon. Um. I've done a lot of historic trail research. There were
not a lot, but you know, I was able to find the actual
historic trail going up from the Klamath River and going all the way up the
creek. Um. You know. Now, the thing is that so here
it was late October, those guys were under the gun to come up with
something. Roger Patterson I think had an experience or you know, he was
a he was a Hollywood stunt stunt guy, and so he was familiar with
costumes and you know, things like this and then the other the other.
So there's there's that just a plant. And then the other part of that
too was that I thought that the guy I think his name was Renee or
Ray or something. Yeah, yeah, I thought he was the one that
said I was the guy in the monkey suit on his deathbed. Um.
You know. And you know, and the thing about it is that that
might have been debunket. Well that wasn't Renee or you know, I'm I'm
yeah, a friend of mine and I actually talk a little bit about this
in my book Ridgewalkers in Two Worlds. I'm gonna hold it up, and
I'm regarding treasure hunting, you know, and how when you tell somebody you
know that that pirate peach secret treasure got found, you know, than their
immediate responses where you're just saying that because you're gonna go after it now and
you're gonna take it from me and so and so, and this is it's
a common thing within the treasure hunting community. You know that they're very possessive
with the stuff. Go figure, it's treasure, right right, It's not
not unlike two salesmen who won't share each other's trade secrets. I get that,
but I I really want to hear your encounter story from start to finish.
That's what I'm I think everybody's gonna really gravitate towards and then and then
I want um and then I and I'll ask for more later. But while
you're doing that, I'm going to eat these peanuts Carolina Nut Company with smokey
mazzarella flavor. I've been dying to try these all day long. So it
won't be my popcorn, so it'll be my peanuts and I will be eating
these and listening intently. So whenever you're ready, I want to hear that,
because that because we can we can go on and on about um,
Patty and Jeff Meldrum and Grover Crantz and all that, and uh, but
you're you're you. You had an experience and only you can share it the
way you can. And unfortunately I didn't get any photographs, Um, you
know, but but I'll I'll break this out that goes beyond the book a
little bit. But also I want to peak the listener into wanting to get
a copy of the book so they could read, because I put my personal
experience as a twenty three hundred word they're right up in the beginning of the
book, and it kind of what it took many I mean, it took
two decades or longer for me to actually decide to tell this story to the
world. And you know, and I still do it with a lot of
hesitancy because I feel like I've become some weird protector of the native ways of
how they approach these things and what it means to them. And that's from
doing a lot of research, talking to elders and sorting this thing out.
And the thing I love about that is because it's timeless. I mean,
it goes back thousands of years within their culture in certain cultures, and so
and there's a lot more to it than than just the giant. It's also
the little people and that's their gods, that's their immortals and so m you
know, it's not like in some drunken stupor I dreamed the stuff up.
That's what they do, you know, it's what they believe in. And
so okay, So what happened. I think I was at a time in
my life where I was going through changes. I needed to get out on
an area and I needed to just because I was a backpacker at heart,
I was totally familiar with hiking across the landscape, going out there, you
know, living in a little pup tent for for six to twelve nights.
You know, whatever I was doing. I wasn't quite the elitist as far
as you know, the PCT hiker, where I want to hike from Mexico
to Canada. I was more into different areas that offered me a wilderness experience.
And you know, hence the show Bigfoot's Wilderness, um, and you
know, and I didn't think I was walking into this, and so as
I went into it with unexpectations and so but I had it in my mind,
like I thought, you know, wouldn't it be cool if I ran
into dot dot dot? So so here I was. I went out to
an area and it was going to be about a sixty mile loop hike,
so to speak, kind of a weird elongated loop, because I was following
a couple of different ridgelines and then dropping into a river canyon. And the
trail, it showed it very clearly on this map that was completely inaccurate.
When you get out on the ground, you know, it's like the trail
all that disappears, you know. Sometimes I was having to backpack like three
hundred yards see some rock carns because it would cross a meadow. I'd see
the cairns. Well, then it would disappear in the forest and I'd have
to drop the pack, scout the trail out, go back to the pack,
pick it up, do the same thing repeatedly for miles, for like
two or three miles. And so as I found myself at this place,
well, well, first of all, before I took off, before I
went on the actual sixty mile hike, I decided to go to this other
place very close by, and I did, and I burned some age.
You know, I didn't have a campfire. I was by myself. I
didn't have a gun. I had my camera, but I didn't use it
very much. It was just just one of these funky little small cameras and
so and so I went out there and burned some sage, and then from
there went back to my truck. The next morning, loaded up my gear
for the longer trip, took off out on this thing, and I go
to it my second night, so to speak. I went to a place
where there was a spring. And I saw the spring. I just kind
of glanced at it. And I set up my tent in a really really
small meadow, but a very beautiful This was like old growth incense cedars,
and these things are huge, and the whole damn place smelled like pencils,
you know, like sharpened pencils. It was just just amazing. You know.
It was summer, you know, and so and really it was an
early summer, and that was a year that there was going to be I
think two blue moons, but I got the first blue moon month and it
was that first blue moon in early June, and so and so there was
going to be a rising moon. I was catching it right on the moon
rise or or you know, like this, and um. And from there,
I set up my tent, went back over to this spring to put
some water, fill up with some water, and I see this beautiful,
beautiful giant salamander, and I went, wow, you are so cool,
you know, And I picked him up and held him and thanked him for
being there and like this to set him back down. And then and then
from there, I then you know, slept the night, you know,
bugs eating me and so forth. And I take off out another four miles
because you know, once again having to drop my pack, navigate where this
trail is because it was basically all but obliterated and um. And I get
out to a place that I knew geographically where I was, and so I
I then from that from that point where there was a juncture, there was
another mountain range almost that are like a like a major ridge line that that
kind of fed in right there. And I went walking up and there was
this amphitheater and I thought, wow, this is cool. It's a big
flat area about the size of a football field, you know, roughly and
brushy and forested in certain areas and then open forests and others. And so
so I camped next to a there was like a really small Darlingtonia pond.
And the Darlingtonia are these picture plants. Pitcher plants are their carnivorous plants that
live, you know, in this in this region. You know, they
eat insects. Sorry, they don't eat humans, you know. Um.
But but at any rate, um um. So, so I'm camped in
this area. What that showed me was that I was on a contact zone
because it went from conifer forest into these picture plants and incense cedar. And
also there was Jeffrey poine and so that's what's called a serpentine environment. And
serpentine is its geology from the Earth's mantle risen up. But then you also
get these contact zones, and this is important, um and so so at
any rate, um. From there, what happened was I walked up to
the top of this ridge line. There were some turns up there, like
little ponds, you know, maybe like the size of someone's bedroom ponds you
know, and maybe about a foot deep and so and so just to get
a view out over the general region and so forth went back to me.
I went back to my camp. The sun was setting, and it was
at time of the thin red line, and Carlos Castaneda talks about this.
There are several there's several entities that talk about that time of power from from
lightness into dark. And it was right at that time, right at the
thin red line, that all of a sudden, I hear this bush crash,
crash, crack, dundun dune over on the far side of the Amphitheater.
And it wasn't that far from me, maybe I don't know, maybe
like one hundred hundred and twenty feet, but I could hear this thing and
then it stops and there was a couple of ponds up there and it um
and I could hear this slurping sound slurt, slurb slurt, and hell is
you know this is not a air well. Also, I should mention prior
to that, you know, when I was setting up my camp, I
was sweating from the day and so forth, I set my tent up and
I went over and um and I would I would basically boil up a little
bit of water. I didn't even get into a boil, just just nice
warm water I could pour over my head, you know, to wash all
the you know, the dust and dirt off from the day in the sweat.
And so I find this place where it's like a little bit of a
gravelly wash, you know, but very small. Um. And it had
gravel and some sand and stuff, and that was a nice flat rock.
So I said, okay, that's perfect, I'll stand there and pour.
Well, right when I was about the poor water in my head, I
looked down. I see a footprint, and I'm going, okay, this
is cool. Um. And the knee thing with it was and darn it,
I didn't bring my plaster, you know, so I couldn't make a
plaster cast or anything. Um but um. But at any rate, it
had a curvature at the heel. And that jumped at me because I remember
seeing the patter in casts, and I remember seeing you know, just because
you live in Bigfoot country, you know, you want to get familiar with
these cool things. And I remember for some reason that locked in my head.
And so at anyway, I continued taking my bath and went back over
to my tent. And then I noticed over by the tent there were like
footprints, but they were smeared and so, you know, and I thought,
oh, it looks like a couple of bears must have been wrestling or
you know, something was in a struggle here. And you know, in
this area and in that whole region of the Klamaths, it's rich with bears.
I mean they are just they're like clockwork. Two o'clock in the afternoon.
Go to any meadow, and boy, there's a couple of them,
you know, and they love grazing on the onions out in the meadows.
You know, there's these wild onions out there, and so and so at
anyway, it's summertime. You know, they're closing in on summer and so,
so anyway, all of that was happening. I go up and I
get this view spot. I come back down. Here comes this encounter.
This thing comes across and drinks water. I could hear it slurping water.
So wherever it was, it was in a place it must not have held
any water. And that also registered with me later that he didn't come down
from the ridgeline. Otherwise I would have heard him. And also we would
have drank water up there because there was ponds up there available. And so
as I hear this thing's drinking water, and then I hear a splash,
splash, splash, crash, cracked, And all this time he's moving in
the shadow of the amphitheater. He's staying in shadow. This thing knows moonlight
light, you know, like this end shadow and so and so he was.
He was completely attuned to what he was doing. And from there he
does a semicircle around my camp. Probably the closest point where he came to
me was maybe about sixty maybe seventy feet away, maybe a little farther,
but in that realm. And now I'm finally seeing him. And it was
a biped maybe eight eight and a half feet tall, and this thing just
glass. He turned and looked at me with these icy gray eyes, and
yeah, God, I'd seen that before somewhere in all my comic book reading
and so forth, like this, um you know. Side note that was
from a Tarzan comic book. I had, like a Life magazine sized one,
and it showed the apes, you know, and god, there were
those icy gray eyes. So anyway, this thing, this thing stares me
down. I'm holding my flashlight by my tent, I don't have it on,
and I just here in my head, don't even think about it.
You know, I'm like, don't, don't even put that on me.
You know, you're not going to treat me like a cop, you know,
and so and so at that point, I just froze, you know,
I just stood still, and this thing continues to do a semi circle
and then drops down below you know where where he's hiking, down where he
would cross the trail that I came in on, and then down into the
river canyon or down into like a side creek which is a big creek.
But but you know, and then disappears. You know. Um, so
here it was, you know, ten o'clock at night, you know,
having this encounter. I'm out there by myself, four or five six miles
away from my truck, and you know, there's no way I'm going to
pack up my gear and split an abject fear it'd probably kill myself for getting
severely hurt trying to get out of there. And so I said, you
know what, to heck with it. He knows where I'm at, and
so if he wants to come back with a big club, and you know,
club bea to death and that's what's going to happen. But I didn't
get that he didn't come back. There was no rocks thrown at my tent.
There was nothing. And I probably had about a minute and a half
to two minutes with him in the amphitheater as he appeared cross this, cross
this pond and disappeared and I got there was just a couple of seconds where
I got a really good look at him, you know, and I could
see the hair and just very athletic. I mean, this thing was muscled.
Um. Yeah, it could easily. I mean, go ahead,
you could be the most you know, long distance runner imaginable. This thing
would to run you down no problem, um, you know. And it
could make distance. I mean, you know as far as as far as
it wouldn't surprise me if this thing could do thirty miles in a night or
forty. I mean, it was just that strong. And I'm in a
heavy presence, I mean, and and I felt like it wasn't from this
world. Um, but some of that could be that I that I'm running
across a biped you know, I'm bigger than me walking by me, you
know, and so right there. That's that's gonna that's gonna make the freak
meter go go through the charts. So that was it, you know,
and then from there I continued on my hike. Well, I dropped down
so the next day because there was a couple of big lakes down at the
other side of this where I got up on the high point, and I
decided the next day to drop down there to see if I see footprints down
there, you know, to see if this thing came up from that side.
So I went down. It was it was a struggle, scramble down
the boulders and so forth like this. I got down to this lake,
you know, six hundred feet below me. Nothing no footprints, no,
no, no, nothing. You know, I didn't see any big foot
cave, you know, not a And so I went back to my pack,
continued on my way, and at a later point where I was about
to spend the night at a certain place, I ran into a couple of
bear you out in a meadow afternoon, and it was just so much fun
because you know, they were romping and playing in the meadow and I just
got to sit down, sit in the grass, relax, and they would
look over at me. But then they just continue romping and playing, and
I just felt like, okay, so I'm kind of part of the whole
scene here. You know, I'm not above it, I'm not below it.
I'm just a part of it. I'm just woven into the fabric of
nature. At this point. This is cool. And so so from there
it continued on my hike, no other encounters, nothing, all right.
So then years later this is where it gets. This is the stuff that's
outside the book. Sorry, I'm okay, um um and so and so
what happened was years later, somebody really needs to get a hold of you.
Yeah right, Well I thought I put it on airplane mode, but
I guess not. Um yeah and so and so at any rate, um
um I um so. So years later, I mean obviously this prompted me
to start doing research in this. And there was a time where I tried
calling um it was a guy doing the big Foot project and he was the
one. It was like one eight hundred big foot and I called him one
time and just had a real brief I think I left a message and that
was it. He never called back. Peter Byrne, That's who it was.
And um and so because this was kind of hot on the plate at
that time, you know, as far as he encounters all right, Well
so then so then I remember going back in there with some of my friends
and UM, and we were getting recorded on these game cameras, and then
we run into this group. Well part of the group was this guy from
the Crypto of the Crypto, the Society of Cryptozoological Research in New York City
and UM, and he was going out there on repeated trips, and I
think his third trip in there was right after that he died of an inoperable
brain tumor. And UM and boy did that ever? Did that ever send
alarm bells off? And um and so and so. At any rate,
what happened there was in the course that I think it was like five years
later, I was talking to an elder and you know when he was telling
me, he said, well, you know, just to let you know
in this whole thing, that the doctors or the apprentices, you know,
one or the other, they would go up, they would have prayer spots
that they would go along into the mountains to approach these areas. And these
areas are I mean, you've just walked into their church and um, you
know, and and so and so at anyway in these areas, though,
they would do different prayers and um and they and from there, if they
approached the spring, if they get up to a spring, if they see
a salamander in the spring, that's an indicator that they're on the right path,
that they're going to have their encounter. And so then what they would
do is that next night they would wait at the just the right time and
they would literally sing a song of introduction, especially when the thing would would
would appear and or approach, So they would sing a song of introduction,
and then they would sing a song seeking knowledge and the knowledge, you know,
keep in mind they're doing this in their native tongue, you know,
you know, sorry, the Lingua Francas, you know, whatever the natives
have spoken for the last two thousand years, um and so and so.
What would happened then is that the Sasquads they're also known as the teacher and
the teachers, what they do is they portend the future for the tribe.
And you know, a great example just recently was we had these fires along
the Klamath River, and the fires, um, you know, they were
able to get somewhere out of a control on this. But then here comes
these rain clouds that drop rain that then cause like a landslide of ash into
the river. That then so here comes a bunch of phosphorus into the river
that displaces the oxygen that kills the fish and so so, and this is
the kind of thing that the big Foot or the you know, these teachers
would would basically tell them that, you know, you might you might have
a problem with your fish supply this next summer, and so you better plan
for other food sources. And that's that's the power of what these things bring.
They portend the future for the tribe, for the survivability and especially food
security for that tribe. And so you know, and this is and I
feel like this knowledge is pretty universal. I mean, it wouldn't surprise me
if pretty much anywhere in the North American continent wherever these things, you know,
wherever sightings are, at one time or another, there was a there
was a relationship and that you had tribal people, certain elders, certain shamans
and so overth like that we're able to go up there and approach these things
and gain knowledge from them, um, you know, And to me,
that just Wow. That blows my mind. Um, because because when this
fellow was telling me about this five years later, I had to think,
think afterward, I think you know now that I remember I had this encounter
with a salamander, you know, and um, and I kind of how
was he telling me what I saw when I didn't tell it to him?
And you know, and so and so now there's that's some fairly good providence,
um, you know. But um, but at any rate, it
was just something that it was like I walk into this thing and I'm the
stupid one, you know, Um, you know, because I just didn't
contain that knowledge. And you know, those apprentices underneath the shaman under you
know, the shamans, they are trained for years sometimes to even approach these
places and be able to go up into these higher places of power and be
able to contend with whatever they run into. Um, you know, because
the thing, I mean like I felt like if I would have put a
flashlight on him and hey hold on, let me get my camera out and
stay right there, you know, I mean, this thing could easily just
walk over and you know, brain me with a beefbone. Um, you
know. But but instead I held respect and slept like a baby. Um,
slept like a baby through the night, and the thing never back.
And and I didn't hear any tree knocks. I didn't have any you know,
I didn't have the normal sorts of things you hear in a lot of
these encounter stories. UM. You know, I wonder how much of that
is antagonists stick not so much from the people to the sasquatch, but from
the sasquatch to the people out there. I don't know. I mean,
that's that's an open question I have. UM. So yeah, that was
That was pretty much it. Um. You know. In since then,
it's led me down a path of doing a lot more research in linguistic studies,
tribal lore, um, you know, all these different things that that
cooborated with my story, and that that salamander came back around to the salamander.
And a friend of mine, who's actually a colleague up at Oregon Caves
who's now retired, he wrote a book and it's called American Elves, and
it's an encyclopedia of the little people, um from the lore of three hundred
and eighty ethnic groups throughout the Western Hemisphere and UM. And half of the
book is bibliography and so and so, and what this deals with are these
are these immortals. And um, my friend John, when I had him,
signed the book because I and I said, well, can you tell
me a good little personal story, he says, I got one. And
this happened about three years ago. It was up at Mountaineer National Park September.
The snow had just fallen, so there was like a dusting of snow
down at the Paradise Lodge and in the area there. And there was a
maintenance worker, a friend of John's and who was the author of that book.
And this maintenance worker was out at a little shed where they had a
generator and he was doing some work on it, and he heard like light
little footfalls. Hell yeah, and he looked out. He just kind of
peeked over the door of the shed and he sees this thing and it was
like it was like almost approaching him. And then it went ah, you
know, and it stood about two and a half feet tall, half deer,
half human. You know, I'm like a like an infant baby almost,
and it had been shocked and it just turned and ran like crazy into
like this side ravine that disappears. That's it. And that was one of
the little people. And these things are the way you split out the little
people. The way I do it anyways, is that is that you've got
you've got people afflicted with dwarfism, you know, that's basically a medical ailment
is recognized. They're in the fossil record, you know, we know,
we know well of them. And then you've got little people, you know,
such as pigmies, and they come in many different sizes and shapes that
might be sort of along the line of like the Pendak orange and also some
of these some of these Indonesian Um I think it's Homo florence ci um,
you know, is another example. They're in the fossil record Pendak, isn't
you know. We'd love to see one of those guys and um. And
so so you know, we can track these out because of that. And
I think John had mentioned that there was a cave in Wyoming where they found
about six skeletal remains of little people and um. You know, these are
like three foot tall. The things we're referring to here are the spiritual things,
and these are the heavy hitters. They live for two to three thousand
years. We really don't know. There's examples of them. I mean all
throughout the world. The men of Huni of Hawaii come to mind. There's
different names that the tribes call them. Sometimes they have different interpretations. They'll
have lizard legs, they'll have you know, they're half deer there. You
know, some might even call them skin walkers. One of my friends ran
into one of them in the Navajo lands where it was like this, half
dear, half human and um, and yeah, what these are are their
gods? I mean, these are the immortals. And you know when I
think that the little people and the sasquads, the giants are almost inextricably tied
together, you know, and and you know, it's just something that the
only reason why I bring that up is because within the tribal war, it
would be like us talking about Jesus, but we never mentioned God. And
so you know, to think of it in those terms, and you also
have to think in terms of two that you know, these tribes had their
gods and heroes. You know that that I'm similar to our Greek mythology.
Just you know, imagine on the northwest coast of British Columbia or you know,
the Rocky Mountains or you know, and so to your listeners, you
know, I just invite them to to you know, research further and find
whatever tribal lore might be happening around wherever they might have their encounter and what
they can learn from that end of it. Um, you know, they
could help perhaps fill the gaps of what of what what they experienced. So
what do you And again you said, there's a there's a there's a connection
between the little people, the immortals and the sasquash. And what do you
think the connection is? Do you think they're equal unequal? Do you think
they work? Intend like would give me a little more specific. I think
that they work. They worked together, you know, Um, they're separate,
but together, Um they they they basically like like in the lore of
the native tribe that I'm familiar with, what it was was that the immortals
were relegated to these mid elevation ridgelines, and there's land babies and there's water
babies. What I ran into was a water baby. It was a salamander.
And um, and so you know, their their exact connection I'm not
sure of. But from the shamans and from the doctors, they basically,
uh, this is how they arguably learned when they first arrived there fourteen thousand
and ten thousand, you know, twenty thousand years ago, whatever it was,
that that that this was who they learned from to be able to survive
on the landscape. And as a result, and even celebration of they would
have ceremonies, um some call them world renewal ceremonies where they basically they renew
the world. They purge, cleans and renew the world through the ceremony.
And if the ceremony is done right and they follow all the procedures exactly to
a t um um, that the area will be blessed by by the little
people. Um. Yeah, do you or did you or do you know
if lights any type of you know, we hear about these balls of light?
Did did you ever experience any of that? Or did did did the
tribal elders speak of lights or talk about lights? Because it seems like that
seems that appears to be something that is occurring occasionally and it sticks out obviously.
And you know, the way I feel about that is is that is
that these things are almost as variable as as humanity, you know, is
also and that for people to have those sorts of experiences with lights and so
forth. I did not have that, and so I can't. I can't
speak to it, you know, one way or the other. I you
know, I mean, anything's possible. Um. You know, we're still
in this nascent stage of you know, figuring out something something that to them
might be very simple as far as like dimensional theory. You know, what
does it mean for their ability to cloak? You know, is there a
difference? Are they the same? Um? The one thing I can tell
you is that, you know, scientifically, I feel like I feel like,
just like with doctor Meldrum, that you know, we would have more
evidence of these things, you know, either in the fossil record or some
kind of skeletal remains. And there have been some skeletal remains that have been
found, just not in the actual forested areas of the Pacific Northwest. UM.
You know, and this this kind of with that, with that video
that I sent on the Pendac. You know, when you think about an
area like that, an animal four feet tall, you know, like this,
you know, hiding in a double the triple canopy jungle, tropical jungle,
um, you know, and the rate of decay of those bones and
so forth like that. Um, Okay, now I could understand where,
yeah, we could have something physical on the ground and in that in that
circumstance, but when you look at it from the Pacific northwest, an eight
to ten foot you know, you know, biped running around. You know,
we should have more evidence. And so this is what lends me to
point to the scientific or you know, looking at this whole thing with dimensional
theory. Um, you know, and just I mean I think it was
like two months ago. It was back in July. I believe that.
Um that two news stories that come in on the same day. One was
that they had discovered through the Hadron collider a new particle or some new particles.
And this steps us closer. I mean you'd have to be an astrophysicist
to explain the meaning of this, but you know it steps us closer to
what these particles could mean and what a dimension is and you know how how
that can move around. And then on that same day with the James Webb
telescope and announcing you know this this like look through a lens where we can
actually see these massively distant galaxies and all we have to do is find the
livable planets within a star system, Bingo. You know, we got our
we got our habitable planet, and um, you know, and so I
think it's you know, and it's kind of like it's kind of like we're
still at baby steps in these steps it would take for us to really have
these discoveries, and so we're just not there yet. You know, you
obviously have a very curious mind because you took a very real experience. You
did a lot of research, and you came up with a lot of theories.
And I think it's I think you're also in Bigfoot Central. You're you're
you're in a place where the experiences of bigfoot are not abnormal, and you
just did a tremendous amount of research about your entire experience, from the from
from the camping part, finding the trail, the salamander, the actual Bigfoot
experience. I think that's um what most people don't do. You're you don't
come off as an amateur. Um. You know, most of the people
that look for bigfoot are unfortunately, whether you want to say that's a good
thing or a bad thing, but they're mostly amateurs. They don't have the
force, the force of people to behind them, to to eventually find this
this this uh person beast creature. It's I don't think it's I don't think
it's gonna happen without the assistance of a huge force of people that aren't amateurs.
But that's just my opinion. Other people will say whatever, But you
know, it's it's it's right, it's true, you know, and look
at look at hunters, you know. I mean the thing about a hunter
is that, you know, it's similar to a forager. I mean,
I think it was in the book Tribal Bigfoot by Polities, you know,
he wrote about, um, um, you know this thing where it's like
if you talk to the natives that are hanging around the bars and you know,
like this in town, and they're like, these things don't exist.
People are nuts, get out of here, you know. Um. But
yet you go talk to the berry pickers, go talk to the go talk
to the ones that are picking mushrooms, you know, that are out there
in the woods, are like, oh yeah, definitely, no doubt about
it. You know, there's there's no well maybes and sometimes no you know,
and that's and that's also you know, power to the elders too,
and even the shamans They're very tight lipped about this stuff. They don't want
you to know because if nothing else, it steals their thunder. And so
you know, you know, I'm gonna hold up a book. I know
we can't show this on the podcast, but this is the Historical Bigfoot.
It's a thousand pages. And do you have that as well? No,
but I want to write that now. Yeah, The Historical Bigfoot not a
hard title to to to, um to mess up. I think it was
about thirty five dollars on Amazon, and it's it's all about it's basically articles
that were printed hundreds of years ago, one hundred years ago, eighty years
ago, forty years ago, all all instances, all news clippings that were
that were in publications all across the United States going back dating back. When
did that come out? Oh gosh, I think this might even be the
second edition. I think they're not even sure. I think this is maybe
a year. Let's see here, oh two thousand, nineteen o nineteen yeah,
yeah, yeah, and that's you know, I mean, and I
think that like, um, I think Ron Moorehead was one, you know
with his Sierra sounds. Um. Also the other one was the guy um
Tom Powell with the edges of science. You know, we're getting close.
I mean I think that these I think in some respects they're right on.
You know, um when you look at it from that side, you know,
from that view. But but with the hunters, back to those guys,
the thing with hunters is that you've got to know the nature in the
essence of the track, you know, and especially bow hunters, where you
know, they're down on the ground with their nose right right in the mud,
and you know, and for days sometimes you know, tracking elk and
stuff. Those would be the guys that are going to run into these things,
um, you know, similar to that fellow up there in British Columbia
that's that's running all over Hell's half Acre. You know, I'm and now
you know, now that would make sense. Oh yeah, I've seen them
before. You know, I didn't think anything of it. I had to
keep going, Man, I got my you know, I'm on my I'm
on my marathon run. I'm not going to stop and spend time with this
ugly thing. You know. He seems he seems obviously he's a bit of
centric living out there alone. And I did notice that he likes his beer.
See that's something. There's a there's a book I have here. I
don't know if I haven't pulled up right now, but um, but it's
one. It's um my bookcase is behind me. That's one of like five.
Um. You know. The um and this guy was was lived out
on the land and what it was was that um and this was in the
nineteen twenties and thirties. I think he went out there first in nineteen twenty
eight. And this was along the Cellway Bitter Roots all right in the nineteen
twenties and nineteen thirties. I mean, this guy had a hell of a
playground, um, you know. And basically what it was, the rangers
would go to their ranger cabins or their fire lookouts and the axes missing,
where's the sleeping bag? You know? Why? Why is there no cans
of beans here? You know? Like this over years and it took them
like twelve years, and they hired these two trackers from from Idaho to go
after this guy, and it took them another two years to finally catch him.
And um and when they finally caught him, they had more in common
with him than they did with the rangers. That hired him to go get
them and um, and so it's it's a really fun story. I think
it's called I think it's called the ridge runner and um and that was an
old Southern term for these for these appellation boys, you know, running the
ridges and and you know, and the power in that, you know,
And that was kind of you know, with the fellow there in bc same
same saying you know, um, you know, And it's just it's the
spirit of it, you know, I guess. And so so this is
where, you know, I've tried to just have a lot of fun with
the big Foot. I don't get you know, too overly serious, but
I think that there's a lot to learn here, and especially for people that
have been on the ground for thousands of years, and you know, how
they handle this thing and what did they do and you know, um,
you know, And I think I think David here in his book, he
he didn't even scratch the surface of the tribes. No, you know,
because the Shamans or whoever, the you know, the doctors there when I
said get out of here, I'm going to talk to you. Um.
Yeah, and so and so he never could he never could crack that nut.
You know, Yeah, you can spend a lot of money on books,
but yeah, the true research is out out in the field. UM,
I have found that. UM, I'm sure you know who this is.
Steve Isdall does the how to Hunt I think it's how to Hunt dot
com. He has a YouTube channel. Oh, he gets a flood of
Bigfoot stories, um, testimonials, and it's it's fascinating to watch him tell
the stories of what people have claimed they've seen and experienced. And he's,
um, he's I guess, I guess in a way maybe you know,
somewhat similar to me, and that you just got to keep an open mind.
You gotta wonder is it real, is it paranormal? Is it mystical,
is it's spiritual? What you know? What exactly is it? And
then, as I mentioned earlier about TV and entertainment, we saw if you
watched it Expedition Bigfoot's season one, where they show towards the end of the
season the bigfoot walk into a portal. Now, and that's open to interpretation.
Some people might say that the equipment they used was, you know,
maybe not not a par Maybe it was just maybe it wasn't a big foot.
You know, they tried to identify the shape. Again, it was
all about a shape. It wasn't about an actual, real, great perfect
image. But but it leaves you. It leaves you wondering if it's real
in our in our term of what real means like you and I, or
is it something more? And your book, even though you have taken creative
license, makes it makes a case for it. And I think that's great
because we really don't know the government's coming out about UFOs or trickling out little
bits of information about UFOs. But yet they're still classifying documentation about UFOs.
So as they're unclassifying some they're classifying others. And I just read the other
day they're classifying the underwater UFO encounters experiences they've had. So there's something out
there that there's people out there that know what's going on about certain things that
they're divulging. But then they're also keeping certain things secret. I wonder if
Bigfoot is one of those things. Well, yeah, when you think about
it, I mean I remember the other vast Tyson describing the universe as imagine
Earth as a grain of sand surrounded by something like the size of a golf
ball, our galaxy, and like your biggest football stadium times five, you
know, and that's what we're that's what we're contending with as far as you
know, the vastness of this and you know, and that's that's one thing
that's really fun with this James Webb telescope and the things they're going to discover
here that you know, um. And then also you know, what do
you look for to find a habitable planet? Um? You know, you
know the right amount of oxygen, hydrogen, carbon, you know, all
of these these basic core elements you have to have. Um. And then
and then also as far as finding intelligent life or what happens if we find
the habitable planet and we get the gist because we're looking you know, from
from a trillion miles away that there was that there was intelligent life on it,
but it's no longer there. And the scary thing with that is is
that is that where we're headed, you know, where it's like, yeah,
you know, like in three hundred years, it's a habitable planet,
but the only thing missing or humans and for that matter, many many other
life forms. What did what did it look like to you? Did it
look like a hairy, upright walking ape or did could you distinguish more like
what what could what kind of details could you give us? It looked like
it looked like um, it didn't look anything like the um the Astralopithecus are
um um um, the blackie eye. UM. You know. So it
wasn't like our range. It wasn't like it wasn't like a mountain gorilla,
you know. So it didn't have the long arms, I mean, had
it had longer. It looked to me like a big human harry with with
I mean as best as I could make out the elongated head. UM.
So I think some of the pictures we see even like even like behind me
here, just like him, but but but but thinner, you know,
um, and more muscular, I mean, you know, just just extremely
you know. There wasn't an ounce of fat on this guy. And you
know, and it was probably a male UM, but I'm guessing I don't
know, you know, do they even have sexes. Let's assume they do.
UM. You know, but it looked just like him, you know,
UM, and but but very graceful. UM. Could could move just
I mean almost like dancing. UM. You know that this thing just its
ability to move, it was very very smooth in its movements. Um yeah,
and so you know, I that's all I could think of, and
it absolutely froze me in fear because of the fact that, um, you
know, I wasn't sure you know what I was running into. And now
I'm looking back on it. I mean, like there was a sue Indian
I think it was one of the doctors or shaman's He said, you know,
just to have the ability to go up and touch it with your finger
like this, um to to to have it allow you to do that would
basically bring about special powers. Um. You know that you would now have
with nature, just being able to go up to deer, deer would approach
you. And you know, I'm in some people that they have that,
you know. So this um you know, you know another crazy thing.
I remember they're being one of the native stories where it's like it's like sometimes
these apprentices would think in their heads that if they could run up to this
thing and tackle it, you know, and wrestle with it and pin it
down, that they could um and let's say they win the fight. You
know, they might not win all the time, um, but if they
could win that fight, that struggle that they would be that they would be
rewarded with great wealth, and great wealth to them could be like two big
baskets filled with dentalia shells, you know, you know, things like this,
that that the tribe and the neighboring tribes would recognize great wealth. And
so you know it's um. So you got to think wealth in their terms,
you know, And that's and that's kind of what um. You know,
that's that's what I find so fascinating. Um. You know. The
the other thing too is language. You know that if you could speak that
native language you know, and be able to talk to this thing, sing
a song, you know, because telepathically it will connect with you. I
mean from what from what they say, you know, they they just say
it is there's no need for words, and so you know, yeah,
there's there's a lot we have to learn. Remember I think it was on
NPR, I believe Jeff Meldrum. Doctor Meldrum was on for an interview and
this was years ago, probably ten plus years ago, said that a person
had told him a story about how he was somewhere out in your neck of
the woods on the Pacific Northwest, climbed up on a rock, pulled out
his guitar and played a guitar and a big foot walked out as he was
playing the guitar, right, and he yeah, they met eyes. They
you know, they they it listened and then it slowly turned around and walked
away as he continued to play. And I always think about a story that
I shared a while ago about a guy who had a terrible flood on his
land and a big foot had come onto his property left, you know,
basically footprints. Was was a bit thin, a bit gaunt, and had
taken some of his food. And the guy was like, well, you
know, it was starving. I mean, my crops are are crops?
Well, I guess some of his maybe some of his land was destroyed from
the flood, but it had helped himself to some dog food and some other
things it could it could acquire, and and he's just let it do it.
He was like, you know, it needs to eat, and it
simply ate and passed on through. And you just you just have to say,
I mean, are they menacing? Would say eight feet tall and however
many hundreds of pounds, Sure looks menacing. But if they if they leave
you alone, I mean, I'm sure we're all very grateful to have them
leave us alone. Yeah. Do you have this book Basquatched The Apes among
Us John Green? This is a great book because there's tons of eyewitness accounts
in there as well. Well yeah, and you know another thing too,
I should mention this that going off of the dimensional theory and pretending as though
these things come here from another place and so forth like that. Um,
you know, the quick question there is that is it how long are they
here? For? Two days, two months, two years? You know,
is there a period of time doesn't have to happen like on certain moons,
you know, and things like this and so and so. To me,
that just it fits the narrative of why we're not finding physical evidence and
yet we're finding footprints and we're having the sightings and and so and so.
You know, it's like puzzle pieces and you know, when they begin to
come together, you can go okay, yeah, all right, yeah,
now that makes sense. And also why are they in Oklahoma? Why are
they in Vermont? Why are they in well, you know, somewhere back
in the history. There wouldn't surprise me if there was a tribal elder or
a shaman that had a relationship with these things that you know, every year
he would go up and seek knowledge, and you know, when he had
a certain approach, certain song, certain things he did to be able to
open the conversation. And you know, and that's in part what gave him
strength to the tribe to be able to say, no, make sure to
harvest the acorns early, because they're going to get a blight on him and
you're going to lose forty percent of your crop. You know, things like
this that you know that the normal person you couldn't relate to. Um.
There's one other fun story and I saw this, I think it was in
a national geographic, but it was up at the Squamish Nation and this is
up like north of Vancouver, British Columbia. It occupies a big area there
of that inland passage and you know, like this well and anyway, they
had a it was a doctor up there or a you know, a shaman
that would pick out pick out tribal members, you know, young may that
were candidates to become an apprentice for them to be the future doctor, you
know, or the future shaman. And what they would do is that you
know, it was it would take several years of training and so forth like
that but then he'd pick out a couple of them, you know, three
or four of them, and say, okay, you're chosen. You're going
to have a special task. And that task is they all have the knowledge
of being able to survive on the landscape, and you know, you basically
do this from nothing. Well, he would release them into the wild and
sometimes for like upwards a ten years or longer, and they would go out
there and live off the land and they would have to start I mean,
they'd have to make their own tools, they'd have to do everything from scratch
basically. And you know, for the ones that survived, every couple of
years, he would go out there and connect with them and learn the secrets
of the forest, you know. And these are things that the only way
you learn this stuff is by living out there on the ground for years.
And you know, um yeah, I mean, you know, my friend
who lives not far not far from where I had my encounter just the other
day, Like along as fence line, they found like a fawn deer,
all ripped to shreds and I think it was a day before they saw a
cougar, you know. Um, And you know, and also he'd have
bear encounters out there like, you know, he's laying in the sun or
you know, doing something. He's all sweaty, and you'd fall asleep and
wake up with a bear licking his face, you know, for the salt,
my god, you know, And that's but I mean, it shows
the closeness to the land and being able to kind of get in that rhythm
of what the animals are doing. So it's really interesting. And yet there
are stories, legends, lore of the big Foot population being hostile towards Native
Americans potentially tribes, you know, Bigfoot tribes that were you know, stealing
from them, killing their their warriors, you know, taking their women,
children, eating anything they could get their hands on. So yeah, it's
it's it's it's an upside upside down thing. I guess in some way they
are spiritual advisors. In other ways they're they're hostile enemies. But yeah,
I guess that's just the way it is. I guess there's just so many
stories, and you know, the internet's a big place. Yeah, yeah,
and some of that that can be geography. I mean, I think
the stories they're up in the Nahani Valley or someplace, you know, very
northern British Columbia on up into the Northwest territories, and you know, I
mean it's it's a harsh place to live to begin with. And you know,
so and so how can you be this nine foot this nine foot biped
you know, and what are you eating? You know? M I mean
that's kind of what wiped out our megapredators, you know, the saber tooth
cat, the short faced bears, you know, all these creatures like this
because their food supply ran out. Yeah. So so when you think of
it, and that's why I also like the pendac. You know, for
something that's three feet tall, that's probably where it's like they might have been
at one time six feet or eight feet tall, but the environment would not
support that life system. And so it's like they co evolved into something smaller
and to be able to survive. Yeah. Yeah, well, well before
we go, I want to, I really do want to. I know
we've we've we've traded a female emails back and forth. And I love your
sense of humor because you have to have a sense of humor when it comes
to Bigfoot. You have to theorize and think and and and if you're on
Facebook or Instagram or any social media, you see the same stuff get recycled
over and over again. And I just love to get your impression of what
you think is the best piece of information, whether it's a photo of video,
a story that really tells you that Bigfoot is real. Don't say,
Patty, we got to get pass that that one minute video O. Right?
Yeah, And I think I think that that's I mean, that's why
I like when you look at these pictures that people post on all the Facebook
pages and so forth, like that, I mean, you know, yet
best there might be one percent of them that okay, now there's the real
deal. But you know, it's it's similar to like looking for pictures of
Western outlaws. Um, you know, it's like trying to find pictures of
people that didn't want their picture taken, you know, and you know,
and that's and that's a difficult that's a difficult task just on its face.
And so it's similar to I think the Sasquatch, where you know they you
know. And and also you know, another cool story here is the dark
Watchers. And the dark Watchers these are like the little people a big sur
and how they're very attuned. I'll send you a little article about them.
Um. But but how they're attuned to like inside of a camera, a
knife, a gun. They could smell that oil and they can smell it
from you know, one hundred yards two hundred yards away, and so you'll
never see them. And um, but if you don't have any of that
stuff and you're going there with a true heart, so to speak. And
that was with I think her name was Olive, and this was John Steinbeck's
mother, John Steinbeck, of the riding up there in the Central Valley,
um, you know, and because she was a school teacher, she was
going out to these remote ranches out there behind Big Sir in the Olane and
Esslon tribal areas and um. And sometimes you'd go over a pass and she
would leave them, you know, you know, gift of sorts, some
flowers or something. And then when she come back, there was like a
beautiful array of eggcorns and some moss and you know, stuff like this.
And that was from the dark Watchers and um, you know. And another
interesting thing with them too was that that dated back all the way to the
Spanish California, where they used to call them Louis vigilante so scuros, which
literally meant the dark Watchers. And there's a book it's called In Search of
the Dark Watchers. Um, it's got I mean, it's like a forty
page book with about eight pages of just pure gold, you know, you
know about the little people there, and it's just it's another iteration of this,
you know, and that's you know, the dark Watchers are actually these
twelve foot tall you know, huge giant looking things. Well actually they're little
guys. And the way the fog and the light hits them, they look
like these big tall things, you know, so pretty fun. Yeah,
there was an article in the San Francisco Gate about this, and by Thomas
Steinbeck, who was the son of John Steinbeck I recently passed, I think,
and so um, but yeah, I want to thank you. I
thank your listenership. I hope, I hope this was this was something of
nothing else informative than joyful. Please buy my book. And you know,
because I I basically describe a lot of this in the book. I tie
in a lot with nature, um, you know, and then from there
I get into the whole thing with plot and storyline and you know, the
antagonist and the protagonist and you know, one thing that's fun with the antagonist.
I should mention this is that is it really legitimately Okay, you got
these guys that want to hunt bigfoot and so forth like that, But if
they're doing it with the intent for science and so that that way we can
then preserve areas or whatever like that, then you know, that's almost a
meritable cause you know, for a lot they would say, no, that's
bad, you're not supposed to shoot one, you know. Yeah, I
don't know. I'll leave that between them and god, you know they go
shooting these things, um, you know, but but it is something that
you know, you could make a strong antagonist from this, you know,
and so and so, Yeah, there's there's merit there. Well, you
did, you did share some stories that there could be very believable. So
I'll let you off the hook on the what's the best video photo because some
of those stories are you know, not including of course yours, but the
one I think the story that I like is about the Sixes mine and about
the miners and how this was back in the eighteen hundreds and they were literally
scared off their property. I believe there was a murder or someone was killed.
Um there, there's there it's in the actual book, the Historical Bigfoot.
It's in that big old thousand page somewhere after eight hundred pages. Right,
was that the one in in in southern Washington and the Cascades where there
was like six big foot that attacked a cabin with miners. No, that's
different. That's um, that's the one with Fred Beck with eight Kenyon.
That's that's different. Uh. This this is a this is a slightly different
story as well. Actually, I did a podcast on the six is Mine.
Go back and look forward on the podcast and I share. Uh,
there's actually several parts to the to the to the Big six is Mine,
um big Foot encounter incident, and it's it's on the podcast. Feel free
to whoever whoever wants to check it out. Check it out. It's there's
so many pieces and parts. I think I actually just touched the tip of
it. It was. There's so much going on with with with so many
stories about about Bigfoot in Oregon. Where did did that happen on the Sixes
River? Yes, yes, okay, yes, I'm familiar with that story.
There's a book I have on Curry County Historical of the Nets and they
and they go over by Walt Schroder. Um, Yeah, I mean,
you know, there's yeah, and I'll send you this one from Tom Powell
where he gets into the Quicksilver Curtain and you know what these things, you
know, And there was one encounter this guy had where it's like he's backpacking.
There's this wavy stuff in the middle of the trail, just in the
air, and he walks into this going, oh my god. He barely
got out of it, you know, And was that was that a portal?
You know? Um, you know, we love them where there are
these glistening things that beautiful fairies leap through and all this, but you know,
I think it's a lot more ugly than that, you know, or
imperfect right right. I think David Polites was actually exploring a potential portal with
all people Bobo they were, they were they'd come together somewhere in the Midwest
and we're exploring the possibility of a portal. And I don't know really where
it went. I think there was a little YouTube video of an interview with
the two of them, and Polites is amazing. He's he's all over the
place. He's just got so much going on. Well, he found his
gold mine in the whole thing with the missing four one one, you know,
and so missing humans, you know, and I mean missing humans and
the Grand Canyon. Please. You know, it's like, hey, look,
everybody, there's Uncle Harry jumping. Hey, what happened to Uncle Harry?
I don't know, it's lunch time, let's go, you know.
Yeah, that's because he's four hundred feet down on a bunch of boulders.
Yeah. When you get a lot of humans and lots of cliffs, bad.
Yeah. Sometimes humans and nature just don't work together. They say,
there's thousands of people who go missing every year, and you know, if
you can throw in the mystery of Bigfoot in there, you can Bigfoot can
be the culprit for some of them, right, although no one's proved it.
I'd like to think big Foot's not picking us off one by one,
but I should say I've never never seen big Foot in the big city,
So that's good. Well yeah, right, you know, And you know
what's funny if somebody was mentioning that and I said, oh, wait a
minute, wait a minute. You know what about the Giants Stadium, you
know, San Francisco downtown. You know, there's got to be some giants
around there somewhere. So yeah, it's just it's just so so heavily imbued
in our own mythology, um, you know, with giants and small people,
and so it's a it's but it's fun exploring whether you're in be it
in the library or in the wilderness. And you know, so it just
depends on where you know and and if you can blend the two. Um.
Yeah, by the way, my hobby is I collect old Forest Service
maps and try to find the old pack trails. Oh okay, that sounds
that sounds very intriguing because that's where would you find the time commentation, not
online? I guess well, they believe it or not, they've scanned a
bunch of them. Now. You can also go like like like to pretty
much any major university library and they should at least have some of these,
and especially for the state, like for instance, the University of Washington Library
Special Collections, they have a lot of that stuff. Also, your regional
National Archives is going to have you know, material on this, you know,
along with the main National archives. Do you remember there's two National archives.
There's ones with letters and portraits and stuff like this. Deep's in downtown
DC. And then in College Park, Maryland is a documents Library's we're the
maps and charts and all that. Greg, let me ask your questions since
I don't know when I'll ever get to the West coast, but I would
love to know what is how accessible are these logging roads. I always hear
stories about people on logging roads and they're camping out there, they're hiking on
un their cars are breaking down on them. I mean, they seem to
be vast. What tell me a little bit about the logging roads because a
lot of people claim to have encounters in those areas. Yeah, but you
know, and the thing there is is that there's millions of miles of logging
roads on our public lands now. Um, many of them they don't maintain.
And so you know, now they might be blocked off and the blockages
may have been opened from atvars and you know, people like this. Um
sometimes they're they're they're successfully blocked off the place where I went, where I
packed in. They dig tank traps like six of them boom boom boom in
a row with boulders and everything to to really try to keep people out of
there. Um. And some of that is for like Portfancia or rot.
You know, there's different reasons for that. But that's the one thing about
when you when you can gather like a historical archive. I did this for
the Oregon Caves and because I'm on the board up there with Oregon Caves and
also Crater Lake, the same place where the guy had his encounter with a
with a crypted wrote a couple of books about it, and you know,
like this, um but um. But yeah, within that you see the
the the regression of trail systems and the progression of logging roads. And you
know, but sometimes the trail and the logging road. You know, in
other reason you get pieces of trail that are still there. And and then
in other places where it's roadless, you know, obviously you can follow those
old pack trails or even see the variances between the pack trail and a new
trail they may have put in um, you know, and so so yeah,
you got to watch, you know, you know. With within that,
it's good to get up to date information, like if you're going to
visit, say the Rogue River National Forest or someplace like this, that you
want to find out what roads are open um. You know. And also
sometimes they'll show a trail, like I can think of one place where there's
a trail on the map, new map, and the trails just hammered.
And those are the fun ones to explore because you know, they might connect
you to another rail system up on a ridgeline, you know, and so
it's a um. So it's like the world's your oyster. And that's what's
fun about the earlier maps too. Um, even in like the sixties and
seventies, these ranger district maps that show the trails you know, that are
laid out on the ground and you know, and they'll take you into places
that you know, first of all, there's nobody around and so and so
you can find yourself in a remote area pretty quickly. Um. And secondly,
you're you're you know, you're kind of exploring and so you know,
within that realm um, you know, and that's where you're gonna have more
a more likely chance of running into bears and running into animals. Um.
You know, that's that's pretty fun. UM. But yeah. The thing
the thing in the Northwest, so especially like southern Oregon, northern California,
I mean, number one, all the fires that have happened, um and
so the amount of road closures in that trying to find a place, I
mean, you know, I say this joking, but it's but it's like
imagine coming around the corner and you know, you go, wow, look
forest, um because everything's burned, you know, and so and so you
run into those problems. But um, but but yeah, just I would
just be a little bit cautious as far as you know that you want to
go to this place, and if you're reliant on a logging road, you
might check if it's either open and or maintained. Um, because there's a
lot of roads of Forest Services just had to let go um due to budget
cuts and you know, like this everything going to fire funding and so um
yeah. Yeah. Kind of the running joke I have in that is is
that you know, we've established a policy in our household that anytime we have
a fire in the kitchen, we always back burn the living room, there's
the whole place. So anyway, sometimes they're having to do that though,
and I understand, but gotcha forest service and really um yeah, so so
yeah, stay safe and yeah, let me know, if you're going up
to the northwest, there's um yeah, yeah, I get crater leg going
to Annie Springs. Springs are another I mean, that's another whole piece of
magic. I put that at the back of the book on how to find
a power spot, you know. And if you can find a spring,
you know that that's that's your first step, you know, especially if it
has this weird bubbling stuff called water. You know, it's not a dry
spring, um, you know. But um, but but yeah, you
know, the Annie Springs is some of the finest water you'll ever drink in
the Northwest, and it's basically the source water for Crater leg Oh wow.
So where where can we find Ridgewalker in two worlds? Well, it's found
on Amazon. You can also contact me at my email Gee Walter twenty seventeen
and all, you know, if you send me twenty dollars, I'll also
include some cards and you know, a big foot um bookmark, you know,
even though I remember one bookmark set on it that bookmarks are for quitters.
So anyways, but yeah, you can contact me directly. That's also
on my website, you know. And and um, but I'd say use
my personal email. I mean, that's that seems to be the one that
works the best. So give me your email address. Again and give me
the website name please, sure it's um, it's it's www dot the Ridgewalkers
dot com. And then and then my personal email is g Walter G W
A L T E R two O one seven at gmail dot com. Perfect.
That's great, and I hope I imagine you'll get quite a few inquiries.
I I haven't got a book yet. I will get a book,
and I will definitely read up on my Indian lore as well, because I
think that there is a connection with Bigfoot and the people who were originally here.
But right, I mean it's kind of landscape relationship here you go.
Yeah, and that's um, and that applies. I mean like look at
the leper cons you know, or anything there with the UK with a little
people. Well, I mean look no further than your than your last box
of lucky charms, you know. Um, yeah, there's the little people
you know. Um, But yeah, send me, you know, I'll
be in touch with you after this and I'll mail you a book. Cool.
I look forward to it. We'll hold on Greg just one second.
Thanks for coming on, all right, Well, many thanks to Greg for
coming on and talking about his book, Ridge Walker in Two Worlds. We
really appreciate it. I really appreciate it. I hope you will too.
Check out his book. It's on Amazon. You can find it there,
Ridge Walker in Two Worlds, And I'll play you out with a nice song
I found on some royalty free music. Have a great night.