And now Audio Theater Central. Hello, welcome to Audio Theater Central. This
is the show that explores family friendly audio drama through news, reviews and interviews.
I'm your host, Jad Sutter. This is episode one hundred and seventy
nine. Well, in this episode, I've got a review of Crown of
Success from Lampider Theater and ATC contributor Austin Peachie will be joining me for that.
I've got some feedback from Christopher green E Z and Sarah, some audio
drama updates to get to in just a minute, and we'll also have another
monologue segment. This time, I'm going to talk a little bit about some
audio drama fan engagement ideas, and lastly, post credits because it will have
spoilers, Austin and I are going to talk a little bit about the recent
Lamplighter Theater bookends and the continuing arc with Finney and Jones. So a whole
lot to get to in this episode. Let's kick it off by jumping into
the audio drama updates. Wired her up this program to bring you a special
report and in other news tonight, a brief look at the headlines. Now
they want exciting, fast piece news that's relevant and entertaining like this. Well,
some sad news here at the top, and that is that Ron Hamilton,
the voice of Patch the Pirate and the creator of that show, died
on April nineteenth, twenty twenty three. He was seventy two years old.
He was not just the creator of that show, but he was also a
musician and a composer, and he wrote many, many songs and hymns over
the years, and you can find a lot of that music out on the
streaming services. But I believe the first Patch the Pirate album was released in
nineteen eighty one somewhere around there, and they have consistently put out new releases
ever since then. And I know there are many fans of that show.
Yes, it is geared towards younger, younger audiences, but I know that
there are a significant number of you listening who grew up on that show.
And it's a it's a sad day if you have never heard that show.
It is played every Saturday morning on Portlight FM radio, so you can check
it out there. But although the character of Patch has not been present on
the show for the last several releases, it is still going strong and they're
doing great work over there. There are always a lot of fun those Those
shows are are really really fun. It's a great quality program. While on
a lighter note, I wanted to tell you about an upcoming audio drama stream
where you can listen back to back to a couple of audio dramas for free
and then hear some behind the scenes info from the producers of those shows.
And that is a stream called Shadows and Sherlock, which will feature Christopher Green
sharing an episode of Shadows and Daylight, followed by Craig Hart, who has
produced a couple of Sherlock Holmes audio dramas, and so you'll get to listen
to those together with a live audience. And here's some behind the scenes from
those guys. So if you want more information about how to participate in that,
head over to Shadows and Daylight's website, which is Shadows and Daylight dot
c A and either join their discord server because they will be announcing that there,
or sign up to the mailing list which is all linked there at the
website and you will get notified of those events. This will be an ongoing
event and Christopher is teaming up with different producers and so if this sounds like
something you want to participate in, be sure to get connected with them.
Well. Speaking of Sherlock Holmes, there is another Sherlock Holmes audio drama,
an original that was just released and it was produced by Caleb Bressler, an
actor that we interviewed here on the show in episode one seventy three due to
his work on Lamplighter Theaters King Jack, and he has launched a new audio
drama brand called mind Palace Audios, and he has produced and released his first
production, which is called Sherlock Holmes The Adventure of the Nightmare and it is
a twenty eight minute audio drama that is really interesting. It's worth checking out
and it is available to stream for free. And Caleb not only voiced Sherlock
Holmes in this production, but he did all of the editing in the post
production as well. So it's very cool to see people in the space branching
out and doing different aspects of creating audio drama and doing it well. So
link is in the show notes of course if you want to check that out.
And I do believe that Caleb has other ideas that will be produced in
the future, so be sure to subscribe to the feed for mind Palace Audios
and in other podcast feed notes. I know I mentioned this in the last
episode, but the Kaboom podcast from BYU Radio and the creators of The apple
Seed storytelling show, they have continued to crank out episodes and I've listened to
every single one of them. A couple of them were re released from their
original airing on the apple Seed, but now that they have a dedicated audio
drama feed they are going to be sharing those there. But I've listened to
all of them. They are doing really great work. I really really like
them. I think my favorites so far have been one called The Shiny and
the glass Cutter. They're just fun shows and I'm really liking it. This
anthology approach where you just get these random stories that you never know where you're
going to go in them, and they're usually around twenty to twenty five minutes
long. And what's also cool is the producers will come on at the end
and talk a little bit about the show and share some of their thoughts on
either the process or what the stories theme made them think of and stuff,
so it's it's really fun. And in the episode called the glass Cutter,
there's this character who is a doctor who are a surgeon, and there's this
thread in the story about having steady hands because you know, well, I
don't want to spoil it anyway, but a surgeon does need steady hands.
And this doctor's name is Amber Dexter, which I thought was very funny.
But anyway, link is in the show notes to the Kaboom podcast and I
highly recommend grabbing that link to pod Chaser, which will then get you to
whatever podcast app that you prefer, because there are a lot of shows out
there that have Kaboom in the name, and so this way you can ensure
you get to the right feed. Now, there is another show that I
think we may have mentioned very briefly in the past, but we haven't really
talked too much in depth about it, and I'm not sure exactly why I
think it was because it hasn't really been available for purchase or download yet.
It's only been airing on the radio up to this point. But it is
called The Clue Crew and it is from Pacific Garden Mission, who are the
producers have unshackled and so it's a lot of the same creative people involved in
this show. You may have heard it referenced in the last episode in our
conversation with Charlie Richards, because he is one of the writers for that show.
So let me tell you a little bit about it. I'll share the
official summary of the show here. The Clue Crew series tells the story of
the Clue Children, who recently moved from Venezuela to Chicago to join their estranged
uncle, Rear Admiral Charles Clue, commander of the Great Lakes Naval Base.
After the children's Christian missionary parents, Chris and Elizabeth Clue die in a plane
crash in the mountains of Brazil, Uncle Chuck must take custody of the children
as the next of kin, but bachelor Uncle Chuck, his doctor friend Bonnie
Chan and the Clue Children or Clue Crew must adjust to their contrary lifestyles and
needs, along with their pet Capucian monkey Bingo. The Clue Crew's natural curiosity
and sense of daring make for some exciting and even outrageous adventures. So this
one is also aimed at a bit of a younger audience. But it is
a really fun show, well done, and they're fun episodes. Now here's
why I'm talking about it. Now, They are going to be making all
of the episodes available for download on the website coming this summer. We don't
know yet if they are going to be available to download for free or if
they will have a cost associated with them, But in the meantime, if
you want to check them out, go to cluecrew dot org. Now it's
Clu without the e Clu crew dot org. The family's name is Clue Clu
and so on the website you'll see the list of episodes some information about it.
They've also started doing study guides for the episodes, and so anyway,
at that site they will be available soon for you to download. But in
the meantime you can listen to them on Unshackled Radio, and I do believe
it is also airing on select radio stations as well, so there is information
there out how you can listen until they are available for download. All right,
moving on to a couple of real quick items. The first is Adventures
and Odyssey has jumped into the low fi craze and they released a remix of
some Adventures and Odyssey qes and themes, and it's a thirty five minute music
track for you to play while you are studying or whatever people do when they're
listening to low Fi. I have checked it out. It's quite fun.
In fact, I turned it on to let it play while I was falling
to sleep last night. So it's fun hearing those familiar Odyssey cues put to
a different use. And it's interesting. It's very interesting that they are jumping
into this space. But there's a link if you want to check that out
and stream it for free. And next up is just a short note that,
in case you missed the post on our blog, River Cross is in
pre production for a new mini series called The Bridge to Freedom. They produced
Holding Esther and Joboda Bridge a while back and those were fantastic, and so
this one will be coming soon. Many of the same team members are involved
in this one. There's a link to check out the post and see all
of the details there. But they were trying to raise funds by the end
of April to produce this. Now, of course, we are in May
now, so that deadline has passed. Although if you are able, I'm
sure they would not turn down your donation to help them get this show produced
and out into the world here in the coming months. All right, Next
up, today, the day that This episode is dropping is the same day
that Glenn Haskell is releasing his new audio drama. It is a short series
called on Demand. Now. This one is very different from his last release,
Slipping Past the Garden Gate, and it is more akin to something like
BTV or Kids Radio on Odyssey. Though Glenn does make it clear that he
is not trying to parody or copy what AIO has done with those formats,
and that the ideas for these sketches which are all put together in this show
have been around for many years. And in fact, here's Glenn to share
a little bit about his inspiration for this new series called on Demand. Glenn
Haskell here, creator of Demand and more than twenty years ago, God sent
me on a journey that I just haven't recovered from yet. I had the
idea that if churches and schools had short sketch based material, they could use
it to share a message, promoted event, or add all the seasoning to
their service or assembly. Now. I started doing this because my wife,
who was a teacher and needed something for her kids to perform for a Thanksgiving
event for parents. I would go on to write a new script for her
every year. Well the next decade found me writing more than four hundred short
stage presentations and then sending them off at no cost to a growing list of
global users. Now they were picked up by other services. Some of those
scripts were used and translated into ten different languages that I know of, and
I still hear from people every month who were using the scripts. This is
also what led me to become fully engaged in the development of audio drama some
ten, twelve, fifteen years ago, even before that, but more strongly
engaged. On Demand is a return to the short sketches once wrote so frequently.
Some of what you're here in on demand or adaptations of some of this
early work, some brand new, and all we've together with a significant point.
By a third episode in the series, I'm blessed to be joined by
an amazing cast who have significant credits and high profile audio dramas themselves. They're
helping to bring this unorthodox idea to light and they're crushing it. From our
team to your home. I hope you enjoy what you hear when on Demand
is fully released in May. So on Demand episode one, the Journey Begins,
drops today, so you can check that out. And he's putting that
on YouTube, but it will also be coming to Dramafy as well, and
there are at least two more I know that he has two planned. Who
knows what the future might hold. But the second installment will be coming in
July, and you may hear a familiar voice in this one. Actually,
there'll be a lot of familiar voices, I think. But I was privileged
to be able to voice a few characters in this show and it was a
lot of fun. Really enjoyed one in particular called Hanky Got a Cold.
So you gotta listen. You gotta listen to this show. It's very fun,
funny and thought provoking as well, which I think is exactly what Glenn
was going for. And the last item here is just a quick note in
case you missed it. We posted on the ATC blog our ultimate list of
family friendly Western audio dramas, and we have compiled several of these lists in
the past on different themes, but this is our latest, so links in
the show notes to go check that out in case you missed it. And
if you're a fan of Western's and know of any that we missed, be
sure to let us know and we'll get them on there as well. Testing
one, two, three testing. That was just me talking. I do
that all, where's my speech? Word with it? That's what I want
to talk about. So here's what I've been thinking about lately. I've been
thinking a lot about the various methods for building audience interaction and engagement with the
fans of audio dramas. And as I'm sure we're all aware, media consumption
habits have shifted and changed a lot in recent years, and even beginning as
far back as ten or twelve years ago. Radio has become less of a
factor in audio drama distribution and more of that focus has shifted to online methods.
And so I've been thinking about how producers can engage their audience or their
fan base in between episodes or just on an ongoing basis. And I'm talking
about things beyond you know, just a teaser for the for the next release,
or trailers or behind the scenes content. You know, Odyssey has been
doing that kind of stuff for a long time, you know, doing the
Odyssey scrapbook clips or whatever, and those would go on the album releases or
occasionally they'll drop those into the radio broadcast in between breaks or whatever. That
kind of stuff, which I love that stuff. I'm not disparaging that at
all. I really like it when producers do that kind of stuff. As
an audio drama nerd myself, I definitely like behind the scenes content, but
I'm talking about more along the lines of either additional content or ways that you
build engagement that kind of keep the buzz going. I think the teasers and
behind the scenes stuff, it's kind of like the minimum or the first level
of doing that kind of thing. And so what I'm what I'm kind of
referring to are well, we just talked about Adventures Odyssey. You know,
they've been recently doing some online only posts which have an ongoing story arc.
Then they have the comic strip. They're doing these art recreations, so they'll
use AI to do these illustrations of you know, our main characters in the
style of different famous artists and posting those online. And then the low fi
music track that I talked about in the last segment. And years and years
ago, they did the Odyssey Times newspaper. Now there weren't a whole lot
of issues of that, but they were printed on actual newspaper and distributed.
I remember I didn't find those until I was a teen I don't know exactly
when they first started coming out, but I ran across it at my local
Christian bookstore many many years ago, and I thought they were super cool.
It was written with articles and even had classified section and I remember reading a
classified ad about Harlow Doyle and just cracking up. And some of the other
things that there was, you know, jokes in there, and you know,
references to our characters from the show and just stuff like that. It
was fun. And none of these things cost anything. These are not additional
products, so these are all just designed to get the fan base involved keep
up the awareness of the show. Now, Odyssey has built a huge fan
base, and so I just wonder how much these kinds of things have affected
that and how much people really get into them. I know, the super
fans like myself, the nerds, you know, we love that kind of
extra stuff. But I wonder how much of an effect it really has on
the average fan, the listener who just really enjoys the show. Do they
do these kind of offerings cause them to really engage with the show more?
I don't know. And in more recent years Shadows and Daylight, Christopher Green
has been doing some really interesting things he has a Discord server where fans can
come in. Now, this is not necessarily a new thing. This has
been a popular thing to do for podcast communities for quite some time now,
you know, since the early days of Discord, people were using them to
communicate with their podcast fan base. And so he's doing something similar with his
audio drama and just doing using different methods to interact with the fan base and
keep them up to date on progress and those kinds of things. And then
also he's been releasing what he calls case file fragments and posting them on the
website, which are just very very short little stories with the characters from the
audio drama, and it's just a little glimpse into their world, the world
of shadows on daylight while you're waiting for the next episodes to come out.
And so there's these interesting creative ways to engage with your community online. And
again I'm not talking about additional product offerings, because all of these things that
I'm talking about are available free. Their interaction tools and things. You know,
certain brands, as they grow from an audio drama, you know,
it's kind of a natural thing to have that spawn other products, like Odyssey
has done video games and graphic novels and middle grade reader books and all kinds
of stuff, and Shadows and Daylight is even kind of heading in that direction
as well. They're developing a graphic novel based on the series, and base
Camp Adventures also did a comic book based on their show, and they even
did a video game based on their show. Now, the difference there is
though, that the base Camp Adventures video game was a web game which was
free, as opposed to the Adventures and Odyssey video games and even board games
that they did those who were all additional products for purchase. So these are
just kind have been things I've been running through as I think about how to
encourage producers, new creators who are getting into the space, how to grow
a following around their show. These kind of ideas are always kind of running
through my mind, and I've just kind have been curious as a fan,
what sort of content or experiences do you like or do you even bother with
this kind of stuff? Does that help you engage with a show more?
And for the producers, so what methods have you used that you think are
worth your time and actually yield the best results? And how can we maybe
replicate that these ideas in other settings. And you know, your average consumer
is not going to be a super fan of all of the audio dramas out
there, you know, so they might gravitate to shadows and daylight because they
love mystery and detective stories, or it might gravitate more to a show that
is more comedy because that's what really resonates with them. So of course we
can't just kind of copy all of these methods over and just duplicate exactly the
same thing. It has to be tailored towards the particular show. But I
know this segment is not always super thought out. These are just things that
are kind of bouncing around in my brain, and so I just share them
here, and if you have feedback on it, I would love to hear
what your thoughts are on this idea of audience engagement tools and ways to interact
and what works, what doesn't, And if you have thoughts on any of
this, I'd love to hear it. What do you think of our little
plan? Your characters were weak, your dialogue was cliched, and you didn't
have much of a story. Wonderful everyone, We have a delightful show.
It's the Michael, A true genius to you symbolism in that way, you
may even get a standing ovation. All right, Well, I've got my
cup of iced coffee here and I'm ready to talk about lamp Ladder Theater.
Austin Peachy is joining me. Thank you, Austin. It's always great having
you on the show. My cup of cold water and myself are ready to
start this review. Thanks for having me. Well, we're gonna talk about
Crown of Success, which was released the end of last year in twenty twenty
two, and it is just about three hours long, so one of the
longer run times for lamp Lighter. I mean, of course, I don't
know if they'll ever beat the Hidden Hand with anything else, but this one
is on the longer side of things. Yeah, it's it's nice having that.
I listened to on the road trip. It was really good having it
that long length. We had a lot of new stuff to listen to for
a good portion of our voyage voyage. What am I thinking, I'm thinking
shipwrecked. Probably it was good listen to that auto road trip, our road
journey, whatever you want to call it. Yeah, you're getting a little
bit ahead of things here. We're on crown of success. Well ship breakfast
three hours too, So that's really awesome, nice, nice, Well,
before we get too far into this one, why don't you kick us off
with this summary? Will this heart of mind ben depridivies growing to hide the
mess of me side of mega deglay lond and open up the creaking door around
the walk upon the dusty floor, Scream away the guilty stays until no sin
or shame remain. Spendlove, farm walls and occupied the ampty holes until the
man I am best feeded no more doors a barricade comments, and this intriguing
allegory, a silver crown of success will be presented to the sibling who wisely
uses time and money to furnish their new home and garden. The results revealed
that some have been hindered by the temptations of their new friends, pride,
procrastination, and folly. And who will conquer the challenges of the thief of
time, the lane of trouble, or the brick of bother. Now,
I'm going to say this right at the top of this review that this was
not my favorite Lamplighter theater ever. In fact, it's probably my least favorite.
But being the professional audio drama critic that I am. I'm trying to
set aside my personal feelings about this one and just be objective. And I
don't know all of your thoughts on this. You don't know all of mine.
But we had a conversation in one of the Audio Drama Alliance and meetings
a while back where we just happened to mention that we had very differing opinions
on this one, and so I said, well, man, I need
to have Austin come on to help balance me out a little bit, because
this is gonna be an interesting discussion. Now. I listened to so much
audio drama and I'm always going in with a critical ear, looking for the
things that I think could be improved or looking for those standout moments, and
I always want to balance, you know, negative with positive, and I've
always done that from the very beginning of this show, and so this one
was really tough for me. I have to say that it was really hard
for me to get into. I just did not find it interesting at all.
Once we got past the bookend, I just found the whole story.
I hate to say this, but I just found it kind of boring and
it did not grab my attention at all. That's not to say that there
weren't a few lines or moments that I thought we were nice, but overall,
I'm just not into this story at all. I guess I'm what I'm
trying to say is I was not the target for this. It did not
resonate with me at all. And so you know, take the rest of
my thoughts on this one with a grain of salt. If that bothers you
listener, then you know you know where I'm coming from on this. But
with that disclaimer out of the way, let's start with the very opening book
end, because that definitely grabbed my attention. And we've had this ongoing arc
with Finney and Jones for the last several lamp Lighter releases. Now, Austin
said, there's so much going on in these, but we don't want to
spoil things. Can we talk about the bookends in a separate segment, and
so I said yes. So if you have already heard the last several lamp
Lighter releases and you want to hear us talk about those, stay to the
very end of the show, after the credits. We're going to chat about
that a little bit, and it's gonna be spoil or filled. So if
you haven't heard them, then bail out at the end of the theme song
or the theme music. So all right, with that said, what did
you think about this first opening book end? Well, I have to say
I was quite excited to hear it after what happened in King Jack and things
were ramped up quite a bit. I did not expect it to go that
epic. Well, more of that later for the end, but I loved
hearing Judah again. We haven't heard him for the past couple lamp Lighter theaters,
and I'm not sure is it the same actor that played Juda before.
He sounds quite a bit older. Yeah, this one was different too.
This was actually a girl that played him in this one, Isabella Goodoy oh
Man. Lamp Lighter is so awesome. I picking actors to do that,
I know, I can't remember her name. Is one plays Luban in this
and also King Jack and the last one. I did not realize that was
a at least for King Jack. I didn't, but yeah, I did
not notice that it was a girl or a woman playing Judah. There.
That's wow, that's amazing. Yeah, in the previous ones, the actor's
name was Judah as well. If I remember correctly, I think it is
Judah ffecto. Yeah, effecto sounds good. It sounds like that's what it
was. Yeah. So, yeah, this is a different, different actor,
and I knew there was a it sounded a little bit different, but
I had no idea that it was a female either until I got to the
cround, like more like his voice change and that, and they just keep
they kept the same person. But I guess having a one play that character,
they can keep the voice consistent without having his voice change having to recast
them. Yeah, that could be the thought process behind that. But this
one was a twelve minute opening book end. I was like, Wow,
this one's going on and on. Is that a record? I don't know.
The ending book end for King Jack was quite long as well. Yeah,
and the one for a Tredge with Secret Cove. I think the end
for that one was quite long too, if I remember right. Yeah.
And so there's some interesting little tidbits that we get out of this one,
and we're definitely going to get to all of that later. But I did
want to say I didn't have a chance to confirm this because I just re
listened to this one again today, and I guess I may have missed it
the first time. But was that Phil Lawler as the parcel delivery man?
I don't know. I didn't catch that. I think it might have been,
but he's not listed in the credits at all. He wrote this adaptation,
yeah, but he's not listed on the acting side at all, So
I'm not sure if it was or not. But it sounded like him to
me. But he did a really if it was him, he did a
really good job of not sounding like, you know, his self, because
a lot of times we've heard Phil do all sorts of voices in Odyssey over
the years, and usually I can tell that it's him, but this one,
it took me a couple of times. I'm like, wait a minute,
I think that might be, but I'm not sure. Yeah, he
was directing this too, I believe. So they might have just said,
hey, Phil, you want to do this line for us real quick,
and maybe they just forgot to credit him. I don't know. I'll have
to go back and re listen to that. Yeah, so I think it
may have been. But that brings us to the credits here. So,
as I said, Phil Aller wrote the main story the audio play as they're
calling it here and the book end was written by Mark Camby and sound designed
by Alan Hurley, music by John Campbell And as you said, Austin Phil
also directed this one as well, which is a post for him first time
being on a lamp Later theater. Yes, yep, we know that he's
been involved in the Guild and the Master's Guild the last few years, and
so I guess it was inevitable that he would eventually take part in some of
the lamp Lader Theater productions. But yeah, so this is the first time
writing or directing for them. Yeah, I'm still holding out for that.
Paulma Cusker written and directed lamp Latter Theater, right, I know that would
be amazing too. So we start off this one after we move out of
the book end. We have a narrator of this story and Melissa Disney.
Melissa Disney, Yes, she plays allegory lit. And if you look at
the way it's spelled, it's an intentional misspelling or alternate spelling of allegory.
I don't know if that's from the original book or if that was a Phil
Lawlor thing. And the lit is probably short for literature, right, Yeah,
she introduces herself there at the top, but then she's not like a
character in the story. So it could have just been a framing device that
he put in there, or it could be from the book. I don't
know which it is. But speaking of that, I know you've talked a
lot on the show about narrators nor usage. What do you think about the
narrator usage in this one means so heavy. I wasn't necessarily a fan of
it because I've felt like she was kind of unnecessary, But it didn't bother
me quite as much because I just was so not into the story all that
much anyway, So it was okay, I guess. But one part where
it did really stick out was when Melissa Disney, as this narrator, has
lines back to back with a character that she plays in the story. She
plays Folly, and I don't know it was there wasn't miss Folly. Yeah,
she did a fantastic job differentiating the characters, but the the vocal effect
or the way they were in the mix felt a little like they weren't differentiated
enough at that point to me. But that's a very nitpicky thing. Yeah,
up on that a little bit on my second listen. So we have
these four characters, these four children, Gilbert, Maddie, Lubin, and
Nellie, two boys and two girls, and well I say children, but
one of them, the youngest is eleven, and they go all the way
up to age fifteen, so I guess teenagers. But it's it's weird because
we have this framing of this narrator who's telling you this story, and she's
she says, welcome to the Land of Story. And then when we get
into the story itself, then we have this character named mister Learning and he
says, we're going to the land of Learning, and it's just like these
it's layers within layers of these things. And then we go to this town
of was it the town of Education? And so it's just all these layers
of places. So it's like where are we Are we in the land of
Story? Are we in the in the land of learning? Where is this
taking place? What is this world where this thing is happening? Yeah,
I don't think I was really confused about that, But for the narrator thing,
I actually I think it was good. Like I really like Bliss of
Disney's voice. I've heard her narrate some stuff for abide and her voice,
just as her regular voice, is just so soothing, and she has such
a great warmth to this character. And it's kind of a bit of whimsy.
And it is an allegory. And the last thing we had an allegory
and lamp Ladder was the Giant Killer, which we had the father in that
as on the narrator, And I know you love this story so night the
splendid way. I've only heard it once. I wasn't really pressed with it
when I first heard it. But was there a narrator in that one?
Do you remember? There is? But he is a character, He's another
Knight who is telling the story, and he actually shows up in the story
itself. Okay, well, I'm thinking me, that's the only reason why
there's a narrator in this lamp Layer theaters all the allegories is because with the
allegory you have to sometimes explain a little bit more than it's probably harder to
put into dialogue to make it sound natural. So I think the storytelling device
for the narrator I think worked, and list of Disney just pulls it off
great. And also it's the first time as a female narrator for a lamp
letter theater. There's other two would being male narrator, so I think it
would differentiated itself pretty well. Yeah. Yeah, she does a fantastic job.
I have no complaints there at all. This one is so on the
nose though, there's like nothing to explain, Like it's very obvious what everything
represents and what it's what the lesson is. So that's why it kind of
felt a little unnecessary. And I should also say too that my gripe with
this one is entirely just the story. Like the actors, every single one
of them more great. There were some really standout performances, which we'll get
to in a little bit. The sound design was wonderful, That music was
fantastic, So I have no issues at all with the production values or any
of the acting. That was all fantastic. So I know you weren't too
keen on this drama being an allegory since there's been a couple in the past.
Did they have anything go into your mindset, like kind of your expectations,
Oh, it's just another allegory. Did that you think that kind of
affected it? No, Generally speaking, I'm just I'm not a huge fan
of allegories that are this style, this direct one to one kind of allegory.
Though I do love Pilgrim's Progress and I loved Sir Knight of the Splendid
Way, So there are exceptions. So I guess when I heard about it,
I was just not I was not excited necessarily about it. I'm like,
Okay, it's a it's an audio drama. I will listen to it.
But you know, certain ones like Shipwrecked or The Hidden Hand. When
I heard the premise of the story, I was really excited and really looking
forward to hearing this. I did not have that with this one. But
as I go into these, I'm going in fresh. I try not to
have any preconceived notions and just be objective as I'm listening to it. So
I think I was able to do that, and I really just I think
it was just the story itself just did not appeal to me. I do
think this one is probably one that's geared towards a younger audience. The whole
the whole story is all about growth as as a person and going through education,
because I mean, when we have this this this town of education,
so the entire thing is an allegory about learning, and it's got some very
basic things math and history and so those kind of things. So I think
generally most lamp ladders would appeal to a wider demographic. This one felt very
much like it was aimed at at a younger demographic. We've talked about this.
No, no, no, it's not a bad thing at all,
and you and I both enjoy programming that is aimed at kids. I mean,
we listen to a lot of stuff that's not aimed at adults, and
I can still get into them. So I really can't pinpoint exactly what it
is about this one that just didn't connect with me. But yeah, yeah,
I as I was listening to it again, I was really trying to
think, what is it and trying to figure it out why I'm just not
enthused about this one. But I just I just don't know for sure.
I will say, the weird thing about this mister learning, who is this
sort of mentor for the children Mom leaves and he's I guess I think they
called him their guardian. Yeah, I think so, And so he's sort
of mentoring them from a distance, though he doesn't he's not with him throughout
the story. He only shows up a few times. But he's a human
being, right, So he's not a creature or some weird being. He's
a human being. But he eats paper and he drinks ink. It was
just weird. That was just strange that the style designed for that was great.
Alan Hurley did such a great job of that. Nato make him that
kind of slurping sounds and things like that. Oh, it was so much
fun. But I understand, but not everybody acts as a normal human does
in this. Like there's some people, especially in the town, like the
alphabet guy, I think, and some of them like like the whole thing
is kind of this heightened sense of this is like an exemplification or kind of
a personification, I guess, is the word of these different attributes or these
different subjects or things like that, And like they kind of think it odd,
but they that might be just being a notice kind of winking at the
audience. Scott, we know this is odd. But I don't know if
that was a good thing for them to kind of do that. I think
the music and just the narrator describing that would have been enough, because other
odd stuff happens which would happened in real life. But since this is like
a straight allegory, I guess it's what's called then. I don't think it
was deserved for them to kind of call that out as being odd. And
if it was actually human being in a real regular story, yeah, that'd
be really odd. But I think it works for the style of the story,
which for this story, I I kind of came in with kind of
little expectations too, Like I wasn't super enthused it was another allegory, but
I was okay with it. I mean, I was the main drawal for
me, I think, because I know lamp Layer Theaters always has great quality
productions. I was also wanting to hear the bookends. I was wanting to
hear the storylines what's happened with Finnie and Jones. And I actually I made
gifts of flak for saying this, but I think I like this story,
this allegory better than Pilgrim's Progress and one very big way. Okay, So
in Pilgrim's Progress, which is probably the most popular allegory out there, and
it's very on the nose on the different things like you know, the Slough
of Despair, I guess, and like the Celestial City and things like that
that story like, it's a great story. It has it's a very powerful
book. I'm sure John Bunyan was led by God to write that. It's
been one of the most impactful books. I think, like the next to
the Bible. It's the best selling book in the world's history, I believe.
But the thing is with the Pokerim's Progress, it's very it doesn't really
follow a normal story arc, like you're different acts structures. There's not much
growth for Christian after he loses his burden at the cross. A lot of
it's just him making a mistake, getting out of it, going on make
a mistake. It's very kind of the same thing just on a different location.
But with this especially since you have like three kind of protagonists to a
certain extent, even though all of them are necessarily good at what they're doing,
I felt that this story was a more comp helling even though it didn't
have, you know, like the dragons and the volcanoes and the sword fights
and all that that we have in Pilgrim's Progress. I felt I connected with
the characters, even though it was an allegory at this level that the characters
I felt had different points where they were either degrading and how they were acting,
or an improvement to certain extent. I felt like at the end of
the story things had really progressed, like the characters actually went through development.
I mean, some characters are more or less the same throughout the whole thing.
But I felt that this story treated regular structure for a story better than
Pilgrim's Progress, better than Pilgrim's Progress was, and I think I connected to
them, even though the story wasn't necessary for someone like me in my age
group, but I think that helped this allegory be a lot more palatable to
me because of that. Also, combined with the great score and sound effects
and things like that. Yeah, that I guess that makes sense. Although
to be fair, Pilgrim's Progress was written in the sixteen hundreds, so people
weren't necessarily concerned with a three act structure or you know, story mechanics and
stuff back then, so he'll they understand that. But for someone that isn't
a fan of allegories, like I remember hearing someone saying that, Oh,
I just don't like allegories, and I think it's a mistake just discounting all
allegories, like not all of them are going to be like Colgram's progress.
We have like the ventures anously episode World of Wotonia with the Renee that kind
of parallels Creation in the Fall, but not in a super super heavy handed
way. And then we have recently this year Glenn Haskell Slipping Past the Garden
Gate. That one's a very like without the kind of ending, it could
have been just a regular story, but it treats the whole story as an
allegory to a certain thing that people go through, and allegory I think can
be very helpful to a lot of people, even though it maybe on the
nose for certain things. Just that kind of personification of it I think can
help people see it in a different light, kind of like how when you
have like a Bible story in a new way, like passages, you see
those original truths, those original stories in a different way, and it makes
you appreciate them and understand them a little bit differently with that different view on
them. Yeah, yeah, that's true. There's different types or styles of
allegory, so they're not You can't just can't group them all together under this
one label and say that they're all alike, because they're not. That's that
is a good point, so we should mention real quickly the cast of our
main characters here. Gilbert was played by Tao Mags, Maddie by Serena Godoy
I think it's how you say that, and Lubin by Gracie Shinn who you
mentioned earlier played King Jack, and Nellie was voiced by True Gleish. Interesting
name. I've never heard of anybody named True, but that's sounds like she
could have stepped right out of this story. Yeah, and those last two
actresses you mentioned, they're they're both in King Jack, playing brother and sister,
and I have to say that it was really cool having Teo Mags in
this one. We haven't heard him in a while. I know I thought
the voice sound it familiar, and when I heard the credits, like,
wait, that's one of the British actors they had when they recorded in London.
So did they fly him out to the States to do this? I
know that's what I was wondering too, because he's the only one that I'm
aware of looking over this cast list. Unless he moved to the United States,
I guess it's possible maybe he was in LA and he recorded, because
I don't think Melissa Disney went to New York either, so she I would
assume she probably recorded there at Salami Studios where where Jess does Jess Harnell,
who I think everybody knows plays Finney and Jones. But yeah, so maybe
he was there or I don't know, maybe they remoted him in from the
soundhouse. No, because in the credits that only he mentions the Lamplider Studio
in Mount Morris, New York and Salami Studios in Hollywood. So yeah,
so maybe he was there. And I think Nato Jacobson is really slacking this
time. He only plays two people in this one, and Daniel Cross gets
to play what six people? That's amazing. Actually he Nato did four mister
Learning, mister Amusement, the carriage driver, and the workman. So okay,
two major roles in two smaller ones. Okay, but yeah, Daniel
Cross still has more characters than him this time he did amazing and his role
as Hubrew's Pride, I think it's his biggest role in this. Yes,
oh he makes the character has such a kind of a slimy, sneaky voice,
that kind of this you know, like, oh, like it's a
character that people love to hate. M hm. He nailed it. He
was so good. That was the one of the standout roles that I mentioned
earlier that we would get to. He was phenomenal and he kind of had
a feel to me a little bit like Thenardier from Le Miz, like just
a slimy kind of guy. Yeah, and he just he just did fantastic
with it. So you mentioned mister Alphabet earlier. They don't actually say exactly
what he is or what he does, but it seems like he's like the
guard or you know, the he's the watchman to the shop for um,
mister Reedwrite, because basically that's the first thing most kids learn at school.
Sure, yeah, and pray numbers right, and you have to pay a
toll to mister Alphabet to get into mister Reedwrite's shop, which again everything is
on the nose. But one thing that I did think was kind of clever
was that he's very short. Mister Alphabet is only twenty six inches tall.
Oh okay, I did not get that. That's clever. So we have
all these different locations we mentioned a couple of earlier, but we have a
Garden of Possibility, the Hill of Puzzle, the brook Bother, the lane
of trouble. The house Needful, which is where the kids stay while they're
furnishing their cottages. That this whole thing is about. They have to use
different materials and items to furnish these cottages, and then they're all given a
purse of time, and the currency in those purses is called hours and minutes.
Again, it's all very straightforward, but there were a few little clever
turns of phrase around those things throughout, and it does kind of make you
think about how you're spending your time. There's a reason why I believe that
in English we have the same word. They're spend for time and for money.
They're both commodities or currencies, and you you spend them, you use
them. And the difference, the big difference, is that you can't get
more time. You can always get more money, but you can't get more
time. And yeah, that was a great scene with a procrastination that steals
the money and he mentioned you know that, you know you can't ever get
it back, or something like that, and then he says, I've got
a fly, you know, like time flies. Yes, yeah, I
caught that too. And so one thing that it was kind of interesting is
so they all have to get wallpaper to cover the walls of their cottages.
And the wallpaper from this shop, mister Read Write. Remember this shop is
called ReadWrite, So it's all about words and stories. But the wallpaper is
themed and they make it sound like they're just images, but it's all everything
is representing something else. So there's wallpaper that has fairies on it and stuff,
and then another one that has nights on it. Well, obviously these
are representing fairy tales and stories of conquest or quests and that kind of thing.
And so the thing that I mean this is probably very obvious, but
you're you're covering the walls of your cottage with books and learning and education.
And how that wallpaper sticks to the wall is with a paste called attention,
and so it's again it's all an allegory about learning, and so it does
make you think about what type of content are you consuming, what are you
using to paper the walls of your mind? M Yeah, it's yeah,
that's pretty powerful. Did you notice did you notice the name of one of
those wallpapers? The name of one, Yeah, one of them calls it.
I think it's the print when the Prince is Sir Knight of the splendid
way. Well, yeah, he does reference that. Yeah, yeah,
However, I know kind of the reason why they had these wallpaper like what's
her name, Maddie, like paper stores with like with a lot of fairy
like little thin, cheap paper. Nellie's is a lot more I guess,
more like the higher quality or something like that. But later on, mister
Learning talks about later like about her wallpaper, and he really goes against fiction
in quite a bit way without much balance on that, Like we're listening to
a fictional story, right from a fictional book, and they mentioned Sir Knight
in this splendid way. Like I understand, you can't all read fiction and
even nonfiction. You gotta be careful what you read, Like I said,
like, you know, be careful what you paper your house with. But
I think, listen to it a second time, I kind of caught that
because I know some people to have the mindset of fiction cannot make you a
better person, or you should just stick with nonfiction, which I think is
not correct. Like I mentioned earlier, Pilgrim's Progress, that's one of the
most influential books in the entire world, and that's a fictional book, and
it's a fiction book that has deeper truths in it, and things like Oliver
Twist and at Christmas Carol, those were super influential in England and our world
to help end child labor in a lot of areas and to bring back the
celebration of Christmas, or even like Uncle Thoma's Cabin, which you know Abraham
Lincoln basically told the author of that that basically she was the one that started
the Civil War. Or so, fictional books can do a lot of good
and bring a lot of good things. But I think that balance so that
wasn't brought out enough in this. It seems like it's almost like the pop
calling the kettle black there, like this is a fictional story and you're really
putting down fiction but not telling us. There should be a balance with that
with fiction and books about learning like your textbook or like history and things like
that as well. Yes, I definitely had that thought too, because he
does, he really rips into it and he doesn't qualify it at all.
And so yeah, I did think about that too, because that's what the
Lamplighter Publishing publishes. They're all fiction. And also in Jesus told fictional stories.
So if you gotta beef with that. You gotta you gotta go back
to the Bible. Yeah, I definitely agree with that point there. It
was a little bit strange that he did that. Another one of the disciplines,
you know, we talked about, you know, reading and words and
stuff. So another one was arithmetic. So we have a mister arithmetic and
the kids have to purchase these grates. Now, I wasn't quite clear on
what these grates were for. Obviously they are for furnishing the cottage. But
what they were for, like grates over the window, grates over the fireplace,
I don't, I don't. But why they needed multiple I don't know.
It wasn't quite clear on what they were used for. But they were
called some sum some grates. And I did not pick that only I how
did I not pick that up? And you can only carry one at a
time. And they tell you to start with the the lightest one, which
is addition and subtraction, and then division is the heaviest one. And so
you know, that's the way you learn mathematics. You start with the addition,
subtraction in multiplication and then division and there's there's four of those rates.
Yeah, I might have picked that up when I first heard it, I
mean, I forgot about it, but yeah, that's that's kind of clever.
And also one of the bad habits of one of the main characters,
Gilbert or gil is that he has the capability to learn and do these things
quite well, but he takes on more than he should or try to skips
past certain things when he should be focusing on the basics. So when he's
trying to get more than one great, more than one sum, he I
think it drops some of them in the brick bother or something like that.
Yes, and it's kind of his downfall later where basically he's working really hard,
but he's doing it for the wrong reasons. Yep, yep. And
I was going to say this later on, but one of the things that
came to mind when I was thinking about Gilbert in particular, because he kept
trying to find shortcuts and stuff. And so again, this whole thing is
an allegory about the proper way to get an education, to educate yourself to
learn things, and you have to follow a process, and it made me
think of the recent adventures. Notice the episode value in the process, and
it's basically the same thing. Is you can't. You're not supposed to take
shortcuts. There's a there's a value in learning the proper method of doing things,
and things must be done in a certain way in order to succeed.
And I thought that was a that was an interesting correlation there. I you
know, it's it's totally not an actual connection, but I think maybe one
of the reasons why that popped into my head was because of Phil Lawler being
involved in both of them. But the other thing that I wanted to mention
about mister Arithmetic though, is he runs this like this iron works facility or
factory, whatever you want to call it. And the sound design inside that
shop was really cool. You had all these metallic clanks and machinery going,
you know, and it just sounded like this big, vast, you know,
huge space with all this stuff happening, and I thought Alan Hurley did
a really really good job with that part. Yeah. Well, one sound
effect moment which I'm not quite sure what to think of it, but there's
a point where I think her first name is Admira or Admira Folly list of
Disney's character in the story, and she's in Maddie's house and mister Larney comes
there and she's blowing bubbles, and I know bubbles don't really make a sound
per se, and let's really close to them. That was one point.
It sound like a little bit cartoony with the way the bubbles were popping and
blowing. But at the same time, if you don't have that, you're
not gonna have any sound with it. But I think it worked in the
story because she's very over the top list of Disney sounds like she was having
so much fun in that role. She's it's so funny to hear, like
she's ridiculous the character of Folly is and she's basically she's furnishing this room with
bubbles, but they're disappearing, but she's getting she's so giddy about it all
and mist of learning. It's just so frustrated about the whole thing. But
it's a really funny scene. And that's one point where the sound effects for
that, like, I'm not quite sure what else you would do but use
that more obvious sounds or more extreme sounds, but I could see why it
was needed, but I think it still worked. Yeah, And with this
type of story, which is not I don't think it's intended to be taken
super seriously. There are it's you know, it's definitely over the top,
and you know, I think it. I think it worked, But I
do understand what you're saying for sure, and you're absolutely right. Melissa Disney
nailed this character. That was the other performance in this one that just stood
out to me. She was fantastic. And there's a scene probably in the
last third or so, where there's this interaction with Folly and Hubrious Pride and
they're just like making these plans and cackling about their sinister plans and they were
they were they were playing off of each other so well. I really was
curious were they recording in real time with each other, because I knew I
knew that cheese in California, and you know, I'm assuming Daniel Cross was
in New York. I think they typically do record everybody at the same time.
But if they didn't, man, they were spot on. I mean,
they sounded so good, especially in those few scenes there where they were
going back and forth with each other. I think there was like three or
four little scenes. One moment was quite long where they were going back and
forth, and um man, it was it was just really, really great
performances from both of Yeah, it was a joy to listen to them.
Like again, they're the villains, but they are so and they're kind of
not quite goofy to thro extent, like they are serious individuals to deal with,
but they're not. They're not just the snow typical cookie cutter villain.
I do have to say one of the best characters and this whole thing is
the music. The music is such an integral part of this. Without the
music, I think this thing would have fallen flat quite a bit. But
John Campbell, this is probably one of my favorite scores he's done for Lamp
Lighter. There's so much whimsy and this I think, thank you and a
lot of like trombone music to do that kind of like kind of sound sounds
there for like certain things to like underscore, especially like a with the narrator
on certain things. It was just it was so different than most of the
scores I've heard them, at least doing this kind of music for this long
period, and like he had this some points in it or sound like regular
Lamp Lighter stories because of more like the action with like the fireworks and things
like that. But there's so many times where he just had these underscores of
these characters, like it's kind of like, okay, it gets into the
story, like this is not real life. It's kind of exaggerated as certain
extent. And the music nails that John Campbell did a phenomenal job on this.
I hope they I really hope they released the soundtrack for this one soon.
Yep. I would totally agree. And the word I was thinking was
quirky, but yeah, whimsy is great too. It was very different from
you know, your typical lamplighter or any score really that we've heard him do.
And yeah, and this thing was like three hours long almost, and
so that's all. There's a lot of music in there. Yeah, speaking
of music, Nelly at one point has a little bird that she keeps what
they're called content, and oh my goodness, that bird's whistle is super catchy
and well after listening to it, it was stuck in my head and were
listening to that. I was whistling some of that earlier and it's so cool,
like it's sprinkled throughout and it kind of here that near the end and
near the middle. But if you notice in the book end early on,
I think the bird that Finian has whistles a little bit of that tune too,
absolutely, yes, And the bird that Finian has says the same phrase
that this bird that thet not this one, but the Cockatoo parade does.
Oh yeah, I just try to remember its name. Fine. Yeah,
So yeah, they definitely tied in the bird thing into the book end a
couple of different ways. But that tune, it felt familiar to me,
but I could not place it. I don't know, maybe it was a
completely original for this story, but I had a feeling that I'd heard it
somewhere, but I have no idea where. But maybe it was just because
it was an earworm that it just has that feeling of being familiar very much.
If they released soundtrack, they need to have a track with just that
whistling, like an extended cut of the bird whistling. Well, and John
integrates that into the score a few different places. Yes, it's awesome.
Yeah, it was pretty cool. Speaking of the birds, we have this
whole metaphor of the cage of complacency, and that one was really good.
I did like that part, and it does tie into what's going on in
the bookend again, the whole bird thing in the cage, but Pride says,
complacency allows you to enjoy the benefits of content without any fear of loss.
And then he says, speaking about the cage, see how safe,
secure and satisfying it is. And that was just a that was a really
cool. In fact, that was probably my favorite moment in the whole thing.
I did like that whole idea of the cage of complacency and trying to
put content or contentment inside this cage so that it doesn't get away, but
that just leads to complacency, and I like that. Yeah, that was
a really great lesson and it's actually we haven't talked much about some of the
other main characters, but that's the one point really for Nellie, which I
know it's an allegory and you kind of need that person that doesn't change that
much, like most characters don't change that much, but she is almost I
mean, she's kind of meant to be like the one good person basically basically
in her siblings, almost to the point I've almost been too perfect. So
I'm really glad the part about the bird and with content in the cage and
things like that, that was one point that she failed at something it made
her feel a little more human against an allegory. It's a little bit different,
but I'm glad they had that in there. I'm sure that was probably
in the book. It helped make her a little more sympathetic, like she
has. You know, the actress for the character has a really cute voice,
and Nellie is lame and she can't keep up with the other kids as
much, so you kind of sympathize with her. But I think with a
lot of characters sometimes you want to make sure they have some kind of flaw
or some kind of weakness, otherwise they'll come off as being you know,
like basic superheroes almost And I'm really glad they had that because we have so
much with like Lubin, who is the youngest of the boys, and he's
very lazy with stuff and doesn't really want to learn as much he has to.
He loses his time and you know, it takes a long time to
learn the alphabet and spelling. But at the same time too, at one
point he does kind of not do what some of the other older siblings are
doing later and stays with Nelly. So there was a little a time or
two where he has these moments of I don't want to say saying this,
but moments of times where he wasn't doing the wrong thing, he was actually
doing something right at least for a little while. Well, with Gilbert and
Maddie, most of them, they were mostly all on the negative side of
things with just a touch of, you know, some good attributes. So
I'm glad there was kind of a spectrum on that of how they weren't all
just a one note character. Yes, yep, as you say, the
three older ones were primarily doing the wrong things, but they each had a
moment or two where they actually made a right choice. And then Nelly was
basically the reverse of that. She primarily did everything correctly and then she had
a couple of moments where she stumbled. Yeah, so there was there was
a good balance there. Yeah, and you're right. If this was a
straight, you know, your typical normal drama, it would have been weird
to have a character that just did everything correctly all the time, you know,
and didn't have any foibles at all. So yeah, but you're right
it worked with this one. And speaking of Nelly, she is the youngest,
she's only eleven, but she is the one who paid attention to what
her mother said, you know, be aware of pride, and there are
other ones, you know, just ignored it basically, and she sort of
becomes like the conscience for her siblings, like she's the one who's helping me
try to get them back on track. And at this one point she says
to Lubin, the regret of the past should motivate us to do better in
the future. Tomorrow is a new day. You can always begin again.
And I think that's probably my second favorite moment in the whole audio drama,
behind the lines from Pride earlier that I mentioned. But you know, it's
obvious, it makes sense when you hear it, but sometimes it does take
a reminder like that for us to sort of recalibrate our perspective and say,
yeah, I mean I did mess up in the past. I have done
some things that I regret. Or maybe it wasn't even all that long ago,
maybe it was just yesterday. But tomorrow is a new day. It's
you know, it's time to just change your perspective and don't let that regret
stay part of who you are. Let it motivate you to improve and don't
stay in the same place. And so I thought that was a great line
and just funny that it was coming from an eleven year old girl. Well,
the Bible says out of the mouth of babes, sure true, and
kind of a line that kind of goes along with that. A character says
at one point, willingness to accept correction is more important than a furnished house,
which the house being kind of like their mind and their learning skills with
that. But if you're not going to learn if you don't accept correction,
and in criticism too, Like I'm the kind of person I thrive on feedback
from stuff. Even if I did something wrong, I want to know about
the stuff I did right and why I did it right. But if I
did something wrong or need to improve on something, I want to know,
I want to improve. I don't want to just stay in the old rut
of how things are. I want to keep on learning and improving. Yeah.
Yeah, it's interesting that I didn't even think about this until you just
made that comment. But this quote totally fits in. And I just looked
it up really quickly because I was familiar with it and it's it's been one
that I've thought about before, but it totally lines up with this story.
It's from the Western author Louis Lamore. But he said a mind, like
a home, is furnished by its owner. So if one's life is cold
and bare, he can blame none but himself. You have a chance to
select from pretty elegant furnishings. Wow, maybe he read this book. Yeah,
who knows, Maybe he did, because it fits. I mean,
that's right, that's basically encapsulating the entire story here in just a couple of
sentences. Yeah. And also like with humility too, because we have pride
as being basically the prince of main antagonist to a certain extent, and accepting
correction and learning new things is an act of humility. And just like learning,
like I don't know all my letters, I don't know my numbers,
Like Lubin was not humble on that, like, oh I don't need this,
or I can do this myself. Like if you have humility, you
will you will learn. And you know, the Bible says, you know,
God resisteth the proud and giveth grace to the humble, And we see
that in a very big way near the end of the story about how humility
is really the key. I think it doesn't it. I think encapsulate kind
of the whole the whole story to a certain extent, because pride is the
main thing, and also folly too, and also I think maybe maybe Lady
Fashion. I don't know if they had a worrying about her or not,
but humility is the key here. If all of the kids humbled themselves in
the errors that they knew that they needed help with, and how they weren't
so important that they couldn't help someone else, it would have solved a lot
of problems. And I've heard a pastor quote someone else. I can't remember
exactly, but basically, I think someone asked a pastor about what's the greatest
grace and he said humility, and said, okay, what's the second greatest
grace? He said humility. And they went down to what's the third greatest
grace? And he said humility. If I remember the quote, write something
like that. But humility is really the key to how we live life,
because you know, we're nothing without God. Well, yeah, because if
you think about it, really the root of every sin comes down to some
form of pride. And so that's why he's the main antagonist here in this
story, and all of the other ones are just sort of his compatriots.
You know, he brings along all this other stuff if you let him in.
And so you're absolutely right that humility is the key. It's the antithesis
of pride. And so that lesson is portrayed or displayed here very well.
It reminds me of another audio drama in Pause and Tales. In one of
the Childer Valley episodes, Eva mentions, pride is just another word for sin,
and it really is when you come right down to it. Yeah,
so this is the last note that I have, really and it's a slight
spoiler, but it really shouldn't be if you think about this, because it
is a straight allegory and it is called crown of success. Well what a
success I mean? And you know you succeed in life by doing certain things.
Can only one person succeed? No, we all have the opportunity to
make a success out of our life. So I knew that there was going
to be an opportunity for each one of them to receive a crown, even
though they were all approaching this thing as if it's some sort of a contest
and only one person is going to win. And so I'm not going to
go too much more into it, because it is a little bit of a
spoiler. But I was waiting for that to show up because they kept it,
like, like I said, treating it as a as a competition,
and I'm like, if that's where this thing is going, and then I
do not agree with that. But it did not go that way, and
so I knew that was all right. I knew that it should happen,
and it did. And of course it's also a parallel for what we know
in scripture, got going to give us a crown, you know, And
so there's there's also that sort of correlation as well. I'm maybe thinking about
it too deeply, but kind of the chronic success and the way mister Learning
talks about how after another twelve months, another year, they'll be able to
show how they've done. It's almost kind of like a report card to a
certain extent, like after a year of school, you get your main grades
on how well you did and whether you get like an A or B or
C or whatever like that and kind of measure how how successful you were in
that year. Yeah. I did pick up on that twelve month thing too,
and I thought, well, it's basically just like a you know,
moving on to the next grade in school. But I didn't. I didn't
necessarily know exactly what if there was a one to one correlation between the crown,
is that like your grade, like you did that? I mean,
that would make sense, but who knows. You know. That's one thing
that is interesting about certain allegories is that some things you can interpret different ways.
Even though a lot of this stuff is very straightforward, some of it,
I guess you could look at different ways. And that verse they have
at the end, I can't remember they give scripture references for other other verses
in this story, because I know they read them from Proverbs. But the
last verse they have about the blessed of the man who remains steadfast under trial.
I look that one up and that's actually James one twelve. For some
reason, I was thinking that was like one of Paul's epistles, but I
guess not because I was the kind of thing it was like that worse about
like running the race successful or something like that. Yeah, I did notice
there was a lot of references to to proverbs, and then yeah, there
were the reference to running the race. She mentions that I think Nelly mentioned
that a couple of different times. It was one little note. I guess
I thought I thought I was done, but he did think of this.
It is an interesting thing that with most of these other allikories, like Pilgrim's
Progress or Sir Knight, it's very obvious that there is a at least a
representation of God or you know, something like that in them. But this
one it was a while before we get into because it almost feels like it's
a fantasy story. It's some you know, fairytale land kind of place where
you don't know if there really is a spiritual thing or if this is just
a morality tale. Yeah. So it's a ways into, probably about halfway.
I mean we're like fifteen or fifteen minutes or so into the second disc
and there's discs on this one before God has finally mentioned, and that was
when Nelly just says a quick prayer trying to ask for help to cross the
brook. But up until that point it was kind of I was like wondering,
is there going to be a biblical tie in at all? But it
does show up multiple times after that, Yeah, because I think like Duty
and what was the other lady's name, Duty in Affection Yeah, duty in
affection give her the book, and they don't call it the Bible. What
they call it the book, which is there are verses found in it,
but they don't outright say it. I don't know. I felt as almost
kind of because again it's so late in the process of them talking about that,
it almost felt like it was a little bit shoehorn and to a certain
extent, like they had to put it in somehow, because I think if
they wanted to do that, I think it probably should have been put in
early on and they could still do a morality thing, but really you don't
have you don't have the best morality unless you have God in the picture.
But since they're not having it like passages like with Unstein One or like Narnia
with Asslin or something like that, they didn't have a substitute name for God
or something like that. In this. Yeah, they never say the name
of Jesus. It's it's just God is mentioned just a couple of different times.
And then of course there's multiple references to scriptures, paraphrases, and some
direct quotations, but it doesn't happen until we get to that about halfway point,
when she first does that little prayer and then after that it's it is
mixed in multiple times. Yeah, it would make I think it may have
been a little bit better to have that at the beginning. Like they are
given this book at the very beginning, which has instructions or whatever, but
they choose to ignore it or something. Yeah, well, who you know,
maybe they were just trying to adapt it the way it was in the
book. So who knows. But that's all that I have. I know
that I said at the top, it is not my favorite. You just
didn't really resonate with me. But I did try to find some moments that
I liked. And again, the production values I thought were really really good.
The acting was great. We mentioned Melissa Disney and Daniel Cross, they
were the standouts to me. Nato Jacobson as mister Learning and mister Amusement both
were really really good. And also this this little girl, Nellie by True
Glish, she was really good. I really liked her voice. I think
the whole cast was really really great. And oh yeah, and I can't
not mention Teo. I mean Teo as Gilbert. He's the oldest, he's
fifteen years old, but he's just a he's a fantastic talent. Everything I've
ever heard him in he just is fantastic, So it was really cool having
him in there. He compleatly the same kind of character in Haunted Room with
Vibert m Yeah. Yeah, I didn't even think of that. Yeah,
Gracie Shin Like she did awesome in King Jack, Like I did not notice
that Jack was played by a female. She did really great in this too.
She is a phenomenal actress. And Teo Magg's his voice is so iconic,
even though I couldn't remember who the guy's name was at the time.
But yeah, they did really really well with this and Melissa Disney. I
was so happy Melissa Disney got to be involved in this project. I really
like that we're getting to hear her in more AUDI dramas than just Odyssey.
She's been in quite a few Abide stuff and The Adventum and Jonathan Park,
so I'm really happy she gets to be in more shows. Yeah, and
even though it was a very small role, a Rich Swingle as mister Alphabet
was really really fun. Yeah. I do have to say kind of like
my final note for the story itself is you think you know the ending and
you're You're not totally wrong, but there is some twist at the end where
I wasn't quite expecting those things to happen in that way. So I'm glad
that it wasn't just a very cookie cutter ending where you kind of say,
Okay, this is probably happen, but there's some kind of bumps along the
way to get to that ending. Well, I guess, I guess this
is where our opinions will diverge. You Once again, I felt like it
was very predictable, like the whole thing, because it felt like everything was
so on the nose, like I knew, you kind of know how it's
going to play out. That's another thing, another reason why I felt like
it was very much geared towards a younger audience. But and I could say
more, but I don't want to spoil anything, but I think this the
ending was a little bit different than I expected. It wasn't as cut and
dry as I expected it to be. But yeah, overall this, I
had a lot of fun with this, and I quite enjoyed it. I
didn't have super high expectations with this, so I guess that's one thing about
qube expectations Alow. It reminds me of Rachel Lynn from Anna Green Gables.
Bus are of those who expect nothing for they will not be disappointed, which
I've learned in recent years, specially when it comes to another audio drama,
to keep my expectations low on stuff. Because you have super high expectation,
sometimes they don't always get met and it can be really disappointed. So I
try to tamper my expectations on stuff a little more now days, which I
guess that's a good lesson to learn. But I was pleasantly surprised at how
good this was, and I know I need to go and listen to a
second time. I talk about listen to something at least twice get a better
opinion of it. After this, I need to go listen to Snite the
Splendid Way, because I did not really enjoy it that much, even though
there's a lot of hype around it. I know, JD you love that
story, it didn't really That one really didn't grab me that much. I
like the Giant Killer quite a bit, but like that one was kind of
a mix of two stories he had, like the real life story and the
allegor with the Giant Killer, but again that allegor was also kind of a
one note kind of thing, where it was very much like Polgrim's Progress in
that respect, which I think this one was a little more inventive and unique
to a certain extent, even though it didn't have all the action and adventure,
more of like a it's more close, like more of a slice of
life allegory than like a big epic fantasy kind of allegory that some people might
be thinking it's going to be. But I really enjoyed it, and the
bookends were I can't say at this point right now, but they were very
epic and super surprising. But overall, I think this is a great production,
and it's not one I'll probably come back to real often, but I
think for what it was, what the story's limitations were, I think it
was a great, great audi drawn production and production, acting music, and
making the story as good as it could be with all those elements. And
I will say that I'm I seem to be in the minority on this because
I was looking through the reviews on the lamp Eider website and they were all
overwhelmingly positive, and I saw several of them that mentioned their kids or grandkids
that just absolutely loved it. So, oh wow, that's interesting. You
know, maybe I'm entirely alone on this one, but as always, links
are in the show notes if you want to get your copy, and I
would say that if you do have younger kids, then they will probably like
this one and there are some valuable lessons in it. But if you're an
adult listener who likes to get these just for your own enjoyment, this one
might not might not meet your discriminating ear so, who knows. Your mileage
may vary, but if you're invested in the Fine and Gene storyline, it's
must have. I mean, that's that's kind of true. Well, thank
you again for joining me, Austin. It's always fun to talk audio drama
with you, and we'll have to do it again in an episode in the
future. Well, thanks for having me, Ja, This is a lot
of fun. Usually we're very similar in opinions and a lot of stuff,
and it's interesting when we diverge on that and whether we have different opinions with
the same opinions. It's always a joy to talk to you about audio drama.
I think it makes for a good discussion. Yep, thank you so
much, so what do you think of the show? Please leave your message
after the zone. Hi, Audio Theater Central. Hey guys, this is
awesome. How about jd Roy Andrew Minamit Victoria? Now? Yesterday I received
a letter from a big band. No time to tra I've got an email
this, I've got a package for me today. No, it's actually just
your mail. Yes, sir, rid is that time to hear what you
have to say? If you would like to get in touch with us,
you can always send an email to Feedback at Audio theater Central dot com,
comment on the show notes, or send a text to six two three six
eight eight two seven seven zero. You can also call and leave a voicemail
at that number as well. And speaking of voicemail, we have one here
from Christopher Green and he's going to share some thoughts regarding the monologue segment from
last episode number one seventy eight where I talked about audio dramas inciting specific memories
in our minds. Okay, so I just listen to your monologue segment jd
on ATC about audio drama and memories and all of that kind of thing.
First of all, I want to just say I think that the monologue segment
is quickly becoming my favorite part of ATAC. I love hearing your thoughts,
your thoughts about audio drama and this whole creative world and realm of things.
But I wanted to share a memory. I remember actually the first time I
ever listened to Adventures and Odyssey. We were in the car, and I
believe that the episode I'm blanking on the name right now, but I believe
that the episode was the one where Aubrey goes into the Imagination Station or the
Room of Consequence and there's like a virus pattern after Regis Black heard in the
thing. I didn't know that at the time. I didn't know who Regis
was, I didn't know who Aubrey wasn't know any of those things. I
had only ever seen the animated cartoons of Ventures Odyssey up to that point,
and I was hearing a very staticky radio and I'm like, okay, what's
going on? It was the Adventures was something, and so from that point
that's how I knew there was an audio drama of Adventures in Hodyssey. And
really, this is the first audio drama that I had ever heard, and
I distinctly remember that driving down the road. I remember where I was.
I remember what road, what corner, and I remember hearing that and wanting
to find out more about that. And it wasn't long until after that until
our parents cause for Christmas a collection of classic Odyssey episodes packaged together, and
that some early episodes that were able to lessen through, and then the rest
is history that led us from there to listen to so many different audio dramas
and eventually produce some of my own. So yeah, really cool to reminisce
about that. I have to say, Yeah, audio drama is awesome as
the storytelling medium that people underestimate individual world. I think the fact that doesn't
have visuals is such the strength because we're bombarded with so much visual media these
days and honestly can give you a headache. Aft well. I appreciate visual
media. I work on editing visual media daily, but I think that because
of that, it's nice to have a break sometimes and just listen to something
so great thoughts, JD. Please keep up this awesome monologue segment. I
think it's my favorite. Oh thank you so much for sharing that. Christopher
really really appreciate that, and I'm glad you're enjoying that segment. And by
the way, the AIO episode that you mentioned there is called Blackhard's Revenge.
It's a It's a great episode in my opinion, I really really liked it.
I know some people were not too crazy about it, but it's definitely
an interesting one and what an entry into the show. My goodness, I
can't even imagine what that was like to hear that as your first AIO episode
and not really having the full context of what's happening there, But my goodness,
that's that's funny. And you know, I did kind of talk about
that last time, the thoughts on audio media and why I love it so
much, and so thank you again for sharing your thoughts. I did also
have a couple other people who shared some of their memories that specific audio dramas
bring to their mind, and so I appreciate everybody who reached out. And
if you didn't send yours in and you want to feel free, please,
I would love to. I would love to hear that. Next up is
a comment from Sarah L on the last episode talking about the theories on the
upcoming Adventures in Odyssey album number seventy five, which is titled The Best Is
Yet to Come and Sarah said, when I read the synopsis and saw the
album art on the club, my first thought was, is this the last
Aio album? What are your thoughts on that? Also? Do you think
it is going to tie into novocom We had the return of the Chairman in
an album seventy three and the synopsis for the four Partner mentions research of Eugene's
Great questions. And first of all, you're not the first person or you're
not the only person I should say, which had the thought that it was
going to be the last album. I never got that idea. I didn't.
I didn't think that was likely at all, But I saw in some
of the fan communities several people had that same thought, so I thought that
was interesting. But my response to Sarah, I don't think the show is
ending for several reasons. First of all, I don't think they would title
the last album of the series the Best is Yet to Come. That just
seems like it would be a little bit cruel to me, saying the best
is yet to come yet it's the end now that I don't. I don't
see that. Also, a focus on the family has spent an enormous amount
of time and money rebuilding the EIO Club from scratch and an entirely new website
platform. Yes, it has had its quirks and kinks, and right I
know that they are working to get all those ironed out, so it hasn't
been without its pain points. But they did, you know, rebuild the
whole experience from the bottom up, and I don't think they would have done
all of that work if they were getting ready to end the show. Yes,
I think the club could still exist without having new episodes coming. I
mean because people would be still paid for access to the back catalog of episodes.
So if they did that, they would I would. I would think
they would need to maybe lower the membership fee somewhat if you're not getting any
new content, but I think that is very unlikely based on all of the
effort that went into rebuilding it. Also, Thirdly, the team has repeatedly
mentioned how close they are getting to one thousand episodes, and it seems like
that that has sort of become a goal of theirs to hit that one thousand
episode mark, and I think they're all really excited about getting to that point.
Now, will it end then, I don't know. I don't think
so, But you know, I guess anything is possible where we're getting very
close to it, but so I don't think this is the last album for
that reason. And then lastly, if they were going to end the show,
I think they would have at least let club members know ahead of time.
I can't see them just stopping the show without letting the fans know that
this will be the last. Now. The fifth reason, which I hadn't
commented because I found out after, is that Phil Lawler did respond directly to
some people who were questioning of this very thing, and he assured them that
no, this is not the last album. Now. As for the novocom
and the Chairman tie ends, I do think that is a possibility based on,
as you mentioned, the synopsis that they shared. Man, Now,
that's an interesting idea. I think it might make sense to do that.
It sounds like this does involve some sort of global plot, and so that
would be a good chance for them to wrap up that arc and address the
Eugene issue at the same time. So I think that's a great theory.
Who knows, we shall see. If you have thoughts on it, be
sure to let us know what you think about these ideas. Our last bit
of feedback comes from Easy, and he's also responding to episode one seventy eight.
He sent this text saying, Hi, Jad, fantastic podcast this month,
and I'm very excited to listen to the most important passover, which I
will do this weekend. Thanks for the feedback there on the episode, Easy,
and I hope you enjoyed the most important passover I think it is.
I really thought the team did an amazing work on that and I enjoyed being
a part of it. But he followed up that text with this voice message,
Hello Jadi. Following up, I was talking to our very good mutual
friend Rose Beastly over at and we were discussing the monetization of audiograma that you
and I have been telling up for a while. And you made the statement
at the end of the podcast this month about supporting the creators and the content
that you like. Well, it goes back to the question, and we
were just having a subsciation today, so I wanted to throw it back out
at you. How do you know what content is out there? Because we
don't live in the nineteen nineties anymore. In radio was the way that Odyssey
got to the masses, So to sort of rephrase his question. Basically,
how do we know what's out there? These days? Radio is not a
major factor, which I talked about a little bit in the monologue segment in
this episode. It isn't that much of a factor. You know, in
those early days, that was where you went, that was where you would
hear down Gillian Lane and Adventures in Odyssey, and that's where the new episodes
would be heard. And things are much different these days. So my answer
easy is three words Audio Theater Central. Yes, I know that is a
little bit self serving, but that is exactly what the goal is of this
show and our website is to help get the word out about new shows that
we think are worth your time, that are of good quality and are clean
and a great entertainment for families. Yes, there's also the element of encouraging
producers who are getting into the space, and I've done a lot of connecting
people over the years, and I love doing that as well. But the
main goal is to connect with the fans and introduce them to new shows and
have conversations about the shows that we all enjoy. So, yes, I
understand that my answer here is a little bit self serving, but that's the
whole goal behind this decade plus endeavor here. Yes, you can dig around
on podcast apps and search around trying to find things. You could go Google
around looking for audio dramas. You can check out dramafy, and those are
all ways where you can find new shows. But in all those methods,
you don't really know what you're getting into quality wise or content wise every single
time. So aside from ATC, I don't. I don't know how else
you would know. There is a ton of content out there, and sifting
through it and finding out what's worth your time is difficult, and so that's
why I'm here, and that's why I have a team of people who are
working with me to help bring you this content in the show every month and
on the blog as well. So I don't know how satisfying that answer is
to your question, but that that's kind of the only answer that I can
think of. It is tough, but that's what I'm here for. And
so that's also why if you ever find a show that you think is worth
listening to, let us know about it so we can check it out,
and if we deem it worthwhile, we'll put it out to this community.
Because we're all fans of this medium, right. We love audio drama,
we like talking about it, We like theorizing about upcoming releases of Adventures Odyssey
and all that stuff, and so this is a place where we can do
that and help get these shows out to a wider audience. Well, don't
forget. After the credits, Austin's gonna hop back on and we're going to
talk about the Lamplighter Theater bookend story arc, So stick around for that if
you don't mind a spoiler filled chat about what's been happening in those shows.
The song at the top of the review segment was Welcome Home by Sean Groves
from his two thousand and one release called Invitation to Eavesdrop. Be sure to
join the ATC Insiders, which is our mailing list where I will email you
periodically about what's going on in the space, usually time sensitive things that it
makes more sense to get out to you right away than to wait for the
next episode, that kind of stuff. Of course, you can always get
in touch with us at Audio Theater Central dot com, slash contact. All
the different ways are available there, and our show notes for this episode,
which links to everything we talked about, is at audio theater Central dot com
Slash one seventy nine. Thank you again to Austin for joining me for this
review and I'll see you next time. Thank you so much for listening.
Audio Theater Central is a production of Porch Light Family Media. Our theme music
was composed by Sam Avandanio. The show is produced and edited by yours truly,
JD. Sutter and our website he's audio theater central dot com. Let's
talk about the book ins Austin. Let's talk about that. What do you
what do you think? So let's as I mentioned in the in the main
review earlier, the last several of these have been written by Mark Hamby.
And so you know, we talked about a while back there was this whole
thing where they were planning to do an entire story about Finney and Jones and
about his life. That never materialized and we have never heard anything else about
it. I thought I remembered them saying that Paul McCusker was going to be
involved in the writing of that one, and since he's never written any thing
since, we heard about him getting involved and then he never wrote anything,
and I thought maybe he was going to be writing that one. I thought
I'd heard that somewhere I couldn't. We were talking about that a while back,
and I tried to go back and find that where i'd heard it,
but I couldn't, So maybe I misremembered something. But I was wondering if
since they didn't end up going that route and Paul didn't write that, maybe
Mark has decided to take those different elements that they were going to focus on
in this story and just start sprinkling him throughout the bookends. I don't know.
That's that's the theory that I have, though, Yeah, I think
I think it is kind of a mistake to a certain extent, unless it's
leading up to a really big just all Finney and Jones drama, which we
almost kind of got that with Candle in the Window, But with this,
it's very difficult to I know some people may have issues with I understand people's
point about this about because, like the lamp Bladder theater dramas aren't numbered before,
you could basically listen to anyone in any order. With this, if
you don't listen to an order, you're gonna be kind of lost on what's
happening. And it's kind of blessing on a curse. We're getting to know
more about Finnian and things are progressing, but at the same time, for
the casual listener, it can be kind of difficult to listen to stuff.
Now it's also difficult just waiting for it. It's like it's like even worse
than waiting for the Idel saga for the different Yeah, yeah, yeah,
it is. I mean, because it's been years and years. So if
you really think about it, it started way back in the early I think
it was maybe even in season one where we have that reference to a brother
and then that there was these little little nuggets that have been dripped out throughout
that kind of stuff is okay. Here's the other thing too, though,
And unless I'm totally misremembering, the bookends in the early days were not nearly
as long as they are now. That's true, and so they have become
more a part of each release, and so that's what makes it really that's
what makes it really difficult for the people that may not be interested in a
particular main story and so they decided to skip it because you know, it
is an investment to get these you know, thirty thirty five dollars a piece.
It's it's not chump change, you know, so it can be like,
for I know one person that like, that's fairly new to lamp Lighter
Theater. He wanted to get kind of success because Phillaller was involved in it,
but he hadn't heard some of the earlier lamp Layer Theater. So I
gave him time stamps where to listen to so he didn't hear the book ends
without hearing the previous stuff, and like, yeah, you can do that,
but it's kind of a pain to do that, oh for sure.
Yeah. We were talking about this not long ago in the Audio Drama Alliance
group and one of the members there, Bethany, she brought it up and
I hadn't. I mean I thought about it a little bit, but when
she brought it up, I'm like, oh, you know what, you're
right, I mean, well, this is what I said in the group.
On one hand, it is cool to have that mystery and that element
of you know, wondering what's going on with Finnian, but it can detract
from the overall experience because of what you pointed out, where it's really difficult
to not be spoiled, if you know, if you want to skip a
certain release or or even just because they are so far in between each release.
And then we had a couple of releases that, even though they were
full dramas, they didn't have any book ins because they were done by the
lamp Lader students, which I mean that was their reasoning for it, Okay,
I didn't necessarily understand why. I mean, if they're still part of
the series, why not have bookings on them anyway? But they didn't do
that, So yeah, it is it is a little bit strange that they
are integrating them so much. I mean, they've become such a big part
of each release, and it's like there's never going to It's like there's not
a resolution. There's constantly like little things. And then I guess that brings
us to this current one, which really got kicked off when when Finnian gets
his grandson Judah. I don't remember which one that was in, do you
remember. I think the whole ongoing store line from now actually began at the
end of Escape from the Eagles Snatch be could get that phone called his daughter,
and then from there each one has been building on the last one quite
a bit. I mean, Mike Goldenship was very small like Juda was in
that very briefly, but that's one that you could probably hear most of any
time. Quicksand was very very important, and then the ones following that,
minus the off brand whatever, lamp player, theater dramas like Dashed Pieces and
The Unlucky Wise Man. But I think part of this might be the marketing
for it, Like it's kind of it makes each drama kind of must have
to a certain extent, like you can't miss it or some stuff like with
this one, you're you're a big auto drum a nerd like me, and
we're gonna listen to it regardless. But for someone that may not be be
someone as invested in autodruma like this, having that if they're really attached,
like character Finnian, they want to know what happens. So even if the
story, artwork, the summer whatever doesn't compel them that much, they should
still get it to get that storyline. So maybe a marketing thing, yeah,
I mean, you could be correct. Maybe it is an intentional thing.
If it is, I don't think it's necessarily the best way to handle
it, because I mean it's kind of twisting people's arm to make them buy
them. I did kind of think it was interesting that. I think it
was in the ending book end on King Jack where Finnian has his joke about
being all ears and he says, well, no, not really, because
then I would be an elephant. And then in the book end on this
one Crown of Success, then Judah makes the comment about being all ears,
and then Finneyan tries to make the joke and then Judah finishes it for him
and says he needs to get new lines or new jokes or something like that.
That was really great that, like, yeah, he's gotten used some
quite a bit, and it's he's almost like a almost like an even match
for his grandfather in wits now almost. Yeah. But see that's a tie
in that you don't necessarily have to have heard either one to still have a
laugh or a chuckle about the joke, but he makes there and so those
kind of things I like. But yeah, so this this whole thing,
I mean, this one, You're right, this one is epic. It
takes things up to a whole different level, brings up to eleven. Yeah.
Yeah, So here's the thing. In the opening book end, this
parcel delivery man delivers two packages and he's like, whoa, I was only
expecting one because he gets this weird phone call from somebody that he just calls
WUG. Daniel Cross voiced him also, by the way, fantastic job,
and he's like like some sort of agent thing or something's going on where he's
like Vinnian's boss or something, and it's like what is the exploratorium and then
whole shop just affront and you're like going in this town? Who they say
they are? Jillian? Yeah? Yeah. So here's my theory is that
the second package that was delivered was the bomb that explodes in the second or
the ending booking. Does he not open it? I can't remember no,
because he's like he gets because he knew the pe package was coming, and
they had the book that WG had told them to get, and so they
immediately go off to go read it, and it's like they don't really he
doesn't really mention anything else about the second package, and so that's what my
theory is that the bad guys who are after this thing that he also mentions
in King Jack that he's like, I've got we don't know what it is.
I'm assuming some sort of artifact or something that this group is after and
he's been protecting it or guarding it there at his shop. Well, that
crew that comes in later in the last book and they start looking for something
for whatever the item is before they look for him. To me, it's
he had it, like he had it on its way. Maybe me whatever
was in that package was what he's protecting or whatever. No, because when
he's talking to WG he he says, he tells him I have it.
I have it here, okay, okay, because he asks him where or
where I think he asks him where is it? Maybe not in those exact
words, but and Finnian tells him I have it. I mean that's the
package because he was links was he he wasn't expecting the book though, right?
No? Or was he? No? The phone call was before the
packagees showed up. So he they're talking about this thing that he referenced in
the book, ind and King Jack that he's been he because he get that
cryptic message and they're saying you have twenty four hours or whatever it was,
and he said, I wonder if they know that I have it, you
know, like, and he doesn't say what it is, and then so
I'm assuming I think it's a safe conclusion to draw that whatever he was talking
about there is the same thing that WG is asking him about, and he
tells him, yes, I have it. So except they go quite a
way unless they bring the other package with them. It sounds like the explosion
is right in the tower room that they are in and not where they left
the other package. I think I'm not sure. I'd have to really listen
to it again. Yeah, but maybe maybe he brought it with him or
something. I don't know, and maybe I was just completely wrong. You
know, you're right though, that the explosion did sound very near to where
they were, so yeah, and you're right they did go up a tower,
so who knows. But but I mean, an explosion could be really
loud, even if you're a little ways away up in the air. Yeah.
And we also to get him kind of condensing a lot of his life
story to Judah said eleven years ago, he made a difficult decision to protect
his wife or protect millions of other people, and I believe he lost his
wife April in an explosion. Lexi and Judah's father, Jacob wouldn't talk to
him until recently, at least, I think Lexi does, and he's told,
Like with that phone call, he's told not to tell Judah about it.
We think he wants to tell him about it, because he about about
tells him about it, and the phone call happens, Like, are they
you've dropping on his conversation? Yeah, the shop's obviously bugged. They're listening
in. And he since he says a specific date, April seventeenth, eleven
years ago, So I mean, there's gonna be a reason why he says
a specific date. So I'm sure that's going to play a part in it.
I was trying to figure out if there is an actual reason story wise
that he would say that date, or if that has something to do with
when Lamplighter Theater first launched, because it was longer. No, yeah,
they've been going for longer than that, so it would have been more than
around two thousand and eight or nine, because it's around the time the Odyssey
would own Hiatus. I think it was two thousand and nine. It was
right before we started ATC, which was in two thousand and ten. So
yeah, but there's there's gotta be a reason why he says a specific date.
Yeah, I'm sure party's telling him. Yeah, And then he tells
Judah that he's a target of a kidnapping attempt, and he doesn't really he
just makes a joke about it. It's like they're both joking about it for
a while before they get serious. It's like he he is so much like
his grandphold now right, like, oh, I was kidnapping. You know
there's always kidnapping. What about teen napping or adult napping? Right? Yeah,
And he doesn't he doesn't say exactly what happened to her in the first
bookend his his wife. But then in the end he says something about an
explosion, and Judah asks for clarification, and then he says, well,
let's just say and then he rephrases it like so it was he meaning a
literal explosion? I don't know if so. That's crazy that right after he
says that he has an explosion at the key word praise for that bomb,
someone to say explosion. Yeah, but I'm wondering here he talks about,
didn't need to mention them out. Something from the Middle East archaeology or something
like that. Yeah, something he found in the Negaev Desert, remember Titus
the Comraade of the Cross JRD, Like John Rays Davies comes in and they
were on archaeology together. I think I wonder how I wonder has a tie
into that Daddy is a good one. Yeah. I didn't even think about
that, but you're absolutely right. He does mention that and they kind of
brush it off and they don't really talk about it that much. Oh,
that be super cool. I'm yeah. I just listened to that one too
before Easter because I wanted to hear it again. And that one absolutely right.
Oh man, interesting too. Total side note, but since we're talking
about the book ends in general, that John Reis Davies plays himself in the
book end. He doesn't play a character. He's yeah, John Rees Davies.
Yeah. So here's something too, Um, what did you figure out
the anagram of the note? Because I couldn't figure out he keeps saying ha
via. Oh he was talking about that ha via Jade. I couldn't figure
out what exactly what he was saying there. He thought I said I have
Judah and then it actually says had the other kid's name Hugh hit Java.
Yeah, but I couldn't figure out exactly what the letters were to make it
work. So it's a pretty good speller. But yeah, I think that
if you're on a CD track name. When I put the CD in my
computer, it brought up the track name I think for that disc, and
I think the first track is called a via jade. It has a spelling
for it. Oh, so what is it? Let me see here,
let me pull this up. Crack research team is on the case. Yeah,
because I don't have the the the physical CD version with the tracks broken
down. I have just have the digital version, which is just one large
file for each disc. Because it was bugging me because I couldn't figure out
the spelling there because I was trying to solve it myself. I think.
I think it's like one word like u h, like the normal spelling of
oh uh. Yeah. I thought he was saying harror, horror or something.
Oh, okay, I was wrong. It's spelled u h H as
one word, then via V I A and then last word is j J
A d E. Okay. So the how in the world I he is
he spelling Hugh because the name Hugh is h U g H and there's no
different and that's it's a different spelling for the for the name. Yeah.
See, that's what was throwing me off because I couldn't make it make sense
and the letters line up unless the spelling on the title of that track is
just how it's phonetically pronounced. Yeah, like hugh hu huh oh, well,
I guess. I mean, it's not a big deal, but it
was just a little thing that was pothering because I couldn't figure it out.
Yeah. Well, that one was kind of like a false kind of a
false mystery or cliffhanger just for an extent, and it's resolved in King Jack,
and I was thinking, oh, is this just all for nothing?
And then he brings up, Oh do they know that I have this?
And it's okay that one and this one it's proven that, yeah, this
is a a real thing that happens. And also we get the appearance of
the ever late every later again right, yes, I think we hear Rollo
at one point, don't we? Uh huh. He shouts to Rollo too.
Finian does a side note here. I actually was out in a state
sell at someone's house recently and kind of their hallway area that had several big
bookshelves and they have one of those rolling ladders in there, like, oh,
that is so cool. I took a picture of it, but because
it'd be kind of cool to you know, jump on that and kind of
slide up and down. It's like, that's like the ultimate bookworm nerd gold
there. Yeah, there's a bookstore here in Phoenix that has one of those,
and it's just the coolest thing. I think I took a picture of
it and posted it somewhere years ago too, saying rollo. Is that you
well that you definitely want to shout go Rollo in the library. Yeah,
So any other thoughts about this one? Like, I mean, it's crazy
they have this bomb explode, these people come in and rescue them. I
think he's in a helicopter, right, they put him in a helicopter or
sound like a jet. I think he's like very physically injured. They do
like chest compressions on them at first. Yeah, I think it gives like
some oxygen or something like that to Judah or something like that. And then
they have to open his shirt to yeah, and he's like, no,
you can't do that. And then it just ends with the guy saying like,
you know, what what is this? And then it of course ends
right there, Yeah, what is under the shirt besides the obvious. Yeah,
I mean the first thing that I the only thing that came to my
mind was that he has some sort of a tattoo of some sort of secret
organization or something I don't know, or or or it's some kind of a
scar I don't know. That was the only thing I can think of.
What what? What are your thoughts? I can't say too much because I
have heard shipwrecked, but oh, okay, it is addressed. Okay,
Okay, that's all. Say anything else on this one or past bookends,
well, I don't think they could do it now. I my mom was
playing Teddy's Button a little while back, and I heard a little bit like
the first book in. It's it's kind of sad that we had several lampler
theaters without an ending book in. It'd be kind of nice that they could
go back and record extra ones for that. I know they probably can't financially
wise, but I'm so glad they do two bookends now. And I'm also
glad that the bookends now are longer. Since we're having this bigger storyline,
they're devoting more time to it rather than making it really short. That would
make a lot harder to wait until the next one. Yeah, yeah,
yeah, right, because like these days, we only get a couple a
year, whereas in the in the beginning, you know, we had multiple
every year like they had wasn't it seven in the first season they were back
when they were actually calling them seasons, And now we get a couple of
a year, which I'm glad. I'm glad they're still making them. Yeah.
I would much rather than take long time a long time than not have
any So yeah, well the good thing, I mean, I always like
listening to high quality audio drama, but with this story line, it's for
me, it's makes me look forward to the next lamp later theater even more.
And maybe a negative for some people with things happening, but for me,
it's a plus. Yeah, I'm I'm not sure where I sit on
that because I see both sides of it, you know, Like I said,
I know that it is an investment to get every single one that comes
out, and if you have a large family that you have to be feeding
and you know, keeping clothed, didn't audio drama is not going to be
on your at the top of your priority list. So I know, coming
from a large family when I was growing up, that you know, it
would have been a tough thing to be putting out money like that on all
of these So I see that side of it is, that's what Christmas and
birthdays are for. Well, the money's still coming from the same place,
regardless of if it's a yeah, we're probably going to list other people to
to get yeah, if they want to, if they want to know.
But yeah, I understand how my life was kind of like that like that
too, So that's one of the nice things about become an adult and Nick
my own money, I can buy all this stuff more. Yeah, very
blessed in that. But overall, I do love the bookends and just getting
to hear more about Finny and it's really cool. He's obviously well he's always
been a little bit of a cryptic character. There's always been something about him
that you just that you know that this guy has a backstory, right,
Yeah, there's truth been that. But at the same time, like what
kind of because we know he's had kind of a I mean, that's a
shitty pass, but like a kind of a dark past to sorta Nicks Town
some stuff, and it sounds like I may go even deeper now. Generally
speaking, a person doesn't get that kind of wisdom and knowledge to be able
to help all these people through tough times without going through some of his own.
So you know, everydy that there's something yeah, yeah, So you
know that there's something to him. You just don't know what it is.
But now that it's just been more and more again, it's been more and
more a part of each release than you get to learn little bits here and
there, and you're really starting to see what he's about. So it's exciting.
You're right, it does make you look forward to each release. So
lap Ladder teams still still killing it with these things, So good job on
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