WEBVTT 1 00:00:40.439 --> 00:00:46.240 Hello, and welcome to Open Minds Radio. I am your host, Alejandro 2 00:00:46.920 --> 00:00:54.520 Rojas, and with me, as always is Jason from Potato Land McClellan. 3 00:00:55.520 --> 00:01:00.479 I'm actually on the moon. Oh you are. Yeah, let's say it's 4 00:01:00.560 --> 00:01:03.359 let's say it's the moon today. It'll be something different next week. Okay, 5 00:01:03.880 --> 00:01:06.680 from the moon. Are you looking at the aliens up there? Tell 6 00:01:06.760 --> 00:01:11.280 us what you see. Well, I've got some very nice any alien family 7 00:01:11.280 --> 00:01:17.519 making dinner for me right now. Another one is fighting over which show goes 8 00:01:17.560 --> 00:01:21.920 on the CV. Yes, very much like us, Alejandro. Awesome. 9 00:01:22.120 --> 00:01:26.920 Well, uh that is appropriate because there was a television show on the Sci 10 00:01:26.920 --> 00:01:34.079 Fi Channel recently called Aliens on the Moon and Mark d' antonio was on it 11 00:01:34.560 --> 00:01:40.239 and he is our guest today. That is very fitting. Yay. So 12 00:01:40.319 --> 00:01:46.319 he is the photo and video analyst for Moufon. We talked to him about 13 00:01:46.519 --> 00:01:51.319 Upho tog project, you know, just because this is kind of my update. 14 00:01:51.680 --> 00:01:56.239 We're doing a lot of updates right now, so updating people on UPHO 15 00:01:56.319 --> 00:02:00.719 TOG. This is the exciting project where he and Doug Trumbull, the special 16 00:02:00.760 --> 00:02:09.159 effects Legend, are trying to create these portable UFO observation units that collect a 17 00:02:09.159 --> 00:02:15.120 lot of telemetry and data to tell more about UFOs, And we also talked 18 00:02:15.159 --> 00:02:20.599 to him about the UFOs on the Moon television show and what he really felt 19 00:02:20.639 --> 00:02:23.159 about the Moon photos and things like that, and some of the cool stuff 20 00:02:23.199 --> 00:02:28.719 that he did for him that they left out. So cool interview. Very 21 00:02:28.719 --> 00:02:32.759 cool stuff they're doing. Yeah, very cool, very cool. It's very 22 00:02:32.759 --> 00:02:38.080 cool on the Moon from what I understand. How's the weather, It depends. 23 00:02:38.479 --> 00:02:43.000 It fluctuates here and there. M depends on what region you're in and 24 00:02:43.080 --> 00:02:47.439 whether or not you're underground. It's a little more chilly than what you're used 25 00:02:47.439 --> 00:02:53.280 to out here in the Phoenix area, though I assume anything feels chilly compared 26 00:02:53.319 --> 00:02:58.639 to Phoenix. That's true. So what's not going to be chilly is this 27 00:02:58.759 --> 00:03:04.560 weekend at Contact in the desert, where it's going to be scorching hot, 28 00:03:05.280 --> 00:03:08.560 and I'll be doing a talk out there. Hopefully don't get rained out always 29 00:03:08.599 --> 00:03:13.879 it's supposed to rain. We are in monsoon season, and I know we 30 00:03:13.960 --> 00:03:19.560 just got slammed both in Phoenix and Las Vegas, the whole Southwest. Big 31 00:03:19.599 --> 00:03:23.000 systems moving in right now. So wow, next weekend, my fingers will 32 00:03:23.039 --> 00:03:25.159 be crossed for you, buddy. Yeah, we'll see what happens, Tom. 33 00:03:25.560 --> 00:03:29.120 But that should be a good time. Yeah, that should be fun, 34 00:03:29.759 --> 00:03:32.919 all right. But before we get to talking to Mark about the moon, 35 00:03:34.800 --> 00:03:38.000 let's talk about UFO news, which is something you and I like to 36 00:03:38.080 --> 00:03:44.680 discuss every week, Senior McClellan, and so let me have it. What's 37 00:03:44.719 --> 00:03:49.159 your favorite UFO story of the week? Man. We've been getting so many 38 00:03:49.240 --> 00:03:54.800 great reports from move On, from mister Roger Marsh that he's posting on Open 39 00:03:54.800 --> 00:04:00.879 mindsot TV, and I just want to highlight one here quickly that a lot 40 00:04:00.919 --> 00:04:03.840 of the stories that come in a lot of UFO reports don't have photos included 41 00:04:03.840 --> 00:04:08.560 with them because the witness didn't have a chance to take photos of the object 42 00:04:08.560 --> 00:04:13.280 when they saw it. But there was one that the incident occurred on August 43 00:04:13.319 --> 00:04:18.319 first, and this happened in the city in the southwest of Ukraine. Now, 44 00:04:18.879 --> 00:04:23.839 this guy, he was outside in the morning on his balcony at six 45 00:04:23.839 --> 00:04:28.279 point thirty in the morning and he saw this object and he had the opportunity 46 00:04:28.319 --> 00:04:33.839 to take two photographs of it, and the photos were about about six seconds 47 00:04:33.879 --> 00:04:36.839 apart. It managed to take I think five photos in total. But in 48 00:04:36.879 --> 00:04:42.480 these photos that he captured are a very strange looking object. Now, the 49 00:04:42.519 --> 00:04:47.879 photos aren't that great of resolution, as is unfortunately usually the case with a 50 00:04:47.920 --> 00:04:55.519 lot of UFO photographs, but it's an oddly strange object the shape of it 51 00:04:55.639 --> 00:05:00.800 and the appearance. And I like these photos, Alejandro, Yeah, I 52 00:05:00.839 --> 00:05:04.839 think they're not too bad. Like you said, they are not the highest 53 00:05:04.920 --> 00:05:11.839 resolution, but it's not immediately obvious what is in the photos, which is 54 00:05:12.120 --> 00:05:17.000 often the case, like for instance, he submitted Roger marsh Remoufon submitted one 55 00:05:17.040 --> 00:05:23.439 that we posted last week, just a day or two prior, over Hurst 56 00:05:23.600 --> 00:05:29.399 Castle in California. Now that I'm pretty sure is a bird per se, 57 00:05:30.160 --> 00:05:33.519 right, I think I share your opinion on that, because there's another bird 58 00:05:33.560 --> 00:05:38.920 in the photo. The colors, even though you can't see this thing's wings, 59 00:05:39.279 --> 00:05:42.480 the colors are exactly the same as the other bird in the photo. 60 00:05:42.920 --> 00:05:46.560 I think it's probably just in a flap, so its wings are down, 61 00:05:46.639 --> 00:05:53.519 so it looks kind of like a lens shaped object. So that's what I 62 00:05:53.560 --> 00:05:56.720 think that is. But when you look at these pictures in the Ukraine, 63 00:05:57.160 --> 00:06:00.319 you can't really make out what that might be. So I think these are 64 00:06:00.439 --> 00:06:08.079 pretty interesting pictures and He had another interesting description of this object. He said 65 00:06:08.120 --> 00:06:13.759 that he didn't hear any noise from the object, and he described a discharge 66 00:06:13.800 --> 00:06:18.040 of air like plasma around the object. That's interesting and it's it's hard to 67 00:06:18.120 --> 00:06:24.439 visualize what exactly he means by that, but that is one darn interesting sighting. 68 00:06:24.439 --> 00:06:28.120 Alejandro. Yeah, pretty cool one, pretty cool one. And I 69 00:06:28.160 --> 00:06:30.560 want to cheat and talk about one more thing. Oh, hey, you're 70 00:06:30.639 --> 00:06:34.279 cheating. You don't cheat often. I'm pulling an Aleandro. I've got to 71 00:06:34.279 --> 00:06:40.680 you, just do. I'm excited about this. Well, don't get too 72 00:06:40.720 --> 00:06:44.560 excited. I just want to throw out a little bit of entertainment news here. 73 00:06:44.680 --> 00:06:50.800 I know there are many fans of the popular internet meme Giorgio Sucolos from 74 00:06:50.839 --> 00:06:55.079 Ancient Aliens, and he's on a new TV show. I haven't heard too 75 00:06:55.160 --> 00:06:58.199 much about this, but it's on H two, the same network as Ancient 76 00:06:58.240 --> 00:07:04.160 Aliens, and this show he's on is called In Search of Aliens. And 77 00:07:04.959 --> 00:07:11.639 anybody who's familiar with Ancient Aliens and specifically Georgio Suclos knows that he tries to 78 00:07:11.800 --> 00:07:16.600 well, he doesn't try. He does attribute absolutely everything to extraterrestrials, no 79 00:07:16.639 --> 00:07:23.040 matter what it is extraterrestrials are responsible for it, and that is sort of 80 00:07:23.079 --> 00:07:27.240 the premise of this show, and that he searches the world. He goes 81 00:07:27.279 --> 00:07:34.120 around the world exploring mysteries, popular mysteries, and tries to find evidence to 82 00:07:34.199 --> 00:07:42.199 support that extraterrestrials. There's some sort of extraterrestrial connection. So if anybody's doing 83 00:07:42.199 --> 00:07:44.639 that in a show, I guess Georgia is the perfect guy for the job, 84 00:07:45.199 --> 00:07:48.120 right, Yeah, because he will find the et connection. Oh, 85 00:07:48.120 --> 00:07:53.560 he will. Regardless of anything that's right, he will find it. Yes, 86 00:07:54.199 --> 00:07:57.279 So yeah, I would love to hear from anybody who's seen this show 87 00:07:57.319 --> 00:08:01.759 to see what people are thinking about it. But Giorgio's got a new show. 88 00:08:01.040 --> 00:08:03.560 Just thought i'd passed that alone. Yeah, I wonder I have. 89 00:08:03.920 --> 00:08:07.720 The only person I've heard from is someone who's kind of a skeptic, you 90 00:08:07.759 --> 00:08:13.759 know, someone who's into UFOs and does I think the phenomenon is interesting and 91 00:08:13.959 --> 00:08:20.519 a valid one. But and he didn't have much positive to say about the 92 00:08:20.600 --> 00:08:24.439 show. But yeah, I'd like to hear from others. Yeah, I 93 00:08:24.439 --> 00:08:28.040 see what people think. It's an interesting concept. I do like exploring and 94 00:08:28.600 --> 00:08:33.679 entertaining the possibilities. But I would hope in doing that that it would be 95 00:08:35.399 --> 00:08:41.600 objective. And you know they do go and talk with scientists, witnesses, 96 00:08:41.639 --> 00:08:46.519 and experts, but I have a feeling, this is just my assumptions here, 97 00:08:48.159 --> 00:08:56.279 that they only show people who further and enhance and support that theory or 98 00:08:56.320 --> 00:09:01.200 the evidence that could possibly suggest that something has an extraterrestrial connec. I would 99 00:09:01.279 --> 00:09:07.720 like to see also talking to the scientists, witnesses and experts who don't necessarily 100 00:09:07.759 --> 00:09:11.039 agree with that theory, so you have both sides, so you can see 101 00:09:11.039 --> 00:09:16.279 both sides of the arguments and take the evidence for what it's worth. Yeah, 102 00:09:16.399 --> 00:09:20.240 that would be nice if they did that, but they don't. But 103 00:09:20.360 --> 00:09:26.879 they don't. All right, those are my stories that I cheated with this 104 00:09:26.960 --> 00:09:30.120 week. All right, Yeah, you know what, I think I'll bring 105 00:09:30.320 --> 00:09:33.799 up the big one because I want to hear what you have to say about 106 00:09:33.799 --> 00:09:39.039 this one too, because maybe the biggest sighting last week, or the one 107 00:09:39.080 --> 00:09:43.879 that made the biggest news, was one that happened last weekend, not this 108 00:09:45.679 --> 00:09:48.480 recent weekend, but the one prior, and that was in Toronto, where 109 00:09:48.519 --> 00:09:56.200 a bunch of people tweeted pictures of UFOs or posted those on YouTube. There 110 00:09:56.240 --> 00:10:01.879 were some videos as well, and some interesting It seemed like a string of 111 00:10:01.080 --> 00:10:07.960 UFOs across this kind of suburb of Toronto. It's actually a section that is 112 00:10:09.080 --> 00:10:15.799 inside of the more urban area of Toronto called North York. But yeah, 113 00:10:15.840 --> 00:10:20.799 it's kind of interesting. All of the sightings were centered around this park and 114 00:10:22.600 --> 00:10:28.240 supposedly there might have been and people suggested this. Police even suggested this, 115 00:10:28.440 --> 00:10:35.159 but it wasn't for sure that there were kites night kites being flown in this 116 00:10:35.360 --> 00:10:39.519 park. There were many people who saw it. There were police officers who 117 00:10:39.600 --> 00:10:43.679 saw it. Some of those one of those police officers actually tweeted that he 118 00:10:43.840 --> 00:10:46.320 saw it and he said, oh my gosh, this is the first time 119 00:10:46.320 --> 00:10:52.080 I've actually gotten a UFO report. And this guy was serious and he laughed 120 00:10:52.080 --> 00:10:54.440 about it, kind of was making fun of it. He then tagged it 121 00:10:54.600 --> 00:11:01.840 quad copter. Him and other police that these things might be, you know, 122 00:11:01.759 --> 00:11:05.639 drones or something like that, but they are in a line across the 123 00:11:05.639 --> 00:11:09.200 city. Now, because they're in a line across the city, I at 124 00:11:09.240 --> 00:11:13.840 first thought maybe they are Chinese lanterns, because when you float those, you 125 00:11:13.879 --> 00:11:16.440 know, you usually do a few and the wind takes them and they're in 126 00:11:16.440 --> 00:11:22.440 a line However, they do seem to glisten with different colors, multiple colors. 127 00:11:22.919 --> 00:11:26.799 One of the ladies said she saw like this light coming down off of 128 00:11:26.879 --> 00:11:31.960 it that kind of looked like she said, sparkling diamond would just fit with 129 00:11:33.039 --> 00:11:37.159 the kites, because a lot of these kites will have some string or some 130 00:11:37.320 --> 00:11:39.840 lights along the string, and I posted a picture of an example of that. 131 00:11:41.399 --> 00:11:46.759 So I don't know. I get the filling these are something terrestrial because 132 00:11:46.799 --> 00:11:50.840 the lights kind of look led ish, but I don't know what At this 133 00:11:50.039 --> 00:11:54.279 point, I personally don't know that I have figured out exactly what this is. 134 00:11:54.360 --> 00:11:56.759 What do you think you did you look at some of that stuff? 135 00:11:58.159 --> 00:12:03.080 I will echo your I don't know at this point, but at the same 136 00:12:03.120 --> 00:12:09.000 time also agree with you that I'm leaning towards some sort of terrestrial object illuminated 137 00:12:09.039 --> 00:12:13.279 by LED lights, multi colored led lights, and the fact that the two 138 00:12:13.399 --> 00:12:20.039 elements there the in a line and really centered around a park. Those are 139 00:12:20.159 --> 00:12:24.960 really strong signals that it's most likely something like heights with LEDs, but they 140 00:12:24.039 --> 00:12:30.440 are interesting in appearance, and I think it's amazing and really cool with deciding 141 00:12:30.799 --> 00:12:35.080 that so many people did see these things and post about it and I hope 142 00:12:35.080 --> 00:12:37.679 we start seeing more of that, because a lot of times there are really 143 00:12:37.720 --> 00:12:43.080 interesting objects in the sky and we'll hear about it from one person who managed 144 00:12:43.120 --> 00:12:46.879 to take a picture. And you know, that's unusual because if it was 145 00:12:46.519 --> 00:12:50.320 that object in a big city, you would think a lot of people would 146 00:12:50.399 --> 00:12:52.080 have seen it and reported it, and that's not always the case. But 147 00:12:52.120 --> 00:12:54.639 this one, you're right. There were so many people posting about it, 148 00:12:54.879 --> 00:13:01.399 and I love that police officer who posted that they saw. Yeah, that 149 00:13:01.559 --> 00:13:05.440 was funny. So many people tweeting and including a police officers, which is 150 00:13:05.480 --> 00:13:07.120 pretty cool. But yeah, I'm a key park. I put up a 151 00:13:07.159 --> 00:13:11.440 map with our story so you can see where the park is in relation to 152 00:13:13.399 --> 00:13:16.559 the different sightings that were reported, and you can see they were all within 153 00:13:16.600 --> 00:13:20.879 a few blocks. But the images are really interesting and the video is really 154 00:13:20.879 --> 00:13:24.799 interesting. So that one's still out there. We'll see if we hear more. 155 00:13:26.200 --> 00:13:30.279 I don't know that we will hear more, but really, there were 156 00:13:30.320 --> 00:13:33.960 stories all last week about it, but nothing really added to the story, 157 00:13:35.320 --> 00:13:37.879 nor did it appear as though there is much in the way of investigation going 158 00:13:37.919 --> 00:13:43.480 on, so any further than what the cops saying. Kind of blowing it 159 00:13:43.519 --> 00:13:48.000 off, so we'll see if there's any more. But that was an interesting, 160 00:13:48.080 --> 00:13:50.399 big story from the week, and a big story for us. Just 161 00:13:50.440 --> 00:13:56.600 to kind of cheat myself because I always do. I won't get two into 162 00:13:56.639 --> 00:14:01.559 it, but it's a really interesting story. Post by Mike Clellan. He 163 00:14:01.600 --> 00:14:09.559 wrote a story where he interviewed a lot of abduction specialists and kind of wrote 164 00:14:09.639 --> 00:14:13.720 how they feel that if you see a UFO, especially one really close up, 165 00:14:13.759 --> 00:14:18.879 how they feel most likely you have been abducted by aliens. So kind 166 00:14:18.879 --> 00:14:26.039 of a controversial opinion of course and topic, but an interesting story which a 167 00:14:26.120 --> 00:14:31.279 lot of people are reading and find it intriguing, so people will have to 168 00:14:31.360 --> 00:14:35.960 check that out as well. And I'm excited that Mike wrote this for us. 169 00:14:37.039 --> 00:14:39.840 And we're getting so many great submissions to the side. We're getting a 170 00:14:39.879 --> 00:14:43.799 lot of really good content on the website lately, so thank you everybody who's 171 00:14:43.840 --> 00:14:48.919 submitting content. We really appreciate that. And a lot of interesting reads there, 172 00:14:48.200 --> 00:14:52.879 yeah, a lot of great stuff. So you know, Mike felt 173 00:14:52.879 --> 00:14:56.720 that we should cover a little bit more in the way of abductions and stuff 174 00:14:56.759 --> 00:15:01.240 like that, and of course we're mostly following me and tw stream media and 175 00:15:01.320 --> 00:15:05.240 we do when when they write something, but as he argues in this story, 176 00:15:05.240 --> 00:15:07.480 they don't always write something. So as long as people are you know, 177 00:15:07.559 --> 00:15:13.279 writing a journalistic story that they're trying to be balanced and report news, 178 00:15:13.320 --> 00:15:16.080 you know, we're more than happy to post it. So he wrote a 179 00:15:16.080 --> 00:15:18.159 great story. So that was a lot of fun. So yes, thank 180 00:15:18.200 --> 00:15:22.159 you to the po to the submitters, and you can read all of this 181 00:15:22.240 --> 00:15:30.279 at Openminds dot TV. Yes, yes you can. All Right, anything 182 00:15:30.279 --> 00:15:33.720 else to say, Jason before you are off for the week. That is 183 00:15:33.759 --> 00:15:37.639 it for me and I'm going to go leap and bound across the moon. 184 00:15:39.240 --> 00:15:41.799 Okay, good, good, and just for you so you know, and 185 00:15:41.840 --> 00:15:45.720 for the rest of the guests. Next week, we're actually going to get 186 00:15:45.799 --> 00:15:52.759 updates from Ruben Uriarte on New Mexico UFOs because he comes and lets us know 187 00:15:52.840 --> 00:15:54.360 about that and he's got a new book out. And then we're also going 188 00:15:54.360 --> 00:15:58.480 to get Frank Kimbler soon because people have been asking about those metals to talk 189 00:15:58.480 --> 00:16:03.639 about that, So we got lots of updates coming up. Excellent. I 190 00:16:03.799 --> 00:16:07.320 like both of those guys. Yeah, awesome, But first let's get updates 191 00:16:07.320 --> 00:16:15.840 from Mark D'Antonio. I am very happy to have Mark D'Antonio on the phone. 192 00:16:17.080 --> 00:16:19.600 Hello, Hey, how are you Eejandro, Thanks for having me. 193 00:16:19.919 --> 00:16:26.320 Good and actually this shows later in the week because unfortunately we had some technical 194 00:16:26.399 --> 00:16:30.840 difficulties the last time we tried this, but things seem to be working okay 195 00:16:30.879 --> 00:16:37.759 now exactly it was probably all my fault. It was see, no, 196 00:16:37.919 --> 00:16:45.559 it wasn't. But so Mark, Mark is you are move On's UFO Photo 197 00:16:45.600 --> 00:16:49.000 and Video Analysis however, and we'll talk to some about that. However, 198 00:16:49.559 --> 00:16:55.320 something that you did recently, at least at the move On symposium, is 199 00:16:55.399 --> 00:17:06.839 you did a presentation with the the CG special effects guru, Doug Trumbull about 200 00:17:06.920 --> 00:17:12.079 UPHO TAG this new project that you're working on. Yeah. Yeah, Doug 201 00:17:12.200 --> 00:17:18.359 is a traditional visual effects artist, you know. His first project he was 202 00:17:18.400 --> 00:17:22.240 working on was two thousand and one of Space Odyssey with Stanley Kubrick. It 203 00:17:22.279 --> 00:17:26.599 was his first job. One of my absolute favorites. It's a crazy movie. 204 00:17:26.599 --> 00:17:30.400 I didn't understand it as a little kid watching it, but I loved 205 00:17:30.559 --> 00:17:34.559 all the spaceships and the special effects kept my attention and a lot of really 206 00:17:34.559 --> 00:17:38.599 interesting things that Doug tells you in the behind the scenes for just that one 207 00:17:38.640 --> 00:17:42.160 movie, a little effects that he came up with. For instance, when 208 00:17:42.279 --> 00:17:48.480 Haywood Floyd the Professor. For those who watched the movie, there's a scene 209 00:17:48.480 --> 00:17:52.799 where this scientist is traveling either to the space station or to the Moon, 210 00:17:52.119 --> 00:17:56.519 and he falls asleep and there's a flight attendant who comes in and there's a 211 00:17:56.559 --> 00:18:00.000 pen that came out of his pocket and it's floating through the sky, floating 212 00:18:00.079 --> 00:18:03.000 through the cabin, and she just reaches over and plucks it out of the 213 00:18:03.039 --> 00:18:07.960 air and puts it back in his pocket. Well, when the movie was 214 00:18:07.960 --> 00:18:11.039 made in nineteen sixty six and sixty seven and released, like I guess in 215 00:18:11.119 --> 00:18:15.240 sixty eight or so, they didn't have a lot of the same computer type 216 00:18:15.279 --> 00:18:18.200 special effects that we have today that would have made that a no brainer to 217 00:18:18.240 --> 00:18:22.720 do. So Doug came up with this really cool special effect. It's ingenious 218 00:18:23.880 --> 00:18:29.559 way to make a pen float in the air, no strings, no nothing, 219 00:18:30.160 --> 00:18:33.400 And it wasn't underwater. That's one that we've heard a lot when people 220 00:18:33.400 --> 00:18:38.960 have asked me. Yeah, it was actually a six foot diameter circular pane 221 00:18:40.160 --> 00:18:44.680 of glass and he took contact tape and he just made the pen stick to 222 00:18:44.720 --> 00:18:48.920 it ever so slightly, and then they rolled the glass slowly on some rollers 223 00:18:48.960 --> 00:18:52.240 in front of the camera, and when they did that, they're looking actually 224 00:18:52.279 --> 00:18:59.680 through the glass and filming the scene, and it looks like you're seeing the 225 00:18:59.680 --> 00:19:03.720 actual tool pen floating in mid air and the flight attendant just plucks right off 226 00:19:03.720 --> 00:19:11.319 the glass. But it's so amazing because that looks so real. I mean, 227 00:19:11.599 --> 00:19:18.079 I've that particular scene. I've tried to figure out how the heck they 228 00:19:18.079 --> 00:19:21.119 did it, and I could never I mean, I thought it might be 229 00:19:21.200 --> 00:19:25.880 a string, but they did so well with the movement. Yeah, you 230 00:19:25.880 --> 00:19:29.920 know, and Doug see so. In other words, many times the solution 231 00:19:30.160 --> 00:19:37.480 that presents itself is the simplest one, but requires the most incredible mind to 232 00:19:37.559 --> 00:19:41.440 see it. You know, we always we over complicate our lives every single 233 00:19:41.559 --> 00:19:45.119 day. You know, the UFO business is kind of like that too. 234 00:19:45.160 --> 00:19:48.759 You know a lot of people really over complicated. They look for things that 235 00:19:48.400 --> 00:19:53.440 may or may not be there and say, of things that are naturally there 236 00:19:53.480 --> 00:19:57.519 that these aren't supposed to be there. You know, certain artifacts on the 237 00:19:57.519 --> 00:20:00.680 Moon, for instance, that could serve have been created naturally, they will 238 00:20:02.000 --> 00:20:07.000 adamantly claim, for instance, that they are not naturally occurring, that they 239 00:20:07.000 --> 00:20:11.519 were in fact put there by aliens, but they have absolutely no basis for 240 00:20:11.839 --> 00:20:15.119 you know, the statements. There are some things that look strange and those 241 00:20:15.119 --> 00:20:18.839 are the things we should investigate. But you know, so we see this 242 00:20:18.920 --> 00:20:22.559 all over the place. Sometimes we tend to overcomplicate and overthink a lot of 243 00:20:22.559 --> 00:20:26.279 things, you know, But in the UFO arena, you know, one 244 00:20:26.279 --> 00:20:30.559 of the things that Doug and I hit on years ago. I've been working 245 00:20:30.559 --> 00:20:34.960 with Doug Knapp for about five years, and that is that we saw and 246 00:20:36.039 --> 00:20:40.279 we both understood, and this is kind of what brought us together that whenever 247 00:20:40.319 --> 00:20:42.880 there was a UFO case, in many of the cases, you only have 248 00:20:44.119 --> 00:20:47.440 one or two photos of the event, and they're usually pretty bad. When 249 00:20:47.519 --> 00:20:52.799 you have any photos at all, video these days is likely a cell phone 250 00:20:52.880 --> 00:20:59.119 video and you're at the mercy of the resolution of that particular camera. So 251 00:21:00.440 --> 00:21:03.480 we both realized there's gotta be another way. Well, unbeknownst to me, 252 00:21:04.000 --> 00:21:10.319 years before I met Doug, he created uphatog, which is the combination of 253 00:21:10.319 --> 00:21:17.920 the words UFO and photography. So UFO TG. Well Youphatog was a vehicle, 254 00:21:18.480 --> 00:21:23.119 actually a hum V vehicle with an opening roof and a hydraulic lift that 255 00:21:23.160 --> 00:21:29.839 would lift five or six different types of telescopes and detectors out and search the 256 00:21:29.880 --> 00:21:34.359 skies and not look just for that one photo, but for say a picture 257 00:21:34.359 --> 00:21:40.559 of it in night vision, a picture of it in a visual spectrum fully 258 00:21:40.680 --> 00:21:44.839 visual spectrum, a picture of it maybe in the infrared, or a magnetic 259 00:21:45.000 --> 00:21:48.079 disturbance, or you know, a variety of corroborating data. And that's the 260 00:21:48.119 --> 00:21:53.440 thing that we never get with UFO cases. The problem with Uphatog is you 261 00:21:53.559 --> 00:22:00.039 Patog was one vehicle, and a very expensive one at that. If I 262 00:22:00.039 --> 00:22:02.720 told you how much you know, time, effort, and money, in 263 00:22:02.759 --> 00:22:06.599 particular the tug put into this, you would just be astounded. But and 264 00:22:06.640 --> 00:22:11.079 it's not. It's like a real hound, a real military version, roof 265 00:22:11.359 --> 00:22:15.279 taken out of it. Luckily I got to be in that presentation you did 266 00:22:15.279 --> 00:22:21.359 with the board, and he showed these pictures. But and I think he 267 00:22:21.400 --> 00:22:25.400 has that video online right where people can go look at it on his website. 268 00:22:25.880 --> 00:22:27.559 Yeah, and and in the interest of time, I didn't show that 269 00:22:27.640 --> 00:22:32.279 video at the board meeting, but yeah, yeah, So what I did 270 00:22:32.400 --> 00:22:37.400 was in that presentation, what I was showing the board was the successor to 271 00:22:37.480 --> 00:22:42.000 you photograph something that we can all get our arms around and our wallets, 272 00:22:42.400 --> 00:22:48.920 because this is something that's really important, and this show is not about asking 273 00:22:48.920 --> 00:22:51.759 anyone for money. We're actually gonna get it funded in a different way altogether. 274 00:22:51.799 --> 00:22:53.759 We're not looking for public funding as a matter of fact. But this 275 00:22:55.160 --> 00:23:00.640 system is now a much smaller design. When I came on board, I 276 00:23:00.640 --> 00:23:03.920 said to Doug, I want to create something that will do you photog's job, 277 00:23:03.000 --> 00:23:07.079 but you know, just one twentieth of the size, a twenty fifth 278 00:23:07.079 --> 00:23:10.119 of the size. And he looks at me and raises an eyebrown and says, 279 00:23:10.160 --> 00:23:12.880 we'll have had it. So I did, and I came up with 280 00:23:12.920 --> 00:23:15.880 a number of designs. I came up with a design for a land based 281 00:23:15.920 --> 00:23:22.000 system and an ocean based system, and the one in the ocean looks for 282 00:23:22.160 --> 00:23:27.279 us, oh, it was in our design evolution. And the one on 283 00:23:27.279 --> 00:23:33.319 the land of courses for any aerial phenomena. But so our smaller units now 284 00:23:33.319 --> 00:23:37.079 can take advantage of new technology, new cameras, new equipment of all kinds, 285 00:23:37.519 --> 00:23:41.720 and we can leverage that and create a much smaller platter, as we 286 00:23:41.759 --> 00:23:44.000 call, and they're about the size of a large serving dish. In our 287 00:23:44.039 --> 00:23:48.160 and art designs currently, and they're going to have a camera that can see 288 00:23:48.440 --> 00:23:53.640 infrared, ultra violet visual light. We're going to have magnetic disturbance magnetic nominally 289 00:23:53.720 --> 00:23:56.319 detector. I didn't want to say it MAD, but yeah, because MAD 290 00:23:56.440 --> 00:24:00.519 connotes something slightly different than what we're doing. But but it is something we 291 00:24:00.599 --> 00:24:08.759 have. Right. So when we talked about, you know, magnetic anomalies, 292 00:24:08.759 --> 00:24:11.079 well, hey, you know, part of the problem is if we 293 00:24:11.119 --> 00:24:15.119 see a bad photo that we even take ourselves with our new system, if 294 00:24:15.160 --> 00:24:21.720 that bad photo of this thing going across the sky is also along with data 295 00:24:21.759 --> 00:24:26.039 that shows a rapid change in the magnetic field as it's going by, or 296 00:24:26.720 --> 00:24:34.039 there may be some strange electrical charge getting on our platter, you know, 297 00:24:34.200 --> 00:24:38.519 hitting our platter from this as it goes by. That's you see, not 298 00:24:38.880 --> 00:24:42.200 just an airplane or a light in the sky like a satellite might be. 299 00:24:42.559 --> 00:24:47.480 It's something else, and that's where we want to go. We want to 300 00:24:47.519 --> 00:24:52.440 get that corroborating data. But the key is we need a lot of these. 301 00:24:52.640 --> 00:24:56.039 Now. The hum V was one vehicle. What I've got and what 302 00:24:56.079 --> 00:24:59.400 Doug and I are proposing is that we're actually going to create hundreds, if 303 00:24:59.440 --> 00:25:06.079 not thoul of these mass produced systems that will allow us to get this data. 304 00:25:06.240 --> 00:25:11.359 And I've come up with a layout plan that so far has gone uncontested 305 00:25:11.400 --> 00:25:14.519 by anyone in the UPHATAG team where we're trying to it will come up with 306 00:25:14.519 --> 00:25:17.519 the best thing. And right now I think that this this will work, 307 00:25:17.559 --> 00:25:21.759 and that is we lay them out in threes in a triad like an equilateral 308 00:25:21.880 --> 00:25:26.000 triangle, and the leg between each you know, vertex of the triangle where 309 00:25:26.039 --> 00:25:32.319 each of these three platters would be in each triad. The length of that 310 00:25:33.240 --> 00:25:40.559 can vary, and then we're playing with half a mile initially, maybe one 311 00:25:40.640 --> 00:25:45.880 hundred yards for testing. But the idea is the farther apart they are within 312 00:25:47.039 --> 00:25:52.400 to a certain you know limit, practical limit, the better the data will 313 00:25:52.400 --> 00:25:56.839 be that we can acquire. Because the larger the base line or the distance 314 00:25:56.880 --> 00:26:03.079 between any two platters in this tri angle set up, the better our calculation 315 00:26:03.240 --> 00:26:07.079 can be, the more accurate the calculation can be. Now, I know 316 00:26:07.160 --> 00:26:10.400 people can do this, you know, with a four foot separation, you 317 00:26:10.400 --> 00:26:14.759 can do this triangulation. But you want to try and get away from using 318 00:26:14.799 --> 00:26:21.960 this small angle business that can really just be at best an approximation, we 319 00:26:22.039 --> 00:26:26.759 actually want to make a real calculation. So let's just do for us, 320 00:26:26.279 --> 00:26:30.160 say we have three in the triad. One of the units, the top 321 00:26:30.200 --> 00:26:34.319 one in the triangle, sees something the first thing it does. Because they 322 00:26:34.319 --> 00:26:38.839 each also have communications systems on board. I say, this is if they 323 00:26:38.839 --> 00:26:42.119 exist. This is our design I'm talking about. In the design, each 324 00:26:42.160 --> 00:26:48.200 of these has a six mile range radio on it, and that radio communicates 325 00:26:48.240 --> 00:26:51.680 with another one in the triad in its same triad and says do you see 326 00:26:51.680 --> 00:26:56.319 this? And it will either respond ac or knack you know, yes I 327 00:26:56.400 --> 00:27:00.799 have, or no I don't. And if it doesn't, it's going to 328 00:27:00.839 --> 00:27:06.079 receive the pointing direction for where it needs to focus and look. Now, 329 00:27:06.839 --> 00:27:10.119 the cameras are all around this platter, so it's going to see the whole 330 00:27:10.160 --> 00:27:12.440 sky all at once, so there's no moving parts, so it's just going 331 00:27:12.519 --> 00:27:18.440 to decide which cameras on board are going to be looking. Now, technically, 332 00:27:18.160 --> 00:27:22.839 if it can be seen, then the other system will have probably seen 333 00:27:22.880 --> 00:27:27.160 it. But if it's something coming into view, then the other system you 334 00:27:27.200 --> 00:27:33.160 see can prepare to acquire it and know where it's going to be based on 335 00:27:33.200 --> 00:27:34.440 what the other one is telling it because the other one can tell it where 336 00:27:34.480 --> 00:27:40.000 it sees it by a radial line. You know, in the distances case, 337 00:27:40.000 --> 00:27:41.880 it's at this number of you know, it's at this bearing okay, 338 00:27:41.920 --> 00:27:48.160 and elevation in degrees from me right now. M hm. Well, the 339 00:27:48.200 --> 00:27:51.400 other unit knows how to calculate where that would be for it, and so 340 00:27:51.599 --> 00:27:53.119 to look for it as well, and if they pick it up. Now 341 00:27:53.119 --> 00:27:57.160 we have two all right, and we have four or five or six instruments 342 00:27:57.160 --> 00:28:03.119 on each platter, so we have operating data from the originating detector location, 343 00:28:03.200 --> 00:28:08.720 and then we'll have secondary information that will allow us to do full triangulation altitude, 344 00:28:08.759 --> 00:28:12.599 speed, distance, all that. So, and we've talked to you 345 00:28:12.720 --> 00:28:18.680 about UFO TAG in the past. However, what you've got now is you're 346 00:28:18.759 --> 00:28:22.160 much further down the road in that you've created kind of this mock up, 347 00:28:22.799 --> 00:28:32.640 but you've also begun to identify specific technologies. So, for instance, when 348 00:28:32.720 --> 00:28:36.920 it comes to the cameras you kind of touched on this earlier, but now 349 00:28:36.960 --> 00:28:42.559 instead of looking for multiple cameras that acquire multiple different types of wavelengths, you're 350 00:28:42.599 --> 00:28:51.839 looking at the possibility and the technologies here right where we can collect a large 351 00:28:51.880 --> 00:28:56.839 amount of wavelengths with just one camera or one type of camera. Yeah, 352 00:28:56.880 --> 00:29:03.599 and of course that's that that's a multi spectral system, a multi spectral camera, 353 00:29:03.960 --> 00:29:06.640 and that is in fact what we're looking at. We're actually talking now. 354 00:29:07.400 --> 00:29:11.960 I'm getting emails fast and furious every day between our lead scientists and Doug 355 00:29:12.039 --> 00:29:15.160 and myself, and we're and the lead scientists saying, okay, I found 356 00:29:15.279 --> 00:29:21.599 this camera chip. The makers say that we're we're like way ahead of where 357 00:29:21.599 --> 00:29:26.480 they are, and Doug is saying, does that matter, And the scientist 358 00:29:26.559 --> 00:29:29.960 says, no, we'll we'll bring them where they have to go. And 359 00:29:30.000 --> 00:29:33.440 they're saying we can get there. Yeah that our lead scientists are saying, 360 00:29:34.599 --> 00:29:37.279 it's no problem getting there. I'll do it. Just give me the opportunity 361 00:29:37.279 --> 00:29:40.440 to do it, and then you guys can have the product that we come 362 00:29:40.519 --> 00:29:42.319 up with and go off and be merry and market it. We just want 363 00:29:42.359 --> 00:29:47.599 to create these new cameras and you know, we're happy to do it for 364 00:29:47.640 --> 00:29:52.279 you. You know. So there's a lot of there's a lot of opportunity 365 00:29:52.400 --> 00:29:57.160 here for development of new technology. H And you know you saw it in 366 00:29:57.200 --> 00:30:02.079 the in the quad co during Drone World. You know, as soon as 367 00:30:02.680 --> 00:30:06.599 they started doing one or two little prototypes, you know, like the one 368 00:30:06.640 --> 00:30:11.359 we created in our in our drone business here, then all of a sudden 369 00:30:11.440 --> 00:30:15.759 it explodes and the next thing you know, there's two or three hundred different 370 00:30:15.839 --> 00:30:23.079 kinds of platforms you can buy and autopilots that are smarter and faster and more 371 00:30:23.079 --> 00:30:26.440 incredible than they were just a year and a half ago. So there's a 372 00:30:26.440 --> 00:30:33.279 lot going on in these technology industries that allow us to leverage this. So 373 00:30:33.359 --> 00:30:37.319 six months from now, these companies that are saying that we're too advanced for 374 00:30:37.359 --> 00:30:41.839 them are going to say, you know, hey, we've got what you're 375 00:30:41.839 --> 00:30:44.359 looking for. But we might be saying back to them, yeah we did 376 00:30:44.359 --> 00:30:48.200 that, and we're we're another thing now. Well hopefully not so you can 377 00:30:48.279 --> 00:30:52.640 get to the actual production stage. But what I mean is we we're not 378 00:30:52.640 --> 00:30:55.599 going to let them hold us back right right. You know, we're trying 379 00:30:55.640 --> 00:31:00.000 to get all the development kits from these companies to try and to develop our 380 00:31:00.200 --> 00:31:07.160 camera systems without any flack or without any concern about you know, who owns 381 00:31:07.160 --> 00:31:11.079 what and all that. We just want to get the technology done and we'll 382 00:31:11.079 --> 00:31:14.519 give it to them when we're done. You know that. That's we're certainly 383 00:31:14.519 --> 00:31:17.680 gonna share it. We have no problem with that. And the bottom line 384 00:31:17.720 --> 00:31:22.680 is a multi spectral system is an absolute requirement because imagine if you would you 385 00:31:22.720 --> 00:31:29.240 get a video recording, say, or even a still shot taken of the 386 00:31:29.319 --> 00:31:33.079 night sky on this on this fast system. It has to be fast. 387 00:31:33.079 --> 00:31:37.359 That's a whole other issue we're have to deal with. But and suppose you 388 00:31:37.400 --> 00:31:40.240 get this image. Now you look at it and individual light image, it 389 00:31:40.319 --> 00:31:44.519 just looks like a white blob. It's all right. However, imagine if 390 00:31:44.559 --> 00:31:47.960 you would you got a you know, a slider on the screen. You 391 00:31:48.000 --> 00:31:52.519 just slide that thing to the right and you get your infrared view because that 392 00:31:52.599 --> 00:31:56.000 data just basically it's like a sliding window. You're just sliding across the full 393 00:31:56.119 --> 00:32:00.240 data and saying, okay, show me the infrared data. And as you 394 00:32:00.279 --> 00:32:04.079 slide back and forth between infrared and ultra violet, you can actually see all 395 00:32:04.119 --> 00:32:07.400 the profiles for that individual data, you know, showing up in the image 396 00:32:07.440 --> 00:32:12.319 itself. You actually see the ultra violet image, the visual light image, 397 00:32:12.359 --> 00:32:15.519 a mix of ultra violet and visual or all the way to the ultra or 398 00:32:15.640 --> 00:32:20.799 infrared and seeing just that or a mix right the near infrared with the visual 399 00:32:20.920 --> 00:32:22.599 you know, how does that look? Yeah, so there's some in some 400 00:32:22.680 --> 00:32:30.000 cases where people believe they've been able to capture a craft and infrared but not 401 00:32:30.240 --> 00:32:35.119 in the scene wavelengths wavelengths of light we see, So you'd be able to 402 00:32:35.640 --> 00:32:39.440 prove that mm hmm. Yeah. See remember this, this this whole project 403 00:32:39.480 --> 00:32:45.599 is about finding a smoking gun, and there's a lot of smoking guns. 404 00:32:45.880 --> 00:32:52.440 Yeah, technologies are in play by alien civilizations. For instance, if string 405 00:32:52.480 --> 00:33:00.920 theory is proven to be workable and fully believable, I believe ittually satisfies a 406 00:33:00.920 --> 00:33:07.079 lot of criteria that can fix problems with our standard model that we use in 407 00:33:07.079 --> 00:33:14.920 physics. I believe that string theory probably can provide a number of propulsion technologies 408 00:33:14.960 --> 00:33:20.240 that would take us sort of well dimensionally, so to speak, allowing the 409 00:33:20.640 --> 00:33:27.160 quote unquote warp drive Star Trek fame to actually exist. Now, you know, 410 00:33:27.240 --> 00:33:30.640 warp drive started a science fiction to most people. What's not really understood 411 00:33:30.720 --> 00:33:34.680 is that the concept of warp drive was around well before Star Trek and Rodenberry 412 00:33:34.720 --> 00:33:38.200 was a smart man. Okay. The idea of warp drive was the the 413 00:33:38.200 --> 00:33:45.039 the space fabric of space and time, which no one understand stands. When 414 00:33:45.079 --> 00:33:47.599 people say fabric of space time, what the heck is fabric? What do 415 00:33:47.640 --> 00:33:51.559 you mean fabric? You know, people don't get that, and I can 416 00:33:51.599 --> 00:33:54.160 totally buy that. It's a really bad analogy that's made its way into into 417 00:33:54.400 --> 00:34:05.000 you know, popular culture. But space is well, space is composed of 418 00:34:05.079 --> 00:34:09.760 structure, and that structure is defined mathematically. That mathematical structure is what we 419 00:34:09.960 --> 00:34:15.960 call all the fabric of space time. And when we say that it's a 420 00:34:15.960 --> 00:34:22.239 fabric, that's just a metaphor to help us understand what the heck we are 421 00:34:22.320 --> 00:34:29.159 talking about. It's really even to the to the most powerful theoretical astrophysicist, 422 00:34:29.880 --> 00:34:31.519 you know, the fabric of space time is still an anomaly. You know, 423 00:34:31.599 --> 00:34:37.119 we don't really understand fully how, for instance, we could create a 424 00:34:37.119 --> 00:34:44.320 warp bubble to make the warp drive a reality. What's worse is, and 425 00:34:44.480 --> 00:34:45.800 I'm gonna get to this because it has a lot to do with you photography, 426 00:34:46.000 --> 00:34:52.559 which is this system we're talking about. What's worse is when you consider 427 00:34:52.679 --> 00:34:58.639 how a warp drive would actually work with an understanding of space time, the 428 00:34:58.719 --> 00:35:01.920 interesting thing that you notice is is that your ship would immerse itself in a 429 00:35:02.239 --> 00:35:07.880 warp bubble. It's called imagine that as a sphere of influence around which the 430 00:35:07.519 --> 00:35:14.840 warp drive system will affect. And instead of you accelerating and moving through space, 431 00:35:15.920 --> 00:35:21.960 you're sitting relatively still and the universe is speeding by you. Now, 432 00:35:22.000 --> 00:35:23.800 that doesn't mean everybody on Earth is going to feel as tremendous as acceleration. 433 00:35:23.880 --> 00:35:29.480 And say, whoa Captain Ross has taken off in his ship again, you 434 00:35:29.519 --> 00:35:31.599 know, no, that's not how it works, you know. But because 435 00:35:31.639 --> 00:35:37.119 again you have to understand relativity in Einstein, you know, it's only operating 436 00:35:37.119 --> 00:35:40.079 on the frame within which those people are in the warp bubble. So it's 437 00:35:40.800 --> 00:35:45.920 you know, all intuition is left at the door when you walk into the 438 00:35:45.960 --> 00:35:49.159 world of space time, you know, And and the space time's house is 439 00:35:49.159 --> 00:35:55.039 full of all kinds of inconsistent, strange, paradoxical things, and thinking that 440 00:35:55.239 --> 00:36:00.079 just isn't normal for any rational human being. That's how I look at it. 441 00:36:00.119 --> 00:36:07.360 But that all said, that type of activity traveling through space time has 442 00:36:07.440 --> 00:36:13.400 consequences in our space. Our space is the X y Z all moving through 443 00:36:13.400 --> 00:36:16.159 time the dimensions of our universe. Now, in our universe we can only 444 00:36:16.199 --> 00:36:21.840 travel the speed of light, and we'll see that light's the fastest. No 445 00:36:22.000 --> 00:36:24.599 speed, we can't physically travel the speed of light. There's a lot of 446 00:36:24.599 --> 00:36:28.159 reasons and a lot of limitations. But if we can get out of that 447 00:36:28.559 --> 00:36:34.840 dimensional space and travel in another set of dimensions, we're not constrained by these 448 00:36:35.159 --> 00:36:39.760 restraints. That sounds like science fiction, it's not. But that all said 449 00:36:40.079 --> 00:36:44.440 in the UPHATONPHO system, when we set up, one of the smoking guns 450 00:36:44.480 --> 00:36:47.000 we want to look for is gamma radiation. Now why would we want to 451 00:36:47.000 --> 00:36:51.519 look for gamma rays? I mean, gamma rays are a naturally occurring radiation 452 00:36:51.599 --> 00:36:54.639 that occurs and the high energy discharge that it can be seen or a black 453 00:36:54.679 --> 00:36:59.480 holes that give off gamma rays. There are other galaxies that are giving off 454 00:36:59.519 --> 00:37:02.840 gamma rays and and there are sometimes you see gamma ray bursters, which are 455 00:37:04.079 --> 00:37:08.280 these anomalous objects with spew massive, copious amounts of gamma rays and in in 456 00:37:08.480 --> 00:37:12.360 lighthouse speaking directions, you know, and if any of those struck us, 457 00:37:12.360 --> 00:37:15.880 they could kill us. And it's thankfully for the size of the universe it 458 00:37:15.920 --> 00:37:22.159 hasn't happened yet. So gamma rays are a very powerful particle array. Or 459 00:37:22.239 --> 00:37:30.480 array rather radiation. Now it's a smoking gun because my new gamma ray radiation 460 00:37:30.760 --> 00:37:37.840 will be given off if an alien civilization is using a spacecraft that utilizes a 461 00:37:37.920 --> 00:37:45.400 propulsion methodology that is born out of a string theory like you know, hypothesis 462 00:37:45.559 --> 00:37:52.920 or other ultra dimensional civilization. Huh, well, it's it's it's it's very 463 00:37:52.960 --> 00:37:54.800 possible. I mean, there's a lot of ways to go with this, 464 00:37:54.880 --> 00:38:00.840 you know. But but what we're looking for is anything tangi in our dimensional 465 00:38:00.840 --> 00:38:06.199 space. Because our instruments, of course, only look within our dimensional space. 466 00:38:06.719 --> 00:38:10.519 We only have our dimensions to peak at. But there is evidence that 467 00:38:10.599 --> 00:38:19.119 there is a tangible bleed from other dimensions into ours that can be detectable. 468 00:38:20.559 --> 00:38:25.840 There could be a magnetic anomaly, a gravitational No gravity doesn't you know, 469 00:38:25.880 --> 00:38:29.840 I mean, in the world of string theory theory, gravity doesn't exist on 470 00:38:29.880 --> 00:38:32.440 our membrane. It's in another place, you know. And so if gravity 471 00:38:32.480 --> 00:38:37.880 is affected, that means something is working with gravity to change gravity locally. 472 00:38:38.360 --> 00:38:42.920 That's a huge finding. And so if we've found that that the gravity changed 473 00:38:42.960 --> 00:38:45.280 locally while this white dot went through the sky, which otherwise would just be 474 00:38:45.559 --> 00:38:50.719 a potential satellite or airplane. That's huge. So what would you use? 475 00:38:51.599 --> 00:38:57.320 Do you have plans to measure gravity? Well, actually, geologists do it 476 00:38:57.360 --> 00:39:00.559 all the time, you know. They they actually do mapping and they actually 477 00:39:00.599 --> 00:39:06.039 map the gravitational fields of the Earth and the changing gravity of the Earth. 478 00:39:06.119 --> 00:39:10.400 Because but are you uphotog unit's gonna tie into that information or is that data 479 00:39:10.440 --> 00:39:15.480 you look up afterwards? Well, it's it's one of these things where we're 480 00:39:15.519 --> 00:39:19.079 gonna have to let that one unfold. We already know how to handle the 481 00:39:19.119 --> 00:39:24.719 magnetic anomaly question, we know how to handle the EMF burst questions. Okay, 482 00:39:24.840 --> 00:39:30.360 but the you know, a gravity sensor and something that can detect the 483 00:39:30.360 --> 00:39:32.920 local changes in gravity. We just know that this is something we want. 484 00:39:32.920 --> 00:39:38.119 That's actually when I did the presentation for the Mutual UFO network board, I 485 00:39:38.199 --> 00:39:40.880 put on the bottom of the list of the main things you want to put 486 00:39:40.880 --> 00:39:44.079 on each of these platters, I put, you know, more to come. 487 00:39:44.280 --> 00:39:45.800 Well, a gravity sensor is one of those into more to come, 488 00:39:45.800 --> 00:39:52.320 and that would probably be a phase to implementation because whatever's out there now is 489 00:39:52.360 --> 00:39:55.119 going to be large and cumbersome. We want something small and tiny, and 490 00:39:55.360 --> 00:40:00.920 small and tiny doesn't mean it's less capable, but it still has a power 491 00:40:00.960 --> 00:40:04.920 requirement. We have to figure out what that is. We have to figure 492 00:40:04.960 --> 00:40:08.599 out how we would actually you know, start logging a change, because if 493 00:40:08.599 --> 00:40:12.880 you think about it, we might not see anything visually. We might only 494 00:40:12.920 --> 00:40:20.079 get a magnetic anomaly change followed by a massive gravitational shift locally. So those 495 00:40:20.119 --> 00:40:22.599 sensors then would have to have been online twenty four to seven in order to 496 00:40:22.679 --> 00:40:27.360 pick that up. So you see, we have power issues too that we're 497 00:40:27.400 --> 00:40:31.719 working out, and a lot of one of the guys that's actually on the 498 00:40:31.719 --> 00:40:37.519 team is someone who actually deals with power systems, and so this is something 499 00:40:37.559 --> 00:40:42.440 that would probably fall squarely in his left yeah, because it seems like, 500 00:40:42.599 --> 00:40:47.840 you know, one of the dangers the project runs into his scope. Creep 501 00:40:49.039 --> 00:40:52.719 creep is you know what they you know, the corporate term where there's a 502 00:40:52.719 --> 00:40:55.400 lot of cool stuff you can do. But at least for phase one, 503 00:40:55.440 --> 00:40:59.960 you're going to have to decide, here's the set of telemetry we want to 504 00:41:00.239 --> 00:41:04.159 gather. We've got to set this and move towards that to actually move to 505 00:41:04.199 --> 00:41:07.719 a prototype exactly right, And we've we've done that, you know, our 506 00:41:07.760 --> 00:41:10.400 our our first prototype is going to have a multi spectral camera that's going to 507 00:41:10.480 --> 00:41:16.840 have communications array for talking to the other platters and US. We have an 508 00:41:16.840 --> 00:41:21.079 alert system that already works, which is, you know, it sends an 509 00:41:21.079 --> 00:41:25.280 alert up to GPS satellites. The GPS satellites relay that to everybody's smartphone on 510 00:41:25.320 --> 00:41:30.760 the team or whoever is designated in the field to receive alerts from the UH 511 00:41:30.320 --> 00:41:36.440 from the platters. That's already in play, and it's a system in use 512 00:41:36.480 --> 00:41:40.519 by hikers who hike the remote wilderness and people that sail around the world alone. 513 00:41:42.719 --> 00:41:45.559 It's called SPOT you know, like a really bad dog name, you 514 00:41:45.599 --> 00:41:51.679 know, a SPOT, and it's it is and it's a really nice unit 515 00:41:51.760 --> 00:41:58.000 because we can actually kind of make it remote and what we can modify it 516 00:41:58.039 --> 00:42:00.960 to actually use it for our purposes so that anytime and see something and can 517 00:42:00.960 --> 00:42:05.239 send an immediate alert to us and then we'll know which unit it was UH 518 00:42:05.719 --> 00:42:08.559 and we'll get a summary of what it saw. Cool. So yeah, 519 00:42:08.599 --> 00:42:15.960 and so move On's participation is going to be essentially they've got boots on the 520 00:42:15.000 --> 00:42:21.920 ground all over the country and there'll be some training yet you will be able 521 00:42:21.960 --> 00:42:25.639 to do so they can help retrieve that data is that what you're looking for 522 00:42:25.639 --> 00:42:29.880 from MOFON. Yeah. Yeah. And the other thing is, you know, 523 00:42:29.960 --> 00:42:31.000 MOFON has to get something out of it too, you know, and 524 00:42:31.079 --> 00:42:36.039 we're very very sensitive to that and hopefully, you know, if the board 525 00:42:36.400 --> 00:42:42.679 does agree to allow us to move forward within move on with the project then 526 00:42:43.320 --> 00:42:45.760 and they all loved it, they all thought it was great. So I 527 00:42:45.760 --> 00:42:49.960 think that if there are any concerns, I'm sure we can work them out. 528 00:42:50.199 --> 00:42:52.800 So I'm very positive that we're going to move forward with the Mutual UFO 529 00:42:52.920 --> 00:42:57.000 network. But one other thing that's important is, you know what happens when 530 00:42:57.000 --> 00:43:00.559 we get data. You know, when we get data, where's it go? 531 00:43:00.039 --> 00:43:04.079 Does it go into lockdown? Does it go only to one person? 532 00:43:04.199 --> 00:43:07.000 How are we going to handle that? Well, my feeling is and Doug 533 00:43:07.039 --> 00:43:13.079 has expressed a similar interest. The first thing that has to happen is that 534 00:43:13.199 --> 00:43:16.679 everybody who is part of the project has to see the data first. Now 535 00:43:16.840 --> 00:43:21.599 move On's part of the project, they have to see the data as well. 536 00:43:22.119 --> 00:43:27.159 So we're certainly not going to be hiding any data. We're not going 537 00:43:27.199 --> 00:43:29.920 to hide data from the public. If we find something that's really interesting, 538 00:43:30.400 --> 00:43:32.920 we have to first vet it. We have to make sure that this is 539 00:43:32.960 --> 00:43:37.159 real data, not a machine anomaly. We have to get peer review, 540 00:43:37.719 --> 00:43:42.920 just in the real science world. You know, when I wrote a thesis 541 00:43:42.960 --> 00:43:46.760 on on on stars running away from the galaxy at high speed, you know, 542 00:43:46.800 --> 00:43:50.360 I couldn't just go ahead and write it and be done with it, 543 00:43:50.599 --> 00:43:52.639 you know, and then go ahead and publish that. I actually had to, 544 00:43:52.480 --> 00:43:55.639 you know, have peer reviews, so I had people in the field 545 00:43:55.800 --> 00:44:00.320 have to read the paper and say, yes, that's that's true. Okay, 546 00:44:00.360 --> 00:44:05.119 that's justifiable data, Yes that's correct, or well this study didn't actually 547 00:44:05.159 --> 00:44:07.559 show that conclusively. You're gonna have to use a different approach. Okay, 548 00:44:07.760 --> 00:44:10.800 you know, things like that, because that's what peer review is all about. 549 00:44:10.880 --> 00:44:16.360 You have to get right. Is this a study that you got published 550 00:44:16.360 --> 00:44:21.719 in a peer review journal? Or oh god, it was in nineteen eighty 551 00:44:21.760 --> 00:44:23.119 three, it was Wow, it was it was yeah, it was my 552 00:44:23.760 --> 00:44:30.320 for my astronomy. Yeah yeah, oh gotcha. So yeah, I know, 553 00:44:30.440 --> 00:44:32.280 huh see how old I am? Yeah, very well. I told 554 00:44:32.280 --> 00:44:37.519 you I joined moufon in nineteen seventy one. I was just a little kid 555 00:44:37.559 --> 00:44:40.199 at the time. I was not even that, but I know you weren't 556 00:44:40.239 --> 00:44:43.519 you were. You look good for your age. That's a good thing. 557 00:44:43.880 --> 00:44:49.880 Oh, thank you. So, how how close do you think you are 558 00:44:50.039 --> 00:44:57.800 to a working proto type we have? We have a few we're thinking about 559 00:44:58.599 --> 00:45:04.159 getting this camera. If we can get the first multi spectral system done in 560 00:45:04.239 --> 00:45:07.920 the next three months or so, then that's a huge, huge piece. 561 00:45:07.960 --> 00:45:15.400 We have a gamma ray detector already. We have a transponder decoder technology available 562 00:45:15.400 --> 00:45:21.559 to us, which will allow us to immediately eliminate aircraft because they admit frequencies 563 00:45:21.559 --> 00:45:27.760 that can be detected and literally, you know, identify the aircraft that's type, 564 00:45:27.760 --> 00:45:32.360 its altitude. Not every aircraft has that same particular technology, but there 565 00:45:32.400 --> 00:45:37.960 are squawks coming from every aircraft. You have to have a transponder, and 566 00:45:37.000 --> 00:45:43.840 we can detect those transponders, so we'd be able to hear that and exclude 567 00:45:43.880 --> 00:45:50.039 those. But if something odd happens, say an airplane is flying over the 568 00:45:50.079 --> 00:45:54.679 desert and it goes down for whatever reason, our system would be able to 569 00:45:54.760 --> 00:46:00.760 record that that was an odd behavior. That's the goal. Would report it 570 00:46:00.960 --> 00:46:05.239 and we would look at it and see that there was a transponder that suddenly 571 00:46:05.239 --> 00:46:08.199 stopped or whatever, and now we can report you know officially what happened to 572 00:46:08.239 --> 00:46:13.199 someone who can actually go investigate. Interesting. So yeah, there's there's there's 573 00:46:13.239 --> 00:46:15.920 benefits, you know, you know, that's that's more of a remote, 574 00:46:15.920 --> 00:46:22.639 obviously extreme one. One of the better ones is, you know, these 575 00:46:22.679 --> 00:46:27.880 systems will probably see every single media that comes in and you know, over 576 00:46:27.920 --> 00:46:31.039 the over them, you know, within a certain distance, so between two 577 00:46:31.440 --> 00:46:35.079 units, if two units see the same meteor, then we can get a 578 00:46:35.079 --> 00:46:39.719 complete triangulation of the altitude and the speed that it was moving. So there's 579 00:46:39.760 --> 00:46:44.559 a whole lot of really cool data we can you know, contribute to the 580 00:46:44.599 --> 00:46:49.599 meteor community before we ever see a UFO. And we'll see we'll see a 581 00:46:49.639 --> 00:46:52.000 lot of meteas before we see any UFO. So I'm sure that's cool. 582 00:46:52.079 --> 00:46:57.199 And it is I think I mentioned before even in your talk. Is it 583 00:46:57.280 --> 00:47:01.639 the University of New Mexico that has some sort of similar system that you've been 584 00:47:01.639 --> 00:47:07.440 able to kind of mirror work with for that purpose? Well, actually that 585 00:47:07.559 --> 00:47:15.159 the University New Mexico SkyWatch system is brilliant. It's an absolutely wonderful system. 586 00:47:15.159 --> 00:47:16.440 And I am going to talk to those people. I have yet to talk 587 00:47:16.480 --> 00:47:20.360 to them. I know that I know at the University of New Mexico. 588 00:47:20.840 --> 00:47:23.559 There's people at University of New Mexico that came to me and said, hey, 589 00:47:23.599 --> 00:47:27.199 we'd like to participate. Let us know what we can do. Now, 590 00:47:27.280 --> 00:47:30.639 whether they're part of the SkyWatch or not, I'm not sure. And 591 00:47:30.719 --> 00:47:32.320 I went back to look at my notes about that because I thought it might 592 00:47:32.360 --> 00:47:36.119 have been from the same program. But I don't have any note to that 593 00:47:36.119 --> 00:47:40.039 effect, so I might have been convoluting the two myself and my chattered brain. 594 00:47:40.360 --> 00:47:46.840 But that said, I think that it's important to understand that anyone that 595 00:47:46.880 --> 00:47:52.760 already has a network of linked systems out there like this is important to talk 596 00:47:52.800 --> 00:47:54.960 to. And I think their system is one that I think everybody should get 597 00:47:54.960 --> 00:47:59.480 on board and support if they have it, because they really have a great 598 00:47:59.519 --> 00:48:04.960 idea and I think it's absolute brilliance. We're using a little bit of a 599 00:48:05.000 --> 00:48:13.119 different tactic because our systems aren't all sky cameras. Our systems are looking at 600 00:48:13.480 --> 00:48:17.960 all sky but with individual cameras because we need more resolution, a little better 601 00:48:21.280 --> 00:48:28.039 ability to track and measure, you know, where things are on these frames 602 00:48:28.079 --> 00:48:32.239 and so forth, and all sky camera necessarily will have some kind of distortion, 603 00:48:34.119 --> 00:48:36.440 you know, that has to be corrected, and then it can be 604 00:48:36.480 --> 00:48:39.039 corrected. But I just don't like the whole fish eye look, you know 605 00:48:39.079 --> 00:48:43.159 what I mean. So we want to have as many cameras as it takes 606 00:48:43.199 --> 00:48:47.079 to get a nice flat field view of the sky, and then produce them 607 00:48:47.159 --> 00:48:51.559 cheaply enough so that we can put as many as we need. Now, 608 00:48:51.599 --> 00:48:57.920 my prototype that I showed you a picture of that we produced and not produced, 609 00:48:57.920 --> 00:49:04.559 but engineered as a computer generated rendering to illustrate it. It looks kind 610 00:49:04.559 --> 00:49:07.920 of like an Adamski UFO. I know, you said that, Yeah, 611 00:49:07.960 --> 00:49:10.480 I know, and you maybe roll my eyes with that, you know when 612 00:49:10.480 --> 00:49:15.079 you said that. But but that's okay. You know, it's kind of 613 00:49:15.079 --> 00:49:19.440 funny that that our platters are actually sort of a nod to the UFO community 614 00:49:19.639 --> 00:49:23.159 of themselves. Yeah, and it's really kind of cool too that, you 615 00:49:23.159 --> 00:49:28.559 know. We just finished a movie that premiered in Seattle through really great fan 616 00:49:28.639 --> 00:49:31.119 fear, and the movie was called Euphatogue, and it was actually a science 617 00:49:31.159 --> 00:49:37.079 fiction movie about a scientist who creates a system to look for aliens using electronic 618 00:49:37.119 --> 00:49:40.599 devices that we've always been talking about, okay, and it uses the original 619 00:49:40.639 --> 00:49:47.400 you photogh system in the movie as the units by which this scientist did his 620 00:49:47.440 --> 00:49:52.079 research. It's really clever. What's interesting is during the making of the real 621 00:49:52.119 --> 00:49:54.760 movie, we were actually working on the real thing in the background. Well, 622 00:49:54.960 --> 00:50:00.320 and how can people see that movie too? Or they yeah, no, 623 00:50:00.360 --> 00:50:02.519 they'll they'll be able to because Doug just got a hold of a theater 624 00:50:02.559 --> 00:50:07.920 in Los Angeles that's actually gonna start showing this. We showed it the in 625 00:50:07.960 --> 00:50:14.159 the seventy millimeters cinerama screen. There's only one of three cinerama theaters I think 626 00:50:14.199 --> 00:50:17.920 left in the United States in Seattle a few months ago, and a lot 627 00:50:17.920 --> 00:50:22.239 of fairly high end people showed up for that from uh, you know, 628 00:50:22.280 --> 00:50:25.039 the film industry, and we were really pleased to see them. And then 629 00:50:25.440 --> 00:50:30.559 in Los Angeles we'll get even more because down there that's the that's their stomping 630 00:50:30.559 --> 00:50:34.000 ground, that's their territory. They'll be able to make the trip, you 631 00:50:34.000 --> 00:50:37.079 know, without having to to, you know, say I'm sorry, I 632 00:50:37.119 --> 00:50:40.159 can't make it. They'll it's right there. Cool. Hopefully I can make 633 00:50:40.159 --> 00:50:44.159 the trip for that. I think you will. I think we will. 634 00:50:44.159 --> 00:50:46.760 I mean it's a I think it's a Remember what theater was I can't remember 635 00:50:46.760 --> 00:50:52.400 the actual name of the theater. But bottom line is Doug setting up a 636 00:50:52.400 --> 00:50:55.440 whole bunch of premieres for it out there with a variety of different groups, 637 00:50:55.960 --> 00:51:00.719 including some public groups of course too, and you know, maybe we'll do 638 00:51:00.880 --> 00:51:06.280 some talks or whatever. I'm not sure how he wants to approach that yet 639 00:51:06.280 --> 00:51:07.920 because it's still in the planning stages, but it'd be really interesting to see 640 00:51:07.960 --> 00:51:14.000 it all come together well out there as well. Yeah. What was really 641 00:51:14.039 --> 00:51:17.079 cool too about seeing Doug Trumbull him being such a legend, because I mean, 642 00:51:17.440 --> 00:51:22.639 you know, Blade Runner, Close Encounters. Yeah, these are two 643 00:51:22.639 --> 00:51:27.960 thousand and one. These are like my absolute favorite movies. If you're gonna 644 00:51:27.960 --> 00:51:30.360 ask me in the list my five favorite movies, those are three of them 645 00:51:30.440 --> 00:51:34.840 right there. Yeah. So, and he's worked on him, but it's 646 00:51:34.920 --> 00:51:39.320 cool to see how committed he is to this topic and this project. I 647 00:51:39.360 --> 00:51:44.599 mean, he is really into it. Yeah, he really is. And 648 00:51:44.960 --> 00:51:46.719 you know, when we were down at the move On conference, you know, 649 00:51:46.760 --> 00:51:52.280 I told Doug, I said, look, we should present this to 650 00:51:52.320 --> 00:51:54.199 the board. I think now's the time, and he agreed. So I 651 00:51:54.239 --> 00:51:58.679 went down on Thursday and I had I had to teach a field investigative training. 652 00:51:58.719 --> 00:52:01.960 So I taught my nice segment there and then Doug joined me on Friday 653 00:52:02.079 --> 00:52:09.159 and we did our board presentation and then we we actually left Saturday morning. 654 00:52:09.280 --> 00:52:13.920 He went back, I went back. I left a little later. But 655 00:52:13.920 --> 00:52:21.639 but what's interesting is Doug is exceedingly committed to this because, you know, 656 00:52:21.679 --> 00:52:27.000 although he just he's never seen a UFO. Excuse me, he he really 657 00:52:27.000 --> 00:52:30.480 wants to, you know. Yeah, yeah, he's built to do it. 658 00:52:31.119 --> 00:52:36.280 Yeah yeah, well no, he's he's just he's like, he's like 659 00:52:36.360 --> 00:52:40.199 me in the following way. We can look at the universe and look up 660 00:52:40.400 --> 00:52:44.320 you and I and and say we can't be alone. We know we can't 661 00:52:44.360 --> 00:52:47.880 be alone. We can also look up there and say, well, I 662 00:52:47.880 --> 00:52:52.599 can you actually calculate the likelihood of there being planets out there that they're like 663 00:52:52.639 --> 00:52:55.239 ours? And of course that was the famous Drake equation. However, the 664 00:52:55.360 --> 00:53:00.760 Drake equation has now been completely rewritten. There is a new Drake equation, 665 00:53:00.719 --> 00:53:08.360 and the new take puts the number of Earth like planets right now, just 666 00:53:08.360 --> 00:53:14.480 in our own galaxy at around twenty billion. Okay, yeah, that's Earth 667 00:53:14.639 --> 00:53:20.480 like planets. Now, what's understood by nearly all scientists in this field is 668 00:53:20.480 --> 00:53:27.079 that there are more planets in the universe and stars, and we know there's 669 00:53:27.079 --> 00:53:31.679 billions of stars, so planets typically have been sort of ignored. Yet we 670 00:53:31.760 --> 00:53:37.880 have a whole retinue of them circling our Sun, and we, for some 671 00:53:37.920 --> 00:53:40.960 reason throughout history have never found that to be compelling enough to say that there 672 00:53:42.000 --> 00:53:46.119 must be billions and billions of planets just nearby us, and in fact there 673 00:53:46.119 --> 00:53:52.960 are. So we are moving into this age when we're actually gonna be able 674 00:53:53.000 --> 00:53:58.000 to detect other life forms. Probably maybe within one hundred years, we'll find 675 00:53:58.039 --> 00:54:04.760 another Earth with life on it. Perhaps Doug is one of these renaissance people 676 00:54:04.840 --> 00:54:12.599 that understands this, and he wants to try and shortcut the search for those 677 00:54:12.760 --> 00:54:16.679 of those life forms that might have found us first. And we want to 678 00:54:16.719 --> 00:54:19.880 do that, and that's we all want to do that in the UFO. 679 00:54:20.039 --> 00:54:23.440 Yah course, pretty cool. So I'm going to change topics now. Sure, 680 00:54:23.639 --> 00:54:27.360 I got more stuff I want to talk to you about. You alluded 681 00:54:27.440 --> 00:54:30.639 to this earlier, but you were recently on a show on side By talking 682 00:54:30.719 --> 00:54:37.280 about aliens on the moon, and I don't think that have you seen it 683 00:54:37.360 --> 00:54:39.599 yet? I still haven't seen you haven't seen it. Well, I think 684 00:54:39.639 --> 00:54:43.920 that I could tell, knowing you that they kind of left a lot out. 685 00:54:43.920 --> 00:54:46.000 They kind of said, had you showing oh this is interesting, this 686 00:54:46.119 --> 00:54:52.400 is interesting, but they left out I think this is interesting. But not 687 00:54:52.480 --> 00:54:57.440 to say, though, that you thought you demunked all of them, or 688 00:54:57.480 --> 00:55:00.800 you you, I shouldn't say that that were making you so sensitive to the 689 00:55:00.800 --> 00:55:06.199 word it's okay, yeah, but not to say that you explained away all 690 00:55:06.199 --> 00:55:09.840 of them, because you did find some interesting. But I guess that was 691 00:55:09.880 --> 00:55:13.719 my point, and I should ask that in the question did you find some 692 00:55:13.800 --> 00:55:19.400 of them genuinely interesting? And what about the others? Yeah? In short, 693 00:55:19.440 --> 00:55:23.719 yes I did. And you know, as a as a researcher, 694 00:55:24.440 --> 00:55:28.840 I can tell you that it's one of those cases where when you look at 695 00:55:28.920 --> 00:55:35.400 data, the first thing you want to do is find the original data, 696 00:55:35.639 --> 00:55:39.039 the original frames, original negatives, or an original print from the original negative, 697 00:55:39.039 --> 00:55:44.239 et cetera. We didn't have that. I was shown one image, 698 00:55:45.440 --> 00:55:49.119 and in this particular show, a lot of the data came from a book 699 00:55:49.159 --> 00:55:53.719 on unknown lunar objects or something like that identified lunar objects. Oh really, 700 00:55:53.760 --> 00:55:57.079 So they brought this book to here and said, what do you think of 701 00:55:57.119 --> 00:55:59.519 this picture? What do you think of that picture? Well, and not 702 00:56:00.360 --> 00:56:05.360 in so many words, but they used pictures that came from this particular book. 703 00:56:05.440 --> 00:56:07.599 Yeah, and the main focus of the show was on this one particular 704 00:56:07.719 --> 00:56:15.039 person's book of these lunar anomalies. Now, I've never really followed lunar anomalies 705 00:56:15.039 --> 00:56:17.880 because in my history, you know, I see the world at high and 706 00:56:17.920 --> 00:56:22.519 low frame rates because of the film industry. I see the world in terms 707 00:56:22.519 --> 00:56:29.360 of light and shadow, and how light and shadow can be used to convey 708 00:56:29.400 --> 00:56:34.599 an illusion in the visual effects arena. So when I see something in a 709 00:56:34.639 --> 00:56:38.000 lunar image that looks like, say, a giant bridge going across a vast 710 00:56:38.119 --> 00:56:42.239 valley, you know, I look at that and say, well, wait 711 00:56:42.280 --> 00:56:45.880 a minute, how would I recreate that? Because that's my whole thing now, 712 00:56:45.920 --> 00:56:49.199 you know. I used to just do analysis and then say I think 713 00:56:49.199 --> 00:56:52.159 this is what it is. Well that's hardly any good. So what I 714 00:56:52.199 --> 00:56:54.960 do now is I'm a little bit more complete. Now I actually do it. 715 00:56:55.239 --> 00:56:59.559 I recreate these things. If I see it and I think it's something 716 00:56:59.639 --> 00:57:02.639 natural, I'll recreate it if I can. And I do this now on 717 00:57:04.039 --> 00:57:07.320 so many cases. And then and it's like with time I barely have I'll 718 00:57:07.320 --> 00:57:10.159 do this, and I still have to because it really is very helpful to 719 00:57:10.199 --> 00:57:15.519 see this. So for the giant lunar bridges, for instance, I had 720 00:57:15.599 --> 00:57:22.280 created this simulated lunar surface. It's composed of several three or four different materials 721 00:57:22.079 --> 00:57:27.280 that are layered together just like the real lunar surface. You know, where 722 00:57:27.320 --> 00:57:31.400 there's a really fine layer on the top. That's the pulverized dust over the 723 00:57:31.440 --> 00:57:37.559 eons and eons and eons of meteor strikes throwing up and smashing things into tiny, 724 00:57:37.599 --> 00:57:42.440 tiny particles. Of course, the biggest rocks stick out of that regulith 725 00:57:42.639 --> 00:57:47.760 and that soil, and it really looks, you know, like a jumbled 726 00:57:47.800 --> 00:57:51.679 mass down there. But on top of all of these are the little tiny 727 00:57:51.760 --> 00:57:54.679 particles of dust. So I recreated this and basically if I were to drop 728 00:57:54.679 --> 00:57:59.039 clay balls, and I do this as the experiment, if I drop clay 729 00:57:59.039 --> 00:58:05.360 balls into the these this regular I've made in my sample glass walled system that 730 00:58:05.400 --> 00:58:07.920 I made, then you actually see a crater form exactly the same way as 731 00:58:07.920 --> 00:58:14.000 a crater forms on the Moon. And I can simulate weathering with the system 732 00:58:14.159 --> 00:58:17.840 by using a vibration thing to actually vibrate the table and then you see it 733 00:58:17.920 --> 00:58:24.960 weather right down over the centuries of moonquakes and other impacts causing things to shake 734 00:58:25.000 --> 00:58:30.519 and dislodge, and you actually create very realistic features. So one of the 735 00:58:30.559 --> 00:58:34.239 things I created was this lunar bridge. Now you might think, well, 736 00:58:34.280 --> 00:58:37.039 wow, that'd be pretty fragile for this bridge to be supported by a little 737 00:58:37.079 --> 00:58:42.519 model like you're making. It's made a lot of soil type material. Well, 738 00:58:42.519 --> 00:58:45.079 the fact is it's extremely strong, and the reason is because it's not 739 00:58:45.119 --> 00:58:52.039 a bridge at all. It's actually two parallel valleys and the sun is at 740 00:58:52.079 --> 00:58:55.000 a low angle all right, And you see I mentioned glass wall. That's 741 00:58:55.039 --> 00:59:00.400 because we changed the angle of the sunlight on this so you can and see 742 00:59:00.400 --> 00:59:05.000 how the features change with the light. And so at low sun angles, 743 00:59:05.519 --> 00:59:10.760 there is a large valley, all right, and then another valley right next 744 00:59:10.800 --> 00:59:15.000 to it. In between the two valleys is a ridge connecting them. So 745 00:59:15.000 --> 00:59:17.039 it's like two scooped out valleys next to each other. Well, in between 746 00:59:17.079 --> 00:59:22.159 those two scoops is a ridge running between them. At low sun angles, 747 00:59:22.079 --> 00:59:27.480 those valleys look pitch black and the top of the ridge is illuminated as bright 748 00:59:27.480 --> 00:59:30.840 as can be, and of course it's weathered so it looks relatively flat, 749 00:59:31.440 --> 00:59:36.920 so it looks like a bridge. So I recreated that exactly. And the 750 00:59:36.960 --> 00:59:38.519 producer that was here, you know, when I told him about it and 751 00:59:38.519 --> 00:59:42.239 it showed him what I was doing, he just looked at me and said, 752 00:59:42.480 --> 00:59:45.360 that's not going to get in the show, which is such a bummer. 753 00:59:45.559 --> 00:59:50.039 And I'm going to criticize the show a bit here because that what you 754 00:59:50.239 --> 00:59:54.639 did is so interesting, and you do this on the NASA UFO Files, 755 00:59:54.639 --> 01:00:00.159 which I love. That's a great show. And yeah, it's explained nasophiles, 756 01:00:00.239 --> 01:00:05.639 right. It's so interesting when you do that, and it's so much 757 01:00:05.719 --> 01:00:10.880 more helpful because then it demonstrates and it really lets you know, oh okay, 758 01:00:10.679 --> 01:00:15.840 that could be you know, it proves your point, it proves your 759 01:00:15.880 --> 01:00:22.920 credibility. And this show was so repetitive it's frustrating because they kept showing the 760 01:00:22.000 --> 01:00:27.760 same clips over and over again. For instance, throughout most of the beginning 761 01:00:27.760 --> 01:00:30.119 of the show, they kept saying, we're going to go to our expert, 762 01:00:30.320 --> 01:00:32.679 and they would show you and they would show you do one line, 763 01:00:34.159 --> 01:00:37.599 and they showed that scene over and over again, talking about how they're going 764 01:00:37.679 --> 01:00:42.559 to talk to you. They showed buzz Aldrin with his one line about being 765 01:00:42.599 --> 01:00:46.280 skeptical about all of this about six or seven times. They could have taken 766 01:00:46.320 --> 01:00:52.760 that time and actually shown your demonstration, which is so much more interesting. 767 01:00:52.440 --> 01:00:58.559 And you know, for example, on The Unexplained Nasaphiles, you talked about 768 01:00:58.599 --> 01:01:04.599 one of the teather incident where it looks like there are UFOs going behind this 769 01:01:04.800 --> 01:01:07.360 teather and so they must be very large. You said, well, know 770 01:01:07.599 --> 01:01:12.360 what, it's an effect of light. And I was skeptical when I first 771 01:01:12.440 --> 01:01:15.199 heard you say that, but then and I was like, well, I 772 01:01:15.199 --> 01:01:20.119 don't know about that mark, But then you demonstrate it on the show, 773 01:01:20.480 --> 01:01:23.920 and it's absolutely amazing. It's one of the most incredible things I've seen lately 774 01:01:23.960 --> 01:01:29.039 on one of these shows. And Bush, Yeah, I loved it to 775 01:01:29.079 --> 01:01:34.119 death, and it just demonstrates how important that is, well science, You're 776 01:01:34.159 --> 01:01:37.800 right, I mean, it's important not to lose sight of the scientific principles 777 01:01:37.840 --> 01:01:40.599 that we are all capable of. And then you know, when I saw 778 01:01:40.840 --> 01:01:45.000 let's let's take the tether incident for a moment, two things happened to me. 779 01:01:45.800 --> 01:01:51.360 I did a talk in Laughlin, Nevada, which included a discussion of 780 01:01:51.360 --> 01:01:54.159 the tether incident and how it occurred. I didn't I had not done that 781 01:01:54.239 --> 01:02:00.159 particular National geographic show yet, So I think that was when we first met 782 01:02:00.239 --> 01:02:02.920 at that event. That was like six years ago or something five years ago. 783 01:02:04.599 --> 01:02:09.760 Okay maybe so maybe so yeah, But what they ended up doing, 784 01:02:09.960 --> 01:02:13.800 I think I met you in Denver before that. But that's okay, you're 785 01:02:13.800 --> 01:02:19.000 probably right, go ahead. But what I what I did was I just 786 01:02:19.199 --> 01:02:22.880 talked about how this works and how the camera you know, the way the 787 01:02:22.920 --> 01:02:25.079 camera set up, and the way the lighting is and the way CCDs work 788 01:02:25.159 --> 01:02:29.360 and the sensors and the low light, et cetera, et cetera. Well 789 01:02:29.480 --> 01:02:32.280 I did was talk about that, and at the end of it, Uh, 790 01:02:32.719 --> 01:02:36.360 out in the lobby, this guy came at me with a fist. 791 01:02:36.719 --> 01:02:39.159 He was gonna hit him. Wow, are you serious? Oh yeah yeah. 792 01:02:39.199 --> 01:02:44.599 And the next day he was arrested. You're kidding. So did someone 793 01:02:44.679 --> 01:02:47.159 stop him or did you karate chop him or something? Oh? No, 794 01:02:47.159 --> 01:02:52.039 No, I didn't have it. No, Well you're read. I never 795 01:02:52.079 --> 01:02:54.960 have any issues with protecting myself, you know, from that stuff. I 796 01:02:54.960 --> 01:02:58.599 mean, that's stuff I have been doing that for years. You know, 797 01:02:58.760 --> 01:03:01.440 but that's beside the point. What's most important? Why? Yeah, yeah, 798 01:03:01.519 --> 01:03:05.840 right, and then they feel bad and they don't hit you. That's 799 01:03:05.840 --> 01:03:09.480 what I do. Just care or they hit you harder, you a little 800 01:03:09.519 --> 01:03:16.199 pierces. But and I couldn't understand his point until I realized he was using 801 01:03:16.239 --> 01:03:21.480 that video to help sell people on going out and doing you know, at 802 01:03:21.519 --> 01:03:29.199 fifty dollars ahead skywatches where people are guaranteed to see UFOs every night. I 803 01:03:29.320 --> 01:03:32.639 know, yeah, And I didn't want to give any names, but you 804 01:03:32.679 --> 01:03:38.280 know, so bottom line was, I was very put off by that, 805 01:03:38.360 --> 01:03:40.679 and I said, you know what, in spite of the fact that I 806 01:03:40.679 --> 01:03:45.239 believe I'm really exposing people to the truth here, there's got to be a 807 01:03:45.239 --> 01:03:47.559 better way to do this. And so that's when I hit on the idea 808 01:03:47.719 --> 01:03:51.840 of just starting to demo. And if I say it's a trick of light 809 01:03:51.880 --> 01:03:53.079 and shadow, that's really easy to say. But you know what, yeah, 810 01:03:53.119 --> 01:03:57.559 show me that's you know, so I'm going to be the show you 811 01:03:57.599 --> 01:03:59.760 guy. I'm going to be the guy that's gonna show you what I mean. 812 01:04:00.079 --> 01:04:04.599 It doesn't mean that what you saw wasn't a UFO. It just shows 813 01:04:04.880 --> 01:04:11.199 you that there's a possibility that what you saw could have been this, because 814 01:04:11.360 --> 01:04:17.719 this is explainable with what we know. So lunar bridges are explainable as parallel 815 01:04:17.760 --> 01:04:26.280 valleys at low sun angle where the ridges illuminated tethers ninety miles away with particles 816 01:04:26.280 --> 01:04:30.960 going behind them are explainable if you understand how image saturation works on a sensor, 817 01:04:31.000 --> 01:04:33.880 where you know, an out of focused image is dimmer, and a 818 01:04:33.920 --> 01:04:39.239 brighter object will always look like it's going in front of it, or it 819 01:04:39.239 --> 01:04:42.519 will always dimmer. Objects will always complate they're going behind brighter objects, no 820 01:04:42.559 --> 01:04:45.719 matter how far away they are or how close they are. So things like 821 01:04:45.760 --> 01:04:48.639 that, you know our principles that you can say, but when you see 822 01:04:48.679 --> 01:04:51.039 it, it's a whole new world. And that's what I do. So 823 01:04:51.519 --> 01:04:57.880 I create these and and NASA's unexplained files. Just sign me up for the 824 01:04:57.920 --> 01:05:01.440 second season. So clearly must be doing something right. Well, that's awesome, 825 01:05:01.480 --> 01:05:04.400 you know what, And that's science, And I think people get really 826 01:05:04.440 --> 01:05:10.880 frustrated. Maybe that's why they're not scientists. Because if we're saying that there's 827 01:05:11.039 --> 01:05:17.920 a bridge on the moon and that is recreatable, it's incumbent upon us the 828 01:05:17.920 --> 01:05:26.679 ones making the extraordinary claim to prove otherwise, and that's science. Scientists try 829 01:05:26.719 --> 01:05:31.920 to prove they're wrong. They try to prove the opposite of their hypothesis is 830 01:05:32.000 --> 01:05:36.320 what is the case. So they essentially try to debunk their own theories, 831 01:05:36.679 --> 01:05:41.599 and if they can't debunk their theory, then hey, it might they might 832 01:05:41.679 --> 01:05:45.480 really have something there because they want to be more harsh on it than anybody 833 01:05:45.480 --> 01:05:50.480 else will be. And that's how science works. So it's frustrating, but 834 01:05:50.519 --> 01:05:56.119 it's incumbent on us is that researchers to go do more work. Then you're 835 01:05:56.159 --> 01:05:59.000 you're exactly right, ala Huka. One of the things that's important to understand 836 01:05:59.039 --> 01:06:03.000 is that you know, I have to be really really hard on the data 837 01:06:03.440 --> 01:06:09.480 now. The reason is because better people than I are going to come along 838 01:06:09.880 --> 01:06:15.719 and analyze data that we vetted and said was genuine someday. And I'm gonna 839 01:06:15.719 --> 01:06:18.719 guarantee you that, you know, if someone comes along and says something we 840 01:06:18.800 --> 01:06:23.760 said was real, you know, was real, then it's gonna be right, 841 01:06:23.880 --> 01:06:27.599 okay, because we're making sure that you know, it's not just my 842 01:06:27.639 --> 01:06:30.719 opinion, okay. Uh. I have other people that I work with in 843 01:06:30.000 --> 01:06:34.280 the analysis group here within the analysis unit, within Mouffin. I've added people 844 01:06:34.320 --> 01:06:39.960 to the to the roster that I think are capable. You know, people 845 01:06:39.960 --> 01:06:44.159 that don't even there's some people they don't even have a science degree. What 846 01:06:44.239 --> 01:06:46.800 they have they have a degree in life. They have a degree in experience 847 01:06:46.840 --> 01:06:51.679 and visual experience. That's actually very essential because you know, there are people 848 01:06:51.679 --> 01:06:57.920 that have no observational background whatsoever, but they're scientists. And these are the 849 01:06:57.920 --> 01:07:00.519 guys that end up on CNN talking about, well, it doesn't look like 850 01:07:00.559 --> 01:07:03.239 any aircraft I've ever seen. Well, of course not, because you know, 851 01:07:03.760 --> 01:07:10.000 you just fly the plane. You don't understand, okay, other types 852 01:07:10.000 --> 01:07:13.800 of phenomena that can cause something to look like that. And so comments like 853 01:07:13.840 --> 01:07:17.800 that get misinterpreted into it was a UFO, and they use it as proof 854 01:07:17.800 --> 01:07:20.920 that there was a UFO. And you know, I know I did one 855 01:07:20.960 --> 01:07:26.400 case where Russell Crowe, the actor. Yeah, remember that case it was 856 01:07:26.440 --> 01:07:29.800 on TMZ. Yeah, And I said, no, that doesn't that's that's 857 01:07:29.840 --> 01:07:31.920 not a UFO. Now I got that one wrong. Just for the record 858 01:07:31.960 --> 01:07:35.400 and for everybody to know, I did not analyze that one correctly. I 859 01:07:35.519 --> 01:07:40.280 said, based on the information that I was given, I didn't know where 860 01:07:40.320 --> 01:07:43.679 it was, all right. I had no knowledge of where it was that 861 01:07:43.719 --> 01:07:47.159 was not provided to me. I was just given TMG sent me in and 862 01:07:47.159 --> 01:07:50.800 said, can you just analyze this video? What's what the lights? Now? 863 01:07:51.000 --> 01:07:54.719 Without any knowledge of where it was, I had no context within which 864 01:07:54.719 --> 01:07:58.360 to work for alternative explanations. So the closest thing I could come up with 865 01:07:58.360 --> 01:08:00.159 with was, well, first of all, lots of time lapse, and 866 01:08:00.199 --> 01:08:05.440 it's certainly not a UFO. It actually looks like, you know, regular 867 01:08:06.119 --> 01:08:10.719 lighting, not quite aircraft lighting. But I'm just gonna have to call as 868 01:08:10.719 --> 01:08:14.480 an aircraft because it looks like that's kind of what it appears to me. 869 01:08:14.960 --> 01:08:17.079 Well, it turned out it was the running lights on the mast of a 870 01:08:17.119 --> 01:08:21.840 sailboat outside the window going down the estuary to head out to see. So 871 01:08:23.640 --> 01:08:26.680 you know, even I know I'm not right all the time, all right, 872 01:08:26.720 --> 01:08:29.840 but I knew enough to know that it wasn't a real UFO based on 873 01:08:29.920 --> 01:08:32.880 how the lights were acting. But I was thrown by what the light just 874 01:08:32.880 --> 01:08:35.880 didn't fit aircraft either, And I said that, I said, but that's 875 01:08:35.880 --> 01:08:40.560 the closest thing I can come to. Yeah, had I known the address 876 01:08:40.600 --> 01:08:44.079 of this place, I would have gone to Google Earth and done my site 877 01:08:44.079 --> 01:08:46.560 plan. The site plan is where you go when you look at the the 878 01:08:46.600 --> 01:08:51.520 imagery and you try to figure out everything in the in the image that can 879 01:08:53.079 --> 01:08:58.119 cause any type of phenomenon home to mankind a humankind. And even then that's 880 01:08:58.199 --> 01:09:01.920 kind of hard because who would think, you know, sailboat mass going past 881 01:09:01.960 --> 01:09:08.720 his balcony. Well, yeah, but you know something that's that's where that's 882 01:09:08.760 --> 01:09:11.840 where some people are more cut out for this than others. I'll tell you 883 01:09:11.840 --> 01:09:15.399 why I said before. I see the world at fast speed and slow speed, 884 01:09:15.439 --> 01:09:18.760 almost never at the normal speed it travels, and I see the world 885 01:09:18.880 --> 01:09:24.119 in a complex play of light and shadow. So I have a different perspective 886 01:09:24.159 --> 01:09:29.079 on the world anyway. So I normally think of the things that you know, 887 01:09:29.399 --> 01:09:33.479 I normally well people normally wouldn't and probably don't think enough of the things 888 01:09:33.479 --> 01:09:40.439 I should. Okay, so I'm I'm kind of imbalanced the other way. 889 01:09:40.359 --> 01:09:44.399 Yeah, right, exactly so, And in this particular field, it's a 890 01:09:44.439 --> 01:09:48.640 benefit not that that well, you know, I see the field as as 891 01:09:49.159 --> 01:09:55.399 the world is love and light, and I know that's getting metaphysical, but 892 01:09:55.479 --> 01:10:03.520 it's actually the truth. You are an amazing Yeah, so anyway, but 893 01:10:03.680 --> 01:10:08.720 I did want to touch on because we're running out of time. Another reason 894 01:10:08.760 --> 01:10:13.800 that the TV show should have done the right thing it is because although you 895 01:10:13.880 --> 01:10:16.840 would have talked about how some of these things could have been a product of 896 01:10:17.560 --> 01:10:21.520 light and shadow, there were a couple of those moon pictures that at least 897 01:10:21.640 --> 01:10:25.560 with the little bit of time they let you look at the pictures, and 898 01:10:25.640 --> 01:10:29.359 the only few pictures they let you look at did look interesting to you, 899 01:10:29.479 --> 01:10:32.439 right, that did look like an anomalist. Yeah, you're absolutely right. 900 01:10:32.520 --> 01:10:36.960 There was. There was at least one that I remember. I think there 901 01:10:36.960 --> 01:10:41.800 were two, but there was one I remember where I actually saw a strange 902 01:10:42.439 --> 01:10:47.239 pair of circular objects. And I'm not they're flying saucers or anything like that, 903 01:10:47.279 --> 01:10:51.239 because they were kind of at a strange angle into the lunar surface and 904 01:10:51.600 --> 01:10:58.600 they had like these radial spokes in them. They kind of looked like the 905 01:10:58.640 --> 01:11:00.560 remightd me a sort of bicycle wheels or some kind of thing like that. 906 01:11:01.079 --> 01:11:05.119 And so my first thought was, Wow, now I don't have the print 907 01:11:05.159 --> 01:11:09.439 in front of me. This could be any number of things. This could 908 01:11:09.479 --> 01:11:18.640 actually be a the crystallized stop bath or developer, you know, on the 909 01:11:18.680 --> 01:11:24.760 print. It could be something that dripped onto the actual print before got scanned, 910 01:11:25.039 --> 01:11:27.880 and this could actually be just an artifact of that that dark room process, 911 01:11:28.239 --> 01:11:30.239 or it could actually be on the negative as an artifact, or it 912 01:11:30.239 --> 01:11:33.680 could be a real object on the moon. But I don't have I didn't 913 01:11:33.720 --> 01:11:39.960 have the original data in order to find out which one it was. So 914 01:11:40.479 --> 01:11:43.920 but yes, it was interesting. It looked very interesting to me because it 915 01:11:43.960 --> 01:11:47.159 was definitely not a natural formation. It's not the kind of formation you would 916 01:11:47.159 --> 01:11:51.720 see on the moon. But again without more time, because I was shown 917 01:11:51.760 --> 01:11:57.279 the picture. Yeah, and basically the guy with the producer would actually just 918 01:11:57.319 --> 01:12:00.600 say, well, here's the picture. What do you think? And I 919 01:12:00.640 --> 01:12:01.840 say, well, I'm not really sure. Okay, let's move on to 920 01:12:01.880 --> 01:12:09.039 the next one. Oh wow, yeah, you know, so now we 921 01:12:09.079 --> 01:12:11.960 did, to his credit, we did go back to you know a number 922 01:12:11.960 --> 01:12:15.560 of those that I didn't know right away, and there was some points where 923 01:12:15.600 --> 01:12:17.279 he actually gave me, you know, time to actually go through and do 924 01:12:17.359 --> 01:12:21.000 some analysis. But it's hard when you got people breathing down your neck and 925 01:12:21.039 --> 01:12:24.800 sitting there and you don't have like all night to play with this. And 926 01:12:25.439 --> 01:12:30.000 you know, they arrived at two in the afternoon to shoot for an hour 927 01:12:30.079 --> 01:12:33.520 and they didn't start filming until ten thirty at night. Oh my gosh. 928 01:12:33.600 --> 01:12:35.640 Yeah, it was a long day. So I was actually very, very 929 01:12:35.680 --> 01:12:40.720 tired when the cameras started rolling. That's funny, you looked tired, Actually, 930 01:12:40.760 --> 01:12:44.479 I felt, knowing you, you probably looked like a person of normal 931 01:12:44.960 --> 01:12:48.680 amount of energy on this show, because knowing you, you're a very highly 932 01:12:48.920 --> 01:12:53.720 energetic person. So you did look tired. Yeah, it was. It 933 01:12:53.760 --> 01:12:57.239 was you know, I didn't count on, you know, eight hours of 934 01:12:57.840 --> 01:13:00.479 not doing anything, you know. Yeah, so you know, they had 935 01:13:00.760 --> 01:13:03.960 hot lights running, they were trying to do setups and all that stuff, 936 01:13:04.000 --> 01:13:06.720 and they were still waiting for some data to show up to actually do the 937 01:13:06.760 --> 01:13:12.600 analysis. I didn't even have the data to analyze until ten, ten thirty 938 01:13:12.640 --> 01:13:15.760 at night. Wow. So they didn't show up with it, and I 939 01:13:15.840 --> 01:13:17.399 wasn't given it ahead of time. I was supposed to have it ahead of 940 01:13:17.399 --> 01:13:20.560 time, and you know, they tried. And I don't fault them. 941 01:13:20.560 --> 01:13:25.159 I fault the schedule of the programming, you know. Yeah, you know, 942 01:13:25.239 --> 01:13:27.800 these companies want to get these quick hits out there, you know, 943 01:13:27.840 --> 01:13:30.520 And I'm not talking about you know, Bob Kiviat in particular, who's the 944 01:13:30.560 --> 01:13:34.880 guy that actually did the show, But you know, the people he's answering 945 01:13:34.920 --> 01:13:39.920 to or or you know, making demands of of him and so forth. 946 01:13:40.000 --> 01:13:43.920 So yeah, everybody's subject to the schedule that someone else is making for them, 947 01:13:43.960 --> 01:13:46.159 you know, And so down at the back end there's me trying to 948 01:13:46.359 --> 01:13:49.840 do something good for these guys. But it's hard when you don't have enough 949 01:13:49.880 --> 01:13:54.359 time. Yeah, So before we leave this stopping, before I let you 950 01:13:54.399 --> 01:13:57.279 go, what do you think of the idea of aliens on the Moon? 951 01:13:58.039 --> 01:14:00.720 I think it's fascinating, I really do. And I tell you why. 952 01:14:00.359 --> 01:14:04.199 If I was an alien species, I know, I am, I know, 953 01:14:06.159 --> 01:14:10.359 But if I was an alien species, I would probably set up shop 954 01:14:10.359 --> 01:14:14.119 on the Moon because just from observation I could see that, you know, 955 01:14:14.520 --> 01:14:16.199 we haven't reached out there yet, you know, not in any kind of 956 01:14:16.359 --> 01:14:20.239 capacity. And by looking at the Earth, if I have the capability of 957 01:14:20.279 --> 01:14:26.800 going interstellar, I certainly have the capability to detect the immensity of the false 958 01:14:26.880 --> 01:14:31.600 ring of artificial satellites that we have around the Earth. The geostationary orbits are 959 01:14:31.960 --> 01:14:38.039 like a false ring around the Earth. You know, thousands and thousands and 960 01:14:38.119 --> 01:14:40.760 thousands of objects. Now, yes, they're spread out in a huge twenty 961 01:14:40.760 --> 01:14:45.359 five thousand miles distance from you know, radial path away from the Earth. 962 01:14:45.399 --> 01:14:49.800 Okay, but still there's still quite a lot out there in the in that 963 01:14:50.279 --> 01:14:56.199 geostationary orbit. Plus at the low level we have you know, tens of 964 01:14:56.239 --> 01:15:00.800 thousands of things circling and zipping around, you know, and between two hundred 965 01:15:00.800 --> 01:15:04.079 and you know, one thousand nautical miles. So we got all kinds of 966 01:15:04.680 --> 01:15:09.239 stuff going there. So we were surrounded by a halo of technology over the 967 01:15:09.279 --> 01:15:13.079 Earth. And any alien beings would look at that and say, well, 968 01:15:13.119 --> 01:15:15.920 they're they're kind of focused on the Earth. They're not really looking out here 969 01:15:15.000 --> 01:15:17.920 yet. Now they might not even know we landed on the Moon for all 970 01:15:17.960 --> 01:15:24.199 we know, and setting up on the Moon, I don't know. I 971 01:15:24.199 --> 01:15:28.000 think i'd do it, Yeah, but uh huh, I'm sorry. I 972 01:15:28.039 --> 01:15:30.039 was gonna say I'd set up on the dark side of the moon or right 973 01:15:30.039 --> 01:15:33.239 at the terminator. You know. I wonder if we say dark side of 974 01:15:33.239 --> 01:15:35.439 the moon, you know, the whole moon gets lit up, you know 975 01:15:35.479 --> 01:15:38.439 that, right, I mean, as the Moon's going around the Earth, 976 01:15:38.720 --> 01:15:42.560 the entire Moon will see light in the course of its orbit around the Earth. 977 01:15:42.600 --> 01:15:45.239 It's the dark side of the Moon is sort of a misnomer. It's 978 01:15:45.239 --> 01:15:50.479 just decided we won't see. But you're right right, Yeah, the pink 979 01:15:50.880 --> 01:15:57.640 go ahead, anyone. I was just gonna say that, you know, 980 01:15:57.760 --> 01:16:00.119 it does seem worthwhile to look for artifacts on the Moon. It seems like 981 01:16:00.159 --> 01:16:04.039 a very good plan. It's something that's nearby, it's something that it is 982 01:16:04.119 --> 01:16:11.680 possible we can do. And even fairly recently a paper was written from Arizona 983 01:16:11.760 --> 01:16:17.239 State University. A well known astrophysicist, Paul Davies was a part of that, 984 01:16:18.159 --> 01:16:21.840 and that's what he said, we ought to be looking at artifacts on 985 01:16:21.880 --> 01:16:26.359 the Moon, and he's trying to start kind of a crowdsource project to do 986 01:16:26.439 --> 01:16:30.479 that. Yeah. I think that's great, and in fact, in the 987 01:16:30.479 --> 01:16:34.520 same way that you know, I used. There was a crowdsource technology that's 988 01:16:34.560 --> 01:16:39.000 out there, and you know, I helped search for Flight three seventy, 989 01:16:39.119 --> 01:16:44.279 you know in the Indian Ocean by looking at thousands I looked at thousands of 990 01:16:44.319 --> 01:16:47.760 frames of ocean and I found shipping containers floating without their ships. Oh wow, 991 01:16:48.119 --> 01:16:50.239 Oh yeah, I found all kinds of debris out there, you know, 992 01:16:50.520 --> 01:16:57.239 shipping palettes. Okay, but obviously no no aircraft. But that all 993 01:16:57.279 --> 01:17:00.079 said, okay, those types of technologies are very trying active. And if 994 01:17:00.159 --> 01:17:05.680 you have an automated search methodology, you can actually have an automated search system 995 01:17:05.760 --> 01:17:13.159 go through and look at the imagery and look for look for shapes that may 996 01:17:13.319 --> 01:17:18.399 not that may be anomalies and uh, and that that's that's a training. 997 01:17:18.439 --> 01:17:21.680 You train the system, you know, so like for the first thousand hours, 998 01:17:24.119 --> 01:17:27.520 you know, you're punching, you know, you're you're clicking different shapes 999 01:17:27.560 --> 01:17:30.520 and you're telling the system. In a learning system, you're telling the system 1000 01:17:30.399 --> 01:17:34.640 what's natural and what natural looks like a different latitudes on the moon set, 1001 01:17:35.399 --> 01:17:39.840 and then you would be able to tell it that you know, uh, 1002 01:17:40.079 --> 01:17:44.159 you know this this next thing is, uh, you know, something that 1003 01:17:44.319 --> 01:17:46.239 is natural although it looks like a pyramid or whatever. I mean, that's 1004 01:17:46.359 --> 01:17:49.920 that's the kind of thing needed for the Moon. And and hopefully something like 1005 01:17:49.960 --> 01:17:55.000 that, a learning system would actually be created so that the searches can be 1006 01:17:55.039 --> 01:18:00.159 done automatically offline, you know, by a computer down in guided space flight 1007 01:18:00.239 --> 01:18:05.560 center going through the highest quality lunar reconnaissance orbiter imagery. There is you know, 1008 01:18:06.039 --> 01:18:12.119 yeah, because you need you need high reds now the Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter 1009 01:18:12.319 --> 01:18:16.199 l ro O. That, uh, there's an online browser for that imagery 1010 01:18:16.239 --> 01:18:18.840 and you can start this tonight. You can go to the l ro O 1011 01:18:18.960 --> 01:18:23.880 site, get to the l ro O browser and go right down to half 1012 01:18:24.039 --> 01:18:29.680 a meter per pixel in resolution in many many places, so you can see 1013 01:18:29.680 --> 01:18:34.479 something anomalistic the size of a car, you know. Pretty cool. Yeah, 1014 01:18:34.600 --> 01:18:39.520 it's exciting. It reminds me of that scene from Prometheus where they're flying 1015 01:18:39.560 --> 01:18:43.399 in and they see these pyramids. It makes me think of Ben McGee and 1016 01:18:43.479 --> 01:18:50.479 it talks about astro archaeology really really or no zeno archaeology really exciting. Staff 1017 01:18:50.600 --> 01:18:57.399 that that it is most likely on the horizon or in our future at some 1018 01:18:57.600 --> 01:19:00.800 point, whether that be in decades or or or centuries, who knows, 1019 01:19:00.840 --> 01:19:04.319 but somebody is going to be doing that. Yeah, and when you know, 1020 01:19:05.039 --> 01:19:09.560 we need to, assuming we don't blow each other up, I think 1021 01:19:09.560 --> 01:19:12.600 we're gonna Actually, I honestly believe we're gonna get past that. I'll tell 1022 01:19:12.600 --> 01:19:15.640 you why real quick, because I know I get to go. But I 1023 01:19:15.640 --> 01:19:21.319 think that when we hit that fusion threshold where we get out more energy than 1024 01:19:21.359 --> 01:19:26.279 we put in, then will be good to go. Fusion is a power 1025 01:19:26.319 --> 01:19:30.079 source that is getting more money every year than all other forms of energy research 1026 01:19:30.119 --> 01:19:33.279 combined. Wow. Yeah, because they really think they can do this. 1027 01:19:33.479 --> 01:19:39.039 And that means if you know, a fusion reactor is hit by a tsunami, 1028 01:19:39.079 --> 01:19:43.800 what happens. The reaction shuts off, it doesn't go into meltdown. 1029 01:19:43.880 --> 01:19:46.199 See the way I tell people about fusion versus fission, which is what our 1030 01:19:46.239 --> 01:19:49.359 current reactors are, is in a fission reactor, you got to imagine a 1031 01:19:49.439 --> 01:19:53.840 large hill where it comes to a point at the top and we're balancing on 1032 01:19:53.880 --> 01:19:59.039 the top of a very delicate reaction which either way could go into catastrophic you 1033 01:19:59.039 --> 01:20:03.600 know, avalanche of conditions down the side of that high mountain. But fission 1034 01:20:03.880 --> 01:20:09.279 is is that much more dangerous you see. So, but fusion, on 1035 01:20:09.319 --> 01:20:12.239 the other hand, is like a valley. The reactor is in the bottom 1036 01:20:12.279 --> 01:20:14.399 of the valley. Would take an awful lot of effort to get that to 1037 01:20:14.439 --> 01:20:16.479 go up the side of the wall into something dangerous. So you know, 1038 01:20:16.760 --> 01:20:24.239 fusion's the exact opposite in terms of danger. So that's that's where we're heading. 1039 01:20:24.239 --> 01:20:26.840 And when we get that kind of energy. You could have a fusion 1040 01:20:26.920 --> 01:20:31.960 reactor in your town and it would pose no greater danger than a guy smoking 1041 01:20:31.960 --> 01:20:38.520 at a gas pump, okay, and and do as little damage of the 1042 01:20:38.560 --> 01:20:43.640 guy, you know. So honestly, fusion is a much safer technology, 1043 01:20:43.640 --> 01:20:47.640 and we're heading that way. We will have just I'm sure because they're very 1044 01:20:47.640 --> 01:20:53.359 close. Now, very cool. So, uh you and your future, 1045 01:20:53.720 --> 01:20:58.359 Uh, you're gonna be doing more NASA Unexplained files. It sounds like, 1046 01:20:58.760 --> 01:21:02.199 do you have some other uh uphro toad coming up? Anything else to look 1047 01:21:02.239 --> 01:21:09.439 forward to. Yeah, we're we're creating instrumentation for the EUPATOC system. My 1048 01:21:09.479 --> 01:21:13.960 book, which is called The Populated Universe, is almost ready. It's a 1049 01:21:14.319 --> 01:21:20.840 cool yeah, and it's a discussion of my belief that life in the universe 1050 01:21:20.960 --> 01:21:28.439 is actually a well, it's not a it's not rare, Okay. In 1051 01:21:28.439 --> 01:21:30.840 other words, it's it's a it's it's not a foregone conclusion either, but 1052 01:21:31.199 --> 01:21:35.760 based on what we see, I believe that the universe is predisposed to the 1053 01:21:35.800 --> 01:21:41.760 creation of life, and so I just use science. There's there's not a 1054 01:21:41.800 --> 01:21:46.159 whole lot of hypothesis. There's plenty of science, but in a layman's terms 1055 01:21:46.159 --> 01:21:49.479 that talks about it in a way that everybody understands. It talks about the 1056 01:21:49.479 --> 01:21:54.039 exoplanets. You know, in fact, exoplanets is really the prime topic of 1057 01:21:54.079 --> 01:21:56.600 the book. You know why they mean a lot to us. What that's 1058 01:21:56.600 --> 01:22:00.239 going to mean for us in the next twenty years awesome. Now, is 1059 01:22:00.279 --> 01:22:02.600 there a website where people can go look at what you're doing lately? Or 1060 01:22:02.920 --> 01:22:05.800 they're gonna have to wait for that too. Yeah, that has to wait 1061 01:22:05.840 --> 01:22:11.159 because unfortunately, I've actually been so busy. Yeah, I get up around 1062 01:22:11.199 --> 01:22:14.039 eight thirty and I go to bed around three thirty in the morning. So 1063 01:22:14.840 --> 01:22:16.920 eight thirty in the morning, three thirty morning, So that's typical, my 1064 01:22:16.960 --> 01:22:21.760 typical day. Yeah. But if they google UFO t O G, they're 1065 01:22:21.800 --> 01:22:25.359 going to find a lot of cool staff. Yeah. Absolutely, they look 1066 01:22:25.399 --> 01:22:29.239 up you phatog. We don't have our you Phatagh two system up there, 1067 01:22:29.279 --> 01:22:32.720 you know, the numeral two or II you know you photagh two is not 1068 01:22:32.920 --> 01:22:39.000 up there yet. But that presentation that I put together with Doug will will 1069 01:22:39.039 --> 01:22:43.039 be made available when when we're ready to show it. We want to make 1070 01:22:43.039 --> 01:22:45.920 sure that all the units are in place, because the next picture you see 1071 01:22:45.920 --> 01:22:49.279 of it's going to be the real thing. And you know with the solar 1072 01:22:49.319 --> 01:22:54.439 cells, the cameras, the radio transmitters, the gamma ray detector, the 1073 01:22:54.520 --> 01:22:59.439 spots system, the transponder decoder or the know, the magnetic anominally system, 1074 01:22:59.479 --> 01:23:03.600 the EMFs assisted all that stuff, you know, and the cellular uh antennas 1075 01:23:03.640 --> 01:23:08.520 as well, because we can use the cell system too. Awesome, pretty 1076 01:23:08.600 --> 01:23:13.960 cool, crazy stuff, exciting stuff. So I love it. Thank you 1077 01:23:14.079 --> 01:23:16.479 so much for coming on the show and sharing all this with us, giving 1078 01:23:16.560 --> 01:23:20.920 us an update and talking about all the cool stuff going on. That's great, 1079 01:23:20.960 --> 01:23:24.880 Alejandro. I really enjoyed talking with you for a while. This is 1080 01:23:24.920 --> 01:23:29.039 great, thanks dude. Yeah. Hey, by the way, in October, 1081 01:23:29.079 --> 01:23:31.960 I'll be in Arizona. We're gonna be doing that one week uh crash 1082 01:23:32.039 --> 01:23:38.920 retrieval class out there. I'm actually not sure the date. I think it's 1083 01:23:39.000 --> 01:23:44.560 later in October. So that's also supposed to happen, and it's gonna uh, 1084 01:23:44.600 --> 01:23:46.159 it's gonna have a bunch of people that are gonna come out and we're 1085 01:23:46.159 --> 01:23:53.239 gonna you know, simulate a crash retrieval system. Wow, photo video analysis, 1086 01:23:53.479 --> 01:23:56.359 uh yeah, and then a few other things too. So it's gonna 1087 01:23:56.359 --> 01:24:00.399 be really interesting for a group of people. Anyone can go, So it's 1088 01:24:00.399 --> 01:24:04.680 just a matter of you know, contacting uh moufon and getting the details. 1089 01:24:05.119 --> 01:24:09.079 Cool. Yeah, I know on the mouf On web page if they go 1090 01:24:09.199 --> 01:24:15.720 to get involved on the bottom there's something related to that at Filled Investigator boot 1091 01:24:15.720 --> 01:24:17.960 Camp. That's what they're calling at right. Yeah. Cool. Oh that's 1092 01:24:18.039 --> 01:24:23.039 awesome. Yeah, So we'll see you there, right. I don't know 1093 01:24:23.079 --> 01:24:27.479 about that busy now, but I would love to try to get there. 1094 01:24:28.039 --> 01:24:31.119 Great. Well, like I said, we'll have fun there. And it's 1095 01:24:31.119 --> 01:24:34.479 all about, you know, keeping the science front and center, because that's 1096 01:24:34.520 --> 01:24:39.159 what we're all about. Our charter is, you know, the scientific investigation 1097 01:24:39.239 --> 01:24:42.239 in UFOs for the benefit of humanity. And we can't leave out the word 1098 01:24:42.319 --> 01:24:46.760 scientific. All right, cool, thanks man, all right, thank you. 1099 01:24:46.800 --> 01:24:51.439 It was wonderful spending time with you. Thank you so much to Mark 1100 01:24:51.640 --> 01:24:58.600 for updating us on what's going on with uf O TOG. Kind of a 1101 01:24:58.640 --> 01:25:00.159 weird thing. I don't think we even talked about it too. It's like 1102 01:25:00.560 --> 01:25:05.680 UFO photography, that's what the UFO TG sounds for. But you can check 1103 01:25:05.760 --> 01:25:10.399 him out at his website and then of course you can go to the moofon 1104 01:25:10.479 --> 01:25:13.439 website and you see him all over the place on your TV and you'll see 1105 01:25:13.520 --> 01:25:15.960 him. Of course, we talked about the TV shows he's going to be 1106 01:25:15.000 --> 01:25:20.840 on, so check him out there. Very exciting stuff. Also, be 1107 01:25:20.920 --> 01:25:25.600 sure to check out openminds dot tv for all of the news that Jason and 1108 01:25:25.600 --> 01:25:29.199 I talked about at the beginning of the show. You can also see some 1109 01:25:29.399 --> 01:25:34.319 videos such as videos from the mofon symposium. We posted some interviews from that 1110 01:25:34.920 --> 01:25:41.079 where the speakers are talking about UFOs and the media, and it's a really 1111 01:25:41.199 --> 01:25:45.239 cool video because these guys really give some insight. We've got people like George 1112 01:25:45.319 --> 01:25:49.000 knap, Li Spiegel, Ben Hansen, people who really work with mainstream media 1113 01:25:49.039 --> 01:25:55.800 on UFOs, so you get some insight. James Fox too into you know, 1114 01:25:56.520 --> 01:26:00.560 how the media handles UFOs and if there is a cover up and if 1115 01:26:00.600 --> 01:26:03.000 so, how and why so. A lot of really good stuff on this 1116 01:26:03.159 --> 01:26:08.079 video. You can find that at open mindstat tv and of course at our 1117 01:26:08.199 --> 01:26:12.920 YouTube. Also, you're probably wondering where the spacing out was on Friday. 1118 01:26:13.039 --> 01:26:15.319 Well, as we talked about, Jason was moving, so he was in 1119 01:26:15.479 --> 01:26:19.520 transit, so we had to hold off for a week, but we will 1120 01:26:19.560 --> 01:26:24.079 have a new spacing out this week, and if you haven't watched the one 1121 01:26:24.119 --> 01:26:26.880 from a couple of weeks ago, go watch that one or watch some of 1122 01:26:26.920 --> 01:26:31.079 the archives at our YouTube page. You can also find them on our homepage. 1123 01:26:31.720 --> 01:26:36.479 And finally, I will thank the guy who does our music, Caleb 1124 01:26:36.560 --> 01:26:41.319 Hanks. He does the open and closed music and you can find more of 1125 01:26:41.359 --> 01:26:45.119 his music at the Clerk Chronicles. You can just google the Clerk Chronicles. 1126 01:26:45.359 --> 01:26:48.600 He also is an artist, so he does like kind of this comic thing 1127 01:26:48.640 --> 01:26:53.359 around that, but his music is awesome. We often have people asking about 1128 01:26:53.399 --> 01:26:58.479 it. Check it out at the Clerk Chronicles. Thank you Caleb, and 1129 01:26:58.560 --> 01:27:01.119 thank you to you all well for listening. I don't know if I said 1130 01:27:01.159 --> 01:27:06.840 it on the show, but we had breached over three million listens a couple 1131 01:27:08.159 --> 01:27:11.600 months ago, I think, so that's pretty awesome. That's a lot of 1132 01:27:11.600 --> 01:27:15.720 people checking out the show, which feels really good because we work hard to 1133 01:27:15.760 --> 01:27:19.479 bring you some of the best and the latest, and it's great to hear 1134 01:27:19.560 --> 01:27:25.399 that you all appreciate it. Thank you so much, and we will then 1135 01:27:25.640 --> 01:27:30.760 talk to you next week. Have a wonderful week. Audio Smooth Chattos