You're listening to the Paranormal UK Radio Network, the best in paranormal talk radio
in the UK and around the world. Welcome to the Paranormal Pendel Podcast and
coming to you from the heart of Pendel, which country in the northwest of
England. My name is Craig Bryant, author, the investigator and collector of
stories. Joined me as we take a journey into the paranormal, UFO sightings,
cryptozoology and big casts. This is the Paranormal Pendel Podcast. Welcome to
episode thirty eight half Paranormal Pandel, Broadcasting to the Paranormal UK Radio Network at
Peer UK radio dot com. So episode thirty eight. My guest on this
episode is a returning guest. It's Philip Mantle, the big wig behind Flying
Dispress. If you don't mind me saying Philip and all around UFO expert.
Well, thank you, Craig, and I to speak to going. I
wouldn't call myself for an expert. That's for a big wig. Well,
I don't know. There's only meeting, does it? So you can call
me what you like, mate, you know, but thank you, No,
you're welcome it, I mean, it's it's certainly been a very a
very successful enterprise for you over the years, hasn't it? It tells.
I mean, it depends on how you measure your success. I measured it,
not necessarily in financial terms, but in the feedback I've received about most
of the books that I've managed to publish in one form or another. And
of course a lot of people might not be aware of us. But we've
also expanded, so we also have Flying Dispress in France. Some of our
books and others get published in French. And we have Flying Dispress Latin America,
so again some of them get published in Spanish. And we also work,
you know, with with other independent publishers in different parts of the world.
So you know, like I said, it just depends how you how
your measure success. But I measure it in the feedback, and most of
it's been pretty positive good. I mean, I think most of us will
will sort of admit that we don't do this sort of thing for the financial
reward. Is it is more for the sort of enjoyments of finding out about
the subjects that were passionate about. I mean absolutely, I mean there is
a financial aspect to it, because it costs money to get the books ready
and out there. Plus, I want to give the authors a return for
all the years of hard work that most of them are putting, you know,
doing research, when investigations, and spending their own money doing that.
You know, none of them's funded by by anywhere, and I'm certainly not
funded by anybody or anything. So if I can make them you know,
a few pounds or a few dollars or a few shekels or a few rubles
whatever, then you know, I'm happy to do so. Yeah, so,
but yeah, yeah, it's so far, so good. Good.
Well, we I'd dropped you an email a couple of weeks ago actually about
trying to get you back home because I wanted to talk to you about the
book that you'd core written with. Is it Irenea Scott? Yes, Dr,
I'm in a Scott yep, beyond reasonable doubt the Pascagoula alien abduction.
But of course we've had some sad nos over the last couple of days that
Calvin sadly passed away. What are your recollections of Calvin? Because you were
quite you were quite a good friends, right, you were quite? Yeah,
yeah, I mean I first spoke to Calvin way back in I think
it was twenty seventeen, twenty eighteen, you know, just trying to get
an interview with him. Yeah, And it went from there, and I
published two of his books that he wrote himself, and continued investigating the case.
You know, I think when Calvin's first stepped out of the shadows,
he tried to keep away from the subject as best he could. And he
told his full story for the first time in twenty eighteen. And we made
an agreement then, even informal agreement. This is not a document or anything
like that, and I said I would help him all I could to try
and investigate the case and find out more information and that, you know,
and it opened up and we have found an awful lot more than we original.
I mean, we started with a blank page, Craig quite literally.
And of course Calvin and I would speak usually every week, sometimes every fortnight
on Skype. In between times it would be exchanging emails. So we became
really good friends. And a lot of the time when we were chatting it
wasn't about what had happened to him or anyone else. It was about,
you know, our own life and you know, what was going on around
us, and your stories about things, you know, totally unrelated to UFOs.
I mean, Calvin had a tremendous sense of humor. You know,
he was a very honorable man. And you soon got to know if Calvin
didn't want to talk about something, there was no point trying to persuade him,
because, you know, we just if he didn't want to, it
wouldn't. He would tell you in his own time, you know, And
if he said something, you know, his word was his bond. And
I'd give you an example. You know, Calvin was diagnosed a while back
now with terminal kidney cancer, and we all knew that. And sometime further
down the line, Calvin's mom was admitted into a nursing home and eventually she
was so polish couldn't even recognize him. Yeah, but every Friday night,
Calvin would get his guitar, go to the nursing home and sing songs for
the residents, even though he was terminally ill himself. And that's the kind
of man he was. And he used to say, Philip, I don't
care if if people don't believe me, you know, I really don't.
I know I'm telling the truth. This isn't however, to call me a
liar, that's that's a different matter, you know. And you know,
he just had a tremendous sense of human He was a very humble man,
but worried down to earth. He believed in God. I'm not a religious
person, but he just said to me, I said, Philip, you
look at the trees and the birds and the river and the fish, and
this is what more evidence do you need that God exists? You know,
a very simple way, but that that that's the way he was. And
and we're a lot of laughs together, you know, a lot of fun.
And he used to have this saying, he said, we all have
our own expiration date. Yeah, and he knew his was coming. Now
we all knew it was coming. It was just it was just sad when
it did. I mean, we we're hoping that he'd make it to the
fiftieth anniversary, which is this October. Unfortunately it hasn't, but the town
of Pasco google And is still having a celebration, So that will that will
go ahead on October the twentieth, and it will be there in spirits.
If not if if if nothing else, and was he was he still a
king fisherman because obviously the you know, the crux of The story is that
he was out fishing with a gentleman called Charles Hickson. Yeah, on the
was it the Mississippi? It was. It was on the Pascagoula River right
okay, which which feeds into the Mississippi. I mean he was fishing,
mad. I mean, fishing wasn't a hobbit. It was a way of
life. I asked Phil it because I'm a bit of a keen fisherman myself,
although I don't do as much now as I used to, but there's
still that that draw. Oh. Absolutely. I mean he lived right by
the river, the house he lived on, and that's why he used to
get flooded so often. And he had a house boat on the river which
he was fixing up. He had a small boat as well. And what
I mean again, this is a kind of guy who was a cat.
Calvin would catch all kinds of stuff, not just fish, but shrimp,
you know whatever. Yeah, And he had a place by his house and
he would just store it in there because he catched too much for his own
gumes. And he would leave it there and you could come and help yourself.
No, you didn't have to pay for it, you know. It
was it was there and freeze. So the neighbors new and it's a bit
like you know, some type of farma will leave eggs and you're gonna help
yourself, you know. And and he did that. But he loved his
fishing. And this shows you his sense of humor. A couple of years
back, the town was celebrating the the you know that the account happening in
October, and they had a festival and people will give him prizes, you
know, as as as a raffle will give you a free prize, raffle
off. So Calvin's raffle prize was, and this is tongue in cheek,
with a big smile on his face, was you can come fishing on the
river with me for a night, you know, obviously arking back to the
night when the close encounter happened. Many people took him up on it.
So that was his sense of humans, see and I mean, yeah,
I mean he sounds like a really fabulous, genuine guy. You know he
was. I mean, you know, he like myself, he didn't have
a great formal education, but he certainly wasn't you know, stupid or anything
like that. I mean the guy used calculus. Yeah, and I think
at one point he used to show the students in the local high school or
whatever how to how to use it. He used it. He had his
own construction company at one time, so you know it. Yeah, I
mean, you know, it was a little just it was the kind of
guy you'd like to live next daughter. You know, he's like everybody's favorite
uncle. So yeah, so let's let's sort of just go back then too.
I mean you mentioned that he first his first book came out in twenty
eighteen. Yeah, so that was obviously, you know, they've been quite
a while between the book coming out and when the incident happened back in nineteen
seventy three. I was reading some of the information that you'd sent and the
other gentleman that was within Charles Hickson, who was I mean, he was
aged forty two in nineteen seventy three. Calvin was eighteen, So I mean
I didn't realize that Calvin was so young, so obvious. So this must
have been a really sort of a traumatic experience for both of them, but
more so for basically a young lad of eighteen, you know, absolutely,
I mean that their families have grown up side by side, So Charlie and
Calvin's dad knew each other. Calvin was friends with Charlie's son Eddie. What
about the same age. And of course the one thing they all loved to
share it was it was a lot of fishing. But you see, Charlie
had been in the army and he had fought in the Korean War, and
it was in several large battles during that conflict, So you know, we
talked about trauma. He had experience in that already was Calvin was eighteen,
almost nineteen. Silly young fellow. I don't think it'd ever been really outside
of Mississippi at that point. You know, he was still young. It
just got engaged and that's why he went to work in Pascagry. He actually
lived a couple of hundred miles away and got engaged to Wayne at and but
he was working like two and three jobs since she never saw him. So
his father said to him, why don't you in Charlie. He works in
the shipyard as a foreman. He might be able to get a job.
So every wrong him. Charlie got him a job. The idea was he
would stay at Charlie's Monday to Friday, paying some bedboard and go on on
a weekend, and so he bought a new car. The wedding was planned
that day. October the eleventh, nineteen seventy three, was Calvin's first day
at work in the shipyard, right, okay, And he said this several
times. It says, I got hired, fired, and abducted in the
same day, you know. And again that's his sense of human And of
course he didn't have any great life. I mean, who who did it
at eighteen? I mean I was I think back to when I was eighteen
o one was daft as a Russian and as green as anything, you know,
And it did actually traumatize him for the rest of his life, Craig,
you know, and when he wrote the book, that helped somewhat because
he could now tell his story in full. That was the first time Wayne
it was still his wife that he even told her what everything that had happened.
So it was a therapy for him. Really, then writes in the
book to think absolutely. I mean, he loved his fishing, don't get
me wrong, but but you know, when the book came out, people
treated him with respect and people wanted to know his story where it's back in
nineteen seventy three certainly, and he was media were all laughing at them,
and he couldn't get away from it fast enough. So sorry, do you
think that's that's why? Then there was such a gap between when it happened
and obviously I mean, I'm trying to some maths in the head here,
but we're talking twenty seven plus eighteen thirty five years. Well, what happened
was when this incident happened. Charlie and Calvin originally they having a discussion,
you know, and they said, we're not going to tell anything. Nobody
will believes anyway. I think we're knots. Plus Calvin was worried that his
future father in law wouldn't let him marry Waynette because it's a different time,
this is nineteen seventy three. Yeah. However, as they're driving home and
Calvin's driving, Charlie had a change of heart. He may said, we've
got to tell somebody. He said, what happened? If these creatures come
back, do this to somebody else, what if it's an invasion? So
Calvin agreed on one condition, he would say that up until the creatures came
out of his craft. That's when he passed out. He wouldn't remember anything
else, when in fact he did, he remembered everything. And that way,
Charlie also went on boardy saying he would he would handle the media,
he would handle any of the questions, you know, and Calvin would say,
yea, and I saw the UFO and I saw these beings, but
that's all I remember, you know, And that was the only condition,
So, you know, Charlie said, okay. And Charlie realized this was
a way of protecting his young friend as well, because you know, Calvin
was was, you know, going around the twist. It was so frightening
and of course for those that don't know what happened, there fishing on the
river and this blue light appears from behind them and it goes out across the
water. They think it's the police because they passed the no entry sign on
the way in, and Calvin thinks he's going to spend a night in jail.
Of course, they turn around and it's not the police. It's like
a huge rugby ball shaped thing descending. It stops a couple of feet above
the ground. It's got two lights on one end, and this opening appears
and then three humanoid figures float out of this thing, and again they didn't
touch the ground. They went two got hold of Charlie, one got old
of Calvin. Both guys were paralyzed. They described these creatures as humanoid but
with no neck the head and pointed protumsons coming out of the side and one
out of the front. The long arms with mitten type or crab like appendages.
Their legs were stuck together and never moved, and they took them towards
which thing as they went through it, Charlie went to the right, Calvin
went to the left. That you know, had this thing come down from
the ceiling and go around them as if scanning of some description. Calvin also
also was interacted with a female on this thing that looked almost human, and
that they removed his lower clothing. They stuck something in his foot and it
hurts, and as they dressed him again, Calvin managed to get old of
this female creature and bang ahead against the wall, but then the great humanoid
figure got hold of him. It was paralyzed again, and then Let's singer
remembers his back out on the pier with Charlie shouting at him and he okay,
young, okay, son, okay. He staggers up, turns around,
and this thing takes off and zips. Something's gone in a flash,
you know, And they end up a payphone and they formed Keslar Air Force
Base, which is nearby, and they say, we're not in the UFO
business anymore. Bring the local authorities. So they do, and it's Jackson
County Sheriff's department. They send a car out and the first thing they do
is give them a sobriety test and they passed that. So they escort them
into town. The interview both gentlemen in the Sheriff's office independently, and quite
frankly, they didn't leave them. They thought of uptor something, these two
guys, you know what I mean. So they put them in a room
together and there's a table next to them, and they left them alone that
The deputy comes back a few minutes later, Oh was the day's take something
out of it. They have no idea what he's doing. Unbeknownst to them,
there was a tape recorder plane recording their conversation. And the police thought,
well, we'll get them now. You know, they'll be laughing and
joking, and of course they're not. You know, Calvin's crawling up the
wall literally and you know, Charlie is shaking his head. Did you see
that thing open? You know, how did that happen? And I always
told you there were people on other planets and all this lot. So the
police then believe them, and the police said, we won't tell anybody,
you know, you know, go home. So they go home and they
think that's it. They go to work the next morning and the boss summons
them straight away and they said, what the hell have you two being up
to? The Sorry, somehow got out and they had no idea. Well,
letters sent to the hospital given, they're all clear that. They were
then driven to Keslan Air Force Base ironically to be checked for radiation, which
that was negative. But the people in charge at Keisler said, well,
why are you here, Why don't you tell us what happened? And we
have a transcript of the interview at Keiseltt Air Force Base. They had a
stenographer and we have that transcript. We also have the so called secret tape
done at the Sheriff's office made available and you know that's unprecedented to have such
evidence, you know, straight away almost and Calvin eventually went home. He
ended up in a hospital. He did manage to get married and Charlie took
up the torch, so to speak. He was the one that would talk
to the media. He went on a couple of talk shows. He would
down the years, he would he would appear at UFO conferences. He even
go speak get global church all if you asked him, you know. And
Calvin wanted him to stop. He wanted it to go away. He got
his life planned, Craig, you know, wife, house, job,
children, grandchildren, retire, a simple life. That's all he wanted.
But that that incident that night changed it forever. And I've given this this
is an idea that there may be people listening who may remember the TV series
The Hook in the nineteen eighties. The Hooks alter ego was doctor David Banner,
and of course they were chased by a journalist and every time the journalists
caught sed up, they would move on to the next town. Well that's
exactly what Calvin did in real life with wife and children. As soon as
a journalist caught with him, he would move. And he even used a
false name at one point, and he got a job and the boss called
him into the office one day and said, you fired it, and they
said, well, why I haven't done anything wrong. He said, well,
your name and your social Security number don't match, you know, And
and that's how he lived his life. Was it was traumatic rightfully day he
died. That trauma was lifted somewhat when he finally told his story in full
in twenty eighteen. And he said to me, you know, he wished
he had done it earlier, but say, you know, none of us
can go back in time calm with Craig. So so what prompted him to
to sort of open up down, you know, sort of? Well,
what what had happened was I got that Charlie Hickson wrote a book in nineteen
eighty three with a chap called William Mendez god Ufo Contacts at Pascagoula, and
I obtained the rights to republish it. Now Charlie had died in twenty eleven.
Well, I had no idea what happened to Calvin. I couldn't find
any of obituary about him, you know, or anything like that, so
I assumed he was still alive, but I didn't know. So I thought,
if I can find him, perhaps I could get an interview and just
put that in the back of this reprint, you know, just to bring
things up to date a little bit, and someone set out trying to find
him. It took me a few months and a podcast about the name of
Martin Willis. I'll be forever grateful to him, he said. I spoke
to him a few years back from him, and he put me in touch
with him. I asked, I wrung him up and I spoke to him,
and he was very polite, didn't tell me an awful lot. But
what I didn't know Craig is just a short while before I found him,
he'd been to a funeral of a friend and as they're coming out of the
service, I think it might have been a book of condolence, and Calvin
signed it and those coming behind him saw his name and they started doing the
old wink wink, nudge nudge, you know. The alien guy. Calvin
thought I was very disrespectable for his dead friend. But his wife went out
and said, well, I'm sick of this. Why the hell don't you
write a book and tell your story in full? So he kind of said,
yes, dear, yes, darling, you know, to placate the
wife didn't really have any intention of doing that. So, you know,
I think it was on our second conversation he told me that story and I
said, well, i'll send you a sample contract then, so I did,
and much to my surprise, he said, okay. He sent me
what he'd started to write, and it wasn't an attempt to write a book.
It was just some notes he'd written, and he said, I'll do
it on one condition. And I said, what's that. He says,
you don't change anything. It said because I want people to know not just
what happened to me and Charlie, but also I want them to know me
kind of guy I am, you know, to US's fine. So and
then we we set off and we worked a framework out for the for the
for the book, and we would do literally one chapter at a time.
Calvin would write, some people think I was the ghostwriter, and I wasn't.
I was more like a you know, an editor if anything. And
Calvin had right, you know, a piece, and I'd say, right,
tell me a bit more about that. I don't quite understand what you're
saying here, and you know, what about this? And he'd come back,
and that would go backward and forwards between us until we were both happy
with it, you know, and we did that with every piece of the
book. And I said to Calvin, you know, have you got any
photographs, documents, anything like that, and he says no, he said,
I lost it all in Hurricane Katrina. You know, the house was
under ten feet of water. So my other job then politely pestering the living
daylights at people looking for photographs and documents and other and other items. So
we literally, in every respect, started with a blank page. You know,
I got Charles Hickson's story because I call his book, and you know,
I was republishing it, and Charlie Is, you know, Calvin is
mentioned in that, but they still were sticking with the story that he passed
out when these creatures approached them, which wasn't true, you know. So
he then explained why, you know, why they come to that decision and
why it wasn't true, and this is the story, and there was more
to it than we could ever imagine, you know, and off we went.
And so that's how it all came about. You know, I'm forever
grateful to Martin Willis, and thankfully, you know, Calvin's wife when it
got him in a headlock and say, since she could to write this book.
You know, that's it. I've had enough and and we did.
Yeah, the power of the wife is quite quite a force to behold when
it will be absolutely, just before we talked about some of the evidence that
you found, because there was some photos, wasn't that showed some punctual ones
to both the guys Just going back to that date in nineteen seventy three,
there had been other sightings, hadn't there? Oh? Absolutely? I mean
straight objects in the sky. Do you want to sort of go through them
if you can? Yeah, Well, I've got a book coming out on
October the first, and it's by Kevin Rangle. Kevin's a prolific author and
investigates it. It's called nineteen seventy three, The Year of UFO Sightings,
Landings and Abductions. And there's an old there's an old sort of handmade publication,
but I think it's called what I think the Chaps Walter Webb and it's
and it says nineteen seventy three the Year of the Humanoids. So you know,
there was a huge wave of sightings right across the United States in nineteen
seventy three, and it looks on the as we look back on it now
that the pinnacle of those sightings was October, the same time as Calvin and
Charlie's incident on October eleventh. So what you know, we found lots and
lots of other information about things that happened that year, and it was exceptional.
We used to call it a flap, you know, but it happened
across the United States that year. It's a nominal amount of what we call
high strangeness. Yeah, it's it's it's not something we see a lot nowadays.
And that's another question. So yes, the answer is yes, there
were a lot of other things happening, and but strangely enough, nothing that
would be like this event. I mean, the creatures they encountered. I
cannot find anything anywhere else in the world at any time that looked just like
them. They are unique to Charlie and Calvin. And when it comes to
abduction accounts, you know, we know Betty and Barney Hill no witnesses that
they went under hypnosis. I think four years after the event. There's there's
nothing else. There's no all the evidence. Same with with Travis Walton,
although his colleagues were there when they saw the UFO, but there's no there's
no backup, there's no other stuff. But here we have with Charlie and
Kelvin that you know, within within no time of the incident happening, the
shap sat being interviewed in the Sheriff's department, you know, the next day
that Keisl Air Force Base, and then as we subsequently discovered there and were
all the witnesses and a lot more than we ever imagined, and other as
you mentioned, documentary evidence as well. There were two of the fishermen.
Weren't there a couple of nights before on the opposite No, no, the
very same night. Sorry that my apologies, but they were on the opposite
side of the river fishing. They weren't fishing the world fishing. What happened
was when Calvin's book came out, a local journalist came and interview with him,
and she wrote a piece for the newspaper. But she also filmed the
interview, and you know, they went on signs sped like a little light
minute documentary, you know. And at some point it was put on YouTube
and I'm reading through the comments Underneathy and there was a comment and it said
my mother and father were on the opposite side of the river that night,
they too saw the U went phone. Okay right, And luckily the person
writing this used their real name, so I managed to find the person on
Facebook, and it was a young lady and I sent her a message explained
who I was, and I said, did any chance we could speak to
your mom and dad please? I didn't even know they were still alive,
you know. And she gone back to yeah, and to give me their
contact details. And they were mister Jerry Blair and missus Maria Blair, and
they were on the opposite side of the river that night. Mister Blair was
going out in a boat that tap serviced the oil rigs out in the gulf,
so we were going to be gone for a few days and his boss
was late, so the you know, they sat on this pier by in
the car. He's not in the best of him, who was his size,
having a sleep, and Maria sees these blue lights on the opposite side
of the river. She said they were maneuver in a very peculiar fashion,
as if they were at a looking for somebody or they were lost, didn't
know where they were going. Jerry saw them as well, and then they
decided, for whatever reason, to go up to the boat and just put
his belongings on it. Anyway, you know, they're still waiting for the
boss to come. And as I'm walking down this little pier that it is
a splash in the water next to them. And Maria said, I looked
down as a grain man, a grain that's her words, a grain man.
And she said, went back under the water and never come up again.
And they got to the boat. She threw the stuff on it.
Now this is where he got interested, she said. At this time,
it was a round about nine o'clock ish, and then she run back down
the pier because she got to go past this place terrified. And when she
got back to the car it was twelve o'clock. It's no idea how that
happened. And she was very emotional about this, and I'm talking to her
on the phone and she says, you know, Philip, she says,
I often think maybe some thing like what happened to Charlie and Calvin happened to
me. And Jerry, I said, why did you think that? She's
I've got these vague recollections almost looking at something out of my peripheral vision.
You can't quite make it out in or. I mean, so I left
it at that. We spoke to Jerry, you know, he didn't he
didn't, but he admitted he saw the blue lights and things. He didn't
want to talk too much about it. A year later, there was a
memorial unveiled, not a memorial, a historical mark and unveiled in Pasacola at
the location by the mayor, and Jerry and Maria turned up. They met
Calvin for the first time. They were filmed for the local TV news.
So you know, she's standing on the page, she's saying the blue lights
and everything. A while later, mister Blair texts ill, I mean seriously
ill, And he says to his wife, Maria, we would also doctor
that night, and he told her the story of what happened, and she
was as mad as hell. No how poorly it was, she was as
mad as hell, and she said, you better start talking, so he
did. He ends up in the hospital. He's having an operation and weren't
sure if it was going to survive or not, and he insisted on speaking
to me from the hospital, and I spoke to him and he told me
what had happened. Maria even got a mobile phone and filmed him and he's
literally sat sat on his hospital dead with the stickers still on him from the
ECG he'd had. It's only a few minutes long, you know. And
he and he survived that the operation, and he went on to give us
some more information, and right to the day he died, Greg he was
still trying to tell her more. She was almost like a deathbed confession.
Yeah. So eventually Maria mentions not as she mentions the possibility of hypnosis,
and I said, no, you know, you're still upset about your husband
dying, Maria, you know she's okay, And then for whatever reason,
she suggested it again. You know. The bulk of the interviews with Maria
was done by my colleague, doctor Arena Scott, who lives in Ohio,
and so I said, look, I'll look into it, but you have
to understand, I lived thousands of miles away. I don't know if I'll
be able to arrange it. So I found a few hypnotherapists in the sort
of general area around Pascagoula, and I emailed a couple and eventually one young
lady said, yeah, I can do that, and she was even prepared
to come out to a location as long as it wasn't too far away.
So what we did last year we arranged for missus Maria Blair to go to
Calvin in Parker's house on a certain days and undergo regressive hypnosis. The reason
we went to Calvin's because she knew him. Calvin had been under hypnosis before,
so he knew the score. You know, we know what to expect.
What we didn't tell the hypnos therapist was anything about the subject matter.
We just told her the date, the time, in the location. So
she put Maria under hypnosis. We also had it filmed by a professional cameraman
and she started talking very emotional, and there was long periods where she didn't
speak. You know, you can just see her face moving and she might
make out a little whimper. But in essence, she said that these creatures
removed some of her eggs. They were interested in our DNA, and they
wanted to make children that could walk amongst us and looked just like us.
Wow, And that was the essence of her store. You know, I've
sent this to other people. You should have seen that look on the on
the hypnotherapist face when when they started to emerge, because she knew nothing about
what we're going to talk about. I can imagine. So a few weeks
later we did the same with Calvin. You know, same hypnotherapist, same
location, same cameraman. Calvin just told us what he had already told us.
He didn't go back and relive the episode. He just told us he
you know, people said, oh, he's not under hypnosis. What it
was under hypnosis. The hypnotherapist is sat right next to him, you know,
and but he'd been under hypnosis before, so he knew what to expect.
And there's different techniques they use. What is interesting, Craig I gave
the hypnotherapist this time a couple of questions to ask Calvin, and one was
asked Calvin, before anything happens, he's stood on the pier, fishing rod
in hand, looking out across the water. Just ask him to describe what
he sees. That's all I want to know. And he says, well,
there's there's the bridge going across the river. You know, there's Highway
ninety bridge ro there's traffic on it. There's a boat going out. He
even could tell me that, you know the boat company, the name on
it. They're right at the end. Just a little throwaway thing, Craig,
He says, oh, there's two figures on the opposite side of the
river. Now, I asked the question in our new book, beyond reasonable
doubt were those two figures Mary and Jerry Blair? And it was too far
they were too far of it. Could it be someone else? Don't know?
I don't know. So again we had that film. We have it
for posterlity, thankfully because sadly, you know, Calvin's no longer with us.
And make of it what you will. What we've done in the new
book, Craig, as we've transcribed these hypnotics sessions, and you know every
word it is in that. The only bit we haven't put in is whether
hypnotherapist is putting them under hypnotesis, you know, because it's strengthfully boring.
But every word they say, there's nothing redacted. It's all there and all
the use of it. Notice is a contentious issue. I can fully accept
that, but it's there. If we hadn't put it in, some of
the accusers of you know, omitting things. So it's in there and you've
decide for yourself. Yeah, I mean I suppose there's some people. You're
damned if if you're doing your damned if you don't absolutely yeah, with with
with something like that, one of these documents that you uncovered them from two
days later with photographs of the puncture. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I
mean this is this shows your a what you can do as a researcher today
with the technology we have, and if you're nice to people and you cooperate,
you know, things can happen. So, like I said, Calvin
had no visual material at all, even even have pictures of his kids when
they were little, I mean, they were gone. So I sent out
a statement to anybody and everybody I could think of, bearing in mind,
you know, after the event happened, Doctor j al and Heideck was there
along with Dr James Harder and had a press conference before he left, saying,
these guys are you know, are on the level. So Heinek had
formed a center for UFO studies. So I contacted them and I just explained
what I was doing. If you got anything, they said, yeah,
of course, Philip, We've got a file on it. So they send
me a PDF file, most of which his newspaper cuttings. If I'm honest,
but in the middle of this file it's very clear. It's a one
page document that is typewritten, so it's done on an old typewriter, and
the days is typed over. So it was originally put optop of the twelfth
and the retyped over it October thirteenth, and it's you know, it's it
says puncher Ones. And it gives a description of Charlie and Calvin stripping down
to their underwear and that being given the once over. You know, Alex
says that Charlie had punch of wounds in his forearm, burned in mind.
When when Charlie says, when these creatures got old of him, they pricked
him in his arm and he felt it if he thought it was some kind
of you know, knockout drop. Calvin said, they said in this this
document had punch you wounds under his foot and again going back to what Kelvin
said, he said, they removed his clothing, his lower clothes and his
shoes and socks and stuck something in his foot and it hurts. And it
then went on to mention that there were photographs, but there were nowhere in
this fire were they any photographs. But this document I thought was fascinating.
So we'll lift it at that again. I can't remember how how long after,
but a good long time afterwards. The same gentleman who sent me this
pedia file, he emailed me out of the blue and I said, Philip,
I've been rooting through some files today, not looking for anything on this,
but he said, I assume you've got these, but I thought I
would send them, you know. Nonetheless, and of course it was the
photographs to go with that particular document, and it shows these minor injuries on
Charles Dixon's inner forearm and on Calvin Parker's foot. And the reason we can't
see the face of the people, we know who's who's who, because their
names were written on the back of the photographs. And of course the guy
scammed back in front for me, and what's the only minor injuries, Craig.
When you put the the verbal testimony, then the document, and then
the photographs together, I think it makes a powerful piece of evidence that there
was a physical component to their encounter that night. Yeah. Absolutely, And
again that's all in the new book. The photographs actually published in the book
for the very first time. Nobody had seen them anywhere, I mean literally
nowhere. I mean my mouth just dropped up when I saw them. You
know, on their own, they don't look anything fantastic, you know,
but when you put it, put all three pieces of evidence together, I
think it's it's quite compelling. So has has the been or had there been
any similar abductions before or since? Because you mentioned that this is the only
time that we've had a description of extraterrestrial beings that look like this. They're
not your sort of archetypal descriptions either. What I'm not calling him extraterrestrials anyway,
I'm just calling him these Calvin called him the big ugly big ugly guys.
That his nickname for them. Okay, I don't know what they were,
but like I said, I have I have literally looked at anything and
everything I could lay my hands on to see if there was any description to
these creatures that were the same, and so far, you know, drawn
a blank. I mean, are there are similarities in a lot of abduction
cases? Most abduction cases? Of course, I have one witness events,
and you know, Betting and Barney Hill were two people you could argue were
about Travis Walton. But essentially there's one person and I haven't found any other
abduction case that has this type of evidence straight away, you know, the
Sheriff's office been secretly recorded Peacelet air Force based the next day, and I
know other other witnesses at the time stepped forward as well. I give you
an I give you an indication. We've we've spoken with the police dispatcher who
was on duty that night. He's still alive and he was the one that
took Charlie's call and he's told us, he said, Philip, I must
have taken over fifty calls that night of UFO sightings, okay, and they
were all entered in the police logists. And when I went back to the
publice station, there were people there in person, people plural people reporting it,
you know. And at the time, back in nineteen seventy three,
television interviewed the chap called Jerry Booth. You know, he'd seen something bizarre
that night, you know, at the same time, and then you know,
we found other evidence as well, and we found all the people.
So people were claiming all these people have just stepped out of the woodworked for
their five minutes of fame. Well, mister and missus Blair didn't step out
of the woodwork it was their daughter that mentioned that little comment on YouTube.
Otherwise we would probably never have known about it, because they had no intention
of talking to anybody, you know. And we found other people in similar
ways. And somebody asked me how many witnesses are in the new book,
and I honestly didn't know. So I went through it and counted, and
there's there's forty witnesses in that of one form or another, not all in
pastor google. I will have met some of the surrounding areas. Others were
a few days before, some a few days afterwards. But again myself and
Irene I think it's it's all linked. Others may disagree, so it's there
for you to to look at and judge for yourself to decide. I think
the interesting thing just just listening to very eloquently explaining what happened and from different
different viewpoints as well. Missus Blair mentioned about wanting about these creatures wanting to
remove her her eggs in order to to breed with us. Now I find
that interesting because Calvin obviously mentioned this female type humanoid who I mean, we
don't know what happened. I mean he admitted didn't either. He sort of
pushed it and banged its head against the wall, which says something like that.
You have to wonder then, you know, if there was some some
intelligence behind that part of the encounter were by you know, perhaps he might
have ended up, you know, not putting it to find a point on
it too bluntly, perhaps having sex with this this well there's you know,
there's there's there's no evidence to suggest that. I know, Calvin didn't like
talking about that particular point. I can imagine. Yeah, But if we
go to other accounts, so I mean, certainly the work of Blood Hopkins,
the late Bud Hopkins, and there was lots of instance, even with
Betty and Barney Hill. You know, there was a genetic component to it.
But I know, I know some of the cases that Blood worked on,
similar claims were made that they were harvesting genetic material. Budd was looking
at the possibility that whatever these creatures were, wherever they come from, maybe
they've gone down some kind of genetic cold de sack, and we're looking to
to rectify that. Doctor David Jacobs was a colleague of Bods. He went
the opposite where he thought, you know, they were making her ybrids for
nefarious purposes, but that was just his opinion and slight. It was different
to pods. So there are other examples of you know, look, you
know these beings looking at the human genetics, so that in itself is not
unusual. However, you know, Calvin had another encounter in nineteen ninety three
that's not featured in the book, purely working on nineteen seventy three and two
others when he was a young a young man, a young kid. And
the common denominated amongst all four encounters is this female being. She's in each
of the encounters, and Calvin even said at one point it looked to him
like she was wearing a mask, you know, and make of that what
you will, you know, I'm just pointing that out. Yeah, so
you think perhaps he was being targeted. Well again, similarly with Charlie Hickson,
Charlie also had two encounters when he was a young fella. He didn't
see any female creature, he didn't see anything, and he had another UFO
sighting later on, not an encounter which was witnessed by his family as well.
We were all together in the car. But Calvin Tony Charlie turned into
what we call a contact. He he claimed to have got a few messages
from these begins and something, something spectacular was going to happen on Earth and
he was going to be part of it. Of course that that never took
place, But that never happened. But he see how how both gentlemen you
dealt with the encounter differently. Calvin didn't want anything to do with it.
Charlie thought something special was going to happen. Hence, you know, he
was quite open to talking about it. Yeah, well it's I'm not quite
sure. I'm going to sleep very well tonight, to be honest with you.
I mean, you know, there are there are a lot of Yeah,
I mean you've you've mentioned a number of other abbut tea cases during during
our chat today, but I think probably the Pasca Girler incident is I would
say probably the most famous, would you agree. Well, what is interesting,
Craig, is when when we started to look into this basically, mind,
when I was looking for for for Calvin, I contracted some UFO researchs
in Mississippi who had never heard of it, and they just they just sent
me some links on Google which I could find myself. So when I first
started talking to Calvin, the case was dead and buried because for so many
years Charles Hickson had been the torch bearer, and of course he died in
twenty eleven and Calvin didn't want anything to do with it. It did a
couple of interviews in twenty thirteen rather reluctantly, but then he disappeared back into
the undergrowth again. So it was resurrected by Calvin stepping forward. And then
on top of that, all these other people I've only given it. You
know, a couple of instances tonight, others that a stepped forward are we've
found by other means, and that hasn't stopped. You know, I've seen
a couple of little statements just this week from a person who said that,
you know, as a young kid, they saw that thing that night.
Now I've sent them a message. Whether they'll respond or not is a different
matter. So you know, that aspect hasn't hasn't finished. And you know,
we're hoping that the new book there there's actually an appeal in the back
of the book for other witnesses to contact us, and it'll be interesting to
see where that goes, you know, and see see if if you see
what pots up next, so to speak. Well, if people want to
sort of read about all the actor, all the other evidence and material that
you found, that obviously going to have to go out by the book working
there. Where can they get the book from? Yeah? What what Irena
and I decided to do with the book. We've made it available in a
variety of formats. So there's a very large hardback, there's a ten by
eight paperback, there's a nine by six paperback, there's a kindle and an
audiobook. We are conscious of today's economic situations, so hopefully there's somewhat something
for everybody's you know, wallet there or pop of a pocket and just go
to Amazon. You know it's it's all there on Amazon. And the book
is beyond reasonable doubt. The pastorgoula, alien abduction, and everything we've uncovered,
we've not hidden anything is in that book. And the reason we use
that title because I was watching you know, courtroom drama one night and it
said, oh, we need to prove beyond reasonable doubt. Our argument is
if we could check all those witnesses and all that evidence into a courtroom,
we could prove beyond reasonable doubt that something bizarre, something quite extraordinary happened that
night. Yeah, but I'll proved they would abducted by aliens, but something
quite extraordinary. And we say, you know, you judge for yourself.
Here is what we've uncovered. There you go, And I would imagine that
there's probably more evidence out there that you'll uncover going forward. I suspect there's
probably more witnesses that that haven't come forward for one reason or another, because
it sounds like it was quite a well observed phenomena that happened. Well,
that's it, you see, Craig. The location where this incident took places
not in the middle of the Mississippi Swampland's right. It's right Hi Highway nineteen.
There's a Moultorway bridge goes over the river. It's a very populated area
that Yeah, we have a witness who was driving over the bridge that night.
You know, he's gone on the record. Yeah, we have a
gentleman who was working in the shipyard on the other side of the river that
night. He's gone on the record, and others in and around the area.
You know. So maybe the book, maybe the passing of Calvin,
will galvanize people and think, well that time we told what we saw that
night. You know, yeah, but I fingers crossed. Well, I
mean, it's quite a legacy that he's left behind, and I think you
probably know him as as as well as anyone. You obviously speak very fondly
of the man. I mean, certainly from from the story that you've told
and from the evidence, I think, I don't think there is any any
doubt that something very strange happened to those two men and to others obviously at
night. And I can only urge you know, the people who are listening
to this this podcast quite and buy the book because it's it's it's a fabulous
read, and the evidence in there I think is really overwhelming, isn't it.
It is. I like it. Like I've said before, if you're
only going to buy one UFOL book this year, by this one, by
this one, I'm biased. I know that, and I've read a lot
of UFOL books and I personally don't think there's anything like it. And you
don't have to agree with us. I'm not saying that that at all.
We're not out doming doctrinate anyone. We're saying here's the evidence we were masked.
See if you agree with us or not. Yeah, well it's been
amazing talk to Philip. Thank you and thanks very much. I'm sure that
that because of your your relationship with Calvin, and as we said, it's
on him in a few days really since since the sad Nose broke, So
I would imagine that you are in great demand to talk about your friendship and
the research that you've done. So I do appreciate you're giving up your time
this evening to come and talk to me. It's been it's been a really
really interesting chat. I am. I am really grateful. Thank you.
No, no, it's my pleasure, Craig and I dare say we will
talk again. I hope, so absolutely, thank you for thank you for
coming on Philip, and take care my pleasure mate. Thank you. You
can visit my website at www dot Craig Bryant dot co dot uk. Paranormal
Pendule will return and remember to keep watching. The shadows told and told me