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Well, it's almost Thanksgiving, Paul
Gobble Gobble. Indeed, I know I'm

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a very passive Thanksgiving participant in my
family, so I don't really do that

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much, but I know that you
are very non passive. Yeah, I'm

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an active I'm an active Thanksgiving participant. Yeah, make like two pies per

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person. Wait? Have I told
you about the pies last year? No?

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Tell me? Wait? Okay,
so I've already made the apple pie

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and frozen because so so last year, we had a guest at the table

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that was I'm just gonna say he
was high. I met him a couple

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of times. He's always been perfectly
lovely, but I don't know if he

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had some social anxiety or something.
He was on drugs last year and it

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wasn't. So I make like,
you know, appetizers entres. They make

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like pounds and pounds of food for
everyone, and we get through the entire

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meal and I put out all the
desserts and I have the apple pie and

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I'm like, oh, would you
like some apple pie? He's like sure,

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that kind of a piece, and
I give it to him and then

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I'm like going around, sorry,
and I sit down next to him and

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he looks at me, and he
kind of like points the apple pie a

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couple of times and says, could
have used a few more minutes in the

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oven. A scandal. My jaw
is drops. I the library is open.

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Holy shit. It's funny because like
three other people heard of it.

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I am self confident enough in the
kitchen that that does not bother me,

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But like three other people at the
table were like, this is the greatest

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apple pie we've ever had. How
dare you look? I didn't even I

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wasn't there. I didn't even try
the pie. I just know you.

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Like, ay, that's rude in
anyone's kitchen. Yeah, b like you

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work your your ass off. You
prepped for fucking things giving like six weeks

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in advance. This is true.
This is true. Yeah shocking. Yeah,

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could have used a few minutes the
oven. I didn't know we were

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serving under cooked apple pie at you
Thanksgiving. Maybe I won't come forget about

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a soggy bottom. It's a raw
bottom. Normally I like it raw bottoms,

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but not this time in America.
And this is that aged well yesterday's

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pop culture today classic movie November.
I love this month, me too.

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I little glimpse behind the scenes when
November was coming. I was like,

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we shouldn't do classics again, we
should mix it up. And Erica was

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like, no, I put my
foot down, you stupid whore. You're

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doing classics. There's so many Shut
up, you fucking philistine. Shut up

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and watch an old black and white
movie. Please. And you know what,

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she was right by the way,
little another peak behind the curtain.

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I've been trying to get him to
watch the film we're going to discuss this

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week for years. Years. I
was like, trust me, you're going

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to love this movie, Paul.
Do you love this movie? Of course?

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I yeah, because you're not an
idiot. Yeah, thank you,

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because this movie is fucking amazing.
But before we talk about the movie,

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Erica, we have to talk about
our five star Apple podcast review excellent.

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Do you want to read sure thing? Today's review comes from b Bourgeois ninety

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one love it, No notes on
that name, fantastic perfect. The review

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is titled are you not entertained?
Yes, we totes are, and she

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wrote tots ay they This fabulous person
wrote totes is like toe bag fabulous.

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Love it Paul and Erica, We
salute you. I cannot tell you how

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fun this podcast is. I was
first lured here by the sweet, dulcet

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tones of Paul's voice when he appeared
on Movies That Made Us gay. Ah,

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and now I have a new obsession. The number of times I have

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laughed out loud on public transportation while
listening to this podcast should be praise enough.

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But no, Paul wants his five
stars, sure do, and by

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gum, both Paul and Erica have
earned them. That's right. If you

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find it in your hearts to review
my favorite movie, Miss Congeniality, we

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do need more Sandy Bullock. We
do need shocking lack of Sandy Bullock on

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this podcast. And can I tell
you something shocking. I've never seen Miss

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Congeniality, really never seen it.
Maybe we need to do like two thousand

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to like the year two thousand,
all a month of all movies from the

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year two thousand, right outside of
the normal comfort zone. All right,

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Yeah, so if I would,
if we would review Miss Congeniality, I

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would be eternally grateful. I hope
that many more of the movies I've grown

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up with we'll also make it to
air, and I'll keep coming back until

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they do. Well. If you
want to have more to say about that

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be Burge one ninety one. Year
you can do you can join our Patreon

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that's right, Yeah, because we
pull what movie we're gonna do the last

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The last movie every month is chosen
by the Patreon listeners, not by us,

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not us mere mortals, not not
us fools, you gods and the

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in the firmament, in the Patreon
firmament, B Burge one ninety one,

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thank you so much. I just
would like, what which of my movies

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that made us gay? Appearances were
my sweet tones the most alsome? You

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have three appearances? Well, one
was with me so clearly, not that

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one. Not that she did not
cheer there or did not mention me,

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Because because I think of Louise Bourgeois. That's why I keep thinking this is

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this is secretly Louise Bourgeois, the
long dead photographer. I love that you

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have Louise Bourgeois so at the forefront
of your brain that you keep equating this

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person with her with yeah, with
again, long dead photographer, Louise Bourgeois.

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Fantastic. So, Louise, if
you would like at that age weel

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tote bag, please shoot us an
email. I will happily send it off

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for you. Erica, What is
the movie that you want to smack me

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in the face for having waited so
long to talk to you about? First

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of all, anyone listening, I
cannot recommend this film enough. Go watch

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this film. Today's film is the
nineteen fifty Perfection film noir Sunset Boulevard.

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This was requested by Luis by Morgan
and by Melissa. It was written by

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Charles Brackett, D. M.
Marshman Junior, and Billy Wilder. It

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was directed by Wilder and stars Gloria
Swanson, William Holden, Eric von Stroheim,

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and Nancy Olsen. Sunset Boulevard was
nominated for eleven Academy Awards, winning

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three, and it really should have
won four. It won Best Screenplay,

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Best Art, Direction, and Best
Score. I mean maybe even Best Picture.

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This would have been All About Evire. I'm torn because I also really

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love All About Eve, and All
About Eve is very funny. I think

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this is a better movie. I
have not seen All About even a while.

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Compared to my memory, I prefer
this movie. But I do think

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I should watch All About Eve again
in rapid succession with this to like,

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Oh, that's a great double feature. Really try to feel which one calls

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to my soul. W Yes,
that's a fantastic double feature. The one

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that this movie I'm Stunned did not
win and should have won is Best Actress

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for Glorious Wanson. I think I
said this during Psycho like that he gave

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a performance of a generation. Again, I'm gonna say again, she gives

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the performance of a fucking generation excellent. She's so good. Judy Holiday famously

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won that year. It was a
stacked year. That's of course we had

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Betty Davis for All About Eve as
well, and like who probably would have

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won it if Anne Baxter hadn't swooped
in there and like Siphon, some boats

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off. The funny thing is Anne
Baxter is terrible and all about it.

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I don't think you think a parly
good app I don't think she's very good.

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I think she's very fun to watch
because she's she does a lot,

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she does so much. But anyway, that's beside the point. Fucking Glorious

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wants and check your purse. You've
been rob check your coffin. Check your

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coffin. Did she You should be
buried with like a like a oscar clutch

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her don't cold dead hands. There
were attempts to make Sunset Art into a

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musical by both Stevensonheim and the team
of Candor and Ebb, but Andrew Lloyd

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Webber finally succeeded in nineteen ninety four. Unfortunately, in bringing it to Broadway

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from London, he crossed Patty Lapone, who successfully sued him for replacing her

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with Glenn Close, and used the
settlement to install what she has named the

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Andrew Lloyd Webber Memorial Pool at her
home in Connecticut. The production went on

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to run for two years, but
became one of the biggest financial failures in

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Broadway history. Amazing, amazing.
I love this story so much. Every

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time it kind of resurfaces in the
pop culture, it's another delight. Well

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because also now that you know the
plot of the film, huh a pool,

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uh huh makes it extra special,
extra special. The fact that she

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used the money to build a pool
and called it the Andreloid Webber Memorial Pool.

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I think she has a fake body
floating in it at all times.

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Amazing. Can I tell you I
saw this with Glenn Close. I did

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not see the original run in the
nineties. I saw the They redid it,

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they revived it on Broadway like ten
years years ago or something. I

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saw that production of it, and
she was so good. Yeah, like

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she can't sing, well, that's
terrible. She can sing, but she's

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not like Broadway singing, so she's
not as good as obviously Patti LuPone would

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have been. But she does really
fucking nail the part. And also by

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the time I saw Glad close to
it, she must have been like seventy,

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which is way too old to play
Norma Desmond, and I didn't care.

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From what I hear too, her
voice had really gotten thinner over the

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years, so like I apparently in
next to ninety four she was singing it

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more strongly than she was. Yeah, a lot of BELTI songs in this

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music will do. Do you know
who's doing it currently? On the West

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End? They've just revived to Oh
it's on the west End? Is on

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the west End? Do you think
it'll come to Broadway? It might?

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Guess the star is west End?
Gosh, I don't know any British Oh

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is it Emil Destontan? Nope,
very clever. I wanted to be a

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mal A stunted so badly. It
is in fact, Nicole Shirt, singer

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from the pussycat dolls. Loosen my
buttons, Baby, I'm gonna throw up.

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Wait, what how is it not
a Melda's stunted because it's the Cole

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shirt singer for the Look before.
Oh Jesus Christy. That woman can sing.

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She is a Lady Gaga pop star
where she can sing the role.

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That is not an issue that I
can. I promise you. I have

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no idea what her acting abilities are. And I mean, honestly, she

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probably is about the right age.
She's in her forties. I don't know

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she's gonna be able to act it. No, I mean she's great when

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she's I mean, she's a great
singer. It's right in her name.

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She's a shirt singer, so she
can ever heard her song about shirts.

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Stop trying to make shirt singer happen, Paul, It's not gonna happen.

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But I did just see a picture
of the boughs and I'm I do kind

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of want to see it because I'm
like this, there's camp happening here because

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in the bows, you know,
the end of the movie. Yeah,

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to my understanding, the end of
the of the of the show is essentially

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the same when Nicole Schertzinger takes her
bows. She's in like a black slip

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dress and she is covered in blood, as is the guy playing Jack Gillis.

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He's like a stud of a man
and a pair of black box of

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braes covered in blood. And I'm
like, what, what? What?

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What happened in this version? What
are we doing that she shot him and

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then rubbed herself on his body before
tossing him in the pool? Did we

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go nice spoiler for the movie.
Yeah, yeah, what's going on here?

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Maybe she gets shot by the cops. Maybe in that version, but

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that's dumb. You need the final
You need that final moment. It's so

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iconic. Maybe she gets shot by
cecil By to Miller, I want to

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be shot with the camera, not
shot with a gun. Maybe she gets

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shot I had a hopper. We
don't know. Sunset Boulevard has a ninety

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eight percent critical rating on Rotten Tomatoes
and a ninety five percent audience score too

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low. I would say, let
me let me interrupt you for right now.

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Everyone, Erica is very angry and
she's gonna say some harsh things.

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I want you to note she doesn't
mean it. She still loves you.

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Erica. Go ahead, What the
fuck is wrong with people? Are we

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so dead inside that we can't recognize
genius when we see it? I actually

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agree with you. This deserves one
hundred. This this deserves three hundred.

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Yeah. Yeah, everyone is great. The whole thing is perfect. There's

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not a I did the recap for
this episode because hey, I already knew

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the movie well and loved it,
and so it was gonna be easier for

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me. But also, let me
tell you, there's no fucking fat to

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trim. Wait. I was looking
for things to cut so that this our

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podcast episode would not be eight hundred
hours long, right, and there's nothing

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to cut. Yeah. I basically
had to cut out like little things that

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were incredible. Yeah, but like
I was like, ah, I'm gonna

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miss talking about that. And it's
an hour and forty five minutes. It's

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not a crazy long movie. No, it's fantastic. Yeah, Okay,

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here the audience score here's what Here
is what I'll say, And again,

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ninety five is very high. So
it may be to a modern audience member

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is a little slow, stupid audience
member. It's a stupid audience member,

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just someone who doesn't give a shit
about life or art or love or beauty

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or whatever, anything like that or
anything like that, or women or Hollywood

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or movies, yeah, or comedy
or art. Yeah. No, so

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astrology, those people exist, I'm
sure. Yeah, Monkeys, sinister German

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butlers. Yeah, Yeah, I
guess. I guess there's some people out

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there who don't care about that.
Yeah. I don't know. I want

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to. I don't associate with them, but I'm sure they exist. Yeah,

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And I'm sure they're beautiful soul somewhere
whatever. Sure the critical score genuinely.

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Who who the fuck are those two
percent? Yeah? Who? I

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want names? I don't want names. I'm gonna go it's on their grades.

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Erica, When did you first see
Sunset Boulevard? Oh? I saw

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it in high school. I rented
it. Here's my journey with some at

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Boulevard. I love Billy Wilder.
Love Billy Wilder's films. The first one

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I ever saw was The Apartment,
and I went on a little bit of

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a tear, being like, who
is this person who made this movie?

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And then I watched them like It
Hot obviously and this one, and like

205
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all the big Billy Wilder movies and
Sabrina and all of those, and then

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at some point in the early two
thousands they were doing like it was either

207
00:14:24.399 --> 00:14:28.679
a Billy Wilder retrospective or a film
Noir retrospective at the Film Forum downtown.

208
00:14:28.679 --> 00:14:31.360
And so I got to see this
on the big screen, and holy shit.

209
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Yeah, when you see on the
big screen, it's really something.

210
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Also, like the difference between watching
it by yourself and watching it with a

211
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theater full of people who get it
and are like laughing and like like really

212
00:14:43.559 --> 00:14:48.200
enjoying it a lot with you.
Yeah, like here real theater full of

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00:14:48.240 --> 00:14:54.840
queers, my people and like old
people like exactly my people. And yeah,

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ever since then, I've just been
like I went from really liking the

215
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movie yeah, to being like,
oh, I get it. This movie

216
00:15:01.879 --> 00:15:05.080
is genius. Yeah. Yeah,
And I've seen it a few times since

217
00:15:05.120 --> 00:15:09.080
probably so I've probably seen it a
total of five times. Gotcha, how

218
00:15:09.080 --> 00:15:11.200
about you? When did you first
see this film? And we already know

219
00:15:11.240 --> 00:15:13.720
the answer, but I'm gonna make
I'm gonna make him say it anyway,

220
00:15:15.279 --> 00:15:20.600
because I spent fucking years to get
to this point and I'm gonna revel in

221
00:15:20.679 --> 00:15:24.559
it. You're a wallow, Get
a wallow? Yeah, when did you

222
00:15:24.559 --> 00:15:28.159
first see this? This masterpiece?
I saw it this week the first time,

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because I frankly who I blame in
my elder gays. When I was

224
00:15:31.720 --> 00:15:33.279
in my twenties, I should have
been sat down and forced to watch it,

225
00:15:33.320 --> 00:15:37.639
and I wasn't. No, I'd
never seen this. I had seen

226
00:15:39.399 --> 00:15:43.399
large swaths of it before obviously,
oh for sure, like through osmosis,

227
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And it was one of those things
where and I was wrong when I thought

228
00:15:46.559 --> 00:15:48.320
this, But I was like,
I bait, Like, am I gonna

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sit down and watch this movie?
I know what happens in this movie.

230
00:15:50.519 --> 00:15:54.360
I know everything, Like I've seen
all the iconic shots, Like how much

231
00:15:54.399 --> 00:15:58.480
more could it have to offer?
It's also parodied so often you feel like

232
00:15:58.519 --> 00:16:03.000
you've you've seen it exactly so,
and I'm here to tell you you haven't

233
00:16:03.000 --> 00:16:07.200
seen all of it. It does
have surprises. There is one shocking moment

234
00:16:07.240 --> 00:16:10.320
in the film that shocking. I'm
sure we're talking about the same one.

235
00:16:10.519 --> 00:16:12.480
Yeah. Every time every time it
comes up, I'm like, I can't

236
00:16:12.519 --> 00:16:17.039
believe it's in here. I can't
believe they got away with this. Yes

237
00:16:18.279 --> 00:16:22.600
that my jaw dropped at that moment, and I loved it. I loved

238
00:16:22.600 --> 00:16:25.399
it. I actually the next time
we're showing the film forum, we have

239
00:16:25.440 --> 00:16:30.360
to go together, because even just
that last moment, I would pay twenty

240
00:16:30.360 --> 00:16:33.919
five dollars for a ticket just to
see the final thirty seconds of this movie

241
00:16:33.960 --> 00:16:37.240
on the big screen in the crowded
theater. Yeah, because when she spikes

242
00:16:37.279 --> 00:16:42.600
the camera. Yeah, it's so
terrifying. Yeah, yeah, Erica.

243
00:16:42.679 --> 00:16:49.080
The tagline for Sunset Boulevard was a
Hollywood story. Actually, I kind of

244
00:16:49.120 --> 00:16:52.159
like that. That's awesome. That's
perfect, and it's kind of good.

245
00:16:52.200 --> 00:16:53.279
That's good. That's a good one. Yeah. Yeah, all right,

246
00:16:53.279 --> 00:16:57.679
shall I read you the iTunes synopsis? Sure thing? Okay. Glorious Swanson

247
00:16:57.759 --> 00:17:03.919
as Norma Desmond, an aging silent
film queen, and William Holden as the

248
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struggling young screenwriter who is held in
thrall by her madness created two of the

249
00:17:08.400 --> 00:17:17.119
screen's most memorable characters in Sunset Boulevard, winner of three Academy Awards, director

250
00:17:17.119 --> 00:17:22.400
Billy Wilder's powerful orchestration of the bizarre
tale is a true cinematic classic. From

251
00:17:22.480 --> 00:17:27.880
the unforgettable opening sequence a body found
floating in a decayed mansion swimming pool,

252
00:17:29.319 --> 00:17:34.640
through the inevitable unfolding of tragic destiny, Sunset Boulevard is the definitive statement on

253
00:17:34.720 --> 00:17:41.039
the dark and desperate side of Hollywood. I mean, whoever wrote this,

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00:17:41.039 --> 00:17:44.000
this is one of the best iTunes
synopsis, and this is someone who like

255
00:17:44.799 --> 00:17:48.880
fulfilled the assignment. Then some like
love the movie and is like, I'm

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00:17:48.920 --> 00:17:52.640
gonna use the voice of the film. I'm going to pretend that I'm Billy

257
00:17:52.680 --> 00:17:56.519
Wilder and write a synopsis for my
own movie. Now I do have a

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00:17:56.559 --> 00:18:00.359
confession, Erica, this is actually
not the false synopsis on iTunes because there

259
00:18:00.400 --> 00:18:04.519
is one more sentence to the synopsis, and in it they ruin the twists

260
00:18:04.559 --> 00:18:07.400
that we are referring to. So
I have, for the first time in

261
00:18:07.480 --> 00:18:11.240
the years we have been doing this, I have not written down the full

262
00:18:11.279 --> 00:18:14.279
synopsis. Oh and I have left
it off because I'm like, on the

263
00:18:14.359 --> 00:18:17.039
chance that there's someone listening who has
not heard Sunset Boulevard, it was not

264
00:18:17.079 --> 00:18:19.160
seen Sunset Bulevard, which I actually
think there there are going to be people,

265
00:18:19.279 --> 00:18:22.200
Yeah, yeah, if they're not
going to watch it for they listen,

266
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I want that twist. I want
that twist to cause them to break

267
00:18:23.920 --> 00:18:30.960
in their car and go to fall
off the treadmill gym and be like,

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00:18:30.039 --> 00:18:33.720
I'm sorry, did they say what
I think they just said, I'm sorry,

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00:18:33.039 --> 00:18:37.319
just take out there. Does that
Sunset bule Ofvard? Ha ha,

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00:18:38.680 --> 00:18:42.119
Paul. Do you have an actual
synopsis for Sunset Boulevard. Yeah, actual

271
00:18:42.160 --> 00:18:47.480
synopsis for Sunset Bulevard is very short
and sweet. It goes like this fifty

272
00:18:48.960 --> 00:18:52.680
Funny thing is we were talking about
the double feature of it all, and

273
00:18:52.720 --> 00:18:56.640
I have recently seen all about Eve
like in the last month, and then

274
00:18:56.680 --> 00:19:00.319
also some Sunset Boulevard, and both
movies are about suits. We're terrified of

275
00:19:00.400 --> 00:19:06.680
being old, and one is forty
and the other one is fit. Stick

276
00:19:06.680 --> 00:19:08.559
around. We're gonna come right back, and we are going to We're going

277
00:19:08.559 --> 00:19:15.720
to slowly and gradually like molasses,
let Sunset Boulevard wash all over all of

278
00:19:15.799 --> 00:19:33.079
us. That got gross, and
we're back. We open very dramatically with

279
00:19:33.160 --> 00:19:37.599
a tracking shot of Sunset Boulevard in
Los Angeles at five am. We see

280
00:19:37.640 --> 00:19:41.559
several police cars zooming down the streets, sirens blaring, and we hear our

281
00:19:41.680 --> 00:19:47.880
narrator Joe gillis played by the luxurious
William Holden. Luxurious Hell William Holden.

282
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The costumes in this film are doing
William Holden no favor, except for the

283
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TuS and tails the tux and tails
is fine. Even that's fine because he's

284
00:19:55.799 --> 00:19:57.279
not a tux and tails guy.
That's the thing. He's like. He's

285
00:19:57.279 --> 00:20:00.480
like a rough in top mechanic.
Yes, he should be a hot makey.

286
00:20:00.480 --> 00:20:04.559
He actually does sort of play like
a like a dirty mechanic type in

287
00:20:04.640 --> 00:20:07.920
Picnic. Oh did you ever see
Picnic? I haven't seen it. No,

288
00:20:07.000 --> 00:20:11.079
Oh it's good, like you get
William Holden in that film. We're

289
00:20:11.079 --> 00:20:18.680
off topic, shocking. Joe explains
the scene that we're witnessing in voiceover.

290
00:20:18.920 --> 00:20:22.680
Right, this is the homicide division, although he says it homo side,

291
00:20:22.680 --> 00:20:26.240
which sounds like a slur. It's
my first note. The homicide cars like

292
00:20:26.240 --> 00:20:30.839
the excuse me what, I'm sorry? Uh what I'm taking off my area

293
00:20:30.039 --> 00:20:33.799
on the fight Bill Holden, get
the vasiline. Oh no, no,

294
00:20:33.839 --> 00:20:37.440
okay, it's just an old timey. It's just the way he pronounced Okay,

295
00:20:37.519 --> 00:20:38.599
we're good, We're good. Yeah, he didn't say fag. Yeah.

296
00:20:40.680 --> 00:20:44.720
The homo side Division. We're gonna
have to talk later about what a

297
00:20:44.759 --> 00:20:51.359
homo side division would be. A
homo side division is. It's it's an

298
00:20:51.480 --> 00:20:55.279
NFL division where it's just the gays
all play football. It's a homo side

299
00:20:55.279 --> 00:20:57.400
division. It's it's a dick Wolf
show about a bunch of gay cops,

300
00:20:57.880 --> 00:21:10.559
murders, homocide, life on the
street, homo side downtown. Christopher Maloney

301
00:21:10.559 --> 00:21:15.440
can still be in it. He's
allowed absolutely, as can she of course,

302
00:21:15.519 --> 00:21:19.480
of course, I mean, but
like, yeah, homicide is excellent,

303
00:21:21.119 --> 00:21:23.319
all right. Anyway, this is
the murder cops. I'm just gonna

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00:21:23.319 --> 00:21:26.359
say, murder cops. And they're
rushing to the scene of a crime in

305
00:21:26.400 --> 00:21:32.440
one of those grand old mansions of
yesteryear. It's in fact his murder,

306
00:21:32.880 --> 00:21:36.680
Joe's murder. The man whose voice
were hearing. Joe was found dead with

307
00:21:36.799 --> 00:21:41.759
three bullet wounds in the swimming pool
of this very famous old timey celebrities home

308
00:21:41.839 --> 00:21:45.160
this morning. The camera cuts to
inside the pool and we see Joe's body

309
00:21:45.279 --> 00:21:49.640
floating at the top of the pool, and sardonically he says that poor dope

310
00:21:49.640 --> 00:21:55.440
always wanted a swimming pool. Joe
then takes us back six months to the

311
00:21:55.519 --> 00:21:59.960
date this particular story started. You
know, it's interesting he very much dissas

312
00:22:00.000 --> 00:22:03.839
asociates from the corpse in the pool
and the voiceover, which is it's just

313
00:22:03.920 --> 00:22:07.200
interesting because then it goes back six
months, and he goes to I as

314
00:22:07.200 --> 00:22:10.119
opposed to that poor fucker. Yeah, that poor guy, that poor dude.

315
00:22:10.319 --> 00:22:14.000
I think a couple of things are
happening here. There's a chance that

316
00:22:14.079 --> 00:22:18.000
some audience members might not connect the
voiceover or the narrator to the guy in

317
00:22:18.039 --> 00:22:21.720
the pool, so that there's like
a twist. Yeah. But also I

318
00:22:21.720 --> 00:22:25.799
think Joe is, on top of
everything else, a storyteller. So even

319
00:22:25.799 --> 00:22:30.160
when he is in his voiceover just
giving us an explanation of his own life,

320
00:22:30.359 --> 00:22:33.519
it's always in this like supercharged language, this hard bodied you know,

321
00:22:33.559 --> 00:22:37.880
I write film noirs language. All
of my notes, by the way,

322
00:22:37.000 --> 00:22:41.240
later for random observations, are my
favorite lines in this movie. I will

323
00:22:41.279 --> 00:22:45.920
not be brief. Okay, get
ready, get ready, You're just gonna

324
00:22:45.920 --> 00:22:49.480
want to buy a script, And
like, look at every other line that's

325
00:22:49.519 --> 00:22:55.519
my is written. It's a poetic
purple prose almost, and it really it

326
00:22:55.559 --> 00:22:59.640
really works given the the miliu that
we are in. I also love this

327
00:22:59.680 --> 00:23:02.279
score. So this is another bubble
butt of a score, and he says

328
00:23:02.319 --> 00:23:07.160
top bubble butt score, just like
in Psycho. It's by Franz Waxman.

329
00:23:07.279 --> 00:23:11.039
Incidentally, Yeah, all right,
so we dissolved into a more middle class

330
00:23:11.079 --> 00:23:15.039
street in La and we zoom in
on Joe's humble apartment building. He tells

331
00:23:15.119 --> 00:23:18.240
us he's been out of work for
six months and it's quickly running out of

332
00:23:18.240 --> 00:23:22.200
money and options. He tells he's
writing stories all the time. I would

333
00:23:22.200 --> 00:23:26.240
like to say, William Holden,
he cannot type, but he does make

334
00:23:26.279 --> 00:23:29.640
it look like he is actually typing. He's hunting and pecking for real.

335
00:23:29.920 --> 00:23:33.119
Two REPO men barge into his apartment
and tell him they're there to repossess his

336
00:23:33.200 --> 00:23:37.559
car. He coolly tells him he
loaned it to a friend for a few

337
00:23:37.640 --> 00:23:40.799
days and the car is in Palm
Springs, and the men warn him that

338
00:23:40.839 --> 00:23:44.200
the car better be there the next
day by noon or there will be fireworks.

339
00:23:44.200 --> 00:23:45.279
And Joe says, well, don't
you say the cutest things? And

340
00:23:45.319 --> 00:23:49.119
I was like, is Joe is
Joe homo side? Is there a side

341
00:23:49.160 --> 00:23:53.400
of Homo? Is he a the
homicide squadh? Yeah? I don't think

342
00:23:53.480 --> 00:23:56.400
they were trying to code him at
all, but like that one line for

343
00:23:56.519 --> 00:24:02.920
a good portion of the movie,
maybe be like genuinely Joe's like like default

344
00:24:03.079 --> 00:24:06.440
is flirt, That's just he knows
he's charming. He's gonna try to charm

345
00:24:06.519 --> 00:24:10.000
you. Joe gillis bisexual king,
Yes, like Scarecrow from last week.

346
00:24:10.400 --> 00:24:12.039
I love the line there will be
fireworks because I'm like, are they going

347
00:24:12.119 --> 00:24:18.160
to beat him up? Like?
Is that the implications situation? Men do

348
00:24:18.319 --> 00:24:21.920
that? I think it's just more
you're gonna get sued by the government situation.

349
00:24:22.079 --> 00:24:23.880
I don't know what kind of repomen
you've been dealing with, but mine

350
00:24:23.920 --> 00:24:29.839
are very fist forward. I mean, I borrow all my money from the

351
00:24:29.880 --> 00:24:33.839
mafia, so they're very kind to
me. It's way better than working with

352
00:24:33.160 --> 00:24:37.240
And also you trade for sexual favors, that's so much safer. That's actually

353
00:24:37.240 --> 00:24:42.519
like like a bonus. Oh no
again, let me go put on my

354
00:24:42.559 --> 00:24:48.079
next Jay. Let's let's play hide
Salab. So as soon as the repoman

355
00:24:48.279 --> 00:24:52.680
leave, Joe actually takes his car, which he had stashed away behind this

356
00:24:52.720 --> 00:24:56.440
like shoeshine store on his street.
And there's a great line here that I

357
00:24:56.440 --> 00:25:00.200
love. He goes Rudy the shoeshine
man. Never act about your finances.

358
00:25:00.279 --> 00:25:03.720
You just look at your heel and
know the score. That's what we're that's

359
00:25:03.759 --> 00:25:08.079
the movie we're in. Yep,
Rudy is also black representation. He does

360
00:25:08.119 --> 00:25:11.759
not speak, but you do get
to see him for a solid two seconds.

361
00:25:11.200 --> 00:25:15.160
He's and he's named name. He's
a character. He's someone who hides

362
00:25:15.200 --> 00:25:18.960
Bill's car or Bill, I keep
calling him Bill, who hides Joe's car

363
00:25:18.000 --> 00:25:22.079
for him when when the repo men
are coming around. I don't know what

364
00:25:22.079 --> 00:25:26.559
more people want. Give this movie
an NAACP award today, all right?

365
00:25:26.599 --> 00:25:30.039
So he takes his car. He
drives over to Paramount to see mister Sheldrake,

366
00:25:30.119 --> 00:25:33.759
an executive who's always liked him.
He plans to pitch him a story

367
00:25:33.759 --> 00:25:37.160
and a hail Mary attempt to make
the two hundred and ninety dollars he needs

368
00:25:37.200 --> 00:25:38.960
to recoup his car. Did you
do the math? I didn't. Two

369
00:25:40.039 --> 00:25:44.279
hundred and ninety and today's money is
about thirty five hundred dollars. Okay,

370
00:25:44.319 --> 00:25:47.759
this it's not a small amount of
money. Joe pitches a story about a

371
00:25:47.799 --> 00:25:49.880
baseball player mixed up with the mob, and he says he's already submitted a

372
00:25:49.920 --> 00:25:55.799
forty page treatment to the studio.
Shel Drake calls in Betty Schaeffer played by

373
00:25:55.880 --> 00:26:00.240
Nancy Olsen. She's what from now
we would call the development department. In

374
00:26:00.279 --> 00:26:03.359
the movie, she's from the reader's
department. I'm like the boy they really

375
00:26:03.400 --> 00:26:08.039
beefed up that title between nineteen fifty
and like when I almost went into development,

376
00:26:10.119 --> 00:26:12.000
I would have been great. Yeah. So she's from the development department

377
00:26:12.039 --> 00:26:15.799
and he's shell Drake's like, hey, did you read this treatment from this

378
00:26:15.799 --> 00:26:18.960
guy named Joe Gillis? And she
walks into the office without seeing Joe behind

379
00:26:19.000 --> 00:26:22.000
her, and she tells shel Drake
that the script sucks. It's just a

380
00:26:22.000 --> 00:26:26.599
rehash of old ideas. I wouldn't
even bother to read it. And shell

381
00:26:26.680 --> 00:26:29.200
Drake's like, oh, by the
way, while you're here, miss Scheffer,

382
00:26:29.200 --> 00:26:32.400
I'd like to introduce you to the
writer, Joe Gillis. And so

383
00:26:32.480 --> 00:26:36.720
she turns around. She's really embarrassed, but she doesn't apologize for her tough

384
00:26:36.720 --> 00:26:38.559
assessment. She says, I know
you, I know what you've written in

385
00:26:38.559 --> 00:26:42.319
the past, and this is not
your best work. Yeah, exactly.

386
00:26:42.359 --> 00:26:47.960
So Joe, of course doesn't take
it kindly fair. He's like, he's

387
00:26:48.000 --> 00:26:48.960
like, okay, great, well
why don't you go why don't you tell

388
00:26:49.000 --> 00:26:52.240
me my mom died? Next?
Like what else do you have for me?

389
00:26:53.000 --> 00:26:57.480
And Betty like just apologizes again for
her tough assessment and then leaves,

390
00:26:57.920 --> 00:27:03.079
and Joe just begs Sheldrake for a
job. He's like, I'll take any

391
00:27:03.160 --> 00:27:06.039
job you have, I don't care
what it is, and Sheldrake tells him,

392
00:27:06.039 --> 00:27:08.839
look, there's just nothing available right
now. So when Nancy Olsen walked

393
00:27:08.839 --> 00:27:12.400
in as Betty Schaefer, I was
immediately like, oh, I like her.

394
00:27:12.440 --> 00:27:17.000
But then I couldn't figure out why
I loved her so instantly. And

395
00:27:17.000 --> 00:27:19.079
then I looked her up and I
realized that she is the love interest in

396
00:27:19.200 --> 00:27:22.319
The Abbsent Minded Professor, which is
a movie I watched about I don't know

397
00:27:22.519 --> 00:27:26.200
ten to twenty times with my sister
when I was young, and I was

398
00:27:26.279 --> 00:27:30.079
like, oh my god, I
think I'm predisposed to love this woman because

399
00:27:30.200 --> 00:27:33.640
she was I think her name is
Betty Carlyle in that movie something Carlyle.

400
00:27:33.680 --> 00:27:36.640
I can't remember the first name.
Yeah, and I loved that movie.

401
00:27:36.680 --> 00:27:41.480
I have not seen it since I
was probably eight years old. We should

402
00:27:41.519 --> 00:27:45.839
do it sometime, all right,
So Joe heads over to quote unquote Headquarters

403
00:27:45.880 --> 00:27:49.480
also known as Schwab's Drugstore, which
is a Hollywood hangout for writers and actors.

404
00:27:49.839 --> 00:27:53.319
He calls a bunch of people asking
for jobs. He says, I

405
00:27:53.400 --> 00:27:56.640
talked to a couple of yes minute
metro to me. They said no.

406
00:27:57.599 --> 00:28:03.160
That such a good line. He
locates his agent playing golf at a bel

407
00:28:03.240 --> 00:28:08.119
Air country club Erica. If we
have an agent on screen and they're not

408
00:28:08.200 --> 00:28:14.559
playing golf, would the world end? It is such movie language for it

409
00:28:14.720 --> 00:28:18.640
is an agent. Yeah, he
does nothing. They play golf. Joe

410
00:28:18.680 --> 00:28:21.880
asks his agent for the three hundred
dollars loan, and the agent tells him

411
00:28:21.880 --> 00:28:23.960
to lean into being poor. This
could finally make him a great writer.

412
00:28:25.160 --> 00:28:27.559
What a dick, What a day? I love, But it's so Hollywood.

413
00:28:27.559 --> 00:28:30.720
It's so like, hey, now
you're really hungry. This is gonna

414
00:28:30.759 --> 00:28:33.920
make you. This is gonna make
you great. Yeah, come on,

415
00:28:33.160 --> 00:28:37.920
kid, you gotta suffer, Oh
Jesus. And Joe's like, I write

416
00:28:37.960 --> 00:28:41.920
movies about baseball players. Yeah,
like I don't need to suffer. Hey,

417
00:28:41.000 --> 00:28:45.599
Joe's fine being middle Like he's not
trying to be the next Proost.

418
00:28:47.000 --> 00:28:49.119
He's not trying to be a great
writer. He just wants to write like

419
00:28:49.400 --> 00:28:53.559
popcorn movies that people will watch and
immediately forget about. And that is his

420
00:28:53.759 --> 00:28:59.079
entire ambition and he's cool with it. So defeated, Joe drives down Sunset

421
00:28:59.119 --> 00:29:03.079
on his way home, he starts
to seriously consider moving back to Dayton,

422
00:29:03.079 --> 00:29:06.279
Ohio, where he came from.
There's a very funny moment here where in

423
00:29:06.359 --> 00:29:10.920
its voiceover, and he's like imagining
the men like making fun of him when

424
00:29:10.920 --> 00:29:12.799
he goes back to Ohio, and
he's like, why don't you try making

425
00:29:12.799 --> 00:29:15.960
it in Hollywood if you're such a
big And then he interrupts himself and he

426
00:29:17.000 --> 00:29:21.359
goes, oh oh, And it's
because his pity party is interrupted by the

427
00:29:21.359 --> 00:29:25.720
two REPO men across the street,
so he sees them in real time and

428
00:29:25.759 --> 00:29:27.920
he's like, ohh. And then
the camera zooms forward and we see the

429
00:29:27.960 --> 00:29:32.799
REPO men across the street and they
see Joe, and then a chase he

430
00:29:32.920 --> 00:29:36.119
tries to outrun them. Basically,
he speeds down Sunset, hoping to get

431
00:29:36.119 --> 00:29:38.599
away, but he blows one of
his tires out and then makes a split

432
00:29:38.599 --> 00:29:42.799
second decision to pull into a driveway
in one of the old Rundown mansions on

433
00:29:42.839 --> 00:29:47.839
Sunset Boulevard. The REPO men don't
see him turn, and they speed right

434
00:29:47.839 --> 00:29:51.720
past him on the property of the
house he's on he sees a four car

435
00:29:51.799 --> 00:29:55.240
garage, so he hides his car
in it, and the only other car

436
00:29:55.240 --> 00:29:59.279
in the garage is an old fashioned
nineteen twenty nine. I had to look

437
00:29:59.319 --> 00:30:02.359
it up or I'd never heard of
this car before they mentioned the name in

438
00:30:02.400 --> 00:30:06.960
the movie. It's an Isada fred
SKINI. It's an Italian car. They

439
00:30:07.039 --> 00:30:11.119
only made like four hundred of these. Ah, it is an ultimate collector's

440
00:30:11.160 --> 00:30:15.279
item car. I can't even begin
to think what it was worth in nineteen

441
00:30:15.359 --> 00:30:18.480
fifty. Yeah, when like this
film was made, all right. He

442
00:30:18.519 --> 00:30:22.640
starts to approach this mansion. He's
talking about it in voiceover again, very

443
00:30:22.720 --> 00:30:26.920
purple prose. He talks about it
being like miss Havisham wants beautiful but well

444
00:30:26.960 --> 00:30:30.319
pasted its prime. He's about to
leave when here's a woman's voice call out

445
00:30:30.319 --> 00:30:34.880
from the balcony. You there,
You keep me waiting. She's mistaken him

446
00:30:34.880 --> 00:30:37.839
for someone Else's annoyed that it took
him so long to get to get there.

447
00:30:38.079 --> 00:30:41.319
She's obscured behind a screen. He
can't get a clear look at her,

448
00:30:41.839 --> 00:30:45.799
but just then a butler emerges from
the house, dressed in full butler

449
00:30:45.839 --> 00:30:51.119
regalia. Never has a butler buttled
so hard I mean English movie times ten.

450
00:30:51.400 --> 00:30:55.160
Yeah, yeah, and they introduced
himself. His name is Max.

451
00:30:55.279 --> 00:30:59.319
He's played by Eric von Stroheim,
famous film director. Yeah, not an

452
00:30:59.359 --> 00:31:02.000
actor. How good is he in
this movie? Great? Got an oscar?

453
00:31:02.039 --> 00:31:04.640
Nod. It's like if like Steven
Spielberg made a movie today and cast

454
00:31:04.680 --> 00:31:08.039
George Lucas to play a button and
then George Lucas was good, and George

455
00:31:08.079 --> 00:31:15.240
Lucas was fucking amazing. He has
a slight German accent. I think that's

456
00:31:15.319 --> 00:31:22.200
not slight. Nothing I like more
than a sinister German butler perfect. So

457
00:31:22.359 --> 00:31:27.440
Max impatiently tells Joe that he's not
properly dressed for the occasion. What occasion?

458
00:31:27.599 --> 00:31:32.160
What is going on? I cannot
believe that. At no point in

459
00:31:32.200 --> 00:31:34.559
this movie did Joe think, Man, do I have a great idea for

460
00:31:34.599 --> 00:31:41.119
a screenplayer? You're right, Joe
sucks. Go back to d Hi,

461
00:31:41.400 --> 00:31:45.000
Joe in my in my head.
The aftermath of this movie is Betty Schaeffer

462
00:31:45.039 --> 00:31:51.440
winning an Oscar for the screenplay of
Sunset. So he doesn't know what else

463
00:31:51.440 --> 00:31:52.519
to do. Joe just kind of
goes with the flow, right, He

464
00:31:52.559 --> 00:31:56.039
walks right in. He tries to
explain who he is to Max, but

465
00:31:56.039 --> 00:31:59.400
the woman upstairs keeps calling for him, and Max insists that Joe must not

466
00:31:59.480 --> 00:32:02.160
keep her way to any longer.
Amused, Joe's like, fine, find

467
00:32:02.559 --> 00:32:07.559
whatever, what else am I doing
today? He starts to go up the

468
00:32:07.559 --> 00:32:12.119
stairs and the smile on his face
is wiped clean erica. When Max says,

469
00:32:12.319 --> 00:32:16.000
if you need help, physic coffin
that called me? I'm sorry what

470
00:32:16.920 --> 00:32:20.720
coffin? Oh shit? This got
real? Yeah? Yeah, do we

471
00:32:20.759 --> 00:32:24.200
need to call the homo side squad? Joe's curiosity gets the better of him.

472
00:32:24.200 --> 00:32:28.720
Though curiosity killed the cat and it's
gonna kill Joe Gillis too. Yeah,

473
00:32:28.799 --> 00:32:32.480
he keeps heading towards the woman who's
calling for him. The woman is

474
00:32:32.519 --> 00:32:40.640
the once great and now totally fucking
insane Norma Desmond played by Glorious Wantson played

475
00:32:40.640 --> 00:32:45.279
by Academy Award winner In My Brain
Glorious Wanson, Now, I have a

476
00:32:45.319 --> 00:32:47.799
question for you. Do you think
that this is a serious question? I

477
00:32:47.839 --> 00:32:52.000
know sometimes I say that and I
can ridiculous. Only with you, do

478
00:32:52.079 --> 00:32:54.039
I have to be like, no, it's for real. Though this is

479
00:32:54.079 --> 00:32:59.559
a serious question. I do not
need a fart joke. Yeah. Yeah,

480
00:32:59.720 --> 00:33:04.519
Do you think that she becomes more
mad in the course of the movie,

481
00:33:04.960 --> 00:33:07.039
or does she just does she having
episodes or she pops in and out,

482
00:33:07.039 --> 00:33:12.559
because I felt like in the movie
there are times she's obviously seventy five

483
00:33:12.599 --> 00:33:14.680
percent of the way there, no
matter what. Yeah, but like it

484
00:33:14.720 --> 00:33:16.680
does feel like there are ebbs and
flows, and there are times in the

485
00:33:16.720 --> 00:33:21.799
movie where it really does almost feel
like you can see like the real person

486
00:33:22.400 --> 00:33:25.720
for a moment, like an actual
genuine like I think she genuinely likes Joe,

487
00:33:27.160 --> 00:33:29.039
oh for sure, And like,
I don't know, what do you

488
00:33:29.079 --> 00:33:30.680
think I think she's crazy? Do
you just think she's she's already crazy?

489
00:33:30.759 --> 00:33:36.559
Yeah, The difference is she doesn't
she has control. She loses control throughout

490
00:33:36.599 --> 00:33:39.720
the film, but like for now, she has control, and she's she's

491
00:33:39.799 --> 00:33:44.319
functional. But no, no,
no, this you're talking about someone who

492
00:33:44.400 --> 00:33:47.720
has and I'm not exaggerating. If
you watch the movie, over a hundred

493
00:33:47.839 --> 00:33:51.839
pictures of herself in her own house. So wait, is that weird?

494
00:33:52.920 --> 00:33:55.400
I've been meaning to talk to you
about this room, about the shrine.

495
00:33:55.519 --> 00:34:00.880
Yeah, so look, I get
I get the face shots. It's the

496
00:34:00.119 --> 00:34:05.200
it's the ab shots. It's the
close ups of all your of your abs,

497
00:34:05.200 --> 00:34:07.400
in this room because I don't know
how to tell you this this those

498
00:34:07.440 --> 00:34:15.840
are not photography worthy as this line, the shrine is writing a check that

499
00:34:15.920 --> 00:34:21.679
your abs are not cashing. Perhaps
thighs. I would go with another body

500
00:34:22.079 --> 00:34:24.840
part if we're gonna do this.
Yeah, I do have a nice set

501
00:34:24.880 --> 00:34:30.559
of pins. But yeah no,
Like, if you like, all the

502
00:34:30.599 --> 00:34:34.400
clues are there because it's the movie, will pass it off. Is like

503
00:34:34.519 --> 00:34:37.880
my not mild but like eccentricity for
a while. But if this is not

504
00:34:37.960 --> 00:34:40.920
eccentricity, if you really think about
it, you talk about a woman who

505
00:34:42.000 --> 00:34:45.280
never leaves the house. His only
friend is her butler, who spends her

506
00:34:45.320 --> 00:34:50.840
days writing like returns to fan letters
and like is obsessed with herself in a

507
00:34:51.119 --> 00:34:59.480
truly crazy way. What a queen? What a queen? So Norma shows

508
00:34:59.559 --> 00:35:05.320
Joe and incredibly ornate Gothic style bedroom. That bed, which is a boat,

509
00:35:05.840 --> 00:35:08.199
will make me laugh every time I
watch this movie. I don't even

510
00:35:08.199 --> 00:35:10.519
know what kind of boat that is. It looks like a Viking pilot.

511
00:35:12.599 --> 00:35:17.760
It's like a miniatureized like worship.
Yes, it's insane. So she shows

512
00:35:17.800 --> 00:35:22.239
Joe into her like bedroom, her
weird gothic bedroom, and she she orders

513
00:35:22.280 --> 00:35:27.920
a satin lined coffin. You see
a body lying like a corpse, lying

514
00:35:28.119 --> 00:35:30.519
like on she put I put him
on the massage table next to the fire

515
00:35:30.559 --> 00:35:34.920
that he loves so much, used
to love poking at the flames. And

516
00:35:35.000 --> 00:35:37.920
at first you think, oh,
this is a child, like oh no,

517
00:35:37.559 --> 00:35:39.760
no, like this is terrible.
There's a dead child in this room.

518
00:35:40.000 --> 00:35:45.320
And then she lifts the blanket covering
the corpse. And this is a

519
00:35:45.400 --> 00:35:46.920
jump scare, I think, because
the first time I saw the movie,

520
00:35:46.960 --> 00:35:52.039
I jumped. A chimpanzee's arm falls
out like a big, hairy chimpanzee arm,

521
00:35:52.320 --> 00:35:54.719
and Joe physically recoils. He's like, what the fuck am I looking

522
00:35:54.760 --> 00:36:00.599
at? Yeah, So it turns
out she thinks he is the undertaker for

523
00:36:00.679 --> 00:36:07.800
her chimpanzee friend who has recently died, and she orders a very special coffin

524
00:36:07.840 --> 00:36:10.159
for him. I wanted to be
lined with satin in a festive color,

525
00:36:10.440 --> 00:36:15.039
pink or blue or maybe red,
bright, flaming red. Let's make it

526
00:36:15.079 --> 00:36:20.320
gay. Let's make it gay.
Joe finally like snaps out of it.

527
00:36:20.360 --> 00:36:22.760
He clears up the confusion. He
tells Norma he is not the animal undertaker.

528
00:36:22.800 --> 00:36:27.159
He's just some guy who pulled into
her driveway because it's he blew out

529
00:36:27.199 --> 00:36:30.840
a tire on the road. Norma
like is like, oh, then leave.

530
00:36:30.880 --> 00:36:34.199
She tells him to leave immediately,
but then he on his way out

531
00:36:34.280 --> 00:36:37.360
recognizes her. He's like, wait
a minute, I know who you are.

532
00:36:37.400 --> 00:36:43.000
Your Norma doesmond you used to be
big and Norma the first truly great

533
00:36:43.039 --> 00:36:45.639
normal line in the movie. She
turns to him and she goes, I

534
00:36:45.679 --> 00:36:50.639
am big. It's the pictures that
got small. She's not wrong. Holy

535
00:36:50.800 --> 00:36:53.679
shit, this this is the moment
you have to fall in love with this

536
00:36:53.719 --> 00:36:58.960
movie and this performance. Because the
first time you see the movie, did

537
00:36:59.000 --> 00:37:01.239
you have a moment where you're like, Okay, this performance is not working.

538
00:37:01.480 --> 00:37:05.000
Because that's that was my reaction the
first time I saw it, where

539
00:37:05.000 --> 00:37:07.440
I was like, like, the
first five minutes, my brain couldn't click

540
00:37:07.480 --> 00:37:10.039
into what she was doing. Uh
huh, And I was like, Okay,

541
00:37:10.039 --> 00:37:15.679
this is terrible. I think huh. And then once my brain clicks

542
00:37:15.679 --> 00:37:17.199
in and I think, it's this
line that did it for me. Yeah,

543
00:37:17.199 --> 00:37:22.039
because I think that's when you realize
she's not just like eccentric and rich,

544
00:37:22.079 --> 00:37:27.199
she's crazy. Yeah that I was
like, oh, actually I'm wrong.

545
00:37:27.320 --> 00:37:30.719
And this is one of the greatest
performances I've ever seen. It's so

546
00:37:30.039 --> 00:37:35.880
strong and bold that it genuinely teeters
on the edge of being too much.

547
00:37:35.920 --> 00:37:37.679
It blows the up everyone else off
the screen. You don't remember anybody else.

548
00:37:37.880 --> 00:37:40.320
I did not have that moment,
I think partially because I just simply

549
00:37:40.360 --> 00:37:45.119
had seen so many clips of the
movie that I knew what to expect,

550
00:37:45.159 --> 00:37:49.360
and I knew what was coming,
even though I hadn't seen the entire arc

551
00:37:49.400 --> 00:37:52.199
of the film. But I but
you're right, it is. It is

552
00:37:52.199 --> 00:37:55.639
a balancing act because it could got
It could have gone mommy, dearist in

553
00:37:55.679 --> 00:38:00.719
a second. Yes, it is
just the side of mommy. That's a

554
00:38:00.760 --> 00:38:04.360
great way to put it. Yeah. So then she starts to rant to

555
00:38:04.440 --> 00:38:07.719
Joe about the death of art in
Hollywood and how they, you know,

556
00:38:07.800 --> 00:38:10.800
quote unquote, they ruined the pictures
with their inane words. Words words.

557
00:38:10.960 --> 00:38:14.880
We didn't need words back when I, when I was a performer, we

558
00:38:14.920 --> 00:38:21.239
had faces. She gets especially irate
when Joe tells her he's a writer.

559
00:38:21.400 --> 00:38:22.159
Joe, what are you doing?
Come on, man, come on,

560
00:38:22.239 --> 00:38:25.599
man, use your head. You
tell her you're a fucking cinematographer. Love

561
00:38:25.639 --> 00:38:29.719
that and She's like, get out
of here, get out of my house,

562
00:38:29.760 --> 00:38:32.519
and so he's like, gladly,
enjoy your life, lady. Yeah.

563
00:38:32.559 --> 00:38:36.800
He's about to make his hasty exit
when Norma stops him and says,

564
00:38:36.800 --> 00:38:38.119
wait a minute, join me in
the living room. I want to show

565
00:38:38.159 --> 00:38:43.320
you. Joe looks all around this
enormous room. It's decorated as though it's

566
00:38:43.360 --> 00:38:46.079
an eighteen Erica writes here, it's
decorated as though in eighteenth century Pope lives

567
00:38:46.079 --> 00:38:52.960
there. Correct ah, And then
he mutters intimate. He's also creeped out

568
00:38:52.960 --> 00:38:57.480
by the pipe organ that plays music
all on its own, because the wind

569
00:38:57.559 --> 00:39:01.920
comes in from the yard and makes
the whole thing wheeze out these discordant mones.

570
00:39:02.800 --> 00:39:07.159
Is that not the most interesting florish
you've ever seen in a movie?

571
00:39:07.199 --> 00:39:08.920
I was like, who thought of
that? Yeah, we can make this

572
00:39:09.159 --> 00:39:13.559
organ just make sounds, so the
whole thing becomes more haunted and bizarre.

573
00:39:13.719 --> 00:39:17.519
It's truly Phantom of the Opera in
here. Yeah, Norma shows Joe hurt.

574
00:39:19.079 --> 00:39:21.679
We're gonna call it a script.
It's more of a tomb. It's

575
00:39:21.719 --> 00:39:24.559
just a page deal. In pages
and pages of this of the movie she

576
00:39:24.559 --> 00:39:30.360
has written called Salome, or we
would say Salame the way people pronounce things.

577
00:39:30.400 --> 00:39:32.920
I'm like, I mean, she's
probably more right than we are.

578
00:39:32.960 --> 00:39:37.599
Really into hard o's and second syllables. It's Salome committed a homo side.

579
00:39:39.360 --> 00:39:43.559
She of course will star in it, and she will deign to let cecil

580
00:39:43.599 --> 00:39:45.880
b demil direct. Joe is doing
everything he can just not to laugh at

581
00:39:45.920 --> 00:39:50.400
her face. Yeah, like,
you're gonna star as Salame who was famously

582
00:39:50.719 --> 00:39:55.480
sixteen? Who else when? Yeah? Like, who else is gonna play

583
00:39:55.519 --> 00:40:00.920
her? Obviously it's gonna be me, Norma. She's a few pages of

584
00:40:00.039 --> 00:40:02.559
Joe, she demands it. He
reads them and offers him a drink.

585
00:40:04.119 --> 00:40:07.840
He decides to stay more just to
get the drink. Yeah, He's like,

586
00:40:07.840 --> 00:40:09.480
ooh a drink, Yeah, yes, please. So he reads her

587
00:40:09.559 --> 00:40:14.639
terrible script. In his voiceover,
he comments about her childish handwriting. While

588
00:40:14.639 --> 00:40:16.280
he's doing this, By the way, Max is there, and he like

589
00:40:16.800 --> 00:40:21.159
closes the curtains and brings a lamp
over and puts it right next to Joe

590
00:40:21.199 --> 00:40:25.119
so you can read better. So
Max is always around, Yeah, constantly

591
00:40:25.280 --> 00:40:32.400
making things better for Norma. Whatever
Normal wants, Max is facilitating, uh

592
00:40:32.480 --> 00:40:37.280
huh. Yeah, So Joe hatches
a plan. He tells her her script

593
00:40:37.320 --> 00:40:39.679
is very good, but it could
be truly great with some trimming and reorganizing.

594
00:40:39.719 --> 00:40:42.880
And she says, I won't have
it butchered, ha ha ha.

595
00:40:43.199 --> 00:40:45.639
But she takes the bait. She
offers him the job on the spot to

596
00:40:45.760 --> 00:40:49.320
be the script doctor. Essentially,
he warns you he's expensive five hundred dollars

597
00:40:49.360 --> 00:40:52.239
a week. She says, oh, don't worry about money. She also

598
00:40:52.280 --> 00:40:54.360
insists that he's stay overnight in the
apartment above the girg a of the garage.

599
00:40:54.719 --> 00:41:00.519
You were gonna say, like her, above the garage the garage,

600
00:41:00.719 --> 00:41:02.480
so he can get started first thing
in the morning. Joe is like,

601
00:41:02.519 --> 00:41:05.960
great, absolutely, I'll stay,
but he does put a little act like

602
00:41:06.000 --> 00:41:07.840
oh no, no, no,
oh no, no, normous, like

603
00:41:07.840 --> 00:41:08.719
I won't hear of it. You'll
stay here, Yes, this is the

604
00:41:08.719 --> 00:41:12.800
most important thing in your life right
now. So Max shows Joe to his

605
00:41:12.920 --> 00:41:15.719
room and tells him he made it
up for Joe this afternoon, almost like

606
00:41:15.800 --> 00:41:19.920
he knew he'd be staying. Joe
starts to ask how the hell Max knew

607
00:41:19.920 --> 00:41:21.920
he was gonna stay, But he
decides the better of it. He's like,

608
00:41:22.079 --> 00:41:23.639
okay, you know what I'm just
gonna let this ride. I'm not

609
00:41:23.679 --> 00:41:29.360
gonna look a gift tour in the
mouth. Ha ha. Max then tells

610
00:41:29.440 --> 00:41:34.239
Joe how Madame was the greatest star
of them all. In her heyday,

611
00:41:34.360 --> 00:41:40.119
Norma received seventeen thousand fan letters a
week, and a maharaja from India flew

612
00:41:40.320 --> 00:41:45.760
all the way to California just to
beg for one of her silk stockings.

613
00:41:45.079 --> 00:41:52.880
In the end, he strangled himself
with it. Holy shit. So,

614
00:41:53.159 --> 00:41:57.840
after Max leaves, Joe looks out
of the window at the crumbling estate and

615
00:41:57.880 --> 00:42:01.360
wonders how many famous faces of yesterdayear
had played tennis on the now defunct court

616
00:42:01.599 --> 00:42:07.480
or swam in the now empty pool. He sees Max and Norma. She

617
00:42:07.639 --> 00:42:12.599
is now dressed in all black like
with like a long black veil, and

618
00:42:12.639 --> 00:42:17.880
she's holding a large candelabray more gothic. And she sees them exiting the house

619
00:42:19.000 --> 00:42:22.119
and bury the chickeney yard. She
just say, when she thinks he's the

620
00:42:22.119 --> 00:42:24.360
animal handler, is it legal to
bury him in the yard? I don't

621
00:42:24.360 --> 00:42:28.960
care. I don't care. So
she is at least somewhat aware that maybe

622
00:42:28.960 --> 00:42:35.159
there might be zoning regulations. So
the two of them bury it with great

623
00:42:35.159 --> 00:42:38.280
dignity. The next morning, Joe
awakens to find someone has gaunt his apartment,

624
00:42:38.679 --> 00:42:42.760
brought all of his things and laid
them neatly out in the room that

625
00:42:42.840 --> 00:42:45.920
he was sleeping in without waking him
up. Creepy, creepy. There are

626
00:42:45.920 --> 00:42:52.280
shades of misery in the setup.
Are this movie like walks of misery?

627
00:42:52.280 --> 00:42:57.320
Could run? He runs into the
house. He confronts Max about breaking into

628
00:42:57.320 --> 00:43:00.079
his apartment. Max is very busy, like playing the playing the organ in

629
00:43:00.079 --> 00:43:05.719
the living room. Norma interrupts his
yelling and makes it clear that Joe needs

630
00:43:05.719 --> 00:43:07.440
to stay at her house if he
wants to keep this job. She also

631
00:43:07.519 --> 00:43:10.159
casually tells him that she paid the
three months rent that he owed on his

632
00:43:10.199 --> 00:43:14.199
apartment and that brings job short,
right, He goes, wait a minute,

633
00:43:14.199 --> 00:43:15.840
you paid the rent, so I'm
he's out of debt. Now what

634
00:43:16.039 --> 00:43:19.960
sells the car? But like,
okay, wait, that's weird. In

635
00:43:20.000 --> 00:43:22.639
the end, he agrees to stay
for a week or two until the job

636
00:43:22.719 --> 00:43:25.039
is done. Okay, I do
have one question about the movie that I

637
00:43:25.039 --> 00:43:29.960
can't quite parse. Yeah, does
she have money or not? Oh?

638
00:43:30.079 --> 00:43:32.360
Yeah, okay, so why is
the house so run down? It's because

639
00:43:32.360 --> 00:43:36.480
she never leaves the house. Yeah, I think so, because Max is

640
00:43:36.559 --> 00:43:40.679
just one man, and so he
can maintain like the bedroom, the living

641
00:43:40.760 --> 00:43:45.159
room. Why don't they have a
gardener and a pool person and blah blah

642
00:43:45.199 --> 00:43:49.400
blah. I don't know. Frankly, there's no real explanation for that except

643
00:43:49.440 --> 00:43:52.559
that they're both they're both crazy.
Yes, slight spoiler, Max is also

644
00:43:52.679 --> 00:43:57.760
crazy. Yeah, they're in their
fantasy world. They're not paying attention to

645
00:43:57.800 --> 00:44:00.679
anything else. Okay, because I
was, I wasn't sure. I thought

646
00:44:00.760 --> 00:44:04.400
at first that she was just stringing
him like or that she genuinely thought she

647
00:44:04.480 --> 00:44:07.440
had money, but she didn't.
I realized she strinks him a long later

648
00:44:07.519 --> 00:44:09.760
to keep him there, so she
doesn't actually give him a lot of money

649
00:44:09.760 --> 00:44:15.000
because she doesn't want him to leave. But like I was a little confused

650
00:44:15.039 --> 00:44:17.159
to what the state was meant to
be her. Yeah, no, she

651
00:44:17.320 --> 00:44:21.719
I think she's as rich as she
claims to be because she talks about owning

652
00:44:21.800 --> 00:44:25.039
oil fields. Oh that's right,
Shit has oil rigs in Baker's field or

653
00:44:25.039 --> 00:44:29.079
whatever. And I'm like, oh, so she's because it would make some

654
00:44:29.119 --> 00:44:30.679
sense if this is all still movie
money. She's hanging on too, I'm

655
00:44:30.719 --> 00:44:34.920
like, this had to have run
out thirty like it's been thirty years since

656
00:44:34.920 --> 00:44:37.400
she made a movie. But no, she also owns oil and three blocks

657
00:44:37.440 --> 00:44:42.320
downtown that she lets rent on.
So no, no, she is genuinely

658
00:44:42.559 --> 00:44:45.880
like loaded loaded. Okay, so
we watched the weeks pass by. Joe

659
00:44:45.880 --> 00:44:52.079
finds he's unable to complete the script. It's so terrible that he cannot adequately

660
00:44:52.119 --> 00:44:57.440
fix it, particularly because Norma is
always looking over his shoulder and refusing to

661
00:44:57.440 --> 00:44:59.559
cut scenes. No, that's very
important. You can't take that out.

662
00:44:59.599 --> 00:45:01.079
That's insane. We need that they
want to see me, they want to

663
00:45:01.079 --> 00:45:04.400
see my face, that people miss
me. Right. At one point in

664
00:45:04.440 --> 00:45:07.440
the scene, she like he looks
over at her and she's just signing like

665
00:45:07.559 --> 00:45:12.400
autographs and signing like headshots for different
people who sent her letters. So she's

666
00:45:12.400 --> 00:45:16.159
still getting letters every week. So
the movie kind of doesn't really get into

667
00:45:16.199 --> 00:45:20.599
the timeline very much. We know
this all unfolds over the course of six

668
00:45:20.639 --> 00:45:23.039
months, but I think at this
point we're now at least a month or

669
00:45:23.039 --> 00:45:28.280
two in. So we flash forward
to a month or two in and Joe

670
00:45:28.360 --> 00:45:32.119
is starting to get real like cabin
fever. So he and Norma like never

671
00:45:32.239 --> 00:45:37.280
leave the house. And for entertainment, they have quote unquote movie nights in

672
00:45:37.320 --> 00:45:39.719
her private screening room, which I
guess in nineteen fifty would have been the

673
00:45:39.880 --> 00:45:45.440
absolute biggest flex you could have.
So they shows the two of them sitting

674
00:45:45.480 --> 00:45:49.360
down. She's in her fineness,
she dresses in like a ball gown to

675
00:45:49.400 --> 00:45:52.480
watch a fucking movie. And then
the movie turns on and we see that

676
00:45:52.519 --> 00:45:57.599
it's one of hers. Yeah,
she's completely enraptured by her own image Norma.

677
00:45:57.639 --> 00:46:00.960
Not I'm sure. I'm sure Wanson
was very normal. Yeah, she

678
00:46:01.119 --> 00:46:06.639
just stares at herself and like she
can't stop looking at herself. And Joe's

679
00:46:06.719 --> 00:46:12.519
watching her watch herself, and he's
like mildly horrified by by what he's seeing.

680
00:46:13.039 --> 00:46:15.920
And at one point she gets so
worked up that she stands up as

681
00:46:15.960 --> 00:46:21.519
she declares that I will be back
on the screen again where I belong,

682
00:46:22.000 --> 00:46:29.440
And Joe's like, can we watch
literally anything else the Wizard of Oz?

683
00:46:29.639 --> 00:46:32.360
Have you seen snow White? Can
we try watching snow White? Any literally

684
00:46:32.440 --> 00:46:38.639
anything but another one of your fucking
movies. Her other form of entertainment is

685
00:46:38.679 --> 00:46:43.039
having her old friends over for a
bridge game. And this is my favorite

686
00:46:43.039 --> 00:46:45.119
scene in the movie, I think, and we have HB. Warner,

687
00:46:45.199 --> 00:46:51.679
Anna Nilsen, and the Great Buster
Keaton all playing themselves. Joe calls them

688
00:46:51.719 --> 00:46:54.840
all the waxworks, and this is
where we find out that Joe has yet

689
00:46:54.880 --> 00:46:59.079
to be paid by Norma for all
of his work on the script. He's

690
00:46:59.119 --> 00:47:02.039
staying there for free, and obviously
she's like feeding him and giving him whatever

691
00:47:02.039 --> 00:47:06.760
he wants, but he's not getting
any money from her. And the only

692
00:47:06.800 --> 00:47:10.159
money he has gotten so far is
half of her jackpot winnings from one of

693
00:47:10.159 --> 00:47:14.960
these bridge games, and the total
was seventy cents. Not a wind fall.

694
00:47:15.079 --> 00:47:16.639
Not a windfall, not the three
hundred and ninety he needs just to

695
00:47:16.639 --> 00:47:20.920
get his car back. The REPO
men show up. They've tracked him down

696
00:47:21.039 --> 00:47:23.199
and they are gonna tow his car
away. So Joe runs up to Norma.

697
00:47:23.360 --> 00:47:24.719
She's in the middle of the bridge
game. He's like, I have

698
00:47:24.760 --> 00:47:28.039
to speak with you right away.
She dismisses him. She says, you

699
00:47:28.159 --> 00:47:30.679
making me lose track of the cards. Go away, go away, go

700
00:47:30.719 --> 00:47:32.280
away. Look at I get that
he's in a crisis, but it is

701
00:47:32.360 --> 00:47:35.880
rude to interrupt someone who's trying to
keep track of the card game, I

702
00:47:35.920 --> 00:47:38.719
will say that. So Joe rushes
out to the balcony and he watches as

703
00:47:38.760 --> 00:47:42.039
his car gets towed. I love
that, Like he's basically in full view

704
00:47:42.079 --> 00:47:44.119
of the REPO man, who I
guess don't really care about him. They

705
00:47:44.119 --> 00:47:46.639
have the car now, so they're
over it. Norma comes out and he's

706
00:47:46.679 --> 00:47:50.760
like, well, I lost my
car because you wouldn't pay me the money

707
00:47:50.760 --> 00:47:52.519
that you owe me, basically,
and she goes, already you talking about

708
00:47:52.519 --> 00:47:54.599
we don't need two cars, we
have the other one. You're fine,

709
00:47:54.599 --> 00:47:59.079
you can use my car. I
have a theory, it's not verified in

710
00:47:59.119 --> 00:48:02.719
the movie. I think she tracked
down the repomen. She knows full well

711
00:48:02.840 --> 00:48:07.599
how important this is, and she's
just playing the flighty fool here. She's

712
00:48:07.639 --> 00:48:10.119
still super in control and she's like, don't bother me, I'm playing my

713
00:48:10.159 --> 00:48:15.039
game. Yeah. And again,
I don't know why Joe doesn't just like

714
00:48:15.079 --> 00:48:17.920
pick her up and shake her and
be like pay me what you owe me

715
00:48:19.119 --> 00:48:25.920
now, or I'll murder Buster Keaton. But no, not you, Buster,

716
00:48:27.280 --> 00:48:30.719
take Anna Nielsen. No one remembers
her. I think it's it's something

717
00:48:30.800 --> 00:48:35.199
he is self loathing, Like we
haven't talked about this like he is depressed.

718
00:48:35.199 --> 00:48:37.360
He is depressed, and he like
you talked about him, not like

719
00:48:37.400 --> 00:48:40.719
he's not trying to write a you
know, the next Great American film or

720
00:48:40.719 --> 00:48:44.880
anything like that. But I think
I think there is something in the character

721
00:48:44.920 --> 00:48:47.280
that maybe he does want to but
he never actually tries. Yeah, Like

722
00:48:47.440 --> 00:48:51.800
like like, okay, Joe,
you have friends that you could sleep from

723
00:48:51.800 --> 00:48:53.280
their couch or down your luck,
maybe go pick up a shift at the

724
00:48:53.280 --> 00:48:59.519
local diner, like get a job, make some money, and get away

725
00:48:59.559 --> 00:49:02.119
from this this herodin that you that
you're just staying with because it's easy,

726
00:49:02.119 --> 00:49:06.800
because you're too afraid to like go
do the hard thing. Yeah, And

727
00:49:07.119 --> 00:49:09.760
there's something about that in the character, which I think is very well performed

728
00:49:10.400 --> 00:49:16.760
because it's subtextual agreed, agreed,
the because the voiceover dialogue is so funny,

729
00:49:17.199 --> 00:49:22.960
you could miss the like he hates
himself. Yeah. So the last

730
00:49:22.960 --> 00:49:24.719
line of that last scene was Norma's
like, don't worry, we can use

731
00:49:24.760 --> 00:49:29.159
my car. She's now she's not
saying you, She's saying wee. She's

732
00:49:29.199 --> 00:49:31.800
weeing them both wee wee wee.
We're a couple. Yeah, we're one

733
00:49:31.840 --> 00:49:37.639
item. So cut straight to Joe
and Norma being chauffed around Mulholland by Max

734
00:49:37.719 --> 00:49:43.119
in her antique car. The car
is open, right, It's like it's

735
00:49:43.159 --> 00:49:45.320
like a model Tea or whatever.
I don't even I mean it isn't it's

736
00:49:45.320 --> 00:49:49.239
a fancier than that, but that's
the like if you want any image,

737
00:49:49.119 --> 00:49:52.280
Yeah, it's like a model t
it's open and like the chauffeur is its

738
00:49:52.320 --> 00:49:58.039
own separate compartment. So it's meant
for like a very wealthy like aristocrat to

739
00:49:58.039 --> 00:50:01.400
be chaffed around in this car in
the f twenties. The interior is lined

740
00:50:01.440 --> 00:50:07.599
in leopard prints like that clearly was
done specifically just for Norma. And I'm

741
00:50:07.639 --> 00:50:12.199
like, it's a Joe. Someone
like Joe who's very like meat and potatoes

742
00:50:12.400 --> 00:50:17.360
and like has a lot of pride, must be like fucking mortified to be

743
00:50:17.519 --> 00:50:24.480
seen in this car. So Norma
decides she wants to dress Joe up to

744
00:50:24.559 --> 00:50:28.559
match her grandeur. And he's like, nope, I don't need clothes,

745
00:50:29.039 --> 00:50:30.760
leave me alone, Norma, And
she's like, no, nonsense, you

746
00:50:30.760 --> 00:50:34.320
need new shirts. And I'm so
tired of seeing you in the same jacket

747
00:50:34.320 --> 00:50:37.800
all the time. So she orders
Max to take them to the best men's

748
00:50:37.840 --> 00:50:43.519
clothing shop in town, and despite
Joe's protestations, Norma buys him a whole

749
00:50:43.679 --> 00:50:46.000
new wardrobe, including a tuxedo in
tails. And he's like, tails,

750
00:50:46.440 --> 00:50:50.679
no one has worn tails in a
decade. What are you doing And she's

751
00:50:50.760 --> 00:50:53.119
like, nonsense, you need it
for the New Year's Eve party. So

752
00:50:53.159 --> 00:50:58.639
he's starting to obviously feel really uneasy
about this whole thing he has somehow gotten

753
00:50:58.719 --> 00:51:01.239
himself into. Yeah, of course, right in his moment of like highest

754
00:51:01.280 --> 00:51:08.199
self loathing, some perfectly cast you
mean John Waters proto Oh my god,

755
00:51:08.239 --> 00:51:15.760
it's John Waters, Like this unbelievably
perfectly cast man playing this greasy salesman approaches

756
00:51:15.880 --> 00:51:19.280
Joe with a couple of options for
overcoats and he's like, well, you

757
00:51:19.280 --> 00:51:22.960
could take the camel hair, which
is very nice, but I've also got

758
00:51:22.960 --> 00:51:27.079
this vicuna as well, and he's
like it's much softer than than the camel

759
00:51:27.119 --> 00:51:30.599
hair, and Joe's like, camel
hair is fine, and he leans into

760
00:51:30.679 --> 00:51:35.199
him and then like you see a
glint from his gold tooth as he's saying

761
00:51:35.199 --> 00:51:37.360
this, and he's like, well, as long as the lady is paying

762
00:51:37.480 --> 00:51:43.239
for it, salacious wink, why
not take the vacuna? Yeah, take

763
00:51:43.280 --> 00:51:46.679
the vacuna and Joe, I mean
Joe's credit, he doesn't throw him out

764
00:51:46.679 --> 00:51:52.800
the window. What do you think
taking the vacuna means, Ah, that's

765
00:51:52.840 --> 00:51:57.719
a code for something, that's code. Yeah, well he's it's like buying.

766
00:51:57.840 --> 00:52:00.000
Why would you buy the milk and
you can get the cow for free?

767
00:52:00.360 --> 00:52:02.920
Like it's the opposite of that.
He's like, the vicuna comes with

768
00:52:04.039 --> 00:52:09.400
perse. Take the va the vicuna. She'll be happier if you take the

769
00:52:09.480 --> 00:52:15.119
vacuna. Yeah, you could take
the camel, but the camel really doesn't

770
00:52:15.159 --> 00:52:17.840
do very much for you. Take
the vacuna. Yeah, listen to the

771
00:52:17.880 --> 00:52:23.559
homo side and take the vacuna.
We cut to the last week in December.

772
00:52:23.760 --> 00:52:29.280
La is experiencing torrential rain. Joe
is forced to move into the main

773
00:52:29.320 --> 00:52:35.000
house because the roof and his garage
caves in and into normous. Oh my

774
00:52:35.039 --> 00:52:37.679
god, husband sweet, I wrote
it that way. That's not what they

775
00:52:37.719 --> 00:52:39.480
call it in the movie, but
that's what it is. But that's what

776
00:52:39.519 --> 00:52:43.519
it is. You're not wrong.
That is accurate. That is the husband's

777
00:52:43.519 --> 00:52:47.239
sweet where all of her ex husbands
have slept in the past, all three

778
00:52:47.280 --> 00:52:52.719
of them. Yep, and now
Joe and now Joe. He notices that

779
00:52:52.719 --> 00:52:55.119
there are any locks or even doorknobs
at any of the doors, and Max

780
00:52:55.280 --> 00:53:00.679
sombrely explains that Madam has episodes of
melancholy and has attempted suicide in the past.

781
00:53:01.239 --> 00:53:05.440
Her doctor suggested they remove all locks, hide all sharp objects, and

782
00:53:05.480 --> 00:53:10.039
have the guest turned off in Norma's
room. What what this is a haunted

783
00:53:10.039 --> 00:53:15.239
house? This is literally a haunted
Joe asks if the depression stems for her

784
00:53:15.239 --> 00:53:19.639
career being over, and posits that
the fan letters she receives every week ought

785
00:53:19.639 --> 00:53:22.480
to cheer her up, and Max
tells Joe and his German accent that perhaps

786
00:53:22.480 --> 00:53:27.599
he should look at the postmark on
those letters, and we realize that Max

787
00:53:28.119 --> 00:53:31.800
is writing dozens of letters a week
to Norma. How many different handwritings do

788
00:53:32.039 --> 00:53:36.039
is Max capable of or is Norma
too far gone to even notice? They're

789
00:53:36.039 --> 00:53:38.199
all in Max's I think he knows
three and he does like one for a

790
00:53:38.239 --> 00:53:43.559
teenage girl, one for a love
sick twenty year old man, and one

791
00:53:43.559 --> 00:53:46.199
for like an old housewife. Like
those are the three people who write,

792
00:53:46.280 --> 00:53:50.599
quote unquote write to Norma every week. We jumped to one week later,

793
00:53:50.760 --> 00:53:53.400
we see Joe walking down the stairs
in his tuxedo that Norma bought him for

794
00:53:53.440 --> 00:53:59.400
the New Year's Eve party that she's
throwing right In voiceover, he warns us

795
00:53:59.400 --> 00:54:02.000
that this is the he finally understood
Norma's feelings toward him, and he's now

796
00:54:02.079 --> 00:54:06.960
actually kind of embarrassed that it took
him this long to figure her out.

797
00:54:07.719 --> 00:54:12.199
Good he should be. This is
not a subtle woman. He gets downstairs

798
00:54:12.239 --> 00:54:15.760
to the ballroom, he finds it
ornately decorated with flowers, a sum shoous

799
00:54:15.800 --> 00:54:19.679
banquet. I don't know if you
notice. There's like a cake that's there

800
00:54:19.800 --> 00:54:22.400
that can feed one hundred people.
On this table. There's also this four

801
00:54:22.400 --> 00:54:27.599
piece orchestra. They're already there set
up. They're playing the tango. Norma

802
00:54:27.679 --> 00:54:30.440
dances over to him and she says, you look divine and he's like thanks,

803
00:54:31.960 --> 00:54:36.400
cool, cool, cool cool,
And they start to tangle. She's

804
00:54:36.400 --> 00:54:38.840
like, would you like to dance
to dance? I have this floor specially

805
00:54:38.880 --> 00:54:44.880
made for Valentino to dance on.
I have a theory that Rudolph Valentino is

806
00:54:44.920 --> 00:54:50.840
not dead. He is hiding from
Norma. She started to build things for

807
00:54:51.280 --> 00:54:53.599
Valentino and he's like, h uh
uh huh, Nope, I know where

808
00:54:53.599 --> 00:54:57.840
this is headed. I'm not dying
in a swimming pool. I'm not dummy.

809
00:54:58.199 --> 00:55:01.079
Ha VALENTI. You know he's in
the witness protection program. She is

810
00:55:01.119 --> 00:55:05.280
looking way too closely at my cod
piece. I am out of here.

811
00:55:05.880 --> 00:55:08.280
He did not take the vacuna.
He did not. Yeah, or he's

812
00:55:08.320 --> 00:55:13.920
buried in the yardwhere or she he's
underneath that chimp. He didn't die from

813
00:55:13.960 --> 00:55:16.960
some mysterious illness. He fucking she
would. She murdered him. He died

814
00:55:17.000 --> 00:55:22.639
from from chimp pops. So he's
she's like, dance with me, and

815
00:55:22.679 --> 00:55:25.719
he's like not on the same floor
as Valentino, and she's like shut up

816
00:55:25.719 --> 00:55:30.239
and dance very cute. Like Joe
is still being friendly to Norma. I

817
00:55:30.280 --> 00:55:34.320
think I get the impression that he
kind of likes her, Like we've glossed

818
00:55:34.320 --> 00:55:37.480
her over a couple of moments,
but there are moments where like it seems

819
00:55:37.519 --> 00:55:40.239
like they genuinely like each other,
like like she's a kooky old lady.

820
00:55:40.280 --> 00:55:45.400
And if you don't see the darkness
behind it, yeah, and you're someone

821
00:55:45.400 --> 00:55:47.719
who loves movies and you're like,
oh I do kind of like this person

822
00:55:47.880 --> 00:55:52.719
was a was my Forebear. Yeah
right, So like I get this like

823
00:55:52.039 --> 00:56:00.159
very genuine affection for her he has
and and I think a genuine affection that

824
00:56:00.199 --> 00:56:05.079
she has for him. Yeah,
that there is a reality to this relationship,

825
00:56:05.519 --> 00:56:08.960
even amidst all of this gothic horror, like the fact that she comes

826
00:56:09.000 --> 00:56:14.280
downstairs and she's dancing alone on the
dance floor, which is like Salame,

827
00:56:14.800 --> 00:56:19.079
right, Salame dances and dances the
Seven Veils and gets to like demand the

828
00:56:19.119 --> 00:56:22.280
head of John the Baptist on a
plate. Yeah right, Like that's kind

829
00:56:22.280 --> 00:56:25.159
of the imagery that we're condraing.
She has lots of like floating shawls on

830
00:56:25.199 --> 00:56:28.840
her or whatever, those things,
Like, yeah, I feel like that's

831
00:56:28.880 --> 00:56:34.920
intentional. I was trying to think
of like because okay, it's nineteen fifty.

832
00:56:35.079 --> 00:56:37.960
She was famous in the twenties.
That's only thirty years past, So

833
00:56:37.079 --> 00:56:42.360
like what who would be like an
equivalent to a Norma Desmond to us,

834
00:56:42.719 --> 00:56:45.239
like someone who was very famous in
the eighties, right, and then kind

835
00:56:45.280 --> 00:56:50.360
of disappeared. And then for some
reason my brain went to like Steve Gutenberg.

836
00:56:50.400 --> 00:56:53.199
He didn't disappear. He's still around, but like he's not as famous

837
00:56:53.199 --> 00:56:55.280
as he was in the nineteen eighties, and I was like, what if

838
00:56:55.280 --> 00:56:59.519
you, like, like, what
if it was someone as charming as Steve

839
00:56:59.519 --> 00:57:04.000
Guttenberg, you would probably go in
pretty deep before you realize, oh no,

840
00:57:04.039 --> 00:57:07.440
I'm in trouble. Yeah, has
not lost a step in his charisma?

841
00:57:07.679 --> 00:57:10.400
Yes, you put all points on
charisma, and he is. He's

842
00:57:10.480 --> 00:57:14.920
rolling natural twenty is. Imagine if
Steve Gutenberg was like, come live with

843
00:57:14.960 --> 00:57:16.440
me and hang out with me and
let me write the script, you would

844
00:57:16.559 --> 00:57:22.119
jump at the opportunity. I'd be
like, I'm living. Like what if

845
00:57:22.119 --> 00:57:25.400
this was Deborah Winger? You'd be
like, yes, Deborah Winger, I

846
00:57:25.400 --> 00:57:30.280
will live in your house and hang
out with you, and like yeah,

847
00:57:30.280 --> 00:57:34.920
and then like your you're four months
in? Yes, yes, you're four

848
00:57:34.960 --> 00:57:37.960
months in. And then Deborah Winger
is like staring at you on your sleep

849
00:57:37.239 --> 00:57:42.719
like like oh no, no,
Steve. Steve Gutenberg is having like a

850
00:57:42.760 --> 00:57:46.960
bust of you made out of Margarine
and you're like why why? So they

851
00:57:47.000 --> 00:57:52.519
start to tango and then like he's
he's kind of like pulling back from her,

852
00:57:52.719 --> 00:57:53.559
and she's like what's wrong with you? And he's like, your veil

853
00:57:53.599 --> 00:57:57.760
is tickling my face. It's very
cute, right, and she rips it

854
00:57:57.800 --> 00:58:00.199
off her head the veil and throws
to the ground, and we get a

855
00:58:00.239 --> 00:58:04.360
close up of this thing, and
you see that what she has ripped off

856
00:58:04.360 --> 00:58:08.039
her head and tossed without a second
thought is a diamond clasp that is probably

857
00:58:08.119 --> 00:58:13.719
worth a super yacht. Yeah,
like literal like hundreds of thousands of dollars

858
00:58:13.719 --> 00:58:16.239
in diamonds. She doesn't even think
about it, she just tosses it away.

859
00:58:16.360 --> 00:58:19.199
Yeah, And he kind of looks
at it. He looks at her,

860
00:58:19.239 --> 00:58:22.920
and he's like okay. Then they
keep dancing and she starts to get

861
00:58:23.239 --> 00:58:27.519
very very close to him. She's
like nuzzling up to his chest. Yeah,

862
00:58:27.599 --> 00:58:30.440
and he's he's into it for a
minute, and then he's kind of

863
00:58:30.519 --> 00:58:32.679
just getting uncomfortable with it because she's
getting a little too close. And he

864
00:58:32.719 --> 00:58:36.159
goes, hey, one of the
other guests arriving. It's after ten o'clock

865
00:58:36.199 --> 00:58:38.880
already, and she goes there are
no other guests. Tonight is just for

866
00:58:38.960 --> 00:58:42.840
the two of us, and he's
like, oh, sorry, what uh

867
00:58:42.880 --> 00:58:46.199
oh excuse me, Steve Gutenberg.
Yeah, I want to read you my

868
00:58:46.239 --> 00:58:50.880
note from this scene. Because this
entire scene, Max is like behind the

869
00:58:50.920 --> 00:58:54.719
bar with all the food, like
serving food, and I just wrote what

870
00:58:54.960 --> 00:59:00.639
exactly is Max's deal? This is
what I was like, Okay, I

871
00:59:00.679 --> 00:59:02.280
could kind of Okay, she has
a butler, right like the beginning,

872
00:59:02.639 --> 00:59:07.159
she has a butler whatever she was
famous. She has a butler, he

873
00:59:07.239 --> 00:59:08.400
says, a butler. She has
a butler, She has a but What

874
00:59:08.440 --> 00:59:15.159
the fuck is going on with the
fucking butler? Okay, just FYI just

875
00:59:15.239 --> 00:59:19.360
put in that, Yes, we
are going to discuss the butler. There

876
00:59:19.400 --> 00:59:22.320
will be an answer to that question. After an hour or two of just

877
00:59:22.360 --> 00:59:25.480
the two of them. Joe's discomfort
has n't wanting to crawl out of his

878
00:59:25.599 --> 00:59:30.039
skin. Norma is expounding upon her
plans for the future after they do this

879
00:59:30.239 --> 00:59:32.760
film, They're gonna make another film, and you're gonna buy him a boat.

880
00:59:34.159 --> 00:59:37.199
Blah blah blah blah. I'll let
him live in her house in Malibu.

881
00:59:37.440 --> 00:59:40.079
Yes, Joe can't take it any
longer. He blows up at Norma.

882
00:59:40.119 --> 00:59:43.320
He says, you can't take me
for granted, and she's like,

883
00:59:43.360 --> 00:59:45.199
what the fuck are you talking about? Obviously I could take you for granted.

884
00:59:45.599 --> 00:59:50.280
You're a whore. We're deeply in
love, Joe, can't you tell?

885
00:59:50.519 --> 00:59:52.519
He tries to tell her he's all
wrong for her. He should be

886
00:59:52.519 --> 00:59:54.519
with someone his own age, and
norma that gets her dander right. Oh,

887
00:59:54.559 --> 00:59:58.639
fuck me, there's the wrong thing
to say, because who who are

888
00:59:58.639 --> 01:00:00.920
you in love with? Probably some
car hop or dress extra. I love

889
01:00:00.960 --> 01:00:06.760
that line so much, She says
it with so much menace. Yeah,

890
01:00:06.800 --> 01:00:12.599
some carup or dress extra, some
low class peasant woman. Ha ha.

891
01:00:13.920 --> 01:00:16.960
She slaps Joe and she heads upstairs
to her room, and Joe grabs his

892
01:00:17.039 --> 01:00:22.199
fancy new ve Acuna coat and walks
out into the rainy night, looking for

893
01:00:22.280 --> 01:00:24.840
carefree people his own age. Yes, this is the moment. He's like

894
01:00:24.920 --> 01:00:28.079
literally out in the rain and he's
like, what am I doing? He's

895
01:00:28.119 --> 01:00:30.719
hitchhiking. Yeah, He's like,
I gotta get the fuck out of here.

896
01:00:30.760 --> 01:00:32.159
I gotta be with people my own
age. It's New Year's Eve.

897
01:00:32.480 --> 01:00:37.920
Yeah, Like Joe is thirty,
rights, he's young ish. It's forty

898
01:00:37.960 --> 01:00:40.480
five. I know, poor William
Holden. The funny thing is is like

899
01:00:40.679 --> 01:00:45.760
Gloria Swanson is like, is a
really young looking fifty. She does not

900
01:00:46.000 --> 01:00:51.400
look fifty at all, And he's
a pretty old looking thirty. He literally

901
01:00:51.519 --> 01:00:53.840
is thirty when he made this movie, or twenty nine even I don't even

902
01:00:53.880 --> 01:00:57.960
think he was thirty. But they
look the same age in a lot of

903
01:00:57.960 --> 01:01:00.360
the scenes. Yeah, the whole
like you're too old for me. I'm

904
01:01:00.400 --> 01:01:04.679
like, like, that's not the
problem. Yeah, which difference is not

905
01:01:04.719 --> 01:01:07.480
the problem. Definitely, you don't
look twenty years apart in age at all.

906
01:01:07.599 --> 01:01:12.360
So he hitchhikes to his friend Artie
Green's apartment. He's mentioned Arty a

907
01:01:12.360 --> 01:01:15.119
few times throughout the film as this
friend of his who's always good for like,

908
01:01:15.480 --> 01:01:17.960
you know, lending him a hand
and helping him out right, good

909
01:01:17.960 --> 01:01:22.000
guy. Artie is played by Jack
Webb. He has very two, very

910
01:01:22.000 --> 01:01:25.599
short scenes in the movie. He's
great, he really probables. So Artie's

911
01:01:25.639 --> 01:01:30.880
throwing this loud, crowded, incredibly
fun New Year's Eve parties. He is

912
01:01:30.920 --> 01:01:32.199
reminded you of the party of Breakast
the Tiffany. Yes, yeah, I

913
01:01:32.280 --> 01:01:35.880
was immediately. This is one of
those parties I think about when I think

914
01:01:35.920 --> 01:01:37.519
about, like, what fictional movie
party would I want to go to?

915
01:01:37.639 --> 01:01:40.239
This is one of them. Like
people around a piano, singing buttons and

916
01:01:40.320 --> 01:01:45.400
both yes, please, everyone's dancing. There's like shoulder to shoulder. It's

917
01:01:45.400 --> 01:01:49.440
so crowded, it's like it's a
fucking COVID nightmare, but I don't care.

918
01:01:50.639 --> 01:01:54.559
So everyone's also dressed normally for nineteen
fifty. No one's dressed up even

919
01:01:54.679 --> 01:01:58.840
like it's all kind of casual.
They none of them have taken the vakuna.

920
01:01:58.960 --> 01:02:00.840
This is the cool kids. These
are the hipsters, right. So

921
01:02:01.119 --> 01:02:06.840
Joe sticks out like a sore thumb
because he's wearing the the cuna coat and

922
01:02:06.960 --> 01:02:08.239
like, like literally, at one
point, Alreadie touches it. He's like,

923
01:02:08.320 --> 01:02:12.480
is this mink? What are you
wearing? And he's wearing his full

924
01:02:12.559 --> 01:02:15.559
like tuxedo and tails from like the
nineteen twenties underneath it. Right, So

925
01:02:15.800 --> 01:02:20.239
Artie is introducing him around, and
this is the line already goes everybody,

926
01:02:20.320 --> 01:02:24.199
everybody, This is Joe gillis,
well known Hollywood screenwriter, Uranium Smuggler and

927
01:02:24.320 --> 01:02:29.840
Black Dahlia suspect. And it's very
cute, and I'm like, Okay,

928
01:02:29.880 --> 01:02:34.000
I know exactly who Artie is and
I fucking love him. Yeah, So

929
01:02:34.119 --> 01:02:36.920
Altie asks, where have you been
the last few months you've disappeared? Are

930
01:02:36.920 --> 01:02:39.039
you a spy? Now? He
genuinely because it makes sense. Joe shows

931
01:02:39.119 --> 01:02:43.519
up looking like James Bond and He's
like, don't tell us you're working for

932
01:02:43.559 --> 01:02:46.679
the government. Joe skillfully avoids talking
about norma. He's like, I've been

933
01:02:46.719 --> 01:02:50.679
working, don't worry about it.
He asks Arti if he can crash on

934
01:02:50.719 --> 01:02:52.159
his couch for the next couple of
weeks. I need a place to stay.

935
01:02:52.280 --> 01:02:55.119
Start trying to get out, and
Artie's like, is the government coming

936
01:02:55.199 --> 01:03:00.000
going to come after us? Artie, of course, is like, absolutely,

937
01:03:00.119 --> 01:03:02.519
no problem. He's like, let
me run it by my girlfriend first.

938
01:03:02.519 --> 01:03:07.519
So he introduces Joe to his girlfriend. She turns around. It's Betty

939
01:03:07.679 --> 01:03:12.559
Schaeffer, the development executive of all
the gin joints in all the world.

940
01:03:14.639 --> 01:03:16.800
Betty pulls Joe aside. She tells
him she's been reading his older work.

941
01:03:16.880 --> 01:03:20.760
She says, I felt bad about
like cutting you off the knees. I

942
01:03:20.760 --> 01:03:22.320
didn't mean to like, So I
just went back some of your older stuff

943
01:03:22.360 --> 01:03:24.760
and I found something I really liked. And he's like, oh, you

944
01:03:24.840 --> 01:03:29.519
like that story. She's like,
I like six pages of it. That's

945
01:03:29.519 --> 01:03:34.519
such a good I like Betty so
much. I love Betty and I love

946
01:03:34.599 --> 01:03:38.199
this performance. I think she's so
plucky, which I hope that doesn't sound

947
01:03:38.239 --> 01:03:44.559
condescending about a female character, but
like it's so like lowest Lane energy.

948
01:03:44.679 --> 01:03:47.079
Yeah, well I think that's intentional. Right. Yeah, she's young,

949
01:03:47.199 --> 01:03:51.880
and she's ambitious and hungry, and
she's got wide eyes about Hollywood. Still,

950
01:03:52.039 --> 01:03:54.920
she is the opposite of Norman Testament. She's also the opposite of Joe.

951
01:03:55.159 --> 01:03:59.760
Joe is over it and cynical and
angry and like she's who he was

952
01:04:00.159 --> 01:04:01.920
years ago. Yeah. So she
says she likes the six pages in this

953
01:04:01.960 --> 01:04:04.159
short story. It's about a school
teacher, and she's like, look,

954
01:04:04.159 --> 01:04:06.320
why don't the two of us work
together. We can flesh it out,

955
01:04:06.360 --> 01:04:11.800
we can make it a script.
They start to like jokingly flirt. Now

956
01:04:11.840 --> 01:04:14.960
I want to explain to you what
my thought process was in this scene.

957
01:04:15.360 --> 01:04:19.159
Okay, because this is such a
stupid choice. You are now flirting with

958
01:04:19.239 --> 01:04:24.719
the girlfriend of your best friend who
just told you you could sleep on his

959
01:04:24.800 --> 01:04:29.719
couch. But he's not really like, it's not flirting flirting. They're having

960
01:04:29.760 --> 01:04:32.440
fun. Well exactly, Erica,
it's not flirting flirting, And I'm like,

961
01:04:32.760 --> 01:04:36.039
is he gay? Like that?
That's what it read like to me.

962
01:04:36.119 --> 01:04:41.679
It read like to me, and
you doing some stupid bit together.

963
01:04:42.679 --> 01:04:45.559
Yeah, Because I was like why
Because they start to basically do like a

964
01:04:45.599 --> 01:04:49.280
melodramatic like almost like a gone with
the Wind esque kind of scene together,

965
01:04:49.320 --> 01:04:54.440
and they're coming up with these lines
off their head and it's very charming.

966
01:04:53.760 --> 01:04:57.360
They're good writing partners, and they
hear each other, and like he starts

967
01:04:57.400 --> 01:05:00.639
to lean in and almost like sniff
her neck and their lips touching him,

968
01:05:00.679 --> 01:05:02.920
Like, what are you doing?
This only makes sense if you are literally

969
01:05:03.679 --> 01:05:08.400
no threat to Arty and already on
some level knows that, and like this

970
01:05:08.559 --> 01:05:12.679
is just you making a friend,
And like, for about twenty minutes in

971
01:05:12.679 --> 01:05:15.519
the movie, I'm like, maybe
maybe this is one of those situations where

972
01:05:15.559 --> 01:05:18.280
like he's like under the cover's gig. The movie will completely blow that up

973
01:05:18.360 --> 01:05:23.159
later, but like, for this
time, that's me like watching the movie

974
01:05:23.199 --> 01:05:26.239
being like, you're an idiot.
Maybe back then, too, it's a

975
01:05:26.239 --> 01:05:30.960
little more allowable. Maybe people didn't
read so much into things they both knew

976
01:05:30.960 --> 01:05:33.599
they were joking. Yeah, it's
not like that serious. If my husband

977
01:05:33.639 --> 01:05:38.280
walked in on me doing that with
another man, there would be blood on

978
01:05:38.320 --> 01:05:43.679
the floor. I don't know,
but I think I think I would get

979
01:05:43.760 --> 01:05:46.960
right away that this was all jokey
jokies also, but it's not that it

980
01:05:47.000 --> 01:05:50.519
isn't isn't it isn't it is also
it was William Holden, right, I'd

981
01:05:50.559 --> 01:05:57.519
be like no, So Joe,
he now has a place to stay.

982
01:05:57.559 --> 01:06:00.840
He rushes out into the party.
He calls Max. There's an moment earlier

983
01:06:00.880 --> 01:06:02.760
where these two girls are on the
phone. This is a movie that is

984
01:06:02.840 --> 01:06:08.239
chockhood of excellent performances, and these
two extras, who I'm sure are lovely,

985
01:06:08.400 --> 01:06:12.559
were lovely, lovely people. They
are going for it. Yeah,

986
01:06:11.800 --> 01:06:15.320
they are playing for the cheap seats
on the left or on the foot.

987
01:06:15.320 --> 01:06:18.159
It is. It sticks out like
a sore thumb of like whose daughters were

988
01:06:18.199 --> 01:06:23.519
you? So he gets to the
phone. He calls Max and tells Max

989
01:06:23.760 --> 01:06:26.599
to pack up his things. I'm
sorry, does Max work for you?

990
01:06:27.719 --> 01:06:30.960
Excuse me? Max lets him know
that he can't do it right now,

991
01:06:30.239 --> 01:06:34.239
Norma took Joe's razor and she cut
her wrists. The doctor's there with her

992
01:06:34.280 --> 01:06:39.599
now, and Joe immediately leaves the
party and rushes back to Norma's side.

993
01:06:39.760 --> 01:06:42.519
Right, So, like there's an
immediate like we were talking about, like

994
01:06:42.519 --> 01:06:45.079
there's a genuine affection. It doesn't
want to hurt Norma. He doesn't want

995
01:06:45.159 --> 01:06:47.440
bad things for Norma, but like
he's starting to get the impression that this

996
01:06:47.480 --> 01:06:51.559
is maybe a weird situation and he
wants to get out of it. Unfortunately,

997
01:06:51.800 --> 01:06:56.920
like like every woman in an SVU
episode, he doesn't follow his own

998
01:06:56.960 --> 01:07:01.440
instance. He goes into her bed. She has like the bandes on her

999
01:07:01.440 --> 01:07:03.920
wrists, she's covering her face.
Oh my god, I can't see me

1000
01:07:04.000 --> 01:07:08.920
like this. He chastises her for
doing something so drastic over and nobody like

1001
01:07:09.000 --> 01:07:11.360
him, and she just weeps and
says she'll do it again as soon as

1002
01:07:11.400 --> 01:07:15.519
she gets the chance. Oh girl, oh girl, your manipulations are out

1003
01:07:15.599 --> 01:07:19.760
front. Yeah, downstairs the band, which is still playing. At one

1004
01:07:19.760 --> 01:07:23.280
point, Joe comes in and Max
is like, don't run up the stairs.

1005
01:07:23.280 --> 01:07:26.599
The band can't know what happened,
So what does this band think is

1006
01:07:26.639 --> 01:07:29.480
going on? The band has just
been told to play, and they will

1007
01:07:29.480 --> 01:07:32.159
play until they're told to stop.
They showed up. A woman danced by

1008
01:07:32.199 --> 01:07:36.440
herself for thirty minutes. A man
showed up. A much younger man showed

1009
01:07:36.519 --> 01:07:42.239
up. The two of them danced
uncomfortably. She started talking and talking and

1010
01:07:42.280 --> 01:07:45.239
talking. He finally blew up at
her left the house. She went upstairs

1011
01:07:45.480 --> 01:07:51.039
now he's back. They've been playing
the entire time after their their blow up.

1012
01:07:51.239 --> 01:07:55.639
Yeah, and now they're playing odd
Lang Syne because it's been playing I'm

1013
01:07:55.639 --> 01:07:59.400
like, holy, they've just been
playing What's New Pussycat over and over again.

1014
01:08:00.719 --> 01:08:03.599
They're doing the John Lady like I
would. I would love to have

1015
01:08:03.639 --> 01:08:06.039
a chat with the fellows in that
band to be like, has she booked

1016
01:08:06.079 --> 01:08:09.679
you before? What else have you
seen in this? Did you know what

1017
01:08:09.719 --> 01:08:12.239
you were getting into when you said
yes to this? Max? At least

1018
01:08:12.239 --> 01:08:14.639
give you a five minute break and
some cake? Did she threaten you with

1019
01:08:14.639 --> 01:08:18.000
homo side? Ha ha ha?
So he sits down and he looks at

1020
01:08:18.319 --> 01:08:21.239
his hands, and then he stands
up and he walks over to Norma and

1021
01:08:21.239 --> 01:08:26.560
he very gently removes her hands from
her face. She's kind of covering her

1022
01:08:26.560 --> 01:08:30.199
face with her hands, and he
looks at her and he says, Happy

1023
01:08:30.239 --> 01:08:33.560
New Year, Norma, and she
says, happy New Year, Darling,

1024
01:08:34.720 --> 01:08:39.239
and she reaches up and she grabs
his lapels and she pulls him down and

1025
01:08:39.279 --> 01:08:45.159
they kiss, and he takes the
vacuna. So now he's in. Yeah,

1026
01:08:45.279 --> 01:08:49.039
it's the path of least resistance and
he does not want this lady's death

1027
01:08:49.079 --> 01:08:51.800
on his hands. Yep. So
he's like, you know what, fine,

1028
01:08:51.960 --> 01:08:59.159
Fine, there are worse lives.
You're right, he does care for

1029
01:08:59.199 --> 01:09:02.399
her, Yes, that's that happy
New Year is so sweet, even at

1030
01:09:02.399 --> 01:09:06.880
the very end, and we'll get
to it. He's not angry at her,

1031
01:09:08.560 --> 01:09:12.319
he's just done. And also I
think on some level he knows he's

1032
01:09:12.399 --> 01:09:15.520
hurting her by lying, by like
continuing to like let her live in this

1033
01:09:15.680 --> 01:09:19.560
delusion. Although he is not the
biggest sinner on not oh no, no,

1034
01:09:19.560 --> 01:09:23.279
no, not even not by a
mile, but like, but like

1035
01:09:23.359 --> 01:09:25.560
that's part of it. He's like, what am I doing? I'm like

1036
01:09:25.640 --> 01:09:29.840
feeding into her delusion that we're happily
in love and I've never been in it.

1037
01:09:29.880 --> 01:09:32.000
So we cut to a few weeks
later, after New Year's, after

1038
01:09:32.000 --> 01:09:35.039
the kiss, and after Joe and
Norma have become lovers, like officially have

1039
01:09:35.119 --> 01:09:40.800
become lovers. Betty has tracked Joe
down at Norma's and she has been calling

1040
01:09:40.920 --> 01:09:44.720
incessantly to get in touch with him, because she really thinks she's got something

1041
01:09:44.720 --> 01:09:47.319
on her hands here with the script. Max has been screening her calls,

1042
01:09:47.479 --> 01:09:51.560
and he's not giving the messages to
Joe. He's basically like, mister Gillis

1043
01:09:51.600 --> 01:09:57.359
is not available, he is dead. Stop calling him, and you're like,

1044
01:09:57.439 --> 01:10:00.600
oh my god. Meanwhile, Joe
is like decided, you know what,

1045
01:10:00.760 --> 01:10:04.560
fuck it, I'm leaning into being
a kept man. The amount of

1046
01:10:04.640 --> 01:10:11.079
movies we have covered with this plot
with male jigglows that we're just gonna talk

1047
01:10:11.119 --> 01:10:16.640
around being maleos where their whole self
worth is just like completely nullified because they

1048
01:10:16.640 --> 01:10:24.039
have they have sunk so low,
so deep into the depths of self hatred

1049
01:10:24.359 --> 01:10:30.880
and loathing that they have started sleeping
with a glamorous older woman who helps to

1050
01:10:30.960 --> 01:10:35.000
pay for their lifestyle. Again,
we're talking Paul Varjack from Breakfast at Tiffany's.

1051
01:10:35.079 --> 01:10:40.000
Yep, we're talking Johnny Castle from
Dirty Dance. Yes, yeah,

1052
01:10:40.079 --> 01:10:44.199
this fucking plot doesn't go away.
No, we haven't even done American jigglow,

1053
01:10:44.279 --> 01:10:46.720
but at least an American jiggle.
He's he's he's doing it, at

1054
01:10:46.800 --> 01:10:50.800
least with Joe from from Midnight Cowboy. He's like, I love having sex

1055
01:10:50.880 --> 01:10:54.239
voter late and I'm very good at
it and I'm great at it, and

1056
01:10:54.279 --> 01:10:56.840
I need the money. So this
is this is this is a win win

1057
01:10:56.920 --> 01:11:00.600
win. Everyone has a talent.
I love Joe's perspective on this, like

1058
01:11:00.840 --> 01:11:03.239
that Joe, not this Joe.
This show is so like he thought he

1059
01:11:03.279 --> 01:11:08.800
couldn't hate himself anymore, but now
taking money from this older lady has made

1060
01:11:08.840 --> 01:11:12.800
him hate himself so much more.
And I'm like, okay, this is

1061
01:11:12.840 --> 01:11:17.840
all very unhealthy. So this is
my favorite, my second favorite scene in

1062
01:11:17.840 --> 01:11:24.880
the film, because we get shirtless
wet William Holden holy shit. So he's

1063
01:11:24.960 --> 01:11:29.560
leaning into the kept Man saying he's
starting a romantic relationship with Norma. He's

1064
01:11:29.560 --> 01:11:32.680
in the swimming pool. She's watching
him swim in her swimming pool, and

1065
01:11:34.680 --> 01:11:40.319
lash as she's she keeps talking about
Demil and how she's so excited to show

1066
01:11:40.359 --> 01:11:44.680
Demil her script and like Venus is
in retrograde or whatever. Yeah, she's

1067
01:11:44.680 --> 01:11:46.199
into astrology too, because of course
she is. Of course she is.

1068
01:11:46.279 --> 01:11:48.880
She's like, this is the perfect
week. She gives him the job originally

1069
01:11:48.920 --> 01:11:53.239
because it's Sagittarius and they're trustworthy.
That's right. I forgot about that.

1070
01:11:53.560 --> 01:11:59.600
She would hate you. No one
likes no one likes Geminis. But literally

1071
01:11:59.600 --> 01:12:01.359
she's like, she's like, you
know, DeMille's a Leo and I'm a

1072
01:12:01.439 --> 01:12:04.239
Virgo and this is the week that
we would make a deal, and Joe's

1073
01:12:04.279 --> 01:12:08.840
like swimming in the pool and he's
like, okay. Cool. A few

1074
01:12:08.880 --> 01:12:12.000
nights later, they're on their way
to a dinner party and Norma realizes she's

1075
01:12:12.000 --> 01:12:15.159
out of cigarettes. So they're running. They're driving past Schwabs that was like

1076
01:12:15.199 --> 01:12:16.640
the old headquarters where he was calling
at the very beginning of the movie,

1077
01:12:16.640 --> 01:12:19.199
calling his agent and everything. So
he's like, all right, pull over,

1078
01:12:19.239 --> 01:12:21.640
I'll run in there and I'll buy
you some cigarettes. So he runs

1079
01:12:21.680 --> 01:12:26.239
into Schwabs. He runs into Artie
and Betty, and Betty is immediately like,

1080
01:12:26.279 --> 01:12:29.239
where have you been keeping yourself?
And he says, I haven't been

1081
01:12:29.279 --> 01:12:31.800
keeping myself at all. Best line
in the movie, right, yeah,

1082
01:12:31.960 --> 01:12:35.760
that's the best lining. I haven't
been keeping myself at all. Oh my

1083
01:12:35.880 --> 01:12:40.199
god, And that flies right over
his friend's heads. They're like, what

1084
01:12:40.199 --> 01:12:44.159
what You just don't think Jiggielow,
you just don't think of Betty's like,

1085
01:12:44.199 --> 01:12:46.319
okay, yeah, whatever, listen. I pitched that story that you wrote

1086
01:12:46.319 --> 01:12:49.479
about the school teacher to shell Drake. He loves it. He wants a

1087
01:12:49.520 --> 01:12:53.560
treatment for it right away. The
two of us should work on it,

1088
01:12:53.720 --> 01:12:56.880
Like, let's do this Joe's like, no, I'm not writing anymore.

1089
01:12:57.000 --> 01:13:00.520
Thanks. Betty is like, what
are you talking about? Like, help

1090
01:13:00.600 --> 01:13:02.239
me write it? Like, help
my career do me a solid here,

1091
01:13:03.039 --> 01:13:06.760
and Joe says he's not interested.
Max, while he's talking, starts to

1092
01:13:06.840 --> 01:13:11.840
lurk in the doorway, and Joe
immediately sees him and just leaves right away.

1093
01:13:12.000 --> 01:13:14.840
Yeah, he doesn't want to explain
who the fuck Max is. Yeah,

1094
01:13:14.840 --> 01:13:18.000
he's also still wearing like a fucking
tuxedo. Yeah, Like it's Betty

1095
01:13:18.039 --> 01:13:20.319
and are You're like, I didn't
write it inbout arty. He's like,

1096
01:13:20.399 --> 01:13:25.199
what are you wearing? How fast
would you jump to the idea that I

1097
01:13:25.239 --> 01:13:28.680
had become a kept boy if I
started showing her random places wearing a tuxedo?

1098
01:13:28.720 --> 01:13:30.119
I feel like that would be first
thought for you, you know,

1099
01:13:30.359 --> 01:13:34.000
only because these movies have trained me
that that's the first time. But genuinely

1100
01:13:34.520 --> 01:13:38.079
they're not wrong to be like you're
so you're a spy now, right,

1101
01:13:38.199 --> 01:13:42.680
Like you're an international man of mystery. That's what's happening. Yeah. So

1102
01:13:42.800 --> 01:13:45.199
Betty and already stare after Joe as
he rushes back to the car, and

1103
01:13:45.359 --> 01:13:47.439
Norma's like, where are my cigarettes? And He's like, you smoke too

1104
01:13:47.520 --> 01:13:51.680
much, Norma, and he gives
her backer money. Aha. In voiceover,

1105
01:13:51.960 --> 01:13:56.279
Joe tells us that Norma would put
on little shows for him when she

1106
01:13:56.319 --> 01:14:00.960
could sense he was quote unquote bored. But what we when she thinks he

1107
01:14:00.199 --> 01:14:06.039
is boredom we immediately know is self
loathing and full depression. He will sit

1108
01:14:06.079 --> 01:14:11.359
on the couch for hours and stare
at nothing, and he's thinking about Betty,

1109
01:14:11.399 --> 01:14:14.800
and he's thinking about writing, and
he's thinking about his lost career.

1110
01:14:14.840 --> 01:14:17.279
And Norma's like, you're bored,
let me do something for you. She

1111
01:14:17.479 --> 01:14:23.600
does a Folly's number, a whole
movie of Norman Desmond doing the Norman Desmond

1112
01:14:23.600 --> 01:14:28.600
follies. I would watch the whole
thing. She's doing like an Esther Williams

1113
01:14:28.640 --> 01:14:31.039
dance number, but on a coffee
table, not in a pool, like

1114
01:14:31.399 --> 01:14:36.560
jumps onto him from the like she
she's diving into the pool. It's so

1115
01:14:36.800 --> 01:14:41.720
cute, so cute. And then
she does she puts on the Charlie Chaplin's

1116
01:14:41.760 --> 01:14:47.600
tramp outfit and does a very like
reasonable impression impersonation of Charlie Chaplin, like

1117
01:14:47.960 --> 01:14:51.720
she's not bad at all, and
like she she like does little mustache and

1118
01:14:51.760 --> 01:14:55.920
everything, and it's super cute,
right, you would want a whole movie

1119
01:14:55.920 --> 01:14:59.479
of this. Oh. Absolutely.
It's also very funny that that that she's

1120
01:14:59.520 --> 01:15:03.279
willing to do that, that she's
willing to put on the Charlie Chaplin costume

1121
01:15:03.800 --> 01:15:08.159
and like try to entertain him.
I'm not saying it's healthy. I just

1122
01:15:08.159 --> 01:15:12.039
say like it doesn't. It almost
doesn't track entirely with her character until you

1123
01:15:12.039 --> 01:15:15.279
think about the fact that it's not. She needs applause, Yeah, she

1124
01:15:15.279 --> 01:15:17.720
needs attention. She needs attention,
and he's staring into nothingness. Yeah,

1125
01:15:17.760 --> 01:15:21.560
and so she's like literally like it's
escalating what she's doing. She literally just

1126
01:15:21.720 --> 01:15:25.439
hurled her body on top of him
and didn't do it. So now she's

1127
01:15:25.479 --> 01:15:30.920
like in drag doing a Charlie Chaplin
routine, doing like I need your attention

1128
01:15:30.079 --> 01:15:34.800
on me twenty four hours a day. Yeah. Holy I don't know how

1129
01:15:34.880 --> 01:15:39.039
Joe is held out this long for
really, like would I would have lost

1130
01:15:39.039 --> 01:15:42.960
my mind like way before this.
Yeah, So none of this is actually

1131
01:15:43.039 --> 01:15:45.920
cheering Joe up. He still looks
like he's like wants to like flee.

1132
01:15:46.159 --> 01:15:50.199
Yeah, he says he misses the
days before Hollywood made him jaded and cynical.

1133
01:15:50.239 --> 01:15:54.319
He's starting to think about Betty,
not in terms of like a romantic

1134
01:15:54.359 --> 01:15:57.159
interest, but he's like, I
used to be like that, Like I

1135
01:15:57.239 --> 01:16:00.399
used to be hungry, and I
used to want things that I used to

1136
01:15:59.560 --> 01:16:02.399
to look for good ideas and want
to work on them. And I don't

1137
01:16:02.439 --> 01:16:05.359
have that, Like it's gone and
I miss it, you know totally.

1138
01:16:05.439 --> 01:16:10.359
I really feel for Joe man.
That is a struggle, like especially for

1139
01:16:10.439 --> 01:16:13.560
writers, because you have to start
from zero when you're writing, Like that

1140
01:16:13.760 --> 01:16:16.000
is a fucking struggle. And like
if you could tell this movie was made

1141
01:16:16.039 --> 01:16:20.680
by writers. Norma gets a call
from Paramount Only Erica, it's not de

1142
01:16:20.840 --> 01:16:27.600
Mill, it's someone called Gordon Cole. She is not interested in this game

1143
01:16:27.680 --> 01:16:32.119
playing. She tells Max to give
Jordan the brush off. She furiously exclaims

1144
01:16:32.319 --> 01:16:36.880
that she will deign to return to
de Mill's call when she's good and ready.

1145
01:16:38.319 --> 01:16:42.079
Smash cut to Joe's voiceover three days
later. She was ready, HAA,

1146
01:16:43.199 --> 01:16:45.439
just to make it clear, so
I don't know if I did earlier.

1147
01:16:45.479 --> 01:16:47.600
She sent the script by this point
to Demil and is now just waiting

1148
01:16:47.600 --> 01:16:49.840
for him to call and be like, You're brilliant, You're wonderful. You

1149
01:16:49.840 --> 01:16:54.760
look like Linda Evangelista. Let's make
this movie together. Yep. Gordon Cale

1150
01:16:54.800 --> 01:16:58.199
has been calling every day and Norma
can't take the suspense any longer. She

1151
01:16:58.279 --> 01:17:02.600
has dragooned Max and driving her and
Joe to the Paramount lot. Can I

1152
01:17:02.640 --> 01:17:05.960
tell you when I went to Los
Angeles, huh for the first time.

1153
01:17:06.720 --> 01:17:12.199
I went to do the tour at
Paramount Pictures because of this film. Oh,

1154
01:17:12.239 --> 01:17:15.479
because I saw this moment and like
later, when they drive onto the

1155
01:17:15.479 --> 01:17:17.119
lot and they show the lot,
I was like, I need to see

1156
01:17:17.159 --> 01:17:21.399
that, and I specifically went to
stage eighteen. I wanted to see the

1157
01:17:21.439 --> 01:17:26.600
stage where this part took place.
That's wonderful. I'm not even sure they

1158
01:17:26.640 --> 01:17:29.119
actually filmed it at eighteen. It's
just the one they name in the movie.

1159
01:17:29.239 --> 01:17:30.680
Yeah. Yeah. And then the
other stage I saw was twenty five

1160
01:17:30.680 --> 01:17:34.439
where they made Frasier and Frankly,
my life is fullfilled. I'm done.

1161
01:17:34.479 --> 01:17:38.760
I'm done now. So they get
to the Paramount gate and there's a young

1162
01:17:38.800 --> 01:17:42.760
guard and he doesn't recognize Norma and
he tells Max he can't let them on

1163
01:17:42.760 --> 01:17:45.600
the lot without an appointment, and
Norma kind of hears this going on.

1164
01:17:45.680 --> 01:17:48.000
She looks up and she's an older
guard and she's like Jonesy. And the

1165
01:17:48.079 --> 01:17:53.079
older guard turns around and he not
only remembers Norma, but he adores her.

1166
01:17:53.159 --> 01:17:56.840
It's like miss Desmond. Yeah.
He tells his fellow guard that Norma

1167
01:17:56.840 --> 01:18:00.239
Desmond does not need an appointment to
enter the lot. He ushers her right

1168
01:18:00.279 --> 01:18:03.279
through. Norma and Jonesy agree that
without Norma Desmond the wouldn't even be a

1169
01:18:03.319 --> 01:18:06.680
Paramount. Yeah, right, so
this was she was a big star.

1170
01:18:08.000 --> 01:18:11.039
Yeah, she built this studio.
It's like, we have no concept of

1171
01:18:11.079 --> 01:18:15.960
that anymore because it's all so like
diffuse. But like there were three studios,

1172
01:18:15.119 --> 01:18:19.880
uh huh, and like seven stars
and seven stars and one star could

1173
01:18:19.880 --> 01:18:25.359
make enough money off their pictures to
fund an entire fucking studio. And that's

1174
01:18:25.359 --> 01:18:30.039
what she did for Paramount basically.
Yeah. It's also interesting that that the

1175
01:18:30.119 --> 01:18:32.680
guard knows her and loves her.
They make a point in the movie of

1176
01:18:32.720 --> 01:18:36.560
being like she was lovely once.
Yeah, like she was a lovely person

1177
01:18:36.680 --> 01:18:43.640
and she she has since soured.
We cut to a bustling film set and

1178
01:18:43.680 --> 01:18:47.039
we hear Cecil B. Demill's voice
directing his actors over a microphone while he's

1179
01:18:47.039 --> 01:18:50.520
setting up a shot and the film, funnily enough, is Samson and Delilah,

1180
01:18:50.560 --> 01:18:54.840
which was Cecil B. Demill's film
that he was making at the time

1181
01:18:54.840 --> 01:18:57.560
that they were shooting Sunset. Really, I don't know if this is his

1182
01:18:57.680 --> 01:19:00.479
actual film or if they just recreated
it as like the end joke, but

1183
01:19:00.560 --> 01:19:06.439
he in nineteen forty nine he released
Samson and Delia. By the way,

1184
01:19:06.640 --> 01:19:11.840
it is actually the real Cecil B. De Mill playing himself. He's not

1185
01:19:12.039 --> 01:19:15.359
bad, not bad at all.
So cecilby de Mill is like working in

1186
01:19:15.600 --> 01:19:18.319
the film set is crowded. There's
hundreds of people on this sound stage working,

1187
01:19:18.479 --> 01:19:21.600
you know, around the clock to
make this happen. An assistant comes

1188
01:19:21.600 --> 01:19:25.680
over to Demil and tells him that
Norma Desmond is on her way to see

1189
01:19:25.720 --> 01:19:29.720
him. And then the assistant,
who's a total shitthead. Again great performance,

1190
01:19:29.760 --> 01:19:33.640
because I got shithead immediately as soon
as this guy started talking. He's

1191
01:19:33.640 --> 01:19:38.359
like that old broad Norma Desmond's come
here to see you. She must be

1192
01:19:38.399 --> 01:19:43.319
about a million years old, like
like trying to like be chummy with Demil,

1193
01:19:43.399 --> 01:19:45.680
and de Mill looks at him and
goes, well, I hate to

1194
01:19:45.680 --> 01:19:48.920
think about how old that would make
me, because I'm old enough to be

1195
01:19:49.000 --> 01:19:53.640
her father. And that shuts the
other guy up right away. He shuts

1196
01:19:53.640 --> 01:19:57.600
a stupid fucking trap. Here's what
I love about this, Like the movie

1197
01:19:58.479 --> 01:20:01.359
in nineteen fifty does not have have
to acknowledge the misogyny, Yeah, like

1198
01:20:01.439 --> 01:20:05.520
aging in Hollywood and how it's vastly
different for men and women, but it

1199
01:20:05.560 --> 01:20:10.680
does. It actually engages with it. And because it's not just that Norma's

1200
01:20:10.760 --> 01:20:15.520
like crazy, it's that she's been
driven crazy because she's been made completely irrelevant

1201
01:20:15.560 --> 01:20:19.199
because she aged out. Yeah,
and that's so unfair because she had the

1202
01:20:19.199 --> 01:20:23.279
nerve to get older. Yeah.
And also she if she aged out twenty

1203
01:20:23.359 --> 01:20:26.319
years ago, that means she aged
out at thirty. At thirty, yeah,

1204
01:20:26.359 --> 01:20:30.000
that's so unfair that the age Joe
is now and he frankly he is

1205
01:20:30.000 --> 01:20:32.119
also aging out, but yeah,
in a different way. And so like

1206
01:20:32.840 --> 01:20:36.000
it's just so cruel. It's just
so so cruel, and Demil is the

1207
01:20:36.000 --> 01:20:41.319
only person who really acknowledges it.
It's funny you're expecting him to not because

1208
01:20:41.359 --> 01:20:45.760
of anything I know about Ces will
be the mil but like the movie sets

1209
01:20:45.760 --> 01:20:49.239
you up for a huge rejection,
Yeah, for him to be an asshole

1210
01:20:49.359 --> 01:20:54.039
or even not even asshole, but
even just dismissive or like, you know,

1211
01:20:54.159 --> 01:20:56.960
Norma is sorry, we had some
good times, but I'm not doing

1212
01:20:57.000 --> 01:21:00.079
this and he's not. He's like
incredibly kind the time, and it's a

1213
01:21:00.199 --> 01:21:03.520
very interesting choice. It just makes
it more tragic, I think. Yeah.

1214
01:21:03.560 --> 01:21:08.199
So Demil knows that she's there to
talk about her terrible salary script.

1215
01:21:08.239 --> 01:21:10.479
He's like, oh no, this
is probably about the script she sent me.

1216
01:21:11.039 --> 01:21:14.520
He's nervous about what to say to
her. It's terrible. He obviously

1217
01:21:14.560 --> 01:21:16.159
is not gonna make it. Oh
my god, how do I how do

1218
01:21:16.199 --> 01:21:18.880
I even tell her this? Like
I don't want to disappoint her. The

1219
01:21:18.920 --> 01:21:23.199
assistant offers to give her the brush
off, and Demil says, thirty million

1220
01:21:23.279 --> 01:21:27.199
fans have already given her the brush
off. Isn't that enough? So Demil

1221
01:21:27.279 --> 01:21:30.439
comes outside. He greets Norma warmly. He admits to reading her script,

1222
01:21:30.479 --> 01:21:34.479
and he actually looks like he's about
to say something, but she isn't paying

1223
01:21:34.479 --> 01:21:38.399
attention. She's so enamored of being
on set again. She's like, look

1224
01:21:38.439 --> 01:21:41.439
at all the lights and the people. And he's like, well, I've

1225
01:21:41.439 --> 01:21:44.279
read your script and she's like,
well, I know you had your assistant

1226
01:21:44.279 --> 01:21:47.079
Gordon Cole called me over ten times
instead of picking up the phone yourself,

1227
01:21:47.359 --> 01:21:49.840
and that was a real dirty trick
you played on me, Cecil. But

1228
01:21:49.880 --> 01:21:53.880
I'll forgive you because I know we're
gonna make an amazing picture together. I

1229
01:21:53.960 --> 01:21:58.439
forgive you sec just this once.
And he starts to look confused and he's

1230
01:21:58.479 --> 01:22:00.479
like, oh, okay, so
someone called you from Paramount. He's like,

1231
01:22:00.520 --> 01:22:03.840
how about you sit in my chair, Norma and watch as I rehearse

1232
01:22:03.920 --> 01:22:09.199
this scene and like kind of get
a feel for how films are made nowadays.

1233
01:22:09.439 --> 01:22:14.119
There is in a fantastic moment here
where Norma is sitting in the director's

1234
01:22:14.199 --> 01:22:18.840
chair and a microphone is coming down
like a line towards the set and it

1235
01:22:18.920 --> 01:22:27.000
hits her hat as she looks at
it with scorn, like you you ruined

1236
01:22:27.199 --> 01:22:32.560
everything. As she smacks it away, demill like deposits her there and then

1237
01:22:32.640 --> 01:22:35.520
goes to an assistant and says,
find out who Gordon Cole is and get

1238
01:22:35.560 --> 01:22:40.479
him on the phone right away.
Yeah, it's as if we never said

1239
01:22:40.520 --> 01:22:45.680
goodbye. The scene is completely lifted
for that Muta for the music. Even

1240
01:22:45.760 --> 01:22:48.159
Jonesy is the name of the guard
in the music. All Yeah, one

1241
01:22:48.199 --> 01:22:53.600
of the older electricians on the set
recognizes Norma and says, hello, hey,

1242
01:22:53.600 --> 01:22:56.439
miss Desmond, Miss Desmond, and
she looks a him and she recognizes

1243
01:22:56.560 --> 01:23:00.560
him. So the electrician shines a
spotlight on Norma so get a good look

1244
01:23:00.560 --> 01:23:02.960
at her face. And Norma like
the spotlight. It's like it's giving her

1245
01:23:03.000 --> 01:23:06.279
life. It's like it's like a
it's like a person with seasonal effective disorder

1246
01:23:06.359 --> 01:23:11.159
under a sun lamp. That's perfect. Yeah. Everyone over forty on the

1247
01:23:11.199 --> 01:23:15.159
set notices like the spotlight and sees
her and recognizes her and is excited to

1248
01:23:15.199 --> 01:23:18.319
see her. They rush towards her. Oh my god, that's Norman Steve

1249
01:23:18.359 --> 01:23:23.800
Gutenberg. Yeah, Oh my gosh, I love Steve Gutenberg. Oh my

1250
01:23:23.840 --> 01:23:30.199
god, that's Tony Kittain. This
is the peak for Norma, right,

1251
01:23:30.279 --> 01:23:33.800
this will be the high point of
the film for Norma Desmond, her moment

1252
01:23:33.800 --> 01:23:38.960
of happiness. It's like we saw
Jonathan Taylor Thomas on the street. Yes,

1253
01:23:39.159 --> 01:23:45.640
They're like, it's you, you, Yes, you used to be

1254
01:23:45.720 --> 01:23:47.680
big. And then Jonathan Taylor Thomas
turns to you and says, I am

1255
01:23:47.760 --> 01:23:54.960
big. It's the pictures that got
sitcoms that got small. It's the mid

1256
01:23:55.000 --> 01:23:59.960
sized family sitcoms that got small.
So we cut to the mill he's got.

1257
01:24:00.159 --> 01:24:02.319
He's gotten on the phone with Gordon
Cole. Turns out Cole works in

1258
01:24:02.359 --> 01:24:06.600
the props department. His only interest
in Norma is in her car. They're

1259
01:24:06.600 --> 01:24:10.800
interested in renting it for a few
weeks for a bing Crosby picture. That's

1260
01:24:10.800 --> 01:24:14.399
why he keeps calling her. Oh
man, that is a real kick in

1261
01:24:14.439 --> 01:24:19.239
the tits. Demill is like,
all right, fine, and he goes

1262
01:24:19.279 --> 01:24:23.159
back. He's gonna break the news
to Norma and then he sees it.

1263
01:24:23.239 --> 01:24:28.000
She's crying and she's just said,
I'm just so moved by how much everyone

1264
01:24:28.159 --> 01:24:30.640
liked me, and I'm so happy
to be back on the set. And

1265
01:24:30.760 --> 01:24:33.520
Salomon is going to be the greatest
film either of us ever do. It

1266
01:24:33.560 --> 01:24:36.880
will be our masterpiece. And remember, Darling, I never worked before ten

1267
01:24:36.920 --> 01:24:41.000
in the morning and never after four
thirty in the afternoon. I love that

1268
01:24:41.039 --> 01:24:45.880
because you get like, oh,
okay, there she is yep. And

1269
01:24:45.000 --> 01:24:48.439
Demill he just can't do it.
He just can't. He just tells her,

1270
01:24:48.520 --> 01:24:51.079
look, I need to get back
to work. I'm gonna think about

1271
01:24:51.079 --> 01:24:54.600
it, and I'm gonna be in
contact with you, and he kind of

1272
01:24:54.880 --> 01:24:57.760
starts. He's like, hang out
on set and watch how movies are made.

1273
01:24:57.840 --> 01:25:00.319
Maybe learn a little bit. Yeah. Then he turns the assistant.

1274
01:25:00.319 --> 01:25:03.720
He's like, tell Gordon Cole never
to call her again. Yeah. Outside

1275
01:25:03.720 --> 01:25:08.479
the soundstage, Joe is just like
sitting in the car waiting for Norma to

1276
01:25:08.479 --> 01:25:12.399
be finished with Cethlaby demel So.
Joe spots Betty going into her office in

1277
01:25:12.399 --> 01:25:15.800
the reader's department, and he decides
to stop and pay her a visit.

1278
01:25:15.880 --> 01:25:18.039
Joe offers to give her his story
for free so she can write her script.

1279
01:25:18.039 --> 01:25:20.359
He's being nice. He's like,
look, I know you love that

1280
01:25:20.439 --> 01:25:24.199
story. Just take it. You
don't owe me anything. He's like,

1281
01:25:24.439 --> 01:25:27.239
if you win an oscar, give
me a leg. She begs him to

1282
01:25:27.279 --> 01:25:29.720
write it with her. She's like, look, you are so good and

1283
01:25:29.800 --> 01:25:33.720
I need your help. Like I'm
free all nights and weekends this month because

1284
01:25:33.840 --> 01:25:39.039
Artie's on location shooting a Western in
Arizona, And so it's so funny how

1285
01:25:39.039 --> 01:25:43.239
like in nineteen fifty that means like
women have no like I literally can't leave

1286
01:25:43.239 --> 01:25:46.199
my house because my man is not
here, so stupid. They can't get

1287
01:25:46.239 --> 01:25:49.680
on that bike. We talked about
that last time, Joe kind of perks

1288
01:25:49.760 --> 01:25:53.159
up and he's like, what does
Artie have to do with how often like

1289
01:25:53.199 --> 01:25:56.359
you go out at night? And
she goes, well, we're actually engaged

1290
01:25:56.439 --> 01:26:00.640
now, so we're gonna get married
soon. And Joe genuinely congratulates her.

1291
01:26:00.680 --> 01:26:03.920
There's no jealousy or weirdness there.
He's like, congratulations, you actually found

1292
01:26:03.920 --> 01:26:08.399
the nicest guy in Hollywood, and
she wholeheartedly agrees. She's like, I

1293
01:26:08.439 --> 01:26:13.279
agree, and I love I love
Armie. So Max starts honking loudly while

1294
01:26:13.319 --> 01:26:15.199
Joe's talking to Betty, and Betty
kind of ignores it, and Joe is

1295
01:26:15.239 --> 01:26:18.840
like, clearly distracted. He decides
to leave immediately. He's like, well,

1296
01:26:18.880 --> 01:26:21.239
I'll see you later, kid,
have a great life. Joe goes

1297
01:26:21.239 --> 01:26:26.920
downstairs and Max tells him that the
real reason Paramount's been calling is for the

1298
01:26:26.960 --> 01:26:30.159
car, right, like somehow Max
has figured it all out, and he's

1299
01:26:30.159 --> 01:26:32.000
like, we have to get out
of here quickly before someone lets Norma know.

1300
01:26:32.319 --> 01:26:35.960
At that moment, luckily, Norma
is being ushered out of the set

1301
01:26:36.039 --> 01:26:40.439
by by Demil. He kisses her
goodbye and they get in the car and

1302
01:26:40.479 --> 01:26:43.640
they just fuck off. They all
leave, so we cutch a little montage,

1303
01:26:43.800 --> 01:26:47.520
Norma goes full Madeline Ashton right,
she does the things that Maddeline Ashton

1304
01:26:47.560 --> 01:26:51.720
wished were still legal, and death
becomes her. It is a punishing route.

1305
01:26:51.880 --> 01:26:56.800
I punished it and and none of
it involves exercise. It seems to

1306
01:26:56.840 --> 01:27:00.680
all involved like snake oil of some
sort or another, sweating, lots of

1307
01:27:00.800 --> 01:27:05.479
sweating. So she thinks Salome is
getting made. She has to get herself

1308
01:27:05.520 --> 01:27:10.479
ready for the camera, and she
starts this punishing health and beauty regimen that

1309
01:27:10.600 --> 01:27:13.520
keeps her very busy during the day
and sends her to bed at nine o'clock

1310
01:27:13.600 --> 01:27:16.399
every night. And because she's going
to bed so early every night, Joe

1311
01:27:16.439 --> 01:27:19.880
has started sneaking out to work on
this script with Betty. So even though

1312
01:27:19.920 --> 01:27:25.840
he turned Betty down, the siren
call of Hollywood and a big hit has

1313
01:27:25.920 --> 01:27:30.279
drawn him back. Norma figures this
out because one night she had a nightmare,

1314
01:27:30.359 --> 01:27:31.560
she called out for him and he
wasn't there and the husband's sweep next

1315
01:27:31.560 --> 01:27:34.439
door ha ha. So he says, I've just been driving to the beach

1316
01:27:34.720 --> 01:27:39.279
and going for walks. I'm not
doing anything behind your back. Norma like,

1317
01:27:39.399 --> 01:27:42.439
please, please, Joe, I
just need patience. This is so

1318
01:27:42.479 --> 01:27:45.239
difficult for me, and he says, I'm not doing anything, and she

1319
01:27:45.319 --> 01:27:48.960
kind of runs her hand through his
very gelled hair, which just so everyone

1320
01:27:49.039 --> 01:27:55.279
knows, is gross. It's not
even Jelle's palmmage. Yeah, fifty,

1321
01:27:55.399 --> 01:27:59.159
it's hard, and she just warns
him, Oh, I know you're not.

1322
01:28:00.119 --> 01:28:01.760
She so yes, starts off as
like a caress, and then she

1323
01:28:02.159 --> 01:28:05.960
balls her hands like a fist in
his hair and she's like, you better

1324
01:28:06.119 --> 01:28:11.800
not do anything, yeah, and
like like holy shit. Nevertheless, he

1325
01:28:11.920 --> 01:28:14.159
heads off as soon as her lights
are out to work with Betty. The

1326
01:28:14.199 --> 01:28:16.399
threat is not enough to scare him
off. They're in Betty's office. She's

1327
01:28:16.439 --> 01:28:19.960
complaining that Artie's movie is running long, which is keeping him in Arizona,

1328
01:28:20.079 --> 01:28:26.920
and Joe absent mindedly says good and
then oh okay. So now he's like,

1329
01:28:26.920 --> 01:28:31.239
I'm sorry, what'd you say?
No? Nothing, nothing, nothing

1330
01:28:31.279 --> 01:28:38.000
nothing. Betty grabs a cigarette from
Joe's solid gold cigarette case, fuck yeah

1331
01:28:38.319 --> 01:28:45.560
and reads the inscription mad about the
boy love norma holy crap, which to

1332
01:28:45.680 --> 01:28:48.479
which she asks about it. She
also says the iconic line I'm sorry,

1333
01:28:48.520 --> 01:28:57.039
I don't usually read private cigarette cases. What Joe half lies, he says,

1334
01:28:57.079 --> 01:28:59.680
he did some script work for a
rich old lady and she gave him

1335
01:28:59.680 --> 01:29:02.680
the cigaret cases a thank you gift, so he obfuscates, yeah, it's

1336
01:29:02.720 --> 01:29:08.079
going on. So they start walking
on the lot and Betty tells him about

1337
01:29:08.479 --> 01:29:12.800
like she says this really charming line
of like, doesn't matter where she is,

1338
01:29:13.039 --> 01:29:15.479
what country she's in, this is
still gonna always be her favorite street

1339
01:29:15.560 --> 01:29:18.840
in the whole wide world, even
though it's all smoking mirrors, it's all

1340
01:29:18.960 --> 01:29:23.159
cardboard and paint. And he's like, wow, you really love the movies

1341
01:29:23.199 --> 01:29:25.359
that much, right, And she's
like, not just that. I used

1342
01:29:25.359 --> 01:29:28.600
to play here when I was a
kid. I grew up on this lot.

1343
01:29:28.760 --> 01:29:31.640
My family is an old Hollywood family. My dad was the head electrician.

1344
01:29:32.039 --> 01:29:35.359
My mother still works in wardrobe.
And he's like, wow, you're

1345
01:29:35.359 --> 01:29:39.880
two generations in. She goes three. My grandmother was a stunt double for

1346
01:29:39.960 --> 01:29:44.000
Pearl White. I mean, like, what a great childhood this woman had.

1347
01:29:44.399 --> 01:29:46.239
It's a company town and she's a
company gal, you know, so

1348
01:29:46.479 --> 01:29:49.920
naturally, because she was so pretty, they her whole family was like,

1349
01:29:50.000 --> 01:29:53.720
well, you're going to be a
great star. That's how you're going to

1350
01:29:53.760 --> 01:29:56.479
contribute. And so they did all
the things you're supposed to do. They

1351
01:29:56.520 --> 01:29:59.800
did dancing lessons in alcution lessons,
and then she took a screen test and

1352
01:30:00.000 --> 01:30:01.880
I didn't like her nose. Her
nose was a little crooked to the to

1353
01:30:01.960 --> 01:30:05.159
the left, so she had to
fix it. So she paid three hundred

1354
01:30:05.199 --> 01:30:09.960
dollars and got her nose fixed,
which I feel like is very reasonable.

1355
01:30:12.439 --> 01:30:15.840
And then she did another screen test, but of course they they all missed

1356
01:30:15.880 --> 01:30:18.199
the first time because of the hideous
nose. Yeah, she can't act right.

1357
01:30:20.439 --> 01:30:23.319
He's like, wow, they really
kicked in the teeth. And she's

1358
01:30:23.359 --> 01:30:25.920
like, no, it was the
best thing that ever happened to me because

1359
01:30:25.920 --> 01:30:28.640
I got a job in the mail
room and then the script department, and

1360
01:30:28.800 --> 01:30:30.960
now I'm doing what I love.
I'm writing. And she's like, that's

1361
01:30:31.000 --> 01:30:34.279
what I should have always been doing
the whole time. Yeah, Joe is

1362
01:30:34.800 --> 01:30:39.159
completely enchanted by her. I have
to save me too. Oh yeah,

1363
01:30:39.199 --> 01:30:45.279
this speech is so charming. I
love Betty Shaeffer and Nancys. He compares

1364
01:30:45.359 --> 01:30:48.800
her to freshly washed linen, something
new and clean, like movie is not

1365
01:30:48.960 --> 01:30:55.279
subtle, not something old and dingy
and perhaps sequins and terrifying. Yeah,

1366
01:30:55.880 --> 01:30:59.039
he like kind of leans in and
he almost kisses her, and she doesn't

1367
01:30:59.199 --> 01:31:00.840
move. She she just kind of
stays there and like she's like, what

1368
01:31:01.000 --> 01:31:04.319
is he going to do? Then
he pulls back very quickly and he's like,

1369
01:31:04.520 --> 01:31:08.239
you know what, from now on, you do not let me get

1370
01:31:08.279 --> 01:31:11.039
within two feet of you. Yep. And if I get within two feet

1371
01:31:11.079 --> 01:31:13.520
of you, you were allowed to
take your shoe off and clock me on

1372
01:31:13.600 --> 01:31:15.520
the head with it. And she
just smiles and agrees, like she is

1373
01:31:16.000 --> 01:31:19.199
clearly also smitten with him, and
she knows he was about to kiss her.

1374
01:31:19.399 --> 01:31:24.079
Yeah. Late one night, Joe
comes back for a writing session.

1375
01:31:24.239 --> 01:31:30.680
Okay, here we go. He
pulls in and he finds Max lurking in

1376
01:31:30.760 --> 01:31:34.279
the shadows like a butler does,
still in his outfit. Like it's like,

1377
01:31:34.520 --> 01:31:39.399
never takes off the outfit. It's
one o'clock in the morning. Max,

1378
01:31:39.800 --> 01:31:44.079
what if madam needs me? Holy
shit? So he sleeps in that

1379
01:31:44.159 --> 01:31:45.960
outfit. He sleeps. I think
the only time he's not in an outfit

1380
01:31:46.039 --> 01:31:49.439
is when he is showering in order
to put on the outfit again. Directly

1381
01:31:49.720 --> 01:31:54.199
afterwards, Max tries to warn Joe
not to let Norma see him cross the

1382
01:31:54.239 --> 01:31:57.319
patio or else she's going to know
something's up. The thing I want to

1383
01:31:57.439 --> 01:32:00.319
point out here, though, is
Max is not angry at Joe's genie.

1384
01:32:00.359 --> 01:32:02.399
He's trying to help him. He's
like, hey, man, if you

1385
01:32:02.520 --> 01:32:04.359
cross this way, she can see
you, and it's going to be a

1386
01:32:04.399 --> 01:32:08.720
whole thing, and like, let's
just work together. Let's make this as

1387
01:32:08.760 --> 01:32:13.680
easy as possible for everyone. So
Max is like he's got one laser focus

1388
01:32:13.760 --> 01:32:16.039
in his life. Max calmly tells
Joe, I don't care where you go

1389
01:32:16.119 --> 01:32:20.199
at night, but I'm worried about
Norma. And Joe tells Max, you're

1390
01:32:20.239 --> 01:32:24.840
not doing Norma any favors by lying
to her about the Salame picture, that

1391
01:32:24.920 --> 01:32:27.359
she'll never star in. This a
little bit of the pot calling the kettle

1392
01:32:27.399 --> 01:32:30.720
black. But sure, Max says, it's my job to make sure she

1393
01:32:30.840 --> 01:32:33.319
never finds out. And I intend
to make sure that that job gets done.

1394
01:32:33.439 --> 01:32:36.680
What is Max's plan? All right, here, hang under your butts,

1395
01:32:36.720 --> 01:32:41.119
people, We're about to get Max's
backstory. Well, it turns out,

1396
01:32:41.279 --> 01:32:45.800
Erica, that Max was a famous
director who discovered Norma when she was

1397
01:32:45.880 --> 01:32:51.159
sixteen and directed all of her early
films. And also he was her first

1398
01:32:51.560 --> 01:32:57.760
husband. What when that happened?
I did not know that part of the

1399
01:32:57.800 --> 01:33:00.600
plot, and my jaw dropped.
I was like, I'm sorry, what

1400
01:33:00.880 --> 01:33:08.159
kind of fucked up relationship is this
that makes the whole thing so so dark?

1401
01:33:08.439 --> 01:33:11.479
Yep, Max says, when I
was younger, there were three directors

1402
01:33:11.520 --> 01:33:15.960
with promise, Cecil B. Demil, d W. Griffiths, and Max

1403
01:33:15.159 --> 01:33:23.399
von Meyer. That's me so wait. So he didn't go into the studio

1404
01:33:23.479 --> 01:33:26.560
because he didn't want Cecil B.
Demil to recognize him. That's why I

1405
01:33:26.640 --> 01:33:29.800
think he stays in the car and
doesn't follow Norma in there. I think

1406
01:33:29.840 --> 01:33:31.920
because he and Cecil B. Demill
know each other. They were buds.

1407
01:33:32.159 --> 01:33:35.720
No, Now I'm also wondering,
like obviously, like Buster Keaton and Anna

1408
01:33:35.800 --> 01:33:40.640
Nielsen and the other dude all know
who he is too, Like everyone's just

1409
01:33:41.199 --> 01:33:45.479
cool, cool with the fact that
Norma has broken this man's mind, and

1410
01:33:45.680 --> 01:33:48.159
like, okay, so he discovers
her when she's sixteen years old, right,

1411
01:33:48.680 --> 01:33:51.560
he is at least fifteen years older
than her. Yeah, I think

1412
01:33:51.800 --> 01:33:56.840
that makes sense. Right, So
he's in his thirties, she's sixteen.

1413
01:33:57.039 --> 01:34:00.920
He discovers her, he marries her, makes her a star, like she's

1414
01:34:01.000 --> 01:34:05.000
his muse. He puts her in
all his films and then she leaves him.

1415
01:34:05.319 --> 01:34:10.720
The power dynamic on this is gonna
switch real fast. He says that

1416
01:34:10.880 --> 01:34:14.640
after she left him, he begged
her to let him work for her in

1417
01:34:14.840 --> 01:34:18.119
any capacity, and Joe sneers and
goes, so she turned you into a

1418
01:34:18.359 --> 01:34:23.840
servant, and he goes, Madame
is the greatest star of all time.

1419
01:34:24.039 --> 01:34:27.720
Let's say it gets hold. That
is all that Max ever says obviously the

1420
01:34:28.079 --> 01:34:30.319
audience, but also Joe, this
is the moment Joe's like, what have

1421
01:34:30.520 --> 01:34:36.640
I wandered him? To? The
Chip funeral really should have been the moment

1422
01:34:36.680 --> 01:34:42.760
that he left. So Max took
the vicuna. Max is the vicuna.

1423
01:34:43.760 --> 01:34:46.680
He got skinned for that code.
The backstory is so fascinating. Yeah,

1424
01:34:46.960 --> 01:34:50.840
who are the other two husbands?
Did they know that Max was the first

1425
01:34:50.960 --> 01:34:55.840
husband? And like at that time
you would think like if they would know

1426
01:34:55.960 --> 01:34:59.159
him, he couldn't have fallen into
obscurity in the space of five years.

1427
01:34:59.199 --> 01:35:00.760
If he was on the pa of
Cecil B. De Mill and d W.

1428
01:35:00.920 --> 01:35:03.479
Griffiths, people remembered him for at
least a decade. Yeah, his

1429
01:35:03.560 --> 01:35:06.760
face would have been in the newspapers
at some point. Did he live under

1430
01:35:08.000 --> 01:35:11.880
like in the house while she was
married, happily married and then unhappily married

1431
01:35:11.920 --> 01:35:14.880
to two other guys, and who
slept in his bed, the bed that

1432
01:35:15.000 --> 01:35:16.640
used to be his. All of
her ex husbands slept in that bed.

1433
01:35:17.000 --> 01:35:19.640
Yes, so that used to be
his bed. And then he got demoted

1434
01:35:20.000 --> 01:35:24.720
to the servants swing. But the
thing is too like before you start to

1435
01:35:24.760 --> 01:35:29.520
feel really sorry for Max. He's
a big part of what's making her crazy.

1436
01:35:29.640 --> 01:35:33.720
Now they're living in this like dual
delusion together where she's still the greatest

1437
01:35:33.760 --> 01:35:41.079
thing ever and he's her trusted best
friend and servant and like and not loverr

1438
01:35:41.159 --> 01:35:44.520
but like father figure at this point, because she runs to him for help,

1439
01:35:44.600 --> 01:35:46.279
what she needs anything, and she
like she cries out for him at

1440
01:35:46.359 --> 01:35:49.319
night when she's scared and expects him
to come, and he does. He

1441
01:35:49.560 --> 01:35:55.039
does. He is a victim,
but so is she. Anyways. You

1442
01:35:55.079 --> 01:35:57.720
know, what is it Carol Burnett
and Matthew Lillard in that SVU episode that

1443
01:35:57.800 --> 01:36:00.880
we did, that's what That's what's
going on there. Ever, there's the

1444
01:36:00.920 --> 01:36:03.319
grooming. It's just going in the
opposite direction. Then it flips. Oh

1445
01:36:03.399 --> 01:36:08.159
god, this is a dark path. It is a dark, dark movie.

1446
01:36:08.439 --> 01:36:12.279
Yeah, so Joe somehow still walks
back into that house. I would

1447
01:36:12.279 --> 01:36:17.560
have been like, Nope, that's
it aps a fuckolutely not. Later that

1448
01:36:17.760 --> 01:36:21.119
night, Norma is pacing her room. She's awake, Joe, Joe,

1449
01:36:21.359 --> 01:36:24.840
where do you go at night?
Why do you leave me? Joe?

1450
01:36:26.079 --> 01:36:30.359
She storms into Joe's room to confront
him, and he's sound asleep and she's

1451
01:36:30.399 --> 01:36:32.399
about to wake him up, and
then she sees on his desk this piece

1452
01:36:32.439 --> 01:36:35.000
of paper and she goes over to
it. She takes it back to her

1453
01:36:35.079 --> 01:36:38.800
room. She puts up her glasses
and she looks at it and it says

1454
01:36:39.479 --> 01:36:45.279
untitled Love Story by Joe Gillis and
Betty Schaeffer. The score tells us it's

1455
01:36:45.279 --> 01:36:54.920
a big moment. A few nights
later, Joe and Betty are working in

1456
01:36:55.000 --> 01:36:59.199
her office. Betty can't stop staring
at Joe. He's like writing at a

1457
01:37:00.319 --> 01:37:02.279
and she's at her desk and she
just keeps staring at him. She's almost

1458
01:37:02.359 --> 01:37:06.039
like she does that creepy thing where
she's lost in thought, and he's like,

1459
01:37:06.159 --> 01:37:09.520
hey, Bennet, are you there? And it takes her a minute

1460
01:37:09.560 --> 01:37:13.359
to snap out of it, right, and Joe immediately jumps to like his

1461
01:37:13.600 --> 01:37:16.560
in his mind. The worst case
scenario, she's found out about him yep,

1462
01:37:16.880 --> 01:37:19.279
and he's like, well, wait, what have you heard? You

1463
01:37:19.359 --> 01:37:23.000
know, she'll never want to work
with me now, Like she thinks something,

1464
01:37:23.039 --> 01:37:26.560
I'm disgusting. I'm some disgusting joke, right, I'm a prostitute.

1465
01:37:26.640 --> 01:37:30.640
Basically, that's not it. It's
actually something else. Entirely. She's distracted

1466
01:37:30.920 --> 01:37:34.840
because Artie wants her to marry him. Joe says, well, that's great.

1467
01:37:34.880 --> 01:37:39.520
He's just mostly relieved that she doesn't
caught on to Norma. And he's

1468
01:37:39.560 --> 01:37:42.800
like, well, what's keeping you
then from running straight into Artie's arms?

1469
01:37:42.840 --> 01:37:45.800
And she goes you yeah, and
the two of them kiss passionately, like

1470
01:37:45.880 --> 01:37:48.079
oh no, where are that?
I was like, wait, he's not

1471
01:37:48.199 --> 01:37:51.840
gay. I had gotten at this
point. It wasn't a surprise. I

1472
01:37:51.960 --> 01:37:56.000
mean. The funny thing is is
Montgomery Cliff was supposed to play this part

1473
01:37:56.479 --> 01:38:00.720
and he turned it down. I
love Montgomery Cliff, but I think William

1474
01:38:00.720 --> 01:38:05.239
Holden was a better choice because he
he plays it very like surface, see

1475
01:38:05.239 --> 01:38:08.960
almost like that's that's the wrong thing
to say. He plays it light like,

1476
01:38:09.119 --> 01:38:12.600
he doesn't get too heavy really into
it, and I feel like Montgomery

1477
01:38:12.600 --> 01:38:15.279
Cliff might have gotten a little heavier. It might have done too much excavation

1478
01:38:15.359 --> 01:38:19.720
of the character. Yeah, but
honestly, like and also if Montgomery Cliff

1479
01:38:19.720 --> 01:38:23.520
had played it, I think the
gay themes would have come out a little

1480
01:38:23.520 --> 01:38:27.239
bit more. Why I don't know, Paul because his best friend was Elizabeth

1481
01:38:27.319 --> 01:38:32.159
Taylor. His best Judy was Elizabeth. Maybe that's why. Maybe that's why.

1482
01:38:32.399 --> 01:38:35.479
Who knows. Joe heads back to
Norma's house. He's in voiceover.

1483
01:38:35.600 --> 01:38:38.840
He's like, maybe maybe I cane
out of this. Maybe I can somehow,

1484
01:38:39.000 --> 01:38:42.119
just like erase, pretend this never
happened. It do a mad man

1485
01:38:42.199 --> 01:38:44.079
on it. You won't believe how
much this never happened. If you just

1486
01:38:44.199 --> 01:38:49.600
pretended what a good pull. That
is perfect, thank you. But as

1487
01:38:49.680 --> 01:38:53.880
he's sitting in his room, remember
there's no doorknobs in the door, so

1488
01:38:53.960 --> 01:38:58.119
you can hear he hears Norma on
the phone. And Norma has tracked down

1489
01:38:58.159 --> 01:39:02.720
Betty Schaeffer, and she called Betty's
apartment and she gets Betty's roommate who she

1490
01:39:02.760 --> 01:39:04.840
has like two lines. But for
some reason I found her very funny,

1491
01:39:05.119 --> 01:39:08.399
like Betty, that weird woman with
the voices on the phone. Again,

1492
01:39:08.520 --> 01:39:10.920
Betty gets on the phone, and
Norma starts to talk to her. She's

1493
01:39:10.960 --> 01:39:13.079
like, you don't know much about
Joe Gillis. Do you do you know

1494
01:39:13.119 --> 01:39:15.479
where he lives? Do you know
what he does for money? Do you

1495
01:39:15.560 --> 01:39:18.479
know what he lives on? Yes? Just as she's about to break the

1496
01:39:18.520 --> 01:39:23.159
most salacious details, Joe walks in. He grabs the phone out of Norma's

1497
01:39:23.199 --> 01:39:25.680
hand, and he tells Betty,
Hey, Betty, it's me. Why

1498
01:39:25.720 --> 01:39:28.279
don't you come see for yourself where
I live? This is the address.

1499
01:39:28.840 --> 01:39:31.399
Come on over. Yeah. Norma
plays the suffering victim. She has a

1500
01:39:31.520 --> 01:39:36.199
beautiful like flash dance off the shoulder
moment in her negligee or slip whatever she's

1501
01:39:36.239 --> 01:39:40.880
wearing. Just don't hate me,
Joe. She threatens to kill herself if

1502
01:39:40.920 --> 01:39:43.079
he leaves her. Look, I
even't bought her revolver to do it.

1503
01:39:44.079 --> 01:39:46.960
Oh my god. Joe stands there
quietly. He doesn't give Norma the satisfaction

1504
01:39:47.039 --> 01:39:53.760
of her response. Her calling Betty
was the straw that broke the camel's back.

1505
01:39:54.359 --> 01:39:57.359
Like I think beforehand, what he
was thinking about doing is is there

1506
01:39:57.399 --> 01:39:59.840
a way for me to do this
where no one gets hurt? That's the

1507
01:40:00.359 --> 01:40:02.079
he was at Also that no one
finds out. No one finds out.

1508
01:40:02.119 --> 01:40:06.119
This is the worst thing that could
possibly happen. Now Betty's gonna know who

1509
01:40:06.199 --> 01:40:11.960
he is and what he's done.
I think her threatening to kill herself over

1510
01:40:12.079 --> 01:40:15.079
his affair with Betty would have worked
if she hadn't called Betty. That was

1511
01:40:15.199 --> 01:40:19.800
I think Norma's mistake because he is
such a passive character and he has no

1512
01:40:19.960 --> 01:40:24.720
backbone. Yeah, if she had
just again, like what she's done numerous

1513
01:40:24.720 --> 01:40:26.880
times in the film, Oh Joe, like, y'all, I'll kill myself.

1514
01:40:26.920 --> 01:40:29.479
You can't leave me, Joe,
Joe, Joe. That works,

1515
01:40:29.680 --> 01:40:32.560
But her threatening to expose him to
Betty, who he actually like, has

1516
01:40:32.720 --> 01:40:35.760
fallen in love with and is like, you know, the Madonna figure of

1517
01:40:35.880 --> 01:40:41.039
the film is what pushes him over
the edge and starts to get that I

1518
01:40:41.359 --> 01:40:44.760
don't care if you kill yourself.
Yeah, moment, I like, something's

1519
01:40:44.760 --> 01:40:47.760
got to give, man, Like, can't I can't keep pretending to love

1520
01:40:47.840 --> 01:40:50.520
you. You have to be in
charge of not killing yourself. I can't

1521
01:40:50.520 --> 01:40:55.920
be in charge of that anymore.
Yeah. Yeah, So the doorbell rings,

1522
01:40:56.079 --> 01:40:59.079
Betty gets there real quick. She
does her roommate is so nice because

1523
01:40:59.079 --> 01:41:00.079
her roommate drives her there, and
he's like, let me go inside with

1524
01:41:00.199 --> 01:41:02.920
you, and then he's like,
probably better that you stay outside. Only

1525
01:41:02.960 --> 01:41:08.359
one of us needs to die tonight. Joe goes downstairs. He lets Betty

1526
01:41:08.399 --> 01:41:11.359
in. She looks genuinely frightened.
She's like, what am I about to

1527
01:41:11.680 --> 01:41:14.920
walk into? Joe? What's going
on? Are you okay? Are we

1528
01:41:15.000 --> 01:41:17.680
all? Are we gonna get hurt
in this big haunted mansion that I've walked

1529
01:41:17.680 --> 01:41:23.279
into. Yeah. He brings her
inside. He's being Joe in the most

1530
01:41:23.439 --> 01:41:26.279
Joe way possible. He's like,
hey, Betty, thanks for coming.

1531
01:41:26.560 --> 01:41:29.079
Take a look at this big old
house. They don't make them like this

1532
01:41:29.199 --> 01:41:31.800
anymore, these old Hollywood villas from
the twenties. Ever been in one of

1533
01:41:31.840 --> 01:41:36.680
these before? Check out that floor. Valentino danced on it like he's He's

1534
01:41:36.800 --> 01:41:40.520
just putting it all out there,
and she's like, what is going on?

1535
01:41:41.359 --> 01:41:46.479
He starts to show her the many, many, many pictures and paintings

1536
01:41:46.560 --> 01:41:50.000
of Norma Desmond. Okay, I've
already discussed that I do have a little

1537
01:41:50.039 --> 01:41:53.560
bit of a shrine for myself.
We don't need to I heard you.

1538
01:41:54.079 --> 01:41:56.560
I will fix it. I will
fit I will take down some of the

1539
01:41:56.600 --> 01:42:00.199
photos Okay, so what I don't
understand. It's like some of them are

1540
01:42:00.760 --> 01:42:04.039
really like well done right, and
I appreciate that proportion and like, but

1541
01:42:04.199 --> 01:42:08.359
you've kept up the ones where you're
sneezing. I think, and I don't.

1542
01:42:08.520 --> 01:42:11.439
There's a whole wat. I think
there's beauty in moments, Erica.

1543
01:42:11.680 --> 01:42:14.800
There's beauty in life. Yeah,
okay, what about this one over here?

1544
01:42:14.840 --> 01:42:16.840
It looks like you have your head
cock like you're thinking, but then

1545
01:42:16.880 --> 01:42:19.760
also like it. Oh my god, Paul, are you on the toilet?

1546
01:42:20.000 --> 01:42:24.039
Is that where that is? I
recognize that bathroom. I'm trying to

1547
01:42:24.119 --> 01:42:27.840
connect the banality of life with beauty, Erica. And the most beautiful thing

1548
01:42:27.880 --> 01:42:30.119
I can find are the pictures of
myself. Oh my god, I can

1549
01:42:30.199 --> 01:42:34.800
smell this picture. That's disgusting.
Paul. Look, I've been meaning to

1550
01:42:34.840 --> 01:42:38.800
ask you this for years. What
is this thing in the jar by the

1551
01:42:38.920 --> 01:42:41.920
door? It's got this like,
Oh my god, is that your appendix?

1552
01:42:42.159 --> 01:42:45.640
Of course not, Erica. I
never had my appendix removed. Who's

1553
01:42:45.680 --> 01:42:47.920
appendix am I looking at? That
is a mock up of my appendix that

1554
01:42:48.000 --> 01:42:53.199
I had made by a professional Hollywood
makeup artist after getting my appendix X rayed,

1555
01:42:54.720 --> 01:42:57.600
We're gonna have to talk about this
later. Let's just finish this movie.

1556
01:42:59.079 --> 01:43:01.399
So he's like Joe, He's like, uh, take a look around

1557
01:43:01.560 --> 01:43:04.600
now, like, do you recognize
Norma Desmond? Don't you? She was

1558
01:43:04.680 --> 01:43:10.520
so famous back in her day.
He basically explains his entire situation to her

1559
01:43:10.760 --> 01:43:13.319
and asks her what she thinks of
him now that she knows he's a sugar

1560
01:43:13.359 --> 01:43:15.560
baby. Yeah, like all right, now what do you think of me?

1561
01:43:15.640 --> 01:43:18.079
Now? I see you must hate
me. I sleep with Norma,

1562
01:43:18.239 --> 01:43:23.359
I take advantage of a helpless old
lady and take her money. Now what

1563
01:43:23.439 --> 01:43:26.640
do you think of me? And
Betty says, I was never here.

1564
01:43:27.239 --> 01:43:30.960
I didn't hear any of this story. I think I should leave, and

1565
01:43:30.079 --> 01:43:33.000
I think you should come with me. She gives him an out, the

1566
01:43:33.079 --> 01:43:35.880
biggest doorway. All he has to
do is walk. Yeah, I will

1567
01:43:36.079 --> 01:43:39.920
never bring this up again. And
she also makes it like the way she

1568
01:43:40.039 --> 01:43:44.880
delivers it I think is so sympathetic, like like like she really seems like

1569
01:43:44.960 --> 01:43:46.479
she's not judging him. It's not
like she's cool. Yeah, it's not

1570
01:43:46.640 --> 01:43:51.079
like a okay, we could you've
had an affair with this woman. It's

1571
01:43:51.159 --> 01:43:56.640
exactly what he was thinking before it's
mad metting it can this just didn't happen.

1572
01:43:56.960 --> 01:43:59.840
Yeah, it doesn't have to happen. You made choices that you have

1573
01:44:00.119 --> 01:44:02.119
to make at that time, and
now we can make a different choice.

1574
01:44:02.159 --> 01:44:04.119
All you have to do is walk
through that door with me. I'm not

1575
01:44:04.159 --> 01:44:06.039
going to judge you, and I'm
not going to bring it up ever again

1576
01:44:06.079 --> 01:44:09.199
if that's if it's something you don't
want to talk about. I don't know

1577
01:44:09.199 --> 01:44:12.800
if you remember, I was raised
in Hollywood. I've heard shit. You

1578
01:44:12.920 --> 01:44:15.399
think this is the first time I've
seen this? Yeah, I think the

1579
01:44:15.439 --> 01:44:18.319
first time I've seen a sugar baby
at Desmond's. She's like, I bet

1580
01:44:18.399 --> 01:44:25.560
maximum Marling's around here somewhere, right, I've heard this story. That's my

1581
01:44:25.720 --> 01:44:31.239
uncle. So he he like softens
for a minute after she says that he

1582
01:44:31.319 --> 01:44:35.159
looks really moved and like you see
him like harden himself back up again,

1583
01:44:35.239 --> 01:44:38.800
and he goes, why would I
do that when I can stay here and

1584
01:44:38.920 --> 01:44:43.079
have all the financial security I want
and I can't leave behind these gifts and

1585
01:44:43.199 --> 01:44:45.880
all the clothes she's gotten me,
and like this is a sure thing.

1586
01:44:45.920 --> 01:44:48.560
Why would I go after something that
I thought was was going to fail?

1587
01:44:49.039 --> 01:44:53.039
When I can stay here and have
a sure thing, and she says,

1588
01:44:53.159 --> 01:44:55.399
if you love me, she gives
him another chance. She goes, if

1589
01:44:55.439 --> 01:44:59.319
you love me, you should leave
with me right now. Yep, and

1590
01:44:59.399 --> 01:45:01.600
he goes, thanks for coming,
Betty, have a good night. Yeah,

1591
01:45:02.399 --> 01:45:06.399
it's for heartbreaking. It's heartbreaking because
she knows what he's doing. Yeah,

1592
01:45:06.399 --> 01:45:10.039
and she's trying. She's like,
trust me, you have to trust

1593
01:45:10.119 --> 01:45:13.000
me, and he's like, I
can't. I actually can't. I'm sorry.

1594
01:45:13.199 --> 01:45:15.520
He kisses her on the forehead.
He wishes her luck, and she

1595
01:45:15.199 --> 01:45:17.439
just cries. As she walks away, She's like, bye, Joe.

1596
01:45:18.800 --> 01:45:21.840
Joe turns around and one of the
best shots in the movie, such a

1597
01:45:21.920 --> 01:45:26.800
good shot. He's outside in the
front door, which is like a filigreed

1598
01:45:27.119 --> 01:45:31.439
gate right. He turns around and
we see Norma towering above him in the

1599
01:45:31.640 --> 01:45:36.039
landing on the second floor of the
house, watching the whole scene. He

1600
01:45:36.199 --> 01:45:40.720
climbs the stairs and as he gets
to the top normousness, Oh, thank

1601
01:45:40.760 --> 01:45:43.800
you Joe, thank you for choosing
me over Betty, but he ignores her.

1602
01:45:44.439 --> 01:45:45.720
He goes into the room. He
starts to pack his bags. He

1603
01:45:45.800 --> 01:45:48.920
has been so broken by this,
like that was an act he had to

1604
01:45:48.960 --> 01:45:51.920
get rid of Betty because he hates
himself so much for what he's done,

1605
01:45:53.039 --> 01:45:56.239
for being exposed that now he's going
to go back to Dayton, Ohio and

1606
01:45:56.319 --> 01:46:00.479
get the job at like the newsroom
and live a quote unquote nor life.

1607
01:46:00.640 --> 01:46:03.279
Ye, he packs only his original
wardrobe. He tells Norma that the clothes

1608
01:46:03.319 --> 01:46:06.640
she bought him will look out of
place in Dayton, Ohio. Norma pleads

1609
01:46:06.640 --> 01:46:10.239
with him to stay. She offers
him more money, anything you could possibly

1610
01:46:10.279 --> 01:46:13.600
ever want. She threatens to kill
herself. I'll do it Joe, and

1611
01:46:13.760 --> 01:46:16.000
Joe is unmoved. He says,
that's your life. Norma doesn't have anything

1612
01:46:16.000 --> 01:46:18.119
to do with me. Those are
your choices. And then he looks at

1613
01:46:18.159 --> 01:46:21.399
her and he says, look and
again this is he doesn't do it cruelly.

1614
01:46:23.000 --> 01:46:26.279
She thinks he's doing her a kindness. Yeah, he says. There

1615
01:46:26.319 --> 01:46:30.680
are no fan letters pouring in.
There is no movie with Demil. The

1616
01:46:30.840 --> 01:46:34.680
only reason Paramount called was to use
your car. Like, come on,

1617
01:46:34.880 --> 01:46:40.079
he says, being fifty isn't a
tragedy unless you keep trying to be twenty

1618
01:46:40.159 --> 01:46:44.600
five. That's the point in the
movie you realize she's only fifty fifty,

1619
01:46:44.840 --> 01:46:51.840
That is where my fifty came from, because truly, the movie acts as

1620
01:46:51.880 --> 01:46:58.560
if she's eighty six. Like obviously
Glorious Wantson does not look eighty six,

1621
01:46:58.680 --> 01:47:00.880
but like the way people talk about
her, you're like, this is this

1622
01:47:01.039 --> 01:47:06.039
woman is one slip in the bathtub
away from departing this mortal coil. Norma

1623
01:47:06.119 --> 01:47:10.680
cries out for Max. Max.
He appears at the doorway. He says,

1624
01:47:10.800 --> 01:47:14.560
I will take mister Gillis's bags,
and he just leaves. He doesn't

1625
01:47:14.600 --> 01:47:16.520
deny anything. That's the meanest he
is to Joe the whole movie. He

1626
01:47:16.600 --> 01:47:19.119
looks at him, He's like,
let me take your bags, you piece

1627
01:47:19.159 --> 01:47:25.359
of shit. I thought we had
a deal. Joe begs him tell Norma

1628
01:47:25.439 --> 01:47:29.199
the truth, but Max only says
madam is the greatest star of them all.

1629
01:47:30.319 --> 01:47:32.439
The two men leave the room.
Norma clutches the gun to her chest.

1630
01:47:32.800 --> 01:47:36.000
She keeps telling herself, I'm a
star. Nobody leaves a star,

1631
01:47:36.600 --> 01:47:42.920
Nobody leaves a star. And Glorious
Wantson is now dialing up right like,

1632
01:47:43.039 --> 01:47:45.479
oh she broken, She's broken now
right, there's no going back. She

1633
01:47:45.640 --> 01:47:49.520
follows Joe outside. She calls his
name, he doesn't answer her, turnaround

1634
01:47:49.840 --> 01:47:54.560
and she shoots him in the back. Joe still doesn't turn around, keeps

1635
01:47:54.640 --> 01:47:59.520
fairly calmly walking forward. That's how
much he wants out of this relationship.

1636
01:47:59.600 --> 01:48:01.960
I think a little piece of me
is like, did William Holden have to

1637
01:48:02.039 --> 01:48:04.399
hit a mark and didn't get there
in time? And now he's just trying

1638
01:48:04.399 --> 01:48:06.960
to get there? How many?
How many shots? Did this too?

1639
01:48:08.119 --> 01:48:10.000
Is this it? This is the
only shot? Okay, I'm gonna keep

1640
01:48:10.039 --> 01:48:14.600
walking, gotta get to the pool. She shoots him again. He turns

1641
01:48:14.680 --> 01:48:18.359
around, She shoots him again.
He stumbles, clutching his stomach and crashes

1642
01:48:18.520 --> 01:48:24.399
into the pool. Norma, fully
disassociating from what just happened, looks at

1643
01:48:24.439 --> 01:48:28.840
the sky. She craddles the gun
and she whispers to herself. The stars

1644
01:48:28.880 --> 01:48:33.199
are ageless, aren't they? Oh
no, oh no, oh no,

1645
01:48:33.399 --> 01:48:39.239
oh no. We cut to dawn. It's the same shot of Joe's body

1646
01:48:39.319 --> 01:48:42.439
floating in the pool from the very
beginning of the movie, and we hear

1647
01:48:42.560 --> 01:48:45.000
his voice over again say, well, this is where you came in.

1648
01:48:45.560 --> 01:48:49.079
Back at the pool again, the
one I always wanted. Yep, we

1649
01:48:49.239 --> 01:48:53.640
watched the police fish Joe's body out
of the pool, or as Joe puts

1650
01:48:53.680 --> 01:48:59.760
it, they beached me like a
harpoon baby whale. We see crowds lurking

1651
01:48:59.800 --> 01:49:02.720
out side the house and the newsreel
cameras and photographers waiting to get footage of

1652
01:49:02.760 --> 01:49:09.560
the aging forgotten star and her dead
lover's corpse. Joe knows the headlines are

1653
01:49:09.600 --> 01:49:13.600
going to be harsh about Norma's age
and irrelevance, and he actually feels sorry

1654
01:49:13.680 --> 01:49:16.079
for her, even though she murdered
him. He's like, whoof this is

1655
01:49:16.159 --> 01:49:20.600
going to be a bad day for
Norma Desmond. We cut to Norma's bedroom.

1656
01:49:20.800 --> 01:49:25.520
Famed gossip columnist Heada Hopper is there. She's sitting on her bed.

1657
01:49:25.560 --> 01:49:29.359
She's reporting the story into the desk. Norma is sitting at her makeup table.

1658
01:49:29.399 --> 01:49:31.239
Did you notice there are moments in
this movie where she's she looks like

1659
01:49:32.239 --> 01:49:38.720
is it Avonta Carlo the bride of
Frankenstein? Like she's holding angling her face

1660
01:49:38.800 --> 01:49:41.079
in a certain way. There's also
moments in this movie where she looks exactly

1661
01:49:41.079 --> 01:49:45.079
like Helen Mirren, but that's a
separate conversation. This is like she's pulling

1662
01:49:45.119 --> 01:49:47.159
her hair up, Yeah, it's
up up, and she has this look

1663
01:49:47.199 --> 01:49:51.239
on her face right She's staring at
herself in the mirror. She's ignoring all

1664
01:49:51.279 --> 01:49:56.039
of these questions. Is she's gone? This is how how a rich white

1665
01:49:56.079 --> 01:50:00.079
lady gets questioned by the police Los
Angeles. No one's a her. They're

1666
01:50:00.119 --> 01:50:03.199
just asking her a bunch of questions
and letting her do her makeup, Like,

1667
01:50:03.439 --> 01:50:05.279
so, why did you kill him? Lady? There doesn't even be

1668
01:50:05.279 --> 01:50:08.880
any question that she did kill him. Oh yeah, they all agree she

1669
01:50:09.039 --> 01:50:13.720
killed him. Yeah. I would
imagine Max is like, yeah, madam

1670
01:50:13.840 --> 01:50:18.520
is the greatest star. Who killed
that guy. One of the cops mentions

1671
01:50:18.640 --> 01:50:25.720
a newsreel camera that has arrived,
and Norma looks up into the cameras cameras

1672
01:50:25.960 --> 01:50:33.840
camera. She is very Jennamarone,
very jen is Norma Desmond, basically without

1673
01:50:33.880 --> 01:50:41.479
the success with that exactly Max Max. And Max appears and he kind of

1674
01:50:41.560 --> 01:50:45.159
is like, yes, the cameras
are here and Demilla is here. They're

1675
01:50:45.159 --> 01:50:47.199
ready to shoot your scene. So
the homicide detectives are like, all right,

1676
01:50:47.279 --> 01:50:51.960
Max, get her downstairs and we
will play along. So Norma starts

1677
01:50:53.039 --> 01:50:57.880
readying herself for her for the cameras. She puts on as like she puts

1678
01:50:57.920 --> 01:51:02.079
on all this makeup and like rhinestones
on her skin, like to get herself

1679
01:51:02.199 --> 01:51:08.760
like dressed for Salome. She thinks
she's making Salome. So Max goes downstairs,

1680
01:51:08.840 --> 01:51:11.960
he clears a path for her.
He goes to the newsreel cameras like

1681
01:51:12.000 --> 01:51:15.199
he's like back in his directing chair
again. He goes, all right,

1682
01:51:15.640 --> 01:51:18.319
lights go, sound go, and
he turns back up and he's like,

1683
01:51:18.399 --> 01:51:23.479
Norma, they're ready for you,
and he directs Norma. He's like,

1684
01:51:23.600 --> 01:51:28.399
descend the stairs, Norma. And
it's an amazing shot because the house is

1685
01:51:28.479 --> 01:51:31.279
filled with I mean probably three dozen
people, at least three or four dozen

1686
01:51:31.319 --> 01:51:35.560
people. There's cameraman, there's a
fucking head a hopper playing herself, there's

1687
01:51:35.760 --> 01:51:43.920
just police everywhere, and everyone freezes
as Norma descends the stairs. As Salome

1688
01:51:44.640 --> 01:51:47.880
exiting the temple, Norma stops at
the bottom of the stairs after her grand

1689
01:51:47.960 --> 01:51:51.159
walk, and she breaks character.
She says, I'm so sorry. I'm

1690
01:51:51.239 --> 01:51:56.560
sorry, but I just have to
tell everyone how how happy I am to

1691
01:51:56.680 --> 01:52:00.239
be back back where I belong,
and how I promise I'll never leave you

1692
01:52:00.439 --> 01:52:08.479
again. It'll just be us and
the cameras and those wonderful people out there

1693
01:52:09.239 --> 01:52:14.880
in the dark and glorious wants and
spikes the camera and looks right at us

1694
01:52:15.359 --> 01:52:18.680
and reaches. She reaches towards us
as she says, those people out there

1695
01:52:19.279 --> 01:52:25.000
in the dark, and she starts
to walk toward the camera, and she

1696
01:52:25.119 --> 01:52:28.760
tells Demil aka Max. Now she
thinks to max is Demil, and she

1697
01:52:28.840 --> 01:52:31.479
goes, I'm ready for my close
up, mister Demil, and she walks

1698
01:52:31.520 --> 01:52:35.760
towards the camera and fades. The
movie doesn't quite fade out so much as

1699
01:52:35.840 --> 01:52:42.119
like it's almost like we're watching Norma
fulfilling her dream and disappearing. It fades

1700
01:52:42.199 --> 01:52:48.000
into RuPaul's Drag Race Season one camera
len more and more vasline scrub. Yeah,

1701
01:52:48.159 --> 01:52:55.640
you see Norma walk towards the camera
until it's all just vasaline. End

1702
01:52:56.159 --> 01:53:00.119
of film. All right, stick
around to come right back and we'll give

1703
01:53:00.119 --> 01:53:15.960
you our random observations and final rankings
on Sunset Boulevard, and we're back.

1704
01:53:17.039 --> 01:53:24.000
Boy. Your thoughts, your delicious
thoughts on Sunset Boulevard. Did you notice

1705
01:53:24.039 --> 01:53:29.479
in the scene where Joe and Betty
are walking they're eating apples. Yes,

1706
01:53:29.680 --> 01:53:32.399
Joe just takes his and tosses it
into the the set. It's not a

1707
01:53:32.439 --> 01:53:35.520
real street, Joe, Joe Hey
don't do it on the real street either.

1708
01:53:35.560 --> 01:53:39.479
But also someone has to fucking clean
that up now, yeah you fuckerr

1709
01:53:39.560 --> 01:53:44.600
they're gonna attract fucking mice and rats
onto the set. Jesus, Olivia Havlin

1710
01:53:44.680 --> 01:53:47.000
has to work there. Come on, she shouldn't have to kick your gross

1711
01:53:47.359 --> 01:53:51.479
discarded apple. That woman lived like
one hundred and seventeen. You think she

1712
01:53:51.560 --> 01:53:56.600
has time to like kick your garbage
out of the way where she slipped on

1713
01:53:56.680 --> 01:53:59.920
an apple and died. Then that
we would have been robbed of like ninety

1714
01:54:00.079 --> 01:54:03.640
years of Olivia to have way to
kill Olivia de Havlin. Fucking Joe Gillis.

1715
01:54:04.159 --> 01:54:06.880
Just because Joan Fonteanne asked you to
do it, doesn't mean you should.

1716
01:54:08.039 --> 01:54:12.000
Haha. Johan Fonteane is around the
corner just dropping banana peels. She's

1717
01:54:12.000 --> 01:54:14.840
like, I'm gonna get that bitch. I hate my sister. I hate

1718
01:54:14.840 --> 01:54:18.840
her so much. So there's a
moment where Max is driving the car and

1719
01:54:18.920 --> 01:54:21.520
they're and like, oh, it's
when they're on their way to Paramount,

1720
01:54:21.520 --> 01:54:26.520
that's what it is. And Norma's
fixing her makeup and she's she's getting ready

1721
01:54:26.560 --> 01:54:30.960
for her big meeting with Demil right
and and Joe can barely look at her.

1722
01:54:30.039 --> 01:54:33.359
He's just like staring out the side, and Max, by the way

1723
01:54:33.760 --> 01:54:39.760
driving in traffic, looks at her
through the rear view mirror, then gets

1724
01:54:39.840 --> 01:54:43.560
on the like little microphone, ye, like the little blower horn, Yeah,

1725
01:54:43.600 --> 01:54:45.640
the horn they have in the car, and says, madam will pardon

1726
01:54:45.760 --> 01:54:51.359
me. But the shadow over the
left eye is not quite balanced everything about.

1727
01:54:51.560 --> 01:54:56.920
I'm like, holy. And she
immediately is like thank you, thank

1728
01:54:56.960 --> 01:54:59.520
you, Max, and she fixes
it and she fixes her eyeshadow, and

1729
01:54:59.560 --> 01:55:01.680
I'm like, how does he see
that he's driving? He should be paid

1730
01:55:01.720 --> 01:55:04.920
to the road, and like Joe
has that same look. Joe as the

1731
01:55:04.960 --> 01:55:12.439
audience story again and it's just like
the hell, I only have one more

1732
01:55:12.840 --> 01:55:15.600
In that first scene with shell Drake
in his office, that with the with

1733
01:55:15.760 --> 01:55:19.920
the development executive in his office,
so they make a comment about him having

1734
01:55:19.960 --> 01:55:23.479
like a stomach issue. Oh my
god, Yes, I know that line.

1735
01:55:23.520 --> 01:55:26.319
You know, I wrote it down
ready. His name was Shell Drake.

1736
01:55:26.439 --> 01:55:29.039
He was a smart producer with a
set of ulcers to prove it.

1737
01:55:29.920 --> 01:55:32.960
Yes, that. So in the
course of the scene, the actor playing

1738
01:55:33.000 --> 01:55:38.359
Shell Drake like takes out a cigar, starts getting the cigar ready starts smoking

1739
01:55:38.399 --> 01:55:41.920
the cigar, burps and goes ooh
because of his ulcers, and then just

1740
01:55:41.960 --> 01:55:46.039
takes a swing of a glass of
milk. I don't think that cigars and

1741
01:55:46.119 --> 01:55:48.520
milk are the cure for ulcers,
sir. I don't think that's it.

1742
01:55:49.359 --> 01:55:55.680
In Madmen, they have Sterling drinking
milk all the time his ulcers. I

1743
01:55:55.760 --> 01:56:00.359
can't believe that actually helps. Also, by the way, just my small

1744
01:56:00.399 --> 01:56:03.720
bit of color about Sheldrake. He's
supporting this movie the guy who turned down

1745
01:56:03.760 --> 01:56:08.039
Gone with the Wind for paramount who
wants to see a movie about the Civil

1746
01:56:08.079 --> 01:56:13.399
War. Everything about Sheldrake is excellent. I just have one more too.

1747
01:56:13.439 --> 01:56:15.760
Mine is not funny. Mine's a
bit of a downer. The one line

1748
01:56:15.800 --> 01:56:20.279
that really always gets me in the
movie is Max is trying to explain Norma

1749
01:56:20.399 --> 01:56:24.119
to Joe and the best way he
can, and he's like, why is

1750
01:56:24.159 --> 01:56:27.760
she so miserable? Like she had
a great career, And then Max says,

1751
01:56:28.199 --> 01:56:31.600
a dozen press agents working overtime can
do terrible things to the human spirit.

1752
01:56:32.760 --> 01:56:39.039
All right, Erica, how are
we going to rank Sunset Boulevard one

1753
01:56:39.119 --> 01:56:45.479
to ten? Twists we did not
see coming? So many of them so

1754
01:56:45.640 --> 01:56:53.359
many. Oh god, what is
that a monkey arm? He's her husband?

1755
01:56:53.439 --> 01:56:58.680
What what there's a husband's sweet one
to ten shrines to me? Uh

1756
01:56:58.760 --> 01:57:00.920
huh yeah, complete with pickle the
pendices. Okay, look, there's something

1757
01:57:00.960 --> 01:57:03.359
else I've been wanting to talk to
you about. And it's weird because it's

1758
01:57:03.399 --> 01:57:06.239
in a candy dish. And so
when I went in there one day,

1759
01:57:06.359 --> 01:57:09.960
like I lifted the top thinking I
was going to get like a delicious Werther's

1760
01:57:10.000 --> 01:57:15.279
Original or some sort of hard candy. I just are these toenail clippings?

1761
01:57:15.359 --> 01:57:18.439
Yes, it's just that's a candy
dish, not fingernail clippings. Crucially,

1762
01:57:18.560 --> 01:57:23.680
just the tea I knew. Yeah, the good luck tonail clippings. Okay,

1763
01:57:23.760 --> 01:57:28.720
that's what how many years of toenail
clippings? At least fifteen years?

1764
01:57:29.159 --> 01:57:32.079
Yeah, yeah you can. There's
there's a smell. It's a distinct odor.

1765
01:57:32.960 --> 01:57:36.000
Yeah, it's it's quite an aroma. Yeah, it's quite an aroma.

1766
01:57:36.079 --> 01:57:39.079
I want you to know. Like, I put the lid back on

1767
01:57:39.159 --> 01:57:43.239
it, and I would appreciate if
you never ever put that out when I

1768
01:57:43.359 --> 01:57:45.199
was here again, no problem,
I'll cover it with it. I don't

1769
01:57:45.199 --> 01:57:46.960
want to move it because that is
where my astrologer told me to leave it.

1770
01:57:47.199 --> 01:57:49.920
I will cover it with a blanket. Okay, yeah, okay,

1771
01:57:50.159 --> 01:57:53.279
I do have a blanket that's just
my face on it. That is that

1772
01:57:53.319 --> 01:57:56.119
okay? If that Yeah, that's
fine, that's totally fine. I don't

1773
01:57:56.119 --> 01:57:59.439
mind. I'm also sitting in a
chair that's made out of a mold of

1774
01:57:59.479 --> 01:58:00.840
your body. That's correct. So
it feels like I'm sitting on your lap

1775
01:58:01.239 --> 01:58:05.800
at all times. Yeah, it's
very very uncomfortable. Yeah, well I

1776
01:58:05.840 --> 01:58:09.840
am erect when they made the mold. So there's that's that is. Okay.

1777
01:58:09.880 --> 01:58:12.920
It is digging into my back pretty
hard. Yeah yeah, okay,

1778
01:58:13.359 --> 01:58:21.199
okay, one to ten very important
monkey corpses, so they really really he

1779
01:58:21.319 --> 01:58:27.359
should have hit the eject button at
the monkey corpse. Me. I see

1780
01:58:27.399 --> 01:58:30.800
the monkey corpse, and I don't
I'm just gone, yeah, like,

1781
01:58:30.199 --> 01:58:33.439
yeah, I'm going back to Dayton, Ohio. Imagine you're in Farah Fawcett's

1782
01:58:33.439 --> 01:58:40.439
house and you and you see a
dead monkey. You're just like, I'm

1783
01:58:40.479 --> 01:58:43.479
sticking here. I would be like, well, it was so nice meeting

1784
01:58:43.520 --> 01:58:45.359
you. I loved you and Charlie's
angels. Yeah, I'm gonna head out

1785
01:58:45.399 --> 01:58:47.720
now, thank you so much,
miss Fass, thanks for having me.

1786
01:58:47.800 --> 01:58:51.000
Oh that's Ryan O'Neill. Okay,
okay, okay, gonna walk away now,

1787
01:58:51.159 --> 01:58:55.319
walking backwards, walking backwards. So
you both knew about the monkey then,

1788
01:58:55.479 --> 01:58:58.319
okay, okay, all right,
I'm not the monkey undertaker. I

1789
01:58:58.359 --> 01:59:00.800
could see how you thought that,
but I'm I'm gonna leave now. I'm

1790
01:59:00.800 --> 01:59:09.359
really budde one to ten homocides.
Last known homocide was when Billy Jean King

1791
01:59:09.479 --> 01:59:12.960
kicked the shit out of Bobby Riggs. Oh that was a homocide. Side

1792
01:59:13.159 --> 01:59:17.800
absolutely, very very satisfying homicide.
That was a homicide. When Tom Daly

1793
01:59:17.840 --> 01:59:20.239
beat the Chinese diving at the Olympics. Oh yeah, there you go.

1794
01:59:20.319 --> 01:59:26.560
That was a homocide. The Chinese
got homocide. Yeah yeah, let's definitely

1795
01:59:26.600 --> 01:59:28.760
do homocides. Okay, okay,
do you want to go first? Or

1796
01:59:28.800 --> 01:59:31.119
shall I? Either way? I
mean, honestly, like everyone knows my

1797
01:59:31.199 --> 01:59:34.199
answer. So why don't we let
you go first? I will just talk

1798
01:59:34.319 --> 01:59:39.760
for forty five minutes if you let
me. Perfect Um, this is a

1799
01:59:39.800 --> 01:59:44.159
great movie. This is a great, great fucking movie. I told you

1800
01:59:44.279 --> 01:59:47.199
so, I told you so so. It's from nineteen fifty again, and

1801
01:59:47.279 --> 01:59:50.600
we made a really big deal about
the black man who just sits in the

1802
01:59:50.640 --> 01:59:56.479
corner for two seconds as the as
the shoe shine man. That's because that's

1803
01:59:56.479 --> 01:59:59.159
all the diversity you're getting, not
even the orchestra. No, like,

1804
01:59:59.560 --> 02:00:02.319
come on, yeah, no,
obviously there is queer content, but there

1805
02:00:02.399 --> 02:00:05.840
is no gay content in the movie. Joe Gillis, despite my misreadings of

1806
02:00:05.960 --> 02:00:12.439
many things, is not a positive
homosexual in anyway, or it's not even

1807
02:00:12.520 --> 02:00:15.199
meant to be read that way.
I don't think. It's just kind of

1808
02:00:15.239 --> 02:00:16.960
like the differences of language and how
people interact with each other that to me

1809
02:00:17.600 --> 02:00:20.920
reads is a little fay and the
nineteen of the audiences just how people talk.

1810
02:00:21.560 --> 02:00:27.239
Does not pass the Bechdel test.
I don't think, hmm, well

1811
02:00:27.560 --> 02:00:31.039
no, because the only other woman
is Betty's roommate, and there's the scene

1812
02:00:31.039 --> 02:00:33.560
where she's like that lady is calling
it again. That's true. But I

1813
02:00:33.600 --> 02:00:35.479
don't know that woman's name. I
don't know that's true. Yeah, I

1814
02:00:35.520 --> 02:00:38.840
think she's built as Betty's roomate.
Yeah, I don't know if that woman

1815
02:00:38.960 --> 02:00:42.039
is ever named. No, there
were only two women in the movie,

1816
02:00:42.159 --> 02:00:45.840
right, I can't even think of
a third. Yeah, so doesn't pass

1817
02:00:45.880 --> 02:00:48.119
the Bechdel Test. All that being
said, so it basically does nothing that

1818
02:00:48.199 --> 02:00:51.359
we asked movies to do. I'm
gonna rate it really high. I know

1819
02:00:53.479 --> 02:00:58.159
it's just a great movie. I'm
not the diversity thing nineteen fifty again.

1820
02:00:58.520 --> 02:01:02.680
You don't go into a movie they've
made from nineteen fifty and expect a rainbow

1821
02:01:02.920 --> 02:01:09.359
of different ethnicities being of different ethnicities
being represented. They have a German,

1822
02:01:09.840 --> 02:01:15.319
yeah something. There's obviously a lot
of queer content in the movie, in

1823
02:01:15.399 --> 02:01:17.600
so far as like the performance and
the drag and the melodrama of it,

1824
02:01:17.720 --> 02:01:20.800
that there's like queer energy to it. I think I think it's fair to

1825
02:01:20.880 --> 02:01:25.279
say. I don't know that that
would necessarily have read as queer energy in

1826
02:01:25.359 --> 02:01:28.800
nineteen fifty, but it certainly does
now. I think the two female characters

1827
02:01:28.840 --> 02:01:31.760
are actually great, and I think
they're given as much as the male characters

1828
02:01:32.079 --> 02:01:35.399
of the four. I think Betty
is the slightest, but she's not just

1829
02:01:35.600 --> 02:01:40.920
a love interest there to balance out
Norma like. She has her own ambitions

1830
02:01:41.000 --> 02:01:44.840
that she pursues Joe for a while
and not romantically. She wants to.

1831
02:01:45.079 --> 02:01:48.119
There's a career ambition in Betty,
and that's what she wants to accomplish,

1832
02:01:48.159 --> 02:01:53.000
and she's she's plucky, and she's
got moxie, and she's really charming,

1833
02:01:53.119 --> 02:01:57.359
and you want her to wind up. You want Joe to wind up with

1834
02:01:57.399 --> 02:02:00.600
her because she's so much better than
Joe. She'll make Joe better. Yeah.

1835
02:02:00.000 --> 02:02:03.000
Actually, I think she gets a
little bit more backstory than Max does.

1836
02:02:03.039 --> 02:02:08.600
Even Maxie, we get the horrified
story, but then he doesn't say

1837
02:02:08.680 --> 02:02:12.840
anything else. That's it. That's
all he gets. Uh. Norma Desmond

1838
02:02:12.920 --> 02:02:16.199
a character for the ages, a
character upon which musicals have been built,

1839
02:02:16.479 --> 02:02:20.840
movies have been built, like what
is upon swimming pools. Swimming pools have

1840
02:02:20.920 --> 02:02:26.439
been built on this character. What
an icon. I think it's kind of

1841
02:02:27.520 --> 02:02:33.960
cool that the movie engages with progressive
ideas for its time. The fact that

1842
02:02:34.119 --> 02:02:41.800
Norma is being ostracized from Hollywood for
the for the sin of getting older and

1843
02:02:42.119 --> 02:02:45.920
obviously has broken with reality. At
this point, it can no longer come

1844
02:02:45.000 --> 02:02:48.840
back. But whatever she did,
it seems to have been pretty mild.

1845
02:02:49.000 --> 02:02:53.920
It's not like, oh, yes, there was that time where she slapped

1846
02:02:54.439 --> 02:02:58.880
Betty Betty Betty Grabel Betty Grabil across
the face and she got ostrat from Hollywood.

1847
02:02:58.920 --> 02:03:01.000
No, it just seems like she
out at thirty and no one would

1848
02:03:01.039 --> 02:03:03.760
give her a part anymore, and
you know, or maybe it was getting

1849
02:03:03.760 --> 02:03:05.760
harder for her to get parts,
and she was starting to get mean to

1850
02:03:05.840 --> 02:03:09.520
people, and that was all the
excuse everyone needed. Okay, now she's

1851
02:03:09.520 --> 02:03:13.119
awful. She's a bitch, right, and now she's just wiling of her

1852
02:03:13.199 --> 02:03:16.319
time away in this dilapidated mansion.
She's she's gray gardening in this mansion.

1853
02:03:16.800 --> 02:03:18.800
I want to give it, like, I want to give it a crazy

1854
02:03:18.880 --> 02:03:21.880
high score, but I probably shouldn't
because it doesn't agent too. I don't

1855
02:03:21.880 --> 02:03:27.319
think it's offensive to anybody. It's
sins of omission, not sins of like.

1856
02:03:27.520 --> 02:03:30.119
They're not They're not like beating up
gay guys on the street or anything.

1857
02:03:30.800 --> 02:03:33.000
I'm going to give it an eight, Okay, I'm going to give

1858
02:03:33.000 --> 02:03:35.680
it an eight. I want to
give it higher, but like I think,

1859
02:03:35.800 --> 02:03:39.800
for movies from like the thirties,
forties, fifties, it's probably not

1860
02:03:39.920 --> 02:03:43.640
possible to be higher than an eight, really, so I'm going to give

1861
02:03:43.640 --> 02:03:47.720
it an eight and eight out of
ten. Homocides Erica, what do you

1862
02:03:47.760 --> 02:03:49.960
think giving it a nine? Pall
you give it a nine? Okay,

1863
02:03:50.000 --> 02:03:53.640
I know you said it's not possible. Guess what is possible? Possible?

1864
02:03:53.720 --> 02:03:57.600
Because this this gal over here has
a sliding scale. And if I fucking

1865
02:03:57.720 --> 02:04:00.359
love a movie, I'm giving it
a nine because here's but it is.

1866
02:04:00.760 --> 02:04:04.359
The movie does so much for the
mythology of Hollywood. Yeah, and like

1867
02:04:04.680 --> 02:04:10.880
turning it on its ear and showing
the dark, gross underbelly of it all

1868
02:04:11.000 --> 02:04:13.960
which other movies had before this.
It's not like a new thing. And

1869
02:04:14.039 --> 02:04:16.840
Hollywood loves nothing more than to talk
about itself. Yeah, and to parody

1870
02:04:16.920 --> 02:04:20.840
itself and to satirize itself. Yeah. It stars, it stars women.

1871
02:04:20.920 --> 02:04:25.880
I mean, I know Bill Holden
is the lead, but like Norma is

1872
02:04:25.960 --> 02:04:29.239
the reason for the season, Like
Norma is why we're here, and Betty

1873
02:04:29.359 --> 02:04:33.079
is, like you said, a
great secondary like character, and Max is

1874
02:04:33.079 --> 02:04:36.359
a great character. And it's pretty
much a foehander. Right, it's just

1875
02:04:36.479 --> 02:04:41.319
four characters. There's just nothing I
have to say bad about this movie.

1876
02:04:41.520 --> 02:04:45.680
Yeah, I'm gonna give it a
nine only because for the reasons you elucidated,

1877
02:04:45.840 --> 02:04:48.520
yeah, sins of omission. Other
than those, it's such a strong

1878
02:04:48.640 --> 02:04:53.199
film and it has such a point
of view, and it's it speaks so

1879
02:04:53.479 --> 02:04:58.119
much to like, like what happens
to women when they age, and the

1880
02:04:58.359 --> 02:05:02.680
cruelty of the patriotch toward women.
And I just think everyone and their mother

1881
02:05:02.800 --> 02:05:05.399
needs to see this movie. So
I'm gonna give it a nine out of

1882
02:05:05.520 --> 02:05:10.159
ten Homo sides. Yes, all
right, I don't think either one of

1883
02:05:10.239 --> 02:05:12.439
us want to offer a palate cleanser. This is going to be my palate

1884
02:05:12.479 --> 02:05:15.520
cleanser for the next five films we
cover. Okay, every film we talk

1885
02:05:15.560 --> 02:05:19.279
about, I'm gonna be like,
watch Sunset Boulevard. What are you waiting

1886
02:05:19.399 --> 02:05:25.600
for? So that is the end
of our show. We would like to

1887
02:05:25.680 --> 02:05:29.239
thank everyone listening. You can all
follow us on social media on Instagram,

1888
02:05:29.359 --> 02:05:31.560
on Twitter, threads, Spoutable.
We have a tea public shop where you

1889
02:05:31.600 --> 02:05:35.319
can pick up podcast swag. If
you are a Spotify user, keep a

1890
02:05:35.399 --> 02:05:39.319
lookout for questions and polls about each
episode we put them on there. You

1891
02:05:39.399 --> 02:05:44.039
have to kind of scroll down past
the description you'll find a question sometimes a

1892
02:05:44.119 --> 02:05:46.720
poll. We would love it if
everyone listening would give a five star review

1893
02:05:46.760 --> 02:05:51.039
on Apple Podcasts or any podcasting platform
that you may use. There are others

1894
02:05:51.239 --> 02:05:56.439
we like them too, You do
that just like b Burgeois ninety one that

1895
02:05:56.560 --> 02:06:00.279
famous photographer Ereka was thinking about.
We will send you all took bag that

1896
02:06:00.439 --> 02:06:05.720
aged well is produced and edited by
Paul Kiola. We would like to thank

1897
02:06:05.840 --> 02:06:12.079
Louis Morgan and Melissa Who are these
people? Who are these people who love

1898
02:06:12.239 --> 02:06:15.880
us and listen to us? Thank
you Louise Morgan and Melissa for reaching out

1899
02:06:15.960 --> 02:06:20.520
to us from out there in the
dark and letting us know what you want

1900
02:06:20.560 --> 02:06:29.399
to hear. Thank you for adoring
us. If you want even more power

1901
02:06:30.039 --> 02:06:33.399
over us and the topics we discuss, you have all the power you've always

1902
02:06:33.439 --> 02:06:38.079
had it. We can't live without
you. We need you. Our fans

1903
02:06:38.159 --> 02:06:44.239
are adoring fans. Tote bags tote
bags for everyone. Or you can join

1904
02:06:44.319 --> 02:06:48.600
our patreon, be a patron,
patronize the arts words words. That's all

1905
02:06:48.680 --> 02:06:54.520
we have are words. Vote in
an exclusive monthly poll to determine one of

1906
02:06:54.560 --> 02:06:59.239
our subjects, win more prizes,
listen to us even more. There are

1907
02:06:59.319 --> 02:07:04.000
more more episodes on the patreon.
Can you imagine how offended Norman Desmond would

1908
02:07:04.000 --> 02:07:08.279
have been by podcasts? So offended? We can't, you can't. You

1909
02:07:08.319 --> 02:07:12.119
can't even see our faces. Knows
that we don't have faces. The performances

1910
02:07:12.199 --> 02:07:16.039
that we are pulling out here into
the void, the void exactly. Ah

1911
02:07:16.600 --> 02:07:19.800
okay, seriously, though, head
on over to our patreon, patreon dot

1912
02:07:19.880 --> 02:07:25.239
com slash that Aged Well podcast to
find out more. Now, Erica,

1913
02:07:25.359 --> 02:07:29.520
some tears on the Patreon do come
with a thanks from a podcast character.

1914
02:07:29.680 --> 02:07:32.760
And today we are hearing from Oh
okay, now, this is unprecedented.

1915
02:07:33.720 --> 02:07:39.239
We're hearing from two podcast characters at
the same time. We have a this

1916
02:07:39.399 --> 02:07:45.720
person. This patron has requested a
thanks from both Katherine Hepburn and Lauren Bacall.

1917
02:07:45.399 --> 02:07:50.279
Hello again, it's your friend,
your family, your greatest star of

1918
02:07:50.399 --> 02:07:56.079
all of Hollywood. Katherine Hepburn,
Kate, you never did lack for self

1919
02:07:56.239 --> 02:08:00.600
esteem, did you. I was
the biggest box office draw of ninety thirty

1920
02:08:00.800 --> 02:08:03.479
six. I remember when I met
you on the African Queen. I immediately

1921
02:08:03.560 --> 02:08:07.920
thought, there's a woman with a
high opinion of herself. Ah. Yes,

1922
02:08:07.039 --> 02:08:11.399
I'm here with my good friend Lauren. Hello, Lauren, Hello Katie,

1923
02:08:11.560 --> 02:08:18.600
Lauren bcall also missus Humphrey Buggert Spencer. Bring me a Brandy Crussa.

1924
02:08:18.199 --> 02:08:22.079
It's got a rim to it,
Bogie. I want an espresso martini,

1925
02:08:22.199 --> 02:08:26.720
but make it with high point.
It's decaffeinated Lauren. We are here today

1926
02:08:26.920 --> 02:08:33.159
to say thank you to our friend
Kayla. Mmm. She says her sister

1927
02:08:33.479 --> 02:08:39.520
loves this podcast. I think it's
pronounced podcaste ah. Yes, it says

1928
02:08:39.560 --> 02:08:41.840
here in these notes that these people
provided for us, that we're supposed to

1929
02:08:41.920 --> 02:08:46.439
say that she has a sister and
she loves Keanu. So she started her

1930
02:08:46.520 --> 02:08:50.039
on speed. Have you ever started
someone on speed? Oh? I love

1931
02:08:50.199 --> 02:08:54.840
speed. In fact, one moment
that gives me an idea spencer, take

1932
02:08:54.960 --> 02:09:01.079
some man fetimin, shove it in
the drink. I want a Brandy krusta

1933
02:09:01.239 --> 02:09:07.279
with an infetament rim so delicious.
It will bring you up and take you

1934
02:09:07.520 --> 02:09:11.840
down, just like Hollywood, just
like coffee, depending on if you have

1935
02:09:11.920 --> 02:09:16.960
it caffeinated or decaffeinated. That's right, it's just like coffee, only instead

1936
02:09:18.039 --> 02:09:24.840
it's a thousand proof alcohol and amphetamies. So thank you, Kayla. We

1937
02:09:24.239 --> 02:09:28.039
love being here, We love thanking
you for being a patron of that age.

1938
02:09:28.119 --> 02:09:31.640
Well, pop coast, think that's
how you say it. That's right,

1939
02:09:31.720 --> 02:09:35.199
it's a popcoast, I believe.
Yes, whatever happened to the good

1940
02:09:35.239 --> 02:09:39.760
old fashioned radio plays? You know, the ones about unwed mothers who were

1941
02:09:39.880 --> 02:09:46.920
murdered by their families. Just good
family entertainment. Those always put me off

1942
02:09:46.000 --> 02:09:50.159
to sleep at night when I'm feeling
a little over caffeinated. So thank you,

1943
02:09:50.359 --> 02:09:54.840
Kayla. Oh good, Spencer brought
my drink. All right, Spencer

1944
02:09:54.279 --> 02:09:58.279
go back to swimming in the pool. He thinks it's a pool. It's

1945
02:09:58.399 --> 02:10:03.520
just a puddle we have in the
driveway. Bogie thinks our poodle is a

1946
02:10:03.560 --> 02:10:05.479
wolf. I let him hold onto
his dream so he feels more like a

1947
02:10:05.560 --> 02:10:11.880
man. Wow. Wow, old
like real famous, old timey Hollywood legends,

1948
02:10:11.960 --> 02:10:16.039
Green legend, famous friends Lahen Catherine
famously friends. We looked it up

1949
02:10:16.079 --> 02:10:18.600
and they definitely met. It's on
the internet, so it must be true.

1950
02:10:18.720 --> 02:10:24.199
They met once, and in our
minds they are best friends forever.

1951
02:10:24.399 --> 02:10:28.239
Yeah, Erica. Any final thoughts
on Sunset Boulevard. No final thoughts in

1952
02:10:28.279 --> 02:10:31.520
this movie, which again I think
is absolutely fucking perfect. Everyone should see

1953
02:10:31.560 --> 02:10:35.840
it. But I do have a
thought that it's been plaguing me ever since

1954
02:10:35.880 --> 02:10:39.520
we started this conversation about shrine that
you built to yourself in the house.

1955
02:10:41.800 --> 02:10:45.760
So, okay, remember a few
weeks ago when you served me some toast

1956
02:10:46.159 --> 02:10:48.239
and you were like, try this
butter it's in the it's like a butter

1957
02:10:48.359 --> 02:10:50.439
bust. It's in the shape of
my face. And I thought, oh,

1958
02:10:50.479 --> 02:10:54.479
that's really silly but fun and like
I tried it and it tasted rancid

1959
02:10:54.600 --> 02:10:58.239
and weird and like, yeah,
not exactly like butter at all. Paul,

1960
02:11:00.640 --> 02:11:03.159
did I eat an ear wax structure
of your face? I can neither

1961
02:11:03.199 --> 02:11:05.239
confirm nor deny that. Yeah,
okay, I'm gonna go have my stomach

1962
02:11:05.279 --> 02:11:16.800
pumped. I'll see you later.
Say it's your appendix. No, No,

1963
02:11:16.880 --> 02:11:20.199
that's funnier, that's funny. I
really thought you were gonna say it's

1964
02:11:20.239 --> 02:11:22.560
my opinions. It was weighing me
down.