1 00:00:16,079 --> 00:00:20,600 What is krack Alakin Hardware knocks Listeners. I am Dama Valley coming at you 2 00:00:20,679 --> 00:00:26,039 with an emergen c ish podcast. Let's call it an impromptu podcast because it 3 00:00:26,039 --> 00:00:30,320 didn't feel like an emergency very quickly before we get started. This is just 4 00:00:30,440 --> 00:00:32,840 your reminder. If you're checking us out for the first time, or if 5 00:00:32,880 --> 00:00:37,359 you've not done so and you're returning listener, please please, pretty please rate, 6 00:00:37,399 --> 00:00:40,320 review, and subscribe to us wherever you're getting your podcast. Subscriptions and 7 00:00:40,359 --> 00:00:43,840 downloads are most important. 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With the housekeeping ones out of the way, though we get 17 00:01:15,560 --> 00:01:19,239 to the Woadge bomb. It came on two thirty one Eastern time, Sunday 18 00:01:19,319 --> 00:01:21,920 night, as I was thinking about getting ready to go to sleep. But 19 00:01:21,920 --> 00:01:23,879 then Woadge was like to me, and only me, because that's the only 20 00:01:23,879 --> 00:01:27,840 person that matters. It was just like, fuck you. The report. 21 00:01:27,879 --> 00:01:30,879 I'll read the first two lines of it. As Brooklyn Nets star Kevin Durant's 22 00:01:30,879 --> 00:01:36,200 trade request approaches a fourth week, the Boston Celtics have emerged among teams engaged 23 00:01:36,239 --> 00:01:38,879 in talks and a possible deal. Sources told the ESPN the Celtics appear no 24 00:01:40,040 --> 00:01:44,680 closer to acquiring Durant than others in discussions with the Nets, but Boston's ability 25 00:01:44,719 --> 00:01:49,879 to include All Star forward Jalen Brown as a centerpiece and offers does help to 26 00:01:49,920 --> 00:01:53,640 make the team formidable in its pursuit. Sources said this was interpreted in many 27 00:01:53,640 --> 00:01:59,239 ways as a non as an update, a non update to the non update 28 00:01:59,319 --> 00:02:01,560 that was the previous non update. Since we've been at this Kevin Durant's stalemate, 29 00:02:02,319 --> 00:02:08,000 a lot of other people took it as Woads setting up the ESPN TV 30 00:02:08,120 --> 00:02:10,599 content for the rest of the week, setting up the content for this podcast. 31 00:02:10,599 --> 00:02:13,639 The other podcast, other shows. The rest of the week is the 32 00:02:13,759 --> 00:02:19,000 NBA news cycle sort of reaches its nadier. We're entering that time of year 33 00:02:19,520 --> 00:02:22,759 and there's really only Kevin Durant and Donman Mitchell to talk about unless you you 34 00:02:22,800 --> 00:02:25,080 know what's going on with Colin Sexton, things along low As Lines, Russell 35 00:02:25,080 --> 00:02:30,520 Westbrook with the Lakers. Everything seems on hold though with you know those three, 36 00:02:30,080 --> 00:02:36,560 Like I guess I'll say teams, Nets, Jazz and Lakers just because 37 00:02:36,560 --> 00:02:39,919 they have players or avenues available, and some of it's intertwined and it has 38 00:02:39,960 --> 00:02:43,159 like the rest of the league at the stand so but we're at a point 39 00:02:43,159 --> 00:02:46,960 where executives around vacation, coaches around vacation, whatever. So regardless, that's 40 00:02:46,960 --> 00:02:51,800 what some people thought. I immediately saw that it was two thirty one am 41 00:02:51,840 --> 00:02:53,919 Eastern time, and I have a thought, like, you schedule that tweet 42 00:02:53,919 --> 00:02:58,159 where it's almost at the exact half hour, but it's not. You want 43 00:02:58,159 --> 00:03:00,039 to put it that one minute or two minutes after, so that people think 44 00:03:00,080 --> 00:03:06,000 that you didn't schedule it because hashtag grind, hashtag always working, hashtag team 45 00:03:06,000 --> 00:03:07,199 no sleep. That stuff is stupid. I don't recommend it, Yes, 46 00:03:07,199 --> 00:03:10,599 I don't I need to take my own vice, my own advice. I 47 00:03:10,879 --> 00:03:15,120 it could be like a content setup. It could just be content for the 48 00:03:15,120 --> 00:03:20,280 sake of content. I don't the timing of it. I don't think he 49 00:03:20,520 --> 00:03:25,719 reports it just because maybe maybe editors, producers, content smiths over at ESPN 50 00:03:25,919 --> 00:03:30,479 really wanted stuff to run with to start the week and didn't have much. 51 00:03:30,719 --> 00:03:35,240 So this was out there in the ether. And we know that every team 52 00:03:35,240 --> 00:03:38,439 has probably been in contact with the nets to some degree about Kevin Durant. 53 00:03:38,599 --> 00:03:40,840 So you leak this out there, give gives us all something to talk about. 54 00:03:42,199 --> 00:03:46,080 I will say, what is odd? Why release it at this time? 55 00:03:46,960 --> 00:03:49,680 It would really only be if just ESPN wanted to have it as an 56 00:03:49,680 --> 00:03:52,680 anchor for its super early morning shows, But what would probably doesn't sleep anyways, 57 00:03:52,719 --> 00:03:54,639 we could have released it whenever. Are you afraid someone else is going 58 00:03:54,680 --> 00:04:00,240 to put it out there? Or this sort of feels like a message eb 59 00:04:00,400 --> 00:04:04,159 being sent to the other teams that are involved, like hey, if you're 60 00:04:04,199 --> 00:04:08,560 the Pelicans, if you're the Raptors, And we can't even really say if 61 00:04:08,560 --> 00:04:12,639 you're the Suns or the Heat because we know what their best offers are and 62 00:04:13,159 --> 00:04:16,360 it's for the Suns, it's Cam Johnson, Michael Bridges other salary, and 63 00:04:16,360 --> 00:04:19,720 then their entire future draft from Miami, it's it pretty much has to be 64 00:04:19,759 --> 00:04:26,639 Kyle Lowry, but it's gonna be Yovic hero salary, their entire future draft. 65 00:04:26,720 --> 00:04:30,959 Maybe maybe Brokelyn would push for Max Struce. So this could sort of 66 00:04:30,000 --> 00:04:32,120 be a message to the other teams in the sweep takes, like, hey, 67 00:04:32,160 --> 00:04:34,000 the Pelicans, if you were trying to get away, and we did 68 00:04:34,040 --> 00:04:39,639 a podcast and video on YouTube for this last week's to go check it out. 69 00:04:39,800 --> 00:04:43,560 The Pelicans I think could probably together a very meaningful offer without brandon ingram 70 00:04:43,600 --> 00:04:46,040 or CG. McCollum and obviously Zion who can't be traded at the moment, 71 00:04:47,480 --> 00:04:51,319 but also the Raptors. They can compablygether an aggressive offer without Scotty Barnes. 72 00:04:51,560 --> 00:04:55,839 Brolkan's gonna want both of those players and Scotty Barnes. So maybe it's a 73 00:04:55,839 --> 00:04:58,439 message to team like that, teams like that, or maybe it's just a 74 00:04:58,439 --> 00:05:00,319 message to teams in general, like, oh, Austin is setting the benchmark 75 00:05:00,560 --> 00:05:04,639 by including Jaylen Brown in these talks. We also, we don't know what 76 00:05:04,759 --> 00:05:11,560 else the Celtics would be theoretically discussing did they just do their due Excuse me, 77 00:05:11,600 --> 00:05:14,639 I'm talking too fast because I'm tired and always talking too fast. Did 78 00:05:14,639 --> 00:05:16,000 they just do their due diligence and say, hey, are you willing to 79 00:05:16,040 --> 00:05:18,920 do Jalen Brown and would have to be another salary to make it work. 80 00:05:18,959 --> 00:05:23,839 So let's I'm assuming it'd be Derek White, Derek White and Jalen Brown for 81 00:05:23,959 --> 00:05:26,519 Kevin Duran straight up, like, did they think that his you know, 82 00:05:26,600 --> 00:05:30,720 Kevin Duran's value is going to reach that type of bottom. We don't know, 83 00:05:30,959 --> 00:05:33,920 per this report how serious the Celtics are about their pursuit of Kevin Durant. 84 00:05:34,160 --> 00:05:38,959 I doubt this had anything to do with them leaking it, because you 85 00:05:39,000 --> 00:05:43,519 don't. Jaylen Brown is smart, super smart and can know that his team 86 00:05:43,560 --> 00:05:46,879 has probably had discussions involving him with Kevin durand you still don't want this out 87 00:05:46,920 --> 00:05:50,439 there. But maybe also the Celtics are like, hey, he's extension eligible. 88 00:05:50,759 --> 00:05:54,560 He didn't want to sign one. We know that he probably wants max 89 00:05:54,600 --> 00:05:57,600 money when he does hit free agency, which is why he wouldn't sign one, 90 00:05:57,600 --> 00:06:00,439 and financially, look, he shouldn't because he would be a player on 91 00:06:00,480 --> 00:06:04,240 the open market and his extension doesn't get him to the max. Maybe they're 92 00:06:04,240 --> 00:06:06,920 just like, well, we would rather pay the next two to four years 93 00:06:06,959 --> 00:06:12,639 of Kevin Durant than pay Jalen Brown over the next seven whatever would work out 94 00:06:12,680 --> 00:06:15,800 too on his next deal. I just have a hard time believe they would 95 00:06:15,800 --> 00:06:17,000 be the ones that are letting this out there. This deal is very much 96 00:06:17,759 --> 00:06:24,240 next driven, Like it doesn't feel the Celtics are trying to move talks to 97 00:06:24,279 --> 00:06:28,439 the towards the goal line because they've they've stalled, and look, they just 98 00:06:28,560 --> 00:06:32,680 came off a finals bid and they just got Malcolm Brogden. They're a team 99 00:06:32,720 --> 00:06:36,399 that has eight really good defensive players in its rotation right now, Like there's 100 00:06:36,399 --> 00:06:42,240 just not a week league defensive among their their top eight. And you're not 101 00:06:42,319 --> 00:06:45,120 going to want to create this. I don't want to call it turmoil. 102 00:06:45,439 --> 00:06:47,079 Everyone in the league knows it's a business, but you don't want this out 103 00:06:47,079 --> 00:06:50,560 there unless it is super serious. That's the one thing that's sticking with me 104 00:06:50,879 --> 00:06:54,800 is that if this is out there, that it does have to have some 105 00:06:54,879 --> 00:06:58,399 material meaning in the sense that I don't think it has anything to do with 106 00:06:58,439 --> 00:07:00,439 the Celtics to be honest, but it's more Nets driven and if they are 107 00:07:00,519 --> 00:07:03,199 letting it out because they're trying to drive up other offers, that leads me 108 00:07:03,240 --> 00:07:10,120 to believe and it's something that I would call it an educated belief or no, 109 00:07:09,959 --> 00:07:14,519 and it's an uneducated belief. Let's just be real that the Nets don't 110 00:07:14,519 --> 00:07:15,920 want to go into training camp with Kyrie and Katie on the roster, that 111 00:07:16,000 --> 00:07:18,600 it would be an absolute shit show if they did that. They want no 112 00:07:18,639 --> 00:07:21,279 part in it. They can posture or say whatever they want, and so 113 00:07:21,399 --> 00:07:25,800 they want this to be done. Maybe they'll still drag it into training camp, 114 00:07:26,040 --> 00:07:28,600 but like they don't want to have to go into this season with this. 115 00:07:28,839 --> 00:07:30,800 And that's sort of how I'm interpreting it, that you let this out 116 00:07:30,839 --> 00:07:36,600 now because you're trying to apply pressure to other teams because you don't want to 117 00:07:36,639 --> 00:07:41,120 be as patient as you've put out there that you're willing to be. For 118 00:07:41,199 --> 00:07:46,079 the Celtics specifically, the value of Durant would be huge. They still they 119 00:07:46,079 --> 00:07:49,439 looked at this roster and I don't think they need like necessary. I mean 120 00:07:49,439 --> 00:07:54,199 that every team needs Kevin Durant like he is just can fire over anyone his 121 00:07:54,720 --> 00:07:58,560 bag of tricks on the offensive end, the Celtics could use him so creatively 122 00:07:58,639 --> 00:08:01,040 too with his room protection and on defense. Now you have two guys in 123 00:08:01,120 --> 00:08:05,759 Jason Tatum and Kevin Durand who were just A one shock creators. And that's 124 00:08:05,800 --> 00:08:09,199 maybe what the two things they were missing is did they have another A one 125 00:08:09,279 --> 00:08:11,839 from scratch creator because it's not Smarter Jalen Brown, They're not really at that 126 00:08:11,920 --> 00:08:16,279 level. It's it's did over Marcus Smart. And then did they have another 127 00:08:16,399 --> 00:08:20,600 did they have even one A plus playmaker? Kevin Durant's not that, but 128 00:08:20,759 --> 00:08:24,399 he's like definitely an upgrade when it comes to secondary playmaking over a Jalen Brown. 129 00:08:24,439 --> 00:08:28,759 And so now you have all of these like one B playmakers with Tatum 130 00:08:28,800 --> 00:08:33,080 and Durant and brog didn't even smart there, even if you don't consider them 131 00:08:33,080 --> 00:08:37,320 the one A alpha passers. So your team is better in the short term 132 00:08:37,360 --> 00:08:41,440 because we know that there's that huge age gap between Kevin Durant and Jalen Brown 133 00:08:41,440 --> 00:08:45,600 because I think, look, Jalen Brown has aged out of the twenty five 134 00:08:45,639 --> 00:08:48,960 and under discussion, but he is still closer to a decade than not younger 135 00:08:50,000 --> 00:08:54,480 than Durant. He's turning twenty six in October and Durant's entering his age thirty 136 00:08:54,519 --> 00:08:58,360 four season. There's that huge gap there, and if you there's Celtics, 137 00:08:58,399 --> 00:09:01,720 you have to bake into your offer. Are you really going with your best 138 00:09:01,720 --> 00:09:05,960 offer of Jaylon Brown? And it would be a twenty twenty five, twenty 139 00:09:07,000 --> 00:09:09,480 seven, and twenty twenty nine first round pick. You already have a swap 140 00:09:09,480 --> 00:09:13,120 going out in twenty twenty eight, you traded your twenty twenty three pick. 141 00:09:13,279 --> 00:09:18,759 You could include other swaps, but are you really going that all in for 142 00:09:18,320 --> 00:09:22,919 the age thirty four season of Kevin Durant. I'm sure like he should want 143 00:09:22,960 --> 00:09:26,320 to be in Boston. It's kind of a situation where it's set up to 144 00:09:26,320 --> 00:09:28,960 where he could sort of ease into a roll down the line where he doesn't 145 00:09:28,960 --> 00:09:31,679 need to be the guy. But he does come in and it's still clear 146 00:09:31,720 --> 00:09:37,000 that he's the best player. Jason Tatum's there. Jayson Tatum is still sort 147 00:09:37,000 --> 00:09:39,480 of their timeline, but it's not like him jockeying for a position with Steph. 148 00:09:39,519 --> 00:09:43,440 It's it's just not like that, and it just gives him a chance 149 00:09:43,480 --> 00:09:48,480 to instantly contend. If I'm the Celtics, I'm not going like, maybe 150 00:09:48,480 --> 00:09:52,360 you include a pick and it can be a distant pick if that's what the 151 00:09:52,399 --> 00:09:56,519 net wants. The Nets want, there's also sort of signals that they're really 152 00:09:56,559 --> 00:10:01,240 serious about wanting players who helped them compete. Now, I have maintained all 153 00:10:01,279 --> 00:10:03,279 along, I thought they would skew one way or the other where they're not 154 00:10:03,320 --> 00:10:07,399 going to get both picks at an All Star that could still be right. 155 00:10:07,440 --> 00:10:11,120 I just thought they'd eventually leaning towards the draft equity route, even though their 156 00:10:11,159 --> 00:10:16,960 own draft is heavily mortgage to Houston. I just it seemed like a very 157 00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:20,639 aggressive offer would be more accessible in that form than getting Scottie Barnes and Ingram 158 00:10:20,679 --> 00:10:24,720 and I never thought Jalen Brown would actually be on the table. Now you 159 00:10:24,799 --> 00:10:28,679 get into the discussion of do the Celtics have the best theoretical trade package for 160 00:10:28,759 --> 00:10:33,120 Kevin Durant if they're going, I'm talking about the full monty of these, 161 00:10:33,440 --> 00:10:37,440 Not that this is what teams should put on the table or are putting on 162 00:10:37,440 --> 00:10:39,360 the table, but they're best offers, and so like, let's use Phoenix 163 00:10:39,360 --> 00:10:43,879 as an example. It's Jay Crowder, Cam Johnson, McHale, Bridges, 164 00:10:43,759 --> 00:10:48,120 four first round picks, and three first round swaps. That would be their 165 00:10:48,159 --> 00:10:52,759 absolute best offer, that is their ceiling. Toronto could do basically the same 166 00:10:52,799 --> 00:11:00,480 setup with Scottie Barnes and Ogann and Obi or Gary Trent Junior plus other salary 167 00:11:00,679 --> 00:11:05,879 and then you're getting four first and three swaps. The heat it's it needs 168 00:11:05,919 --> 00:11:09,600 to be Kyle Lowry and then probably Tyler Hero Nikola Yovic and if you can 169 00:11:09,679 --> 00:11:13,679 unprotect the pick, you go to ok See you can do three first and 170 00:11:13,840 --> 00:11:18,399 three swaps. So the heat clearly to me among the teams that have been 171 00:11:18,399 --> 00:11:20,279 mentioned, and we know what New Orleans can do. I went over a 172 00:11:20,320 --> 00:11:22,399 trade offer. If they really wanted to, they can get to the money 173 00:11:22,440 --> 00:11:28,279 without brandon Ingram and just include it's Dyson Daniels and then Trey Murphy the third 174 00:11:28,600 --> 00:11:31,480 and then like they can include any like they can include a fuck ton of 175 00:11:31,519 --> 00:11:35,799 picks, but let's say they include like five or six first just to be 176 00:11:35,840 --> 00:11:39,240 able to hold on to branding, or maybe somewhere between four and six. 177 00:11:39,440 --> 00:11:43,039 Their best offer would be brandon Ingram and then more first than the Celtics are 178 00:11:43,039 --> 00:11:46,879 offering with Jalen Brown like that would that would be the beat the Celtics offer, 179 00:11:46,960 --> 00:11:50,039 and there's so many. There are more variations to what New Orleans can 180 00:11:50,080 --> 00:11:52,879 offer than what Phoenix can offer after they resigned, a what Miami can offer 181 00:11:52,879 --> 00:11:56,799 when looking at their salary matching, and even what Toronto can offer. They're 182 00:11:56,799 --> 00:12:01,799 more versatile because if you're willing to trade pascals seem so that the Pelicans in 183 00:12:01,879 --> 00:12:05,679 Toronto are definitely more flexible in what they can offer. They can really get 184 00:12:05,679 --> 00:12:09,279 aggressive without including Scotty Barnes, without including Siakam in Toronto, or maybe you 185 00:12:09,320 --> 00:12:13,120 include Siakam and then it's in New Orleans where it's sort of well ingram Need 186 00:12:13,559 --> 00:12:16,919 needs to be in it in theory, but he also doesn't if the Nets 187 00:12:16,919 --> 00:12:20,679 are willing to skew draft heavy or you rally third teams together to where maybe 188 00:12:20,679 --> 00:12:24,000 you're getting players that the Nets want with some of that draft equity while also 189 00:12:24,039 --> 00:12:28,120 sending some draft equity to Brooklyn. So I think New Orleans and Toronto are 190 00:12:28,120 --> 00:12:30,799 the most fungible when it comes to the offers that they could go to. 191 00:12:30,919 --> 00:12:33,600 But when you look at the ceiling versus what the Nets want, I would 192 00:12:33,639 --> 00:12:39,519 say that Jalen Brown is the best immediate player that appears to be available for 193 00:12:39,639 --> 00:12:43,080 Kevin Durant, I think you can quibble over whether it's him or brandon Ingram, 194 00:12:43,080 --> 00:12:48,720 and I might lean brandon Ingram just because of his creativity on the ball. 195 00:12:50,039 --> 00:12:52,960 He's I don't want to say, and if you're fit, he's a 196 00:12:52,000 --> 00:12:56,120 tougher fit next to Ben Simmons than Jalen Brown, just because you look at 197 00:12:56,840 --> 00:12:58,840 how much brand Ingram prefers to operate with the ball. I think he did 198 00:13:00,279 --> 00:13:03,960 really well with CJ. McCollum, and I think he will do just fine 199 00:13:03,960 --> 00:13:07,039 with Zion Williams in next season n CG. McCollum together, But that is 200 00:13:07,080 --> 00:13:11,200 still something to factor in, and you do sort of value Jalen Brown is 201 00:13:11,240 --> 00:13:16,000 the better defender at this point by a pretty substantial margin, and so I 202 00:13:16,039 --> 00:13:20,240 think you go I would lean Jalen Brown is more well bred. I think 203 00:13:20,240 --> 00:13:24,600 of brand Ingram is he's under contract for longer, so you're looking at Jalen 204 00:13:24,679 --> 00:13:28,559 Brown has two years left on his deal at twenty eight point eight million and 205 00:13:28,559 --> 00:13:35,159 then thirty point eight million, but brandon Ingram has three before he gets the 206 00:13:35,159 --> 00:13:39,360 free agency, so that extra year might matter to Brooklyn. Maybe they're not 207 00:13:39,399 --> 00:13:41,960 concerned about and their payrolls are they're within a few million dollars of each other. 208 00:13:43,320 --> 00:13:46,320 Maybe Ingram does of a trade bonus. I don't know if Jalon Brown 209 00:13:46,399 --> 00:13:50,320 is a trade bonus, but that is really sort of im material to this 210 00:13:50,440 --> 00:13:54,440 discussion. So you have that extra year of branding or maybe that makes him 211 00:13:54,799 --> 00:13:58,240 slightly more valuable. And again his on ball creativity as such that it exceeds 212 00:13:58,279 --> 00:14:01,519 jan Brown. It's neck and neck. I think when it would come down 213 00:14:01,559 --> 00:14:03,480 to, if you're looking at these players as the base of offers, I'm 214 00:14:03,519 --> 00:14:07,240 not saying the Pelicans are offered in brandon Ingram I was an advocate of saying 215 00:14:07,399 --> 00:14:09,840 I probably wouldn't do it if I'm them, but if you have the chance, 216 00:14:09,840 --> 00:14:11,799 if Kevin Durant says, hey, I want to come to New Orleans, 217 00:14:11,919 --> 00:14:16,559 I do think fans are being a little like, it's not even shortsighted, 218 00:14:16,600 --> 00:14:18,159 but ignorant to say, well, we're gonna have a longer title window 219 00:14:18,200 --> 00:14:22,440 with this corps because it's younger. The league doesn't work like that, and 220 00:14:22,519 --> 00:14:26,039 also with Zion's health and his archetype of just like this anomaly of a human 221 00:14:26,080 --> 00:14:30,399 being, I would be worried about my window being shorter than most because of 222 00:14:30,480 --> 00:14:33,039 his athletic prom he already has those injuries in the rearview. No, don't 223 00:14:33,039 --> 00:14:35,639 want to bank on him not being available. But you also can't just pencil 224 00:14:35,639 --> 00:14:39,639 the Pelicans in for a seven to nine year title window. In a couple 225 00:14:39,639 --> 00:14:43,480 of seasons, We've even seen teams that are healthy just fall apart because players 226 00:14:43,759 --> 00:14:46,279 leave me in the Golden State. Why, I mean, they weren't healthy 227 00:14:46,320 --> 00:14:48,200 at the time. But these title windows in the NBA are increasingly fleeting. 228 00:14:48,200 --> 00:14:52,240 If you have the chance to open one, and Kevin Durant open one for 229 00:14:52,320 --> 00:14:54,759 you, and he says I want to go to New Orleans, you have 230 00:14:54,799 --> 00:14:58,320 to at least entertain and be open to moving brandon Ingram. I'm not saying 231 00:14:58,320 --> 00:15:01,879 you need to make the call, but it's I'm not talking about just media. 232 00:15:01,960 --> 00:15:03,000 I'm not talking about just the team, but the fans even need to 233 00:15:03,000 --> 00:15:05,480 just realize, like this is Kevin fucking Durant. At the end of the 234 00:15:05,559 --> 00:15:09,240 day, you would roll the dice depending on what the other parameters are, 235 00:15:09,320 --> 00:15:15,120 and so you put Ingram versus Jayalen Brown, and then I'll do this too, 236 00:15:15,399 --> 00:15:18,080 if you did Siakam versus Ingram versus Jalen Brown, like Let's say Toronto 237 00:15:18,120 --> 00:15:22,200 was willing to trade Siakam for Durant because we know the Nets want to win. 238 00:15:22,240 --> 00:15:24,919 Now, you don't want twenty eight year old Pascal Siakam if you're rebuilding. 239 00:15:24,159 --> 00:15:26,759 For the most part, that being said, it doesn't appear that the 240 00:15:26,799 --> 00:15:31,279 Nets want to do that. That's like three really interesting immedia pieces. They 241 00:15:31,320 --> 00:15:33,480 beat out Kyle ow or E from Miami, they beat out Mchaal Bridges and 242 00:15:33,519 --> 00:15:37,720 Cam Johnson from from Phoenix. There then it all of a sudden comes down 243 00:15:37,720 --> 00:15:39,360 to, Okay, well, who's willing to include more picks? New Orleans 244 00:15:39,360 --> 00:15:43,000 has the ability to include the most picks. But when you're looking at and 245 00:15:43,039 --> 00:15:50,120 I'll say, because of their age, Boston and New Orleans are incentivized to 246 00:15:50,159 --> 00:15:54,159 include fewer picks than I think Toronto would have to with Siakam. And I 247 00:15:54,200 --> 00:15:58,360 also think you're looking at some of these, I mean, maybe not Boston, 248 00:15:58,360 --> 00:16:00,639 I feel all that way, but like Toronto, maybe you don't them 249 00:16:00,679 --> 00:16:03,600 to be bad anytime soon because you're letting them keep Scotty Barnes, Whereas even 250 00:16:03,600 --> 00:16:06,360 in Boston, though, you're not going to trust them to be bad with 251 00:16:06,440 --> 00:16:10,320 Jayson Tatum still there. New Orleans and if you're a proposition just because of 252 00:16:10,399 --> 00:16:12,519 Zion's injury history, but you wouldn't. Those aren't teams that I would want 253 00:16:12,559 --> 00:16:17,120 to bet against their future anyway. What I'm basically saying is who would be 254 00:16:17,240 --> 00:16:21,120 willing to include the most picks in that I don't think I think Boston would 255 00:16:21,120 --> 00:16:23,120 be committed to adding the fewest, just because I'm looking at it through this 256 00:16:23,159 --> 00:16:27,000 perspective. They've already been to the finals, they added Malcolm Broad into their 257 00:16:27,039 --> 00:16:30,559 rotation. They very well could be the favorites to con of the East next 258 00:16:30,639 --> 00:16:33,720 year, depending on how healthy the Bucks are. I think I'm leaning towards 259 00:16:33,759 --> 00:16:36,559 the Bucks at this point, but Kevin rants on the Celtics, that will 260 00:16:36,600 --> 00:16:41,120 certainly change. So I just I don't think and they have fewer picks to 261 00:16:41,159 --> 00:16:45,240 offer, but I don't think they're incentivize as much as a Toronto or New 262 00:16:45,360 --> 00:16:49,080 Orleans to include more picks. And I'm saying this as if New Orleans is 263 00:16:49,080 --> 00:16:52,879 actually involved, it means they're actually involved, like this isn't if they're having 264 00:16:52,919 --> 00:16:56,159 their little cuchie quaint offer that's not really serious. Okay, fine, then 265 00:16:56,159 --> 00:16:59,679 they're not going to include as many picks. But if brandon Ingram is on 266 00:16:59,720 --> 00:17:03,799 the table, is my point, Then they're they're committed. That's a show 267 00:17:03,840 --> 00:17:07,200 of commitment by even discussing brandon Ingram. Not to say he's untouchable, but 268 00:17:07,240 --> 00:17:10,519 you're at least entertaining the possibility that, Okay, we're gonna do this, 269 00:17:11,079 --> 00:17:15,680 and that's going to take more equity. I think of the three boston Is 270 00:17:15,839 --> 00:17:19,359 could probably put together the package that the Nets like the most. I think 271 00:17:19,400 --> 00:17:23,920 they would end up valuing Jalen Brown more than Brandon Ingram, if only because 272 00:17:23,960 --> 00:17:29,200 of Ben Simmons being in Brooklyn. That's really those players are so neck and 273 00:17:29,279 --> 00:17:33,519 neck when you're looking at their values. Jalen Brown more two way, but 274 00:17:33,680 --> 00:17:37,200 Ingram made some strides on defensive. Again, the playmaking is just so different. 275 00:17:37,599 --> 00:17:41,240 I think the Nets would prefer Jalon Brown. I hope Pelicans fans aren't 276 00:17:41,240 --> 00:17:44,160 mad about that. And so if Boston came into Jaylon Brown three first round 277 00:17:44,200 --> 00:17:48,480 picks, I think they would prefer that to Siakam and three first first three 278 00:17:48,559 --> 00:17:52,359 to four first round picks. And then I don't know. The thing with 279 00:17:52,680 --> 00:17:55,480 the Pelicans too, is that they can offer the Milwaukee pick in twenty seven, 280 00:17:55,759 --> 00:17:59,279 and that Lakers pick in twenty four to twenty and twenty five in addition 281 00:17:59,319 --> 00:18:03,880 to their own. But are they incentivized as much as the Raptors to include 282 00:18:03,200 --> 00:18:06,920 the most picks that they can if brandon Ingram is on the table already. 283 00:18:07,279 --> 00:18:10,799 I don't think that they are. I just think the Raptors they already have 284 00:18:10,880 --> 00:18:14,079 Van Fleet. There's scenarios in which they don't even give up siak Ramer Barns. 285 00:18:15,359 --> 00:18:18,480 Because you have o Ganna Nobi, you have Gary Trent Junior, you 286 00:18:18,480 --> 00:18:21,519 can get to other salary filler, you can include those picks, and they 287 00:18:21,599 --> 00:18:23,319 just feel like they would be a little bit more. We've seen them be 288 00:18:23,359 --> 00:18:29,000 more aggressive in these situations than New Orleans historically, so it's not a matter 289 00:18:29,039 --> 00:18:32,200 of look out right. I want to make this clear. I think the 290 00:18:32,200 --> 00:18:37,440 Pelicans can offer the best package when it comes to willingness, or let's say 291 00:18:37,480 --> 00:18:40,960 the Pelicans can offer the best package. I don't think they're the team that 292 00:18:40,960 --> 00:18:45,079 would be willing to offer the best package when you're talking about realistic avenues. 293 00:18:45,400 --> 00:18:48,519 I think the Celtics can realistically offer the best package that the Nets would want. 294 00:18:48,599 --> 00:18:52,960 That they're the team that blends the disofers really attractive and we'd be maybe 295 00:18:53,000 --> 00:18:56,279 willing to give it to you. And I don't even know how much I 296 00:18:56,319 --> 00:18:59,440 buy that. And then I feel like the Raptors are the most incentivized to 297 00:18:59,480 --> 00:19:04,880 throw everything that's not name Scotty Barnes at the nets and try and work it 298 00:19:04,920 --> 00:19:07,599 that way. So that's where I'm sort of split here. I do think 299 00:19:07,640 --> 00:19:11,839 this report overall, it's fine if you think that it's worthless. I won't 300 00:19:12,920 --> 00:19:18,039 push back against that theory. I thought it was notable enough to record a 301 00:19:18,039 --> 00:19:22,480 podcast at a little bit after four in the morning Eastern time on Monday. 302 00:19:22,720 --> 00:19:26,640 We'll see if anything comes of this. I don't have the same I don't 303 00:19:26,720 --> 00:19:30,079 have that inkling or that knowledge that this deal is going to come together quickly 304 00:19:30,160 --> 00:19:32,960 and that this will sort of a last ditch effort to drive up the price. 305 00:19:33,079 --> 00:19:37,960 I do think, because this report released, that it is more likely 306 00:19:37,240 --> 00:19:41,279 that Kevin Durant now gets moved before the start of next season than it was 307 00:19:41,079 --> 00:19:45,519 just a few hours before I recorded this. That's not to say that this 308 00:19:45,559 --> 00:19:48,680 isn't out there because it's like the slow season, if you want to view 309 00:19:48,680 --> 00:19:52,039 it that way. I just don't think you let this get out there unless 310 00:19:52,039 --> 00:19:56,920 you're actually committed to moving Kevin Durant or wanting to explore the market for Kevin 311 00:19:56,039 --> 00:20:00,720 Durant, And so that just to me my read on it, the Nets 312 00:20:00,720 --> 00:20:03,240 aren't as oh, no, we'll let this get awkward. If we need 313 00:20:03,279 --> 00:20:06,559 to have both Kyrie and Katie come back. Maybe it's different if the relationship 314 00:20:06,559 --> 00:20:08,640 has soured with one of the players. The fact that it's both that this 315 00:20:08,680 --> 00:20:14,480 is a pail that's been hanging over your franchise for what feels like eternity at 316 00:20:14,480 --> 00:20:17,279 this point, I don't think you want to go into next season when you're 317 00:20:17,319 --> 00:20:21,720 also trying to They're very clearly trying to take the organization back from the Stars 318 00:20:21,759 --> 00:20:26,160 that they handed it over to a few years ago. So that's my read 319 00:20:26,240 --> 00:20:29,680 on it. I don't in the end, I don't think Kevin Durant goes 320 00:20:29,720 --> 00:20:32,039 to the Celtics. I think he'd be more likely to go to the Raptors 321 00:20:32,279 --> 00:20:36,119 than the Pelicans, with the Celtics and then the Pelicans before the Celtics being 322 00:20:36,160 --> 00:20:38,079 in the middle there. I still think, because this is what tends to 323 00:20:38,079 --> 00:20:41,039 happen with Stars, that he's most likely to end up in Phoenix because that's 324 00:20:41,039 --> 00:20:44,960 where he wants to go first and foremost, and their package is at least 325 00:20:45,000 --> 00:20:47,960 more attractive than Miami's. But I ultimately think he ends up in Miami or 326 00:20:47,960 --> 00:20:49,440 Phoenix. Still, I would love for it to be a dark horse team 327 00:20:49,480 --> 00:20:52,920 just for the chaos, and then maybe that also, I don't want to 328 00:20:52,960 --> 00:20:56,279 say send a message, because I'm not saying NBA players need to be taught 329 00:20:56,279 --> 00:21:02,839 a lesson, but it might make the awkward trade demand set up, which 330 00:21:02,839 --> 00:21:04,480 I get into in the mail bag that hopefully you all here on Tuesdays. 331 00:21:04,519 --> 00:21:11,240 I don't want to put out two podcasts in one day, but we get 332 00:21:11,240 --> 00:21:14,880 into this that this is going to be addressed the next CBA trade requests in 333 00:21:14,920 --> 00:21:18,400 general, but something is stark is Kevin Durant. The resolution to this is 334 00:21:18,440 --> 00:21:22,720 going to loom over those CBA negotiations, And if he goes to a wild 335 00:21:22,799 --> 00:21:26,160 card team, I just feel like that would maybe act as sort of this 336 00:21:26,359 --> 00:21:30,960 organic obstacle for players who might be considering to do the same with this many 337 00:21:32,000 --> 00:21:33,880 years left on his deal. And so even if he didn't put Toronto on 338 00:21:33,920 --> 00:21:37,559 a shortlist, or he didn't put New Orleans on a shortlist and the NEST 339 00:21:37,640 --> 00:21:40,279 just sent him there, anyway, I root for chaos. I'm not anti 340 00:21:40,359 --> 00:21:44,039 KD, I'm not anti player, I'm not pro billionaire. I root for 341 00:21:44,119 --> 00:21:45,680 chaos, and so that's what I would like to see. I still think 342 00:21:45,880 --> 00:21:49,599 the most likely ending is the least inventive ending, and that's megastars tend to 343 00:21:49,640 --> 00:21:52,599 get where megastars want to go. He is cited, to the best of 344 00:21:52,599 --> 00:21:56,119 our knowledge, that he would go to Phoenix or Miami. Maybe he'll start 345 00:21:56,160 --> 00:22:00,039 opening up that list, especially now that Boston's involved. Would say this report, 346 00:22:00,400 --> 00:22:03,640 though, does not mean does I'm not. I don't think it's any 347 00:22:03,680 --> 00:22:07,359 more likely the Celtics Kevin Durant than I did before this report came out, 348 00:22:07,359 --> 00:22:11,079 and I didn't even really have them. I thought they could offer a competitive 349 00:22:11,079 --> 00:22:12,680 package. I just didn't have them in the mix. Maybe I'll be wrong, 350 00:22:14,440 --> 00:22:17,319 But I also think even if I'm right, this report amounts to more 351 00:22:17,680 --> 00:22:21,839 than fluff. It does it? It is at least a harbinger of not 352 00:22:22,359 --> 00:22:26,039 just the state of negotiations, but sort of the state of how the nets 353 00:22:26,039 --> 00:22:32,960 are thinking. Because this information isn't just out there randomly because Woade wanted first 354 00:22:33,000 --> 00:22:36,119 Take to have something to talk about in ESPN. It Honestly, it doesn't 355 00:22:36,119 --> 00:22:38,759 even work like that. And I know that there are conflicting agendas, but 356 00:22:38,799 --> 00:22:42,279 like, it wouldn't work like that. It wouldn't come at this time of 357 00:22:42,400 --> 00:22:47,079 night either, at two thirty one am Eastern time, Wodge with the with 358 00:22:47,160 --> 00:22:49,599 the chaos grenade, the woage bomb, but but the chaos grenade, the 359 00:22:49,680 --> 00:22:55,559 fuck you minefield or grenade or bomb, so to speak. So That's where 360 00:22:55,559 --> 00:22:56,880 I'm at on this. I think the Celtics could offer one of the better 361 00:22:56,880 --> 00:23:02,279 packages in the league. I just I'm not attaching that many picks to Jalen 362 00:23:02,319 --> 00:23:03,920 Brown given the age gap. In the fact, this is where my team 363 00:23:03,960 --> 00:23:06,880 is at. It's great thing. You think Kevin Rant put you over the 364 00:23:06,920 --> 00:23:10,640 hump. You don't know that this isn't a question of you needing to get 365 00:23:10,640 --> 00:23:12,200 over the hump, like you might already be there. You could have theoretically 366 00:23:12,240 --> 00:23:15,160 been there this past season. I know the road to a title doesn't get 367 00:23:15,160 --> 00:23:19,119 any easier with the Raptors perking up. The Bucks shouldn't go anywhere, the 368 00:23:19,160 --> 00:23:22,000 Sixers shouldn't be going anywhere. The Heat are still going to be there, 369 00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:26,119 and then out west you have more contenders you need to deal with whether you 370 00:23:26,160 --> 00:23:30,440 know, you look at the Clippers in Denver specifically, in addition to the 371 00:23:30,480 --> 00:23:33,119 Warriors, the Suns aren't going to go anywhere? Do the Pelicans or the 372 00:23:33,119 --> 00:23:37,000 Timberwolves? Is the one of those teams sort of explode and enter the fringes 373 00:23:37,039 --> 00:23:38,839 of the discussion. What happens with the Lakers? Do they get Miles Turner? 374 00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:42,079 Do they get Buddy He'll? Do they wind up with Kyrie Iring because 375 00:23:42,079 --> 00:23:45,440 that changes the complexion of the race. I get there being urgency in Boston 376 00:23:45,480 --> 00:23:49,519 and maybe maybe they've gotten the sense that Jalen Brown doesn't want to be there 377 00:23:49,839 --> 00:23:53,480 long term. If they've had that conversation with him, then yeah, that 378 00:23:53,559 --> 00:23:56,480 changes a lot of things as well. This doesn't feel like that either, 379 00:23:56,559 --> 00:24:03,279 because that information is very clearly not in there. So I think to sum 380 00:24:03,359 --> 00:24:07,640 up here, the Celtics are still not the most likely Kevin rantestination, but 381 00:24:07,680 --> 00:24:11,960 the fact that it's out there that Jaalen Brown is on the table very much 382 00:24:12,000 --> 00:24:18,400 serves a purpose to let other teams know what baseline they're working for it toward. 383 00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:19,640 And I will say I still don't think the Nets are going to be 384 00:24:19,640 --> 00:24:22,519 able to get both, Like if you get Jayon Brown in a pick or 385 00:24:22,519 --> 00:24:25,680 two. I don't think that counts as, oh, we got all these 386 00:24:25,759 --> 00:24:27,799 picks in an All Star. You could sell it as multiple picks in an 387 00:24:27,839 --> 00:24:32,400 All Star, like they're gonna either have to choose the jail and Brown or 388 00:24:32,400 --> 00:24:36,160 brandon Ingram type package, or maybe the Pascal Siakam type package, or the 389 00:24:36,160 --> 00:24:38,039 one that's just teaming with picks. I don't think we look back at this 390 00:24:38,079 --> 00:24:42,279 and say, oh, the Pelicans moved like four firsts in addition to brandon 391 00:24:42,359 --> 00:24:45,920 Ingram, where the or the Celtics did three and Brown or the Raptors did 392 00:24:45,920 --> 00:24:49,480 four and Siakam. I don't think we look back on that. With Phoenix 393 00:24:49,519 --> 00:24:52,640 and Miami, it's different just because the primary players they'd be trading or not. 394 00:24:52,759 --> 00:24:59,039 These like could be or are fringe superstars. So yeah, you could 395 00:24:59,079 --> 00:25:00,519 see them throwing all their p on the table, but that's not getting an 396 00:25:00,559 --> 00:25:03,079 All Star player back in return. You don't sell Kyle Lowry as that. 397 00:25:03,279 --> 00:25:07,279 I love Mchaal Bridges and Cam Johnson. They're not that either. So I'm 398 00:25:07,359 --> 00:25:11,000 very just interested to see how discussions with other teams or what other reports we 399 00:25:11,079 --> 00:25:15,440 might find going from here. Hopefully this podcast isn't outdated by the time you 400 00:25:15,440 --> 00:25:18,920 listen to it. Thank you all for joining me for this latest Kevin Durant 401 00:25:19,000 --> 00:25:23,359 update. I will have a mailbag barring something happening that's already recorded done. 402 00:25:23,599 --> 00:25:26,359 It's mostly evergreen content. It'll be out on Tuesday, so look forward to 403 00:25:26,359 --> 00:25:30,039 that. If this is your first time checking us out on podcast form or 404 00:25:30,200 --> 00:25:33,640 on YouTube, please hit the permit subscribe button. It would mean the world. 405 00:25:33,759 --> 00:25:37,319 Like comment call us on the socials those are both in the descriptions and 406 00:25:37,359 --> 00:25:41,079 the podcast and the YouTube channel, and join our discord. The links to 407 00:25:41,119 --> 00:25:44,119 the discorder in the pod descriptions as well as well be a few descriptions. 408 00:25:44,200 --> 00:25:47,079 Until next time, and as always, I'll leave you all with a shout 409 00:25:47,079 --> 00:25:51,480 out to the one, the only, the untouchable in Kevin Durant trade talks. 410 00:25:51,759 --> 00:25:52,519 St. Frank