WEBVTT

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Wal check, check and check.
Walt. This is to two seventeen Recovery

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Podcast with Corey Winfield. You knows
as soon as he gives it to her,

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he's gonna give her his heart to
her too, and we'll have kids

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and getting married. That's too far. It is the twenty eighth of September

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twenty twenty three from Corey Winfield in
the North Studio today with a very special

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guest, a little Blasts from the
past, a friend of mine, dear

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friend of mine, mister Ron Robinson. Ron, Welcome to the two seventeen

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studio and to the podcast. Thank
you, thank you. I've a very

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cool place you got here, very
honored to have for you to have me

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today, very cool. Yeah,
two seventeen Recovery center now five years ago,

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six years ago, and somebody would
have said, Ron, here's here's

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here's what you're gonna be doing on
the twenty eighth of September and twenty twenty

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three. You're gonna be sitting with
Corey Winfield in his recovery center doing a

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recovery podcast, and you're gonna be
like recovery, like he hurt his back

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or like what would you think about
that if someone said that I wouldn't have

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believed it. I couldn't. I
can't tell you how proud I am of

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how far you've come, because I
saw you when you're at your worst.

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I mean, you know, I
saw you when you had a problem.

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So it's very cool to see what
you're doing now, very very impressive,

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my friend. Yeah, thank you
man. And we met in radio ye

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back when I was a youngster.
Should I tell you the cliff notes story

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of that of how we met?
Yeah, yeah, go ahead, all

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right. Well, was I had
just started at the station called WSJM and

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Button Harvard, Michigan, and didn't
know Corey from Adam. The people that

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hired me weren't there because they were
on some promotion, so I didn't know

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anybody in the building. And I
was literally a minute from going on the

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air, and this young kid opens
the door to my studio says, hey,

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if it's not too much trouble,
try not to suck, and then

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he closed the door, and then
I had to go on the air,

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And that was the first time I
met Corey Winfield. That's a true story.

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That's a true story. I know
you love telling it, and like

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you gotta think about it too.
That was maybe what twenty one, twenty

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two, twenty I don't remember what
I was. I was young, but

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you know I had always were the
backwards cap, you know, and you

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look like a limp biscuit video.
It really did. I was like,

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who's this guy telling me not to
suck? You don't know me. I'm

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like, it's all about the newkie. I'm going back in my studio.

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Yeah no, but that is how
we met. And I figured, you

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know this news guys over here,
and he doesn't look like the normal news

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guy, and the news news people
in just your regular it looks like stuff

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shirts. If we're being honest,
Radio personalities are completely different. It's like

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oil and water. And for people
who go to school for a radio,

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if they want to be a news
anchor or something on TV or something,

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hey man, go for it.
Now. If you just want to be

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on the radio and have some fun
and you're going to school, that's stupid.

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You're wasting your money. You can
learn everything on the job actually now

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yeah, and I will just start
your own podcast. You can get just

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as simple like that. But but
so well, that's how we met,

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and then we've actually worked it.
I think three different radio stations. Yes,

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let's talk about our second time.
Our second time. Well, oh

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oh, so this one's gonna make
this the sick one was in Kalamazoo.

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Corey got me the gig. We
had been a friend for a couple of

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years, and I think I was
I was doing mornings with wild Bill on

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the country station at WYTZ and Betton
Harbor, and I wanted to do more

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top forty type of stuff. And
you were at at our KR and Kalamazoo.

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If I'm not mistaken, right,
yep rock Yeah, and their sister

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station was more of a top forty
station, and there was a weekend gig

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open and you put your name in
and lo and behold, I got pulled

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in to do I think saturdays,
and uh, and I get do you

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want to tell the story from there? Why I was? Because I think

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I did that for like three weeks
or maybe a month before I was fired.

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Yeah, and and and look,
I deserved to be fired. You

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really did. But here's the thing
in my offense, I wanted to preemptive

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by saying I deserve to be fired. However, comma to just give you

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some background. At the station,
we were playing discs. Yeah, and

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and this time most most radio stations
had moved on to digital. Yes,

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and that's what drove me nuts about
working at r KR and countless you at

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that time because I come from Ben
Harbor, not even rated market, just

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small little whatever, but ran ran
well at that time. And now I

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go to Countla Zoo, you know, Market one seventy five or whatever it

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is, you know, and I'm
wearing Rated Market. Cool. I get

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there. It's nasty, everything's dirty. A mouse dies in the studio once

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a month, and it made you
realize. It made you realize how good

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we had it, and say,
Joe Ben Harbor, oh yeah, yeah,

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and so yeah, so they're playing
CD still. And so there was

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a song by an artist called Amen
and it was called I Don't Want You

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Back, and it pretty much it
was a poem to a girl who broke

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as yeah, go ahead so much, I don't know. Yeah, anyway,

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it was like a poem that was
put to music, and it was

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called I Don't Want You Back.
Aman E A m o N. I

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think his artist. I think he
was one of those hit one hit wonders.

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You can look it up on iTunes. I'm sure it's available. I

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would play it, but then they
would like censor this whole podcast because we

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don't have the rights to that's own. There was a version that they played

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on the radio which was track one
of the disc beep you Hoe and they

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don't want you back. And there
was a version two that had all the

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f us and expletatives in there.
Yeah, so the one version that you

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that was not cut one was like
you ho, I don't want you back,

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and then when you played said fuck
you you ho r don't want you

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back? Right, And but what
I did was when I put the disc

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in, I pushed the button like
apparently twice. So my point is,

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as although it's my fault and that
song did go over the air, was

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Now here's the funny part about that
before I tell you the backstory is immediately

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after I started playing the song,
I potted down and I wasn't listening or

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you turned the music, you turned
the studio the studio amount of it down,

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so I was not listening to the
song. Wasn't your jam. So

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you're in car like all of a
sudden, for no reason, it's a

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Saturday. No one calls the radio
station on a Saturday. The phone lines

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lit up like a Christmas tree,
damn lit up like. I was like,

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I must be a good DJ,
I must have posted up. I'm

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just right up to the artist came
to tell me I'm awesome. I am

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now I hit the post right on
that. But my favorite calls. I

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took a call and he goes,
I don't care about the FCC, play

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that fucking song again. I was
like, I don't know. And then

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the next thing I know, the
PD was you were playing cards with my

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boss at the time. Yeah,
he's having a poker party in his house

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and so I'm over there and what
he comes in. He because I called

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him and told him because I wasn't
I wasn't looking. I called him and

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I said, this is what happened, and I full disclosure. I told

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him it was up right, go
on. What he's like comes he's on

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the phone and he's just looking pissed. His face turns red and he looks

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immediately right at me, and I'm
like, what the fuck what's going on?

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And he comes up to me and
he's like, f you, Corey,

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I'm never hiring anybody who suggest again. Fuck you know, and he

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just runs out and he's like,
I'm leaving. I gotta go up and

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finish this shift. I'm firing this
guy, you know. And I'm like,

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oh no, what happened? And
so he leaves the poker party in

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his own home, so everybody's still
playing. He gets to leave. Yeah,

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go fire you and then finish the
rest of your shift. And I

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know there's gonna be some people out
there, So what's the big deal.

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But you have to understand, if
you remember the Janet Jackson Super Bowl instant

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justin timber Lake, when that the
fall out of that was kind of a

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radio problem. Ironically enough, even
though that happened on television, the fall

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out of that really put the sticks
in the structure into radio where it really

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hurt radio. Yeah, which it
makes no sense whoever. Yeah, but

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that's what happened, you know.
And now again you can't play songs with

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the effort and when you're on the
radio, that goes out to especially in

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Kalamazoo. I mean, you know, yeah, we all say it,

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we've all heard it, but uh
yeah, I'm the radio and I was

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supposed to do that. But yeah, it was funny though, and that

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so that was the sacond time.
So then the third time, I'm in

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Dallas, and the girlfriend and I
at the time, and this is something

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that I tried to hide for a
long time, you know, the fact

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that she was writing me these notes
and look, dude, you're drinking's too

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much. Yeah, And I thought, well, I work all the time

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and I deserve it, you know, and I'm just drinking beer. Well,

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And that's the thing is, you
know, because at the time I

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was I was smoking some pot and
I just Corey was a drinker. But

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I didn't never looked at you like
an alcoholic. He would just you liked

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you, You liked your beer,
you know. I mean, I was

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very ignorant, but you know,
I was a pod guy. You were

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a beer guy. I just I
didn't look at you as like an alcoholic.

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And I'm sure, as we know, it got worse later. But

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go on, So in Dallas,
you know, she's like to drink.

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And here's the thing. Whether you're
drinking just beer, whether you're drinking alcohol,

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you can just put beer like do
an equation, Beer over alcohol equals

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drunk, like they both equal drunk, you know. And that's what people

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didn't like. And that's what the
woman at the time didn't like. And

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so she wrote me, Now,
and it was like, look, man,

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you got to get out. And
when she wrote me the first no,

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I think I started looking. I
started putting our demos and stuff like

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that. And for Smith Arkansas,
I hadn't written me back, and they

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were like, hey, you know, we got something for you. And

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I wanted to get in management anyway, but this was more of like me

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just saying, well, we grew
apart. You know. I would tell

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people, do you want to get
your phone? Is that your phone's I

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think I just gotta put it on
mute. I just for some reason when

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I get texts, I'm sorry,
they get on the podcast and do the

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same thing to get rid of that. That's fine or nothing at all,

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live live podcast. Other jesus,
hey you're gonna get a call from your

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PD here pretty quicking. I know
I don't want it back. So I

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explained to people that we just grew
apart whatever, you know, she became

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vegan or I don't. I would
just say the almost things, but though

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in reality she was like, I'm
tired of your drinking. And I looked

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at it like, you know what, she was holding me back in my

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career anyway, I need to go
be in management and took the job enforcementth

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Arkansas. On long story short after, I drove all the way back to

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Michigan, then drive all the way
back to Forment, Arkansas like two years

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later, and I get there and
I am I'm lost. I remember I

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stayed in some really crappy hotel and
I went to work the next day and

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I was late because Ralph was like, oh, we got a meeting at

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nine, and I'm like yeah.
But I went and bought a bunch of

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beer the night before, drank as
much as I could, woke up the

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next day and just feeling like I
could just feel it coming out of my

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pores. And then I'm supposed to
go meet all these people and so I

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did, and I'm just like what
did I do? Like where am I

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at? And I couldn't find a
place, but I finally did. Not

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a good not a good reaction.
As soon as you get to a radio

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station, right, yeah, And
I meet Ralph Cherry at the time,

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and meeting him, I mean,
I like Ralph, you know, but

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when you first meet him, it's
a lot. It's a lot, and

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you're just coming from Dallas and you're
like, what did I just do?

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You know? And he's like trying
to simplify simple, very make everything like

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simple as he's kind of dumbing things
down. But he's dumbing a dumb situation

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down, which is making me like
not have much faith in any of this.

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And so day or two after I
started, maybe the same day I

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started, and they're like, oh, there's a country job open, you

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know, blah blah blah. And
I think we had talked and I told

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you I'm here in Arkansas. It's
great. You should get a job here

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too. This is I love it
here. It's so wonderful, Ron,

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And so you send in your demo, and then Ralph was, you know,

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talking to me about this is an
eight. I should give a little

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backstory because it's in OH eight,
I was. I was working at w

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Jared Detroit as a news anchor covering
a high profile murder case. I was

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teaching it at broadcasting school called specs
Howard. And I was running the ribbon

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boards of co America Park Tires games, which was one of the best jobs

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every very cool. And in OH
eight, when everybody knows in the economy,

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you know, kind of took a
dive. I went from working all

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three jobs and it was welcome because
I was working a lot of hours.

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I was going through a divorce.
It was just I need to work a

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lot of hours. And I went
from working three pretty much full time jobs

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to just part time in JR.
Because the trial ended, the season ended,

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I got laid off as specs,
and so I was in need of

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a job. And if I wanted
to stay in radio, my compass had

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to point to Fort Smith, Arkansas. Yep. And that's how it started.

206
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Yeah, and especially in guys,
you know when child supports do child

207
00:12:41.679 --> 00:12:43.720
supports do? Sorry again, behind, that's not good. So it was

208
00:12:43.759 --> 00:12:46.960
it was a great situation for you
because it was it was a job,

209
00:12:46.000 --> 00:12:48.600
it was in radio, and you
didn't know anything about Fort Smith, Arkansas

210
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at the time. So nope,
why not, My boy Coy's there is

211
00:12:52.840 --> 00:12:58.080
some how great it is. And
here's the thing you told Ralph, you

212
00:12:58.080 --> 00:13:00.000
said, hey, you need to
cover Ron. You need to bring him

213
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into the country stage. Because in
addition to news, I had also had

214
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a lot of jobs working in country
radio. As I mentioned, I was

215
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doing the morning show on WYTZ and
Betton Harber with wild Bill while Bill Lewis

216
00:13:13.159 --> 00:13:18.480
everybody knows him, Betton Harder wild
Bill anyway, So you Ralph reach out,

217
00:13:18.639 --> 00:13:20.480
reaches out to me, said,
hey, you know, we're gonna

218
00:13:20.519 --> 00:13:22.679
hire you and sit tight and I'll
give you a call back. When then

219
00:13:22.679 --> 00:13:26.759
I got ghosted and then you ghosted
me, and I was like, what's

220
00:13:26.759 --> 00:13:28.879
going on? So I was like, like, am I going to have

221
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a job here? So I actually
went to visit my father in Nashville because

222
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I didn't know what was going on. So, but come to find out,

223
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he ended up hiring someone else.
Talk about that because I didn't know.

224
00:13:39.679 --> 00:13:41.840
I mean, you guys ghosted me. I thought I was gonna get

225
00:13:41.879 --> 00:13:43.960
hired the next thing, I know
nothing, because they hired somebody else for

226
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the gig. Yeah, he'd always
coming to my studio and just kind of

227
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sitting there and like show and I'm
like, dude, you gotta hire him

228
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a boy man. And I don't
think he actually told me he was going

229
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to hire somebody else, but I
was starting to get that failing, and

230
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I was pretty pissed at him,
and I'm like, dude, that's stupid.

231
00:14:01.600 --> 00:14:03.320
I think. Then he came in
he's like, well, I'm gonna

232
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hire you of a way. I
was like, all right, cool,

233
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you know, and then then you
came to Fort Smith, Arkansas, and

234
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that it was very cool. It
was nice to have somebody that because being

235
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somewhere you don't know anybody. And
then later I would look at my abandonment

236
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issues and then okay, well you're
moving around the country where you're in relationships

237
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that just aren't working because of the
drinking, and the drinking became my best

238
00:14:26.000 --> 00:14:30.080
friend. That's my only friend,
you know, And you were there and

239
00:14:30.159 --> 00:14:33.440
that helped would watch football on the
weekends. And I should say when I

240
00:14:33.480 --> 00:14:37.600
first got there, even then,
I really didn't realize how bad your problem

241
00:14:37.679 --> 00:14:39.799
was, because it's not like you
would talk about it. But I remember

242
00:14:39.840 --> 00:14:43.279
I came over your house and you're
like, and you would have these empty

243
00:14:43.320 --> 00:14:48.440
containers of I think it was bush
light. Maybe it was Milwaukee's best,

244
00:14:48.480 --> 00:14:52.279
Milwaukee's yeah, brock Bottom, Well, if you want to hire alcohol content,

245
00:14:52.360 --> 00:14:54.840
you know. But I was like, wow, Corey drinks a lot

246
00:14:54.879 --> 00:14:58.679
of beer, like that was my
I was like, wow, I you

247
00:14:58.720 --> 00:15:00.960
know, I was. I was
in the core. I used to drink

248
00:15:00.960 --> 00:15:03.720
some beer. I couldn't you were
a first ballot Hall of Famer. I

249
00:15:03.879 --> 00:15:07.320
wasn't beer drinkers A tall pack of
night Yeah, so of this. And

250
00:15:07.440 --> 00:15:11.240
I say at night, I mean
like from six o'clock to ten o'clock or

251
00:15:11.279 --> 00:15:15.600
eleven o'clock whenever, I would you
know, pass out. I mean that's

252
00:15:15.600 --> 00:15:16.840
slamming some beers. Really, you
know when you think about it. And

253
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then I would come to work and
I remember you would be like, man,

254
00:15:20.039 --> 00:15:22.960
it seems like a brewery in here. Because if you drink that much

255
00:15:22.960 --> 00:15:26.759
so quick, the alcohol can't it
doesn't leave you and your pea, you

256
00:15:26.759 --> 00:15:28.559
know, but it wants to get
out of your body. So it leaves

257
00:15:28.600 --> 00:15:31.799
out of your pores. And that's
the thing, because I know you weren't

258
00:15:31.799 --> 00:15:33.679
coming to work drunk. It's just
from the night before that you just when

259
00:15:33.679 --> 00:15:35.759
you get off of work, you
would just go and drink beer and beer.

260
00:15:35.840 --> 00:15:41.480
So when you'd come in and we'd
have these meetings, department had meetings,

261
00:15:41.519 --> 00:15:43.840
and just it was like it was
so strong, it was coming out

262
00:15:43.840 --> 00:15:48.600
of the pores of your skin.
It was it was I've never experienced anything

263
00:15:48.639 --> 00:15:50.000
like that. I was like,
wow, this is it's a lot of

264
00:15:50.039 --> 00:15:54.240
beer Coreyes, drinking. Yeah,
And the feeling like on your skin is

265
00:15:54.279 --> 00:15:56.840
like hot. You just feel like
hot, and of course Arkansas's hot.

266
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Anyway, but you just feel like
and the only time I wasn't drinking is

267
00:16:02.960 --> 00:16:07.799
when I woke up to the time
I got out of work. That time

268
00:16:07.840 --> 00:16:14.000
I was not drinking, but every
other time I was drinking, you know,

269
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and it just became the problem.
Then you left, I know,

270
00:16:18.480 --> 00:16:23.240
you left me there, that's okay, and then you know it left very

271
00:16:25.240 --> 00:16:30.879
kind of go on alone again.
And I remember because you went to Memphis

272
00:16:30.440 --> 00:16:37.120
for Saint Judeau have a radio.
Yeah, And after you left, then

273
00:16:37.320 --> 00:16:41.240
Kendra left or whatever, and I
became the promotions director too, So I

274
00:16:41.360 --> 00:16:47.360
ended up going to Saint Jude and
they have their little poker night where everybody's

275
00:16:47.399 --> 00:16:51.320
drinking and gambling, and boy,
I was drinking and I ended up winning

276
00:16:51.360 --> 00:16:55.399
a bunch of little coop. I
was cleaning everybody out at poker. But

277
00:16:55.480 --> 00:16:56.960
we did the station didn't win anything, so I kind of sucked. But

278
00:16:57.320 --> 00:17:00.639
I drank so much that next day
I couldn't even function. Dude, I

279
00:17:00.639 --> 00:17:04.680
couldn't even go down to the little
meetings they were having. You know.

280
00:17:04.720 --> 00:17:07.160
It was so bad. I'm like, oh great, it's and you know

281
00:17:07.200 --> 00:17:11.559
my boss was there too, and
he had actually went out drinking with me

282
00:17:11.640 --> 00:17:15.200
a little bit but they weren't like
me. You know, like at the

283
00:17:15.200 --> 00:17:17.720
time, we were social drinkers.
They weren't drinking for sport. Yeah.

284
00:17:18.119 --> 00:17:21.319
I was like, let's keep going, like we drink until we pass out.

285
00:17:22.359 --> 00:17:26.559
And I think he kind of red
flag that a little, but he

286
00:17:26.599 --> 00:17:30.000
didn't say much to me. And
I always had excuses of, oh,

287
00:17:30.039 --> 00:17:33.160
well, because of this or that, but but honest truth was I just

288
00:17:33.200 --> 00:17:36.799
got way too drunk. And I
didn't drink hard liquor much at that time.

289
00:17:37.920 --> 00:17:40.359
Yeah, so this was like mixing
all in and you know, my

290
00:17:40.400 --> 00:17:45.920
body wasn't used to that, and
so get back buy a house. Woman

291
00:17:47.599 --> 00:17:49.440
ended up, you know, meeting
somebody and think, oh this is great,

292
00:17:49.480 --> 00:17:52.240
and I was just settling and it
has nothing to do with her.

293
00:17:52.319 --> 00:17:56.240
She's she's a good person or whatever. This is all all me and this

294
00:17:56.279 --> 00:17:59.200
is all my fault. But she
saw that I liked to drink, so

295
00:17:59.279 --> 00:18:00.000
she was like, okay, well
he likes to drink, Well, then

296
00:18:00.000 --> 00:18:03.519
I'll drink too. And she didn't
drink beer. She only drink like liquor.

297
00:18:03.880 --> 00:18:07.200
And so then I started drinking hard
liquor and I had sworn off our

298
00:18:07.200 --> 00:18:08.799
liquor. And I was like twenty
three like as far as like buying it

299
00:18:08.839 --> 00:18:11.640
and bring it home, like if
I'm at the bar or whatever, I'm

300
00:18:11.640 --> 00:18:14.920
like, yeah, okay, sure. But I started buying it and then

301
00:18:14.920 --> 00:18:18.519
it became pints and then fifths and
then half gallons. And I'm not talking

302
00:18:18.559 --> 00:18:21.599
just regular, so I'm talking like
a hundred proof, you know. Ninety

303
00:18:21.640 --> 00:18:26.160
proof is like the weakest I would
go. And yeah, eventually she got

304
00:18:26.160 --> 00:18:27.599
tired of my ship and said,
I can't do it any more. I'm

305
00:18:27.599 --> 00:18:32.920
out. And I think like a
year after that is when my liver and

306
00:18:33.000 --> 00:18:36.160
kidney shut down. Well, I
want to add here because while that was

307
00:18:36.200 --> 00:18:38.680
going on, because I even when
I left Fort Smith to come back to

308
00:18:38.720 --> 00:18:42.839
Michigan, I don't think I really
realized how bad your problem was until I

309
00:18:42.880 --> 00:18:47.559
did move back, because we would
talk on the phone and I don't remember.

310
00:18:47.559 --> 00:18:48.759
I mean, you would go off
on these long tangents and you could

311
00:18:48.799 --> 00:18:52.119
just tell that you were just hammered. Yeah, and I never expect I

312
00:18:52.160 --> 00:18:56.680
mean, I don't think I ever
saw you drunk when we when we worked

313
00:18:56.680 --> 00:18:59.480
together in Fort Smith, because you
never came to work drunk, right,

314
00:18:59.599 --> 00:19:02.000
and if you worked drunk, you
hit it pretty well. But when you

315
00:19:02.079 --> 00:19:04.319
when when I came home and and
you would talk on the phone. I

316
00:19:04.319 --> 00:19:07.839
mean you would go on runs where
you just weren't making a lot of sense,

317
00:19:07.839 --> 00:19:11.000
and I was like, wow,
this is not good. This is

318
00:19:11.039 --> 00:19:14.400
not good. And then you were
telling these stories about about your kidney and

319
00:19:14.440 --> 00:19:18.000
about that you know that you just
you were you were seeing it. You

320
00:19:18.000 --> 00:19:19.319
were trying to get help, and
it just nothing seemed to work, and

321
00:19:19.359 --> 00:19:22.759
you just kept it was like a
hamster and hampster wheel. You just couldn't

322
00:19:22.799 --> 00:19:26.440
kick it. Yeah, I felt
helpless as a friend. It felt helpless

323
00:19:26.440 --> 00:19:30.119
because I could see you were spinning
out of control and there was really nothing,

324
00:19:30.440 --> 00:19:33.200
especially being you know, you being
in Arkansas still, I mean,

325
00:19:33.319 --> 00:19:34.160
be in Michigan. What am I
gonna do? How am I gonna help

326
00:19:34.200 --> 00:19:40.160
you? Yeah, and being there
alone. And so then when an opportunity

327
00:19:40.240 --> 00:19:44.640
came for me to move back to
Michigan, I first told them no,

328
00:19:44.759 --> 00:19:45.640
and they're like, no, we
pay better now, and I'm like,

329
00:19:45.640 --> 00:19:48.279
well, They're like, oh,
this Dave douche guy, he's running the

330
00:19:48.279 --> 00:19:51.880
place now, and I'm like,
yeah, I didn't like him before when

331
00:19:51.880 --> 00:19:53.839
he worked there. I thought he
was kind of an ass. Why would

332
00:19:53.839 --> 00:19:56.119
I do that? Well, but
he's changed and you'll probably like it.

333
00:19:56.200 --> 00:20:00.839
And so then like I remember I
was supposed to you interview with him,

334
00:20:00.839 --> 00:20:03.480
and I kind of blew them off, and then they call me. They're

335
00:20:03.480 --> 00:20:06.640
like, are you missed an interview. I'm like yeah. He's like,

336
00:20:06.640 --> 00:20:08.720
no, fear of real you know, what do you what are you want?

337
00:20:08.720 --> 00:20:11.200
And I was like, well,
this is why I made last year,

338
00:20:11.279 --> 00:20:12.720
like we'll match that angel get bonuses. And I was like, hmm,

339
00:20:15.640 --> 00:20:18.319
I thought that was great because coming
back to sign, you know,

340
00:20:18.400 --> 00:20:19.799
like and this is what what I'll
need, you know, and this is

341
00:20:19.839 --> 00:20:22.839
the things that will happen. And
then you know, I moved back and

342
00:20:23.359 --> 00:20:26.440
as soon as I like signed that, yeah I'm coming and told my boss

343
00:20:26.480 --> 00:20:30.559
in Arkansas and he understood. He
was like, yeah, I get it,

344
00:20:30.559 --> 00:20:32.839
man, You're gonna go home.
When I left, he was probably

345
00:20:32.920 --> 00:20:34.680
you were probably just waiting for you
to drop the other shoe because we knew

346
00:20:34.680 --> 00:20:37.680
we were both from Michigan. And
he's like, you could have worked here

347
00:20:37.680 --> 00:20:38.279
for the first of your life.
Man. He's like, we're gonna put

348
00:20:38.279 --> 00:20:41.359
you bought a house. We're gonna
put you in different I left, you

349
00:20:41.400 --> 00:20:44.119
bought a house. I was like, Corey staying at Arkansas. I was

350
00:20:44.119 --> 00:20:45.519
in Fayetville and Fort Smith. He
was talking a little rock, you know,

351
00:20:45.559 --> 00:20:48.839
and maybe who knows what else,
and so I was just like,

352
00:20:48.880 --> 00:20:51.799
all right, then I'm leaving because
I'm gonna go home and this is probably

353
00:20:51.799 --> 00:20:53.720
what I need for my sobriety and
for me to have a chance, and

354
00:20:53.720 --> 00:20:56.920
I move home. But as soon
as I, you know, sealed the

355
00:20:56.960 --> 00:21:00.519
deal, that's when I started hearing
all the bad news about oh, you're

356
00:21:00.599 --> 00:21:03.559
not gonna like it, and the
dudes even worse than he was before.

357
00:21:04.200 --> 00:21:07.079
Your buddy kind of reached out to
you. Ye a foul friend from the

358
00:21:07.160 --> 00:21:11.319
SGM days. Yeah, and a
few other people did. And then I

359
00:21:11.519 --> 00:21:12.759
get back there and I'm like,
well, where's wild Bill And They're like,

360
00:21:12.759 --> 00:21:15.519
oh, he doesn't work here anymore. I'm like what. Wild Bill

361
00:21:15.599 --> 00:21:19.200
was a staple? Like, yeah, I loved talked about him earlier in

362
00:21:19.400 --> 00:21:22.880
a nice conversation with him last night, and hopefully we'll be starting something soon.

363
00:21:23.119 --> 00:21:27.079
I'm looking forward to that. But
I was like, what is going

364
00:21:27.119 --> 00:21:29.920
on? Like what do you mean? They're like, well, yeah,

365
00:21:30.240 --> 00:21:33.880
build and they always had some shit
to say about somebody, and that's that's

366
00:21:33.920 --> 00:21:38.079
a huge red flag just for everyone
out there. If you're listening and you

367
00:21:38.160 --> 00:21:41.079
hear your boss talking bad shit about
people, you know, at least when

368
00:21:41.079 --> 00:21:44.960
I talk shit about people, I
talk about it all. I talk about

369
00:21:45.000 --> 00:21:48.160
all of them, you know,
in front of the little sidebar. I

370
00:21:48.160 --> 00:21:49.319
had to tell you, Like me
and my wife were talking about this the

371
00:21:49.359 --> 00:21:53.640
other day, like I I don't
hate anybody, but I really dislike when

372
00:21:53.680 --> 00:21:57.200
people feel they're so insecure they need
to talk crap about, talk shit about

373
00:21:57.240 --> 00:22:00.599
somebody else to make them feel better. I just it's so ugly. It's

374
00:22:00.599 --> 00:22:03.960
so ugly, and it's transparent to
me too, like, you know,

375
00:22:03.559 --> 00:22:06.720
you got your own issues, man, why are you worried about what this

376
00:22:06.799 --> 00:22:10.000
guy's doing. There's so much of
that going on. It's really sad there

377
00:22:10.119 --> 00:22:12.000
is. At least I do it
to people's faces if you can, yea

378
00:22:12.480 --> 00:22:15.599
well, and if they're standing here, I will say it, just just

379
00:22:15.680 --> 00:22:17.599
like if somebody's like, you said
this, and I'm like, yeah I

380
00:22:17.599 --> 00:22:19.799
did, Yeah, here's why.
You know, I'll explain why I said

381
00:22:19.839 --> 00:22:25.079
that. But these guys, man, they were just And then I looked

382
00:22:25.079 --> 00:22:29.799
back to see when the last bonus
was and that station didn't work, Like

383
00:22:29.839 --> 00:22:33.279
iHeart media where a commercial cost this
much, It cost that much on your

384
00:22:33.279 --> 00:22:36.640
station, it costs that much on
my station. All the stations where they

385
00:22:36.720 --> 00:22:41.000
could move things around, and even
though I'm not in sales, my bonuses

386
00:22:41.039 --> 00:22:45.000
were reflected by what they sold,
but they could move it like somebody says,

387
00:22:45.039 --> 00:22:48.920
hey, here's ten grand. Okay, let's put ten cents on corries

388
00:22:49.000 --> 00:22:52.599
and put eight grand over here,
and they would do that, and like

389
00:22:52.079 --> 00:22:55.799
people didn't have. Nobody got a
bonus in the last like six and a

390
00:22:55.799 --> 00:22:59.119
half years. And I was like, are you effing kidding me? Like

391
00:23:00.039 --> 00:23:02.519
this isn't what I signed up for
it, you know. And the work

392
00:23:02.559 --> 00:23:03.680
I was working. I was doing
the morning show, so I was working

393
00:23:03.759 --> 00:23:07.720
from like five to seven at night, you know. And it was just

394
00:23:07.799 --> 00:23:11.000
like it was too much, and
I thought I would throw myself into the

395
00:23:11.000 --> 00:23:11.720
work. And that's why my mom
was like, hey, you're depressed,

396
00:23:11.720 --> 00:23:14.440
and I was like, are you
talking about I don't I'm a man.

397
00:23:14.519 --> 00:23:17.720
I don't get depressed. And I
went and took this a little online test

398
00:23:17.720 --> 00:23:21.160
and it was like depressed and I
was like, oh shit. And so

399
00:23:21.240 --> 00:23:23.400
I was like I'm gonna go get
help for that. And now at this

400
00:23:23.440 --> 00:23:26.880
time, where you're still drinking.
No, okay, you had stopped,

401
00:23:26.880 --> 00:23:30.240
you were yeah, yeah, yeah, it was like no, but I

402
00:23:30.279 --> 00:23:32.440
was right. I was teetering,
sure, you know, And I was

403
00:23:32.519 --> 00:23:34.119
like thinking about it. And Christmas
whul just came, or was just about

404
00:23:34.160 --> 00:23:37.640
to come, and I sat down
with him on my review. It was

405
00:23:37.640 --> 00:23:41.400
like Christmas Eve, and I was
like, look like, I'm depressed.

406
00:23:41.559 --> 00:23:42.960
You know, here's the stuff that's
happening in my life and blah blah blah

407
00:23:42.960 --> 00:23:45.599
blah blah, and I don't know
what to do. And they're like,

408
00:23:45.640 --> 00:23:48.680
oh, goh, Street the stirrupish
guy. And that's when I had like

409
00:23:48.680 --> 00:23:52.000
a panic attack and I couldn't even
get out of the car. I was

410
00:23:52.000 --> 00:23:55.000
really crazy. And that's when I
started to like, well, let me

411
00:23:55.039 --> 00:23:57.839
go back to the old friend.
He makes me feel better, and I

412
00:23:57.880 --> 00:24:00.000
just want to crawl in a hole. And you know, it's really really

413
00:24:00.039 --> 00:24:03.559
weird, and thinking, oh,
I missed my life up and I screwed

414
00:24:03.599 --> 00:24:08.319
everything up. I took eighteen steps
back in my career and I went out

415
00:24:08.359 --> 00:24:11.000
of here. And I reached out
to Mike Thomas, whose guy who hired

416
00:24:11.000 --> 00:24:15.160
me in radio, and think he
was working at CBS Broadcasting then he runs

417
00:24:15.200 --> 00:24:18.319
the whole sports department. Now it's
pretty crazy, but I was like,

418
00:24:18.359 --> 00:24:22.240
man, do you know anybody?
And he sent me some guy in Atlanta.

419
00:24:22.440 --> 00:24:23.480
At that time, I was drinking, so who knows how that went,

420
00:24:23.559 --> 00:24:26.279
you know, like, oh Jesus, but yeah, from there though,

421
00:24:26.319 --> 00:24:30.119
then it went from you know,
hitting the rock bottom and then you

422
00:24:30.160 --> 00:24:32.759
know, being a forty year old
man trying to move back in with your

423
00:24:32.799 --> 00:24:34.200
parents. And my mom hates when
I say that because she's like, oh,

424
00:24:34.240 --> 00:24:36.799
you make it sound like a bad
thing. I'm like, well,

425
00:24:36.839 --> 00:24:38.720
for a forty year old man,
it is, you know, like from

426
00:24:38.759 --> 00:24:42.319
someone who owned his own home,
was a program director, promotions director,

427
00:24:42.559 --> 00:24:45.960
had all this and I'm using air
quotes right now because you can't see me,

428
00:24:47.279 --> 00:24:49.440
like all these things in his life, you know, and then it's

429
00:24:49.440 --> 00:24:52.680
all taken away. The nice car
was taken away, the house was taken

430
00:24:52.720 --> 00:24:56.440
away, you know, like all
that is gone quicker than you realize.

431
00:24:57.160 --> 00:25:03.359
And was it it directly because of
the drinking? Maybe? No, I

432
00:25:03.440 --> 00:25:04.839
don't know, you know, there
was depression in there. I went to

433
00:25:04.920 --> 00:25:07.880
a place in Grand Rapids to get
helpful that I got out, and then

434
00:25:08.400 --> 00:25:11.559
they tell me that I'm suspended for
two weeks of no pay because I scheduled

435
00:25:11.599 --> 00:25:14.400
music when they told me, don't
worry about it, and I scheduled it

436
00:25:14.400 --> 00:25:17.960
out as far as I could,
and it just it just didn't make sense.

437
00:25:17.960 --> 00:25:21.039
And then people later were like,
they just didn't They don't know how

438
00:25:21.039 --> 00:25:22.680
to deal with that, and they
don't want to deal with it, so

439
00:25:22.720 --> 00:25:25.799
they're trying to, you know,
push you out, and they fire me,

440
00:25:25.839 --> 00:25:26.759
and then they say, didn't fire
me, And I have to tell

441
00:25:26.799 --> 00:25:30.440
you this is when and I've talked
to a lot of people. We mentioned

442
00:25:30.440 --> 00:25:33.359
wild Bill, there's a couple others
that worked with us back in the day,

443
00:25:33.480 --> 00:25:36.599
back in the day when it was
good, and it was about the

444
00:25:36.640 --> 00:25:40.680
time that Charlie Sheen was having his
days on TV and we had our own

445
00:25:40.759 --> 00:25:45.960
Charlie Sheen because Corey went on went
online and was just making up these characters

446
00:25:47.000 --> 00:25:52.559
for Dave Deutsch and Douche and Paul
Landecker and uh and so the cops came

447
00:25:52.599 --> 00:25:56.039
to your but but Corey was having
these social medium meltdowns where he was just

448
00:25:56.119 --> 00:26:00.720
being unfiltered and raw about his perspective
because you had felt you've been wronged because

449
00:26:00.759 --> 00:26:03.880
you were getting different conflictions you were
being fired for something that you thought was

450
00:26:03.880 --> 00:26:07.160
cool because you were getting help.
Yeah, and you felt betrayed. No,

451
00:26:07.480 --> 00:26:11.640
absolutely, and so Corey, if
you know anything about Corey, Corey

452
00:26:11.680 --> 00:26:14.160
doesn't take that shit. Corey is
like, this is what this is who

453
00:26:14.160 --> 00:26:18.680
I am. There is nothing fake
about Corey Winfield, good, bad and

454
00:26:18.720 --> 00:26:22.200
different. Corey is going to give
it to you straight and even if that

455
00:26:22.599 --> 00:26:26.079
makes himself look bad. But you
that's why I appreciate you as a friend,

456
00:26:26.119 --> 00:26:29.759
because you're You're gonna give it to
you, tell it like it is.

457
00:26:30.000 --> 00:26:33.960
Yeah, and so, but my
point is is we were watching living

458
00:26:33.079 --> 00:26:38.440
vicariously through you go through all this
stuff, and so much so that you

459
00:26:38.559 --> 00:26:41.960
the police came to Did you have
you ever told a story about the police

460
00:26:41.960 --> 00:26:45.519
come in your house about this?
I don't know. Maybe I just built

461
00:26:45.519 --> 00:26:48.839
you up as a straight shooter.
Are you going to share that or Yeah?

462
00:26:48.920 --> 00:26:52.279
The cost came. I was quite
intoxicated. But but see, the

463
00:26:52.319 --> 00:26:56.680
thing was is the social media attacks
because I had been in managers meetings and

464
00:26:56.720 --> 00:27:00.039
I had seen them and heard them
talk bad about so many different employees.

465
00:27:02.039 --> 00:27:03.880
And when they were talking about about
this guy name Randy, and they were

466
00:27:03.920 --> 00:27:07.119
like, yeah, he's just a
drunk and he needs this and that.

467
00:27:07.200 --> 00:27:08.319
And I'm like thinking to myself,
Oh, they don't know my half,

468
00:27:08.400 --> 00:27:11.319
do they, you know, like
wait till I tell them my story.

469
00:27:11.359 --> 00:27:15.039
But I kept that from they didn't
need to know that. And they but

470
00:27:15.079 --> 00:27:18.119
they would talk about this woman who
worked there, who was a little bit

471
00:27:18.160 --> 00:27:22.400
heavier than other people, and they
were like laughing, like well we just

472
00:27:22.440 --> 00:27:26.000
need to, you know, have
a backdoor and just blurd and someone who

473
00:27:26.000 --> 00:27:30.759
had been nothing but good for that
radio station, absolutely and she but sales

474
00:27:30.880 --> 00:27:33.839
in the community. Oh yeah,
yeah yeah. And they were like pushing

475
00:27:33.920 --> 00:27:37.039
her out and they're like, yeah, well we can't fire. We gotta

476
00:27:37.079 --> 00:27:38.000
get her to quit, you know. And I'm hearing all the stuff in

477
00:27:38.039 --> 00:27:42.079
these meetings. Then their sports guy, they were saying the same shit about

478
00:27:42.119 --> 00:27:45.359
him, and I'm like, well, like that's not cool. He's been

479
00:27:45.400 --> 00:27:48.640
here forever too, you know.
Like it's like they wanted their own regime,

480
00:27:48.880 --> 00:27:51.319
Like they wanted their own people that
they could tell what to do,

481
00:27:51.359 --> 00:27:53.599
because these other people that have been
there for twenty thirty years, you know,

482
00:27:53.680 --> 00:27:59.079
like they couldn't do anything. Like
they already knew what they were doing,

483
00:27:59.079 --> 00:28:02.200
they already had their place in the
community and these guys, these jokesters

484
00:28:02.319 --> 00:28:07.319
that we're just playing radio. We're
trying to pull some straight. I don't

485
00:28:07.319 --> 00:28:10.680
know what they were trying to do. Man and shareholders. Yeah, and

486
00:28:10.680 --> 00:28:11.720
that's what they were. And that's
how the dude even took over. Like

487
00:28:11.799 --> 00:28:15.440
they bought a house somewhere and they
hit oil and they were like, hey,

488
00:28:15.480 --> 00:28:18.599
we can start buying stock, and
you buy so much stock, you

489
00:28:18.720 --> 00:28:21.480
become a shareholder and then you can
be a GM. It wasn't like he

490
00:28:21.519 --> 00:28:25.000
worked his ass off in radio and
it was freaking awesome. And to be

491
00:28:25.079 --> 00:28:26.839
fair, it wasn't exclusive to Betton, Harbor, Saint Joe. That was

492
00:28:26.880 --> 00:28:30.799
happening all over the country because when
you had these conglomerates buying stations and the

493
00:28:30.839 --> 00:28:37.480
marriage between that and the internet,
that was the fallout as you got that

494
00:28:37.559 --> 00:28:40.920
kind of behavior and it just was
what it was. And I think our

495
00:28:40.960 --> 00:28:44.240
first exposure to that was in Fort
Smith, Arkansas, when we had our

496
00:28:44.279 --> 00:28:48.559
supervisors telling us stuff that made no
sense at all, and we were like,

497
00:28:48.640 --> 00:28:52.920
okay, this isn't you know,
we're not being supervised by people who

498
00:28:52.960 --> 00:28:55.880
grew up in this industry. They
have no idea what radio is or what

499
00:28:55.920 --> 00:29:00.119
good radio is. Yeah, well
I've been down here and here and here

500
00:29:00.119 --> 00:29:02.119
here, and they tell you the
list of like like okay, why did

501
00:29:02.160 --> 00:29:04.920
you leave, like because you had
a better opportunity, Like you're just moving

502
00:29:04.960 --> 00:29:08.480
because that's the who would hire you, you know, like and we were

503
00:29:08.519 --> 00:29:12.839
kind of selective with where we went
for the most part. And yeah,

504
00:29:12.920 --> 00:29:15.160
so I don't know, I just
didn't mean to get you offside, but

505
00:29:15.160 --> 00:29:18.599
I just wanted to give that because
that was that was entertaining. You were

506
00:29:18.680 --> 00:29:22.960
the Charlie Sheen of the South Southwest, but for hearing like all the stuff

507
00:29:23.000 --> 00:29:27.119
and just knowing what they're other people, and yeah, yeah I did that

508
00:29:27.119 --> 00:29:30.279
has a little tiger butt in me. And so I just, yeah,

509
00:29:30.319 --> 00:29:33.039
I did it for everybody, man, because I was saying what people wanted

510
00:29:33.079 --> 00:29:37.680
to say, you know, and
I was I didn't care at that point.

511
00:29:37.839 --> 00:29:41.359
And so yeah, the police show
up at my house and they're from

512
00:29:41.359 --> 00:29:45.440
Stevensville and the radio stations to Ben
Harbor. So I had a real problem

513
00:29:45.480 --> 00:29:49.359
with that. But then like they
were saying that I'm not allowed on that

514
00:29:49.400 --> 00:29:52.000
property, and I'm like, well, it's gonna be a Ben Harbor cop

515
00:29:52.039 --> 00:29:55.359
that comes to tell me that man, like, you can't tell me that

516
00:29:55.480 --> 00:29:57.319
here. Well why did they say? Why did they say? Well,

517
00:29:57.319 --> 00:30:00.599
you know there's Facebook post and you
know there was some names being a call

518
00:30:00.640 --> 00:30:04.319
and you know this is slander and
uh and then and you said what names

519
00:30:04.319 --> 00:30:11.559
were they? They said, uh, Paul Dick Sucker and Dave Douche.

520
00:30:11.759 --> 00:30:15.400
That's not their names. Yeah,
that's a real person. I think my

521
00:30:15.440 --> 00:30:18.759
mom was saying that too, like
that's if that's the real name. Then

522
00:30:18.880 --> 00:30:21.759
I'm like, yeah, like if
I if I slandered them, But first

523
00:30:21.759 --> 00:30:26.319
of all, I said they were
assholes and pieces of shit. So you

524
00:30:26.359 --> 00:30:29.400
think that's Stevensville cops right now.
He knocked a lot harder than that.

525
00:30:29.920 --> 00:30:32.640
So I was just like, please
don't ever come back in my house again

526
00:30:32.680 --> 00:30:36.680
with this bye, you know,
like it was just it was stupid,

527
00:30:36.920 --> 00:30:40.200
you know, like they don't have
the jurisdiction to be like police in all

528
00:30:40.200 --> 00:30:41.680
the fucking Michigan, you know,
and it's still weird to me. Something

529
00:30:41.680 --> 00:30:48.000
to bet Harbor. A different municipal
thinking behind that was was somebody knew.

530
00:30:48.000 --> 00:30:51.200
Somebody were like, I'll show him
and I'll scare him with the cops.

531
00:30:51.240 --> 00:30:53.799
Oh oh oh damn, right,
you know, it's like I kind of

532
00:30:53.799 --> 00:30:56.160
know my rights a little bit.
Man. I listened to jay Z songs

533
00:30:56.799 --> 00:31:02.480
he breaks it down, Gonna have
a more for that, Like I got

534
00:31:02.599 --> 00:31:04.640
nine and nine problems and the only
one to see you. Thanks for the

535
00:31:04.680 --> 00:31:07.640
attempt of scaring me or something.
But yeah, and I think I got

536
00:31:07.720 --> 00:31:11.880
right online. It was like,
yeah, a few pigs. I think

537
00:31:11.880 --> 00:31:14.519
it wasn't talking about the cops.
And I mean I was like, if

538
00:31:14.559 --> 00:31:17.359
you like whatever I called them,
I'm sure it was nice. It's probably

539
00:31:18.000 --> 00:31:21.480
Charlie Sheen meltdown as you. Was
that rock bottom for you? Oh?

540
00:31:21.599 --> 00:31:23.640
No, that was just getting in
the cock seat? The cock seat,

541
00:31:23.920 --> 00:31:27.119
I'm sorry, is that a new
word. I'm gonna I'm not gonna google

542
00:31:27.160 --> 00:31:30.359
cock seat because I'm afraid it was
gonna pop up. That's just me getting

543
00:31:30.440 --> 00:31:33.559
by the way, A little side
note, Corey Winfield's huge fan of dictionary

544
00:31:33.640 --> 00:31:37.559
dot com. Yes, I am
huge fan. It's a fun game to

545
00:31:37.559 --> 00:31:40.359
play. See when they say the
words for you, yes, yes,

546
00:31:40.720 --> 00:31:44.119
go on continue? But no,
what so what was rock bottom for you?

547
00:31:44.400 --> 00:31:51.440
Oh? Because it was shortly after
that that you kind of started getting

548
00:31:51.440 --> 00:31:53.160
your ship together. That that was
the starting point. That was just me

549
00:31:53.240 --> 00:31:59.599
getting in the driver's seats. Seat
the driver's seat. That's gonna make a

550
00:31:59.640 --> 00:32:02.640
sure, says, getting the cock
seat. I would give us something to

551
00:32:02.640 --> 00:32:07.039
you for a Christmas rod. I'll
be the first one to buy that stale.

552
00:32:07.480 --> 00:32:10.559
So so yeah. So after that, that's when I started going to

553
00:32:10.559 --> 00:32:16.440
treatment though again because I went previously
in Arkansas, I went to California,

554
00:32:16.119 --> 00:32:19.279
and so this is when I started
going. And this was when I had

555
00:32:19.279 --> 00:32:22.480
to get on Medicaid. And the
funny thing is about them saying they didn't

556
00:32:22.480 --> 00:32:25.519
fire me, like I went to
go to the mental place again that I

557
00:32:25.559 --> 00:32:29.119
went for the depression. And when
I went back there, like you can't

558
00:32:29.119 --> 00:32:30.160
say in this unit, you got
to go to the other unit because you

559
00:32:30.160 --> 00:32:35.680
don't have insurance. And they said
they had fired me like that day before

560
00:32:35.799 --> 00:32:39.119
or something when the insurance was cut
off the month before. So they clearly

561
00:32:39.160 --> 00:32:42.079
fired me, you know. And
so I'm like, whatever, man,

562
00:32:44.440 --> 00:32:46.519
so her I'm on medicaid, you
know, I'm like, what do I

563
00:32:46.640 --> 00:32:49.599
what does this even mean? And
they're like, well, you can't get

564
00:32:49.640 --> 00:32:53.880
treated over here yet, gotta go
over there. And that was interesting.

565
00:32:54.799 --> 00:32:58.920
It did help though. I was
able to go back and when you first

566
00:32:58.920 --> 00:33:02.480
get on Medicaid in Michigan, you
can go back and and list like all

567
00:33:02.480 --> 00:33:06.079
the medical stuff that you had,
and Medicaid will take care of that for

568
00:33:06.119 --> 00:33:08.440
you for like the previous ninety days. And that was a huge help because

569
00:33:08.440 --> 00:33:12.359
my mental institution thing I was supposed
to pay for or I don't want to

570
00:33:12.359 --> 00:33:16.119
call mental institution, but my mental
health therapy counseling place that I went to,

571
00:33:16.680 --> 00:33:19.640
I would I had to pay for. And then so then since I

572
00:33:19.680 --> 00:33:21.720
was on Medicaid, they went back
and they took care of that. And

573
00:33:21.759 --> 00:33:27.079
then you know, not having a
job and just just being defeated mentally,

574
00:33:27.279 --> 00:33:32.920
emotionally, physically from the alcoholics and
deliver just still wasn't even healed. So

575
00:33:32.960 --> 00:33:37.839
I would get like sick as a
dog, you know, and it was

576
00:33:37.880 --> 00:33:40.519
it was rough. But the only
way I could get out of my head

577
00:33:39.039 --> 00:33:44.079
to make this, make this stop
for a minute, was to drink,

578
00:33:44.119 --> 00:33:46.759
which was harming me and just sending
me in reverse. So it was really

579
00:33:46.759 --> 00:33:52.920
hard go to a place and after
a weekend leave and it was just a

580
00:33:52.960 --> 00:33:58.480
struggle. I didn't want to be
there. I was ashamed that I was

581
00:33:58.519 --> 00:34:00.640
an alcoholic, right you know.
That's why today I say I'm a person

582
00:34:00.720 --> 00:34:02.519
in recovery. You know, if
I go to an AA meeting, I'm

583
00:34:02.519 --> 00:34:07.400
like, I'm a person in recovery
and so and that hurts somebody's feelings.

584
00:34:07.480 --> 00:34:09.320
That's what they need to talk to
their therapists about, Like why is what

585
00:34:09.519 --> 00:34:12.960
this guy is saying hurting your feelings? You know, you should probably worry

586
00:34:13.000 --> 00:34:16.320
about what's going on. So you
got to look at it different and many

587
00:34:16.360 --> 00:34:22.079
many times going through it over and
stop start horrible relationships, like just stupid

588
00:34:22.119 --> 00:34:25.199
stuff, stupid decisions that everybody told
me that's not good, don't do it,

589
00:34:25.280 --> 00:34:29.559
And I would do it anyway because
I'm different. That's what we all

590
00:34:29.559 --> 00:34:31.320
think. Do Oh no, I'm
different. I'm gonna figure this out.

591
00:34:31.360 --> 00:34:35.239
And then still thinking like i'd have
like three months, I'm like, yeah,

592
00:34:35.239 --> 00:34:37.519
you know, I should reward myself. You know what, the football

593
00:34:37.559 --> 00:34:39.079
games on this weekend. I haven't
drink it three months. This time,

594
00:34:39.119 --> 00:34:43.559
I'm just gonna just I swear I'm
just gonna do it Friday and Saturday.

595
00:34:44.360 --> 00:34:46.599
And then Saturday I'm like, hmm, I should probably just go get a

596
00:34:46.639 --> 00:34:49.880
little more because I don't have enough
for today and already said I could drink

597
00:34:49.920 --> 00:34:52.159
Friday and Saturday, so I buy
extras. So then Sunday I woke up,

598
00:34:52.199 --> 00:34:54.320
well, I gotta finish this off. Next I know, it's Thursday

599
00:34:54.360 --> 00:34:58.840
and I lost my job again.
I'm like Jesus, And it was jobs

600
00:34:58.840 --> 00:35:00.599
that I didn't really want, and
I was try go back to school,

601
00:35:00.679 --> 00:35:02.559
be a drug therapist, drug counselor. I didn't know, but I didn't

602
00:35:02.599 --> 00:35:06.239
really want to do that either.
And I didn't really want to get back

603
00:35:06.280 --> 00:35:10.519
in radio. So I was like, what do I do? And Lord

604
00:35:12.039 --> 00:35:15.800
he did it for me. He
think. Thankfully I didn't kill anybody,

605
00:35:15.840 --> 00:35:17.800
but I don't remember even driving.
That's the scary part of it. And

606
00:35:17.880 --> 00:35:22.599
the whole time I was in jail
because I just remember being in my car

607
00:35:22.639 --> 00:35:24.800
and some dude beating out my window
saying, hey man, you almost killed

608
00:35:24.800 --> 00:35:28.679
somebody. And I'm like, dude, I'm just sitting in my car in

609
00:35:28.719 --> 00:35:30.159
my apartment complex, in my parking
spot. I'm like, you didn't even

610
00:35:30.199 --> 00:35:34.159
know you were driving? No,
And I'm in my pajama pants and T

611
00:35:34.320 --> 00:35:36.960
shirt and he's like, yeah,
he almost killed somebody. I was like,

612
00:35:37.039 --> 00:35:37.480
dude, you're crazy. And I
get out and he's like, you're

613
00:35:37.559 --> 00:35:40.159
drunk, and I'm like, yeah, who cares. He's like, you

614
00:35:40.199 --> 00:35:43.639
almost killed him. I'm like stop
saying that, Like what are you talking

615
00:35:43.639 --> 00:35:45.280
about? Bro? And he's like, I'm gonna call the cops. I

616
00:35:45.320 --> 00:35:49.440
was like, call them, I'll
wait right here, and so I did.

617
00:35:49.519 --> 00:35:51.280
And the cop gets there and he's
like, well, he said you're

618
00:35:51.360 --> 00:35:52.960
driving, and I was like,
well I wasn't. He's like, well,

619
00:35:52.960 --> 00:35:54.960
who was driving? I was like, I have no idea. Man.

620
00:35:55.320 --> 00:35:58.679
It was like maybe it's maybe it's
the girl that was in the passenger

621
00:35:58.719 --> 00:36:00.519
seat, and maybe I was so
drunk that you didn't even realize you were

622
00:36:00.599 --> 00:36:07.079
driving. Don't remember one bit of
a wow. And so the cops looking

623
00:36:07.079 --> 00:36:08.320
at me, and he had this
like a real weird looking at his face,

624
00:36:08.360 --> 00:36:09.920
and he just like he didn't know
what to do it. He had

625
00:36:09.920 --> 00:36:14.360
been to my house many times or
my apartment for wellness checks because my mom

626
00:36:14.440 --> 00:36:15.719
was like, you're not supposed to
be drinking and your liver could seize up,

627
00:36:15.719 --> 00:36:19.719
and so she'd call him. The
one time I was so drunk and

628
00:36:19.760 --> 00:36:22.800
I told the cop I'd been drinking. He came in and he told my

629
00:36:22.800 --> 00:36:27.840
mom he wasn't even drinking. Like
that's how well I could hide it,

630
00:36:27.840 --> 00:36:32.599
which is scary really, And so
the cops looking at me and he's got

631
00:36:32.639 --> 00:36:35.639
this look in his face, and
I'm like, well, you can't arrest

632
00:36:35.679 --> 00:36:37.880
me, you can't take me to
jail. That's when he whipped up the

633
00:36:37.880 --> 00:36:39.639
cuss and took me to jail.
And I was in there for five days,

634
00:36:39.760 --> 00:36:43.440
and I'm the whole time i'm in
there, I'm just like this is

635
00:36:43.480 --> 00:36:45.480
bullshit. Like they didn't breathalyze me, they didn't fingerprint me to like day

636
00:36:45.519 --> 00:36:50.639
three, Like what are they even
holding everybody was obvious to everybody except you

637
00:36:50.679 --> 00:36:54.920
that you were drunk, though obviously
yeah they do. Well. I think

638
00:36:54.920 --> 00:37:00.840
the cop knew I was drunk at
that point, but like legally I don't

639
00:37:00.840 --> 00:37:01.599
know, like they would have had
to breath lights me. So I'm just

640
00:37:01.679 --> 00:37:05.000
in there like man, they're setting
me up and blah blah blah. And

641
00:37:05.039 --> 00:37:07.400
then I was talking to my mom
when she finally was like, all right,

642
00:37:07.400 --> 00:37:09.360
I'll finally come get you out.
You know, I was like,

643
00:37:09.400 --> 00:37:12.880
I didn't have my wallet on me, didn't have my phone, didn't have

644
00:37:12.920 --> 00:37:14.960
my vape, I didn't have anything. There was no reason for me to

645
00:37:15.000 --> 00:37:16.880
be in that car. And that's
what it just didn't none. None of

646
00:37:16.920 --> 00:37:19.880
it made sense. So I'm just
like trying to figure it out. And

647
00:37:19.880 --> 00:37:21.400
then I was talking to my mom
from jail. I'm like, you come

648
00:37:21.400 --> 00:37:23.199
on her. What I said it
just like that too. I was like,

649
00:37:23.280 --> 00:37:25.800
you come on to wood, but
get your way and see your ma.

650
00:37:27.639 --> 00:37:30.960
I didn't say it like that,
but so anyway, she's like,

651
00:37:30.159 --> 00:37:32.000
what did you do to your car? Because she had to go get my

652
00:37:32.039 --> 00:37:35.840
wallet and stuff. And I was
like, what are you talking about.

653
00:37:35.840 --> 00:37:37.199
She's like, the headlights bashed out, and I was like, let's just

654
00:37:37.239 --> 00:37:42.079
stop talking because we're on a gel
phone, so let's just we'll talk about

655
00:37:42.079 --> 00:37:45.639
this later, because I was thinking
that they went over and bashed my headlight

656
00:37:45.719 --> 00:37:51.599
out because they're they're setting me up
brow And I was arrained while I was

657
00:37:51.639 --> 00:37:52.760
in there, and the judge was
like her, we'll have a court date

658
00:37:52.800 --> 00:37:58.320
whatever. Don't drink, don't do
drugs, blah blah blah. And so

659
00:37:58.360 --> 00:38:00.719
when I got out went home,
there's a half gallon sit on the counter,

660
00:38:01.880 --> 00:38:06.039
unopened. Like that's why. I'm
like, none of us made sense.

661
00:38:06.039 --> 00:38:09.119
So of course I started drinking.
And I remember seeing the Brady bunch

662
00:38:09.159 --> 00:38:12.519
of my house and they had always
asked me. When I would go to

663
00:38:12.559 --> 00:38:15.880
the hospital, they'd say, hey, man, do you hallucinate? You

664
00:38:15.920 --> 00:38:17.239
know? Or they wouldn't really say
it like that, but there's like any

665
00:38:17.280 --> 00:38:20.360
hallucinations. And I'm like, how
would I know, you know, like

666
00:38:21.199 --> 00:38:22.400
like you would know trust me?
And so the Brady bunch in my house,

667
00:38:22.440 --> 00:38:24.159
you know, and I'm like,
what this is? This is what

668
00:38:24.199 --> 00:38:29.559
they're talking about. Next, I
know, I wake up text from my

669
00:38:29.599 --> 00:38:31.239
mom when you pay your rent?
Told her I'm paying it Monday. She

670
00:38:31.280 --> 00:38:36.519
said it's Wednesday. That's why I
kind of looked around some bottles on the

671
00:38:36.519 --> 00:38:42.960
ground hole in the wall from where
I had stumbled into the door apparently and

672
00:38:43.039 --> 00:38:45.199
sent the handle of the door through
the dry wall. And I go to

673
00:38:45.199 --> 00:38:47.480
the kitchen. There's like this huge
mess that I was trying to make some

674
00:38:47.760 --> 00:38:52.760
cream, cheese something I don't even
know. Glad it didn't turn the oven

675
00:38:52.840 --> 00:38:55.920
on. And that's when it hit
me, like I just lost four days,

676
00:38:57.000 --> 00:39:00.960
dude. I don't remember anything for
four days, and I don't know

677
00:39:00.000 --> 00:39:06.800
how I got these bottles. That's
when it hit me that I probably was

678
00:39:06.920 --> 00:39:09.679
driving. And I doubt the Buchanan
police are really trying this hard to set

679
00:39:09.679 --> 00:39:14.199
me up, and that's when it
all came like, holy shit, I'm

680
00:39:14.199 --> 00:39:17.199
glad I didn't kill anybody. Yeah, this could have been so much work.

681
00:39:17.400 --> 00:39:22.000
You know, this could have been
just horrible, and I'm thankful for

682
00:39:22.079 --> 00:39:28.000
God for putting me in that situation
and not killing anybody. And so I'm

683
00:39:28.039 --> 00:39:30.639
just like, wow, So I
drove a car. Don't remember, you

684
00:39:30.679 --> 00:39:32.800
know, like these four days that
are just gone, I don't remember anything

685
00:39:32.880 --> 00:39:37.360
from them. And like I said, that's that was the wake up call

686
00:39:38.440 --> 00:39:42.079
I would imagine. Yeah, you
know, I went to the meet my

687
00:39:42.159 --> 00:39:44.119
lawyer in court again. They're like, oh, you're gonna have to go

688
00:39:44.119 --> 00:39:47.639
back to jail because when I did
wake up my mom, she called the

689
00:39:47.679 --> 00:39:50.760
ambulance or something the police heard and
they're like, oh, mister Windfield,

690
00:39:50.800 --> 00:39:52.159
not supposed to be drinking. Let's
go over. And I think I pu

691
00:39:52.320 --> 00:39:57.760
like a point four or five something
at that that time. But the John

692
00:39:57.760 --> 00:40:00.039
I knew they're doing and thrown me
back into jail again. So they it

693
00:40:00.199 --> 00:40:04.320
put me in for another week.
You blew a four or five? Yeah,

694
00:40:04.639 --> 00:40:07.679
holy tol, It's it's been way
higher. And one time my mom

695
00:40:07.760 --> 00:40:12.199
was telling my stepdad what it was. It was like point five something eight

696
00:40:12.320 --> 00:40:15.800
or something, and my stepdad I
was like, no, I think you're

697
00:40:15.800 --> 00:40:17.559
getting that wrong. I think he
meant point zero five and moms like no,

698
00:40:17.719 --> 00:40:20.719
point five. My step dad I
was like, no, you'd be

699
00:40:20.840 --> 00:40:23.039
dead. I was like no,
this, I've I heard them, you

700
00:40:23.079 --> 00:40:25.840
know. And so then there was
another time in the hospital where they had

701
00:40:25.840 --> 00:40:29.559
said something it was like higher than
that, and my step dad I was

702
00:40:29.599 --> 00:40:32.639
like, my mom, I just
remember kind of coming to and my mom

703
00:40:32.679 --> 00:40:35.360
was like, see, I told
you, Mike, I told you,

704
00:40:35.360 --> 00:40:37.719
And he just had this like this
like this look in his face, like

705
00:40:37.719 --> 00:40:40.920
holy cow, like how do you
get that drunk? Like that's not even

706
00:40:40.960 --> 00:40:45.079
a real number. I can't even
believe that's that was that high. Like

707
00:40:45.119 --> 00:40:47.119
the judge was like everybody in this
courtroom, if they drank as much as

708
00:40:47.119 --> 00:40:52.800
you did you that day, they
would be dead. And I'm like I

709
00:40:52.840 --> 00:40:55.239
know like this, I want help, you know, like I've tried many

710
00:40:55.280 --> 00:40:58.119
times, and at that time I
didn't know how many times have been a

711
00:40:58.159 --> 00:41:00.760
treatment. So I was just like
yeah, man, like so go to

712
00:41:00.840 --> 00:41:02.800
jail. And then I met with
my lawyer as I was going to get

713
00:41:02.800 --> 00:41:06.800
sentenced or whatever later for it,
which is you know, probation or whatever,

714
00:41:06.840 --> 00:41:09.480
and I was gonna try to find
it. At first, I was

715
00:41:09.480 --> 00:41:13.800
like, nah, man, I
need I need broath lad and breath Lisban.

716
00:41:13.880 --> 00:41:15.639
He's like, well, you kind
of screwed up when the judge told

717
00:41:15.639 --> 00:41:17.360
you not to drink and you did
after that. So I'm like, yeah,

718
00:41:17.360 --> 00:41:21.320
but how can they impress me on
that when they can't even get me

719
00:41:21.360 --> 00:41:22.320
on the first charge? And it's
like it doesn't matter, it doesn't work

720
00:41:22.360 --> 00:41:25.039
that way. It's like you're getting
charged with all of it, and how

721
00:41:25.079 --> 00:41:29.519
about you just do this probation for
a year. And when's the last time

722
00:41:29.519 --> 00:41:32.760
you've been sober for a year?
I was I was probably twelve. He

723
00:41:32.840 --> 00:41:36.800
just had this disbelief like look on
his face, like I can't believe that,

724
00:41:37.119 --> 00:41:37.880
which I'm like, dude, you
must hear this all the time.

725
00:41:38.599 --> 00:41:42.360
He's like, you know, this
might save your life because for a year

726
00:41:42.400 --> 00:41:45.880
you won't be able to drink and
can get your year coin. You said,

727
00:41:45.920 --> 00:41:46.760
you've been at this for a while, you know this, this might

728
00:41:46.800 --> 00:41:50.239
be what you need. This,
this might just save your life. And

729
00:41:50.280 --> 00:41:54.000
that dude was absolutely right. It
did and it has. And so from

730
00:41:54.000 --> 00:41:58.880
moving forward from that, I was
just like all right, well what am

731
00:41:58.880 --> 00:42:01.400
I going to do different this time? And just accepting the fact that I

732
00:42:01.400 --> 00:42:05.719
can never drink again. I can
never smoke pot again because I tried that

733
00:42:05.800 --> 00:42:07.719
and it leads me right back to
drinking, you know. So like I

734
00:42:07.760 --> 00:42:10.039
think you'll be okay, Yeah,
I'm just fine. When you're younger,

735
00:42:10.159 --> 00:42:14.000
you smoke it. You can get
by without it, trust me. When

736
00:42:14.000 --> 00:42:16.679
nothing against people that do. I
just can't, you know. And my

737
00:42:16.679 --> 00:42:20.079
my thinking on that goes, if
you just smoke pot your whole life and

738
00:42:20.079 --> 00:42:23.159
you just won't pot, Okay,
you're probably okay, you should probably not

739
00:42:23.199 --> 00:42:28.360
smoke pot and figure out why you're
smoking pot. Anything like you you use

740
00:42:28.400 --> 00:42:30.599
a lot of it is not good. Yeah, you know, whatever the

741
00:42:30.639 --> 00:42:32.800
case may be. But that's fine. But I think once you move on

742
00:42:32.880 --> 00:42:39.079
to bigger and better things and once
that substance takes control of your brain's like,

743
00:42:39.119 --> 00:42:42.480
that's my shit, right, I
gotta have it. I gotta have

744
00:42:42.559 --> 00:42:44.639
it. And you're trying to go
back to pot and guess what your brains

745
00:42:44.679 --> 00:42:51.239
like. M It's like, hey, okay, I'll do analogies. So

746
00:42:51.639 --> 00:42:53.039
you get this great turtle Sunday,
right, and you're like, that's the

747
00:42:53.079 --> 00:42:57.320
best sun I've ever had. Like, well, come over next weekend.

748
00:42:57.360 --> 00:43:00.159
Next weekend, I just give you
a twinkie, Like, fuck that twinkie.

749
00:43:00.599 --> 00:43:05.760
I want that turtle Sunday with the
fudge and caramel and the nuts and

750
00:43:05.800 --> 00:43:07.719
the whipped cream. I want that. It's gonna be a twinkie. It's

751
00:43:07.719 --> 00:43:10.840
stupid, you know. And come
back the next weekend. I give you,

752
00:43:10.840 --> 00:43:13.679
you know, something a little better
than the twinkie. But you're like,

753
00:43:13.719 --> 00:43:15.880
ask, don't want that, But
your brain remembers that because it's so

754
00:43:16.000 --> 00:43:19.360
good to you, you know.
And so that's my thinking on that.

755
00:43:19.559 --> 00:43:21.840
Of course, I'm not a doctor
or anything. I want to ask you

756
00:43:21.880 --> 00:43:25.119
a question because earlier you said that
that you could you know, you would

757
00:43:25.199 --> 00:43:28.960
drink, and you could, you
couldn't. People couldn't tell that you were

758
00:43:29.039 --> 00:43:31.840
drunk, did you, like I, I never thought you were drunk in

759
00:43:32.280 --> 00:43:35.519
when we were in anarcas. Did
you ever come to work dron No?

760
00:43:35.880 --> 00:43:38.239
Okay, unless I was drunk from
the day before. But I mean if

761
00:43:38.239 --> 00:43:42.800
they'd pull me over sometimes I who
knows, you know, But no,

762
00:43:42.880 --> 00:43:45.599
I never never drank on the air. There that's good. But anyway,

763
00:43:45.639 --> 00:43:49.079
I mean after Betton Harbor, when
I made that pact with myself that I

764
00:43:49.079 --> 00:43:51.840
wouldn't drink on the air an ever
again, right, I never did,

765
00:43:52.280 --> 00:43:53.440
like I gotta be out of Remote's
people like, hey, here's a shot.

766
00:43:53.480 --> 00:43:58.480
I'm like, nope. What's interesting
because we both have a mutual friend

767
00:43:58.519 --> 00:44:04.079
that's kind of facing some demons right
now, and he was recently arrested for

768
00:44:04.119 --> 00:44:08.599
stealing beer, ironically enough, and
I had reached out to you because he

769
00:44:08.719 --> 00:44:13.039
reached out to me wanting me to
bail him on a jail, and we

770
00:44:13.119 --> 00:44:15.840
had a conversation about it. I
mean, there's really no reason to mention

771
00:44:15.920 --> 00:44:19.599
his name, but the fact remains
is I didn't know what to do.

772
00:44:19.679 --> 00:44:21.519
I wanted to help him out,
but you said, hey, look,

773
00:44:21.559 --> 00:44:23.559
this ends one of three ways.
Either they end up dad, or they're

774
00:44:23.559 --> 00:44:29.000
in jail, or they seek help
and they get help. And I wasn't

775
00:44:29.039 --> 00:44:30.800
able to do too. But I
was able to, as hard as it

776
00:44:30.880 --> 00:44:35.400
was for me, just to not
bail him out because he had already been

777
00:44:35.599 --> 00:44:37.039
letting it affect his work. He
was so he was so far. It

778
00:44:37.079 --> 00:44:40.480
seems like because he was he was, he was letting it affect his job

779
00:44:40.480 --> 00:44:45.000
because he would just not show up
for gigs that he was being paid for,

780
00:44:45.880 --> 00:44:49.559
and so he was already a letting
it affect his job. He was

781
00:44:49.599 --> 00:44:52.480
just getting drunk all the time.
And there's a lot of things going on

782
00:44:52.480 --> 00:44:58.000
in his life. But man,
he's I just I asked your listener to

783
00:44:58.039 --> 00:45:00.039
say a prayer for this guy,
because I hope he comes out on the

784
00:45:00.000 --> 00:45:01.360
the other side. He's a good
dude. He just Yeah, it's it's

785
00:45:01.360 --> 00:45:06.280
a disease. It will just rip
you apart. It's it takes over the

786
00:45:07.039 --> 00:45:10.199
front part of the brain. And
for most people, you know, you

787
00:45:10.199 --> 00:45:14.719
can make decisions and you can like
walk yourself through it. And if you're

788
00:45:14.760 --> 00:45:17.480
like, hey, if I eat
this big old turtle Sunday, I'm gonna

789
00:45:17.519 --> 00:45:20.280
have. It's gonna make me gain
weight, you know, and you can

790
00:45:20.320 --> 00:45:22.760
go is it worth it? And
well, I did run twenty miles a

791
00:45:22.840 --> 00:45:24.599
day, or I'm biked from Traverse
City to Sutton's Bay. You know,

792
00:45:24.719 --> 00:45:28.519
I can well believe me. As
much as I ride my bike, I

793
00:45:28.559 --> 00:45:31.119
couldn't be on a substance that I
just there's too much exercise involved. And

794
00:45:31.199 --> 00:45:35.039
if I had those substances, I'd
be like, oh fuck it, I'm

795
00:45:35.079 --> 00:45:37.960
not doing that day. But I
just can't I like riding my bike too

796
00:45:37.039 --> 00:45:40.440
much. So maybe riding your bike
is your your thing, but that's me,

797
00:45:40.760 --> 00:45:44.760
that's how I do. But with
everybody else that you know has the

798
00:45:45.159 --> 00:45:50.159
substance use disorder, and then that's
that's where it goes to, where telling

799
00:45:50.960 --> 00:45:53.320
telling him or even telling me back
in the day, you know, you

800
00:45:53.360 --> 00:45:57.039
can never drink again. It's like
saying round, you can never ride your

801
00:45:57.039 --> 00:46:00.800
bike again. Yeah, I don't. I would suck. How I'm gonna

802
00:46:00.800 --> 00:46:02.320
sneak out. You're already thinking like, well, I'll just go on the

803
00:46:02.320 --> 00:46:05.719
weekend when you're not around them,
you know, like that, But that's

804
00:46:05.800 --> 00:46:08.079
that's the same thing, because you
can't fathom going without that, you know,

805
00:46:08.199 --> 00:46:13.280
like, no, you can't do
that. So it's it's a it's

806
00:46:13.320 --> 00:46:15.719
a tricky, it's a tough,
it's a sneaky, it's a son of

807
00:46:15.719 --> 00:46:21.079
a bitch disease. Really a lot
of justification in your own mind, right,

808
00:46:21.159 --> 00:46:22.360
Oh god, yeah, is that
what you face? Oh? Yeah,

809
00:46:22.400 --> 00:46:24.639
that and just the I can do
what I want. I can,

810
00:46:24.719 --> 00:46:28.760
you know, and you know,
being in sober living and I didn't want

811
00:46:28.760 --> 00:46:31.400
to go to Silver Living. That's
why I went because I think I heard

812
00:46:31.440 --> 00:46:36.880
somebody saying something about you know,
want versus need, and I was like,

813
00:46:36.880 --> 00:46:38.320
well, what do I want?
I want to go live somewhere again,

814
00:46:38.360 --> 00:46:40.440
I want to go do this.
I want to be on my own.

815
00:46:40.639 --> 00:46:45.519
What do I need? I probably
need to learn how to live sober,

816
00:46:46.239 --> 00:46:50.480
you know. And if I would
have just went back to an apartment

817
00:46:50.599 --> 00:46:53.519
or back to my mom's house and
just been in the same situation, kicking

818
00:46:53.559 --> 00:46:58.119
the same tires, the same results
are gonna happen. And so that's why

819
00:46:58.159 --> 00:47:00.199
I'm like, I'm gonna stay up
here. I'm gonna go to sober living.

820
00:47:00.199 --> 00:47:02.360
I don't want to live with eighteen
different dudes, but that's what I

821
00:47:02.360 --> 00:47:05.119
gotta do. That's what I gotta
do. And then I met some really

822
00:47:05.159 --> 00:47:07.440
good guys in there, and so
I never really was alone. You know.

823
00:47:07.519 --> 00:47:09.920
I would go to work, I
would come home, and I started,

824
00:47:10.000 --> 00:47:15.960
you know, doing the podcast,
and started going back to school,

825
00:47:15.119 --> 00:47:20.119
and I don't know, started you
know, putting the nonprofit together. And

826
00:47:20.199 --> 00:47:23.760
I was moving my life forward.
And I've tried AA. That was the

827
00:47:24.039 --> 00:47:28.039
kind of main way that I went. But I started kind of reaching out

828
00:47:28.079 --> 00:47:31.679
to different, different kind of groups
and started realizing what worked for me.

829
00:47:31.840 --> 00:47:37.480
In AA, I love going to
meetings. Those are my people. But

830
00:47:37.559 --> 00:47:42.360
working those steps, I found myself
rewinding everything, going back to the past,

831
00:47:43.440 --> 00:47:45.199
and there's nothing back in the past
for me. Man. You know,

832
00:47:45.239 --> 00:47:49.360
like we can tell some funny stories
about going Charlie Sheen on people,

833
00:47:49.360 --> 00:47:52.079
but but then that's fun. But
like like for me to see here and

834
00:47:52.119 --> 00:47:55.199
go, oh, I wish I
was in radio, I really ruined my

835
00:47:55.320 --> 00:48:00.480
career. I'm exactly where I'm supposed
to be. And when I was able

836
00:48:00.519 --> 00:48:02.280
to accept that and be good with
that and then understand that I can never

837
00:48:02.960 --> 00:48:07.519
drink, never smoke pot, I
can never do drugs again and be cool

838
00:48:07.519 --> 00:48:10.280
with it, and then once you
start building a life, it becomes easier

839
00:48:10.320 --> 00:48:14.599
to become cool with it because you
realize you've never lived before. You know,

840
00:48:14.639 --> 00:48:16.239
I went twenty years is just a
stupid drunk, you know, like

841
00:48:17.119 --> 00:48:21.000
I don't have to go back and
relive that. You know through some of

842
00:48:21.039 --> 00:48:22.440
the steps, you know that they
do. And I was telling this guy

843
00:48:22.559 --> 00:48:28.639
Tom, I love Tom Charlotte voy
A, and he was like, no,

844
00:48:28.760 --> 00:48:30.960
you are working the steps. I
was like what He's like, You're

845
00:48:30.960 --> 00:48:32.559
doing this, this, this,
this, this, You're working one even

846
00:48:32.559 --> 00:48:35.239
know it. That's what he said, and I was like, all right,

847
00:48:35.280 --> 00:48:37.320
Tom, if that makes you feel
better, buddy, I was like,

848
00:48:37.360 --> 00:48:38.360
but I'm just saying, I don't
sponsored down to do that, you

849
00:48:38.400 --> 00:48:40.960
know, recovery coach, and you
know, they kind of point me in

850
00:48:42.000 --> 00:48:49.280
the right direction. And so it
just became my life. And I think

851
00:48:49.320 --> 00:48:52.039
that's the difference between well, I
don't drink anymore, I'm sober, versus

852
00:48:52.519 --> 00:48:59.440
I'm living in recovery, you know, because it's everything. It's it's it's

853
00:48:59.519 --> 00:49:01.840
everything, you know. It's I
tell the story about the jelly jar,

854
00:49:02.039 --> 00:49:06.159
which people in the treatment center's love, and I would tell the jelly jar

855
00:49:06.320 --> 00:49:12.039
story. I was making myself peanut
and jelly sandwich. I was at home.

856
00:49:12.159 --> 00:49:15.360
I think I've told the story on
the podcast before, and I was

857
00:49:15.400 --> 00:49:17.320
out on my sugar free jelly.
So I reached from my wife's I grab

858
00:49:17.400 --> 00:49:22.400
it and fight it off of the
off of the door on the refrigerator.

859
00:49:22.400 --> 00:49:24.280
I'm like, damn, there's jelly
on the bottom of it, all on

860
00:49:24.360 --> 00:49:29.840
the side of the door. And
I set it on a paper towel and

861
00:49:29.840 --> 00:49:31.199
I make my sandwich and I put
the camp back on it, and I

862
00:49:31.320 --> 00:49:37.760
go to put it back in that
moment, I realized, like, I

863
00:49:37.840 --> 00:49:40.639
don't like a messy fridge. Why
the why would I just put that back?

864
00:49:42.199 --> 00:49:45.360
I clearly see the problem. Did
I make it? No? My

865
00:49:45.480 --> 00:49:49.000
wife did? Who I love,
who bust her ass for our family?

866
00:49:50.519 --> 00:49:53.400
What Am I just gonna put it
back and tell her clear jelly jar off?

867
00:49:54.199 --> 00:49:58.840
No. In that moment, I
decided if that and these are like

868
00:49:58.880 --> 00:50:01.719
the small things in life round that
people can catch themselves in and make that

869
00:50:01.840 --> 00:50:06.599
right decision. And so I was
like, hold on now, took it

870
00:50:06.639 --> 00:50:09.119
over the sink, washed it off, wiped it off, wiped the fridge

871
00:50:09.159 --> 00:50:12.440
off, took me thirty seconds to
put it back, close the door.

872
00:50:14.119 --> 00:50:15.639
And then the old me too would
have been like, yeah, I cleaned

873
00:50:15.679 --> 00:50:19.760
the jelly jar off, but didn't
it. And I told that story later

874
00:50:19.880 --> 00:50:22.519
at a meeting that I was talking
at a treatment center and I told that,

875
00:50:22.559 --> 00:50:24.639
and my wife worked for the same
treatment center, and she came in

876
00:50:24.800 --> 00:50:28.000
then a couple days later and they're
like, oh, the jelly jar.

877
00:50:28.159 --> 00:50:30.800
She's like, what it's like,
Oh, Corey told the jelly jar story.

878
00:50:30.840 --> 00:50:34.079
She had no idea, no clue
what they were talking about. They're

879
00:50:34.119 --> 00:50:36.360
like, well, ask Corey,
and she gets She's like so I'm supposed

880
00:50:36.360 --> 00:50:38.079
to ask you about some jelly jar, and I'm like, oh, yeah,

881
00:50:38.320 --> 00:50:40.119
see, I was telling them,
you know, about being in that

882
00:50:40.280 --> 00:50:45.159
those moments when you can catch yourself
doing the right thing, you know,

883
00:50:45.239 --> 00:50:46.920
being part of the solution or being
part of the problem. And then those

884
00:50:47.039 --> 00:50:51.199
little moments it could be just as
little as cleaning up a little jelly jar,

885
00:50:51.280 --> 00:50:52.800
I could be picking up a napkin. You know, you can be

886
00:50:52.880 --> 00:50:54.719
part of the problem, part of
the solution, you know, and if

887
00:50:54.760 --> 00:50:57.960
you start living your life that way, Now do I do it ten out

888
00:50:58.000 --> 00:51:02.360
of ten times? No? But
I'm trying to be more aware, trying

889
00:51:02.400 --> 00:51:07.880
to you know, be more in
the moment to realize those things and just

890
00:51:08.079 --> 00:51:10.920
that kind of thinking and that kind
of stuff I would not do before,

891
00:51:12.400 --> 00:51:14.960
you know. So you got a
fantastic when you much like me. You

892
00:51:15.079 --> 00:51:17.519
definitely married up. Oh yeah,
right, yeah, you gotta know,

893
00:51:17.679 --> 00:51:21.639
you bet they pull you up,
And so I would just making made me

894
00:51:21.719 --> 00:51:22.639
think, it's like, for all, for that thing, there's probably ten

895
00:51:22.719 --> 00:51:27.079
things that she cleans up after you
who doesn't even mention. So it's like,

896
00:51:27.360 --> 00:51:30.679
Okay, I'll clean up the jelly, no problem. But speaking a

897
00:51:30.719 --> 00:51:31.840
lot of ones, I want to
ask you this because I actually want to

898
00:51:31.840 --> 00:51:35.440
ask you a couple of questions because
hopefully people are listening to this, not

899
00:51:35.599 --> 00:51:37.920
just people who are, you know, having an issue, but loved ones.

900
00:51:38.360 --> 00:51:44.480
How does a loved one who is
feeling helpless help someone who isn't ready

901
00:51:44.519 --> 00:51:46.760
to be helped yet? How does
that work? What do they what can

902
00:51:46.840 --> 00:51:50.360
they do? Because they can't give
up on them because it's not them.

903
00:51:50.639 --> 00:51:53.559
Funny that you bring that up,
bron. It's a little close to home,

904
00:51:54.199 --> 00:51:57.760
but it's perfect. Yeah, And
just like myself, people think,

905
00:51:57.800 --> 00:52:00.159
oh cool, you help people all
the time. Sure, sometimes when they

906
00:52:00.199 --> 00:52:02.840
want to be helped. But if
the person does not want to be helped,

907
00:52:05.280 --> 00:52:08.000
it's tough. He's gotta sit on
the sidelines. And they say,

908
00:52:08.079 --> 00:52:12.559
what comes around goes around, And
I see it, see it happening in

909
00:52:12.639 --> 00:52:15.920
my life today. Man, there's
there's somebody love care about very very much.

910
00:52:15.000 --> 00:52:22.400
But persons like nas I and you
just gotta sit back. You know,

911
00:52:24.079 --> 00:52:27.960
if the person comes to me and
wants some help, I would do

912
00:52:28.079 --> 00:52:30.519
it, but they're you know,
in denial from what I can see and

913
00:52:30.639 --> 00:52:36.039
can tell, and no problem,
nothing to see here, but yet and

914
00:52:36.159 --> 00:52:38.400
this is what must have been like
for my mom and everybody else. It

915
00:52:38.480 --> 00:52:40.639
was close to me. You just
you see this happen and you're like,

916
00:52:40.719 --> 00:52:45.039
this is a ticking time bomb,
like this is going to explode. This

917
00:52:45.159 --> 00:52:49.000
is not going to end well,
and it gets just as bad as you

918
00:52:49.039 --> 00:52:52.639
wanted to get. You know,
So when the person does reach out for

919
00:52:52.719 --> 00:52:54.239
help and wants to say, I
have a problem, I don't want to

920
00:52:54.360 --> 00:52:58.800
do this, I don't want to
live this way anymore. I'll be there,

921
00:52:59.320 --> 00:53:01.599
but from me to start judging them
or you know, being on top

922
00:53:01.639 --> 00:53:05.159
of it, because you know,
when I was around that age, you

923
00:53:05.199 --> 00:53:10.159
couldn't tell me shit anyway, And
so you just pretty much have to wait

924
00:53:10.280 --> 00:53:14.519
till that person's ready to get help. Yeah, and then just pitch in

925
00:53:14.599 --> 00:53:17.000
then, because it seems to me
you're just you're throwing rocks in a river.

926
00:53:17.079 --> 00:53:21.280
It's really not doing any good.
Yeah, if you if you reach

927
00:53:21.320 --> 00:53:23.199
out, because unless a person's ready
to and these are things you've said to

928
00:53:23.280 --> 00:53:27.920
me, so I mean it's coming
from a very ignorant because I've never experienced

929
00:53:28.519 --> 00:53:32.320
what you've experienced. So I just
you just gotta be there waiting for them

930
00:53:32.440 --> 00:53:35.679
to ask you for help. No, I mean, is that which I

931
00:53:35.760 --> 00:53:37.480
mean because it's it's kind to be
tough, especially when you're really close to

932
00:53:37.559 --> 00:53:42.159
somebody you just see just going over
the deep end and there's nothing you can

933
00:53:42.199 --> 00:53:44.360
do about it. That's gonna be
I mean, it's helpless. You feel

934
00:53:44.360 --> 00:53:46.000
helpless. You know the money will
dry up soon. They'll start asking you

935
00:53:46.079 --> 00:53:50.079
for that, like what happens to
you? Hey, Ron, I really

936
00:53:50.119 --> 00:53:51.760
need, you know, build me
out of jail. And I was like,

937
00:53:51.880 --> 00:53:54.000
dude, don't do that like I
do exactly where he needs to be.

938
00:53:54.039 --> 00:53:57.119
I think I even said that he's
right where he's supposed to be right

939
00:53:57.119 --> 00:54:01.679
now. The money will will dry
up. Alcohol is expensive, you know,

940
00:54:01.760 --> 00:54:08.880
drugs are expensive, So you know
that'll that'll come. Just don't you

941
00:54:08.960 --> 00:54:12.599
know, throw money at them.
I had a guy and don't ever ask

942
00:54:12.639 --> 00:54:14.960
me for money on Facebook. That
just goes for everybody out there, Like

943
00:54:15.039 --> 00:54:16.639
he's dude I was in treatment with
before, and I like to dude,

944
00:54:16.679 --> 00:54:19.639
nothing against him, but you know
it hit me up. Hey man,

945
00:54:20.000 --> 00:54:22.400
I'm like, I don't give money
like that. Man, Sorry, I

946
00:54:22.480 --> 00:54:25.519
don't you know, it's just there's
a lot of scams going on, a

947
00:54:25.599 --> 00:54:29.840
lot of people. Will we'll just
ask everybody. I got five thousand friends,

948
00:54:29.840 --> 00:54:32.199
I'll ask everybody for twenty dollars and
do some stab. But people do

949
00:54:32.320 --> 00:54:34.760
that and people give it. I've
seen it, and I'm like, what

950
00:54:34.840 --> 00:54:37.679
are you doing? You know?
But I don't give money that way.

951
00:54:37.360 --> 00:54:40.199
That's that's not how you help people. Well, but my electra is getting

952
00:54:40.239 --> 00:54:45.280
shut off, Okay, you'll live. Yeah, Like you gotta figure out

953
00:54:45.280 --> 00:54:46.840
how to get it turned back on
then, you know, like, I

954
00:54:47.039 --> 00:54:50.119
don't know to tell you, but
I'm not gonna give you money because you

955
00:54:50.159 --> 00:54:52.599
know what they're gonna do with that
money. They're electroc is getting turned off

956
00:54:52.599 --> 00:54:54.559
anyway. They're gonna drink with it. They're gonna use drugs with it.

957
00:54:55.079 --> 00:54:58.960
You know. That's they're not gonna
like let me. This one guy was

958
00:54:58.960 --> 00:55:00.679
like, oh, I need some
Sugarrett and I was like, all right,

959
00:55:00.679 --> 00:55:01.719
where are you at? Well,
I'm into Saint Marie. I was

960
00:55:01.719 --> 00:55:05.679
like, all right, what gas
stations near you? H I was like,

961
00:55:05.719 --> 00:55:08.440
I'm a calm and I'll pay them
over the phone for a pack of

962
00:55:08.519 --> 00:55:13.159
cigarettes. Oh man, if you
need more than you know what, I'm

963
00:55:13.199 --> 00:55:15.519
like, let's see. Yeah,
you know, but I really wasn't gonna

964
00:55:15.559 --> 00:55:19.519
call that gas station. But I
was just calling his bluff, you know,

965
00:55:19.599 --> 00:55:23.079
and it's it's just different things.
But yeah, money, you know,

966
00:55:23.159 --> 00:55:28.000
that's that's something. And how how
bad do they want it to get?

967
00:55:28.079 --> 00:55:30.199
Everybody says that would you hit your
bottom? And they always said the

968
00:55:30.239 --> 00:55:32.320
bottom there's a basement, and then
in the basement you can dig another hole

969
00:55:32.440 --> 00:55:35.800
and get to the cellar, and
then the cellar it goes as deep as

970
00:55:35.800 --> 00:55:39.280
you wanted to. And for me, it took that wake up call of

971
00:55:39.440 --> 00:55:44.239
like cold cow, like I am. I don't remember those days, and

972
00:55:44.360 --> 00:55:45.480
this could have been bad. I
don't even know what I did last night.

973
00:55:45.519 --> 00:55:49.320
I don't know what to night before. It was my neighbor over,

974
00:55:49.679 --> 00:55:52.679
I don't even know, Like do
I gotta get There was a lot of

975
00:55:52.719 --> 00:55:58.159
things that I was like, I
gotta get out my my bank statements.

976
00:55:58.199 --> 00:56:00.880
It started seeing what happened, try
to piece it together or do I just

977
00:56:00.960 --> 00:56:04.440
pretend it didn't even happen, you
know, Like it was just that moment

978
00:56:04.519 --> 00:56:07.880
of like, oh my god.
But one thing that I I used to

979
00:56:07.920 --> 00:56:13.199
think blackouts just happened to people that
they'd used as an excuse. So I

980
00:56:13.320 --> 00:56:15.920
cheated my wife, Oh I blacked
out, So I thought it was just

981
00:56:15.039 --> 00:56:20.400
like a right something that somebody said. But when I would stop drinking for

982
00:56:20.599 --> 00:56:25.119
months sometimes and sometimes weeks at a
time, and now I would go hardcore

983
00:56:25.400 --> 00:56:30.599
right back in it, like I
lived in Arkansas, and that's when the

984
00:56:30.639 --> 00:56:36.599
blackouts that started. You know,
it was just I don't know, alcohol

985
00:56:36.679 --> 00:56:38.480
too much, too fast. I
have no idea, but something with that

986
00:56:39.239 --> 00:56:43.559
having that clean time in there and
my brain healing and then you know,

987
00:56:43.719 --> 00:56:45.239
going right back to it. Like
that's when I started having like blackouts.

988
00:56:45.239 --> 00:56:47.559
And like I said, I didn't
even believe in blackouts. I thought there

989
00:56:47.599 --> 00:56:51.840
was just some shit people made up, cheated on their wife or something and

990
00:56:52.159 --> 00:56:54.920
do something bad. Well I blacked
out, Yeah, okay, buddy,

991
00:56:55.280 --> 00:56:59.719
you know I was like, I
shut my liver and kidney's down. I'd

992
00:56:59.800 --> 00:57:01.840
never blacked out before. You're stupid, you know, And no, it

993
00:57:01.920 --> 00:57:08.519
makes sense. But yeah, so
for loved ones hanging there, it's it's

994
00:57:08.599 --> 00:57:15.079
tough. Every situation is different,
every person's different. But if they're if

995
00:57:15.119 --> 00:57:17.760
you see it, you see the
train coming and you're like, oh,

996
00:57:17.880 --> 00:57:22.199
this ain't gonna be good, you
can sit back and watch, you know,

997
00:57:22.400 --> 00:57:25.719
but unless you got duct tape and
a basement an old rickety chair you

998
00:57:25.840 --> 00:57:30.119
needed detox, yeah, or just
tie them up somewhere right, which I

999
00:57:30.199 --> 00:57:32.840
don't think it's legal almost states.
Well, you asked me at the top

1000
00:57:32.920 --> 00:57:36.480
of the show, if I'd imagine
we'd be sitting here talking about this,

1001
00:57:36.679 --> 00:57:38.599
I would not have imagined it,
but I could. As I said before,

1002
00:57:38.639 --> 00:57:44.519
I've just what you've done for other
people. You've took your situation and

1003
00:57:44.599 --> 00:57:49.159
you've made other You've You've most people
don't understand what this like. You've affected

1004
00:57:49.239 --> 00:57:52.800
other people's lives, countless people,
and so what you're doing here, hats

1005
00:57:52.840 --> 00:57:54.159
off to you. I'm so proud
of what you are, what you've become,

1006
00:57:54.239 --> 00:57:58.199
and I'm proud to call your friend. Thank you for having me on

1007
00:57:58.280 --> 00:58:00.400
today. Man, this is blast. Yeah, thanks for and I hope

1008
00:58:00.440 --> 00:58:04.159
we help some people. I hope
some people listened. And because it's this

1009
00:58:04.400 --> 00:58:08.079
never ends, it's it's it's alcohol, drugs, they're a huge part of

1010
00:58:08.119 --> 00:58:10.000
our society. I mean, look
at some of the big cities, they're

1011
00:58:10.039 --> 00:58:15.800
just they're like walking around zombies and
it's it's tragic. So all you're doing

1012
00:58:15.920 --> 00:58:19.320
is one person at a time,
helping who you can. So heads off

1013
00:58:19.360 --> 00:58:22.760
to you and my friend and behind
the scenes of doing a little bit of

1014
00:58:22.800 --> 00:58:25.639
things, and like gambling is something
that I'm just like, I gotta tackle

1015
00:58:25.719 --> 00:58:29.880
it, bro, because the state
of Michigan gets so much money, Ron,

1016
00:58:30.880 --> 00:58:32.760
so much money, and they give
peanuts. Yeah, I want to

1017
00:58:32.800 --> 00:58:36.719
say, like half a mill,
maybe a quarter mill. Whatever. It

1018
00:58:36.840 --> 00:58:39.119
is back to the gamble, to
the program to help people, and they

1019
00:58:39.159 --> 00:58:42.800
just they do that with billboards.
You think, oh, there's help,

1020
00:58:42.880 --> 00:58:45.840
they'll call the eight hundred numbers.
You call it, Ron, I'm gonna

1021
00:58:45.840 --> 00:58:47.039
have you call it. You're gonna
have some lady to go. All right,

1022
00:58:47.119 --> 00:58:51.199
can I schedule you an outpatient therapy
session? You're like, but I

1023
00:58:51.280 --> 00:58:53.239
need help now, Okay, but
I'm gonna schedule this, schedule this with.

1024
00:58:53.360 --> 00:58:57.960
I gotta look up and see in
your area if there's anybody available up

1025
00:58:58.000 --> 00:59:00.880
here, Ron, all of the
northern Michigan. There's three, maybe four

1026
00:59:01.119 --> 00:59:05.039
at least on the cording of the
Michigan website. Their website's a joke,

1027
00:59:05.199 --> 00:59:07.840
like nothing, nothing's there to help
anybody, and the state dude raking it

1028
00:59:07.920 --> 00:59:10.360
in. I'm the lottery. Oh
jeesus, see how much from MC nine

1029
00:59:10.400 --> 00:59:14.599
and then a little small print called
this a little eight number. Ron.

1030
00:59:15.159 --> 00:59:16.519
I will tell you this. This
isn't something that we talked about. We

1031
00:59:16.599 --> 00:59:20.000
were not going to talk about,
but this is a subject I can speak

1032
00:59:20.039 --> 00:59:21.960
to. Did you know about this
about me? I don't think so.

1033
00:59:22.679 --> 00:59:23.880
I don't think I've ever shared this. It's not something a part of my

1034
00:59:23.960 --> 00:59:28.199
life that I'm I'm nice, proud
of. I thought we were going to

1035
00:59:28.239 --> 00:59:31.360
wrap it up, but could you're
a completely honest guy. In my early

1036
00:59:31.440 --> 00:59:35.239
twenties, I had a real bad
gambling problem. This is in my my

1037
00:59:35.480 --> 00:59:38.679
My thing was football, the one
o'clock games. I would bet twenty dollars

1038
00:59:38.760 --> 00:59:42.199
on a game, twenty dollars on
another, fifty on another. It was

1039
00:59:42.239 --> 00:59:45.719
fifty fifty twenty twenty. And if
I lost, I'd do the same thing

1040
00:59:45.800 --> 00:59:50.519
the four o'clock games. And there'd
be weekends, you know, or I'm

1041
00:59:50.559 --> 00:59:54.039
down three or four hundred bucks,
you know, And it's just it was.

1042
00:59:54.159 --> 00:59:58.079
It was a never ending pit and
you always think that you have the

1043
00:59:58.159 --> 01:00:02.840
lock of the century, and God
provided I eventually got out of We don't

1044
01:00:02.840 --> 01:00:05.920
need to go on the details,
but I hit it was it was tough.

1045
01:00:05.960 --> 01:00:07.599
I hit some bad parts of my
life. I needed help from people

1046
01:00:07.599 --> 01:00:13.480
who loved me, and I got
it. My cousin Sean Graham, who

1047
01:00:13.559 --> 01:00:16.760
I recently saw after thirty years recently
out on the boat. He put me

1048
01:00:16.920 --> 01:00:21.519
up and I got my shit together. But uh, you know, I

1049
01:00:21.639 --> 01:00:24.320
was doing shit that I wasn't proud
of to feed my gambling addiction. And

1050
01:00:24.400 --> 01:00:28.760
it was addiction. And I'm telling
you, as bad as I thought things

1051
01:00:28.800 --> 01:00:32.320
were then, I can't imagine having
that problem now because it's everywhere TV radio.

1052
01:00:32.440 --> 01:00:35.920
It's always, well, we'll give
you the first four bets for free,

1053
01:00:36.039 --> 01:00:39.039
are you fucking kidding me? And
then at the end of these commercials,

1054
01:00:39.079 --> 01:00:42.679
if you have a gambling problem,
it's like, are you fucking kidding

1055
01:00:42.719 --> 01:00:47.079
me? It's like, what,
yeah, I just it's but yeah,

1056
01:00:47.119 --> 01:00:50.440
that's something I can speak to.
I had, and it was football,

1057
01:00:50.480 --> 01:00:52.320
it wasn't anything else. But to
this day, when me and my wife

1058
01:00:52.360 --> 01:00:57.000
go to Vegas, we gonna gamble. I just do not do any gambling

1059
01:00:57.039 --> 01:01:00.519
because I'm afraid that this twenty dollar
bet will turn into this chase. Because

1060
01:01:00.519 --> 01:01:04.639
you're chasing, You're always chasing.
And so when we go to Vegas,

1061
01:01:04.679 --> 01:01:07.400
we just go to see the shows. I mean, my wife plays the

1062
01:01:07.440 --> 01:01:08.519
slots once in a while, but
I don't go down to the casino.

1063
01:01:08.599 --> 01:01:13.440
I mean, I just but it
is. It's far worse now than it

1064
01:01:13.679 --> 01:01:16.000
was in the late eighties early nineties, to be sure. So I can

1065
01:01:16.039 --> 01:01:19.960
speak to that that that addiction was
a problem for me. It was.

1066
01:01:20.239 --> 01:01:22.920
It was a real bad gambling addict
for three or four years, and it

1067
01:01:22.039 --> 01:01:28.199
was, you know, besides quitting
chewing tobacco, probably the toughest thing I

1068
01:01:28.280 --> 01:01:30.440
ever had to kick was that gambling
problem. It's tough. And I want

1069
01:01:30.480 --> 01:01:35.559
to start tracking where that money goes
because none of it makes sense. And

1070
01:01:36.280 --> 01:01:39.000
what they say with there the online
sports betting, now, yeah, there's

1071
01:01:39.039 --> 01:01:43.159
like some ridiculous fee for them to
do that in the state of mission,

1072
01:01:43.199 --> 01:01:45.280
which they collect and then like I
want to say it's two hundred fifty thousand,

1073
01:01:45.320 --> 01:01:50.960
maybe five hundred just given the credit
and say it's half a mill it's

1074
01:01:51.239 --> 01:01:54.440
billions of dollars. Sof is like, hey, it's big business. That's

1075
01:01:54.599 --> 01:01:58.400
there's a reason it's all over TV
and radio and social media. Yeah,

1076
01:01:58.639 --> 01:02:01.960
it's everywhere, it's saying, and
for them to give back crumbs and then

1077
01:02:02.039 --> 01:02:09.599
they say the rest goes to emergency
workers workman's comp which would show me the

1078
01:02:09.639 --> 01:02:14.679
receipt, which doesn't go like the
ems worker love love what they do.

1079
01:02:14.960 --> 01:02:17.920
They don't pay their workman's cop at
two seventeen recovery. We pay our workman's

1080
01:02:17.960 --> 01:02:22.119
comp. It comes out of the
employer's check. So wait, who's huh?

1081
01:02:22.480 --> 01:02:24.440
Oh the state? Okay, so
the state runs that. So where's

1082
01:02:24.480 --> 01:02:29.920
this going? Like where's the scam? Like and the syntaxes they call it

1083
01:02:30.039 --> 01:02:34.519
for cigarettes, alcohol, tobacco,
marijuana, four hundred million a year,

1084
01:02:36.119 --> 01:02:39.760
Where's where's that going? Like there's
a treatment center at all. We could

1085
01:02:39.800 --> 01:02:45.639
house this place every single day,
full to the brim, all the resources,

1086
01:02:45.760 --> 01:02:50.719
and that's only for a full year, full every single day, and

1087
01:02:50.800 --> 01:02:52.480
that would only be like fifteen million, okay or no, it wouldn't even

1088
01:02:52.519 --> 01:02:54.559
be that. But then I was
like, let's pretend there's ten of them

1089
01:02:54.599 --> 01:02:58.239
in the state, which there's not, and that would only be like sixty

1090
01:02:58.280 --> 01:03:02.199
millions. So where's the where's the
three four every year? Where's that going?

1091
01:03:02.440 --> 01:03:07.079
It's not the schools, there's definitely
not the roads getting rich. Where

1092
01:03:07.239 --> 01:03:09.239
in the f is it going?
Ron? And you're a city commissioner now,

1093
01:03:09.360 --> 01:03:13.840
so like we're building our political career
right here. Yeah, the same

1094
01:03:13.880 --> 01:03:19.880
thing. It's yeah, I'm not
a human rights commission. We're on commissions.

1095
01:03:21.159 --> 01:03:22.480
Well, now we're talking bad about
Gamblance and we've got to watch our

1096
01:03:22.519 --> 01:03:25.400
backs. No, Well, it's
funny that you bring out bout because recently

1097
01:03:25.440 --> 01:03:29.840
on the city council we were because
there's already two dispensaries. We were speaking

1098
01:03:29.840 --> 01:03:32.239
about marijuana earlier. We were talking
there's two dispensaries in the city of Utica,

1099
01:03:32.360 --> 01:03:36.159
and there was a motion to I
mean, Utica is like fifty two

1100
01:03:36.239 --> 01:03:40.199
hundred people, we don't need more
dispensaries. It's well, well, here's

1101
01:03:40.239 --> 01:03:45.800
the thing. I have big feelings
about that because it's not truly like a

1102
01:03:45.840 --> 01:03:51.320
liquor store. There's a lot of
they sell chips and stuff. There's a

1103
01:03:51.360 --> 01:03:53.760
lot of variables to it. But
but recently it got shut down. So

1104
01:03:53.840 --> 01:03:57.559
I think we're just gonna stick with
the two, which is fine. We

1105
01:03:57.639 --> 01:04:00.679
don't. I mean, there's two
and at the probably, you know,

1106
01:04:00.840 --> 01:04:03.119
there's some people who think that that's
not enough. Some people how many dispensaries.

1107
01:04:03.480 --> 01:04:05.880
I came up to Traverse City.
There's like five of them here.

1108
01:04:06.800 --> 01:04:10.559
There's like all kinds. I couldn't
believe how many dispensaries are here. But

1109
01:04:10.639 --> 01:04:13.599
my point is getting back to the
gambling where you're talking about drinking, gambling,

1110
01:04:13.679 --> 01:04:18.719
drugs, alcohol. It's not good. It doesn't produce positive things from

1111
01:04:18.760 --> 01:04:23.599
our society. It's their schools,
right yeah, Governor Whitmery, it helps

1112
01:04:23.639 --> 01:04:25.960
our schools. I hate you,
Cory, wouldn't for you. I need

1113
01:04:26.000 --> 01:04:29.239
to pick up each other because the
powers that be with the advertising, they're

1114
01:04:29.280 --> 01:04:30.559
not they're not. They don't care
about you. They don't care about me,

1115
01:04:30.840 --> 01:04:34.079
No, they don't. And this
is where sometimes two and people don't

1116
01:04:34.079 --> 01:04:36.360
like to be held responsible for their
own actions. I know I didn't.

1117
01:04:38.000 --> 01:04:42.000
Sometimes I still don't like to be
But this is where you really have to

1118
01:04:42.079 --> 01:04:45.079
draw the line in the sand.
Like if people really hated the police or

1119
01:04:45.119 --> 01:04:50.840
hated the system, stop doing crime. And there's that that line from a

1120
01:04:50.960 --> 01:04:55.159
liar, liar, and that criminal
calls Jim care and he picks up the

1121
01:04:55.199 --> 01:04:58.639
phone. He says, stop breaking
the law and he hangs up there.

1122
01:04:59.039 --> 01:05:01.119
If everybody just for a mo just
don't speed, don't do anything, just

1123
01:05:01.360 --> 01:05:05.320
follow the law for a month,
everybody in Michigan. And I'm trying to

1124
01:05:05.360 --> 01:05:09.719
worry about Indiana or any other state. I don't care, just the Michigan

1125
01:05:09.760 --> 01:05:14.639
stop breaking the law just for a
month. That's a that's a tall order

1126
01:05:14.639 --> 01:05:18.159
of my friend. Yeah, that
goes it piss them off. Probably it

1127
01:05:18.320 --> 01:05:21.119
was because they're like, what the
fuck are we doing? Like nobody squent

1128
01:05:21.199 --> 01:05:26.400
crimes is crazy. They must really
hate us. I don't want to brag

1129
01:05:26.440 --> 01:05:28.599
about right if if you want to, you know, get out and get

1130
01:05:28.639 --> 01:05:30.480
out and enjoy nature. That's my
best suggestion. If you're thinking about doing

1131
01:05:30.559 --> 01:05:33.079
drugs, go out and enjoy nature. Go fishing, go bike riding,

1132
01:05:33.159 --> 01:05:38.760
do something outdoors. That's the next
election for governor. I don't know what

1133
01:05:38.920 --> 01:05:44.639
turn turn turn turn turn turn Windfield
Robinson. Nope, don't want it,

1134
01:05:44.880 --> 01:05:47.440
no interest, No sir, No, sir, doesn't want it. City

1135
01:05:47.480 --> 01:05:50.400
councils the end of the road from
must do it for him. You gotta

1136
01:05:50.440 --> 01:05:53.599
do the things you don't want to
do. Ron. Look, if you

1137
01:05:53.679 --> 01:05:57.679
want a put life in public st
what you need, don't turn turn turn

1138
01:05:57.800 --> 01:06:01.079
turn Windfield, Robin. I think
it's not natural to run a rule over

1139
01:06:01.159 --> 01:06:04.119
people. I'm on the city council
to give back to my community. How

1140
01:06:04.159 --> 01:06:08.360
can you get back to him?
Well, just be like, here's why,

1141
01:06:08.599 --> 01:06:15.960
being governor of Michigan, you're killing
me. Winfield Robinson, I say,

1142
01:06:16.000 --> 01:06:19.840
that's why I go to my PUKA
radio voice. Governor of Michigated twenty

1143
01:06:20.079 --> 01:06:26.880
twenty whatever. If you want a
mayor who's afraid of the governor, then

1144
01:06:26.960 --> 01:06:30.840
you want a governor that doesn't care
about your mayor. That's Ron Robinson and

1145
01:06:30.920 --> 01:06:34.280
Corey Winfield. They're gonna tag team
the role. The views of Corey Winfield

1146
01:06:34.320 --> 01:06:40.760
do not necessarily express the written views
of Ron Robinson governor bad that's some whittmer

1147
01:06:40.880 --> 01:06:45.039
crap. They're both going to be
governor. I'm Ron Robinson and I did

1148
01:06:45.159 --> 01:06:48.559
not approve of this message. He
doesn't want to. That means he needs

1149
01:06:48.599 --> 01:06:53.800
to do it the Winfield ways,
sir. No, sir, I will

1150
01:06:53.920 --> 01:06:55.960
vote for you, but I want
no part of that. You ever want

1151
01:06:56.079 --> 01:07:01.559
the man station and buy a joint
at the counter, Nope. I think

1152
01:07:01.599 --> 01:07:04.800
people need to police themselves, That's
what I think, and that's my point.

1153
01:07:04.880 --> 01:07:08.880
They really have to, you know, just be accountable, you know,

1154
01:07:08.960 --> 01:07:11.679
be responsible for what's going on because, like you said, nobody cares.

1155
01:07:12.079 --> 01:07:14.079
Yeah, you know, they're all
out there to make money. Money

1156
01:07:14.159 --> 01:07:17.639
rules everything, and what can you
do about your situation? And that's what

1157
01:07:17.679 --> 01:07:20.320
I started doing too with my own
recoveries. And we live in a society

1158
01:07:20.400 --> 01:07:25.119
where everybody wants to feel good now, never worrying about the repercussions of what

1159
01:07:25.199 --> 01:07:28.360
they're gonna their actions might be later. You know what I mean, You

1160
01:07:28.519 --> 01:07:30.719
really just to have to look at
the big picture. You can't you can't

1161
01:07:30.800 --> 01:07:34.519
do it for instant gratification because if
you chase that tail, you're never going

1162
01:07:34.559 --> 01:07:39.199
to stop chasing it, right.
So, yeah, the gambling thing is

1163
01:07:39.239 --> 01:07:41.320
a huge issue, and that's why
I want to kind of get more involved

1164
01:07:41.360 --> 01:07:45.519
in for you. I'm glad to
hear it because there's one place in Michigan.

1165
01:07:45.519 --> 01:07:46.840
If you're like I need I need
away from this. I need to

1166
01:07:46.880 --> 01:07:51.679
go somewhere and just hit the reset
button. Like impatient treatment. There's one

1167
01:07:51.760 --> 01:07:57.760
place in Detroit, just one for
men only. So if you're a woman

1168
01:07:57.800 --> 01:08:03.360
with a gambling change things. We're
gonna creep jobs. There needs to be

1169
01:08:03.480 --> 01:08:08.760
more estrogen in there. We're gonna
open up treatment centers and places for people

1170
01:08:08.800 --> 01:08:10.760
to go with gambling. They got
the money, that's the same man,

1171
01:08:10.800 --> 01:08:13.840
they just do it. Open it. If you're gonna let people gamble and

1172
01:08:13.880 --> 01:08:16.439
do all this stuff, open it
because the gambler man like, it's you're

1173
01:08:16.479 --> 01:08:19.840
the dirty person. You're the dirty
guy. You lost your lost the family,

1174
01:08:20.439 --> 01:08:23.920
and the shame is, Oh,
it's the alcohol made him do it.

1175
01:08:23.960 --> 01:08:26.640
He's a different person when he drinks
with someone who gambles, even though

1176
01:08:26.680 --> 01:08:30.760
the same receptors are firing in the
brain. It's you're the bad guy.

1177
01:08:30.000 --> 01:08:32.760
The blame is on you. And
if you're well, I did make the

1178
01:08:32.840 --> 01:08:35.560
bets. If you noticed, Okay, I did take the drink alcohol,

1179
01:08:35.640 --> 01:08:40.439
But the alcohol keeps going in my
brain where it takes over so like it

1180
01:08:40.560 --> 01:08:45.239
changes the chemistry in your brain.
But if you notice, there's some very

1181
01:08:45.399 --> 01:08:51.119
similarities with alcohol and gambling and how
they word it that it's your problem.

1182
01:08:51.640 --> 01:09:01.039
Yeah, and drink responsibly, gamble
responsibly, responsible hambling, responsible drinking.

1183
01:09:01.840 --> 01:09:06.319
Oh okay, we're falling for this
one again. Yeah it is. And

1184
01:09:08.039 --> 01:09:10.640
it's like, oh, they're putting
a blame on you, them sneaky bastards.

1185
01:09:11.039 --> 01:09:14.239
And the opiate like the pharmaceutical companies, which I think we should sue

1186
01:09:14.239 --> 01:09:16.239
the state just as much because of
how many people they don't allow to go

1187
01:09:16.319 --> 01:09:19.399
to treatment because oh they didn't have
a ride. Oh well no, you

1188
01:09:19.560 --> 01:09:21.800
just you were just there. We're
not going to send you to treatment again.

1189
01:09:23.399 --> 01:09:27.439
Wait, what, but yet you
collected all this money from all these

1190
01:09:27.479 --> 01:09:30.079
pharmaceutical companies, but you're telling people
they can't go because they've already been.

1191
01:09:30.640 --> 01:09:33.119
You were just there two weeks ago. Yeah, somebody needs to explain to

1192
01:09:33.159 --> 01:09:36.840
me the difference between the drug dealers
selling cocaine or crack on the corner with

1193
01:09:36.960 --> 01:09:42.159
the pharmaceutical company pitching opiates. Tell
me, because I really don't see the

1194
01:09:42.199 --> 01:09:45.640
difference. Yeah, and other than
the money, yeah, and the states

1195
01:09:45.720 --> 01:09:47.439
getting money, and that's why the
state was like, hey, we want

1196
01:09:47.479 --> 01:09:49.079
some money for that, and all
of them were like, hey, we'll

1197
01:09:49.079 --> 01:09:53.000
get some money. Oh shit,
yeah, let's get on that that bandwagon.

1198
01:09:53.079 --> 01:09:56.560
When they're allowing things like that to
even even continue, you know,

1199
01:09:56.640 --> 01:09:59.600
and they're just sitting back collected at
all. And then the money for that

1200
01:09:59.840 --> 01:10:02.399
was supposed to go to help like
organizations like ours or a recovery community organization.

1201
01:10:03.359 --> 01:10:06.680
Families that have lost people should should
start stuff, and they have,

1202
01:10:06.960 --> 01:10:11.439
but they're like, where's where's our
help? And it goes to the jails.

1203
01:10:11.960 --> 01:10:14.079
It goes back to the jails,
and it's like, wait, the

1204
01:10:14.159 --> 01:10:15.960
jail is getting so much money and
it well, but we need a new

1205
01:10:15.000 --> 01:10:21.479
swap team. What okay, Well
I thought we were helping people now oh

1206
01:10:21.520 --> 01:10:24.439
no, no, So now you're
gonna go out and arrest all the people

1207
01:10:24.560 --> 01:10:32.000
and throw them back in jail a
Ron Robinson, Corey Winfield, some kind

1208
01:10:32.000 --> 01:10:36.199
of elected officials. I think we
might get canceled if we talked too much

1209
01:10:36.199 --> 01:10:41.640
about big Pharma. Yeah yeah,
yeah, but anyway, we gotta go.

1210
01:10:41.760 --> 01:10:43.720
We got five jails or something.
Fun. Yeah, thank you for

1211
01:10:43.920 --> 01:10:45.079
having me man, I appreciate it. Yeah, thanks for stopping Vibe and

1212
01:10:45.119 --> 01:10:47.960
want to have you on for quite
a while. And I'm glad you got

1213
01:10:48.039 --> 01:10:49.880
to check out. You got more
out of me than you. I mean,

1214
01:10:49.920 --> 01:10:51.880
you learned. So I think we
learned some things about each other.

1215
01:10:53.000 --> 01:10:56.880
Yeah, we did. It's fun
and it wasn't scripted because that's not what

1216
01:10:56.960 --> 01:11:00.279
I do. But you got to
see the East Studio, the homest I

1217
01:11:00.279 --> 01:11:01.880
think it's very nice. You and
Marty have a great place. Cool.

1218
01:11:02.000 --> 01:11:06.520
And the North Studio, the North
Studio rocks. Yes, but I will

1219
01:11:06.560 --> 01:11:09.920
tell you this, and I said
this because last night when you gave us

1220
01:11:09.920 --> 01:11:13.560
a tour of your house, you
made me look bad because my studio is

1221
01:11:13.720 --> 01:11:18.359
very messy and your house in your
home studio is very clean and everything.

1222
01:11:18.680 --> 01:11:23.279
But here, this this area here, it's not that messy, but it's

1223
01:11:23.319 --> 01:11:27.720
more resembles what my studio looks like. It's just papers around. You know,

1224
01:11:28.439 --> 01:11:34.239
you're energy drink here and your cards
and just energy drink around. This

1225
01:11:34.359 --> 01:11:38.119
episode brought to you by Power Aid
until they pay me not to say their

1226
01:11:38.159 --> 01:11:43.079
name anymore. Samor reversed advertise,
Okay, I want you to quit vaping.

1227
01:11:44.119 --> 01:11:45.880
I think it's bad for you.
I'm in the process. Okay,

1228
01:11:46.159 --> 01:11:49.680
big steps because it's just it's not
good for you, man, it's not

1229
01:11:53.800 --> 01:12:00.159
Thanks for having me. I appreciate
this was funny. Yeah, thanks for

1230
01:12:00.199 --> 01:12:06.439
coming by man, thanks for listening
to the two seventeen Recovery podcast. When

1231
01:12:06.760 --> 01:12:12.520
a bunch of free step from two
seventeen Recovery go to the app on the

1232
01:12:12.640 --> 01:12:15.439
website two seventeen recovery dot com