1 00:00:17,399 --> 00:00:21,519 We're back with another edition of The Federalist Radio Hour. I'm Emily Jashnski, 2 00:00:21,600 --> 00:00:24,359 culture editor here at the Federalist. As always, you can email the show 3 00:00:24,399 --> 00:00:28,280 at radio at the Federalist dot com, follow us on Twitter at fdr LST. 4 00:00:28,559 --> 00:00:31,920 Make sure to subscribe wherever you download your podcasts, and to the premium 5 00:00:32,039 --> 00:00:35,520 version of our website as well. We have a special guest on today's show. 6 00:00:35,520 --> 00:00:39,759 It's not often that you get to actually interview someone you consider a mentor, 7 00:00:40,119 --> 00:00:43,439 but I'm joined today by Kimberly Beg, who is the author of a 8 00:00:43,560 --> 00:00:46,719 truly wonderful new book. I really encourage you, especially if you're a parent, 9 00:00:46,759 --> 00:00:49,679 but not just if you're a parent, to go out and get Unbreakable 10 00:00:49,799 --> 00:00:55,799 Saints who inspired Saints to moral courage. Kimberly is also the editor of Catholic 11 00:00:55,880 --> 00:00:59,280 School Playbook, and she's a project advisor for Run with Saints. I know 12 00:00:59,359 --> 00:01:02,640 Kimberly, of course, because she's a long time staff member board member at 13 00:01:02,679 --> 00:01:06,840 Young America's Foundation where we're recording this podcast. Actually, so Kimberly welcome. 14 00:01:07,040 --> 00:01:10,640 Thank you, Emily. I'm thrilled to be here. So I texted Kimberly 15 00:01:11,200 --> 00:01:14,760 I picked up a copy of the book, and I texted Kimberly like halfway 16 00:01:14,760 --> 00:01:17,120 through the book that I was loving it. And then I texted her like 17 00:01:17,239 --> 00:01:22,200 two hours later saying I'd finished it because it was so so readable. And 18 00:01:22,680 --> 00:01:25,439 this is, by the way, Kimberly, another edition of what our listeners 19 00:01:25,519 --> 00:01:30,560 enjoy as Lutheran's attempt to talk to Catholics, which happens like every week, 20 00:01:30,599 --> 00:01:34,560 because you Catholics write so many books. But what a beautiful book. Congratulations 21 00:01:34,599 --> 00:01:38,280 on it and tell us just a little bit. Because you're a mother of 22 00:01:38,280 --> 00:01:42,719 many children, I imagine that inspired the idea behind this book. What made 23 00:01:42,719 --> 00:01:45,920 you want to write Unbreakable? Well, thank you, Emily. First of 24 00:01:45,959 --> 00:01:49,640 all, that is high praise coming from you, and it's so neat that 25 00:01:49,680 --> 00:01:53,920 you call me a mentor, because honestly, I have admired your work so 26 00:01:53,000 --> 00:01:57,000 much. In fact, I've often thought that one of the worst days at 27 00:01:57,040 --> 00:02:01,400 Young America's Foundation was a day that you came into my office and told me 28 00:02:01,439 --> 00:02:06,000 that you were leaving the staff. So I am very grateful that you corrected 29 00:02:06,120 --> 00:02:10,159 that terrible mistake that you are now the executive director of our National Journalism Center. 30 00:02:10,560 --> 00:02:15,759 So thank you very much while as for the inspiration for the book. 31 00:02:15,039 --> 00:02:20,360 We are living in a moment of great confusion in the world. We are 32 00:02:20,479 --> 00:02:23,840 even a lot of Christians don't know who they are and why they were made. 33 00:02:24,240 --> 00:02:29,680 They don't have an understanding of their duties in the world, their duties 34 00:02:29,719 --> 00:02:32,719 to God, their duties to their family. And as a result, a 35 00:02:32,759 --> 00:02:37,800 lot of people, and especially a lot of parents, are trying to find 36 00:02:38,000 --> 00:02:43,879 a way around the cross for themselves and their children. But in Christianity, 37 00:02:43,960 --> 00:02:47,360 this idea that there is a way around the cross, this idea that your 38 00:02:47,400 --> 00:02:53,240 path, on your way to heaven can ever be free of sacrifice and suffering, 39 00:02:53,800 --> 00:02:59,879 has absolutely no grounding in sacred scripture or the traditions of the Church. 40 00:03:00,159 --> 00:03:04,680 And one of the greatest traditions of the Church that we have are the stories 41 00:03:04,879 --> 00:03:08,199 of the Saints. So a few years ago I gave a presentation to Young 42 00:03:08,240 --> 00:03:15,599 America's Foundation, and I gave the presentation on Blessed Yergi Papishko. And if 43 00:03:15,599 --> 00:03:20,759 you're not familiar with Father Yurgi, he was the very courageous priest in Communist 44 00:03:20,759 --> 00:03:24,919 Poland after World War Two who was the chaplain of the Solidarity movement, and 45 00:03:25,039 --> 00:03:30,439 he helped millions of people throughout Poland, throughout the Eastern Bloc, throughout the 46 00:03:30,479 --> 00:03:37,000 world see through the lives of communism by his courageous homilies. He was a 47 00:03:37,080 --> 00:03:40,680 truth teller, a courageous truthteller. So in doing my research for this presentation, 48 00:03:42,000 --> 00:03:46,520 I made this wonderful discovery that Father Yurgi's favorite saint, beginning when he 49 00:03:46,560 --> 00:03:51,960 was a little kid, was Saint Maximilian Colby. And he actually learned about 50 00:03:52,000 --> 00:03:57,240 Saint Maximilian Colby going to his grandmother's house as a little boy and reading Father 51 00:03:57,360 --> 00:04:01,240 Colby's Knights of the Immaculata, which was Father cole These newspaper. So when 52 00:04:01,280 --> 00:04:05,520 I learned this wonderful discovery about Blessed Yergy, the whole rest of his life 53 00:04:05,599 --> 00:04:10,479 made sense to me. I believe that you can't really understand a person without 54 00:04:10,560 --> 00:04:15,400 understanding their heroes, that the people that they admired throughout their lives. And 55 00:04:15,479 --> 00:04:20,199 you can see the steady progression and these repeated acts of courage in Father Yergi's 56 00:04:20,279 --> 00:04:25,199 life all the way through to his death. So that's where the idea for 57 00:04:25,240 --> 00:04:28,279 the book came from. Paul Kangar is a good friend of mine. He 58 00:04:28,360 --> 00:04:32,800 was also giving a presentation at that seminar for Young America's Foundation. He and 59 00:04:32,839 --> 00:04:36,480 I chatted about it, thought it would be a great idea for a book. 60 00:04:36,519 --> 00:04:41,360 He became my editor. Fast forward a couple of years and here we 61 00:04:41,360 --> 00:04:44,759 are talking about it. And you know, there's something in your introduction which 62 00:04:44,759 --> 00:04:47,639 I thought was beautifully written. It's worth reading in and of itself. It's 63 00:04:47,680 --> 00:04:51,000 it's a wonderful piece of writing. But you say something to the extent of, 64 00:04:51,759 --> 00:04:56,639 we can't understand or we can't minimize, I think is the word you 65 00:04:56,759 --> 00:05:01,519 use, the importance of the images the stories that dance in child's imagination. 66 00:05:02,079 --> 00:05:06,680 And I loved the way you put that. Can you flesh that out a 67 00:05:06,759 --> 00:05:10,920 little bit, especially, and maybe give people some idea of your kid's age 68 00:05:11,000 --> 00:05:13,279 range? Yes, as you were writing this, because I imagine that was 69 00:05:13,279 --> 00:05:15,160 in your head too, Yes, And I appreciate you pointing that out. 70 00:05:15,240 --> 00:05:21,560 There has been a very dangerous trend in education over the last several decades to 71 00:05:21,639 --> 00:05:26,959 focus on skills and not to focus on content. So, for example, 72 00:05:27,079 --> 00:05:33,519 we often teach kindergarteners and first graders and second graders how to read using sentences 73 00:05:33,600 --> 00:05:39,399 that are meaningless, using books that have nothing beautiful about them, and the 74 00:05:39,439 --> 00:05:43,800 focus is on skills, almost like it's a waste that your brain can't handle 75 00:05:43,920 --> 00:05:47,399 beauty, that they can't handle the extra information. But we are robbing children 76 00:05:47,959 --> 00:05:53,240 of the opportunity to be inspired, you know, to understand who they are 77 00:05:53,439 --> 00:05:57,600 as human beings, and to really get a sense of the richness of the 78 00:05:57,720 --> 00:06:01,120 human experience. So that's some thing that was very much in my mind too, 79 00:06:01,199 --> 00:06:04,160 because the Catholic Church, I think, over the last few years, 80 00:06:04,319 --> 00:06:11,839 has gotten better about instilling a love of the most courageous saints in young people. 81 00:06:12,240 --> 00:06:15,279 But I grew up as a Catholic in New Jersey in the nineteen seventies 82 00:06:15,360 --> 00:06:19,839 and nineteen eighties, and I was wholly unfamiliar with not only the saints in 83 00:06:19,839 --> 00:06:24,600 this book, but the vast majority of Catholic saints. And I think what 84 00:06:24,680 --> 00:06:29,759 that does is when you are robbed of the history of you know, so 85 00:06:29,759 --> 00:06:32,800 many of the heroes that generations before us have had to look up to. 86 00:06:34,079 --> 00:06:38,360 What it does is it makes you feel like you're the first person ever encountering 87 00:06:38,360 --> 00:06:41,600 a challenge, and that is so untrue. I mean, you look at 88 00:06:41,639 --> 00:06:45,800 the challenges that the saints in this book and the saints throughout the history of 89 00:06:45,839 --> 00:06:49,560 the world have had to encounter. You know, you feel better equipped to 90 00:06:50,480 --> 00:06:55,319 challenge, to encounter whatever challenges that you have in front of you. You 91 00:06:55,360 --> 00:07:00,040 know, I mentioned the trend of focusing on skills, and this other trend 92 00:07:01,040 --> 00:07:06,120 is that we try to give kids today stories that are relatable to them, 93 00:07:06,160 --> 00:07:12,759 and we have this idea that they can only understand the challenge of a character 94 00:07:12,920 --> 00:07:15,199 in a book if they are from the same kind of family, if they 95 00:07:15,240 --> 00:07:18,639 live in the same part of the world, if they are from that same 96 00:07:18,879 --> 00:07:25,519 time period. But actually, I think that the more powerful stories for children 97 00:07:25,600 --> 00:07:30,480 and people of all ages are those that speak to eternal truths, because when 98 00:07:30,480 --> 00:07:34,079 you read about somebody who lived centuries before you in a different part of the 99 00:07:34,120 --> 00:07:39,399 world, with different circumstances, what that does is it allows you to draw 100 00:07:39,920 --> 00:07:43,959 parallels that you can see as bigger than yourself, that you can see as 101 00:07:44,000 --> 00:07:47,879 eternal. So, yes, there was a lot of intentionality of putting stories 102 00:07:47,920 --> 00:07:53,800 in the book that would appeal to young people. Five of the fourteen saints 103 00:07:53,839 --> 00:07:58,399 in the book are actually children or teenagers, and I was very much thinking 104 00:07:58,439 --> 00:08:01,680 along the lines of you know, what are the kind of stories that are 105 00:08:01,759 --> 00:08:05,959 going to inspire children that I see in my day to day life. So 106 00:08:05,120 --> 00:08:09,600 my children are now nine years old up to seventeen years old. In fact, 107 00:08:09,600 --> 00:08:13,680 today is my son, Charlie's seventeenth birthday, right, Happy birthday, 108 00:08:13,720 --> 00:08:18,399 Charlie. And my youngest my baby's ninth birthday was two days ago, so 109 00:08:18,800 --> 00:08:22,560 I know. So August is a busy month for us. So we have 110 00:08:22,600 --> 00:08:26,399 a nine year old and eleven year old, at thirteen year old, at 111 00:08:26,399 --> 00:08:28,399 fifteen year old, and a now seventeen year old. So I have three 112 00:08:28,439 --> 00:08:33,919 teen teenagers. And I wrote the book very much to be inspirational for parents, 113 00:08:35,480 --> 00:08:39,720 but also to be appropriate for read alouds for kids of all ages, 114 00:08:41,120 --> 00:08:46,360 and then appropriate for independent reading for kids twelve years old and up. I 115 00:08:46,399 --> 00:08:50,559 wanted teenagers who were very accustomed to reading Harry Potter and other books that go 116 00:08:50,720 --> 00:08:54,879 very very quickly. My eleven year old daughter loves the Rangers Apprentice series. 117 00:08:54,879 --> 00:08:58,639 She's read all of them like five times, and I was thinking of her, 118 00:09:00,120 --> 00:09:01,919 thinking of a book that she would be able to pick up, be 119 00:09:03,000 --> 00:09:05,360 able to understand, be able to get through quickly, but also to be 120 00:09:05,440 --> 00:09:11,720 able to understand just the challenges that each of these saints lived through in their 121 00:09:11,720 --> 00:09:15,320 lives. You don't dumb it down at all. Actually, I felt like 122 00:09:15,440 --> 00:09:16,919 it was a history book, and I think that's why I devoured And the 123 00:09:16,919 --> 00:09:20,879 history is amazing. There was so much I didn't know actually about Joan of 124 00:09:20,960 --> 00:09:22,840 Arc. You tell the story of Joan of Bark in great detail, and 125 00:09:24,000 --> 00:09:26,480 I feel like as a reader, that story resonates with you a lot. 126 00:09:28,639 --> 00:09:31,240 What, if anything, did you learn about Johan of Bark that sort of 127 00:09:31,279 --> 00:09:35,519 sticks with you since you researched it in such detail. I learned so much. 128 00:09:35,600 --> 00:09:41,039 I thought that I knew Joan's story until I researched her story. And 129 00:09:41,080 --> 00:09:43,720 in fact, the chapter on Joan of Arc is the first chapter in the 130 00:09:43,720 --> 00:09:48,600 book, but it is actually the last chapter that I wrote. And it 131 00:09:48,639 --> 00:09:52,519 took me about twice as long to write the chapter on Joan than it did 132 00:09:52,720 --> 00:09:56,240 to write the other chapters. And part of the reason is because we actually 133 00:09:56,279 --> 00:10:01,759 have more information about Joan of Arc and we do about any figure who lived 134 00:10:01,960 --> 00:10:07,440 in history before her time, and that is because she had her trials and 135 00:10:07,639 --> 00:10:13,320 her retrials, and we have this just wealth of testimony not just from Joan 136 00:10:15,279 --> 00:10:18,480 but from those around her that they interviewed, so there was a lot of 137 00:10:18,519 --> 00:10:22,600 information to go through. But what I found most interesting about Joan is, 138 00:10:22,679 --> 00:10:26,720 you know, we all know that it was Saint Michael, the archangel who 139 00:10:26,919 --> 00:10:31,639 inspired her and interceded for her. So he visited her for the first time 140 00:10:31,200 --> 00:10:35,000 when she was thirteen years old, and continued to visit her until she left 141 00:10:35,039 --> 00:10:39,679 home for the first time at age sixteen, and then throughout her time in 142 00:10:39,759 --> 00:10:45,720 battle up until the burning of her at the Stake at age nineteen. But 143 00:10:45,840 --> 00:10:48,960 what was most fascinating to me I had known that there were other saints who 144 00:10:48,960 --> 00:10:54,399 had appeared to her and who had inspired her and interceded for her. Those 145 00:10:54,440 --> 00:11:01,080 two saints were teenage martyrs who died in the early fourth century. They were 146 00:11:01,159 --> 00:11:07,679 victims of the Diocletian persecutions, and they, as I said, were teenagers. 147 00:11:07,080 --> 00:11:11,159 So like Joan, they had to go out in the world and defend 148 00:11:11,200 --> 00:11:18,080 their faith against hostile people who very much wanted to humiliate them, and who 149 00:11:18,120 --> 00:11:22,480 wanted to defeat them, and who wanted to silence them. And that is 150 00:11:22,519 --> 00:11:26,320 what Joan had to encounter time and time again throughout her life. You know, 151 00:11:26,360 --> 00:11:31,360 one of the things that I found fascinating is that all of the saints 152 00:11:31,399 --> 00:11:37,200 in the book were inspired by saints that are no longer familiar to us in 153 00:11:37,240 --> 00:11:41,960 the modern age. And that is especially true of these teenage saints who inspire 154 00:11:41,039 --> 00:11:46,519 Joan. So Saint Margaret of Antioch is one of them, and Saint Catherine 155 00:11:46,519 --> 00:11:50,919 of Alexandria was the other. Saint Margaret of Antioch was the daughter of a 156 00:11:50,960 --> 00:11:56,480 pagan priest, and her father had found out that she'd become a Christian kicked 157 00:11:56,480 --> 00:12:00,200 her out of the house. She had to live on her own, like 158 00:12:00,320 --> 00:12:05,399 Joan, had to survive on her own without her parents. As she was 159 00:12:05,440 --> 00:12:11,120 making her way first to Voculer to seek the assistance of the captain of a 160 00:12:11,159 --> 00:12:15,720 fortress, she actually had to convince, as sixteen years old, the captain 161 00:12:15,720 --> 00:12:22,440 of a fortress that she had been given this mission by God to save the 162 00:12:22,159 --> 00:12:26,600 French from the English, to drive the English out of Orleans and drive the 163 00:12:26,639 --> 00:12:31,759 English out of France. This must have seemed like the most bizarre, impossible 164 00:12:31,879 --> 00:12:37,879 story that the captain of the fortress had ever heard. He told her to 165 00:12:37,919 --> 00:12:41,440 go home to her father, and she had to. You know, at 166 00:12:41,440 --> 00:12:45,360 that, at that moment, build up the courage. You know, you 167 00:12:45,399 --> 00:12:48,519 can look at her burning at the stake and her trials that she had to 168 00:12:48,639 --> 00:12:52,879 endure, being wooded in battle, but actually the courage to take that first 169 00:12:52,879 --> 00:12:58,399 step again to visit this man who was enraged that she had wasted his time 170 00:12:58,600 --> 00:13:03,600 to re quest and escort so that she could travel, if a three hundred 171 00:13:03,600 --> 00:13:07,120 and fifty miles to go see the Dauphin Charles the Seventh, who was the 172 00:13:07,200 --> 00:13:13,399 rifle King. The courage that that alone must have taken, I think is 173 00:13:13,440 --> 00:13:22,519 an inspiration. Hey, y'all, this is Sarah Carter, host of The 174 00:13:22,559 --> 00:13:26,240 Sarah Carter Show. Thanks for listening to the Federalist. Hey, folks, 175 00:13:26,360 --> 00:13:31,879 I love My Pillow and I love Mike Lindell, but you're the ones that 176 00:13:31,039 --> 00:13:35,879 helped build My Pillow into an incredible company it is today. Mike Lindell, 177 00:13:35,960 --> 00:13:39,639 the creator of My Pillow, knows this and continues to give back to listeners 178 00:13:39,639 --> 00:13:43,000 with incredible deals on his most popular products, including the six piece towel set 179 00:13:43,080 --> 00:13:46,639 now back in stock. Nothing beats the feel of a luxurious towel when you 180 00:13:46,639 --> 00:13:50,159 step out of the shower, wrap yourself in that best towel with the My 181 00:13:50,279 --> 00:13:54,679 Pillow six piece towel set for yes what only thirty nine ninety nine with code 182 00:13:54,720 --> 00:13:58,360 car. Every six piece twel set is made with USA cotton, making it 183 00:13:58,399 --> 00:14:03,600 extremely absorbent yet still providing that soft, luxurious feel. Available in a variety 184 00:14:03,639 --> 00:14:07,720 of colors, Each set has two bath and two hand towels and two washcloths. 185 00:14:07,799 --> 00:14:11,440 Shop at my pillow dot com backslash Carter to get the six piece towel 186 00:14:11,440 --> 00:14:16,879 set regularly seventy nine ninety eight, now only thirty nine ninety nine with promo 187 00:14:16,919 --> 00:14:20,799 code Carter. Or call one eight hundred and six s eighty five seven two 188 00:14:20,799 --> 00:14:24,879 two one shot my pillow dot com backslash Carter promo code Carter or call one 189 00:14:24,919 --> 00:14:30,320 eight hundred sixty five seven two two one that's my pillow dot Com backslash Carter 190 00:14:30,639 --> 00:14:37,480 Romo code Carter. I'm wondering, especially because this is something you think about 191 00:14:37,480 --> 00:14:43,080 a lot, the idea of raising children in the culture of America at twenty 192 00:14:43,080 --> 00:14:46,000 twenty three, a very hostile culture. Obviously, there are a lot of 193 00:14:46,039 --> 00:14:50,480 parallels in the stories that you tell and Unbreakable. Does that resonate Do you 194 00:14:50,559 --> 00:14:54,600 find that that resonates with kids who are sort of brought up to be aware 195 00:14:56,159 --> 00:14:58,360 that they're in a hostile culture, which is not the majority of kids, 196 00:14:58,360 --> 00:15:01,120 but a lot of the kids that you work with, certainly your own children, 197 00:15:01,240 --> 00:15:05,080 and a lot of their friends, I imagine, are very aware that 198 00:15:05,120 --> 00:15:11,519 they're swimming in this dark, hostile culture. Do these stories resonate for that 199 00:15:11,600 --> 00:15:13,840 reason? It just seems so heavy but so obvious. Well, I think 200 00:15:13,840 --> 00:15:16,720 that they do. You mentioned the introduction, and one of the themes that 201 00:15:16,799 --> 00:15:22,840 I discuss in the introduction is our desire for happiness. So most parents today, 202 00:15:22,960 --> 00:15:26,279 if you ask them what they want for their kids, they will tell 203 00:15:26,320 --> 00:15:28,759 you in this line. I hear it all the time. I just want 204 00:15:28,840 --> 00:15:33,559 my kids to be happy. What's really interesting is that when you're out in 205 00:15:33,600 --> 00:15:37,200 the world and you're seeking pleasure, and by the way, all the social 206 00:15:37,240 --> 00:15:43,440 science data backs all of this up, when you're seeking happiness for the sake 207 00:15:43,480 --> 00:15:48,039 of happiness, and when you are not following eternal truths, when you don't 208 00:15:48,080 --> 00:15:52,399 know the difference between vice and virtue, and when you are going along with 209 00:15:52,440 --> 00:15:56,519 all of the new ideas in the world which are not rooted in truth, 210 00:15:56,759 --> 00:16:00,320 it actually does not make you happy. You know what neat is The saints 211 00:16:00,320 --> 00:16:07,480 in this book all exhibited this inner piece so even when they knew that their 212 00:16:07,519 --> 00:16:11,039 lives were in danger. So we were just talking about Father Yerji Papishko. 213 00:16:11,519 --> 00:16:15,879 He's a great example. His friends were telling him to go seek safety at 214 00:16:15,879 --> 00:16:22,039 the Vatican. But that wasn't his plan, that wasn't God's plan for his 215 00:16:22,080 --> 00:16:25,879 life, and he knew that, and so they were advising him to go 216 00:16:26,000 --> 00:16:30,919 seek safety. He had been arrested something like fifteen times and harassed, and 217 00:16:32,039 --> 00:16:37,200 they planted the communist planted evidence in his apartment, and they slanted him in 218 00:16:37,480 --> 00:16:41,519 the press and told him and called him an agitator, and that he was 219 00:16:41,840 --> 00:16:45,440 presiding over these hate meetings that were at hate By the way, we think 220 00:16:45,440 --> 00:16:48,639 it's so new now, but this is a tactic that has been used by 221 00:16:48,960 --> 00:16:55,919 leftists trying to edge out religious people and conservatives and people who want to put 222 00:16:55,960 --> 00:16:59,240 the interests of their families over the interests of the state. This is a 223 00:16:59,279 --> 00:17:02,799 tactic that his and used just time and time again. So this is nothing 224 00:17:02,840 --> 00:17:07,799 new. But Yearsy had this inner piece, you know, just like Mother 225 00:17:07,000 --> 00:17:12,599 Teresa had this inner piece, and Saint Jose Luis Sanchez del Rio had this 226 00:17:12,680 --> 00:17:17,160 inner piece. And we look at their stories and we think, you know, 227 00:17:17,240 --> 00:17:21,960 could I have been as courageous as they were. I was gonna say, 228 00:17:22,039 --> 00:17:25,880 what's interesting about Father Yersey is that comes from Colby. Yes, And 229 00:17:25,920 --> 00:17:29,519 that's the sort of it's kind of meta reading the book and especially realizing it's 230 00:17:29,559 --> 00:17:33,680 directed at children like Father Yersley was himself when he came across Colby. That's 231 00:17:33,759 --> 00:17:37,200 right, that this can be perhaps an introduction in the same way like Colby 232 00:17:37,319 --> 00:17:41,480 was for Jersey. Yes. Well, And it's funny because it actually occurred 233 00:17:41,480 --> 00:17:44,160 to me that there were very there were different ways that I could have structured 234 00:17:44,200 --> 00:17:48,359 the book, you know, and one way was, you know, starting 235 00:17:48,359 --> 00:17:52,480 with some of the earliest saints, like you know, Saint Margaret of Antioch 236 00:17:52,559 --> 00:17:56,200 and Saint Catherine of Alexandria, and then just going through Joan of arc who 237 00:17:56,240 --> 00:17:59,519 inspired Saint Chrez who's in the last chapter with Mother Teresa, and then going 238 00:17:59,519 --> 00:18:03,880 on to Mother Teresa because yes, you know, the final stories that are 239 00:18:03,920 --> 00:18:07,799 in here will be written in another book about inspiring the saints that we are 240 00:18:07,799 --> 00:18:11,839 going to see into the future. Yeah, that the inner peace I found 241 00:18:11,920 --> 00:18:17,880 very resonant in the chapter on Father Jersey and Maximilian Colby. And what do 242 00:18:17,920 --> 00:18:22,319 you think it was about Colby that we I mean, you're probably going to 243 00:18:22,359 --> 00:18:26,799 say the interpeace. Actually that makes sense, but that gave so much comfort 244 00:18:26,240 --> 00:18:32,680 to Father Jersey, and how can people be looking for that now? I 245 00:18:32,720 --> 00:18:37,000 just found that chapter be very moving and resonant. It's truth, you know, 246 00:18:37,160 --> 00:18:41,279 it's all truth. You know, YERSI was a courageous truth teller because 247 00:18:41,400 --> 00:18:45,920 he knew what he was doing was spreading truth to people who had been denied 248 00:18:47,000 --> 00:18:49,400 it. You know, these were people who were living under an atheistic government 249 00:18:51,839 --> 00:18:56,279 that was trying to just distort the reality that they should be loyal to a 250 00:18:56,359 --> 00:19:02,000 government before they are loyal to God. You know, we have rights as 251 00:19:02,119 --> 00:19:07,960 human beings made in the image and likeness of God that are foundational. Government 252 00:19:07,000 --> 00:19:11,759 cannot take away those rights. And it is not government that grants us those 253 00:19:11,880 --> 00:19:17,680 natural light rights. Those rights come from God. You's not so Protestant right 254 00:19:17,680 --> 00:19:26,160 now. Well, in response to that comment, I would like to point 255 00:19:26,200 --> 00:19:30,599 out that another I think another part of this book that I was actually very 256 00:19:30,680 --> 00:19:36,880 pleased to be able to highlight is that time and time again, the Catholic 257 00:19:36,960 --> 00:19:45,680 Church in response to socialism and communism and fascism and all of these other you 258 00:19:45,720 --> 00:19:51,119 know, new systems that emerge that are rooted in lies. Time and time 259 00:19:51,200 --> 00:19:56,839 again, the Church has made very bold statements bringing it all back to the 260 00:19:56,880 --> 00:20:00,119 truth that is written on our hearts. So is the truth that is written 261 00:20:00,119 --> 00:20:06,000 on our hearts. And that is why when Father Yergi was giving these homilies, 262 00:20:06,039 --> 00:20:10,599 and you know, twenty thousand people would show up to hear his homilies 263 00:20:10,680 --> 00:20:15,680 live, which is just so spectacular to me under communism. Under communism, 264 00:20:15,759 --> 00:20:18,599 including non Catholics, by the way, and non Catholics were interviewed and they 265 00:20:18,720 --> 00:20:23,720 would say, I came to hear the truth spoken unfiltered, and hearing the 266 00:20:23,839 --> 00:20:29,000 truth allowed me to recognize the lies, you know, by the way. 267 00:20:29,359 --> 00:20:33,440 One thing I want to point out, since he just mentioned Maximilian Colby, 268 00:20:33,599 --> 00:20:37,319 is Saint Maximilian Colby was this you know, media and was a media star. 269 00:20:37,519 --> 00:20:42,519 But he was this media entrepreneur, you know, and he had this 270 00:20:42,640 --> 00:20:48,799 wonderful newspaper called Knights of the Immaculata which reached reached a circulation of one million. 271 00:20:49,039 --> 00:20:55,960 God that printing press, which oh my, I'm having so much fun. 272 00:20:56,759 --> 00:21:02,799 But this was also an inspiration for Father Yergiet because twenty thousand people came 273 00:21:02,880 --> 00:21:08,279 to hear his homilies in person, but millions more actually got to listen to 274 00:21:08,359 --> 00:21:15,079 his messages because his friends would record his homilies and they would play them on 275 00:21:15,200 --> 00:21:19,079 Radio Free Europe, which would be broadcast throughout the Eastern Bloc and throughout the 276 00:21:19,119 --> 00:21:25,359 world. But they would also reprint his words in underground newspapers. So these 277 00:21:25,400 --> 00:21:30,119 were both men that understood the power of truth telling, you know, and 278 00:21:30,160 --> 00:21:34,160 that is something that in our culture today. You know, I have heard 279 00:21:34,359 --> 00:21:41,680 even well meaning Christians and well meaning Conservatives give young people the advice that they 280 00:21:41,680 --> 00:21:45,279 should keep their heads down, just get through school, just get the good 281 00:21:45,279 --> 00:21:51,400 grades. I cannot think of worse, more soul and endangering advice than to 282 00:21:51,400 --> 00:21:56,799 tell a young people to develop a habit of cowardice, because we develop these 283 00:21:56,799 --> 00:22:02,680 habits as young people, and a young person who chooses cowardice and tries to 284 00:22:02,759 --> 00:22:07,920 mask it as prudence is going to be an adult who is not going to 285 00:22:07,000 --> 00:22:11,799 make those hard decisions and are not is not going to be truthful in the 286 00:22:11,799 --> 00:22:15,799 world and spread truth the way that father Maximilian Colby did and the way that 287 00:22:15,880 --> 00:22:18,839 father and Yorg Poppy should go did. That's incredible. I haven't thought about 288 00:22:18,880 --> 00:22:22,480 that before. That's I feel very almost condemned right now. I don't know 289 00:22:22,519 --> 00:22:25,960 if I've given anyone that advice, but so you hear it. You do 290 00:22:26,039 --> 00:22:29,880 hear it all the time. It's everywhere. So actually, I'm so glad 291 00:22:29,880 --> 00:22:33,279 you mentioned that because the Catholic Church right now is playing a really fascinating role 292 00:22:33,759 --> 00:22:37,319 and something I wanted to talk to you about, which is this h some 293 00:22:37,400 --> 00:22:45,359 people in this this high tech world are more and more I guess in two 294 00:22:45,440 --> 00:22:52,319 camps. One is a camp where the supernatural seems totally uh silly, right 295 00:22:52,359 --> 00:22:56,359 like it's this is this is We've we've solved this, this is all foolish, 296 00:22:56,400 --> 00:23:00,640 et cetera, et cetera. On the other hand, the last time 297 00:23:00,839 --> 00:23:06,039 Raymond Roy was on the show, we were talking about the trad cath explosion 298 00:23:06,359 --> 00:23:11,119 in places like New York City, where there's almost an underground hipster edge to 299 00:23:12,079 --> 00:23:15,720 Latin mass for instance. And I think what you were just talking about, 300 00:23:15,720 --> 00:23:22,599 in terms of truth being more seductive than anything when you're living in a hostile 301 00:23:22,640 --> 00:23:29,319 culture, is completely fascinating, and it's an incredible recruitment tool for the Catholic 302 00:23:29,440 --> 00:23:36,559 Church, which has in so many ways remained unmoved esthetically, especially by the 303 00:23:36,640 --> 00:23:40,279 culture throughout the centuries. And I wanted to ask you about that because you 304 00:23:40,640 --> 00:23:44,680 write in a way when it comes to you were writing about our Lady of 305 00:23:44,680 --> 00:23:49,640 Guadalupe in the story of Saint Jose Luis Sanchez del Rio, really interesting chapter 306 00:23:49,839 --> 00:23:56,279 by the when Mexican Catholicism is fascinating no matter what, you don't have to 307 00:23:56,279 --> 00:24:00,039 do much to make it fascinating. But for children, the supernat is kind 308 00:24:00,039 --> 00:24:04,480 of obvious, right, like that's the child's mind. For adults right now, 309 00:24:04,799 --> 00:24:08,680 I think there are a lot of people for whom these stories are incredibly 310 00:24:08,759 --> 00:24:17,720 powerful because it's something that feels opposed to this high tech, anti truth world, 311 00:24:17,720 --> 00:24:19,640 and it feels different. Can you talk a little bit about that. 312 00:24:21,000 --> 00:24:25,319 It feels a little rebellious. Yes, it is. It is different. 313 00:24:25,799 --> 00:24:32,839 But you know, scientism has been really damaging to Christianity over the last several 314 00:24:33,000 --> 00:24:38,880 decades centuries. Actually, this idea that we can only know what we can 315 00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:48,400 prove through the scientific method is so obviously on its face false, And I 316 00:24:48,480 --> 00:24:55,759 think that what stories about the supernatural do. What attending a traditional Latin mass 317 00:24:56,799 --> 00:25:03,319 that feels very spiritual, that is very focused on this the spiritual realities that 318 00:25:03,440 --> 00:25:11,799 cannot be measured using only your eyesight, losing using scientific instruments. We know 319 00:25:12,039 --> 00:25:15,920 that there is more. It is intuitive, you know, even just looking 320 00:25:15,920 --> 00:25:21,920 at some of the most important issues that we debate on a day to day 321 00:25:21,920 --> 00:25:26,119 basis basis. You know, look at the issue of morality. You know, 322 00:25:26,359 --> 00:25:29,640 what is right, what is wrong? What is a virtue, what 323 00:25:29,759 --> 00:25:33,119 is advice? You know, these have been flipped on their head, but 324 00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:37,480 you can't use the scientific method to determine these things, and yet we are 325 00:25:37,519 --> 00:25:41,680 talking about them every single day. So I think what happens is when you 326 00:25:41,759 --> 00:25:45,880 start to encounter some of these stories, so for example, like our Lady 327 00:25:45,880 --> 00:25:55,599 of Guadalupe appearing to Saint Juan Diego, you know, you start to realize 328 00:25:55,680 --> 00:26:02,119 that, you know, there is something more that has driven history, you 329 00:26:02,160 --> 00:26:06,920 know, through the ages. And you look at the way that Mexico was 330 00:26:07,000 --> 00:26:15,079 converted almost immediately and almost completely after the appearance of our Lady of Guadalupe to 331 00:26:15,160 --> 00:26:21,599 Saint Juan Diego, and you realize that that these phenomena cannot be cannot be 332 00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:29,039 explained against purely by observation and purely through the scientific method. So what it 333 00:26:29,079 --> 00:26:33,160 does is it is it reveals a greater truth, a greater truth that we 334 00:26:33,200 --> 00:26:37,319 all know is there, we all sense is there, and it feels really 335 00:26:37,359 --> 00:26:42,079 good to admit it when embrace embrace it, Embrace it and admit it to 336 00:26:42,160 --> 00:26:48,759 people when when you know that they are going to be accusing you of being 337 00:26:48,799 --> 00:26:56,960 a simpleton and relying on your blind faith, but when you feel that you 338 00:26:56,039 --> 00:27:00,000 have discovered something that the rest of the world is turning a blind eye too. 339 00:27:02,279 --> 00:27:06,680 Some of them, I think purposefully. Others are just going along with 340 00:27:06,720 --> 00:27:11,880 the crowd right. Others just have not been in a position to be taught, 341 00:27:11,920 --> 00:27:15,240 I think, to be thinking through matters in a very sophisticated way. 342 00:27:15,240 --> 00:27:19,960 There's a lot of distraction in our world today. The kind of education that 343 00:27:21,000 --> 00:27:26,039 we are giving young people is one that does not cultivate a sense of wonder 344 00:27:26,400 --> 00:27:30,400 curiosity about the world. It is one that is designed to produce compliance, 345 00:27:30,400 --> 00:27:34,880 citizens who do what they are told. And so again, talking about these 346 00:27:34,920 --> 00:27:38,400 habits that you develop as a child, you know, the habit of asking 347 00:27:38,519 --> 00:27:45,279 questions and the habit of pursuing truth is one that you really need to cultivate 348 00:27:45,319 --> 00:27:51,960 as a very young age because what happens when you just give children the direction 349 00:27:52,240 --> 00:27:56,119 of get a good grade, go on to the next level, go to 350 00:27:56,160 --> 00:28:00,799 college, get a job, watch Netflix, spend and it's gracious. I 351 00:28:00,799 --> 00:28:04,319 don't know how many hours teenagers and young adults are spending on their phones these 352 00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:11,359 days. They're they're not reading stories like the stories in this book, and 353 00:28:11,400 --> 00:28:18,640 what it's doing is really just numbing them to this natural wonder that you know 354 00:28:18,880 --> 00:28:22,480 is in all of us that really needs to be cultivated. And just that 355 00:28:22,680 --> 00:28:27,119 the picture you just painted makes so much sense when you think of the story 356 00:28:27,119 --> 00:28:30,519 of for instance, Father, you're see why those people, some of those 357 00:28:30,519 --> 00:28:34,720 people would then in this very gray world, would then flock to hear him 358 00:28:34,799 --> 00:28:40,400 speak in the thousands, or would be tuning in the radio by the thousands, 359 00:28:40,480 --> 00:28:44,160 Because again, when you're in that kind of culture, there's something so 360 00:28:44,200 --> 00:28:48,000 intoxicating in the contrast either, you know, for some peoples just like well, 361 00:28:48,039 --> 00:28:52,720 this, this contrast with this the scientific world and the supernatural just obviously 362 00:28:52,799 --> 00:28:57,200 condemns the supernatural, makes the supernatural look crazy. For other people, the 363 00:28:57,279 --> 00:29:02,160 contrast pulls them to the side of true. I think because in young people, 364 00:29:02,359 --> 00:29:03,279 I want to ask you about this again, you spend a lot of 365 00:29:03,279 --> 00:29:07,599 time thinking about this. I have seen in the last five years, maybe 366 00:29:07,640 --> 00:29:14,920 since COVID. You know, when Little Nassas is out with Satan outward images 367 00:29:15,279 --> 00:29:19,920 of the demonic being romanticized and I think championed by people in popular culture in 368 00:29:19,920 --> 00:29:23,680 ways that we haven't seen quite so explicit for some time. A little bit 369 00:29:23,680 --> 00:29:33,279 of time that is converting people. That feels so real and the embrace of 370 00:29:33,319 --> 00:29:37,359 the ugly and the evil. I have seen young people react to that in 371 00:29:37,440 --> 00:29:42,119 ways that I would never have imagined. How So, it feels very obvious 372 00:29:42,240 --> 00:29:48,839 that something is something is very very wrong, that the culture has gone awry. 373 00:29:48,119 --> 00:29:52,799 And then it seems to me that people turn towards not everybody, but 374 00:29:52,839 --> 00:29:56,160 it seems to me there's a chunk of people that are living very secular lives 375 00:29:56,279 --> 00:30:00,960 and are sort of it's a it's a it's an alarm when you see something 376 00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:03,079 like that, it's an alarm that kind of shakes you out of it and 377 00:30:03,400 --> 00:30:07,440 pushes you to sort of reconsider everything. It's like the gateway. Well, 378 00:30:07,519 --> 00:30:12,319 we are physical beings and we are spiritual beings. And again, just because 379 00:30:12,400 --> 00:30:17,279 you can't see something again, to go back to the issue of morality, 380 00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:22,839 just because you can't see morality doesn't mean that morality does not exist. And 381 00:30:22,160 --> 00:30:30,000 just because you cannot see Satan and you can't see the demons working in the 382 00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:36,119 world, and you can't see God's angels working in the world, does not 383 00:30:36,359 --> 00:30:41,000 mean that they are not there. And I think that over the last few 384 00:30:41,079 --> 00:30:45,960 years there has been a greater appreciation for the spiritual aspect of our lives, 385 00:30:47,079 --> 00:30:51,680 the real spiritual aspect of our lives that is there every single day. We 386 00:30:51,759 --> 00:30:56,960 are spiritual beings, we are physical beings. And there has been a fascination 387 00:30:57,759 --> 00:31:03,000 with the devil on both sides, you know, both by those in secular 388 00:31:03,200 --> 00:31:11,119 society who I think are longing for, you know, a spirituality longing for 389 00:31:11,240 --> 00:31:15,359 purpose. You know, That's another thing is when you're seeking happiness but you're 390 00:31:15,359 --> 00:31:19,400 doing so through pleasure and you're not doing so through truth, You're still going 391 00:31:19,519 --> 00:31:22,480 to be there. There's something just in the human condition. You know, 392 00:31:22,599 --> 00:31:29,039 we are always looking for God. But when you're looking for God without an 393 00:31:29,119 --> 00:31:36,240 understanding of truth and goodness and beauty, you're going to be seeking and finding 394 00:31:36,279 --> 00:31:41,519 something that is going to feed something in you and that is going to give 395 00:31:41,559 --> 00:31:47,720 you some kind of of a purpose that maybe you're lacking. But it doesn't 396 00:31:47,759 --> 00:31:51,039 mean that it's good, you know, and it very much can be rooted 397 00:31:51,160 --> 00:31:55,240 in the supernatural and rooted in evil. But there's also been a fast fascination 398 00:31:55,279 --> 00:31:59,559 by the way, among Christians about evil in recent years. We've seen all 399 00:31:59,599 --> 00:32:06,039 sorts of movies and books and podcasts you know, taking off on you know, 400 00:32:06,079 --> 00:32:13,319 really exploring the demonic and the actions of the demonic and her everyday lives. 401 00:32:14,359 --> 00:32:17,039 And again, I think that this is a reaction to just this denial 402 00:32:17,200 --> 00:32:22,079 of reality that has always existed, and yet for a long time we pretended 403 00:32:22,160 --> 00:32:25,000 that if we can't see it and we can't measure it them, then it 404 00:32:25,039 --> 00:32:30,200 doesn't exist. You can't find purpose without truth, and there's no more obvious 405 00:32:30,240 --> 00:32:34,680 or gateway to truth than the supernatural. You know. It's something that completely 406 00:32:34,720 --> 00:32:39,680 makes everything else melt away. Interesting. Yeah, and you know, it's 407 00:32:39,680 --> 00:32:45,160 like you see it in astrology too, the secular interest in astrology, which 408 00:32:45,200 --> 00:32:51,480 is just exploding and taking off on TikTok. It's everywhere. The interest in 409 00:32:51,559 --> 00:32:53,720 astrology is like on another level. Right, it's interesting. I didn't know 410 00:32:53,839 --> 00:32:57,720 that. How do you know that about TikTok? Are you on TikTok? 411 00:32:57,759 --> 00:33:00,799 I'm not on TikTok. I promise you I'm not on TikTok, but I 412 00:33:00,799 --> 00:33:05,079 didn't want to disappoint camp really, but it is. I mean, there 413 00:33:05,079 --> 00:33:08,359 are some people have written pieces about it, but you can it's you see 414 00:33:08,359 --> 00:33:14,759 it everywhere too. I mean, there are totally normal podcasts influencers whoever they 415 00:33:14,759 --> 00:33:19,079 are, that seem they're very popular people. Whatever it is that they're constantly 416 00:33:19,119 --> 00:33:22,680 talking about astrology. The cultural interest in astrology is like taking off. And 417 00:33:22,799 --> 00:33:27,240 again, I think it is because when you live in this world which is 418 00:33:27,319 --> 00:33:30,960 telling you, is it making you miserable because you lack purpose. It feels 419 00:33:31,200 --> 00:33:35,559 like if you can connect with something outside of the world that you're in, 420 00:33:35,680 --> 00:33:37,960 which is which is feeding this, I can understand why that would be kind 421 00:33:37,960 --> 00:33:42,720 of intoxicating too. Yeah, that's interesting. I'm glad that you mentioned the 422 00:33:42,799 --> 00:33:51,599 influencers because I recently read that about the influence of pure influencers to teenagers. 423 00:33:51,720 --> 00:33:54,319 Now, my kids do not have smartphones, and they have gab phones, 424 00:33:54,519 --> 00:34:00,279 which are their dumb phones. I guess they're for kids and old people gap 425 00:34:00,319 --> 00:34:05,559 phone. So we have gab phones for our three teenagers and they can text 426 00:34:05,599 --> 00:34:09,280 on them and they can call people. They can even text photos. They 427 00:34:09,320 --> 00:34:14,039 can take pictures, but they do not have social media access. My kids 428 00:34:14,079 --> 00:34:20,119 do not have social media accounts and they don't have Internet access. That's yeah, 429 00:34:21,119 --> 00:34:24,360 it seems again so obvious, but I think growing up, so I 430 00:34:24,400 --> 00:34:28,880 was born in nineteen ninety three, and that seems completely obvious to me, 431 00:34:28,960 --> 00:34:30,960 but I think parents, it took a while there was a learning curve for 432 00:34:30,960 --> 00:34:37,079 people to realize exactly how evil and horrible some of this technology was well and 433 00:34:37,239 --> 00:34:44,000 how how influential the influencers are influencers are. Yeah, you know, that 434 00:34:44,119 --> 00:34:50,280 has been very jarring to me to discover that we have teenagers who you know, 435 00:34:50,440 --> 00:34:52,840 have parents who are living in the same home as their parents, who 436 00:34:52,840 --> 00:34:57,360 are going to school, who have teachers, who have coaches. But you 437 00:34:57,400 --> 00:35:02,239 know, the data is showing that who they're looking to to shape their ideas 438 00:35:02,280 --> 00:35:07,559 are people their own age who have large social media followings. You know. 439 00:35:07,639 --> 00:35:13,840 Again, I think that this is why focusing on heroes and passing down the 440 00:35:13,960 --> 00:35:19,079 stories of heroes are important, because everybody looks up to somebody, you know, 441 00:35:19,719 --> 00:35:23,400 and you know, we used to when we had stronger families, we 442 00:35:23,440 --> 00:35:28,559 would pass down the stories of our families through generations. And we would, 443 00:35:28,599 --> 00:35:32,559 you know, tell the stories of our great grandparents and they would be a 444 00:35:32,639 --> 00:35:37,840 part of our identity. And with the breakdown of the family, we've largely 445 00:35:37,880 --> 00:35:40,800 lost that. So, you know, kids are growing up in all sorts 446 00:35:40,840 --> 00:35:45,239 of different family situations. They're not having these stories passed down to them. 447 00:35:45,280 --> 00:35:50,519 They don't have religion, a lot of them are not going to church. 448 00:35:51,760 --> 00:35:57,599 But when you start to introduce some of the stories of some of the courageous 449 00:35:57,719 --> 00:36:02,519 people who have existed in history before us, it does give you somebody to 450 00:36:02,559 --> 00:36:07,519 look up to and somebody to start kind of comparing your life to theirs and 451 00:36:07,559 --> 00:36:12,360 how they dealt with the challenges, you know, how they navigated through the 452 00:36:12,400 --> 00:36:16,280 complexities of their worlds. Is the Church doing a good enough job promoting these 453 00:36:16,280 --> 00:36:21,760 stories? I think a much better job than we used to be. So 454 00:36:21,960 --> 00:36:27,400 there's been a really wonderful trend over the last few years in liturgical living. 455 00:36:27,480 --> 00:36:30,199 Is this something you're familiar with, so as you have some you know again 456 00:36:30,400 --> 00:36:34,280 Catholic influencers, but I know a lot of them have done, you know, 457 00:36:34,480 --> 00:36:40,039 a really wonderful and beautiful job for the church in highlighting wonderful feast days 458 00:36:40,199 --> 00:36:44,519 you can celebrate in your homes different ways that you can, you know, 459 00:36:44,559 --> 00:36:51,079 be bringing traditional Catholic music and cultural music into your homes to celebrate the lives 460 00:36:51,079 --> 00:36:54,440 of some of these saints. And it's been I think, really it's been 461 00:36:54,440 --> 00:36:57,920 a good thing for a lot of reasons. You know. For one, 462 00:36:58,039 --> 00:37:04,320 because the lives of the saints are so they are so inspirational, and they 463 00:37:04,360 --> 00:37:07,480 are a part of what it means to be Catholic to have these these stories 464 00:37:07,519 --> 00:37:10,840 before you. But it also it's just it's fun, you know, it's 465 00:37:10,880 --> 00:37:15,639 fun to build a culture in your home that is based on you know, 466 00:37:15,119 --> 00:37:22,199 excitement, you know, these wonderful stories and these amazing personalities you know of 467 00:37:22,400 --> 00:37:24,039 the people who have come before us. So I think it's been good for 468 00:37:24,079 --> 00:37:29,599 a lot of reasons. You know, we mentioned phones earlier, and some 469 00:37:29,679 --> 00:37:32,480 homes have gone completely digital. I've actually been in a lot of homes recently 470 00:37:32,840 --> 00:37:39,360 where there are no books. Have you experienced this? Go out West in 471 00:37:39,440 --> 00:37:44,000 California. There are a lot of homes without books because everything has gone digital 472 00:37:44,039 --> 00:37:49,400 now, and I think physical books are really important. So that's the other 473 00:37:49,440 --> 00:37:52,400 thing that you're probably realizing that I'm getting to now is the importance of a 474 00:37:52,400 --> 00:37:57,639 home library and having physical books that your kids can actually, you know, 475 00:37:57,679 --> 00:38:02,159 pop off the shelf look through. I hear that the Barnes and Noble that 476 00:38:02,519 --> 00:38:06,039 we just had here and rest and is coming back. Did you hear that? 477 00:38:06,079 --> 00:38:09,679 I didn't know, very exciting. We went to Amazon very very quickly, 478 00:38:09,920 --> 00:38:14,679 and where you just click a button and the book arrives. But we've 479 00:38:14,719 --> 00:38:17,639 lost that ability to take a book off the shelf and look through it. 480 00:38:19,159 --> 00:38:22,119 And whereas I think some bookstores are going to be returning because there's a desire 481 00:38:22,199 --> 00:38:25,239 for that, there's no reason that families can't do this on their own in 482 00:38:25,280 --> 00:38:29,599 their home, you know. And they should start collecting books for their kids, 483 00:38:30,119 --> 00:38:32,199 you know. Really, as soon as you're married, as soon as 484 00:38:32,239 --> 00:38:36,800 you start having children, you should start putting books on your bookshelves that your 485 00:38:36,840 --> 00:38:39,719 kids can take down and flip through and read a portion here, read a 486 00:38:39,719 --> 00:38:44,880 portion there, revisit it as they want to. I recently found a book 487 00:38:44,920 --> 00:38:46,000 that I had read, oh, I don't know, maybe ten years ago, 488 00:38:46,039 --> 00:38:50,119 and I was thinking about this one particular part of the book, and 489 00:38:50,159 --> 00:38:52,519 I was so happy that I find it on my bookshelf and be able to 490 00:38:52,559 --> 00:38:57,039 find the exact place in the book where it was, and I read before 491 00:38:57,039 --> 00:39:00,320 it, and I read after. I ended up sitting down and just finding 492 00:39:00,320 --> 00:39:02,679 myself because the second time you read a book is never the same as the 493 00:39:02,679 --> 00:39:06,320 first time you read it, because you have all those experiences that have happened 494 00:39:06,320 --> 00:39:10,079 in the meantime. So I think that's you know. There was another motivation 495 00:39:12,000 --> 00:39:17,840 for writing the book was to help families build a culture in their homes that 496 00:39:17,960 --> 00:39:23,400 includes a family library. I love that, and again, it's putting words 497 00:39:23,440 --> 00:39:29,599 to paper that it's enduring and nobody can change it. They can reprint another 498 00:39:29,679 --> 00:39:32,320 copy, but they can't change the original. They can destroy it physically if 499 00:39:32,360 --> 00:39:36,440 they want to. But when you I'm a pretty avid Kindle user, but 500 00:39:36,679 --> 00:39:38,639 I don't like it's not ideal. I try to buy as many hard copy 501 00:39:38,639 --> 00:39:44,079 books as I possibly can. Because you don't own a Kindle book, someone 502 00:39:44,079 --> 00:39:46,119 could. Let's say you get on the wrong side of Amazon, Kimberly and 503 00:39:46,360 --> 00:39:50,400 I have a Kindle download. They can wipe that off your device. The 504 00:39:50,440 --> 00:39:53,360 same thing with music, same thing with TV and movies. What is it 505 00:39:53,400 --> 00:39:58,000 about flipping through a book you think is particularly important for children? I wanted 506 00:39:58,000 --> 00:40:00,760 to ask you that question as you were talking because seems like there's something you 507 00:40:00,800 --> 00:40:05,599 think for kids about picking up of a physical copy of the book and then 508 00:40:05,639 --> 00:40:09,239 physically moving through the space of the book. That's important. You can flip 509 00:40:09,360 --> 00:40:13,840 back very easily, so I do this whenever I read. In fact, 510 00:40:13,920 --> 00:40:16,960 there's an index you probably noticed in the book. I was very very adamant 511 00:40:17,000 --> 00:40:22,599 that I wanted an index, and I was told that's great, if you 512 00:40:22,639 --> 00:40:25,480 can do the index yourself. It took me about a week to do the 513 00:40:25,519 --> 00:40:30,719 index. But I love indexes because inevitably I will get to a point in 514 00:40:30,760 --> 00:40:32,599 the book and I'll think, oh goodness, I want to go back to 515 00:40:32,639 --> 00:40:37,199 that part, and it is very easy then to go to the index and 516 00:40:37,239 --> 00:40:40,880 to find we know where a particular part of a book has a topic, 517 00:40:42,079 --> 00:40:45,519 or a person or a place has been mentioned. Because books are not meant 518 00:40:45,559 --> 00:40:49,400 to just be read in one sitting and then to be forgotten, you know. 519 00:40:50,119 --> 00:40:52,039 And I think when you read something on a kindle, it's just too 520 00:40:52,119 --> 00:40:55,280 hard. It's just too much work to go back and to try to find 521 00:40:55,840 --> 00:41:00,159 whatever it is that you've read before. There is something about actually flipping through. 522 00:41:00,280 --> 00:41:02,440 There's no sense of space on a kindle. There's no physical space right 523 00:41:02,559 --> 00:41:07,320 well, and the other things numbers that. I think beauty is important and 524 00:41:07,360 --> 00:41:12,960 books are beautiful. You know. I love hardcover books, and I was 525 00:41:13,039 --> 00:41:17,239 so pleased because Tan created this beautiful cover more the book, which I think 526 00:41:17,320 --> 00:41:22,039 is just absolutely beautiful at Saint john Vard looking up to the heavens, and 527 00:41:22,840 --> 00:41:29,559 I think actually having a book that is beautiful and sitting on a couch and 528 00:41:30,639 --> 00:41:34,039 just kind of flipping through the pages is just a wonderful way to spend an 529 00:41:34,039 --> 00:41:36,840 afternoon. Before we wrap, I want to return actually to the stories in 530 00:41:36,880 --> 00:41:42,000 the book with one question about the twentieth century. And obviously we've talked about 531 00:41:42,000 --> 00:41:45,280 communism and Father yoursy, We've talked about Saint Theresa a little bit. But 532 00:41:45,880 --> 00:41:53,880 the scientism then sort of communism, Nietzcheism of the twentieth century. How did 533 00:41:54,000 --> 00:41:59,199 that And I asked this question because I think it might resonate with people in 534 00:41:59,199 --> 00:42:05,599 twenty twenty three. How did that culture make them shape them to be such 535 00:42:05,599 --> 00:42:12,199 incredible leaders for the faith? Well, I think that anytime we are encountering 536 00:42:12,320 --> 00:42:16,360 dark times, you are going to see some of the brightest lights shining out 537 00:42:16,360 --> 00:42:22,079 there for truth. And I think that you know, all of the individuals 538 00:42:22,119 --> 00:42:27,719 who are in the book are those who had a very strong devotion to truth, 539 00:42:27,760 --> 00:42:30,840 devotion to the faith very early on, and so they had a very 540 00:42:30,960 --> 00:42:35,920 very strong sense of right and wrong and in the proper role, you know, 541 00:42:36,000 --> 00:42:42,719 especially the chapters that are about just very offensive, tyrannical governments, gross 542 00:42:42,760 --> 00:42:46,880 abuses of power, there's a very strong sense that the role of the government 543 00:42:49,119 --> 00:42:54,719 per Christianity through the ages is to protect the god given rights of individuals and 544 00:42:54,840 --> 00:42:59,840 families. And so I think a lot of it was a sense of justice 545 00:43:00,119 --> 00:43:06,519 on the part of the heroes in the book, because when they're confronted with 546 00:43:06,519 --> 00:43:12,800 with with such with such evil, and a real attempt by the powers that 547 00:43:12,840 --> 00:43:19,320 be to silence the truth tellers, you know, I think their their sense 548 00:43:19,320 --> 00:43:25,679 of purpose became all the more obvious. And there was such a you know, 549 00:43:25,760 --> 00:43:31,039 such a difference between what the authorities were doing and what the truth tellers 550 00:43:31,039 --> 00:43:36,440 were doing, and there was such a stark contrast that I think that you 551 00:43:36,440 --> 00:43:40,119 know, it did enable their message to really resonate with those around them. 552 00:43:40,360 --> 00:43:45,239 Okay, actually one more question. We are so isolated from death in our 553 00:43:45,239 --> 00:43:50,400 culture, especially children, thinking of the ways that affects children and that's a 554 00:43:50,480 --> 00:43:54,360 huge theme of this book, Martyrdom, the looming fear of death that actually 555 00:43:54,679 --> 00:44:00,440 sort of counterintuitively was because death was so much more present and prior cultures, 556 00:44:00,480 --> 00:44:07,239 before modern technology, there was sort of more more comfort with death maybe, 557 00:44:07,239 --> 00:44:08,880 And again it's it's kind of intuitive, and a lot of people have written 558 00:44:08,920 --> 00:44:13,599 whole books on this. But when you're when you're writing a book like this 559 00:44:13,679 --> 00:44:20,800 for children and the importance of life and death and heaven and earth is central 560 00:44:20,800 --> 00:44:28,119 to these stories, how on earth do you make that accessible and almost comforting 561 00:44:28,400 --> 00:44:31,079 to children in the way it needs to come through in these stories. Well, 562 00:44:31,239 --> 00:44:35,960 it is comforting, you know, you know, the idea that again 563 00:44:36,039 --> 00:44:39,679 we are we are made for a particular purpose, you know, to know 564 00:44:39,960 --> 00:44:45,119 and to love and to serve God and to do his will here on earth 565 00:44:45,159 --> 00:44:50,000 and then to spend eternity with Him in heaven. That's all part of the 566 00:44:50,039 --> 00:44:54,559 plan, you know. And when we don't talk about the death, and 567 00:44:55,239 --> 00:45:00,119 we don't talk about you know, the journey, you know, the divide 568 00:45:00,159 --> 00:45:04,639 between heaven and earth, and we don't talk about you know, as Catholics, 569 00:45:04,639 --> 00:45:07,480 we believe that there are saints in heaven who intercede for us that we 570 00:45:07,519 --> 00:45:15,159 can pray to who pray for us, to Christ. You know, when 571 00:45:15,320 --> 00:45:21,360 we leave that all out of the experience of childhood, that's very confusing, 572 00:45:21,719 --> 00:45:24,639 you know. I actually think it's more companying for a child to be more 573 00:45:24,679 --> 00:45:29,920 familiar with these stories of martyrtom and death, you know, and in crossing 574 00:45:29,960 --> 00:45:34,320 that divide, so that we know that the Saints are there to pray to 575 00:45:34,360 --> 00:45:37,199 them, and so that they can intercede for us and we can all be, 576 00:45:37,440 --> 00:45:44,159 you know, praying together to God, and that that there is more 577 00:45:44,159 --> 00:45:46,800 of a comfort in recognizing that all of that is true, that all of 578 00:45:46,840 --> 00:45:50,480 that is real, and that it all gives us purpose in our lives. 579 00:45:51,000 --> 00:45:54,400 Can really this was such a treat I hope the listeners now understand why I 580 00:45:54,440 --> 00:45:58,199 admire you as much as I do. This was wonderful. The book is 581 00:45:58,239 --> 00:46:01,639 wonderful again. It's called Unbreakable Saints who inspired Saints to moral courage, super 582 00:46:01,679 --> 00:46:06,280 readable. Whether you're an adult or your child, Congratulations on this book, 583 00:46:06,320 --> 00:46:09,599 Kimberly, Thank you. Emily Kimberly once again is a is the editor of 584 00:46:09,679 --> 00:46:15,119 Catholic School Playbook. She is also the project advisor for Run with Saints and 585 00:46:15,199 --> 00:46:20,039 a board member of Young America's Foundation, and again, go out get this 586 00:46:20,079 --> 00:46:22,719 book. You won't regret it. Great investment. I'm emilitacian skate culture editor 587 00:46:22,760 --> 00:46:27,159 here at the Federalist. You've been listening to another edition of The Federalist Radio 588 00:46:27,280 --> 00:46:30,719 Hour. We'll be back soon with more. Until then, be lovers of 589 00:46:30,760 --> 00:46:36,119 freedom and anxious for the fray.