WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.720 --> 00:00:06.240 Welcome to Wine Soundtrack USA. Listen to the passion with which producers narrate their 2 00:00:06.240 --> 00:00:11.519 winery and their world. In thirty answers discover their stories, personalities, and 3 00:00:11.640 --> 00:00:15.519 passions. Hello, friends and listeners of Wine Soundtrack. This is Alison Levine 4 00:00:15.599 --> 00:00:20.760 and today I am sitting in the beautiful Applegate Valley in the Rogue Valley in 5 00:00:20.960 --> 00:00:26.280 southern Oregon at Troon Vineyard. I have known Craig camp for a while, 6 00:00:26.359 --> 00:00:29.640 since back when he was in California, but he's been up here in Oregon 7 00:00:29.679 --> 00:00:34.520 for a while working at Troon Vineyard as the general manager, which is organically 8 00:00:34.520 --> 00:00:39.119 certified, biodynamically certified, regeneratively certified. I mean, they have got all 9 00:00:39.159 --> 00:00:43.039 the right certifications and I'm so excited to have Craig here today. So Craig, 10 00:00:43.119 --> 00:00:46.880 welcome to Wine Soundtrack. And aside from what I've said, give us 11 00:00:46.880 --> 00:00:50.759 a little overview about Troon. Well, Allison, it's great to be here 12 00:00:50.799 --> 00:00:54.320 with you today. We've known each other for a long time and takes a 13 00:00:54.320 --> 00:00:59.399 lot of wine together over the years and various bloggers conferences and things like that. 14 00:00:59.560 --> 00:01:03.879 So it's great to have you here at Troon. And in the springtime, 15 00:01:03.920 --> 00:01:08.560 it's a wonderful time to be in the applegate. So I'm over thirty 16 00:01:08.599 --> 00:01:14.599 five years in the fine wine business. I started off as an importer distributor, 17 00:01:14.719 --> 00:01:18.840 so I got in Chicago, so I got the hardball version of wine 18 00:01:18.879 --> 00:01:23.519 sales as a learning process, which was I think a really good place to 19 00:01:23.599 --> 00:01:27.200 start. And then we built up a very successful company called Direct Import One 20 00:01:27.239 --> 00:01:32.760 Company, and we sold that. My partner sold out first, and then 21 00:01:32.799 --> 00:01:37.319 I stayed for a few years. And then I had enough of the big 22 00:01:37.359 --> 00:01:42.560 wine company business that purchased us at the time and went to Italy and immersed 23 00:01:42.560 --> 00:01:48.319 myself in sellers in barbaras Co and Barolla for three years, and then spent 24 00:01:48.439 --> 00:01:51.599 time in the Wilholmette Valley and then doing Pin and No Ars. I went 25 00:01:51.599 --> 00:01:57.920 from Nebbiolo and Barbara to Pin and Nor and then down to Nepple Valley Cornerstone, 26 00:01:57.920 --> 00:02:04.400 where we met up in Ahall Mountain doing Cabernet Sovegno, and then finally 27 00:02:04.480 --> 00:02:07.919 made it over to back to Oregon. Back to Oregon, which is something 28 00:02:07.960 --> 00:02:10.280 I wanted to do. When I was in Wilhommett Valley, I was buying 29 00:02:10.319 --> 00:02:15.360 Sarah and Viner from Rogue Valley, and I just thought it was just an 30 00:02:15.360 --> 00:02:21.639 incredibly interesting area and it was a really a counterpoint to the NAPA experience, 31 00:02:21.719 --> 00:02:27.400 where things are there's less opportunities for experimentation. So tell us a little bit 32 00:02:27.400 --> 00:02:30.400 about Truon. So Trouon. The name Truon comes from Dick Troon, which 33 00:02:30.520 --> 00:02:36.000 was the farmer that first planeted grapes here in nineteen seventy two. So he 34 00:02:36.080 --> 00:02:38.719 was a pioneer. He's part of Oregon wine history, and so we kept 35 00:02:38.719 --> 00:02:45.840 that name to honor that history. And his daughters are still come to visit 36 00:02:45.919 --> 00:02:49.759 us. So it's a great experience. But you know, Dick was typical 37 00:02:49.840 --> 00:02:53.560 farmer of the area. He planet grapes because he thought it would be a 38 00:02:53.560 --> 00:02:57.360 better crop, a better commercial decision, not out of some you know, 39 00:02:57.919 --> 00:03:00.199 you know, having gone to Burgundy or whatever, fallen in love with wine. 40 00:03:00.360 --> 00:03:05.159 He just was a real farmer. And then it was sold. He 41 00:03:05.199 --> 00:03:09.000 sold it to another family, and then I came here in twenty sixteen, 42 00:03:09.599 --> 00:03:17.680 and then the new owners, doctor Brian and Denise White of Texas, purchased 43 00:03:17.680 --> 00:03:23.599 at twenty seventeen, and we started this voyage to biodynamics and re generator organics. 44 00:03:23.639 --> 00:03:27.840 Wow, and how many acres is the property, so we're one hundred 45 00:03:27.879 --> 00:03:31.479 acre farm, so about half of that is devoted to grape vines twenty varieties 46 00:03:31.560 --> 00:03:37.560 and fifty acres, and then the rest is as you would expect on a 47 00:03:37.560 --> 00:03:43.960 biodnemic farm, dedicated to biodiversity. So we have over three hundred French cider 48 00:03:43.960 --> 00:03:46.800 apple trees, so it'll be a cider out in a few years of Normandy 49 00:03:46.840 --> 00:03:53.719 style bottle fermented. We have sheep and chickens and dogs and wildlife as you 50 00:03:53.759 --> 00:04:01.479 heard last night. And then we have five acres of hay and about three 51 00:04:01.479 --> 00:04:08.560 acres of vegetable gardens and food forest for our farm stand and to selling to 52 00:04:08.680 --> 00:04:12.280 local restaurants. I love that. And of course you get your manure from 53 00:04:12.319 --> 00:04:15.279 the dairy next door. Yes, yes, sir. This is the ultimate 54 00:04:15.399 --> 00:04:19.399 good karma, because we need a lot of manure, far more than we 55 00:04:19.480 --> 00:04:25.959 could produce ourselves with the kind of number of cattle that we could sustain here. 56 00:04:26.319 --> 00:04:29.600 So we have a noble dairy which is our next door neighbor, with 57 00:04:29.839 --> 00:04:33.079 several thousand head of organic cattle. We've been organic since two thousand and four, 58 00:04:33.639 --> 00:04:38.680 so we are able to just pick up the phone and call Sharon Noble 59 00:04:38.920 --> 00:04:46.560 and the manure starts arriving. So it's a great symbiotic relationship because, as 60 00:04:46.600 --> 00:04:50.480 you know, dairy farmers are struggling and for them it's another profit stream and 61 00:04:50.560 --> 00:04:56.079 for us it's an unbelievable asset. Wow. So you said that you have 62 00:04:56.120 --> 00:05:00.120 twenty different varieties, can you name them? Oh? Geez off the time 63 00:05:00.000 --> 00:05:08.759 I had, well, your Southern French inspired yes, So when when when 64 00:05:08.800 --> 00:05:11.560 I first came here. What we did is we brought in a company called 65 00:05:11.600 --> 00:05:16.879 the Vineyard Soil Technologies out of NAPA, and we dug seventy five foot deep 66 00:05:17.079 --> 00:05:23.040 soil pits seventy seventy throughout the property, and we had a couple of PhDs 67 00:05:23.120 --> 00:05:27.759 here for a week up to their chins and holes and did this this you 68 00:05:27.759 --> 00:05:31.439 know, complete soil analysis. Where it came back it looks like the you 69 00:05:31.439 --> 00:05:33.480 know, it looks like the Bible. You know, it's about that thick, 70 00:05:33.839 --> 00:05:36.800 and we kind of treated it like that, I guess. So we 71 00:05:36.839 --> 00:05:42.759 took that information along with our own experience and weather data and really decided that 72 00:05:43.120 --> 00:05:46.639 these Southern French varieties were ideal for the Applegate Valley. So we have kind 73 00:05:46.639 --> 00:05:51.279 of the complete range where we're doing almost all of the chatannu varieties, at 74 00:05:51.360 --> 00:05:56.000 least all the famous ones, the really obscure ones we can't get. And 75 00:05:56.079 --> 00:06:01.720 then and then from from southwest we have great and not so you know, 76 00:06:01.920 --> 00:06:04.279 but a lot of Serrah, a lot of more Vedra, a lot of 77 00:06:04.319 --> 00:06:10.800 grenache, and and then a lot of Marsan, Roussan and vigne. Those 78 00:06:10.800 --> 00:06:15.839 will be the predominant varieties. But Vermentino is actually our our largest planted white 79 00:06:15.920 --> 00:06:19.519 variety, which of course the French called roll right exactly. I hear lots 80 00:06:19.519 --> 00:06:23.560 of white makers say that Vermontino is the future. Well, you know, 81 00:06:23.600 --> 00:06:26.160 it's it's a one, it's a it's a it's a dream variety. It's 82 00:06:26.199 --> 00:06:30.160 wonderful department. It's absolutely you know, it's a it's a plant that likes 83 00:06:30.160 --> 00:06:33.720 to go grapes. It's very resilient, it maintains acidity, and it's and 84 00:06:34.680 --> 00:06:39.319 if you fire it properly, it's a very complex wine, as you see 85 00:06:39.399 --> 00:06:43.000 often from the winds of Sardinia and Corsica that these are. You know, 86 00:06:43.120 --> 00:06:46.560 there's also many lighthearted Vermonino's out there, you know, along the coast, 87 00:06:46.639 --> 00:06:50.639 for the r Frito Misto on the coast and liguria. But what we do, 88 00:06:50.720 --> 00:06:55.000 well, you know what we're doing here is more in that richer uh 89 00:06:55.079 --> 00:06:59.759 Sardinia and Corsican style and what's your total case production? So right now we 90 00:06:59.839 --> 00:07:03.720 have well we had to go through a replant because we had red blotch virus 91 00:07:04.079 --> 00:07:10.040 throughout the vineyard. And when you have weakened vines, that that leads to 92 00:07:10.199 --> 00:07:14.560 every other kind of trunk disease coming in. You know, the students from 93 00:07:14.560 --> 00:07:15.680 Oregon State would come down here, they'd love it because they could pull up 94 00:07:15.759 --> 00:07:18.480 vine and see like a dozen different diseases. You know, it's like perfect 95 00:07:18.480 --> 00:07:21.560 for them. So but you know, so obviously that the negative of that 96 00:07:21.680 --> 00:07:27.439 is that it's incredibly expensive and time consuming to replant a vineyard. The positive, 97 00:07:27.519 --> 00:07:30.639 of course, is that we get to plant exactly what we want, 98 00:07:30.800 --> 00:07:33.319 where we want it, and how we want it. So we were able 99 00:07:33.360 --> 00:07:39.439 to select the varieties we want, the rootstocks we want, and plant them 100 00:07:39.480 --> 00:07:43.920 biodynamically from the beginning. So you know that that has been an exciting When 101 00:07:44.000 --> 00:07:47.000 was that replanting So we just finished last year. It was it was a 102 00:07:47.040 --> 00:07:53.639 six year process. So so so going back to the original question of how 103 00:07:53.720 --> 00:07:56.720 much wine did it make Right now, we're making about six thousand cases, 104 00:07:56.759 --> 00:08:00.680 but eventually, as all these vineyards come back into production, be about twelve 105 00:08:00.720 --> 00:08:05.399 thousand cases of wine in about two thousand cases of cider. Nice. And 106 00:08:05.560 --> 00:08:09.519 where are your wines available? What markets? We are available in most major 107 00:08:09.560 --> 00:08:18.079 cities, in markets in the United States and three Canadian provinces. You're not 108 00:08:18.079 --> 00:08:22.000 going to find us at the big grocery stores and the big box stores, 109 00:08:22.040 --> 00:08:26.319 but you can find us at you know, wine shops and wine bars and 110 00:08:26.360 --> 00:08:31.720 things like that people that are looking for naturally crafted wines. So what is 111 00:08:31.759 --> 00:08:37.960 your first memory relevant to wine? Ah? Okay, So when I was 112 00:08:37.000 --> 00:08:41.679 in college, well, I grew up in Harvard, Illinois, and you 113 00:08:41.720 --> 00:08:46.000 know, dairy farmers and things like that, and wine was not a part 114 00:08:46.120 --> 00:08:50.000 of my life at all. I never never saw any wine. So when 115 00:08:50.080 --> 00:08:56.200 I was in college, I went and studied quote unquote for a semester in 116 00:08:56.240 --> 00:09:01.960 Austria and then hitchhiked around Europe for the rest of the summer. Spend a 117 00:09:03.000 --> 00:09:07.120 lot of time in France, and I think the first wine I remember was 118 00:09:09.320 --> 00:09:13.480 at a wine bar in Strasbourg and Alsus and it was just an edelsecker, 119 00:09:13.559 --> 00:09:18.240 you know, just a just the house blend and I just really really appealed 120 00:09:18.240 --> 00:09:22.399 to me. And and and then traveling around France, we would go to 121 00:09:22.440 --> 00:09:26.440 go to the store and you would buy wine based on the alcohol level, 122 00:09:26.159 --> 00:09:30.360 you know, because the higher, the more expensive it was, you know, 123 00:09:30.399 --> 00:09:33.480 so we weren't finding the most expensive. But these were the days of 124 00:09:33.519 --> 00:09:35.919 hippies. So we would go to the park around the Eiffel Tower, and 125 00:09:35.960 --> 00:09:39.000 if you had a bottle of wine, you could sit down with people and 126 00:09:39.039 --> 00:09:41.159 somebody would have some meat, somebody would have some cheese and things, and 127 00:09:41.279 --> 00:09:46.000 you have this kind of communal meal. So I came back from that that 128 00:09:46.120 --> 00:09:50.919 time in Europe and feeling incredibly sophisticated, like, you know, I'm really 129 00:09:50.960 --> 00:09:54.679 on top of the room. And I went to a wine store and realized 130 00:09:54.720 --> 00:09:58.639 I didn't know anything. So I bought the like a lot of people at 131 00:09:58.639 --> 00:10:01.679 the time, Alexis bes Buloff's Signal Book of Wine. I read it and 132 00:10:01.679 --> 00:10:07.320 then I was just down the rabbit hole after that. So once you knew 133 00:10:07.320 --> 00:10:11.039 a little bit more about wine, is there one of those memorable wines that 134 00:10:11.159 --> 00:10:13.720 was one of those aha moments. I'm sure you've had a few over the 135 00:10:13.799 --> 00:10:16.879 years, but is there one that stands out? Yeah, I think I 136 00:10:16.879 --> 00:10:18.639 think there is is. Going back when I was first getting into wine, 137 00:10:18.840 --> 00:10:22.279 a good friend of mine, Don Clemens, was in the wine business and 138 00:10:22.360 --> 00:10:28.679 he was representing the company that imported Shapoutier, and he was having to cookout 139 00:10:28.679 --> 00:10:31.159 and a hand a bottle of Shapootier tavel Rose, and I'm just like, 140 00:10:31.320 --> 00:10:35.759 wow, this is like something else, and it just kind of really up 141 00:10:35.759 --> 00:10:39.200 the fact it could be something more than just this beverage and things like that. 142 00:10:39.240 --> 00:10:41.879 And then you know, like then after that, and there was just 143 00:10:41.159 --> 00:10:46.039 terrible after that. You know. I was a journalist at the time, 144 00:10:46.080 --> 00:10:50.080 and about two years later I was in the wine business. I mean, 145 00:10:50.120 --> 00:10:54.799 I don't know, at least as a As a in the wine business, 146 00:10:54.799 --> 00:10:58.840 you got to drink more good wine. So if we were to come to 147 00:10:58.919 --> 00:11:01.879 your home today, what kind of wines would we find in your home? 148 00:11:01.919 --> 00:11:05.240 Are you drinking mostly organ wines? Are you drinking wines from around the world. 149 00:11:05.240 --> 00:11:07.679 Are you drinking only your own wines not your own wines? Well, 150 00:11:07.799 --> 00:11:11.960 I have to be honest, I don't drink our own wines a lot at 151 00:11:11.960 --> 00:11:16.759 home because it's it's too emotional. So I think sometimes because like I wonder 152 00:11:16.799 --> 00:11:18.120 if we should have picked that a little earlier, this or that. You 153 00:11:18.120 --> 00:11:22.519 know, there's always critical there's always this this, like you're you're digging, 154 00:11:22.080 --> 00:11:28.159 and you know it's too digging into the nitty gritty too much all the time. 155 00:11:28.639 --> 00:11:35.559 So at home I tend to try it's a pretty diverse range of wines. 156 00:11:35.639 --> 00:11:41.000 I have to that they're mostly Italian and French because living down here in 157 00:11:41.000 --> 00:11:45.039 southern Oregon, there's not a lot of great wine shops, so I tend 158 00:11:45.080 --> 00:11:50.399 to order most of my wine online. I belong to the very narrow range 159 00:11:50.399 --> 00:11:54.840 of wine clubs, but the main one is Kermit Lynch, So I buy 160 00:11:54.960 --> 00:11:58.360 a lot of wine from Kermit Lynch, and as a wine club member, 161 00:11:58.360 --> 00:12:01.759 they give these wonderful discounts every few times a year, and I stuck up. 162 00:12:01.799 --> 00:12:07.840 But I so I'm drinking a lot of profans Bourgelat and then you know, 163 00:12:07.000 --> 00:12:11.159 from Italy, a lot of Chetto and Barbara and things like that, 164 00:12:11.200 --> 00:12:15.960 because because you know, I think at home, especially you know during the 165 00:12:15.960 --> 00:12:18.919 week, it's it's really lighter meals and things like that. So I like 166 00:12:18.000 --> 00:12:22.159 lighter pressure wines and I'm a bit of an acid junkie. So you know, 167 00:12:22.440 --> 00:12:26.440 like the I understand the usually usual win ge thing, you know, 168 00:12:26.440 --> 00:12:28.720 where I want recently and all those things. You know, So, is 169 00:12:28.720 --> 00:12:33.080 there a wine that you opened up recently that drank really well, something from 170 00:12:33.120 --> 00:12:35.840 your cellar or maybe you were out to dinner. Well, I'm fortunately, 171 00:12:37.759 --> 00:12:43.519 over the years to have focused on trying to keep ongoing collection of certain Burrel 172 00:12:43.600 --> 00:12:48.759 and Barbarasco's that I worked at and were friends of mine. I really like 173 00:12:48.919 --> 00:12:52.320 to drink the wines of people I know there's a story there, there's a 174 00:12:52.320 --> 00:12:56.120 story there, and you know there's a personal connection and things like that. 175 00:12:56.440 --> 00:13:03.000 So a lot of from from Burl and Barbarusco, Marcarini from Memora and then 176 00:13:03.080 --> 00:13:07.000 Poderi Cola really favorites. I have wines going back to the nineties from them 177 00:13:07.480 --> 00:13:15.279 and the vat pre Luca leaving and everything. I loved his wines. These 178 00:13:15.320 --> 00:13:18.759 are all people that I worked with or involved in and Sotiomano and barbar Usco. 179 00:13:20.039 --> 00:13:22.240 Nice. Did you open any recently? Well, you know, I 180 00:13:24.519 --> 00:13:28.440 tend to open those older bottles here with the team because it's it's like this 181 00:13:28.600 --> 00:13:31.720 is like, you know, open up with wine geeks. You know, 182 00:13:31.919 --> 00:13:37.080 they're really into it so so usually we always finished harvest, I'll make a 183 00:13:37.519 --> 00:13:43.879 risotto coci and opened up some old simes. So we opened up I happened 184 00:13:43.960 --> 00:13:50.679 up in ninety eight Marcarini Lomora Brnante last year. That really stuck out in 185 00:13:50.759 --> 00:13:54.120 my mind. Nice. Nice, So you work with a lot of different 186 00:13:54.120 --> 00:13:56.840 grapes. Over the years, you've worked with a lot of different grapes. 187 00:13:56.879 --> 00:14:03.399 You've kind of covered every every rein of France at some point. I'm curious 188 00:14:03.440 --> 00:14:07.159 if you think there's a such thing as a perfect variety. Well, I 189 00:14:07.159 --> 00:14:09.279 think it's a perfect variety for a place. I don't think there's a perfect 190 00:14:09.360 --> 00:14:16.159 variety as an individual. Great variety. You know, obviously Pean and r 191 00:14:16.320 --> 00:14:20.399 Sharen they do pretty well in Burgundy and Walmet Valley. I'm a big fan 192 00:14:20.480 --> 00:14:24.440 of Wamet Valley, Pean and Noir. I belonged to those other two of 193 00:14:24.480 --> 00:14:26.320 the other clubs I've belonged to our Brick House and Crystal. I'm really big 194 00:14:26.360 --> 00:14:30.960 fans of their wines. And Tony Soder, you know, old friend of 195 00:14:30.960 --> 00:14:35.240 mine. So I really love love those wines. But going you know, 196 00:14:35.879 --> 00:14:39.759 again, it's more where it's grown and what you're eating to me that makes 197 00:14:39.919 --> 00:14:45.519 the wine great. So you know you're having a pizza earlier, we were 198 00:14:45.519 --> 00:14:48.039 talked about it earlier. You know, a carbonic masceration wine could be the 199 00:14:48.080 --> 00:14:50.799 best wine in the world for it. But well, I'm going to jump 200 00:14:50.840 --> 00:14:54.919 ahead then, since you're on that topic, how do you approach pairing wine 201 00:14:54.919 --> 00:14:58.240 and food? You said, like during the week, you like you eat 202 00:14:58.320 --> 00:15:01.039 lighter, so you like a lot of lighter wine. Is that the rule 203 00:15:01.120 --> 00:15:05.399 you follow? Are the rules you'll follow? Are there guidelines or is it 204 00:15:07.399 --> 00:15:11.759 the red wine and you know, meat and white wine and fish? Like, 205 00:15:11.200 --> 00:15:13.639 how do you approach it? And how would you suggest other people do 206 00:15:13.720 --> 00:15:18.360 that? I'm not very rigid, I have to admit I find very few 207 00:15:18.399 --> 00:15:22.159 times it's like really really good food and really really good wine where it's a 208 00:15:22.159 --> 00:15:28.440 miserable experience. You know, you know honestly, but I think you know 209 00:15:28.559 --> 00:15:35.440 you want to me. I want complimentary matches, not you know, I'm 210 00:15:35.519 --> 00:15:41.879 not a big fan of high alcohol, big bombastic wines because I think you 211 00:15:43.039 --> 00:15:46.200 lose the nuance of the wine itself, but also it overwhelms the food you're 212 00:15:46.200 --> 00:15:50.440 having them with. Now I get it. You know you're going to a 213 00:15:50.480 --> 00:15:54.559 big steakhouse and having a giant sixty four ounce thing, you probably want a 214 00:15:54.559 --> 00:15:58.480 bigger wine. But even then I would lean towards something with acidity because I 215 00:15:58.519 --> 00:16:02.120 want that acidity to cut the fat and so forth. So I think, 216 00:16:02.240 --> 00:16:06.960 you know, you know, what I look for in wine is balance, 217 00:16:07.840 --> 00:16:11.440 uh, And that's what I look for in food. So I like them 218 00:16:11.440 --> 00:16:17.399 to balance together. So the wine should ultimately be refreshing, yes, part 219 00:16:17.399 --> 00:16:21.559 of part of the meal. So so you were you started out as a 220 00:16:21.639 --> 00:16:25.559 journalist and what did you write about? Well, I was on the news 221 00:16:25.559 --> 00:16:30.320 side of things. I was a photojournalist and uh primarily, but then they 222 00:16:30.399 --> 00:16:33.919 also, uh, my first job out of college was at the Kanka Key 223 00:16:34.039 --> 00:16:37.759 Daily Journal, and they also said, oh, you do the food section 224 00:16:37.840 --> 00:16:42.879 too. So okay, so you've you've been a critic a reviewer of some 225 00:16:42.919 --> 00:16:45.200 point, and you said, when you drink your own wine, you get 226 00:16:45.200 --> 00:16:48.320 a little critical and questioning should we have done this? So I'm curious when 227 00:16:48.360 --> 00:16:52.799 it comes to critiques and things like that. What's your opinion online critics and 228 00:16:52.840 --> 00:16:59.159 scores? Well, I think the most important thing with scores is that the 229 00:16:59.200 --> 00:17:03.039 critic is consumed stunt you know, you know, it was like back in 230 00:17:03.039 --> 00:17:04.680 the days of Robert Parker, you know, when that was, when he 231 00:17:04.720 --> 00:17:07.359 was doing the reviewing. That was a big deal. When he gave a 232 00:17:07.400 --> 00:17:11.559 wine a high score. I knew exactly what that meant. Often it meant 233 00:17:11.559 --> 00:17:14.680 I didn't like that wine. But I knew exactly what he what he meant, 234 00:17:14.799 --> 00:17:18.200 which means that he was a good critic because he was consistent. He 235 00:17:18.279 --> 00:17:22.920 was consistent, so he communicated that effectively, and and and the same to 236 00:17:22.960 --> 00:17:25.359 the people that actually liked those wines. You know, that was that was 237 00:17:25.359 --> 00:17:27.799 effective. So I think you have to look at, you know, each 238 00:17:27.880 --> 00:17:33.519 critic separately because obviously we're humans. Learn we're imperfect. We're not machines imperfect, 239 00:17:33.680 --> 00:17:40.200 you know, we're imperfect tasting devices that are our palettes changed daily depending 240 00:17:40.240 --> 00:17:45.200 on mood and amidity and and the wine you just had before and what you're 241 00:17:45.240 --> 00:17:49.519 eating it with. So I think that that the consistency is the most essential 242 00:17:49.559 --> 00:17:56.119 aspect of a good critic. But I actually think, you know, I 243 00:17:56.160 --> 00:17:59.440 always there's the critics, none there's the wine writers. And as you know 244 00:18:00.039 --> 00:18:03.839 from my experience, I always lean towards the wine writers because I think the 245 00:18:03.920 --> 00:18:10.440 story, you know, is as important as as any score could be, 246 00:18:10.440 --> 00:18:15.039 because if the story and the reason and the way it's farmed is in alignment 247 00:18:15.160 --> 00:18:18.799 with what you believe, you're also going to probably enjoy that wine more. 248 00:18:18.000 --> 00:18:21.960 Right. There's a context to it all. Yeah, there's a context, 249 00:18:22.119 --> 00:18:26.039 especially you know in a smaller farm like ours. You know, this is 250 00:18:26.079 --> 00:18:29.160 a this is a it's a real statement what we're doing. These are Everything 251 00:18:29.240 --> 00:18:33.640 is intentional, you know, we're not just kind of the wines change every 252 00:18:33.720 --> 00:18:37.400 year based on what mother nature decides they're going to be. You know, 253 00:18:37.519 --> 00:18:41.319 like in this replant we we we may say, okay, we've planted this 254 00:18:41.440 --> 00:18:44.839 block with grenache and we think this is going to be read. Well, 255 00:18:45.160 --> 00:18:48.839 it could very well decide that it's going to be rose, and we have 256 00:18:48.880 --> 00:18:52.759 to be open to that. So it's it's being you know. So I 257 00:18:52.799 --> 00:18:56.400 think that that's that's the story. I think there's a certainly a place for 258 00:18:56.839 --> 00:19:00.880 critics. Yeah, and as because there's just so much wine out there. 259 00:19:02.319 --> 00:19:04.160 But you know, I always go back. We can go back to Robert 260 00:19:04.240 --> 00:19:08.359 Parker because he was so famous so years ago. If you read his notes, 261 00:19:08.759 --> 00:19:15.400 they are often not they different from the score. You know, if 262 00:19:15.440 --> 00:19:18.279 you actually read the note, you say, oh, well, at this 263 00:19:18.319 --> 00:19:19.799 one, I would like it may have been an eighty seven point wine, 264 00:19:19.799 --> 00:19:23.759 but it sounds that's Oh that's what I want, you know, So I 265 00:19:23.799 --> 00:19:27.640 think I think it's it's the ability to communicate that's important. So if you 266 00:19:27.640 --> 00:19:33.680 can communicate effectively with points, I think that's reasonable. But as long as 267 00:19:33.680 --> 00:19:37.960 you're consistent. So your ninety seven point wine tell actually tastes like that a 268 00:19:37.960 --> 00:19:42.960 certain style all the time, right, absolutely, So for somebody who hasn't 269 00:19:42.960 --> 00:19:45.839 had true vineyard wines yet, what do you think they're missing out on? 270 00:19:45.880 --> 00:19:48.440 I mean, I know you've hit on this a little bit about you know, 271 00:19:48.599 --> 00:19:53.039 place, but what do you think someone is missing out on? Well, 272 00:19:53.079 --> 00:19:56.839 it's a unique place we are, and that's why I wanted to come 273 00:19:56.880 --> 00:20:03.680 here. And what attracted me is we're in this transitional zone between you know, 274 00:20:03.720 --> 00:20:11.480 we're are cooler and wetter than northern California, but drier and warmer the 275 00:20:11.559 --> 00:20:15.720 Lama Valley. So it's a very distinct growing region where we're very close to 276 00:20:15.759 --> 00:20:19.440 the ocean, we're in the mountains, we're at about fourteen hundred feet right 277 00:20:19.480 --> 00:20:23.039 here, and we're in the valley. So it gives you an idea you 278 00:20:23.079 --> 00:20:29.160 know, most most like I think the Hull Mountain ABA starts at fourteen hundred 279 00:20:29.160 --> 00:20:32.039 and you're up in the mountain at this point. But here we're actually in 280 00:20:32.039 --> 00:20:34.960 the valley and we're at fourteen hundred. So so you know, this combination 281 00:20:36.079 --> 00:20:40.359 of unique weather patterns along with the fact that we're in the Siski Mountains, 282 00:20:40.440 --> 00:20:45.640 not the you know, not in the Volcanic Ranges, is that these are 283 00:20:45.759 --> 00:20:48.960 ancient, ancient soils. These mountains were probably formed in about volcanoes over by 284 00:20:49.079 --> 00:20:55.920 Japan and then jammed up against the coast over billions of years ago. That's 285 00:20:55.960 --> 00:21:03.559 amazing, And so you get a this decomposed grantite, this unique weather pattern 286 00:21:03.200 --> 00:21:08.359 that creates a distinctive style. And also because as where we are on the 287 00:21:08.400 --> 00:21:12.440 map, you know, combined with the altitude, so we get it's a 288 00:21:12.480 --> 00:21:18.519 compacted growing season because of the altitude and because as far north as we are, 289 00:21:18.640 --> 00:21:21.480 so the days, you know, the season is shorter, but during 290 00:21:21.480 --> 00:21:23.839 the growing season, our days are much longer and we don't get any fog 291 00:21:25.279 --> 00:21:30.119 like they do, say in Sonoma. So the vines basically go into photosynthesis 292 00:21:30.319 --> 00:21:33.799 immediately in the morning and then go really really long through the day. That's 293 00:21:33.799 --> 00:21:40.359 why we can ripen these varieties successfully here. But then in hivest this season 294 00:21:40.359 --> 00:21:45.960 in October, for these reds, the days get extremely short and the night's 295 00:21:45.960 --> 00:21:48.480 extremely cold. I've been out there in the twenties, you know, in 296 00:21:48.519 --> 00:21:53.240 the morning. So what that allows us to do is is, you know, 297 00:21:53.279 --> 00:21:57.319 the days get short, so photosynthesis comes to a crawl, so sugar 298 00:21:57.359 --> 00:22:03.640 accumulation almost stops, but the phenolic ripening continues, so we can let the 299 00:22:03.680 --> 00:22:10.920 grape hang on the vine, let those tannins and everything round out ripen up 300 00:22:11.559 --> 00:22:17.440 without alcohol going up too high or without loose, and without losing acidity. 301 00:22:17.839 --> 00:22:25.440 So the applegate style is wines with moderate alcohol and higher acidity. So space 302 00:22:25.599 --> 00:22:27.599 aliens were to land on your property today, which of your wines would you 303 00:22:27.599 --> 00:22:30.519 want to say, welcome to Troon? Which one is out of this world? 304 00:22:30.839 --> 00:22:36.839 That's a question. Yeah, I don't know, Yeah, you know 305 00:22:37.119 --> 00:22:41.160 it's I would I would say sat because because I think that the Sri is 306 00:22:41.400 --> 00:22:47.039 like the ideal variety for this this area, because it buds a little later, 307 00:22:47.160 --> 00:22:49.640 which is good for frost, and ripens early, which is also good 308 00:22:49.640 --> 00:22:52.680 for frosts. And then they, you know, they say that you know, 309 00:22:52.759 --> 00:22:57.160 Surras and optimist and Granash is a pessimist. So the Graza is going, 310 00:22:57.240 --> 00:23:00.359 yeah, everything's going to be great. I'll keep growing and you know, 311 00:23:00.480 --> 00:23:07.759 so it's but you know, here we get I think connections with French 312 00:23:07.799 --> 00:23:11.880 wine are always a bit tenuous, but I'll connect it to Northern Ruin like 313 00:23:11.000 --> 00:23:15.759 a coat of tease style, where you get a Surrah with with higher acidity, 314 00:23:15.960 --> 00:23:22.839 lower alcohols like thirteen five for us is probably great maximum velocity and you 315 00:23:22.960 --> 00:23:26.359 get this. So when you when you have that moderate alcohol in the higher 316 00:23:26.400 --> 00:23:30.640 a cidity, you get these the characteristics of true sirah. So you get 317 00:23:30.640 --> 00:23:34.319 the white pepper, the black pepper, the leather, the you know, 318 00:23:34.400 --> 00:23:41.000 the the umami type aromatics instead of when you get the higher alcohol and these 319 00:23:41.079 --> 00:23:45.880 fifteen fifteen five sarajs, you get this kind of jammy sweet, which I'm 320 00:23:47.000 --> 00:23:48.160 yeah, you know that. Maybe a lot of people love that, but 321 00:23:48.240 --> 00:23:52.359 that's not what we want to make. And that's why I would making Surah 322 00:23:52.359 --> 00:23:55.119 here. So I would say our Surahs out of this world. Yeah, 323 00:23:55.279 --> 00:23:59.079 I like that. I like that. So you as a wine drinker, 324 00:23:59.559 --> 00:24:06.519 redwood rose orange, well, you know that's that's the again, you know, 325 00:24:06.519 --> 00:24:08.039 it's always what you're doing. I think orange is like the ultimate of 326 00:24:08.079 --> 00:24:11.319 paratife. To me, I would use it like a I do with you 327 00:24:11.319 --> 00:24:15.599 know, people with pinochet, I would use in the same situation, you 328 00:24:15.599 --> 00:24:18.079 know, tapus and things like that. But I think, like most wine 329 00:24:18.440 --> 00:24:22.599 people, I'm on the red wine side of things, just the but I 330 00:24:22.599 --> 00:24:30.720 would sorely hate a world without white and rose still are sparkling probably still, 331 00:24:30.960 --> 00:24:33.799 I mean, I love sparkling wine. We all love champagne, you know, 332 00:24:33.160 --> 00:24:37.559 And I mean, but I mean, just you know, as far 333 00:24:37.640 --> 00:24:41.839 as as as what what I consume wine, I do with a meal, 334 00:24:41.279 --> 00:24:48.400 and that's my major connection. So I think of of of red still wine. 335 00:24:48.039 --> 00:24:52.640 So you know, we're we're on a property here that is very in 336 00:24:52.720 --> 00:24:56.920 tune with nature. It has I mean, to look out in the vineyard 337 00:24:56.920 --> 00:25:00.839 and see the flowers that are growing, to see the you know, everything 338 00:25:00.880 --> 00:25:03.559 after, to hear the animals. I mean, you clearly are one with 339 00:25:03.680 --> 00:25:08.079 nature and with all your certifications. So I'm curious in all your experience and 340 00:25:08.359 --> 00:25:11.759 working different places. We know every vintage tells a different story. You make 341 00:25:11.799 --> 00:25:17.079 wines that express these years, but do you see more commonality from your year 342 00:25:17.160 --> 00:25:22.000 do you see big variation? What does a vintage here in the Rogue Valley 343 00:25:22.000 --> 00:25:23.960 tell you? And maybe because of your experience in other places in comparison to 344 00:25:25.000 --> 00:25:30.880 other places you've worked, well, there's always vintage variation. I mean people 345 00:25:32.160 --> 00:25:36.200 in my time and nap out of ten years there there was dramatic vintage variations. 346 00:25:38.480 --> 00:25:45.119 It depends if you try to overwhelm those with your winemaking technique. It's 347 00:25:45.160 --> 00:25:56.079 pretty easy to overwhelm a vintage character with technology. And also in a climate 348 00:25:56.160 --> 00:26:00.480 like California where you basically can pick as late as you want. You've got 349 00:26:00.559 --> 00:26:04.519 this gigantic rightning window at least, and lots of parts of it obviously on 350 00:26:04.559 --> 00:26:10.359 the coastal areas you don't other places. But uh uh, you know that 351 00:26:10.359 --> 00:26:14.000 that gives you the opportunity to to just keep it going and then get it. 352 00:26:14.000 --> 00:26:17.240 Gives you this consistent style. But you know, I mean, if 353 00:26:17.279 --> 00:26:22.079 you watch how they make wines, that the bigger operations, that's it's a 354 00:26:22.440 --> 00:26:26.759 that's an industrial concept. You know, you're you take in this product from 355 00:26:26.799 --> 00:26:32.680 the vineyard and you analyze it and then you start adding stuff. So you 356 00:26:33.079 --> 00:26:36.319 the first thing, the last thing they want is vintage variation, and with 357 00:26:36.839 --> 00:26:41.000 modern technology it's pretty easy to overwhelm that and to smooth it all loud. 358 00:26:41.720 --> 00:26:48.640 So what we're trying to do is to express that we actually want that difference. 359 00:26:48.079 --> 00:26:52.240 Also, obviously, as a biodenamic winery, we don't really have any 360 00:26:52.240 --> 00:26:55.799 options. You know, there isn't really anything you can do to it. 361 00:26:56.400 --> 00:27:00.000 Uh So it's it's a mindset. There's a I think there's two parts of 362 00:27:00.039 --> 00:27:04.440 the wine business. There's the beverage alcohol side, where they're trying to make 363 00:27:04.480 --> 00:27:07.839 a consistent product and you see the executive as they bounce back and forth between 364 00:27:07.880 --> 00:27:14.079 Coca Cola and the giant wine corporations because they're selling this beverage. And then 365 00:27:14.119 --> 00:27:18.759 there's there's there's artists and wine makers that are trying to express a place and 366 00:27:18.799 --> 00:27:22.599 a variety, and it's they're really different products. So it's really hard to 367 00:27:22.960 --> 00:27:30.400 compare them because they're different. Are there any signs or predictors that you look 368 00:27:30.440 --> 00:27:33.599 for that will tell you what a vintage is going to give you? Yeah, 369 00:27:33.880 --> 00:27:37.160 so certainly, you know, as you go through the year, there's 370 00:27:37.440 --> 00:27:45.119 lots of indicators and as people think about the ynamics, we actually do include 371 00:27:45.160 --> 00:27:48.759 science and the process. So really you're not just running through the vineyards naked. 372 00:27:48.400 --> 00:27:52.640 Yeah, So we actually go out and take measurements and so you we 373 00:27:53.079 --> 00:27:59.599 have an idea where everything is going, and you know that changes your decision 374 00:27:59.640 --> 00:28:04.640 through the through the season where a line those grapes may be destined for. 375 00:28:06.279 --> 00:28:08.359 So you may have thought you were going to make a big red out of 376 00:28:08.359 --> 00:28:11.079 this block, but then you change it to I'm going to make a carbonic 377 00:28:11.119 --> 00:28:15.440 wine out of it, or a rose or something like that based on what 378 00:28:15.480 --> 00:28:18.839 that season is doing. So it's you have you have, you have to 379 00:28:18.920 --> 00:28:25.359 let it tell you what it's going to be and then actually listen. Speaking 380 00:28:25.359 --> 00:28:29.759 of listening, walking through the vineyards, you talk to your vines. Do 381 00:28:29.799 --> 00:28:33.119 you listen to them or do you talk to them or talk at them? 382 00:28:33.680 --> 00:28:37.559 Uh? I don't talk out loud to them, Are you sure? Yes? 383 00:28:37.839 --> 00:28:41.839 Well, I don't think I have to. I think that you know 384 00:28:42.079 --> 00:28:45.720 that it's all It's all that we I mean, our whole point a by 385 00:28:45.759 --> 00:28:49.079 dynamics is that it's this natural system. We're trying to build up a natural 386 00:28:49.119 --> 00:28:52.880 system. So you got the natural system of the soil. You have a 387 00:28:52.960 --> 00:28:56.359 natural system in the soil, you have a natural system in the vine, 388 00:28:56.640 --> 00:29:00.200 and you have a natural interaction with it as the humans, and then then 389 00:29:00.240 --> 00:29:04.440 you're all that's how you communicate with each other. So we're communicating to the 390 00:29:04.519 --> 00:29:11.599 vines through the help that we give them in the soil. So I don't 391 00:29:11.799 --> 00:29:15.599 know, I don't talk to them person. They're not named. You don't 392 00:29:15.599 --> 00:29:21.599 have to reprimand them because they're so happy because they're they're living in their perfect 393 00:29:21.640 --> 00:29:30.440 world, their own biomes of exactly flies and birds and bees and flowers and 394 00:29:30.519 --> 00:29:33.079 everything they need to thrive. You were saying that at the end of a 395 00:29:33.119 --> 00:29:37.960 harvest, you always open up one of your burrellas and Buberisco's and you make 396 00:29:37.960 --> 00:29:41.839 dinner. Do you have any rituals that you do at the start of the 397 00:29:41.880 --> 00:29:45.960 harvest for either yourself or for your team? Lastly, maybe more than one. 398 00:29:48.920 --> 00:29:52.720 Well, we do. Well. One of the fun parts of harvest 399 00:29:52.759 --> 00:29:56.160 every year is the intern's coming in. And you know, we have two 400 00:29:56.240 --> 00:29:59.960 or three interns a year that come from all over the world, you know, 401 00:30:00.240 --> 00:30:03.960 and uh uh, so I would say that our our opening intern dinner 402 00:30:04.079 --> 00:30:07.559 is kind of the the kickoff because they arrived just a little you know, 403 00:30:07.640 --> 00:30:14.319 time before harvest starts. And so that's our our celebratory event. Uh. 404 00:30:14.359 --> 00:30:18.839 And we will open some nice wines also for that and it's a fun place 405 00:30:18.880 --> 00:30:25.440 to hang out, just opening a lot of good wines and uh and and 406 00:30:25.440 --> 00:30:30.200 and of course you know we like to open a bottle of Bubbly Uh. 407 00:30:30.359 --> 00:30:33.559 I like to open uh. Last few years we've opened Iron Horse, which 408 00:30:33.640 --> 00:30:37.960 is joy Sterling is a close spread of mind for many many years. And 409 00:30:37.039 --> 00:30:41.440 so I like to include her and her wine gets served at State Department dinners 410 00:30:41.480 --> 00:30:45.880 and it gets served at true Yeah. Yeah, So so we'll do that 411 00:30:45.079 --> 00:30:48.359 and and I mean that's but there's you know, we open a bottle or 412 00:30:48.440 --> 00:30:53.000 two for twenty something people, so you know, but that I really think 413 00:30:53.039 --> 00:30:57.799 that the experience of harvest is our harvest meals. You know that we'll put 414 00:30:57.839 --> 00:31:02.240 together at the end of the day for the team, and you know, 415 00:31:02.319 --> 00:31:04.519 everybody will chip in, you know, bring interesting bottles and things like that 416 00:31:04.559 --> 00:31:08.720 and talk through and then it's it's so we're see we're different here. So 417 00:31:08.759 --> 00:31:12.920 if you're like in Napa, or we'll have a value where it's basically a 418 00:31:12.960 --> 00:31:17.799 couple of varieties and they're all ripening at once. We have twenty varieties and 419 00:31:17.880 --> 00:31:21.440 so our harvest is long. It's because they all ripen at different times, 420 00:31:21.759 --> 00:31:26.000 so maybe six weeks long. And so so it's it's it's it's it's a 421 00:31:26.000 --> 00:31:27.400 different experience. You know, when I was in well, I'm at Valley, 422 00:31:27.400 --> 00:31:30.640 you know, Pino, It's like, okay, here you go, 423 00:31:30.279 --> 00:31:34.920 and it's all coming, you know, the next two weeks. So it's 424 00:31:34.960 --> 00:31:38.160 that's a very different experience than how we do it. So it's you don't 425 00:31:38.240 --> 00:31:44.440 necessarily have that kind of intense two week period where you're working eighteen hours a 426 00:31:44.519 --> 00:31:49.440 day. It's more spread out, which I think creates a different social interaction 427 00:31:49.559 --> 00:31:55.319 between the team. Absolutely. So with such long harvests and such like that, 428 00:31:55.839 --> 00:31:57.480 when do you get any free time? And if you get free time, 429 00:31:57.519 --> 00:32:00.240 what do you like to do in your free time? Yes, we 430 00:32:00.279 --> 00:32:04.079 do get free time to a harvest, I say, because we get those 431 00:32:04.119 --> 00:32:07.960 breaks. I think everybody tries to stay a little quiet in those days, 432 00:32:07.000 --> 00:32:09.200 to tell you the truth, and you know, it's a good day. 433 00:32:09.279 --> 00:32:13.559 I'll remind my wife that I'm around, you know, during and come home 434 00:32:13.599 --> 00:32:17.079 for a few days. But you know, it's you know, we don't 435 00:32:17.079 --> 00:32:22.640 have it's not a big staff here, so It's not like there aren't other 436 00:32:22.720 --> 00:32:24.359 things to do, right, But when you're not at work, what do 437 00:32:24.400 --> 00:32:28.799 you like to do? Or do you just work all the time? Oh 438 00:32:29.119 --> 00:32:31.200 yeah, it's a it's a small team and you work all the time. 439 00:32:31.319 --> 00:32:35.160 We work all the time. I love to cook. I mean this to 440 00:32:35.200 --> 00:32:38.880 me is that that would be one of my pleasures is to spend the day 441 00:32:39.039 --> 00:32:45.960 cooking something. Probably a time hungry. So if you were planning a romantic 442 00:32:46.039 --> 00:32:50.640 evening for you and your wife, what sort of wines get opened to set 443 00:32:50.680 --> 00:32:54.440 the mood different from just an average night. A really good bottle of champagne. 444 00:32:54.519 --> 00:32:59.559 She looks bubbles. So in the end, it's always champagne. Yes, 445 00:32:59.720 --> 00:33:01.160 right, right, So going back to that other question you had, 446 00:33:01.319 --> 00:33:05.400 it still comes to me, can't you can't avoid the champagne? You know? 447 00:33:05.440 --> 00:33:07.240 That's right. It may not. You may want still over sparkling, 448 00:33:07.279 --> 00:33:12.720 but you cannot eliminate the sparkling. That's that's correct, that's correct. So 449 00:33:12.720 --> 00:33:16.440 so so when you look back at your career or in life, you know, 450 00:33:16.440 --> 00:33:20.799 we're given advice from by a lot of people, from our parents, 451 00:33:21.000 --> 00:33:25.559 teachers, mentors, friends. Is there a piece of advice that you got 452 00:33:25.599 --> 00:33:29.640 somewhere along the way that is something you try to live or work by. 453 00:33:30.079 --> 00:33:37.319 I think it's not a single piece of advice, but but a philosophy and 454 00:33:37.799 --> 00:33:40.200 I think, you know, so for me, I would say my main 455 00:33:40.640 --> 00:33:46.160 mentors in the wine business were Becky Wasserman, Neil Mson, Neilan, Marie 456 00:33:46.200 --> 00:33:52.480 Aamson, and Christopher Cannon. Those are the people I started working with as 457 00:33:52.480 --> 00:34:00.680 an importer, and they their love of authentic uh terrowa driven relines really uh 458 00:34:01.440 --> 00:34:07.519 gave me the base of my education at philosophy traveling with them in Europe. 459 00:34:07.519 --> 00:34:12.719 One of my favorite memories when I was just getting into the wine business was 460 00:34:12.760 --> 00:34:16.880 spending three weeks with Neil Empson on the road in Italy, going from the 461 00:34:16.960 --> 00:34:22.400 state to a state and then coming back year after year to those states. 462 00:34:22.960 --> 00:34:27.119 So so would I would say those people like that. Then then in the 463 00:34:27.199 --> 00:34:30.840 United States, Uh, you know Tony Soder I met him when he was 464 00:34:30.880 --> 00:34:36.239 at Spotswood and we would meet in a very sleepy uh young Philip those days 465 00:34:36.440 --> 00:34:42.239 and uh open mines and talk about wines and Kathy corson the same thing. 466 00:34:42.320 --> 00:34:46.639 Josh Jensen, Clara Richard Sandford. Yeah, but these were you know, 467 00:34:46.639 --> 00:34:51.400 when I met them. They weren't big names, normal people they were they 468 00:34:51.400 --> 00:34:53.920 were just starting out and getting going. But I mean I was. It 469 00:34:54.000 --> 00:34:59.760 was a fabulous time to to get connected to wine. So I would say 470 00:35:00.079 --> 00:35:02.599 to say, you know, I'm leaving out all sorts of people burying Audrey 471 00:35:02.599 --> 00:35:07.360 Sterling pioneers and things like that, and on Fred Fisher Fisher pen years there's 472 00:35:07.400 --> 00:35:13.239 a long list of them. Wow. So with all these amazing people were 473 00:35:13.239 --> 00:35:15.480 sitting at a table, your wines around the table, and you have a 474 00:35:15.480 --> 00:35:17.519 seat next to you. If there was anyone from any walk of life living 475 00:35:17.599 --> 00:35:21.719 or deceased that you could share a bottle of tron Line with, who would 476 00:35:21.760 --> 00:35:24.400 it be? Ah? Well, that's easy and a sad answer. My 477 00:35:24.480 --> 00:35:30.400 father died very young, and now that I'm much older than he was when 478 00:35:30.400 --> 00:35:32.960 he died, I realized how young he was. So he was just sixty 479 00:35:34.000 --> 00:35:37.360 four of his died and I was in his thirties. So he never saw 480 00:35:37.559 --> 00:35:39.079 any of this aspects of my life, just the beginning of it. So 481 00:35:39.119 --> 00:35:43.880 I would definitely want to share with him. I love that when you look 482 00:35:43.920 --> 00:35:46.920 back at your career, what would you say is one of your proudest achievements 483 00:35:46.920 --> 00:35:52.039 to date? The biodynamic certification here at Truon. I think that was to 484 00:35:52.079 --> 00:36:00.079 take a property that had been farmed conventionally and has so much potential and within 485 00:36:00.159 --> 00:36:06.840 three years getting a biodynamic certification. I think that was I'm very proud of 486 00:36:06.840 --> 00:36:10.960 that accomplishment. I love that. And of course you're regenerative now, and 487 00:36:12.000 --> 00:36:15.880 you're the only winery in organ that's regenerative, and you were the second winery 488 00:36:15.880 --> 00:36:19.360 in the US to be regenerative. Is that correct? Okay, so we 489 00:36:19.480 --> 00:36:22.320 are the we were the first in organ and we are still the only one 490 00:36:22.320 --> 00:36:29.239 in organ that's both domative Demeter bonamic and reginative organic certified. But we are 491 00:36:29.519 --> 00:36:32.239 we were the second winery in the world to be reginative organic certific world, 492 00:36:32.960 --> 00:36:37.760 and we are one of four farms of any kind in the world to be 493 00:36:37.840 --> 00:36:43.360 reginative Organic gold certified, which means that you're you've been certified in all three 494 00:36:43.360 --> 00:36:49.079 pillars, which include the farming, agriculture, the human the social aspects, 495 00:36:49.119 --> 00:36:52.400 and the animal welfare. So when you're drinking wine, this is what you 496 00:36:52.440 --> 00:36:57.880 want to drink. You want to drink a wine that understands everything, Earth, 497 00:36:58.360 --> 00:37:00.760 the people, everything. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, if you 498 00:37:00.760 --> 00:37:04.440 look at that, like the wines I was mentioning before, you know, 499 00:37:05.000 --> 00:37:10.880 here in Oregon crystal and brickhouse and soda, and then in Europe, you 500 00:37:10.920 --> 00:37:14.840 know, you know, I think of like Macarini is always one of my 501 00:37:15.280 --> 00:37:19.039 favorites, and Lemura and they have this just beautiful you know, they were 502 00:37:19.079 --> 00:37:21.679 farming organically. They didn't even know it, you know, they just kept 503 00:37:21.760 --> 00:37:27.320 going that way and they just make wines that are so authentic and a place 504 00:37:27.480 --> 00:37:31.920 Sotimano and Barbarisco has a wonderful story. They were able to purchase in one 505 00:37:31.960 --> 00:37:37.199 of the equiple Grand Crew. They were added to their property and the vines 506 00:37:37.400 --> 00:37:43.519 were fifteen years old, so they were eligible to be Barbresco already, but 507 00:37:43.639 --> 00:37:45.280 they didn't think they were. You know, they spent a fortune for this, 508 00:37:45.440 --> 00:37:49.480 you know, this is to buy this property. They but they wanted 509 00:37:49.480 --> 00:37:52.760 to wait until they were in their twenties before they put it into Barbarisco. 510 00:37:52.239 --> 00:37:59.119 So they just sold it as Nebuolo Dalva, which is so non American, 511 00:37:59.199 --> 00:38:00.920 a new world, you know, but that kind of thing, you know, 512 00:38:00.960 --> 00:38:07.079 that kind of connection and everything is really amazing, so complete. This 513 00:38:07.119 --> 00:38:12.519 sentence for me, a table without wine is like breakfast, but you don't 514 00:38:12.519 --> 00:38:21.079 have one at breakfast. I'm a coffee person with as someone who is so 515 00:38:21.199 --> 00:38:25.039 in tune with the environment as part of your farming practices and how this winery 516 00:38:25.119 --> 00:38:30.480 runs. We know climate change is an issue. We we hear it, 517 00:38:30.519 --> 00:38:35.159 we know it, we live it. You think we'll still be making wine 518 00:38:35.159 --> 00:38:38.079 in three hundred years, five hundred years, Well that may be above my 519 00:38:38.159 --> 00:38:45.880 pay grade. But yeah, I mean, you know, assuming the best. 520 00:38:46.679 --> 00:38:50.320 Yeah, and maybe in different places, and it may be with different 521 00:38:50.400 --> 00:38:59.039 varieties. You know, the whole propagation plonal propagation is really cut down with 522 00:38:59.119 --> 00:39:04.400 the genetic diverse city. Uh uh in wine grapes is uh. I know 523 00:39:04.440 --> 00:39:07.480 you're involved in a project that goes beyond the kind of the basic seven. 524 00:39:07.559 --> 00:39:13.639 Whatever they do is so uh Uh. I think we're going to have to 525 00:39:13.639 --> 00:39:17.599 look at different varieties in different places. Uh you know, one hundred years 526 00:39:17.599 --> 00:39:21.360 from now is maybe? You know, while I'm a value to be great 527 00:39:21.400 --> 00:39:24.320 Cabernet territory, it's hard to say. And you know in the Saskatchewan growing 528 00:39:24.760 --> 00:39:30.639 ginere so but I mean, I you know who knows the thing is it's 529 00:39:30.679 --> 00:39:35.400 our responsibility. I mean, this is part of our our our project and 530 00:39:35.400 --> 00:39:39.519 and and the reason we get the certifications is that we want other people to 531 00:39:39.559 --> 00:39:44.119 farm this way. So we're trying to communicate that you can run a business, 532 00:39:45.239 --> 00:39:52.280 uh it's environmentally responsible, still make incredibly high quality product and and and 533 00:39:52.400 --> 00:39:55.159 be financially viable. So that's what you have to do. You know, 534 00:39:55.280 --> 00:40:00.960 we have to change the way people are are are living other No, we 535 00:40:00.079 --> 00:40:06.000 won't be Yeah. Well, remember those aliens that first came to your property, 536 00:40:06.119 --> 00:40:07.360 that you shared a wine with, They're going to take you home with 537 00:40:07.400 --> 00:40:10.599 them. And if you could, if you were going with them, what 538 00:40:10.719 --> 00:40:14.719 three bottles of wine or what three wines would you want to take with you 539 00:40:15.159 --> 00:40:20.280 to enjoy? Any three wines? It can be your own or not your 540 00:40:20.280 --> 00:40:22.760 own. Well, I'll go back to the wines I have said in my 541 00:40:22.760 --> 00:40:27.079 claw right now, I really don't want to leave for that. So I 542 00:40:28.320 --> 00:40:34.920 a ninety eight Macarini Bernante, a two thousand biondi Sante Bernola, the month 543 00:40:35.039 --> 00:40:39.239 Chino, and by the third one, I don't think I will say a 544 00:40:39.320 --> 00:40:45.039 ninety four Bodera Cola Barola. I love it. You you have it down 545 00:40:45.039 --> 00:40:49.159 to the vintage. Yeah, well, I don't have a lot of those 546 00:40:49.159 --> 00:40:53.960 bottles left, so it's it's not hard to remember them. Most people are 547 00:40:54.039 --> 00:40:57.480 like, well, i'd have a grower champagne. This that you're like, 548 00:40:57.639 --> 00:41:00.360 no, I wanted twenty twenty two, nineteen eighty four. I know, 549 00:41:00.480 --> 00:41:04.000 I know those bottles are there, and I know I wanted to consume. 550 00:41:06.440 --> 00:41:08.519 I love it. Well, Okreig, It's time for us to play our 551 00:41:08.559 --> 00:41:13.159 little game. Now. It's about pairing wine with music. You know, 552 00:41:13.199 --> 00:41:16.960 we know that wine and music go hand in hand. Wine makes us feel 553 00:41:17.000 --> 00:41:22.280 something music does. So looking at your wines, I want you to tell 554 00:41:22.280 --> 00:41:27.880 me either a genre or a specific song that best expresses the wine that we 555 00:41:27.960 --> 00:41:37.039 have. So I'm most fascinated by your Glauglau, your glue glu glub club 556 00:41:37.079 --> 00:41:39.480 for music. Since we're on the West Coast and I make wine on the 557 00:41:39.519 --> 00:41:44.519 West Coast, let's go to West Coast Jazz and say Dave Brubeck, Uh, 558 00:41:44.880 --> 00:41:49.599 you know his hit the background rhythms based on classical music that he used 559 00:41:49.880 --> 00:41:53.639 made for really complex music. But then the light lifted. Uh. You 560 00:41:53.679 --> 00:41:58.519 know Paul Desmond on Sacks. You know he called Paul Desmond. It was 561 00:41:58.519 --> 00:42:01.000 always the sound of a dry Martinez. It's the sound sound of an applegate 562 00:42:01.039 --> 00:42:07.000 valley and the glove glub is is the glue glub is what exactly is that 563 00:42:07.199 --> 00:42:13.400 glulue is? It's this French slang for gulpable glug glug wine and it's a 564 00:42:13.519 --> 00:42:16.639 carbonic masceration. Why don't we make so it's like nuva bogelo we make every 565 00:42:16.719 --> 00:42:21.599 year in one tank and it's like, uh, chill it down, gulp 566 00:42:21.639 --> 00:42:24.039 it down in the summertime, have fun and uh that's it. So it's 567 00:42:24.159 --> 00:42:30.440 very very lighthearted and fun, which I like a lot. So what about 568 00:42:30.480 --> 00:42:34.320 your negrete, Well, i'll tell you when we actually you know that we 569 00:42:34.400 --> 00:42:37.599 put a little bit into Uh, we just harved this a little bit, 570 00:42:37.639 --> 00:42:40.079 so we haven't really gotten it out yet, so i'll let you know we 571 00:42:40.400 --> 00:42:45.679 we have, it has not told us where it's going moved. Well, 572 00:42:45.760 --> 00:42:50.039 I think that's one of our more exciting wies right now that I would put 573 00:42:50.079 --> 00:42:55.639 it is the forum d the uh it's so that's uh aged for ten months 574 00:42:55.760 --> 00:43:01.039 in clay form, and I really like the texturization you get from the clay 575 00:43:01.039 --> 00:43:05.920 and concrete. It changes the textures on the palate and the aromatics and I 576 00:43:05.960 --> 00:43:08.440 really like it a lot. So it's I think it's a really exciting one. 577 00:43:08.760 --> 00:43:13.599 And there's more of it sitting in Bora aging right now. And the 578 00:43:13.920 --> 00:43:20.079 and the music, the music for that, Let's go uh uh something more 579 00:43:20.199 --> 00:43:23.199 like chopin Nocturns or something like that, you know, very uplifted, bright 580 00:43:23.800 --> 00:43:31.440 and little dreamy. What about your Vermintino or role Ah, okay, uh, 581 00:43:31.760 --> 00:43:36.800 let's uh, let's make that a little more. Uh that that's definitely 582 00:43:37.360 --> 00:43:45.320 crisper and fresher. So let's go to uh Coltrane and uh uh, you 583 00:43:45.360 --> 00:43:51.960 know, something that is more fun, upbeat. And then of course the 584 00:43:51.960 --> 00:43:59.400 wine you would give to the aliens that wonderful surrah. Yes, well that 585 00:43:59.400 --> 00:44:05.719 that you know, that's boy, that's that's you know again again, I 586 00:44:05.719 --> 00:44:09.719 guess I would lean towards, uh, that's a little more operatic, So 587 00:44:09.920 --> 00:44:15.039 I would lean towards something from most Figaro or something like that. I think, 588 00:44:15.079 --> 00:44:20.800 something just a little because it's it's fun but serious at the same time. 589 00:44:21.800 --> 00:44:25.000 Good job, you did it. We're done, so Craig, I 590 00:44:25.039 --> 00:44:30.679 have one last question. It's a two parter. The first part is what 591 00:44:30.920 --> 00:44:34.639 wine region in this world is at the top of your bucket list to explore? 592 00:44:34.679 --> 00:44:37.239 Where do you want to where do you want to go? I'd never 593 00:44:37.280 --> 00:44:39.079 been to New Zealand. I'd really like to go to New Zealand. I 594 00:44:39.119 --> 00:44:44.840 mean it looks just I love the wines, I like the attitude, and 595 00:44:45.199 --> 00:44:47.760 the photos look great. I've been to Australia, I've been to Europe many 596 00:44:47.800 --> 00:44:52.400 many times. Every wine region in Europe, and that one that appeals to 597 00:44:52.440 --> 00:44:55.440 New Zealand appeals to me. Well, you should head to New Zealand. 598 00:44:55.519 --> 00:45:00.440 But if somebody wants to come here to Troon and visit, how can they 599 00:45:00.480 --> 00:45:04.400 find you? What can they do? Where do they find you? Tell 600 00:45:04.480 --> 00:45:07.480 us? How do they get here? Well, the easiest way to find 601 00:45:07.559 --> 00:45:12.440 us, of course is our website Truan Vineyard dot com, where we break 602 00:45:12.480 --> 00:45:15.920 down. We have our tasting room here and at in the Applegate Valley at 603 00:45:15.960 --> 00:45:20.039 the winery, and we're open every day. But we also have a tasting 604 00:45:20.119 --> 00:45:25.079 room in mcmndille in the heart of Peano Country up there, because we are 605 00:45:25.199 --> 00:45:30.239 very you know, we're very remote down here in southern Oregon in the mountains, 606 00:45:30.280 --> 00:45:32.760 so we're you know, six hours from San Francisco and five hours from 607 00:45:32.760 --> 00:45:37.679 Portland, and so we wanted to reach out a little more to people in 608 00:45:37.719 --> 00:45:43.400 the area. So we have our home Bidamic Winebar in mcmanville, so I 609 00:45:43.480 --> 00:45:46.119 love that. Well, if you want to come to the Upgate Valley, 610 00:45:46.320 --> 00:45:50.440 you can fly into Medford. That's the closest airport. How far is that? 611 00:45:50.920 --> 00:45:55.480 Medford International A flat at Canada is just forty five minutes from the winery. 612 00:45:55.679 --> 00:46:00.639 Yeah, and we're just outside the town of Grant's Pass. A great 613 00:46:00.679 --> 00:46:04.719 outdoor area. So if you like river rafting and fly fishing and hiking, 614 00:46:05.159 --> 00:46:08.039 this is the area to come to and definitely make troon a stop on the 615 00:46:08.079 --> 00:46:12.480 way. Craig, thank you so much for joining us today on Wine Soundtrack. 616 00:46:12.760 --> 00:46:14.760 Thank you so much's been my pleasure. It's been fun. Alis. 617 00:46:14.760 --> 00:46:16.760 I'm so happy to have you here. I'm so excited. Let's go explore 618 00:46:16.760 --> 00:46:22.400 and go see the animals. Thanks for listening to a new episode of Wine 619 00:46:22.440 --> 00:46:29.280 Soundtrack USA. For details and updates, visit our website windsoundtrack dot com.