WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.760 --> 00:00:15.119 Adventist Radio London inspiration for the song. Good evening and welcome to Talking Point. 2 00:00:15.880 --> 00:00:20.960 I certainly hope you had a wonderful sabbath. The sunshine has been glorious. 3 00:00:21.239 --> 00:00:25.640 I hope there has been sunshine where you are, whatever the weather, 4 00:00:25.800 --> 00:00:31.719 I hope you've been basking in the sunshine of God's love. I'm in the 5 00:00:31.760 --> 00:00:37.719 hot seat today. I am joined as usual I should say, my usual 6 00:00:38.840 --> 00:00:42.719 co host or my partners in crime, Partners in Christ, Partners in Christ. 7 00:00:45.759 --> 00:00:52.079 I've got Angela who's joining us from Balum actually on zoom, and Pedro 8 00:00:52.240 --> 00:00:56.520 who may or may not be here. I think he possibly disappeared for a 9 00:00:56.520 --> 00:01:02.039 minute, but he'll certainly be back, I'm sure, as well as a 10 00:01:02.119 --> 00:01:07.519 number of guests. It's a full packed house this afternoon, and we'll have 11 00:01:07.879 --> 00:01:15.920 them introduced themselves in a little bit. As usual, we start our discussion 12 00:01:15.000 --> 00:01:21.879 with um talking about our weeks, and then we'll move into the conversation. 13 00:01:21.920 --> 00:01:26.239 It's the Siblings Part two. We had a part one a few weeks ago 14 00:01:26.040 --> 00:01:34.000 in celebration of Brothers and Sisters Day, and we got so full into the 15 00:01:34.040 --> 00:01:38.280 conversation that, as usual, we thought a part two was warranted just to 16 00:01:38.400 --> 00:01:44.400 kind of settle the discussion. And I think we don't usually get to the 17 00:01:44.439 --> 00:01:46.840 party. We always say we will have a part two, but it never 18 00:01:46.879 --> 00:01:51.359 really manifests. But it has. And some of the persons who were on 19 00:01:51.519 --> 00:01:57.840 last time I hear again Rouelle pet Ruell and Andrea saying good afternoon to you, 20 00:01:59.359 --> 00:02:02.439 and some of persons who were are not here at this time, but 21 00:02:02.480 --> 00:02:09.800 we'll have a discussion anyway, recap a little before we move forward. I 22 00:02:09.840 --> 00:02:14.960 think as well, it is going to be the Brothers and Sisters or National 23 00:02:15.000 --> 00:02:16.919 Siblings Day. Sorry it's National Siblings Day. Last time. It's Brothers and 24 00:02:16.960 --> 00:02:22.039 Sisters Day on the thirty first of May. Sorry for that, And that's 25 00:02:22.080 --> 00:02:25.000 why I think the timing is right to have that siblings too. As we 26 00:02:25.680 --> 00:02:34.319 discussed just a little bit of housekeeping. This live programming today started with at 27 00:02:34.319 --> 00:02:40.960 the Request show, followed by tell me a Story that was from I think 28 00:02:42.000 --> 00:02:46.159 that comes from two thirty till four, and just before us was you See 29 00:02:46.159 --> 00:02:49.919 Why, which is formally Bricks Kids. That's normally from four to five, 30 00:02:50.800 --> 00:02:55.360 talking point from five to seven, and this evening possibly potentially we'll have a 31 00:02:55.439 --> 00:03:04.400 music show with myself Saturday night pray is from seven to nine pm. Right, 32 00:03:04.439 --> 00:03:07.879 with that out of the way and with Pedro back family in his seat, 33 00:03:07.039 --> 00:03:15.120 Pedro, how was your week, guys, Angie Pedro? Oh, 34 00:03:15.400 --> 00:03:21.000 actually, my week started off fantastically. I remember actually when it actually was. 35 00:03:21.319 --> 00:03:23.039 I basically he was celebrating my birthday at a bit of a birthday celebration 36 00:03:23.680 --> 00:03:30.520 Sunday and Monday, now my birthday. At the time, I was so 37 00:03:30.599 --> 00:03:34.000 busy, and I remember being on the show and actually completely forgetting it would 38 00:03:34.000 --> 00:03:38.639 be my birthday that week. However, because I was so busy and had 39 00:03:38.719 --> 00:03:39.840 loads of things on, do we have time to celebrate? I'm like, 40 00:03:40.039 --> 00:03:45.240 I'm going to celebrate for the whole year, But myself was actually over at 41 00:03:45.240 --> 00:03:50.360 the moment of America and her and some other friends kind of schemed behind my 42 00:03:50.400 --> 00:03:55.520 back and she used me to hotel and Spa a couple of days. So 43 00:03:57.840 --> 00:04:01.240 yeah, so we spent a lot of time a QZ steam room. They 44 00:04:01.840 --> 00:04:05.840 had a full body mussage in the dream. That's a really lovely foodence. 45 00:04:05.840 --> 00:04:10.199 It's really nice Nepoalese restaurant. So yeah, it was a lovely way to 46 00:04:10.280 --> 00:04:13.080 start the week. So yeah, that was really good. And then I 47 00:04:13.120 --> 00:04:15.120 guess the most of the week, you know, just back at work as 48 00:04:15.199 --> 00:04:17.920 usual, not too too stressful, although I found I was actually quite productive 49 00:04:17.959 --> 00:04:21.040 this work this week and got quite a lot done, so that was good. 50 00:04:21.759 --> 00:04:28.480 Um. So yeah, being quite happy to see the weather being sunny 51 00:04:28.560 --> 00:04:32.079 as it is. I'm determined to think that spring is here. Um, 52 00:04:32.680 --> 00:04:40.000 spring has sprung, Spring should be summer. Yeah, spring was a bit 53 00:04:40.160 --> 00:04:43.720 hit and mist to be fair, but yes, we are moving into summer. 54 00:04:43.920 --> 00:04:46.439 I'd like to see that. Yeah, it's so, it's been a 55 00:04:46.480 --> 00:04:48.160 bull and all. Pretty good week, I'd say, pretty positive week. 56 00:04:48.720 --> 00:04:53.000 I know sometimes we always say that, but actually I can stay this week. 57 00:04:53.000 --> 00:04:59.160 Actually had a good week. So a happy birthday again. When was 58 00:04:59.160 --> 00:05:02.040 your birthday? I was like, yeah, it was much but hey yeah 59 00:05:04.639 --> 00:05:16.439 Patrick, the birthday celebration. Yeah yeah, I know you can't top that, 60 00:05:16.600 --> 00:05:23.079 but try Petra. You there, Oh yeah, I'm here, I'm 61 00:05:23.079 --> 00:05:26.519 sorry. Yeah, how is your difficulties? Trying to get myself sorted? 62 00:05:27.839 --> 00:05:31.759 Worried? How was your week? Petra? How was your week? Oh? 63 00:05:31.800 --> 00:05:35.920 I thought that's what it was. My week was good? Um again, 64 00:05:36.000 --> 00:05:40.759 it was busy when really fast, Um looked up it was Friday already. 65 00:05:41.639 --> 00:05:46.759 Um, not really much going on besides work and the kids and the 66 00:05:46.879 --> 00:05:51.480 wife. Deal for a little bit of um swing this in the throat and 67 00:05:51.560 --> 00:05:56.399 stuff seems to be going around. Hopefully it doesn't get to me. Um 68 00:05:56.519 --> 00:06:00.800 started with my son, that my daughter, then my wife. So I'm 69 00:06:00.800 --> 00:06:02.319 hoping it doesn't, you know, come to me. But otherwise for that, 70 00:06:02.720 --> 00:06:08.120 UM, pretty healthy, Pretty well. Enjoy the sunshine somewhat. As 71 00:06:08.160 --> 00:06:11.279 I said before, I really don't like the sun. So you know, 72 00:06:11.560 --> 00:06:15.000 just you know, trying to maintain and yeah, you need to you need 73 00:06:15.040 --> 00:06:18.279 to expand on that. People here where you're saying you don't like the sun 74 00:06:18.439 --> 00:06:21.920 might think what's wrong. And like I said last time, I grew doesn't 75 00:06:21.959 --> 00:06:25.120 like the sun. You know, grew up in New York where is really 76 00:06:25.160 --> 00:06:28.040 hot. Yeah, and um, but it's a different kind of hot. 77 00:06:28.160 --> 00:06:30.839 It's hot to me. It's just hum, isn't it can't have the heat. 78 00:06:31.040 --> 00:06:33.279 So like I said before, like it's you know, you're going to 79 00:06:33.560 --> 00:06:38.879 a business and it's just like boiling go on a bus is boiling go in 80 00:06:39.000 --> 00:06:42.079 your car. It's hot and then the AC takes forever to kick in. 81 00:06:42.879 --> 00:06:45.040 It just it's just to me, it's just a different kind of heat. 82 00:06:45.279 --> 00:06:47.040 Not that I don't like it, not that I don't like being in the 83 00:06:47.120 --> 00:06:50.000 sun. It's just I just don't like when it gets really hot here because 84 00:06:50.000 --> 00:06:55.240 it just doesn't seem the UK is not equipped to handle heat. Yeah, 85 00:06:55.600 --> 00:07:00.519 I should say I think that maybe a different, different conversation, different show. 86 00:07:00.560 --> 00:07:02.519 But I'm not sure what weather the UK can handle to be fair. 87 00:07:02.639 --> 00:07:10.360 But um, we move forward quickly, swiftly better, swiftly we're moving forward. 88 00:07:11.079 --> 00:07:14.000 But yeah, it's it's it's something. Um, and I'm not sure 89 00:07:14.040 --> 00:07:16.680 if we're ready for forty degrees again, have mercy, But um, I 90 00:07:16.800 --> 00:07:19.600 do enjoy the sunshine and a little bit of heat. It is good for 91 00:07:19.720 --> 00:07:23.639 me. Today's weather was perfect. I call it sailing weather. There was 92 00:07:23.639 --> 00:07:28.040 a nice breeze um to keep the temperature down and it was just perfect. 93 00:07:28.120 --> 00:07:30.279 It was just perfect. So thank you Lord. Um I put a note 94 00:07:30.319 --> 00:07:35.560 down this is this is where it could possibly stay for me. Um. 95 00:07:36.199 --> 00:07:43.399 But yeah, yeah, my week's been better. UM. I think a 96 00:07:43.480 --> 00:07:46.120 few weeks ago we spoke about it. How our listeners say, oh, 97 00:07:46.279 --> 00:07:48.480 oh, you know, you guys have amazing weeks. Um, what's going 98 00:07:48.560 --> 00:07:51.639 on? You know you're not living the real life in the real world. 99 00:07:53.439 --> 00:07:56.720 Um. And I think for me, when my my my week is bad, 100 00:07:56.800 --> 00:08:01.639 I generally don't show up for talking point. Um. So you know, 101 00:08:01.000 --> 00:08:05.199 last week I was under the weather. I got a cold of flu 102 00:08:05.319 --> 00:08:09.360 and as Petrol said, it is going around and I just kind of sat 103 00:08:09.439 --> 00:08:16.519 that one out and Angie so abably ably took over and ran the shows. 104 00:08:16.600 --> 00:08:20.399 But I was listening and it was excellent And I'm back, glad to be 105 00:08:20.519 --> 00:08:26.639 back. Still coughing a little bit, but yeah, Covidavid seems to be 106 00:08:26.839 --> 00:08:30.959 doing a bit of the round. Yeah again, so definitely as the summer 107 00:08:31.000 --> 00:08:35.799 colds and flus king. Yeah, yeah. And I think we still all 108 00:08:35.919 --> 00:08:39.519 need to be vigilant, you know. Um, it's not it's not off 109 00:08:39.600 --> 00:08:43.759 the scene. It's not it's not gone completely. We still do absolutely need 110 00:08:43.799 --> 00:08:46.679 to be vigilant. And I think I read somewhere about some new strain in 111 00:08:46.799 --> 00:08:50.320 China. Whether that's true or not or whatever, Um, we just need 112 00:08:50.360 --> 00:08:54.559 to keep our ears and eyes um to the ground. To be fair, 113 00:08:54.399 --> 00:08:58.159 I don't think it's really even that it's COVID. I think it's just natural 114 00:08:58.360 --> 00:09:01.960 whenever it goes from cold to heat, like what I love. The only 115 00:09:01.960 --> 00:09:05.279 thing I learned about the UK or anywhere. Actually when it's cold, then 116 00:09:05.320 --> 00:09:09.840 when it gets hot, everybody loses their mind and goes out of my shirt 117 00:09:09.279 --> 00:09:13.120 and shorts. And then it gets cold at night because like even up here, 118 00:09:13.200 --> 00:09:18.200 which is where like it was hot during the day and then it just 119 00:09:18.440 --> 00:09:20.759 dropped. Yeah, and you're still out in the shorts and a T shirt. 120 00:09:22.039 --> 00:09:24.840 Now you get sick because now it's cold your body, you know. 121 00:09:24.080 --> 00:09:28.240 So I think it's not just covid. But I think it's just natural flu 122 00:09:28.399 --> 00:09:33.519 cold season, yes, where people are just getting sick because they're not dressing 123 00:09:33.600 --> 00:09:35.919 properly for the weather. Yeah, that is true. That is true. 124 00:09:37.240 --> 00:09:41.759 Um. I think I tested negatively, but my boss, um, we 125 00:09:41.919 --> 00:09:45.240 had very similar symptoms where he was positive. So yeah, I think it's 126 00:09:45.279 --> 00:09:50.480 a mixture of both. I think they call it what fluid it's um it's 127 00:09:50.480 --> 00:09:52.240 just a mixture of that going around. Um. So we just have to 128 00:09:52.279 --> 00:09:58.519 be vigilant and keep our keep ourselves and our immune systems boosted. So yeah, 129 00:09:58.759 --> 00:10:07.440 that's that's the message for for this week. UM. I also kind 130 00:10:07.480 --> 00:10:11.000 of wanted to to give a little bit of a recap on on what we 131 00:10:11.159 --> 00:10:18.759 discussed on our Siblings Siblings program A few weeks ago and to say that, 132 00:10:18.440 --> 00:10:26.080 um, we kind of drew a conclusion that that siblings were worth having. 133 00:10:26.120 --> 00:10:31.919 Um, it's definitely good to have someone to share your burdens with and your 134 00:10:31.240 --> 00:10:37.799 your joys with. But I want to toss it out to our two specialists 135 00:10:37.080 --> 00:10:41.279 in the house. First, I let them introduce themselves. But the question 136 00:10:41.360 --> 00:10:45.600 I want you to mull over, and we'll start with a specialist, but 137 00:10:45.639 --> 00:10:50.000 we'll all have maybe a chance to pitch in, is whether it is or 138 00:10:50.039 --> 00:10:54.519 it isn't useful to have siblings for our parents or parents to be who are 139 00:10:54.559 --> 00:11:00.879 contemplating do we have one, do we have more? Is one easier? 140 00:11:01.440 --> 00:11:05.399 Two or three more stressful, more confusion, more problems? Or is it 141 00:11:05.480 --> 00:11:11.080 too difficult to answer that question because it's not as black and white, it's 142 00:11:11.120 --> 00:11:13.559 not as clear cut. Or maybe we'll come to a conclusion at the end, 143 00:11:15.440 --> 00:11:18.039 but we certainly want to maybe put because we couldn't the last time. 144 00:11:18.519 --> 00:11:22.159 We want to definitely put an answer to that if we could. Is it 145 00:11:22.320 --> 00:11:26.440 best to have siblings or is it best to go it alone. Let's just 146 00:11:26.519 --> 00:11:30.759 pray before we get into the discussion, and then we'll we'll go into the 147 00:11:30.879 --> 00:11:33.759 meat of it definitely, Father, Thank you for bringing us together this afternoon. 148 00:11:33.799 --> 00:11:37.080 Thank you for bringing the members of the panel, and also for our 149 00:11:37.120 --> 00:11:41.000 listeners. I pray that this discussion would be a blessing to us all in 150 00:11:41.159 --> 00:11:50.399 Jesus name. Amen. Amen. Right, So, Angie and those of 151 00:11:50.519 --> 00:11:56.600 us who were part of the conversation last time, what were your takeaways? 152 00:11:56.759 --> 00:12:03.159 What was the conclusion that you drew from the conversation that we had if you 153 00:12:03.200 --> 00:12:07.360 can draw your mind back that far, and a lot has happened since, 154 00:12:09.120 --> 00:12:13.080 um, but what was the conclusion that you came to at the end of 155 00:12:13.120 --> 00:12:18.879 our conversation last timent? And perhaps Angie, I can start with you. 156 00:12:18.600 --> 00:12:22.720 Yeah, I mean I was gonna say, going back to your first question, 157 00:12:24.200 --> 00:12:26.440 Um, you know, is it worth as having siblings? I think 158 00:12:26.480 --> 00:12:30.320 for me, um, And I think my takeaway from what I can see 159 00:12:30.360 --> 00:12:37.000 that people's lives are enriched by the siblings. You know. Um, Now, 160 00:12:37.039 --> 00:12:41.480 I guess that could depend on how many and the makeup and what have 161 00:12:41.639 --> 00:12:46.240 you, But it sounds like most most of us have had a fairly positive 162 00:12:46.320 --> 00:12:50.799 relationship with our siblings, despite any challenges and what have you. Definitely better 163 00:12:50.919 --> 00:12:54.919 being better than maybe being I got to not being an only child, I 164 00:12:56.080 --> 00:13:00.480 was for a few years before my sister came. But actually I think whilst 165 00:13:00.519 --> 00:13:03.480 the relationship may have changed over the years, all in all, you know, 166 00:13:03.679 --> 00:13:07.279 I think it's it's been a real positive and a benefit. And you 167 00:13:07.360 --> 00:13:11.840 know, you have you almost have you know, you'd have instant best friends, 168 00:13:13.480 --> 00:13:16.440 you'd have people to kind of share things with, maybe somebody challenge you, 169 00:13:16.600 --> 00:13:20.039 but that there's a lot of growth and learning from that. And I 170 00:13:20.159 --> 00:13:24.240 think have I said all of that, with all of those positives, there 171 00:13:24.320 --> 00:13:28.679 does sometimes come the challenges with all of that because you are instantly working at 172 00:13:28.799 --> 00:13:33.720 dynamics and how that plays out with the best of the family, with your 173 00:13:33.840 --> 00:13:39.279 parents. So it can equally be a real blessing. I'm not going to 174 00:13:39.320 --> 00:13:43.000 say it's going to be a curse, but it can be tricky and it 175 00:13:43.080 --> 00:13:46.240 can be difficult, and I think there are lots of things that complain to 176 00:13:46.360 --> 00:13:50.639 that. I think parents role parents' roles are really important, but I think 177 00:13:50.639 --> 00:13:54.120 when you have siblings, even more so you have more than one child, 178 00:13:54.159 --> 00:13:58.200 even more so because you you know, what you do and how you are 179 00:13:58.279 --> 00:14:03.440 with each of your children can really shape their developmental think going the journey going 180 00:14:03.519 --> 00:14:07.519 forward. But all in all, I think, yeah, it's a really 181 00:14:07.519 --> 00:14:11.559 positive thing, and I think it's and I guess, you know, depending 182 00:14:11.559 --> 00:14:13.639 on everyone's going to be so unique and different, so you know, there's 183 00:14:13.679 --> 00:14:20.840 certainly no m cookie cutter fit for every family dynamicing group and what have you. 184 00:14:22.159 --> 00:14:24.480 And I think as over the time I've been sort of speaking to my 185 00:14:24.639 --> 00:14:28.879 friends who, you know, they've got lots of siblings or have no siblings, 186 00:14:28.000 --> 00:14:31.639 and just sort of seeing their experiences and how different and varied they can 187 00:14:31.720 --> 00:14:35.679 be. I can alway sort of see that as really positive and it's a 188 00:14:35.720 --> 00:14:41.759 really enriching experience. M But and there's so many theories possibly around it as 189 00:14:41.799 --> 00:14:46.039 well, and I'm sure our practitioners can shed some light on some of that, 190 00:14:46.159 --> 00:14:48.600 I'm sure as well. But yeah, I think it was you know, 191 00:14:48.919 --> 00:14:52.360 it was a really fascinating conversation that we had, UM and we've had 192 00:14:52.399 --> 00:14:56.399 sort of you know, different sets and different types of siblings software and each 193 00:14:56.440 --> 00:15:01.759 of those came with their uniqueness and differences, but equally lots of things that 194 00:15:01.799 --> 00:15:05.120 we could all relate to, a lot of similarities, a lot of things 195 00:15:05.120 --> 00:15:07.600 they had in coming didn't know they had in coming. But yeah, yeah, 196 00:15:07.799 --> 00:15:13.080 I think genes and genetics obviously plays yeah, sort seeing if some of 197 00:15:13.120 --> 00:15:18.240 the theories, like you know, does your position in the family, you 198 00:15:18.320 --> 00:15:20.240 know, in the sibling lineup, does it make a difference, Like I'm 199 00:15:20.279 --> 00:15:24.960 an old I'm the eldest, so you know, can I relate to somebody 200 00:15:24.000 --> 00:15:28.000 else who's the eldest? A lot of the times I can, and it's 201 00:15:28.120 --> 00:15:31.720 maybe something very different who's in the who's a middle child or the youngest child. 202 00:15:31.919 --> 00:15:35.559 It's quite interesting to see those kind of similarities more completely difference. You 203 00:15:35.639 --> 00:15:39.159 have a set of twins on as well, and I think that's a really 204 00:15:39.279 --> 00:15:43.480 unique bonding dynamic as well. So you know whether, yeah, whether you 205 00:15:43.559 --> 00:15:48.480 are similar or you're very very different. Fascinating, but you know, that's 206 00:15:48.519 --> 00:15:52.600 the beauty God has created as we are, God's great inspiration and I think 207 00:15:52.679 --> 00:15:56.399 you know with that comes in uniqueness, sivarians, everything else, and that 208 00:15:56.480 --> 00:16:04.279 plays out in our family dynamics and absolutely absolutely M Petro, what what did 209 00:16:04.320 --> 00:16:10.000 you take away? And I think you had a slightly slightly different stance because 210 00:16:10.039 --> 00:16:14.440 you were starting with Tara and her sister, her twin sister, M what 211 00:16:14.559 --> 00:16:18.600 did you take away from from the conversation, Like Angela said, it's just 212 00:16:18.759 --> 00:16:23.639 a uniqueness. Um, growing will be married to tar for seventeen years, 213 00:16:23.879 --> 00:16:29.559 knowing her for eighteen Um, just seeing how their dynamic was so different. 214 00:16:29.919 --> 00:16:33.480 Even though they were twins, they were done a good twins. On top 215 00:16:33.519 --> 00:16:37.759 of that, it was just their their attitude, their demeanor that everything was 216 00:16:37.080 --> 00:16:41.720 was totally opposite. One was to the left, almost to the um. 217 00:16:41.759 --> 00:16:45.240 And then also myself growing up, Um, I didn't really have siblings until 218 00:16:45.600 --> 00:16:48.200 right. Let mean I say that I had siblings at a young age, 219 00:16:49.360 --> 00:16:52.639 but I didn't know my siblings that well, Like we spent time together, 220 00:16:53.480 --> 00:16:57.600 but it was very in between. So I kind of almost grew up as 221 00:16:57.639 --> 00:17:02.200 an only child. Especially when we moved from Bermuda to New York, I 222 00:17:02.320 --> 00:17:06.279 was the only child. So when I finally then when my mother married and 223 00:17:06.559 --> 00:17:12.079 brought on my brothers and sisters from his marriage from his previous marriage, Um, 224 00:17:12.480 --> 00:17:15.559 then it was like learning to be a sibling all over again. And 225 00:17:15.720 --> 00:17:19.480 that was a dynamic that was that was that was very unique and trying to 226 00:17:19.559 --> 00:17:22.559 figure out because you had to try to find your place because all of a 227 00:17:22.559 --> 00:17:26.720 sudden, I got like a blended family. I'm just got this big family 228 00:17:27.160 --> 00:17:30.160 and now I got to learn my place and you know, where I'm at, 229 00:17:30.279 --> 00:17:33.119 where I belong, where I don't belong, you know. Um, 230 00:17:33.440 --> 00:17:38.559 But I just took that it's good to have siblings, um, in the 231 00:17:38.680 --> 00:17:41.720 sense of just to have somebody else to lean on, to hang out with. 232 00:17:41.960 --> 00:17:47.359 Like my oldest sister, she was always she was stuck with me pretty 233 00:17:47.400 --> 00:17:49.359 much. They pretty much just threw on me, threw me on her and 234 00:17:49.480 --> 00:17:52.599 said, if anything happens, you're in You're in trouble. So she was 235 00:17:52.640 --> 00:17:56.480 pretty much like, you know, like my my parent. You know, 236 00:17:56.960 --> 00:18:00.240 not that my parents was in parents, but she was pretty much It's just 237 00:18:00.319 --> 00:18:03.319 like everywhere she went, I had to go. She wanted to go somewhere 238 00:18:03.319 --> 00:18:07.119 I had to go too. So but it developed. It allow us to 239 00:18:07.200 --> 00:18:11.319 develop a relationship with each other, um as a sibling, as brother and 240 00:18:11.400 --> 00:18:18.079 sister, just to um understand each other and and just and confiding each other, 241 00:18:18.279 --> 00:18:21.559 you know. So it was good to have a sibling as I got 242 00:18:21.640 --> 00:18:26.119 older. UM. And you spoke there about about the closeness between you two, 243 00:18:26.160 --> 00:18:33.559 and I think we'll also unpack that the differences between the eldest we have. 244 00:18:33.720 --> 00:18:37.160 I said this before, that we have my relationship with my siblings is 245 00:18:37.200 --> 00:18:42.400 a weird relationship. And we talked about this um this past week. And 246 00:18:42.680 --> 00:18:45.920 I don't mind saying this because I said to my siblings, we me and 247 00:18:47.000 --> 00:18:49.400 my siblings were weird in the sense of that we can go a whole year 248 00:18:49.519 --> 00:18:52.480 or two if I speaking to each other, and then when we speak it's 249 00:18:52.519 --> 00:18:57.200 like we never left. UM. But then we can also, um, 250 00:18:59.480 --> 00:19:03.200 if something that happens, we can kind of they can we can kind of 251 00:19:03.240 --> 00:19:06.559 ghost each other and not talk to each other for a while. Like I 252 00:19:06.559 --> 00:19:11.200 haven't talk to some of my siblings over things that's happened for a while, 253 00:19:11.440 --> 00:19:15.000 and it's just the way it is. I don't lose no sleep over it. 254 00:19:15.079 --> 00:19:19.319 It's just what it is. I can't control. You know that they 255 00:19:19.400 --> 00:19:22.079 may not want to speak to me or they don't really like me at this 256 00:19:22.200 --> 00:19:26.240 moment, But UM doesn't mean that I don't still have love for my siblings. 257 00:19:26.319 --> 00:19:29.599 I always if they need something that they call me, I'm gonna be 258 00:19:29.680 --> 00:19:33.200 there and be like, hey, I got you. But at the moment 259 00:19:33.279 --> 00:19:36.680 they're just not you know, just we're just not on the same page. 260 00:19:37.160 --> 00:19:41.480 So it you know, it's siblings. UM, Yeah, it's unique. 261 00:19:41.519 --> 00:19:45.119 In that sense. You know, it's I think for me, my uniqueness 262 00:19:45.240 --> 00:19:49.440 just that I have such I have siblings from half siblings, step siblings. 263 00:19:49.559 --> 00:19:52.880 You know, I'm like really the only technically the only child of my mother 264 00:19:52.960 --> 00:19:59.680 besides my brother and my sister, who are actually twins. And so it's 265 00:19:59.680 --> 00:20:03.799 just makes it just a weird it just makes my situation a weird dynamic in 266 00:20:03.839 --> 00:20:08.240 a sense of siblings because we didn't all grow up from beginning to end. 267 00:20:08.400 --> 00:20:14.240 You kind of like kind of meshed as the years went along. So and 268 00:20:14.400 --> 00:20:17.400 it's it's you know, as I said, it's interesting to hear that because 269 00:20:17.440 --> 00:20:19.640 it's it's just all sorts of dynamics that make up the family, doesn't it. 270 00:20:21.160 --> 00:20:26.720 Um. I'm going to introduce who've been patiently waiting our practitioners, um 271 00:20:26.960 --> 00:20:30.880 Dorothy, you've been here with us before. I think I've said it Europe 272 00:20:32.599 --> 00:20:36.920 practically our resident therapist at this point. I'm not sure if you want the 273 00:20:37.559 --> 00:20:41.960 title, but I'm handing it over to you. And also we've got with 274 00:20:41.160 --> 00:20:45.799 us Kelly Brodrick. Um Dorothy, if you want to introduce yourself, and 275 00:20:45.920 --> 00:20:51.200 for those of us who may not have heard you before and new to talking 276 00:20:51.279 --> 00:20:55.599 point, let us know a little bit about yourself. Okay, just briefly, 277 00:20:56.279 --> 00:21:02.000 I'm a psychotherapist and having in the field for over twenty five years, 278 00:21:02.680 --> 00:21:10.519 mainly worked in education universities and colleges. In the last ten years or so, 279 00:21:11.160 --> 00:21:18.000 I've been working in private practice. Okay, excellent, Kelly. I 280 00:21:18.279 --> 00:21:23.519 my name is Kelly, and I am the integrative therapist. I've been in 281 00:21:23.599 --> 00:21:32.000 practice for about five years. My volunteer at Cornerstone Christian Council in Service as 282 00:21:32.079 --> 00:21:36.680 well as the volunteer councilors, and I also have been in private practice for 283 00:21:36.799 --> 00:21:47.119 a while and specialize in working with minority communities around attachment and psychodynamic kind of 284 00:21:47.240 --> 00:21:51.519 theory, which is around your history in the past. Lovely, but this 285 00:21:51.720 --> 00:21:53.799 is your first time to talking point to Welcome to you both as well. 286 00:21:56.680 --> 00:22:00.640 So we've we've sort of talked about what we gathered for the last show. 287 00:22:00.680 --> 00:22:06.400 You've heard that we've all got our own little unique family dynamic. But Dorothy 288 00:22:06.559 --> 00:22:11.440 Kelly, Um, is this something that it's new to you in your personal 289 00:22:11.759 --> 00:22:17.359 and your professional capacity? What do you think about that sibling relationship? Is 290 00:22:17.400 --> 00:22:19.920 it? Is it more complex than we can have ever unraveled? Um? 291 00:22:21.680 --> 00:22:32.440 What's your take on the relationship. M hm. How it's as you It's 292 00:22:32.480 --> 00:22:36.359 as unique or complicated as we want to make it. So when I look 293 00:22:36.400 --> 00:22:40.200 in the Bible, the first one is Caine and Able, and look what 294 00:22:40.359 --> 00:22:45.480 happened there? Sibling rivalry. Yeah, um, so there's good things about 295 00:22:45.599 --> 00:22:51.759 it. Was it Able who was Caine was the eldest one, and Angela 296 00:22:51.839 --> 00:22:56.279 said before she was she was our only child for a certain time till the 297 00:22:56.759 --> 00:23:00.119 other one turned out. And then you know, so he was having a 298 00:23:00.200 --> 00:23:04.519 great bath. Then the younger one came up and he may have been a 299 00:23:04.559 --> 00:23:12.440 little jealous of how the parents related to the newsborn. And then the younger 300 00:23:12.519 --> 00:23:17.079 child is looking up to the bigger brother, thinking, wow, you're great, 301 00:23:18.079 --> 00:23:22.079 and whereas the older one is like, you're annoying, you're spoiled. 302 00:23:22.839 --> 00:23:26.039 You get on my nerves, black king, you know. So when we 303 00:23:26.119 --> 00:23:30.240 look at it from way back then, there's always been some sort of rivalry 304 00:23:30.279 --> 00:23:34.759 within siblings. And if I look at my own personal life, I'm one 305 00:23:34.839 --> 00:23:41.119 of six, I'm second youngest. Did I like being in a large family 306 00:23:41.359 --> 00:23:45.079 as a child, No, there were too many. And then when we 307 00:23:45.200 --> 00:23:48.880 had all the cousins come around, you know, and then my friends were 308 00:23:48.920 --> 00:23:52.599 single children getting everything. I was getting hand downs. We shared everything. 309 00:23:52.680 --> 00:23:57.359 We had one bite between three of us. You know, everything was shared. 310 00:23:57.680 --> 00:24:03.480 No, as an adult, having siblings is my life, is my 311 00:24:03.640 --> 00:24:07.400 everything. I couldn't do if I had my siblings. They're my best friends. 312 00:24:07.680 --> 00:24:12.200 My sister and I've got brothers who are everything. Do we have the 313 00:24:12.400 --> 00:24:18.960 rivalry and whatever we sought it out now is she's still there? We still 314 00:24:19.079 --> 00:24:25.039 sort out our stuff now. You know, we don't have the problems that 315 00:24:25.119 --> 00:24:30.880 we did as younger children as adults. Now we can get hard and talk 316 00:24:30.960 --> 00:24:37.000 about things and get through them much easier than when I was growing up. 317 00:24:37.400 --> 00:24:41.599 So being like being an adult with siblings different. When we look at the 318 00:24:42.480 --> 00:24:49.839 research, again, it's as complicated, more depend on the parents than the 319 00:24:49.960 --> 00:24:56.759 siblings themselves. How are the siblings managed? And that's what it is. 320 00:24:57.319 --> 00:25:06.160 How do we manage the situation as adults and we work with the rivalry? 321 00:25:07.720 --> 00:25:11.319 What is rivalry? The dynamics? How do we introduce a new child? 322 00:25:12.480 --> 00:25:17.359 And we talked about earlier about blending families, how do we do that? 323 00:25:18.240 --> 00:25:22.759 So it's about managing it all? So is it more it depends on the 324 00:25:22.880 --> 00:25:30.039 individuals and how it's all managed. Yeah, it's not as and she said, 325 00:25:30.079 --> 00:25:33.359 it's not a cookie cutter approach. It really just depends on the family 326 00:25:33.799 --> 00:25:37.799 and the dynamics of it. And you're You're very right. Parenting plays a 327 00:25:38.000 --> 00:25:42.759 very key role and we want to dissect that in a moment, Kelly, 328 00:25:42.799 --> 00:25:48.799 anything to add there, So I'm losing my voice. I think Dorothy kind 329 00:25:48.839 --> 00:25:52.640 of covered quite a lot of it. I said that it was a lot 330 00:25:52.680 --> 00:25:56.359 of it depends on the family mission statement. So you know, that's like 331 00:25:56.440 --> 00:26:00.640 that your values and your morals and what you what your parents think are important 332 00:26:00.799 --> 00:26:06.720 and often what is part of that. It's around dynamics. So a lot 333 00:26:06.799 --> 00:26:11.680 of it is intergenerational and that also includes trauma as well, so you know, 334 00:26:11.880 --> 00:26:15.599 some some of it is passed through into you know, those sibling groups 335 00:26:18.359 --> 00:26:25.559 that can create the dynamic you know, between the siblings. I think that 336 00:26:26.079 --> 00:26:30.880 you know, is it is it better to have siblings or not have siblings? 337 00:26:30.240 --> 00:26:33.160 It depends on the person that you talk to, because some people have 338 00:26:33.920 --> 00:26:42.599 some real difficult situations as a result of having siblings, and you know, 339 00:26:42.720 --> 00:26:47.160 for some people that can be you know, that can be quite a tough, 340 00:26:47.359 --> 00:26:51.519 quite tough thing to navigate. For the vast majority of people, having 341 00:26:51.680 --> 00:26:56.319 siblings is an extension of like a best friend or you know, it's a 342 00:26:56.599 --> 00:27:00.920 it's good teaching ground. You know, you learn how to age and forward 343 00:27:00.000 --> 00:27:07.160 relationships, you learn how to you know, navigate conflicts, learn how you 344 00:27:07.240 --> 00:27:11.240 know in terms of attachments, you know, things like that. So there's 345 00:27:11.319 --> 00:27:17.839 lots of rich learning that you can get from from siblings. But everybody's situation 346 00:27:18.039 --> 00:27:21.799 is very, very different. I'm I'm the eldest. I'm the eldest of 347 00:27:21.960 --> 00:27:26.160 three, okay, and it would you'd probably say that I may have been. 348 00:27:26.240 --> 00:27:30.119 I was brought up as like an only child. There's seven years between 349 00:27:30.200 --> 00:27:33.839 me and my next my next sibling, which is my brother, and then 350 00:27:34.160 --> 00:27:37.559 three years after him was my sister. So there's many eleven years between me 351 00:27:37.599 --> 00:27:41.599 and my youngest. So I pretty much was almost brought up like an only 352 00:27:41.720 --> 00:27:45.720 child, and my brother and sister were like they were created this like a 353 00:27:45.839 --> 00:27:49.039 new family. Because I was seven by the time, you know, my 354 00:27:49.160 --> 00:27:53.359 brother came along, so I had everything, you know, I had everything 355 00:27:53.440 --> 00:27:56.319 that I wanted, you know, and when he came along, there was 356 00:27:56.359 --> 00:28:00.640 a lot of jealousy, you know, and that had to be done so 357 00:28:00.480 --> 00:28:07.640 yeah, what I'm gathering from what you're saying is a lot of the relationship 358 00:28:07.720 --> 00:28:14.720 between brother and sisters navigated or established by the peer rental relationships, and that 359 00:28:14.960 --> 00:28:22.119 is quite key, Angie. Anything to add there before we move on, 360 00:28:26.359 --> 00:28:29.079 No, I mean, I totally agree with everything, but it's really interesting. 361 00:28:30.359 --> 00:28:33.279 Kelly was just saying they're about the age difference and how that can you 362 00:28:33.359 --> 00:28:37.440 know, the gap between two or three or whatever can make a real big 363 00:28:37.519 --> 00:28:42.400 difference. And again, as you said, I guess it depends on also 364 00:28:42.440 --> 00:28:45.079 the length of time as well. I made between myself and my sisters. 365 00:28:47.920 --> 00:28:53.039 There's really five between a second one and then I can't even do the masks 366 00:28:53.200 --> 00:28:56.799 a lot more between that, so yeah, that doesn't make a difference. 367 00:28:56.839 --> 00:28:59.920 I've never need to thought it from that perspective because I guess I'm not how 368 00:29:00.119 --> 00:29:03.160 to think of it that way. Um, I'm sure my sister might have 369 00:29:03.240 --> 00:29:07.680 a lot to say about that, but yeah, yeah, and again that's 370 00:29:07.720 --> 00:29:11.319 where the parents have to really play a huge part in that because if that's 371 00:29:11.359 --> 00:29:17.200 not managed or noticed or what happened, then actually that can cause a lot 372 00:29:17.240 --> 00:29:19.720 of problems. And I guess what's set up from being a child can just 373 00:29:19.880 --> 00:29:26.920 you know, continue into adulthood and can you know as you get older each 374 00:29:27.039 --> 00:29:30.079 presentment for instance, for those years and it could be quite unknown as well. 375 00:29:30.359 --> 00:29:33.759 I guess maybe we'll talk a little bit more about that placed one in 376 00:29:33.880 --> 00:29:36.240 terms of conflict. You know, there might be an issue, and you 377 00:29:36.279 --> 00:29:38.599 can be so unaware of these things to later on in life it comes out 378 00:29:38.640 --> 00:29:42.920 and you're like, wow, that happened when we were tear So, yeah, 379 00:29:44.519 --> 00:29:48.039 that's really interesting on that. Well, Andre, you've been You've been 380 00:29:48.400 --> 00:29:55.960 very quick. That part of part of what you just said about the year 381 00:29:56.160 --> 00:30:00.640 the gap. Oh yeah, it makes some sense now to myself, like 382 00:30:00.799 --> 00:30:03.480 my personal self, like I'm like, wow, okay, that makes so 383 00:30:03.599 --> 00:30:10.119 much sense because I was fourteen years between me and my brother and sister when 384 00:30:10.160 --> 00:30:14.480 my mother had them. I don't you know, I had siblings that was 385 00:30:14.759 --> 00:30:17.160 one that's four years older than me, one that's four years younger than me, 386 00:30:17.839 --> 00:30:19.599 but we didn't live agree, wasn't together. So in the sense of 387 00:30:19.880 --> 00:30:25.759 being with my growing up with my sibling was I was fourteen, and you're 388 00:30:25.799 --> 00:30:30.759 right, you do. I didn't realize I was brought up like as a 389 00:30:30.240 --> 00:30:36.440 loner. That displaced why my parents were so different towards the twins than it 390 00:30:36.680 --> 00:30:41.640 was towards us, and it just it just clicked. It just literally clicked 391 00:30:41.759 --> 00:30:44.759 my head when she said that, Yeah, it makes a difference. I 392 00:30:45.000 --> 00:30:48.440 was the baby of the family for about five six years and it took a 393 00:30:48.519 --> 00:30:53.400 lot not to be resentful that that this young man had come into the picture. 394 00:30:53.440 --> 00:30:56.880 I'm like, yeah, I'm I'm I'm the baby. I'm I'm the 395 00:30:56.960 --> 00:30:59.440 one that should be spoiled, and you know, I'm the one that that 396 00:30:59.519 --> 00:31:03.680 should get everything and you know, should be doated on. And you know, 397 00:31:03.799 --> 00:31:07.920 six seven years later, I'm like, well, where did he come 398 00:31:07.000 --> 00:31:11.839 from? Um? Why why? You know, why why do you need 399 00:31:11.880 --> 00:31:15.640 another child? Um? Surely I'm enough. But obviously, I mean, 400 00:31:15.680 --> 00:31:19.720 these dynamics play a role. And again it will impact how our relationship, 401 00:31:21.559 --> 00:31:25.559 how will we engage each other, myself and my brother. And it's difficult 402 00:31:25.599 --> 00:31:29.640 because of that age gap. You know, we don't necessarily do the same 403 00:31:29.759 --> 00:31:33.359 things, and we don't necessarily have the same interests. Um. And it's 404 00:31:33.480 --> 00:31:37.240 it's important for us to make an effort to foster that relationship because it may 405 00:31:37.319 --> 00:31:42.319 not come naturally. So that the age gaps definitely make make a difference. 406 00:31:44.880 --> 00:31:48.759 Yeah, Andre Royal, you've been waiting patiently. Thank you. Um, 407 00:31:48.359 --> 00:31:52.200 just tell us a little bit about yourselves, um, and we want to 408 00:31:52.279 --> 00:31:59.960 just talk about your own relationship as the only siblings at present online I think 409 00:32:00.240 --> 00:32:05.519 Angie and some bad they've disappeared. Um, so just tell us for those 410 00:32:05.599 --> 00:32:09.079 who miss siblings part one, a little bit about yourself and then we'll talk 411 00:32:09.119 --> 00:32:15.559 about your relationship as brother and brother. And do you want to start the 412 00:32:15.640 --> 00:32:30.079 ball rolling? Sorry, you're a mute, You're both are my apologies. 413 00:32:30.319 --> 00:32:36.599 That's fine. I should know better boy now as Ricky Ricky mistake anyway. 414 00:32:37.240 --> 00:32:39.599 All right, So my name is Andrew Jones. Like I'm currently healing from 415 00:32:42.119 --> 00:32:47.240 coaches to slash classon LC some more on the coast East Coast. But I 416 00:32:47.720 --> 00:32:54.440 was born in Barbada's Group in Barbadas and was essentially an only child until my 417 00:32:54.640 --> 00:33:00.599 brother turned up some ten eleven years later, after I stopped asked for sibling, 418 00:33:00.079 --> 00:33:09.279 well, constantly prestering my parents for sibling. Um, uh, well 419 00:33:09.279 --> 00:33:15.759 it's clesy. Um yeah, I'll really interest himself and then we will talk 420 00:33:15.799 --> 00:33:22.759 about a relationship. Uh. Yes, So my name is LL I currently 421 00:33:22.799 --> 00:33:27.480 live in Portsmouth. Recently at least a year now. Um. I was 422 00:33:27.599 --> 00:33:30.319 born into grew up in Barbados, and a little bit of Martinique as well. 423 00:33:30.359 --> 00:33:35.960 Andrea also Martinique. He missed up partner, but and it is actually 424 00:33:36.000 --> 00:33:39.039 twelve years, not at ten, and he's missing years. That's fine, 425 00:33:39.559 --> 00:33:51.759 um, younger brain, younger brain. UM Uh yeah, I'm also married, 426 00:33:51.880 --> 00:33:57.440 don't have any kids yet, that's all, UM, tell us a 427 00:33:57.480 --> 00:34:00.599 little bit go on. God, no, I was going to say, 428 00:34:00.599 --> 00:34:07.159 I couldn't help watching the faces of our resident psychologists characters listening as each other 429 00:34:07.920 --> 00:34:20.280 their already analyzing you. Mus stood up by default anyway, UM tell us 430 00:34:20.320 --> 00:34:23.119 about your own relationship you You've already spoken about the divide, the time, 431 00:34:23.480 --> 00:34:29.199 the time gap between our the age gap between you both. UM. But 432 00:34:29.480 --> 00:34:32.079 I know from from knowing you both that your relationship was very very strong, 433 00:34:32.679 --> 00:34:38.920 UM, very close. Um what what what makes that possible? Even though 434 00:34:39.079 --> 00:34:43.199 you weren't did you say that much? If you did, you weren't raised 435 00:34:43.400 --> 00:34:52.559 together for most um of your youth or time together siblings was relatively short, 436 00:34:53.599 --> 00:34:59.239 um, in a sense that, as we all said, eleven twelve years 437 00:34:59.599 --> 00:35:05.519 different when I left home when Royal was still young, but whilst I was 438 00:35:05.639 --> 00:35:08.119 home. No, I would take role with me when I when I went 439 00:35:08.199 --> 00:35:14.639 out to some extent of course, when I got involved in singing UM, 440 00:35:15.400 --> 00:35:19.599 so I sang an a cappella group from young and he would be there present, 441 00:35:20.000 --> 00:35:24.320 kind of taking it all in UM. But when I left, we 442 00:35:24.800 --> 00:35:30.639 communicate by letter every you know. And again I actually stumbled across a card 443 00:35:30.320 --> 00:35:37.440 that Royal wrote me UM when he was I think it probably about seven years 444 00:35:37.480 --> 00:35:40.800 old or their boats and I started came across it just UM last week a 445 00:35:40.840 --> 00:35:46.079 week before, and so that that's how our initial kind of exchanges were. 446 00:35:46.960 --> 00:35:52.360 But when we got older, that's kind of mostly when or leadership kind of 447 00:35:52.880 --> 00:35:59.000 caught forged or a lot closer. Um. We share varies in my personalities, 448 00:36:00.119 --> 00:36:07.039 similar interests UM. Some of that possibly from UM rule being around me, 449 00:36:07.159 --> 00:36:09.880 but some of it not. Some of it's just quite organic UM. 450 00:36:10.199 --> 00:36:17.679 Possibly because of our parents maybe. But the distance hasn't prevented us from developing 451 00:36:17.800 --> 00:36:25.679 a close relationship. There's a mutual respect, of mutual admiration and yeah, 452 00:36:27.440 --> 00:36:35.400 it's been it's been a blessing to have a brother. Oh Ull, do 453 00:36:35.480 --> 00:36:43.480 you feel the same way as Absolutely, it's it's more pros and cons having 454 00:36:43.519 --> 00:36:50.360 a better from my point of view. Um. I think also it's also 455 00:36:50.440 --> 00:36:52.760 down to the parenting, even though we were probably parented by different people, 456 00:36:53.199 --> 00:37:00.280 because twelve years in that time people change and probably parents. What I've learned 457 00:37:00.400 --> 00:37:05.280 from what they've done with Andrea and what I've done things differently with me. 458 00:37:05.960 --> 00:37:10.119 But the principle of what they taught us it was the same, um to 459 00:37:10.320 --> 00:37:16.480 some to some extent, so um, but I was always the I guess 460 00:37:16.800 --> 00:37:21.599 it's a common thing where whenever are would be around, I would want to 461 00:37:21.679 --> 00:37:24.840 be right by his like or wherever he would wanted to go. Even though 462 00:37:24.920 --> 00:37:29.199 I couldn't go everywhere with him I did. I just wanted to be there. 463 00:37:29.440 --> 00:37:34.880 And part of the influence of music that you had just fell straight back 464 00:37:34.920 --> 00:37:37.199 on me. And then I had my own group and to this day we 465 00:37:37.320 --> 00:37:42.159 sang in London make this karale together. And so music has always been that 466 00:37:42.280 --> 00:37:46.800 kind of threat that blinded us together even more. Even you were supposed to 467 00:37:46.880 --> 00:37:52.159 sing this, we came coming up, but somehow he's not able to make 468 00:37:52.199 --> 00:37:53.360 it up. But that's fine, we will make it up for another time. 469 00:37:54.000 --> 00:38:00.639 UM. But yeah, we're definitely much closer now as a pretty much 470 00:38:00.760 --> 00:38:06.440 making up for the times that he was away while I was still young and 471 00:38:07.159 --> 00:38:09.000 still kind of played a bit of ketchup and whenever you get the chance to. 472 00:38:09.159 --> 00:38:15.000 Even though we're far apart, I mean personalities and colchister, most of 473 00:38:15.079 --> 00:38:20.760 our bonding will be either through what's that catchingly, how are you doing? 474 00:38:20.960 --> 00:38:23.519 What's life like? And trying to make sure we advise each other the best 475 00:38:23.559 --> 00:38:30.679 way we know how. Yeah, technology has certainly helped in terms of keeping 476 00:38:30.039 --> 00:38:34.199 our families closer. I can't imagine doing it when you had to do it 477 00:38:34.239 --> 00:38:37.760 buy paper and pen, you know, many many years ago. We're going 478 00:38:37.840 --> 00:38:40.360 to take a break with stick a pin right here. I have a lineup 479 00:38:40.400 --> 00:38:45.360 of songs from siblings. In fact, we're going to start perhaps with that 480 00:38:45.280 --> 00:38:49.840 Mary, Mary. I'm running and when we come back, I will ask 481 00:38:50.000 --> 00:38:52.960 our therapists to unpack because a lot of that has come up during a conversation. 482 00:38:53.360 --> 00:38:58.800 Maybe to talk to our parents and talk about parenting and how significant that 483 00:38:59.199 --> 00:39:06.960 is in sort of managing and sort of developing that sibling relationship. Yeah, 484 00:39:07.400 --> 00:39:13.320 all right, you're listening to Advantis Radio London and it's talking point back with 485 00:39:13.440 --> 00:39:45.400 you after this when you speak to me I have direction, but I woke 486 00:39:45.599 --> 00:39:52.880 up today. You ain't said nothing down which way? Do not go? 487 00:39:53.199 --> 00:40:00.840 And tell me when do I? Because I will never know if I don't 488 00:40:00.960 --> 00:40:27.639 get to you. So fine, it's hard, but it's worth getting looking 489 00:40:28.719 --> 00:40:34.840 said, I'm just trying to find you. It feels like Danny, I'm 490 00:40:34.880 --> 00:40:40.719 so last without you. But I'm feeling that spread and I don't want to 491 00:40:42.000 --> 00:40:54.199 feelings because I need a solution. Walking, just walking walking matter, my 492 00:40:54.559 --> 00:41:04.239 boy, it's gonna get to where you are. I gotta go. We 493 00:41:04.360 --> 00:41:19.639 gotta go and show where as the tear passy waters all my soul, get 494 00:41:19.800 --> 00:41:50.639 down on my heart, desire and two words then I get, I stop 495 00:41:55.760 --> 00:42:23.960 and wall. This is one run and I can start set. I'm mind 496 00:42:24.719 --> 00:42:34.599 and I won't start. I won't sid I'm mind, run money, I 497 00:42:34.800 --> 00:42:51.000 want it running to my keeper, to my help. You love Mary Mary. 498 00:42:51.760 --> 00:42:54.719 Um, It's siblings Part two, and I've got a lineup of siblings. 499 00:42:55.000 --> 00:43:00.440 Um, justin give us a little break in between. I think. 500 00:43:00.559 --> 00:43:06.880 Next, we've got BBCC widens. Who doesn't love that dynamic duo. We're 501 00:43:07.000 --> 00:43:12.719 back and we're talking to siblings, we are talking to therapists. It's all 502 00:43:12.760 --> 00:43:15.519 happening here this afternoon, but it's been a really good discussion so far. 503 00:43:15.639 --> 00:43:20.039 And I think for me, where I'd like to go next is to talk 504 00:43:20.159 --> 00:43:23.559 to our parents and to talk about parenting, because from all the conversation that 505 00:43:23.679 --> 00:43:30.079 we've had, we've realized how crucial and parenting or what part that plays in 506 00:43:30.199 --> 00:43:35.519 the sibling relationship. And I'm going to go straight to our therapist and perhaps 507 00:43:35.559 --> 00:43:39.960 they can shed some light on that to help us to unpack unpack that what 508 00:43:40.599 --> 00:43:46.039 part do our parents play? And I'm thinking now of the story of Joseph. 509 00:43:47.559 --> 00:43:52.079 That always comes to mind because he was doted on by his father, 510 00:43:52.320 --> 00:43:58.079 he was spoiled by his father, he was cherished by his father, perhaps 511 00:43:58.800 --> 00:44:06.119 more than the others, maybe not perhaps, And I think that had a 512 00:44:06.199 --> 00:44:09.519 part to play in how the brothers felt about him. And we all know 513 00:44:09.639 --> 00:44:14.599 how that story ended to God with the glory, but there were some really 514 00:44:14.800 --> 00:44:21.039 rough patches in between. Dorothy, I'm going to I'm coming to you first, 515 00:44:21.880 --> 00:44:30.599 what part do our parents play in that sibling relationship? A very very 516 00:44:30.760 --> 00:44:37.360 important part as parents. There there's so many different roles because you don't want 517 00:44:37.360 --> 00:44:39.760 to be too much involved. So what I would say First, it's about 518 00:44:39.760 --> 00:44:46.199 to create, creating an atmosphere so the children can feel like they can talk 519 00:44:46.400 --> 00:44:54.679 together. It's important for parents to help them to navigate it, but allow 520 00:44:54.760 --> 00:45:00.840 them to talk and to develop and that that environment where they can talk one 521 00:45:00.440 --> 00:45:08.400 to another you talked about, Joseph. It's about celebrating each child's uniqueness and 522 00:45:08.679 --> 00:45:16.119 talking about that as a family and encouraging that talk, giving them space to 523 00:45:16.280 --> 00:45:22.679 be themselves and encouraging them to talk as one. It's all about creating that 524 00:45:23.000 --> 00:45:31.400 atmosphere, treating each children as individuals, celebrating each children and allowing them to 525 00:45:31.480 --> 00:45:37.880 talk one to another. I think that's really important. Put them in the 526 00:45:37.960 --> 00:45:40.360 ring together. I can say that as I said that I've come from a 527 00:45:40.519 --> 00:45:45.280 big family. Our parents they would listen. So if I had a complaint 528 00:45:45.280 --> 00:45:49.159 about my brother, my parents would listen to me and encourage me. Or 529 00:45:49.239 --> 00:45:52.000 don't worry. Maybe your brother didn't mean it. Why don't you tell your 530 00:45:52.039 --> 00:45:55.559 brother how you felt. I think that's the important thing for your parents to 531 00:45:55.599 --> 00:45:59.760 be parents and encourage them. What would it be like and if they can 532 00:45:59.840 --> 00:46:06.280 do together, allow them to. But you may need to also being there 533 00:46:06.599 --> 00:46:10.760 and mediate between the two of them. Media listen to both of them and 534 00:46:12.039 --> 00:46:15.599 mediate, but really listen to the children, allow them to have their space, 535 00:46:16.400 --> 00:46:24.119 one with you, one with each other. Absolutely, Kelly, let 536 00:46:24.199 --> 00:46:31.800 me ask you this, how much of how we treat each other, how 537 00:46:31.960 --> 00:46:39.199 we communicate, how we manage our conflicts, is based on how we see 538 00:46:39.280 --> 00:46:45.480 our parents do that. How much of everything we see and what we everything, 539 00:46:45.719 --> 00:46:51.719 because it's you know, the way how our parents treat us, the 540 00:46:51.800 --> 00:46:58.000 way how our parents handle each other, as in, parents sets the blueprint 541 00:46:58.519 --> 00:47:07.400 for children as to how they then manage their relationships. So if parents find 542 00:47:07.480 --> 00:47:14.280 it very difficult to manage conflict, children are absorbing that environment. Because they 543 00:47:14.400 --> 00:47:22.239 say that seventy parent teaching is modeling, is through modeling, and thirty percent 544 00:47:22.519 --> 00:47:25.119 is actual teaching, as in telling them what they should be doing. So 545 00:47:25.280 --> 00:47:30.880 children are watching, you know, even as babies, they are watching and 546 00:47:30.960 --> 00:47:35.320 they've already sussed their parents out in terms of how to kind of manage things. 547 00:47:35.760 --> 00:47:42.039 So it's very very important. Parenting is the key to how children are 548 00:47:42.119 --> 00:47:47.079 able to you know, engage with one another, engage with them, and 549 00:47:47.679 --> 00:47:52.320 you know, it's it's everything. Don't I like what you said? And 550 00:47:52.440 --> 00:47:58.519 thank you Kelly for adding to it. Andrey Pedrol, both parents on the 551 00:47:58.599 --> 00:48:04.599 panel. How much how involved do you get because Dorothy does say that you 552 00:48:04.679 --> 00:48:07.239 need to you get involved as you're needed. You step back, you navigate, 553 00:48:07.360 --> 00:48:15.360 you you um sort of mediate. So how involved do you get as 554 00:48:15.480 --> 00:48:17.800 you because you've got kids as well, how involved do you get in in 555 00:48:19.119 --> 00:48:27.920 the arguments and the discrepancies between them? Just interested to know. I was 556 00:48:27.960 --> 00:48:30.400 just thinking about what Dorothy said. I forgot it was Dorothy or the other 557 00:48:30.920 --> 00:48:35.679 therapists we had on the last time with the siblings, and that was so 558 00:48:35.800 --> 00:48:38.159 then my wife and I both started to do was to not get in between 559 00:48:38.239 --> 00:48:44.320 their arguments because my wife had a habit even me even myself sometimes of like 560 00:48:44.880 --> 00:48:51.440 they stopped bickering like like a a stop. And we noticed now that when 561 00:48:51.480 --> 00:48:54.760 they stop bickering or when they start having a disagreement amongst themselves, just let 562 00:48:54.800 --> 00:49:00.159 them be and just knowing when to step in when when when you know it's 563 00:49:00.159 --> 00:49:05.800 just getting too much. So we actually start using that that thought process from 564 00:49:05.880 --> 00:49:08.880 the last time where we had the siblings um meeting a couple of weeks ago, 565 00:49:09.320 --> 00:49:13.159 and we noticed a big difference that they seem to work it out on 566 00:49:13.239 --> 00:49:16.000 their own and um, we just let them. You know, that is 567 00:49:16.280 --> 00:49:21.760 that is healthy for them to actually argue with each other because I think sometimes 568 00:49:21.840 --> 00:49:23.920 as parents we have a tendency to not have the kids argue at all. 569 00:49:24.519 --> 00:49:27.880 But yeah, then they see us, they see my wife and I arguing, 570 00:49:28.239 --> 00:49:30.719 but then they also see us. They may see us having a disagreement, 571 00:49:31.280 --> 00:49:37.159 but then they also see us okay, diffusing this disagreement and then coming 572 00:49:37.199 --> 00:49:42.360 to a compromise. And so they they're learning that process too. Now when 573 00:49:42.400 --> 00:49:45.639 they when they're discussing something that they don't like, that they can express to 574 00:49:45.840 --> 00:49:50.960 each other like um, Kelly said, how how Doughty said to how they're 575 00:49:51.000 --> 00:49:52.440 feeling, and then the other one can say, Okay, I'm sorry, 576 00:49:52.440 --> 00:49:58.039 I didn't realize you felt that way. And we were actually seeing the progression 577 00:49:58.199 --> 00:50:04.159 of their mind thinking and their because my oldest is it's gonna be fifteen and 578 00:50:04.280 --> 00:50:07.599 then another one's gonna be thirteen. So as teenagers, you know, it's 579 00:50:07.639 --> 00:50:09.400 just a lot of homemones, a lot of things going on. So some 580 00:50:09.559 --> 00:50:14.199 days they're just having a bad day. Sometimes school is just a little stressed 581 00:50:14.239 --> 00:50:16.239 for them, so and sometimes they take it out on each other. So 582 00:50:16.320 --> 00:50:21.960 we're learning we're actually learning that that is actually a good thing to let them 583 00:50:22.159 --> 00:50:24.400 work it out on their own. It's just when they come to us and 584 00:50:24.440 --> 00:50:28.599 say, look, you know this is going on, then we kind of 585 00:50:28.639 --> 00:50:30.960 step in and say, okay, we sit down, we have worship. 586 00:50:30.320 --> 00:50:35.119 Doing worship. A lot of times if they have a disagreement, I won't 587 00:50:35.119 --> 00:50:38.079 say anything. I'll wait to worship, and then doing worship, I would 588 00:50:38.159 --> 00:50:43.079 then address the whole I was just the hope now, like because sometimes you 589 00:50:43.320 --> 00:50:45.719 gotta let it breathe. So they have a disagreement, I won't even say 590 00:50:45.760 --> 00:50:50.239 nothing right away. I I let just the argument or the disagreement going. 591 00:50:50.280 --> 00:50:52.840 They can be mad at each other for an hour or two. But then 592 00:50:52.880 --> 00:50:57.519 when we have worship, I'll address it and then explain, and then I 593 00:50:57.559 --> 00:51:00.800 can see that mine's working. Like, Okay, maybe I did overreact, 594 00:51:00.519 --> 00:51:04.360 maybe I didn't you know, maybe I took it in the wrong way and 595 00:51:04.440 --> 00:51:07.599 I could have thought of it in a different way. So I just noticed 596 00:51:07.639 --> 00:51:10.199 that that's the best way to do it, like have a family setting, 597 00:51:10.239 --> 00:51:14.760 as they said, have that family setting, have them all together, and 598 00:51:14.840 --> 00:51:17.039 then we talk about it. Yeah, And as Dorothy said, communication is 599 00:51:17.159 --> 00:51:22.039 key. Communication is key. The ability to communicate with each other. Um, 600 00:51:22.320 --> 00:51:31.800 andre I didn't want peace and quiet, feel quiet? Um no, 601 00:51:32.239 --> 00:51:37.559 I think that's that's that's often what prompts his parents to jump in, and 602 00:51:37.760 --> 00:51:43.639 he would annoys, shut up, keep quiet. Stop. But um, 603 00:51:45.159 --> 00:51:51.159 especially with my my two younger children, they are as thick as thieves there 604 00:51:51.239 --> 00:51:57.920 you cannot separate them. But in life fashion, they argue just as fierce 605 00:51:58.639 --> 00:52:05.079 as they love each other. So it's um letting them work it out. 606 00:52:05.719 --> 00:52:07.599 Let them work it out. It teaches them how to deal with conflict, 607 00:52:07.639 --> 00:52:14.519 how to manage disagreements. But then there are those times when either one is 608 00:52:14.599 --> 00:52:17.440 just not letting the others speak. For example, at that point, maybe 609 00:52:17.440 --> 00:52:23.519 you can step in itself, listen, let let her talk and listen, 610 00:52:24.000 --> 00:52:28.119 and then you get to talk, so you kind of mediate but don't get 611 00:52:28.159 --> 00:52:31.519 involved. And if it gets a bit too hot, you could try a 612 00:52:31.559 --> 00:52:36.000 little joke just to try and just taper off some of the theme, as 613 00:52:36.039 --> 00:52:42.280 it were. But it works better when you let them work it out, 614 00:52:43.639 --> 00:52:45.440 and sometimes you don't. You can just sit back and just watch it play 615 00:52:45.480 --> 00:52:50.599 out and have a good laugh, and another time will come out you share 616 00:52:50.639 --> 00:52:54.320 that same story and you get everyone has a laugh about it, but it 617 00:52:54.519 --> 00:53:00.199 is sometimes hard to watch them all out, especially it's getting kind of serious. 618 00:53:00.280 --> 00:53:05.719 It is hard to step back and let it play out. But more 619 00:53:05.760 --> 00:53:08.079 often that it is a better option, the better way of dealing with it. 620 00:53:08.920 --> 00:53:15.239 Okay, um, And that kind of thank you ANDREI that lends itself 621 00:53:15.360 --> 00:53:20.800 to our next sort of topic of discussion. What are some of these issues 622 00:53:20.880 --> 00:53:27.239 that create conflict between siblings? Um? You know, what are the hot 623 00:53:27.559 --> 00:53:34.719 points of the hot issues amongst us that can really push our buttons? Um? 624 00:53:35.719 --> 00:53:40.719 Angela Samantha, Samantha, you there, hello, Yes, I hear 625 00:53:42.320 --> 00:53:46.239 weekend we can, Um, we didn't hear enough of your story, and 626 00:53:46.320 --> 00:53:52.440 I think we want to start there because we ran out of time last last 627 00:53:52.800 --> 00:53:58.039 um, well, the last show siblings won tell us a little bit about 628 00:53:58.079 --> 00:54:00.719 you, um, and to the sister, we know that we've got that 629 00:54:00.880 --> 00:54:06.519 down, but tell us a little bit about you and then maybe you can 630 00:54:07.400 --> 00:54:09.480 talk about the relationship. I know last time you spoke, you said, 631 00:54:09.800 --> 00:54:15.119 and I think it's been alluded to in our conversations thus far that it's a 632 00:54:15.159 --> 00:54:19.719 little dicey at first. You know, as young uns, we're feisty, 633 00:54:20.519 --> 00:54:23.000 and as we grow, our hormones, et cetera, et cetera. But 634 00:54:23.679 --> 00:54:30.119 Dorothy has mentioned, as has been mentioned with Pedrow, as you get older, 635 00:54:30.519 --> 00:54:34.519 you come to value that relationship. You come to value your siblings a 636 00:54:34.599 --> 00:54:37.960 lot more. Um, so tell us about you and then we start to 637 00:54:38.039 --> 00:54:45.639 talk about that development between and that growing between you and Angela. Okay, 638 00:54:45.920 --> 00:54:52.480 well, Semantha was born and raised in the UK. Um, born in 639 00:54:52.599 --> 00:54:55.519 Derby. Then we moved down south to Hampshire and then was last living in 640 00:54:55.840 --> 00:55:02.199 London. One minute, how do you get this US accent? Then in 641 00:55:02.400 --> 00:55:07.719 London? All right? Okay, in South London? Yeah so um, 642 00:55:08.639 --> 00:55:12.880 yeah, So I work in human resources. So I've been doing that for 643 00:55:12.960 --> 00:55:16.760 a number of years for different companies. Um, twelve years ago I moved 644 00:55:16.800 --> 00:55:22.920 to the US. So my husband's American. So when we obviously decided to 645 00:55:23.039 --> 00:55:28.159 get married, I had to figure out does he come here to the UK 646 00:55:28.480 --> 00:55:30.199 or do I go to the US. I chose to go to the US, 647 00:55:30.280 --> 00:55:34.920 and twelve years here I am, although I'm over in the UK right 648 00:55:35.000 --> 00:55:39.599 now. Yeah. So I live in Connecticut, which is near New York 649 00:55:39.599 --> 00:55:45.119 because no one really has heard of Connecticut. U. Yeah, so they 650 00:55:45.280 --> 00:55:52.079 have any children? And yeah, so that's me. Obviously I have two 651 00:55:52.159 --> 00:55:58.400 siblings, so Angela is my older sister, and then I have a younger 652 00:55:58.480 --> 00:56:02.360 sister, Charlie, as well, So that's a bit about me. So 653 00:56:02.800 --> 00:56:06.800 I mean, I guess pivoting to what you were asking around the kind of 654 00:56:06.880 --> 00:56:12.679 dynamics. So you know, what I remember is, you know, obviously 655 00:56:12.880 --> 00:56:15.599 Angela was first, and then I came along four and a half years later, 656 00:56:16.280 --> 00:56:21.519 and I think I had definitely second child syndrome. I think that's the 657 00:56:21.599 --> 00:56:25.039 thing. New therapists probably will say that what is that, but I didn't 658 00:56:25.039 --> 00:56:29.880 believe it is. And I remember like kind of just always striving to be 659 00:56:30.039 --> 00:56:35.719 doing what my older sister had opportunities to do. I just felt like it 660 00:56:35.960 --> 00:56:38.840 wasn't fair if I couldn't go this place or that place, or couldn't get 661 00:56:38.880 --> 00:56:43.239 this and couldn't get that. And so I found that I was, you 662 00:56:43.320 --> 00:56:45.880 know, wishing I was older, and then you know, trying to hang 663 00:56:45.960 --> 00:56:52.320 out with my sister and her friends and you know, she'd be like, 664 00:56:52.440 --> 00:56:54.559 no, no, you're too young and etce. So I would be like, 665 00:56:54.719 --> 00:57:00.880 no, no, I'm wearing an old close and all of that kind 666 00:57:00.920 --> 00:57:05.199 of thing. So I kind of went through that phase for sure. Um. 667 00:57:06.119 --> 00:57:07.800 And then you know, between my sister and I, you know, 668 00:57:07.920 --> 00:57:12.119 we would fight at times because I think I've got a little bit of a 669 00:57:12.239 --> 00:57:22.159 bossy nature, so um, I would set faces on radio, so I'd 670 00:57:22.239 --> 00:57:27.440 be like sometimes acting as if I'm the older sibling, you know, and 671 00:57:27.760 --> 00:57:31.239 sometimes that would cause you know, tension, and you know, we'd fight, 672 00:57:32.079 --> 00:57:35.519 just argue and things like that. So I wouldn't say that when we 673 00:57:35.559 --> 00:57:39.079 were younger we were that close, but I think you know, as obviously, 674 00:57:39.119 --> 00:57:43.679 Angela moved out went to university and I was I was at home. 675 00:57:44.280 --> 00:57:49.199 Um, and then eventually I moved out. And then over that time, 676 00:57:49.280 --> 00:57:52.840 as we're kind of just adapting and trying to just figure out, um, 677 00:57:53.000 --> 00:57:58.119 you know, our life more independently, that's when I felt like, you 678 00:57:58.239 --> 00:58:01.039 know, we became much more close. Um, you know, spend time 679 00:58:01.239 --> 00:58:06.480 and things like that, and over time, you know, I do, 680 00:58:07.320 --> 00:58:09.880 you know, feel that our relationship has just got strengthened, for sure. 681 00:58:10.679 --> 00:58:15.880 UM. So it was a big thing then when obviously moving to the US 682 00:58:15.960 --> 00:58:20.920 and kind of making that decision because obviously that provides you know, it's a 683 00:58:21.039 --> 00:58:24.079 distance now which we didn't have before. We didn't we had distance of just 684 00:58:24.440 --> 00:58:28.400 you know, being a different part of the country, but being in another 685 00:58:28.519 --> 00:58:31.559 country and then having to do with the time zone difference. You know, 686 00:58:31.639 --> 00:58:36.000 it's been quite harder. But that in of itself, I guess going through 687 00:58:36.039 --> 00:58:38.760 that experience, we have got you know, like closer. Um, so 688 00:58:39.039 --> 00:58:42.920 I guess there's some kind of benefits to a certain extent where they say, 689 00:58:42.960 --> 00:58:45.440 you know, absence makes the heart grow fonder, and I think there's some 690 00:58:45.920 --> 00:58:50.280 you know, some some truth to that in terms of that. So so 691 00:58:50.480 --> 00:58:52.920 yeah, so that's I guess, you know, one aspect and then the 692 00:58:53.000 --> 00:58:59.360 other aspect is being obviously an older sibling. I always wished, you know, 693 00:58:59.440 --> 00:59:04.639 I had younger you know siblings as well, and so obviously Charlene came 694 00:59:04.760 --> 00:59:10.239 along. I think the difference with me is let's see, eleven years no 695 00:59:10.480 --> 00:59:15.119 sorry, nine years, nine years different age difference. Um. And so 696 00:59:16.280 --> 00:59:21.159 what was interesting with that though, is that you know, she has special 697 00:59:21.239 --> 00:59:25.119 needs, so she had learning difficulties. So she's thirty eight m she's a 698 00:59:25.239 --> 00:59:31.360 very loving sister, and we saw obviously really like grow but obviously wanting to 699 00:59:31.519 --> 00:59:38.679 experience um, you know, the I guess normal aspects of person kind of 700 00:59:38.760 --> 00:59:45.440 developing as a child and going into adulthood just really didn't experience that, And 701 00:59:45.559 --> 00:59:49.000 you know, that's been in of itself, you know, challenging and sad 702 00:59:49.280 --> 00:59:52.039 because I often wish, oh, what would it be like if you know, 703 00:59:52.519 --> 00:59:57.679 she didn't have this challenge? UM, you know what the dynamic as 704 00:59:58.079 --> 01:00:02.239 three sisters would be, UM and things like that and so UM. But 705 01:00:02.559 --> 01:00:07.840 you know, I would change it, though, because she is just such 706 01:00:07.920 --> 01:00:12.239 a wonderful, wonderful sister, loving sister, and I you know, miss 707 01:00:12.239 --> 01:00:16.440 her dearly. UM went to see her yesterday, UM in a care home 708 01:00:16.599 --> 01:00:22.599 and she's just all smiles and stuff like that. So but obviously I don't 709 01:00:22.639 --> 01:00:25.039 know what it feels like to you know, obviously you know have like unlike 710 01:00:25.079 --> 01:00:29.039 my sister, having a younger sister, UM, you know, and kind 711 01:00:29.039 --> 01:00:31.679 of building that relationship. It's been a sort of a different dynamic in that 712 01:00:31.800 --> 01:00:37.280 front. Okay, you did you did you see it the same way? 713 01:00:37.360 --> 01:00:40.039 Did you experience it the same way? Did you feel that it's Do you 714 01:00:40.119 --> 01:00:45.400 feel that your relationship has certainly grown, um and gotten stronger over the years. 715 01:00:46.199 --> 01:00:51.400 Yeah, definitely. I think it's interesting. But you know, sort 716 01:00:51.400 --> 01:00:54.000 of talking about the age difference, UM, I maybe don't remember it quiet 717 01:00:54.000 --> 01:00:58.199 like that, because iimes I kind of think she's saying about the second child. 718 01:00:58.239 --> 01:01:00.079 I kind of think I made things really easy for her because I probably 719 01:01:00.079 --> 01:01:02.840 did loads of stuff, got into loads of trouble for it, and then 720 01:01:02.920 --> 01:01:06.199 you know, smile to have the opportunities to do things. And I would 721 01:01:06.239 --> 01:01:08.159 look back and think, if it wasn't for me, you'd never have that 722 01:01:08.239 --> 01:01:13.760 opportunity. And I guess that's understandable. You know, parents kind of you, 723 01:01:14.719 --> 01:01:16.000 they kind of relax a little bit, that sort of thing um. 724 01:01:16.920 --> 01:01:19.880 And I kind of think, I mean, I'd like to think I was 725 01:01:19.880 --> 01:01:22.159 a cool big sister as well, So as much as she maybe felt she 726 01:01:22.199 --> 01:01:27.239 couldn't do things, I probably did bring her along to stuff. I remember. 727 01:01:27.280 --> 01:01:30.000 Actually maybe it's just my imagination, but even when I had my own 728 01:01:30.039 --> 01:01:32.239 flat and stuff, I'd say, you know, come down with your friends. 729 01:01:32.280 --> 01:01:35.599 I'm going out. You can come and hang out at my place. 730 01:01:35.840 --> 01:01:38.039 So she had an older sister that she could bring her friends down to stay. 731 01:01:38.199 --> 01:01:42.199 They hear my place and that sort of thing. So I think I 732 01:01:42.280 --> 01:01:45.800 paid the way, but I interesting. I think Andre was saying about his 733 01:01:45.920 --> 01:01:50.400 two young his two children who think of seeds, but they fight equally. 734 01:01:50.760 --> 01:01:53.199 I think there has been times when we have really argued, but at the 735 01:01:53.239 --> 01:01:58.440 same time really concocted stories between us that would say, Okay, we're going 736 01:01:58.480 --> 01:02:01.000 to get into trouble by a parents, but you know what, Okay, 737 01:02:01.079 --> 01:02:05.599 we'll contact this story so we can try and get out of trouble, even 738 01:02:05.679 --> 01:02:07.599 though apparently probably just think, I don't know why you think you can try 739 01:02:07.599 --> 01:02:09.880 and pull the wool over our eyes, but we did. So we'd be 740 01:02:09.960 --> 01:02:15.480 scheming with each other, and we had a secret language as well. You 741 01:02:15.599 --> 01:02:27.800 know, children speak when we speak Haggy Peggy. Oh, and again that 742 01:02:27.920 --> 01:02:31.440 was our way of communicating. So our parents didn't you know, didn't understand. 743 01:02:32.079 --> 01:02:36.079 Um, you cut out, So you're saying that you speak, you 744 01:02:36.199 --> 01:02:38.159 two speak a different language, Hagy Peggy. Did I hear that one? 745 01:02:38.920 --> 01:02:55.480 Hey you thank you? Um you can Dorothy, Okay, Hey Lego, 746 01:02:57.199 --> 01:03:02.519 UM, I gonna say take a Kegyegan vegas nag and zeggas megang Mega eggs 747 01:03:02.519 --> 01:03:10.000 egger jagger Lega will tell you what I said. So she basically said that 748 01:03:10.159 --> 01:03:15.800 her name is Angela, and I was saying hello, talking point listening the 749 01:03:15.880 --> 01:03:19.880 way of kinds of you put different sounds and fancy break down the word put 750 01:03:19.960 --> 01:03:22.000 sounds to count to the back the vowels and what have you. So, 751 01:03:22.480 --> 01:03:25.880 yeah, we did all We did all that as we were younger, which 752 01:03:27.000 --> 01:03:38.360 is very handy, very clever. Did you have to oh my gosh, 753 01:03:43.159 --> 01:03:47.199 oh pig Latin? Yeah, yeah, okay, oh yeah, exactly. 754 01:03:47.280 --> 01:03:52.960 That's a similar one as well. So, um, unless we've got older. 755 01:03:52.079 --> 01:03:54.719 I mean, as Spanta talked about, you know, um, when 756 01:03:54.760 --> 01:04:00.599 she moved away, I remember feeling really devastated, actually thinking not that I've 757 01:04:00.679 --> 01:04:03.440 lost her, but you know, the distance is a big distance. However, 758 01:04:03.639 --> 01:04:08.760 we probably I mean we practically speak most days at least a couple of 759 01:04:08.840 --> 01:04:13.880 times during the day, so probably grown a lot closer. Um, there 760 01:04:13.960 --> 01:04:17.119 are probably times where you have to sometimes wonder who is the oldest at the 761 01:04:17.199 --> 01:04:21.519 two I think that kind of five year difference has really reduced in terms of 762 01:04:21.679 --> 01:04:27.000 how we're what we're like. We've got very different personalities but also quite similar. 763 01:04:27.559 --> 01:04:29.760 And then I think, you know, with our relationship with our young 764 01:04:29.840 --> 01:04:32.480 with Charlie and our younger sister, again the closeness there as well. I 765 01:04:32.599 --> 01:04:36.599 know I'm fiercely protective of both of them, you know, we'd do absolutely 766 01:04:36.639 --> 01:04:41.320 anything for them, you know, we'd try to do and I like, 767 01:04:41.360 --> 01:04:43.840 you know, trying to do as much as I can for them in one 768 01:04:43.880 --> 01:04:46.079 of the situations. So you know, I take my role as a big 769 01:04:46.119 --> 01:04:54.280 sister really seriously, you know. But yeah, it's been it's an interesting 770 01:04:54.400 --> 01:04:57.039 ride, and I'm really glad for the relationships that I have. You know, 771 01:04:57.119 --> 01:05:01.000 I think it's been able to me to develop skills resilient. It's been 772 01:05:01.119 --> 01:05:04.760 very character building, you know, all along. So like I said at 773 01:05:04.800 --> 01:05:09.320 the beginning, definitely a benefit. And I think, you know, i'd 774 01:05:09.360 --> 01:05:11.920 like to think, you know, my sisters have learnt something from me, 775 01:05:12.079 --> 01:05:16.000 and equally I've learnt a lot from them as well, you know, and 776 01:05:16.199 --> 01:05:20.440 despite the challenges, and I think it's just again finding ways to deal with 777 01:05:20.559 --> 01:05:24.800 those challenges in a really positive way, if there is such a thing, 778 01:05:26.119 --> 01:05:30.119 or maybe Dorothy and doth Kelly and nodding their heads and some of the things 779 01:05:30.159 --> 01:05:32.159 you've been saying. So I guess there's a lot to unpack there as well. 780 01:05:33.800 --> 01:05:38.119 So yeah, so I'll leave that there, and the Sun's got something 781 01:05:38.159 --> 01:05:41.239 else to add on that one. I mean, one thing I will say 782 01:05:41.239 --> 01:05:45.280 about Angela, She's like very resourceful, so you know it's like, oh, 783 01:05:45.800 --> 01:05:47.440 have you got this? I'll go to her house and you know, 784 01:05:47.599 --> 01:05:53.360 she basically has all the clothes and all the gadgets and this and that. 785 01:05:53.559 --> 01:05:56.920 You know, so I've never left wanting, so I really appreciate the fact 786 01:05:56.960 --> 01:06:00.960 that, you know, Angela will always you know they call Mary popping that 787 01:06:00.079 --> 01:06:05.800 she has everything in her bag or just everything around. So there's there's that, 788 01:06:06.039 --> 01:06:10.880 and so obviously I think we'd compliment because, as Angela said, you 789 01:06:10.920 --> 01:06:14.639 know, very different skills and personality, but I think, you know, 790 01:06:14.920 --> 01:06:17.320 where there will be things that I fall short of, you know, she'll 791 01:06:17.400 --> 01:06:21.079 be excelling in that and vice versa. And then together, you know, 792 01:06:21.199 --> 01:06:27.159 I think complimentary as how we kind of you operated as a unit to support 793 01:06:27.199 --> 01:06:30.280 each other. So yeah, and I think that's also a testiment probably to 794 01:06:30.360 --> 01:06:32.039 our parents as well. I mean, I think as we were brought up 795 01:06:32.320 --> 01:06:38.599 to be very much independent and kind of resourceful to do things, we take 796 01:06:38.599 --> 01:06:42.840 a lot of characteristics from our parents. We lost our dad when we were 797 01:06:42.880 --> 01:06:45.440 fairly young, so again we've probably had to almost conversate for some of that 798 01:06:45.559 --> 01:06:49.760 as well. But you know, I think we were taught to kind of 799 01:06:49.880 --> 01:06:54.280 strife for things, to be able to do things off our own kind of 800 01:06:54.320 --> 01:06:56.920 our own back and do stuff. You know, we will always talked to 801 01:06:57.039 --> 01:07:00.000 be you can be something. How we were in to do lots of different 802 01:07:00.000 --> 01:07:03.280 activities, different things, so you know we probably could do random things that 803 01:07:03.320 --> 01:07:05.639 maybe you sorry you think, Ah, I didn't know you could do that, 804 01:07:05.920 --> 01:07:09.360 but yeah, we've always been and we've always been like that as well. 805 01:07:09.480 --> 01:07:12.199 So you know, as you talk about parents and the role that they 806 01:07:12.280 --> 01:07:15.440 play, I think that's been a big part of it as well. Wonderful, 807 01:07:16.079 --> 01:07:20.000 Um, everyone's so close and so loving. I think the next the 808 01:07:20.119 --> 01:07:23.880 next segment of the next section has to be about conflict. We need to 809 01:07:24.159 --> 01:07:27.800 we need to unpack some of that and see if there's been anything that we 810 01:07:27.920 --> 01:07:33.280 need to talk about that's transpired between our siblings that we can maybe delve into, 811 01:07:34.159 --> 01:07:38.320 because I'm sure it has. I mean that's the nature of relationships. 812 01:07:38.400 --> 01:07:41.639 They're good times and bad times, and I think the beauty of it is 813 01:07:41.679 --> 01:07:44.599 being able to navigate them all. Um, So we're going to take a 814 01:07:44.599 --> 01:07:47.760 break, baby and cc um. The selection is called Grace, and when 815 01:07:47.800 --> 01:07:50.840 we come back, we'll talk about conflict and maybe Dorothy and Kelly can in 816 01:07:50.920 --> 01:07:56.239 their professional capacity, speak about some of those conflicts that they have come across. 817 01:07:56.320 --> 01:08:00.400 What's what's prevalent, what do you usually see among siblings? And then 818 01:08:00.480 --> 01:08:04.480 our siblings can speak maybe of conflicts that they've navigated um on their own. 819 01:08:19.359 --> 01:08:30.239 He wrought me my trials, He wrought me through tribulations, never let a 820 01:08:30.359 --> 01:08:36.359 day gone back. And I realize, and I've been the lord who was 821 01:08:36.439 --> 01:08:43.800 on my side, go against the wall, little goble of me. He 822 01:08:44.159 --> 01:08:49.560 heard my pride and restilled him. Never let a day go back in I 823 01:08:49.840 --> 01:09:11.000 be alive right here to die. Shine and weird blessing and the highly babor 824 01:09:14.239 --> 01:09:24.560 shines and weird blessing and the highly baby. I would said that one more 825 01:09:24.600 --> 01:09:34.439 time. He brought me my trials. He brought me through tremulation, Never 826 01:09:34.600 --> 01:09:42.239 let a day go by, and I feel life and happen. For the 827 01:09:42.359 --> 01:09:46.279 lord who was on my side that goes against the wall. He looked tough 828 01:09:46.359 --> 01:09:54.960 for me, he hearl cry and rescue me. Never let a day go 829 01:09:55.199 --> 01:10:16.600 life. And I realize d taking the land. And we name how many 830 01:10:16.600 --> 01:10:28.520 of you believe she has no no less and Ida, I just want you 831 01:10:28.520 --> 01:10:34.800 to take a look back back don't you know that it's a busy. It's 832 01:10:34.880 --> 01:10:45.319 amazing how he the tevil? What's the devil? Then turn around around, 833 01:10:53.439 --> 01:11:09.079 baby true here and I babor. I just want you to think about it 834 01:11:09.199 --> 01:11:15.960 for a moment. It could have been me. It should have been me. 835 01:11:17.039 --> 01:11:21.840 It would have been me. If it was the mother black, it 836 01:11:23.079 --> 01:11:28.439 could have been me. It should have been me. It would have been 837 01:11:28.640 --> 01:11:32.319 me. If it was the mother blah, it would have been me. 838 01:11:33.439 --> 01:11:39.520 It should have been me. It would have been me. It did was 839 01:11:39.680 --> 01:11:45.000 a mother blad, it should have been me. It should have been me. 840 01:11:45.119 --> 01:11:50.760 It would have been me. If it black, it would have been 841 01:11:50.960 --> 01:11:57.720 me. It should have been me. It would have been me. If 842 01:11:57.800 --> 01:12:06.640 it was a mother blah, get, it should be get. It was 843 01:12:11.000 --> 01:12:19.680 place my Mercy cover, Marcy cover, it was rin. Ain't called me 844 01:12:19.880 --> 01:12:35.479 just the plan when I wasn't mastar thanking for your prad time. I don't 845 01:12:35.720 --> 01:12:53.119 because I knew I can't I welcome in the mor I do think you for 846 01:12:53.319 --> 01:13:00.520 your grads think a Marcy ain't no, I walk? Don't that is a 847 01:13:00.640 --> 01:13:27.880 shower? Yes, nobody have to tell me. And that's live radio for 848 01:13:28.079 --> 01:13:32.640 you instead of the city. It was the clock sisters who with blessed and 849 01:13:32.840 --> 01:13:38.720 highly favored beautiful selection. Nonetheless, it's about twenty five minutes past year of 850 01:13:38.800 --> 01:13:42.319 six o'clock and you're listening to Talking Point if you've just joined us. Its 851 01:13:42.479 --> 01:13:47.359 Siblings Part two, Really good discussion we've had so far. We've got on 852 01:13:48.239 --> 01:13:53.000 the panel, so many names, so many faces. I'm very well who 853 01:13:53.119 --> 01:13:57.479 was with us before for Siblings Part one? Thank you for joining us again, 854 01:13:57.760 --> 01:14:03.399 and Dorothy and Kelly or a resident therapists. Kellya thrown it at you, 855 01:14:03.920 --> 01:14:11.800 you said you would. Now it's lot who've been helping us to unpack 856 01:14:11.920 --> 01:14:17.600 this dynamic. And of course my usual co host and partners, Angela and 857 01:14:18.880 --> 01:14:25.479 Pedro. Angel's also got Samantha and Mine who's her sister, her younger sister, 858 01:14:25.920 --> 01:14:30.880 and she's been talking about that relationship as well. Right where we wanted 859 01:14:30.920 --> 01:14:38.000 to go from here was talking about conflicts, because we've got some relationships we've 860 01:14:38.000 --> 01:14:41.279 been talking about and it's been all good and wonderful and we like it like 861 01:14:41.439 --> 01:14:48.239 that very close athen Roual and Angela and Samantha, we're talking about our own 862 01:14:48.319 --> 01:14:53.880 relationships and we've got close siblings as well. But we know as life is 863 01:14:54.000 --> 01:15:00.319 that it can get dicey, it can get troublesome. Some sibling relationship ships 864 01:15:00.399 --> 01:15:03.279 have ended in devastation, and we know that. So we want to talk 865 01:15:03.319 --> 01:15:11.600 about what causes conflicts, what causes rivalry and so forth amongst siblings. And 866 01:15:11.720 --> 01:15:15.840 I've asked Kelly Paps, you can start this conversation off, what are some 867 01:15:15.960 --> 01:15:19.880 of the things perhaps you've seen in practice maybe personally, what are some of 868 01:15:19.960 --> 01:15:29.239 the things that divides our siblings. So I seem to work a lot with 869 01:15:29.399 --> 01:15:35.800 the Black community with counseling. So there's issues that may have come up around 870 01:15:36.319 --> 01:15:42.520 the wind rush and migration where siblings have been split. So there may be 871 01:15:42.800 --> 01:15:47.479 some children that may have been left behind and some that you know, we're 872 01:15:47.880 --> 01:15:53.600 living in maybe the UK, and then there may be put together and that 873 01:15:53.880 --> 01:16:00.840 can often cause some difficulties. And sometimes it's difficult for the parents to be 874 01:16:00.920 --> 01:16:05.039 able to recognize that there's an issue or maybe the parents have caused the issue, 875 01:16:05.840 --> 01:16:09.560 and a lot of it is you know, a lot of them don't 876 01:16:09.600 --> 01:16:14.640 talk about it. And what I've seen is that when sometimes when parents pass 877 01:16:14.720 --> 01:16:16.800 away, that's when a lot of the childhood issues come up that have never 878 01:16:16.880 --> 01:16:21.880 been addressed. You know, when parents were alive, and that's quite that 879 01:16:21.960 --> 01:16:27.880 can be quite devastating. So there's always been something there, but nobody talks 880 01:16:27.920 --> 01:16:30.560 about it. It's like the elephant in the room, but nobody talks about 881 01:16:30.640 --> 01:16:40.479 Nobody knows how to unpack it safely in a way that everybody gets to ear 882 01:16:40.560 --> 01:16:45.520 their perspective and you know, but find a way to be able to build 883 01:16:45.720 --> 01:16:48.600 a better foundation. So that that's often that comes up at what comes up. 884 01:16:48.880 --> 01:16:54.359 And also gender roles as well, So if you know, dependent on 885 01:16:54.479 --> 01:16:57.520 your order of birth, you know, you would have been brought up by 886 01:16:57.600 --> 01:17:02.319 different parents at a different time in their development. Some children who may have 887 01:17:02.439 --> 01:17:06.640 been the eldest may have been adultified, so they might have been responsible for 888 01:17:06.720 --> 01:17:12.760 the younger ones have become a surrogate parent, particularly girls. If they're the 889 01:17:12.800 --> 01:17:15.600 firstborn, they will have to often look after the younger ones. Or if 890 01:17:15.680 --> 01:17:20.520 it's a first boy then often it may be quite different. So if the 891 01:17:20.760 --> 01:17:26.439 old if the eldest is a boy, and he may not have the responsibility. 892 01:17:26.560 --> 01:17:30.079 But then if the next child along is a girl, then maybe she's 893 01:17:30.119 --> 01:17:34.560 then adultified. So there's there's lots of different dynamics, and then there's issues 894 01:17:34.640 --> 01:17:43.479 around neurodiversity, So neurodiversity would be you know, maybe autism ADHD Those things, 895 01:17:43.520 --> 01:17:47.159 if they're not diagnosed, can cause a lot of it can cause a 896 01:17:47.239 --> 01:17:51.800 lot of destruction in the family if it's undiagnosed, and you know there maybe 897 01:17:51.920 --> 01:17:57.600 might be difficult to manage, and parents may feel the need to try and 898 01:17:57.760 --> 01:18:01.680 pander to the child. Maybe that maybe quite explosive, emotionally explosive, and 899 01:18:01.840 --> 01:18:08.119 maybe the other children may feel that they are being sacrificed. So those are 900 01:18:08.199 --> 01:18:11.840 just a few of you know, some of the issues, and I'm sure 901 01:18:11.920 --> 01:18:16.000 Dorothy you may have seen other things as well, So yeah, thank you 902 01:18:16.079 --> 01:18:23.079 for that, Kelly. Dorothy, you want to add here basically what Kelly 903 01:18:23.239 --> 01:18:27.239 said, the big part of it when we said before about how to manage 904 01:18:27.279 --> 01:18:32.000 it is how the parents deal with the siblings. So when we talk, 905 01:18:32.079 --> 01:18:35.800 a lot of the time parents tried to or they say, I treat you 906 01:18:36.079 --> 01:18:45.119 all equally, but they're not equal. They're individuals. So it's about seeing 907 01:18:45.159 --> 01:18:51.760 them as individuals and being fair and explaining that to the rest to their siblings. 908 01:18:53.159 --> 01:18:56.239 No, no, the reasons, it's kind of bending towards alluding to 909 01:18:56.279 --> 01:19:00.319 what Kelly was talking about. New our diversity, different needs. I think 910 01:19:00.479 --> 01:19:06.560 that's a big thing within families. We think everybody gets the same, everybody's 911 01:19:06.600 --> 01:19:13.199 allowed this, but no, no, no, equity. It's better the 912 01:19:13.279 --> 01:19:18.680 better word equity. Absolutely, So that's a part that I want to really 913 01:19:18.760 --> 01:19:24.600 bring it at this point. Do you see any other because we were looking 914 01:19:24.640 --> 01:19:30.199 at at some of the in my research some of the reasons. Um obviously 915 01:19:30.760 --> 01:19:36.159 neurodiversence is one. UM order of birth is another. So you know, 916 01:19:36.319 --> 01:19:42.159 the youngest, as I spoke to before, feeling very entitled, feeling poet, 917 01:19:42.239 --> 01:19:45.840 spoiled what mom did with the eldest when when she really wanted to pay 918 01:19:45.840 --> 01:19:48.119 attention and she was younger, and you know, she was more on it. 919 01:19:48.800 --> 01:19:50.880 That goes out of the window. By the fifth one, You're like, 920 01:19:50.960 --> 01:19:55.039 you know, do what you want. I'm over it now, you 921 01:19:55.119 --> 01:19:58.199 know. Um. So there's a difference in treatment from the eldest to the 922 01:19:58.319 --> 01:20:03.119 younger, and that comes across us in their relationship. UM. Maybe difference 923 01:20:03.319 --> 01:20:10.119 in looks, difference in in um ability abilities, things like that. These, 924 01:20:10.319 --> 01:20:13.399 yeah, these are all some of the reasons why you have that divide 925 01:20:14.199 --> 01:20:17.960 amongst siblings as well. Do you get a lot of that in your practice? 926 01:20:18.000 --> 01:20:20.920 Do you get a lot of Do you see a lot of that in 927 01:20:21.000 --> 01:20:28.159 your practice? Um, yes, there's a lot of that, And it's 928 01:20:28.159 --> 01:20:30.720 about trying to get them to see the differences. It's what we've talked about. 929 01:20:31.319 --> 01:20:36.159 Each one of your siblings are different. So the eldest in my family, 930 01:20:36.239 --> 01:20:43.520 there's six of us that grew together, and the eldest three looked at 931 01:20:43.600 --> 01:20:46.920 the looked at the youngest three and I mean the youngest thing. So it's 932 01:20:46.920 --> 01:20:51.439 a bit like what Angelis said, you got away with murder, they paid 933 01:20:51.560 --> 01:20:56.199 the way, that's it. And by the time they had all gone to 934 01:20:56.359 --> 01:21:00.239 UNI, we were allowed to do a lot more. But again, my 935 01:21:00.439 --> 01:21:04.600 parents were probably five, six, seven, ten years older, so they 936 01:21:04.680 --> 01:21:10.760 had learned maybe they retired. So then you get the older ones coming back 937 01:21:10.800 --> 01:21:15.199 and trying to parent the younger ones. And it's about saying no, no, 938 01:21:15.319 --> 01:21:17.239 no, no, you're you're your your siblings, you're not parents. 939 01:21:17.720 --> 01:21:23.640 Adultifying Kelly. Sometimes it's it's pushed on you. Sometimes people just take it 940 01:21:23.760 --> 01:21:28.880 on and think that they need to and it's just but it's difficult to say 941 01:21:28.920 --> 01:21:31.880 you shouldn't. Because Angela talked about it, saying with Samantha, well, 942 01:21:31.880 --> 01:21:35.439 I want to believe that I paved the way. You know, I did 943 01:21:35.560 --> 01:21:40.399 say to you come down. So as a as a older one, you're 944 01:21:40.479 --> 01:21:44.279 thinking you're paving the way. You're doing this because it's like you just do 945 01:21:44.479 --> 01:21:46.760 that. It's it's not a big a deal. It's just what I do. 946 01:21:47.720 --> 01:21:50.840 And again, as parents is to stand back. And it sounds like 947 01:21:50.920 --> 01:21:57.359 that's what a mother's parents did allow them to get home with it. They 948 01:21:57.479 --> 01:22:00.520 talked about a loss of a parent. You know, they lost their father 949 01:22:00.600 --> 01:22:03.920 and they were quite young. And that's another thing if you lose parents or 950 01:22:03.920 --> 01:22:09.680 another sibling, because we will all deal with all of these different things and 951 01:22:09.800 --> 01:22:15.439 it will call it may cause conflict because Kelly mentioned earlier, if a parent 952 01:22:15.720 --> 01:22:24.520 dies, a lot of things that were never spoken about now come out and 953 01:22:24.680 --> 01:22:30.039 it is an issue and we have to try and navigate that. I'm doing 954 01:22:30.119 --> 01:22:34.760 that. If it's not parents, hopefully we're older, and then the different 955 01:22:34.840 --> 01:22:41.920 personalities come into play here and it can be explosive. Or you can seek 956 01:22:41.960 --> 01:22:45.800 help, get outside support, is what I always say. If you can't 957 01:22:45.840 --> 01:22:48.439 manage it in a family unit, seek help. You don't have to do 958 01:22:48.680 --> 01:22:55.680 everything on your own. Perfect if I can chame in, which is I 959 01:22:55.840 --> 01:23:00.840 completely agree with the point I was made in terms of the fairest thing a 960 01:23:00.920 --> 01:23:05.000 parent can do to their children is not treat them the same because they're not. 961 01:23:06.319 --> 01:23:09.319 They may share a lot of traits, a lot of qualities, but 962 01:23:09.439 --> 01:23:14.960 they're they're still individuals, um, and so to treat them all the same 963 01:23:15.000 --> 01:23:18.000 will be to be treat to treat them un fairly, essentially. Absolutely. 964 01:23:20.039 --> 01:23:25.159 I'm not sure if we mentioned this. One of the thing that I not 965 01:23:25.359 --> 01:23:29.560 within my family, but what I've noticed caused a lot of conflict is when 966 01:23:30.560 --> 01:23:41.760 um, different children of different parents, so step step siblings, the different 967 01:23:41.760 --> 01:23:46.520 treatment that can sometimes be experienced because of that. Yeah, Joseph family is 968 01:23:46.560 --> 01:23:53.800 a real typical biblical example of that, and disparity and treatment because of the 969 01:23:53.960 --> 01:23:57.520 mother that was loved more than another mother or whatever else, etcetera, etcetera, 970 01:23:57.600 --> 01:24:02.640 and often cause mean can I was actually going to jump in and say 971 01:24:02.680 --> 01:24:10.399 something like that because he was talking about treating your children differently. Um, 972 01:24:11.079 --> 01:24:15.000 Also, how about the dynamic of like growing up, Like when I grew 973 01:24:15.079 --> 01:24:17.680 up, we didn't have much money. We had my mother made sure we 974 01:24:17.760 --> 01:24:21.039 had where we needed. But then when my when my brother and my sister 975 01:24:21.159 --> 01:24:26.479 came along. My parents were in a better place financially where they were able 976 01:24:26.479 --> 01:24:30.319 to get more stuff. So they got they got to go to boarding school, 977 01:24:30.319 --> 01:24:32.079 they got to go to Pineforch where we didn't get to go to Pine 978 01:24:32.119 --> 01:24:35.199 fORCH because we didn't have the money to go to Pine fORCH at that time. 979 01:24:36.279 --> 01:24:41.279 And so there was like it was like, wait, they get like 980 01:24:41.720 --> 01:24:45.399 we had me and my sister. We had that dynamic of like, man, 981 01:24:45.520 --> 01:24:46.840 you guys are treating them better than you treated us, Like you know, 982 01:24:47.039 --> 01:24:50.119 like you're doing more for them than you did for us. But it 983 01:24:50.239 --> 01:24:55.159 was more just economically. They didn't have it at that time because they were 984 01:24:55.199 --> 01:25:00.640 starting out and as they grew they the financiers just got better then. But 985 01:25:00.760 --> 01:25:05.079 what Andre said about um, I just lost the thought. But what he 986 01:25:05.159 --> 01:25:11.960 said about with children and also treating them the same, it's hard sometimes because 987 01:25:12.079 --> 01:25:15.239 children want to be treated the same. They think they want to be treated 988 01:25:15.279 --> 01:25:17.039 the same, but they don't need to be treated the same. Right, 989 01:25:17.439 --> 01:25:20.840 So I got what you were saying about. Like with my two children, 990 01:25:20.880 --> 01:25:26.560 My my my hurting old she thinks she's the boss of us all and she 991 01:25:26.720 --> 01:25:30.279 tries to boss the fourteen fifteen year old he's like, I'm the oldest, 992 01:25:30.399 --> 01:25:32.880 leave me alone. And that's how a lot of the arguments and fight start. 993 01:25:33.720 --> 01:25:36.000 And that's where a lot of it we have to be like, wait, 994 01:25:36.079 --> 01:25:39.720 you're the youngest, he's the oldest. He's in charge of your second, 995 01:25:39.760 --> 01:25:44.239 in charge of right, like just finding that place to put them, 996 01:25:44.920 --> 01:25:47.680 you know, so they can they can manage. And then also wants thing 997 01:25:47.720 --> 01:25:53.880 because I go up back a step the I mean ever, I think when 998 01:25:53.960 --> 01:25:58.439 you have when you blend the family, and there is a step involved. 999 01:25:59.640 --> 01:26:01.880 Um, Like for me, Mike, when my father married my mother, 1000 01:26:03.359 --> 01:26:08.800 he was trying to learn me, so we we I pushed back a lot 1001 01:26:08.880 --> 01:26:11.279 on him. It was my fault. I pushed back a lot. I 1002 01:26:11.359 --> 01:26:15.680 gave him a hard time, so he was harder on me that he was 1003 01:26:15.760 --> 01:26:18.319 with his own children. Was I look back, It is because he already 1004 01:26:18.359 --> 01:26:23.600 had that relationship with his children where he didn't have to push as hard as 1005 01:26:23.640 --> 01:26:26.800 he did with me. And as we got, as we got more and 1006 01:26:26.920 --> 01:26:31.760 more into our relationship, I learned to conform to what he wanted, and 1007 01:26:31.880 --> 01:26:38.359 then I found that my life was easier. Um having did he did he 1008 01:26:38.439 --> 01:26:41.840 have a conversation with you about that? Because here's the thing. We can 1009 01:26:42.279 --> 01:26:48.000 you know we can, right, so back then because back then we didn't 1010 01:26:48.039 --> 01:26:51.439 talk exactly and then we didn't talk. No, right, that's what I'm 1011 01:26:51.439 --> 01:26:54.680 saying. That's but that's why I'm bringing this up. It's saying that we 1012 01:26:54.800 --> 01:26:57.960 need to have that you need if you are, if you are joining into 1013 01:26:58.039 --> 01:27:01.479 it where you're the stuff. Like my my wife. I have two older 1014 01:27:01.520 --> 01:27:06.800 kids, twenty eight and twenty five, and when I met my wife, 1015 01:27:08.159 --> 01:27:11.520 I sat them. We all sat down and we had a conversation and I 1016 01:27:11.560 --> 01:27:14.359 said, this is my wife. Now you don't have to be You may 1017 01:27:14.439 --> 01:27:16.840 not like her, but you're gonna respect her. So we had that conversation, 1018 01:27:17.560 --> 01:27:21.159 and my wife for a long time didn't think that they even liked her. 1019 01:27:21.279 --> 01:27:26.239 But then when we was having conversations with them, they'll bring up stuff 1020 01:27:26.239 --> 01:27:29.560 that she was doing, just little things that she was doing for them that 1021 01:27:29.720 --> 01:27:31.000 she didn't realize she was doing. And they was like, I remember when 1022 01:27:31.000 --> 01:27:34.119 you made us breakfast and it was so good, and you know you made 1023 01:27:34.159 --> 01:27:35.920 the eggs of the black you know, like, and she was like you 1024 01:27:36.000 --> 01:27:41.039 remember that. They're like yeah, So, like you said, just having 1025 01:27:41.079 --> 01:27:46.119 that conversation because you're trying to it could be difficult sometimes and I just remember 1026 01:27:46.159 --> 01:27:48.720 that with my father, we just had a really hard Like the first couple 1027 01:27:48.760 --> 01:27:53.760 of years was really hard. We didn't have that conversation, but I think 1028 01:27:54.479 --> 01:27:59.920 we developed. I did a lot for I did a lot with him working 1029 01:28:00.119 --> 01:28:02.000 and stuff. I use a work in the ABC and the conference, and 1030 01:28:02.079 --> 01:28:04.840 he worked in the conference, so I will go to work with him. 1031 01:28:04.880 --> 01:28:11.560 And we didn't have communicate. We communicated in that way and spending time together. 1032 01:28:12.119 --> 01:28:14.880 So it was never spoken, but it was understood, if that makes 1033 01:28:14.920 --> 01:28:19.680 sense, Like we developed a relationship with our communication, but we did thankfully 1034 01:28:19.920 --> 01:28:25.319 develop a relationship as time went on. It can go, but it can 1035 01:28:25.399 --> 01:28:28.000 happen, but it's just harder. If we would have had that conversation, 1036 01:28:28.479 --> 01:28:31.680 I think it would have been much easier for us both. And I guess 1037 01:28:31.720 --> 01:28:36.359 the key word you used it as a conversation because you did communicate nonverbally, 1038 01:28:36.880 --> 01:28:42.279 yes, but what you didn't do was sick together and talk about it. 1039 01:28:42.640 --> 01:28:46.000 And sometimes that's difficult, especially with men. We talk about gender. It's 1040 01:28:46.039 --> 01:28:50.720 hard sometimes to talk about really what's going on. But you kind of started 1041 01:28:50.800 --> 01:28:54.600 to recognize, Okay, so if I do this, then I get this, 1042 01:28:54.760 --> 01:28:59.680 and he does that you communicated. You just didn't have that conversation, 1043 01:29:00.159 --> 01:29:03.279 and that's what was missing, but that you did communicate, So that'd be 1044 01:29:03.279 --> 01:29:06.520 too hard to each other. Oh no, no, Well, the reason 1045 01:29:06.560 --> 01:29:13.119 why I realized that we actually connected was because my sister, Stephanie passed away 1046 01:29:13.880 --> 01:29:17.399 and at the funeral, my father got up and he said, I just 1047 01:29:17.520 --> 01:29:21.399 want to thank one person in the whole you know, in the group something. 1048 01:29:21.479 --> 01:29:25.000 He's gonna say one of the children and he's like, I want to 1049 01:29:25.039 --> 01:29:28.359 thank my son Pedro. And the rest of the kids were mad at me. 1050 01:29:28.439 --> 01:29:30.920 They was like, what, why are you thinking him? And he 1051 01:29:30.039 --> 01:29:33.640 was like, because if I needed something for Stephanie, he was there. 1052 01:29:34.079 --> 01:29:38.119 If I needed him to do something, he was there if I you know, 1053 01:29:38.319 --> 01:29:42.119 and he started naming all these things and that's what and that was our 1054 01:29:42.199 --> 01:29:45.640 way up. That was when it clicked. That's when I realized that he 1055 01:29:45.800 --> 01:29:47.800 did now respect. You know, we had a respect for each other and 1056 01:29:47.960 --> 01:29:53.079 we understood each other. So it was never really communicated, but by him 1057 01:29:53.119 --> 01:29:57.640 saying that in front of everybody, the whole family, it kind of just 1058 01:29:57.840 --> 01:30:00.920 like okay. And then from then our relations ship grew even stronger. If 1059 01:30:00.960 --> 01:30:04.840 that make them absolutely went to a different level. It went to a different 1060 01:30:04.920 --> 01:30:10.039 level. Yeah, communicating, but it wasn't verbalife. And when your dad 1061 01:30:10.279 --> 01:30:15.319 verbally said it verbally in front of so many people, it took the relationship 1062 01:30:15.399 --> 01:30:18.439 to another level. Right again, to recommend just because we're not talking, 1063 01:30:19.279 --> 01:30:23.880 we're looking at each other, children are looking, siblings, we're all looking. 1064 01:30:24.039 --> 01:30:27.000 Do you see what they said? And do you notice how? And 1065 01:30:27.159 --> 01:30:32.600 we say it? So that's why we said before it's about it's sist in 1066 01:30:32.680 --> 01:30:40.279 the room. Think Pedro you said earlier your family before worship, you talk 1067 01:30:40.319 --> 01:30:44.840 about issues, and I guess it's about having those things in place. When 1068 01:30:44.880 --> 01:30:46.359 do you talk. Some people do it at meal times, some people do 1069 01:30:46.439 --> 01:30:49.920 it at worship, some people do it on the drive to school, coming 1070 01:30:50.000 --> 01:30:55.880 back from school, whatever it is. But having that talking because they're watching 1071 01:30:55.960 --> 01:31:00.960 you, our children and this is the nephews, they're watching us. They 1072 01:31:00.159 --> 01:31:04.800 may not say it that they store it up and that helps them to develop 1073 01:31:05.479 --> 01:31:13.880 as young men. Women take going into their own relationships. But don't don't 1074 01:31:14.000 --> 01:31:17.279 ever think just because you're not saying it, people say they don't see it. 1075 01:31:17.600 --> 01:31:26.760 Your children see it by how you treat yourself them your partner and the 1076 01:31:26.840 --> 01:31:31.760 rest of the siblings. There's a lot that said without being spoken. Can 1077 01:31:31.800 --> 01:31:36.960 I just bring in as well sometimes in terms of the communication, because children 1078 01:31:38.079 --> 01:31:41.159 can be quite black and white. I've got two girls, you know, 1079 01:31:41.760 --> 01:31:45.079 one is ten and one is six, and they are at two very different 1080 01:31:45.199 --> 01:31:50.359 developmental stages. So you know, the fighting, you know, again you 1081 01:31:50.439 --> 01:31:55.680 have to understand their developmental stage when they're arguing. You know, within my 1082 01:31:55.840 --> 01:31:59.439 house it turns to fist fights because the six year old, she's just got 1083 01:31:59.520 --> 01:32:01.359 that kind of energy, and you know, the ten year old, she's 1084 01:32:01.560 --> 01:32:04.640 you know, she can't be bothered with a with her six year old because 1085 01:32:04.640 --> 01:32:10.000 she's too little. But it's also about their perspective in terms of what they 1086 01:32:10.199 --> 01:32:15.399 understand of the situation, because it's they're both in the same situation. So 1087 01:32:15.640 --> 01:32:19.319 a fight will take place and you know, one will see it from a 1088 01:32:19.359 --> 01:32:24.600 different perspective from the other, and they believe it and they run with that 1089 01:32:24.800 --> 01:32:29.319 with that story. So and this is where it's important to have that conversation 1090 01:32:29.399 --> 01:32:33.760 with them to find out their perspectives and help them to learn how to navigate 1091 01:32:34.520 --> 01:32:40.439 the difficulty in their both in their developmental stages, which is going to be 1092 01:32:40.560 --> 01:32:44.359 different and that can be and that can be really really tough because you know, 1093 01:32:44.960 --> 01:32:47.039 my children would just blanket just say, oh, you love her more 1094 01:32:47.119 --> 01:32:49.880 than me when I was her eight you know, there's all that kind of 1095 01:32:49.960 --> 01:32:54.960 thinking, really are we really doing that? But but it's forced me as 1096 01:32:55.000 --> 01:33:00.800 a parent to really kind of asked questions them ankwesome about their feelings. So 1097 01:33:00.880 --> 01:33:03.680 now might not be the time, but maybe at dinner time, maybe having 1098 01:33:03.760 --> 01:33:08.760 someone to one time with them, and they all then express and explain how 1099 01:33:08.880 --> 01:33:12.920 it's made them feel, you know, and often it's that it's that feeling 1100 01:33:13.199 --> 01:33:16.439 of injustice. You know. The six year old is all about injustice. 1101 01:33:17.119 --> 01:33:20.239 The ten year old is all about you know, her feelings, her emotions, 1102 01:33:20.279 --> 01:33:25.960 and it feels this is how it feels. So it's about trying to 1103 01:33:26.800 --> 01:33:30.359 understand their perspective and that can be really really difficult. But also as well, 1104 01:33:31.000 --> 01:33:34.199 you want to help them to learn to conflict, you know, you 1105 01:33:34.279 --> 01:33:39.039 know, manage conflict. And also you have to be careful how you get 1106 01:33:39.119 --> 01:33:42.840 involved, because you can get involved and think that you're supporting them and then 1107 01:33:42.840 --> 01:33:45.119 the two of them will turn on you and you're the enemy. So you 1108 01:33:45.199 --> 01:33:48.239 know, you have to know how to kind of navigate. And it's based 1109 01:33:48.279 --> 01:33:55.359 on their personalities. You've got to know their personalities. So yeah, communication 1110 01:33:55.560 --> 01:33:59.520 is key. We we We've said that through and through and I think this 1111 01:33:59.640 --> 01:34:05.600 is the this program. The conversations need to happen. And I remember, 1112 01:34:05.880 --> 01:34:13.079 for me, I've got five brothers and sisters and we're all for different months 1113 01:34:13.680 --> 01:34:18.640 from the Caribbean. Hey. Hey, And one thing we always salute our 1114 01:34:18.720 --> 01:34:21.479 dad for. He made a lot of mistakes, but one thing he did 1115 01:34:23.079 --> 01:34:26.439 very right is that he used to come and get us. So we're all 1116 01:34:26.479 --> 01:34:30.600 in different houses, we're all growing up differently, but on the weekends, 1117 01:34:30.720 --> 01:34:33.439 just for church and for Sunday, he would come and get us all and 1118 01:34:33.600 --> 01:34:42.279 we would overnight at his house and that established the connection that we take even 1119 01:34:42.399 --> 01:34:45.640 today and we've built on. Had we not had that, we would have 1120 01:34:45.840 --> 01:34:50.520 lived separate lives and maybe never been as close as we are now. And 1121 01:34:50.760 --> 01:34:55.000 when he came for us, it was the conversations we had with each other 1122 01:34:55.039 --> 01:34:57.680 and with him. Yes, I know I made a mistake. I know 1123 01:34:57.800 --> 01:35:00.039 I didn't do the right way. Maybe if I had to do all over 1124 01:35:00.119 --> 01:35:02.800 again, I'll do it differently. But I love you all and etcetera, 1125 01:35:02.800 --> 01:35:06.159 and etcetera, etcetera. And those are the moments that I remember even now 1126 01:35:06.399 --> 01:35:13.159 fondly because the foundation I think was set there for the relationship that we have 1127 01:35:13.399 --> 01:35:15.960 now. And when we're talking about step sisters and step brothers, I think 1128 01:35:16.000 --> 01:35:20.600 that's crucial conversation. This is what's happening now, this is a new dynamic. 1129 01:35:20.760 --> 01:35:23.880 These are the rules, these are the you know, this is how 1130 01:35:23.960 --> 01:35:26.239 it will be. This is the respect that you need to give to her 1131 01:35:26.359 --> 01:35:29.239 and to him and all that kind of stuff. Conversation is key, and 1132 01:35:29.359 --> 01:35:32.840 it's it's it's coming out in this conversation that we're having now how crucial and 1133 01:35:32.960 --> 01:35:36.079 how important it is. I mean, I'm going to go to our siblings 1134 01:35:36.479 --> 01:35:40.960 next because I want to know how they resolve and one of the conflicts that 1135 01:35:41.359 --> 01:35:45.399 you've faced over the years, if you care to tell us and how you've 1136 01:35:45.520 --> 01:35:51.880 navigated them. Um Angela, Sam, welcome back. Do you do you 1137 01:35:51.920 --> 01:35:57.159 want to take it from here? Yeah, I'm trying to think actually, 1138 01:36:00.000 --> 01:36:03.800 I think actually major really major conflicts. I mean, what I would say 1139 01:36:03.960 --> 01:36:08.840 is kind of what I touched on earlier around like as we were younger, 1140 01:36:09.840 --> 01:36:13.840 we used to kind of fight and so I remember. What I remember is 1141 01:36:13.880 --> 01:36:17.359 that when Angela moved out, we weren't talking as much. I think, 1142 01:36:17.479 --> 01:36:21.680 you know, once I came to London, it's like we kind of because, 1143 01:36:23.000 --> 01:36:25.640 yeah, you were just doing your thing. You you know, obviously 1144 01:36:25.720 --> 01:36:29.560 had moved away and there was that kind of dynamic and I was just at 1145 01:36:29.640 --> 01:36:31.079 home doing my thing. So I guess there was a little bit of kind 1146 01:36:31.119 --> 01:36:34.239 of separation. I wouldn't say it was like a major conflict, and I 1147 01:36:34.319 --> 01:36:42.800 don't think, thankfully, we've had to navigate something so dramatic where you know, 1148 01:36:42.880 --> 01:36:45.880 we weren't talking for a very long period of time and things like that. 1149 01:36:46.079 --> 01:36:49.359 Usually we can just kind of, you know, argue it out a 1150 01:36:49.399 --> 01:36:55.680 little bit, even like now you know where I like did You'll call me 1151 01:36:55.720 --> 01:36:58.800 out on something and I'll call her out and stuff. But then that's it. 1152 01:36:58.880 --> 01:37:02.880 There's no kind of of you know, grudge and holding onto it for 1153 01:37:02.920 --> 01:37:06.840 a long time kind of thing, which is you know, blessing because you 1154 01:37:06.920 --> 01:37:11.439 know, I know that there are some siblings that just don't talk, just 1155 01:37:11.560 --> 01:37:15.880 kind of talk because they just have that kind of you know, unfortunately unhealthy 1156 01:37:15.319 --> 01:37:18.760 relationship. Yeah, and I think, you know, if we are we 1157 01:37:18.840 --> 01:37:24.039 have disagreements. I don't think that's necessarily because they don't get to anything physical 1158 01:37:24.159 --> 01:37:26.800 or anything like that. But I think if we have a bit of an 1159 01:37:26.880 --> 01:37:30.359 argument and I'm a sort of temperament who I might get really angry, I 1160 01:37:30.439 --> 01:37:31.880 fizzle, I sort of you know, I may go from not to one 1161 01:37:31.960 --> 01:37:35.159 hundred as I sort of fizzle back down very very quickly. So we might 1162 01:37:35.279 --> 01:37:42.279 argue, words are said, and then I don't know, two minutes later, 1163 01:37:42.439 --> 01:37:45.439 it's all fine again, you know, so really nothing that's serious. 1164 01:37:45.439 --> 01:37:48.039 And I kind of just think maybe that's something developed over the years in the 1165 01:37:48.159 --> 01:37:51.800 sense of actually even if you are having a disagreement, meant to the case 1166 01:37:51.840 --> 01:37:56.680 of walking away to both as a calm down and then can kind of address 1167 01:37:56.760 --> 01:38:00.319 it. And usually actually I think probably both of us probably laugh at each 1168 01:38:00.319 --> 01:38:02.800 other in the sense of the way we might have carried on at the time, 1169 01:38:03.359 --> 01:38:08.199 like it just seems so we see the ridiculousness of it, you know, 1170 01:38:09.399 --> 01:38:12.239 and whereas I might have got really upset about something, should just be 1171 01:38:12.319 --> 01:38:15.319 laughing again and you're just silly and likewise, do you know what I mean? 1172 01:38:15.359 --> 01:38:17.760 And I think you know from that it takes away maybe the harshness of 1173 01:38:17.840 --> 01:38:20.560 what could have been. And sometimes you know, we like we say, 1174 01:38:20.600 --> 01:38:24.960 we call each other out on things. Sometimes things need to be said and 1175 01:38:25.079 --> 01:38:28.399 that can be difficult to listen to. But I guess as you get older 1176 01:38:28.680 --> 01:38:32.520 you appreciate that because somebody's looking out for you. Development they don't need you 1177 01:38:32.920 --> 01:38:36.439 actually needs me any harm in that respect and vice versus. So. But 1178 01:38:36.840 --> 01:38:43.199 yeah, thankfully we've never really had any major disagreements. I mean, then 1179 01:38:43.239 --> 01:38:45.680 we've got very different personalities, and there are things that are probably driving me 1180 01:38:45.800 --> 01:38:49.159 mad. That's probably feels driver is mad about each other, but you know 1181 01:38:49.359 --> 01:38:54.840 we can we can resolve them because nothing that's seriously because I think the reality 1182 01:38:55.159 --> 01:38:58.600 is, you know, life shows us that life, you know, the 1183 01:38:58.680 --> 01:39:01.159 last few years benthic shared as a life is so short, such a value. 1184 01:39:01.960 --> 01:39:04.840 You know, people that you love around you, you know, and 1185 01:39:04.960 --> 01:39:09.720 again I appreciate this isn't always the same for everybody eat you know, but 1186 01:39:10.079 --> 01:39:13.399 when you have got good relations with people, and if it's your family, 1187 01:39:13.600 --> 01:39:15.159 you know, you keep them close. You just don't know what will happens 1188 01:39:15.159 --> 01:39:19.920 tomorrow. I think I said earlier about you Tube as well, when you 1189 01:39:19.960 --> 01:39:24.119 were talking, I was watching you and for me, it's a lot to 1190 01:39:24.119 --> 01:39:27.319 do. If your parents allowed you guys to get on. I think what 1191 01:39:27.560 --> 01:39:30.319 you show what I see it with you two, your parents left you to 1192 01:39:30.439 --> 01:39:32.359 do it, deal with it. They didn't get involved. You had to 1193 01:39:32.439 --> 01:39:35.960 negotiate, and it was kind of like you had each other. At the 1194 01:39:36.079 --> 01:39:39.520 end of the day, you knew you just had each other. That's what 1195 01:39:39.600 --> 01:39:43.800 I'm getting when I'm hearing you talking. So yes, you you had your 1196 01:39:43.920 --> 01:39:46.399 arguments. At the end of the day, it was just an argument. 1197 01:39:46.479 --> 01:39:50.720 That's my sister. That's my sister, which I think is to it all 1198 01:39:50.800 --> 01:39:55.119 as well. And I guess that's similar to my family. We had a 1199 01:39:55.279 --> 01:39:59.640 similar we will my sister and myself. There's two girls and boys. My 1200 01:40:00.119 --> 01:40:02.840 so I was the eldest one and I idolized her and I felt she was 1201 01:40:02.920 --> 01:40:06.039 a blue eyed child and she was looking at me, what are you talking 1202 01:40:06.119 --> 01:40:10.039 about? Because she was always with mum. But she didn't want to be 1203 01:40:10.119 --> 01:40:13.359 with mum, you know, So again we have to look at that in 1204 01:40:13.520 --> 01:40:16.199 families. My sister was the eldest in the kitchen. She mum was getting 1205 01:40:16.199 --> 01:40:19.640 shop, but she took my sister. I was ramping with the boys. 1206 01:40:19.760 --> 01:40:23.720 John wanted to ramp with the boys. But she could have. But I 1207 01:40:23.800 --> 01:40:27.119 thought, oh, she was so ladylike and I was never ladylike. And 1208 01:40:27.239 --> 01:40:31.079 I guess, and you're similar with yours that you know once this way you 1209 01:40:31.079 --> 01:40:34.840 said very different one. Maybe ladies like one may not be and you see 1210 01:40:34.880 --> 01:40:38.520 it and at the time it's like what is going on? And you might 1211 01:40:38.680 --> 01:40:43.640 think one thing and the other is thinking something different. So my sister and 1212 01:40:43.760 --> 01:40:46.640 I growing up, we didn't have no bigger fallout, but I know as 1213 01:40:46.720 --> 01:40:49.840 adults now because when I said, yeah, well you at Mum's funeral and 1214 01:40:49.960 --> 01:40:53.479 I did my talking, I said, and my sister was a blue wiled 1215 01:40:53.560 --> 01:40:55.520 child. She looked at me and she said, what do you mean? 1216 01:40:55.720 --> 01:40:58.960 I was a blue wife. And it was not until then that I didn't 1217 01:40:59.000 --> 01:41:02.399 realize that she did see herself how I saw her. I thought she was 1218 01:41:02.520 --> 01:41:08.520 Moneth's favorite. She didn't say it, and she didn't think that. Always 1219 01:41:08.600 --> 01:41:12.439 the talking, and I guess it's very difficult for some Manthor and Andrew they're 1220 01:41:12.479 --> 01:41:15.039 sitting together, they're really not going to say really and truly, And again 1221 01:41:15.119 --> 01:41:19.239 they've pushed it down. They've pushed it down because they've let adults to get 1222 01:41:19.279 --> 01:41:21.600 on with it. We've only got each other at the end of the day, 1223 01:41:21.800 --> 01:41:26.720 We're gonna do this together, you know. And it always ends up 1224 01:41:26.760 --> 01:41:30.000 that it comes out somewhere. It might be a funeral and we don't know 1225 01:41:30.560 --> 01:41:32.840 it. Could you think, well, why don't they talk or why don't 1226 01:41:32.880 --> 01:41:39.760 they They might not even know themselves have that conversation you're saying, because and 1227 01:41:39.840 --> 01:41:42.119 it will come out, Oh, I didn't know you saw it like that. 1228 01:41:43.960 --> 01:41:45.479 That's yeah, that's very true. But you know, at the same 1229 01:41:45.520 --> 01:41:48.600 time, I sometimes think they're probably are things. I think actually, sometimes 1230 01:41:48.600 --> 01:41:53.880 you just weigh up a situation and sometimes you have to really think, actually, 1231 01:41:53.960 --> 01:41:56.960 it's like this my issue is my issue, and I just need to 1232 01:41:56.960 --> 01:41:59.920 get over it. If it was something really you know, it's really pressing, 1233 01:42:00.279 --> 01:42:02.439 I'd like to think I'd like to be able to talk to my sister 1234 01:42:02.520 --> 01:42:05.920 about this, talk to a month about it. Um, I'm sure they 1235 01:42:05.960 --> 01:42:09.439 could probably use things. But you know, at the same time, I 1236 01:42:09.520 --> 01:42:12.079 just think, yeah, like I said, life's too sure, and I 1237 01:42:12.159 --> 01:42:14.479 think, you know, you have to really just see what's going to be 1238 01:42:14.720 --> 01:42:18.439 important to enable your relationship to go forward. If there is if there is 1239 01:42:18.520 --> 01:42:21.720 something that's going to be a challenge. Yes, address it. You know, 1240 01:42:21.800 --> 01:42:27.840 I'd like to think rather was enough to do that. Yeah, I 1241 01:42:27.880 --> 01:42:31.840 don't think of anything. Yeah, I mean is keep the real going after? 1242 01:42:36.439 --> 01:42:39.920 Um? What are your thoughts on this? What? What? What 1243 01:42:40.680 --> 01:42:43.960 keeps you close? What divided you in the past? How have you gotten 1244 01:42:44.039 --> 01:42:47.159 past it? And this might be a good point to interject, Um, 1245 01:42:47.760 --> 01:42:56.079 you know, how has your faith paid a part in your relationship? Well, 1246 01:42:57.079 --> 01:43:02.760 I've got a story. I can't really remember six sorry me kent of 1247 01:43:02.840 --> 01:43:06.560 time I'm thinking about. People say, no, I don't. I can't 1248 01:43:06.560 --> 01:43:12.600 recall as adults us having any major confidence Andrew. I have one. But 1249 01:43:12.720 --> 01:43:15.800 I do remember a particular story when we were younger. I was I was 1250 01:43:15.840 --> 01:43:21.159 really like seven years old and they maybe eight and Andre Andrew carried brought over 1251 01:43:21.359 --> 01:43:26.479 a friend that was a girl that as a kid, I had a very 1252 01:43:26.560 --> 01:43:31.199 slight crush on her when when he bought her over, but I felt like 1253 01:43:31.399 --> 01:43:34.800 Andrew was using me as his as his butler, right, so when he 1254 01:43:34.880 --> 01:43:39.479 needed water, he would send me in the kitchen get him some water. 1255 01:43:40.039 --> 01:43:45.039 At one point I just shook my kiss my teeth or stoops as it were, 1256 01:43:45.600 --> 01:43:48.439 and walked off. I think I drink. A little bit embarrassed with 1257 01:43:48.520 --> 01:43:50.600 that because I did it in front of his you know, his friend. 1258 01:43:50.640 --> 01:43:55.079 I was a girl, um, and he came after me. He gave 1259 01:43:55.119 --> 01:43:59.199 me a little pinch and it started to cry. But in the end the 1260 01:43:59.319 --> 01:44:02.359 girl came to comfort me. So I believe that I probably won anyway. 1261 01:44:02.720 --> 01:44:08.199 But that's the only major comfort I could remember as a child. It was 1262 01:44:08.279 --> 01:44:11.920 unfair that Andrea was older. He had an advantage, was bigger than me, 1263 01:44:12.079 --> 01:44:15.079 could if you wanted to throw me across the room. So we didn't 1264 01:44:15.079 --> 01:44:19.760 really have much arguments except for the fact that I was probably a little annoying 1265 01:44:19.760 --> 01:44:25.560 as a kid because I always wanted to be around him. But as adults, 1266 01:44:26.600 --> 01:44:31.640 I can't really think of anything else except for the fact that my parents 1267 01:44:31.800 --> 01:44:39.279 never really showed their arguments in front of us, so we would probably sense 1268 01:44:39.319 --> 01:44:44.760 a little tension, but they would do the resolutions behind doors. Whether that 1269 01:44:44.920 --> 01:44:45.960 was a good thing or a bad thing, I'm not sure, but it 1270 01:44:46.079 --> 01:44:53.000 resonated a little bit bit of s where we were never very We would never 1271 01:44:53.159 --> 01:44:57.439 voice or issues right away. It would more like suppressive, if anything, 1272 01:44:58.000 --> 01:45:03.520 to avoid comfort um, and rather than fighting, we more have a conversation 1273 01:45:03.960 --> 01:45:10.279 about things, disagreements here and there, yes, but it never escalated to 1274 01:45:10.399 --> 01:45:14.479 the point where we want to talk to each other for weeks or months or 1275 01:45:14.560 --> 01:45:21.800 so. But that's what I can think of. Andrew. Did you see 1276 01:45:21.800 --> 01:45:26.279 it the same way? Did you? Yeah? Pretty much? I mean, 1277 01:45:26.359 --> 01:45:30.359 like girls have, you've never experienced our appearance, having a full blown 1278 01:45:30.479 --> 01:45:33.399 argument in front of us. You've never been It needs to raise voices and 1279 01:45:33.560 --> 01:45:39.119 harsh words. That's just not part of what we grew up with um, 1280 01:45:39.600 --> 01:45:44.479 so we never We're never accustomed to that kind of conflict and between us again, 1281 01:45:44.600 --> 01:45:47.520 partly because of the a difference, most likely not really much conflict growing 1282 01:45:47.600 --> 01:45:53.800 up as adults. The only conflict I can think of was not between us 1283 01:45:53.880 --> 01:46:00.399 directly, but more our partners. We both married similar type women, very 1284 01:46:00.439 --> 01:46:09.319 strong headed, very stubborn, and we had conflicts partly because of clashes between 1285 01:46:09.439 --> 01:46:15.359 them, and that then impacted us, and both of us kind of trying 1286 01:46:15.399 --> 01:46:19.319 to be mediators, trying to calm things down to our hot headed wives, 1287 01:46:21.159 --> 01:46:28.720 which then caused us to have some distance between us. But direct conflicts between 1288 01:46:28.800 --> 01:46:34.399 us between us, not really. There were there were times where there was 1289 01:46:34.399 --> 01:46:40.159 a situation where my action was misunderstood by real For example, if realism might 1290 01:46:40.239 --> 01:46:45.159 be sharing this was when he chose his wife, and you're planning the marriage 1291 01:46:45.279 --> 01:46:48.399 and whatnot, and we spoke about it, and I was trying to give 1292 01:46:48.520 --> 01:46:55.159 advice in terms of, Okay, maybe you can push back the date and 1293 01:46:55.520 --> 01:46:58.439 get a few more things in place so that you can already for this next 1294 01:46:58.479 --> 01:47:03.760 step. And that was misunderstood partly by him and him party by his wife, 1295 01:47:03.760 --> 01:47:08.840 as well as me not agreeing with the relationship, not want them to 1296 01:47:08.880 --> 01:47:11.840 get married, whereas I was not the case. I was just trying to 1297 01:47:12.479 --> 01:47:15.720 give advice to give anyone you know, probably better to do such and such 1298 01:47:15.880 --> 01:47:19.159 first, and then if it means pushing back date, then push them back. 1299 01:47:19.239 --> 01:47:21.800 I mean, it's not going to stop you from getting married and you've 1300 01:47:21.920 --> 01:47:28.720 chosen. It's just just taking a bit more time. But not conflicts I 1301 01:47:28.800 --> 01:47:32.680 can think of beyond those those situations. Wow, I've got some really strong 1302 01:47:32.760 --> 01:47:38.279 relationships here, good relationships. But before I close, let me, just 1303 01:47:38.399 --> 01:47:42.159 because we've got only a few minutes, let me then ask Dorothy and Kelly, 1304 01:47:43.000 --> 01:47:47.079 what would you say then to those of us who may have difficulties in 1305 01:47:47.199 --> 01:47:51.479 our sibling relationship, who have fallen out and have not spoken for years, 1306 01:47:51.640 --> 01:47:57.960 who have come to fist fights and blows, and maybe restraining orders are involved, 1307 01:47:58.039 --> 01:48:00.600 et cetera. I mean the extremities. And for those who maybe have 1308 01:48:00.800 --> 01:48:05.399 lost siblings and there are difficulties there that need to be resolved. I mean, 1309 01:48:06.279 --> 01:48:11.279 perhaps too much to siblings. Three. I can see it coming, 1310 01:48:11.600 --> 01:48:15.600 but we have a few minutes. Let's use it wisely, and just to 1311 01:48:15.680 --> 01:48:21.520 talk to those who may be struggling in their own relationships. Really, I 1312 01:48:21.680 --> 01:48:29.760 would it's about understanding how you feel, how you feel about the relationship and 1313 01:48:29.920 --> 01:48:35.439 what's happened, to be able to verbalize the feelings and to see if there's 1314 01:48:35.479 --> 01:48:43.199 a possibility of having a conversation, but be with the intention of trying to 1315 01:48:43.399 --> 01:48:49.119 understand the other person's perspective so that you can then understand where maybe there might 1316 01:48:49.159 --> 01:48:56.479 have been a misunderstanding. It may mean that having a completely outside person to 1317 01:48:56.640 --> 01:49:01.319 help mediate the conversation, because sometimes can be a bit too explosive to be 1318 01:49:01.479 --> 01:49:08.079 able to manage that within the sibling group. So if there's a third person, 1319 01:49:08.239 --> 01:49:11.880 that third person that can come in and help to manage. Okay, 1320 01:49:12.119 --> 01:49:15.680 you speak when you're holding the orange, you speak you listen okay, and 1321 01:49:15.800 --> 01:49:20.039 then you know, being able to reflect and refrain back what the other, 1322 01:49:20.199 --> 01:49:24.399 what each person has said, to see if there can then be some sort 1323 01:49:24.399 --> 01:49:30.680 of result. Very quickly, I'll just say it's okay, it happens. 1324 01:49:30.439 --> 01:49:35.920 Life happens. I believe that God allows us to be born into the families 1325 01:49:35.960 --> 01:49:41.319 with the personalities that are there for a reason. And I always if you 1326 01:49:41.479 --> 01:49:45.800 can make it out with your siblings and your parents, you'll be able to 1327 01:49:45.920 --> 01:49:49.479 work out in life because those people in your families, they're only representing people 1328 01:49:49.520 --> 01:49:54.840 that you're going to meet up with in your life. Absolutely, so reach 1329 01:49:54.880 --> 01:49:58.359 out, get help if you can. It's not the end of the day. 1330 01:49:59.239 --> 01:50:04.079 Learn from it. Well said, I'm going to actually share our cornerstone 1331 01:50:04.600 --> 01:50:09.319 details shortly, and also if anybody wants to get in touch with these lovely 1332 01:50:09.439 --> 01:50:12.560 ladies, then they can reach out to us when Adventice Radio London and we'll 1333 01:50:12.640 --> 01:50:17.000 pass on details. Final words as a way about two minutes after from Angie 1334 01:50:17.199 --> 01:50:21.319 and then the final word from Pedro with a prayer, and then we'll say 1335 01:50:21.920 --> 01:50:27.920 goodbye. I guess I would say we're doing this shows a part two, 1336 01:50:28.039 --> 01:50:30.279 but we're looking at you know, Siblings Day and this a couple of days 1337 01:50:30.319 --> 01:50:32.800 time, his brother and sister's day, and it was inspired by a woman 1338 01:50:32.960 --> 01:50:38.479 who realized how little he expressed her love and admiration for her brother before he 1339 01:50:38.600 --> 01:50:42.399 died. And the reality is life is short, and as Dorothy says, 1340 01:50:42.439 --> 01:50:45.680 God has blessed us with siblings and put us into families with alation ships if 1341 01:50:45.720 --> 01:50:49.119 we have them, and you know, we should try and remain connected, 1342 01:50:50.279 --> 01:50:56.359 bond, enjoy, fixed, resolve whatever it is with those if you know 1343 01:50:56.479 --> 01:51:00.640 that's to be and you know, aim to be a blessed into each other. 1344 01:51:01.039 --> 01:51:04.319 I was in a communication is key to that. I relation would God 1345 01:51:04.399 --> 01:51:09.680 is ultimately key to that as well, so I would encourage that did go 1346 01:51:09.840 --> 01:51:15.800 forward. Thanks Petro. Any final words and then you can really I was 1347 01:51:15.920 --> 01:51:21.640 just um piggybacking on what Andre and um we Ell said about with their wives 1348 01:51:21.680 --> 01:51:25.800 are hard headed. Um, my wife is hard headed too, as you 1349 01:51:25.880 --> 01:51:30.920 guys know. I when she had argument she's not on this time, but 1350 01:51:31.239 --> 01:51:33.680 because she was a feeling well, but when she's had an arguments with her 1351 01:51:33.720 --> 01:51:40.279 sister, I tended to remove myself from the situation and kind of like let 1352 01:51:40.359 --> 01:51:44.000 them work it out themselves. As siblings. UM, I would not UM. 1353 01:51:45.000 --> 01:51:46.920 I would give you know, like advice, but I would never like 1354 01:51:47.760 --> 01:51:51.920 UM, I would just try to get my wife to see her sister side 1355 01:51:53.239 --> 01:51:55.640 because a lot of times when they got into the argument, my wife is 1356 01:51:55.640 --> 01:51:58.640 on one side where she's like, you know, this is what's going on, 1357 01:51:58.800 --> 01:52:01.479 and I'm like, have you looked at what your sister's feeling and try 1358 01:52:01.600 --> 01:52:05.560 to encourage it. I kind of went that way. I was never UM. 1359 01:52:06.479 --> 01:52:10.279 I was never the type to be like, um, you know, 1360 01:52:10.439 --> 01:52:13.960 trying to put a wedge between them, because if I if I put a 1361 01:52:14.000 --> 01:52:16.560 wedge between them, then I ended up getting blamed. Then it'll be my 1362 01:52:16.720 --> 01:52:20.680 fault that they're not talking. So I just always rant the opposite way in 1363 01:52:20.880 --> 01:52:25.520 that way. That's just me personally. UM. It's not easy to do 1364 01:52:25.600 --> 01:52:27.960 sometimes because then the wife would get mad at me. Now she's mad at 1365 01:52:28.000 --> 01:52:30.680 me, but hey, I you know, it's it's fine. We can 1366 01:52:30.760 --> 01:52:33.560 work it out. You know, we can communicate and conversate and work it 1367 01:52:33.600 --> 01:52:38.800 out. They should understand where I'm coming from that. I was just thinking 1368 01:52:38.840 --> 01:52:43.399 about that when they was talking about, you know, about how that made 1369 01:52:43.439 --> 01:52:45.680 that caused them a little bit of grief. Throughout their you know, adult 1370 01:52:45.800 --> 01:52:54.840 relationship, communication and compromise. Yep, I said, right, can you 1371 01:52:54.920 --> 01:52:59.319 just close the side with a prayer and then we'll wrap it up all righty 1372 01:52:59.359 --> 01:53:01.640 fo, We don't think all for joining us today. We thank you Lord 1373 01:53:01.760 --> 01:53:08.880 for allowing us to have this conversation about siblings, conflict and resolution and understanding 1374 01:53:08.960 --> 01:53:12.520 each other and loving each other and compromise. We ask a Lord that you 1375 01:53:12.520 --> 01:53:16.439 will be a physicist we go forward throughout this week, everybody listening and everybody 1376 01:53:16.520 --> 01:53:20.199 on the panel, that we all have a good week and that we can 1377 01:53:21.039 --> 01:53:26.920 better ourselves through this conversation with our siblings and with each other. And we 1378 01:53:27.000 --> 01:53:29.159 just want to say thank you Lord for your loving, your mercy, and 1379 01:53:29.239 --> 01:53:31.880 you have a lasting grace for this uppering your Holy name. Amen. Amen, 1380 01:53:32.199 --> 01:53:36.640 Amen. Well, we're trying to spend as usual, but I want 1381 01:53:36.680 --> 01:53:42.000 to say thank you for everyone's contribution. Thank you for joining us, taking 1382 01:53:42.039 --> 01:53:45.079 the time out of your busy schedules, out of your sabbath afternoons to be 1383 01:53:45.199 --> 01:53:51.000 with us. I hope you will come again. I'm already plugging another show. 1384 01:53:51.359 --> 01:53:55.079 What it will be about, we don't know, but it's really good 1385 01:53:55.159 --> 01:53:58.159 having you on board and I certainly look forward to talking to you again. 1386 01:53:59.159 --> 01:54:01.840 Until next m I want to say good night from myself, Zenia, and 1387 01:54:02.439 --> 01:54:10.239 from Man and Pedro and from the rest of the panel. God bless you 1388 01:54:10.680 --> 01:54:16.640 and take absolute care. By way Adventist Radio, London inspiration for the song