What is track a Lackey and Hardwood Knocks listeners, I am Dan for Valley, coming at you with some Russell Westbrook thought believe it or not. Before we actually get started, just our usual reminder slash please around these parts to subscribe to us. Whether you're getting your podcast and if you're watching this on YouTube, please and helps us a ton of you. Hit that like button and subscribe to us permanently as we continue and try and build up this community word of mouth as well. So if you're all ready listening to this podcast watching this on YouTube, tell friends, family members, acquaintances, random people on the internet, co workers, anyone you know that likes the MBA. We cover the entire league at large, go through the rest of our library. We try and talk about every single team as often as possible. We do exercises where we go through every single team. We normally break down by division or or conferences. The job is extremely thorough. We are extremely underrated. Hit that subscribe button wherever you're getting your podcasts or also on YouTube as well. It would really appreciate it. And as I say every single time, I am endlessly grateful for all the listeners and YouTube watcher subscribers that we have as well as on Twitter, Instagram, TikTok. You can find all our socials in the podcast description in the tube description and also consider checking out our discord. We have a great community building up. It's up and coming there as well any team. We talk about everything, so the link is also in the YouTube description and the podcast description. Let's dive into this Russell Westbrook stuff though, because I feel like we don't talk about the Lakers enough on this podcast. I guess as it relates to when they were in the Kyrie Irving News. Everyone talks about the Lakers, though, so I don't feel a need to add something unless I think I have an original thought or something that's important. And I'm not someone who has fallen on the side of Russ is deeply underrated. But I'm also not someone who has fallen on the side of the Lakers or Russ's fault. And I think that we've started to veer way too far into this direction of blaming Westbrook for a lot of what's wrong with the Lakers when they should have known what they were getting into. And I think so the latest news WOS broke it late Friday night to talk about a news dump he separated from his agent, Chris Foucher, who cited he gave these quotes to WOAG. I'm going to read one of them here, but it was just unlike anything I've really ever seen released publicly talking about like talk about what felt like damage controller. He was trying to communicate, Chris Foucher that Russell Westbrook is in the wrong. It felt like he intimated Russ made a trade request to the Lakers that came out and said Russ never made a trade request to the Lakers. Let's read the statement that Chris Foucher said. I represented Russell Westbrook for fourteen years, and I'm proud of our partnership, which includes a highly successful two thousand and eight draft, a Supermax contract, and the only renegotiation that extend Max contract in history. I also supported Russ through his rise into prominent fashion industry figure, and recently orchestrated three successive trades on Russell's behalf, culminating with the trade to his hometown Lakers. Each time teams gave up valuable players and assets to acquire Russell, and each time a new organization embraced his arrival. We did it together. With grace and class. Now with a possibility of a fourth trade in four years, the marketplace is telling the Lakers they must add additional value with Russell in any trade scenario, and even then, such a trade may require Russell to immediately move on from the new team be a buyout. My belief is that this type of transaction only serves to diminish Russ's value, and his best option is to stay with the Lakers, embrace the starting role and support that Darvin Hamm publicly offered Russell's a first ballot Hall of Famer and will prove that again before he is retired goes on. Unfortunately, irreconcirable differences forced them to be no longer working together. I don't know what that says about anybody in this scenario, but it kind of drags Russ under the bus here by saying he really wants a trade from LA and his agent former agent didn't agree with him, and they're at the point where with Russ is going to enter the open market next summer, he will be a free agent. His former agent didn't want to. Chris didn't want to have to be have the burden of negotiating his next contract. Which I you know what, I wouldn't want that job either, because Russ's value was so divisive as it stood anyway, and to just add this stretch where his value really plunged with the Lakers. We were talking about with the Lakers to give a first round pick to dump him, like to just dump him, just get off himich turn out a team that didn't have flexibility, and it was going to take a first round pick just to get off Russ's salary without sort of guaranteeing that you're even going to get an upgrade. I take issue with this, that this narrative, and I hate that word continues to be spun that this is all Russell Westbrook's fault and we even saw it. I mean, you talk about just people when they come up with trades, Like they're blaming Russ because he couldn't fit with the team. They're blaming Ross because he committed so many turnovers. They're blaming Russ for pouting after he was benched in the fourth quarter later in the season. They're blaming Russ because he's not he's taking jumpers and not making enough of them. And look, all that's fair. Russ did not do what La thought he was going to do when they brought him in. He still took You know, his jumpers were just not good. He shot. He had a thirty nine point three effective field goal percentage on pull up jumpers, one of the worst marks in the league for anyone at high volume, the single worst mark in the league for anyone who attempted at least five pull up jumpers per game. He had under thirty percent of his catch and shoot threes. That number did Wax and Wayne as the season went on, so there was some merit to, oh, could he work off the ball a little bit? People have complained that he never said enough ball screens. Those are all fair complaints. He I think the biggest argument in favor of acquiring Russ as far as it existed, was well, what can he do when Lebron and a d are off the court and the team was awful? They were a minus seven point three points perne hundred possessions. Teams outscored them by seven point three points per one hundred possessions. When Russell Westbrook played without Lebron and Anthony Davis. Us was not good. But I'm very uncomfortable with the way that everything is being sort of blamed in his direction and did he accept enough culpability behind the scenes. It certainly does not seem like it, but you also have reports like this from Brian Winnhorse of ESPN. I'm gonna play this clip right now. I don't think enough people talk about this Russell Westbrook exit interview because what Russ said, and that was just a couple of parts of it, he went on for twenty minutes was borderline delusional. And basically what Russ did at the end of that Laker season was taking no personal accountability for the way the season went down and blamed most of it on his coach, Frank Vogel for not setting things up in defining things more for him to be successful. And then he partially blamed it on Lebron and Anthony Davis too, or he said that they didn't change their games when Russell himself changed almost nothing. And so to listen to someone talk like that. When I heard that conference, I remember saying, oh my god, like this guy never had any intention of changing his game and has no intention of changing his game. Look, that is not great. And again Russ deserves so much blame here, But can we not lose sight of why Russ it was in la in the first place. The front office made the decision to acquire him, and Lebron and a D apparently pushed to acquire him. That trade was build as a terrible fit in the moment, and there are a lot of times where you look at trades in the moment, you have your reflective reactions, and you go back hindsight is twenty twenty and everything is fine, you were wrong, or it turns out better than expected. This was one of those things that you could see was going to be a disaster from the moment that it happened. They gave up so much value. They obliterated their depth. It's not Russ's fault that they obliterated their depth. It's also not even if you think that Lebron and a D wanted Russ, it's not their fault that the team went out and acquired Russ. It's not Frank Vogel's fault that he was unable to fit Russell Westbrook onto a team that wasn't built to fit Russell Westbrook. You don't want to build a team to fit Russell Westbrook in the year twenty and twenty two. I also get that but you put him alongside another paul dominant guy in Lebron James, don't really surround him with a ton of shooting or defense. What did you think was going to happen? And I'm not even saying if the Lakers wanted to move on from Vogel. I'm so intrigued with the job that Darvin Hamm is going to do. People around the league said nothing but great things about him. There's fine, there was, there was a basis for firing Vogel anyway, I guess I still think he received too much of the blame as well. Jine was not receiving still all this time, after enough of the blame. The front office, Rob Polinka, Kurt Rambis apparently and Linda Rambis apparently have these really powerful voices still behind the scenes. And then, of course, you know the team's primary governor in Genie Buss. This is like, you can't let these people skate by. They made the decision, whoever it was among those four. However it went on. They didn't resign Alex Caruso if Ad and Lebron wanted Russell Westbrook, guess who had to sign off on at first? Part of being executives of a team is knowing when to not listen to your stars, and it's some organizations we're going to turn the entire fate of their franchise over to those stars because of how important they are on the court. That doesn't mean that they need to be the end all be all of the voices off the court. And I'm not trying to diminish how smart certain players can be, but it was very clear that Russ wasn't going to be a good fit and that this was sort of a flashy name acquisition. You need to be able to part of your job, as Genie Buss as Rob Pelinka, as Kurt and Linda rambus I, guess you need to be able to say no, they're wrong, like we're gonna go the Buddy Healed route because that was on the table, or we're not going to make a move at all because hey, fucking guess what wings are valuable in this league and you traded away two of them essentially in KCP and Kuzma, then let another really like a guard but a great defender, and Alex Caruso walk for money that you could have paid him because you're worried about your luxury tax bill, like those are the people that deserve the blame in this. It's not Russ for refusing to change, because you want to know what's happened at every single stop in Russell Westbrook's career. He hasn't changed. This isn't like breaking news here that Russ wants the ball in his hands, that Russ is gonna dribble into bad jumpers that I do think his turnover issues were exacerbated this year. Turned the ball over on eighteen point one percent of his pick and rolls. That happens. Guess what. James Harden turned the ball over in eighteen point one percent of his pick and rolls this past year two. It's probably the worst season we've seen from James Harden in quite some time. But there were worst players in the NBA when it came to turnovers. Russ might have been the single most detrimental player among high volume among high volume players. Just looking at what happened to him on defense, like he was sometimes there's like a lot of pomp and circumstance to his defense, it didn't even feel like there was that this year. Guess what. Russell Westbrook has never pretended that he was going to change. He's been moved from team to team for real value in certain instances these past few years. Specifically went okayc traded him to Houston. They really want that deal. That was sort of the start of the fall. There was already rumblings about that while he was in Okay See that he would be and we kind of knew that when Kevin Durant left that he's maybe not the easiest person to play with. I'm not talking about his personality, though maybe that's grading on some I'm just talking about his style of game. And if he wasn't going to play off the ball aton, if he wasn't going to be an efficient jump shooter, if he wasn't going to be a frequent ball screener, they were going to always be issues there. That has now happened at every stop, even when he's played well. He had high moments in Houston towards the second half of the season, he had high moments in Washington towards the second half of the season. It still just didn't work out there, and these teams constantly talked themselves into acquiring him for value. I mean, Washington gave up the least amount of value when you look at it in that trade, but the Lakers and then the Rockets specifically, Yeah, there there are competing agendas here. James Harden didn't want to play with Chris Paul anymore. Part of your job as a front office would be to tell James Harden, you'll suck it up, deal with it. If we find a better trade for CP three, whose value wasn't great at that time. We're not going to mortgage our entire future to get Russell Westbrook. It reminds me just of that clip where it's like, oh, is this going to work out for us? What did it work for those people? No? It never does. I mean, these people somehow delude themselves into thinking it might. But but it might work for us. This is not It's not on Russ in the sense that Russ came to LA and torpedoed everything. They had other issues. Mind you, they were injured, they were banged up. Who knows what this team looks like at full strength. Just having a healthy lebron n Ad for the entire year would have absolutely gone a long way. I wouldn't have picked them and winning the title. I would have probably expected them to make the playoffs. If we're talking about Lebron and a D playing in more games. But the Lakers, once again, like they did at the beginning of the Lebron e, took a team and decided to not build it around shooting and defense to compliment Lebron and a D or to compliment Lebron in general. They specifically minimized shooting. They minimize defense as well, but they had players enough town, especially when Adie was healthy, to paper over a lot of their issues on that end of the floor. And now even leading into next season. I like some of the stuff they've done over the offseason. Thomas Bryant thought that was a really good signing, especially if you want a D to play the four, Thomas Bryant can give you floor spacing. I actually liked the Lonnie Walker the fourth signing more than most if anyone watched him towards the latter end of this past year. His game really started to come together over an extended period of time, kind of post Derek White trade. He might need the ball in his hands, but you know they found touches from a league monk there. He's gonna be a little bit bigger than Malik Monk. He can get you going downhill. He can hit some tough jumpers. He can also space the floor with the three. I don't know, it does feel like there's going to be a higher variance to his game. He feels less complimentary than a Leakue Monk did, but I can appreciate the flyer. And you're just taking some gambles on youth here and it only cast you to many me level exception. What I've gone that direction, I don't know, but I'm ultimately fine with it. I love the want Toscano Anderson signing. You want versatile wings on this team, which you needed. He does that. He might be sort of a combo forward more than a wing, but he can defend almost every position depending on who's on the floor with him. I really the Damien Jones, like he had some really nice moments last year in Sacramento offensively, so again, I like some of the moves they made in the vacuum, but they haven't done anything inspiring inspiring this offseason, and so now it just feels like, oh, we're going to pivot to blaming this on Russ. Who again, Russ, is it fault here because it's not Frank Vogel's fault. It's not Lebron in AD's fault insofar as Russ actually said that. By the way, that just feels something like he expected Lebron and AD to change their games, but not himself. I just can't imagine anyone would be that stubborn or ignorant, and look, maybe he is. I think everyone here bears the share of blaminglude Lebron and a d If they pushed this trade for Russ, and if Lebron is sort of passed aggressively trying to get Russ out after he was in favor of this on any level, that's fucked up too. So there's blame to be tossed around to everyone, including the departed Frank Vogel. But this front office, the leadership in this organization has been a fucking shit show for the past year plus, right down to the way that they let the news out that Frank Vogel was going to get fired, even though it was just considered inevitable anyway, there was no way to let that leak out before you even met with him immediately after your final game of the season. It was it was grotesque the way that they handled that, and so you want to point the finger at anyone, Rob Plinka, Kurt Rambis, Linda Rambis, Jeanie Buss, who signed off on the Russell Westbrook trade, who let Alex Caruso walk for luxury tax reasons, who decided to obliterate their depth for a player that always profiled this extremely if he fit. Who decided to build a team with more ball handling and versatility rather than complimentary defense and shooting. Because why because Lebron's getting older and he is still yet to ever really seed real control over the offense wherever he's been. We've talked about that in the past two about oh, this is gonna make it easier for Lebron to sort of ease off the ball, and it sort of reached the fever pitch when he first came to the Lakers and the way they built that team by having the kiddos there with with Lonzo Ball and Brandon ingram. No, it doesn't work like that because Lebron's going to have the ball in his hands, and you know what, Lebron should have the ball in his hands. If you want to Lebron to turn into a screen and roll guy, you don't really need anthy davis oven team anymore. And he's Lebron James, So as long as he's playing peak near peak Lebron basketball, you should absolutely build your team to maximize his talents. Not make this trade that was that always hinged upon. Will imagine what Russ can do when Lebron isn't on the court. If that is the primary argument in favor of the trade, that you have one of the two greatest basketball players of all time, NBA players of all time, and you're trying to envision what your team can look like on the court without him while he's still on the team, I don't care well he is. That's fucking stupid. It's ass and nine. And that's where the Lakers I've really messed up the most. And I don't I feel it's cringey the way that this is all being thrown onto Westbrook, who again was bad last year. And it's okay to say that we don't need to. You know, I talk a lot about I don't want to tell anyone how to fan and I preached that a lot too. I don't want to preach, but I say that a lot where I don't like how certain media members, analysts, bloggers, podcasts can be really condescending when they're talking to people, and I try not to do that unless you're being a real ass hat to me. I don't like it when they say, well, you have to like this is how we have to look at the game, like no fuck trades and transactions and free agency, like I want to talk about, you know, horns, like we need to dive deep into that. I'm a horn set that was run between the Pistons and the Pelicans from twenty seventeen in February on the second night of a back to back on a Wednesday. If that's what you're into, fine, I'm I love I try. I love this game on so many different levels. And I like reading and listening to people who are smarter than I am, and I like reading about it all. The off court drama is part of the appeal. Free agency, transaction, trades, that's part of the appeal too, actually just watching the game in real time and seeing what some of these individuals are doing with the ball in their hands, their shot making, watching Draymond Green away from the ball on defense, seeing like certain teams in their ball movement, or how they get guys open, guys who are relocating away from the ball to get their open shots, appreciate the game however you want, if that's not something you're into, if you enjoy more of just the soap opera element of this that I don't have an issue with it too. There's detrimental coverage, but people flipping out because ESPN during the finals is talking about whether ad is still a top five player in the league or top ten player. That's not one of them. That's a legitimate question. And when we're in the finals, there are twenty eight other teams. Even though that happens to be the Lakers we're talking about in that situation, there are twenty eight other teams, twenty eight other fan bases. Not everyone's going to care about that one series as deeply as everybody else. With being said, it's just and I'm also not a fan of like we don't have to, you know, masturbate to this game every five seconds where everyone's the greatest thing ever and every play is the greatest thing ever, and we can't say anything negative. Russell Westbrook was bad. That's one thing too. Russell Westbrook deserves a ton of the blame here if he's alwaysn't willing to change his game, and I don't believe he was. I find it very hard that they would look at Russ and say, yeah, you know, we're not even going to try you out on more ball screens, Like why would you ever say that? That has to be part of like what Russ is going to do. Is the Laker's fault for maybe not trying to get him moving off the ball, or if you can't reach him, to get him moving off the ball, because there was a lot of stationary action with Russ when he was away from the ball, or stationary and action would probably be the better way to say it. Yeah, that falls into the coaching staff, also falls in the front office because they acquired Russell Westbrook, who has never been one to change or adapt his game to anybody. That that is the primary party to blame here, and I think we need to not lose sight of that. And you want to know why else we should blame them? And we're gonna get into this is what team should actually trade for Russ or should talk themselves into it. They've yet to give up the assets necessary to move Russ because he's a negative value contract at this point and they don't want to attach more of their future picks. They can trade one in twenty seven and twenty nine, and they don't want to do that, that's fine. Keep him and stop trying to throw him under the bus, Like what are you trying to get him to do? Give you twenty million dollars back and a buyout or when you ultimately do trade him and say, oh, well, he requested a trade, guess what. Russell westbrook no longer has the cachet based off what he's done on the court to request a trade and then get it at the same time his forty seven point one million dollars salary. It's expiring. It's not immovable. And if the Lakers are going to try and spin it as it is, they're lying, like that's the spin game that we're getting into. Is wild. If they refuse to trade him, that's fine, that's their prerogative. That's how things work in the NBA, And it suggests that they would prefer to do that rather than move any assets to get him. But you want to blame them, I can almost guarantee you right now if they had put their twenty seven and twenty nine picks on the table, that Brooklyn would have traded Kyrie Irving to them already. I can all I can. I'm willing to all but guarantee that, but they don't want to give up that much value. I don't know if they were not willing to take back Joe Harris either. I think Brooklyn would be stupid to want to include Joe Harrison that deal. I still ultimately think that Kyrie ends up in in La at this juncture. I can't imagine him and KD playing for the Nets again. But the Lakers, if they're not willing to include the assets necessary to change up their team, that's on the Lakers. That's not on Russ. That's not on Lebron or a D either. It was just like when Polinka came out and said that they talked to Lebron and Ad and they were at the trade deadline, excuse me, and they were okay with the Lakers doing nothing at the trade deadline, and then Lebron and Nadi were like, no, that's not a conversation that we ever had. This front office is a disaster, like and it's almost it's comedic because of how incompetent it is. It's hilarious and it's hopeless at the same time, the Lakers still might be fine because Kyrie Irving wants to go to LA and there are avenues that they can explore to take advantage of this situation that the Nets have also gotten themselves into. It's not just on Kyrie Irring. But you can't trust this front office right now. Who's done. Look the Lakers buy on large like they've done some nice job mining talent on the margins when you look at players they drafted or acquired outside of the draft, and this isn't it doesn't all fall under the same front office. But like this organization has been able to you know ingram great player, Kuzma, great player, Cruzo, great player, James Russell turned into a really solid player, getting them leak monk Flyer to focus on more recent stuff. Like I said, I like the Lonnie Walker the fourth Flyer, and this team won a championship in twenty twenty, can call the fake bubble championship. Whatever. Blame the front office for what's happening with the Lakers. First and foremost the front office. Polinka the Rambai is that the player of ramat ram By. It sounds like a shape and Genie Buss Polinka and the Rambai for this more so than Westbrook, more than Lebron, more than a d more than vocal. And if they keep Russ, don't put any of the blame on Darvin because he couldn't make it work. This is not a workable situation on paper, on the court. Everyone knew it to begin with. I don't if you watch Russell Westbrook as untradable, and I think that teams that aren't going to be on this superimmediate timeline should consider if the Lakers are going to attach first round picks, not to just take on a salary, but send some value back. Maybe it's one you don't need, players you don't need long term, and Brooklyn's a special case. Let's just assume they move Kevin Durant. So yeah's actually let's just connon Ball into these Russell Westbrook trade destinations. Just teams that I believe should be looking at Russ because they're either not on an immediate timeline or they are a special circumstances where you look at this and say, Okay, he's gonna make forty seven point one million dollars next year. That's it. He's off the books after that. Maybe you're acquiring him, and most of these teams are going to suggest would with the intention of waiving him or negotiating a buyout. If you're not on an immediate timeline. To me, that's fine, that's absolutely something that you should consider. I'm gonna start off with the Nets, though, because they all are in a special circumstance. If you are Brooklyn, Kyrie wants to go to LA you want to win immediately. You're not bringing in Russ to play with Ben Simmons. That would be fucking twisted and stupid. And you're also not bringing him back to play with KD. You're not going to bring in Russ. Keep him, then also keep KD. If you trade for Russ, you're probably doing someone of the guys that you will broker a buy out or because the Lakers are going to have to include value in that deal, there will be a third team which is reaping the assets of getting Russ that they otherwise wouldn't be getting from the Lakers because Kyrie Irving wouldn't be part of that deal. The Lakers have made it clear they don't want to trade first for Russ just to get him off the team without getting value back. I can understand that stance Brooklyn. Though you send out Kyrie Irving, there needs to be more salary to make it work. People have mentioned Joe Harris. I don't think once he's healed from his ankle surgery that he's going to be this negative. He's the perfect superstar compliment. But you have Joe Harris, you have Royce O'Neil, who gave up a first round pick four, so I don't think it should be him. You have Seth Curry expiring contract that shouldn't be him. So that's why it almost, you know, really needs to be Joe Harris. It also doesn't need to be any one substantial, by the way, because Kyrie I Ring is making thirty six point six million dollars rich under the trade rules, that's going to get you almost too Russell westbrook salary. So like you can send out some smaller contracts of players that maybe don't trust. I guess the problem is the nets as cheap as contracts, none of them looking at it at all. You know you're not trading Cameron Thomas or Dayron Sharp to get them, and so if it is, if it is Harris, maybe that just means you're getting more value out of the Lakers. If you're the Nets, though, and you can get the Lakers twenty seven and twenty twenty nine first round picks, you should absolutely be doing this trade because if you're moving Kevin Duran, if you're planning on bringing these two back and competing, fine try that. Good luck. I don't think it's gonna This whole situation just seems super combustible, but you're trying to as much as you want to be this immediate threat. You also need to restock your your draft cover. You did some of that with the with the James Harden trade, and look, it helps you out. You have your twenty twenty seven pick, you have it, but it's a swap to Houston, and so you could definitely wind up with the You're gonna wind up with the worst of the two picks in that scenario. You also have Phillies twenty twenty seven picks, so yeah, you end up with three first but like some of those could be moved later. The Lakers can offer swaps, but you need to get they're in the weird situation because the Nets. The twenty twenty eight swap you could offer that would be valuable as the Nets, but they owe their twenty twenty six pick I believe is gone, so the swap in twenty twenty six doesn't matter. But the Lakers godfather offer is those two first and twenty seven and twenty nine plus swaps in twenty six and twenty eight plus Russ. Who can you get for that? If it gets you Kyrie Irving and you're just setting it up, there's a three team deal, someone else goes and latches onto Kyrie Irving and any of the teams are going to talk about now should maybe be in it? Then fine, do that. If you can get Kyrie and you're the Lakers, then you should absolutely positively be making that deal. And if you don't, then you can't go back and say, well, Russell's unmovable, this and that. Russ can be moved if you're willing to trade your first round pick, cause I do believe he probably could be dealt for Kyrie Irving at this juncture as well. Other teams to keep an eye on. I think we should start with the two that have cap space. So Indiana, after going after the eight offer sheet can keep around thirty plus million in cap space, they can do something as simple as sending out Buddy Healed for Russell Westbrook. They could also send out Miles Turner for Russell Westbrook. They could send out both if they believe the Lakers have enough value to get that. They have so much cap space, though, they could start sending out cheaper players. You could send out No, you can't send out TJ mccon force. Well, you could send out one of Miles Turner or Buddy Healed. Doesn't have to be both. Maybe they don't want Buddy Healed because he has two years at over forty million dollars left on his deal. If the Lakers are willing to trade Russ in the first or Buddy Healed alone, they're getting immediate payroll relief and that's big, apparently to their tax bill. They run their team like a small business. I would include the first round pick to do that. And if I'm the Pacers again, you're probably out Russ. You're rebuilding. That money comes off your books in a year. There's no reason to stretch and wave it. Just do it now. If it's a matter of you know, do they want Miles Turner, Yeah, things get iffy. There would I do twenty seven twenty nine and RUSS for Miles Turner and Buddy Healed from the Lakers. Sure, the Pacers probably not. If the Lakers include swaps in twenty six and twenty eight, I might consider it. If they include two, first, I would give up Myles Turner for sure alone. And if again, if you really don't value Buddy Healed and maybe you're looking at it as we needed true threes on this roster anyway, and we have like sort of this surplus of guards and like swing men rather than actual wings, and you don't really value Buddy Healed in that way and you just want to play Tyrese Halibert and Christo Arte Bene nic mathurin O shaber Set a crap ton, then sure, if you don't view Buddy, if you yourself as the Pacers, don't view Buddy Healed as a net negative, I would absolutely consider Russ for Heel Turner and at least and the Lakers two first round picks. Now, if you can get more, if you can get the swaps, that's even better. If you can get Austin Reeves by the way, out of this quiet like has a really nice pump and drive game, held up on defense quite well. I'd look at that. I don't think they need talent Horton Tucker, but if they want him, like the Lakers, the Lakers have avenues to sweeten their offer beyond twenty seven to twenty nine. And if I'm the Lakers and if you can get Turner, I would give up both those first round picks, probably because you want to play another big alongside Ad. Turner's not the best rebounder, but again, Ad can be the four on defense and still be a great rebounder. Turner space to the floor and offense that helps out a lot. Doesn't need to be the primary screener. You have to make sure he wants to stick around long term, of course, because you don't want to risk trading away your future for a rental. My point is, if you're the Pacers, you're in full on rebuilding mode one year of Russell Westbrook. If it's even coming with one unprotected Lakers first round pick, I'm considering it. I know things tend to work out for LA, but twenty twenty seven that ages you out of the Lebron Davis Corps. Probably Lebron certainly not there. So that's a team that should consider it. And then The other one, of course, is the Spurs. They're still sitting on. I have them mad in my spreadsheet. They have over thirty million dollars in capital as well. I'm in the thirty two. That's you know, Josh Richardson for Russell Westbrook could work. That probably doesn't get either. But like Josh Richardson and Doug McDermott for Westbrook, and the Lakers are giving you one or two or their first, that's a deal I would consider if I'm LA or San Antonio. If I'm saying Antonio, I might even consider it if it's one. Josh Richardson, great voice in the locker room for them on an expiring contract. Doug McDermott doesn't fit their timeline over thirty years old, and he's probably relative to what he does a little bit overpaid. The Lakers could use his shooting and cutting. We'll see if Darvin Ham actually succeeds in getting players moving away from the ball, which has been difficult for lebron led teams in the past. Those are two players that helped them right away. Doesn't add size to the Lakers front court, but Richardson had an underrated year last year, can still hit the three gives you a lot of a positional valuability. I don't think you're and I wouldn't want Purtle next to Anthony Davis. So those are two players right there. I don't know if it takes both your first to get Russ because we're only looking at twenty six million dollars in salary there. The Lakers end up saving almost twenty one million off their media payroll. That's probably worth going the two first four. If I'm san Antonio, I'm demanding a first and something else. Is it a swap, two swaps or that outright first round pick in twenty nine as well? Maybe you don't want to do that if you're LA because you're not getting us. You know, when it's Irving, it's a star. If it's not Irving, then it's weird. Now, could they latch on as a third team And there's a scenario where maybe the Spurs are eating Joe Harris's contract and they're sending Richardson back to the Lakers, and they're getting some of the Lakers picks while Brooklyn gets one, and you're splitting the baby, so to speak. In that direction, you could look at that, but I think the Spurs are a team that could they should be willing to take on Russell Westbrook, because no, he's not gonna stay there. You're gonna wave him or buy him out. He comes off your books after next year. You're not trying to win this season anyway. They've made the Spurs of that clear trading away de Jante Murray, they trade away Derek White mid season last year. They've they've just made that very clear. And even Indy, Yeah, they went after eight and it'd be a different story if he was there. He's not, and so that's a team that's not looking to win immediately. It does get a little challenging though, when you look at teams that you know, don't beyond those teams, someone else, another squad that should be looking at them. Speaking of a team in full looking at Russ is the Jazz, speaking of a team that's in full tear down mode. They have salaries that they can send out to match. It would have to be basically a dollar dollar for dollar match. Here doesn't have to be dollar for dollar. But the Jazz, they're not going to go in a luxury tax for a team that's going to be bad. They have they have currently like enough like some room under the luxury tax, like fourteen million dollars in rooms. You can save the Lakers a little bit of money, But you're not gonna want your payroll to be so high. You might not even want to be over the cap if the team is going to be this bad, I'll tell you right now, like your stands are not getting Donod Mitchell for Russell Westbrook, which is I mean, boyon Bogdanovich, Malik Beasley, and Beverly like those you could get that adds to the Lakers payroll. But you could get those three players just for Russ. Would you give up a first round pick? You're twenty twenty seven, both first round picks twenty seven and twenty nine. I would. I'm not gonna lie. I would. Those players are all complimentary, they're on expiring deals, Beasley's second years of team option. In that scenario, Bayamodanovich is a perfect player to have alongside Lebron Nad. Maybe you want Mike Conley to sort of have that other point guard option on this team. I don't hate that idea. He probably decreases how much you need to get up give up to get the deal done. He's owed twenty two point seven next year and then guaranteed fourteen point three of twenty four point four in twenty twenty three, two twenty four. I know people remember how Conley played towards the end of last year's postseason and some of the mistakes he made. He was really good for the Jazz last year, And so could the trade be something like, I don't think you're gona get Conley and Bogdanovich, but like, let's say, if it's Conley and Malik Beasley or Conley and Patrick Beverley for US Westbrook, the jack should consider that if they're getting out of one on the more than fifty percent guarantee on Conley's second year salary here, and if it's an unprotected Lakers pick, I think it's worth giving up. If it's Malik Beasley, if it's Beverly, I might even consider if it's Boya Macdanovitch, he's making nineteen point six next year. I don't know who's giving you a first round pick. Maybe you just think you can get better value. But that's a team just looking at the construction of those contracts. Conley, Bogdanovich, Leek Beasley, Patrick Beverly and then even Jordan Clarkson has a player option for twenty three twenty four, a reunion with him shouldn't be out of the question for LA. Whatever combination the players they can get from Utah while minimizing the first round damage they're giving up the motherload is probably just like I said Beverly Beasley and macdonovitch, that will Utah do that? Will they do swaps in twenty six and twenty eight, do those that value to them or the Lakers out right picks in twenty seven and twenty nine, those are look swaps or assets. I know people are probably laughing at the idea of swaps. Things tend to work out for the Lakers swaps or assets, and we saw that in the you know, the Celtics getting Derek White, that twenty twenty eight swap. Let's say, Tonio So let the go bear trade a Minnesota giving up an one unprotected swap in addition to other stuff. If you think that the Lakers are going to go sideways, and especially under the control of this front office, if you don't see the clear path of them getting another star, they're swaps in twenty six and twenty eight. A few years down the line, I have a ton of value if I'm the Lakers. This one's a little bit less clear cut to me, just like san Antonio. I don't know if I'm giving up both my first round tangible picks. If it's Macdonovitch, Beasley and Beverley, I might, I'm not gonna lie. I'm definitely giving up the twenty twenty seven pick unprotected if that gets it. If that gets it done, and if I can only get two of those players, I mean, Utah's will want to sort of, you know, swallow the salary. The Conley Beasley deal feels like the best middle ground or Conley and Patrick Beverley from one of the Lakers first, then maybe a swap. That's something that that's something that you talk to look at. And again, you're not acquiring Russ with the intention of keeping him. You're buying him out or you're waving him and then he's off the books after that year. And the benefit there is Conley costs less than Russell Westbrook in the aggregate of his salary next year, and then what he's guaranteed the following season. He calls about what, let's say they guarantee his salary for twenty three twenty four, calmly over the next two years cost you about what Russell Westbrookville next year. But just having the money completely off your books opens up a different a few different avenues of flexibility. The Hornets are another team that I think should consider it. I have no idea what the hell is really going on with them. They seem pretty dead set on being competitive. Miles Bridges is currently being charged with a variety of domestic abuse allegations or charges. I believe that situation is a disaster. And look, it doesn't matter about his free agency or fit with the Hornets, their actual basketball part of this is is he going to be back? Is he even going to be playing next season? Do you move forwards? If he's not going to be on the team. What's the punishment going to be for what he did, which was just you know, when you saw the pictures and the video from his son, just absolutely disgusting. We need to make that much clear. But the Hornets, they seem to value flexibility. It's tough again, not knowing the direction of the team fully, it does seem my theory in Streney now Russ is not someone you keep in that scenario unless the you know, the Jordan brand is so strong there, but they have Hayward. Maybe they want to get off his deal and they can include another salary. I mean you could trade. Maybe you don't like the rest of Turt ros Year's contract. Is there something you can work out there or is it Plumbly and Hayward for Russ and you're taking on I don't think they have enough wiggle room under the tax to actually want to do that. They actually they do. They're there. Wow, they're further under the No, they're closer to the tax than I believe, so excuse me. You know, can you do just other moves? You can get to a dollar for dollar matches and if you're the Lakers, yeah, I'd roll the dice in the final two years of Gordon Hayward's deal if the Charlotte wanted to get rid of Rosier. I don't let me be clear, I don't love this landing spot for RUSS, but for a team like Charlotte, if I thought that they were really gonna use the flexibility wisely, because you'd be turning longer term contracts into a shorter term one that just comes off the books after next season, I might feel a little higher about it. Cap space poly doesn't mean a ton in Charlotte. They are concerned about the tax bill though, and maybe just knowing that they have Lamello's extension coming up, they just want to have a little bit more maneuverability moving forward and sooner. That could help you get Russ. And if again, if they're willing to take a step back next season and you give up Tarry Rosier and Hayward for Russ, and then the Lakers could do that due out right, but we know how they feel about their tax bill. You know they can send out some smaller salaries there, Kendrick Nunn, just to make the money just a little bit more palatable. Match for match, Are you getting an asset if you're Charlotte in that situation, I think Terry Rozier and even Gordon Hayward good enough where you should be getting at least one Lakers first. And I would do it if it was look Terror's year, Hayward for none and Russ and the twenty twenty seven Lakers first, I definitely do that. If I'm the Lakers, I'm on the fence. If I'm Charlotte, it depends upon my aims, if you're making that trade, I would assume you're, you know, kind of having this gap year. Maybe you view that as dangerous with LaMelo extension eligible following next season. It's debatable. At least I don't think if I don't think the Lakers are giving up two first in that scenario though, that's for sure that that kind of when I was going through the destinations, that's kind of like the end of the teams, that might make sense. You could say Detroit can stand to swallow it. They just can't even like build. They have some cap him right now, but it's not a ton. I guess you would be doing Neurland's Noel Alec Burks and Kelly Olenick type deal, and I don't even know if that's gonna help you. Neurlan Sawell's nine point two Burks. That's nineteen with Burks and then another twelve with so you come pretty close to that's like thirty million dollars in salary right there, a little bit over a thirty million dollars and ats you have you have enough? Yeah, no, you don't have enough cap states to swallow that difference. So you need to include a fourth player. In there. How high are you on have a Udiallo, maybe Corey Joseph if the Lakers w want to give you a first round pick for I just don't know that you're getting much more than that. If you view Noel and Burks as useful players who are moving forward, then you're certainly gonna want more than its distant Lakers First, you're again not keeping Russ and I do think Kelly Olynik looking at their front court structure is probably pretty important now, especially if you want Marvin Bagley to fit into a rotation that has Isaiah Stewart, that now has Jalen Duran, Kelly Lynx spaces the floor and so he can play. He's the one big that can play alongside any of their other bigs. In theory, that's part why I didn't like the Marvin Badley the third contract. But you could look at going that route and view it as, oh, well, we're actually consolidating our big man rotation because we're getting rid of Olynek and Noel and having Marvin Badley the third jail and Duran and Isaiah Stewart or is three primary bigs. You could there's definitely a rotation to be made out of that. I thought about the Rockets for a hot minute, just because they're rebuilding, and again you get Russ with the thought of then buying him out. Step laddering their way there gets a little too difficult, and when evolved sending out a crap ton of contracts, you begin with Eric Gordon a nineteen point six million. Are the Lakers giving you an asset for that? I have no idea. I don't think they'd want to give up a first for Eric Gordon, even though it's getting them off of Russ. Maybe because it's getting them off of Russ as well. You have to step out of your way though, ultimately, in my opinion, with too many contracts we're looking at, you know they're gonna trade Eric Gordon and then David Nuaba. Bobon has the expiring salary, Trey Burke has the three point three expiring salary did over Sterling Brown, and it basically needs to be all of those players. Just looking at how like Gordon doesn't even make twenty, but you round him up to twenty. The Laba brings you to twenty five twenty eight point five with Bobon, and then another six and a half million with you know, you're around thirty five million at this point, which is actually not enough money to take back Russ and not have any cap space left over. So that's a team that again, you could do it, especially because it's the offseason, but you have to really step ladder your way too much. In my opinion, after that, it gets iffy. I was a big advocate of the Knicks doing it, maybe using Russ's expiring salary as a means to get off of Fournier and or Julius Randall. They don't appear headed in that direction. They're fully engaged in Donovan Mitchell, They've already they've already signed Jalen Brunson. It's unreal It was always unrealistic, but now it's less palatable if they miss on Mitchell. I still wouldn't hate the idea of, hey, yeah, we signed Brunson, but we're trying to make this a longer term timeline, and so we have rows, we have FOURGNYA, we have Randall. If you're willing to take at least one of four NA and Randall and give us a first round pick in addition to russ salary, then the Knicks should absolutely consider it. That's another distant pick in their chamber to go out and acquire a star again if they're not going to have complete the Donovan Mitchell trade and it doesn't do anything for you next season. But I would argue, if you can get rid of Julius Randall, who might look is a worthy reclamation project. If he hits his deal looks great as the cap rises, he could help the Lakers. He's gonna help the Lakers more than rust did during the during the lebron lest stretcher. I'll tell you that much right now. And he's shot well enough on spot up threas in the past, where if you can convince him to be more of a screen and dive guide and dominate the ball or at least limited his ball domination to when he's on the court by himself, he can help the Lakers more than Russell Westbrookin. I would argue, then, by getting Russ, waiving him or buying him out, you've actually done more for your team as the Knicks to open up things for Jalen Brunson and also RJ Barrett, independent of what's going on with Donovo Mitchell. And if you're getting a first round pick or two as part of that equation, should absolutely be considering it. Again, that's depending on what happens with the Donovan Mitchell stuff, and you might not want to do it anyway because it costs you some flexibility when it comes to going after Donno Mitchell this season. Just having that dead money of Russ on the books unless you think, are you just going to carry him? I argue you probably shouldn't play him, even though the franchise loves flashy names. But are you just going to keep his money on the books to maybe be moved at midseason if Donovan Mitchell isn't moved and becomes available, or another star becomes available and you need that salary anchor the thunder. Everyone loves a good homecoming store. They just they can't get to the money to acquire Russ. There's their biggest contract that they would actually consider moving is Derek Favors is ten point two million dollars salary. That's just out of the question. I did think, and this is gonna rankle some feathers. I thought about Orlando for a hot minute. They don't. Again, they don't keep him. You're probably getting Russ and buying him out. You have some bigger salaries that maybe you don't want. I know a lot of Orlando fans like Marquel Folts, like Jonathan Isaac, But would you be willing to move one of them plus Terrence Ross. If you're getting two first round picks from the Lakers for Russell Westbrook, there have to be other pieces, moving pieces involved there. I would do that if I'm Orlando. I have Pablo Banko, I have Franz Wagner, I have John Suggs. They are my timeline. To a lesser extent, Wendell Carter Jr. He's my timeline. They are my future. I don't you know. Faults was good last season when for the minimal time that he was healthy, and he's been good really since coming over to Orlando. In general, He's not good enough for me to say he's a cornerstone. I wouldn't move him, and Isaac is up in the air. But part of the intrigue would be imagine Isaac and Davis defensively, not sure that works too well. Offensively, he turns into a barking contract if he remains healthy. If he doesn't, he's guaranteed basically twenty five million dollars over the next two seasons because he can be partially waived in twenty two twenty three, and then he's fully non guaranteed at the moment. Excuse me, he's partially guaranteed in twenty two twenty three, then fully non guaranteed right now in the latter two years of his deal. If I'm the Lakers and it's Ross Isaac as the basis, I'll give you two first round picks for that, the two distent first round picks. I'm protected. I roll the dice on John E. Isaac. I really would. He is the higher upside than Russ, even if it's faults, just for what he brings defensively, I'd be less inclined to do it, but I look, I would. I'm gonna tell you right now too. If the offer was and the Magic are just okay taking the continuing to sort of not tank, but they're not gonna be. They wouldn't be great next year, even if Ben Carol's fantastic, which I fually expected to be. If they willing to do the full boat the Lakers full boat Isaac faults Ross for two first and at least one swap. Hell, yeah, I'm doing that. If I'm Orlando, I would just consider it. Maybe I'm too low on Faults, but I don't. I think Ross is probably you know it also ran asset at this point didn't have the best shooting year last season. I think on a better team he'd shoot the ball better with more space. Do the Lakers provide that? I don't know, but that's kind of the player You're you're paying for the possibility of Jonathan Isaac in that scenario, but you're also Faults right now is probably the most valuable asset going out in that trade, and he's has a non guaranteed salary partially guaranteed salary in twenty three, twenty four as well. But that's a team that just has the matching contracts to get it together, and you start to run out of options after that, unless we see the King's pivot into more of a rebuild. That's which that's just not going to happen. Ditto for Washington, whatever they're doing there, they don't even have you. You need Christaps Porzingis in that deal. You could get there with Kuzma and Morris and Barton and delan Wright eventually, like when they become trade eligible, but just they're not a team. So yes, I recognize that the Russell Westbrook trade destinations are limited. It's not impossible if the Lakers are actually willing to give up value. Do I think that they should be willing just to give up value to get rid of Russ. No, you need useful. You need a useful player and or players in return. There are teams Utah, San Antonio, Indiana specifically, I think should be open to going that route and shorting the Lakers future by targeting they're distant first picks. And then, of course Brooklyn, if you just want Kyrie off the team, maybe you're trying to figure out a way to get actual players shrim or if you think you're gonna keep Durant, then yeah, it makes sense to maybe roll the dice on Irving and see how things go. But if they're really going to move Durant or if that situation is unsalvageable, should absolutely be trying to target the Lakers distant draft picks. Thank you everyone for listening to this podcast. I hope you enjoyed my thoughts on actual Russell Westbrook. If you didn't check out that video on YouTube and you're listening to this clip of it, on YouTube, go back and look at the full episode until next time. And as always, please remember to subscribe to us hit that subscribe and like button on YouTube. It helps us out a ton, It helps me out a ton. Subscribe to us wherever you get your podcast. It also helps me out a ton, and finally recommend us help us by retweeting our our promos on Twitter or like I said, just just word of mouth. I appreciate it all and it helps out a ton. Until next time. And it's always if you knew around these parts, get used to it. You get the shout out to one the only for only the Lakers could acquire hits to salvage their future. Right keep