What's up everybody? Welcome back to the show. My name is Adam.
I am going to be your host here on Hobby Hotline episode three oh one.
I'm here with Chris from Stale Gum and Brody the Kid. Chris will
start with you. How's your week been going? What's been up to?
Are we frozen? We were frozen there for just a moment. Oh okay,
okay, well hopefully right now. Hopefully it worked there. So okay,
sorry, So Chris, uh for you? How's your weekmen going?
What you been up to be doing? Just fine? I'm about to uh,
tomorrow's my birthday, all right, you can I'm gonna be uh but
uh, you know, other than that, I've I've actually I'm in the
process of transferring most of my my uncle's house in New Jersey, which is
where I kind of kept it when I moved, and I'm kind of rediscovering
all of my old cards from the late nineties and I'll I'll just say I
didn't uh A lot of them have come come out bricked. So uh yeah,
so let's get some uh, let's get some happy birthdays in the chat.
Here for Chris celebrating his twenty first birthday. Can you believe that?
So, yeah, my twenty ninth anniversary of that. Very very excited.
Yes, I will be at the Union game tonight, so nice. Ye.
See if you see Chris or you hit him up on Twitter or whatever,
make sure I wish happy birthday, Brody. Same question to you.
How's your week been going? What you been up to? You're are you
still in high school? Like are you almost done with school and stuff too?
Yeah? I just finished school this week. I'm going into my junior
year, so right at the early birthday at Chris too. I've been watching
college baseball. It's been fun. College World Series. Georgia is in Illinois,
so it's been it's been fun watching college baseball. Nice. Yeah,
Georgia has a player, uh Condon, I think his name is first baseman.
Yeah, he's I'm pretty sure he's playing. So I live on Cape
Cod and there's something called the Cape Cod Baseball League, which is like one
of the main like premier college sport or baseball leagues basically and during the summer,
and he's coming to play for the team that plays in my town.
So I'm pretty excited. Yeah, he's been he's been absolutely on a tear.
So yeah, college baseball one of those times of the year that you
know, it feels like it comes and goes ever every so quickly, and
then same with the you know, litt League World's is probably coming up to
But as we're in this time of the year, this also means that we
have the NBA Finals, and that is the topic we actually are going to
start off today's episode with because now we have the finals are locked between my
Boston Celtics, so I think probably everybody knows who I will be rooting for
in this series and the Dallas Mavericks, So this is gonna be It should
be a pretty exciting series, I think. I don't know. I mean,
I'm not gonna give any predictions necessarily because I'm obviously rooting for the Celtics,
so my prediction would be the Celtics. Chris, I'll start with you
here, what do you think of the finals so far or what do you
think of the finals and how like, how do you think it's going to
or if it will affect Cards really at all. I think, well,
from a hobby perspective, you have what Jason Tatum is the big star for
Boston and with Dallas you have Luca and you have Kyrie Irving, who's kind
of his career has kind of been reborn in Dallas. He's no longer really
a head case anymore, and he's kind of been that good number two guy
for Luca. So I'm kind of excited for this series. I think it's
gonna be I think I will go at least six. I would think even
seven, But I think Boston. I think Boston. And I say this
as a seventy six ers fan, I still can't believe we trade it up
to get Markel Foltz the year, but I think if I have Boston in
seven. So Brody saying with you, what do you think of the finals?
What do you you know, kind of a interesting matchup, probably one
of Boston's toughest matchups. We'll see, but what are your thoughts overall?
I mean, I think from a high perspective, this is good either way,
no matter who wins. Tatum and Luca back to back years drafted,
so I think ali perspective, it's definitely good. I think Celtics and six
or seven, I think they're I think they're better built, but I think
Luca is definitely the best player. But I think Tatum Finals MVPs my prediction,
but yeah, it should be a good series to watch. Yeah.
Now, I think one of the interesting things that's happened within sports cards over
the past few years is, you know, players like Luca and players like
Tatum, their prices seem to already involve MVPs and championships because if you look
at you know, Tatum maybe a little bit differently, but Luca at one
point he was like one of the hottest players in the hobby, and I
would I mean, I would argue that he probably was before uh, you
know, during the twenty twenty twenty twenty one year, stuff was fluctuating,
going up, going down. It was pretty crazy. But I think a
lot of for Luca, championships and MVPs, like I was saying, was
already baked into some of his prices. So, Chris, I'll ask you,
since you, I think you've probably been in the hobby a little bit
longer than I have, back before maybe the twenty because I twenty eighteen is
really when I got back in, So back maybe early twenty tens, what
was really affecting sports card prices? Like if you have a perspective on that,
because, like I said, I don't I've only seen really kind of
the I would call it a reactionary market since I've been in sports card,
So like, was that the same was it the same way before the twenty
twenty twenty twenty one boom that we saw Chris. A lot of that had
to do with performance and perceived future performance. So if you were drafted to
a team that was expected to go on a playoff run or even and in
a finals run, you know, a lot of that value was baked into
it. In the case of Luka Doncic, I think it's important to understand
that during COVID, I mean, this guy basically carried the basketball hobby during
COVID, So I think a lot of I mean, regardless of the results
of this of this series, I think a lot of his value is is
pretty much baked in right now. So yeah, yeah, I don't know.
That's kind of like the weird thing. Like I said, it's just
it seems like the hobby has just agreed that Luca would be At one point,
they were just like, yeah, Luca's gonna win like four or five
championships, and it's like, well that's you know, you look at the
players who have won more than one, it's really a slim list, and
Luca hadn't even this is the farthest. And I don't even know if Luca
had played in the conference finals before this year, like this is this is
a big step up for Luca, Tatum and Brown, are you know they're
they've been here before, They've been in the finals before and they lost.
So I mean, obviously a Celtics fan, I'm rooting for them. But
Brody, I'll ask you this question, do you think that either player or
I mean, I guess you could put Brown in that conversation because he's part
of kind of the modern modern sports card like twenty seventeen for him twenty sixteen,
and then Tatum was twenty seventeen, then Lucas twenty eighteen. Do you
think that any of these players are gonna see a spike in their card prices
because of the finals? I mean, potentially, But I mean, like
we saw Anthony Edwards, his cards were going crazy and he just got to
the conference finals and they lost in five, and his cards were going absolutely
bonkers just because he got to the conference finals and he had a couple of
really good games. So I mean, they could see a potential rise,
but they'd have to have some really good games and like really maybe like go
on to sweep or like win in five or something to see an absolute super
increase, right, And I want to give a shout out to Rex over
at the Sports Card Shop got us up in the big TVs there. Mike
also said he got us up on the all eighty nine TVs at the Costco.
Shout out to Mike for that. I mean, that's obviously being a
little hyperbolic there. Hopefully at least one of the Costco team these hoses up
there, you never really know we're we're making a big time here at the
Costco. Somebody said Luca, Luca definitely gets a bump in value once he
gets a ring. Same thing happened with Giannis. Uh. There's another level
once players get a ring. And I think that's I think that's an that's
an interesting conversation. I think, like the the ring conversation for sports cards.
Does it you know, Chris, I'll ask you this question, does
having a ring matter within sports cards? I think everybody within the media would
say would say one way, But I think within cards, do you think
card values really are tied to winning championships. How many rings does do Mike
Trout and have? That's a great question. Zero I value, right,
I mean it doesn't hurt, right if these guys eventually win a championship.
But you know, if you're recognized as one of the five or ten best
players in the game right now, I mean, that's got to do something
for your card value. So right, yeah, that makes sense. I
also want to ask, so MD sports cards that uh ask Peyton Manning if
rings matter in sports cards? You know, Peyton Manning one of the winning
his quarterbacks in NFL history. Somehow you could still find his cards relatively cheap,
I mean relatively can all things considered within football? Now, So I
got two other questions for you, So Brody, I'll ask you. So
let's just we'll move past the finals a little bit here. Let's just say
in two weeks whatever, whichever team is one, hopefully the Celtics, but
whatever, let's just say two weeks from now. Is there any advice you
have for anybody who's looking to buy any cards right now? Or are you
are you telling people like what's are you telling people to wait potentially till the
offseason? Kind of what's what's maybe your advice for the finals, and then
maybe potentially after the finals as well. I want to buy anybody that's in
the finals. I'd wait until like closer to the season. I mean after
somebody's been to the finals, and especially a team that wins and they've had
a great finals and they just won, especially if it's their first ring.
I mean, don't go and buy an expensive Luca cart after he just won
his first ring. I mean, wait a little bit to his markets cooled
off right totally, and also something to it, something important to remember.
We also have the Olympics coming up and for basketball this summer, which I
think Tatum, I don't know if Brown is on the team, but I
know Tatum's on the team. So we're gonna be seeing more of these players
this offseason than we have previously through other off seasons. I think one of
the cool cards for Lebron actually that I bought a while back was like there
was a Fleer two thousand and four USA card that was really cool. So
maybe we'll see some USA cards potentially coming out this summer. I don't know,
if I guess it would still be Pennini would have that license. Maybe
I don't know, Chris says the US Olympic. So yeah, I mean
I don't know who has that. That is a good question. Anybody in
the chat know, which you know chat the chat may or may not know,
but anybody in the chat know whether whether Tops or Panini's gonna be making
basketball like for the USA cards, because that's gonna be a very interesting set,
I mean, especially with you know, it's probably Lebron's last Olympics,
last last time with team USA potentially as well. I don't know the Olympics
for sure, because the next Olympics obviously for another four years, and then
I don't know what other you know, there was like the FOBA Championship last
summer right at the World Cup, yeah, which I mean some players don't
really take super seriously. So the Olympics, it seems like they're they've really
got the a team out there for the Olympics this year. So and just
remember so, like I said, we have more time with these players,
which look, I hope there's not more injuries, That's what I'll say,
because it seems for these types of players that are playing in the fine,
which I don't, I think it's Kyrie on that team. I don't I'm
not one hundred percent sure, but Luca will probably be playing for whichever country
he played at Slovakias or does anyone know off the top of their head for
Luca. Just look up real quick, because I know that if Yugoslavia was
still a country that I saw a crazy statistic that Luca and Joki will be
playing on the same team. If that was the same uh Sylvania, Yep,
So he'll be playing probably for that team in the NBA Finals. So
I guess we'll move on from this topic. I mean, I want to
give everybody a shout out in the chat as well. Make sure you comment
where SELVENI ye, thank you. Make sure you leave a comment where everybody's
watching the show. I love checking out to see how nationwide we're becoming.
Basically here on Hobby Hotline episode three oh three. Like I said, make
sure you like fallow the stream, all that kind of good stuff if you
want to support the show. Also will be we have a slot on Hobby
Palooza coming up on the twenty sevenecond of June, I believe, so make
sure you're on the lookout for that Hobby pull out tons of tons of fun.
We got something from Philadelphia, we got Oklahoma, very exciting. Uh.
The next topic we're gonna move on to is another hobby superstar that kind
of made his rise throughout the hobby through covid uh, and that is oh
I did stop sharing. Uh. That is going to be Jason Dominguez and
his one of one was pulled and some of you may remember that. Actually
the original story was that someone pulled the one of one at a game,
So I don't know what that pack would have been. I don't know if
that was part of the story. I don't know if any either of you
guys remember what story it was. But he pulled the card at a game
and then it comes back and came back at PSA ten, which is I
mean, pretty impressive. You can tell. You can tell that PSA kind
of does the thing with the the centering, so they I think there's like
sixty forty. I'm pretty sure where they're pretty leanient on the centering. I
don't think I would have given this one to ten based on this centering being
super obvious and based on the I don't know, based on the If PSA
had a nine and a half grade, it would probably get a nine and
a half, right, right, I agree, because the card, the
card does look pretty clean. Uh, it's just that centering that's off.
So you know, Chris, I'll kick to you. What are your kind
of what are your thoughts on the card, thoughts on the story in general?
I mean, I think I think it's right. I think this was
at a Phillies home game early earlier in the year, and I think it
was pulled out of a hangar box. I want to say. So.
The fact that it was pulled at a and this person didn't have like penny
sleeves or a top loader to put it in, right, right, that's
funny. I guess they just throw it back in the box and somehow this
got a PSA ten. I don't if I were at a game and i'd
pull up, I buy a pack of cards, and I pull a valuable
card like this, there's no way it's coming home as a ten. That
to me. The fact that it came back as a ten without, you
know, without any proper cardboard protection, that's the part that amazes me.
Yeah, this is it's almost like a like a curb your enthusiasm skit where
it's like the guys into sports cards, and he pulled this card that I
mean, I don't know how much it'll sell for. I mean it's probably
you know, Dumigas has been hurt, so like he's still is kind of
in that prospecting mode for sure, but like somebody who doesn't if he's with
a group of people, have no idea about anything about sports cards. And
he pulls this card and he's like, I have to go, guys,
I got to get out of here, and they're just like, well why.
It's like I have this thing that's probably worth like ten thousand dollars in
my hand right now. I got to get out of here. Like I
would love to have seen that part of the story and seen like a behind
the scenes footage of like how that guy got out. Like for me,
i'd just be holding in my hand, like don't get near me, don't
touch me, don't get near me. Brody, I I SA same kind
of question to you. What were your kind of initial thoughts when you saw
the ten and just the story itself overall. I mean, I think it's
pretty awesome that they pulled this at a game, because I've seen like it
seems like more cards have been at games recently, I think is awesome.
But I mean the way they were holding this card. I can't believe those
corners didn't have more problems with it because it just seemed like their hands were
kind of over the But it surprised me, to be honest. But I
mean, awesome story. I mean, I always bring sleeves and topplers in
case I find any cards that game, so I'm usually always ready just in
case. But pretty cool story, Pretty awesome, Yeah, definitely. And
then somebody said, h will the will the Domacica is one of one sell
higher than eighty nine Costco TVs and Mike's hot Dog. Yeah, I know,
you mean I guess, well, I guess we'll guess we'll see there.
That's the and a half Costco hot dog that comes with to drink.
Yeah. Probably probably. Yeah. Yeah, So, I mean, I
think cards at game. I almost think that they card stores at games.
I think would be if they're selling cards, they should have top loaders and
stuff. I mean, this is probably a one in a billion chance that
this card was to be pulled at that moment at the game. Again,
I forget who I was listening to. I was listening to someone else's podcast,
and they were saying that, like, oh, no, you know
what it might have been. It might have been Chris Carlin was on Chris
Carlin from PSA was on someone's show. Maybe it might have been the DA
Card DA Show, where he was like, yeah, I'm actually surprised a
lot of cards would just get a PSA ten in general. And this is
something that I've thought for a little bit too. It's like, do the
scaling of PSA tens. I think it should. I think it needs a
change. I don't think they can change it within one year, go retroactively,
but I think maybe next year said or the star of one year.
I do think that need to make a little bit of an adjustment when it
comes to what cards are grading a PSA ten or what cards like how they're
just being graded in general. And so Chris, I'll ask you this,
like, so you know this card gets a PSA ten. Do you think
the PSA ten do you think it's gotten stale? Almost like no pun intended,
but like, do you think it's gotten like to a point where it's
like it's sure you want the PSA ten, but it's like you get you're
expecting to get a PSA ten, which is yeah, I don't think that's
what it should be. I mean, well, first of all, credit
to the card companies for making cards that you know, you know, a
generation ago, you weren't really guaranteed to get mint cards out of a pack.
You probably would get a few off center cards, maybe some wrong backs,
some gum stains and wax stained cards. And it seems like every card
that you get would grade a minimum of A nine or a nine to five
these days. So I think what that said, since so many cards are
coming out of the pack as nine's are better than the allure of a ten
really doesn't have what A ten isn't what it used to be. You know.
Now, as far as PSA may be changing their scale, now you're
getting into the trouble that Beckett did last year when they announced that they were
going to change their scale and have I think it was three different versions of
a ten. You have the regular ten, the black label ten, and
then kind of almost like a nine and three quarters, but we're gonna call
it a ten, I think. If you know, I remember when when
PSA added half grades about a decade and a half ago, I noticed that
they didn't include a nine and a half grade, And I think that that
was for this reason, is that collectors, collectors would prefer in their cards
be a ten then instead of it being a nine and a half, even
if it is a kind of an imperfect ten and should have been a nine
and a half. So so yeah, I mean I think too here.
Like you know, I think there's always a debate I've seen about grading one
of ones and if you should do it, if it's worth it. I
I don't know, I'm not I don't know if I if I fully have
a stance one way or the other. But you know, Brody, I'll
ask you, like, do you think grading one of ones? Do you
think it's something where do you think it's worth it? Because like, if
you get a ten, obviously that's great, But if you get if you
get a nine, you're probably breaking even in terms of what's gonna happen to
the price eight or below, that's where things get a little bit sketchy,
I think, in terms of what could happen to pricing. So do you
think do you think grading one of one's cards like this is worth the risk
of the what could happen the price? If you're looking to sell it.
I mean, if it's a card like this, I think it's probably worth
it just because I mean there's probably somebody that would pay a lot for somebody
like the Mingas. But I mean if it's more of a random one on
one then probably not right. Yeah, Yeah, I think like you said,
I think it's a it really I think goes on case by case basis.
I think some cards should you should probably try and grade them some of
them. I don't know what you would really do. I mean I don't
know, like do you put it in like a some sort you know,
what's the MA the mag case or I don't know exactly what you'd do here.
Now, Chris, I'll ask you this question. With with Jason Dimingez,
for example, I think he's had an interesting and interesting ride throughout the
hobby here because he was the guy during COVID that everyone wanted coming out of
Bowmen. They basically created a new product for him, like with the with
the first the Bowman first, but then it was like the first edition Bowman
that came out that was the first year that they had done that, or
at least first year in a while. And then you know, he makes
his debut last year in the majors. He plays pretty well, but then
he has to get Tommy John surgery and he's gonna be out for a while.
And now, I mean, luckily for him, he's not a pitcher,
so he his recovery is probably a little bit shorter. So he hasn't
made his debut yet. Now. If so, I'm gonna ask you this
question, Chris, do you have advice for anybody who is holding Domingos and
looking to sell. Is it like a now time to sell? Or would
you wait until he makes his debut again? Or do you think like because
he already made his debut, the juice that you would get from that moment
in his career has already gone. This guy, to me has serious Ruben
Rivera vibes. Do y'all remember Ruben Rivera. He was a big Yankee prospect
about twenty five thirty years ago, canned out, he kinda He's best known
for trying to steal Derek Jeter's glove from the locker room. But yeah,
I remember his first bowman's were like twenty dollars bills right out of the pack.
And keep in mind this was nineteen ninety four, where they didn't have
inserts or anything. So I would say, if you have this card,
sell it, get what you can for it, because I think the market
on this and again I mean, who knows with prospects anymore, what what
you're going to get from these guys, right, I would say, sell
while you can and cash out, right, Yeah, I think I think
that makes sense. And I would say, you know, I always think
that the buying and selling of prospects is what you should do to get the
cards that you don't want to sell. I think there are tons of different
ways to get those funds in my opinion. You know, whether whatever you're
however you're trying to sell. But I think the prospecting, the long term
holding of prospecting, I think has really run its course within the hobby.
Like I think, again, I keep referencing COVID times, but like twenty
eighteen, twenty nineteen, twenty twenty, I think people were much more looking
into long term prospecting, which may or may not have been the right move
potentially. So Proty, I'll see you this question. We're going to move
on to a topic that's very similar to this one actually, but obviously a
little bit different. So proty. I'll ask you, like if you are
you know, when you're buying and selling cards, like are you, like
how how much are you prospecting and looking into like the short term hold or
are you mainly buying cards for the long term or do you really just kind
of buy cards and you really don't buy and sell. I mean, I'm
interested in what your kind of strategy is there. I buy some cards,
but it's mainly PC stuff, And if I'm buying anything that's more expensive,
it's really guys that I know have done stuff like Ohtani, like I know
Tani looks like a superstar, or Trout like he was at least a superstar,
at least at the time, Like a couple of years ago, we
know Trout was a superstar. Maybe now he might you know, he might
never except as he might not play much longer. But or guys in the
NBA like Tatum kind of he's a superstar. I mean trading. When I'm
trading, I'm looking for guys like Otani, guys for my PC. If
I'm prospecting, it's White Sox, it's guys for my PC. I'm not
going out of my way for random prospects. Like to mean, it's just
not what I do, right, Yeah, I'm kind of similar. I
mean I wish I could, you know, the buying and selling of prospects
seems like a lot of fun, but I'm just I don't have the time
really to spend diving into all the data, especially when I mean, for
me, this isn't a full time business. So like for people who for
full time business people within the hobby, it's probably something that they have to
do this type of prospecting for the buying and selling. But yeah, so
the the next topic, like I said, is very similar to this one,
not exactly the same, but something that I've seen floating around on Twitter
is apparently some people have noticed this. I've noticed it, but I've kind
of noticed it. Once other people started talking about it, was Tops in
their marketing has started to really push I guess you could maybe call it a
narrative, maybe not, but they've started to push sort of the retail cards
that people are pulling these crazy cards out of retail. And I'm wondering,
you know, Chris, I'll start with you, is this something that you've
seen or is this something that you think is just you know, it's it's
maybe just a coincidence that Tops is doing this. They're not really trying to
push any type of narrative necessarily. It's just something that's happening, and Tops
is kind of talking about it more and the fact that now that we're seeing
it, it's more of like when you buy a car and you see everyone
else has the same car as you. Do you think it's more like that
or do you think Tops is actually doing something here with their marketing, trying
to push retail stuff. Have you seen the price of hobby blacks lately?
I mean, how much is a hobby box? Not the jumbo box,
but just the regular hobby box of Bowman Baseball this year it's like two seventy
five three hundred. Why would you pay for three hundred dollars for that when
you can get three or four blaster boxes at what twenty five thirty dollars and
basically get the same amount of cards. It's just to me, it's just
a better deal to buy retail. And you're still and you know you're probably
not. You're gonna miss out on some of the hobby exclusive stuff like the
orange Wave, Fusia die Cut nuclear refractor number to one twenty five or whatever.
Right, yeah, yeah, right, right, yeah, yeah,
who cares, It's just another parallel. I mean, if you're just interested
in you know, building your set, building your inserts, and you know,
if you hit on an autograph or a low number fractor, which you
can still get in retail, hey, that's that's a great deal. And
it also would not surprise me though, with Tops pushing retail that you know,
they themselves are one of the big retailers fanatics, so probably that going
on too, so right right yeah, And and Prety kind of the same
question to you do you where do you stand on well, not stand,
I don't know you have you don't have to make a stand, but what
do you what do you think in general of like just maybe Tops is trying
to push retail versus hobby. I suppose, I mean, I mean,
I, like you said, like Chris said, for hobbies really expensive,
I mean, especially products like Bowlman and Tops Kerlman Tops Chrome Platinum is like
one hundred and forty bucks. They think it's some places, so I could
we could give it a blaster for thirty thirty five bucks. I mean,
I got a blaster of Tops Chrome Platinum and I got two number cards.
It was a fun rep. I enjoyed it. So, I mean I
like retail. I mean a blaster is basically what one third of a hobby
box. So if you buy three blasters at what thirty dollars each, that's
ninety dollars and you're getting basically the same cards as a one hundred and forty
dollars hobby box. Right, yeah, well you're missing out. You're missing
out on whatever the whatever the guaranteed stuff that's coming out of the hobby boxes
are. But I mean nowadays it's like on Panine, and this is tops
versus Panini, but like in Panini stuff, you know they're doing you know,
their big thing is that they're on average, Like they they're saying on
average, there's on average there's two autographs per box, and people are seeing
that they're really you're getting some people are getting one, some people are getting
done. It's like the I don't know, the marketing around hobby boxes and
the guaranteed stuff you get out of hobby boxes. I don't know if I
love it. You know, I think that if you're going to be trying
to sell hobby it should have a guarantee that you're gonna get autographs, like
there has to be sort of a sort of an incentive, and I think
that's maybe that's what I think the big difference is that hobby used to be,
like you know, it used to be fairly reasonably reasonably priced. Like
I mean, I remember buying a Series two and this is way back in
twenty eighteen or twenty nineteen whatever. The Fernando Tatist Junior first uh first tops
card was I think it was Series two and twenty nineteen, I'm pretty sure,
and it was like it was like a sixty or seventy dollars box that
I bought. Nowadays you're looking at blasters and they're like eighty ninety one hundred
dollars for Series one, Series two. It's like that's there's just not the
incentive of it isn't worth it, unfortunately. And I think you know,
breakers in general, they're the ones sort of that you know, potentially maybe
driving up some of these prices for hobby boxes. And like you said,
you could go and find three blasters of some product at you know, Walmart,
Target wherever you're going and get almost the same amount of cards. Like
I'm sure you're missing out on certain guaranteed things you get in hobby boxes,
but just in general, like I don't even you know, I don't even
know if the incentive to get an autograph out of hobby boxes nowadays is really
even worth it, because like you look at the number of just non rookie
autographs that they're putting in there, and the fact that like I don't remember
which prospect it was, but it was some prospect that posted like a stack
of like ten thousand cards that he was signing, and it's like there's that
many cards from one autographs from one player. It really is. It really
is pretty insane, you know, and no not to you know, this
is a one of one autograph, but you know how many people are nowadays
at least Like I obviously know mov On, but it's like, you know,
Brody, maybe do you Brody for I'll ask you, do you even
know Movon? Like do you know are you aware of mova On? Really?
Like cause he's sort of an older player, So it's like I'm wondering,
do you think at what point do they need to be careful with what
older players they're putting in these Like so I makes my question he is like,
do you know mov On, Like, is this a player that we
would be interested in? Uh to pull one of his autographs? I mean,
I know who Mavon is, but I guess like if I pull his
base autograph, I wouldn't be like jumping out of my chair. I mean,
if I pull a Factor, I'd be pretty excited. I think think
super Fractor is pretty cool, but I would to be like jumping out of
my chair necessarily. Oh hey, mov On autograph. But I mean it's
still pretty cool, right right? Uh? And then Rex had some had
some good comments here. So both both Tops and Panini are now selling blasters
in megas directly uh to hobby Hobby Direct, Hobby account, Hobby shop sorry.
Uh. And then in Penini cases they are Hobby exclusive blasters and megas.
So you know, I don't know, Chris. I'll ask you this
question, and I think it's it's kind of a it's it's it's sort of
vague in a way. It's like, do you think that there should be
hobby in retail? Do you think that there should be a difference between the
two products. I understand why there is, but like, do you even
think that should be a do you think it should be that way? Like
do you think that everything should all be together? And then you just have
smaller, different size boxes and then everything is there's no difference between hobby and
retail. It's just the box size and the number of cards again in the
box is different, but there's no difference between from wherever you're buying it,
I suppose. Because also just real quick, sorry, because like now your
people can buy retail at hobby shops, so it's like, what's what's even
the difference? It's like, you know, that's so do you think that
that is? Do you think do you think they should do it? Do
you think that they should make the merge or do you think that they should
leave it how they have it? Well, the reason why we have separate
retail and separate hobby is that, you know, a lot of these mass
market retail outlets like Walmart and Target, they have so much buying power that
they can basically impose on the hobby that you know, if you want our
cards in our store, we want something that you can't get anywhere else.
And you know, for years decades, really products have had retail only inserts
and hobby only inserts as well, So I have no problem with that.
But if the retail slash hobby only insert is just just another parallel, you
know, like the orange Wave Fusia Nuke die cut refractor numbered seventy five or
whatever, is that really worth? Is it really special for that specific product
type? You know, for me, it's not. I mean, and
and by the way, one other thing, mo Vaughn was a pretty good
player, but he needs to give his MVP Award in ninety five to Albert
Belt because he had a better Yeah. Yeah, obviously as a Red Sox
guy, I maybe disagree any MVP any any awards keep keeping coming. As
a fiftys in one season, nobody's ever done that before or since. Belle
should have won that year, So sorry, Yeah, I mean, the
one thing I remember about mo vaugh is he had this like crazy should I
hit my money? He had this like crazy like thing that he did with
his bat. I mean that was cool, obviously. I mean, again
as red Talk saying, I maybe I'm a little bit biased here, but
Brody, so I'll ask you the same question, which actually kind of stems
from Rex here talking about some of the the mass market stuff being available in
hobby shops is a good news, is a good move because it gives uh,
it allows people to buy stuff at a cheaper price point. So at
what point, you know, like because I think that's sort of the point
here, It's like, at what point is like when you're buying retail versus
hobby should there not even be a difference, because like if you can if
if hobby shops are selling retail boss excuse me, retail boxes, you know,
what's what's really the point? So I mean, for you, do
you think that there should be a difference or do you think what they what
they're doing now is fine? And even even the hobby shops, you know,
hobby shops buying retail blasters is also you know, part just part of
part of the ecosystem, I suppose. I mean, I think it's fine
because I think, well, like Rex said, I mean, I think
it's good for the market because they can sell it, like they could sell
blasters to kids, and then like the people that want to chase after the
case that can buy hobby and jumbo and whatever, you know, I mean,
I don't know, I mean, the hobby and jumbos are just so
expensive it's hard to really deep dive. But it's like Chris, like,
if you want the oranges and whatever else is in the hobby, I mean,
go by a hobby. But if you just want to collect the sets
and have a chance at the autos and stuff like that, buy retail.
Or if you're a kid who don't have that much money, buy retail as
well. And now, Adam, I'm gonna make you a little jealous here
because of my blaster bucks. I pulled this nice Brian Bayo gold auto.
Oh nice baby Pedro. Yeah he's been I mean of I don't I don't
want to get started on the Red Sox and how much they pissed me off
just because they you know, they they they're they're pretty good at the getting
prospects through the system, but like they've really basically I'm not actually not even
gonna get into it because I'll just ran for the rest of the show about
how the Red Sox pissed me off. But yeah, Bejo, I really
I do like him. Like I said, good prospects. Maybe the rest
of the team they kind of are just the ownership mailing it in a little
bit when it comes to trying to get trying to get some of these players
with about fifteen and forty three. You know what I'm saying, right,
that could? That could? That is true. Also, let's see if
we got any stuff in the chat here, we got people talking about we
got people talking about Mova. If Movaon walked into my bedroom, I'd put
oh Jesus, I should preread some of these before I put them up on
the screen. Are you jumping out of your chair, big dude? Yeah?
Mova is he was massive. Let's see. Yeah, exciting. I
mean, my thoughts on it, I think that I agree with both what
both of you guys said. It's like, you should have a cheap,
a cheaper option for people to get these cards where they don't have to spend
you know, you're not shilling out two hundred dollars because realistically, like two
hundred dollars, like the amount of cards you could if you were to buy
singles with two hundred dollars, which I know that people are probably sick of
hearing that type of advice. It's like, yeah, obviously you're buying singles,
you're getting the card exactly what you want, but you know, two
hundred dollars, three hundred dollars for a blaster box, or I mean,
not a blaster a hobby box is out of the as out of the price
range for a lot of people. And I do wonder, I wonder what
percentage, which I would imagine it's probably pretty high of breakers are actually the
ones buying a lot of these boxes versus just normal people, not breakers at
all. Like i'd imagine, it's probably skewed in the breaker direction, which
could be causing some of the pricing. I would say, But you know,
I don't know, it's it's it's that's all speculation. There's no hard
data that I really have there that can I can point to, I suppose.
But so we're actually going to move on to our it'll probably be the
last topic. It might be the last topic. We might have one after
this. But an interesting article that has been kind of or an interesting piece
of news. It's kind kind of been floating around a lot of I guess
what you could call mainstream sports media. So Perfect Game and Fanatics signed a
partnership, but the partnership may not be very good. And Chris, you
were explaining this to me before the show, and I think you have a
pretty good rundown on what exactly is happening here. So I'll let you have
the floor and just kind of give us a give us a give us a
little bit of a spark noted version of what exactly is going on here.
Okay, So Perfect Game, I think for people that have collected Bowman cards
over the last ten, fifteen, twenty years of have come across this Perfect
Game outfit, and they're they're a scouting service, and what they do is
that if you're a sixteen, seventeen, eighteen year old kid who aspires to
play baseball at the next level, either to get drafted or to get a
college scholarship, Perfect Game brings together these players for a nominal fee, and
they organize these all star games and showcases for major league scouts and college coaches.
And they're probably best known for their All Star game that they have at
the end of the year where they invite I think it's fifty or sixty of
the best players. It used to be called the AFLAC Game, and now
it's sponsored by somebody else. And while I think in the late two thousands
and early twenty tens, Tops actually made a card set for the AFLAC Game
and had the players sign their cards and then when they finally signed a pro
contract, they would put these cards in the Bowman packs. I think about
a decade ago, Leif took over the Perfect Game license, but Tops has
been pretty much doing the same thing with something called the under Armor Game,
which is from a competing service called what are they called and Baseball Factory.
Same thing. Okay, So what this deal does now is that it brings
back those rights, the Perfect Game rights, into the Fanatics Tops Bowman family.
Now, what Perfect Game has been doing over the last couple of years
is that they've hidden a little clause into their player release that basically forces these
kids to sign away their NIL rights to Perfect Game. And it's in perpetuity
and as a condition for participating in some of these more high profile all star
games that Perfect Game throws has been throwing, they have the players sign like
hundreds of items like baseballs, photographs, cards, and stickers. Now,
what this agreement does with Fanatics is now, because Perfect Game owns your rights,
your NIL rights, they can now go to to Fanatics. So let's
say you were sixteen, seventeen years old and you signed up with Perfect Game.
You wound up getting your college scholarship, and now you excel in college
baseball so much so that you're projected to be a high round draft pick.
Because you've signed away your nil rights to Perfect Game, Perfect Game can now
is now going to turn around and sell those rights to Fanatics, who can
now produce a Bowman You branded card of you without you being compensated for.
And because you signed hundreds, thousands, tens of thousands of autograph stickers while
you were in Perfect Game, Perfect Game can now transfer those to Fanatics,
so that now your first Bowman Chrome autograph card could be in a Bowman You
product with a sticker autograph on it, and you would not be compensated for
it. I think this deal stinks to high heaven, and I think a
lot of it's exploitative. It could be illegal, and a lot of big
time agents like the Scott Borises of the world, are advising high school players
not to sign with Perfect Game because of this. Yeah, I mean it
really there's two kind of my two thoughts here. It seems almost like the
opposite of other stuff that Fanatics has tried to do, like signing play and
trying to give them a bit more equity when it comes to what they're paying
players. It seems like Fanatics has done a pretty good job at trying to
get players more involved in the industry, and I'm I mean, I'm hoping
that means that they're paying the players a little bit more because you know,
I think the marketing that's done around a lot of sports card products is very
autograph heavy. So like if a player is, you know, signing however
many autographs, I don't know if I mean, in my opinion, I
think they probably should be getting a little bit more money for all the autographs
that they're signing. And this is just doing basically the opposite. This is
like we're we're gonna get you, We're gonna try and get you, but
we're get you as one of our athletes, but like you're not gonna which
I feel like that has there has to be something here that's missing where it's
like Fanatics is gonna come out and say that there's a second part of this
deal where I don't know, if they make it, they get a different
type of nil deal. I don't know exactly. And the other thing is
that I think this is also a something that we've seen recently, like Panini
did this with a couple of different like high school athletes where they sign them,
like one of the top recruited quarterbacks that is it hasn't even said that
he's signing anywhere with with a college team. He's they they sign him.
So they're almost trying to, I don't know, maybe one up each other
in terms of who who can sign the players the earliest to their contracts.
Yeah, because I think nowadays we're seeing players be much more much more financially
savvy around some of these autograph deals that they're signing. And this this,
like you said, doesn't seem like something that doesn't seem like something that makes
a lot of sense for the industry. You know, Brody as somebody who
is a little bit you know, younger in high school. Is this something
that you know? Do you know anybody that is playing in these types of
games or is going to any of these types of showcases? Like is this
something that you know for you like, is this something that you know of
people that are like that They're like, no, I'm not gonna do this
or what are kind of your overall thoughts on the deal? I guess I
mean as a travel baseball player, a lot of people's goals eventually are to
get the Perfect Game showcases, because it is a big deal to be at
a Perfect Game showcase down the road to try to get to play college baseball,
but zero compensation. Like no, you can't do that, like Enuff
said, right, yeah, yeah, And I mean I think too.
It's like the Perfect the showcase of the Perfect Game is a way for players
to get scouted and stuff. So it's like if you are if you're now
financially, if you're adding financial implications to a player getting getting into the showcase,
I don't know if that's the move, Like I don't. I don't
think that's a good idea because you're affecting and I understand it's a business move.
It's a money move. You got sometimes you got to make moves that
are maybe a little bit harder than others. But it's like, you know,
if you like, perfect Game has always been one of these, like
if you look at a lot of players that are in the MLB, like
they played in these Perfect Game showcases before they went to college or before they
played in the MLB. But it really is a way that players are going
to get their name out there and important, which I mean I think just
in general baseball, it's like such a such a convoluted system and it's so
hard to get to the pros that this is just you're adding a step that's
making it more complicated and making it so that players will have less of an
opportunity to play in something like this. So yeah, Chris, I mean,
is this something that you think they're going to revert or what do you
think the aftermath of this kind of this deal is going to be? Essentially
First of all, I think that this does eventually get thrown out by the
courts. I mean, this reeks of exploitation. But the thing is is
that you know, sixteen seventeen year old kids can't legally sign these contracts.
It's the parents that do. And some parents, you know, they're thrilled
their kid's going to be on a baseball card, and then they don't understand
that, yeah, they're going to be on a baseball card, but they
could also be on a baseball card and be compensated for their name, image
and likeness too. But yeah, I think this is this is a way
for fanatics to I think save some money too, because when when these guys
get drafted, right and let's say you're trying to assemble a Bowman draft autograph
checklist. You know, other than other than you're signing bonus, you're still
not getting paid a whole lot of money as a minor league baseball player.
So signing maybe like five thousand autographs for tops, you know, that's a
quick way to make ten, fifteen, twenty thousand dollars. Well, now,
if fanatics already has your autograph on these stickers that you signed five,
six, seven years ago when you were in a perfect game showcase, that
that's that's another that's another source of income that you're not going to get as
a player. So right, Yeah, the ramifications of this, especially in
this new era of M and I L it's a it's a brave new world
that we're just beginning to understand hobbywise. So right, yeah, And I
mean I think I think, like I was saying before, like players in
the leagues now that are signing any type of autograph deals, they're definitely signing
higher deals than they were before. So I mean, if your fanatics,
I guess it's you know, unfortunately, it's a pretty ruthless move. I
mean, to fanatics has been pretty much on record, not on record,
but all the moves that they've made have been like business oriented. They're gonna
make money somehow, like they're gonna figure it out. So getting these players
in the door as early as possible, you know, they may not especially
if you're like you're saying like they're the agents for these players might just be
their parents, like they may just they might just not even realize that they're
They might even not realize what they're signing because down the road, these players,
if they're good enough to play in this you know, granted, I'm
sure it's not a high, super high percent super high percentage of these players
that are kind of going on, but it's like all they need is one
player, Like really, for a fanatics, all they need is for one
player in all of it to really sign this type of contract and then get
to some sort of place in their career where they would be in Bowman and
then they don't have to sign them. Like if they're popular, if they're
good enough, and if they play well enough that they could be in Bowman,
their autographs are probably going to be pretty expensive. At that point,
they probably have some sort of actual real agent. Not because I think I
was reading in one of these articles, they said that because of their ages,
technically they can't have agents. They can have agents advising them, but
they can't technically have the agents themselves. So yeah, I don't know,
I mean, I I don't I can see why they're doing it, I
don't necessarily love it. So you know, Brody, I'll kick it to
you for one last kind of conversation piece and then we'll wrap up. We're
getting close to the top of the hour here, you know, for fanatics
and Panini too, do you think do you think it's really a good idea
for them to be signing these players at such a young age to any of
these like exclusive contracts or do you think like there has to be something that's
someone that steps in And I know that there's no real entity that's kind of
controlling the sports card industry, but like that says like they have to be
X age before they can sign any type of deal with fanatics, Like do
you think that has to happen or because like I mean, from your perspective,
since you're since you're you know, younger and you're in high school,
like, do you think that there should be an age of where they have
to wait to get these NIL deals or it's like you know, it's a
free for all, you can do whatever you want. I mean, like
you said, I see why they're doing it. They want to try to
get exclusives with these players as soon as possible. But I mean it would
be nice if it's like as once you're drafted or once you sign, But
I just don't think it can happen. I mean, Fanatics is a huge
company. I mean, there's nothing stopping them for doing as of now,
right, Yeah, I think because I think that's we're still sort of in
the early early stages of NIL and I don't think that we've really seen I
think we've seen controversies and issues and like now, I mean even you know,
we're we're there's a huge change within the NCAA that they're going to be
allowed to pay players. So I mean this is we're really seeing a huge
shift in not even just in sports business, and not even just in sports
cards, but just well yeah, sports business. Sorry, that's what I
meant to say. We're not just in sports cards, but in sports business
in general. The whole landscape is really shaped, is really shifting because of
you know, now the NCAA after hundreds and hundreds of years, they're allowing
teams to pay players, which I think, you know, they should have
probably been looking at this. I think this was a this was bound to
happen eventually, especially once the nil deals came around and then the transfer port
on all these types of things. I think the players should be looking out
for the players because the NCAA has been it's very clear that the NCAAA doesn't
really care or doesn't really look out for the players in general. So the
fact that they're gonna be paying these players now, I think that's definitely.
I think it's a good thing, and I think it will depend on you
know, I think the NCAA has maybe some shady business stuff going on,
so we'll see how it ends up panning out. But overall, I think
it is it's a good thing for the players. We'll see if it ends
up being a good thing for the NCAA and the leagues in general. But
that is That's pretty much all we got for today's show. I want to
I'll throw it around the horn one more time. We'll get your last thoughts,
Chris, last thoughts for today's show. Got anything promote anything? Going
on, like, what do you what do you want to say to the
audience before we head out here? Uh? Dortmund versus Real Madrid, that's
yep in the Champions League Final, and also Columbus Crew versus Patucca tonight in
the Conker CAF Champions League Final. I'm rooting for Columbus bring it home for
MLS. Other than that, I got nothing else going on. Check out
Baseball card Pedia, check out Hobby News Daily, and check out Steal them
on whatever Elon's calling it this week. Yeah, Brodie, same question.
What you got going on? Let let the audience know we're watching Illinois.
Kentucky's hailed Mary Kentucky's a number two ranked team, and I started Travel baseball.
So this might be my last episode for a while. So we'll see
if I can hop on soon. But we'll see, might have a week
on. Yeah, soon, we'll we'll have to do something. We'll have
to sign you to, like an nil contract or something get you get you,
like a get you a hobby hotline nil contract. Yeah, And I
want to say I want to say thank you to everybody that left comments in
the chat. We had a big time chat day to day. I saw
a lot of comments in there. Really appreciate that. Shout out to everybody
watching, depending no matter where you are, unless you're a Dallas Mavericks fan.
For the next couple of weeks, I'll be pretty furiously rooting for the
Celtics. Maybe we'll see how long that series goes. But my message always
going into these going into the end of the show here is just you know
there's gonna be questions people have. Just be kind to people coming into the
hobby. We are still sort of seeing people come in, come in and
out of the hobby. My message as always, these people are new,
they were in a position that we were in at one point. So if
they have questions, be nice, answer the questions for him. Help them
out because you never know one day they might be in the same boat as
you where they're helping somebody out because you help them out. Do all of
these things. Everybody, thank you all for listening or watching or any any
all that kind of stuff, and we will see everybody in the next episode.
All right, bro,