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Then remember them many m I know
what the hell is going on? Yes,

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thank you chat for reminding me how
late we are. That's okay,

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this is a show worth waiting for. It's mixed bag panel. Uh,

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it's number what what number are we
at? We're at number five? You

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guys, it's already number five.
I can't believe it. It's going great.

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So we have some some guests tonight, some exciting guests. I'll bring

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the first one up. He'll introduce
himself where he can find him some of

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his background and whatnot. Welcome to
the stage, Austin Peterson. Hey,

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thanks for having me. Jim Bobbinson
honor appreciate. It's good to see you

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again. Yeah, people call me
AP for Liberty. You can find me

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on everywhere Instagram, Facebook, and
Twitter, but probably the best place to

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catch me is on my Wake Up
America show. So if you've got a

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Rumble dot com slash AP for Liberty, I've got a five day a week

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morning talk show. It's a great
way to start your day, stay informed

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about what's happening in the world,
and yeah, keep up to date with

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everything in the world of Liberty.
So thank you, awesome, thanks for

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being here. And Jay let the
audience know. Yeah, Jay Dyer,

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I cover everything from geopolitics to movies, film symbolism, esoterica, religious debates,

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open panel madness, fairal wine,
moms with Virginia slims in their mouth

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calling in to argue and wrap battle
with me. Literally. We also do

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the I also do the fourth hour
of the Ox Jonesho every Friday. Uh

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and yeah, that's got a few
books. You can find me over at

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jays Analysis or on YouTube or j
Dyer or on Twitter as well and Instagram.

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Awesome. All right, well thanks
for being here. Jay. One

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of the first things Austin said is
I said, oh, we have other

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panelists like Jay, And he said, we're gonna talk about God, are

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we? I said, no,
it's come it could it could come up.

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But this is a more relaxed,
uh sort of fun. We don't

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We try to stay a little bit
away from like the meta and the philosophy

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because it you know, we like
it, but it could bore some people.

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But we do want to get into
some technology. And I actually wanted

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to start with this as Jay has
been covering, you know, smart cities

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and these concepts for many years now, and now people are starting to really

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hone in on on on what it
is. Someone like Patrick Wood I think

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his name is wrote these great books
where he outlines all of the companies why

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they're positioning themselves the way they are. Uh, And from my view it

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kind of looks like this. If
you're a big company and you could mass

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produce and be the you know,
the explicit provider of all products and services,

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well the next step would be take
ownership in this over the city,

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right and takes some sort of stake
in the city, kind of like black

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Rock seems to be doing. And
this is an interesting topic because it seems

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that technology companies, along with products
and service companies are looking at cities now

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as platforms. Now, that sounds
wacky, right, we go, what's

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a platform? Oh, it's the
thing on my phone I use. Are

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you on that platform? Well,
platforms come with tos and they come with

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community guidelines and all these things.
So what if a city was owned by

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a company and the company had tos
and community guidelines that in a way maybe

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replaced you know, your bill of
rights, your basically everything we know about

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how to behave in society. I
think that's the plan I might be.

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It might be hyperbolic. I don't
think so, but I did want to

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get your take, Austin is I'm
gonna let you actually let Jay give a

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summary of that. See if I
missed anything. But I did want to

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take your position, Austin, because
as a libertarian, I wonder I wanted

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to know from you how you see
that progressing and if there's any red flags

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that might come up from the view
the principal view of libertarianism, because it

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seems like if a company can take
over a city, a company can take

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over larger than a city, and
if they buy it, you know,

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in a way it's fair game.
Right, So Jay, give a quick

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summary of smart cities and what you
think, and then I'll let Austin tackle

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that hard question. Yeah, it's
interesting that you mentioned this idea of cities

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as platforms. I remember watching Metallic, the co creator of Ethereum not too

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long ago, talk about the possibility
of creating cities as platforms, and they're

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marketing, at least in the crypto
side, and maybe even Trump has given

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a nod at times to the idea
of freedom cities. I don't know exactly

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know what that means, but the
idea is that well, there will be

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smart cities. It's unavoidable. So
maybe we can have like a libertarian smart

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city where it's where it's freedom oriented
versus I don't know, you know,

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Google and Bill Gates's smart city,
which will not be freedom oriented. It

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will be you know, oriented towards
I'm sure you know, carbon credits,

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controlling your movements, rationing meet all
the things that we would expect the dystopian

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smart city to be. I think
the idea comes out of the technocratic movement

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in the nineteen twenties thirties forties,
which was kind of a weird fringe version

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of socialism at the time, and
it kind of got resurrected when Brazinski wrote

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Between Two Ages. There was always
technocrats. There's always people in different power

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strata or strata the power structure that
believed in technocracy and thought they could have

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these these you know, plastic computer
AI cities of the future. But I

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think Brazenski really breed new life into
it with Between Two Ages and ended up

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being something that the rock Filler sought
was a great idea. They put a

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lot of money behind it, promoting
it, and it really became you know,

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US policy officially throughout the Cold War
and then the corporation Silicon Valley,

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really Silicon Valley I view as a
bunch of kind of private, private,

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corporate partnerships that also adopted this model
under a veneer of libertarianism. So that's

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the danger I think is that it'll
be sold as convenience security utopia, and

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even the ones that are billed as
kind of libertarian I would be very suspicious

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of. Yeah, before you answer
to this, Austin, welcome to the

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stage, Chad. Thanks for sorting
that out. Why don't you introduce yourself

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to the audience. Let us know
where you can find you and what you're

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all about. Yeah, can everybody
hear me? Okay, yes, sir,

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okay, good. Sorry, I
was having internet complications at the most

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convenient time. So yeah, my
name is Chad O. Jackson. I

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am an independent researcher and business owner
here in Dallas, Texas. I'm also

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a film producer or co producer,
I should say. I can be found

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on YouTube at Chad oh Jackson,
as well as Instagram at Chadow Jackson and

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x at Chadow Jackson. So awesome. Yeah, good, and so I'm

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I'm sorry. Yeah, sorry,
dans reupt good. You're not a what

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I'm not a Republican, I'm not
a Democrat. I'm I'm politically interested.

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But I don't believe that any of
the political parties or anything like that have

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the answer to our problems. I
believe that most of the problems that we

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have can be handled at the individual
or ground level. So that's my take

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on politics, or that's the approach
that I take on politics. So got

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it all? Right? Well,
thank you for that, Austin. Now

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you see the challenge of this question
and right, the smart city complex,

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as Jay and I laid it out
in our various ways. You know,

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bigger companies owning more of everything and
having a natural or unnatural monopoly on it.

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You decide. But the thing is
what occurs now, Like, what's

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your take from a libertarian position?
What are some of the advantages you see?

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But are there some things that you're
going Well, maybe I don't know,

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maybe there's something off here about about
companies taking over like this. I

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mean, nots so much. I
do like what I'm hearing from Chad and

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Jay, and I definitely think that
there's a little there's a little Chad and

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a little Jay inside of me.
Right so maybe they're the angels on my

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shoulder, But how can corporations possibly
screw things up more than the government already

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has? I mean, how can
you not be excited about a little bit

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of an experiment with anarcho capitalism.
How can you not look at what Javier

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Mala is doing in Argentina and not
be like Ron Swanson slash slash slash it

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and have an opportunity for Samsung,
who builds these beautiful cell phones that I

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love, my Galaxy Samsung S twenty
one Ultra. You know, there's a

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little community outside of Soul speaking in
South Korea where our phones are manufactured.

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This is a really fascinating case of
what you guys are talking about. It's

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a modern private city called song Dough, built from scratch fifteen hundred acres of

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reclaim land. It's a smart city
known for its advanced technology, eco friendly

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design, high quality infrastructure, developed
by gael International and the Incheon Metropolitan City

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song Dough. It's a new model
of urban development focusing on sustainability, technology

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and the quality of life. Do
you think that they could do worse than

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they're going to do worse than San
Francisco? Do you think the people in

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South Korea, the corporations that build
these are going to let their private property

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turn into what are our major cities
are turning into here in the United States.

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You know, there is no utopia, right, There's not gonna be

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a perfect city or or there's there's
some cities that are better than others.

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There are some cities that are doing
better than others. But the you know,

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there is no such thing as a
fully private city, and there's no

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such thing as a fully government city. Every city and every country has aspects

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of both market and then government control. U the only few times that there've

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ever been like real true experiments to
try and set up privatized communities, most

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of the time it's failed miserably,
but that's because they got chased out either

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by local tribes or governments come in
and prevent them from setting them up.

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So, you know, let people
experiment a little bit, you know,

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let these cities, Let these cities
come to fruition, let people try and

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live there. You know, Epcot, remember Epcot, The whole experiment of

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Epcot was supposed to be this new
city of the future. It didn't really

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work out well. This new world
is not bad, but Epcot didn't become

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that perfect, shining example of a
private city that everybody wanted to live at.

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Turns out people don't really actually enjoy
living in those types of community communities,

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but they should have the choice to
do it, and a corporation certainly

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isn't going to do any worse than
Gavin Newsom of California and whoever the mayor

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of San Francisco is at this point. I mean, I think those are

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good arguments. What do you,
gentlemen think. I'll let either of the

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two on the bottom respond to that. Good Well, go ahead, Chad.

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I think I follow what's going on
here, although I was a little

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late to the show. When it
comes to smart cities, that's what we're

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talking about, right, smart cities. I do think that when you look

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at technological advances over the course of
the last fifty years, it makes me

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wonder how will we advance quote unquote
technologically over the next fifty years. So

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I think smart cities are to some
extent and inevitable. I am totally against

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the federalization of such cities or taxpayer
dollars going to such cities on a state

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or federal level. When it comes
to the local level. However, if

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some random city in the middle of
you know, Washington or where have you

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wish to utilize whatever local tax dollars
to build this thing as a kind of

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experiment, I mean, you know, go ahead, But there is a

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lot of issues that come up as
a result of these things, namely intrusive

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surveillance and other such issues. So
I think people should think twice. I

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mean, I know, for me, in the city that I live here

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in Texas, we're pretty much like
minded in so far that if some politician

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come out of nowhere who's wet behind
the ears and have these big visions and

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ideas about how to change the city
and how to make us more towards friendly,

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this person is typically laughed at a
court because we tend to be people

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who want for our government to be
small. We don't want our property taxes

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raise, and so we want for
our councilmen to be a lot of boring

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old guys who don't have any ideas
or any visions about anything. Just keep

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things the way they are, because
we don't want you to to build the

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next Disneyland at the expense of our
tax dollars. And so understandably, in

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a country as ideologically diverse as ours. You're going to see more and more

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of these cities coming up or popping
up. I mean when you see the

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technological advances just in smart homes,
A lot of people's homes. I mean

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the business that I that I own
happens to be in the construction kind of

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industry, and we're seeing a lot
of these smart homes popping up where you

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can talk to your house and you
can set the oven. Just the house

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rights, I call it the direction
toward house rights. No. Yeah,

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yeah, I think your summary there
is is good because I do agree with

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the inevitability of some of these things, but then pointing out like, well,

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what are some of the what are
some of the things that we might

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not be able to foresee or some
of us might be Jay, do you

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see anything that was missing in Chad
or Austin's assessment of this. Yeah,

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I think they run a really good
point. I don't. I didn't hear

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anything I disagree with. The only
thing I would take issue with, maybe

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is just for me. I mean
just from a practical perspective, it looks

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like the same structure that that would
build the smart city, whether it's Gavin

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Newsom trying to do it, or
whether it's Google. I mean, to

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me, it's like the same.
I don't really see a huge difference between

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the two because for so long we've
had really controlled by a military industrial complex

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that is essentially a unit party,
that is a public private partnership, secret

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deep state that runs everything. So
to me, it's going to be the

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same thing, whether it's marketed as
Mark Zuckerberg's Facebook City or whether it's marketed

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as Batalics Ethereum City. Like,
to me, I think it's going to

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be the same. I just see
a lot of this as irrelevance. You

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could look at, for example,
the structure of how in the Cold War,

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when well right before the Cold War
set off, you can look at

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the way that Lenin structured cities and
tried to utilize corporatism. Stalin also tried

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to utilize corporatism. So I don't
really see a huge difference between between corporatism

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and you know, private what's called
free market libertarian governance. To me,

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it all ends up being the same
thing in practice, and what we end

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up debating is a lot of ideals
we end up debating. Yeah, but

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in theory, you know, the
city that's truly voluntaristic. An archo capitalists

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would be so much better. Yeah, but like, where is that right?

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It's to me, it's no different
than Marx's end goal of the withering

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way of the state and the final
freedom that's going to result from Marxism.

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And so for me, again,
I like a lot of libertarian ideas.

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I was libertarian for a while when
I was younger. To me, it's

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just like, at the end of
the day, they kind of have the

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same presuppositions, which are materialism,
which are essentially the highest goals of man,

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are temporal gains, pleasure, security, safety, Those end up being

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the highest things to attain to.
And so when they measure societies on the

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basis of what is a good society
versus a bad society, it's always something

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like that. So it never transcends
those values into valuing things that are in

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any way ever transcendent. There's never
a notion of the good. The good

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is always presumed. There's never a
notion of what freedom actually is or freedom

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to be, what freedom to do
what. It's always just freedom. And

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so because it's anti metaphysics most of
the time, because it's an enlightenment philosophy,

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it's always just kind of put out
their sort of generic ideas of freedom,

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liberty, you know, quality of
life or something like that. So

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anyway, that's my take. Yeah, yeah, I wanted to get more

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into something specific regarding what Jay's pointing
to is like practical things. I saw

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a comment thanks for that. You
know, right now we have this this

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system where you know, we're on
platforms, and I used platform as a

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term to that that cities will eventually
be seen as platforms. But if that's

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the case and we're pissed about a
company who's woke, you know, DEI

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woke, you know, don't say
this, don't say that. If a

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company does run a city, and
from your review Austin, you know,

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it's principled, so great, but
it seems like the people who do pursue

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these company run cities, like Jay
said, it's all going to be Google

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these kind of things, and their
philosophy is going to actually dominate what the

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behavior of the city is. And
what I mean by that is maybe Austin

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wakes up in the city thinks it's
awesome, you know, we're progressing here.

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You start your coffee machine, right
and there's a little I'm sorry,

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Austin, your tweet last week violated
blah blah blah, and you agreed to

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this and your you know, crypto
agreement. Right, suddenly you can't make

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coffee. These little things, these
little things add up. It's not even

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necessarily a big thing, because guess
what if you can't make your coffee,

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you'll find an alternative. Great,
But it's not like you're gonna get up

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and move because you didn't get your
coffee because the company shut off that particular

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aspect of your life. But maybe
they add it. Maybe they say,

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you can't go to the gym now, right, Maybe they say and so

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these are not fantasies. This is
an extrapolation of what we see now with

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corporations owning shit right and being able
to tell you the ethics that you ought

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follow if you're gonna be on their
platform. And so you'd say, well,

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no, that's just an agreement.
But what if they can just change

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the agreement once you're already in the
apartment, right the Amazon uh, well

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we call them coom pods. But
you're in the pod and it's going great,

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and then suddenly you start getting these
notifications, right, like that's what

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we're pointing to, at least I'm
pointing to when I go, are there

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any red flags with these views?
Fine, let's say they're not utopian,

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like Austin says, I think they're
tied a little bit to some vision.

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But let's say they just we try
them, all right? Does that seem

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inevitable Austin that the the woke corporations
who are actually ahead of the game in

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all of this, By the way, they're gonna in the same kind of

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bullshit tos for you to get your
coffee. Sorry, buddy, showers not

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today. You don't get a shower
today. So what do you is that

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that has to be something you admittedly
concede and say, well, yeah,

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that's gonna that could be a big
issue, right, No, for sure.

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And I mean, like one thing
I would say though, first is

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that, like you have to consider
that those things are happening right now,

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and they're happening under the current system
that we have now. But what I'm

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advocating for is, excuse me,
something a little bit different. But like

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you know, in presupposing in this
also too, is like that the business

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owner and the person who creates,
who builds the coffee machine doesn't have some

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rights as well. I mean,
there is like such a thing as a

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private contract, Like if I want
to create a contract with someone and say

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I want to create a coffee machine
that if one day I want to shut

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it off, then I should be
able to have the right to create something

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like that. Who are you to
tell me that I shouldn't be allowed to

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create that kind of a private contract. Now, we all live in the

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United States, and I agree that
we should have a bill of rights in

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a constitution, and that people should
have rights, and that we should elect

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representatives to govern us to solve some
of these problems. Right, So I

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don't I'm not an anarcho capitalist.
So I don't believe in a completely you

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know, private utopia because one,
I don't think that that could exist.

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Because two, because two the times
that it has been tried, it hasn't

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worked successfully, just like socialists utopias
have failed to have failed spectacularly and phenomenally.

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We have a lot though, we
have a lot more examples of socialist

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utopias that have failed. Jamestown and
New Guyana where everybody drank the kool aid

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and killed themselves, perfect example of
a socialist utopia. Right, that went

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wrong North Korea. We have example
after example after example, but we have

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so few examples on the other side. And you even said that, you

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pointed it out and said, well, where does this exist? Where has

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this existed? Right there? Ford
Landia was an example of Henry four trying

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to create a community that was based
on a utopian ideal that was mostly market

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based. The Corporation of Ford in
the rubber plants where they were, you

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know, harvesting rubber for the tires, where they set up this community.

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And Ford was he was a very
conservative man. He wanted to have conservative

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values and he tried to impose them
on the community of people in ford Landia,

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which included workers. Were not allowed
to drink alcohol, they had curfews,

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they had very strict rules, exactly
what you're talking about right here.

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And it failed. So the thing
is is that these utopian experiments that we're

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discussing right now, I don't think
that they exist. They can't exist in

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a vacuum and in the times the
very few times where the experiments have been

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tried again, whether it's a socialist
utopia of Jamestown or whether it was ford

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Landia created by Henry Ford those utopian
experiments always fall apart because reality has a

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way of getting in the way of
people's dreams too. To centrally plan some

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a society, it didn't work with
Epcot Center, it didn't work with Jamestown,

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it didn't work with ford Landia.
Right. What tends to work are

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00:24:11,799 --> 00:24:15,799
people who are able to make individual
choices on a level with a certain basis

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of rights, a modicum of movement
of freedom that they're allowed to have,

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to be able to make their own
decisions, and then to go out and

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transact into contract to get all the
goods and services that they need to accomplish

305
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whatever their goals are in their life. So really, what we're at the

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end of the day, what you're
talking about is still central planning, right

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if it's a whether it's a corporation
or whether it's a government, like,

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it's still something that I oppose in
principle. This concept is central planning,

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which does tend to fall apart because
one of us can never be as smart

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as all of us each. And
it's not that there's no plan, it's

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that there's more planners, right,
and individuals are free to make these decisions

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about what coffee companies they want to
contract with. But again, these these

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00:25:00,519 --> 00:25:10,279
utopian experiments tend to fail on their
own merits because their idealism usually just it

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can't work in reality because people are
people and their individuals and they make their

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own decisions. And sometimes, you
know, if somebody may want to break

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their contract with the coffee company that
they entered into, and for that you're

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00:25:22,400 --> 00:25:25,960
going to need a court to step
in into adjudicated dispute. So there's always

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going to be some layer of a
regulation on a corporation. That's going to

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00:25:30,519 --> 00:25:34,440
be some neutral arbiter third party.
It's always going to exist, whether or

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not anarchocapitalists say it should you know, it should be all private courts as

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well. There's gonna be some outside
regulatory force. The question is what that

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looks like and how the rest of
us can manage ourselves and manage society on

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00:25:48,559 --> 00:25:52,839
our own, you know, absence
of some central vision and central plan handed

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00:25:52,880 --> 00:25:56,720
down from us from a pollic bureau. If you well, you did you

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00:25:56,960 --> 00:26:00,599
said one thing there and I'll let
Jay or Chad John been here. Is

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that you said, well, even
in the corporate city, you do have

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rights. Well, I'm actually saying
what if what if all the materialists and

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00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:12,759
all these coomers coming up are gonna
say, well, I actually don't care

329
00:26:12,839 --> 00:26:18,400
much about rights. Give me stuff, right, give me stuff, Give

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00:26:18,480 --> 00:26:22,519
me a conveyor belt, subscription to
my own life. Let me sit in

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the city, and I'll trade off
my liberties and I'll abandon that construct and

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I'll trade it for another construct.
Now, what do you say to those

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00:26:30,119 --> 00:26:33,920
people, Because regardless of whether you
think it's gonna fail or succeed, right,

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I agree with you that these things
fail, I think because they fundamentally

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00:26:37,880 --> 00:26:44,680
don't account for other aspects of being
a human being, which includes transcendental categories

336
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and things like this that we value
actually more in the end. But regardless,

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if someone goes into the city and
goes, hey, this is great.

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00:26:52,720 --> 00:26:56,160
I get three years, three to
five years here, and they give

339
00:26:56,200 --> 00:27:00,440
you everything, everything you could imagine. Right, you can't see yourself into

340
00:27:00,480 --> 00:27:06,599
slavery, right, so the thirteenth
Amendment, no indentured servitude, no slavery.

341
00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:10,000
You can't, but you can willfully, but you can willfully forfeit your

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00:27:10,079 --> 00:27:15,519
rights through a contract. I don't
see something like that happening. I think

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00:27:15,519 --> 00:27:18,279
most people don't want to live in
the pod or eat the bugs. Are

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00:27:18,319 --> 00:27:22,839
there people who absolutely listen jonestown happened, People drank the kool aid, they

345
00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:26,319
committed suicide out in the junk.
There are absolutely people who do that,

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00:27:26,480 --> 00:27:30,079
Like you know, those people here
are people who want to live in a

347
00:27:30,119 --> 00:27:33,519
cult. How are you going to
stop people from living in cults? Okay,

348
00:27:33,759 --> 00:27:37,400
there are cults. There are still
cults. You're never going to stop

349
00:27:37,440 --> 00:27:40,839
people entirely from living in cults.
Right. You want to try and minimize

350
00:27:40,839 --> 00:27:44,799
it and encourage free thought, but
you can't force people not to be in

351
00:27:44,839 --> 00:27:48,200
cults. It's impossible. There's too
many cults and we're all prone to cult

352
00:27:48,200 --> 00:27:52,920
thinking. Anyways, continue Well,
one thing that I would say a couple

353
00:27:53,000 --> 00:27:56,559
of a couple of things is that
it's not so much just a matter of

354
00:27:57,319 --> 00:28:03,400
do people join cults just be because
people are cult like. You can also

355
00:28:03,519 --> 00:28:10,519
have an intentional top down degradation of
the population through weaponized culture, and that's

356
00:28:10,519 --> 00:28:14,160
something that's existed for a long time, but particularly throughout the Cold War.

357
00:28:14,680 --> 00:28:19,359
Pop culture was from the top down, both corporate and private and government in

358
00:28:19,720 --> 00:28:27,160
a dual operation toxified to degrade the
population. And this is something that the

359
00:28:27,200 --> 00:28:32,039
libertarians typically miss or not aware of. I'm not accusing you guys of that,

360
00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:33,599
just saying that, in my experience
of a lot of debates libertarians,

361
00:28:33,839 --> 00:28:38,720
they will sort of pass over this
idea of toxic culture which is created by

362
00:28:38,759 --> 00:28:44,839
the establishment to grade the population so
that they become pliable and ready to go

363
00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:52,759
into these kinds of settings and basically
rat mazes is what I would say these

364
00:28:52,799 --> 00:28:56,480
smart seaes will be. So my
question to you guys would be, let's

365
00:28:56,519 --> 00:28:59,559
say, I mean, surely some
of us probably have worked at a Fortune

366
00:28:59,559 --> 00:29:02,359
one hundred watching for five hundred company
at some point, right, I've worked

367
00:29:02,400 --> 00:29:06,119
for a couple of them. In
my in my mind, the the smart

368
00:29:06,160 --> 00:29:10,200
city run by one of these fortunes, it's gonna be like living at work.

369
00:29:10,599 --> 00:29:14,680
Okay, Yeah, I remember working
at a fortune one hundred company and

370
00:29:14,759 --> 00:29:18,720
I had a fat bitch manager screaming
in my face managing every little thing I

371
00:29:18,759 --> 00:29:22,720
did, and it was a nightmare. So I can't imagine that living in

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00:29:22,799 --> 00:29:26,720
it. So if I'm given that
but with also with my com pod,

373
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like, that's gonna be somehow a
better thing. So my question is just

374
00:29:30,440 --> 00:29:34,720
that you said something earlier like why
not let Sony have a hand have a

375
00:29:34,759 --> 00:29:38,680
spot at running a smart city.
And I'm like, I mean, dude,

376
00:29:38,680 --> 00:29:42,240
that's gonna be the same fat bitch
manager, maybe even an ai fat

377
00:29:42,279 --> 00:29:45,839
bitch manager telling what you what you
can eat, what you can do,

378
00:29:45,000 --> 00:29:49,160
an Ai an Ai manager. Yeah
right, Like she popped in on the

379
00:29:49,200 --> 00:29:52,319
hologram right while you're in the toilet, and it's like, and they forced

380
00:29:52,400 --> 00:29:57,759
they forced her to be overweight.
So their representation and all that accurately represent

381
00:29:59,400 --> 00:30:04,200
manager operation. Yeah, yeah,
yeah, they have to listen. We're

382
00:30:04,200 --> 00:30:07,880
gonna shift a tiny bit here.
I think we got a good chunk of

383
00:30:07,880 --> 00:30:12,599
meeting there, Chad. We were
talking just before in the green room about

384
00:30:12,599 --> 00:30:18,720
how uh you know we pick I
think that people pick famous people right,

385
00:30:18,759 --> 00:30:22,400
and they approach them at this point, especially this is I think this has

386
00:30:22,400 --> 00:30:26,000
always been the case, but now
I think it's even more rampant. And

387
00:30:26,079 --> 00:30:30,640
Jay's covered this a bunch where you
seek a spokesperson who's flashy, charismatic,

388
00:30:30,720 --> 00:30:34,119
talks loud, whatever is pretty,
and you approach them and go, hey,

389
00:30:34,200 --> 00:30:38,480
hey, I'm gonna yeah, yeah, we wanna you wanna you wanna

390
00:30:38,519 --> 00:30:41,880
work for NATO. It's it's underneath
the radar, though, Like can you

391
00:30:41,920 --> 00:30:45,279
push some of these narratives. Don't
worry you're doing a good thing. Don't

392
00:30:45,279 --> 00:30:48,920
you want to be bigger than your
the scripts that you read that you didn't

393
00:30:48,920 --> 00:30:52,480
actually create. Yeah, I know, I'm gonna be great. I'll you

394
00:30:52,519 --> 00:30:55,640
know, Jesse Smollett, I'm gonna
put a noose around my neck. I

395
00:30:55,680 --> 00:30:59,200
love it. So we've seen this
now, Chad, You've done some decent

396
00:30:59,240 --> 00:31:02,920
work on MLK and you get a
lot of backlash. Right. I think

397
00:31:03,200 --> 00:31:07,799
MLK Jr. Is one of those
people where whether or not it's organic in

398
00:31:07,839 --> 00:31:11,920
the beginning, that's not the point. The point is there are agencies that

399
00:31:12,000 --> 00:31:18,559
can sniff out influential people. Right, The blue check marks of the fifties

400
00:31:18,599 --> 00:31:22,920
and sixties existed, and so you
find them, you sort of groom them

401
00:31:22,920 --> 00:31:26,160
in a way, and then you
have them become a product. I think

402
00:31:26,839 --> 00:31:30,559
you and I would agree, maybe
J Two. I'm not sure Austin's take

403
00:31:30,599 --> 00:31:34,319
on this that someone like Martin Luther
King Jr. Was definitely utilized to the

404
00:31:34,359 --> 00:31:40,640
advantage of some other people and to
push certain things in certain Yeah, yeah,

405
00:31:40,680 --> 00:31:42,319
certain out outcomes. Right, But
now we have this, Jay,

406
00:31:42,319 --> 00:31:47,079
you did a little bit on I
mentioned NATO. It was NATO right with

407
00:31:48,079 --> 00:31:52,599
Taylor Swift. Now we were all
called like complete lunatics when we'd say well,

408
00:31:52,599 --> 00:31:56,000
no, there are actually there is
culture creation. You know a lot

409
00:31:56,000 --> 00:32:00,279
of work has been done again in
this regard as you know, go back

410
00:32:00,319 --> 00:32:05,559
to the the rel you know,
the sexual revolution and all of this.

411
00:32:05,759 --> 00:32:07,480
We can document it, we can
look at it. So the question is

412
00:32:07,480 --> 00:32:13,839
today is this running out of steam? Right? This this? I think

413
00:32:13,960 --> 00:32:16,640
the the veil is dropping where you
start to see, well, there's more

414
00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:21,920
famous people, so there's some saturation
now, so they don't have the same

415
00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:24,039
influence of like Muhammad Ali being like, oh oh I'm going to do this

416
00:32:24,039 --> 00:32:28,680
thing, and you know everyone's all
like yeah, that that guy. Well,

417
00:32:28,720 --> 00:32:31,680
so many people are this now that
it's almost making it sterile in a

418
00:32:31,720 --> 00:32:36,519
way, which I think is not
a bad thing. But I'm wondering,

419
00:32:36,640 --> 00:32:39,640
is is the veil dropped? Jay? You've covered this, is it dropped?

420
00:32:40,160 --> 00:32:45,160
Are people already seeing well famous people
they just really don't have much influence

421
00:32:45,200 --> 00:32:47,799
now they kind of they kind of
blew it. I think they blew it

422
00:32:47,839 --> 00:32:52,119
with the KRUNKA. We can't say
the other word on YouTube, but I

423
00:32:52,160 --> 00:32:57,000
think they utilize too many talking heads
and Everyone's like, wait, how is

424
00:32:57,039 --> 00:33:00,720
this possible that every single person with
a bright, you know, you know,

425
00:33:00,799 --> 00:33:07,599
bleach smile ends up being on the
same basically like a border directors side

426
00:33:07,680 --> 00:33:10,279
of a big, big pharma.
This doesn't make sense. So is it

427
00:33:10,319 --> 00:33:14,319
over? Is it the end of
this? Jay? I don't think it's

428
00:33:14,359 --> 00:33:15,680
over. Okay, good, No, Chad, go ahead, you want,

429
00:33:15,720 --> 00:33:19,559
won't you go? Yeah? I
don't. I don't think it's over.

430
00:33:19,640 --> 00:33:22,519
I think that they've grown more sophisticated
in the way that they carry out

431
00:33:22,680 --> 00:33:29,240
these kind of agendas, and more
often than not, you'll find that the

432
00:33:29,319 --> 00:33:35,200
celebrity or the individual in question themselves
aren't really privy to exactly what it is

433
00:33:35,359 --> 00:33:38,400
or a part of I would say
that Lebron James and his dealings with China

434
00:33:38,960 --> 00:33:44,200
is I mean, he's not a
very smart person. I don't think he

435
00:33:44,240 --> 00:33:46,440
knows what he's up to or how
he's being used. But he's definitely being

436
00:33:46,519 --> 00:33:52,519
used in the same vein as say
a in the same vein as say a

437
00:33:52,599 --> 00:34:00,079
Paul Robeson circa nineteen eight, who
was being used by the eight nineteen eighteen,

438
00:34:00,680 --> 00:34:08,719
nineteen nineteen nineteen twenty area. He
was a full blown communist and I

439
00:34:08,760 --> 00:34:13,800
think he was more aware of how
he was being used and all too willing

440
00:34:13,840 --> 00:34:16,079
to be used in the same way
that MLK was. But I don't think

441
00:34:16,199 --> 00:34:20,880
Lebron James is fully aware of what's
going on. But again, they've grown

442
00:34:20,920 --> 00:34:23,760
more sophisticated because over the course of
the twentieth century, what we've seen is

443
00:34:24,079 --> 00:34:30,239
the so called expert class influencing the
trajectory of our country. These were the

444
00:34:30,239 --> 00:34:32,880
ones who were acting as the kind
of brain trust, if you will,

445
00:34:32,880 --> 00:34:38,199
of the FDR administration, both Republican
and Democrat administration throughout the course of the

446
00:34:38,199 --> 00:34:44,599
twentieth century. I mean the whole
political theatrics of it all, where you

447
00:34:44,679 --> 00:34:49,199
think that you're pulling the lever for
one party's agenda over the other is when

448
00:34:49,199 --> 00:34:52,239
in reality it's just one uniparty.
This isn't anything new. This has been

449
00:34:52,280 --> 00:34:58,400
the case for a very long time. The vell is breaking, so to

450
00:34:58,440 --> 00:35:04,440
speak, in so far that folks
like myself and you, Jim, Bob

451
00:35:04,519 --> 00:35:12,000
and Jay and others are growing more
aware of how ideological subversion works. But

452
00:35:12,079 --> 00:35:14,920
I think part of the reason of
that is because we have, like we

453
00:35:15,000 --> 00:35:19,639
know what the word ideological subversion is. We know about uri Besmanov sitting down

454
00:35:19,639 --> 00:35:22,000
with g EDERG. Griffin in nineteen
eighty four talking to us about the way

455
00:35:22,000 --> 00:35:29,840
in which the KGB and the Soviet
Union influenced ideological subversion cultural demoralization here in

456
00:35:29,840 --> 00:35:32,960
the United States. And so we're
aware of how this thing works. And

457
00:35:34,039 --> 00:35:39,320
even though someone like a Uribezmanov was
able to put into a nicely packed four

458
00:35:39,360 --> 00:35:45,760
point process of how ideological subversion works, that's more for our understanding. The

459
00:35:45,840 --> 00:35:51,239
reality is it doesn't actually quite work
out in exactly those four stages. It's

460
00:35:51,360 --> 00:35:57,079
kind of zigzag in the way that
it truly works. We learn because we

461
00:35:57,280 --> 00:36:02,280
are all educated by the same mass
compulsor very public school education system. We

462
00:36:02,400 --> 00:36:07,760
understand everything in phases and bullet points, and this is the way that we

463
00:36:07,840 --> 00:36:14,199
understand things. And so part of
Yuri's genius is that he understands the way

464
00:36:14,199 --> 00:36:16,599
that we were educated in the West, and so he gave us a framework

465
00:36:16,639 --> 00:36:21,440
to understand how ideological subversion works.
But the reality is, when the rubber

466
00:36:21,480 --> 00:36:25,880
hits the road, it's more zig
zag and more kind of fluid in reality.

467
00:36:25,920 --> 00:36:30,280
So we don't know at a given
time whether they're in a stage of

468
00:36:30,760 --> 00:36:37,239
normalization or crisis, or destabilization or
demoralization. Sometimes all these things are happening

469
00:36:37,239 --> 00:36:43,519
simultaneously, but they're happening nonetheless,
the point being to make the public think

470
00:36:43,599 --> 00:36:46,480
that everything is happening in a vacuum, or everything's organic, there's no hidden

471
00:36:46,559 --> 00:36:51,800
hand behind whatever is going on at
a given time. And then along comes

472
00:36:51,800 --> 00:36:57,639
some bright, smiling politicians saying that
he has the answers if you would only

473
00:36:57,719 --> 00:37:01,039
vote for him or support his policy
for the sake of safety and security.

474
00:37:01,039 --> 00:37:05,599
We end up pulling the lever for
that politician, not realizing that the whole

475
00:37:05,639 --> 00:37:08,679
time, the whole point was to
empower the federal government all the more at

476
00:37:08,679 --> 00:37:12,519
the expense of the rights and the
freedoms of the American people. So this

477
00:37:12,599 --> 00:37:15,639
thing continues to happen over and over
again, and I think politicians in the

478
00:37:15,679 --> 00:37:22,039
expert class today are working simultaneously to
that end. And so that's the sophistication

479
00:37:22,119 --> 00:37:25,039
of it all, which and entertainment. And you add that element of entertainment

480
00:37:25,079 --> 00:37:30,480
as well, which has never been
as accessible like technology allowed entertainment and high

481
00:37:30,480 --> 00:37:35,280
production value to be ubiquitous such that
we can have a show like this.

482
00:37:35,360 --> 00:37:38,880
I mean, imagine this panel right
now this show this quality. You know,

483
00:37:39,320 --> 00:37:43,039
forty years ago it would be like
what the hell do you? Who

484
00:37:43,039 --> 00:37:45,880
do you know? But now everybody
has that, and so I would yeah,

485
00:37:45,920 --> 00:37:51,719
everything you said, Chad, but
add in the technological aspect that you

486
00:37:51,719 --> 00:37:55,199
know, actually kind of adds to
the confusion in a sense. But it

487
00:37:55,239 --> 00:38:01,199
also allows us to seek out alternative
views and information so that we can it's

488
00:38:01,239 --> 00:38:04,840
like a it's like a double edged
sword, like you know, you open

489
00:38:04,880 --> 00:38:07,519
it up to everybody, so you
get more garbage. Like YouTube there's gonna

490
00:38:07,519 --> 00:38:12,639
be eighty five percent garbage. What's
the parido principal? Eighty twenty and then

491
00:38:12,760 --> 00:38:15,639
and then what you know, you
have to find out the truth of the

492
00:38:15,639 --> 00:38:19,599
matter. But we're you know,
some people say we're even in post truth.

493
00:38:19,719 --> 00:38:22,239
So like people don't even care that
it's fake. You see this with

494
00:38:22,360 --> 00:38:25,880
AI stuff, You go, that's
an AI influencer. The person goes,

495
00:38:25,920 --> 00:38:30,039
I don't care. They're filling this
thing, this thing that I need,

496
00:38:30,199 --> 00:38:32,840
And that's that's the that's the value. The value isn't that it's real or

497
00:38:32,880 --> 00:38:37,599
breathing or authentic or has a soul
or you know, it's this other thing.

498
00:38:37,599 --> 00:38:40,320
And I think that's true for politics, at some level where if the

499
00:38:40,840 --> 00:38:45,000
if the character fits and they say
all the right lines, I think there's

500
00:38:45,079 --> 00:38:50,199
enough metadata they have access that you
say X, you could probably predict a

501
00:38:50,320 --> 00:38:52,599
movement to the right or to the
left to some extent. I'm not saying

502
00:38:52,599 --> 00:38:58,840
there's like there's an effective wizard of
oz who really can do it all,

503
00:38:58,920 --> 00:39:00,840
I think, and it ends up
being quite a mess. Right, So

504
00:39:00,840 --> 00:39:06,559
I'm not that big of a conspirat
hard but I'm a little bit like I

505
00:39:06,639 --> 00:39:09,920
earned a helmet, but I'm not
that bad, right, I agree.

506
00:39:10,800 --> 00:39:15,119
I think Chad is definitely right on
the money. And I liked your point

507
00:39:15,559 --> 00:39:20,960
made by Jimbob. You talked about
control over the culture, and you know,

508
00:39:21,000 --> 00:39:23,199
I'll be first to admit, like
I'm very white pilled right, Like

509
00:39:23,400 --> 00:39:29,320
I very much like am an optimist
and see a lot of good things in

510
00:39:29,360 --> 00:39:35,199
our future. Maybe short term pessimistic, long term optimistic, because I'll say

511
00:39:35,199 --> 00:39:38,599
this, like when you think about
the Hollywood system and how it used to

512
00:39:38,639 --> 00:39:44,079
be so much easier to control the
media and the message. Right, there

513
00:39:44,079 --> 00:39:49,280
have been sort of you know,
information revolutions that have been occurring. You

514
00:39:49,280 --> 00:39:53,480
know, in our lifetime, there
have been several information revolutions, not just

515
00:39:53,519 --> 00:40:00,280
because of the medium with which how
we're able to spread information, but what

516
00:40:00,320 --> 00:40:05,559
we can all how we can also
broadcast information and who is considered to be

517
00:40:05,639 --> 00:40:08,880
credible in terms of public information.
Right when I was a child, there

518
00:40:08,920 --> 00:40:14,000
were you know what five six networks, how many you know five or six

519
00:40:14,079 --> 00:40:19,599
news you know shows, and only
one Walter Cronkite was like the most credible

520
00:40:19,639 --> 00:40:23,039
person in reporting. And even with
the Pareto principle, if like there's twenty

521
00:40:23,079 --> 00:40:28,760
percent good information eighty percent bad,
right, that's still that's a low you

522
00:40:28,760 --> 00:40:32,800
know, noise to signal to noise
ratio there. But the at least the

523
00:40:32,920 --> 00:40:37,440
tools are available for people like us
to get the information. I mean,

524
00:40:37,559 --> 00:40:44,119
we are in some sense the elites
because we are seeking out that information.

525
00:40:44,320 --> 00:40:47,119
And you are, you know,
you able to control three hundred and twenty

526
00:40:47,119 --> 00:40:50,880
people who are going to listen to
this show live as what I think of

527
00:40:50,880 --> 00:40:53,400
the numbers are. It used to
be that when we had four or five

528
00:40:53,480 --> 00:40:59,800
channels, a million people were watch
a show and that was that barely ever

529
00:41:00,039 --> 00:41:04,719
exists anywhere except online in the means, if you get a million people on

530
00:41:04,880 --> 00:41:07,679
live, like you're talking about breaking
like a stream or something like that.

531
00:41:07,760 --> 00:41:12,199
It does happen like you get close. But mostly what we see with like

532
00:41:12,239 --> 00:41:15,719
the biggest information streamers now like Dan
Bongino, I think he got like eight

533
00:41:15,800 --> 00:41:20,559
hundred nine hundred thousand people watching live
at some point and it was like the

534
00:41:20,599 --> 00:41:24,760
biggest stream in all of history ever
and that was just recently. So there

535
00:41:24,800 --> 00:41:30,199
has been a power change. Can
corporations and and you know, near do

536
00:41:30,320 --> 00:41:34,800
Wells come in and control their voice
and you know, yes, sure,

537
00:41:34,920 --> 00:41:38,400
but I mean the mob is even
more powerful now than it used to be.

538
00:41:38,559 --> 00:41:44,280
The mob has more tools to uncover
corruption. I mean, how many

539
00:41:44,280 --> 00:41:47,920
times are we saying I mean Sam
Bankman Fried and FDx and the fraud that

540
00:41:49,199 --> 00:41:52,480
was uncovered at FDx was uncovered pretty
damn fast. Bernie made off. I

541
00:41:52,559 --> 00:41:59,360
think it took them like over a
decade to reveal his fraud Enron for example,

542
00:41:59,440 --> 00:42:01,639
Like every thing is speeding up now, I mean, including the speed

543
00:42:01,639 --> 00:42:07,320
of the scams, but also the
justice that's occurred because leoks. Be honest,

544
00:42:07,920 --> 00:42:12,280
we frequently do not get justice from
our justice system, which is why

545
00:42:12,360 --> 00:42:17,880
you see you know sometimes unfortunately cancel
culture mobs that will destroy a person unjustly,

546
00:42:19,400 --> 00:42:22,480
but because there's such a desire for
people to know the truth about the

547
00:42:22,519 --> 00:42:27,920
people who are spreading information, find
out who they're connected to. You do

548
00:42:28,000 --> 00:42:30,880
get justice, you do find out, you know, people who are public

549
00:42:30,920 --> 00:42:35,840
figures that are pedophiles, a lot
faster than you would have found out years

550
00:42:35,840 --> 00:42:37,840
ago. People might have gone their
whole lives and you didn't know that they

551
00:42:37,880 --> 00:42:42,920
had these associations, either to Jeffrey
Epstein or God. You could probably find

552
00:42:42,960 --> 00:42:45,280
a dozen people in the media that
you know, you don't know their names,

553
00:42:45,320 --> 00:42:49,159
but they had a small following and
they got busted talking to a twelve

554
00:42:49,199 --> 00:42:52,519
year old girl at a park because
you know, some kid with a cell

555
00:42:52,559 --> 00:42:57,280
phone was able to go out and
record them and capture them and play the

556
00:42:57,400 --> 00:43:00,880
role of what used to be the
was the to catch a predator. Now

557
00:43:00,920 --> 00:43:05,039
everybody's to catch a predator, right, So well, that's what the that's

558
00:43:05,039 --> 00:43:07,280
what the policing would be in the
smart cities. It would just be like

559
00:43:08,360 --> 00:43:15,119
a mob of bees ready to sting
someone, right, maybe unjustly the well

560
00:43:15,239 --> 00:43:19,719
smart city will mandate that you meet
your pedo quota every yeah, yeah,

561
00:43:19,880 --> 00:43:22,679
right, graiger than that. But
so there's a positive side to this,

562
00:43:22,719 --> 00:43:27,719
which is true which is that we're
at this inflection point where there's a massive

563
00:43:27,800 --> 00:43:34,840
war going on with controlling the voices, controlling the reach of stuff. I've

564
00:43:34,880 --> 00:43:38,840
dealt with this for since twenty sixteen, got my whole website deleted. You

565
00:43:38,880 --> 00:43:43,119
know, it's it's a nightmare to
to fight. But also at the same

566
00:43:43,159 --> 00:43:45,719
time, we're at a point where
we're starting to have some victories. And

567
00:43:45,760 --> 00:43:51,719
it's not just in like alternative media
and speaking about these kinds of issues.

568
00:43:51,760 --> 00:43:55,239
I mean, it's other areas as
well, like Kat Williams talking about comedy

569
00:43:55,320 --> 00:43:59,440
being a gate you know, there's
a bunch of comedians out there and ain't

570
00:43:59,519 --> 00:44:04,400
never been and funny, by the
way, put into your face every day

571
00:44:04,559 --> 00:44:07,280
like they trying right, no,
right, and they're not. And the

572
00:44:07,360 --> 00:44:14,039
establishment has been doing that. There's
even like non establishment people still trying to

573
00:44:14,079 --> 00:44:16,000
gatekeep and I don't know if you
guys have seen this, but you know,

574
00:44:16,000 --> 00:44:20,760
one of the biggest things on YouTube
is comedy. And there's this whole

575
00:44:21,239 --> 00:44:25,559
fracas in the last year on YouTube
of people pointing out it actually started with

576
00:44:25,800 --> 00:44:30,280
Amy Schumer and people pointing out that
she was foisted on everyone and she's not

577
00:44:30,400 --> 00:44:34,960
funny. Then it came. Then
it became Brendan's jab and everybody being forced

578
00:44:35,000 --> 00:44:37,119
to supposedly, you're supposed to like
Brennan's jab, and he threatened people that

579
00:44:37,119 --> 00:44:40,199
were making fun of his his stand
up, and so it's like people are

580
00:44:40,239 --> 00:44:45,199
not understanding the way the internet works. You can't threaten your audience to not

581
00:44:45,360 --> 00:44:53,400
people laugh. It's just crazy.
So there's this revolution that's happening Elon with

582
00:44:53,840 --> 00:44:58,000
X. I mean, whatever you
think of Elon, I mean, certainly

583
00:44:58,000 --> 00:45:01,320
there's areas to be critical, but
just in the issue of being able to

584
00:45:01,360 --> 00:45:05,880
have a little bit more free speech
and make Twitter like the Internet was in

585
00:45:05,920 --> 00:45:09,639
twenty fourteen has been very good for
me. My Twitter has grown well in

586
00:45:09,679 --> 00:45:14,039
the last year. So there are
positives of our pluses. But I think

587
00:45:14,039 --> 00:45:17,039
if we zoom out at the metal
level and we think about this, I

588
00:45:17,119 --> 00:45:24,679
still just like I'm worried that the
Internet itself was given to us by the

589
00:45:25,079 --> 00:45:30,920
public private corporate partnership of the Deep
State and the Pentagon. I don't think

590
00:45:30,920 --> 00:45:36,000
it was given to us for freedom
and liberty and libertarian values. I think

591
00:45:36,000 --> 00:45:38,920
that it's there ultimately, I mean
I wish I want it to not be.

592
00:45:39,000 --> 00:45:42,800
I hope it's not going to be
bad. There's a lot of positives

593
00:45:42,800 --> 00:45:45,920
on pro bitcoin and pro you know, all of these things. But I'm

594
00:45:45,960 --> 00:45:50,920
also worried that it will have the
effect of degrading society to the point where

595
00:45:51,639 --> 00:45:54,880
the future generations gen Z and younger
are going to actually be that blob of

596
00:45:54,920 --> 00:45:59,199
people who don't have any critical thinking
skills and will be raised in a smart

597
00:45:59,199 --> 00:46:01,000
city and will be he populated.
I think that's the danger. And I

598
00:46:01,000 --> 00:46:04,679
don't know what the answers are.
I mean, I think there are some

599
00:46:04,800 --> 00:46:07,880
things that we can do. I
don't have any big scale solution to everything,

600
00:46:07,000 --> 00:46:10,519
but but I mean, I'm just
worried that the internet itself is also

601
00:46:10,719 --> 00:46:16,320
contributing to the decline. I don't
know. And also in regard to your

602
00:46:16,320 --> 00:46:22,559
revestment of I mean, he's a
great example of why I don't think the

603
00:46:22,599 --> 00:46:27,360
libertarian ethos itself is the answer.
I think it has a lot of good

604
00:46:27,400 --> 00:46:30,079
points and the good good critiques of
the state, But if you look at

605
00:46:30,119 --> 00:46:35,159
your REVESTMENTOV, I mean, for
one, everything that he says when he

606
00:46:35,320 --> 00:46:38,480
defected is what the CIA wanted him
to say. So that's why you find

607
00:46:38,480 --> 00:46:42,639
if you watch the full lectures.
He goes on to talk about how we

608
00:46:42,719 --> 00:46:46,280
have to we have to liberate the
Eastern Europeans who are being oppressed because they

609
00:46:46,320 --> 00:46:50,719
can't have the butt sex, and
we must give them the freedom of all

610
00:46:50,760 --> 00:46:53,320
the liberties of the gay and it's
like, wait a minute, So he's

611
00:46:53,320 --> 00:46:58,960
just another kind of tool, you
know, voicing what the CIA wanted in

612
00:46:59,000 --> 00:47:01,920
the Cold War, and we're actually
doing the very things right now that Uri

613
00:47:02,039 --> 00:47:05,800
said. So I don't know why
people if people have a problem with what's

614
00:47:05,800 --> 00:47:07,840
happening in Ukraine. I mean,
Uri said, we need to liberate these

615
00:47:07,840 --> 00:47:12,599
people so that they can have you
know, skittles, weddings and whatnot.

616
00:47:12,719 --> 00:47:15,119
So again, it's just liberty.
I mean, yeah, he says some

617
00:47:15,199 --> 00:47:20,719
good things, but it wasn't the
KGB that was running these operations in the

618
00:47:20,760 --> 00:47:23,559
Cold War. It was the Fortune
one hundred, Fortune five hundred running those

619
00:47:23,599 --> 00:47:30,239
operations demoralized in America, not the
KGB. And the CEOs of the Fortune

620
00:47:30,239 --> 00:47:32,039
five hundred were not KGB agent.
Okay, well, just you know,

621
00:47:32,480 --> 00:47:38,239
maybe maybe your Abezmanov was a liar, right, so it's possible that he

622
00:47:38,400 --> 00:47:43,599
was also full of shit, right
because he was a Soviet. So just

623
00:47:43,719 --> 00:47:47,800
remember that it's possible that your a
Bezmanov was telling us, well, we

624
00:47:49,000 --> 00:47:52,360
you know, we the anti establishment. Why we the revolutionaries, right,

625
00:47:52,440 --> 00:47:57,639
we who are the anti Hillary Clinton's, the anti Mitt Romneys of the world.

626
00:47:57,920 --> 00:48:00,079
You know, whatever you consider yourself
to be, if you're not a

627
00:48:00,199 --> 00:48:04,400
libertarian, right, we're on this
side, and right and met Romney and

628
00:48:04,480 --> 00:48:07,840
Hillary Clinton and everybody else is on
the others. But just because Yury Besbanov

629
00:48:07,920 --> 00:48:10,719
told us a few things that we
wanted to hear, it doesn't mean that

630
00:48:10,760 --> 00:48:15,119
we ought to take Ury Besmanov as
the gospel truth. Like, it's possible

631
00:48:15,199 --> 00:48:22,800
to think that Hillary Clinton is a
fraud and Vladimir Putin is a murderous killer,

632
00:48:22,960 --> 00:48:25,840
right, Like, you don't have
to buy into either narratives. And

633
00:48:27,280 --> 00:48:32,159
my favorite, actually, my favorite
former Soviet who I don't trust completely is

634
00:48:32,199 --> 00:48:37,559
a guy by the name of Mitroschkin, who was a former KGB general who

635
00:48:37,559 --> 00:48:43,960
defected to the United States, and
he had a whole treasure trove of not

636
00:48:44,119 --> 00:48:51,119
just conspiracy theories that he brought with
him, but actual conspiracies that intelligence agencies

637
00:48:51,159 --> 00:48:59,519
overseas had perpetrated upon the American public. Americans love conspiracy theories and the Soviets

638
00:48:59,599 --> 00:49:04,119
knew that, and they know that
if you wanted to have power over the

639
00:49:04,159 --> 00:49:08,119
American people, the best way is
to spread conspiracy theories because we love it,

640
00:49:08,159 --> 00:49:14,039
mostly because we're so prosperous and wealthy
compared to the rest of the world

641
00:49:14,039 --> 00:49:16,360
that our wives, who are bored
at home, or at least were in

642
00:49:16,360 --> 00:49:21,960
the nineteen fifties and the Cold War
until the eighties, they love conspiracy theories.

643
00:49:21,960 --> 00:49:24,079
The board Housewives, man, you
see them on Twitter now because now

644
00:49:24,079 --> 00:49:29,800
they have social media and they're out
there spreading the nine to eleven inside job.

645
00:49:30,159 --> 00:49:32,760
Oswald didn't shoot alone from that,
They've got nothing better to do with

646
00:49:32,840 --> 00:49:40,320
their lives than spread Soviet horseshit on
Liot Believe because and the deep State loves

647
00:49:40,360 --> 00:49:45,039
it because it keeps us retarded and
arguing over things like an assassination from the

648
00:49:45,119 --> 00:49:50,559
nineteen sixties and whether it's important that
there was somebody on a grassy knoll or

649
00:49:50,639 --> 00:49:53,440
not, instead of fighting about the
fight that's happening right now. So like

650
00:49:53,880 --> 00:50:00,039
foreign intelligence agencies are just as as
guilty as spreading horseshit conspiracy theories that Americans

651
00:50:00,079 --> 00:50:05,000
love and believe because we are believers, man, We love to believe in

652
00:50:05,000 --> 00:50:08,599
conspiracy. But don't you think that
when somebody defects, they're going to they're

653
00:50:08,639 --> 00:50:12,360
going to put out what we didn't
let me? Haven't you let me finish?

654
00:50:12,440 --> 00:50:14,199
Yet? You don't know what I
want to say? Yeah, you

655
00:50:14,239 --> 00:50:19,679
don't think that they're going to say
what their new masters want. No.

656
00:50:19,800 --> 00:50:22,800
I think they're going to say whatever
is going to make sure that they get

657
00:50:22,800 --> 00:50:25,119
the champagne and the Coca cola flowing, and it's going to get them,

658
00:50:25,519 --> 00:50:30,199
and that would be what the c
wants. Right. Perhaps, maybe maybe,

659
00:50:30,280 --> 00:50:34,400
but just you know, just because
the CIA says something doesn't mean it's

660
00:50:34,440 --> 00:50:37,800
wrong. You know, Ana Hitler
drank water, right, so the truth

661
00:50:37,880 --> 00:50:43,920
to be true, you're a fallacy, which I didn't argue. I wouldn't

662
00:50:43,960 --> 00:50:45,920
argue that. My point is is
that your a vestment off. Some of

663
00:50:45,960 --> 00:50:50,360
what he said was ostensibly true,
and some of what he said I think

664
00:50:50,440 --> 00:50:52,960
was ostensibly false. Right, So
you gotta be careful, especially when we

665
00:50:53,000 --> 00:50:59,480
talking about Soviet defectors, because a
lot of those people they weren't necessarily defectors.

666
00:50:59,519 --> 00:51:01,000
They were still working on the side
of the Soviets. Some of them

667
00:51:01,000 --> 00:51:05,000
were double Okay, I understand people
have that theory, but let me give

668
00:51:05,000 --> 00:51:08,559
you an example. So again he
says that one of the things that has

669
00:51:08,599 --> 00:51:13,519
to happen is that we have to
support the efforts of the West and the

670
00:51:13,519 --> 00:51:16,559
CIA and the Cold War because of
the fact that there's a lot of oppressed

671
00:51:16,559 --> 00:51:20,840
people on the other side of the
Iron Curtain, in the Eastern Bloc countries

672
00:51:20,880 --> 00:51:24,280
who don't have access to coke,
pepsi and gay marriage. So what I'm

673
00:51:24,320 --> 00:51:29,719
saying is that that is the CIA's
line during the Cold War. They adopted

674
00:51:29,800 --> 00:51:37,840
through the Congress for Cultural Freedom,
the liberal policy of social ethics and liberal

675
00:51:37,199 --> 00:51:40,960
art ideas. That's why they funded
modern art, abstract art, all of

676
00:51:40,960 --> 00:51:45,000
that. So if you understand the
dominance of the CIA in American pop culture

677
00:51:45,320 --> 00:51:49,239
from the nineteen sixties all the way
up into the nineteen eighties, that look

678
00:51:49,360 --> 00:51:52,800
smart Jay, that worked, right, that was effective. I mean you're

679
00:51:52,880 --> 00:51:57,119
making the CIA's point for them.
I mean, they funded jazz artists,

680
00:51:57,159 --> 00:52:02,599
they funded American artists and work it
and it worked. I mean, job,

681
00:52:04,719 --> 00:52:07,840
the CD, the c i A
aren't necessarily ideologues, right, They

682
00:52:07,840 --> 00:52:13,159
don't necessarily operate on an ideological fashion
like you do. Right. Their their

683
00:52:13,199 --> 00:52:17,480
mission changes based on the administration that
controls them. The mission is the mission

684
00:52:17,519 --> 00:52:25,239
of the narrative in the nineteen fifties, it's kill Castro and kill It's not

685
00:52:25,320 --> 00:52:30,440
the same mission as the CIAM narrative
of what the CIA is and what they

686
00:52:30,519 --> 00:52:32,400
know. Jay, you've been drinking. You've been drinking a lot of kool

687
00:52:32,400 --> 00:52:36,280
aid yourself. It sounds like you
want to believe that. You want to

688
00:52:36,280 --> 00:52:40,320
believe the alternative mainstream narratives that agree
with you completely entirely. And it's possible

689
00:52:40,360 --> 00:52:46,480
that maybe the mainstream narrative is horseship
drinking cool and specifically ship that comes out

690
00:52:46,480 --> 00:52:50,800
of Info Wars on a daily basis, because you want to sell us Dick

691
00:52:50,880 --> 00:52:55,880
pills and the establishment wants to sell
us Dick no arguments whether I buy you're

692
00:52:55,920 --> 00:53:00,559
going to whether I buy my Dick
pills from Pfizer, or whether you don't

693
00:53:00,559 --> 00:53:06,159
have an actual do you have actual
debate or you want to go into Dick

694
00:53:06,239 --> 00:53:09,880
bill ship. I'm that that you
are just you are not immune to the

695
00:53:09,920 --> 00:53:15,960
same corruption that the establishment is engaged
in, because against the establishment, you

696
00:53:15,960 --> 00:53:21,239
can still spread the same horseship.
You're a Bezmanov. That doesn't prove that

697
00:53:21,280 --> 00:53:28,639
I've actually done that. A non
can wait. So I've actually done that

698
00:53:28,760 --> 00:53:31,840
by saying that it's possible for someone
to spread misinformation, that's not an argument.

699
00:53:35,320 --> 00:53:38,880
Do you do you have you think? Do you think misinformation? Yeah?

700
00:53:38,880 --> 00:53:44,199
Do you think Jay through I guess
through info? Wors? Are you

701
00:53:44,239 --> 00:53:47,639
saying that he's he's part of a
disinfo thing or that it's just possible?

702
00:53:49,000 --> 00:53:52,800
I know I'm saying that, you
know, building on my point from people

703
00:53:52,800 --> 00:53:57,480
who are bored tend to believe in
conspiracy theories, that what your a bezmanofs

704
00:53:57,480 --> 00:54:00,159
spread here in the United States may
not have been the high truth, and

705
00:54:00,199 --> 00:54:05,559
that things like that. Just because
the CIA says something doesn't mean that it's

706
00:54:05,599 --> 00:54:08,639
wrong. They may say something that's
true on one day. They sent me

707
00:54:08,719 --> 00:54:12,199
this a lot, but their job
isn't made an argument. Yeah, it's

708
00:54:12,239 --> 00:54:15,119
all strong men, none of those. I'm not talking about your argument.

709
00:54:15,159 --> 00:54:19,960
How can I strang man my own
argument. I'm only saying you're not addressing

710
00:54:20,000 --> 00:54:22,800
my argument. Then, okay,
well I didn't hear a question. They

711
00:54:22,800 --> 00:54:24,880
may have cut out, So did
you ask a question? No, a

712
00:54:25,000 --> 00:54:30,480
question is not an argument, So
not addressing the arguments I made, then

713
00:54:30,480 --> 00:54:32,079
there was no reason to go to
Dicktills and this would you like me to

714
00:54:32,239 --> 00:54:37,159
what would you like me to address? Jay, Well, let's go back

715
00:54:37,159 --> 00:54:39,199
to the CIA in the Cold War. You said it was effective, and

716
00:54:39,360 --> 00:54:44,159
I didn't. I didn't question whether
it was effective or not. My point

717
00:54:44,280 --> 00:54:49,920
was that they adopted and utilized the
arts and the principles of degeneracy as a

718
00:54:49,960 --> 00:54:52,239
form of cultural warfare. Don't give
a ship. I don't give a about

719
00:54:52,280 --> 00:54:58,400
your degeneracy like I don't sit around. That's why I don't care like I'm

720
00:54:58,440 --> 00:55:05,039
not. You don't care that I'm
not. I don't thinking about butt sex

721
00:55:05,079 --> 00:55:08,440
all the time. Bro, I'm
not obsessed with, but care about you

722
00:55:09,119 --> 00:55:14,199
are obsessed with. But made my
point you you can't stop thinking about it,

723
00:55:14,320 --> 00:55:19,199
and and it's your it's your primary
goal in life. It's just I

724
00:55:19,199 --> 00:55:25,400
don't identify with that. Hold on
a second, Hold on, Hold on

725
00:55:25,440 --> 00:55:30,199
a second, Jay, Hold on
Austin. If what we're talking about is

726
00:55:30,280 --> 00:55:35,960
cultural and ideological subversion, right,
yes? Would you say you just that

727
00:55:36,079 --> 00:55:38,559
doesn't care? Right? Well?
Do you get what about what I'm in

728
00:55:38,639 --> 00:55:43,239
favor of? Cout cultural and ideological
subversion? I'm we're engaging in it right

729
00:55:43,280 --> 00:55:45,199
now. We want to subvert the
culture. Who wants to We don't want

730
00:55:45,199 --> 00:55:49,320
to keep the culture the same.
I'm not a conservative. I'm not a

731
00:55:49,360 --> 00:55:53,639
conservative. I'm a revolutionary. I
want revolution. Wait, hold on,

732
00:55:53,679 --> 00:55:57,239
hold on, hold on, hold
on a second, I'm almost done.

733
00:55:57,639 --> 00:56:00,039
Don't get it, don't get it
twisted here. I don't want an old

734
00:56:00,119 --> 00:56:05,079
world order. I want a new
world order. I want things to be

735
00:56:05,199 --> 00:56:07,719
changed. I don't want things to
be how they were. I want bitcoin.

736
00:56:07,800 --> 00:56:10,920
I want monetary reform. I want
to end the Federal Reserve. I

737
00:56:10,960 --> 00:56:15,400
want to see Hillary Clinton in jail. I want to see Donald Trump be

738
00:56:15,480 --> 00:56:17,440
president. I want to see I
want to see a revolution. I want

739
00:56:17,440 --> 00:56:22,039
to see things get shaken up because
I don't want things to be the same.

740
00:56:22,079 --> 00:56:25,159
I don't have that. I don't
want to know a worldview. All

741
00:56:25,239 --> 00:56:31,360
you have is subjective libertarian pleasure principle. Okay, well you know the things

742
00:56:31,400 --> 00:56:37,119
you made up your head is your
fast moral principle. But mine is completely

743
00:56:37,119 --> 00:56:43,280
subjective. But yours is completely objective, literally just based on something in based

744
00:56:43,360 --> 00:56:46,079
in fast in reality. That's why
you don't even know what a fallacy is.

745
00:56:46,119 --> 00:56:52,840
You've made multiple fallacies already in this
discussion okay, because you separate subjective

746
00:56:52,960 --> 00:56:58,360
argumentation from objective So, Austin,
I want to ask you if if cultural

747
00:56:58,400 --> 00:57:00,360
subversion, if you're for it,
you're not for every version of it?

748
00:57:00,440 --> 00:57:09,280
Right? No, I'm okay.
What's the basis for ethics here? Oh

749
00:57:09,400 --> 00:57:13,280
god, please, I'm not going
a key and ethics. I'm not going

750
00:57:13,320 --> 00:57:17,559
to get into like ancient Greece and
and uh marcus right, I'm not going

751
00:57:17,599 --> 00:57:24,280
to sit down. I'm not going
to sit down stoicism. And you're making

752
00:57:24,440 --> 00:57:29,440
arguments that we need to adopt this. Dude, can you answer this or

753
00:57:29,480 --> 00:57:30,960
not? Right? And then you're
saying I want n and ethics, but

754
00:57:31,000 --> 00:57:34,800
I don't want to answer for what
it means to go to ancient Greek ethics.

755
00:57:34,840 --> 00:57:37,880
That is no, I don't because
I think that ship's boring, bro,

756
00:57:37,960 --> 00:57:40,840
And I don't care that you think
it's boring. I need a basis.

757
00:57:42,199 --> 00:57:44,880
If you don't think that I have
a fixed moral principle in the standard,

758
00:57:44,920 --> 00:57:46,800
that's fine. We won't agree on
that. I want to know the

759
00:57:46,920 --> 00:57:50,639
argument for it. Let's talk about
what people give a shit about. Nobody

760
00:57:50,679 --> 00:57:55,280
cares about an everybody in the audience
cares about it because you came with a

761
00:57:55,400 --> 00:57:59,840
moral they do not. You can't
justify, yes they do. The object

762
00:57:59,880 --> 00:58:01,400
of life is not to be on
the side of the majority, but to

763
00:58:01,599 --> 00:58:08,320
escape finding one the ranks of the
insane. Marcus. There there's the base.

764
00:58:09,320 --> 00:58:14,079
Read memes, Marcus. I'm reading
Marcus Aurelius. Hold on, hold

765
00:58:14,079 --> 00:58:21,559
on stoic ethics exactly. So it's
something I didn't hear. You say,

766
00:58:21,719 --> 00:58:25,119
why should we accept stoic ethics?
Oh my god, All right, listen.

767
00:58:25,159 --> 00:58:30,079
You don't want answer it because I
think it's a pointless discussion. That's

768
00:58:30,639 --> 00:58:32,679
j J. Hold on. Let
me ask you different, Let me ask

769
00:58:32,719 --> 00:58:37,199
you, Let me ask a different
way. Is there any Is there any

770
00:58:37,239 --> 00:58:43,800
degeneracy that you point to that we
ought not pursue in society? Are you

771
00:58:43,800 --> 00:58:46,559
asking me? Yeah? Does the
term degeneracy mean anything to you at all?

772
00:58:50,599 --> 00:58:53,159
Yeah? To to some extent,
we probably wouldn't share the same definition

773
00:58:53,280 --> 00:58:58,840
of what and what defines what makes
it what you degenerate? Right, so

774
00:58:58,920 --> 00:59:04,880
to to so the actual literal definition
of digit to have to have a pod,

775
00:59:07,239 --> 00:59:09,960
which you have degenerate. But I'm
not like Jay Dinalds, sit around

776
00:59:10,000 --> 00:59:14,039
worrying about the butt sex, right, it's not it's not the top of

777
00:59:14,079 --> 00:59:24,800
my concerns for you got to stop
them from Okay, wait, let me

778
00:59:24,960 --> 00:59:28,400
j j. Let me take it
one step at a time. Here are

779
00:59:29,079 --> 00:59:32,639
is the current culture that I called
degeneracy and Jado's as well. Are they

780
00:59:32,719 --> 00:59:40,440
pushing that on children? Yes?
And as yes, and listen and as

781
00:59:40,480 --> 00:59:45,519
a man who got booed when I
ran for president for saying you should not

782
00:59:45,519 --> 00:59:49,519
be allowed to sell drugs to children, I can tell you that there are

783
00:59:49,679 --> 00:59:54,880
moral standards and principy you do not
cross. And are they so so?

784
00:59:54,880 --> 01:00:00,360
So there are? There are absolutely
some moral standards and are they stuff?

785
01:00:00,079 --> 01:00:02,519
But but I draw the line at
children? What you want to answer?

786
01:00:04,280 --> 01:00:07,360
Answered? I just answered, I
draw the line at children? What are

787
01:00:07,440 --> 01:00:12,639
they? What are the standards?
I draw the line children your personal opinion

788
01:00:13,239 --> 01:00:17,039
what the standard is. But consenting
adults are a different matter. So it

789
01:00:17,159 --> 01:00:23,159
is debate being this. Listen,
you're being arbitrary. You understand in philosophy

790
01:00:23,159 --> 01:00:27,000
you can't be arbitrary. Yes,
I can't all I can do whatever the

791
01:00:27,000 --> 01:00:30,000
funk I want. It's a free
country debate. I want to be arbitr

792
01:00:30,320 --> 01:00:35,360
debate whatever. You just lost the
debate by saying I could do whatever I

793
01:00:35,400 --> 01:00:37,880
want in the debate. Yes,
of course I can. Of course I

794
01:00:37,880 --> 01:00:42,719
could do it. This isn't format, you know. Jim Bobby even said,

795
01:00:44,000 --> 01:00:45,920
do whatever you want. It's not
a it's not a hard debate format.

796
01:00:46,039 --> 01:00:50,079
So I can do whatever I want. I can say whatever I like.

797
01:00:50,119 --> 01:00:52,559
I don't even understand that doing it
doesn't mean that you're I'm talking about

798
01:00:52,559 --> 01:00:55,440
following the laws of debate, the
laws of logic. You think you can

799
01:00:55,440 --> 01:01:00,119
commit fallacies and the arguments are still
good? Okay, mister Uri back is

800
01:01:00,199 --> 01:01:06,599
minov is. Everything has the same
mission from the nineteen fifties until today,

801
01:01:06,840 --> 01:01:10,079
right, Austin Alston, let me
hold on, hold on. J Jay

802
01:01:10,079 --> 01:01:15,119
can make it up on the spot, but I have to hold on.

803
01:01:15,119 --> 01:01:17,719
I'm amuse. I'm gonna mute.
I'm gonna mute both you hold on a

804
01:01:17,760 --> 01:01:21,400
second. I have a question.
I'm gonna bring it back on the on

805
01:01:21,559 --> 01:01:25,039
tracks in a way that still follows
the where this is going. You,

806
01:01:25,639 --> 01:01:31,480
Austin, you do appeal your foundation? Would you say is based on rights?

807
01:01:32,920 --> 01:01:37,000
Am I unmuted? Okay? Yes? Yeah? Rights? Yeah,

808
01:01:37,400 --> 01:01:42,920
okay? And so from your view, is it fair to ask what what

809
01:01:42,960 --> 01:01:46,519
these rights are? Oh? Of
course it is okay, So what are

810
01:01:46,679 --> 01:01:50,920
what are rights? From? From
your view here, all right, would

811
01:01:50,920 --> 01:01:53,840
you agree that a right? Would
you'd agree with the definition that a right

812
01:01:54,280 --> 01:02:01,559
is an entitlement absent to duty.
Uh? Yes, that's that's a pretty

813
01:02:01,599 --> 01:02:06,039
close to the technical definition of what
our right is a right? Like,

814
01:02:06,079 --> 01:02:09,159
the simplest way to explain it is
that as a right is a guarantee.

815
01:02:09,639 --> 01:02:14,360
Okay, So if a right is
an entitlement absent of duty. From your

816
01:02:14,480 --> 01:02:17,039
view, when you say, well, I have a concept of degenerate right,

817
01:02:17,079 --> 01:02:22,800
there's some degeneration of something. So
there's a positive thing that's unraveling.

818
01:02:22,880 --> 01:02:25,920
Let's call it a fabric. Right. So let's say from all of our

819
01:02:27,000 --> 01:02:30,920
views, there's a fabric and when
we see that fabric unraveling, we call

820
01:02:30,000 --> 01:02:36,079
it degenerate. We call it degeneration. Right, that's a clearer visual way

821
01:02:36,079 --> 01:02:38,920
to say it. So my question
is, if a right is a is

822
01:02:39,000 --> 01:02:50,559
an entitlement absent duty, where do
you get the duty to defend rights from?

823
01:02:50,639 --> 01:02:53,960
Where do you get the duty to
defend these rights from? Yeah?

824
01:02:54,000 --> 01:03:02,199
So could you rephrase your question in
a different way? Why give hold on

825
01:03:02,440 --> 01:03:06,960
hold on? Yes? Because it's
it's low I Q to want to understand

826
01:03:07,639 --> 01:03:10,440
it's okay, it's okay, hold
on, what why Basically if a right,

827
01:03:10,559 --> 01:03:13,960
if the thing you're defending is the
rights, which is an entitlement,

828
01:03:14,000 --> 01:03:19,079
apps and a duty, I want
to it entails that a duties somewhere in

829
01:03:19,159 --> 01:03:22,920
there right entangled. And I'm asking, like, what is the what's from

830
01:03:22,960 --> 01:03:27,840
your view from a libertarian view,
what actually grounds that we ought to defend

831
01:03:28,000 --> 01:03:31,239
rights if they are in fact just
entitlements absent the duty? By definition?

832
01:03:31,480 --> 01:03:36,360
Well, not everybody, not everybody
has to defend rights. Very few people

833
01:03:36,400 --> 01:03:39,760
actually do, right, It's usually
a very small people group of people that

834
01:03:39,840 --> 01:03:43,320
end up defending rights overall. So, I mean, you know, are

835
01:03:43,320 --> 01:03:46,559
you asking why every person should have
to acknowledge or let's say, let's say

836
01:03:46,559 --> 01:03:52,360
acknowledge then asking a tactical question here? How about philosophical question? How about

837
01:03:52,360 --> 01:03:58,079
how about how about acknowledge instead of
defend? Well, uh, a duty

838
01:03:58,119 --> 01:04:02,679
to acknowledge that that that they have. I mean, it depends, right,

839
01:04:02,760 --> 01:04:05,400
like, not everybody has a capacity
to do that, right. That's

840
01:04:05,400 --> 01:04:10,679
why the rights exist to an extent
to protect the liberty of people who don't

841
01:04:10,719 --> 01:04:15,599
even necessarily have the capacity to acknowledge
it, like children for example right or

842
01:04:15,039 --> 01:04:19,440
the mentally deficient right, the mentally
insane right. Those people have rights even

843
01:04:19,480 --> 01:04:24,880
if they don't you know, can't
acknowledge that they have those rights. They

844
01:04:24,960 --> 01:04:28,760
still just like the unborn, the
unborn in the womb, they can't acknowledge

845
01:04:28,760 --> 01:04:30,960
that they have rights. But they
what they do have rights, they can't

846
01:04:30,960 --> 01:04:34,639
acknowledge they have a duty to protect
those rights. So we do that on

847
01:04:34,679 --> 01:04:41,480
their behalf through a constitutional government.
Okay, So if someone who doesn't have

848
01:04:41,519 --> 01:04:45,400
the capacity to know that they have
these concept of rights and they don't have

849
01:04:45,440 --> 01:04:53,039
the capability of acting out the duty
right, that doesn't that's not embedded in

850
01:04:53,079 --> 01:05:00,000
the rights. By the way,
the duty is added. I'm asking if

851
01:05:00,119 --> 01:05:05,239
if granting someone rights that they can't
actually act on in a way, you

852
01:05:05,239 --> 01:05:10,360
you can violate their rights because they
don't have the capacity to act on them.

853
01:05:10,440 --> 01:05:13,280
Right, happens every day, But
you should obviously, you know.

854
01:05:13,360 --> 01:05:15,239
I mean, like you know,
I think abortion is a crime and a

855
01:05:15,400 --> 01:05:19,360
crime against the rights of an individual. That person can't speak out on behalf

856
01:05:19,400 --> 01:05:24,079
of their own rights. So you
have a person who speaks out for them

857
01:05:24,239 --> 01:05:28,639
as an intermediary. But I mean
most people, most people do not acknowledge

858
01:05:28,760 --> 01:05:34,400
or or have a respect for a
one right or second j J. Let

859
01:05:34,400 --> 01:05:39,639
me finish this one last thing.
So my question is if Jay and I

860
01:05:39,679 --> 01:05:45,199
agree that someone who's walking around the
street sort of not fully naked but almost

861
01:05:45,239 --> 01:05:47,679
and it's you know, from your
view, it's their liberty. They didn't

862
01:05:47,679 --> 01:05:51,679
steal anything, they didn't violate anyone
else's rights, and they didn't take you

863
01:05:51,719 --> 01:05:57,239
know, any anybody's stuff or whatever. From our view, we have a

864
01:05:57,360 --> 01:06:04,320
duty to actually violate their autonomy right
and from our perspective take care of them.

865
01:06:04,320 --> 01:06:08,639
In a sense, now, taking
care of such a person is actually

866
01:06:08,639 --> 01:06:12,360
a violation of the rights from your
view. And that's why I ask from

867
01:06:12,360 --> 01:06:15,679
a this is why I fundamentally reject
libertarianism, having gone through a phase of

868
01:06:15,719 --> 01:06:21,199
it, is that if rights are
are just privileges absent duty, you self

869
01:06:21,199 --> 01:06:25,199
have to ground the duty part.
And that's why Jay's asking about the ethics,

870
01:06:25,199 --> 01:06:29,920
because the ought claim that we ought
to acknowledge rights is separate from the

871
01:06:30,000 --> 01:06:33,079
rights itself. Right, So uh, from my view, it all comes

872
01:06:33,119 --> 01:06:39,360
down to duties. And the problem
with libertarianism is if you value liberty above

873
01:06:39,440 --> 01:06:43,800
all things. Liberty is a description
of what is right. It doesn't tell

874
01:06:43,880 --> 01:06:46,000
us what we ought to do with
liberty. It doesn't tell us when we

875
01:06:46,000 --> 01:06:50,280
should violate liberty or when we shouldn't
violate liberty. It just gives you a

876
01:06:50,280 --> 01:06:54,239
baseline the beauty of it, right, I mean, isn't that sort of

877
01:06:54,239 --> 01:07:00,360
theist? Does san Francisco look beautiful? Are telling using San Francisco as an

878
01:07:00,400 --> 01:07:04,159
example of libertarianism? Right? No? No, liberty, just liberty because

879
01:07:04,360 --> 01:07:08,639
it does. It's because like San
Francisco is like the worst example. How

880
01:07:08,679 --> 01:07:11,840
about burning Man? How about burning
Man? Well, burning Man, that's

881
01:07:11,920 --> 01:07:15,039
better, right, much much better, much more environment better than San Francisco.

882
01:07:15,079 --> 01:07:18,239
At least they clean up after themselves, right right. But it's but

883
01:07:18,440 --> 01:07:23,599
still again like that you ask yourself, I guess what I'm trying to understand

884
01:07:23,639 --> 01:07:28,119
here is like, are you saying
that people don't have rights? Yeah?

885
01:07:28,159 --> 01:07:33,320
I'm actually saying they don't have RIGHTO? I actually okay that that I did

886
01:07:33,360 --> 01:07:35,920
not know, so I was not
aware that you do not believe that people

887
01:07:35,960 --> 01:07:39,639
did. Yeah, I think there
are. I think they are a social

888
01:07:39,719 --> 01:07:45,360
construct that are left with what two
things force, whatever the force is,

889
01:07:45,079 --> 01:07:50,039
and to whatever the uh the standard
of ethics is. That's being imposed,

890
01:07:50,320 --> 01:07:55,760
and and and we already all agree
that rights as you even say them,

891
01:07:56,079 --> 01:08:00,239
actually not everyone gets them, because
you can violate them to do certain things.

892
01:08:00,320 --> 01:08:02,880
You can stop people from doing certain
things based on their situation. So

893
01:08:03,360 --> 01:08:09,960
the problem is it's the duties.
I think my belief is that only duties

894
01:08:10,039 --> 01:08:15,119
exist. And if rights are privileges
absent duties, you still need duties to

895
01:08:15,239 --> 01:08:20,119
exist. And from the libertarian principle, the only imperative is to seek freedom,

896
01:08:20,520 --> 01:08:25,720
and to look at liberty or freedom
as an end goal is to say,

897
01:08:25,960 --> 01:08:30,039
is to look at efficiency as the
end goal. Well, efficiency is

898
01:08:30,079 --> 01:08:32,680
a description toward a goal, but
it can't be the end goal, just

899
01:08:32,720 --> 01:08:36,479
like liberty can't be the end goal. It's actually a start point if anything.

900
01:08:36,840 --> 01:08:41,479
And that's why ought claims like Jay's
pointing to the ethics, the meta

901
01:08:41,520 --> 01:08:44,159
ethics, which I didn't really want
to get into. It bores the shit

902
01:08:44,199 --> 01:08:46,560
out of everyone except for me and
maybe Jay and maybe Chad. He has

903
01:08:46,600 --> 01:08:51,000
a pipe, so it probably doesn't
board Chad. But it isn't important because

904
01:08:51,039 --> 01:08:57,920
if you organize a society around libertarianism, you're actually entailing that there is a

905
01:08:57,960 --> 01:09:01,079
meta ethical principle that you ought to
follow. And when you say something is

906
01:09:01,159 --> 01:09:05,399
degenerate, you're actually assuming there's a
positive in which being torn apart, and

907
01:09:05,439 --> 01:09:09,760
we just don't know what that positive
is that fabric that's being torn apart.

908
01:09:10,000 --> 01:09:14,039
Okay, I don't know that necessarily, other than the idea that we don't

909
01:09:14,079 --> 01:09:16,159
have rights, I'm not sure that
what you and I are saying is saying

910
01:09:16,439 --> 01:09:21,560
is necessarily in conflict some of what
you're asked. You're saying there is a

911
01:09:21,680 --> 01:09:26,960
utilitarian claim, right, You're you're
stating that, you know, if a

912
01:09:27,159 --> 01:09:32,399
society existed around these fundamental ideals,
So it does beg the question of,

913
01:09:32,520 --> 01:09:35,680
you know, whether or not that
society, if it were to come into

914
01:09:35,720 --> 01:09:43,800
creation, would be able to fundamentally
create moral goods that then could potentially be

915
01:09:43,880 --> 01:09:47,840
degenerated. You know, if degeneracy
were introduced into that system, Right would

916
01:09:47,880 --> 01:09:54,119
the what would that degeneracy be?
And how would that system be degraded through

917
01:09:54,199 --> 01:09:59,199
that degeneracy or that moral decline?
So it seems that, you know,

918
01:09:59,239 --> 01:10:02,560
it doesn't sound like I'm disagreeing with
much of what you're saying. Otherwise,

919
01:10:02,640 --> 01:10:08,319
well, other than the concept that
individuals, you know, how don't.

920
01:10:09,479 --> 01:10:13,359
No, this is this is where
we disagree, is that when you go

921
01:10:13,439 --> 01:10:16,319
after jay about like the butt stuff, is that what the culture that we're

922
01:10:16,359 --> 01:10:20,800
seeing right in the West and other
developed nations is that there is a clear,

923
01:10:20,960 --> 01:10:25,560
deliberate pushing of certain behaviors, in
this case sexual. They're not just

924
01:10:25,600 --> 01:10:29,520
sexual. There's there's drug behaviors being
pushed. There's a lot of behaviors,

925
01:10:29,680 --> 01:10:35,239
but that specific thing is actually directed
pretty much directly, explicitly towards children.

926
01:10:35,279 --> 01:10:41,439
And so what we're saying is that
if San Francisco metaph I mean, like

927
01:10:41,720 --> 01:10:45,079
when I confronted you on the San
Francisco example, I mean like you don't

928
01:10:45,079 --> 01:10:49,239
believe San Francisco is an example of
a libertarian city, right, No,

929
01:10:49,039 --> 01:10:54,920
No, I didn't use libertarian,
but but it's liberty based. It's liberty.

930
01:10:54,960 --> 01:10:59,920
It's based on the concept that liberty
about because there's no self evident definition

931
01:11:00,119 --> 01:11:03,359
of what liberty actually is or what
your position actually is. You yourself said

932
01:11:03,359 --> 01:11:06,560
it was subjective. And that's why
I asked you, why do you think

933
01:11:06,600 --> 01:11:12,000
that ballacies are able to be done
in a debate? Do you not think

934
01:11:12,000 --> 01:11:16,199
that a debate is governed by the
rules of logic and critical thinking? Well,

935
01:11:16,239 --> 01:11:20,600
I never said that that the definition
of liberty was necessarily subjective. So

936
01:11:20,920 --> 01:11:24,640
talking about straw mans, I never
said I asked you what it was.

937
01:11:24,840 --> 01:11:27,439
You said, oh oh, you
asked me. You asked me for where

938
01:11:27,479 --> 01:11:31,199
my moral standards came from. You
didn't ask me what my objective defina.

939
01:11:31,279 --> 01:11:35,079
I don't think liberty is. Is
that not a value judgment? It is

940
01:11:35,159 --> 01:11:39,479
a value judgment. But I never
said it was subjective. So you can

941
01:11:39,600 --> 01:11:42,279
you know, you can disagree with
me, but please put those things are

942
01:11:42,319 --> 01:11:46,199
subjective. I asked you about value
judgments? Are you? Are you asking

943
01:11:46,239 --> 01:11:50,640
about about value judgments now? I
asked you then, and I'm asking you

944
01:11:50,680 --> 01:11:56,560
now, okay, So what about
value judgments? Are you asking me specific?

945
01:11:56,560 --> 01:11:59,079
Where do you get the standard?
Because if you're going to say there's

946
01:11:59,119 --> 01:12:02,680
aughts, you gotta have a basis
for the standard. Okay? Is it

947
01:12:02,720 --> 01:12:05,920
okay? Is it okay? Do
I have to have one standard like you

948
01:12:05,920 --> 01:12:11,920
do? Or am I allowed to
use multiple? Understand what? It doesn't

949
01:12:11,920 --> 01:12:15,239
even means? I'm not like you, guys, I don't. I don't.

950
01:12:15,560 --> 01:12:19,399
I am not a social conservative,
okay. So I do not conform

951
01:12:19,600 --> 01:12:27,720
to an an inherently monotheistic view of
society that bases all value judgments on one

952
01:12:27,880 --> 01:12:31,840
single standard handed down to me from
on high. I don't have. I

953
01:12:31,840 --> 01:12:39,720
don't have understand he doesn't know.
I'm not No, I'm not a postmodernist.

954
01:12:40,279 --> 01:12:43,159
No and no and no. I
do not agree with the wokies that

955
01:12:43,199 --> 01:12:47,319
there is no such thing as objective
truth. Okay, so, but I

956
01:12:47,359 --> 01:12:56,880
don't believe in one one truth handed
down for you. You do. I

957
01:12:56,920 --> 01:13:00,239
don't know as you do. I
believe in amalgam. I believe in what's

958
01:13:00,319 --> 01:13:04,880
called triangulation. What's the one thing? Hold on, awesome, you said

959
01:13:04,880 --> 01:13:10,359
something false, you gotta be corrected. There is one truth. There is

960
01:13:10,399 --> 01:13:15,600
one truth that you rested on.
I do not believe in one metaphysical Yes

961
01:13:15,640 --> 01:13:19,640
you do, Yes, you do, Yes, you do? You understand

962
01:13:19,680 --> 01:13:28,560
that the only way that the only
way that that the only listen, Jay,

963
01:13:28,600 --> 01:13:31,479
I don't call you like basement dwelling
retard that looks like you smell bad

964
01:13:31,680 --> 01:13:34,439
and you haven't taken a shower in
a month. So if you could keep

965
01:13:34,479 --> 01:13:43,159
the personal at least before you criticize, if you're gonna you should take a

966
01:13:43,239 --> 01:13:49,239
shower, as I could smell you
from here and how you look as there's

967
01:13:49,279 --> 01:13:58,560
the copy more listen, you fucking
retard. I'm speaking. Okay. There

968
01:13:58,640 --> 01:14:02,359
is a concept to find what is
true called triangulation, and what you do

969
01:14:02,479 --> 01:14:06,680
is you don't even understand you have
a Let me tell you that I doesn't

970
01:14:06,680 --> 01:14:10,720
even understand that it's one. Let
me let j let him go. Let

971
01:14:10,840 --> 01:14:14,199
me. Let me explain to you
how you find logic. You go out

972
01:14:14,199 --> 01:14:17,920
and you find information. There's an
information gathering you. You don't start with

973
01:14:18,000 --> 01:14:23,439
a conclusion. That's not what you
don't. You don't start with what's truth.

974
01:14:25,640 --> 01:14:27,159
Hold on, Jay, hold on
a second. Let me, let

975
01:14:27,159 --> 01:14:30,800
me, let me just manage this. Austin, you said you don't you

976
01:14:30,840 --> 01:14:34,920
don't stand on a single truth,
right, a monolithic truth for your values.

977
01:14:35,720 --> 01:14:39,800
And then you said that I do
not believe the truth is handed down

978
01:14:39,840 --> 01:14:43,479
to us from high as a revelation. I do not believe. I do

979
01:14:43,479 --> 01:14:47,680
not believe a revealed truth. Okay, hold on, hold on how And

980
01:14:47,720 --> 01:14:53,960
then you said you triangulate to see
what's logical and true outside And I'm asking

981
01:14:53,960 --> 01:14:56,840
you from both of those standards,
right, from both of those statements,

982
01:14:56,840 --> 01:15:00,600
that you don't get any revelation of
what's true. You try angulate and you

983
01:15:00,720 --> 01:15:04,359
use rationality and reason. Right,
I'm asking you, Well, it seems

984
01:15:04,359 --> 01:15:10,960
as though your foundation is actually rested
on one solid brick that you assume before

985
01:15:11,159 --> 01:15:14,359
you can look out in the world
and find it, and it's called a

986
01:15:14,439 --> 01:15:18,920
human right. Well, that's only
one example amongst many. See. The

987
01:15:18,960 --> 01:15:26,399
thing is is that if these concepts
they work together, just like the construction

988
01:15:26,479 --> 01:15:29,920
of a building, Right, you
have to have one pillar and then the

989
01:15:30,000 --> 01:15:32,880
next, and then you have to
build it all on the foundation. Okay,

990
01:15:33,199 --> 01:15:35,600
And so in order for us to
determine, in my view, in

991
01:15:35,680 --> 01:15:40,199
order to determine what is true,
we have to go out we don't we

992
01:15:40,239 --> 01:15:43,960
don't know what is true, and
then go out and find facts to support

993
01:15:44,000 --> 01:15:46,960
it. Where did you find rights
and facts? We find facts and then

994
01:15:47,000 --> 01:15:49,880
we put them together. Where did
you find Where did you find? Where'd

995
01:15:49,920 --> 01:15:54,079
you find rights? Where'd you find
rights? Though? Then, if your

996
01:15:54,199 --> 01:16:00,000
standard for epistemology and what's true is
looking out and doing triangulation and reason,

997
01:16:00,359 --> 01:16:02,960
I'm asking you, how did you
come to the conclusion using that method that

998
01:16:03,079 --> 01:16:09,640
rights exist? Well, here's the
here's the thing. I'm willing to change

999
01:16:09,680 --> 01:16:15,359
my mind if I'm wrong, But
I drew this conclusion based on a litany

1000
01:16:15,600 --> 01:16:24,079
of literature that was convincing enough to
me, and I would present to you

1001
01:16:26,079 --> 01:16:33,439
a whole body. I find that
I find literature. What if we say,

1002
01:16:33,520 --> 01:16:36,760
well, that's what revelation is to
us. So you still have a

1003
01:16:38,359 --> 01:16:42,920
problem in your method because you said
your method is you don't start from your

1004
01:16:42,920 --> 01:16:45,960
conclusion and you go out and find
things. So let's say you found literature,

1005
01:16:46,079 --> 01:16:51,680
right, I'm asking you what method
did you determine to say that rights

1006
01:16:51,720 --> 01:16:56,399
exist? I'm not sure how you
would possibly come to the conclusion by looking

1007
01:16:56,399 --> 01:17:00,319
to the external world that something like
with that. Listen, Jim Bob,

1008
01:17:00,359 --> 01:17:02,760
I wrestle with that, right.
I wrestle with that, just like I

1009
01:17:02,760 --> 01:17:05,920
wrestle with a lot of concepts.
And you know, I absolutely could be

1010
01:17:06,000 --> 01:17:11,640
wrong. Uh. And you know
you you could convince me that that what

1011
01:17:11,760 --> 01:17:17,159
I have divined from my education and
my knowledge and limited experience, UH could

1012
01:17:17,199 --> 01:17:23,039
be incorrect. But I'll tell I
can only show you what I have read

1013
01:17:23,199 --> 01:17:28,000
in regards to the natural law,
in regards to you know, the treatises

1014
01:17:28,000 --> 01:17:31,439
of government John Locke, right,
life, liberty, and property, I

1015
01:17:31,479 --> 01:17:35,239
can only show I can only point
to those right because of me being a

1016
01:17:35,319 --> 01:17:41,640
being a secondhand purveyor of ideas.
I can only show you those and say

1017
01:17:42,159 --> 01:17:47,079
this is what I believe to be
true based on how closely it corresponds to

1018
01:17:47,159 --> 01:17:53,079
what I believe to be reality.
And I ask you to believe it as

1019
01:17:53,159 --> 01:17:56,319
well, sure, based on whether
or not you can. But but I

1020
01:17:56,359 --> 01:18:00,439
could be wrong. I'm willing I
observe. What I observe in reality is

1021
01:18:00,600 --> 01:18:04,439
force winds, both in the animal
kingdom and the human And so for me,

1022
01:18:04,720 --> 01:18:11,479
you mean this is the descriptive truth
about reality in all animals and humans?

1023
01:18:11,560 --> 01:18:17,920
Is that force force winds? Do
you disagree? I mean, like

1024
01:18:17,960 --> 01:18:20,840
you just mean in general, like
one hundred percent of the time, it's

1025
01:18:20,880 --> 01:18:27,800
always there's always force ready to go, either looming or there's always forced Yeah,

1026
01:18:27,880 --> 01:18:29,920
yeah, I agree, And I
mean, like, and so I

1027
01:18:29,960 --> 01:18:31,600
wrestle with that, and I'll tell
you it's I think that you know,

1028
01:18:31,720 --> 01:18:39,920
it's it's difficult to live in a
society where we can balance or to create

1029
01:18:40,000 --> 01:18:44,920
a society where there's a balance against
those laws of nature. Right, So,

1030
01:18:45,000 --> 01:18:47,039
like, just to create a civilization, if we will, is to

1031
01:18:47,119 --> 01:18:53,520
sort of reject the fundamental root you
mean appeal to you mean you mean appeal

1032
01:18:53,600 --> 01:18:59,600
to something supernatural right. What do
you mean you have to reject You reject

1033
01:19:00,159 --> 01:19:03,920
the brute nature right for us to
have dignity as human beings, right to

1034
01:19:04,399 --> 01:19:08,920
ground, the value of us being
human beings, which is not identical to

1035
01:19:08,960 --> 01:19:15,319
your dog, is something not found
in nature. So we don't find these

1036
01:19:15,359 --> 01:19:18,680
things. You know, rights assume
dignity, right, but it also assumes

1037
01:19:19,520 --> 01:19:24,159
some sort of duty. And so
if we both agree the descriptive truth in

1038
01:19:24,199 --> 01:19:27,560
premise one for the world is that
force wins, and force is always in

1039
01:19:27,640 --> 01:19:31,880
action or it's looming at least,
right, it's always looming. And so

1040
01:19:32,039 --> 01:19:36,399
if that's if that's the case,
then would you agree that it actually wouldn't

1041
01:19:36,399 --> 01:19:43,239
be a right that informs our behavior, but rather a duty that would actually

1042
01:19:43,279 --> 01:19:45,920
give us how we ought right?
Okay, So, so if the truth

1043
01:19:45,960 --> 01:19:50,079
of the matter is force winds and
and that's the way of the land for

1044
01:19:50,319 --> 01:19:57,119
animals and humans, that there's something
that intervenes that isn't necessarily an entitlement,

1045
01:19:57,720 --> 01:20:00,600
and would you say, if that
entitlement even existed, which I don't believe

1046
01:20:00,600 --> 01:20:08,079
it does, you would still have
to point to the duty in which tell

1047
01:20:08,239 --> 01:20:12,640
informs us how we should interact with
each other. Not necessarily. I mean,

1048
01:20:12,640 --> 01:20:15,399
you're partially right. I mean I
do think that like force wins in

1049
01:20:15,840 --> 01:20:19,479
nature outside of what man has created. But you know, they're you know,

1050
01:20:19,960 --> 01:20:25,760
cops, courts, you know,
nuclear weapons, right, the instrumentation

1051
01:20:26,199 --> 01:20:29,479
of the state. Right. So
since I'm not an anarchist and I do

1052
01:20:29,560 --> 01:20:32,079
believe in a limited government, then
that means that I do believe in an

1053
01:20:32,159 --> 01:20:40,359
artificial third party, you know,
interceding in order to ensure that force doesn't

1054
01:20:40,359 --> 01:20:44,560
always win. And I think the
truth is is that it doesn't. Right.

1055
01:20:44,640 --> 01:20:46,359
The fact that no, hey,
wait, wait, wait, I'm

1056
01:20:46,359 --> 01:20:50,560
almost done. The fact that Grandma
you know, can safely go and get

1057
01:20:50,560 --> 01:20:56,720
groceries here in mid Missouri without having
to worry about bands of highwaymen or theefs

1058
01:20:56,760 --> 01:21:01,079
because of yes, because of four. But that's introduced in a way to

1059
01:21:01,239 --> 01:21:06,960
ensure that that force doesn't always win
in the threat of force. The threat

1060
01:21:06,960 --> 01:21:12,680
of force does the threat of force
always wins? Yeah, if you want

1061
01:21:12,680 --> 01:21:15,600
to if you want to appeal to
rights, all you're appealing to is an

1062
01:21:15,640 --> 01:21:18,920
agreement that you have an entitlement that
ought not be violated, and if it

1063
01:21:19,039 --> 01:21:24,000
is, there's a consequence that is
force. Right, And so force wins

1064
01:21:24,159 --> 01:21:27,479
is still descriptively true even in your
system of rights. Now, what we're

1065
01:21:27,520 --> 01:21:31,800
pointing to is that's actually not good
enough for a society that has any sort

1066
01:21:31,800 --> 01:21:38,640
of fundamental principles or good, a
sense of a good, and these things

1067
01:21:38,680 --> 01:21:44,439
that you actually need to confront the
problem that entitlements themselves actually just leads you

1068
01:21:44,479 --> 01:21:48,640
down a path like we're seeing today, where now you have modifiers for entitlements.

1069
01:21:48,720 --> 01:21:53,239
You have the gay entitlement, you
have the this entitlement, the black

1070
01:21:53,399 --> 01:21:57,680
entitlement that you know whatever, and
you just keep adding entitlements. Now,

1071
01:21:57,680 --> 01:22:02,640
notice how no entitlement that's ever given
is ever paired with the duty. What

1072
01:22:02,640 --> 01:22:08,319
what grounds this duty that we ought
to value or acknowledge entitlements at all?

1073
01:22:08,720 --> 01:22:12,479
And from your view, you can't
ground it in the natural natural world.

1074
01:22:12,560 --> 01:22:16,079
It's nowhere found. And so the
thing that actually makes us intervene as human

1075
01:22:16,119 --> 01:22:21,199
beings is the assumption that we're actually
not just animals, we're not just a

1076
01:22:21,239 --> 01:22:26,199
part of nature. That something is
in us that's bigger than that, and

1077
01:22:26,239 --> 01:22:30,199
it necessarily needs to be supernatural,
because you can't find these things in nature,

1078
01:22:30,640 --> 01:22:33,920
And so we're asking you can I
can be convinced I could be convinced

1079
01:22:33,960 --> 01:22:38,239
of that. Uh, and certainly
I'd love to see your evidence for it,

1080
01:22:38,279 --> 01:22:41,800
and I'm willing evidence supernatural. Well, what's the evidence of a right?

1081
01:22:43,720 --> 01:22:48,640
I'm not listen. I'm not the
one making claim super I'm not making

1082
01:22:46,439 --> 01:22:55,279
you did right. It is a
supernatural everything that everything that I say can

1083
01:22:55,600 --> 01:23:00,600
I can point to and where is
the right? And where is the right?

1084
01:23:00,760 --> 01:23:08,039
But you're the one making its right
exists? Require extraordinary You're saying that

1085
01:23:08,159 --> 01:23:19,359
rights exist as makes sense that the
rights exist, rights exist supernat Talking over,

1086
01:23:19,680 --> 01:23:26,600
do you believe that you could be
wrong about your worldview? Are you

1087
01:23:26,640 --> 01:23:30,520
willing to admit that that your metaphysical
claims could potentially be wrong? No,

1088
01:23:30,880 --> 01:23:33,880
because metaphysics needs to be No,
because here's why, Austin, hold on,

1089
01:23:35,359 --> 01:23:38,479
hold on a second. Let's just
go one, one thing at a

1090
01:23:38,520 --> 01:23:43,880
time. Uh, Austin, you
said extraordinary claims require evidence. I simply

1091
01:23:43,960 --> 01:23:46,880
asked you. I'm telling you that
a right is an claim, and I'm

1092
01:23:46,920 --> 01:23:50,359
asking you where the evidence. I'm
telling you, Austin, as a as

1093
01:23:50,359 --> 01:23:56,239
an olive branch, you already believe
in the supernatural. A right is meta

1094
01:23:56,359 --> 01:24:00,479
natural? Where is it? Where
is it? Where is it, guys,

1095
01:24:00,279 --> 01:24:04,159
guys, because answer that someone who
is telling you that, like a

1096
01:24:04,239 --> 01:24:13,319
basis of rights that's built on a
found evidence, it's not the same thing.

1097
01:24:13,560 --> 01:24:20,479
What is it's claiming? Literally?
Right? And audience, we don't

1098
01:24:20,520 --> 01:24:25,680
we're we're not even speaking of we're
talking past each other. Are there evidence?

1099
01:24:25,840 --> 01:24:30,520
Rights? Claims the supernatural? And
where's where's the right? Yeah,

1100
01:24:30,520 --> 01:24:34,159
but that doesn't mean that it's grounded. That's the point. Where's the right?

1101
01:24:34,279 --> 01:24:39,520
Though it's supernatural? Are not found
in natural? Well? Where is

1102
01:24:39,520 --> 01:24:43,960
your thought? Do you have thoughts? Are they in your brains? Open

1103
01:24:44,039 --> 01:24:50,239
up your brain? You have great? We both agree that there's a thought?

1104
01:24:51,000 --> 01:24:56,079
Were good? Good? We reject
we reject materialism? Do we both

1105
01:24:56,159 --> 01:24:59,680
not reject material materialism? Now?
Right? No? I do not reject

1106
01:24:59,720 --> 01:25:02,399
material Okay, so where's the right? So where's the right? Then?

1107
01:25:02,800 --> 01:25:06,199
I like you? So you're saying
concept which molecules make up? Or right?

1108
01:25:06,560 --> 01:25:10,119
Yeah? Tell us where right is? Well, listen, you'll have

1109
01:25:10,199 --> 01:25:14,880
to talk to a brain chemist listen
to explain to you what the electrical chemistry

1110
01:25:14,920 --> 01:25:17,279
can tell you where a right is? Okay? All right, well listen

1111
01:25:18,119 --> 01:25:24,119
listen. You may have an actual
or not. And I simply deny them

1112
01:25:24,119 --> 01:25:27,119
and say I don't see that that's
the case. I'm willing to believe it.

1113
01:25:27,600 --> 01:25:30,760
How about take another example? How
about take another example that you appeal

1114
01:25:30,800 --> 01:25:33,119
to. Are the laws of logic
real? Do you believe they exist?

1115
01:25:34,000 --> 01:25:38,079
The laws of logic? Do I
believe that they exist? Yes? Where?

1116
01:25:38,239 --> 01:25:41,960
Okay? So where do they exist? The laws of logic? Right?

1117
01:25:42,760 --> 01:25:45,680
Oh my god, Guys like you
want to go on every time you

1118
01:25:46,479 --> 01:25:54,000
it's a fair question. You want
to talk about debate? Right, so

1119
01:25:54,560 --> 01:25:59,680
how do the laws of you're asking? Does Socratic debate method work? Okay?

1120
01:25:59,720 --> 01:26:03,359
Now, no, that requires to
explain to you like how to use

1121
01:26:03,560 --> 01:26:12,119
the Socratic method. And we're still
please enlighten us like awestin debate like Austin

1122
01:26:12,199 --> 01:26:15,479
debate is not the same as the
laws of logic. Debate presuppose the laws

1123
01:26:15,479 --> 01:26:18,880
of logic. We're asking you if
I don't know why this is hard for

1124
01:26:18,920 --> 01:26:23,560
you to concede to. You appeal
to things that are not found in nature,

1125
01:26:23,680 --> 01:26:26,920
that don't weigh or smell or you
can't see them. Right, we

1126
01:26:27,279 --> 01:26:30,560
this isn't a big this isn't controversial. You appeal to things that are not

1127
01:26:30,680 --> 01:26:38,000
found as matter? Correct, No, you don't. Okay, So where

1128
01:26:38,079 --> 01:26:44,880
is a right found as matter?
So right is a concept that arises from

1129
01:26:44,920 --> 01:26:49,119
matter? How does it arise from
matter? Is it matter? Then you're

1130
01:26:49,119 --> 01:26:55,000
not a materialist. It is a
it is. Just because something is a

1131
01:26:55,079 --> 01:27:00,079
concept doesn't mean that it's not material. Right is created from materials. Make

1132
01:27:00,119 --> 01:27:05,600
up a consonant material. Guys,
this is not even an interesting conversation,

1133
01:27:05,680 --> 01:27:12,760
and I feel bad because you don't
have an answer to you. He accused

1134
01:27:12,760 --> 01:27:15,439
me. Hold on. The thing
that got this all salur was that he

1135
01:27:15,479 --> 01:27:18,319
accused me of foisting conspiracy theories.
He doesn't even know what I talk about.

1136
01:27:18,359 --> 01:27:23,319
He just assumed that because I'm on
info Wars, I foiced all the

1137
01:27:23,359 --> 01:27:27,000
conspiracy theories. Name one thing that
I teach that's false, or one thing

1138
01:27:27,000 --> 01:27:29,600
I've said false about Mary Besmob.
You said I just made it up.

1139
01:27:29,800 --> 01:27:32,880
Can you explain it? Because you
immediately got salty over that. No justification

1140
01:27:32,960 --> 01:27:40,119
for those accusations. Okay, Well, so the question that I had for

1141
01:27:40,279 --> 01:27:45,600
Austin was, I mean, you
you accuse Jay of building a straw man

1142
01:27:45,680 --> 01:27:53,159
if I'm not mistaken, but you
then use a straw man to explain Jay's

1143
01:27:53,239 --> 01:27:58,880
view as being of wanting people not
to have butt sex and basically policing people

1144
01:27:59,239 --> 01:28:01,720
as far as they're more and things
are concerned. I guess my question for

1145
01:28:01,800 --> 01:28:06,600
you is like, how is your
view not a postmodern view? If your

1146
01:28:06,880 --> 01:28:12,800
basis, if your argument isn't based
on any kind of objective understanding of truth

1147
01:28:12,800 --> 01:28:16,560
and morality, if you are kind
of adhering to this more fluid way of

1148
01:28:16,600 --> 01:28:24,000
thinking and of having your views changed
by I guess the next smartest person in

1149
01:28:24,000 --> 01:28:27,199
the room, how is that not
most? How is that not postmodern?

1150
01:28:28,000 --> 01:28:30,920
Well? I mean, I mean
it's god man. I hope you're asking

1151
01:28:30,920 --> 01:28:38,039
that question legitimately, because postmodernism is
to suggests that there is no objective truth.

1152
01:28:38,359 --> 01:28:41,840
I do believe that there is objective
truth, but I don't necessarily claim

1153
01:28:41,880 --> 01:28:45,079
to know all of objective truth.
I don't claim to know all of the

1154
01:28:45,159 --> 01:28:50,079
answers I only know of. Actually, I think I know very little in

1155
01:28:50,119 --> 01:28:55,159
regards to all of the potential of
human knowledge. Most people know very little,

1156
01:28:55,239 --> 01:28:59,720
right, So, like the concept
of knowledge itself is, we are

1157
01:28:59,840 --> 01:29:03,520
very very limited as humans with these
meat brains of what we can actually have

1158
01:29:03,560 --> 01:29:08,399
a capacity to understand. So just
because I just because I don't know it

1159
01:29:08,479 --> 01:29:11,600
all doesn't mean that I don't think
there is an objective standard. I do.

1160
01:29:11,760 --> 01:29:15,680
And when I find those bits of
truth along the way, those very

1161
01:29:15,840 --> 01:29:20,800
rare jewels in my search for knowledge, like I reveal them, I believe

1162
01:29:21,000 --> 01:29:25,000
and and will, I'm willing to
have them challenged. I'm willing to have

1163
01:29:25,079 --> 01:29:29,119
them question. But I don't think
you wait, I don't, I don't

1164
01:29:28,920 --> 01:29:34,720
don't immediately went as soon as I
postmodernist. If you if you don't believe,

1165
01:29:35,800 --> 01:29:46,359
you like, it's not like,
it's not Christian talks over that's you

1166
01:29:46,359 --> 01:29:51,239
can you can slander me in a
moment, Chad, you it's not this

1167
01:29:51,439 --> 01:29:57,800
question. It's not theism versus postmodernism. Right, you don't have to be

1168
01:29:57,840 --> 01:30:00,520
a theist, you know, in
order to not be a postmodernist. You

1169
01:30:00,520 --> 01:30:03,880
do, right, you can you
can be You cannot be a postmodernist and

1170
01:30:03,920 --> 01:30:10,880
not necessarily believe that the objective truth
is handed down knowledge logical. There are

1171
01:30:11,000 --> 01:30:15,159
plenty of secular There are plenty of
secularists who do not accept the postmodernists a

1172
01:30:15,199 --> 01:30:17,600
fallacy? Do you even know what
a fallacy is? Like? You just

1173
01:30:17,680 --> 01:30:24,279
appealed to a mass fallacy like mass
like mass appeal? Do you know what

1174
01:30:24,319 --> 01:30:30,079
fallacies are, So he doesn't so
awesome, do you? Would you say

1175
01:30:30,079 --> 01:30:34,000
that your views as it relates to
morality and and things like that are more

1176
01:30:34,079 --> 01:30:41,560
humanist? Yes, okay, and
what is a what's a fallacy? Here?

1177
01:30:41,640 --> 01:30:44,760
Let let Chad run this line?
Let Chad run this line. Go

1178
01:30:44,760 --> 01:30:47,640
ahead, Chad, So, so
break that down if you will. So,

1179
01:30:47,640 --> 01:30:51,000
so you're you you would be more
humanist in your I guess moral worldview.

1180
01:30:51,079 --> 01:30:55,760
Yeah. I consider myself a secular
humanist in the sense that I think

1181
01:30:55,840 --> 01:31:02,119
that the concerns of humanity and of
material concerns things on this planet should be

1182
01:31:02,119 --> 01:31:08,119
the primary concern for humans and not
that which is celestial. Right, So

1183
01:31:08,159 --> 01:31:12,079
that's and and that's how I would
define you know, I wanted to immediately

1184
01:31:12,119 --> 01:31:16,079
go to the ad hominyms. Did
you want to follow up with that?

1185
01:31:16,199 --> 01:31:19,920
Chad? You're not going to answer, so he's just ignore me because you

1186
01:31:20,000 --> 01:31:25,119
went to ad hominems first. You
said you wanted to be challenged. You

1187
01:31:25,119 --> 01:31:28,479
don't want to be challenged, and
I don't. I don't roll around in

1188
01:31:28,479 --> 01:31:30,600
the mud with pigs because you both
get dirty and the pig enjoys it.

1189
01:31:31,479 --> 01:31:34,760
So you want to be challenged when
your challenge. You go to Ad HOMINYMS.

1190
01:31:34,880 --> 01:31:40,159
Why okay, So Chad, you're
not going to answer is your question?

1191
01:31:40,239 --> 01:31:43,439
Then? And I don't want to. I don't want to put words

1192
01:31:43,439 --> 01:31:50,319
on your mos enlightened. Hold on, let I want to Chad hasn't talked

1193
01:31:50,319 --> 01:31:53,640
a lot. I actually want to
see where he runs this. I want

1194
01:31:53,680 --> 01:32:00,760
to see where he runs like do
you like if postmodernism like secularism and humanism

1195
01:32:01,039 --> 01:32:11,399
are intrinsically tied to postmodernism? How
how aren't they? Well, I mean

1196
01:32:11,920 --> 01:32:15,319
an example in front of you.
Right, So I believe that there are

1197
01:32:15,399 --> 01:32:19,840
objective moral standards and that truth is
a real concept that exists, right,

1198
01:32:20,199 --> 01:32:25,840
But it's not ever changing. Now
our knowledge and our understanding of it may

1199
01:32:25,840 --> 01:32:29,399
be changing, because when I say
I think I know the truth, I

1200
01:32:29,439 --> 01:32:34,600
could be wrong and I'm willing to
change my mind if you provide evidence that

1201
01:32:34,680 --> 01:32:39,920
contradicts my beliefs and my world where
my understanding, or you provide facts that

1202
01:32:40,039 --> 01:32:45,520
contradict and you're able to effectively persuade
me. But the truth was the truth

1203
01:32:47,079 --> 01:32:53,039
even if I didn't understand it.
A postmodernist would say the truth changes or

1204
01:32:53,079 --> 01:32:57,520
I'm living my truth, and that's
not what I'm saying hold on, but

1205
01:32:57,600 --> 01:33:00,319
hold on a second. You are
saying that. And here's how, Because

1206
01:33:00,319 --> 01:33:03,680
if you're a materialist and truth and
the logic and these things are material and

1207
01:33:03,760 --> 01:33:08,840
they come from a mechanism called the
brain, then these are just kind of

1208
01:33:08,920 --> 01:33:13,279
like effects that come from a machine, right, And so those effects could

1209
01:33:13,319 --> 01:33:16,079
change. Like how could you say
one group of molecules called the truth from

1210
01:33:16,119 --> 01:33:20,119
a brain is true and another group
of molecules from another brain is false.

1211
01:33:20,399 --> 01:33:25,520
I don't know how you're gonna say
the truth is incorrect. Yeah, but

1212
01:33:25,560 --> 01:33:30,439
that appeals to that appeals to the
chemical reactions again to another brain. Right.

1213
01:33:30,479 --> 01:33:33,880
And so this is why materialism should
be rejected wholesale because when you say,

1214
01:33:34,039 --> 01:33:36,760
well, Chad just said a truth, but that just came from his

1215
01:33:36,800 --> 01:33:40,640
brain. It's just an emergent property
of a machine. And then you say,

1216
01:33:41,159 --> 01:33:44,039
well that's true for what you just
said, right, Uh, Austin,

1217
01:33:44,079 --> 01:33:45,760
you have to say, yes,
it is. How could it not

1218
01:33:45,800 --> 01:33:48,359
be? How could it not be? Well, you know, there's there's

1219
01:33:48,359 --> 01:33:51,760
a lot of complicated concepts in what
you've said, right, and and so

1220
01:33:53,239 --> 01:33:56,840
you know there's a lot there's a
lot to unpack there. But I don't

1221
01:33:56,880 --> 01:34:02,720
know that necessarily materialism is you know, requires one to believe in an unfixed

1222
01:34:03,439 --> 01:34:08,680
concept of what is true? Right
I I I actually I believe the opposite

1223
01:34:08,680 --> 01:34:15,079
of that. So I do think
that materialism and objective reality and objective truth

1224
01:34:15,520 --> 01:34:17,880
like they all exist within the same
plane or the same spere. Let's go

1225
01:34:17,920 --> 01:34:23,119
to aesthetic. Let's go to aesthetics. That's good. Uh, hey,

1226
01:34:23,199 --> 01:34:25,720
this guy is not gonna answer any
questions. There's no there's no point may

1227
01:34:25,760 --> 01:34:29,560
being being here early. So all
right, thanks, thanks, appreciate.

1228
01:34:29,920 --> 01:34:31,399
Good luck with being a single gay
man in an apartment with a lot of

1229
01:34:31,439 --> 01:34:35,119
books. Okay, well, good
luck with obsessing over gay sex. You

1230
01:34:35,199 --> 01:34:40,359
smeg muss smelling retard, see you
later. You don't even have good jokes,

1231
01:34:40,439 --> 01:34:45,039
at least if you're gonna make a
good joke. I got hopefully,

1232
01:34:45,239 --> 01:34:51,760
I got a rebel tooth that you
got tonight. A bath is an wash

1233
01:34:51,800 --> 01:34:59,000
your hair you shampooed. Drink the
Florida drink the Florida water. I don't

1234
01:34:59,000 --> 01:35:02,000
forget to run the Florida the water. Don't let the C. I don't

1235
01:35:02,039 --> 01:35:05,520
let the C. I a chip
mind control you? Anyways? Can we

1236
01:35:05,520 --> 01:35:10,840
please have a different Okay, awesome, Yeah, what is your reason for

1237
01:35:10,880 --> 01:35:12,079
saying something is more beautif