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Hello, you are welcomed and a
warm embrace a new episode of Sherezal stories.

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Today we have the special participation of
a very dear friend who is Diego

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Villa, Diego, thank you so
much for being here again accompanying us in

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Sherezade' s stories in this episode
that will talk about the titan chronos and

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how his performance as a Saturn comes
to Roman mythology. Thank you so much

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for being here, Diego, Hello, Susana and listeners, thank you so

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much for having me back here on
your podcast. It' s a pleasure

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and we did have this very important
God a little forgotten in the tint,

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but we already had the opportunity to
meet to talk a little bit about his

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Saturnian history. Chronos O crono saturno, as you want to call it So,

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a super interesting opportunity to talk about
one of the gods that are considered

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primordial of the group of primordials of
Greco- Roman mythology. This in primordial

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means that they are of the first
leities that appeared when the world was created

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from Chaos, along with the pure
night Nogea, and I think we will

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well remember a little bit about this
story of Thiodo and the origin of the

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world. No yes, then let
us begin by taking back the Greek titan

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Chronos and then go on developing us, that is, how was his arrival

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in Rome as Saturn. Then let
us return a moment to the time of

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the Titans, who were those sons
of Gea and Uranus, who were giants

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and Gea and Uranus, for we
are then returning to the primordial deities in

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ancient Greece and although Crono was the
youngest titan, the fact of rebelling against

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Uranus led him to become king and
all the sons of Uranus were imprisoned in

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the body of Gea. And to
put an end to that uncomfortable situation,

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Gea gave a sickle to Crono and
when the couple tried again to have sex,

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Crono attacked Uranus and castrated him.
And Asynchronous took control of the world

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and the universe. When Crono threw
the cut genitals, the drops of blood

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became the erynias or vengeful fury of
those who committed you against the family.

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Giants and nymphs also emerged. According
to another version of the myth, Cronos

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threw the gentals into the sea and
around them accumulated the foam that produced Aphrodite.

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Then known as Venus by the Romans, the goddess of passion. During

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the reign of Cronos, he soon
became as tyrannical as that of Uranus and

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forced the giants, including the cyclops, to return underground. And since Gea

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had warned him that one of his
sons would dethrone him, devoured them as

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soon as his royal wife was born, the wife of Cronos gave him six

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children who are eventually going to be
the Olympians and these are beast to bring

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in was ades possession and Zeus Cronos
swallowed everyone except Zeus, whom Rea replaced

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by a stone wrapped in diapers.
Zeus was then taken away to be raised

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away from his father and in the
end, with the help of the Titans,

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threw them to Cronos into the abysses
of Tartarus for a time where there

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were giants of a hundred arms destined
to watch over him. According to another

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version of the myth, Crono was
exiled on an island and there he was

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with some followers, the Greek poet
Ezíodo. Let us remember that he lived

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about the eighth century, before Christ. According to him, the first humans

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were, say, lived, came
to see Cronos and lived in a golden

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age, free from worries and fatigues. And then it is probable that Cronos

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was a worshiped deity before the arrival
of the Greeks and so, according to

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some interpretations, he had to be
dethroned in order to be able to give

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rise to the rise of Zeus and
the Olympics, who were the gods dwelling

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on Mount Olympus, as Cronos and
his brothers were believed to dwell on Mount

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Otis. Now let' s go
on with everything I have to tell us

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about this interesting immortal. All right, Susana, yes, it was necessary

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to put this story back in the
background to locate people a little bit.

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Although he is an unknown God,
he has a lot of history, a

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history or also complex, long,
long, but we have just tried to

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summarize as far as possible. And
so people don' t have much in

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their heads, but in language they
are all the time, because if we

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ask people what they relate to the
word crono, some won' t go

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much and they won' t go
any other days in time and it'

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s just time. The theme here
relevant. We have words for example,

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such as chronology in Spanish, less
in the leda in the European languages,

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which is the systematization of the organization
of information over time. We have synchrony

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when two times are in harmony,
For example, we have the chronic adjective

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when we have a condition that extends
over time we talk about chronic diseases,

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right, so let' s say
that the name Durano is present in everything.

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Not then that' s super interesting. People can also think a little

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bit about Goya and her Saturn,
devouring the children and those who take a

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little closer to Greek mythology, they
will think about Zeus' father And precisely,

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because that is the line of time
that we are going to work the

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thematic line. The name" chronos" has been a problematic name since ancient

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times. This is because of the
confusion with the word time, which is

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chronic, with the letter x or
the letter or the penultimate Greek, the

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penultimate letter of the Greek alphabet,
which is the personification of time. And,

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on the other hand, it was
time, the titan of God theogony,

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of the crops that merged very early. The two words let' s

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say they' re paronymous words,
which are words when we have a sound

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that sounds the same or they'
re very similar, but they mean two

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different things. Then let' s
also think in Spanish how to sew with

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that and sew with c it.
That would be the same case. It

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has been attempted to give etymology to
the name cros has not been possible.

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It was thought at a time that
it could come from the word kere in

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an Indo- European root of the
Indo- European languages, which means cutting.

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But there have also been other linguists
who like Herbert Rose, who says

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there is no Greek etymology, so
he has led to think that he is

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a native native god of Greece,
not of the peoples who later arrived on

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the Peninsula, which we know as
ancient Greeks. It' s basically like

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that for now with the name chronos. Yes, that seems very interesting to

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me that topic of the relationship of
crones with time, because let' s

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say originally they could be different,
but they are going to synthesize in some

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way in one, even or Robert
Graves argued that it was not simply a

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mistake, but that, because they
are going to be conceptually related and that

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is interesting time is also related as
with that idea of devouring life. True,

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it is something that does time by
devouring your children, it is devouring

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life and saying time is something that
relentlessly devours us in life. Yeah,

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I agree, too. It could
not be so much a mistake, even

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if we say that the idea that
there is a mistake is well argued.

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There because, despite being the god
of crops and agriculture, we answer what

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better way to measure time and perceive
time than through agricultural cycles. So let

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' s say there' s a
debate still not resolved. Some think that,

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indeed, how they correspond to the
same concept. Both corronos with each

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one of us are going to speak
a little bit of Greek alphabet and time,

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because we are going to take them
as a unit for in this case,

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Fortunately, Saturn' s name does
not have so many complicities. It

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' s a less troublesome name.
It has been possible to identify with the

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Latin pronoun satus, which means planting
or planting with satur which is an adjective

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in the Latin language that means full, abundant, saturated satiate. The Latin

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name is Saturnus. The first one
is pronounced a little longer. He is

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also associated with the god etrus cosotre
that the Etruscans were an older people than

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the Romans who influenced them. We
can talk a little bit about them later

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and well, and we also have
in popular culture words related to Saturn,

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for example, Saturnine. When someone
has a very gloomy, very sad character,

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he is told to have a Saturnine
character, a Saturnine personality. Or

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in Antiquity Well, already at the
beginning of the Middle Ages, alchemists spoke

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of Saturnism, a disease acquired by
excess lead. Lead, in addition,

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was Saturn metal. So, then, always starting with the names to identify

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a little bit the essence of the
gods, I think it' s the

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best way to start platoon on the
crátil also speaks of the name of crones.

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He says it means pure, immaculate, clear, relates it to the

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current of time. So, this
discussion of the name was raised since ancient

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times and we continue to take it
up again. That' s very interesting

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and let' s see that then, from time to time to Saturn there

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' s also going to be a
little change in personality, because let'

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s say, because we' re
going to go towards Rome and among the

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Romans plays a little more role,
of a little quieter, I would say

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almost like a good kingen of a
legendary territory and does not have the devouring

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force of cronos or, at least
so I perceive it as you see it.

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You well, if we ended up
a little bit like the one we

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would pretend to go to the future
to talk a little bit about the image

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of God in Italy, because after
the Titanomachia it is thought that Chrono had

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Saturn time. We' re going
to put it Chrono bar Saturn had several

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destinies. The best known is that
his son mowed him to Tartarus with the

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other titans. Although not all Titans
participated in the war. We need to

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clarify that, either I promise or
I didn' t participate. Well,

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he didn' t participate and some
others didn' t help the titans.

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Then these who remained neutral or who
helped were Hecate, Prometheus Joseano and his

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wife, Tetis Rea, of course, Metis La, who would be the

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first wife, one of the first
wives of Zeus and Nemocine, that of

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the titanide of memory. And well, the rest of Titans joined the war

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and we had Atlas as the general
of this war, the commander general Atlas

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is put as punishment to hold the
skies, a very harsh punishment and Cronos

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was sent to the Tartar chained along
with the other Titans and the Hecatonkirs,

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they were to watch. It'
s one of his versions of what happened

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to him. The other is that
he was exiled to Italy, which is

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not a new subject in Greek mythology, because many of the most relevant characters

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in Greek mythology ended up in Italy. She promotes that after her drama with

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Jason, having killed her children,
having attacked and having murdered the new Bride,

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she takes refuge in Italy and where
she is known as the goddess Angitia,

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the goddess of snakes and healing within
a village called the Marrusinos and Marches.

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Also then it is thought that Cronos
ended his days in Italy civilizing the

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inhabitants of Lazio, who at that
time are said to have lived in barbarism

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and founded a city called Saturnia.
He was received by Hanno. In addition,

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Hano is thought to have been an
originally mortal, mythical king who was

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verified. And here it has a
much more benevolent look and look. It

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is thought that a golden age has
been re- established, which we will

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later discuss on the subject of ages, myths, zinc, and because it

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is a fundamental deity for Rome,
it was not so much so for Greece.

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That' s important to talk about. But in Rome it was going

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to be quite relevant. Yeah,
that' s interesting. This is condensing

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a bit on a symbolic level the
image of time. Let' s say

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going a little bit into what would
be the archetype, deep crone psychology.

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True, and we have that he
was a kind of king, a sovereign

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who could not adapt as to the
evolution of life and society. And although

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somehow he looks like an ideal king
in a golden society, he could not

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cope with the changes that took place
and could not with the transformations. And

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then that' s an interesting topic
of what he' s going to represent

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as boss, but as with conflict, a kind of conflict with innovation and

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the meanings that it has. How
do you see the deep meaning of what

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would be the archetype of time.
Well, here we would understand that we

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go to something very old, and
it is the appearance of younger gods against

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God, ancients against the father.
Normally let' s say that the castration

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of uranus already gives us the pattern
of how this theme appears let' s

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say in history, in myths.
Basically, I want to start by talking

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a little bit like how Uranus'
castration has been seen. For as long

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as I' ve dealt with a
little bit more. The question you'

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re asking us is asking me.
For example, we have a platoon in

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the Republic that recalls the account of
castration counted by eiode and the subsequent revenge

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desires against time and says the following
are things of greater concern than the biggest

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lies are told. He says that
the issue of time and Durano is a

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matter of quite concern, but of
which they are not told. The truth

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is that ugly inventions which, even
if they were true, I do not

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think should be said lightly to unthinking
young people. Of course, this subject

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of parricide, the concern for him. That' s one of the issues

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that' s inside that deep archetype
that you' re commenting on. But

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this issue of castration is very old. It comes from other mythologies. For

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example, we have urrita Hitta mythology. We had spoken of the Hittites in

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the chapter of Cibeles, which was
this town of Anatolia and her small-

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handed neighbors, which were farther east
and ended up being assimilated. For example,

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in this there are very similar passages
and this are far older peoples than

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the Greeks. We' re talking
about the Bronze age. Then, for

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example, we had the god Kumarbi, who is the god of lightning that

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to become head of the gods,
cast Anu. The god his half of

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heaven that was his father transformed into
a bird, attacked him and cut off

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his organs, which fell to heaven
were born three gods and among them,

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the god of time that dominates over
the other two is one of those sons

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is called Teshoop Tezup, who is
also going to be Rivache son. There

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' s another thing. It'
s already from the rivalry between father and

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son, or you also assume Asimila
as a double from Kumarbi, but let

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' s assume that he' s
the son who beats a rock monster named

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Ulicumi, with the voice that originally
separated the sky from the earth. Another

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theme of theogony. Then we see, for example, here in these primordial

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myths of creation. There is always
a need to separate heaven from earth.

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That is another issue that we see
here important, not and to set in

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motion creation, in motion creation and
that time is born. Then this could

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be one of the probable origins of
the myth. Although in Egypt we also

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have parallels. For example, we
have the primordial God, Tum Ra or,

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as he is known as Rada,
the primordial reality, father of Shu

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and Tefnut and grandfather of Heav and
Nuth Heaves the earth male god. Here

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the order of the genre is reversed
a little and Nuth the sky, who

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fell deeply in love and did not
want to separate were never totally in love

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with tum disapproved of this behavior and
separated them violently, pushing boldly into heaven

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and geb Hep remained on earth,
always looking at himself. Then again the

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violent separation of heaven and earth.
Lovers could now see each other, but

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not touch each other. It does
happen And so, then, already returning

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to the subject of the father,
of a god, of the ancient gods

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and the new gods. This also
brings us to India, where the subject

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of Hindu mythology, the subject of
ancient deities that are displaced by younger gods.

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It' s very common we have
it too or new gods. Simply,

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for example, we have a varuna
that would be the representation of Uranus.

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Etymologically, the two names look very
much like the representation of heaven,

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the moral authority. It is said
that he is an inflexible god, but

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well, just also with the worshipers. He experiences a gradual loss of status

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and power and influence. First,
before Indra, the god of Ray,

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who is the counterpart in India of
what Zeus would be. And then before

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Rama, the hero god Rama of
Ramayana, who once Varuna confined to the

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seas, loses his dominion of the
sky. Before Varuna he submits to Rama

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in a passage from Ramayana and Varuna, but forgiveness. But Indra, as

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well as will lose ground of sometimes
violently, to other gods like Vishnu who

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in his avatar of Krishna confronts him
and in a struggle of power pours out.

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Then there is always this constant issue
of conflict with the father by power.

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Obviously, we' re talking about
male gods. This doesn' t

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show up. I' ve never
seen a myth. Let' s say

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goddesses have these characteristics. So let' s say that the theme of change

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can be seen reflected in many cultures, as you have said, and this

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is also a very human theme.
Obviously, we had talked about how it

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seems to me that when we were
talking about levels, we were saying the

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example of companies and that the almighty
father, he was resisting the changes,

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the changes of the children and sometimes
he was very slowing down that of coming

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natural, which is that the children
take the place of the father. So

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you' ve always been afraid of
being overthrown, of losing power, and

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this is one of the characteristics of
the human condition. I' d think

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I was very very interesting and very
nice. I always hear you say it.

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Thank you so much, thanks to
you being here. Many images do

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arise while you are speaking, but
then, going back to Crus and Saturn,

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we would see this primarily in the
image of Cronos, not so much

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in Saturn' s. True because, in fact, there are many people

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who consider or many scholars who do
not see so clearly that interpretation that has

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been made of the relationship between Cronos
and Saturn, but rather are said to

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be a late equivalence and that Saturn
would symbolize more as a kind of civilizer

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and has not so many these elements
of conflict with the father. How you

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see it. You have been thought
to say that Saturn was exiled in Italy

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or exiled in Italy, sought in
some way as a change or originally a

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very cruel deity as crones, and
it seems that he decided how to change

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his behavior a little as a more
beneficial deity. But this happened, too.

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I liked the parallel here with Medea, because Medea also went from being

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a maleficent figure in Greece and Italy, she became a benefactor of these peoples

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that I tell you that the most
Rusins and Marches worshiped her as a healer

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00:25:30.079 --> 00:25:34.400
and as a goddess who could kill
and control the snake. It seems that

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this area was surrounded by many snakes
and Medea came and helped them with this

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predicament. And although I really,
for example, have a passage of diodoros

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and asses, I don' t
know if suddenly we can read it to

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introduce the topic of Saturn a little
bit more. Then Diodoro Cronos tells us,

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as the greatest of the Titans,
he became king and made all the

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men who were his subjects change from
a still civilized barbaric way of life.

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For this reason he received great approval
and visited many regions of the inhabited land.

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He introduced the righteousness and sincerity of
the soul and so the tradition has

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come to later generations that the men
of the time of time were of good

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heart, totally innocent and blessed with
happiness. His kingdom was stronger in the

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western regions, where he really enjoyed
his greatest honor. Consequently, even until

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relatively recent times, among the Romans
called by them Saturn and also within the

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Carthaginians to whom we are going now
to speak later, possibly of gods with

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which he is assimilated. There is
one of the possible origins of Saturn time

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is that they are in origin East
and we obtained these parallels with Hittite mythology,

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because they would corroborate it. Notable
feasts are celebrated and sacrifices are celebrated

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in honor of this god and in
many places bear his name. And because

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of exceptional obedience to the laws,
no one committed injustice at any time and

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all the subjects of the crone government
lived a life of bliss in the enjoyment,

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00:27:26.599 --> 00:27:30.720
without hindrance of all the placestes.
Then, of course, in Italy

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he melted civilizer, taught agriculture the
laws, civilized the barbarians who lived in

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the area. This is the myth
of the civilizing god that we have not

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00:27:40.640 --> 00:27:49.279
only in Rome, but also let' s go to our homeland, South

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America, nothing but Colombia. In
Muisca mythology we have Chica, for example,

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who is said to have arrived in
the land of the muiscas who lived

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under the Sunday of the goddess Huitata, that Witaka is also a goddess well

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known for these places, the goddess
of unbridledness, of passion, of idleness,

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of total chaos. Bo Girl arrived, imposed civilization and good that we

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00:28:18.519 --> 00:28:22.079
say out a confrontation. We'
re not going to get into that,

286
00:28:22.720 --> 00:28:25.160
but let' s say it'
s the civilizer we sometimes forget. This

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archetype we find present in several mythologys. This is the center of why his

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00:28:32.079 --> 00:28:37.279
image is as positive in Italy as
Saturn. Not sure, it' s

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00:28:37.279 --> 00:28:41.319
very interesting. Again, everything you
say is evoking a lot of images that

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would allow us to talk a lot
about this. But there are several aspects

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00:28:47.039 --> 00:28:52.240
worth exploring. One of them is
to remember something that we all know and

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is that it is Saturn. It
is the name of a planet and those

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00:28:56.839 --> 00:29:03.799
who began with this subject of astrology
were the Sumerians and the Babylonians and for

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00:29:03.559 --> 00:29:11.039
them Saturn was the star of justice
and as of law and in some way

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that aspect is going to remain in
Rome, where we have seen that the

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00:29:19.160 --> 00:29:27.480
gods seek a little to be exemplary
in the sense of being associated with good

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00:29:27.599 --> 00:29:40.400
behavior, and this astro is also
linked symbolically speaking to fertilisation and to that

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00:29:41.599 --> 00:29:48.000
of this way, for as to
tradition, then how you see the symbol

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00:29:48.519 --> 00:29:57.880
of Saturn, both the Saturnic Chrono
Divinity that here we can see a little

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if they separate or if they continue
to be only one the term of Saturn

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in astrology, because all manners,
in Saturn Astrology it is going to be

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both concentration, contraction, fixation and
condensation of something that tends to crystallize.

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Many times in astrology it is also
associated with evil. How do you see

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00:30:30.000 --> 00:30:38.200
that association of the symbolic of Saturn
as it is to be interpreted. And

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00:30:38.319 --> 00:30:44.759
this is also connected with the interpretation
that Sumerians and Babylonians had of him in

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00:30:44.880 --> 00:30:49.480
close proximity. Let' s say
here we have other great ones of the

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00:30:49.519 --> 00:30:53.839
many dualities that appear in mythology.
One God himself can be perceived in a

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00:30:53.920 --> 00:30:59.960
very positive or very negative way,
depending on who does not say it,

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00:31:00.799 --> 00:31:04.759
under what circumstances his story is told, under what time, also with the

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Sumerians. Claro began the identification of
deities as astronomical bodies. But for example,

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00:31:11.240 --> 00:31:15.440
let us think of Juvenal, who
was one of the Roman satyrs.

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00:31:15.720 --> 00:31:22.720
Already in his work there is an
important antecedent of considering Saturn, the planet

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00:31:22.920 --> 00:31:26.839
or the celestial body as an evil
influence on life and the fate of humans.

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There is the background that remained in
fact, because, well, I

315
00:31:32.079 --> 00:31:34.839
am not an astrologer, but if
we ask a modern one, surely he

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00:31:34.880 --> 00:31:41.039
will tell us about the influence that
Saturn has, which is usually regressive,

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00:31:41.200 --> 00:31:51.440
restrictive, It is hard work,
it is problems, often the slowness of

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00:31:52.240 --> 00:31:59.880
processes. But, on the other
hand, we have the myth of the

319
00:32:00.160 --> 00:32:06.759
five ages that SiO gathers us within
his work, works and days. It

320
00:32:06.880 --> 00:32:12.039
speaks of an age of gold,
silver, bronze, heroic and iron.

321
00:32:14.960 --> 00:32:20.240
And in the Golden Age I'
m going to read a little Isidoro tells

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00:32:20.279 --> 00:32:23.200
us the following. First of all, the immortal gods who inhabit the Olympian

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00:32:23.279 --> 00:32:28.880
and made a golden race of mortal
men who lived at the time, the

324
00:32:29.359 --> 00:32:34.200
reign of crones in heaven and lived
as painless gods in the heart, free

325
00:32:34.200 --> 00:32:40.599
from work and grievances. The miserable
age did not remain upon them. His

326
00:32:40.720 --> 00:32:49.079
arms and legs never failed, they
had fun beyond all evil. When they

327
00:32:49.079 --> 00:32:52.079
died, they were taken for a
dream. They did not age these original

328
00:32:52.160 --> 00:32:58.039
human beings under the age of Gold
and always died sleeping the wonderful one.

329
00:33:00.400 --> 00:33:06.720
Everything was perfect. The land sprouted
without the need for agriculture, gave its

330
00:33:06.759 --> 00:33:09.640
fruits without problem, the honey sprouted
from the trees. This was Eden.

331
00:33:10.039 --> 00:33:15.559
Basically this reminds us a little bit
of the Bible. They lived in peace

332
00:33:15.640 --> 00:33:22.720
and quiet in the lands, the
flocks and the gods. The flocks were

333
00:33:22.759 --> 00:33:29.680
blessed by the gods. The abundance
was fully given and when these human beings

334
00:33:29.720 --> 00:33:38.519
died they went on to make leading
spirits or daimons inhabiting the kindly earth freeing

335
00:33:38.640 --> 00:33:44.720
themselves from harm to the human beings
who would come in the following ages.

336
00:33:45.480 --> 00:33:49.759
And so, we' re talking
about an idyllic world. Then there is

337
00:33:49.839 --> 00:33:54.559
talk of the silver age, which
is when Zeus takes control of the universe

338
00:33:55.519 --> 00:34:00.440
and there is a setback. There
is talk of men who, while not

339
00:34:00.480 --> 00:34:07.480
violent, were believed to be pusillanimous
because they lived in subjection, and were

340
00:34:07.640 --> 00:34:12.159
totally subjected to the will of their
mothers until the end of their lives came.

341
00:34:13.480 --> 00:34:16.519
But they say, they' re
not so violent. And then,

342
00:34:16.599 --> 00:34:21.400
let' s not say, they' re not as catastrophic as those who

343
00:34:21.400 --> 00:34:25.519
could come. Then it is spoken
after the age of bronze, the age

344
00:34:25.559 --> 00:34:31.920
of warriors, of beings who only
live by war, beings who ate very

345
00:34:31.960 --> 00:34:38.719
warlike flesh, did not stop fighting
among themselves, and it is said that

346
00:34:38.800 --> 00:34:45.400
the plague took them all. There, virtue and human situation, the human

347
00:34:45.400 --> 00:34:51.960
condition, are degrading. Then we
have an intermediary that has been thought that

348
00:34:52.000 --> 00:34:55.199
this is a devious invention, which
is the heroic age, which is like

349
00:34:55.679 --> 00:35:00.679
an attempt to correct the bad,
which I saw that the gra process that

350
00:35:00.679 --> 00:35:06.559
is taking place and it is from
the time when we have Jason' s

351
00:35:06.679 --> 00:35:12.159
acquiles to all the heroes that we
know were dying young. But with Gloria

352
00:35:12.239 --> 00:35:17.599
it is a matter of restoring again
virtue, warrior virtue and personal virtue.

353
00:35:20.559 --> 00:35:23.360
And finally, it comes to the
age of bronze forgiveness of iron, which

354
00:35:23.440 --> 00:35:28.280
is where we would meet and that
ear speaks of him already being in the

355
00:35:28.280 --> 00:35:36.000
isolation of iron. He complains enough
about the condition of this age, widespread

356
00:35:36.280 --> 00:35:46.519
corruption, totally zero, values,
injustice, total war, depravity. There

357
00:35:46.559 --> 00:35:52.760
are not enough negative adjectives to talk
about this age that is where we are

358
00:35:52.880 --> 00:36:00.000
living. This myth of the ages
is also very interesting to analyze, because

359
00:36:00.039 --> 00:36:07.760
we see that it goes from more
to less than change and movement and revolutions

360
00:36:07.880 --> 00:36:12.719
in the celestial sphere of the gods. These changes can be beneficial to them

361
00:36:12.800 --> 00:36:15.199
because, in fact, if we
do not analyze from the only divine point

362
00:36:15.559 --> 00:36:23.400
of view, then Zeus does not
represent an improvement in the condition of existence

363
00:36:23.480 --> 00:36:28.000
that the gods have. There is
no longer a god like Uranus or Chronos

364
00:36:28.079 --> 00:36:35.800
who is tyrannizing everything, devouring everything
and even the dam justice is restored,

365
00:36:36.599 --> 00:36:39.559
for let it be said that he
is a more benevolent ruler than one wants.

366
00:36:42.000 --> 00:36:45.960
But these changes already in the human
sphere, yes, for them,

367
00:36:46.000 --> 00:36:52.079
are good for the gods, but
for us they are not detrimental to the

368
00:36:52.159 --> 00:36:55.920
human condition. This is an Eastern
myth. It also has origins in India.

369
00:36:57.679 --> 00:37:01.960
In India we have the myths of
the yugas at four ages. Also

370
00:37:02.039 --> 00:37:07.440
the decline of virtue. This myth
is found in the Vagabatguita, one of

371
00:37:07.480 --> 00:37:12.639
the fundamental texts of Hinduism, and
it goes beyond speaking, not of five,

372
00:37:12.920 --> 00:37:19.679
but of four ages. We have
the crypt or Satiayuga, which corresponds

373
00:37:19.679 --> 00:37:24.519
to the Golden Age, where we
have justice and virtue. Like maximum banners.

374
00:37:24.639 --> 00:37:28.400
There is no sadness, there is
no pride, there is no deception.

375
00:37:28.400 --> 00:37:31.000
The laws should not be written,
because everyone complied with them without anyone

376
00:37:31.000 --> 00:37:36.760
telling them to do so. A
perfect parallel with the Golden Age, a

377
00:37:36.800 --> 00:37:44.000
paradise another eden as we would say
later, would come the tretra or ruse

378
00:37:44.079 --> 00:37:46.119
the silver one. It would correspond
to the silver one. The duties are

379
00:37:46.159 --> 00:37:51.039
no longer fulfilled spontaneously and sacrifices begin
to be made. Here comes religion.

380
00:37:52.199 --> 00:37:54.599
In the golden ages there is no
religion, because I forgot to comment on

381
00:37:54.679 --> 00:38:01.559
one thing, and it is thought
that they live in total synchrony and in

382
00:38:01.559 --> 00:38:07.079
sharing the same space both gods and
men. This is very important. Then,

383
00:38:07.119 --> 00:38:14.280
in this silver photographer, duties are
no longer performed spontaneously, sacrifices must

384
00:38:15.000 --> 00:38:21.159
be made. Religion is established to
put some ceremonies in order, but let

385
00:38:21.199 --> 00:38:27.760
' s say that still the Awata
virtue, as we would say in colloquial

386
00:38:28.360 --> 00:38:32.480
terms, would then come the daha
for the bronze one. People get even

387
00:38:32.599 --> 00:38:38.960
more unbalanced. Sickness appears. There
are no diseases in the other two eras

388
00:38:39.000 --> 00:38:45.880
of distress. Also appears the desire
say in the tradition of India and from

389
00:38:45.960 --> 00:38:52.559
the appearance of the desire, also
appear the ascetic practices, practice to practice

390
00:38:52.559 --> 00:38:58.280
austerity to counteract this element of the
desire that arrives until today. If we

391
00:38:58.360 --> 00:39:04.519
think of those people who get involved
with yoga, for example, and finally

392
00:39:04.519 --> 00:39:09.960
we have the Kali Yuga, which
is the iron age. Again, the

393
00:39:10.079 --> 00:39:15.960
Hindus also consider that we are in
iron. They say it began in about

394
00:39:16.039 --> 00:39:22.320
three thousand one hundred and twenty BC. Then the scholars of the Vagabatite have

395
00:39:22.400 --> 00:39:27.320
made calculations. It' s very
interesting, but well, it' s

396
00:39:27.400 --> 00:39:30.440
astronomical numbers that we' re not
going to mention here. It' s

397
00:39:30.559 --> 00:39:34.400
the current iron one. Ignorance in
wars of the sight of greed. Corruption

398
00:39:34.480 --> 00:39:40.400
is total. Love is scarce.
The sixth is separated from love. Selfishness

399
00:39:40.440 --> 00:39:45.559
is the order of the day.
There is no justice, but the good

400
00:39:45.559 --> 00:39:52.000
thing is that it is the shortest
according to scholars. Then we have some

401
00:39:52.119 --> 00:39:59.679
comfort left. And well, then
it was necessary to talk a little bit

402
00:39:59.719 --> 00:40:02.280
about this to talk about this fluctuating
image that you have in turn Cronos.

403
00:40:04.039 --> 00:40:10.599
It' s very interesting. Of
course, then, as if recapitulating a

404
00:40:10.719 --> 00:40:16.639
little bit and synthesizing the themes of
Saturn Chronos we have talked about, then

405
00:40:16.719 --> 00:40:22.360
we have seen their relationship with time. We have talked about Uranus' castration,

406
00:40:22.760 --> 00:40:30.599
true, and his references since the
theogony of cannibalism that he practiced with

407
00:40:30.719 --> 00:40:37.480
his children precisely septum with Zeus and, as you mentioned, the theme of

408
00:40:37.480 --> 00:40:45.800
the ages. Now we could go
a little deeper into the issue of fighting

409
00:40:45.159 --> 00:40:53.039
with Zeus. We had already mentioned
it a little, but then specifically what

410
00:40:53.159 --> 00:41:02.199
was the titans' war against the
Olympics. Yes, this is very important.

411
00:41:06.039 --> 00:41:10.320
We have or well, although I
wanted to introduce here there is another

412
00:41:10.400 --> 00:41:19.119
version of the story that is in
Diodoro sículo' s Historical Library gives us

413
00:41:19.159 --> 00:41:23.400
a slightly different version, because most
of the later authors have been that they

414
00:41:23.480 --> 00:41:29.400
touched on this subject simply took the
same story. They added some minor things,

415
00:41:29.480 --> 00:41:32.960
some minor details, but it was
the same story, basically without great

416
00:41:32.960 --> 00:41:38.920
variations. Titanomachia, Castration, Sorry
castration titanomachia. Let' s say,

417
00:41:40.599 --> 00:41:45.639
the conflict remains unchanged, but Diodorus
gives us a different perspective. It tells

418
00:41:45.760 --> 00:41:50.360
us about the birth of Zeos and
the way he became king. There'

419
00:41:50.440 --> 00:41:54.960
s no agreement, he says.
Some say he came to the throne after

420
00:41:55.000 --> 00:42:00.039
Cronos passed from among men to the
company of the gods, not beating his

421
00:42:00.039 --> 00:42:05.119
father with violence, but in a
manner prescribed by custom and with righteousness,

422
00:42:05.719 --> 00:42:12.039
having been judged. Zeus, worthy
of this honor, Dad is talking to

423
00:42:12.119 --> 00:42:16.800
us about something completely different, like
a handover to power negotiated without violence.

424
00:42:19.639 --> 00:42:23.199
But others tell a myth that says
the following. Cronos was given an oracle

425
00:42:23.480 --> 00:42:29.159
about the birth of Zeus, which
said that the son to be born would

426
00:42:30.000 --> 00:42:35.480
take his reign from him by force. As a result, Cronos over and

427
00:42:35.559 --> 00:42:39.559
over eliminated the children she begot but
restricken as she was, and yet decided

428
00:42:39.599 --> 00:42:46.199
to change her husband' s purpose. When you were diced, he hid

429
00:42:46.199 --> 00:42:52.920
it. And then, because we
had talked a little bit about this,

430
00:42:52.039 --> 00:42:57.559
we had no longer analysed in more
detail in the history of the cybels what

431
00:42:57.639 --> 00:43:01.000
was the concealment of these children.
It does an interesting thing. Before I

432
00:43:01.000 --> 00:43:06.800
forget in the aphrodite american anthem,
this one appears as the oldest and youngest

433
00:43:06.840 --> 00:43:10.960
of the daughters. Why do they
tell us this, because as they were

434
00:43:12.039 --> 00:43:15.280
born, Estia is the greatest.
She was the first to be eaten,

435
00:43:15.280 --> 00:43:22.239
but when Cronos takes the drinker prepared
by Metis, who makes the children vomit,

436
00:43:22.840 --> 00:43:28.639
vomits them in the reverse order.
Then this ended up being the last

437
00:43:28.760 --> 00:43:31.840
one to come out of his father' s body. That' s why

438
00:43:31.880 --> 00:43:37.400
they talk about the older and younger
at the same time calima coyleiodos also say

439
00:43:37.480 --> 00:43:45.880
that coivantes are children of Cronos.
The coribants remember are these gods of genius

440
00:43:45.880 --> 00:43:52.800
who helped Rea with the colliding of
her shields and swords so that the child

441
00:43:52.920 --> 00:43:59.119
Zeus could cry without problems. Another
of the sons of Cronos is Chiron.

442
00:44:01.000 --> 00:44:02.920
I didn' t want to forget
about this. Son of Cronos and Oceanity

443
00:44:04.000 --> 00:44:09.920
Filira. At nightfall, I'
m in the Argonauts. The Argonauts passed

444
00:44:09.920 --> 00:44:15.119
through the island of Filira and said
the following. This was where Crono deceived

445
00:44:15.639 --> 00:44:22.280
his consort, Rea, lay with
Filira in the days when he ruled the

446
00:44:22.320 --> 00:44:27.159
titans and Zeus was still an unspeakable
child, but Crono and Filira were caught

447
00:44:28.079 --> 00:44:34.639
in the act by the goddess rea. Crono jumped out of bed and,

448
00:44:34.800 --> 00:44:39.000
taking the form of a cemental,
a long- haired horse escaped as the

449
00:44:39.119 --> 00:44:45.800
embarrassed nymph left the place and took
the furry mountains there, there he saw

450
00:44:45.840 --> 00:44:52.760
the monstrous Chiron Okaron Greek, half
horse, half divine. But let'

451
00:44:52.840 --> 00:44:59.000
s remember that Quiron, I think
you had it here as a subject in

452
00:44:59.039 --> 00:45:05.719
the podcast, because magnificent, loved
by the heroes and gods of great wisdom,

453
00:45:06.320 --> 00:45:10.360
genius artist. Pre Let' s
say a sage of the time professor.

454
00:45:10.719 --> 00:45:15.960
In addition, the figure of the
teacher, of the tutor of the

455
00:45:15.079 --> 00:45:21.840
one- way Bobos, as the
Greeks would say, is established in the

456
00:45:21.840 --> 00:45:24.280
place. Not then, because we
have another version that no longer mention,

457
00:45:24.440 --> 00:45:29.199
Diodoro' s version. There is
also a version that there was no war.

458
00:45:29.360 --> 00:45:32.960
This is also interesting. It is
very interesting, because it is a

459
00:45:34.320 --> 00:45:39.000
completely different version, true, because
the other one sustains the succession in war.

460
00:45:39.079 --> 00:45:45.880
And here we' re talking about
something peaceful that also hardly anyone knows

461
00:45:45.920 --> 00:45:50.800
clearly ah well, and talking a
little bit about Metis and Medvers We have

462
00:45:50.800 --> 00:45:53.000
Metis, which was one of the
titanies that supported Rea and then Zeus.

463
00:45:53.960 --> 00:45:58.719
She was the one who prepared the
baby drinker they gave Saturn to Cronos.

464
00:46:00.039 --> 00:46:07.760
The drinker is said to have poppy
seeds, among other ingredients. It is

465
00:46:08.159 --> 00:46:13.440
told we follow in the same account. When Zeus released his brothers with Metis

466
00:46:13.480 --> 00:46:20.239
' drinker, Cronos fainted. Zeus
wanted to attack him with the same voice

467
00:46:20.280 --> 00:46:23.719
with which he had castrated Uranus,
but could not lift it with his strength.

468
00:46:24.599 --> 00:46:29.000
He had to retire to plan his
war, and it' s a

469
00:46:29.239 --> 00:46:31.719
ten- year war where there'
s no winner. They reached a draw,

470
00:46:34.559 --> 00:46:40.800
but Gea thought to intervene and help
Zeus and told him to put on

471
00:46:40.840 --> 00:46:45.320
his side the cyclops that were the
forgers of lightning. At that time,

472
00:46:45.440 --> 00:46:50.920
Zus did not have access to the
lightning and the hecatons threw that were other

473
00:46:51.000 --> 00:46:55.079
sons of hers, both sons of
hers, who are beings with a hundred

474
00:46:55.119 --> 00:47:00.639
arms and the help of these beings
gave him the victory Zeus, for we

475
00:47:00.679 --> 00:47:06.480
had said that not all the Titans
participated and because those who did not participate

476
00:47:06.559 --> 00:47:13.199
feron rewarded in their entirety. There
are reasons why they do not participate or

477
00:47:13.320 --> 00:47:16.440
at once help Zeus, for example, I mean, there are no thetis

478
00:47:16.480 --> 00:47:22.239
that were the Titani, the titans
of the water, of the ocean,

479
00:47:23.039 --> 00:47:28.159
lived very afflicted. It is said
that they lived very afflicted under the reign

480
00:47:28.159 --> 00:47:32.639
of Cronos, because Cronos, returning
to the subject of a little more benevolent

481
00:47:32.639 --> 00:47:37.599
use, took over the dominion of
the universe. All of him. He

482
00:47:37.679 --> 00:47:40.039
did not make a division of power
with his celebrities, as Zeus did,

483
00:47:40.480 --> 00:47:43.599
who according to his sons, well, I stay in heaven. He'

484
00:47:43.599 --> 00:47:45.679
s going to stay with the underworld, and they' re going to keep

485
00:47:45.679 --> 00:47:51.880
the sea. Cronos dominated everything,
absolutely everything. He was very jealous.

486
00:47:52.000 --> 00:47:55.400
He was constantly watching his brothers.
I was very upset with Ocean, for

487
00:47:55.599 --> 00:48:00.840
example, I thought I could overthrow
it. And it' s one of

488
00:48:00.920 --> 00:48:07.079
the reasons why, because there are
some titans they didn' t decide to

489
00:48:07.079 --> 00:48:14.480
accompany Cromos. There is a description
that Pausanias, the geographer historian, geographer

490
00:48:14.719 --> 00:48:20.000
and tells us of one of the
Olympic Games of origin, related to the

491
00:48:20.079 --> 00:48:23.639
struggle of Zeus and Cronos tells us
the following. Now, some say that

492
00:48:23.679 --> 00:48:29.199
Zeus fought here in Olympia with Cronos
himself for the throne, while others say

493
00:48:29.280 --> 00:48:37.519
that the Games were held in honor
of his victory over Chronos. And already

494
00:48:37.639 --> 00:48:44.920
in these Games celebrating the victory over
Crono. It is said that Ares fought

495
00:48:45.000 --> 00:48:49.599
with Apollo and Apollo defeated him in
boxing and that Hermes also competed with Apollo

496
00:48:49.639 --> 00:48:53.199
in the races and that Apollo,
again Logan beat him. And because Pausanias

497
00:48:53.679 --> 00:48:59.039
tells us, the Olympic Games date
back to an earlier era, to the

498
00:48:59.039 --> 00:49:05.079
human square, and the story is
that Chronos and Zeu showered there. In

499
00:49:05.119 --> 00:49:12.119
that scenario, Kilo also told us
a little bit about the dethronement of Chronos.

500
00:49:12.760 --> 00:49:16.199
He tells us that he had cursed
his son so that he would suffer

501
00:49:16.320 --> 00:49:21.880
the same fate as he did.
However, he promised promptly warned Zeus that

502
00:49:22.559 --> 00:49:28.159
he should have avoided the Union with
the nereid Tetis, Achilles' mother,

503
00:49:28.639 --> 00:49:32.119
since any of her children would be
superior to her father. And there'

504
00:49:32.239 --> 00:49:39.719
s also the warning that Mettis is
going to give a more powerful son than

505
00:49:39.719 --> 00:49:45.239
he is. Here' s a
kind of double again, as Zeus takes

506
00:49:45.280 --> 00:49:51.760
the role of Cronos, we say
they are different, but in some things

507
00:49:51.880 --> 00:49:59.000
he liked some more his behavior and
devours Metis and begins to gesturing inside his

508
00:49:59.039 --> 00:50:04.480
body of this girl who is going
to be athenea coming out of his armed

509
00:50:04.559 --> 00:50:09.320
head and giving a war cry.
Not then, because I wanted to mention

510
00:50:09.360 --> 00:50:13.320
a little bit of these issues.
That' s very interesting. Not that

511
00:50:13.480 --> 00:50:17.960
that Zeus, anyway, is going
to have elements of time, despite fighting

512
00:50:19.280 --> 00:50:23.639
him in quotation marks, despite not
wanting to be like him, certain patterns

513
00:50:23.719 --> 00:50:34.199
are going to be repeated. That
is very interesting to follow then that idea,

514
00:50:35.679 --> 00:50:39.280
because we talk about castration, cannibalism, the ages, the struggle with

515
00:50:39.400 --> 00:50:46.880
Zeus. There is something interesting that
I would love you to explore that is

516
00:50:47.000 --> 00:50:52.960
the curse to Zeus that happens with
that relationship between time and use and what

517
00:50:53.000 --> 00:50:58.199
consequences it will have for Zeus,
which are also reflected in mythology, because

518
00:50:58.199 --> 00:51:02.559
we had already talked a little bit
about the consequences, because the main consequence

519
00:51:02.679 --> 00:51:08.800
is that the Golden Age and the
human condition are ended. It begins to

520
00:51:08.800 --> 00:51:15.480
decay, for how interesting it is
also the fear that Zeus will maintain for

521
00:51:16.159 --> 00:51:23.519
being overthrown. Yeah, so that' s why he' s gonna marry

522
00:51:23.559 --> 00:51:30.920
Achilles' mom, Tetis to Peleo, because he' s afraid he'

523
00:51:30.039 --> 00:51:35.079
s gonna be dethroned, like he
dethroned his father, how he dethroned his

524
00:51:35.239 --> 00:51:43.119
grandfather. So, like that fear
is going to remain latent in these beings

525
00:51:43.199 --> 00:51:47.320
of such powerful appearance and controllers of
the universe. Yeah, it' s

526
00:51:47.400 --> 00:51:52.320
gonna be dormant, because this is
an eternal theme. Mythology speaks basically is

527
00:51:52.360 --> 00:51:59.440
important, not because it tells us
the literal truths of human existence, but

528
00:51:59.559 --> 00:52:02.760
because, through a symbolic language,
it speaks to us of subjects that are

529
00:52:02.840 --> 00:52:08.280
eternal that are and that are present
throughout time, through cultures, and that

530
00:52:08.320 --> 00:52:15.039
is no longer relevant to losing power, even within the immortals, For the

531
00:52:15.119 --> 00:52:21.320
immortal it will always be alive.
But that idea is to be displaced.

532
00:52:21.679 --> 00:52:25.639
Not then. That' s an
ancient, anthrabic fear, that is,

533
00:52:25.880 --> 00:52:30.760
it' s been from the very
beginning. We see it in these older

534
00:52:30.760 --> 00:52:37.679
mythologies, the Hittite, the Hurrite, the Indian. Also, however,

535
00:52:37.039 --> 00:52:44.039
because again Saturn Cronos is going to
have a relatively happy ending, we can

536
00:52:44.079 --> 00:52:50.920
say it according to some, pindaro
or, for example, pindaro and sado

537
00:52:51.000 --> 00:52:55.480
Cronos was released later by Zeus.
Salzeus decides to release him and forgive him.

538
00:52:57.039 --> 00:52:59.639
This is another one. I would
also like to stress that there are

539
00:52:59.679 --> 00:53:07.639
other versions in which there is a
kinder resolution of all these issues. He

540
00:53:07.719 --> 00:53:12.880
is appointed King of the islands of
the blessed or the fortunate islands, or

541
00:53:13.440 --> 00:53:20.719
is also known as the Elisha.
And it is very interesting because they were

542
00:53:20.840 --> 00:53:28.360
located to these islands where the Canary
Islands could currently be in the Atlantic or

543
00:53:28.400 --> 00:53:31.079
in the Azores. The works are
islands that are part of Portugal and that

544
00:53:31.119 --> 00:53:36.199
are also in the Atlantic, in
the extreme West, of enterprise and notion

545
00:53:36.199 --> 00:53:39.159
of the extreme West, as paradise
and heroes were going there. It also

546
00:53:39.199 --> 00:53:44.719
began to dwell in paradise and it
was thought, therefore, that crones here

547
00:53:44.719 --> 00:53:49.960
had established a new age of plutarc
gold. He tells us of another destination

548
00:53:50.000 --> 00:53:53.880
that is very picturesque, according to
which there is a sacred island near Britain

549
00:53:54.320 --> 00:54:00.840
that is now. It is Britain
that were the furthest ends of the known

550
00:54:00.920 --> 00:54:07.199
world, where chronos sleeps with his
followers around him and I will briaré or

551
00:54:07.239 --> 00:54:13.159
one of the Montaguardian hecaton kiros.
That' s the way it is It

552
00:54:13.159 --> 00:54:15.440
' s very interesting. So there' s like two main ideas. One

553
00:54:15.559 --> 00:54:22.239
that would be in the Tatar understanding
or say in the underworld, but on

554
00:54:22.360 --> 00:54:29.400
the island of the blessed let'
s say something equivalent, like the fields

555
00:54:29.400 --> 00:54:35.360
of choice. Basically, and on
the other hand, in this less known

556
00:54:35.559 --> 00:54:39.119
story, which is the one that
would be on an island of today'

557
00:54:39.239 --> 00:54:45.760
s, in Brittany and which,
then, will be with its followers.

558
00:54:45.840 --> 00:54:54.239
So these are like quieter versions of
what' s going to happen to this

559
00:54:54.719 --> 00:54:59.360
character. Yeah, well, before
we go through, let' s say

560
00:54:59.400 --> 00:55:00.840
there' s going to be a
bit of a Rome thing going on to

561
00:55:00.840 --> 00:55:10.840
do a parenthesis. Although Crono did
not have so much, he did not

562
00:55:10.880 --> 00:55:17.440
receive so much worship compared to Saturn. If you had celebrations in Athens,

563
00:55:17.599 --> 00:55:23.880
in ours. In the Attic Pausanias
tells us that inside the enclosure of the

564
00:55:23.920 --> 00:55:28.760
sanctuary of Olympic seus, in Athens
there is a Bronze ceus, a statue

565
00:55:28.840 --> 00:55:34.880
of Bronze greetings, a temple of
irrea crones and also the cronias are celebrated

566
00:55:34.920 --> 00:55:43.000
in Athens since 17 December, just
that day for now. And these chronicles

567
00:55:43.159 --> 00:55:47.400
are the forerunners of the Saturnals that
also begin on December 17. Then we

568
00:55:47.480 --> 00:55:52.679
have Olympia, south of Greece.
Olympias is one of the few places in

569
00:55:52.760 --> 00:56:00.880
Greece where Saturn cronos has the greatest
relevance. It is said that on Mount

570
00:56:00.079 --> 00:56:06.559
Chronoius, as I said, we
are still talking to Pausanias. Mount Chronius,

571
00:56:07.159 --> 00:56:09.440
as I have said, extends for
the parallel to the terrace at the

572
00:56:09.480 --> 00:56:14.360
Sanctuary of Olympia, inÉis,
on top of the mountain of the Bazilai,

573
00:56:14.639 --> 00:56:20.000
the kings, as it is called. There a sacrifice is made to

574
00:56:20.079 --> 00:56:24.440
crones in the spring equinox, the
beginning of the new year, in the

575
00:56:24.480 --> 00:56:30.159
month called the foes or, the
month of the Deer. This is interesting

576
00:56:30.320 --> 00:56:35.159
because in Rome the Saturnals will not
coincide with the Spring equinox, but with

577
00:56:35.280 --> 00:56:37.719
the winter equinox. We' ll
talk a little bit about that, then,

578
00:56:37.960 --> 00:56:43.639
if you want to later. Finally, there is another geographical reference about

579
00:56:43.639 --> 00:56:49.320
the cult of cronos, very interesting
in Spain, in the south of Spain,

580
00:56:49.719 --> 00:56:53.519
in Gades, in that ancient time
Cadiz was known as gades with tea

581
00:56:53.639 --> 00:56:59.599
and tells us strabon. The following
worked on the geographer. The city of

582
00:56:59.719 --> 00:57:04.280
gal is located in the western part
of the island. Cadiz is an island

583
00:57:04.920 --> 00:57:08.320
on the southern coast of Spain and
next to it, at the end of

584
00:57:08.400 --> 00:57:14.159
the island and near the Islet,
is the temple of Cronos, but the

585
00:57:14.199 --> 00:57:16.159
temple of Heracles is located on the
other side. Looking east, then Here

586
00:57:16.840 --> 00:57:24.639
we have some examples prior to the
worships that the Romans gave to God,

587
00:57:25.400 --> 00:57:31.760
of course because the Romans would already
be the Saturnal ones that were also celebrated

588
00:57:31.920 --> 00:57:40.800
between December 17 and 24. And
then let' s see that, while

589
00:57:40.880 --> 00:57:45.800
there are differences, there is also
going to be a continuity relationship on the

590
00:57:46.000 --> 00:57:52.719
subject of cult between time and Saturn. Yes, here I wanted to do

591
00:57:52.719 --> 00:57:54.360
a parenthesis that I didn' t
want to forget. We wanted to.

592
00:57:54.440 --> 00:57:59.480
There' s been a question that
you' ve constantly asked me, like

593
00:57:59.559 --> 00:58:05.760
that last time as well as because
in Italy it did have so much relevance

594
00:58:06.199 --> 00:58:07.920
and this image so positive and in
Greece it wasn' t. And then

595
00:58:08.079 --> 00:58:13.519
it takes a while. I want
to make a historical parenthesis about the history

596
00:58:13.679 --> 00:58:19.639
of Rome basically and how they assimilated
the gods of other peoples. Let'

597
00:58:19.639 --> 00:58:23.920
s say let' s put him
in this situation. Rome, as a

598
00:58:23.920 --> 00:58:31.400
people, perceives in itself a problem
of origins and there are experts much more

599
00:58:31.440 --> 00:58:37.119
versed than I have who have explained
it in a better way and some also

600
00:58:37.119 --> 00:58:39.360
extend it. There' s a
problem of originality that you said. The

601
00:58:39.559 --> 00:58:45.199
Romans did not copy all the Greeks
and had nothing original. Well, this

602
00:58:45.320 --> 00:58:51.960
is all true. We know they
had their own customs and their own culture.

603
00:58:52.000 --> 00:58:55.480
They even had myths of their own, very some, not many,

604
00:58:57.039 --> 00:59:00.400
but they were in certain ways similar
to what a Greek myth could do.

605
00:59:00.000 --> 00:59:05.199
For example, we have the myth
of Vertumn Pomona. Many saca in Colombia

606
00:59:05.199 --> 00:59:08.800
sound like Pomona because of this shop
that existed many years ago, in which

607
00:59:08.840 --> 00:59:15.400
these two agricultural deities, because they
have a go and go. Vertum isn

608
00:59:15.760 --> 00:59:19.639
' t in love. She doesn' t want to. In the end,

609
00:59:19.880 --> 00:59:22.679
there' s a trick to get
the truth out of him. And

610
00:59:22.840 --> 00:59:25.159
they end up, then, in
one of the most idyllic loves of Roman

611
00:59:27.239 --> 00:59:31.559
mythology and let us say that there
are myths as properly said. But in

612
00:59:31.599 --> 00:59:39.039
Rome rites are more important than myths. The exact procedure in the ceremonies,

613
00:59:39.199 --> 00:59:44.639
they were very pragmatic. Much has
he said that more than the Greeks and

614
00:59:44.760 --> 00:59:51.280
myths simply performed a function of setting
an example of conduct. Let us say

615
00:59:51.360 --> 00:59:57.000
that there was not that more spiritual
background that the Greeks gave to the two

616
00:59:57.000 --> 01:00:00.280
myths. But back to the subject
of Rome' s origins, let me

617
01:00:00.360 --> 01:00:04.239
go. This is a problem that
is present, since the first days of

618
01:00:04.239 --> 01:00:07.800
the Republic and because it became a
priority as time passed and came to the

619
01:00:07.840 --> 01:00:15.360
time of the Empire. Because we
say there is a problem, because we

620
01:00:15.440 --> 01:00:21.400
have Titus Livius, who is the
Roman historian by Antonomasia. He tells us

621
01:00:22.559 --> 01:00:25.039
that the city was founded in seven
hundred and fifty- three before Christ.

622
01:00:28.400 --> 01:00:34.400
But there is a big problem here
historiographical, and that is that all the

623
01:00:34.519 --> 01:00:38.760
great majority say with ninety- five
percent of the Latin authors who are not

624
01:00:38.920 --> 01:00:44.280
historians, also who tell us about
Rome, are from the first century before

625
01:00:44.360 --> 01:00:47.960
the Cross, and there is only
one now that escapes me the name,

626
01:00:49.119 --> 01:00:53.320
which is from the Ters, of
the third century. There' s no

627
01:00:53.320 --> 01:00:58.199
more. Then there is a gra
there is a great void, because,

628
01:00:59.360 --> 01:01:04.519
if we trust this date at least
five centuries that are at least like in

629
01:01:04.559 --> 01:01:10.960
the dark, not but well,
through the archaeology of research that have been

630
01:01:12.000 --> 01:01:16.559
done, because we know that Roman
was originally a village, a village of

631
01:01:16.639 --> 01:01:24.119
shepherds who were having to settle on
a swampy, very difficult, very difficult

632
01:01:24.119 --> 01:01:32.920
terrain. They were surrounded by towns
like the Etruscans, which were clearly much

633
01:01:32.960 --> 01:01:40.320
more advanced and civilized than the early
Romans. They were surrounded by warlike villages

634
01:01:40.400 --> 01:01:45.400
like the Volskos, the Umbrios.
Moreover, in the south there were already

635
01:01:45.440 --> 01:01:51.599
the settlements of the Greek machine,
which corresponds to this period of history,

636
01:01:52.079 --> 01:01:55.119
which is the Greek colonization between the
8th and 6th centuries before Christ, for

637
01:01:55.719 --> 01:02:02.440
the Greeks had to go out to
colonize outside the Peloponnese because the conditions of

638
01:02:02.480 --> 01:02:10.639
theélad are not known to him, because they were rather difficult very steep

639
01:02:10.639 --> 01:02:16.599
landscapes, and this was a state
policy. The cities, the cops took

640
01:02:16.679 --> 01:02:21.960
this as a project in which they
were involved, they selected the population.

641
01:02:22.719 --> 01:02:28.599
This had to go with guidelines,
well, and they came to many places

642
01:02:28.840 --> 01:02:32.239
as far as Ukraine as Spain,
there were Greek colonies and the colonies of

643
01:02:32.320 --> 01:02:38.079
southern Italy and Sicily were called the
Magna Greece. There comes the main Greek

644
01:02:38.199 --> 01:02:45.320
influence that the Romans have. But
for the Romans, what was important was

645
01:02:45.320 --> 01:02:51.880
not to find the real origin of
their people, but to find satisfactory ones.

646
01:02:52.159 --> 01:02:55.599
And what are those origins, for
you have already spoken it the Trojan

647
01:02:55.679 --> 01:03:04.719
War the victors who were the Greeks
and the defeated Trojans, that for the

648
01:03:04.800 --> 01:03:10.679
Romans it was very convenient to take
this version. Of us are the children

649
01:03:10.679 --> 01:03:15.440
of the defeated Trojans. They beat
us once, but we' re going

650
01:03:15.480 --> 01:03:21.880
to conquer the world. In the
future we will have our second chance and

651
01:03:22.239 --> 01:03:29.239
that is the center as of this
problem of the origins that we speak of

652
01:03:29.239 --> 01:03:36.199
Rome, because there is how we
legitimize the authority to conquer the world.

653
01:03:36.519 --> 01:03:42.920
That is the crux of this issue, for seeking a link with peoples of

654
01:03:43.000 --> 01:03:49.800
great historical prestige, this is a
problem that most peoples have. It'

655
01:03:49.840 --> 01:03:55.159
s not just Roman. I want
to clarify it because because ancient peoples,

656
01:03:55.599 --> 01:04:02.440
ancients who are Sumerians, are the
Egyptians. We have the civilizations of India,

657
01:04:02.519 --> 01:04:05.960
the Indus Valley, Jarapa, two
major cities, Jarapa and Moja in

658
01:04:05.960 --> 01:04:13.480
Joadaro and perhaps China. There are
four very few villages, since the aotars

659
01:04:13.480 --> 01:04:18.840
of history are direct heirs to one
of those four traditions. Let' s

660
01:04:18.880 --> 01:04:24.400
say then, of course, they' re not the only ones who had

661
01:04:24.519 --> 01:04:30.719
that problem, but for them it
did become a pretty big constant. Then,

662
01:04:30.880 --> 01:04:35.280
solving this is looking for a link
with a people of great historical prestige

663
01:04:35.320 --> 01:04:42.239
and which is the people who chose
him, for it was the Greeks that

664
01:04:42.639 --> 01:04:45.800
fascinated them the most. On the
other hand, there is a fascination with

665
01:04:45.800 --> 01:04:49.559
all the Greeks, but at the
same time the relationship is ambivalent, because

666
01:04:49.719 --> 01:04:56.960
there are times when the Romans,
as they perceive themselves to be very much

667
01:04:56.960 --> 01:05:00.280
superior by the military subject, because
they conquered them also. But, on

668
01:05:00.360 --> 01:05:03.480
the other hand, because the Roman
education was that practically the education, especially

669
01:05:03.480 --> 01:05:11.159
of men, of men had to
be Greek. And one then in this

670
01:05:11.199 --> 01:05:16.760
about education, because religion enters,
religion as a way of linking itself to

671
01:05:16.760 --> 01:05:21.880
that oldest people of a longer tradition, because, of course, the Romans

672
01:05:23.440 --> 01:05:29.239
really arrived, because for us it
seems to us that history has been a

673
01:05:29.280 --> 01:05:31.239
long time, but that it has
been a long time. But the Romans

674
01:05:31.280 --> 01:05:40.519
were really newcomers in history, a
very late town. We are talking about

675
01:05:40.599 --> 01:05:46.159
seven hundred and fifty before Christ.
The Greeks had already had. If we

676
01:05:45.559 --> 01:05:50.119
put together all the archaic, dark, classical, and more periods, the

677
01:05:50.239 --> 01:05:55.119
Mycenaean and Cretan world, which is
the world of Mycenaeans and Cretents, which

678
01:05:55.119 --> 01:06:00.199
were the basis upon which we become
the culture we consider ancient Greece. So,

679
01:06:00.280 --> 01:06:02.039
we put all that together, that' s 3, 000 years.

680
01:06:03.119 --> 01:06:11.079
Then of course in front of this, because the Romans say no I cannot

681
01:06:11.360 --> 01:06:15.400
be to me. Don' t
tell me that I rule a shepherd where

682
01:06:15.719 --> 01:06:18.119
you see a swamp, because,
because we were born to conquer the world,

683
01:06:18.760 --> 01:06:23.239
We were already warriors from the beginning
and that' s why the Trojan

684
01:06:23.599 --> 01:06:27.480
war is so interesting, so important. It was spoken good historically. There

685
01:06:27.519 --> 01:06:31.199
is talk of a sack, of
a first Celtic plunder, when Rome was

686
01:06:31.280 --> 01:06:36.559
just a village, and it seems
that this left them with quite a trauma.

687
01:06:38.239 --> 01:06:42.079
Romes will suffer several lootings during its
history. There will not be many,

688
01:06:42.159 --> 01:06:45.960
but they will be, let'
s say present, for in fact,

689
01:06:45.119 --> 01:06:50.760
the end of the Empire ends with
plundering Also then, because I did

690
01:06:50.880 --> 01:06:55.599
not want to let this issue pass, but let' s say that Rome

691
01:06:55.599 --> 01:06:58.719
later goes other peoples. Then,
when the Empire falls, history follows its

692
01:06:58.760 --> 01:07:02.719
must come, for example, Constantinople
will be considered the second Rome and by

693
01:07:03.519 --> 01:07:11.519
the fifteenth century the Italians, the
Russians will think that Moscow will be the

694
01:07:11.639 --> 01:07:14.599
Third Rome, they will be the
heirs of that which for them would already

695
01:07:14.639 --> 01:07:19.000
be that great Roman people repeat the
pattern if you see how to search for

696
01:07:19.079 --> 01:07:24.559
origins in something greater than one to
justify, for it is to justify that

697
01:07:24.639 --> 01:07:32.360
desire to gain power in the world. Nazi Germany also did so at the

698
01:07:32.400 --> 01:07:36.960
time, not with the Romans,
but with the Greeks, because they said

699
01:07:38.719 --> 01:07:43.440
good in the Italians Mussolinia are already
identifying themselves with the Romans. Ri Mussolini

700
01:07:43.519 --> 01:07:47.320
also did the thing of identifying himself
with Third Rome and Nazi Germany, because

701
01:07:47.440 --> 01:07:55.119
with whom he identified they had to
look and because it seemed to them that

702
01:07:55.159 --> 01:08:03.320
the Dorios were the most suitable people, these blond mellow warriors that appear in

703
01:08:03.440 --> 01:08:09.119
the history of Greece over there in
the archaic epoch and between the dark,

704
01:08:10.320 --> 01:08:15.519
the archaic epoch the times. Let' s say more primitive of Greece,

705
01:08:15.359 --> 01:08:21.760
let' s say America also has
a little this, this predicament. Think

706
01:08:21.800 --> 01:08:30.000
of the doctrine of manifest destiny God
has chosen us to leave the odd,

707
01:08:30.760 --> 01:08:34.720
corrupt England, now. We are
Puritans, Calvinists, we are of the

708
01:08:34.760 --> 01:08:41.479
power to choose from God to expand
on this new land that is this North

709
01:08:41.479 --> 01:08:46.279
America to the west. And so
we have this idea to finish, because

710
01:08:46.399 --> 01:08:53.079
the stories that people tell themselves matter
a lot and religion and it plays a

711
01:08:53.159 --> 01:09:00.159
determining role and let' s say
that the Romans are going to be very

712
01:09:00.520 --> 01:09:08.600
smart in taking good Greek mythology.
Let' s say the deities that are

713
01:09:08.680 --> 01:09:12.520
not very appreciated or that have a
very positive vision for us. On the

714
01:09:12.560 --> 01:09:15.159
part of the Greeks or who have
been a little relegated. They' re

715
01:09:15.159 --> 01:09:19.960
going to take them, they'
re going to take them and they'

716
01:09:19.960 --> 01:09:23.880
re going to exalt them a lot. So Saturn is the most paradigmatic case.

717
01:09:24.920 --> 01:09:29.239
But the other case that you have
already explored much more extensively here is

718
01:09:29.279 --> 01:09:32.800
that of Vesta que estia, for
let us say that we have a very

719
01:09:32.920 --> 01:09:39.039
modest place within the Greeks, within
the Greek peoples, but here, because

720
01:09:39.439 --> 01:09:47.239
honor is maximum. Not then is
this way of communicating with the past what

721
01:09:47.239 --> 01:09:51.199
I wanted to reinvent here. And
that' s why, because we talked

722
01:09:51.279 --> 01:09:58.399
a little bit about because we could
explain it more details were longer, but

723
01:09:58.479 --> 01:10:03.079
a little bit of why there is
this change of identity in Saturn. It

724
01:10:03.479 --> 01:10:10.600
' s exciting to hear you say
it all the time. Thank you and

725
01:10:10.640 --> 01:10:17.880
I love another let' s say
rounding all this, it is interesting to

726
01:10:19.560 --> 01:10:29.359
note that the great enemies of Rome, the Carthaginians, also adapted their way

727
01:10:29.359 --> 01:10:33.600
to Saturn. True, it was
like a sort of African Saturn, one

728
01:10:33.640 --> 01:10:42.600
of its vouchers in this territory.
Then the figure of Saturn will also be

729
01:10:43.399 --> 01:10:51.960
syncretized with the Phoenician Baal and with
moloc. True and they even told him

730
01:10:53.079 --> 01:10:59.399
human sacrifices, evoking a little that
memory of the clock devouring his children.

731
01:11:00.159 --> 01:11:08.479
Then they offered them to them.
Then it is interesting how it transcends the

732
01:11:08.600 --> 01:11:14.920
borders of the Greek and the Roman
to do something of the Mediterranean, not

733
01:11:14.960 --> 01:11:19.680
only before the Greek culture, but
parallel, because it was in the area

734
01:11:19.680 --> 01:11:26.720
of Carthage. Then they made sacrifices
to them, for children’ s humans,

735
01:11:27.119 --> 01:11:32.079
those who were accompanied by flutes,
by drums that made such a noise

736
01:11:32.119 --> 01:11:35.880
that the child’ s cries could
not be heard. Then we see that

737
01:11:35.960 --> 01:11:45.920
there are many facets, many reinterpretations
in different cultures and that returning to Rome

738
01:11:45.960 --> 01:11:49.199
Saturn, then, according to what
you had said, that I find very

739
01:11:49.239 --> 01:11:56.279
interesting the subject of the West and
the fact that the temple to Saturn was

740
01:11:56.319 --> 01:12:02.399
on the western side of the Roman
forum, because where the public thesaurus was

741
01:12:02.560 --> 01:12:14.960
true, So it is something that
I find very interesting. The many nuances

742
01:12:15.239 --> 01:12:19.600
and the representation he will have in
Rome, already as an old man,

743
01:12:20.680 --> 01:12:27.640
curved by the weight of the years, which has a certain scythe to point

744
01:12:28.159 --> 01:12:30.479
out that he presides over time.
And this connects us back to what you

745
01:12:30.520 --> 01:12:35.800
were saying at the beginning. The
scythe, the relationship with the sowing with

746
01:12:35.840 --> 01:12:42.479
the seasons, but in turn,
over time, in some monuments will be

747
01:12:42.600 --> 01:12:45.199
represented with a veil, perhaps because
the time, because it is impenetrable.

748
01:12:48.359 --> 01:12:56.960
Then we see how on a symbolic
level it is all over the Mediterranean and

749
01:12:57.079 --> 01:13:05.119
how it will have different adaptations,
interpretations according to the region and that in

750
01:13:05.119 --> 01:13:10.640
Rome it will have, therefore,
a very pleasant force to close the issue

751
01:13:10.760 --> 01:13:15.119
of the oriental deities that are associated
with Saturnic Crono, since yes, of

752
01:13:15.119 --> 01:13:20.039
course, Crono was identified by the
Greeks with the Semitic god of time,

753
01:13:20.239 --> 01:13:25.640
he Holamo, he to whom the
eternal time was told in Greek was written

754
01:13:25.840 --> 01:13:31.680
to Paulomos and since this god received
sacrifices from children who emphasized, say,

755
01:13:31.880 --> 01:13:38.399
the connection with cronos in the Greek
mind by the deboration of his children.

756
01:13:38.600 --> 01:13:42.479
Then, associated, with this sacrifice
of children, with these oriental deities,

757
01:13:43.239 --> 01:13:50.560
amloc cabal ham with the cannibalism of
ceos with their own children. That cannibalism

758
01:13:50.760 --> 01:13:55.239
we have forgotten to comment on.
It has also been taken as a metaphor

759
01:13:55.399 --> 01:14:00.880
of the time that all the Greeks
take by returning a little bit quickly to

760
01:14:01.560 --> 01:14:09.560
the Greek porpoises came into contact with
these eastern deities, for let us remember

761
01:14:09.800 --> 01:14:13.279
that the Greeks had contact with the
Phoenicians and took their alphabet from the Phoenicians.

762
01:14:13.479 --> 01:14:16.880
So, yes, for the first
few years they happened to the dark

763
01:14:17.039 --> 01:14:18.760
age, let' s say already
in the Ark and we' re talking.

764
01:14:18.800 --> 01:14:21.920
So, then, obviously, by
taking its use alphabet and coming into

765
01:14:21.960 --> 01:14:29.520
contact with this culture, they possibly
took this God as a reference for what

766
01:14:29.560 --> 01:14:33.960
would later be time, although there
is also another idea, and that time

767
01:14:34.439 --> 01:14:39.760
is really a deity that was already
from the beginning in Greece. It is

768
01:14:39.880 --> 01:14:46.239
said that it is a Velaga deity, the pelasgos would be the native inhabitants

769
01:14:46.239 --> 01:14:50.399
of Greece, who would be,
therefore, from the dawn of time and

770
01:14:50.479 --> 01:14:58.039
because they had another mythology that would
correspond more with the titans, but with

771
01:14:58.039 --> 01:15:01.199
the Olympics. And well, like
to close the relationship with other deities a

772
01:15:01.199 --> 01:15:04.520
little bit. And yes, exactly, Saturn' s temple was on the

773
01:15:05.399 --> 01:15:11.239
Roman forum. There the public treasure
was kept in the Arium era and there

774
01:15:11.319 --> 01:15:15.319
' s an idea that it also
served as a sort of notary of the

775
01:15:15.319 --> 01:15:23.560
time. It is said that the
Libris Actorum or the records of all kinds

776
01:15:23.680 --> 01:15:29.800
of events were registered there, the
birth, marriage, divorce and death records

777
01:15:29.840 --> 01:15:32.920
were kept in the temple of Saturn. Then it was a very important place

778
01:15:33.039 --> 01:15:36.560
for the Romans and I don'
t know if you want us to start

779
01:15:36.560 --> 01:15:41.000
talking a little bit more like Saturnalia. It was depth. Yeah, exactly

780
01:15:41.119 --> 01:15:46.159
that. That was going to tell
you how to close down that we talked

781
01:15:45.600 --> 01:15:50.600
a little bit about Saturnals, those
feasts in honor of Saturn, which,

782
01:15:50.920 --> 01:15:59.520
as we had said, were between
December 17th and December 24th and how to

783
01:15:59.560 --> 01:16:03.479
say what that was like. Originally
they lasted one day, but Octavius Augustus,

784
01:16:03.720 --> 01:16:12.960
the first Roman emperor, ended up
extending them for three days and then

785
01:16:13.039 --> 01:16:18.359
Caligula increases another fourth day, as
well as that certain festive pleasure in which

786
01:16:18.479 --> 01:16:23.399
the masters' power over slaves is
suspended, which will have as antecedent what

787
01:16:23.560 --> 01:16:32.960
we understand by carnivals and a space
of freedom. So, yes, it

788
01:16:33.039 --> 01:16:41.119
would be very interesting for us to
conclude with the festive tone of the Saturnalias.

789
01:16:41.199 --> 01:16:44.880
Yes, Yes, Then, because
we have the dates were from 17

790
01:16:44.920 --> 01:16:48.680
to 23 December each year, during
the winter solstice lime It would be a

791
01:16:48.680 --> 01:16:56.199
little useful to explain what this is
about the winter solstice to prepare to those

792
01:16:56.199 --> 01:17:00.800
who live here in Colombia, this
sounds very foreign to us and because we

793
01:17:00.920 --> 01:17:08.840
are engaged in seasons properly said and
always our day darkens at about six o

794
01:17:08.840 --> 01:17:11.399
' clock in the afternoon. There
is no variation in that, but in

795
01:17:11.439 --> 01:17:15.000
the northern hemisphere, in the southern
hemisphere, this is very different. The

796
01:17:15.159 --> 01:17:19.760
days are provided or extended depending on
the season. If we are approaching summer,

797
01:17:20.239 --> 01:17:24.680
the days are longer and, on
the contrary, we are seeing towards

798
01:17:24.720 --> 01:17:35.720
autumn winter, the days of light
hours are smaller. Then we have the

799
01:17:35.760 --> 01:17:40.560
season of winter solstice. It is
between the 21st and the 22nd of December,

800
01:17:41.479 --> 01:17:45.159
at the time when there is less
light and in this time there are

801
01:17:45.239 --> 01:17:50.159
celebrations like the Saturnalias, but not
the only one. The Europeans of the

802
01:17:50.319 --> 01:17:55.920
North will have one that is called
the yul or jol It is also that

803
01:17:56.039 --> 01:18:00.840
of the Germanic Scandinavian area and that
have in common a little the same.

804
01:18:01.119 --> 01:18:11.720
There are jolgorio, there are agricultural
rounds, dances a lot of fire,

805
01:18:11.880 --> 01:18:16.960
because from the 25th of December it
is when the sun returns or it will

806
01:18:16.960 --> 01:18:18.640
start to be more, it will
be more present. That' s why

807
01:18:18.760 --> 01:18:23.319
the othornalia goes up to twenty-
three, twenty- four years old there

808
01:18:23.319 --> 01:18:26.800
' s like a kind of rest. And the twenty- fifth of December

809
01:18:26.920 --> 01:18:30.840
is the celebration of the invicrus sun
that I think this has also been spoken

810
01:18:30.920 --> 01:18:38.840
about on other occasions, which is
when the return of the sun is celebrated

811
01:18:38.840 --> 01:18:42.760
then, but well, focusing on
the Saturnals, we have that there.

812
01:18:42.960 --> 01:18:46.760
This is what is called an investment
ritual in anthropology. What' s an

813
01:18:46.760 --> 01:18:53.279
investment ritual. It is a kind
of resource that societies have to alleviate the

814
01:18:54.279 --> 01:19:00.760
social tensions that occur throughout the year. Here we have the reversal of social

815
01:19:00.760 --> 01:19:08.960
roles. It was the most popular
celebration of the year. Many authors have

816
01:19:09.000 --> 01:19:13.000
said it was the happiest moment of
the year. Catulo said it was the

817
01:19:13.079 --> 01:19:18.279
happiest moment of the year. Then
we have an author already of the period

818
01:19:18.479 --> 01:19:23.800
of the old afternoon, already in
the last endings of Rome, who is

819
01:19:23.840 --> 01:19:27.479
macrobio, who writes a text that
is called Saturnales and tells us a little

820
01:19:27.479 --> 01:19:33.279
about the nature of these feasts and
always remembering that the Saturnales was a wonderful

821
01:19:33.279 --> 01:19:42.359
moment. She' s the happiest. Indeed, it is thought that the

822
01:19:42.479 --> 01:19:48.279
Romans intended to revive the Golden Age
of Saturn with this celebration. Because there

823
01:19:48.359 --> 01:19:55.680
' s this idea. This again
takes to myrce de Liad that all the

824
01:19:56.039 --> 01:20:00.600
time there is an original time,
that has been degraded with that of coming,

825
01:20:01.439 --> 01:20:10.880
with the passage of time, worth
the redundancy and that it is necessary

826
01:20:10.960 --> 01:20:18.159
to do a rite or ceremony to
purify. Let' s say the year

827
01:20:18.199 --> 01:20:26.279
and be able to return to that
initial time, where everything was perfect,

828
01:20:27.000 --> 01:20:31.600
let' s say where nothing was
defiled. So this is basically the nature

829
01:20:31.640 --> 01:20:39.920
of Saturnalia. It is thought that
say it was a predecessor of Christmas and

830
01:20:40.000 --> 01:20:44.720
in fact, it does make a
lot of sense by the date, by

831
01:20:44.720 --> 01:20:47.520
the festive character. In the Saturnals
gifts were given and we have the reversal

832
01:20:47.560 --> 01:20:51.600
of the roles of slave master.
Slaves could say do almost what they wanted

833
01:20:51.720 --> 01:21:00.800
and masters took the place of slaves. The food was abundant, all the

834
01:21:00.920 --> 01:21:08.119
schools were closed. There were no
obligations to work. It was to recreate

835
01:21:08.199 --> 01:21:13.600
the golden age, basically where everyone
lived in harmony. They decorated the houses

836
01:21:13.840 --> 01:21:19.119
with vegetation, as well as we
see at Christmas that we put allusive decoration,

837
01:21:19.880 --> 01:21:24.239
like mapinos, vegetables. Well,
in Rome we had this, too.

838
01:21:24.640 --> 01:21:30.000
The fir was placed on a special
tree for this celebration. Already people

839
01:21:30.079 --> 01:21:34.680
think that the tree at Christmas is
only an influence. Let' s say

840
01:21:34.680 --> 01:21:39.079
Europeans. In the north, the
Anglo- Saxons. Of course, there

841
01:21:39.119 --> 01:21:42.079
was a tree in yours, too, but the Romans also had it.

842
01:21:42.279 --> 01:21:47.479
So let' s say they are, let' s say parties that are

843
01:21:47.560 --> 01:21:54.840
very similar between them, because the
motivation to celebrate them is the same and

844
01:21:54.840 --> 01:21:59.199
they are related to the winter solstice
and the winter harvest and the arrival,

845
01:21:59.640 --> 01:22:02.159
when waiting, the arrival of the
sun that was so important in agricultural societies,

846
01:22:02.439 --> 01:22:05.079
which we do not manage to size
what it is. That because we

847
01:22:05.199 --> 01:22:11.000
are already in another type of industrial
service society, let' s say in

848
01:22:11.039 --> 01:22:15.039
our homes, but in well,
in societies that were dependent 100 percent on

849
01:22:15.199 --> 01:22:20.960
the countryside, the relationship with the
elements of nature and the seasons was very

850
01:22:21.239 --> 01:22:26.399
important for the VI by the playing, the, the survival. And then,

851
01:22:26.439 --> 01:22:29.880
for this is the origin of all
these ceremonies. It' s not

852
01:22:29.880 --> 01:22:33.720
about saying ay is that as foolish
as you think the sun if they don

853
01:22:33.840 --> 01:22:38.920
' t celebrate, that' s
not going to come out that there is,

854
01:22:39.039 --> 01:22:43.279
there isn' t, We don' t have to analyze it from

855
01:22:43.359 --> 01:22:45.000
our eyes, but have the humility
to retire a little bit and see the

856
01:22:45.000 --> 01:22:48.640
context. Not good. Another important
feature that links it to Carnival is that

857
01:22:48.720 --> 01:22:56.399
the Saturnals were presided over by a
king who represented Saturn and was called Saturnaly

858
01:22:56.479 --> 01:23:01.880
yous Prinket was the leader of the
Saturnals and this may sound similar to the

859
01:23:01.960 --> 01:23:10.199
Carnival of Barranquilla, for example.
Other carnivals where there is a Momo king,

860
01:23:11.199 --> 01:23:16.479
for example. He was not associated
as the lord of anarchy. He

861
01:23:16.520 --> 01:23:20.319
was selected from among the most humble
members of the house, that is,

862
01:23:20.640 --> 01:23:24.359
each house had its kingdom. He
was one for all of Rome, but

863
01:23:24.399 --> 01:23:29.279
each enclosure had its own king of
disgovernment. As he was also called.

864
01:23:30.880 --> 01:23:35.439
The clothes that citizens wore were very
informal. It was known as a synthesis.

865
01:23:36.039 --> 01:23:41.039
The word synthesis as it was simple. The place of the robe of

866
01:23:41.119 --> 01:23:45.039
a lifetime, games were made jokes. This seems very interesting to me,

867
01:23:45.560 --> 01:23:49.159
because we do not even know if
all that celebration, but we had Innocent

868
01:23:49.199 --> 01:23:56.840
Day during this time of late December
when jokes are indeed made. This comes

869
01:23:56.960 --> 01:24:03.960
here, I was already here I
also don' t know if you have

870
01:24:03.960 --> 01:24:08.800
to pant any notation for me.
I find it exciting to hear you as

871
01:24:09.399 --> 01:24:16.159
I have told you all along,
and I do find it very interesting that

872
01:24:17.079 --> 01:24:23.439
you mention the Roman tree as part
of this cult that existed in the Saturnalias,

873
01:24:24.079 --> 01:24:30.920
the theme as from the end of
the time, the association that exists

874
01:24:30.079 --> 01:24:38.319
with Christmas and its festive character,
as well as with the carnivals that took

875
01:24:38.920 --> 01:24:45.600
place, as there are references under
medieval, true and that continue until our

876
01:24:45.720 --> 01:24:51.520
days and in some way are more
or less in the same season. So,

877
01:24:51.760 --> 01:25:02.279
if you wanted to tell me how
to leave a message about Saturna and

878
01:25:02.640 --> 01:25:08.920
the Saturnalias for the listeners to take
away. What would be like that phrase

879
01:25:09.479 --> 01:25:16.159
that would synthesize as the memory we
wanted to leave Saturn. Well before the

880
01:25:16.199 --> 01:25:25.159
final message, Christianity, like many
other things, could not suppress. He

881
01:25:25.199 --> 01:25:30.920
could not suppress this celebration of pagan
origin. Then, in time, already

882
01:25:30.960 --> 01:25:34.239
for the Middle Ages, this celebration
was known as the Brumals and much later

883
01:25:34.239 --> 01:25:44.319
it was known as Christmas. It
was more intelligent to take the pagan element

884
01:25:44.359 --> 01:25:50.800
that was already there and to blend
it into the Christian so that people could

885
01:25:50.920 --> 01:25:57.039
better introduce Christianity to the people.
The birth of Jesus Azooste was also at

886
01:25:57.039 --> 01:26:00.600
this time. But I think that
is perhaps another subject, for another agenda.

887
01:26:01.199 --> 01:26:06.560
It' s a long thing.
It could be explored later but yes,

888
01:26:06.720 --> 01:26:11.720
the origin of Christmas is here practically
both in the Yule, this Germanic

889
01:26:12.159 --> 01:26:17.520
Norse as well as in the Roman
Saturnals. And so, well, our

890
01:26:18.159 --> 01:26:23.520
celebrations, because they have not disappeared
in a certain way, in a way,

891
01:26:23.720 --> 01:26:27.600
with Christmas we continue to remember a
little bit Saturn and the Golden Age.

892
01:26:29.079 --> 01:26:31.920
That' s why we have a
vacation. That' s why nobody

893
01:26:31.960 --> 01:26:36.079
wants to fight at Christmas. The
idea is that we are all in harmony,

894
01:26:38.520 --> 01:26:44.039
because unconsciously we are returning to a
golden age. Not then, for

895
01:26:44.119 --> 01:26:50.000
each time remember and celebrate Christmas,
for we can think that Saturn and the

896
01:26:50.039 --> 01:26:55.239
Golden Age have attained a certain immortality
through us. That' s milky.

897
01:26:55.439 --> 01:27:02.119
I love it, I love it, thank you, thank you, Diego

898
01:27:02.399 --> 01:27:13.119
who makes you so exciting that so
beautiful way to rescue this character, sometimes

899
01:27:13.439 --> 01:27:20.079
forgotten that it is time and also
known as Saturn. Thank you so much

900
01:27:20.159 --> 01:27:25.479
and I hope you' ll be
back very soon in Sherezan' s accounts.

901
01:27:26.199 --> 01:27:30.359
Of course I will When you invite
me there, I' ll be

902
01:27:30.359 --> 01:27:45.359
there or I' ll have a
hug. Thank you.