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Hi everyone. This story next story
we're going to cover comes from the Religion

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News Service. It was written by
Jack Jenkins, and it talks about a

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group of more than thirty Catholic Democrats
in the US House of Representatives who unveiled

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a new statement in principles last week
reaffirming their support for abortion rights and expanding

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on a similar letter that they had
sent back two years ago from through the

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American Catholic Bishop. So it seems
like a pretty big move for people in

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our government. But I'd like to
see what SR has to say about it.

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Totally. Totally. I think,
you know, at the very least

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we should take we should take a
quick second to just say round of applause,

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like you hang on, hang on, Phoebe, You'll have your time,

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You'll have your time. I think
this is one of those moments where

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even though it feels to me as
if like, hey, congratulations, you

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finally figured out that slavery's not a
good thing, Like wow, it's took

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you long enough, you know,
but this is still good in my eyes

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for a lot of different I think
oftentimes on the non religious or secular side,

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we are too quick to cut off
the individuals on the religious side who

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agree with us in so many things, and I think this isn't this is

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an opportunity for us to capitalize us
right. One reason I say that is

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they reference a poll from twenty twenty
two from the Public Religion Research Institute that

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shows sixty one percent of Hispanic Catholics, sixty two percent of White Catholics,

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and seventy one percent of Catholics of
color all say abortion should be legal in

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all or most cases. That's huge. I think, so, yeah,

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Phoebe, why do you why do
you disagree? Where do I stop?

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You have people who follow a religion
that he's run by the head of state

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of another country, making laws in
another country. That is a problem to

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begin with. A man who is
elected by a secretive enclaven colored smoke out

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of a chimney, giving you his
rantings on a Sunday morning in Saint Peter's

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Square, going oh, yes,
look at all this, And these people

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are now going, yes, we
still believe that, but we now also

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disagree on that. This is the
open face of hypocrisy within Catholicism. These

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Catholic donkey party residents. I don't
trust these people. I don't like these

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people. And I don't want them
making laws that affect me. These people

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are the problem. Yes, they
have decided that, for once in their

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life, they are going to realize
that humanity has something that isn't coming out

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of the backside of a papal head
dress. But guess what. We shouldn't

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be congratulating these people for doing the
basics. Oh good, you didn't stab

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me today. I'm not going to
cheer you for not stabbing me today.

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You would have done it yesterday.
Ah you didn't do it today. Oh,

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how wonderful for you. These people
actually doing the bay six we should

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just be going these are the basis. Could we get some movement on actual

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socialt issues that will last far longer
than the pole numbers which have turned to

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dusk. Who won the West and
who lost the South? Whether the Nasdaq

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is up or the Footsie is down? Who gives up monkeys about all these

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things? The social issues will last
longer. Nobody knows the polls that Abraham

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Lincoln was looking at when he decided
that he was going to sign the Emancipation

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Doctorate Declaration. But the Emancipation Declaration
is still enforced, and that social issue

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will last far longer. Than this
bare faced nonsensical Graham to try and go,

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well, we're actually, you know, not that bad as human beings.

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Yeah that Helena so as son that
was formerly Catholic. I have seen

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the church go through many iterations over
the time, and one of the major

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reasons I left church was the sex
abuse scandal that happened. Remember that happened

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twenty years ago? Remember that?
Yeah, remember still happening today. I'm

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still having Now that's twenty years old. Now, okay, so what's older

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than that. We just found out
about her twenty years now years old.

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Yeah, well, you know,
all this, all this dust. But

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the thing that's so frustrating is everybody's
recognizing this for what this is. Like,

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if you have a brain in your
head, you know that this is

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the people in the pew, Because, as we keep talking about on the

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show, people are leaving and they
have to be and they're may like,

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oh you know what, Oh,
there's this feminism thing happening. Oh oh,

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there's a big reaction from all the
people in the United States when you

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know, Robust's awake got turned over. Oh no, people are now starting

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to getting scared. They're scared in
their fancy boots, and they're going to

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see people tweeping out of the churches, especially again younger and younger people.

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And also people are deciding not to
have children. They're already making these decisions.

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So they're just like, well,
you know where we're a little slow

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on the up keep, but here
we are now, you know. And

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I just but this is nothing.
This is a nothing burger. Like when

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they say they'd being gay, you
shouldn't be criminalized the same crap. You

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know. It's I've been trying to
keep up at the time, trying to

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be progressive whatever that means, but
still hold on to those old timey Catholic

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values. So I don't find this
appealing. I just see it as another

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paragraph and like, I just don't
this, This is not This isn't coming

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from a genuine place of learning.
This comes from fear. And I can

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smell it and I know it.
I know, I know misogyny really really

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well, and I know when I
see it just to appeal to people just

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same. Actually, it looks it
looks like I might be the only one

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that's that's positive about But what do
you think, Kelly, Well, I

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was cynical too when I read it. Not quite as much as Phoebe.

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But I had some problems with it. And you know what, well,

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my first thought was, who cares? Who really cares? The cat the

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church don't care what they did.
The Pope is not quaking in his bed,

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hiding under their covers because these thirty
democrats signed a freaking piece of paper,

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wasn't it, Richard Jilliver, there
was looking underneath the pope's covers.

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We can send them over there to
check out and just check it out to

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make sure. But I mean anti
abortion and anti freedom advocates, they don't

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care. They are all Republicans anyway. They don't give a shit what these

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Democrats have to say. They could
care less with these COMMI freedom hateum democrats

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have to say, So who is
this really for? Who is it for?

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It's for their constituents back home,
so that they can say, hey,

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look I did something without actually doing
anything. You know, I'm off

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for stepping up and supporting these worthwhile
causes. But if you're gonna put your

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energy into something useful, do something
useful. That's what that was my cynicism

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in this. I just don't I
just look at it as just a baseless

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symbolic thing. SR. You want
to you want to bring some positism back

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to it. Yeah, I'll I'll
give some thoughts and then I can let

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Phoebe slam us back down again.
All right, So I got a little

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bit more, I think when when
I first read this, um, I

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think I took it a little bit
more charitably than than the rest of y'all

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did. I did first one,
not first, but go ahead. Sorry.

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So, when when I saw this
statement, as I have seen similar

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statements in the past, UM,
my belief was that this was for nobody

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but the thirty individuals who signed it. This is this is a true,

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sincere statement that these individuals actually believed. I don't think this was a ploy,

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because if it was a ploy,
it seems like the worst way to

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do it in my eyes. That
doesn't mean that it isn't. It just

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seems to me that the way that
they're doing it here is literally the exact

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same thing that has been done for
decades. Um. So I don't see

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this as being a way to try
and keep people in the church. I

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also don't see this as a way
exactly to sway the religion. This seems

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to me just thirty individuals who genuinely
believed things and wanted to put it out

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there, and that's what you do
as a pub official. It's literally your

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whole job, So not doing that
would be disingenuous in opinion. But the

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other thing I would add that I
see the positives here is that, unfortunately

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or fortunately however you know folks feel
about it, your in group has more

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sway than your out and all of
us here would be more likely to listen

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to somebody who's on our side on
an issue that we disagree on, rather

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than somebody from the other side who
we already clearly disagree on. So funny

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enough, just in case people don't
know, there are literally millions of registered

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independence in this country, millions of
registered individuals who vote every election but do

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not have hardcore stances on thing.
I guarantee in that group there is somebody

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out there who is both religious and
against abortion who see something like this and

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does get value out of it,
And I think that pulls more people to

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the side of secular humanism. I
do think that. But yeah, Phoebe,

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tell me why I'm wrong. Straight
up, you don't get it.

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Don't get it. You have not
lived in a country which has an established

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religion having people sitting in its legislature. There are twenty four members of the

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Church of England who have seats in
the House of Lords and they are Head

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of the Church of England. Is
the head of state of this country.

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You don't get how dangerous these people
are by having what is effectively an existential

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individual guiding what they're doing. These
people believe that the head of state of

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the world's smallest country makes declarations that
they should be following. That's how dangerous

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this is. Well, they're actually
going against the Pope, though, aren't

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they. Yeah, But that's how
dangerous is though, because it's now bare

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faced hypocrisy. You can't have in
the one hand, I follow Catholicism and

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therefore I accept the Pope and then
go but I disagree with the Pope on

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this, on this, and this. It's not a pick and choose.

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Is not pick and mixed down at
Walworth's. You take Catholicism and you take

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the Pope with it. You don't
come around and go, well, I'll

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take the Pope on this. I'll
take the Pope on this. I believe

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that I'm eating Jesus. I believe
I'm drinking Jesus. I believe in this,

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and I believe in that we have
it. In the UK. We

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have twenty four people who are religious
bishops, actual bishops in our legislature.

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At least we're open about it.
In America you have people who are not

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open about these things. To head, any person who just self describes himself

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as an Anglican is taking direction from
the King of England on how they should

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run their life. Think about it. You have the melding of religion and

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the state in so many religions,
two big ones the King of England on

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the Pope, and if you follow
either of those religions and you're a legislator

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in another country, you are effectively
taking your cues from the head of state

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of another country on how to make
laws in your own country. Yeah.

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I think I think those are all
very good points. I would like to

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make clear though. I think there's
a really big difference from saying we don't

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want religion and government and we don't
want religious in government. One is attacking

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the ideology and one is attacking and
I think the first one is the way

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to go, not the second one. Um. But Helen, what what

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do you think on this? We
thee and I've been going back and forth

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a little of this, so,
UM, I don't I don't think there's

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an easy answer to this. But
um, because I'm seeing both sides,

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because like you're both the angels and
devils on my shoulders. So there's this

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like combat going on. But and
I'm saying like, well, that's let's

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go in now. And um,
I'm but whenever I see stuff like this,

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I just feel like there's, um, you know, a rat in

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the kitchen, you know. Um
that And that's the things that I get

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so worried about because it has the
face of being progressive. It has a

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face that maybe we'll, you know, we can't come to an agreement.

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But as Phode pointed out, the
all the bishops, the cardinals and everybody

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take word from the pope. He
is the word of God and he is

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God's representative honors. So because he
is the representative of an invisible sky daddy,

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Um, people have to listen to
him. And we know from Rome

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having a wild history with cardinals and
popes and you know them having in being

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in charge of state and then that
falling apart and then they had to create

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their own damn country. So for
me, I'm I just see this as

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just another performance Pete. You know, yes, they might be since here.

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You know, I don't know the
hearts and hearts and minds every every

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person, you know, just my
own, but I don't like it makes

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it's making me go on. I
can see how this can turn bad.

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This can turn bad. And and
this is the thing that I'm also gonnacerned

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about we were talking about before,
is like these are this like he gets

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this campaign, you know, this
type of stuff. It is to wrap

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religion and this nice fluffy blanket,
you know. But the thing is that

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the ship leaking out the blanket.
But they're trying, you know, they're

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trying to keep it in. And
I'm just sitting here going okay, great,

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but you know, for hundreds of
years you allowed people, people in

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charge of children to hurt. You
don't get a free paciting. I'm sorry,

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I'm done. I can't. I
just can't. You know, I

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understand, but I can't. But
like for me, I'm like, why

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you sell part of an organization that
can done child And that's something I that's

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where I when people mores are bendable
like that, it makes me deeply uncomfortable

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anyway, Kelly, what do you
have something else to say? Yeah,

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just just one quick thing. Um, my real problem was, and uh

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sorry you said that, this this
was this is you know what their job

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basically is to do this. I
don't agree with that. The time that

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they spent fighting this up, they
could have been working on writing up a

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bill to explained abortion options for women. They could have been working on improving

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extra funding to help raise the kids
whose mothers didn't want to have an abortion

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but couldn't make ends meet. I'm
always talking about people getting up and doing

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something to make the world a better
place, really encouraging regular people like you

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and I to get up and do
it. And these thirty people promised to

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make those changes. They dedicated their
life to it. They stood up before

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people and say we're going to fight
to make those changes, and this is

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what we get out of them instead? This is bullshit to me. And

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this is why I saw this so
cynically, is because I could think of

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a million better ways that these representatives
could have spent their time than writing up

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a bullshit thing that really doesn't seem
like it's going to matter to anybody.

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So go ahead, Phoebe. You
take it out, take it away from

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me. I don't understand America.
Sometimes I try very hard. I mean

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I try really, really, really
hard to understand America. But this is

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what I don't understand about America.
You don't have an established religion, but

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you have established religions in your government. You don't have church and state melding,

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yet you have churches melding the state. I don't understand what on earth

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has allowed this level of religiosity.
One of the people, the people I've

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got nothing against. It's the idea
that you have allowed religiosity to come in

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and to start running the show,
start running the absolute show. You've got

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all this madness. There are I
think at last count two people out of

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five hundred and thirty five who do
not have a religion or declare themselves to

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be atheist. Two two for crying
out loud. You have every religion under

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the sun, except those with no
religion. Because it's not sin as the

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way that you get into the building
to actually make the rule. It's not

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sin as the way that you get
it onto the ballot paper. And instead

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of people laughing these people off the
ballot paper, they go, yeah,

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they'll do nicely. That's what I
don't understand about America, and that's what

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I don't understand about these thirty people. I just don't get America sometimes.

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Yeah, I gotta say, y'all. That is a great place to wrap

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it up from our friend across the
pond, and for everybody listening, whether

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you're in America or not. If
you want to hear more, clicking