WEBVTT 1 00:00:16.879 --> 00:00:23.760 Spanning the entire globe, involving hundreds of different cultures, explaining the same phenomenon 2 00:00:23.839 --> 00:00:30.359 by different names of the nature of the footprints, namely their remarkable consistency, 3 00:00:31.160 --> 00:00:39.840 their biomechanical appropriateness, you know, those aspects that are are extremely compelling. 4 00:00:53.079 --> 00:00:58.000 Hey, guys, welcome to the show. This is the Bigfoot Influencers Podcast. 5 00:00:58.240 --> 00:01:03.719 I'm Dana Hallerin and I'm Tim Hallan. We are just thrilled as always 6 00:01:03.759 --> 00:01:07.519 to do this. We're so happy you guys are turning and tuning in and 7 00:01:07.599 --> 00:01:11.400 we just appreciate each and every one of you. Make sure that you head 8 00:01:11.400 --> 00:01:14.159 on over to the Untold Radio Network. We have a I don't know how 9 00:01:14.200 --> 00:01:15.879 many shows we're up to now, Dougs. Might you know, Mike, 10 00:01:15.920 --> 00:01:19.799 it's definitely more than seven. Yeah, I think it might be ten or 11 00:01:19.799 --> 00:01:23.120 eleven now. Yeah, we've got a ton of shows. So there's anything 12 00:01:23.159 --> 00:01:26.000 you like or you're interested in, you can find it on the Untold Radio 13 00:01:26.040 --> 00:01:29.719 Network. And yeah, just go over to there on YouTube, like and 14 00:01:29.760 --> 00:01:33.439 subscribe. If you listen to us on podcast platform, the same thing, 15 00:01:33.439 --> 00:01:38.359 any podcasts platform you're you're part of, you can just head on over look 16 00:01:38.439 --> 00:01:42.879 up the Untold Radio Network and send us some love. We appreciate it. 17 00:01:42.120 --> 00:01:46.840 And speaking of love, I just want to give a shout out to Lake 18 00:01:46.920 --> 00:01:53.560 and Arnold. He just made such a nice comment this past week, and 19 00:01:53.599 --> 00:01:56.799 I just want to say thank you for that. We appreciate the kind words, 20 00:01:57.159 --> 00:01:59.959 and thank you for tuning in and a bunch of your bunch of you 21 00:02:00.079 --> 00:02:02.439 tune in. I was in the chat last night. I'm watching one of 22 00:02:02.439 --> 00:02:07.879 our other shows, and uh, Charlotte was on Air two and Charlotte joins 23 00:02:07.959 --> 00:02:10.319 in every week. So we just we just appreciate each every one of you. 24 00:02:10.520 --> 00:02:15.919 So, but tonight or today, super excited for our guests. Yep, 25 00:02:16.039 --> 00:02:21.360 we have right Robert Lighterman. Yeah, pretty sure. That's he'll help 26 00:02:21.560 --> 00:02:25.159 correct if you pronounced. I think that's probably how you. Robert's a legend. 27 00:02:25.280 --> 00:02:30.319 He's been around this for so long, and uh, he's got a 28 00:02:30.360 --> 00:02:31.759 lot exciting things. And I'm not going to take away from his thunder. 29 00:02:32.080 --> 00:02:35.560 So we'll bring in, bring him in, and we'll kind of talk about 30 00:02:35.800 --> 00:02:38.199 where he was, what's he's what, you know, what he's done, 31 00:02:38.280 --> 00:02:40.159 what's he doing now, and and get into it all Right, sounds good, 32 00:02:40.400 --> 00:02:46.960 So let's be Robert in. Hello, Hi Robert, welcome to the 33 00:02:46.000 --> 00:02:53.159 show. Thanks for joining us. So how you doing. I'm done good. 34 00:02:53.319 --> 00:02:58.400 Yeah, I guess it's a Saturday morning afternoon. Rather. Yeah, 35 00:02:58.439 --> 00:03:00.199 you're you're on the You're on the West coast. Were on the East coast. 36 00:03:00.680 --> 00:03:02.680 But we're used to doing that. We've had a lot of our guests, 37 00:03:02.719 --> 00:03:06.360 you know, you know, like Bob and Kathy Strain who you know, 38 00:03:06.439 --> 00:03:08.439 and some folks like that and Daniel Perez and folks are out on the 39 00:03:08.479 --> 00:03:14.759 West coast and our folks up in the Pacific Northwest. So we make it 40 00:03:14.800 --> 00:03:20.000 work. We appreciate joining us on midday, so we thank you so much 41 00:03:20.000 --> 00:03:23.719 for that. Absolutely. So do you want to give um there or maybe 42 00:03:23.719 --> 00:03:28.360 like maybe Robert, Robert, why don't you intro yourself and give us give 43 00:03:28.400 --> 00:03:32.560 our viewers just like a little bit of what you're all about and and what 44 00:03:32.639 --> 00:03:38.000 you know, what what you do there? Yeah? Well, yeah, 45 00:03:38.199 --> 00:03:40.840 I mean California. I've been born raised pretty much out this way. A 46 00:03:40.919 --> 00:03:45.280 lot of people assume California is like southern California, but you know, that's 47 00:03:45.280 --> 00:03:47.240 just a part of it. I'm in the northern part, north of San 48 00:03:47.280 --> 00:03:51.960 Francisco. I love people like to claim that's northern California and stuff. But 49 00:03:52.560 --> 00:03:54.960 yeah, I got into big footing. Uh, I guess a while ago. 50 00:03:55.400 --> 00:03:58.879 As a kid always had an interest in it. We all watched the 51 00:03:59.240 --> 00:04:02.039 legend movie Got Scared. I guess first time I watched I was at a 52 00:04:02.080 --> 00:04:04.759 movie theater. That was pretty exciting until I had to go pee and then 53 00:04:04.759 --> 00:04:08.759 I had to walk all the way down to the bathrooms. It was scary, 54 00:04:09.639 --> 00:04:13.439 and and then I kind of follow the shows here and there. But 55 00:04:13.520 --> 00:04:15.639 I really didn't put much much faith into idea that it was just like an 56 00:04:15.759 --> 00:04:19.560 entertaining thing. It wasn't until like college, I started reading stuff instead of 57 00:04:19.560 --> 00:04:24.959 my assignments. I started doing some entertaining reading and started keeping notes. And 58 00:04:24.959 --> 00:04:29.000 at probably the time I got suckered in, well, originally was when I 59 00:04:29.079 --> 00:04:31.720 was working as a park ranger. I was doing interpretive programs, like on 60 00:04:32.040 --> 00:04:36.639 programs on natural cultural history. I go, well, let's just do one 61 00:04:36.639 --> 00:04:40.000 on Bigfoot. That'd be fun. So I did a bunch of homework on 62 00:04:40.079 --> 00:04:43.160 it, did a lot of research on it. And it's one of those 63 00:04:43.399 --> 00:04:46.160 folklore and mysticism sections, so you don't want to, you know, get 64 00:04:46.199 --> 00:04:50.240 too serious about it. So had slides. I had tabloid magazines from my 65 00:04:51.120 --> 00:04:56.079 handhelds, you know, little show things, and I just had the slides 66 00:04:56.120 --> 00:04:59.040 about the process. So I told the story and then I kind of added 67 00:04:59.040 --> 00:05:00.680 a bunch of humor to it. Us they could. That kind of got 68 00:05:00.680 --> 00:05:03.160 me started. So the boss was okay with that. You know, that 69 00:05:03.279 --> 00:05:10.279 was all good. And at the end one day, you know, this 70 00:05:10.360 --> 00:05:13.879 guy shows up, John Fredis and he shows up. He's got this pickup 71 00:05:13.879 --> 00:05:16.240 truck. He's got he's shift speaker on it. It says bfrro on it, 72 00:05:16.839 --> 00:05:19.439 and he goes, hey, I'm a fellow peace officer. I kind 73 00:05:19.439 --> 00:05:23.120 of worked down in the North to live up north. Hey, we want 74 00:05:23.160 --> 00:05:26.720 to do some some call blasting. I'm like, what, you know, 75 00:05:28.360 --> 00:05:31.160 we just take an alleged, you know, bigfoot calls and then we blast 76 00:05:31.240 --> 00:05:35.040 them all over the place. Back then, we're talking about nineteen ninety nine 77 00:05:35.120 --> 00:05:39.720 ish. Well, back then, the part about call blasting was how far 78 00:05:39.759 --> 00:05:42.839 can you send the calls? You know, you got to let the people 79 00:05:42.879 --> 00:05:46.240 halfway around the county know yet you're out calling. So and he happened to 80 00:05:46.279 --> 00:05:50.240 show up on a Labor Day weekend, and that in the parks is kind 81 00:05:50.279 --> 00:05:55.120 of a really busy time with a lot of people, so you kind of 82 00:05:55.160 --> 00:05:58.839 don't want to know your your customers. And we also have these birds. 83 00:05:59.480 --> 00:06:01.399 We have to types of birds. One of them is a marbleo miralett. 84 00:06:01.920 --> 00:06:08.399 It's a plagic bird that endangered and it nests in old girld forests down where 85 00:06:08.399 --> 00:06:12.800 we're at, so it's family protected so you can't scare it during certain times 86 00:06:12.800 --> 00:06:15.000 of the year. Nothing called a spot at out and that was another one 87 00:06:15.079 --> 00:06:19.199 that was protected. So we had sound ordness and said you can't make any 88 00:06:19.240 --> 00:06:24.439 loud noises basically during the summer period of the wait till the winter time. 89 00:06:25.079 --> 00:06:29.959 And so I encouraged him to go somewhere else and you can't do it here. 90 00:06:30.079 --> 00:06:32.480 So I told we're to go, you know, out that way, 91 00:06:33.160 --> 00:06:36.560 and I thought that was kind of the end of it, but ends up 92 00:06:36.560 --> 00:06:43.319 being where It turns out that I actually wrote wrote up something on their visit 93 00:06:43.639 --> 00:06:47.879 and then they were there because there was a sighting. It was a father 94 00:06:47.959 --> 00:06:54.759 and a son over at Burlington Campground at Humboldt Redwood State Park and the dad 95 00:06:54.759 --> 00:06:57.839 and some were on the river trail and they were walking, you know, 96 00:06:58.199 --> 00:07:02.240 taking it, taking a tour and then the sun's shoe lace came untied, 97 00:07:02.319 --> 00:07:06.720 so he said, hey, tie your shoe. So the kid been overtireed 98 00:07:06.720 --> 00:07:11.040 shoe and the dad was standing there, and that's when the dad saw what 99 00:07:11.120 --> 00:07:16.279 he described as a half naked individual harry from a waist up walking back and 100 00:07:16.319 --> 00:07:21.399 forth up the side of the hill. They cleaned some trees and then he 101 00:07:21.399 --> 00:07:25.600 said it stopped and rubbed his back on the tree, and that's when he 102 00:07:25.639 --> 00:07:30.079 got excited. And then when he got back down he reported to the BFROL. 103 00:07:30.560 --> 00:07:34.399 That was in August of August twenty third, I want to say, 104 00:07:34.480 --> 00:07:40.439 of nineteen ninety nine, and when John Freddy stood up, it was September. 105 00:07:41.040 --> 00:07:44.759 It was a labor day weeket so you could see how how quick that 106 00:07:44.879 --> 00:07:47.839 was turn around. So when all the customers were gone, I decided to 107 00:07:47.839 --> 00:07:53.959 go investigate it myself. So I went up there with another park person and 108 00:07:54.079 --> 00:07:57.920 she was a good tracker, so I had her user tracking skills. So 109 00:07:58.000 --> 00:08:01.639 based on the photograph of what that was put up by the BFROL, we 110 00:08:01.759 --> 00:08:07.519 located the location they were at and we went up the hillside and we found 111 00:08:07.879 --> 00:08:11.399 a camera, a camera strap, a old cigarette, and a big stump 112 00:08:11.439 --> 00:08:18.680 that fit the bill. So thus became the investigator, the bigfoot investigator. 113 00:08:18.720 --> 00:08:22.240 That's my first big foot you know, follow up report investigation. Okay, 114 00:08:22.319 --> 00:08:24.600 so I'm sorry, I'm sorry I have to interrupt you for a second. 115 00:08:24.720 --> 00:08:28.920 Yeah. So you so you went up. So she tracked, she was 116 00:08:28.959 --> 00:08:33.799 tracking something. Yeah. What she was doing is she's a skilled tracker. 117 00:08:33.879 --> 00:08:39.399 So she was looking for disturbances based on the photograph standing on the trail looking 118 00:08:39.480 --> 00:08:43.080 up the hill. That's how we have to match the location. So because 119 00:08:43.080 --> 00:08:46.840 a photograph was taken by the dad, the photograph was taken by the investigators 120 00:08:46.879 --> 00:08:52.240 from the BFROL investigating of the side. Yeah, at the site, and 121 00:08:52.279 --> 00:08:56.200 then when they posted it, they put pictures up and one of those pictures 122 00:08:56.679 --> 00:09:01.320 was taken from the trail shooting up the hills where the father allegedly saw whatever's 123 00:09:01.320 --> 00:09:07.120 going on. Yeah, and so we're using that photograph along the trail, 124 00:09:07.159 --> 00:09:09.799 walking toward Is this it? Nope? Is this it? Nope? Until 125 00:09:09.799 --> 00:09:13.000 we finally found a matching area and lo and behold, there's a stump up 126 00:09:13.000 --> 00:09:16.559 there, a huge redwood stump that was burned out and covered with with moss 127 00:09:16.600 --> 00:09:20.120 and stuff. So we went up the hills looking for all sorts of sign 128 00:09:20.240 --> 00:09:26.559 you know, disturbances, broken branches. Well, what we found was a 129 00:09:26.600 --> 00:09:33.399 pathway premius of game trail pathway and in late September and in towards late September 130 00:09:33.440 --> 00:09:37.679 and August around that time they read which off starts that the rabbit chief started 131 00:09:37.720 --> 00:09:41.519 dropping their duff, so it starts covering everything. So the trail wasn't real 132 00:09:41.559 --> 00:09:46.080 good to track. But we did find a pathway which led past that stump 133 00:09:46.159 --> 00:09:50.120 we talked about, and that's where we found the cigarette. But that's where 134 00:09:50.120 --> 00:09:54.879 we found the camera strap. But we also know it from John right, 135 00:09:56.000 --> 00:09:58.279 which was probably from John. Well, I'm not gonna blame John, oh 136 00:09:58.639 --> 00:10:01.679 oh yeah. We don't want to get John because he's still out there doing 137 00:10:01.679 --> 00:10:03.480 it, so we won't get he's still working hard than that. It was 138 00:10:03.559 --> 00:10:07.159 it was, it was, it was from their group, and it was 139 00:10:07.200 --> 00:10:09.039 just something you kind of forget lee behinde, but that just told me that's 140 00:10:09.039 --> 00:10:13.159 where they were at too, and it matched everything. And the description was 141 00:10:16.039 --> 00:10:22.360 an alleged bigfoot rubbing its back against a piece of wood, whether it's a 142 00:10:22.399 --> 00:10:24.679 tree or whether it's a stump. So you're looking for what you're looking for, 143 00:10:24.720 --> 00:10:28.159 disturbances of scrape marks, right, So we went up to that big 144 00:10:28.200 --> 00:10:31.600 stump and we looked at it and it was an old burnt stump that had 145 00:10:31.639 --> 00:10:35.639 a fire a long time ago, an old redwood stump, and you scratched 146 00:10:35.639 --> 00:10:39.639 it and it took off the charcoal and it took off the moss that was 147 00:10:39.679 --> 00:10:43.320 growing on it, and there was no indication of anything rubbing that stump. 148 00:10:45.559 --> 00:10:48.720 So it wasn't a stump, not that stump, and so we were like, 149 00:10:48.759 --> 00:10:52.279 oh, I don't know. And then we looked off to our left 150 00:10:52.360 --> 00:10:56.360 and we just followed that old game trail pathway. There's a spur that went 151 00:10:56.399 --> 00:11:01.360 over to this other redwood tree that's probably about probably about a half ish in 152 00:11:01.480 --> 00:11:07.559 diameter, and the bark on it was a younger redwood tree, so it 153 00:11:07.600 --> 00:11:11.399 was pushed down and moved to the side. So we looked at that, 154 00:11:11.519 --> 00:11:16.679 going huh. So from about a foot off the ground to about six foot 155 00:11:16.759 --> 00:11:22.039 up, something rubbed against that redwood, young redwood tree, and you could 156 00:11:22.039 --> 00:11:26.600 tell the bark is filled fibers and soft, and it was pushed back and 157 00:11:26.720 --> 00:11:31.440 so we go, oh, look evidence. And I didn't think about collecting 158 00:11:31.480 --> 00:11:33.320 hair samples or looking for any hair samples there, I just go look, 159 00:11:33.360 --> 00:11:37.440 well, we now we know what was rubbed against. And there was another 160 00:11:37.480 --> 00:11:41.039 spurd trail that went past that and went over towards some shrubbery and it went 161 00:11:41.200 --> 00:11:45.679 right over the top of these big piles of shrubs and it went downhill, 162 00:11:45.840 --> 00:11:48.960 and I'm like wow, So it wasn't a footpath. It was just like 163 00:11:50.000 --> 00:11:54.080 an area that animals use and you can't find the details to it. So 164 00:11:54.679 --> 00:11:58.240 it's a game trail and you can't see foot placements, but you could tell 165 00:11:58.279 --> 00:12:03.360 something big with through there. So I thought this was pretty cool. I 166 00:12:03.399 --> 00:12:07.000 went ahead and said, yeah, this is it, So I guess I'll 167 00:12:07.000 --> 00:12:09.399 follow up and see what we can figure out. So my partner there, 168 00:12:11.000 --> 00:12:13.240 she didn't want herself in any of the photographs, So if you're doing any 169 00:12:13.240 --> 00:12:16.840 bigfoot investigations, some people don't want to be photographed to be associated with it. 170 00:12:18.480 --> 00:12:22.200 At this point, you still weren't really into it. You were just 171 00:12:22.360 --> 00:12:26.159 curious of what was going on, right, Yeah, I wasn't. I 172 00:12:26.159 --> 00:12:28.279 could take it to leave it. I was just providing interpretive programs and just 173 00:12:28.399 --> 00:12:33.320 educating people on it. But I just thought this is an opportunity to, 174 00:12:33.720 --> 00:12:37.519 I don't know, just prove it, you know why not. So I 175 00:12:37.519 --> 00:12:41.559 decided to go ahead and do that. So now we're taking photographs, but 176 00:12:41.679 --> 00:12:43.840 she doesn't want to be in it. So I got pictures of the tree, 177 00:12:43.000 --> 00:12:46.840 got pictures of the ground, I got pictures of the stump, and 178 00:12:46.399 --> 00:12:50.759 I was used for a size reference. So I stood there with my stetson. 179 00:12:50.840 --> 00:12:54.799 By the way, as a park ranger, you were stetson when you 180 00:12:54.879 --> 00:12:58.240 do your interpretive programs as part of your uniform, so you can't just be 181 00:12:58.320 --> 00:13:03.120 shop without it. So got my statson on. I'm posing in front of 182 00:13:03.120 --> 00:13:05.039 this picture. It's a great shot. I go, this is gonna be 183 00:13:05.039 --> 00:13:07.799 good. And then I do a little write up. And what I did 184 00:13:07.799 --> 00:13:09.840 with the write up is I just wrote what we found, which is not 185 00:13:11.039 --> 00:13:15.399 confirming a bigfoot sighting, but it was confirming that there's a disturbance there, 186 00:13:15.840 --> 00:13:20.799 that's something actually most likely rubbed against the tree and mostly exited stage left and 187 00:13:20.840 --> 00:13:24.279 went down over the hillside because you followed the pathway. And so I wrote, 188 00:13:24.440 --> 00:13:28.000 I put that together instead of putting as a report for the department because 189 00:13:28.000 --> 00:13:31.279 they're not excited about those kind of things. I send it to the BFRORO 190 00:13:31.399 --> 00:13:37.159 Matt Moneymaker and within him receiving it. I got this phone call says, 191 00:13:37.159 --> 00:13:41.279 hey, how would you like to be a curator for the BFRRO, And 192 00:13:41.320 --> 00:13:43.840 I go, what's a curator? Well, you know somebody who follows up 193 00:13:43.879 --> 00:13:48.159 on sightings or talks to people and sets them up, Like okay, I'll 194 00:13:48.159 --> 00:13:52.120 do it. Sure, why not? So that became my first investigation of 195 00:13:52.120 --> 00:13:54.960 following up in big foot reports. And I become a member of the BFRORO 196 00:13:54.080 --> 00:13:58.200 in nineteen nine December of nineteen ninety nine, and that just opened this door 197 00:13:58.399 --> 00:14:01.919 of Pandora's box, if you want to call it. And now I'm following 198 00:14:03.000 --> 00:14:05.799 up in reports and meeting interesting people. Afraid it's now a good friend. 199 00:14:05.879 --> 00:14:09.159 He's setting them up for interviews that I kind of bomb a few of those 200 00:14:09.200 --> 00:14:13.639 in the beginning. But I still can't come out and say, hey, 201 00:14:13.360 --> 00:14:16.360 I worked for the State of California. I'm a state park ranger. They 202 00:14:16.360 --> 00:14:20.519 give me a gun, and I believe in flying spit space ships in the 203 00:14:20.600 --> 00:14:26.639 UFOs and all sorts of crypted monsters. So I continue to do my interpretive 204 00:14:26.639 --> 00:14:31.000 program. But once that article went out, it ended up back in my 205 00:14:31.159 --> 00:14:37.559 supervisor's box, because all of a sudden there was a complaint. The article 206 00:14:37.559 --> 00:14:41.440 went up. It was posted more so than I expected to be, And 207 00:14:41.519 --> 00:14:46.279 I said posted it was through the BFRORO. So this time that they tracked 208 00:14:46.320 --> 00:14:50.120 someone was especially in nineteen ninety nine. Then they were able to be that 209 00:14:50.200 --> 00:14:54.159 diligent to track it back back down. Yeah, that's when I stay up 210 00:14:54.159 --> 00:14:58.799 at night going listening to That's like the Internet system when you were waiting to 211 00:14:58.840 --> 00:15:05.480 get It's like my god. Now now you push a button, you expect 212 00:15:05.480 --> 00:15:07.840 it, you know, before you push the button. But anyhow, so 213 00:15:09.840 --> 00:15:13.120 I got to sit down with the supervisor in the office saying, hey, 214 00:15:13.159 --> 00:15:16.840 did you write this? Yeah, yeah, yeah, I wrote it. 215 00:15:18.919 --> 00:15:22.799 Who took the pictures? I go, well, yeah, yeah, big 216 00:15:22.840 --> 00:15:28.519 for dead you know, want to be in it. So I got a 217 00:15:28.600 --> 00:15:33.159 cease and to disorder from my supervisor saying you can't use any more state time 218 00:15:33.480 --> 00:15:39.399 or state equipment or write anything else about this. But the problem was, 219 00:15:39.840 --> 00:15:45.120 for the last couple of years I've been doing interpretive programs on the subject matter. 220 00:15:45.519 --> 00:15:48.919 So now I'm not allowed to research my subject matters that I got the 221 00:15:48.960 --> 00:15:52.440 approval to give to the public. The article did not say hey I believe 222 00:15:52.480 --> 00:15:56.279 in this stuff. It just it just regurgitated research information like you're supposed to 223 00:15:56.279 --> 00:16:02.559 do anyhow. So after the season to Disorder, I think nine months later 224 00:16:03.720 --> 00:16:07.960 released Scary Stories, was looking for somebody to interview. And because of my 225 00:16:07.039 --> 00:16:14.039 involvement and because I was a ranger, a person in responsibility positions that's still 226 00:16:14.519 --> 00:16:18.639 going along with the Bigfoot research stuff, that let's interview that guy. So 227 00:16:19.039 --> 00:16:22.799 they had to go through the department to do it, and so the deal 228 00:16:22.919 --> 00:16:29.080 was made where they can only ask me questions that the department decided we're okay 229 00:16:29.120 --> 00:16:33.519 to answer, right, So their department sends a list to the guy. 230 00:16:33.159 --> 00:16:37.960 I get to take my nice shiny white truck, all washed out in my 231 00:16:38.519 --> 00:16:44.120 ranger uniform, and drive all the way towards Cress's city in del North Coast 232 00:16:44.159 --> 00:16:48.879 area. Jed Smith and I get to be interviewed for real Scary Stories, 233 00:16:48.000 --> 00:16:52.480 a program about kids you know, in the woods getting lost and chased by 234 00:16:52.519 --> 00:16:55.879 creatures. I guess and yo, I get to be interviewed. So during 235 00:16:55.879 --> 00:16:59.399 the interview process, it's a beautiful shot. You can imagine me sitting in 236 00:16:59.440 --> 00:17:04.880 my white patrol car wearing my stets in the sun is setting. I'm on 237 00:17:04.920 --> 00:17:10.200 the side of a hill, it's beautiful. It's the most beautiful shot because 238 00:17:10.240 --> 00:17:14.079 all the sun sets and the orange is reflecting off the clean white pickup truck. 239 00:17:14.440 --> 00:17:18.039 Can you guys, can you guys picture on that? It's an awesome 240 00:17:18.039 --> 00:17:22.119 shot. I wish I was there right now, but anyhow, so I'm 241 00:17:22.160 --> 00:17:25.880 sitting there and then they started asking me all these questions that I can answer 242 00:17:26.039 --> 00:17:29.839 because they're not on the list that was sent to me. So they asked 243 00:17:29.839 --> 00:17:32.160 me, I can't as to that. No, no, I can't answer 244 00:17:32.240 --> 00:17:33.720 that. Now, I can't answer that. I finally say, well, 245 00:17:33.799 --> 00:17:37.799 if if you're looking for information like that, you know you'll need it. 246 00:17:37.799 --> 00:17:41.160 Whatever. Anyhow, so I made the cutting room floor, of course. 247 00:17:41.880 --> 00:17:45.920 But another gentleman. He has passed away since, but he had a cast, 248 00:17:47.119 --> 00:17:51.039 and unless cast he had there was hair fibers on this cast and they 249 00:17:51.079 --> 00:17:56.039 were still attached to the cast. And he was standing there holding his cast 250 00:17:56.119 --> 00:18:00.279 with the sun setting behind him, the most beautiful sunset ever. He made 251 00:18:00.319 --> 00:18:03.240 the show. I did not, But that's okay. But that was my 252 00:18:03.359 --> 00:18:07.519 first No you can't no, no, no, no, you can't talk 253 00:18:07.559 --> 00:18:11.640 about Bigfoot. Oh yeah. Nine months later, guess what we're sending you 254 00:18:11.720 --> 00:18:17.039 over. We're going to pay your travels and everything. So it didn't make 255 00:18:17.079 --> 00:18:18.680 it there, but I still got involved with the researching and a bunch of 256 00:18:18.680 --> 00:18:22.519 other interviews. So it was kind of fun that first initial push to get 257 00:18:22.559 --> 00:18:26.839 you into something that most people think, Ah, you got to be crazy 258 00:18:26.880 --> 00:18:30.880 to be involved with something like that. And so my nickname now, which 259 00:18:30.920 --> 00:18:36.559 I didn't know about until Bobo James Bubbo Fake told me that I was the 260 00:18:36.599 --> 00:18:41.200 Bigfoot Ranger. Oh, I'm the Bigfoot Ranger now. So Robert, I 261 00:18:41.240 --> 00:18:48.279 have to ask you a question. So why do you think your department didn't 262 00:18:48.319 --> 00:18:53.200 want you answering all the questions because it's a subject matter that could be controversial, 263 00:18:53.359 --> 00:18:56.799 and every time we were talking to the public, we're not supposed to 264 00:18:56.839 --> 00:19:00.960 be involved with controversy. So we can talk about is myth and folklore, 265 00:19:02.079 --> 00:19:04.799 which I did you know, humor gets a long ways, So myth and 266 00:19:04.960 --> 00:19:10.319 myth and folklore it was just fine. But when you start doing an investigation 267 00:19:10.480 --> 00:19:14.039 on it, that makes the department go, what are you doing? An 268 00:19:14.119 --> 00:19:19.440 investigation is every time you represent an agency and you do something, if it's 269 00:19:19.480 --> 00:19:23.039 good or bad, it reflects poorly or positively on the agency. So if 270 00:19:23.079 --> 00:19:26.039 you're going to go out and do these kind of things, you probably should 271 00:19:26.079 --> 00:19:30.200 get permission. So I guess what I probably should have done is says, 272 00:19:30.240 --> 00:19:36.759 hey, is it okay my department if I write this article and send it 273 00:19:37.039 --> 00:19:40.759 to whatever. But when I write the article, I'm not writing it on 274 00:19:40.880 --> 00:19:45.240 state time, already on my own time. And and it's it's an interest 275 00:19:45.279 --> 00:19:48.799 in mine. And I didn't think it'd be a big problem. And if 276 00:19:48.799 --> 00:19:49.599 I had to do it again, I would have done the same thing, 277 00:19:49.759 --> 00:19:55.000 because I still don't think it was a problem. But it did open doors. 278 00:19:55.119 --> 00:19:57.759 It did open doors for me to investigate things. It made me reevaluate 279 00:19:57.839 --> 00:20:02.880 the whole process at that moment, though I'm still thinking it was it was 280 00:20:02.920 --> 00:20:06.440 something else that it Maybe it was a bear. It was a long distance 281 00:20:07.000 --> 00:20:11.160 that rubbing against something and walking back and forth in two legs is not an 282 00:20:11.240 --> 00:20:15.599 unusual behavior for a bear, but the person it was all the way down 283 00:20:15.680 --> 00:20:18.720 though. You said as low as one foot off the ground. Yeah, 284 00:20:18.720 --> 00:20:22.640 one foot off the ground to about six feet on this tree. So something. 285 00:20:22.240 --> 00:20:26.079 Wait, if you set the squad a position and lean it back against 286 00:20:26.119 --> 00:20:29.079 something and move up and down, then you're gonna have that, you know, 287 00:20:30.400 --> 00:20:33.799 free range of motion, which means nice squat and full extension, which 288 00:20:33.839 --> 00:20:37.680 is you know that's like five feet I guess if it's about six foot up 289 00:20:37.880 --> 00:20:41.440 and it's six foot off the ground and it starts a foot up just about 290 00:20:41.480 --> 00:20:45.119 five foot, so five foot of contact. Whatever was rubbing back and forth 291 00:20:45.160 --> 00:20:52.519 on that. But they said that this creature or whatever was only Harry from 292 00:20:52.519 --> 00:20:56.200 the waist up. That's the report was. It was human like features Harry 293 00:20:56.920 --> 00:21:02.519 moving back and forth, stop slide up and down against something which they the 294 00:21:02.559 --> 00:21:04.680 guy thought was a stump, which ended up being not the stump. The 295 00:21:04.720 --> 00:21:08.720 evidence say it was just like hairless from the waist down. I don't have 296 00:21:08.759 --> 00:21:14.000 pictures. Oh, okay, I didn't know. They described all you saw 297 00:21:14.200 --> 00:21:18.319 was the waist up based on parking. Oh he didn't see the bottom, 298 00:21:18.480 --> 00:21:22.000 okay, No, No, he only saw the upper torso and moving back 299 00:21:22.000 --> 00:21:26.960 and forth. When you're looking up hill and there's a vegetated slope, everything's 300 00:21:27.039 --> 00:21:30.960 going to be blocked except for the gap. Like if I was a predator 301 00:21:30.000 --> 00:21:33.839 and I was looking for a snack, I would I would flank a game 302 00:21:33.880 --> 00:21:37.799 trail that's used a lot, and I could be up above it and I'm 303 00:21:37.839 --> 00:21:41.720 harder to see, and the people down below can't see me very well, 304 00:21:41.720 --> 00:21:44.960 but I can get a good look looking down. So we have something that's 305 00:21:45.200 --> 00:21:48.960 up on the hillside doing his thing, and somebody down below got lucky. 306 00:21:49.200 --> 00:21:52.119 I was able to see up through gaps, but they, based on the 307 00:21:52.200 --> 00:21:57.039 vegetation on the hillside, they could only see from the waist up and only 308 00:21:57.119 --> 00:22:02.079 through the gaps of the trees that allowed to do that, which brings up 309 00:22:02.079 --> 00:22:08.039 another situation that Bartetino was had some thermal footage of and he filmed it for 310 00:22:08.039 --> 00:22:12.799 forty five minutes. Something in this Siera is that was a heat signature that 311 00:22:12.960 --> 00:22:18.960 was moving back and forth between gaps and trees and not stopping and rubbing his 312 00:22:18.039 --> 00:22:21.920 back, but moving back and forth. Well, another one was stationary and 313 00:22:21.920 --> 00:22:25.319 something was dropping a rock, something was throwing something, and something was moving 314 00:22:25.359 --> 00:22:29.359 farther in the back side of it. So I guess that's not an unusual 315 00:22:29.359 --> 00:22:33.519 thing for somebody to look up and see something and because of the topography, 316 00:22:33.559 --> 00:22:36.960 you only see it through gaps, right, Okay, that makes sense, 317 00:22:37.039 --> 00:22:44.200 And so based on you know, the six feet tall yeah, and if 318 00:22:44.200 --> 00:22:47.200 it's the middle of the middle between scapular bones, I guess in the middle 319 00:22:47.240 --> 00:22:51.400 of the back you could you can kind of guesstimate maybe how big it could 320 00:22:51.400 --> 00:22:55.000 have been. Well, yeah, well how long of the legs. How 321 00:22:55.200 --> 00:22:57.400 if those long legs, then that's a long squad. I would expect as 322 00:22:57.440 --> 00:23:02.200 long as the legs were really long, I would expect it not to be 323 00:23:02.359 --> 00:23:03.960 so far down. I mean, you're only scratching your back, right, 324 00:23:06.279 --> 00:23:08.960 how far are you down? You need to go? Really yeah, And 325 00:23:10.000 --> 00:23:14.400 bears do stand in front of the trees and scratch their backs, but they 326 00:23:14.480 --> 00:23:17.440 take You know, the steps are short because the way the way they're built. 327 00:23:18.559 --> 00:23:22.519 And I mentioned before that I couldn't really pinpoint the exact strideln. All 328 00:23:22.559 --> 00:23:26.440 I know is that the path because of the fall Redwoo Duff covering the ground 329 00:23:26.759 --> 00:23:30.319 that you couldn't see details, but you could see where it gets packed. 330 00:23:32.039 --> 00:23:33.839 Bears will walk the same path, and they love to stick at their feet 331 00:23:33.839 --> 00:23:37.000 in the same holes, and that's why you get these little indentations. But 332 00:23:37.039 --> 00:23:41.519 they're not long stride laps. They're short, which is a dead giveaway for 333 00:23:41.599 --> 00:23:45.480 them. But this hadn't been an active pathway that is beat in, so 334 00:23:45.519 --> 00:23:48.440 I couldn't use any of that. All I can go by is with the 335 00:23:48.599 --> 00:23:52.680 RP the reporting party saw as they he was looking up for that short window. 336 00:23:53.519 --> 00:23:57.400 And when you go up to the site you can see what evidence are 337 00:23:57.440 --> 00:24:04.599 there based on foot traffic or rubbing against the tree or even hithhe What I 338 00:24:04.680 --> 00:24:10.839 would I love to ask is the height of the stump. The stump was 339 00:24:10.880 --> 00:24:14.799 a decent height stump, but he said it was rubbing against the stump. 340 00:24:14.880 --> 00:24:18.440 But there's no way that could really happen very well because the stump is a 341 00:24:18.480 --> 00:24:21.720 certain night and the trees are off to the side. But when you're looking 342 00:24:21.799 --> 00:24:25.000 up a hill at a distance, and it's almost like a three dimensional model, 343 00:24:25.079 --> 00:24:26.640 right, you have all these things in front of you, and it's 344 00:24:26.680 --> 00:24:32.359 hard to judge distance, is hard to judge how far something is away. 345 00:24:33.160 --> 00:24:37.160 A prime example is the Patterson film. When you're looking at it, you 346 00:24:37.160 --> 00:24:40.039 don't know how far those trees are by just looking at the footage. Right, 347 00:24:40.079 --> 00:24:42.000 you have trees in the foreground, You have trees in the background, 348 00:24:42.519 --> 00:24:48.119 and it's moving it she's moving. She does her once over in three point 349 00:24:48.119 --> 00:24:51.960 fifty two and she looks back, and then you have that you have that 350 00:24:52.119 --> 00:24:55.640 tree in the back and the stump over here, but you can't tell distance 351 00:24:55.759 --> 00:24:59.720 very well because it's just so far away. So in this situation, that's 352 00:24:59.720 --> 00:25:03.480 the same thing. So Robert, here's a question for you. So you're 353 00:25:03.519 --> 00:25:07.799 you're retired now right, Well, I'm retired from park rangering, but I 354 00:25:07.799 --> 00:25:12.799 starting to college and so you know, like, did you ever get any 355 00:25:12.839 --> 00:25:19.640 other witness experiences from people who are visiting the park? Yes, That's one 356 00:25:19.640 --> 00:25:23.400 of the neat things about it is when you give a presentation about a subject 357 00:25:23.480 --> 00:25:26.039 about cryptos. Let's say, I don't know, like like bigfoot creatures, 358 00:25:26.079 --> 00:25:30.640 whatever. You give this presentation, you do a tongue in cheek, you 359 00:25:30.680 --> 00:25:33.000 flash your tabloid magazines, you know, you tell your stories. And then 360 00:25:33.000 --> 00:25:37.119 when your presentation is done, people come up to you afterwards and they say 361 00:25:37.200 --> 00:25:41.359 this happened to me, or that happened to me, or and I there's 362 00:25:41.359 --> 00:25:45.160 a there's a list of activities that at the Humble Rudbod Park they have taken 363 00:25:45.200 --> 00:25:51.279 place over the years that the visitors believe they were sausquashed activities. Uh anywhere 364 00:25:51.359 --> 00:25:56.000 is from screaming to shaking trees to uh stepping, stepping out of creeks or 365 00:25:56.039 --> 00:26:03.519 whatever, moving along uh trena is something you hear screams like in Burlington Campground. 366 00:26:03.720 --> 00:26:06.759 It's the only campground we have open on the off season, and we 367 00:26:06.839 --> 00:26:11.240 close a lot of the loops down so we get a minimal visitation. But 368 00:26:11.319 --> 00:26:15.599 sometimes in the winter with no access across to the other side of the large 369 00:26:15.599 --> 00:26:18.519 part of the park is people report heard screams at night, you know, 370 00:26:18.599 --> 00:26:22.480 from the campground. We hear about that. I know. So what do 371 00:26:22.519 --> 00:26:26.039 you I mean? So my question, so, can you share maybe like 372 00:26:26.160 --> 00:26:32.400 one of the most compelling experiences that you heard from a witness. Well, 373 00:26:32.480 --> 00:26:37.359 let's start with the one that Daniel Prez investigated a long time ago. Caltran's 374 00:26:37.359 --> 00:26:40.599 employee. Early morning hours, not that yet, it's kind of dark. 375 00:26:41.200 --> 00:26:45.119 He's driving around trying to do his early morning stuff, and he sees what 376 00:26:45.160 --> 00:26:48.880 he describes as a bigfoot basically running across the roadway near the founder's grow, 377 00:26:49.319 --> 00:26:55.079 running across the roadway and disappearing at early morning hours. And his description was 378 00:26:55.279 --> 00:26:57.880 bipedal, which means two legs, not on all fours. And it was 379 00:26:57.920 --> 00:27:04.519 early morning hours. And that's that's interesting. You see bears all the time, 380 00:27:04.599 --> 00:27:07.960 and I've never seen a bear run across the road on two legs. 381 00:27:07.960 --> 00:27:12.799 I've seen them run across the four legs and stand up at the last second, 382 00:27:14.279 --> 00:27:17.079 trying to turn and look before they go kind of uphill or something. 383 00:27:17.960 --> 00:27:21.000 And I've seen I've seen that. Yeah. I remember one time I went 384 00:27:21.000 --> 00:27:25.359 to the Olympic Peninsula for nine days of bigfoot research and I was with a 385 00:27:25.440 --> 00:27:29.680 friend coming back and we got to one O one in Redwind National Park, 386 00:27:30.160 --> 00:27:33.400 right almost hit the peak, and I'm driving half asleep. If you're driving 387 00:27:33.480 --> 00:27:37.119 for a long time and long, behold, this dark, hairy figure runs 388 00:27:37.160 --> 00:27:38.839 across the road in front of us, a slam of that breaks to miss 389 00:27:38.880 --> 00:27:41.359 it, and as soon as it gets out of the front end of it, 390 00:27:41.359 --> 00:27:45.319 it swerves towards us and stands up. It was a bear. But 391 00:27:45.519 --> 00:27:48.599 you know, for that second, they're like, we did it right, 392 00:27:49.720 --> 00:27:55.039 especially on your way back from nine days of big Yeah, nine days of 393 00:27:55.880 --> 00:28:02.039 researching and having the whole concept of the big for phenomena to rea reassured that 394 00:28:02.079 --> 00:28:04.920 there might be something to this based on your investigations up there, and you're 395 00:28:04.920 --> 00:28:07.559 like, I'm waiting, Yeah, I wish I would have saw one. 396 00:28:07.599 --> 00:28:11.640 And then que the grizzly bear, you know, queue the Bigfoot and it 397 00:28:11.720 --> 00:28:15.680 runs in front of your car in the dark at the most unopportune time when 398 00:28:15.680 --> 00:28:18.720 you're half asleep, and I'm surprised, Well, I'm not surprised. I 399 00:28:18.720 --> 00:28:22.720 mean, I would expect a lot more people to have these grade encounters. 400 00:28:22.720 --> 00:28:26.720 So the last second when they're dozing off and see something and only for a 401 00:28:26.759 --> 00:28:29.759 brief second, and then try to decipher what it is that they saw. 402 00:28:30.519 --> 00:28:33.920 But yeah, but I'm going back to the Humboll Redwood stories. I had 403 00:28:33.920 --> 00:28:37.640 a search and rescue I was on where individuals get lost. What they do 404 00:28:37.720 --> 00:28:42.000 is they they they kind of don't pay attention, and then they go get 405 00:28:42.079 --> 00:28:45.839 a little confused, and then they decide they're gonna hike uphill even though they 406 00:28:45.920 --> 00:28:49.759 never hiked up Hell, They're gonna hike uphill and then really get lost, 407 00:28:49.799 --> 00:28:53.640 and then they're gonna call nine to one one in the area where sell reships 408 00:28:53.720 --> 00:28:59.000 is not very good, and then you're gonna hear where you know, and 409 00:28:59.000 --> 00:29:00.440 then you're trying to figure out what what's going on with that, And then 410 00:29:00.839 --> 00:29:03.759 we get called out to go search for them, and of course we find 411 00:29:03.759 --> 00:29:08.519 most of them, and then we call it off. We're good. We 412 00:29:08.599 --> 00:29:11.519 got these guys. So I'm driving back and I was on a quad. 413 00:29:11.920 --> 00:29:15.880 I parked off of them a toll road on the turnout, and I rode 414 00:29:15.880 --> 00:29:18.880 my quad up up into the northern portion of the park. It's pretty wild. 415 00:29:19.880 --> 00:29:22.240 I love it up there. It's great. And then I ride my 416 00:29:22.319 --> 00:29:26.799 cord back. It's dark, it's like almost ten o'clock, and I park 417 00:29:26.839 --> 00:29:29.319 it and it's good. We're all ready to go. So I load the 418 00:29:29.319 --> 00:29:33.079 back of my pickup truck, I secure it, I take care of everything, 419 00:29:33.200 --> 00:29:36.440 and I'll go, okay, turn the engine on, get it all 420 00:29:36.480 --> 00:29:37.599 warmed up. And then I'm thinking, you know, I better go back 421 00:29:37.599 --> 00:29:42.880 outside and remake sure I secured it, because when you're out late sometimes you 422 00:29:44.400 --> 00:29:48.000 go do thinks she should because you're half asleep. So I opened the door 423 00:29:48.039 --> 00:29:51.759 back out and I go to check in. I hear this whack from the 424 00:29:51.799 --> 00:29:56.480 trees way above me, probably within fifty yards away up the hillside, and 425 00:29:56.519 --> 00:30:00.240 I'm like, huh, that sounds like a knock to me, and it's 426 00:30:00.279 --> 00:30:03.359 not the first time I've heard it, but whack, big knock. Update 427 00:30:03.440 --> 00:30:07.160 what's the coincidence? The timing of that is I'm getting ready to leave and 428 00:30:07.200 --> 00:30:10.559 I get back down on my car and there's this big knock wearing the hillside 429 00:30:10.960 --> 00:30:14.960 and it's really not way up the hillside. It's it's within a stone scrow 430 00:30:15.079 --> 00:30:18.240 with a good arm. And it's time for me to go. It's late, 431 00:30:18.960 --> 00:30:21.680 and I'm like, do I wait? So of course I waited about 432 00:30:21.680 --> 00:30:23.359 ten minutes, and of course I don't hear anything, and they go, 433 00:30:23.400 --> 00:30:27.440 okay, get back on my car and finish heading back. My partners are 434 00:30:27.480 --> 00:30:30.680 waiting for me to get back before we can all go home, right, 435 00:30:30.559 --> 00:30:33.720 So I'm not going to string them out. But there was nothing there. 436 00:30:33.200 --> 00:30:36.759 And now the time I was at for a real long walk, I was 437 00:30:36.799 --> 00:30:38.799 over at the Rockefeller Forest. I was on the other side of the creek 438 00:30:40.480 --> 00:30:44.519 and it's getting late. I'm walking back. Everything's good, and you know 439 00:30:44.559 --> 00:30:47.319 how you kind of get in that zone when you're walking. It's like you 440 00:30:47.400 --> 00:30:51.200 fill at peace and you're thinking and you're walking. And there's one section where 441 00:30:51.200 --> 00:30:53.480 I double back and I was just going to cross the footbridge and as soon 442 00:30:53.519 --> 00:30:57.319 as I passed this large tree, whack, I hear one of those again, 443 00:30:57.440 --> 00:31:00.480 and it's just beyond the big trees. Of course I stop, ago 444 00:31:00.640 --> 00:31:04.759 did I hear that? And I creep back a little bit. I'm trying 445 00:31:04.759 --> 00:31:07.599 to peek around that one tree near me to see if I can see anything. 446 00:31:07.599 --> 00:31:11.359 I don't see anything, so I go I look around to find nothing. 447 00:31:11.640 --> 00:31:15.640 It's just like, was it a tree knock or was it one of 448 00:31:15.640 --> 00:31:21.079 the old ancient redwood trees that have large buttress cracks that run the whole length 449 00:31:21.079 --> 00:31:25.400 of it that allow the flexibility of the tree. And they move and they 450 00:31:25.440 --> 00:31:27.240 pop, but you're a whoop. But then you say, well, the 451 00:31:27.279 --> 00:31:30.480 wind's not blowing, and why was there only one tree? And so you 452 00:31:30.519 --> 00:31:33.319 always have to be rational about the things you run into. So it was 453 00:31:33.359 --> 00:31:37.160 like, oh, I don't know. So I waited there for a bit, 454 00:31:37.359 --> 00:31:40.000 started getting dark, and of course it doesn't happen again. And then 455 00:31:40.039 --> 00:31:42.359 I have to hustle walk back to my unit because it's like two miles away 456 00:31:42.680 --> 00:31:47.359 and it's getting dark, and I didn't make a flashlight because you know, 457 00:31:47.400 --> 00:31:48.880 it's extra weight you don't want to carry around on your belt. Because I'm 458 00:31:48.880 --> 00:31:55.319 carrying all my Batman extend or stuff in my boots and my stets and sometimes 459 00:31:55.319 --> 00:31:57.839 sometimes ball caps. And we go off with the long walk and it's not 460 00:31:57.880 --> 00:32:00.960 that long it's only about an hour or so, and then it stuff hits 461 00:32:00.960 --> 00:32:04.319 a fan. Then you got to go back to your UNI get other such 462 00:32:04.400 --> 00:32:07.400 stuff. But anyhow, so that's a couple of things. So then of 463 00:32:07.480 --> 00:32:09.319 course you talk about the shadows you see and then they're not there anymore. 464 00:32:10.240 --> 00:32:15.079 Uh. That's always makes you wonder about And then you hear the calls occasionally 465 00:32:15.720 --> 00:32:16.960 and you're like, well, I don't know if that was a coyote or 466 00:32:17.000 --> 00:32:24.000 something else. But it's like if I if the visitors recorded the calls at 467 00:32:24.000 --> 00:32:28.720 the Burlington campground and they can play it back for me, I would be 468 00:32:28.720 --> 00:32:30.920 able to compare that sound of what they heard. So I don't know what 469 00:32:31.000 --> 00:32:34.759 it is, but I've heard a few calls and I go, well, 470 00:32:34.799 --> 00:32:37.279 it's not quite a coyote, it's not a fox. I don't know what 471 00:32:37.359 --> 00:32:42.759 it is. But with it it's basically inconclusive if I can't really match what's 472 00:32:42.759 --> 00:32:45.079 making that noise. But it's another one of those things that you see or 473 00:32:45.119 --> 00:32:51.200 you hear or hear or experience. They make you go hmmm. Because you're 474 00:32:51.240 --> 00:32:53.240 a skeptical person. You have to be to make right decisions. Right, 475 00:32:54.039 --> 00:33:00.920 there's a point where I'm less skeptical, but I'm still not raising the flag 476 00:33:00.039 --> 00:33:04.039 saying yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, it's out there. But I 477 00:33:04.079 --> 00:33:07.480 do that because for years I've always been taught to be skeptical about things that 478 00:33:07.519 --> 00:33:12.000 don't jump to conclusions like the film site. If I would have jumped to 479 00:33:12.039 --> 00:33:15.240 conclusion that we think we found it and we didn't find it, I look 480 00:33:15.279 --> 00:33:17.400 pretty stupid. So if your name's on something, you want to make sure 481 00:33:17.400 --> 00:33:22.359 it's done right, and so you wait till the all reasonable doubt. So 482 00:33:22.400 --> 00:33:25.240 I still function that way. I annoy a lot of people because I always 483 00:33:25.279 --> 00:33:30.559 say, well, that's what's the other facts? Like Bart, my good 484 00:33:30.599 --> 00:33:35.799 old friend Barkatino, we were investigating an area in an undisclosed location near Redwin 485 00:33:35.880 --> 00:33:39.799 National Park and we were on the trail right and our job that day. 486 00:33:39.880 --> 00:33:43.759 We've been on the trail many times before. So we hike up. We 487 00:33:43.799 --> 00:33:45.559 find a place slightly up the hillside, and we sit and we wait. 488 00:33:45.920 --> 00:33:50.000 We get there sometimes right before it gets start, and the whole point is 489 00:33:50.039 --> 00:33:52.000 to sit there right If we gets stark and you wait and hear what you're 490 00:33:52.000 --> 00:33:58.200 here, and then you start doing either calls or knocks. Well, a 491 00:33:58.319 --> 00:34:01.599 month earlier, Bobo and Bart were walking the very same trail and they had 492 00:34:01.640 --> 00:34:06.640 some knocks and sounds and they had something flanked them and move around, and 493 00:34:06.720 --> 00:34:09.760 so they left the tarp on the ground with a recorder going and they left. 494 00:34:10.800 --> 00:34:14.519 They came back later, retrieved the recorder in the tarp, and they 495 00:34:14.599 --> 00:34:19.840 under tarp. They have recordings of something going walking around on the tarp. 496 00:34:21.039 --> 00:34:24.039 Interesting. So a month later Bart and I in same location and that's when 497 00:34:24.079 --> 00:34:29.519 we are out there doing these sounds and knocks, trying to get a response 498 00:34:29.599 --> 00:34:34.039 back. Well before the fighting Bigfoot show, it's try to get it with 499 00:34:34.039 --> 00:34:37.679 some response backs. So we I forget if it was a call or knock, 500 00:34:37.719 --> 00:34:44.360 but we do it and get nothing. We wait a little bit, 501 00:34:44.519 --> 00:34:52.880 we do it again, we knock, and within three minutes we get a 502 00:34:52.960 --> 00:34:55.559 knock back. And that's just a coincidence, right, you know timing. 503 00:34:57.159 --> 00:35:01.239 So we wait seven minutes and we do a call, and three minutes after 504 00:35:01.280 --> 00:35:10.159 that a tree falls down. So I call it the tree failure event and 505 00:35:10.239 --> 00:35:15.199 Bart calls it the tree destruction event. So those are two mindsets of the 506 00:35:15.239 --> 00:35:21.039 same action where Bart has more luck with this therm and he's more on the 507 00:35:21.079 --> 00:35:24.519 page of I know it's out there. I'm totally convinced. Roberts on the 508 00:35:24.559 --> 00:35:28.159 point there, Well, I've got so many things that have happened, but 509 00:35:28.199 --> 00:35:31.360 I can't confirm what it is that made these things happen. So this is 510 00:35:31.400 --> 00:35:34.960 a tree failure. And Bart is on the other side of goal, and 511 00:35:35.000 --> 00:35:39.199 this is a tree destruction, tree failure, tree destruction. We both witness 512 00:35:39.280 --> 00:35:42.920 the same thing. But I'm still holding reserved for a lot of things. 513 00:35:42.920 --> 00:35:45.519 So that pisses a lot of people off, just my good friend Bart, 514 00:35:45.960 --> 00:35:49.360 And every opportunity he gets to say, well, Robert, what are you 515 00:35:49.400 --> 00:35:51.159 going to say now? You know? And I had to come up with 516 00:35:51.159 --> 00:35:52.559 some of that excuse why I don't believe, I'm like, well, you 517 00:35:52.599 --> 00:35:55.599 know, it sounds a little different. So he's always, he's always. 518 00:35:55.760 --> 00:35:59.559 Every time we have a crazy thing happened, he pulls me to the side 519 00:35:59.599 --> 00:36:02.280 and you look in my eyes and he says, so, what do you 520 00:36:02.280 --> 00:36:07.559 say now? What percentage of believer are you now? But if you do 521 00:36:07.639 --> 00:36:12.480 the math, it comes down to forty nine percent is a null and a 522 00:36:12.559 --> 00:36:16.199 fifty is a yes. So I'm on the fifty one percent. There's something 523 00:36:16.199 --> 00:36:20.039 weird going on out there, and we don't I'm not so sure exactly what 524 00:36:20.119 --> 00:36:22.880 it is, but it could very well be a bipedal primate running around. 525 00:36:23.519 --> 00:36:29.599 But I can't say I've seen one. I can't say I heard one. 526 00:36:30.000 --> 00:36:32.719 I can't say I smelled one. I can't say that's the guy who threw 527 00:36:32.800 --> 00:36:37.039 rocks at me. I can't see those are these things because if you don't 528 00:36:37.079 --> 00:36:40.639 see who's doing it, then sid you got to figure out what it is. 529 00:36:42.159 --> 00:36:45.039 All all those things happen to you. But unless you could, you 530 00:36:45.079 --> 00:36:47.760 can't attribute it to it unless you saw it. And he's so here's the 531 00:36:47.800 --> 00:36:52.119 thing too, Robert. So, Kathy and Bob Strain are friends of yours. 532 00:36:52.159 --> 00:36:57.480 Correct, Yes they are, and we've interviewed them, and Kathy probably 533 00:36:57.519 --> 00:37:00.199 for me, has one of the most compelling eyewitness stories that she had in 534 00:37:00.320 --> 00:37:04.679 Area X. Yes, So what do you think about that? I mean, 535 00:37:04.719 --> 00:37:07.800 being that you you know you are skeptic, which is I agree with 536 00:37:07.800 --> 00:37:10.599 you one hundred percent. Is so important. We should be a skeptic to 537 00:37:12.039 --> 00:37:15.360 everything in life that's happening around us. We should always question things. So 538 00:37:15.400 --> 00:37:20.159 what do you say to that kind of experience that Kathy has, And especially 539 00:37:20.239 --> 00:37:23.039 since you know her so well well, I have No, I have no 540 00:37:23.079 --> 00:37:29.119 reason to doubt what she's experienced. Those are her experiences, and I've listened 541 00:37:29.119 --> 00:37:31.960 to her share those things. It's crazy, you know, it's something reacting 542 00:37:32.000 --> 00:37:37.039 to what you do. It's running around's fast, it's smart, it's more 543 00:37:37.079 --> 00:37:40.039 than one and that whole area X thing, it's incredible, and I listen 544 00:37:40.159 --> 00:37:44.280 to talk about it, and I'd like to go there when these days to 545 00:37:44.360 --> 00:37:47.079 experience that as well. I'm not going to say that none of us have 546 00:37:47.159 --> 00:37:50.760 happened. It happens to her, and I believe everything she says about that. 547 00:37:51.800 --> 00:37:53.719 Those are experiences and she's had them, and she's not the only one 548 00:37:53.760 --> 00:37:59.239 who talks about these things. She's been added a long time. And you 549 00:37:59.280 --> 00:38:01.599 know, so it's Bob, her husband. And when they tell me these 550 00:38:01.639 --> 00:38:05.480 things, I take it for what it is. I believe them on the 551 00:38:05.519 --> 00:38:08.960 stories. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I get a little jealous, of 552 00:38:09.000 --> 00:38:13.440 course, to say, well, how come I wasn't there, or what 553 00:38:13.519 --> 00:38:15.880 had that happened to me? Why didn't you invite me on the trip? 554 00:38:15.920 --> 00:38:21.719 Hello? Of course, I've also had something a lot of people don't experience. 555 00:38:22.079 --> 00:38:25.360 They call it the samurai talk. And yeah, I was with Bobo 556 00:38:25.719 --> 00:38:30.440 and this is kind of funny little story here, because the first be Over 557 00:38:30.519 --> 00:38:35.000 expedition that I had the privilege to organize through Matt Moneymaker was and I want 558 00:38:35.039 --> 00:38:37.960 to say, two thousand and four, and it was in the Redwoods, 559 00:38:37.480 --> 00:38:42.199 and I had to get some guest speakers, so I actually had Kathy, 560 00:38:42.320 --> 00:38:47.199 she did a tracking class. I had the two Sarah sound guys on that 561 00:38:47.239 --> 00:38:53.519 one, and Ron moorehead and Dave Barry o Alberry. Yeah, I'm sorry 562 00:38:53.559 --> 00:38:57.079 Alberry. Yeah, I'm a Dave Bury friend of mine. I kept calling 563 00:38:57.119 --> 00:39:00.480 him Dave Berry. Sorry, I'm dyslexic, but I also switched those names. 564 00:39:00.880 --> 00:39:05.840 Yeah. And I have a cousin in Louisiana who I can't pronounce any 565 00:39:05.920 --> 00:39:09.760 Louisiana words properly, and I can't even finish my sentences because he's always that's 566 00:39:09.920 --> 00:39:15.199 uh, you know, that's Chapelia and I chapel a. Well there's an 567 00:39:15.239 --> 00:39:20.760 A and a T, you know. So that's where I'm at, going 568 00:39:20.800 --> 00:39:22.320 back to what I was talking about, if I almost forgot, See when 569 00:39:22.320 --> 00:39:24.880 you get older, you kind of forget that. I know we have that 570 00:39:24.920 --> 00:39:30.719 too. So where you were talking about Kathy and Bob Stream and the yes, 571 00:39:30.840 --> 00:39:34.559 okay, organizing right, right, Yes, So I have the sound 572 00:39:34.559 --> 00:39:40.159 guys, I have and Ron moorehead show off for this. So they're given 573 00:39:40.199 --> 00:39:45.679 their talk and they're talking about all this incredible sear sounds, right, and 574 00:39:45.719 --> 00:39:50.159 then they're playing the tapes and I get to hear this, and I hear 575 00:39:52.639 --> 00:39:53.719 I'm like, why shou I could do that? You know I can make 576 00:39:53.760 --> 00:39:57.639 stuff like that. And I'm selling the tapes for them, you know, 577 00:39:57.679 --> 00:40:01.320 ten bucks to pop and by up for myself. And then I'm in the 578 00:40:01.320 --> 00:40:05.639 back of my mind, I'm going, how do they know? Did they 579 00:40:05.679 --> 00:40:09.480 see? How do they how do they really know? So be careful what 580 00:40:09.519 --> 00:40:16.119 you asked for. Nine months later, I'm on a I'm on a special 581 00:40:16.199 --> 00:40:21.760 Uh well, well the Shelby Car Club is going on a bfor expedition. 582 00:40:21.800 --> 00:40:25.440 It's a special expedition. So, uh, Mail's there, Bobo's there, 583 00:40:25.639 --> 00:40:30.599 I'm there, Matt's there. We're taking our clients out from the East Coast 584 00:40:30.679 --> 00:40:36.719 Shelby Car Club and we're on this We're on this walk up the same area 585 00:40:36.760 --> 00:40:39.960 where Bart and I have had some strengths to happen to us and yhow so 586 00:40:40.000 --> 00:40:44.639 we're we're using night visions, you know, gen Well, ours are like 587 00:40:44.679 --> 00:40:46.880 Gen one and a half, so you see, it's hard to navigate. 588 00:40:47.199 --> 00:40:50.960 But Mail has a g Gen three, so he's done really good with that. 589 00:40:51.440 --> 00:40:53.039 And we're walking up, going really slow because we don't turn the lights 590 00:40:53.039 --> 00:40:59.920 on, and we get overrun by this group that that Bobo's leading, and 591 00:40:59.760 --> 00:41:02.360 they're using their infrared, which means in the low light, your night vision 592 00:41:02.360 --> 00:41:06.599 could pick up the infrared beam you can see like a flashlight. And we're 593 00:41:06.599 --> 00:41:09.000 just stumbling along those root systems trying to get there. So they go in. 594 00:41:09.320 --> 00:41:13.639 They passed us up. Ten minutes later, the radios come on the 595 00:41:13.679 --> 00:41:16.760 portables. It sounds like they're being attacked and ripped the part. And so 596 00:41:16.880 --> 00:41:21.679 basically what happened was is while they were up there, they started hearing calls 597 00:41:21.679 --> 00:41:24.679 and movement around them, and it chased them out. And they had they 598 00:41:24.679 --> 00:41:29.719 had a Gen three night vision, but they couldn't see anything. So they 599 00:41:29.760 --> 00:41:31.679 came out. We went in and we sat there and nothing happens to us. 600 00:41:34.079 --> 00:41:37.360 Becareful, you know, nothing we hear olves, maybe it was ols 601 00:41:37.400 --> 00:41:42.159 they heard, so whatever, so we kind of leave. We're like disappointed. 602 00:41:42.480 --> 00:41:45.079 So we come back the next day and I'm bringing a few other people. 603 00:41:45.199 --> 00:41:49.239 It was Mail, it was Bobo and myself. We're looking around and 604 00:41:49.280 --> 00:41:53.480 we find tracks, large bipedal tracks in the softer soil at the bottom lands 605 00:41:53.480 --> 00:41:59.119 there, which makes me think humph. And then we find a medium size 606 00:41:59.159 --> 00:42:01.519 and a small when it's like Papa Bear, Mama Bear baby beer. But 607 00:42:01.519 --> 00:42:05.679 they just don't look like bear tracks, and so we're like, oh, 608 00:42:05.719 --> 00:42:07.840 this is this is odd and it's the same area where the weird stuff took 609 00:42:07.840 --> 00:42:13.320 place. So we like, finish your expedition. So Sunday rolls around. 610 00:42:13.480 --> 00:42:15.960 I know, I'm just just I'm sorry. I'm worried. You got a 611 00:42:16.000 --> 00:42:20.519 lot of stories. I gotta laid the foundation before. Now we love you 612 00:42:20.519 --> 00:42:24.239 are an amazing storyteller. Keep on keep on telling us, Robert. So, 613 00:42:25.000 --> 00:42:28.719 our our days are fri our days are Sundays. We send the clients 614 00:42:28.719 --> 00:42:30.880 and say bye bye clients, Thanks, it's been a great time, and 615 00:42:30.920 --> 00:42:32.360 then we go out. We spend Sunday night by ourselves. So, Garrett, 616 00:42:32.360 --> 00:42:37.400 where do you think we went? We went to the place where the 617 00:42:37.440 --> 00:42:43.239 strange thing went down. So we're on the hillsides with our listen. Matles 618 00:42:43.239 --> 00:42:46.599 gott is listening device farther up the hill. I'm with Bobo. Our clients 619 00:42:46.639 --> 00:42:50.800 are free. But before we get there, I was supposed to Matt was 620 00:42:50.800 --> 00:42:53.039 supposed to join us. We're supposed to walk up the trail, but right 621 00:42:53.119 --> 00:43:00.119 before we left, something large crashed through the brush at the end, and 622 00:43:00.360 --> 00:43:02.360 Matt decided that he's going to ride with somebody else to go drive up and 623 00:43:02.400 --> 00:43:07.079 down the one road. So I'm going in. So I'm going in and 624 00:43:07.119 --> 00:43:09.719 trying not to use my flashlight because there's something huge out there. We do 625 00:43:09.760 --> 00:43:14.400 have elk, so it could very well have been, and they do frequent 626 00:43:14.440 --> 00:43:17.360 that area, but it was scary, something huge crashing into the brush making 627 00:43:17.400 --> 00:43:22.119 noise on purpose, but not me. I'm too stupid to go in, 628 00:43:22.199 --> 00:43:24.039 so I go it's probably just helf. So I go in there with my 629 00:43:24.079 --> 00:43:28.719 intermittent light, and I thought I was a smart guy. So right where 630 00:43:28.760 --> 00:43:31.440 we made our plan to go up the hill to spend the night, we 631 00:43:31.519 --> 00:43:36.159 flagged it with flags and I was being real smart. I'll use a white 632 00:43:36.239 --> 00:43:39.280 flag. No, no, I'll use bright red flags. They were bright 633 00:43:39.719 --> 00:43:45.719 pink or orange. And I got to that area scared shitless because there's something 634 00:43:45.760 --> 00:43:46.880 I know it was out there, and I'm trying to move fast, so 635 00:43:46.960 --> 00:43:50.320 I try to call my buddies who were up there on the radio, and 636 00:43:50.400 --> 00:43:54.119 they turned them radios off so they won't even listen to me. And they 637 00:43:54.159 --> 00:43:57.599 turn them off because Matt was talking a lot in the radio, so they 638 00:43:57.639 --> 00:44:00.480 want they want to listen to it, so he turned them off. And 639 00:44:00.480 --> 00:44:04.000 then I'm trying to get in there. Hey, where are you guys come 640 00:44:04.039 --> 00:44:07.199 getting? The problem was I got to the location and then I couldn't find 641 00:44:07.239 --> 00:44:12.199 the flags. Well, when you take flags and you put them all the 642 00:44:12.320 --> 00:44:15.360 bright colors at night, you don't see bright colors about flashlights. They blend 643 00:44:15.400 --> 00:44:19.719 in like leaves. You can't even find them. And I don't want to 644 00:44:19.760 --> 00:44:22.800 turn my light on because you know, I don't want to give away the 645 00:44:22.840 --> 00:44:24.199 location. There we're trying to keep it quiet, and then I go, 646 00:44:24.440 --> 00:44:29.199 well, what about night stuff? Well, Robert didn't have any night stuff, 647 00:44:30.039 --> 00:44:32.800 so I turned on the light intermittently t I find you fund the flags. 648 00:44:32.840 --> 00:44:36.519 I made my weight top the top and then thank got them nept there. 649 00:44:36.559 --> 00:44:39.840 So while we're up there, Mel's farther up. He's running into recorder. 650 00:44:40.239 --> 00:44:44.599 Bobo and I were cooking bacon, eating bacon, cooking bacon eating bacon. 651 00:44:44.639 --> 00:44:46.320 They give them some of the milk. The whole idea of the bacon 652 00:44:46.360 --> 00:44:51.559 thing, which is Bobo's favorite thing to do, was during the daytime, 653 00:44:51.599 --> 00:44:53.079 a lot of the smells go uphill. At night time they go back down, 654 00:44:53.639 --> 00:44:58.199 and so we're trying to flood the bottom flat areas where the activity took 655 00:44:58.239 --> 00:45:01.559 place with smell of bacon. We're thinking this would be good, and plus 656 00:45:01.559 --> 00:45:05.760 we got the bacon. It was good, and so we got nothing right. 657 00:45:06.159 --> 00:45:08.360 So we're kind of half asleep. So Bobo and IM are kind of 658 00:45:08.400 --> 00:45:12.480 sitting back to back. He's a lot bigger, so it's small like my 659 00:45:12.599 --> 00:45:15.320 back's to his like hip or something, and you know, so we're sitting 660 00:45:15.360 --> 00:45:21.119 on the still side waiting for I don't know something, and then I was 661 00:45:21.519 --> 00:45:24.519 I was woken up and it was it was really something I've never heard before, 662 00:45:24.840 --> 00:45:28.960 but I take it back. I have heard it before, but never 663 00:45:29.000 --> 00:45:34.679 out in the wild. And it sounded like well yoke. And then I 664 00:45:34.719 --> 00:45:37.000 was awake, and then Bobo's awake and I go, what the hell is 665 00:45:37.000 --> 00:45:42.239 that? And he mouthed, I don't know. Well that was the samurai 666 00:45:42.280 --> 00:45:47.360 talked That was very similar to what we listened to that Ron was playing and 667 00:45:47.400 --> 00:45:52.320 I'm thinking nine months earlier, I was making fun of that stuff, and 668 00:45:52.360 --> 00:45:54.840 here I am on the hillside in the dark, and we had this same 669 00:45:54.920 --> 00:45:58.639 similar thing going through. Now, if I were to say what was being 670 00:45:58.679 --> 00:46:01.079 said, I'd say it was like, can't I go out there now? 671 00:46:01.400 --> 00:46:06.519 Can we go out there now? No? And that was my interpretation of 672 00:46:06.559 --> 00:46:09.480 what was being said. And yeah, that's interesting because we were just talking 673 00:46:09.480 --> 00:46:15.599 to Rick Nelson, Yes Nelson, we were talking about him. I'm sorry, 674 00:46:15.639 --> 00:46:20.400 we haven't talked to him yet. We listened to him and he and 675 00:46:20.519 --> 00:46:23.679 you know, he said that it's a definite language. And you know, 676 00:46:23.760 --> 00:46:29.599 like sometimes if you hear a foreign language, you can you can almost understand 677 00:46:29.599 --> 00:46:31.280 what they're saying, just like you were saying, Robert, like you can 678 00:46:31.280 --> 00:46:36.039 almost translate just by the way that they're you know, they have like you 679 00:46:36.039 --> 00:46:38.159 know, when it's a question or when they're responding and stuff like that. 680 00:46:38.239 --> 00:46:43.320 So that's interesting that you say that it's the voice fluctuations. Whether you speak 681 00:46:43.320 --> 00:46:45.519 a language or not, it's the voice fluctuations. We let you know the 682 00:46:45.599 --> 00:46:49.960 meaning behind it, whether it's aggressive or whether it's soft, or whether it's 683 00:46:49.960 --> 00:46:53.800 funny. It's almost like whether it's a question yet or a statement, and 684 00:46:53.840 --> 00:46:59.280 it sounded like it was. It was like a question followed by a A 685 00:46:58.840 --> 00:47:02.760 A A the answer and the answer was abrupt, and we didn't hear anything 686 00:47:02.760 --> 00:47:07.519 for a while, but we eventually heard something moving on our flank sites around 687 00:47:07.559 --> 00:47:10.880 us, moving up the hill, real quiet, and just just for references, 688 00:47:12.119 --> 00:47:15.039 I want to say that was in two thousand and four, no, 689 00:47:16.039 --> 00:47:19.880 late two thousand and four, two thousand and five, when the Shelby Club 690 00:47:19.920 --> 00:47:23.280 thing was going on. First expedition was two thousand and four when I heard 691 00:47:23.320 --> 00:47:28.880 the sounds from from Ron and stuff. And then it was later on in 692 00:47:29.159 --> 00:47:32.400 Oh Gosh, Time Flies. And then was quite a few years later when 693 00:47:32.400 --> 00:47:37.840 I was with Bart when I when I heard the when we went up to 694 00:47:38.519 --> 00:47:43.719 listen to sounds and we had the knocks return and the tree fall down, 695 00:47:44.159 --> 00:47:47.920 as Bart said, the tree destruction. She felled down. And that's the 696 00:47:47.960 --> 00:47:52.440 same exact area that everything went down at. And here's another coincidental thing. 697 00:47:52.559 --> 00:47:57.199 Is you have something that happens in one area, it's just a coincidence. 698 00:47:57.280 --> 00:48:00.800 Right then you start saying, well it happens, do I do this? 699 00:48:00.480 --> 00:48:04.119 And you say, well, that's more. Is that a coincidence? Well 700 00:48:04.119 --> 00:48:07.480 we did it twice and happened both times. Well that's no longer just a 701 00:48:07.519 --> 00:48:12.840 coincidence. That's almost like a pattern. And so you have an area that's 702 00:48:12.880 --> 00:48:17.599 had several things happen up there, so it's not coincidental. So here's the 703 00:48:17.599 --> 00:48:21.800 skeptic guy who is actually fifty one percent, so he's actually a believer, 704 00:48:21.920 --> 00:48:27.480 had fifty one versus forty forty nine, who still looks at things scientifically and 705 00:48:27.519 --> 00:48:30.360 wants to prove beyond reasonable doubt. Because there's so many people are so quick 706 00:48:30.360 --> 00:48:35.440 to jump at the bandwagon, there's also so many people willing to condemn your 707 00:48:35.440 --> 00:48:39.960 investigation because you don't do it right because you go in the investigation believing that 708 00:48:40.079 --> 00:48:45.800 you have something without really proving it. So you go in with preconceived ideas 709 00:48:45.800 --> 00:48:47.800 of what you have, and you're going to find exactly what you want to 710 00:48:47.800 --> 00:48:52.760 find. When you go in without preconceived ideas and be open to the investigative 711 00:48:52.760 --> 00:48:58.159 aspect of it, you're more open to ponder the evidence and to prove or 712 00:48:58.199 --> 00:49:01.519 disprove it. And when we had the therm siding with Bart in the Sierras, 713 00:49:01.760 --> 00:49:07.800 that's the approach we did over the nine days investigation and that was quite 714 00:49:07.840 --> 00:49:10.239 interesting. And for that investigation, my job is to tear it apart and 715 00:49:10.280 --> 00:49:14.760 just prove it. And that's like a whole story for another evening. But 716 00:49:15.440 --> 00:49:20.760 that was Bart's thermal footage and I was just the lead investigator who told me 717 00:49:20.800 --> 00:49:23.760 to tear it apart, and that's what I tried to do. And that's 718 00:49:24.239 --> 00:49:29.360 that's such a super smart way of approaching things. Yeah, well, this 719 00:49:29.440 --> 00:49:31.760 day and age where so many people are critics, like, you have people 720 00:49:31.840 --> 00:49:36.920 who are jealous of your success and they'll blow holds of what you have. 721 00:49:37.360 --> 00:49:40.639 And then there are people who want to make themselves look smart by putting you 722 00:49:40.679 --> 00:49:45.159 down. And then you have people who are just skeptical. No matter what 723 00:49:45.239 --> 00:49:47.880 happens, they're going to have a skeptical approach to it. And it's okay 724 00:49:47.880 --> 00:49:52.000 to be skeptical, but you should be fair. You should be fair too. 725 00:49:52.079 --> 00:49:57.039 It's so interesting, Robert, are you getting like a less Droud vibe 726 00:49:57.079 --> 00:50:01.440 from Robert? Like are you related to less Droud? Because you you sound 727 00:50:01.519 --> 00:50:05.480 like him, you kind of look like him, you know. It's really 728 00:50:06.159 --> 00:50:07.960 it's funny. I should send the picture up. I don't have it here. 729 00:50:08.559 --> 00:50:13.679 Uh, it's a picture of the shroud in his book cover with this 730 00:50:13.800 --> 00:50:17.360 bandana over his head and sad. Yeah, and then I have a picture 731 00:50:17.400 --> 00:50:22.119 of me holding his book doing the same thing. Oh my god. Okay, 732 00:50:22.119 --> 00:50:24.280 because Robert and you also have like his same kind of philosophy too, 733 00:50:24.320 --> 00:50:29.280 with the approach to Bigfoot. So we did actually interview last he was one 734 00:50:29.320 --> 00:50:31.559 of our first people. But I'm like, you need to do your DNA 735 00:50:31.719 --> 00:50:37.920 and check that out because well, my, my, my, my Canadian 736 00:50:37.960 --> 00:50:42.280 ancestry is from Quebec. That's what it is. Scotia. Do you have 737 00:50:42.360 --> 00:50:45.239 I mean, did you ever live there? No? No, Barn raised 738 00:50:45.239 --> 00:50:52.639 south central Los Angeles and immigrated to uh northern California. Hm. So I'm 739 00:50:52.639 --> 00:50:54.679 looking at my phone right now. Is while we're talking, I was gonna 740 00:50:54.679 --> 00:50:59.559 send you that picture. I almost thought it to you, but but I 741 00:50:59.559 --> 00:51:04.039 didn't. I didn't want to be too forthcoming of depending like the round you 742 00:51:04.119 --> 00:51:07.639 know now you are from the get go. I was like, he's like 743 00:51:07.760 --> 00:51:09.559 his brother, something's going on here. I don't know what is here. 744 00:51:09.639 --> 00:51:14.000 I was thinking the same thing. Oh here, that is so funny. 745 00:51:14.400 --> 00:51:17.039 Yeah, that's awesome. While we're still talking, I'm looking for that picture 746 00:51:17.119 --> 00:51:21.840 right now and I have it in my phone, so I'm looking for as 747 00:51:21.880 --> 00:51:25.480 we talk, I can almost multitask. That's cool because we're like, we're 748 00:51:25.480 --> 00:51:29.079 getting to like the last ten minutes here. We got to get into the 749 00:51:29.079 --> 00:51:30.320 book. So yeah, we need to talk about your book, Robert, 750 00:51:30.400 --> 00:51:35.079 because we want everybody to know about what your book is and what it's about. 751 00:51:35.440 --> 00:51:37.760 It's actually your second book. Correct, I'm sending you that picture right 752 00:51:37.760 --> 00:51:45.719 now. Okay, yeah, so can I see I could probably pull it 753 00:51:45.800 --> 00:51:52.760 up. Oh my god, can we can we do this? I don't 754 00:51:52.760 --> 00:51:54.400 know if this works. No, I'm gonna I can probably do it on 755 00:51:54.800 --> 00:51:59.440 film here. That is so awesome. Doesn't get mad at me, dude, 756 00:52:00.039 --> 00:52:02.400 I mean, so apparently I'm not crazy. So I'm not the first 757 00:52:02.400 --> 00:52:06.280 person that's thought this. No, no, you're not the first person. 758 00:52:06.320 --> 00:52:07.639 It was brought to my attention by somebody else. I thought it'd just have 759 00:52:07.760 --> 00:52:12.039 fun with it. But I mean, I think now because this was taken 760 00:52:12.199 --> 00:52:15.400 that was a picture of Less taken a while ago. But like Less, 761 00:52:15.719 --> 00:52:19.960 you know his age since that picture, so he's got a little that little 762 00:52:20.000 --> 00:52:22.840 bit of you know, sprinkling of white going on, do you know what 763 00:52:22.880 --> 00:52:27.280 I mean? So I think even now more than ever. You really look 764 00:52:27.360 --> 00:52:31.119 and you sound like him, and you just weird have the same words, 765 00:52:31.199 --> 00:52:37.199 you have the same philosophy. So it's pretty cool. But anyways, we 766 00:52:37.239 --> 00:52:43.119 want to hear about your book. Yeah, the Bluffcak Project book. Yeah, 767 00:52:43.239 --> 00:52:47.199 so tell us about that. Well, it all started, No, 768 00:52:49.400 --> 00:52:54.320 it started when I was into videography and I met Steven Stroyford a while back, 769 00:52:54.480 --> 00:52:59.960 and I think in two thousand and seven, it was a special event 770 00:53:00.039 --> 00:53:04.880 at the forty fifth anniversary and I was with I met Steven at the uh 771 00:53:05.480 --> 00:53:09.000 at the uh in in Willow Creek, and then after that event, we 772 00:53:09.039 --> 00:53:13.800 went over to Lost Camp and we chatted around the campfire and he was talking 773 00:53:13.800 --> 00:53:16.760 about this lost film site which he went to the two thousand and three when 774 00:53:16.760 --> 00:53:21.880 they couldn't find it anyhow, he's talking about it and and I said, 775 00:53:21.880 --> 00:53:23.000 oh, yeh, that'd be great. And a few years go by, 776 00:53:23.360 --> 00:53:28.400 and then in two thousand and nine I get involved with videography. So for 777 00:53:28.480 --> 00:53:34.159 the BFRO, I'm after videotaping everything and I edited out so we have over 778 00:53:34.159 --> 00:53:37.960 one hundred had over one hundred YouTube videos on the on the BFUR YouTube channel 779 00:53:38.000 --> 00:53:42.079 that I was editing and doing so that was a big thing for a couple 780 00:53:42.119 --> 00:53:44.519 of years. I you know, give the guy a camera and he goes 781 00:53:44.559 --> 00:53:47.280 crazy, right, and so then teach him how to edit, you know, 782 00:53:47.559 --> 00:53:51.559 instead of instead of giving me fish, they taught me how to fish. 783 00:53:51.599 --> 00:53:54.320 So I was just like going crazy with it. So I decided to 784 00:53:54.880 --> 00:53:58.679 do these things. And one of the projects was Steven, so Stephen and 785 00:53:58.719 --> 00:54:01.199 Ian we're going to go find it film site that got misplaced. And at 786 00:54:01.199 --> 00:54:05.239 that point I really didn't care where it was or anything about it. I'd 787 00:54:05.239 --> 00:54:07.079 been to the area, but it wasn't big, it wasn't important to me. 788 00:54:07.840 --> 00:54:12.440 It was just, ah, yeah, that's nice, I'll go somewhere 789 00:54:12.480 --> 00:54:15.880 else anyhow. So I liked the area, but didn't care about the film 790 00:54:15.920 --> 00:54:17.599 site. There's only zealiz go to the film site, you know, and 791 00:54:17.639 --> 00:54:22.039 I'm not as zealot, so I wouldn't do that. So I go over 792 00:54:22.039 --> 00:54:24.400 and and I show up at the bookstore in twenty ten, and now on 793 00:54:24.519 --> 00:54:30.280 the on their new videographer who's going to film them up in the research. 794 00:54:30.920 --> 00:54:34.000 So I kind of got suckered in after a few days. The next thing, 795 00:54:34.039 --> 00:54:36.559 you know, I was no longer the videographer. Well I was the 796 00:54:36.639 --> 00:54:39.760 videographer, but now I was a member of the team of three. It 797 00:54:39.840 --> 00:54:45.119 was I was asking questions because I was learning that Stephen was He's a great 798 00:54:45.159 --> 00:54:47.719 speaker, he has a lot of knowledge, and he had blogs going on, 799 00:54:47.760 --> 00:54:52.159 so everything was a PowerPoint. So we sat down in his office at 800 00:54:52.159 --> 00:54:55.480 the Big Foot Books and we went down his blog like it was an outline, 801 00:54:55.840 --> 00:54:58.800 and I learned so much about it, and I got to the point 802 00:54:58.800 --> 00:55:00.159 where I was, hey, this is kind of pretty cool, you know, 803 00:55:00.239 --> 00:55:04.239 may hey, we should find it. And then it's like, that's 804 00:55:04.239 --> 00:55:07.760 why we started. So in twenty ten we did the basic bulk research. 805 00:55:07.199 --> 00:55:10.400 About twenty eleven, we kind of had an idea where it was, and 806 00:55:10.440 --> 00:55:15.639 we finished out into twenty eleven where we were convinced. I was probably the 807 00:55:15.679 --> 00:55:19.000 last guy to get convinced. But it started out with Steve and Ian, 808 00:55:19.239 --> 00:55:24.360 then me and then Uh then then Uh then Ian kind of backed out a 809 00:55:24.360 --> 00:55:28.719 little bit because of health issues and family back east, and then I pulled 810 00:55:28.760 --> 00:55:34.960 in Rowdy and then we ended up pulling in Jamie ended up pulling in a 811 00:55:34.960 --> 00:55:38.360 bunch of other players too, and kIPS involved with this, Tates involved with 812 00:55:38.440 --> 00:55:44.800 this, uh, Dustin seevers is involved with this. People gonna get mad 813 00:55:44.800 --> 00:55:46.440 if I can't remember all their names. I know, I'm yeah, and 814 00:55:46.519 --> 00:55:49.519 we're not going to get into the last names. Just too many. Yeah, 815 00:55:49.559 --> 00:55:53.199 yeah, yeah, yeah, I'll not. So it's it's it's a 816 00:55:53.199 --> 00:55:57.559 group and we've been doing it since then. But so in the process of 817 00:55:57.840 --> 00:56:01.519 doing the videographies, uh, it's like a well in twenty twelve, we 818 00:56:01.599 --> 00:56:05.559 bring him up, Bill Munts down and we show him the site because Bill 819 00:56:05.639 --> 00:56:08.079 Mum's never been there before, but he did magic. He's got a great 820 00:56:08.079 --> 00:56:14.400 book out something about Patty and yeah, I can't remember the name right now, 821 00:56:14.440 --> 00:56:16.559 sorry, but he did a lot of work. So we brought him 822 00:56:16.559 --> 00:56:20.400 down and showed him the site and it was it was a great to watch 823 00:56:20.480 --> 00:56:22.679 him walk down there and just as soon as he got close to the big 824 00:56:22.719 --> 00:56:29.960 trees, this thing developed on his face. And he stayed there for the 825 00:56:30.000 --> 00:56:32.800 longest time and it was really cool talking about it. And he had his 826 00:56:32.960 --> 00:56:37.559 trees and he's double check out what he had. But we do have to 827 00:56:37.599 --> 00:56:39.079 We had to remind him a couple of times. Well Steven did that, 828 00:56:39.239 --> 00:56:44.320 you know when he's on podcasts, that there was this group called the Bluff 829 00:56:44.320 --> 00:56:46.280 Creek Project who kind of helped you find the place, so you got to 830 00:56:46.280 --> 00:56:51.639 remember that credit where credit is due. So about ten years go by and 831 00:56:51.679 --> 00:56:53.159 then I'd said, you know, we should make this an a book, 832 00:56:53.199 --> 00:56:59.559 hard copy for I'd written several books at that time, fiction, mostly fiction, 833 00:57:00.079 --> 00:57:01.119 and I go, well, this is kind of like not fiction. 834 00:57:01.239 --> 00:57:05.159 It's true, it's nonfiction, so we should do it. So I wrote 835 00:57:05.159 --> 00:57:07.519 the nonfiction book. I got other members of the team to contribute articles. 836 00:57:07.559 --> 00:57:10.960 Steven did the forward for it. And it was a great project. And 837 00:57:12.440 --> 00:57:16.360 it's kind of I love it, you know, it's it's it's it's just 838 00:57:16.400 --> 00:57:21.719 a perfect way to get away from me, perfect weight to hold thing's up, 839 00:57:22.519 --> 00:57:23.920 keeps the doors, you know, open when I want to do it. 840 00:57:24.800 --> 00:57:30.840 And so we've been trying to tell people about about the film site and 841 00:57:30.400 --> 00:57:34.079 make sure they got the facts right. There's still some people who don't believe 842 00:57:34.079 --> 00:57:37.119 it, but they don't go down to the right area. But that's just 843 00:57:37.079 --> 00:57:39.679 the way it is. So how long did it take you? So you 844 00:57:39.679 --> 00:57:44.920 started the project and you said twenty ten, Yeah, well, twenty ten 845 00:57:45.000 --> 00:57:47.239 is when we started doing the video part of it, and ten to twenty 846 00:57:47.360 --> 00:57:52.679 eleven. The twenty eleven to twenty twelve. I'd say about two years ish, 847 00:57:52.079 --> 00:57:59.079 two years to pretty much be convinced. I mentioned earlier that your name 848 00:57:59.159 --> 00:58:02.559 means something to you, your reputation and being the person I am and who 849 00:58:02.599 --> 00:58:06.280 I work for, I want to make sure that I'm interpret it correctly. 850 00:58:06.760 --> 00:58:08.559 So we want to make sure the book was right, and we and that's 851 00:58:08.559 --> 00:58:12.599 why we didn't jump too early on the gun. We want to make sure 852 00:58:12.639 --> 00:58:15.119 it's done right. So I was like the last guy to say, okay, 853 00:58:15.119 --> 00:58:16.960 okay, I believe you, because I just wanted to make sure that 854 00:58:17.000 --> 00:58:22.159 everything was right. And people enjoyed the book. It's not just about Bigfoot. 855 00:58:22.239 --> 00:58:23.840 It's got a lot of other things associated with it, and it was 856 00:58:23.960 --> 00:58:28.239 kind of fun to write. I remember some people look at it and go, 857 00:58:28.239 --> 00:58:30.320 wait, you got too many pictures in here. Well, yeah, 858 00:58:30.400 --> 00:58:35.400 pictures speak, pictures tell stories. Yeah, there are a lot of pictures 859 00:58:35.400 --> 00:58:39.840 in there. So it's a big book. Like it's a big book book 860 00:58:39.880 --> 00:58:45.159 because all the pictures in it. But yeah, there's a lot to say 861 00:58:45.199 --> 00:58:49.119 and a lot is involved in the story, and the pictures helped describe what's 862 00:58:49.119 --> 00:58:52.760 going on. And we've got maps in there. We threw maps in order 863 00:58:52.760 --> 00:58:57.719 to find the film site, we had to grid out the fanbar. And 864 00:58:57.840 --> 00:59:01.880 since rene's the hindins over seventy one, you can't climb the hillside and take 865 00:59:01.920 --> 00:59:06.800 that picture. It's a forest, so you had to go on site. 866 00:59:07.079 --> 00:59:12.599 Do north south lines, create blocks squares of thirty foot, draw in the 867 00:59:12.760 --> 00:59:17.519 artifacts of the thirty foot then compare what you have with the hindon seventy one 868 00:59:19.119 --> 00:59:21.840 and then you have your match. And that's what we did. And they 869 00:59:21.880 --> 00:59:24.239 also have the background trees. A lot of people just use the background trees. 870 00:59:24.800 --> 00:59:28.719 Well there's a lot of big trees, but they're not always in the 871 00:59:28.760 --> 00:59:31.840 patterns you see. But it was easier for me in my mind to understand 872 00:59:31.840 --> 00:59:37.880 it if I use the artifacts, which are the stuffs, logs, positions, 873 00:59:37.239 --> 00:59:40.760 and compare it with the background series. And that was helpful. And 874 00:59:40.920 --> 00:59:44.400 since they're still there, I mean, because the film was you know, 875 00:59:44.519 --> 00:59:50.519 nineteen sixty seven. So Robert, how can people follow you? Like are 876 00:59:50.559 --> 00:59:53.840 you active on social media? Well, not real active in social media. 877 00:59:53.880 --> 00:59:57.719 I'm still like that recluse guide that you know, you still banish. So 878 00:59:57.760 --> 01:00:00.880 when it comes to stuff, but the Bluff Creek Project, it has everything 879 01:00:00.960 --> 01:00:05.000 that has we also have a camera project and they post the camera footage. 880 01:00:05.400 --> 01:00:09.280 We have the special events like on after big Foot Days, and we have 881 01:00:09.360 --> 01:00:14.760 a booth and we talked to people about it. I went to beach Foot, 882 01:00:14.840 --> 01:00:19.159 which is kind of nice. Did that just happen? He just got 883 01:00:19.199 --> 01:00:24.719 back from Beachfoot? Yeah yeah yeah. Uh. I Kip, my good 884 01:00:24.719 --> 01:00:29.679 buddy Kip talked me into speaking there. So I spoke there. It was 885 01:00:29.760 --> 01:00:35.000 kind of fun. And I also did some more speaking stuff over at Willow 886 01:00:35.000 --> 01:00:37.800 Creek and so it's kind of fun doing all these different things. I'm looking 887 01:00:37.840 --> 01:00:42.920 at it right now in the book too. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah. 888 01:00:42.920 --> 01:00:46.119 For the folks that are watching and not listening here, I just pulled 889 01:00:46.159 --> 01:00:51.119 up the Amazon website thing, the Blove Creek Project, and for you are 890 01:00:51.159 --> 01:00:53.559 listening, you can you can just type that in or Robert's name and you 891 01:00:53.719 --> 01:00:57.199 definitely can find it there. So I just want to make sure we shared 892 01:00:57.199 --> 01:01:00.079 that as well. Yeah, absolutely, yeah, Yeah, it's it's it's 893 01:01:00.119 --> 01:01:04.639 a nice book. I really like it. It's it's done very well. 894 01:01:04.840 --> 01:01:08.880 And uh we got we got a few good reviews and and I guess the 895 01:01:08.880 --> 01:01:14.159 most thing people say about it is that it flows. It's it's a good 896 01:01:14.199 --> 01:01:17.159 read. It's not just about the bigfoot stuff. There's a lot of ride 897 01:01:17.199 --> 01:01:22.039 of other things associated with it, so so which is kind of nice and 898 01:01:22.039 --> 01:01:25.679 that I really appreciate. So, yeah, we don't have Yeah, we 899 01:01:25.719 --> 01:01:29.679 don't get that. We will. Yeah, and we could have. We 900 01:01:29.679 --> 01:01:31.280 could have done a whole show on just on that. Probably. Yeah, 901 01:01:32.760 --> 01:01:36.679 don't worry, Robert, our cat jumped on our laps while we were talking 902 01:01:36.679 --> 01:01:37.880 a few minutes. Well, I just had some people walk in the house 903 01:01:37.920 --> 01:01:43.039 to it. Okay, no worries were our time. Yeah, yeah, 904 01:01:43.039 --> 01:01:45.440 no worries, Robert. Yeah, but we thank you so much for being 905 01:01:45.480 --> 01:01:49.920 on the show. You are like super super interesting and you're such a great 906 01:01:49.960 --> 01:01:52.639 storyteller. You know, it would be awesome to actually meet you in person 907 01:01:52.639 --> 01:01:55.559 one day, so hopefully that'll happen. Him and less together, Yeah, 908 01:01:55.559 --> 01:02:00.000 you and your brother lest Yeah, he's probably it's probably a third cousin once 909 01:02:00.119 --> 01:02:05.840 removed or something. You never know, you know. Yeah, well apples 910 01:02:05.840 --> 01:02:07.320 don't fall very far. And you know, I'm not going to say, 911 01:02:07.360 --> 01:02:10.679 yeah, what we're related. But it is funny though, you know sometimes 912 01:02:10.719 --> 01:02:15.440 that the mannerisms people tell the mannerisms. Yeah, and you know, get 913 01:02:15.440 --> 01:02:19.760 that nice shot in there. Yeah, yeah, I think so for sure. 914 01:02:21.320 --> 01:02:22.519 I'm going to ask him. Yeah, we're going to ask him next 915 01:02:22.519 --> 01:02:25.800 time we talked to him. All right, Robert, thanks again, We 916 01:02:25.880 --> 01:02:30.440 really appreciate you being on the show. Well, it's been a pleasure and 917 01:02:30.480 --> 01:02:32.760 thanks thanks for talking and hope hopefully you pull me back on again. And 918 01:02:32.800 --> 01:02:37.000 I absolute, oh my god, you're full of stories. We love you. 919 01:02:37.159 --> 01:02:42.400 And Robert's going to be in the next book too, really cool, 920 01:02:42.760 --> 01:02:46.920 excited for that. So thanks again, Robert, thank you. Right, 921 01:02:46.960 --> 01:02:52.960 it's been a pleasure. Thank you so much. That was super cool. 922 01:02:53.280 --> 01:02:55.920 So, I mean he's he's been around. I mean, he's just such, 923 01:02:57.840 --> 01:03:00.320 he's got so much information in his background, the woods. He's just 924 01:03:00.360 --> 01:03:06.280 everything you want and he's his objective point of view is Yeah, I love 925 01:03:06.360 --> 01:03:08.599 that open minded. But but a skeptic you have to have to be. 926 01:03:08.679 --> 01:03:14.360 You have to be unless you see something making a sound or doing something you 927 01:03:14.360 --> 01:03:19.079 can't you know, you have to. That's a whole different skeptic and everybody, 928 01:03:19.119 --> 01:03:22.880 this is our kitty. Ya. No, it's been jumping yeah on 929 01:03:22.039 --> 01:03:25.800 us during the whole podcast, jumping on the whole time. She wants love. 930 01:03:25.840 --> 01:03:30.119 I think it's because we're getting close to dinner time. Maybe everybody say 931 01:03:30.199 --> 01:03:35.880 hi, leayah hire everybody. We thank you guys. Thanks guys so much 932 01:03:35.920 --> 01:03:38.079 for being here. We're so don't forget to comment. If you have any 933 01:03:38.159 --> 01:03:43.719 questions, you can comment. We're always around to uh to answer your questions 934 01:03:43.800 --> 01:03:47.960 and we appreciate you. We're going to play a quick promo video before we 935 01:03:49.000 --> 01:03:53.199 take it out. See you guys later. Hi, are you ready to 936 01:03:53.320 --> 01:03:58.719 uncover the mysteries of Bigfoot? Join us for Squatch Con Idaho twenty twenty three. 937 01:03:59.159 --> 01:04:00.920 This year, we're bringing the magic directly to your screen, or join 938 01:04:01.000 --> 01:04:05.679 us in person. Witness the world premiere of the enhanced Paul Freeman Bigfoot Footage. 939 01:04:06.039 --> 01:04:11.119 Doug Hicheck discovered a secret within this enhanced video you'll have to see to 940 01:04:11.159 --> 01:04:15.800 believe. Hear from an all star panel of Bigfoot experts like doctor Jeffrey Meldrum, 941 01:04:15.920 --> 01:04:18.840 Cliff Barrockman, Brian King Sharp, and Michael Freeman. But that's not 942 01:04:18.960 --> 01:04:25.239 all. 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