The Chilly Effect is sponsored by Wall Street Window dot com and listeners like you
yeah, and now in O Media Chucky May four, May the fourth be
with you. I guess it is a Star Wars holiday right as I speak
live allegedly according to that thing we call a calendar. Indeed, it is
the fourth of May twenty twenty three, and here we are live on Ocelli
dot com Radio, which, by the way, there was an outage on
many, many, many radio broadcasting platforms, and I think mine might have
been down for a couple of days. But we are back to live,
and those of you listening on the podcast, you don't care anyway, But
I'm still putting out the podcast doing all that good stuff. And here we
are again. Boy, the week flew by quickly. We are back around
to Thursday. And last Thursday, I wasn't feeling well, tried to go
to air, and no, I'm not releasing that podcast, but I am
going to redo the show minus one element. No Carmine Savastano tonight, although
we're gonna get Carmine with us again. Scheduling I guess prohibited him from joining
us tonight. But we are blessed as per usual, I've got Mike Swanson
in the first hour, the guy behind Wallstreet Window dot com be in the
no go to Wall Street Window dot com. He's also the author of the
War State, Why the Vietnam War, the first in a series of three
books, three planned books on that conflict, but author of many other pieces
of work out there. Actually wrote an introduction to a book that his dad
wrote that's up on Amazon anyway, links to all that in the show notes.
And yes, indeed my voice is still a little weak. But what
are you gonna do? Sore throats or sore throats? And I'll try and
get the shutting up as quickly as I can. Michael Swanson with me in
the first hour, second hour. Larry Hancock, the author is so many
books. I'm not going to bother to list him right now, but you
can always go to Larry dash Hancock dot com and check that out, and
I advise you to read his blog. You know, we've been talking aliens,
we've been talking Russia, JFK assassination randomly. I have no idea what
we're going to get into tonight, because I had a plan last week,
but it might have went awry. Anyways, let's get to it, Mike
Swanson, and I did go to air five minutes late on the live stream,
but again, podcasters podcatchers don't really tell time. You don't care.
You could be listening to this anytime anywhere and it doesn't really matter. But
as I speak, it is just about eleven minutes after eight pm Eastern time
here and what we used to call America. Mike Swanson, I know I
sound more coherent this week than usual, although my normal sloppiness is in play.
How are you doing tonight, sir? Oh, I'm doing good.
It's good to talk with you head a week where I've been taking it easy
quite frankly. So we did the show last week. Um it helps spur
me into making a decision to slow down myself. And UM, I've I'm
I have a a table that's right in front of me that I'm looking at
that has one two over fifteen stacks of piles of papers documents that are supposed
to be a chapter in a book that and it's been sitting there for for
several years now. So is that the next Vietnam book or is that something?
Yeah? Yeah, And I'm not really exactly sure if it's gonna be
just a Vietnam book. It's gonna be a sequel to both those two books.
Really, But I've decided, um to slow down my website and stop
doing these. It takes me ninety minutes to put out these morning emails I've
been doing for the past couple of years. Oh yeah, for the listeners,
you know, it's great to sign up for those uh you get.
I mean, look, it's a totally different thing than what you get from
JP s Attilla who does the rundown um And it's another sort of a quick
news brief over there, and I get him every morning to stop it.
So oh okay, in order to free up time so I can, uh,
you know, to write a book and write other things. Well,
and you do have some people putting out articles over there on the website.
I've slowed that down to what I'm referencing all kinds of stuff. You're gonna
slow down, okay, yeah, yeah, yeah. I've been updating the
website every single day or Monday through Friday, and I'm probably just gonna do
it once once a week. Um. Well, you know, for people
that that do like some kind harder labor job, they're sitting there going these
guys are complaining about doing websites. But I'm gonna tell you something. It
becomes quite dreaming when you have to continuously work on these things and you have
to keep updating them on a daily basis. I mean generally speaking. I
mean, I've slowed down quite a bit with the podcasts, right but that's
gonna speed back up, and we're gonna start putting out you know, twenty
podcasts a week again. It's gonna be there. I mean, I'm not
personally gonna talk on twenty podcasts, but I'm gonna go back to my five
as per usual. You know, Chris has three. That's eight right there.
You know what I'm saying. We're gonna pump out a bunch of stuff,
but it becomes exhausting if you don't stop. And you know, he's
back a little bit. You got editing and placement, and you wind up
a lot of hours on a computer and it's not the healthiest activity really for
the organism that you are. You know what I'm saying. It gets to
working on your eyes. I really, you know, I wasn't. I
really want to do more serious writing, and I came to conclusion just thicking
back over the past year of a couple of things that I wrote that had
a big impact or you know, I don't mean like one hundred thousand people
read them, but a couple of thousand people read them that are important.
And you saw some actions off of your stuff. I mean on a local
level. You saw people actually react and things happened due to the information that
you were putting out. And that's the thing is that you can choose to
pump out a high volume of stuff truthfully and you know, and it's a
crapshoot, or you can really focus your energies and put out things selectively.
Right. And uh, you know, last night I was going to do
a show live by the Way, and a cult priestess who was scheduled to
be with me, she broke a twoth earlier in the day. So it
wasn't me taking the break. But I'm noticing a lot of people are,
you know, tripping over things and needing to slow down because you know,
we're trying to pump out a lot of stuff. Yeah. I like,
basically two or three years ago, I had every year with you know,
starting like two or three years ago. I would start the year out and
I would say well, I'm gonna have to make a decision. I'm either
gonna have to slow down and start to write books and do things more creative
than I want to do, or try to turn this into some big news
website of more writers and really make this into some giant thing. And at
you know, I finally made a decision. Well, I'm just gonna slow
down. And one thing about it is, um a couple of things,
the things I have written, that's say, in the past ten months,
I didn't need a giant platform to get them out. They just kind of
went viral on their own. And one article was one that we talked about
on your show about the LBJ tapes and the Kenny assassination. Well, I've
got you know, I could write an article about that once a month with
more free time, with original research, and would actually be more conducive.
I if I want to sell more books, it helps do that or drive
up interest in the next book whenever it comes out. But I'm more interested
in researching and you know, doing that and just you just spitting trying to
feed the news cycle. Uh really with all with talking about the markets and
whatever. Oh yeah on the website. So and I've decided to change things
up a little bit. We're not always gonna have two hour programs. There's
gonna be a lot of one hour programs. And we're gonna add video elements.
Even though I've been dragged, kicking and screaming into that, there's gonna
be more video stuff going on, and um, I want to focus more
on getting out things that are more informative, more educational. So that's going
to happen. Plus uh, you know, and this is the thing.
You have different shifts when you're doing this where look, for a little while,
it's great to just pump out a ton of stuff and uh and see
where it goes. But I mean, ultimately, uh, you got you
gotta be choosy about this kind of stuff. And again, I know some
people out there might be going, well, I got a hard job.
You know, you're working with a computer and whatnot. But the truth is
that any of this stuff can become quite draining and you got to you gotta
make a cost benefit analysis. What is the thing that you want to accomplish?
Right? Um, And I'm very much building up to this, uh,
you know, to Dallas in November. Ultimately that's going to be a
big thing for me, and it's going to mark a serious change here.
Um, we're going to go forward with a different game plan, okay,
um using facilities. Yeah yeah. With that topic, Karma has been doing
looking through the recent files. He's written a couple two articles about he's interested
in these defectors, Soviet defectors and what their stories are, and not just
the famous ones like Nussenka, but all of them and he's you know,
studying that. But he's hopefully we'll get him on the show soon. I'll
just say he's found a real explosive JFK document, not in terms of solving
it or something, but one. Uh, you know, we'll have to
get him on the show to get them to talk about. But no one,
you know, it's not out there yet. No, in the next
couple of weeks, a unique piece of work from Carmine is gonna come up.
And there's gonna be some unique work here because finally we've had enough time
to go through a bunch of things, a bunch of us now, uh,
and it's been very interesting and quite frankly, Larry's working on that that
you know UAPR you know stuff right now that is fascinating. Um, it's
very academic and dry reading to some people, but the truth is, I
mean, that's gonna be quite interesting. Uh. He's still not going to
get away from the JFK stuff. He's likely going to be in Dallas also
in November. UM, And I just think it's going to be a very
interesting year for all of us because it is time that that that that our
impact is much much better measured, and we're all gonna make choices. I
mean, I'm gonna love to see you write more books. I mean,
I appreciate what you do with the website and everything, but I love when
you actually put together a volume. And if the Vietnam series evolves, Um,
it'll be great to just sort of get a full on twentieth century view
from you with geopolitics, because again, I love the War State and where
it takes us up to there going forward and fleshing some other things out that
have happened since basically where that book sort of stops is huge, you know,
So I'm looking forward to that stuff and what could be built off of
it. Frankly, why why is there not a documentary that is of the
same name about the War State? Why? You know what I'm saying like,
I think these kinds of things could get done, and uh not not
saying that you need to do them. What I'm saying is that other people
might get interested in this material and want to um transpose it to other types
of media. And I think that's going to be something that's going on here.
I hear tell of a bunch of different people that we know off and
on maybe having interest and going forward with films and things. So I'd love
to see that that whole thing happen. And yeah, I just I just
look forward to the evolution of this stuff, and I think it's going to
be an interesting time. I just hope that we don't fall into the same
ruts, you know, because sadly, we have twenty twenty four selection coming
up, Mike, and you know that's gonna occupy a whole lot of air
in every room everywhere, right, I mean, that's gonna be a big
deal, isn't it. Well that's one thing too, Like I know,
for the past couple of years, I've been compiling these morning headlines and setting
them out. Um, I'm still set out occasion. I'm still gonna set
out occasional emails, but I'm not gonna be doing that, you know,
and you mentioned JP's attille. I highly recommend everyone get his. Go to
news vandal dot com and subscribed. It is his is a daily email.
But yeah, I mean, I'm telling you it. It took me ninety
minutes to put mine together. It's got to take him at multiple hours to
do what he does. Oh, I mean it is the four or five
six hours a day because he's finding you know, I mean, I'll just
tell you how. I mean, I don't he's going. Well, he
told you in your show once. He just has lots of websites bookmarked and
goes through them every single day, right, and he balances out a whole
bunch of things where he goes for you know, the opposing view. Okay,
so you got a headline story, let's say, and let's just talk
about Okay, it's Trump and his most recent legal woes. Right, So
he'll get an article which is clearly very sympathetic to him, you know,
sort of right wingy press, right, and then he'll go and get a
left wing attack sort of article and place that with something that might seem a
little more neutral, uh, you know, from the standard news feeds.
If you will right, your your reuters, and your associated press and put
them all together. And what he does is it creates a snapshot of that
thing where you get it from all sides, right, and then each one
of these little beats in the story tell a story in and of themselves if
you just read the headlines, you know. So, I mean that's kind
of a complex construct there, which he puts together. And yeah, it
takes several hours. Um. And he's another one who's thinking about changing up
the way he's doing stuff and you know, getting back to uh, you
know, his real bread and butter, because he's he's really a superb writer.
Yeah, I mean really, you know, no offense to you or
anything, but he's probably one of the best writers that we know, just
pure authors of information. He tells very interesting stories without coloring them too much,
but at the same time giving you a flair and various color commentary without
leaning, you know, hard into one agenda or another. He lays out
a lot of information and very succinctly in an entertaining way, which is extremely
rare. I mean, right, I mean, there's not a lot of
authors that can do the type of work that JP does. And he's very
undervalued. A lot of people used to pay him to do that, and
he used to be able to make a good living off it and not so
much nowadays. So you know, he's had to shift the way that he's
putting things out. And the rundown is an unpaid thing. You know,
people kick in a little bit here or there, but I mean it's it's
not something that people paid for. You know. Would people pay a dollar
or two a day? I think they should. I would, you know,
I mean not a day, but I mean a couple of dollars a
month. I think it would be fair to subscribe to him for a couple
of dollars a month. I support him on Patreon for a few dollars,
you know, not a lot. I don't got a lot, but you
know, but if everybody who read that thing kicked in a couple of dollars,
the guy would make a living, you know what I'm saying. So
that's the other thing is trying to monetize and utilize the skills that you have
as a content creator. Who is one of some skill you know, not
just somebody's throwing things up against a wall, but somebody who puts things together
with a great deal of thought. That's becoming a challenge too. And thus
we're back around to what you were talking about, which is, you know,
you're now going to start focusing more on the long form and the books
and more substantive presentations, right yeah, yeah, And it could be an
article, you know, a couple of thousand words like the one that did
a bit at LBJ. I got a couple ideas and in mind. But
you know one thing that well I asked the other other week you mentioned Elon
Musk. Well, oh yeah, well you know one thing that started just
drain on me on the other stuff. I started to feel like actually putting
out looking at for me, looking at this stuff, the news cycles.
What I was really looking at every morning, I was looking at the financial
media, all the major financial websites, what their top stories of the day
are, and then looking at I mean, you can do this with the
RSS feeds, Google News, other aggregators. You could see what the top
headlines of the day are throughout the media. And what I One thing I'll
say I've learned is I believe and I subscribe to a couple of newspapers online,
major newspapers. But I'll just say that I've come to inclusion that the
Financial Times in the Wall Street Journal, as far as straight news of what's
going on, are the two best publications. But that said, one thing
that really has just in this school link into the R twenty twenty four thing.
One thing that I've found grading as I've been doing this, is that
so often the news cycle it's just dominated by garbage stories. We saw the
balloon story panic a couple of months ago, but uh, multiple times,
and I'm not talking about Twitter here, but multiple times. There have been
a couple moments this year. And there's one two weeks ago where Elon Musk
became you know, there's a stupid story about Elon Musk on all the websites,
all the major websites, and it was something about AI something something dumb.
Well, it's a strange Yeah, no, it's a strange landscape.
And by the way, you know, I don't want to look at that
crap I got, I got here. I don't want to look at Elon
Musk garbage, right, I don't want to spend you know, here it
is again here we go, And you know, did you take note recently
of the way news Break is marketing themselves now no, how okay, well,
no, their their most recent push is you don't need local news anymore
because we are your local news where Yeah, no, I get it on
my on my YouTube, you know, because I don't pay for any of
that stuff, So I gotta deal with all the ads. Uh. So
on all my video platforms that have any sort of commercials, and also on
my audio platforms. Uh if you subscribe to some of the you know,
radio things, even if you have commercial free radio, they'll insert commercials every
once in a while, right if you go with the free service, you
know what I'm saying. Um, and a lot of them are are they're
they're actually literally paying for ad space all over the place. Hey, we're
a news break and we are your local news no matter where you are,
which you know you you talked about this well ahead of their marketing campaign,
that this is precisely what they were doing. And I told you it seemed
to me like everybody in the world was starting to use news break picking up
their local stories even no longer going to you know, the local constitution or
whatever it is that's in their area anymore. Right, we talked about the
death of local news essentially, and and we were talking about this thing as
an aggregation tool. It's literally become the thing. Right, So, no
matter where you are, your local news can be customed because of news breaks.
So the apps are another part of the game here, right, Well
oh man, yeah good decided another advertising like that. Well, I just
say I sold out and um submitted myself. I'm a I've written three articles
for them. Okay, so now you are part of what they're going to
present to people in Virginia right as we're the local news for Virginia, and
it'll be yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Um. You
know, when we first were talking about them, I was like, well
they were. They were linking to my website. I would write a local
news story, they would linked to it, and I would get sometimes thousands
of hints. And then starting around New Year's they stopped linking to my website,
and I noticed the Lee Enterprises, giant conglomerate local newspaper, they stopped
linking to them too. They continue to link to mote to the others locally
where I live, but it looks like a lot most of them had made
some sort of deal where they're taking their articles and sharing the ad revenue or
something and that's a program they have for publishing companies. Well, I submitted
to join that because I gave up that they'd ever linked to me again.
They never responded. So then I said, well, I don't care.
I'm not doing this to make ad money anyway when I write these local articles.
So I just said, screw it. I'll just write on there is
one there. You know, anyone can do it. Anyone can submit and
do it, but it's it's not necessarily a good thing. I mentioned the
local paper r I Live is owned by Lee Enterprises. Well, they put
out a press release a few days ago this week. I mean they owned
the Riddichment Times, Dispatch Rodo newspaper. They are newspapers across the country.
They're the second or third biggest owner of newspapers, and they downsize and they
shrink them. And our newspaper they don't. I don't even know how many
people subscribe to it. I don't think it's their paper. I don't think
it's but a few thousand people. They only have. I looked. Well,
they put out announcement saying they're considering the Lee Enterprises company to shift to
only putting out three paper newspaper a week and the amount of local news and
it is already minimal. Their website, they have unique websites forevery of their
newspapers, but I think they look like crap. I don't see how they
attract an audience or build a connection with their readers. It's just it's it's
an example of the death of the newspapers. And one of the things that
bothered me was when the news break thing kicked me off around New Year's I
went and looked at the various apps. I don't have these things on my
phone, so I had installed them on my phone, and I looked at
my website, I looked at all the local news websites, and I realized
that someone that sixteen years old that gets on their phone really has no way
to tell the difference between my website or the the enterprises website right, which
you know, to the other websites, they all blend together, right,
it's all a blended mix of right. And then they got their apps.
So a news breaker is that, well, the ap right, But the
app is the sifting But that's the thing. The app has become the sifting
tool. And I just forwarded you something that was written by by this guy
John leake Um about the change in attitude of you know, with the Washington
Post in the New York Times, uh, you know, and and also
you know, the World Seed Journal this week what well, with the way
that they're presenting news and the way that they're breaking things and challenging you know,
the establishment um, which is interesting. And it's all become this very
homogeneous sort of blend of stuff and then it's just sort of squeezed out like
Plato through these apps where this is your information stream now, right, So
it's impossible to discern the legitimate journalistic organization from the guy who's got a local
popular blog or you know, an independent person who might be very serious like
yourself, who's actually trying to get out information about things that are happening locally.
It's impossible to discern you from the little mom and pop newspaper that's still
trying to survive, from the you know, cookie cutter multi conglomerate representation because
it's been bought up locally. All this stuff has sort of been squeezed together
into one big pile of Plato. Right, Yeah, and eventually the news
about this, yeah is I'll use myself as an example, any I mean
it's good and bad, but any person if they want to, can just
go to their city council meetings and start writing about it. And if you
just do that, the listener um you would have a huge impact. You
probably could. But here's the community, because that's what app That's all I've
done, right, you know, there's you know that's what I've done.
Do I know you've been going to the council meetings and stuff and going to
these important you know, like we're getting together to discuss this particular project and
stuff like we talked about the concert that was local to you, this kind
of stuff. But what's bad is now, is anybody ever gonna get paid
again? Outside of the big huge right, the people that are on the
app, they get paid, and you know, the ad revenue comes to
that. That's that's right, that's right. But there you go. So
death of the job that is journalistic, it's over. I think it's possible.
No, I think it's possible to I think you can build your own
I mean, maybe I'll one day try to do this again, you know,
or get motivated. I really want to write, dude, Can you
do research and write some stuff? Well? You want to do some more
long form historical stuff, is what you're going to be doing. Yeah,
yeah, yeah, But I think I think one could do it. And
the example, well, I I'm a baseball fan and the I follow the
I like the Baltimore Orioles, but it doesn't matter what the team is.
I follow this sports team. And in two thousand, you know, there's
the Baltimore Sun. Uh, just a few outlets really covering them, right,
radio shows that you know, I'm sure, and in the Maryland area,
like a local uh there there's like an ESPN radio outlet or some kind
of local sports talk, you know, probably the same station that carries the
game. Yeah. But what there was a anyway, There was one website,
there was a message board that was pretty big. Now it's over time,
it's fallen by the wayside as most message boards have. But at this
moment, there's probably five podcasts about the Bottomore Orioles baseball team, and there's
ten to twelve websites about them, put up former reporters and so forth.
The thing is, probably none of these people are making very much money at
all, and that's the problem you pointed to. But I think there's one
that is and they've been around since the eighties or nineties. In what they
are, there are a sports publication just for the city of Baltimore. It's
free, they distribute it to stores. We've paid advertising in it. They
also have a radio show and um and it's kind of integrated together. So
when I was looking at these apps and seeing how all the news sources are
blending together, they answer to that. The solution or way to work beyond
it, I think would be too right and also do some sort of video
or podcast that is integrated into the articles. That way, when the people
load the app up and go to your article, they'll listen to the thing,
the audio visual thing, and that'll be the connection to have of you
that's unique that the others aren't doing. Yeah, that's the one way to
support that. I think that's ultimately a trick. Yeah, No, Ultimately
it looks to me like if you have a diverse sort of media presentation where
here's some video clips, here's a short podcast, here's the written article,
and you have this all combined into one thing, there's your publication. Like
it's the evolution of the magazine, where the magazine's now not just pictures and
words, but it's pictures, words, video clip audio, here's the podcast
discussion, and you make it interactive. That's the only way, and what
is it going to do. It's going to be done all along a bunch
of different niche issues. Obviously fandom, whether it's a TV show or sports
team, or it's following politics or whatever. That's the way it's going to
be now, and that's the only way to go on. I mean,
if you look at the major corporate outlets, they're doing this although it's pretty
cold, it's not really super attached to the listeners. It's not very interactive.
See. That's the difference between the major corporate ones and the Independence is
that the Independence actually try to connect with their audiences. Other than that,
it's like I connect with my audience, you know, which causes me to
have a loyal base, But I don't have the the the giant expansive you
know, a bunch of tools to put out a bunch of different things.
I'm working on it though, okay, But once I do, then that
allows me to have sort of a diverse universal magazine that has a diverse amount
of different types of media combined. That's got to be the key anymore I
think, is that's the way it's going to go. Anyway, let's take
a little break and we'll come back on the other side and maybe we'll discuss
some other stuff, or we'll continue talking about the evolution of the media and
the information waves of today, because it is changing. And look, I'm
not saying I've got a crystal ball. I'm not prognosticating here, but I'm
just taking a look at which way the wind is blown, and so are
you, Mike, and we're going to decide where it is we want to
be during the storm. Stick around. The Ochully effect continues. Wall Street,
Streindo, dot com, rold still the stock market, Wall streetdo dot
dot. If you're invested deeply, perhaps you're not in deep enough. Maybe
you're thinking about getting started Wall Street, Window dot Com, do dot com.
Michael Swanson, the brilliant author of the War State, understood these trends
professionally for many years, and now he gives you the benefit of his knowledge.
Wall streetdo dot dot Go there, now go there, now go there
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Marry Hancock's book In Denial rips the cover off many of them, using
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through conversation. Second segment of the o'chelly effect begins now here at ochelly dot
com. Of course, if you're listening to us via the podcatcher to your
you know, your final slab of choice, et cetera, et cetera.
Could be anytime any day, but it is Thursday as I speak. So
Mike Swanson is with me for the next little bit. Then we're gonna get
into segment number three with the one and only Larry Hancock. So we've been
talking about media stuff here in this first hour, and definitely covered the gamut
if you excuse me, if you will. Uh sorry, Mike had a
little bit of a belchair dinner was reminding me. I just ate it.
Sorry. Anyways, the thing is, uh, yeah, we were going
over some media stuff here and it has been an interesting, uh couple of
what a couple of weeks in the media. We've seen what the dismissal of
Tucker Carlson, Ton Lemon so your major MSM people, and I had a
bit of a viewpoint on that this past Friday show. But let's not go
into that. Let's actually get into some news. Um, gotta tell you
it's strange, and I know I'm gonna have to discuss this with Larry in
the next hour. But yeah, any thoughts Mike on the assassination attempt of
Vladimir Putin allegedly, I mean, go ahead, what do you think?
Well, the thing you talk about to me, you know when to me
when the Ukraine War started. That really soured me too on the so called
alternatomy media and just social media in general as far as trying to find out
what's really going on, because I really believed in the first twenty four hours
forty eight hours that and I was trying to really follow it closely to figure
out where this thing, that war was all headed. And I just really
believed I was being bombarded on both sides by manufactured propaganda distributed through Twitter and
you know, social media to control people with these different narratives. And then
I do and have subscribed to the New York Times, and I've you know,
talked about some of the things with you that are reading there on the
show, because I consider the New York Times to be the mouthpiece of the
national security state, at least some of their calmness in particular. Yeah,
I would say our mouthpieces of the national security state. And I've read a
couple articles, you know, explaining that they even speak that way as if
they are and they want China and Russia to read what they're saying. Well,
in the lead up to the war, they you know, had articles
showing the disposition of the Russian troops. Um, you know, the first
let's say, three or four weeks before the war started, there was the
the Ukrainians, Zelenski was saying there won't be a war, and then the
New York Times put out these articles and you look at that and you say,
well, boy, they sure do you have these things mass like they're
serious and then they did turn out to start a war. But um,
one troubled aspect of their coverage is their main source is a think take ran
by the Cagans, right, Um that that were the big proponents of neo
conservatism and the Iraq war surge. So you can't just you get to point
with the subject of Ukraine. I just don't want to take any source at
face value. Now, Well, it's tough because they all have agendas,
Mike. So the thing is that the agenda, you know, comes through
first, and then you're trying to get at, you know, just some
solid brass tax information. What is interesting to me is I don't think anybody
a year ago was saying this will last a year, you know what I
mean, Like, nobody thought that that that there would be this much resistance.
I mean, quite frankly, it seemed to me like Ukraine would get
rolled right over by by Russia or there would be intervention, okay, and
that would be prevented. And what's happened is neither of those things has happened
cleanly, has it? Right, we have the continuation of this conflict.
It appears to escalate and just sort of stagger along. This very small country
is getting pounded continuously, right, allegedly to protect a certain area, to
take back a certain area, you know, so on and so forth.
But forget about all that for a second. It is really amazing to me
that this has gone on as long as it has. And I don't think
any of these, any of these people, whether it was the mouthpieces for
our national security state or the propagandists for uh, you know, the pro
Russian propagandists, or the you know, supposedly pro American but non interventionist uh
propagandists. I mean, all sides here. We got a lot of different
sides, and all of the propagandists, the one thing they all seem to
miss is that this was going to be a protracted event. Um. And
it's weird to me because I don't think anybody was saying that. Do you
do you recall anybody saying this is going to go on for a long time?
Uh? Not right when it started, not at the beginning. No,
I mean, because the one thing that seemed to be universally accepted,
no matter what the propagandists bent was is that this will be over pretty quickly,
right, But it's not unpreceded. I mean, no, no Iraq,
that Iraq war against Iran. Before the Americans were over there, they
had a war if Iran. Yeah, that turned into a stalemate. Um.
And I think it was expected when it started that the Iraqis would be
able to have a pretty good victory. And that war lasted for several years.
Uh. And this, you know, looks like that's how this could
be headed, could be But but weird because again, okay, so let's
go to today's you know, banner headline out of this, right, this
drone strike that was allegedly targeting Putin or targeting you know, the Kremlin in
general. Right. Very strange because now this has been I don't know how
many claims, but a handful claims now that have been made that the Ukrainians
are staging terrorist attacks asymmetrical warfare against Russia in order to you know, get
them to back off or in retaliation, right. Um, And that narrative,
on his face just seems crazy to me that they would even be able
to do that. Now, Zelinsky came out today and said, you know,
look, we're spending time depending on our land and let's be honest,
if the guy was somehow marshaling asymmetrical attacks against Russia or Putin directly, he's
not going to come straight out and go, yeah, we did that.
But I don't know. I'm I'm at a loss to believe that that's what's
happened. And the Russians seem to have now put out statements saying that they
believe that it may have been American based in some way, but the Ukrainians,
like, in other words, with American support, Ukrainians are attempting to
do these things. And I don't know what to think of this, um,
I mean, do you have any thoughts on that particular event or or
you just like wait and see on it. I'm waiting to see. I
haven't really study trying to study it. Figured out it does seem I mean,
yeah, my first thought would be what you're saying that it seems pretty
fantastic and it's probably a ruse by the Russians. That's how the war started.
Yeah, and right away they started out by saying they're evacuating people from
that to the Dunbass region. Russians were being evacuated into Russia because Ukraine was
going to attack. Well, that was all a ruse. You know,
you know that they're doing Look most things when it comes to war, um,
the trickery, audit propaganda, it's all about their own people. They're
not trying to fool us, They're trying to if it's a trick, he's
trying to fool the Russian people into believing that this is happening. Well,
and you know what's and you know what's highly suspect to me is that people
that are admitted mouthpieces for our CIA, our intelligence community, right current people
and UH and and people that in the recent past were in positions of authority
UH in the intelligence community came right out immediately and started saying the one thing
that we don't think this is is a false flag attack by the Russians because
they have no need to justify what they're doing, because they're already doing what
they want. They don't need to stage this for some excuse. Now I
object to that. And also the moment that you see you know, former
CIA, this guy or current whatever person coming out and saying, hey,
this is not what this is, you know, going out of their way
to address something like it's not a false flag attack by the Russians. It
almost automatically, Um, you know, suggests to me that that's that is
indeed what it is, because people to get on television to be saying these
things in the first place, Yeah, good points. That's supposed to be
intelligence agencies, like for the American people. They're supposed to report to the
president. Right, So what are they doing? Right? No? Look,
automatic question there. But secondly, when you see you know, former
CIA guy, former fat when you see them come out and make you saying,
hey, look, folks, this is not what this is. What
does that make you think? I mean, you know, your initial gut,
what does that tell you? You know, pay no adjution to this,
folks. Nothing to see here, Move along, you know what I'm
saying. So you know, I'm not saying that's what it is. I'm
just saying that, man, when I see these sorts of things and these
guys come straight out and make an effort to make a statement that you know,
this is not something that it is, almost suggests to me that it's
like they don't want you even looking in that direction, because indeed the real
circumstance might be in that direction. And what is their job is not to
inform us, but to keep us in the dark, right, So you
know, I'm just saying when when you see a guy who's out there and
his job was, you know, counterintelligence and psychological warfare, and he's out
there trying to decode something that's happening and telling you this is not what this
is. Yeah that that that that that's a weird sort of reverse psychology to
me. But then again, it could be just me in my suspicious mind
like the old Elvis song, right, I mean, it just is what
it is. But Mike, we only got like a couple of minutes left
and then we're gonna move on to Larry Hancock. But uh, anything you
want to close out with here, Uh, clearly bad about a week this
week, So thank you. I'm always looking forward to hear what Larry has
to say. Um. So that's that's kind of my last two cents I
got you. Well, you know what I'm gonna I'm gonna run this very
same thing by Larry before he gets into whatever's on his mind tonight. Uh,
because I want to know what his view is on this, you know.
Yeah that's yeah, me too, believe me. We're gonna go there
with Larry Hancock starting right off but in the meantime being the no go to
Wall Street window dot com. Uh, it is not just about Wall Street,
It's about a whole lot of other things. Mike might be slowing down
his email and everything, but believe me, there's plenty of information over there.
And as for usual, I suggest that you read The War State and
also Why the Vietnam War, which is the first in a series of Well,
it's going to be a series of books, and they're going to be
historical and interesting, with stuff in them that's not available elsewhere. In the
unique style, the writing style of Michael Swanson, who I'm very glad to
have had with me. In the first hour, Mike, thanks, Hey,
are you coming? Are you coming back next week or are we gonna
have to wait two weeks? I should be here next week. Excellent.
So we will talk to Mike Swanson next week in the meantime, But coming
right up, the author who occupies more spots on my book shelf than any
other, Larry Hancock. In the next hour. The o'celly effect continues after
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through Conversation. Get ready, So there's a little reminder from the intro.
Okay, the older intro from the Ocelli Effect. But segment number three beginning
now, I have author Larry Hancock with me and we are going to discuss
some current events that are awfully strange. So let's get into the geopolitical military
what the hell is going on? And I'll start off this segment. Before
I do start it off, I advise you to go to Larry dash Hancock
dot com check out his work always I'll give you the link to his blog
in the show notes, etc. Follow that follow Larry's work, especially the
more recent stuff he's doing on UAPs, which we covered a couple of weeks
ago on the show. I know there's gonna be more to discuss about that,
but no UFOs tonight, at least I think not. Although I'm not
really satisfied that we have an identification on the aerial object that allegedly was sent.
As you know, the banner headline assassination attempt against Vladimir Putin? Okay,
So, so shall we just begin with the headline? Was that an
assassination attempt? They're blaming Ukraine and now also blaming the United States because the
United States is back in Ukraine. Ukraine's president comes out and says, look,
we're having a hard enough time defending our own territory. Why would we
be doing this, etc. Et cetera. So who do I turn to?
One of the best analysts period that I know for sure, Larry Hancock?
What the hell is going on with all this? Number one? But
because I don't know, I got my suspicions, let's put it that way.
But do I have enough information to follow through and give you guys a
satisfactory analysis at this time? I don't, But perhaps Larry Hancock to us
first, Larry, how are you doing tonight, sir? I'm doing good,
Chuck. It's good to be back. It's good to have you back.
Look, really sorry that we weren't able to get to you last week.
But yeah, I had had a bit of an issue. If anybody
missed it, I had a bit of a seizure on air. And no,
I'm not releasing that podcast because only got as far as talking to Mike
Swanson and that was not going well. So uh, there you go.
But I am intact and you know, shaky as always, but still here,
folks, not going anywhere. Just just yet. Um, so larry
to to this point. What a what a weird landscape, What a strange
time to be alive? Um? Did you see the film of this yet?
Uh? Because I want to begin there, but then I'm just gonna
let you go and tell us about the rest of what in the hell is
going on? H Did you see the film of this alleged drone attack on
the Kremlin and all that? Yet? Yeah? I've seen three or four
versions of the film. I mean it is it is handy for you know,
simp. People will go why is there a film at all? And
it's sort of like, well, it is like the most symbolic building in
the Kremlin, you know. It's kind of like, is there constant film
coverage of the White House? Yes? There is. I mean there's cameras
set up for security purposes a way, so at least we know there's no
real mystery as to why there's film of it. But good news is you
kind of started off for once, we know that it's it was an object.
At least we have that first art. It's not really identified in terms
of origin or intent, but we know it was a flying object. So
at least we gotta we gotta start for a change. But we also know
a couple of things it was not. It certainly was not an assassination weapon.
If you look at that film, the explosive charge, if there was
an explosive charge on the device, and it wasn't just whatever took it down,
which which we don't see on the film. You know, seeing the
film from Ray's angles, you see something flying in on a trajectory, and
one of the questions it gets to be, what is that If it's a
you know, propeller propeller driven drone, why do you see a trail coming
down in the film? What's making that trail? Or was that a rocket
coming after the drone towards the Kremlin, which would be pretty exciting. It's
kind of like we've got to we've got to take that sucker down, even
if we hit the Kremlin. There are lots of unknowns about the film,
but we're seeing an object, yeah, well really quick rail behind it coming
towards the Kremlin roof, and then it goes off for a minute and you
don't see it, and then suddenly you see something explode, apparently near the
flagpole, but it's it's a minor explosion. It doesn't certainly not enough to
damage the roof. Seriously, it's nothing that could have penetrated that building.
It's in no way a real serious weapon that could cause damage to the building
nor in any way harm Putin if he were there. It's you can't there's
no way you could consider it as a serious assassination effort. Whatever it was
was symbolic. I think it's safe to say that because it's something happening over
a building that symbolizes Russia. So we can say it's it's a symbolic event.
It is not a serious weaponized assassination attempt. Well, because if it
was more serious, you would have a much more significant explosive device being employed
here. If they were to, say, try to do some significant damage
to the build holding or damage to building enough so they could harm the occupants,
it would be a much more significant machine. Okay, I don't even
know if this is not something. Now this is weird because it almost makes
me concur with some of the talking heads that they hauled in, you know,
immediately onto onto the MSM right where it's like, well, this might
be opposition from somebody within Russia. Now, is it a significant piece of
opposition, like an actual attempt on poutin? No, But is it a
symbolic thing to say, hey, look, you know we're we're objecting.
Is is it the kind of thing where it's just like an objection being noted,
you know, to what's going on? Or is it something else?
I mean, I'm not buying this idea that this is some sort of a
you know, asymmetrical attempt to make a point or to actually do some damage
being conducted by Ukraine. I think that's completely ludicrous. What are your thoughts
there? Yeah, that's resistance going on in Russia. We do know there's
some opposition to the war and the administration. You know, it doesn't look
like it doesn't look like to me if it were symbolic, whoever these folks
were, would seem to have done more to take it, you know,
responsibility for it in advance or not in advance, but to make it clear
that you know, this is an opposition to the war, right, but
that's not there quite Frankly. The symbolize the symbolism, and you know,
Russia has always been about symbolism about important dates and their their nation's history dates
are critical to them. Uh. You know, if there's some symbolism going
on here, the only people leveraging it, I mean, obviously there's nothing
for Ukraine to leverage, right, you know there the only people that are
leveraging the incident and taking an advantage of it are the Russian spokespeople and essentially,
I don't know, you probably saw Chuck the the interesting remark that I
saw immediately come out because you mentioned asymmetrical, and somebody's going, well,
yeah, how could this What could the Ukrainians? What could the Russians not
do that they haven't done yet? Right? You know what? What's Where's
the asymmetry? Was their Secretary of States response that said, this incident gave
them the authority and moral and legal right to target essentially to kill and assassinate
not only Zilinski but his entire cabinet, and thought gave them the justification to
do that. Now, that's that's an interesting like who benefits from this?
That would be yeah, that would be one symbolic justification to go all out
to waste the kid of administration. Right, Well, that that was my
initial thought is that indeed it could be a false flag, like I said,
in order to justify well, now you've made an attempt on our capital.
That means that we can you know, pound Kiv, right, and
because we have to retaliate. And there was something about retaliation or in the
initial statement that came from the Russian government, right, that was sort of
like, we're going to have to answer this, And I didn't maybe the
same statement you're talking about where it was indicated that look, we're going to
have to do something about this. And it seems to me they're the only
ones that have made a statement like this. So and that's the other interesting
thing is if this was a legitimate opposition from within the country, a good
point, why wouldn't somebody have claimed responsibility and said, look, this is
a point we're trying to make. Or maybe we don't want to harm the
Russian government, but we want to make Ladi mere putin reconsider what he's doing.
And it may have nothing to do with even the conflict in Ukraine.
It could have to do with something else, right, but no, none
of that has happened. The only statement so far. And it's not as
though, you know, we're not dealing with a regime that doesn't control the
information coming out. So indeed, there could be information that somebody wants to
get out about this that's not emerging. But you would think if it was
some sort of point against Putin, somebody would have taken responsibility. Yeah,
and I think yeah, in terms of focusing on Putin, it does one
thing. A it makes it very personal. This wasn't the way Russia responded.
It's public statements was this is all about Putin? Right, This is
an assassination on Putin, which does two or three things. First of all,
it makes Putin look very important. I mean, up to this point,
one might say, gosh, in terms of the Russian military adventurism in
Ukraine, Putin's a nonentity. He hasn't made any right decisions. You know,
Putin's not the key adversary. Let's take out the Wagner guy. You
know, if if we're gonna go kill somebody, let's go go for the
guys that are running the private military companies or running going for the you know.
But this makes Putin like the epitome of Russia. If it's in back
on the pedestal, is target number one, so he's obviously the most important.
So to me, it actually reinforces how important and critical if Ukraine felt
that way. I don't for a minute think that Ukraine feels that Putin is
the number one target. If anything, I suspect right at the moment,
you're Kraine is more than happy to have Putin bolloxing up the whole command structure.
But it's so if there's some symbolism to me, because Russia immediately made
it personal, the symbolism is about elevating Putin, an elevating Putin's position,
and then giving them the right, the moral right whatever, to go not
after Kiev. I'm not talking about massive strikes on. They specifically said to
go after Zelinski and his cabinet, and what that means is, you know,
forget targeting Kiev or Leev. You know, we're going to bring some
weapons into play that are going after individuals, whether that's assassins, that's you
know that that ratchets up the security phobia in Ukraine, which is already quite
high and is counterproductive for Ukraine. So again, I have to step back
and say the only the only people that I see that profit by the symbolism
of of of what wasn't really a serious attack would be the Russian psychological warfare
people, and in particular putting himself since it re emphasizes his importance. Right,
and we have to put this alongside. You bring up Wegner. Well,
this week it was floated and I'm not sure how serious to take this,
but apparently the leader of the group there was saying he's running out of
ammunition and unless he gets resupplied shortly, I guess there's going to be consequences
there where maybe they're not going to be able to continue to press things as
they have up to this point. Not a good look on the world stage
there, if you know, if you're you're supposedly private contractors are saying,
hey, look, we're not getting supplied well enough to prosecute the thing that
you're telling us to go do. Uh you know, what are your thoughts
on that? Because I mean that it's a weird thing to also come out
this week too, right, it really is, and it really is a
good diversion in a way because the conversation up to that point was really about
literally about Russian military infrastructure. Because the incident that occurred last week that didn't
get much coverage is now there have been at least there at least three or
four major other paramilitary companies that have been formed by oligarchs or by companies like
gas From, and they have fielded their own forces inside Ukraine. And last
week there was an incident to incidents, actually one from contract people working for
gas From, as I understand, who actually complained that when they ended up
in Ukraine, they were taken over by the Donets people through public forces and
fed into the front lines against their will. What happened at that point in
time is Wagner objected to it, and there actually was a gun battle between
a variety of Wagner for it. You know, you don't. That's a
terrible story to have floating around, and it was getting a lot of coverage
in military circles, and of course this diverted attention from that. But the
last thing you want is those kind of discussions going on in advance of any
Ukrainian counter offensive, and this did, you know, preempt some of that,
or at least divert attention from the the infighting that's going on within the
various Russian units, right, and all of this is happening again. You
know, last week we were going to wind up discussing some of the other
movements and some of the other issues that are occurring on the African continent,
which does seem to be disconnected from the circum dance in Ukraine. But maybe
not, because there's a bunch of stuff going on here, and I don't
think it's getting a lot of coverage generally in the Western world. I mean,
you know, here in America, we're quite busy with new shooting events
every day and various things like that, and of course the different announcements and
pronouncements from different potential presidential candidates, so on and so forth. I mean,
which, by the way, I find it interesting that CNN is actually
gonna have a town hall with Donald Trump. You know, for those who
think, oh he's they're totally against him. They're working against them, and
they're gonna use him to amp up their primetime TV viewership by giving him a
town hall. Yeah, Okay, he's not part of the programming or anything.
He's not part of their business strategy, is he. Anyhow? Forget
that what about what's going on there, because we had a lot of action
going on in Sudan and places like that, and how does this, uh
you know come to play regarding the circumstances there in Ukraine. Yeah, I
think one of the one of the things that the Wagner Group UH leader said,
as you said, he made has made a lot of confidence or the
last couple of weeks. But one thing he has literally said is that because
essentially there is treason within Russia and he used that word by the way,
people as people aren't getting the ammunition they need. Quite frankly, he's beginning
to run out of the prisoners h And he's what he said was he's going
to have to preserve his force so that he can continue his other activities,
which are almost entirely within Africa, Central Africa, North Africa. That's where
PMC, his company makes their money. That's where his business is. What
he's what he's doing in Ukraine was you know, purely a patriotic activity.
And it was okay when he was doing nothing other than sacrificing prisoners. But
now that he's starting to chew into his core units, you know, that's
bad for business. So he he literally came out and said that, and
again that didn't get much coverage in terms of so what is his core business?
And his core business is in Africa, where he has done deals as
a security broker for some African nations. He's done deals as a weapon supplier
for revolutionary groups. I mean, he's happy to play both sides of the
fence if you need, if you're in power, he'll give you a security
force. If you're not in power and have access to natural resources that are
profitable, he will get you whatever you need. As a matter of fact,
he has forces, Wagner forces actually flying MiGs in combat missions in North
Africa, in Libya, and I'm sure one of the they would have been
happy in Sedan once they're the people that they're supplying weapons to. The revolutionary
group there managed to take over several high end Egyptian MiG fighters. I'm sure
he would have loved to have gotten his people in there and flown them out
and added to his air force, but the government forces blew them up.
Apparently somebody blew them up before that could happen. But the bottom line is,
if if you step back, where Wegner is really has been extremely successful
and is making tons of money is in Africa because they have they had this
double ended deal where they do business with whoever has control of the assets.
Either it's a government in power or it's a revolutionary group, and their service
is around weapons, but their real profit is in getting access to those resources.
And that's why he's partnered with some other Russian oligarchs to do that.
But the Wagner Group is simply as it's kind of I wouldn't call it a
cover, but it's basically an entree for those natural resource deals. And of
course that takes you to Sedan, and it takes you into why there has
been some written about it, but not nearly enough as to who's providing the
suddenly providing weapons to this revolutionary group in Sedan, where they had actually worked
up a compromise, it was going to be a joint government. Everything was
relatively stable, and then all of a sudden, the revolutionary group shows up
with new weaponry and launches this new initiative. Takes everybody by surprise, and
we find ourselves in the situation which you know, on the surface, seems
to explode it overnight, right, and nobody has asked the question of how
and why they happened. I haven't seen a single news article that really explores
the how and why it happened with no particular warning. I guess you would
say it just like you know, somebody through a switch, right, Well,
unlike what's happening in Israel right now, where you know what the build
up was and you know why there's been you know, a bit of conflict
in this and that you can see the evolution of what's happened there right What's
gone on in Africa though, does seem to have sort of happened overnight and
they didn't note it temporarily seemingly in the international press. But then you know,
just just like the wind that went right out, you know. So
it's an interesting thing. And is it just I mean, is it just
opportunism from Wegner and some other groups maybe you know, they're oh, I
think that's an excellent word. It is. It's opportunism, But it's not.
It's not opportunism sounds like short term, right. This is more like
it's opportunistic in that they're willing to play either side of a field in a
given geographic area. It's opportunistic and in that they may not stay there for
all that long. But it's it's more like um combine opportunistic with pillage,
because the whole point has has to do with the natural resources and setting up
the setting up the ability to extract large quantities of national resources natural resources in
exchange for this service that you're providing. So I just you try to put
it in the context of they're not just in it for the money being made
from weapons or security services. That that sounds like a dealer, right,
you know, what's important to them is the flip side of the coin,
which is natural resources, which quite frankly I suspect as the reason. And
there's been not just me, there's been a lot of suspicion that Putin convinced
Wegner that if he would, you know, really, you know, come
back to Ukraine, get get behind this thing, we're gonna win in a
matter of days or weeks and guess who it gets it. Guess who gets
the salt mines, Guess who gets the titanium? Who where? You know,
you you bring your forces in and will make sure that you get the
natural resources. You know, it's very much in line with Wagner's philosophy and
I have to say Wagner presents themselves as a paid for it. Wegner's ski
keiko in life is the ability to get lots and lots of money, right.
Well, uh and that's the interesting thing here, as as I noted
with Mike in the first hour, I think it's it's fascinating that the one
thing that seemingly all the different, you know, uh, well, the
talking heads out there, the analysts, one thing that they all seem to
have an agreement on, uh, no matter which a side of the propaganda
pool they were swimming at them um, was that this would be a short
lived conflict, right. I think nobody anticipated the amount of time that that
what's going on in Ukraine was going to take. I mean really, I
didn't even think that there was any way that a conflict could have lasted this
long as it has, you know. And meanwhile, you have Zelinsky now
going you know, traveling outside of the country, visiting with other groups,
other countries, other leaders. You have a longer term commitment here which has
had to be had. So, like you said, Wegner ran out of
prisoners because that was going on for a bit where they were just you know,
we I think you and I talked about this a bit on the show
about how that's how they were filling their ranks there in Ukraine. But as
time has gone on, I mean, look, there is something called attrition,
and over time, you know, it's a different it's a different set
of circumstances that you're dealing with when you have something that goes on and it's
protracted as this is. So, I mean, yeah, go ahead.
I don't think anybody in their right mind would lay out a game plan that
said, Okay, I'm gonna I'm gonna plan on taking fifty thousand hardcore prisoners
to use as my military force. Okay, that wasn't even at the Dirty
Dozen, right, anybody saw that movie. No, it's okay, rum
that makes no sense. What does make sense is wider Widner had had units
fighting in Ukraine since twenty fourteen. He had units in Crimea. But we're
talking about hundreds of people, maybe a few thousand people, highly skilled experience
the combat vets. These these are people that you know, know what they're
doing. They're hardcore, they're in it for them. And seeing him commit
that level of support to putin for you know, an union initiative makes sense.
Then after a week or so, seeing him go, wait a minute,
you know, I don't have the resources to do this. What am
I going to do? Gives you the perspective that you know, going to
the prisons was was never part of a plan. You know clearly that that
wasn't something that the Wagner Group was built to do, to to run very
large scale military operations. They were built to be mercenaries, kind of like
you know, the the Blackwater model. People are probably familiar with that.
You know that that's what they were built to be to feel tens of thousands
of troops and in you know, trench warfare, not his model. So
I cannot believe that any of that was some part of a you know plan.
Well, I was straining not to bring up Blackwater here, but I
really couldn't avoid it after a bit. Yeah, Blackwater. See that's the
thing, Uh, this was not meant to These guys are not meant to
be in there for the long haul, not in this circumstance um. So
you know the fact that they still are regardless of whether they were bringing in
prisoners or not, they were not going to be there for the long haul.
They weren't supposed to have a massive true presence and generally it's making him
no money. And let's get back to that. It's sort of like,
wait a minute, or was my business plan? My business plan did not
call for two years of exponential lawsuits. That's not what we're here to do.
It's a company. Well yeah, so so here it is. You
know, patriotism goes just so far. But you know, look, guy,
you got to supply us better. And I mean, and that was
the weird thing because I'm like, he's asking for ammunition. I mean,
that seemed to be really straight to me, because you would think that the
one thing they'd want to do is if they have a self contained group out
there that they don't have to supply Otherwise, if all you gotta do is
give ma ammunition and the go ahead, doesn't seem to be a difficult transaction,
right, I mean, it seems like somebody would say, well,
let's just make sure these guys are well supplied since they're doing this work.
You know, I don't know, I'm trying to think of it from that
angle. Meanwhile, you know, we skipped over something because you talked about
the symbolism of this attack and we didn't really break that all the way down,
I don't think because you did mention. I don't know if it was
on air affair, but the date itself when this occurred, maybe you should
lay that out for people and explain that the dates are very important. Russia
celebrates Victory Day. I mean May Day is historically, you know, for
the Communist Party, which you know, putting is very Soviet oriented, if
not Communists, but May Day and May Day celebrations, World War two victory
celebrations. They have a whole series of celebrations that are that are planned around
this part of May, and that they're not just in Moscow, they're out
in the various republics, the regions all have their own celebrations. And one
of the things that started to become apparent over the last month or so is
some concern that now now that um the true cost and manpower is becoming visible
at a regional, regional level, you know, there was there's a couple
of concerns. First of all, they're not the large military units that were
available before now to put into parades and shows of force, you know,
roll out all the new tanks, roll out all the air defense systems,
sorry, they're in Ukraine or they're gone. Yeah. I was gonna say,
with the quote mobilization end quote, right that's going on, I think
that probably doesn't leave a lot of guys behind to be able to run around
in the parades because they and there was some talk about that too, which
was shut down pretty quickly because again, if there was an opposition leader or
an opposition point to be made by this symbolic attack, which again it couldn't
be any anything serious because there was not enough of an explosive device to do
any serious damage. It clearly was not something that was an efficient vehicle to
say go after somebody personally. To me, it didn't look like because even
if there's somebody was standing on the street, the explosive device didn't look like
you know. I mean, obviously I understand it probably could have done some
damage, but I mean unless you have somebody out, you know, on
the street, okay and literally like, you know, crash this thing into
him, I don't think you're gonna do serious damage to even an individual.
You know, Could you successfully have blown up a car with this little pop
that we saw, I don't even think so, Yeah, go ahead,
what did you do? And the fact that supposedly Rush had been talking for
a week or so about you know, a handful of drones that had been
collected in different places inside Russia. It gave them the excuse to declare a
security emergency, right and essentially cancel almost all of the celebrations because it's too
dangerous. I haven't even thought of that. Yeah, because now you can't
put puttin out on a viewing stand. Say you know why you prayed the
weapons by which you said, again, we're probably all being deployed elsewhere anyway.
But you know, the old the thing that we used to see,
you know, when the Soviets, I mean because he's not a Soviet,
but but they have to tip their hat to the Soviet Union in that time
period for sure. Um, that kind of thing where you know, you
got the leaders on a on a viewing stand, right and elevated viewing stand
out in public, everybody can see them, uh you know and all that,
and they can watch the parade go by. Well, yeah, there's
a good justification now to say, hey, look we can't do that.
Although it's a little close, because you would have thought they would have stayed
if it was staged. They would have staged it a little earlier, so
that it's a week before or something, right, Um, but I want
to cancel it, really, I know you kind of want to cancel it
the last minute because Okay, you're walking a tight you're walking a tight rope.
Okay, What's what I'm going to do is I'm going to admit what
was supposedly the nation with the best strongest air defense in Europe can't, you
know, can't protect itself. So I don't I'm not excited to say that.
That's that's not a good thing to say. Um, So you you
don't want to get that out early as it were, I would say that
you want a time at you know, certainly no more than a week or
so. And they started quote unquote discovering those drones about a week week and
a half ago. So there's that. But there's one other area of symbolism
that I found interesting and I would not have thought of this, but apparently,
as part of this hero celebration, it's very common to allow families to
join the parades with posters of their relatives who have been killed in battle.
Okay, and I guess there was a concern that there literally might be thousands
of people showing up that couldn't be rejected. It's kind of like, well,
my boy died, you know, in combat. I can't tell you,
no, you can't. But suddenly, if this, if this parade,
which is going to be limited because of available resources, has attached to
it, you know, two thousand people marching behind it with pictures of dead
and wounded, it's not a good look. Well, and there there's an
interesting thing because I haven't seen a great deal of detailed reports about what the
losses are, right, I mean, a few months back we were seeing
declarations from Russia and from Ukraine about the level of losses. But have you
noted that as of late, we're not seeing counts of what the casualties are
in these different operations. Right, They're not saying, oh, well we
know that this many were killed or that many were killed. I'm not seeing
that as often. Are you seeing it somewhere? Maybe I'm missing it?
Well, I think it's everybody is concerned because you know, you who's going
to make that assessment. But there there have been there are some independent groups
that monitor from videos and destruction of equipment and so on and so forth that
the number again, even though it's probably it's primarily in bach Mutt, Okay,
where the big losses are. So let's just count. Let's say that
sent the losses are in bog Mutt to the Wagner troops, even based on
what he himself says, he's lost thirty or forty thousand people in the last
five months, okay, and the combat estimates that the Pentagon is giving is
total killed and wounded since December is upwards of one hundred thousand. Now that's
immense. That's that's something on the almost like the you know, the previous
nine months. So we obviously Ukraine is taking heavy laws as well. But
the Russians, there is no doubt that they have that they would have taken
losses substantial enough. So now it's been felt all over Russia. It just
the two places it's felt less than anywhere else are in Moscow and Saint Petersburg
because that's where they intentionally recruited fewer people because those are like the national hubs.
And you know, if you can, if you can pull in most
of your troops from out in the boondocks, that losses are less obvious.
So to answer your question that there is no doubt that the losses, especially
because of the meat grinder and mack Mutt and the last four four or five
months, have been significant. No, they've been significant, but the reporting
on them does not seem to be so intense at this point according to what
I can follow. I mean, I'm just not seeing a lot of declarations
here that there are heavy losses. I don't see the Ukrainians even pushing out
numbers like we're really giving them heavy losses lately unless I'm missing it. Am
I missing it? No? No, they kind of do a week by
week, but they don't they don't politicize it. If you will, I
mean they're they will. Every week they issue a table of estimated you know,
tanks destroyed, aircraft destroyed, killed, and we did in action.
But it's now become just kind of routine, and it doesn't get unless you
happen to be on you know, certain military blogs or sites. You don't
see it in general media coverage. But these days there's so much that's missing
out of general media coverage. It's amazing, as you said, it's you
know, I look at the front page of CNN and it's politics and entertainment
and shootings and then I have to really even look for, you know,
other news from around the world, strategic type of news like the Philippines,
which I've mentioned to you, right And look, we'll get there before we're
done, because I mean, yeah, the front page of CNN or whatever
is Jamie Fox saying, you know, look I had a problem here,
Thanks for all your prayers. Yeah, I mean literally, that's like the
front page I think right now, and that's where we're at is entertainment,
news and politics and oh, get ready for twenty twenty four. Here we
go, Biden declared, you know, And that's it. So the conflict,
you know, continues to drudge on right as at its pace, and
there could be more intense casualties that have occurred recently, but you wouldn't know
it necessarily from the banner headlines, is all I'm trying to get at.
But okay, so what is happening with the Philippines, because that is another
part of this thing. I mean, look, all these things are part
of the landscape right now, okay, And we also see that there there
has been an absence of the uh you know, get nervous about China coverage
too lately. Um that seems to have been taken down a bit, even
on the neo kon side of things. Uh, they they've turned you know,
turned down the volume on that a bit um. But but here we
are, we're still in the midst of a great deal of well, a
great deal of hotspots that could get out of control quickly in various regions,
it looks like to me. But anyway, what is happening with the Philippines
which you did mention off air and we didn't get to here yet. Yeah,
I think it's background. One of the things that's going on for the
last three or four years, actually a little bit longer, is you know,
there's there's no doubt that China, China was for a period of time,
quite frankly, as Russia did earlier, adopted a very a model for
not for diplomacy based on economics, which was weirdly displayed when apparently there was
a phone call between what Jijan Ping and and Zolensky recently right where there seemed
to be some encouragement, some sort of you know, discussion. There's some
diplomacy on behalf if you will, of the well, the alliances there that
are between them and Russia and now making contact with Zolensky. I found that
to be an odd thing in the equation too, But go ahead and well,
and the fact that this week, for the first time, China actually
voted for a really severe resolution against Russia, essentially a resolution that described their
attack on Ukraine as a you know, illegal, It called for prosecution for
war crimes. And it was the first time that China's actually voted for a
resolution against Russia. That was significant, and that followed the call that you
discussed. But the longer term is the sad thing is you know, you
and I both discussed it. There was a period of time in the early
nineties where Russia was pursuing economic diplomacy in Europe based around oil and gas and
being very successful with Italy and France and Germany, and then Putin decided to
go in another direction, a much more military warrior. Oriined direction well China,
and we see what happened him. China was doing the same thing during
the early part of the last decade with their new Silk Road initiative linking China
through Southeast Asia into Africa, economic development to a lot of African nations and
very successful in the Pacific not just you know, into Africa, but they
had turned thurntangs around in the Philippines to the extent that the Philippines had canceled
all of the US based contracts. The US military was really no longer welcome
in the Philippines. You know, there are a lot of economic ties being
created with China. And then China adopted this new new strategy called essentially the
Way of the Wolf Warrior, which was you make everybody go where you want
them to go by showing that you're so superior that it's you know, it's
not a cooperative effort. They take orders, you know, it's sort of
like if you don't take orders. And they begin really with several shows of
force against Philippines fishing boats and basically fishing and territorial interest out in adjacent waters.
And that really upset the film. I mean China. When China does
that sort of thing, they are brutal. I mean they literally take no
prisoners, They sink boats, they use their own fishing fleet in a military
fashion. And the Philippines has gotten tired of that and during the past couple
of months have signed a series of new agreements with the United States to allow
the United States to re enter bases and to actually set up new bases in
the Northern Philippines, a security pact for the US to come to their assistance,
for example, if their territorial waters are violated, and you know,
with a visit to the US a very high level things have turned around like
one hundred and eighty degrees away from China towards the US because essentially the same
thing's happening in Australia and other nations in the Pacific just because the Chinese approach
to bullying people didn't sit well. And the strange thing is hopefully China won't
slide the wrong direction. But you know, well, yeah, clearly they
don't have a homogeneous agenda though, Larry, because I mean, if you
take a look at how they basically enabled in Vietnam to become a you know,
a much stronger partner in the Asian business community and things like that.
They've definitely made their their allegiances clear with people that are cooperating with them.
They help them economically and militarily, right, But if you don't take orders,
as you said, well then it becomes rough and some people are chafing
against that. Some of the other nation states are chafing against that while others
have you know, taken to the partnership. Right, So you don't have
a singular sort of reaction to them in the region. I'm saying that there's
just various there. There's a spectrum of reactions and interactions there in the entire
region. So you have you have different results coming out. And the thing
with the Philippines is, well, that's not working out too good for the
Philippines because they're not taking orders. So maybe they're rethinking their relationship with the
US now right, Well, and we're seeing a transition period. There's a
spectrum. They had this one strategy of economic fraternity, codependence, so on
and so forth, and as you say, that still works in some places
with certain segments of the population, right, However, they overlaid this.
It works when they're they're not in competition right at the moment. The places
that they're really in competition are at sea, basically related to fishing resources,
oil and gas resources. So even though Vietnam's fishing fleet has been under some
pressure, uh, it's it's probably not as significant to them. But so,
like I said, during any transition period, you've got two two approaches.
You know, where the economic was working and is still working great,
where it's not working and the force is definitely not working, not so great,
I will say, you know, in terms of Vietnam, um,
it's a it's a mixed bag. Because the US now has port access in
Vietnam. We've made friendship visits with our navy ships into Vietnam. Uh.
There's certainly no military alliance there, but it's certainly not um that the Vietnamese
there, there's the Chinese of pressured. It's fishing fleet, They've sent boats,
They've taken over oil platforms. So it's you know, it's kind of
what's happening this week? You know, is it is it pleasure or pain?
Am I making money with them? Or am I taking grief from them?
You know, what's what what's going on this week? Well, and
it's not again, it's just not the the simple constant answer any longer.
It does seem to be fluctuating a bit. But that's why I found it
really strange that there was that, you know, that action like you were
to describing regarding their change in orientation with the boat against Russia and UH,
and and also just the phone call as the Lensky in general. Uh,
the idea that they were attempting to, you know, look into that dip
amatically when it's a quagmire that clearly the Russians are well committed to. I
mean, I don't I don't foresee them just turning around and going home tomorrow.
Uh you know what I mean. So what was going to be accomplished
there if if they are still the strongest ally to the Russian Federation, right,
because it wasn't that long ago there was the big show of uh you
know, the the leadership meeting with Putin there, you know, with with
China, right, So I'm just saying it's it's it's a very interesting thing.
That is. Um, the current data on US oil exports. US
oil exports are going through the roof, and part of that is because China
is buying a considerable amount of US oil, which is interesting because of course
they can get all the Russian oil they want at depressed prices, right,
so why would they even It's like wait a minute, yeah, it looks
like there being a little bit more even handed, if you will, um,
maybe not just literally you know, being pulled into the Russian vacuum.
You know it. It does look like that that has changed a bit.
There's stand storage. Taiwan may not have changed, but there's stands storage.
Russia certainly looks like it's changed a bit over the last couple of months,
and if if the Ukrainian counter offensive kicks in with any success, I think
it will change even more. Well. See, there you have it.
It's it's it's in flux, is what I see, and a bit confusing,
honestly. I mean, I don't know. Maybe there is some greater
strategy at play here that I don't understand, but I gotta be honest with
you. I see a lot of inconsistency here, and you would think that
a unified kind of totalitarian regime I usually don't see a lot have been consistency
in their action. You know, it's very well coordinated. Usually, uh,
it's very well considered and coordinated. Right, Even the smallest nations,
they're generally pretty consistent about their behaviors. But China's behavior is not consistent at
this point, um, at least to me. Again, maybe I don't
understand something here, but I think you have different facts. It's not as
monolithic, but all of us, myself included you know, like to think
things are monolithic, you know, because okay, it's they have a policy,
but um, I don't think it's quite that way. That might be
true for North Korea, but even China is you know, there are there
are different interests, their economic interests, their military interests, and they joust
with each other even they would they would like to have a monolithic appearance.
But you know that's the way of the world is not quite that simple.
There you have it. Well, look, Larry, I know we're probably
gonna get together again in a couple of weeks. Uh what do we have
to look forward to from you in a couple of weeks? I mean,
I also want to find out what your final takeaway is on tonight's discussion.
But before we go there, what what do you what do you think we'll
be looking at in a couple of weeks or are we just gonna wait to
see what the new cycle presents us next? Because I gotta tell you,
if you had asked me to predict a couple of weeks ago, whether we'd
be talking about a drone strike on the Kremlin, uh or you know,
alleged assassination attempt, I would have I would have not believed you, um,
but but here we are. Are we gonna wait to see what the
new cycle presents or do you have something in mind maybe in a couple of
weeks to come back on with no. I think I think you're right.
I think you use state of flux. I mean that's what we were in
Uh. If you really want to talk about contemporary events, I don't think.
I don't see how anyone can consect. I can guess at the moment.
I think maybe it's kind of like what we did earlier. It's sort
of like, Okay, let's look at what the headlines are two weeks from
now and see if we can drawn into insanity out of it, because quite
frankly, that's not being done. As you and I have discussed. People
are just reporting news and it's so fluid and changing so fast you don't even
have time. Nobody has time for analysis. They report the news for forty
eight hours and it's on another subject, and you kind of go, what
did the world happen to that? Did anybody ever figure out? I tell
you what we're probably going to be. My prediction is that Denmark and Finland
are going to provide positive evidence that not only did Russia blow up Nordstream,
but Russia is as either beginning to or demonstrating that it can start taking out
their to see cable infrastructure for communications and a lot of other things. I
think that's gonna be a hot button. Just a prediction, So that don't
gonna be two weeks, but that's gonna that's gonna happen. Well, I'll
tell you what, especially now that Finland has actually reaching accord with us to
put basses just just like the Philippines. We're talking about the Philippines, they've
reached the ford where we can put basses in the northern Philippines. Again,
the same with Finland. When you have that sort of thing occurring, just
kind of kind of roll with it. I got you. Well, I'll
tell you what I think. Even if Finland does present a definitive evidence that
Russia is responsible for the issue with nord Stream, you know what's going to
happen is a whole lot of people are going to deny it's real anyway,
They're going to claim that it's fiction. I mean, that's shocked and amazed.
I'll be shocked and amazed if if because look immediately as soon as somebody
even suggested that maybe, you know, maybe this was a nope, Nope,
that's absolutely crazy. You're just you know, an anti Russian blah blah.
And I'm like, you know, you're not thinking about this strategically.
And again, even with this ridiculousness over this, you know, assassination attempt,
I mean, I don't know how not to mock that. It's just
it's stupid. If that was an assassination attempt, I mean, I don't
know, maybe if a teenager was demonstrated themselves to be that unskilled. My
assassment is that they've shown themselves to be pretty competent, and I think pretty
competent is not taking out the flag on top of the Kremlin. Well,
that's the thing is, if this was a serious attempt, I'm thinking they
would have done a lot more damage, you know, I mean just maybe
it's just me, but why why would they not have waited for the parade?
If I'm really going to do this and roll the dice, okay for
Russia using nukes against me? Right, I'm going to take out their command
structure by a heavily armed drone. We're saying they're targeting is good enough.
They can fly a drone eight hundred miles across Russia and hit a flagpole.
Why not wait until the next day and hit the grandstand, right, I
mean, that would be a lot more effective. And again, you got
somebody who's not protected by a building. You got somebody who's out in the
open. I mean, and at the very least, you could register a
very serious point if they were able to. I mean, it wouldn't necessarily
stop what's going on, but it would register a very serious point. It
would make a point to the entire world community. If you were able to
even get close after point, you'd have to be best for to do it.
I mean, you'd have to be making a bet that a decapitation strike
would lead to civil war. I mean, you'd have to be under extreme
pressure to do that. Now, I can see a point in time if
Russia were just about to roll over Kiev and occupy all of Ukraine. O.
Hey, that's a desperation move, right all it's the other way around,
Ukraine is about to roll east. Why would you do that? Makes
no sense. Look, just because it makes no sense doesn't mean that that's
not what people are gonna think is happening. Okay, Like I said,
you know, even if with definitive evidence, I think a lot of people
are gonna say, Nope, that's fiction anyway. That's the other problem is,
even even if you do present him with something that has a great deal
of contextual analysis, it doesn't necessarily mean the listener, the viewer, the
reader is going to believe it anyway. But one thing you can believe is
the work of Larry Hancock. Again. Go to Larry dash Hancock dot com.
Check out his work there, and perhaps we'll hear from in a couple
of weeks when something else crazy goes on in the news speed I guess we'll
find out then, Larry, thanks for doing this with me. It's been
great to be bad Jack, and thank you guys listening. Sorry again about
my voice tonight, still a little strained, but that's okay. No matter
who you are, where you are, when you are, remember I'm merely
o'celly, and all of you are indeed the effect seeing tomorrow night for the
live call in show, and I hope you're well until then. Take it