1 00:00:16,199 --> 00:00:19,679 Welcome to episode two of Get Out Alive. And before we get started today, 2 00:00:19,960 --> 00:00:22,559 we're going to do a quick Patreon shout out. So if you don't 3 00:00:22,600 --> 00:00:26,640 know what Patreon is, it's a website where you can subscribe to different creators, 4 00:00:26,679 --> 00:00:29,239 and we have one. There's three different tiers that you can join. 5 00:00:29,320 --> 00:00:32,359 There's a one dollar level, which means you can support us for just twenty 6 00:00:32,399 --> 00:00:35,759 five cents an episode. There's a five dollars level and then a fifteen dollars 7 00:00:35,799 --> 00:00:39,679 level, and they each have different perks for the each different amounts of money 8 00:00:39,679 --> 00:00:43,679 whatever. So one of the perks is that you get your name shouted out 9 00:00:43,799 --> 00:00:47,640 on our podcast if you subscribe at a certain level. So Nick, take 10 00:00:47,640 --> 00:00:51,600 it away. Uh, I'm very excited for this. We have loads of 11 00:00:51,600 --> 00:00:54,479 cash flowing through right now, lots of people shout out today. So we're 12 00:00:54,479 --> 00:01:00,759 gonna start the music, all right. Our first patron of the day Sebastian 13 00:01:00,359 --> 00:01:10,719 Ghazara and music Episode two. Black Bears, Yes, Bears, black bears 14 00:01:11,879 --> 00:01:15,680 beats. I'm gonna tell you how black bears sometimes kill people. So right, 15 00:01:15,760 --> 00:01:19,159 are you gonna go? Bouser a not to go? I know copyright 16 00:01:22,879 --> 00:01:25,840 God forbid Rain Wilson southe us. Yeah, it might be a good way 17 00:01:25,879 --> 00:01:29,159 to meet them. Oh, I would love that. Anyways, this week 18 00:01:29,200 --> 00:01:33,239 we're talking about black bears. This is the species. Like I said in 19 00:01:33,280 --> 00:01:37,879 the previous episode, we have probably the most experience with firsthand, me just 20 00:01:37,959 --> 00:01:42,439 as a biologist who lives in New Hampshire and tells people daily how to not 21 00:01:42,799 --> 00:01:46,480 get attacked by a black bear, or just how to not have their animals 22 00:01:46,519 --> 00:01:49,519 be attacked by black bears, which I'm more than happy to go into later, 23 00:01:49,560 --> 00:01:53,519 but we're going to start with some different stories about bear attacks. Nick, 24 00:01:53,840 --> 00:01:56,799 what experience do you have with black bears. No, we're near as 25 00:01:56,840 --> 00:02:00,799 much as you do. I don't have the scientific background in them, but 26 00:02:00,840 --> 00:02:04,840 I do spend a lot of time outside. I've gone to Yosemite a few 27 00:02:04,840 --> 00:02:07,840 times, where there are black bears everywhere, and you know, like I 28 00:02:07,879 --> 00:02:13,199 am a big fan, so I try to have as much interaction with them 29 00:02:13,240 --> 00:02:16,479 safely as I possibly can. And I've never been attacked, so clearly I'm 30 00:02:16,520 --> 00:02:20,240 doing good. Well. Yeah, and I think an important thing to note 31 00:02:20,240 --> 00:02:24,199 too is your chances of being injured by a injured, not even killed injured 32 00:02:24,240 --> 00:02:29,400 by a black bear are one out of two point one million according to National 33 00:02:29,520 --> 00:02:32,840 Yuik Geographic pretty slim chance that one's even gonna hurt you. Yeah, no, 34 00:02:32,879 --> 00:02:37,479 And I do know that in Yosemite, majority of the bears that get 35 00:02:37,479 --> 00:02:40,319 moved, they get moved from rummering around into trash cans. There they don't 36 00:02:40,599 --> 00:02:45,159 really have any interaction with people, but you know, once they start getting 37 00:02:45,159 --> 00:02:47,520 too comfortable, they start to move them away. Yeah. And according to 38 00:02:47,639 --> 00:02:53,120 bear dot org they are roughly this website, they're roughly eight hundred thousand black 39 00:02:53,159 --> 00:02:57,560 bears in North America and on average, they kill less than one person a 40 00:02:57,639 --> 00:03:00,879 year, according to bear dot org. So do they kill like their leg? 41 00:03:00,960 --> 00:03:04,159 Do they kill? All? Right, well, we're not going to 42 00:03:04,199 --> 00:03:07,919 get into it. Okay, I hate talking about my mouth so or I 43 00:03:07,960 --> 00:03:10,479 hate doing that. What percentage of people do they kill? Just their soul? 44 00:03:10,680 --> 00:03:14,639 A lot of things kill my soul every day. So you're more likely 45 00:03:14,719 --> 00:03:19,159 to be killed by lightning, dogs, or a cow than a black bear 46 00:03:19,800 --> 00:03:23,400 in that order. In that order, lightning kills more people a year than 47 00:03:23,400 --> 00:03:27,000 dogs. Isn't that weird? Yeah? It is definitely is Is that just 48 00:03:27,039 --> 00:03:30,199 in North America? Is that like worldwide? Worldwide? Wow? I believe. 49 00:03:30,800 --> 00:03:35,319 Although yeah, I mean, dogs can kill you through giving you diseases. 50 00:03:35,319 --> 00:03:38,400 Like, we're not going to count that. I know it's ext thing. 51 00:03:38,439 --> 00:03:42,000 Deer kill people because the takes that fall off and kill people. Yeah, 52 00:03:42,199 --> 00:03:45,479 or you hit them with your car. That's all bears are waiting. 53 00:03:45,520 --> 00:03:49,159 No moose, We'll get there. We'll get the moose. So the first 54 00:03:49,199 --> 00:03:52,439 story I have for you today, because the ones I have are like pretty 55 00:03:52,439 --> 00:03:54,639 short, so we might be able to mention a few. The stories I 56 00:03:54,680 --> 00:03:59,639 have are from bear attacks, their causes and avoidance. The book by Steven 57 00:03:59,680 --> 00:04:02,800 Herret pretty straightforward title. So the first story that I have for you today 58 00:04:03,039 --> 00:04:09,639 is a brutal one, and it's the story of carol Anne palm Eranky near 59 00:04:09,800 --> 00:04:15,680 Salt Saint Marie, Michigan on July seventh, nineteen forty eight. She lived 60 00:04:15,680 --> 00:04:18,759 in a cabin with her parents and brother Allan. It was July seventh, 61 00:04:18,800 --> 00:04:21,360 it was a hot day, and Carol Anne was playing outside in the yard 62 00:04:21,360 --> 00:04:26,600 by herself, which is according to her mom, pretty normal. So in 63 00:04:26,639 --> 00:04:31,560 the book, the mother is listed as Missus Arthur Palmeranki, which gave me 64 00:04:31,720 --> 00:04:35,720 pause because I'm like, is her name Arthur? Is that the name of 65 00:04:35,759 --> 00:04:40,279 her husband, and it was like a you know when they introduce people at 66 00:04:40,360 --> 00:04:44,360 weddings as mister and missus his name? Is that all she gets in this 67 00:04:44,399 --> 00:04:46,639 book? I think that's all she gets in this book. That's awful. 68 00:04:46,800 --> 00:04:49,839 It's nineteen forty whatever. Really, that's no excuse to be misogynistic. It 69 00:04:49,879 --> 00:04:53,720 is not, but it's the way it was back then. Well I don't 70 00:04:53,800 --> 00:04:59,600 like it. Can't change history. So was go by Missus Palmerinsky Carol's mom 71 00:04:59,680 --> 00:05:03,959 Carol, Yeah, so anyways, July seventh, nineteen forty eight. I 72 00:05:03,959 --> 00:05:10,800 mean she also, I guess deserves to be that guy's wife whatever, hung 73 00:05:10,879 --> 00:05:13,639 up on. Yeah. So it's two thirty pm and Carol's mom was in 74 00:05:13,639 --> 00:05:16,319 the kitchen with her friend, Missus Merlin Summers, which is a name that 75 00:05:16,399 --> 00:05:20,560 I love. That's a good name. Is Merlin her husband's name or her 76 00:05:20,680 --> 00:05:24,720 name? I don't know, but Merlin's also a pretty cool bird, So 77 00:05:24,759 --> 00:05:27,959 I'm gonna go with that. Her and Missus Merlin Summers were hanging out in 78 00:05:28,000 --> 00:05:31,800 the kitchen about four feet from the back door. Missus Summers was facing the 79 00:05:31,839 --> 00:05:35,519 rear of the room and couldn't see outside, and Alan, their son, 80 00:05:35,680 --> 00:05:40,879 was playing in the basement. And from what I can gather, Carol's mother 81 00:05:41,319 --> 00:05:43,959 could at least see at the window while she was like doing dishes and cleaning 82 00:05:43,959 --> 00:05:46,160 and whatnot, so she you know, had eyes on her at least a 83 00:05:46,160 --> 00:05:49,720 little bit. Her first indication that something was wrong was when she heard Carol 84 00:05:49,839 --> 00:05:54,879 scream. So she immediately runs to the back door, which was open, 85 00:05:55,199 --> 00:06:00,199 but the screen was closed. Looks out and little Carol Anne is I mean, 86 00:06:00,319 --> 00:06:04,360 also, she's three years old. She's three. Little Carol Anne is 87 00:06:04,480 --> 00:06:10,040 kneeling in front of the door and has her hand on the door, and 88 00:06:10,160 --> 00:06:15,079 right behind her, a bear is walking up the porch. It growled, 89 00:06:15,399 --> 00:06:19,079 showed its teeth, and what I'm assuming is in an instant grabbed Carol Anne 90 00:06:19,120 --> 00:06:23,720 in its mouth and pulled her off the porch. It pulled her to the 91 00:06:23,720 --> 00:06:27,040 ground, picked her up by her arm in its mouth and went into the 92 00:06:27,040 --> 00:06:32,959 woods. And at this point, Missus Summers the friend pulls Carol's mother from 93 00:06:33,000 --> 00:06:40,319 the door and shuts it and shuts the inside door. I cannot for the 94 00:06:40,399 --> 00:06:44,120 light. It makes me so angry when I read it, and I feel 95 00:06:44,160 --> 00:06:47,439 bad casting any judgment, but like, don't shut the door, open the 96 00:06:47,480 --> 00:06:51,000 door and go after it. I would agree, but when when you're in 97 00:06:51,079 --> 00:06:55,759 shock like that, you don't. She's more about her own survival. She 98 00:06:55,800 --> 00:06:59,160 doesn't care about the mom, she doesn't care about the daughter. She just 99 00:07:00,600 --> 00:07:03,560 I mean, she's in shock, she's panicking. No whatever. Carol's mom 100 00:07:03,800 --> 00:07:08,959 runs for her husband's pistol, a thirty two to twenty Colt revolver. Nice. 101 00:07:09,120 --> 00:07:11,959 I know, I'm really into revolvers, would love one, but maybe 102 00:07:11,959 --> 00:07:15,480 not to go after a bear. No. She was obviously panicking and couldn't 103 00:07:15,480 --> 00:07:19,160 load it. So she runs to the door, but obviously the bear is 104 00:07:19,480 --> 00:07:24,720 gone and she has no direction of where it went, so she calls the 105 00:07:24,800 --> 00:07:28,759 ranger station and they all gathered up as soon as they can and went to 106 00:07:28,759 --> 00:07:30,920 the woods to look for the bear. And the rest of it's pretty gruesome 107 00:07:31,000 --> 00:07:35,759 if you're of the faint of heart. There's parts that you shouldn't listen to. 108 00:07:36,199 --> 00:07:39,800 But we're only going to ever talk about the bits that are important. 109 00:07:39,800 --> 00:07:44,920 We're not here to like shock anybody or anything. We can assume some of 110 00:07:44,959 --> 00:07:48,680 the worst stuff problem. Yeah, exactly soon after Carol was dragged away, 111 00:07:49,360 --> 00:07:54,399 she also called her husband and they organized the search party, and the party 112 00:07:54,480 --> 00:07:58,199 was headed by Alex van Luvin, another great name who was a former state 113 00:07:58,279 --> 00:08:01,920 trapper, but he was badly recognized as a competent woodsman. So they were, 114 00:08:03,000 --> 00:08:05,040 you know, they felt that they were in good hands trying to track 115 00:08:05,040 --> 00:08:09,399 it down. The next bit is from an account of his taken that day. 116 00:08:09,879 --> 00:08:13,439 Alex van Lubin drives to his home to get his tracker dog Tower. 117 00:08:13,959 --> 00:08:18,319 I don't know what breed Tower is that I want to know everything about him. 118 00:08:18,680 --> 00:08:22,519 Anyways, no one except three men had gone into the woods as searchers, 119 00:08:22,720 --> 00:08:26,720 and he, Alex van Lubin, told them to wait until he got 120 00:08:26,759 --> 00:08:30,800 back with his dog. He gets back with Tower and tells the guys to 121 00:08:30,839 --> 00:08:33,960 stay behind him, and they set out. He traveled west from the cabin, 122 00:08:35,480 --> 00:08:37,519 and you know, since no one could get a peg on where the 123 00:08:37,519 --> 00:08:41,399 bear had gone, and approximately one hundred yards west the cabin, the dog 124 00:08:41,480 --> 00:08:46,600 scented the bear and just started taking off. So they follow the dog for 125 00:08:46,639 --> 00:08:52,840 about sixty yards, and the men were starting to discover blood spots and picked 126 00:08:52,919 --> 00:08:56,919 up one of Carol's shoes, and they noticed in this one spot that the 127 00:08:58,000 --> 00:09:03,360 leaves had been disarranged, and that's when the dog pulled very strongly northwest and 128 00:09:03,720 --> 00:09:09,919 for about one hundred and fifty feet until they discovered Carol's body. She was 129 00:09:09,919 --> 00:09:13,000 face up. She had her head reclining at the base of an oak tree. 130 00:09:13,440 --> 00:09:16,039 Part of her clothing was still there. It was like weird to them 131 00:09:16,039 --> 00:09:20,080 because it was kind of untouched. The clothing. It was like a little 132 00:09:20,120 --> 00:09:22,320 tattered, but like, it's not. The bear ripped her apart, you 133 00:09:22,360 --> 00:09:28,840 know, it completely removed her abdomen and all of her like innerds were gone. 134 00:09:28,879 --> 00:09:31,960 Both of her legs were eaten away to the bone. There was no 135 00:09:33,039 --> 00:09:37,000 blood evidence, and the leg bones were very clean and visible. She had 136 00:09:37,039 --> 00:09:39,840 some deep gashes on her head and neck, but there was little damage to 137 00:09:39,879 --> 00:09:41,480 her face. It was, you know, most of the trauma was to 138 00:09:41,600 --> 00:09:46,240 this abdomen. A short while later, they discovered a one hundred and twenty 139 00:09:46,320 --> 00:09:50,440 five pound black bear and shot it. Now, if you're imagining a bear 140 00:09:50,480 --> 00:09:54,480 big enough to take a child, how big would you assume it would be? 141 00:09:54,679 --> 00:09:58,360 Oh? Three girls, not that big. I wouldn't imagine it's huge. 142 00:09:58,720 --> 00:10:01,120 That's a bear the size of me. That is not a big bear. 143 00:10:01,320 --> 00:10:05,039 No, I don't think a bear would have to be very big to 144 00:10:05,039 --> 00:10:07,039 take a three year old. Yeah, maybe the size of your little pop 145 00:10:07,080 --> 00:10:11,440 Swarer here swears eighty pounds that even that, I think it would be more 146 00:10:11,480 --> 00:10:15,919 than enough to take. He's pure muscle. He's different. They found the 147 00:10:15,919 --> 00:10:18,440 bear that they assumed killed Carol, did the knee cropsy on it and confirmed 148 00:10:18,440 --> 00:10:22,039 that there were bits of Carol inside. And I think the important thing to 149 00:10:22,200 --> 00:10:28,039 mention about why we talked about, you know, the condition her body was 150 00:10:28,080 --> 00:10:31,679 found in is because that's pretty classic for black bears. They'll you know, 151 00:10:31,759 --> 00:10:35,600 take out the intestines and eat those first because that's like nutritionally the best part. 152 00:10:37,120 --> 00:10:39,679 All of it led to it being a black bear kill, which makes 153 00:10:39,679 --> 00:10:41,759 sense. So it wasn't like the bear took her and then I don't know, 154 00:10:41,759 --> 00:10:45,519 somebody murdered her, so it would be even wilder story. That'd be 155 00:10:45,519 --> 00:10:48,240 a very bad day. I mean, it was horrible. Anyways, after 156 00:10:48,399 --> 00:10:50,639 you know, checking up on the bear, they found out it was very 157 00:10:50,679 --> 00:10:54,960 thin, but there was nothing else abnormal, like it wasn't rabbit or anything. 158 00:10:54,440 --> 00:10:58,159 What time of year was this July? He said it was July seventh, 159 00:10:58,240 --> 00:11:00,399 so like the bear should have been fattening up a little. It was 160 00:11:00,440 --> 00:11:03,759 before blueberry season, so it's probably spring. Yeah, so you know their 161 00:11:03,799 --> 00:11:07,480 main food source isn't out yet, so that's when they're pretty desperate. Okay, 162 00:11:07,039 --> 00:11:11,080 I mean, like I said, I don't want to bash the mom 163 00:11:11,120 --> 00:11:15,840 too hard, but it's not hard to deter black bears. So if she 164 00:11:16,080 --> 00:11:22,039 had fought at all, there's a chance she could have stopped Carolyn for being 165 00:11:22,080 --> 00:11:24,240 like fully dragged away. Yeah. I mean, who knows. Carolyne could 166 00:11:24,240 --> 00:11:26,639 have been dead as soon as she hit the ground, so maybe it wouldn't 167 00:11:26,639 --> 00:11:30,799 have stopped her from dying, but it could have stopped her from being hauled 168 00:11:30,799 --> 00:11:35,120 away. Yes, and I'm sure having a child eaten is a little more 169 00:11:35,279 --> 00:11:37,399 than just I would assume, so not a mom, but not a mom, 170 00:11:37,600 --> 00:11:41,480 but I would assume it gets a little more traumatic one. Yeah. 171 00:11:41,559 --> 00:11:46,639 Yeah, and there's not a lot carol Anne could have done differently. She's 172 00:11:46,679 --> 00:11:50,600 not doing it. Yeah. So as an example of how little, well 173 00:11:50,679 --> 00:11:54,639 not how little you need to do to deter a bear, but ways to 174 00:11:54,080 --> 00:11:58,279 save yourself, yeah, ways to use the environment around you to aid you 175 00:11:58,519 --> 00:12:03,240 things. Another story in this book by Stephen Herrero is this ten year old 176 00:12:03,240 --> 00:12:07,440 girl. They don't have a name for her, but it was September first, 177 00:12:07,559 --> 00:12:11,039 nineteen seventy six, and she was attacked and injured by a black bear 178 00:12:11,240 --> 00:12:16,480 in British Columbia, near Williams Lake. A account of the attack says that 179 00:12:16,639 --> 00:12:20,039 this girl was playing by a creek and she was carrying a water bucket up 180 00:12:20,080 --> 00:12:22,240 back to her hut. I don't know where this girl's parents was. Was 181 00:12:22,279 --> 00:12:26,279 she living in the woods? Bear herself? I really don't know. I 182 00:12:26,279 --> 00:12:28,519 hope. I mean, hey, she is killing it. She's bringing a 183 00:12:28,559 --> 00:12:33,559 water bucket up back to her hut, and when she notices a bear approaching 184 00:12:33,559 --> 00:12:37,799 her, a black bear, she drops the bucket and grabs an axe laying 185 00:12:37,799 --> 00:12:41,159 nearby, hits the bear twice, and then starts running for the house. 186 00:12:41,600 --> 00:12:46,960 This bear was like all right, and followed her, swatted her and knocked 187 00:12:46,000 --> 00:12:50,120 her down, but she still managed to reach the door of the cabin. 188 00:12:50,759 --> 00:12:56,200 It tried to follow her inside, but with some quick thinking, she remembered 189 00:12:56,200 --> 00:13:00,360 that she had a pot of boiling water and grabbed it and threw in the 190 00:13:00,360 --> 00:13:03,440 bear's face, and that was enough to get the bear to give up. 191 00:13:03,600 --> 00:13:07,080 Yeah. I mean if I got boiling water on my face, I would 192 00:13:07,080 --> 00:13:09,000 probably run away to Yeah, And you know, she got some broken ribs, 193 00:13:09,000 --> 00:13:13,679 but no one died that day, So that's a wind for everybody. 194 00:13:13,679 --> 00:13:16,720 Your ten year old kick can do it. You came too. Thankfully she 195 00:13:16,799 --> 00:13:20,639 had a pot of boiling water with her. It's a lot of people don't 196 00:13:20,639 --> 00:13:22,639 when they're out in the woods. Yeah, I don't think when you're hiking 197 00:13:22,679 --> 00:13:26,840 you carry a pot of boiling water. I enjoy my tea, so actually 198 00:13:26,840 --> 00:13:28,360 I do have one, you know, a little tea maker in my backpack. 199 00:13:28,399 --> 00:13:33,039 You have a teamaker, a hot yeah, shut your mouth, all 200 00:13:33,159 --> 00:13:35,080 right, but yeah, I mean the point is if a bear is coming 201 00:13:35,080 --> 00:13:39,039 at you fight it with everything that you got. Black bears are historically big 202 00:13:39,080 --> 00:13:45,960 fat babies, So quote me on that flat bears are big fat babies bfbs. 203 00:13:46,279 --> 00:13:50,159 And what you've told me is that they are more known for attacking for 204 00:13:50,440 --> 00:13:54,159 predation than they are for protecting their young. Yes, And I mean we'll 205 00:13:54,159 --> 00:13:58,320 get into we'll get into grizzlies in later episodes. But ninety percent of black 206 00:13:58,320 --> 00:14:03,000 bear attacks, like rough attacks, are predaceous. So that's the main difference 207 00:14:03,000 --> 00:14:05,759 with them and grizzlies is grizzlies, you're way more likely to be attacked because 208 00:14:07,039 --> 00:14:11,200 it's a mother protecting your cub and so it's defensive. But yeah, for 209 00:14:11,240 --> 00:14:13,159 black bears, it's they're trying to eat you. So this is where it 210 00:14:13,200 --> 00:14:16,679 comes in, where when a black bear is attacking you, it wants you 211 00:14:16,799 --> 00:14:20,080 dead. So the whole story of playing dead when you're being attacked by a 212 00:14:20,080 --> 00:14:22,559 bear, do not do that with black bears because they was start eating you 213 00:14:22,600 --> 00:14:26,840 if they you're dead. Well it depends, right, So I mean, 214 00:14:26,480 --> 00:14:31,360 I guess that's why bear biologists don't really use that adage like, oh, 215 00:14:31,559 --> 00:14:33,399 play with a grizzly, not with the black bear, because it really depends. 216 00:14:33,440 --> 00:14:37,639 Like if there's a grizzly that's persistent coming for you and it's like an 217 00:14:37,679 --> 00:14:41,840 adult male, it's not protecting its cubs, it's probably gonna I mean, 218 00:14:43,000 --> 00:14:46,159 it doesn't have to be predaceous. But anyways, it's circumstantial. So like 219 00:14:46,399 --> 00:14:50,039 use context clues. You don't have to be a bear expert or a biologist 220 00:14:50,120 --> 00:14:54,480 to understand when an animal is trying to kill you and when it is uncomfortable 221 00:14:54,519 --> 00:14:56,679 with how close you are to it. So that's kind of the difference. 222 00:14:56,759 --> 00:15:00,879 And you know a lot of people will call me and hey, there's a 223 00:15:00,919 --> 00:15:03,399 mother black bear with cubs I'm worried because I know that I shouldn't get near 224 00:15:03,440 --> 00:15:07,759 them. It's really not the case with black bears. For example, there's 225 00:15:07,840 --> 00:15:11,840 in Stephen's book, there's cases of people trapping black bear cubs and the mom 226 00:15:13,000 --> 00:15:16,279 just like either hangs around the area or is like, okay, you got 227 00:15:16,279 --> 00:15:18,600 them. Sorry now. Yeah, there's not a lot of threat there the 228 00:15:18,600 --> 00:15:22,399 black bear. Not that they're not good moms, but like they just they're 229 00:15:22,440 --> 00:15:26,960 not as you know, aggressive as grizzly moms. Yeah, there's only one 230 00:15:28,039 --> 00:15:31,639 case I could find, according to wide openspaces dot com, between nineteen ninety 231 00:15:31,679 --> 00:15:35,279 seven and twenty seventeen, that was actually caused by a mother bear, and 232 00:15:35,320 --> 00:15:39,320 it was this woman named Glinda Ann Bradley, and she was killed but also 233 00:15:39,440 --> 00:15:43,480 partially consumed in two thousand by a mother bear in her cub in the Great 234 00:15:43,519 --> 00:15:48,120 Smoky Mountain National Park. So it's unclear in that case too, whether it 235 00:15:48,200 --> 00:15:52,960 was initially defensive or if it was predacious from the get go. But I 236 00:15:52,960 --> 00:15:54,879 think it's important in that case to highlight the fact that they did start to 237 00:15:54,879 --> 00:15:58,000 eat her. So it's totally possible the mom bear was like, hey, 238 00:15:58,120 --> 00:16:03,080 uh, maybe we'll just eat this. So yeah, who knows, but 239 00:16:03,480 --> 00:16:07,039 you know, in contrast to grizzlies, black bear attacks are extremely rare in 240 00:16:07,120 --> 00:16:10,039 national parks, and the issue there, like you were saying early on, 241 00:16:10,399 --> 00:16:14,720 is they just become so habituated to people and eating trash and that's when they 242 00:16:14,759 --> 00:16:18,919 become problem bears. But the bears that are eating people are bears that live 243 00:16:19,519 --> 00:16:23,159 not around a lot of people. Yeah, like National Park bear is not 244 00:16:23,200 --> 00:16:27,960 going to they're eating the trash, they're eating all the stuff with the campsites. 245 00:16:29,080 --> 00:16:32,600 They don't need to kill a human for food, and they know that 246 00:16:32,639 --> 00:16:34,759 they're not going to be killed by humans. They know they're not really part 247 00:16:34,759 --> 00:16:38,879 of the food chain there, so they're not worried about a human coming killing 248 00:16:40,039 --> 00:16:42,159 their babies. It's just not really a thing. Yeah, these are bad 249 00:16:42,159 --> 00:16:45,440 examples of bears. Like so for me, like I said, I've been 250 00:16:45,480 --> 00:16:49,279 in Yosemite, I can't really use my experiences there to say, oh, 251 00:16:49,399 --> 00:16:52,279 every black bear in the world is going to be like this. It's just 252 00:16:52,360 --> 00:16:56,720 not logical. Now I've seen black bearries with cubs that are hanging out thirty 253 00:16:56,759 --> 00:17:00,399 feet from people because they're just used to being around people and they're not worried 254 00:17:00,399 --> 00:17:03,519 about it. Exactly. But if I ran too the woods out here and 255 00:17:03,599 --> 00:17:06,960 I see a black bear in a mother like like you said, it's not 256 00:17:06,960 --> 00:17:08,799 gonna be an issue. But I don't imagine they're gonna be as calm as 257 00:17:08,799 --> 00:17:11,319 the other ones were. Yeah, I mean I don't live in like that 258 00:17:11,440 --> 00:17:15,000 role of an area. But yeah, black bears are way more likely to 259 00:17:15,039 --> 00:17:18,759 be habituated to people. And like you were saying about the National Park thing, 260 00:17:18,240 --> 00:17:22,400 I mean, black bears are omnivorous and can eat anything, like they 261 00:17:22,400 --> 00:17:26,039 love berries. They very rarely will actually like hunt things actively and put in 262 00:17:26,039 --> 00:17:30,079 that much ever fruit stuff. So it's not I mean, it's not like 263 00:17:30,119 --> 00:17:33,839 grizzlies where they're like hunting down deer or elk CAFs and you know, fishing 264 00:17:34,039 --> 00:17:37,400 for trout and stuff like that. So black bears don't need to expend the 265 00:17:37,440 --> 00:17:41,359 extra energy to kill us. So why would they. Yeah, A lot 266 00:17:41,400 --> 00:17:44,920 of the issues I have when people call me is you know, I'm sitting 267 00:17:44,960 --> 00:17:48,440 on my porch and this black bear just walked into my yard and I yelled 268 00:17:48,480 --> 00:17:51,160 at it, and it's not doing anything. Can you come remove it? 269 00:17:51,720 --> 00:17:56,799 One? No, we will not do that. No, it's a such 270 00:17:56,839 --> 00:17:59,720 a rare circumstance for a bear to be moved, because you have to remember 271 00:18:00,079 --> 00:18:02,319 so much time and money goes into that. You have to find the right 272 00:18:02,319 --> 00:18:04,640 bear, tranquilize it, have a vet to make sure that it has the 273 00:18:04,720 --> 00:18:10,440 right dosage of that, transport it somewhere where you're assuming it won't be somebody 274 00:18:10,480 --> 00:18:12,799 else's problem, and hope and pray that the bear doesn't just walk right back, 275 00:18:12,880 --> 00:18:15,640 because that is a thing that happened here in New Hampshire. It was 276 00:18:15,680 --> 00:18:18,880 a case in Hanover a few years ago with this bear that they named Mink, 277 00:18:19,400 --> 00:18:22,400 and she was going to be put down because she kept she was a 278 00:18:22,480 --> 00:18:26,200 nuisance and you know, kept killing livestock and stuff like that. And instead 279 00:18:26,240 --> 00:18:27,319 of killing her, the governor, you know, people made us think about 280 00:18:27,319 --> 00:18:30,119 it, and the governor was like, you know what, just move her 281 00:18:30,200 --> 00:18:33,119 up to Pittsburgh, New Hampshire, which is the very tip super rule. 282 00:18:33,720 --> 00:18:36,880 So they move her. What happens next, She's just been going to town 283 00:18:36,920 --> 00:18:38,960 and do the same thing. She walked back all the way back to the 284 00:18:40,039 --> 00:18:42,920 She walked all the way back to Hanover, which is like hundreds of miles 285 00:18:42,960 --> 00:18:47,440 and really impressive. I mean, so think about it, like she knew 286 00:18:47,559 --> 00:18:48,400 where there was a good food source, and she knew what to do, 287 00:18:48,440 --> 00:18:52,400 and she lived out her natural life in Hanover and they just were like, 288 00:18:52,440 --> 00:18:55,039 well, well she's part of the town now. Yeah. Ye, she 289 00:18:55,119 --> 00:18:56,400 since passed away, but she loved to be a very old bear. But 290 00:18:56,559 --> 00:19:00,720 my point in saying that is like, if a bear is coming into your 291 00:19:00,799 --> 00:19:03,839 yard and isn't afraid of you, no one's gonna move it. The point 292 00:19:03,880 --> 00:19:07,720 is you need to harass bears, and specifically black bears. If they're habituated 293 00:19:07,720 --> 00:19:10,519 to people, they don't care that you're yelling at them. You have to 294 00:19:10,599 --> 00:19:14,680 make loud, unexpected noises with airhorns, you know, firing off guns, 295 00:19:14,720 --> 00:19:17,119 things like that, and you have to be persistent. That is the key, 296 00:19:17,200 --> 00:19:21,359 being persistent. It's very easy to live with black bears. And you've 297 00:19:21,359 --> 00:19:25,680 probably been around so many black bears and just never noticed it because they chose 298 00:19:25,720 --> 00:19:27,799 to not bother you. That's just my two cents about it. I could 299 00:19:27,839 --> 00:19:30,720 go on and on and on and on about black bears. Well this is 300 00:19:30,839 --> 00:19:33,599 by way of the podcast, so you can go on and on and on 301 00:19:33,640 --> 00:19:37,880 about black bears, because we have just gone on and on and on between 302 00:19:37,880 --> 00:19:40,640 ourselves and we're like, you know what, more people need to hear it. 303 00:19:41,079 --> 00:19:47,519 The next story is about a woman named Cynthia Doosal Bacon. Come on, 304 00:19:48,160 --> 00:19:52,599 it's a good name. Dousal Bacon, dost hyphen Bacon. Oh, 305 00:19:52,680 --> 00:19:55,559 so which one is her name? Is it Bacon? Well maybe her parents. 306 00:19:56,039 --> 00:20:00,759 Oh that's a thing sometimes nineteen seventy seven, Cynthia Dusal Bacon, You 307 00:20:00,920 --> 00:20:06,000 done? Yeah, all right. It's August of nineteen seventy seven and Cynthia 308 00:20:06,039 --> 00:20:10,519 it's headed to the Yukon tanana uplands of Alaska with five other geologists just to 309 00:20:10,559 --> 00:20:14,279 do some work. And when they do this work, they're in the wilderness, 310 00:20:14,359 --> 00:20:18,680 there is nothing, and they work alone, which probably stopped after this. 311 00:20:18,920 --> 00:20:22,359 But anyways, she hadn't seen a lot of fire activity before. She'd 312 00:20:22,400 --> 00:20:26,759 seen two grizzlies. But like she kind of just you know, did her 313 00:20:26,839 --> 00:20:29,480 thing, got in, got out, and you know, tried to do 314 00:20:29,519 --> 00:20:32,200 her best to remain aware of the bears. She made a lot of noise 315 00:20:32,200 --> 00:20:33,680 when she walked, and you know, that's the thing. We'll talk about 316 00:20:33,680 --> 00:20:37,720 a lot with grizzlies. So on this day, August thirteenth, nineteen seventy 317 00:20:37,720 --> 00:20:42,039 seven, she gets off the helicopter piloted by Ed Spencer, who he'll come 318 00:20:42,039 --> 00:20:45,759 in later. She was descending down a ridge for several hundred yards and you 319 00:20:45,799 --> 00:20:52,240 know, she was moving looking at some rocks and suddenly heard a loud crash 320 00:20:52,279 --> 00:20:56,160 behind her in the bushes. So she turned around just in time to see 321 00:20:56,160 --> 00:21:00,279 a black bear step out of the bush about ten feet away from her. 322 00:21:00,599 --> 00:21:03,759 And initially she thought like, oh, a bear. I better do what's 323 00:21:03,839 --> 00:21:07,240 right, and then realized, oh, it's just a black bear. All 324 00:21:07,279 --> 00:21:08,640 I have to do is make noise, like I don't have to worry about 325 00:21:08,759 --> 00:21:11,440 you know, if it's a grizzly, what do I do? Do I 326 00:21:11,440 --> 00:21:14,880 play dead that kind of thing. She thought she had it in the bag 327 00:21:15,000 --> 00:21:18,119 tried to start scaring it away, so she yelled at it. She was 328 00:21:18,119 --> 00:21:19,680 saying, get out of here, go away, in a very commanding voice, 329 00:21:19,759 --> 00:21:22,359 and the bear just kind of looked at her, and she clapped. 330 00:21:22,480 --> 00:21:26,960 She yelled louder, but the bear just kind of stayed there, staring. 331 00:21:26,519 --> 00:21:32,720 Instead of running away, it began slowly walking towards her, watching her, 332 00:21:33,119 --> 00:21:37,400 and she was waving her arms, clapping, yelling even more, and none 333 00:21:37,400 --> 00:21:40,480 of it was making a difference to this black bear, so she took a 334 00:21:40,480 --> 00:21:42,920 step back and managed to get some elevation on it. But by this time 335 00:21:42,960 --> 00:21:47,160 the bear had reached the trail that she was on, so it looked up 336 00:21:47,200 --> 00:21:49,519 the hill in the direction in which she had come, and then looked back 337 00:21:49,519 --> 00:21:52,359 at her again, almost like, you know, is there anyone behind you? 338 00:21:52,480 --> 00:21:57,200 Nope, okay, And after that the bear darted behind an outcrop and 339 00:21:57,440 --> 00:22:03,279 the next thing she remembers is being hit from behind and she was thrown forward, 340 00:22:03,440 --> 00:22:07,599 landed face down, arms spread out. She remembers playing dead because she 341 00:22:08,359 --> 00:22:14,039 had heard that playing dead would cause an attacking bear to lose interest. But 342 00:22:14,160 --> 00:22:18,559 instead of hearing the bear run away, she felt it pierce into her right 343 00:22:18,599 --> 00:22:22,640 shoulder, biting really deep down, and it started shaking her, like holding 344 00:22:22,680 --> 00:22:26,960 it in her mouth, holding her in its mouth, shaking her. And 345 00:22:26,039 --> 00:22:30,640 after a few minutes of playing dead, she realized, there is no way 346 00:22:30,640 --> 00:22:33,440 that is going to make a difference to this bear. Her next thought was, 347 00:22:33,480 --> 00:22:36,200 Okay, I have a radio in my pack. I can call out 348 00:22:36,240 --> 00:22:38,920 to somebody. Although the bear was attacking her right arm, she still had 349 00:22:40,039 --> 00:22:44,000 her left arm that was free and not damage. She tried to reach out 350 00:22:44,160 --> 00:22:48,279 with her left hand in her backpack to grab her walkie talkie, but realized 351 00:22:48,319 --> 00:22:52,359 that the flap that was like buckled the radio in was preventing her from getting 352 00:22:52,359 --> 00:22:56,559 it out because it was really secure in there. This sudden movement of her 353 00:22:56,599 --> 00:23:00,559 left arm caused the bear to start a whole new flory of attacks, biting 354 00:23:00,599 --> 00:23:03,920 and tearing apart her right arm again. She said she was completely conscious of 355 00:23:03,960 --> 00:23:10,000 her flush being torn, but the sensation was more like numb and horrified rather 356 00:23:10,079 --> 00:23:14,160 than how this hurts. Yeah, she was just in shock, all that 357 00:23:14,200 --> 00:23:17,480 adrenaline going, You're not gonna feel a thing. So she's just thinking, 358 00:23:17,839 --> 00:23:18,960 well, now I'm not going to be able to call for help, and 359 00:23:19,079 --> 00:23:22,839 unless this bear decides to leave me alone, I'm dead, which is really 360 00:23:22,880 --> 00:23:26,240 clear thought for someone who's being mauled by a black bear. After chewing on 361 00:23:26,319 --> 00:23:29,599 her right arm and her right shoulder, it began to bite her head and 362 00:23:29,680 --> 00:23:33,359 tear at her scalp, and she remembers hearing the horrible crunching sound of it 363 00:23:33,440 --> 00:23:36,279 biting into her skull. Then thought this is it, Like this is the 364 00:23:36,279 --> 00:23:38,680 worst way to go, Like I'm being eaten by a bear. Then the 365 00:23:38,720 --> 00:23:42,319 bear clammed its jaws into her and began dragging her by her right arm down 366 00:23:42,319 --> 00:23:45,880 the slope through some brush, which is not great. As we talked about 367 00:23:45,920 --> 00:23:51,039 before, they're dragging you somewhere to keep you, you know, we talked 368 00:23:51,039 --> 00:23:53,160 about Carol's case. It had buried her a little bit and like disturbed some 369 00:23:53,240 --> 00:23:57,599 leaves because it was going to come back. So it pulled her along the 370 00:23:57,599 --> 00:24:02,559 ground over rocks and through brush, which is like so brute, extra brutality 371 00:24:02,599 --> 00:24:06,000 added on to it by the bear. And then once it got her to 372 00:24:06,079 --> 00:24:08,079 a spot that it liked, it walked four feet away, sat down and 373 00:24:08,200 --> 00:24:11,440 just watched her like it was just taking a break. So she was like, 374 00:24:11,440 --> 00:24:15,279 all right, this is my next chance. If I moved slowly enough, 375 00:24:15,799 --> 00:24:18,119 I can probably grab my radio. So her left arm still intact, 376 00:24:18,559 --> 00:24:23,279 she slides it over to where her radio was and was relieved to find that 377 00:24:23,319 --> 00:24:27,440 the latch that was like attaching her radio into her backpack had been broken, 378 00:24:29,119 --> 00:24:32,920 assuming from the bear's claws, so she was able to get the radio out, 379 00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:37,960 use her left hand to her mouth to loudly say into the radio, 380 00:24:38,359 --> 00:24:41,720 ed, this is Cynthia, come quick, I'm being eaten by a bear. 381 00:24:41,839 --> 00:24:45,359 Because she was very aware you're past the attack point. You're in the 382 00:24:45,400 --> 00:24:51,079 process of being eaten. Eaten. She repeated her message, like ed, 383 00:24:51,119 --> 00:24:52,960 I'm just down the hill from where you left me. But by the time 384 00:24:53,039 --> 00:24:56,599 she got to that point, the bear got off its feet, ran over 385 00:24:56,640 --> 00:25:00,079 to her and started tearing apart her left arm. Would just imagine getting that 386 00:25:00,079 --> 00:25:04,880 call with the radio, just like no real quick yours a pilot probably just 387 00:25:06,000 --> 00:25:08,400 chilling in the helicopter. I don't know what you would do back in nineteen 388 00:25:08,400 --> 00:25:11,359 seventy seven, you know, plane, Sudoku or some stuff. Napping, 389 00:25:11,599 --> 00:25:15,119 napping, Yeah, and all of a sudden you have your coworker screaming that 390 00:25:15,160 --> 00:25:21,119 they're being eaten by a bear. So anyways, so the bear starts tearing 391 00:25:21,160 --> 00:25:26,119 apart her left arm and spoiler, when she was found there was literally no 392 00:25:26,279 --> 00:25:30,240 flesh on her left arm between her shoulder and her elbow. At that point, 393 00:25:30,359 --> 00:25:32,319 she was like, well, I did what I can. All I 394 00:25:32,319 --> 00:25:36,599 could do is radio in That's it. She was worried because she hadn't extended 395 00:25:36,640 --> 00:25:38,559 the antenna on her radio, so she wasn't even sure if it was going 396 00:25:38,640 --> 00:25:41,400 to work, if the message was just going to get across, and she 397 00:25:41,480 --> 00:25:45,359 was down a ravine there was a lot of ridges around them, a lot 398 00:25:45,400 --> 00:25:47,640 of brush, so she was like, the odds of them even seeing me 399 00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:51,519 if they fly the helicopter over is pretty slim. So she started screaming at 400 00:25:51,519 --> 00:25:53,519 this point as the bear tore into her left arm and her left shoulder and 401 00:25:53,599 --> 00:25:56,599 it was just gonna eat her no matter what she tried to do. And 402 00:25:56,640 --> 00:26:00,519 then it started tearing at her backpack, which was like relief for her because 403 00:26:00,519 --> 00:26:03,160 it gave her a break, you know, And it was like crunching the 404 00:26:03,200 --> 00:26:07,039 cans in her bag, you just tearing it open, and she thought, 405 00:26:07,240 --> 00:26:11,000 Okay, at least my arms are being given a break. And all she 406 00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:14,960 could think of as she was laying face down on her stomach with her arms 407 00:26:15,079 --> 00:26:18,480 torn apart, with this animal on top of her, was how much that 408 00:26:18,559 --> 00:26:21,680 she wanted to live and wanted to go home to her husband, Charlie, 409 00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:25,759 of only five months, and she said, how tragic it would be to 410 00:26:25,880 --> 00:26:29,200 end it all three days before I turned thirty one. Oh my god, 411 00:26:29,440 --> 00:26:32,039 I know, And she said it was about ten minutes of the bear like 412 00:26:32,079 --> 00:26:36,359 going into her pack and whatnot before she heard the faint helicopter sound the distance 413 00:26:37,000 --> 00:26:41,000 and it started to come closer and seemed to circle her but not passed directly 414 00:26:41,039 --> 00:26:44,319 over her. But then she heard it going away and thought, was it 415 00:26:44,400 --> 00:26:47,599 just a routine pass, like is someone else, you know, being dropped 416 00:26:47,599 --> 00:26:51,079 off or brought to a different area? Did anyone even hear me? And 417 00:26:51,119 --> 00:26:52,799 the bear didn't care it Like her, the helicopter was like, whatever, 418 00:26:52,880 --> 00:26:56,880 I'm still going through this backpack. Do you know what the terrain she's in? 419 00:26:56,920 --> 00:27:00,240 And is she like in a forest really hard to see her? Or 420 00:27:00,240 --> 00:27:03,240 are they on like a yeah, I mean she's in like it's a wooded 421 00:27:03,240 --> 00:27:06,839 area. So even though they saw it, even if she calls them, 422 00:27:06,880 --> 00:27:10,240 like, they don't know the exact spot, like exactly, they just know 423 00:27:10,279 --> 00:27:14,279 the area. So there is flying over hoping to see something of her. 424 00:27:14,599 --> 00:27:15,839 Yeah, you know, as she's having this crisis in her head like oh 425 00:27:15,880 --> 00:27:18,319 my god, did they hear me? Can they see me? She hears 426 00:27:18,319 --> 00:27:22,359 the helicopter coming back, circling and getting close to her, and she's flat 427 00:27:22,359 --> 00:27:26,440 on her face. She can't see anything, like she can't even wave her 428 00:27:26,519 --> 00:27:30,279 arms or anything to get their attention. But this time she was sure she 429 00:27:30,359 --> 00:27:33,440 was to be rescued because they hovered directly over her in a few seconds, 430 00:27:33,759 --> 00:27:37,160 it was silent, no bear. The bear wasn't on her, but she 431 00:27:37,240 --> 00:27:41,480 also couldn't hear the helicopter. They left her again. The helicopter left her 432 00:27:41,519 --> 00:27:45,640 again, but then she also sends like the bear is not next to me 433 00:27:45,680 --> 00:27:48,200 anymore, Like it's quiet. The helicopter's gone, but so is the bear. 434 00:27:48,519 --> 00:27:52,559 And assume that the sound of the helicopter frightened it away. So for 435 00:27:52,599 --> 00:27:56,160 about ten more minutes she sat in silence, and then heard the calicopter coming 436 00:27:56,319 --> 00:28:00,400 again, and it was fast and directly towards her, and in just a 437 00:28:00,400 --> 00:28:03,839 few seconds it was right above her, and she started kicking her legs and 438 00:28:03,880 --> 00:28:07,200 then heard the helicopter move towards the crest of the ridge for what she thought 439 00:28:07,279 --> 00:28:10,920 was like it was landing, and then she heard the engine shut down, 440 00:28:11,039 --> 00:28:15,039 voices people yelling for her, and she started yelling back, but the trees 441 00:28:15,039 --> 00:28:18,799 were thick and she kind of blended in like with the uniform she had on. 442 00:28:19,200 --> 00:28:23,440 But luckily ed the pilot spotted her and called out to two other women 443 00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:26,599 geologists to come help him, and they carried her up the hill to the 444 00:28:26,599 --> 00:28:30,519 backseat of the helicopter. You know, besides the trauma to her arms, 445 00:28:30,799 --> 00:28:34,240 her head was clear, she was breathing good, her insides were all intact, 446 00:28:34,599 --> 00:28:37,799 and she thought to herself, I'll have to do is keep calm and 447 00:28:37,880 --> 00:28:41,319 let the doctors fix me. So anyways, she survived, and long story 448 00:28:41,359 --> 00:28:47,880 short, and after several months of hospitalization, she was able to state quote, 449 00:28:48,119 --> 00:28:49,400 the bites on my head have healed, and my hair is grown back 450 00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:53,160 and covers the scars completely. My right side is covered with my new skin. 451 00:28:53,559 --> 00:28:56,799 My left stump is strong and has good range of motion. Oh my 452 00:28:56,920 --> 00:29:02,599 god, I'm fitted with artificial and I'm ready to resume my interrupted life as 453 00:29:02,640 --> 00:29:07,079 both wife and geologist. It'll be difficult for me to operate a workable arm 454 00:29:07,119 --> 00:29:08,960 on my right side where I have no stump, and to manage the use 455 00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:11,960 of an arm and hook on the other side where I have no elbow. 456 00:29:12,279 --> 00:29:15,920 But with practice, I know that I will eventually be able to make my 457 00:29:15,079 --> 00:29:18,759 prosthetic device and my feet and my mouth do many of the things my hands 458 00:29:18,799 --> 00:29:22,880 did for me before. I plan to continue my job with the US Geological 459 00:29:22,880 --> 00:29:26,000 Survey. Both Charlie and I have loved our work there, and our colleagues 460 00:29:26,039 --> 00:29:30,640 have been tremendously supportive of me throughout the ordeal. I am determined to lead 461 00:29:30,680 --> 00:29:33,319 as normal a life as possible. I know that there are certain limitations I 462 00:29:33,319 --> 00:29:37,319 can't get around having to rely on artificial arms, but I'm certainly going to 463 00:29:37,319 --> 00:29:40,480 do the best I can with all I have left. And that's a lot. 464 00:29:41,039 --> 00:29:44,720 What a gee. So she is the most badass person on the planet, 465 00:29:44,880 --> 00:29:48,640 big old badass, but she's a bob. She is a bob. 466 00:29:48,799 --> 00:29:52,799 I can't imagine being that positive after something like that and just like that clear 467 00:29:52,839 --> 00:29:55,799 headed as you're being maled. Yeah, you know, it's just like, 468 00:29:55,839 --> 00:29:57,160 oh, well, this is what it is, this is happening. Here 469 00:29:57,160 --> 00:30:00,640 are my options yep. I mean you really don't have many at that is. 470 00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:04,799 She did probably everything she could once she's already being attacked, Like yeah, 471 00:30:04,799 --> 00:30:07,799 and I think it's important. You know. The reason I want to 472 00:30:07,799 --> 00:30:11,880 tell this story is because she tried to play dead and this is what happened. 473 00:30:11,039 --> 00:30:14,960 Like, if a black bear is attacking you and it is trying to 474 00:30:15,000 --> 00:30:18,559 eat you and like fighting into you, you fight it back because black bears, 475 00:30:18,559 --> 00:30:22,799 like I was saying earlier, they don't put in that much effort for 476 00:30:22,839 --> 00:30:25,440 their kills. And if you were putting up a lot of a fight and 477 00:30:25,519 --> 00:30:27,759 they think that there's more risk than reward, they're going to bail. Yep. 478 00:30:27,960 --> 00:30:32,759 So just fight as much as you can use what's around you and try 479 00:30:32,759 --> 00:30:34,920 to keep as I mean, I can say this as a person who hasn't 480 00:30:34,920 --> 00:30:37,480 been attacked by a black bear. Try to keep as clear ahead as you 481 00:30:37,519 --> 00:30:41,000 can. Like she did, Like she did, and she got out of 482 00:30:41,039 --> 00:30:45,119 it because she was able to radio think of her options and know that, 483 00:30:45,200 --> 00:30:48,440 you know, even after everything was said and done, technology exists to help 484 00:30:48,519 --> 00:30:52,119 her lead as most of a normal life as possible. It's exactly seventy seven 485 00:30:52,160 --> 00:30:56,279 you said, right, like, Yeah, I can't even really imagine what 486 00:30:56,319 --> 00:31:00,640 the prosthetic world was like back then, but I don't imagine it was very 487 00:31:00,720 --> 00:31:03,640 Yeah, it wasn't very advanced. Yeah. So she's like, oh, 488 00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:07,599 yeah, I got a a mannequin arm. Now we're good. I'll figure 489 00:31:07,640 --> 00:31:11,160 it out. Yeah, like a robot arm. I would also be a 490 00:31:11,160 --> 00:31:14,599 bob in the situation, a big old bitch, and that would would not 491 00:31:14,960 --> 00:31:18,599 have the same reaction. I truly bashed my knee on like a couch, 492 00:31:18,640 --> 00:31:21,880 and I'm like, oh my god, this is the worst pain anyone's ever 493 00:31:21,920 --> 00:31:25,519 felt. As we'll talk about probably every episode your your cat messes you up 494 00:31:25,519 --> 00:31:29,279 and you cry, so, hey, she hasn't done it lately. Sure, 495 00:31:29,599 --> 00:31:33,519 you know insummation scare bears instead of care bears scare bears. I like 496 00:31:33,599 --> 00:31:37,440 this. Yeah, I just want to reiterate how hard it was for us 497 00:31:37,480 --> 00:31:41,599 to even find those stories because of how rare it is for black bears to 498 00:31:41,640 --> 00:31:45,079 attack and try to kill people. I was thinking about that, like it 499 00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:48,240 really is, like you have to go back into the thirties or forties, 500 00:31:48,279 --> 00:31:52,039 but was I even remember, but like we couldn't find attacked. Yeah, 501 00:31:52,079 --> 00:31:53,559 seventies, that same thing, like who cares, it was all back then, 502 00:31:53,839 --> 00:31:59,440 But we couldn't find anything like remotely that violent recently. Like well, 503 00:31:59,480 --> 00:32:01,759 yeah, so there were there's one case in New Hampshire two or three years 504 00:32:01,759 --> 00:32:05,839 ago, but it wasn't a predacious attack. It was a woman left her 505 00:32:05,880 --> 00:32:08,839 door open at night and she had bird seed because she fed all the animals, 506 00:32:08,920 --> 00:32:13,079 and the bear walked into her house in the night, so she heard 507 00:32:13,079 --> 00:32:15,880 it. She was in a wheelchair also, so she rolled out into her 508 00:32:15,920 --> 00:32:17,960 living room. The bear was there. The door was closed behind it, 509 00:32:19,359 --> 00:32:22,720 so it like mauled her. Yeah, I like ripped her face off, 510 00:32:22,759 --> 00:32:25,039 I'm pretty sure. So, like cases like that, it's because the bear 511 00:32:25,079 --> 00:32:29,759 is cornered. A black bear's instinct is to turn and run up a tree, 512 00:32:29,799 --> 00:32:31,799 but if you have it cornered somewhere, it's obviously going to defend itself 513 00:32:31,839 --> 00:32:35,519 like a person would. And in her case, it was obviously a super 514 00:32:35,559 --> 00:32:37,039 unfortunate that she was in a wheelchair, so there's not a lot she could 515 00:32:37,079 --> 00:32:40,759 do to protect herself and like get away. So but that's such a rare 516 00:32:40,759 --> 00:32:45,480 case. And the last case of someone being killed by a black bear in 517 00:32:45,519 --> 00:32:49,640 New Hampshire was in the seventeen hundreds, so clearly. Yeah. And you 518 00:32:49,640 --> 00:32:52,200 know people always call me and say, oh, well, you're not going 519 00:32:52,200 --> 00:32:53,759 to come remove this bear from me, I'm just supposed to let it eat 520 00:32:53,759 --> 00:32:58,319 my children. Well, no, if black bear's eight children, you'd hear 521 00:32:58,359 --> 00:33:01,000 about it. I mean, obviously we talked Carol earlier on, but she 522 00:33:01,160 --> 00:33:05,720 lives somewhere where black bears weren't used to people. The bears that are in 523 00:33:05,759 --> 00:33:07,279 your neighborhood eating out of your bird feeders, which you should take down, 524 00:33:07,319 --> 00:33:10,599 by the way, they don't want to eat your kids. They're just lazy 525 00:33:10,599 --> 00:33:15,079 and trying to eat trash and bird seed. Also, on that note, 526 00:33:15,319 --> 00:33:20,240 it's not fair for you to uproot an animal's life and move it somewhere else, 527 00:33:20,559 --> 00:33:23,200 or to kill an animal simply because you fear it because you don't know 528 00:33:23,240 --> 00:33:27,279 a lot about it. If you are so afraid of black bears or any 529 00:33:27,279 --> 00:33:30,720 other animal that we talk about that you are, it's like stopping you from 530 00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:31,519 living your life. You know, Like people will call me and say, 531 00:33:31,559 --> 00:33:34,839 I haven't gone in my backyard because I'm afraid of black bears, or I 532 00:33:34,880 --> 00:33:37,319 don't sit on my porch anymore. Go to therapy, and I'm not saying 533 00:33:37,319 --> 00:33:40,799 that in a derogatory way. I also go to therapy for different phobias I 534 00:33:40,839 --> 00:33:45,839 have. There's a thing called exposure therapy for a reason. Go look at 535 00:33:45,839 --> 00:33:47,680 pictures of black bears, look up facts about them. You're listening to this 536 00:33:47,720 --> 00:33:51,240 podcast, so that's a start, and then just work your way up. 537 00:33:51,279 --> 00:33:54,119 Go to a zoo, see a black bear. See that they're just oafs 538 00:33:54,200 --> 00:33:57,640 that like to sit around and eat and lay in the sun. Can we 539 00:33:57,680 --> 00:33:59,920 do that, sit and lay in the sun, or look at black bears? 540 00:34:00,119 --> 00:34:02,759 Noe? Yeah we can do all that. But yeah, I mean, 541 00:34:02,759 --> 00:34:07,039 my point is you're afraid of things because you don't understand them, or 542 00:34:07,079 --> 00:34:09,320 you don't have a lot of exposure to them, so go out and get 543 00:34:09,360 --> 00:34:14,199 more exposure. We got rid of predators so long ago, at least in 544 00:34:14,199 --> 00:34:15,960 New Hampshire. I mean, obviously there's like places like Montana where there's grizzlies 545 00:34:15,960 --> 00:34:19,920 and stuff, which we are going to talk about. We don't know how 546 00:34:19,960 --> 00:34:23,320 to act around predators anymore, so our instinct is to be afraid and to 547 00:34:23,440 --> 00:34:30,000 kill it, which is not reasonable at all. There's hundreds of thousands of 548 00:34:30,039 --> 00:34:34,800 black bears in North America, and think of how little you hear about them 549 00:34:34,800 --> 00:34:37,760 attacking people. It just rarely happens. You just have to be they're aware 550 00:34:38,159 --> 00:34:43,119 and realize there's things you can do to not be attacked. And there's ways 551 00:34:43,119 --> 00:34:45,760 that black bears and other animals too. We'll obviously get to it, but 552 00:34:45,079 --> 00:34:49,800 there's ways that black bears tell you to screw off and to leave them alone. 553 00:34:49,880 --> 00:34:52,559 They'll pop their jaw, which you might be like, what does that 554 00:34:52,599 --> 00:34:54,840 sound like? You'll know if it happens, they'll salivate a lot, they'll 555 00:34:54,840 --> 00:35:00,639 pin their ears down. They'll sometimes bluff charge, which like that's the more 556 00:35:00,719 --> 00:35:04,199 dramatic way to show you to f off. But yeah, and there's things 557 00:35:04,199 --> 00:35:06,960 that you can do. So if you're really afraid of encountering a black bear, 558 00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:08,719 which I mean personally, I don't know about you, Nick, I've 559 00:35:08,760 --> 00:35:13,519 never seen one in the woods and I've gone highking. I may have had 560 00:35:13,559 --> 00:35:16,039 one in my backyard like two weeks ago, and I'm still not even half 561 00:35:16,039 --> 00:35:20,599 percent sure why was that. There may have been bear bait in the backyard. 562 00:35:20,840 --> 00:35:23,400 It's a license thing for black bears. If you are really that scared 563 00:35:23,440 --> 00:35:28,559 of them, just carry bear spray with you or pepper spray. You just 564 00:35:28,639 --> 00:35:31,639 need any sort of spray where capsation is the active ingredient and it's the most 565 00:35:31,760 --> 00:35:36,239 useful in stopping unwanted attacks. Also, don't be stupid and keep the bear 566 00:35:36,239 --> 00:35:38,360 spray in your backpack, like if you get charged by a bear, like 567 00:35:38,480 --> 00:35:42,360 you need it on your hip. Your backpack will do you know good, 568 00:35:42,639 --> 00:35:45,360 Just another thing too. Practice with it, practice taking it out, practice 569 00:35:45,440 --> 00:35:49,400 using it. Make sure that when you use it the wind's not blowing back 570 00:35:49,400 --> 00:35:53,159 at your face. They make specific pepper sprays where it's a gel so it 571 00:35:53,159 --> 00:35:58,119 shoots directly out. Those are good. But like I said, black bears, 572 00:35:58,519 --> 00:36:00,800 especially ones that live around people, We'll give you a lot of signs. 573 00:36:01,159 --> 00:36:06,480 It's similar to why rattlesnakes rattle and why skunks have a stripe. It's 574 00:36:06,519 --> 00:36:08,400 to show you to not mess with them, and black bears have their methods 575 00:36:08,400 --> 00:36:12,800 too. But also just leave them alone. Again, chances are they're just 576 00:36:12,800 --> 00:36:15,840 gonna leave you alone anyway, like they don't want to be anywhere near you. 577 00:36:15,880 --> 00:36:17,000 They don't care. Also, and if they do approach you, because 578 00:36:17,000 --> 00:36:21,159 if black bears are super used to people and you're sitting on your porch and 579 00:36:21,159 --> 00:36:22,559 they walk up and they're like, hey, what's for dinner, that's because 580 00:36:22,599 --> 00:36:27,119 people aren't scaring them. Because if people are afraid of them, they'll just 581 00:36:27,199 --> 00:36:29,760 run inside and the bear gets to do what it wants. You have to 582 00:36:29,920 --> 00:36:32,800 harass them. Use air horns. Those are great for scaring black bears. 583 00:36:34,000 --> 00:36:37,480 You have live stock, put an electric fence around it. I know you're 584 00:36:37,480 --> 00:36:38,760 like, Ooh, I don't want to spend the money on electric fencing for 585 00:36:38,840 --> 00:36:42,880 my six chickens. I don't care you bought the chickens. If you're gonna 586 00:36:42,960 --> 00:36:45,639 kill a bear over six chickens, you can afford electric fencing. If you 587 00:36:45,679 --> 00:36:47,519 really care that much about them. It's a great point. Do chickens have 588 00:36:47,599 --> 00:36:51,960 teeth? Do you just ask me if chickens have teeth? Yeah, you 589 00:36:52,000 --> 00:36:55,679 already know the answer to this. Don't make this a thing I have to 590 00:36:55,679 --> 00:37:00,360 do every time. I would love to do this every time. God, 591 00:37:00,639 --> 00:37:04,679 so be aware of bears. Don't approach bears. If you're one of those 592 00:37:04,679 --> 00:37:07,400 people who goes to a national park and you're like, uh, I need 593 00:37:07,440 --> 00:37:08,480 to get a good picture. First of all, no one cares. We 594 00:37:08,480 --> 00:37:10,440 all know what a black bear looks like. You don't need to walk up 595 00:37:10,480 --> 00:37:14,119 to it to get a good picture of it. Invest no lens. Okay, 596 00:37:14,599 --> 00:37:16,599 I don't want to hear it. I just wanted to see the bear 597 00:37:16,719 --> 00:37:21,239 closer. And you're the worst type of person and I hate you for it, 598 00:37:21,320 --> 00:37:22,519 But I love them. That doesn't matter. You can love them from 599 00:37:22,519 --> 00:37:25,559 a distance. If you love them, let them go, okay. Like 600 00:37:25,840 --> 00:37:30,880 imagine being a celebrity and having paparazzi run at you all the time, like 601 00:37:30,920 --> 00:37:34,239 poor Britney Spears. That's what we're doing to black bears. Leave them alone. 602 00:37:34,559 --> 00:37:36,920 Just don't run up to them, take pictures when they're with their babies. 603 00:37:36,960 --> 00:37:39,119 To try to eat lunch. Okay, just be safe, respect the 604 00:37:39,119 --> 00:37:43,440 bear's space. If you don't like people running up and getting into your space, 605 00:37:43,480 --> 00:37:45,239 which I know I don't. We're from New England. We hate being 606 00:37:45,320 --> 00:37:50,119 near people. Bears do too. Just assume every black bear is like a 607 00:37:50,159 --> 00:37:52,199 New Englander and doesn't want you to talk to or look at them. Okay, 608 00:37:52,400 --> 00:37:55,599 all bears are introverts, except for the ones that people have been feeding. 609 00:37:55,599 --> 00:37:59,039 And if you're feeding a bear knowingly, once again, I hate you. 610 00:37:59,079 --> 00:38:00,920 I have a very strong stars on this. No, you're not like 611 00:38:01,000 --> 00:38:05,280 giving any room for like wiggle, You're just straight to hate in them. 612 00:38:05,400 --> 00:38:07,119 Well, because a fed bear is a dead bear. There's a reason that 613 00:38:07,199 --> 00:38:12,440 saying exists. Dude, you have the freaking lines today. You are spitting 614 00:38:12,719 --> 00:38:16,360 fire. Thank you. No, it's because these are phrases people use all 615 00:38:16,400 --> 00:38:21,039 the time because they're true. Like if you have a bird feeder out and 616 00:38:21,559 --> 00:38:22,599 you know that a black bear is coming by and eating out of it, 617 00:38:22,639 --> 00:38:25,880 and you don't care, that's cool for you. But your neighbor down the 618 00:38:25,920 --> 00:38:29,920 road who has chickens or also has bird feeders that they don't want a bear 619 00:38:29,960 --> 00:38:32,280 getting into. It's not gonna stop them from shooting and killing it. I 620 00:38:32,320 --> 00:38:36,400 don't ever want to get super political on this podcast, but there's a lot 621 00:38:36,400 --> 00:38:39,920 of New Hampshire called RSA two seven twenty six which states that you can shoot 622 00:38:39,960 --> 00:38:45,599 any animal that is doing active and substantial damage to your property, which is 623 00:38:45,239 --> 00:38:49,960 super vague for a reason, because if a black bear is getting into your 624 00:38:50,000 --> 00:38:52,719 chickens, legally you can shoot it, and that excuse my French mom, 625 00:38:52,760 --> 00:38:57,079 close your ears is bullshit. You shouldn't be allowed to kill a bear because 626 00:38:57,079 --> 00:38:59,079 you don't know how to protect your chickens or don't know how to take in 627 00:38:59,079 --> 00:39:01,239 a bird feeder. I have a petition to change that law. I say, 628 00:39:01,719 --> 00:39:06,679 is there a change dot org petition anywhere we could visit it? Do? 629 00:39:06,840 --> 00:39:08,760 I will link it below, and I have an emailing our governor like, 630 00:39:08,800 --> 00:39:13,119 hey, I am still mad about this because it happens all the time, 631 00:39:13,320 --> 00:39:15,639 and then bears get orphaned and they have to be sent to the one 632 00:39:15,719 --> 00:39:20,280 guy who can raise them in New Hampshire. Ben kill him. He's a 633 00:39:20,360 --> 00:39:22,199 very famous bear biologist. Please look him up and donate to him, which 634 00:39:22,239 --> 00:39:24,519 I will also link below. Do you have anything else you'd like to say 635 00:39:24,519 --> 00:39:29,639 about black bears? I love them? Great me too level? Is that 636 00:39:29,639 --> 00:39:32,199 our official stance we love black bears. Yes. When we are running for 637 00:39:32,239 --> 00:39:36,519 president in twenty twenty four as a team, our official stance will be we 638 00:39:36,599 --> 00:39:38,679 love black bears right, and that's the one hard stance we will have. 639 00:39:39,159 --> 00:39:43,360 Thank you for listening to episode two of Get It Alive. If you'd like 640 00:39:43,400 --> 00:39:45,239 to see information and the links for this episode, I'll also link to the 641 00:39:45,239 --> 00:39:50,199 book that I referred to. Links will be in the podcast description and also 642 00:39:50,280 --> 00:39:52,719 of course on our website, get out a Live podcast dot com. Once 643 00:39:52,760 --> 00:39:57,360 again, you can always rate us on Apple Podcasts and subscribe on whatever app 644 00:39:57,360 --> 00:39:59,719 you're listening to us on. We are trying to get on Google Play that 645 00:39:59,800 --> 00:40:01,440 is the only one, or Google Podcast, whatever the hell it is. 646 00:40:01,480 --> 00:40:04,960 It's the only one that requires us to pay more money to be on it, 647 00:40:05,000 --> 00:40:07,199 which is stupid. But we're working on it. I've gotten a specific 648 00:40:07,239 --> 00:40:09,840 request for it, so we got to make it happen. Join our Patreon, 649 00:40:09,880 --> 00:40:15,400 We'll make it happen. Oh yeah, I mean that's all. Yeah, 650 00:40:15,440 --> 00:40:16,880 but yeah, and Patreon. Like I said at the beginning, there's 651 00:40:16,920 --> 00:40:20,760 different tiers you can join for his little Last twenty five cents an episode, 652 00:40:20,760 --> 00:40:22,199 it really means the world to us. Merch is coming. So yes, 653 00:40:22,360 --> 00:40:28,159 we are work on merch. I'm actually talking to somebody about yeah yeah, 654 00:40:28,199 --> 00:40:30,800 so stay tuned for that. If you're on our Patreon, you will get 655 00:40:30,840 --> 00:40:32,960 a discount on all of our merch that's to come. You can follow us 656 00:40:34,000 --> 00:40:37,199 on Instagram at get Out a Live Pod, and you can follow me on 657 00:40:37,239 --> 00:40:39,800 Twitter at the Angryologist. Once again, I'm gonna ask you every time, 658 00:40:39,880 --> 00:40:43,280 Nick, do you want to mention your socials? No? And thank you 659 00:40:43,320 --> 00:40:45,440 to my good friend and second great husband, Josh Walsh for making our intro 660 00:40:45,559 --> 00:40:59,519 music. And we'll be back with a new animal attack story on next Wednesday. Assass