WEBVTT 1 00:00:01.480 --> 00:00:04.000 Hell, everybody, Welcome back to desk. The Door's favorite board game design 2 00:00:04.000 --> 00:00:07.440 and crash podcast has always shaped by you. We bring the best nating tabletop 3 00:00:07.480 --> 00:00:10.439 game. Him Kylett, I am the dork. I'm joined today once again 4 00:00:10.599 --> 00:00:16.160 by the beautiful Graham Games. Graham aio man, I'm great, um ready 5 00:00:16.160 --> 00:00:20.600 to be extremely positive. Yeah, this is kind of a positive thing. 6 00:00:20.679 --> 00:00:25.440 So as always, this who comes from Graham's incredible que pod drops and were 7 00:00:25.519 --> 00:00:29.440 guys said, I refused to stop calling them that. It's so funny, 8 00:00:29.800 --> 00:00:34.039 but just so, Graham has this idea of what is our most favorite thing 9 00:00:34.200 --> 00:00:38.119 from some of our least favorite games. I have some very strong opinions on 10 00:00:38.159 --> 00:00:42.399 some games that I actively despise, and it was kind of cool to go 11 00:00:42.439 --> 00:00:45.920 back to games that I have previously revisited and been like wow, like this 12 00:00:45.960 --> 00:00:54.320 game sucks, but to like to try to dig for like the gold in 13 00:00:54.479 --> 00:00:59.079 those games. In those places I did try to avoid like tabletop hot like 14 00:00:59.600 --> 00:01:03.159 not hobby games, but I did try to avoid like mass market titles like 15 00:01:03.200 --> 00:01:06.560 I'm not gonna I'm not gonna spend this podcast just you know, dunking on 16 00:01:06.640 --> 00:01:10.120 Monopoly and candy Land, Like yeah, I don't. I don't have Monopoly 17 00:01:10.159 --> 00:01:12.159 on my list of games to talk about. It doesn't make any sense. 18 00:01:12.239 --> 00:01:15.280 I think if we were to talk about Monopoly, we should carve out a 19 00:01:15.280 --> 00:01:19.640 whole episode to like talk about both its history and the kind of curios stuff 20 00:01:19.680 --> 00:01:23.000 and like whatever else, um, because there's much more to it other than 21 00:01:23.079 --> 00:01:30.120 like it becoming this iconic symbol of everything that's wrong with board game culture and 22 00:01:30.200 --> 00:01:34.000 the like I'm so exhausted, but yeah, well and like we have talked 23 00:01:34.040 --> 00:01:37.200 about it at nauseum already on the podcast about the history of Monopoly, because 24 00:01:37.200 --> 00:01:38.879 I've been obsessed with that because I'm like this, this was this was not 25 00:01:40.000 --> 00:01:42.920 like as a game, it's bad, but it's supposed to be because it's 26 00:01:42.920 --> 00:01:46.840 a statement like yeah, yeah, and then and then its history is a 27 00:01:46.879 --> 00:01:49.599 statement upon itself as well. Yeah, it's like crazy that that it was 28 00:01:49.640 --> 00:01:55.159 stolen like capitalists and then reused and then we used to market the very thing 29 00:01:55.239 --> 00:02:01.599 that uh it was supposed to be mocking, which perrect like it's it might 30 00:02:01.640 --> 00:02:08.199 be the best example of deep rooted, multilayered irony of all time. Yeah, 31 00:02:08.400 --> 00:02:13.199 but what's amazing is they couldn't wash off the layers of irony enough to 32 00:02:13.319 --> 00:02:15.120 like stop it from being a bad game, because that was intentional, and 33 00:02:15.159 --> 00:02:19.520 I just like, so the message still secretly carries through, which I love. 34 00:02:19.560 --> 00:02:21.599 But yeah, so I love a wes Like we're not going to talk 35 00:02:21.599 --> 00:02:25.400 about monopoly immediately we get talking about monopoly, but it's a good interest, 36 00:02:25.479 --> 00:02:29.800 right as as you know, you're talking about quote unquote games I hate. 37 00:02:30.719 --> 00:02:35.439 And I think that part of what led me to come up with this idea 38 00:02:35.879 --> 00:02:42.719 is and I think broadly all nerd culture, but especially board games. Um. 39 00:02:42.759 --> 00:02:46.639 I think that the population m have a lot of opinions and it's all 40 00:02:46.759 --> 00:02:51.319 very black and white, and it's all very extreme. It's I hate it 41 00:02:51.439 --> 00:02:53.000 or I love it. It's the worst game ever, it's the best game 42 00:02:53.000 --> 00:02:57.960 ever. Um. But also as designers, I think that there is a 43 00:02:59.039 --> 00:03:04.120 very positive, very interesting exercise to be had for looking for a critical thought 44 00:03:04.240 --> 00:03:07.639 for analysis. And also if you're at a table, this is a human 45 00:03:07.120 --> 00:03:12.360 as if you're play testing a game. I've been in play tests of which 46 00:03:12.400 --> 00:03:15.639 I was miserable beginning to end, but like the environment is such that, 47 00:03:15.759 --> 00:03:19.560 like you need to think about the person on the other side of the table. 48 00:03:20.000 --> 00:03:22.560 So if I have a game that I absolutely hate. How do I 49 00:03:22.599 --> 00:03:25.319 focus in If I went and had Monopoly and somebody was like, this is 50 00:03:25.319 --> 00:03:29.439 a game I have, how would I tell that person the things that I 51 00:03:29.479 --> 00:03:35.240 think are working, even if from minute one I was absolutely miserable. You 52 00:03:35.280 --> 00:03:37.400 know. So there's a lot of elements. There's a lot of things working 53 00:03:37.479 --> 00:03:38.960 here. Why I think this is a very interesting thing to talk about. 54 00:03:39.080 --> 00:03:42.919 Yeah, and that's what I liked about it too. Is it it let 55 00:03:42.960 --> 00:03:46.159 me kind of re evaluate and revisit some titles that, like, I have 56 00:03:46.280 --> 00:03:51.000 very strong opinions on. Now, this reevaluation has not changed any of the 57 00:03:51.080 --> 00:03:55.919 things that I feel about these games. Like my least favorite game of all 58 00:03:55.919 --> 00:03:59.319 time is on this list. I don't know if I'll actually talk about it 59 00:03:59.400 --> 00:04:03.199 or not, because I struggle really hard to pull like something good out of 60 00:04:03.240 --> 00:04:10.000 it. Um, But I don't think I could let you off the hook 61 00:04:10.080 --> 00:04:14.080 on that one then, because I I have a couple of games on my 62 00:04:14.120 --> 00:04:16.399 list that I'm like, oh man, it's pulling nails. So I think 63 00:04:16.399 --> 00:04:18.720 that I think we can't even say anything negative. I think I'm gonna go 64 00:04:18.720 --> 00:04:21.519 even further and be like, the most you can say is I hate this 65 00:04:21.600 --> 00:04:26.519 game. But then you can't actually give any specific negative criticism about it. 66 00:04:26.800 --> 00:04:28.519 I don't know if I don't know if I'll be able to do it. 67 00:04:28.560 --> 00:04:31.160 I will try. I will endeavor because I like the challenge, but I 68 00:04:33.360 --> 00:04:39.720 know that I will probably fail. Um, I do want to start off 69 00:04:39.720 --> 00:04:42.279 with a couple of stats. First, Yes, let's do stats, and 70 00:04:42.319 --> 00:04:44.759 then I want one more caveat too. I think it is important to talk 71 00:04:44.759 --> 00:04:47.079 about why I why we don't like games, but limit the criticism, like 72 00:04:47.160 --> 00:04:50.480 in like a positive way. I guess that makes sense, like generally not 73 00:04:50.560 --> 00:04:55.800 about this episode, but yeah, of course, yep. So all right, 74 00:04:56.040 --> 00:05:00.360 So I went I went to my my board game geek a Out to 75 00:05:00.439 --> 00:05:02.959 kind of do a lot of this, and so I found that, Um, 76 00:05:03.000 --> 00:05:05.600 of all the ratings I've ever done, I have an average rating of 77 00:05:05.639 --> 00:05:12.000 a six point two four Wow, thirty percent of the games I've rated, 78 00:05:12.040 --> 00:05:15.160 I've given a seven. And I think that that says a lot about what 79 00:05:15.199 --> 00:05:19.680 I'm saying, is that like this is it's it's not I'm not loving it. 80 00:05:19.839 --> 00:05:24.959 I see what it's doing. Maybe it's not for me, but there 81 00:05:25.000 --> 00:05:27.600 are plenty of good things to be had. So that's kind of where I 82 00:05:27.639 --> 00:05:32.439 am as as ah as somebody who enjoys critique, who enjoys analysis, who 83 00:05:32.480 --> 00:05:36.160 plays lots of lots of lots of games just to experientially kind of get out 84 00:05:36.199 --> 00:05:42.120 there. Um I. I additionally, at the bottom of my list, 85 00:05:42.879 --> 00:05:46.680 I have I gave three games or no, no, no no. I 86 00:05:46.720 --> 00:05:50.920 gave eight games of three wow, nine games of two, and I have 87 00:05:51.079 --> 00:05:59.160 three ones. Wow. Man, that that's that's that's a decent spread, 88 00:05:59.160 --> 00:06:02.079 though I have more ones. I think, did you do? And I 89 00:06:02.079 --> 00:06:06.360 don't track my stuff on BGG. I have a spreadsheet that I use because 90 00:06:06.360 --> 00:06:09.839 I've been buying and selling board games for a while. And what I'll do 91 00:06:09.879 --> 00:06:12.120 is I'll I'll talk about how much I paid for the board game, how 92 00:06:12.199 --> 00:06:15.199 much I sold the board game for where I got the board game, and 93 00:06:15.199 --> 00:06:16.959 then what did I rate the board game? Um. I just that's like 94 00:06:17.319 --> 00:06:23.600 something that I do for me because I just enjoy buying used board games, 95 00:06:23.639 --> 00:06:27.399 like it's just something fun. Um. But to pull up the desks and 96 00:06:27.439 --> 00:06:30.680 Dork's rating scale, because I looked at my spreadsheet of games, um, 97 00:06:30.839 --> 00:06:34.079 the majority of games that I have rated have fallen between a five and a 98 00:06:34.120 --> 00:06:40.480 seven. UM, so like which we would qualify as a salt like so 99 00:06:40.600 --> 00:06:44.240 six sevens like solid fun. It's not. It's not You're not going to 100 00:06:44.279 --> 00:06:46.639 write home about it. It's not gonna go like, you know, go 101 00:06:46.680 --> 00:06:50.759 anywhere else, like four and five flawed, but it appeals to a specific 102 00:06:50.800 --> 00:06:56.399 type of person, which I think is a bunch of Like I would put 103 00:06:56.480 --> 00:06:59.160 Munchkin as like a four and a five game, right, Like I think 104 00:06:59.199 --> 00:07:02.160 Munchkin is horror flawed, but it does appeal to a specific subset of people, 105 00:07:02.360 --> 00:07:05.879 and am a specific subset of gamers who love munch game. And I 106 00:07:05.920 --> 00:07:09.920 get it, even if I don't want to play it necessarily I don't like, 107 00:07:10.040 --> 00:07:12.480 but I get it. I have a couple eights, couple of nines, 108 00:07:12.560 --> 00:07:15.720 and I have like a handful of tens, like most of them from 109 00:07:15.800 --> 00:07:18.800 the year twenty eighteen, because I was a great year for games, but 110 00:07:19.560 --> 00:07:23.800 um, at least for games that I played. But I'm excited. It's 111 00:07:23.839 --> 00:07:25.680 okay. So see if I can guess what they are. It's after the 112 00:07:25.759 --> 00:07:34.959 ring, yes obviously, yeah. Uh six drafting games yes, and engine 113 00:07:34.959 --> 00:07:40.839 building tableau based uh drafting games. Yeah. Yeah, there's a lot of 114 00:07:40.839 --> 00:07:43.680 this on there. I'm not even gonna I'm not even gonna lie to you. 115 00:07:44.040 --> 00:07:47.800 There's a lot of those on there. Uh. Oh man, all 116 00:07:47.839 --> 00:07:51.639 right, are you ready? Are you ready? I'm very ready? Do 117 00:07:51.639 --> 00:07:55.120 you Why don't you kick us off? What's what game? And what do 118 00:07:55.160 --> 00:07:58.560 you like about it? Graham? Okay, So what I'm gonna do is 119 00:07:58.879 --> 00:08:01.360 I'm gonna start by say and that I hate a game, and then I'm 120 00:08:01.399 --> 00:08:05.040 not gonna say anything negative about it. Oh God, good luck? Are 121 00:08:05.040 --> 00:08:11.279 you ready again? I believe in you. I hate Jamaica. Uh wow. 122 00:08:11.680 --> 00:08:16.600 From two thousand and seven, Ye Jamaica. Um, I played Jamaica. 123 00:08:16.639 --> 00:08:20.199 I would with Jamaica was out. Um. I think it was everywhere, 124 00:08:20.240 --> 00:08:24.680 and I think that attributed to a lot of there there. I think 125 00:08:24.720 --> 00:08:28.920 that, um, this is common across the board. But if if people 126 00:08:28.959 --> 00:08:33.519 have a singular bad experience with the game, I think that that can bring 127 00:08:33.600 --> 00:08:37.639 up this like this vitriol. Right. Um. That was not the case 128 00:08:37.639 --> 00:08:43.120 for Jamaica. I had multiple bad games in it over over a series of 129 00:08:43.159 --> 00:08:48.879 time. Um, Jamaica has a great theme. UM, it could be 130 00:08:48.919 --> 00:08:58.360 played by anybody. Um. Uh your board is is is really fun to 131 00:08:58.399 --> 00:09:01.279 interact with. You have multiple sections of it, You're placing things in. 132 00:09:03.120 --> 00:09:05.799 Um, it's got a little bit of a Mario Kart feeling. You can 133 00:09:05.879 --> 00:09:11.039 kind of take people down. You're trying to slide along to these sections and 134 00:09:11.279 --> 00:09:18.559 races are just there. They're excellent in terms of demoing and design because the 135 00:09:18.600 --> 00:09:24.000 goal is is cooked in. Um A lot of games that I have difficulty 136 00:09:24.039 --> 00:09:28.759 with or like, okay, I'm looking for the fund Still, how do 137 00:09:28.799 --> 00:09:33.039 you win? You got to say when you're explaining somebody how you win. 138 00:09:33.519 --> 00:09:37.120 Usually it's the most number of points, Okay, what does that mean? 139 00:09:37.200 --> 00:09:39.480 And so there's a lot more description. With a race, You're like, 140 00:09:39.519 --> 00:09:45.120 it's a race and everyone inherently knows, you know what it is. That's 141 00:09:45.159 --> 00:09:52.639 that's I think everything I like about I was gonna say, just watching your 142 00:09:52.840 --> 00:09:58.799 thinly veiled material so fun because I haven't played Jamaica, but I've heard nothing 143 00:09:58.799 --> 00:10:03.399 but really positive things about the game. I hate, Yeah, I don't. 144 00:10:03.919 --> 00:10:07.720 I'm gonna last one game. I'm just gonna tell you, I might 145 00:10:07.759 --> 00:10:09.440 not even make it through this game before it starts spouting off why I don't 146 00:10:09.480 --> 00:10:15.080 like throtaines? Oh no, my self control is extreme. I also think 147 00:10:15.120 --> 00:10:16.759 it's interesting too, because I think people went on and I do hate Jamaica 148 00:10:18.600 --> 00:10:20.600 I hate it. I think people might also want to know why we dislike 149 00:10:20.720 --> 00:10:22.759 I know, I don't know that. I don't think we can. I 150 00:10:22.799 --> 00:10:26.279 don't think again, But what I will I'm a script around my own role 151 00:10:26.440 --> 00:10:30.879 and say that I played Jamaica multiple times with kids, and there's a difference 152 00:10:30.879 --> 00:10:35.799 for me as somebody, as as a really empathetic person, because I'm so 153 00:10:35.879 --> 00:10:37.559 interested in the health of the table, in the joy of the table, 154 00:10:37.960 --> 00:10:41.919 especially when I'm playing with a mixed group or kids. Um, if I'm 155 00:10:41.960 --> 00:10:45.480 not having a good time is one thing. But if I'm looking at a 156 00:10:45.519 --> 00:10:48.399 table and there's kids who are miserable, like and not just like mad, 157 00:10:48.919 --> 00:10:54.480 but like crestfallen, I'm like, buy Golly. And then my designer brain 158 00:10:54.559 --> 00:10:58.240 kicks in it, and I'm like, why is this happening? And then 159 00:10:58.240 --> 00:11:01.720 i get mad, Yeah, because then I get mad at the game for 160 00:11:01.879 --> 00:11:07.000 doing you get these children. I hate Jamaica. There's my first game. 161 00:11:07.159 --> 00:11:09.440 There's your first game. So this is not a game that I hated, 162 00:11:11.360 --> 00:11:13.639 but it is a game that I like talking about because I think it it 163 00:11:13.720 --> 00:11:18.919 does one thing in a really fascinating way. I this The game is called 164 00:11:18.919 --> 00:11:22.759 Barker's Row, which I don't think. I don't think I know Barker's Row. 165 00:11:22.879 --> 00:11:24.240 It was a it was a Kickstar game from a while ago that I 166 00:11:24.320 --> 00:11:31.080 picked up on a sale a couple of years back, and because there's one 167 00:11:31.120 --> 00:11:33.399 thing that I love and this is not actually what I picked out, because 168 00:11:33.399 --> 00:11:35.720 I try to limit my stuff to like as much game design as possible, 169 00:11:37.840 --> 00:11:41.399 and the theme of the game really appealed to me, Like you you're running 170 00:11:41.559 --> 00:11:48.840 basically a a Barker's Row, like an old timey like freak show during like 171 00:11:48.039 --> 00:11:52.320 the dust Bowl, which I think was like it was like, so you're 172 00:11:52.360 --> 00:11:54.320 like putting together all of these different people for these performances, and in terms 173 00:11:54.320 --> 00:11:58.960 of the people have actual powers, these are not like you know, the 174 00:11:58.360 --> 00:12:01.440 history of those things. Obviously of a Barker's Row is maybe not a little 175 00:12:01.480 --> 00:12:05.480 more sorted. But like the game itself is like kind of leans into this 176 00:12:05.039 --> 00:12:09.279 almost like Invader Zim kind of aesthetic, which is odd. I liked the 177 00:12:09.279 --> 00:12:13.639 theme and I enjoyed that art style. I liked the presentation a lot. 178 00:12:13.960 --> 00:12:18.960 The game itself was not very good, but what I thought was interesting was 179 00:12:20.720 --> 00:12:24.240 they had so basically it's a set collection and you have to get matching sets 180 00:12:24.559 --> 00:12:26.960 in order to claim one of the performers to add to your show. The 181 00:12:28.000 --> 00:12:31.440 performers then give you powers. There were three things that I really enjoyed. 182 00:12:31.840 --> 00:12:37.720 One, there is no scoring track. You have what are called rubes, 183 00:12:37.159 --> 00:12:41.480 which are just people in your Yes, that's the points. So it had 184 00:12:41.519 --> 00:12:46.480 these lovely screen printed wooden meeples that looked like carnival goers. So there's like 185 00:12:46.519 --> 00:12:50.679 one dude like just chalking down on a big piece of cotton candy. There's 186 00:12:50.720 --> 00:12:54.919 like this like this lady who has like six kids. There's like there's like 187 00:12:54.960 --> 00:12:58.200 one guy like two bags of popcorn and those are your points and you put 188 00:12:58.240 --> 00:13:01.240 them on the little bleachers like and so if you feel your bleachers up, 189 00:13:01.279 --> 00:13:05.840 you win the game. I thought that was awesome, Like from just from 190 00:13:05.840 --> 00:13:09.559 a sheer table presence side of things, I was like, this is like 191 00:13:09.639 --> 00:13:15.200 that's great. I like, I get bored of set collection games pretty easily. 192 00:13:15.639 --> 00:13:20.039 Like I know people love their like their sushi goes, but I need 193 00:13:20.080 --> 00:13:22.399 a little bit. I mean, it's a drafting game, it is, 194 00:13:22.440 --> 00:13:24.360 but it's more set but it's also I almost consider I mean it's as much 195 00:13:24.360 --> 00:13:26.679 set collection it feels like, but I'm like the sets don't do anything, 196 00:13:28.320 --> 00:13:31.799 but when you get these performers, they have powers. And these powers are 197 00:13:31.840 --> 00:13:35.080 either like one offs that you can use for a really big, swingy turn, 198 00:13:35.600 --> 00:13:39.639 or they're like stuff that kind of helps you a little bit each and 199 00:13:39.679 --> 00:13:41.480 every turn. I really liked that. I thought it was a nice, 200 00:13:41.480 --> 00:13:46.240 little unique twist on set collection in general, because I'm like, now there's 201 00:13:46.240 --> 00:13:48.080 a strategy. Maybe I don't just go for, you know, playing a 202 00:13:48.120 --> 00:13:52.080 set of cards to basically claim one of these performers as fast as possible. 203 00:13:52.279 --> 00:13:56.240 Maybe I want to finacle it so that I can get another type of performer. 204 00:13:56.559 --> 00:14:01.000 And the reason I think that all kind of works is there's a Strongman 205 00:14:01.159 --> 00:14:05.919 meter in the center of the game board, and every time you score a 206 00:14:05.960 --> 00:14:11.559 performer for your Barker's row, you wind up moving your strong Man meter up, 207 00:14:11.600 --> 00:14:16.200 which makes the number of cards that you have to play to claim the 208 00:14:16.279 --> 00:14:20.759 next person for your Barker's row go up another tick. Sure, so it's 209 00:14:20.759 --> 00:14:22.240 like a catchup mechanic, right, Like, as you start doing well, 210 00:14:22.840 --> 00:14:26.279 like you're it's gonna be harder for you to keep doing well, so you're 211 00:14:26.279 --> 00:14:28.080 not just gonna blow out the other players. I really enjoyed that. I 212 00:14:28.080 --> 00:14:33.639 thought that was like a really interesting balancing mechanism and the use of it as 213 00:14:33.639 --> 00:14:37.759 a strong man like game, like where you hit the little bell at the 214 00:14:37.840 --> 00:14:41.240 end of that's how that's the max that you can be at. I thought 215 00:14:41.360 --> 00:14:46.360 was really neat. So it was a it was a case of the game 216 00:14:46.399 --> 00:14:50.879 maybe not handing out in terms of like it's gameplay, but the theme and 217 00:14:52.159 --> 00:14:56.039 the rules blending together in the ways that they did I thought was pretty impressive. 218 00:14:56.360 --> 00:15:01.879 So I have a feeling that a calm and comment across these these things 219 00:15:01.879 --> 00:15:05.519 for us is going to be like I hate this game. Great components, 220 00:15:05.720 --> 00:15:11.080 Like I mean, listen, you know people like pretty I'm not above it. 221 00:15:11.360 --> 00:15:15.240 There's a part of my crowbrain that's like I like shinny bits, like 222 00:15:15.559 --> 00:15:18.360 its shinty bits, but you know, not to get too negative. And 223 00:15:18.399 --> 00:15:24.440 our extremely positive episode, Uh that's the Kickstarter thing. It's driven by shiny 224 00:15:24.480 --> 00:15:28.080 bits and plastic and like bigger and bigger things. Like I'm so like, 225 00:15:28.240 --> 00:15:31.840 did you did you back this on Kickstarter or did you just know? I 226 00:15:31.279 --> 00:15:35.159 bought it after the fact, And I'll be honest, the components weren't even 227 00:15:35.159 --> 00:15:37.480 the thing. I liked the most. I just the rule set I thought 228 00:15:37.600 --> 00:15:41.759 was really interesting. Like I'm a sucker for if you can blend a rule 229 00:15:41.799 --> 00:15:45.799 set and theme together. I love that. That's my jam, dude. 230 00:15:46.159 --> 00:15:48.320 And so yeah, nice components, but like that, I don't know if 231 00:15:48.320 --> 00:15:52.840 the strongman meter being a good limiting factor for a set collection game. I 232 00:15:52.879 --> 00:15:54.840 was like, that's kind of cool. I mean I see that immediately, 233 00:15:54.879 --> 00:15:58.759 like it's the iconography is so strong, so it's it's it's the bell with 234 00:15:58.799 --> 00:16:03.440 like the strong thing and then moving it up like like I love that. 235 00:16:03.679 --> 00:16:07.480 Yeah, it's it was. It was really really quite nice. There's again 236 00:16:07.600 --> 00:16:11.080 components decide. Like the blend of those rules I think was what was really 237 00:16:11.159 --> 00:16:12.000 special about it, at least for me. And I was like, man, 238 00:16:12.960 --> 00:16:18.200 I wish this game was bad, and I feel bad because like clearly 239 00:16:18.200 --> 00:16:19.720 the team that worked on it like had so much passion for it, because 240 00:16:21.039 --> 00:16:23.480 otherwise you don't go that hard, you know what I mean? Yeah sure, 241 00:16:25.320 --> 00:16:26.600 but yeah, Burgers Show is my number one pick. I don't I 242 00:16:26.600 --> 00:16:33.159 don't hate it. I just I'm not mad. I'm just disappointed. Golly 243 00:16:33.240 --> 00:16:37.559 all right, well let's bring us back down again. Um my next game. 244 00:16:38.559 --> 00:16:47.440 Uh that I Despise. Um, I hate, I absolutely hate Betrayal 245 00:16:47.519 --> 00:16:55.000 at House on the Hill. Wow, I hate this game. Wow, 246 00:16:55.159 --> 00:16:57.360 big big swing because I love all right, I love Betrayal. So go 247 00:16:57.399 --> 00:17:00.679 ahead and by away man, Oh well, then you'll agree with everything go 248 00:17:00.679 --> 00:17:06.039 about to say, because I fully am aware by the way that Betrayal is 249 00:17:06.039 --> 00:17:08.480 one of those games that I think, um holds a tender spot in my 250 00:17:08.559 --> 00:17:14.079 heart because it was one of my first hobby games. As I'm starting everybody's 251 00:17:14.119 --> 00:17:18.880 heart. So here's the thing about Betrayal, Um, I yeah, like 252 00:17:18.039 --> 00:17:22.480 you, it was very early in my like real board game career. I 253 00:17:22.519 --> 00:17:29.119 mean I grew up playing like, you know, Magic and um, you 254 00:17:29.160 --> 00:17:32.440 know, Funge and Maggins and like all this stuff, and then in college 255 00:17:32.480 --> 00:17:34.680 I played a bunch of like I don't know, acts and allies with guys 256 00:17:34.680 --> 00:17:37.920 in the dorms and like risk Legacy and all this stuff. But there was 257 00:17:37.960 --> 00:17:41.160 like a certain point where I like looked around and I realized what the board 258 00:17:41.200 --> 00:17:45.400 game revolution was happening. And I've been playing the whole time, but I 259 00:17:45.400 --> 00:17:48.920 didn't realize it was a thing. Yeah, and so there was this moment 260 00:17:48.960 --> 00:17:52.960 that I blasted off and I started, like you know, getting getting all 261 00:17:52.960 --> 00:17:57.079 these different games and like really thinking about things differently. Um and Betrayal was 262 00:17:57.079 --> 00:18:02.599 a game that the moment I heard the premise, I immediately would online bought 263 00:18:02.599 --> 00:18:04.440 it, like in an instant, Like I didn't. I was like, 264 00:18:04.480 --> 00:18:08.039 I need to check this out. Time to say a bunch of post stuff 265 00:18:08.039 --> 00:18:14.400 about it. Um. It's it's a hidden roll game where you don't know 266 00:18:14.480 --> 00:18:19.440 who the trader is at the beginning of the game. In in hidden roll 267 00:18:19.480 --> 00:18:26.279 games, you're the suspicion starts immediately and somebody feels clever, or in the 268 00:18:26.319 --> 00:18:30.960 space of the best hidden roll games, byfall, somebody's sweating sweating bullets, 269 00:18:32.839 --> 00:18:36.519 somebody feels clever in spart the whole time. In Betrayal, it's a thing 270 00:18:36.559 --> 00:18:38.839 that occurs at a certain point. So everybody is going through the first part 271 00:18:38.880 --> 00:18:42.160 of the game and it feels like a haunted house. What's the next room? 272 00:18:42.279 --> 00:18:45.160 Is it going to be something bad? Oh? I don't know, 273 00:18:45.240 --> 00:18:48.920 I'm Scooby dude doing through this thing. Yeah, And then eventually there's a 274 00:18:48.960 --> 00:18:53.440 switch and it turns to a one vall game. Yea. And the premise 275 00:18:53.559 --> 00:19:00.720 of fifty different scenarios means that you're like trying to drain a milkshakee by eating 276 00:19:00.720 --> 00:19:03.240 it with your pinky. It's the idea that, like how many times you've 277 00:19:03.240 --> 00:19:07.160 played this game, you're always chasing that novelty, which I think is a 278 00:19:07.160 --> 00:19:11.079 big part of these experiences at board games in general, is that you want 279 00:19:11.079 --> 00:19:17.759 so to be novel and betrayal has a huge um uh thesis which says, 280 00:19:17.920 --> 00:19:21.960 here you go, I'm gonna give you fifty of these scenarios where you're going 281 00:19:22.039 --> 00:19:26.039 to be a vampire, you're gonna be a slime monster, You're going to 282 00:19:26.119 --> 00:19:29.799 be a vampire, and you're gonna be taking people out. Um. And 283 00:19:29.880 --> 00:19:33.880 so in your group that the tension, the rising tension is not who is 284 00:19:33.920 --> 00:19:37.359 the betray or, it's who's going to be right its ray And then the 285 00:19:37.480 --> 00:19:41.960 game like kicks into high gear when like all these things occur and everybody's very 286 00:19:41.960 --> 00:19:48.319 excited and um. Each scenario also provides like novel situations like sometimes the house 287 00:19:48.440 --> 00:19:52.440 is going to step down into into hell and so you're like losing the rooms 288 00:19:52.480 --> 00:19:56.039 that you may Sometimes there's a dragon in an elevator who's sometimes it's a dragon 289 00:19:56.799 --> 00:19:59.880 like which I still remember that. Okay, so the thing that's I think 290 00:19:59.880 --> 00:20:06.119 that that's all I could say before I get too angry. Yeah, that's 291 00:20:06.240 --> 00:20:10.599 very Since it's not my game, I will say it is a wildly uneven 292 00:20:10.680 --> 00:20:14.720 experience. And I think the longer I have been in the hobby what an 293 00:20:14.759 --> 00:20:19.799 interesting observation, right, the more the more that that experience has been exacerbated. 294 00:20:21.480 --> 00:20:23.000 Um. I will say, however, that I am a big sucker 295 00:20:23.039 --> 00:20:27.480 and just enjoying it for the ride, which sometimes it's a real game, 296 00:20:27.759 --> 00:20:32.240 and sometimes you get murdered by worm monsters in the first twenty seconds. You 297 00:20:32.400 --> 00:20:36.640 know, it's it's a mixed bag. You say, here's here's the thing, 298 00:20:36.640 --> 00:20:38.079 and I'm going to try and stick to my to my guns. I'm 299 00:20:38.119 --> 00:20:45.240 trying to say positive, positive things. Only if it was a game where 300 00:20:45.559 --> 00:20:48.160 I got killed by where monsters in the first did you say twenty seconds? 301 00:20:49.799 --> 00:20:56.079 I would be great with that, because then it would be twenty seconds. 302 00:20:56.119 --> 00:21:00.599 Sometimes you just game is just stupid and random and it's twenty seconds long. 303 00:21:02.440 --> 00:21:06.759 That's great. Yeah, if you can read with you the lines two hours 304 00:21:07.079 --> 00:21:11.119 what I'm saying, UM controversial opinion too. By the way, Spyfall is 305 00:21:11.119 --> 00:21:14.960 the number one hidden roll game. I don't know, it's my favorite. 306 00:21:14.960 --> 00:21:17.400 I don't know I feel about that. It is very good, though, 307 00:21:17.440 --> 00:21:21.960 are you are you a resistance guy? No, no, no, I 308 00:21:21.960 --> 00:21:25.720 don't know if you want One Night as a hidden role game or not. 309 00:21:25.759 --> 00:21:29.079 But I think COO is like one of the best games ever designed. Who 310 00:21:29.160 --> 00:21:30.480 is Great? Who Is? Who Is? Who Is? Who Is? 311 00:21:30.519 --> 00:21:34.200 Who Is Great? It's definitely a game that I don't love, but I 312 00:21:34.279 --> 00:21:38.799 have taught it so many times and I it's it's it's on my shelf. 313 00:21:38.880 --> 00:21:42.960 I own it. But again because as an ambassador of board games, I 314 00:21:44.039 --> 00:21:45.640 like using it, I don't like to play it, maybe because I played 315 00:21:45.640 --> 00:21:48.519 it too much. And that might be who is one of those things like 316 00:21:48.960 --> 00:21:52.279 some you know, like old people have, like Bridge Night. I think 317 00:21:52.359 --> 00:21:55.519 it's gonna be yeah, of course, no, no, no, no, 318 00:21:55.599 --> 00:22:00.920 I've I've played Coup with a wildly very number and kinds of people, 319 00:22:00.039 --> 00:22:04.039 you know. I find it a useful game because it's not really like a 320 00:22:04.240 --> 00:22:08.640 hidden role game in the truest sense. It's a it's a bluffing game. 321 00:22:08.799 --> 00:22:11.480 Yeah, yeah, I was gonna say, I it's one of those things 322 00:22:11.480 --> 00:22:17.319 that like I will be at the retirement home probably slinging Coup, Like all 323 00:22:17.359 --> 00:22:22.640 right, so my other one, I talked about Barker's Row. Um man, 324 00:22:22.000 --> 00:22:26.359 let's let's uh talk about let's talk about the DC Deck Build their first 325 00:22:26.400 --> 00:22:30.599 a second okay, right, No, I've never played it, but it 326 00:22:30.640 --> 00:22:34.480 was good. It kept it kept being that the same rule set was plastered 327 00:22:34.480 --> 00:22:37.880 over and over again. Right. Wasn't there a series of games that it 328 00:22:38.000 --> 00:22:41.799 is the exact same Yeah? Pretty much, and most of them were by 329 00:22:41.799 --> 00:22:45.039 Cryptozoic who kind of just would slap some new skin on it. And we 330 00:22:45.119 --> 00:22:48.880 had we had the like Resident Evil building one of the board game libraries and 331 00:22:48.960 --> 00:22:52.000 other things, but nobody ever played them because I was teaching Star Realms all 332 00:22:52.039 --> 00:22:56.720 the time, which a great game, like Stars, great game. All 333 00:22:56.799 --> 00:23:02.920 right, so tell me all the great things the DC Deck Building game. 334 00:23:03.200 --> 00:23:08.559 The best thing about this is that Isaac showed it to me. Um, 335 00:23:08.759 --> 00:23:15.799 delegate the delegate to your door. Yes, yeah, uh, I don't 336 00:23:15.839 --> 00:23:18.599 feel bad because Isaac brought this over right like it was like our last boding 337 00:23:18.599 --> 00:23:22.920 district? Are you in again? Not in his Sadly, I wanted to 338 00:23:22.920 --> 00:23:27.640 give a shout Outasten though, who was Yeah, so that's my frienising But 339 00:23:27.799 --> 00:23:32.440 um, yeah, he brought this over. But before my brother moved to 340 00:23:32.480 --> 00:23:36.279 Australia, and it was like our final like saying goodbye to my little brother 341 00:23:36.359 --> 00:23:37.279 kind of thing, because he's like, oh yeah, he's like he's going 342 00:23:37.319 --> 00:23:40.640 to Australia. It's gonna be awesome, and we're all excited for him. 343 00:23:40.640 --> 00:23:42.519 And he just wanted you to experience the pain of your brother being gone, 344 00:23:42.920 --> 00:23:48.319 you know. And I and boy howdy, I did game. You gotta 345 00:23:48.359 --> 00:23:52.279 you gotta give me team is you gotta give me more? More more than 346 00:23:52.319 --> 00:23:57.799 that. It's actually not. It's actually not why I picked it. Um, 347 00:23:57.839 --> 00:24:02.960 that was a joke. I have a legitimate reason. Um. The 348 00:24:02.960 --> 00:24:07.160 best thing that I can say about the DC deck Builder has nothing to do 349 00:24:07.319 --> 00:24:11.880 with its intended play pattern. Um. It has nothing to do with the 350 00:24:11.920 --> 00:24:15.279 fact that it's like it's got a competitive mode. I think that competitive mode 351 00:24:15.279 --> 00:24:21.359 is abysmal. Um something. I'm doing it anyway. It's a baseball But 352 00:24:22.759 --> 00:24:25.480 I will say, and I haven't even played this mode yet, but I 353 00:24:25.680 --> 00:24:30.640 I think the system was going to work a lot better because there is a 354 00:24:30.640 --> 00:24:36.440 cooperative mode, and there are some systems that I experienced. For example, 355 00:24:36.480 --> 00:24:41.400 there are injury cards, which are just useless cards in your deck, and 356 00:24:41.440 --> 00:24:45.960 I'm like, why am I starting a superhero game with a card that has 357 00:24:45.000 --> 00:24:49.000 no by power like at all. It's in your it's in your starting deck. 358 00:24:49.039 --> 00:24:52.599 It's in your starting deck and has no function. I mean that's that's 359 00:24:52.599 --> 00:24:56.720 a pretty common mechanic throughout deck builders. But starting deck is pretty wild. 360 00:24:56.839 --> 00:25:02.480 Yeah, starting deck is pretty weld. We also have negative point cards that 361 00:25:02.799 --> 00:25:06.839 are also able to be added as well, and I'm like, why are 362 00:25:06.839 --> 00:25:11.559 these in here? All? This has reminded me of my riotous experience I 363 00:25:11.559 --> 00:25:17.559 had with Millie Born. Is that how you say it? Yeah? Yeah, 364 00:25:18.240 --> 00:25:21.759 I had. I had an absolutely hysterical experience with it that I'll talk 365 00:25:21.799 --> 00:25:23.440 about later. But essentially, nobody can start the race yea. And we 366 00:25:23.519 --> 00:25:26.680 played it for like an hour and like everyone was it was like this is 367 00:25:26.680 --> 00:25:29.640 a race game, but we were all at the started line and we get 368 00:25:29.640 --> 00:25:33.119 playing the cards each other. It was just like a race of a bunch 369 00:25:33.160 --> 00:25:37.960 of people with no broken legs. Yeah, and that's and I'm like, 370 00:25:38.160 --> 00:25:41.559 so I'm in are going like why does this exist? And then I find 371 00:25:41.599 --> 00:25:45.480 out there's a competive cooperative mode and I was like, oh my god. 372 00:25:45.880 --> 00:25:52.160 Thematically that makes sense. Of course I would start with injuries against the super 373 00:25:52.240 --> 00:25:55.759 villain. Chances are some of their evil plans have already been triggered by the 374 00:25:55.759 --> 00:25:57.440 time we get to them, So of course I have some dead cards in 375 00:25:57.480 --> 00:26:02.160 my deck ten. So I'm gonna I'm gonna say It's It's strength is its 376 00:26:02.200 --> 00:26:07.759 cooperative mode. Every everybody loves those parts of the story where you uh miss 377 00:26:07.480 --> 00:26:12.079 established into the village is dangerous and we all all storage to be in media 378 00:26:12.119 --> 00:26:15.359 res where you miss everyone getting beaten down. You know, I don't, 379 00:26:15.359 --> 00:26:18.759 but I don't mind that so much for a comic books, right, Like 380 00:26:19.759 --> 00:26:22.559 I like comic books that you know, a comic book can be punchy and 381 00:26:22.680 --> 00:26:26.400 fun, and I don't mind it so much. But most most are most 382 00:26:26.880 --> 00:26:32.160 superheroes, You're gonna be a lot of punching. We're gonna we're gonna fundamental 383 00:26:33.000 --> 00:26:37.160 h what is it? Um? Ultimate Marvel has entered the chat. Sure 384 00:26:37.599 --> 00:26:40.799 was that now that one was not good? Who I was? Like? 385 00:26:40.839 --> 00:26:42.759 Everyone was really really grity. I don't know why they made trying to be 386 00:26:42.880 --> 00:26:45.480 Spider Man really gritty. And I remember, like back in like the late 387 00:26:45.559 --> 00:26:48.079 nineties, like what are you doing? Oh? I hate I hate the 388 00:26:48.160 --> 00:26:52.319 Ultimates? But yeah, Mark Mark Mark Ballar, I think is a terrible 389 00:26:52.319 --> 00:26:55.200 writer. But I was like, what is like, what is happening? 390 00:26:55.359 --> 00:26:59.240 Was like the blob, the blob ate ate the Wasp. Yeah and also 391 00:26:59.359 --> 00:27:03.799 yeah, and then Nightfaller teleports into his stomach and with a shark and the 392 00:27:03.880 --> 00:27:07.160 shark eats him. It's uh, it was bad. It's not the two 393 00:27:07.160 --> 00:27:11.920 thousands, baby, it's something. Um But I think that eleven gritty violence. 394 00:27:12.480 --> 00:27:15.960 I just I think the I think the cooperative mode on that UM again 395 00:27:17.160 --> 00:27:22.079 is a good extension of gameplay and theme working together. UM And I think 396 00:27:22.079 --> 00:27:25.319 that that's kind of cool. So that's what I'll say about DC deck Builder. 397 00:27:25.359 --> 00:27:27.400 I I and and it was shown to me by Isaac, so it 398 00:27:27.400 --> 00:27:34.240 gets it gets a little both from I got through it. I listen. 399 00:27:34.319 --> 00:27:37.440 I got through that. I felt good. I didn't I didn't destroy it. 400 00:27:38.359 --> 00:27:41.759 Yeah. You were like, oh, it's it should be this way 401 00:27:41.839 --> 00:27:45.000 not that way. I suppose it's not. It's not. I didn't say 402 00:27:45.039 --> 00:27:47.640 that. I just said, man, this is are odd. Why is 403 00:27:47.680 --> 00:27:49.000 this in here? Like I don't mind deck Builder's having two different types of 404 00:27:49.000 --> 00:27:52.680 currency. I think Ascension might be my favorite, like Vanilla deck Builder of 405 00:27:52.720 --> 00:27:56.839 all time, and that's got two different types of currency, but sure, 406 00:27:56.920 --> 00:28:00.759 it's it's it's more or less like the second deck Builder. Yeah, and 407 00:28:00.799 --> 00:28:06.079 it took it took dominion and then complicated it enough and then has was was 408 00:28:06.480 --> 00:28:08.680 a high watermark for a long time. Yeah, and I love it as 409 00:28:08.680 --> 00:28:12.359 somebody who owns like that in like four of its expansions. I don't mind 410 00:28:12.359 --> 00:28:17.759 two currencies. So but I'm excited to try and fight against the super villain 411 00:28:17.799 --> 00:28:19.440 where that is it's on the docket of things to play this summer is the 412 00:28:19.440 --> 00:28:23.000 cooperative mode of that struthly because I'm like, I bet the themes of this 413 00:28:23.039 --> 00:28:26.960 are actually really good against the super villain, and if they're not, they're 414 00:28:26.000 --> 00:28:29.400 gonna go back to it. It's on your games I Hate list, and 415 00:28:29.400 --> 00:28:33.599 you're like, you're you're diving back in. I mean, I can't imagine 416 00:28:33.599 --> 00:28:37.240 how many games you have sitting in a tower that are unplayed behind you right 417 00:28:37.240 --> 00:28:40.000 now, and you're gonna go back to the DC deck Builder. Yeah, 418 00:28:40.000 --> 00:28:41.240 you know, here's the thing and we can talk about this later. The 419 00:28:41.319 --> 00:28:44.279 thing is cool, that would be a cool episode two is like why do 420 00:28:44.359 --> 00:28:47.880 we go back to certain games? But like I always go back to certain 421 00:28:47.920 --> 00:28:52.640 games because truthfully, I mean I have assembled like a game fortress, Like 422 00:28:52.920 --> 00:28:56.680 I have Calax everywhere, and like we got the big wrap around couch around 423 00:28:56.720 --> 00:29:03.000 the big table, and I have a U watercolor painting of Fantasy Overlord Jeff 424 00:29:03.000 --> 00:29:07.720 Bezos. Um, that's not a joke. I'm gonna wait, hold up, 425 00:29:07.880 --> 00:29:11.759 let me. I'm just gonna hello and welcome to Desks and Dorks, 426 00:29:12.119 --> 00:29:18.799 a solo podcast in which I uh monologue about Kyle's madness. Um, I'm 427 00:29:18.880 --> 00:29:25.079 here to keep the peace. I am the dragon to his dork. He's 428 00:29:25.119 --> 00:29:27.960 back, come back. I just had we'd like to call content your your 429 00:29:29.039 --> 00:29:33.279 co host leaves you suddenly, and to show you a picture of Fantasy Overlord 430 00:29:33.319 --> 00:29:37.400 Jeff Bezos over a podcast in audio format. You know it's it works. 431 00:29:38.920 --> 00:29:41.200 This goes on YouTube as video. I just want to point that out, 432 00:29:41.240 --> 00:29:44.920 so the people who are watching this, if you're not, if you're not, 433 00:29:45.000 --> 00:29:47.839 if you're only listening to this, you should go see Fantasy over Lord 434 00:29:47.880 --> 00:29:49.680 Jeff Bezos, which is painted for me, by the way, by one 435 00:29:49.680 --> 00:29:53.640 of my D and d players. Um, it just it just looks like 436 00:29:53.720 --> 00:29:57.839 Dune. Man. It's it's dude, it does kind of look like dude. 437 00:29:59.240 --> 00:30:03.359 But yeah, I I don't know the longest long short answer to the 438 00:30:03.400 --> 00:30:07.440 longer form responses like I play games because only people, right, and oh 439 00:30:07.519 --> 00:30:11.000 yeah, if somebody absolutely loves the game, then yeah, I'll go back 440 00:30:11.000 --> 00:30:14.440 to it even if I don't know if I don't necessarily love the game. 441 00:30:14.720 --> 00:30:17.480 You know, that's that's a pretty good transition of my next game. Yeah, 442 00:30:17.880 --> 00:30:21.920 because I fully agree, I like games because I like people. Um. 443 00:30:21.960 --> 00:30:26.839 I think the best games are the best games because of their design being 444 00:30:26.480 --> 00:30:32.799 uh enhanced by the people you play them with. Um, which is why 445 00:30:33.720 --> 00:30:40.319 I hate Cards against Humanity. Fair, I hate Cars against Humanity. Okay, 446 00:30:40.400 --> 00:30:47.319 now I have to say positive things about it. Cards against Humanity has 447 00:30:47.400 --> 00:30:56.160 made me feel clever once. Um, there was there was one experience once 448 00:30:59.119 --> 00:31:03.480 I felt clever. Once. I was playing this game at a party. 449 00:31:03.559 --> 00:31:07.559 Everyone was wasted, and somebody pulled our Cards against Humanity. This was years 450 00:31:07.559 --> 00:31:11.880 and years and years ago too, so this is maybe like the second time 451 00:31:11.920 --> 00:31:18.200 I'd ever played it. And we played it with somewhere in the in the 452 00:31:18.240 --> 00:31:23.559 ballpark of like nine or ten people, and everyone was shouting and throwing things 453 00:31:23.559 --> 00:31:30.799 down. So a lot of the initial kind of shock of seeing a car 454 00:31:30.880 --> 00:31:34.640 for the first time was still there for a lot of people. And the 455 00:31:36.200 --> 00:31:41.400 prompt was something like white people be like And the card that I found in 456 00:31:41.440 --> 00:31:47.799 my hand was this incredibly long winded like get up every day, go to 457 00:31:47.880 --> 00:31:51.519 work, you know, struggle with a job, get married, and then 458 00:31:51.599 --> 00:31:53.440 like die sadly it was. It was so long, and I threw it 459 00:31:53.480 --> 00:31:59.240 down with absolute confidence, and everyone got through like nine other responses, which 460 00:31:59.240 --> 00:32:02.599 were all like off color and racist and blue. And it had the classic 461 00:32:02.640 --> 00:32:05.880 thing of somebody being like, how can you put that? And somebody's like, 462 00:32:05.920 --> 00:32:10.559 it's just the card as as I edged carefully towards the negative criticism. 463 00:32:12.240 --> 00:32:15.640 Um. And then and then my card came up and the room I left 464 00:32:15.720 --> 00:32:20.079 with laughter and everyone fell off their chairs. They were laughing so hard. 465 00:32:20.319 --> 00:32:22.640 And I won that one card, and I felt like that was me. 466 00:32:22.799 --> 00:32:24.680 I felt like that was me playing the game. It wasn't the card. 467 00:32:24.920 --> 00:32:31.680 It was me making a comedy choice, making a commentary on that. Um, 468 00:32:31.920 --> 00:32:37.720 golly, um great, by the way you're doing you're doing great, 469 00:32:37.240 --> 00:32:42.920 doing awesome. When I play Cards against Humanity, I can make fun of 470 00:32:42.960 --> 00:32:45.799 it, and I feel like it could be an engine for my humor. 471 00:32:45.839 --> 00:32:53.200 Uh. And when people put in responses that are uh um boring, I 472 00:32:53.359 --> 00:32:58.240 can make fun of them. Uh. And that can make me feel good 473 00:32:58.720 --> 00:33:01.960 about myself when I'm like, really, you did that card that's so that's 474 00:33:02.000 --> 00:33:06.240 so funny. Man, love the I'm not allowed to. I'm not allowed 475 00:33:06.240 --> 00:33:07.920 to be Like I love Escape because I think bought up, and you're like, 476 00:33:08.200 --> 00:33:12.119 I love Cards gas Fanny because I can hate on it while i'm playing. 477 00:33:14.880 --> 00:33:19.680 Um, that's awesome. I I think I'm done. I don't think 478 00:33:19.720 --> 00:33:25.799 there's anything else. No notes, no notes, that's so good. Oh 479 00:33:25.839 --> 00:33:30.160 man, I will tell you I have. It feels like with Cards Eis 480 00:33:30.240 --> 00:33:36.319 Humanity, the stories about Card behind or like about the games you played during 481 00:33:36.359 --> 00:33:40.359 Cards Against Umanity are better than playing Cards against Humanity. Like that's that's that's 482 00:33:40.359 --> 00:33:43.799 how it feels. That's how I mean, That's how I feel, because 483 00:33:43.799 --> 00:33:46.039 like I don't I feel it's like also, everybody has a Cards Agains Humanity 484 00:33:46.079 --> 00:33:51.240 story, Like I won my copy of Cards Against Humanity at a story at 485 00:33:51.240 --> 00:33:54.839 a bingo night in college. Oh that's cool. Uh well, so yes, 486 00:33:55.039 --> 00:33:59.319 it was great. But the way that it works is it's neon bingos 487 00:33:59.359 --> 00:34:01.480 that you play only in black lights and the like, the prizes were like 488 00:34:01.640 --> 00:34:06.039 ridiculous all and like all the lights are off. It was kind of yeah. 489 00:34:06.119 --> 00:34:09.000 And then if you cool again, if you tied for bingo, you 490 00:34:09.079 --> 00:34:13.800 had to pay. It was like Ninja sword something. It was like rock 491 00:34:13.800 --> 00:34:15.679 paper scissors basically, but you played it with your full body on stage. 492 00:34:16.159 --> 00:34:21.840 So that was the tiebreaker. And that and I was one my copy of 493 00:34:21.840 --> 00:34:25.400 Cards Against Humanity on stage in front of like three hundred people in in a 494 00:34:25.519 --> 00:34:30.079 tiebreaker rock paper scissors around I'm like, who does Okay, I'll i'll, 495 00:34:30.199 --> 00:34:36.559 i'll, I'll agree with you excitedly and also with a bit of side comment. 496 00:34:36.719 --> 00:34:39.039 Is your idea that like, oh, everybody has a Cards Against Humanity 497 00:34:39.159 --> 00:34:43.519 story And I'm like absolutely, And you're like, yours isn't even a play 498 00:34:43.559 --> 00:34:45.239 in the game. It's acquiring the game. That's your story. That's what 499 00:34:45.280 --> 00:34:52.039 I mean, though, is like I think that that those at home it's 500 00:34:52.039 --> 00:34:58.519 not worth uh we are this is now, this is this is the show 501 00:34:58.559 --> 00:35:08.400 hosts against Cards Against Uh oh boy. So you have mentioned your your convention 502 00:35:08.440 --> 00:35:15.840 space and how you are like a curator of games and a um an ambassador 503 00:35:15.920 --> 00:35:22.880 of games to use your your nomenclature absolute um. I got my start in 504 00:35:22.360 --> 00:35:28.719 the tabletop industry by essentially doing the same thing. I got my start by 505 00:35:28.719 --> 00:35:31.880 showing people games. That's like something that you know. I was really lucky 506 00:35:32.000 --> 00:35:37.679 and I got I got in with Yellow USA at like twenty eighteen, and 507 00:35:37.719 --> 00:35:39.719 I had a great time. And where is this going? This is so 508 00:35:39.960 --> 00:35:44.400 nice and heartworm it is and it was I am on the edge of my 509 00:35:44.440 --> 00:35:46.800 seat and it truthfully was like one of the best times of my life. 510 00:35:46.840 --> 00:35:51.559 And I loved it, like I loved what I did. And that first 511 00:35:51.559 --> 00:35:55.800 convention it was PAX twenty eighteen, um, and I was sent a crate 512 00:35:55.840 --> 00:36:01.800 of games by Yellow to learn prior to the show. And so one of 513 00:36:01.840 --> 00:36:07.840 those games happens to be a little game called Raids. What what's it called 514 00:36:08.039 --> 00:36:14.079 raids? Like like rain raids? Yeah? Oh um, like uh yeah 515 00:36:14.119 --> 00:36:20.199 like this like Shadow, yes, yea raide Shadow. It was this house. 516 00:36:20.440 --> 00:36:23.920 It was the porn game adaptation of Rage Shadow Legend. How how funny 517 00:36:23.920 --> 00:36:27.880 would it be if we had a brain integration right now? You know what 518 00:36:28.039 --> 00:36:32.360 we transition started like and then you start doing an a raid Shadow Legends like 519 00:36:34.199 --> 00:36:39.440 now use code the DORC to get sober and eight legendary roles like I don't 520 00:36:39.440 --> 00:36:42.800 even I've never played. I would, I would, I would put my 521 00:36:42.800 --> 00:36:45.639 headphones and I would walk away. I would walk off the podcast and you'd 522 00:36:45.639 --> 00:36:49.880 have to find another. Let just be like it's it's done. I can't, 523 00:36:49.920 --> 00:36:57.199 I understand, understandable, have a nice day. But like, so 524 00:36:57.360 --> 00:37:01.039 I played this game and it is how do I describe this? It's like 525 00:37:01.119 --> 00:37:07.119 to Kaido but worse. Um, if anyone's ever played to Kaido, like, 526 00:37:07.199 --> 00:37:12.239 it has this mechanic where if you are the person that is, it's 527 00:37:12.280 --> 00:37:15.440 like you. It like takes place in a line um and whoever the last 528 00:37:15.480 --> 00:37:19.920 person is is the first one to go next turn. So there's ways that 529 00:37:19.960 --> 00:37:24.639 you can finagle that game to get extra turns. With raids, um, 530 00:37:24.639 --> 00:37:32.480 not the shadow legends variety you you it was it was a circle because you 531 00:37:32.480 --> 00:37:37.519 were going on these raiding expeditions like you were pillaging, and these shadow legends. 532 00:37:37.559 --> 00:37:44.639 If these shadow legends, You're just gonna break, just gonna break every 533 00:37:44.639 --> 00:37:46.960 time. I can't. It's it's so hard to be Like, no I 534 00:37:47.079 --> 00:37:53.480 thinks think about raids shadow legends, that's a uh goodbye productivity. Um, 535 00:37:54.679 --> 00:38:00.360 But nah, I have to be nice. Um, you have to be 536 00:38:00.440 --> 00:38:04.960 nice. Let's just say that the rule set for this particular title kind of 537 00:38:04.960 --> 00:38:08.840 falls apart, but nope, don't fall apart. Nope, I'm bringing it 538 00:38:08.840 --> 00:38:15.599 back. I'm bringing it back. Gosh, darnett. Is that central movement 539 00:38:15.679 --> 00:38:21.599 mechanic I actually thought was a little better than to Kaido's because if you like 540 00:38:22.559 --> 00:38:24.519 the one My one problem with t Kaido was you could there's always a strategy 541 00:38:24.519 --> 00:38:28.480 where you can kind of play to the back and it feels like you get 542 00:38:28.480 --> 00:38:30.360 a lot more actions. Now you're not going to get very good actions, 543 00:38:31.079 --> 00:38:37.039 but there's no counter to that particular play. But with raids, if X, 544 00:38:37.280 --> 00:38:39.679 if some person I think makes it to the end of the map, 545 00:38:40.039 --> 00:38:45.719 there's a rules where they're like, there's a rule set where they're allowed to 546 00:38:45.719 --> 00:38:50.280 sort of end that round of play faster. So if you see somebody kind 547 00:38:50.280 --> 00:38:52.599 of lollygagging and trying to get all these free actions, like, oh, 548 00:38:52.840 --> 00:38:55.519 look at me, I'm so cute getting all my free actions, you could 549 00:38:55.519 --> 00:39:00.800 be like, well, even if it's not necessarily the most strategically viable decision, 550 00:39:00.079 --> 00:39:04.360 you can skip to the end of the track, and it really sort 551 00:39:04.400 --> 00:39:07.360 of punishes them and forces them to be like, oh, I I probably 552 00:39:07.360 --> 00:39:09.000 should have played this a little bit differently, so I thought that was cool. 553 00:39:09.519 --> 00:39:13.920 Um. It also came with metal coins in the base game, which 554 00:39:14.119 --> 00:39:16.119 was I was trying to I was trying not to say anything about components, 555 00:39:16.159 --> 00:39:19.840 but that's kind of no no, no, no, no, it's it's 556 00:39:20.039 --> 00:39:23.199 of all the compones to talk about metal coins. Is it's really special because 557 00:39:23.199 --> 00:39:25.880 there's a moment where everyone picks them up and they're like, wow, these 558 00:39:25.920 --> 00:39:29.719 are heavy, and they do the thing everyone does, which is they drop 559 00:39:29.800 --> 00:39:34.199 them on each other yea, which is you know, you like you're talking 560 00:39:34.199 --> 00:39:36.840 about the Chromagnum brain a lot. But that's one of those that I like 561 00:39:36.920 --> 00:39:39.159 never get hired of where I'm just like, ah, and you're like setting 562 00:39:39.199 --> 00:39:43.000 up the game to getting read for your demo and you and you get to 563 00:39:43.000 --> 00:39:47.880 pass out the metal coins and everyone goes ooh yeah, back up in their 564 00:39:47.880 --> 00:39:52.400 hands, the Glee, the child, the Goblin like glee and be like, 565 00:39:52.400 --> 00:39:55.440 I have coins, yeah, yeah, yeah, don't don't underestimate the 566 00:39:55.440 --> 00:40:00.360 metal coins because I made I I've lost track of the number of like kick 567 00:40:00.360 --> 00:40:04.679 Sure upgrades or other you know, there's like I feel like whole websites have 568 00:40:04.880 --> 00:40:08.199 made their their money by upgrade kits, and most of them were just like, 569 00:40:08.239 --> 00:40:12.440 oh, Bolt, sell you metal coins for this game you don't really 570 00:40:12.440 --> 00:40:15.239 like. I like, but but what I like it more with metal coins 571 00:40:15.239 --> 00:40:17.119 and the answers is sadly, yeah, probably I would like a lot of 572 00:40:17.159 --> 00:40:22.199 things with metal coins. Ah, all right, do you want to do 573 00:40:22.199 --> 00:40:25.559 one more? I think I sure? How many? Yeah? One more 574 00:40:25.559 --> 00:40:28.880 each? I got one more. I got one more in me, all 575 00:40:28.960 --> 00:40:30.639 right, so I'm gonna give you a one. None of these have been 576 00:40:30.679 --> 00:40:34.079 ones for me, and I've been I've been kind of saving this up. 577 00:40:34.360 --> 00:40:38.599 Oh boy, I'm excited. I don't know what I'm gonna be able to 578 00:40:38.639 --> 00:40:42.800 say about I'm excited. I don't know what this is. It's it's it's 579 00:40:42.840 --> 00:40:47.320 classically a game that I point to when I'm on a rant or I'm comparing 580 00:40:47.400 --> 00:40:52.679 different games, and I'm like, don't be like X, because I just 581 00:40:52.719 --> 00:40:55.079 like, I sort of can't imagine a worse game than this. Um, 582 00:40:55.159 --> 00:40:58.840 there's a serious game. You already you already made the caveat. I'm I'm 583 00:40:58.880 --> 00:41:02.199 the wind up this so long this because I'm nervous, Like I didn't I 584 00:41:02.239 --> 00:41:07.159 didn't put on Monopoly, you know, I didn't put on something like Candy 585 00:41:07.239 --> 00:41:13.639 Land or War because I don't feel like those are ones, especially when you 586 00:41:13.679 --> 00:41:15.599 understand what they are, right. I didn't even put Uno, which is 587 00:41:15.639 --> 00:41:20.880 a game that I despise, because Uno is within this category of games that 588 00:41:20.960 --> 00:41:24.239 I feel like. It's exactly what you said previously, which is it's not 589 00:41:24.280 --> 00:41:27.760 the games the people you're with. You don't play Uno to play, you 590 00:41:27.840 --> 00:41:30.440 know, you play Uno to talk to the people you're with. It's that 591 00:41:30.519 --> 00:41:35.480 fridge club thing you bust out Uno or you do so that you can talk 592 00:41:35.480 --> 00:41:38.280 to your friends and lay down some cards and somebody does a reverse and everyone 593 00:41:38.400 --> 00:41:43.079 screams, right, like that's the game, expecting it to be more. 594 00:41:43.440 --> 00:41:45.480 It is not good for you, nor good for the game. But this, 595 00:41:45.480 --> 00:41:50.280 this is a game that I absolutely despise. I hated more than every 596 00:41:50.320 --> 00:41:53.320 other game that I've said so far, and I do hate those other games 597 00:41:53.360 --> 00:41:57.639 like you've you've been kind of doing, right, like, I don't hate 598 00:41:57.679 --> 00:42:00.760 this game, but um so we need to chase that real vitriol. Are 599 00:42:00.800 --> 00:42:04.920 you ready? I hate mine's coming, so all right, I'm ready. 600 00:42:04.920 --> 00:42:13.559 I'm I hate Fleux. I hate flux. Really, I hate flex more 601 00:42:13.639 --> 00:42:19.880 than munchkin. I hate flex more than I don't know, exploding kittens. 602 00:42:20.760 --> 00:42:30.320 Um Uh, I hate flex. I hate flex. Um. I have 603 00:42:30.519 --> 00:42:37.239 so many questions. This is this is so hardy, like I want I 604 00:42:37.400 --> 00:42:44.239 want to know, oh like bonus content or something. So the one, 605 00:42:44.360 --> 00:42:45.880 it's the one out of ten. I only have three of these, according 606 00:42:45.920 --> 00:42:50.440 to board game Geek. Apparently I only have three games I've ever given a 607 00:42:50.480 --> 00:42:55.079 one. Um, God, here we go, all right? Holding cards? 608 00:42:55.320 --> 00:43:00.320 It's nice, okay, I'd like holding cards. I like shuffling cards. 609 00:43:00.519 --> 00:43:04.639 I'd like holding a hand of cards. I like shifting cards around in 610 00:43:04.679 --> 00:43:14.679 my hand. That feels good. Um Um, I think I've done. 611 00:43:17.039 --> 00:43:22.320 Wow, all right, we need to follow up episode. We just we 612 00:43:22.360 --> 00:43:24.639 need to follow up. We need to follow up episode. I need to 613 00:43:24.639 --> 00:43:29.960 follow up episode for my own sanity. I need it. I have so 614 00:43:30.000 --> 00:43:32.119 many questions now, and all of them are well. I mean, you 615 00:43:32.159 --> 00:43:35.719 can ask me your questions or you can talk about flux, and I'll do 616 00:43:35.840 --> 00:43:39.639 my best given my caveats. But uh, because I don't hate I don't 617 00:43:39.679 --> 00:43:43.880 love flux. I don't hate flux, though. I hate flux because I'm 618 00:43:43.920 --> 00:43:46.960 like, it's okay, that's my that is I'm I'm always baffled by its 619 00:43:46.960 --> 00:43:52.119 okayness. I think is my is my big thing. Every time I'm like, 620 00:43:52.199 --> 00:43:57.559 man, this what an okay? This game sure does exist, like 621 00:43:58.119 --> 00:44:02.199 but but it's like it's like the Totino's pizza rolls of games, like I'm 622 00:44:02.320 --> 00:44:06.920 I'm never gonna be like clambering for them, but like it's actually that's not 623 00:44:06.960 --> 00:44:08.639 true. I love pizza rolls. I gotta find it. That's a terrible 624 00:44:08.719 --> 00:44:15.639 bet up. That doesn't it doesn't work. You should have I mean, 625 00:44:15.840 --> 00:44:19.239 you could have gone hot pockets. But even hot pockets are like pretty great 626 00:44:19.239 --> 00:44:22.079 too. It's like hot pockets are like a two out of ten or a 627 00:44:22.079 --> 00:44:24.400 three out of tan. No, man, there's there's there's a hungry college 628 00:44:24.400 --> 00:44:28.159 of gremlin and that lives with me. It's like I love the hot pockets. 629 00:44:28.880 --> 00:44:32.079 They're they're their nasty meat dumped in toilet water. Is what is what 630 00:44:32.280 --> 00:44:37.159 a pot pocket is like? If you're if you're if you're starving, and 631 00:44:37.159 --> 00:44:40.920 you've already burned your taste buds off on the three previous hot pockets, they 632 00:44:40.960 --> 00:44:45.320 start to taste good, uh in your in your dorm room. That already 633 00:44:45.360 --> 00:44:52.320 already stinks of the ramen that you spilled on the rug. I think the 634 00:44:52.400 --> 00:44:57.840 biggers on takers that you just know I got pockets. I don't think that's 635 00:44:57.840 --> 00:45:04.320 a hot take at all. I love that. Up Rise up, let's 636 00:45:04.360 --> 00:45:08.119 go, let's go, gamers. No, it's like I'm just trying to 637 00:45:08.119 --> 00:45:13.000 think of something bland and milk toast, because like like like a regular like 638 00:45:13.760 --> 00:45:16.079 slice of cheese pizza from a slightly below average pizza place, Like it's never 639 00:45:16.119 --> 00:45:19.920 gonna blow you away. I've never been blown away by it. But I 640 00:45:19.960 --> 00:45:22.039 don't hate it. I have so many questions. I have so many questions. 641 00:45:22.079 --> 00:45:25.880 I mean, if you got cheese pizza and you were like extra cheese 642 00:45:25.960 --> 00:45:30.400 and they forgot to put extra cheese and instead they put broken glass on it, 643 00:45:30.480 --> 00:45:35.519 I think that's I think that's flux. Yes, oh my god, 644 00:45:35.559 --> 00:45:40.119 I love it. I'm sorry, are bad and you gotta do the American 645 00:45:40.159 --> 00:45:43.400 thing and be like I want my money back and I want a free thing, 646 00:45:44.079 --> 00:45:46.760 and you're like, god, Americans, they're so like so entitled because 647 00:45:46.760 --> 00:45:52.599 we've put a broken glass on your slice of cheese pizza. Or if it's 648 00:45:52.599 --> 00:45:55.400 not broken glass, it's that piece of pizza that's been kept under the light 649 00:45:55.639 --> 00:46:01.159 all day. Like everyone is everything else. They get the whole rest of 650 00:46:01.199 --> 00:46:04.920 the pie, every other pieces, but there's one piece left. It's sitting 651 00:46:04.960 --> 00:46:08.679 under that lamp. And you walk in five minutes before this pizza place closes. 652 00:46:08.840 --> 00:46:13.760 It's one of those like eight to ten joints where it's ten pm. 653 00:46:13.840 --> 00:46:17.559 You walk in at nine fifty five and they're like, so we're about to 654 00:46:17.559 --> 00:46:20.960 close, and you say it's okay, I'll just have a slice of cheese 655 00:46:20.960 --> 00:46:22.840 pizza. And both of you looked out at the same time, and there's 656 00:46:22.840 --> 00:46:27.199 that one slice that's been sitting there all day. That's Flux. And you 657 00:46:27.280 --> 00:46:31.039 realize and all these see they say, sir, that'll be nine ninety nine. 658 00:46:32.159 --> 00:46:39.400 Here's your card game, that's Flux. I love this. This is 659 00:46:39.440 --> 00:46:45.639 so good. This is so good. That is the most oh wow. 660 00:46:45.960 --> 00:46:50.800 Um So, you know what, in honestly and in fairness to you, 661 00:46:50.960 --> 00:46:53.239 I have also picked my least favorite game of all time. And I felt, 662 00:46:53.320 --> 00:46:57.519 you know, like, if you if Grahama's going hard, I'm gonna 663 00:46:57.559 --> 00:47:00.360 go hard to um this. I feel like this might actually be harder for 664 00:47:00.400 --> 00:47:02.960 you to because I'm gonna say what it is. I don't know if you're 665 00:47:04.000 --> 00:47:06.559 gonna agree with me or not, and I might be like, what is 666 00:47:06.599 --> 00:47:09.840 wrong with you? Why are you like this? But my my least favorite 667 00:47:09.880 --> 00:47:15.480 game of all time is T Dragon Society. Um he Dragon Society. Yes, 668 00:47:15.719 --> 00:47:22.440 it is a deck builder based on Shocker Surprise. But it is my 669 00:47:22.519 --> 00:47:29.280 least favorite game of all time. It is um and I can't say any 670 00:47:29.320 --> 00:47:31.679 more than that, and it hurts my soul. You got to talk about 671 00:47:31.679 --> 00:47:35.679 it because I don't know what it is. Okay, So Dragon Society is 672 00:47:35.719 --> 00:47:39.800 as So it is a deck builder based on the popular graphic novel comic book 673 00:47:39.840 --> 00:47:44.159 series by Only Press, which is all about these cute little dragons. They 674 00:47:44.239 --> 00:47:46.239 run a T shop. UM. Renegade Games put it out and it won 675 00:47:46.280 --> 00:47:50.920 the Origin Award in twenty eighteen. Um, what yeah, okay, great 676 00:47:51.119 --> 00:47:52.840 at one or one? An Origin Award in twenty eighteen? I forget which 677 00:47:52.880 --> 00:47:57.920 one? Um? And basically what was such a drop off? You were 678 00:47:57.960 --> 00:48:01.880 like the award of the whole Show was now because I realized that I phrased 679 00:48:01.880 --> 00:48:05.760 that wrong and like, that's not it didn't actually win, Like they didn't 680 00:48:05.760 --> 00:48:08.280 win the whole Show. It won a Pulitzer Prize and you're like the Pulz 681 00:48:08.320 --> 00:48:14.480 Prize, Like no, it was just his Nephews Prize, Like it's yeah, 682 00:48:14.480 --> 00:48:19.440 it's not a huge deal. Um, and you, Oh god, 683 00:48:20.559 --> 00:48:23.039 this is so hard because like I want to just light into this game because 684 00:48:23.119 --> 00:48:28.719 it's so bad and I and I don't know a good way to be like, 685 00:48:28.760 --> 00:48:31.559 oh, yeah, this is how you play it without insulting it, 686 00:48:31.639 --> 00:48:40.400 because right the gameplay is insultingly bad. Like you can replicate the feeling of 687 00:48:40.440 --> 00:48:45.360 playing t Dragon Society if you split a deck of fifty two cards in four 688 00:48:45.880 --> 00:48:50.000 and then every turn you just took the top card and flipped in front of 689 00:48:50.039 --> 00:48:52.760 you, and then every so often, just whenever you feel like it, 690 00:48:52.840 --> 00:48:54.800 you flipped the top two cards. Yeah. See that seems fine. That 691 00:48:54.920 --> 00:48:58.960 like that sounds like war again. Like these games that I didn't put on 692 00:48:59.000 --> 00:49:04.280 the list, and you know it would be fine if it didn't, if 693 00:49:04.320 --> 00:49:08.360 it didn't market itself as like this is a very important tabletop game or like 694 00:49:08.519 --> 00:49:13.599 this is like an actual thing. I Nope, I can't. I can't. 695 00:49:13.639 --> 00:49:15.480 Oh my god, you're killing me, Graham. But this rule, 696 00:49:15.599 --> 00:49:16.920 Yeah, I know, I want to. I want to like come in 697 00:49:17.000 --> 00:49:22.480 and needle you in a way that like, oh, it's about marketing. 698 00:49:22.559 --> 00:49:27.000 Oh, except the fact that, like I'd be totally honest, I think 699 00:49:27.000 --> 00:49:30.199 that part of my vitriol for things like flux, like Cards against Humanity has 700 00:49:30.239 --> 00:49:35.079 a little bit to do with the culture that surrounds them. Um or you 701 00:49:35.119 --> 00:49:43.519 know that that gets my hipstery grumpy. Uh like uh grunk grunckles up. 702 00:49:43.760 --> 00:49:47.199 Yeah, And that's and that's the thing. Like it it's so bad, 703 00:49:47.840 --> 00:49:52.960 like I can't I can't be me into it. I have to say something 704 00:49:53.079 --> 00:49:57.159 nice. Oh god, um, I have something. It's cute. It's 705 00:49:57.159 --> 00:50:00.440 cute dragons. Right. I was trying to stay away from the team because, 706 00:50:00.480 --> 00:50:02.199 like we do the theme of Bunch, it's too easy. But I 707 00:50:02.239 --> 00:50:06.920 was like, you know what, that's what we'll go with it. Um. 708 00:50:07.039 --> 00:50:09.639 The the art and the presentation are very pretty. The graphic novel is 709 00:50:09.679 --> 00:50:13.519 great. Hey. I love the graphic novel, big fan of it. 710 00:50:13.599 --> 00:50:19.000 Very inclusive, tons of representation, diversity, and it has adorable dragons. 711 00:50:19.039 --> 00:50:22.039 It's just very very homey, sort of I live in a cottage kind of 712 00:50:22.119 --> 00:50:25.920 vibes, and I love that. Come come coming up, big man. 713 00:50:27.000 --> 00:50:29.480 Yeah it is. It was cottage core, I think kind of before cottage 714 00:50:29.559 --> 00:50:34.199 Chre was cool, sum and I love so comic is great. Y'll go 715 00:50:34.280 --> 00:50:37.039 support the author of the comic. Just maybe don't buy T Dragon Society. 716 00:50:37.559 --> 00:50:42.960 Um, well it sounds great. I'm gonna go right now. I actually 717 00:50:42.960 --> 00:50:47.360 did buy a copy of T Dragon Society recently, because every one of my 718 00:50:47.440 --> 00:50:51.119 game group is like, dude, you talk about this ad nauseum. We 719 00:50:51.480 --> 00:50:53.360 have to try it at some point, and our store got rid of its 720 00:50:53.400 --> 00:50:57.960 copy. I found it for four dollars at a good will and I was 721 00:50:58.000 --> 00:51:01.679 like, fine, I will buy this, we will play it once. 722 00:51:02.400 --> 00:51:07.280 I will then sell this at more than I bought it for, and we 723 00:51:07.280 --> 00:51:10.679 were all gonna move on with our lives. But that's my last ticket here. 724 00:51:12.320 --> 00:51:14.599 You have some deep cuts for a lot of yours, you know, 725 00:51:14.679 --> 00:51:16.960 as as somebody who feels like I'm ountain playing things. You know, I 726 00:51:17.039 --> 00:51:21.559 tried to pick things that I consumably think that people had played. Yeah, 727 00:51:21.920 --> 00:51:23.840 there's there. There is a series of games that I played once at a 728 00:51:23.920 --> 00:51:30.360 convention and walked away angry. Oh am, I allowed to ask, is 729 00:51:30.360 --> 00:51:31.679 that or is that violence? Oh? Yeah, sure it was. It 730 00:51:31.760 --> 00:51:36.800 was a game called death Cup, Um, death Cup, death Cup. 731 00:51:36.920 --> 00:51:42.239 Yeah. It was like a drinking game promotional thing. It lived in a 732 00:51:42.280 --> 00:51:45.519 similar space as like your Cards against Humanity. It was like kind of offensive 733 00:51:46.079 --> 00:51:51.719 and h they ran these big events at I want to say gen Con, 734 00:51:52.320 --> 00:51:53.599 and so they rented out a lot of space, made it seem like the 735 00:51:53.599 --> 00:51:58.039 company was pretty big, and I just had the worst time, at the 736 00:51:58.039 --> 00:52:00.639 worst time playing it, at the worst time doing it. I started asking 737 00:52:00.719 --> 00:52:06.960 questions about the gameplay uh and um uh. There was like a weird, 738 00:52:07.280 --> 00:52:09.400 a weird thing that happened in the room where I was like asking questions, 739 00:52:09.440 --> 00:52:13.679 and like I was like, wait, this doesn't make any sense rules rules 740 00:52:13.679 --> 00:52:17.960 wise, and everyone got really awkward because everyone was like so invested, and 741 00:52:19.039 --> 00:52:21.880 so it was like this, this is a complete waste of my time and 742 00:52:21.920 --> 00:52:27.039 I hate it. Um It somehow managed to like take the rules to drinking 743 00:52:27.079 --> 00:52:30.360 games and then pretend like they had made them up and then sold them with 744 00:52:30.440 --> 00:52:36.119 like this big presentation. Um probably one of the worst convention game experiences I've 745 00:52:36.119 --> 00:52:39.000 ever had. Wow, that sounds bad, but does sound bad. Sounds 746 00:52:39.480 --> 00:52:43.679 genuinely awful. But I didn't put it because people will be like, what's 747 00:52:43.800 --> 00:52:47.800 death cut, what's tea? Dragons and fairness? Teacher Society does still sell 748 00:52:47.840 --> 00:52:52.679 pretty well. Um, it's at Renegade's booth every year. Um. It 749 00:52:52.840 --> 00:52:58.079 constantly comes up on like lists of like family friendly games for like for you 750 00:52:58.159 --> 00:53:00.480 to try when you're ready to move on from like other stuff like oh, 751 00:53:00.679 --> 00:53:05.000 this is a much more accessible version of this other thing you might already be 752 00:53:05.000 --> 00:53:07.559 playing. And it's like, I mean, yeah it is, but like 753 00:53:07.559 --> 00:53:13.920 it also with bad like so it like it's it's crazy to me how popular 754 00:53:14.000 --> 00:53:15.880 that game still is. Um, so I thought people would at least know 755 00:53:15.920 --> 00:53:19.000 about that one. But yeah, maybe I should have picked some other ones. 756 00:53:19.000 --> 00:53:20.760 You're right, man, I didn't think about that. I was thinking 757 00:53:20.880 --> 00:53:23.719 like games that like I was really trying to challenge myself on some of these. 758 00:53:23.960 --> 00:53:28.719 Sure, but um man, do you have a weird question? I 759 00:53:28.719 --> 00:53:30.920 have a weird question for today. Yeah, hit me, hit me with 760 00:53:30.920 --> 00:53:35.639 your weird lission. But um, first off, though, thank you again 761 00:53:35.679 --> 00:53:37.719 everybody. By the way, folks. Um, we haven't made a formal 762 00:53:37.719 --> 00:53:39.320 announcement, but this is gonna be our formal announced. Graham is gonna stepping 763 00:53:39.360 --> 00:53:42.679 in for the next couple buts as the interim coast of Desk and Dork. 764 00:53:43.039 --> 00:53:47.400 Yeah. Um, seriously, silly Man, I know I told you this 765 00:53:47.440 --> 00:53:51.239 yesterday, but I really appreciate you doing this and being a part of the 766 00:53:51.239 --> 00:53:54.320 show and just being a friend. Man. It's it's it's gonna be awesome. 767 00:53:54.800 --> 00:53:58.639 It is it already is. I've I've had so much fun of these 768 00:53:58.639 --> 00:54:00.119 episodes where you're like, do you want to do like one of your ideas? 769 00:54:00.159 --> 00:54:02.280 Like no, no, I absolutely do not want to do one of 770 00:54:02.320 --> 00:54:06.639 my ideas. You're a way better, but I absolutely because like it's just 771 00:54:06.719 --> 00:54:08.920 fun. Um, so huge. Thank you again to Graham. If you 772 00:54:08.960 --> 00:54:12.480 would like to support Graham if you're not watching this on YouTube, Graham has 773 00:54:12.519 --> 00:54:15.119 a Never Going Home banner. Um. He is a guest writer on Never 774 00:54:15.159 --> 00:54:17.679 Going Home, which is in the middle of a Kickstarter campaign right now. 775 00:54:19.119 --> 00:54:22.599 So if you would like to see and support them and buy extensions support Gram's 776 00:54:22.599 --> 00:54:25.559 work, you could do that too. M Grams are any other place too 777 00:54:25.559 --> 00:54:30.239 that people can go check your stuff out, your workout while we're plugging. 778 00:54:30.719 --> 00:54:35.360 You can find me on Instagram at Poor Game Ambassador. You could reach out 779 00:54:35.400 --> 00:54:42.159 to me through desks and Jorge's things. Um. The Never Going Home kickstarter 780 00:54:42.320 --> 00:54:46.119 is doing really great. Never Going Home is a World War One kind of 781 00:54:46.159 --> 00:54:52.239 horror game talking about the metaphors of war through one of the most horrific m 782 00:54:52.440 --> 00:54:57.159 experiences in human history, and then kind of the supernatural things that occur being 783 00:54:57.199 --> 00:54:59.880 that metaphor. For like, you can't talk about what happens at war, 784 00:55:00.000 --> 00:55:05.000 there's no way to translate that because in this case it is incongruent with what 785 00:55:05.119 --> 00:55:08.679 the lives that people have. Yeah, and so this kickstarter is called Beginnings 786 00:55:08.679 --> 00:55:13.039 and Endings, and it's a book that talks about the beginning and end of 787 00:55:13.039 --> 00:55:15.119 the war. And it's going to be kind of book ending a lot of 788 00:55:15.119 --> 00:55:20.920 these a lot of these elements. And so I'm very excited. I love 789 00:55:20.960 --> 00:55:23.559 wedding games. I think they do phenomenal work. So I'm very excited to 790 00:55:23.599 --> 00:55:28.880 be able to be a part of it. Yeah, it's gonna be awesome. 791 00:55:29.119 --> 00:55:31.199 It's very exciting stuff. So um again, please make sure you guys 792 00:55:31.199 --> 00:55:36.559 are checking out with kind stuff we love having. So all right, my 793 00:55:36.639 --> 00:55:38.880 weird question, Oh, before I forget after the Rain, you go check 794 00:55:38.960 --> 00:55:43.760 that out on an indie press revolution. It's still doing really well. I'll 795 00:55:43.800 --> 00:55:45.000 be honest with you, Riley, and I still get shocked a little bit 796 00:55:45.000 --> 00:55:49.199 every time we're like Wow, this is still still buying this, which is 797 00:55:49.239 --> 00:55:52.039 great, Like, that's a great it's a great feeling to have. But 798 00:55:52.079 --> 00:55:53.800 if you have not gotten yourself a copy, get over at Indi Press Revolution. 799 00:55:54.639 --> 00:56:00.360 Also, the Fear Within Kickstarter concluded, but we are actually be looking 800 00:56:00.360 --> 00:56:04.400 at getting you guys some copies. We will start once basically, final edits 801 00:56:04.400 --> 00:56:07.239 are done. Final layout on the book is finished as well, which was 802 00:56:07.320 --> 00:56:10.000 kind of a huge thing. Like our layout is done, editing is done, 803 00:56:10.639 --> 00:56:14.760 compiling is done, all of it is done, and so the electronic 804 00:56:14.800 --> 00:56:17.599 copy is going to be shipping out to backers very soon, with the physical 805 00:56:17.639 --> 00:56:22.199 copies coming out there after which you will have an opportunity to get yourself a 806 00:56:22.239 --> 00:56:27.159 copy of a Fear Within from us desk. DRKS is going to start selling 807 00:56:27.239 --> 00:56:30.239 that game and a bunch of other of our other zine games direct basically, 808 00:56:30.840 --> 00:56:36.119 which is a huge step for us as a company. So yeah, although 809 00:56:36.119 --> 00:56:38.199 if you have them in your future local game store then or your local games 810 00:56:38.239 --> 00:56:40.239 that wants to carry our stuff, please let us know. All right, 811 00:56:42.320 --> 00:56:44.480 all the good stuff out of the way, Graham, You're ready for the 812 00:56:45.119 --> 00:56:47.440 weird question. Absolutely. Okay, Let's assume for a moment that you have 813 00:56:47.480 --> 00:56:52.360 been cursed by a powerful, powerful college wizard, and they've replaced your arms 814 00:56:52.360 --> 00:56:55.760 with an indestructible food substance that is found in your dorm. What are your 815 00:56:55.920 --> 00:57:00.440 arms? What are your arms replaced with? And why? Okay, let's 816 00:57:00.800 --> 00:57:06.079 what college food is like college dorm food? Is your arm replaced with? 817 00:57:06.239 --> 00:57:09.639 N y? Okay, so I I picking up what you you setting down 818 00:57:09.639 --> 00:57:14.000 because the idea is that I want to eat the thing, right, the 819 00:57:14.039 --> 00:57:17.920 curses that I want to eat it. Therefore I'm tempted by my arms. 820 00:57:19.039 --> 00:57:22.000 Is this what you're getting at? No, it wasn't, but it is 821 00:57:22.039 --> 00:57:24.159 now that's way better than That's awesome. Yeah, welcome, Welcome to the 822 00:57:24.159 --> 00:57:29.760 workshop, everybody. Um uh, I give it's a curse. The idea 823 00:57:29.920 --> 00:57:31.559 is that you want to be tempted like curses have to be like ironic, 824 00:57:31.679 --> 00:57:37.079 right, and you have a deeply thematic mythological thing going on. I mean, 825 00:57:37.480 --> 00:57:38.960 you know, if it was hot pockets, if I had linked a 826 00:57:39.000 --> 00:57:43.280 series of hot pockets for both arms, I would not be tempted. I 827 00:57:43.280 --> 00:57:46.079 would be tempted to strangle myself with them, so I wouldn't have to I 828 00:57:46.119 --> 00:57:51.320 wouldn't have so I wouldn't have to have the smell, just like permeating everything 829 00:57:51.360 --> 00:57:52.960 all the time. You think you smell bad as a college student, wait 830 00:57:53.039 --> 00:57:58.519 until your arm has been placed by an interconnected link of hot pockets. Um 831 00:58:00.159 --> 00:58:01.639 hard hard to put them in the microwave, So they're gonna be yeah, 832 00:58:02.039 --> 00:58:07.440 like your hot pocket arms, So they're gonna be frozen, and they're gonna 833 00:58:07.480 --> 00:58:10.320 slowly dethought, they're gonna get like really wet and like like sloppy, which 834 00:58:10.360 --> 00:58:15.960 is like extra bad um. But uh, I mean I think my most, 835 00:58:15.960 --> 00:58:20.159 honestly, more than I hate hot pockets, I think I hate easy 836 00:58:20.199 --> 00:58:24.320 mac um. I think I think easy mac is disgusting specifically because you put 837 00:58:24.320 --> 00:58:28.639 water in it, you microwave it. I think it just ruins everything about 838 00:58:28.920 --> 00:58:32.320 like a good craft Macaronian chiefe from the box, Like you need the creaminess 839 00:58:32.360 --> 00:58:38.519 to have any kind of flavor to get that weird like acidic cheese dust taste. 840 00:58:38.760 --> 00:58:45.199 But water, oh man, Like there's noodles just floating in like in 841 00:58:45.400 --> 00:58:50.920 water. It's it's it's it's so awful, oh man. A dorm food 842 00:58:51.000 --> 00:58:54.960 um uh, it's pub mix a thing, and uh yeah yeah, publics 843 00:58:54.960 --> 00:59:00.039 is definitely all publics is pubics is we may gar bread and butter on Okay. 844 00:59:00.079 --> 00:59:04.079 Pub publics all the way, one hundred percent. The number one best 845 00:59:04.159 --> 00:59:08.360 dorm food is publics. It's it's in a container that's like as tall as 846 00:59:08.400 --> 00:59:13.480 your Torso it has the novelty. You get it there, you get it. 847 00:59:13.559 --> 00:59:15.760 You know, no matter who comes in, they're always excited for one 848 00:59:15.800 --> 00:59:20.159 element of it. You can you know, Uh, you eat it when 849 00:59:20.159 --> 00:59:22.920 you're drinking, you eat it sober. Uh. It's awesome and it's so 850 00:59:23.039 --> 00:59:28.679 big and like weirdly cumbersome that it's it's it has the communal feel. But 851 00:59:28.880 --> 00:59:30.920 again, I love come in, come in. Oh, Like everybody wants 852 00:59:30.920 --> 00:59:35.360 to have that polar parlor room where they're an awesome host and with a pub 853 00:59:35.400 --> 00:59:37.800 mix you feel very sophisticated with your public Oh, come on in. Oh 854 00:59:37.960 --> 00:59:42.000 was you like a handful of publics? And there's the guy down the hall 855 00:59:42.360 --> 00:59:45.320 in your dorm who's always like in there a little too much, being like, 856 00:59:45.360 --> 00:59:46.199 hey, what's going on? Do you want to play smash it? 857 00:59:46.320 --> 00:59:50.199 Oh? I notice you a pub mix. You're always in here eating my 858 00:59:50.280 --> 00:59:55.840 puppets. Just picture pillars of constantly whirling pub mix for arms. Yeah, 859 00:59:57.000 --> 01:00:00.480 those are my arms. My arms are the public's arms. Absolutely, What 860 01:00:00.639 --> 01:00:05.159 about you? What what are your curse arms? Kyle? I I from 861 01:00:05.159 --> 01:00:09.920 Mike's such a good I love this. Oh man, I'm gonna say I 862 01:00:10.039 --> 01:00:15.000 give you like elastic ramen noodle arms. That's what I want. I want 863 01:00:15.039 --> 01:00:17.360 like you know it, don't get eight up. You'll get eight up right 864 01:00:17.480 --> 01:00:22.480 fast. You know you won't eve, but you won't insurvive your first class 865 01:00:22.480 --> 01:00:23.719 in the morning. You'll wake up and be like, I don't want to 866 01:00:23.719 --> 01:00:28.039 go to the cafeteria. I'm just gonna nibble on my arms. Then I'm 867 01:00:28.039 --> 01:00:30.360 gonna like slump to class because I was stupid enough to sign for a nine 868 01:00:30.519 --> 01:00:35.400 thirty one and I was up till four in the morning just trying to figure 869 01:00:35.440 --> 01:00:43.480 out what to do with my ramen noodle arms. Very Octo Dad, it's 870 01:00:43.559 --> 01:00:46.159 very ot. Shout out to Octo Dad. Does feel like Octo Dad. 871 01:00:46.440 --> 01:00:51.239 Oh my gosh, I forgot that game existed, man. So there's there's 872 01:00:51.519 --> 01:00:53.840 uh for those of you love Octodad. That company has a game that I 873 01:00:53.880 --> 01:00:57.159 think is even better, which came out in the last couple of years. 874 01:00:57.199 --> 01:01:02.840 It's called bug Snacks. Um Snacks is a first person puzzle solving a monster 875 01:01:02.920 --> 01:01:08.920 collecting game with like just a layer of cosmic horror and body horror. You're 876 01:01:08.960 --> 01:01:14.199 like these weird you look like muppets, and you're on this island and you're 877 01:01:14.280 --> 01:01:19.599 hunting bug snacks, which are they look like food, like a strawberry or 878 01:01:19.639 --> 01:01:22.199 a hamburger, and they have Pokemon names where they only say they're a Pokemon 879 01:01:22.320 --> 01:01:25.519 name. And you have to run around from area to area and catch them 880 01:01:25.800 --> 01:01:29.239 so that you can then feed them to people. And when you feed them 881 01:01:29.280 --> 01:01:31.800 to the weird muppet people, their arms and legs and bodies start to transform 882 01:01:31.880 --> 01:01:36.760 it into those things. But everybody's like they're like talking like a muppet. 883 01:01:36.880 --> 01:01:39.440 Oh I'm so hungry, just give me, give me burger burger, burger, 884 01:01:39.480 --> 01:01:43.239 burger burger, which is like this like this like this spider burger. 885 01:01:43.239 --> 01:01:45.519 And then people eat them, and all of the weird muppet people talk the 886 01:01:45.559 --> 01:01:51.559 whole time about how delicious bug snacks are. Bug snacks is incredible. I 887 01:01:51.639 --> 01:01:54.360 highly recommend everybody go play it. What is happening right now? It's it's 888 01:01:54.440 --> 01:01:58.559 amazing, Like you play it the whole time with your jotting the floor and 889 01:01:58.599 --> 01:02:02.280 as somebody who's tired APAA games, so exhausted by video games because I'm just 890 01:02:02.360 --> 01:02:07.760 not surprised anymore. I'm just like, Okay, buck snacks, I'm I'm 891 01:02:07.760 --> 01:02:15.960 appalled a little bit. And also buck Snacks. After you finish hanging out 892 01:02:15.000 --> 01:02:22.639 on the can playing Raid, Shadow Legends Shadow cool down with the nice session 893 01:02:22.639 --> 01:02:27.199 of bug Snacks and which you'll be treated to monster collection and cosmic horror. 894 01:02:27.679 --> 01:02:30.480 You know, my two buck snacks get yours today. Bug Snacks get yours 895 01:02:30.519 --> 01:02:36.239 today. Um, oh my god, yeah, maybe bug Snacks a sponsor. 896 01:02:36.400 --> 01:02:37.880 So I don't think that. Oh it's so good, I hope so 897 01:02:37.920 --> 01:02:44.719 I love bucks. Oh man, it's hysterical. That's yeah, that's the 898 01:02:44.760 --> 01:02:47.440 episode. That's that's it. We did it team. Um, if you've 899 01:02:47.440 --> 01:02:51.000 liked this episode, we hope you have again. You could do all the 900 01:02:51.039 --> 01:02:52.639 wonderful things we do like share, common, subscribe, all that stuff. 901 01:02:52.880 --> 01:02:55.719 If you can fall us anywhere you can find a great podcasts. I am 902 01:02:55.719 --> 01:02:59.920 contractually obligated or Riley will find me and eat my shoes to tell you that 903 01:03:00.039 --> 01:03:02.880 we're on Geo Chavan and uh yeah, make sure that you follow Graham and 904 01:03:02.960 --> 01:03:07.119 give him some support and some love to until next time. Though I'm Kyle 905 01:03:07.119 --> 01:03:12.159 out for desks and Dorks, I'm Graham Gains and you have all been awesome. 906 01:03:12.159 --> 01:03:14.360 We'll see you next time. Goodbye, everybody, Goodbye,