We're back with another edition of the Federalist Radio Hour Emily Dashinski, culture editor
here at the Federalist. As always, you can email the show at radio
at the Federalist dot com, follow us on ex at fdr LST, make
sure to subscribe wherever you download your podcasts, and of course to the premium
version of our website as well. Today we are joined live and in person
here at Federalist HQ by two wonderful author authors who have a new book out
called Next Gen Marxism, What It Is and How to Combat It. That
will be Mike Gonzalez and Catherine Cornell Gorko. Welcome to both of you.
Thank you so glad to be here. To be here. One of the
benefits of doing this in person is that I got to see who would say
thank you first. This is pretty fun. Katherine was waiting to see if
Mike would do it. Mike was waiting to wait, ladies first, right,
No, it's great, and I was just saying that we are going
to keep a copy of this book here for our summer interns, because you
know, it's probably relevant to their lives. But one thing I would just
want to toss out to both of you is why you felt it was important
to write this book right now in twenty twenty four. I don't know who
wants to take it first, but Catherine. Okay, So first, the
idea for the book really came about in I would say twenty twenty one,
didn't or twenty twenty one tour together at Heritage. Yeah, so I joined.
I was in the Trump administration at DHS, and I left and went
over to the Heritage Foundation, where I had always wanted to work. So
it was a real dream come true for me. What a time to be
at Heritage too. Oh, it was incredible. But I got there.
I started work just a few weeks before the COVID shutdown, and if you
remember, that was really an extraordinary time because that was the beginning of the
parent movement, right and that was when people's started to really wake up to
what their kids were being taught. And so I got pulled into that very
very quickly. I started working with Moms for Liberty and Moms for America both
actually, and I was traveling all over the country working with these nascent parent
groups who were trying to regain control over their children's education. And then,
of course, you know, Mike has been an incredible outspoken expert on black
lives matter and identity politics, and so, you know, we were talking
about just this whole world of cultural crisis that was going on in the United
States, and we decided that the right was not doing enough to really dissect
it and understand it and understand how we got so far, but also coming
up with a strategy to combat it. You know, we felt that that
was almost the most important thing, and in a lot of ways trying to
understand how we got here, we thought that's a key piece to developing a
strategy to comb at it. And you'll see that in the book that those
two things really go hand in hand. So I would say that would be
my response, Mike, do you have a different idea? It's very very
similar, with somewhat different taken. But first, let me say what a
pleasure it is to be on with you. Emily. We've emailed before every
time you're on the radio, and you're so brilliant, and I always send
an email to our friends saying Emily was back on again, making complete sense.
So we still be interviewing you. Look, something else was happening in
twenty twenty other than COVID, and that was the BLM riots that shocked our
society, shocked our system. We had over six hundred riots that year.
We had about twelve thousand demonstrations. So when the press is always covering for
BLM would say, well, most of the process were peaceful, they're actually
not lying. But a small percentage of twelve thousand, it's a lot.
So we have six hundred riots, as coded by by by the crisis Monitor
at Princeton. And what happened was that the gatekeepers of our cultural institutions,
who were already not had already not bought into cultural Marxism, but were now
already influenced by cultural Marxism, surrendered to They were so intimidated by the riots
that they surrendered and accepted the notion that America is systemically racist, that we
lived, that we live in systems of oppression, that the unifying cultural matrix
of American society is white supremacy, and they implemented a raft of cultural changes
that were very rapid. I remember, I had to be honest, I
have memory hold that year because I so suffered the face masks and all that,
But I have very vivid memories in August of when Major League came back
finally, the opening day was in August. I was watching with my son
in something that is so pure, such as a national pastime, was suddenly
suffused with politics, and everything was about race and something. You know,
Baseball teams are fully integrated. They had the demographically people Americans in the Caribbeans
from all walks of life, bringing together for the good of the team,
bringing their talent and to the four to win together as a team. And
all of a sudden, politics and this whole poison that we that we had
inflicted upon us in twenty twenty was being plastered all over Opening Day and that
really upset me. And it was not just that, it was the schools,
the universities, the libraries, the museums, everything that have been taken
over. So I think we wrote this book as a clarion call to our
fellow Americans that what we're seeing is an attempt at cultural genocide, an attempt
at changing completely our culture. They new President Biden has just appointed a new
head of DEI for the State Department. This is a diplomat who's supposed to
protect American interests abroad, and yet she's saying she wants complete transformation of our
system because we live in heteronormativity blah blah blah blah blah. And so we
need to face up to the fact that if you like America, if you
like its culture, and America is not perfect. American culture is not perfect,
American history is not perfect. It's full of tragedy as well as victories.
But if you think this is a good country with a good society,
with a good culture, and it is, and I think so, then
you must defend it. And what we're doing with our book is shining light
to what's being done in how we must react. And Marxism is obviously in
the title. And one thing that shines through in the book is that both
of you are history lever students of history, and you trace some of the
fascinating history through academia here and other places. And this has become I mean,
there are a lot of people who studied this on the right for years,
and you know, it's come a little bit more into the mainstream sort
of studying where this came from. Even people like Andrew Sullivan are trying to,
you know, put the pieces together at this point. But just that
phrase surrendered is so interesting to me because that means, or maybe it implies
that there was hesitation or disagreement initially. Can you talk to us a little
bit. I don't know who wants to take this question first, on the
part of the gatekeepers, as you mentioned, Mike, can you talk to
us a little bit about who sort of stormed the barricades, who stormed the
gates that the gatekeepers were holding, and where their ideas came from historically when
they started. I mean, Katie can tell you about this article we found
from the New York Times. But it does begin in the eighties. In
what it is is they children the sixties, radicals and sometimes terrorists of the
sixties begin to take over, begin to emerge, sometimes from hiding on the
ground because over terrorists like in the weather on the ground, and begin to
take over the academy and begin to take over, especially the humanities. So
that really is where it begins. They take a hold of the law school
faculties with critical race theory in nineteen eighty nine of the humanities faculties, and
they spread from their The critical race theory was kept within the confines of university
walls for the first In fact, people wrote about this in the late nineties,
but then it began to emerge, and it really is in twenty twenty
when we had the outbreak of two viruses. One is the COVID from Muhan
and the other one was critical race theory from the university. Do you want
to you like to talk about the subject? Do you want to talk about
that? Yeah? You know, as you're saying this, it just strikes
me again how in so many respects this was a revolution of elites. You
know, when I think about, for example, I mean, it's always
hard to talk about the beginning of this because you can always go back another
generation, another generation the printing press. Yes, exactly, you can go
back to Brousseau. But I think that absolutely, as Mike has said,
the sixties were a key turning point because that's when the radicals here really made
Marxism uniquely American. They they kind of gave birth to a uniquely American Marxism
you left, Yeah, which is the roots of what you know, we're
seeing the fruit of that today. But when you think about you know,
like Tom Haydenen and leaders of the Students for Democratic Society, these were you
know, elite kids saying we can't you know, we don't like our country.
We've to overthrow it. Right. It starts with that, and then
of course they go into the ghettos. They go into the inner cities in
Newark and elsewhere, they actively foment revolution, which, let's be clear,
the highest price for that was paid by the people who live there. Right,
destroyed property values, destroyed lives for years. But that wasn't enough,
Right, they wanted to go on. They ultimately many of them, a
bunch of them, became terrorists. Right. Debt it keeps you tossing and
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time, just a few blocks from here, I went into a restaurant and
it smelled like there was a gas leak. So I went into the restaurant
next door with a friend and this is I swear this is true. We
sat down, had a beer and I looked over to my left and sure
enough it was Bill Air's and never deemed doorn at a table. This was
only a couple years ago, and I thought it was so hilarious that I
one of the restaurants next door, because it's not like a Ghasolic, and
wow, and there they were, the terrorists were stowing a quiet meal together,
you know. On that note kidding, I just have to say,
on that note, that one of the you know, one of the really
fun things about doing a book in partnership with somebody else is that not only
your own learning process, but you get the benefit of their learning process.
And Mike's Mike Wroth chapter on Bill Air's okay, but he did a lot
of the deep digging on that and the it is so it was so eye
opening to me how profoundly evil that couple is. And yet they have received
awards, they have been celebrated. There they are. He is a professor
emeritus. I think today he's an education reformer. He's an education reformer.
It is it is sunny. No people need to know just how evil these
people are struggle political world. Well, I was gonna say, can you,
I mean, just camp out on that point for a moment, because
I think a lot of people and one of the things reading this part of
the book, it's stunning how much of this history has been totally memory hold.
We act like it never happened. We even like sds in general.
I don't think a lot of people journalist should be you're a Journali's addiction to
it. But the New York Times, it's amazing people my age. If
you told them what was happening on campuses in the nineteen sixties. Their jaws
would drop. I don't think they truly don't understand what was happening. And
people then still have a hard time connecting, you know, maybe the statue
terrors down, tear down, tear I don't even know. It's not like
Attorney's General, but the people who were tearing down statues in twenty twenty connecting
them to a young Bill ayers, why are those why can you draw the
line from point A to point B? Yeah? So, I mean because
you had this huge radical student movement which was very directly influenced by people like
Fidel Castro and other you know, by the Chinese, by the Vietnamese,
the North Vietnamese by Man was your favorite author. Yeah, it was a
communist from Martinique. There you go. Many avowed communists and enemies in the
United States really helped shape that student movement. But what happened by the late
sixties, these radical students started to say, our revolution is not happening the
way we wanted it to, and so several things happened at once. You
had one group that went super radical, that's the Weather Underground. They literally
went undergrounds. Yes, and they started carrying out acts of terrorism. You
know this is here's another little known fact. I think the year nineteen seventy
two there was just under two thousand bombings across the United States. Like people,
right, you don't know that. So you had the group that went
full terrorism. You had a group that went into the universities and said,
we weren't able to achieve the change we wanted through student de demonstrating and street
revolution. Let's change it through the law. And so that gave birth to
critical legal studies, which then gave rise to critical race theory. There's a
direct line which we draw. And then there was a third group that said,
well, what we really need to do is better organize, and so
there were you know, several outgrowths of that. Eric Mann, one of
the SDS members, whether underground members, actually served two years in prison.
Yeah. For Sultan Mattery. Yeah, for I thought it was attempted murder
because of a shooting. I thought it was a Sultan battery. Well he's
in the book. Yeah, So he there was a bullets shot through a
police station I think, but served two years in prison. He's now a
mainstream organizer. So in nineteen eighty nine, paid any attention to him,
No, except for us, not at all. And I would say he
really gave birth to Black Lives Matter because he trained, yeah, in identifying
and training Patrice Cool. He recruits her into his Labor Community Strategy Center.
He uses that word, by the way, this is his word which he
uses in the twenty eleven book. In other words, two years before Patric's
clar becomes famous because found in Black Lives Matter, he says he's recruited is
brilliant organizer. He has recruited her eleven years earlier, because he recruited her
in the late nineties when she was seventeen into the Labor Community Strategy Center where
he teaches organizing, and his wife teaches them Maoism and Leninism and Marxism a
knight, So they're getting at them both ways. But another one that is
key in this third stool that you described so well Katie, is Alynski.
And there was tension between Olynsky in the other two groups between because Olensky said,
you can go crazy and set off bombs, you're not going to achieve
anything what you can organize. And and and he's a history Forred approach was
organizing outside the universities. He creates Caeesar Chavez. He's the one that begins
to the first focuses on Mexican Americans in Los Angeles in southern California as a
group that he says had had revolutionary potential but needed to be organized. So
he's very key, and I believe there was a I'm working for memory here.
I think it's in the book. There was a meeting between the lens
Key and Tom Hayden in which that showed the tension between the two. But
yeah, no, it's it's it has to go back to the sixties where
several things happened. Katie mentioned the Cuban Revolution the impact that that. But
they say this, they look at Chickevarra and Fidel Castro to university educated,
one a lawyer, the only one doctor, both rich, both white,
and they say there is potential here for the university elite to lead the people.
Of course, Castro is now Castro and Czechobar are not doing that,
and Hube they're killing the people. But they're very and that's one of the
reasons why some people walk away. Horowitz walks away because they're embrace of Castro,
Irving Howe walks away because of their embrace of Castro. They're put off
by that, but these are principal leftists. But it's really then, Katie
put it very well, the creation of critical legal studies in the seventies,
which then metastasizes into critical race theory nineteen eighty nine. But it really is
when they take over again. Bill Ayres is a perfect example. That's why
Katie and I devoted a chapter to him, because he personifies metamorphosis. He
was a football he was a jock in high school. He goes to the
University of Michigan, where he radicalizes, becomes a member of SDS. In
nineteen sixty nine, he dumps SDS and establishes the Weather on the Ground,
one of the founders, and then he emerges in nineteen eighty one. I
believe when whose Cartis's attorney channel Griffin Bell when he I wish everyone I love
that. You think I would know something like that, she actually just insulted
her. He gave them some kind of amnesty. So they emerge from on
the ground. And what does he do. He goes to Teachers College,
which is which is just so full of symbolism. Because who had set up
shop at Teachers College in the thirties, the Franford School. You know,
I've had so many pictures of myself taking a teacher. I went to Columbia
to the Business School, a teacher's college because it's been defunct to so much
bad stuff in America. So Bill Ayers goes to Teachers College, gets a
PhD in education, and becomes what you know. Tom Bracock calls him an
education reformer. Soul Start says, that's like calling style and an agricultural reformer.
And he actually got an award from the Mayor of Chicago for his contribution
to education or youth. He was putting charge. He was putting charge of
deciding millions of thousand words by daily the son of the mayor. He protested
in sixty eight. It's just full of ironies. Yeah, hello, thank
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and our good times. So and I want to go back to Patrise's colors.
I don't know if you say coolers or colors, but colors. Okay.
So she's such an interesting figure and is in the book, and Eric
Mann is all over the book. But that question of next gen Marxism falls
so squarely on Patrise's colors, I think because what she does with BLM is
you know, they said self proclaimed Marxists, they were against the Nuclear family
on their website until they scrubbed that they This is something I wrote because of
something Mike wrot. But so this would have gone totally unnoticed if not for
Mike your work and people just saying, what is going on with all of
the corporate money that is being hoovered up by BLM and she turns it into
a full blown grift. She buys a mansion and you basically waste all this
money. She is doing this like cronyism with the security who's like, what,
her brother, her boyfriend. It's crazy. But people on the left,
my friends on the left, will look at that and say, tell
me how exactly that's Marxism is that why I always answer this question. First
of all, I get into arguments with radio hosts and tvOS because I say
I don't care. I don't care about the grift. I know America's we
have a rich history of grifting. Uh, you know, corruption exists,
But this is pure Marxism. Breshnev, Gorbachev and drop off Stalin, they
all had dashas in the countryside. They all had wealthy houses. Castro died
a billionaire eating lobster, while Cuban starved. You know, uh Shosku in
Romania and his wife before they did Romanians shot them were wealthy. This is
this is she has been a complete Marxist when she buys a mention. This
is what Marxist leaders are supposed to do. But yes, you're the people
on the left who argue with you on this do have a point. And
I have argued with people on the left the same way, the real orthodox
Marxist who don't recognize Graham she or George Lucas or Horkheimer or Marcus as Marxist.
First of all, Marcusa criticizes of a union, though not nearly as
much as he criticized the Western capitalists and democracies. But the main reason is
that they depart from economic determinism. They depart from the worker as the agent
of revolution. They abandoned the worker. I mentioned Evering howe or earlier he
in the sixties rights, we're all speaking of the new left. We're all
looking for a substitute proletariat. You know Howard Zinn talks about it very explicitly.
He writes, we have to we have to be disabused of the notion
that the American worker is going to lead the revolution. He is not.
Horkheimer says this in sixty nine to an interviewer. He says, we have
to stop saying that the capitalist system will produce victims, that the worker will
realize he's bereft because of the capitalist system. No, the capitalism produces wealth.
What it produces also is inequality. And he says there is a dialectic
relationship, that the dialectical relationship between justice and equality. The sorry justice,
equality and freedom, the more freedom, the less equality and justice the less
the more equality and and and justice, the less freedom. Uh. And
if you look at it from the perspective of a Marxist, he's making perfect
sense. So they abandoned that altogether an orthodox what the new Left would call
vulgar Marxists would would say. The old Marxist would say that what creates social
classes between men is their relationship to the means of production. In other words,
the owner of the factory is a bourgeois, a capitalist, and he
and his enemy of society. And the guy who toils on the factory,
with the plant, with the laithe is a proletariat, a member of the
working class, and his purpose, his mission in life is to destroy,
destroy the BOURGEOISI destroy his family, rapist wife killed him. A bloody revolution
that doesn't happen, that never happens. Marx was wrong that what the Western
capital is discovered in the nineteen twenties and thirties is that Marx had gotten all
of that wrong. And my own opinion on this is that I don't think
Marx ever met a single worker. He was a He was a middle class
guy, constantly, you know, bothering his mother and father for money.
Then he finds his sugar daddy in Frieda Angles and he's always in the London
library doing research, writing capital and Satanic poetry, and Satanic poetry. He's
very influenced by Satan. You know our friend Pauker right, just very well
about this. So I think that that is the evolution. That's one of
the evolutions. Can I interject? So I think it's it's it's so interesting,
how you know, what we've seen through history is, as Mike has
said, the worker does not revolt because the worker likes his work and he
likes to have work. Yes, to be fair, he would like to
have better working conditions. But one of the other points as well that Marx
did not foresee is that capitalism, by its nature, would create better working
conditions. Right. Those conditions improved over time and continue to improve. But
what was there was a key turning point in the nineteen fifties here in the
United States when American leftists fully said, okay, we're leaving the worker behind.
We now think the locus of revolution is going to be really young people's
students and intellectuals, people of color. That's eighteen years later, right,
that comes up more that starts to emerge in sixties, right, And and
what I find so interesting, You know, people are horrified by where Harvard
is today. But let's not forget Harvard hosted Fidel Castro months after he brought
about the revolution in Cuba as then he was some kind of hero. So
no wonder Harvard's students were embracing the concept of revolution. And by the way,
Emily, this explains why the working man is walking away from the left
today. Yes, and you cannot say anymore that if you call a worker
you're going to vote left his ticket. That just that's just did get part.
There's not a single did get part out there anymore, you know.
And the longer exisits I also to old for you on the same age as
you, I don't know what you're talking about. He was, he was
the attorney general for Jimmy Carter. Well, so on that. On that
point, the next generation, as you say, like this is the title
of the book, the next Generation of Marxism. In what ways is it
distinct from you know, it reminds me of the shows of like Degrassy next
Generation, like what is the what what makes this generation distinct? If,
as you just talked about, Patrice Colors is essentially just following the same playbook
that was laid out for her by you know, previous quote unquote Marxist leaders
and yeah, corrupted by mansions. But you just talked about sort of that
trajectory, mid century trajectory, and as you read about in the book,
and then it goes to sort of the people of color, then it goes
into the law, and then you have you know, in the nineties,
people like Camille Paulia on TV. William F. Buckley had a TV show
and Camille Poulia is writing, you know, shouting this from the rooftops.
You know, she's studied under hell A Bloom, And there was some serious
consideration to what was happening to the academy never caught on, and everyone's shocked
in twenty twenty. Are they shocked because the next generation of Marxism is just
something they never saw coming. Yes, but I think there's it's important to
point out what happened. So, as I mentioned, you had a whole
group of disoriented, disappointed social revolutionaries from the nineteen sixties, these student activists
who said, our revolution's not working on the streets, let's use the law.
And so they went into the law schools and they developed critical legal studies
and they absolutely had a Marxist worldview, which was this notion of opposition,
right, not oh, we can use the law to improve things. No,
we have to tear down the law. The law. Yeah, use
the law to tear down the existing system and create a whole new system.
But here's what happened that I think is so interesting. These lawyers, except
for maybe one or two, were all white men. Their students were people
of different ethnicities, different color, a lot of women. Kimberly Crenshaw.
Yeah, exactly. And you you about ten twenty years past, and the
faculty of the law schools are not changing, but you've had all these students
rise up. So that's where you get this group of different They were fundamentally
had been students of these lawyers, of these professors, and they say,
you know what, white men, we've had enough for you. Time for
you to hand over exactly the reason, Yeah, those leave the field of
the civil rights. They said you have no you have no place here anymore.
And they took over. And that was in nineteen eighty nine. That
was, yeah, the lead the field civil rights to take your talents elsewhere,
and that was the birth of critical race theory. But to come back
to the point, racism, yes, yeah, aaps one hundred percent.
Yeah, we're going to look at the world through race now. So that
is, and and other things started to get brought in as well. You
know, you had the whole notion of intersectionality. Right, it's not just
yeah, it's not just races, it's ethnicity, its gender. Then it
becomes sexual orientation and all of this. But to come back to the point
that we started with this year, this was nineteen eighty nine that this conference
happened. It was such a pivotal year because, as we mentioned, Mike
had found this incredible article by a Felicity Barranger, who had been a former
Moscow bureau chief for the New York Times, who knew communism, who knew
I understood communism, and said, communism has I mean Marxism has now gone
mainstream in US colleges and universities. Yeah, while it is losing in Eastern
Europe. Yes, and probably through this it will survive. But I my
personal theory about this is, and I think Mike shares this view because the
people who understood that, those who understood that Marxism is a threat, that
Marxism is not a good thing. We were all looking at Central and Eastern
Europe and we thought it was done. We thought, Okay, history is
finished, right, and so people weren't paying attention to what was going on
here at home, and that's how I think it was able, you know,
in eighty nine. But I have my own theory on this, which
it's not I didn't put in the book. Just so happens, by the
way, that Katie was in Eastern Europe in eighty nine, what country no
went I was watching? I did not go over until ninety and then I
spent the next eighteen years actually first researching in Eastern Europe and then living there
for twelve years. United. So I'm in Hong Kong. I'm in Hong
Kong as a correspondent, and I covered the Tenem Square marches. I actually
cried. I remember myself crying on June fourth, nineteen eighty nine, when
the kids were massacred. I don't cry very often. I remember crying with
my girlfriend as we were watching this on TV. But we thought that Chinese
communism was going to go the way of Soviet Communism in Eastern European communism.
We're wrong. But you ask a very good question when you bring up Camio
Pallia and Herold Bloom, Because there were people who were twigging onto this.
There were people Herold Bloom. Obviously, I think his closing with the American
mind. I think he may have been eighty eight. I don't want to
look it up right now, but I think it was publishing eighty eight.
Coustal Feminism is ninety four. Peter Thiel writes the first book about identity politics
on Stanford in nineteen ninety four. He has a co author as well,
Norman pod Horitz, rights in the National you know in commentary in nineteen ninety
six, we're all Graham seenes now, you know. Don't worry. We've
understood the culture. So I think intellectuals and key places are beginning to understand
what is happening. But I think happened is not only were we looking at
Eastern Europe in the early nineties, but then nine to eleven happened. On
nine to eleven, all our minds, the best minds in conservatism were focused
on what to do about the enemy without this lam of fascist enemy. I
myself was in Brussels with a Wall Street journal on nine to eleven, and
I devoted my attention completely to this through the contacts that I had made in
West European capitals and these European capitals. I was traveling the continent extensively,
and I think that happened to a lot of people. And that's why one
of the reasons, and it does sound like an excuse, but it is
an explanation, not an excuse why so many of us took our mind off
the ball when it comes to the cultural takeover of the institutions. Does that
sound to somebody a few generation. Does this sound like an excuse or it
doesn't sound like an excuse. It sounds like it sounds like everyone was busy
paying attention to other things and didn't realize especially actually, I think after nine
to eleven, and people even younger than myself, how profoundly the foundation had
kind of been eroded, so that these seeds were really when they were planted,
they bore fruit in the minds of young people because in academia they were
being taught things like Howard zen and Zenism, which was number one best selling
book. By the way, I think in history to this day it might
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You know. Here's my last kind of question for both of you from this
is I remember interviewing Lee Edwards, obviously a long time historian of the conservative
movement. I'm sure both of you know doctor Edwards. He was in the
summer of twenty twenty. He was on the show and my colleague Christopher Bedford,
and I asked him, is it worse now than nineteen sixty eight?
And Lee was in Chicago in nineteen sixty eight and he saw the riots himself,
and LI said yes. He said, because most people can't sit down
and just sort of talk things through anymore. At the end of the day.
In nineteen sixty eight, most Americans could, at the end of the
day go to their dinner table and talk these things through. Yes there were
the radicals, but at the end of the day, most people had some
sort of consensus. Paraphrasing what Li said, and that's really a question about
next generation Marxism. That's really what he's getting at. And so is there
something actually worse about this next generation? And maybe we can leave people on
a thoroughly pessimistic and I think it's more dangerous because they have made such inroads.
But I think the American people have woken up to a much greater degree
than the American people were in nineteen sixty eight, although in naeteen sixty eight
most Americans were not hippies. Nixon won Wona resounding, not as much as
resounding victory in nineteen sixty eight as he won in seventy two. But let's
not forget that Nixon won. You know, MC government lost and he were
Humphrey lost. Because of this surrender, the overwhelming surrender of the leaders of
our cultural institutions in twenty twenty and the crazy stuff that they have implemented since
then. In the last four years, the American people have woken up and
said no, no, no, no, no, no, we don't
want this. And I think we have the American people on our side,
and I think I let Katie respond now, But I think what Katie and
I are trying to do is trying to give the American people the help they
need by e learning policymakers saying, hey, you got to help the American
people. You have to give them the policies that they need to fight this
back, and Katie turning to you. I just want to add one thing
to that, because Mike made me think of it. One thing that terrifies
me about this next generation of Marxist is I don't think they even understand Marxism.
And when you look back at the writings of people, I mean,
sure there are hangers on in the sixties, but there was a sort of
serious intellectual effort happening, whereas today you have the bin Laden letter going viral
on TikTok and people just being like, oh wow, I didn't know America
did all of this. I'm going to join the bandwagon. To me,
that seems extra terrifying. I don't if you agree with that, but I'm
curious for your thoughts. Yeah, well, I just want to point out
though, going back to your quote from Lee Edwards, who we love and
admire, you know, the other really big difference between what was happening in
the sixties and what's happening today is that in the sixties, you know,
these students were extremely isolated. They did not have support, not just from
the American people, but from local government. And you know, it still
blows my mind that our Washington, d c. Government paid tax dollars to
paint Black Lives Matter on the street and you're seeing this quote in the Smithsonian,
in the Museum of African American. Yeah, and Marael Baser's a fairly
corporate democrat, hardly a sort of trained Marxist, right exactly. But I
would agree with Mike that it's really there is one hundred percent something happening amongst
the American people. And it's not just you know, the the American people
in the heartland. I think it's you know, African Americans, Hispanics in
the cities. I think the cities, the people have you know, subjected
to these failed democratic policies in cities are fed up with the crime, the
mental illness issues, the fentanel issues, the drug issues, the economic issues.
I mean, yes, I think there's just a lot of people upset.
You know. As for whether people really understand today what's going on,
I mean, I still think as much as I'm optimistic about the American people,
what concerns me is the universities. Because the universities, one percent are
are factories of indoctrination right now. And honestly, to be fair, too
many of our schools K through twelve have become that way as well. And
I know some people see it, but if you pay close attention to the
way, even like English lessons and math lessons in K through twelve are starting
to carry this this you know what is fundamentally Marxist and anti American people should
be really frightened. Let me just keep very warning here, by the way,
because people listening will say, well, I believe in these things and
I'm not a Marxist. There you know, there are different layers of this.
There are people are cultural gatekeepers who are Marxists, say the Marxist.
There are some who are influenced by neo Marxist like got Graham, she and
Marcus and Fuco. And then there are those who are not influenced by any
of this, but still have bought into these ideas. And what I say
all the time is if you believe in in deficit spending or in racing taxes
definitis spending to grow the economy, on racing taxes to thought of the economy,
you may never have heard the word the name John Maynard Kanes, but
you're still a Knesian. And you if you, if you may be using
Shakespeare in phrases all day along with unknowing that you quoting Shakespeare. You know,
a rose is just a sweet even by another name. You know,
we use Shakespeare in the King James Bible constantly in the English language, not
knowing that we're not consciously doing that. So it's the matrix the ideas.
So these people may say, well, I'm not a Marxist, yet if
they look at the world through the prism of the oppressor versus oppressed, if
they buy into a lot of these shibolettes, they are influenced by these Marxist
ideas that Katie and I are talking about. And one thing I really like
in this book, and I think gets left out a lot of the history,
is the sort of internationalism. And you guys write about the globalism of
the broad leftist projects. So I can't recommend this enough, especially for people
who think just would be interested in the history and maybe their minds would be
changed just by the history and sort of understanding the legacy of where these ideas
come from. So, Mike Gonzalez and Catherine Gorga, thank you so much.
And the book is called Next Gen Marxism, what it is and how
to combat it. I hope to have you guys back and do this again.
It was so much fun. Thank you, Thank you. It was
a lot of fun for me. Thank you. Of course you've been listening
to another edition of the Federalist Radio Hour. I'm Emil Jaschinski, culture editor
here at the Federalists. Will be back soon with more. Until then,
be lovers of freedom and anxious for the fray.