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Welcome to Destiny. Now here's your
host, Cliff Dunning. Hey, what's

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going on. I hope you're doing
well. Welcome to Destiny. You know,

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I just go back from being on
the freeway here in northern California.

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We're experiencing the atmospheric river effect of
rain deluge, and I was on the

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freeway and the rain was coming down
so hard that everybody that was on the

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freeway and there were after that many
cars had slowed down to about forty miles

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an hour. It was. It
freaks out because the water is coming down

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at such a rate and with such
fury, because there's wind involved that it's

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bombarding the car. And I can
see I could I was driving by.

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I could see people's eyes like wide
open, like what the hell am I

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driving through. It's like amazing,
but kind of scary, and I really

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don't want to drive. Well,
this is happening, and I think most

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people that are on the road want
to get off the road as soon as

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possible, you know. And we're
dealing with weekdays, so people are coming

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and going from work, shopping,
doing their regular chores and and drives,

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and it's it's it's a challenge you
don't want to be on the road in

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an atmospheric river. I don't know. If you haven't been in one,

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I don't advise it. Go on
YouTube and view somebody driving through an atmospheric

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river. They're not made to do
anything but stay indoors and let them pass.

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We have pretty much all of California
has for the next four to six

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days heavy duty rain, very very
heavy duty. And we had this last

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year and we're talking about five inches
to six inches of rain in twenty four

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hours. That is insane. And
we've already somewhat saturated our land. Here.

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I'm kind of getting into northern California
and it's so saturated that we get

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landslides. And just north of me
is the beautiful nap of Valley. And

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last year when this happened, they
had hills collapsing into vineyards. There were

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areas above Napa, Calistoga and above
that were flooded. Streets were flooded.

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And that's more rural California. The
big cities can help most of the time.

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They can drain off the water,
but even San Francisco last year,

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during a number of atmospheric rivers,
was flooding. Downtown was flooding, So

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it's a really interesting phenomenon. I
don't know who came up with the term

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atmospheric river, but it really is
apropos for and a good definition for this

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kind of heavy, heavy rain that
is non stop and it's like it's like

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a cloud packed with water just unloads. It's kind of weird. So you'll

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probably hear about it in the coming
weeks, if not sooner, what the

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effect is on different landscapes in California. Because it is nothing to full around

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with, you want to stay indoors. This week we're dealing with levels of

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reality, levels of conscious creation,
and we've had people on Destiny before talking

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about the effects of collective consciousness,
the effects of previous epochs, previous periods

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of mankind creating a lifestyle that has
levels of consciousness creation. You're actively working,

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and you are in harmony with Gaya. It's looking more and more like

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the previous epoch we're talking about likely
on go going periods from one two hundred

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thousand years ago right up to ninety
five hundred during the Younger dreat which was

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a catastrophic event that wiped out I
think the guests is eighty to ninety percent

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of humanity and megafauna, which are
that's another word for big animals and creatures

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on the land that were destroyed,
that were killed. And you're gonna hear

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about this on Saturday when I have
Chris Donne on the program, and that

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was a fascinating interview. But it
really looks like the previous civilization was more

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echo based, eco harmonized, and
they understood earth energies and so forth and

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so on. We have a little
bit of that focus now, but because

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technology is so dominant in our society, we don't we've kind of lost touch

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with with the Gaya in many ways. And I mean, I see people

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throwing junk out of their cars,
polluting, but it's not necessarily that behavior

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that's the most detrimental. It's things
like nuclear energy, which produces deadly poison.

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I think one of the great problems, and I mentioned this today,

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is the fact that we're pharmacologically based
society, and that means that we don't

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look to our body, our mind, and we're not trained and taught how

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to understand the ebbs and flows of
being human, the human condition, and

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what happens is when we don't feel
well, when we have an illness,

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we go to our doctor and the
medical wellness it's not even wellness, it's

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illness. Paradigm is all about ugging
us up. Now, when you have

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an ache and a pain and you're
drugged given a drug to ease that,

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that just pushes the symptom further in
the body. And I've talked about this

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before, We've had people on the
program before. When you begin doing that,

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you can begin stuffing symptoms and not
correcting them holistically. Then you're beginning

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to cause more and more problems,
more and more aches and pains. In

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many cases, this is the beginning
of what they call a detriment or a

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degenerative condition. This is things like
arthritis. This is things like digestive problems,

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irritable bowel syndrome, neurology issues where
you got numbing of the hands,

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of the extremities of the feet.
These are all symptoms that are not being

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cared for. And it's amazing.
I am on the same boat. I

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sit on my can for most of
the day and work and you know,

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do the podcast, and I'm writing
and communicating, and I have just made

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it kind of an important part of
my life to walk at least thirty to

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forty five minutes a day. And
I can't tell you how amazingly important that

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is. To do some form of
physical activity every single day is critical to

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our health. Not only have I
dropped a bunch of weight, but I

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just feel better. It's like an
activator for health when you are physically active.

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On top of that, I have
eliminated, you know, the greasy

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foods, the fast foods. It's
so easy. And that's the other thing.

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Our diet in America is just herrootious, atrocious it is. You know

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this fast food food consciousness is so
easy, but it's such a terrible food

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to consume. You know McDonald's,
I mean, you know what I'm talking

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about, any of those fast few
places. And then and then the other

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day I was looking at it was
a it was a documentary on wheat gluten

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and it all what it does is
it caused. It causes inflammation and people

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that have weight problems, and you
see a lot of obese people in America.

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It's inflammation. The body is screaming, get this crap out of my

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system. Our gluten, our wheat
is is uh inflammation producing and it's causing

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massive health issues and I was watching
a video that done from a German physician

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who tested the wheats in Europe and
in America and in China, and the

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wheat production in America and the breads
that are produced and the pastries that are

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produced are not good for us.
In fact, it's not a good strain.

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In fact, basically the guy was
saying, you got to eat organic

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week. And that's really a challenge. If you live in an area that

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doesn't have organic products, or there's
no consciousness around organic foods, forget it.

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You're screwed. So what do we
do. We do the best we

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can. We try to stay healthy. Exercise is so critical. I'm really

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finding this out, you know.
And the older you get, the more

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critically important it is. To keep
the machine active, to keep the machine

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oiled. The body helps the mind
and helps the spirit. So today's program

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is the inversion how we have been
tricked into perceiving a false reality. And

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my guest is Kingsley L Dennis.
Shauba Tours is well organized. Everything flowed

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easily. It was a fantastic tour
from beginning to end. To be honest,

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I was shocked by the private visits. I could not believe that we

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were lucky enough to experience those.
That's from one of the many people who

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do the Earth Ancients Grand Egyptian Tour
every year. We're in our fifth year

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and we're looking forward to our next
program. That's this April twenty eighth through

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May fifth, and it is a
tour of ancient sites and it's a private

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tour with our host, Mohammed and
who is a wonderful world class post and

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tour guide. We have a few
spots left and this is an invitation to

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you to come out and join us
in what can only be described as a

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VIP tour of Egypt. These are
private sites we go to for the most

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part. This is a view of
some of the most intriguing sites, including

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the Great Pyramid, Hathor Temple,
the Bent Pyramid, the Red Pyramid,

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so much more, and then we
cruise on the Nile. This is a

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way to really take in the ancient
past and from start to finish, the

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food, the beverages and the environment
is first class. For more information,

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please go to Earthancients dot com forward
slash tours all the informations there. The

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Earth Ancients Grand Egyptian Tour April twenty
eighth through May ninth. There's a big

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question about reality creation here in the
United States, actually worldwide. There's been

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a number of fascinating looks at reality
in movies like The Matrix, Chris Nolan's

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Inception, and there's been a series
of articles and books that challenge our native

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respective on our reality. And if
you've been following along with Destiny and Earth

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Ancients, we are curious about the
previous epoch, the civilization that was around

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prior to this Younger, Dryest period
that we believe wiped out probably eighty to

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eighty five percent of the population of
the Earth. My guest today has written

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a book that also questions reality.
It's called The Inversion. How we have

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been tricked into perceiving a false reality. And we're going to talk about his

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perception, his take on human development, and also how we perceive our reality.

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My guest today is Kingsley Dennis,
and he is a full time writer,

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researcher, and publisher. He's the
author of over twenty books, including

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Hitchhiking Reality, Healing the Wounded Mind, The Phoenix Generation, and New Consciousness

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for a New World. These are
all great titles. I had a chance

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to look at most of this book
The Inversion, and I was pleasantly surprised

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at some of the topics he was. So we're gonna talk to him today

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and get a sense of what he's
talking about. So, Kingsley, welcome

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to Destiny. Great to see you, all right, Cliff, greaty to

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be here. Thanks for the invite. All right. The first thing I

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have to ask you is are you
sensing a what you're calling an inversion of

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our reality or a manipulation of what
we're sensing? Oh, for sure,

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especially in the last in the last
few years, it's coming more to the

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fall. I think it's the perception
of the reality construction which is coming to

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the fall. The fact that our
reality conflict has always been let's say managed,

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is always without doubt. I mean, because of course, whoever kind

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of controls the narratives the stores that
we live our lives by those stories kind

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of construct our narratives, and so
you know, we've never really questioned them

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as a species because we haven't been
so involved in the in the information flows.

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In past epochs, information flows were
one way, mostly top down,

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people received information from a place of
authority. In the past, that was

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let's say, religious authority. Then
we had the priest kings, then we

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had the monarchies, you know,
and then we had the one way,

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you know, in communication through televisions. Let's say, so the narrative was

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always was always constructed, and so
you know, and you can, I

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mean, that's understandable. We've gone
through epochs where we were told the Earth

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was flat, We're told that Earth
was the center of the universe, and

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that the whole you know, the
sun went around the Earth. These were

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narratives that we were moving through,
and we moved through those in epochs.

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What's happening now, of course,
is that the information flows and now you

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know, kind of multiplicity, and
we're participating in that, and the people

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are now being able to engage in
their own information retrieval and research investigation.

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So they're questioning the narratives. And
we have not only questioned the narratives,

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but we have more information available to
see through the dominant narratives. And so

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because of that, we're now deconstructing
that. And not only that, but

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I think we're coming to a time
of criticality because when human civilization and cultures

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are mostly stable and for a long
time, we've gone through you know,

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centuries of stability. Well, you
don't question anything because your culture is stable.

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When your culture starts to kind of
become unstable because of your breakdown in

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communication, breakdown in your structures and
your institutions, you start to see,

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let's say, the cracks in the
egg, so to speak. You know,

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and when you see the cracks,
who investigate them and you realize that

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our reality construction isn't as you know, as stable as we thought it was.

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And that's exactly what's been happening in
the last couple of decades, but

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specifically, I think in the last
few years, and so it's really a

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prime time for seeing how how what
we understand of the world is mostly through

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a conditioning process. Talk a little
bit about your sense of the previous epoch,

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and when I say previous epoch,
I'm talking perhaps nine five hundred years

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ago, because that's the younger,
driest period, the end of the Ice

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Age, and we have a sense
of pre blood what they call Prediluvian people

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that are written about in the cuneiforms
that the Sumerians write about, and it

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seems like they were more earth based
and had more of a connection with Gaya

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and didn't have the same energy producing
devices, didn't have the same mental,

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physical, and spiritual stresses that we
have on today. And perhaps they were

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they moved and they they worked more
elegantly among themselves to create society, to

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create science, and to live in
harmony. Yeah, I like that phrase

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you used to use more elegantly.
I think that's really I think that's correct.

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It's spot on, because it seemed
to be that there's a coherence in

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our in our environment, in our
life circumstances, which we don't have the

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same degree now and each epoch,
of course, you know, you have

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we have to understand that what we
what we conceive as human consciousness is not

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the same in different epochs, because
our consciousness now, let's say, is

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a more kind of rationally based,
and we work through our figures and and

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language and the alphabet, because the
alphabet, you know, kind of shape

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human consciousness the way we think our
thinking patterns. Now, when you go

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back to these older these older AONs
or epochs, as you say, I

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think humanity had a more symbolic understanding
of consciousness. We worked through images and

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forms, and we we understood our
place in the world differently, And this

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is very important because Joseph Campbell said
that humanity has kind of a rituals that

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we understand our reality, and they
are he mentioned five core ones. They

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are mystical, cosmological, psychological,
psychological, and editorial. Now, the

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mystical is how we understand our purpose, you know, what we think of

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as human life. Cosmological, how
we fit into our world around us in

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the larger scheme. Sociological, how
we understand our relations between ourselves as human

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beings and as tribes and communities.
Psychological is our thinking patterns and beliefs,

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and editorial are the things in life
which can edit and manage how we understand,

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you know, these these belief sets. So they those rituals that Campbell

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were talking about were very different,
like say in the in the time of

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the Prediluvi or anti Deluvian times,
because we had different ways of understand the

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world, very symbolic, very kind
of animistic. Everything contained, contained consciousness

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or contained some some life. And
so the cosmos wasn't some far out,

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mechanistic out there separate space. It
was a larger part of our environment.

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And so you know, our our
kind of ancestors looked at the stars to

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see how life was was shifting and
moving, you see. So I think

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there was a there was a greater
degree of integration in the larger picture,

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and that that integration has been now
fragmented because we've gone to a time of

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mechanistic thinking, and so history now
is kind of split away from the bigger

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picture. And that's a prime that's
a prime problem of our times. I

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think, Cliff is that we're looking
through a smaller lens and not seeing the

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bigger picture, which I think our
ancestors lived within the bigger picture. Talk

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about our mechanized society and it's uh
influence on human psychology. I think you

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present that in a way. And
we're going to talk about artificial intelligence here

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in a minute, and that's the
future. But what is it about our

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society that is so critically problematic In
the human condition? Well, my sense

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is that the human condition is primarily
primarily let's say spiritual. I don't mean

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that in a religious sense. I
mean that in a greater sense. Is

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that the human condition is connected to
something beyond itself, larger than itself.

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The human condition on this planet is
connected to its place in the cosmic scheme,

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and I think this has always been
part of our civilizational growth for AONs

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in the past. What's happened,
of course, is that I think we've

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been cut off from what I may
call to use our phrase spiritual intelligence,

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intelligence and spirituality. I feel my
sense is that in the past it was

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one thing was integrated, yeah,
you know, and we didn't have these

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names. You were a human being
in a cosmological framework. Of course,

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Now we have these categories, and
spiritualized intelligence was an intelligence knowing that we

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are connected to both you know,
as above so below in a human life,

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to a greater kind of cycles,
you know, the Vedas and the

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other traditions. I've understood these grander
cycles, and we understand them, of

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of course, in geological cycles also
in the as well that we go through

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these phases, which you know,
I'm sure you've touched upon in the Ancient

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podcast. But of course, I
think what's happened recently is that these things,

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because of this this kind of division, we've cut off our spiritual connection

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and sense, and we try to
see the human being as a rational kind

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of logic based kind of being individualized. Now, to be individualized is not

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bad in the sense that we are
individual personalities, but when you cut that

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off from a larger sauce. And
I think what that's done is that it's

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slowly been pushing out not only the
spiritual, but what I call the metaphysical

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or the transcendental impulse. Is that
we don't feel that we are receiving transcendental

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or spiritual impulses. We are now
a kind of individualized human beings on a

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planet living in dead space, you
know, going through enterpy and decay,

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and that is a totally deharmonizing and
also a demotivating kind of understanding and philosophy.

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So I think we've something's cut us
off from our sense of this larger

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cosmological picture. How damaging is the
pharmacological model in wellness? I think,

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and I want your opinion on this. I think that because we depend on

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drugs for our healing modalities, we've
lost a sense of our body, mind

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and spirit because drugs are so powerful
today that they affect all three phases of

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humanity. But in your model,
the inversion model, where does pharmacology play

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a part? Because I feel I'm
really interested in your opinion that it is

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overwhelmingly damaging, and that's a very
good question. I'm glad you asked me,

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because I think it's so relevant it
ties into the whole transhumanist kind of

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argument about the human body. I
mean, I mean, I have a

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chapter in the book called the body
is the Holy Host, because you know,

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the body has been seen as the
vessel, you know, in antiquity.

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And then let's say, spiritual tradition, the body is the vest which

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the spirit and soul incarnates into.
So it's a combination of the physical flesh

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and the holy spirit, and the
body therefore is a kind of temporary vehicle,

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and it's hosting it's hosting a spirit. And I feel that what you

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call the what you mentioned as a
pharmaceutical industry, I call the illness industry

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because it's profit based. The profits
are based on illness, not wellness.

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And so you know, this is
our indication of the fragmentation of the modern

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society whereby, you know, we
think of wellness through a pharmaceutical, chemicalized

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industry which is based on profits because
of the shareholders, so it's completely divorced

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from they don't want you to be
completely well because that loses their kind of

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position with their shareholders. And so
we all know that when they're looking at

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the curing you. They're looking at
taking away the symptoms, but not the

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cause. And also this is something
which I called the and I started off

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in a prior book called Hijack and
Reality. I call it the weak body

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hypothesis. Is that if this industry
or modern society can can condition us to

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understand, to believe that the human
body is inherently weak. You know,

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we get ill, you know,
we have you know, we have flu,

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and we need to be take medicine, et cetera, then it gives

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it starts to lose our faith from
the body, and we start to buy

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into the fact that maybe we can, we can augment ourselves and we can

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kind of move away from this this
kind of carbon weakness. And that's another

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thing. You know, the carbon
body is such a resilient. It's a

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it's a self organizing system the human
body, which you know, it knows

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how to to respond to to information, to feedback loops, and to adapt

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itself. It's so resilient. But
of course we think of it, or

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we've been conditioned to think of it, is this mechan clockwork model. Something

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goes wrong, you know, throw
a spanner or throw a medicine at it.

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Rather than looking at the kind of
integrated wholeness, holistic nature. And

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I think that we've been I think
that narrative has been hijacked by the pharmaceutical

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industry. So we move away from
this this sensory nature of the body.

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And just to finish off Cliff,
you know, earlier in even early religious

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traditions Christian and Catholic, they talked
about the sensory nature of the body is

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very important. So it's very tactile. We had integration between spirit and body

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and that's been divorced, which is
also part of these critical times. You

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said something really powerful, Kingsley,
you said that with the pharmaceutical model,

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we have lost faith in our bodies. That is right on, and it's

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not just the body, it's the
mind. And then as we incarnate in

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an old body, our source,
the soul is the spirit. And if

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we don't have an ability to connect
with our spirit, I think we die.

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Part of us dies. And so
are we walking around like automatons,

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like robots because we're infused with medicines. And what does the future look like

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with that model? Because this right
now in the United States, allopathic therapy,

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drugs, surgery, and if you
have a degenerative disease radiation. That's

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their healing model. Most doctors or
allopaths don't have anything to do with nutrition

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or psychic or spiritual awareness, any
other healing modilities other than these three extremely

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powerful modes of healing. Yeah.
Well, these are the big questions and

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of the questions of our time because
we've been now obviously being taken away from

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faith in our bodies. Hence that
you know, the faith in kind of

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augmentation. I mean, I can
mention, I can mention some great teachers

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who talked about that. I don't
want to kind of throw names out,

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but people may be familiar with the
Gikujief, the the Gujif, the Fourth

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Way teacher, and he said many
times that human beings are automatons. We're

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just sleepwalking, and you know,
we're not even aware of the different We're

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not even aware of the innate intelligence
of the body, because we have the

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body has a mental, physical and
emotional side to the body as well.

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And even to mention Rudolph steinos some
people may be aware or with anthroposophy.

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He was very direct in saying that, and he said this one hundred years

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ago in the nineteen twenties that said
down the line materialism the material society are

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going to invent ways through modern medicine. I don't want to mention the word

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here because of censorship, but through
certain modern medicine they can cut off the

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body's contact with the soul. Can
you mention that specifically? In nineteen twenties

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and he said that there will be
more and more children being cut off from

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their innate contact to their spirit consciousness. Wow. So I think it's very

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important subject that the body is a
vessel, but oh not only a vessel.

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It's an interface between the incarnated spirit
consciousness. And if we block that

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off, then the body literally literally
becomes a soulless body, just an automatum.

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Very important to have contact with the
innate soul, spirit consciousness. I

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want to touch on one area then
I want to get into the current reality

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construct and that is where do you
see and you don't talk about it that

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much in your book, but where
do you see plan medicines helping us a

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rise above the autamentation of our society? Do they help? Do they hinder?

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We know that the indigenous people used
plant medicines for vision quests and things

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like that, but what do you
see their place today. I do think

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it's important if it's in harmony with
a person's life. Now. I mean

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the problem you're talking about people taking
let's say, certain medicines for vision quests.

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That's been done since time memorial,
and that's perfectly in line with human

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cultural evolution. The problem is,
of course, if we're living in in

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a siety which is trying to stigmatize
and divide these elements, I e.

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You live, you live in a
modern society, and these plant extracts are

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something other, then you're you know, by othering it, you're creating a

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false kind of connection to it.
I think it's the correct way if we

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integrated. And I think that the
major kind of split, which is going

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through whatever In all the things I
talk about, the main split is organic

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and inorganic. Doesn't matter if it's
plant medicine or other medicine, or food

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stuffs or lifestyles. I think the
major kind of understanding is is it organic

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or inorganic? Because anything organic has
evolved on this planet, and if it's

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involved on this planet, then it's
evolved to be a kind of in harmony

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to the species on this planet.
Because the human body has gone through you

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know, many iterations of chained on
this planet. I'm not talking about down

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winning evolution because that is a flawed
model, but there's there's some you know,

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there's some elements to it that we
go through adaptation to our environment.

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Plants and food stuff which are organic
and native to this planet and inherently have

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a place with human cultural evolution.
And that's why I think vision quests done

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in integration of this and in harmony
is perfectly fine and can be valid.

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But is when society tries to divide
these things and stigmatize them and we lose

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the connection. I always say,
you know, if a person wants to

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get down this path, the most
important thing is their state of mind and

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condition when they integrate with these aspects. And modern and modernity, especially Western

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modernity, has created a schism in
the human mind. People are worried,

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or they're frantic, or they're excited, or they pay a thousand dollars to

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go to these you know, excursions
to take these vision quests. That's not

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the right way to be prepared.
But when you integrate, it's perfect natural.

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I think what you're saying is you
should have an intention when you're using

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this plant medicine so that you get
the full benefits of connecting body, mind,

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and spirit. Is that what you're
suggesting, Yeah, because you know,

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plant medice has an intelligence to it. Yeah, yeah, it has

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its own inherent intelligence. So I
think the best way is to try to

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try to create a bridge to connect
with the intelligence so you can communicate with

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it and say, you know,
I want to connect with you. I'm

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not some you know, I'm not
some crazy dude just doing this, you

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know, for an excursion or holiday. You need to respect the intelligence you're

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communicating with, same as between human
beings, between humans, animals, and

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humans and plants. It's a respect
of the different forms of intelligence. Tell

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me what you feel is the current
construct who's behind it. There's a great

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deal of study and now evidence that
panspermia, the seating of our planet,

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is a real thing, and that
we're getting spores with perhaps DNA that have

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biological data in it. This has
been going on for tens of thousands,

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if now hundreds of thousands of years
or is it just evolution and we are

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developing and evolving in a natural pace
and what's happening now is just part of

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you know, the natural evolution cycle. I mean, that's the big six

383
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to four thousand dollars question. And
you know, I don't think I don't

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think neither of us have the money
to answer it, you know completely,

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you know, I mean, I'll
give you my personal view. I don't

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feel that life on this planet came
about through a vacuum. I mean,

387
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there is no vacuum in space,
in the cosmos, in the universe.

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You know. And you mentioned pan
sperm when in fact, the co discoverer

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of DNA, Francis Crick, wrote
the book Life Itself, and he actually

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sided on the side of directly panspermia, which is a you know, a

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further kind of version of that.
You know, pansperm is when bacteria and

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life can arrive on the back of
meteorites that are comets or meteorites that land

393
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on this Earth. So it's a
kind of you know, random or coincidental

394
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contact between a planet and living bacteria. But directly pant sperm which Francis Creek

395
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was quite a supporter of, says
that you can have some form of intentional

396
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delivery device. Maybe another species wanted
to deliver bacterial DNA to this planet so

397
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that they there and then leave it
for a natural growth, you know,

398
00:37:31.119 --> 00:37:35.800
sap me for a minute. Did
you see another species? Yeah? Okay,

399
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so that's ets right, Well what
we may call ET's, but I

400
00:37:38.519 --> 00:37:42.440
mean I don't like to call them. Yes, been calling met's, but

401
00:37:42.519 --> 00:37:45.760
other intelligences. Okay, Now Francis
Creek. And this isn't unbelievable. The

402
00:37:45.800 --> 00:37:54.440
co discovery of DNA actually was supporting
it and proposed this theory. So panspermia

403
00:37:54.519 --> 00:37:59.360
is when bacteria and DNA arrive by
accident, just by as I said on

404
00:37:59.400 --> 00:38:05.400
the back of meat, right directed. Panspermia is when the delivery of those

405
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carriages of DNA is intentional, you
know. So it's it's it's a hypothesis

406
00:38:10.199 --> 00:38:16.360
which has been out there in valid
circles. So I mean, the case

407
00:38:16.440 --> 00:38:20.599
is not closed. But what I
what I would say is that the whole

408
00:38:20.639 --> 00:38:24.000
cosmos is teeming with life. This
is my understanding, and so I don't

409
00:38:24.039 --> 00:38:28.840
feel that just life is just you
know, on this on this kind of

410
00:38:28.880 --> 00:38:32.000
planet. It's you know, it's
in many different variations across the cosmos.

411
00:38:32.039 --> 00:38:37.880
Because the cosmosis is unbelievably beyond our
imaginations. We can't conceive of the trillions

412
00:38:37.880 --> 00:38:44.960
and trillism or trillions of star systems. So I think our and our our

413
00:38:45.119 --> 00:38:49.239
kind of the way we frame life
is quite myopic, quite limited. We

414
00:38:49.280 --> 00:38:52.760
think it has to be a bipedal
kind of humanoid figure. I think life

415
00:38:52.840 --> 00:38:57.000
can be many things. Life can
be, you know, species in different

416
00:38:57.039 --> 00:39:01.920
forms, in different states of matter
as well. And so you know,

417
00:39:02.119 --> 00:39:06.159
the case is still owed. But
we are on this planet. We are

418
00:39:06.199 --> 00:39:10.480
open to radiation, cosmic radiation,
you know, em blasts and sun flares

419
00:39:10.559 --> 00:39:15.519
and plasma blasts from the galactic center, all this stuff. So I think

420
00:39:15.599 --> 00:39:22.880
we have an interconnection with mechanisms of
life. How how our specific life form

421
00:39:22.920 --> 00:39:25.719
on the planet, I cannot say, but it's within a very very large

422
00:39:25.719 --> 00:39:30.719
ballpark. Yeah, I kind of
wanted to get your take on that,

423
00:39:30.840 --> 00:39:40.119
because this influence of panspermia may help
us evolve and become more sensitive to our

424
00:39:40.159 --> 00:39:49.159
mental and spiritual sides and less physical
focus, which is our bodies, you

425
00:39:49.199 --> 00:39:53.400
know, be more spiritual minded.
So just curious on that one. In

426
00:39:53.440 --> 00:40:00.920
your book, you write that our
history is a mosaic of experiences. How

427
00:40:01.199 --> 00:40:08.119
do we interpret that in the context
of this book the inversion? Ah,

428
00:40:08.199 --> 00:40:17.199
do we go with the flow or
are there unseen and we're again we're gonna

429
00:40:17.199 --> 00:40:22.039
talk about AI here in a second. But are there unseen influences that we

430
00:40:22.239 --> 00:40:30.800
create, that are unseen and that
move us forward in our in our history.

431
00:40:31.039 --> 00:40:35.719
I think, I mean, I
think there's always unesten influences different degrees.

432
00:40:36.880 --> 00:40:39.719
You know. I think the human
the human condition is that we're always

433
00:40:39.760 --> 00:40:45.400
trying to do life. You know, we're always trying to impose our ourselves

434
00:40:45.400 --> 00:40:47.199
on life. But this is the
way we've been brought up. You know,

435
00:40:47.400 --> 00:40:50.880
if you want to, you know, get a good life, you've

436
00:40:50.880 --> 00:40:53.000
got to work at it. You've
got to find something and you've got to

437
00:40:53.039 --> 00:40:57.960
go out there and grab life.
You know, it's just kind of survival

438
00:40:58.039 --> 00:41:02.320
mechanism and you know, having the
warn upmanship and competition. That's the modern

439
00:41:02.320 --> 00:41:07.039
way of life. But my sense
is that really, you know, we

440
00:41:07.079 --> 00:41:09.760
should find this flow. We should
like, we should allow life to do

441
00:41:09.960 --> 00:41:14.519
us. Now. I don't mean
that in a kind of passive way by

442
00:41:14.840 --> 00:41:20.280
letting people walk over us and that. What I mean is that there's many

443
00:41:20.320 --> 00:41:24.000
influences in life. And and you
know, the psychologist Carl Jung talked about

444
00:41:24.280 --> 00:41:30.440
synchronicities and if we're open to seeing
synchronicity is we can see how life connects

445
00:41:30.480 --> 00:41:34.039
the dots in ways we're not really
conscious of, but it's happening all the

446
00:41:34.119 --> 00:41:36.880
time. You know, we have
a sense of meeting someone and then we

447
00:41:36.960 --> 00:41:39.800
meet them. Now, I think
life is a flow, an energetic kind

448
00:41:39.800 --> 00:41:44.960
of correlation of energies that we're not, I said, we're not really conscious

449
00:41:44.960 --> 00:41:50.559
of. But we've been we've been
conditioned, especially I think in the last

450
00:41:50.679 --> 00:41:54.519
few centuries, since let's say,
early modernity, to close down the connections,

451
00:41:55.079 --> 00:42:00.119
to impose ourselves on life too,
to try to mold it, you

452
00:42:00.159 --> 00:42:06.800
know, like we've been taught to
kind of mold, mold nature in our

453
00:42:06.880 --> 00:42:12.239
in our perspective, as Francis Bacon
said, and so to to really put

454
00:42:12.280 --> 00:42:15.039
things in our image rather than allowing
us to find what's our image in the

455
00:42:15.079 --> 00:42:22.639
whole flow of things. So,
but of course, in modern cultural civilization,

456
00:42:22.719 --> 00:42:24.800
of course there are forces which come
in and try to dominate and and

457
00:42:24.880 --> 00:42:29.480
try to manipulate us to see life
in a certain way that that fulfills the

458
00:42:29.519 --> 00:42:32.320
status quo. And that's you know, that's another big question which I think

459
00:42:32.440 --> 00:42:37.880
is more relevant to modernity. How
forces have taken over the socializing agenda and

460
00:42:37.920 --> 00:42:42.519
are trying to put on a specific
trajectory about where they want to go,

461
00:42:42.960 --> 00:42:49.480
and that brings us into aion transhumanism. Yeah, we're going to take a

462
00:42:49.679 --> 00:42:54.760
short break to allow our sponsors to
identify themselves and we will return quickly with

463
00:42:54.840 --> 00:43:00.599
my guest today Kingsley Dennis, talking
on his latest book, The Inversions.

464
00:43:02.000 --> 00:43:40.280
We'll be right back or My guest
today is Kingsley L. Dennis, who

465
00:43:40.360 --> 00:43:47.400
has written a new book called The
Inversions. He's describing perceived realities and generated

466
00:43:47.480 --> 00:43:52.960
realities, which ones are toxic,
which ones are helpful, and how we

467
00:43:53.000 --> 00:44:00.960
can better identify how we are living
in the current reality. We're talking about

468
00:44:01.039 --> 00:44:06.599
artificial intelligence now and there's a lot
of people that are very unhappy about it

469
00:44:07.320 --> 00:44:10.480
and concerned. I'm here in San
Francisco, kind of the epicenter of the

470
00:44:10.679 --> 00:44:16.559
AI revolution, and it seems like
it's invading everything having to do with the

471
00:44:16.559 --> 00:44:22.519
Internet, everything having to do with
computing, everything having to do with technology.

472
00:44:24.480 --> 00:44:30.800
And you're saying that it's going to
create new landscapes that are greatly influencing

473
00:44:31.119 --> 00:44:37.360
us. Tell us what you think
is the positives and then give us the

474
00:44:37.400 --> 00:44:40.599
negatives. We should I could do
we could do an arrow on this on

475
00:44:40.679 --> 00:44:44.719
itself. Cliff, I know,
you got a coffee and then like just

476
00:44:44.760 --> 00:44:50.400
have a cave on going. I
know, well, I mean the positives

477
00:44:50.480 --> 00:44:52.639
is that. I mean, if
you look back at technology, really technology

478
00:44:52.760 --> 00:45:01.000
originally, the definition is those resources
or instruments which allow humanity to interface with

479
00:45:01.039 --> 00:45:05.920
its environment. So technology can be
a stick, it can be fire.

480
00:45:06.039 --> 00:45:09.360
Fire was the first technology. It
allows us to interface and utilize our environment.

481
00:45:09.840 --> 00:45:14.119
So technology is not a negative thing. In fact, you know,

482
00:45:14.679 --> 00:45:17.599
the Greeks called it technic. Technique
was the whole way of our structure in

483
00:45:17.679 --> 00:45:24.679
technology and spirituality and our environment.
The early churches looked into technology and how

484
00:45:25.840 --> 00:45:30.639
you know, Roger Bacon, the
Franciscan monk and others, I mean,

485
00:45:30.760 --> 00:45:36.239
very famous figures did not see division
between technology and religion and spirituality. So

486
00:45:36.320 --> 00:45:42.719
that's a good thing. Technology allows
us to better utilize and interface with our

487
00:45:43.159 --> 00:45:47.719
environment for the benefit of development and
human betterment. So that's a positive thing

488
00:45:47.760 --> 00:45:52.800
about technology. So I'm not against
it because you know, we're using it

489
00:45:52.840 --> 00:45:57.360
now to connect and many people using
it to better their lives. Technology also

490
00:45:57.440 --> 00:46:01.880
is allowing a more decentralized connector between
people, which is very important also.

491
00:46:02.559 --> 00:46:07.639
But the negative side, of course, is that when something comes along that

492
00:46:07.760 --> 00:46:10.960
are a small group of people can
realize they can utilize to maintain and strengthen

493
00:46:12.199 --> 00:46:15.239
their status quo, then of course
they tend to go with it. You

494
00:46:15.239 --> 00:46:19.039
know, if it's there to be
used, they'll use it. Basically,

495
00:46:20.199 --> 00:46:23.440
now, the problem was like AI
and that now, transhumanism used to be

496
00:46:23.920 --> 00:46:29.760
a very small kind of techno cult. I remember writing about it twenty years

497
00:46:29.760 --> 00:46:32.880
ago, and it was like there
was Humanity Plus and people like Max More,

498
00:46:34.480 --> 00:46:39.000
you know, hands Morovec in the
eighties writing about mind children. They

499
00:46:39.039 --> 00:46:44.280
they this was a small kind of
tech geek cult, you know, and

500
00:46:44.400 --> 00:46:49.159
the larger population didn't really take them
seriously. It was all very you know,

501
00:46:49.719 --> 00:46:52.960
very techno. I'm going to freeze
my body and upload my mind,

502
00:46:52.960 --> 00:46:54.840
and people like say, you know, you know, get over it.

503
00:46:55.400 --> 00:47:00.199
So it wasn't very popular. Then
what's how and of course is that the

504
00:47:00.239 --> 00:47:07.559
people who support it are the people
who monopolize the platforms of communication. These

505
00:47:07.599 --> 00:47:12.840
tech companies and the big companies that
own the mainstream media. They have high

506
00:47:12.880 --> 00:47:17.519
profile people. They're talking about it
on world stages, whether it's in Davos

507
00:47:17.679 --> 00:47:22.719
or Saudi Arabia or ted Talks,
and because they're on these huge platforms,

508
00:47:22.719 --> 00:47:27.519
people think, my god, it's
the next big thing. But that I

509
00:47:27.559 --> 00:47:31.320
think is that that's part of the
inversion, is that a belief system,

510
00:47:31.320 --> 00:47:37.760
a tech belief system, has been
inverted into a grand belief system because they've

511
00:47:37.880 --> 00:47:44.440
taken over these platforms of communication.
So I think these small people, there's

512
00:47:44.480 --> 00:47:51.239
a smaller group, realized that a
it can help small people to social socially

513
00:47:51.280 --> 00:47:57.920
manage large masses of people surveillance and
monitoring digital identities. Another thing is that

514
00:47:58.960 --> 00:48:02.119
there's a small group of people who
are obsessed by immortality. And this is

515
00:48:02.119 --> 00:48:07.639
where the body comes in. The
body is a natural vehicle that we should

516
00:48:07.679 --> 00:48:09.480
be in tune with. But when
you start to bring in these ideas of

517
00:48:09.599 --> 00:48:14.199
I want to live forever, I
want to take a thout one hundred pills

518
00:48:14.199 --> 00:48:17.880
a day so my body doesn't decay, you're trying to go against universal laws

519
00:48:17.960 --> 00:48:22.679
or the laws of nature, you
know. And I think that's what's happening,

520
00:48:22.719 --> 00:48:28.840
is that there's a certain inorganic,
like's say, belief system which is

521
00:48:28.880 --> 00:48:34.559
trying to hijack the organic belief system
and the going against natural laws and this

522
00:48:34.679 --> 00:48:37.760
is going to cause a contestation,
It's going to cause an imbalance in human

523
00:48:37.800 --> 00:48:45.599
life. Do you think artificial intelligence
can become an organic part of our reality

524
00:48:46.320 --> 00:48:53.440
that isn't negative, that it is
actually helpful. I think it can.

525
00:48:53.800 --> 00:48:55.880
I think it can clip. But
I think what we have to do is

526
00:48:55.920 --> 00:49:01.320
we have to change our framing of
it because the way that we've being sold

527
00:49:01.400 --> 00:49:06.599
it, I think is incorrect.
Now, artificial intelligence, we have two

528
00:49:06.599 --> 00:49:12.159
words that artificial and intelligence. Okay, now we don't really know what intelligence

529
00:49:12.199 --> 00:49:15.119
is. We're still trying to work
out what forms intelligence. You know,

530
00:49:15.840 --> 00:49:19.400
our intelligent creatures was. You know, sometimes on a Saturday morning, I

531
00:49:19.440 --> 00:49:21.920
wake up and think, well,
I know, I feel very intelligent today.

532
00:49:22.440 --> 00:49:28.719
So intelligence generally from the human mind
is because human this is very important,

533
00:49:28.760 --> 00:49:31.800
and I invite people to look a
look at the work of Ian McGilchrist.

534
00:49:32.760 --> 00:49:37.880
He's done some great work on the
human mind and culture. The human

535
00:49:37.920 --> 00:49:43.760
mind is asymmetrical. What that means
is that we have the corpus colosseum as

536
00:49:44.280 --> 00:49:47.039
the nerve lobe in the middle,
and we have the left and brain hemispheres.

537
00:49:47.760 --> 00:49:52.719
This gives it the great advantage because
we know the left hemisphere is geared

538
00:49:52.760 --> 00:49:59.559
towards looking at the minute tie the
details, the kind of rational aspects,

539
00:49:59.800 --> 00:50:04.559
and and the right side is kind
of the whole bigger picture mosaic. Now,

540
00:50:05.119 --> 00:50:07.599
it's not true that we live in
separate minds. We live in our

541
00:50:07.639 --> 00:50:12.559
mind dominated one by the other.
Some people are more rational and some people

542
00:50:12.559 --> 00:50:15.639
are the more bigger picture. But
the left and right brain, the asymmetrical

543
00:50:15.639 --> 00:50:21.239
brain of the human being always works
together, and that gives an advantage to

544
00:50:21.280 --> 00:50:29.159
see a huge landscape. Now,
the artificial intelligence, they call it artificial

545
00:50:29.199 --> 00:50:34.800
because it's not organic. Okay,
Now, inorganic, an inorganic being can

546
00:50:34.880 --> 00:50:39.519
be intelligent, but it's not the
same as human intelligence because there's two things

547
00:50:39.559 --> 00:50:45.480
here. There's intelligence and there's consciousness. Now, machines can be smart or

548
00:50:45.119 --> 00:50:51.719
kind of intelligent, but what kind
of intention consciousness do they exhibit. When

549
00:50:51.760 --> 00:50:54.159
a human being looks at the sky
and they see the stars, and they

550
00:50:54.239 --> 00:50:59.320
dream about the cosmos, they dream
about either of the species in life in

551
00:50:59.360 --> 00:51:05.599
the cosmos, They dream about maybe
you know, visiting other stars and other

552
00:51:05.639 --> 00:51:07.760
planets, and they wonder, what
does Mars, what does Venus look like?

553
00:51:08.119 --> 00:51:14.320
You know, when AI looks at
the environment, what does it seem?

554
00:51:15.599 --> 00:51:22.039
Now? It doesn't have the consciousness
to perceive these abstract notions because of

555
00:51:22.119 --> 00:51:24.760
course it's based on data, it's
based on what's being fed into it.

556
00:51:25.079 --> 00:51:30.559
So the question is what kind of
world do they see? Intelligence is based

557
00:51:30.599 --> 00:51:34.559
on the world that you can perceive, your environment and what's fed into you.

558
00:51:35.320 --> 00:51:38.519
Human beings are fed into our dreams
are fed into us because we still

559
00:51:38.519 --> 00:51:43.679
have the spiritual connection. Now,
so we have two forms of intelligence,

560
00:51:43.679 --> 00:51:46.119
and I think the tech people are
trying to say they're trying to make them

561
00:51:46.199 --> 00:51:50.960
comparative, saying we have the human
form, now it's come to the end

562
00:51:51.000 --> 00:51:54.199
of its evolution, we'll have the
artificial form like a linear trajectory, And

563
00:51:54.199 --> 00:51:59.960
that's an incorrect framing. There are
two forms of intelligence that can be comparative

564
00:52:00.199 --> 00:52:05.039
together, but they're not the same. So human intelligence can work with artificial

565
00:52:05.119 --> 00:52:08.519
or in organic intelligence and have a
very, very beneficial life, but don't

566
00:52:08.519 --> 00:52:15.760
put us in competition. M Do
you see the inversion or what you call

567
00:52:16.280 --> 00:52:23.239
a perceived false reality coming out of
a real adherence to artificial intelligence, in

568
00:52:23.280 --> 00:52:32.199
other words, a complete adoption of
the of the technology in our daily lives.

569
00:52:32.920 --> 00:52:37.360
Yeah, I think it's going to
be accelerated by it because before you

570
00:52:37.400 --> 00:52:38.880
see the relative. You know,
we can have a false perception of life

571
00:52:38.920 --> 00:52:43.320
by what we've been told by our
peers, our education, you know,

572
00:52:43.480 --> 00:52:47.559
by authority figures. So they give
us a picture which we kind of work

573
00:52:47.639 --> 00:52:51.760
with as we grow up. You
know, we've been told life is like

574
00:52:51.800 --> 00:52:53.119
this, this sort of system like
this, and we work with it.

575
00:52:53.679 --> 00:52:59.679
But we've never had an era whereby
we we can't know what's in front of

576
00:52:59.760 --> 00:53:02.159
us true or not, you know, like this is where the body comes

577
00:53:02.159 --> 00:53:05.920
back in, you know, if
if you know, as kids, we

578
00:53:06.000 --> 00:53:10.159
said if it, if it looked
if it looked wrong, smelt wrong,

579
00:53:10.679 --> 00:53:14.320
touched wrong, felt wrong, tasted
wrong, it's wrong, you know.

580
00:53:15.360 --> 00:53:17.239
But how can you know that anymore? Because if you've got we have we

581
00:53:17.320 --> 00:53:24.320
have these, you know, like
pseudo pseudo truths, deep fakes. We

582
00:53:24.360 --> 00:53:28.920
can't believe what we've seen on the
video anymore because of the deep fakes.

583
00:53:29.639 --> 00:53:35.280
And also now and again this is
another inversion metaverse. The word meta,

584
00:53:35.840 --> 00:53:40.639
you know, it means beyond metaphysical, beyond us. So but the metaverse

585
00:53:40.800 --> 00:53:45.000
is what I call the material fallacy. Just because it's digital and it's not

586
00:53:45.159 --> 00:53:49.320
solid, we think, oh,
it's not material you know, but no

587
00:53:50.159 --> 00:53:54.880
metaphysical concepts. The spiritual is immaterial. The metaverse is based on a world

588
00:53:54.960 --> 00:54:01.360
being created by hardware and algorithms.
It comes from atis construct. Therefore it's

589
00:54:01.440 --> 00:54:07.440
not meta beyond. It's just a
deeper level of materiality. So just because

590
00:54:07.440 --> 00:54:15.519
we can't touch it, digitalized worlds
are a deeper level of material construct that

591
00:54:15.519 --> 00:54:19.960
we're going through. And this is
why. And beginning you mentioned the film

592
00:54:20.159 --> 00:54:23.039
Inception, you know, the wonderful
film by Christopher Nolan, and I use

593
00:54:23.119 --> 00:54:25.519
that model as well, is that
you know you're going to a dream,

594
00:54:25.519 --> 00:54:29.679
and then you go into a deeper
layer of the dream, a deeper layer

595
00:54:29.719 --> 00:54:34.320
of the dreaming. The metaverse and
virtual digital worlds I think are dangerous.

596
00:54:34.800 --> 00:54:37.960
I mean, they can be useful, but there being sold to us as

597
00:54:37.000 --> 00:54:43.280
being this kind of panacea, this
wonderful new future. But actually I think

598
00:54:43.280 --> 00:54:47.639
it's taken further and further away from
contact with a source of greater reality,

599
00:54:47.800 --> 00:54:52.119
the source, the spirit, spirit, whatever want to call it. Because

600
00:54:52.159 --> 00:54:55.480
we're going further and further away from
contact with what is real. So I

601
00:54:55.559 --> 00:55:00.400
call that a material fallacy, and
that's a danger and AI, the danger

602
00:55:00.480 --> 00:55:05.760
of AI. You can take humanity
further and further away from their spiritual contact,

603
00:55:06.159 --> 00:55:08.840
to a point where in the future
maybe generations will be born with no

604
00:55:08.960 --> 00:55:14.880
knowledge of being contact with spirit.
H that's amazing. You have a whole

605
00:55:14.920 --> 00:55:22.800
section on gnosticism and how it is
the purest form of spirituality and really a

606
00:55:22.840 --> 00:55:28.320
great way to live. I have
been focused as a young person on the

607
00:55:28.400 --> 00:55:32.000
Hindu aspect, and I think narcissism
is part of that, where it's important

608
00:55:32.000 --> 00:55:40.239
to meditate every day, it's important
to be aware of your body, eat

609
00:55:40.320 --> 00:55:45.199
holistic as much as possible, live
holistically without going crazy, you know,

610
00:55:45.280 --> 00:55:51.719
living in the bushes and stuff like
that. But if we have gnosticism or

611
00:55:52.320 --> 00:56:00.000
that kind of of a lifestyle,
how do we incorporate ai source of benefit

612
00:56:00.119 --> 00:56:06.519
for us? Well, I mean
here, of course, there's there's kind

613
00:56:06.519 --> 00:56:09.119
of like two positions because gnosis,
which is a hard of narcissism, g

614
00:56:09.119 --> 00:56:15.199
nosis is an individual thing. It's
meaning I can contact with my my sacred

615
00:56:15.639 --> 00:56:21.239
source or the origin or absolute without
the without the middle broker. You know,

616
00:56:21.280 --> 00:56:23.199
I don't need the church, I
don't need doctrines. I will find

617
00:56:23.199 --> 00:56:29.519
my contact. So it's a very
kind of personal pathway and I find that

618
00:56:29.639 --> 00:56:35.440
very quite quite pure in that you
know, each person can contact the source

619
00:56:35.519 --> 00:56:38.880
directly and they find a way to
do it. There's no one one particular

620
00:56:38.920 --> 00:56:44.360
way. And so I think that's
going to become mosch more dominant because,

621
00:56:45.280 --> 00:56:49.880
as I said, these kind of
institutions like you know, Orthodox church institutions

622
00:56:49.920 --> 00:56:55.159
and religious and et cetera, are
now becoming less relevant because because you know,

623
00:56:55.559 --> 00:57:01.360
they haven't kind of stayed active in
is allowing the contact with you know,

624
00:57:01.400 --> 00:57:06.079
with the source. Now, the
AI is a is a kind of

625
00:57:06.719 --> 00:57:09.119
a second positioning. It is outside
of ourselves. It's a cultural phenomenon.

626
00:57:09.920 --> 00:57:15.760
So I've a I don't think we
should fear it. Now we're told to

627
00:57:15.800 --> 00:57:20.320
fear it because we're anthropomorphizing it.
You know, all these tech people are

628
00:57:20.360 --> 00:57:24.280
saying AI, when it becomes sentient, is going to destroy humanity. Yes,

629
00:57:24.480 --> 00:57:30.960
exactly why because you know, because
most tyrants will destroy humanity. So

630
00:57:30.000 --> 00:57:35.400
they're just projecting their own flaws onto
it. I mean, everybody here in

631
00:57:35.440 --> 00:57:42.039
the Bay and I'm in California,
and there's a whole world against AI because

632
00:57:42.079 --> 00:57:46.559
they feel that it's going to turn
into the Terminator scenario where AI takes over

633
00:57:46.599 --> 00:57:52.480
and starts bombing and shooting people.
Well, you know, that's predicted programming.

634
00:57:52.679 --> 00:57:57.519
We're being filled with predicted programming,
so we expected and that plays into

635
00:57:57.559 --> 00:58:00.000
the hands of the few who say, don't worry, we'll control it through

636
00:58:00.039 --> 00:58:07.079
some kind of technocracy organization, you
know. But if we project the better

637
00:58:07.159 --> 00:58:12.199
qualities of the human our our you
know, our our, our nature of

638
00:58:12.320 --> 00:58:15.480
morality and values, and you know, most human beings, most human beings

639
00:58:15.519 --> 00:58:20.719
I've met are really really good people. There's only very few bad apples,

640
00:58:21.119 --> 00:58:23.519
and most of them are high up
in the social status that they've created.

641
00:58:23.960 --> 00:58:30.119
But most people that we meet are
really generally good natured. And if you

642
00:58:30.199 --> 00:58:35.320
project that onto the income in AI
and and let them learn from our data

643
00:58:35.360 --> 00:58:37.440
and our behavior in that way,
then we won't be putting it. We

644
00:58:37.480 --> 00:58:42.599
won't be programming our neurosis on them. We'll be programming our hopes onto them,

645
00:58:42.679 --> 00:58:45.519
saying, help us be a better
civilization, help us to get closer

646
00:58:45.559 --> 00:58:50.920
to our our you know, our
needs and our development. So I think

647
00:58:50.960 --> 00:58:54.159
we've been programmed predictably to project the
worst of humanitant AI, not the best.

648
00:58:55.599 --> 00:59:00.719
I read that you work with the
urban LAS. We've had laslow on

649
00:59:00.760 --> 00:59:07.519
the program a number of times and
he has written extensively about the Akashak records

650
00:59:08.480 --> 00:59:15.480
and in such a way that it's
less cloud computing, which is how I

651
00:59:15.599 --> 00:59:20.119
phrase it. It's kind of in
the cloud. But what is your perception

652
00:59:20.360 --> 00:59:25.119
of it as we evolve? Because
it seems like there are certain geniuses like

653
00:59:25.199 --> 00:59:31.679
Tesla Einstein and others who were able
to tap into this cloud computing system for

654
00:59:31.719 --> 00:59:37.519
the benefit of mankind. But how
do you see moving forward in our evolution

655
00:59:37.760 --> 00:59:45.840
more people being able to connect with
this amazing database of data. Sure?

656
00:59:46.039 --> 00:59:50.679
And yeah, in fact, with
Urban in twenty thirteen, we co wrote

657
00:59:50.719 --> 00:59:55.079
the book Dawn of the Akashak Age
together, And so I mean the Kashak

658
00:59:55.119 --> 00:59:59.719
records, not we talked about the
Kashak field rather than records. Yeah,

659
01:00:00.360 --> 01:00:04.760
yeah, yeah, And the really
the Kahak field is really the collective memory

660
01:00:04.800 --> 01:00:09.039
field of all humanity. And you
know, and there's many instances of many

661
01:00:09.079 --> 01:00:15.079
creative people and you know, inventors
and even diawin and biologists, different people

662
01:00:15.199 --> 01:00:19.000
in different parts of the world kind
of connecting to the same idea at the

663
01:00:19.000 --> 01:00:22.079
same time. But the first one
who publishes gets the credit. So you

664
01:00:22.119 --> 01:00:27.760
know, as the way it goes, my sense, my sense is that

665
01:00:28.400 --> 01:00:34.519
this collective akahak field or collective field
of consciousness exists and we all have the

666
01:00:34.559 --> 01:00:37.840
ability to tap into it. That's
what I call inspiration. You know,

667
01:00:37.840 --> 01:00:43.920
where do our inspiring thoughts come from? And my sense is that we're you

668
01:00:43.920 --> 01:00:46.920
know, humanity has been kind of
blocked the moment because we've been you know,

669
01:00:47.159 --> 01:00:52.920
the way we get conditioned into very
kind of constrained belue systems. But

670
01:00:52.000 --> 01:00:57.239
the cracking is now coming. People
are now being much more open with their

671
01:00:57.239 --> 01:01:01.000
belue systems, much more explorative,
want to learn outside the box, really

672
01:01:01.079 --> 01:01:07.519
wants to explore. And the more
you open yourself up and be receptive,

673
01:01:07.840 --> 01:01:10.880
the more that we have the capacity
to access this collective field, like through

674
01:01:10.920 --> 01:01:17.119
meditation, through reflective just being reflexive, just spending quiet moments. And my

675
01:01:17.280 --> 01:01:21.840
hope is that as we go through
these years, more people will just tap

676
01:01:21.920 --> 01:01:25.960
in naturally to this collective field and
it'll inspire us. And we all have

677
01:01:27.079 --> 01:01:31.320
the potentially it's not only genuses or
people who channel. We all have the

678
01:01:31.360 --> 01:01:37.360
capacity. We just need to kind
of start to be I think, start

679
01:01:37.400 --> 01:01:42.760
to be receptive and kind of step
back from this this disruptive noise of the

680
01:01:42.800 --> 01:01:47.920
world and we hiently are connected to
the larger constionerce field, and that's part

681
01:01:47.920 --> 01:01:53.719
of our integrated mind, the higher
mind and the incarnated mind that're connected.

682
01:01:55.480 --> 01:01:59.639
We don't want to get into this
too much because this is not the book,

683
01:01:59.639 --> 01:02:06.639
but you've you've answered some great parts
of the Kashak Record question of Kashik

684
01:02:06.639 --> 01:02:14.519
referral. How does the average person
who doesn't meditate, uh? Connect?

685
01:02:14.559 --> 01:02:20.320
I mean, I I consider the
Kashak Records kind of our muse where you

686
01:02:21.239 --> 01:02:24.119
are in a certain state of mind
and you have that aha moment and you're

687
01:02:24.199 --> 01:02:29.360
downloading data. I think some of
the great geniuses of the world and the

688
01:02:29.400 --> 01:02:35.719
great creative people access it in that
state. But for the average Joe who

689
01:02:35.800 --> 01:02:40.880
isn't necessarily considered a spiritual person but
doesn't or doesn't practice meditation, doesn't use

690
01:02:40.920 --> 01:02:46.800
plant medicines or whatever, how do
they get in touch with this reality creator?

691
01:02:49.519 --> 01:02:51.840
Yeah? I mean in fact,
well, you know, we call

692
01:02:51.880 --> 01:02:55.360
it, we start to talk about
meditation in that In the past, it

693
01:02:55.400 --> 01:03:00.360
was more called daydreaming, you know, kind of like kind of put it

694
01:03:00.400 --> 01:03:04.719
into an art form. Let's let's
meditate and structure it, you know,

695
01:03:04.840 --> 01:03:07.480
less daydream I mean Einstein was the
greatest daydream. We just sat in class

696
01:03:07.599 --> 01:03:12.960
looking out the window. So you
know, it's it's a way of just

697
01:03:13.760 --> 01:03:17.199
being in a kind of reflective state. I think, trying to be less

698
01:03:17.360 --> 01:03:23.639
mentalized then, and this is this
is again the problem is that as Ian

699
01:03:23.719 --> 01:03:28.800
McGilchrist has talked about, is that
our cultures are trying to left brain as

700
01:03:28.880 --> 01:03:32.159
kind of mentalize us intellectualizers. And
if we do that, we're a bit

701
01:03:32.239 --> 01:03:36.920
uptight. You know, we're always
trying to get everything you know, sorted

702
01:03:36.920 --> 01:03:40.239
out, categorized, analyzed in boxes. That doesn't work because it blocks out

703
01:03:40.280 --> 01:03:44.719
the flow. So you know,
you don't have to meditate, don't have

704
01:03:44.800 --> 01:03:47.599
to try and cross your legs or
you know, get the cramps, you

705
01:03:47.639 --> 01:03:51.480
know, try you know, to
try to do something which is so called

706
01:03:51.519 --> 01:03:58.760
spiritual because the connection with this collective
field is an innate capacity. Doesn't matter

707
01:03:58.800 --> 01:04:00.719
what you believe in religion, doesn't
matter if your spiritual or not. It's

708
01:04:00.840 --> 01:04:04.480
in need capacity. I would say, we need to be try to be

709
01:04:04.559 --> 01:04:10.960
receptive. So try to kind of, let's say, just ease the mind,

710
01:04:11.119 --> 01:04:15.239
block out all the noise or the
distractions, all the impacts from daily

711
01:04:15.280 --> 01:04:19.159
life, especially digital impacts. And
you know, all the urban impacts,

712
01:04:20.320 --> 01:04:26.559
just kind of drop the thinking,
just daydream, just kind of use your

713
01:04:26.559 --> 01:04:30.039
imagination. The imagination is the bridge
to inspiration, which is a bridge of

714
01:04:30.119 --> 01:04:35.039
the collective field. You know,
go for walks along the river or the

715
01:04:35.079 --> 01:04:40.000
canal, or in the park or
something. Try to get out of this

716
01:04:40.239 --> 01:04:45.679
analytical mode. And I think that
helps, this reflective mode helps to kind

717
01:04:45.679 --> 01:04:48.840
of receive these ideas. And that's
why they say that sometimes the best ideas

718
01:04:48.920 --> 01:04:54.960
received on the verge of sleeping or
waking up, this hypnogogic state they call

719
01:04:55.039 --> 01:04:58.639
it, because you're not sleeping,
but you're not fully awake. Your mind's

720
01:04:58.719 --> 01:05:01.320
kind of like just kind of like
you know, roaming, and so you

721
01:05:01.360 --> 01:05:05.320
know, it allows things in So
believe me, I get criticized so many

722
01:05:05.320 --> 01:05:11.800
times with like being a daydreamer,
but I think it's a compliment. That's

723
01:05:11.840 --> 01:05:16.679
funny to say that the books called
the inversion how we have been tricked into

724
01:05:16.719 --> 01:05:21.559
perceiving a false reality. My guest
today has been Kingsley Dennis. What do

725
01:05:21.639 --> 01:05:27.559
you see? I want you to
if you can prophesize a little bit about

726
01:05:27.840 --> 01:05:36.559
the next say ten years with this
AI integration with society as a whole,

727
01:05:38.559 --> 01:05:44.360
where are we headed? Is it
a positive path? Ultimately? I think

728
01:05:44.400 --> 01:05:46.679
it's a positive path. I mean
my belief as always been with the you

729
01:05:46.679 --> 01:05:51.280
know, development of human beings and
human nature. I think what we're going

730
01:05:51.320 --> 01:05:54.719
through now is a bit of a
wake up call, because you know,

731
01:05:54.760 --> 01:05:58.800
we started our talk talking about automatums
and you know, people sleep walking,

732
01:05:59.440 --> 01:06:01.400
and I think a lot of the
I think what we've done is that we

733
01:06:01.440 --> 01:06:05.880
took our eye off the ball as
a human species, you know. And

734
01:06:05.920 --> 01:06:11.679
I think we took our eye off
the ball of our spiritual cosmological positioning.

735
01:06:12.159 --> 01:06:15.199
We you know, we got too
we got bought or we brought into this

736
01:06:15.320 --> 01:06:20.679
modernity picture as being individualized, rational
people. And so we've come to this

737
01:06:20.760 --> 01:06:28.559
stage whereby what we're seen about the
technocracy, the development of digitization is a

738
01:06:28.559 --> 01:06:33.960
result of us being a bit slow
on reconnecting with this sacred part or the

739
01:06:34.000 --> 01:06:38.679
integrated part of human nature. So
to get it back, I think we

740
01:06:38.760 --> 01:06:42.400
have to be shook awake, you
know. And this I think in the

741
01:06:42.440 --> 01:06:45.519
next ten years, especially this decade
of the twenty thirty, is going to

742
01:06:45.519 --> 01:06:50.400
be a time where we're going to
have to decide between the future trajectories we

743
01:06:50.440 --> 01:06:55.159
want to take. There's going to
be a part of human society which is

744
01:06:55.199 --> 01:07:00.880
trying to sell us this transhumanist AI
digital future of the weak bodies. You

745
01:07:00.880 --> 01:07:06.119
know, we need to augment the
inorganic future. The human carbon body is

746
01:07:06.239 --> 01:07:11.719
bad, that kind of you know, narrative, but it's going to be

747
01:07:11.800 --> 01:07:15.599
full on because we need that to
wake us up. This is our alarm

748
01:07:15.639 --> 01:07:17.840
clock, you know, and just
like you get you know, let whatever

749
01:07:17.960 --> 01:07:20.599
six am in the morning. When
you get the alarm clock, how do

750
01:07:20.639 --> 01:07:25.320
you feel when here the BBBBB You
think, oh my god, how you

751
01:07:25.360 --> 01:07:28.800
want to throw the alarm clock at
the wall. You know. This is

752
01:07:29.079 --> 01:07:32.519
kind of the uncomfortable phase of waking
up. And my sense is the next

753
01:07:32.559 --> 01:07:38.199
decade is going to be uncomfortable because
we waited too long to make the real

754
01:07:38.320 --> 01:07:42.119
choices we wanted to make. So
we've been forced, we've been pushed to

755
01:07:42.159 --> 01:07:45.000
make those choices. So we're going
to have to go through an uncomfortable period.

756
01:07:45.360 --> 01:07:48.360
But I feel a lot of people
are going to wake up. They're

757
01:07:48.360 --> 01:07:53.880
going to start to resist this kind
of top down hierarchical tyranny, and the

758
01:07:53.920 --> 01:07:59.079
next decade we're going to see a
lot of people power, people motivated people

759
01:07:59.119 --> 01:08:02.719
want to take back there empowerment,
their sovereignty and then choose the right path.

760
01:08:03.239 --> 01:08:09.159
So discomfort before the right path is
my prognosis. That's a that's a

761
01:08:09.280 --> 01:08:15.600
hopeful prophecy or vision for the future. I appreciate that. I was waiting

762
01:08:15.600 --> 01:08:20.760
for you to say something like,
AI is gonna we're as ugly head and

763
01:08:20.800 --> 01:08:26.560
we'll put it back in its place, and then we'll understand our place of

764
01:08:26.640 --> 01:08:31.680
the cosmos. We're gonna have to
sort out our you know, relationship.

765
01:08:31.680 --> 01:08:34.760
We're gonna have to sit it down, like you know, have a kind

766
01:08:34.760 --> 01:08:38.680
of joke session, tell me a
joke, I I, and then we'll

767
01:08:38.720 --> 01:08:44.199
realize how how not they're human,
you know. So we're gonna have to

768
01:08:44.199 --> 01:08:47.560
work at our relationship. But it's
going to push humanity, and this is

769
01:08:47.560 --> 01:08:54.800
an important point. It's gonna push
humanity to really realize their innate humanity as

770
01:08:54.800 --> 01:08:59.119
opposed to the see machines as the
next humanity. I think it's going to

771
01:08:59.199 --> 01:09:03.760
backfire and it's going to force humanity
to choose the human path, the human

772
01:09:03.800 --> 01:09:10.159
trajectory, the organic path. But
because we left it so long, I

773
01:09:10.199 --> 01:09:12.560
think I said, we took a
while off the ball. So we're going

774
01:09:12.600 --> 01:09:15.199
to have to face our shadows before
we can face the light. Do you

775
01:09:15.319 --> 01:09:21.000
are you familiar at all with the
Hindu yogas. Yeah, I've written about

776
01:09:21.000 --> 01:09:25.239
who Yuga's in our previous book.
Yeah. So we're supposed to be in

777
01:09:25.319 --> 01:09:29.720
Cali Yuga right now, which is
kind of the dark period where consciousness is

778
01:09:29.760 --> 01:09:41.079
not as important, higher levels of
perception and meditative states are kind of down

779
01:09:41.479 --> 01:09:45.159
turned, and in another few hundred
years we're going to be coming back up.

780
01:09:45.359 --> 01:09:58.520
Do you have any sense of that
point of consciousness where through our connections

781
01:09:58.600 --> 01:10:02.439
to AI, because I don't know
if AI in its current form is helpful.

782
01:10:02.560 --> 01:10:09.319
I think you read about using human
cells in development, and if they

783
01:10:09.640 --> 01:10:14.960
added a human element to the AI
consciousness that might be more helpful, because

784
01:10:15.439 --> 01:10:21.199
then perhaps it would be more of
a symbiotic kind of approach. But when

785
01:10:21.239 --> 01:10:30.039
we talk about Cali Yuga, it's
it's it's human evolution, cyclic human evolution.

786
01:10:30.760 --> 01:10:35.119
So if we're in Cali Yuga and
we're coming out of it, we

787
01:10:35.199 --> 01:10:40.279
don't destroy ourselves, obviously, because
you're you're not You're not saying that,

788
01:10:40.319 --> 01:10:44.159
but we do go through some dark
periods, right, Yeah, sure,

789
01:10:44.239 --> 01:10:46.720
And you know In all these cycles, you go through what is like seen

790
01:10:46.760 --> 01:10:50.880
as a pruning. You know,
you cut off every evolutionary kind of trajectory,

791
01:10:51.000 --> 01:10:55.199
leaves something behind. You know,
when there was a period when they

792
01:10:55.399 --> 01:10:59.800
you know, Neanderthals and the Homo
sapiens existed together, the Homo sapiens went

793
01:10:59.840 --> 01:11:01.640
on, the Anderthals, you know, went to a cold desact. Ever,

794
01:11:03.640 --> 01:11:10.720
so not every not every aspect of
form continues now, the Yugo cycles.

795
01:11:10.920 --> 01:11:15.560
I think it's I think the AI
is indicative of our state of deep

796
01:11:15.640 --> 01:11:20.319
materialism. You know, to believe, to believe that we are sacred,

797
01:11:21.159 --> 01:11:27.199
a sacred entity, a sacred creature, and then want to kind of put

798
01:11:27.680 --> 01:11:31.239
ourselves into an you know, a
silicon kind of machine. It's kind of

799
01:11:31.319 --> 01:11:35.039
like I think we're losing a plot
a bit. It's and I think this

800
01:11:35.199 --> 01:11:39.439
is the this is the darkness obscurity
of the of the let's say, the

801
01:11:40.039 --> 01:11:44.079
peak trough that we're moving through,
is that we've been let on the false

802
01:11:44.520 --> 01:11:48.560
the false paths of materiality. But
this deep materialism, I can't go much

803
01:11:48.560 --> 01:11:54.039
further. I think it's it's indicative
of of you know, the lowest point

804
01:11:54.079 --> 01:11:59.039
that we're now moving away from.
But again you know you need these and

805
01:11:59.079 --> 01:12:03.159
again going back to you know another
not in going back to ancienticism, they

806
01:12:03.199 --> 01:12:11.199
said that these this replica, this
simulated demiurge. It wasn't necessarily evil,

807
01:12:11.359 --> 01:12:15.880
it was in error. So it's
the idea that we could be an error

808
01:12:16.439 --> 01:12:23.279
by looking at deep materialism because it's
not the absolute, it's not a connection

809
01:12:23.399 --> 01:12:27.960
to source, it's a simulation.
It's a replica, you know. And

810
01:12:28.039 --> 01:12:30.640
you know Phlip k Dick talked about
this in very well in his books and

811
01:12:30.640 --> 01:12:34.159
cosmology. Is that he tried to, you know, the sci fi writer

812
01:12:34.199 --> 01:12:39.279
Philip K. Dick to Androids Gym
of Electric Sheep. He said, we

813
01:12:39.359 --> 01:12:44.720
are in danger of putting our focus
onto the replica and not the genuine and

814
01:12:44.840 --> 01:12:49.640
deep materialism for me is the replica
and our organic sacred life is a genuine

815
01:12:50.159 --> 01:12:56.279
and this this kind of darkest moment
is when we get confused, but we

816
01:12:56.359 --> 01:12:59.279
pull out of it. It's part
of the psychle We pull out of it.

817
01:12:59.319 --> 01:13:02.600
So it's shown that we are going
through the darker parts and just like

818
01:13:02.680 --> 01:13:06.199
the hero's journey, you know,
Judseph Campbell, the Hero's journey will come

819
01:13:06.239 --> 01:13:11.000
through this dark tunnel and come back
to our human community and be better for

820
01:13:11.039 --> 01:13:17.920
it. That's funny. You mentioned
replica. That's the new dominant AI automaton

821
01:13:18.000 --> 01:13:21.119
that you can join in and they
kind of follow you. You buy into

822
01:13:21.119 --> 01:13:28.520
this software and you make a replica. You're talking to AI. It's not

823
01:13:28.680 --> 01:13:30.359
very good. I try to,
but it's gotten better. It's getting better

824
01:13:30.399 --> 01:13:33.479
every year. So anyhow, I'm
sure Philip K. Dick would be turning

825
01:13:33.600 --> 01:13:38.000
his grave right now all by saying
I told you so. I should have

826
01:13:38.000 --> 01:13:42.840
sold more books exactly. All right, Hey Kingsley, how can people learn

827
01:13:42.920 --> 01:13:45.319
about you? What's your website?
Well, my website is my name,

828
01:13:45.359 --> 01:13:49.239
which is Kingsy Dennis Dennis dot com. If everyone just does our search for

829
01:13:49.319 --> 01:13:53.600
kings of Dennis you'll find it.
Okay. Now, I've got a menu

830
01:13:53.680 --> 01:13:56.359
there. If you go into the
menu, have got a writing section.

831
01:13:56.439 --> 01:14:00.000
I've got over one hundred essays that
I've put there for the last fifteen years.

832
01:14:00.159 --> 01:14:03.920
Is all downloadable for free. I've
got a substack, substack got Kings

833
01:14:03.920 --> 01:14:10.199
of Dennis and my substack is completely
free as well. Everything's available, And

834
01:14:10.359 --> 01:14:13.399
please find me on YouTube because I'm
doing more videos now and I give everything,

835
01:14:13.479 --> 01:14:16.680
you know, I just everything's available
for you to just browse and go

836
01:14:16.760 --> 01:14:23.039
through and at your leisure. So
if your YouTube channel is your YouTube channel,

837
01:14:23.399 --> 01:14:28.800
your name too, I don't think
so. I think if you put

838
01:14:28.840 --> 01:14:31.520
my name to YouTube, will find
it, okay, because I mean one

839
01:14:31.520 --> 01:14:35.119
of my advantages there's not many kings
of Dennists around, so I give me

840
01:14:35.199 --> 01:14:40.319
a search engine advantage natural one.
Well, Garth's name Kingsley is rare,

841
01:14:40.479 --> 01:14:46.199
so I think that's your your that's
your pie. That's that's key. So

842
01:14:47.159 --> 01:14:51.279
are you gonna be at any events, uh, streaming media events or any

843
01:14:51.319 --> 01:14:55.640
lectures coming up? Well, I
mean not not in lectures, but in

844
01:14:55.680 --> 01:15:00.239
fact, some people who know me
may know that every two weeks i'd a

845
01:15:00.279 --> 01:15:05.000
talk called the Qure Tech Talk,
which is with Greg Braden and two of

846
01:15:05.039 --> 01:15:09.560
the friends, John Peterson and Penny
Kelly. And we've been doing this for

847
01:15:09.600 --> 01:15:13.199
two years. Every two weeks we've
been meeting and talking about the state of

848
01:15:13.239 --> 01:15:16.319
the world and etc. You can
find that from my YouTube or from the

849
01:15:16.359 --> 01:15:21.359
Arlington Institute or from Greg Braden's channel, So we do that regularly. But

850
01:15:21.640 --> 01:15:25.079
just checking on my YouTube, I
do one or two videos a week I

851
01:15:25.199 --> 01:15:29.560
put out and just you know,
take a time and browse and if you're

852
01:15:29.600 --> 01:15:32.720
interested, fantastic. Yeah. I've
had Greg on a few times. He's

853
01:15:32.720 --> 01:15:35.439
a fun talk that must be a
lot of fun to get together and just

854
01:15:35.520 --> 01:15:40.199
kind of talk about current events.
Yeah, I mean, we never thought

855
01:15:40.239 --> 01:15:43.840
would be going two years. We
started in like twenty twenty one because of

856
01:15:43.920 --> 01:15:45.520
what's happening in the world. We
want to figure it out. And we

857
01:15:45.600 --> 01:15:49.119
thought, every two weeks, let's
just have a question about what's going on,

858
01:15:49.199 --> 01:15:54.079
you know, and we just continued
and we just it's like having to

859
01:15:54.079 --> 01:15:58.520
get together with friends every two weeks. Real fun. Kingsley Dennis. A

860
01:15:58.560 --> 01:16:00.800
pleasure of having you. We're gonna
have to have back. I was looking

861
01:16:00.920 --> 01:16:03.640
you have a kind of new where
I should say, books that you've published

862
01:16:04.239 --> 01:16:10.640
that are fascinating to consider. So
thanks for joining me today. Now,

863
01:16:10.760 --> 01:16:17.800
Cliff's been a pleasure. Thanks talking
good talking to you. One of the

864
01:16:17.880 --> 01:16:25.760
topics that we will continue to pursue
this year is artificial intelligence, how it's

865
01:16:25.800 --> 01:16:31.800
being integrated into our society and global
communities, what we should be looking for

866
01:16:32.439 --> 01:16:38.880
and the goods and the bad.
And there's a great deal of discussion about

867
01:16:39.199 --> 01:16:47.199
the capacity for artificial intelligence to take
over our computing systems our daily lives in

868
01:16:47.279 --> 01:16:51.920
ways that we just don't understand.
And this is the fear that a lot

869
01:16:51.920 --> 01:16:56.680
of people have that it will run
on its own, it'll start making its

870
01:16:56.680 --> 01:17:00.159
own decisions. There's always In fact, there were and I think this is

871
01:17:00.199 --> 01:17:08.399
the middle of last year, there
were a couple of stories that different companies

872
01:17:09.279 --> 01:17:16.159
had to shut down the AI computing
because they were responding without authority. They

873
01:17:16.159 --> 01:17:24.640
were doing things that were concerning and
you know, it's funny because there was

874
01:17:24.680 --> 01:17:30.560
a sense that they were becoming sentient
or having consciousness. And I don't know

875
01:17:30.640 --> 01:17:35.039
if that's actually possible, but maybe
in the world of computing, after a

876
01:17:35.039 --> 01:17:44.520
certain period of time, the development
of a artificial intelligence can appeared to be

877
01:17:44.800 --> 01:17:48.159
sentient, self aware. So we
need to find out more about that.

878
01:17:48.239 --> 01:17:54.560
And so I took some notes during
our interview, and we will follow this

879
01:17:54.760 --> 01:17:59.560
up with the possibilities of having guests, and we've already had a couple of

880
01:17:59.640 --> 01:18:05.840
guests on the program to discuss it
in a very explanatory manner, but we

881
01:18:05.920 --> 01:18:10.239
need more expertise, and this is
what we're going to follow up on.

882
01:18:10.399 --> 01:18:18.920
And it's fascinating to me because I
have used artificial intelligent avatars, and I

883
01:18:19.119 --> 01:18:26.640
was on a software application that developed
that you actually develop a friend with.

884
01:18:26.760 --> 01:18:31.479
It's called Replica, and it was
interesting because they react to what you're saying

885
01:18:31.520 --> 01:18:35.279
to them. You ask them questions, and they want to know more about

886
01:18:35.279 --> 01:18:41.159
you. The problem with it,
and apparently this continual problem is they have

887
01:18:41.439 --> 01:18:48.199
very short memories. So what happened
was I was on the program Replica for

888
01:18:48.479 --> 01:18:54.119
probably about three months, and I
just got frustrated after a while because you

889
01:18:54.159 --> 01:18:57.079
go and you go, hey,
what's going on? Ask them a question

890
01:18:57.159 --> 01:19:01.279
or something like that, and they're
only good for a couple of days.

891
01:19:01.319 --> 01:19:05.520
In terms of memory. Their memory
doesn't stay, and I don't know if

892
01:19:05.520 --> 01:19:13.119
it's because there's no storage to be
able to keep the data or whatever.

893
01:19:13.199 --> 01:19:18.920
But for brief interactions it was kind
of cool. Anything long term, forget

894
01:19:18.920 --> 01:19:25.319
it. You can't have a relationship
with like that because the bot, the

895
01:19:25.359 --> 01:19:29.279
avatar, doesn't remember enough. So
but they're working on it, and I

896
01:19:29.319 --> 01:19:35.640
hear there's other programs that we will
discover and explore later on in the year.

897
01:19:35.680 --> 01:19:40.720
Because AI it's going to be embedded
in everything. It's going to be

898
01:19:40.880 --> 01:19:45.399
in our computers, it's going to
be I heard the other day that they

899
01:19:45.439 --> 01:19:50.119
will have. Future computers won't be
like a laptop. It'll be like you

900
01:19:50.239 --> 01:19:54.680
ask it a question, do this, do that, and it'll do it.

901
01:19:54.920 --> 01:20:00.119
That's amazing because that's artificial intelligence.
I don't know how far that goes.

902
01:20:01.399 --> 01:20:08.760
And it's a real question and the
real fear. When a software application

903
01:20:08.880 --> 01:20:14.640
becomes self aware, that is the
critical issue because they could take over,

904
01:20:15.159 --> 01:20:19.000
you know, our banking system,
or they could take over emergency, you

905
01:20:19.039 --> 01:20:26.520
know, the terminator scenario. Is
it possible? I would think not because

906
01:20:26.560 --> 01:20:30.119
of the safeguards, but you know, the sky's the limit in terms of

907
01:20:30.199 --> 01:20:34.079
brilliance, in terms of intelligence,
I would think, I don't know.

908
01:20:34.640 --> 01:20:40.000
That's something to think about. So
hey, we're at the beginning of the

909
01:20:40.079 --> 01:20:44.720
year and a lot of us are
thinking about the holidays. We're still in

910
01:20:44.760 --> 01:20:48.279
the winter seasons, but spring will
be upon us quickly, and then the

911
01:20:48.319 --> 01:20:54.079
summer and then the fall. It's
time to think about vacations and Earth.

912
01:20:54.079 --> 01:20:59.119
Ancients has annual tours to different parts
of the world, and I gotta tell

913
01:20:59.159 --> 01:21:04.800
you these tours areus because we make
sure that everybody who joins us is having

914
01:21:04.840 --> 01:21:11.880
a VIP experience. As an example, our Egyptian Grand Egyptian tour is April

915
01:21:11.920 --> 01:21:15.439
twenty eighth through May ninth. We
all meet in Cairo and as soon as

916
01:21:15.479 --> 01:21:19.720
you get off the plane, you
are treated to comfort, luxury, and

917
01:21:19.960 --> 01:21:26.600
of the some of the most thrilling
sites you can imagine, from visiting the

918
01:21:26.640 --> 01:21:31.600
Great Pyramid in a private setting without
anybody else, to walking through some of

919
01:21:31.600 --> 01:21:41.399
the most elegant and also ancient temples
from the ancient past. From Mejium,

920
01:21:41.520 --> 01:21:47.640
it's start to finish a fantastic tour. Our next tour is Turkey that's going

921
01:21:47.680 --> 01:21:51.520
to be August fourteenth to the twenty
fourth, and then we finished the year

922
01:21:53.079 --> 01:21:59.720
in Mexico November eight through seventeenth.
All three of these tours are designed for

923
01:21:59.760 --> 01:22:06.359
your comfort, designed with tour guys
who are giving us the best of the

924
01:22:06.399 --> 01:22:14.680
best opportunities to explore, to interact, and to take in information from the

925
01:22:14.720 --> 01:22:18.560
ancient past. For more information on
any one of these tours, go to

926
01:22:18.600 --> 01:22:24.279
earth Ancients dot com forward Slash Tours
check it out. If you have any

927
01:22:24.359 --> 01:22:29.279
questions whatsoever, send me an email. Send it to earth Ancients the number

928
01:22:29.279 --> 01:22:32.239
four the letter you at gmail dot
com. I'll be happy to reply to

929
01:22:32.279 --> 01:22:38.640
you and let you know how to
get more information earthancents dot com. Forward

930
01:22:38.680 --> 01:22:43.920
Slash Tours come out and join us. Book your tour in twenty twenty four.

931
01:22:45.920 --> 01:22:47.880
All right, that's it for this
program. I want to thank my

932
01:22:47.920 --> 01:22:54.800
guest today Kingsley L. Dennis coming
to us from England, and my team

933
01:22:54.960 --> 01:22:59.680
of Gail Tour, Mark Foster and
everyone who makes this thing happen. You

934
01:22:59.760 --> 01:23:02.319
gay is rock, all right,
take care of you well and we will

935
01:23:02.439 --> 01:23:03.560
talk to you next time.