WEBVTT 1 00:00:25.120 --> 00:00:29.320 Hello there everybody, and welcome back to the Disconnected. I am here with 2 00:00:29.559 --> 00:00:33.840 Craig and Dennis from Deaf Crocodile. Thank you guys for coming on today. 3 00:00:34.280 --> 00:00:39.960 I've gotten many many requests to hear some stories from you guys, because you 4 00:00:40.000 --> 00:00:45.320 have such a wild past in terms of the industry this hobby as a whole 5 00:00:46.000 --> 00:00:52.479 restoration and suddenly coming on as many people's newfound favorite boutique, Blu Ray label. 6 00:00:52.880 --> 00:00:56.719 So thank you for fulfilling all of those requests today. Appreciate it. 7 00:00:56.759 --> 00:01:00.079 Oh, thank you for having us. For those that don't know, could 8 00:01:00.119 --> 00:01:06.439 you possibly share one of the time some of your your varied magical backgrounds that 9 00:01:06.519 --> 00:01:12.040 both of you have had. Maybe Craig go first. Sure. I moved 10 00:01:12.040 --> 00:01:21.400 to Los Angeles in nineteen ninety four to go to film school and I found 11 00:01:22.439 --> 00:01:30.040 I couldn't afford USC and so I found actually a film trade school called Columbia 12 00:01:30.079 --> 00:01:34.200 College Hollywood, and they used to be on Le Brea Avenue in Hollywood, 13 00:01:34.480 --> 00:01:42.159 and they've now moved to the old Panavision building in Tarzana. They're much bigger 14 00:01:42.159 --> 00:01:49.560 and nicer place than when I was going there. Then kind of got disillusioned, 15 00:01:51.280 --> 00:01:59.239 worked in travel that industry imploded with the everything going on to the Internet, 16 00:02:00.519 --> 00:02:04.000 so reached out to a friend I had met when I was in film 17 00:02:04.040 --> 00:02:09.800 school and got a job at Imax back in two thousand, so I've worked 18 00:02:10.360 --> 00:02:15.479 in film since two thousand. I was at Imax for a little over a 19 00:02:15.520 --> 00:02:22.759 decade. One of the things I liked most about working at Imax was when 20 00:02:22.800 --> 00:02:29.319 I was doing digital. It wasn't really restoration so much. It was because 21 00:02:29.360 --> 00:02:35.120 it was like usually new films, but being Imax, the screens are so 22 00:02:35.280 --> 00:02:43.199 large. Things had to be very clean or it looked very dirty. And 23 00:02:43.240 --> 00:02:47.360 then that combined with my love of history and just sit them in general, 24 00:02:47.840 --> 00:02:53.120 I thought, you know what I'd really like to do is restore movies. 25 00:02:53.360 --> 00:02:59.280 And I was also kind of inspired by Martin Scorsese's passion for film preservation. 26 00:03:00.120 --> 00:03:01.280 So when I left Imax, I was like, well, I'm going to 27 00:03:01.400 --> 00:03:07.520 just try doing this on my own, and I started a one man operation 28 00:03:07.719 --> 00:03:10.520 and reached out to some people I knew and started. The first work was 29 00:03:10.520 --> 00:03:20.280 restoring some old sixty surfing films for mcgilery Freeman, who he got his start 30 00:03:20.599 --> 00:03:25.159 making surfing films in the sixties, and then he was doing aerial photography. 31 00:03:25.199 --> 00:03:31.680 He actually shot the aerial opening of the Shining Oh Wow. And then when 32 00:03:31.840 --> 00:03:37.599 Imax debuted in the seventies, he was one of the first people to make 33 00:03:38.039 --> 00:03:40.919 an Imax film and then that's that's his whole career that he's known for now 34 00:03:42.039 --> 00:03:46.759 is with Imax films, but it started with his surfing films. So I 35 00:03:46.800 --> 00:03:51.879 was working on those. That led to I needed a place that could scan 36 00:03:53.400 --> 00:04:01.800 sixteen millimeter reversal, and so Delicious in Holly would could do that, and 37 00:04:02.240 --> 00:04:06.240 they did that job for me, but then convinced me I should work for 38 00:04:06.280 --> 00:04:13.639 them, being the head of their restoration. So that's where I met Dennis 39 00:04:15.279 --> 00:04:20.079 This and Delicious was it was kind of amazing. It was like every everybody 40 00:04:20.160 --> 00:04:28.360 was doing what they really loved doing, and then just internally that company kind 41 00:04:28.360 --> 00:04:31.879 of imploded, and a group of us just decided, well, well, 42 00:04:31.920 --> 00:04:39.600 this is silly, you know, the the company imploded not because of business, 43 00:04:40.399 --> 00:04:43.720 and we're all doing what we love. We should just keep doing it 44 00:04:43.800 --> 00:04:50.160 on our own. So then we formed Barbelows and then Dennis and I just 45 00:04:50.279 --> 00:04:56.720 kind of we just had different ideas of what we wanted to do. So 46 00:04:57.360 --> 00:05:00.600 Dennis and I were like, well, we can do what we want to 47 00:05:00.639 --> 00:05:06.800 do, and we started deaf guys out and already making some waves obviously with 48 00:05:06.879 --> 00:05:12.720 that name. So thank you guys for that specifically, what about yourself there, 49 00:05:12.759 --> 00:05:17.920 Dennis, So, I would say NYU Film School back in the eighties 50 00:05:18.519 --> 00:05:24.720 New York City when it was still kind of Lou Reed's New York and you 51 00:05:24.759 --> 00:05:30.360 know, there were guys selling bootlegs tapes of Springsteen concerts on Saint Mark's place. 52 00:05:30.519 --> 00:05:35.480 And then when I got out, I worked for a little while for 53 00:05:35.639 --> 00:05:41.639 Tribeca Productions, Robert de Niro's production company when they first opened the Tribeca Film 54 00:05:41.680 --> 00:05:49.759 Center town, and through connection with Scorsese's office, I got an interview out 55 00:05:49.759 --> 00:05:55.519 here in ninety two with the American Cinema Tech and they hired me as they're 56 00:05:55.680 --> 00:05:59.759 head of programming, and I was involved with them on and off for almost 57 00:05:59.759 --> 00:06:02.800 their years. Versus head of programming. I left for a while and then 58 00:06:02.839 --> 00:06:10.360 came back on the executive management side. And then parallel to that, I 59 00:06:10.360 --> 00:06:15.560 had sold some scripts to the studios to Fox and New Line, and I 60 00:06:15.600 --> 00:06:20.879 wound up writing and producing an anthology horror film called Trap Dashes that Lionsgate put 61 00:06:20.959 --> 00:06:27.600 up in two thousand and seven with episodes directed by Monte Hellman and Joe Dante 62 00:06:27.680 --> 00:06:38.639 and Ken Russell and Sean Cunningham, and then continued working free lance until I 63 00:06:38.680 --> 00:06:45.279 partnered with the guy named Paul Korver, who was the president of Sinalicious as 64 00:06:45.279 --> 00:06:48.279 a parent company, and we started a distribution division, which is how I 65 00:06:48.319 --> 00:06:53.519 got to work with Craig, and we wound up licensing, and Craig wound 66 00:06:53.560 --> 00:06:59.920 up restoring Belladonna Sadness and Funeral Parade of Roses and Leslie Stevens private property, 67 00:07:00.079 --> 00:07:06.639 a bunch of great projects. So we've continued to work together since. And 68 00:07:06.720 --> 00:07:12.519 I'm also now the executive director for a long running nonprofit in LA called the 69 00:07:12.519 --> 00:07:20.959 Philosophical Research Society, So we've got a bunch of different while projects going interesting. 70 00:07:23.199 --> 00:07:25.480 We have a current project we're going to talk about a little bit for 71 00:07:25.560 --> 00:07:30.439 Solomon King, but first just to share some of the philosophies. Speaking of 72 00:07:30.639 --> 00:07:35.040 for this channel, I really highlight archival on this channel quite a bit and 73 00:07:35.079 --> 00:07:40.199 making sure that we're saving things, and that's why we talk about physical media 74 00:07:40.279 --> 00:07:45.360 so much, and having these restorations be something that we value as important in 75 00:07:45.439 --> 00:07:48.480 society. And then the other thing is I tend to really try to focus 76 00:07:48.480 --> 00:07:55.079 on transparency because there's a lot of entitlement in this hobby nowadays, and there's 77 00:07:55.079 --> 00:07:58.920 a lot of people that don't understand the behind the scenes stuff. So as 78 00:07:59.000 --> 00:08:03.199 much as you can share we talked through this would be absolutely wonderful. And 79 00:08:03.879 --> 00:08:07.639 speaking of those, we've got a couple of questions that were given to me 80 00:08:07.879 --> 00:08:11.680 from my patrons of the channel, and the first one talking about restoration. 81 00:08:13.160 --> 00:08:16.920 They want to know, can you speak to both of your collective pathways into 82 00:08:16.079 --> 00:08:22.959 the restoration business and how maybe collecting any physical media sort of got there for 83 00:08:22.000 --> 00:08:31.120 you than first, well, the incident that comes to mind is many years 84 00:08:31.159 --> 00:08:33.279 ago. This would have been in the mid nineteen nineties, when I was 85 00:08:33.320 --> 00:08:39.559 programming at the Cinema Tech. We organized a retrospective tribute to the Monty Python 86 00:08:39.639 --> 00:08:48.240 group and we were really fortunate. We had Terry Jones and Terry Gilliam and 87 00:08:48.360 --> 00:08:56.759 Eric Idle join us, and Neil Lennis and Carol Cleveland and Graham Chapman's longtime 88 00:08:56.679 --> 00:09:05.039 companion husband. And when we were prepping, we got a box from Terry 89 00:09:05.080 --> 00:09:11.159 Gilliam that had been in his basement for decades, and it was all these 90 00:09:11.200 --> 00:09:20.120 amazing reels, original thirty five millimeters reels of pre python animations that he had 91 00:09:20.159 --> 00:09:24.759 done for various British TV programs, and there were little notes on it that 92 00:09:24.840 --> 00:09:28.799 said, treat this as if it's the only copy, because it is. 93 00:09:30.759 --> 00:09:37.399 And when the time came to do the actual screenings, Terry Gillium actually came 94 00:09:37.480 --> 00:09:41.879 up to the booth and noticed that we were projecting off of digital instead of 95 00:09:41.879 --> 00:09:43.919 the film prints, and he said, why aren't you running the film prints 96 00:09:43.919 --> 00:09:50.120 that I sent you? And I said, you know, if I were 97 00:09:50.200 --> 00:09:56.240 responsible for damaging in any way the only existing copy of this incredibly rare and 98 00:09:56.440 --> 00:09:58.840 beautiful animation that you did in the late sixties, like, I couldn't forgive 99 00:09:58.840 --> 00:10:03.799 my So that was probably the first thing in the back of my mind. 100 00:10:03.879 --> 00:10:09.879 One Opening that box was kind of like peering into King Hut's tomb and just 101 00:10:09.919 --> 00:10:15.039 seeing all of these wonderful treasures. But then the second part of it is 102 00:10:15.080 --> 00:10:20.840 like film is a very fragile medium. I wound up spending five years researching 103 00:10:20.879 --> 00:10:28.320 and writing a book about obsessive film collectors and film dealers that University of Mississippi 104 00:10:28.320 --> 00:10:35.840 Press put out in twenty sixteen called a Thousand Cuts, and everyone I spoke 105 00:10:35.919 --> 00:10:46.080 to had found some rare and unique element. One of the collectors, West 106 00:10:46.080 --> 00:10:50.639 Shank, was responsible for finding the four minutes of missing footage that had been 107 00:10:50.679 --> 00:10:56.159 cut out of the original nineteen thirty three King Kong, and that's footage of 108 00:10:58.200 --> 00:11:03.159 Kong playing erotically with Fay raised dress and kind of stomping and chewing on some 109 00:11:03.279 --> 00:11:09.320 of the natives on Skull Island. And it had been cut out in the 110 00:11:09.399 --> 00:11:13.720 late thirties during the Hayes production code when they thought it was too graphic and 111 00:11:13.759 --> 00:11:20.320 disturbing and some so they'd actually cut it out of the negative and it was 112 00:11:20.440 --> 00:11:24.159 lost. And what had happened was clearly back in the thirties, when the 113 00:11:24.240 --> 00:11:28.559 order came down to remove the footage, some projectionists cut it out of a 114 00:11:28.639 --> 00:11:33.840 release print, spliced it together and just kept it. And then many decades 115 00:11:33.919 --> 00:11:39.480 later this reel found its way to west Shank, and I asked him what 116 00:11:39.639 --> 00:11:43.279 he did with it, because eventually he turned it over to RKO so that 117 00:11:43.320 --> 00:11:48.480 they could include it and have the full length version of the film again. 118 00:11:48.639 --> 00:11:50.919 And I said that you charge the money, and he said, no, 119 00:11:52.000 --> 00:11:56.159 I really he said, it didn't belong to me, It belonged to everyone 120 00:11:56.200 --> 00:11:58.519 who loved King Kong. And I said, well, you know, that's 121 00:11:58.559 --> 00:12:05.879 an amazing kind of altruistic attitude to take. This isn't mine, and that's 122 00:12:05.919 --> 00:12:11.919 I think our attitude as well. Is our job is really to shine the 123 00:12:11.960 --> 00:12:18.440 best possible light on the films and the filmmakers and hopefully present the movies the 124 00:12:18.559 --> 00:12:22.679 way they would want them to be seen. And it's not about us. 125 00:12:22.759 --> 00:12:28.480 It's about the movies, whether it's Unknown Man of Shandigo or Delta Space Mission, 126 00:12:28.759 --> 00:12:35.320 or Helia Murrimetz and Sampo and upcoming Solomon King, or the new films 127 00:12:35.360 --> 00:12:39.679 that we've been doing, like The Shepherdess and The Seven Songs in the Village 128 00:12:39.679 --> 00:12:48.919 House and others. We're really here to kind of support and assist the filmmakers 129 00:12:48.000 --> 00:12:56.000 and make sure that we don't destroy Terry Gilliam's only copy of its super rare 130 00:12:56.159 --> 00:13:01.240 pre python animations. Did anything ever happen with all those originally the film reels? 131 00:13:03.799 --> 00:13:07.799 You know, that's a good question. I mean, we returned all 132 00:13:07.840 --> 00:13:13.039 of the materials, of course to Terry afterwards, and I don't know if 133 00:13:13.080 --> 00:13:22.519 anyone has put them out as a like Jerry Gilliam pre Python Rarities collection, 134 00:13:24.000 --> 00:13:28.519 because it was all these little interstitial bits and opening and closing credits and different 135 00:13:28.519 --> 00:13:33.519 things. As far as I know, it has not come out as a 136 00:13:33.559 --> 00:13:39.000 single package, and it was really wonderful stuff. I mean, if you 137 00:13:39.080 --> 00:13:43.840 love the pythons and and I don't want to talk to you if you don't 138 00:13:43.840 --> 00:13:48.440 love money Python it you know, it was so much like his later work. 139 00:13:48.600 --> 00:13:52.639 It's just fantastic to see. So it sounds like you need to make 140 00:13:52.639 --> 00:13:56.240 some phone calls that I need, I need to get to be a wonderful 141 00:13:56.279 --> 00:14:01.200 companion release to this. Yes, well we actually we have a companion released 142 00:14:01.200 --> 00:14:05.679 to that upcoming which we haven't announced, but you know, Craig can tell 143 00:14:05.720 --> 00:14:11.039 you about that as well. When other people are looking to get into restoration, 144 00:14:11.159 --> 00:14:15.120 do you guys have any suggestions for people that work in sort of an 145 00:14:15.159 --> 00:14:18.639 adjacent field, maybe editing or videography of some sort, because it seems like 146 00:14:18.919 --> 00:14:22.200 more and more people are doing that on their own nowadays. But when you 147 00:14:22.279 --> 00:14:26.919 are in this hobby, the passion, if you really have it for these 148 00:14:26.919 --> 00:14:31.000 films, it will tend to lead you toward that path. Eventually. It 149 00:14:31.000 --> 00:14:41.039 feels like yeah, I mean this secret to getting into restoration is loving it 150 00:14:41.080 --> 00:14:48.759 a whole lot because you're not going to make any money. But yeah, 151 00:14:48.960 --> 00:14:54.879 it's it's I don't know how to explain it. It's like, yeah, 152 00:14:54.960 --> 00:15:01.360 you, I mean there are some very specific, you know, technical software 153 00:15:01.759 --> 00:15:05.679 you kind of need, and then there's not a whole lot of you. 154 00:15:05.679 --> 00:15:07.840 I mean, you get a little bit of training from the company, but 155 00:15:09.240 --> 00:15:15.360 you kind of just have to do it. It's there's no I don't know. 156 00:15:15.639 --> 00:15:24.639 Most most film schools don't have a specific restoration course. You know, 157 00:15:26.440 --> 00:15:33.840 some places will have they have some stuff about archiving and preservation, which is 158 00:15:33.840 --> 00:15:41.480 a very related but not the same because yeah, preservation is usually we're talking 159 00:15:41.519 --> 00:15:48.519 like photochemical and making sure that it's in a vault for posterity. That's not 160 00:15:48.799 --> 00:15:56.320 the same as you know, digital restoration, which is for access. Like 161 00:15:56.879 --> 00:16:03.679 they're two one but both sides need each other, but they're not the same 162 00:16:03.759 --> 00:16:07.799 thing, right, Because you know, there's lots of archives that do amazing 163 00:16:07.879 --> 00:16:12.759 work and have saved a lot of films that still no one has seen because 164 00:16:12.759 --> 00:16:18.960 they're just sitting in their archives. They're safe. But what's the point if 165 00:16:19.000 --> 00:16:23.559 no one knows they exist? Exactly. Some of the stuff that you guys 166 00:16:23.639 --> 00:16:26.960 put out seems to have been on that path for a long time. Like 167 00:16:27.679 --> 00:16:32.360 your first release was The Unknown Man of Shandigor and this was gone for just 168 00:16:32.480 --> 00:16:37.600 decades, right, Yeah, that was The Unknown Movie of Shandigor. You 169 00:16:37.639 --> 00:16:44.559 know, we were really lucky. We got in touch with the Michael and 170 00:16:44.639 --> 00:16:48.039 Christian Roy, who were the sons of Jean Louis Roy. It was the 171 00:16:48.159 --> 00:16:53.000 late filmmaker who sadly died just before we were able to get in touch with 172 00:16:53.039 --> 00:17:03.679 his estates, but his sons and his wife were incredibly cooperative and supportive. 173 00:17:03.359 --> 00:17:08.200 We licensed the rights from them, and then the Cinematech Suisse had done a 174 00:17:08.240 --> 00:17:15.279 four K scan of the camera negative and transfer of the audio materials, and 175 00:17:15.920 --> 00:17:22.319 Craig was able to work his magic and wizardry on those materials to improve it 176 00:17:22.359 --> 00:17:26.400 even more. And that was just a movie that had been kind of on 177 00:17:26.440 --> 00:17:33.799 my radar for decades, and I just loved the title and the few images 178 00:17:33.839 --> 00:17:38.960 that I had seen from it. But I don't think, at least I 179 00:17:40.039 --> 00:17:48.319 wasn't prepared for how visually beautiful and striking the film turned out in the end. 180 00:17:49.079 --> 00:17:55.559 Both the direction and the cinematography by Roger Bimpaj was the director of photography 181 00:17:55.599 --> 00:18:00.759 on Kids. A really stunning film. Really is just he's on the screen 182 00:18:00.880 --> 00:18:06.680 beautifully, the black and white cinematography. Dennis had told me about it and 183 00:18:07.400 --> 00:18:15.440 his I don't know, he undertold it to me. And so I mean 184 00:18:15.960 --> 00:18:21.680 between Sin Delicious and Arbelos and and and now Deaf Crocodile. My my background 185 00:18:21.759 --> 00:18:26.079 was always old studio in the American studio films. That's those are the films 186 00:18:26.119 --> 00:18:30.880 I know. I don't we can't work on those because they're studio films. 187 00:18:32.160 --> 00:18:37.680 So so I've relied on Dennis and our old partners at Arbelos and Sin Delicious 188 00:18:37.759 --> 00:18:42.880 to unearth these films that I've never heard of before. And so he told 189 00:18:42.880 --> 00:18:45.480 me, He's like, oh, this is this the Swiss film you know, 190 00:18:45.599 --> 00:18:51.000 No man is Shander Gore. And I was like, okay. Uh 191 00:18:51.400 --> 00:18:56.440 So then I we got the film and the first time I watched it, 192 00:18:56.480 --> 00:19:00.839 I immediately called Dennis and I'm just like, dude, do you really undersold 193 00:19:00.880 --> 00:19:08.319 this? Like this thing is spectacular. It's it's it's hard to describe too. 194 00:19:08.839 --> 00:19:11.640 It is like it is a it's a spy film of its own, 195 00:19:11.680 --> 00:19:15.960 but it's also kind of a send up of spy films, but it's it's 196 00:19:17.119 --> 00:19:22.519 the fine line between you know, its own thing and a send up of 197 00:19:22.599 --> 00:19:26.240 it. It plays it right down the middle. And then, like Dennis 198 00:19:26.240 --> 00:19:33.039 had said, the cinematography and the and the location shooting, and it's it's 199 00:19:33.079 --> 00:19:38.519 the most beautiful. I mean it's it's visually it's better than any spy film 200 00:19:38.519 --> 00:19:44.160 I've ever seen, you know, know, like it's just absolutely stunning. 201 00:19:45.599 --> 00:19:48.599 So yeah, when I when I got the the scans and I was going 202 00:19:48.640 --> 00:19:51.640 through it, I was just like, scene after scene, I was like, 203 00:19:51.799 --> 00:19:57.200 this is just stunning. Really. When I first popped that in, 204 00:19:57.279 --> 00:20:02.319 that was the first thing that caught me is this is not just your average 205 00:20:02.519 --> 00:20:07.599 film restoration. This looks incredible. And then the first couple acts were good 206 00:20:07.640 --> 00:20:12.920 and beautiful as usual, But then that third act comes and it just flies 207 00:20:14.279 --> 00:20:18.640 and everything on that it like jumps off the screen at you. Is something 208 00:20:18.680 --> 00:20:22.480 that you just know is special. Is there something that originally got you guys 209 00:20:22.519 --> 00:20:29.119 into film that maybe maybe enhanced your passion for sharing some of these just very 210 00:20:29.240 --> 00:20:33.279 lost films with people, because that's just such a very specific, you know, 211 00:20:33.720 --> 00:20:37.079 niche that a lot of people will never even hear about very specific titles. 212 00:20:37.160 --> 00:20:42.119 Obviously, you know, I used to, like I said before, 213 00:20:42.200 --> 00:20:45.559 be it a hit of programming for the American cinema tech out here, and 214 00:20:45.599 --> 00:20:51.839 so sometimes I would spend a ridiculous amount of time tracking down a film that 215 00:20:52.000 --> 00:20:59.279 was hard to see. I spent years trying to find a print of of 216 00:20:59.599 --> 00:21:04.519 Mario Bova's Twitch of the Death Nerve before it was widely available, and I 217 00:21:04.559 --> 00:21:08.839 had to say, you know, there was a commentator on NPR a couple 218 00:21:08.880 --> 00:21:14.519 of years ago made a great observation and said, you know, this is 219 00:21:14.519 --> 00:21:18.079 a fantastic time to be a content consumer. It's a very difficult time to 220 00:21:18.079 --> 00:21:29.640 be a content creator in terms of getting a satisfying or sustainable revenue stream But 221 00:21:30.079 --> 00:21:33.960 if you were a fan of or you just discovered for the first time the 222 00:21:34.000 --> 00:21:40.799 movies of Kinji Fukusaku or Mario Bava or Argento or any of these great genre 223 00:21:40.799 --> 00:21:52.279 filmmakers, you can access beautiful HD streaming copies of their films instantaneously. You 224 00:21:52.359 --> 00:22:03.319 can get gorgeous blu rays, and you know you can actually and we have 225 00:22:03.440 --> 00:22:07.039 from time to time as a backup, or if no other materials were available, 226 00:22:07.039 --> 00:22:10.960 you could project in a very large movie theater off of Blu ray, 227 00:22:11.039 --> 00:22:19.160 and it looks really good. And that's incredible that there is a that there 228 00:22:19.200 --> 00:22:26.200 is a consumer format that is that high resolution, that that is kind of 229 00:22:26.200 --> 00:22:32.960 an incredible like paradigm shift. Well, yeah, it's not even talking about 230 00:22:32.960 --> 00:22:36.359 the four K Blu rays now, yeah, oh yeah, no, I 231 00:22:36.359 --> 00:22:41.039 mean, I mean four K is the cinema standard now, so we have 232 00:22:41.200 --> 00:22:47.440 that at home. Four K. If you if you scan, you know, 233 00:22:47.720 --> 00:22:51.079 or if you have a four K player, you are essentially seeing the 234 00:22:51.200 --> 00:22:57.680 resolution of a thirty five millimeter film frame. So that is equivalent to owning 235 00:22:57.720 --> 00:23:03.759 a thirty five millimeter print. And so I knew. I talked with a 236 00:23:03.759 --> 00:23:07.599 lot of collectors that had, you know, some of them who were really 237 00:23:07.599 --> 00:23:15.559 obsessive collected thirty five millimeter and even had built beautiful miniature movie palaces with projection 238 00:23:15.720 --> 00:23:21.839 booth in their own home with thirty five milimeter changeover. But most of them 239 00:23:22.359 --> 00:23:29.319 collected sixteen millimeter. But Blu ray and especially you know, four K Ultra 240 00:23:29.400 --> 00:23:36.480 high death is way beyond that in terms of the resolution you're seeing, and 241 00:23:36.480 --> 00:23:41.680 that is kind of mind blowing. So when I came out here in the 242 00:23:41.759 --> 00:23:48.039 nineties and I started getting interested in the work of Mario Bobbin and Luccio Fulci 243 00:23:48.200 --> 00:23:56.640 and Jess Franco. There was almost nothing available on any home video consumer format, 244 00:23:56.880 --> 00:24:02.839 and so so I would spend five seven years trying to find a print 245 00:24:02.880 --> 00:24:06.880 of Twitch of the Death Nerve, which we eventually found, I think with 246 00:24:07.119 --> 00:24:15.359 the Cinematech Royale in Belgium and brought in for a one time show. So 247 00:24:15.400 --> 00:24:19.960 I would spend all of this time fly a print in and we would show 248 00:24:21.000 --> 00:24:26.200 it one time. I remember we did a tribute to Hammer Films in the 249 00:24:26.279 --> 00:24:33.240 UK and we brought in an original thirty five millimeters ibtechnicolored print of John Gillings 250 00:24:33.279 --> 00:24:41.279 The Reptile with Jacqueline Pierce, one of two great companion films he made, 251 00:24:41.319 --> 00:24:45.759 along with Plague of the Zombies or two of my favorite Hammer films. This 252 00:24:45.920 --> 00:24:49.640 print was immaculate. It must have been the show print they probably used for 253 00:24:49.720 --> 00:24:55.880 the premiere, and I'm guessing it was struck off the camera negative because it 254 00:24:55.920 --> 00:25:00.759 looked like it had never run through a protector or maybe once and it came 255 00:25:00.759 --> 00:25:06.200 from the vaults. I think at Pinewood we showed it once and I knew 256 00:25:06.200 --> 00:25:08.400 Immediately I was like, this is one of the most beautiful technically prints I've 257 00:25:08.440 --> 00:25:12.880 ever seen. And then afterwards we boxed it up and we shipped it back 258 00:25:12.920 --> 00:25:18.160 to England. Now, if you were there for that show, the hundred 259 00:25:18.160 --> 00:25:22.400 and twenty five people who saw it had this incredible experience like never to be 260 00:25:22.480 --> 00:25:26.160 repeated, literally because I don't know where that print is now or if it 261 00:25:26.200 --> 00:25:33.519 even still exists, but it occurred to me at some point this is like 262 00:25:33.799 --> 00:25:40.759 a lot of work for you know, a one time event, and that's 263 00:25:40.799 --> 00:25:48.160 great if you're an exhibition. But from a an access preservation, consumer perspective, 264 00:25:49.319 --> 00:25:56.839 you know, maybe making these things available in a format that's more easily 265 00:25:56.880 --> 00:26:00.599 accessible is a better thing. And that's what we do now. If we 266 00:26:00.680 --> 00:26:07.000 don't we love film, almost everything we do starts in an analog film format 267 00:26:07.119 --> 00:26:12.720 but then is transferred to digital and you know, and Craig can talk about 268 00:26:14.200 --> 00:26:19.200 the work he's doing in our colorist Tyler Fegerstrom on Solomon King. That is 269 00:26:19.319 --> 00:26:26.839 the you know, example a for why digital restoration is so important because everything 270 00:26:26.880 --> 00:26:33.960 they're doing could not be done photochemically. Absolutely not. As much as I 271 00:26:34.039 --> 00:26:37.680 love the film medium, I wrote a book about people who are obsessed with 272 00:26:37.759 --> 00:26:45.279 film, I also see what an incredible tool digital restoration is, and for 273 00:26:45.799 --> 00:26:51.720 me, they're not. Some people are like, ah, we're never going 274 00:26:51.799 --> 00:26:55.759 to show digital. We're thirty five millimeters only and you know, and there 275 00:26:55.839 --> 00:26:59.880 is a purity to that, and there's a kind of a cool marketing book. 276 00:27:00.079 --> 00:27:03.759 But for me, it's it's the material itself and what is the best 277 00:27:03.759 --> 00:27:08.799 way to make it, you know, accessible and in the best format possible. 278 00:27:08.839 --> 00:27:14.640 And absolutely digital restoration is the way to go for almost everything we've done 279 00:27:15.119 --> 00:27:18.240 well. And it's sustainable too, obviously, with how fragile film can be 280 00:27:18.279 --> 00:27:25.279 over time. So the problem that people have with the the idea of if 281 00:27:25.319 --> 00:27:30.920 I hate digital, I only want to see film is they've seen bad restorations. 282 00:27:32.319 --> 00:27:38.480 Yeah, because so many people, different companies, even large companies that 283 00:27:38.519 --> 00:27:45.279 should know better, will just scrub all the grain gone like, and then 284 00:27:45.279 --> 00:27:49.079 they'll add a because that softens the image. So then they add a bunch 285 00:27:49.119 --> 00:27:55.920 of sharpening and so now you've got just sharp edged, you know, blobs 286 00:27:55.960 --> 00:27:59.920 with no texture running around, And people are like, see digital is off. 287 00:28:00.119 --> 00:28:03.400 It's like, well, no, Like, when you do it wrong, 288 00:28:03.480 --> 00:28:07.279 it's awful. But you know, if you shot a film and exposed 289 00:28:07.279 --> 00:28:12.079 it incorrectly, that would look bad too, because yeah, Dennis was saying 290 00:28:12.079 --> 00:28:18.720 about that that print being likely a show print struck from the negative. That's 291 00:28:18.759 --> 00:28:26.720 always my bar. That's my goal for every restoration. If we've got access 292 00:28:26.720 --> 00:28:30.599 to the original negative. When I'm done, it should look like that show 293 00:28:30.640 --> 00:28:37.480 print, like no damage, all the grain is there. It just you 294 00:28:37.519 --> 00:28:41.759 know, it's just in immaculate. What people at the premiere saw is what 295 00:28:42.119 --> 00:28:48.160 my goal is. And I'm always kind of fascinated. I appreciate it, 296 00:28:48.200 --> 00:28:55.759 but I'm always kind of surprised when people see my work and always comments on 297 00:28:56.359 --> 00:29:00.359 how it still looks like film and like you retain the grain, and I'm 298 00:29:00.400 --> 00:29:07.079 like, yeah, it's just it's weird to me that that's an anomally. 299 00:29:08.640 --> 00:29:15.559 This is an example of a film that another movie we've now been gently and 300 00:29:15.640 --> 00:29:25.720 persistently trying to license rights on for four or five years now. I don't 301 00:29:26.039 --> 00:29:30.880 because we haven't closed a deal, but it is this amazing and almost completely 302 00:29:30.000 --> 00:29:42.279 unknown Eastern European full horror movie that's really incredible, and the studio that owns 303 00:29:42.319 --> 00:29:48.519 the rights to it overseas had done or or I think subcontracted with a private 304 00:29:48.559 --> 00:29:53.240 company to do a restoration, and unfortunately, what they what they did, 305 00:29:53.279 --> 00:29:59.599 which is what happens in a lot of cases, is they use scratch removal 306 00:29:59.599 --> 00:30:06.200 and grain reduction software and they've taken out a lot of detail that the filmmaker 307 00:30:06.240 --> 00:30:12.680 intended to be in there. There's a scene in a cemetery where it's lightly 308 00:30:12.799 --> 00:30:21.319 raining, not anymore, not anymore, because it looks like the grain reduction 309 00:30:21.599 --> 00:30:26.799 software removed all the rain. And we know because we have an earlier version 310 00:30:26.880 --> 00:30:29.839 of the film and we're like, guys, you know, there's supposed to 311 00:30:29.880 --> 00:30:34.799 be light rain falling here and and now it's it's gone, even the fog. 312 00:30:36.319 --> 00:30:41.119 Like yeah, it's like you're they just wiped away everything. There's an 313 00:30:41.240 --> 00:30:48.480 there's another movie, an incredible UH period epic that we've looked into UH re 314 00:30:48.480 --> 00:30:53.319 releasing for a while, and they did again. The studio Oversees Different One 315 00:30:53.880 --> 00:31:00.799 did a restoration and they removed all of the the texture from the skin, 316 00:31:02.599 --> 00:31:10.480 so all of the characters look like slightly rubbery mannequins. And it's like, 317 00:31:10.599 --> 00:31:15.119 yes, the image is incredibly clean, but it's so clean that they look 318 00:31:15.240 --> 00:31:21.079 like artificial humans now, and like you've gone too far in the opposite direction. 319 00:31:21.160 --> 00:31:25.359 We actually see that happen quite a bit, where you know, there's 320 00:31:25.519 --> 00:31:30.440 there's studio level restoration, which is which is what we aim for, which 321 00:31:30.480 --> 00:31:37.559 is what Columbia, Warner Brothers or Disney or any of the major studios would 322 00:31:37.559 --> 00:31:48.720 consider to be the studio grade. And that's that's our goal internally. And 323 00:31:48.799 --> 00:31:52.960 sometimes we have to delay, Like there's a film we were hoping to release 324 00:31:52.079 --> 00:31:56.640 later this year and it and we did a new four case scan from the 325 00:31:56.680 --> 00:32:02.400 original camera negative, and and it's a companion film by the same filmmakers who 326 00:32:02.440 --> 00:32:08.119 did Delta Space Mission and the similar animated sci fi style, even more obscure, 327 00:32:08.160 --> 00:32:12.680 if that's possible than Delta Space Mission. And it's just going to require 328 00:32:12.759 --> 00:32:19.960 more time for Craig to to remove dirt and scratches and make it look the 329 00:32:19.960 --> 00:32:24.119 way it should. So sometimes we have to actually delay or push back our 330 00:32:24.200 --> 00:32:31.640 planned release dates because Craig, thank god, is a perfectionist, and he's 331 00:32:31.680 --> 00:32:35.720 like, this is going to be our shot, and who knows if anyone 332 00:32:35.759 --> 00:32:42.920 after us will take the time and expend the crazy resources to release this film. 333 00:32:43.720 --> 00:32:49.119 So it's our kind of responsibility to make it look as as beautiful as 334 00:32:49.119 --> 00:32:52.400 possible, and thank god he does. I mean, obviously that's our that's 335 00:32:52.440 --> 00:32:59.839 our huge advantages. That set a bar that people are expecting. And so 336 00:33:00.279 --> 00:33:05.759 if if we put out something now that's you know, dirty and still flickers, 337 00:33:05.799 --> 00:33:10.359 and they'd be like what happened? And I'm like, and I don't 338 00:33:10.359 --> 00:33:16.720 want to put my name on that, but yeah, like the companies or 339 00:33:16.759 --> 00:33:22.960 the the do the you know, they just set all the dolls to eleven 340 00:33:22.039 --> 00:33:27.119 and they're like, look, it's clean. Uh. I mean part of 341 00:33:27.119 --> 00:33:30.000 me gets it because it's you know, everyone wants it done. They want 342 00:33:30.119 --> 00:33:34.519 they want to feature restored, and they want it in a week or two 343 00:33:35.319 --> 00:33:39.559 and they've got five thousand dollars and that is literally the only way that that's 344 00:33:39.599 --> 00:33:45.960 going to happen. But it's I would I would rather, you you know, 345 00:33:47.079 --> 00:33:51.759 put it out with a bunch of dirt still in it, you know, 346 00:33:52.079 --> 00:34:01.079 like it just I don't I don't understand who would prefer it looks completely 347 00:34:02.000 --> 00:34:09.320 robbed of all texture, But it seems to happen a lot. I saw 348 00:34:09.360 --> 00:34:15.480 someone on a Facebook group posting some work they did before and after, and 349 00:34:15.519 --> 00:34:19.400 I almost type a comment and I'm like, no, if you haven't got 350 00:34:19.440 --> 00:34:22.840 anything nice to say, don't say anything at all, because the after was 351 00:34:22.880 --> 00:34:31.920 worse. And just for you know, just a rough estimate, just for 352 00:34:32.039 --> 00:34:40.920 your your your viewer, is a good four K restoration will cost at minimum 353 00:34:40.960 --> 00:34:47.760 about fifty to seventy five dollars on the low end, between scanning color grade 354 00:34:47.840 --> 00:34:52.559 if you need audio restoration, and then the digital restoration. So that's what 355 00:34:52.639 --> 00:34:57.199 you're what you're looking at. And if someone says, oh, we did 356 00:34:57.199 --> 00:35:05.039 a fantastic four K restoration and only just fifteen thousand dollars, then either nobody 357 00:35:05.079 --> 00:35:09.760 was getting paid or it's not a really good four K restoration because it's just 358 00:35:09.840 --> 00:35:16.239 there's hard costs that you can't get around, and then then the sky's the 359 00:35:16.280 --> 00:35:22.239 limit, depending on, you know, the quality of the materials and the 360 00:35:22.280 --> 00:35:27.280 rest. The four K restoration that we were involved with on Belladonna's Sadness at 361 00:35:27.280 --> 00:35:32.800 Some Delicious Picks cost close to two hundred thousand dollars when all was said and 362 00:35:32.880 --> 00:35:38.320 done, because they seven minutes of footage had been cut out of the film 363 00:35:38.360 --> 00:35:43.679 in the late seventies for an unsuccessful reissue, and they lost that footage, 364 00:35:44.159 --> 00:35:47.880 so we had to try and track down a complete original release print of the 365 00:35:47.920 --> 00:35:54.320 film, which we found also ironically with the Cinematech Royale in Belgium, the 366 00:35:54.360 --> 00:36:00.840 two times in my life that I've dealt with him, and they've very kindly 367 00:36:00.960 --> 00:36:07.280 scanned the missing footage and four K which had Flemish and French subtitles. Fortunately, 368 00:36:07.360 --> 00:36:10.400 there's not a lot of dialogue in that film, and we were able 369 00:36:10.440 --> 00:36:15.199 to digitally remove the subtitles that were visible and then replace it. It's not 370 00:36:16.320 --> 00:36:21.800 the same resolution as the four K scan from the camera negative for the rest 371 00:36:21.800 --> 00:36:25.840 of the movie. But if you don't know, like if you're if you're 372 00:36:25.880 --> 00:36:30.679 a specialist in a restoration like Craig, you can tell that it's from a 373 00:36:30.719 --> 00:36:37.760 different source. But if not, you won't even notice. And that's also 374 00:36:37.920 --> 00:36:42.719 a testament to Craig and colorists. I mean, color grade is one of 375 00:36:42.840 --> 00:36:45.079 you know, Craig, maybe you could talk to that. Color grade is 376 00:36:45.079 --> 00:36:54.559 one of the unsung aspects of digital restoration. Everyone thinks it's it's just dustbusting, 377 00:36:54.639 --> 00:37:00.159 removing scratches, repairing damage, lost frames, torn sprockets, things like 378 00:37:00.199 --> 00:37:06.519 that, and that's incredibly important, but color grade is also essential, and 379 00:37:06.920 --> 00:37:13.800 honestly, it's one of the things that people screw up the most often. 380 00:37:15.760 --> 00:37:20.119 I'll look at new restorations and I'll go, especially technicolor films from the forties 381 00:37:20.119 --> 00:37:25.440 and fifties, I go, ah, this just doesn't look like an original 382 00:37:25.440 --> 00:37:30.360 technicolor print. And it's and in some cases it because it's because I've actually 383 00:37:30.480 --> 00:37:36.880 shown original thirty five millimeters tech or even nitrate tech prints of those titles, 384 00:37:36.920 --> 00:37:44.079 and so I know that's what it looks like in an original print. The 385 00:37:44.119 --> 00:37:47.320 War of the World's restoration actually is a very good example of the where they 386 00:37:47.400 --> 00:37:55.480 I think they did a great job of matching the color grade of original IB 387 00:37:55.639 --> 00:38:01.440 technicolor. Yeah. I mean you need someone involved in the restoration that has 388 00:38:01.719 --> 00:38:06.039 seen it but knows, you know, this is what it looks like, 389 00:38:06.159 --> 00:38:10.920 because if they've never seen it, they don't know. You know, it's 390 00:38:12.840 --> 00:38:20.599 it's a yeah, it's it's important that that there's still like knowledge needs to 391 00:38:20.639 --> 00:38:29.000 get passed on right to from generation to generation, and people that actually saw 392 00:38:29.320 --> 00:38:34.880 film on a screen, especially the older stuff, it's not a lot of 393 00:38:34.880 --> 00:38:42.000 people that have that knowledge, and it's it's and it's kind of a knowledge 394 00:38:42.039 --> 00:38:46.719 that's difficult to pass on, Like what you know what something looked like, 395 00:38:46.719 --> 00:38:50.960 like, how do you pass that on to the next generation? Like, 396 00:38:52.800 --> 00:38:58.840 so, yeah, it's it's definitely important that you know, different films from 397 00:38:58.840 --> 00:39:06.199 different periods have different looks. The speaking of color were as when we did 398 00:39:06.239 --> 00:39:15.360 the restoration for Assault on Precinct thirteen, there was well one one is that 399 00:39:15.480 --> 00:39:19.920 we were instructed and we didn't need to be, but we were instructed don't 400 00:39:19.960 --> 00:39:23.719 make it look like a modern film, which we would we would never have 401 00:39:23.800 --> 00:39:30.440 done anyway. But as far as color restoration goes, there's the head of 402 00:39:30.519 --> 00:39:36.239 reel I think it was Real four, I don't know one of one of 403 00:39:36.280 --> 00:39:39.679 the the head of one of the reels. When that film first came out, 404 00:39:39.760 --> 00:39:49.920 they they were making prints from the original negative, which you don't generally 405 00:39:49.960 --> 00:39:57.119 do for a wide release. And the reason why is that the lab tore 406 00:39:57.440 --> 00:40:01.679 the head of Reel four and split it right down the middle the original negative, 407 00:40:04.039 --> 00:40:07.519 and they didn't have an IP or an I N and they didn't have 408 00:40:07.559 --> 00:40:14.159 a backup. So every release of that film sense, the head of Real 409 00:40:14.320 --> 00:40:21.159 four looks kind of like a muddy kind of mess because all they could do 410 00:40:22.360 --> 00:40:30.159 is shoot an optical negative from a release print and then print from that negative, 411 00:40:30.639 --> 00:40:36.199 a negative that was made from a print, and yeah, so the 412 00:40:36.599 --> 00:40:43.440 grain is huge and soft. It just doesn't look that great. So when 413 00:40:43.440 --> 00:40:51.800 we were doing the restoration, they discovered that Joe had the producer, had 414 00:40:51.920 --> 00:41:00.280 an original release print that was printed from the original negative before the damage, 415 00:41:00.480 --> 00:41:09.639 but it was completely faded red. So working with our colorists, he was 416 00:41:09.679 --> 00:41:17.760 working on it and then we so we had we had the dupe negative that 417 00:41:17.920 --> 00:41:23.239 had been cut in years ago but was really soft, but it was the 418 00:41:23.280 --> 00:41:30.400 correct color. And then we had this print which had all the resolution but 419 00:41:30.519 --> 00:41:34.760 didn't have the color. So I asked Tyler. I was like, hey, 420 00:41:36.320 --> 00:41:40.440 can we digitally kind of use both elements, like use the resolution from 421 00:41:40.519 --> 00:41:45.360 one but then like steal the color from the other. And I was on 422 00:41:45.400 --> 00:41:49.159 the phone with him asking him about this and he's like, I'm actually trying 423 00:41:49.199 --> 00:41:54.760 that right now. Both had the same idea and it did. It did 424 00:41:54.800 --> 00:42:00.119 work out. It was interesting because it it had to go through like three 425 00:42:00.159 --> 00:42:06.599 phases to get to a point where it looked right because then there was fringe 426 00:42:06.639 --> 00:42:10.800 because you know, you got two different elements comps on each other and it's 427 00:42:10.840 --> 00:42:15.480 not exactly the same, so you kind of got this ghosting effect that then 428 00:42:15.559 --> 00:42:22.480 we got rid of that, and then getting the timing right brought out this 429 00:42:22.480 --> 00:42:29.079 this big, chunky red noise in the image that we then had to remove 430 00:42:29.119 --> 00:42:34.960 that, but in the end it now looks the head of Real four looks 431 00:42:35.000 --> 00:42:42.440 the same as the rest of Real four. So then our next one of 432 00:42:42.440 --> 00:42:46.519 our next projects was Solomon King, and so I called Tyler. I'm like, 433 00:42:46.599 --> 00:42:50.559 hey, Tyler, remember you did that little section that was all read. 434 00:42:52.679 --> 00:42:59.239 We've got an entire film that looks like that. So it was good 435 00:42:59.280 --> 00:43:04.280 that we had this practice of how to get color back. In the case 436 00:43:04.320 --> 00:43:08.199 of Solomon King, we weren't comping two different elements because we literally the faded 437 00:43:08.320 --> 00:43:15.519 print we have is the only element that there isn't anything else. And so 438 00:43:15.559 --> 00:43:22.119 he did some tests and quite a while back we posted a video, you 439 00:43:22.159 --> 00:43:24.199 know, of this initial test when we kind of announced we were going to 440 00:43:24.280 --> 00:43:31.440 be doing it, and it looked amazing. And in the months since then, 441 00:43:34.159 --> 00:43:38.559 Tyler's been able to refine his process even more and it looks it looks 442 00:43:38.559 --> 00:43:45.280 better than that original video did. So it's just it's just kind of miraculous 443 00:43:45.400 --> 00:43:52.280 that this film that's been just gone and then the one element that was left 444 00:43:52.719 --> 00:43:59.800 is just a faded you know, pink print. We're able to put it 445 00:43:59.800 --> 00:44:06.079 back out, you know now with its original you know, it looks it 446 00:44:06.119 --> 00:44:10.119 looks amazing. I'm I'm shocked. I'm like, I get the the real 447 00:44:10.199 --> 00:44:14.480 from Tyler and I'm going through and give him some you know, some notes 448 00:44:14.559 --> 00:44:20.079 for the color grade. But overall, I'm just like, this is amazing, 449 00:44:20.239 --> 00:44:28.119 Like this film that that really should be seen because you know, in 450 00:44:28.159 --> 00:44:30.480 Dennis, you can you can talk more about the story behind it. But 451 00:44:31.719 --> 00:44:36.599 it's the more we got into this project with Solomon King, the more we 452 00:44:36.760 --> 00:44:43.840 realized this is about a lot more than this film. It's it's more about 453 00:44:43.880 --> 00:44:47.400 the people who made it in the time it was made in and ah, 454 00:44:49.519 --> 00:44:57.840 it shouldn't be h it shouldn't be lost because yeah, it it falls into 455 00:44:57.880 --> 00:45:02.639 the mean people are going to put it in the blaxploitation category, but it's 456 00:45:02.679 --> 00:45:08.199 not a blaxploitation film. It's an independent film made by a black filmmaker in 457 00:45:08.239 --> 00:45:15.800 the seventies and that's not the same thing. So Dennis, yeah, why 458 00:45:15.800 --> 00:45:22.119 don't you. Yes. Sal Watts, who co directed, wrote Start In 459 00:45:22.199 --> 00:45:29.840 he plays Solomon King, produced the movie was this amazing entrepreneurial and creative figure. 460 00:45:30.119 --> 00:45:35.159 We kind of say he was like Oakland's equivalent of Barry Gordy because he 461 00:45:35.280 --> 00:45:40.320 had two record labels. In the mid seventies, he executive produced a local 462 00:45:40.360 --> 00:45:49.880 Oakland dance and music program called soul Is or The Jay Payton Show, hosted 463 00:45:49.880 --> 00:45:55.239 by a famous MC impresario and Oakland Jay Payton. He had a string of 464 00:45:55.320 --> 00:46:01.840 fashion stores, mister Sal's fashions, He owned, restaurants, made movies. 465 00:46:02.719 --> 00:46:09.559 So he was working in all of these media and fashion and the restaurant fields. 466 00:46:10.400 --> 00:46:16.039 And you see all of that combined in Solomon King. Because the soundtrack 467 00:46:16.559 --> 00:46:22.280 with all of these amazing and virtually unknown Oakland artists was put out on his 468 00:46:22.360 --> 00:46:29.400 own sal Law label. A lot of the costumes in the film were from 469 00:46:29.480 --> 00:46:35.920 mister Salle's fashions. They shot in his house. There's a scene there's a 470 00:46:35.960 --> 00:46:40.760 scene it's it's one of the kind of the funny scenes where he's he's being 471 00:46:42.400 --> 00:46:46.519 tended to after getting shots and he's laying in the bed and this woman's coming 472 00:46:46.559 --> 00:46:52.280 to to undress him and he puts his feet up on the bed and he's 473 00:46:52.280 --> 00:46:57.639 got these shoes on that I just paused it and I was like, oh 474 00:46:57.679 --> 00:47:02.440 my god, Like I wish I had the confidence in the fact to pull 475 00:47:02.480 --> 00:47:10.400 off of shoes the incredible black and white with like a four inch heel, 476 00:47:10.719 --> 00:47:21.480 like they are the coolest look of shoes. No that the I mean really 477 00:47:21.840 --> 00:47:28.400 a book should be written about sal And and his wife Belinda, who we 478 00:47:28.519 --> 00:47:32.079 have been really blessed to become great friends with and and license the rights to 479 00:47:32.159 --> 00:47:39.440 us manages his estate, because I mean that the film is super fun. 480 00:47:39.519 --> 00:47:45.480 It was Sally was obviously trying to make a commercial, you know, crime 481 00:47:45.519 --> 00:47:51.519 film in the vein of of Shaft or like Rudy Raymore with with dolomite, 482 00:47:51.599 --> 00:48:00.119 and and it captures so much of of black music, fashion, culture, 483 00:48:01.920 --> 00:48:07.440 businesses. You know what the neighborhoods looked like at that period in Oakland in 484 00:48:07.519 --> 00:48:15.159 nineteen seventy three seventy four, And just as a historical document of those scenes 485 00:48:15.239 --> 00:48:23.519 in that time, I think it's it's amazing because of course Oakland is radically 486 00:48:23.559 --> 00:48:31.360 transformed and it's being gentrified and changing as we speak, So it doesn't look 487 00:48:31.400 --> 00:48:37.679 like that doesn't sound like that. I wish we had photos of the interior 488 00:48:37.800 --> 00:48:43.599 or the interior of mister Salle's fashions or some of the clothes, and that's 489 00:48:43.639 --> 00:48:49.800 a whole other avenue for research. I'm hoping that somebody will be able to 490 00:48:50.320 --> 00:48:55.400 do an article or a blog post about that. Apparently there was a designer, 491 00:48:55.599 --> 00:49:01.400 clothing designer named Jesse Strange who create aided many of the most incredible clothes 492 00:49:01.440 --> 00:49:07.880 for mister Salle's fashions. And I've tried digging. We've talked to the African 493 00:49:07.880 --> 00:49:13.559 American Museum in Oakland, which part of the public library system there, and 494 00:49:13.599 --> 00:49:20.239 they've searched their archives and we can't come up with it any images, ads, 495 00:49:20.360 --> 00:49:24.400 or anything about Jesse Strange. So if somebody out there knows anything about 496 00:49:24.480 --> 00:49:29.559 Jesse Strange, who designed clothes for mister Salle's fashions in the seventies, please 497 00:49:29.639 --> 00:49:32.320 let us know because we would love to. I mean, we're including some 498 00:49:32.480 --> 00:49:37.400 of the photos, and of course the film showcases those clothes, and we 499 00:49:37.440 --> 00:49:44.360 have some incredible photos from the set of Soul Is aka The j Payton Show 500 00:49:44.719 --> 00:49:52.880 with Jesse Strange's designs, but we don't know anything else about him. He's 501 00:49:52.920 --> 00:49:59.280 in the film in the end credits. This is Jay just says the commandos 502 00:49:59.320 --> 00:50:05.119 because there's a scene where they land on the beach and he's one of the 503 00:50:05.159 --> 00:50:08.880 commandos, but we don't know which one. So it was clearly it was 504 00:50:08.880 --> 00:50:15.280 one of those movies where and I know because I've directed, you know, 505 00:50:15.679 --> 00:50:21.679 independent genre films, and so at a certain point when you don't have any 506 00:50:21.960 --> 00:50:27.239 money left in your budget, it's crew members, friends, family, or 507 00:50:27.280 --> 00:50:32.920 even the filmmaker. You're like, okay, we need somebody put these clothes 508 00:50:32.960 --> 00:50:37.239 on and get in front of the camera. So a lot of the people 509 00:50:37.320 --> 00:50:43.239 in the cast of Solomon King were friends or family of Salin. Belinda's Belinda's 510 00:50:43.239 --> 00:50:46.280 in the film at the very end on an airplane. They shot a number 511 00:50:46.320 --> 00:50:52.320 of scenes and Belinda's and Sal's house. The Maserati that Sal drives in the 512 00:50:52.320 --> 00:50:59.519 film was Belinda's car, and I said, do you still have that? 513 00:50:59.599 --> 00:51:04.679 She goes, oh, no, I wish, but she's she's fan. 514 00:51:04.840 --> 00:51:08.960 I think she still has the painting though, right is that there's this this 515 00:51:09.079 --> 00:51:13.960 is recognize that that that first scene that we put out when they're sitting at 516 00:51:14.599 --> 00:51:16.760 the dinner table. Yeah, she was like, oh my god. She's 517 00:51:16.800 --> 00:51:22.199 like, I remember the rug because it was like the seventies thick it's a 518 00:51:22.320 --> 00:51:25.199 thick check parting and the painting on the wall. She was like, yeah, 519 00:51:25.760 --> 00:51:28.960 you know, she's like, that was our that was our house. 520 00:51:29.039 --> 00:51:31.559 Like, that's just amazing to see you. I think she may. I 521 00:51:31.559 --> 00:51:37.239 think she may still have that painting, she said. But she had what 522 00:51:37.320 --> 00:51:43.840 she thought was the camera negative in her closet for over twenty five years since 523 00:51:43.920 --> 00:51:47.159 the lab that it was held at in La closed down. And this is 524 00:51:47.199 --> 00:51:53.000 unfortunately what happens with independent productions is the negative and sound materials will be held 525 00:51:53.039 --> 00:51:58.119 at an independent lab. I mean, this is this is the one of 526 00:51:58.119 --> 00:52:04.159 the huge benefits of this having the studios as the guardians of film materials or 527 00:52:04.280 --> 00:52:07.199 archives like UCLA Film and TV Archive, who we you know, we're so 528 00:52:07.280 --> 00:52:13.599 grateful to be able to borrow the print from that is the image for Solomon 529 00:52:13.679 --> 00:52:21.760 King, because they have a central archive where they store and preserve these materials. 530 00:52:21.800 --> 00:52:25.480 But so many independently produced films are with a lab here or a lab 531 00:52:25.519 --> 00:52:29.360 there, who may be in business for twenty years, but then if they 532 00:52:29.400 --> 00:52:34.559 close, all of those materials wind up being scattered, right, and if 533 00:52:34.599 --> 00:52:38.760 they can't find the original producers or filmmakers, whoever's on the paperwork. A 534 00:52:38.760 --> 00:52:45.000 lot of that material gets junked. I mean it's I have heard horror stories 535 00:52:45.039 --> 00:52:49.599 about labs going out of business and dozens and dozens of orphan films sitting on 536 00:52:49.719 --> 00:52:53.800 racks that are then thrown in the dumpster because there is nobody to claim them 537 00:52:54.760 --> 00:53:00.679 and they can't legally sell them to somebody else. It's not it's not like 538 00:53:01.199 --> 00:53:05.119 storage Wars or something where it's like you don't pay your fee and now we 539 00:53:05.159 --> 00:53:09.800 can just sell it to anybody. So so we we talked to Belinda. 540 00:53:10.039 --> 00:53:15.440 She pulled the cans of film out of her closet, which we thought was 541 00:53:15.440 --> 00:53:19.519 the negative, and it turned out to be the original thirty five millimeter soundtrack, 542 00:53:20.039 --> 00:53:23.840 which is I was suspicious because she sent us some fronto and they were 543 00:53:23.840 --> 00:53:30.639 in paper boxes which black. To me, I'm like, that's probably audio, 544 00:53:31.440 --> 00:53:34.960 and it was. It's I mean, it's great that we have that 545 00:53:35.000 --> 00:53:39.440 though, because it's the thirty five you know, optical track. Yeah, 546 00:53:39.519 --> 00:53:45.199 so that's that's awesome, but it's left us with sound but no movie, 547 00:53:45.480 --> 00:53:47.440 Like, okay, we've got the sound, but we still don't have to 548 00:53:47.760 --> 00:53:53.960 don't have any more, we don't have any image. And then we found 549 00:53:54.079 --> 00:54:00.480 coming and reaching out to archives and private collectors. We found that you CLA 550 00:54:00.400 --> 00:54:07.400 had a single thirty five millimeter badly faded release print, and again they were 551 00:54:07.760 --> 00:54:13.599 enormously generous in making it available to us. And then after we're done with 552 00:54:13.639 --> 00:54:20.599 the restoration, we're going to deposit a digital copy of that with UCLA so 553 00:54:20.639 --> 00:54:27.599 it will be preserved, and Belinda agreed to deposit the thirty five millimeter sound 554 00:54:27.679 --> 00:54:32.519 elements. That the pieces that were in her possession are now on deposit UCLA 555 00:54:32.679 --> 00:54:38.880 Archives, so they're all together, which means the film will now be preserved 556 00:54:38.960 --> 00:54:45.519 and available for the future. And I'd say that's you know one. We 557 00:54:45.440 --> 00:54:50.400 love the film, we love the music, the portrait of Oakland at that 558 00:54:50.519 --> 00:54:54.639 time, absolutely love having become friends with Belinda, love being able to tell 559 00:54:55.400 --> 00:55:05.920 Sal's story. But we're also really grateful that we had the opportunity to preserve 560 00:55:06.000 --> 00:55:10.599 this film before it disappeared forever, because there is a good chance that it 561 00:55:10.719 --> 00:55:19.920 had it not been scanned digitally restored now in five or ten years, if 562 00:55:19.920 --> 00:55:27.400 that print goes vinegar, if all the picture elements are lost, then it's 563 00:55:27.440 --> 00:55:30.519 gone. Because as far as we know that the camera negative, we don't 564 00:55:30.519 --> 00:55:34.719 know if any innernegative or IP elements were made, but as far as we 565 00:55:34.760 --> 00:55:37.599 know, the camera negative was lost years ago and it's just gone. We 566 00:55:37.719 --> 00:55:44.079 tried numerous ways to track it. Yeah, we reached out all the different 567 00:55:44.119 --> 00:55:50.119 film marchives and laboratories because when I worked at Imax, when I first started 568 00:55:50.119 --> 00:55:55.800 there, the lab CFI was the lab we used, That is the lab 569 00:55:55.880 --> 00:56:02.480 that had the Solomon King elements, but it closed down, and so I 570 00:56:02.599 --> 00:56:10.039 reached out to some old Imax colleagues who I knew had actually worked at CFI, 571 00:56:12.159 --> 00:56:15.679 and then reached out to him, and so he got us in contact 572 00:56:15.719 --> 00:56:22.119 with anyone that where CFI elements might have gone. And so we reached out 573 00:56:22.159 --> 00:56:28.199 to every every place that's conceivable that those elements may have ended up, and 574 00:56:28.559 --> 00:56:34.639 there's just nothing and we have even tried to track down I'm going to open 575 00:56:34.719 --> 00:56:37.360 my file here for a second and see if I can get the name, 576 00:56:38.559 --> 00:56:57.239 uh, the recording studio where they did let's see. So, yeah, 577 00:56:57.360 --> 00:57:01.360 so it was, it was recorded. The sound track was recorded at CBA 578 00:57:01.679 --> 00:57:08.519 Studios here in La Well. CBA no longer exists under that name, but 579 00:57:08.599 --> 00:57:21.320 it later became a nonprofit kind of cultural music institute in the same building and 580 00:57:21.360 --> 00:57:22.920 we did reach out to them about six months ago and said, hey, 581 00:57:22.920 --> 00:57:29.400 do do you have any old boxes of audio tapes lying around and they said, 582 00:57:29.440 --> 00:57:30.719 yeah, no, we do. We're going to check. But unfortunately, 583 00:57:30.880 --> 00:57:37.039 if they've not managed to discover any any of the missing Solomon King audio 584 00:57:37.199 --> 00:57:42.039 masters, so as far as we know, those elements are gone as well. 585 00:57:43.239 --> 00:57:45.679 And we do have the you know, we have the thirty five millimeter 586 00:57:46.519 --> 00:57:51.679 soundtrack, the original, which is great, but of course that has dialogue 587 00:57:51.679 --> 00:57:54.679 and effects mixed in of course, and then we have original vinyl copies of 588 00:57:54.719 --> 00:58:00.360 the album which are pretty pristine. We haven't complete given up hope that the 589 00:58:00.400 --> 00:58:07.719 audio masters will pop up somewhere, but you know, unfortunately, again with 590 00:58:07.800 --> 00:58:12.719 independent productions and i know, produced films independently, you know, you move 591 00:58:12.760 --> 00:58:16.440 around and elements will get split up between various producers. Although be again with 592 00:58:16.519 --> 00:58:21.840 the lab like CFI or whatever, and they get lost, they slip through 593 00:58:21.840 --> 00:58:25.320 the cracks. This is one of the great tragedies of you know, film 594 00:58:25.360 --> 00:58:30.679 preservation that even like as we're speaking right now, elements are being lost. 595 00:58:30.719 --> 00:58:36.960 They are because you know, the studios don't preserve everything, and even when 596 00:58:37.000 --> 00:58:43.079 they do, you know, I talked with Joe Dante for my book and 597 00:58:44.519 --> 00:58:50.840 on film collectors, and he and others, I think Robert Rodriguez they had 598 00:58:50.880 --> 00:58:54.559 directed there. They did a series it was it Showtime. It was kind 599 00:58:54.559 --> 00:59:04.320 of updated remakes of Roger Corman movies from the fifties. Yep. And they 600 00:59:05.000 --> 00:59:07.800 I think they shot on film but posted on digital, and they went back 601 00:59:07.920 --> 00:59:14.239 years later to try and find the elements to re release them on I think 602 00:59:14.239 --> 00:59:24.400 it was first DVD and found out that everything had been junked except for I 603 00:59:24.400 --> 00:59:28.480 think it might have been a D one or a D two master. It 604 00:59:28.519 --> 00:59:34.880 was all that existed, so it was still preserved, but not nearly in 605 00:59:34.920 --> 00:59:39.519 the resolution that it would want. And that's apparently all that exists. Now 606 00:59:39.880 --> 00:59:45.840 we're talking about films that were shot within the past twenty five thirty years, 607 00:59:45.360 --> 00:59:51.440 and not just by small names, by bigger directors too. Oh yeah. 608 00:59:51.599 --> 00:59:57.199 So this was for like a major cable network with very well known filmmakers. 609 00:59:58.320 --> 01:00:06.599 So it's one of the reasons why I encourage filmmakers to always get a thirty 610 01:00:06.599 --> 01:00:12.199 five millimeter print. If you know it's possible, that's that you probably need 611 01:00:12.280 --> 01:00:16.840 to be on a Christopher Nolan or Paul Thomas Anderson level now because everything's digital. 612 01:00:16.880 --> 01:00:22.480 But at the very least, see if you can get a pro res 613 01:00:22.639 --> 01:00:28.800 or a DCP or something that you know, you can sock away or put 614 01:00:28.840 --> 01:00:36.719 on deposit with an archive so that some high res file of your film will 615 01:00:36.760 --> 01:00:42.880 be preserved. So Solomon King is coming soon and we talked a lot about 616 01:00:42.880 --> 01:00:45.639 that. I'm sure you've got this question a few times from other people. 617 01:00:45.880 --> 01:00:51.519 Why Kickstarter? Why does a company like def Crocodile need to raise funds for 618 01:00:51.599 --> 01:00:57.559 something like this? Well? Probably Well this is our first Kickstarter we've ever 619 01:00:57.599 --> 01:01:04.599 done, and a company like def Crocodile is just Dennis and I. You're 620 01:01:04.639 --> 01:01:09.679 not rolling in the dough here now. By the way, congratulations hit your 621 01:01:09.679 --> 01:01:14.360 first goal. And as I just checked, just cross seventeen thousand while we 622 01:01:14.400 --> 01:01:20.599 were recording this. So hey yeah, so yeah, like we had said 623 01:01:20.639 --> 01:01:23.840 earlier, like you know, a restoration, the low end is going to 624 01:01:23.840 --> 01:01:28.519 be about fifty grand, right, and that's with me doing all of the 625 01:01:28.559 --> 01:01:37.480 restoration cleanup work by hand for free. So yeah, that's that's why we 626 01:01:37.880 --> 01:01:43.960 could use to kick started to raise some funds to make doing these type of 627 01:01:43.960 --> 01:01:47.119 projects more often. You know, it's you know, we need to reach 628 01:01:47.159 --> 01:01:51.880 out to to archives and stuff, and we do hope sometimes that they do 629 01:01:52.000 --> 01:01:55.320 have, you know, something that's already been restored, right, But a 630 01:01:55.320 --> 01:02:00.199 lot of times, especially where you know, we're looking for the stuff that 631 01:02:00.920 --> 01:02:07.079 is amazing that people haven't heard of. A lot of the archives will have 632 01:02:07.119 --> 01:02:10.119 the elements, but they're just sitting in their vault. They haven't been scanned, 633 01:02:10.159 --> 01:02:15.679 they haven't been you know, nothing that they've got them. So there's 634 01:02:15.719 --> 01:02:19.000 just a lot of cost involved in getting it scanned and getting it color grated 635 01:02:19.039 --> 01:02:24.679 and getting the audio transferred. And we want to keep doing those kind of 636 01:02:24.679 --> 01:02:30.760 films, but it costs a lot of cash upfront, cash we don't have. 637 01:02:32.320 --> 01:02:37.320 Yeah, I mean, there's there's a companion film. It's sort of 638 01:02:37.320 --> 01:02:42.760 a semi squel to Delta Space Mission from the same directing team of Kiln Kazan 639 01:02:42.920 --> 01:02:49.159 and mercher Toya that was made in Romanian eighty five that's never been released here, 640 01:02:49.320 --> 01:02:52.880 and it's really wonderful. It's sort of a mashup of the Empire Strikes 641 01:02:52.920 --> 01:02:59.840 Back, Alien and Tarzan and just incredibly freakadelic. All right, I actually 642 01:03:00.079 --> 01:03:05.400 could more than Delta Space Missions. It's a fun film. I love them. 643 01:03:05.639 --> 01:03:08.159 I love them both, and we've become really good friends with Kalin Kazan. 644 01:03:08.679 --> 01:03:14.440 Murchantoya sadly passed away in the nineties, but Kalin Kazan is still alive 645 01:03:14.519 --> 01:03:17.000 and has become a great friend. He lives in Bucharest, Romania, and 646 01:03:17.039 --> 01:03:22.920 we've interviewed him for both releases. But we were very lucky with Delta Space 647 01:03:22.920 --> 01:03:27.760 Mission in that the Romanian Film Archive had already done a four K scan, 648 01:03:28.039 --> 01:03:31.239 so there were these, you know, lovely raw scans from the negative, 649 01:03:31.400 --> 01:03:37.559 but for the second film, there was nothing. They had the rights, 650 01:03:37.599 --> 01:03:40.480 they had the elements, they had the sound elements, and so they were 651 01:03:40.519 --> 01:03:44.320 like, Okay, you know, if you want to do this, you're 652 01:03:44.360 --> 01:03:47.280 going to have to pay for a new four K scan. And we were 653 01:03:47.360 --> 01:03:52.559 really fortunate in that they actually think because we were repeat customers and we're the 654 01:03:52.599 --> 01:03:54.800 only people that are asking for these movies, they were like, we'll give 655 01:03:54.800 --> 01:03:59.000 you a deal and we'll give you a four K scan from the negative for 656 01:03:59.039 --> 01:04:01.480 the two K rate. They're like, ah, great, we'll take it. 657 01:04:03.679 --> 01:04:10.800 But we're also a little crazy because we're like, this is completely obscure 658 01:04:10.880 --> 01:04:15.760 Romanian animated sci fi film for eighty five. Clearly nobody else is come knocking 659 01:04:15.800 --> 01:04:18.599 on their door. They're like, all right, if it's not us, 660 01:04:18.599 --> 01:04:23.840 who's it going to be. So so we paid for the four K scam 661 01:04:24.519 --> 01:04:28.519 and that's going to come out in twenty twenty three, and it's going to 662 01:04:28.559 --> 01:04:32.320 look gorgeous, and I think people, certainly people who love Delta Space Mission 663 01:04:32.400 --> 01:04:38.360 or who love eighties sci fi animation will be over the moon for it because 664 01:04:38.400 --> 01:04:45.000 it is supremely strange and surreal and psychedelic and amazing synthesizer score, kind of 665 01:04:45.079 --> 01:04:50.039 space froggy synthy score like Delta Space Mission, it's got all the things. 666 01:04:51.320 --> 01:04:54.960 They up the bar a little bit with some of the animation I think on 667 01:04:55.000 --> 01:05:02.599 this one too, Like there's some long stretches of this really cool just floating 668 01:05:02.639 --> 01:05:11.199 eyes and outer space and just crazy medieval space nights. And I mean clearly 669 01:05:11.320 --> 01:05:16.719 they loved Empire Strikes Back, so they were sort of important big chunks of 670 01:05:16.719 --> 01:05:23.199 it, but also Tarzan and then filtered through this incredible behind the Iron curtain 671 01:05:24.119 --> 01:05:29.079 sensibility in Japanese animation, kind of TV animation from the time, So it's 672 01:05:29.400 --> 01:05:33.679 it's one of these amazing like I'm a big music officionado and one of the 673 01:05:33.679 --> 01:05:40.800 things I love our sixties beat bands from behind the Iron Curtain, and clearly 674 01:05:40.840 --> 01:05:46.599 they heard like Beatles, Stones, Kinks, you know, Animals records and 675 01:05:46.639 --> 01:05:51.239 they were like, we gotta get guitars and do our own version of this. 676 01:05:53.280 --> 01:05:58.360 So there's a fantastic Romanian sixties beat band I look called synchron Si n 677 01:05:58.559 --> 01:06:08.480 cro N do their own kind of deranged frat rock versions of like Western songs, 678 01:06:08.719 --> 01:06:15.320 but filtered through this kind of crazy Romanian mid sixties sensibility. So that's 679 01:06:15.400 --> 01:06:18.239 kind of one of the things we really love about both Delta Space Mission and 680 01:06:18.239 --> 01:06:25.920 the second film is they you know, they are uniquely Romanian, but they 681 01:06:26.039 --> 01:06:33.760 also interact with Western narratives and media a little bit like Jean Pierre Melville. 682 01:06:34.360 --> 01:06:43.239 His amazing noirs from the late fifties sixties bob La Flambourg and Le Samurai and 683 01:06:43.559 --> 01:06:53.639 Army of Shadows are clearly kind of in a dialogue with classic American film noir 684 01:06:56.760 --> 01:07:02.320 Kubrick's Killing and you know a lot of other great movies of that period. 685 01:07:02.360 --> 01:07:08.119 But they're also uniquely French, and that's one of the things that sort of 686 01:07:10.199 --> 01:07:17.599 syncretic intermixing of narratives, characters, symbolism and cultures that we really love. 687 01:07:18.000 --> 01:07:23.880 And it's one of the things we love most about the Delta space mission in 688 01:07:23.880 --> 01:07:28.199 the second film as well. So we've got a bunch of wild stuff coming 689 01:07:28.199 --> 01:07:33.559 out in actually the end of the year and in twenty twenty three. We 690 01:07:33.679 --> 01:07:40.000 sort of have a backlog where we're in a unique position of kind of having 691 01:07:40.000 --> 01:07:45.039 too many movies to put out right now that all of course require Craig to 692 01:07:45.079 --> 01:07:48.960 spend. I saw hundreds of hours restoring Dennis the other day. I'm like, 693 01:07:49.039 --> 01:07:55.639 dude, you need to pump the brakes. We've got like five restorations 694 01:07:55.679 --> 01:07:59.599 lined up and like this go take Oh wow. Well, I mean that's 695 01:07:59.599 --> 01:08:02.360 a great question to lead into for how much work these get on on average? 696 01:08:02.440 --> 01:08:05.639 How long does a decent restoration just for a single film take. For 697 01:08:05.760 --> 01:08:16.000 you, the actually the actual restoration part of it, probably that three months 698 01:08:16.039 --> 01:08:24.079 maybe jeez, But I would say the average and that it can I mean, 699 01:08:24.119 --> 01:08:29.920 it's and that's if everything's going well. But you know, partly, 700 01:08:30.000 --> 01:08:31.640 you know again, like I said, like work, work, a two 701 01:08:31.640 --> 01:08:41.000 man operation, just the admin of running you know, deaf crocodile, like 702 01:08:41.359 --> 01:08:44.479 keeps you know, takes you away and it's like, oh, I need 703 01:08:44.520 --> 01:08:49.279 to deal with these invoices or you know, or even even just staying you 704 01:08:49.319 --> 01:08:55.800 know, somewhat active on social media. You know, it's like I enjoyed 705 01:08:55.840 --> 01:08:59.119 doing and I love interacting with people and talking to people, but you know, 706 01:08:59.239 --> 01:09:04.760 it's like I need to be working on restoration. So yeah, it's 707 01:09:06.000 --> 01:09:11.359 a lot of a lot of it is the finding the materials and then working 708 01:09:11.399 --> 01:09:19.079 out a licensing agreement. There's another European incredibly gonzo sci fi film. It's 709 01:09:19.159 --> 01:09:28.000 kind of a cross between a seventies Italian kind of Jollo esque thriller and a 710 01:09:28.119 --> 01:09:34.399 completely crazy kind of alien sci fi movie. And now it's years we're talking 711 01:09:35.319 --> 01:09:41.600 five six years that we've been going back and forth trying to secure the rights, 712 01:09:41.600 --> 01:09:44.159 and we're hoping at the end of this year we'll finally make a deal. 713 01:09:45.319 --> 01:09:47.920 So a lot of it is waiting very patiently, and then there'll be 714 01:09:47.960 --> 01:09:54.239 long stretches where you don't hear anything and it completely it looks like it's disappeared, 715 01:09:54.319 --> 01:09:58.720 and then like a year and a half later, you'll send them an 716 01:09:58.720 --> 01:10:01.319 email hoping and they'll go, oh, yeah, yeah, let's talk about 717 01:10:01.319 --> 01:10:06.680 that again. So it does take a tremendous amount of patience and persistence. 718 01:10:08.479 --> 01:10:12.960 I will say the quickest Delia ever made was for Sampo, which is a 719 01:10:12.960 --> 01:10:17.760 film I've loved for many years, and I organized a retrospective on Patrishko's work 720 01:10:17.800 --> 01:10:23.720 with Oliver Lonski's Seagull Films in the early two thousands at the Cinematack and toward 721 01:10:23.760 --> 01:10:28.439 the Country. So in some ways I'd spent twenty twenty five years thinking about 722 01:10:28.479 --> 01:10:31.720 it. But when we actually from the time we got in touch with KAVE, 723 01:10:32.399 --> 01:10:39.720 the Finnish National Audio Visual Institute, to when we made the deal was 724 01:10:39.960 --> 01:10:45.000 I think it was like four or five weeks and I was like, we 725 01:10:45.079 --> 01:10:49.119 got a license every film we be with KAVE, because they were just like, 726 01:10:49.359 --> 01:10:54.000 okay, we have it. This is what we've got, bam bam, 727 01:10:54.039 --> 01:10:57.560 bam bam bam. Deal signed. We're sending you the materials that we 728 01:10:57.560 --> 01:11:00.960 were like, I mean, Craig and I were kind of shocked, really, 729 01:11:00.159 --> 01:11:05.279 is this actually come together this quickly. We can usually be four or 730 01:11:05.279 --> 01:11:15.199 five weeks in between an email getting replied to yeah, we just I don't 731 01:11:15.239 --> 01:11:19.319 know if you saw that. We just got an email message for the the 732 01:11:19.960 --> 01:11:29.720 other unannounced the film that they've discovered more elements from that film. So I 733 01:11:29.800 --> 01:11:34.640 actually did not see that email yet. But they have to have scenes that 734 01:11:34.640 --> 01:11:41.520 that we didn't know existed. Wow, I have to apologize. I'm actually 735 01:11:41.520 --> 01:11:45.600 gonna have to jump off because I have to I have to get ready and 736 01:11:45.680 --> 01:11:49.880 run to my my other job at p RS. So you guys are more 737 01:11:49.880 --> 01:11:58.000 than welcome to keep UH Gavin. I have enjoyed this so much. Thank 738 01:11:58.039 --> 01:12:03.239 you for having UH song. We love talking about these movies. Thank you 739 01:12:03.600 --> 01:12:06.239 by all means. I would love to have you back on someday once we 740 01:12:06.319 --> 01:12:11.600 get a couple more releases we can discuss. I just want to tell everybody 741 01:12:11.600 --> 01:12:14.920 all the links are in the description below for the kickstarter, for the website 742 01:12:15.239 --> 01:12:18.640 for everything, and just genuinely thank you guys so much for everything that you've 743 01:12:18.680 --> 01:12:23.640 done so far. For saving these films. Yeah, we love doing it, 744 01:12:23.720 --> 01:12:27.800 so thanks for having us on and helping spread the good word and keep 745 01:12:27.840 --> 01:12:34.920 adding to the shelf of physical media. Yeah, there's there's a suspicious I 746 01:12:34.960 --> 01:12:43.039 could see behind the right part of your head. You have the down right, 747 01:12:43.560 --> 01:12:46.479 okay, but then if you turn them sideways and you can shove some 748 01:12:46.520 --> 01:12:49.000 more in on top of the ones that are standing up there. Yeah, 749 01:12:49.279 --> 01:12:57.039 all the ways that you try and fit more media into many many times. 750 01:12:57.039 --> 01:13:00.560 Craig Dennis, thank you so much. Wonderful talking to you. We'll see 751 01:13:00.560 --> 01:13:02.680 you next time. Thank you. You got a couple more minutes, Is 752 01:13:02.680 --> 01:13:06.279 that all right with you? Yeah, if you've got more questions a couple. 753 01:13:06.880 --> 01:13:10.279 First of all, how did these come to you? And how did 754 01:13:10.279 --> 01:13:13.760 the restoration go? Because these have made a lot of waves this year. 755 01:13:15.159 --> 01:13:21.560 Those are again, like Dennis had mentioned, he had programmed a bunch of 756 01:13:21.880 --> 01:13:27.439 Justco films for the American Cinema Tech back in the day, and so he'd 757 01:13:27.439 --> 01:13:30.840 always loved them and it was on his radar of like we should put these 758 01:13:30.880 --> 01:13:40.680 out on Blu ray. Gilia Murra Metz. We licensed through Muss Film and 759 01:13:41.960 --> 01:13:47.520 they had done a restoration already and gave us those files. I didn't have 760 01:13:47.560 --> 01:13:51.039 to do a lot to that. That was. That was a pretty good 761 01:13:51.119 --> 01:13:58.159 restoration. And I just tweaked the color a bit because it was they had 762 01:13:58.840 --> 01:14:03.600 kind of given it that Cyan kind of tint to it, and that just 763 01:14:05.039 --> 01:14:17.359 I can't The Sampo film is from the Finnish Film Archive because the originally was 764 01:14:17.399 --> 01:14:24.800 a Finnish Russian co production with Moss Film. So when they and that one's 765 01:14:24.880 --> 01:14:30.000 interesting because when they shot it, they actually shot it both in Finish and 766 01:14:30.079 --> 01:14:35.560 in Russian, so they basically made the movie twice. So we we licensed 767 01:14:35.640 --> 01:14:44.359 the Finnish version from the Finnish Film Archive. That did require quite a bit 768 01:14:44.399 --> 01:14:50.399 more cleanup and work, so I spent quite a while just there's there's I 769 01:14:50.439 --> 01:14:56.119 don't know, it's I mean, it's just like Dennis said, I'm kind 770 01:14:56.119 --> 01:15:00.640 of a perfectionist, and we probably could have put it out as was it 771 01:15:00.800 --> 01:15:02.760 was and people would have been like, oh, it's wonderful, and I 772 01:15:02.760 --> 01:15:11.000 would just been like, but it couldn't matter, right, So yeah, 773 01:15:11.039 --> 01:15:15.079 So I spent a good amount of time doing some extra work on top of 774 01:15:15.119 --> 01:15:19.119 the work that the finished archive had already done. And that's similar to to 775 01:15:20.119 --> 01:15:25.159 Shandig or you know, I think I think they had done mostly a uh 776 01:15:25.399 --> 01:15:32.560 analogue, you know, photochemical restoration of Shandigor and I think they've done a 777 01:15:32.600 --> 01:15:38.960 little bit of digital work, but not much. And it was gorgeous, 778 01:15:38.960 --> 01:15:43.079 so many it was it's for the original negative, so that black and white 779 01:15:43.079 --> 01:15:47.279 photography and the and the beautiful film Green that that's in that film was you 780 01:15:47.319 --> 01:15:50.039 know, it was all preserved, so when they gave us the files, 781 01:15:50.079 --> 01:15:56.960 it was just gorgeous. But there was a lot of things that only digital 782 01:15:56.960 --> 01:16:01.000 could fix. So I went through Shannon Gore and did all of that kind 783 01:16:01.039 --> 01:16:05.279 of work, which was Yeah, it was a couple of months I probably 784 01:16:05.319 --> 01:16:09.880 spent because it was it was just one of those things where it's like this, 785 01:16:10.119 --> 01:16:14.840 the imagery is so beautiful. I don't want people to get distracted by 786 01:16:15.000 --> 01:16:18.680 like some stray dirt or some some spot stains and and whatnot, Like it's 787 01:16:19.760 --> 01:16:26.119 it's too beautiful, Like it should be as clean as possible because the images 788 01:16:26.159 --> 01:16:30.479 are so clean. It's gorgeous. So yeah, that's the for those two 789 01:16:30.560 --> 01:16:39.159 films, one from Moscow, one from Cove, and hopefully we can add 790 01:16:39.159 --> 01:16:45.680 to the Patucco films. We'll see they are astonishing movies overall. And actually 791 01:16:46.159 --> 01:16:50.760 the the I know they've they've they've been a lot of people have been loving 792 01:16:50.760 --> 01:16:57.840 them and talking about them, which is fantastic. Got to give some credit 793 01:16:57.960 --> 01:17:05.680 to Tony Stella who did those paintings for the for the covers. It's it's 794 01:17:06.039 --> 01:17:14.399 just it blows my mind that he he does not work digually, so those 795 01:17:14.399 --> 01:17:21.880 are those are actual oil paintings and uh yeah, so yeah, between the 796 01:17:23.760 --> 01:17:27.840 films themselves, and then you know, the incredible artwork from Tony, I 797 01:17:27.880 --> 01:17:30.119 think a lot of people are like, oh, we should check this out. 798 01:17:30.840 --> 01:17:33.119 Well, and one thing that I'm sure doesn't get a lot of pointed 799 01:17:33.119 --> 01:17:38.199 out compliments, I'd also like to say the booklets on those two releases really 800 01:17:38.239 --> 01:17:41.319 wonderful as well. It's nice to see something like that get that sort of 801 01:17:41.760 --> 01:17:45.199 contextual supplement. I'm always pleased to see some actual writing on the film with 802 01:17:45.239 --> 01:17:49.359 it. All of I think all of our releases we've we've got you know, 803 01:17:50.000 --> 01:17:55.720 it's you know, it's it started with you know, So Delicious when 804 01:17:55.720 --> 01:17:59.359 we were there, the owner of So Delicious, you know, he had 805 01:17:59.399 --> 01:18:04.079 done some scanning work and colligrading work and restoration work. It's a delicious that 806 01:18:04.279 --> 01:18:11.880 ended up you know, on Criterion discs, and he reached the point where 807 01:18:11.880 --> 01:18:14.199 he's just like, well, this is silly, Like we're doing all the 808 01:18:14.239 --> 01:18:17.520 work and they're getting all the credits. Right. So that's kind of how 809 01:18:17.560 --> 01:18:23.079 So Delicious Picks was born. Was was like, well, we're already doing 810 01:18:23.079 --> 01:18:26.079 all this, why don't we take it to the next step and actually distribute 811 01:18:26.079 --> 01:18:31.399 it so you know, and criterion is you know, they're the standard everyone 812 01:18:31.399 --> 01:18:35.119 else is judged by. You know, some people might do you know, 813 01:18:35.239 --> 01:18:39.159 there might be some releases that are a little better than than their average, 814 01:18:39.159 --> 01:18:44.760 and most aren't as good, but they're the standard. And that's the standard 815 01:18:44.760 --> 01:18:48.920 we've set for ourselves. Is you know, we want We've always going to 816 01:18:48.960 --> 01:18:53.359 have a commentary, there's always going to be an essay in the booklet. 817 01:18:54.840 --> 01:18:58.239 Any extras we can get our hands on, you know that with that that 818 01:18:58.279 --> 01:19:03.039 we can afford because yeah, that that the extras just add up. It's 819 01:19:03.119 --> 01:19:11.399 it's silly, like, you know, there's just licensing. I think when 820 01:19:11.399 --> 01:19:15.279 we did the last movie release at Arblows, you know, there's just a 821 01:19:15.399 --> 01:19:19.359 clip from God, what's the it was a TV talk show. I can't 822 01:19:19.560 --> 01:19:23.399 I'm blanking on the name. But you know, short clip. He's not 823 01:19:23.600 --> 01:19:29.680 like it's expensive, it's like and it's just bonus material on the Blu ray. 824 01:19:29.720 --> 01:19:33.079 It's not it's not generating revenue on its own. So there's only so 825 01:19:33.239 --> 01:19:40.640 much you can kind of justify spending on bonus material when you don't have you 826 01:19:40.640 --> 01:19:46.680 know, a big company foot in the bill. That's true. I got 827 01:19:46.680 --> 01:19:51.720 a hot take question and then we'll end on one genuine question here. But 828 01:19:51.960 --> 01:19:57.479 you brought up Criterion. A lot of people have complained because of directors coming 829 01:19:57.520 --> 01:20:00.520 in and wanting to change the color grip, eating of their original film. 830 01:20:00.800 --> 01:20:03.840 As somebody that works in restoration, how do you how do you feel about 831 01:20:03.840 --> 01:20:12.199 that? I mean, it's a difficult position to put the distributor in because 832 01:20:12.319 --> 01:20:15.199 they you know, I'm sure they know as soon as the director's like, 833 01:20:15.239 --> 01:20:24.439 oh I want to tweak this, they're probably like shit because they know the 834 01:20:24.479 --> 01:20:29.920 internet is going to lose its mind. But you know, it's the director's 835 01:20:29.960 --> 01:20:33.159 film, and if they want to put it out, they kind of have 836 01:20:33.319 --> 01:20:38.640 to do what the director wants. Yep. I mean you can, you 837 01:20:38.680 --> 01:20:43.239 can try and persuade them, you know, but if they're dead set on 838 01:20:43.319 --> 01:20:46.199 it changing, there's not a lot you can do unless you just want to 839 01:20:46.199 --> 01:20:48.760 be like, all right, we're not going to release it. It's not 840 01:20:48.960 --> 01:20:54.960 usually going to be the end result. So and by then you've probably sunk 841 01:20:54.960 --> 01:20:57.720 a lot of money into it already, so you're pretty much yeah, yeah, 842 01:20:57.880 --> 01:21:02.239 you know, so yeah, it's I mean, if it's a dramatic 843 01:21:02.319 --> 01:21:05.520 change. The thing is, it's like there's some minor changes that people lose 844 01:21:05.560 --> 01:21:09.880 their minds over, and I'm like, it's not that different, Like you 845 01:21:09.880 --> 01:21:13.159 know, it's not like you watch this film and all of a sudden, 846 01:21:13.399 --> 01:21:15.520 like you know, the ending is different. It's like, no, they 847 01:21:15.640 --> 01:21:23.159 changed the color a little bit. It's okay, calm down. The last 848 01:21:23.199 --> 01:21:30.920 thing is more of a philosophical question for Deaf Crocodile because despite differences in genres, 849 01:21:30.960 --> 01:21:34.439 types of films, formats, even because we have animation, we didn't 850 01:21:34.439 --> 01:21:39.319 even talk about the fact that we genuinely have a box set here for a 851 01:21:39.439 --> 01:21:45.000 director. Despite all of those, something about the releases feels cohesive in a 852 01:21:45.039 --> 01:21:49.039 way because of the passion behind these, because of the lost film aspect. 853 01:21:49.560 --> 01:21:54.279 Was that really what was going to be focused on with Deaf Crocodile when that 854 01:21:54.279 --> 01:21:57.199 came out, or is that sort of like a mission to make them all 855 01:21:57.199 --> 01:22:02.640 feel cohesive in a way. I think the only reason they might feel cohesive 856 01:22:02.760 --> 01:22:12.119 is that they're all being kind of curated by you know, one person's tastes, 857 01:22:12.640 --> 01:22:20.640 right, you know, our goal has always been to find films, 858 01:22:20.960 --> 01:22:29.399 you know, excellent films that people aren't familiar with and that's partly out of 859 01:22:29.680 --> 01:22:34.560 we want to give them exposure that they deserve, but it's also financially we 860 01:22:34.960 --> 01:22:41.880 can't afford to license, you know, films everyone knows. It's like, 861 01:22:42.359 --> 01:22:45.159 you know, that's too expensive, that's not we can't. We can't do 862 01:22:45.279 --> 01:22:48.800 that. So we have to find the gems, the films that are just 863 01:22:48.880 --> 01:22:58.479 as good. But you haven't heard of it. Sorry, uh and it 864 01:22:58.560 --> 01:23:02.720 was a spam call even so, of course, thank you so much for 865 01:23:02.760 --> 01:23:08.319 your time. I genuinely appreciate all of your work, not only just for 866 01:23:08.439 --> 01:23:12.119 the time spent here, but the restoration work. It appears to be tireless 867 01:23:12.159 --> 01:23:17.119 because some of these look better than you could possibly imagine. So well, 868 01:23:17.119 --> 01:23:20.560 thank you. I do I do. Like I said, it's always I 869 01:23:20.560 --> 01:23:27.399 wanted to look like the show print. So we're not obviously not going to 870 01:23:27.439 --> 01:23:30.359 be able to No one would. Unfortunately, no one's gonna be able to 871 01:23:30.359 --> 01:23:33.880 see that again with Solomon King, because you know, we're working from a 872 01:23:33.920 --> 01:23:41.479 faded print, but it's going to look as good as it could possibly look. 873 01:23:42.520 --> 01:23:47.439 And I think people are going to really I hope they really appreciate the 874 01:23:47.880 --> 01:23:53.399 context of the film as much as the film itself, because the film itself 875 01:23:53.760 --> 01:23:59.119 is really fun. It's not you know, Dennis had mentioned like in the 876 01:23:59.199 --> 01:24:01.560 Vein of dolam and it's not the film isn't in the Vein of Dolomite. 877 01:24:01.800 --> 01:24:09.079 The desire to make your own film, your own way, for your own 878 01:24:09.119 --> 01:24:14.600 community is the same. The Dolomite was comedic, I mean it was they 879 01:24:14.600 --> 01:24:20.880 were comedies. Uh. Solomon King is an action film. The opening scene 880 01:24:21.039 --> 01:24:29.640 is kind of hilariously bad, but you know it's a it's a first time 881 01:24:29.720 --> 01:24:32.640 filmmaker. You know, it's literally someone is like, grab a camera, 882 01:24:32.800 --> 01:24:40.039 is like, let's do this. But honestly, the the I think the 883 01:24:40.079 --> 01:24:44.359 film keeps getting better as you both get through it. It almost feels like 884 01:24:44.399 --> 01:24:51.560 they shot it in chronological order and got better as it went because I was 885 01:24:51.680 --> 01:24:57.239 really surprised, like some of the just the camera work and the scenes and 886 01:24:57.279 --> 01:25:00.920 there's there's some you know, there's some stunt action with the explosions, and 887 01:25:00.000 --> 01:25:09.520 you know, it's it's impressive film. Like like sal was an amazing person, 888 01:25:10.000 --> 01:25:15.560 Like it seems like his whole life he decided what he wanted and made 889 01:25:15.560 --> 01:25:23.159 it, so you know, like it's how he managed to do so much 890 01:25:23.960 --> 01:25:30.960 and his life is just absolutely incredible, and we've we've definitely wanted his story 891 01:25:31.279 --> 01:25:36.439 to be the story, and the film is just part of it. I 892 01:25:36.439 --> 01:25:39.720 can't wait to get it in and give it a watch. One of the 893 01:25:40.039 --> 01:25:44.039 things that really sells these restorations. You posted a before and after video on 894 01:25:44.079 --> 01:25:48.159 Twitter of the restoration and what it looked like before and the cleaned up. 895 01:25:48.680 --> 01:25:54.199 I mean that alone has to be something that makes people want these films to 896 01:25:54.600 --> 01:25:58.359 see the change because it's evident how much work gets put in. Again, 897 01:25:59.359 --> 01:26:02.640 just astonished and I and I selected the clip I posted I tweeted last night 898 01:26:02.880 --> 01:26:13.479 specifically because it's also uh just it's a cool shot of that that what you 899 01:26:13.560 --> 01:26:20.000 don't realize is an extreme telephoto shot and then pulls back to to reveal and 900 01:26:20.239 --> 01:26:25.399 it's just like I was like, that's that's cool filmmaking, Like you know, 901 01:26:25.720 --> 01:26:31.840 that's not amateur filmmaking. That was very cool. So yeah, it's 902 01:26:32.000 --> 01:26:38.000 I'm very excited about Solomon King. It's it's definitely, I mean, there's 903 01:26:38.039 --> 01:26:42.079 been a bunch of films that that I've been excited about and felt were important, 904 01:26:42.119 --> 01:26:45.800 but this is another level nice. Uh well, I hope the Kickstarter 905 01:26:46.000 --> 01:26:49.439 is insanely successful. Still got some time left. I will be directing people 906 01:26:49.439 --> 01:26:54.119 there every single time I go live and talk to fans, because it is 907 01:26:54.319 --> 01:26:59.079 it is important to to keep these companies going, to keep archiving art for 908 01:26:59.119 --> 01:27:01.039 the rest of our time. So again, thank you for your time here 909 01:27:01.079 --> 01:27:03.479 today. I know that you've got a lot of restoration work to do, 910 01:27:03.560 --> 01:27:09.479 so I'll let you back to your John have a good day, Craig. 911 01:27:09.520 --> 01:27:12.399 Thank you for your time. Hopefully we'll talk you again soon. All right, 912 01:27:12.479 --> 01:27:41.800 Thanks, see you, sir, Thank you tell me no