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Hello, and welcome to the show. I'm Martin Willis your host, and

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we have an interesting guest this evening. We have doctor Michael Masters, and

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he has he has a very interesting
idea of what UFOs could possibly be.

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And as most of my long time
listeners know, I have absolutely know what

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idea, what they are or what's
in them, if anything is in them

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at all. And and so I
loved hearing different ideas and exploring the different

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thoughts that people come up with.
It's really enjoyable for me. So he'll

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be coming up right after the news
with Alajandro Rojas, who's joining us today

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in just a minute. I want
to thank everyone that helps us out and

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supports a show. Anyone can do
that. That information is over at podcast

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ufo dot com. And speaking of
that, we have blogs now every week

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from Charles Leir check it out.
This week we have something that's close to

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home for him. He talks about
UFOs in his backyard and that's just in

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the area which he lives in the
Long Island area, and he involves a

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number of people that actually have been
on the show in the past and talking

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about you know, what's going on
over there, and there has been a

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lot of sightings out there. I
think it's one of the top I don't

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know if you want to call hotspots, but one of the top places in

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the country where there's sightings in New
York. And of course a lot of

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that has to do with population.
Um. You know, New York City

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the most populated city by by far. Um. So anyway, that blog

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is up there, and h I
think that is it. Next week.

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I just wanted to talk about because
I always announced my guest for next week.

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I don't have a guest for next
week. I do, um he

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is H. He's going to let
me know for sure if he can be

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on the show, so I don't
want to announce his name. Um.

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But anyway, I, like I
said, I usually it's going to be

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a surprise next week whoever the guest
is going to be. And anyway,

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I'm going to start the show with
Alejandro Aurojas. Welcome to the show,

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Alejandro, Thank you very much.
I am happy to be here. Yeah,

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I'm always happy that you're here.
And so hey, it's been a

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Newsy Newsy day. Newsy weeds been
Newsy a f I'd like to put it

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a f okay as heck as flip
as flip. Okay, thank you for

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using that word instead of what I
thought you were gonna say. Well,

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you're not supposed to say out the
acronym. Yeah, that's the whole point.

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Yeah. But yeah, but just
so people know, and I've told

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this people on this on my show. If I use like af I mean

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as flip, I always mean that
the flip sounds good to know. But

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anyways, yes, it's been so
news he because so much has been going

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on. Really, we're kind of
in the middle of this mega media blast

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kind of fervor around UFOs, and
it all does hie back and habits everything

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to do with Unidentified America's UFO Investigation, which is the television show that is

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coming out on Friday that covers essentially
to the stars as they investigate UFOs.

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The main lead character in it is
Louise Elizondo. It's a reality show.

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Of course. He used to run
the Pentagon program, the Advanced Daispace Threat

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Identification Program a TIP and so it
also gets into cases that he looked at.

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Now this all started the fervor,
of course, all of this started

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in December twenty seventeen when Leslie Kane, Ralph Blumenthal and Helen Cooper wrote this

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story about a tip, and everybody's
been really excited about it, but we

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haven't gotten a whole lot of information, and that has mostly been I know,

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for her back because of this television
show was an idea of how do

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we get this information out there for
better or worse. So a lot of

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people have criticized it, but those
of us who have seen the program,

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like you and I Martin, think
that this program is really good, at

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least the first episode that we've seen. So this is how they decided to

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release this information. But people who
have been wondering what is going to be

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in the show, and there's been
some interviews that we've all had to talk

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about what was in the show.
Lose dropped him said other cases are going

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to be in there. And of
course when the New York Times article came

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out, there was a video in
there. There were two Flair videos,

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one of them from the two thousand
and four Limits event, the other one.

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We didn't have much information. Then
soon after two the Stars released a

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third video. And there's a lot
of debate over the last year or so

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and did the DoD really release these
videos. We do know that they did,

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well, this all hit another huge
It's all making a big deal again

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right now because the New York Times, well for a couple articles. First

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the Politico, they wrote, Brian
Bender, the guy working with Politico who

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is actually in this new History Channel
television show. He wrote an article about

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the Navy making new guidelines. Tom
DeLong. They came out and said that

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To the Stars influenced getting the Navy
to make UFO reporting guidelines. Chris Mellon

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then backed him up a little bit
later in an article with George Knapp,

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and then some of us such as
yourself and myself spoken to one of the

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executive producers, Anthony Lapey, and
he confirmed that not only did these guys

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have an influence with the Navy,
but that is going to be in the

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show. We're going to actually see
this influence and see lu Alisando and the

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other two the Stars guys working with
the Navy to get all of this information.

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Now, so on top of that, there are also going to be

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some more exciting cases related to those
other videos in the History Channel show.

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And The New York Times finally,
you know what, a year and a

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half later, has done a follow
up to their original a tip article and

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this one's called their headlines are really
weird. Actually both articles. The headlines

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are weird, but the headlines and
this is wow, what is that?

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Navy pilots report unexplained flying objects.
I do agree about the headlines. I

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thought of it. Yeah, the
other one was auroras and whatever. But

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this has a couple more pilots that
are coming forward about events that took place

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in twenty fourteen and twenty fifteen.
So they're talking about these UFO sightings,

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and you know, essentially, I
don't think these encounters that they're talking about

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here are necessarily as exciting as Faver's
personal account. However, they are talking

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about more credible accounts where they're chasing, essentially looking for objects that are showing

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up on radar. One case that
they talked about is really exciting, where

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these two jets are flying along in
this jet and his wingman are about one

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hundred feet apart and some object zips
in between them. And this actually was

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a pivotal moment. This happened I
think at twenty fourteen or twenty fifteen,

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early twenty fifteen, and up until
this point they weren't sure what these objects

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were that were showing up on radar. But once this thing zipped through in

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between them, then they really took
it seriously for two reasons. One because

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they were getting close. This was
a near miss they could have been hurt.

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And two because the object was a
cube inside of a circle. They

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describe it as like a clear beach
ball with a cube inside of it,

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so it was extremely flipping odd.
They even said people have described it as

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kind of X files. Titler Rogue
away from war Zone wrote about how it's

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X file like because it's just so
weird. So at that point, you

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know, they took it really seriously. And we've got a new story that

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came out just today the Washington Post. This is a great title of this

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article too. It's called essentially that
UFOs are a big deal and now we

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can't He says UFOs exist and everyone
needs to adjust to that fact. And

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what's great about this article, it's
a political writer and he says UFOs are

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not the same as aliens, that
we don't know what UFOs are. They're

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unidentified. What's beautiful about that is
all of us know that. But this

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has been a real hard cell.
This has been hard to educate The main

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stream and mainstream media on that point, because they always want to go to

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aliens. So it's great to see
him writing that. And then just now

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I just posted some videos that I
got from history of interviews with these pilots

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from that New York Times article,
And these are small clips about minute and

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a half of these pilots talking about
these counters. And these are clips from

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the show from upcoming episodes. So
really exciting stuff. One other story to

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plug my stories, I wrote another
story that just came out yesterday. Oh

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no, it just came out this
morning, and den of Geek, but

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this was centered around why tommed along. I think a lot of people are

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seeing the previews for Unidentified and they
see lu Alisando, you know, this

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career intelligence guy. They show Chris
Mellon, who was, you know,

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worked in intelligence with like the deputy
assistant to you know, National Intelligence,

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crazy working at the White House and
the Pentagon and everything. Steve Justice,

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a guy who worked for Lockheed Martin
Skunkworks. These are the guys who built

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the SR seventy one. So you
have all of these very highly credible people.

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What's with this rock star right in
the middle of it. Yeah,

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of course, a lot of us
know who have been following this, and

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this is the gist of the article
is that none of this really would have

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happened without Tom DeLong. And what's
really funny is I wrote this article probably

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two three weeks ago, but after
this news with not just the Navy changing

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their guidelines, with all of these
Navy pilots coming forward, and the mainstream

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taking this seriously, and it all
comes back to Tom DeLong. Really,

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Tom DeLong, this might have happened
maybe in the months from now or years

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from now as people kind of came
out, but he was kind of the

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person who coalesced all this and brought
everybody together and focused this effort. And

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Tom DeLong deserves an immense amount of
credit for all of this. Yeah,

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as long as he stays off Chill
Rogan's show, you know, yeah,

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as long as he says he still
has some really crazy ideas. And I

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don't know about you, but I
have a lot of people harassing me,

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well what about Tom. Tom said
this, and Tom said that, and

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it's like it's great, but what
Tom says, we don't have anything corroborating

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what Lou says. Now, we
have a lot of government documents that have

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come out d D at first kind
of claim that Lou was inaccurate in some

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things. But you know, finally
recently they've had to admit that no,

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Lou was right about all of these
things, that a tip was about UFOs

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that they did release the videos.
So Lou has a lot of corroborating evidence.

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All of these navy guys have you
know, other pilots radar that they

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came back up their claims. So
a lot of the more fringey, kind

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of wild ideas that Tom Delongs has
have still really really don't have any idea

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where he got some of those ideas. But nevertheless, this crazy rock star

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guys rock and their UFO world.
Oh what a great title off Rocket the

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World. There will be a song, um, you know it. You've

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got to give credit where credits due
exactly, And I think, you know,

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there's a lot of people that really
really do not want to give Tom

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DeLong any credit at all. And
I kind of get that. The reason

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I kind of get that is because
you know, he comes out of nowhere

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basically, and there's people who have
been working really hard, you know,

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perhaps their entire life, trying to
you know, get some headway here.

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I've been at it a couple of
decades. I've spent and lord knows how

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much money, and he just kind
of, you know, I don't want

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to say he fell into it,
but maybe he did fall into it.

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It kind of but if you know, without his celebrity status, he would

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have never gone anywhere. Really with
with that, you know what, I

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think that you've got a great point
there because in a way I think he

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did. It's not just his celebrity
status. He was wise enough to go

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to the right place. You know, it keeps sending us notes, but

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I think that the person who's sending
us notes doesn't have everything right. But

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in a way they do. I
think that you know, they're mentioning like

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help put Off, who's part of
the group, Which is true that help

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put Off is part of the group
and has been very helpful Kick Green,

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It's worked in this field. But
the point being at Robert Bigelow, a

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lot of this comes back to all
of this group of researchers and very credible

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people who have worked inside of government
to make the paranormal serious, to make

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people pay attention to the credible evidence
towards different paranormal aspects. Decades and now,

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really, with the help of Tom
DeLong and kind of a more of

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a coalescing and a team kind of
atmosphere among all of these people, and

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help from people like Leslie Kane and
Ralph Blumenthal who write these articles from the

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New York Times, we've got this
perfect storm situation where it's all coming together

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now with a History Channel show,
and people are going to have to take

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our word for it that the History
Channel's good show is good and I don't

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blame them. In my review,
I wrote, I could see how you'd

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be skeptical, especially when History Channels
doing Ancient Aliens, and this show's coming

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right after Ancient Aliens, but it's
much much different than Ancient Aliens, and

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you can attest to that. Yeah, I have only watched up Ancient Aliens

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a couple of times in my life, so and it was a long time

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ago, so I don't really I
can't really remember much about it. Only

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Suculist's hair, you know, Well
that kind of speaks volumes though, because

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you're into this topic yet you're you're
not that big of a fan of Ancient

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Aliens, and I'm in the same
boat. I love Georgio, I love

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the guys who are in the show. They're personal friends, many of them.

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But that's really not my cup of
tea so much, however, unidentified

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is. It's it's hard hitting evidence
and facts, navy pilots, jet fighters,

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exciting stuff. Yeah, great stuff. Excellent, Well, Alejandro,

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thank you so much out and it's
really you know, the news is breaking

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daily, it seems it is.
I mean, it's it's keeping me so

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busy. It's uh, I think
it's breaking even you know, throughout the

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day, even today has been so
hot with several great stories and now these

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videos that I literally just posted because
before coming on with you. So yeah,

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it's exciting, Steff. So check
out. Is it at your own

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channel? What's the name of your
channel? Most of this news you can

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find at open Minds dot tv,
and I'll have this article up there soon,

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but otherwise you can also find it
at on my social media Alejandro t.

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Rojas is my Twitter or also Alejandro
Rojas dot com. Excellent. All

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right, alhandro thanks so much,
and I'll be talking to you next week.

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All talk to you later, Thanks
man. Thank you. All right,

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our guest this evening pretty excited about
talking about this subject and it's doctor

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Michael P. Masters, and he
is a professor of biological anthropology at Montana

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Tech and Butte Montana. He received
a PhD in anthropology from the Ohio State

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University in two thousand and nine,
where he specialized in human evolutionary anatomy,

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archaeology, and biomedicine. His new
book is called Identified Flying Objects, a

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multidisciplinary scientific approach to the UFO phenomena, challenges readers to consider the new possibilities

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while cultivating conversations about our ever evolving
understanding of time and time travel. And

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this is why he's on to cultivate
a conversation. Welcome to the show,

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Doctor Masters. Thanks Martin's so great
to be here. Thanks for having me

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00:16:45,600 --> 00:16:49,279
on. Yes, yeah, So, I guess I'm going to start out

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by asking you to talk about your
background and kind of what major decide to

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look take a look at this whole
idea of yours. Well, it all

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started when I was a small child. I was about eight years old and

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overheard a conversation that my parents were
having with some friends that were over at

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our house. And I remember creeping
down the stairs and kind of sitting up

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on the stairs and listening, and
it was this crazy story about this glowing

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ball of light that my father saw
a short period of time before I was

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born, and described it as this
glowing orb sitting across the horizon in a

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very dark part of Ohio and Amish
country, and said it shot toward the

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truck. Him and someone a colleague
that we're riding along with him that night

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both observed the same thing, sat
there for a little bit, shot back

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across the horizon, hovered there for
a while, and then went straight up.

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And that that really piqued my interest
and made me want to learn more

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about it. Well, and did
he ever try to, you know,

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tried to decide what he thought he
saw? I mean, did he did

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the actual the word UFL actually come
out? You know, what do you

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think you saw? Yeah? Well, I mean I think he was really

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confused, as as are most people
that have an experience like that. He

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did try to get some level of
understanding. What was really formative for me

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personally was that he got Whitley Stryber's
book Communion, and I remember seeing it

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up on the shelf in our living
room and kind of had this mental image

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that I describe early in the book
is just kind of a chimpanzee and early

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hominin form, a modern human form, and then this archetypal alien form with

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a big head, big guy's small
face and whatnot. And it sort of

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made me wonder if there could be
some sort of phylogenetic evolutionary connection there,

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and that's that's what set me down
this path. But he really didn't talk

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about it much. I remember actually
having to ask him about it. I

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think I was in college, maybe
a sophomore junior in college, and sat

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down just just because I was really
starting to look into this more and wanted

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to get a take on his personal
experiences. But other than that little sitdown

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we had many years ago, it
really wasn't something he brought up or or

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discussed willingly. Kind of took some
proudying to get him to to even describe

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his personal experience, but I know
he was certainly interested in trying to get

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more information, because when you see
something like that, there's there's really no

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way to just ignore it. I
think everybody it's a life changing thing,

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and people really want some explanation or
at least some answers for what that might

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have been. Yeah, that's actually
why I'm here. You know what was

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it really experienced? Yeah, what
was yours? It was? You know

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what's it's by most people's sightings,
I have to tell you it was.

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It was you know, boring,
um, you know it was. I

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was in basically in a hot tub
and something caught my eye. It was

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in Carmel Valley, California, back
in two thousand and six. Something caught

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my eye. I told this story
a number of times, so listener,

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bear with me here. And so
I looked up and it was it was

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sort of dusk, you know,
it wasn't really nightfall, and I saw

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this perfectly shaped disc u I would
say it's like probably the size of it's

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hard to say, look like the
size of a quarter, I guess.

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I don't know exactly how high up
it was. And it had like a

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light blue glow and no lights or
anything, and it just it moved and

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silently. And that was the thing
that freaked me out the most. It's

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like, wow, there's no noise
this thing is, you know, not

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a single noise. And then it
just stopped and then went off at an

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angle toward Carmel, I'm sorry,
towards Monterey. So I jumped out of

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the hot tub and called. I
didn't know what. I didn't know any

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reporting centers or anything like that,
never even dawned to meet, to look

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online or anything. And so I
called the police department and said, as

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anyone else seeing this? And I
was put on hold for about twenty minutes

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and gave up. So it's kind
of a boring site. I don't think

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so at all. In fact,
it's I haven't seen anything, so to

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me, that's that's phenomenal. It's
a really great experience and a cool place

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to see it too. Actually this
came from Monterey last week. I was

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there's part of a book tour I
was on, and so beautiful, beautiful

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area. Oh isn't it. Yeah, it was really nice. I've lived

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out that way for I think it
was nine years. So the the thing

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I'm coming up with, did your
did your father actually see an entity of

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some type? No? No,
just the just the light and it was

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the same thing. There were lights
on it. He just he described it

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as glowing as just not not radiating
beams of light as they do when you

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look at a bright light and a
dark street light or whatever, but just

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sort of a glow that it had. Yeah, but no, I don't

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think I don't think it was any
sort of presence of a being or any

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sort of communication or anything like that. Yeah. Yeah, you know we're

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gonna be talking about time travel,
the possibility of it, and this is

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what your book kind of I believe
the basis of the possible basis of it.

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And you know, as a kid, I remember I used to I

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used to make a lot of stupid
jokes and one of them was, well,

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we'll never invent time travel because we
never see anyone from the future.

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But I think your book kind of
is questioning that it addresses that specifically.

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That was always Stephen Hawking's principal argument
too, is that because we're not inundated

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with time and tourists, it must
mean that time travel will never be possible.

296
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Yeah. Yeah. One of the
things that I was thinking about it

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and I want I wanted to tell
you your get your thoughts on this is

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I had an astro biologist on this
show, astrophysicists on this show a number

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00:23:00,400 --> 00:23:03,680
of years ago, and Jeffrey,
I just can't think of his last name

300
00:23:03,759 --> 00:23:11,440
right now, and he said that
him and his colleagues at NASA was a

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senior visiting scientists at NASA, and
he said they would kind of talk,

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you know, quietly. And one
of the things you know about the possibility

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00:23:21,000 --> 00:23:23,240
of you know, space travel and
all that, and one of the things

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they can you know that they kind
of bounced off each other is that if

305
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a civilization can get through the bottleneck
of technology without blowing themselves up, then

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they would be traveling the stars.
And so I wanted to wanted to get

307
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your your feedback on that phrase.
Yeah, I mean that was a big

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00:23:42,000 --> 00:23:47,119
part of the Drake equation too.
I think one of the most important variables

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00:23:47,200 --> 00:23:52,000
is l in his equation is how
long does a civilization exist? How how

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00:23:52,000 --> 00:23:59,000
long can they persist after they reach
that point when they developed complex societies and

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politics and economics and war, And
yeah, it does seem like there would

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00:24:03,960 --> 00:24:11,519
be some sort of intrinsic bottleneck associated
with that. And looking at humanity on

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00:24:11,559 --> 00:24:15,039
this planet, and that is currently
our only frame of reference, since we

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don't have other visitors from other planets
coming here and interacting with us openly and

315
00:24:21,400 --> 00:24:25,440
telling us what's going on on their
own planet. But here, Yeah,

316
00:24:25,480 --> 00:24:27,480
we've been a very warmongering species for
a long time, and there have been

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00:24:27,559 --> 00:24:33,880
very peaceful societies throughout history and prehistory, but they tend to not last very

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00:24:33,880 --> 00:24:37,920
long or have been driven to the
outskirts by agricultural groups, especially up to

319
00:24:37,920 --> 00:24:42,440
the Neolithic Revolution in the dawn of
agriculture. And yeah, ever since then,

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we anytime, as I tell my
anthropology classes, anytime humans have developed

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00:24:48,680 --> 00:24:53,559
technology to kill each other better,
that technology and those people spread very rapidly.

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00:24:53,759 --> 00:24:56,599
You see it with the copper age, Iron age, gunpowder age,

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00:24:57,039 --> 00:25:02,079
and now with the potential to complete
wipe ourselves out or at least to really

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00:25:02,799 --> 00:25:06,720
damage the human population and the earth
that we live on with nuclear war.

325
00:25:07,519 --> 00:25:11,160
Uh yeah, it really makes you
think about that and contemplate how important that

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00:25:11,240 --> 00:25:18,799
might be. What if we did
create a true bottleneck, both genetically technologically,

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00:25:18,359 --> 00:25:22,359
it set us back tremendously and all
of the progress that's brought us to

328
00:25:22,359 --> 00:25:26,039
where we are today. I definitely
think that's important to consider. Yeah,

329
00:25:26,119 --> 00:25:32,359
yeah, well, we're right at
our break right now. So the first

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00:25:32,400 --> 00:25:34,519
time this has happened when in doubt, When in doubt, keep going,

331
00:25:34,599 --> 00:25:38,640
I guess yeah, yeah, yeah, So, um no, I think,

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00:25:38,920 --> 00:25:42,440
you know, I think of a
number of things, and you know

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you've heard, you know, the
fear of artificial intelligence, you know,

334
00:25:48,079 --> 00:25:52,480
I mean what that can do in
the future. I mean, you know,

335
00:25:52,599 --> 00:25:55,599
you could create a machine that says
destroy the world, and you know,

336
00:25:55,720 --> 00:25:59,160
keep creating new machines to destroy the
world, and you know, and

337
00:25:59,160 --> 00:26:00,599
then it can get out of control. You know, But that's kind of

338
00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:04,519
like, you know, maybe that's
a little way out there, but I

339
00:26:04,519 --> 00:26:08,319
mean, if well, it's it's
been a theme in so many science fiction

340
00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:12,640
films, and a lot of times
those are based in real fears, real

341
00:26:12,680 --> 00:26:18,519
possibilities. I could certainly see where
where there might be the potential for that.

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00:26:18,599 --> 00:26:22,039
You'd think as humans, we would
tame it once it got to the

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00:26:22,079 --> 00:26:25,839
point where maybe that could potentially happen. And a lot of it comes down

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00:26:25,880 --> 00:26:29,839
to consciousness too, and this idea
of free will, and there may be

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00:26:29,920 --> 00:26:33,720
more to it than just the robots
decide to do this. But no,

346
00:26:33,839 --> 00:26:37,079
it's it's definitely something. Who was
it? I think Elon Musk just came

347
00:26:37,119 --> 00:26:41,880
out recently and warned us of that, and a couple other high level executives

348
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of smart people, UM certainly very
intelligent and connected people. So yeah,

349
00:26:48,400 --> 00:26:51,799
when when people like Elon Musks say
we should be afraid of that, I

350
00:26:51,920 --> 00:26:56,880
definitely sit up and listen. Yeah, yeah, definitely yeah, And so

351
00:26:57,200 --> 00:27:03,240
if if one of the things I
have said many times on this show,

352
00:27:03,400 --> 00:27:07,599
also when talking with people that had
different ideas on you know, what possibly

353
00:27:08,079 --> 00:27:12,599
could UFOs be? I always say
a lot of times that we often think

354
00:27:14,279 --> 00:27:18,440
in terms of human terms, and
it's so hard too, and that that

355
00:27:18,440 --> 00:27:21,839
comes to everything, even down to
physics. You know, we think of,

356
00:27:22,440 --> 00:27:25,880
um, well, they can't get
they can't get here from there because

357
00:27:25,880 --> 00:27:30,920
it's it is extremely vast. I
mean it's you can't even comprehend the vastness

358
00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:34,559
of from one start to another and
all that. So I understand that,

359
00:27:34,920 --> 00:27:38,519
but I also understand that we are
we are thinking in human terms. We're

360
00:27:38,519 --> 00:27:44,079
thinking of terms of what we know, and we don't know if everything has

361
00:27:44,079 --> 00:27:48,400
been thought of in physics, it's
most likely not. Um So what are

362
00:27:48,440 --> 00:27:53,079
your what were your thoughts that kind
of led you on the path of possible

363
00:27:53,079 --> 00:28:00,559
time travel instead of visitors? Well, I think you're absolutely right, and

364
00:28:00,079 --> 00:28:08,519
humans have a tremendous knack for anthropomorphizing
things and ascribing human characteristics or I mean,

365
00:28:08,519 --> 00:28:12,519
it's really all we know. We
can't sit down with dolphins and have

366
00:28:12,599 --> 00:28:18,160
these conversations about dolphin points of view
or chimpanzee points of view. We're kind

367
00:28:18,160 --> 00:28:22,640
of alone in our intellect, at
least with regard to these higher level cognition

368
00:28:22,200 --> 00:28:29,440
types of things. But for me
personally, the main thing is the physiology,

369
00:28:29,519 --> 00:28:34,759
the physical characteristics, and looking at
long term evolutionary changes in the Homanan

370
00:28:34,839 --> 00:28:41,200
lineage and two of the main changes
that characterize us as humans and hominins,

371
00:28:41,279 --> 00:28:47,559
which is just us and our upright
walking ancestors, going back to the split

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between us and eventually what became the
chimpanzee, which was about six to eight

373
00:28:51,160 --> 00:28:55,359
million years ago when we shared a
common ancestor. But the two main changes

374
00:28:56,359 --> 00:29:02,200
have to do with our brains increasing
in size and expanding laterally from the inside

375
00:29:02,200 --> 00:29:04,359
out, but also forward and coming
out over top of our eyeballs. And

376
00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:08,839
in fact, we're the only mammal
that has that cranio facial configuration in which

377
00:29:08,960 --> 00:29:14,960
our forebrain sits right on top of
our eye orbits, and the tradeoff there

378
00:29:15,000 --> 00:29:17,519
is that our faces have to get
out of the way. It would be

379
00:29:17,559 --> 00:29:21,799
like it would be like putting a
camper trailer on top of a corvette and

380
00:29:21,839 --> 00:29:26,400
expecting that to work out logistically,
it's just and it's the same thing with

381
00:29:26,759 --> 00:29:30,839
craniofacial morphology. You can see it
very clearly in dogs, as an example,

382
00:29:30,839 --> 00:29:36,519
a Doberman pincher, a Collie versus
a pug or a even a Rottweiler,

383
00:29:36,759 --> 00:29:41,200
larger dogs that still have those retract
faces and larger, larger forehead.

384
00:29:41,279 --> 00:29:48,960
So over evolutionary time, and especially
more recently in recent human evolution the last

385
00:29:48,000 --> 00:29:53,200
day hundred thousand years or so,
our brains have continued this increase in size,

386
00:29:53,200 --> 00:29:57,240
but also a change in shape.
They've become what we as anthropologists called

387
00:29:57,319 --> 00:30:03,960
globular and increasing popularity where they become
more rounded, more balloon likeker we become

388
00:30:03,960 --> 00:30:07,720
more bubbleheaded, essentially, and our
faces continue to get out of the way

389
00:30:07,720 --> 00:30:11,559
of this runaway brain. And it's
it's not just that morphology, but it's

390
00:30:11,599 --> 00:30:18,400
also given us this evolution in our
culture going back three three point three million

391
00:30:18,440 --> 00:30:22,000
years ago with the advent of the
first stone tools that set in motion this

392
00:30:22,160 --> 00:30:26,880
accelerating rate of change in our culture
and technology as well, and the phones

393
00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:33,119
that we have, any sort of
machinery, computers, all of it is

394
00:30:33,160 --> 00:30:37,119
the direct descendants of those first stone
tools three million years ago. And so

395
00:30:37,160 --> 00:30:44,240
if we look at time and the
sense of deep time and human evolution both

396
00:30:44,279 --> 00:30:52,119
culturally and biologically, you can really
see this consistent pattern, these tenacious trends

397
00:30:52,119 --> 00:30:57,640
both in our morphology and culture,
and projecting those forward you would get something

398
00:30:57,920 --> 00:31:03,720
that very much trees numbles, the
most commonly described alien form or what I

399
00:31:03,759 --> 00:31:07,319
referred to as an extra tempestrial in
the book, replacing tear the Latin root

400
00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:14,920
for Earth, with tom the root
for a time. So even even without

401
00:31:14,960 --> 00:31:18,519
making claims or speculating about what might
happen if we did blow ourselves up and

402
00:31:18,559 --> 00:31:22,079
there was nuclear war and we had
to live in space or underground, without

403
00:31:22,119 --> 00:31:27,319
even going down that speculative road,
just looking at the continuation of these same

404
00:31:27,440 --> 00:31:33,640
enduring trends throughout hominan evolution into the
future, you would expect to get something

405
00:31:33,759 --> 00:31:37,960
very similar to what's commonly described in
these reports of close encounters. Wow,

406
00:31:38,119 --> 00:31:45,119
well I just found out that we
are we are on break Oh Kgarry,

407
00:31:45,319 --> 00:31:48,839
But that's okay. Where this is? So that was moot? No,

408
00:31:48,839 --> 00:31:51,079
no, no, that's okay.
It's all going to be on YouTube and

409
00:31:51,200 --> 00:31:53,640
on my podcast. So it's all
good. It's all good. So but

410
00:31:53,720 --> 00:32:00,880
we're going back in about half a
minute from now, so we won't well,

411
00:32:00,920 --> 00:32:04,119
we'll just we'll just continue on with
the conversation. That's all we can

412
00:32:04,160 --> 00:32:07,319
do at this point, because I
wasn't prepared for that. So I'll try

413
00:32:07,319 --> 00:32:10,440
to work some of that back in
at some pointcause I do think it's important

414
00:32:10,680 --> 00:32:16,119
to understand in the argument. Yeah, and the holistic aspects of the argument.

415
00:32:16,559 --> 00:32:21,160
Yeah, okay, Um, so
I'm just gonna break here for just

416
00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:24,640
a second. Race, you want
to count us back in race? You

417
00:32:24,720 --> 00:32:31,519
there? I panted the mic w
I had to meet but sorry, okay,

418
00:32:31,599 --> 00:32:37,720
we're ready to go. Yeah,
we're ready here. Five four three

419
00:32:37,440 --> 00:32:43,920
two, all right, welcome back. My guest is doctor Michael Masters.

420
00:32:44,480 --> 00:32:52,880
And during the break we were talking
about how the evolution is possible and can

421
00:32:52,920 --> 00:32:55,839
you kind of just go since um, since we didn't realize we were on

422
00:32:55,880 --> 00:33:00,240
a break here, I want to
repeat the same thing right over again,

423
00:33:00,279 --> 00:33:02,000
but can you kind of give like
a nutshell of what you were saying just

424
00:33:02,039 --> 00:33:06,519
so to catch the people up over
where they're at KGr radio, Yeah,

425
00:33:06,559 --> 00:33:12,079
no problem. And instructing and being
a professor, we have to give cliff

426
00:33:12,119 --> 00:33:15,839
notes versions of things all the time. So yeah, the bottom line is

427
00:33:15,960 --> 00:33:19,960
the after we stood upright, after
we became bipedal about six to eight million

428
00:33:20,039 --> 00:33:23,359
years ago. One of the main
changes that results from that, and I

429
00:33:23,480 --> 00:33:27,519
actually didn't mention this in the brake, so it adds new content to what

430
00:33:27,640 --> 00:33:30,960
was just mentioned, is that our
heads have to rotate down in order to

431
00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:35,200
see where we're going. Our heads
have to come forward to keep our eyes

432
00:33:35,240 --> 00:33:39,079
in line with the horizon, and
quadrupedal animals don't have that requirement. So

433
00:33:39,400 --> 00:33:44,200
we stood upright, our heads rotated
down, and that created a flexing of

434
00:33:44,240 --> 00:33:47,240
our cranial base. So the anterior
cranial base, the area where the four

435
00:33:47,279 --> 00:33:52,119
brain sits right on top of the
eye orbits, came down, and the

436
00:33:52,200 --> 00:33:54,960
frame and magnum, the big hole
where our spinal cord passes to connect with

437
00:33:55,000 --> 00:34:00,960
our brain, rotated downward and forward
in association with their It's rotating down,

438
00:34:00,200 --> 00:34:04,359
and that, really, more than
anything else, is a big part of

439
00:34:04,400 --> 00:34:07,199
why we grew such large brains in
the first place. It created what's called

440
00:34:07,239 --> 00:34:12,199
cranial flexing. Can think of bending
two ends of a slinky down toward each

441
00:34:12,199 --> 00:34:15,880
other. It creates this bowing on
the top and this more bulbous characteristic that

442
00:34:16,079 --> 00:34:22,199
is essentially what our brains look like. So beyond any of the other changes

443
00:34:22,239 --> 00:34:25,920
that took place in hominan evolution,
really just standing upright was a big catalyst

444
00:34:27,039 --> 00:34:30,840
for the development of these larger brains, more retracted faces, more intelligence.

445
00:34:31,079 --> 00:34:35,159
You certainly have to add to that
the free use of our hands. We're

446
00:34:35,159 --> 00:34:37,960
not using our arms and our hands
to walk around anymore. Rather, we

447
00:34:38,000 --> 00:34:43,800
can use them to make tools and
to communicate, to do things that we

448
00:34:43,840 --> 00:34:49,679
couldn't do if they're burdened with locomotion. So really standing upright set in motion

449
00:34:49,719 --> 00:34:55,519
a number of important changes that really
contributed to the uniqueness of modern humans and

450
00:34:57,000 --> 00:35:00,639
a lot of the unique traits of
our ancestors as well. Now I know,

451
00:35:00,760 --> 00:35:04,320
I understand, I've read it quite
a bit just from my own interested

452
00:35:04,719 --> 00:35:08,559
you know, Neanderthals and now they're
you know, with recent discoveries they believed

453
00:35:08,599 --> 00:35:14,519
that they were actually cooking with fire, which is pretty amazing. And oh

454
00:35:14,679 --> 00:35:17,280
not, that goes way back at
one point eight million years ago. Let's

455
00:35:17,320 --> 00:35:22,119
see the first events and that amo
erectus. Oh wow, and that also

456
00:35:22,159 --> 00:35:28,480
adds to intelligence too, right,
absolutely, yeah, And the tradeoff I

457
00:35:28,519 --> 00:35:31,639
was mentioning between our brain size and
our facial size. Our face had to

458
00:35:31,679 --> 00:35:36,239
get out of the way of our
expanding brains, and by cooking our food

459
00:35:36,800 --> 00:35:40,679
it helped with a number of things
that made the food safer to eat.

460
00:35:40,719 --> 00:35:46,000
It cooked off bacteria and parasites and
viruses and things. But it also reduced

461
00:35:46,119 --> 00:35:52,440
selective pressure to maintain big teeth and
a big chewing apparatus or mastication masticatory muscles

462
00:35:52,440 --> 00:35:58,360
as we call them. So so
it allowed a reduction in the face because

463
00:35:58,360 --> 00:36:02,360
of culture, that allowed the brain
to continue expanding. And that's why an

464
00:36:02,360 --> 00:36:07,920
anthropology we talk about biocultural evolution.
We can't really separate those. There's many

465
00:36:07,960 --> 00:36:13,000
things about our physiology that they that
are the direct result of our culture,

466
00:36:13,159 --> 00:36:15,840
and many things in our culture that
are influenced by our biology. So we

467
00:36:15,880 --> 00:36:21,679
really look at them as the synergy, this relationship that's that's inseparable. And

468
00:36:21,760 --> 00:36:27,840
looking at the long history of human
evolution on this planet, well um,

469
00:36:28,119 --> 00:36:31,679
modern humans. Um. Now that's
always baffled me because you know, they

470
00:36:31,719 --> 00:36:37,880
say modern humans have doesn't appear that
they've been around that long. And as

471
00:36:37,880 --> 00:36:43,559
far as it's in the hundreds of
thousands of years and it's it's just baffling

472
00:36:43,599 --> 00:36:47,559
to me. Where do you Where
do you? I think I read somewhere

473
00:36:47,599 --> 00:36:52,079
in some of your literature or whatever. There's no such thing as a missing

474
00:36:52,119 --> 00:36:54,679
link anymore. So do you want
to do you want to tackle that a

475
00:36:54,679 --> 00:36:59,320
little you know, talk about that
a little bit. Yeah, if somebody

476
00:36:59,360 --> 00:37:04,199
says something about Amissian link, that's
an instant red flag. It's sort of

477
00:37:04,199 --> 00:37:10,280
an archaic idea, mostly an attempt
to refute evolutionary change, or human evolutionary

478
00:37:10,360 --> 00:37:14,480
change specifically. But no, at
this point, we have a very very

479
00:37:15,440 --> 00:37:20,519
good understanding of our revolutionary history,
as I mentioned, going back to that

480
00:37:20,760 --> 00:37:22,880
time when we first started walking up
right about six to eight million years ago,

481
00:37:23,159 --> 00:37:29,480
and a big part of my research
is looking at those evolutionary changes,

482
00:37:29,599 --> 00:37:35,440
and there are places where there's not
as much information. Beginning with our own

483
00:37:35,480 --> 00:37:38,159
genus, Homo habilists is one of
the best examples. We have a number

484
00:37:38,199 --> 00:37:42,599
of skulls, bones, and there
were some of the first to use stone

485
00:37:42,599 --> 00:37:45,400
tools, so we have a lot
of information, but it's all relative.

486
00:37:45,800 --> 00:37:49,480
But there is no point that we
just don't know what was going on.

487
00:37:49,719 --> 00:37:52,840
And I think a big part of
that comes down to for some people,

488
00:37:52,840 --> 00:37:59,159
it's a desire to not understand it
or to try to find some reason to

489
00:37:59,239 --> 00:38:04,039
criticize it, even though it's an
outdated idea. But it's also that there's

490
00:38:04,079 --> 00:38:08,199
a disconnect between what we do as
scientists and where we publish and then what

491
00:38:08,599 --> 00:38:14,480
is released in more mainstream media outlets. And that's just an aspect of science

492
00:38:14,880 --> 00:38:19,679
in generals that we write for each
other the vast majority of time, in

493
00:38:19,800 --> 00:38:24,119
order to communicate new things, new
discoveries, to have really detailed arguments about

494
00:38:24,239 --> 00:38:28,360
the morphology of this hominant and how
it fits in with these other ones and

495
00:38:28,360 --> 00:38:31,480
should it be a different species or
classified as the same species. But the

496
00:38:31,519 --> 00:38:37,239
general public is left out of that
conversation because it's very esoteric and it's complicated

497
00:38:37,519 --> 00:38:42,280
speech. But you do have stories
come out, there's big finds, And

498
00:38:42,920 --> 00:38:46,519
one thing I try to do with
this book is to really explain things in

499
00:38:46,599 --> 00:38:54,679
understandable terms and to present not just
an argument about what or who rather these

500
00:38:55,039 --> 00:39:00,159
aliens might be, these extra tempestrials, but also to really give people a

501
00:39:00,199 --> 00:39:06,360
deep understanding of human origins and of
human evolution and of cultural evolution and what

502
00:39:06,519 --> 00:39:10,159
things really got us to where we
are. Today and tie it into all

503
00:39:10,199 --> 00:39:13,840
of this. But it would be
impossible to read this book, I think,

504
00:39:13,880 --> 00:39:20,280
and to walk away without a much
deeper knowledge of anthropology, astrobiology,

505
00:39:20,320 --> 00:39:24,480
astronomy, and physics, because I
really try to do a science communication thing

506
00:39:24,519 --> 00:39:31,119
and really convey in real understandable terms
what we can learn from each of these

507
00:39:31,159 --> 00:39:37,880
fields and how it applies to this
UFO phenomenon. I remember reading something in

508
00:39:37,960 --> 00:39:42,239
a dentist's office or something, an
article I forget what magazine was in,

509
00:39:42,280 --> 00:39:45,599
but it was saying that, you
know, they think, within you know,

510
00:39:45,760 --> 00:39:49,960
I forget about a thousand years or
something like that, that most people

511
00:39:49,960 --> 00:39:52,960
will have more of a darker complexion
than you know, dark care and all

512
00:39:52,960 --> 00:39:59,239
that. What would be the basis
of you know, I don't know if

513
00:39:59,239 --> 00:40:02,760
you've ever heard that as well,
but what would be the basis for thoughts

514
00:40:04,320 --> 00:40:08,079
of that? I mean, how
can someone judge where we're heading? Or

515
00:40:08,639 --> 00:40:13,400
is it just by the subtle things
that you have repeated in the past.

516
00:40:14,920 --> 00:40:19,079
Yeah, that's a sticky wicket.
Really. I try to stay away from

517
00:40:19,079 --> 00:40:22,360
those types of conjectures in my own
research because there really is no way to

518
00:40:22,400 --> 00:40:28,239
know it. So many little things
like that, especially stature, height,

519
00:40:28,360 --> 00:40:34,360
weight, Different characteristics that are already
so variable among humans, like skin color,

520
00:40:35,000 --> 00:40:38,360
and that have a long evolutionary history
associated with them, those tend to

521
00:40:38,440 --> 00:40:45,599
also respond to environmental variables, and
without knowing what those environmental variables are going

522
00:40:45,639 --> 00:40:50,360
to be in the proximate or distant
future, it's much harder to say what

523
00:40:51,320 --> 00:40:54,000
those traits would be or would look
like. I touch on them a little

524
00:40:54,000 --> 00:40:59,039
bit in the book. In the
context of current cultural trends, there is

525
00:40:59,079 --> 00:41:02,679
a tendency to to whitewash. A
lot of people with darker skin try to

526
00:41:02,760 --> 00:41:06,280
lighten their skin. But at the
same time, a lot of people with

527
00:41:06,360 --> 00:41:09,000
light skin spend a lot of money
and a lot of time and put themselves

528
00:41:09,000 --> 00:41:13,840
at risk or skin cancer and trying
to darken their skin too. So there's

529
00:41:13,840 --> 00:41:17,119
a number of things that play into
that issue of skin color. I do

530
00:41:17,880 --> 00:41:22,800
talk a little bit about the self
domestication process, and one of the things

531
00:41:22,840 --> 00:41:30,760
that happens as we domesticate other animals
and as we domesticate ourselves, because beginning

532
00:41:30,760 --> 00:41:35,079
with agriculture, we've started domesticating ourselves
as well, is that you have a

533
00:41:35,119 --> 00:41:40,840
reduction and pigmentation. And so in
looking at this commonly reported characteristic in close

534
00:41:40,960 --> 00:41:46,639
encounters where the bean was actually seen
or an individual was abducted. They often

535
00:41:46,679 --> 00:41:52,079
report a sort of grayish looking skin, and that doesn't exist in humans.

536
00:41:52,079 --> 00:41:55,119
We don't have gray skin. We
have brown skin and black skin and white

537
00:41:55,119 --> 00:42:00,159
skin and everything in between. And
if you did average out the skin tone

538
00:42:00,000 --> 00:42:04,519
and of the whole human population,
it would sort of be a brownish color,

539
00:42:04,559 --> 00:42:07,920
and that could potentially be what they
were talking about in that article,

540
00:42:07,079 --> 00:42:12,920
is more of an averaging or a
homogenization of these genes that code for skin

541
00:42:13,039 --> 00:42:21,039
color. But even outside of that
and domesticating ourselves, we may start to

542
00:42:21,119 --> 00:42:28,360
just reduce pigmentation in general, which
over time could potentially result in those characteristics

543
00:42:28,760 --> 00:42:34,679
a grayish color skin without all of
the melanocytes firing off melanin and creating the

544
00:42:34,679 --> 00:42:38,840
brown skin color just a sort of
a pale grayish color that lacks pigmentation.

545
00:42:38,920 --> 00:42:46,440
But again, that's that's rooted and
things we've already shown experimentally with other animals,

546
00:42:46,480 --> 00:42:50,679
So there's a little bit more of
a basis for arguments like that,

547
00:42:50,800 --> 00:42:55,000
rather than saying that that will will
have more sun or LESSO zone. We

548
00:42:55,280 --> 00:42:59,360
can't know those things for sure.
So I do try to stay away from

549
00:42:59,360 --> 00:43:02,360
those as much as possible on my
own research. Now, a number of

550
00:43:02,360 --> 00:43:06,760
things I've thought of over the year, the years or whatever is. You

551
00:43:06,800 --> 00:43:10,119
know, we're a rare solar system
where we only have one son um.

552
00:43:10,440 --> 00:43:15,119
You know, most a lot of
solar systems have you know, more than

553
00:43:15,199 --> 00:43:21,079
one son um. There's all these
different things that play into with how we

554
00:43:21,199 --> 00:43:27,719
evolved, and so it's it's always
been curious to me to wonder how something

555
00:43:28,960 --> 00:43:35,519
could evolve on another planet. The
variables of oxygen or breathable air or whatever

556
00:43:35,559 --> 00:43:39,239
it is they can learn to breathe, the weight of the planet gravity,

557
00:43:39,920 --> 00:43:45,639
that's a major part in the development
of something something as simple as a moon

558
00:43:45,760 --> 00:43:49,239
or not having a moon, with
the tides and things like that or all

559
00:43:50,039 --> 00:43:57,320
all stepping stones with to how we
got here. And so is that just

560
00:43:57,440 --> 00:44:00,920
some of the variables on an e
and how we crawled out of the water

561
00:44:01,000 --> 00:44:07,880
basically, Yeah, but those are
certainly important ones. A binary star system

562
00:44:07,960 --> 00:44:13,280
would really complicate the formation of life
in different ways. It can certainly happen,

563
00:44:14,599 --> 00:44:19,400
but it's evolutionary trajectory would certainly be
very different than our own. And

564
00:44:19,719 --> 00:44:22,320
yeah, you're right, the chemistry, the climate, the distance from the

565
00:44:22,440 --> 00:44:25,920
Sun, the amount of water,
the amount of ice, the moon.

566
00:44:27,519 --> 00:44:30,400
All of those things are important.
I'm really glad you mentioned gravity too,

567
00:44:30,400 --> 00:44:32,599
because that's one that I talk about
a lot in the book. Is we

568
00:44:34,559 --> 00:44:39,639
suffer a lot of maladies associated with
our upright form of walking, bipedal locomotion

569
00:44:39,679 --> 00:44:45,199
as we call it, and we're
one of few mammals that does it habitually.

570
00:44:45,400 --> 00:44:49,079
Most animals or quadrupedal walking on all
four. So the fact that we

571
00:44:49,159 --> 00:44:54,280
have things like like herniated discs,
fractured discs, blown out knees, hemorrhoids,

572
00:44:54,320 --> 00:44:59,880
hernias, just all kinds of problems
with our knees, ankles, hi

573
00:45:00,320 --> 00:45:06,320
broken hips, and older age with
osteoporosis. All of these things indicate that

574
00:45:07,039 --> 00:45:13,239
we are at the upper limit of
what a planet might be able to sustain

575
00:45:13,280 --> 00:45:16,440
with regard to bipedalism, and we're
only at nine point eight meters per second

576
00:45:16,480 --> 00:45:20,679
squared. And an argument I make
in the book is that most of the

577
00:45:20,719 --> 00:45:24,800
planets that have been found as part
of the Kepler mission are far heavier than

578
00:45:24,880 --> 00:45:29,199
Earth. I think only about two
point two two point seven I forget the

579
00:45:29,199 --> 00:45:35,480
exact number, but somewhere under three
percent of them are much larger than Earth,

580
00:45:35,719 --> 00:45:42,639
which would really make it prohibitive for
an upright walking humanoid form to evolve.

581
00:45:42,719 --> 00:45:45,559
And a big part of what I
was talking about earlier but for during

582
00:45:46,199 --> 00:45:51,039
I guess a little bit after the
break, is that bipedalism was so important

583
00:45:51,599 --> 00:45:54,679
for us becoming what we are today, having the ability to sit down and

584
00:45:54,719 --> 00:46:00,159
have these conversations in different parts of
the country. I can't see you,

585
00:46:00,159 --> 00:46:04,320
you can't see me, I guess
we can through Skype, which also is

586
00:46:04,320 --> 00:46:07,480
a testament to our success. But
we have all of these technologies and these

587
00:46:07,519 --> 00:46:15,480
abilities that really are either directly or
indirectly the result of our bipedalism. So

588
00:46:15,480 --> 00:46:22,360
so in looking at all of this
variability in size across these different planets,

589
00:46:22,719 --> 00:46:25,599
even taking out of the equation,
the chemistry and the climate and the binary

590
00:46:27,400 --> 00:46:32,719
or Uni one star systems, we
still aren't likely to have bipedalism on those

591
00:46:32,760 --> 00:46:37,519
planets, and we aren't likely to
have this humanoid form. So even looking

592
00:46:37,599 --> 00:46:46,559
at the other reports of mantis men
and insects like humanoids and reptilians, there's

593
00:46:46,599 --> 00:46:52,760
still almost universality universally described as being
bipedal And that's just not something you would

594
00:46:52,760 --> 00:46:59,199
expect to see based on the current
data coming out of the Kepler Mission.

595
00:47:00,039 --> 00:47:04,000
Interesting, never would think of that. And I know we're going to get

596
00:47:04,039 --> 00:47:07,360
into all of that topic. We're
coming up in about seven minutes on the

597
00:47:07,400 --> 00:47:14,159
next break. And so is evolution. I mean, this has always been

598
00:47:14,239 --> 00:47:17,239
kind of fascinating to me. It's
very very slow. It seems to be

599
00:47:17,400 --> 00:47:22,760
very very slow. I know,
you know, have done they've done studies

600
00:47:22,760 --> 00:47:29,119
and like the Gallops Islands, the
different islands, the same bird changed with

601
00:47:29,880 --> 00:47:31,920
a lot of it had to do
with the food and environment and all that.

602
00:47:32,320 --> 00:47:38,840
But how slow is first of all, is part of evolution? Can

603
00:47:38,960 --> 00:47:45,039
part of evolution be a freak of
nature, like you know someone that is

604
00:47:45,079 --> 00:47:51,239
all of a sudden born differently and
then they you know, proceed to have

605
00:47:51,320 --> 00:47:54,559
children and that that change happens like
that or is it just very very always

606
00:47:55,079 --> 00:48:00,760
known to be extremely slow and very
subtle. How does that work? Well,

607
00:48:00,800 --> 00:48:05,480
it really depends on the reproductive time
of the organism. So one of

608
00:48:05,519 --> 00:48:10,440
the reasons why we're constantly having to
develop new drugs to combat diseases that we've

609
00:48:10,559 --> 00:48:15,800
evolved with over many millennials, because
they evolve much faster than we do.

610
00:48:15,400 --> 00:48:20,719
So if you have, for instance, influenza as a good example, because

611
00:48:20,719 --> 00:48:23,639
each year we have to identify which
strain of influenza is going to be the

612
00:48:23,719 --> 00:48:28,320
dominant one. Sometimes they get it
wrong, as it turns out, and

613
00:48:28,360 --> 00:48:32,320
then we have a different strain in
the vaccine is completely useless. But what

614
00:48:32,800 --> 00:48:37,960
the reason we have to do that
is because that's constantly evolving. It's evolving

615
00:48:37,079 --> 00:48:43,480
very very quickly, because viruses evolve
very rapidly. You take a petri dish

616
00:48:44,039 --> 00:48:52,760
and subjects bacteria to these strong environmental
conditions, You add radiation or a lot

617
00:48:52,800 --> 00:48:58,440
of solvents, and they're going to
evolve very quickly. We've created many really

618
00:48:58,480 --> 00:49:02,679
interesting forms of drossoft full of fruit
flies. A lot of our early genetics

619
00:49:04,400 --> 00:49:07,760
data and understanding of the double helix
came from research that was done with these

620
00:49:08,039 --> 00:49:13,440
fruit flies. And the main reasons
because they have a very rapid reproductive cycle.

621
00:49:13,719 --> 00:49:15,599
They don't live very long they reproduce. I think it's just a couple

622
00:49:15,599 --> 00:49:20,960
of days or something like that.
So those organisms evolve very quickly. Us

623
00:49:21,159 --> 00:49:28,519
with it taking until puberty age twelve
thirteen, and in modern times we typically

624
00:49:28,519 --> 00:49:31,960
wait even longer to reproduce. It
is a much slower process as seen by

625
00:49:32,039 --> 00:49:37,039
us obviously. You know, if
you asked a sloth or a tortoise,

626
00:49:37,079 --> 00:49:40,199
they'd probably think we look like the
drosophila. And if you asked drosophila,

627
00:49:40,280 --> 00:49:45,360
they'd think it was incredibly slow,
and they'd be dead before they even finished

628
00:49:45,360 --> 00:49:49,519
that thought because they are born and
die so quickly. But it really just

629
00:49:49,599 --> 00:49:52,199
comes down to the organism and also
the environment. Like I mentioned, if

630
00:49:52,239 --> 00:50:00,559
you were subjecting those organisms to a
very strong selective pressure, they're going to

631
00:50:00,639 --> 00:50:04,440
evolved very quickly. So it's both
both of those things. And yeah,

632
00:50:04,440 --> 00:50:09,400
as you point out, those freaks
of nature mostly result from mutations. And

633
00:50:09,440 --> 00:50:15,800
if there's a mutation that's beneficial and
that individual is able to make more babies

634
00:50:15,920 --> 00:50:21,000
relative to other individuals that don't have
that mutation, and then their offspring also

635
00:50:21,039 --> 00:50:23,119
have it and they make more babies, you're very quickly going to see that

636
00:50:23,199 --> 00:50:29,679
trait spread throughout the population and over
subsequent generations. If that trait's a negative

637
00:50:29,880 --> 00:50:35,039
characteristic, and especially if it kills
that individual before reproductive age, it's not

638
00:50:35,199 --> 00:50:38,320
going to show up anywhere. It
dies with that individual. So yeah,

639
00:50:38,360 --> 00:50:43,679
those freaks of nature those random things
that happen are really an important part of

640
00:50:43,679 --> 00:50:49,199
evolution and understanding the evolutionary process.
Now, I know that, you know,

641
00:50:49,280 --> 00:50:53,159
the lifespans have changed dramatically, you
know, even over the last four

642
00:50:53,239 --> 00:50:58,320
or four hundred years, you know, I mean you think of the thirties

643
00:50:58,360 --> 00:51:01,000
were the average age of a um, you know, due to all different

644
00:51:01,000 --> 00:51:07,119
types of reasons and so um and
like you said, you know, the

645
00:51:07,119 --> 00:51:10,679
the children were I mean basically there
were there was childbirth at you know,

646
00:51:10,840 --> 00:51:15,639
fourteen twelve, and you know all
that, um so. But other than

647
00:51:16,079 --> 00:51:21,079
um, I know that, you
know, like I've I've seen um um

648
00:51:21,519 --> 00:51:25,639
armor from nights from you know,
the fifteen hundreds and Middle Ages or whatever,

649
00:51:25,679 --> 00:51:30,920
and they're very small, you know, I mean very short and for

650
00:51:30,960 --> 00:51:35,400
the most part. But other than
height and things like that, have we

651
00:51:35,519 --> 00:51:39,000
been able to record in human you
know, recorded human history, any type

652
00:51:39,000 --> 00:51:45,199
of changes in development of of of
our species. Well, yeah, absolutely,

653
00:51:45,440 --> 00:51:47,719
um. I know we're coming up
on a break, so I'll keep

654
00:51:47,760 --> 00:51:52,880
it pretty short. But but yeah, you're you're right. Heights a dia

655
00:51:52,960 --> 00:51:57,199
chronic thing, and you can easily
see whenever there's one of the first studies

656
00:51:57,199 --> 00:51:59,880
I worked on in grad school looked
at this. Whenever you have a recess

657
00:52:00,320 --> 00:52:04,679
or a depression or a war,
height drops tremendously and it starts to come

658
00:52:04,679 --> 00:52:07,559
back up. Yeah, no,
it's very It's one of the main variables

659
00:52:07,599 --> 00:52:13,280
we use in biarchaeological analyzes when we
dig up past cemeteries. There's a big

660
00:52:13,280 --> 00:52:17,360
study to have a state that looked
at pre agricultural and post agricultural populations,

661
00:52:17,400 --> 00:52:22,480
and just after agriculture, that same
thing happened. Our health deteriorated. We

662
00:52:22,559 --> 00:52:28,039
started having all kinds of new problems
diseases, but one of the biggest indicators

663
00:52:28,119 --> 00:52:31,000
is our size. Our height decreased
tremendously, as it did with other animals

664
00:52:31,039 --> 00:52:36,039
that we are trying to domesticate.
So yeah, there's quite a few of

665
00:52:36,039 --> 00:52:42,400
those. Malaria is an important one. Another biocultural example, where we started

666
00:52:42,400 --> 00:52:46,719
to live in places with standing pools
of water and worthound the trees that other

667
00:52:46,760 --> 00:52:52,800
animals inhabit, and we started to
evolve sickle cell alleles sickle cell anemia,

668
00:52:52,840 --> 00:52:57,960
which in itself is a negative thing, but in a malarial environment it actually

669
00:52:57,960 --> 00:53:02,119
protects you against malaria. So there's
quite a few changes like that, and

670
00:53:02,400 --> 00:53:06,360
I mentioned a number of them.
In the book that are associated with more

671
00:53:06,440 --> 00:53:12,320
recent evolutionary changes, things that you
can identify that have happened in very recent

672
00:53:12,360 --> 00:53:15,400
human history. I wonder if we're
going to I was in a cafe yesterday

673
00:53:15,679 --> 00:53:21,440
and I happened to look out,
and the whole entire cafe, everyone in

674
00:53:21,480 --> 00:53:24,639
that cafe was looking down at their
phone, a single person, and I

675
00:53:24,679 --> 00:53:29,000
thought, or if we're going to
develop somehow, if our bodies are going

676
00:53:29,039 --> 00:53:34,440
to develop to change with the cell
phone. We're right at the break,

677
00:53:34,519 --> 00:53:37,639
So we're going to come back right
after these messages. Everyone hang in there.

678
00:53:38,320 --> 00:53:45,280
We'll be back in just a few
minutes. Alrighty, welcome back.

679
00:53:45,400 --> 00:53:50,760
This is Martin Willis with podcast UFO, and my guest is doctor Michael P.

680
00:53:50,960 --> 00:53:53,559
Masters, and we're having a very
interesting conversation. We haven't really got

681
00:53:53,599 --> 00:54:00,719
into what these things possibly are yet, and I'm heading that way just to

682
00:54:00,800 --> 00:54:05,159
let you know, if you're the
listener. We're going to take calls in

683
00:54:05,320 --> 00:54:10,679
about a half an hour or so
from now, so that number is going

684
00:54:10,719 --> 00:54:15,119
to be the same as always.
Next week we should have a call screening

685
00:54:16,360 --> 00:54:20,920
set in place with a different phone
number. That number will be announced And

686
00:54:21,239 --> 00:54:24,199
I did want to tell the listener
that if anyone wants to jump over at

687
00:54:24,239 --> 00:54:32,960
the the International UFO Congress website that's
UFO Congress dot com. There is a

688
00:54:34,000 --> 00:54:38,760
code you can put in there that's
i u f O C. That's i

689
00:54:39,880 --> 00:54:45,840
u f O C. That's like
a UFO with an eye in front of

690
00:54:45,840 --> 00:54:47,960
it and a C after it,
and put in that code and you get

691
00:54:49,000 --> 00:54:53,559
thirty dollars off if you want to
get a ticket for the International UFO Congress

692
00:54:53,599 --> 00:54:57,880
coming up this September. I can't
wait. I'll be there as usual and

693
00:54:57,960 --> 00:55:01,320
it'll be a lot of fun,
and so will our guests, Doctor Michael

694
00:55:01,400 --> 00:55:06,039
Masters will be there. Ye like, that will be really nice to meet

695
00:55:06,079 --> 00:55:07,960
you in person. Absolutely, I'm
really looking forward to that. I think

696
00:55:07,960 --> 00:55:10,519
it's going to be a really great
event. I'd also like to mention that

697
00:55:10,599 --> 00:55:17,280
I thought Aleandro's news segment was tremendously
fascinating, really informative, and yeah,

698
00:55:17,519 --> 00:55:20,920
that was it was super fun to
listen to. Oh that's great. I'm

699
00:55:20,960 --> 00:55:23,360
glad I'll give him that feedback.
Um, yeah, he does. He's

700
00:55:23,679 --> 00:55:27,480
you know, there's not too many
people in the topic as deeply as he

701
00:55:27,599 --> 00:55:29,920
is. And uh, yeah,
that's a lot of Funny's a good guy.

702
00:55:30,559 --> 00:55:36,079
Yeah. So, um, the
we haven't really touched on the possible

703
00:55:37,159 --> 00:55:40,760
things that people are seeing, possibly
time travels yet where we're going to get

704
00:55:40,800 --> 00:55:45,440
into that some more. But a
couple more questions I had for you is,

705
00:55:45,599 --> 00:55:51,599
um, you have heard what people
have described as what they're seeing in

706
00:55:51,639 --> 00:55:57,760
these abduction sequences. You mentioned the
grays, that's a one typical. There's

707
00:55:57,880 --> 00:56:00,840
a lot of different ones that people
are saying a different species or whatever.

708
00:56:00,920 --> 00:56:05,480
And you know, and I'm on
the fence about all that stuff because I

709
00:56:06,000 --> 00:56:10,239
don't really know, you know,
but do you think that we are on

710
00:56:10,320 --> 00:56:19,559
a path of evolution to head toward
a species with the characteristics that you're seeing.

711
00:56:19,639 --> 00:56:22,400
They always talk about the large eyes, they always talk about the little

712
00:56:22,400 --> 00:56:27,079
slit for the mouth, thin bodies, small and stature. Mostly this is

713
00:56:27,119 --> 00:56:29,559
what a lot of people are reporting. Um. I don't know if you've

714
00:56:29,559 --> 00:56:36,079
ever listened to any of the Ariel
School incident in South Africa, but that

715
00:56:36,320 --> 00:56:39,840
you know, they describe very well
on what they saw in similar aspects but

716
00:56:40,039 --> 00:56:45,400
skin like porcelain, and you know, just there's been so many accounts.

717
00:56:45,880 --> 00:56:50,480
Do you so the question? I
know I'm rambling here, but do you

718
00:56:50,519 --> 00:56:55,559
see like a trend of evolution going
in any of these directions slowly? Yeah.

719
00:56:55,639 --> 00:57:00,599
Absolutely. That's really a big focus
of the book, I think,

720
00:57:00,800 --> 00:57:06,360
is to really focus on what we
can know now and looking back our revolutionary

721
00:57:06,360 --> 00:57:10,039
past. We can see these changes
taking place, and we have a very

722
00:57:10,079 --> 00:57:15,519
good record of them, and we
have very good means with which to study

723
00:57:15,559 --> 00:57:21,559
them, primarily through CT scans and
endocasts and MRI, which is something I've

724
00:57:21,599 --> 00:57:23,679
used in my own research quite a
lot. And yeah, if you look

725
00:57:23,679 --> 00:57:30,519
at these evolutionary changes in our own
lineage here on Earth, projecting those forward,

726
00:57:30,599 --> 00:57:36,800
you would get something very very similar
to what is so ubiquitously reported in

727
00:57:36,840 --> 00:57:40,480
these accounts, And I break it
down into more concrete terms and talk about

728
00:57:40,519 --> 00:57:46,039
what specifically has led to our brains
growing larger and our face is growing smaller,

729
00:57:46,199 --> 00:57:52,480
and even trying to address things like
telepathy that's so commonly reported and what

730
00:57:53,559 --> 00:57:59,360
might contribute to that over evolutionary time, and looking at modern research into brain

731
00:57:59,400 --> 00:58:05,440
to brain and action and different evolutionary
trends related to the reduction of our face

732
00:58:05,480 --> 00:58:08,920
and how that could impact vocalization over
the long term. So yeah, I

733
00:58:09,159 --> 00:58:17,920
very much took time to research,
numerous abduction accounts and other close encounters of

734
00:58:17,960 --> 00:58:22,760
the fourth and fifth kind in which
these beans were observed or people claim to

735
00:58:22,800 --> 00:58:27,079
have observed them. And like I
tell people all the time, if they

736
00:58:27,119 --> 00:58:34,559
were consistently describing some ten legged squid
like monster creature, I never would have

737
00:58:34,599 --> 00:58:39,719
written this book. But the fact
that they so often so consistently or described

738
00:58:39,800 --> 00:58:44,519
as hominins. I mean, if
you look at the form of these organisms

739
00:58:45,119 --> 00:58:50,880
and the average, say even taken
into account the reptile like, insect like,

740
00:58:51,400 --> 00:58:54,840
but even if you average them all
out, what you get is something

741
00:58:54,920 --> 00:58:59,840
that if you put them next to
us and our hominoid relatives, the chimp,

742
00:59:00,000 --> 00:59:05,000
anzi, rangantan, gorilla, all
of the different primates, there's no

743
00:59:05,159 --> 00:59:09,239
question that they would be considered a
hominant. They have all of the characteristics

744
00:59:09,280 --> 00:59:14,000
that we have. And like I
said earlier, we fight a lot about

745
00:59:14,039 --> 00:59:20,559
what traits should be used to classify
a specific species or a specific genus within

746
00:59:20,639 --> 00:59:24,920
our own human evolutionary history. But
but looking at this form that's so commonly

747
00:59:24,960 --> 00:59:30,000
reported and described in these accounts,
there's there's absolutely no question. And something

748
00:59:30,000 --> 00:59:34,800
that came up I gave a talk
at a moof on meeting an Oregon just

749
00:59:35,039 --> 00:59:37,840
last week two weeks ago, and
something that came up, we're hybrids,

750
00:59:38,360 --> 00:59:43,280
and I mentioned to them, well, I mentioned to them that if you

751
00:59:43,360 --> 00:59:50,800
believe that we are hybridizing with these
extra tempestrials, as I call them,

752
00:59:50,880 --> 00:59:54,119
then you have to acknowledge that they
are human, because that's the definition of

753
00:59:54,119 --> 01:00:00,800
a species. The biological criteria of
species classification is that if two organisms can

754
01:00:00,960 --> 01:00:06,559
mate with each other and produce viable
offspring, meaning that offspring itself is able

755
01:00:06,559 --> 01:00:08,880
to reproduce, then by definition,
they are the same species. So if

756
01:00:08,920 --> 01:00:15,280
you believe that we are hybridizing with
these aliens and whatever capacity you understand them,

757
01:00:15,559 --> 01:00:19,239
you have to admit that they are
humans simply because that's the criteria we

758
01:00:19,400 --> 01:00:22,760
use to define humanness and to define
a species. So there's a lot of

759
01:00:22,760 --> 01:00:28,599
traits even beyond that that I think
are really important to consider and the point

760
01:00:28,639 --> 01:00:34,760
of the book, in addition to
looking at questions of what extraterrestrial life might

761
01:00:34,800 --> 01:00:37,079
look like in other planets, and
the question of time and time travel and

762
01:00:37,480 --> 01:00:42,960
the cosmos written large, they're the
main focus of the book, or at

763
01:00:43,039 --> 01:00:47,760
least a principal focus of the book, is that is what have we done,

764
01:00:47,920 --> 01:00:52,679
what has happened to us? How
have we evolved over the last six

765
01:00:52,719 --> 01:00:57,239
to eight million years, and what's
that going to look like going forward?

766
01:00:57,440 --> 01:01:00,800
Just if we project those same things
forward, and it's hard to argue that

767
01:01:01,280 --> 01:01:07,960
it wouldn't look like what's being described
in these encounters. As all of these

768
01:01:07,000 --> 01:01:10,360
different thoughts are going through, my
miners are speaking, and one of them

769
01:01:10,440 --> 01:01:15,599
is, you know I talked about
earlier the bottleneck of technology. It's possible

770
01:01:15,679 --> 01:01:21,639
we could wipe ourselves out and start
over again. I mean, if time

771
01:01:21,760 --> 01:01:24,679
is you know, if we have
enough time left before the sun swells up

772
01:01:24,679 --> 01:01:30,599
and burns everything on Earth, we
have time to evolve again. Possibly,

773
01:01:30,719 --> 01:01:36,000
But I don't know. I'm going
off on that one. But one of

774
01:01:36,039 --> 01:01:39,679
the things I was thinking about is
you talked about telepathy, and a lot

775
01:01:39,719 --> 01:01:44,840
of people have reported kind of something
that kind of fits with what you're talking

776
01:01:44,880 --> 01:01:49,239
about. I would have to say, a lot of people report of take

777
01:01:49,280 --> 01:01:52,000
care of your planet. You know, they're along those lines, like you

778
01:01:52,039 --> 01:01:55,800
know you hear about that, and
I mentioned, you know, the r

779
01:01:57,000 --> 01:02:00,960
L school very commonly. Yeah,
yeah, so that kind of fits with

780
01:02:00,000 --> 01:02:05,480
your thoughts. But another thing that
comes to mind is like the butterfly effect.

781
01:02:06,119 --> 01:02:09,519
You know, don't change anything because
that one little subtle change may wipe

782
01:02:09,519 --> 01:02:14,679
out the effect that you even exist. So what were your how did you

783
01:02:14,679 --> 01:02:19,480
get into any of that stuff?
Oh? Absolutely, we dive. We

784
01:02:19,599 --> 01:02:23,199
dive very very deep into that part
of the swimming pool. Um. I'd

785
01:02:23,199 --> 01:02:28,840
like to circle back to something you
just said though, is there if a

786
01:02:28,880 --> 01:02:32,559
big part of this model, And
what I think is important, especially for

787
01:02:32,639 --> 01:02:37,119
your scientific listeners or your listeners that
are involved in the scientists, is to

788
01:02:37,199 --> 01:02:42,519
understand is that it is a testable
hypothesis. It's falsifiable, and as you

789
01:02:42,599 --> 01:02:46,199
mentioned, even if we wipe ourselves
out, we've still tested this model.

790
01:02:47,199 --> 01:02:53,800
We by definition, we would become
them, and at that point at which

791
01:02:53,840 --> 01:02:57,760
we do, or whatever point they
decide to let us in on this,

792
01:02:58,000 --> 01:03:00,480
we would understand this. We would
with this, we could search the heavens

793
01:03:00,880 --> 01:03:07,760
for millennia trying to find organisms on
other planets that fit our hominan form and

794
01:03:07,840 --> 01:03:12,159
just keep looking. But at some
point we would eventually become them under this

795
01:03:12,199 --> 01:03:15,280
model. I think that's an important
thing to mention. And like you said,

796
01:03:15,360 --> 01:03:19,960
yeah, why would they why would
they constantly be telling us take care

797
01:03:19,960 --> 01:03:22,960
of your planet, or warning us
about nuclear weapons, or why would there

798
01:03:23,000 --> 01:03:28,559
be so many reports during major historic
events like World War two and the food

799
01:03:28,559 --> 01:03:34,800
Fighters, or with all of the
sightings over major historic prehistoric sites. All

800
01:03:34,800 --> 01:03:39,639
of those things just make more sense
in the context of future humans investigating their

801
01:03:39,639 --> 01:03:45,039
past, or possibly even tourism like
hockey. And always said what we started

802
01:03:45,039 --> 01:03:51,519
this conversation with earlier is that if
because we're not inundated with time and tourists

803
01:03:51,519 --> 01:03:54,519
means time travel must not exist.
And I counter that by saying, we're

804
01:03:54,599 --> 01:03:59,199
probably seeing them all the time,
and that's what the UFO phenomenon is,

805
01:03:59,280 --> 01:04:01,679
or at least a big part of
it. So I think it's important to

806
01:04:01,800 --> 01:04:06,599
also acknowledge those things. But yeah, no, the big part, I

807
01:04:06,639 --> 01:04:14,079
would say, as I just mentioned, the first major focus of this book

808
01:04:14,159 --> 01:04:19,000
is on our evolutionary anatomy and what
links are pasted to our present and our

809
01:04:19,039 --> 01:04:23,679
present to our presumed future. But
the other big part is time. You

810
01:04:23,719 --> 01:04:29,960
can't talk about time and time travel
and the context of this phenomenon without providing

811
01:04:30,000 --> 01:04:34,960
a very detailed account of our current
understanding of what time is or how backward

812
01:04:35,039 --> 01:04:39,840
time travel may be achieved. So
a big section throughout the middle of the

813
01:04:39,880 --> 01:04:46,639
book focuses on the history of our
understanding of time and what time means cross

814
01:04:46,719 --> 01:04:51,199
culturally. It's really interesting to look
at how other cultures perceive time or don't

815
01:04:51,559 --> 01:04:58,519
at all. Some societies don't have
any word or any verbs that describe actions

816
01:04:58,559 --> 01:05:04,880
and the past the future. So
just acknowledging that variation and our understanding or

817
01:05:04,920 --> 01:05:11,639
perception of time, and then really
getting into how physicists understand time. They

818
01:05:12,719 --> 01:05:16,159
historians and logicians and philosophers would probably
argue with this to some extent, but

819
01:05:16,159 --> 01:05:21,679
but physicists are in the best position
to really understand what time is, and

820
01:05:23,239 --> 01:05:28,239
they and engineers and people and material
sciences are probably going to be the most

821
01:05:28,360 --> 01:05:34,559
instrumental and actually developing a time machine. So I really turned to modern physics

822
01:05:34,599 --> 01:05:43,320
research, researching quantum mechanics with regard
to not just how we might achieve backward

823
01:05:43,360 --> 01:05:47,239
time travel, and I go into
great detail about that and looking at early

824
01:05:47,320 --> 01:05:53,880
research in this with Van Stockham and
Godell and Tippler, and modern research that's

825
01:05:53,960 --> 01:05:58,760
come from that, much of which
really all of which started with Einstein and

826
01:05:58,960 --> 01:06:03,320
his general relativity model and different solutions
to his field equations. So I go

827
01:06:03,440 --> 01:06:08,440
deep into that, but then also
get into what you're you're talking about.

828
01:06:08,440 --> 01:06:13,320
You know, what happens if we
travel through time? And the big questions

829
01:06:13,320 --> 01:06:17,360
always sent around paradoxes, the grandfather
paradox and other consistency paradoxes, and you

830
01:06:17,400 --> 01:06:24,440
see these in television and movies all
the time. Many books really look at

831
01:06:24,880 --> 01:06:30,239
time travel and obscure terms and fantasy
terms. But but what I've found that

832
01:06:30,400 --> 01:06:33,920
I have to do often times,
and talking about this book and talking about

833
01:06:34,000 --> 01:06:39,920
modern physics research into this question is
correct a lot of those assumptions that people

834
01:06:40,000 --> 01:06:45,320
have that they've gotten from things like
Back to the Future or Futurama or any

835
01:06:45,320 --> 01:06:48,360
other show that talks about the future. Futurama, they actually do a great

836
01:06:48,440 --> 01:06:53,800
job. They really acknowledge paradoxes and
try to stay consistent with it. And

837
01:06:53,840 --> 01:06:58,679
they have I think collectively they had
fifty years at Harvard and masters and PhD

838
01:06:58,800 --> 01:07:00,239
programs. The writers on that show, it's a very good show, and

839
01:07:00,280 --> 01:07:03,400
they do a great job. But
there are a lot of others that don't.

840
01:07:03,639 --> 01:07:08,360
They don't have that expertise to draw
from, and and so I find

841
01:07:08,400 --> 01:07:13,679
that that I often am addressing those
things, and those questions that relate to

842
01:07:13,719 --> 01:07:16,280
the paradoxes, and you're right,
the butterfly effect is a big one,

843
01:07:17,519 --> 01:07:27,239
and it's important to acknowledge though that
the main idea, or the consensus among

844
01:07:27,360 --> 01:07:32,039
physicists is that time and space exist
as one giant entity. What they refer

845
01:07:32,119 --> 01:07:35,760
to as block time or landscape time
or the block universe is something that you

846
01:07:35,840 --> 01:07:43,360
often time here where all moments,
all events that ever existed or will exist,

847
01:07:43,599 --> 01:07:45,559
from the beginning of the Big Bang
to the end of time when all

848
01:07:45,599 --> 01:07:51,519
matter is sucked up into black holes
or however happened, exists as one static

849
01:07:51,599 --> 01:07:59,159
block of space time, and we, as cognizant organisms biological beings, move

850
01:07:59,320 --> 01:08:02,719
through that, and it feels like
we do so linearly. We perceive these

851
01:08:02,760 --> 01:08:09,199
events that are exist as part of
the static block universe as a sequential series

852
01:08:09,199 --> 01:08:12,880
of events. So we have this
entrenched idea of an arrow of time or

853
01:08:13,000 --> 01:08:16,920
linear time, which really is kind
of a false sense of how things work.

854
01:08:17,439 --> 01:08:21,560
Almost everything in physics is time reversible. It's time neutral. Can it

855
01:08:21,600 --> 01:08:26,640
makes just as much sense running from
future to past as it does from past

856
01:08:26,640 --> 01:08:31,600
to future. But we see things
as progressing in this way. So a

857
01:08:32,439 --> 01:08:38,800
lot of those issues related to the
butterfly effect and consistency paradoxes just have to

858
01:08:38,840 --> 01:08:45,399
do with our entrenched view of linear
time rather than being some violation of the

859
01:08:45,399 --> 01:08:48,640
physical laws of the universe. So
I think it's important to make that distinction,

860
01:08:49,119 --> 01:08:56,560
and then I really dive into what's
referred to as the Navikov's self consistency

861
01:08:56,600 --> 01:09:00,159
principle. He was a Russian physicist. He was really instrumental and continues to

862
01:09:00,239 --> 01:09:09,079
be instrumental in providing clarity on these
issues and helping us understand how the future

863
01:09:09,159 --> 01:09:14,319
can dictate events in the past,
given that the future president and pastor all

864
01:09:14,399 --> 01:09:16,520
one. If you understand it in
the context of this block universe and block

865
01:09:16,560 --> 01:09:20,880
time, then none of them are
ahead of or behind each other in the

866
01:09:20,920 --> 01:09:24,800
presence of a time machine. Once
you have a time machine and the ability

867
01:09:24,840 --> 01:09:30,439
to travel through the block universe,
there is no past to future causality any

868
01:09:30,439 --> 01:09:38,479
longer. And this has actually recently
been demonstrated with some experiments in physics looking

869
01:09:38,560 --> 01:09:45,520
at Wheeler's Gadenkin models and things that
are probably not something that should go into

870
01:09:45,600 --> 01:09:48,079
now because they're pretty complex and I
probably put people to sleep with it.

871
01:09:48,159 --> 01:09:55,239
But the main takeaway here is that
visiting the past. It's non disruptive.

872
01:09:55,800 --> 01:10:01,039
So anything resulting from someone visiting the
past and acting with the past already occurred

873
01:10:01,479 --> 01:10:05,600
before that person ever left from the
future to go to the past. It's

874
01:10:05,680 --> 01:10:11,319
it's always a part of it.
So there's an inherent self consistency that's maintained

875
01:10:11,760 --> 01:10:15,319
across these different slices of block time. So we don't have to worry about

876
01:10:15,319 --> 01:10:18,640
a butterfly effect. We don't have
to worry about a new parallel universe poppying

877
01:10:18,680 --> 01:10:23,399
out, or the universe having to
correct itself when we traveled into the past,

878
01:10:23,640 --> 01:10:29,479
because it's already self correcting. There's
already self consistency inherent across the block

879
01:10:29,600 --> 01:10:33,960
universe. Wow, this is this
is really fascinating to me. I was

880
01:10:34,000 --> 01:10:40,319
going to mention I'm just going to
talk about parallel universe possible possibilities and other

881
01:10:40,399 --> 01:10:45,079
dimensions and all that, but I
wanted to know when you're talking about time

882
01:10:45,079 --> 01:10:47,840
in the very beginning back there.
It reminding me of I had a great

883
01:10:47,840 --> 01:10:53,880
science teacher in high school, and
he said, on a Friday afternoon,

884
01:10:53,920 --> 01:10:58,279
he said, Okay, your assignment
for this weekest weekend is to come back

885
01:10:58,640 --> 01:11:02,239
with a full definition of time.
And then he turned around and I remember,

886
01:11:02,359 --> 01:11:06,479
you know, I really uh it
was a fascinating Monday. It was

887
01:11:06,520 --> 01:11:10,560
a fascinating day. I can't really
remember. It's a long long time ago,

888
01:11:10,680 --> 01:11:15,640
but yeah, but you know it
was I you know, basically we're

889
01:11:15,680 --> 01:11:17,880
saying, well, this is how
you measure you know, like uh you

890
01:11:17,920 --> 01:11:21,720
know, uh, you know,
measure moments, you know type of thing.

891
01:11:21,720 --> 01:11:26,359
But no one could really I mean, there really isn't um you know,

892
01:11:26,399 --> 01:11:30,520
what is the best description of time
and how how we understand it?

893
01:11:30,840 --> 01:11:32,840
You know, you said the annial
time. That's all we can really understand,

894
01:11:32,920 --> 01:11:38,439
right, my my favorite definition of
time. Uh. Physicists for his

895
01:11:38,600 --> 01:11:42,840
first name, William Phillips, maybe
uh, well he quoted this. I

896
01:11:42,840 --> 01:11:45,359
guess it was Einstein that first said
it, but he uh, he would

897
01:11:45,359 --> 01:11:49,399
often respond to that question with time
is what clocks measure? Yea, And

898
01:11:49,520 --> 01:11:53,920
that was it. Yeah, because
no, but if when people like Einstein

899
01:11:54,000 --> 01:11:57,920
don't fully understand what time is.
And we have gotten a much better idea

900
01:11:58,000 --> 01:12:02,319
since then, and especially with research
and quantum mechanics and particle physics and cosmology

901
01:12:02,399 --> 01:12:06,199
and the formation of the universe,
we have a much better understanding than we

902
01:12:06,319 --> 01:12:12,159
used to, but it's still something
that eludes us. And I think that's

903
01:12:12,199 --> 01:12:17,560
awesome that your teacher asked that question, and especially with no clarity given whatsoever,

904
01:12:17,680 --> 01:12:19,880
just throwing it out there and say, all right, you guys.

905
01:12:19,920 --> 01:12:25,520
Figure that's a great teaching tool heuristic
device as we call them, because it

906
01:12:25,560 --> 01:12:29,960
forces you to think, well,
what is he asking or she I don't

907
01:12:29,960 --> 01:12:32,760
know, and why did they ask
that? And well, what if they

908
01:12:32,760 --> 01:12:35,039
were asking for this reason? Then
you have to go and look at all

909
01:12:35,079 --> 01:12:39,479
of these different things and you get
a much deeper insight into that thing.

910
01:12:39,520 --> 01:12:43,119
And with time, it takes that
with something as complex as time, it

911
01:12:43,199 --> 01:12:46,600
takes really coming at it in all
of these different ways. And I remember

912
01:12:47,199 --> 01:12:53,439
our social media site for academics,
or at least where we can keep track

913
01:12:53,479 --> 01:13:00,479
of publications and who's publishing when is
a site called research gate, and I

914
01:13:00,479 --> 01:13:04,520
think it was last year sometime one
of my peer reviewers asked a very specific

915
01:13:04,560 --> 01:13:12,119
and insightful question related to a specific
aspect of time. And because there's so

916
01:13:12,159 --> 01:13:15,600
many different academics from all over the
world on the site, I just posted

917
01:13:15,640 --> 01:13:19,000
her question copy and pasted it onto
research gate, and within a day there

918
01:13:19,039 --> 01:13:26,760
was something like two hundred responses by
PhDs in physics and philosophy and history and

919
01:13:27,600 --> 01:13:31,279
astronomy just coming out of the woodwork
because people are so passionate about it,

920
01:13:31,279 --> 01:13:35,840
and it's one of the last great
unknowns, is not not just what time

921
01:13:36,000 --> 01:13:41,800
is, but but how how do
we really understand it and how could we

922
01:13:41,840 --> 01:13:46,920
manipulate it potentially in the same way
that you see with all of these celestial

923
01:13:46,960 --> 01:13:51,359
bodies and black holes, where there's
this tremendous warbage of space and time and

924
01:13:51,439 --> 01:13:58,279
with very rapid movement, high velocity, and it was really insightful. I

925
01:13:58,319 --> 01:14:00,000
read every single one of them,
and I'd kind of jump in from time

926
01:14:00,000 --> 01:14:08,439
to time, but but I really
just watched as this really complex conversation unfolded

927
01:14:08,479 --> 01:14:12,000
in front of me because of this
one simple question that one of my period

928
01:14:12,079 --> 01:14:17,119
viewers asked about. And I think
that's a testament to how how interesting but

929
01:14:17,199 --> 01:14:25,760
yet how elusive the question of time
really is. Right right now, the

930
01:14:26,920 --> 01:14:32,319
one question I have for you.
Now, there have been people reporting abductions.

931
01:14:32,960 --> 01:14:38,159
The earliest known one was in the
nineteen twenties, and then you really

932
01:14:38,159 --> 01:14:43,479
didn't hear of anything. Then you
heard of nineteen sixty two with Betty and

933
01:14:43,560 --> 01:14:46,359
Barney Hill and then and then you
start in then Travis Walden, and then

934
01:14:46,359 --> 01:14:54,399
you started hearing more and more of
them. I guess the question is for

935
01:14:54,439 --> 01:14:58,800
you is why now? Why in
the modern more what we're going to call

936
01:14:58,840 --> 01:15:02,279
the modern times modern UFO, you
know, we call the modern UFOs nineteen

937
01:15:02,319 --> 01:15:09,399
forty seven till now type of thing. But why would you suspect that there

938
01:15:09,560 --> 01:15:14,279
wasn't these situations happening prior to or
do you think they may have been happening

939
01:15:14,279 --> 01:15:19,720
and just not reported. I think
they've been happening as far back into the

940
01:15:19,760 --> 01:15:25,039
past as our future descendants are able
to go, I think, And that's

941
01:15:25,079 --> 01:15:30,279
probably a really it might be an
evolving point in the past too, wherewith

942
01:15:30,600 --> 01:15:34,760
advances in technology, with the ability
to go faster, well light cones are

943
01:15:34,880 --> 01:15:40,159
oriented toward the past and you can
create close time light curves. I think

944
01:15:40,199 --> 01:15:45,239
the challenge will be how fast can
they go where? What time can they

945
01:15:45,279 --> 01:15:50,399
get to physically in the past.
And I think that will be a really

946
01:15:50,439 --> 01:15:56,920
important threshold and one that will continue
to be pushed because it's important if you're

947
01:15:56,920 --> 01:16:01,840
studying the past and you are able
to collect data from that past, the

948
01:16:01,920 --> 01:16:05,720
earlier you can go. The more
information you have, the broader the span

949
01:16:05,800 --> 01:16:10,880
of your knowledge is. So I
think from whatever point they're able to,

950
01:16:11,319 --> 01:16:14,920
they have been doing it, and
I can't say what point in the past

951
01:16:15,000 --> 01:16:19,520
that is. I think I actually
saw and I think it was maybe even

952
01:16:19,560 --> 01:16:27,560
under hypnosis. Jim Peniston talking about
the information he was given binary code type

953
01:16:27,600 --> 01:16:31,079
of situation but mentioned the same thing. I found this after I published the

954
01:16:31,079 --> 01:16:35,039
book, so it was really interesting
to see. But them even saying they

955
01:16:35,039 --> 01:16:39,720
could only go I think it was
something like fifty thousand years into the past,

956
01:16:39,760 --> 01:16:44,880
just because of limitations and their craft
and the speed at which they could

957
01:16:44,920 --> 01:16:49,520
obtain. So no, I think
I think it's probably two things. An

958
01:16:49,560 --> 01:16:56,760
aspect of that is somewhat becoming normalized, and that's really amazing to see right

959
01:16:56,800 --> 01:17:01,039
now that it's something that's coming out
in the media more and it's becoming something

960
01:17:01,079 --> 01:17:05,439
that's discussed and those that have said
no, UFOs aren't real are now having

961
01:17:05,439 --> 01:17:09,960
to really take a step back and
think about that and try to assess whether

962
01:17:09,960 --> 01:17:15,159
they're just being closed minded, or
have biases, or just really don't want

963
01:17:15,199 --> 01:17:19,119
them to be real. But in
any case, I think that at some

964
01:17:19,199 --> 01:17:27,399
point we're going to have to come
to grips with this that if this has

965
01:17:27,439 --> 01:17:32,359
been happening, if this is happening
now, and it's becoming normalized, we're

966
01:17:32,399 --> 01:17:34,680
going to hear about it more.
And as we hear about it more,

967
01:17:34,720 --> 01:17:38,399
it's going to help with that normality. And you can kind of hear this

968
01:17:38,479 --> 01:17:44,239
drip drip drip of disclosure that we're
just moving towards this point where it might

969
01:17:44,800 --> 01:17:47,000
be something that's that's widely acknowledged,
and I write about that towards the end

970
01:17:47,000 --> 01:17:50,399
of the book, where if we
do get to the point where there isn't

971
01:17:50,399 --> 01:17:56,119
secrecy surrounding the subject, and these
are indeed our future descendants coming back through

972
01:17:56,159 --> 01:18:00,479
time and we don't have to worry
about disruptions to space time or the butterfly

973
01:18:00,479 --> 01:18:04,800
effect or anything like that. It's
possible that in the future, even the

974
01:18:04,920 --> 01:18:10,079
proximate future, the next hundred years
or twenty years or whatever point they decide

975
01:18:10,119 --> 01:18:14,600
we're ready to know this, it
could be as common to hang out with

976
01:18:14,640 --> 01:18:16,960
people from a thousand years in the
future as it is now to hang out

977
01:18:17,000 --> 01:18:21,119
with people from Sub Saharan Africa or
Australia or the Far East, or Europe

978
01:18:21,199 --> 01:18:28,640
or the United States wherever we see
variation geographically referred to as geographic race or

979
01:18:28,680 --> 01:18:33,119
ancestry. But in the future,
we could potentially be interacting with people who

980
01:18:34,000 --> 01:18:41,079
have temporal ancestry. They have variation
resulting from where they came from in time,

981
01:18:41,119 --> 01:18:43,960
and I think that would be an
amazing thing to see, and I

982
01:18:44,000 --> 01:18:50,119
certainly hope it happens in my lifetime. I wanted to just another thing that

983
01:18:50,399 --> 01:18:54,000
I was just thinking of just now. Is that a lot of times we

984
01:18:54,079 --> 01:19:00,000
think of how people in even sometimes
just a few hundred years in the past,

985
01:19:00,560 --> 01:19:03,399
maybe not being as bright as us. And I don't agree with that

986
01:19:03,479 --> 01:19:05,920
at all. As a matter of
fact. Um, you know, I

987
01:19:06,159 --> 01:19:13,159
I transcribed as six page letter of
George Washington wrote, and I had to

988
01:19:13,199 --> 01:19:16,399
use the dictionary twenty five times and
there wasn't And then those six pages there

989
01:19:16,439 --> 01:19:21,039
wasn't one single misspell and wow,
um so, but they were writing it

990
01:19:21,119 --> 01:19:25,720
by hand, weren't they they were? There was no spell check. Yea

991
01:19:25,800 --> 01:19:29,560
beautiful hand raising and uh so.
But you go back in time, and

992
01:19:29,680 --> 01:19:33,199
you know, we just assume that
people weren't as bright and I and I

993
01:19:33,279 --> 01:19:36,960
disagree. I feel like people have
been, you know, just as smart

994
01:19:36,840 --> 01:19:41,840
and and um, you know,
I mean just for a college person to

995
01:19:41,880 --> 01:19:45,399
pass a fourth grade test that was
two hundred years ago. Um, maybe

996
01:19:45,520 --> 01:19:49,079
difficult, you know, I mean, there's anyway. Um, what I'm

997
01:19:49,079 --> 01:19:54,760
getting at is, do you think
there is a trend toward an evolutionary trend

998
01:19:54,800 --> 01:20:00,960
to actually brain size actually growing?
Well, that's it's an interesting question.

999
01:20:01,000 --> 01:20:03,319
There's a couple of things going on
with that. Yes, our brains have

1000
01:20:04,079 --> 01:20:11,840
certainly been growing larger over evolutionary time, and it's an accelerating change. Over

1001
01:20:11,880 --> 01:20:15,760
the last eight hundred thousand years.
In particular, our brains have been getting

1002
01:20:15,840 --> 01:20:19,439
much bigger. They've shrunk a little
bit over the last ten thousand years,

1003
01:20:20,159 --> 01:20:27,800
which is actually just a result of
our overall body size reducing since about thirty

1004
01:20:28,319 --> 01:20:31,640
twenty five, thirty thousand years ago. Across the board, almost every human

1005
01:20:31,720 --> 01:20:36,720
group has seen a reduction in body
size. And but what's important to keep

1006
01:20:36,760 --> 01:20:41,119
in mind is it's not just size
when it comes to the brain. In

1007
01:20:41,159 --> 01:20:50,439
fact, a lot of my research
specifically looks at at MRIs and the connections

1008
01:20:50,479 --> 01:20:56,199
among the brain, the thickness of
different gyrie within the brain, the relationship

1009
01:20:56,239 --> 01:21:00,760
to eye size, how the eye
relates to different structures in the brain as

1010
01:21:00,760 --> 01:21:04,720
well. And one thing I've found
in researching these things is that it's almost

1011
01:21:04,960 --> 01:21:10,359
as far as intelligence goes, better
to have a smaller brain. There's denser

1012
01:21:10,439 --> 01:21:15,359
connections. It's dendritic density that really
plays into intelligence more than just the overall

1013
01:21:15,359 --> 01:21:20,079
size of the brain. With that
said, there's no doubt that our increase

1014
01:21:20,239 --> 01:21:26,399
in brain size over the last four
to five million years in particular, and

1015
01:21:26,520 --> 01:21:30,760
especially in the last eight hundred thousand
years, there's no doubt that it's correlated

1016
01:21:30,840 --> 01:21:35,000
with intelligence. We can see that
clearly in our culture and the evolution of

1017
01:21:35,079 --> 01:21:42,079
technology. They're very intricately linked.
But in looking at differences among modern humans

1018
01:21:42,159 --> 01:21:45,560
or between the sexes or what have
you, size of the brain isn't that

1019
01:21:45,680 --> 01:21:49,399
important. Most of it comes down
to organization of the brain, the density

1020
01:21:49,680 --> 01:21:55,560
of the dendritic connections, the shape. And that's the main thing to keep

1021
01:21:55,600 --> 01:21:59,000
in mind. Is you talked about
earlier how we define modern humans, but

1022
01:21:59,119 --> 01:22:01,920
we actually do have a definition for
that, And the two main traits that

1023
01:22:02,000 --> 01:22:09,600
define anatomically modern Homo sapiens sapiens are
that globularity that I mentioned earlier, the

1024
01:22:09,720 --> 01:22:15,319
rounded skull shape where our parietal lobes
and our temporal lobes have expanded media later

1025
01:22:15,359 --> 01:22:19,000
earlier from inside out, but then
also a facial retraction to the extent that

1026
01:22:19,000 --> 01:22:23,520
we have a chin or a mental
eminence as we call it. So the

1027
01:22:23,640 --> 01:22:28,720
chin is actually one of the criteria
we use. And another thing to keep

1028
01:22:28,720 --> 01:22:32,520
in mind is that we're talking about
a continuous change. So we can't necessarily

1029
01:22:32,560 --> 01:22:36,840
just draw a discrete line and this
continuum and say, now we have modern

1030
01:22:36,920 --> 01:22:42,600
humans. That's the first person there
with a baboustranium and a chin. It

1031
01:22:42,600 --> 01:22:45,640
doesn't work that way. It's a
continuum. So a lot of people like

1032
01:22:45,800 --> 01:22:50,560
to speculate that aliens came down and
made modern humans, or there's this big

1033
01:22:50,640 --> 01:22:55,279
jump that happened. That's just not
true. There's no evidence for that whatsoever.

1034
01:22:55,439 --> 01:23:00,920
We see this continuous change, but
we as anthropologists have to have some

1035
01:23:01,039 --> 01:23:06,119
criteria with which to mark that change
or mark that new form, and those

1036
01:23:06,159 --> 01:23:11,840
are the two main characteristics we use. So so answer your question size of

1037
01:23:11,880 --> 01:23:16,239
the brain, what happens from now
on isn't as important as what shape changes

1038
01:23:16,600 --> 01:23:24,119
take place and how those shape changes
are associated with other characteristics in the face

1039
01:23:24,159 --> 01:23:30,239
and the body, and the context
of neotny ptomorphosis, retaining juvenilized traits into

1040
01:23:30,279 --> 01:23:34,840
adulthood is a big part of the
shape change that we see and and so

1041
01:23:34,840 --> 01:23:39,560
so, Yeah, brain size is
important, has been important, but it's

1042
01:23:39,680 --> 01:23:45,239
it's really more about how our brains
are connected, what's going on inside them,

1043
01:23:45,359 --> 01:23:48,439
and at least in the sense of
what we see from the outside,

1044
01:23:48,720 --> 01:23:56,000
what that overall shape of the brain
is. M This is probably kind of

1045
01:23:56,000 --> 01:24:00,720
a bizarre question, but is there
those are those are my favorite of questions,

1046
01:24:00,760 --> 01:24:03,119
just so you know, okay,
um, is there a part of

1047
01:24:03,119 --> 01:24:10,600
the brain that could develop enough um
or has there ever been any research into

1048
01:24:10,680 --> 01:24:15,479
what makes someone be able to have
telepathy, you know, to send like

1049
01:24:15,520 --> 01:24:21,960
a telepathic message. Is there part
of the brain that that would um originate

1050
01:24:23,760 --> 01:24:29,920
or start to develop or could that
Actually, it's really funny you mentioned that

1051
01:24:30,159 --> 01:24:34,800
is the subject of my next research
project. I would I I would really

1052
01:24:34,840 --> 01:24:40,840
like to know that too. And
um, I just actually agreed to co

1053
01:24:40,960 --> 01:24:47,199
author a book with another PhD who
also has a very very deep interest in

1054
01:24:47,199 --> 01:24:51,199
this and for a very good reason. And and we've talked a lot about

1055
01:24:51,239 --> 01:25:02,479
consciousness and telepathy and locid dreaming and
teleport It was mentioned earlier. Um Alejandro

1056
01:25:02,640 --> 01:25:09,680
mentioned it in his news report the
oh remote viewing people. People claim to

1057
01:25:09,680 --> 01:25:12,600
be able to do this, and
there's a lot of evidence that, you

1058
01:25:12,640 --> 01:25:15,399
know, some people are actually doing
these things. Um. So yeah,

1059
01:25:15,479 --> 01:25:20,760
we we're planning to research that more
to my knowledge, No, it's one

1060
01:25:20,760 --> 01:25:26,760
of the it's one of these things
that much like studying UFOs or talking about

1061
01:25:26,880 --> 01:25:30,720
UFOs and aliens just instantly gets you
nowhere in academia. Yeah, there's there's

1062
01:25:30,760 --> 01:25:33,439
a lot of people that have research
that. Don't get me wrong, but

1063
01:25:33,479 --> 01:25:39,239
at least in the sense of getting
grant money to do functional MRI analyzes of

1064
01:25:39,319 --> 01:25:45,199
which part of the brain is firing
when someone is remote viewing or connecting with

1065
01:25:45,239 --> 01:25:48,680
another brain telepathically. I think there's
a lot of a lot of room to

1066
01:25:48,720 --> 01:25:53,359
move about the cabin there. There's
a lot of research that could help us

1067
01:25:53,359 --> 01:25:58,840
with actual testable hypotheses. Like I
mentioned before, it's important in doing these

1068
01:25:58,840 --> 01:26:02,960
things to work with and the scientific
method and to develop testable hypotheses and data

1069
01:26:03,000 --> 01:26:06,920
collection. And I'd like to continue
with that in this research. And that

1070
01:26:08,039 --> 01:26:13,479
to me is the next big question
is to understand consciousness and to understand people's

1071
01:26:13,680 --> 01:26:18,439
psychic abilities. Certain people have real
abilities to tell what's going to happen in

1072
01:26:18,479 --> 01:26:23,920
some capacity or another. And telepathy, I think is just a big part

1073
01:26:24,119 --> 01:26:30,640
of that overarching aspect of consciousness that
I think is something that the humanity should

1074
01:26:30,640 --> 01:26:34,640
certainly be looking into more. Yeah. Yeah, it certainly would save a

1075
01:26:34,640 --> 01:26:38,960
lot of time and you know,
to gether their cell phones and all that.

1076
01:26:39,439 --> 01:26:43,079
Well. As someone pointed out previously, though, it would make podcasters

1077
01:26:43,159 --> 01:26:46,199
jobs somewhat difficult. You know,
how do you do your job that everyone's

1078
01:26:46,239 --> 01:26:55,439
communicating telepathically? That's right, Yeah, so tune in to the nog Yeah,

1079
01:26:55,479 --> 01:26:59,600
this brain wave, this frequency.
Yeah, yeah, that's pretty funny.

1080
01:26:59,680 --> 01:27:01,800
So I do want to let you
know that I did put the phone

1081
01:27:01,880 --> 01:27:06,720
number up. We are accepting calls
for those of you over at KGr A

1082
01:27:06,920 --> 01:27:13,399
Radio. Write this number down.
It's six zero three nine six seven four

1083
01:27:13,520 --> 01:27:16,079
zero three. Oh if anyone would
like to give us a jingle, and

1084
01:27:16,439 --> 01:27:23,079
I got a question for for doctor
Masters, so feel free to give us

1085
01:27:23,079 --> 01:27:27,760
a call. I think it's to
me. This is a very fascinating topic.

1086
01:27:27,840 --> 01:27:30,560
It's a little do you do you
mind if I plug the book?

1087
01:27:30,600 --> 01:27:32,239
Well, absolutely, go right to
it. Yes, Well, the name

1088
01:27:32,279 --> 01:27:39,640
of The book is Identified Flying Objects, a multidisciplinary scientific approach to the UFO

1089
01:27:39,680 --> 01:27:45,840
phenomenon, and it's available on all
major platforms. The website's probably the best

1090
01:27:45,880 --> 01:27:51,920
place to find places to purchase it
or to find out more information or talks.

1091
01:27:51,960 --> 01:27:57,279
I think it came up earlier that
i'd be at the International UFO Congress

1092
01:27:57,319 --> 01:28:01,079
and Phoenix in September. I'll be
speaking at move on fiftieth anniversary event in

1093
01:28:01,119 --> 01:28:08,399
Irvine, California on in late July, so there's yeah, there's a lot

1094
01:28:08,520 --> 01:28:11,680
going on. There's a lot of
moving bits and pieces, and like I've

1095
01:28:11,720 --> 01:28:15,399
said from the beginning, it's just
an evolving process, an evolving project,

1096
01:28:15,600 --> 01:28:20,079
and doing things like this having conversations
with you right now is a very important

1097
01:28:20,119 --> 01:28:25,239
part of that. Yeah. Yeah, I would put that. I've actually

1098
01:28:25,680 --> 01:28:30,720
got bumped off of YouTube monetization actually
when I put a cover of a book

1099
01:28:30,800 --> 01:28:32,920
up, so I can't do that
anymore. But it is easy to find

1100
01:28:33,000 --> 01:28:38,800
on Amazon or actually you have,
as you mentioned, your website which actually

1101
01:28:38,840 --> 01:28:42,039
stands for Identified Objects, right,
is that what? Yeah, Yeah,

1102
01:28:42,039 --> 01:28:47,079
it's just a shortened version of the
book i'd flyob dot com, idfly O

1103
01:28:47,239 --> 01:28:51,800
b J which in retrospect. I
was on coast to coast and George Nori

1104
01:28:53,119 --> 01:28:55,720
was, you know, doing the
whole spiel, and he was like,

1105
01:28:55,800 --> 01:28:59,520
and his website is just a random
string of numbers. All right, we'll

1106
01:28:59,560 --> 01:29:02,000
be right. We ran a string
up letters, he said. I was

1107
01:29:02,039 --> 01:29:04,680
like, ah, yeah, he's
right. I probably should have done something

1108
01:29:04,680 --> 01:29:09,560
else. But IFO was taken,
I couldn't use IO and that was that

1109
01:29:09,680 --> 01:29:15,359
was the next best idea in my
mind. I'd fly obs. But yeah,

1110
01:29:15,840 --> 01:29:18,840
George Norri called me out and he
was doing so yeah. Yeah,

1111
01:29:19,760 --> 01:29:23,840
um, well again the lines help, but if anyone like to call in

1112
01:29:24,079 --> 01:29:30,840
and so on. As far as
the future traits of the human anatomy,

1113
01:29:31,319 --> 01:29:34,000
um, you said, A lot
of it is a lot of it is

1114
01:29:34,000 --> 01:29:39,640
shaped around environment. I know,
you know, food, supply of food

1115
01:29:39,640 --> 01:29:45,840
and all that. Um, but
do you think that we're um, you

1116
01:29:45,880 --> 01:29:48,640
know, I was talking earlier about
intelligence and you know, some I've heard

1117
01:29:48,680 --> 01:29:51,600
people say this, and I don't
know it's just people talking or whatever,

1118
01:29:51,640 --> 01:29:58,439
but they say people are getting less
intelligent? Is there there's no way to

1119
01:29:58,439 --> 01:30:01,439
to track that that's not really happening? Is it that you we're aware of?

1120
01:30:02,239 --> 01:30:05,159
Oh? No, there's tons of
ways to track that absolutely, and

1121
01:30:05,239 --> 01:30:11,720
we do all the time. Yeah, anytime you see any quantitative metric about

1122
01:30:11,880 --> 01:30:16,039
schools or tests, or especially because
we've standardized tests for so long, i

1123
01:30:16,399 --> 01:30:20,720
Q tests or I don't know what
the FCC rules are, so I'll just

1124
01:30:21,039 --> 01:30:28,119
use a nice term our our bunk
essentially, And we're developed for very horrible

1125
01:30:28,199 --> 01:30:31,239
reasons as part of the eugenics movement. They're very racist, really, and

1126
01:30:31,279 --> 01:30:34,880
I don't Yeah, I don't lend
much credence to i Q tests, but

1127
01:30:35,319 --> 01:30:41,119
there are standard, standardized tests that
are very useful, and we can compare

1128
01:30:41,199 --> 01:30:48,600
these across different countries, across different
demographic groups obviously different ages, different ethnicities

1129
01:30:48,640 --> 01:30:54,600
and whatnot, and see what our
intelligence is like. And yeah, we've

1130
01:30:54,680 --> 01:30:59,079
been fallen by the wayside certainly.
And as you mentioned, I think it's

1131
01:30:59,239 --> 01:31:03,119
important to think about this too.
Is we're people smarter in the past.

1132
01:31:03,199 --> 01:31:06,960
Sure, as you mentioned, they
were able to write without spelling errors,

1133
01:31:08,000 --> 01:31:11,560
with very beautiful handwriting, and they
took their time to do it. But

1134
01:31:11,600 --> 01:31:15,640
what did they really produce and how
quickly did they produce it? But culture

1135
01:31:15,800 --> 01:31:20,760
builds on top of culture, and
technology builds on top of technology, and

1136
01:31:20,920 --> 01:31:25,960
there are people that drive that forward, who are very very smart people.

1137
01:31:26,560 --> 01:31:31,000
But it almost sounds like you're asking, are we as a species or the

1138
01:31:31,119 --> 01:31:38,520
average of humans sort of devolving or
getting am I often left field? There?

1139
01:31:38,920 --> 01:31:41,000
No, No, that's exactly what
I was where I was going.

1140
01:31:41,079 --> 01:31:44,680
Yes, Yeah, And I think
a lot of that comes down to a

1141
01:31:44,720 --> 01:31:49,760
couple things. This is anecdotal to
some extent, but there is also data

1142
01:31:49,840 --> 01:31:55,319
to back this up and studies to
back this up that on average, there

1143
01:31:55,359 --> 01:32:00,079
are more less intelligent people in this
country then in the past, and that

1144
01:32:00,079 --> 01:32:04,039
could partly be because there were fewer
people in the past. It also comes

1145
01:32:04,039 --> 01:32:09,600
down to birth rates among different demographic
groups, and especially those in poverty,

1146
01:32:09,720 --> 01:32:14,279
they tend to have more children,
but that's also socio political if they have

1147
01:32:14,359 --> 01:32:20,600
less access to birth control and less
education about ways to prevent unwanted births.

1148
01:32:20,600 --> 01:32:25,840
There's also more rape and abuse and
a number of things that play into it.

1149
01:32:25,920 --> 01:32:30,720
So so yeah, and looking at
if we are sort of devolving or

1150
01:32:30,800 --> 01:32:35,880
getting dumber, we have to also
factor into it the economic situation and the

1151
01:32:35,920 --> 01:32:43,520
political situation. If we're cutting access
to education, healthcare, preventative measures,

1152
01:32:43,600 --> 01:32:47,640
then yeah, you could definitely see
the beginning of a trend. That would

1153
01:32:47,680 --> 01:32:55,520
continue to push us toward more people
that have a lower education and therefore less

1154
01:32:55,560 --> 01:33:01,079
intelligence as indicated by these standardized tests. You know, I myself have seen

1155
01:33:02,000 --> 01:33:08,319
a trend in just what I do
as far as you know, your your

1156
01:33:08,319 --> 01:33:11,600
phone has spell checked for you now, um, you know there's all these

1157
01:33:11,640 --> 01:33:16,479
little things that calculators. Yeah,
right out hand, you know, right

1158
01:33:16,520 --> 01:33:20,760
out and really you know, use
your brain for it's so much easier to

1159
01:33:20,800 --> 01:33:27,199
ask Surry or or Alexa or whatever
it is. Um. But you know,

1160
01:33:27,439 --> 01:33:30,560
and that that way, and in
that way in particular, I can

1161
01:33:30,560 --> 01:33:34,520
see that technology is harmful to us. And actually, but but let me

1162
01:33:34,560 --> 01:33:39,079
ask you this. Does that does
that mean we're dumber or does that mean

1163
01:33:39,079 --> 01:33:44,359
we're smarter? Because again, on
average, you know, regardless of what

1164
01:33:44,399 --> 01:33:47,560
we can do or can't do within
our brains, we're still able to learn

1165
01:33:47,560 --> 01:33:50,920
this technology, and we're still able
to learn how to use these apps.

1166
01:33:50,920 --> 01:33:57,520
And it's constantly evolving technology that we
have to adapt to. And and and

1167
01:33:57,640 --> 01:34:01,239
even though yeah, we might be
getting dumber and certain segments of the population,

1168
01:34:01,279 --> 01:34:06,840
I think we're still we still are
required to do things that one hundred

1169
01:34:06,960 --> 01:34:13,880
years ago just wouldn't really even be
something we could conceptualize. So I don't

1170
01:34:14,159 --> 01:34:16,199
know. I g it's a tough
one. I think it's a multifaceted they

1171
01:34:16,239 --> 01:34:19,199
I'm really glad you brought it up, actually, because it's it's something that

1172
01:34:19,279 --> 01:34:24,279
I think we all kind of bounce
around in our heads and as something we

1173
01:34:24,279 --> 01:34:28,319
should have more of a discussion about. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, you

1174
01:34:28,359 --> 01:34:32,840
know, getting back to the topic
that you know my shows about UFOs.

1175
01:34:32,920 --> 01:34:40,039
Basically, do you think that or
is some of your thoughts that what people

1176
01:34:40,079 --> 01:34:45,359
are seeing as far as the ufou
are actually carrying people, you know,

1177
01:34:45,439 --> 01:34:49,560
from the future to the past,
or do you think some possibly that some

1178
01:34:49,600 --> 01:34:54,159
of them are Is that is that
kind of your theory that these are actually

1179
01:34:54,199 --> 01:34:59,680
time machines? Yeah, I do. I that's a main argument, and

1180
01:34:59,720 --> 01:35:03,800
the book is that these devices,
these UFOs themselves, are the actual time

1181
01:35:03,800 --> 01:35:10,520
machine. And I look at,
like I mentioned earlier, some of the

1182
01:35:11,479 --> 01:35:16,680
early solution st. Einstein's field equations, and most of them involved some sort

1183
01:35:16,720 --> 01:35:23,439
of rotating cylinder or silenoid or a
disc, many times a disc, especially

1184
01:35:23,479 --> 01:35:28,479
in more recent research, and the
main thing that happens the main way in

1185
01:35:28,479 --> 01:35:31,760
which you can travel into the past, that you reorient light cones toward the

1186
01:35:31,800 --> 01:35:38,319
past, and a light cone is
just all of the possibilities within the speed

1187
01:35:38,319 --> 01:35:43,039
of light, within the laws of
physics, any moment radiating out into the

1188
01:35:43,079 --> 01:35:46,159
future. If you can imagine beams
of light on either side, it creates

1189
01:35:46,279 --> 01:35:51,079
this probability layer, this cone of
probabilities, which is what's known as a

1190
01:35:51,159 --> 01:35:55,520
light cone. But in order to
travel into the past, you have to

1191
01:35:55,520 --> 01:35:58,840
re orient those toward the past.
You have to get them to tip over

1192
01:35:59,359 --> 01:36:04,520
so that you can actually move physically
into a past period. And one of

1193
01:36:05,319 --> 01:36:10,520
this has been demonstrated many times.
It's something that we understand, we can't

1194
01:36:10,560 --> 01:36:15,800
create it. Yet. More recent
research actually is starting to investigate these things

1195
01:36:15,800 --> 01:36:20,079
in a laboratory setting and look into
how we create these frame dragging lens Thirin

1196
01:36:20,119 --> 01:36:25,199
effects to create an actual time machine. But what they all come down to

1197
01:36:25,359 --> 01:36:30,119
is the rotation, or at least
a dominant theme throughout is the rotation of

1198
01:36:30,159 --> 01:36:36,239
a highly massive or highly energetic disc. And if you think about black holes,

1199
01:36:36,279 --> 01:36:41,920
the only thing in the known universe
that can actually send matter back in

1200
01:36:42,000 --> 01:36:45,319
time at the event horizon, the
Schwartzschild radius of a black hole, that

1201
01:36:45,479 --> 01:36:50,279
is when it disappears from our four
dimensions of space time. Even light can't

1202
01:36:50,319 --> 01:36:55,920
penetrate that event horizon because of the
massive gravitation. And I certainly don't think

1203
01:36:55,960 --> 01:37:00,039
that these UFOs or ifos as I
call them in the book are like black

1204
01:37:00,079 --> 01:37:05,239
holes. That would the tidal forces
of a black hole and singularity associated with

1205
01:37:05,279 --> 01:37:11,760
it would rip apart anything that entered
it. But a good surrogate for that

1206
01:37:11,880 --> 01:37:15,560
is the electromagnetic force. And what
a lot of people don't realize is the

1207
01:37:15,600 --> 01:37:20,760
electromagnetic force is ten to the forty
times stronger than gravity. We think of

1208
01:37:20,800 --> 01:37:25,399
gravity is this thing that holds us
to the Earth, and it holds the

1209
01:37:25,439 --> 01:37:28,800
Earth to the Sun and the Moon
to the Earth, and it is an

1210
01:37:28,840 --> 01:37:33,880
important force of the four forces in
nature. But electromagnetism is so much stronger.

1211
01:37:33,920 --> 01:37:40,359
So if we could harness that electromagnetic
force and still create this frame dragon

1212
01:37:40,399 --> 01:37:45,520
effect or this rotational energy that's needed
to reorient those light cones towards the past,

1213
01:37:46,119 --> 01:37:53,760
we could potentially create a time machine
without having to create singularities associated with

1214
01:37:53,880 --> 01:37:59,079
black holes and the physics and particle
physics involved with that. So yeah,

1215
01:37:59,119 --> 01:38:03,760
an idiom. A common mantra in
biology is that form follows function. And

1216
01:38:04,079 --> 01:38:09,000
that applies to anything, and it
certainly applies here. I think where the

1217
01:38:09,079 --> 01:38:15,520
form of these craft and the properties
that they have, the common description of

1218
01:38:15,520 --> 01:38:23,119
them being disc like and having h
rotating h could facilitate the function of backward

1219
01:38:23,159 --> 01:38:27,399
time travels. Yeah, I really
do believe, and I feel like I

1220
01:38:27,520 --> 01:38:30,079
make a strong argument for this in
the book, that these are the actual

1221
01:38:30,079 --> 01:38:35,880
time machines themselves. Wow, amazing, amazing m so and the food fighters

1222
01:38:36,399 --> 01:38:42,479
mostly were orbs, So that that
doesn't that doesn't kind of follow that same

1223
01:38:42,560 --> 01:38:45,119
line, you know, I mean
mostly what people were seeing or No,

1224
01:38:45,119 --> 01:38:48,680
No, I'd like to address that
rightfully, actually, as I don't.

1225
01:38:48,720 --> 01:38:53,960
I don't think all of them aren't. Um, there are things like like

1226
01:38:54,079 --> 01:38:59,920
what was described recently, the cube
and the orb or the something like that.

1227
01:39:00,960 --> 01:39:06,319
I've been shown images of things that
appear to be drones that aren't that

1228
01:39:06,399 --> 01:39:13,159
certainly aren't time machines. Many of
them are more circular. But the actual

1229
01:39:13,800 --> 01:39:17,359
craft that the large I hate to
use this word because it's so cliche,

1230
01:39:17,479 --> 01:39:24,319
but mothership type craft they do seem
to have the capacity what comes out of

1231
01:39:24,359 --> 01:39:29,640
those to do whatever sort of thing
is happening. Obviously, you're not just

1232
01:39:29,720 --> 01:39:31,479
going to take that down in someone's
bedroom and see if you can get in

1233
01:39:31,520 --> 01:39:34,000
there to abduct them. At that
time, you're going to send a little

1234
01:39:34,479 --> 01:39:39,039
a little probe, a little drone
type thing. So I think a lot

1235
01:39:39,079 --> 01:39:44,159
of the UFO phenomenon is people observing
those types of things that are being sent

1236
01:39:44,199 --> 01:39:48,760
out by our time traveling descendants in
order to do their research. Pick up

1237
01:39:48,800 --> 01:39:54,359
a couple of people, do their
biomedical examination, then return to their own

1238
01:39:54,399 --> 01:40:00,239
time without having to really be there
and hovering over large metropolitan areas. So

1239
01:40:00,279 --> 01:40:03,960
I think a lot of the UFO
phenomenon is just what they're sending out as

1240
01:40:04,000 --> 01:40:12,680
part of their research mission. Well
well, and care to speculate how many

1241
01:40:13,920 --> 01:40:16,279
thousands and thousands of years in the
future you think that this could be.

1242
01:40:18,399 --> 01:40:24,760
I hate speculating about that. However, to be fair, I was just

1243
01:40:24,800 --> 01:40:29,920
talking about being on Coast to coast
a couple of months ago, and George

1244
01:40:29,960 --> 01:40:33,520
Nori made me do it. He
wouldn't he wouldn't go to commercial really until

1245
01:40:33,560 --> 01:40:36,479
I did it. So if I
do it for George nor I feel like

1246
01:40:36,479 --> 01:40:40,520
I should have to do it for
everyone who asked that question. But the

1247
01:40:40,600 --> 01:40:47,840
number I gave him it was I
think around I think around twenty thousand years,

1248
01:40:49,079 --> 01:40:53,199
and that's what Again, that's not
that at all really, But again

1249
01:40:53,239 --> 01:40:58,279
it's also complicated because we could potentially
have the technology to do this in a

1250
01:40:58,319 --> 01:41:01,279
couple of thousand years, but we
also wouldn't expect to see people from that

1251
01:41:01,359 --> 01:41:04,720
time because they likely already have records
of what happened, and we wouldn't be

1252
01:41:04,760 --> 01:41:09,520
that interesting too, there's no real
incentive to do it. So I think

1253
01:41:09,720 --> 01:41:15,560
the vast majority of accounts, abduction
accounts and whatnot, where we see these

1254
01:41:15,680 --> 01:41:24,279
more evolved humans with still very hominant
traits but slightly derived versions of them based

1255
01:41:24,319 --> 01:41:29,800
on those is where I get that
twenty thousand year estimate. Though I think

1256
01:41:29,840 --> 01:41:33,760
the technology will probably be available before
that, it just won't be used for

1257
01:41:33,840 --> 01:41:39,680
this necessarily. And it's important to
keep in mind too that once that technology

1258
01:41:39,760 --> 01:41:45,079
exists, as I mentioned earlier in
the context of Novikov's self consistency principle,

1259
01:41:45,439 --> 01:41:48,600
none of these things are ahead of
or behind the other once that time machine

1260
01:41:48,880 --> 01:41:56,479
is developed, So there could potentially
be an IFO chocked full of our future

1261
01:41:56,560 --> 01:42:00,319
humans who actually have the technology who
went back and picked up a bunch of

1262
01:42:00,600 --> 01:42:04,319
Neanderthals, and maybe they drop some
off just to mess with us, and

1263
01:42:04,359 --> 01:42:09,640
that's where the bigfoot sasquash thing comes
from. They pick them up in the

1264
01:42:09,640 --> 01:42:13,159
past, they come back and get
a couple of humans from a thousand years

1265
01:42:13,159 --> 01:42:15,640
in the future, and then you
know, some major celebrity just because it's

1266
01:42:15,680 --> 01:42:20,479
funny, and then pick us up. And we're looking at this whole spectrum

1267
01:42:20,640 --> 01:42:26,000
of human evolution because they have the
technology to do that. So I think

1268
01:42:26,000 --> 01:42:29,640
it's important that even you know when
I throw out this arbitrary number because obviously

1269
01:42:29,720 --> 01:42:32,239
have no idea, I'm just speculating. But based on those physical traits,

1270
01:42:32,680 --> 01:42:40,039
they seem to be from a period
in our future that's somewhat consistent with twenty

1271
01:42:39,479 --> 01:42:44,640
fifty thousand years. But anybody could
be in there. They can pick up

1272
01:42:44,680 --> 01:42:48,000
anybody they want, within the limits
of what their craft can do, within

1273
01:42:48,039 --> 01:42:55,039
the limits of when the earliest point
their craft can reach. So I think

1274
01:42:55,079 --> 01:42:59,640
we need to still consider it holistically
and think about the whole of space time

1275
01:43:00,039 --> 01:43:02,920
and not just when they might be
coming from in the future. Yeah,

1276
01:43:03,239 --> 01:43:08,479
I'm sure you probably caught the headline
a few months ago where it said major

1277
01:43:08,520 --> 01:43:13,720
breakthrough in time travel and ended up
just being something with a quantum computer and

1278
01:43:14,199 --> 01:43:18,199
it really I hate disappointing with it. It was yeah, yeah, there's

1279
01:43:18,239 --> 01:43:27,000
a question in the chat room Constantineous, that's the screen name. Have you

1280
01:43:27,159 --> 01:43:34,199
ever come in contact with Bashar bas
Hr Bishar shares the same concept of them

1281
01:43:34,239 --> 01:43:40,399
being descendants thus from the future.
Did you ever Are you aware of that

1282
01:43:40,560 --> 01:43:45,640
name or I'm not, But I
would like to respond to that question by

1283
01:43:45,720 --> 01:43:53,720
saying that I've been really excited about
how many people have also thought of this

1284
01:43:53,800 --> 01:44:00,680
and have also researched this tremendously,
and I certainly plan on looking this person

1285
01:44:00,760 --> 01:44:02,920
up as well, because what I've
also found is that we've all come at

1286
01:44:02,920 --> 01:44:09,600
it with a similar sort of reason, but with very different things to add.

1287
01:44:09,960 --> 01:44:13,800
And I've always said that, you
know, this is an evolving project,

1288
01:44:13,880 --> 01:44:16,600
and I'm just trying to put some
pieces of the puzzle in where they

1289
01:44:16,680 --> 01:44:23,079
might fit and then hopefully start more
dialogue and more conversation, especially among my

1290
01:44:23,119 --> 01:44:27,199
academic peers, because this is what
science is supposed to be, is asking

1291
01:44:27,279 --> 01:44:31,840
questions about things that are unknown.
So I would hope that more people would

1292
01:44:31,920 --> 01:44:36,640
start to look at these questions and
develop testable hypotheses. But but I've already

1293
01:44:36,640 --> 01:44:45,399
been really excited by how many other
people have really thought about this and in

1294
01:44:45,479 --> 01:44:47,399
deep terms, and I've had the
chance to talk to many of them with

1295
01:44:47,520 --> 01:44:55,800
really exciting conversations. Actually just started
signed a contract to start working with a

1296
01:44:55,840 --> 01:45:03,279
TV production company with a couple really
amazing people who who are excited about the

1297
01:45:03,319 --> 01:45:09,680
project and who have also thought about
this and have have really been excited to

1298
01:45:10,199 --> 01:45:15,680
build this and to present it in
a more main to a more mainstream audience.

1299
01:45:15,920 --> 01:45:17,760
I sure hope they don't go off
the fringe fringe side with it to

1300
01:45:17,800 --> 01:45:20,800
make it more well. No,
no, no, no, no,

1301
01:45:21,159 --> 01:45:25,920
we that was the very first thing
we talked about, the very last thing

1302
01:45:26,000 --> 01:45:29,760
that I can sat by your your
manner in general, that you would oh

1303
01:45:29,800 --> 01:45:32,560
my god, no, you guys
spoke about Ancient Aliens earlier. I've been

1304
01:45:32,560 --> 01:45:39,920
contacted by two producers of Ancient Aliens
in the last five months, and and

1305
01:45:40,079 --> 01:45:44,079
I I hope we can find common
grounds soon because I really would like to

1306
01:45:44,119 --> 01:45:45,880
be on the show. But I'm
not I'm not going to sell out my

1307
01:45:45,920 --> 01:45:49,960
integrity good, I'm not gonna I'm
not gonna lie. I'm not gonna make

1308
01:45:50,000 --> 01:45:55,800
things up Um and and these guys
know that We've had some really great discussions

1309
01:45:55,800 --> 01:45:58,399
and I'm really excited to work with
them. I think it'll be phenomenal.

1310
01:45:58,560 --> 01:46:00,279
Great. We do have a call
on the line. Caller, your first

1311
01:46:00,359 --> 01:46:05,199
name? Where are you calling from? James? And I'm in Bellevue,

1312
01:46:05,279 --> 01:46:09,800
Washington. Oh, yes, James, you've called him before. You you're

1313
01:46:09,880 --> 01:46:13,399
kind of a science type guy.
How are you? Yes, that's right,

1314
01:46:13,600 --> 01:46:18,000
Yes, I'm good, great show. Thank you. Yes, yeah,

1315
01:46:18,079 --> 01:46:24,319
my I really can't wait to read
the book. And and I like

1316
01:46:24,479 --> 01:46:29,560
the the whole idea of the ifos
UM. I'm just wonder what your thoughts

1317
01:46:29,600 --> 01:46:34,319
are. Um. You know,
there's such a huge variety of descriptions of

1318
01:46:34,439 --> 01:46:42,239
the various ships. You know,
there's triangles and I've heard of rectangles and

1319
01:46:43,239 --> 01:46:46,680
saucers and all of that. And
do you what do you think about do

1320
01:46:46,680 --> 01:46:53,479
you think it is possible that there
are other, you know, cultures or

1321
01:46:53,720 --> 01:47:00,000
species that maybe visiting or maybe they're
von Newman probes or something along those lines.

1322
01:47:00,920 --> 01:47:04,159
Yeah, that's a great question.
I actually really appreciate that question because

1323
01:47:04,720 --> 01:47:09,399
it's something that I didn't really go
into in much detail on the book,

1324
01:47:09,600 --> 01:47:14,119
but I wished i'd had. Once
I published it, you'll you'll you'll be

1325
01:47:14,159 --> 01:47:16,800
able to see where that should have
gone and where I wished I would have

1326
01:47:16,840 --> 01:47:20,439
put it if if you end up
getting it. But one thing I would

1327
01:47:20,520 --> 01:47:26,640
like to mention, I don't necessarily
think that they're they're extraterrestrial. There are

1328
01:47:26,720 --> 01:47:30,880
different shapes, absolutely, there's the
cigar shape is a very common one.

1329
01:47:30,279 --> 01:47:33,640
What I personally think, and I'm
just speculating here, but what I personally

1330
01:47:33,640 --> 01:47:40,399
think is that the triangle ones are
our ours rurs. Now. I want

1331
01:47:40,399 --> 01:47:43,960
to talk about that well well modern
man made because if you think about it,

1332
01:47:44,199 --> 01:47:46,840
um, if they don't have to
worry about the time travel aspects,

1333
01:47:46,840 --> 01:47:53,159
if they don't have to maintain that
that symmetrical shape and have a material that

1334
01:47:53,199 --> 01:47:57,520
couldn't stand not just the centripical forces, but all of the kinetic forces and

1335
01:47:57,600 --> 01:48:02,840
the friction, uh and spinning something
that fast and with that much energy.

1336
01:48:02,960 --> 01:48:10,000
Yeah, exactly. But the triangles
almost seem like a primitive attempt by us

1337
01:48:10,199 --> 01:48:18,199
to use that anti gravity electromagnetic propulsion
system to still make something that's unidentifiable to

1338
01:48:18,359 --> 01:48:23,960
us, because we're used to vector
propulsion and we're used to airplanes with jets

1339
01:48:24,039 --> 01:48:28,079
or helicopters, But I almost think
the triangles are ours. I almost think

1340
01:48:28,079 --> 01:48:32,560
that those have been developed, perhaps
even with technology that was acquired during the

1341
01:48:32,640 --> 01:48:38,439
Roswell crash where we reverse the engineer
didn't figured out fifty years is a long

1342
01:48:38,520 --> 01:48:44,439
time, oh ship, We're almost
a like seventy years now since that happened,

1343
01:48:44,479 --> 01:48:48,239
so that's actually a very long time
to reverse engineer something like that.

1344
01:48:48,479 --> 01:48:53,239
I personally think the triangles, and
again I'm just speculating, but those shapes

1345
01:48:53,359 --> 01:48:59,720
where it's just about trying to get
stability, you know, like if you

1346
01:48:59,760 --> 01:49:03,279
think about sitting on a chair,
you have three legs, you're gonna wobble

1347
01:49:03,319 --> 01:49:06,239
in three different directions. You have
four, you're better situated for that.

1348
01:49:06,359 --> 01:49:11,000
So that takes some of the variables
out of it where it's not a rotational

1349
01:49:11,079 --> 01:49:13,840
thing. It's not like trying to
maintain a rotating frisbee in the air,

1350
01:49:13,880 --> 01:49:18,119
but it's just these these three places
where you have to control those independently.

1351
01:49:18,359 --> 01:49:21,760
Well, I would argue I'm actually
gonna have to cut this short, but

1352
01:49:21,960 --> 01:49:26,119
because we are out of time,
and thanks for the call. Well,

1353
01:49:26,159 --> 01:49:29,039
thanks Marty, all right, thanks
for the call, Thanks James, and

1354
01:49:29,239 --> 01:49:33,640
I wish I had longer time to
argue the triangular UFO with you. I'd

1355
01:49:33,640 --> 01:49:36,520
still like to hear your idea.
Okay, well hang on, don't you

1356
01:49:36,560 --> 01:49:40,079
give me cliff notes? Okay,
wait, don't go away, stay on

1357
01:49:40,239 --> 01:49:43,039
Skype for a minute. And this
is going to be the end of the

1358
01:49:43,039 --> 01:49:46,039
show. Again, I want to
thank everyone for helping out with the show,

1359
01:49:46,119 --> 01:49:48,920
and Aljandro and the first at the
first part of the show, and

1360
01:49:48,960 --> 01:49:53,039
a guest of course, doctor Michael
Masters. You can get his book,

1361
01:49:53,720 --> 01:49:58,479
check it out online. Go ahead
and throw that website out there one more

1362
01:49:58,479 --> 01:50:03,560
time if you would, I'd fly
obj dot com I d O b J.

1363
01:50:03,960 --> 01:50:08,119
Okay, since you are on and
I'm asking you to stay on,

1364
01:50:08,399 --> 01:50:11,039
there's going to be an outro.
You're not gonna hear it, so you're

1365
01:50:11,079 --> 01:50:15,760
just gonna have to um hang in
there and not make any noises because we're

1366
01:50:15,760 --> 01:50:18,119
going to go into it. So
thanks so much for everyone, everyone for

1367
01:50:18,560 --> 01:50:23,399
listening, and uh, we'll see
you next week. I'm not sure who

1368
01:50:23,399 --> 01:50:47,520
our guest will be, but remember
to keep your eyes to the sky.