What is going on? Clippers fans, Welcome to season two, episode twenty
nine of Clips and Dip. I am Chuck Buckler. William Updike is here
as well. Adam Oslin, who is usually with us, is sick today.
He cannot make it. He did want us to tell everyone he is
still keeping receipts. So don't think just because he's sick. Say some wild
stuff to Adam on Twitter if you get a chance today, just give the
man a reason to keep on living exactly. We are Clips and Dip.
You can find us anywhere you find podcasts. If you're watching us on YouTube,
welcome. We're at YouTube dot com slash at Clippers podcast. We have
a fantastic show. We are joined today by Rod Benson, former Cal Bear,
Korean League Champion, All Star in the Korean League, Import player of
the Year, d League All Star, and seven hell of a goll for
a fantastic artist and the author of the new book that came out today that
we are going to talk about different. Dude, Rod, thank you so
much for bringing your high level basketball acumen to the show. How the hell
are you? First of all, you left off like the only thing that
matters to this podcast, which was Summer League Clippers starter. No, I
don't know who. I didn't find me. Why are you not open with
you? I don't know. It was Blake Griffin's like rookie year too.
It was like because he he was hurt, so he did he was coming
back, so he like only trained with us and then didn't play. But
yeah, like dj A, I was out there. I was with at
the Jersey on Bro. You could have been you could have been in Love
City. What could have been? That's so rad. We are so happy
to have you on the show. Will I won't run down your resume because
I I don't think it's too extensive. Extensive. How are we doing?
The Clippers just beat the Nuggets for the first time in fifty six years,
feeling pretty good about it, I guess so was that an exaggeration? No,
they hadn't They had only two. I think it's the last time.
Yeah, OK, whoa, I think it's been around. I also don't
like that that actually is something we had to do where it's like, what
has it been fifty six? But yeah, I don't know. We're feeling
pretty good, Rod. Yeah, I'm sure you've seen what's the Clippers current
roster, they've made some moves. They they've crawled back to five hundred.
We're gonna talk about how we feel the Clippers being five hundred after twenty games
in the grand scheme of things. But as a former Clipper, Great,
what are your impressions right now of the Clippers? Do you see this team
being able to make a run? Are they putting things together? What do
you what are you seeing in Clippers? Miss? Yeah, I'll say that
since twenty ten is when I first came into the Clipper verse, we'll call
it. Since then, they've been like a fourth place team for like twenty
years with a couple like and they still feel like it. And the reason
they feel like it is because you can't even do you understand? I tried
to prep for this by like how do I find Clippers talk? Like,
where do I how do I get some information about what's been happening recently with
the Clips? There's like, actually none, You might be the only people
I get Clippers fans now today? There's three podcasts. Yeah, because it's
like, you guys are always just not good enough to be in the zeitgeist.
So it just always feels like, eh, Clippers have some good players.
Maybe fourth, You're not wrong, like the Clippers media cycle is a
trip because it's usually the media buys in and then the Clippers underperform, and
then the media gets really upset that they bought in and then decides to write
the Clippers off. Well, does that feel accurate? It feels like we're
I think it feels accurate. For the two to one three era, everyone
was like really excited in like when that the summer that that trade happened.
We had the earthquake during Summer League in Vegas, right, and then like
the Clippers enjoyed like two years of you know, contender sort of I guess
status where it seemed like a possibility despite not you know, like the first
year, despite not playing a minute together yet, so they didn't even know
what it was gonna look like. And then after the fall apart in the
bubble, people thought they could come back from it. But since then,
I agree with Rod, I think it's been very much like what is this
team like truly? What is like the ceiling of their potential? And is
it of interest because it's not a sexy team, Like there's nothing about this
team that's like an interesting team to from a media perspective, you have maybe
four of like the most disliked players in the league. And I mean,
like truly like Harden in Westbrook have to be two of the most disliked players
in the league, deserved or undeserved. They are the most two of the
most polarizing players for reasons. I can not comprehend Kawhi. The media hates
him, coaches hate him, everyone seems to hate him, and then Paul
George sticks his foot in his mouth on a daily basis, So that one
is maybe the most earned of the four. But like the you know,
it's just it's like I said, it's just not a it's not a headlining
team. It's not you know's there's not a lot of sizzle there. No,
it's a steak, but there's not a lot of it's a well,
there's no And this has been some random person tweeting this out the other day,
but the identity has been the Clippers issue, because like there's not one
thing you can point towards with the Clippers team and say that is what Clippers
basketball is. You know, it's not like gritty rebounding. It's not like
you know, Memphis or something in the grit and grind days where it's like,
oh, you're gonna get out hustled. The Clippers. It's like they're
gonna play fundamental, go for it. Yeah. No team has had more
like definitions of what they are than the Clippers. It's like lob City.
Oh. Then it was like it was like whatever, like the headband,
like the three Knuckleheads knucklehead Yeah, and it's like I don't follow Clippers enough
to remember, like no other team has like literally their offense called like their
nickname. And when they got I mean again, it died down so quickly.
There was some like there was a lot of hype when Kawhi and Paul
George got together, and I'm sure if they had done one thing, if
they'd been healthy enough to do one thing, it's like, oh, man,
team helicopter and a helicopter offense the Clippers. You know how it goes
out there. Everyone knows what the Clippers do. They just don't do it
when like people are watching. Like I played basketball a long time and like
the best teams, I was on the very best teams. I'm not saying
we tanked the regular season. That's not it at all. We purposely wouldn't
put in strategies. We would practice them every day and we'd wait, like
we know we're going to play this team at the second round of this,
we would save all that stuff. And when I was on teams that would
do well in the regular season, we wouldn't save any of that. We
would just go all out. We gotta show what we are. And it's
like the Clippers have never been good enough to save anything. Like it just
comes like you get to the playoffs and it's like, you know, you
have to beat nine six seven dudes, cool, like figure it out,
Like I don't know, It's not like there's no secrets, there's no surprises
ever from this. I would agree, like except for that first year when
it was like the small ball was something that they kept in the back pocket
or I guess that was the first tie year they kept the small ball in
the in the back pocket with you know, Mark Morris out there and all
the wings and that they even had to move away from. So yeah,
I mean, I agree with you. I that's something that I wonder about,
like with the Clippers being five hundred right now, like is there another
year? Is there another thing from an X's and O's standpoint, I don't
really think so, Like I don't think that that is. I'm not seeing
any progression towards that, So unless they're really holding it back, I think
like where they can kind of do better than five hundred or win more is
on the margins and like some of these rotations and like the combination of players,
which just with the overhaul that happens every year. I mean, you
know, I'm sure you have more expense like experience, right, Like how
long does it take a team to gel when you're going through constant like when
people are getting shuffled around all the time. Man, I'll say this,
like I also think now that you said that, the Clippers have always been
in like weird emotional positions, like guys move in weird ways where it's like
that's way bigger than people think, way bigger than people think, like if
you aren't comfortable, like the teams were like like and I guess to plug
the book. It's in the book, but there's some tings I played on
where it's like we walked in day one and everyone knew we were gonna win.
Now the season had like crazy ups and downs where like we might not
have believed it the whole time. But it's like I would walk into those
training camps like you know, I'm you know, especially we're talking overseas.
As the American you get a lot of leeway, like because we're considered lazier
and all these things. I'll walk in like those championships teams first day,
I'm like, yo, guys, let's go leading it going dumb hard because
you know, it's a whole different set of expectations. There are also other
teams that just clearly don't have those expectations the same. Sure, and may
you can fake it, like I've gone into shitty teams and tried to figure
it, but like after a couple of days, we suck. It's not
that we suck, it's like you still believe you're gonna win, like you
always believe you're gonna win. But it's like, oh, well, like
you know, like you know, uh, I'm gonna mat Terry. Doesn't
you know he thinks she's talking down to him, cuz I would, you
know, I mean, like you gotta you gotta approach a guy like Terry
differently. Yeah, And it's like, oh, we're one of those teams.
Okay, let's see, and the Clippers have kind of always been one
of those teams. I I like, what the thread you're kind of pulling
with that. Like we got asked on our last episode if Russell Westbrook was
still going to be on this team after the trade deadline, and like the
answer is a resounding yes, because if the Clippers, after all the campaign
that TYLERU and Paul George did, if they traded Russell Westbrook, that is
when shit hits the fan. I'm not saying it's like like just on court
stuff aside, if they traded Russell Westbrook away this team, I think it
wouldn't implode, but there would be you have three huge egos. Feels like
such a pejorative term in this sense because like these guys, you know,
like Hardened, Russ Kawhi NPG earned their status right Like it's they're very good
at basketball to have been in the league for a very well their particular I
feel like it's very particular. They're very particular, and that's I would love
to jump in right here. I would just love to let's go. I
don't know, man, Like I am fans of all of these players,
especially because they're all from La so I have seen them, you know,
some of them growing up. I like used to go to SDSU and play
against Kawhi. I'm doing that. I'm doing the uh stephen A. Smith
thing where it's like, you know, I go to Dwayne Wade's house actually
play. I have to caveat this whole thing. Yeah, so hard because
I don't mean this as hatefully it's gonna sound totally but you know, uh,
Paul George didn't win MVP right now, and Kawhi Leonard did not win
MVP. Yeah. The year they traded for Paul George, he finished third
in MVP voting, which people fucking forget anyway, Right, So I guess
if I'm looking at the Clippers, Paul George is the only player who has
been like near MVP status that I've respected as having that talent. And I
don't mean that it's like some like these guys don't deserve to be heralded.
But totally, when Russell Westbrook first won MVP, I was like, is
anybody watching this if he if he had averaged the same points and assists but
for rebounds, he wouldn't have gotten it. It was all about the triple
double. But then we're giving credit to him for being an elite rebounder when
he couldn't box me out. If we're being really honest, if I was
in a game with Russell Westbrook, he couldn't stop me from getting an offensive
rebound today, I'm not saying I mean even in his prime, right,
Like got the notes, But I was also like, you can look this
up, like per minute, one of the best rebounders to like ever live.
I know that's weird, but my agent used to damn make these big
emails to send off to NBA teams to try to get me signed. And
he's like, per minute, what Rod is doing? He's crazy, Andre
Drummon and it's Rod Benson. I guess it's not like Oscar Sheebway, but
I mean this, I mean this in a very sincere way. Right,
Like if Oscar Sheebway came into the league tomorrow and played twenty six minutes a
game on a Westbrook team, well we'll call it, no, we'll call
it twenty sixteen and he averaged six rebounds. Is Russell Westbrook better than him
at rebounding? Like, obviously not, But we gave him credit for that,
and that credit was leveraged James Harden won an MVP, but I'm not
gonna say it wasn't because he wasn't good. It was like he kind of
found all the loopholes in the game and turned them into like this magic trick
that was like Floyd. It's like Lloyd boxing. Harden took the rules like
Floyd took the rules in boxing, was like, I'm gonna figure out how
to make this shit work for me as well as possible. And I've never
seen anyone maximize that space as hard. But I think on the backside of
that is if you're maximizing a box, anyone who can go outside the box
is gonna find that space, and so on and so forth. Kawhi,
I mean you want to chip, but you know a lot of people were
injured that year. All I mean is the hype around the Clippers is always,
like I shouldn't say, is always has been. We have these two
three era you've got some MVPs. I mean, maybe they're aging or whatever,
but in all honestly, in their primes, I don't think this team
wins a championship. N they don't work together well. What most of what
we think of them as good, like their best attributes are the like the
ones that we give them credit, Like, he's not just a point guard.
He does these things too, those things to run into what other players
should be doing. A lot of overlap, A lot of it doesn't like,
it doesn't actually work out the way that people think. When you just
add like oh this guards get rebounding this bigs, We're like, no,
we're gonna run into each other a lot. Now I gotta get out of
his way. We're gonna run it this way now less effective. There's a
lot of reasons why these things happen. But you have four like essentially MVP
level players who are younger than like most of the Lakers have ever been,
and you literally are sitting at five hundred like, it's not to me,
it's it is a little bit of rocket science. But no one analyzes a
game like in that way because it's not sure sexy. Say it doesn't ye,
sorry for that long. No that that So the overlap makes total sense
because Will and I were watching the game last night against the Nuggets and the
Clippers offense. Right now things are trending up, but right now it's a
lot of one pass. What are you gonna do with it. You know
you're not, they're not making the defense second guess anything, it's all if
the second. If there's three passes, I am in heaven because it probably
means we went to the paint, we kicked it out. But it's usually
right now kind of one pass and we're being carried as we should be,
which is the other part of the conundrum. By the abilities of these the
three the three starters between Harden, PG and Kawhi, it's a lot of
asking of individualness and not as much ball movement, teamwork stuff right now,
and we kind of it's a great segue into the five hundred thing, like
Will, We'll start with you five hundred after twenty games, which correct me
if I'm wrong either of you. That is worst case scenario that if you
would have asked any Clippers fans after twenty games with and with James Harden,
not for the full twenty but sure, But like if you were to say,
hey, Kawhi and PG, you're gonna play the first twenty games,
what's the worst thing you could possibly think of happening five hundred? I would
be hard pressed to not be the worst case scenario. Will kenn Of,
is this gonna be the first team that's what is it? A top three
seed? I don't see us being a top three seed with this start.
Mathematically it seems very difficult. What does this Clipper seem have to show you
to make you believe that after starting five hundred through twenty games they can win
a chip? Ooh, I don't really even know if they're I really like
at this point, I don't I don't know if they're capable of putting enough
of that together for me to be like, what do you no they're ready?
And for me, it's it's not even just the record. I mean,
it's just you know, the games that we've lost, the way that
we've lost them. I feel like we've gotten to this point where the same
things keep happening to the team again and again, regardless of like what the
supporting cast is around Paul George and Kwai Like basically every team has the formula
if even if you're shorthanded, if you want to beat the Clippers, play
with pace and out hustle them, and you will win. Yeah, Like
there there is a better than fifty percent chance that you will win even if
the Clippers aren't a hundred percent healthy it's just it's too easy. And I
think with the offensive struggles right now, which the numbers are good, like
the net ratings are good, when the players are when everybody is you know,
efficient, it looks really like it looks good from a stats perspective,
I would say, looking at it on the floor, it doesn't to me
feel like a cohesive team that could really do something, you know, that
could win sixteen games essentially sixteen games at the highest level. And I think
right now, I think there's a lot of positives, and there is a
lot of talent. But for me, this year, the team feels more
piece mealed together than ever. It's just like it feels, I mean kind
of like to Ro's point, like it just feels like there's all these pieces
that in a vacuum are good. I just I'm like, they're not really
fully fitting together, and I struggle to see how you can I'm struggling a
little bit to see how you can can maximize it to the highest level.
Could they get out of the second round? I mean, I mean I
could believe that, right And we're saying all this December seventh, six fifty
eight PM, as they're sitting five hundred. We have seen ty Low split
up Russ and James Harden, which is very much needed if you watched any
of the games, Rod, what does this Clippers team have to do to
make you believe that they could Let's just say, go to the finals,
because at this point, if you're a Clippers fan, we've been in the
Western Conference finals. This is probably the last year that is the best shot
at winning a championship for all four of these players. What would you have
to see from this version of the clips to really believe? Like twenty wins
in a row? I mean, I guess if I say I have to
see them win the correct amount of games? Is that a good issue?
No, that's fair because they lose games they shouldn't lose. They lost to
a to a Nuggets team with DeAndre Jordan and Reggie Jackson killing us. Like
to win the amount of games should win is I think actually a really great
day because they don't do They've never done that. So I'm an artist and
you see my art behind me. I tend to take like the bigger sweeping
answers, which is probably why I'm not on TV because it's nothing shorter like
fun about what I say, I alluded to this earlier. I think the
Clippers are built wrong. I think that there is like a six year stretch
where the Warriors were doing well where teams tried to copy it a bunch of
Like again, I set a bunch of sixty seven guys on purpose. I
don't care if you put one big around them. That's not really gonna win
you a chip. I haven't. I haven't seen a team win like since
the Warriors, or besides the Warriors, because Draymond Green can kind of play
outside his size. Having all their guys be essentially wings and then surrounded big
that was exclusively to the Warriors. And I even bring that up about the
Warriors because you know, and about art because I do think. I think
that there is a tendency in like business, especially tech, to look at
what exists and how do I improve upon it totally. So at a time
when basketball was that Warrior style, yeah, like it was like pretty much
science. I think the Lake up and all these guys would say that they,
you know, cancoct to the team like no one had ever seen.
They use like they with the help of a cap jump that was never seen
exactly and moneyball to whatever, but just copying that is part of the reason
the Clippers were expected to do well. No one actually ever said, No
one actually ever. I don't think like if the Wars hadn't played, like,
oh, if you put a bunch of like six seven wings, you'll
win because we can switch everything. We could be one like like literally,
no, you have to be the best shooting wings of all time. Yes,
and have like your for be a guy who can guard seven foot three
dudes. That's just not like, that's not plug and play. Yeah,
And I've just seen it from you know, like most sports teams where they
don't have like the forefront thinkers of the sport working. I'm not saying all
these people are really really like in depth they know everything. Like I don't
know any coach I've ever been around with the NBA, he doesn't know one
thousands percent more than me. But some are stuck in what is and some
are looking at what is becoming. And I don't know if you notice in
the last seven years, and this is a big leg point of mind,
but the Biggs are back. They are being without one of those guys,
You're just not And the reason why Anthony Davis gets all this shitt he gets
is because everyone knows the Lakers won't win unless he plays like the best player,
because the best player on the other team is gonna be a big I
don't care who you have if you can't stop someone near the basket. That's
why every rule in basketball is designed to stop big people from playing. Literally.
But now they've they've been developing in Europe and they're coming back bigger,
taller, with the same skills. You're not gonna beat it. I'm sorry,
you're not gonna beat it with a bunch of The NBA is not have
to relax rules again. Maybe they will because they want to promote more stars.
They need like as many stars as possible, and gambling better it goes
and gambling. But there's like four teams with a chance to win, and
they all have the big that's it. Oh so all right, we got
to take a quick break because we have to pay the bill. But because
of you know, lights and whatnot, we're gonna keep talking about this.
We got an ad break coming up, and then we're talking the big issue,
which is fantastic to think about with the Western Conference when you look at
who's in the first place right now, and where the Clippers are in our
big situation. We got ads coming up. They've been a little loud for
some people. If that's been the case for you, go ahead and turn
it down. We got ads coming up and they were continuing this big conversation
in three two one, all right, we're back in on clips and Dip.
We talked a little bit about the problems facing the Clippers and the shift
in the NBA towards big men. We're gonna talk some trade issues and also
the biggest the biggest issue with the Clippers, right Charles, Wait? Uh,
what it was the biggest issue? Oh? The give no quarterer streaky.
Oh, we're absolutely talking about that. So you mentioned the big issue
Rod. A lot of Clippers fans hate Avitza Zubats, hate or love.
There's like, there's no middle ground. It's mostly hate. Uh Is it
even like? Cause obviously, I personally it seems like right now with how
Nikola Jokic is playing, I'm not seeing a lot of challenges for this number
one seed. The Nuggets are a well oiled machine that have five different people
playing five different positions. Kind Of going back to your point and things like
that, how can the Clippers mitigate that because they're not gonna They're not gonna
trade for Miles Turner, which is a very hot trade name for for Clippers
fans. The Pacers are playing historically, well, they're not going to trade
anything for Myles Turner. Like, what is the Clippers path to getting a
you know, four wins in a seven game series against the team with an
elite big man, because, like you said, they're all kind of six
seven. If you want to know my act, like if I was paid
a billion dollars to try, like I have four months figure this out,
I would do what every team used to do and is about to come back.
I would sign like three bigs that have no business trying to score an
offensive bucket because you have four guys around him usually at any particular point,
who should be able to get a bucke whenever they want. Your offense is
already go one on one, get me for Dwight Howard's and use all those
fouls on Nikola Jokic. This is how people used to go at shack.
Yes, like the reason why I say the bigs like I'm gonna take you
through a journey here, stay with me for like I don't know get either.
Hey, we're on the journey. We're on the journey. Wilt Chamberlain
was the most unstoppable player and in basketball history, and people talk about him
like, oh, he was just dominant, Like why because small people need
to feel like, well, if it's skill is technical skill, no,
the game is get the ball in the hole as skilled as you can do
that is as good as you are. And Kareem, I'm sorry. And
Wilt Chamberlain was unstoppable. So thenk leu Al Sinder comes up in high school
and they're like, oh no, oh no, no, no, not
only are you super racist, and this guy believes in things, he is
gonna keep doing what this guy did. And he's dunked, like his high
school videos are crazy, like he's just like boot just dunking on people.
And they're like, Okay, we're gonna make sure, we're gonna put in
rules, make sure you have to go to college for like eight years before
you can enter the NBA. Yeah, and then we're gonna say you can't
dunk, hoping that by the time he gets here he won't do it.
Yeah, And so Kareem literally has to invent the sky hook. But like
people forget. He was also like the most athletic player in the league,
like his first few like ten years. If he wasn't just a skyhook old
guy, he was actually like everything the guards were but seven foot that's it.
Yeah. And when he turned like thirty five and joined the Lakers and
one two more MVPs, but was like walking down the floor while Michael Jordan
was like selling shoes. The NBA was like, oh no, no,
no, we can't have this ever again. So the year he retired,
the NBA put in, uh, I'm sorry, not the year retired.
Shaq came in the next year, I left this, I got this a
little mixed up. Shack came in the next year and just continue doing what
Kareem was doing. And everyone saw this coming, but because Michael Jordan was
at his prime, it didn't matter. It wasn't affecting the profitability of the
game. When mj started slowing down and Shaq won his first championship, that's
when the NBA put in defensive three seconds. Shack had been playing nine ten
years, you guys, gont a three hundred and twenty pound dude to now
move from just sitting in the paint to covering the whole floor. It was
a death sentence. And that death sentence wasn't because Shaq was good. It
was because every team needed four Danny Fortson's. It was making like rosters look
dumb. I remember watching a game where the Warriors played. Shaq wasn't even
on the Lakers. He's like in Cleveland or something, and they had this.
They had this dude from Indiana, the Warriors of this like six ten.
He was actually kind of skinny white dude from me. He's putating all
like brass knuckles like before he goes in. But he just went in to
get three fouls in like thirty seconds, just to make Shack work a little
bit, and that was it. And the NBA hated that, so they
basically legislated out big men. And then there's like ten year gap where Tracy
mcgrady's like the best player, like and I don't mean that in some shitty
way, I just know you're Yeah, the shoe does a lot of help
for Tracy mcgrady's legacy. I will say that the Temac two does a lot
of help for as it should. Think about two thousand and two to twenty
ten, like the best players if we're like not gonna include Lebron and that
necessarily or like Tim Duncan who started like kind before, then uh, it's
like the worst period of like legends we've ever had, Like no one ever
just like, oh, put this team against any team, like yeah,
no, because big men are these nets teams against. Yeah. So all
this happened during while I was coming out of college, so I was over
for a lot of this time, and I was playing guys in like France,
like, who the does anybody know who the fuck this guy Pekovic is?
Because why is he not in the NBA? Yeah, And then the
year later he was. And then I did this three on three in Saudi
Arabia like four years ago, five years ago, and all the best teams
in three on three all have an itch at the end of the last name
that I was like. I was like, these guys aren't big because they're
doing the three on three, but they're still like taller than everyone else here,
like six five to six nine. This is a little wild who's missing
from here? Yo, Kicic, nurdkicch, Pekovic, Giannis. All these
dudes have been just playing over there learning because it's the only place they will
let big gard bellows. Yeah, just let them play at all, because
they're not being legislated out for money. FIBA's international. There isn't a they
don't have the same poor of course they're for profit, but they don't have
the same profit motivations as the NBA. Literally, it'll it might be seven
years before the NBA produces the next great big Men's gonna see guys come back
from overseas again, and like literally like when Ralph Sampson's coming and how scared
people were. The Ralph Sampson's are just coming back like no one's gotten like
bigger necessarily just like great, you force us to learn these skills. We're
back. And all that to say, the Clippers will literally never win until
they pick one of these guys first. Ooh, like it's gonna be the
first overall pick in like the twenty twenty nine drafts, because there's gonna be
like they're gonna call them wen b two. They've already outlawed six moves Wenby
does because it's making the game unfair, right, because we love it when
it makes the best down, it's fine. I don't know why we don't
do this in government. It's okay, but you're gonna you're gonna have to
like you're gonna have the first pick because you're gonna have leverage everything, and
this isn't gonna work. I just hope we keep the twenty twenty nine pick
or twenty thirty picks, keep it totally and draft the tallest motherfucker you can
find because there will be more. Well, don't work there. The funny
part about that is the Clippers have a horrendous track record of drafting undersized centers
who can't do shit, so right now, they're all the complete opposite end
of that spectrum. The Clippers drafted Daniel o Chuu during the COVID years,
and because they did all their meetings on zoom and stuff with him, this
is printed in the Athletic. We're surprised at how undersized he was. Like,
that's the kind of draft rooms we're dealing with here. So I hope
you get hired to maybe help us scout. Some of these bigs are gonna
help us. I love it's done well. I love Blake Griffin, but
he had a shorter wingspan than his height. At the end of the day,
him and JJ Reddick yeah, which is wild. He's like six nine
and a half, but his wingspan's like six eight, and that's just not
gonna be the big you draft. Like, the thing is, people just
follow what they're told. My agent used to say this all the time I
was talking. I'm not saying it was a bad pick. I just mean
that you know you're you're bound by your year and stuff like that, but
my agent, I'm sorry. I was talking to a scout the other day
when I was in the Bay Area and we are watching cowplay and I'm like,
how do you even know? He's like, well, first of all,
size you know, if I don't think they can athletically do it.
But he got to like it started feeling a bit foo gazy, and I'm
like, man, it's like it's hard to follow. He's like, you
understand, Like I'm going to keep ever with you. We don't know what
we're doing, Like this is a crap shoot, right, we are,
Like He's like some of us, like me, I try to do it
my own way, but I don't get it right all the time. In
fact, I get it wrong more than I get it right. So when
I look at a draft that's people operating like that. People see a system
and they're like, great, how do I be the best at the system?
No one tries to think about what the system even is? Is there
a different system? Can I like fully ignore draft boards and literally every team
that you're like, damn, they keep hitting, just does that? Like
it's not it's not it's not a lot of if you like, just keep
it's not that hard. But if you are following like this, how you
end up this is how you end up drafting Sam Booie, this how you
end up drafting. I mean, I don't know, I don't know who
Canuelot Jerome Robinson. Have you looked at the draft that Jerome Robinson was in
and how the Clippers drafted Shay and also drafted Jerome Robinson for no goddamn reason.
I mean it's it's again, you're never gonna get it right. But
drafting because everyone especially this is kind of like an American capitalist thing a little
bit. I don't get weird. But they need to go for the highest
hit, not the best need for what they need. Yeah. Absolutely,
they talk about that all the time, like you're you're drafting on upside even
if it's not the best fit, which is kind of asinine, but that
seems to be what everybody does. Well, there was some quote from some
draft careber who it was, but they were like, can we just draft
like if a guy was good for three years, draft him over the guy
who you think who was bad, who was okay for three years but has
potential. Sometimes it's that simple, and it feels like the Clippers specifically really
spin their wheels with like we found this guy, Like they drafted Angel del
Gatto, great rebounder in college, all that, but just a small center.
Like to your point, there's a size issue at some point, you're
just not tall of Daniel Tice was brought in because Mason Plumley, an actual
seven footer who we haven't gotten any updates on his his injury recovery, but
he did a light jog, I believe the other week, which was the
news we got, which why would you report that? Okay, well,
the Clippers, dude, the Clippers injury reports. That that is a golden
nugget compared to what we usually get for Clippers injury reports. But they brought
in a guy, Daniel Tye, who has been okay, he's six eight,
he's he's the replacement for Mason Plummy, who was an actual seven footer.
And I and I felt like like a simpleton on Twitter because I was
like, look, I love Daniel Tyson's connectivity, and you know, is
passing out of the short role, but like he's still like he's still not
gonna be a presence on the boards as much as we need when we lose
an actual seven footers. So like, I'm leaning into your take that as
much as I love Zubats, he would be a great backup center to someone
who can do a lot more stuff. And I also think that your take
makes sense that right now, it's like the Clippers have to overcome a lot
to beat someone with an elite five, like like throw out Jokic, you
know, like even the Timberwolves have seemingly figured it out. Rudy Gobert.
As much as I do not like, the guy is playing fantastic defensive basketball
right now, and that two time dpo y, Sure, two TIMEPOY,
But I think like this year or too, it's even more exacerbated because the
Clippers are smaller, like they got rid of all their wings and they prioritize
guards once again, like at the trade deadline, last year and then in
the off season. So yeah, I mean I think that's I think that's
a great point, and it's only going to get worse. Man. I'll
say this because you brought up Daniel Tice, and I don't know how Tally
is really He's like, what is he listed? He's listed at six eight.
Let me let me google it, because I also did this whole thing
where I put out a tweet where like Daniel Tye like he's not a shooter.
Like I said, he's going to be very good, but he's not
a shooter U and everyone called me an idiot, but he's he's just not
a shooter. He's listed at six eight per Wikipedia. Okay, so the
reason I ask, and I'm I'm six' ten on the number like on
the button. Yeah, Rod is huge. Rob has to get the extra
Why didn't you open with this? I wasn't trying. Your dating profile is
just just six ten, there's nothing else. Yeah, oh lord, but
I said that to say. You know, one thing that really like mentally
confused me a lot of times was that, like, I don't know pretty
much every big on it on a roster everywhere I played with six ten,
but I get in like I'd stand next to him. I'm like, and
a lot of these guys we'd be at bars, we'd be at you know,
the club or whatever, friends and they'd be like, nah, bro,
you like you like you like seven? You like seven seven one because
they needed to be six ten. All I mean is this, like it's
a long way to say we're talking about Daniel Tice potentially playing on the court
with Harden, George uh Kawhi and Russ or whoever in cerm point guard here.
Sure what if none of those guys are their hype? And I mean
that in a way where it's like, I don't think you even get how
small that team is, And it's like it's an issue if I was on
like so I was known for being a faster player, right me on a
court like that, Like, hey, I might have some trouble trying to
guard a pick and roll, but that wasn't really my deficit. Someone like
me, who isn't even that like talented relative to the NBA could very much
contain something like that if I had the right Like, if I'm around a
bunch of all stars, they don't even need like an all star level player
to play my role. I can just be Tristan Thompson like it's because you
cause it's because everyone's so small. Yeah, everyone's so small. I mean,
obviously the NBA players are huge, but I actually don't think people get
like the wide hype disparacy, disparities between like the guys who say what they
like. N Kevin Garnett used to say, like, oh, I'm not
the rumors where he was like actually seven feet It's like, no, the
truth was the six tens were six eight. Yeah, Well, I think
KD says he's he lists himself shorter because for some reason, KD is like
against being a seven footer and he's standing next to someone who's seven feet and
you're like, you are seven feet tall? Were the exact same and KD?
That's crazy, That's what I mean. How the rumors like even work,
right, someone not six ten looks at KD and you're like, bro,
he long so like he was at the University of Texas when I was
on the Austin Tours as a rookie. Oh shit, and he would come
to our games and we didn't have a ton of fans, so it's like
we played a convention center, like you know what I mean, Like,
he just sat next to us, and I staid next to him. I'm
like, who's this college kid who's like literally like I mean not maybe not
in the face, but from behind. People were like, yeah, it's
like not like we're the exact same height. So that that's what I mean.
You get these stories because people who don't have it want to make it.
They gotta inflate him to make themselves six ten. Did you this is
reminding me. Did you guys see the clip going around where the guy was
asking people at gym's like how tall they were, and they'd say and he'd
pull out a tape measure and be like, let's measure it, man.
And there were guys who's like, oh, I'm six two and he's like,
all right, cool, I'll measure and they were like, no,
I don't want to do that. I would also say no, very flippantly,
but that's an interest, like I would just say my real height,
which is six to two, which shit, like that is why people hide,
and also like, why are we attacking our short kings in the first
place. Let the short things live, so the short kings love. Napoleon
conquered the world, like let them conquer like left handed. Yeah, we'll
take them live. So can the Clippers make a mood? Do you think
the Clippers should make a move for a big or has the Clippers bed kind
of been made with this wing stop that we used to kind of think about.
But like, I don't think they're going to make a move. I
mean, I mean a move is signing somebody, or I think people think
moves is trading somebody. Literally sign all the bigs that like you think can
rebound in are strong, sign oscar she way out of the D League right
now. Dwayne Deadman's on our G League team. Now, I mean I
don't again, I actually think, well, I don't know, he's probably
good at this. I haven't seen enough dead Men. I used to train
with them years ago, and I was like, am I just hating because
I used to train with him. I was upset that he made it and
I didn't. And I think that's really it's fine, Yeah, he's fine.
I just think that signing two or three of these guys to literally have
one job, and that's to wear down the big the other team. Yes,
you're gonna get fouls, but you got to like even plan in the
idea that like the bonus will be your friend, Like fuck it, send
the other team to the line every time that they get fouled, because it's
probably slower, especially we're talking like a team like the Pacers than letting them
play their pace. If you just get it. Also is upsetting, like
here's one thing people don't get. What's this is an emotional game? Yeah
another like thing that's in my book, but like actually I can tell the
whole story in a second and different. Dude. Thank you out today December
seventh, Barns Nooma, go buy it. But there's a guy and I
like made him think we were friends for a whole season. We'd go out
to the club and I'd be like, ah, my god, like because
I knew he he just got to Korea. He didn't know he was on
like the rival team, and we play each other because there's only ten teams
in Korea. Six times they went sixty games, so six times during the
year, and a bunch of times at the club, I was like,
my god, like, ah, you know, you know, we don't
even take this shiit serious. First game of the playoffs where we played them
in the Semis just did this to his side and he was like bro,
like, bro, like, it's not a call foul, I'm just touching
you. It's the most annoying motherfucking shit you can do to a guy in
that position. And because he thought we were friends, he was so much
more upset, like bro, like what are you doing? What are you
doing? What are you doing? Like this ain't cool? Like right of
call fall? Now what? I'm just touching you? And we sweat.
We swept these guys. Hell. Yeah. And I just mean to say
that, like it matters. Having the mental edge matters, and it can
be got a lot of ways, most of all by just making the other
team play exactly how they don't, even if they're good at it. Here's
what usually happens. People forget basketball as a series. It's not like the
super Bowl, like ah, like we made it. We try to make
make short passes and like it didn't work. Yeah, But basketball it's like,
oh, we try to make them shoot mid range and it didn't work
because the whole media the next day is going to be like, see,
that's what you get for, Like everyone knows you don't try it for four
games. That isn't like living his day that way. Yeah, look at
Luca versus the Clippers. Everyone says, oh, Luca kills the Clippers.
It's like, not in series, not in the shit that matters, Like
they lose every single one of those series. All of these things are why,
Like you just don't understand why certain teams just keep winning or why certain
guys just keep winning, because all it plays in the game is not just
the lines, it's everything. You are a human. You guys are doing
a job right now. Anybody who's like someone might be listening to this at
a job. You're a human. You have days that matter. They used
to tell us in college, like don't gamble. We had all this because
this guy from Arizona State was caught. Maybe it's any yes, but damn
I lost my train of thought when I was trying to remember Edie House drinking.
Listen, it doesn't matter. Home saying is that there's there's a lot
that goes into these things that people don't get because they take their human they
remove their humanity from the sport when they watch it. They have to otherwise,
like watching someone get Carter off the field, imagine if that happened at
work. Cognitive dissonance is important. We do it to protect ourselves from like
the nature of it, but we also do it to our detriment because we
end up ignoring, like how much humanity plays into who a basketball player is,
how they respond to your comments. How like I do a podcast about
cal basketball, and I like take so much care before I say something negative
because I'm like this player. It could be negative today, it could eve
maybe be negative for a week, but it might not stay that way if
I don't talk about it the same because this is a human totally. So
all these things play in and we disconnect so that we can say they played
millions. Bro, this is part of it. Figure the fuck out.
Sure, yeah, right, no pressure, you're getting paid millions of dollars.
Uh. This reminds me one time at a job that Will and I
had a guy got so mad he punched a hole in the wall at work,
which was didn't you get fired? Did not have to replace the hole.
It did have to fix the hole. That shit was crazy. So
all right, I'm gonna go to Will and then we're gonna talk to Rod
about this. Will, what's your prediction for the rest of the Clippers season?
Forty two more games, sixty two more games, I don't know,
sixty two more games on this regular season. We're talking regular season only.
Where are we sitting? Where are we entering the playoffs or play in depending
on what you're saying. I will look up some standings right now, just
for some reference if you need it. The Clippers are sitting at ten and
ten, holding down that ninth spot, two wins behind the Pelicans for eight,
tied with the Rockets, tied with the Rockets at five hundred. Things
have been trending up up into the right a little bit, but we still
that six game losing streak. Pardon my French, totally fucked us. Where
are you seeing us? Sixty two more games? Adam's out here to be
positive, so this might be a bit of a dark segment. I'm gonna
say forty eight forty eight is that's the upside? Like that's oh no,
okay, so forty eight wins last year? I mean you're sitting at three
forty eight wins last year of the three seed. Yeah, I just don't
know if that'll be the same this year, because it wasn't. Last year's
lower on average than yes, like the normal win percentages. Yes, so
forty eight last year the Timberwolves are hundred right now, which I don't think
they'll maintain. But damn, you're not catching that. Yeah, I don't
know for catching eight hundred. Mmm. I think if we're just if.
And I'm again saying that I have time stamp every take because people lose their
minds. I got a time stamp at December seventh, seven, twenty seven
pm one Gin and Tonic double Gin and Tonic in. I will say,
as long as we're not in the play in I'm I'm a coward's move.
You had me pick a record, and you're gonna say, as long as
we're not in the play coward, I asked, the coward is okay,
here, here's my answer. Whatever the record for the playing it. No,
I'm gonna say, damn what So. The funny thing about the Clippers
is Vegas. I don't think was giving an over under on wins like bet
online. They weren't for a long time because I think people were waiting on
the Herden thing, like we don't know what the fuck's gonna happen. Give
me, give me, I hate to say the forty eight numbers good,
give me the low of there's no way there's sub five hundred. There's no
way they're under five hundred. No, they're not in in the streak this
year. There's no way. It's like the longest running streak of any team
with winning season. What was it ten seasons? Eleven seasons? I think
it's eleven seasons. Yeah, which, Hey, is there a trophy for
being over five hundred for a decade? Wow? And the fireworks are out?
Did you click something? Dude? So if you're not watching us,
go watch us on YouTube dot com, sa AS podcast. But the new
update with iOS and re stream, Like if you do a thumbs up or
something, it'll sometimes do fireworks. It'll sometimes it's so random. I think
it'll make a heart if you do one of these. I do if I
do like at this, like I'm a soccer player who just scored, Yeah,
let's go. Uh. The bottom is forty five Willians, the top
is forty nine. So there's not a lot of wiggle room. So Vegas
has it at one sports book. It is at FanDuel it's currently forty four
wins. At bet MGM it is forty seven. Damn. I would not
take that bet at the MGM bet Rod. What are you seeing eighty two
games. Where are the Clippers at Give us your stamp, give us some
hope or not. It's your call. Man. It's hard for me to
like because I don't even think that way, like about critens and losses as
a total. I don't know. They feel like a play in team.
They feel like a team that will like get in the play in and win
one makes them them lose the series. And you know, I was looking
down, so I was like, let me write this down so I don't
forget what I'm like thinking about here. Part of the reason the Clippers don't
even there. People don't take the Clippers seriously. I think the seven and
three after like losing six games is in part because people are like, man,
I can take this night off, like even a little bit, take
this night off. I'm coming to LA and it's not the Lakers, it's
not on national TV. It all adds up, and I think that leaves
them like perennially with inflated records, Like the only team to have five like
above five hundred in the last ten years is a team no one would guess.
Yeah, why do you think they're extremely They're extenuating factors that don't work
when people take you seriously, when people game for you and scout for you
in a way that's like meaningful and put their best rosters forward night after night.
The number, I guess I would say is like whatever the number to
get the seven seed in the play top play in seed. Yeah, and
that's then what's tough, too, is the scheduled debacle of the Clippers being
the third tenant is always absurd. It's the most absurd this year. I
think the schedule makers came out and said it's their last year in Staples,
so we're giving them a big double bird, and you can deal with seventeen
games in March or whatever like that. But I think you might be right.
This is the Clippers have so much about themselves to figure out. It
feels like we've seen Ty pull some good strings with splitting up you know,
Harden in Westbrook. But again, this team goes as far as PG and
Kui take them, and we've gotten twenty straight games of PG and Kawhi and
the six game losing streak. I don't know if this is maybe a rough
question, are they gonna have a winning streak as long as that six game
losing streak that's like they need one. But that's tough, man. Their
longest will last year, I think was five sick. I don't know if
they do. I don't know if they make it. I don't know.
They need to. They need to offset that losing streak with with a with
an actual six game winning street, because that is did you say that they
have seventeen home games in March? Like what, like what team total games
in March? Is that a? Like? I guess that's yeah, that's
every other day. It's more than every other day, and it's at the
end of the season. I've been preaching that everyone should be preparing for this
with their earthquake preparedness kits. Like since the schedule came out, I'm actually
really glad you're drawing attention of this because people also don't get scheduling like your
favorite team, like the teams have win a lot, get really great scheduling.
It really matters. Last year, I really thought that the Warriors were
going to come out of the gate so dead. Yeah, but then their
schedule, like twenty three of their first twenty five games were against like sub
five hundred teams from like the year before, so they were able to get
it rolling like this all matters, Like start talking about the other things because
they all play in bro like it's not even a conspiracy. No, this
is like if black Rock will move investment proper, he's based on like a
one percent change in like in like the rate. Do you really think nbaight?
Like the NBA doesn't operate the same. Like if people are watching one
thing, if a team gets credit for something, people move, like it
all ships right away. It really does, it really does. Thank you
for saying that I am not a complete lunatic for focusing on March already in
December. Now getting to the second most important part of this podcast, We're
gonna talk about different dude in a sec. The Clippers slogan, rod,
if you were not aware, is one of the worst in professional sports.
It is give no quarter, which is, as we know, impossible,
And we have a thing on this show where we were going to donate a
quarter into a jar every time they've lost a quarter. So far, they've
played twenty games. These stats are from John Rodriguez. Shout out John Rodriguez.
Twenty games, eighty total possible quarters. They've won forty four, they've
lost thirty three so right now, will we're in for a cool The other
three were tied quarters. I'm assuming yeah, something like that. We won
them, thankfully, But I hope, I hope they don't keep losing quarters.
I hope that doesn't happen because eight twenty five, like we'll right,
we're only twenty games in, Like I can't afford this. Man, that
does feel like something Elon Musk would say, like to promote his team,
like we're yes, like it's we've actually won forty four quarters despite being five
hundred. Who gives. I'm not going to say a team will lose a
quarter on purpose, because that's not what I mean. But sure, I
don't know. We know for a fact that if me and the point guard
are resting in the second quarter, we lose that quarter a lot, like
there is no The problem with sports is that the outcome is final, but
nothing about what led to it is, and so people need like hard answers
to figure out why something happened. Give no quarter, Oh we lost three
quarters. As a basketball player, I'm not thinking that at all. Now.
If I'm if I'm on like a ten game losing streak and we realize
it's because we give up twenty point deferences. Is the first quarter, like,
hey, let's let's start figuring out like a lineup that gets us going
or good early, but give no quarter makes no sense unless it's Middle Earth
or like Lord of the I mean, I don't know, Like it's it's
insane. It's an act. We will hold the line, Like, what
do you mean? This is basketball? It's the least holding of a line
game there is. That's football. Give no. That's why every I don't
care how old. Go to like a Pop Warner football game or a football
game, or go to like the Rams. Every time the fourth quarter starts,
all the players were like, because we know we guys, we gave
up the third will never give up. That's not basketball. Every single play
is a give and take. There's yeah, all right, Now to the
most important part of the show, Rod, your book is out. Different
Dude, give a little bit of a spiel. What can people expect from
us? You have so much experience that we've talked about just just LifeWise,
basketwise, everything. What can people expect from Different Dude? The book?
Uh, well, a lot of this, I mean just being long w
Like it's like it's you write a book so you can have the uninterrupted versions
of your long thoughts. But it's really just a lot of stories I'm about
my career, but they're not the ones you normally get, uh. And
I think at the end of it, you kind of get this idea that
basketball as we know it is like something we just all believe in, but
as it actually plays out, it's nothing like most people will most people believe
in. And I really think that the authenticity is going to change how people
even discuss sports, because no one has been this honest, even like Andrea
Agascy. The honesty was very like personal to but not about the sport.
I see everything at once, Like I'm someone who can like layer stuff.
It's like a big part of my art. And so like when the book
was done, I was like, oh damn, Like this is saying a
lot of things that if you're not paying attention, hey, maybe you just
hear some cool basketball stories. If you are paying attention, you're like,
why would that story be in here? Why would he include that? And
uh, like a thirty second story I can tell it is from the book.
It's like the third one in the book. When I was thirteen,
my grandmother, I'm sorry. My mom told me and my brother get to
get in the car. We drove from San Diego to LA to meet my
grandmother at work, which is weird. I'm like, why are we always
meeting family at work? Like can we meet it? How? Like?
We drove two hours for this. My grandmother was not like kind to me.
We weren't friends, so I also didn't really want to go. But
we get there and she walks us into the office and is like, like
gives me the biggest hug, and it's like, oh my god, Like
you're so handsome now, how tall are you? I'm like six' one,
Like I don't know you, like what's happening. She walks me through
this office and every single person there takes pictures with me as we stretch out
my arms back to back like and I wasn't feeling it, but everybody else
was like this is important, there's a future something here. After that whole
charade, my grandmother walked me outside and she's like, you know, don't
forget about us when you're like in the NBA and famous. When I was
thirteen, I wasn't even on a team, and I was like, I'll
never forget, forget about you, which was a lie, and she literally
goes, don't marry no white girl like Kobe. Damn. It's a short
story that to me encapsulates so much about the basketball experience, the expectations from
other people, the even like the white girl like Kobe, Like there's race
that crosses to like what is my grandmother thinking is wrong with white people?
But also like Kobe didn't marry a white one right now, okay? And
so like what is the connection there? Like it's so many things that I
think again, I try to be really deliberate with my work. At the
end of it, if you were paying attention to the details, you get
it. Like whatever everybody else is seeing with basketball, I don't see.
I see the matrix. I see green shit falling, and I go blonde,
brunette, redhead. I cannot wait to read it. Thank you so
much for coming on and giving us high level basketball thoughts. It's been fantastic.
We usually add on a positive about the Clippers that Adam does, but
will You're gonna have to do that. But before we get into it,
Rod, where can all these fantastic listeners find you? Plug the socials,
plug everything you want to plug? Yeah, well, first, let me
plug the Clippers positive. They do have players, they are exciting. It
is the team that people want to watch. There's a lot of teams people
don't want to watch, so I understand that it's easier to be negative than
positive. But I'm going to give a positive point before you do, William,
which is just to say that they are still fun. There's controversy.
You care. You're here listening, so it must be doing something. As
for the book, it's called Different Dude. It can be found at different
Dude dot com, Barnes and Noble, Amazon, et cetera. And you
can find me on all socials at z s O R R y O N,
which is just my middle name and my art name, but it's pronounced
jerry on. I had black parents. And besides that, I'm just really
thankful that you brought me on. Man. We're happy. Yes, it
was wonderful. We're gonna be back. We're gonna be on the radio at
some point. I think Adam is sick. He's still he's not doing the
pod so he can do his pre and post game job for the Clippers,
which is great. We'll have a tripod on Sunday. I think we got
a three and four coming up reviews. Help us will give us one more
positive thing about the Clippers before we send these very intelligent listeners and watchers about
their weekend. I think the like the brightest light of the tunnel. And
I know Clippers fans are trepidacious because that's the way they are. But I
think the biggest stat to look at so far is Kawhi and Paul George planning
one hundred percent of the games. And I'm not saying that they finished with
eighty two, but that is about I mean, like, you know,
for a team that's dependent on these two guys about as I don't know,
they couldn't do any better. They can't do extra credit, they can't play
an extra game. So that that that to me is a good sign.
Well take it. I hope they don't play any extra play in games.
I think that's a I think that's a great trend to hop on. We
will be back in a couple of days. Thank you to everyone for listening.
Find us on YouTube over at YouTube dot collup slash at Clippers Podcast on
Twitter. We are at Clippers Pod. Remember that Adam Olsen is still keeping
received It's something we don't do, but we need someone out there to be
in the trenches for us. Rod Benson, thank you so much. Everyone
go check out his work. Will be back soon. As always, let's
go clips.