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Hello world. You're listening to Eleanor
Wagner's strange and scary world here on the

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Paranormal Uki Radio Network, where we're
always creeping it real. I'm your host,

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Eleanor Wagner. Welcome all to my
paranormal Closet where the stories in magic

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take place. My guest today is
a world renowned exorcist and doctor theology with

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over thirty years of experience casting out
demons. He has appeared on the Dead

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Files and a Haunting in Saginaw,
Michigan, with pieces as seen on the

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television shows My Ghost Story and Paranormal
Witness. Join me in welcoming GP Hagger

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to my show today. Welcome,
Thank you so much for joining me today.

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I'm glad Beer. I don't know
if you know it, but I

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deal with the weird and unexplained on
my show and I reached out to you

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specifically because of your book on the
Miship King dog Man. For the listeners

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tuning in today, the cryptozoological creature
is described as a seven foothold, blue

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eyed or ambride bipedal canine like animal
with the torso of a man and a

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fearsome hell that sounds like a human
scream. In your book, New Detail

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sixty true stories from eyewitness accounts across
the state of Michigan, along with the

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description of variance types and actual photos
from eyewitnesses who have claimed to have seen

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this Michigan Dogman. As I understand
it, the first sighting of the dogman

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was in Wexford County in the year
eighteen eighty seven. A couple of lumberjacks

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spotted him as they were working.
Since then, there have been many reported

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sightings of this creature throughout Michigan,
though most have been from the northern quadrant.

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What enticed you to write about the
dogman subject? A few years ago,

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I was a vendor for Michigan Paraicon
su Saint Marie and my wife and

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I we set up our table and
loby all right next to us was Linda

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Godfrey, and we became fast friends
and we started talking more about well at

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first, it was funny because I
didn't know who she was until I talked

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to my friend ty Clements and he's
also an author Hero tauntson Mackenham and he's

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up there every year and he's like, did you realize that you're right next

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to Linda Godfrey? And I'm likes
Linda God alright. Yeah, I personally

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come from right from the church community, and not really at the time was

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familiar with a lot of people in
the paranormal, or wasn't interested in the

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paranormal. I mean I was when
I was a kid. I loved the

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idea of bigfoot, UFO was that
kind of thing, and that was I

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like to watch the Scooby Doo and
all that, So they intrigued me.

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But over time it just kind of
went away. And he was telling me

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about Linda and then he comes around
and he says, yeah, I got

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to talk to her about my story. I'm like, what are you talking

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about? May I ask you?
Who is you? Tell us? Oh?

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She passed away, But she was
the lady that everybody pretty much went

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to because she when people had their
dog man stories, they wrote into her.

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They told her about them as she
lived at Wisconsin, and I don't

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believe that she ever saw one herself. But in Wisconsin they have what's called

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the Beast of Bray Road. But
as like I mentioned my book, they're

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like their sightings of dogment all over
the world in different forms. And I

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remember the following year I was talking
to her, and I gave her my

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theory at the time that I thought
it was Dinapithecus, because I don't jump

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to the conclusions, especially when it
comes to somebody coming to me and asking

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for deliverance. We have we're deliverance
ministers, actorssists were trained to have an

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objective diagnosis. We're not gonna believe
it until the devil shows his face.

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And I myself have never seen a
dog man. I've seen bear, black

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bear around here. I sent backed
last week. I went out to get

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my mail and I lived way out
in the woods here in Michigan, and

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just down the road I saw a
huge black bear crossing from my neighbors or

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from across the road all over to
the other side. I have them in

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my yard too, yeah, down
along with fox and deer, and you

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got it. My wife, she
works for a sports sports store, and

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I told her, I said,
big, my want. I guess some

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bear spray just in case, because
we have a heaving boy and he likes

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to play out in the yard sometimes, and so I go and take the

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chance, usually black beer. They're
they're more scared of us than them.

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They run away, except that they
got cubs and that's when you're going to

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have a problem. Zach, can
you define dynapithecus. It's a pretty much

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a giant type of hyena, a
little larger than a hyena, but a

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babylon I'm sorry, I was thinking
of the Hya version of the dog.

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But they there are just a large
babylone. Basically, they're a little bigger

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than than a person, and they
usually, you know, they have have

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snouts, they have the kind of
linky arms, the legs, psychia of

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thing, and they can walk up
right. And so that's why I was

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talking to her. I said,
well, have you ever saw a dianpithecus,

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as you know, a one of
the main theories. And she's like,

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you know, I've had people come
to me and tell me that,

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but I just don't know because there
are so many accounts of this thing acting

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like wolves, and so it just
sparked my imagination, you know, maybe

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curiosity more than look into it.
I'm a person that even though I'm a

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theologian and in the spiritual, but
I also am trained to having to do

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deliverances. I have to know a
psychology and be familiar with it, being

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familiar with the human mind and so
and As a doctor, I'm trained to

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have a developed a hypothesis first and
even test to their hypothesis, and so

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I'm really into research, and so
I have my own theories about it.

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It's a combination the scientific and the
spiritual. Can I do talk about it

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a little bit, not relating to
the dog man, but it's at the

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conclusion of my new book Serial Killers
and Their Demons, you know, I

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talk about it. The theologians have
three theories, basically the anti the Lutavian

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Age, the age before the flood, about how the giants came about.

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Those theories is that the giants the
Bible was referring to the sons of God,

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that it is referring to the sons
of shem like a holy type of

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race. They're set apart upon God. But a lot of us have just

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thrown that out, doesn't make any
sense. But there are still a few

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pastors out there that do accept that, because there is a big problem in

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the church today that you go into
a church today here in the United States

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and missho how it is and the
other other parts of the world. But

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they don't want to talk about Well, I talked about demons, and I

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want to talk about exorcism occasionally.
My wife and I we visit churches and

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they tell them, you know,
they ask me, so what do you

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do? Like, well, inside, I have a ministry, I mean

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do deliverance. And it's kind of
okay, and it's kind of a taboo

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subject, which really irks me in
a way because I think deliverance is eliminating

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demons, casting them out. Yeah, it's more of I don't like to

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say that. I like to say
that it's healing, healing the soul.

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It was the number one miracle that
was performed in the early Church and really

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what caused the early Church to explode
with its numbers, and the Bible refers

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to it as signs of wonders.
It doesn't talk, you know, like

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the word exorcism came later on in
church history. I lost my training.

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Thought was where I was going to
go with that. But but oh we

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have pretty much three theories. The
other one is is that the fallen angels,

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which the books of Jubileese and the
Book of Ena talk about the watchers

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Gogory that had come down. They
were meant to watch over humanity and they

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had lost their way and they and
Jude talks about how they shed their spiritual

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robes and on the other theories that
there's a lot that branched off of that

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idea that they had actually physically mated
with the children of men daughters of men,

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and some of us are even starting
to throw that out too, that

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that has there really no revalence because
how can spirit meete with flesh. We

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don't see any possible way for that
to happen. The only way that spirit

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can really interacts with flesh is to
enter it and possession where either an evil

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spirit enters the person or Holy Spirit
enters a person into what was in them,

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which has led to this type of
new theory called the demonic possession theory,

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where it is believed because in my
experience as an exorcist, I see

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it, I can see it happening. And there's a lot of studies out

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there in genetics so that we really
only know like maybe ten percent of what

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genes can do and demons and during
interrogations haven't even admitted to me that yeah,

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we have the capability of altering the
genes, which really blew me away,

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and that was under penalty of torment
by the Holy Spirit, and that's

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final that they're telling the truth.
And I've heard other exorcists explained the same

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thing that they had. They'd heard
them admit that they're able to alter the

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genes, which has caused a lot
of us to believe more in this type

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of theory where there were willing to
participants, humans who allowed themselves to go

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through abuse and trauma that had because
I we go, we can go back

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to. A good example is research
that was done after World War Two where

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the Nazis at the time had talked
about this in my book. The Nazis

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at the time had well, the
Dutch had rebelled against the Nazis, but

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what the Nazis had done is they
had removed a lot of their supplies and

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caused them to go through starvation,
and the result of that was of course

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a famine. But after World War
two, scientists found out that there were

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that this Descendants of these people who
went through starvations started to develop health problems,

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and they found out that it was
done at the genetic level, So

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people that went through trauma and abuse
were starting to their genes got altered and

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sected their children. It was also
the case with Holocaust survivors, people who

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have went through the trauma and the
abuse during the Holocaust, their children resulted

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genetically to having diabetes. And so
my theory is that demons can't can't make

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you do something you don't want to
do. They have to break down your

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will. And so what they do
is they allow a person to go through

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abusive situations in their life which will
alter the genes of the person so that

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they can have a more susceptible host
that they can influence to do things that

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they want them to do and leader
in life, which is the case of

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what happened with serial killers. They
were abused and traumatic. If you compile

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a lot of their stories together,
they come about and are altered from lessons

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and they go through life experience and
that trauma that they have when they were

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young, they experience the sociative identity
disorder, and then later on life it

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affects them because all that emotion has
buried down. So these willing participants and

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the Antidlumian age, we're willing to
go through situations that had altered them,

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allowing demons to come about them and
to alter their DNA how they want them

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to be on the change to suit
more their image, and because of those

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genes being passed on extensively onto their
young resulted in some possible mutations or what

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have you, that had caused a
giant race. That's just one theory because

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we have in it's also proven and
you can go back and look that there

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is giganticism in our genes. We
have people throughout history that have experienced huge

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andre. The giant is one example. Seven people throughout history. To look

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back, we're very tall people.
It's so we're leaning more towards that aspect.

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Well, just for the listeners that
don't know about your recent book,

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Serial Killers and Their Demons GP reviews
a lot of popular serial killers that makes

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determinations based on experience with casting out
demons, and it explores the twisted bites

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of serial killers and the demons that
drive them and influence their actions. And

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I read a lot of true crime
stuff so fascinating that you believe demons enter

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these offenders. But what about the
serial killers that have no history of abuse

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at all in their childhood? Well, at some level there is something that

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causes the mind to fracture, and
I get that question a lot. Is

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what causes dissociated identity disorder, and
it's a subject that is divided the psychologic

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on psychiatric communities. I know a
few counselors sharing player that debate about it

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and not very When I bring up
the subject, they're like kind of like,

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well, we got to talk about
this again. Myself as a counselor,

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not a licensed counselor, but you
know, as a pastor minister,

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you know, I do counsel people
when I have to for deliverance. There

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is some sort of trauma that does
a cur and trauma combs in all kinds

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of areas. A good example is
chi Wayne Gacy. That guy experienced a

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lot of trauma in different aspects.
He was verbally abused by his father.

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He was do you verbally verbally abused
by his father, or he was beaten

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by his father. He was selected
by a fifteen year old girl when he

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was maybely four. And not only
that, but their their family friend would

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take him out on enjoy your rides
and sexually molest him. So abuse comes

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in all different forms. There is
of course, sexual which I see a

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lot in people, which gives the
demon Jezebel. Right, that's the number

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one right that she claims, and
I encounter this demon a lot and as

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the most dangerous demon out there,
and there is verbal abuse and at this

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at a very young age. This
is why I'm we have to protect our

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kids, folks. We have to
at this young age, even if it's

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not your kid and there's somebody as
abusing them or in some way causing trauma

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to a young kid. It has
to stop because I these people that come

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to me for deliverance and their dissociatives
come forward. It's all emotional pain.

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It's a painful experience inter healing and
deliverances, and we treat demons as just

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kind of an annoyance because the whole
object of deliverance, of course, is

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to heal the soul of the person. And when demons pop up and they

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do you know, I just make
them go down. Hey, we're not

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done, and the whole objective is
to weaken the deemon before the extracism and

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exorcism is actually a very small part
of deliverance, and it's a lot of

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people want what they want to experience. I get that a lot of a

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lot of messages asking hey, how
can they join in a deliverance? And

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it's funny because a lot of people
when they watch the deliverance and the other

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person is the client is all right
with it. There the witnesses are watching

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our a live witnesses to come in
because they want to boost their faith up,

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and they they're kind of bored.
I tell them ahead of time,

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just so you know that this is
not what you think. This is more

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of a counseling session. And so
we go through and renouncing, We go

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through curse breaking at and healing the
soul, helping them to forgive their abusers

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and all the trauma that they went
through. And then when the exorcism happens,

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by that time, the demons are
very weak because they lost most of

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their rights strong wards are healed,
they got nothing to hold on too.

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I've even had demons say, you
know what, just I want to go

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because this person is too strong sounds
and everyday occurrence actually for a lot of

208
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people. Well, what of my
to the frustrations that my team and I

209
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have is there's people in the peronymal
community that say, the world to my

210
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possessions rare, to my activity is
rare. No, it's not. No.

211
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We have rapes every day, We
have murders every day throughout the world.

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We have wars, we have dictators, we have evil people in this

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world that wanting to harm others.
Happens every day, and who's influencing them

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their own demons. I've even had
people come to me and say, oh,

215
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I want to get tested to see
if I have a demon, and

216
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they sell that our profile and we
go through I'm renouncing and lo and behold,

217
00:19:00,680 --> 00:19:03,640
demon pops up. So how'd you
get in there? And they'd usually

218
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tell me we go from there,
I interrogate them, But yeah, getting

219
00:19:10,599 --> 00:19:15,920
back to that question that and he
asked about how those serial killers that have

220
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never faced debusd Like one example is
BTK killer as his name escapes me right

221
00:19:23,200 --> 00:19:27,200
now, but he was one where
I really had trouble trying to get right

222
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down to signed anything in its youth, and a lot of them in their

223
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history didn't really tellt him much about
their youth. But when I went back

224
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and saw what they did in the
future, all the killing is that they

225
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did, and I know which demon
it is. I talked about that in

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the book and revealing each serial killer. It just it all adds up to

227
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one particular demon who brings some other
demons, and they know this demon is

228
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so well because and honor it quite
a bit. And I'm like, they

229
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have to had to have had some
sort of trauma in their youth. Some

230
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we're back in there, not just
abuse, but some sort of trauma something

231
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that traumic doctor Shipman known as doctor
death. It was another one where really

232
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there was no nothing too much in
his youth. But yeah, he had

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a domineering mother. Okay, Well, in my experience, there is such

234
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a thing as generational curses, and
they follow right down the line. And

235
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Bible talks about gyrational curses as pretty
much flying around the gyrational line until somebody

236
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does something exactly the same as their
ancestor. So let's say an ancestor has

237
00:20:52,440 --> 00:20:59,839
done a blood covenant, maybe a
human sacrifice wage back there a lot of

238
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do you know your ancestry not?
No, yeah, very far back right.

239
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It takes about forty five thousand people
to sixty thousand people generations way back

240
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to make one person, to make
you, to make me. And so

241
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we have a lot of ancestors,
we have a lot of connections. So

242
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there's curses that are flying around out
there, but they're not landing on it.

243
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But it because a lot of us
have not done what that particular person

244
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in our ancestry has done. So
let's say if somebody has done a human

245
00:21:38,039 --> 00:21:45,119
sacrifice, Let's say like a German
had done a human sacrificed to the to

246
00:21:45,240 --> 00:21:52,000
the god. Thor now Thor is
another variation of the demon Lucifer, and

247
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Lucifer a lot of demons. They
they're the same type of demon, they're

248
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just in different variations, their different
personifications. Take for example, with the

249
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main enemy of the church, the
Jezebel spirit. Jezebel comes in many variations

250
00:22:10,240 --> 00:22:15,160
Lilith, colleague, iiss and that
and so forth. There's a lot of

251
00:22:15,240 --> 00:22:22,519
variations of the Jezebel spirit. I've
had people to confirm this. I've had

252
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people. I had one lady who
had isists in the same room with another

253
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woman who had Lilith, and when
they were both in the same room,

254
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they had that kind of connection,
like they felt each other's spirit. They

255
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felt like when Lolith came forward and
I was dealing with her the Isis spirit

256
00:22:45,720 --> 00:22:51,839
and the other lady would just started
getting irritated and they usually manifest as anxiety.

257
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And people in the room they were
witnessing this, they were like amazed.

258
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I sit in one person and spoke
up and said, how is this?

259
00:22:59,680 --> 00:23:03,359
You know what I said, Well, it's it's the same spirit,

260
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it's just a different personification. So
even Lucifer takes on different personifications deals above

261
00:23:11,079 --> 00:23:17,839
the al Alile even himself off Lucifer, and personally, I like dealing with

262
00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:22,079
Lucifer because I honestly don't know why
a lot of the other demons are afraid

263
00:23:22,119 --> 00:23:26,920
of him. Because the difficult demon
that I have to deal with is Jezebel.

264
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She manifests laughing, you know,
she comes forward, she's like this,

265
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she's like she thinks it's all funny, and so she manifests deal with

266
00:23:41,079 --> 00:23:45,400
her and she lies quite a bit, have to torm from her. She

267
00:23:45,480 --> 00:23:52,599
all responds to authority and have to
display that authority. And after much torment,

268
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she finally gives in to that authority. And it's difficult to get information

269
00:23:56,960 --> 00:24:04,000
out of her. And so is
absolutely funny is Lucifer and Jezebel and whichever

270
00:24:04,200 --> 00:24:10,039
form just they don't like each other, but yet they work together. Isn't

271
00:24:10,079 --> 00:24:15,880
that crazy? It really is?
Yea? And so when they and when

272
00:24:15,920 --> 00:24:21,000
this is all going on with the
demons, yeah, is it talking through

273
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the person's body or is it true. Oh it is so crazy. Yeah,

274
00:24:26,000 --> 00:24:30,880
they have. Each one of them
has their own personality. They each

275
00:24:30,000 --> 00:24:36,119
have their own usually, however,
the Bay language is However, the tone

276
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of voice when they first come forward, doing this for so long, I

277
00:24:38,680 --> 00:24:45,240
even have to ask what their name
is. Yeah, this is Lucifer is

278
00:24:45,319 --> 00:24:51,960
usually angry, snarling, and he's
just he's angry. I don't know why

279
00:24:52,000 --> 00:24:56,240
he's angry. Jezebel, of course, is laughing, giggling. She thinks

280
00:24:56,279 --> 00:25:03,079
everything's funny. She thinks God's funny. The whole topic. The viasin him

281
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and murder are the only two demons
that have ever tried to come at me,

282
00:25:07,200 --> 00:25:12,200
try to attack me, and have
a video that's up by YouTube.

283
00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:18,680
Nice actually sure where. But there
was a guy we had an open deliverance

284
00:25:18,039 --> 00:25:25,640
in Columbiaville, Michigan here and this
guy he's a friend of mine and he

285
00:25:25,759 --> 00:25:30,279
actually he wanted deliverance because he felt
that he was being oppressed. And he

286
00:25:32,200 --> 00:25:34,559
started out from Chicago and he says, hey, just want to let you

287
00:25:34,599 --> 00:25:40,480
know I threw up. And that
telled me right there from experience that Okay,

288
00:25:40,799 --> 00:25:47,400
whatever he has is its judgment is
coming. Usually if there's no reaction

289
00:25:47,799 --> 00:25:52,240
when the person doesn't tell me that
when they're either way or I'm I'm on

290
00:25:52,359 --> 00:25:56,880
the way, I want to text
them say I'm my way over to see

291
00:25:56,960 --> 00:26:00,880
you. And if there's no reaction, I know that the deliverance is going

292
00:26:00,920 --> 00:26:06,119
to happen today. They're not going
to be cast out, and they know

293
00:26:06,720 --> 00:26:11,799
when their judgment is near. And
so you started throwing up before he drove.

294
00:26:11,119 --> 00:26:15,200
And when he got there and it
was his time, his turn for

295
00:26:15,480 --> 00:26:18,720
his deliverance, all I had to
do is let's see what you got,

296
00:26:19,119 --> 00:26:23,319
and they call it whatever up and
they just came right forward and they front

297
00:26:23,359 --> 00:26:26,839
of me, and this is these
are all signs of okay, yeah,

298
00:26:26,880 --> 00:26:30,640
I know that these guys are going
to be cast out because they know it's

299
00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:36,119
their time. And that's just that's
very I always thought that was very fascinating

300
00:26:36,319 --> 00:26:41,319
that they they know when their time
is and so they're yeah, I'm sorry,

301
00:26:41,079 --> 00:26:47,079
they just submit to whatever it is. H they'll they'll fight more or

302
00:26:47,200 --> 00:26:51,480
they just give in or they put
up a fight. That's why I really

303
00:26:51,599 --> 00:26:55,799
dig into that person's psyche and okay, well let's find out what more that

304
00:26:55,880 --> 00:27:00,519
they have happening in your life.
Because a lot of people think that demons

305
00:27:00,839 --> 00:27:04,559
live in the now. They don't
really live in the now. They live

306
00:27:04,599 --> 00:27:08,240
in your past. And so that's
where we have to look at as a

307
00:27:08,319 --> 00:27:15,640
person's past to explore the explore where
they are at that moment that they entered.

308
00:27:15,400 --> 00:27:22,200
And then we then we explore that, we we renounce it, we

309
00:27:22,400 --> 00:27:26,319
cover it with the blood of Christ, so that sin does not exist anymore.

310
00:27:26,680 --> 00:27:30,200
They can't be seen. It's called
clean and so now and demons are

311
00:27:30,279 --> 00:27:33,759
like, well, wait a minute, at this point in time where I

312
00:27:33,000 --> 00:27:37,759
enter, it is gone now and
nothing to hold on to and bring them

313
00:27:37,799 --> 00:27:41,400
back up. Do you have any
more legal right now? Okay, well

314
00:27:41,400 --> 00:27:45,839
then you gotta go. And then
it's that's the point that where we start

315
00:27:45,920 --> 00:27:49,319
the extracism is when they when they
say, now I don't have any more

316
00:27:49,400 --> 00:27:55,599
legal right and we try to get
them because there was in the past when

317
00:27:55,640 --> 00:27:59,559
I was starting deliverance, I was
getting so frustrated. After our deliverance,

318
00:28:00,240 --> 00:28:03,440
they have that people would would get
we get in their cars, they would

319
00:28:03,480 --> 00:28:07,279
drive down the road and all of
a suddenly they start manifesting like okay,

320
00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:10,759
well yeah, to turn around and
come back. Let's find out what you

321
00:28:10,880 --> 00:28:15,960
got what's going on. I'm going
to sit down and find out from Yeah,

322
00:28:17,119 --> 00:28:18,519
I find out from the demons.
Well, I didn't. That was

323
00:28:18,599 --> 00:28:22,759
just part of me that left.
I left a little bit of myself behind.

324
00:28:22,759 --> 00:28:29,279
And so now when I do do
exorcisms, I make them fully manifest.

325
00:28:29,880 --> 00:28:33,599
And what we do is get that
because demons are emotional beings, and

326
00:28:33,720 --> 00:28:40,240
so I want to experience that person's
emotion at the fullest. I tell them,

327
00:28:40,759 --> 00:28:45,039
Tom, you gotta you gotta bring
up all that anger, every bit

328
00:28:45,119 --> 00:28:48,960
of it. I want to see
all that anger and make sure that there's

329
00:28:48,000 --> 00:28:51,440
people that are able to hold them
down, and you know, make sure

330
00:28:51,480 --> 00:28:56,160
that doesn't want to come in anybody. And as the extorcists, we try

331
00:28:56,200 --> 00:29:00,759
to make their entire focus on us, away from everybody in the room.

332
00:29:00,839 --> 00:29:04,480
And there's people that have tried in
the past to try and you know,

333
00:29:04,720 --> 00:29:07,440
I say something to the demon,
they want to get right in and I

334
00:29:07,559 --> 00:29:11,160
want to, you know, can
I experience I experienced this? I ask

335
00:29:11,240 --> 00:29:15,599
a question, absolutely, not for
what they're going to lie to you.

336
00:29:15,039 --> 00:29:21,079
They're going to deceive you because now
you're curious about them, and you want

337
00:29:21,240 --> 00:29:26,559
something from something unholy rather than God, and put your focus on God.

338
00:29:26,079 --> 00:29:30,880
And so that's what exactly what they
want is they want your attention to be

339
00:29:32,039 --> 00:29:37,519
drawn away from God upot them.
And so I tell everybody that are that's

340
00:29:37,599 --> 00:29:42,640
involved in exorcism, look, don't
talk to the demons when they manifest.

341
00:29:44,119 --> 00:29:48,039
Don't say anything. If you have
a question, you can write it down,

342
00:29:48,519 --> 00:29:52,799
you know, towards me and slide
it over to me. I'll make

343
00:29:52,839 --> 00:29:56,720
the demons go down and it will
take a break. No answer your questions.

344
00:29:56,240 --> 00:30:03,519
And so it's that's something that I
am very limit about is doing up.

345
00:30:03,640 --> 00:30:08,519
Don't talk to the demons, don't
try to just observe and witness sounds

346
00:30:08,599 --> 00:30:15,640
like even something as simple to some
people such as like unacceptance. Let's say

347
00:30:15,720 --> 00:30:19,119
somebody who's in that place where they're
being unaccepted, it could be so such

348
00:30:19,119 --> 00:30:26,400
a torment to their soul that that
would be enough for them to do something

349
00:30:26,480 --> 00:30:30,319
horrible, like be a serial killer. Let's say Jeffrey Dahmer, for example.

350
00:30:30,319 --> 00:30:34,440
I don't think there's anything his history
and his upbringing that would lead you

351
00:30:34,519 --> 00:30:37,960
to believe there's a demon, but
he did suffer from unacceptance for who he

352
00:30:38,240 --> 00:30:42,880
was and felt like he was unloved, and maybe that was enough to make

353
00:30:44,599 --> 00:30:51,400
I don't know him who they're hind
And you can't abuse yourself. People don't

354
00:30:51,440 --> 00:30:59,559
realize that people can't abuse themselves slf
Hey, even drinking, what we do

355
00:30:59,759 --> 00:31:06,160
to our bodies daily is a form
of that, I believe. Oh yeah,

356
00:31:06,680 --> 00:31:11,200
interesting, I've never heard of extacism
in this form before, but you've

357
00:31:11,240 --> 00:31:18,640
made it very clear as to what
it is. I see it apparently.

358
00:31:18,759 --> 00:31:25,680
Now, let's just say my approach
to extracism is more. I want to

359
00:31:25,720 --> 00:31:32,319
get the personally healed. I don't
want any form whatsoever for the demons to

360
00:31:33,200 --> 00:31:38,039
sit down and have something attached to
whatsoever. And I heal the strongholds,

361
00:31:38,039 --> 00:31:44,839
I'll removed the legal rights so I
know that when that person leaves, they're

362
00:31:44,920 --> 00:31:48,799
healed. And you wonder for how
long though, because we could just keep

363
00:31:48,839 --> 00:31:52,799
on doing this ourselves over and over. Supposed to say, you'll never be

364
00:31:52,880 --> 00:31:57,880
out of work, because it sounds
if we are all susceptible to a demon.

365
00:32:00,079 --> 00:32:02,079
Yeah, I sit down. I
tell people when I look up for

366
00:32:02,160 --> 00:32:07,920
deliverance, like, look, this
is your deliverance. You're conducting the exorcism

367
00:32:08,279 --> 00:32:14,039
and deliverance you decide if you want
to break free or not. I'm just

368
00:32:14,160 --> 00:32:16,680
here as a guide. I'm here
to help you. And we, of

369
00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:21,839
course we are we are sinners.
We're going to I had There's been people

370
00:32:22,079 --> 00:32:27,759
actually, just like recently with that
lady with LOLd of Spirit, and we

371
00:32:28,079 --> 00:32:32,480
do make mistakes. I make mistakes. In her case, there were three

372
00:32:32,519 --> 00:32:37,640
demons there was, and demons will
also go by the namestill take on the

373
00:32:37,720 --> 00:32:45,039
personification of the person's abuser. People
don't know that, and eman an ancestral

374
00:32:45,160 --> 00:32:51,160
abuser. In this lady's case,
she had a demon named Jacob, and

375
00:32:51,319 --> 00:32:54,440
she had a demon name Samuel.
Well, I know that there is a

376
00:32:54,519 --> 00:33:01,440
demon named Samuel, a Luciferian spirit, and it connecting Jezebel spirit as a

377
00:33:01,480 --> 00:33:07,519
little us. And that's what I
believe that happened to the sa sam killings.

378
00:33:08,640 --> 00:33:14,279
David Bergowitz, you know, he
had a Jewish ancestry, and and

379
00:33:14,480 --> 00:33:17,640
once you know, I saw the
name sam, I'm like Samuel. And

380
00:33:19,079 --> 00:33:25,559
so she had Samuel Jacob and there
was this feminine entity that I couldn't determine

381
00:33:25,599 --> 00:33:30,839
at the time if it was a
soul tie or if it was a dissociative

382
00:33:30,119 --> 00:33:35,599
and it was claiming to be a
dissociative going by in the name Anne that

383
00:33:36,799 --> 00:33:43,599
and so we cast out Jacob and
we cast out Samuel and she went back

384
00:33:43,640 --> 00:33:46,920
to her own state. Well later
on another event, she came up and

385
00:33:47,079 --> 00:33:51,039
she's like, I want you to
check me again. I could hear the

386
00:33:51,160 --> 00:33:54,119
voice of God saying you missed Anne. I'm not like, okay, So

387
00:33:54,240 --> 00:33:59,880
I want to explore this Anne again. Because then she actually had two sessions

388
00:34:00,079 --> 00:34:05,599
prior to the third and the second
one when we were casting out Samuel,

389
00:34:05,880 --> 00:34:08,000
I said, is there anybody else
in there? And don't lie to me

390
00:34:08,159 --> 00:34:14,440
or I'll torment you. And I
said, just that B like I say

391
00:34:14,480 --> 00:34:17,920
the B word on your show off, And I'm like okay. So I

392
00:34:19,000 --> 00:34:22,800
started wondering about and because when I
was talking to a claiming it to be

393
00:34:22,840 --> 00:34:32,000
a dissociative from her childhood, that
it was. We started the diffusion process.

394
00:34:32,559 --> 00:34:37,719
And a lot of exorcists don't do
this if they're familiar with the sociaive

395
00:34:37,760 --> 00:34:44,519
identity disorder. But I'm one of
few that know how to fuse the dissociative

396
00:34:44,559 --> 00:34:49,920
back with the core personality. So
we started the process of fuse fusing back

397
00:34:50,679 --> 00:34:53,440
and she didn't do that, which
tipped me off. I'm like, I'm

398
00:34:53,480 --> 00:34:58,400
starting to wonder about and and I
started even wondering there if it was a

399
00:34:58,480 --> 00:35:04,320
Jezebel spirit, because jess of those
are very difficult to deal with. And

400
00:35:04,920 --> 00:35:08,079
so in the third session when she
said, well, I am going through

401
00:35:08,159 --> 00:35:13,000
all this and I want you to
check me out again. So we sat

402
00:35:13,079 --> 00:35:20,639
down and lo and behold it was
actually Littleith And I know what littleis how

403
00:35:20,800 --> 00:35:23,880
she gets in. So I asked
her some other questions and like, okay,

404
00:35:24,280 --> 00:35:28,719
have you done this in your life? You know something that she hadn't

405
00:35:28,880 --> 00:35:31,519
told me. It was a subject
to a lot of women who have done

406
00:35:31,559 --> 00:35:37,239
it don't want to discuss it.
And just when I raise it from their

407
00:35:37,280 --> 00:35:39,280
life, I said, okay,
just remember that that's where they are.

408
00:35:40,119 --> 00:35:45,840
They're dwelling on that event, that
it was in your past. And so

409
00:35:45,000 --> 00:35:52,199
we had renounced it and went back
to the little because that's what she told

410
00:35:52,239 --> 00:35:54,159
me. That was her legal right. And I said to having more legal

411
00:35:54,280 --> 00:36:00,599
right. No, it sounds like
in a court room. Yeah, it

412
00:36:00,760 --> 00:36:07,119
is a courtroom process. Negotiations.
Is what is that by dissociative identity disorder

413
00:36:07,239 --> 00:36:13,159
exactly? Okay. The associative identity
disorder used to be called multiple personality as

414
00:36:13,960 --> 00:36:19,440
okay, and personalities personalities do exist
in the mind. And what happens is

415
00:36:19,679 --> 00:36:22,760
the best way I explain to people
and they ask, is you take an

416
00:36:22,800 --> 00:36:25,920
egg. The egg is whole,
and that's a young egg, and so

417
00:36:27,320 --> 00:36:30,239
think of that as a child's Okay, Well, I want to take and

418
00:36:31,119 --> 00:36:36,599
make other personalities. So you drop
it. As you do, it cracks.

419
00:36:37,400 --> 00:36:42,639
So all those cracks, all those
different pieces are being made, are

420
00:36:42,719 --> 00:36:47,800
different personalities. So those those shells
are their own pieces of shell That's essentially

421
00:36:47,920 --> 00:36:52,519
what happens to the mind. If
you take abuse, trauma and have it

422
00:36:52,639 --> 00:36:58,239
go through that, have that child
go through that experience, the mind fractures.

423
00:36:59,000 --> 00:37:05,280
So if your neighbor is a pedophile
and starts abusing the child early in

424
00:37:05,400 --> 00:37:10,760
life, then what happens is see
children, of course, we have this

425
00:37:12,079 --> 00:37:15,559
mindset similar to the imagined likeness of
God. We're innocent and that's all we

426
00:37:15,679 --> 00:37:20,199
know is we want to experience the
fruits of the spirit. We want experience

427
00:37:20,320 --> 00:37:24,679
love, which wants to experience love, patience, kindness, not all the

428
00:37:24,760 --> 00:37:30,079
time patience, but the good things
in life. And we trust people that

429
00:37:30,440 --> 00:37:36,360
are close to us, our friends
or family. And when somebody like that

430
00:37:37,039 --> 00:37:40,480
even a family friend in the case
of ji Wayne Gacy, turns on us

431
00:37:42,440 --> 00:37:49,519
and starts performing evil acts on us. Then the mind cannot comprehend what's going

432
00:37:49,599 --> 00:37:53,920
on and it dissociates. It leaves. Well, somebody has to come forward,

433
00:37:54,840 --> 00:37:58,519
Mark, we give back what I'm
saying. The personality, the core

434
00:37:58,679 --> 00:38:02,360
personality leaves, so the mind fractures, it breaks off a piece of it

435
00:38:02,960 --> 00:38:08,880
itself and brings that forward. Now, a great example of this is in

436
00:38:09,039 --> 00:38:16,960
the Demaca of Gadera, where the
scripture talks about when the gentleman came out

437
00:38:17,000 --> 00:38:23,719
of the tombs, he was yelling
and screaming, gnashing of teeth and cutting

438
00:38:24,519 --> 00:38:30,639
with sharp stones. I experienced that
a lot with people that come with me,

439
00:38:30,760 --> 00:38:36,599
especially to have Jezebel. Is when
I see marks of them or they

440
00:38:36,679 --> 00:38:45,000
have some sort of fantastic addiction.
The dissociative is constantly experiencing that pain that

441
00:38:45,880 --> 00:38:51,480
it went through in childhood. It's
always there, it's always holding onto it.

442
00:38:51,559 --> 00:38:57,719
And so it's a way that God
has allowed our minds to go through

443
00:38:58,599 --> 00:39:04,320
to actually have a survive. And
I tell these dissociatives when they come forward,

444
00:39:04,320 --> 00:39:07,960
I'm like, thank you, thank
you so much for your presence,

445
00:39:08,159 --> 00:39:15,280
you have allowed this person to survive. And because they're a child living in

446
00:39:15,400 --> 00:39:22,119
a grown up body, they're a
little angry over this situation. While I

447
00:39:22,199 --> 00:39:24,880
got hold out of this pain,
you know, I'm making this person lives.

448
00:39:25,000 --> 00:39:29,280
I'm watching, so have to talk
to them and ease them in to

449
00:39:29,400 --> 00:39:32,320
let them know, like, look, Ted is forty five. Now he's

450
00:39:32,320 --> 00:39:38,639
an adult. He can experience this
trauma that you're going through and sort through

451
00:39:38,719 --> 00:39:44,679
it and you can actually protect you. And then they we want to get

452
00:39:44,760 --> 00:39:50,320
at least like fifty one of the
soul to agree to accept Christ. And

453
00:39:50,440 --> 00:39:54,360
this ticks off demons, and so
I'll lead the dissociative because it is part

454
00:39:54,400 --> 00:40:00,519
of that person that is without Christ. To Christ. They accept Christ and

455
00:40:00,599 --> 00:40:07,079
they begin to start to begin that
fusion process will fuse them. And usually

456
00:40:07,199 --> 00:40:12,960
the one demon who will claims to
legal right or abuse is Jezebel, a

457
00:40:13,079 --> 00:40:19,440
Jezebel spirit, and then when that
happens, the fusion happens. Jezebel hasn't

458
00:40:19,639 --> 00:40:22,960
nothing to hold onto, but she'll
still claim a legal right. And Jezebel

459
00:40:24,599 --> 00:40:32,000
in any form has this unique motherly
characteristic about it, and she will try

460
00:40:32,239 --> 00:40:39,280
to bring up that associative that's a
child as its own and to see it

461
00:40:40,320 --> 00:40:45,599
more fit into the person that wants
to be. Because demons can't make you

462
00:40:45,159 --> 00:40:51,159
do something, but they can make
your dissociatives do something, or even use

463
00:40:51,280 --> 00:40:57,920
solatizing the person to manipulate your mind
to do something. And that's where the

464
00:40:58,400 --> 00:41:02,400
change comes in, my people,
And you really allow these serial killer accounts

465
00:41:02,480 --> 00:41:07,079
so like I don't remember doing it, or I have no recollect election of

466
00:41:07,239 --> 00:41:13,840
going that far. It's the dissociative
that is in pain trying its best to

467
00:41:13,960 --> 00:41:17,760
relieve the pain. That's why I
like in the Bible that demoniac had was

468
00:41:17,880 --> 00:41:24,519
cutting because it was inwardly an emotional
pain. It was doing its best to

469
00:41:25,199 --> 00:41:30,679
relieve the pain, trying to It's
a build up. And the same thing

470
00:41:30,840 --> 00:41:34,360
with a lot of these serial killers
is they say, well, it became

471
00:41:34,360 --> 00:41:37,199
an addiction. When after I did
it, it was it felt like a

472
00:41:37,280 --> 00:41:40,480
big release, And that's why they
do it again, because over time,

473
00:41:40,719 --> 00:41:45,280
the dissociative builds up the pain again
to the can't tolerate anymore. It's God

474
00:41:45,400 --> 00:41:51,800
release it. So that's why it's
so important to get to these dissociatives as

475
00:41:51,880 --> 00:41:58,039
quickly as possible and heal them.
M wow, so interesting. When did

476
00:41:58,079 --> 00:42:00,039
your bo ahead and tell the listeners
how they can find your books, especially

477
00:42:00,159 --> 00:42:05,280
this new Serial Killers and their Demons
book that you came out with. I

478
00:42:05,440 --> 00:42:08,559
they can find them on Amazon the
Kindle version of it. It'll be coming

479
00:42:08,599 --> 00:42:12,760
out at the twenty first. I
have other books as well. I talk

480
00:42:12,840 --> 00:42:16,360
about my story. It's called The
Equilist, and I can be found it

481
00:42:16,440 --> 00:42:21,840
to red Cover. A lot of
people go to Amazon to find my books,

482
00:42:21,960 --> 00:42:25,920
but they're once once published, they
start trickling out into other other bookstores

483
00:42:25,960 --> 00:42:30,559
as well online. Do you have
a personal website of your own? Not

484
00:42:30,760 --> 00:42:36,400
yet. I believe that I do
own the domain name gphaggart dot com.

485
00:42:36,880 --> 00:42:39,440
But if you try it, it
should take it to my web page.

486
00:42:39,559 --> 00:42:46,119
I've been so busy with a lot
of multiple things that I just haven't really

487
00:42:46,199 --> 00:42:53,760
got around to doing it really trying
to Yeah, trade people been writing.

488
00:42:54,840 --> 00:43:01,360
I also, do you have a
full time job there. I'm transitioning hopefully

489
00:43:01,519 --> 00:43:09,719
into starting my own type of business
and do own. It's helped people build

490
00:43:09,840 --> 00:43:14,639
churches and ministries in the past,
and a lot of business knowledge, so

491
00:43:15,400 --> 00:43:22,079
that's full time. Where so this
is deliverance ministry is something I do on

492
00:43:22,199 --> 00:43:24,960
the side, hopefully being able to
do it full time. I'd like to

493
00:43:25,039 --> 00:43:30,360
do it full time, travel around
Teller States even other countries and helping to

494
00:43:30,440 --> 00:43:36,039
deliver people, so that's my goal. I do hope that this show brings

495
00:43:36,320 --> 00:43:43,320
in people who need your help be
able to find you. So thank you

496
00:43:43,440 --> 00:43:45,880
so much for joining me today.
I really appreciate this. I know we

497
00:43:45,960 --> 00:43:49,920
started off with Dogman and that was
my original intention, but I really didn't

498
00:43:51,039 --> 00:43:55,079
The subject of exticism and the whole
serial killer thing very interesting and informative,

499
00:43:55,119 --> 00:44:00,239
So thank you very much. Yeah, thank you for having me to the

500
00:44:00,320 --> 00:44:04,400
listeners. If you like listening to
this week's episode and you're into all things

501
00:44:04,480 --> 00:44:07,480
paranormal, check out my other show, Eleanor Wagner's Creeping It Real podcast out

502
00:44:07,519 --> 00:44:10,920
of the Post to Coast Entertainment Network, which is available wherever you can get

503
00:44:12,000 --> 00:44:15,639
your podcasts. And if any of
you are interested in reading any of my

504
00:44:15,760 --> 00:44:17,840
books, you can find the links
to them on my website, author Eleanor

505
00:44:17,920 --> 00:44:22,559
Wagner dot com. I read about
the history of the town and location,

506
00:44:22,039 --> 00:44:25,360
add the paranormal story to the mix, and finish it all off with photos

507
00:44:25,519 --> 00:44:30,360
and evidence. Everybody loves a good
ghost story, but there's nothing better than

508
00:44:30,400 --> 00:44:32,880
a true ghost story, so check
it out and I water Elnorwager dot com.

509
00:44:34,880 --> 00:44:38,599
Thank you again, ghostly listeners.
You can follow me on my website,

510
00:44:39,079 --> 00:44:44,599
author Eleanor Wagner dot com, where
there are links to my books and

511
00:44:44,800 --> 00:44:50,400
video updates and photographs. Also,
you can sign up or level up on

512
00:44:50,519 --> 00:44:57,320
my author Eleanor Wagner Patreon program that's
PA t R e O N, where

513
00:44:57,440 --> 00:45:02,559
you will find special bonus opportunities only
available to its patrons, such as one

514
00:45:02,639 --> 00:45:08,599
on ones with me and co hosting
opportunities on episodes of Eleanor Watner's Strange and

515
00:45:08,760 --> 00:45:15,159
Scary World podcast. Thank you paranormal
enthusiasts for tuning in today. I hope

516
00:45:15,199 --> 00:45:21,760
you'll come back again. Remember to
tap into your own gifts. Everyone has

517
00:45:21,880 --> 00:45:28,280
them, and in the meantime,
make sure you're creeping it real. O

518
00:45:38,880 --> 00:45:40,760
fows the Long Dog to se