WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.120 --> 00:00:11.800 This is pod Populi Podcast for the People, the Great Love Debate. It's 2 00:00:11.839 --> 00:00:18.239 the Great Love Debate, the Great Love Debate. It's the Great Love Debase. 3 00:00:18.600 --> 00:00:22.839 Hi again everyone, It's Brian Howie. Welcome to the Great Love Debate, 4 00:00:22.879 --> 00:00:26.679 the world's number one dating and relationship podcasts. It's twenty fifteen. I 5 00:00:26.719 --> 00:00:31.160 am back here in the very fine studios of pod Populi Podcast for the People. 6 00:00:32.000 --> 00:00:35.240 Got Cam and Barrie on the controls. Give a shout out a little 7 00:00:35.280 --> 00:00:39.240 louder if I'll see that was terrible, given much, I gonna mic come 8 00:00:39.320 --> 00:00:43.240 up. I'm the one in Scottsdale, Arizona. It is no longer surface 9 00:00:43.320 --> 00:00:46.039 of the Sun. Hot. I think we got through another season here. 10 00:00:46.280 --> 00:00:51.320 It's always lovely in the Scots Dazzle anyway. Uh. We talk a lot 11 00:00:51.799 --> 00:00:55.840 on this podcast over the last you know, eight nine years about the dating 12 00:00:55.920 --> 00:00:59.719 Pool and the size of the dating pool. And some people want to say 13 00:00:59.759 --> 00:01:03.000 that the dating pool is six inches wide and one hundred feet deep, and 14 00:01:03.079 --> 00:01:08.640 some people say it's one hundred feet wide and six inches deep. And it's 15 00:01:08.640 --> 00:01:11.760 a very rare thing that it is the only body of water that is both 16 00:01:11.959 --> 00:01:17.239 deep and shallow at the same time. The dating pool. I think that 17 00:01:17.280 --> 00:01:22.319 the dating pool is getting bigger now. It's not in the way that that 18 00:01:22.439 --> 00:01:26.319 we've talked about on the shell. I think the traditional dating pool, the 19 00:01:26.359 --> 00:01:29.959 people in their twenties and thirties and whatever, I think that has gotten smaller. 20 00:01:30.079 --> 00:01:32.799 I think that is shrunk. I think a lot of people dropped out. 21 00:01:32.920 --> 00:01:34.200 I think a lot of people are like, I don't need the ship, 22 00:01:34.359 --> 00:01:38.280 I don't like the the dating apps. I just want to be complete, 23 00:01:38.319 --> 00:01:42.040 one hundred scent introvert with my dog and my wine and my video games 24 00:01:42.079 --> 00:01:45.519 and my porn and and I just don't want a part of it. A 25 00:01:45.519 --> 00:01:47.719 lot of people dropped that out of COVID, and they never came back. 26 00:01:48.319 --> 00:01:53.200 Where the growth is happening, for lack of a better term, is in 27 00:01:53.280 --> 00:01:59.760 the pool over fifty. And not only is it happening because people are living 28 00:02:00.079 --> 00:02:05.079 longer, it is happening because a lot of people, especially women, are 29 00:02:05.159 --> 00:02:08.120 realizing I can have a second act in my life. I still am very 30 00:02:08.199 --> 00:02:13.400 vibrant. There's a whole lot of i'll just say, medications out there that 31 00:02:13.479 --> 00:02:16.120 allow the men to have certain capabilities that they might not have had twenty thirty 32 00:02:16.199 --> 00:02:21.960 years ago. And so that has brought a bunch of people back into either 33 00:02:22.039 --> 00:02:25.840 both the shallow end or the deep end of the dating pool. That being 34 00:02:25.960 --> 00:02:31.400 said, the group of will say over fifty, they have a unique set 35 00:02:31.400 --> 00:02:35.840 of advantages and there's also a unique set of challenges. So I want to 36 00:02:35.840 --> 00:02:38.800 get in all that I brought in somebody, not that she's over fifty. 37 00:02:38.840 --> 00:02:42.199 I'm not even gonna say how old she is, but she also has a 38 00:02:42.240 --> 00:02:47.800 particular interest in this demographic. She is a writer, speaker, comedian, 39 00:02:49.039 --> 00:02:54.439 she may tell jokes, bon vivant and host of the Geezer Proofer podcast. 40 00:02:54.520 --> 00:02:59.120 And I'll let her explain what that is later on. Nancy Shanker, how 41 00:02:59.120 --> 00:03:01.360 are you, Brian? Thank you for having me on your show. Do 42 00:03:01.159 --> 00:03:06.039 you agree that that you know, maybe we didn't pay any attention to it 43 00:03:06.039 --> 00:03:09.439 back when we were twenty, But if I go to Florida or any place 44 00:03:09.439 --> 00:03:15.039 like Arizona and there's a lot of retirees, there's a lot of sixty plus 45 00:03:15.159 --> 00:03:20.280 dating, sexing, texting, all that going on that I'm not sure happened 46 00:03:20.360 --> 00:03:24.280 before. Absolutely. And the other thing that I think is going on is 47 00:03:24.319 --> 00:03:30.639 that people over sixty, over sixty five are not necessarily retirees. So I 48 00:03:30.800 --> 00:03:34.840 fall into that pool, and I have my own marketing company, I've got 49 00:03:34.840 --> 00:03:39.120 as speaking and writing practice. I'll soon have a podcast. And there still 50 00:03:39.240 --> 00:03:45.400 is this archaic assumption and it's not unfounded that a lot of people over sixty 51 00:03:45.439 --> 00:03:49.039 five just want a wait to die and play pickleball. Until that happened, 52 00:03:49.080 --> 00:03:53.840 that's a really good point. People are working longer, they're second careers, 53 00:03:53.840 --> 00:03:57.439 they're entrepreneurs, they're doing longer, which people are like, oh, that 54 00:03:57.599 --> 00:03:59.599 means they don't have time to date. No, what that does is it 55 00:03:59.639 --> 00:04:03.199 puts them in contact with a lot more people all the time. They're in 56 00:04:03.240 --> 00:04:09.080 business environments, they're networking environments, they're in social environments, and that also 57 00:04:09.520 --> 00:04:14.919 leads them not to get stagnant either physically or psychologically. That their brain is 58 00:04:14.960 --> 00:04:17.199 still turned on in a lot of ways because they're working. Yeah, and 59 00:04:17.240 --> 00:04:21.560 I do think that that is one of the differences between men and women in 60 00:04:21.600 --> 00:04:26.600 today's dating world. That a lot of men have had corporate careers. You 61 00:04:26.680 --> 00:04:30.160 talked about the second act, and when they retire from their jobs, they 62 00:04:30.199 --> 00:04:33.560 want to kick back, they want to hang with their grandkids, they want 63 00:04:33.600 --> 00:04:39.519 to play pickleball or golf, and the women who have spent a lot of 64 00:04:39.600 --> 00:04:46.600 years raising kids, being married, taking care of household chores. We view 65 00:04:46.639 --> 00:04:51.639 that as a time of liberation. So there's a very big disconnect between active 66 00:04:51.680 --> 00:04:57.279 women over sixty five and, for lack of a better term, passive men 67 00:04:57.360 --> 00:05:01.279 over sixty five. So I I think also the women of the eighties were 68 00:05:01.360 --> 00:05:08.560 a generation that has economic independence. We've got smarts, a lot of us 69 00:05:08.600 --> 00:05:14.560 have been married previously, and the statistics actually show that a lot of what 70 00:05:14.560 --> 00:05:18.439 it's called gray divorces are initiated by the women and the men are then kind 71 00:05:18.439 --> 00:05:23.680 of gobsmacked and they fall into a few different categories. They're the kids in 72 00:05:23.720 --> 00:05:28.079 the candy store who maybe haven't had sex for two years and are just out 73 00:05:28.079 --> 00:05:30.839 there. They think the dating apps are like the door dash of vaginas. 74 00:05:31.040 --> 00:05:39.199 Yeah, I believe that's their new slogan. You do really well with vaginas. 75 00:05:39.839 --> 00:05:44.560 That's true. And so in a town like this Scott's d Arizona, 76 00:05:46.000 --> 00:05:49.160 if you go out at after eleven o'clock and you see a lot of young 77 00:05:49.199 --> 00:05:53.279 people, But if you go out in that sort of happy hour to nine 78 00:05:53.319 --> 00:05:59.920 pm zone, you're going to see a ton of women together and not nearly 79 00:06:00.040 --> 00:06:02.560 as many men. The men like golf all day, They did something else 80 00:06:02.600 --> 00:06:05.800 all day, and they are pooped out by eight o'clock. That is the 81 00:06:05.839 --> 00:06:10.360 single biggest challenge of the women over fifty that we have heard since the day 82 00:06:10.360 --> 00:06:13.959 we started this show is I want to date somebody my age, and the 83 00:06:14.000 --> 00:06:16.600 guys my age don't want to do this. They want to hang they want 84 00:06:16.639 --> 00:06:21.240 to sit home. And I had my twenty five years of raising my children 85 00:06:21.279 --> 00:06:24.600 or whatever. It's my time and I want to go out and the guys 86 00:06:24.639 --> 00:06:27.720 don't want to do that, so I have to go chasing around young guys. 87 00:06:28.480 --> 00:06:30.680 That's who's out there. And then I get this, you know, 88 00:06:30.800 --> 00:06:34.480 sort of cougar reputation going on. But really it's like I can't find men 89 00:06:34.560 --> 00:06:36.920 that are sixty five years old who want to go out till ten thirty. 90 00:06:38.079 --> 00:06:40.519 And the ones who do want to go out, and I see them a 91 00:06:40.519 --> 00:06:44.759 lot out at Eddiv's or any other steakhouse in the valley. They want the 92 00:06:44.800 --> 00:06:48.040 young stuff. And I was in a bar a couple of months ago and 93 00:06:48.040 --> 00:06:50.920 there was a guy who had to have been close to eighty with a woman 94 00:06:50.959 --> 00:06:56.000 who was in her twenties, and she was like wriggling to get out from 95 00:06:56.040 --> 00:06:59.720 under his grip. Well, here's why they want the young stuff. They 96 00:06:59.720 --> 00:07:01.920 don't about the young stuff because the young stuff is hotter. They want the 97 00:07:02.000 --> 00:07:04.519 young stuff. That's a good way to put that. The young stuff. 98 00:07:04.560 --> 00:07:09.879 They want the young stuff because it is easier for them to get their confidence 99 00:07:09.959 --> 00:07:13.439 back and play hero with the young stuff. Somebody takes you out to dinner 100 00:07:13.720 --> 00:07:15.040 and buys your dinner. You've done this a lot of times, and you 101 00:07:15.079 --> 00:07:18.360 could probably buy your own dinner. Okay, take a twenty five year old 102 00:07:18.399 --> 00:07:20.800 out, no offense, sto our twenty five year listener and buy our two 103 00:07:20.839 --> 00:07:26.959 glasses of chardonnay, and you are appreciated. You feel good about yourself. 104 00:07:27.000 --> 00:07:30.920 So they're going young to try and feel better about themselves. It's really hard 105 00:07:30.959 --> 00:07:36.079 for the men over fifty to impress a women over fifty, and that is 106 00:07:36.120 --> 00:07:40.759 the challenge of the rise of the independent woman, which is creeped into the 107 00:07:40.839 --> 00:07:44.519 dating pool of all ages. Is you're just harder to You don't need us 108 00:07:44.519 --> 00:07:47.319 that much anymore, especially at that age. Well, we need men for 109 00:07:47.480 --> 00:07:53.920 different things, and it's not necessarily the things that men of that age want 110 00:07:54.000 --> 00:07:56.680 to do. So what do you need a man for who's sixty two? 111 00:07:57.079 --> 00:08:00.319 I would love a traveling companion, get a dog. He's not sign it 112 00:08:00.399 --> 00:08:01.839 up for that. Like, that's the thing we hear that, you know, 113 00:08:01.879 --> 00:08:07.160 the old Jackie Onassis line, as you marry the first time for love 114 00:08:07.199 --> 00:08:09.680 and the second time for money and the third time for companionship. That guy 115 00:08:09.720 --> 00:08:13.120 doesn't want to be a companion. He wants to be more than that. 116 00:08:13.639 --> 00:08:16.279 He doesn't want to be that. You know, that's essentially your You can 117 00:08:16.319 --> 00:08:20.199 have your hairdresser go with you, you can have your girlfriend go with you. 118 00:08:20.399 --> 00:08:22.839 He wants to be the one who took you around the world on a 119 00:08:22.879 --> 00:08:28.079 trip and gave you an adventure of a lifetime and you're not really looking for 120 00:08:28.120 --> 00:08:30.879 that. Well, but I would be fine with that. If a man 121 00:08:31.040 --> 00:08:35.039 said to me, I'm going I've always wanted to go to Sicily, would 122 00:08:35.039 --> 00:08:39.600 you like to come with me? And it would be a traveling friend with 123 00:08:39.720 --> 00:08:43.600 benefits. Yeah, there has to be the benefits. Oh, and that's 124 00:08:43.720 --> 00:08:46.960 that's totally fine. You know, it depends on the guy, but I 125 00:08:48.000 --> 00:08:52.919 would be down with that. The problem is that a lot of the men 126 00:08:52.080 --> 00:08:56.480 of that age, who maybe have the means to travel they've traveled for work, 127 00:08:56.559 --> 00:09:01.039 they've traveled with their late wife, they've traveled with the first turn and 128 00:09:01.120 --> 00:09:05.960 there, and they're well, you know, widow widow hoo is a thing. 129 00:09:05.039 --> 00:09:09.360 It is a thing. This year's Golden Bachelor is a widower who was 130 00:09:09.399 --> 00:09:13.279 married for forty years. I know, and it's it's those people are usually 131 00:09:13.799 --> 00:09:16.840 a lot of people because those that that's a challenging demo that comes to a 132 00:09:16.879 --> 00:09:18.559 lot of our shows. And the widow and the widowers, they're like, 133 00:09:18.639 --> 00:09:22.360 I'm ready to date, and a lot of people who I want to date 134 00:09:22.879 --> 00:09:26.919 don't want to deal with the ghost is what they call it. It's hard 135 00:09:26.960 --> 00:09:28.840 for them to compete with a memory, and so a lot of people are 136 00:09:28.840 --> 00:09:31.759 like, I don't want to get into that. And the Golden Batch you 137 00:09:31.799 --> 00:09:33.919 brought that up. When I heard his story, I was like, Oh, 138 00:09:33.960 --> 00:09:37.080 that's so sad because he was married a long time, love his life, 139 00:09:37.080 --> 00:09:39.279 and I'm like, if I'm competing for this, I don't. And 140 00:09:39.320 --> 00:09:43.120 again, this is my weird issue. And I think a lot of people 141 00:09:43.519 --> 00:09:48.919 have second and third spouses of after somebody passed, and it's just different. 142 00:09:48.960 --> 00:09:52.159 It's not better or worse. But you're right, I the the end. 143 00:09:52.879 --> 00:09:56.360 Again, if you're twenty two and listening to this year, like what the 144 00:09:56.399 --> 00:09:58.519 man worked and the woman stayed at home and all like for a big generation, 145 00:10:00.039 --> 00:10:01.480 this is what happened. And he did travel for work, and he 146 00:10:01.559 --> 00:10:05.759 had his adventures, and now he just wants to stay in one place with 147 00:10:05.799 --> 00:10:09.039 the same tea time and the same group of buddies. And she's like, 148 00:10:09.399 --> 00:10:13.120 it's my time. So Howard Stern got divorced. He worked and he went 149 00:10:13.159 --> 00:10:16.519 home and he want to sit in his basement. And his first wife is 150 00:10:16.559 --> 00:10:20.840 like, I need a life. So she got divorced, and his new 151 00:10:20.879 --> 00:10:22.519 wife, it's the same rumbling. Now he's like, I don't want COVID, 152 00:10:22.519 --> 00:10:24.279 I want to stay home, and she's like, I want to have 153 00:10:24.480 --> 00:10:30.120 this. That's not unusual, No, absolutely not. So I think that 154 00:10:30.159 --> 00:10:35.679 the population of men over sixty, over sixty five, who really have that 155 00:10:35.879 --> 00:10:41.919 energy level and who view you know, I often say that I have another 156 00:10:41.120 --> 00:10:46.240 thirty three years left in my life. That's an entire lifetime, and I 157 00:10:46.320 --> 00:10:50.919 want to do things very precise number well, I will later reveal how old 158 00:10:50.960 --> 00:10:52.240 I actually am. I know, but you might have fifty years, you 159 00:10:52.320 --> 00:10:56.919 might have five. I mean, I don't know I'm being optimistic. But 160 00:10:56.000 --> 00:11:01.879 however, however many it is, there are things that I still would like 161 00:11:03.000 --> 00:11:07.879 to do in my lifetime, and I'm very clear with the people I meet 162 00:11:07.440 --> 00:11:11.279 that those things are on my wish list. And I don't think my bar 163 00:11:11.440 --> 00:11:16.600 is particularly high for what it is that I'm looking for. But I know 164 00:11:16.759 --> 00:11:20.120 also what I don't want. I don't want to be Netflix and chilling seven 165 00:11:20.240 --> 00:11:24.279 nights a week, or have to go out with my girlfriends five out of 166 00:11:24.279 --> 00:11:28.720 seven nights a week because my significant other is too tired. I mean, 167 00:11:28.759 --> 00:11:33.600 my ideal would actually be to have a long distance relationship so that we both 168 00:11:33.639 --> 00:11:37.559 have our lives, we have our work, we have our kids. It's 169 00:11:37.639 --> 00:11:41.120 special exactly. Yeah, that's not about it. Have you taken dance classes? 170 00:11:41.720 --> 00:11:45.840 I have two left feet, I know, but the men who go 171 00:11:45.919 --> 00:11:50.039 to the dance classes of all ages have a little extra figure. I will 172 00:11:50.360 --> 00:11:54.639 little energy. I will have to keep that in mind. Arthur Murray's or 173 00:11:54.679 --> 00:11:58.120 whatever. Shout out to Arthur Murray's. Are you on the dating apps? 174 00:11:58.360 --> 00:12:01.840 I am on the dating apps and off the dating apps. What is your 175 00:12:01.799 --> 00:12:09.440 age parameters? My parameters are forty eight to seventy two so it's a pretty 176 00:12:09.440 --> 00:12:13.519 wide range. That's well, no, it's a wide range on the low 177 00:12:13.600 --> 00:12:16.600 side. Again, not to give away your age, but you're there's a 178 00:12:16.600 --> 00:12:22.399 lot more below you than above you in that range. I say it's a 179 00:12:22.440 --> 00:12:24.799 mixed bag. I do think, as you said earlier, there are more 180 00:12:24.799 --> 00:12:30.679 and more men over the age of fifty who've discovered the apps. The apps 181 00:12:30.679 --> 00:12:35.320 have done a really good job of broad mass advertising, and their ads are 182 00:12:35.320 --> 00:12:37.759 oh you know this guy's like, oh, somebody liked me, and so 183 00:12:37.840 --> 00:12:41.320 the men are flocking saying, oh, maybe that's how I'll meet somebody, 184 00:12:41.399 --> 00:12:43.720 or there's guy peer pressure. Yeah. The sad thing is a lot of 185 00:12:43.720 --> 00:12:48.080 them don't know how to take selfies. There's like the classic bathroom picture where 186 00:12:48.080 --> 00:12:52.799 like you have a nice face and I can see your toilet right or are 187 00:12:52.840 --> 00:12:56.480 they holding the fish right again? Or they still believe the Tinder is exclusively 188 00:12:56.519 --> 00:13:01.320 a hook up app, so they lead with the sexting. Well, I 189 00:13:01.320 --> 00:13:03.360 don't know if they believe it's for that, but if they lead with the 190 00:13:03.399 --> 00:13:09.759 sexting, it's got as good a chance to work as anything else. Now 191 00:13:09.759 --> 00:13:13.159 we've talked about that to death on this podcast. The women aren't answering anything, 192 00:13:13.480 --> 00:13:16.120 So you might as well just lead with that and see who gets interest, 193 00:13:16.240 --> 00:13:18.360 especially if you're like, I'm not looking this is This is the other 194 00:13:18.759 --> 00:13:24.159 both benefit and challenge. In your twenties and your thirties, you are trying 195 00:13:24.159 --> 00:13:28.559 to date most of the time, to have a relationship and a partnership that's 196 00:13:28.600 --> 00:13:31.279 going to last forever, and you're going to raise a family and all that. 197 00:13:31.279 --> 00:13:35.480 That is usually the goal of people. Once you've gotten through that and 198 00:13:35.639 --> 00:13:37.600 for either your spouse is no longer with us or you got divorced or whatever, 199 00:13:37.799 --> 00:13:41.639 that little fairy tale of the next fifty years together is gone. Take 200 00:13:41.720 --> 00:13:46.399 some of the pressure and some of the idea out of it. It's also 201 00:13:46.519 --> 00:13:50.120 like, I know very specifically what I need in my life. I need 202 00:13:50.159 --> 00:13:52.080 these time. I need, you know, the fun, the companionship, 203 00:13:52.080 --> 00:13:54.120 the laughs, that travel or whatever. And then so then you're like, 204 00:13:54.480 --> 00:13:58.679 it's a little bit easier resume to search for. But when you are not 205 00:14:00.039 --> 00:14:05.639 driven by that impetus of I want to find deep and lasting love, that 206 00:14:05.720 --> 00:14:09.399 makes it hard too. So it's both easier on one side and it's harder 207 00:14:09.440 --> 00:14:13.039 on the other. I think the motivation comes from I want to fall in 208 00:14:13.080 --> 00:14:16.080 love and spend happily ever afterwards somebody and when you take that away, which 209 00:14:16.080 --> 00:14:20.120 you do over fifty six year whatever, because either you're jaded or those reasons 210 00:14:20.159 --> 00:14:24.080 I just brought about, it's not quite as motivating. Yeah. I also 211 00:14:24.200 --> 00:14:28.519 think that you know my generation. Again, without revealing my age, we're 212 00:14:28.519 --> 00:14:33.480 gonna have a drum roll at the end. There are a lot of men 213 00:14:33.600 --> 00:14:37.720 who either grew up in sexually repressed times, they got married young, they've 214 00:14:37.759 --> 00:14:43.320 only been with one woman, yep, they never really allowed themselves that what 215 00:14:43.399 --> 00:14:46.399 I call the wilding stage, where like right after you get divorced, you 216 00:14:46.440 --> 00:14:50.559 can have fun for a year, get it out of your system. And 217 00:14:50.639 --> 00:14:54.320 maybe these guys will never get it out of their system. And you know, 218 00:14:54.360 --> 00:14:58.600 we talked about the Golden Bachelor. I've seen pictures of his late wife. 219 00:14:58.840 --> 00:15:01.440 Yeah, and you know, she looks like a really sweet, solid 220 00:15:01.519 --> 00:15:07.320 person. But the women who they cast on as his potential dates, yeah, 221 00:15:07.360 --> 00:15:11.480 look nothing like her. They're all hotties. So I'm sure he misses 222 00:15:11.559 --> 00:15:13.799 his late wife. Forty years is a long time, but I also think 223 00:15:13.840 --> 00:15:16.960 there's probably something now what it was forty years agogether, Yeah, which is 224 00:15:18.000 --> 00:15:20.759 such a rarity most marriages don't last forty years. But I do think there's 225 00:15:20.759 --> 00:15:24.399 probably a small part of his brain that's like, yeeha, Now I finally 226 00:15:24.440 --> 00:15:30.600 get to go to the fantasy suites with these hot women who look nothing like 227 00:15:30.799 --> 00:15:33.799 my late wife, and yeah, we have a you know, we have 228 00:15:33.799 --> 00:15:37.559 a good relationship with the bachelor community, the show, the producers and all 229 00:15:37.600 --> 00:15:39.759 that. And back in the day, I pitched a version of that to 230 00:15:39.840 --> 00:15:41.279 them. I'm like, I, you should try it with an old guy, 231 00:15:41.320 --> 00:15:46.039 and they're like, nobody wants to see that. But now this is 232 00:15:46.159 --> 00:15:52.120 that was probably six seven years ago the data because dating now is an interesting 233 00:15:52.240 --> 00:15:56.039 thing to older people, and older people look better than they do. There 234 00:15:56.080 --> 00:15:58.519 are ways at sixty five to look forty five, and they're ways at eighty 235 00:15:58.559 --> 00:16:03.080 five looks sixty five. That the pool it seems like, oh my god, 236 00:16:03.320 --> 00:16:07.759 these are not geriatric people. These are people who look good and they 237 00:16:07.799 --> 00:16:10.519 seem like they should be dating and the idea of them hooking up is not 238 00:16:10.600 --> 00:16:15.039 disgusting to people and all that stuff, and so I gotta take a quick 239 00:16:15.039 --> 00:16:18.720 break. We're you know, I'm gonna pay for botox and things around here 240 00:16:18.759 --> 00:16:23.200 for us aging seniors. I with Nancy Shankar. We're talking about dating over 241 00:16:23.200 --> 00:16:27.120 fifty and a whole lot more. We will be back right after this, 242 00:16:32.799 --> 00:16:36.200 and we are back. So if somebody says to you, is it easier 243 00:16:36.240 --> 00:16:44.360 to date at sixty than twenty or is it harder? I think it's different. 244 00:16:44.519 --> 00:16:47.279 I wouldn't say easier or harder. I think you summed it up when 245 00:16:47.279 --> 00:16:49.679 you said, when you're in your twenties or thirties, you are looking for 246 00:16:49.759 --> 00:16:55.840 that happily ever after, And women's biological clocks are still kind of ticking. 247 00:16:55.879 --> 00:16:59.440 They have to decide do I want a child with a spouse. Do I 248 00:16:59.480 --> 00:17:02.840 want to have a child by myself, which is now an option. But 249 00:17:02.879 --> 00:17:07.960 there is this mortgage, marriage, mortgage kid thing that's happening in the twenties 250 00:17:07.960 --> 00:17:15.599 and thirties. When you're at my age, it should theoretically be easier because 251 00:17:15.759 --> 00:17:21.200 I'm economically independent, I have the flexibility to travel. Why would that make 252 00:17:21.200 --> 00:17:25.079 it easier. I think that makes it harder. Well, you don't have 253 00:17:25.160 --> 00:17:29.559 to have tough conversations about money, you know, when you're young and you're 254 00:17:29.720 --> 00:17:32.160 But if you're sixteen and you're broke, and he's like, I want to 255 00:17:32.160 --> 00:17:33.839 take you on a trip. You're like, yeah, I can't do that 256 00:17:33.920 --> 00:17:37.599 myself. Let's go. Like it takes the safety net away of I don't 257 00:17:37.720 --> 00:17:41.559 need him to do that gets back to the need and the want thing again, 258 00:17:41.920 --> 00:17:47.200 like if you if you can be excited by an adventure that you could 259 00:17:47.240 --> 00:17:51.279 not do on your own, I think that opens up possibilities for the man 260 00:17:51.400 --> 00:17:56.119 to get into your world. Yeah, I totally agree with that. I 261 00:17:56.160 --> 00:18:00.079 think that the apps themselves are agist. I think the fact that in most 262 00:18:00.079 --> 00:18:04.960 of the apps you're forced to report a number right off the bat. I 263 00:18:06.000 --> 00:18:08.920 don't look my age. So I just came back from a three day trade 264 00:18:08.920 --> 00:18:15.359 show in Vegas. People were talking to me left and right when even between 265 00:18:15.359 --> 00:18:21.119 the time I was sixty and now and now for the big reveal, one 266 00:18:21.200 --> 00:18:22.400 hundred and forty seven years old. Now, how are you? I'm sixty 267 00:18:22.400 --> 00:18:26.519 seven, okay, so I'm closer to seventy than I am to sixty. 268 00:18:26.799 --> 00:18:30.599 And I refused to lie about my age on the apps. And I found 269 00:18:30.680 --> 00:18:37.400 that my pool of suitors has dropped precipitously because when men set their age range, 270 00:18:37.519 --> 00:18:41.359 sadly, they still have an ord. No better, you just said 271 00:18:41.400 --> 00:18:45.240 you said it from forty eight to seventy two, So you set eighty five 272 00:18:45.400 --> 00:18:52.359 percent of the possibilities younger than you. So they're doing the same thing. 273 00:18:53.680 --> 00:19:00.400 Maybe true my motivation, my motivations are different though I work in tech and 274 00:19:00.440 --> 00:19:04.519 I still work. So what I found is when I and there are exceptions 275 00:19:04.519 --> 00:19:08.160 to every rule. If somebody who was seventy five, seventy seven, eighty 276 00:19:08.240 --> 00:19:15.400 five messaged me Alan Patrickoff, who may or may not still be single, 277 00:19:15.480 --> 00:19:19.119 is in his eighties and he just started a VC fund for Age Tech, 278 00:19:19.160 --> 00:19:22.000 and he did say that he was on bumble. I haven't been able to 279 00:19:22.000 --> 00:19:26.079 find him yet, So again I'm not going to limit myself based on a 280 00:19:26.200 --> 00:19:30.079 number on a birth certificate. But I do find that the fact that on 281 00:19:30.119 --> 00:19:36.079 the apps, that's what you're leading with as opposed to interests. And then 282 00:19:36.079 --> 00:19:38.759 in fact, last night I did matches speed dating and one of the guys 283 00:19:38.799 --> 00:19:42.319 within the first three questions he asked, said how old are you? He 284 00:19:42.359 --> 00:19:47.720 didn't say what do you like to do? Are you involved in? Do 285 00:19:47.759 --> 00:19:52.000 you still work? I think though a little bit of the asking that and 286 00:19:52.759 --> 00:20:00.799 some of the sexual nature of the early dialogue, I think they want to 287 00:20:00.799 --> 00:20:04.160 know not only does shit still work. I think they want to know is 288 00:20:04.200 --> 00:20:08.039 this something you're still interested in? Right? And that would be an appropriate 289 00:20:08.160 --> 00:20:11.839 question for me. If some and I do sometimes get that, someone will 290 00:20:11.880 --> 00:20:15.119 say is intimacy still important to you? Which is a gentlemanly way of asking. 291 00:20:18.319 --> 00:20:21.440 Yeah, I say do you yeah? You want? I see intimacy 292 00:20:21.519 --> 00:20:25.160 sounds dirty to me? I know it reminds reminds me of that scene in 293 00:20:25.400 --> 00:20:29.200 Tutsi where Jessica Lyn says to Dustin Hoffman, I wish a man would come 294 00:20:29.240 --> 00:20:32.000 up to me at a party and say blah blah blah. And he goes 295 00:20:32.039 --> 00:20:34.200 up to her and he says it and she immediately slaps him across the face. 296 00:20:34.319 --> 00:20:37.119 Right. So I think it's a hard question to ask. It is 297 00:20:37.160 --> 00:20:41.680 because some people want to be want to get asked very pg. Thirteen, 298 00:20:41.720 --> 00:20:45.640 and some people want the X version that. Maybe my next infographic is, 299 00:20:45.720 --> 00:20:51.680 yeah, ten ways to ask if somebody is is sexually interested? I'll say 300 00:20:51.680 --> 00:20:55.319 that or it does it still work? Yeah? I think that's tough. 301 00:20:55.440 --> 00:21:00.559 A lot of these guys want companionship, which is a lot times why they 302 00:21:00.599 --> 00:21:03.200 go younger. A lot of times the way they go younger is the girl 303 00:21:03.720 --> 00:21:07.279 sex is not even on the table for her with him, which is almost 304 00:21:07.279 --> 00:21:10.680 a relief because he can't do it anyway, so he'd rather just be around 305 00:21:10.720 --> 00:21:15.319 the pretty thing. You know. The women at sixty they probably want to 306 00:21:15.319 --> 00:21:18.839 get laid, you know, and so he feels like it might work once 307 00:21:18.880 --> 00:21:22.960 in a while. You know. You know what's the Toby Keith song, 308 00:21:23.480 --> 00:21:26.599 not as good as I once was, as good once as I ever was. 309 00:21:26.759 --> 00:21:30.359 Yeah, I mean one of the one of the lines. And you 310 00:21:30.400 --> 00:21:34.119 know when I give dispense dating advice is ready to date medicate, like if 311 00:21:34.160 --> 00:21:37.680 in doubt, you know, if you think it's not going to work, 312 00:21:37.799 --> 00:21:41.759 then get it and you still have a desire to be intimate again using that 313 00:21:41.759 --> 00:21:45.319 that word that's up there with like moist an ointment because it does just sound 314 00:21:45.359 --> 00:21:49.240 like an icky words. Well, I've been I've been shocked. I always 315 00:21:49.279 --> 00:21:53.519 say to the women, I'm like, if a guy had to use viagraph 316 00:21:53.599 --> 00:21:56.720 for me, I would be so offended. Most women are like, I 317 00:21:56.720 --> 00:22:00.000 don't give a shit what he has to that's his problem. Yeah, they're 318 00:22:00.000 --> 00:22:02.920 like I don't know. They're like we don't care. I don't care. 319 00:22:03.119 --> 00:22:04.680 I know I would care, that's my ego. Women are like I don't 320 00:22:04.680 --> 00:22:10.440 fucking care. Who cares A ready, I heard that men are starting to 321 00:22:10.480 --> 00:22:14.319 take drugs as early as like forty forty five. Oh no, they're starting 322 00:22:14.359 --> 00:22:15.920 to take them as early as twenty and twenty five. They take it recreationally, 323 00:22:15.920 --> 00:22:18.880 so by the time they get to forty and forty five, the body's 324 00:22:18.920 --> 00:22:22.079 dependent on it and it's all messed up. You know. It's like the 325 00:22:22.079 --> 00:22:26.200 people who took the adderall recreationally, like now they're all screwed up. And 326 00:22:26.559 --> 00:22:30.680 yeah, same thing. So that has though, brought a generation of daters 327 00:22:30.720 --> 00:22:34.759 back who previously probably would have to drop out at sixty something, I guess. 328 00:22:37.200 --> 00:22:41.599 And so then it is more on the table, which has shifted the 329 00:22:41.680 --> 00:22:44.640 dating thing too, that this is going to be a you know, I 330 00:22:44.680 --> 00:22:48.119 remember my grandmother got a boyfriend at like eighty eight. I didn't think they 331 00:22:48.119 --> 00:22:52.000 were having sex, but they wanted to spend time together. And the one 332 00:22:52.160 --> 00:22:55.599 not to gross you out, but they might might have been Yeah, you 333 00:22:55.680 --> 00:22:59.920 rest in peace, Grandma, Jesus. I know the you know, the 334 00:23:00.000 --> 00:23:04.200 the old line about the biggest population of sexually transmitted diseases is like over seventy 335 00:23:04.240 --> 00:23:10.799 in Florida. They're carrying around ship from the war and Sun City I last. 336 00:23:11.000 --> 00:23:14.519 But also they're not worried about getting pregnant, and they're not worried about 337 00:23:14.559 --> 00:23:18.279 anything. So it's really just a I think the age of over sixty means. 338 00:23:18.359 --> 00:23:22.119 And a good side of it is we are just having fun here and 339 00:23:22.160 --> 00:23:26.319 we really want to share the best parts of our existence with you, and 340 00:23:26.359 --> 00:23:29.000 we really are. And the pressures and the stresses and are we going to 341 00:23:29.079 --> 00:23:30.519 do this? And how a we're going to save for college and are gone, 342 00:23:30.720 --> 00:23:36.039 which should be liberating. And if you're liberated from the bad stuff and 343 00:23:36.039 --> 00:23:37.359 you could just focus on the good, I think that's a good way to 344 00:23:37.480 --> 00:23:41.440 date. I totally agree with you, Brian. And you know, I've 345 00:23:41.559 --> 00:23:48.279 also just encountered a lot of sad men, you know, because they are 346 00:23:48.319 --> 00:23:53.279 depressed about getting older. They're confused because maybe their wife was the one who 347 00:23:53.319 --> 00:23:56.880 asked for the divorce. You know. I get a lot of that. 348 00:23:56.039 --> 00:24:00.160 I think I give off like a therapist vibe. And I've been at with 349 00:24:00.240 --> 00:24:07.039 men who then spend twenty minutes telling me about how their wife dropped them and 350 00:24:07.079 --> 00:24:10.319 how they're kind of lost and they don't know what to do and they don't 351 00:24:10.359 --> 00:24:11.640 process it and they don't deal with it, and they don't have a circle 352 00:24:11.680 --> 00:24:15.880 of the women are usually like, fuck him, let's go out, we're 353 00:24:15.880 --> 00:24:18.599 gonna have fun. And the guys that aren't doing that, and so he's 354 00:24:18.680 --> 00:24:22.240 left to process this and the kids everyone wanted, Like you ever hear from 355 00:24:22.240 --> 00:24:26.319 mom like it's awful, like But there's a lot of men sad who, 356 00:24:26.480 --> 00:24:30.519 like I said earlier, completely had their confidence shattered because she woke up one 357 00:24:30.559 --> 00:24:33.079 day and she's like, this isn't for me. I have fifty years to 358 00:24:33.119 --> 00:24:36.519 go. The kids are going on in a new life and it doesn't involve 359 00:24:36.519 --> 00:24:38.839 you. That is a pretty common thing now. I don't understand why he 360 00:24:38.880 --> 00:24:41.920 can't take that opportunity then and been like, you know what, I was 361 00:24:41.960 --> 00:24:45.839 in this at least from her perspective, relative of an unhappy situation, and 362 00:24:45.920 --> 00:24:49.559 I'm going to make a new life for myself. They don't do that as 363 00:24:49.640 --> 00:24:52.680 much the men. No, they don't, And I think women, you 364 00:24:52.680 --> 00:24:56.880 know, are just used to because of the way we live, are used 365 00:24:56.880 --> 00:25:00.720 to reinvention. We change our hairstyles, we if we have kids, we 366 00:25:00.799 --> 00:25:04.920 have to go through this stage where we go from single woman to married woman 367 00:25:06.039 --> 00:25:11.799 to mother to housekeeper, so we're kind of used to flexing and bobbing and 368 00:25:11.839 --> 00:25:15.079 weaving, whereas a lot of men have been the providers, especially men of 369 00:25:15.079 --> 00:25:22.480 a certain generation. I meet a lot of men around my age who have 370 00:25:22.680 --> 00:25:26.799 never really been with a woman who worked before their woman was home. Their 371 00:25:26.799 --> 00:25:30.720 wife was their woman, their wife was home taking care of And you know, 372 00:25:30.880 --> 00:25:34.680 there is something to be said for that lifestyle. It was much simpler. 373 00:25:34.720 --> 00:25:37.319 It was everybody knew what their roles were. Yeah, and a lot 374 00:25:37.319 --> 00:25:41.160 of women say this, and they're right to say this, that men tend 375 00:25:41.160 --> 00:25:44.240 to get stuck in their ways. I don't believe though, that that as 376 00:25:44.279 --> 00:25:47.720 a permanent stuck. I think the right woman, with the right message and 377 00:25:47.759 --> 00:25:52.039 the right proposition can get us to change anything at any age. And a 378 00:25:52.079 --> 00:25:55.079 lot of time the women are like, I don't want to have to change 379 00:25:55.119 --> 00:25:56.160 him. Is too much work. He's not going to be open to it. 380 00:25:56.319 --> 00:26:00.640 But if you present him with a scenario like this was you up till 381 00:26:00.680 --> 00:26:03.559 age sixty, and now I'm going to take you in a different world, 382 00:26:03.720 --> 00:26:06.839 I think there are men that are open to that. If you sort of 383 00:26:06.960 --> 00:26:08.599 shake the snow globe up there, I totally agree. And if any of 384 00:26:08.680 --> 00:26:11.960 you are listening. I'm still single, so you know we're gonna follow me 385 00:26:12.279 --> 00:26:18.279 twelve thirty. But yeah, I think that when you said, you know 386 00:26:18.519 --> 00:26:22.680 that we don't necessarily want to be a nurse or a purse ort to be 387 00:26:22.160 --> 00:26:27.079 a fixer. You know, I'm not looking to fix somebody who's deeply, 388 00:26:27.200 --> 00:26:33.039 deeply damaged or bitter. But if somebody has at least the training wheels and 389 00:26:33.160 --> 00:26:37.279 says, yeah, what I was doing before isn't working for me, I'm 390 00:26:37.359 --> 00:26:40.720 open to going to Sicily. You could tell I'm like obsessed with Sicily. 391 00:26:41.960 --> 00:26:45.519 Also, I've never been to a concert that starts at nine o'clock. I'm 392 00:26:45.640 --> 00:26:48.079 there, like, no, I've never eaten a gummy, But if I 393 00:26:48.119 --> 00:26:51.799 can, I want to go to concerts in a place like Santa Barbara where 394 00:26:51.799 --> 00:26:55.240 they have a hard curfew of like NPM because of the neighbors and so there's 395 00:26:55.279 --> 00:26:57.640 no chance it's going late. They literally pull the plug on it. I'm 396 00:26:57.680 --> 00:27:00.519 like, take me to that concert, give me there. But I agree 397 00:27:00.559 --> 00:27:04.359 with you. Now, would you or have you run across guys that are 398 00:27:04.680 --> 00:27:08.559 sixty two or whatever and have never been married? Yes, and I am 399 00:27:08.680 --> 00:27:12.480 probably in that. I think at the beginning of my dating journey, I 400 00:27:12.599 --> 00:27:17.079 was more of a hard liner about men who've never been married or never had 401 00:27:17.200 --> 00:27:21.519 kids. And in fact, I'll do a little pre selling here, Brian, 402 00:27:21.559 --> 00:27:25.440 You're going to be a guest on my podcast for a segment called what 403 00:27:25.559 --> 00:27:27.279 the hell is wrong with You? Yeah, I've never been married and I've 404 00:27:27.279 --> 00:27:30.119 never had kids, and I think there is something wrong with me or has 405 00:27:30.200 --> 00:27:33.240 been not. Now now I'm fine, but I think that the woman or 406 00:27:33.319 --> 00:27:38.640 the man, if you get over forty five and you have not been married, 407 00:27:40.480 --> 00:27:44.759 I think the other person has every right to want to know why. 408 00:27:45.160 --> 00:27:48.920 And the why is not I was too busy, I haven't found the right 409 00:27:48.960 --> 00:27:52.160 person yet. I think that's bullshit. I think either you were not capable, 410 00:27:52.240 --> 00:27:56.119 not emotionally vulnerable, didn't do the work, or you did not recognize 411 00:27:56.160 --> 00:27:57.960 the person that were. I think there really is, and I was in 412 00:27:59.039 --> 00:28:02.960 that category for a long time of somebody who was just not capable. So 413 00:28:03.079 --> 00:28:06.440 if somebody said to me, oh, I've never been married, I'm fifty 414 00:28:06.440 --> 00:28:08.359 eight years old, I would think it's a giant red flag, even though 415 00:28:08.599 --> 00:28:11.599 I'm not fifty eight. But I would have had that too, Like I 416 00:28:11.799 --> 00:28:15.279 think that you have a right to ask. So if somebody's on there and 417 00:28:15.359 --> 00:28:17.240 you just say like, how can we in every marry and they give some 418 00:28:17.319 --> 00:28:19.279 flipping answer like I would be like, it's only four o'clock. Yeah, 419 00:28:19.680 --> 00:28:23.359 you know, I think you want to know if they've done the work and 420 00:28:23.519 --> 00:28:27.799 have a real answer exactly. I totally totally agree. And even though I've 421 00:28:27.880 --> 00:28:33.640 only been single for three years since I got out of my last relationship, 422 00:28:33.720 --> 00:28:37.119 welcome back, well, thank you. People will say to me, why 423 00:28:37.240 --> 00:28:41.319 haven't you been scooped up already, as if I'm rocky road rather than a 424 00:28:41.440 --> 00:28:44.240 human being, and I say, well, I don't. My goal is 425 00:28:44.279 --> 00:28:45.960 not to be scooped up. But that's a compliment. They don't ask that 426 00:28:47.039 --> 00:28:49.240 to people who shouldn't be scooped up. They know why you're not scooped up. 427 00:28:49.480 --> 00:28:52.880 So if somebody says that or they say why are you still single? 428 00:28:52.599 --> 00:28:55.559 And then we get an argument about this on this show all the time, 429 00:28:56.000 --> 00:28:59.519 it's a huge compliment. They do not ask that to people who are unappealing, 430 00:28:59.759 --> 00:29:02.599 because you know why that person is still single. This is true, 431 00:29:02.640 --> 00:29:04.880 and you just hit on at Brian. The real question is, you know, 432 00:29:06.000 --> 00:29:07.319 if you're going to ask the question, why are you still single. 433 00:29:07.640 --> 00:29:12.079 The implication shouldn't be you must be flawed in some way. It should be 434 00:29:12.240 --> 00:29:17.920 what ho And again, this is a psychology major in me talking, because 435 00:29:17.960 --> 00:29:22.359 I could have just as easily been single at sixty seven. I just got 436 00:29:22.440 --> 00:29:25.680 to a point in my life where I really wanted kids in a family, 437 00:29:25.759 --> 00:29:29.240 and I loved my ex husband, and my friends were all starting to couple 438 00:29:29.359 --> 00:29:33.200 up. But if I hadn't met him, there's probably a better than even 439 00:29:33.319 --> 00:29:36.720 chance that I would still be single, right, because you know, I'm 440 00:29:36.720 --> 00:29:38.559 not sure somebody getting married at twenty two for a year and a half makes 441 00:29:38.680 --> 00:29:41.799 any difference in their life at fifty two. You know, I'm like, 442 00:29:42.000 --> 00:29:45.480 so that was then, Like, I don't think anything anybody does in their 443 00:29:45.480 --> 00:29:51.440 twenties and thirties has much relevance at all in terms of doing the work, 444 00:29:51.839 --> 00:29:55.319 in terms of things like kids, in finance and something. Because a lot 445 00:29:55.319 --> 00:29:57.400 of women I thought, like, oh, but when you're rather day to 446 00:29:57.480 --> 00:30:00.279 dad because they have some sense of sponsibility or whatever, And a lot of 447 00:30:00.319 --> 00:30:03.480 women are like, no, they're fucking worse, or they could be in 448 00:30:03.519 --> 00:30:07.440 a responsible pair, could be responsible, or you want to be a There's 449 00:30:07.480 --> 00:30:11.440 a lot of people on both sides of it that are people are like, 450 00:30:11.559 --> 00:30:14.839 don't use sides when you talk about men and women. I mean, have 451 00:30:14.920 --> 00:30:22.960 you seen our logo that they were locked in this mom dad phase for twenty 452 00:30:23.079 --> 00:30:27.799 years and then once they divorce or whatever the reason is why they separate, 453 00:30:29.279 --> 00:30:33.759 they turned back into whatever they were when they went into prison, so to 454 00:30:33.839 --> 00:30:37.559 speak, Like they basically like, Okay, I'm twenty three again and she's 455 00:30:37.640 --> 00:30:41.960 running out and getting a terrible tattoo, and he's out there, you know, 456 00:30:41.440 --> 00:30:45.680 hitting a waitresses and the whole thing goes bad. I don't think somebody 457 00:30:45.720 --> 00:30:51.319 who hasn't been married goes through that because they're just normal. Yeah. And 458 00:30:51.400 --> 00:30:53.039 as I said, you know, as long as to me, the most 459 00:30:53.119 --> 00:30:56.519 important question and I wouldn't ask it on a first date necessarily, but like 460 00:30:56.640 --> 00:31:03.440 maybe third date or beyond and is And you hit the nail on the head 461 00:31:03.480 --> 00:31:07.200 when you said, you know, have you done the work? Like have 462 00:31:07.359 --> 00:31:11.039 you looked internally? So when people ask me why, you know, whether 463 00:31:11.079 --> 00:31:15.839 I take responsibility for my divorce, I say, yeah, I take fifty 464 00:31:15.920 --> 00:31:18.440 percent responsibility and they'll say, well, you should only take forty nine, 465 00:31:18.559 --> 00:31:22.440 as if there's like some prize that I would get but I think that you 466 00:31:22.519 --> 00:31:26.400 know, in the ten years that I've been single again or not married, 467 00:31:27.640 --> 00:31:33.960 I really have done more work on myself than I did the entire you know, 468 00:31:33.279 --> 00:31:37.319 first three quarters of You're right. I think that's a very very valuable 469 00:31:37.400 --> 00:31:41.200 question. Not for the first date. The most important question you can ask 470 00:31:41.279 --> 00:31:45.799 on a first date is would you like to see a dessert menu? That's 471 00:31:45.880 --> 00:31:51.559 it. And then every the harder stuff goes when a little bit of the 472 00:31:51.640 --> 00:31:53.440 walls have come down and you're like, I really want to get to know 473 00:31:53.680 --> 00:31:56.759 you beyond this, like what have you work? Like? How are you 474 00:31:56.880 --> 00:32:00.720 different now than ten years ago? Good or bad? Like? I don't 475 00:32:00.720 --> 00:32:02.680 think anybody's going to be opposed to that question. And if they have an 476 00:32:02.720 --> 00:32:06.559 answer kind of ready to go, I could tell they've done the work. 477 00:32:06.799 --> 00:32:09.200 And if they don't know, they haven't done anywhere. Or if they say, 478 00:32:09.880 --> 00:32:15.599 my spouse started drinking, And then my follow up question is always when 479 00:32:15.680 --> 00:32:20.160 did they start drinking? Why did they start drinking? Did you drink together? 480 00:32:20.319 --> 00:32:22.039 Yeah? And if they don't know the answer to that question, that 481 00:32:22.240 --> 00:32:27.640 to me is a pink flag. Is it hard to date somebody who has 482 00:32:27.799 --> 00:32:31.400 been was married for a long long time? Whether they got divorced or widowed 483 00:32:31.480 --> 00:32:36.039 or widow or it was like, I was married for forty three years and 484 00:32:36.119 --> 00:32:39.119 now I'm back out there. You know, that seems like somebody really has 485 00:32:39.200 --> 00:32:44.759 not been in a lot of social dynamic situations. Maybe, but I don't 486 00:32:44.759 --> 00:32:46.160 know. People been married forty three years and they lead separate lives. So 487 00:32:46.279 --> 00:32:49.559 I don't think you can judge that either. Yeah, I mean you can. 488 00:32:49.680 --> 00:32:54.640 I can usually tell pretty early on if someone was married for a long 489 00:32:54.720 --> 00:33:00.240 time and then divorced. You know, there's usually a conversation about what point 490 00:33:00.279 --> 00:33:05.640 did the marriage And I hate using judgmental words like the marriage fell apart, 491 00:33:05.799 --> 00:33:08.559 the marriage failed. I just say, you know, you parted ways. 492 00:33:08.640 --> 00:33:13.079 Here's here's the question that you should ask. And I asked this, and 493 00:33:13.079 --> 00:33:15.160 we asked people on this podcast a lot too. When they're divorced. It's 494 00:33:15.200 --> 00:33:19.039 not why did you get divorced? Is when did you know it wasn't going 495 00:33:19.119 --> 00:33:24.119 to be forever? And so many people say when he asked me the wedding 496 00:33:24.240 --> 00:33:27.240 day, and I'm like, well, you were married twenty three years, 497 00:33:27.640 --> 00:33:30.240 and they're like, well, we had kids, And I'm doing the math 498 00:33:30.359 --> 00:33:31.480 in my head all the time. I got four more years, I got 499 00:33:31.480 --> 00:33:35.880 six more years or whatever. Back to me, just sounds awful, but 500 00:33:35.960 --> 00:33:39.359 it's also normal. Lots of people are like, when the youngest is eighteen, 501 00:33:39.519 --> 00:33:44.920 we're going to get divorced. Because keep this in mind, Brian marriage 502 00:33:44.960 --> 00:33:51.119 is an institution that was invented when people got married at seventeen. They married 503 00:33:51.200 --> 00:33:53.759 somebody in their town and then farmed for ten years. They had a bunch 504 00:33:53.799 --> 00:33:57.960 of kids, and then somebody got the plague and it was over. And 505 00:33:58.160 --> 00:34:01.799 so if plane went down fifty percent of the time or seventy percent of the 506 00:34:01.839 --> 00:34:07.239 time, you would never fly anywhere. But marriage as an institution now has 507 00:34:07.320 --> 00:34:10.920 a fail rate of, depending on what city you're living in, between fifty 508 00:34:12.039 --> 00:34:15.800 and seventy percent. So nobody, I mean, people are trying, doesn't 509 00:34:15.920 --> 00:34:19.760 That doesn't even include the people who should be divorced and stay together unhappily exactly. 510 00:34:19.880 --> 00:34:24.440 And so now people are creating these alternative lifestyles like open marriages, polyamory, 511 00:34:24.960 --> 00:34:28.840 and I'm not judging, I'm just saying they're all of these options out 512 00:34:28.880 --> 00:34:32.519 there now, but you know, nobody's really yet having the conversation you have 513 00:34:32.719 --> 00:34:37.800 two girlfriends is because you don't have one does that make sense, because if 514 00:34:37.840 --> 00:34:40.239 you like the first one enough, you wouldn't need the second one. I 515 00:34:40.360 --> 00:34:44.599 have never heard of guys say that before, but thank you for that, 516 00:34:44.800 --> 00:34:49.599 bro that warms my cockles. Well, I think that if you love the 517 00:34:49.719 --> 00:34:53.239 first one, you don't need the second one. Or men will say I'm 518 00:34:53.320 --> 00:34:58.800 confused, I have stuff I'm still working out to which my response Mormon and 519 00:34:58.920 --> 00:35:01.360 have four wives. Yeah, work it out, but just not with me, 520 00:35:01.760 --> 00:35:04.599 like I don't want to be. I went on a date with a 521 00:35:04.639 --> 00:35:07.960 guy who was an open relationship. I did it mainly out of curiosity. 522 00:35:07.440 --> 00:35:10.199 He had a wife of thirty three years, he had a girlfriend he saw 523 00:35:10.239 --> 00:35:14.119 on Tuesdays. And I said, well, what am I like? The 524 00:35:14.199 --> 00:35:16.760 out of town hook up? And he said, well, that's very pejorative. 525 00:35:16.840 --> 00:35:19.239 I said, well, what is it? Do I get a T 526 00:35:19.400 --> 00:35:21.760 shirt? Do I get a prize? Like? But you just said you 527 00:35:21.840 --> 00:35:23.599 might be open to something like that this occasional, you know, isn't that 528 00:35:23.639 --> 00:35:27.639 sort of same? I'll just be the Thursday night person. No, because 529 00:35:27.719 --> 00:35:31.119 I would like to ideally be in a relationship that just because it's a long 530 00:35:31.239 --> 00:35:37.119 distance doesn't mean that in between we're seeing other people. Oh yeah, that's 531 00:35:37.159 --> 00:35:39.400 odd. Details. Yeah, So I do think it's possible to have a 532 00:35:39.480 --> 00:35:44.880 monogamous long distance relationship, and it's a little easier at sixty because you don't 533 00:35:44.880 --> 00:35:46.199 have to do it for sixty years. You could do like you doing it 534 00:35:46.239 --> 00:35:51.039 for like twenty five, you're doing less time maybe exactly, and also being 535 00:35:51.119 --> 00:35:53.519 respectful of the other person. Like there are things that I like to do 536 00:35:53.800 --> 00:35:59.519 that I do do with my girlfriends that I wouldn't necessarily expect the man in 537 00:35:59.599 --> 00:36:01.760 my life to come along for that, Like if I want to watch reality 538 00:36:01.880 --> 00:36:07.679 TV on Tuesday nights, you know, I'm fine doing that alone. I 539 00:36:07.760 --> 00:36:09.920 don't have to do it with a companion. So I think there's also this 540 00:36:12.000 --> 00:36:15.639 thing that we've been raised with, especially as women, that you're going to 541 00:36:15.719 --> 00:36:20.320 In fact, that's my first dating blog was the BGS let us astray because 542 00:36:20.360 --> 00:36:22.239 they said, I just want to be your everything, and nobody could be 543 00:36:22.320 --> 00:36:27.719 your everything. You've got to have a little entourage around you. Is a 544 00:36:28.599 --> 00:36:35.119 sixty five year old fast to introduce a date to their kids or grandkids than 545 00:36:35.159 --> 00:36:38.079 a forty five year old. It really depends on the person. You know. 546 00:36:38.199 --> 00:36:42.880 I have friends who are in their forties who really wait until they're sure 547 00:36:43.000 --> 00:36:47.320 something is serious before they bring a significant other around. My kids, even 548 00:36:47.360 --> 00:36:52.559 though I'm they're grown and I'm grown, have only met one person that I 549 00:36:52.679 --> 00:36:55.960 was seeing in ten years, because I think they think it would be cool, 550 00:36:57.039 --> 00:36:59.119 like, oh, look, Grandma's eighty two, she's dating. Like 551 00:36:59.239 --> 00:37:04.320 I think it would be more positive that they're finding at least some degree of 552 00:37:05.000 --> 00:37:07.400 happiness or pleasure. Yeah, my kids know that I'm dating. I think 553 00:37:07.440 --> 00:37:09.920 they probably are thinking what's wrong? What the hell is wrong with her? 554 00:37:10.079 --> 00:37:15.280 She's been single for three years and can't seem to you settle on somebody. 555 00:37:15.440 --> 00:37:19.639 But you know, at this stage of my life, I'd rather do it 556 00:37:19.840 --> 00:37:22.760 right, even if it's for six months or a year. I would rather 557 00:37:22.840 --> 00:37:27.320 have six great months or a year. Like I don't think it's you know, 558 00:37:27.880 --> 00:37:30.760 anything is forever. And as you just pointed out so so optimistically, 559 00:37:31.199 --> 00:37:34.719 it could be like I could drop dead as soon as we're done with this 560 00:37:34.840 --> 00:37:37.239 podcast, play play as my mother would say, we all could. All 561 00:37:37.320 --> 00:37:39.119 right, I'm gonna let you plug whatever you want to plug, but in 562 00:37:39.159 --> 00:37:43.280 the interest of time, this is your first time on this podcast. We 563 00:37:43.480 --> 00:37:46.519 play something called worst date or first date, which means you have to give 564 00:37:46.559 --> 00:37:51.880 us either the absolute worst date you ever went on or the greatest first date 565 00:37:51.920 --> 00:37:58.360 you went on, your choice. Oooh, probably the worst date, just 566 00:37:58.519 --> 00:38:01.119 because it was a major, major your time and energy suck. As I 567 00:38:01.320 --> 00:38:07.280 drove about an hour to meet somebody to discover that he was twenty years older 568 00:38:07.440 --> 00:38:12.800 than the age he had reported on his profile, and I didn't want to. 569 00:38:13.320 --> 00:38:15.840 I mean, if it had been five minutes away, the date would 570 00:38:15.840 --> 00:38:20.920 have lasted fifteen minutes and I would have left. But instead, because I 571 00:38:21.039 --> 00:38:25.079 felt sorry for him, I stayed the entire hour, had dinner with him, 572 00:38:25.239 --> 00:38:30.000 listened to him talk about the good old days, and well, but 573 00:38:30.079 --> 00:38:31.760 if you knew how old he was, would you have gone that far? 574 00:38:32.159 --> 00:38:36.639 You wouldn't have gone. He basically had to lie on his resume to get 575 00:38:36.639 --> 00:38:38.679 the job interview, and he lied by a lot, you know if somebody 576 00:38:38.840 --> 00:38:42.360 lies, Yeah, by like did he admit when you confronted him? Like? 577 00:38:42.400 --> 00:38:44.920 What did he say? Like I wanted you to come, you wouldn't 578 00:38:44.920 --> 00:38:46.519 have come? Like how did he get out of that it's twenties a lot? 579 00:38:46.719 --> 00:38:50.960 Like what did he say when I when I realized how old he was? 580 00:38:51.239 --> 00:38:54.119 Yeah? Did you confront him or You're just like, this guy's lying 581 00:38:54.119 --> 00:38:57.639 about his age and didn't bring it up. Yeah, I didn't confront him. 582 00:38:57.760 --> 00:39:00.760 I mean, well, maybe he just looked bad or was he like 583 00:39:01.119 --> 00:39:07.800 back in the twenties issues. Yeah, he was talking about like back in 584 00:39:07.880 --> 00:39:12.679 the nineteen forties. I got out of the war, the big one, 585 00:39:13.559 --> 00:39:15.760 and it really becomes more of a you know, in that Ven diagram of 586 00:39:15.840 --> 00:39:19.880 relationships, which is a phrase I use a lot. You just have to 587 00:39:19.960 --> 00:39:22.599 have enough in the magic middle. You know, the age is almost secondary. 588 00:39:22.679 --> 00:39:25.800 If somebody's interested in the same stuff that I'm interested in, they can 589 00:39:25.880 --> 00:39:30.039 match my energy level or come close. They have the same sense of humor. 590 00:39:30.440 --> 00:39:36.000 The age almost becomes irrelevant the magic middle. I like that. That's 591 00:39:36.039 --> 00:39:37.320 good. All right, Plug whatever you want to plug. All right. 592 00:39:37.400 --> 00:39:44.639 So my podcast is officially launching on October seventh, which is Ageism Awareness Day. 593 00:39:45.119 --> 00:39:47.559 As Brian said, the title of it is The Geezer Proofer How to 594 00:39:47.639 --> 00:39:52.960 be a Badass after fifty And what I'm trying to do is combat all of 595 00:39:52.039 --> 00:39:58.320 the women's comedy and women's rhetoric out there that aging is a bad thing and 596 00:39:58.400 --> 00:40:02.599 that we have to have our boobs lifted and our faces botoxed and I've had 597 00:40:02.840 --> 00:40:07.360 no work done. I'm sixty seven. I plan to live another thirty years 598 00:40:07.480 --> 00:40:09.559 minimum till I hit one hundred. My mother, God bless her, was 599 00:40:09.960 --> 00:40:14.840 ninety five when she died. My grandmother was ninety nine, So the statistics 600 00:40:14.880 --> 00:40:17.960 are on my side. And I really want to create a spirit of positive 601 00:40:19.519 --> 00:40:23.760 and fun aging so that young women don't dread getting older. But I am 602 00:40:23.800 --> 00:40:30.159 also going to address some of the serious issues around agesm and employment, perceptions 603 00:40:30.199 --> 00:40:34.920 of older people. So it's going to be everything aging, sex, tech, 604 00:40:35.519 --> 00:40:39.119 and lifestyle. You know, that's the fine line that's going on as 605 00:40:39.159 --> 00:40:43.400 we record this, and you might be listening in twenty twenty seven and who 606 00:40:43.440 --> 00:40:46.000 knows what happened. But you know, the Joe Biden issue, is it 607 00:40:46.079 --> 00:40:51.480 the age or is it the you know, mental faculty or like you're kind 608 00:40:51.519 --> 00:40:53.239 of because I don't ever want to draw because they're like, nobody should run 609 00:40:53.320 --> 00:40:55.639 for office if they're this age. I don't think you can ever be hard 610 00:40:55.719 --> 00:41:00.159 and fast on that or make the rules or laws around that, because who 611 00:41:00.239 --> 00:41:02.559 knows, there's always exceptions. There's people that are sixty one and they see 612 00:41:02.800 --> 00:41:06.960 a thousand. Yeah, and I just listened to Mick Jagger's new single, 613 00:41:07.440 --> 00:41:09.719 and nobody was he shouldn't be recording views that. That's a very good point. 614 00:41:09.760 --> 00:41:15.559 Mick Jagger would be a fine British prime minister. That's good. This 615 00:41:15.840 --> 00:41:19.559 is fun. It was all right. Go out and go date. As 616 00:41:19.599 --> 00:41:22.360 far as us like, share, follow, please review this podcast. Your 617 00:41:22.360 --> 00:41:25.280 reviews to this day mean a lot in the podcasting ecosystem. Shoot us in 618 00:41:25.400 --> 00:41:29.000 email. Great Love Debate at gmail dot com. If you've got thoughts, 619 00:41:29.159 --> 00:41:31.480 questions, or you want to date somebody in their late eighties, we'll pass 620 00:41:31.519 --> 00:41:36.000 it along. We'll match it up for you the Magic Middle. Go to 621 00:41:36.039 --> 00:41:39.039 Great Love Debate dot com. I believe there are some live shows on again. 622 00:41:39.320 --> 00:41:42.119 Every time I say this, I'm like, oh, I don't, 623 00:41:42.280 --> 00:41:45.800 don't go back on the road again. But people are calling from fancy venues 624 00:41:45.840 --> 00:41:47.960 around the country. We're probably doing a show at Citywinery, New York, 625 00:41:49.000 --> 00:41:51.119 and that may or may not be on sale by the time you do this. 626 00:41:52.360 --> 00:41:55.559 Betwime, you listen to this because, as always at the Great Love 627 00:41:55.679 --> 00:42:04.960 Debate, we never stop making love. See you next time, the Greatest 628 00:42:05.119 --> 00:42:12.000 Love Debate. It's the Greatest Love Debate, The Greatest Love Debate it's the 629 00:42:12.119 --> 00:42:13.360 greatest love debate.