What is a fellow thermonuclear a efforts. I am Dana Valley dropping another NBA
team look ahead for twenty two twenty three, we are onto the Boston Celtics,
which means if you listen to this podcast before you know that, I'm
gonna talk to Alex Kungu, fantastic NBA follow Follow him on Twitter at Kungu
Underscore NBA. That's at k U n g U Underscore NBA. He does
a great job talking and covering not just the Celtics but the entire league.
He's very insightful when he does decide to post his takes on Twitter, so
I appreciate him always taking the time to speak with me. One of my
many questions for this podcast, though, Alex, and the most important one,
how the heck are you doing doing well? Man? Doing well?
Can't complain, I'll circumstances the side. It's been good to have two preseason
games against the Hornets, I'll say that, yeah, to shave more of
those games will come against that we'll come against. So I think the place
to start is just do you have any thoughts that you wanted to convey about
the Yoka suspension situation? And then the decision to name Joe Mazul as the
interim head coach. H yeah, I mean it was obviously, like everyone
else, was pretty crazy to just see that kind of just build like a
week before the preseason. I think this year is probably not the year it's
gonna in affect him. Really, It'll be next year to see what you
do what you DOOKA staff is gonna work, Yoka staff is gonna go.
I know, guys like Damons Dodomar, Ben Sullivan, Aaron Miles, Tony
Dobbins all have very high ranks around the league. Brad immediately came out and
hired Joe Mazula, who who just mentioned who was you know, the one
the one member from his coaching staff that that remains he stayed there. You
don't go hide a whole new team now, you don't gone. And Brad
put appoints him as a coach. So I don't know what that means for
the rest of the assistance and they'll stay. But I think those contributions next
to and stuff like that, I think that's where we'll really start to see
the impact because right now there's still a lot of familiarity in the coaching staff.
Place. But as as as for Judoka, you know, I don't
know. I don't know, Like like everyone else, we don't know.
So just hoping that the people that were affected by that are in a better
place. And it's already to really say about it. Yeah, that is
all you can say. And we actually rescheduled this because we we're gonna record
like the day after that the suspension came down, and it was I think
he only takes to really because we still don't know the full details, and
I don't know that we shouldn't because that involves giving people's names out, and
as we saw, speculation on Twitter is already bad when we don't know who
it is. I can't imagine that the female employee involved she faced more harassment.
But so there was just the responsive there was irresponsible reporting in the way
that things were framed as well, went from you know, the power dynamic
was potential, power dynamic was ignored to it was consensual to allegedly consensual.
So that stuff is tough to grapple. And I think the one thing that
you can maybe analyze is it feels like the Celtics don't or don't expect,
don't want him or don't expect him to come back. How do you suspend
someone for a year and just think this is going to blow over? And
then there's the reporting that they support other teams that want to inquire about him.
Feels very much like we don't expect this guy to be back, but
we're trying to figure out if we have grounds to fire him just yet.
Yeah, that's my doubt that that's mine. This would take too just to
not fire him, but then to still be leaking out. I think even
Wilds reported that they were open to teams who wanted to maybe interview him or
get more information about it. So if you're doing stuff like that, you
know that's a guy that you plan on keeping. And so I agree with
you on the continuity, I guess just only does it become something that is
a distraction just in general, becomes a bigger storyline sometime there is actual basketball,
lots of basketball questions to talk about with this team, and I'd be
remissed though if I didn't ask you since we haven't spoken. Is there just
sort of any arcing themes concerned sentiments you have from their finals loss to the
Warriors that are sticking with you entering the regular season this year, I would
say just a general feeling of like it takes it's very hard yet to the
final it's a lot of still has to go your way and you don't know
if you're ever going to be back. So it's it's more of that feeling.
But I do feel like, you know, the way the season progressed
and how they played, it did look like they just ran out of gas
at the end, and that's understandable. I mean, in large part of
it was their fault for you know, sucking for sixty percent of the regular
season and then having to go as hard as they had to go to get
to that seating. So that's when you send the something that they can learn
and take from. But you know, there's no promise out that we get
back, and that's probably like the hardest point. It's like, you had
a really great run, you beat a lot of very hard teams that I
don't know if you could, if anyone could repeat that again. So you
know, things have to go your way and maybe they don't go their way
again. So that's so that's probably the biggest thing I have that tis in
the back of my mind too now, even more so than ever, because
I think there would be a tendency to look at the Jay's and say,
well, they could be here for a while. And the windows in the
NBA have just been closing so quickly lately, and the fact that they went
to the finals, it's like, might they not never get but they'll be
in a conversation, but look how robust the East looks this year. And
so that stuck with me too. Whereas we have a tendency to think these
younger cores will be around longer than they actually end up being around. We've
just seen the NBA as a ship show when it comes to that stuff.
Oh yeah, I think no one can, no one should be able to
project that side of their team more than three to four years. Yeah,
that's just really how it is in this league. Now, I be ambitious
if you look at the Brooklyn Nets a little bit at me, Yeah,
honestly. So the other thing too, I can't remember. I think this
came out before we were slated to record the first time. But Robert Williams
goes from needs a second knee procedure and it's gonna be out four to six
weeks to now eight to twelve is the expectation. How big of a deal
is this for the Celtics both during that span and they're kind of monitoring him
coming back. I mean, it's a hit, it's a huge deal,
you know, as as bron Wyn Horse says, it's most of the things
that matter surgery, and he's had two of them very and very very close
times, and that's a problem that's persisted him coming into the league with injuries
and staying healthy. So it's definitely concerning, you know, I think talent
wise, there's no question that, like when he's on the floor, like
he's part of the core that you see going forward. It's just the problem
is that, you know, the best skill is still availability, and right
now we don't know how available he's going to be. They said eight to
twelve until he's you know, getting ready to ramp up to begin massive activities.
So chances are we're not going to see him in the year twenty twenty
two and maybe not before the All Star break, and it's just going to
be a question of like, is this something that is going to be continuously
ongoing with him or not, but history suggests that it is. So that's
kind of concerning for someone that you know unlocks. I think the next unlocks.
The thing about their defense that makes it, you know, the nightmare
that it is. And at the same time as like the real only really
like really really dangerous, like vertical spacing threat with that ability in passing that
they have. So it's it's a lots on both ends of the court.
And it is concerning because he does mean a lot to the team. So
the dough I don't expect that being a big issue in the regular season.
They should be able to hold a forth with the regular season, but it
will be a difference in the playoffs. It'll be a difference maker when you
look at that, so when you factor the Nila Gallanari injury, by the
way, so that's just looming over all this he's out for the season with
an ACL injury. I've heard a lot of rosy things being said about Luke
Cornette and Sam Howser if you care to. My first question would be,
what are your hopes for those guys or do you think that they're fit to
play a bunch more minutes? And then does this team need to go out
and get another front court body because there's okay, maybe you have guys you're
roster that you like, but Al Horford's thirty six. How many minutes do
you want him playing? Do you want Grant Williams playing at the five?
And so how do you envision them kind of sorting this all out at least
through that initial you know, twelve plus week period without RW three. I
mean it's gonna be hard. I mean they're gonna have to base there.
I mean they have to play Luke. I'm assuming maybe Noah Bala might make
the team now, just you know, to add to add additional depths.
So maybe you have something I was all in on, Like, was that
twenty twenty when Noah was on the Knicks. Maybe it's twenty nineteen. I
was all in on that version of no von Le So if we relat a
few years, I might like this. Yeah, he he just looks like
he can play, you know what I mean. It's like, oh,
look at him. He's so in shave. He just run up and down
the court. He can do something. But I mean it'll be hard.
I mean, they like Luke Cornette in a few minutes. He's played with
the with the Celtics last year. He seems to be some of that at
least position. He's he's positional sound and he's really big, so that's a
big part of the battle defensively. Offensively, I don't really know what his
role is. He's not much of like a like a floor spacer. They're
not gonna have I don't think they're gonna be picking them popping him in the
mid range. And I mean, we'll see how he is, but he
could just be like a hard roller type of guy. So it's limited,
it's it's it's limiting. I can see them getting creative, maybe having some
more grants at the five Luke for as long as they can whatever whatever time
out the same way, and you just have to you know, put together
like a ragtag crew, like I think you can do stuff like pairing maybe
a guy like Noah Bondley with the Jay's and Brogden and stuff like that,
just so you know, even when you're kind of like playing big or less
talent, there's like so much trying talent with them, and they just they
are able to place a more like limited role. But it'll be a lot
of bandaging until Rob gets back. But you know, that's that that's a
choice that they made for not going after I'm sorry Blake Griffin too. He'll
got about him second. Yeah, so he'll be another guy in there getting
whatever minutes he can handle too. But I definitely think it's going to be
a bi committee, by matchup type of deal. I am semi intrigued by
FIANDU Cavin Gelly just feels like a shot of adrenaline when you watch him.
But I'm just like, once we get to that point, I'm just you're
right, it's gonna be by committee, and so I hope I'm here for
the Noa von la resurgence. Although it might be a startup, when you
look at the rest of how his career has panned out, it's kind of
I think it speaks to how wonky an off season the Celtics had that it
took me this long to get to Malcolm Brogden. But how do you feel
about that trade now that we've had a few months go by, and then
what do you just think about his overarching fit on the team. I think
it's actually scary how well he pissed on the team. I feel like,
almost as a fan, i feel like I'm almost like a picture picture no
hitter. I just don't want to say anything, you know what I mean,
Like you just don't want to jinx it because he's becoming even with the
way he looks like in the and just in the preseason, the way he's
just a connector that he can just move the ball, have somebody else I
can do that type of stuff, push the pace. He just looks like
such a seamless fit. And it's just like, man, like, how
are they going to survive the thirty five forty games that they're probably gonna have
to survive without him now? Because he seems very solidified so basketball wise,
like you see the fit, you could see him even being closing lineups even
with a healthy Rob and which is saying something. He could probably be in
the starting lineup, but they're probably trying to like space out the talent,
which is why he's not starting. I would assume that, man, he
looks every bit. He hasn't been shooting well in the preseason, but he's
taking the right type of shots. He's creating a lot of open shoft especially
for Sam Houser. So he's just a guy that's he's fitting in vary seems
like as advertised, It's just it's just a matter of how important does he
get and how much does that start to matter when you start to factor in
his injury history? Unfortunately, Yeah, that's true. They have to factor
that as well. Do you think just between him and Derek White that they
now sort of have now Gallows gone, Do they have enough like tertiary creation
to be a more dangerous playoff offense where maybe they don't have to rely on
Jason Tatum as much. I mean, they're sure hoping, Like I mean,
if Braddon can make it to the playoffs and he's healthy, then yes,
I'd say yes. If he doesn't, it's a it's a toss up,
like maybe maybe Sam Houser takes this step, you know what I mean,
maybe something like like maybe someone else is not on the roster right now
or something like that steps up. But it would be like something like that
right now. I think the paths without answer being yes and Ribbing being healthy
for the playoffs, he's the one that He's the one that takes it.
He definitely is better suited for that than Derek White because he's historically been a
more reliable shooter, even tho I think Derek White is definitely more disruptive on
defense. Is there also still an element. You and I have talked about
this so many times at this point, neither of us fall on the side
of the fence that Jalen Brown is this super robotic player, But there's still
sort of a huge chunk of Boston's fate that hinges on him still progressing as
an offensive player. Where Yeah, we've seen him hit step backs, it's
he shot like a really high clip on step backs last year. He's got
a really high clip on turnaround jumpers. I think that stuff's valuable, But
does is the next frontier for him doing more as a passer, maybe some
more methodical initiation for the offense involving others or is this kind of no,
If we're gonna get there, it's gonna be because of we either get other
players or it's because of these other players by committee. Dang. I hate
to bring it back to bribing. I think a lot of that depends on
him too, because you have a healthy bribing going in some player. He's
gonna be a big time but play handler, ball handler, playmaker, so
you could probably you're probably gonna want to have Jalen plan off of him more
often. But if you don't have a guy like like Brogden or some of
the big playmakers, and yeah, you are gonna need your you know,
like your second best player, a guy that might take the most on your
team to make somebody else better. You know, that is going to be
important. And we did see during the playoffs there were stretches where even when
he was having like good performances and good nights and stuff like that, it
was just him. And the reason why I it's like that because he isn't
really creating for others. That's that's something that he wants to start doing and
he sees himself as someone that can do that, and I think for his
personal development maybe outside of the Celtics, that's something that he should still want
to, you know, pursue if he wants to be like a number one
at some point in his career. But right now, that's still the hardest
jump in Basso want to make. And it would be crazy to sit there
and say, after like six seven years, oh yeah, that guy's just
gonna pick or that one out. He could because because that stuff you learned
later and learn in your career. But it's not something I could like with
like oh yeah, that stuff mixed up it's not like scoring and things.
If you just get in the lab and practice the movements, like that's field
that's knowing the game. So it'll we'll see. But I do think if
they go into playoffs Skinny without Brog, then without some of their other playmakers,
they are going to need Jayalen to make that type of leave. Do
you think even though his even his scoring offense is kind of misperceived, maybe
if it's even nationally where I think a lot of people still view him as
just a driver and shooter. And this is someone who we shot fifty on
turnaround jumpers last year seventeen or forty one on step back threes. I'm not
saying I'm not saying he's your best bailout option, but his bet his offensive
armory, I still feel like it's a lot deeper, deeper than people are
crediting him for. Or do you think like I'm just overstating man, No,
I'm sorry, my dog no good. We love dogs on this podcast.
No, I would say that you're absolutely correct, like he has turned
himself from maybe more of like what he started in the league with, like
a stationary three and D, which I like to remind people so did so
did so did Jason Tatum. When he first came and started starting, he
was not creating at that type of level. It was spacing the floor three
and D. And I think Jalen has progressively grown and add and added to
his game where like he is a complete self creator now and when he plays
off the ball, it's like for the better of the team and it's not
something that he needs to get his points. So I think, even going
back to your playmaking question, a lot of that is a balance that he
has to strike knowing that, yes, I do have this capability to create
for myself to be to be like an engine for an offense and spurts.
But is that the best for the Boston Celtics right now? Or should I
be looking to get Luke Cornett engaged who hasn't touched the ball in a little
bit, And let me try to get this guy in touch as well.
I mean, and let me make this extra pass here even though I'm open,
it's a good shot for me, just so Grant can take that shot
and feel good about himself that level of thinking the game like at on that
level of the playmaker, I don't necessarily see it, but I don't necessarily
think that's a problem on this team because he is such a talented offensive player
and it do have so many so much playmaking that I would still probably be
okay if he just moved off ball, and I could easy to see him
taking like an off ball role and just playing playing off these guys, and
he would still be able to get his twenty plus. So ideally, I
think the team is set up for him to kind of do that, and
there's a there's less pressure for him to turn to playmaker, even because of
the fact that he has grown so much as an offensive player. Do you
glean anything profound from Boston's involvement of the Kevin Durant pursuit or is it just
like, oh, was Kevin fucking Durant and so we were involved. I
mean, I don't know, right, because I mean it clearly to a
level where, I mean everyone knew that, everyone else was talking about it,
but nobody else had a report out where it was like Jaylen Brown,
Derek White, first round pick, you know what I mean, Like,
there's no one. There's not many other teams that were that I were as
good as the Celtics that had that type of level of offer like out there
publicly, even though we heard Miami raps as all those people, all of
them had leveling interest. So in my in my opinion, I don't really
know, it seemed like it had maybe upset Jalen. No one asked Theeric
White for there White, no one asked him how he felt about this.
I thought of many being in trade rumors, but I think as of right
now, from what we're sitting on the court and what people have talked about,
at least publicly, there wasn't. I don't. I don't think anything
will come with it. I think Kevin is okay and understands the landscape,
and I means the season started now right so, and I think because of
the other news that happen, it kind of took away from that as well,
regarding Emay, So it could have been maybe something that stuff always had
the possibility maybe come up again when it comes back to contract extension time and
maybe like we saw that in Utah of Gordon Hayward and in a little bit
of different circumstances when they made him go out and get his deal. It's
not that it impacted him going for those next four years, but he remembered
that when it came time to the free agency. So maybe for Jalen that
means, hey, I'm making all NBA teams did not expect to get a
to get any type of discount for me. You know, you clearly show
me you would trade me. So yeah, I need, I need the
max contracts. Maybe that's where where where it actually impact the Celtics on the
line. Yeah, And that's just what I was thinking, especially because there's
gonna be time for the speculation to fester because we know Jalen Brown is not
going to sign an extension because the CAP's going up and you can't even get
to his max by extending him off his current number. And that's what I'm
just because he was so Yeah, the other the rest of the offer wasn't
necessarily thrown out there, but it was just so like free we've flown around
and you know, WOES isn't necessarily writing that stuff unless it's like those dialogues
have been happening. No matter how you feel about, we'll just reporting.
And so I understand players understand that it's a business. But if I'm Jalen
Brown just coming off the finals and hear my name mentioned in rumors this summer.
It's just it. It impacts me a little bit differently. But I'm
just soft and probably can't play like I don't have a thick enough skin for
it. Maybe, But that's what I what you outlaid towards the end is
exactly what I was thinking. Yeah, yeah, so, I mean it'll
see, it will be something. And I mean if if if you're the
Celtics and like you did actually have a chance of the rant and you stopped
it at like Jailan or whatever, you really can't like you have to go
all in on Jalen. Yeah. Now, like you can't sit there and
then go, oh, well, you know, I don't want to pay
you this and this if like you you said no to Kevin dur and you
said no, why you know what I mean, Like you cannot can Like
you have to pay him. You have to. You have to. You
have to be comfortable about uh, do you Jalentatum Galentatum? Wow, Jason
Tatum had a Yeah, Jayson Tatum had a rough NBA Finals. Do you
actually take anything like consequential away from that or was this very much just sort
of like a young superstar first taste of the Finals. There was definitely some
of the things he shots, he passed up at points, some of his
finishing was all over the place. Is this just like getting his first taste
of finals basketball, also against a Warrior's defense that was hillacious and totally geared
towards just making his life absolute Hell? I mean yeah, I mean I
think there's been like a historical like blueprint of like some of like the young
stars coming in against great dynasty teams. Lebron compared himself to Tatum's experience the
summer, So I think there's I think there's definitely I think there's definitely an
element of, yeah, this was like, you did not play well at
all. But I think in the grand scheme of things for him in his
career, I still think they were they were really gassed, and they were
playing a team that you knew what they knew what to do, knew how
to play. And he was going against the guy that, you know,
a wing with very great length and Andrew Wiggins, who also wasn't being asked
and carried the same offensive burden. So it wasn't the kind of the samest
playing against Kevin Durant where it's like, yeah, even I'm defending you,
like we're both carrying so much for our team. Like it kind of evens
out with Wiggins, like his job is just shut down Katie and play off
my team, right, And that's hard because he's a really good defender too.
So I think the Warriors didn't really great. They played him extremely well.
But I think for Tatum Hill ultimately, like look at that as just
a learning curve for his next for his next step. And do you buy
into the playmaking jump because when you go back and watch Jason Thames passing from
last year, my fucking god, man, he it feels like he was
materially different and a lot of the passes he were throwing were just so much
more complicated and difficult than he wasn't an even years past. And it's been
probably like a linear progression too. I think we've talked about how he's kind
of improved incre mentally and passed you and so I'm fully on board it.
And if this is someone who then like takes it to the next level if
he needs to, who knows if the Celtics need him through this season when
you have a Broadden coming in, you have a full season of Derek White,
not to mention Marcus Martin Jaylen Brown as well. This is very much
someone to me who may have entrenched himself in that MVP tier of Superstar.
Yeah, I mean, I think that was like the last friends here for
him and some elected. The differentiator between him and some of the best creators
in the league is how well they were able to create for their team and
how they could easily go into seven and tennis is a game, and I
think we started to see that understanding Potatum, learning how to leverage his gravity,
learning where his reads are. I think as a year went on,
he actually even got more accurate with his passes where at first he was.
He has been able to make the read a long time in his career,
but there's so much more to making the read, like knowing the timing down,
knowing getting it in the shooting pocket every time, and different guys at
different kind of levels where they liked to touch the b and you could even
see on something that's passed like look some of the system picture versus Grant versus
al. You're seeing a guy that's understanding like his teammates and where his teammates
like like to shoot it, like to shoot it and like to get the
ball as well. So for me, I don't that's not like shooting for
me, I don't know. I don't know, that's something that just falls
off or comes ebbs and flows, because that that's a read and understanding of
the game that you can make. You might not always get tennis, it's
a game, but you can always make that read. You always know where
that read is. So I think his passing leap was real, and I
would adventure even as far as say, I think even with the extended playmaking
that they have on the team now, I think he's still going to see
the ball of fair fair bit amount. And I really expect him to be
in the in the five to eight assists per game range this year. And
I have a couple of triple doubles on on on on him this year.
Triple doubles, how do you have one? Last year? I can't remember.
I think he's had winners and in his whole career, and it was
it was pretty weak, like he wasn't in control of the game. He
just he fell into that. So this one, I want to see him
actually control of the game, actually get it. When you step back and
look at this roster. Is there a concern that you have aside from you
know, RW three's health and maybe even we talked to the front court rotation
that you don't think is receiving enough attention. I would say the overall health
of the team just being great consideration. You touched on Robert Williams, We
touched on Al Horford. Who's who's thirty six right? Marcus Smart misses a
lot of games. Malcolm brogg Man, we talked about missing a lot of
games the past two years. Jaylen Brown has missed, you know, at
least more than ten games himself. Blake Griffin is pretty old. I don't
think he'll be able to He's not a guy that you're expecting to play all
eighty two. That's like half our rotation right there, that has some type
of varying, varying injury concerns, So that staying together and being okay for
a full season, I don't know. At some point, you know,
there's gonna be a time where I think Payton Pritcher is gonna start at point
guard. It's how I feel like at some point of the year. So
I think I think injuries could be the thing that you know, makes or
break. This makes or break this team ceiling, and I don't think I
think people see it from like the raw perspective in the Brock then I don't
think people realize like it's a it's it's across the team that there's at every
position there's like someone that has had some type of recurring injury that that has
required rest and who knows, Like you don't always get the time your injuries.
If you have smart em Brogman, I would at the same time,
like I was saying, suddenly like your backup point guard is JD. Davidson,
things can happen like that, So that would be that that would be
my biggest concern right now. And also it's just Al Hoover being thirty six
too, and he's I think he's at twenty nine minutes last year, and
I just wonder early on if that number is going to have to be ticked
up because of our W three not being there. I hope not. I
mean, they like Luke Cornett, so we'll see. Yeah, what is
Brad Stephen's fascination was Luke Cornette. He's like loved him since the Dawn of
time man one of his only LIFs. I guess he just likes very fundamental
basketball. And you know it's funny though, because the video he liked that
Luke Cornette was not fundamental basketball. It was him trying to break down guys
off the dribble and it looked like a Summer twenty four seven gem or something
like that. So that was that was very interesting. Maybe he just likes
Luke. You know, guys have guys that they stand, maybe Brady,
maybe Brad is a is a Luke Cornette stand somewhere. So we should expect
to see Luke Cornette grabbing, go run the floor, run the offense based
off that liked video. That's all I'm That's all I'm understanding. I mean,
that's all we can take from it. Honestly, are there any does
this team have any underrated strengths or even hidden gems on the roster that you
don't think you're receiving enough attention heading into the season. M everyone has the
same Howzard point now and I think everyone has kind of seen him a little
bit, but you know, I don't not all your listeners are locked in
the Celtics Twitter. So Sam, how there's is a shutter that they got
last year? Undrafted actually stole him from from the mind heat. It was
those who were competing for his services. He played. He played a man
a little bit that did really well, got a two way and last year
before the year ended, they gave him his his his full contracts. He's
a sniper like legitimately, whether there's NBA length on him, no NBA length,
like lights out type of god, the type of guy that you know
gives you like little remnants of like how Korb a little bit, just like
his size and like the way he plays and stuff like that. So that
type of shooting has never really existed with the Celtics core, with the Jay's
especially now like now, the type of playmakers that they have on the team,
the fact that they're at this age now or like they're kind of ready
to win and see it having a guy like that that can just prate so
much gravity just from moving around conflict like that. I'm very interest to see
what type of what type of what type of like spacing and stuff like that
that that opens up for them. So I think I think I think Sam
Houser is probably like Uno. Honestly, I also think Payin Pritchard is too.
I know he's very behind on the depth chart, but he's a hooper
man like, he can really really play. He shoots well, he's fearless.
He's a good point of attack defender, even though he's not versus hound
due to his guide if he handles two yes, and he's very shifty,
very very like kind of explosive within his moves. I just think he's a
guy that playing around the type of talent Sultans have coming into that year four
and kind of having that confidence about him. I think he's gonna find his
way on the court. I think some people forget that, Like even towards
the end of last year, he was closing games over Derek White at times.
He's not someone that you know, it's just like a clear stuff below.
I think at times he might even warrant playing over some of those guys
like like Derek White at times. So I think he's a secret guy that
I think because the team that didn't have a lot of wings outside of them
Jays, you could see them kind of get funky with them through dark line
up sink, he might end up being, you know, a bigger part
of the rotation than them. People imagine, so payin Princher, someone payin
Princher and Sam Houser. Those are two guys who I think can really like
do some special things with the Celtics, just kind of playing off those those
top core members. Yeah, sam Houser specifically, then, like Jason and
Jalen have never really played with someone like this, this like iteration of the
Celtics. They've had good shooters, but like the functional, complimentary shooter who
can just fly all over the place. It's not necessarily I'm trying to remember
my missing someone that they played with along similar lines. It's just like their
first crack at it. Yeah, the closest thing with them in Fournier.
So yeah, it's a good point. Nick's legend Evan Fourier, I think
very much. I didn't ask this in the outline I said, but Grant
Williams extension eligible been oddly quiet on that front. What would be do you
want? Do you expect an extension to get done or is this league in
restricted free agency? And if you have the opportunity to sign him, you're
the Celtics, what would be your your walk away number? My probably guess
is that they probably want him around the same money as Rob which is like
Rob was four fifty two, it's like thirteen mile average out. So I
think anywhere between maybe like twelve thirteen and be the perfect perfect amount. Fifteen
is probably where you're like I'm getting I'm getting to my breakaway point. Bank
You still see them even going up to like sixteen seventeen, but I don't
think anything passed. Like you start getting to seventeens, like the twenty mills
and stuff like that, that's probably where you start like walking away in that
range. And a lot of that just kind of depends on how people see
Grant, because I think Grant probably sees himself as maybe more of like over
until like like he's a four, but like he can play five, he
can play like he was up all over the court, and people just kind
of only see him as like just a front court guy. That could change
how how his market is perceived. I don't think it's a mistake that during
this preseason we're seeing him break out a lot of like hesitations and a lot
of times the stuff you start like tennessee some of the mid post games and
stuff like that. I think he's trying to make a point within the within
the offense because it hasn't looked selfish at all, but within the offense,
he's trying to show that he's not just some three and D guy that can
just you know, maybe just like guard especially or something like that. Like
he's some of that have the full arsenal game that can't do something creating and
you know there's something some don't get a deal done and that ends up being
true throughout a whole year. You know, someone is going to throw him
a lot of money. That eighteen twenty midd number not maybe that's somewhere where
like he is getting So I think right now, right now, they probably
think they can get him around like twelve to fifteen. And it's just a
matter of whether it's okay with that or he's willing to bet on himself and
his work and think that may be showing more so creation going into this year
will help raise his stock. But that's obviously that's a that's a tough game
because you have a bad year too, you know, you end up you
know, maybe losing a lot of money at the same time. So we'll
see, but I think I think they'll get a deal done though. Yeah,
And also the non star big market can be weird and Grant Williams is
not your traditional big but maybe some team I think they're probably somebody's out there
that don't think he could play the five. They're probably other teams out there
that don't think he warrants more like on ball activity. If if the Celtics
to get him for between twelve and fifteen, I think I do it on
their part, But if I'm him, I might also roll the dice on
myself, thinking, well, Rob's gonna miss this time. My role is
gonna be elevated for at least, you know, a third or a half
of the season. Maybe I get myself paid. So it wouldn't shock me
if they don't get a deal going to well say that or I think some
people might get stick or shock from what his deal is actually worth. Should
they agree to an extension. Yeah, And I mean the other proponent that
I think it sells again to consider as like if it gets like the fifteen
million stuff like that within the context of the TV deal, like that just
might be like standard money for a core player, you know, So I
think they understand that. So to me, I think he's he's young enough,
this is not his last deal where I think they can both kind of
like give a little and meet around that like fifteen mode number. Given the
I mean, some of the injury concerns on this roster, the fact that
they made the move for White last season in the middle of the year,
they make the move for Brogdon this offseason. They're in on some level on
the KD discussions. Is this a team that you could see, knowing how
deep the East is, if they're not sort of just in the thick of
the tile race again they are, they're a step behind or something that will
continue to be aggressive in making trades. They do have some mid trade exceptions
that they could use as well. Or do you think that they've they're very
much short of in we need to see a full year from what we have
from this group sort of mode. I think I think they'll make it.
Do it because it's gonna be a lot of opportunity because there's a seven four
alien coming out of the draft, and I think it's and to make a
lot of teams feel that are there's a lot of in the middle teams that
might decide, you know, the plan is not for us this year.
I think a chance that at you know, what's what's what's coming in this
draft might be it might be more appealing than fighting, and I think because
of that, I think there's gonna be a lot of options for them.
And they do have Gallows contract who towards acl and at his age, you
don't know how you're gonna recover, you don't know what's have a player he's
gonna be able to be asked or something like that so late in his career.
But it's like, you know, it's a good number, like six
mols something like that, you feel like you really need you really need some
wing depth at this time, like you pair him with maybe like Pritchard.
I think it's a good backup guard in this league for a team that's maybe
just now ready to tang and stuff like that that you know, maybe they
do something like that, but I think they'll it'll obviously be something like on
a small scale. I think it's gonna be more of like like a rotation
guy like something just to more to solidify their floor then to raise or sealing.
Yeah, this isn't a team that's going to try and like acquire a
top six player now, like they've done that twice basically with White and Brogden,
it's sort of anything happens like that. Again, the durant interest,
it didn't throw me off, but they're they're strong links to It threw me
off a little bit where it was, oh, are they still sort of
in like this weird aggressive talent acquisation more near the top of the roster.
So when you look at full strength this team, the ten man rotation,
it feels like they're probably it might be eight locks with Smart Brown, Tatum,
Horford, RW three, Broggden, White and then Grant Williams. Would
you agree with those eight locks for their ten man rotation? Who? How
would you flesh out the final two or how do you expect that to pan
out? I think I think they're gonna play Cornette off top. I'm pretty
comment in Corrett that I would almost even name him just someone just just off
of the fact that they need they need another center, like they need someone
else to blink twice. If Pratt Stevens is in the room with you right
now, he's he's right here. You can't even see him. He's just
right here looking at me. So I think I think he's gonna play.
And then I think Howser's gonna play but then you know, when you start
getting like eight, nine, I think in the regular season, maybe they're
more liberal, just just just based off how it's going when it gets serious
or maybe more competitive games, and probably gonna match up based they have like
robbfully healthy, maybe you're not going to see a lot of Cornette. They
might just go a little bit more smaller with like Brand and Blake and stuff
like that. So I would say for sure, I would think, I
would say for sure, and eight Cornett's gonna have to play out of necessity,
so maybe nine. And then you're playing and then you're tinkering around with
Howser, Griffin, Pritchard, and then maybe even you know, having Yelli
and von Ley, just based off how things go. But pretty much what
I'm saying is the rest of that is probably gonna be matchup dependent. When
you do have White brogged in and Smart all available, is that gonna on
a regular basis then squeeze Putcher out of the rotation or do you think there
would still be room to get him in there? It depends. It depends
because White and Broad there are both pretty big guards. So depending on what
type of second second unit lineups they have, they played pretty small in the
preseason. They even tried out like a Tatum at the Bob line up,
So they go like a three guard lineup for example, That might be the
way to steal minutes. But then again, you know, if Hawser shows
himself, you know it, to be a good shooter, able to kind
of hold his own defensively, and maybe just that size is what end up
winning out most of the time, then maybe you know that does end up
squeezing him out. But that's kind of where I go back to. Maybe
it's going to end up being a matchup dependence type a thing unless someone really
like shows themselves to be a player that has to play every night. This
question's matchup dependent as well. But what do you envision as their go to
closing unit? Is it just in crunch time? Is it just going to
be what the full strength starting five would be like we should expect to be
at or do you think they'll be some tinkering You know, you could make
it when you're looking at Robin Horford, but then also you have these different
guards and Brogden and White as well. Oh no, I think it'll be
Broggden over Horford like closing when it's like serious, and I think they'll keep
They'll keep Rob because Rob Rob. They need Rob for the vertical throat,
obviously, the obviously the defensive ability and stuff like that, some of his
some of his own passing ability. But I definitely think it'll be smart Brogden,
Jalen Jason and Rob when it's like go time, like season on the
line whatever, like that's gonna be. There a lot of Is there a
weirdo quirky Bonker's lineup that you want to see Missoula try this year? I
do. I do like they have some weird lineups that can allow them to
kind of play. I like, I like seeing this might not be weird
because it's like world guys, But like, I think there's some type of
symmetry that can go on between Brogden, Howser and Rob Williams because Rob is
a little bit better and pass than how some people realize. I think there's
a lot of like type of like trible handoffs giving go action that him and
Hawser can and a lot of the brig and thing that you see is like
him make having a lot of chemistry with the Manta Sa Bonus and him becoming
like a completely great like pick and roll partner with him something I think something
I think he can develop with rob in different ways. And during the preseason
he's been, you know, saying, how the biggest benefactor. So I
think starting off, I want to see those three, and then I'd want
to have Grants in there, and then I'd probably want to have another small
guard like Pritchard, just because I want to like the intense floor spacing,
just because Pritchard being able to Prichard began to shoot from thirty, Grant being
a marksman. Then you have kind of like Robin, there is like the
ultimate vertical throughout, and then you have a pick and roll like Master and
Malcolm Broda. So maybe like something like that. It's not really like long,
it is kind of like traditional in that way, but just I think
those collection of players when weirdly like an interesting chemistry. I'm gonna use Tatum
spending time at the five in the preseasons the impetus for mine. I think
that I think that was against the Hornets. Oh that's the only teams they
played against the Hornets. Is recording this forgot. I'm gonna go with Tatum,
Brown, Brogden, and then I kind of want to put Sam Howser
in there, and then maybe we'll go with Marcus Smart. I'm trying to
think of how's the best way to flesh out of Jason Tamotham. I would
like to see Pritchard and just go all offense and sup it up. And
I know you said he can be an underrated point of attack defender, but
I'm wondering if you need Smart more than Pritchard in the way that that lineup
structure is. No. I mean you need Smart if you didn't have the
center on the court now you and now you have, you know, the
ultimate center and Marcus Smart. Yeah. So as we're recording this, their
wind total over under is set at fifty three point five. I believe it
dropped from fifty four and a half to fifty three point five. Are you
hitting the over the under on that? And where do you think they stack
up relative to the rest of the East as of right now. I think
they're gonna hit the over on it. I think with all the stuff going
on, I think a lot it's been pushing a lot of the focus just
on the basketball. Everything that everything that's coming out of them is how they're
ready to play. How the continuity and kind of the chemistry built last year,
it feels like it's just coming right in to this year. And I
think it can kind of be Simmons kind of like the Sounds, where it's
like they just came out to the finals, they kind of figure something out,
they knew who they know, who they are as a team, and
it just kind of just come in and just play really hard in the regular
season. So I think they're actually going to be over the over I would
put them even. I'll put them at like fifty five wins one. I
guess that's too far over if you're gonna go fifty yeah, I would so
like so like the fifty sixth one, I would have gone under, But
fifty three, I think they'll go over that one. I think they were
when I first noted it before the whole thing happen, it was a fifty
four and a half, so it did drop a win. I'm I've been
hitting way too many overs in this exercise and with them, I'm just so
unbelievably worried about the front court rotation and its fragility with out RW three,
and I'm curious as to whether if we could see some defensive regression for half
of the year without him, and whether that winds up seriously repressing their their
win total. Squere No, I don't think they're gonna be like forty five
wins, but something like forty nine fifty fifty one. That's interesting. I
mean, it's possible. It's very possible. Rob was a very special piece
for them. I just I don't know. I think regular season it's so
like teams really don't target your weaknesses as much. A lot of it is
just trying to do what they do best a lot of times. So for
me, I just kind of feel like there's still enough talent for the Celtics
that even missing Rob, the type of like space and that they have now
type of offense that they're kind of playing that's a little different than Emays,
Joe's doing a little bit of different stuff. I think that's like enough that
they're still gonna kind of for regular season purposes, still be able to be
a contender. So going to be consistent and do that for kind of like
a full year, That's that's kind of where my where I'm going with it.
And I think I think I kind of, you know, I don't
I think playing five the people that they have and played the five I think
for like three months, you know, if you want to put if you
want to put a lot on al to start the year and then kind of
wane him down to the second half of the year when teams are tanking,
new teams that didn't realize they were taking starting to tank. Now it's a
little bit lighter on the schedule, Maybe you start pushing his minutes down there
and setting him in the second in the back half the year, and play
him heavy there in the first first half, so you're playing maybe twenty five
twenty seven minutes just exclusively at the five. Then you know, Luke adds
a little bit, Blake adds a little bit of Bondler or whatever, Grant
adds a little bit, and you're able to kind of, you know,
still get your forty eight without it being too much of like you know what
many of us believe at this DAYE is still like below average and the eight
players. Yeah, that's a I've I've yet to sort of reconcile how there
might be more available wins for the top of the East. And I'm expecting
if teams like Charlotte and Walk Sheton pivot into a tank. But I also
then look at the East and I'm like, with Cleveland and Miami and Philly
and Milwaukee, Toronto, whatever the hell Brooklyn winds up being. I'm not
like too confident Atlanta, but they're still really good. Those first like seven
eight spots in the East are just so jam packed with teams that are gonna
make it difficult to pick up wins. And I'm just curious whether that not
the Celtics specifically, does that almost like create this parody of wins near the
top of the East to where oh, just fifty three like or something win
the East like it to come up with the one seed. And so it's
just it's so tough for me to wrap my head around because it feels like
the East from the middle to the top is just an absolute beast this year.
It's true, and I think that the heat where I think the first
seed of fifty three last year, So that's some reason you're right, and
so just fifty one get the one seed this year or something, just like
because those late season games against the Calves and then presumably the net like we're
gonna matter more. But then you can counter that with Ball, Washington,
Charlotte, maybe even Chicago looks pretty combustible. I don't know what the Knicks
are, to be honest with you, it's it's just fascinating. There's still
the Celtics are still near the tippy top of the East for me, but
it feels like it's almost or doesn't feel almost. It does feel like it's
going to be tougher to come out of this year than it was last year.
Oh, I for now, you know from what we had right now,
I completely agree. I just think, yeah, it's too much talent,
way too much talent. Alex this did I not ask you about anything
that you think it needs to be covered with regards to this team? Hmm,
man, I feel like there's been so much carbage being a finals team.
I can't even think of an angle that has not been hit. Yeah,
man, I A letts want to talk about our second two way spot
Justin Jackson, Boordick Thomas. I don't want to put the sleepers asleep,
but I think yeah, I mean that's the biggest point. Can they stay
healthy? Can they survive without Rob And let's see I Jones Luking coaching them
a team, Alex this was great As always, I appreciate you being so
generous with your time in case anyone skipped the intro. Are you able to
tell our listeners where they can find you? Yes, you can find me
on my Twitter handle ku n gu Underscore NBA. With the season up and
running, I'm looking forward to posting about it and I think I think this
year I'm going to be guests running at a couple of places, So hell
yeah, now over there, Hell yeah. I always enjoyed you when I
got to read you, so that's that's exciting to hear. Go follow this
man. He's also, as we know now pro dog, so that's another
reason to go follow him. Thank you so much, Alex, And as
you know, I will be spamming your DM again in the future and our
problem hopefully could get news.