1
00:00:00,800 --> 00:00:06,599
You're listening to the Paranormal UK Radio
Network, the best in paranormal talk radio

2
00:00:06,799 --> 00:00:13,359
in the UK and around the world. Hello world, You're listening to Eleanor

3
00:00:13,400 --> 00:00:19,239
Wagner's Strange and Scary world here on
the Paranormal UK Radio Network, where we're

4
00:00:19,320 --> 00:00:26,320
always creeping it real. I'm your
host, Eleanor Wagner. Welcome all to

5
00:00:26,440 --> 00:00:31,800
my paranormal Closet, where the stories
in magic take place. Today's guest currently

6
00:00:31,879 --> 00:00:39,000
runs two shows, Inquiries of Our
Reality and Bizarre Encounters. He's founded Open

7
00:00:39,039 --> 00:00:43,560
Minds Media, which is the production
company that covers both shows. He's a

8
00:00:43,640 --> 00:00:49,359
fourteen researcher and a part of the
Phantoms and Monstrous team who has what he

9
00:00:49,520 --> 00:00:54,640
considers to possibly have been a Wendigo
encounter. Please join me in welcoming.

10
00:00:54,799 --> 00:00:58,759
Shane Jones Welcome, Hi, how
are you? Thanks for inviting me on

11
00:00:58,840 --> 00:01:03,359
this show. Thanks coming on.
I appreciate it so A when DIGO encounter,

12
00:01:03,560 --> 00:01:07,079
huh, at least what I believe
is one. I mean, I

13
00:01:07,680 --> 00:01:11,599
hadn't told the story for a long
time because I didn't really know what I

14
00:01:11,640 --> 00:01:14,400
saw. But once I started kind
of digging into it myself and doing some

15
00:01:14,400 --> 00:01:17,439
of the research, it's at least
what I assume that it is, but

16
00:01:17,480 --> 00:01:22,239
I'm not saying it is, but
it's what at least I've collaborated to believe

17
00:01:22,239 --> 00:01:26,000
that it was well for the listeners
tuning in Whendigo or when Digo is a

18
00:01:26,079 --> 00:01:33,280
cannibalistic giant or person who has been
transformed into a monster by the consumption of

19
00:01:33,439 --> 00:01:41,200
human flesh. Ew do tell your
story please? So I guess kind of

20
00:01:41,200 --> 00:01:45,079
breaking it down into the beginning because
there's a there's a shadow person encounter that

21
00:01:45,120 --> 00:01:49,200
I kind of get them coompanied into
all of it. But back probably about

22
00:01:49,599 --> 00:01:53,400
seven or so years ago, my
girlfriend and I used to do urban exploring,

23
00:01:53,519 --> 00:01:56,799
so we used to go and like
explore abandoned places. We used to

24
00:01:56,799 --> 00:02:00,840
try to look for like haunted places
specifically. But we found this place called

25
00:02:00,879 --> 00:02:04,560
Northfille Psychiatric Hospital, which was really
cool because it wasn't just one building.

26
00:02:04,599 --> 00:02:08,120
It was like a full campus with
dorms and a gym and just a bunch

27
00:02:08,159 --> 00:02:12,599
of different buildings. So we started
getting to the point where we go like

28
00:02:12,599 --> 00:02:15,120
almost every weekend and we had the
whole place mapped out. You know,

29
00:02:15,159 --> 00:02:20,159
we're taking really cool like board photos
and stuff, but nothing like super crazy

30
00:02:20,199 --> 00:02:23,560
happened at that point, so we
just got really really comfortable with going there

31
00:02:23,639 --> 00:02:27,879
and not really having anything super crazy
happened like along the way, like one

32
00:02:27,879 --> 00:02:30,960
of the crazy is not even crazy. But one of the most memorable things

33
00:02:30,000 --> 00:02:35,599
before the Wind to Go encounter was
this door slamming shut when we're up on

34
00:02:35,680 --> 00:02:38,879
like the seventh floor. It was
kind of weird because it was like a

35
00:02:38,000 --> 00:02:40,520
blue it was painted blue, and
it had like a smiley face on it,

36
00:02:40,879 --> 00:02:45,159
and we there wasn't any busted windows
or anything like that on that level,

37
00:02:45,280 --> 00:02:49,159
so we opened the door back up
after it slam shut, because it

38
00:02:49,400 --> 00:02:53,400
slammed like super hard, like loud
slam, but there wasn't any wind or

39
00:02:53,400 --> 00:02:54,439
anything like kind of pushed it shut, So we kind of were like,

40
00:02:54,479 --> 00:02:58,879
all right, that's that's a little
weird. So a couple of weeks later,

41
00:02:58,919 --> 00:03:01,240
we're still exploring this place, and
uh, at the time, I

42
00:03:01,319 --> 00:03:06,120
wasn't super familiar with like the dues
and don'ts as far as the paranormal goes,

43
00:03:06,520 --> 00:03:08,560
so I thought it'd be cool to
take this no smoking sign. And

44
00:03:08,599 --> 00:03:14,039
I also found this little like foam
teeky head and what I kind of assumed

45
00:03:14,039 --> 00:03:16,159
that it was later on, was
that normally at like mental hospitals, they

46
00:03:16,199 --> 00:03:20,120
won't give people like a piece of
wood and a knife to like carve something

47
00:03:20,120 --> 00:03:23,039
for arts and crafts, to give
them like foam and like a plastic knife.

48
00:03:23,080 --> 00:03:25,280
So it seemed kind of weird because
it was in somebody's office and it

49
00:03:25,319 --> 00:03:29,879
looked like it was like handpaigned and
looked like it was machine made. So

50
00:03:29,919 --> 00:03:35,400
I kind of assumed, do you
see that you took these as souvenirs at

51
00:03:35,439 --> 00:03:39,680
the time? Yet, y way, No, it only lasted in my

52
00:03:39,719 --> 00:03:46,599
house at night. I'm sure that's
yeah. Oh mg, yeah, no,

53
00:03:46,599 --> 00:03:50,080
no, no, no, I'm
sorry. I just was like,

54
00:03:50,159 --> 00:03:52,360
oh my god, I can't believe
you just said he took these things from

55
00:03:52,400 --> 00:03:55,039
this place. Okay, go ahead. Yeah. I wasn't familiar with all

56
00:03:55,039 --> 00:03:59,400
the dues and don'ts at the time
of this happening, so I ended up

57
00:03:59,400 --> 00:04:02,199
bringing them home and that night was
one of the knights that we saw like

58
00:04:02,240 --> 00:04:05,840
a shadow person in the house.
So we got home, we started unloading

59
00:04:05,840 --> 00:04:10,120
everything, went up to the bedroom, and the way the house was set

60
00:04:10,159 --> 00:04:12,400
up, there was like a flood
of stairs right up the door where you

61
00:04:12,439 --> 00:04:15,040
first walk in and then there was
the front room and then like the kitchen,

62
00:04:15,199 --> 00:04:17,759
but it had the two doorways,
so it was like a full loop

63
00:04:17,800 --> 00:04:21,600
around circle. So we go and
drop stuff up upstairs, we come back

64
00:04:21,639 --> 00:04:26,000
down. I'm standing at the base
of the stairs by the door, and

65
00:04:26,040 --> 00:04:29,639
my girlfriend goes to walk into the
kitchen, and as she walks into the

66
00:04:29,720 --> 00:04:33,959
kitchen, both of us catch eyes
on this black human shaped thing sitting on

67
00:04:34,000 --> 00:04:38,000
the couch and it was pitch black
in the room, so it was darker

68
00:04:38,040 --> 00:04:42,720
than dark. And she had that
moment of fear where she just kept going

69
00:04:42,759 --> 00:04:46,279
and didn't really like react to it
right away. Yeah, she walked right

70
00:04:46,319 --> 00:04:48,639
past it, looped around in the
kitchen, and I'm staying at the base

71
00:04:48,639 --> 00:04:51,680
of the stairs, still staring at
this thing, and I turned to look

72
00:04:51,720 --> 00:04:54,199
at her, and she goes,
you saw that, right, And I

73
00:04:54,240 --> 00:04:56,000
was like, yeah, I saw
that, And we turned back and it

74
00:04:56,079 --> 00:05:00,399
wasn't there anymore. So after that, I ended up bringing those out projects

75
00:05:00,480 --> 00:05:06,800
back to the psychiatric hospital and that
again in that house. But yeah,

76
00:05:06,800 --> 00:05:10,079
I got to tell you the same
thing kind of happened. We were doing

77
00:05:10,120 --> 00:05:16,959
an investigation in a private residence which
was actually the former manor house of an

78
00:05:17,000 --> 00:05:24,680
Italian mafia guy. And so now
it's been restructured into separate apartments for people

79
00:05:24,759 --> 00:05:30,439
to rent out. And everybody in
all the apartments were having major activity going

80
00:05:30,480 --> 00:05:33,879
on, I mean affecting their moods
and their health and everything like that.

81
00:05:34,399 --> 00:05:40,160
But this one couple that lived in
this one apartment was kind of elevated what

82
00:05:40,240 --> 00:05:44,759
they were experiencing. And I mean
even the animals were affected. They were

83
00:05:44,759 --> 00:05:47,720
all frazzled, and the electricity was
going crazy. And when we went in

84
00:05:47,759 --> 00:05:50,639
there, stuff was happening. The
doors were opening and closed, and it

85
00:05:50,680 --> 00:05:55,199
was just a really really crazy atmosphere. And we got to talking to the

86
00:05:55,240 --> 00:05:58,279
two women. They were like,
oh, you were really into the paranormal

87
00:05:58,360 --> 00:06:01,720
too, just like you guys.
Like Okay, I'm real sensitive blah blah

88
00:06:01,759 --> 00:06:05,160
blah. And we go on these
investigations here and there, and we went

89
00:06:05,160 --> 00:06:10,519
to this psychiatric place and I got
these things that I brought home with me,

90
00:06:11,519 --> 00:06:15,560
and we were like, oh no, because you bring home this stuff

91
00:06:15,639 --> 00:06:21,839
from this psychiatric mental facility and you're
bring it into the residence of a mafia

92
00:06:23,279 --> 00:06:28,480
boss. Just think of the ramifications, right, So we were like,

93
00:06:28,720 --> 00:06:30,560
no, the first thing you got
to do is bring this stuff back,

94
00:06:30,759 --> 00:06:32,959
get that out of here, because
you're dealing with enough as it is,

95
00:06:33,000 --> 00:06:40,720
living in this place that's already quanted
with this stuff. So they agreed to

96
00:06:40,720 --> 00:06:42,920
bring them back. Whether they did
or not, I don't know, but

97
00:06:43,120 --> 00:06:46,560
it was really very active in that
place. I can't even get to tell

98
00:06:46,600 --> 00:06:49,959
you. Hopefully they brought this stuff
back, because that's one of those things

99
00:06:50,000 --> 00:06:54,079
that it's like, not just about
getting it away from you, but it's

100
00:06:54,079 --> 00:06:58,399
actually about returning it to the location
that you founded at. Sure the otherwise

101
00:06:58,439 --> 00:07:01,879
the activity will possible pass on to
somebody else, it might still follow you,

102
00:07:02,000 --> 00:07:06,560
but it's about returning it to its
exact location. I'm glad you realized

103
00:07:06,600 --> 00:07:12,800
that, really, because to not
know and then have that experience, it's

104
00:07:12,879 --> 00:07:15,839
crazy. It's a learning curve though, because I mean, I've gotten heavy

105
00:07:15,879 --> 00:07:19,160
into it now where it's like I
understand all of these things, but it

106
00:07:19,279 --> 00:07:25,959
ast embarrassing now as a researcher and
investigator saying like the previous mistakes I've done

107
00:07:26,959 --> 00:07:30,360
for a good story, though,
I guess that happened. So, yes,

108
00:07:30,480 --> 00:07:36,600
you've learned your lesson. Is that
what inspired you to pursue the avenue

109
00:07:36,639 --> 00:07:42,759
that you have with your shows part
of it. Yeah, originally, I

110
00:07:42,759 --> 00:07:45,439
mean at least for me, and
then I can hop back into whole like

111
00:07:45,439 --> 00:07:47,199
getting to the wind to go part
of it. But I mean, I've

112
00:07:47,199 --> 00:07:51,319
always kind of been interested in other
weird things happening, and there's like a

113
00:07:51,360 --> 00:07:55,639
whole back, long, extensive story
that kind of goes along with it.

114
00:07:55,680 --> 00:07:58,519
But as a kid, I used
to astro travel and I didn't really realize

115
00:07:58,560 --> 00:08:01,920
what I was doing at the time, but I used to see shadow people

116
00:08:01,959 --> 00:08:05,480
regularly, and I particularly saw this
one with like green eyes that used to

117
00:08:05,480 --> 00:08:09,360
follow me. But that's kind of
like where the interest in it started.

118
00:08:09,399 --> 00:08:11,040
But it was kind of like I
rejected it at the same time because it

119
00:08:11,079 --> 00:08:15,639
was I was kind of stuck in
it and then kind of just running quick

120
00:08:15,639 --> 00:08:18,480
through it. I lived in a
house that it had this like heavy presence

121
00:08:18,519 --> 00:08:22,879
to it where the longer you stayed
in it, the more like bad parts

122
00:08:22,920 --> 00:08:28,680
of your personality would start to come
out. Yeah. Yeah, yeah,

123
00:08:28,839 --> 00:08:33,799
it was like it was kind of
weird. It was it was a foreclosed

124
00:08:33,799 --> 00:08:37,159
house and whoever lived there previously tried
to flood the house out, and the

125
00:08:37,159 --> 00:08:41,039
basement, like all the floors in
the house were destroyed. But in the

126
00:08:41,039 --> 00:08:43,399
basement in particular, there was like
pages of the Bible torn out all over

127
00:08:43,399 --> 00:08:46,080
the basement, and nobody really thought
anything of it at the time. So

128
00:08:46,240 --> 00:08:50,840
just something weird with that house.
And then as when I was a teenager,

129
00:08:50,879 --> 00:08:52,799
my step brother and I realized that
if you're in the basement alone at

130
00:08:52,919 --> 00:08:56,240
night, you'd hear screaming, but
nobody else would hear it in the house,

131
00:08:56,279 --> 00:08:58,840
and it would just be off in
the distance, just really really weird.

132
00:08:58,519 --> 00:09:01,320
And and that same house, it
would be one of those things where

133
00:09:01,360 --> 00:09:05,480
you'd see like shadow people and these
like apparitions behind you all the time,

134
00:09:07,000 --> 00:09:09,840
Like when you're in the bathroom in
the mirror, you'd see these things moving

135
00:09:09,879 --> 00:09:11,679
around behind you. Like it was
just a really weird, uncomfortable house.

136
00:09:13,159 --> 00:09:15,840
And I ended up getting out of
the house, so did my stepbrother.

137
00:09:16,480 --> 00:09:18,720
I think that my mom and her
boyfriend still at there, but we haven't

138
00:09:18,759 --> 00:09:22,000
talked in years, so I'm not
one hundred percent sure, but pull all

139
00:09:22,039 --> 00:09:26,200
the bad parts out of their personality, So like that also kind of started

140
00:09:26,240 --> 00:09:28,159
to spark up some of the interest
in it. And then I was kind

141
00:09:28,159 --> 00:09:33,279
of into conspiracies and just kind of
weird off the wall things the research into

142
00:09:33,399 --> 00:09:37,960
kind of going forward off that.
But after I had this particular encounter with

143
00:09:37,679 --> 00:09:41,759
Northfill Psychiatric Hospital was when I started
kind of taking the research a little bit

144
00:09:41,759 --> 00:09:46,879
more seriously. And then it led
into me listening to a lot of podcasts

145
00:09:46,000 --> 00:09:50,200
with people theorizing about, you know, the paranormal, cryptids, aliens,

146
00:09:50,240 --> 00:09:54,559
all of that, and I just
kind of noticed a lot of the time

147
00:09:54,600 --> 00:09:58,440
that most of the time people weren't
really saying what I would say or throw

148
00:09:58,480 --> 00:10:01,440
in the theories that I would throw
into it. So that's kind of what

149
00:10:01,559 --> 00:10:05,399
rooted me to start my podcast,
was hearing these conversations and being interested in

150
00:10:05,399 --> 00:10:09,120
the topics and not hearing people ask
the questions that I would ask, And

151
00:10:09,200 --> 00:10:11,679
so it kind of led me into
saying, I want to have conversations with

152
00:10:11,720 --> 00:10:15,559
these people. I want to start
kind of throwing my theories and ideas into

153
00:10:15,600 --> 00:10:18,120
it. And here I am going
on almost two years later with Inquiries,

154
00:10:18,159 --> 00:10:22,320
and then the year after that I
started Bizarre Encounters. But Inquiries was kind

155
00:10:22,360 --> 00:10:26,279
of like my open minded talk show
where I would just talk to people about

156
00:10:26,840 --> 00:10:31,240
bizarre phenomenon, be it from like
an author's perspective, researcher, investigator,

157
00:10:31,320 --> 00:10:35,360
answer and then Bizarre Encounters is more
so the like deep dive show that my

158
00:10:35,440 --> 00:10:39,559
co host and I are, and
we both research into different things and we

159
00:10:39,639 --> 00:10:41,720
do deep dive topics on that,
so it's a little bit different format,

160
00:10:41,759 --> 00:10:46,080
ones like our research and the other
ones like an open minded talk show is

161
00:10:46,120 --> 00:10:50,399
probably kind of the best way to
describe it. Have you ever thought about

162
00:10:50,440 --> 00:10:56,279
delving more and learning more about those
astral travel sessions that you had, because

163
00:10:56,320 --> 00:11:00,639
I know I've done that too myself, and I've always thought about maybe learning

164
00:11:00,679 --> 00:11:05,360
more about how to do it and
not be so afraid of it or stop

165
00:11:05,399 --> 00:11:09,320
it ahead of where it would take
me, because I've gotten as far as

166
00:11:09,840 --> 00:11:13,360
well, from what I can remember
anyway, I've gotten as far as above

167
00:11:13,399 --> 00:11:18,159
the roof of my house and staying
there and feeling the wind in my hair

168
00:11:18,399 --> 00:11:20,799
and looking at the stars and all
the lights around me, and then I

169
00:11:20,879 --> 00:11:26,279
kind of go back down. So
I've never gotten any further than that that

170
00:11:26,440 --> 00:11:28,440
I know of, because I've spoken
to a couple of experts and they say,

171
00:11:28,440 --> 00:11:33,440
oh, you've gone further probably and
you just don't remember it, which

172
00:11:33,480 --> 00:11:37,120
is maybe the case. I don't
know, but they do have studies out

173
00:11:37,120 --> 00:11:41,519
there that you could learn how to
remember and how to do it even more.

174
00:11:41,639 --> 00:11:46,120
And I'm actually still afraid of that. So see, I've like dug

175
00:11:46,159 --> 00:11:50,320
into it. There's so many different
like philosophies on it, you don't necessarily

176
00:11:50,320 --> 00:11:52,600
always know which one to follow.
But at least when I would ask your

177
00:11:52,639 --> 00:11:56,960
travel, I'd always get sleep paralysis
after so I even like if I stopped

178
00:11:56,000 --> 00:12:01,200
remembering my dreams, if I got
sleep paralysis, I would just that I

179
00:12:01,279 --> 00:12:03,919
astra traveled somewhere. Because it was, like, you know, most people

180
00:12:03,080 --> 00:12:07,039
experienced sleep prolysis a couple of times
in their life. I've experienced sting to

181
00:12:07,039 --> 00:12:11,200
at least like once or twice every
six months, So I mean I've probably

182
00:12:11,240 --> 00:12:15,600
experienced it a good like twenty thirty
times by now. Yeah, me too,

183
00:12:15,840 --> 00:12:18,720
me too. It was it was
with me. It was it was

184
00:12:18,840 --> 00:12:24,000
a spirit that would be doing in
some sort of apparition trying to get my

185
00:12:24,039 --> 00:12:30,080
attention. They'd be waking me up
with that sleep paralysis. And it's scary

186
00:12:30,120 --> 00:12:33,600
when you go through that, for
sure, and I was able to deal

187
00:12:33,600 --> 00:12:35,799
with it, but then when it
started happening to my kids, then I

188
00:12:35,840 --> 00:12:39,120
had to really like stage the house
and sold the house because I'm doing all

189
00:12:39,120 --> 00:12:43,159
this paranormal investigating now, and I'm
sure that things, even though we tell

190
00:12:43,200 --> 00:12:48,039
them they can't come home with us
and we do the whole process, I'm

191
00:12:48,080 --> 00:12:52,080
sure that some of them still try. And because I have like all sorts

192
00:12:52,120 --> 00:12:58,600
of protection on my body and in
my mind they don't bother me, but

193
00:12:58,759 --> 00:13:01,600
my kid they will. So she'll
wake up and shock a mom, I

194
00:13:01,639 --> 00:13:05,039
had sleep paralysis. Hit freak me
out, and I'll be like, oh

195
00:13:05,039 --> 00:13:07,799
god, I got a stage to
a See. It's one of those things

196
00:13:07,840 --> 00:13:11,919
too that I feel like there's a
lot of beans that maybe don't necessarily like

197
00:13:13,080 --> 00:13:15,919
fit in, you know, the
lens that you're kind of looking at them

198
00:13:15,919 --> 00:13:18,480
through, so you know, you'll
try to do something and say, oh,

199
00:13:18,559 --> 00:13:20,639
stay away, and they'll go haha, yeah, I'll stay away,

200
00:13:20,679 --> 00:13:24,480
and they just kind of sit in
the back quietly waiting for opportunity. Yet

201
00:13:24,759 --> 00:13:26,919
And it's not that they're like vanished
so that they're gone. It's just that

202
00:13:26,960 --> 00:13:31,799
they kind of let you believe that
what you did worked, and they're they're

203
00:13:31,840 --> 00:13:33,879
just sitting there waiting. They're just
like, all right, I'll stop for

204
00:13:33,919 --> 00:13:39,399
now, but I'm here. Oh
my god, that's creepy. When you

205
00:13:39,440 --> 00:13:43,360
think of it that way, you
know, Oh my god, Well tell

206
00:13:43,440 --> 00:13:48,120
us about increase about our reality?
What's that all about? So actually,

207
00:13:48,279 --> 00:13:52,399
let me finish up the Windo story
first and then I'll then I'll dive into

208
00:13:52,399 --> 00:13:54,080
that part because I want to make
sure I don't leave a listeners hanging for

209
00:13:54,080 --> 00:13:56,799
two too. I wouldn't leave you. That was going to be a big

210
00:13:56,840 --> 00:14:00,799
highlight at the show. So don't
worry about it. Oh do you want?

211
00:14:00,840 --> 00:14:01,600
If you want, I can just
wait to come back around to it

212
00:14:01,679 --> 00:14:05,799
all about you, goodhead, you
can go ahead. So as far as

213
00:14:05,840 --> 00:14:09,960
like the rest of the encounter goes. So when we were regularly going to

214
00:14:11,000 --> 00:14:13,000
this place, we would just like
I said, we had everything kind of

215
00:14:13,080 --> 00:14:16,519
mapped out, and we just regularly
explored this place. And we got to

216
00:14:16,600 --> 00:14:20,559
a point where we had seen just
about everything. And there's these tunnels that

217
00:14:20,600 --> 00:14:24,120
go underneath the building. They call
them the Northville Tunnels, and they go

218
00:14:24,480 --> 00:14:28,799
through the city into like different places. They are like access tunnels for something

219
00:14:28,840 --> 00:14:31,600
at all. Yeah, we have
them. We have them in Sussex County

220
00:14:31,600 --> 00:14:35,000
where I lived too, with the
underground tunnels, and they go throughout the

221
00:14:35,000 --> 00:14:37,879
county that I live in, and
then surrounding counties too, and back in

222
00:14:37,919 --> 00:14:41,679
the day, from what I understand, they use them for all sorts of

223
00:14:41,720 --> 00:14:46,120
things. It's even storage for refrigeration
because it's cooler down there, and deliveries

224
00:14:46,120 --> 00:14:52,159
and stuff like that. Underground tunnels
were used for the underground Railroad. I

225
00:14:52,200 --> 00:14:54,799
mean, they had many purposes over
the years. But a lot of those

226
00:14:56,000 --> 00:15:01,120
outlets that are to the world now
have been blocked off because of people getting

227
00:15:01,159 --> 00:15:05,399
hurt or not coming out alive and
stuff like that. So there are there

228
00:15:05,440 --> 00:15:09,879
are branches that are unsafe and so
they've blocked everything. But I would love

229
00:15:11,039 --> 00:15:13,200
to kick down into those tunnels if
I could. I mean, I've spoken

230
00:15:13,240 --> 00:15:20,159
to firemen and my interviews who say
that it's almost kind of like initiation when

231
00:15:20,200 --> 00:15:22,960
they become a firefighter. They say, come, oh, we'll take you

232
00:15:24,000 --> 00:15:26,480
down to the tunnels, and they
bring them down to see what it's all

233
00:15:26,600 --> 00:15:30,639
like, and I'm like, I
want to go take me. So it

234
00:15:30,679 --> 00:15:33,240
sounds like very similar to what we
have here in Sussex County. Yeah,

235
00:15:33,240 --> 00:15:37,759
it's probably about the same thing.
I think it was intended they said,

236
00:15:37,799 --> 00:15:39,519
for like moving patients different spots,
but it went throughout the county, so

237
00:15:39,559 --> 00:15:45,799
I'm sure it had multiple uses and
got repracticed throughout the years. But I'm

238
00:15:45,840 --> 00:15:48,679
glad that you brought up the refrigeration
part because that'll actually kind of come in

239
00:15:48,679 --> 00:15:50,519
a little bit further on as far
as like me trying to figure out what

240
00:15:50,559 --> 00:15:54,120
exactly this thing was, But I
guess before that, I don't know if

241
00:15:54,159 --> 00:15:58,080
it's necessarily linked or not. But
we're up on the third story and there's

242
00:15:58,120 --> 00:16:02,759
like a wooded area behind this place, and I'm in Michigan, so it's

243
00:16:02,799 --> 00:16:07,000
not like this animal is necessarily like
native to Michigan. But we were up

244
00:16:07,039 --> 00:16:08,919
on the floor looking down and it
was me and my girlfriend and one of

245
00:16:08,960 --> 00:16:14,440
her friends, and I saw this
cougar walk out of the woodline and it

246
00:16:14,480 --> 00:16:17,120
looked up at us on like the
seventh floor, which I thought was kind

247
00:16:17,120 --> 00:16:18,600
of weird because we weren't really making
any noise or anything, and it made

248
00:16:18,639 --> 00:16:22,919
like direct eye contact with us.
And my girlfriend's friend saw it, and

249
00:16:23,000 --> 00:16:26,120
I was like, that's my scene
when I think I'm seeing she goes,

250
00:16:26,159 --> 00:16:29,039
yeah, it looks like a cougar. So I ended up looking into it,

251
00:16:29,080 --> 00:16:33,120
and apparently there was like there was
a cougar sighting in Northville but it

252
00:16:33,159 --> 00:16:36,879
was never the body was never found, the animal was never recovered. So

253
00:16:36,919 --> 00:16:38,360
it's just it was just one of
those things that kind of got left in

254
00:16:38,399 --> 00:16:41,960
the air, and it might link
into the windyg aspect of it, but

255
00:16:41,960 --> 00:16:45,120
I'm not one hundred percent sury.
I just thought it was weird that it

256
00:16:45,159 --> 00:16:48,960
looked up directly at us when we
weren't really making any noise. But like

257
00:16:48,000 --> 00:16:51,639
the following I think it was the
following weekend or the weekend after. It

258
00:16:51,679 --> 00:16:55,279
was right after that we ended up
deciding that we wanted to go into these

259
00:16:55,279 --> 00:16:59,279
tunnels. And our biggest fear with
these tunnels was the fact that, you

260
00:16:59,360 --> 00:17:00,919
know, you were on a out
of light, you know, you run

261
00:17:00,919 --> 00:17:03,440
out of batteries, anything like that, and you're pretty much feeling your wall,

262
00:17:03,759 --> 00:17:07,960
the wall your whole way back for
miles, and these things are old,

263
00:17:08,039 --> 00:17:11,599
decrepit, you know, moist,
wet, just you know, tunnels

264
00:17:11,640 --> 00:17:17,480
underground realistically, So we make it. We go start going down into the

265
00:17:17,480 --> 00:17:21,519
basement and in the basement there's to
the right there's this big cutout in the

266
00:17:21,559 --> 00:17:23,480
wall, but it looks like not
like Sony knocks a piece out, but

267
00:17:23,599 --> 00:17:27,759
rather that they purposely removed it because
it was a bricked wall with the pieces

268
00:17:27,799 --> 00:17:33,279
removed into the into like a circle
walkway. So I go to turn into

269
00:17:33,319 --> 00:17:34,799
there. This is the first time
we've decided to go down this far and

270
00:17:34,839 --> 00:17:38,079
actually start looking into the basement and
into the tunnels because there's an access point

271
00:17:38,119 --> 00:17:41,200
into the tunnels from there. And
as soon as I turn into this room,

272
00:17:41,440 --> 00:17:45,359
there's this metal like dirdy like cart, like you know, like the

273
00:17:45,400 --> 00:17:48,920
hospital carts, and it's up against
the wall, and I'm staring at that,

274
00:17:49,039 --> 00:17:53,319
and I hear this voice in my
right ear that says in like a

275
00:17:53,359 --> 00:17:57,079
whisper. And as I heard that, I saw this thing start to stand

276
00:17:57,200 --> 00:18:00,759
up. And the best way to
described this thing is tall, lanky,

277
00:18:02,200 --> 00:18:06,400
It had like decaying looking flesh color
to it, and it had this long,

278
00:18:06,519 --> 00:18:10,160
greasy, long, greasy black hair
that was like slicked back on the

279
00:18:10,200 --> 00:18:12,119
top of its head. And as
soon as I saw that, I just

280
00:18:12,160 --> 00:18:15,680
took off running. And I had
my girlfriend and her friend with me,

281
00:18:15,759 --> 00:18:18,440
so they took off running behind this
behind me or because I want to go

282
00:18:18,519 --> 00:18:22,799
take off, And as we're going
to leave, she my girlfriend was actually

283
00:18:22,839 --> 00:18:26,000
taking some picture, so I'll have
to send you it after the show.

284
00:18:26,079 --> 00:18:29,359
But it didn't come out as something
like solid or physical, but it almost

285
00:18:29,400 --> 00:18:33,920
looks like an apparition picture. But
I didn't know what I had seen for

286
00:18:33,039 --> 00:18:37,079
a long time, like I just
assumed that. I honestly didn't really know

287
00:18:37,119 --> 00:18:41,960
what to assume because you look up
Windigoes and most people's depiction of him is

288
00:18:41,000 --> 00:18:45,240
like the deer headed creature. But
that's kind of where I left it on

289
00:18:45,279 --> 00:18:48,279
retainer for a while that I started
digging in and found like the rake for

290
00:18:48,319 --> 00:18:51,200
example, pale crawler, so I
was like, maybe I saw one of

291
00:18:51,240 --> 00:18:55,319
these things. And once I started
digging more into windog because everything kept coming

292
00:18:55,359 --> 00:18:59,759
back to it when I started explaining
like the characteristics. I actually did a

293
00:18:59,759 --> 00:19:02,880
show with Justin from Phipps of the
Corn. He started kind of connecting pieces

294
00:19:03,079 --> 00:19:06,440
for this one with me too.
But as far as like the folklore goes

295
00:19:06,559 --> 00:19:10,759
for Windigoes, they're not the depiction
that people think they are. They're more

296
00:19:10,799 --> 00:19:12,240
like a zombie. That's kind of
the best way to describe it. Like

297
00:19:12,279 --> 00:19:17,400
a fleshy, lanky, gross looking
creature that is so hungry that it eats

298
00:19:17,440 --> 00:19:22,039
its lips off, as they describe
it. But it gets that deerheaded view

299
00:19:22,119 --> 00:19:26,640
from like other people basically retelling the
story from like white settlers coming through and

300
00:19:26,640 --> 00:19:32,279
picking up the windy go culture or
the wind Togo story and then kind of

301
00:19:32,319 --> 00:19:36,240
mixing it with like Christian beliefs and
trying to make everything that's pagan as they

302
00:19:36,240 --> 00:19:40,240
would see it as demonic. So
it just took on like a whole other

303
00:19:41,119 --> 00:19:45,319
viewpoint from white settlers hearing these stories
instead of it actually coming straight from the

304
00:19:45,440 --> 00:19:49,359
natives telling the story. So then
the whole idea of like what a wind

305
00:19:49,359 --> 00:19:53,480
to go completely got misconscrewed through time. So like I mean, even now,

306
00:19:53,519 --> 00:19:56,200
like I said, everybody thinks that
a windigo is this deer headed creature,

307
00:19:56,240 --> 00:20:00,720
but the natives never described it that
way at any point. And I'm

308
00:20:00,720 --> 00:20:04,200
pretty convinced that the people that are
talking about rake encounters or pale Coroller encounters

309
00:20:04,400 --> 00:20:08,519
are actually seeing these wind Togo creatures, but they just don't have a good

310
00:20:08,559 --> 00:20:11,359
level of context for it, because
everybody thinks that the wind to go is

311
00:20:11,359 --> 00:20:17,880
something totally different than what it was. But as far as like the cougar

312
00:20:17,960 --> 00:20:22,240
goes, I mean assumably that there's
always the whole animalistic like shape shifting ide

313
00:20:22,359 --> 00:20:26,799
and perspective that comes in especially when
you start getting into like like skin walkers

314
00:20:26,799 --> 00:20:30,519
for example, which seemed to be
just like the best way to kind of

315
00:20:30,559 --> 00:20:36,720
describe it as the difference between the
two is that they seem to always like

316
00:20:36,799 --> 00:20:41,240
there's when it comes to the skin
walker, you have a medicine man that

317
00:20:41,400 --> 00:20:45,839
basically like sells his soul in a
way to be able to become this creature,

318
00:20:45,319 --> 00:20:48,640
versus like the wind to Go,
where it seems to have a lot

319
00:20:48,680 --> 00:20:52,480
of the same abilities, but it's
not that the person chose to go down

320
00:20:52,519 --> 00:20:56,359
that path, but rather that somebody
they resorted to cannibalism or they were too

321
00:20:56,720 --> 00:21:00,640
had too much pride in other different
beliefs as far as when it go goes

322
00:21:00,640 --> 00:21:04,160
like the wachuwga for example, and
then they end up becoming this creature based

323
00:21:04,200 --> 00:21:08,920
on the fact of them having to
do some type of awful act, where

324
00:21:10,000 --> 00:21:12,400
like the skin walker, they're intentionally
doing an awful act. So like,

325
00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:15,880
as I started digging into a lot
of the folklore, it seemed like there's

326
00:21:15,920 --> 00:21:19,039
a lot that's like comparable between the
two. So then I started taking out

327
00:21:19,039 --> 00:21:22,839
of the things into consideration, like
the possibility being able to shift into other

328
00:21:22,880 --> 00:21:29,079
animals or at least making people perceive
them as other animals, except for I

329
00:21:29,079 --> 00:21:32,960
would assume that as far as like
the wind Togo goes versus like a skin

330
00:21:33,000 --> 00:21:36,039
walker for example, like the one
is able to choose or the other one

331
00:21:36,200 --> 00:21:41,640
is at the will and bay of
this evil, evil spirit or force that's

332
00:21:42,000 --> 00:21:45,720
occupying their vessel or their body at
the time. But it was just super

333
00:21:45,759 --> 00:21:48,240
weird encounter. I started digging into
bunch of stuff. I still don't know

334
00:21:48,240 --> 00:21:52,079
when one hundred percent of what I
saw. All I can really say is

335
00:21:52,079 --> 00:21:55,319
that I've made a lot of different
theories on it, and it definitely wasn't

336
00:21:55,359 --> 00:21:57,799
a person. Because of the shape
of this thing, being super tall and

337
00:21:57,880 --> 00:22:03,599
just decrectit lanky like, it definitely
wasn't a person. But the best that

338
00:22:03,680 --> 00:22:07,640
I can kind of describe this thing
as is possibly a wind to go or

339
00:22:07,839 --> 00:22:11,279
what people call like a paill crawler
or a rape Very interesting. I mean,

340
00:22:11,359 --> 00:22:15,200
I've never even heard of this before. This is all news to me,

341
00:22:15,799 --> 00:22:22,039
and I'm really curious to learn about
these different types of creatures because there's

342
00:22:22,039 --> 00:22:23,519
so much more out there that I
wasn't even aware of. I mean,

343
00:22:23,559 --> 00:22:27,920
I had this this square box of
things that fit in it, this is

344
00:22:27,920 --> 00:22:32,240
what I was interested in, and
like, okay, I want to learn

345
00:22:32,279 --> 00:22:33,359
more about it. And then all
of a sudden, the box just fool

346
00:22:33,440 --> 00:22:37,759
larger and larger. I hear all
this stuff and I'm like, oh my

347
00:22:37,839 --> 00:22:40,759
god, and you try and wrap
your head around it, and then you

348
00:22:40,839 --> 00:22:44,480
talk to all these people that are
professionals in the field and you hear about

349
00:22:44,519 --> 00:22:48,559
this, and you're like, oh
my god, is it real or isn't

350
00:22:48,559 --> 00:22:52,079
it? You know, so I've
never even heard about the windigo until you've

351
00:22:52,119 --> 00:22:57,400
mentioned it. So it's pretty interesting
stuff for sure. And now my boxes

352
00:22:57,440 --> 00:23:00,880
then it's always can cost expanding every
time I hear about something new, and

353
00:23:00,920 --> 00:23:03,359
I of course got a research and
dive into it. So like i have

354
00:23:03,440 --> 00:23:10,480
a wide array of different creatures and
different types of beings that things could possibly

355
00:23:10,519 --> 00:23:12,880
be. But I've heard so many
different stories of people encountering so many different

356
00:23:12,880 --> 00:23:15,640
things. I love theorizing what they
could be. And I mean, I

357
00:23:15,640 --> 00:23:18,960
mean you think about like I've been
hearing about other dimensions, and I'm starting

358
00:23:18,960 --> 00:23:22,920
to really be open minded about the
possibility that these things can go in and

359
00:23:22,960 --> 00:23:30,119
out of dimensions and the possibility that
they are real, that they exist,

360
00:23:30,160 --> 00:23:36,200
that you know, as crazy as
it sounds, that there is this huge

361
00:23:36,200 --> 00:23:41,680
possibility that these things do come from
other dimensions into our world, whether it

362
00:23:41,759 --> 00:23:48,519
be just spontaneously for certain periods of
time or whatever makes it happen. I

363
00:23:48,920 --> 00:23:53,279
have no explanation for it, really, but it's just very intriguing. Nonetheless,

364
00:23:53,319 --> 00:23:57,200
and you mentioned about the tunnels and
stuff, So do you think this

365
00:23:57,240 --> 00:24:03,920
thing just resuildes there, hides there
or yeah, Because you say, well,

366
00:24:03,920 --> 00:24:06,279
you went into the tunnels first of
all, I guess my question is

367
00:24:06,519 --> 00:24:07,880
it's open to the public, can
you just go? If you want to

368
00:24:07,920 --> 00:24:12,160
go, you have to sneak into
the place, at least the hospital.

369
00:24:12,200 --> 00:24:15,720
It was like right now to a
police station. So I saw a lot

370
00:24:15,720 --> 00:24:18,880
of people get arrested trying to get
into this place. But we were kind

371
00:24:18,880 --> 00:24:22,160
of smart about where we parts and
everything. But part of like the windy

372
00:24:22,160 --> 00:24:26,440
goo lore, which is why I
mentioned the refrigeration thing, is that they

373
00:24:26,480 --> 00:24:29,279
say that you're not safe from the
wind to go from the first no fall

374
00:24:29,359 --> 00:24:32,440
to the last now fall. And
these creatures are known for coming out during

375
00:24:32,480 --> 00:24:34,759
like the winter months. They're more
of like a northern folklore type of creature.

376
00:24:36,720 --> 00:24:41,960
But the reason for that being that
they're decaying flesh essentially, So the

377
00:24:41,960 --> 00:24:44,960
theory behind it is that these things
would go into caves, they would bury

378
00:24:44,960 --> 00:24:47,960
themselves in the dirt, they would
do different things in order to maintain a

379
00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:51,839
cooler temperature. So if you dig
into the native folklore as far as like

380
00:24:51,839 --> 00:24:55,799
how these things preserve themselves during the
warmer months, which this was I believe

381
00:24:55,920 --> 00:25:00,599
like fall, end of summer kind
of area, that makes sense why I

382
00:25:00,599 --> 00:25:03,400
would be down in the tunnels because
it was like a good thirty twenty to

383
00:25:03,440 --> 00:25:07,720
thirty degree drop going into the tunnels, So it kind of fit even more

384
00:25:07,759 --> 00:25:10,960
so that narrative of it possibly being
a wind to go, considering like the

385
00:25:11,039 --> 00:25:12,599
actions in which you know, I
didn't see this thing ever leave the tunnel.

386
00:25:12,599 --> 00:25:15,839
I don't think it made it up
past outside of the hospital and outside

387
00:25:15,880 --> 00:25:19,799
or anything like that. Like we
only basically heard it moving behind us as

388
00:25:19,839 --> 00:25:23,160
we're coming up out of the basement, so assumably it was just trying to

389
00:25:23,200 --> 00:25:26,759
stay down there and not be seen
by people. But this whole place was

390
00:25:26,839 --> 00:25:30,799
kind of weird in general. That
you know, like any abandoned hospital,

391
00:25:30,799 --> 00:25:33,759
there's people that are always making different
markings on the walls, and they don't

392
00:25:33,759 --> 00:25:37,559
necessarily know what they mean different schigules, So I mean, it definitely could

393
00:25:37,559 --> 00:25:41,160
have been a wind to go,
or maybe it could have theoretically been something

394
00:25:41,240 --> 00:25:45,960
else that somebody summoned without realizing it
from producing writing different signals and sigils on

395
00:25:47,000 --> 00:25:51,119
the walls and maybe even trying to
do some type of practice that they read

396
00:25:51,160 --> 00:25:53,440
about in a book, for example, and not realizing what happened. But

397
00:25:53,880 --> 00:25:57,960
they ended up shutting this hospital down
soon after. Because so when I went

398
00:25:59,000 --> 00:26:02,799
there a few times, like the
elevator doors were you'd have to cram yourself

399
00:26:02,799 --> 00:26:04,359
into it in order to be able
to look down the elevator shafts, and

400
00:26:04,400 --> 00:26:07,359
there was two people that had fallen
down the elevator shafts and had died.

401
00:26:07,400 --> 00:26:11,359
So they completely like box this place
off, shut everything down, and me

402
00:26:11,480 --> 00:26:15,039
spending as much time as I spent
there, I realized that, like I

403
00:26:15,039 --> 00:26:17,799
think there was some kind of foul
play involves, and maybe they were aware

404
00:26:17,880 --> 00:26:21,400
that there was some kind of weird
thing in this building that it was doing

405
00:26:21,440 --> 00:26:23,960
this, because they explain it,
Yeah, you could, you just couldn't

406
00:26:23,960 --> 00:26:27,079
have fallen down these elevator shafts,
Like the doors are pretty much like welded,

407
00:26:27,480 --> 00:26:30,480
but most of the doors are welded
shut, and then the couple of

408
00:26:30,559 --> 00:26:33,559
floors that were open, it was
like maybe an eight inch gap. So

409
00:26:33,640 --> 00:26:37,319
I think the only way I could
see that somebody could fall down those is

410
00:26:37,319 --> 00:26:41,680
if they were trying to get away
from something possibly or they were pushed through

411
00:26:41,720 --> 00:26:48,279
it, one of the two.
Yeah, well that's that's crazy. Huh.

412
00:26:48,039 --> 00:26:52,519
Oh my god. You think about
that, and it's just a weird

413
00:26:52,599 --> 00:26:56,880
encounter because I still don't quite know
how to place it. I didn't.

414
00:26:56,960 --> 00:26:59,960
I didn't. I went like a
good four or five years without telling anybody

415
00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:03,440
about any part of that story because
I didn't even know how to like place

416
00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:06,119
it in my own mind, let
alone try to describe what I saw to

417
00:27:06,200 --> 00:27:08,079
somebody else. Crazy. You don't
want them to say, Ellie or you're

418
00:27:08,119 --> 00:27:11,519
all crazy in the head. Dude. You don't want to hear that because

419
00:27:12,000 --> 00:27:15,519
you saw what you saw and you
can't explain it. But you know what,

420
00:27:15,599 --> 00:27:18,759
I think people are more openly receptive
to talk about this sort of stuff

421
00:27:18,759 --> 00:27:22,599
now, which makes it easy to
talk about it, right. You know,

422
00:27:23,079 --> 00:27:26,720
there's so many of us out there. We can't all be crazy,

423
00:27:26,279 --> 00:27:30,119
at least with in the community I
think that was partly what it was is

424
00:27:30,160 --> 00:27:33,559
that even in like even all the
stuff that I dive into regularly, as

425
00:27:33,559 --> 00:27:37,519
far as like aliens currently working on
a different couple different shows too, anything

426
00:27:37,559 --> 00:27:41,400
that I'm diving into, it's not
like I go around and talk to people

427
00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:45,079
about it in like my normal life. Like it's kind of sectioned off to

428
00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:49,920
people in the community because you know, I'm Sasquatched. Isn't like that out

429
00:27:49,960 --> 00:27:53,920
there in the community by any means. It's like the entry level into the

430
00:27:53,920 --> 00:27:59,039
community, but it's still a stereotype. But if you go around telling people

431
00:27:59,079 --> 00:28:02,680
you full on belief even Taskquatch in
your normal everyday life, you are going

432
00:28:02,720 --> 00:28:04,559
to look at you like you're crazy. So it's like, I'm open about

433
00:28:04,599 --> 00:28:07,880
my research for the people that want
to come help them look about it,

434
00:28:07,920 --> 00:28:11,799
but I'm not going around and telling
everybody about, you know, the squash

435
00:28:11,880 --> 00:28:15,079
trips I go on or anything like
that, because it's just like, you

436
00:28:15,119 --> 00:28:18,759
don't want the normal world looking at
you like you're crazy, even though I

437
00:28:18,799 --> 00:28:22,599
guess they could just publicly go online
and listen to all the different stuff you

438
00:28:22,640 --> 00:28:26,880
talk about, but it's a matter
of themselves so much. I got to

439
00:28:26,920 --> 00:28:30,240
tell you, when I was writing
my books on true account hauntings, which

440
00:28:30,279 --> 00:28:36,440
would ghost stories, in my community
in the county where I live, people

441
00:28:36,480 --> 00:28:41,400
were just reaching out to me with
different stories about things that they had encountered.

442
00:28:41,440 --> 00:28:45,920
And then all of a sudden,
I was getting all these stories from

443
00:28:45,920 --> 00:28:51,759
people about Bigfoot in Sussex County,
along with UFO sidings as well, and

444
00:28:52,519 --> 00:28:56,079
they were such good story shame that
I could not leave them out of the

445
00:28:56,079 --> 00:28:59,200
books, and thinking, well,
how am I going to fit them into

446
00:28:59,240 --> 00:29:06,160
a book good ghost stories? So
I created the title Sussex County Hauntings and

447
00:29:06,359 --> 00:29:11,400
Other Strange Phenomena, so this way
I could talk about those Bigfoot stories and

448
00:29:11,440 --> 00:29:15,119
talk about those UFO stories because they
were so good and there were so many

449
00:29:15,160 --> 00:29:19,079
of them. So I'm actually glad
that I ended up dealing that with the

450
00:29:19,079 --> 00:29:25,880
books too, because it actually opened
up a whole array of opportunity to write

451
00:29:25,880 --> 00:29:30,440
about different things that would normally fit
under that ghost theme, like near death

452
00:29:30,519 --> 00:29:37,119
experiences and reincarnation stuff like that.
But that first book is filled with Bigfoot

453
00:29:37,160 --> 00:29:41,480
stories. Got to tell you,
you know, stories from rangers, park

454
00:29:41,559 --> 00:29:47,000
rangers, cops, teachers, people
that you wouldn't call crazy. I mean,

455
00:29:47,000 --> 00:29:49,079
they call them, you know,
a normal joke crazy, but they

456
00:29:49,079 --> 00:29:53,279
wouldn't really necessarily call a cop crazy, right, I mean, at least

457
00:29:53,319 --> 00:29:56,839
for all that stuff too. I'm
glad that you accompanied everything all into your

458
00:29:56,839 --> 00:30:00,960
one book because I feel like a
lot of it's has a lot of connecting

459
00:30:02,039 --> 00:30:06,759
factors. But the communities have stayed
divided for so long that there's like paranormal

460
00:30:06,799 --> 00:30:11,039
people, crypted people, UFO people. That is not until relatively recently that

461
00:30:11,079 --> 00:30:15,200
I feel like there's people that are
just researchers of all the phenomenon all as

462
00:30:15,240 --> 00:30:18,880
a whole. And it's only been
like maybe the last like five ten years

463
00:30:18,920 --> 00:30:22,200
that people have started looking at things
through all lenses. Because even before that,

464
00:30:22,319 --> 00:30:26,240
people that were starting to connect stuff, it was like kind of vaguely

465
00:30:26,240 --> 00:30:27,720
connecting stuff. They still kind of
picked the camp. But now you have

466
00:30:27,759 --> 00:30:33,079
people that aren't necessarily a paranormal investigator
or a cryptid investigator or anything. They're

467
00:30:33,119 --> 00:30:37,640
just a forty in researcher that looks
into all the phenomenon all at once exactly

468
00:30:38,160 --> 00:30:42,240
exactly do you buy any chance and
that this is just a north question,

469
00:30:42,359 --> 00:30:47,720
but do you think that they're inner
dimensional at all? As far as what

470
00:30:47,839 --> 00:30:53,880
exactly elementals or the windygo any of
that stuff coming through. Do you think

471
00:30:53,880 --> 00:30:57,359
it's interdimensional? Do you think they're
coming from other dimensions, or do you

472
00:30:57,359 --> 00:31:00,440
think you're in this reality or or
do you really know how to go out

473
00:31:00,440 --> 00:31:03,519
on it at all. I think
it's like a different mix of things.

474
00:31:04,319 --> 00:31:07,960
I don't. I think that there's
different things that come from different places,

475
00:31:07,960 --> 00:31:10,079
and there's some that are kind of
like a mix of holes. Like just

476
00:31:10,079 --> 00:31:12,160
as an example, as far as
like the dog man phenomenon goes, like

477
00:31:12,200 --> 00:31:15,839
you hear different variations of dog men. So even within that, I think

478
00:31:15,839 --> 00:31:19,440
that there's things that are natural that
are kind of fitting the category, there's

479
00:31:19,440 --> 00:31:22,960
things that are interdimensional that are fitting
the category, and then there's also man

480
00:31:23,000 --> 00:31:27,519
created things that are fitting that category. Even as far as like sasquatch goes,

481
00:31:27,559 --> 00:31:30,599
I know a lot of people have
physical encounters and a lot of people

482
00:31:30,720 --> 00:31:36,079
have these interdimensional encounters with them.
So I've even kind of theorized that,

483
00:31:36,519 --> 00:31:38,400
you know, there could be like
time split phenomenon that's happening, and that

484
00:31:38,440 --> 00:31:41,680
could be The connecting factor with a
lot of this stuff is that it's not

485
00:31:41,759 --> 00:31:47,759
necessarily that it's physical or spiritual it's
just that it's there's like a veil thing,

486
00:31:47,880 --> 00:31:51,319
or these things are going through time
splits, and then sometimes the timeline

487
00:31:51,359 --> 00:31:53,440
corrects itself, which would be like
the random footprints that just stop and go

488
00:31:53,480 --> 00:31:56,279
away. And then there's other times
when you know, they get to end

489
00:31:56,359 --> 00:32:00,039
up getting stuck here, and then
it becomes more of like thing. But

490
00:32:00,160 --> 00:32:04,240
I mean, everything that I kind
of based around it's it's all theories.

491
00:32:04,279 --> 00:32:07,200
Like I'm not one hundred percent sure
on it, and my camp regularly changes

492
00:32:07,240 --> 00:32:10,160
on it. But I was had
somebody on the show a week or two

493
00:32:10,160 --> 00:32:15,440
ago actually, and we kind of
got into this whole idea about negative dimensions,

494
00:32:15,640 --> 00:32:17,599
and everybody kind of thinks of something
as being like a parallel dimension that's

495
00:32:17,680 --> 00:32:22,440
like next to us or something that's
existing within the place that we're in currently.

496
00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:24,759
But what we kind of started diving
into is he started talking about like

497
00:32:25,039 --> 00:32:29,680
molecular structures and how like everybody kind
of had this idea of like how a

498
00:32:29,759 --> 00:32:32,160
proton and how an electron kind of
sit together. But they started doing some

499
00:32:32,200 --> 00:32:37,519
research into I think it was being
used for some type of like nuclear testing,

500
00:32:38,039 --> 00:32:42,279
but they figure out that you can
create different variations of it where they

501
00:32:42,359 --> 00:32:46,079
end up basically chaining off of each
other, and when you get them so

502
00:32:46,119 --> 00:32:49,880
close to each other, they end
up basically like creating this like negative where

503
00:32:49,880 --> 00:32:52,960
they'll keep sucking everything into it.
And so we kind of got into this

504
00:32:52,960 --> 00:32:58,759
whole theory about negative dimensions being where
these things could potentially be coming from and

505
00:32:58,799 --> 00:33:01,680
not necessarily a parallel to mention,
because you get into the whole idea about

506
00:33:02,400 --> 00:33:06,799
when people have like battery loss when
they're dealing with the para normal or dealing

507
00:33:06,839 --> 00:33:10,880
with sasquatch or aliens. And if
something was creating this structure that he was

508
00:33:10,920 --> 00:33:16,039
talking about, it would basically be
pulling all energy into this thing all at

509
00:33:16,039 --> 00:33:20,160
once in order for it to be
able to react and basically be able to

510
00:33:20,160 --> 00:33:23,440
create itself. So the reason why
people could be having these experiences where they

511
00:33:23,440 --> 00:33:29,759
completely lose battery could be because there's
some type of portal that's being opened and

512
00:33:29,799 --> 00:33:32,000
it's sucking all the energy out of
everything around it in order for it to

513
00:33:32,039 --> 00:33:36,839
have energy to be able to function. So, I mean, that's that's

514
00:33:36,880 --> 00:33:40,079
like a totally different concept that I'm
kind of pretty fascinating that it's not again

515
00:33:40,319 --> 00:33:44,519
like a parallel dimension, but rather
a negative dimension. That's kind of hard

516
00:33:44,759 --> 00:33:50,759
to describe that it's like almost like
a microscopic place that's existing like negative of

517
00:33:50,799 --> 00:33:53,960
our dimension. Just a different,
different insight of thinking about it. But

518
00:33:54,000 --> 00:33:59,119
I definitely think that there are things
that are something physical. I think that

519
00:33:59,119 --> 00:34:02,319
there's stuff that could potentially be coming
from different planets. But I also throw

520
00:34:02,400 --> 00:34:07,640
into the interdimensional theory and it's kind
of hard to place it. It kind

521
00:34:07,640 --> 00:34:10,360
of depends on the encounter. But
I do also as a side note of

522
00:34:10,360 --> 00:34:15,119
all of this, I think that
you know, there's like the orbs that

523
00:34:15,119 --> 00:34:20,239
are the connecting factor as far as
aliens, cryptids, and the paranormal go.

524
00:34:20,960 --> 00:34:23,719
And actually I was just talking about
it on the show that I actually

525
00:34:23,800 --> 00:34:30,239
just wrapped up before this. But
basically the idea is that maybe these things

526
00:34:30,360 --> 00:34:34,480
are fully conscious and that they're able
to pick what form they want to present

527
00:34:34,519 --> 00:34:38,079
themselves as in order to like scare
people away, for example. So all

528
00:34:38,119 --> 00:34:42,840
this phenomenon can be linked to these
orbs, and these orbs just choose that

529
00:34:42,880 --> 00:34:44,960
if you're they know you're scared of
aliens, they're going to be an alien

530
00:34:45,000 --> 00:34:49,199
in order to scare you away from
them, or they know to scare you

531
00:34:49,199 --> 00:34:52,760
away, But they could essentially be
like either elemental beings that are just existing

532
00:34:52,800 --> 00:34:59,199
as white orbs and they can just
choose their shape, or they could potentially

533
00:34:59,199 --> 00:35:01,039
be just like a whole other life
form that we're not aware of that we

534
00:35:01,199 --> 00:35:05,360
just perceive them as whatever we're scared
of because we know we're supposed to get

535
00:35:05,360 --> 00:35:07,760
away from him. But there's just
there's so many theories that will kind of

536
00:35:07,800 --> 00:35:12,480
dive into different aspects of the phenomenon. But I guess to bring it all

537
00:35:12,519 --> 00:35:16,800
back around, I definitely take into
consideration the whole idea of they're being interdimensional

538
00:35:16,840 --> 00:35:21,360
beings just as much as I take
into consideration they're actually being physical beings that

539
00:35:21,440 --> 00:35:27,880
exist within our reality, which brings
me to the question inquiries of our reality?

540
00:35:27,880 --> 00:35:31,000
What's that all about? H So, actually, as far as that

541
00:35:31,079 --> 00:35:34,559
name goes, it was just one
of those perfect names that, like I

542
00:35:34,599 --> 00:35:37,840
said, when I was hearing a
lot of different other shows and a lot

543
00:35:37,840 --> 00:35:40,719
of different other researchers talk, it
was just a matter of them not necessarily

544
00:35:40,719 --> 00:35:45,400
always asking the same questions that I
would ask, or the just theories that

545
00:35:45,400 --> 00:35:49,760
I would throw in on things.
So I said, decide I want to

546
00:35:49,760 --> 00:35:52,280
start a podcast but I feel like
it's gonna sound weird, But one of

547
00:35:52,280 --> 00:35:53,920
the first things you kind of need
to do is pick like a name to

548
00:35:53,920 --> 00:35:57,800
be able to put everything behind,
because you can have great episodes, but

549
00:35:57,840 --> 00:36:00,519
you almost I feel like if you
needed to have a name just to like

550
00:36:00,599 --> 00:36:04,199
place yourself as far as things go. But that came to me as like

551
00:36:04,199 --> 00:36:06,920
a shower idea, and I just
felt like it was perfect because all I

552
00:36:06,960 --> 00:36:12,639
really do is question our reality.
So increase of our reality is questions of

553
00:36:12,880 --> 00:36:16,760
our trying to accompany everybody reality,
because I'm trying to view it from the

554
00:36:16,760 --> 00:36:21,599
standpoint of not everybody necessarily having their
own reality, but we're all existing in

555
00:36:21,599 --> 00:36:25,800
a reality together, so we have
to inquire into what should be happening in

556
00:36:25,840 --> 00:36:30,360
our reality. So it's one of
those things that the name kind of fell

557
00:36:30,400 --> 00:36:32,559
into place, and then it all
kind of fell into place because I had

558
00:36:32,599 --> 00:36:36,559
a totally different idea for the show
and what I originally wanted to start with

559
00:36:36,679 --> 00:36:39,519
versus what it turned into. But
like most shows, it starts incompanying like

560
00:36:39,599 --> 00:36:45,000
your personality, and as your personality
changes through time and your perspective changes through

561
00:36:45,039 --> 00:36:47,480
time, it kind of your show
kind of warps and transforms with you,

562
00:36:49,039 --> 00:36:52,000
but increase of our reality seems like
it's just that perfect name that no matter

563
00:36:52,039 --> 00:36:55,440
how much my views and everything change, it's still just gonna be one of

564
00:36:55,480 --> 00:36:59,800
those perfect names because it's at the
root of all of it. All of

565
00:36:59,840 --> 00:37:05,639
our try to do is answer and
question things within our reality. So then

566
00:37:05,679 --> 00:37:12,239
it turned into this open minded talk
show essentially about just that I'll have people

567
00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:16,480
on, like I said, that
are experiencers, researchers, authors, investigators,

568
00:37:19,199 --> 00:37:22,039
philosophers. I guess you could say, to people that just make series

569
00:37:22,039 --> 00:37:25,239
and everything based on everything, and
then it's just pretty much I'll have people

570
00:37:25,280 --> 00:37:29,559
come on. Uh they'll start with
just basically roughly who they are, and

571
00:37:29,559 --> 00:37:35,320
then we'll get into this vast deep
conversation about inquiries into our reality essentially,

572
00:37:36,000 --> 00:37:38,599
and uh, it's just it's a
really really cool show, is as far

573
00:37:38,639 --> 00:37:43,039
as like from my perspective of me
getting to do it because it was one

574
00:37:43,079 --> 00:37:45,719
of those things that in your normal
life you don't always get to have these

575
00:37:45,800 --> 00:37:50,159
like deep conversations, and a lot
of people that are on podcasts, you

576
00:37:50,199 --> 00:37:52,360
know, they'll just do They'll have
somebody on for like something in particular,

577
00:37:52,719 --> 00:37:55,599
and every show that that person goes
on. You know, it's kind of

578
00:37:55,639 --> 00:38:00,199
like they're going over the same thing
that they go on on any other show.

579
00:38:00,519 --> 00:38:02,280
But where I kind of try to
tear it away is that I don't

580
00:38:02,320 --> 00:38:08,159
go into any of its scripted whatsoever. It kind of just organically develops itself

581
00:38:08,440 --> 00:38:12,800
as the episode goes on, and
if I noticed that the guest is really

582
00:38:12,840 --> 00:38:15,559
interested in something, or if they
bring something up that connects in with my

583
00:38:15,679 --> 00:38:20,400
research, gives me the room an
opportunity to be able to dive into that

584
00:38:20,559 --> 00:38:23,679
and not necessarily keep it to a
specific script or view of things. So

585
00:38:24,360 --> 00:38:29,119
it's just it's been going on almost
two years now and haven't stopped, and

586
00:38:29,159 --> 00:38:34,360
I have no plans on stopping by
any means. But I have honestly just

587
00:38:34,400 --> 00:38:38,119
developed more inquiries into our reality as
I've progressed through it, instead of actually

588
00:38:38,119 --> 00:38:44,119
answering inquiries of our reality. So
still putting in I guess that probably answers

589
00:38:44,239 --> 00:38:47,599
my next question where you mentioned you're
a fourteen researcher, is that how it's

590
00:38:47,639 --> 00:38:52,440
pronounced for fourteen? Yeah? Forty
in, which is just it kind of

591
00:38:52,480 --> 00:38:55,079
in companies, just everything all into
one. It's not like I mean,

592
00:38:55,119 --> 00:39:02,840
I specialize in cryptozoology, but I
definitely die into extraterrestrial's paranormal just beings as

593
00:39:02,880 --> 00:39:07,239
a whole, like I like digging
into folklore. So I just forty in

594
00:39:07,320 --> 00:39:12,840
kind of incompanies all of it into
one place. I feel it feel like

595
00:39:12,880 --> 00:39:15,639
it's just kind of a good name
for that, because there's not the colid

596
00:39:15,719 --> 00:39:21,400
name yet for all of them yet. The listeners forty in Phenomena are events

597
00:39:21,440 --> 00:39:24,960
which seem to challenge the boundaries of
accepted scientific knowledge, which is pretty much

598
00:39:24,960 --> 00:39:32,480
what you've just said and described in
overall about the inquiries of reality show What

599
00:39:32,599 --> 00:39:38,239
about Bizarre Encounters? What's that all
about? So bizarre encounters. Originally it

600
00:39:38,280 --> 00:39:44,480
was going to be, I guess, basically just diving into people's bizarre encounters.

601
00:39:44,519 --> 00:39:47,880
It was pretty straightforward as far as
the NAD goes. But I purposely

602
00:39:47,960 --> 00:39:52,960
picked the word bizarre because it's supposed
to be something unusual or odd that sparks

603
00:39:53,280 --> 00:39:58,440
amusement. So it's like something you're
entertained by, but it's something that's strange

604
00:39:58,559 --> 00:40:01,840
or weird or off. So it
started to become It originally started off as

605
00:40:01,880 --> 00:40:05,800
an interview show that I was doing
with another podcaster at the time, named

606
00:40:05,840 --> 00:40:07,800
Ghosts, who's on my third eye. He didn't. He ended up leaving

607
00:40:07,840 --> 00:40:12,400
at one point because he was just
focusing on his podcast. So it's just

608
00:40:12,480 --> 00:40:15,639
one of those mutual things you end
up leaving. So then after that,

609
00:40:15,679 --> 00:40:19,119
I ended up having this guy named
Oran, who I had had as a

610
00:40:19,119 --> 00:40:22,400
guest on my show, kind of
show a little bit of interest, like

611
00:40:22,519 --> 00:40:24,800
I was interested in doing some episodes
with him, just because the way we

612
00:40:24,880 --> 00:40:29,159
bounce back and forth just worked really
really well. Uh So I ended up

613
00:40:29,159 --> 00:40:31,079
putting on an ad after ghost left
the show, saying that I wanted a

614
00:40:31,320 --> 00:40:35,679
new co host, and I had
a bunch of people end up hitting me

615
00:40:35,760 --> 00:40:38,320
up and everything. I was gonna
start kind of like scheduling interviews with people

616
00:40:38,440 --> 00:40:42,079
just to see how the flow went
back and forth. And then I was

617
00:40:42,079 --> 00:40:44,039
like, hey, no, already, I already had somebody in mind that

618
00:40:44,079 --> 00:40:45,480
I want to do for this.
So I ended up hitting up Orrin.

619
00:40:46,000 --> 00:40:50,599
Uh he said he'd be interested in
doing it, and the first couple episodes

620
00:40:50,679 --> 00:40:54,639
were basically just you know, us
interviewing people about their bizarre encounters. And

621
00:40:55,079 --> 00:40:59,880
soon after that you kind of realized
that Orn likes to write and research.

622
00:41:00,039 --> 00:41:02,639
I like to write and research.
So Ghosts was more of like an interview

623
00:41:02,679 --> 00:41:06,360
guy, and I was kind of
doing the same thing on Inquiries, but

624
00:41:06,400 --> 00:41:08,760
I also had this researcher side of
me that wasn't really coming out in Inquiries

625
00:41:08,800 --> 00:41:14,159
because it's just doesn't really fit the
show format. So we ended up kind

626
00:41:14,159 --> 00:41:19,400
of just three sixteen the show itself
and made it our research deep dive show.

627
00:41:19,880 --> 00:41:22,559
So the name originally was Bizarre Encounters
in order to have people on to

628
00:41:22,559 --> 00:41:27,679
talk about their bizarre encounters, but
then it started being compassing into it just

629
00:41:27,719 --> 00:41:31,400
a deep dive of bizarre encounters in
general, with you know, people experiencing

630
00:41:31,440 --> 00:41:37,000
this, people experiencing that, And
yeah, it turned into like we like

631
00:41:37,039 --> 00:41:43,039
we cover topics from every perspective that
we possibly can, but in turn we

632
00:41:43,119 --> 00:41:45,960
create theories on it. We don't
just you know, read the story off

633
00:41:45,000 --> 00:41:46,880
and just call it a day.
Like both of us at the end of

634
00:41:46,880 --> 00:41:52,280
the day are researchers and investigators.
Uh so we throw in our ideas,

635
00:41:52,280 --> 00:41:55,880
our perspectives, so we think it
could possibly be different things that connect into

636
00:41:58,719 --> 00:42:01,360
the same folklore stuff. Like just
another example, like we were talking for

637
00:42:01,400 --> 00:42:07,760
a while about you know, alien
phenomenon, alien abduction, not necessarily always

638
00:42:07,840 --> 00:42:10,280
being as it's perceived that it is. Like, I definitely think there's interdimensional

639
00:42:10,280 --> 00:42:14,920
beings. I think there's extraterrestrial beings, but I do think that there's a

640
00:42:14,920 --> 00:42:20,719
good amount of abduction cases that are
actually government experiments that they're running on people,

641
00:42:20,800 --> 00:42:25,000
and they just hide behind this facade
of extraterrestrials. And because you can't

642
00:42:25,079 --> 00:42:29,480
just take people and just run these
kind of weird futuristic experiments on them to

643
00:42:29,519 --> 00:42:32,480
begin with, so a lot of
that happened around the same time that they

644
00:42:32,480 --> 00:42:37,119
started kind of digging into like psychedelic
research. So I've been theorizing for a

645
00:42:37,159 --> 00:42:44,320
while that a lot of these abduction
encounters were some type of psychedelic drugs that

646
00:42:44,320 --> 00:42:46,280
the government had worked on, something
that they probably synthesized, it was lab

647
00:42:46,360 --> 00:42:52,000
created that would just blast you off
into just another whole mindset of thinking.

648
00:42:52,599 --> 00:42:54,480
And so I think I was thinking
for a while that they might just wear

649
00:42:54,559 --> 00:42:58,880
like alien masks, get people on
these things, and then run experiments on

650
00:42:58,920 --> 00:43:00,519
them. So then when they get
thrown act, you know, they don't

651
00:43:00,559 --> 00:43:02,920
really have anybody to go after.
They can't say the government did it,

652
00:43:02,920 --> 00:43:06,079
They can't say anybody did it.
They can't say this, did it.

653
00:43:06,480 --> 00:43:08,440
So I've been talking about that on
the show for a while, and we

654
00:43:08,480 --> 00:43:15,519
covered the Pascagoula alien abduction and part
of that story the guy because we started

655
00:43:15,559 --> 00:43:17,519
reading the transcripts on the show,
the guy mentioned that there was a woman

656
00:43:17,559 --> 00:43:21,039
that was checking him out and it
looked like she was wearing a mask,

657
00:43:21,599 --> 00:43:24,400
and so we started connecting that in
with all the other research that we'd been

658
00:43:24,400 --> 00:43:28,440
doing. So we just have we
have a different way of covering stuff.

659
00:43:28,440 --> 00:43:30,960
I guess everybody kind of has their
own spin in their own way of covering

660
00:43:30,079 --> 00:43:34,840
stuff. But originally it started off
as an encounter show and then it kind

661
00:43:34,840 --> 00:43:37,960
of just turned into our forty in
research and our deep dives kind of all

662
00:43:37,960 --> 00:43:42,079
in one place. We still do
interviews here and there, but the majority

663
00:43:42,079 --> 00:43:45,599
of the show after Orn joined is
us doing deep guys. Now. I

664
00:43:45,679 --> 00:43:52,519
love that. Now, what about
phantoms and monsters? The team? So

665
00:43:52,920 --> 00:43:54,920
as far as nantems and monsters go, this is still like a relatively new

666
00:43:54,920 --> 00:44:00,800
thing that I joined that team.
But I had lots of circular on increases

667
00:44:00,800 --> 00:44:04,840
of our reality and he started his
blog back in two thousand and five,

668
00:44:05,440 --> 00:44:07,440
back when I was a teenager.
I used to read about all these different

669
00:44:07,440 --> 00:44:10,559
monster encounters because I was interested in
the stuff at the time, but I

670
00:44:10,599 --> 00:44:14,639
wasn't like heavy researching into it like
I do now, really like picking up

671
00:44:14,639 --> 00:44:17,639
and understanding everything. So, you
know, he just saw somebody that's been

672
00:44:17,639 --> 00:44:21,559
in the back of my mind for
a long time. When I originally started

673
00:44:21,559 --> 00:44:22,480
the show. He was one of
the main people that I wanted to have

674
00:44:22,519 --> 00:44:24,960
on the show just because you know, I had been following his work since

675
00:44:24,960 --> 00:44:29,360
I was a teenager, and I
had him on the show probably about a

676
00:44:29,400 --> 00:44:32,440
month and a half or so ago
around that, and he's heavy dig He

677
00:44:32,440 --> 00:44:37,079
heavy digged into the Chicago moth Man, and we started getting into different theories

678
00:44:37,119 --> 00:44:40,760
on that. We started deep diving
into that a bit. We talked about

679
00:44:42,119 --> 00:44:45,840
black guyed kids, just our different
theories on like what we possibly think things

680
00:44:45,840 --> 00:44:47,840
could be. So right after the
show, he ends up asking me if

681
00:44:47,880 --> 00:44:52,079
I'd be interested in joining his forty
and research team. So he ended up

682
00:44:52,079 --> 00:44:55,679
taking a vote and everything and everybody
decided they were rich in me being on

683
00:44:55,760 --> 00:45:00,599
the team, which was a huge
genre for me considering that I'd been looking

684
00:45:00,599 --> 00:45:04,559
into this guy's work since I was
a teenager and as far as like being

685
00:45:04,639 --> 00:45:10,079
part of that team goes Lon takes
in any weird encrypt any weird encounter,

686
00:45:10,480 --> 00:45:16,639
be it aliens, extraterrestrials, time
slips, cryptids, just literally any weird

687
00:45:16,679 --> 00:45:21,880
thing, and the stuff that he
has for the areas that we're in.

688
00:45:22,360 --> 00:45:23,800
Uh he sends to us and like
a message and stuff, and basically we

689
00:45:23,840 --> 00:45:29,000
get the opportunity to investigate it.
Uh So, technically I'm the cryptid and

690
00:45:29,079 --> 00:45:36,519
paranormal investigator for Michigan and Indiana and
whenever there's stuff that's available that needs to

691
00:45:36,519 --> 00:45:38,400
get investigated, you know, not
just like oh I had this encounter twenty

692
00:45:38,480 --> 00:45:43,079
years ago, but something that happened
recently. Basically, what it is is

693
00:45:43,119 --> 00:45:46,360
that we would go and check out
the area and if he comes across anything

694
00:45:46,360 --> 00:45:51,440
really really weird. It's also partly
like a like a group where we can

695
00:45:51,440 --> 00:45:53,079
all kind of discuss our different theories
on what it could be and kind of

696
00:45:53,119 --> 00:45:58,280
like all of us throw in what
we believe. So at the root of

697
00:45:58,360 --> 00:46:01,639
it, it's essentially that he takes
in all these bizarre encounters and the forteen

698
00:46:01,679 --> 00:46:07,320
research team investigates and researches and theorizes
about the encounters that he takes in this

699
00:46:07,360 --> 00:46:13,079
through phantoms and monsters, and a
lot of other podcasters use phantoms and monsters

700
00:46:13,079 --> 00:46:15,079
for doing their own show research,
which makes it even bigger than an honor

701
00:46:15,079 --> 00:46:21,320
to be part of it because he
has documentation of any type of crazy creature

702
00:46:21,360 --> 00:46:25,480
he could possibly imagine on there,
So he kind of set like a template

703
00:46:25,519 --> 00:46:29,639
i'd say for you know, like
this is what this creature is. This

704
00:46:29,679 --> 00:46:31,079
is what this creature is. He's
kind of been one of those people that

705
00:46:31,119 --> 00:46:37,559
have kind of helped to categorize,
like there's a dictionary of phantoms and monsters

706
00:46:37,039 --> 00:46:39,320
exactly. Yep. That's that's a
good way to describe it. It takes

707
00:46:39,360 --> 00:46:44,519
some encounters and Interney ends up categorizing
because of all the encounters that he takes

708
00:46:44,519 --> 00:46:47,639
in. It actually starts creating like
an archetype for these different beings because of

709
00:46:47,679 --> 00:46:53,920
how many encounters he takes in.
That's great, That's that's great. Do

710
00:46:54,039 --> 00:47:00,440
you have a story of something that
you've heard that was so fascinating writing that

711
00:47:00,480 --> 00:47:02,000
you'd like to share with the listeners? But there's like, oh, I've

712
00:47:02,000 --> 00:47:07,639
got to tell you this story did
cool. Let's see here. As far

713
00:47:07,719 --> 00:47:13,079
as I'm trying to think of like
a really really interesting one that I've heard

714
00:47:13,119 --> 00:47:15,039
recently. Because I have so many
people that come on my show, I'm

715
00:47:15,039 --> 00:47:19,920
trying to think if I have one
that's straight from the horse's mouth, because

716
00:47:19,920 --> 00:47:24,559
I have a lot that come from
other people's third hand here preak, yeah,

717
00:47:24,960 --> 00:47:29,360
yeah, yeah, but it's you
know, other people's like stories that

718
00:47:29,360 --> 00:47:31,159
they've kind of taken in. But
I guess a good one that I could

719
00:47:31,159 --> 00:47:36,000
talk about as far as just being
a Michigander and me not giving it enough

720
00:47:36,079 --> 00:47:38,159
love, as far as like dog
Man for Michigan goes, because everybody talks

721
00:47:38,159 --> 00:47:43,079
about the beats of Great Road for
example. One of my personal favorite encounter

722
00:47:43,119 --> 00:47:49,280
stories that I've heard, This one
goes back to I think nineteen forties or

723
00:47:49,320 --> 00:47:52,559
fifties, but this was one of
the main focal points as far as the

724
00:47:52,559 --> 00:47:58,679
Michigan dog Man goes. There was
a man who was working nice security for

725
00:47:58,760 --> 00:48:01,039
a factory. I don't know exactly
what city was in off Pannis moment.

726
00:48:01,079 --> 00:48:05,639
I do have munch of notes on
it that I I probably should have brought

727
00:48:05,679 --> 00:48:12,039
up beforehand. But so he was
doing nightwatch for this factory, and he

728
00:48:12,159 --> 00:48:15,079
lived on a house that was in
the property and there was this fenced off

729
00:48:15,119 --> 00:48:20,320
area where it went into the woods
and everything, and as he's watching,

730
00:48:20,440 --> 00:48:24,199
he starts noticing this thing that's moving
around off in the distance, and he

731
00:48:24,360 --> 00:48:28,199
ends up like calling to his son
to kind of like point out to try

732
00:48:28,239 --> 00:48:31,559
to figure out what it was,
and he ends up catching this thing on

733
00:48:31,599 --> 00:48:36,119
his camera as he's watching this thing
move around, and it ends up being

734
00:48:36,159 --> 00:48:39,199
this dog like creature that's hiding behind
a pole. And it's one of those

735
00:48:39,239 --> 00:48:43,880
like infinite infamous pictures that you can
actually probably look up on the internet and

736
00:48:43,920 --> 00:48:47,239
find it. But it was just
one of the most fascinating dog man encounters

737
00:48:47,239 --> 00:48:51,400
because at least back then, I
don't feel like it was one of those

738
00:48:51,400 --> 00:48:55,199
things that you can just photo edit
as easy. This thing definitely looks like

739
00:48:55,239 --> 00:48:59,880
it has some body to it too, which definitely makes this fascinating. And

740
00:49:00,079 --> 00:49:02,280
then kind of digging into a little
bit farther on as far as like Michigan

741
00:49:02,320 --> 00:49:07,679
dog man lore goes, Uh,
there was also a videotape that somebody had

742
00:49:07,719 --> 00:49:09,920
found that a lot of people try
to stay at the hoax. But it's

743
00:49:09,920 --> 00:49:16,199
called the uh what is it called. It's not gimblin. It's try trying

744
00:49:16,199 --> 00:49:19,519
to remember the name of it offhand, But there's just this random tape.

745
00:49:19,559 --> 00:49:22,159
If you look up Michigan dog Man
tape, I'm sure people will find it.

746
00:49:22,880 --> 00:49:28,199
But it was supposedly this tape that
was found in storage of these people

747
00:49:28,239 --> 00:49:31,039
that were going snowmobiling back in the
seventies. And the end of the video

748
00:49:31,119 --> 00:49:37,599
ends up being this wolf like human
humanoid creature that takes off towards him and

749
00:49:37,639 --> 00:49:39,880
you see him like drop the camera
and run away. But that thing looks

750
00:49:39,920 --> 00:49:44,000
a lot like the guy the picture
that the other guy had gotten back in

751
00:49:44,039 --> 00:49:47,400
the day, and kind of connecting
even farther into like the Michigan dog Man

752
00:49:47,440 --> 00:49:52,960
stuff, there's all these like chains
of attacking counters that happened near the Manistee

753
00:49:52,039 --> 00:49:55,559
Forest. And one of the most
fascinating ones that I was digging into as

754
00:49:55,559 --> 00:50:00,199
far as that goes, was with
this trucker who he had an issue with

755
00:50:00,239 --> 00:50:02,599
like the aeronest tire, so he
went to pull over and stop for a

756
00:50:02,639 --> 00:50:06,840
second, and when he did,
he saw this creature that ended up jumping

757
00:50:06,920 --> 00:50:10,239
up on his cab and trying to
get into his cab, and he ended

758
00:50:10,280 --> 00:50:14,280
up putting three shots into this thing
and watching it full and roll into the

759
00:50:14,280 --> 00:50:17,559
woods on the side, and then
he left Loups's truck around and came back

760
00:50:17,559 --> 00:50:21,800
and saw that there was like a
fit like another car that was sitting there,

761
00:50:22,199 --> 00:50:23,760
and they were like, oh,
we saw like a bear or something,

762
00:50:23,880 --> 00:50:27,840
and he was like, yeah,
it's cool, get away from it.

763
00:50:28,360 --> 00:50:31,760
And he ended up having like government
interaction where they're basically saying like,

764
00:50:31,800 --> 00:50:36,960
hey, you've damaged some of our
some of our property, and you know

765
00:50:36,960 --> 00:50:39,599
you're gonna deal with this kind of
a thing. Yeah, But yep,

766
00:50:39,840 --> 00:50:44,239
there's there's so much with the man
stee with people having encounters like that.

767
00:50:44,679 --> 00:50:47,719
Like there was another investigator that I
had that was talking about he was coming

768
00:50:47,760 --> 00:50:52,599
up to Michigan to start looking into
like the Michigan dog Man stuff, and

769
00:50:52,679 --> 00:50:54,960
he got stopped by an unmarked vehicle
that basically said, we know what you're

770
00:50:55,000 --> 00:50:59,920
doing here and you need to leave
now before you know, you get yourself

771
00:51:00,079 --> 00:51:02,800
to some trouble. So there's definitely
something weird to the man of sc I

772
00:51:02,800 --> 00:51:07,760
think that's why it doesn't get as
much top It doesn't get talked about as

773
00:51:07,840 --> 00:51:09,519
much in the dog Man lore as
a lot of other stuff, but at

774
00:51:09,599 --> 00:51:14,159
least being from Michigan, Like,
I hear these different stories all the time,

775
00:51:14,599 --> 00:51:17,000
and I feel like it's one of
it's just a really it's it's heavily

776
00:51:17,039 --> 00:51:21,239
covered up in comparison to the other
dog Man stuff because I think that there's

777
00:51:21,239 --> 00:51:24,599
something really heavy to it, and
I mean, maybe there's a possibility of

778
00:51:24,639 --> 00:51:30,039
it costibing government created and that's why
they are so on top of this versus

779
00:51:30,079 --> 00:51:31,679
it being some type of natural phenomenon
where they can just kind of play it

780
00:51:31,719 --> 00:51:36,360
off. But I've been digging into
the Michigan dog Man stuff for a while

781
00:51:36,760 --> 00:51:40,599
and it's just accompanied all these just
just weird stories as far as like all

782
00:51:40,639 --> 00:51:44,639
based around the Man of Stee,
people having these like full on a tac

783
00:51:44,719 --> 00:51:49,159
account encounters. Like there was another
one that wasn't even necessarily close to the

784
00:51:49,159 --> 00:51:52,639
Man of Spee, but it was
in Troy, Michigan. And when I

785
00:51:52,679 --> 00:51:57,360
first found this call, I found
it in like one spot and then it

786
00:51:57,400 --> 00:52:00,679
went it disappeared off the internet for
a while, but luckily I I had

787
00:52:00,719 --> 00:52:02,880
recorded it, so I ended up
saving it. But essentially it was these

788
00:52:02,880 --> 00:52:07,199
people that called on Star after something
darted across the road and ended up going

789
00:52:07,199 --> 00:52:10,199
off the side of the road and
hitting a tree, and in the turn

790
00:52:10,280 --> 00:52:15,039
of them talking to this on Star
person, they're basically talking about how they're

791
00:52:15,079 --> 00:52:19,119
seeing this like dog man creature,
and then it takes off for the car

792
00:52:19,159 --> 00:52:22,239
and new here all this like blood
curdling screaming, and then the phone line

793
00:52:22,239 --> 00:52:24,360
goes that and the on Star person
is like trying to get their attention,

794
00:52:24,440 --> 00:52:29,199
like hello, Hello. And the
part that I thought was really really weird

795
00:52:29,239 --> 00:52:31,800
after that was that right after that
original call had come out, which was

796
00:52:31,800 --> 00:52:37,719
supposed to be from Troy Michigan on
started some prank Halloween were Wolf attack phone

797
00:52:37,760 --> 00:52:42,559
call and it was like super cheesy, super spoofy, and I was just

798
00:52:42,599 --> 00:52:45,000
thinking in my head, like,
so there, I can't find this specific

799
00:52:45,039 --> 00:52:49,360
call on the internet. I look
around everywhere. It disappears here and there,

800
00:52:49,400 --> 00:52:52,480
and like I said, I keep
a recording of it on my computer

801
00:52:52,559 --> 00:52:57,320
because it's just one of those things
that disappears here and there. And as

802
00:52:57,320 --> 00:53:00,000
soon as they that had come out, they had done this fake on Star

803
00:53:00,119 --> 00:53:05,599
call and it seems like they're trying
to pull away from the phenomenon, yeah,

804
00:53:06,400 --> 00:53:08,559
make it look like a joke.
So there's just so much for the

805
00:53:08,559 --> 00:53:13,320
Michigan Dog man backstory, and it
just seems like it's all massively covered up

806
00:53:13,320 --> 00:53:17,760
on purpose, which is why it
fascinating. So wow, wow film so

807
00:53:17,880 --> 00:53:23,719
interesting. Wow, that's crazy.
I could see that happen in that way

808
00:53:23,760 --> 00:53:28,719
for sure, covering up. Wow, that's good. I like that one.

809
00:53:29,119 --> 00:53:31,199
Thanks for sharing it. Yeah.
I could got on the Michigan dog

810
00:53:31,199 --> 00:53:34,320
Man stuff for a while, but
at least a lot of that is like

811
00:53:34,519 --> 00:53:37,280
Michigan stories in general. So it's
like, I've taken a lot of ultra

812
00:53:37,360 --> 00:53:42,840
fascinating stories, but people use them
to write in their own books and stuff,

813
00:53:42,840 --> 00:53:45,880
and I just don't want to take
somebody else's story that's like their story.

814
00:53:46,760 --> 00:53:50,639
But at least for that one,
that's just like common knowledge that's out

815
00:53:50,639 --> 00:53:53,519
there and stuff that I've dug into. But you know, I could go

816
00:53:53,559 --> 00:53:57,400
on for days about different stories,
but I just have to make sure that

817
00:53:57,679 --> 00:54:00,280
whoever story it is, I give
credit for being that first that collected that

818
00:54:00,320 --> 00:54:04,360
story, because I don't want to
take credit for anybody else's work in research.

819
00:54:04,480 --> 00:54:07,679
So sure, I understand, I
understand. I appreciate that well.

820
00:54:07,679 --> 00:54:10,760
When I write my stories and true
account ghost wanting, it's the same thing.

821
00:54:12,440 --> 00:54:15,599
I always want a first hand account
from somebody when I write about it,

822
00:54:15,639 --> 00:54:20,559
and I like to give them credit
if they don't want to remain anonymous,

823
00:54:20,599 --> 00:54:22,760
if they want me to mention their
name, I make sure that I

824
00:54:22,840 --> 00:54:25,320
do so. I totally get that. Hey, can you let everybody know

825
00:54:25,360 --> 00:54:30,199
how they can find you and what
your website is and all that stuff.

826
00:54:30,719 --> 00:54:34,880
Absolutely, So if everybody wants to
come and find me, the quickest way

827
00:54:34,920 --> 00:54:37,519
to do it is through Open Minds
Media, which is my production company for

828
00:54:37,559 --> 00:54:40,760
both things that I do. You
guys can always look up Increase of Our

829
00:54:40,800 --> 00:54:45,519
Reality or Bizarre Encounters, you know, any podcatcher so you know, Spotify,

830
00:54:45,719 --> 00:54:52,079
iTunes, podcast Addict, any of
those Amazon, but also on YouTube

831
00:54:52,079 --> 00:54:53,480
you can look up open Minds Media, and I do have a YouTube channel

832
00:54:53,519 --> 00:54:58,400
and TikTok. But if everybody wants
to just find one link that can accompany

833
00:54:58,440 --> 00:55:00,320
all of this and you can find
everything that I you, the easiest way

834
00:55:00,320 --> 00:55:05,360
to do it is through my Open
Minds Media website, which is lamk p

835
00:55:05,679 --> 00:55:09,800
R, period ee Slash, Open
Underscore, Minds Underscore Media, and there

836
00:55:09,920 --> 00:55:13,920
is like a link tree that just
connects to all my different work, all

837
00:55:13,960 --> 00:55:15,920
my different shows. So that's just
quick at the easiest place to give it

838
00:55:15,920 --> 00:55:20,559
to everybody, all in one place. Perfect, perfect, And thank you

839
00:55:20,599 --> 00:55:23,480
so much for joining me today.
I really enjoyed our discussion in you opening

840
00:55:23,519 --> 00:55:27,239
up all this stuff for me.
This was fun. Yeah, thanks for

841
00:55:27,239 --> 00:55:29,360
inviting me. I had a lot
of fun and hopefully I didn't talk to

842
00:55:29,400 --> 00:55:31,480
you too much. It's great to
be on the other side of the microphone

843
00:55:31,480 --> 00:55:36,440
and be the one that's the majority
of the talking. That's you know what.

844
00:55:36,440 --> 00:55:38,039
That's so it's supposed to be.
We have you on here for a

845
00:55:38,079 --> 00:55:44,840
reason. So and if the listeners
like listening to this week's episode and you're

846
00:55:44,880 --> 00:55:49,119
into all things paranormal, check out
my other show, Eleanor Wagner's Creeping,

847
00:55:49,199 --> 00:55:52,719
a Real podcast out of the Coast
Coast Entertainment Network, which is available wherever

848
00:55:52,800 --> 00:56:00,199
you get your podcast stream directly through
my Eleanor Wagner web page. And if

849
00:56:00,239 --> 00:56:01,880
you are interested in reading any of
my books, you can find them on

850
00:56:01,920 --> 00:56:07,159
Amazon or you can get signed copies
directly through me at author Eleanor Wagner at

851
00:56:07,159 --> 00:56:09,800
gmail dot com. I write about
the history of the town and location,

852
00:56:10,280 --> 00:56:15,239
add the paranormal story to the mix, and finish it all off with photos

853
00:56:15,280 --> 00:56:19,440
and evidence. Everybody loves a good
ghost story, but there's nothing better than

854
00:56:19,480 --> 00:56:22,559
a true ghost story. So check
it out and I hope you'll stay awhile

855
00:56:22,760 --> 00:56:27,480
and listen as Silent Crafter Stranger Part
two takes us out of the show.

856
00:56:27,800 --> 00:56:32,440
Ghostly listeners, you can sign up
or level up on my author Eleanor Wagner

857
00:56:32,480 --> 00:56:38,920
Patreon program that's PA t R e
O N, where you will find special

858
00:56:39,000 --> 00:56:45,840
bonus opportunities only available to its patrons, such as one on ones with me

859
00:56:45,400 --> 00:56:52,480
and co hosting opportunities on episodes of
Eleanor Wagner's Strange and Scary World podcast.

860
00:56:52,960 --> 00:56:58,239
Thank you, paranormal enthusiasts for tuning
in today. I hope you'll come back

861
00:56:58,239 --> 00:57:04,119
again. Remember to tap into your
own gifts. Everyone has them, and

862
00:57:04,199 --> 00:57:07,079
in the meantime, make sure you're
creeping it young