WEBVTT 1 00:00:40.079 --> 00:00:45.320 Hello, and welcome to Open Mind UFO Radio. I am your host, 2 00:00:45.560 --> 00:00:52.000 Alejandro Rojas, and I am joined with Martin. I can do, Willis, 3 00:00:52.719 --> 00:00:55.479 I can do, I can do, I can do, I can 4 00:00:55.600 --> 00:00:59.240 do anything. I don't even think that's the right words for that song, 5 00:00:59.320 --> 00:01:03.120 but the yeah, you can do it. And because you get out there 6 00:01:03.200 --> 00:01:08.280 and you're a doer. You know what we were complaining about some people on 7 00:01:08.359 --> 00:01:12.400 social medium and so much of the big complainers, that's what they do. 8 00:01:14.159 --> 00:01:18.599 That's it. You know, they're not out there really doing, and I 9 00:01:18.640 --> 00:01:25.640 think that's important. They're plaining complaining. Yeah, but that's not to anybody 10 00:01:25.640 --> 00:01:29.840 can do that. Yeah, yeah, that's pretty easy. Yeah, it's 11 00:01:29.879 --> 00:01:33.079 really easy. It's harder to, like, you know, tackle all the 12 00:01:33.079 --> 00:01:34.959 stuff that you do. I was talking about you, oh with Race. 13 00:01:36.079 --> 00:01:38.599 I saw Race this weekend. But actually before I'm going to get into that, 14 00:01:38.680 --> 00:01:42.719 but first I want to tell you who my guest is today. Great. 15 00:01:44.560 --> 00:01:49.480 Oh, you're going to be shocked and amazed, really great because it's 16 00:01:49.519 --> 00:01:53.920 you. This show is just going to be Martin and I talking about news 17 00:01:53.959 --> 00:01:57.680 and some of the latest things that happened going on. So sit back and 18 00:01:57.760 --> 00:02:01.079 relax and we're just going to have a good time here. Now, I 19 00:02:01.120 --> 00:02:05.799 do want to say I have some exciting interviews coming up. I have Nick 20 00:02:05.879 --> 00:02:08.960 Pope for next week. Of course, he's got some the government documents that 21 00:02:09.039 --> 00:02:14.520 he has discovered. I saw him this weekend and we talked something about that, 22 00:02:14.560 --> 00:02:17.840 and he's got a lot of really important news to talk about this. 23 00:02:17.960 --> 00:02:21.719 He's going to be on some other show, and he promised this show, 24 00:02:22.280 --> 00:02:23.879 which is it's a really big show, so I don't blame him, but 25 00:02:23.919 --> 00:02:25.800 I'm not going to say the name because I don't want you to listen, 26 00:02:25.800 --> 00:02:30.639 because I want to hear all this stuff first on my show. But you 27 00:02:30.719 --> 00:02:36.199 might already know if you follow Nick Pope. But Nick Pope used to work 28 00:02:36.240 --> 00:02:42.199 for the UK investigating UFOs and he recently got some information from the DoD about 29 00:02:42.919 --> 00:02:46.759 the Pentagon project that was revealed by the New York Times. So we're going 30 00:02:46.840 --> 00:02:51.000 to talk about that. And there's a lot of really great points and nuances 31 00:02:51.000 --> 00:02:53.840 in these documents that Nick has pointed out that are really important. So we're 32 00:02:53.879 --> 00:03:00.479 going to talk about that, and then speaking of the A TIP program sometime 33 00:03:00.520 --> 00:03:06.000 in the next couple of weeks, hopefully the week after that, I'll be 34 00:03:06.159 --> 00:03:10.879 interviewing mister lou Elizondo. So it's about time. Yeah, I know. 35 00:03:12.360 --> 00:03:15.719 And I haven't harassed him on it. He's always said, oh, we 36 00:03:15.759 --> 00:03:16.639 got to do an interview, We got to do that, we got to 37 00:03:16.680 --> 00:03:21.960 do that. So he actually gave me a call because I hadn't heard it 38 00:03:22.000 --> 00:03:24.240 from him for a while and we just were catching up and I said, 39 00:03:24.240 --> 00:03:28.479 hey, would now be a good time. He said, definitely, this 40 00:03:28.599 --> 00:03:32.879 is a great time. So we worked we're working on scheduling that and I 41 00:03:32.919 --> 00:03:38.439 asked some people in the open minds UFO news group what kind of questions you 42 00:03:38.439 --> 00:03:43.080 would like me to ask, and of course I invite all of you listeners 43 00:03:43.120 --> 00:03:46.639 to do so as well. You can email contacted openminds dot tv or just 44 00:03:46.719 --> 00:03:52.479 email yeah that will work, or you can email me at allehandro t Rojas 45 00:03:53.319 --> 00:03:57.800 at gmail dot com and let me know what your questions are and I'll get 46 00:03:57.800 --> 00:04:00.680 those in front of him. Now. A lot of people, fortunately, 47 00:04:00.919 --> 00:04:08.039 and this is kind of funny, don't they ask They're asking questions that don't 48 00:04:08.039 --> 00:04:13.840 pertain to what he does, and so I know the answer is going to 49 00:04:13.879 --> 00:04:15.720 be I don't know about that, or I have nothing to do with that, 50 00:04:16.319 --> 00:04:20.720 and it's interesting to me that people do that. Of course, any 51 00:04:20.759 --> 00:04:25.920 speaker knows. Often when you do a whole talk on a topic that's really 52 00:04:25.920 --> 00:04:30.800 interesting and then you open the floor for questions, often people start asking you 53 00:04:30.839 --> 00:04:33.439 about stuff that has nothing to do with what you just reviewed, or sometimes 54 00:04:33.439 --> 00:04:39.000 nothing to do with, you know, anything you know anything about. And 55 00:04:39.959 --> 00:04:43.639 I don't know if people just do that. Yeah. Now, when I 56 00:04:43.680 --> 00:04:47.399 met him last summer, I was all said, I had arrange to have 57 00:04:47.439 --> 00:04:51.439 this dinner where you could ask him questions, you know. It was sort 58 00:04:51.480 --> 00:04:56.920 of like a one on one type thing, and he got whisked away there 59 00:04:56.920 --> 00:04:59.720 was some type of family situation. Now I never got to do it. 60 00:04:59.759 --> 00:05:03.160 I was really looking forward to that and I had a question to ask him. 61 00:05:03.279 --> 00:05:05.680 So I am going to try to dig that up. I can't remember 62 00:05:05.720 --> 00:05:12.319 what it was. The only thing he'll remember about the conversation he and I 63 00:05:12.360 --> 00:05:17.160 had in the hallway. There was talking about collectibles and when he collects and 64 00:05:17.199 --> 00:05:21.800 stuff like that. He's pretty fascinating. Yeah, he's cool. He's a 65 00:05:21.839 --> 00:05:26.480 regular dude, you know, And that's what I'm excited to do. So 66 00:05:26.560 --> 00:05:31.560 we're going to have him at the Congress. And but I'll say this, 67 00:05:31.959 --> 00:05:36.480 you know, in interviews, I feel that's when he reveals the most interesting 68 00:05:36.519 --> 00:05:42.720 information. So I think we'll have a lot of interesting information and my interview 69 00:05:42.720 --> 00:05:46.480 coming up here. But by the time the UFO Congress comes around in early 70 00:05:46.560 --> 00:05:51.639 September, we'll have him again. But I'm going to do a Q and 71 00:05:51.680 --> 00:05:56.480 A with him, and I know some of my colleagues will probably be jealous 72 00:05:56.519 --> 00:06:00.000 about that, but well, of course have open mic, but that I 73 00:06:00.079 --> 00:06:03.000 want to do my correct and I think, you know, I want to 74 00:06:03.000 --> 00:06:06.759 do my best to really grill him. Uh. You know, we're familiar 75 00:06:06.800 --> 00:06:11.199 with each other, but in a way that's comfortable to him to see how 76 00:06:11.279 --> 00:06:13.920 much we can get out of him, you know, because that's what people 77 00:06:13.959 --> 00:06:17.040 want, is some of the most some information that he is new that he 78 00:06:17.079 --> 00:06:24.560 hasn't shared before, and information there's a lot he can't share. But if 79 00:06:24.600 --> 00:06:29.480 you ask the right questions, there are aspects of those those topics that he 80 00:06:29.600 --> 00:06:31.720 can answer. But if you ask him to do a talk, he's not 81 00:06:31.759 --> 00:06:34.639 going to go there. Some people have said, oh, you know, 82 00:06:34.720 --> 00:06:38.480 he did a lecture and it was kind of boring like that, or because 83 00:06:38.480 --> 00:06:42.399 he's just like promoting to the stars, But that's that's what he does. 84 00:06:42.720 --> 00:06:46.439 So if you really want pointed answers to certain questions, you've got to go 85 00:06:46.480 --> 00:06:50.519 there and then kind of massage it and work around the topic to get everything 86 00:06:50.560 --> 00:06:55.879 you can. So yeah, so that's going to be a lot of fun 87 00:06:56.439 --> 00:07:00.279 looking forward to it. Yeah, if only we could know what he really 88 00:07:00.319 --> 00:07:05.120 knows, you know, Yeah, I mean I think what he really knows 89 00:07:05.879 --> 00:07:12.639 is I think you can kind of know. We certainly won't know everything he 90 00:07:12.720 --> 00:07:17.000 really knows, but the most revealing piece of information, now, what we're 91 00:07:17.040 --> 00:07:25.399 going to review with Nick Pope is interesting and it has generated some headlines. 92 00:07:26.560 --> 00:07:30.600 And I do implore people if you're not I've got my live show that I 93 00:07:30.639 --> 00:07:38.439 do on YouTube and it's on my Alohandro Advantage YouTube channel, and I hope 94 00:07:38.480 --> 00:07:40.879 you watch that at some time. Of course, if you don't watch it 95 00:07:40.920 --> 00:07:44.600 live, you can catch it afterwards. But I review in detail, you 96 00:07:44.639 --> 00:07:48.120 know, all of the news of the week. And so this information that 97 00:07:48.240 --> 00:07:53.680 Nick Pope shared in this document he received. There was another organization, the 98 00:07:53.720 --> 00:07:57.959 Federation of American Scientists, who received these documents, and these were kind of 99 00:07:57.959 --> 00:08:03.199 papers products that came out of this a tip study that lou Ran. So 100 00:08:03.240 --> 00:08:07.560 we have an insight into kind of more of the science that they're looking into. 101 00:08:07.120 --> 00:08:09.800 But what they're looking into is very telling, and that's what we're going 102 00:08:09.839 --> 00:08:15.279 to talk with Nick. But there's the whole aspect of the UFO end. 103 00:08:15.560 --> 00:08:18.879 The only product and it wasn't included in this list, but that we have 104 00:08:18.959 --> 00:08:24.199 been able to see on that end is that leaked NIMIT document that of course 105 00:08:24.480 --> 00:08:28.680 I talked with Dave Batty about. I know you've had some recent quite a 106 00:08:28.680 --> 00:08:33.120 few recent interviews on the whole limit situation as well, where I'm sure you 107 00:08:33.159 --> 00:08:39.600 all have reference to that document that's the only by the military for the military 108 00:08:39.679 --> 00:08:45.039 report from that a tip that we've seen, so I think, and it 109 00:08:45.080 --> 00:08:50.200 is terribly interesting if you've heard our past interviews. But I think that what 110 00:08:50.399 --> 00:08:56.000 Lou knows is there's just a lot more of those reports. And that's essentially 111 00:08:56.080 --> 00:08:58.360 what he told me is there's a lot more of that. There's other cases, 112 00:08:58.679 --> 00:09:01.200 he said, is that are just as good, if not better. 113 00:09:01.600 --> 00:09:07.320 But that's kind of the idea. So it's almost like this Project Blue Book 114 00:09:07.320 --> 00:09:09.399 show, you know, where they're covering a great case every week. It's 115 00:09:09.480 --> 00:09:16.759 like we've seen one episode of the a tip show, you know, which 116 00:09:16.799 --> 00:09:22.080 is NIMT. So there's other episodes. Who knows how many or even if 117 00:09:22.120 --> 00:09:28.480 there's a full season's worth using that metaphor, but there's just a lot of 118 00:09:28.519 --> 00:09:33.759 other great episodes and that would be interesting. But like Blue Book, you 119 00:09:33.799 --> 00:09:41.000 know, it's not necessarily that they retrieved a crash shaucer or something, but 120 00:09:41.120 --> 00:09:48.519 observed and recorded some incredible cases an incident, you know what I mean, 121 00:09:50.240 --> 00:09:56.960 And you just wonder, you wonder how many are there, and you know, 122 00:09:56.039 --> 00:10:00.240 I think there's still something going on as far as them, you know, 123 00:10:00.360 --> 00:10:03.799 doing the research, So you just wonder how, you know, how 124 00:10:03.799 --> 00:10:07.360 many of these cases they're paying attention to. Now, you know, nothing 125 00:10:07.399 --> 00:10:11.879 really comes to mind as far as like big sightings, except for when it 126 00:10:11.960 --> 00:10:15.879 involves the airlines. There has been a couple, you know, within the 127 00:10:15.960 --> 00:10:20.600 last few months. But just wondering how much they were still doing the research 128 00:10:20.840 --> 00:10:26.879 and if there's anything you know they're researching deeply into. Yeah, I know, 129 00:10:26.080 --> 00:10:33.279 And you know, this organization has essentially no resources, so they're more 130 00:10:33.320 --> 00:10:41.080 of a data retrieval kind of and perhaps an an analyst sort of group than 131 00:10:41.200 --> 00:10:43.480 anything, which is what intelligence is about. I mean, if you watch 132 00:10:43.519 --> 00:10:48.039 that show like Jack Ryan or something, and you hear analysts. The CIA 133 00:10:48.200 --> 00:10:52.440 has a bunch of analysts, because what all these people are doing is usually 134 00:10:52.480 --> 00:10:56.200 looking at sets of information that they're getting from the field, and they're using 135 00:10:56.240 --> 00:11:01.879 that information to understand what's going on about a particular thing, like what lou 136 00:11:01.960 --> 00:11:05.559 worked on was terrorism, kind of like Jack Ryan, you know that television 137 00:11:05.639 --> 00:11:11.759 show where and I read all those Tom Clancy books, so you know, 138 00:11:11.840 --> 00:11:15.480 he talks about the analysts, how they're grabbing the data and they're trying to 139 00:11:15.519 --> 00:11:18.360 figure something out, and then sometimes they're able to discover, hey, it 140 00:11:18.399 --> 00:11:22.320 looks like, you know, this group is doing X, Y and z 141 00:11:22.080 --> 00:11:26.600 that indicates maybe they're building a bomb, you know, and so we got 142 00:11:26.639 --> 00:11:28.919 to check into this, and it's the same sort of thing they're gathering, 143 00:11:30.000 --> 00:11:35.519 and we see this in that report because that report didn't do any real investigation. 144 00:11:35.200 --> 00:11:39.399 What it did, though, was gather testimony, which is good. 145 00:11:39.440 --> 00:11:46.879 It's an investigation from witnesses, and then also given that testimony, questioned people 146 00:11:46.919 --> 00:11:54.919 like the submarine that were part of the carrier strike group to see if there 147 00:11:54.960 --> 00:11:58.879 was any correlation there or anything that could corroborate what the others had seen or 148 00:11:58.919 --> 00:12:05.879 give them more information about whatever phenomena they were dealing with. But that's essentially 149 00:12:05.879 --> 00:12:11.320 what they're doing. But it's it's because it's of that nature. You know. 150 00:12:11.399 --> 00:12:16.720 All it can be is kind of analysis as opposed to, you know, 151 00:12:16.799 --> 00:12:20.080 being able to do some hands on research. The other thing that I 152 00:12:20.080 --> 00:12:26.120 think is important is that, you know, we have this Adam project where 153 00:12:26.559 --> 00:12:33.600 to the Stars now is trying to examine the material these meta materials or materials 154 00:12:33.600 --> 00:12:41.440 that have been allegedly retrieved from UFO incidents to determine whether or not these materials 155 00:12:41.480 --> 00:12:48.120 are anomalous or not. I think that's telling in that since Lou is doing 156 00:12:48.120 --> 00:12:52.879 this work, there's been and in his interviews, there's been no indication that 157 00:12:52.919 --> 00:13:00.000 there has been any material besides someone mentioned retrieved, and what we know about 158 00:13:00.120 --> 00:13:05.440 out at least this material that was retrieved that there's analysis still ongoing. So 159 00:13:07.600 --> 00:13:16.679 it kind of lends to the idea that no anomalist material has yet been you 160 00:13:16.720 --> 00:13:20.600 know, fully analyzed or probably discovered by the A TIP group. I think 161 00:13:20.679 --> 00:13:26.600 that that's what it seems, and we can ask Lou, you know, 162 00:13:26.759 --> 00:13:31.039 more specifically, and I think we have essentially, but that still lends to 163 00:13:31.279 --> 00:13:37.000 Most of what they've done is kind of analysis, but those files have to 164 00:13:37.000 --> 00:13:41.799 be fascinating. Oh, I'm sure is an amazing case. So if they 165 00:13:41.840 --> 00:13:46.840 have cases better than that, holy cow. Right, Well, forgive me 166 00:13:46.879 --> 00:13:50.919 if I'm getting this mixed up or wrong or we've already talked about in the 167 00:13:50.960 --> 00:13:54.399 past, but does this have to do with what is supposed to be housed 168 00:13:54.440 --> 00:13:58.720 at Bigelow? That is, Yeah, that's one of the items. That's 169 00:13:58.759 --> 00:14:03.679 one of the pieces of material. But they have others as well, some 170 00:14:03.799 --> 00:14:09.480 that have been brought to them by other UFO witnesses outside of a tip, 171 00:14:09.039 --> 00:14:16.240 and I think some that other UFO researchers have obtained as well. So yeah, 172 00:14:16.320 --> 00:14:20.440 and I think they're preparing to at least give the public some more information. 173 00:14:22.159 --> 00:14:28.799 There is rumors about television shows and stuff, so there might be a 174 00:14:28.840 --> 00:14:33.720 show that kind of talks a little bit about what they're looking into coming up 175 00:14:33.759 --> 00:14:37.600 here, so we'll see. One of the things that people often say to 176 00:14:37.639 --> 00:14:41.679 me, and I'm sure you probably hear it too, is you know, 177 00:14:41.919 --> 00:14:46.080 whatever it is got all the way here, how why would it? Why 178 00:14:46.080 --> 00:14:48.679 on earth would it crash? You know? Is that you know? I 179 00:14:48.799 --> 00:14:52.799 agree personally, I personally. And I've said this many times, and I'm 180 00:14:52.840 --> 00:14:56.559 sure you know some people don't like it, but oh well, I'm honest, 181 00:14:58.159 --> 00:15:01.039 I don't see it. I don't see is happening. In fact, 182 00:15:01.399 --> 00:15:09.720 let's say Roswell was a truly crashed extraterrestrial spacecraft and advanced technology. I think 183 00:15:09.799 --> 00:15:15.120 if that had crashed and there was some sort of you know, and they 184 00:15:15.159 --> 00:15:18.080 didn't want to interact with us at all, then I think they would very 185 00:15:18.120 --> 00:15:24.639 easily be able to retrieve it. I mean, since it had crashed, 186 00:15:24.639 --> 00:15:28.799 it could probably even just fly in a saucer, pick up everything, even 187 00:15:28.799 --> 00:15:31.919 if there are some Army guys standing there, you know, with their jaws 188 00:15:31.000 --> 00:15:35.759 on the ground watching this happen and then fly off, and nobody's the Army 189 00:15:35.759 --> 00:15:39.399 first of all, probably isn't going to say anything. Even if those guys 190 00:15:39.440 --> 00:15:43.879 who saw this did say something, nobody's gonna believe them and it would be 191 00:15:43.919 --> 00:15:50.080 problem solved. So if I think there's a strong using that kind of perspective, 192 00:15:50.080 --> 00:15:56.879 I think there's a strong personally argument to be made that if there was 193 00:15:56.159 --> 00:16:03.480 truly a crash and we retrieve that material and we're allowed to keep it, 194 00:16:03.960 --> 00:16:07.240 then we were given it wasn't a crash. It was here's some technology. 195 00:16:07.279 --> 00:16:11.200 Here you go for whatever reason, you know, we feel you're ready to 196 00:16:11.279 --> 00:16:15.639 move to the next level of tech or whatever. And I mean if Colonel 197 00:16:15.720 --> 00:16:18.679 Corso, who was in the army, who claims he received some of that 198 00:16:18.759 --> 00:16:25.200 material is telling the truth, then a lot of the technology that we use 199 00:16:25.399 --> 00:16:30.919 to this day and have advanced us to where we are technologically is due to 200 00:16:30.039 --> 00:16:34.679 the back engineering or in corporation of some of that technology that they got from 201 00:16:34.759 --> 00:16:40.600 Roswell and so you know, it has had a major effect on our growth 202 00:16:40.639 --> 00:16:45.159 and evolution. So maybe they are helping push us along, or maybe it 203 00:16:45.159 --> 00:16:49.080 hasn't happened at all, and there hasn't ever been a crash, So I 204 00:16:49.080 --> 00:16:52.159 don't know, what do you think? Well, one of the theories, 205 00:16:52.159 --> 00:16:56.759 of course, is that it's you know, a drone or drone piloted or 206 00:16:56.240 --> 00:17:00.960 self replicating drone or something like that, you know, for the when it 207 00:17:02.000 --> 00:17:06.720 comes to them trying to deal with the space time, the space you know, 208 00:17:06.839 --> 00:17:10.480 travel and all that speed of light. So I don't know, you 209 00:17:10.519 --> 00:17:15.039 know, there's all I think we're thinking about the whole thing in a human 210 00:17:15.680 --> 00:17:19.559 way, and who knows what the rill answer is, yeah, yeah, 211 00:17:19.559 --> 00:17:23.279 those are all good points, I mean, and there's been lots of speculation 212 00:17:23.440 --> 00:17:29.559 that you know, and it would make sense, and a lot of scientists 213 00:17:29.559 --> 00:17:34.519 are even more ready to adopt this idea. In fact, Sas Shostak has 214 00:17:34.559 --> 00:17:40.359 even talked about it, and so has that Columbo guy or Columbus you know 215 00:17:40.400 --> 00:17:45.279 who wrote this paper for the City Institute convention that you know, we keep 216 00:17:45.319 --> 00:17:51.400 thinking that any beings out there wouldn't be able to survive this trip, but 217 00:17:52.079 --> 00:17:57.000 you know, a robot essentially could, So who's to say there aren't drones? 218 00:17:57.559 --> 00:18:03.640 And people seem to be more open to that idea, so that's a 219 00:18:03.680 --> 00:18:07.519 possibility as well. Of course, if there's a ton of them, you 220 00:18:07.640 --> 00:18:11.480 think there might be several crashes or something like that if that does happen, 221 00:18:12.200 --> 00:18:18.599 But who knows hum right now, do you think that lou would be privy 222 00:18:18.680 --> 00:18:25.480 to anything that To the Stars is working on, or they compartmentalized as far 223 00:18:25.559 --> 00:18:27.839 as you know, the materials and things like that, or do you think 224 00:18:29.279 --> 00:18:33.240 that they kind of share the information that they're not letting out to the public 225 00:18:33.319 --> 00:18:37.240 with you know, between the people involved. I'm pretty sure they share it 226 00:18:37.279 --> 00:18:44.279 with each other. It seems that way. It doesn't sound like they'repartmentalizing from 227 00:18:44.319 --> 00:18:49.160 each other. I don't completely know how the structure works, but there's pretty 228 00:18:49.160 --> 00:18:55.519 small group, so I think they're all working together pretty closely because they are 229 00:18:55.559 --> 00:18:59.319 a small group. So now I know you and you and I have talked 230 00:18:59.319 --> 00:19:04.960 about this before, or mostly you about their becoming if they're going to become 231 00:19:06.000 --> 00:19:10.160 more transparent when it comes to something like this, What do you think would 232 00:19:10.240 --> 00:19:15.839 happen if they actually you know, study the material and ended up being something 233 00:19:15.880 --> 00:19:19.400 they couldn't you know, they just couldn't identify as something that was you know, 234 00:19:19.480 --> 00:19:22.960 human made or made on Earth. Well, I think that a lot 235 00:19:23.000 --> 00:19:26.160 of people would say, you got to tell people right now, but I 236 00:19:26.400 --> 00:19:30.200 don't think that's the wisest way to do it, And I know people get 237 00:19:30.200 --> 00:19:38.960 frustrated by that, but it's just it's best to have all your ducks in 238 00:19:40.000 --> 00:19:44.119 a row before coming out. So, for instance, you know, it 239 00:19:44.160 --> 00:19:49.200 would be wise for them to have, like scientists do, develop a complete 240 00:19:49.240 --> 00:19:57.000 paper for peer review that makes your argument as strong as possible so that you 241 00:19:57.039 --> 00:20:02.720 can get it out there and then you know, then you you have your 242 00:20:02.839 --> 00:20:07.200 your strongest argument coming out first and that takes a lot of time to develop, 243 00:20:07.599 --> 00:20:15.039 especially if you for instance, it's often that you need to do many 244 00:20:15.400 --> 00:20:19.720 pieces of analysis. One analysis you do shows that this nature, this you 245 00:20:19.759 --> 00:20:25.400 know is anomalous. That justifies then you're doing more research, and if you 246 00:20:25.559 --> 00:20:30.359 continue to get these anomalous you know results, then then you're pushed to do 247 00:20:30.440 --> 00:20:37.039 more and more and more, which all bolsters your case that something is odd 248 00:20:37.079 --> 00:20:41.759 about what it is you're you're looking at. So the better the case, 249 00:20:41.839 --> 00:20:47.240 So longer it's going to take to investigate and analyze, and so it's going 250 00:20:47.319 --> 00:20:52.480 to take a longer time to develop that paper or argument that it is something 251 00:20:52.880 --> 00:20:57.039 demonstrating what analysis you did and why you think it's anomalous. So it's just 252 00:20:57.079 --> 00:21:00.960 going to take a lot of time. So I think I think that that's 253 00:21:00.000 --> 00:21:03.960 the thing is that if they did have something, they wouldn't share it. 254 00:21:03.039 --> 00:21:07.039 I think it would be wise for them not to share it, beyond maybe 255 00:21:07.559 --> 00:21:12.799 saying something like we do have some promising leads and we're working on those, 256 00:21:12.839 --> 00:21:18.279 and we're working towards sharing more information on the with the public on this as 257 00:21:18.319 --> 00:21:23.920 soon as possible. That's I understand. I understand what you're saying about, 258 00:21:25.200 --> 00:21:27.319 you know, doing it the right way. I'm just wondering, even if 259 00:21:27.359 --> 00:21:32.480 it's done the right way, how much of a blip is this? You 260 00:21:32.559 --> 00:21:37.640 know, would something like that make Would people consider it serious enough? Do 261 00:21:37.680 --> 00:21:38.839 you think or do you think they would just say, well, that's just 262 00:21:38.880 --> 00:21:42.359 saying that they don't. That's just saying they have no idea how it's made, 263 00:21:42.359 --> 00:21:45.279 and that's it. It's not gonna you know, I think it will 264 00:21:45.319 --> 00:21:51.920 be a serious blip. Here's why I think that who is saying it matters 265 00:21:52.039 --> 00:21:56.039 a lot. So for instance, if you or I no offense to you, 266 00:21:56.079 --> 00:21:59.920 but it's the same for me if I was to say, oh, 267 00:22:00.200 --> 00:22:06.279 Mind's TV has done this analysis and here's what we found, and I think 268 00:22:06.319 --> 00:22:10.079 we have we have a pretty good reputation with the mainstream. So but even 269 00:22:10.119 --> 00:22:12.200 then, you know, it's not as big of a deal. But when 270 00:22:12.240 --> 00:22:19.119 you have you know, somebody connected to the Melon family or the Melon you 271 00:22:19.160 --> 00:22:26.000 know dynasty, you have these ex intelligence people, you have somebody who ran 272 00:22:26.440 --> 00:22:32.000 a department for the DoD investigating this stuff. When a group like that comes 273 00:22:32.000 --> 00:22:38.640 out and says we have scientific evidence that this this anomalous material is created by 274 00:22:38.839 --> 00:22:45.039 an intelligent an intelligence that is off planet. I think that's a big deal. 275 00:22:47.319 --> 00:22:51.000 Just like if any other scientific organization, like if SETTI was to say 276 00:22:51.119 --> 00:22:52.799 we think we found something. I think that is a big deal, and 277 00:22:52.839 --> 00:22:57.599 so will get a lot of attention. It'll get a lot of scrutiny, 278 00:22:57.640 --> 00:23:02.200 which is good. That's what you want. You want to encourage, you 279 00:23:02.240 --> 00:23:07.920 know, this scientific organization set the others to challenge your assumptions because that means 280 00:23:07.920 --> 00:23:12.920 they're taking it seriously, and then you go from there. So I think 281 00:23:14.000 --> 00:23:19.000 from this group it will be a big deal. Now do you think this 282 00:23:19.079 --> 00:23:22.599 is probably a question you may not even want to answer, but do you 283 00:23:22.640 --> 00:23:32.640 think that Tom deloms and Delong's involvement with this would take away from it? 284 00:23:33.000 --> 00:23:37.759 No? I don't think so at all. And I think that's what a 285 00:23:37.799 --> 00:23:44.000 lot of people in the UFO field are kind of missing, is that you 286 00:23:44.079 --> 00:23:49.240 know, and we have plenty of evidence of this, that it won't have 287 00:23:49.319 --> 00:23:56.200 an effect because Tom got those doors opened in the first place, why and 288 00:23:56.240 --> 00:24:00.799 what is his role? And I think that's what people need to think about. 289 00:24:00.920 --> 00:24:07.480 In the professional world. You know, we all have titles, and 290 00:24:07.519 --> 00:24:11.599 the reason you have those titles, it's because that's what your expertise is that's 291 00:24:11.599 --> 00:24:17.079 what you bring to the table. Tom DeLong is a rock star, so 292 00:24:17.200 --> 00:24:22.640 essentially what he brings to the table is a perspective from the youth and a 293 00:24:22.799 --> 00:24:29.880 media perspective, not a scientist or an expert or anything like that. He 294 00:24:30.000 --> 00:24:34.519 brings that media connection and I think that's what his importance is. But we 295 00:24:34.680 --> 00:24:37.480 do have to go to break, but I want to elaborate more on this 296 00:24:37.519 --> 00:24:41.559 because I think this is an excellent question. At the UFO field is just 297 00:24:42.079 --> 00:24:47.559 getting wrong, and I'm going to justify my answer when we come back from 298 00:24:47.640 --> 00:24:51.480 the break. You're listening to Open minds UFO Radio. We're here with Martin 299 00:24:51.480 --> 00:24:56.240 Willis. Yo, Martin Yo. We'll be right back from this break. 300 00:25:11.839 --> 00:25:15.319 Welcome back to Open Mind UFO Radio. I'm your host Leandro Rojas, and 301 00:25:15.400 --> 00:25:22.279 we have with us Martin Willis of podcast UFO. I forgot what OH can 302 00:25:22.440 --> 00:25:26.000 do? Yeah, I was telling you, mush brain, Martin, mush 303 00:25:26.039 --> 00:25:33.200 brain. Willis. That's right. You almost brained. Oh I'm hanging in 304 00:25:33.440 --> 00:25:37.519 by a thread. But yeah, getting back to the Tom DeLong thing, 305 00:25:37.200 --> 00:25:41.599 is, uh, you know, we were all doubtful when he said that 306 00:25:41.720 --> 00:25:47.680 he was talking to insiders in the government and uh in the military. But 307 00:25:47.799 --> 00:25:52.000 it turned out he it really was going on, and if you read some 308 00:25:52.079 --> 00:25:55.839 of that stuff, it seems like this sense that they like the idea, 309 00:25:56.039 --> 00:26:02.079 and he had talked about this of him being an hour let to the youth 310 00:26:02.559 --> 00:26:07.319 to try to get an interest in science peaked by people out there. So 311 00:26:08.519 --> 00:26:12.680 you know, that's Tom's rule. Tom is seen by the mainstream. And 312 00:26:14.000 --> 00:26:18.400 here's my argument as to you know why. The evidence that that I'm right 313 00:26:18.440 --> 00:26:22.079 about this is, first of all, he was taken seriously by the military 314 00:26:22.400 --> 00:26:26.880 and others in moving all this along. Second of all is in the media 315 00:26:26.960 --> 00:26:30.920 reaction. The media reaction has been, you know, to make fun of 316 00:26:32.000 --> 00:26:36.079 him and to tease especially some of the things he said, but it hasn't 317 00:26:36.119 --> 00:26:41.240 had a negative effect on the group as a whole or lou Elizondo personally. 318 00:26:41.640 --> 00:26:47.920 They're all being taken very, very seriously because they have titles and positions that 319 00:26:48.799 --> 00:26:56.160 warrant that you know, someone who is a defense intelligence expert and advisor such 320 00:26:56.200 --> 00:27:03.559 as Melon or you know Elizon, who's an intelligence for the Pentagon. They're 321 00:27:03.599 --> 00:27:07.599 the ones who you're going to get the technical information from, not Tom. 322 00:27:07.759 --> 00:27:11.759 Tom is going to be like the marketing guy in any company, who you 323 00:27:11.839 --> 00:27:14.319 know is kind of full of it, and it's just you know, they're 324 00:27:14.400 --> 00:27:15.960 to say, hey, raw, raw, and this is cool, and 325 00:27:17.000 --> 00:27:21.519 this is great, and to keep the energy going and to keep communication and 326 00:27:21.559 --> 00:27:25.359 connections with people going. But that's not the expert. In fact, when 327 00:27:25.359 --> 00:27:27.640 a salesperson or a marketing person tells you x, y, and z about 328 00:27:27.680 --> 00:27:33.640 the tech, you know, anybody savvy in a corporation is gonna say yeah, 329 00:27:33.759 --> 00:27:36.720 right, and then actually go to the tech people to confirm whether and 330 00:27:36.720 --> 00:27:40.200 that that's true, because typically they're going to be told well, you know, 331 00:27:40.359 --> 00:27:44.240 out of all those points, most of those are inaccurate. But here's 332 00:27:44.000 --> 00:27:49.559 the real beef behind what it is. So so yeah, I don't think 333 00:27:49.559 --> 00:27:56.039 it doesn't appear as though that has been damaging up until this point. If 334 00:27:56.039 --> 00:28:02.319 there are some major campaigns to credit the groups in the future, which could 335 00:28:02.359 --> 00:28:07.160 happen, you know, they may use that tom against them. But yeah, 336 00:28:07.200 --> 00:28:11.160 so far we haven't seen it. I don't think. Yeah, the 337 00:28:11.640 --> 00:28:15.559 Joe Rogan podcast is the one. I'm sure you. I mean, I've 338 00:28:15.599 --> 00:28:18.039 got so many emails about that and it just didn't go well. It was 339 00:28:18.079 --> 00:28:22.559 not a good idea. No, not at all. And we see that 340 00:28:22.599 --> 00:28:26.240 Tom kind of feels that too, and that he has not been out in 341 00:28:26.240 --> 00:28:30.839 the media at all since that occurred. So it's been like a year and 342 00:28:30.920 --> 00:28:33.440 a half since we've heard from him. Yeah, I think that was sometime. 343 00:28:33.799 --> 00:28:40.799 I think it was actually in two thoy seventeen when he was actually on 344 00:28:40.920 --> 00:28:42.920 the Joe Rogan Show. I don't remember exactly what. Yeah, it was 345 00:28:42.960 --> 00:28:48.920 like mid to late twenty seventeen, which of course it was October twenty seventeen 346 00:28:48.920 --> 00:28:52.960 when they announced to the Stars, and I believe it was just before that. 347 00:28:53.440 --> 00:28:56.680 Oh, it was just before that. Wow. Wow. Yeah, 348 00:28:57.200 --> 00:29:00.240 So that's good, you know what I mean. I was you know, 349 00:29:00.279 --> 00:29:04.519 there are like you said, the team for the most part is pretty amazing, 350 00:29:04.839 --> 00:29:08.519 and that's really has you know, it has a lot of people talking 351 00:29:08.680 --> 00:29:12.880 about you know, their backgrounds and wow, you know this is being taken 352 00:29:12.920 --> 00:29:18.480 serious by these people. So it is good. And the UFO field, 353 00:29:18.519 --> 00:29:22.880 you know, I it's unfortunate because I think there's a level of professionalism and 354 00:29:23.920 --> 00:29:26.880 who was I talking to this with. I don't remember who, But there 355 00:29:27.000 --> 00:29:32.720 is this disconnect I think where they are not many of them are not seeing 356 00:29:32.720 --> 00:29:37.880 things from the perspective of like the mainstream, which is damaging because if you 357 00:29:37.920 --> 00:29:41.799 know, we wanted to be taken seriously, then you have to understand that, 358 00:29:42.359 --> 00:29:47.519 and you know they I think that just there's a lot of people who 359 00:29:47.599 --> 00:29:52.079 are discounting the credibility, the very high level of credibility of this to the 360 00:29:52.119 --> 00:30:03.279 Stars organization and the individuals involved. It's so high that at even comments from 361 00:30:03.599 --> 00:30:11.400 the do d's PR department do not hold water as compared to Harry Reid or 362 00:30:11.480 --> 00:30:18.279 lou Elizondo or others in the organization. And we've seen that the media doesn't 363 00:30:18.279 --> 00:30:26.519 even reference the d D PR Department, and they don't need to because there's 364 00:30:26.559 --> 00:30:30.119 ample evidence of everything that they have said. And these documents that we're going 365 00:30:30.200 --> 00:30:34.960 to talk to Nick Pope about are even further, you know, confirming that 366 00:30:36.160 --> 00:30:42.039 exactly what they said is true. And they also confirm similar leaked documents that 367 00:30:42.160 --> 00:30:48.359 George Knapp from KLAS in Las Vegas had been able to share months ago. 368 00:30:49.319 --> 00:30:56.079 Now, do you actually feel comfortable teasing a little bit Nick Pope's for you 369 00:30:56.599 --> 00:31:00.000 depends on what No. No, I just want to I want to hear 370 00:31:00.079 --> 00:31:02.519 I mean it seems to me, I mean, I looked into it a 371 00:31:02.559 --> 00:31:04.319 little bit. It was actually going to be something I was going to talk 372 00:31:04.319 --> 00:31:10.440 about, like a news you know story. But anyway, it's it sure 373 00:31:10.559 --> 00:31:15.599 seems to me on the outside. So far without I haven't been able to 374 00:31:15.599 --> 00:31:18.000 actually read the documents. I know there there's a copy online, but it's 375 00:31:18.079 --> 00:31:26.359 very tiny and hard to read. Sounds like the technology was taken serious and 376 00:31:26.720 --> 00:31:33.319 uh, and it sounds like it's kind of geared to extra terrestrial exactly. 377 00:31:33.880 --> 00:31:38.839 Yeah, And that's the point is that that's a big point. And I 378 00:31:38.839 --> 00:31:47.480 guess because you made that observation is that you know, they're not talking about 379 00:31:47.559 --> 00:31:57.880 it's the program is Advanced Aerospace and Threat Identification Program. But uh, and 380 00:31:59.039 --> 00:32:07.359 they're not talking about foreign technologies. They're talking about space propulsion technologies. So 381 00:32:08.079 --> 00:32:15.279 it goes to wonder, if you're looking at those documents and you're thinking, 382 00:32:15.319 --> 00:32:23.000 Okay, what is the foreign technology they're looking at, it points to that 383 00:32:23.119 --> 00:32:29.559 this foreign technology is not Russian or Chinese or you know, there's no reference 384 00:32:29.599 --> 00:32:35.359 to that. What there is reference to a space that this technology is space 385 00:32:35.480 --> 00:32:40.279 related, so exactly what you're talking about. So that's another really important part 386 00:32:40.359 --> 00:32:46.400 of those papers. There's even reference to the Drake equation exactly. That kind 387 00:32:46.440 --> 00:32:51.960 of points it out right there exactly. And you know, that's what Nick 388 00:32:52.000 --> 00:32:58.680 Pope brought up to Tucker Carlson on Fox News. That exact point is that 389 00:32:58.799 --> 00:33:04.119 if they're referring to the Great equation, that right there tells you the foreign 390 00:33:04.200 --> 00:33:08.599 parties that they're looking towards. Mm hmm. So exciting. So I can't 391 00:33:08.640 --> 00:33:14.319 wait to have I can't wait to hear that interview. Should be great, 392 00:33:15.000 --> 00:33:17.119 be a lot of fun. Now, hey, I want to hear from 393 00:33:17.200 --> 00:33:23.079 you if you don't mind sharing about some of your recent interviews, because you've 394 00:33:23.119 --> 00:33:28.720 had some really cool people on to talk, particularly about the Nimtz case. 395 00:33:28.799 --> 00:33:31.640 Right, So yes, yeah, could you share maybe I think it's the 396 00:33:31.680 --> 00:33:35.920 last two shows you've had focused on that. Well. I have this show 397 00:33:36.000 --> 00:33:43.759 coming up tomorrow with Robert Powell talking about any of the updates that he can 398 00:33:43.839 --> 00:33:47.640 share on the research on that, so that'll come up. But anyway, 399 00:33:47.759 --> 00:33:52.319 the last show I had, I had a former guest of yours on as 400 00:33:52.319 --> 00:34:00.359 well, Tyler Rogoway and Rights for the war Zone. And I also had 401 00:34:00.559 --> 00:34:07.320 Vincent I Yellow and he is a former fighter pilot. He's also a top 402 00:34:07.400 --> 00:34:15.000 gun trainer and he now is a commercial airline pilot and he really I asked 403 00:34:15.039 --> 00:34:20.119 him if he's gonna have any trouble talking about UFOs, you know, with 404 00:34:20.280 --> 00:34:22.719 his career in any type of way, and he said, I don't know. 405 00:34:22.760 --> 00:34:25.639 You know, he wasn't worried about it at all and had some great 406 00:34:25.679 --> 00:34:32.039 conversations with him. And he actually has a fighter Pilot podcast where he interviewed 407 00:34:32.679 --> 00:34:39.639 David Fraverer directly about the Nimitz case and it was basically pilot to pilot talking. 408 00:34:40.320 --> 00:34:44.119 So it's a really great interview. I think you said you had that 409 00:34:44.159 --> 00:34:47.199 posted somewhere right, Oh, yeah, yeah, I had that posted on 410 00:34:47.239 --> 00:34:52.840 the front page because yeah, I mean, how I think that's really important. 411 00:34:52.440 --> 00:34:59.559 And so as a fellow, you know, a pilot, and how 412 00:34:59.559 --> 00:35:05.840 did he feel about Fraver's testimony one hundred percent credible? He said that I 413 00:35:05.920 --> 00:35:08.960 like what he said. He said, you know before he actually sat and 414 00:35:09.000 --> 00:35:14.599 talked face to face with with Fravor, who was a friend, you know, 415 00:35:14.840 --> 00:35:19.159 a former friend, and they were he was actually on uh Vincent was 416 00:35:19.199 --> 00:35:24.159 actually on the USS Nimics during the encounter, remember you know, so, 417 00:35:24.639 --> 00:35:29.679 but but there were you know, he didn't he would see him in passing. 418 00:35:29.800 --> 00:35:35.159 There wasn't any direct contact at that point, but he does discuss you 419 00:35:35.199 --> 00:35:37.760 know, what happened. There was a you know, people teasing him. 420 00:35:37.760 --> 00:35:40.679 There was a lot of ridicule at that time, you know, because of 421 00:35:40.719 --> 00:35:47.440 the because of that. But he said that he but prior to actually talking 422 00:35:47.719 --> 00:35:52.000 directly to David, that he thought, you know, UFO people were just 423 00:35:52.039 --> 00:35:54.639 wackos. He said, I hope I don't offend anyone, and he says, 424 00:35:54.639 --> 00:35:59.320 but I do. He says, but now I know that there's really 425 00:35:59.360 --> 00:36:05.000 something to this, and I think it's very interesting. He further went on 426 00:36:05.039 --> 00:36:07.199 to say, you know, I asked him if he was going to, 427 00:36:07.960 --> 00:36:10.159 you know, look into the topic more, and he said, it's kind 428 00:36:10.159 --> 00:36:15.880 of like you know, golfing. It's something I might think is interesting. 429 00:36:15.960 --> 00:36:19.480 But he says, I'm not really you know, and unless it circles back 430 00:36:19.480 --> 00:36:22.960 around again, he says, I'm not going to be exploring the topic. 431 00:36:22.000 --> 00:36:24.119 And I said, no, I'm not talking about on your show. I 432 00:36:24.159 --> 00:36:29.679 mean personally, do you think that you might have more of an interest now 433 00:36:29.719 --> 00:36:34.039 that you think they're you know, you think that David Favor is credible And 434 00:36:34.079 --> 00:36:37.440 he said, well, yeah, yeah, not to be honest, you 435 00:36:37.519 --> 00:36:39.880 know, not not really, you know, so I think it's I think 436 00:36:39.920 --> 00:36:43.920 that's kind of fascinating that he might. I mean to me, I think, 437 00:36:44.599 --> 00:36:47.159 you know, I can only I can only go by what I feel, 438 00:36:47.239 --> 00:36:52.239 And you know, I just think it's such an important topic and could 439 00:36:52.280 --> 00:36:55.719 mean so many changes in the world. Just that one thing. If there's 440 00:36:55.760 --> 00:37:00.000 actually intelligent life out there and we know it for sure and it's actually visiting 441 00:37:00.079 --> 00:37:04.239 us, I mean, if that's really what it is, I think that's 442 00:37:04.320 --> 00:37:07.760 major, and you know, I'm surprised at that. Yeah, And I 443 00:37:07.800 --> 00:37:10.920 agree with you. On the other hand, I can kind of see it 444 00:37:12.000 --> 00:37:17.480 because in a way, I mean, in a way I even feel and 445 00:37:17.599 --> 00:37:21.719 maybe you do too. I know, Mikah Hanks talks about this, and 446 00:37:21.719 --> 00:37:25.840 I agree with him, you know, feeling agnostic about this whole field in 447 00:37:27.000 --> 00:37:32.320 that it's really interesting to look into and look into discoveries and advancements, but 448 00:37:32.920 --> 00:37:37.760 we may not, if not, probably won't really make much headway in our 449 00:37:37.800 --> 00:37:44.280 lifetimes. And you know, if you're a real student of this field, 450 00:37:44.880 --> 00:37:50.440 and you look at even people like doctor j Allen Heinek, he passed away 451 00:37:50.840 --> 00:37:57.000 without really knowing a whole lot more, and so have many many researchers coming 452 00:37:57.039 --> 00:38:01.679 gone, some spending the majority of their lives looking into this without much a 453 00:38:01.719 --> 00:38:07.440 whole lot of knowledge necessarily, you know, like real understanding being gained. 454 00:38:07.760 --> 00:38:12.679 So however, it's still really interesting and he may feel that way. It's 455 00:38:12.719 --> 00:38:15.320 just kind of like how we feel about you know, he probably feels, 456 00:38:15.360 --> 00:38:22.760 let's say, and no doubt Tyler Roguaway does about certain technologies that they're really 457 00:38:22.800 --> 00:38:28.400 important, you know, certain jet propulsion or other technologies that are cutting edge, 458 00:38:28.760 --> 00:38:30.519 but we don't pay attention to it, even though it may affect our 459 00:38:30.559 --> 00:38:37.880 lives in that it makes air travel ten times quicker and maybe ten times safer 460 00:38:37.920 --> 00:38:39.400 for us in the next few years. But we're like, yeah, that's 461 00:38:39.400 --> 00:38:44.519 interesting, but we don't look into the details, even though it's something that 462 00:38:44.559 --> 00:38:47.159 will affect our lives. So I could see how, you know, we 463 00:38:47.360 --> 00:38:51.239 just all have our interests in things that we're looking into. But it is 464 00:38:51.280 --> 00:38:54.559 funny. Some people in this field get really frustrated that others aren't, like, 465 00:38:55.079 --> 00:38:59.800 you know, freaking out and talking about this every day. But I 466 00:38:59.800 --> 00:39:01.239 can see why they wouldn't, you know, it's not really going to affect 467 00:39:01.239 --> 00:39:07.440 his life except for when he hears fellow pilots talking about UFO sightings, he 468 00:39:07.519 --> 00:39:12.079 may at least not make fun of them or take them more seriously. Yeah, 469 00:39:12.079 --> 00:39:15.760 there's something I'm gonna mention that Tyler was talking about. But another thing, 470 00:39:15.800 --> 00:39:19.679 though, I do, I do have to say a commenting on what 471 00:39:19.719 --> 00:39:23.119 you just said there a minute ago, and that is you don't think or 472 00:39:23.320 --> 00:39:28.840 you feel as though that you probably won't know in your lifetime. I've always 473 00:39:28.960 --> 00:39:32.440 I have said that many times on my show and felt that way also, 474 00:39:32.719 --> 00:39:38.000 But I don't know. Lately, I just seem to be having a feeling 475 00:39:38.039 --> 00:39:42.159 that we're going to know more, and we're going to know more fairly soon. 476 00:39:42.519 --> 00:39:46.280 Now. Maybe people have said that for the last seventy years and like 477 00:39:46.320 --> 00:39:52.320 you said, passed away without knowing anything extra. But I just have that 478 00:39:52.400 --> 00:39:57.599 feeling. It just feels like things are like the bananas being peeled back a 479 00:39:57.679 --> 00:40:00.480 little and more is being revealed now. No, well, I think we 480 00:40:00.599 --> 00:40:04.960 all have that feeling, and that's where things like twenty twelve happen. You 481 00:40:04.960 --> 00:40:07.079 know, we all feel something BIG's going to happen. So when people say 482 00:40:07.079 --> 00:40:10.360 twenty twelve is a year something BIG's going to happen, that feels right, 483 00:40:10.440 --> 00:40:15.079 that's got to happen, and then nothing does. However, there is a 484 00:40:15.079 --> 00:40:19.360 little bit there is something to your argument in that. And this is another 485 00:40:19.400 --> 00:40:22.679 thing that I feel, you know, with a lot of the UFO community, 486 00:40:22.760 --> 00:40:29.400 not all of it, but a lot, there's this you know, 487 00:40:29.480 --> 00:40:36.039 what's going on right now has literally never happened in the UFO field. This 488 00:40:36.159 --> 00:40:44.360 amount of credible information and witnesses coming forward about a secret program or these military 489 00:40:44.440 --> 00:40:47.480 encounters. This just does not happened like this in the past. The closest 490 00:40:47.480 --> 00:40:52.199 thing would be blue Book, Project blue Book. But Project blue Book, 491 00:40:52.960 --> 00:40:58.000 as we know from Edward Rupelt's book, who ran Blue Book in nineteen fifty 492 00:40:58.000 --> 00:41:01.239 two, began the nineteen fifty two Final Bubrig Project. A lot of the 493 00:41:01.280 --> 00:41:06.880 Air Force's stance was anti UFO to really kind of, you know, get 494 00:41:06.920 --> 00:41:12.440 the public to quit being so fascinated with the topic. Whereas that wasn't lose 495 00:41:13.079 --> 00:41:16.719 intention. In fact, there's what's the opposite was to actually look into the 496 00:41:16.760 --> 00:41:22.679 mystery of the whole topic. So it's a huge difference. And you know, 497 00:41:22.880 --> 00:41:28.119 I think that like, for instance, it's fun because George Knapp is 498 00:41:28.159 --> 00:41:31.360 like a little kid in a candy story. He is so excited about this 499 00:41:31.480 --> 00:41:35.960 moment in life because he's worked so hard, you know, towards looking at 500 00:41:36.000 --> 00:41:39.679 this topic, and he's been a part of some major investigations that have been 501 00:41:40.599 --> 00:41:46.840 revelatory. But a lot of this information he felt would never get out and 502 00:41:47.599 --> 00:41:51.199 he didn't feel like, you know, we would have this level. And 503 00:41:51.239 --> 00:41:55.159 he really feels extremely excited and happy to be alive. As the way he 504 00:41:55.239 --> 00:42:02.519 put it that during this time where so much information is coming forward, and 505 00:42:02.960 --> 00:42:09.159 I think that that's a I think that that's a justified perspective, and I 506 00:42:09.199 --> 00:42:15.159 think it, you know, is an argument to justify your feelings too that 507 00:42:15.239 --> 00:42:19.119 you know, more is happening right now, and more may continue, probably 508 00:42:19.159 --> 00:42:23.000 will continue, and so you know, it could the information could ramp up 509 00:42:23.000 --> 00:42:28.880 exponentially. Yeah. So I was saying just a minute earlier that I was 510 00:42:28.880 --> 00:42:32.079 going to talk about something. Tyler Rogaway said a couple of things. First 511 00:42:32.119 --> 00:42:37.000 of all, as I think he mentioned on your show, you know, 512 00:42:37.880 --> 00:42:42.440 throw out what is not you know, what can be explained that should be. 513 00:42:42.480 --> 00:42:44.719 He was calling himself a debunker, and I said, no, you're 514 00:42:44.760 --> 00:42:50.119 not. I think of a debunkers someone that takes a hoax and disproves it. 515 00:42:50.159 --> 00:42:52.599 I said, you're you're just explaining what people are thinking as a UFO, 516 00:42:52.760 --> 00:42:55.639 and he, you know, he's very You think that's very important, 517 00:42:55.679 --> 00:42:59.440 and I do too, you know, and I like what he said. 518 00:42:59.480 --> 00:43:04.519 He said, there's so much that can't be explained, you don't need to, 519 00:43:05.000 --> 00:43:07.480 you know, hang on. The stuff that can be explained exactly just 520 00:43:07.519 --> 00:43:13.039 takes up space. And I thought that was really good. That is really 521 00:43:13.039 --> 00:43:15.599 good, and it's a great point. And I mean, I know Mark 522 00:43:15.679 --> 00:43:17.760 d' antonio, you know, the photo and video analysts rem move on, 523 00:43:19.119 --> 00:43:22.400 gets really frustrated when I talk about him debunking stuff, but he does, 524 00:43:22.559 --> 00:43:28.239 and I love it, and it's great because, uh, for that point 525 00:43:28.360 --> 00:43:31.199 right there, we need to get rid of the stuff that could be explained, 526 00:43:31.480 --> 00:43:37.800 focus on the truly anomalous, because that's you know, our efforts well 527 00:43:37.840 --> 00:43:42.599 spent, as opposed to wasting our time with stuff. And that's why it's 528 00:43:42.639 --> 00:43:45.960 exciting. I don't know, I think you feel this way too. I 529 00:43:45.960 --> 00:43:51.280 get excited when something gets explained, even if it's mundane. Yeah, because 530 00:43:51.280 --> 00:43:52.519 then we don't have to spend our time with that. We can focus on 531 00:43:52.559 --> 00:43:57.320 that better stuff. Move on, move on to the real stuff if you 532 00:43:57.360 --> 00:44:00.559 can. Yeah. On the second part of what he's said, I think 533 00:44:00.639 --> 00:44:05.119 is very interesting, and he was getting into the new technologies, you know, 534 00:44:05.199 --> 00:44:08.239 black project things that we don't know about. He said that he has 535 00:44:09.199 --> 00:44:14.559 you know, from what heat he researches, that we're going to be seeing 536 00:44:14.800 --> 00:44:19.000 things in the sky that are military that we're not going to be able to 537 00:44:19.000 --> 00:44:22.199 explain. He said, you know, there's going to be a lot more 538 00:44:22.559 --> 00:44:28.280 of what people are considering UFOs that you know, maybe just you know, 539 00:44:28.480 --> 00:44:32.840 new technologies. And he said, you know again that the Air Force, 540 00:44:32.920 --> 00:44:37.840 as they have done in the past, may actually not mind if we call 541 00:44:37.880 --> 00:44:43.519 the UFO you know, yeah, divert the attention of you know, of 542 00:44:43.519 --> 00:44:46.440 what it really is. Yeah. I mean, some people argue that that 543 00:44:46.679 --> 00:44:52.360 case you can see this at the Scientific Coalition for Uphology, the s CU 544 00:44:52.760 --> 00:44:59.440 website, seu dash online, that there's this case you know, or over 545 00:44:59.639 --> 00:45:02.800 part of we go actually at Open Minds, we've got to kind of break 546 00:45:02.840 --> 00:45:09.000 the investigation of this case. And a lot of people argue that what is 547 00:45:09.039 --> 00:45:14.400 seen in this video that you know, Mark for instance, he hasn't put 548 00:45:14.440 --> 00:45:17.239 together his full argument, but he feels that he it is something mundane. 549 00:45:19.119 --> 00:45:22.480 Others, especially the investigators, do not, and and a lot of very 550 00:45:22.559 --> 00:45:27.880 credible people don't agree with him. But some argue that what that is is 551 00:45:27.920 --> 00:45:35.039 could be just that technology that is being tested out there. And I think 552 00:45:35.039 --> 00:45:38.280 that's a great point. I mean, drones have shown that with They've got 553 00:45:38.320 --> 00:45:43.079 sparkly lights on him, and people mist make mistake them for UFOs all the 554 00:45:43.119 --> 00:45:49.519 time. But you know, even with drone technology the military could be developing, 555 00:45:49.599 --> 00:45:53.239 Like my drone is a spark, a DJA spark, super tiny, 556 00:45:54.079 --> 00:46:00.199 but the lights are really bright. It can zoom around super fast. So 557 00:46:00.360 --> 00:46:02.920 like if the military souped up one of these things and let it autonomously, 558 00:46:04.360 --> 00:46:07.320 you know, fly a couple hundred miles across the country on its own, 559 00:46:07.760 --> 00:46:10.519 or even put it in a mode where it can go to an area, 560 00:46:12.119 --> 00:46:16.159 examine and photographed the entire area that is maybe a few one hundred or thousand 561 00:46:16.239 --> 00:46:21.400 miles away and then come back, or while it's transmitting the data that it's 562 00:46:21.840 --> 00:46:24.159 you know, at the same time, it would look so tiny that you 563 00:46:24.199 --> 00:46:29.360 wouldn't recognize it as a as a military technology or something like that. So 564 00:46:30.239 --> 00:46:35.000 I think what he says makes a lot of sense now just for the listener 565 00:46:35.000 --> 00:46:37.199 out there. The Puerto Rico. I know you've interviewed a couple of people 566 00:46:37.239 --> 00:46:44.639 on that Puerto Rico. UFO was in Aguadilla. Yeah, that was like 567 00:46:44.639 --> 00:46:50.000 in twenty seventeen, also, wasn't it. And now that I was earlier, 568 00:46:50.039 --> 00:46:53.119 what two thousand when it occurred with something like two thousand and nine when 569 00:46:53.119 --> 00:46:58.400 the paper came out was around twenty sixteen or seventeen. And you know who 570 00:46:58.519 --> 00:47:01.079 is one of the top end investigators of that was Robert Powell, who you're 571 00:47:01.119 --> 00:47:07.559 having on your show, right And Larry Kate's Larry Kates was one of those. 572 00:47:07.719 --> 00:47:14.519 Rich Hoffman, Morgan Biale and Rich oh Man and Carl Paulson. I 573 00:47:14.519 --> 00:47:16.840 think those were the leads. One or two other people I might be forgetting 574 00:47:16.880 --> 00:47:22.000 and I apologize, but yeah, Well, the weird thing about that it 575 00:47:22.079 --> 00:47:24.679 is a skim through the water, never lost speed. I don't think there's 576 00:47:24.719 --> 00:47:31.000 anything. Yeah, I can't imagine technology that would do that. Now, 577 00:47:31.119 --> 00:47:37.000 I I think it's hot. That's the part that is a little bit more 578 00:47:37.000 --> 00:47:39.719 difficult to prove whether or not that happened. If that did happen, that 579 00:47:39.760 --> 00:47:45.800 would be very significant. They feel they can prove that pretty strongly, and 580 00:47:45.880 --> 00:47:53.000 maybe they can. But even the aerodynamics or at least the flight path that 581 00:47:53.239 --> 00:48:00.440 I think that you know, they have demonstrated, and the other aspects, 582 00:48:00.519 --> 00:48:07.320 the physical aspects of the object are very unique, very strange. And that 583 00:48:07.440 --> 00:48:10.760 was a gun camera too, right, there's gun camera. And this is 584 00:48:10.800 --> 00:48:15.599 an important point, and that doesn't fit actually Mark's theory. Mark theory is 585 00:48:15.599 --> 00:48:22.280 that it's a balloon. So and it is important, I think to review 586 00:48:22.360 --> 00:48:27.880 this theory because Mark makes a very excellent point on the nature of photography and 587 00:48:29.119 --> 00:48:35.119 videography when it comes to moving cameras. So you see this object traveling over 588 00:48:35.599 --> 00:48:39.079 from the ocean over the land, it loops around and then travels back out 589 00:48:39.119 --> 00:48:45.199 to the ocean. Well, Mark points out that this aircraft is essentially doing 590 00:48:45.280 --> 00:48:49.760 a half circle around the object. So when you see the background moving quickly, 591 00:48:50.280 --> 00:48:53.039 that doesn't necessarily mean the objects moving quickly. He feels the object is 592 00:48:53.079 --> 00:48:58.039 actually moving very slowly. It's a balloon, and then it gives the appearance 593 00:48:58.039 --> 00:49:01.519 of moving quickly because the background is moving. And he's got a good point 594 00:49:01.559 --> 00:49:07.000 because that is a phenomenon I believe it's called parallax, and that does give 595 00:49:07.039 --> 00:49:12.960 the wrong impression and that happens often. But right after this break, I'll 596 00:49:13.000 --> 00:49:17.760 make the argument as to why he I feel that and many others feel he's 597 00:49:17.760 --> 00:49:22.199 off on and he's still working on proving his perspective. But we've got to 598 00:49:22.239 --> 00:49:28.079 take another break. We'll be right back after this short musical interlude. Or 599 00:49:28.079 --> 00:49:34.079 for those of you listening on other outlets such as KGRA, you'll hear some 600 00:49:34.119 --> 00:50:16.519 commercials. Be right back. Welcome back to Open Mind UFO Radio. I'm 601 00:50:16.519 --> 00:50:22.159 your host, Alejandro Rojas, and we have with us mister Martin Podcast UFO. 602 00:50:22.320 --> 00:50:30.760 Willis can do can what a can do attitude. So here's where I 603 00:50:30.760 --> 00:50:35.360 think we just talked about the parallax where a slow moving object can be looking 604 00:50:35.440 --> 00:50:40.760 fast on a video. However, there is I think that the group argues, 605 00:50:40.800 --> 00:50:45.800 and I think very I think they have a strong argument, is that 606 00:50:45.840 --> 00:50:52.280 it appears this object is moving behind a poll, and so that that's a 607 00:50:52.320 --> 00:50:59.599 big deal. That would demonstrate that it is moving. And you know, 608 00:50:59.639 --> 00:51:02.440 when you do all the line alignments and everything, I mean, it really 609 00:51:02.480 --> 00:51:07.360 does look like it is moving. And what Mark is also doing is discounting 610 00:51:07.400 --> 00:51:15.079 the witness testimony, which as a video analyst or a photo analyst, you 611 00:51:15.239 --> 00:51:20.199 don't take into account to witness testimony, So that's good for him to do. 612 00:51:20.719 --> 00:51:24.320 Here's why, at least in one phase of your analysis, you don't 613 00:51:24.360 --> 00:51:31.079 want to take into witness testimony. It's because if the data, if you 614 00:51:31.239 --> 00:51:35.800 just give this photo or video to an analyst like Mark, don't even tell 615 00:51:35.840 --> 00:51:37.639 them about the rest of the case, and let them see what they determine. 616 00:51:37.840 --> 00:51:42.599 If they come back with an answer that is similar to what the witnesses 617 00:51:42.639 --> 00:51:46.480 tell you, then you have a stronger case. Then you have better corroboration 618 00:51:46.719 --> 00:51:52.679 or better of the story, because that means the data that is able to 619 00:51:52.719 --> 00:52:00.679 be retrieved from the photo or video corroborates what the witness is saying. So 620 00:52:00.719 --> 00:52:05.159 that's what's really important. That piece of data, that photo or video has 621 00:52:05.199 --> 00:52:08.119 to stand on its own as far as if it's a good piece of evidence 622 00:52:08.360 --> 00:52:15.000 or not. So that's why that's important. But in this case, we 623 00:52:15.199 --> 00:52:22.639 have the pilots of the Homeland Security or Customs plane that captured this, so 624 00:52:22.679 --> 00:52:28.400 we have some very credible witness data. And the credibility of the witness data 625 00:52:28.480 --> 00:52:30.800 is extremely important. Some people say, oh, you can put someone away 626 00:52:31.280 --> 00:52:36.760 with witness testimony, but there's a caveat to that. There's a lot that 627 00:52:36.800 --> 00:52:43.239 goes into that, and expert testimony counts one hundred million times better than just 628 00:52:43.320 --> 00:52:47.840 a civilian novice testimony and layman testimony. In this case, you can consider 629 00:52:47.880 --> 00:52:54.000 these pilots expert testimony. But here's a part of their testimony that really blows 630 00:52:54.400 --> 00:53:00.920 marks the balloon theory out as well as that this whole thing starts. It 631 00:53:00.960 --> 00:53:07.280 was dark out and they saw a light. They saw an illuminated object out 632 00:53:07.320 --> 00:53:12.639 in the ocean moving towards the land, and that's how this whole thing started. 633 00:53:13.199 --> 00:53:17.159 The light then turned out, but they had aimed their cameras over there 634 00:53:17.199 --> 00:53:22.719 to capture to see whatever this thing was, and they were able to capture 635 00:53:22.719 --> 00:53:28.320 it on their infrared while it was invisible to the naked eye because the light 636 00:53:28.400 --> 00:53:32.280 had gone out. And then they tracked this object. So we have witness 637 00:53:32.400 --> 00:53:39.440 testimony that it traveled in the manner in which the SEU group estimates it did 638 00:53:39.480 --> 00:53:45.119 travel. So their estimation does corroborate what the witnesses had said. And of 639 00:53:45.159 --> 00:53:49.440 course a balloon is not going to have a light on it, and that 640 00:53:49.559 --> 00:53:53.000 it can turn on and off, and plus the balloon was out over the 641 00:53:53.000 --> 00:53:58.159 ocean and then moved into the land and move back to the ocean. So 642 00:53:59.679 --> 00:54:05.840 yeah, I really think these guys are really onto something, and a lot 643 00:54:05.840 --> 00:54:10.639 of the military experts that have taken a look at it agree, So I 644 00:54:10.639 --> 00:54:15.719 think it's a really good case. But now, did they get any radar 645 00:54:15.800 --> 00:54:21.599 returns on that? No, no radar returns, but there was like at 646 00:54:21.679 --> 00:54:25.639 least one aircraft that was delayed because they were told that something was in the 647 00:54:25.679 --> 00:54:30.440 area. But we I don't think we know exactly why. Of course, 648 00:54:30.679 --> 00:54:34.760 Robert Pal's the expert on this, he would know all the very minute details. 649 00:54:34.800 --> 00:54:38.119 But I don't think they gave a reason as to why that was delayed. 650 00:54:38.760 --> 00:54:42.599 So they didn't say we had something on radar or anything like that. 651 00:54:43.599 --> 00:54:46.639 I remember speaking Bart me go ahead, Oh, I was going to say 652 00:54:46.639 --> 00:54:52.840 that I think Robert was the one who was able to grab at least do 653 00:54:52.960 --> 00:54:58.880 the investigation into the radar aspect. I was just saying that. I remember 654 00:54:58.880 --> 00:55:01.639 speaking with Bruce ma could be a number of years ago, and he said 655 00:55:01.639 --> 00:55:10.440 that the witness testimony was as important as the image. But I understand the 656 00:55:10.480 --> 00:55:15.320 way you put that, and that is that you know, first have them 657 00:55:15.679 --> 00:55:22.519 you know, look at the data and then and then you know, I 658 00:55:22.519 --> 00:55:25.159 think that is important because that is you know something right in front of you 659 00:55:25.960 --> 00:55:30.679 and then go ahead ahead. I was going to say, if if you 660 00:55:30.760 --> 00:55:37.440 were a field investigator that worked with Bruce mcabe, you would be surprised. 661 00:55:37.480 --> 00:55:43.920 He said that because it was frustrating. I was a field investigator when Bruce 662 00:55:44.000 --> 00:55:49.239 mcaby was the photo analyst before Mark Antonio was, and that's where I learned 663 00:55:49.280 --> 00:55:52.840 this from was from Bruce, because I would send him stuff and he'd say, 664 00:55:53.000 --> 00:55:57.280 well, it looks like this, this and that, but he would 665 00:55:57.360 --> 00:56:02.239 not take into account the witness testimony, and so I would get really frustrated 666 00:56:02.440 --> 00:56:07.519 until I could discuss this with him and understand it better. Because in his 667 00:56:07.719 --> 00:56:14.280 at least photo initial photo analysis, and that's different than the entire case as 668 00:56:14.320 --> 00:56:16.760 a whole. So for the photo analysis, he would do just what Mark 669 00:56:16.800 --> 00:56:21.960 said. He would not take into witness account testimony into account at all. 670 00:56:22.000 --> 00:56:24.119 He would look at it and say, and it was a good point because 671 00:56:24.159 --> 00:56:29.119 then I knew that even though this person took this picture of a light in 672 00:56:29.199 --> 00:56:38.159 the sky at night, that data from that photo did not serve as good 673 00:56:38.280 --> 00:56:44.039 evidence to support what the witness was saying. Even though we get so excited, 674 00:56:44.079 --> 00:56:46.320 oh my gosh, we have a photo, it's really not big of 675 00:56:46.360 --> 00:56:51.559 a deal. That's why photo analysis. Our photos aren't really a lot of 676 00:56:51.599 --> 00:56:57.840 times great evidence or data to bolster a case because it doesn't support or it 677 00:56:57.840 --> 00:57:01.280 doesn't prove what the witness is saying. So you're then left just to rely 678 00:57:01.719 --> 00:57:08.559 on the witness testimony on its own because the photo doesn't really land any It's 679 00:57:08.599 --> 00:57:13.239 an interesting thing. It's interesting for the media and you know the layman who 680 00:57:13.239 --> 00:57:17.079 wants to look into the case, but it's not as interesting as a piece 681 00:57:17.079 --> 00:57:22.559 of evidence when you're analyzing whether it's a substantial piece of evidence. So he 682 00:57:22.639 --> 00:57:27.440 did the same thing as Mark. But I think what he was telling you 683 00:57:27.559 --> 00:57:30.880 is when you take a step back and you're looking at the case as a 684 00:57:30.920 --> 00:57:34.920 whole, that's when the witness testimony, you know, plays a big role. 685 00:57:35.559 --> 00:57:37.280 Yeah. I can't remember the exact context, but you're probably right. 686 00:57:37.719 --> 00:57:45.679 Yeah, because I used to get utraighted and so before, and that's how 687 00:57:45.679 --> 00:57:47.719 I learned it all because I was I was like, you're not taking I 688 00:57:47.760 --> 00:57:52.440 do account the whitness testimony, and he's like, well, it just from 689 00:57:52.480 --> 00:57:55.800 what the witness says and the evidence are showing in the photo. The photo 690 00:57:55.920 --> 00:58:02.079 just does not show anything. It's not conclusively anomalous at all, which is 691 00:58:02.079 --> 00:58:07.519 a great point, you know, And that's the limitations of photos and videos. 692 00:58:07.599 --> 00:58:14.960 They got to be really extraordinary too, and we don't really have extraordinary 693 00:58:15.000 --> 00:58:22.599 photo or video evidence, really extraordinary. Well there's always CGI, yeah, 694 00:58:22.679 --> 00:58:28.119 and then there's CG on top of that, and there's a lot of issue. 695 00:58:28.440 --> 00:58:32.320 So it's a really good point. And I don't think, you know, 696 00:58:32.440 --> 00:58:37.480 I mean, the fact that something is not picked up on radar seems 697 00:58:37.480 --> 00:58:42.519 to not really matter because there's case after case after case where there was never 698 00:58:42.639 --> 00:58:46.320 a radar return on an object that people clearly see, which is you know, 699 00:58:47.039 --> 00:58:51.840 I don't think it, you know, it's probably just another capability of 700 00:58:51.880 --> 00:58:55.679 whatever it is. But what's exciting are the cases that do have radar, 701 00:58:55.760 --> 00:59:00.840 and there are quite a few. So the NIMETS has some radar data that 702 00:59:00.880 --> 00:59:06.760 comes with it. And speaking of Tyler Rogaway, there are a couple great 703 00:59:06.840 --> 00:59:13.239 cases that he you know, broke to the media and wrote about that had 704 00:59:13.280 --> 00:59:20.280 some anomaloist radar returns as well, especially that Colorado, Utah. I think 705 00:59:20.320 --> 00:59:27.760 it was yeah, Oregon, the Oregon case. That was California Oregon case 706 00:59:27.840 --> 00:59:31.239 that had the radar and that that adds a lot. In fact, there 707 00:59:31.320 --> 00:59:36.840 was another case in New Mexico he wrote debate about that got more media attention, 708 00:59:37.480 --> 00:59:40.880 but all we had there was some pilots talking back and forth about something 709 00:59:40.920 --> 00:59:46.440 they saw. Where he really likes this California Oregon case better because it not 710 00:59:46.480 --> 00:59:52.119 only has the witness testimony from the pilots and the audio of that, but 711 00:59:52.199 --> 00:59:59.000 it also has radar returns of something really strange. So let's say scrambled. 712 01:00:00.159 --> 01:00:02.719 They scrambled a jet after that too. I do believe yep, the jet 713 01:00:02.760 --> 01:00:07.400 got there too late. It was already gone. But you're right, and 714 01:00:07.480 --> 01:00:13.320 that Another really crazy part of that case is that you had the FAA people 715 01:00:14.440 --> 01:00:21.159 talking about should we have the commercial aircraft follow this object and not land in 716 01:00:21.320 --> 01:00:28.239 Oregon, and they decided against that because they didn't know if whatever this object 717 01:00:28.480 --> 01:00:31.199 was was hostile, so they didn't want to put civilians in harm's way, 718 01:00:32.119 --> 01:00:37.559 so they let the commercial aircraft land or the civilian aircraft land, and that's 719 01:00:37.599 --> 01:00:42.480 why they lost visual of the object. By the time the jets got there 720 01:00:42.519 --> 01:00:49.239 that were scrambled, the object was nowhere to be found. Wow. Also, 721 01:00:49.960 --> 01:00:54.559 the conversation I had with Tyler recently, it seems to me that the 722 01:00:54.639 --> 01:01:04.119 FAA has loosened up as far as you know, being cooperative in information when 723 01:01:04.199 --> 01:01:07.400 it comes to UFOs. At least they are listening to him. May be 724 01:01:07.400 --> 01:01:13.880 because you know, he's a journalist and he writes about aviation and maybe he's 725 01:01:14.360 --> 01:01:17.079 connected in that way, but they have actually shared a lot of things with 726 01:01:17.199 --> 01:01:21.239 him, and as you know, that's not the way it used to be. 727 01:01:22.039 --> 01:01:23.960 No, not at all of them, and they wouldn't share anything. 728 01:01:24.000 --> 01:01:30.679 They would just refer you to Newfork, which is a website ran by Peter 729 01:01:30.800 --> 01:01:35.159 Davenport, one guy you know that collects UFO sidings, or they may refer 730 01:01:35.239 --> 01:01:39.079 you to Bigelow to just report your siding. But that was about it, 731 01:01:39.480 --> 01:01:44.199 and which was shocking that they wouldn't want to know or look into it, 732 01:01:44.239 --> 01:01:47.719 and they wouldn't share information. But like you said, even Tyler has been 733 01:01:47.800 --> 01:01:52.960 shocked at the level of cooperation he's received from them regarding these cases he's looked 734 01:01:52.960 --> 01:02:00.800 into, right, even radio I think even radio recordingss you know, pretty 735 01:02:00.800 --> 01:02:07.679 amazing it is, and you know what would be interesting to ask Robert Powell 736 01:02:07.000 --> 01:02:10.679 if he has had that same experience. I have not approached the fa for 737 01:02:10.840 --> 01:02:15.920 anything in the last few years. I used to when I was a move 738 01:02:15.000 --> 01:02:22.320 on field investigator, and I'd get that run around. But I believe Robert 739 01:02:22.320 --> 01:02:27.719 Powell has because he's so actively researching these cases that he would probably it'd be 740 01:02:27.760 --> 01:02:36.000 interesting to see if from a UFO investigator's perspective, if they've had that same 741 01:02:36.199 --> 01:02:40.079 kind of experience of the FAA being more forthcoming, right. I wonder if 742 01:02:40.119 --> 01:02:46.000 they I wonder if they hang on to the material from past, you know, 743 01:02:46.119 --> 01:02:51.159 incidents for you know, just thinking back to like two thousand and six, 744 01:02:51.199 --> 01:02:54.119 Oh here you know that. I wonder if they mean because they wouldn't 745 01:02:54.119 --> 01:02:59.719 share anything about that really m hm. And you wonder if they have that 746 01:02:59.800 --> 01:03:05.960 some we're archived. Yeah, I wonder. I know that recently the Robert 747 01:03:06.000 --> 01:03:12.239 had shared with me that the way you access radar changed, and I think 748 01:03:12.280 --> 01:03:15.320 he said, you can't foil a FAA data anymore. So you have to 749 01:03:15.360 --> 01:03:24.000 foia military radar installations to get radar data. So wow, yeah, Well, 750 01:03:25.599 --> 01:03:29.920 one thing I wanted to talk to about. Did you you probably read 751 01:03:29.920 --> 01:03:36.800 this that Harry Reid purportedly is pushing for more UFO research. Yeah, he 752 01:03:36.920 --> 01:03:43.679 just had this interview where they asked him about his UFO stuff, and which 753 01:03:43.719 --> 01:03:45.840 is great. He did not shy away from it. He said, yeah, 754 01:03:45.000 --> 01:03:49.360 right, you know, I started this program. I'm happy I did. 755 01:03:49.800 --> 01:03:52.800 And he said, we need to look into this stuff. It's important. 756 01:03:53.280 --> 01:03:58.760 And he welcomes you know, fellow politicians and others to you know, 757 01:03:58.920 --> 01:04:03.360 advocate and to continue, you know, looking into what he feels as a 758 01:04:03.440 --> 01:04:11.519 very important topic. Right, And I'm really glad that he's doing that because 759 01:04:11.559 --> 01:04:15.599 you you know, I mean it might he might start the ball rolling. 760 01:04:15.639 --> 01:04:18.599 I mean, he was an important He wasn't just a senator, you know, 761 01:04:18.679 --> 01:04:23.880 he was I think he was a whip, wasn't he also, Yes, 762 01:04:24.559 --> 01:04:29.639 well he was the majority leader. Yeah, the majority leader. That's 763 01:04:29.880 --> 01:04:33.039 that's pretty big. Yeah. So yeah, so he was big, very 764 01:04:33.039 --> 01:04:36.000 influential, and I think that's really important. And of course we're in a 765 01:04:36.039 --> 01:04:40.800 period of time and that's what it was my last interview with Nick Pope where 766 01:04:41.639 --> 01:04:48.920 we have these congressional subcommittees talking to David Fraverer and other witnesses and people involved 767 01:04:49.760 --> 01:04:56.039 with the phenomena and you know, lue Elisondo, it's something we talked about 768 01:04:56.079 --> 01:04:59.840 recently, but he also wrote about this that he's like, I shouldn't be 769 01:04:59.880 --> 01:05:03.559 the shouldn't be the gospel. According to Lou I'm not a spokesperson. I 770 01:05:03.639 --> 01:05:08.920 ran the project. It wasn't my job to share information and it still isn't 771 01:05:09.400 --> 01:05:12.519 so. But what it is his job to do, and what they're trying 772 01:05:12.559 --> 01:05:16.719 to do is to get those people with the information to be forthcoming with information 773 01:05:16.960 --> 01:05:21.840 and to share information. And that means it's a lot of that aspect. 774 01:05:21.840 --> 01:05:27.559 There's a lot of behind the scenes work that we won't see, but we 775 01:05:27.679 --> 01:05:31.519 can get little hints at the fruits of those efforts, and we have. 776 01:05:32.280 --> 01:05:38.400 And that's what Nick Pope wrote this Guardian article about that we interviewed him about 777 01:05:38.519 --> 01:05:43.880 last which is that, you know, these subcommittees have been discussing and having 778 01:05:43.960 --> 01:05:48.159 briefings and talking to people and so things have been moving forward in that aspect. 779 01:05:48.199 --> 01:05:56.360 We don't know exactly what to the Stars or Alessander and specifically has done. 780 01:05:56.719 --> 01:06:00.679 He's alluded to a little bit, but they are, like he wrote 781 01:06:00.679 --> 01:06:03.760 in that article, you know, greasing the wheels to make all this happen 782 01:06:04.320 --> 01:06:12.239 and so it sounds like from what I understand from various interviews is that there 783 01:06:12.360 --> 01:06:17.480 was more pushback when he first left than there is now, and so things 784 01:06:17.760 --> 01:06:25.320 are moving in a very positive direction that way, which who knows. I 785 01:06:25.360 --> 01:06:30.320 mean that leads for an interesting possibility as far as the future goes, is 786 01:06:30.920 --> 01:06:41.079 you know, will we have then and opening of this topic. It's so 787 01:06:41.199 --> 01:06:49.960 much so that there is another public facing in investigative group that the government or 788 01:06:50.000 --> 01:06:56.079 the military sponsors or creates. And if that's so, you know, how 789 01:06:56.119 --> 01:07:00.440 will the public react to that? Certainly the conspiracy minded are not to believe 790 01:07:00.440 --> 01:07:03.639 anything they have to say. And honestly, we know in the past there's 791 01:07:03.679 --> 01:07:09.519 been so much spin or or just false information. Unfortunately, I hate to 792 01:07:09.559 --> 01:07:13.199 say that, but we just noticed if we've been you know, we've got 793 01:07:13.199 --> 01:07:16.000 that video out there. I've got a video about where I go over government 794 01:07:16.079 --> 01:07:19.679 secrecy and UFOs, and you know, we haven't been told the truth over 795 01:07:19.800 --> 01:07:24.199 the years, so how can we believe they'll tell us the truth in the 796 01:07:24.239 --> 01:07:28.840 future. And so it's going to be interesting to see what results of this. 797 01:07:29.079 --> 01:07:33.639 But kind of to your point that things seem to be unrolling in the 798 01:07:33.639 --> 01:07:39.880 Banana, you know, Peel keeps being pulled back. It seems as though 799 01:07:39.960 --> 01:07:47.519 something's going to happen, right right. I wonder how lou Alazuondo and others 800 01:07:47.760 --> 01:07:56.679 over to the Star's Academy really view the UFO community or if they just think 801 01:07:56.760 --> 01:08:00.960 they want to get this information to the public and you know a lot of 802 01:08:00.960 --> 01:08:04.440 the UFO community or you know, bashers or fringe or whatever. I wonder 803 01:08:04.440 --> 01:08:09.199 what they really think about that, if that ever comes up in an interview, 804 01:08:10.480 --> 01:08:21.560 Well, I'll tell you that I think that I don't want to put 805 01:08:21.680 --> 01:08:28.640 words in anyone's mouth, misrepresent what anybody has said, nor share things they 806 01:08:28.640 --> 01:08:34.279 don't really feel they want to be shared. However, I think what you're 807 01:08:34.359 --> 01:08:45.640 asking is an important question, and I think that there has been a larger 808 01:08:46.520 --> 01:08:57.079 negative pushback than was expected by all parties. And I think that that has, 809 01:08:58.520 --> 01:09:01.039 my guess would be and I think it really has at least a bit, 810 01:09:01.800 --> 01:09:06.000 you know, discertained some of them a bit. And I know that 811 01:09:06.239 --> 01:09:12.119 is I think it's a similar experience that Bigelow went through when he was, 812 01:09:12.640 --> 01:09:17.960 you know, doing more public facing work in this arena, and he shared 813 01:09:18.079 --> 01:09:26.720 his experience with George Knapp in interviews before on coast to coast, and that 814 01:09:26.760 --> 01:09:30.000 reminds me of a line of information I want to talk about here too. 815 01:09:32.720 --> 01:09:41.640 But you know, Bigelow has a lot of money. He wanted to really 816 01:09:41.760 --> 01:09:46.760 spend time and effort researching this field. He funded a lot of the top 817 01:09:46.840 --> 01:09:54.560 researchers in their work. And you would think that the community would be very 818 01:09:54.640 --> 01:10:00.399 positive about all of that. But that's unfortunately not what happened. All of 819 01:10:00.399 --> 01:10:05.439 these haters and and naysayers, and in fact, there's a huge amount of 820 01:10:05.680 --> 01:10:14.600 negativity. And although Bigelow had that experience, I don't know that. Uh. 821 01:10:15.319 --> 01:10:18.319 I don't think Lou Lou might not have even noticed that or been aware, 822 01:10:18.479 --> 01:10:24.039 But I don't know if he and I don't even know if Tom would 823 01:10:24.039 --> 01:10:28.840 have felt that they would have faced the same thing. But they certainly are 824 01:10:29.279 --> 01:10:32.640 and so I think that is disheartening for all of them a bit, but 825 01:10:32.720 --> 01:10:36.640 they can move past it because they've got a they're very passionate about their their 826 01:10:36.800 --> 01:10:43.600 end results. I don't think that, you know, along those lines, 827 01:10:43.640 --> 01:10:46.520 I don't think that we would in the community. You know, possibly, 828 01:10:48.279 --> 01:10:53.680 you know, George Knapp may know something before others, but for them, 829 01:10:54.039 --> 01:10:56.439 and he's a journalist, of course, but he does, you know, 830 01:10:56.720 --> 01:11:00.359 get involved in this topic. But I don't think as a whole we would 831 01:11:00.399 --> 01:11:05.399 be privy to any new information any more than anyone else. That's kind of 832 01:11:05.399 --> 01:11:11.439 where I'm going with this. Oh yeah, well, I well, although 833 01:11:12.239 --> 01:11:18.199 you know, some of us who have relationships are privy, are somewhat we 834 01:11:18.279 --> 01:11:24.359 do get to find out before everyone else. I mean, I got phone 835 01:11:24.359 --> 01:11:28.520 calls from you know, I got the call from DeLong before he announced to 836 01:11:28.640 --> 01:11:33.000 the stars in October, so I could be ready for it. Even now, 837 01:11:33.439 --> 01:11:40.319 I'm being given clues as to the future of what they're working on and 838 01:11:40.359 --> 01:11:44.720 maybe able to share with people, some of which I can share and some 839 01:11:44.800 --> 01:11:48.640 I can't, which is not uncommon. I mean often when we're when I'm 840 01:11:48.680 --> 01:11:55.319 invited as a journalist for the press too, especially something regarding entertainment, I'm 841 01:11:55.319 --> 01:11:58.520 told, you know, I'm given all the information, but told this is 842 01:11:58.520 --> 01:12:02.560 embargoed for a month or two or three or four. You know, you 843 01:12:02.560 --> 01:12:08.159 can release this on March twenty second. And I keep in close contacts so 844 01:12:08.199 --> 01:12:13.119 I know when the embargo is lifted so I can share the information. So 845 01:12:13.159 --> 01:12:18.159 it's a common practice, especially with the media. And so yeah, so 846 01:12:19.640 --> 01:12:25.279 in that aspect, at least those of us who are kind of UFO journalists 847 01:12:25.840 --> 01:12:29.720 are given some insight kind of like you know, Ryan Sprague, I know, 848 01:12:29.880 --> 01:12:34.479 and you and I have been given some Project blue Book you know, 849 01:12:34.680 --> 01:12:42.359 material before the rest of the public, so we can help get prepared to 850 01:12:42.479 --> 01:12:46.279 release it when it's releasable and get excited about it. So, for instance, 851 01:12:46.319 --> 01:12:48.760 you know you had all the episodes, you still have them. You've 852 01:12:48.760 --> 01:12:53.199 seen all the episodes of Project blue Book, even though they haven't all come 853 01:12:53.199 --> 01:12:57.920 out. We've only we're only maybe halfway in, but you don't reveal what's 854 01:12:57.960 --> 01:13:02.039 in the last three episodes until after they're out. So someone just has to 855 01:13:02.079 --> 01:13:06.960 make me an offer, that's all. But along those lines in the last 856 01:13:08.000 --> 01:13:12.680 minute or so that we have here is that what is really blows my mind 857 01:13:12.920 --> 01:13:17.800 is in my last story about Project blue Book, my review of the third 858 01:13:17.840 --> 01:13:26.640 episode I reference because in that episode, you know, a car was stopped 859 01:13:27.159 --> 01:13:31.680 and there was an electro Really kind of these shocks, like electrical shocks and 860 01:13:31.720 --> 01:13:39.199 the shocks I haven't heard of, but electrical malfunctions are issues with vehicles and 861 01:13:39.359 --> 01:13:44.359 stopping during UFO sidings have happened. Oh a lot. One of these cases. 862 01:13:44.399 --> 01:13:48.600 That's a really good case. Happened just a few years ago and two 863 01:13:48.640 --> 01:13:53.399 thousand and nine, I believe it was, and it was a Star Team 864 01:13:53.560 --> 01:13:59.359 project. The Star Team is the product is the group that was funded and 865 01:13:59.399 --> 01:14:03.079 working with Bigelow. And so this is a group that people said, oh, 866 01:14:03.119 --> 01:14:06.000 it was all secret and they were hiding stuff from the public. No, 867 01:14:06.359 --> 01:14:10.760 not at all. In fact, I wrote about all of those great 868 01:14:10.800 --> 01:14:15.560 cases that Bigelow funded and they were able to research. It's totally public. 869 01:14:15.960 --> 01:14:21.119 There was no hiding of anything. And it's just a great case where this 870 01:14:21.159 --> 01:14:26.760 person saw this cigar shaped craft with lights on it. It was above his 871 01:14:26.880 --> 01:14:30.600 car, his car stopped. When the Star Team guys got there, were 872 01:14:30.640 --> 01:14:35.600 able to fly out there with great equipment thanks to Bigelow, they were able 873 01:14:35.640 --> 01:14:42.680 to find out that the car had a very strong, strange electromagnetic field to 874 01:14:42.760 --> 01:14:46.359 it. So it's a really great case. And it was just funny reading 875 01:14:46.399 --> 01:14:51.520 that story again and sharing it with everybody, because I haven't looked at that 876 01:14:51.720 --> 01:14:58.399 story since this New York Times article came out. And the funny thing is 877 01:14:58.399 --> 01:15:01.399 is I didn't know that at that back then, that that funding Bigelow is 878 01:15:01.439 --> 01:15:06.840 spending on that project was coming from the Department of Defense. So that is 879 01:15:06.920 --> 01:15:11.960 amazing, really crazy. Huh yeah, well, I know we're out of 880 01:15:11.960 --> 01:15:15.520 time, but I just wanted to just throw this out that there was someone 881 01:15:15.560 --> 01:15:19.279 in Russia that had a very very similar experience. Cigar shaped UFO made all 882 01:15:19.319 --> 01:15:25.720 the car cars stall a mountain pass. It's really a great uh talk directly 883 01:15:25.760 --> 01:15:30.199 to the person that is a very similar situation. Mm hm wow, yeah, 884 01:15:30.319 --> 01:15:35.039 it happens. Weird stuff man. Right, all right, Well that's 885 01:15:35.119 --> 01:15:40.439 it for the show. So thank you so much Martin for joining us and 886 01:15:40.680 --> 01:15:43.159 uh, you know, spending the time to talk about some of the news 887 01:15:43.199 --> 01:15:45.880 out there. Got some great shows coming up. Of course, you can 888 01:15:45.960 --> 01:15:54.960 check out Martin on podcast, UFO dot com. Thank you, dot com 889 01:15:55.039 --> 01:15:58.560 dot com, thank you, we just dot com both, thank you, 890 01:15:58.960 --> 01:16:03.000 thank you, Alah mind pleasure, thank you. So just a couple of 891 01:16:03.039 --> 01:16:09.319 things that I want to remind people, Please do go to the Alejandro Advantage 892 01:16:09.439 --> 01:16:12.399 or if you're on my social media, just check that out and go check 893 01:16:12.399 --> 01:16:17.840 out some of my live shows from Thursday evening. Martin's there often, Chase 894 01:16:17.920 --> 01:16:23.680 Kletsky was there this last time actually, uh and some other people. So 895 01:16:23.840 --> 01:16:25.920 yeah, so they are a lot of fun, and I go over a 896 01:16:25.960 --> 01:16:29.479 lot of news and then give you some insight and background and then go into 897 01:16:29.479 --> 01:16:32.560 some of these other stories like I was talking about earlier and hopefully you've seen 898 01:16:32.640 --> 01:16:36.199 on Also, you can find these on my social media. You can also 899 01:16:36.239 --> 01:16:41.359 find these on my blog, my new blog, Alejandro t rojast dot com. 900 01:16:41.640 --> 01:16:44.479 You can't find all of these things now, but I'll be posting them 901 01:16:44.720 --> 01:16:47.359 up real soon. But I'm going to keep that updated for everyone. But 902 01:16:47.439 --> 01:16:50.039 you know what I put there, and you should check this out too, 903 01:16:50.039 --> 01:16:55.800 Martin, it's kind of fun. At Alejandro t RoHS dot com. I 904 01:16:55.880 --> 01:16:59.960 made a list of a lot of the media things I've been involved with, 905 01:17:00.560 --> 01:17:03.239 and it's a really long list. I was surprised, but you can find 906 01:17:03.239 --> 01:17:09.239 links to lots of the videos, interviews I've done for news. You can 907 01:17:09.279 --> 01:17:15.239 see a link to my taking the Kardashians to Area fifty one, stuff like 908 01:17:15.279 --> 01:17:19.159 that, and tons and tons and tons of mainstream articles where they've mentioned my 909 01:17:19.239 --> 01:17:24.159 work or interviewed me. So a lot of fun. I was kind of 910 01:17:24.159 --> 01:17:27.439 proud putting that list together, but I'll be putting a lot of stuff there 911 01:17:27.479 --> 01:17:30.279 so you can see it as well as my social media, So if you 912 01:17:30.279 --> 01:17:33.119 want to watch those videos, please do, and then take out my dene 913 01:17:33.119 --> 01:17:38.560 of geek articles because I do give a lot of background into those blue Book 914 01:17:39.720 --> 01:17:45.800 cases. And then for instance, when there are phenomena that happened in the 915 01:17:45.840 --> 01:17:49.079 television show that weren't about the case they were covering, but did happen in 916 01:17:49.159 --> 01:17:55.079 other high profile cases, then I review those other high profile cases with links 917 01:17:55.119 --> 01:18:00.119 as well. And I also include links back to the original Bluebook files on 918 01:18:00.359 --> 01:18:04.920 all of these cases as well, so you can go actually see the Project 919 01:18:04.960 --> 01:18:10.520 blue Book files. And I don't see any other reviewers or writing writers who 920 01:18:10.520 --> 01:18:14.920 are writing about Project blue Book linking to the blue Book files for some reason. 921 01:18:15.079 --> 01:18:16.800 So if you want to go see those and find out how you can 922 01:18:16.840 --> 01:18:21.600 read all the blue Book files, go check out those articles. But I 923 01:18:21.640 --> 01:18:29.319 also don't forget International UFO Congress. We've got more information for us coming about 924 01:18:29.359 --> 01:18:31.479 speakers and tickets in the next month or so. But we've got lots of 925 01:18:31.520 --> 01:18:34.880 cool products that you can see at the store, so check out the store 926 01:18:35.479 --> 01:18:42.119 and then and we've got free videos up. So speaking of some of the 927 01:18:42.159 --> 01:18:45.199 new stuff coming out, you know, we've got a debate with Stanton Friedman 928 01:18:45.319 --> 01:18:50.159 and Jeremy Corbel, and I did want to mention I saw Nick Pope at 929 01:18:50.520 --> 01:18:56.520 the Snowfest Alien Snowfests in Big Bear, California. Karen just decided in the 930 01:18:56.600 --> 01:19:00.159 last minute, hey, let's go out there and see if they'll get his 931 01:19:00.279 --> 01:19:02.000 table. So we did and we sold some stuff and hung out with some 932 01:19:02.039 --> 01:19:04.840 of our friends. So it was a lot of fun, got to talk 933 01:19:04.880 --> 01:19:09.359 to people. But Stanton was there, so really, yeah, it was 934 01:19:09.399 --> 01:19:12.720 great to see him, and we did get because I keep making sure that 935 01:19:12.760 --> 01:19:16.640 he's going to do it. We didcate a confirmation he will be speaking at 936 01:19:16.680 --> 01:19:21.319 the UFO Congress, his last presentation at the UFO Congress, so we'll be 937 01:19:21.359 --> 01:19:28.520 doing something special with that and him at the UFO Congress because he's, of 938 01:19:28.560 --> 01:19:31.600 course such an important, great guy. And I know Jeremy felt he won 939 01:19:31.640 --> 01:19:36.000 that debate with Stanton over Bob Blazaar, but I don't think everybody feels that 940 01:19:36.039 --> 01:19:41.880 way, especially if you look in the comments, and I didn't feel it 941 01:19:41.920 --> 01:19:45.840 was really one sided at all. So that was a lot of fun. 942 01:19:45.840 --> 01:19:49.199 But you can see that on the UFO Congress YouTube page. You can watch 943 01:19:49.239 --> 01:19:53.520 that video. Yeah, I'm interested to see that. Oh you haven't seen 944 01:19:53.520 --> 01:19:56.119 that yet? No, no, oh, yeah, you have to go 945 01:19:56.199 --> 01:20:00.479 check that out. So yep, just the UFO Congress YouTube pa where we 946 01:20:00.520 --> 01:20:03.000 also have a lot of other great lectures up there for free. We have 947 01:20:03.079 --> 01:20:06.159 our UFO Jeopardies that were a lot of fun where we had kind of a 948 01:20:06.199 --> 01:20:11.600 game show with UFO researchers. And I've got to talk up there from Lee 949 01:20:11.640 --> 01:20:15.640 Spiegel, which is really good because Lee's awesome, of course, and so 950 01:20:15.720 --> 01:20:19.960 check that out. Otherwise, I want to thank Micah Hanks for the opening 951 01:20:20.000 --> 01:20:24.520 and closed music. People are always asking about it because it's so cool. 952 01:20:25.079 --> 01:20:29.319 Just or not Mikah Hanks, it's his brother, Caleb Hanks. Caleb Hanks 953 01:20:29.720 --> 01:20:32.640 for the opening and closed music. In fact, go look for Caleb Hanks 954 01:20:32.720 --> 01:20:36.560 on Patreon if you want to get more of that music. He shares it 955 01:20:36.600 --> 01:20:41.920 all for free and he's creating new music that's super cool all the time. 956 01:20:42.079 --> 01:20:46.640 I love it. Thanks to Systematics for the bumper music. And here's the 957 01:20:46.760 --> 01:20:49.439 end part where we say thank you to the people. Martin, just so 958 01:20:49.479 --> 01:20:55.600 you're ready, yes, and thank you all the listeners for being here. 959 01:20:55.960 --> 01:21:01.520 Thank you so much for coming and patronizing the show until next time, Audios 960 01:21:01.680 --> 01:21:53.079 smooth shot Jos