1 00:00:27,839 --> 00:00:32,439 Hello, I'm Martin Willis, your host and welcome to the show podcast UFO 2 00:00:33,359 --> 00:00:38,280 and weekly show. I have a lot of great fans from over the years 3 00:00:38,719 --> 00:00:42,520 and I want to thank you all for watching the show, and I want 4 00:00:42,560 --> 00:00:46,399 to thank the people that support the show, and whether you're supporting me or 5 00:00:46,439 --> 00:00:51,200 not, I do thank you. And our blog this week is there is 6 00:00:51,240 --> 00:00:55,840 no blog. Charles is in a play opening this week, so he wasn't 7 00:00:55,880 --> 00:00:59,560 able to put out a blog, so there's still plenty to read over a 8 00:00:59,600 --> 00:01:04,439 podcastufo dot com where we have new blogs generally every single week and they turn 9 00:01:04,519 --> 00:01:11,280 into an audio blog and audio podcast that comes out roughly once a week or 10 00:01:11,319 --> 00:01:18,480 so. We'll get those out and Crossfire this week UAP Crossfire has been canceled 11 00:01:18,480 --> 00:01:23,239 this I've been moving from one place to another and there's a lot going on 12 00:01:23,400 --> 00:01:26,519 with everyone, so we can't run the show this week, but we'll be 13 00:01:26,640 --> 00:01:32,799 back next week and soon we will have I believe, hopefully Danny Sheanon with 14 00:01:34,359 --> 00:01:41,840 also with Kevin Wright on the avisci Adits can't remember the name of his group, 15 00:01:42,959 --> 00:01:49,519 but it's UAP Transparency. It's basically the subtitle of it. They'll both 16 00:01:49,599 --> 00:01:53,680 be on Crossfire coming up soon, So keep in mind that's every Thursday night 17 00:01:53,719 --> 00:01:57,319 generally speaking, except for this week. So our guest tonight Jim Low. 18 00:01:57,519 --> 00:02:02,439 He has done a lot of research into what it would be like to have 19 00:02:02,480 --> 00:02:08,080 a UFO briefing book, a guide for congress or someone if they were looking 20 00:02:08,199 --> 00:02:13,439 into this topic in a serious way. And he has some UFO encounters when 21 00:02:13,479 --> 00:02:16,680 he was young, and I'm going to bring him in now, and welcome 22 00:02:16,719 --> 00:02:22,120 to the show, Jim. I thank you very much, Martin. And 23 00:02:22,199 --> 00:02:27,560 as the watcher of YouTube can see, you're in sunny weather out in California, 24 00:02:28,759 --> 00:02:31,960 which is a nice area to be not always. You didn't get caught 25 00:02:32,039 --> 00:02:35,719 up in the floods you were saying, that's great. No, no, 26 00:02:35,919 --> 00:02:40,000 I was. I'm in an area in the mountains that normally gets the flooding 27 00:02:40,039 --> 00:02:44,800 bit the coast got it this time. Ah, all right, that's good. 28 00:02:45,319 --> 00:02:50,800 So so thank you for you actually reached out to me you had written 29 00:02:50,800 --> 00:02:54,879 this book. I think it's an interesting book. And what I guess I 30 00:02:54,960 --> 00:03:00,120 want to ask you what inspired you to write this? In the beginning, 31 00:03:01,919 --> 00:03:08,680 well, I'm a retired attorney and for twenty five years I was going to 32 00:03:08,879 --> 00:03:15,400 retire and write an election law book. And then on my sixty fifth birthday 33 00:03:16,680 --> 00:03:24,479 December seventeenth, two thousand and seven. December sixteen, twenty seventeen, the 34 00:03:24,919 --> 00:03:30,159 Politico and New York Times came out with the three videos. Wow that was 35 00:03:30,400 --> 00:03:36,280 your birthday. Yeah, sixty fifth birthday. Now I'll always remember your birthday 36 00:03:36,280 --> 00:03:45,199 because I remember that date, me and Beethoven. But it made me think 37 00:03:45,240 --> 00:03:53,000 about what I was doing. Having practice government law for close to forty years, 38 00:03:53,159 --> 00:04:00,240 I kept my experiences pretty much to myself because representing politicians, it's not 39 00:04:00,319 --> 00:04:06,199 the best thing to do to talk about UFO encounters. It could be used 40 00:04:06,199 --> 00:04:14,280 against you in the courtroom. So having practiced election law and represented local and 41 00:04:14,639 --> 00:04:19,839 regional governments, I'd always leaned that way. But my interest has always been 42 00:04:19,959 --> 00:04:27,240 something I've been kept to myself. And then when that came out, I 43 00:04:27,920 --> 00:04:34,360 saw that as a trigger, which it certainly did trigger things into, you 44 00:04:34,399 --> 00:04:42,240 know, the possibility disclosure, and having worked with hundreds of elected officials over 45 00:04:42,279 --> 00:04:48,600 the years, I know what they go through and what they perceive of the 46 00:04:48,639 --> 00:04:58,240 world around them, and jumping off into a issue like UFOs. It happened 47 00:04:58,279 --> 00:05:02,000 to Dennis Cascinage, you know, back in I think nineteen ninety two, 48 00:05:02,600 --> 00:05:09,920 and it killed his political career, yes, And so I saw this as 49 00:05:09,959 --> 00:05:17,040 a way to sort of educate elected officials primarily, And so I wrote the 50 00:05:17,120 --> 00:05:25,000 UFO Briefing Book, A Congressional Guide to the UAP Phenomena, back in twenty 51 00:05:25,120 --> 00:05:35,240 twenty one six months. I usually got it published four months before the OH 52 00:05:35,319 --> 00:05:43,399 the Director of National Intelligence issued their first preliminary assessment. And what I wanted 53 00:05:43,399 --> 00:05:48,480 to do is predict what they were going to say and then explain to members 54 00:05:48,519 --> 00:05:57,199 of Congress what would happen if they followed certain rules or procedures that would help 55 00:05:57,240 --> 00:06:03,360 them sort of peel back the onions. And so I was writing one book 56 00:06:04,680 --> 00:06:10,199 on UFOs at the time, and I dropped it and picked up this book 57 00:06:10,240 --> 00:06:15,040 and wrote it in six months and put it out. Most of the copies 58 00:06:15,160 --> 00:06:20,560 that I didn't I didn't market it. I went on two podcasts and figure, 59 00:06:20,639 --> 00:06:26,879 this is a waste of time. And because at the time it wasn't 60 00:06:27,319 --> 00:06:30,399 it wasn't as big an issue. You know, the UFO community as well, 61 00:06:30,480 --> 00:06:36,279 where was going on, but the general public didn't. And so what 62 00:06:36,399 --> 00:06:42,759 I did was I put something together that would be more aimed at elected officials 63 00:06:42,879 --> 00:06:47,480 and what they can do within their role. And I distributed over two hundred 64 00:06:47,480 --> 00:06:54,480 copies to members of the National security committees in Congress, and from the feedback 65 00:06:54,519 --> 00:07:01,600 I've gotten, it was well received, and Harry Reid sent me a personal 66 00:07:01,639 --> 00:07:05,959 note he was retired at the time, saying that it was done well and 67 00:07:06,040 --> 00:07:13,879 that he was happy for my interest in this vital subject. And so while 68 00:07:13,920 --> 00:07:15,759 I was writing, I was sending them the books, I wasn't getting a 69 00:07:15,879 --> 00:07:20,079 response. And I don't live in Washington or play the you know, play 70 00:07:20,120 --> 00:07:28,000 along Washington, you know, the typical You've had people on the deal in 71 00:07:28,199 --> 00:07:32,759 Washington. But I was looking at it as an outsider from the political perspective, 72 00:07:33,199 --> 00:07:41,519 how they would go about this, And so I predicted that the intelligence 73 00:07:41,519 --> 00:07:46,160 and the military would slow walk anything. They would be like pulling teeth, 74 00:07:46,399 --> 00:07:57,439 and that they'd have to boost the protections for whistleblowers, put together doc or 75 00:07:57,800 --> 00:08:07,639 legislation to allow the release of NBA's non disclosure agreements. I have a friend, 76 00:08:07,720 --> 00:08:15,600 Robert Salas, Robert Salas, who was forced to sign one of those 77 00:08:15,639 --> 00:08:20,439 agreements and never seen a copy of it, and so you know it. 78 00:08:20,399 --> 00:08:26,079 So I started down that road and made some recommendations, and so far most 79 00:08:26,120 --> 00:08:31,000 of the recommendations I've put together have been put into law. Now whether that's 80 00:08:31,080 --> 00:08:35,080 coincidence or not, I don't know, but I know I was along that 81 00:08:35,120 --> 00:08:39,039 path. So I have a new book out now, Threat to the Body 82 00:08:39,120 --> 00:08:48,559 Politic From Food Fighters to UAP, and that's also available at bookstores in Amazon. 83 00:08:50,399 --> 00:08:52,960 And in that book, I try to go back to the beginnings of 84 00:08:54,000 --> 00:08:58,320 what the the not the not the UFO policy is, whether they're real or 85 00:08:58,360 --> 00:09:03,279 not because of people have done that, and I went back and looked at 86 00:09:03,720 --> 00:09:11,679 how the process began that led to the stigma that we all feel about the 87 00:09:11,720 --> 00:09:20,879 subject, and centered on the Robertson panel in nineteen fifty three. And there's 88 00:09:20,919 --> 00:09:26,600 been a lot written on the Robertson panel, but mostly saying that they got 89 00:09:26,679 --> 00:09:31,039 the UFO issue wrong. And I ignored that part of it pretty much and 90 00:09:31,159 --> 00:09:37,399 looked at what they did that sort of start the debunking process. And so 91 00:09:39,120 --> 00:09:46,480 I traced through declassified records and stories mostly from government officials, either state, 92 00:09:46,600 --> 00:09:56,840 local, or federal, how they were cast and treated very unfairly. Now, 93 00:09:56,879 --> 00:10:01,639 your typical person who saw UFO back then, it was usually just lights 94 00:10:01,639 --> 00:10:07,440 in the sky. But when you had someone like Rex Heflin in nineteen sixty 95 00:10:07,519 --> 00:10:15,679 five, who saw a structured craft very close took three polaroids at a time 96 00:10:15,759 --> 00:10:22,919 when trying to fake a polaroid was near impossible for a traffic engineer. Un 97 00:10:22,000 --> 00:10:28,919 let's let alone someone in Hollywood that in the way he was approached, the 98 00:10:28,960 --> 00:10:35,440 way they stole his photographs. I found a pattern of these kinds of things 99 00:10:35,840 --> 00:10:43,759 in the records. Many of the records were like I found civil rights violations 100 00:10:43,840 --> 00:10:48,799 in the FBI records committed by the Air Force, but the FBI didn't have 101 00:10:48,879 --> 00:10:54,240 records about their violations. Those I found in CIA records, And so a 102 00:10:54,279 --> 00:11:00,320 lot of cross checking of records, I was able to come up with a 103 00:11:00,600 --> 00:11:05,960 series of they couldn't be coincidences. There were just so many times where they 104 00:11:07,159 --> 00:11:11,840 people would approach the government say I've got the there's the famous picture. I've 105 00:11:11,879 --> 00:11:16,720 been on that street looking in that direction. There's a big shopping mall there 106 00:11:16,759 --> 00:11:22,960 now, but I don't tell. Yeah, it's like everything else in California, 107 00:11:22,000 --> 00:11:26,200 it's a mall. Yeah, this is the one right outside of his 108 00:11:26,240 --> 00:11:31,279 pickup truck window. Yeah. First first polaroid. I believe the last one, 109 00:11:31,360 --> 00:11:33,840 I don't the last one, I don't see it. It shows like 110 00:11:33,879 --> 00:11:37,320 a streak of smoke if I remember, right, Yep, a smoke ring 111 00:11:37,399 --> 00:11:41,399 that he never showed around. Yeah, yeah, he had a smoke ring 112 00:11:41,480 --> 00:11:46,240 and his co workers laughed at it, so he never showed it around. 113 00:11:46,360 --> 00:11:54,399 So when the quote unquote nor read officers show up and he gave his photographs 114 00:11:54,440 --> 00:11:58,799 to them, they disappeared for twenty two years, and they returned him to 115 00:11:58,879 --> 00:12:05,919 it when he was dying of cancer in retirement. And so someone had to 116 00:12:05,960 --> 00:12:11,320 hold on to those photographs for twenty two years, twenty seven years almost actually. 117 00:12:13,720 --> 00:12:18,840 And so I found a pattern of these kinds of things where your typical 118 00:12:18,919 --> 00:12:24,039 person was who took a picture of a UFO. They showed a structured craft, 119 00:12:24,120 --> 00:12:28,159 not lights in the sky. But you know, the type of pictures 120 00:12:28,200 --> 00:12:33,240 that would not be considered swamp gas, you know there, there wouldn't be 121 00:12:33,240 --> 00:12:37,919 an explanation for that. They would take these pictures, and most of them 122 00:12:39,519 --> 00:12:43,080 they had no interest in the UFO subject before they took the pictures. Each 123 00:12:43,159 --> 00:12:48,279 one of them approached the government to say, I've got these, do you 124 00:12:48,320 --> 00:12:52,960 want them? And I want them back? And they take them and steal 125 00:12:52,000 --> 00:12:58,000 them, never give them back. And Rex Heffeln's case, they claimed he 126 00:12:58,240 --> 00:13:03,320 was a hoaxer. How many hoaxers turned over their originals to the government. 127 00:13:03,919 --> 00:13:07,200 Yeah, that's right. This is the smoke, that's the smoke ring. 128 00:13:07,759 --> 00:13:13,679 So uh yes, and they're in this there for years, they were in 129 00:13:13,720 --> 00:13:18,799 the safe. I'm trying to remembers of female ufologists, really well known in 130 00:13:18,840 --> 00:13:22,159 California. I can't remember her name. I spoke with her daughter. Her 131 00:13:22,240 --> 00:13:26,120 daughter was on my show. Anyway, they were in They're in their safe. 132 00:13:26,639 --> 00:13:28,799 They're in the safe in their house. Really okay those images, yes, 133 00:13:30,399 --> 00:13:33,919 yeah, yeah, I'm drying a blanket in her name too. But 134 00:13:33,759 --> 00:13:37,279 yeah, she's really well known. She passed away I think maybe five or 135 00:13:37,320 --> 00:13:43,720 six years ago. Very well known. She wrote the book Firestorm about all 136 00:13:43,759 --> 00:13:46,639 right, I'm going to look her up just because I want to pay good 137 00:13:46,679 --> 00:13:54,519 tribute to her. But anyway, Uh so, let's talk about you. 138 00:13:54,519 --> 00:14:05,000 You had you had some sightings yourself, right, Oh yes, I'm what 139 00:14:05,399 --> 00:14:13,279 is generically called an experiencer, and so I've had experiences pretty much my whole 140 00:14:13,320 --> 00:14:18,960 life. And first one I remember, I was five and a half years 141 00:14:18,039 --> 00:14:24,200 old. It was the weekend before kindergarten started, and I was out in 142 00:14:24,200 --> 00:14:31,559 the country with my dad and my aunt and uncle and their family camping, 143 00:14:31,679 --> 00:14:39,240 and I was I was five and a half and the next youngest person was 144 00:14:39,279 --> 00:14:43,840 about thirteen, so there was a big gap between everyone, and I was 145 00:14:45,000 --> 00:14:50,039 very hyperactive, and so they told me, you know, why don't you 146 00:14:50,080 --> 00:14:52,639 just look up at the sky and look for Sputnik, you know, to 147 00:14:52,720 --> 00:14:58,080 keep me busy. And while they were sitting another campfire, drinking and telling 148 00:14:58,159 --> 00:15:07,159 stories or and I looked off to a cow pasture that was about five hundred 149 00:15:07,159 --> 00:15:11,720 to one thousand feet away from us, and I saw this object that was 150 00:15:11,840 --> 00:15:16,279 probably the size of a full moon, and it was dripping metal off of 151 00:15:16,320 --> 00:15:20,480 it. It looked like it was and it was shooting off sparks. In 152 00:15:20,559 --> 00:15:28,320 fact, I talked to Colonel Halt about it because it looked remarkably like the 153 00:15:28,320 --> 00:15:31,240 one at Rambush and Forest right. He said, it looked like an eyeball, 154 00:15:31,279 --> 00:15:37,639 and it was dripping magna magna exactly. And this was late summer and 155 00:15:37,759 --> 00:15:43,440 the cow pasture was dry, and so whatever it was, it didn't, 156 00:15:43,600 --> 00:15:50,279 you know, it didn't catch fire. So I remember looking at it and 157 00:15:50,279 --> 00:15:56,240 then looking back at my family, and they were all just staring with their 158 00:15:56,279 --> 00:16:00,759 mouths open, dumbfounded. Later on, I sort of compared it to a 159 00:16:00,840 --> 00:16:07,600 deep Stephen Spielberg movie where they always had normal people just looking perplexed, and 160 00:16:07,639 --> 00:16:12,399 it reminded me of a few scenes and close encounters. But I'm looking at 161 00:16:12,399 --> 00:16:18,679 them, and that's the last thing I remember. And I remember waking up 162 00:16:18,720 --> 00:16:26,200 the next morning and there and coming out outside from the cabin, the rough 163 00:16:26,240 --> 00:16:30,679 cabin were the family was working on, and uh, everyone's sitting here on 164 00:16:30,759 --> 00:16:37,679 the campfire, having breakfast, drinking coffee and talking about the comet they saw. 165 00:16:38,399 --> 00:16:41,720 So, being a five and a half year old, I thought commas 166 00:16:41,840 --> 00:16:47,679 just flew over cow pastures and you know, and uh, so you know, 167 00:16:48,360 --> 00:16:52,720 I go, wow, and now I've seen a comet. So the 168 00:16:52,759 --> 00:16:56,720 next morning is Monday, and I'm going off to kindergarten. I think that's 169 00:16:56,759 --> 00:17:00,320 one of the reasons I remember this so well, because it was at that 170 00:17:00,440 --> 00:17:04,240 time in my life. Whenever you know, you started, you remember, 171 00:17:04,680 --> 00:17:10,440 you know, long long bits of time. And I asked my dad what 172 00:17:10,519 --> 00:17:14,799 he thought when that neat seeing the comet, and my dad said, I 173 00:17:14,799 --> 00:17:18,480 don't know what you're talking about. And so I just sort of dropped it 174 00:17:19,039 --> 00:17:25,640 went off to kindergarten, and so later on, you know, I'm I'm 175 00:17:25,759 --> 00:17:29,799 in high school and then going into college, and I still have this impression 176 00:17:29,880 --> 00:17:33,279 that comments are really big things that you know, stop and everything else. 177 00:17:33,880 --> 00:17:38,160 And I knew from science books that that didn't make sense. And then I 178 00:17:38,240 --> 00:17:44,000 actually saw my first comment when I was, you know, in my teens 179 00:17:44,079 --> 00:17:48,160 or early twenties, and I remember how disappointed I was. I go, 180 00:17:48,279 --> 00:17:52,000 that's not big. That didn't have metal dripping off of it. And it's 181 00:17:52,039 --> 00:17:57,960 funny how I kept that that not only that memory, but that understanding despite 182 00:17:59,000 --> 00:18:03,240 the fact what I learned in science. Well, before you move on to 183 00:18:03,279 --> 00:18:08,079 anything else, I'd like to tell you about an encounter that was told to 184 00:18:08,119 --> 00:18:12,319 me by someone not really into the UFO world or whatever. It's just someone 185 00:18:12,359 --> 00:18:18,759 I know in the outside world. She's actually an author of like antique books 186 00:18:18,759 --> 00:18:23,119 and things like that. And she was a girl scout and they were on 187 00:18:23,720 --> 00:18:29,440 an island on a lake and they were camping out. They had the campfire 188 00:18:29,480 --> 00:18:33,319 going, and they saw this thing come over them. She said, it 189 00:18:33,400 --> 00:18:34,920 kind of looked like the size of the moon type of thing, and it 190 00:18:34,960 --> 00:18:38,559 came over them and then it appeared to be right over them, and she 191 00:18:38,680 --> 00:18:42,720 said. The next thing she remembers she woke up in the morning in her 192 00:18:42,880 --> 00:18:49,079 tent and was asking, you know, like the the different people, hey, 193 00:18:49,400 --> 00:18:53,079 what about what we saw last night? And they said they didn't remember 194 00:18:53,200 --> 00:18:57,240 or they didn't know anything. And then to the leader, the girl Scout 195 00:18:57,319 --> 00:19:02,759 leader said, don't you even think about talking about it. That's what she 196 00:19:02,799 --> 00:19:06,799 said to her. So that was her impression. I mean, there is 197 00:19:06,839 --> 00:19:08,599 some similarities here. That's why I thought i'd bring it up. That was 198 00:19:08,839 --> 00:19:17,279 no, it's good exactly. You know. About twelve twenty twelve, twenty 199 00:19:17,400 --> 00:19:22,359 thirteen, I decided I was just gonna sort of open up my mind and 200 00:19:22,119 --> 00:19:26,640 talk to people about this, and so I started going to conferences and what 201 00:19:26,720 --> 00:19:33,079 I found is listening to speakers was nice, but talking to other experiences. 202 00:19:33,240 --> 00:19:40,079 Were there ones that have had these experiences? I joined IVONN. Smith's Oh 203 00:19:40,160 --> 00:19:48,119 Yeah SERO group, the Close Encounters Resource Organization, and I've learned more from 204 00:19:48,279 --> 00:19:52,799 other experiencers than I've learned from all the books and all the podcasts. No 205 00:19:52,960 --> 00:19:57,000 fans, but in fact, probably a lot of your listeners fit in the 206 00:19:57,039 --> 00:20:06,400 same category as me. You know and and you learned so much and you 207 00:20:06,519 --> 00:20:12,680 stop being surprised about similarities like that, right, Yeah, Yeah, I 208 00:20:14,000 --> 00:20:18,279 do think it's funny. Up. You hear a lot of people say either 209 00:20:18,319 --> 00:20:23,480 they don't talk about it the next day or people don't remember, which is 210 00:20:23,599 --> 00:20:27,079 really you know, I mean, it's such a dramatic, you know, 211 00:20:27,279 --> 00:20:33,519 situation. You know. I recently listened to the Aligash, Yeah, the 212 00:20:33,559 --> 00:20:41,559 Alagash incident. The two it was Jim Wiener and Charlie Foltz that we're talking 213 00:20:41,559 --> 00:20:44,119 about it, and I got to meet them at that conference they're at. 214 00:20:44,119 --> 00:20:48,400 But I was listening to it again and it's basically the same thing. You 215 00:20:48,440 --> 00:20:52,000 know, it happened to them and they just like move on, and boy, 216 00:20:52,039 --> 00:20:55,720 that's strange. The fire had burned down and if anyone wants to check 217 00:20:55,759 --> 00:21:00,200 out that case, it's a fascinating case. And Eyes on Cinema on YouTube 218 00:21:00,279 --> 00:21:04,279 has posted the conference that I was at where they spoke. It's very interesting. 219 00:21:06,519 --> 00:21:11,279 Their whole life all for them. Their lives changed and they never really 220 00:21:11,440 --> 00:21:15,319 realized they were abducted until you know, ten years after, but their whole 221 00:21:15,319 --> 00:21:18,920 life's changed, and their artwork. They were all artists or artwork all changed 222 00:21:19,000 --> 00:21:26,200 dramatically and since that encounter, which is another fascinating thing when people's lives change. 223 00:21:29,200 --> 00:21:34,160 Yvonne Smith has written a book called Coronado, Oh Got a Joint Abduction? 224 00:21:34,720 --> 00:21:42,160 And the day after they all the group left the conference and drove back 225 00:21:42,160 --> 00:21:48,680 to Los Angeles and different cars. They were meeting at a restaurant up the 226 00:21:48,720 --> 00:21:56,559 coast towards LA and they were most mostly irritated with each other and didn't want 227 00:21:56,599 --> 00:21:59,000 to talk about it, and a lot of them never talked to each other 228 00:21:59,079 --> 00:22:03,400 again they were before, and so something drove them apart. How about that? 229 00:22:03,920 --> 00:22:07,799 Yeah, I remember her talking about that. I had her on the 230 00:22:07,799 --> 00:22:12,039 show years ago when I think actually before she wrote the book, or maybe 231 00:22:12,079 --> 00:22:17,079 about that same time. But I know the hotel. I used to go 232 00:22:17,119 --> 00:22:21,720 there when I lived in the in San Diego area years ago. Beautiful, 233 00:22:21,839 --> 00:22:26,079 beautiful place. That was a strange encounter. That's another one to look up. 234 00:22:26,680 --> 00:22:32,160 This is a question we have doctor Richards in about every show. Thank 235 00:22:32,200 --> 00:22:36,039 you for the questions. Do you have any theories about what the visitors are 236 00:22:36,119 --> 00:22:42,640 up to? I think my thinking is they're not here to take us over, 237 00:22:44,759 --> 00:22:52,559 because let's assume I don't believe this is the case. But let's assume 238 00:22:52,599 --> 00:22:57,039 they got here in World War Two the food fighters started showing out. You 239 00:22:57,079 --> 00:23:03,319 know, if you're gonna somebody, you don't wait eighty years. Still, 240 00:23:03,359 --> 00:23:08,279 they get better able to defend themselves, and so I don't think they're out 241 00:23:08,319 --> 00:23:14,480 to overtly do that. But I think it's a mixed bag, my guest, 242 00:23:14,640 --> 00:23:22,440 is a mixed bag of different entities from different locations, perhaps not all 243 00:23:22,480 --> 00:23:29,440 from this dimension. And I think that some of them mean well and others 244 00:23:29,559 --> 00:23:34,160 are probably just uh. In my book, Threat to the Body Politic, 245 00:23:34,240 --> 00:23:41,720 in the last chapter, I talk about there are probably four different excuse me, 246 00:23:42,599 --> 00:23:48,079 there are probably four different categories. There's a because I'm right that book 247 00:23:48,160 --> 00:23:53,480 I wrote to inform Congress, and they don't have the knowledge of your listener 248 00:23:53,559 --> 00:23:59,000 base. You know, they're learning this from scratch, right, And so 249 00:23:59,119 --> 00:24:03,599 the first possible is hostility, and I don't for the reason I said, 250 00:24:03,799 --> 00:24:10,440 I don't think they're hostile in that regard. The next is transactional, that 251 00:24:10,519 --> 00:24:18,720 they're here for resources, just like you know Chevron goes to Nigeria, you 252 00:24:18,759 --> 00:24:22,119 know, to drill for oil. You know, they're doing that kind of 253 00:24:22,160 --> 00:24:26,559 thing. That's one possibility, some of them could just be here for purely 254 00:24:26,680 --> 00:24:36,880 transactional purposes, and possibly the abduction program is that, and the hybridization program, 255 00:24:37,839 --> 00:24:42,920 then there could be it could be uncaring. A third category that they're 256 00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:49,400 just here to observe because we've got nuclear weapons and we're trying to launch into 257 00:24:49,440 --> 00:24:53,440 space and so you know, would you want to keep an eye on the 258 00:24:53,519 --> 00:25:03,119 local civilization like that? And then the third is the there that they're positive, 259 00:25:03,000 --> 00:25:11,319 and a fourth is that they're positive and if they were, are they 260 00:25:11,359 --> 00:25:14,640 really going to just show up and say hey, we're here. Hi. 261 00:25:15,599 --> 00:25:19,359 You know, no, they're not. They're probably protocols in place to keep 262 00:25:21,240 --> 00:25:27,200 societies like ours from not going through the right steps. And uh, you 263 00:25:27,240 --> 00:25:33,200 know, just you don't hand you don't hand people, you know in the 264 00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:37,559 Middle Ages nuclear weapons, yeah, you know, you don't give the machine 265 00:25:37,599 --> 00:25:41,680 guns. You know, you don't you know, if we were to go 266 00:25:41,720 --> 00:25:48,160 back in time, so they would you know, I'm not just taking this 267 00:25:48,240 --> 00:25:52,680 from Star Trek. I really think there has to be some sort of ground 268 00:25:52,839 --> 00:26:00,240 rules that that civilizations have when they approach a society like ours, because want 269 00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:04,400 of them to develop naturally where they're not just going to be given something ahead 270 00:26:04,400 --> 00:26:10,240 of time and jump into space and start trying to take over other planets and 271 00:26:11,240 --> 00:26:17,720 and you know, once you achieve that nuclear stage. See notice that all 272 00:26:17,960 --> 00:26:22,960 you know, the biggest portion of our understanding of UFOs comes from the nineteen 273 00:26:23,039 --> 00:26:29,920 forties on. And so what were we doing then? We're putting together a 274 00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:34,839 nuclear weapon? And so even if they're supportive of US, I would think 275 00:26:34,920 --> 00:26:40,000 that they would sit back and wait, and that's what they've been doing. 276 00:26:41,759 --> 00:26:47,440 Yeah, yeah, this there hasn't There hasn't been a lot of interference. 277 00:26:48,079 --> 00:26:51,279 You know, that is a question a lot of people ask, you know, 278 00:26:51,440 --> 00:26:56,200 like what why don't they show themselves, you know, show themselves on 279 00:26:56,279 --> 00:26:59,519 the White House lawn, blah blah blah. You hear that all the time, 280 00:26:59,599 --> 00:27:04,839 things like that, And you know, I think there's definitely fears involved 281 00:27:04,920 --> 00:27:08,759 here, like what do they want? You know, why are they even 282 00:27:08,799 --> 00:27:14,160 here to begin with? You know, that type of thing whatever they are. 283 00:27:14,599 --> 00:27:18,119 And I think you're right too, I don't. I don't think it's 284 00:27:18,160 --> 00:27:23,680 one just one type of situation, one type of entity whatever that is showing 285 00:27:23,799 --> 00:27:29,920 up here. I think it could be a lot of different things. And 286 00:27:30,279 --> 00:27:33,480 you know, there's there's always the argument from skeptics that they could never get 287 00:27:33,519 --> 00:27:40,880 here, that's it's too far to travel and all that. But obviously whatever 288 00:27:40,960 --> 00:27:45,359 is getting here has figured out how to get here wherever they're from. You 289 00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:51,680 know, there's just too many things that have been witnessed to say otherwise, 290 00:27:52,440 --> 00:27:56,480 you know, at this point, So, so, how do you think 291 00:27:56,559 --> 00:28:08,599 the government has been handling the situation? That's a schizophrenic answer. I'm expectedly 292 00:28:10,319 --> 00:28:18,519 disappointed in the defense and intelligence communities, but I'm very happy with how Congress 293 00:28:18,559 --> 00:28:25,319 has handled this. You know, until this last year, you haven't had 294 00:28:26,480 --> 00:28:30,559 a lot of pushback, and the recent pushback. I don't want to go 295 00:28:30,599 --> 00:28:36,000 down that rabbit hole, but when was the last time you ever heard Congress 296 00:28:36,039 --> 00:28:41,920 passing laws three years in a row on the same subject. They usually they 297 00:28:41,039 --> 00:28:47,240 usually get it done in one year. And if it you know, and 298 00:28:47,319 --> 00:28:52,160 I've worked on legislation for years, what you do is you put together a 299 00:28:52,200 --> 00:28:57,519 package to address whatever the issue is. It takes compromises, you finally put 300 00:28:57,519 --> 00:29:02,880 it together. Everyone's happy, you pass it, you cut the ribbon. 301 00:29:03,559 --> 00:29:07,359 You know, you you have your you know, congratulations. Then you go 302 00:29:07,400 --> 00:29:12,079 on to the next topic. Here. You know, occasionally you'll bring back 303 00:29:12,200 --> 00:29:19,599 like curative legislation. It's called where you made a mistake. But both in 304 00:29:19,680 --> 00:29:26,720 the Trump administration and the Biden administration, you did not have overt pushback of 305 00:29:26,759 --> 00:29:33,960 the of the Congress on these issues. The pushback came from below. And 306 00:29:33,920 --> 00:29:38,400 so look at it this way. I think you know right now, you 307 00:29:38,440 --> 00:29:44,480 know the Trump administration, the actual presidential administ the Office of the President, 308 00:29:45,480 --> 00:29:49,559 UH, didn't really push back to this. And then when Biden came in, 309 00:29:51,799 --> 00:29:53,799 you don't have the same kind of pushbacks. He signed all the bills. 310 00:29:55,880 --> 00:30:00,440 UH. In the first bill, he issued a sign statement that said 311 00:30:00,519 --> 00:30:07,559 that the National Defense Authorization Act of twenty twenty two, adopted in twenty twenty 312 00:30:07,599 --> 00:30:11,839 one, they always do it a year ahead of the fiscal year. That 313 00:30:11,920 --> 00:30:18,599 particular signing statement pointed to the Defense Act, which is a massive bill, 314 00:30:19,160 --> 00:30:26,599 and said we're going to comply with requests or information for Congress as long as 315 00:30:26,599 --> 00:30:33,640 it doesn't reveal battle plans or the names of confidential sources or that kind of 316 00:30:33,680 --> 00:30:38,480 thing. But he never applied it to UFOs. In fact, none of 317 00:30:38,519 --> 00:30:44,680 the examples they listed they were all about the Afghanistan War and the Iraq War, 318 00:30:45,079 --> 00:30:52,200 and also Central Command and their battle plans for some reason, but nothing 319 00:30:52,200 --> 00:30:56,640 about UFOs. And so you know, you've got Joe Biden, who's the 320 00:30:56,680 --> 00:31:02,960 Senate guy. I mean, that's his that's its foundation, is the Senate. 321 00:31:03,839 --> 00:31:07,759 And you've got pretty much the leading group on this has been the Select 322 00:31:08,240 --> 00:31:18,319 Committee on Intelligence in the Senate and they've been passing out this legislation on seventeen 323 00:31:18,680 --> 00:31:22,880 zero votes. I mean, they can't agree that the sun is coming up 324 00:31:22,920 --> 00:31:30,880 tomorrow is unanimous vote, you know. And so we're talking about a unique 325 00:31:32,400 --> 00:31:38,880 window here where as long as it stays by partisan we could make tremendous progress. 326 00:31:40,160 --> 00:31:44,720 I mean we've made They've made more progress in the last five years than 327 00:31:44,799 --> 00:31:49,680 they've made the last eighty. And yeah, so you know, you've got 328 00:31:49,680 --> 00:31:55,680 a core of people. And the interesting thing is, if it was just 329 00:31:55,799 --> 00:32:02,160 the national security people, you're going to have or senators or congressman, they're 330 00:32:02,160 --> 00:32:07,200 going to vote know one the bill because or try to take out the UFO 331 00:32:07,319 --> 00:32:13,440 stuff because they think it's crazy. Nobody did that until you know, this 332 00:32:13,680 --> 00:32:16,799 recent thing here, you don't have that. So you know, when you're 333 00:32:16,839 --> 00:32:25,599 talking about you know, especially the Defense and Intelligence committees, they're bipartisan. 334 00:32:27,359 --> 00:32:30,119 You know, they have people from both parties, and so, you know, 335 00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:35,079 if you're a rank and file congressman and you're trying to figure out, 336 00:32:35,079 --> 00:32:40,720 what about this UFO bill in the National Defense Authorization Act, and so they're 337 00:32:40,759 --> 00:32:45,480 going to ask one of their colleagues. It's you know, from their party 338 00:32:45,519 --> 00:32:47,559 that agrees with them. You know, if you're a Republican, you're going 339 00:32:47,640 --> 00:32:52,440 to ask Mike Gallagher, why do you have this crazy stuff in here? 340 00:32:53,279 --> 00:32:59,079 He'd say, leave it alone. I know what I'm talking about. You 341 00:32:59,079 --> 00:33:04,279 know, they're you're they know so much more than they're telling us right now 342 00:33:04,680 --> 00:33:07,680 while they're still because they're still trying to figure it out. They can't tell 343 00:33:07,799 --> 00:33:12,319 us at every stage, but there comes a point they're going to have to 344 00:33:12,400 --> 00:33:22,880 tell us. And probably what my suggestion is that they do internal briefings on 345 00:33:22,039 --> 00:33:28,000 each step. Yes they're real, Yes they're from some place else. No 346 00:33:28,039 --> 00:33:31,839 they're not from Russia. No they're not from China, they're from someplace else. 347 00:33:32,480 --> 00:33:37,680 And then next step do another set of brief But they've been doing that 348 00:33:37,720 --> 00:33:42,559 since nineteen forty seven though, you know, with the Twining Memo, and 349 00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:45,640 you know, oh, I agree, this is not fictitious. This is 350 00:33:45,680 --> 00:33:51,279 real. It's not visionary, you know, I mean it keeps. And 351 00:33:51,799 --> 00:33:57,759 again in fifty three fifty, right after the fifty two UFO flap, you 352 00:33:57,799 --> 00:34:01,039 know, they came out again and basically saying it's real, you know, 353 00:34:01,119 --> 00:34:07,240 but they got to I guess they have to reinforce that. So I'm sorry, 354 00:34:07,720 --> 00:34:09,880 continue on. I just no, no, no, no, that's 355 00:34:09,920 --> 00:34:15,800 an excellent point. In nineteen fifty five, Senator Richard Russell, who the 356 00:34:15,880 --> 00:34:23,039 Russell Office building is named after, was on a train going from Russia to 357 00:34:23,639 --> 00:34:30,800 Czechoslovakia on a mission, you know, for the for the Senate, you 358 00:34:30,800 --> 00:34:38,360 know, an investigation tour, and a classic Billy Meyer UFO flew by the 359 00:34:38,360 --> 00:34:45,400 plane and a Russian official came in and shut all the curtains. So they 360 00:34:45,440 --> 00:34:51,000 were press in the car, in the train car, and so later they 361 00:34:51,360 --> 00:34:54,400 you know, it got out what happened, and so a lot of people 362 00:34:54,400 --> 00:35:00,000 were asked questions, and so one of a reporter asked Richard, Senator Russell 363 00:35:00,079 --> 00:35:07,519 about it, and he said, I've been advised by the you know, 364 00:35:07,559 --> 00:35:12,400 parts of the government that are working on this, and it is best not 365 00:35:12,480 --> 00:35:15,599 for me to talk about it now. Okay. That was nineteen fifty five. 366 00:35:16,199 --> 00:35:22,840 The Senate until twenty seventeen eighteen, it wasn't talking about it at all. 367 00:35:22,880 --> 00:35:27,880 And so this to me, that's the difference between now and back then 368 00:35:28,639 --> 00:35:34,599 is you have Congress that is interested in it, and you know, if 369 00:35:34,599 --> 00:35:38,320 you're a whistleblower, are you going to blow the whistle if there's no one 370 00:35:38,480 --> 00:35:43,159 going to back you up? And now we've got someone that's backing them up. 371 00:35:43,199 --> 00:35:50,039 And so I know Robert Sallas has already spoken to Ero about his incident, 372 00:35:50,719 --> 00:35:58,559 the Malstrom UFO incident, And it galls me because Sean Kirkpatrick comes out 373 00:35:58,599 --> 00:36:05,519 after retires and says there's no evidence, no first hand witnesses. Yeah, 374 00:36:05,239 --> 00:36:08,920 and he and Sean Kirkpatrick talked to Bob sellas I know he did, and 375 00:36:09,000 --> 00:36:13,159 same as I brought this up many times in the show. That also, 376 00:36:13,440 --> 00:36:15,679 some of that's been on the show. I'm a friend with is Mario Woods, 377 00:36:15,920 --> 00:36:22,079 who have talked four hours to them, you know, four hours to 378 00:36:22,159 --> 00:36:23,880 be exact, four hours and nineteen minutes. He always puts that in, 379 00:36:24,679 --> 00:36:29,519 but yeah, you know, first hand witness again, yeah, so no 380 00:36:29,639 --> 00:36:32,639 first hand witness is no evidence. Yeah, so I think Arrow was just 381 00:36:32,920 --> 00:36:38,719 is just window dressing, you know, we'll see though maybe the undernew leadership 382 00:36:38,719 --> 00:36:43,440 it'll be different, but I don't have any real hopes for it. Well, 383 00:36:43,440 --> 00:36:47,920 we'll find out in June of twenty twenty four when they release, and 384 00:36:49,000 --> 00:36:52,480 they will. They won't release it on time because they haven't released anything on 385 00:36:52,559 --> 00:37:00,079 time since Aro took over. But whenever they released the history of UFO uh 386 00:37:00,199 --> 00:37:10,400 information, Uh, then we'll know whether they're they're serious actors or not. 387 00:37:12,000 --> 00:37:15,760 But see, you can come forward now, and you know Deve Grush and 388 00:37:16,119 --> 00:37:21,440 there are many others besides him that have come forward that we don't know about 389 00:37:21,519 --> 00:37:28,280 yet. And uh so they they have to educate themselves because if they tried 390 00:37:28,320 --> 00:37:31,440 to do this, if the Republicans tried to do this alone or the Democrats, 391 00:37:31,920 --> 00:37:36,679 the other side's going to go, you're crazy. You know, they're 392 00:37:36,719 --> 00:37:42,079 gonna they've got to do it together, and considering the political environment, and 393 00:37:42,360 --> 00:37:45,920 it's difficult to do things together, and so they've they've got to figure out 394 00:37:45,920 --> 00:37:51,159 a way. And so my goal has been, uh, well, I 395 00:37:51,239 --> 00:37:58,840 haven't worked in Congress myself. I've worked with the elected officials and for decades 396 00:37:58,920 --> 00:38:04,440 and sit down with them and how do you want to do this? Well, 397 00:38:04,480 --> 00:38:07,639 if you do it that way, you know you're gonna it's all gonna 398 00:38:07,639 --> 00:38:10,880 fall apart. But if you try this, maybe it'll work. And you 399 00:38:10,880 --> 00:38:15,920 know, I'm not always right, but uh, I see a process that 400 00:38:16,039 --> 00:38:22,000 needs to unfold. And so besides my book, I've been writing a series. 401 00:38:22,079 --> 00:38:27,400 I've started a series of blog about how they should release, how they 402 00:38:27,480 --> 00:38:32,920 should start the disclosure process. And uh, I'll like the book, I'll 403 00:38:32,960 --> 00:38:38,079 package it up and and send it to Congress, and uh, you know, 404 00:38:38,239 --> 00:38:43,079 if I'm wrong and there's better way to do it, then that's what 405 00:38:43,119 --> 00:38:46,360 they have staff for. And they have they have good staff on this. 406 00:38:46,480 --> 00:38:52,800 They have a few staff members that are handling this and they will go unsung 407 00:38:53,400 --> 00:38:58,880 and they you know, without them, know, you know, Marco Rubio 408 00:38:59,000 --> 00:39:02,639 and Mark Warner, the two heads of the Senate Intel Committee, would not 409 00:39:02,679 --> 00:39:09,159 be stepping forward. One of the things I've thought about this, and I 410 00:39:09,159 --> 00:39:13,760 don't know, just trying to get your opinion on it, is that I 411 00:39:13,800 --> 00:39:16,800 think they don't know the whole picture. And because they don't know the whole 412 00:39:16,840 --> 00:39:22,000 picture, then they can't say that they can protect us from it, right, 413 00:39:22,119 --> 00:39:25,280 whatever it is. And so that's why I think disclosure is going to 414 00:39:25,280 --> 00:39:30,119 be very difficult for our government to actually come all out and say, look, 415 00:39:30,159 --> 00:39:37,960 we are being visited and we don't know exactly what it is. So 416 00:39:37,159 --> 00:39:43,480 I don't know, you know, I don't know if we'll ever get to 417 00:39:43,480 --> 00:39:46,599 that point, because you know, it's only my opinion. But I don't 418 00:39:46,599 --> 00:39:50,519 really think they know the whole picture. Oh. I agree with you on 419 00:39:50,559 --> 00:39:57,320 that they're learning the picture, and they're learning the picture, but what we 420 00:39:57,480 --> 00:40:01,199 don't know is how much they've learned into the puzzle. Like I said at 421 00:40:01,199 --> 00:40:07,519 the beginning, it's an onion. And my guess is there a layer five 422 00:40:07,599 --> 00:40:13,719 of forty and I'm hoping we can keep this going till they get to layer 423 00:40:13,840 --> 00:40:15,679 forty so they can do it all, you know. But I agree with 424 00:40:15,719 --> 00:40:22,000 you there. You know, if if if they don't know, if they're 425 00:40:22,039 --> 00:40:25,960 worried about how stilly, they're not going to bring it out. Yeah, 426 00:40:27,079 --> 00:40:31,599 especially Yeah, this just put up a couple of questions here. Has a 427 00:40:31,679 --> 00:40:37,320 Disclosure Act been watered down? Yes? Yeah, quite a bit, actually, 428 00:40:37,920 --> 00:40:42,480 yeah quite a bit. Yeah. Yeah. You know, timber Chet's 429 00:40:42,519 --> 00:40:51,519 done an awful lot for UFO disclosure. But when you compared his bill in 430 00:40:51,639 --> 00:40:58,679 the House to the Mike Rounds Chuck Schuber bill in the Senate. I mean 431 00:41:00,960 --> 00:41:07,599 it's a qualitative difference. And so near the end of the session last year, 432 00:41:08,400 --> 00:41:13,599 Chuck Schumer and Mike Rounds both came on the floor at the same time 433 00:41:15,760 --> 00:41:22,400 and talked about their bill that wasn't part of the package, and in a 434 00:41:22,599 --> 00:41:27,760 colloqu way back and forth, which of the likes I've never seen of Republicans 435 00:41:27,880 --> 00:41:32,639 Democrats. They both said that they're going to press forward and try in this 436 00:41:34,280 --> 00:41:39,920 year to get it adopted. And the difference between the two bills is that 437 00:41:43,079 --> 00:41:47,599 under the House version, a lot of the power for this is left with 438 00:41:47,639 --> 00:41:55,440 the agencies themselves that hold the records. When you have an independent commission that 439 00:41:55,719 --> 00:42:05,800 is vetted and uh chosen by the entire Senate, you're going to have a 440 00:42:05,840 --> 00:42:13,840 better chance with this independent group. Considering now this, I'll you can, 441 00:42:14,079 --> 00:42:16,400 you can yell at me, and I'll stop, but talk a little bit 442 00:42:16,400 --> 00:42:24,159 about the legal stuff. The standard in the bill is that an independent group 443 00:42:25,360 --> 00:42:31,719 must be convinced by clear and convincing evidence that the record should stay secret. 444 00:42:32,519 --> 00:42:39,000 Clear and convincing evidence is the highest civil standard there is. It's not beyond 445 00:42:39,000 --> 00:42:43,800 a reasonable doubt in the criminal setting. But it takes a hell of a 446 00:42:43,800 --> 00:42:47,440 lot of evidence, you know, to be able to say that. So 447 00:42:47,960 --> 00:42:52,519 you know, if there are you know, breakthroughs on you know, propulsion 448 00:42:52,800 --> 00:42:57,400 or you know you don't, we don't also turn over nuclear weapons, how 449 00:42:57,400 --> 00:43:01,519 to make those you know, so the those should stay you know, you 450 00:43:01,559 --> 00:43:07,079 know, as classified as possible. But you know the fact that you know, 451 00:43:07,239 --> 00:43:12,199 pictures like the one you showed of Rex Hefflin took, you know, 452 00:43:13,079 --> 00:43:21,960 those need to be released NDAs if the if Bob Sella says I'll waive my 453 00:43:22,079 --> 00:43:28,519 privacy rights and you can release the NDA, then it's released. You know, 454 00:43:28,599 --> 00:43:32,719 you don't give the military the chance to say no first, and this 455 00:43:34,039 --> 00:43:39,800 commission would have done that. And just by the fact that it was a 456 00:43:39,800 --> 00:43:45,280 bill by Mike Grounds, you know, a quality senator, you know, 457 00:43:45,360 --> 00:43:52,239 high up in the ranks of the Republican side, and Chuck Schumer, I 458 00:43:52,280 --> 00:43:59,320 cannot remember the last time the majority leader or minority leader in either House actually 459 00:43:59,360 --> 00:44:05,840 sponsored bill. You don't see Nancy Pelosi's name on bills. And Chuck Schumer 460 00:44:05,920 --> 00:44:12,239 did this himself. That is, that doesn't get that means that Biden didn't 461 00:44:12,239 --> 00:44:19,719 have a problem with it because the Democratic leader of the Senate would not put 462 00:44:19,719 --> 00:44:24,480 a bill out that makes the president look bad of his own party. That 463 00:44:24,840 --> 00:44:32,960 yeah. Yeah, And so the combination Chuck Schuber, Mitch McConnell, when 464 00:44:32,960 --> 00:44:37,199 he started having some of his episodes, uh you know where he couldn't talk 465 00:44:37,239 --> 00:44:45,159 for a while, he started delegating work, and Mike Grounds ended up with 466 00:44:45,239 --> 00:44:51,320 the UAP portfolio on this. At least, this is my outside reading. 467 00:44:51,800 --> 00:44:57,280 And Chuck Schumer and Mike Rounds are also going to be the two point people 468 00:44:57,360 --> 00:45:02,480 for both parties in the Senate on AI. So look at that. You've 469 00:45:02,519 --> 00:45:09,239 got UFOs and AI. I mean, can you think of two future things 470 00:45:09,440 --> 00:45:14,239 bigger than those two? And the same two guys on both sides of the 471 00:45:14,280 --> 00:45:19,960 aisle are working together. Yeah. Now, they'll still argue about abortion and 472 00:45:20,400 --> 00:45:24,719 gun control and you know, the border and all that, and we can't 473 00:45:25,159 --> 00:45:30,239 wish everyone to be kumbaya, but on this issue, you know, if 474 00:45:30,280 --> 00:45:34,360 you step out and you ain't going to stay, they're jumping off a bridge 475 00:45:34,519 --> 00:45:37,599 that they don't know where the bottom is. It's better to do it together, 476 00:45:38,920 --> 00:45:44,840 yeah, then separately. Yeah, that's right. I was actually at 477 00:45:44,880 --> 00:45:50,360 the hearing this last July and it was really very I was so second to 478 00:45:50,400 --> 00:45:55,719 last person in the door with my producer and Chrislito, so we were all 479 00:45:55,800 --> 00:46:06,159 in there watching and it was really amazing to see what is it AOC on 480 00:46:06,159 --> 00:46:08,880 one side and Matt Gates on the other side, and them all just getting 481 00:46:08,880 --> 00:46:13,679 along and discussing, you know, the topic and having you know, it 482 00:46:13,800 --> 00:46:22,679 was a clear bipartisan you know, you know issue that they were really looking 483 00:46:22,719 --> 00:46:27,159 and taking seriously and working together. So that was Yeah, that was really 484 00:46:27,920 --> 00:46:32,199 very I felt it was very historic. It was and and there wouldn't be 485 00:46:32,199 --> 00:46:37,119 another subject whether it happened, I don't think bro. And you know, 486 00:46:37,239 --> 00:46:40,039 there was I've said this before in the show. There was over a thousand 487 00:46:40,079 --> 00:46:45,280 people that showed up for those thirty seats, and I was there at five 488 00:46:45,360 --> 00:46:47,960 forty am. I would have never gotten in, you know, at five 489 00:46:49,079 --> 00:46:52,480 forty and you're the last two people in. Yeah, but there were people 490 00:46:52,480 --> 00:46:54,559 that cut in front of us. Quite a few. Oh okay, yeah, 491 00:46:54,679 --> 00:46:58,639 certain people, George Knapp, Jeremy Corbell, you know, people like 492 00:46:58,719 --> 00:47:07,079 that. Yeah, well, Georgia is a true journalist. But uh yeah, 493 00:47:07,119 --> 00:47:12,880 they should they should wait their turn. But except for Virginia Fox, 494 00:47:13,000 --> 00:47:19,440 the congresswoman from North Carolina, she bashed spend her five minutes bashing the Biden 495 00:47:19,440 --> 00:47:24,679 administration over the Chenese balloon incident. Besides that, I mean, it was 496 00:47:24,760 --> 00:47:31,760 amazingly bipartisan, amazingly And you know, you have to remember that's the committee, 497 00:47:31,800 --> 00:47:37,519 the Hunter Biden Committee. I mean, yeah, yep, you know, 498 00:47:37,599 --> 00:47:42,000 that's the Biden Crime Family Committee. Yet Chuck Schumer, when he put 499 00:47:42,079 --> 00:47:50,440 his bill together with Mike Grounds, the overseer of that, the committee that 500 00:47:50,519 --> 00:47:55,199 would review the documents to see whether they should be released. The oversight by 501 00:47:55,239 --> 00:48:02,679 the House was the over House Oversight Committee. So the most contentious committee on 502 00:48:02,760 --> 00:48:09,519 the other side was written into the bill in the UFOs having oversight authority because 503 00:48:09,559 --> 00:48:15,400 if Matt gaz complained that they didn't have access to secrets, you know, 504 00:48:15,719 --> 00:48:21,440 at that hearing. And the reason they didn't is because when they adopted the 505 00:48:21,480 --> 00:48:28,280 original bill in twenty twenty one, they listed who the appropriate committees were to 506 00:48:28,320 --> 00:48:32,360 receive classified information, and they're up to twelve, but Oversight isn't on the 507 00:48:32,440 --> 00:48:39,360 twelve. So there are already almost two hundred members of Congress out of the 508 00:48:39,400 --> 00:48:44,559 five hundred and thirty five that are on these committees. So you've got a 509 00:48:44,599 --> 00:48:52,559 core. You got about forty percent of Congress already that are They may all 510 00:48:52,599 --> 00:48:55,519 show up for all the hearings on this or the class sided briefings, but 511 00:48:55,639 --> 00:49:00,599 you're talking about a big group of people, so it's not a question of 512 00:49:01,039 --> 00:49:05,320 you know, educating everyone. It will take a year and a half. 513 00:49:06,000 --> 00:49:10,960 They can they can spread out pretty quick and educate him. And when you 514 00:49:12,000 --> 00:49:17,119 start seeing briefings like that, you not die. Disclosures coming right, Yeah, 515 00:49:17,199 --> 00:49:22,760 I hope. So I know that Luella Suondo had said twenty twenty four 516 00:49:22,880 --> 00:49:28,199 is the big year, whatever that means. Well, I've been communicating not 517 00:49:28,320 --> 00:49:31,719 with him but directly, but with his wife, and I know that as 518 00:49:31,719 --> 00:49:36,440 soon as his new book comes out, he'll be coming on podcasts again, 519 00:49:36,519 --> 00:49:38,159 and I would just oh good. I'd like to like to hear more of 520 00:49:38,159 --> 00:49:43,679 what he has to say. So I'm going to shift gears a little bit 521 00:49:43,719 --> 00:49:47,119 and just well, maybe or maybe not. Have you ever had any other, 522 00:49:47,480 --> 00:49:51,519 you know, events, any other UFO sightings in your life or was 523 00:49:51,519 --> 00:49:57,519 that the was that the one and only one? I've had dozens, dozens, 524 00:49:57,880 --> 00:50:07,519 yes, and unexplained pretty much all I've done regressions with Avon Smith and 525 00:50:07,880 --> 00:50:15,800 have only pulled out limited information, very little. She teases me that I'm 526 00:50:15,800 --> 00:50:21,079 a lawyer and I don't follow direction very well, and so that's probably, 527 00:50:21,159 --> 00:50:23,000 you know, my block has more to do, I think, with them 528 00:50:23,079 --> 00:50:32,199 than us. But I've I've had my uf you know, it's actual sightings. 529 00:50:32,239 --> 00:50:37,679 I've had a few, but frankly, some of the other paranormal behavior, 530 00:50:38,400 --> 00:50:45,440 you know, stands out to me more like in the last fifteen years, 531 00:50:46,079 --> 00:50:52,920 you know, actually, yeah, about twelve or thirteen years, I'd 532 00:50:52,920 --> 00:51:00,000 say I've as I started getting into this more, I've had a couple of 533 00:51:00,440 --> 00:51:13,159 instances of missing time where things I've ended up in my hotel room in various 534 00:51:13,320 --> 00:51:22,400 times twice for two significant times where something has appeared in the room that sort 535 00:51:22,440 --> 00:51:27,039 of started between you know, I'm laying in bed and it's between me and 536 00:51:27,119 --> 00:51:32,159 the area where the TV is, not from the TV, but where like 537 00:51:32,239 --> 00:51:39,599 a bubble sort of would form and then I'd see visions. And I had 538 00:51:39,639 --> 00:51:46,960 one when I was at the International UFO Conference in Arizona, where all of 539 00:51:46,960 --> 00:51:55,760 a sudden, I wake up at about three o'clock and this greenish light is 540 00:51:55,800 --> 00:52:04,000 starting to form, like thousands of tiny lights that merge into one and formed 541 00:52:04,119 --> 00:52:09,159 sort of an oblong three dimensional area. It was sort of like a plasma 542 00:52:09,360 --> 00:52:20,480 or something. And then from that I actually saw images first. The one 543 00:52:20,519 --> 00:52:22,679 that stood out I could have reached out and touched it. As I was 544 00:52:22,719 --> 00:52:34,440 sitting up, I saw this like three foot silver metallic domino sort of looking 545 00:52:34,519 --> 00:52:38,480 thing, and on the top and bas relief, it had a classic UFO 546 00:52:38,639 --> 00:52:45,519 with a line going down like a beam or something, and the second half 547 00:52:45,559 --> 00:52:52,719 of the domino had a DNA strand in it. But the DNA strand had 548 00:52:52,920 --> 00:53:00,239 hundreds hundreds of DNA strands in it, and out of those strands pop like 549 00:53:00,320 --> 00:53:07,440 a symbol. And I just kept staring at that simple symbol, trying, 550 00:53:07,519 --> 00:53:10,599 I've got to remember this. I kept telling myself, I got to remember 551 00:53:10,679 --> 00:53:15,599 this, got to remember this, And then all of a sudden, the 552 00:53:15,679 --> 00:53:21,679 symbol disappeared and it went right out of my head. I just lost on 553 00:53:21,800 --> 00:53:24,719 knowledge, and so you know, I'm totally disturbed. And then the whole 554 00:53:24,760 --> 00:53:30,519 thing shrinks down to nothing and leaves. Boy, you hear that a lot, 555 00:53:30,679 --> 00:53:35,840 that something shrinks down to nothing and disappears. Listen, We're just about 556 00:53:35,920 --> 00:53:40,719 out of time here. So and that was quite a fantastic story to end 557 00:53:40,920 --> 00:53:45,039 the show on. So where can people find you and get a hold of 558 00:53:45,079 --> 00:53:50,519 you, or at least get your books. Well, my books are available 559 00:53:50,559 --> 00:53:55,440 on Amazon for sure, and starting to be available other places. Had a 560 00:53:55,440 --> 00:54:05,599 few problems in production, but U I have a website j P l ufo 561 00:54:05,880 --> 00:54:10,800 dot com excellent of time. I'm sorry to say we're out of time. 562 00:54:10,840 --> 00:54:15,199 I will link your website in the show notes and in the text below. 563 00:54:15,280 --> 00:54:19,320 Thank you so much. It's been a real pleasure. I enjoyed it, 564 00:54:19,360 --> 00:54:22,320 Martin. All right, take care, all right everyone. We'll be back 565 00:54:22,480 --> 00:54:27,559 next week with g. O. Turner. He's in the UK and should 566 00:54:27,599 --> 00:54:30,480 be an interesting show. Thank you, and remember to keep your eyes to 567 00:54:30,519 --> 00:54:55,719 the sky.