WEBVTT 1 00:00:34.119 --> 00:00:38.359 Hello, and welcome to the show. I'm Martin Willis your host, and 2 00:00:38.840 --> 00:00:42.920 I think we have a show for you this evening. I did what I 3 00:00:42.960 --> 00:00:47.240 always do in that as I do it a sound test with our guest earlier 4 00:00:47.280 --> 00:00:51.280 on. Everything was just fine. And now when we get him on Skype, 5 00:00:51.280 --> 00:00:55.640 he's saying hello, Hello. That's all we got so far. So 6 00:00:56.560 --> 00:00:59.439 we have Bill in the background. Thank you. Bill. He's going to 7 00:00:59.520 --> 00:01:04.079 try to work that out, and so we're not really getting too far, 8 00:01:06.000 --> 00:01:10.200 but we will see how things go. We get to this news with Alejandro 9 00:01:10.480 --> 00:01:14.920 Rojas for about fifteen minutes, so during that time hopefully we will connect. 10 00:01:15.560 --> 00:01:19.439 And anyway, I want to thank everyone that supports the show. Anyone can 11 00:01:19.480 --> 00:01:23.519 support the show, all you have to do is go over to podcast ufo 12 00:01:23.640 --> 00:01:29.079 dot com and check it out over there. Also, we have a new 13 00:01:29.120 --> 00:01:34.319 blog this week called rockin UFOs that's by Charles Lear and it's about some rock 14 00:01:34.359 --> 00:01:38.439 stars, not all of them because a lot of them have had UFO experiences, 15 00:01:38.680 --> 00:01:44.719 but some of them are listed there. So go check that out over 16 00:01:44.760 --> 00:01:49.000 at podcast ufo dot com and our Facebook page. We've got I don't know 17 00:01:49.239 --> 00:01:53.079 twenty three thousand or so people are over there, and the reason they're there 18 00:01:53.239 --> 00:02:00.319 is because Peggy in Las Vegas is kind enough to post a news story every 19 00:02:00.400 --> 00:02:07.120 day on their one kind or another in relation to UFOs or space, interesting 20 00:02:07.159 --> 00:02:10.159 subjects things like that. And I think it's about ready for me to stop 21 00:02:10.199 --> 00:02:15.879 talking and to get Alejandro in a how are you welcome to the show? 22 00:02:15.479 --> 00:02:20.759 Hello? Thank you for having me. Well, you might have, you 23 00:02:20.840 --> 00:02:24.400 might have doing the whole show with me. I know you've got things to 24 00:02:24.439 --> 00:02:30.039 do. But anyway, deer in the headlights looking, so, how are 25 00:02:30.039 --> 00:02:34.919 you doing? Have you how you relaxed yet a little bit? Not really 26 00:02:35.080 --> 00:02:38.199 a little bit? Yeah, yeah, I probably look better because I'm not 27 00:02:38.319 --> 00:02:42.800 totally freaked out. But it's been kind of crazy. In fact, I 28 00:02:42.879 --> 00:02:46.879 am like super busy again because there was the UFO Congress. We took a 29 00:02:46.919 --> 00:02:53.639 few days off and then I sold my house and it sold way more quickly 30 00:02:53.680 --> 00:02:58.879 than I expected, And so I am literally moving out because I have to 31 00:02:58.919 --> 00:03:01.039 be out by the end of the week, and in fact, I am 32 00:03:01.120 --> 00:03:07.319 tempting to have everything ready tomorrow. So yeah, so it's crazy goodness, 33 00:03:07.599 --> 00:03:10.919 wow, And so why why am I moving out of my house? And 34 00:03:10.960 --> 00:03:15.280 what the heck is going on? Yeah, it's just about ready to ask 35 00:03:15.360 --> 00:03:23.599 that the answers to that question may have implications in the UFO field, which 36 00:03:23.639 --> 00:03:29.919 will be I think for our listeners very interesting. So I don't have anything 37 00:03:29.919 --> 00:03:31.280 to share. Unfortunately, I can't share anything now, and I hate it 38 00:03:31.280 --> 00:03:35.840 because I told this all the time, there's good stuff coming up, but 39 00:03:36.719 --> 00:03:42.159 luckily it's lately when I've been told that it's come true. You know, 40 00:03:42.280 --> 00:03:46.240 we've got a lot of amazing things that have been happening, and there's more 41 00:03:46.319 --> 00:03:49.719 great stuff in store, and I'll share with you all as soon as i 42 00:03:49.759 --> 00:03:53.759 can. But yes, I'm really exciting stuff on the horizon excellent. Well, 43 00:03:54.199 --> 00:03:59.080 you know, usually I know kind of the inside story and I have 44 00:03:59.159 --> 00:04:02.000 to keep a list. But I'm part of this. Uh, the people 45 00:04:02.000 --> 00:04:06.639 on this side that going are yeah, not at all. So I have 46 00:04:06.719 --> 00:04:12.840 an idea and I'll show that I have an idea. Okay, Well, 47 00:04:12.879 --> 00:04:15.039 either way, you'll be one of the first to know. Of course, 48 00:04:15.039 --> 00:04:19.519 in your audience often gets to know stuff before my audience because if I'm too 49 00:04:19.560 --> 00:04:24.000 busy to do my show. Luckily, I'm usually able to still pop on 50 00:04:24.240 --> 00:04:28.879 with you. And I have had some people where are you, where's your 51 00:04:28.879 --> 00:04:33.199 podcasts and you know, hopefully i'll have it up again soon and or some 52 00:04:33.240 --> 00:04:39.319 bigger, better news for everybody. But yeah, so that's up. What's 53 00:04:39.439 --> 00:04:41.680 up with me? Of course, there's lots of UFO news out there. 54 00:04:41.720 --> 00:04:45.879 Should we get into that. I think we should. Okay, So it's 55 00:04:45.920 --> 00:04:49.560 a lot more complicated than what we're reading in the headlines. We're seeing headlines 56 00:04:49.759 --> 00:04:56.759 such as UFOs are real. The Navy says UFOs are real, and the 57 00:04:56.879 --> 00:05:01.240 Navy UFO videos are real, which is significant. Of course, Life Science 58 00:05:01.279 --> 00:05:05.839 has a headline here that says UFOs are real and you were never supposed to 59 00:05:05.879 --> 00:05:12.720 see them. Military official says. There was also a political story of a 60 00:05:12.759 --> 00:05:17.519 week ago Navy withholding data on UFO sidings, according to a congressman. So 61 00:05:17.600 --> 00:05:20.759 let's get into break all this down. So what the heck is going on? 62 00:05:21.959 --> 00:05:27.480 So here's something that's kind of strange. We've got confirmation and essentially the 63 00:05:29.000 --> 00:05:33.680 representative spoke to or sent a message to John Greenwall of the Black Bowl saying 64 00:05:33.720 --> 00:05:40.160 that yes, those videos, which confirms essentially what lu Alisando was telling us 65 00:05:40.199 --> 00:05:43.279 our UAPs. We don't know what they are, we don't think they're a 66 00:05:43.360 --> 00:05:46.079 Russian. We don't think they're Chinese. They didn't say that explicitly, but 67 00:05:46.160 --> 00:05:50.519 that's essentially what they're saying. They're UAPs. They don't know what these things 68 00:05:50.560 --> 00:05:58.639 are. That's very significant because that means they feel they've ruled everything else out. 69 00:05:58.759 --> 00:06:01.079 They've ruled out Chinese, they've ruled out the Russians, they've ruled out 70 00:06:01.160 --> 00:06:06.959 some secret project that is ours that somehow, you know, got the scene 71 00:06:08.240 --> 00:06:15.480 by the Roosevelt crew or the Nimitz crew who took those videos, the pilots 72 00:06:15.519 --> 00:06:19.160 that were part of those groups that took those videos. So they're saying that 73 00:06:19.199 --> 00:06:26.000 they feel those are genuine unknown represented in those videos. The weird thing is 74 00:06:26.079 --> 00:06:30.480 they also told him those videos were not to be released to the public. 75 00:06:31.600 --> 00:06:34.319 On the surface, that may seem like, oh my gosh. You know, 76 00:06:35.040 --> 00:06:40.120 so Lou was kind of a whistleblower. He released these UFO videos even 77 00:06:40.120 --> 00:06:44.399 though he wasn't supposed to normally. Of course, for the UFO community, 78 00:06:44.439 --> 00:06:46.879 that'd be very exciting. Everybody'd be like, Wow, that's great, this 79 00:06:46.959 --> 00:06:49.879 whistleblower got the info out, which is what we've been waiting for. Unfortunately, 80 00:06:49.959 --> 00:06:54.560 some of the naysayers out there, including mister Greenwald, are like, 81 00:06:54.600 --> 00:06:57.279 oh, look, he released these things and he didn't go through the proper 82 00:06:57.360 --> 00:07:01.079 procedures. However, we just got a couple of weeks ago, and I 83 00:07:01.160 --> 00:07:08.240 got this myself in my own fourier request an email string regarding the release of 84 00:07:08.279 --> 00:07:12.560 those videos. Not only do we have a release form that was that was 85 00:07:12.600 --> 00:07:17.160 filled out and stamped by the Navy approved for release, we also got an 86 00:07:17.160 --> 00:07:23.879 email correspondence where you can see Alizondo discussing with the Navy about the release of 87 00:07:23.879 --> 00:07:28.000 the videos. So we have this correspondence, we have this document that all 88 00:07:28.040 --> 00:07:33.439 shows the videos were released for the public. Yet we have this uh you 89 00:07:33.519 --> 00:07:40.199 know, press public the relations person saying no, they weren't supposed to be 90 00:07:40.240 --> 00:07:44.040 released to the public. So it creates some problems. First of all, 91 00:07:44.079 --> 00:07:46.560 why are they doing this. This keeps happening over and over again. They 92 00:07:46.600 --> 00:07:51.079 say they when they acknowledge something as real, like even when they acknowledge that 93 00:07:51.120 --> 00:07:57.560 the DD nineteen ten to form that allows a release of those videos, even 94 00:07:57.600 --> 00:08:01.279 when they confirmed that was real, they said, how however, you know 95 00:08:01.319 --> 00:08:05.360 it wasn't supposed to be released to the general public. Now, this is 96 00:08:05.439 --> 00:08:09.720 after they said those videos had nothing to do with the Department of Defense, 97 00:08:09.959 --> 00:08:15.040 and they were not released by the Department of Defense. That was not true. 98 00:08:15.279 --> 00:08:18.600 They had everything to do with the Department Offense. They were released by 99 00:08:18.600 --> 00:08:22.519 the Navy. In fact, we know of even though not all their names 100 00:08:22.519 --> 00:08:26.560 are revealed about You know, some of us know, and at least we 101 00:08:26.639 --> 00:08:31.240 know of the pilots, and we know the pilots who know the pilots who 102 00:08:31.319 --> 00:08:35.080 took those videos and are interacted with those objects. So they certainly were taken 103 00:08:35.080 --> 00:08:39.559 by Navy pilots who were chasing something that they did not know what it was. 104 00:08:39.399 --> 00:08:43.200 Why the Navy is saying that these were not supposed to be seen by 105 00:08:43.240 --> 00:08:46.360 the public, I don't know why they would say that, especially when we 106 00:08:46.399 --> 00:08:52.559 have these emails, we have this document that says otherwise. But it gets 107 00:08:52.639 --> 00:09:00.919 even further. So Mark Mike Walker, he's in the House Command for Homeland 108 00:09:00.960 --> 00:09:07.559 Security and he's a very important Republican in the House. He wrote a letter, 109 00:09:07.600 --> 00:09:11.000 it was a very educated letter to the Navy saying, hey, you've 110 00:09:11.039 --> 00:09:13.639 got these UFOs. You have these UAPs. You're confirming that you have them. 111 00:09:15.039 --> 00:09:20.120 What are they? Whose are they? If they're really unidentified, why 112 00:09:20.159 --> 00:09:26.240 are you saying that you canceled your investigation the a tip group that Louis Lazondo 113 00:09:26.360 --> 00:09:30.360 worked for in twenty twelve. Why don't you continue to do that investigation. 114 00:09:30.639 --> 00:09:35.919 I want to know who's investigating that and if not, why you're not why 115 00:09:35.960 --> 00:09:39.600 not? And so they gave a response, and the response was essentially, 116 00:09:39.639 --> 00:09:45.240 we are investigating them. You know, we do briefly Arm Services Committee, 117 00:09:46.000 --> 00:09:48.240 and that's about it, which he took as kind of a blowoff, and 118 00:09:48.279 --> 00:09:54.879 he essentially has said to Politico Brian Bender of Politico a week ago, Hey, 119 00:09:54.919 --> 00:09:56.440 I'm not happy about this. The Navy is blowing me off, and 120 00:09:56.480 --> 00:10:01.559 the Navy is hiding information on you fos. So it's kind of strange that 121 00:10:01.639 --> 00:10:05.759 the Navy would come out and say those videos should not have been released. 122 00:10:05.799 --> 00:10:11.159 We did not intend that when there's documentation showing that at least the people who 123 00:10:11.159 --> 00:10:15.559 would prove it did seem to intend those videos to be out to the public. 124 00:10:15.720 --> 00:10:20.360 And when they're being criticized for not sharing information, why would they then 125 00:10:20.440 --> 00:10:24.240 go and say, oh, look, here's another example where we're not sharing 126 00:10:24.240 --> 00:10:28.679 information, just like Congressman and Walker is upset with us about. So it's 127 00:10:30.039 --> 00:10:35.559 a very strange situation. I can say this though, that there is a 128 00:10:35.639 --> 00:10:41.039 lot of interface in the background with some of these witnesses from the Navy. 129 00:10:41.919 --> 00:10:45.759 You know, there are people involved like we saw on the show unidentified like 130 00:10:45.919 --> 00:10:52.639 lou Alesando and Steve Justice and Chris Mellon who are also speaking with officials. 131 00:10:52.960 --> 00:10:58.000 I have a feeling, and this is just my feeling, I think that 132 00:10:58.039 --> 00:11:03.240 there's a lot of still kind of chaos going on as far as people understanding 133 00:11:03.279 --> 00:11:09.960 all the different departments in the DoD trying to come to terms with this new 134 00:11:11.000 --> 00:11:15.360 world of UFOs being a credible thing. And I think that we're going to 135 00:11:15.399 --> 00:11:20.440 see more cooperation and we're going to see some of these issues cleared up in 136 00:11:20.519 --> 00:11:24.360 the future, hopefully the near future, but I'm pretty sure this is going 137 00:11:24.399 --> 00:11:28.799 to happen. As all of these groups begin to work together, information starts 138 00:11:28.840 --> 00:11:33.000 to get to all of the departments. I think what we have to understand 139 00:11:33.080 --> 00:11:39.840 is that these public affairs people, they are very, very detached from the 140 00:11:39.919 --> 00:11:43.559 guys out in the field, the pilots or the people that are actually running 141 00:11:43.600 --> 00:11:48.639 these programs. A Tip in particular was a program that was secretive. Harry 142 00:11:48.679 --> 00:11:52.919 Reid by design didn't want people to really know about it, mostly because he 143 00:11:52.960 --> 00:12:00.080 didn't want people to make fun of it and be embarrassed by But but you 144 00:12:00.120 --> 00:12:03.000 know, I think that we're moving We're going to be moving forward together as 145 00:12:03.000 --> 00:12:07.120 opposed to all of this weirdness that's going on. But Martin, are you 146 00:12:07.120 --> 00:12:11.240 still there? Yeah, I'm here. I want to hear your thoughts. 147 00:12:11.279 --> 00:12:15.120 What do you think of all of this? I mean, well, you 148 00:12:15.120 --> 00:12:18.679 know, I've been letting you. I'll be honest with you. I've been 149 00:12:18.759 --> 00:12:20.279 letting you. I've been trying to get our guests on the phone, so 150 00:12:20.279 --> 00:12:24.480 I've been hearing just bits and pieces. I feel really, uh like I'm 151 00:12:24.559 --> 00:12:30.879 caught. Now, well, let me ask you this way then I am 152 00:12:30.960 --> 00:12:33.519 here. I am here now, Oh great, great, all right, 153 00:12:33.600 --> 00:12:37.759 Rob, we'll introduce you. Just thank you, thank you, Okay, 154 00:12:37.120 --> 00:12:41.240 But I do want to ask you this before before we end the news. 155 00:12:41.679 --> 00:12:46.279 You know, from your perspective, you see, you know this this email 156 00:12:46.320 --> 00:12:52.080 string where apparently they're giving lou permission to release those videos, and then we 157 00:12:52.200 --> 00:12:58.120 have this new news that they're saying those videos are genuinely UAPs, they're unidentified, 158 00:12:58.440 --> 00:13:01.759 but we did mean to release them to the public. I mean, 159 00:13:01.799 --> 00:13:05.919 what does that make you think you know, I gotta tell you, I've 160 00:13:05.960 --> 00:13:13.639 been trying to follow this and I'm totally the more this goes on, and 161 00:13:13.720 --> 00:13:16.559 I don't know if anyone shares this with me at all, but the more 162 00:13:16.559 --> 00:13:22.120 confused I get, I get it. Yeah, I don't understand what's going 163 00:13:22.159 --> 00:13:28.200 on, and I just wish there could be some type of clarity from you 164 00:13:28.240 --> 00:13:31.320 know, like you said, I heard you say, you know, all 165 00:13:31.360 --> 00:13:35.639 the groups perhaps working together, you know, maybe this can be cleared up 166 00:13:37.039 --> 00:13:41.080 and there could be some focus on what exactly is going on, because as 167 00:13:41.159 --> 00:13:43.440 time goes on, it just seems more and more confusing to me all the 168 00:13:43.480 --> 00:13:48.240 time. I really don't know what does that. I don't blame you, 169 00:13:48.279 --> 00:13:54.480 and I don't understand why these why they keep muddling the water like this, 170 00:13:54.600 --> 00:14:00.639 and why they keep making statements that, especially like this one, that we 171 00:14:00.679 --> 00:14:05.759 already have information that counters from the Navy that counters this part that they didn't 172 00:14:05.799 --> 00:14:09.799 mean to release those videos. So it's it's very strange. It's really weird. 173 00:14:11.279 --> 00:14:13.279 But I think I just counted down to I think people are just not 174 00:14:13.360 --> 00:14:16.440 all in the same page, and over time, I think they will get 175 00:14:16.440 --> 00:14:20.440 on the same page. At least I'm hopeful. Do you think there's any 176 00:14:20.559 --> 00:14:26.519 do you think there's any possibility that there's someone is being fed disinformation in this 177 00:14:26.559 --> 00:14:31.840 whole thing to make it confusing like it is, or do you think it's 178 00:14:31.879 --> 00:14:39.799 just miscommunication? Well here and I believe this is an objective perspective, and 179 00:14:39.279 --> 00:14:46.519 I don't think that I'm being biased in that. Other people who are objective, 180 00:14:46.600 --> 00:14:50.519 despite you know, some criticism, are coming to the same conclusion. 181 00:14:52.120 --> 00:15:01.799 The waters are getting muddy by these the public affairs the part the public Affairs 182 00:15:01.840 --> 00:15:05.559 departments. At first, I think we were all like, who's telling the 183 00:15:05.559 --> 00:15:11.639 truth, what's going on? But what we've seen over time is that Elesando, 184 00:15:13.720 --> 00:15:18.600 the claims that he's made have been backed up by documents. Most of 185 00:15:18.639 --> 00:15:22.320 these documents were leaked by George Knapp, but they were confirmed to be real, 186 00:15:22.440 --> 00:15:28.679 either by the DoD themselves or by people involved with the DoD. So 187 00:15:28.720 --> 00:15:33.559 we see that at least lou has had a consistent record of being accurate and 188 00:15:33.720 --> 00:15:41.720 having people back him up on that. So I think that if there is 189 00:15:41.879 --> 00:15:48.120 disinformation, it's being introduced by the public affairs departments. And why is that? 190 00:15:48.600 --> 00:15:52.080 Is it that they're honestly getting it wrong? And they're making genuine mistakes, 191 00:15:52.639 --> 00:15:56.679 is that that they have been given wrong information and then they have to 192 00:15:56.759 --> 00:16:02.720 later correct themselves. At this point, because they have to keep correcting themselves, 193 00:16:02.960 --> 00:16:06.440 I mean, it's hurting their credibility. I don't know why anybody would 194 00:16:06.480 --> 00:16:10.480 kind of take their word for anything at this point, because they keep consistently 195 00:16:11.039 --> 00:16:15.840 being wrong, and I don't know why. I think it's probably you know, 196 00:16:15.000 --> 00:16:18.480 speaking of Greenwald, over the years, he's taught us this, He's 197 00:16:18.480 --> 00:16:25.559 shown us that these public affairs departments typically don't have the best information, even 198 00:16:25.600 --> 00:16:27.679 when he's taken documents he knows to exist and they say no, they don't 199 00:16:27.679 --> 00:16:30.879 exist, and he's like, well, look I've got it right here. 200 00:16:32.480 --> 00:16:34.600 I think that it's a difficult job. They don't have a lot of access 201 00:16:34.639 --> 00:16:40.679 to information. So I don't know if it's a genuine mistake or they're trying 202 00:16:40.679 --> 00:16:45.480 to muddy the waters because they just are not happy about being left out of 203 00:16:45.480 --> 00:16:49.159 the loop of the release of this information. Could be the latter. You 204 00:16:49.200 --> 00:16:55.200 know, our friend, our good friend Lee Spiegel's listening and he's just texting 205 00:16:55.240 --> 00:16:57.039 me a couple of things. His opinion is, you know, one hand 206 00:16:57.080 --> 00:17:03.600 doesn't know what the other hand, does and that's always been this way historically. 207 00:17:03.639 --> 00:17:07.440 No government wants to risk the negative feedback that will happen if they acknowledge 208 00:17:07.440 --> 00:17:12.559 the existence of UFOs. So that's Lee's opinion, So he just joined us. 209 00:17:14.200 --> 00:17:17.000 Yeah, I think that's up in there. Yeah, that these different 210 00:17:17.039 --> 00:17:19.079 departments they don't know what each other are doing. So, you know, 211 00:17:19.160 --> 00:17:22.400 I do feel for the Public Affairs Department because they're on the back foot and 212 00:17:22.440 --> 00:17:26.960 they're having to figure stuff out and it's probably frustrating for them, and they 213 00:17:27.039 --> 00:17:33.079 probably wish someone would have briefed them prior to all of this coming down. 214 00:17:33.519 --> 00:17:36.759 But to lose point, I think lu didn't want anybody to know he was 215 00:17:36.759 --> 00:17:41.319 going to share this information because he didn't want it to be shut down before 216 00:17:41.359 --> 00:17:45.200 he shared it. He wanted the public to get this information. I think 217 00:17:45.240 --> 00:17:48.279 that many of us appreciate that, and that this information is now out. 218 00:17:48.839 --> 00:17:53.640 So it's a tough situation, and that's what I ascribe it to. I 219 00:17:55.119 --> 00:18:03.160 don't personally see definitive proof that anybody is disinforming anyone, But if there is 220 00:18:03.279 --> 00:18:07.440 disinformation the group that's been wrong, it's the Public Affairs Department, So that's 221 00:18:07.480 --> 00:18:11.279 where it would be coming from but I couldn't see them wanting. I hope 222 00:18:11.279 --> 00:18:15.279 that that's not what they're doing. I think it's more along the lines of 223 00:18:15.319 --> 00:18:17.960 what Lee saying, and they're just not all on the same page, and 224 00:18:18.000 --> 00:18:22.519 hopefully over time they will get there. Right, Just to let you know 225 00:18:22.599 --> 00:18:26.480 that, Lee followed all that up with he's the only human that knows the 226 00:18:26.519 --> 00:18:30.759 truth? Who Lee? Yeah, Well, now he's claiming he's human, 227 00:18:30.799 --> 00:18:34.440 and I'm not so sure. I doubt that too. I've always had that 228 00:18:34.559 --> 00:18:38.359 feeling. Yeah, all right, Hey, Alejandro, thanks so much. 229 00:18:38.440 --> 00:18:41.799 I appreciate it, and thanks for hanging in. And we do have our 230 00:18:41.880 --> 00:18:48.119 guest on the line, and of course Lye wants me to plug the film 231 00:18:48.160 --> 00:18:55.000 the phenomenon you know, coming up. I did as Yeah, and he 232 00:18:55.079 --> 00:18:57.839 did a great presentation at the UFO Congress. He revealed for the first time 233 00:18:57.880 --> 00:19:03.400 a lot of what's in there at and we will be posting that video pretty 234 00:19:03.400 --> 00:19:07.240 soon here so everybody can see that on our video on demand. That's right, 235 00:19:07.720 --> 00:19:11.440 all right, Alejandro, thank you so much. I appreciate it. 236 00:19:11.720 --> 00:19:14.119 Thank you, Matty. Talk to you, Sam, talk to you soon. 237 00:19:14.519 --> 00:19:18.279 Okay, So we're not going to take a break at the time. 238 00:19:18.279 --> 00:19:19.240 We usually do. In a couple of minutes, we're going to go all 239 00:19:19.279 --> 00:19:26.440 the way to the six fifty five pm Eastern Standard time, so that's when 240 00:19:26.519 --> 00:19:27.839 our break will be. Just one break tonight, is what I'm getting at. 241 00:19:29.160 --> 00:19:33.559 So our guests, Rob Shelski, he's an avid and eclectic writer. 242 00:19:33.240 --> 00:19:37.480 Average it's about four thousand words a day. Wow, I wonder what Nick 243 00:19:37.559 --> 00:19:41.839 Redfern does. Must be somewhere around there. But anyway, he has a 244 00:19:41.880 --> 00:19:48.160 degree in science. He is. He has a show coming up on the 245 00:19:48.160 --> 00:19:52.079 Travel Channel. We can talk about that. He's actually the on camera expert. 246 00:19:53.279 --> 00:19:57.720 And welcome to the show, Rob, thanks for having me. I 247 00:19:57.720 --> 00:20:02.319 didn't think I was going to make If you're tonight, I know that's so 248 00:20:02.480 --> 00:20:06.599 weird. All your settings went haywire, but somehow you figured them out and 249 00:20:06.680 --> 00:20:10.160 here you are. Yeah, I rebooted everything. Too bad. We can't 250 00:20:10.160 --> 00:20:15.880 do that with our lives sometimes. Yeah, there's many times I've I've to 251 00:20:15.000 --> 00:20:18.880 do that. Yeah, just that one little mistake I want to change, 252 00:20:18.880 --> 00:20:22.240 you know. But anyway, welcome to the show. Can you tell the 253 00:20:22.359 --> 00:20:26.680 listening audience a little bit about your background and what got you interested in this 254 00:20:26.759 --> 00:20:32.599 topic? Sure, my background started when I was very young, was always 255 00:20:32.599 --> 00:20:37.079 interested in UFOs. I had a couple of odd experiences that way. My 256 00:20:37.119 --> 00:20:41.279 brother had one, which was kind of the turning point for me because when 257 00:20:41.279 --> 00:20:45.640 he told me about his it made me really think a lot more about UFOs 258 00:20:45.680 --> 00:20:49.559 and I began to research them. I was a journalist for Alien Skin magazine, 259 00:20:49.599 --> 00:20:55.240 investigative journalist and went on site to various locations. I was a mouf 260 00:20:55.240 --> 00:21:00.519 on field investigator. I've been investigating UFOs on my own now for about thirty 261 00:21:00.599 --> 00:21:03.960 years. And as I do research, I write books about what I find 262 00:21:04.000 --> 00:21:08.680 out, and quite a few books got published, to the point where now 263 00:21:10.400 --> 00:21:14.640 apparently they're considering me an on camera expert. But we'll see about that. 264 00:21:15.799 --> 00:21:18.599 Yeah, I heard, you know, I've I've had a lot of talks 265 00:21:18.640 --> 00:21:23.119 about you know. I was contacted from I think it was a history channel 266 00:21:23.160 --> 00:21:26.559 a while ago and they said, we would like to talk to you about 267 00:21:26.559 --> 00:21:30.400 finding us a UFO expert. And I said, well, if anyone claims 268 00:21:30.519 --> 00:21:36.079 or a UFO expert, run the other way. Absolutely. Yeah, I 269 00:21:36.119 --> 00:21:40.880 don't think, you know, I know that I know just as much about 270 00:21:40.920 --> 00:21:44.880 them or less than I did. You know, eight eight years ago, 271 00:21:45.160 --> 00:21:49.119 eight years ago when I started the show coming up. But I'm sorry you 272 00:21:49.240 --> 00:21:52.400 say you know just about the same amount as you did, any I think 273 00:21:52.400 --> 00:21:56.759 I know less? Oh well, you know it's kind of true the way, 274 00:21:56.799 --> 00:22:00.240 because every time you come up with another question, you're adding to the 275 00:22:00.480 --> 00:22:04.240 knowledge you don't have. And the more we learn about UFOs, the more 276 00:22:04.319 --> 00:22:08.920 questions we have Like that right now, Have you ever personally had a sighting 277 00:22:08.960 --> 00:22:12.400 of your own? Yes, I had a weird sighting, well, I 278 00:22:12.400 --> 00:22:17.200 can't really call it a sighting when I was about six in Australia. I 279 00:22:17.599 --> 00:22:21.039 woke up one night in an absolute panic and fear, and I walked into 280 00:22:21.079 --> 00:22:25.400 the hallway and I saw what looked like some kind of space person or creature 281 00:22:25.799 --> 00:22:27.559 looking at me through the back door. A hallway went straight from the front 282 00:22:27.559 --> 00:22:30.759 door to the back, and the back door had glass in it, and 283 00:22:30.960 --> 00:22:34.440 I panicked and I ran into my parents' room and told them what I was 284 00:22:34.480 --> 00:22:37.279 seeing, And of course my father goes, you're Joe having a nightmare. 285 00:22:37.279 --> 00:22:41.359 To go back to bed. But that has stuck with me all my life. 286 00:22:41.400 --> 00:22:45.599 That was no dream, whatever it was. So I've just decided that 287 00:22:45.880 --> 00:22:48.640 I was interested in UFOs after that and got into it all the more. 288 00:22:49.359 --> 00:22:56.279 Wow. So did you see any signs of any lights or anything like that 289 00:22:56.680 --> 00:23:00.720 or was it just whatever that being was? Oddly, at the time was 290 00:23:00.799 --> 00:23:04.079 when we had a full solar eclipse over Australia within like a day later, 291 00:23:04.599 --> 00:23:07.640 so I don't know if there's any connection there or not. Now since then, 292 00:23:07.680 --> 00:23:12.440 I have sent a UFO over Greensboro and being a move on field investigator, 293 00:23:12.440 --> 00:23:15.680 have been exposed to a lot of people and the sites where they said 294 00:23:15.680 --> 00:23:21.039 they saw things, and I would guess about five to seven percent are probably 295 00:23:21.680 --> 00:23:25.240 seeing something that is out of the ordinary. I certainly did. Again, 296 00:23:25.319 --> 00:23:27.519 it's like with you, you can sort of figure out what they're not, 297 00:23:29.079 --> 00:23:32.440 it's what they are that leaves you wondering. I mean, I looked at 298 00:23:32.480 --> 00:23:36.559 this thing for about gosh almost two minutes over Greensboro, and I had time 299 00:23:36.599 --> 00:23:40.119 to rule out a jet, a helicopter, dridgible, a drone, of 300 00:23:40.599 --> 00:23:42.680 air balloon, all of this stuff. So I know what it wasn't. 301 00:23:42.759 --> 00:23:48.279 I just don't know what it was other than it was an unidentified flying object. 302 00:23:48.279 --> 00:23:52.680 Well, you just reminded me that I just posted about an hour or 303 00:23:52.720 --> 00:23:57.119 so ago one of the interviews that I did out at the UFO Congress. 304 00:23:57.759 --> 00:24:02.839 I'm just letting people know that on YouTube if you want to check that out. 305 00:24:02.920 --> 00:24:08.440 And that's about the Victorian UFO Action Group. They were visiting the States. 306 00:24:08.480 --> 00:24:11.279 They went to Roswell, they went to Sokoro, and they went to 307 00:24:11.279 --> 00:24:15.839 the UFO Congress. So I sat down with I think about six of them 308 00:24:15.279 --> 00:24:19.480 and had a nice conversation. So check that out on YouTube. That's on 309 00:24:19.559 --> 00:24:23.799 Martin Willis Live Shows on YouTube. Also, it will be a podcast posted 310 00:24:25.480 --> 00:24:33.319 this coming week on our website for supporters only, so check that out anyway. 311 00:24:33.720 --> 00:24:36.640 So when did you move out of Australia. How old were you when 312 00:24:36.640 --> 00:24:38.440 you moved here to the States? Are you from? Were you born in 313 00:24:38.480 --> 00:24:41.720 Australia? No, I was born in Texas. My mother was Australian. 314 00:24:41.799 --> 00:24:45.240 We emigrated there. We came back when I was twelve. I lived in 315 00:24:45.279 --> 00:24:51.160 Texas about six weeks after I was born, so I don't really know Texas 316 00:24:51.160 --> 00:24:53.799 well. But yeah, I came back and slowly got more and more into 317 00:24:53.839 --> 00:24:57.799 the whole thing. Lived in San Diego, went to university in Canada, 318 00:24:57.880 --> 00:25:03.240 San Diego State. But all through this the UFO process kept slowly developing. 319 00:25:03.279 --> 00:25:07.440 For me, there was a sighting over San Diego. Fifty thousand people saw 320 00:25:07.440 --> 00:25:11.359 it at the San Diego Stadium arena, and so I wasn't the only one. 321 00:25:11.440 --> 00:25:14.880 But whatever it was, we don't know. It was a mystery space 322 00:25:14.880 --> 00:25:18.839 object was the headlines in the newspaper. And then I saw the UFO in 323 00:25:18.880 --> 00:25:23.799 Greensboro, and my brother has missing time. So I just sort of gradually 324 00:25:23.799 --> 00:25:27.599 fell into all of this. And if anyone asks me do I believe in 325 00:25:27.680 --> 00:25:30.480 UFOs, I say no, I don't believe in them. I think there's 326 00:25:30.599 --> 00:25:34.000 enough evidence to suppose they actually exist. It's like saying you believe in a 327 00:25:34.000 --> 00:25:37.839 refrigerator, or don't believe what you believe or not they're there. Yeah, 328 00:25:37.880 --> 00:25:42.039 my friend Sam Moronto is really big on that, exactly what you're saying, 329 00:25:44.400 --> 00:25:48.640 and you know, he always cringes when someone says or asked him if he 330 00:25:48.799 --> 00:25:53.119 if he believes in UFOs. Kind of goes along that same line. So 331 00:25:55.000 --> 00:25:59.200 you're here in the States, and when was this at the stadium in San 332 00:25:59.240 --> 00:26:03.480 Diego that you're talking about. Oh, that was back in the early seventies, 333 00:26:03.519 --> 00:26:07.200 I believe, And then the Greensboro's siding was two years ago. And 334 00:26:07.880 --> 00:26:11.359 okay, yeah, so that one was more recent. I don't think they're 335 00:26:11.359 --> 00:26:15.319 singing me out. Maybe they are. Maybe they're singing out my family because 336 00:26:15.319 --> 00:26:21.480 again my brother has missing time and so it is his friend and they don't 337 00:26:21.519 --> 00:26:23.279 know if they were abducted or not because they've never gone through any kind of 338 00:26:23.319 --> 00:26:29.079 hypnosis. I kind of warned him against that. Yeah, that's that's a 339 00:26:29.119 --> 00:26:36.319 double edged sword. And speaking of that, Calvin Parker from the Pascagoula incident, 340 00:26:36.720 --> 00:26:38.000 we're in touch all the time now. Of course I met him out 341 00:26:40.000 --> 00:26:44.880 out in Phoenix and he's been on the show a number of times. So 342 00:26:44.960 --> 00:26:48.279 Calvin just was regressed. He just went through regression therapy. And that's going 343 00:26:48.319 --> 00:26:53.000 to be transcribed. If anyone's following that, you can check out Phil Mantle's 344 00:26:53.319 --> 00:26:57.839 website, I'm sorry, Phil Mantle's Facebook page. He's going to put the 345 00:26:57.880 --> 00:27:03.400 transcription of the which I think is very daring of Calvin Parker. He's going 346 00:27:03.400 --> 00:27:10.279 to post that transcription at some point. Regression therapy. Yeah, I understand 347 00:27:10.319 --> 00:27:12.240 it can be scary, and you know, people like I've mentioned as before, 348 00:27:14.079 --> 00:27:18.480 Travis Walton said he went he did it once, he would never do 349 00:27:18.559 --> 00:27:22.000 it again, And a lot of people are scared, you know, by 350 00:27:22.200 --> 00:27:25.359 what they may find out. They don't want to know, and things are 351 00:27:25.440 --> 00:27:30.039 better off just the way they are. So I know there's a you know, 352 00:27:30.079 --> 00:27:33.920 there's a there's some people that can do a really nice job, and 353 00:27:33.359 --> 00:27:40.200 some people that may lead someone along. But what what was your thoughts when 354 00:27:40.240 --> 00:27:45.160 you told your brother that? When I told him about the hypnotism? Yeah, 355 00:27:45.160 --> 00:27:48.880 well yeah, he wanted to know why, and I said, well, 356 00:27:48.960 --> 00:27:52.720 the definition of hypnotism is the power of suggestion, and unless you have 357 00:27:52.799 --> 00:27:59.079 an extremely well qualified hypnotist, they can plant false memories that you then when 358 00:27:59.119 --> 00:28:00.960 you wake up, believe are real and you think of them as real from 359 00:28:00.960 --> 00:28:06.039 that point forward. All they have to do is say something like tell us 360 00:28:06.039 --> 00:28:10.599 about your UFO experiences, and that plans the suggestion and the human mind, 361 00:28:11.000 --> 00:28:15.400 according psychologists, is very flexible and quite willing to make up any fabricated stories 362 00:28:15.440 --> 00:28:18.079 you like to please you. But unfortunately, then when you wake up, 363 00:28:18.079 --> 00:28:22.519 you remember them as being real. But that is the power of suggestion. 364 00:28:22.599 --> 00:28:25.319 They can make you believe you're a chicken or a dog or a cat, 365 00:28:25.440 --> 00:28:27.440 or they can make you believe you had memories of something you didn't have. 366 00:28:27.839 --> 00:28:36.599 This has also been a problem with reincarnation regression as well. Interesting. Interesting, 367 00:28:36.720 --> 00:28:40.920 So can you tell us did you already describe the sighting you had in 368 00:28:40.960 --> 00:28:45.440 Greensboro or was that that wasn't when you described yet? Right? No, 369 00:28:45.640 --> 00:28:49.839 it was a silver orb shaped craft. At first, I thought it was 370 00:28:49.880 --> 00:28:53.240 the nose of a jet because there was some clouds in the sky. Well, 371 00:28:53.359 --> 00:28:56.319 just the nose of a jet. I was stopped at a stoplight and 372 00:28:56.359 --> 00:28:59.920 I was a move on field investigator at the time, and I thought, 373 00:29:00.279 --> 00:29:02.960 Okay, that's just a jet coming out from clouds. But it wasn't. 374 00:29:02.960 --> 00:29:06.119 It came out of the clouds and it was like a silver orb. And 375 00:29:06.160 --> 00:29:11.759 then right away my so called professionalism kicked in and I began to try to 376 00:29:11.799 --> 00:29:14.559 find out what it wasn't so I could kind of pin what it was. 377 00:29:14.920 --> 00:29:18.599 Unfortunately, my phone was dead so I couldn't take any pictures. And my 378 00:29:18.640 --> 00:29:21.319 state director asked me. She said, why did you report it? Robert 379 00:29:21.359 --> 00:29:22.160 said, no, I didn't report it. She said why. I said, 380 00:29:22.839 --> 00:29:27.440 We're getting reports of UFOs by the thousands every year. Just knowing that 381 00:29:27.640 --> 00:29:32.960 someone else saw another UFO doesn't really add significantly to our database other than the 382 00:29:33.000 --> 00:29:36.559 location in the time, which I said, is a valid thing to add. 383 00:29:36.920 --> 00:29:40.799 But we have tons of data now over decades and decades. We need 384 00:29:40.839 --> 00:29:45.599 to start utilizing the data to get some answers. And how would you think 385 00:29:45.640 --> 00:29:48.839 that? What does that look like to you? Well, it takes extensive 386 00:29:48.839 --> 00:29:52.200 research. Move On has a huge database which I had access to for quite 387 00:29:52.200 --> 00:29:55.880 a while. And what you start doing is trying to cross relate things. 388 00:29:56.200 --> 00:29:59.480 Where are the hot spots? Are there hot spots? Are their patterns to 389 00:29:59.519 --> 00:30:02.519 this? Are there areas that could see more UFOs than not? Of course 390 00:30:02.559 --> 00:30:03.960 we know that there are, but is there anything more to it? You? 391 00:30:04.039 --> 00:30:08.119 More specific? Are UFO sightings on the rise? What type of UFOs 392 00:30:08.119 --> 00:30:12.200 are we seeing? Is it more triangles and less cylinders, less flying saucer 393 00:30:12.200 --> 00:30:17.240 types. There's so much information we could find out. We could probably find 394 00:30:17.319 --> 00:30:22.480 trends and we could probably ascertain quite a bit about what their capabilities are. 395 00:30:22.680 --> 00:30:26.400 There's been enough sightings, film and photos legitimate once I'm not talking about the 396 00:30:26.400 --> 00:30:30.400 hoaxes, of course, the photoshops where we should be able to start using 397 00:30:30.400 --> 00:30:33.920 the statia to arrive at some answers. And that's why I'm in this business. 398 00:30:33.000 --> 00:30:37.039 I want answers. Now, you said, that you've been at this 399 00:30:37.200 --> 00:30:42.279 for about thirty years, I seem to have noticed that there's a lot more 400 00:30:42.319 --> 00:30:48.000 triangles. Maybe it's just that there's maybe I just hear about it more. 401 00:30:48.240 --> 00:30:53.039 But have you seen over the years like a change in what people are claiming 402 00:30:53.079 --> 00:30:56.680 they see. Yes, definitely, triangles are really on the rise and have 403 00:30:56.799 --> 00:31:02.960 been. They first started seeing around late nineteen eighties, early nineteen nineties along 404 00:31:03.000 --> 00:31:06.000 the Husband River Valley, a vast, silent triangle about the size of a 405 00:31:06.039 --> 00:31:08.559 football field hovered over a house, made almost no noise at all, and 406 00:31:08.599 --> 00:31:11.839 if it had any noises, like a low hum, and it did have 407 00:31:11.920 --> 00:31:15.519 lights underneath it. And from that point forward, and actually I went up 408 00:31:15.519 --> 00:31:19.519 to the area of Pine Bush, New York and camped out there for a 409 00:31:19.559 --> 00:31:22.839 number of days in the hopes of spotting some UFOs. Unfortunately, and that 410 00:31:22.920 --> 00:31:26.400 trip I did not golf breeze. Yes, I did see one. So 411 00:31:27.039 --> 00:31:33.319 but I do take these investigatory trips abroad to England for a superstorm of UFOs, 412 00:31:33.400 --> 00:31:37.480 pine Bush golf breeze, Florida, anywhere where there seems to be a 413 00:31:37.559 --> 00:31:41.599 large number of sidings, I'll go to check it out. What's your idea 414 00:31:41.720 --> 00:31:48.680 on why there are hot spots. Well, the data seems to show that 415 00:31:48.720 --> 00:31:52.279 they do, like military bases, nuclear power plants, that sort of thing. 416 00:31:53.599 --> 00:31:59.279 However, we seem to be seeing them all over the place, and 417 00:31:59.720 --> 00:32:02.440 the yes sightings are on the rise. Some psychiatrists felt that it was the 418 00:32:02.559 --> 00:32:07.640 fear and anxiety of the Cold War that caused many people to think they saw 419 00:32:07.960 --> 00:32:12.000 a UFO when they didn't, and it was like a Cold War hysteria. 420 00:32:12.079 --> 00:32:15.079 So they felt that once the Cold War was over, these whould drop off. 421 00:32:15.319 --> 00:32:19.160 The reverses happened. These number of settings have gone up and almost on 422 00:32:19.160 --> 00:32:22.319 an annual basis. Partly it's because people have more phones, they're becoming more 423 00:32:22.319 --> 00:32:25.519 aware of it. They've got more cameras with those phones, so we're getting 424 00:32:25.519 --> 00:32:30.400 a lot more input now. Whereas before people would see one but didn't have 425 00:32:30.400 --> 00:32:32.720 a camera handy, you know, because they didn't have phone cameras. So 426 00:32:32.759 --> 00:32:36.799 but now they do and they're taking pictures and with that evidence, they're willing 427 00:32:36.839 --> 00:32:39.640 to report it. You know. I can't remember who it was. I 428 00:32:39.680 --> 00:32:44.319 think it was a set shot stack from Setti. By the way, he's 429 00:32:44.319 --> 00:32:47.480 going to be on hopefully next month if all goes well. We're going to 430 00:32:47.559 --> 00:32:53.000 be talking actually UFOs. But he said something like, why don't we have, 431 00:32:54.319 --> 00:32:59.319 with all the millions of cell phones camera, you know, camera taking 432 00:32:59.319 --> 00:33:02.559 cell phones in everybody's pocket, why don't we have a really good clear picture 433 00:33:04.240 --> 00:33:08.400 of a UFO? And to me, when I see a really clear picture, 434 00:33:08.839 --> 00:33:13.279 the first thing I think of a CGI or something. But so, 435 00:33:13.519 --> 00:33:19.720 what would be your answer to someone like Seth Shostack on that question. Well, 436 00:33:19.720 --> 00:33:22.599 first of all, it's you're not expecting to ever see a UFOs, 437 00:33:22.640 --> 00:33:24.960 so you have to see one. You have to react. I have to 438 00:33:24.960 --> 00:33:28.839 grab your phone, you have to turn it on, you have to quickly 439 00:33:28.839 --> 00:33:32.599 focus. And frankly, camera phones are not the best for taking pictures. 440 00:33:32.640 --> 00:33:37.920 They want to do everything automatically, so they tend to fuzzy the picture. 441 00:33:37.160 --> 00:33:39.759 They're trying to focus on the background, and this thing can be so far 442 00:33:39.799 --> 00:33:44.240 away that they simply don't want to focus on, so the picture often comes 443 00:33:44.240 --> 00:33:49.599 out fuzzy. However, I've seen some pretty darn good evidence of UFOs, 444 00:33:49.680 --> 00:33:52.839 and our photo analysts that move on certainly have determined that many of them are 445 00:33:52.880 --> 00:33:59.839 real and not touched up or photoshopped. I have a conversation with Mark dan 446 00:34:00.000 --> 00:34:04.960 Conio, who's actually now he's a you know, MUFON's photo and video analysts. 447 00:34:05.039 --> 00:34:07.279 A lot of people don't like him. They think he's a debunker. 448 00:34:07.759 --> 00:34:12.360 I like Mark. He's a character and he's you know, basically says that 449 00:34:12.440 --> 00:34:15.159 there's only been a couple of photos that he thinks, you know, maybe 450 00:34:15.239 --> 00:34:21.840 really can be something. He is really good at figuring out what is not. 451 00:34:22.559 --> 00:34:24.440 Just like you said earlier in your conversation, you know what something is 452 00:34:24.480 --> 00:34:30.559 not, you know, I you know, I showed him something one time 453 00:34:30.599 --> 00:34:34.400 I thought for sure was a mistaken picture that I took, and right away 454 00:34:34.480 --> 00:34:37.599 he said, it looks like something was on your window. So sure enough, 455 00:34:37.599 --> 00:34:40.840 I went into my car window and I looked at the angle where I 456 00:34:40.880 --> 00:34:45.159 took the picture, and there was a little tiny piece of grass sitting on 457 00:34:45.199 --> 00:34:51.880 the window that looked like a perfect disc. So that can happen. But 458 00:34:52.079 --> 00:34:57.079 anyway, you know, I gotta tell you you just mentioned about how difficult 459 00:34:57.119 --> 00:35:00.679 phones can be or not that good. But I was out in my front 460 00:35:00.719 --> 00:35:07.159 yard on the water and a bald ego came in and landed like twenty five 461 00:35:07.239 --> 00:35:09.920 feet away from me in the water and grabbed a big fish and I'm fumbling 462 00:35:09.960 --> 00:35:15.360 and fumbling with my phone, and by the time I actually got the photo 463 00:35:15.480 --> 00:35:20.199 whatever it's called the app open, he was already gone. He'd already dragged 464 00:35:20.280 --> 00:35:23.079 up exactly. And also, if that bird was flying away from you at 465 00:35:23.119 --> 00:35:28.800 any speed, your camera would be trying to constantly be focused on a vanishing 466 00:35:28.880 --> 00:35:31.800 dot, and it's very hard for these automated cameras to do that. They 467 00:35:31.840 --> 00:35:36.639 want to focus on a wider field if they can, and they do have 468 00:35:36.679 --> 00:35:40.440 their problems. They also been noted for causing orbs. The slightest duscimo and 469 00:35:40.480 --> 00:35:44.880 a digital camera will pick it up and turn it into an ORB. And 470 00:35:45.159 --> 00:35:46.840 I've had that happened to me. I had a new house, but walked 471 00:35:46.840 --> 00:35:51.079 in, took some pictures I didn't see the orbs came out and all my 472 00:35:51.079 --> 00:35:52.880 photos were loaded with these little orbs all over the place. Turned out there 473 00:35:52.920 --> 00:35:59.559 were dusimos from the construction people. So and on a investigation of a haunted 474 00:35:59.559 --> 00:36:04.039 mansion in Ohio, I thought I had ectoplasm caught in one film. It 475 00:36:04.119 --> 00:36:07.079 was my own breath, quite good on camera. It was a cold light. 476 00:36:08.239 --> 00:36:12.559 So again you have to be so careful. But Moufon is extremely careful. 477 00:36:12.599 --> 00:36:15.320 We rule out about ninety five percent of all of the reports. I 478 00:36:15.400 --> 00:36:19.599 have had reports that were really darned good reports, but because they took place 479 00:36:19.639 --> 00:36:24.199 near an airport or a private airport, I've had to discount them. And 480 00:36:24.199 --> 00:36:28.960 and and my state director here said, well, you don't think it happens, 481 00:36:29.000 --> 00:36:30.440 so I think it probably happened to right, It probably is the way 482 00:36:30.440 --> 00:36:36.360 she described it, But because of mitigating circumstances, I can't say that this 483 00:36:36.440 --> 00:36:38.719 was a genuine UFO she saw. It could have been other things. And 484 00:36:38.760 --> 00:36:43.159 whenever it could have been other things, we just say it was and then 485 00:36:43.199 --> 00:36:49.079 we don't count it as in the UFO count. You know, the landing 486 00:36:49.159 --> 00:36:51.880 lights, you know they're coming at you, their big bright lights. You 487 00:36:52.000 --> 00:36:55.760 kind of have to discount for the most part, unless there's really strange activity. 488 00:36:57.320 --> 00:36:59.800 When you're seeing a light in the sky, A lot of times it's 489 00:36:59.840 --> 00:37:02.599 just the lightness guy, you know. So, well, that's true, 490 00:37:02.800 --> 00:37:06.079 and it could be a satellite going our head. It could be a plane 491 00:37:06.079 --> 00:37:07.559 in the distance, could be a helicopter, could be a drone. These 492 00:37:07.639 --> 00:37:13.360 days, right, yeah, we have we have a lot to a lot 493 00:37:13.400 --> 00:37:16.920 to look out for, you know, Uh, Chinese lanterns, you name 494 00:37:16.960 --> 00:37:22.639 it, where you know you can be fooled real quickly. And U and 495 00:37:22.920 --> 00:37:25.320 drones. I don't think they're going to be going away. Um, so 496 00:37:25.360 --> 00:37:30.039 we really have to keep in mind when we see these things. Now, 497 00:37:30.079 --> 00:37:34.840 I'm sure you've been following, you know what's happened since I know you really 498 00:37:34.840 --> 00:37:37.360 didn't hear much of the conversation with Aljandro and I. But what's been happening 499 00:37:37.360 --> 00:37:45.559 since the Pentagon admitted they we're looking into the UFO field, our UFOs in 500 00:37:45.559 --> 00:37:52.719 general, or some type of aerial threats And it's been an easier topic to 501 00:37:52.760 --> 00:37:54.920 talk about. What's your what's your thoughts on that? Well? I think 502 00:37:54.920 --> 00:38:00.519 it's the current flavor of the month kind of thing. I think it's compelling. 503 00:38:00.800 --> 00:38:05.199 I think it again, we don't know a lot about it, but 504 00:38:05.239 --> 00:38:07.199 what we do know tells us some of what we don't know. We know 505 00:38:07.320 --> 00:38:13.800 that the Navy was highly interested in the Nimits incidents. Of course, we 506 00:38:13.840 --> 00:38:16.880 do know that the commander of the six jets that when the squadron said, 507 00:38:16.880 --> 00:38:21.440 this thing looked like a giant Dick tac, had no apparent proposal system or 508 00:38:21.480 --> 00:38:24.159 wings. It was like a white, featureless cylinder, but it could outmaneuver 509 00:38:24.280 --> 00:38:29.079 his jets if they were standing still. According to him, you do have 510 00:38:29.159 --> 00:38:31.480 some ground to air radar, just as we did in Belgium. These things 511 00:38:31.480 --> 00:38:36.920 are real. I mean, they're not our imagination. They're not geese flying 512 00:38:36.920 --> 00:38:40.599 across the sky or someone misinterpreting something. These are trained observers. These people 513 00:38:40.639 --> 00:38:45.440 do this for a living. We have policemen, we have military personnel. 514 00:38:45.480 --> 00:38:50.519 We have pilots, both commercial and military, who have all claimed on numerous 515 00:38:50.519 --> 00:38:53.519 occasions they have spotted UFOs, with witnesses to go with it, including some 516 00:38:54.639 --> 00:39:00.159 of the control towers seeing them on radar as well. We have people have 517 00:39:00.280 --> 00:39:02.840 died from encounters with the UFOs, So if their imagination, how the heck 518 00:39:02.880 --> 00:39:07.559 does that happen. We've had people injured in the hundreds, We've had property 519 00:39:07.639 --> 00:39:12.639 damage. This has been going on at least since nineteen forty seven, and 520 00:39:12.639 --> 00:39:15.760 if you look at it historically, apparently it's been going on for centuries. 521 00:39:15.760 --> 00:39:20.880 Can you tell us about any of the cases that you personally investigated that you 522 00:39:20.920 --> 00:39:23.800 thought were compelling. Well, actually we're not really. You know, we 523 00:39:23.800 --> 00:39:29.719 are supposed to keep it as anonymous as possible, but they ranged from the 524 00:39:30.119 --> 00:39:34.599 mundane where someone saw a strange light in the sky and took a picture of 525 00:39:34.639 --> 00:39:38.280 it, to where they saw silvery objects that danced about the sky and had 526 00:39:38.320 --> 00:39:44.960 some video. I've had other cases where one woman says she wrestled with a 527 00:39:45.000 --> 00:39:47.599 gray alien in her bedroom. I never saw uphone anything, but this thing 528 00:39:47.679 --> 00:39:52.280 was attacking her and she tried to choke it to death. Wow, and 529 00:39:52.400 --> 00:39:57.480 she was a minister. But I mean, you get you run the whole 530 00:39:57.519 --> 00:40:00.960 gam and of course you have to sit there and you have to listen with 531 00:40:00.000 --> 00:40:05.800 an open mind because you don't know what anything and everything is capable of. 532 00:40:05.880 --> 00:40:07.679 So I try to keep an open mind and listen to it. But then 533 00:40:07.719 --> 00:40:10.199 I kind of have to discount it because number one, it wasn't a u 534 00:40:10.199 --> 00:40:15.960 of O sighting, and number two, the woman's didn't strike me as incredibly 535 00:40:15.000 --> 00:40:20.440 stable, and so therefore when I wrote it up, I said, not 536 00:40:20.559 --> 00:40:24.679 a sighting. So that must be kind of difficult to make a judgment, 537 00:40:25.599 --> 00:40:29.960 and I don't like doing it. I'd rather just have reported the information without 538 00:40:30.039 --> 00:40:34.199 having to do that final step of what I have determined whether it is because 539 00:40:34.239 --> 00:40:37.880 that determine is where it goes in the database or not as a genuine sighting. 540 00:40:38.559 --> 00:40:43.559 And I don't know this woman. Who am I to make a judgment 541 00:40:43.559 --> 00:40:46.920 calling er after just one meeting and a couple of phone conversations, Right, 542 00:40:47.920 --> 00:40:52.639 how many would you say, if you could kind of figure a calculation for 543 00:40:52.679 --> 00:40:58.320 the things that you've looked at, end up being's what they call an unknown 544 00:40:58.320 --> 00:41:01.679 and move on. Well, quite a few are unknown. I would say 545 00:41:01.719 --> 00:41:06.920 that only about something. They're saying five percent on average, but mine was 546 00:41:06.960 --> 00:41:10.079 more like seven or eight percent. Seemed to have been genuine UFO settings that 547 00:41:10.119 --> 00:41:15.199 people were reporting. There was enough evidence to suppose that they were seeing something 548 00:41:15.239 --> 00:41:19.719 that wasn't. Everything else had been discounted that it could be. I mean, 549 00:41:19.719 --> 00:41:22.280 when we do an investigation, we go out to the actual site, 550 00:41:22.280 --> 00:41:24.039 We walked the grounds, We look for any physical evidence on the ground. 551 00:41:24.400 --> 00:41:28.679 We check all the weather records for that day. We know if it was 552 00:41:28.719 --> 00:41:31.519 cloudy, how windy it was. We check air flight patterns out of the 553 00:41:31.559 --> 00:41:36.360 local airports, international airports to make sure it couldn't have been anything at that 554 00:41:36.400 --> 00:41:39.159 at that given time and moment. So we're really pretty thorough about it when 555 00:41:39.199 --> 00:41:45.039 we do these investigations, right, Right, And I think there's there's now 556 00:41:45.119 --> 00:41:49.920 some apps too that help, you know, an iPhone apps that actually help 557 00:41:49.960 --> 00:41:52.800 out with investigation. From what I understand, yes, there are. We 558 00:41:53.199 --> 00:41:59.800 prefer that the observer of the incident doesn't use those. We prefer to get 559 00:41:59.800 --> 00:42:02.800 the unsullied, if you know what I mean. Not having spoken to many 560 00:42:02.840 --> 00:42:07.760 people first, because every time a person tells this story embellishes. One woman 561 00:42:07.760 --> 00:42:10.840 who saw UFO started off by saying she saw it for about five or six 562 00:42:10.920 --> 00:42:15.519 seconds. By the end of our conversation, she'd seen it for approximately four 563 00:42:15.519 --> 00:42:21.280 minutes. So you know, things changed as they tell it to you, 564 00:42:21.719 --> 00:42:25.000 right right. And you know you mentioned your brother and his friend had missing 565 00:42:25.000 --> 00:42:30.360 time, and that's that's such a bizarre thing. That's almost like someone could 566 00:42:30.360 --> 00:42:34.880 do a show on that alone. That was critical. That was critical to 567 00:42:34.960 --> 00:42:37.400 my getting involved in all of this. That was the I always had a 568 00:42:37.440 --> 00:42:42.079 strong interest in the paranormal, had already been reading and researching it. But 569 00:42:42.199 --> 00:42:45.599 when my brother finally told me this twenty years or so or more after it 570 00:42:45.679 --> 00:42:52.079 happened, I was absolutely flabbergasted. Because my brother was unimpeachable. My brother 571 00:42:52.159 --> 00:42:53.920 is no liar, and neither was his friend John. I'd grown up with 572 00:42:54.000 --> 00:42:59.119 them nearby. You know, I knew them, and I mean John, 573 00:42:59.159 --> 00:43:01.559 and I knew my brother Mike, and I know for a fact that he 574 00:43:01.599 --> 00:43:06.920 wasn't lying. In fact, he just was watching television one night and the 575 00:43:07.000 --> 00:43:09.800 memory came back of seeing a red light in the sky over the desert when 576 00:43:09.800 --> 00:43:14.159 he and his friend John were camping out. It was about midnight, and 577 00:43:14.159 --> 00:43:15.320 he said, you know, that looks like it came down near us. 578 00:43:15.320 --> 00:43:17.639 Should we go investigate? And John goes, yeah, let's do it. 579 00:43:17.960 --> 00:43:22.440 That's the last thing they remember. The next thing they remember is striking camp 580 00:43:22.440 --> 00:43:25.280 in the morning and John's father picking him up at about nine am and they 581 00:43:25.360 --> 00:43:29.519 left. Now, they never spoke about it at all, never said hey, 582 00:43:29.519 --> 00:43:30.960 how about that red light? Nothing, absolutely nothing. They had no 583 00:43:31.039 --> 00:43:35.559 memory of it. And so my brother moved to Vegas, John stayed in 584 00:43:35.599 --> 00:43:38.199 San Diego, and then my brother remembered it. He called Johnny said do 585 00:43:38.199 --> 00:43:40.760 you remember this? And John goes, well, I do. Now I 586 00:43:40.800 --> 00:43:44.800 hadn't kill this moment. He said, well what happened to us? And 587 00:43:45.199 --> 00:43:47.800 John said I don't know. But they were so compelling for them that John 588 00:43:47.920 --> 00:43:51.679 sold his house in San Diego, took his wife and kids and moved to 589 00:43:51.760 --> 00:43:54.480 Las Vegas to be near my brother who was living near Nella's Air Force Base 590 00:43:54.599 --> 00:44:00.079 in Ant Area fifty one at the time, and they spent years researching this 591 00:44:00.119 --> 00:44:02.840 and getting heavily involved into it, and then abruptly my brother dropped it all. 592 00:44:04.280 --> 00:44:06.599 Perhaps he wanted nothing. I want to do with it. Do you 593 00:44:06.719 --> 00:44:08.239 know why? Did he say? Why? Yeah? Well, no, 594 00:44:08.679 --> 00:44:13.239 well, yes and no. It was pretty obvious he was scared that he 595 00:44:13.320 --> 00:44:16.519 felt it was going in a very negative, dark direction. So I asked 596 00:44:16.559 --> 00:44:20.079 him, I said, Mike, on your deathbed, if you could have 597 00:44:20.119 --> 00:44:23.800 the answers, would you like to know? And he said it depends. 598 00:44:24.079 --> 00:44:27.559 And I said on what, whether the answers are good or bad? He 599 00:44:27.599 --> 00:44:30.960 said yes exactly. I said, so you'd rather die unknowing? He said 600 00:44:30.079 --> 00:44:34.400 yes, I just want to have what's left in my life and peace and 601 00:44:34.480 --> 00:44:37.280 quiet, and I don't want to know any more about any of this. 602 00:44:37.639 --> 00:44:42.719 I totally get that. Yeah, I mean you can imagine that, you 603 00:44:42.760 --> 00:44:45.639 know, if you'd been through what he'd been through. So, I mean, 604 00:44:45.639 --> 00:44:47.559 he did have an implant that was gouged out, he did have a 605 00:44:47.599 --> 00:44:52.440 scoop mark. I have no doubt that he was probably abducted, although he 606 00:44:52.800 --> 00:44:54.400 will not say that, and I will not say that because we do not 607 00:44:54.559 --> 00:45:00.639 have evidence, and I'm an evidence kind of guy. Okay, well we 608 00:45:00.679 --> 00:45:05.639 have. Let's say we have about five minutes left. So I did want 609 00:45:05.639 --> 00:45:08.159 to talk. I listened to you on another show and I wanted to. 610 00:45:08.719 --> 00:45:12.159 I don't want to say I want to debate you, but I just wanted 611 00:45:12.199 --> 00:45:17.320 to. I wanted to challenge you a little bit on you. I think 612 00:45:17.320 --> 00:45:22.400 you've written a couple of books about you have a theory that the moon may 613 00:45:22.400 --> 00:45:24.679 be hollow, so I wanted to wanted to talk a little bit about that 614 00:45:25.280 --> 00:45:30.159 in the five or so minutes we have for sure break well. It started 615 00:45:30.159 --> 00:45:32.119 when I was on Coast to Coast radio. George Nor asked me when I 616 00:45:32.159 --> 00:45:35.880 thought of the hollow moon theory, and I laughed and said, not much. 617 00:45:36.519 --> 00:45:37.320 I think it's silly. The moon's there, it's in the sky, 618 00:45:37.440 --> 00:45:42.440 pulls our ties. It's not all. And then I started investigating. It 619 00:45:42.519 --> 00:45:49.079 just tweaked my imagination and the evidence I found, although not conclusive, is 620 00:45:49.079 --> 00:45:52.800 certainly intriguing. I mean, we have no good theory for the origin of 621 00:45:52.840 --> 00:45:54.800 the moon, not even now with the impact theory there's a lot of things 622 00:45:54.800 --> 00:45:59.079 wrong with it. There's a lot of oddities about the Moon. It's density, 623 00:45:59.119 --> 00:46:01.079 it's too low for its size, and yet the rock seems to be 624 00:46:01.159 --> 00:46:05.039 made of the same material as our rock here on Earth. Here it's mantle. 625 00:46:05.519 --> 00:46:07.320 So if it's the same material and the Moon's as large as it is, 626 00:46:07.360 --> 00:46:12.760 where's the missing mass. It has to be taken from somewhere. So 627 00:46:12.800 --> 00:46:15.760 it's either got large caverns or it's hollow. Several scientists, including a couple 628 00:46:15.760 --> 00:46:20.800 of NASA I've quoted them in my book, literally say it's easier to explain 629 00:46:20.840 --> 00:46:24.039 the non existence of the Moon than to explain its existence. And another one 630 00:46:24.079 --> 00:46:29.559 said the way the size and graps left on the moon recorded moonquakes seem to 631 00:46:29.599 --> 00:46:35.840 show that the Moon either had a very strange core that doesn't allow seismic waves 632 00:46:35.880 --> 00:46:39.000 to travel through it, which is very bizarre, or it's hollow. It 633 00:46:39.079 --> 00:46:43.519 raises the frightening question that the Moon may be hollow. And this goes on 634 00:46:43.559 --> 00:46:45.679 and on, and then it was too Soviet scientists who came out with the 635 00:46:45.719 --> 00:46:50.159 idea of the spaceship moon theory in the seventies. They were members of the 636 00:46:50.159 --> 00:46:54.280 Soviet Science Academy. So there's big names involved here, McDonald of NASA and 637 00:46:54.320 --> 00:47:00.440 all sorts of others. Vassin Scherbakoff, all these people have talked about this 638 00:47:00.760 --> 00:47:05.880 and delved into it, and they've come up with some very reasonable scenarios. 639 00:47:06.880 --> 00:47:08.800 The big craters on the Moon are shallow, the small ones are deep, 640 00:47:08.880 --> 00:47:13.159 as if there was an inner shell that was making the big meteorites bounce back 641 00:47:13.239 --> 00:47:16.360 up. The layers on the Moon the top three layers of soil and reverse 642 00:47:16.519 --> 00:47:21.039 order, with the densest being on top and the lightest being three layers down. 643 00:47:21.639 --> 00:47:24.760 We can't come that would that have anything to do with atmosphere or gravity. 644 00:47:25.159 --> 00:47:30.960 That would have to do anything that has gravity will have the densest material 645 00:47:30.079 --> 00:47:34.119 in the center and the lightest material on the surface. Throw a bunch of 646 00:47:34.119 --> 00:47:36.440 different types of soil into a glass of water, shake it up really good 647 00:47:36.440 --> 00:47:38.239 and let it settle. You'll see all sorts of layers. The densists are 648 00:47:38.280 --> 00:47:43.000 always at the bottom. But I'm thinking up a helium three, which I 649 00:47:43.000 --> 00:47:45.840 know there's a lot of on the Moon. Isn't that like more toward the 650 00:47:45.920 --> 00:47:49.800 surface, and then that like a lider material it's on the Moon and it 651 00:47:49.920 --> 00:47:52.559 is helium three, and it is a lighter material, and it is not 652 00:47:52.679 --> 00:47:57.519 atmospheric. It's not gaseous in nature. But so there is no atmosphere in 653 00:47:57.519 --> 00:48:00.039 the Moon to speak of. In fact, when the Apollo Moon landed and 654 00:48:00.159 --> 00:48:04.840 jettisoned its tanks, it actually incrementally gave the Moon a tiny bit of atmosphere. 655 00:48:05.079 --> 00:48:07.760 It was big at the time because it's so close to a vacuum. 656 00:48:07.119 --> 00:48:12.440 But we also have strange lights on the Moon. We over a NASA commissioned 657 00:48:12.519 --> 00:48:15.639 report over the last five hundred years and it's still going on right now. 658 00:48:15.960 --> 00:48:20.760 We have seen streaks, flashes, beacons, tracks, volcanoes aren't volcanoes on 659 00:48:20.800 --> 00:48:23.519 the Moon. We have seen mists, we have seen fogs. We've seen 660 00:48:23.559 --> 00:48:27.559 strange lights. We've seen blinking lights, and a lot of blue lights. 661 00:48:27.880 --> 00:48:31.840 There's one crater that is so known for this phenomena, that Aristarchus Crater that 662 00:48:32.000 --> 00:48:37.119 is referred to by astronomers, not me, astronomers as the Blue Gem. 663 00:48:37.199 --> 00:48:40.440 Now, if the Moon's a dead world with no atmosphere, what is all 664 00:48:40.480 --> 00:48:49.119 this stuff are what are they trying to explain these phenomena that you just mentioned. 665 00:48:49.480 --> 00:48:53.800 Well, yeah, well, standard scientists are the problem. Is. 666 00:48:53.800 --> 00:48:59.039 There's so many different types of these. They call it transient lunar lunar phenomena. 667 00:48:59.119 --> 00:49:01.320 And the report by now so it was commissioned by NASA, and it's 668 00:49:01.360 --> 00:49:04.719 online. You can take a look up at it, or get my book. 669 00:49:04.719 --> 00:49:09.039 It's at the back of my book. But no one explanation can explain 670 00:49:09.079 --> 00:49:15.199 all of it. For instance, about a century ago and volcanoes, what 671 00:49:15.199 --> 00:49:17.559 they thought were volcanos are noticed on the Moon. These were just quick blips 672 00:49:17.559 --> 00:49:21.880 and gone. These went on for months, some things went on for years. 673 00:49:22.079 --> 00:49:24.679 They call it transient lunar phenomenon, and a lot of it is very 674 00:49:24.679 --> 00:49:29.760 transient, but some of it sticks around enough for other observatories to observe it 675 00:49:29.880 --> 00:49:34.199 easily and over long periods of time. But the Moon has no volcano. 676 00:49:34.280 --> 00:49:37.440 So what were they seeing? Well, they're seeing lightning on the Moon, 677 00:49:37.480 --> 00:49:42.800 but there's no atmosphere. How do you get lightning and avoid they're seeing tracks 678 00:49:42.840 --> 00:49:45.960 and streaks and beacons and these flashes, and they're in different locations, but 679 00:49:46.320 --> 00:49:51.679 principally around two craters, Plato and Aristarchis. I believe that they're two. 680 00:49:52.199 --> 00:49:53.960 How do we account for neptunium two thirty seven being on the Moon. It's 681 00:49:54.000 --> 00:49:58.039 half life is less than two and a half million years. There should be 682 00:49:58.079 --> 00:50:00.239 no neptunium two thirty seven on the Moon. There's none on the Earth. 683 00:50:00.719 --> 00:50:07.000 We have to create it artificially. How has that created naturally? It's just 684 00:50:07.079 --> 00:50:09.760 because I don't know. I don't even know what it is so well, 685 00:50:09.760 --> 00:50:15.039 it's a highly radioactive substance and it has a very short half life of just 686 00:50:15.199 --> 00:50:17.159 under two and a half million years, relatively speaking, short half life. 687 00:50:17.800 --> 00:50:22.840 It can occur naturally, and it probably was on Earth at the beginning. 688 00:50:22.840 --> 00:50:27.119 But because the Earth is four and a half billion years old and a half 689 00:50:27.159 --> 00:50:30.679 life of neptunium two thirty seven, it's only two and a half million years, 690 00:50:30.039 --> 00:50:34.119 it long since ceased to exist on the Earth. If the Moon is 691 00:50:34.119 --> 00:50:36.760 that old, it should have ceased utterly to exist on the Moon too, 692 00:50:36.800 --> 00:50:39.800 But it's there. We also have titanium on the Moon in large amounts than 693 00:50:39.880 --> 00:50:45.280 on the Earth. We have these large maria, these flat gray areas that 694 00:50:45.280 --> 00:50:49.559 they believe our lava flows. They're only on the side facing the Earth. 695 00:50:49.840 --> 00:50:52.880 On the far side of the Moon. There aren't any there are. Let 696 00:50:52.880 --> 00:50:58.079 me ask this, going back to the radioactive material, does an atmosphere play 697 00:50:58.119 --> 00:51:01.760 any aspect and a half life on a material like that not normally, No, 698 00:51:02.679 --> 00:51:07.920 it's it's a constant rate of decay, like uranium, utwo thirty eight, 699 00:51:07.559 --> 00:51:10.119 polonium, any of this stuff. I mean, any of the radioactive 700 00:51:10.159 --> 00:51:15.280 isotopes at the top end of the periodic table, And the higher you go, 701 00:51:15.320 --> 00:51:17.000 the shorter the half lives are. Some of them are mere split seconds 702 00:51:17.000 --> 00:51:22.800 before their decay. I mean uranium YouTube thirty eight has a half life of 703 00:51:22.800 --> 00:51:27.119 four and a half billion years, so we only have half left of what 704 00:51:27.199 --> 00:51:30.079 the Earth started out with four and a half billion years ago. The rest 705 00:51:30.079 --> 00:51:34.280 of it eventually degraded into some other element. I believe it was lead, 706 00:51:34.760 --> 00:51:39.960 but so and that's odd because lead can stop radiation. Isn't funny something should 707 00:51:39.960 --> 00:51:45.320 decay from a radioactive state to something that blocks radiation. Isn't that strange? 708 00:51:45.440 --> 00:51:46.960 Yeah, if it is lead, I'm not I think I remember reading it 709 00:51:47.000 --> 00:51:51.440 does decay eventually into lead, but I'm not positive about that. All right, 710 00:51:51.480 --> 00:51:52.840 that's it for the free part of the show. Thank you so much 711 00:51:52.840 --> 00:51:59.400 for listening. Anyone can sign up for the full hour and forty five minute 712 00:51:59.400 --> 00:52:02.880 shows. All you have to do is go over to podcast ufo dot com. 713 00:52:02.880 --> 00:52:07.360 Don't forget to check out our website as I just mentioned. Also, 714 00:52:07.440 --> 00:52:13.000 there's a blog over there called Rockin' UFOs. Thanks so much for listening. 715 00:52:13.000 --> 00:52:19.840 We'll be back next week with Dan Wright about CIA UFO papers. All right, 716 00:52:19.880 --> 00:52:22.840 everyone, see you next week, and remember to keep your eyes to 717 00:52:22.920 --> 00:52:35.760 the sky.