WEBVTT

1
00:00:04.639 --> 00:01:07.359
Wearing waiting. Welcome back to midnight
Viewing the horror anthology. Oh wait a

2
00:01:07.359 --> 00:01:11.920
minute, Actually I need to welcome
you to a separate but equals midnight viewing.

3
00:01:12.200 --> 00:01:18.920
This is Midnight Viewing Anthologies Attack,
where we discuss anthologies in all the

4
00:01:19.000 --> 00:01:23.040
various media and genres and sharing the
midnight view with me is the director of

5
00:01:23.040 --> 00:01:29.400
the award winning live action cartoon Space
Detective, mister Antonio Lapour. Hey there,

6
00:01:29.560 --> 00:01:33.239
father Malone. How are you today? I'm doing wonderful. We just

7
00:01:33.359 --> 00:01:37.319
were talking about Batman without recording.
That was really dumb, but that's just

8
00:01:37.319 --> 00:01:40.400
how how it goes. Man.
You get excited, you know you hate

9
00:01:40.799 --> 00:01:46.319
dedicated to the bat And in tonight
our inaugural outing, we've chosen to absolutely

10
00:01:46.680 --> 00:01:53.359
certified anthology classics starting back in nineteen
ninety two, we're doing two episodes from

11
00:01:53.439 --> 00:01:57.439
Batman the Animated series, almost got
them and Legends of the Dark Knight.

12
00:01:57.480 --> 00:02:00.959
Now I say that they're from Batman
the Animated series, and they've certainly been

13
00:02:01.000 --> 00:02:05.599
folded into the Batman Animated series.
If you were to stream it now available

14
00:02:05.640 --> 00:02:07.599
on Max, everybody go check it
out. Actually go watch it right now

15
00:02:07.680 --> 00:02:10.280
and then come back because We're gonna
be spoiling the shit out of these things.

16
00:02:10.520 --> 00:02:14.199
These are two. The second episode, the Legends of the Dark Knight,

17
00:02:14.319 --> 00:02:17.360
is actually from the New Batman Adventures
from nineteen ninety seven, which ran

18
00:02:17.400 --> 00:02:22.199
for one season, maybe two,
I don't know, And and it's now

19
00:02:22.240 --> 00:02:27.039
been reappropriated. Now we're gonna talk. We're gonna be talking Batman today,

20
00:02:27.240 --> 00:02:31.319
Batman the animated series. It didn't
spring whole cloth from the creators of that

21
00:02:31.360 --> 00:02:35.560
animated series. No, we're gonna
have to go back to nineteen thirty nine

22
00:02:35.919 --> 00:02:38.039
Batman. Wow. Yeah, I'm
gonna let Antonio take over. I just

23
00:02:38.080 --> 00:02:43.000
want to say that Batman was created
by Bill Finger. Bill Finger, Yeah,

24
00:02:43.240 --> 00:02:45.520
oh, and Bob Kane. He
did some of the drawing it.

25
00:02:46.560 --> 00:02:50.199
You know, this is this story
and now what I'm gonna preface it.

26
00:02:50.280 --> 00:02:53.039
If you get a chance, there's
a brilliant documentary you can catch it on

27
00:02:53.360 --> 00:02:58.400
I think it's on Hulu. It's
called Batman and Bill and it's about Bill

28
00:02:58.439 --> 00:03:00.120
Finger, and it gives you the
whole history of it. But I'm going

29
00:03:00.199 --> 00:03:02.879
to give you, you know,
the cliff notes basically. But so,

30
00:03:04.039 --> 00:03:07.319
Bob Kane was a you know,
up and coming cartoonist, I guess like

31
00:03:07.400 --> 00:03:12.800
everybody in Brooklyn or whatever. They
were probably New York in the late thirties.

32
00:03:12.840 --> 00:03:15.800
You know, he was a teenager
just that a high school and he

33
00:03:15.879 --> 00:03:19.560
they he knew the folks over at
National Comics, which was, you know,

34
00:03:19.719 --> 00:03:23.360
the original DC Comics. Detective Comics
was come out, you know there,

35
00:03:23.479 --> 00:03:27.800
and you know, Superman had just
come out and was huge, and

36
00:03:27.840 --> 00:03:30.879
the editor was like, hey,
I need a new superhero. And Bob

37
00:03:30.000 --> 00:03:32.639
Kane is like, all right,
let me see what I can come up

38
00:03:32.680 --> 00:03:39.759
with. And he just pretty much
saw a drawing of Da Vinci's Flying Machine.

39
00:03:40.120 --> 00:03:43.879
Yeah, oh, I'm going to
make a superhero out of that.

40
00:03:44.680 --> 00:03:47.639
And he drew this dude in a
red costume, in a red unit hard

41
00:03:47.719 --> 00:03:53.159
with black shorts and a black Domino
mask and blonde hair, and he had

42
00:03:53.240 --> 00:03:59.919
on black bat wings. Here's my
character. I guess he's gonna be bat

43
00:04:00.120 --> 00:04:02.680
Man. Maybe, I don't know. Bill Finger went, oh, I

44
00:04:02.680 --> 00:04:06.280
guess this is going to need some
BackStar. Yeah, basically had some characters,

45
00:04:06.360 --> 00:04:09.919
right, Yeah, can remember the
guy's name now, but the guy

46
00:04:09.919 --> 00:04:14.120
who ran the company, he set
him up together with Bill Finger, who

47
00:04:14.159 --> 00:04:16.439
was one of the up and coming
riders. And Bill Finger was the writer.

48
00:04:16.600 --> 00:04:20.439
So Bill Fingers, Okay, this
costume was stupid. He was gonna

49
00:04:20.439 --> 00:04:24.720
fight crime in a red costume like
that, and he's gonna be a scary

50
00:04:24.759 --> 00:04:29.560
Batman. No, so he made
the costume gray and black and they put

51
00:04:29.600 --> 00:04:32.160
together the mask. I don't know
who designed the mask though, I mean,

52
00:04:32.279 --> 00:04:35.800
we'll just give it to bobka Yeah, I guess, but he had

53
00:04:35.839 --> 00:04:39.800
eyeballs though if he were here he
would take credits. Well, yeah,

54
00:04:39.839 --> 00:04:44.279
obviously he The Batman mask had eyeballs
in it, and Bill Finger got rid

55
00:04:44.279 --> 00:04:48.160
of the eyeballs. He gave it
the color scheme. He even and Kane

56
00:04:48.240 --> 00:04:55.439
drew stiff wings. Bill Finger made
it a cape. So basically he revamped

57
00:04:55.439 --> 00:04:58.399
and then made the Batman that we
know today. Well, yeah, then

58
00:04:58.399 --> 00:05:01.079
he came up with everything else,
you know, Bruce Wayne, Gotham City,

59
00:05:01.480 --> 00:05:05.639
the Batmovie, or Robin. All
this other shit came up thanks to

60
00:05:05.759 --> 00:05:10.439
Bill Finger. Now, Bob Kane
did come up with the Joker. No

61
00:05:10.519 --> 00:05:13.519
he didn't, Yes, he did. No, the Joker was Jerry Robinson.

62
00:05:14.040 --> 00:05:16.279
It was really a combination of the
three of them. If you want

63
00:05:16.279 --> 00:05:19.360
to be fair, say I was
just being the normal fan who assumes that

64
00:05:19.399 --> 00:05:23.959
Bob Kane did everything else. Bob
Kane has been crying about his creations for

65
00:05:24.360 --> 00:05:29.240
ever. No, it was a
combination of more than likely Jerry Robinson and

66
00:05:29.720 --> 00:05:33.279
Bill Finger. Jerry Robinson had the
card with the Joker face on it.

67
00:05:33.360 --> 00:05:36.839
He had drawn that. That's how
legend goes. The other legend is they

68
00:05:36.879 --> 00:05:41.199
had seen the movie The Man Who
Laughs, you know, was ten years

69
00:05:41.240 --> 00:05:45.399
old. That movie wasn't like right
and oldie, it was just a movie

70
00:05:45.399 --> 00:05:47.639
that come out well it was silent, and that was, you know,

71
00:05:47.680 --> 00:05:53.319
a German film by a guy named
Goula Pane who was a circus freak who

72
00:05:53.319 --> 00:05:56.839
had his face carved into a hideous
smile. And if you guys look at

73
00:05:56.839 --> 00:06:00.160
this up online, the Man who
Laughs, it's the fucking joker. Yeah,

74
00:06:00.319 --> 00:06:04.160
Like it's that ear. Yeah.
But the funny thing is it's the

75
00:06:04.160 --> 00:06:10.360
best joker makeup there ever been.
Like it's just this giant mouth with these

76
00:06:11.120 --> 00:06:15.519
teeth. It's always smiling and this
really it's always smiling. Even when he's

77
00:06:15.600 --> 00:06:19.040
sad, he's stuck in that smile. And none of the movies have ever

78
00:06:19.199 --> 00:06:25.079
got that, maybe the Burton movie. But yeah, they tried became surgical.

79
00:06:25.279 --> 00:06:28.959
Yeah, we did a short film
called Joker Does Shakespeare Man like twenty

80
00:06:29.000 --> 00:06:31.480
years ago. You can find it
on YouTube and at my our website,

81
00:06:31.480 --> 00:06:36.920
Swamp Media Group dot com. But
in it, the Joker performs they Halet's

82
00:06:36.920 --> 00:06:42.360
soliloquy to a dead guy. That's
basically and I show up as a Batman

83
00:06:42.480 --> 00:06:46.199
reference in it. I'm not in
a Batman costume. You're trust for you

84
00:06:46.279 --> 00:06:49.959
know, You're okay. I was
imagining. And anyways, we tried to

85
00:06:50.040 --> 00:06:54.480
do that permanent smile thing and we
you know, we use the Halloween mask

86
00:06:54.519 --> 00:06:56.879
and gat I'm gonna tell you right
now, it doesn't look great, so

87
00:06:56.959 --> 00:06:59.839
I don't know how to do it
nowadays. Conrad Vite they just took to

88
00:07:00.040 --> 00:07:03.680
wires and yanked his mouth back and
then those ears or something great. Yeah,

89
00:07:03.720 --> 00:07:08.240
they chanyed him that. But then, anyways, everybody has seen that

90
00:07:08.399 --> 00:07:12.439
movie that I think the Joker came
out of Bill Finger and Jerry Robinson and

91
00:07:13.319 --> 00:07:15.120
maybe Bob Kane. I don't know
how involved he was. I feel like

92
00:07:15.680 --> 00:07:19.600
he was in the office stan Lee
and they was saying, I'm stan Lee,

93
00:07:19.720 --> 00:07:24.759
hello, I'm doing everything. But
really he's just like dignating. Why

94
00:07:24.800 --> 00:07:28.439
do we love stan Lee for doing
exactly what Bob Kane was doing, because

95
00:07:28.439 --> 00:07:32.199
stan Lee was fucking charming. I've
met stan Lee and he's just laying it.

96
00:07:32.360 --> 00:07:34.920
I shot an event that he was
at, a signing, and I

97
00:07:34.959 --> 00:07:38.279
got him to say Excelsior. It
was great. I'm like, hey,

98
00:07:38.319 --> 00:07:42.519
stank and I got an excelsior.
He turns around and he excel sia and

99
00:07:42.680 --> 00:07:45.399
I'm like, wow, that's amazing. And he actually did a ton of

100
00:07:45.480 --> 00:07:46.399
right, he did do a ton
of writing. But then I mean,

101
00:07:46.480 --> 00:07:49.839
come on, Jack Kirby, and
we need to get into that. Yeah,

102
00:07:49.839 --> 00:07:53.160
that's a whole nother one. That's
a whole other show. We can

103
00:07:53.199 --> 00:07:57.279
stick to Bob Kane filtering all the
glory. Bill Finger is the name that

104
00:07:57.600 --> 00:08:01.000
generally when you think of all cool
stuff that Batman has, Bill Finger came

105
00:08:01.079 --> 00:08:03.639
up with it, you know.
And there was a whole slew of artists.

106
00:08:03.720 --> 00:08:07.279
There was Jerry Robinson. I was
probably my favorite of the Golden Age.

107
00:08:09.079 --> 00:08:13.319
He if you see, like,
his most recognized piece is that Detective

108
00:08:13.439 --> 00:08:18.319
thirty eight with Robin's first appearance,
and it's got the little Robin jumping through

109
00:08:18.560 --> 00:08:22.480
the circus circle or whatever, you
know, the hoop, Yeah, jump

110
00:08:22.519 --> 00:08:26.879
into the hoop and breaking the thing
and he's smiling, and that's Jerry Robinson.

111
00:08:26.920 --> 00:08:28.800
Bob Kane could not draw that well. Detective twenty seven, Now,

112
00:08:28.800 --> 00:08:33.240
okay, that's Bob Kane. Probably
ain'ts by Jerry Robinson. We can't deny

113
00:08:33.399 --> 00:08:37.480
Bob Kaine's contributions to Batman. But
Batman didn't get cool until everybody else got

114
00:08:37.559 --> 00:08:41.360
their hands on him, and Dick's
there was Sheldon Meldoff was another writer.

115
00:08:43.000 --> 00:08:46.240
I mean it was another artist.
The other writer was Gardner Fox. Gardner

116
00:08:46.320 --> 00:08:50.039
Fox is known for creating the Flash
and the Justice Society and all that and

117
00:08:50.120 --> 00:08:54.039
those guys, and he wrote Batman
for a little bit too. If the

118
00:08:54.320 --> 00:08:58.600
early early early stuff, if he
was you Batman holding a gun, that's

119
00:08:58.639 --> 00:09:01.840
a Sheldon Meldoff Batman and the gun
thing. They got rid of that nineteenth

120
00:09:01.840 --> 00:09:05.960
by tight Robin showed up No guns, no killing. That was by nineteen

121
00:09:05.080 --> 00:09:09.080
forty. Robbie came out like nine
months after Batman debut. It wasn't like

122
00:09:09.200 --> 00:09:13.799
a big weight with no because we're
getting back to the original Batman, the

123
00:09:13.840 --> 00:09:16.200
original Batman, but no Robin was
like six months Man and then the gets

124
00:09:16.200 --> 00:09:20.879
shot up and then the Batman that
we know in love that doesn't kill people,

125
00:09:20.519 --> 00:09:24.600
that doesn't have a gun. That's
been there pretty much since the very

126
00:09:24.720 --> 00:09:28.080
very beginning. The Batman who doesn't
kill right from the beginning, interesting,

127
00:09:28.320 --> 00:09:31.960
Zack Snyder. Yeah, I mean
yeah, sure, Like it's the forties,

128
00:09:33.039 --> 00:09:37.320
so it's a literal it's a liberal
view of killing. Yeah, the

129
00:09:37.440 --> 00:09:41.279
monster might get killed or you know
whatever. But Batman's now women had a

130
00:09:41.320 --> 00:09:45.240
gun and shooting somebody. He's not
murdering anybody. I seem to remember a

131
00:09:45.360 --> 00:09:48.840
run of comics where Batman used to
carry again, but this was during the

132
00:09:48.960 --> 00:09:52.120
seventies early eighties. That was Batman
year too. I just remember him draped

133
00:09:52.159 --> 00:09:56.480
over a grave with a forty five
in his hand. That was Todd McFarland's

134
00:09:56.519 --> 00:09:58.879
big break was really Yeah, he
only does two issues of it. It's

135
00:10:00.000 --> 00:10:01.720
it's so weird. Two issues are
done by him and two issues are done

136
00:10:01.759 --> 00:10:05.879
by Alan Davis. I've seen Todd
McFarland sketching Batman just for fun, and

137
00:10:07.080 --> 00:10:11.519
I actually love his style with him. McFarland Batman the action figure statue back

138
00:10:11.600 --> 00:10:15.480
behind me with the giant oversized cape
and everything. Yeah beautiful, Yeah,

139
00:10:16.000 --> 00:10:20.039
it is beautiful, And you know
That's that's funny thing. It's my second

140
00:10:20.080 --> 00:10:22.320
one of those things because I got
it and I opened it and you can

141
00:10:22.360 --> 00:10:24.879
put the arms on it and stuff
in the arm broke like immediately, So

142
00:10:24.080 --> 00:10:26.799
I got it refunded and got another
one and then I haven't opened it again.

143
00:10:28.639 --> 00:10:31.000
The McFarland Batman is sort of echoing
the gothic style of Denny O'Neil.

144
00:10:31.279 --> 00:10:35.480
Oh. Yeah, it takes to
Denny O'Neill and Neil Adams stuff and then

145
00:10:35.679 --> 00:10:39.039
pluses it. But you know that
Blue Cape Batman that was the seventies and

146
00:10:39.120 --> 00:10:43.080
eighties and all that stuff. The
best guy is from the eighties. That

147
00:10:43.120 --> 00:10:48.000
was Jim Apparrel, Like Jim and
Parol was Batman in that time period the

148
00:10:48.120 --> 00:10:52.000
best because he did it the longest
my entire child. Jim Apparrel drew Batman

149
00:10:52.080 --> 00:10:54.759
up until I got to high school. So does that make him your Batman?

150
00:10:54.120 --> 00:10:58.919
They say that about Saturday Night Live, Like, whoever your group was

151
00:10:58.000 --> 00:11:01.840
in high school, that's your cast. The Neil Adams bat this is an

152
00:11:01.879 --> 00:11:07.120
extension of the Neil Adams Batman.
You know, the Jim Apparrel's Batman and

153
00:11:07.200 --> 00:11:11.519
Neil Adams is pretty similar. Neal
Adams is much more detailed than deliberate with

154
00:11:11.519 --> 00:11:13.559
this stuff. And Jim Man Jim
Apparel just had great camera angles, a

155
00:11:13.639 --> 00:11:16.879
lot of Dutch angles. Was really
good at action and I feel like you

156
00:11:18.080 --> 00:11:20.639
just do it forever. And then
the other great one was the Marshall Rodgers

157
00:11:22.000 --> 00:11:24.559
and the Marshall Rodgers and Terry Austin
Batman is the best looking one of the

158
00:11:24.639 --> 00:11:28.679
bunch. That's the but they only
did the six issues. Yeah, and

159
00:11:28.879 --> 00:11:31.919
that's the late seventies. It was
my first Batman comic I gotten as a

160
00:11:33.000 --> 00:11:37.200
reprint in the mid eighties. And
that's the Laughing Fish. That's a gorgeous

161
00:11:37.279 --> 00:11:41.240
drying and you know the end of
the Dark Night with them on top of

162
00:11:41.279 --> 00:11:45.320
the of the scaffolding and stuff.
And that's the end of the Marshall Rogers

163
00:11:45.600 --> 00:11:48.120
Laughing Fish. It ends with them
on the scaffolding and the lightning gets the

164
00:11:48.200 --> 00:11:52.960
joke and he falls into the river
rather than getting caught. But oh,

165
00:11:52.120 --> 00:11:56.720
that and that Marshall Rodgers had a
really exaggerated cape too. My favorite Batman

166
00:11:56.840 --> 00:12:01.120
artist obviously is Bernie Wright's in his
work on the Cult. Oh yeah,

167
00:12:03.519 --> 00:12:07.799
everybody's really ripped and there's some giant
bat ears that he draws bat ears that

168
00:12:07.879 --> 00:12:11.000
he draws so far up they seem
to reach to heavy. Yeah, he's

169
00:12:11.039 --> 00:12:15.759
one of my other go to favorites. It's sick lawless. The more restrained

170
00:12:15.840 --> 00:12:18.399
version of that, to me is
the Brian Bowlin version of Batman. He

171
00:12:18.519 --> 00:12:24.639
draws the Joker and Batman and everyone
so long. It's unlike anything we've seen,

172
00:12:24.799 --> 00:12:28.759
certainly cinematically, we'll get back to
the artists. Let's talk Batman in

173
00:12:28.840 --> 00:12:33.879
the cinema or Batman in a visually
moving media. And this started back in

174
00:12:33.919 --> 00:12:37.399
the forties with the cereals. See
the first cereal is nineteen forty three.

175
00:12:37.679 --> 00:12:41.799
That was a Batman named Robin.
I know it was Batman, the Batman,

176
00:12:41.919 --> 00:12:45.799
I think it was, And it
was Lewis Wilson was Batman. He

177
00:12:45.879 --> 00:12:48.240
was some guy in his twenties and
his costume kind of looks really good,

178
00:12:48.600 --> 00:12:52.759
but it's hella, saggy and doesn't
move well, and in the movie it

179
00:12:52.799 --> 00:12:56.440
looks terrible. There's a couple of
publicity shots it looks great and they were

180
00:12:56.519 --> 00:13:00.960
driving a sedan and they're driving a
sidan. The Robin is played by Douglas

181
00:13:01.080 --> 00:13:05.759
Croft, who is also in the
Greatest Movie of all time. He plays

182
00:13:05.960 --> 00:13:09.799
little Charles Foster Kane. Wow,
I got the right. Yeah, Okay,

183
00:13:09.879 --> 00:13:13.120
So cereals, that's the first taste
of Batman. Or he's either that

184
00:13:13.279 --> 00:13:22.240
or he's Kine's son. He's one
of the two. And then there's another

185
00:13:22.320 --> 00:13:26.720
one in forty oh and then that
one they fight doctor Daca, who's you

186
00:13:26.799 --> 00:13:28.799
know, a guy with the wax
eyelids. None of the Rogues gallery of

187
00:13:28.879 --> 00:13:33.000
villains show up in the cereals.
And then in forty nine you get Batman

188
00:13:33.080 --> 00:13:39.720
and Robin, where you the Robin
looks like he's thirty and they drive a

189
00:13:39.879 --> 00:13:43.919
darker Sedan. Yeah, but that
one introduces the bad signal. That's the

190
00:13:43.000 --> 00:13:46.120
first place you've seen in anywhere was
in that cereal. When I was growing

191
00:13:46.240 --> 00:13:50.279
up in the town next to mine, Chelsea, Massachusetts, there was a

192
00:13:50.480 --> 00:13:54.759
movie theater that was a second run
revival house where I got to see the

193
00:13:54.879 --> 00:13:58.039
cereals on a Saturday morning, and
I got to tell you, I was

194
00:13:58.200 --> 00:14:01.440
crazily disappointed. I was we were
going to go see Batman. I thought

195
00:14:01.440 --> 00:14:03.480
we were going to go see a
Batman cartoon, or at the very least,

196
00:14:03.519 --> 00:14:07.840
we were going to see perhaps the
greatest incarnation at least from television up

197
00:14:07.879 --> 00:14:13.399
until the show we're talking about from
nineteen sixty six, the Adam West Batman.

198
00:14:13.720 --> 00:14:16.240
I love that each of the iterations
of Batman will include at least a

199
00:14:16.279 --> 00:14:22.799
few characters or situations that will resonate
so hard that people think that they've been

200
00:14:22.879 --> 00:14:26.480
there since the beginning, that it's
some sort of new innovation. Well,

201
00:14:26.519 --> 00:14:28.799
you know, Kryptonite was introduced first
on the Superman radio show. Well,

202
00:14:28.840 --> 00:14:33.440
he was just too powerful. It's
amazing, And Bratman and Robin's first Leady

203
00:14:33.559 --> 00:14:37.080
appearance was on their radio Superman didn't
even fly to begin with. No,

204
00:14:37.200 --> 00:14:39.559
he just jumped. Yeah, you
know, I'm a little younger, but

205
00:14:39.639 --> 00:14:43.240
it's you know, it lived in
reruns. I remember being a little boy

206
00:14:43.559 --> 00:14:48.360
in Vegas and waking up at six
o'clock in the morning on Saturday because they

207
00:14:48.480 --> 00:14:52.639
ran in two episodes of it,
and I'm being like eight or nine,

208
00:14:52.720 --> 00:14:54.440
going, this is my only way
I can get a Batman fix. And

209
00:14:54.600 --> 00:14:58.600
you got both parts. Yeah,
I got both parts and it was awesome.

210
00:14:58.639 --> 00:15:01.840
But if you look back at that
show, that is literally the most

211
00:15:01.039 --> 00:15:05.679
faithful adaptation of all of it.
Yeah, it's silly and it's wacky,

212
00:15:05.799 --> 00:15:09.840
but it's the sixties, man,
everybody's either drunk or high, and it's

213
00:15:09.879 --> 00:15:13.320
perfectly fine. And you know,
and they know it's a joke. They

214
00:15:13.399 --> 00:15:16.639
know it's a joke. Man.
They're basing it off of the silver Age

215
00:15:16.639 --> 00:15:20.320
of Batmans. Yeah right, I
mean those comics were that, like you

216
00:15:20.480 --> 00:15:26.480
pick up a nineteen fifties Batman comic
drawn by the magnificent genius Dick Sprang.

217
00:15:26.720 --> 00:15:30.960
Who're gonna get to today in today's
episode, Dick Sprang is? I mean

218
00:15:31.320 --> 00:15:33.720
that's from the episodes they adapted from
that comic, I mean for the show,

219
00:15:33.919 --> 00:15:37.279
from the Dick Sprang era when he
was drawn as the joker's utility belt.

220
00:15:37.519 --> 00:15:41.440
That's you know, that's a Bill
Finger Dick Sprang comic. You know

221
00:15:41.519 --> 00:15:43.320
what. The the only thing they'd
never got tough was like the giant typewriter

222
00:15:43.720 --> 00:15:48.000
like that. But they probably had
a giant typewriter on the ad of My

223
00:15:48.120 --> 00:15:50.080
show. But they didn't have the
penny. No, he didn't get the

224
00:15:50.159 --> 00:15:52.360
penny. Well, we didn't get
two Face on the show. He was

225
00:15:52.399 --> 00:15:56.679
too weird, which is bizarre considering
they were concocting characters just for the show.

226
00:15:56.840 --> 00:16:02.120
Two Face, like they had False
Space, who was playface, but

227
00:16:02.240 --> 00:16:04.039
then two face. It never got
to what it was cool? Was that

228
00:16:04.240 --> 00:16:07.799
a few years ago they did those
animated movies. Yes, well that before

229
00:16:08.039 --> 00:16:11.600
we lost Adam West, The Return
of the Caped Crusaders, the Two Face

230
00:16:11.679 --> 00:16:15.960
one Bill William Shatner has two Face, and I'm just like, wow,

231
00:16:17.480 --> 00:16:22.960
whoever cook that one up at orders
animation just because somebody should have played two

232
00:16:22.000 --> 00:16:26.080
face got out of West movie.
I had it on videotape, you know,

233
00:16:26.120 --> 00:16:30.320
I've taped off ABC or whatever,
and I just watched it so much

234
00:16:30.320 --> 00:16:33.720
as a kid. It's just such
a blast, and added West and Burt

235
00:16:33.799 --> 00:16:37.759
Ward are great man. Yeah they're
in off a joke and all that stuff,

236
00:16:37.759 --> 00:16:41.159
and it's a comedy show. But
here a little kid that's clearly Batman

237
00:16:41.240 --> 00:16:45.919
and Robin because I bond into it
one as a kid. It's only when

238
00:16:45.960 --> 00:16:51.080
you become a teenager you realize that
Zang and pow those are a bit silly,

239
00:16:51.200 --> 00:16:52.879
and you start to see all of
the seams, and there was a

240
00:16:52.919 --> 00:16:57.519
whole culture around what a joke the
show was. But they were in on

241
00:16:57.679 --> 00:17:02.039
that joke. But the Burton you
look back and look at the Burton pictures

242
00:17:02.279 --> 00:17:04.559
and were the Burton movies, not
even the Joel Schumachers that were trying to

243
00:17:04.640 --> 00:17:08.920
be Adam West. But the Burton
movies themselves are pretty silly. I mean

244
00:17:08.960 --> 00:17:12.839
this, scripts are ridiculous, you
know, like they don't have the scripts

245
00:17:12.839 --> 00:17:18.880
of those movies don't capture all the
nuanced drama and flug did the comics give

246
00:17:18.920 --> 00:17:23.119
you. They just look amazing and
they're really well paced, so they're very

247
00:17:23.240 --> 00:17:26.519
entertaining movies, but they're shitty scripts. Before we get to Burton, there's

248
00:17:26.559 --> 00:17:30.880
a period between say nineteen sixty eight
and the present where the only Batman we

249
00:17:30.960 --> 00:17:36.960
were getting were the super Friends appearances, and in Scooby Doo movies you had

250
00:17:37.000 --> 00:17:41.920
two guys playing Batman. Basically you
had Adam West actually plays him on the

251
00:17:41.200 --> 00:17:45.160
late seventies filmation Batman, which is
probably the first thing I saw, I

252
00:17:45.240 --> 00:17:48.880
would assume, and then Adam West
plays it on that last season of super

253
00:17:48.960 --> 00:17:52.799
Friends, which is the first place
you get Batman's origin. Actually I remember

254
00:17:52.880 --> 00:17:55.799
distinctly when he took over the part, and that's a great episode. That's

255
00:17:55.799 --> 00:17:59.200
the first place I really got that
origin, you know, as a little

256
00:17:59.240 --> 00:18:00.599
boy, and I'm like, oh, I get it now. I lost

257
00:18:00.680 --> 00:18:03.039
my dad when I was seven,
and it was you know, and it

258
00:18:03.160 --> 00:18:07.359
was I was there and it was
very traumatic. You know, it was

259
00:18:07.400 --> 00:18:10.079
just a heart attack. It was
a bugger. But I got it.

260
00:18:10.200 --> 00:18:11.519
And now, as you know,
in the eighty or nine, ten eleven

261
00:18:11.640 --> 00:18:15.960
year old boy watching that super Friends, how old I was, I got

262
00:18:15.000 --> 00:18:18.799
it. I'm like, oh god, Batman, he gets it. And

263
00:18:18.920 --> 00:18:22.200
I was like, that was I
had always loved it. You will find

264
00:18:22.240 --> 00:18:25.880
me pictures of two year old me
with Migo Batman toys or stuff. But

265
00:18:26.079 --> 00:18:27.880
that's where I got it. That's
the connection. Yeah. But the other

266
00:18:27.960 --> 00:18:32.759
Batman was Olan Soule, and he
was the guy. He was the hey,

267
00:18:32.880 --> 00:18:36.279
great Robin, that guy on the
super Friends. Yeah, yeah,

268
00:18:36.720 --> 00:18:38.640
yeah, but you know, he
played Batman for fifteen years almost. He

269
00:18:38.759 --> 00:18:44.200
was Batman in the late sixties show
that was pretty much a cartoon version of

270
00:18:44.240 --> 00:18:45.519
the Out of Us show, I
guess, right, and then on the

271
00:18:45.559 --> 00:18:49.640
super Friends all through the seventies,
and then on The Scooby Show that was

272
00:18:49.720 --> 00:18:55.559
him too. That episode of super
Friends where you get the origin and they

273
00:18:55.640 --> 00:18:59.400
fight the Scarecrow, you know,
that is loosely based on like a seventies

274
00:18:59.400 --> 00:19:02.759
comedy. They swapped Wonder Woman for
Batgirl, but it's kind of the same

275
00:19:02.880 --> 00:19:07.160
thing. And that was a backdoor
pilot for a Batman show that that never

276
00:19:07.240 --> 00:19:11.960
happened. But sixty six, no, this is the eighty six eighty seven

277
00:19:11.039 --> 00:19:15.720
super Friends. It was a backdoor
pilot for the for a Batman show,

278
00:19:15.759 --> 00:19:18.440
a Hannah Barbara Batman show. So
in it you got al Ford, that

279
00:19:18.519 --> 00:19:22.079
you got Robin, you got Batman's
origin, and you know, now it

280
00:19:22.240 --> 00:19:26.440
just lives on as that meame video
that Hey look out, Ruth, He's

281
00:19:26.480 --> 00:19:29.960
coming after you. Oh my god, you know that one with like the

282
00:19:30.000 --> 00:19:33.799
wacky voices of that. It's a
pretty big internet me But that's about it.

283
00:19:33.119 --> 00:19:37.279
And I remember always searching for that
episode, hoping a rerun I would

284
00:19:37.319 --> 00:19:40.079
catch it, and I think I
saw twice when I was a little kid,

285
00:19:40.359 --> 00:19:45.200
but it stuck. Batman sort of
comes into his own in popular culture

286
00:19:45.720 --> 00:19:49.160
in nineteen eighty nine with the Batman
film, the project that had been ges

287
00:19:49.279 --> 00:19:56.480
dating forever since the seventies, but
really since Superman. That's when Mankowitz writes

288
00:19:56.559 --> 00:20:00.000
his script. That's when Michael Uslan
gets the rights to it. Michael us

289
00:20:00.160 --> 00:20:04.680
was like some twenty year old kid
that worked at DC Comics has already started

290
00:20:04.680 --> 00:20:07.799
as an internal or something, and
he might have written some copy for them

291
00:20:07.920 --> 00:20:11.359
or something, and he saw Superman. He's pro I love Batman. I

292
00:20:11.400 --> 00:20:15.160
wonder if I could get the rights
to it. And so another he found

293
00:20:15.200 --> 00:20:18.680
this old, tiny Hollywood producer who
was like seventy five years old named Benjamin.

294
00:20:19.440 --> 00:20:22.920
Yeah, that's it, and he
put up a little bit of money

295
00:20:22.920 --> 00:20:25.960
and they got the rights for nothing. It's insane. He still has those

296
00:20:26.079 --> 00:20:29.200
rights, still has those rights.
Every time you see Batman and anything,

297
00:20:29.599 --> 00:20:32.519
you're gonna see Michael hous Lynde's name. I had his book sitting on my

298
00:20:32.559 --> 00:20:34.400
table right now. The boy who
loved Batman I saw the documentary. You

299
00:20:34.400 --> 00:20:38.400
know, we owe him a debt
of gratitude because all this media that we

300
00:20:38.519 --> 00:20:42.200
have really exists because some kid was
like, dude, I love Batman.

301
00:20:42.200 --> 00:20:45.440
I wonder if I could get the
rights to its wild And I've read that

302
00:20:45.519 --> 00:20:48.519
Mankut with Script, and that manke
with Script is great. It's a lot

303
00:20:48.599 --> 00:20:52.720
of fun. It's the Superman.
Yeah, it's the same, it's the

304
00:20:52.839 --> 00:20:56.319
exact same tone, but it's fun. It's got a giant typewriter and it's

305
00:20:56.359 --> 00:20:59.599
got Robin in it. I didn't
right, but it was attachment, and

306
00:20:59.599 --> 00:21:03.480
they wanted any Murphy to be Robin
and Bill Murray to be Batman. And

307
00:21:03.599 --> 00:21:07.920
that manscript Thomas Wayne I think might
have been running for mayor or something and

308
00:21:07.319 --> 00:21:11.599
the Joker. And there were some
interim scripts as well, because at one

309
00:21:11.640 --> 00:21:15.160
point Joe Dante, right after Gremlin's
Oh no kidding, and he said that

310
00:21:15.319 --> 00:21:18.079
he read the script and kept going
over and over in his mind about how

311
00:21:18.160 --> 00:21:22.079
he would shoot it. But the
next day he went back to the producers

312
00:21:22.119 --> 00:21:23.519
and he said, I can make
this movie, but I can make it

313
00:21:23.559 --> 00:21:27.039
about the Joker. That's all I'm
interested in. And that's not what you

314
00:21:27.160 --> 00:21:30.279
need. You want a Batman movie. So he bowed out. That's amazing,

315
00:21:30.400 --> 00:21:33.680
that's I can't believe that. See, that's a weird thing because back

316
00:21:33.799 --> 00:21:38.680
then, these guys don't realize that
there's a comic shop of over on,

317
00:21:38.920 --> 00:21:42.400
a really good comic shop over on
Sunset. You know, they can just

318
00:21:42.480 --> 00:21:45.599
go take a taxi down to Golden
Apple and spend the afternoon and there's your

319
00:21:45.640 --> 00:21:49.960
movie. Tam Ham or Warren Scarrot, one of those guys been making the

320
00:21:51.039 --> 00:21:56.400
rounds lately talking about, you know, the Burton movies and how they're coming

321
00:21:56.480 --> 00:22:00.920
up with the shit for Batman Returns, and there m and Burton are just

322
00:22:00.000 --> 00:22:03.599
coming up with it. That's Daniel
Waters, that's Dan Waters. But they're

323
00:22:03.640 --> 00:22:07.519
just coming up with it and not
cracking open a comic book or anything like

324
00:22:07.599 --> 00:22:08.920
that. I'm just like, are
you guys that big of snobs back then?

325
00:22:10.400 --> 00:22:12.720
I don't know if it was snobbishness. I happen to think that Batman

326
00:22:12.839 --> 00:22:17.240
Returns is my favorite Batman movie.
I mean what we have right now,

327
00:22:17.359 --> 00:22:22.079
the current Batman, the Matt Reeves
the Batman. That Batman is the actual

328
00:22:22.160 --> 00:22:25.079
comic book Batman I like, and
I like that movie, and I want

329
00:22:25.119 --> 00:22:27.400
to see more of it. But
I love the fairy tale aspect of the

330
00:22:27.480 --> 00:22:32.640
Tim Burton film. It feels like
a one off issue of a comic by

331
00:22:33.359 --> 00:22:37.680
a guest artist. I like the
world that he makes in those movies.

332
00:22:37.759 --> 00:22:41.519
I like what he does visually in
those movies, and I equate it to

333
00:22:41.599 --> 00:22:45.119
getting a Batman comic where the guy
where the story's on, but the art

334
00:22:45.240 --> 00:22:49.119
is so good right that you just
can't help just go back and keep looking

335
00:22:49.200 --> 00:22:52.000
at it. That's jelly what I
feel. I prefer the first one a

336
00:22:52.039 --> 00:22:56.319
little more only because I just love
Jack Nichols and it's a lot of black,

337
00:22:56.480 --> 00:23:02.119
and it's the Prince music and it's
just and it was that movie at

338
00:23:02.200 --> 00:23:04.720
that age for me, right,
And it's like that movie at that age,

339
00:23:06.160 --> 00:23:10.880
being obsessed with it, reading the
novelization and in a day did the

340
00:23:10.960 --> 00:23:14.680
comic book, learning how to draw
Michael Keaton accurately at that age, and

341
00:23:15.680 --> 00:23:19.400
then a few months later realizing what
the fuck did the Joker kill Batman's parents?

342
00:23:21.319 --> 00:23:25.079
Did the Batman just drive that fucking
batmobile to the and kill all these

343
00:23:25.119 --> 00:23:27.519
guys? And I started finding all
the things that I didn't like about it,

344
00:23:27.599 --> 00:23:30.279
and I go, well, if
I made a Batman movie, and

345
00:23:30.400 --> 00:23:33.640
if I made a Batman movie,
and if I made a Batman movie,

346
00:23:33.680 --> 00:23:36.480
and then as I'm like, oh, I want to make a Batman.

347
00:23:36.559 --> 00:23:40.440
Oh, I want to make movies, even though Star Wars is my whole

348
00:23:40.559 --> 00:23:44.920
you know, and even yeah,
even though that year I saw Goodfellas and

349
00:23:45.039 --> 00:23:48.359
I discover what a director does watching
good Fellas, because I remember not liking

350
00:23:48.400 --> 00:23:52.559
Goodfellas the first time I watched it, and going I didn't wait a second,

351
00:23:52.559 --> 00:23:53.880
I don't think I just didn't understand
it. Let me watch that again.

352
00:23:55.960 --> 00:23:59.960
But that Batman though, let me
tell you, And when Batman Return

353
00:24:00.000 --> 00:24:03.240
Turns came out was I was all
over that too, and it's a beautiful

354
00:24:03.279 --> 00:24:06.319
movie. But that summer they announced
that there was gonna be a cartoon show

355
00:24:06.480 --> 00:24:10.039
and that they were gonna spend money
on this cartoon show and there was gonna

356
00:24:10.039 --> 00:24:14.319
be something you had never seen before, and it premiered like on Sunday night

357
00:24:14.400 --> 00:24:18.720
at seven thirty. They aired that
on leather Wings episode with men bat and

358
00:24:19.119 --> 00:24:22.400
I recorded that shit because I had
to be at church because you know,

359
00:24:22.440 --> 00:24:26.799
I was like a Catholic kid and
whoa I was. I'm like, I

360
00:24:26.880 --> 00:24:32.000
can't believe it. This is I
go, Michael Heaton is need and everything,

361
00:24:32.119 --> 00:24:33.359
but this is Batman. For fans
of the comic. It was the

362
00:24:33.400 --> 00:24:37.200
first time we got Batman, and
I was obsessed with that comic that you

363
00:24:37.240 --> 00:24:40.960
know, I was just I was
going through puberty, so self Catwoman,

364
00:24:41.960 --> 00:24:48.119
I'm you know, I'm Jason Todd
is Dying the Dark Knight returns and oh

365
00:24:48.279 --> 00:24:52.720
Arkham Asylum, Oh my god.
Arkham Asylum still makes me melt my brain

366
00:24:52.759 --> 00:24:55.279
when I read it because I can
just discover new stuff when I go back

367
00:24:55.319 --> 00:24:59.119
to it, and of course the
killing joke alls you what a time to

368
00:24:59.160 --> 00:25:03.319
be twelve thirteen years old. It's
renaissance, yeah, and you know to

369
00:25:03.480 --> 00:25:07.319
this day it's because of that.
But that show was funnies at the time.

370
00:25:07.440 --> 00:25:11.400
In the mid eighties, people started
taking comic books seriously, and it's

371
00:25:11.480 --> 00:25:14.799
mainly due to Watchmen, But I
argue that people were still saying this was

372
00:25:14.880 --> 00:25:18.720
for kids until Batman blew up.
So now all of the media that we

373
00:25:18.880 --> 00:25:22.720
had been consuming as comic book readers, which was no longer a kiddy cartoon.

374
00:25:22.000 --> 00:25:26.720
He was dealing with very adult issues
and themes. Finally the rest of

375
00:25:26.759 --> 00:25:30.079
America accepted it, but then we
were dealt a horrible blow with Joel Schumacher.

376
00:25:30.400 --> 00:25:33.880
But those don't matter because we're not
talking about them right now. We're

377
00:25:33.880 --> 00:25:37.960
talking about nineteen ninety two Batman,
the animated series, which for the first

378
00:25:38.000 --> 00:25:41.720
time in any media that Batman has
appeared. You can tell the creators are

379
00:25:41.920 --> 00:25:47.880
actually fans. This show deserves a
lot of credit for keeping Batman in the

380
00:25:47.920 --> 00:25:52.359
zeitgeist. It deserves a lot of
credit for keeping a generation of kids younger

381
00:25:52.400 --> 00:25:56.279
than me interested in the characters and
stuff. Because of though Joel Schumacher movies

382
00:25:56.319 --> 00:26:00.960
were so off putting, you know, and you know you can make the

383
00:26:00.160 --> 00:26:03.240
argument then oh, I'm just being
a fuddy duddy and this and that,

384
00:26:03.480 --> 00:26:07.240
or I'm being you know, some
kind of phobic or the other whatever,

385
00:26:07.359 --> 00:26:14.119
because you know, they like Batman
Forever takes a father son relationship and these

386
00:26:14.119 --> 00:26:15.720
two guys who are the same age
living together. Okay, I'm going wrong

387
00:26:15.720 --> 00:26:19.480
with that, but it makes the
relationship that I grew up with weird.

388
00:26:21.799 --> 00:26:23.680
Yeah, it makes it weird to
be when you don't hang on a lot

389
00:26:23.720 --> 00:26:26.240
of biker bars, do you.
I'm like, what kind of line is

390
00:26:26.279 --> 00:26:32.720
that for Robbie to give Batman?
And then the next one is awful too,

391
00:26:33.079 --> 00:26:34.920
And it's too bad because all Cabra
would have been great in a decent

392
00:26:34.960 --> 00:26:41.119
Batman movie, and George Clooney,
would you have been better? Because there's

393
00:26:41.119 --> 00:26:45.400
a couple of scenes and that and
that awful second one, or he's there,

394
00:26:45.400 --> 00:26:51.960
there's a scene where he's because he
him talking to to gras O'donnald is

395
00:26:52.039 --> 00:26:55.599
more fatherly. They look older,
you know, there's the age difference is

396
00:26:55.680 --> 00:26:59.279
more apparent there and him yelling at
him. I make the rules that we

397
00:26:59.359 --> 00:27:03.279
live and you will by by them. I'm like, okay, And then

398
00:27:03.279 --> 00:27:06.440
when he's with Alfred, I'm like, oh, okay, Yeah he deserved

399
00:27:06.920 --> 00:27:11.079
he deserved Batman for Batman Begins or
whatever, and Batman Begins, it kind

400
00:27:11.079 --> 00:27:15.359
of sucks too. They are their
pretentious There's one thing Batman can't be his

401
00:27:15.440 --> 00:27:18.359
pretentious man. We just lost our
one listener. I know, right,

402
00:27:18.480 --> 00:27:22.319
you can't go against the Holy Holy
Trilogy. I will argue that the scripts

403
00:27:22.359 --> 00:27:26.680
for the for Begins and Dark Knight
are pretty good. I don't like the

404
00:27:26.720 --> 00:27:30.920
script for Batman Begins, but then
I've never been a fan of Rasshak Ghul

405
00:27:30.960 --> 00:27:33.519
and that whole plotline. I appreciate
it's where he would come from, but

406
00:27:33.960 --> 00:27:38.319
I don't need any more dealings with
Rasha Ghul or his Ninja assassins. Yeah

407
00:27:38.640 --> 00:27:45.880
that was you know, that was
Denny O'Neil and Neil Adams attempt to James

408
00:27:45.960 --> 00:27:48.279
Bond defy Batman a little bit,
and it works in the comics, but

409
00:27:48.559 --> 00:27:52.079
I and I don't have any trunck
with it. But ultimately it's just I

410
00:27:52.160 --> 00:27:56.559
want Batman in Gotham exactly what you
just said. It turns Batman into an

411
00:27:56.640 --> 00:28:02.920
international affair, like James Bond.
That's fine, and it's fine that Batman

412
00:28:03.039 --> 00:28:07.720
is with the Justice League. But
for me, Batman in Gotham City with

413
00:28:07.880 --> 00:28:11.759
his Rogues gallery. I don't need
one thing more. Yeah that, I

414
00:28:11.920 --> 00:28:14.519
love all of that other stuff.
I love the super Friends, you know.

415
00:28:14.559 --> 00:28:17.319
I would love to make up a
Justice League film. I know how

416
00:28:17.359 --> 00:28:18.079
to do it, I know what
to do with it. But at the

417
00:28:18.200 --> 00:28:22.039
end of the day, don't need
any of it. The only thing that

418
00:28:22.200 --> 00:28:26.759
I just Batman and Gotham and any
other comic book heroes. I don't even

419
00:28:26.759 --> 00:28:29.680
know. I just need Batman,
I think is of the genre, it's

420
00:28:29.799 --> 00:28:34.160
the most interesting, it's the most
contemporary, and it's the most adaptable.

421
00:28:34.759 --> 00:28:37.400
I mean, and I'm talking about
to other media. I'm talking about to

422
00:28:37.519 --> 00:28:42.039
the times. Batman comics can always
be relevant for some reason or the other.

423
00:28:42.720 --> 00:28:48.039
Superman always has to fight for his
relevance. So there's always periods where

424
00:28:48.440 --> 00:28:52.319
in time when you people are going, oh, why Superman, He's not

425
00:28:52.480 --> 00:28:56.039
relevant anymore, and someone's got to
come on, Superman's good because A,

426
00:28:56.200 --> 00:28:59.559
B and C. Batman is always
relevant. That's true. No one ever

427
00:28:59.640 --> 00:29:02.519
has to go, hey, remember
Batman now, and we're gonna forget him.

428
00:29:02.519 --> 00:29:06.039
He's the best guy. He's got
the car. There's the wish fulfillment

429
00:29:06.079 --> 00:29:07.920
of it. To a certain degree, I can be batman. I don't

430
00:29:07.920 --> 00:29:11.160
know anybody would want to, because
losing a parent is the worst, and

431
00:29:11.279 --> 00:29:15.279
there's all these other things, but
I don't know. It doesn't seem like

432
00:29:15.279 --> 00:29:17.640
a fun life. But it doesn't
seem like a fun life at all.

433
00:29:18.160 --> 00:29:21.359
No, he has chosen the hardest
thing he can sensibly do. The only

434
00:29:21.400 --> 00:29:23.119
guy who's really having a good time
is Dick Grayson, and even he had

435
00:29:23.160 --> 00:29:26.920
to go through hell. I bet
Alfred's having a good time. He's at

436
00:29:27.000 --> 00:29:32.279
least amused, right, And if
you keep up with the comics, the

437
00:29:33.359 --> 00:29:36.920
boy I raised and he called her
by now he just calls him my boy.

438
00:29:37.519 --> 00:29:41.359
What those comics really are at their
heart about. It's about this kid

439
00:29:42.079 --> 00:29:48.039
who lost his mom and his dad
horribly, and here's this makeshift family that

440
00:29:48.119 --> 00:29:52.799
he kind of builds for himself.
You know. Yeah, it's about avenging

441
00:29:52.880 --> 00:29:56.519
the night and all this other wonderful
stuff, But there's an emotional heart at

442
00:29:56.559 --> 00:30:00.240
it, and there's always that it
doesn't matter how big the family is,

443
00:30:00.920 --> 00:30:04.279
like in some iterations, just him
in Alfred and other iterations. It's Batman

444
00:30:04.519 --> 00:30:10.400
or Batman and Robin or Batman,
Catwoman in Alfred or now Batman, night

445
00:30:10.480 --> 00:30:15.079
Wing, Red Hood, Red,
Robin, Barbara, Stephanie. It's the

446
00:30:15.200 --> 00:30:19.480
dog's name Ace. His dog is
Ace, and Damian's dog is is Titus.

447
00:30:19.720 --> 00:30:23.079
Damien Wayne is a whole other facet. Okay, we could talk to

448
00:30:23.160 --> 00:30:27.480
this universe forever, but we have
to talk about mister Bruce Tim. So,

449
00:30:27.640 --> 00:30:33.240
Yeah, Bruce Paul the actual architect. I guess the show roaders was

450
00:30:33.279 --> 00:30:36.240
what they would be down. Yeah, Bruce Tim is technically the showrunner.

451
00:30:36.319 --> 00:30:40.880
Paul Denis, story editor, Dan
Rieba, glenmur A COMI. I think

452
00:30:41.000 --> 00:30:42.720
you know that's a bunch of it. It's a lot a group of exceedingly

453
00:30:42.839 --> 00:30:48.440
talented people given them the chance of
a lifetime to make the ultimate Batman television

454
00:30:48.519 --> 00:30:52.400
series, and they fucking did it. Not only as far as story goes.

455
00:30:52.640 --> 00:30:56.440
They finally got plots correct, they
got the characters correct, and they

456
00:30:56.559 --> 00:31:00.359
made it gorgeous. Hand Drawn animation
is a lost art and it was pitiful

457
00:31:00.400 --> 00:31:04.519
on television. The best stuff you
got you had to get from Japan.

458
00:31:04.759 --> 00:31:10.960
Transformers and Gi Joe actually looked pretty
good, but they were made by anime

459
00:31:11.079 --> 00:31:15.240
studios, and they were made by
the cheapest anime studios available. I mean,

460
00:31:15.279 --> 00:31:18.599
the animation is not even great on
them, but forget it. And

461
00:31:18.839 --> 00:31:22.200
like key Man, the animation on
he Man is awful, and it's too

462
00:31:22.240 --> 00:31:26.200
bad because it's from fromation and filmation
and a lot of good stuff in the

463
00:31:26.240 --> 00:31:29.599
seventies. But by he Man,
they're just phoning it in. Man,

464
00:31:29.720 --> 00:31:33.559
it's like they have three or four
rotoscope animation cycles for every character and then

465
00:31:33.559 --> 00:31:36.880
that's what they go with. All
the mighty houses have fallen by nineteen ninety

466
00:31:36.920 --> 00:31:40.920
two, but thank god Warner Brothers. I remember driving I lived in Los

467
00:31:40.960 --> 00:31:42.920
Angeles at the time, and I
remember seeing the Batman, the animated series

468
00:31:44.000 --> 00:31:47.480
billboard go up, which at the
time was just the red silhouette of the

469
00:31:47.559 --> 00:31:51.559
bat of his cowl. There's no
verbiage on it. All I could think,

470
00:31:51.599 --> 00:31:53.759
well, fucking something specials on the
way. Yeah, I remember that.

471
00:31:53.839 --> 00:31:59.000
A lot did that explosion, I
mean a lot of it because of

472
00:31:59.039 --> 00:32:01.240
Spielberg, right, because he influxed
a lot of cash in the Warner Brothers

473
00:32:01.319 --> 00:32:06.599
animation to do tiny tunes and animanias
and stuff, and a lot of the

474
00:32:06.680 --> 00:32:09.240
Batman staff came out of tiny tuons. Pauldineed, for example, came out

475
00:32:09.279 --> 00:32:13.519
of tiny tuons. So all of
these guys come together and the character models

476
00:32:13.559 --> 00:32:16.160
are kind of my favorite of all
time. Bruce Tim's style. If you

477
00:32:16.200 --> 00:32:20.000
look at all of those character models, Yeah, he did all the character

478
00:32:20.119 --> 00:32:22.480
models and his and the show of
alved even with his own style a little

479
00:32:22.480 --> 00:32:27.039
bit, and you know, it's
all they started with. Who was the

480
00:32:27.119 --> 00:32:30.440
designers on the show. He was
a designer, comic book artist Kevin Nolan,

481
00:32:30.680 --> 00:32:34.799
he was literally designer too. There's
a couple other dudes, but Tim,

482
00:32:35.119 --> 00:32:37.839
Bruce Tim was the main guy.
Bruce Tim, I will say here

483
00:32:37.279 --> 00:32:44.640
draws ladies better than any other animator. Every comic book artist has a problem

484
00:32:44.680 --> 00:32:47.079
when they're drawing women. It's either
they drop perfect body in a terrible face

485
00:32:47.240 --> 00:32:52.240
or a perfect face and a terrible
body. Bruce Tim can can. Bruce

486
00:32:52.319 --> 00:32:55.920
Tim can do both. Who's that
fine artist out now that does like all

487
00:32:57.000 --> 00:33:00.640
those a lot of princes, like
very sixties kind of stuff. Yeah,

488
00:33:00.839 --> 00:33:04.559
Shag And the first time I saw
Shag, I'm like, man, that

489
00:33:04.720 --> 00:33:09.319
motherfucker's biting t bur Bruce him.
That guy's that motherfucker. Shag is biting

490
00:33:09.359 --> 00:33:14.000
Bruce Tim, because it's that kind
of Bruce Tim. What I think he

491
00:33:14.119 --> 00:33:17.519
gets it is he gets just the
basic geometry too, like you know who

492
00:33:17.680 --> 00:33:22.799
every character is without any color at
all, but you mentioned the ladies.

493
00:33:22.960 --> 00:33:25.279
He gets the shape, the triangle, the oval. You know, he

494
00:33:25.440 --> 00:33:30.880
gets it. And I think his
style translates so well to animation. You

495
00:33:30.960 --> 00:33:35.359
know, people but the uninformed to
call it cartoony, you know, but

496
00:33:35.599 --> 00:33:39.920
no, it's efficient. It's like
super Friends, they get away, they

497
00:33:40.000 --> 00:33:45.759
try to get away with kind of
more realistic looking, not realistic, but

498
00:33:45.960 --> 00:33:52.880
more anatomically full. Yeah, closer
to realism, closer to the comic book

499
00:33:52.119 --> 00:33:58.279
than not. But to annimate that
it's hard man. So you get a

500
00:33:58.319 --> 00:34:00.759
lot of stiff people with just the
Moutains movie. But with the Bruce Tenn

501
00:34:00.799 --> 00:34:04.279
style, I mean they're able to
be more fluid. I think because it's

502
00:34:04.359 --> 00:34:10.079
there. They're basic shapes on the
animation that's really revolutionary. Everybody's all that's

503
00:34:10.119 --> 00:34:14.159
not going to work. It doesn't
look it looks like a Disney cartoon,

504
00:34:14.920 --> 00:34:16.360
and I think it is. I
think his argument is like, well,

505
00:34:16.400 --> 00:34:20.280
yeah, there's a reason why those
work, and not only the character models

506
00:34:20.320 --> 00:34:23.880
but the animation itself, and the
color palette and the amount of shading and

507
00:34:24.039 --> 00:34:29.400
shadow that goes into this. It's
very that the noir influence is undeniable,

508
00:34:29.719 --> 00:34:32.800
the influence from the Flisher Superman's.
That was when they started. They said,

509
00:34:34.119 --> 00:34:37.280
we want to do the Fleischer Batman. Basically, they want to do

510
00:34:37.400 --> 00:34:42.320
something that was as handsome as those
flags are Supermans and those flights are Superman's

511
00:34:42.440 --> 00:34:45.760
are gorgeous, the most beautiful and
all rotoscope too, by the way,

512
00:34:46.360 --> 00:34:52.400
but very painstakingly, very expensive too. The best cheat on the Batman the

513
00:34:52.440 --> 00:34:57.079
animated show is that all the backgrounds
are in black paper. It gives it

514
00:34:57.719 --> 00:35:00.039
life though, and I was rewatching
it. You know, they've remastered it.

515
00:35:00.079 --> 00:35:04.599
Now it's high daff and stuff,
and you can really see the detail

516
00:35:04.679 --> 00:35:07.519
on it, and it's magnificent.
You can at this point you can almost

517
00:35:07.519 --> 00:35:10.360
see the grain of the paper.
It's it's gorgeous. It's just I want

518
00:35:10.360 --> 00:35:13.920
to say, there's never been anything
like it. But these guys kept chugging

519
00:35:14.000 --> 00:35:17.000
on even after the series ended.
The subsequent shows and you even see it

520
00:35:17.079 --> 00:35:22.320
when this switch is the Superman.
But even the New Adventures season three of

521
00:35:22.400 --> 00:35:24.840
this show, a little lot lighter, no but paper for example, you

522
00:35:24.920 --> 00:35:29.280
know, oh, they've discovered photoshop
the color of them now and then by

523
00:35:29.280 --> 00:35:32.079
the time in Justice League, they're
you know, CG animating the big things

524
00:35:32.239 --> 00:35:36.639
and all that stuff. And it's
not their fault. It's just a budget.

525
00:35:36.679 --> 00:35:38.480
People can'st to get hand of Barbara
for their cheap style. But I

526
00:35:38.599 --> 00:35:44.320
counter that they were the ones keeping
animation alive. So pick your goddamn battles

527
00:35:44.559 --> 00:35:47.719
TV animation because they did the Flintstones. Yeah, the Flintstones is cheaply animated,

528
00:35:47.760 --> 00:35:52.880
but it was popular and it was
on TV for a thousand years,

529
00:35:52.920 --> 00:35:58.840
and you know, yeah, and
Yogi Bear is really cheaply animated. Speak

530
00:35:58.920 --> 00:36:02.400
of writing, we're talking about Paul
Deani because very far into the first season.

531
00:36:02.519 --> 00:36:07.400
First season has what sixty episodes,
So if you haven't seen the show

532
00:36:07.679 --> 00:36:10.039
available on Max right now, you
better get going. There's one hundred and

533
00:36:10.159 --> 00:36:15.719
nine total of the original show plus
the other stuff. This is episode thirty

534
00:36:15.760 --> 00:36:21.960
five, written by Paul Deany,
directed by Dan Arriba and starring Kevin Conroy

535
00:36:22.000 --> 00:36:25.280
as Batman, Mark Hamill is the
Joker, Richard Maul as Harvey two Face,

536
00:36:25.599 --> 00:36:30.400
Arlene Sarkin as Harlene quinzel A word
about Harlene Quinzel and what I was

537
00:36:30.440 --> 00:36:36.079
saying earlier about how each popular iteration
of whatever media Batman happens to appear in

538
00:36:36.119 --> 00:36:40.119
at the time tends to echo.
Everyone loves Harley Quinn. She's been around

539
00:36:40.159 --> 00:36:46.719
forever, right. No. Nineteen
ninety two Harlen quinzell Arkham psychiatrist who becomes

540
00:36:46.760 --> 00:36:52.039
the Joker's paramore and eventual lover of
poison Ivy begins here from the pen of

541
00:36:52.199 --> 00:36:57.119
Paul Deaniy the first they do.
If you go back and watch some of

542
00:36:57.159 --> 00:37:00.440
the old Outam West shows, there
are proto Harley's on that Caesar o'd merrill

543
00:37:00.480 --> 00:37:02.760
always had a girlfriend and stuff,
and there was a couple, you know,

544
00:37:04.000 --> 00:37:06.880
bimbo ones. But I can't believe
this was like a one off character.

545
00:37:07.039 --> 00:37:09.320
And Paul Deedy I think it was, or one of them was friends

546
00:37:09.360 --> 00:37:14.840
with Arlene Zorkin and she was a
soap opera actress and she had done an

547
00:37:14.880 --> 00:37:19.000
episode in Harley gwent costume with kind
of that voice, and now it's like

548
00:37:19.119 --> 00:37:22.599
she's always been there. Yeah,
and she's magnificent, And there are other

549
00:37:22.719 --> 00:37:28.760
Harley's, but she's the gold standard. Also starring in The Penguin There have

550
00:37:28.800 --> 00:37:31.679
been lots of great iterations of the
penguin over the years, Burgess Meredith,

551
00:37:32.559 --> 00:37:38.559
Danny DeVito, Robin Lord Taylor,
now Colin Farrell. But I have a

552
00:37:39.039 --> 00:37:44.280
soft spot in my heart for the
voice of the penguin here, mister Paul

553
00:37:44.400 --> 00:37:49.400
Williams, you know he's in my
head when I you know when he's pretty

554
00:37:49.440 --> 00:37:53.480
good. She doesn't have the raspiness
that like Burgess Meredith had, which I

555
00:37:54.079 --> 00:37:58.920
adore. But he's still playing that
penguin. I believe this penguin doesn't lift

556
00:37:58.960 --> 00:38:01.000
a finger if he doesn't have to. And I love the way he speaks.

557
00:38:01.039 --> 00:38:07.159
I love his alliterations, his quotes, and your malicious decavations. I'm

558
00:38:07.239 --> 00:38:10.800
like man, I love that.
And the script very keenly observes all of

559
00:38:10.880 --> 00:38:15.599
these characters to the point where,
well, of course he's drinking a pot

560
00:38:15.639 --> 00:38:19.840
of tea while they're playing poker,
and of course Harvey two faces drinking coffee

561
00:38:19.920 --> 00:38:22.760
with half and half. The episode
itself, the plot is it finds Batman's

562
00:38:22.840 --> 00:38:25.960
rogues gallery in the form of the
Joker, Penguin, Killer Croc, Harvey

563
00:38:27.079 --> 00:38:30.440
Dent, and Poison Ivy. I
think Harley's in there, but she only

564
00:38:30.480 --> 00:38:34.440
features into the story she features in
the story. Yeah, initially I misremembered

565
00:38:34.480 --> 00:38:37.159
this as them telling stories in prison, but no, they're in a bar.

566
00:38:37.519 --> 00:38:43.000
But that's a traditional thing with Batman
villains. I feel like the upper

567
00:38:43.079 --> 00:38:46.199
echelon Batman villains tend to hang out
with one another to a certain degree.

568
00:38:46.239 --> 00:38:51.719
I feel like there should be a
certain lose camaraderie with them. Okay,

569
00:38:51.719 --> 00:38:54.119
they're not gonna invite Firefly, and
they're not gonna you know, they're not

570
00:38:54.159 --> 00:38:59.000
gonna invite killer Moth, you know
or whatever, or tweetled up with tweetled

571
00:38:59.199 --> 00:39:02.360
But if you the Joker and the
Penguin, you know, And I feel

572
00:39:02.360 --> 00:39:06.239
like they don't like inviting the Joker, but he's gonna go anyways. The

573
00:39:06.440 --> 00:39:10.519
more modern, I guess iterations of
some of these characters whether more than just

574
00:39:10.679 --> 00:39:15.480
loonies that are on a caper,
whereas now they're, you know, the

575
00:39:15.519 --> 00:39:20.079
Scaracole kind of has the corner on
the drug market. The Penguin kind of

576
00:39:20.119 --> 00:39:23.159
feel like stealing the void of the
mobsters in the town, and you know,

577
00:39:23.199 --> 00:39:27.800
they all kind of have their long
running rackets now, rather than the

578
00:39:27.880 --> 00:39:30.039
way of the army before it would
be just whatever random crime and this show

579
00:39:30.079 --> 00:39:34.519
does it when you get to the
Penguin stories, I'd put word out in

580
00:39:34.559 --> 00:39:37.719
the underworld that I was gonna steal
this rare bird and make the main or

581
00:39:37.760 --> 00:39:42.760
whatever. I'm just like, what
like the Bird Crimes the Aviary of Doom.

582
00:39:44.079 --> 00:39:46.000
Paul Williams looks like you know,
I know you're a big fan of

583
00:39:46.079 --> 00:39:51.159
his. Yeah, so you know
he If you're a young person listening to

584
00:39:51.239 --> 00:39:52.960
this, you have no idea who
the hell Paul Williams is. Well,

585
00:39:53.079 --> 00:39:57.239
if you ever heard of the Rainbow
Connection, you know Paul Williams. He

586
00:39:57.320 --> 00:40:00.400
wrote all of them Uppet songs.
If you were bored sometime, you know,

587
00:40:00.639 --> 00:40:05.480
in the seventies or something like any
time before or a little bit after,

588
00:40:06.000 --> 00:40:08.400
this guy was like the go to, Like he was always pumping up

589
00:40:08.440 --> 00:40:10.599
somewhere. If you watch something when
you were a little kid back then,

590
00:40:10.960 --> 00:40:14.960
Paul Williams in an inadvertently show up
at some point, was a Muppet Show

591
00:40:15.360 --> 00:40:17.199
or the A Team or the Dukes
and Hazard he was gonna be a guest

592
00:40:17.280 --> 00:40:22.840
on it. But he's this famous
ass songwriter and singer, and he had

593
00:40:23.039 --> 00:40:27.920
just a string of hits throughout the
seventies. There's really a documentary on him

594
00:40:28.280 --> 00:40:31.320
that I saw not long ago.
It's huge in the Philippines, apparently well

595
00:40:31.400 --> 00:40:36.360
for me. Paul Williams will always
be Swan, the antagonist of Phantom of

596
00:40:36.440 --> 00:40:39.679
the Paradise Brian to Palm was glam
rock musical from nineteen seventy five. You

597
00:40:39.719 --> 00:40:43.639
know, I've seen him perform a
bunch of times. I will attend Paul

598
00:40:43.719 --> 00:40:47.119
Williams huddle me up and sing a
song directly to me because we had requested

599
00:40:47.199 --> 00:40:51.840
the song and he had forgot to
sing it on stage. He just huddled

600
00:40:51.840 --> 00:40:53.000
me up and said, here,
I'll do it for you. And if

601
00:40:53.039 --> 00:40:57.920
you see him visually, he looks
like the comic book Penguin, like he's

602
00:40:57.920 --> 00:41:01.119
a little short diy Lit Shelby,
and he put him in a tuxedo and

603
00:41:01.159 --> 00:41:04.400
a big rubber nose. Man.
He could have just knocked it out of

604
00:41:04.440 --> 00:41:07.679
the park. If this had just
been Batman, the series not animated,

605
00:41:07.880 --> 00:41:10.320
he could have stepped into the role
easily. So these guys all get together

606
00:41:10.599 --> 00:41:15.519
that they have play poker, have
some cocktails or whatever they're gonna do.

607
00:41:15.960 --> 00:41:17.800
Joker's obviously getna cheat at cards.
The first shot of you see him,

608
00:41:19.039 --> 00:41:22.199
he's got all the cards fanned out
in his hands at the same time.

609
00:41:22.519 --> 00:41:27.480
Now Killer Kroc begins telling a story
about Batman. It's important that Killer Kroc

610
00:41:27.719 --> 00:41:30.119
is the one there it who was
The actor is Aaron ken Kaid. He

611
00:41:30.400 --> 00:41:34.440
was an American actor. He looks
like he did a lot of the beach

612
00:41:34.519 --> 00:41:37.719
party bingo movies in the sixties.
He was actually pretty good too. I

613
00:41:37.800 --> 00:41:42.320
look like the tenor of his voice
when he talks, like, let me

614
00:41:42.440 --> 00:41:45.039
tell you a story. I almost
head Batman. I threw a rock at

615
00:41:45.119 --> 00:41:49.679
him. This version of Killer Croc
is great. I hate to default to

616
00:41:49.719 --> 00:41:52.840
the character designs here being so fucking
spectacular, but this is simply the best

617
00:41:53.000 --> 00:41:57.320
Killer Croc of all time. And
he's not even green, No, he's

618
00:41:57.559 --> 00:42:00.599
gray and weird looking. He's a
fucking creek. Now. The character Whaler

619
00:42:00.719 --> 00:42:05.360
Jones is from the South. He's
a black guy now. I think they

620
00:42:05.559 --> 00:42:07.039
write him as a black dude now, But back then he was just you

621
00:42:07.079 --> 00:42:09.800
know, studying on a comic book. Characters always evolve and stuff, especially

622
00:42:09.800 --> 00:42:15.199
if you know their b listers and
they and I liked him in that terrible

623
00:42:15.239 --> 00:42:19.119
Suicide Squad movie. I liked the
performance to a certain degree. And he

624
00:42:19.239 --> 00:42:22.599
looked cool. But this is the
best Killer Croc there's ever been like,

625
00:42:22.039 --> 00:42:25.800
and he's stupid and he's but he's
kind of lovable. They eat in the

626
00:42:27.239 --> 00:42:30.920
in the season three they green them
up in it. But he's got a

627
00:42:30.960 --> 00:42:35.039
great episode of baby Doll and they
like, you know, have a couple,

628
00:42:35.159 --> 00:42:37.280
and it's really well done. It's
a cool character. And I love

629
00:42:37.320 --> 00:42:44.280
the way he plays out of this
and how the other villains are very dismissing

630
00:42:44.360 --> 00:42:46.280
him of him man and by the
end of the episode, you really,

631
00:42:46.320 --> 00:42:50.440
oh Man. Of course he's gonna
use good Killer Crock. Killer Krock is

632
00:42:50.480 --> 00:42:53.079
telling a story about he almost got
Batman. He almost killed Batman, which

633
00:42:53.199 --> 00:42:59.239
prompts a roundtable discussion from the Rogues
Gallery of villains about their favorite or most

634
00:42:59.320 --> 00:43:04.199
important time. I'm the one time
where they almost killed Batman but he got

635
00:43:04.239 --> 00:43:07.880
away. It's almost like they almost
got him. And starting our tails is

636
00:43:08.000 --> 00:43:12.440
the lovely Poison Ivy, who tells
a tale about how she rigged an entire

637
00:43:12.519 --> 00:43:15.880
pumpkin patch at Halloween time with poison
gas. In the original script, evidently

638
00:43:16.199 --> 00:43:20.119
this was supposed to take place at
Christmas time, and she was supposed to

639
00:43:20.239 --> 00:43:24.440
explode a Christmas tree killing everyone in
the vicinity. Standards and Practices said,

640
00:43:24.480 --> 00:43:30.119
Nope, can't do that. There
there is I have a handy dandy Batman

641
00:43:30.280 --> 00:43:34.840
the animated series Bible book. You
know the overview of this of the series

642
00:43:34.880 --> 00:43:39.079
by Pauldiny and famed graphic designer Chip
Kid, which is really me. And

643
00:43:39.119 --> 00:43:45.159
there's a drawing in there of the
there's right here the standard of practices and

644
00:43:45.280 --> 00:43:47.840
as you know, it's all the
stuff that they couldn't do for our listeners.

645
00:43:47.920 --> 00:43:52.199
Let me describe it. It is
Batman and the Joker tussling. They've

646
00:43:52.320 --> 00:43:57.400
broken through and are falling out a
window. The Joker has a forty five

647
00:43:57.519 --> 00:44:00.639
caliber pistol in his hand and has
shot a hole through Batman. There's a

648
00:44:00.880 --> 00:44:05.599
kid sitting on Batman, so that
kid is in danger. There's a hypodermic

649
00:44:05.760 --> 00:44:07.920
needle in the bottom of the frame
falling out. There's also a bottle of

650
00:44:08.000 --> 00:44:13.199
booze and top it off, Catwoman
is on the bottom flying out the window

651
00:44:13.199 --> 00:44:17.360
as well, and she's completely nick
I really want to see this episode.

652
00:44:17.559 --> 00:44:21.480
So like there's standards of practices,
like you read the book, it's just

653
00:44:21.679 --> 00:44:24.559
they were on them like white on
Rice Man. They just would not let

654
00:44:24.639 --> 00:44:29.599
them, so they had of course
get creative and they snuck some stuff in

655
00:44:29.679 --> 00:44:31.920
there. You know, something I
always thought was like super industry interesting,

656
00:44:32.039 --> 00:44:35.440
is so my family's left to you
know, we're super Catholic, right.

657
00:44:35.719 --> 00:44:37.880
I grew up with the Catholic school
my whole life, and you know,

658
00:44:37.000 --> 00:44:40.960
I'm a really you know, you
know, lapsed. I guess I'm growing

659
00:44:42.000 --> 00:44:45.000
up. But anyways, what I
always what struck me about the show this

660
00:44:45.159 --> 00:44:47.320
was the first place I had ever
seen an actual priest on the show.

661
00:44:47.400 --> 00:44:52.599
There was an episode about a gangster
trying to go straight and his brother was

662
00:44:52.679 --> 00:44:57.639
a priest, and you know,
the very nineteen fifties movie kind of episode

663
00:44:58.119 --> 00:45:00.440
that like, what other show are
you going to get a super he shut

664
00:45:00.440 --> 00:45:02.159
and I got a little treat this
on this But the guy's brother was a

665
00:45:02.320 --> 00:45:07.320
priest, not a parson, not
a reverend, not like every other show

666
00:45:07.320 --> 00:45:10.960
always had these generic So I feel
like they kind of fried a little harder

667
00:45:12.360 --> 00:45:15.320
with this show. They tried not
to make a kid show. They just

668
00:45:15.360 --> 00:45:16.840
tried to make a show that everybody
would watch. They made a show that

669
00:45:16.880 --> 00:45:21.559
they wanted to watch. They also
get the regular citizens of Gotham right in

670
00:45:21.639 --> 00:45:25.159
the form of Commissioner Gordon, Rename
Ontoya, and particularly Harvey Bullock. These

671
00:45:25.199 --> 00:45:30.280
are all mainstay characters. They're all
major Batman and they were just background characters

672
00:45:30.320 --> 00:45:31.880
at that point in the comic books. I think re Named Ontoya actually came

673
00:45:31.920 --> 00:45:37.639
from this show, right, and
now she's one of the main supporting casts

674
00:45:37.039 --> 00:45:44.559
in the comics. Very weird because
of the Dark Knight. That's clearly Renee

675
00:45:44.679 --> 00:45:50.280
Ontoya and Harvey Bullock in that movie
where she's the dirty cop and he's they're

676
00:45:50.280 --> 00:45:52.960
both dirty cops or something like that, and it Dark Knight, but their

677
00:45:53.039 --> 00:45:55.519
names are different, and I'm just
like, why the fuck would you change

678
00:45:55.559 --> 00:46:00.440
their name? Clearly John Nolan and
go write some comic books and this is

679
00:46:00.480 --> 00:46:02.719
what they came up with. So
I like the script of that. I'm

680
00:46:02.760 --> 00:46:06.920
like, I see there's a Batman
movie in there, but it gets all

681
00:46:07.159 --> 00:46:10.679
anyways. Rosie Perez ended up playing
her in that weird Birds of Prey movie,

682
00:46:10.719 --> 00:46:15.840
and that was a missed opportunity to
get black Mask correct on screen,

683
00:46:15.239 --> 00:46:19.920
and they just made him a spoiled
rich kid, whereas black Mask is probably

684
00:46:20.000 --> 00:46:23.639
the most terrifying Batman villain. He's
really scared with a black Mask is Yeah,

685
00:46:23.719 --> 00:46:28.280
he's a spoiled rich kid. Okay, he's a spoiled son of a

686
00:46:28.360 --> 00:46:31.599
mobster who was jealous of his dad, so he killed his dad and then

687
00:46:31.800 --> 00:46:38.559
made a skeleton mask out of the
mahogany of the of his dad's casket and

688
00:46:38.719 --> 00:46:45.800
then takes over the Gotham mob In
my eventual Batman, we were gonna say

689
00:46:45.800 --> 00:46:47.440
at this point, right, I'm
gonna do it when I swear there's a

690
00:46:47.480 --> 00:46:51.840
gang war if you did a Banguin
in the black Mask, because those two

691
00:46:51.920 --> 00:46:55.280
characters I don't think could exist in
the same city. Okay. Poison Ivyes,

692
00:46:55.320 --> 00:46:59.719
rigged some pumpkins. It actually kind
of bothered me that she was using

693
00:46:59.760 --> 00:47:04.920
play plants as the explosive device,
Like it seemed like she wouldn't destroy plants

694
00:47:04.960 --> 00:47:07.679
in any form. It's Gotham City. If you're a super villain, you've

695
00:47:07.719 --> 00:47:13.760
got a you've got a drug guy
making you the craziest shit imaginable. Yeah,

696
00:47:13.840 --> 00:47:17.519
this is the every and if you
notice in this episode the wacky drugs

697
00:47:17.639 --> 00:47:22.920
are like I she's I've got this
gas ready for Gotham City and my pumpkins.

698
00:47:23.159 --> 00:47:30.360
The penguin has his poison. The
humming birds with their wacky gas and

699
00:47:30.559 --> 00:47:34.440
you know, wacky poison, and
the Joker's got his joker thing. Batman

700
00:47:34.679 --> 00:47:39.880
and Robin must be high just constantly
throughout. There's a great there's a great

701
00:47:40.000 --> 00:47:44.840
essay by Grant Morrison, who I
think is hip and Denny O'Neil and Bill

702
00:47:44.920 --> 00:47:49.800
Finger, those are the three great
Batman riders. And Grant Morrison says that

703
00:47:50.079 --> 00:47:52.719
you know, Batman's whatever, how
old he is now, but you can

704
00:47:52.800 --> 00:47:55.519
see it. You know, when
he starts out, he's initially twenties.

705
00:47:55.559 --> 00:47:58.840
He doesn't know what he's doing.
He's got a gun for a little bit,

706
00:47:59.480 --> 00:48:01.400
you know, but maybe no that
he meets this kid, so he's

707
00:48:01.440 --> 00:48:05.840
gonna lighten up a little bit.
And by the sixties, you know,

708
00:48:06.360 --> 00:48:12.360
the villains are using so much like
hallucinogenic gases against them that they're actually seeing

709
00:48:12.440 --> 00:48:17.320
the automatopoeia show up on because they're
just hallucinting, so they see pow biff

710
00:48:17.480 --> 00:48:22.360
and bash and all that stuff.
So it's you know, and to a

711
00:48:22.440 --> 00:48:24.639
point, ye, they all use
that shit. They're always gassing Batman,

712
00:48:24.679 --> 00:48:29.039
They're always this and that. It's
just reader Hayworth. Yeah, and in

713
00:48:29.320 --> 00:48:31.800
her flashback she's not wearing her tights. She's just in a bathing, so

714
00:48:31.880 --> 00:48:37.480
she's barefoot. It's oh weird.
They redesign her later, and what's funny,

715
00:48:37.519 --> 00:48:39.880
the design here with the trench coat
and the Casablanca hat will become a

716
00:48:39.960 --> 00:48:44.920
major part of her character design henceforward, it's as important as the leotard,

717
00:48:45.039 --> 00:48:49.000
the sexy version of her. Now
you were going into the Harley, we'll

718
00:48:49.000 --> 00:48:51.360
go back. We'll stick her back
to a Poison Ivy on Harley. But

719
00:48:51.719 --> 00:48:54.960
her redesign is actually one of the
redesigns that I prefer. I love readA

720
00:48:55.000 --> 00:48:58.639
Hayworth. Like I say, I'm
a huge Horson Rolls fan, so obviously

721
00:48:58.719 --> 00:49:01.400
I love readA Hayworth. The Poison
Ivy in the later episodes, where she's

722
00:49:01.480 --> 00:49:07.760
pale with the kind of green undertone
and kind of almost gothy, really plays

723
00:49:07.800 --> 00:49:13.840
well to the characterization of her.
I think Poison Ivy moving forward in comic

724
00:49:13.960 --> 00:49:17.440
media, not talking about Uma Thurman, but in comics and in the video

725
00:49:17.519 --> 00:49:22.119
game certainly, I think that's the
kind of direction they went. The next

726
00:49:22.119 --> 00:49:25.239
story is the Penguin in his aviarya
of Doom. What I really liked about

727
00:49:25.480 --> 00:49:30.559
this is how silent Batman is,
and he's silent pretty much throughout. He

728
00:49:30.639 --> 00:49:36.800
could be cracking wise the entire time. Batman cracks wise with only Alfred and

729
00:49:37.079 --> 00:49:39.719
the kid, you know. But
you know, depends on your dynamic of

730
00:49:39.760 --> 00:49:44.599
the kid. You know, if
it's Dick, it's a little more looser.

731
00:49:44.639 --> 00:49:46.000
If it's one of the younger ones, it's a little more dad like.

732
00:49:46.800 --> 00:49:50.639
I do think that if I was
writing him, you know what,

733
00:49:50.800 --> 00:49:53.159
I give him a lot of not
with the bad guys or with anybody else,

734
00:49:53.199 --> 00:49:57.239
but among the family. I would
write him with bad dad jokes.

735
00:49:57.920 --> 00:50:01.559
Yeah to me. That so Batman
is like this father figure to me work,

736
00:50:01.599 --> 00:50:05.920
you know, with some mino background. But he doesn't he can be

737
00:50:05.920 --> 00:50:08.400
equipping with the bad guys. You
know that Spider Man's job. But if

738
00:50:08.400 --> 00:50:12.239
you know that, there's a theme
in the episode two in the death trap,

739
00:50:12.840 --> 00:50:15.159
they've all got some crazy death trap
and that is the number one Batman

740
00:50:15.360 --> 00:50:19.960
one of the number one Batman troupes
is he gets out of death traps,

741
00:50:20.000 --> 00:50:22.199
he pulls that thing out of his
butility about the last second, pull it

742
00:50:22.239 --> 00:50:25.159
out of his ass in the last
second, you know, and here you

743
00:50:25.239 --> 00:50:29.119
know, he has he's got the
pig. What I like about it is

744
00:50:29.159 --> 00:50:31.239
that think was well, I thought
psipating your genius moves here and getting out

745
00:50:31.239 --> 00:50:35.679
of my death trap. Right,
yeah, I know you're reaching for your

746
00:50:35.760 --> 00:50:39.519
prepared and he talks, well,
here's this ostrich with whatever that's gonna come

747
00:50:39.599 --> 00:50:44.119
eat you. Like he's like Scaramanga, the man with the Golden gun.

748
00:50:44.159 --> 00:50:46.880
He's just practicing and waiting to get
his hands on bond. But he gets

749
00:50:46.880 --> 00:50:50.320
out of it. He's Batman,
that's what he does. But his method

750
00:50:50.400 --> 00:50:55.480
here is birds with poison tipped beaks, birds that are slowly flying after Batman,

751
00:50:55.880 --> 00:51:01.519
this heavily armored super vigilante. But
Batman's solution is fucking ingenius. He

752
00:51:01.679 --> 00:51:06.000
just turns the sprinklers on and it
wints the birds down and they can't fly.

753
00:51:06.280 --> 00:51:08.320
And that's what's so great about that
Character's always love too. It's just

754
00:51:08.639 --> 00:51:13.119
his ability to problem solve, you
know, it just it's always that's all

755
00:51:13.159 --> 00:51:15.599
right, I got this on Batman. The greatest innovation from The Dark Knight

756
00:51:15.679 --> 00:51:20.800
returns Frank Miller's book was we finally
got to hear Batman's inner monologue, which

757
00:51:20.960 --> 00:51:23.760
is missing in the adamptation. But
we'll get to that one night when we

758
00:51:23.840 --> 00:51:28.800
cut to the next episode. Yeah, so for Batman fans, now we

759
00:51:29.280 --> 00:51:32.920
know about what he's saying to himself. So even if you see him in

760
00:51:34.000 --> 00:51:37.079
a silent scenario, you know the
wheels are turning in there. There's something

761
00:51:37.159 --> 00:51:42.440
that the Miller misses, I think, and I love the Miller. My

762
00:51:42.559 --> 00:51:45.840
favorite Batman stories. That's when my
first ones were Year one and Dark Knight

763
00:51:45.920 --> 00:51:51.880
Returns, and then Grant Morrison's Archaemus
Alumals were really like and of course killy

764
00:51:51.960 --> 00:51:54.559
joke. But Miller's interior monologue is
really good, but it's very hard.

765
00:51:54.639 --> 00:51:59.360
Ones in Year one when he's writing
the younger Bruce Wayne, I like the

766
00:51:59.440 --> 00:52:01.559
vulnerable of him trying to figure it
out and he's just no, I'm not

767
00:52:01.639 --> 00:52:05.039
a killer. But the penguin.
But the one thing I have to say

768
00:52:05.079 --> 00:52:08.119
about the penguin, it is the
most atypical I mean, it is the

769
00:52:08.239 --> 00:52:14.079
most typical penguin story imaginable. Yeah, when you think about the penguin,

770
00:52:14.360 --> 00:52:16.920
this is clearly it. The Bois
and Ivy one is all right, but

771
00:52:17.039 --> 00:52:22.840
it's not a traditional It's not a
boys and Ivy story. Is she kisses

772
00:52:22.920 --> 00:52:27.880
some powerful man into doing something to
save the environment. But and at the

773
00:52:27.920 --> 00:52:30.559
same time committed crime. The remarkable
thing is each of the stories presented here

774
00:52:30.679 --> 00:52:36.079
boil their character down to their basics, except Poison Ivy. And maybe this

775
00:52:36.239 --> 00:52:38.960
is because it was in a pumpkin
patch that it's jogging this sort of connection.

776
00:52:39.199 --> 00:52:44.400
But that story should have been Scarecrow. There's no seduction part. There's

777
00:52:44.440 --> 00:52:47.519
no part where she uses seduction in
any way. It's just about blowing shit

778
00:52:47.639 --> 00:52:52.360
up. And the thing is,
and I think the character of Poison Ivy

779
00:52:52.400 --> 00:52:59.400
really matured in all media because of
this show, because she matures in her

780
00:52:59.480 --> 00:53:01.719
episode too. They develop her a
lot over the road of the show.

781
00:53:02.159 --> 00:53:06.400
You know, I think she's very
kind of one dimensional, and by the

782
00:53:06.480 --> 00:53:07.639
end of it, you kind of
understood, Look, she's got these plant

783
00:53:07.719 --> 00:53:10.840
children and she cares about her children. Oh, I see her connection to

784
00:53:10.880 --> 00:53:14.239
the you know, it's a little
bit both, Yeah, and the teaming

785
00:53:14.280 --> 00:53:16.920
here with Harley and realizing after all
these years, Oh yeah, of course

786
00:53:16.960 --> 00:53:21.719
she's gay. But of course poison
it is gay. That was something like

787
00:53:21.960 --> 00:53:25.519
she's so hyper sexual and in her
powers and all that stuff. Of course

788
00:53:25.559 --> 00:53:30.960
she doesn't love these guys. Yeah, and like when they got together it

789
00:53:30.159 --> 00:53:36.519
was this of course, but it
started as this weird sex fantasy, not

790
00:53:36.599 --> 00:53:38.079
a weird sex fantasy, because it's
a sex fantasy that I would have written

791
00:53:38.119 --> 00:53:42.519
to a twenty something years old do. But it's just, hey, let's

792
00:53:42.519 --> 00:53:45.199
get these two guys and these two
girls in their underwear. Togain. I

793
00:53:45.280 --> 00:53:50.840
like that her eventual acceptance of her
homosexuality echoes backwards because in this one there's

794
00:53:50.880 --> 00:53:54.280
tension between her and Two Face because
they used to date. I wonder why

795
00:53:54.320 --> 00:53:58.199
it didn't work out. She there
was an episode, it was one of

796
00:53:58.280 --> 00:54:01.679
her first episodes. She was dating
Harvey Dent before it became Two Face,

797
00:54:02.119 --> 00:54:07.960
and she was manipulating him and it
was like in the early runs of the

798
00:54:07.159 --> 00:54:09.440
earlier episodes, and she was,
you know, using him as one of

799
00:54:09.440 --> 00:54:14.239
the vict It's kind of incredible how
influential. The more you get into it,

800
00:54:14.320 --> 00:54:16.880
the more you look at all the
characters and situations and everything like this

801
00:54:17.119 --> 00:54:22.800
is informed Batman. The next story
is the Two Face one, the Giant

802
00:54:22.920 --> 00:54:27.159
Penny, and the penny, of
course is common knowledge lives in that batcave.

803
00:54:27.360 --> 00:54:29.320
You know, if you were a
passing fan of the comics of the

804
00:54:29.400 --> 00:54:32.280
TV show, you would always see
these the trophies that Batman has in the

805
00:54:32.360 --> 00:54:37.320
Batcave a Tyrannosaurus rex and a giant
typewriter and a joker card, and there

806
00:54:37.400 --> 00:54:44.360
was this giant penny. Most people
believe that the penny comes from Two Face.

807
00:54:45.199 --> 00:54:49.920
Not true. The penny originated in
a nineteen forty seven issue I think

808
00:54:50.360 --> 00:54:53.519
called the Penny Plunder, and that
was a prop and that story and Batman

809
00:54:53.639 --> 00:54:57.199
kept it. I think it worked
so much better. It does work better.

810
00:54:57.320 --> 00:55:00.719
And another death truck. Ah,
Batman, I've got you tied to

811
00:55:00.800 --> 00:55:05.599
this penny and I'm gonna flip this
coin and smush you like good Lord Adams

812
00:55:05.639 --> 00:55:07.280
could have been tied to that thing
he sais literally, you know, I

813
00:55:07.320 --> 00:55:10.280
think it was a fly swatter they
were tied to on the sixties show or

814
00:55:10.320 --> 00:55:14.760
something like that, you know.
But again, that's a Batman trope.

815
00:55:14.800 --> 00:55:16.079
Is a death trap. I love
this is Richard Mole, by the way,

816
00:55:16.159 --> 00:55:20.400
playing two Face. It's a great
version of two Face. You know.

817
00:55:20.480 --> 00:55:22.960
As a little kid, you know, I watched night Court, so

818
00:55:22.039 --> 00:55:25.159
you know, wow, I haven't
seen night Ball like it was that.

819
00:55:25.639 --> 00:55:30.280
But he's so good because his two
face before getting scarred is really just a

820
00:55:30.360 --> 00:55:34.079
normal guy and it really does a
lot of things with the voice. When

821
00:55:34.119 --> 00:55:37.480
I find a music about the whole
scenario is if the Penny Lane lands face

822
00:55:37.599 --> 00:55:40.400
down, Batman's going to be squished, But if it lands face up,

823
00:55:40.599 --> 00:55:45.320
he's going to be broken into pieces. Anyway, I've seen it online.

824
00:55:45.360 --> 00:55:47.199
There's a you know, there's a
million things on YouTube. Yeah, and

825
00:55:47.320 --> 00:55:52.679
one of it was like, there's
a psychologist trying to psychoanalyze these characters.

826
00:55:53.559 --> 00:55:55.559
I don't think he even gets it
right. I've been reading. I know

827
00:55:55.679 --> 00:55:59.960
these characters better than the psychologist does. And he said, two face,

828
00:56:00.199 --> 00:56:02.840
this thing is actually OCD And I'm
like, that's part of it. And

829
00:56:04.039 --> 00:56:07.639
Harvey Dend's a really rich character.
They explored him a lot on the show.

830
00:56:07.920 --> 00:56:10.280
They really go through the whole transformation
with him. He's Harvey dead for

831
00:56:10.320 --> 00:56:15.639
a while, then he becomes too. It's on a TV show. Now,

832
00:56:15.800 --> 00:56:19.239
Harvey Dentz the guy, and he
doesn't. He turns into Harvard into

833
00:56:19.280 --> 00:56:22.280
two Face at the end of season
two. And you've liked this guy,

834
00:56:22.480 --> 00:56:24.960
you know all this time? Oh
jeez, now he's his monster and you

835
00:56:25.039 --> 00:56:28.400
know, for a sixty something and
whatever, how many episodes they do this

836
00:56:28.440 --> 00:56:32.000
show. That's pretty cool to develop
on a kids show that much character development

837
00:56:32.239 --> 00:56:37.599
and continuity like it's And the cool
thing is that all the episodes still operate

838
00:56:37.679 --> 00:56:42.199
as their own little individual short films. As serialized as it is, it's

839
00:56:42.280 --> 00:56:45.039
really epistomic. You can still drop
in anywhere. That's the neat trick that

840
00:56:45.159 --> 00:56:52.079
these shows were doing on regular epis
television. There was never any attempt at

841
00:56:52.119 --> 00:56:55.280
a through line. So that's pretty
neat. I mean, that's very sophisticated

842
00:56:55.400 --> 00:57:00.079
for a show I think aimed essentially
a teenagers in college kid. It's drafting

843
00:57:00.159 --> 00:57:04.400
off of the success of the Batman
film. Speaking of which, the theme

844
00:57:04.480 --> 00:57:07.519
for this show, much like Star
Trek Generation looked over at Star Trek the

845
00:57:07.559 --> 00:57:10.480
motion picture and said, hey,
you know that main theme you've got there?

846
00:57:10.719 --> 00:57:13.800
I could I just take a look
at it. I'm just gonna hold

847
00:57:13.840 --> 00:57:16.239
it. No, I'm just gonna
hold it here. On Batman the animated

848
00:57:16.280 --> 00:57:21.719
series, they appropriated Danny Elfman's score, which you know, of course it's

849
00:57:21.760 --> 00:57:24.360
brilliant. How can you not love
it. What Shirley Walker ends up doing,

850
00:57:24.519 --> 00:57:29.840
though, is pretty magnificent because she
doesn't ate a score at all.

851
00:57:30.880 --> 00:57:34.360
She likes she builds on it and
makes it her own and I always are

852
00:57:34.400 --> 00:57:42.400
her liking, really liking dum dum
du dum dum du. The other thing

853
00:57:42.519 --> 00:57:45.800
is just an echo of some other
Batman because it's and it's majestic, and

854
00:57:45.960 --> 00:57:50.239
it's and they do it in massive
the phantasm with the choir. It's great

855
00:57:50.559 --> 00:57:53.079
that lady, she got a lot
of accolades for the show, but her

856
00:57:53.159 --> 00:57:58.599
name should be more more well known. And I wish she had been able

857
00:57:58.679 --> 00:58:04.239
to do films. The Batman films
criminally underused because you know, I don't

858
00:58:04.280 --> 00:58:06.559
want to. I don't like the
bash on their filmmakers, so I want

859
00:58:06.599 --> 00:58:07.639
to like, Oh, I don't
like the louva movie Outo. But those

860
00:58:07.679 --> 00:58:13.119
movies don't have a theme. There
certainly hasn't been one memorable Batman theme score

861
00:58:14.239 --> 00:58:19.519
in Batman and Nolan's defense, since
The Batman, there hasn't been a memorable

862
00:58:19.559 --> 00:58:22.920
superhero score either. Star Spangled Man
for Captain America's pretty catchy. Okay,

863
00:58:23.159 --> 00:58:27.920
all right, well that's fair.
We ever heard the Who's Batman cover?

864
00:58:28.400 --> 00:58:30.280
Okay, We're gonna listen to that
later. Yeah, they do. They

865
00:58:30.360 --> 00:58:35.679
have a cover of the sixties song
that they dropped in the sixties, Batman's

866
00:58:35.679 --> 00:58:39.159
Everywhere Man. That was what's cool
about I think on our last podcast I

867
00:58:39.280 --> 00:58:43.760
was on and I said that movies
aren't cool. Yeah, but nineteen eighty

868
00:58:43.880 --> 00:58:47.559
nine Batman was very cool. Prince
was very cool. Prince had a whole

869
00:58:47.599 --> 00:58:52.679
fucking album of it, and it's
terrible and it's ridiculous and it's brilliant.

870
00:58:52.880 --> 00:58:55.559
I love that album separately from the
film, although I do like hearing it

871
00:58:55.639 --> 00:59:00.440
in some of the backgrounds of the
scenes and the opening they're playing the Future,

872
00:59:00.719 --> 00:59:04.679
which you only hear briefly, But
that's a fucking great song. I've

873
00:59:04.719 --> 00:59:07.280
seen the Future and it will be. Oh yeah, I've seen the future

874
00:59:07.400 --> 00:59:09.800
and it will be. I love
that whole album and get shit on a

875
00:59:09.880 --> 00:59:14.639
lot. But he was right.
You can't convinced. My friend Todd Rowling

876
00:59:14.719 --> 00:59:16.960
Cutter, and we were I think
we were starting high school or the eighth

877
00:59:17.000 --> 00:59:21.199
there or something. There's a talent
show and I'm like, hey, let's

878
00:59:21.280 --> 00:59:24.880
dress up like the Joker and Batman
and act out the Batman. I want

879
00:59:24.880 --> 00:59:28.880
to get laid. At some point
in my life, I was trying to

880
00:59:28.920 --> 00:59:30.320
direct, you know. Then I
went as a Joker for that Halloween.

881
00:59:30.400 --> 00:59:36.599
My aunt made me this gangster ass
velvet like top, you know, the

882
00:59:36.719 --> 00:59:39.199
tuxedo coat with the tails. Yeah, and I had some pajama pans and

883
00:59:39.280 --> 00:59:43.880
my sisters. Man, I was
a gangster. It was so cool at

884
00:59:43.920 --> 00:59:46.360
the Flower that squirt water and shit, and it was the best. All

885
00:59:46.440 --> 00:59:50.880
the movies had a cool song in
it that's so seen, the manche song,

886
00:59:51.000 --> 00:59:57.119
and Batman returns that YouTube banger from
Batman Forever, and the worst Batman

887
00:59:57.239 --> 01:00:00.760
movie has the best song, that
Smashing Pumpkins song. Reading an interview,

888
01:00:01.199 --> 01:00:04.360
he said, why did you do
this movie? He's like, I like

889
01:00:04.480 --> 01:00:07.119
Batman comic books, and I wrote
a song about Batman. This so exactly

890
01:00:07.159 --> 01:00:12.480
about Batman. So it's cool.
But this episode is great because I love

891
01:00:12.960 --> 01:00:15.519
it boils down all the characters and
as you know, the two Face with

892
01:00:15.679 --> 01:00:20.679
his coin and traditional because it ends
the way ninety percent of all Two Face

893
01:00:20.760 --> 01:00:23.199
movie appears. His end, Batman
fucked with his coin. This is what

894
01:00:23.400 --> 01:00:27.039
he pickpocketed the coin off of him. This is the first time I've ever

895
01:00:27.119 --> 01:00:30.880
seen the coin damaged on the edge
though. That's true because they needed it

896
01:00:30.000 --> 01:00:32.599
to be. They needed to because
I've got my little replica of the coin

897
01:00:32.599 --> 01:00:37.159
in my bedroom. Still. It's
the book The Pitch so it's very quick.

898
01:00:37.239 --> 01:00:38.679
Essentially, he does something with the
coin to fuck up two Face.

899
01:00:38.840 --> 01:00:42.960
It's part in person. Like I
said, each of these episodes so perfectly

900
01:00:43.119 --> 01:00:45.719
encapsulates each of the characters without having
to do it in twenty two minutes.

901
01:00:46.000 --> 01:00:50.400
Not that any of these stories wouldn't
be fine in a twenty two minute segment,

902
01:00:50.760 --> 01:00:52.519
You Knows the Penny. After Batman
escapes the penny in mid air,

903
01:00:52.880 --> 01:00:55.599
it lands on the goons. But
yeah, they don't kill the goons.

904
01:00:55.719 --> 01:01:00.599
Oh it kills them. That coin
slamming down on those guys. They are

905
01:01:00.599 --> 01:01:06.159
at least never walking again. Batman
didn't kill those people. Kamail nan Gianni

906
01:01:06.199 --> 01:01:08.960
has this theory that Batman has a
different definition of death than the rest of

907
01:01:09.039 --> 01:01:13.960
us. But here's the thing with
him and killing. It's like Batman's arch

908
01:01:14.079 --> 01:01:19.639
enemy isn't the Joker. Archenemy is
death. Batman's arch enemy is Bruce Wayne.

909
01:01:20.239 --> 01:01:23.199
Maybe one of those is keeping him
from being Batman forever. Well that's

910
01:01:23.239 --> 01:01:25.519
the thing though, if he stops
being Bruce Wayne, he's gonna fall into

911
01:01:25.519 --> 01:01:29.400
this trap or just being that guy, and he needs to go out and

912
01:01:29.440 --> 01:01:31.880
get laid. I don't like if
Zack Snyder had him drink. Batman does

913
01:01:32.000 --> 01:01:37.719
not drink, He does not smoke
weed. He he does meditation. Like

914
01:01:37.039 --> 01:01:42.800
everything he does is perfect. He
only eats lead meats. Zack Snyder's whole

915
01:01:42.840 --> 01:01:45.760
take on Batman is based off of
Frank Miller's Dark Knight Returns. But in

916
01:01:45.880 --> 01:01:51.800
that story, but Bruce Wayne has
been retired for years and years and that's

917
01:01:51.840 --> 01:01:54.280
why he's drinking. His Bruce Wayne
copes with his parents. He's absolutely quote

918
01:01:54.320 --> 01:01:59.000
is like his Bruce Wayne copes with
his parents' death banging women and drinking.

919
01:01:59.119 --> 01:02:01.079
And I'm like, no, he
comes with his parents' death by being Batman.

920
01:02:01.159 --> 01:02:05.159
He doesn't do Batman halfway. I
you know the things I like.

921
01:02:05.519 --> 01:02:07.679
Ben Affleck's another actor. I think
that would have been fine in a better

922
01:02:07.760 --> 01:02:12.719
movie, because he's actually pretty good
in the movie. I don't like what

923
01:02:12.920 --> 01:02:15.840
his Batman's up to. I don't
like that he's got wanting to kill people

924
01:02:15.000 --> 01:02:20.719
and and you know whatever. But
like when he's goofing off as Bruce Wayne

925
01:02:20.760 --> 01:02:23.639
and then he's nice shoes, that's
fucking great. And when he's in the

926
01:02:23.679 --> 01:02:27.440
bat gave with Alfred, he's great. And he's even in the suit and

927
01:02:27.559 --> 01:02:30.880
that fight scene is amazing. Yeah, but anyways, this show, on

928
01:02:30.960 --> 01:02:35.599
the other hand, he's never off
and this in this episode shows you how

929
01:02:36.039 --> 01:02:39.760
well rounded and except Batman does all
these ridiculous things in these episode and it's

930
01:02:39.800 --> 01:02:44.159
all believable because the character, it's
all part of his you know, makeup,

931
01:02:44.199 --> 01:02:45.519
and you know, now we get
to and each episode shows you the

932
01:02:45.559 --> 01:02:49.199
villain more or less at their core. And of course, now the Joker,

933
01:02:49.480 --> 01:02:54.119
the episode that short encompasses what the
Jokers like. First gag was taking

934
01:02:54.159 --> 01:02:58.679
over a radio station and telling I'm
at a murder. This guy, the

935
01:02:58.760 --> 01:03:01.360
Joker, takes over TV shows all
the time. He does it in the

936
01:03:01.519 --> 01:03:07.079
Roland movies, he does it in
Love That Joke movies. The Joker understands

937
01:03:07.119 --> 01:03:09.280
the power of media better than any
other Batman velt. Yeah, he's the

938
01:03:09.360 --> 01:03:13.679
show business guy. They've kind of
turned the Riddler into that with the latest

939
01:03:13.760 --> 01:03:16.599
film him taking over the broadcast airwaves. Yeah, but the Riddler, I

940
01:03:16.719 --> 01:03:21.400
think is more about I like the
Riddler with the death traps. They've gone

941
01:03:21.440 --> 01:03:24.079
the extra fucking mile here, given
us a television broadcast that is somehow more

942
01:03:24.159 --> 01:03:30.679
consistent than Late Night with the Devil, where the Joker takes over the dark

943
01:03:30.719 --> 01:03:35.199
Knighty Jernsys or TV show the Joker
takes over and then that gets aped in

944
01:03:35.599 --> 01:03:38.920
and the Woking Phoenix Tophilps movie Joker
takes over the TV show. Yeah,

945
01:03:39.000 --> 01:03:43.960
and oh there's Harley and again you
know, Harley Guinn, this character that

946
01:03:44.480 --> 01:03:47.079
was supposed to be a one off
and they liked the design of like nostringerback

947
01:03:47.119 --> 01:03:52.000
we I'm friends with this actress and
that voice and that performance is ah,

948
01:03:52.280 --> 01:03:57.440
what's you know? Like it goes
from this to down and it makes you

949
01:03:57.599 --> 01:04:01.800
believe that's not Harley's real voice.
Harley talks like you or me, you

950
01:04:01.880 --> 01:04:04.840
know. Okay, she might be
from the you know, Brooklyn or the

951
01:04:04.880 --> 01:04:10.880
Bronx or whatever, but she's a
friggin I mean, she's a psychiatrist.

952
01:04:10.920 --> 01:04:14.679
She's a medical doctor. She's got
it. She went to If she's a

953
01:04:14.880 --> 01:04:17.400
psychiatrist, then she's a doctor,
you know, because there's a difference between

954
01:04:17.400 --> 01:04:21.119
a psychologist and a psychiatrist. And
psychologists you get a PhD and you just

955
01:04:21.239 --> 01:04:28.280
do therapy. A psychiatrist really just
gives you plays. Some of them do

956
01:04:28.440 --> 01:04:30.920
the therapy so they know what pills
to give you, but for the most

957
01:04:30.960 --> 01:04:36.480
part, they just give you bills. She was a clinical psychiatrist that worked

958
01:04:36.599 --> 01:04:43.880
in an insane asylum and who was
an Olympic alternat or something. She was

959
01:04:44.000 --> 01:04:45.239
that girl you went to high school
with it. You never saw it because

960
01:04:45.280 --> 01:04:50.159
she was always away at some tournament
or something. She was this overachieving perfection

961
01:04:50.559 --> 01:04:55.159
like you. They don't explore that
enough. The last episode of the series,

962
01:04:55.239 --> 01:04:58.920
Madlove delves right into it, and
it's based in a great comic too,

963
01:04:59.400 --> 01:05:00.960
by these guys, by these guys, and they finally give you what

964
01:05:01.159 --> 01:05:05.840
she's about. Ultimately, she's the
star almost of this entire series because but

965
01:05:06.039 --> 01:05:09.199
you don't care. She's such a
delightful character, and you know what,

966
01:05:09.360 --> 01:05:12.719
it doesn't feel anything but natural.
I've got kind of a criticism of the

967
01:05:12.760 --> 01:05:15.760
fucking Star Wars universe. And I
know I'm not the first person to say

968
01:05:15.800 --> 01:05:19.639
it, but that fucking cowboy had
a guy, Dave Faaloni slowly sticking all

969
01:05:19.719 --> 01:05:25.960
of his characters into every fucking possible
media, cementing his place in the universe.

970
01:05:26.360 --> 01:05:29.480
It's like, we get it,
man, you didn't create Star Wars,

971
01:05:29.559 --> 01:05:33.039
but you're goddamn gonna make sure we
remember your name. I never felt

972
01:05:33.079 --> 01:05:39.000
that way about Paul Deny or Bruce
Tim They kept building characters, and it

973
01:05:39.199 --> 01:05:44.079
just kept happening, and it just
kept getting better, and they kept any

974
01:05:44.239 --> 01:05:46.880
new character they created was equally good
as the ones that were already there.

975
01:05:47.039 --> 01:05:51.000
Also, another thing is that characters
that are invented, that are created for

976
01:05:51.519 --> 01:05:57.400
outside media rather than the comic books
always suck. Right, Who the fuck

977
01:05:57.519 --> 01:06:00.760
is Matt Shrek not Stretcher but black? He should have been that They could

978
01:06:00.800 --> 01:06:03.639
have rewritten him as an industrialist who, by the end of it is worrying

979
01:06:03.679 --> 01:06:06.199
his black skull mask because they would
have been. Now he's just got a

980
01:06:06.239 --> 01:06:11.280
superhircut. And he's named after a
German silent film star that only was in

981
01:06:11.360 --> 01:06:14.119
one movie because he was really a
vampire. But that's in a whole other

982
01:06:15.199 --> 01:06:18.400
That's a whole other thing. And
Harley's a character that I should hate right

983
01:06:18.559 --> 01:06:23.960
like that, as a devotee of
the comics that I learned how to read

984
01:06:24.039 --> 01:06:27.599
on or whatever and raised me as
a fault you know, has played that

985
01:06:27.719 --> 01:06:30.559
pother figure because of that comic book. She's awesome. I was a kid.

986
01:06:30.599 --> 01:06:34.360
I was working at the Warner Brothers
studio store and I worked on the

987
01:06:34.480 --> 01:06:40.880
art gallery and in nineteen ninety three
or whatever. So were my first jobs

988
01:06:41.239 --> 01:06:44.360
ninety four, ninety five, whatever
it was. You know what, Harley

989
01:06:44.400 --> 01:06:49.320
shit Be sold the Little Statues a
couple hundred dollars. She was two years

990
01:06:49.360 --> 01:06:54.320
old, that character and already a
phenomenon. And the reason why is that

991
01:06:54.400 --> 01:06:57.519
even though she's the Joker's girlfriend,
Harley's not a murderer. Really. I'm

992
01:06:57.519 --> 01:07:00.280
sure she's killed a bunch of people, but at her heart, he's not

993
01:07:00.760 --> 01:07:05.320
evil, right, She's misguided,
and she's a lot like Bart Simpson.

994
01:07:05.800 --> 01:07:10.760
Let's be real. She'll feed you
to hyenas Mart Simpson the ten year old

995
01:07:10.800 --> 01:07:15.480
equivalent of because they're pure id.
They're just pure id impulse. Harley's gonna

996
01:07:15.480 --> 01:07:19.440
do it for you. Speaking of
perfect casting, the final segment belongs to

997
01:07:20.079 --> 01:07:26.079
the Joker, and you can't get
much more perfect casting than this. Mark

998
01:07:26.320 --> 01:07:29.840
hamil Mark Hammill's a genius, man. I think he's one of the finest

999
01:07:30.239 --> 01:07:32.880
character actors out that you know.
And I think we were robbed of a

1000
01:07:32.960 --> 01:07:39.199
really delicious movie career from him because, you know, Milosh Foreman didn't want

1001
01:07:39.239 --> 01:07:43.800
to cast them Skywalker in Amadeis or
everybody just saw Luke Skywalker and didn't want

1002
01:07:43.840 --> 01:07:45.159
to give him a shot after Star
Wars, and I'm like, you watch

1003
01:07:45.199 --> 01:07:49.519
Star Wars. He's really good at
that, Like he's a spoiler, Brad

1004
01:07:49.840 --> 01:07:55.000
and the first one and by the
last one, she's the most unbelievable badass

1005
01:07:55.000 --> 01:07:58.519
in the galaxy. And you buy
him defeating going up in the Emperor and

1006
01:07:59.199 --> 01:08:01.360
this little tidy. He was a
little bigger than Michael J. Fox doing

1007
01:08:01.480 --> 01:08:05.920
all of this. Geuse's a good
actor and you buy that shit, and

1008
01:08:06.039 --> 01:08:09.960
all we get is Corvette Summer.
Mean, come on, I was excited.

1009
01:08:10.079 --> 01:08:14.599
Remember Slipstream Luke Skywalker in a different
space outfit with funky blonde hair.

1010
01:08:14.760 --> 01:08:17.479
Jim Curry's joker just didn't cut the
mustard for these guys. And then they

1011
01:08:17.600 --> 01:08:21.399
read Mark Campbell went in just because
he wanted to be a part of it.

1012
01:08:21.520 --> 01:08:26.880
And he read a character in Heart
of Ice. He reads dagged or

1013
01:08:26.920 --> 01:08:30.199
when there's a Daggon on the show, he reads the antagonist that causes Victor

1014
01:08:30.279 --> 01:08:34.560
Freeze to become mister Freeze. I've
heard that, Tim Curry. It's not

1015
01:08:34.800 --> 01:08:38.199
bad, you know. I would
have liked to have seen a live action

1016
01:08:38.359 --> 01:08:41.359
Jim Curry. He would have been
dynamic man. He would have been amazing.

1017
01:08:41.399 --> 01:08:44.039
He would have gotten the fact that
the Jokers a showmen, and he

1018
01:08:44.039 --> 01:08:45.800
would be give you a song and
dance and you never know what he's gonna

1019
01:08:45.840 --> 01:08:48.479
do next. And you know,
had he continued in the part, we

1020
01:08:48.560 --> 01:08:51.520
were going to get a lot of
singing episodes, Yeah, we weren't going

1021
01:08:51.560 --> 01:08:55.279
to get a lot of singing jokers. Much loved to Tim Currey. I

1022
01:08:55.319 --> 01:08:57.920
mean, we all love Tim Carrey, but you listen to Mark Hampbell,

1023
01:08:58.000 --> 01:09:01.279
and when Mark Hamill does is to
find what the joker sounds like. I

1024
01:09:01.359 --> 01:09:06.079
think everybody listens to everybody kind of
does an impression of him. Even Keith

1025
01:09:06.159 --> 01:09:10.800
Ledger to a certain degree, kind
of gets into that little neighborhood, that

1026
01:09:10.960 --> 01:09:15.000
kind of low Gravelly neighborhood that Mark
Hamill sometimes visited, and he voices him

1027
01:09:15.039 --> 01:09:19.920
like a looney to his character almost
other times like he does every word is

1028
01:09:20.000 --> 01:09:26.279
a meal to this guy, and
like he's an actor over actors dream almost

1029
01:09:26.399 --> 01:09:29.960
like I can you can just cut
loose with it. And the chemistry that

1030
01:09:30.000 --> 01:09:33.000
he develops with Kevin Conroy over the
years is magnificent. They were so good

1031
01:09:33.079 --> 01:09:39.560
together. Yeah, because when I
hear Batman and anything that's that's a voice

1032
01:09:39.560 --> 01:09:44.720
I hears Kevin Conroy's obviously, you
know. Oh, the episode Batman escapes

1033
01:09:45.039 --> 01:09:48.640
the Joker's Crazy DEATHTOPI is a catwoman
and he and the Jokers all these I

1034
01:09:48.840 --> 01:09:53.479
almost got him, but Batman got
aways. Yeah, but I got Catwoman

1035
01:09:53.560 --> 01:09:57.960
tied up in a cat food factory
downtown and I'm gonna send him a nice

1036
01:09:58.000 --> 01:10:01.079
bag of cat food tomorrow. I
got but then Killer Croc starts talking.

1037
01:10:01.680 --> 01:10:05.680
So it's Batman disguised as Killer Croc. This is why cartoons ultimately and are

1038
01:10:05.720 --> 01:10:10.359
the best medium for this kind of
shit. There's that reveal, So that's

1039
01:10:10.359 --> 01:10:14.600
the shot. It's a profile or
three quarter profile on Killer Crock with the

1040
01:10:14.720 --> 01:10:18.079
swinging overhead lamp swinging off, and
in the shadow it becomes Batman and swings

1041
01:10:18.079 --> 01:10:21.800
back as Killer Crock and in the
shadow it's Batman again. It's painstaking,

1042
01:10:21.920 --> 01:10:26.920
it costs money, but they fucking
did it because it was absolutely appropriate,

1043
01:10:27.159 --> 01:10:30.880
just spectacular man. And it turns
out rips off his mask and Batman's there

1044
01:10:30.119 --> 01:10:32.920
and everybody at the bar is a
cop. My favorite part of this whole

1045
01:10:33.039 --> 01:10:40.800
thing is that Batman gets his most
hated villains to give him information by asking

1046
01:10:40.920 --> 01:10:45.920
them each to tell a story in
which Batman is the hero, such a

1047
01:10:45.000 --> 01:10:49.279
great idea that is the equivalent of
a Batman wise crack. And then of

1048
01:10:49.359 --> 01:10:53.279
course at the end, him and
Katwomen are up on the roof, you

1049
01:10:53.359 --> 01:10:56.840
know, he's got her rescued and
she's trying to get into his pants and

1050
01:10:57.319 --> 01:11:01.239
he's having none of it. And
then ultimately it's about how Catwoman almost got

1051
01:11:01.520 --> 01:11:06.199
almost got him, and ultimately she
did so, and they're doomed to be

1052
01:11:06.279 --> 01:11:09.760
on again, off again, on
again, off again until they decide to

1053
01:11:09.760 --> 01:11:12.600
stop doing what they do for a
living. That is the end of Batman

1054
01:11:13.039 --> 01:11:16.239
the animated series Almost Got Him,
I think arguably one of the best episodes

1055
01:11:16.439 --> 01:11:20.079
of the series. Yeah, it's
really good. This is going to amount

1056
01:11:20.119 --> 01:11:25.760
to the end of part one of
our discussion of Batman. We've talked about

1057
01:11:25.920 --> 01:11:28.800
Almost Got Him in on our next
episode, we're going to be discussing his

1058
01:11:28.880 --> 01:11:32.079
further adventures in Legends of the Dark
Knight, which I cannot wait to talk

1059
01:11:32.079 --> 01:11:35.079
about. We're going to get really
into the nuts and bolts of the different

1060
01:11:35.119 --> 01:11:41.520
Batman artists and their different styles and
the various iterations of Batman through the decades,

1061
01:11:41.600 --> 01:11:44.399
because That's what Legends of the Dark
Knight is all about. Yea,

1062
01:11:44.439 --> 01:11:47.359
everything bends and they really adapt different
looks and different styles, and for God's

1063
01:11:47.359 --> 01:11:53.039
sakes, Michael ironside and dark Man
returns Batman, Let's not forget Michael McKean.

1064
01:11:53.199 --> 01:11:56.520
What are you working on? Where
can people find you? Antonio Lapo

1065
01:11:56.600 --> 01:11:59.600
or Well? You can find us
that my company, Swamp Media Group at

1066
01:11:59.680 --> 01:12:03.439
swap Media Group dot com. And
you can watch my feature film Space Detective

1067
01:12:03.479 --> 01:12:09.520
over at our sister site, Spacedetectivemovie
dot com. I'll work it on a

1068
01:12:09.560 --> 01:12:12.079
couple shorts. It'll be out later
this year. You can find everything I

1069
01:12:12.199 --> 01:12:15.119
do at Weirdingwaymedia dot com. I
have a couple of shows over there,

1070
01:12:15.239 --> 01:12:17.960
Dark Destinations or radio drama I write
and produce. And you can hear me

1071
01:12:18.039 --> 01:12:23.560
on HP's show Night Mister Walters,
a taxi podcast. Until next time,

1072
01:12:23.920 --> 01:12:34.640
try to enjoy the daylight midnight viewing. The Horror Anthology podcast is a proud

1073
01:12:34.720 --> 01:12:41.239
member of Weirdingwaymedia. Our theme song
was composed by HP with an assist from

1074
01:12:41.319 --> 01:12:45.359
Donald Rubinstein and Erica Lindsay. If
you want to hear these episodes early and

1075
01:12:45.439 --> 01:12:49.800
commercial free, become a patron over
at patreon dot com slash follom alone.

1076
01:12:50.720 --> 01:12:55.840
Not only are the episodes up early, but we have extended interviews and bonus

1077
01:12:55.920 --> 01:13:00.680
podcasts where we spotlight the best episodes
of horror anthologies from ever. But if

1078
01:13:00.720 --> 01:13:03.199
you just like the show and wanta
hell, please share it with your friends

1079
01:13:03.239 --> 01:13:08.199
and give us a rating on your
favorite podcatcher. Together, we'll keep journeying

1080
01:13:08.239 --> 01:13:12.159
through the places that are just as
real, but not as brightly lit.