WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.160 --> 00:00:07.799 Superintendent Tyson Bennett of Sherman Independent School District in Texas resigned after controversial removal and 2 00:00:07.839 --> 00:00:14.679 reinstatement of a transgender student in a high school production of Oklahoma sparked national outrage. 3 00:00:14.880 --> 00:00:19.519 The school board accepted Bennett's transignation followed a I'm sorry, I can't start 4 00:00:19.559 --> 00:00:23.920 over again. I I just could not read. I was just like, 5 00:00:24.039 --> 00:00:29.920 wait, greading. It's fundamental, and obviously I completely forgot how to do 6 00:00:29.960 --> 00:00:32.520 it. Okay, but yeah, if we can see it one more time, 7 00:00:32.600 --> 00:00:35.039 I would appreciate it. I forgot to bring crew back in, so 8 00:00:35.200 --> 00:00:37.560 sorry, I was talking and you could near me. All right, well 9 00:00:37.560 --> 00:00:40.200 that's cool. Okay, let me make this a little bit bigger so I 10 00:00:40.200 --> 00:00:44.240 can actually see what the fuck I'm saying. Okay, very good, all 11 00:00:44.320 --> 00:00:47.079 right, you're ready. Yeah, let's go ahead, all right. In 12 00:00:47.520 --> 00:00:55.439 five or Superintendent Tyson Bennett of Sherman Independent School in Texas resigned after controversial removal 13 00:00:55.479 --> 00:01:00.079 and reinstatement of a transgender student in a high school production of Oklahoma sparked outrage 14 00:01:00.280 --> 00:01:07.359 nationally. The school board accepted Bennett's resignation following a closed session and appointed Thomas 15 00:01:07.400 --> 00:01:15.079 O'Neill as interim superintendent. The controversy began in March when Max high Tower, 16 00:01:15.200 --> 00:01:19.079 a transgender student, was barred from playing a role that did not match his 17 00:01:19.200 --> 00:01:23.760 sex. Have signed. Ever, after significant backlash, the school reversed this 18 00:01:23.879 --> 00:01:30.159 decision, reinstating the original cast and script. Max's father, Philip Hie Tower, 19 00:01:30.319 --> 00:01:34.319 praised the board for advocating for all students, hoping it marks a shift 20 00:01:34.599 --> 00:01:42.519 towards inclusivity and standing against discrimination. The story is from NBC News by Joe 21 00:01:42.599 --> 00:01:48.120 Jakaba on May two, twenty twenty four. So, Senny, I'm coming 22 00:01:48.159 --> 00:01:53.599 to you. I'm wondering, what impact do you think student the superintendent is 23 00:01:53.640 --> 00:01:57.959 Tyson Beckford's. I'm sorry, Tyson Bennett. Tyson Beckford is a hot model. 24 00:01:57.239 --> 00:02:04.519 Not to be construe with Tyson Bennett, but his resignation will have on 25 00:02:04.680 --> 00:02:09.840 Sherman's Independent school district and it's handling of issues related to trans understood. I 26 00:02:09.879 --> 00:02:15.560 don't know. I don't know this state enough to be able to have a 27 00:02:15.639 --> 00:02:19.759 qualified opinion, but I would. Well, there's Texas, so I'll just 28 00:02:19.840 --> 00:02:28.080 keep that in mind. Yeah, yeah, it's it's I don't think it 29 00:02:28.159 --> 00:02:32.080 will have a huge impact, maybe specifically in the school for a few years. 30 00:02:32.360 --> 00:02:39.280 But the political climate is so so hard on transfiople right now. I 31 00:02:39.319 --> 00:02:46.080 saw a video of Pete Boody Jedge recently and he was talking about how the 32 00:02:46.400 --> 00:02:52.120 far right equates being different as an adult subject, how the simple fact that 33 00:02:52.159 --> 00:02:55.840 those people exist is an adult subject, when when it's simply not, it's 34 00:02:55.919 --> 00:03:02.120 just people existing, and it's I don't see how it can get better. 35 00:03:02.479 --> 00:03:07.840 Uh when when when I see the situation right now, how polarized the the 36 00:03:08.000 --> 00:03:14.400 US is, because it feels like on one side, the purpose is just 37 00:03:14.520 --> 00:03:20.520 to be mean to everyone. And I don't know how you can come back 38 00:03:20.560 --> 00:03:24.280 from that, from that, that kind of mentality of wanting to trigger other 39 00:03:24.360 --> 00:03:30.479 people just because you you like it and it just fits you. I just 40 00:03:30.599 --> 00:03:35.639 don't know how you can come back from that end. And so I don't 41 00:03:35.680 --> 00:03:39.960 think one guy being fired for that is going to change much. Uh. 42 00:03:40.000 --> 00:03:46.120 It's going to change a hell for the life of this teenager, that's for 43 00:03:46.159 --> 00:03:51.599 sure, in a good way. But other than that, I don't think 44 00:03:51.639 --> 00:03:55.719 it will help much. You know, you said something very interesting when you 45 00:03:55.879 --> 00:04:03.159 talked about how basically it's become a polarized issue just to mention a people exist, 46 00:04:03.960 --> 00:04:09.039 and I and I think about how, especially on the right, you 47 00:04:09.120 --> 00:04:15.399 have such outcries about people who happen to be not white, not cis gender, 48 00:04:15.800 --> 00:04:20.079 not I mean that are that are cis gender, that are has weosexual, 49 00:04:20.360 --> 00:04:24.759 and how this is supposed to be the norm, but any person who 50 00:04:24.800 --> 00:04:30.920 happens to be outside of that particular uh group is considered Oh, well, 51 00:04:30.160 --> 00:04:35.240 you're you're being you're being woke, right, just because you mentioned that these 52 00:04:35.279 --> 00:04:39.920 people exist and and it's and it's very and I don't know how we come 53 00:04:39.959 --> 00:04:44.720 back from that either. Kelly, what what are your thoughts from it's the 54 00:04:44.759 --> 00:04:47.079 only old white guy cis male on this panel. I have to say, 55 00:04:47.240 --> 00:04:58.319 I am qualified to say this panel is pretty goddamn woke. Okay, okay, 56 00:04:58.879 --> 00:05:00.680 okay, that's fine. I mean, like, listen, I don't 57 00:05:00.720 --> 00:05:04.519 necessarily have an issue with using the term woke. I've used it for a 58 00:05:04.560 --> 00:05:10.480 long time before it became polarized. Uh. Woke just really just meant, 59 00:05:10.560 --> 00:05:13.040 you know, when I used to use it back in the day, that 60 00:05:13.360 --> 00:05:15.279 you know, you just need to be aware of the systems that are around 61 00:05:15.319 --> 00:05:18.480 you and how they can affect you. If you happen to not be white 62 00:05:18.839 --> 00:05:25.639 or a man or both or anything of that particular effect, right and and 63 00:05:25.920 --> 00:05:30.560 like right now, I just see when we're having these particular discourses concerning like 64 00:05:30.639 --> 00:05:35.959 especially trans people, that you know, just like giving them a place to 65 00:05:36.040 --> 00:05:41.040 say, I exist, I am here, I am human, and I 66 00:05:41.079 --> 00:05:45.680 want to live my life and participate in life and community around me. That's 67 00:05:45.720 --> 00:05:48.079 the polarizing issue, and it makes it makes no sense to me. But 68 00:05:48.199 --> 00:05:53.879 you know, but Kelly, since you mentioned wokeness, this article actually mentions 69 00:05:53.920 --> 00:05:58.160 the school board, you know, held a special meeting last week to discuss 70 00:05:58.240 --> 00:06:02.279 terminating Bennett, but then take any action. Yeah, they didn't. Yeah, 71 00:06:02.319 --> 00:06:08.120 so what factors might have influenced the boards decision to even accept his resignation? 72 00:06:09.439 --> 00:06:13.199 That particularly the weekend, you know what, I was wondering why they 73 00:06:13.240 --> 00:06:15.759 didn't vote and to get rid of them, and that I found it really 74 00:06:15.759 --> 00:06:20.240 interesting. And then then it made me wonder what it was that talked him 75 00:06:20.279 --> 00:06:26.920 into resigning. And I have a feeling they probably made some kind of backroom 76 00:06:26.959 --> 00:06:30.000 deal. You just resign and you go walk away from this without the bad 77 00:06:30.240 --> 00:06:34.279 we had to fire you thing hanging over you for the rest of your career. 78 00:06:34.720 --> 00:06:38.560 And I'm pretty sure that that had something to do with it, But 79 00:06:38.879 --> 00:06:41.399 I want to know. And this is not something again. You know, 80 00:06:41.480 --> 00:06:44.959 you start to read these stories, you want to know more, you start 81 00:06:45.000 --> 00:06:47.040 doing some research on them, and you can't get the answers to some of 82 00:06:47.040 --> 00:06:50.759 the questions. And I want to know, was Bennett responsible for getting this 83 00:06:50.839 --> 00:06:54.920 kid kicked off the play? Was it somebody at the school? Was it 84 00:06:54.959 --> 00:06:59.800 the principal? Who was it exactly? Because we don't actually know, and 85 00:07:00.079 --> 00:07:03.040 I think that person is you should be the one we're talking about here. 86 00:07:03.319 --> 00:07:06.759 And if it was Bennett, that's fine, But I want to know that 87 00:07:06.800 --> 00:07:12.560 it was Bennett. And I can't see like somebody on the school supervisor, 88 00:07:12.600 --> 00:07:15.920 on the board of supervisors calling up the school to complain about one kid. 89 00:07:15.920 --> 00:07:19.120 That just doesn't I mean, it could have happened, but it doesn't seem 90 00:07:19.639 --> 00:07:24.279 probable to me at all. It seems to me that there was probably somebody 91 00:07:24.399 --> 00:07:29.160 at the school or somebody affiliated with the school that made that decision. Well, 92 00:07:29.800 --> 00:07:30.759 well, let me ask you, do you think that Bennett was just 93 00:07:30.839 --> 00:07:32.879 like since you brought it up, do you think he was just like fall 94 00:07:32.920 --> 00:07:35.680 guy? He could he could well have been. I don't know that he 95 00:07:36.360 --> 00:07:41.000 was because he may well have made been made the decision, but there is 96 00:07:41.040 --> 00:07:44.040 a really good chance that, yeah, we have to do something, and 97 00:07:44.120 --> 00:07:46.519 maybe that's why they made that back room deal to let him walk away without 98 00:07:46.560 --> 00:07:49.879 being fired. You know, we understand that it's not you who made this 99 00:07:49.959 --> 00:07:54.600 decision, but we have to take some kind of action and somebody has to 100 00:07:54.639 --> 00:07:58.720 go. And you were the where the bucks stops last at that school, 101 00:07:59.040 --> 00:08:01.600 and so it's got to you, you know, And I could I could 102 00:08:01.600 --> 00:08:05.360 see that happening. I don't know if he was actually the decision maker or 103 00:08:05.399 --> 00:08:07.199 if he was just a scapegoat. I could see it going either way. 104 00:08:07.519 --> 00:08:11.439 And that's why it's been a really bad week for getting answers to questions that 105 00:08:11.480 --> 00:08:15.600 were that were recovering because I've been trying to do some deep dives and I 106 00:08:15.879 --> 00:08:18.519 just can't get some of the details I want. So, oh my goodness, 107 00:08:18.879 --> 00:08:22.560 you know what, I just want to sit to all news outlets. 108 00:08:22.560 --> 00:08:26.480 How dare you keep information away from Kelly for me being able to do deep 109 00:08:26.519 --> 00:08:31.199 dives? Yes, we need these things. This is why we pay Kelly 110 00:08:31.240 --> 00:08:35.000 the big bucks. But you know, but you mentioned something concerning like you 111 00:08:35.080 --> 00:08:37.399 give me a raise? Yeah, I know, right, I'll talk to 112 00:08:37.440 --> 00:08:43.080 the powers to be about giving you a raise once I give me a raise, 113 00:08:43.080 --> 00:08:45.840 and everybody else on the panel. But you know, I think that 114 00:08:45.879 --> 00:08:48.600 one of the things that the article mentioned, because I talked about it earlier, 115 00:08:48.759 --> 00:08:54.080 is that there was a national outcry of why on how like egregious removing 116 00:08:54.159 --> 00:09:01.399 Max High Tower was from this production And and and basically I'm I'm thinking that 117 00:09:01.519 --> 00:09:03.639 since there was a natural outcry, there was a lot of pressure to do 118 00:09:03.840 --> 00:09:09.320 something right. Yeah, And since like it was a natural outcry to do 119 00:09:09.399 --> 00:09:13.759 something, you know, sometimes that that just means that we pick a guy, 120 00:09:13.000 --> 00:09:16.519 and you're the visible guy, so you know, you gotta go or 121 00:09:16.679 --> 00:09:20.200 you know, or if you make your particular decision, then maybe it's not 122 00:09:20.279 --> 00:09:24.399 that bad. But you know, if I want to ask you, how 123 00:09:24.440 --> 00:09:31.360 do you think public pressure and media attention influenced the school eventually reversal of his 124 00:09:31.440 --> 00:09:35.919 decision. Well, I think that without public and external pressure nothing would have 125 00:09:35.039 --> 00:09:39.000 changed at all. The truth is, in a small rural area like Sherman, 126 00:09:39.120 --> 00:09:43.279 Texas, I would say that, And I do think the principal is 127 00:09:43.519 --> 00:09:48.120 likely played a role in it beforehand. If not, he's an incompetent principle 128 00:09:48.200 --> 00:09:50.559 because you should know what's going on in the school. So presuming that he 129 00:09:50.600 --> 00:09:54.480 had a certain level of culpability there, I would say that he thought it 130 00:09:54.519 --> 00:09:58.759 was a diamond does a decision. I don't think he thought it was controversial, 131 00:09:58.960 --> 00:10:01.080 and I think in the local area is completely correct. I think that 132 00:10:01.159 --> 00:10:05.840 they would not have cared. It's only because there was external pressure and because 133 00:10:05.840 --> 00:10:11.120 it got the publicity that it did that we have the results we have because 134 00:10:11.279 --> 00:10:16.840 once again, this is a very rural part of Texas, and so it's 135 00:10:16.919 --> 00:10:18.879 not hard for me to imagine them saying, you know what, we don't 136 00:10:18.879 --> 00:10:24.000 want any of that transgender stuff here, and so this is what happens. 137 00:10:24.440 --> 00:10:28.399 And I don't think this is as isolated as we'd like to think it is 138 00:10:28.399 --> 00:10:33.360 in Texas. So with that in mind, attention are in the United States 139 00:10:33.360 --> 00:10:35.639 in general, So with that in mind, I think it was the attention 140 00:10:35.960 --> 00:10:41.200 that changed the situation. You know, I could think of years ago during 141 00:10:41.200 --> 00:10:48.639 the Civil Rights movement. One of the tactics was to use media to show 142 00:10:48.799 --> 00:10:52.639 people at lunch counters getting beat up or you know, pulled away, or 143 00:10:54.759 --> 00:11:01.919 protesters getting dogs sit upon them or also flower horses on the right in order 144 00:11:01.960 --> 00:11:07.320 for them to for for all of these for the world basically to see that, 145 00:11:07.480 --> 00:11:11.080 hey, you know, the people who happened to be standing up for 146 00:11:11.120 --> 00:11:15.600 civil rights. This is not These are not isolated incidents, and it's not 147 00:11:15.639 --> 00:11:18.480 just in people's minds. It's really happened, and it really wasn't until like 148 00:11:18.720 --> 00:11:24.720 you had like that world the world is watching you type thing happening until there 149 00:11:24.879 --> 00:11:30.840 was like some type of like movement on the federal level to really create and 150 00:11:30.879 --> 00:11:35.840 push legislation to change things. And you know, reading this particular story, 151 00:11:35.840 --> 00:11:41.039 that's that's kind of like how I see it. It's like using media, 152 00:11:41.480 --> 00:11:46.879 using people's voices, using these particular things to like show that you know, 153 00:11:46.960 --> 00:11:50.639 this this kid is a kid. And the kid was only removed from this 154 00:11:50.679 --> 00:11:54.440 production because they're transient full stop. You know, had nothing to do with 155 00:11:54.519 --> 00:11:58.679 their ability to be able to act out of the part had nothing to do 156 00:11:58.840 --> 00:12:03.360 with them not being able to have the capability of doing anything that was called 157 00:12:03.399 --> 00:12:09.360 for him to do. You just removed him because he is not what you 158 00:12:09.720 --> 00:12:13.240 want him to be. He does not fit this particular criteria. So I 159 00:12:13.279 --> 00:12:20.320 now, Cindy, you mentioned that you don't really think that this particular incident 160 00:12:20.440 --> 00:12:24.879 is going to be effective in really being a change agent per se. But 161 00:12:24.960 --> 00:12:31.360 let's say, for instance, you had the attention to be able to put 162 00:12:31.399 --> 00:12:37.399 in the catalysts for the change agent. What do you think could be the 163 00:12:37.159 --> 00:12:45.200 thing that could really help communities and school districts work together to create environments where 164 00:12:45.240 --> 00:12:48.120 all students feel safe and supported. Well, I'm sorry, I'm going to 165 00:12:48.159 --> 00:12:56.600 repeat myself. Every single discrimination has a false information at its core, like 166 00:12:56.919 --> 00:13:03.519 trans people are crazy or whatever, where homosexually see the choice, uh Mexicans 167 00:13:03.519 --> 00:13:11.639 are are you know, lazy or other criminals, et cetera. And so 168 00:13:11.879 --> 00:13:18.480 the there are two ways to fight this. Either you pick one topic and 169 00:13:18.080 --> 00:13:24.120 try to defend the people who are discriminated against, and that's that's a valid 170 00:13:24.120 --> 00:13:31.360 approach. But the other way is to attack the valid information at the core 171 00:13:31.399 --> 00:13:35.120 of the discrimination, and to do that you need education and critical thinking. 172 00:13:35.320 --> 00:13:41.240 You need both. So because when you when you listen to to the people, 173 00:13:41.679 --> 00:13:50.200 uh the right wing talking about how talking about gay people makes people gay, 174 00:13:50.519 --> 00:13:52.600 like, how does that work? Exactly? Exactly exactly, how many 175 00:13:52.720 --> 00:13:58.519 gay people have been exposed to only straight movies and TV shows and books all 176 00:13:58.559 --> 00:14:03.440 their lives and steal their gay So how can you touch the other way? 177 00:14:03.720 --> 00:14:07.759 They have to touch us so the cooies can move from them to you. 178 00:14:07.919 --> 00:14:11.320 Yeah, yeah, well then I should be the gay they ever ran into 179 00:14:11.360 --> 00:14:13.519 the face of the earth. And if that's the case, yeah, it's 180 00:14:13.559 --> 00:14:22.039 the frogs maybe. Yeah. No, It's the only way we can solve 181 00:14:22.039 --> 00:14:28.120 this problem is education and critical thinking. That there is no other way. 182 00:14:28.679 --> 00:14:31.679 But you know, Cindy, okay, so, and and I guess this 183 00:14:31.840 --> 00:14:35.440 is like to the panel, like, please feel free to chime in because 184 00:14:35.440 --> 00:14:37.759 I'm about to spitball if you don't mind, Like, I agree with you 185 00:14:39.039 --> 00:14:43.399 that, you know, education and critical thinking is the way to be a 186 00:14:43.399 --> 00:14:48.039 pathway to reason right to the point where when we are having these conversations about 187 00:14:48.039 --> 00:14:52.879 people who happen to be different from the you know, well in America specifically 188 00:14:52.960 --> 00:15:00.200 the majority, that then we can be like, Okay, we're not going 189 00:15:00.240 --> 00:15:05.080 to give credence to any of these particular false notions or rhetoric that happens to 190 00:15:05.120 --> 00:15:11.960 be talked about this particular group. But unfortunately, even if you happen to 191 00:15:11.000 --> 00:15:16.080 be the most learned person ever in life, and you are constantly putting out 192 00:15:16.440 --> 00:15:24.159 you know, information that compacts combats rather the propaganda that is actually you know, 193 00:15:24.320 --> 00:15:26.360 espoused about a certain people. For some reason, it just seems like 194 00:15:26.399 --> 00:15:30.399 it just goes through one ear and right out the other. And you know 195 00:15:31.159 --> 00:15:35.039 how and I know for me, especially like you know, for a person 196 00:15:35.159 --> 00:15:37.559 like you know, as we all are here because we care about the truth, 197 00:15:37.679 --> 00:15:43.600 and we spend time making ourselves as educated as possible in order for us 198 00:15:43.639 --> 00:15:48.799 to be as well informed as possible about the truth. Right. But you 199 00:15:48.840 --> 00:15:52.039 know, but for some reason, it seems like that we are still in 200 00:15:52.200 --> 00:15:58.919 this same you know circle of constantly you know, combating misinformation, you know, 201 00:16:00.080 --> 00:16:03.399 inductrination and all the alls when it comes to like, you know, 202 00:16:03.399 --> 00:16:10.879 having these particular conversations. So you know that, yeah, it can come 203 00:16:10.960 --> 00:16:18.759 from random people. In my country, we have our driving license as points. 204 00:16:18.000 --> 00:16:22.600 We have twelve points, and every time you speak too much of the 205 00:16:22.639 --> 00:16:29.159 limit or any any other thing, you lose points. And when you reach 206 00:16:29.320 --> 00:16:36.279 zero you have to go back to follow some some specific courses. And one 207 00:16:36.320 --> 00:16:42.039 of them teaches you why it's wrong to act like this and and and this 208 00:16:42.200 --> 00:16:48.519 is taught by people who teach people to drive. And so we need to 209 00:16:48.559 --> 00:16:56.279 do the same like when someone commits racially motivated crime, instead of just going 210 00:16:56.360 --> 00:17:02.960 to prison or paying a fine or something, they should go to a university 211 00:17:03.039 --> 00:17:11.359 or whatever and they should learn about not because not not why they what they 212 00:17:11.400 --> 00:17:17.519 did is wrong, but why what they believe is wrong and show them the 213 00:17:17.880 --> 00:17:23.200 facts with with books, with studies, with everything, and going to the 214 00:17:23.240 --> 00:17:30.039 source of the information. Because if if you social media are too polarizing, 215 00:17:30.440 --> 00:17:34.160 uh when when when you see something you feel the need to answer quickly, 216 00:17:34.599 --> 00:17:40.480 and so you don't think as much and so you're not touched as much by 217 00:17:40.559 --> 00:17:45.160 what other people respond to. And so it needs to be from from the 218 00:17:45.200 --> 00:17:51.119 top, from from the government, from uh, someone with authority to say, 219 00:17:51.200 --> 00:17:55.440 okay, uh, yeah, no, Mexicans are not thieves. Look 220 00:17:55.559 --> 00:17:59.559 look, look at the statistics, look at and and then go through the 221 00:18:00.440 --> 00:18:07.039 the arguments and explain why the arguments are false and wrong. And that's the 222 00:18:07.480 --> 00:18:10.960 only way to do it in my opinion. Infidel and Kelly, what do 223 00:18:11.000 --> 00:18:12.880 you say to that, Well, one thing that I have to say is 224 00:18:12.880 --> 00:18:17.680 is that right now we're so divided that I don't think there would ever be 225 00:18:17.759 --> 00:18:21.599 any agreement on what is the right way. And I think you probably lost 226 00:18:21.640 --> 00:18:25.480 half the United States when you said books, they seem to be one to 227 00:18:25.519 --> 00:18:30.680 go quite the opposite direction, unfortunately, and that goes back to wanting a 228 00:18:30.079 --> 00:18:36.119 dumbed down population and not warning proper education for them. So while I was 229 00:18:36.160 --> 00:18:38.640 a little bit tongue in cheek, I do really believe that that's one of 230 00:18:38.640 --> 00:18:44.640 our problems is we are so polarized at this point that I don't think that 231 00:18:44.759 --> 00:18:48.400 we have any recognition of authority on either side to go, Okay, this 232 00:18:48.599 --> 00:18:52.799 is what we do. Because if you had somebody who said, well, 233 00:18:52.839 --> 00:18:56.720 no, we shouldn't be teaching people that Mexicans are thieves, you would find 234 00:18:56.759 --> 00:19:00.759 thirty percent of the population out there who would be on your side by the 235 00:19:00.839 --> 00:19:04.400 fault. So then it's about committing to the other ones, and that that's 236 00:19:04.440 --> 00:19:08.680 why we're so split right now that I don't think that we can make that 237 00:19:08.759 --> 00:19:12.160 decision. But I hope that is something that we can do in the future, 238 00:19:12.279 --> 00:19:15.920 because you are right in the fact. Until we're honest and we can 239 00:19:15.960 --> 00:19:22.480 call misinformation for what it is and actually have a conversation about it, we're 240 00:19:22.519 --> 00:19:26.759 really not going to change anything because we're going to do exactly what Cynthia said 241 00:19:26.079 --> 00:19:29.640 and that is is that we're going to talk. It's going to go in 242 00:19:29.759 --> 00:19:32.920 one ear and out the other, and that is one of the things that's 243 00:19:32.960 --> 00:19:37.319 trying. But I have to remember that there are people that do change their 244 00:19:37.400 --> 00:19:41.240 mind, so you know what we're doing here. If somebody sees it and 245 00:19:41.359 --> 00:19:45.799 just causes them to reconsider one bad idea, that's a step because nothing changes 246 00:19:45.839 --> 00:19:51.000 overnight. But learning that one bad idea is something maybe I should get rid 247 00:19:51.039 --> 00:19:55.440 of can help not just the trans community and just the mere right to exist, 248 00:19:55.640 --> 00:20:00.119 but the whole realm of things. Because once you start deconstructing a real 249 00:20:00.319 --> 00:20:04.519 sick and twisted mindset and worldview, that religion tends to get and that's where 250 00:20:04.519 --> 00:20:08.359 a lot of this comes from. Once you start deconstructing, it's like pulling 251 00:20:08.359 --> 00:20:11.839 a thread on that sweater. You never know where you're going to end up. 252 00:20:12.279 --> 00:20:15.640 Do you think that we can combat one by idea, Kelly, Yeah, 253 00:20:15.680 --> 00:20:19.359 I think we can. We have. I mean, that's that's history. 254 00:20:19.480 --> 00:20:23.440 It's not something that happens overnight. It's something that takes time. It 255 00:20:23.519 --> 00:20:29.000 takes people standing up. In fact. On that note, I wanted to 256 00:20:29.119 --> 00:20:33.440 I was thinking we would be remiss if we didn't that throughout this episode at 257 00:20:33.440 --> 00:20:37.079 one point didn't give up. Kudos to Max Hihtower and his father Philip for 258 00:20:37.200 --> 00:20:41.960 standing up for what was right, and I really appreciate that they did that. 259 00:20:41.279 --> 00:20:44.880 But yeah, I think I think we can do that. I think 260 00:20:44.920 --> 00:20:48.640 we are doing that. One of the problems we have to fight now is 261 00:20:48.680 --> 00:20:52.559 one of the ways that we can educate people to accept others is to breed 262 00:20:52.640 --> 00:20:57.920 familiarity with those others. And that's when we get people in our society who 263 00:20:57.960 --> 00:21:04.440 are being demon for things that they aren't. That's prohibiting that familiarity with them. 264 00:21:04.680 --> 00:21:10.519 And I really think that is a process that's thought that's been thought through. 265 00:21:10.640 --> 00:21:14.240 We're going to demonize these people because we don't want people to get to 266 00:21:14.279 --> 00:21:18.519 know them, we don't want people to accept them. So yeah, kudos 267 00:21:18.559 --> 00:21:22.640 to Max for you know, young high school kid stood up and made the 268 00:21:22.640 --> 00:21:26.319 world a better place. So thank you Max. He's in his corner in 269 00:21:26.359 --> 00:21:30.480 Texas, right, Yeah, yeah, that little candle. Indeed. Indeed, 270 00:21:30.720 --> 00:21:33.319 Yeah, even though like I am, you know, a bit jaded, 271 00:21:33.440 --> 00:21:37.039 I would definitely have to say only because like you know, bitten into 272 00:21:37.039 --> 00:21:41.559 these particular circles where you are you know, doing the counter arguments, using 273 00:21:41.640 --> 00:21:48.359 facts and data to actually bolster what you're saying. There still is I would 274 00:21:48.400 --> 00:21:52.359 have to say, and this is even about personal experience, about having conversations 275 00:21:52.359 --> 00:21:57.119 with people and actually presenting facts, and then that light comes on, like 276 00:21:57.559 --> 00:22:00.160 I did not know that, right. And I even think about, like 277 00:22:00.240 --> 00:22:03.559 the four of us that's even sitting on this panel right now, that you 278 00:22:03.559 --> 00:22:08.160 know, at one point in our lives we were on one end of the 279 00:22:08.160 --> 00:22:12.279 spectrum and now we're on another end of the spectrum. And I would argue 280 00:22:12.359 --> 00:22:19.000 that it was good information that changed our minds from the bad information that we 281 00:22:19.119 --> 00:22:21.160 received in the past.