Get some facts and come back and seebe. Get some facts and come back
and Seebee. Don't fill up salaries or other things. Get some facts and
come back and Seebee. You can't handle the true now told our players you
need a bit more like a dog. We don't need a bunch of cats
in here. Looking in the mirror, I look good. I got my
extra bands on, I got my other shoes. Be a doll. We
don't need no mouns. We don't need no cats. We need more dolls.
Why you're not a detain Oh you're not. At the time, we
weren't good. There's no sense of asking me things about the game. I'm
telling you we laid an egg. So I'm not gonna break it down for
you. He sucks. He sucked. He laid an egg. That's all
I have to say. Guys, I'm sorry. I'm not gonna break it
down for you. Nothing went well for us. It's on us. We
have to figure it out every way. SHOWDA, it is showtime. Welcome
on a Thursday. Glad you're with us throughout the great state of Michigan.
On Exes and Bros. We're with you Monday through Friday, six until nine
Flint, Cadillac, Grand Rapids, Grayling, Gaylord, Midland, Saganaw,
Bay City, Pataski, Charlevoid, Traverse City. We are there for you
to talk about anything that might be on your mind here on Exus and Bros.
On a day to day basis really fortunate to be able to bring in
this next guest. He's as admired as maybe any writer who has ever written
in the state of Michigan. I mean, there are certain writers where you
look at and you say, you know what, I believe him. That's
not always easy. A lot of people feel like they have been fortunate to
work with a legend like Mike O'Hara, who's in the Michigan Sports Hall of
Fame, and rightfully so, he's been doing as well as anybody. From
nineteen sixty six through two thousand and eight he was of the Detroit News and
after that time with the Lions in on Lions dot Com, and he's been
a Liones beat writer since nineteen seventy seven. He has served his country and
he has served this area so gracefully and so well, and he joins us
now that he's going to retire on Monday, and rightfully so Michael Harris with
us here on Exis and Bros. Michael, thank you, congratulations. It's
so well deserved. How did you know it was time? It just felt
that way, And I think I was probably a year late. I probably
should have retired last year, not this year. Yeah, not this year.
It's just the things that were easy to do were quite as easy,
and just just just had that feeling that it's time to go. But now
I guess I think I kind of got caught up in the new organization and
all that thought. I could just see what they had in this last year,
and it turned out they had a lot, And I don't regret staying
another year. I really don't. Yeah, I don't think anybody who reads
your synopsis, your breakdowns, your analysis feels that either what have you enjoyed
most about your career? Well, it's you know, I'm not a player,
so I can't, but it's really similar to that for us. You
know, it's it's the test room, you know, kind of to come
to work and the the insults start to fly and all of that, and
then I start to talk about things in the game, and you know,
it's still competing. Don't get me wrong, but you know what it's like
to start talking about what happened yesterday what might happen tomorrow, you know.
And that was the fun part, just sort of interacting with with guys from
you know, from the other other papers and other media outlets. That that
was really to me the fun of the business. What's interesting, too,
is that this team might have its best opportunity. You would know this better
than I, but this team might have its best opportunity to reach the super
Bowl, and you may not be able to write about that if you're leaving
on Monday. Did you ever think about that as you were contemplating this decision?
Well, that's why I stayed another for this year. It was just
know the season we just had. No I thought about it, Yeah,
but no I didn't. They wouldn't do it for that reason. I really
wouldn't. By the way, I just like to mention one thing. A
guy who's made boll of this a lot easier is Tim twenty than you know.
He came over from the Detroit News about a year before I did to
the and I think he's probably one of the most prolific writers I've ever been
prouded my life. He just does so many things does him so well.
It's just it's really been a pleasure looking with Tim. Yeah, it's a
great points. He's excellent at what he does and he yeah, he really
is. And he sent something out on Twitter. He's been so well accommodating,
endearing and understanding and willing to learn. I mean, it's it's funny,
even when you do it for as long as you and Tim has done,
you can still learn from people. And absolutely yeah, and he wrote,
look, legend I'm so fortunate to being able to work with and learn
from Mike at both the Detroit News and here with the Lions over the last
twenty years. It's not like he stayed to claim to his territory and said
I'm sorry, I feel threatened by a legendary writer. Instead, he opened
his arms to you. And I think you've done that for quite a few
people as well, so many stories with the Detroit Lions. I'm sure you
get asked this all the time by people. So I'll just be one in
the many of a line of people who've asked you this. Is there any
one particular player or storyline that sticks out to you in all the years you've
covered this franchise, well, this one really stands out, and it is
not a good one. I don't think that Berry Sanders retirement was that was
one, and I was expecting it. I really was. And I'll tell
you a quick, little quick story that one of the writers for ESPN had
just a little item in his column that offseason that Barry wasn't happy and he
sort of got a sense of that, you know, And so I called
his father, William, who I got to know somewhat not you know,
we want close friends, but he was always accommodating to talk. And I
said, mister Williams dot Williams. Anyway, I said, I asked him
to say that what I remember on Sports Illustrated And I said, what's the
deal? And he said, he's sick of them, He's sick of losing.
Oh boy, this is going to be something. It turned out to
be just a blackbuster story from that moment until Barry Sanders, you know,
did not show up for training camp three months later or whatever it was.
And then then and then it was just to me that was probably the biggest
story that I covered. It was involved with or whatever you want to call
it. Michael, by the way, I'm sorry, just want to think.
So it wasn't my favorite because I wanted to see Barry Sanders play and
not just a great player, but a great person too. But to me,
it was the most obviously had the most impact. Michael here joining us
here on Exes and Bros. He retires Monday, and he's a Michigan Sports
Hall of Famer. He's been the reason you read about the Lions for for
so many decades. When you when you look back at all the teams and
all the players you've covered, is there what's the biggest misnomer that people failed
to realize about a player or this franchise. That the Fordes don't want to
don't care about winning and losing, and they care very much about it.
That's why they made so many changes. And I'm just going, since I
came on the beat in nineteen seventy seven, you know, they add up
the number of coaching changes and personnel changes and all that, but we'd be
here for a month and a half or something like that. They put all
that together. But you know, they care very much and they always have,
always will through different generations. You know, mister William clay Ford passed
away, and think it was nineteen, nineteen eighty, nineteen eighty for something
like twenty I'm sorry, twenty fifteen. And then his wife, Martha Firestone
Ford took over and absolutely committed to winning. And then now Sheila hamp the
daughter and who really has been on the front line there of changing things for
the Detroit Lions, and she's been successful. She's had the success that the
other ones haven't had for whatever reason. What do you like about this Lion's
team? Younger players with talent and speed? I like speed, and then
they have that. They have a lot of other excuse me, a lot
of other things too, but they have some interchangeable perps and and I don't
think if you look at that team, look, nobody has it all.
And it's just it's it's impossible, what really is because no matter how well
things are going, you're going to have they're going to change personnel from one
season to the next. I mean, there's a been somebody came up with
a figure one time on the average, thirty percent of your rosteril channel from
one season to the next. I don't know if that's exactly true, but
I'm sure it's not saying off. And so that's the hard part is putting
all these players back together. But the however they've done and through the just
great drafting. You know, really, but Bret Holmes, the general manager,
and with the head coach Dan Campbell, you know, chime it in.
They've really been able in three years. The first three years. We
haven't seen this year's team play yet, but in the first three years,
excuse, they've really put together good players, not just first round players,
but you know, all the way through the through the noster and through the
draft, they've been able to put together good players on the field for the
and they're going to be good, not just this year and next to it,
every they're going to be good for a while. They really are because
they don't have like any aging players that they have to get rid of.
They're pretty solid from top to bout him. He's been writing in this area
since nineteen sixty six. He's covered the line since nineteen seventy seven. He's
a Hall of Famer. He's Michael Harra. Mike, thanks for your time,
Congratulations, appreciate the friendship and all that you've done and keeping things interesting
for Lions fans, whether they're winning or losing. You deserve this my friend.
Congrats, Hey, thanks thanks for calling me. I appreciate it.
You bet any. That's Michael Harra joining us here on ex'es and Bros.
We'll talk a little bit more about the Lions on the other side and all
the great things that Michae O'Hara has seen and some of the frustrating things that
he's seen as well in his time as a Lions beat writer. When we
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be twenty winters old in Michigan. Are playing. I hope you enjoyed the
conversation we had with Michae O'Hara. Find out on our podcast. Michael'hara still
covering the Lions until Monday, and one of the things that he noticed Yesterday
was day two of their training not training camp, but their mandatory mini camp,
and one of the things that people are starting to recognize is that,
first of all, Hendon Hooker is still trying to find his way a little
bit in the NFL. One day good, one day maybe not so good.
The other thing that we're starting to recognize is just how important it will
be for Jamison Williams in this team. Really important to have certain players break
out, break from a mold and become who you thought they were going to
become. Jamison Williams was the number twelve overall pick in twenty twenty two.
There's been some issues. He's only twenty three years old. That's awesome.
That kind of goes to what Mike was telling us. Mike said, the
reason this team's going to be good for a long time is because of how
they manage their roster. I thought it was pretty interesting that he said thirty
roughly thirty percent of every NFL roster changes. It's the key guys who you
have to keep. You have to know when to sign them, how long
to sign them for, at what age are you signing them, and how
much money it's going to take for you to keep them there right well,
with Jamison Williams just twenty three years young, that's a huge positive for this
team. But this is a massive year. Dan Campbell said that if you
said give me one player who's been the most improved from start to finish,
Jamo would be that guy. Right now. That doesn't always translate into games.
So with your permission, I'm going to hold I'm going to reserve my
opinion for right now on Jamison Williams. This year is a huge year for
him and what it means to the success of this franchise. They have all
the pieces they need. No team is perfect. As Mike just mentioned,
no team is perfect, especially during the regular season as Kansas City I end
up winning the Super Bowl. But how many times did you read during the
season that Kansas City is susceptible, that they're vulnerable, that their run may
have ended, their window may have closed, they'll have to reboot After every
loss you read that people didn't believe that they were Super Bowl worthy during the
regular season. They started to buy in in the playoffs when they beat Baltimore,
But overall, there were a lot of people who were shaking their heads
saying it's time for a new champion. They've played a lot of football more
than anybody else. They just don't have the horses anymore. Whatever excuse you
want. Josh Reynolds has now gone. He's in He's in Denver, right,
Yeah, he's in Denver. That means Jamison Williams is the number two
guy. He'll start, He'll be their deep threat. He'll be targeted quite
a bit, and rightfully so, and he will be what many Lions fans
hope to be, will be their next star at that position. Now I'm
on, Ross Saint Brown is that star. Many people felt like that was
unlikely. But you can't deny the numbers. You just can't. You can't.
And he's got the contract to go with it. That's the beauty of
what I'm on. Ross Saint Brown has delivered for the Lions so far.
He's delivered catches, yards, big catches too, by the way, yards,
contract and wins, the latter being the most important. Jamison Williams will
be a guy who this offense will need, not just as a compliment player.
No, no, I think Josh Reynolds was a complimentary player. Jamison
Williams will have to be much more than that. How long will he have
to do it? Looks like he'll have to do it over an eighteen game
regular season soon. There are certain players in the NFL. I wish we
could have gotten to this with Michaelherra, but time is short in the first
half hour of our shows each hour. But I would have liked to have
asked him his opinion on an eighteen game regular season because Ryan Kelly, who
is the vice president of the National Football League Players Association, is steadfast against
it. He's a hell of a player, by the way, center for
the Colts. When asked about extending the season even one more game, Kelly
said this, I hope not eighteen games. Sounds great when Roger Goodell is
saying it on the Pat McAfee podcast. But until you're the one going out
there putting a helmet on eighteen of those games, yeah, then come talk
to me. Football maybe more than any other sport. I don't even think
there's a maybe looking for more because we the fans can't get enough think about
it. I mean I say this all the time, and rightfully so Football
gets it right. They are constantly, constantly in the news. Why that's
by design. We're never too far away from talking about football, and this
is another way for Roger Goodell to extend it. Here's what Goodell said.
The key for us is looking at making sure we continue to do the things
that make our game safer. Seventeen games is a long season. That's number
one. Working with our players Association is number two. We would reach an
agreement with them if we were going to proceed in that level. But third,
this is not necessarily in order is the quality of our game. We
would do it in the context of reducing the number of preseason games. We
think that's a good trade. Less preseason games, more regular season games.
I think most anybody would think that's beneficial. Really, what he's getting at,
he's getting at when the games are played, when that final game,
or when those playoffs are being played. The timing of it, for Roger
Goodell is really important. He has said that we've got to eighteen and two.
That's not an unreasonable thing. Super Bowl Sunday ends up on President Day
weekend, which is a three day weekend, which makes it Sunday night,
and then you have Monday off. There you go. That's a big thing
for him. What's interesting and almost laughable is that he says, the key
for us is making sure we're doing things to make our game safer. How
are you making it safer on a collision sport. It's not a contact sport.
It's a collision sport. How are you making it safer by extending it
and asking your athletes, your participants to do it for at least one more
week during the regular season. Don't tell me taking out a preseason game makes
up for the regular season game. The regular season game, all the starters
are playing the preseason game. That is not the case. I can imagine
the NFLPA agreeing to something like this. Your thoughts on it will take your
phone calls on the Meyer hotline eight sixty six eight three eight forty eight forty
three, or you can text the program sports Radio to twenty one thousand.
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The huge show is coming up later today at three right here on the
Michigan Sports Network. Another good example of how the NFL just continues to stay
in the pickup discussion. The articles written are pretty damn creative. I'm sure
many of them are almost annual, but who remembers right, I mean,
you'd have to go way back and chart it all. But it's fun to
discuss top NFL MVP candidates for all thirty two teams. How many ben how
many do you think are non quarterbacks. Anytime you think of MVP, you
immediately go toward the quarterbacks. NBA MVP, what do you think of?
You think of leading scorers or close to it? Right, Luca Dodges didn't
win the MVP, but he was in that discussion. Same thing in hockey,
the leading scorer. You're not getting a defenseman winning the Heart Trophy,
okay, in the National Hockey League. In baseball, what's it usually about.
It's about hits and runs, and it's about offense, is what I'm
referring to. In the NFL, it's primarily about quarterbacks. How many teams
do you think have a leading candidate for MVP who is not a quarterback?
I would say about ten to fifteen. There's one one. Oh wow,
there's one team. This is based on odds betting odds. Okay, there's
one team out there who's leading candidate for the MVP award in the upcoming NFL
season who is not a quarterback? Who is it? Like I had in
mind, like Christian McCaffrey or Justin Jefferson. Justin Jefferson is the answer.
Okay, all right, So Arizona, it's Kyler Murray, Atlanta's Kirk Cousins.
You can figure it out. I don't have to give you all the
quarterbacks, right, but you had mentioned San Francisco go, which is good,
but it's it's you know, brock Purty at plus two thousand. Obviously,
that means the Lions for Jared Goff. That to me is fascinating.
And the reason I think it's fascinating is because for a lot of these you
just don't know, Like for Washington, it's Jaden Daniels for New England who
drafted Drake May Do you know who the odd odds on favorite is to win
the MVP from the New England Patriots is it's Jacoby Brissett. That is ridiculous.
I get c J. Stroud, I get Jordan Love, I get,
to a certain extent, Deshaun Watson or Joe Burrow. I don't know
if I could go so far as Jared Stidham. That's what it is for
Denver, But I Matthew Stafford to a tongue of ALOA, Okay, I
understand it. Aaron Rodgers for the Jets, Jalen Hurts, Right, how
in the world did you have Jacoby Brissette think about this? Anthony Richardson was
hurt all of last year. He's the leading candidate for the Indianapolis Colts.
We are so focused on quarterbacks in the NFL. And I'm not saying it's
not important, you know, damn well it is. It's the most important
position in sports. That and goalie. I've said it constantly. It's just
amazing that you'll dig that deep into something just to prove the importance of that
position. It's crazy, absolutely nuts. All right, I want to shift
gears. NBA Finals it starts tonight in Boston. Thankfully, it's been a
long layoff. I understand the layoff. I get why it happens. It
happens because the NBA has to schedule like each series might go seven games,
all right, so you understand that. I wish there could be some flexibility
there. It's not as simple as just saying, well, Boston swept Cleveland,
Dallas dispatched their opponent Minnesota in six games, five games, and now
we can start playing two days later. It's not how it works, not
with television rights and arena set up and everything else like that. So I
don't think it's quite that easy. I wish there was some flexibility there.
There isn't so be it. It starts tonight the sixty four win Boston Celtics
that currently possess, based on numbers, the most efficient offense in the league,
and some have written it's the most efficient offense in NBA history. Now
it was last week. I believe. I said they've gotten some breaks and
that's okay. These things happen. You play the team that you're faced with,
right, Okay. Indiana didn't have Tyre's Halburton for a couple of games.
Cleveland didn't have Donovan Mitchell for a couple of games. Jimmy Butler never
played for Miami. That's not Boston's fault. They did what they were supposed
to do. It's interesting they've only lost twice in the playoffs, but people
will try and take it away from them because of the players who weren't available
for the opposition. My argument to that has always been, well if they
lost to those teams, I get why you're using it, but what are
they supposed to do when you don't have Jimmy Butler, you expect Boston to
dominate Miami. They pretty much dominated them. They lost one game when there
is no Donovan Mitchell for Cleveland. You expect Boston to dominate them. They
did except for one game. And by the way, when Donovan Mitchell was
healthy, they still beat them, but they lost game two. So they
lost game two against Miami. They lost game two against Cleveland. Then they
take on Indiana. When you don't have Tyrese Haliburton, you expect Boston to
take care of business, and they did in four games. How much is
enough? You have to decide that, Oh, they only beat him by
three, sheep, They beat him by three in each of the last two
games. So how special can they really be? Hey, listen, they
still did what they were supposed to do. You expected them to sweep them
if there is no Tyres Albert. You expected them to dominate the previous two
teams, as I mentioned, without their stars, and they did. But
it's still not enough. Now you're going to put an average margin of victory
onto the argument. Okay, there's the second caveat. I suppose that you
want. But it's an efficient offense according to all the numbers, the most
efficient offense in NBA history, led by Jason Tatum and Jalen Brown Dallas.
In the meantime, arguably the best backcourt in playoff history, arguably last said
offensive wise, gifted wise, shooting, and the like. You could make
the argument it's probably gone a little bit under the radar that they added guys
like Daniel Gaffer for PJ. Washington to help bring everything together and give them
everything. But when you have Luka Doncic and you have Kyrie Irving, it's
hard to argue how good they are offensively. Dallas won fifty games, that's
a lot, but it pales in comparison to sixty four for Boston. Number
one offensive rating for Boston, number eight for Dallas, number two defensive rating
for Boston. A team for Dallas. This goes back to what I was
saying earlier. I was talking about an article that ranked the top fifteen players
in the NBA Finals, and they've got Luka Doncic in there as number one.
We know why, right, he led the league in scoring. He's
one of the best versatile offensive players we perhaps have ever seen. I mean,
when healthy, I'd probably take Giannisan to Ta Coompo, So I think
he does it on the defensive side of the floor, too. But man,
I mean, you cannot argue with how pure a shooter Doncich is how
crisp his offense is and how pretty it is to watch Dallas play when he's
on the floor in that type of groove. It's even more mesmerizing when it's
he and Kyrie ir ring together. But defensively, that's what it's going to
come down to, Right, Can Dallas match Boston's defensive intensity? They couldn't
during the regular season, as evident by the numbers. Can they do it
in this series? We'll soon find out. I'm looking forward to it.
Tomorrow. We'll talk a little bit about the Stanley Cup Finals that starts on
Saturday. You talk about long layoff, that Florida and Edmonton waiting. You're
just hoping that Saturday gets here quick enough. But who's the Who do you
think is the best player in this NBA Finals? Look, this might be
I'm not saying this just to be different, because I think Jason Tatum's underrated.
I do. I think he takes a lot of crap there in Boston,
and I think he's a really good player. I think he's you could
make the argument he's their best player. But I think the guy going into
there are many keys, Right, Drew Holliday trying to stop Kyrie Irving is
going to be big. Who on Dallas is going to check Derek White.
I think the best player going into the series is Jaylen Brown. He won
the Eastern Conference Finals MVP, DCIC won the Western Conference Finals MVP, and
I like Brown. He averaged twenty five points, shot fifty four percent,
averaged six rebounds, two and a half assists, over a steal per game
in the first three rounds. Hit that game time three in Game one against
Indiana, had a forty point game in game two. Remember a couple of
years ago when he made his first Finals appearance, he did not shy away
from those proverbial big lights. Sure they lost to Golden State in six games,
but he averaged close to twenty four points and over seven rebounds and four
assists per game. That's pretty damn good. So I think he's the guy.
I'm not saying he's going to be the MVP of this Finals, and
I'm not telling you I think he's a better scorer than Luka Danciz or Kyrie
Irving or perhaps even j Sentatum. I'm talking about his overall game. Is
there anybody else who you look at as this Finals begins and you think that's
the guy. You can call us on the Meyer Hotline eight sixty six,
eight three, eight forty eight forty three. You can Tech Sports Radio to
twenty one thousand. When I watch these two teams play, I will say
this, you probably know exactly where I'm going with this, and you probably
feel the same way. When you watch these two teams play, it really
does make you realize just how far away your team is and what you can
expect to try and add in the draft or maybe use from the draft to
get a different player, because they're not even close to these two teams.
This is what it takes. Detroit's going to draft number five. Who they
take, you know, I don't know. I mean, like I've said
before, I'd love to trade the pick if it were worth anything, if
there was any type of value in it, because people have always said,
for I think for the last couple of years, that this is going to
be a very weak draft, and it sure seems that way. But I
saw mock recently that Donovan Klingon, the twenty year old from Connecticut who is
seven foot two, might be Detroit's answer at number five. Dalton, connect
would make a lot of sense. I tend and this is unfair. I'll
admit it, but I tend to gravitate toward college players, and I do
that because I watch them more. No offense to any of these other players,
Nicola Tapch, I have no idea how good that eighteen year old is,
no idea. Don't ask me to break down. Mattis Bizellus, who's
with the G League. Don't expect any type of deep response when it comes
to Ale Sar, the seven foot one nineteen year old who played for the
Perth Wildcats. Because you and I don't know those guys. That doesn't mean
you close your mind to a foreign born player as someone who's playing. I
mean, would you not have taken a lot of the players recently. Luka
Doncic is a really good example. Webin Yama is an excellent example. Absolutely
neither one. None of the players in this upcoming draft are expected to be
anything close to those guys. Look at the cops who some of these guys
are. Who writers and I guess it would be scouts. Front office personnel
are comparing these guys too. There aren't They're not names that make you go
gotta have them. That's the next Tim Duncan Wow, that guy plays a
lot like Shaquille O'Neal. That's great. I'm gonna take no no. They're
names of guys who have played in the league and have been productive players in
the league. That's as nice as I can put it. It's not blow
your socks off type players. I don't think any of them are going to
be the next leader of a franchise. Well, that's up to Trajan Langdon
and the Pistons to quickly figure out. Really didn't talk much about that when
that news broke that Langdon's now in charge, Troy Weaver is gone. But
I know in reading social media that many people could not be more thrilled than
to see Troy Weaver out the door and Trajan Langdon in the door because it's
the latest next best thing needs somebody to turn it around, because you just
don't feel like this guy knew what he was doing, and it's been pretty
evident, even though he did a nice job with Oklahoma City as their assistant
general manager, coming off a fourteen and sixty eight season and coming off some
of the worst I mean, he never won more than twenty eight percent of
the games in a single season. That's on him. That's his team,
the team he put together, the team he believed in. Again, it
goes back to what we were saying earlier in the show, the patience.
I'm tired of the word because you and I have been living it for an
extended period of time with the Pistons, with the Red Wings, with the
Tigers, the Lions finally satisfied our thirst for winning a year ago. I
want to thank Michael Harra for joining us here on Xes and Bros. This
morning. That was a lot of fun, man. I mean, here's
a guy who is a Michigan Hall of Famer. He's going to retire on
Monday. He spent two years in the Army, one year as in Vietnam,
a writer from the Detroit News from nineteen sixty six through two thousand and
he's seen it all, heard it all when it comes to the NFL,
and we've been lucky to be able to read his insights for years. So
I want to thank him, want to thank Ben for his producing of our
program, and most of all, thanks to you for your texts. Hopefully
tomorrow we get some more phone calls on the Meyer hot line, and we
hope you can join us tomorrow. We'll begin our program at six o'clock every
Monday through Friday. Hope you can join us in the meantime. Have a
great rest of your Thursday, everybody, and we'll talk to you again tomorrow
morning on XES and Bros. Across the great state of Michigan on the Michigan
Sports Network. What's Up, Michigan. I want to give some love to
and Glaze producing another great shep broadcast Superflies. Producer my show later today at
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